1
00:00:04,360 --> 00:00:07,760
Speaker 1: Welcome to the Therapy for Black Girls Podcast, where we

2
00:00:07,880 --> 00:00:12,119
Speaker 1: discuss all things mental health, personal development, and all the

3
00:00:12,200 --> 00:00:15,120
Speaker 1: small decisions we can make to become the best possible

4
00:00:15,240 --> 00:00:19,520
Speaker 1: versions of ourselves. I'm your host, Dr Joy Harden Bradford,

5
00:00:19,840 --> 00:00:24,680
Speaker 1: a licensed psychologist in Atlanta, Georgia. To get more information

6
00:00:24,960 --> 00:00:28,960
Speaker 1: and resources, visit the website at Therapy for Black Girls

7
00:00:29,000 --> 00:00:31,800
Speaker 1: dot com. And while I hope you love listening to

8
00:00:32,240 --> 00:00:35,159
Speaker 1: and learning from the podcast, it is not meant to

9
00:00:35,200 --> 00:00:38,400
Speaker 1: be a substitute for a relationship with a licensed mental

10
00:00:38,400 --> 00:00:47,680
Speaker 1: health professional. Hey, y'all, thanks so much for joining me

11
00:00:47,760 --> 00:00:51,240
Speaker 1: for session forty four of the Therapy for Black Girls Podcast.

12
00:00:51,960 --> 00:00:55,160
Speaker 1: Today's episode focuses on another topic that many of you

13
00:00:55,200 --> 00:01:00,320
Speaker 1: said you wanted covered, perfectionism. For today's episode, I am

14
00:01:00,400 --> 00:01:05,360
Speaker 1: joined by Bianca Hughes. Bianca is an associate professional counselor

15
00:01:05,440 --> 00:01:11,039
Speaker 1: in Atlanta, Georgia. She specializes in perfectionism, helping people embrace

16
00:01:11,040 --> 00:01:16,360
Speaker 1: their imperfections and authentically be themselves. She helps clients work

17
00:01:16,400 --> 00:01:23,240
Speaker 1: through concerns of self worth, unhealthy relationships, identity, are feeling overwhelmed.

18
00:01:24,120 --> 00:01:29,200
Speaker 1: Her approach within therapy is direct but open, meeting clients

19
00:01:29,200 --> 00:01:33,600
Speaker 1: where they are providing them freedom to change when they're ready.

20
00:01:34,160 --> 00:01:38,240
Speaker 1: She believes in empowering and equipping people with skills, tools

21
00:01:38,360 --> 00:01:43,480
Speaker 1: and resources they can utilize for life. In addition, her

22
00:01:43,520 --> 00:01:47,160
Speaker 1: passion is to eliminate mental health stigmas, which are prevalent

23
00:01:47,200 --> 00:01:52,600
Speaker 1: within the black community. Bianca and I discussed what perfectionism is,

24
00:01:53,240 --> 00:01:56,360
Speaker 1: where it comes from, and tips and strategies you can

25
00:01:56,480 --> 00:02:00,880
Speaker 1: use to create realistic expectations and feel more comfortable being

26
00:02:00,880 --> 00:02:05,800
Speaker 1: your authentic self. Here's our conversation. Well, thank you so

27
00:02:05,880 --> 00:02:09,040
Speaker 1: much for joining us to Dave Bianca, Thank you for

28
00:02:09,120 --> 00:02:12,400
Speaker 1: having me. I'm so excited to be here. Joy No,

29
00:02:12,680 --> 00:02:16,000
Speaker 1: I am incredibly excited to have you here because this

30
00:02:16,040 --> 00:02:19,000
Speaker 1: has been a very highly requested episode and I knew

31
00:02:19,040 --> 00:02:21,400
Speaker 1: exactly who I wanted to bring on to talk about this.

32
00:02:21,760 --> 00:02:25,799
Speaker 1: So we are going to be chatting about perfectionism today. UM.

33
00:02:25,840 --> 00:02:27,920
Speaker 1: So can you start by kind of giving us a

34
00:02:27,960 --> 00:02:33,360
Speaker 1: definition of what perfectionism is? Yes, so I have kind

35
00:02:33,360 --> 00:02:37,000
Speaker 1: of created my own, um and just keeping it really simple.

36
00:02:37,120 --> 00:02:42,680
Speaker 1: But basically, it's UM a continuous and exhausting cycle of

37
00:02:42,919 --> 00:02:48,400
Speaker 1: trying to be enough. UM A big thing. UM. You know,

38
00:02:48,440 --> 00:02:53,000
Speaker 1: people talk about perfectionism or perfectionists and trying to be perfect.

39
00:02:53,680 --> 00:02:56,000
Speaker 1: But it's just and I always want to highlight it's

40
00:02:56,040 --> 00:02:58,360
Speaker 1: continuous because of course we're always going to want to

41
00:02:58,400 --> 00:03:02,560
Speaker 1: do our best, but it's that continuous cycle of trying

42
00:03:02,560 --> 00:03:04,959
Speaker 1: to be enough and you never feel like you are

43
00:03:05,560 --> 00:03:09,680
Speaker 1: enough or doing enough. M m yeah, I mean, just

44
00:03:09,800 --> 00:03:12,239
Speaker 1: you're talking about it, it sounds like an exhausting kind

45
00:03:12,240 --> 00:03:16,520
Speaker 1: of thing, like if it's a continuous kind of thing. Yes, yes, yes,

46
00:03:16,560 --> 00:03:19,120
Speaker 1: And that's what that perfectionism is. And I always want

47
00:03:19,120 --> 00:03:22,600
Speaker 1: to highlight to people that it's not a person. So

48
00:03:22,840 --> 00:03:25,680
Speaker 1: I don't really use the term perfectionist because I don't

49
00:03:25,720 --> 00:03:30,200
Speaker 1: like to label people, and so I use the term perfectionism.

50
00:03:30,240 --> 00:03:33,640
Speaker 1: And it is a belief, Okay, it's a belief of

51
00:03:33,880 --> 00:03:37,560
Speaker 1: I can do enough, I can be perfect or um,

52
00:03:37,600 --> 00:03:39,680
Speaker 1: I can be enough and I can prove to people.

53
00:03:39,720 --> 00:03:42,600
Speaker 1: So it's that belief that if I'm do enough and

54
00:03:42,640 --> 00:03:46,280
Speaker 1: prove enough, I'll be perfect, Um, I will be loved,

55
00:03:46,720 --> 00:03:50,520
Speaker 1: and which will lead me onto the deep seated thing

56
00:03:50,560 --> 00:03:53,640
Speaker 1: of it's all about wanting to be accepted as well,

57
00:03:54,440 --> 00:03:59,000
Speaker 1: and um it often stems from the deep thing of rejection.

58
00:04:00,040 --> 00:04:03,440
Speaker 1: So I'm gonna do everything I can to be enough,

59
00:04:03,800 --> 00:04:08,480
Speaker 1: do enough so I won't be rejected. Mm hmm. Okay,

60
00:04:08,960 --> 00:04:11,040
Speaker 1: so you already touched on it a little bit. Can

61
00:04:11,080 --> 00:04:14,640
Speaker 1: you talk more about where this need to be perfect

62
00:04:14,680 --> 00:04:21,440
Speaker 1: comes from? Yeah? Um, so the root issue is always

63
00:04:21,480 --> 00:04:24,040
Speaker 1: you know, I'm someone always looked at the root, how

64
00:04:24,080 --> 00:04:26,039
Speaker 1: did this start? Where did this come from? And it

65
00:04:26,120 --> 00:04:31,160
Speaker 1: comes from rejection? Okay, So I'm gonna do everything I

66
00:04:31,240 --> 00:04:35,040
Speaker 1: can do to be perfect to be accepted, which is normal.

