1
00:00:09,600 --> 00:00:11,959
Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Savor production of iHeart Radio.

2
00:00:11,960 --> 00:00:14,320
Speaker 2: I'm Annie Reese and I'm Learned Vogelbaum, and today we

3
00:00:14,360 --> 00:00:16,560
Speaker 2: have an episode for you about vermoot.

4
00:00:17,040 --> 00:00:20,959
Speaker 1: Yes, which I do always associate with you, Lauren. Oh yeah,

5
00:00:21,280 --> 00:00:23,639
Speaker 1: huh yeah. I feel like you were the person that

6
00:00:23,960 --> 00:00:27,319
Speaker 1: told me I should I should give Vermouth more of

7
00:00:27,320 --> 00:00:27,840
Speaker 1: a chance.

8
00:00:28,000 --> 00:00:31,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's I did get pretty into it. Maybe, oh gosh,

9
00:00:31,560 --> 00:00:34,360
Speaker 2: I don't know what time it is anymore. Maybe around

10
00:00:34,440 --> 00:00:37,120
Speaker 2: like seven ish years ago, seven or eight years ago,

11
00:00:37,159 --> 00:00:39,600
Speaker 2: there was kind of a big Vermouth boom in the

12
00:00:39,600 --> 00:00:42,440
Speaker 2: local Atlanta restaurant scene where all of a sudden, all

13
00:00:42,479 --> 00:00:46,760
Speaker 2: of these cool little restaurants had like tasting menus, and

14
00:00:46,840 --> 00:00:50,200
Speaker 2: I was like, all right, I'm into tasting weird stuff.

15
00:00:50,280 --> 00:00:55,720
Speaker 1: Let's go. And so yeah, yeah, yeah. Was there any

16
00:00:55,720 --> 00:00:56,880
Speaker 1: reason it was on your mind?

17
00:00:57,920 --> 00:01:01,840
Speaker 2: Oh? Good question. Nope, I don't think so. I think

18
00:01:01,920 --> 00:01:04,520
Speaker 2: I was. I think just like a drink was in

19
00:01:04,560 --> 00:01:08,200
Speaker 2: the rotation. And if there was a reason, it has

20
00:01:08,240 --> 00:01:09,160
Speaker 2: gone from my mind.

21
00:01:11,160 --> 00:01:14,480
Speaker 1: Well, first of all, I appreciate how you said good question,

22
00:01:14,800 --> 00:01:17,200
Speaker 1: as if I am a good interviewer, as opposed to

23
00:01:17,240 --> 00:01:20,000
Speaker 1: the fact that I asked this question every.

24
00:01:19,760 --> 00:01:26,120
Speaker 2: Time oh, good question, hard hitting, unexpected, whoa how deep.

25
00:01:28,840 --> 00:01:31,480
Speaker 1: But also when you and I were talking about this topic,

26
00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:35,120
Speaker 1: you said, there are certain things I can't believe we've

27
00:01:35,360 --> 00:01:38,720
Speaker 1: not done. Yeah, thermooth was one.

28
00:01:39,240 --> 00:01:43,959
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, right, like seven years in, it seems incredible

29
00:01:44,000 --> 00:01:47,000
Speaker 2: to me that we had not done it. And because

30
00:01:47,000 --> 00:01:50,760
Speaker 2: we've done all kinds of episodes that like the touch

31
00:01:50,800 --> 00:01:54,400
Speaker 2: on It, all kinds of cocktail episodes like the Manhattan

32
00:01:54,440 --> 00:01:58,880
Speaker 2: and Martini and the Groni. But yeah, and I think

33
00:01:58,880 --> 00:02:00,840
Speaker 2: the reason that we had was because I was like,

34
00:02:00,880 --> 00:02:04,040
Speaker 2: that sounds hard. I would like to have an easier

35
00:02:04,080 --> 00:02:09,480
Speaker 2: homework tonight, please. And but yeah, you know, in the

36
00:02:09,520 --> 00:02:14,760
Speaker 2: spirit of twenty twenty four being our let's do the

37
00:02:14,760 --> 00:02:17,760
Speaker 2: word that popped into my mind was annoying, annoying episodes,

38
00:02:18,480 --> 00:02:20,680
Speaker 2: the interesting, the challenging episodes.

39
00:02:21,000 --> 00:02:25,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, here we are. Here we are. But as we've said,

40
00:02:25,560 --> 00:02:27,600
Speaker 1: I mean, I feel like listeners, you're getting a real

41
00:02:28,520 --> 00:02:31,920
Speaker 1: peak behind the scenes how we choose topics. We do

42
00:02:31,960 --> 00:02:36,640
Speaker 1: avoid difficult ones, but also every topic we choose inevitably

43
00:02:36,760 --> 00:02:41,240
Speaker 1: becomes more than we thought it would be. Always every time. Yes,

44
00:02:41,520 --> 00:02:46,320
Speaker 1: so this is quite comical how many things we've put off,

45
00:02:47,240 --> 00:02:49,359
Speaker 1: but how many other things we've done in their place

46
00:02:49,639 --> 00:02:55,360
Speaker 1: that were probably equally is a little difficult. Yes, yeah, yeah,

47
00:02:55,600 --> 00:02:59,560
Speaker 1: we're speaking of We have done several episodes related.

48
00:02:59,560 --> 00:03:04,040
Speaker 2: To Sure yeah. In addition to those cocktail episodes that

49
00:03:04,080 --> 00:03:07,480
Speaker 2: I just mentioned, you might also see our episodes on

50
00:03:07,680 --> 00:03:12,919
Speaker 2: sherry Absinthe tomorrow. Strangely enough, the Gin and Tonic. I

51
00:03:13,360 --> 00:03:17,320
Speaker 2: know that Gin and Tonic doesn't contain Vermouth, but kind

52
00:03:17,360 --> 00:03:20,160
Speaker 2: of related material in there. Yeah, pretty much, any of

53
00:03:20,160 --> 00:03:22,160
Speaker 2: the Boose episodes, sure yeah.

54
00:03:22,520 --> 00:03:31,440
Speaker 1: Brewing, Yeah, some of our holiday episodes for sure, like

55
00:03:31,440 --> 00:03:35,080
Speaker 1: we sailing. Yeah, while sailing, I always forget how to

56
00:03:35,080 --> 00:03:37,920
Speaker 1: say it, but you know what I mean. Plenty of

57
00:03:37,960 --> 00:03:42,120
Speaker 1: those also. But I guess this does bring us to

58
00:03:42,280 --> 00:03:49,839
Speaker 1: our question. I guess it does. Vermouth what is it?

59
00:03:50,680 --> 00:03:54,640
Speaker 2: Well, Vermooth is a sort of wide category of aromatized

60
00:03:54,960 --> 00:03:59,120
Speaker 2: fortified wines. Usually you're dealing with a base of white

61
00:03:59,120 --> 00:04:02,360
Speaker 2: wine made from grapes that's then infused or otherwise mixed

62
00:04:02,520 --> 00:04:05,960
Speaker 2: with aromatic plants and then made more alcoholic and stable

63
00:04:06,120 --> 00:04:09,800
Speaker 2: with the addition of a neutral liquor. The plants used

64
00:04:09,840 --> 00:04:14,600
Speaker 2: can really vary, but common ones include bitter things like wormwood, citrus,

65
00:04:14,640 --> 00:04:21,320
Speaker 2: peel quina, Gentian and rhubarb. Fremooth can range from like

66
00:04:21,440 --> 00:04:24,479
Speaker 2: sweet and sort of sticky to quite dry and thin,

67
00:04:24,760 --> 00:04:29,599
Speaker 2: from nearly opaque to very translucent, and from deep scarlet

68
00:04:29,600 --> 00:04:33,119
Speaker 2: in color to rose to amber to like a pale,

69
00:04:33,160 --> 00:04:37,160
Speaker 2: pale yellow green. Note that color is not always an

70
00:04:37,160 --> 00:04:41,520
Speaker 2: indicator of sweetness. Important Note Yeah, the result again can

71
00:04:41,560 --> 00:04:44,800
Speaker 2: really vary, but will be some combination of bitter, sweet

72
00:04:44,920 --> 00:04:47,280
Speaker 2: and sort of spiced floral woody.

73
00:04:47,880 --> 00:04:48,120
Speaker 1: Sure.

74
00:04:48,279 --> 00:04:52,280
Speaker 2: Yeah. Fremooth can be consumed straight room temperature or slightly

75
00:04:52,360 --> 00:04:54,440
Speaker 2: chilled or on ice, or it can be mixed into

76
00:04:54,440 --> 00:04:57,839
Speaker 2: cocktails or used in cooking, especially in sauces and marinades.

77
00:04:58,440 --> 00:05:01,240
Speaker 2: It's like, it's like if you looked at a glass

78
00:05:01,279 --> 00:05:04,400
Speaker 2: of wine and went, you know, this could be weirder.

79
00:05:05,680 --> 00:05:08,640
Speaker 2: We could make this weirder. Hm, I think that's I

80
00:05:08,680 --> 00:05:10,640
Speaker 2: think that's a Saber motto right there. We can always

81
00:05:10,640 --> 00:05:11,640
Speaker 2: make it weirder.

82
00:05:12,120 --> 00:05:12,799
Speaker 1: As we can.

83
00:05:15,880 --> 00:05:18,760
Speaker 2: Remooth is like it's like, uh, if your wine spent

84
00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:21,400
Speaker 2: a few years wandering around in the woods with your

85
00:05:21,520 --> 00:05:25,360
Speaker 2: like foresty magic user of choice. I'm personally thinking of

86
00:05:25,440 --> 00:05:26,320
Speaker 2: rat Agasta the brown.

