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Speaker 2: All right, let's get to the broader market here. You're
Speaker 2: taking a look at treasuries, still having all the sell
Speaker 2: off here, yield's really pushing higher. The question is why
Speaker 2: is it just purely just a risk on trade and
Speaker 2: then risk off and treasuries. Let's get more with Ira Jersey,
Speaker 2: Bloomberg Intelligence Chief US Interest Rate strategistic joining us IRA.
Speaker 2: When you look at a move like this, is this
Speaker 2: a purely Hey, tariffs might not be as bad. We're
Speaker 2: buy inequities, we're selling bonds.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it's as simple as that, Alex. At
Speaker 3: least this morning the headline certainly of the SMP Global
Speaker 3: pmis also didn't hurt any either. You saw a little
Speaker 3: bit of a move after that with yields moving up
Speaker 3: a basis one or two, But generally it's the risk
Speaker 3: on sentiment right now. And you know, we've been talking
Speaker 3: about the entire year We're going to have this play between, Look,
Speaker 3: are we going into a recession anytime soon or is
Speaker 3: the economy going to hang on just enough that the
Speaker 3: Fed Reserve is going to be reluctant to cut interest
Speaker 3: rates because you know, the services sector is doing okay.
Speaker 3: Plus tariffs might increase inflation expectations. So the market just
Speaker 3: hovering around this, you know, low four percent range for
Speaker 3: the tenure yield is probably something that we're going to
Speaker 3: continue to see for quite a long time.
Speaker 4: We're going to get some inflation data at the end
Speaker 4: of this week, Ira, what do you think the how
Speaker 4: do you think the Fed's looking at this core PCEE
Speaker 4: data that we'll get on Friday.
Speaker 3: Well, they like the core PC data. But usually and
Speaker 3: in the recent past, the forecast has been done a
Speaker 3: pretty good job in determining where it's going to be,
Speaker 3: at least within a tenth of a percent. So I
Speaker 3: suspect that that the market. Yeah, if there's a big surprise,
Speaker 3: obviously the market will move. But I think we'll move
Speaker 3: on that and think about next week's non form payroll
Speaker 3: report and some of the other PMI reports that we
Speaker 3: get from the US from the Institute of Supply management
Speaker 3: next week. Those tend to be the bigger movers, right,
Speaker 3: and the jobs market still is the key, with certainly
Speaker 3: CPI inflation being number two. Interestingly, when you look at
Speaker 3: what the ten year yield has been most sensitive to
Speaker 3: in terms of changes when data points miss, it's always
Speaker 3: payrolls number one. CPI has been number two, but this
Speaker 3: pc inflator is all the way down at number seven
Speaker 3: right now in our list of the top ten, so
Speaker 3: that's fallen off quite a bit. Retail sales, on the
Speaker 3: other hand, that's now number three. That had been number
Speaker 3: two for a long time. But those three are really
Speaker 3: the data points that you want to focus in on.
Speaker 3: That's certainly when you see any shifts there, that's when
Speaker 3: you're going to see big moves in the treasury market.
Speaker 2: And we get some auctions this week as well, really
Speaker 2: in the belly of the curve. You had mentioned earlier
Speaker 2: last week that the ten year had kind of found
Speaker 2: its high, but we're looking for a bottom. But what
Speaker 2: does that mean then for the belly.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so we get twos, fives, and seven So those
Speaker 3: fives and sevens is distinctively the belly. I actually think
Speaker 3: tomorrow's two year auction will be maybe the most well
Speaker 3: bid this year of the this week's auctions, in part
Speaker 3: because the break even and the risk factors that you
Speaker 3: can get at a four percent two year yield means
Speaker 3: that basically yields have to double over the next year
Speaker 3: for people to start losing money. So you're if you're
Speaker 3: an investor, whether you're benchmark to some index or you
Speaker 3: just want to hide somewhere, the two year I think
Speaker 3: will still get pretty good demand, But those fives and
Speaker 3: sevens are the question, Alex, and I think that they'll
Speaker 3: probably do okay. And I'm basing that on the fact
Speaker 3: that last week's twenty year and the twenty year auctions
Speaker 3: have not gone particularly well in general over the last
Speaker 3: couple of years. But last week it was very strong.