67
00:04:35,400 --> 00:04:38,640
Speaker 1: We want to be accepted, okay, um, because we're designed

68
00:04:38,640 --> 00:04:41,520
Speaker 1: for relationships. But the whole idea is I don't want

69
00:04:41,520 --> 00:04:47,880
Speaker 1: to be rejected because once I'm rejected, UM, I experienced

70
00:04:47,880 --> 00:04:52,320
Speaker 1: a deep loneliness, a deep pain UM, and I'm gonna

71
00:04:52,400 --> 00:04:56,279
Speaker 1: feel like I'm disconnected. And of course, as um, humans

72
00:04:56,320 --> 00:04:59,520
Speaker 1: were all wired for connection, and so the fear of

73
00:04:59,640 --> 00:05:03,280
Speaker 1: us to be and disconnected um not, which comes from

74
00:05:03,320 --> 00:05:06,839
Speaker 1: not being accepted, it's huge. So in order to avoid

75
00:05:06,920 --> 00:05:09,720
Speaker 1: that pain, um and not experience that, we're going to

76
00:05:09,839 --> 00:05:13,560
Speaker 1: do everything we can to be perfect because we believe

77
00:05:13,640 --> 00:05:17,039
Speaker 1: being perfect is the only way we're going to be accepted. Unfortunately,

78
00:05:17,120 --> 00:05:22,160
Speaker 1: a lot of it comes from family, um. In things

79
00:05:22,360 --> 00:05:26,200
Speaker 1: and expectations of family UM. You know of course, being

80
00:05:26,240 --> 00:05:29,480
Speaker 1: compared to other people in the family either wanting you

81
00:05:29,560 --> 00:05:34,880
Speaker 1: to excel um or other people at school make sure

82
00:05:34,920 --> 00:05:37,440
Speaker 1: you do better than so and so. Um, look what

83
00:05:37,560 --> 00:05:41,479
Speaker 1: grades they have, and um, we experienced a lot of

84
00:05:41,520 --> 00:05:45,680
Speaker 1: shame sometimes in our families unfortunately, and so because that hurts,

85
00:05:45,920 --> 00:05:49,680
Speaker 1: we don't never wanted to experience that again. So how

86
00:05:49,720 --> 00:05:52,200
Speaker 1: early are we talking about this, Bianco? You know, because

87
00:05:52,200 --> 00:05:54,640
Speaker 1: I'm thinking, like to my four year old who will

88
00:05:54,720 --> 00:05:58,599
Speaker 1: like sometimes be on the playground and says two things like, um,

89
00:05:58,640 --> 00:06:00,400
Speaker 1: you know, like so and so didn't want to with

90
00:06:00,440 --> 00:06:03,400
Speaker 1: me or so. Surely it's not like one or two

91
00:06:03,520 --> 00:06:06,400
Speaker 1: instances of like somebody not wanting to play with you.

92
00:06:06,480 --> 00:06:08,560
Speaker 1: Like what kinds of things that we're really looking at

93
00:06:08,920 --> 00:06:12,600
Speaker 1: in terms of like history, Um, like how many rejections are,

94
00:06:12,640 --> 00:06:15,279
Speaker 1: Like what kind of pattern of rejection are we really

95
00:06:15,279 --> 00:06:18,359
Speaker 1: looking at before we see like some kind of perfectionistic

96
00:06:18,440 --> 00:06:21,320
Speaker 1: kind of tendencies developed. Well, you know, it's so funny.

97
00:06:21,320 --> 00:06:23,240
Speaker 1: I was talking to my friend the other day and

98
00:06:24,720 --> 00:06:26,880
Speaker 1: her door I think it's eight or nine, and she's

99
00:06:26,960 --> 00:06:29,280
Speaker 1: stigned to see in her doors. So often you'll see

100
00:06:29,320 --> 00:06:32,560
Speaker 1: like I got to keep on doing my work. It's

101
00:06:32,600 --> 00:06:34,560
Speaker 1: not good enough. So I'm going to rub it out

102
00:06:34,839 --> 00:06:38,440
Speaker 1: and sorry, rub it raise it out. Excuse me, guys,

103
00:06:38,520 --> 00:06:44,920
Speaker 1: that's my I'm gonna RaSE it out because it's it's

104
00:06:44,960 --> 00:06:49,880
Speaker 1: not enough. So but it's a continuous thing of hearing

105
00:06:49,920 --> 00:06:53,720
Speaker 1: those slight words and not being even though we experienced

106
00:06:53,800 --> 00:06:56,960
Speaker 1: some form of rejection, we also have to be reassured

107
00:06:57,400 --> 00:07:01,239
Speaker 1: that we're okay in that, and so there's that big,

108
00:07:01,320 --> 00:07:04,640
Speaker 1: big need for approval. So it's you know, sometimes it

109
00:07:04,720 --> 00:07:07,600
Speaker 1: can just even have to once, to be quite honest

110
00:07:07,640 --> 00:07:11,640
Speaker 1: with you, if we're not being approved also in that moment,

111
00:07:11,960 --> 00:07:15,080
Speaker 1: So you know, I hear people saying, oh, you know,

112
00:07:15,200 --> 00:07:18,880
Speaker 1: you're never going to amount to anything. And of course

113
00:07:18,960 --> 00:07:21,200
Speaker 1: you have to remember as children we kind of know this,

114
00:07:21,320 --> 00:07:25,240
Speaker 1: but cognitively as children, they don't know how to process

115
00:07:25,320 --> 00:07:28,400
Speaker 1: that as we do as adults. So even though sometimes

116
00:07:28,520 --> 00:07:31,320
Speaker 1: children are really resilient, sometimes they take things to heart

117
00:07:31,560 --> 00:07:35,040
Speaker 1: and that's who they are. So it also depends on

118
00:07:35,080 --> 00:07:38,960
Speaker 1: the makeup of the person as well. So something else

119
00:07:39,040 --> 00:07:43,320
Speaker 1: you said, Bianca, um, you know sometimes parents will kind

120
00:07:43,320 --> 00:07:46,200
Speaker 1: of unknowingly kind of instill some of this and talking

121
00:07:46,200 --> 00:07:48,760
Speaker 1: about like, oh, I want you to have better grades

122
00:07:48,800 --> 00:07:51,000
Speaker 1: than so and so are you have to be like

123
00:07:51,080 --> 00:07:53,520
Speaker 1: your big sister who you know has really good grades

124
00:07:53,560 --> 00:07:56,160
Speaker 1: or has done all of these amazing things. And I

125
00:07:56,320 --> 00:08:00,000
Speaker 1: that makes me think of, you know, like culturally, Um,

126
00:08:00,080 --> 00:08:02,680
Speaker 1: you know this whole idea that black people have to

127
00:08:02,680 --> 00:08:05,480
Speaker 1: work twice as hard to get half the amount of

128
00:08:05,520 --> 00:08:09,440
Speaker 1: accomplishment and achievement as other people. Um. So do you

129
00:08:09,480 --> 00:08:12,240
Speaker 1: think that there are some cultural pieces that might make

130
00:08:12,280 --> 00:08:19,480
Speaker 1: this more prevalent especially for black women? Yes? Yes, as

131
00:08:19,600 --> 00:08:24,040
Speaker 1: women in general. Yes. And then of course, you know,

132
00:08:25,360 --> 00:08:27,920
Speaker 1: you know we're talking about all these different me too

133
00:08:27,960 --> 00:08:30,760
Speaker 1: and and and how women are treated and and seen

134
00:08:30,920 --> 00:08:34,440
Speaker 1: as objects in general as a woman, and now to

135
00:08:34,520 --> 00:08:38,719
Speaker 1: add on the race thing, yes, it's huge. Okay, I

136
00:08:38,920 --> 00:08:41,400
Speaker 1: give an example of me, Like I'm a first of many,

137
00:08:41,520 --> 00:08:45,240
Speaker 1: first going to college, first, getting a master's, first doing this.