87
00:05:28,960 --> 00:05:32,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like a wine that went on a after

88
00:05:33,440 --> 00:05:37,480
Speaker 1: after some journey, yeah, a little gap year.

89
00:05:39,320 --> 00:05:42,039
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like drinking. It is like hiking through the

90
00:05:42,040 --> 00:05:45,640
Speaker 2: woods and finding that your beverage as it's changed as

91
00:05:45,680 --> 00:05:48,880
Speaker 2: you are by the experience of like all of those

92
00:05:49,080 --> 00:05:53,440
Speaker 2: towering trees and tiny blossoms and patches of moss and

93
00:05:53,520 --> 00:05:54,600
Speaker 2: dapples of sunlight.

94
00:05:57,000 --> 00:05:59,520
Speaker 1: It's a wine that's seen some things.

95
00:06:04,640 --> 00:06:05,400
Speaker 2: It's the truth.

96
00:06:05,480 --> 00:06:06,240
Speaker 1: It's the truth.

97
00:06:07,279 --> 00:06:12,560
Speaker 2: All of these aromatic, aromatic liquors and wines feel very

98
00:06:12,680 --> 00:06:19,640
Speaker 2: much like it's seen some stuff. Yeah, Okay, if you

99
00:06:19,720 --> 00:06:24,800
Speaker 2: are a native English speaker, you may have heard of

100
00:06:24,839 --> 00:06:28,719
Speaker 2: like basically two kinds of vermouth, sweet red Italian vermouth

101
00:06:28,760 --> 00:06:31,600
Speaker 2: and dry white French vermouth. You put the first one

102
00:06:31,640 --> 00:06:34,000
Speaker 2: in Manhattan and the second one in a martini. And

103
00:06:34,040 --> 00:06:36,040
Speaker 2: that's low key why most of them knew about them

104
00:06:36,120 --> 00:06:40,480
Speaker 2: for a long time. This terminology does reflect like a

105
00:06:40,520 --> 00:06:43,920
Speaker 2: facet of the history of Remouth, but it doesn't cover

106
00:06:44,120 --> 00:06:48,760
Speaker 2: anywhere near the breadth and depth of what Vermouth actually is.

107
00:06:49,320 --> 00:06:52,600
Speaker 2: More in this more in the history part in the

108
00:06:52,640 --> 00:06:56,279
Speaker 2: history section, but okay, more recently, you'll often hear remooth

109
00:06:56,560 --> 00:07:01,279
Speaker 2: described in three categories. Sweet red also called rosso or

110
00:07:01,360 --> 00:07:05,200
Speaker 2: rojo or rouge, sweet white also called bianco or blanco

111
00:07:05,400 --> 00:07:08,960
Speaker 2: or blanc, and dry white also called seco or sec.

112
00:07:10,280 --> 00:07:12,760
Speaker 2: Though that also leaves out like a range of amber

113
00:07:12,800 --> 00:07:15,280
Speaker 2: and rose styles, it can still be useful for reading

114
00:07:15,360 --> 00:07:17,800
Speaker 2: labels if you're unfamiliar with a brand of remouth and

115
00:07:17,840 --> 00:07:19,560
Speaker 2: want like a basic idea of what you're in for

116
00:07:19,960 --> 00:07:23,880
Speaker 2: and don't have Google with you for some reason, or

117
00:07:24,000 --> 00:07:28,040
Speaker 2: ask a ask a friendly store human. I recommend talking

118
00:07:28,040 --> 00:07:31,560
Speaker 2: to friendly store humans unless you don't want to and

119
00:07:31,560 --> 00:07:35,880
Speaker 2: then don't. Yeah, so let's go into how remouth is

120
00:07:35,920 --> 00:07:37,360
Speaker 2: made to kind of get an idea of what it

121
00:07:37,400 --> 00:07:40,640
Speaker 2: is right to make a remouth. You take wine often

122
00:07:40,680 --> 00:07:42,400
Speaker 2: you start with a white wine made from grapes, but

123
00:07:42,440 --> 00:07:44,600
Speaker 2: you can use other fruits if you want. You'll probably

124
00:07:44,640 --> 00:07:48,200
Speaker 2: start with a relatively neutral flavor of wine because it'll

125
00:07:48,240 --> 00:07:50,320
Speaker 2: be competing with other flavors, but you can do what

126
00:07:50,360 --> 00:07:54,640
Speaker 2: you want. You'll then add botanical flavors, maybe steeped directly

127
00:07:54,680 --> 00:07:57,760
Speaker 2: into the wine, may be extracted separately. And let us

128
00:07:57,800 --> 00:08:01,960
Speaker 2: talk about those botanicals for a minute, because Okay, the

129
00:08:02,000 --> 00:08:05,920
Speaker 2: traditional main flavor in Vermouth is wormwood, which is a

130
00:08:05,960 --> 00:08:12,560
Speaker 2: type of leafy herb, A taxonomical name artemisia absynthium. I think, yes,

131
00:08:12,800 --> 00:08:17,720
Speaker 2: wormwood is a traditional ingredient in absinthe. No drinking vermouth

132
00:08:17,840 --> 00:08:20,280
Speaker 2: or absinthe will not give you hallucinations. You're not consuming

133
00:08:20,480 --> 00:08:24,560
Speaker 2: enough wormwood through them. But yeah, wormwood is bitter and herbal,

134
00:08:24,920 --> 00:08:30,720
Speaker 2: sort of like a super cyan stage. Yeah. After that,

135
00:08:31,080 --> 00:08:33,120
Speaker 2: it's like kind of difficult to say what the most

136
00:08:33,120 --> 00:08:38,679
Speaker 2: popular flavorings are because, like Amari, recipes for remooth are

137
00:08:38,679 --> 00:08:42,160
Speaker 2: often guarded secrets, and as I said before, they can

138
00:08:42,440 --> 00:08:47,040
Speaker 2: vary just wildly. A dry white might incorporate peppermint and

139
00:08:47,160 --> 00:08:51,400
Speaker 2: lemon peel and cori under seed. Sweet red might include

140
00:08:51,440 --> 00:08:55,920
Speaker 2: bitter orange peel, rose petals, and ginger. Sweet white might

141
00:08:56,000 --> 00:09:01,160
Speaker 2: have hibiscus, basil and cinnamon. Other than that, I read

142
00:09:01,760 --> 00:09:09,720
Speaker 2: ingredients ranging from saffron to thyme, anis, vanilla, camomeal, cardamom, rosemerry, strawberry, cocoa.

143
00:09:10,760 --> 00:09:17,840
Speaker 2: You often have like thirty plus different flavorings in there. Dang, Yeah, yep.

144
00:09:20,280 --> 00:09:22,600
Speaker 2: A lot of these ingredients will have a bittering effect

145
00:09:22,600 --> 00:09:24,640
Speaker 2: on the wine, which you're gonna then want to balance

146
00:09:24,640 --> 00:09:27,960
Speaker 2: with some kind of added sweetener, maybe sweet grape, must

147
00:09:28,480 --> 00:09:33,240
Speaker 2: juice basically or sugar, either straight or caramelized or honey.

148
00:09:33,360 --> 00:09:35,000
Speaker 2: You can sweeten it a little bit or a lot,

149
00:09:35,920 --> 00:09:38,360
Speaker 2: and you're going to fortify your remooth with some kind

150
00:09:38,400 --> 00:09:40,559
Speaker 2: of distilled spirit which will bring it to its final

151
00:09:40,559 --> 00:09:43,840
Speaker 2: alcohol level and also help preserve it and give it

152
00:09:43,880 --> 00:09:47,480
Speaker 2: like a wee kick compared to straight wine, neutral grape

153
00:09:47,520 --> 00:09:52,160
Speaker 2: distillate brandy is common. Some producers might age remooth, maybe

154
00:09:52,160 --> 00:09:55,560
Speaker 2: in wood barrels, to develop further flavors. Again, a lot

155
00:09:55,559 --> 00:09:59,800
Speaker 2: of different production methods can go depending on how you

156
00:09:59,800 --> 00:10:02,880
Speaker 2: want to be able to label it. Because okay, laws

157
00:10:02,920 --> 00:10:05,840
Speaker 2: about what can be labeled removeth very in different places.

158
00:10:06,480 --> 00:10:10,280
Speaker 2: The European Union has the strictest designations. They're removed must

159
00:10:10,280 --> 00:10:15,760
Speaker 2: contain something in the Artemisia genus, usually wormwood. It can

160
00:10:15,800 --> 00:10:18,679
Speaker 2: only be sweetened with natural sweeteners. The final product must

161
00:10:18,720 --> 00:10:22,160
Speaker 2: contain at least seventy five percent wine and have between

162
00:10:22,320 --> 00:10:25,360
Speaker 2: fourteen point five and twenty two percent alcohol by volume,

163
00:10:25,559 --> 00:10:29,240
Speaker 2: having been fortified with whatever distilled liquor you like. There

164
00:10:29,240 --> 00:10:33,360
Speaker 2: are also five categories from sweet to dry for the

165
00:10:33,400 --> 00:10:36,720
Speaker 2: EU labeling standards, depending on the grams of sugar per

166
00:10:36,840 --> 00:10:41,080
Speaker 2: liter in the final product, and those those category labels

167
00:10:41,080 --> 00:10:47,720
Speaker 2: are sweet, semi sweet, semi dry, dry, and extra dry. Yeah.

