Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Kristin Davis, and I want to know are
Speaker 1: you a Charlotte today? I have an incredible friend on
Speaker 1: you want to know me, Lena Wait, who is an
Speaker 1: incredible actress, producer, and screenwriter and director. She created a
Speaker 1: Showtime show called The Shy, which is now in its
Speaker 1: seventh season, which is amazing. She wrote and produced Queen
Speaker 1: and Slim the film. And when I first really really
Speaker 1: became aware of her as most people is when she
Speaker 1: started Master of None. She became the first African American
Speaker 1: woman to win the Prime Time Emmy Award for Outstanding
Speaker 1: Writing for a Comedy Series. And she's also in that
Speaker 1: series and it's so incredible. It's about her own coming
Speaker 1: out story. I love her so much and she knows
Speaker 1: so much about television. I think you guys are really
Speaker 1: going to enjoy this.
Speaker 2: Elena Wait.
Speaker 1: Yay ye, thank you for joining us.
Speaker 2: THANKI for having me dined. Have you on?
Speaker 3: I've been dying to come on.
Speaker 1: I texted Lena right away, Yeah when we got this podcast,
Speaker 1: did saying.
Speaker 2: You will have to be on, please please please.
Speaker 3: And I said, yes you did, thank God, thank God.
Speaker 3: So honored to be here.
Speaker 1: I am honored to have you, and I'm honored to
Speaker 1: have you for many reasons. Number One, I just like
Speaker 1: to see you. I love to see Number two Lena,
Speaker 1: in case you guys don't know, is a multi hyphen it.
Speaker 1: I'm going to tell you your whole resume later and
Speaker 1: you're not in front of me. But the thing that's
Speaker 1: important is that her knowledge a film and television is
Speaker 1: so expansive and deep, and this is partly why I
Speaker 1: love her. Like when we first started, and just like that,
Speaker 1: you left me the sweetest, sweetest voicemail. I don't know
Speaker 1: what panicky thing I had sent to you or whatever,
Speaker 1: but you know, you're just very grounding. Your knowledge is
Speaker 1: very grounding in terms of you know what has happened before,
Speaker 1: You know how things develop in our culture on television,
Speaker 1: in film, what it means. And as you just said
Speaker 1: to me when you sat down we were talking about
Speaker 1: this episode, you said, I think television has a timestamp,
Speaker 1: which tell me more, what.
Speaker 3: Do you well?
Speaker 4: I think sometimes when people look at TV from say,
Speaker 4: ten years ago or even twenty, it can feel in
Speaker 4: moments uncomfortable or icky, even because you're thinking, oh, well,
Speaker 4: no one would make that joke today, or you couldn't
Speaker 4: do that now. And what's interesting about that is what
Speaker 4: I believe art is it's time capsule, really, and it's
Speaker 4: a time stamp of where we were at that time
Speaker 4: and what was happening in the world then. And so
Speaker 4: I think of even though yes, He's are fictitious characters,
Speaker 4: in a way, this is sort of giving us a
Speaker 4: sense of what New York was at that time, what
Speaker 4: it was for women at that time, what the limits
Speaker 4: were at that moment, and what could and couldn't be
Speaker 4: talked about, and what barriers you guys were pushing up against.
Speaker 4: And so I'm really grateful that I got to grow
Speaker 4: up with it.
Speaker 3: I was, like am I.
Speaker 4: I was a teenager when it first came on, and
Speaker 4: so I was learning so much about what it meant
Speaker 4: to be an adult friend by watching you all. And
Speaker 4: I think I was more interested in that than the
Speaker 4: love stories per se. But the love stories are there
Speaker 4: as well, sold you bust about self love and how
Speaker 4: you see yourself. But watching it now as a forty
Speaker 4: year old person revisiting the episode, for a lot of
Speaker 4: us who are my age, we feel a little confronted
Speaker 4: by now Sex and the City because we are now
Speaker 4: the ages that you guys were then at that time,
Speaker 4: and we're seeing ourselves play out some of these storylines,
Speaker 4: and that I think is saying that the show. You
Speaker 4: may point certain things out and say, oh, you can
Speaker 4: make that joke now, but I do think the show
Speaker 4: is aging well, thank you, because the fact that I
Speaker 4: can see myself.
Speaker 3: In it as I get older and understand things better.
Speaker 4: It's worked that I've gotten to grow up with and
Speaker 4: I still get to sit with now. But now it's
Speaker 4: not a lot of us are saying it's not just
Speaker 4: fun on the background. Now now it's okay, I'm in
Speaker 4: this stage right now, or I'm going through a divorce,
Speaker 4: or I'm about to get married, or I'm about to
Speaker 4: have my first baby right and so now it's as
Speaker 4: if you guys are still there. I think of art
Speaker 4: as an inheritance, and so we have inherited this, this work,
Speaker 4: and that's why I think within just like that is
Speaker 4: the continuation of the life of the work. And so
Speaker 4: when I go back and revisit, and just like that,
Speaker 4: I will be as I get older, I will then
Speaker 4: start to understand these stories even more.
