WEBVTT - Confronting The Divide Between Black and Asian Americans 0:00:00.280 --> 0:00:02.720 Hey, fam I'm Jada Pinkett Smith and this is the 0:00:02.759 --> 0:00:06.080 Red Table Pop podcast, all your favorite episodes from the 0:00:06.120 --> 0:00:10.280 Facebook watch show in audio, produced by Westbrook Audio and 0:00:10.360 --> 0:00:13.360 I Heart Radio. Please don't forget to rate and review 0:00:13.680 --> 0:00:19.439 on Apple Podcasts. I've been feeling very stressed, very stressed. 0:00:19.480 --> 0:00:24.040 You've been feeling stressed by just thinking about this conversation today, 0:00:24.280 --> 0:00:28.600 being so concerned about choosing the right words, saying the 0:00:28.720 --> 0:00:33.360 right thing, but still being able to speak authentically, authentically. 0:00:33.640 --> 0:00:37.160 I get it. This is a really tough subject. Here's 0:00:37.200 --> 0:00:42.120 the hard truth. There's real animosity between blacks and Asians, 0:00:42.159 --> 0:00:46.840 and that has really talked about brazen attacks against Asian Americans. 0:00:46.840 --> 0:00:49.320 The man walked up and started hitting her in the face. 0:00:49.560 --> 0:00:52.239 We want to warn you the videos are graphic. The 0:00:52.280 --> 0:00:56.000 recent surge of hay crumbs against Asian Americans. I've seen 0:00:56.080 --> 0:00:58.800 my grandma get yelled at your Asians. So you're a 0:00:58.880 --> 0:01:01.880 virus has illuminate needed a painful divide between the black 0:01:01.920 --> 0:01:05.440 and Asian American communities. You're seeing my skin as dirty. 0:01:05.680 --> 0:01:07.880 Asian people just want to hang out with Asian people only. 0:01:08.240 --> 0:01:13.319 Anti blackness is rooted in our culture. That's very subtle. 0:01:13.680 --> 0:01:18.160 But is very deeply rooted. Reports of Blacks attacking Asians 0:01:18.360 --> 0:01:22.759 have fed the tension that goes back decades. In Black 0:01:22.800 --> 0:01:26.440 fifteen year old name Latasha Harlans was shot and killed 0:01:26.440 --> 0:01:29.280 by Korean grocer during an argument over a bottle of 0:01:29.319 --> 0:01:33.920 orange juice. The store owner was convicted of voluntary manslaughter 0:01:34.280 --> 0:01:40.760 but got no jail time. When justice wasn't served, outrage exploded, 0:01:41.120 --> 0:01:45.680 fueling the LA riots. The recent increase in social injustices 0:01:45.760 --> 0:01:49.560 has called for a racial reckoning for Black and Asian Americans. 0:01:52.040 --> 0:01:55.280 My perspective is the fact that we're both minorities. I 0:01:55.320 --> 0:01:58.320 feel like, obviously we come from very different cultures, but 0:01:58.760 --> 0:02:01.880 it's hard for me to believe that other things could 0:02:01.880 --> 0:02:04.160 get in the way of us having a common ground. 0:02:04.440 --> 0:02:07.560 I guess what I need to understand is where does 0:02:07.680 --> 0:02:11.040 their animosity for us come from? Because that's what it 0:02:11.080 --> 0:02:14.080 feels like. It feels like that they have come into 0:02:14.160 --> 0:02:18.880 our communities, taken over our stores, taken over the hair 0:02:18.960 --> 0:02:23.400 and nail industry, and really blocked us from being able 0:02:23.440 --> 0:02:27.960 to thrive in that industry because we're coming into those stores, 0:02:28.400 --> 0:02:31.240 you know, we're getting our hair and nails done, and 0:02:32.360 --> 0:02:35.400 what are they giving back to the community, and when 0:02:35.440 --> 0:02:39.839 we come into those environments and patronize their businesses, we're 0:02:39.840 --> 0:02:43.600 not even treated with respect and kindness. I've had some 0:02:43.840 --> 0:02:51.600 very volatile and um passionate discussions with family members and friends, 0:02:51.880 --> 0:02:54.960 and most of my friends feel like I don't care. 0:02:55.760 --> 0:02:58.160 I don't care. I don't have the bandwidth or the 0:02:58.280 --> 0:03:01.320 interests because they don't care about about us and they 0:03:01.320 --> 0:03:04.320 don't treat us with respect. So I don't care about 0:03:04.360 --> 0:03:07.360 anything that they're talking about. I'm worried about what's happening 0:03:07.360 --> 0:03:09.760 with my people, you know, because