168
00:10:48,200 --> 00:10:51,360
Speaker 2: There are a few types of remot that have geographical distinctions,

169
00:10:51,400 --> 00:10:55,600
Speaker 2: either nationally or internationally, which means that they are produced

170
00:10:55,640 --> 00:10:59,280
Speaker 2: under more strict rules than those those are removed pitino

171
00:10:59,640 --> 00:11:02,920
Speaker 2: removed d chimberry shimbiri. There you go, share great. I

172
00:11:02,920 --> 00:11:07,280
Speaker 2: don't know. French and a remoth day rey use remouth

173
00:11:07,480 --> 00:11:10,920
Speaker 2: is generally in the category of a paratifs, also called

174
00:11:10,960 --> 00:11:14,479
Speaker 2: a parativos, because they are traditionally meant to be consumed

175
00:11:14,640 --> 00:11:16,920
Speaker 2: in a small amount before a meal, as a sort

176
00:11:16,960 --> 00:11:21,840
Speaker 2: of a palette or appetite opener. Yeah. In cultures where

177
00:11:21,880 --> 00:11:24,440
Speaker 2: this is a thing, like any place with strong influence

178
00:11:24,480 --> 00:11:27,200
Speaker 2: from like these specific areas of Italy, France, and Spain,

179
00:11:28,440 --> 00:11:31,760
Speaker 2: this a paratif thing is not just a drink. It

180
00:11:31,880 --> 00:11:35,640
Speaker 2: is a social situation, like it's a way to transition

181
00:11:35,880 --> 00:11:39,600
Speaker 2: from day to evening, maybe with some snacks. I've read

182
00:11:39,600 --> 00:11:43,360
Speaker 2: it referred to as sacred y'all, y'all write in. I

183
00:11:43,400 --> 00:11:45,719
Speaker 2: do not have personal experience with this, but I love it.

184
00:11:47,120 --> 00:11:49,480
Speaker 1: Wow, yes, please write it.

185
00:11:51,480 --> 00:11:53,480
Speaker 2: But yeah, these days, remooths find their way into all

186
00:11:53,559 --> 00:11:56,360
Speaker 2: kinds of other applications. Mixed with soda water for a

187
00:11:56,400 --> 00:11:59,400
Speaker 2: sort of sprits, or mixed with liquors and other ingredients

188
00:11:59,400 --> 00:12:02,400
Speaker 2: to form lots of different cocktails. And yes, it's sometimes

189
00:12:02,480 --> 00:12:04,560
Speaker 2: used in cooking. The dry white type is just so

190
00:12:04,720 --> 00:12:09,800
Speaker 2: nice with like a seafood sauce. Oh yeah, good science.

191
00:12:09,880 --> 00:12:14,080
Speaker 2: Note here vermouth is fortified, but it's still perishable once opened,

192
00:12:14,440 --> 00:12:17,000
Speaker 2: like stored in the fridge after you've started in on

193
00:12:17,080 --> 00:12:19,640
Speaker 2: a bottle, and just be aware that it'll start losing

194
00:12:19,679 --> 00:12:21,559
Speaker 2: its charms after like a week or so.

195
00:12:21,559 --> 00:12:29,120
Speaker 1: So oh't no, it's like me on a vacation.

196
00:12:33,679 --> 00:12:36,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, gets a little bit rougher around the edges, Yeah,

197
00:12:36,440 --> 00:12:40,199
Speaker 2: a little flat maybe, like we can it's a little.

198
00:12:43,080 --> 00:12:45,560
Speaker 1: Well what about the nutrition.

199
00:12:46,000 --> 00:12:51,079
Speaker 2: Drink responsibly? Yes, yes, always, Yeah, yeah, that's all I

200
00:12:51,120 --> 00:12:52,840
Speaker 2: gotta say.

201
00:12:53,720 --> 00:12:55,240
Speaker 1: We do have some numbers for you.

202
00:12:55,920 --> 00:12:59,440
Speaker 2: We do, all right. The global market for vermouth is valued.

203
00:12:59,480 --> 00:13:02,920
Speaker 2: It's somewhere over ten billion dollars a year, or maybe

204
00:13:02,920 --> 00:13:06,200
Speaker 2: twice that much, with the sweet red types accounting for

205
00:13:06,280 --> 00:13:09,080
Speaker 2: nearly half of that. I read a lot of conflicting

206
00:13:09,120 --> 00:13:12,560
Speaker 2: numbers on this one. Basically, though, like vermouth is on

207
00:13:12,600 --> 00:13:15,360
Speaker 2: the rise and the dry types are starting to take

208
00:13:15,440 --> 00:13:18,440
Speaker 2: up like a larger part of the market, So that's interesting.

209
00:13:19,040 --> 00:13:21,840
Speaker 2: The top exporters are Italy, France, and Spain. The top

210
00:13:21,880 --> 00:13:28,480
Speaker 2: importers are Russia, the US, Poland and Germany. Cut science

211
00:13:28,520 --> 00:13:31,720
Speaker 2: thing that I it's not really a number, but like

212
00:13:31,760 --> 00:13:35,480
Speaker 2: I couldn't help but include it here. As I'm googling,

213
00:13:35,600 --> 00:13:38,640
Speaker 2: like whatever the thing we're talking about science, sometimes these

214
00:13:38,679 --> 00:13:41,400
Speaker 2: completely unrelated things come up and they're just so so

215
00:13:41,520 --> 00:13:46,720
Speaker 2: nerdy and joyful. Okay. So, in the world of molecular dynamics,

216
00:13:46,880 --> 00:13:52,360
Speaker 2: there is an application of molecules known as Martini that

217
00:13:52,520 --> 00:13:54,959
Speaker 2: was developed in two thousand and four. I don't really

218
00:13:55,040 --> 00:13:59,839
Speaker 2: understand why, but that's okay. Like, like two decades later,

219
00:14:00,080 --> 00:14:05,320
Speaker 2: twenty twenty three, these researchers were suggesting a coding framework

220
00:14:05,640 --> 00:14:10,880
Speaker 2: for modeling this type of molecular system that they called VERMOUTH,

221
00:14:11,840 --> 00:14:21,720
Speaker 2: standing for the Versatile Modular Universal Transformation Helper. I love

222
00:14:21,840 --> 00:14:24,960
Speaker 2: that because you know they use it in conversations. Oh yeah,

223
00:14:25,200 --> 00:14:27,200
Speaker 2: and I just love how hard they worked to get there.

224
00:14:27,920 --> 00:14:32,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, so good.

225
00:14:33,440 --> 00:14:36,480
Speaker 2: You know they were just giggling about it anyway. Yeah beautiful.

226
00:14:37,960 --> 00:14:40,480
Speaker 1: I mean that's where I am every time with the titles,

227
00:14:40,520 --> 00:14:47,440
Speaker 1: I'm like, ah, this is great, this is genius.

228
00:14:48,840 --> 00:14:51,040
Speaker 2: I don't think we've mentioned this on air in a while.

229
00:14:51,120 --> 00:14:53,600
Speaker 2: Annie does send me a whole list of titles for

230
00:14:53,720 --> 00:14:57,520
Speaker 2: every episode that we then, you know, like like kind

231
00:14:57,520 --> 00:14:59,120
Speaker 2: of workshop into the final form.

232
00:14:59,520 --> 00:15:04,440
Speaker 1: But I love how I send some to you that

233
00:15:04,480 --> 00:15:06,520
Speaker 1: I'm like, we can't use this one, but I need

234
00:15:06,520 --> 00:15:09,960
Speaker 1: you to know I thought of it. No one else

235
00:15:10,000 --> 00:15:12,760
Speaker 1: will get it, perhaps, but I need you to know,

236
00:15:14,760 --> 00:15:15,520
Speaker 1: uh huh.

237
00:15:15,920 --> 00:15:17,560
Speaker 2: And then there's a bunch that are based on like

238
00:15:17,600 --> 00:15:21,120
Speaker 2: weird song lyrics and stuff like that, and like like

239
00:15:21,280 --> 00:15:23,520
Speaker 2: specific last of us references and.

240
00:15:25,120 --> 00:15:29,240
Speaker 1: They're so specific, like I send twenty and probably only

241
00:15:29,560 --> 00:15:31,760
Speaker 1: like one third is usable.

242
00:15:34,000 --> 00:15:35,840
Speaker 2: There are things of beauty. There are things of beauty.

243
00:15:36,640 --> 00:15:40,000
Speaker 2: Oh all right, I couldn't find I couldn't find more,

244
00:15:40,040 --> 00:15:42,040
Speaker 2: but maybe I wasn't looking hard enough. There there are

245
00:15:42,080 --> 00:15:45,040
Speaker 2: a number of remooth festivals. All of the ones that

246
00:15:45,040 --> 00:15:48,040
Speaker 2: I found are in Spain, which makes sense because Spain

247
00:15:48,120 --> 00:15:52,520
Speaker 2: is currently trying to popularize it's remouth on a on

248
00:15:52,560 --> 00:15:55,280
Speaker 2: a wider market. France and Italy have been kind of

249
00:15:55,320 --> 00:15:59,560
Speaker 2: like the two main internationally known like pegs of Remo

250
00:16:00,480 --> 00:16:01,520
Speaker 2: and Spain is kind of.

251
00:16:01,480 --> 00:16:02,640
Speaker 1: Like, oh yeah, we exist. Too.

252
00:16:03,200 --> 00:16:06,320
Speaker 2: But yeah, so one in Barcelona is happening this very

253
00:16:06,360 --> 00:16:10,640
Speaker 2: weekend May third through fifth, shockingly timely on our part.

254
00:16:10,920 --> 00:16:13,480
Speaker 2: It's called Vermouth and Soul and it's like a jazz

255
00:16:13,600 --> 00:16:21,240
Speaker 2: slush remote festival. Oo right right. Another one from Spain

256
00:16:21,360 --> 00:16:25,320
Speaker 2: just passed in March was the ninth Annual International Vermouth

257
00:16:25,360 --> 00:16:26,280
Speaker 2: and a Partie Fair.