Speaker 3: I love time.
Speaker 2: Thank you.
Speaker 1: Yes, that's part of the reason I wanted to do
Speaker 1: the podcast is because I do feel also for myself.
Speaker 3: Right, you know you're there, right, because I was there.
Speaker 1: But also I was the age I was when we started, right,
Speaker 1: and now I'm the age I am now, and I
Speaker 1: have such a different perspective.
Speaker 2: And as I was telling you when you sat down.
Speaker 1: I had never really rewatched because when they would come
Speaker 1: out in the beginning, we would be so excited to
Speaker 1: see them, you know, because obviously we were kind of
Speaker 1: doing this fresh, totally different thing, and you know, we
Speaker 1: were always like a little scared also, you know about
Speaker 1: whatever we get done, as you know, because you act
Speaker 1: as well, it's like scary, you.
Speaker 4: Don't know how it's going to turn out, and you
Speaker 4: guys are taking a lot of.
Speaker 3: Risks, a lot of risks.
Speaker 1: I mean, we still are like wait till you see
Speaker 1: the first episode.
Speaker 3: Of Wait, I'm ready. Okay, I'm ready.
Speaker 2: I know, but I was like, oh my god, I
Speaker 2: forgot about that.
Speaker 1: But that's how we used to feel too, like you know,
Speaker 1: what do we say, what do we do? How's it
Speaker 1: going to seem? Are people going to be Just in
Speaker 1: the beginning, we thought people would just be outraged, you know,
Speaker 1: because there was nothing else like it, you know, and
Speaker 1: we weren't out there talking about sex freely as women
Speaker 1: time in nineteen ninety seven when we filmed the pilot,
Speaker 1: right a different time, right. So then over time, the
Speaker 1: first time that they syndicated the show, they edited it.
Speaker 2: Do you remember this it was on?
Speaker 3: Of course I was actually think about that, right, And so.
Speaker 1: They took a lot of stuff out, And if you'd
Speaker 1: be walking by TV and Beyon, I'd be like, ah,
Speaker 1: you know, it just seemed so weird to me, like
Speaker 1: to first of all have it be out in a
Speaker 1: mass way, right, we never expected that, and then to
Speaker 1: have it kind of altered, which was weird, so like
Speaker 1: whole storylines would be gone. And then also I felt like, well,
Speaker 1: I just don't want to relive it and like live
Speaker 1: in the past.
Speaker 4: Sure that's true, because the past and future don't exist, right.
Speaker 2: Exactly, there's only the now.
Speaker 1: But then when it came on Netflix and all these
Speaker 1: younger people started discovering it absolutely, and I think because
Speaker 1: we're still together working, so it's not that thing where
Speaker 1: it hurts you to look at it, you know, because
Speaker 1: we're still really very vibrantly together exactly, and you know, love.
Speaker 2: What we're doing still. So then I felt like, I so.
Speaker 1: Want to see what storylines still resonate, what still is true,
Speaker 1: what isn't true?
Speaker 2: You know what?
Speaker 1: Culturally, where are we at? So many things have changed
Speaker 1: and then certain things not changed it at all. Yeah,
Speaker 1: super fascinating, absolutely.
Speaker 4: I mean what I remember when it did come to E,
Speaker 4: and I remember because obviously I watched it on HBO
Speaker 4: and loved it.
Speaker 3: I us to watch what my mom was is like crazy,
Speaker 3: you know.
Speaker 4: But I think when it came to E, I think
Speaker 4: some people work kind of nervous about how is this
Speaker 4: going to translate? Because the whole thing about it is
Speaker 4: that it's HBO, it's premium, it's different. But I think
Speaker 4: what was happening was it had become such a cultural
Speaker 4: point in our society that I think it was actually
Speaker 4: really smart for E to put to grab it. Obviously
Speaker 4: for a lot of reasons, but because then it became
Speaker 4: this sort of thing where anyone could have access.
Speaker 3: To it, you know.
Speaker 4: And the truth is, because Sex and the City is
Speaker 4: such a premium type of entertainment, it was nice for
Speaker 4: people to have access to it, absolutely, and I think
Speaker 4: that was cool. And I think now when it came
Speaker 4: to Netflix because now it's everywhere.
Speaker 3: It's exactly as it was.