138
00:08:45,480 --> 00:08:48,520
Speaker 1: Oh you're you know, and there's this expectation and this

139
00:08:48,760 --> 00:08:51,960
Speaker 1: pressure for you to do better, even better than your

140
00:08:52,000 --> 00:08:55,400
Speaker 1: family members or some people with they might already have

141
00:08:55,520 --> 00:08:57,880
Speaker 1: doctors in their family, so they have to perform the

142
00:08:57,960 --> 00:09:01,320
Speaker 1: same way. But there's always this expectation of you have

143
00:09:01,440 --> 00:09:04,240
Speaker 1: to do better, You have to prove yourself and to

144
00:09:04,320 --> 00:09:08,400
Speaker 1: prove that you are worthy and prove that you are valuable.

145
00:09:08,559 --> 00:09:11,200
Speaker 1: It's not enough that you're just a human being, which

146
00:09:11,280 --> 00:09:14,440
Speaker 1: is the basic standards that you're valuable and you're worthy

147
00:09:14,480 --> 00:09:16,480
Speaker 1: because you're a human being. No, it has to be

148
00:09:16,559 --> 00:09:21,920
Speaker 1: even more than that. And that's exhausting. Absolutely. I mean

149
00:09:21,960 --> 00:09:23,720
Speaker 1: that's kind of what we talked about in the beginning,

150
00:09:23,800 --> 00:09:26,360
Speaker 1: like the fact that it's a continuous kind of thing

151
00:09:26,400 --> 00:09:29,680
Speaker 1: that you're always kind of thinking about how I could

152
00:09:29,679 --> 00:09:32,760
Speaker 1: be doing better, or not even able to kind of

153
00:09:32,800 --> 00:09:36,760
Speaker 1: celebrate what you currently finished because you're already thinking about

154
00:09:36,760 --> 00:09:39,640
Speaker 1: the next thing that needs to be done. Yes, oh

155
00:09:39,760 --> 00:09:43,839
Speaker 1: my god. Yes that doesn't mention things like, um, the

156
00:09:43,960 --> 00:09:51,880
Speaker 1: strong black woman. I mean, you know, I you know,

157
00:09:51,960 --> 00:09:56,240
Speaker 1: you just cannot be strong all the time. This is

158
00:09:56,280 --> 00:09:58,880
Speaker 1: just not possible. And there's this expectation that we're strong,

159
00:09:59,080 --> 00:10:02,000
Speaker 1: we're feiless and all, and yes we are, but you

160
00:10:02,000 --> 00:10:04,880
Speaker 1: know what, we always have also have moments of weaknesses,

161
00:10:05,880 --> 00:10:09,760
Speaker 1: and um, we don't always ask for help as women

162
00:10:10,000 --> 00:10:12,960
Speaker 1: black women when we need to. We wait until it's

163
00:10:13,040 --> 00:10:16,760
Speaker 1: really really, really bad. And if we do ask for help,

164
00:10:16,840 --> 00:10:19,880
Speaker 1: then we now lose that expectation of us being that

165
00:10:19,960 --> 00:10:22,760
Speaker 1: strong black woman. That is a big thing and I

166
00:10:22,840 --> 00:10:25,000
Speaker 1: think the other one is the angry black woman. So

167
00:10:25,120 --> 00:10:26,920
Speaker 1: then we have to prove that we're not the angry

168
00:10:26,960 --> 00:10:31,280
Speaker 1: black woman. You know. So these two things that keep

169
00:10:31,320 --> 00:10:34,240
Speaker 1: coming at us. That's you know, we're trying to fight

170
00:10:34,280 --> 00:10:37,560
Speaker 1: against these images, not to mention all the stuff that

171
00:10:37,600 --> 00:10:39,880
Speaker 1: our parents have told us. So we've got these coming

172
00:10:39,920 --> 00:10:44,480
Speaker 1: at us at different angles. Um. Not trying to be

173
00:10:44,520 --> 00:10:50,760
Speaker 1: a statistic, however, that's single mother, onward mother, um, all

174
00:10:50,800 --> 00:10:53,600
Speaker 1: those things that come into it. Then if you are

175
00:10:53,640 --> 00:10:58,000
Speaker 1: also religious, then you have those expectations. So you know,

176
00:10:58,160 --> 00:11:00,719
Speaker 1: you see what We've just got so much coming at

177
00:11:00,760 --> 00:11:04,640
Speaker 1: us as black women, not just to mention as women, right,

178
00:11:04,720 --> 00:11:08,520
Speaker 1: And it really feels like, um, no matter what you do,

179
00:11:08,600 --> 00:11:12,080
Speaker 1: a lot of times, there is another expectation. Right. So

180
00:11:12,360 --> 00:11:15,000
Speaker 1: you go to school and you get all these degrees,

181
00:11:15,080 --> 00:11:17,640
Speaker 1: and then the questions are, well, when you're going to

182
00:11:17,679 --> 00:11:20,160
Speaker 1: be married, and then when you're married, when you're gonna

183
00:11:20,160 --> 00:11:22,360
Speaker 1: have kids, and then when you have the next kid

184
00:11:22,720 --> 00:11:25,040
Speaker 1: you know. So I mean, so it feels like every

185
00:11:25,040 --> 00:11:28,240
Speaker 1: time you hit one of these markers, then there is

186
00:11:28,400 --> 00:11:33,560
Speaker 1: another marker that people expect you to to meet. And unfortunately,

187
00:11:34,160 --> 00:11:36,760
Speaker 1: I think it's starting to change now but I don't

188
00:11:36,800 --> 00:11:39,760
Speaker 1: know about you, Joy, but I don't remember anyone telling me,

189
00:11:39,800 --> 00:11:44,960
Speaker 1: you know what, just celebrate you know, versus Okay, when's

190
00:11:45,000 --> 00:11:48,160
Speaker 1: the next thing? And I'm having to learn and teach

191
00:11:48,640 --> 00:11:52,760
Speaker 1: my UM clients to celebrate the small things. I don't

192
00:11:52,760 --> 00:11:55,000
Speaker 1: care if you just made your bed today. Can you

193
00:11:55,080 --> 00:11:59,720
Speaker 1: celebrate something? You know? Can we take time and celebrate

194
00:12:00,040 --> 00:12:04,200
Speaker 1: masses degree before trying to get our PhD? Right? Right?

195
00:12:04,240 --> 00:12:06,120
Speaker 1: But I think a part of that comes with the

196
00:12:06,120 --> 00:12:09,040
Speaker 1: fact that it's an expectation, right. So if people expect

197
00:12:09,040 --> 00:12:11,920
Speaker 1: you to do something, then it's not really a cause

198
00:12:12,000 --> 00:12:16,400
Speaker 1: or a celebration because it's what you're expected to do. Yeah, yeah,

199
00:12:16,679 --> 00:12:20,120
Speaker 1: And um, you know you're talking about expectations. That's a

200
00:12:20,200 --> 00:12:26,040
Speaker 1: big thing that I talk about is realistic expectations, um,

201
00:12:26,080 --> 00:12:31,839
Speaker 1: because often with the perfectionism, the expectations are unrealistic. And

202
00:12:31,920 --> 00:12:36,920
Speaker 1: so when we still constantly trying to reach on realistic expectations,

203
00:12:37,840 --> 00:12:41,920
Speaker 1: we feel worthless, you know, we feel inadequate. But we

204
00:12:42,000 --> 00:12:46,040
Speaker 1: never started to look at art if our expectations are realistic.

205
00:12:46,480 --> 00:12:50,560
Speaker 1: We just look at the fact that we didn't achieve them, right, right.

206
00:12:50,600 --> 00:12:53,600
Speaker 1: So so that kind of takes us into my next question,

207
00:12:53,679 --> 00:12:57,960
Speaker 1: which is, what does perfectionism look kind of in everyday life? Like,

208
00:12:58,080 --> 00:13:02,200
Speaker 1: how would somebody know that they are actually struggling with perfectionism? Yeah?