we you know, we 0:03:09.880 --> 0:03:13.600 have our own struggle. Yeah, and that's the majority. That 0:03:13.760 --> 0:03:17.560 is the majority, You're right, So it's very difficult for 0:03:17.680 --> 0:03:21.400 there to be any any real concerned I don't even 0:03:21.400 --> 0:03:23.839 feel like they want our help. Now. I may hear 0:03:23.919 --> 0:03:28.440 something different from the scholars, but from the average person, 0:03:28.760 --> 0:03:33.200 do they care? Are they interested in a relationship with me? 0:03:33.560 --> 0:03:36.320 I just had an experience in the airport where I'm 0:03:36.520 --> 0:03:39.280 standing in line waiting for coffee, and I had a 0:03:39.320 --> 0:03:43.080 whole conversation going A white man my age came behind 0:03:43.120 --> 0:03:45.880 me stud in line. We started having a conversation. A 0:03:46.000 --> 0:03:48.880 young couple in front of me, white had a conversation. 0:03:48.960 --> 0:03:52.640 I've never had an Asian person come up to me 0:03:53.120 --> 0:03:56.360 that I didn't know to start a conversation, to speak 0:03:56.400 --> 0:03:59.440 to me, to give me eye contact, and anyway, that's 0:03:59.480 --> 0:04:02.920 also a cultural things. Well, it is cultural. But when 0:04:02.960 --> 0:04:05.680 I go on vacation and I go to a foreign country, 0:04:05.960 --> 0:04:09.040 I make it my business to try to be conscious 0:04:09.240 --> 0:04:14.320 of the culture there so that I can act accordingly. Right, 0:04:15.480 --> 0:04:19.440 So I think that we're owed some of that when 0:04:19.960 --> 0:04:24.400 you come to our country and you start businesses, that's 0:04:24.520 --> 0:04:27.480 just even good business practice to treat your patrons with 0:04:27.560 --> 0:04:33.039 respect and care, like that's just common sense, right, But 0:04:33.240 --> 0:04:35.360 we don't feel like we we get that. And I 0:04:35.480 --> 0:04:39.760 also recognize that it's a very limited exposure that we 0:04:39.880 --> 0:04:43.799 have with the community. They're so separate, that's the only 0:04:43.880 --> 0:04:46.920 interaction that we really have, and the cultures are so 0:04:47.240 --> 0:04:52.039 crastically different. Yeah, that's what I've come to understand. But 0:04:52.080 --> 0:04:56.240 I hear you. I think there's a lot of misunderstandings culturally. 0:04:56.960 --> 0:05:05.800 The biggest misconception is that Asian is just Asian, Vietnamese, Chinese, Japanese, Filipino, 0:05:05.920 --> 0:05:08.200 like you just throw them all in one. But they're 0:05:08.240 --> 0:05:13.040 also different, so different but various cultures, right, it's difficult 0:05:13.080 --> 0:05:15.920 to distinguish one from the other sometimes too not if 0:05:15.960 --> 0:05:21.320 you pay attention. You pay attention. For me, it's the 0:05:21.360 --> 0:05:25.719 feeling of or the lack of reciprocity, right, And it's 0:05:25.720 --> 0:05:28.200 a feeling that like, I'm not going to go out 0:05:28.240 --> 0:05:31.400 of my way to support and help someone if I 0:05:31.400 --> 0:05:35.039 don't even have the feeling that they even want my support. 0:05:35.240 --> 0:05:37.320 Here's the thing, and I hear you, and I think 0:05:37.400 --> 0:05:40.000 one of the biggest misconceptions that we have in this 0:05:40.080 --> 0:05:44.840 fight as a whole is that it's about this reciprocity situation, right, 0:05:44.880 --> 0:05:47.680 And I get that. I totally understand that, and of 0:05:47.720 --> 0:05:50.160 course we want to feel as though there's some exchange, 0:05:50.160 --> 0:05:52.160 but at the end of the day, what we can 0:05:52.279 --> 0:05:58.359 allow is hate of any kind to exist. I hear 0:05:58.560 --> 0:06:03.240 this conversation endlessly. They didn't do that, so why should 0:06:03.240 --> 0:06:04.480 I have to do this? And they didn't do that, 0:06:04.520 --> 0:06:06.520 so I did this. And it's really hard because we 0:06:06.560 --> 0:06:10.880 do feel hurt, and we feel neglected, may exactly overlooked, 0:06:10.880 --> 0:06:13.159 and we feel not seen. I get all of that, 0:06:13.320 --> 0:06:16.040 and that's what makes it so difficult because I understand, 0:06:16.720 --> 0:06:19.920 but I also know there's nothing in