WEBVTT - A World Without Plastic 0:00:00.240 --> 0:00:04.680 From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is 0:00:04.760 --> 0:00:09.080 riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or 0:00:09.200 --> 0:00:12.079 learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A 0:00:12.200 --> 0:00:25.920 production of I Heart Radio. Hello, welcome back to the show. 0:00:26.040 --> 0:00:28.880 My name is Matt, my name is they called me Ben. 0:00:29.040 --> 0:00:32.080 We are joined as always with our super producer Paul 0:00:32.159 --> 0:00:35.960 Mission Control decade. Most importantly, you are you. You are here, 0:00:36.200 --> 0:00:39.080 and that makes this the stuff they don't want you 0:00:39.200 --> 0:00:44.920 to know. Uh. Suspected serial killer Benjamin Franklin once famously wrote, 0:00:45.320 --> 0:00:49.080 in this world, nothing is certain except for death and taxes. 0:00:49.600 --> 0:00:53.920 And it's it's such an interesting thought exercise to imagine 0:00:53.960 --> 0:00:58.000 what he, or truly anybody from the seventeen hundreds would 0:00:58.040 --> 0:01:02.000 think about the modern day. Like Benji Frank's example, I 0:01:02.040 --> 0:01:05.039 personally think the guy would have loved Twitter and probably 0:01:05.040 --> 0:01:09.040 tender too, probably like things even more specific than tender, 0:01:09.240 --> 0:01:11.959 you know, might he might have gone grinder occasionally, you know, 0:01:12.040 --> 0:01:16.640 I think he can see as an equal opportunity um romantic. 0:01:17.040 --> 0:01:19.800 I can imagine him adding an addendum just for the 0:01:19.840 --> 0:01:23.199 purposes of this episode, to be like and glass jars 0:01:24.480 --> 0:01:29.400 or right exactly. Yeah, it's it's because it's easy for 0:01:29.520 --> 0:01:32.800 us to imagine what someone from the seventeen hundreds would 0:01:32.800 --> 0:01:36.000 find impressive in the modern day. You know, things like 0:01:36.520 --> 0:01:40.400 airplanes or electric lights, or space shuttles, or the fact 0:01:40.480 --> 0:01:43.440 that some people can survive diseases that used to be 0:01:43.520 --> 0:01:46.960 a death sentence. But it's also easy to forget the 0:01:47.080 --> 0:01:51.960 commonplace stuff that would absolutely like destroy their brain for 0:01:52.000 --> 0:01:56.800 a few days. And one of those big things is plastic. 0:01:56.960 --> 0:02:00.000 We live in the age of plastic. It's all around 0:02:00.000 --> 0:02:03.320 fund us. If he was confronted with this, Ben Franklin 0:02:03.400 --> 0:02:05.880 might have to revise that quote and say nothing is 0:02:05.920 --> 0:02:09.880 certain other than death taxes, and I guess plastic. Now. 0:02:10.400 --> 0:02:14.760 We did an episode on a real conspiracy surrounding recycling, 0:02:15.160 --> 0:02:18.200 and it's about microplastics. Please check it out. That's where 0:02:18.240 --> 0:02:21.000 you'll learn a lot of the basics of plastics history 0:02:21.240 --> 0:02:24.440 and it's composition. But there's still a ton of stuff 0:02:24.480 --> 0:02:27.040 they don't want you to know about plastic, billions of 0:02:27.120 --> 0:02:31.840 tons actually. And today we're taking a slightly more meditative approach, 0:02:32.200 --> 0:02:35.520 and we're asking a question that many of our fellow 0:02:35.560 --> 0:02:38.400 conspiracy realists have probably thought about, which is this what 0:02:38.560 --> 0:02:41.880 would the world be like without this? Stuff. Could we, 0:02:42.919 --> 0:02:46.280 as a global civilization ever turned back the clock and 0:02:46.440 --> 0:02:49.400 live in a world without plastic, and then perhaps is 0:02:49.480 --> 0:02:53.519 it something that we would actually want to do? Well, 0:02:53.840 --> 0:02:57.280 here are the facts. It's uh, we've got a lot 0:02:57.360 --> 0:03:00.200 of numbers here, but we're gonna try to make sure 0:03:00.240 --> 0:03:02.000 they're not the kind of numbers that make your eyes 0:03:02.080 --> 0:03:06.440 glaze over. Yes' because plastic is absolutely everywhere. I mean 0:03:06.639 --> 0:03:10.040 just look around your workspace, or your bedroom, or your 0:03:10.080 --> 0:03:12.760 house anywhere. I