209
00:13:02,280 --> 00:13:06,360
Speaker 1: Absolutely so sounds like this in our heads. I'm not

210
00:13:06,440 --> 00:13:10,120
Speaker 1: doing enough. Everyone is so much further along with me. Um,

211
00:13:10,160 --> 00:13:13,559
Speaker 1: if I do it perfectly, I will feel better. M

212
00:13:13,800 --> 00:13:16,880
Speaker 1: And another big one other should I should not feel

213
00:13:16,920 --> 00:13:21,680
Speaker 1: this way? I should be so much further along then

214
00:13:21,720 --> 00:13:27,200
Speaker 1: I am. Um. Look, I should not have made that mistake.

215
00:13:27,559 --> 00:13:30,200
Speaker 1: If only I didn't do this way, do it this way,

216
00:13:30,280 --> 00:13:33,480
Speaker 1: I would have been so much better. Those are the

217
00:13:33,520 --> 00:13:35,840
Speaker 1: some of the things that we kind of sound it

218
00:13:35,920 --> 00:13:41,040
Speaker 1: sounds like in our in our head um to ourselves. Um.

219
00:13:41,360 --> 00:13:44,320
Speaker 1: It also looks like, you know, everyday life, there might

220
00:13:44,400 --> 00:13:48,120
Speaker 1: be some often procrastination. Oh my gosh. People don't think

221
00:13:48,160 --> 00:13:52,880
Speaker 1: that procrastination has to do with perfectionism, um, but it

222
00:13:52,960 --> 00:13:56,640
Speaker 1: does because the way that works is because you want

223
00:13:56,679 --> 00:14:00,240
Speaker 1: it to be perfect the first time and you don't

224
00:14:00,240 --> 00:14:03,440
Speaker 1: want to make a mistake. Often you don't even stop,

225
00:14:04,600 --> 00:14:11,000
Speaker 1: and that's where the procrastination comes in. That's huge with perfectionism. Um.

226
00:14:11,200 --> 00:14:13,440
Speaker 1: Also looks like we kind of talked about the unrealistic

227
00:14:13,559 --> 00:14:17,840
Speaker 1: expectations um in our everyday life a big one social media,

228
00:14:18,840 --> 00:14:24,120
Speaker 1: constantly comparing yourself two people on social media, whether they're

229
00:14:24,160 --> 00:14:29,360
Speaker 1: your friends, UM, in relationships, having kids, getting jobs, being successful,

230
00:14:29,400 --> 00:14:32,120
Speaker 1: when business, wh where people are smiling, and I always

231
00:14:32,120 --> 00:14:34,320
Speaker 1: have to remind people, you know, this is like the

232
00:14:34,440 --> 00:14:38,480
Speaker 1: two second picture, one second picture that's probably taken twenty times.

233
00:14:40,720 --> 00:14:44,000
Speaker 1: And so there's that comparison is so huge if you

234
00:14:44,080 --> 00:14:48,520
Speaker 1: find your constantly UM comparing yourself. Another big one UM,

235
00:14:48,600 --> 00:14:51,200
Speaker 1: which I find sometimes I do this is I don't

236
00:14:51,240 --> 00:14:56,960
Speaker 1: have enough time, and so we limit what we're able

237
00:14:57,040 --> 00:15:01,520
Speaker 1: to do because I'm not having enough time. Yeah. Oh,

238
00:15:01,560 --> 00:15:04,680
Speaker 1: and another big one is your toss less. Your tossless

239
00:15:04,800 --> 00:15:09,520
Speaker 1: is endless and never seems to get finished and is

240
00:15:09,520 --> 00:15:14,800
Speaker 1: another big one. Yeah. Okay, So having this long list

241
00:15:14,840 --> 00:15:17,360
Speaker 1: of tasks that you have to get done, but then

242
00:15:17,400 --> 00:15:19,960
Speaker 1: you can't make it through the test because you're taking

243
00:15:20,000 --> 00:15:23,680
Speaker 1: so much time trying to be perfect at completing a task. Okay,

244
00:15:24,000 --> 00:15:27,000
Speaker 1: but your list was probably too long in the first place, right,

245
00:15:27,040 --> 00:15:31,400
Speaker 1: going back to that expectations, Yeah okay. And there's also

246
00:15:31,640 --> 00:15:35,920
Speaker 1: there's a sense of sorry, inadequacy. M hmm, Yeah, I'm

247
00:15:35,920 --> 00:15:39,840
Speaker 1: feeling in adequate. Feel lonely or overwhelmed. Overwhelmed is a

248
00:15:39,880 --> 00:15:43,320
Speaker 1: big one. Feeling overwhelmed. Yeah, and it feels like that

249
00:15:43,400 --> 00:15:46,640
Speaker 1: might lead back to the procrastination piece that you said, like,

250
00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:49,400
Speaker 1: if I feel like I'm kind of inadequate in approaching

251
00:15:49,440 --> 00:15:51,760
Speaker 1: this task, then that makes it less likely that I

252
00:15:51,800 --> 00:15:57,520
Speaker 1: want to start it. Yes, yes, okay, okay, So what

253
00:15:57,800 --> 00:16:00,360
Speaker 1: is the solution for some of this janga? Like how

254
00:16:00,400 --> 00:16:03,680
Speaker 1: are you working with your clients um to kind of

255
00:16:03,760 --> 00:16:08,360
Speaker 1: help to manage some of these perfectionistic tendencies. Yeah. So

256
00:16:08,480 --> 00:16:12,080
Speaker 1: one of the things my focus is on embracing your

257
00:16:12,120 --> 00:16:18,080
Speaker 1: imperfections and authentically being you. Uh, And so with that,

258
00:16:18,320 --> 00:16:22,720
Speaker 1: my big thing is teaching people to kind of embrace

259
00:16:22,760 --> 00:16:26,400
Speaker 1: who they are with all those mistakes, imperfections, all that

260
00:16:26,880 --> 00:16:29,880
Speaker 1: beautiful mess is what I like to call it, and

261
00:16:30,000 --> 00:16:32,840
Speaker 1: just finding out who they are in the midst of that.

262
00:16:33,480 --> 00:16:36,440
Speaker 1: Because the focus has been so much on trying to

263
00:16:36,440 --> 00:16:39,240
Speaker 1: be perfect and what other people want that sometimes they

264
00:16:39,280 --> 00:16:41,920
Speaker 1: often lose a sense of who they are. And when

265
00:16:41,920 --> 00:16:45,680
Speaker 1: I mean who they are, I mean what are your characteristics?

266
00:16:45,680 --> 00:16:48,440
Speaker 1: Are you kind? Are you thoughtful? Not what you do?

267
00:16:48,600 --> 00:16:52,480
Speaker 1: Which is their role um regards you know, if they're

268
00:16:52,480 --> 00:16:55,560
Speaker 1: a mom, or a sister or a worker, But just

269
00:16:55,720 --> 00:16:59,720
Speaker 1: who are you as a person without all of these labels,

270
00:16:59,720 --> 00:17:03,840
Speaker 1: with out all of these expectations, Who are you? And

271
00:17:03,920 --> 00:17:06,680
Speaker 1: so how can we start to embrace that? And so

272
00:17:06,800 --> 00:17:12,160
Speaker 1: what I always kind of emphasize is honesty yourself. Um.

273
00:17:12,320 --> 00:17:17,120
Speaker 1: Sometimes we realize that something's off, we feel off, patns off,

274
00:17:17,160 --> 00:17:20,840
Speaker 1: we've got unhealthy behavior, but we keep going anyway because

275
00:17:20,880 --> 00:17:23,880
Speaker 1: we hope that it's going to get better. So the

276
00:17:23,880 --> 00:17:26,560
Speaker 1: first thing is being honest with myself and saying, Okay,

277
00:17:26,600 --> 00:17:30,399
Speaker 1: there's something going on, something is not right, um, and

278
00:17:30,440 --> 00:17:34,639
Speaker 1: I need help. And so what I do then is

279
00:17:34,880 --> 00:17:39,199
Speaker 1: constantly I'm always talking through my clients, um and just

280
00:17:39,280 --> 00:17:42,840
Speaker 1: asking them questions. Um. That's one of my superpowers, this

281
00:17:43,000 --> 00:17:47,000
Speaker 1: is asking questions. So things like, okay, what does this

282
00:17:47,080 --> 00:17:50,080
Speaker 1: say about me? You know, when you're about to do something?