the world that 0:06:20.040 --> 0:06:23.080 makes a woman sixty five years old in New York 0:06:23.120 --> 0:06:26.520 City from the Philippines getting beat up by a man 0:06:26.600 --> 0:06:32.599 and nobody helps. That makes no sense whatsoever. Hate his hate. 0:06:32.680 --> 0:06:35.440 I agree, and I think I think people feel terrible 0:06:35.480 --> 0:06:39.960 about that. But I just don't feel like, you know, 0:06:40.440 --> 0:06:45.600 there's no real um, there's nothing in us that makes 0:06:45.680 --> 0:06:48.240 us stand up and feel like we really want to 0:06:48.320 --> 0:06:50.520 come to Well, here's the thing. Then why should we 0:06:50.560 --> 0:06:53.280 expect that from white people? Because that's how white people feel. 0:06:53.320 --> 0:06:57.800 White people feel like, that's not my problem, that's your problem. Okay, yeah, 0:06:57.880 --> 0:07:00.200 so we brought you guys over here. Okay, whatever, blah 0:07:00.200 --> 0:07:03.279 blah blah blah blah, you figure it out. That's on you. 0:07:03.920 --> 0:07:07.240 That's exactly how white people feel about our struggles, you know. 0:07:07.360 --> 0:07:10.680 And so that's what I'm saying. The cycle. It's the cycle, 0:07:11.320 --> 0:07:14.600 and I get it. Listen, It's like we're asking you 0:07:14.640 --> 0:07:18.840 to care because we're committing we have out of compassion 0:07:18.920 --> 0:07:23.080 for humanity. I understand in the community. What makes it 0:07:23.160 --> 0:07:26.120 so difficult that we are tired. We're tired always having 0:07:26.200 --> 0:07:29.560 to put it aside, take the hot road all that. 0:07:31.000 --> 0:07:33.760 So when we decided to bring this intense topic to 0:07:33.840 --> 0:07:36.440 the table. There were two people we wanted to have here. 0:07:37.160 --> 0:07:40.880 Both have devoted their careers to taking on tough subjects. 0:07:42.240 --> 0:07:45.160 Award winning journalists Lisa Laying is fighting on the front 0:07:45.200 --> 0:07:48.480 lines to stop Asian hate. Lisa and her family have 0:07:48.600 --> 0:07:52.080 received numerous death threats since the increase of hate crimes 0:07:52.120 --> 0:07:54.560 on the A A p I community. One of the 0:07:54.600 --> 0:07:58.080 smartest people I know, Dr Michael Eric Dyson, is a 0:07:58.160 --> 0:08:03.040 leading voice on black history and culture. This ordained preacher, professor, 0:08:03.120 --> 0:08:06.800 and author of seven New York Times bestsellers, is known 0:08:06.840 --> 0:08:11.640 for breaking down difficult topics. Let's get to let's get 0:08:11.640 --> 0:08:15.760 to it. This is a really tough subject and attend time. Yeah, 0:08:15.960 --> 0:08:18.200 and so we just wanted to get some education just 0:08:18.280 --> 0:08:23.400 around the tensions between blacks and Asians. How did they 0:08:23.400 --> 0:08:26.960 get this way? One of the first things any immigrant 0:08:26.960 --> 0:08:29.080 group learns when they come to America who the bottom 0:08:29.080 --> 0:08:31.040 of the totem pole is. I don't care who you are, 0:08:31.120 --> 0:08:34.080 black people, right, the darker people are at the bottom 0:08:34.080 --> 0:08:36.400 of the totem pole when immigrants come over here and 0:08:36.480 --> 0:08:41.319 they do they recognize this structure, right, or Whites are 0:08:41.360 --> 0:08:43.800 at the top and blacks are at the bottom. So 0:08:44.200 --> 0:08:47.160 often when immigrants from Asia come to this country with nothing, 0:08:47.360 --> 0:08:50.280 they have this aspiration of being able to achieve some 0:08:50.360 --> 0:08:52.920 semblance of the American dream. And what does that look like? 0:08:53.600 --> 0:08:56.960 It looks white, right, But everyone is being dehumanized, right 0:08:57.040 --> 0:09:00.280 because everyone is trying to rise up that ladder where 0:09:00.280 --> 0:09:03.120 in Los Angeles, And we think about Latasha Harlan's right, 0:09:03.160 --> 0:09:05.680 that was a touch stone, like see, that's what they 0:09:05.800 --> 0:09:09.520 do to us, the history of anti blackness within Asian communities, that, 0:09:09.640 --> 0:09:12.520 along with the Rodney King, this was a signal moment. 