Speaker 3: Auction was one of the strongest twenty year auctions that
Speaker 3: we've actually had since that point was reintroduced. And so
Speaker 3: I do think that that fines and sevens this week
Speaker 3: will probably go okay, particularly if they cheapen up a
Speaker 3: little bit here over the next forty eight hours.
Speaker 2: As Paul, have you totally tuned out at this moment
Speaker 2: because I was talking about auctions.
Speaker 4: Yes, sweet, I did, absolutely.
Speaker 5: I feel you, I, but I'm ready to follow up here.
Speaker 4: What's the soccer match we got to focus on in
Speaker 4: the next couple of days here? I?
Speaker 3: Oh, well, I'm still I'm still depressed that the United
Speaker 3: States came in fourth in the Nations League in over
Speaker 3: the weekend, losing to both to both Panama and Canada
Speaker 3: in the consolation game. So you know, ask me later
Speaker 3: this week and I'll let you know.
Speaker 4: He got him off his game. All right, Iran, thank
Speaker 4: you so much. We appreciate it. Ivery Jersey Chief, you
Speaker 4: wish interest rate strategist, Chief International soccer strategist for bloomerg Intelligence.
Speaker 4: You wears two hats.
Speaker 2: There.
Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Intelligence Podcast. Catch us live
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Speaker 2: Alex Deal, You're alongside paulse We need this at Bloomberg
Speaker 2: Intelligence Radio. Happy rainy Monday in New York. Were broadcasting
Speaker 2: live from our interactive broken studio right here in Mintown, Manhattan,
Speaker 2: and also check us out on YouTube as well. I's
Speaker 2: got to check in on the markets. We're obviously seeing
Speaker 2: a relief rally here. It's definitely a risk on kind
Speaker 2: of day. Does it last? What do you do with it?
Speaker 2: Danian Dioria is co chief investment officer at Investment, joining
Speaker 2: us now from Hartford Data. Is this the kind of
Speaker 2: day that you sell into rallies or do you feel like,
Speaker 2: all right, things are going to.
Speaker 1: Go well well?
Speaker 6: I mean, you know, the obviously the correction that preceded
Speaker 6: all of this was a lot more sentiment driven, I
Speaker 6: think than fundamentals driven. And so you know, if you're
Speaker 6: going to be trading on any of these moves in
Speaker 6: the market, you know, any of the hey, now we're
Speaker 6: going to have a.
Speaker 5: Lot of tear ffs, no apso we're cutting back. It's
Speaker 5: going to be the dirty fifteen. It's not going to
Speaker 5: be everybody, et cetera.
Speaker 6: Then yeah, this is probably a buying moment I think
Speaker 6: for the app person. You know, in the average investor,
Speaker 6: it's more about what are the fundamentals here? Do we
Speaker 6: actually think you know, the kind of the tariff tantrum
Speaker 6: that we're going through and have been going through and
Speaker 6: will continue to you know, in spite of a little
Speaker 6: bit of positive news on that front, you know, is
Speaker 6: that is that something that's going to ultimately lead to
Speaker 6: broader concerns in the market. And you know, look, corrections
Speaker 6: three quarters of the time don't lead to recessions. But
Speaker 6: you know, a lot of it depends on what news
Speaker 6: is yet.
Speaker 5: To come.
Speaker 4: For a world where there is some level of uncertainly
Speaker 4: maybe greater than average. Is it a way you construct
Speaker 4: your portfolio, is how you allocate your assets or just
Speaker 4: buy quality and I guess hope for the best.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 6: So I mean, look, there's a there's a lot of
Speaker 6: different ways you can kind of come at this. Certainly,
Speaker 6: and we sit you know, investments, it's at the junction
Speaker 6: of a lot of manager there's.
Speaker 5: A lot of research services.
Speaker 6: I mean, certainly you're hearing a lot more international speak.
Speaker 6: You know, obviously I came into this year, I'll be
Speaker 6: honest with you. We do these chief Investment Officer panels everywhere,
Speaker 6: and the idea of US dominance was just you know,
Speaker 6: very much a theme at these panels. And you know, look,
Speaker 6: markets are cyclical, and certainly the US markets had much
Speaker 6: higher valuations than international markets.
Speaker 5: I think you're seeing some repricing of that now.