Speaker 4: They aren't taking things, yeah and so, but now it's
Speaker 4: happening in a way where like when somebody gets sick
Speaker 4: or you're chilling at home, whatever, now you can just
Speaker 4: have it on, but you're not. It doesn't feel mindless though,
Speaker 4: it's sort of it's almost this new rebirth. If you
Speaker 4: think about it, how it airing this original then it
Speaker 4: goes to E now it's on Netflix. What it's telling
Speaker 4: you is, this is the kind of thing every television writer, creator,
Speaker 4: person wants to make something that can live in different mediums.
Speaker 4: You know, it can be on a streamer, it can
Speaker 4: be on a basic K you can go to HBO,
Speaker 4: Max Steell. I think if you want to find it
Speaker 4: and obviously still find the latest, it means that there
Speaker 4: is a desire for it. There is something about these characters,
Speaker 4: something about dating, something about friendship, something about trying to
Speaker 4: balance career and family. These are just universal things, you know.
Speaker 4: And look, you deal do with the race element, yes,
Speaker 4: like for women. But at the end of the day,
Speaker 4: it's like it's something very universal about it, very universal.
Speaker 3: And that's cool.
Speaker 4: But I mean, look, I mean, we live in a
Speaker 4: white leaning society, we live in a patriarchal society, we
Speaker 4: live in a capitalist society.
Speaker 3: Those are just facts.
Speaker 4: And when you accept that, there's a level of Okay,
Speaker 4: this is what's happening. But what I do think it
Speaker 4: just like that does is where you guys have brought
Speaker 4: black women to the table now, and so what you
Speaker 4: kind of find is that there's cultural differences, but not
Speaker 4: when it comes to love and balance and trying to
Speaker 4: raise kids and keep a husband and have a sense
Speaker 4: of self right. And so what that also reminds us
Speaker 4: is we have more in common than we think. But
Speaker 4: what's interesting about these characters is a black woman could
Speaker 4: say I relate.
Speaker 3: To Charlotte, of course, you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 4: A black woman could say I relate to Carry, an
Speaker 4: Asian woman could say I'm a Samantha my crew. Because
Speaker 4: it's really more about these these character sort of types.
Speaker 4: And also if I mean, there are people that break
Speaker 4: down sex in the city in much deeper ways than
Speaker 4: I do, but there are people that say they represent
Speaker 4: they make up one woman.
Speaker 3: I know you know, yeah, I mean, okay, see hello, hello,
Speaker 3: she knows.
Speaker 1: I did push back, did push back.
Speaker 4: It also depends on where you are in your life,
Speaker 4: because because sometimes you're you're in a Charlotte era where
Speaker 4: you're like, I really want to be married, I want
Speaker 4: to have the kid, and other times you're in the
Speaker 4: Samantha era where you're like, I'm cool here, I want
Speaker 4: to yes, exactly. So I think what's also interesting about
Speaker 4: the show is as you grow, and there's that whole
Speaker 4: argument online is that everybody says, when Miranda was right,
Speaker 4: you know, we were kind of were almost taught by
Speaker 4: society to, oh, Miranda is so uptight and she's so cold,
Speaker 4: and she doesn't she's not as you know, frolicky as
Speaker 4: the other girls. Yeah, but then you kind of grow,
Speaker 4: you kind of realize in your life, oh, she's a
Speaker 4: person with a lot of discernment, she doesn't trust easily.
Speaker 3: She's not as like warm and cuddly.
Speaker 4: And I think that's because the world, especially a corporate
Speaker 4: world where she lives in, you don't really get to
Speaker 4: be that, you know, I'm saying the Also, Charlotte is
Speaker 4: a person who is in the art world and she's
Speaker 4: a curator and all these different things. So I think
Speaker 4: you get to be a little bit more leaning to
Speaker 4: your feminine in a way that maybe of people can't.
Speaker 4: With Samantha working in pr you have to be tough,
Speaker 4: but there's also a level of like using her feminine
Speaker 4: wiles to get what she wants. And Carrie is a writer,
Speaker 4: so she has to live in order to do her job.
Speaker 4: If she's not dating and having sex, Like, what's her
Speaker 4: column going to be about?
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I forget that.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 4: So so there's just so many things about it and
Speaker 4: also so interesting because of course the press or critics,
Speaker 4: if you look at old reviews, they say, oh, it's
Speaker 4: gay men writing white writing, it's hating, or they have
Speaker 4: all this sex, or where they got this money from.
Speaker 3: Look, at the end of the day, it's what the
Speaker 3: show is actually.
Speaker 4: Doing is confronting all of us about what it means
Speaker 4: to be a woman in the world. And I really think,
Speaker 4: to me it was so fascinating about the show really
Speaker 4: covers is motherhood, you know, and about you know, have
Speaker 4: you got an abortion? Did you think about getting one?