0:09:12.760 --> 0:09:16.199 I don't know a single Asian person who isn't horrified 0:09:16.400 --> 0:09:20.400 still to this day about that case. I truly don't. 0:09:20.480 --> 0:09:24.080 And that's the thing to understand that the people it 0:09:24.240 --> 0:09:27.440 horrified are not just black, and the people it horrified 0:09:27.440 --> 0:09:30.360 are many Asian brothers and sisters who saw that, who 0:09:30.520 --> 0:09:34.680 felt that it was a horrible misrepresentation of who they 0:09:34.720 --> 0:09:37.800 are as a people. And here's the thing. The so 0:09:37.880 --> 0:09:41.400 called negative thing that any particular group does is seen 0:09:41.440 --> 0:09:44.240 as representative of that group. Black people have a right 0:09:44.280 --> 0:09:48.439 to feel hurt and injured by the fact that everywhere 0:09:48.640 --> 0:09:53.079 in this world, to be darker is to be the humanized, 0:09:53.120 --> 0:09:56.440 and there's no question about that, which means that we 0:09:56.440 --> 0:10:01.040 should be especially careful not to reproduce that same herb 0:10:01.480 --> 0:10:05.839 to other groups when that tension starts to to brew. 0:10:06.960 --> 0:10:09.640 No one, our communities aren't the ones that are benefiting 0:10:09.679 --> 0:10:11.800 from it, not at all. For black people to be 0:10:11.880 --> 0:10:15.200 demonizing Asian brothers and sisters. What the Wuhan flu? The 0:10:15.320 --> 0:10:19.160 Chinese flu? Who wins white supremacists? So it hits us 0:10:19.160 --> 0:10:23.160 against each other. And that exact idea of pitting minorities 0:10:23.160 --> 0:10:28.480 against each other is the most perfect path towards domination. 0:10:29.080 --> 0:10:31.240 I mean, white supremacy is what we're not talking about 0:10:31.240 --> 0:10:33.680 individual white brothers and sisters. We're talking about the conscious 0:10:33.800 --> 0:10:37.520 or unconscious belief in the inherent inferiority of some and 0:10:37.600 --> 0:10:40.080 the superiority above. And I think that's the thing. I 0:10:40.120 --> 0:10:43.400 think there's a lot of people in our community specifically, 0:10:43.400 --> 0:10:49.400 who don't recognize the white supremacy construct that we're falling into. 0:10:49.679 --> 0:10:51.880 You know, that's the thing, like how you just broke 0:10:51.960 --> 0:10:54.480 that down, but you've been breaking it down. It's like 0:10:55.160 --> 0:11:01.040 I didn't really have the words. You know, you're come 0:11:01.080 --> 0:11:03.000 into red table. I got to bring my a game. 0:11:04.640 --> 0:11:08.040 That's exactly it. But it's got power. But that's what's 0:11:08.160 --> 0:11:11.280 ruining and ruling it. And it also is stoking fear 0:11:11.520 --> 0:11:15.160 amongst people whose livelihood and lives and the way they've 0:11:15.200 --> 0:11:18.600 always known things feels threatened. And that's the thing about 0:11:18.640 --> 0:11:22.559 this period right now, and white people are starting to recognize, well, 0:11:23.200 --> 0:11:26.560 I really had no idea. What's interesting, though, the ingenuity 0:11:26.559 --> 0:11:29.400 of white supremacy is it don't matter who's in control 0:11:29.559 --> 0:11:32.600 as long as the system is operating. So you could 0:11:32.600 --> 0:11:36.280 have a black head of Department of Housing under the 0:11:36.320 --> 0:11:40.840 Trump administration and you still gonna have white supremacist ideology 0:11:40.920 --> 0:11:44.920 being pumped through that black mouth and body. The ingenuity 0:11:44.920 --> 0:11:47.960 of white supremacy is it doesn't demand a white body 0:11:48.040 --> 0:11:52.200 to be efficacious and effect. That's a very important point. Basic. 0:11:52.280 --> 0:11:57.640 Have you personally felt the surge of animosity that is happening. 