258
00:16:27,120 --> 00:16:27,560
Speaker 1: Love that.

259
00:16:29,840 --> 00:16:33,520
Speaker 2: And I think that the fifth annual Vermouth Festival in Rais,

260
00:16:33,640 --> 00:16:37,520
Speaker 2: Spain is happening early this June in celebration of the

261
00:16:37,560 --> 00:16:40,600
Speaker 2: fourteenth anniversary of the area having like a national designation

262
00:16:40,640 --> 00:16:45,520
Speaker 2: of origin for its wines in general beyond Vermouth. Yeah,

263
00:16:45,720 --> 00:16:47,800
Speaker 2: it's part of a larger wine festival that one looks.

264
00:16:47,880 --> 00:16:51,000
Speaker 2: They all look super fascinating. Again, if anyone has ever

265
00:16:51,040 --> 00:16:54,320
Speaker 2: been to any of these specific festivals or others, let.

266
00:16:54,200 --> 00:17:05,439
Speaker 1: Us know, please, please let us know. Well, we do

267
00:17:05,640 --> 00:17:07,280
Speaker 1: have quite a history for.

268
00:17:07,280 --> 00:17:12,199
Speaker 2: You, we do, we do, yeppers. Yeah, and we are

269
00:17:12,240 --> 00:17:13,800
Speaker 2: going to get into that as soon as we get

270
00:17:13,840 --> 00:17:16,359
Speaker 2: back from a quick break for word from our sponsors.

271
00:17:27,280 --> 00:17:30,919
Speaker 1: And we're back. Thank you sponsor, Yes, thank you. So

272
00:17:31,720 --> 00:17:37,520
Speaker 1: the history of Vermouth is very much disputed. Oh wow.

273
00:17:39,000 --> 00:17:46,080
Speaker 1: But Hippocrates, yes, yep, apparently made something close to Vermouth

274
00:17:46,080 --> 00:17:49,199
Speaker 1: as far back as four hundred BC in Greece, and

275
00:17:49,320 --> 00:17:52,919
Speaker 1: to make it he would macerate didney flowers and wormwood

276
00:17:53,400 --> 00:17:54,680
Speaker 1: along with local.

277
00:17:54,440 --> 00:17:58,960
Speaker 2: Wine, Didney being a type of oregano majora type of

278
00:17:59,080 --> 00:17:59,520
Speaker 2: type herb.

279
00:17:59,680 --> 00:18:00,000
Speaker 1: Yeah.

280
00:18:00,400 --> 00:18:01,840
Speaker 2: I didn't know what it was, so I had to

281
00:18:01,840 --> 00:18:04,080
Speaker 2: look it up. So, yep, that's what it is.

282
00:18:04,760 --> 00:18:06,520
Speaker 1: I had to look it up too, because I thought

283
00:18:06,600 --> 00:18:10,200
Speaker 1: it sounds like a potion ingrediment. That's what it is.

284
00:18:10,640 --> 00:18:13,000
Speaker 2: Mostly extinct now, so good job humans.

285
00:18:14,359 --> 00:18:18,760
Speaker 1: Wow, that was a downer. Sorry, No, it's okay. We

286
00:18:18,880 --> 00:18:21,400
Speaker 1: need to be realistic with the truth. I just wasn't

287
00:18:21,440 --> 00:18:25,920
Speaker 1: expecting it, so really, my bad. No, it's okay, that's

288
00:18:25,920 --> 00:18:31,399
Speaker 1: all right. Yeah, never apologize. So the result of this

289
00:18:31,600 --> 00:18:37,679
Speaker 1: was a sweet ish digestive called Hippocratic wine. He of

290
00:18:37,720 --> 00:18:41,119
Speaker 1: course prescribed it for all kinds of things, including period

291
00:18:41,200 --> 00:18:46,479
Speaker 1: pains and rheumatism. So you can look back at our

292
00:18:46,800 --> 00:18:53,480
Speaker 1: episodes we've done on things like the humors for an instance. Yeah,

293
00:18:53,840 --> 00:18:55,960
Speaker 1: but for a long time, people believed a good diet

294
00:18:56,200 --> 00:18:59,800
Speaker 1: needed to include a wide range of flavors.

295
00:19:00,480 --> 00:19:04,840
Speaker 2: Which is weirdly true. It is true, it is not

296
00:19:04,920 --> 00:19:06,440
Speaker 2: in the way that they were thinking, but.

297
00:19:08,080 --> 00:19:09,800
Speaker 1: Not in the way that they were thinking. But there's

298
00:19:09,840 --> 00:19:13,119
Speaker 1: several things that looking back, I'm like, you were onto something.

299
00:19:13,320 --> 00:19:16,720
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, we just hadn't figured it all out yet,

300
00:19:16,720 --> 00:19:19,360
Speaker 1: which we still haven't in a lot of cases. Absolutely.

301
00:19:19,720 --> 00:19:21,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, My science is so fun.

302
00:19:22,119 --> 00:19:27,400
Speaker 1: It's a great time to achieve this kind of wide

303
00:19:27,480 --> 00:19:30,480
Speaker 1: range of flavors is good diet. People would add herbs

304
00:19:30,520 --> 00:19:35,680
Speaker 1: and spices into things like wine, including absinthe too, by

305
00:19:35,720 --> 00:19:38,080
Speaker 1: the way, to create a tonic that was believed to

306
00:19:38,119 --> 00:19:43,399
Speaker 1: help and even prevent a whole host of issues. That

307
00:19:43,520 --> 00:19:48,760
Speaker 1: being said, according to one source, I found some trace

308
00:19:48,800 --> 00:19:52,040
Speaker 1: removed back to a wine out of China that was

309
00:19:52,040 --> 00:19:55,439
Speaker 1: spiced with rice, malt, honey, and fruit, going back as

310
00:19:55,440 --> 00:19:59,520
Speaker 1: far as eight thousand years ago. India most likely had

311
00:19:59,520 --> 00:20:03,679
Speaker 1: a version too, However, the author speculates and this was

312
00:20:03,720 --> 00:20:06,760
Speaker 1: from this was actually from an event. Notice I found

313
00:20:07,760 --> 00:20:09,800
Speaker 1: about somebody who had done a lot of research and

314
00:20:09,960 --> 00:20:13,320
Speaker 1: had written a book about Vermouth who was doing this talk.

315
00:20:14,680 --> 00:20:19,480
Speaker 1: He speculated that Vermouth probably popped up in a couple

316
00:20:19,480 --> 00:20:21,040
Speaker 1: of places separately.

317
00:20:21,520 --> 00:20:25,399
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, at this point, distillation didn't exist yet, so

318
00:20:25,440 --> 00:20:29,439
Speaker 2: it wouldn't have been fortified, but certainly adding wormwood to

319
00:20:29,560 --> 00:20:32,800
Speaker 2: wine was a thing that right, It seems like people

320
00:20:33,000 --> 00:20:34,879
Speaker 2: again they're like, oh, I like this thing, and I

321
00:20:34,960 --> 00:20:36,440
Speaker 2: like this thing. I'm going to smooth them together.

322
00:20:36,560 --> 00:20:41,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, yes, exactly, And as always, it goes back to

323
00:20:41,680 --> 00:20:49,120
Speaker 1: your definition of a thing. Yeah right. So meanwhile, over

324
00:20:49,200 --> 00:20:53,040
Speaker 1: in Rome, these types of wine based tonics became more

325
00:20:53,080 --> 00:20:57,600
Speaker 1: complex as they gained access to more spices via trade routes.

326
00:20:59,119 --> 00:21:01,840
Speaker 1: They added things like wormwood and honey to make these

327
00:21:01,880 --> 00:21:06,280
Speaker 1: really aromatic wines that were in high demand, perhaps particularly

328
00:21:06,359 --> 00:21:08,399
Speaker 1: enjoyed at the end of a mule.

329
00:21:09,880 --> 00:21:13,639
Speaker 2: After distillation did catch on in Europe right around what

330
00:21:13,680 --> 00:21:16,280
Speaker 2: was that, like like a thousand CE or so, people

331
00:21:16,320 --> 00:21:19,920
Speaker 2: began fortifying aromatic wines with brandy to help them last longer.

332
00:21:20,440 --> 00:21:24,040
Speaker 2: That was like early thirteen hundred CE or so that

333
00:21:24,440 --> 00:21:26,159
Speaker 2: records of that started popping up.

334
00:21:27,359 --> 00:21:32,320
Speaker 1: Right and during the Middle Ages. Two main remooth production

335
00:21:32,400 --> 00:21:36,199
Speaker 1: spots emerged in Europe, one in the Piedmont region of Italy,

336
00:21:36,320 --> 00:21:39,040
Speaker 1: where a lot of botanicals were available, and one near

337
00:21:39,119 --> 00:21:44,119
Speaker 1: France's southeast border. Both were within the borders of the

338
00:21:44,200 --> 00:21:47,440
Speaker 1: Kingdom of Savoy, so people often report that it originated

339
00:21:47,560 --> 00:21:48,080
Speaker 1: from there.

340
00:21:48,640 --> 00:21:51,479
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, and that's one way of settling the argument

341
00:21:51,520 --> 00:21:55,760
Speaker 2: of whether removeth is from France or Italy. It's from Savoy,

342
00:21:56,040 --> 00:21:59,240
Speaker 2: which was a political state that lay right across the

343
00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:03,000
Speaker 2: modern border friends in Italy near the Mediterranean coast from

344
00:22:03,040 --> 00:22:06,000
Speaker 2: around one thousand CE through the formation of the Kingdom

345
00:22:06,080 --> 00:22:08,119
Speaker 2: of Italy in the eighteen sixties.