Speaker 1: You know?
Speaker 4: I love the show coulda is one of my favorite
Speaker 4: episodes that talk about that one. It's fine, but you know,
Speaker 4: but yeah, it's just gonna, i know, come back. But
Speaker 4: it just sort of covers. And that's how I learned
Speaker 4: television writing, really from watching the watching Sex in the
Speaker 4: City and listening to Michael Patrick King's commentary.
Speaker 3: It's about making sure you have everyone's opinion in the room.
Speaker 4: And and and those writers were so great at making
Speaker 4: sure whatever the topic was, all four of you none
Speaker 4: of you agreed, right, and and I think that was
Speaker 4: and it was. That's what makes the scene, those obviously
Speaker 4: those iconic lunch dinner scenes so amazing because you all
Speaker 4: are going to have a different opinion, you know. Anyway,
Speaker 4: I love an episode I'm here to talk about. Miranda
Speaker 4: actually has to leave the table.
Speaker 1: God, I know I'd forgotten about this.
Speaker 3: She leaves the table because she's like, I'm tired of
Speaker 3: talking about men.
Speaker 1: I know, which I think Michael Patrick, because Michael Patrick
Speaker 1: wrote this episode is called you Now to the ball details.
Speaker 3: It's all good?
Speaker 4: Where Care was season two opener where Carrie is mourning her.
Speaker 1: Relationship exactly her relationship, living in that horrible fear that
Speaker 1: you're going to run in to your eggs somewhere in
Speaker 1: the world, which of course happens especially in New York
Speaker 1: on those streets you.
Speaker 4: Are and Charlotte is saying you have to, you know,
Speaker 4: be sad and be inside and go through, which I
Speaker 4: actually agree, I kind of agree.
Speaker 3: I agree with Charlotte there.
Speaker 2: I agree with myself. I agree with that.
Speaker 3: Character and Miranda.
Speaker 1: I don't know Miranda's like, nor don't feel those feelings.
Speaker 3: Just just you gotta go. Let's stop talking about it.
Speaker 4: And the truth is, when I was watching and I
Speaker 4: was like, oh my god, that's our lives right now,
Speaker 4: Like somebody's going through, you know, a separation, and some
Speaker 4: of us are saying, girl, you got to move on,
Speaker 4: and others are saying you need to mourn. And I
Speaker 4: was watching episodees like, oh Jesus, this is my.
Speaker 3: Life being reflected back.
Speaker 4: But I think that we're both right, you know, in
Speaker 4: some ways, I do believe in May I'm that friend saying,
Speaker 4: like I was in a voice note, give yourself grace, like,
Speaker 4: be gentle with yourself, take your time, It's okay.
Speaker 3: But then the others are saying, girl, is time you
Speaker 3: got to go?
Speaker 2: Because this is one thing Charlotte talks about, is there
Speaker 2: a limit?
Speaker 1: Because I do think I do think with myself certainly,
Speaker 1: and I haven't been through a breakup in a while,
Speaker 1: thank God, But you know, there comes a time where
Speaker 1: it maybe goes too long.
Speaker 2: Couch too long?
Speaker 3: True.
Speaker 4: I mean, well, I think that's the interesting thing is
Speaker 4: I think, well, I also believe everything is temporary, good
Speaker 4: feelings as well as bad, and so if you're feeling
Speaker 4: sad for a really long time, or it feels like, hey,
Speaker 4: what's going on? Then I mean, if Eleena character is there,
Speaker 4: I'm saying, then it might be a time to talk
Speaker 4: to a therapist for sure and kind of get to
Speaker 4: the root of what's going on, because now this person
Speaker 4: is more a representation of something.
Speaker 1: You've projected onto this relationship.
Speaker 3: Yes, this is triggering something.
Speaker 4: You got to get to the root of it and
Speaker 4: looking at it in retrospect, because we ultimately knows what
Speaker 4: happens with Carry and Big. The question then becomes, if
Speaker 4: you can't get over someone, are you actually meant to
Speaker 4: get over them? Is there something going on? Will that
Speaker 4: person come back? Or you know, there's a season you
Speaker 4: know it's like that, maybe it's time for that.
Speaker 3: Person to go away and you come back.
Speaker 4: But I think also the writing is just so beautiful
Speaker 4: because she does bump into Big. Of course, she looks
Speaker 4: great she's with the hot guy, you know, and he
Speaker 4: of course is a little a little burned by it.