mean, right in front of my eyes 0:03:12.880 --> 0:03:15.639 is like a ring light that's made of plastic. The 0:03:15.760 --> 0:03:18.639 lens part that the light filters through this webcam that 0:03:18.720 --> 0:03:21.959 we're broadcasting into made of plastic. You know, all of 0:03:22.080 --> 0:03:25.760 the pieces that make up the case of my monitor, 0:03:26.280 --> 0:03:29.799 any of our monitors, plastic inside the guts of the thing, 0:03:30.200 --> 0:03:33.720 so many plastics. The printed circuit boards that electronics are 0:03:33.840 --> 0:03:38.520 mounted on made of plastic, um or various you know, 0:03:38.800 --> 0:03:41.480 types of plastic. They're there. There are obviously several categories, 0:03:41.920 --> 0:03:44.560 but the fact is it is absolutely everywhere, and it's 0:03:44.600 --> 0:03:49.600 an incredible miracle of innovation. Uh. It's lightweights, it's easy 0:03:49.640 --> 0:03:52.480 to manufacture, you can shape into just about anything, and 0:03:52.600 --> 0:03:55.760 it's sturdy. Um then you point out that it's up 0:03:55.800 --> 0:03:59.640 there with say the wheel or you know, the basic 0:03:59.720 --> 0:04:02.600 tool tools that we use are things like pully or 0:04:02.680 --> 0:04:06.800 a lever. You know, important innovations that allowed us to 0:04:07.040 --> 0:04:09.880 kind of step outside of our limitations as human beings. 0:04:10.640 --> 0:04:12.960 I want to jump into the six basic tools real fast. 0:04:13.640 --> 0:04:15.360 I'm off the top of my head without looking at 0:04:15.400 --> 0:04:20.800 the list. The hammer, hammers, one bottle, opener, Scott number two, 0:04:21.760 --> 0:04:28.520 instant opener, ice, ice pick, or some sort of stabbing tool. 0:04:28.560 --> 0:04:33.360 I imagine, right, I think we're talking. I don't know. 0:04:33.360 --> 0:04:35.200 I know we're not talking about those things. Are being jokey, 0:04:35.320 --> 0:04:38.160 but sorry about that. Guys, what don't apology? Don't ever 0:04:38.240 --> 0:04:41.560 apologize for a good joke. No joke left behind. Hashtag 0:04:41.640 --> 0:04:47.039 it tweeted it's it's true that it's easy for us 0:04:47.120 --> 0:04:51.200 to underestimate the profound impact of plastic in all its 0:04:51.279 --> 0:04:54.600 various forms and genres. I mean, I I don't think 0:04:54.720 --> 0:04:56.760 some people disagree with me, but I don't think it's 0:04:56.800 --> 0:05:00.480 exaggerating to say that in terms of importance to civil wization, 0:05:01.080 --> 0:05:04.279 both positive and negative, plastic might be up there with fire. 0:05:04.880 --> 0:05:08.520 It might be up there with the time somebody figured 0:05:08.520 --> 0:05:11.200 out how to create fire. But it also begs the question, 0:05:11.320 --> 0:05:13.240 like all the things that we're describing, all of those 0:05:13.240 --> 0:05:15.120 things that I'm looking in my room and and and 0:05:15.480 --> 0:05:19.640 rattling off, are these things that we necessarily need? I mean, 0:05:19.680 --> 0:05:22.080 if you look back to you know, bake light, the 0:05:22.200 --> 0:05:26.160 earliest version of plastic, it was kind of designed to 0:05:26.400 --> 0:05:29.600 make sort of chintzy crap that we could be sold 0:05:30.520 --> 0:05:33.400 and and convinced that we needed it. It is very 0:05:33.480 --> 0:05:36.480 much a product of like the material age, you know, 0:05:36.640 --> 0:05:40.200 the materialistic age that we need to acquire all this stuff, 0:05:40.520 --> 0:05:42.960 and certainly the idea of computers and the plastics that 0:05:43.040 --> 0:05:44.960 are used and things like a monitor. I mean, you 0:05:45.160 --> 0:05:47.480 could certainly be hard pressed to turn back the clock 0:05:47.560 --> 0:05:50.320 and live without those things. But you know, when you're 0:05:50.320 --> 0:05:54.040 talking about the basic simple machines, things like a screw 0:05:54.640 --> 0:05:56.720 or a wedge, you know, or a plane or a 0:05:56.800 --> 0:06:00.839 pulley or whatever, these are I think much more necessary 0:06:01.080 --> 0:06:04.360 than plastic. But you can't really put that genie back 0:06:04.400 --> 0:06:07.560 on the bottle, now, can't you, because we're used to it. Yeah, No, 0:06:07.760 --> 0:06:10.320 I'm not gonna It's probably not going to happen. And 0:06:10.440 --> 0:06:14.240 that is the most optimistic way I can phrase that response. Unfortunately, 0:06:14.560 --> 0:06:18.320 the most solid reports right now estimate that there is 0:06:19.040 --> 0:06:22.400 a little north of eight point three billions of tons 0:06:22.720 --> 0:06:27.120 of plastic on the planet. Of that eight point three billion, uh, 0:06:27.400 --> 0:06:31.440 six point three billions of those tons are straight up trash. 