283
00:17:50,440 --> 00:17:53,200
Speaker 1: What does it say about me? What does it say

284
00:17:53,200 --> 00:17:55,679
Speaker 1: about who I am? Why is it so important? Simple

285
00:17:55,760 --> 00:17:59,840
Speaker 1: things like getting people to write things down. We don't write.

286
00:18:00,200 --> 00:18:02,439
Speaker 1: And I always say, you know, when you take the

287
00:18:02,480 --> 00:18:05,040
Speaker 1: time to stop and write things down, then you start

288
00:18:05,080 --> 00:18:08,000
Speaker 1: to think more clearly. You don't feel so overwhelmed. So

289
00:18:08,119 --> 00:18:11,159
Speaker 1: sometimes okay, if I'm gonna make a decision. Let me

290
00:18:11,240 --> 00:18:14,720
Speaker 1: actually write out the pros and cons versus it being

291
00:18:14,760 --> 00:18:18,240
Speaker 1: in my head, because down that begins to make things clear.

292
00:18:18,320 --> 00:18:22,840
Speaker 1: Now I'm starting to make decisions. I teach clients about boundaries.

293
00:18:23,240 --> 00:18:27,040
Speaker 1: Boundaries is so huge, um. And that means saying no

294
00:18:27,640 --> 00:18:29,960
Speaker 1: to other people that might be even been saying no

295
00:18:30,119 --> 00:18:34,040
Speaker 1: to myself. So that's another big thing. UM that I

296
00:18:34,119 --> 00:18:37,600
Speaker 1: teach them is just boundaries. You've got to have boundaries.

297
00:18:38,119 --> 00:18:42,080
Speaker 1: And then um, also asking your questions about your expectations.

298
00:18:42,200 --> 00:18:47,000
Speaker 1: Are they realistic? Um? Are they realistic for me? Are

299
00:18:47,040 --> 00:18:50,600
Speaker 1: they realistic to other people? And then one big thing

300
00:18:50,640 --> 00:18:53,840
Speaker 1: I'd like to teach is on self compassion because we

301
00:18:54,000 --> 00:18:56,480
Speaker 1: tend to be so hard on ourselves. I'm not good

302
00:18:56,600 --> 00:18:59,960
Speaker 1: enough from a failure, Um, I can't believe I'm made

303
00:19:00,000 --> 00:19:03,159
Speaker 1: all these mistakes. I teach people how to be gentle,

304
00:19:03,480 --> 00:19:08,480
Speaker 1: kind and loving towards themselves, um, and start to embrace

305
00:19:08,560 --> 00:19:11,439
Speaker 1: who they are as a person, in their strengths, and

306
00:19:11,960 --> 00:19:15,520
Speaker 1: teach them about the power of vulnerability. Like you know,

307
00:19:16,359 --> 00:19:20,919
Speaker 1: I often hear people talk about the negative emotions and

308
00:19:21,000 --> 00:19:23,600
Speaker 1: positive and for me, there is no difference in emotion.

309
00:19:23,720 --> 00:19:27,159
Speaker 1: Is an emotion. But people have a hard time and

310
00:19:27,400 --> 00:19:32,040
Speaker 1: sharing what they call negative emotions like sadness, hurt because

311
00:19:32,040 --> 00:19:35,040
Speaker 1: they sense that it's weak. Well, actually, when you start

312
00:19:35,960 --> 00:19:38,600
Speaker 1: being honest with yourself, saying how you feel, saying what

313
00:19:38,640 --> 00:19:41,840
Speaker 1: you need, then you get so much more power than

314
00:19:41,920 --> 00:19:45,040
Speaker 1: you actually think. I think that's that's key as well.

315
00:19:46,400 --> 00:19:49,920
Speaker 1: So something you mentioned beyond and that made me think, um,

316
00:19:50,040 --> 00:19:54,720
Speaker 1: what somebody who struggles with perfectionism really be able to

317
00:19:54,840 --> 00:19:58,119
Speaker 1: gauge whether an expectation was realistic or not? Like, how

318
00:19:58,160 --> 00:20:02,560
Speaker 1: would you help them to gauge whether something was realistic? Yeah,

319
00:20:02,720 --> 00:20:08,320
Speaker 1: so at the beginning of MM, that is very hard.

320
00:20:08,480 --> 00:20:11,560
Speaker 1: But um, the first thing I would ask is like, well,

321
00:20:11,760 --> 00:20:15,360
Speaker 1: well where did this come from? Where did the idea

322
00:20:15,760 --> 00:20:20,200
Speaker 1: come from? Um? And asking them do you think there's

323
00:20:20,240 --> 00:20:23,440
Speaker 1: any possible up a way? Have you seen anyone else

324
00:20:23,520 --> 00:20:28,399
Speaker 1: do it? And so in asking questions for me, it

325
00:20:28,560 --> 00:20:33,800
Speaker 1: stops and makes people think, um, at different ways of

326
00:20:33,920 --> 00:20:38,760
Speaker 1: looking at things, in different experiences. And if you and

327
00:20:38,840 --> 00:20:41,640
Speaker 1: you know, and I always give examples or well who

328
00:20:41,880 --> 00:20:46,359
Speaker 1: who where did you learn that from? And then they'll

329
00:20:46,359 --> 00:20:48,320
Speaker 1: tell me and I'm like, okay, well the person that

330
00:20:48,440 --> 00:20:51,159
Speaker 1: learned you learned that from, or who told you this?

331
00:20:51,520 --> 00:20:55,080
Speaker 1: What do you think about that person? And the reason

332
00:20:55,119 --> 00:20:56,600
Speaker 1: I asked in that because I always don't want to

333
00:20:56,640 --> 00:20:59,200
Speaker 1: know is this a healthy source that you're getting your

334
00:20:59,240 --> 00:21:04,160
Speaker 1: expectations from, because if it's not, and then they're like, oh,

335
00:21:04,240 --> 00:21:06,679
Speaker 1: I never thought about it like that. So I find

336
00:21:07,160 --> 00:21:10,560
Speaker 1: breaking down the questions finding out where did these expectations

337
00:21:10,600 --> 00:21:14,720
Speaker 1: come from? And are there any alternatives stops to make

338
00:21:14,760 --> 00:21:17,480
Speaker 1: people think. Does they always make them change straight away? No?

339
00:21:18,160 --> 00:21:22,400
Speaker 1: Absolutely not. But then they come back and be like, oh, yeah,

340
00:21:22,440 --> 00:21:24,560
Speaker 1: you know that thing that you said like three months ago,

341
00:21:24,680 --> 00:21:27,600
Speaker 1: and I say, yes, oh I see it now. So

342
00:21:28,520 --> 00:21:30,880
Speaker 1: I think that's a big thing for us as therapists

343
00:21:30,880 --> 00:21:33,160
Speaker 1: as well, not to expect our clients to change straight

344
00:21:33,160 --> 00:21:35,960
Speaker 1: away because you know, this is what they've been doing

345
00:21:35,960 --> 00:21:38,880
Speaker 1: for a long time, right of course, of course, And

346
00:21:38,920 --> 00:21:41,320
Speaker 1: one of the questions that you mentioned early on, I

347
00:21:41,320 --> 00:21:44,639
Speaker 1: could imagine that being a very powerful probably a couple

348
00:21:44,680 --> 00:21:48,760
Speaker 1: of sessions, UM tell me about like who you are

349
00:21:49,119 --> 00:21:52,119
Speaker 1: not necessarily your rule, right, because it feels like a

350
00:21:52,160 --> 00:21:55,000
Speaker 1: lot of perfectionism is tied to rules like I want

351
00:21:55,000 --> 00:21:56,720
Speaker 1: to be the perfect mother, I want to be the

352
00:21:56,720 --> 00:21:59,680
Speaker 1: perfect therapist, I want to be the perfect daughter kind

353
00:21:59,680 --> 00:22:02,359
Speaker 1: of thing, and like you describe, those are all rules.