0:11:58.160 --> 0:12:01.880 I have been teased and been on the receiving end 0:12:01.880 --> 0:12:05.360 of the aggressions my whole life. But over the last year, 0:12:05.800 --> 0:12:10.560 the level of vitriol and just the hatred that is 0:12:10.600 --> 0:12:14.800 expressed has been really unnerving. I mean, even people wishing 0:12:14.840 --> 0:12:18.840 harm on my own children because we brought the coronavirus 0:12:18.880 --> 0:12:22.600 to this country, so absolutely, but it kills me that 0:12:23.240 --> 0:12:26.760 so many of our Asian elders and mothers and children 0:12:26.840 --> 0:12:31.520 are being attacked so senselessly for no reason. At this table, 0:12:31.679 --> 0:12:35.160 we always want to hear from you, so check this out. 0:12:35.600 --> 0:12:39.000 Recently Stop Asian Hate posts on our Red Table Talk, 0:12:39.080 --> 0:12:44.000 Instagram and Facebook page confirmed this steep divide. We received 0:12:44.000 --> 0:12:48.160 so many comments and responses like these that relaid frustration, anger, 0:12:48.320 --> 0:12:53.160 and pain. I'm supposed to care about stop Asian hate. 0:12:53.400 --> 0:12:57.680 I'm supposed to care about what's happening to Asian people. 0:12:57.960 --> 0:13:04.360 They're rude, did you respectful in their racist if you 0:13:04.440 --> 0:13:09.880 ask me? Rushing us out their stores, following us around, 0:13:10.080 --> 0:13:13.040 watching us every move like we're gonna rob the whole store, 0:13:15.840 --> 0:13:20.160 but they don't mind taking them black dollars, and they 0:13:20.160 --> 0:13:24.439 didn't mind opening up these businesses in our neighborhoods. They 0:13:24.480 --> 0:13:29.920 have never helped me in mind do anything, So why 0:13:29.960 --> 0:13:36.000 would I jump on some stop Asian hate bandway? That 0:13:36.200 --> 0:13:41.040 was the Jara te And it was so deep that 0:13:41.200 --> 0:13:43.920 there were lots of posts that had to be pulled, 0:13:44.040 --> 0:13:47.079 that's how offensive they were. How would you address that? 0:13:47.400 --> 0:13:49.559 You know, I think it's really easy to say things 0:13:49.640 --> 0:13:52.400 like well, this black person did something to me, and 0:13:52.440 --> 0:13:55.760 this nail songer or this Asian person disrespected me. Those 0:13:55.800 --> 0:14:01.600 are individual experiences and that can't categorize who. That's not 0:14:01.640 --> 0:14:05.120 the totality. They are so diverse. I mean, there are 0:14:05.160 --> 0:14:10.000 over twenty different Asian cultures living in this country, with 0:14:10.160 --> 0:14:13.920 different languages, different traditions, and frankly, not only do I 0:14:13.960 --> 0:14:17.360 know very little about being Thai or Laotian, or Cambodian 0:14:17.520 --> 0:14:20.960 or Vietnamese, I don't even know the first thing about 0:14:20.960 --> 0:14:23.880 being Chinese because I'm not from China. I'm from America. 0:14:24.120 --> 0:14:26.760 And this sister, bless her heart, I don't doubt her hard. 0:14:27.000 --> 0:14:29.000 I don't doubt the fact that this is her experience. 0:14:29.120 --> 0:14:32.080 I don't want to dis black people who have been mistreated. 0:14:32.120 --> 0:14:34.080 I'm not saying there are no rude Asian people in 0:14:34.160 --> 0:14:36.480 stores that have done exactly what this woman said. But 0:14:36.560 --> 0:14:39.040 here's the question. I would say this to black people 0:14:39.680 --> 0:14:42.320 when we say this, and God bless this woman right 0:14:42.360 --> 0:14:45.000 wife have been saying that forever about us. You know, 0:14:45.120 --> 0:14:47.840 I don't mind. But these black people they're just rude, 0:14:48.480 --> 0:14:51.680 They're loud, you can't get them to work on time. 0:14:52.160 --> 0:14:56.640 They never come prepared, they always got excuses, on and 0:14:56.840 --> 0:14:59.640 on and on. Is that a large enough sample size 0:14:59.680 --> 0:15:03.320 for you to determined this is the fundamental characteristic of 0:15:03.400 --> 0:15:05.400 Asian brothers and sisters. Or if we're gonna get real 0:15:05.520 --> 0:15:10.920 ugly about it, how many black people have stolen from them? 0:15:11.000 --> 0:15:16.440 That their attitudes have been misshapen by the behavior of 0:15:16.520 --> 0:15:19.240 certain black people, And you're gonna go, wait a minute, 0:15:19.280 --> 0:15:21.960 most black people ain't ripping you off. Most black people right, 0:15:22.040 --> 0:15:25.000 So I would ask them, I understand your pain, but 0:15:25.200 --> 0:15:28.520 don't draw conclusions based on your limited sample side because 0:15:28.600 --> 0:15:31.680 white folks have been doing that forever. Jim was based 0:15:31.680 --> 0:15:34.440 on that. White supremacy is based on that. You don't 0:15:34.440 --> 0:15:36.960 want all black people being judged by your knuckle head cousin. 