0:06:31.680 --> 0:06:33.920 It's garbage. No one's gonna use it, no one's gonna 0:06:33.920 --> 0:06:37.120 recycle it, no one's gonna burn it. Uh. This is 0:06:37.560 --> 0:06:39.719 just to give you the image in your mind, folks, 0:06:39.839 --> 0:06:44.119 this is the equivalent of like fifty five million jumbo jets. 0:06:44.920 --> 0:06:49.160 And uh, if that, if that doesn't really bring it home, Uh, 0:06:49.360 --> 0:06:52.080 pull up a picture of Mount Everest and realize that 0:06:52.080 --> 0:06:54.880 if you stacked all this plastic up in one place, 0:06:55.240 --> 0:06:58.480 you would easily get a pile literally bigger than the 0:06:58.640 --> 0:07:02.839 tallest mountain in human experience. Uh, there's already an insane 0:07:02.839 --> 0:07:06.320 amount of trash just on that actual mountain itself from 0:07:06.360 --> 0:07:11.040 all the would be uh you know, Everest summitters, you know, 0:07:11.240 --> 0:07:13.960 out there and like leaving all their their droppings behind. 0:07:14.040 --> 0:07:16.520 It's it's become a real problem. I get an image 0:07:16.520 --> 0:07:20.680 of that movie Wally, with all the trash mountains that 0:07:20.840 --> 0:07:23.840 exists on the planet at that point in the future. 0:07:24.720 --> 0:07:27.600 That's what I'm seeing. The three of us recently went 0:07:27.720 --> 0:07:31.240 to a friend of ours art studio that happens to 0:07:31.320 --> 0:07:36.160 be situated right next to what is supposedly a recycling dump, 0:07:36.280 --> 0:07:38.480 I guess, for lack of a better term, uh, And 0:07:38.640 --> 0:07:41.960 yet it never seems to get smaller. Um. And there's 0:07:42.000 --> 0:07:45.040 a reason for that, isn't there? Yeah? There is uh 0:07:45.240 --> 0:07:47.760 the numbers that we just named. If they're not troubling, 0:07:47.920 --> 0:07:49.680 or if there are things you've heard before and it's 0:07:49.720 --> 0:07:54.080 easy to shake off, think of it this way, this time, 0:07:54.600 --> 0:07:57.920 five years from now, that may well be referred to 0:07:58.000 --> 0:08:00.800 as the good old days. Uh, when it was when 0:08:00.920 --> 0:08:04.480 only of the trash in the world's ocean was some 0:08:04.680 --> 0:08:09.840 form of plastic. Right now, as we speak, every second, 0:08:09.880 --> 0:08:13.200 a hundred and sixty thousand plastic bags are getting used 0:08:13.280 --> 0:08:17.680 by someone somewhere. That means that each year, just every 0:08:17.720 --> 0:08:21.640 single lookout under year, five trillion plastic bags new ones 0:08:21.840 --> 0:08:26.000 are made. And this means this leads experts to project 0:08:26.120 --> 0:08:31.480 that pound for pound, by the weight of the plastic 0:08:31.520 --> 0:08:34.679 and the oceans alone will outweigh the mass of all 0:08:34.760 --> 0:08:39.840 the fish not hyperbole. Literally, all of the fish dell 0:08:40.000 --> 0:08:45.599 weigh less than the trash and that's particularly puzzling to 0:08:45.720 --> 0:08:50.760 my mind when you imagine the weight of a plastic bag. 0:08:51.760 --> 0:08:55.240 But think about that, Just picture that scene American beauty. 