354
00:22:02,400 --> 00:22:04,840
Speaker 1: Those are not things that are like inherent to me.

355
00:22:04,960 --> 00:22:07,679
Speaker 1: Those are just rules that I play UM. So I

356
00:22:07,720 --> 00:22:10,159
Speaker 1: can imagine that may even be a struggle for people

357
00:22:10,200 --> 00:22:16,280
Speaker 1: to divorce themselves of those roles versus who I really am. Yeah,

358
00:22:16,400 --> 00:22:19,679
Speaker 1: So how I teach that is UM, I incorporate the

359
00:22:19,800 --> 00:22:24,840
Speaker 1: roles um in the sense that so say they have

360
00:22:25,720 --> 00:22:30,520
Speaker 1: UM A sister, say their mole ism mom okay, And

361
00:22:30,600 --> 00:22:34,000
Speaker 1: so I say to them, Okay, what does it take?

362
00:22:34,200 --> 00:22:39,840
Speaker 1: What characteristics or um do you need to be a mom?

363
00:22:39,880 --> 00:22:44,000
Speaker 1: And so they all identify loving, care, l caring, thoughtful.

364
00:22:44,119 --> 00:22:47,240
Speaker 1: I said, okay, give me another role. So then they'll

365
00:22:47,240 --> 00:22:49,840
Speaker 1: give me another role in their life, for example, friend.

366
00:22:50,040 --> 00:22:51,600
Speaker 1: And then I'll say to them, well, what do you

367
00:22:51,640 --> 00:22:54,960
Speaker 1: need to be a good friend? And then they'll give

368
00:22:55,000 --> 00:22:58,680
Speaker 1: me the characteristics. So by them giving me those characteristics,

369
00:22:58,720 --> 00:23:03,119
Speaker 1: they start to see how um those characteristics are playing

370
00:23:03,160 --> 00:23:07,480
Speaker 1: out in their roles versus their roles playing into their characteristics.

371
00:23:07,640 --> 00:23:09,320
Speaker 1: That's how I kind of helped them and break it

372
00:23:09,359 --> 00:23:12,679
Speaker 1: down for them. Okay, yeah, that does seem like it

373
00:23:12,680 --> 00:23:15,280
Speaker 1: would be easier to manage in that way. Because they

374
00:23:15,320 --> 00:23:17,720
Speaker 1: have they can't you know, it's hard for them to

375
00:23:17,840 --> 00:23:21,040
Speaker 1: see it, UM, to see who they are and the

376
00:23:21,119 --> 00:23:25,120
Speaker 1: great person they are. So that's where the therapy comes in.

377
00:23:25,280 --> 00:23:30,240
Speaker 1: And I think also once you start building um a

378
00:23:30,320 --> 00:23:36,480
Speaker 1: great relationship and making a safe place UM with with clients, UM,

379
00:23:36,600 --> 00:23:38,760
Speaker 1: then I can also start to help them see some

380
00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:41,760
Speaker 1: things and you know, and congratulate them and things that

381
00:23:41,840 --> 00:23:44,760
Speaker 1: they've done and changes, and then they're like, oh, yeah

382
00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:46,920
Speaker 1: I did do that. Oh I didn't think about that,

383
00:23:47,040 --> 00:23:49,479
Speaker 1: And then they begin to it's not their eyes and

384
00:23:49,560 --> 00:23:53,520
Speaker 1: see already who they are. They just didn't realize it.

385
00:23:56,680 --> 00:23:59,680
Speaker 1: So you've already kind of offered us some tips and

386
00:23:59,760 --> 00:24:02,200
Speaker 1: ex plaining the way that you work with your clients

387
00:24:02,320 --> 00:24:05,240
Speaker 1: UM to help with this perfectionism. But are there other

388
00:24:05,359 --> 00:24:08,120
Speaker 1: tips or strategies that you could offer to people who

389
00:24:08,160 --> 00:24:10,159
Speaker 1: may be listening and thinking like, oh, I can kind

390
00:24:10,200 --> 00:24:13,040
Speaker 1: of see myself and which he's describing, um, some tips

391
00:24:13,080 --> 00:24:16,359
Speaker 1: to trying to manage some of this perfectionism. UM. Yeah.

392
00:24:16,480 --> 00:24:18,840
Speaker 1: I did actually kind of mention quite a few of them.

393
00:24:18,880 --> 00:24:24,320
Speaker 1: But besides UM, you know, also having a safe space.

394
00:24:24,840 --> 00:24:28,920
Speaker 1: Some people don't have a safe space to share UM,

395
00:24:28,960 --> 00:24:31,320
Speaker 1: so sometimes you might want to start creating that. And

396
00:24:31,359 --> 00:24:33,159
Speaker 1: I always say to people people like, well, have I

397
00:24:33,200 --> 00:24:35,359
Speaker 1: know if people safe? And I was like, just pay

398
00:24:35,400 --> 00:24:38,919
Speaker 1: attention to people, and how do they talk about other people?

399
00:24:39,000 --> 00:24:42,000
Speaker 1: Do they speak highly of them or not highly of them?

400
00:24:42,080 --> 00:24:43,399
Speaker 1: And they're like yeah, And I was like, you know,

401
00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:45,840
Speaker 1: for the most part, you guys know more than you

402
00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:47,959
Speaker 1: think you do, and you kind of get that feeling

403
00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:51,400
Speaker 1: if they're a safe person. And so you just gradually,

404
00:24:51,560 --> 00:24:53,800
Speaker 1: you know, kind of say hey, I'm having a hard day,

405
00:24:53,840 --> 00:24:57,479
Speaker 1: I'm having a tough moment. UM. So those are some

406
00:24:57,560 --> 00:25:00,520
Speaker 1: things being like I said, saying no to your self

407
00:25:01,080 --> 00:25:04,639
Speaker 1: and finding through the fear. UM. I don't know if

408
00:25:04,640 --> 00:25:09,280
Speaker 1: people heard this saying do it afraid, UM, I do

409
00:25:09,359 --> 00:25:12,399
Speaker 1: a whole bunch of things afraid, Like coming onto this podcast,

410
00:25:12,720 --> 00:25:17,720
Speaker 1: it's scary, okay, and UM. And I say this because

411
00:25:17,720 --> 00:25:23,880
Speaker 1: you know, I constantly UM struggle with perfectionism. You know, UM,

412
00:25:23,920 --> 00:25:26,040
Speaker 1: I was even mentioned to you Joy. You know, I

413
00:25:26,080 --> 00:25:29,639
Speaker 1: had a perfectionism moment and I thankfully had a great

414
00:25:29,640 --> 00:25:33,639
Speaker 1: friend to talk to and share that. And what I

415
00:25:33,760 --> 00:25:37,720
Speaker 1: realized is which we share UM with everyone, is I

416
00:25:37,840 --> 00:25:42,159
Speaker 1: have to be honest about UM what I need and

417
00:25:42,240 --> 00:25:46,800
Speaker 1: what I didn't get so um in this moment um,

418
00:25:46,840 --> 00:25:49,560
Speaker 1: and I was telling myself why shouldn't feel like that?

419
00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:52,600
Speaker 1: Or I shouldn't want this? But no, I had to

420
00:25:52,640 --> 00:25:54,879
Speaker 1: say in that moment it was particularly I just needed

421
00:25:54,920 --> 00:25:59,000
Speaker 1: approval from somebody in that moment and they wasn't giving

422
00:25:59,040 --> 00:26:01,800
Speaker 1: it to me. But I felt like I shouldn't even

423
00:26:01,840 --> 00:26:04,720
Speaker 1: want that. This goes back to Shuggar would have could it?