346
00:22:09,760 --> 00:22:12,520
Speaker 1: Yes, and Savoy had a lot of grapes. But these

347
00:22:12,640 --> 00:22:16,760
Speaker 1: grapes didn't produce the best wine. I say that with

348
00:22:16,800 --> 00:22:19,199
Speaker 1: a laugh because it's always kind of comical to me

349
00:22:19,240 --> 00:22:22,280
Speaker 1: about I don't know what's the best wine. But yes,

350
00:22:23,880 --> 00:22:28,640
Speaker 1: they didn't produce the best wine. However, producers did have

351
00:22:28,760 --> 00:22:31,960
Speaker 1: access to a lot of ingredients and spices thanks to

352
00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:37,920
Speaker 1: their proximity to these trade routes, including things like cinnamon, cloves, cardamom, ginger,

353
00:22:38,040 --> 00:22:46,480
Speaker 1: and rhubarb, and people started experimenting. And this many sources.

354
00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:51,399
Speaker 1: I read trace our modern day Vermouth to Alessio di

355
00:22:51,560 --> 00:22:57,560
Speaker 1: Pimonte our Jeremano Ruscielli, who recorded recipes for wormwood wine

356
00:22:57,600 --> 00:22:59,320
Speaker 1: in the mid fifteen hundreds.

357
00:23:00,560 --> 00:23:06,440
Speaker 2: Okay, so there was this home remedy and recipe book

358
00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:10,080
Speaker 2: first published in Venice in fifteen fifty five that became

359
00:23:10,240 --> 00:23:13,280
Speaker 2: really widespread over the next few decades, it was called

360
00:23:13,640 --> 00:23:18,480
Speaker 2: of the Secrets of the Reverend Don Alicio Piedmontes. If

361
00:23:18,520 --> 00:23:20,919
Speaker 2: you could read in Europe during this period, and more

362
00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:23,880
Speaker 2: people did than you probably think, you probably came across

363
00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:28,520
Speaker 2: some version of this book as it was translated and

364
00:23:28,800 --> 00:23:32,600
Speaker 2: amended and updated by all kinds of editors and publishers.

365
00:23:32,800 --> 00:23:37,120
Speaker 2: Because copyright wasn't a thing yet, they were just trying

366
00:23:37,119 --> 00:23:40,000
Speaker 2: to sell more copies of this useful and popular book.

367
00:23:40,920 --> 00:23:44,480
Speaker 2: The thing is, Alessio doesn't seem to have been a

368
00:23:44,480 --> 00:23:49,199
Speaker 2: real person. The prevailing theory for a long time was

369
00:23:49,240 --> 00:23:53,080
Speaker 2: that this writer and early science dude Rasquelli had used

370
00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:55,679
Speaker 2: Alessio as a pen name and written this book. But

371
00:23:55,760 --> 00:23:59,840
Speaker 2: that's based on his own claim after Secrets was already

372
00:23:59,800 --> 00:24:03,440
Speaker 2: popular and he was trying to sell his own recipe

373
00:24:03,520 --> 00:24:07,080
Speaker 2: slash remedy books, so no one really knows. At any rate.

374
00:24:07,480 --> 00:24:12,520
Speaker 2: Various types of aroeumatized wine, including versions with wormwood, were

375
00:24:13,320 --> 00:24:17,000
Speaker 2: being made in Piedmont and beyond at this time, and

376
00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:19,320
Speaker 2: I'm pretty sure that there are recipes for it in

377
00:24:19,359 --> 00:24:27,280
Speaker 2: this book. At some point, yep, Remouth did not have

378
00:24:27,320 --> 00:24:30,520
Speaker 2: its name yet at this point though, the product was

379
00:24:30,560 --> 00:24:33,480
Speaker 2: just called wormwood wine in like whatever language was being used,

380
00:24:34,640 --> 00:24:38,880
Speaker 2: but back to Savoy. So in the fifteen fifties when

381
00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:42,800
Speaker 2: this book was published, the capital of Savoy was Shambairi

382
00:24:43,680 --> 00:24:46,200
Speaker 2: on what is modernly the French side of the Alps,

383
00:24:46,600 --> 00:24:49,320
Speaker 2: and the ruler was technically a duke under the Holy

384
00:24:49,400 --> 00:24:53,520
Speaker 2: Roman Empire. That's just a note. I just I looked

385
00:24:53,520 --> 00:24:54,960
Speaker 2: it up because I was so confused about this whole

386
00:24:55,040 --> 00:24:56,680
Speaker 2: Kingdom of Savoy thing. And then it was talking about

387
00:24:56,680 --> 00:24:58,239
Speaker 2: the ruler being a duke. So there you go.

388
00:24:58,320 --> 00:25:05,439
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, needed to share. Wow, thank you. To better

389
00:25:05,560 --> 00:25:08,680
Speaker 1: stave off the threat of French invasion, the Duke of

390
00:25:08,720 --> 00:25:12,560
Speaker 1: Savoy relocated the capital to the Piedmont region in fifteen.

391
00:25:12,320 --> 00:25:16,000
Speaker 2: Sixty three, specifically to a city called Tarno, which you

392
00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:18,280
Speaker 2: may know as Turin and in English.

393
00:25:19,640 --> 00:25:24,080
Speaker 1: Yes, and they ended up pretty much adopting this style

394
00:25:24,200 --> 00:25:28,119
Speaker 1: of aromatized wine in the royal court.

395
00:25:28,920 --> 00:25:33,080
Speaker 2: Meanwhile, wormwood was also known in Germanic states further north

396
00:25:33,440 --> 00:25:36,560
Speaker 2: as a medicinal herb and a bittering agent and like

397
00:25:36,560 --> 00:25:39,560
Speaker 2: a brewer's helper before hops were popular, and as a

398
00:25:39,560 --> 00:25:45,040
Speaker 2: flavoring for wine. This was possibly influenced by aromatic wines

399
00:25:45,280 --> 00:25:49,240
Speaker 2: from Piedmont. Many question marks. Couldn't get to the bottom

400
00:25:49,240 --> 00:25:52,600
Speaker 2: of that. At any rate. The Germanic word for wormwood

401
00:25:52,840 --> 00:25:56,680
Speaker 2: was remote, so the product was called remote wine.

402
00:25:56,920 --> 00:26:02,080
Speaker 1: There, yes, and eventually the vermouthvine found its way to

403
00:26:02,320 --> 00:26:06,320
Speaker 1: France's aristocracy, where some pronounced it Barmouth.

404
00:26:07,800 --> 00:26:11,680
Speaker 2: Back in to Reno, it really maintained that these these

405
00:26:11,880 --> 00:26:15,240
Speaker 2: wormwood wines really maintained their popularity with the Royal Court

406
00:26:15,240 --> 00:26:15,760
Speaker 2: of Savoy.

407
00:26:17,080 --> 00:26:20,760
Speaker 1: They even gave it an official title in seventeen sixty eight,

408
00:26:21,480 --> 00:26:27,080
Speaker 1: a perretivo de courte Love it, Yes, I love it too.

409
00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:31,919
Speaker 1: The demand for this product led to the proliferation of

410
00:26:32,040 --> 00:26:36,640
Speaker 1: shops in Torino offering concentrates of wormwood that vendors or consumers.

411
00:26:37,160 --> 00:26:39,119
Speaker 1: I couldn't get really to the bottom of this because

412
00:26:39,119 --> 00:26:41,800
Speaker 1: it sounded like it was a specific thing to the shops.

413
00:26:41,840 --> 00:26:45,119
Speaker 1: But then it also sounded like they sold the concentrate. Okay,

414
00:26:45,119 --> 00:26:47,680
Speaker 1: so people could make it, but yeah, you would add

415
00:26:47,720 --> 00:26:51,639
Speaker 1: it to the wine as a producer or a consumer

416
00:26:52,200 --> 00:26:55,920
Speaker 1: to make this yourself. One of these shops started offering

417
00:26:55,960 --> 00:26:59,520
Speaker 1: the first commercial brand of Vermouth in seventeen eighty six,

418
00:27:00,119 --> 00:27:05,320
Speaker 1: formulated by Antonio Bendetto Carpano. He used Moscato grapes to

419
00:27:05,320 --> 00:27:08,760
Speaker 1: make a higher quality wine than was typical for these

420
00:27:08,800 --> 00:27:13,520
Speaker 1: earlier vermuse and tapped local monks for ingredients. And he

421
00:27:13,600 --> 00:27:16,119
Speaker 1: called his product Remote.

422
00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:20,000
Speaker 2: And yes, that carpano. If you are familiar with vermouths,

423
00:27:20,119 --> 00:27:22,360
Speaker 2: that is one of the big brands to this day.

424
00:27:23,359 --> 00:27:27,320
Speaker 1: Yes, and it did not take long for his Remote

425
00:27:27,320 --> 00:27:30,600
Speaker 1: to gain some noteworthy fans, including the Duke of Savoy

426
00:27:30,680 --> 00:27:34,400
Speaker 1: at the time, who established it as the court's preferred wine.

427
00:27:35,400 --> 00:27:38,479
Speaker 1: Since more folks spoke French than German in this region,

428
00:27:38,560 --> 00:27:40,920
Speaker 1: people started widely calling it vermuth.

429
00:27:42,200 --> 00:27:46,359
Speaker 2: All of this popularity bred imitators or enthusiasts I guess

430
00:27:46,440 --> 00:27:50,359
Speaker 2: around Tourno and back in Chambeiri and down along the

431
00:27:50,359 --> 00:27:53,960
Speaker 2: coast of the Mediterranean, stretching mostly westward towards Spain.