0:08:55.600 --> 0:08:58.440 You know that that that lighter than air plastic bag 0:08:58.600 --> 0:09:03.200 just wafting through the ease, you know. Um. And one 0:09:03.280 --> 0:09:05.560 of the reasons that plastic bags, I mean, I think 0:09:05.600 --> 0:09:08.480 most people know that plastic bags are not recyclable. Um 0:09:08.640 --> 0:09:10.680 it is because in order to recycle a thing, they 0:09:10.760 --> 0:09:13.000 have to weigh enough for you to actually be able 0:09:13.040 --> 0:09:15.199 to kind of chop them up into little bits. And 0:09:15.280 --> 0:09:18.520 can you imagine trying to chase around the gazillion plastic 0:09:18.559 --> 0:09:21.600 bags and some sort of centrifuge like it just wouldn't 0:09:21.679 --> 0:09:25.239 wouldn't work. So plastic bags are like the least recyclable 0:09:25.320 --> 0:09:29.880 and most popular plastic item. Maybe that's not exactly accurate, 0:09:29.920 --> 0:09:33.000 but that certainly feels like it's up there. Um it's 0:09:33.040 --> 0:09:35.920 it's very troubling with those numbers, you know, especially considering 0:09:36.000 --> 0:09:38.280 how light they are. Yeah, and let's twist the knife 0:09:38.280 --> 0:09:40.439 a little bit, you know what kind of shows those 0:09:40.480 --> 0:09:46.400 folks that's the optimistic projection that what they really saying 0:09:46.720 --> 0:09:52.000 is by it could happen sooner than that And Uh, 0:09:52.400 --> 0:09:57.400 it's a shame that environmental concerns have been sort of politicized, 0:09:57.720 --> 0:10:03.000 or they've been appropriated for different people's agendas, whatever those 0:10:03.160 --> 0:10:05.880 agendas may be. But if you look at the numbers, 0:10:06.160 --> 0:10:09.959 which no no ideology, then you should be concerned. This 0:10:10.160 --> 0:10:14.360 growth is part of an accelerating pattern. In nine fifty, 0:10:14.800 --> 0:10:18.480 the world, the whole shebang made about two million tons 0:10:18.559 --> 0:10:22.880 of plastic per year, and since then annual production has 0:10:22.960 --> 0:10:27.319 increased two hundred times two d cks. Uh So, just 0:10:27.480 --> 0:10:31.120 in twenty for example, the world was making not two 0:10:31.160 --> 0:10:34.679 million tons, but three d eighty one million tons. Just 0:10:34.800 --> 0:10:39.640 for comparison, three eighty one million tons is about the 0:10:39.800 --> 0:10:44.880 same weight as two thirds of the entire human population. 0:10:45.240 --> 0:10:47.440 That's what I was going to ask. I mean, obviously, 0:10:47.920 --> 0:10:50.640 in part this this has to be a product of 0:10:50.760 --> 0:10:54.520 population growth, but not to that degree. How do you 0:10:54.600 --> 0:10:56.959 go from two million tons a year to three hundred 0:10:57.080 --> 0:11:00.599 eighty million tons a year um? Even given explosion and 0:11:00.720 --> 0:11:03.199 population It seems to me that it means that the 0:11:03.320 --> 0:11:07.240 production and usage of plastic has gone completely unchecked um. 0:11:07.600 --> 0:11:10.600 And no one's really thinking about the future at all. Yeah, 0:11:10.720 --> 0:11:12.439 just not for a long time they weren't and just 0:11:12.600 --> 0:11:17.400 works so well for so many things. Will will explore 0:11:17.520 --> 0:11:20.079 this too, uh. We it should go without saying, but 0:11:20.160 --> 0:11:21.800 we have to point it out. The plastic game is 0:11:21.880 --> 0:11:27.840 not distributed equally. The biggest producers of plastic uh, plastic 0:11:27.920 --> 0:11:32.160 waste at least are the wealthy countries, just because because 0:11:32.280 --> 0:11:35.920 of consumer culture, because of economic booms. I mean, if 0:11:36.000 --> 0:11:39.360 you look at the US and so an agency the 0:11:39.440 --> 0:11:43.520 e p A reports that Americans generate thirty five point 0:11:43.640 --> 0:11:48.080 seven million tons of plastic in one year. And as 0:11:48.120 --> 0:11:52.640 we pointed out the microplastics episode UH study show that 0:11:52.840 --> 0:11:57.600 nowadays plastic particles might be inside your body before your board. 0:11:57.840 --> 0:12:01.360 I think they might go through your or mother and 0:12:01.760 --> 0:12:05.920 go across the barrier and get into while you're in 0:12:06.000 --> 0:12:10.040 the womb. What long term effects will that have? People 0:12:10.040 --> 0:12:13.240 aren't too sure. That's the scary part. And before it 0:12:13.280 --> 0:12:16.080 sounds like we're dumping on plastic. Yes, it's like any 0:12:16.160 --> 0:12:19.000 other technology, at least until the day we get to AI. 0:12:19.600 --> 0:12:22.920 Plastic has no moral compass. It's just like a gun. 0:12:23.480 --> 0:12:27.719 It's just like I'll pop it. Those are two very 0:12:27.760 --> 0:12:30.960 different examples. It can do wonderful and terrible things depending 0:12:31.000 --> 0:12:34.520 on how it's used I've definitely pictured somebody using a 0:12:34.600 --> 0:12:40.480 pop it as a bludgeoning device. Yeah, it's a menacing toy. Actually, 0:12:40.520 --> 0:12:43.400 if you think about it, it could be psychological warfare. 