0:15:37.360 --> 0:15:39.840 How do you get beyond that when that is the 0:15:39.880 --> 0:15:43.920 only experience that you have, when your experience is so limited, 0:15:45.040 --> 0:15:51.160 because that's too experience interacting with the Asian community is 0:15:51.240 --> 0:15:54.520 so freaking limited. White focusing the same thing. We don't 0:15:54.520 --> 0:15:57.120 know no negroes, They don't live next door to us. 0:15:57.680 --> 0:15:59.840 All I see is what I see on a rap video. 0:16:00.280 --> 0:16:05.720 But I tell people read a book, Uh, go Google, 0:16:06.360 --> 0:16:09.240 but look at some darned YouTube. It ain't that hard. 0:16:10.400 --> 0:16:13.400 So you are ignorant, but you're responsible for your ignorance. 0:16:13.640 --> 0:16:16.120 So when we say we don't have any experience with 0:16:16.360 --> 0:16:18.440 you know, hey, the only Asian person I know is 0:16:18.440 --> 0:16:20.720 the person you know in the nails a line of light, 0:16:20.800 --> 0:16:23.760 Well then we don't want black people judge by what 0:16:23.800 --> 0:16:27.640 we think happens with the black person at McDonald's and wife, folk, girl, 0:16:27.880 --> 0:16:31.640 do you want them? We ain't got no fried If 0:16:31.840 --> 0:16:36.440 so called pooky and so called is the litmus test 0:16:36.920 --> 0:16:39.840 for how people judge. Now, my point is stereotype as 0:16:39.840 --> 0:16:42.760 a lazy person's way of engaging the other. So have 0:16:42.840 --> 0:16:48.080 a more complicated, nuanced perspective. We gently encourage her, ma'am, 0:16:48.120 --> 0:16:50.560 just like I do with white folks when I challenged 0:16:50.640 --> 0:16:55.560 them with humor or acerbic, intense rhetoric aimed at their 0:16:55.560 --> 0:17:00.840 colossal indignity, that you've got to just say, open up 0:17:00.840 --> 0:17:03.160 a little bit, open your heart. Do you want to 0:17:03.200 --> 0:17:05.600 be judged by the worst things you've done? Do you 0:17:05.640 --> 0:17:07.800 want to be judged about how black people have been 0:17:07.880 --> 0:17:10.560 said to treat white folks? Cause I get letters every 0:17:10.600 --> 0:17:12.560 day and they're going, you up here talking about this, 0:17:12.720 --> 0:17:14.440 and I don't deny that these white people have had 0:17:14.440 --> 0:17:17.159 this experience that they've seen black people do X, Y 0:17:17.200 --> 0:17:19.760 and Z right there saying I saw this, this is 0:17:19.760 --> 0:17:22.879 in my store. I hired this many black people. Every 0:17:22.920 --> 0:17:25.520 black person I hired acted like this. So they got 0:17:25.520 --> 0:17:28.200 a sample too. It ain't scientific, but they got a 0:17:28.240 --> 0:17:31.119 pole too. So we're gonna put their bigoted pole against 0:17:31.160 --> 0:17:34.399 your biggoted pole. Let's do something different. Let's draw back 0:17:34.880 --> 0:17:38.399 and see that there's our different experiences, different peoples. And 0:17:38.440 --> 0:17:40.560 if we judge people based upon the worst of what 0:17:40.640 --> 0:17:42.840 they do or the worst of how they behave or 0:17:42.920 --> 0:17:45.320 on one day, have you judged them over space and time? 0:17:45.359 --> 0:17:47.680 Did you have a conversation with them, Did you talk 0:17:47.720 --> 0:17:50.159 to them about where they come from? Have you spoken right? 0:17:50.440 --> 0:17:51.960 In other words, have you treated them the way you 0:17:52.000 --> 0:17:53.680 want to be treated. If you want an Asian person 0:17:53.720 --> 0:17:55.240 to speak to you, have you ever spoken to them? 0:17:55.600 --> 0:17:57.800 So my point is that when we get into the 0:17:58.080 --> 0:18:01.240 politics of reciprocity and knowledge, it's not just about read 0:18:01.280 --> 0:18:04.280 a book, it's not just about no more. I recommend 0:18:04.280 --> 0:18:07.320 all that, but open up your perspective, be a bit fair, 0:18:07.840 --> 0:18:10.040 and don't do the same things I think we need 0:18:10.080 --> 0:18:16.760 to have Michael Eric Dyson like pumped into everyone's It 0:18:16.920 --> 0:18:21.560 just doesn't sound satisfying to say that to that woman. 