432
00:27:55,760 --> 00:27:59,760
Speaker 1: Yes, in the eighteen hundreds, at herbalist in Lyon, France,

433
00:28:00,320 --> 00:28:06,560
Speaker 1: Joseph Noilly something like that decided that the almost salty

434
00:28:06,640 --> 00:28:09,800
Speaker 1: flavor created in the process of shipping wine and barrels

435
00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:14,000
Speaker 1: was pretty desirable actually, and something that he wanted to replicate.

436
00:28:14,640 --> 00:28:18,760
Speaker 1: He moved to Marseilles in eighteen thirteen, very confident that

437
00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:22,160
Speaker 1: he could find a market for it. He added flavors

438
00:28:22,200 --> 00:28:26,040
Speaker 1: like wormwood to his wine, along with things like bitter

439
00:28:26,119 --> 00:28:31,440
Speaker 1: orange and camomeal. He called his product Noiley Prats, which

440
00:28:31,480 --> 00:28:34,480
Speaker 1: also yes that one. I'm sorry if I was pronouncing it,

441
00:28:34,520 --> 00:28:34,960
Speaker 1: but if you.

442
00:28:34,960 --> 00:28:36,680
Speaker 2: Know, you know that one.

443
00:28:37,280 --> 00:28:42,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, yep, yep. A bunch of other companies followed suit

444
00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:45,280
Speaker 1: with their own products, but for the next several decades

445
00:28:45,600 --> 00:28:47,960
Speaker 1: to Reno remained the top producer.

446
00:28:48,560 --> 00:28:52,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, long standing brands like Martini and Rossi started up

447
00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:55,440
Speaker 2: during this time. It's like, it is hard to overstate

448
00:28:55,720 --> 00:29:01,200
Speaker 2: how popular this sweet red vermooth was here and also

449
00:29:01,240 --> 00:29:04,760
Speaker 2: Trino was was simultaneously developing like a serious cafe culture.

450
00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:07,959
Speaker 2: And those shops would sometimes make their own house of remouth,

451
00:29:08,080 --> 00:29:10,320
Speaker 2: which to this day you can still go to there

452
00:29:10,440 --> 00:29:11,080
Speaker 2: and get.

453
00:29:13,440 --> 00:29:17,960
Speaker 1: Yes. And they grew really protective over the product too.

454
00:29:18,000 --> 00:29:21,160
Speaker 1: In this region. The Duke of Savoyd decreed that the

455
00:29:21,200 --> 00:29:24,800
Speaker 1: wine could not be sold outside of the Piedmont region

456
00:29:25,040 --> 00:29:26,280
Speaker 1: in eighteen forty.

457
00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:29,640
Speaker 2: Yeah. So yeah, so this is where we get the

458
00:29:29,640 --> 00:29:33,760
Speaker 2: beginnings of that dichotomy of like dry white French styles

459
00:29:33,920 --> 00:29:38,440
Speaker 2: versus sweet red Terriino styles later returned to Italian styles

460
00:29:38,480 --> 00:29:41,120
Speaker 2: after Torino became part of the Kingdom Italy a couple

461
00:29:41,160 --> 00:29:45,680
Speaker 2: decades later. But yeah, outside of those two dominant styles,

462
00:29:45,680 --> 00:29:48,880
Speaker 2: other styles of Remouth were being developed. For example, the

463
00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:52,920
Speaker 2: sweet White style came out of Chambeiri, thanks largely to

464
00:29:53,080 --> 00:29:57,000
Speaker 2: the innovations and popularity of the Dolin brand, which set

465
00:29:57,040 --> 00:30:00,600
Speaker 2: up shop there around eighteen thirty. Spanish products of Vermouth

466
00:30:00,760 --> 00:30:02,640
Speaker 2: seems to have gotten started a little bit later towards

467
00:30:02,680 --> 00:30:05,120
Speaker 2: the turn of the century, but certainly like Vermouth had

468
00:30:05,160 --> 00:30:09,080
Speaker 2: already been a popular product in Raised Spain, which was

469
00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:12,280
Speaker 2: a major hub of wine trade during the eighteen hundreds.

470
00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:17,520
Speaker 1: Vermouth was also present at the eighteen fifty three World's

471
00:30:17,560 --> 00:30:21,040
Speaker 1: Fair in New York City, and around this time mixed

472
00:30:21,040 --> 00:30:25,120
Speaker 1: cocktails really started taking off around the globe, and several

473
00:30:25,160 --> 00:30:27,800
Speaker 1: of them incorporated removeth.

474
00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:30,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, there were also a few waves of Italian immigration

475
00:30:30,280 --> 00:30:33,280
Speaker 2: around this time, which brought Remove to places like the

476
00:30:33,400 --> 00:30:37,520
Speaker 2: United States and Argentina and further World's Fairs in eighteen

477
00:30:37,560 --> 00:30:41,800
Speaker 2: fifty six and eighteen sixty seven, like cemented the international

478
00:30:41,840 --> 00:30:48,080
Speaker 2: presence of Vermouth and included some really beautiful illustration posters.

479
00:30:48,120 --> 00:30:51,520
Speaker 2: Like Like illustrated posters that were gorgeous look them up.

480
00:30:51,560 --> 00:30:57,880
Speaker 2: Look them up. Yes, skipping ahead a little bit, World

481
00:30:57,880 --> 00:31:01,040
Speaker 2: War two really mucked up the existence of remouth in

482
00:31:01,080 --> 00:31:03,360
Speaker 2: the US for a while, starting with a halt on

483
00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:05,360
Speaker 2: imports for perhaps obvious reasons.

484
00:31:06,520 --> 00:31:10,440
Speaker 1: Right, there was also post World War II racism against

485
00:31:10,440 --> 00:31:15,040
Speaker 1: Italians and the low quality of many domestic replacements.

486
00:31:15,680 --> 00:31:18,000
Speaker 2: And you would think that remouth would have come back

487
00:31:18,080 --> 00:31:21,280
Speaker 2: with the martini boom of like the nineteen fifties, But

488
00:31:21,720 --> 00:31:25,720
Speaker 2: this was the era of the clean tasting vodka martini.

489
00:31:26,480 --> 00:31:29,320
Speaker 2: Noiley Pratt, I hope that we're saying that right, began

490
00:31:29,480 --> 00:31:34,440
Speaker 2: selling this like less flavorful, extra dry remoth here for

491
00:31:34,720 --> 00:31:36,200
Speaker 2: those martinis.

492
00:31:36,920 --> 00:31:40,440
Speaker 1: Kind Of interestingly too, people in the US at least

493
00:31:41,360 --> 00:31:44,560
Speaker 1: didn't like the whole medicinal vibe of remouth which had

494
00:31:44,600 --> 00:31:47,360
Speaker 1: been so popular, made it so popular for a while.

495
00:31:47,440 --> 00:31:51,360
Speaker 1: But that being said, for some communities, like Italian immigrants

496
00:31:51,400 --> 00:31:54,400
Speaker 1: in the US, their love never waned.

497
00:31:54,760 --> 00:31:57,520
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, And there are other places like Argentina where

498
00:31:57,520 --> 00:32:01,240
Speaker 2: it's popularity mostly increased. Local pt of remots there started

499
00:32:01,240 --> 00:32:05,080
Speaker 2: in the nineteen twenties or thirties. Also, there was a

500
00:32:05,120 --> 00:32:08,960
Speaker 2: wave of popularity for like simple slash kind of retro

501
00:32:09,200 --> 00:32:12,360
Speaker 2: vermouth sippers in the United States and the UK around

502
00:32:12,360 --> 00:32:14,720
Speaker 2: the nineteen seventies, kind of along with the rise of

503
00:32:14,760 --> 00:32:17,640
Speaker 2: like fresh Mediterranean style cuisine and sort of this like

504
00:32:17,680 --> 00:32:26,080
Speaker 2: aspirational Mediterranean vacation concept. Yeah, there are some amazing commercials

505
00:32:26,200 --> 00:32:30,440
Speaker 2: out of the UK television ads that mostly involved Joan

506
00:32:30,520 --> 00:32:33,040
Speaker 2: Collins getting remooths spilled on her accidentally.

507
00:32:38,280 --> 00:32:40,560
Speaker 1: Sorry, wasn't expecting that.

508
00:32:42,240 --> 00:32:46,600
Speaker 2: Full of surprises today.

509
00:32:45,360 --> 00:32:50,680
Speaker 1: The remooth episode ghost plays who okay?

510
00:32:51,160 --> 00:32:54,000
Speaker 2: As trends tend to go, though, towards the end of

511
00:32:54,040 --> 00:32:56,360
Speaker 2: the nineteen hundreds, Vermouth came to be considered like a

512
00:32:56,360 --> 00:32:59,520
Speaker 2: little bit old fashioned in communities that didn't have like

513
00:32:59,600 --> 00:33:04,160
Speaker 2: strong traditions towards it, especially during that heck in dark

514
00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:06,880
Speaker 2: Age of the cocktail around the nineteen nineties.

515
00:33:07,840 --> 00:33:09,320
Speaker 1: The Dark Age of the Cocktail.