0:12:43.559 --> 0:12:45.520 I think some of those toys, when the kids get 0:12:45.559 --> 0:12:49.480 really into them, can probably do things to their parents 0:12:49.640 --> 0:12:52.719 or caretaker's minds. But this is okay. So as think 0:12:52.760 --> 0:12:54.839 of an analogy, Tell me when you think of this, 0:12:55.240 --> 0:12:59.319 Plastic in a way is a lot like advertising. You 0:12:59.640 --> 0:13:03.760 are almost certain to be unaware of how much of 0:13:03.840 --> 0:13:06.960 it surrounds you, how much you touch on a daily basis, 0:13:07.000 --> 0:13:09.760 how much you just see passing by, how much you encounter, 0:13:10.160 --> 0:13:13.800 and if you want to be incredibly depressed or profoundly 0:13:14.040 --> 0:13:17.120 impressed or both at the same time, take our old 0:13:17.160 --> 0:13:21.199 advertising game and apply it to plastic. Wake up, start 0:13:21.240 --> 0:13:23.520 a clock for twenty four hours, and start trying to 0:13:23.640 --> 0:13:27.640 count every example of plastic you see. I don't know 0:13:27.679 --> 0:13:29.360 about you, guys. I don't want to speak for everyone, 0:13:29.440 --> 0:13:32.719 but I am personally so convinced that this is an 0:13:32.760 --> 0:13:36.400 impossible task that I you have my word, if you 0:13:36.480 --> 0:13:39.160 can accurately count all the plastic you see over a 0:13:39.240 --> 0:13:41.640 period of twenty four hours, right to us, and I 0:13:41.760 --> 0:13:44.000 will send you a prize. I don't know if it's 0:13:44.040 --> 0:13:46.440 going to be fancy, but it might because I doubt 0:13:46.520 --> 0:13:49.240 anyone can actually do this. Will it be made of plastic? 0:13:50.960 --> 0:13:53.920 I was gonna win. I'm gonna win this. I'm gonna 0:13:53.960 --> 0:13:56.200 go out and I'm gonna go camping and I'm gonna 0:13:56.240 --> 0:14:01.120 stand my tent for twenty four hours and I'm just tent. Right, 0:14:03.120 --> 0:14:05.160 You're definitely going to get a Dakota ring from men 0:14:05.240 --> 0:14:09.800 and Dakota Rick. Yes, Uh, it's I mean, it is 0:14:09.920 --> 0:14:12.160 really tough, and it has a lot in common with advertising, 0:14:12.280 --> 0:14:15.079 and there's you know, to be fair. Um, if we 0:14:15.120 --> 0:14:17.360 look at the pros and cons, plastic has helped people 0:14:17.679 --> 0:14:20.880 accomplish so many things. It's saved countless lives in the 0:14:21.080 --> 0:14:25.280 field of medicine. It's helped humans reach space that would 0:14:25.320 --> 0:14:29.120 not have happened. But there's also no question that plastic 0:14:29.440 --> 0:14:34.880 is universally causing profound harm to just about every thing 0:14:35.680 --> 0:14:39.160 human or not on the planet except for the bank 0:14:39.200 --> 0:14:43.200 accounts of several very powerful corporations. They're making out like gangbusters, 0:14:43.280 --> 0:14:48.160 places like SABIC, the Saudi Arabia Basic Industries Corporation. Money 0:14:48.240 --> 0:14:52.280 hand over fist, you know, they're the largest single manufacturer plastic, 0:14:52.560 --> 0:14:55.160 but most of the other you know, like the Captain 0:14:55.320 --> 0:14:58.120 Planet villain types are also in on the game dw 0:14:58.440 --> 0:15:00.400 X on mobile, you know, all the it's all the 0:15:00.480 --> 0:15:04.320 good ones. Uh. And we know that it's despite the 0:15:04.920 --> 0:15:08.240 statements that you see from international organizations and in g 0:15:08.440 --> 0:15:11.280 o s and even these companies themselves, we know the 0:15:11.400 --> 0:15:15.240 pattern is set to accelerate even further. We're looking at 0:15:15.280 --> 0:15:18.360 a Jacob here. This is exponential growth. Yeah, it is. 0:15:18.600 --> 0:15:21.920 So if we look at and we look at the 0:15:22.120 --> 0:15:27.480 global plastic market size. Okay, so it was five hundred 0:15:27.520 --> 0:15:31.360 and two billion US dollars and then four years later 0:15:31.440 --> 0:15:35.320 in it was five hundred and seventy nine point seven 0:15:35.560 --> 0:15:40.440 billion dollars. So that's a nice little jump in the billions. 