424
00:26:05,359 --> 00:26:07,879
Speaker 1: So in that it's saying, Okay, well what do I

425
00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:11,000
Speaker 1: really need? And that goes back to being honest with myself.

426
00:26:11,280 --> 00:26:14,560
Speaker 1: But of course if you're struggling with perfectionism, you don't

427
00:26:14,560 --> 00:26:16,320
Speaker 1: want to pay a week, You want to tear like

428
00:26:16,440 --> 00:26:20,159
Speaker 1: you've got everything um together. But in that experience, it

429
00:26:20,200 --> 00:26:23,840
Speaker 1: asked me, let me feel so much more free, And

430
00:26:23,880 --> 00:26:27,360
Speaker 1: that's what we're going towards. We're going towards freedom um

431
00:26:27,400 --> 00:26:30,080
Speaker 1: in that and being authentic and being who you are

432
00:26:30,920 --> 00:26:34,040
Speaker 1: UM in in embracing those. So I don't know if

433
00:26:34,040 --> 00:26:36,120
Speaker 1: you also wanted me to share some books that would

434
00:26:36,160 --> 00:26:40,320
Speaker 1: be helpful as well? Yes, absolutely, all of your favorite

435
00:26:40,359 --> 00:26:44,919
Speaker 1: resources for people to learn more about about perfectionism. Um

436
00:26:46,400 --> 00:26:50,160
Speaker 1: soh yeah, before we talk about books, journaling, um, just

437
00:26:50,280 --> 00:26:53,879
Speaker 1: writing down. Um. We always go back to this, I

438
00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:59,119
Speaker 1: think as therapists, not me. But it's so powerful and

439
00:26:59,160 --> 00:27:01,399
Speaker 1: I'm gonna say that I don't always do it, but

440
00:27:01,480 --> 00:27:03,919
Speaker 1: when I do do it, I do feel so much better.

441
00:27:04,240 --> 00:27:07,239
Speaker 1: The things like, UM, writing how you felt today and

442
00:27:07,400 --> 00:27:10,960
Speaker 1: writing a gratitude list what you're thankful for also help

443
00:27:11,040 --> 00:27:14,720
Speaker 1: you to be present. I think that's another big thing,

444
00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:20,040
Speaker 1: is trying to be present in the moment. UM. Turning

445
00:27:20,080 --> 00:27:25,240
Speaker 1: off the phone to be present, or turning off Instagram

446
00:27:25,640 --> 00:27:28,920
Speaker 1: or social media for the weekend. I do that, um,

447
00:27:28,960 --> 00:27:31,879
Speaker 1: just because I don't want to, um, you know, be

448
00:27:32,160 --> 00:27:36,520
Speaker 1: kept connected and wired and comparing myself. But UM, some

449
00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:42,040
Speaker 1: great book is Boundaries by Townsend and Cloud. UM that's

450
00:27:42,040 --> 00:27:45,439
Speaker 1: a really really good book, UM for them to read like,

451
00:27:45,720 --> 00:27:51,040
Speaker 1: it's so good. Gifts of Imperfection by Brune Brown and

452
00:27:51,119 --> 00:27:54,840
Speaker 1: Brne Brown also has a Ted talk on UM. Two

453
00:27:54,880 --> 00:27:59,640
Speaker 1: Ted talks on listening to shame and the power of vulnerability. UM.

454
00:27:59,680 --> 00:28:05,239
Speaker 1: She was has another good book, Daring Greatly. And for

455
00:28:05,320 --> 00:28:08,800
Speaker 1: those clients. I do have clients, UM, and and people

456
00:28:08,920 --> 00:28:13,119
Speaker 1: who are Christians. So that's because I help my clients

457
00:28:13,160 --> 00:28:15,719
Speaker 1: as I've also been trained for that, and so for

458
00:28:15,760 --> 00:28:19,199
Speaker 1: those who are Christian, and because I find there's a

459
00:28:19,240 --> 00:28:23,720
Speaker 1: lot of parental wounds in the perfectionism. As we talked

460
00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:27,040
Speaker 1: about it starts from the family. And one good book

461
00:28:27,080 --> 00:28:28,760
Speaker 1: and even if you're not a Christian, you can still

462
00:28:28,800 --> 00:28:32,720
Speaker 1: read it. But it's called Experiencing Father's Embraced by Jack

463
00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:38,880
Speaker 1: frost Um is another one, and also the blog The

464
00:28:39,000 --> 00:28:44,920
Speaker 1: Father Swap by kia Um Stevens and is another good book,

465
00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:49,080
Speaker 1: a really really good book. And for those um Without

466
00:28:49,160 --> 00:28:53,800
Speaker 1: Bruises by Jillian Simmons. It talks about her abusive relationship.

467
00:28:54,320 --> 00:28:57,080
Speaker 1: And I just want to highlight on that because she

468
00:28:57,280 --> 00:29:00,720
Speaker 1: was a really good book and she was like, she's

469
00:29:00,880 --> 00:29:04,080
Speaker 1: still a radio personality, and so she was on the radio,

470
00:29:04,720 --> 00:29:07,360
Speaker 1: you know, presented herself as just having it all together

471
00:29:07,400 --> 00:29:10,320
Speaker 1: and having a great life, but behind closed doors, she

472
00:29:10,440 --> 00:29:15,360
Speaker 1: was in an abusive relationship, um and very much more

473
00:29:15,400 --> 00:29:18,640
Speaker 1: emotional abusive. That's why I kind of liked that book.

474
00:29:18,680 --> 00:29:21,280
Speaker 1: So I think that's a good book for people to

475
00:29:21,320 --> 00:29:25,120
Speaker 1: read and realize they're not alone. He said. The name

476
00:29:25,120 --> 00:29:29,400
Speaker 1: of that one was Without Bruises, Without Bruises by Julian Simmons,

477
00:29:29,520 --> 00:29:31,959
Speaker 1: and I think that's that's a really good one. So

478
00:29:32,000 --> 00:29:37,360
Speaker 1: those are some um good tips to start with. Yeah,

479
00:29:37,400 --> 00:29:39,520
Speaker 1: that's a really good list. I mean in the Boundaries

480
00:29:39,520 --> 00:29:42,840
Speaker 1: and the Gifts of Imperfection, like like many guests have

481
00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:45,680
Speaker 1: recommended those, so you can tell that those are like

482
00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:49,360
Speaker 1: therapist favorites because there are people so people have already

483
00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:52,360
Speaker 1: recommended though, so that should indicate that those are actually

484
00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:57,480
Speaker 1: really good ones. Tookshelf m definitely definitely, definitely, definitely. So

485
00:29:57,560 --> 00:29:59,840
Speaker 1: that's just a good place to start. And sometimes you know,

486
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:04,920
Speaker 1: go back and read like bios autobiographies of people who

487
00:30:04,960 --> 00:30:07,520
Speaker 1: you really admire, and you will find that their lives

488
00:30:07,520 --> 00:30:13,600
Speaker 1: were not perfect. So I think that's also helpful as well.