516
00:33:10,400 --> 00:33:13,200
Speaker 2: But starting around the turn of the twenty first century,

517
00:33:13,480 --> 00:33:17,720
Speaker 2: a number of wineries and distilleries outside of the traditional

518
00:33:17,760 --> 00:33:22,120
Speaker 2: areas started producing their own remouths, including the US and

519
00:33:22,200 --> 00:33:26,520
Speaker 2: the UK, Australia and Germany, and new makers started really

520
00:33:26,520 --> 00:33:29,280
Speaker 2: playing with like riffs on the concept, like what wines

521
00:33:29,320 --> 00:33:32,840
Speaker 2: go into it, what you add to those? Perhaps in

522
00:33:32,920 --> 00:33:37,400
Speaker 2: response to this, in twenty nineteen, the European Union gave

523
00:33:37,520 --> 00:33:43,000
Speaker 2: a Vermouth di Torino a protected geographical indication. These vermouths

524
00:33:43,080 --> 00:33:47,240
Speaker 2: must be made in Piedmont using Italian wormwood and wine.

525
00:33:47,680 --> 00:33:52,280
Speaker 2: There's also a Spieriore designation that focuses on Piedmont produced

526
00:33:52,360 --> 00:33:56,520
Speaker 2: wines and herbs, and in twenty twenty three, after a

527
00:33:56,600 --> 00:34:00,600
Speaker 2: three year campaign, that term of vermouth di torino also

528
00:34:00,640 --> 00:34:04,840
Speaker 2: gained legal protection in the United States. So sometimes there,

529
00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:07,760
Speaker 2: sorry about my yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, and sorry about

530
00:34:07,760 --> 00:34:10,160
Speaker 2: my pronunciation being all over the place in this episode

531
00:34:10,200 --> 00:34:11,160
Speaker 2: that's it's been a long.

532
00:34:11,120 --> 00:34:17,920
Speaker 1: Day, Yeah, blanket apologies, like kind of as always like meal,

533
00:34:20,640 --> 00:34:25,839
Speaker 1: And I will say Vermouth anecdotally has certainly been part

534
00:34:25,840 --> 00:34:29,000
Speaker 1: of the craft cocktail movement in the US. I have

535
00:34:29,160 --> 00:34:33,240
Speaker 1: seen a lot more interest in it, partly from you, Lauren,

536
00:34:34,320 --> 00:34:35,839
Speaker 1: in the past decade or so.

537
00:34:36,560 --> 00:34:40,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, like the whole craft beverage movement more broadly. Yeah,

538
00:34:41,000 --> 00:34:44,440
Speaker 2: it's been featured on a lot of non European menus

539
00:34:44,600 --> 00:34:47,560
Speaker 2: by itself outside of cocktails, and there has been like

540
00:34:47,600 --> 00:34:51,759
Speaker 2: a Distiller led push for education and for clarity and

541
00:34:51,840 --> 00:34:55,799
Speaker 2: labeling as part of marketing efforts not to diminish the

542
00:34:55,800 --> 00:34:56,319
Speaker 2: cocktail part.

543
00:34:56,360 --> 00:34:56,520
Speaker 1: Though.

544
00:34:56,600 --> 00:35:00,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's also seen extra interest in the recent and

545
00:35:00,600 --> 00:35:03,799
Speaker 2: of low alcohol cocktails since what was that like twenty

546
00:35:03,840 --> 00:35:07,440
Speaker 2: eighteen ish, maybe, as it has about half the alcohol

547
00:35:07,480 --> 00:35:11,680
Speaker 2: content of liquors and therefore it can make for lighter cocktails.

548
00:35:12,200 --> 00:35:19,200
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, I think Remoose's future is bright. Oh yeah,

549
00:35:19,560 --> 00:35:24,760
Speaker 1: it does feel like a it's a very potion esque vibe.

550
00:35:25,040 --> 00:35:30,040
Speaker 1: Oh yeah. The Tomorrow episode was front of mine for

551
00:35:30,160 --> 00:35:32,200
Speaker 1: me when I was doing this research.

552
00:35:32,360 --> 00:35:32,960
Speaker 2: Absolutely.

553
00:35:33,320 --> 00:35:37,280
Speaker 1: Yeah. That was a fun one. If you haven't heard it, oh.

554
00:35:37,160 --> 00:35:41,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, and great great interview with the excellent humans

555
00:35:41,480 --> 00:35:45,680
Speaker 2: at the Eta Rhine Distillery in Asheville, who then right

556
00:35:45,760 --> 00:35:49,000
Speaker 2: gave us that beautiful tale about how they got their

557
00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:52,239
Speaker 2: name that we use story Yeah yeah, ghost story that

558
00:35:52,280 --> 00:35:53,720
Speaker 2: we did in a Halloween episode.

559
00:35:54,400 --> 00:36:01,840
Speaker 1: Yes, oh yes. But also I do mind it fascinating

560
00:36:01,880 --> 00:36:04,759
Speaker 1: as people who this is our job and we get

561
00:36:04,760 --> 00:36:07,840
Speaker 1: invited to stuff sometimes or sometimes we just go to

562
00:36:07,880 --> 00:36:09,520
Speaker 1: stuff whether we were invited or not.

563
00:36:11,120 --> 00:36:13,040
Speaker 2: Famous party crashers the Savor days.

564
00:36:13,880 --> 00:36:19,319
Speaker 1: Yes, I've been to several events where it'll be like,

565
00:36:20,640 --> 00:36:23,480
Speaker 1: what you get wrong about sherry, and it'll they'll go

566
00:36:23,640 --> 00:36:26,520
Speaker 1: through the history of sherry and they'll have tastings and

567
00:36:26,560 --> 00:36:29,759
Speaker 1: pairings and all this stuff. So that business part of

568
00:36:29,800 --> 00:36:33,560
Speaker 1: it to me is very fascinating. Yeah, and I feel

569
00:36:33,600 --> 00:36:37,399
Speaker 1: like Vermouth is going through that or has just been

570
00:36:37,440 --> 00:36:40,400
Speaker 1: through that where it's like, no, you can just drink it.

571
00:36:40,520 --> 00:36:42,000
Speaker 2: You can drink it, it's nice.

572
00:36:42,640 --> 00:36:44,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, or you can put into cocktail, or you can

573
00:36:44,200 --> 00:36:49,200
Speaker 1: have a like lower alcohol content. Like yeah, it's just

574
00:36:49,719 --> 00:36:51,880
Speaker 1: really interesting to me. I appreciate it.

575
00:36:53,239 --> 00:36:55,560
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, oh heck yeah, and especially right, like, it's

576
00:36:55,560 --> 00:37:00,000
Speaker 2: so fascinating that all of these brands have one hundreds

577
00:37:00,040 --> 00:37:05,160
Speaker 2: of years of history and are still going. And some

578
00:37:05,239 --> 00:37:09,839
Speaker 2: of them have like specifically brought back classic recipes like

579
00:37:09,840 --> 00:37:14,680
Speaker 2: my favorite sort of go to sweet red Italian formouth

580
00:37:14,880 --> 00:37:20,720
Speaker 2: is one by Carpano that released this Antica Formula, which

581
00:37:20,760 --> 00:37:25,520
Speaker 2: is based on some of Carpano's original notes for making remouth,

582
00:37:25,640 --> 00:37:27,719
Speaker 2: and it's kind of like their throwback and it's so good.

583
00:37:28,160 --> 00:37:30,600
Speaker 2: Oh my goodness, it makes a delicious Manhattan.

584
00:37:31,239 --> 00:37:38,560
Speaker 3: Okay, good note, good note. Yeah, it's so cool to

585
00:37:38,840 --> 00:37:42,360
Speaker 3: the history of it, but also fascinating to see the

586
00:37:42,480 --> 00:37:44,800
Speaker 3: kind of remember this though.

587
00:37:48,480 --> 00:37:51,880
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. I also I know nothing about Italian history

588
00:37:51,880 --> 00:37:54,319
Speaker 2: other than what Shakespeare wrote, who I'm pretty sure also

589
00:37:54,320 --> 00:37:58,719
Speaker 2: didn't know anything about Italian history, so that's always fun

590
00:37:58,719 --> 00:38:00,160
Speaker 2: in these episodes.

591
00:38:02,960 --> 00:38:08,560
Speaker 1: Well, listeners, you can always write in we love hearing

592
00:38:08,560 --> 00:38:11,719
Speaker 1: from this. But I think that's what we have to

593
00:38:11,719 --> 00:38:13,000
Speaker 1: say about Remove for now.

594
00:38:13,280 --> 00:38:16,160
Speaker 2: It is. We do already have some listener mail for you, though,

595
00:38:16,160 --> 00:38:17,480
Speaker 2: and we are going to get into that as soon

596
00:38:17,520 --> 00:38:19,040
Speaker 2: as we get back from one more quick break for

597
00:38:19,080 --> 00:38:31,759
Speaker 2: a word from our sponsors, and we're back. Thank you, sponsor, Yes,

598
00:38:31,880 --> 00:38:44,640
Speaker 2: thank you, and we're back with listeners. It's very magical,

599
00:38:44,680 --> 00:38:45,360
Speaker 2: thank you, Annie.

600
00:38:46,440 --> 00:38:51,359
Speaker 1: Removeth is magical, it is, it is, so are these

601
00:38:51,440 --> 00:38:55,120
Speaker 1: listener mails. I have to say. We continue to get

602
00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:57,440
Speaker 1: messages about Mountain Dew, which is great, but now we're

603
00:38:57,480 --> 00:39:04,400
Speaker 1: getting a lot about thousand Islands. Oh, Place's aces beautiful

604
00:39:04,960 --> 00:39:11,680
Speaker 1: coming so good, but okay, Jacob wrote, I'd completely forgotten

605
00:39:11,840 --> 00:39:15,279
Speaker 1: about the Mountain Dew Sweet Lightning until you mentioned it.