0:15:41.160 --> 0:15:46.120 But here's the deal. Uh, the this global plastic market 0:15:46.240 --> 0:15:50.480 will likely increase to seven hundred and fifty billion dollars 0:15:50.560 --> 0:15:56.960 are a little bit more actually by t and that's insane. Yeah. Uh, 0:15:57.320 --> 0:16:01.320 eighth largest industry in the U, US, the world's richest country, 0:16:01.840 --> 0:16:05.120 and every day around one million people in the US 0:16:05.160 --> 0:16:08.560 alone wake up and they work on plastic. And they're 0:16:08.600 --> 0:16:11.200 not bad people at all. It's their job. In fact, 0:16:11.280 --> 0:16:14.880 there's some of the smartest people around. Uh. The this 0:16:15.200 --> 0:16:19.880 argument about what to do, this dilemma is often bogged 0:16:19.960 --> 0:16:24.720 down in politics ideological tribalism. You know, you might have 0:16:24.840 --> 0:16:27.480 someone who's more on the conservative side saying like, uh, 0:16:27.600 --> 0:16:31.560 these uh it's an outdatd phrase, but like these tree 0:16:31.640 --> 0:16:36.800 hugging hippies are choosing you know, obscure amphibians over actual 0:16:36.920 --> 0:16:40.360 human beings who need this job to survive. But that's 0:16:40.400 --> 0:16:45.080 so misleading when it comes to plastics, civilization, us making 0:16:45.120 --> 0:16:49.240 the show you listening, everybody is in a crabs in 0:16:49.280 --> 0:16:52.280 a bucket scenario. I mean, this is the same species 0:16:52.640 --> 0:16:56.240 that can't stop killing itself over things like religion or 0:16:56.560 --> 0:17:01.280 resources or in name disagreements over the dumbest things, like 0:17:01.920 --> 0:17:04.440 this is a species that has gone to war over 0:17:04.560 --> 0:17:07.320 one guy's ear. It's true story. It's called the War 0:17:07.400 --> 0:17:09.560 of Jenkins Ear. You can check it out on Ridiculous 0:17:09.640 --> 0:17:12.959 History wherever you find your favorite podcast. Always be closing 0:17:13.720 --> 0:17:19.800 so you get the cot. Yeah, but there's no, there's 0:17:19.840 --> 0:17:23.440 not really if you look at realistically, as as terrified 0:17:23.480 --> 0:17:27.600 as it maybe to admit, there's no plausible chance of 0:17:28.240 --> 0:17:31.399 this species cooperating long enough to right the ship of 0:17:31.480 --> 0:17:35.560 humanity before it sinks irrevocably into the deep waters of extinction. 0:17:35.680 --> 0:17:40.240 But what if, what if somehow people did manage to 0:17:40.359 --> 0:17:44.680 walk back from the precipice, What would the world actually 0:17:44.800 --> 0:17:48.560 look like without plastic? We're gonna pause for a word 0:17:48.600 --> 0:17:51.440 from our sponsors. Uh, maybe we can come back and 0:17:51.960 --> 0:17:54.440 count some of the plastic stuff we found, but we'll 0:17:54.440 --> 0:18:04.080 see when we return. Here's where it gets crazy. All right, 0:18:04.160 --> 0:18:08.200 did you guys counting plastic things? I mean I don't 0:18:08.240 --> 0:18:11.560 stopped counting and counting ever since we started. Yeah, it's 0:18:11.640 --> 0:18:15.000 free easily, just like in my purview, just on my desk, 0:18:15.320 --> 0:18:20.280 just not even moving, rolling the chair anywhere. No. Yeah, man, guys, 0:18:20.359 --> 0:18:22.320 before we get back into this, I just want to 0:18:22.720 --> 0:18:27.760 make a point here. I guess that maybe we haven't 0:18:27.880 --> 0:18:31.440 hit enough in this episode yet. And it just it 0:18:31.560 --> 0:18:35.119 reminded me when we mentioned Saudi Arabia Basic Industries Corporation, 0:18:35.680 --> 0:18:39.520 just that the plastics industry is inextricably connected to the 0:18:39.560 --> 0:18:44.040 petroleum industry, to gasoline, and just how you know, where 0:18:44.160 --> 0:18:48.520 we find ourselves with plastic use, we also find ourselves 0:18:48.640 --> 0:18:52.840 with oil usage. And