Speaker 4: And it's season two, so yeah, and it's setting something up,
Speaker 4: which I think. You know, Sex and City does a
Speaker 4: beautiful job of creating these romances that can that can
Speaker 4: come and go, which I also learned about in terms
Speaker 4: of relationships. They can blossom for a season and then
Speaker 4: they can close and they can come back.
Speaker 3: I mean that happens with your character as well.
Speaker 4: You have gentlemen that come and go and then they
Speaker 4: find their way back into your life.
Speaker 1: That's true, and that is true true, I think with
Speaker 1: in the beginning, And again I wasn't I wasn't really
Speaker 1: thinking very objectively when we were doing it. I whatever
Speaker 1: they wrote, I was like, let's try.
Speaker 2: To make this work, you know.
Speaker 1: That was my thing, right, Like I never examined it
Speaker 1: very hard, right, So when I'm looking back on it,
Speaker 1: sometimes I'm like, I know, Charlotte believes in love, but like,
Speaker 1: why was she so into Big?
Speaker 2: Because Big really puts Carrie through it, you know, true?
Speaker 1: Right, I was always like, yay.
Speaker 2: Big, you know what I mean, that's interesting. I thought
Speaker 2: about it.
Speaker 1: But I also think it's because I'm my age now
Speaker 1: versus my age then do you know.
Speaker 2: What I mean?
Speaker 4: Well, well, what's interesting because I think she believes in
Speaker 4: them because for Carrie, she's thinking like this is the one.
Speaker 2: I think she's thinking that because Carrie is thinking.
Speaker 4: Right, and she wants Carrie to be to have what
Speaker 4: she wants, and she wants the guy that she's going for.
Speaker 4: And I think at the time, I don't know if
Speaker 4: we had the emotional intelligence to say, well he's not
Speaker 4: really committing, what's going on and what should we do?
Speaker 1: And also he was all the things that they talk
Speaker 1: about now like breadcrumbing, the things that people talk about
Speaker 1: on life.
Speaker 2: We never thought those things in the nineties. No you didn't, No,
Speaker 2: we didn't.
Speaker 4: But it's so interesting because like I was around, like
Speaker 4: you know, my mom and her friends always say, I
Speaker 4: haven't mister Big, I haven't mister Big, and.
Speaker 3: So I think everybody kind of has one.
Speaker 4: And I think, but now, what mister big represents to
Speaker 4: someone who is just unattainable definitely and.
Speaker 3: Someone you kind of can't have.
Speaker 4: And that's why I think, you know, within just like that,
Speaker 4: people get so in their feelings because in a way,
Speaker 4: Sex and the City is like the sort of fairy
Speaker 4: tale for adult women.
Speaker 3: And so well, the movie then also kind of gave us.
Speaker 4: It continues the chapter where oh they it was a
Speaker 4: mess up and they got married, and then the second
Speaker 4: movie okay, cheetah, okay now and just like that, okay,
Speaker 4: it sort of takes you through all all these stages
Speaker 4: of a relationship, you know. And then I mean not
Speaker 4: to get too deep, but you know, when his character
Speaker 4: dies and away, it's that part of that little.
Speaker 3: Girl of her has also died. But she doesn't need
Speaker 3: to chase a prince charming anymore.
Speaker 1: That's so true, and I feel like she really embodies
Speaker 1: that so beautifully. You know, people complain about Carrie online,
Speaker 1: which I find weird.
Speaker 3: I don't know who could complain about Carry. I know, Lena,
Speaker 3: what's the issue?
Speaker 1: Explain about Carry? They think she's self centered?
Speaker 3: I think, well, aren't we all?
Speaker 1: I mean, yes, my feeling.
Speaker 2: Is this, and you, as a writer are going to
Speaker 2: have some insight into this.
Speaker 1: My feeling is that partly, I mean, if she was perfect,
Speaker 1: it wouldn't have been interesting exactly.
Speaker 4: No, she has to be flawed, right, I don't know what.
Speaker 4: I was talking with someone the other day. We were
Speaker 4: getting really deep about se They never really dealt with
Speaker 4: Carrie's daddy issues. They glance at it with the Vogue episode. Yes,
Speaker 4: you know when you see the photo because there is
Speaker 4: the older gentleman who's helping her, thinks that there's something
Speaker 4: between them and she for her, it's not. It's more, Oh,
Speaker 4: this is a paternal figure. Even though mister Big is
Speaker 4: older than hers, it's enough of age difference where it's
Speaker 4: sort of like, you know, Speach and Trey type energy.
Speaker 3: But I think, you know, I think as I.
Speaker 4: Learn and grow and do read books and go to therapy,
Speaker 4: what you realize is how you show up in your
Speaker 4: romantic relationships is a direct reflection of how you were
Speaker 4: loved by your parents.