0:18:21.800 --> 0:18:24.879 Get a book and read your history. And it's the 0:18:25.040 --> 0:18:28.800 human problem to Yeah, and I know it's hard, but 0:18:28.840 --> 0:18:32.119 it's also like, maybe try to expand your heart a 0:18:32.160 --> 0:18:34.480 little bit and your mind just a little bit. How 0:18:34.520 --> 0:18:39.240 about that. You can't reduce the world to your perspective. 0:18:39.840 --> 0:18:42.600 And yet at the same time, your perspective is so 0:18:42.680 --> 0:18:45.280 critical of how you see the world. So it is 0:18:45.320 --> 0:18:48.159 to your advantage to continue to expand. Okay, but it 0:18:48.240 --> 0:18:51.119 is not the onus on the Asian community to do 0:18:51.200 --> 0:18:53.960 the same when it comes to us. And I would 0:18:53.960 --> 0:18:56.040 say the same thing to Asian people who have a 0:18:56.080 --> 0:18:59.919 myampic view black people. You know, have you taken the 0:19:00.040 --> 0:19:04.560 time when you moved into this community, did you read 0:19:04.600 --> 0:19:06.440 about the history, did you get to know people, did 0:19:06.480 --> 0:19:09.760 you invest? Did you hire people from the community and 0:19:09.760 --> 0:19:13.240 give them opportunities? I do think it's incumbent upon all 0:19:13.280 --> 0:19:17.199 of us. I mean, if we don't start functioning that way, 0:19:17.240 --> 0:19:21.080 this is all headed down. And you raise a great 0:19:21.080 --> 0:19:26.000 point because part of the investment of the model minority 0:19:26.320 --> 0:19:29.320 is that it is insulated Asian community. It helps, but 0:19:29.359 --> 0:19:32.679 It also hurts because that honorary white status allows you 0:19:32.720 --> 0:19:35.360 to derive a certain kind of benefit from being quiet, 0:19:35.480 --> 0:19:40.280 from not speaking of from not making noise. How open, Lisa, 0:19:40.359 --> 0:19:45.320 do you believe that the Asian community is too educating 0:19:45.440 --> 0:19:50.920 themselves around the history of the relationship between black people 0:19:50.920 --> 0:19:53.439 and Asian people, but just black people in general, you know, 0:19:53.600 --> 0:19:57.399 just having understands, I do actually think that there's a 0:19:57.440 --> 0:20:02.800 generational divide in the Asian community. Um, younger Asians were 0:20:02.840 --> 0:20:07.160 taught black history, so that's why I think so many 0:20:07.240 --> 0:20:11.919 Asian Americans showed up to protest the systemic injustices that 0:20:12.040 --> 0:20:14.960 have been directed towards black people this summer. So that's 0:20:15.000 --> 0:20:19.800 why it hurts when we hear Asian people have never 0:20:19.800 --> 0:20:22.399 stood up for us. So many younger Asians are like, 0:20:23.400 --> 0:20:26.280 where is this animosity coming from. There's a history, and 0:20:26.280 --> 0:20:29.320 it's there's a reason for it. If our main goal 0:20:29.440 --> 0:20:32.320 is to really have some harmony, we have to stop 0:20:32.720 --> 0:20:36.040 like inserting ourselves right back in that cycle. And I'm 0:20:36.040 --> 0:20:39.479 not making excuses for Asian people, but often there are 0:20:39.600 --> 0:20:43.680 language barriers, and there are cultural differences, and as a whole, 0:20:44.160 --> 0:20:49.680 Asians aren't the most communicative people around my husband, he's 0:20:49.800 --> 0:20:52.240 a Korean American and his parents didn't even tell him 0:20:52.280 --> 0:20:54.080 I love you until he was in his forties. So 0:20:54.080 --> 0:20:56.959 that's what we're working with here. So typically they're just 0:20:57.040 --> 0:20:59.840 not warm and cuddly and friendly. It's not so much 0:20:59.840 --> 0:21:01.439 of the not warm and cuddly. It's just not the 0:21:01.440 --> 0:21:07.280 most communic to It's not affection, particularly affection. But I 0:21:07.320 --> 0:21:10.359 don't think that Asians not approaching you to talk to you. 0:21:10.440 --> 0:21:13.400 It's not so much because they're discriminating against you. I mean, 0:21:13.400 --> 0:21:15.400 I do think there's a cultural piece to it where 0:21:15.520 --> 0:21:17.440 they're probably not even talking to each other that much. 0:21:17.480 --> 0:21:20.320 Quite honestly, when we talk about race in this country, 0:21:20.400 --> 0:21:23.200 it's through a certain lens, right, it's black and it's white. 