Speaker 6: But you know, the tone has shifted, right, and you're
Speaker 6: hearing more around well, hey, maybe international diversification is a
Speaker 6: good idea in portfolios. We would say that's a long
Speaker 6: run secular asset allocation need you know, for most people, right,
Speaker 6: unless you're unless you're completely focused on US indexes and
Speaker 6: can't handle the tracking error, we would largely say be
Speaker 6: diverse bied international markets.
Speaker 5: Anyway, we are certainly.
Speaker 6: Hearing more now even from a news and macro perspective,
Speaker 6: that looking at international you know, having diversification away from
Speaker 6: US makes sense.
Speaker 2: And does that do you have to sell something to
Speaker 2: then buy or is this like, hey, I had some cash,
Speaker 2: I'm going to deploy.
Speaker 5: Well, you know, that's a great question because of course.
Speaker 6: We've been living in the last few years with this
Speaker 6: massive amount of money sitting in cash. And while it's great,
Speaker 6: you know, we're past these years of financial repression for
Speaker 6: just savers.
Speaker 5: We all know that, you know that kind of.
Speaker 6: The traditional wisdom is unless it's money you need in
Speaker 6: the next three years.
Speaker 5: It's probably better served than sitting in cash.
Speaker 6: So there are certainly people with money on the sidelines
Speaker 6: who they've missed, you know, whopping twenty plus percent two
Speaker 6: years in a row from the S and P for example,
Speaker 6: And as we all know, you know, it's time in
Speaker 6: the market, right, if you're missing those big months, years,
Speaker 6: et cetera, it's really hard to make that back up
Speaker 6: when you look at the average that.
Speaker 5: You accumulate over time.
Speaker 6: So look, if you if you have long run money
Speaker 6: sitting in cash, for sure, we would say put that
Speaker 6: into a balanced portfolio. But the other side of the
Speaker 6: coin is you've also got a lot of people who
Speaker 6: leaned into stocks, right, very pro growth optimism that we
Speaker 6: started the year. You know, obviously big run up, especially
Speaker 6: driven by growth, and so you have people who are
Speaker 6: overweight equities. And if your overweight equities relative to your
Speaker 6: risk tolerance and what you can handle, you know, you
Speaker 6: should be thinking about harvesting from the equity position if
Speaker 6: you're doing more equity, and you should also be thinking
Speaker 6: about getting more into fixed income.
Speaker 4: Well, in your notes, you've got bitcoin is no gold,
Speaker 4: So let me get your thoughts on bitcoin.
Speaker 6: Yeah, you know it's bitcoin is one dred percent from
Speaker 6: my perspective, a risk on speculative asset. I we read
Speaker 6: and you know you're seeing headlines obviously now comparing kind
Speaker 6: of the performance of bitcoin and gold are these places
Speaker 6: to kind of hot out, say again, good, thank you? Yeah,
Speaker 6: so so so look are these places to hide out?
Speaker 6: And we would just very much point out that they
Speaker 6: are massively different. You know, when people think about a
Speaker 6: bitcoin investment, they're not thinking about it a as a
Speaker 6: currency or b as you know, certainly you know, there's
Speaker 6: an argument that this is another form it's digital gold,
Speaker 6: but from the standpoint of the volatility of these assets,
Speaker 6: there's no comparison.
Speaker 5: And when you're thinking about bitcoin, it's really kind.
Speaker 6: Of more this asymmetric payoff, the potential for sort of
Speaker 6: like a lott of like return.
Speaker 5: If you want.
Speaker 6: That, that's fine, But thinking that it looks like gold
Speaker 6: and is going to be a safe haven asset I
Speaker 6: think doesn't work.
Speaker 2: Okay, So that kind of lined me up for the
Speaker 2: safe haven part. So all this taking into effect what's
Speaker 2: like your best safe haven trade right now?
Speaker 6: Certainly fixed income, you know, the standard place to have
Speaker 6: ballast in the portfolio, I think makes a lot.
Speaker 5: Of sense still.
Speaker 6: You know, but if you're talking about with inequity markets,
Speaker 6: you started off there actually mentioned quality.
Speaker 5: There's a couple of different ways to go after quality.
Speaker 6: You can do you know, traditional quality is a fundamental indicator.