Speaker 3: So true, what you didn't get from your parents you
Speaker 3: try to get from your love.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and so you have to kind of look at
Speaker 4: your parents and ask what was I missing and what
Speaker 4: was I getting from you? Because what she says is
Speaker 4: very clear in the episode is that her dad had
Speaker 4: abandoned her and her mother he was gone, and so
Speaker 4: she in a way is looking for a man to validate,
Speaker 4: to accept, to be present.
Speaker 1: And I mean, good, you are solving these questions for me. Yes,
Speaker 1: it's so true. I had not thought about this clearly.
Speaker 4: I mean it's literally that I just had this conversation
Speaker 4: with someone. Wow, they were like, what are they ever
Speaker 4: get to carry his dad stuff? I don't really know if
Speaker 4: they talked too much about her mother.
Speaker 2: No, we didn't, because.
Speaker 3: That's on purpose. You want them to exist outside of their.
Speaker 2: Parents, right, And he didn't.
Speaker 1: He felt like when people go to New York City,
Speaker 1: no one ever talks about their their background. You know,
Speaker 1: you're just there, present in the moment, creating whatever. You're
Speaker 1: trying to create your own person, right. And he had
Speaker 1: reminded me at one point that there had been a
Speaker 1: scene that they ended up not using where she had
Speaker 1: in her bedside drawer a little picture of her father
Speaker 1: and she had looked at the picture and closed the
Speaker 1: drawer and they ended up cutting.
Speaker 3: It from which the Vogue episode early I think the.
Speaker 1: First season, I want to say, I know I had
Speaker 1: totally forgotten about this. Well, yeah, it's never explained.
Speaker 4: Well, I do remember him saying something about that, like saying,
Speaker 4: I didn't want to go into the whole parents stuff,
Speaker 4: which you know, which I get as because with TV
Speaker 4: in the nineties that was always an episode, it was
Speaker 4: over here coming to parents, you got to clean up
Speaker 4: and who am I dating? And d and so give
Speaker 4: you insight more into the characters and so what was
Speaker 4: great about which obviously it clearly works because we see
Speaker 4: you all as individuals, you know, and now it's about
Speaker 4: like what you're starting your own dynasties. In a way,
Speaker 4: it's about like who am I going to Mary? What
Speaker 4: kid am I going to have? But as we as
Speaker 4: just people out here watching it, and what I found,
Speaker 4: who I am in relationship is a direct reflection of
Speaker 4: what I grew up witnessing or didn't have or what
Speaker 4: i'm what I missed. And I'm telling you it's like
Speaker 4: the Dad conversation is like who was Carrie?
Speaker 3: Who is mister Bradshaw?
Speaker 2: I mean, that's so true.
Speaker 3: Because that's more important than who is mister Big?
Speaker 2: Definitely, that's so interesting.
Speaker 1: And it's also interesting because people talk about the Aiden
Speaker 1: versus Big obviously they're so so different, and it is
Speaker 1: interesting that she's still I mean when I talked to Sarah,
Speaker 1: Sarah was on the podcast and I said, you know,
Speaker 1: what would you like to share with us insight into this?
Speaker 1: And she also no matter what she says, can't separate, right,
Speaker 1: she has.
Speaker 2: Played carry for thirty years or you know it's it's crazy, yeah,
Speaker 2: twenty nine whatever it is.
Speaker 3: Wow.
Speaker 1: Wow. But she she explained Big in a super interesting
Speaker 1: way I never thought about. She's right, And I was like, no,
Speaker 1: I'm trying to ask you about.
Speaker 2: Carrie, Like, let's talk about Carrie. Why is Carrie one?
Speaker 2: Mister Big? Did you know what I mean? Because she
Speaker 2: said so many interesting things that I would never have
Speaker 2: thought of.
Speaker 1: And also, this is what I love about talking to people,
Speaker 1: is that everyone has their own first of all experience
Speaker 1: and second of all thoughts and memories, and you know, knitting.
Speaker 2: It all together is super fascinating.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: But what she The thing I took away from her
Speaker 1: thoughts about carrying Big was that in the initial pilot,
Speaker 1: do you remember I really hated the pilot previous to
Speaker 1: rewatching it.
Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, I know. I always pilots are hard.
Speaker 3: Pilots are hard, so hard.
Speaker 1: You've made so many, I mean, do you if you
Speaker 1: ever heard my theory of pilots. My theory of pilots
Speaker 1: is this, a pilot needs to be like seventy five
Speaker 1: percent good, but not one hundred percent good because you
Speaker 1: have to have the elements there, but you don't want
Speaker 1: it to come together too good because if it comes
Speaker 1: together too good, then when the show goes at my.