like what those those are the 0:18:52.880 --> 0:18:55.280 effects that both of these industries are having, or maybe 0:18:55.359 --> 0:18:58.879 this one industry is having on the planet and on 0:18:59.000 --> 0:19:01.400 the human species. I just want to like make sure 0:19:01.440 --> 0:19:03.080 that's in the back of our minds as we're going 0:19:03.160 --> 0:19:06.520 throughout the rest of this episode. Yeah, well said, and 0:19:06.560 --> 0:19:09.440 it'll be in uh, it'll be on the front of 0:19:09.480 --> 0:19:12.000 your mind at the end of this episode, for sure. 0:19:13.119 --> 0:19:16.520 Yeah they are. There are fingers on a hand. Um. 0:19:17.480 --> 0:19:20.320 And with the question we left at the break, what 0:19:20.520 --> 0:19:22.639 would happen if the world what would the world actually 0:19:22.680 --> 0:19:25.640 look like without plastic? Well, you know, put it bluntly, 0:19:26.440 --> 0:19:28.720 let's just rip off the band aid. Also with plastic, 0:19:29.440 --> 0:19:33.359 things would suck. They would suck so bad and so hard, 0:19:33.480 --> 0:19:36.840 and they would suck for a long long time. It 0:19:36.960 --> 0:19:40.320 would be, there's no way around it, a hard cut 0:19:40.359 --> 0:19:44.000 off on plastic use. First, it would cripple industries and 0:19:44.080 --> 0:19:47.960 economies alike. The Great Depression would be nothing compared to 0:19:48.080 --> 0:19:51.840 this innovation, and countless areas of research would crying to 0:19:51.960 --> 0:19:54.639 a halt. And there's honestly a good chance a lot 0:19:54.720 --> 0:19:57.480 of that innovation would not pick up again for decades 0:19:57.640 --> 0:20:00.840 or maybe even centuries. That's the level the impact we're talking, 0:20:01.000 --> 0:20:03.399 think about how much it would affect the price of things. 0:20:04.040 --> 0:20:07.080 You know, it's plastic is used as a cheap alternative 0:20:07.200 --> 0:20:12.000 to maybe more durable, long lasting materials. Are heavier materials, 0:20:12.080 --> 0:20:14.760 like all of the side panels you know, and um 0:20:14.960 --> 0:20:18.080 dash boards and things in like, you know, affordable mid 0:20:18.200 --> 0:20:21.680 level cars are all made of plastic. Everything's housed in plastic. 0:20:21.960 --> 0:20:23.800 It's not until you start getting up into the like 0:20:23.960 --> 0:20:27.160 super bespoke kind of higher end cars that things start 0:20:27.200 --> 0:20:30.239 to be made out of wood or metal. You know. Um, 0:20:30.400 --> 0:20:32.880 it would just it would like make so many things 0:20:33.000 --> 0:20:36.800 not affordable for so many people instantly. Oh yeah, worse 0:20:36.960 --> 0:20:40.359 than we might assume. This is one of those things 0:20:40.480 --> 0:20:44.720 where the stuff we're gonna say might be might sound alarming, 0:20:44.840 --> 0:20:49.119 but unfortunately, the odds are we will be vindicated tending 0:20:49.200 --> 0:20:52.640 on believers sooner than we'd like, like the like think 0:20:52.680 --> 0:20:58.080 about this. So it's difficult historically to pinpoint the exact 0:20:58.160 --> 0:21:03.240 moment when a monumental global change occurs. So for some folks, 0:21:03.320 --> 0:21:06.040 the way forward is grassroots. It's kind of a each one, 0:21:06.119 --> 0:21:09.080 teach one approach. If you're familiar with the saying, there 0:21:09.160 --> 0:21:11.920 are a lot of people in my mind, noble people 0:21:12.119 --> 0:21:14.920 who have either minimized their use of plastic or cut 0:21:15.000 --> 0:21:18.480 it from their lives almost entirely. That is definitely a 0:21:18.600 --> 0:21:22.160 herculean effort, But it also, at the same time points 0:21:22.200 --> 0:21:25.000 out one of the biggest problems with addressing this global 0:21:25.080 --> 0:21:28.560 plastic addiction. Class. You know what, I hear about a 0:21:28.640 --> 0:21:33.639 lot on the local news programs, Because as fringe as 0:21:33.680 --> 0:21:35.760 it may sound for me to point this out, there 0:21:35.800 --> 0:21:38.520 are some things that you know, mainstream news media is 0:21:38.760 --> 0:21:43.600 is totally fine not mentioning in these conversations, and class 0:21:43.680 --> 0:21:45.320 is one of those. It's one of the number one 0:21:45.440 --> 0:21:49.080 complicating factors in a war on plastic. Any attempt to 0:21:49.800 --> 0:21:53.919 argue otherwise is either incorrect or it is purposely misleading. 