Speaker 6: You're looking for stocks that or you know, frankly ETFs
Speaker 6: or mutual funds with a bevy of stocks that have
Speaker 6: high quality earnings, right, so high profitability, you know, not
Speaker 6: the need to reinvest plow a lot of money back in,
Speaker 6: you know, and also probably you know, cash based earnings
Speaker 6: more than a cruel based earnings. So that's one indicator.
Speaker 6: Another is more technical indicator, of course, which is just
Speaker 6: what is the volatility of that stock? And you've got
Speaker 6: a lot of ways to make that play to the
Speaker 6: traditional defensive sort of you can pick low volatility stocks,
Speaker 6: or you can pick kind of minimum variants where you know,
Speaker 6: the stock itself maybe is not the lowest volatility, but
Speaker 6: it doesn't correlate well with the rest of the market,
Speaker 6: so it adds sort of padding to the rest of
Speaker 6: the portfolio.
Speaker 2: That's a really good point, all right, Dana, Thanks Slot.
Speaker 2: We really appreciated Dana Diyoria, a CoA Chief investment officer
Speaker 2: at Investnet joining us on the markets.
Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Intelligence Podcast. Catch us live
Speaker 1: weekdays at ten am Eastern on Applecarplay and Android Auto
Speaker 1: with the Bloomberg business app listen on demand wherever you
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Speaker 2: The other wild carbon than the Trump administration is how
Speaker 2: the talks unfold when it comes to peace between Russia
Speaker 2: and Ukraine. Apparently US and Russian officials are meeting in
Speaker 2: Saudi Arabia to discuss a potential CEA spot in the war,
Speaker 2: and this of course follows talks between the American and
Speaker 2: Ukrainian teams joining US now. As Roz mathis and Bloomberg
Speaker 2: News director for Europe, the Middle East and Africa, Roz,
Speaker 2: what do you know in terms of where the talks
Speaker 2: are well?
Speaker 7: As you were saying, we had talks initially between the
Speaker 7: US and Ukraine officials in Saudi Arabia. Now we've got
Speaker 7: talks that have been going on today between the US
Speaker 7: and Russia, and they seem to be really granular and
Speaker 7: quite technical in nature, focused on some specifics around perhaps
Speaker 7: getting agreement for ceaespar and maritime traffic in the Black Sea,
Speaker 7: for example. We're not getting a lot of redoubts at
Speaker 7: the moment from those conversations, so they seem to have
Speaker 7: gone into a bit of a quiet phase on it,
Speaker 7: at least with each other. But the sense is they're
Speaker 7: going bit by bit and this idea of a ceasefi
Speaker 7: in Ukraine. We had that conversation aitially around in a
Speaker 7: CESFI fit not hitting each other's energy infrastructure even though
Speaker 7: attack seemingly are still going on in the minute. And
Speaker 7: now we've got conversations around how to get you know,
Speaker 7: guarantees around traffic, maritime traffic in the Black Sea. But
Speaker 7: the big one, of course is what to do where
Speaker 7: people are actually fighting along the line of contact, which
Speaker 7: is a very long line on the side of Ukraine,
Speaker 7: and what to do there in terms of bringing the
Speaker 7: fighting to a holt. There doesn't seem to be any
Speaker 7: particular developments on that front so far. So the message
Speaker 7: really that we're getting is that even though the US
Speaker 7: President clearly wants a very quick ceasefire here, that there's
Speaker 7: a lot of steps that need to happen, a lot
Speaker 7: of complexity along the way.
Speaker 4: And rise as you point out, the US administration certainly
Speaker 4: hopes for a Ukraine piece deal, but it doesn't seem
Speaker 4: like Vladimir Putin is in any hurry here. What do
Speaker 4: we know about his thinking?