Speaker 4: That's kind of true, do you mean? Yeah, it needs
Speaker 4: to have something, needs to be rough around the edges
Speaker 4: a little.
Speaker 1: Bit right, to have that that energy the thing. It's
Speaker 1: kind of intangible, but not be all the way there.
Speaker 1: That's true, right, And that's how I feel like our
Speaker 1: pilot was fair. But I think the one scene in
Speaker 1: our pilot and when I went back and watched it
Speaker 1: was way better than I remember, because I'm hard on
Speaker 1: my self in my memory.
Speaker 2: Whatever.
Speaker 1: But you know the final scene where he drives her
Speaker 1: to keep running into each other, and he drives her
Speaker 1: in that crazy old fashioned town car and she gets
Speaker 1: out and she says to him or whoever, says, have
Speaker 1: you ever been in love? And he says that, and
Speaker 1: the lights are all glistening in the background. She basically
Speaker 1: said that in that moment, the die was cast.
Speaker 3: Mmmm, that's good.
Speaker 2: When I was trying to.
Speaker 1: Get her to explain, why'd you put up with all
Speaker 1: the stuff you know you carry?
Speaker 3: You know, yes, yes, yeah, she was.
Speaker 1: Just basically saying that the die was cast and that
Speaker 1: she It wasn't necessarily something that.
Speaker 2: Was thought out. It just happened.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I get interesting. I think that's fair.
Speaker 1: I get that too.
Speaker 4: But also the I think that thing because I hear
Speaker 4: what you're saying. For it, it's an iconic last scene
Speaker 4: and it's the beginning of this journey that we had
Speaker 4: no idea with last, like you said, almost thirty years. Yeah,
Speaker 4: but I think it's also that Casablanca moment. It's that
Speaker 4: moment of us falling in love with them. Yeah, and
Speaker 4: this sort of like push and pull. And I think
Speaker 4: what you learn about TV couples is that they can
Speaker 4: never just be happy.
Speaker 3: Otherwise you don't have a show totally. You know, that's
Speaker 3: why Big had to die totally.
Speaker 1: I know.
Speaker 3: They had the house, they.
Speaker 4: Had the thing, they figured it out, and now once
Speaker 4: you learn the lesson, you go, that's right, and so
Speaker 4: now it's a new lesson for her to learn.
Speaker 2: That's exactly right.
Speaker 1: This is the other thing I think about Carrie in
Speaker 1: terms of people criticizing her. Is it because she is
Speaker 1: the writer and because she is driving everything and hearing
Speaker 1: her thoughts. Of course she's going to see him self centered.
Speaker 1: You're hearing her thoughts.
Speaker 3: But here's the thing. What I love, love, love, love
Speaker 3: love about.
Speaker 4: Sex and the City is they engage the audience because
Speaker 4: she's always asking a question. That's however, I wonder, yeah,
Speaker 4: or like, you know, should you stay?
Speaker 1: Look?
Speaker 4: And it makes you question she's wondering, and so now
Speaker 4: you're wondering get old things quickly?
Speaker 3: Or by which am I? Or like do I do this?
Speaker 3: Do that?
Speaker 4: You know?
Speaker 3: And so? And I think, so now what I what
Speaker 3: I love?
Speaker 4: What I feel like we love Carrie and she very
Speaker 4: much is sort of I think of Mary Richards for
Speaker 4: her time.
Speaker 3: Yes, is that we now are on.
Speaker 4: This ride with her right now we're dating with That's
Speaker 4: what we're saying, like it should be big, it should
Speaker 4: be aid and D and my old lesbian as a
Speaker 4: sitting there thinking like who do I want to be?
Speaker 3: Am'm mister bigger on my aid and I always wanted
Speaker 3: to be.
Speaker 4: I want to be yeah, you know, I want to
Speaker 4: be the one that's like making furniture, breaking down the wall.
Speaker 4: But the sucky thing is is that a lot of
Speaker 4: us feel like if you're an aident type, you're probably gonna.
Speaker 3: Get cheat on Oh no big, But then.
Speaker 4: I also have mister big qualities about myself. I think
Speaker 4: I think they say, like, okay, this is a little
Speaker 4: bit of a suave energy.
Speaker 3: I don't know, but that's like I'm looking. I'm looking
Speaker 3: at both of them.
Speaker 4: It's like, huh, okay, totally they represent different things.
Speaker 2: Definitely, they represent different things.
Speaker 1: Okay, let's talk about the breakup rules for a second,
Speaker 1: because when you're talking about the question that's there, that's
Speaker 1: her question. Yeah, so this is also so funny to me.
Speaker 1: So in my mind, the pilot was really bad and
Speaker 1: really dark, right, which it is really dark dark, But
Speaker 1: now I look back on it.