0:21:54.400 --> 0:21:58.720 Like imagine, it reminds me of the like take the 0:21:58.840 --> 0:22:04.320 situation of the brick countries, right the Brazil's, Russia's, India's, 0:22:04.440 --> 0:22:08.680 China's there as emergent superpowers. In the case of China, 0:22:09.359 --> 0:22:12.960 for like a century, China, like any other place on 0:22:13.040 --> 0:22:16.560 the planet, suffered long term consequences of plastic pollution from 0:22:16.600 --> 0:22:20.760 other countries, and it was a side effect of enormous 0:22:20.840 --> 0:22:24.560 economic boons for these countries. So if you look at 0:22:24.600 --> 0:22:27.600 it in very simple and real terms, China was paying 0:22:27.640 --> 0:22:30.800 the price for this progress and receiving no benefits from it. 0:22:30.880 --> 0:22:34.080 There's a similar argument with um, what you could call 0:22:34.160 --> 0:22:37.800 the climate change conuntrum, just because alliteration is dope. And 0:22:38.040 --> 0:22:41.000 you know, countries like China definitely have a valid argument 0:22:41.040 --> 0:22:45.280 when they point out that industrialized nations raped the benefits 0:22:45.440 --> 0:22:48.720 from things like coal, Um, so why shouldn't they be 0:22:48.760 --> 0:22:51.200 able to do the same. It's not fair And then 0:22:51.480 --> 0:22:54.320 I would tend to agree with that on paper, um, 0:22:55.160 --> 0:22:58.000 at least from their perspective, you know. But it's also 0:22:59.119 --> 0:23:00.600 it's sort of a do as I say, not as 0:23:00.640 --> 0:23:02.920 I do approach, and I think that always kind of 0:23:03.160 --> 0:23:06.879 you know, leaves a bad taste in countries mouths. Uh. So, 0:23:07.840 --> 0:23:10.320 you know, China's argument as they should have access to 0:23:10.400 --> 0:23:14.960 the same strategy also putting politics aside, just objectively, this 0:23:15.320 --> 0:23:21.360 approach restricts their access to further economic success. Um. It's 0:23:21.359 --> 0:23:24.119 not even to say they don't care about pollution or 0:23:24.119 --> 0:23:26.800 they're completely callous about these things. It's just kind of 0:23:26.920 --> 0:23:31.760 like a you know, well you you you know, other 0:23:31.880 --> 0:23:35.320 countries have laid the groundwork to where we are now 0:23:35.400 --> 0:23:37.160 and if you've just been a little more responsible about 0:23:37.200 --> 0:23:38.840 it than maybe we wouldn't be in this position or 0:23:38.880 --> 0:23:42.719 something like them. Yeah, it's like, uh, let's freestyle, uh 0:23:43.359 --> 0:23:46.320 imperfect analogy. Okay, Let's say let's say there's like a 0:23:46.440 --> 0:23:49.800 marathon and the people who ran the race and got 0:23:49.880 --> 0:23:53.160 first place, uh, didn't actually run. They had a car 0:23:53.680 --> 0:23:57.000 and they drove to the finished slide they said we won, 0:23:57.600 --> 0:24:00.479 and uh, You're like, well, we want to also winners. 0:24:00.720 --> 0:24:02.560 And they say, okay, but you can't drive a car, 0:24:03.480 --> 0:24:07.320 right and and and uh and and but if you 0:24:07.440 --> 0:24:10.160 get a better time than us, will say one, it's 0:24:10.200 --> 0:24:13.680 just we used a car. That's like that argument is 0:24:14.080 --> 0:24:16.440 valid from their perspective. Is important to think about that. 0:24:16.520 --> 0:24:18.280 And then if you take it back to the individual 0:24:18.440 --> 0:24:23.080 to like microscopic or microplastic level, being able to live 0:24:23.160 --> 0:24:26.440 a life like this without interacting and plastic requires a 0:24:26.560 --> 0:24:30.399 certain amount of privilege an individual agency. It's sort of 0:24:30.480 --> 0:24:33.720 like when people say like, hey, why um, why do 0:24:33.920 --> 0:24:38.919 actors in Blockbuster action movies look so in shape? They 0:24:39.000 --> 0:24:41.480 have a team of people who helped mold them into 0:24:41.560 --> 0:24:47.399