0:21:24.040 --> 0:21:28.840 Asians have been in this country since two hundreds, right, 0:21:29.000 --> 0:21:32.760 long time? Did you read about Asian history in your 0:21:32.760 --> 0:21:35.320 textbooks and schools? I mean, I didn't, even when I 0:21:35.400 --> 0:21:38.200 hear this aversion and people saying, well, Asian people don't 0:21:38.440 --> 0:21:42.480 stand up for our community. Asian Americans don't even know 0:21:42.640 --> 0:21:45.240 their own history, you know, because it's not taught in 0:21:45.240 --> 0:21:48.040 our schools. If you look at Asian American history in 0:21:48.080 --> 0:21:51.000 this country, we can't compare it to what black people 0:21:51.040 --> 0:21:54.160 have gone through. Right, Although some Chinese and some films 0:21:54.440 --> 0:21:59.520 were actually enslaved, but the Chinese were the only demographic 0:21:59.560 --> 0:22:02.840 to ever excluded from being able to immigrate to this 0:22:02.880 --> 0:22:07.760 country for decades. Hundred and twenty thousand Japanese rounded into 0:22:07.840 --> 0:22:11.280 camps for years. They lost their businesses, they lost their homes. 0:22:11.640 --> 0:22:14.840 I also learned that there were lynchings that happened of 0:22:15.920 --> 0:22:20.359 lying in the American history, happened in Chinatown exactly. And 0:22:20.400 --> 0:22:23.399 I just learned about this. Think about Asian brothers and 0:22:23.440 --> 0:22:25.159 sisters the way white folks think about us, and I 0:22:25.200 --> 0:22:27.760 think we'd be a bit more compassionate. Tony Morrison said, 0:22:27.840 --> 0:22:30.320 on the backs of black people, America has been built, 0:22:30.720 --> 0:22:35.720 and we know Asian labor, unrecognized, has provided the opportunity 0:22:35.760 --> 0:22:37.639 for America to be what it is. So here is 0:22:37.680 --> 0:22:40.320 the tragic irony that we would come to a place 0:22:40.320 --> 0:22:45.280 now where we're at each other's next when indeed what 0:22:45.320 --> 0:22:47.320 we should be doing is trying to look at the 0:22:47.400 --> 0:22:51.480 common enemy of white supremacies that is murking all of us. 0:22:51.760 --> 0:22:54.240 I've heard a lot of my Asian peers talking about 0:22:54.280 --> 0:22:58.040 aspiring to this level of whiteness and not wanting to 0:22:58.080 --> 0:23:00.840 have their original name, Like if their parents call them 0:23:00.840 --> 0:23:02.720 their original name and they have friends in the house, 0:23:02.880 --> 0:23:05.840 that makes them feel some type of way. Well, I mean, 0:23:05.880 --> 0:23:09.199 when you don't know your history, and if whites are 0:23:09.200 --> 0:23:12.280 at the top, you can understand why you've are moving 0:23:12.320 --> 0:23:16.520 that direct an honorary white exactly. Now, Michael, let me 0:23:16.520 --> 0:23:20.720 ask you a question. What do we say to Black 0:23:20.760 --> 0:23:24.080 people in the community who feel threatened and feel as 0:23:24.080 --> 0:23:28.200 though that the presence of Asians and our community are 0:23:28.800 --> 0:23:32.800 stealing livelihood? Why be mad at the Asian brothers and 0:23:32.840 --> 0:23:35.920 sisters who came here looking for an opportunity. Don't hate 0:23:35.920 --> 0:23:39.000 the player, hate the game. Why do Asian people have 0:23:39.119 --> 0:23:41.159 those nail shops? Where could they get them in the 0:23:41.200 --> 0:23:44.200 black community? Be mad at white supremacists who denied black 0:23:44.240 --> 0:23:46.840 people access to the loans to be able to own 0:23:46.880 --> 0:23:49.600 the shops in their own community. And the game at 0:23:49.640 --> 0:23:52.120 this point is black people can't get loans. The reason 0:23:52.280 --> 0:23:54.760 Asian brothers and sisters are all no shops because they 0:23:54.800 --> 0:23:58.520 were able to get loans right and Asians historically haven't 0:23:58.520 --> 0:24:01.760 had the opportunities to open their businesses or even live 0:24:01.800 --> 0:24:06.240 in some cases in predominantly white communities, so they end 0:24:06.320 --> 0:24:10.000