Speaker 2: And I love that it's so dark.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's cool.
Speaker 2: It's different.
Speaker 1: I mean, you can barely see us sometimes, I know
Speaker 1: where are we?
Speaker 3: I know? But then it gets super light.
Speaker 2: I know, it really does.
Speaker 3: We get more money, right, get a little fancier and.
Speaker 1: Most definitely we had Sarah Jessica told me we had
Speaker 1: ten thousand dollars for costumes the first season.
Speaker 2: Can you believe I.
Speaker 3: Didn't even cover the shoe budget?
Speaker 1: Is no, I know, I know, but that that was
Speaker 1: when we had to get people to lend us stuff,
Speaker 1: you know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's all the way we did it in the beginning?
Speaker 3: Do anyway?
Speaker 1: Here we are? This is the second season in my mind.
Speaker 1: I also love season three as we.
Speaker 3: I really like seeing three terms of where everything's just
Speaker 3: sort of gelling. But she's season two.
Speaker 4: But I like season two, the season two opener, because
Speaker 4: what's interesting about it is there's an energy of you
Speaker 4: guys feel a little confidence.
Speaker 3: Yes, there's a confidence in all of it.
Speaker 4: Definitely, I think because you guys, oh, we're here for
Speaker 4: a second season.
Speaker 1: You feel that way when you're doing a show.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I think the actors because sometimes you know, if
Speaker 4: I'm the creator, I'm on the opposite side of it.
Speaker 4: Actors feel a little bit more settled because in the
Speaker 4: first season you're just trying, okay, hopefully get picked up.
Speaker 4: You get picked up for a second season, it means
Speaker 4: all right, what we did last time didn't work, the
Speaker 4: work it works okay, so we're not too bad. And
Speaker 4: then now you're like, okay, now we're on these journeys
Speaker 4: and who are these people?
Speaker 3: Who are these characters?
Speaker 4: I feel they're like there, you guys are like it's great, right,
Speaker 4: and we.
Speaker 2: Have the coffee shop set.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we actually because like first the first season, you're
Speaker 1: like where are they and like we're in weird places
Speaker 1: along along inide the city. Yeah, it's crazy. So we
Speaker 1: finally got the coffee shop set, which is great, and
Speaker 1: we have a scene that is a coffee shop scene,
Speaker 1: which is the one where Miranda gets about. And Michael
Speaker 1: Patrick wrote this episode and I think that he was
Speaker 1: actually using criticism of the show.
Speaker 4: Yes, all you guys do is talking about man, you
Speaker 4: can feel that, and yes, and I've been you know,
Speaker 4: I've done that too. You write it kind of just
Speaker 4: like a run toward it, address it, address it.
Speaker 2: Run toward it. Definitely.
Speaker 1: I have the sweater that Cynthia is wearing in that
Speaker 1: scene in my house. Sometimes I would take miranda clothes
Speaker 1: home because you can wear them in normal life.
Speaker 3: Oh my gosh. Right, I know, Miranda's like the real girl.
Speaker 3: She's like, I got to be.
Speaker 1: A real normal Yes, as we go anyway, so this
Speaker 1: is the whole, the whole we go out to the
Speaker 1: baseball We're gonna.
Speaker 2: Talk about them a second.
Speaker 1: But the big question, which I love because it does
Speaker 1: come up from Charlotte, where Charlotte says that to get
Speaker 1: over a breakup, it takes half the time of the
Speaker 1: relationship what do you think.
Speaker 4: I've always heard that and I always loved that theory. Yeah,
Speaker 4: here's the deal.
Speaker 3: I love that.
Speaker 4: You know, they're so like classic about it with you,
Speaker 4: like you take you, like they gave the number of how.
Speaker 3: Long you were with the guy and how long to
Speaker 3: get over.
Speaker 4: But I mean, if you if you set an intention
Speaker 4: for yourself where you're like, okay, dated for somebo three years, all, right,
Speaker 4: year and a half someone to give myself.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's all going to give myself.
Speaker 2: That's good.
Speaker 4: But some you know, you could date somebody for like
Speaker 4: six months and it could be super intense.
Speaker 3: Good point, and you might need a little bit longer.
Speaker 2: That's a good point, you know.
Speaker 3: So it just all depends because some people can linger
Speaker 3: with you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it just.
Speaker 3: Depends on the purpose person. Yeah, some people are easier
Speaker 3: to get over than others.
Speaker 2: I think that's so true my case.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we'll keep that.
Speaker 2: Yet, we'll keep that, Lena.
Speaker 1: You are dropping the wisdom every which way, and then
Speaker 1: we're just going to have to come back for another episode.
Speaker 2: So you guys come back later in the week.