Speaker 7: Well, that's right, I mean, obviously he's willing to have
Speaker 7: conversations and perhaps even a direct meeting with the US
Speaker 7: President with Donald Trump at some point in the near future,
Speaker 7: perhaps in a place like Arabia again. But he's made
Speaker 7: it really clear, and that's by our own reporting and
Speaker 7: our own sourcing as well, is that he's got Maximum's
Speaker 7: demands here and he's not going to shave those down
Speaker 7: in any great hurry. These are things that he says
Speaker 7: that he insists need to happen for there to be
Speaker 7: a cease fire moving towards a more permanent deal, and
Speaker 7: those are essentially red lines that are not that great
Speaker 7: for Ukraine in all of this, in terms of his
Speaker 7: territorial demands to make sure that Ukraine can never join NATO,
Speaker 7: for example, to really know confence Ukraine in and whether
Speaker 7: those are just demands that he gets traction on with
Speaker 7: Donald Trump and the US in the end that are
Speaker 7: detrimental to Ukraine. So he's not in any great hurry
Speaker 7: here to get to a ceaspar final dear, He's obviously
Speaker 7: open to talking, but the position from Russia has been
Speaker 7: very clear. They've got demands and they want them met.
Speaker 2: What about Europe? Where's Europe right now? In during these conversations,
Speaker 2: still trying to get in the door, it seems from
Speaker 2: the conversation in a fulsome way at least.
Speaker 7: I mean, obviously we've had a lot of meetings that
Speaker 7: have gone on just at the EU level lately, including
Speaker 7: last week, and Ealy is having another call this week.
Speaker 7: We know that again the US pent the UK Prime
Speaker 7: Minister rather talked with Donald Trump yet again. So a
Speaker 7: lot of conversations going on, and the message from Europe
Speaker 7: is we need to be part of the discussion around
Speaker 7: a CEASPA, and Ukraine's interesting to be represented, but it's
Speaker 7: very clear that they know they're struggling to get a
Speaker 7: seat at the table and that Donald Trump is not
Speaker 7: particularly interested in giving them one at the table, let
Speaker 7: alone giving Ukraine a proper seat at the table. And
Speaker 7: so for Europe the challenge is getting their voice is heard,
Speaker 7: or showing that they're there and able to pick up
Speaker 7: some of the slack potentially and supporting Ukraine.
Speaker 4: Roz Is there any sense of timing when this could
Speaker 4: come together? Is there any consensus building out there?
Speaker 7: Well, it's very hard to say, because again these talks
Speaker 7: that are going on at the moment seemed to have
Speaker 7: been very technical in nature and very specific around detail.
Speaker 7: So are we getting the little pieces of the chessboard
Speaker 7: towards a bigger CEASPA at some point? Imagine? The key
Speaker 7: thing is whether there's an agreement to have further rounds
Speaker 7: of talks within a matter of days or at least
Speaker 7: towards the end.
Speaker 8: Of this week.
Speaker 7: And at what point can that build to a direct
Speaker 7: meeting between Vladimir Putin and Donald Trump, possibly as soon
Speaker 7: as next month. I mean, obviously Donald Trump keeps saying
Speaker 7: Easter as a timeline. He wants something by Easter. But
Speaker 7: what exactly he would be happy to get by easter?
Speaker 7: Is it a partial ceasepar again around energy, or perhaps
Speaker 7: maritime traffic in the Black Sea as a springboard to
Speaker 7: something else. So we're likely to get a full throat
Speaker 7: at CSPA either way, at least in the next couple
Speaker 7: of weeks.
Speaker 2: All right, Ros, thanks a lot, We really appreciate it.
Speaker 2: Ras Mathison joining us on the talks between Russia and
Speaker 2: the US on Ukraine. All right, some breaking news for you,
Speaker 2: ASHALLMI is said to raise about five point five billion
Speaker 2: dollars an upsized share placement. They were selling about eight
Speaker 2: hundred million shares now, Shelmy was kicking off a share
Speaker 2: sale in part to raise funds for its EV business.
Speaker 2: The fundraising expected to be a long term positive for
Speaker 2: the company, but many saying that it may pressure shale
Speaker 2: shares in the short term due to shocker dilution.
Speaker 4: And the stock is up bus sixty five percent year
Speaker 4: to date and two hundred and eighty five percent on
Speaker 4: a trilling a twelve month basis. Even I know that's
Speaker 4: a good time to self stock.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it is, and they take your point, all right.
Speaker 2: Coming up R J. Gallows, Senior portfolio manager Fixed and
Speaker 2: come at Federate Hermes will be joining us on the
Speaker 2: fixed income space. We get two fives and tens later
Speaker 2: on this week. A lot of supply coming online there.
Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Intelligence podcast. Catch us live
Speaker 1: weekdays at ten am Eastern on Applecarplay and Android Auto
Speaker 1: with the Bloomberg Business app. Listen on demand wherever you
Speaker 1: get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube.
Speaker 4: Switch over to the EV business interest story out there
Speaker 4: that's really been rocking. I think the EV business that's
Speaker 4: byd you know, saying they've gon have a five minute
Speaker 4: charging system that is a game changer if that is
Speaker 4: in fact the case. Let's check in with bn EF
Speaker 4: folks here b n EF. They cover all the energy
Speaker 4: industry head to toe. Alex's b but they've got all
Speaker 4: the data, all the analysis. Great stuff. Ryan Fisher joins
Speaker 4: us Bloomberg bn EF EV Charging team leader. So Ryan,
Speaker 4: talk to us about this by d story as relates
Speaker 4: to this fast charger.
Speaker 9: Yeah, I mean this has just come out of nowhere.
Speaker 9: In some ways, we had the portions of this world
Speaker 9: doing charging three fifty KILLOW. This is a thousand killer
Speaker 9: what we were three to four times the kind of
Speaker 9: other best in class that people were expecting when we
Speaker 9: talk about five minutes. Obviously, that's similar to gasoline for
Speaker 9: four hundred kilometers of charge. Some of the others are
Speaker 9: more like the best in class. Lucid obviously is quite famous.
Speaker 9: They're doing it in like one hundred maybe one hundred
Speaker 9: and eighty kilometers in that time.
Speaker 8: This is a real step change.
Speaker 9: And not only is it that, what you've got is
Speaker 9: an announcement and they're going to do it, going to
Speaker 9: make the vehicles available a month later. So typically you
Speaker 9: might hear an announcement from a Western automaker and maybe
Speaker 9: a couple of years later that tech you've heard about
Speaker 9: will be there. Whereas they're saying these vehicles in China,
Speaker 9: you'll be able to buy them soon, but yeah, that
Speaker 9: is only in China.
Speaker 2: How how did they get it down to five minutes?
Speaker 9: So it seems like they've improved the fast charging technology
Speaker 9: through both the voltage so you have higher voltage on
Speaker 9: the vehicles, you could lower the current or the current
Speaker 9: to accept this power, and then changing the battery chemistry
Speaker 9: as well.
Speaker 8: So the interesting thing is.
Speaker 9: That they've added different types of calling because if you
Speaker 9: have really high currents going through the battery, then you
Speaker 9: have a lot of heat.
Speaker 8: Being created, so they've changed their cooling technology.
Speaker 9: They've improved some of the other intricacies of the sales
Speaker 9: as well. And on a bigger market point, you've got
Speaker 9: a lot of companies saying we're going to build solid
Speaker 9: state batteries, so like next generation battery technologies for the car, Well,
Speaker 9: is that even needed any more? Or if BYD can
Speaker 9: do this with an evolution of the current tech.
Speaker 4: So what can be what likely will be the competitive
Speaker 4: response from the Western battery infrastructure people. They got to
Speaker 4: up their game, like now don't they.
Speaker 8: Yeah, it's just such a race.
Speaker 9: Like you look at these evs and you think about
Speaker 9: buying one, and there's just something new coming that's more advanced,
Speaker 9: one after the other. So like as a consumer, maybe
Speaker 9: you don't want to buy because you think, well, I'm
Speaker 9: going to buy something that'd be absollete pretty quick. From
Speaker 9: the Western automakers, they're going to find it hard. You
Speaker 9: look at BYD they've just got so many engineers, they're
Speaker 9: vertically integrated. They're doing much of this by themselves, all
Speaker 9: the way down to now buying the ships to distribute
Speaker 9: these cars they've built around the world and getting involved
Speaker 9: in the metals and mining game and things like that.
Speaker 9: So it's hard to imagine how everybody is going to compete. Obviously,
Speaker 9: we've got tariffs in different regions to try and block
Speaker 9: the Chinese out, and then when you think about this tech,
Speaker 9: there is an element of do you actually need it?
Speaker 9: So when you look on the Chinese articles, they were
Speaker 9: looking at the JAOMIU Su seven, which is the vehicle
Speaker 9: made by the Jami, which is the smartphone maker. So
Speaker 9: they've entered the market and they're selling electric vehicles and
Speaker 9: the hundreds of thousands of volume. They've outsold loads of cars.