489
00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:17,360
Speaker 1: If we have the expectation that life is imperfect versus

490
00:30:17,400 --> 00:30:19,320
Speaker 1: that it's going to be perfect, it gets a lot

491
00:30:19,360 --> 00:30:24,880
Speaker 1: easier to manage, right, Yeah, So is there anything exciting

492
00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:27,520
Speaker 1: going on in your practice, Bianca that you want to

493
00:30:27,560 --> 00:30:33,400
Speaker 1: share with people? Um? Yes, So for those who are

494
00:30:33,560 --> 00:30:37,760
Speaker 1: in Atlanta, UM, i am got a couple of things

495
00:30:37,840 --> 00:30:42,800
Speaker 1: going on so in March, which is much twenty four Um,

496
00:30:42,880 --> 00:30:45,680
Speaker 1: you guys can find out this information on my website,

497
00:30:45,720 --> 00:30:48,720
Speaker 1: which I'll give to you as well. I'm going to

498
00:30:48,840 --> 00:30:51,960
Speaker 1: be doing a workshop called I Love Me Some Me

499
00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:56,680
Speaker 1: and that will be talking about the self compassion as

500
00:30:56,720 --> 00:31:03,040
Speaker 1: an antidote for perfectionism. So that we'll be in Atlanta. UM. Also,

501
00:31:03,360 --> 00:31:06,640
Speaker 1: you ladies can find me those who are in Atlanta

502
00:31:06,760 --> 00:31:10,920
Speaker 1: at a Sister Siesta, which is actually for black women

503
00:31:12,240 --> 00:31:14,840
Speaker 1: and it's a monthly event. UM. You can find the

504
00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:19,160
Speaker 1: information on event Bright monthly event where women of color,

505
00:31:19,200 --> 00:31:22,360
Speaker 1: black women just come together and just we just talk

506
00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:25,120
Speaker 1: on different topics. And I just co facilitate that with

507
00:31:25,960 --> 00:31:28,520
Speaker 1: Jumping with Jazz with Jazzmine, which is a great event

508
00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:30,840
Speaker 1: and everyone who comes just loves it because they just

509
00:31:30,920 --> 00:31:33,200
Speaker 1: feel safe. They feel they can let their head down

510
00:31:33,240 --> 00:31:36,800
Speaker 1: and they don't have to have this strong woman um

511
00:31:36,840 --> 00:31:39,400
Speaker 1: and be perfect in that. So that's a good place

512
00:31:39,400 --> 00:31:43,240
Speaker 1: where you can come and join in and um oh,

513
00:31:43,320 --> 00:31:45,040
Speaker 1: and I'm also going to be preparing to do a

514
00:31:45,080 --> 00:31:49,560
Speaker 1: group on parental wounds which will start in mid March,

515
00:31:49,720 --> 00:31:54,240
Speaker 1: which would be a private UM therapy group. So yeah,

516
00:31:54,800 --> 00:31:57,480
Speaker 1: you're going to be very busy, I am. And I

517
00:31:57,640 --> 00:32:02,200
Speaker 1: also wanted to offer the ladies daily affirmations which they

518
00:32:02,200 --> 00:32:05,880
Speaker 1: will be able to download on my website. UM. And

519
00:32:05,920 --> 00:32:09,080
Speaker 1: it's just daily affirmations that they can read to themselves

520
00:32:09,200 --> 00:32:13,560
Speaker 1: prontown import in their mirror like an amazing, I'm courageous,

521
00:32:13,880 --> 00:32:16,400
Speaker 1: I'm kind those kind of things because so they can

522
00:32:16,440 --> 00:32:19,280
Speaker 1: start to build up on their identity and start thinking

523
00:32:19,280 --> 00:32:24,480
Speaker 1: about themselves and who they are. So, what is your website, Bianca? So?

524
00:32:24,560 --> 00:32:30,440
Speaker 1: My website is Bianca K Hughes. It's about h Q

525
00:32:30,560 --> 00:32:36,120
Speaker 1: G h e s dot com in any social media

526
00:32:36,160 --> 00:32:40,520
Speaker 1: handles you want to share with people. Yes, so, And

527
00:32:40,600 --> 00:32:43,880
Speaker 1: if you don't get this, everything is on my website.

528
00:32:43,960 --> 00:32:49,520
Speaker 1: But on Facebook and Twitter, I am authentically and then

529
00:32:49,560 --> 00:32:52,600
Speaker 1: it's the letter B and then the letter you, and

530
00:32:52,640 --> 00:32:56,720
Speaker 1: then Instagram and YouTube. You can find me on authentically

531
00:32:56,800 --> 00:33:00,640
Speaker 1: be you. So that would be UM spelled b E

532
00:33:01,040 --> 00:33:04,840
Speaker 1: and N y o U. And all of this information

533
00:33:04,880 --> 00:33:06,760
Speaker 1: will also be in the show notes so that people

534
00:33:06,760 --> 00:33:11,320
Speaker 1: don't have to worry about missing any of that. Yeah,

535
00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:13,240
Speaker 1: I know, it's hard to keep out with all of

536
00:33:13,240 --> 00:33:16,479
Speaker 1: this stuff joy, especially when people are driving. You know,

537
00:33:16,520 --> 00:33:18,560
Speaker 1: they can't make notes of this, So that's why I

538
00:33:18,600 --> 00:33:22,240
Speaker 1: always like to include it in the show notes. Yeah. Well,

539
00:33:22,280 --> 00:33:24,680
Speaker 1: thank you so much for joining us today, Bianca and

540
00:33:24,720 --> 00:33:28,479
Speaker 1: sharing a wealth of information. I really appreciated. You're welcome

541
00:33:28,480 --> 00:33:33,360
Speaker 1: and I really hope this helps the women um that

542
00:33:33,440 --> 00:33:37,240
Speaker 1: are struggling with that, and you know, because it's difficult,

543
00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:40,760
Speaker 1: So I hope this helps everyone. Absolutely. Thank you, Bianca.

544
00:33:41,240 --> 00:33:45,120
Speaker 1: You're welcome. Make sure to check out those incredible resources

545
00:33:45,160 --> 00:33:48,120
Speaker 1: Bianca mentioned. You can find links to all of the

546
00:33:48,160 --> 00:33:51,400
Speaker 1: books and videos she mentioned at Therapy for Black Girls

547
00:33:51,440 --> 00:33:56,160
Speaker 1: dot Com slash Session forty four. If you recognize yourself

548
00:33:56,160 --> 00:33:59,120
Speaker 1: in this episode, I feel like you learned something new.

549
00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:02,360
Speaker 1: We loved hear about it. Please share your thoughts with

550
00:34:02,480 --> 00:34:04,840
Speaker 1: us on social media and make sure to use the

551
00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:10,080
Speaker 1: hashtag t b G in session. Remember that if you're

552
00:34:10,120 --> 00:34:14,080
Speaker 1: looking for a therapist, use the therapist directory at Therapy

553
00:34:14,120 --> 00:34:18,080
Speaker 1: for Black Girls dot com slash directory. And if you

554
00:34:18,120 --> 00:34:20,440
Speaker 1: want to join us in the thrive tribe, where we

555
00:34:20,480 --> 00:34:24,080
Speaker 1: continue the conversations from the podcast and talk about all

556
00:34:24,200 --> 00:34:27,200
Speaker 1: other kinds of issues, head on over to Therapy for

557
00:34:27,200 --> 00:34:31,560
Speaker 1: Black Girls dot com slash tribe and join us To

558
00:34:31,719 --> 00:34:35,520
Speaker 1: keep up with important updates and mental health information. Make

559
00:34:35,520 --> 00:34:39,080
Speaker 1: sure you're following us all across social media. You can

560
00:34:39,120 --> 00:34:42,479
Speaker 1: find us on Twitter at Therapy for the Number four

561
00:34:42,840 --> 00:34:45,839
Speaker 1: be Girls, and you can find us on Instagram and

562
00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:50,080
Speaker 1: Facebook at therapy for Black Girls, and please make sure

563
00:34:50,160 --> 00:34:53,040
Speaker 1: that you're continuing to share the podcast with new people

564
00:34:53,080 --> 00:34:55,560
Speaker 1: who have not heard of it. You can do that

565
00:34:55,600 --> 00:34:59,279
Speaker 1: by texting them about the episode, tweeting about the episode,

566
00:34:59,560 --> 00:35:02,920
Speaker 1: or share the information about the podcast in your Insta stories.

567
00:35:04,239 --> 00:35:06,640
Speaker 1: Thank you all so much again for joining me this week,

568
00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:09,560
Speaker 1: and I'm looking forward to continue in this conversation with

569
00:35:09,640 --> 00:35:11,919
Speaker 1: you all real soon. Take care,