606
00:39:15,480 --> 00:39:19,800
Speaker 1: Considering it was a KFC exclusive, a honey peach flavor

607
00:39:20,120 --> 00:39:23,920
Speaker 1: and the down home vibe of old mountain dew and KFC,

608
00:39:24,360 --> 00:39:26,040
Speaker 1: it's pretty clear that it was trying to be a

609
00:39:26,040 --> 00:39:31,759
Speaker 1: cross between sweet Tea and white Lightning another name for moonshine.

610
00:39:31,920 --> 00:39:34,600
Speaker 2: I can't believe I didn't put this together me either,

611
00:39:35,040 --> 00:39:35,680
Speaker 2: that's wonderful.

612
00:39:35,719 --> 00:39:38,960
Speaker 1: When I read this, I was like, I need to

613
00:39:38,960 --> 00:39:41,040
Speaker 1: go sit in a corner or something that What.

614
00:39:43,160 --> 00:39:47,920
Speaker 2: Did I not realize? It's beautiful. I adore this. I

615
00:39:47,960 --> 00:39:51,440
Speaker 2: adore everything about this. What a what a beautiful further

616
00:39:51,880 --> 00:39:58,200
Speaker 2: marketing of this increasingly elusive moonshine connection.

617
00:39:58,440 --> 00:40:04,160
Speaker 1: Yes, that's so great. I love how there's still like moonshine,

618
00:40:04,320 --> 00:40:13,160
Speaker 1: but moonshine. Yeah, remember these were our roots. You can't

619
00:40:13,160 --> 00:40:17,360
Speaker 1: have moonshine, but we'll hint at it. Yep, it's great.

620
00:40:17,440 --> 00:40:24,680
Speaker 2: It's great for a soda. Oh, Alicia, Alicia, I'm not sure.

621
00:40:25,520 --> 00:40:28,440
Speaker 2: Sorry about just words. I'm sorry about words today. Okay,

622
00:40:28,480 --> 00:40:31,040
Speaker 2: here we are. Uh, they wrote It's been a while

623
00:40:31,080 --> 00:40:33,280
Speaker 2: since I've written in, but I listened to the episode

624
00:40:33,280 --> 00:40:36,359
Speaker 2: one Thousand Island Dressing and had to write in. I

625
00:40:36,400 --> 00:40:38,600
Speaker 2: was born and raised in the Thousand Islands, and I

626
00:40:38,600 --> 00:40:41,920
Speaker 2: can tell you that the story about the dressing is baffling.

627
00:40:42,239 --> 00:40:44,960
Speaker 2: There are just so many opinions about the origin and

628
00:40:45,040 --> 00:40:49,040
Speaker 2: in the area. People are so passionate about it. I've

629
00:40:49,040 --> 00:40:52,080
Speaker 2: heard more arguments than I would like to admit. I'm

630
00:40:52,120 --> 00:40:54,600
Speaker 2: sorry to inform you, but George Bolt never actually lived

631
00:40:54,800 --> 00:40:57,920
Speaker 2: in Bolt Castle. The project on Heart Island was abandoned.

632
00:40:58,360 --> 00:41:01,040
Speaker 2: I've visited many times and my dad actually worked maintenance

633
00:41:01,080 --> 00:41:04,000
Speaker 2: crew there. They're trying to complete it now. I would

634
00:41:04,040 --> 00:41:07,000
Speaker 2: recommend doing the self tour there, the two Nation tour

635
00:41:07,239 --> 00:41:10,279
Speaker 2: on Uncle Sam boat Tours, and going to Chipewa Bay

636
00:41:10,320 --> 00:41:13,120
Speaker 2: to visit Singer Castle as well. The story about the

637
00:41:13,160 --> 00:41:15,359
Speaker 2: Thousand Islands in is what most of us go by.

638
00:41:15,480 --> 00:41:18,040
Speaker 2: In a way, what many of us claim is that

639
00:41:18,120 --> 00:41:20,760
Speaker 2: it was created on a fishing boat in the middle

640
00:41:20,880 --> 00:41:24,600
Speaker 2: of the river. The location is very much disputed, as

641
00:41:24,640 --> 00:41:28,439
Speaker 2: people claim the boat was in Clayton and Alexandria Bay.

642
00:41:28,960 --> 00:41:31,160
Speaker 2: The Thousand Islands Inn has a big claim for it,

643
00:41:31,200 --> 00:41:34,080
Speaker 2: though unfortunately I don't believe this location is open at

644
00:41:34,080 --> 00:41:37,400
Speaker 2: this time due to local politics. In this episode, I

645
00:41:37,440 --> 00:41:40,719
Speaker 2: found myself yelling out facts before y'all said them. Great

646
00:41:40,760 --> 00:41:43,360
Speaker 2: job on the island count it's a common tourist question,

647
00:41:43,800 --> 00:41:47,480
Speaker 2: and yes, an island is very specifically a land mass

648
00:41:47,480 --> 00:41:51,600
Speaker 2: exposed year round with one tree. Such a crazy fact.

649
00:41:51,920 --> 00:41:54,000
Speaker 2: I spent most of my life working at state parks

650
00:41:54,000 --> 00:41:55,680
Speaker 2: in the area, so I needed to learn a lot

651
00:41:55,719 --> 00:41:58,360
Speaker 2: of information about it. As always, y'all did a wonderful

652
00:41:58,400 --> 00:42:00,640
Speaker 2: job with this episode. It was exciting to hear about

653
00:42:00,640 --> 00:42:06,520
Speaker 2: my hometown. Oh yay, Yes, that's so good. I'm glad

654
00:42:06,640 --> 00:42:12,319
Speaker 2: a whole heck, that's like way off honestly, yes, And

655
00:42:12,400 --> 00:42:16,160
Speaker 2: thank you so much for writing in because the experience

656
00:42:16,200 --> 00:42:18,880
Speaker 2: of someone that lives in the places we're just you know,

657
00:42:19,080 --> 00:42:23,360
Speaker 2: it's so valuable and so great. Yeah, yeah, really really affirming.

658
00:42:24,520 --> 00:42:27,600
Speaker 1: But also I just love this. I love oh yeah,

659
00:42:28,120 --> 00:42:31,560
Speaker 1: people are passionate about it, they fight about it.

660
00:42:31,800 --> 00:42:32,120
Speaker 2: Yeah.

661
00:42:32,160 --> 00:42:36,960
Speaker 1: I love that there's a specific story details, vague but specific,

662
00:42:37,880 --> 00:42:39,880
Speaker 1: invented on a fishing boat.

663
00:42:41,200 --> 00:42:43,359
Speaker 2: No, it's no, that's that's a good way of you know,

664
00:42:43,440 --> 00:42:46,160
Speaker 2: like like it. Well, it wasn't invented here or here.

665
00:42:46,200 --> 00:42:47,160
Speaker 2: It was in the middle of the river.

666
00:42:47,200 --> 00:42:47,439
Speaker 1: Okay.

667
00:42:47,440 --> 00:42:48,920
Speaker 2: Can we all agree it was the middle of the river.

668
00:42:49,000 --> 00:42:50,000
Speaker 2: Is that okay with everybody?

669
00:42:50,040 --> 00:42:50,400
Speaker 1: I love this.

670
00:42:51,760 --> 00:42:57,320
Speaker 2: Also, good tour recommendations. Thank you. It looks it looks

671
00:42:57,360 --> 00:43:00,600
Speaker 2: so beautiful, Like I I really I really want to

672
00:43:00,600 --> 00:43:01,000
Speaker 2: go to there.

673
00:43:01,880 --> 00:43:03,759
Speaker 1: I do as well, and I would love to hear

674
00:43:05,080 --> 00:43:09,400
Speaker 1: these facts and passionate opinions. And also, yes, thank you

675
00:43:09,440 --> 00:43:12,239
Speaker 1: for confirming because I know we mentioned in the episode

676
00:43:12,480 --> 00:43:20,479
Speaker 1: we weren't sure. Yeah, George Bolt had ever gone lived there? Yeah, yes,

677
00:43:21,080 --> 00:43:23,799
Speaker 1: I can't believe. I mean it can, but wow, they're

678
00:43:23,800 --> 00:43:25,879
Speaker 1: still working on it. Yeah.

679
00:43:25,960 --> 00:43:26,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's wild.

680
00:43:27,440 --> 00:43:30,799
Speaker 1: That's that is all. It is very very wild. But yes,

681
00:43:30,880 --> 00:43:35,800
Speaker 1: we appreciate it very much. Thank you. Thanks to both

682
00:43:36,120 --> 00:43:39,440
Speaker 1: of these listeners for writing in. If you would like

683
00:43:39,440 --> 00:43:41,800
Speaker 1: to write to as you can, Our email is Hello

684
00:43:41,920 --> 00:43:43,640
Speaker 1: at savorpod dot com.

685
00:43:43,840 --> 00:43:47,120
Speaker 2: We're also on social media. You can find us on Twitter, Facebook,

686
00:43:47,160 --> 00:43:49,920
Speaker 2: and Instagram at savor pod, and we do hope to

687
00:43:49,920 --> 00:43:52,719
Speaker 2: hear from you. Savor is production of iHeartRadio. For more

688
00:43:52,760 --> 00:43:55,319
Speaker 2: podcasts on my Heart Radio, you can visit the iHeartRadio app,

689
00:43:55,440 --> 00:43:58,160
Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

690
00:43:58,400 --> 00:44:01,640
Speaker 2: Thanks as always, Toy superproducer, Dylan Fagan and Andrew Howard.

691
00:44:01,880 --> 00:44:03,560
Speaker 2: Thanks to you for listening, and we hope that lots

692
00:44:03,560 --> 00:44:12,840
Speaker 2: of more good things are coming your way