Speaker 9: It's kind of an amazing story, and people comparing saying, well, actually,
Speaker 9: this one BYD is talking about is ten thousand dollars
Speaker 9: more expensive. So like the tech is not necessarily everything
Speaker 9: on fast charging when there's people who are doing I
Speaker 9: don't know, fast cars.
Speaker 8: Fancy cars.
Speaker 9: They've got a lot of other features as well, like
Speaker 9: whilst this is a step change, do we necessarily need
Speaker 9: five minutes over ten minutes?
Speaker 8: Does everybody care? It's debatable.
Speaker 2: I mean it depends how long your bathroom break is,
Speaker 2: which you know you got a shot some concessions. Okay.
Speaker 2: We also had the headline that BYD is out selling
Speaker 2: Tesla's in China. In particular, you can't get a BYD
Speaker 2: car in the US, I should point that out. And
Speaker 2: the BYD sales for this year about five to six
Speaker 2: million cars. So is this five minute battery like a
Speaker 2: big selling point for this in comparison to say a
Speaker 2: Tesla or no?
Speaker 8: Yeah, I think so.
Speaker 9: And then in China what you've got is I think
Speaker 9: last year BID saw something like one point six million
Speaker 9: pure battery election because just the battery powers the car,
Speaker 9: and I think Tesla was somewhere around six hundred thousand
Speaker 9: to seven hundred thousand.
Speaker 8: So it gives you, and they were seconds.
Speaker 9: It gives you an idea Tesla doing well, but obviously
Speaker 9: just how well BYD are doing one of the things
Speaker 9: BYD had been leaning into previously with these plug.
Speaker 8: In hybrid models. So you have an engine and you
Speaker 8: have a battery.
Speaker 9: The engine might only be small and the car itself
Speaker 9: might be mainly running off the battery. So they've done
Speaker 9: quite well with those, and it might just show a
Speaker 9: little bit of a pivot from them to say, actually,
Speaker 9: we can.
Speaker 8: Maybe do without the engine. Now, look we've got this.
Speaker 9: Huge range, huge huge, huge range, fast charging power vehicles
Speaker 9: like you don't necessarily need.
Speaker 8: To worry about that.
Speaker 9: Also, it might be a pivot from them in terms
Speaker 9: of Tesla versus BYD when you said that they're not
Speaker 9: available in the US.
Speaker 8: But they are available in other regions.
Speaker 9: So they've done very well in places like Brazil and Thailand.
Speaker 9: There's something like eighty ninety percent share of the EV
Speaker 9: market there, and like eighteen ninety percent share is obviously
Speaker 9: huge for the So that's just that's Chinese manufacturers, with
Speaker 9: which Bwide is pretty major one they've got to plant
Speaker 9: out in Brazil as well, so they're making moves to
Speaker 9: kind of dominate those The charging tech could be part
Speaker 9: of that too. So the interesting thing is, like we've
Speaker 9: had these like charging connector wars. Do you have the
Speaker 9: Tesla connector do you have the connector that all the
Speaker 9: other manufacturers are using? And in Europe all the other
Speaker 9: manufacturers won out. In America, Tesla went out well. Arguably
Speaker 9: in some of these kind of smaller merging markets, this
Speaker 9: that you could end up with the Chinese connector becoming
Speaker 9: an interesting proposition and maybe the Chinese automotive industry will
Speaker 9: think about that. And it doesn't mean that they've got
Speaker 9: it so far, but if they're selling the most cars
Speaker 9: and they've got the most advanced charging tech, then maybe
Speaker 9: that's the way.
Speaker 8: That they can exert more influence over the rest of
Speaker 8: the world.
Speaker 2: Hi, Ryan really appreciate it. Ryan Fisher is EV Charging
Speaker 2: team leader. That basically means he heads up all the
Speaker 2: coverage when it comes to EV charging at Bloomberg BNF,
Speaker 2: and as Paul was saying earlier, Bloomberg EF covers pretty
Speaker 2: much everything commodities, power, transport, industry, buildings and ad sectors,
Speaker 2: all to help with the energy transition and some hard
Speaker 2: data there.
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