1 00:00:02,640 --> 00:00:05,840 Speaker 1: Hey, everybody, it's Bill Courtney with an army of normal folks. 2 00:00:05,880 --> 00:00:09,840 Speaker 1: And we continue now with part two of our chat 3 00:00:10,160 --> 00:00:14,400 Speaker 1: with Buddy Osborne right after these brief messages from our 4 00:00:14,840 --> 00:00:21,360 Speaker 1: general sponsors. 5 00:00:30,200 --> 00:00:33,280 Speaker 2: To answer your question, what was an organizer? So I 6 00:00:33,320 --> 00:00:37,560 Speaker 2: would run into you and I would say I would 7 00:00:37,960 --> 00:00:40,239 Speaker 2: be very complimentary to you, and I would mean it, 8 00:00:41,000 --> 00:00:43,640 Speaker 2: and I'd say, listen. You know with the Roofs Union, 9 00:00:43,920 --> 00:00:46,199 Speaker 2: you know, we have a collective Barty agreement. By bye bye, 10 00:00:46,280 --> 00:00:48,919 Speaker 2: I would I would honor, I would be honored if 11 00:00:48,960 --> 00:00:50,920 Speaker 2: you would sign this agreement. We would take care of 12 00:00:51,000 --> 00:00:53,800 Speaker 2: your men. You know, they would have a pension, hospitalization, 13 00:00:53,960 --> 00:00:56,200 Speaker 2: dental care, and they would have everything you can imagine. 14 00:00:56,480 --> 00:00:59,600 Speaker 2: We'd help you with your jobs, protect your equipment, YadA, YadA, YadA. 15 00:01:00,320 --> 00:01:03,040 Speaker 2: And you could say, and this is our territory. You know, 16 00:01:03,200 --> 00:01:05,680 Speaker 2: when you work in this area, it's prevailing ways that 17 00:01:05,720 --> 00:01:08,600 Speaker 2: you have to pay because of what we've established in 18 00:01:08,640 --> 00:01:10,959 Speaker 2: the So you would there was a whole spiel of 19 00:01:10,959 --> 00:01:12,960 Speaker 2: things that you that you would talk to the guy. 20 00:01:13,040 --> 00:01:17,480 Speaker 2: And I believed it. I believe or not. I signed 21 00:01:17,520 --> 00:01:22,160 Speaker 2: up fifty eight contractors in eighteen months. Hold it, what 22 00:01:22,240 --> 00:01:24,880 Speaker 2: if I say no, Okay, beautiful. 23 00:01:24,920 --> 00:01:26,800 Speaker 1: So you would say I gotta get kneecapped. 24 00:01:27,040 --> 00:01:36,400 Speaker 3: Yes, yes, so an organizer is a really good, strong 25 00:01:36,560 --> 00:01:40,240 Speaker 3: salesman who won't take no for an answer. 26 00:01:40,520 --> 00:01:43,800 Speaker 2: Yes, wow, you would know. 27 00:01:44,480 --> 00:01:46,440 Speaker 1: All right. So if I'm a dude with a truck 28 00:01:46,760 --> 00:01:50,080 Speaker 1: and I'm out roofing on my own, if I'm from 29 00:01:50,120 --> 00:01:53,320 Speaker 1: this area, I gotta know I'm gonna meet one of 30 00:01:53,360 --> 00:01:56,560 Speaker 1: you guys. Eventually, y'all are gonna show up. Oh yeah, 31 00:01:56,840 --> 00:02:00,480 Speaker 1: and I gotta know I'm gonna say yes, pay my 32 00:02:00,680 --> 00:02:04,360 Speaker 1: union dues. Well you have, or I'm about I'm gonna 33 00:02:04,400 --> 00:02:08,840 Speaker 1: have lots of trouble. Yes, yes, that's the way it works. 34 00:02:08,080 --> 00:02:14,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, do you yes, your building would be your right? 35 00:02:15,000 --> 00:02:21,079 Speaker 2: Do I think that's right? Uh huh, absolutely not. You know, now, 36 00:02:21,120 --> 00:02:24,960 Speaker 2: now look at there there's reasons that you know that. 37 00:02:25,240 --> 00:02:26,440 Speaker 2: I mean, there's things there's. 38 00:02:26,280 --> 00:02:29,600 Speaker 1: I'm not saying this unionization. We're not getting into that 39 00:02:29,639 --> 00:02:30,600 Speaker 1: political argument. 40 00:02:30,639 --> 00:02:34,519 Speaker 2: It's no, it's it's wrong. Yeah, there's you know. I mean, 41 00:02:35,240 --> 00:02:37,919 Speaker 2: it was so wrong that I was indicted on federal 42 00:02:38,000 --> 00:02:41,680 Speaker 2: racketeering strategy. Okay, okay, all right, so yeah, no, it's 43 00:02:41,720 --> 00:02:44,920 Speaker 2: it's definitely wrong. I mean, you don't have to like 44 00:02:45,000 --> 00:02:46,880 Speaker 2: I'll give you like this, I'll give you I'll give 45 00:02:46,880 --> 00:02:49,240 Speaker 2: you an example. I'll give you an example. So I 46 00:02:49,280 --> 00:02:52,600 Speaker 2: go up to the job. I'm a new kid. I'm excited. 47 00:02:53,000 --> 00:02:55,560 Speaker 2: You got to understand, like, like I know, I'm excited 48 00:02:55,600 --> 00:02:58,600 Speaker 2: about the about about the roof. I just love what 49 00:02:58,680 --> 00:03:00,920 Speaker 2: I do and to making care of the men. It's 50 00:03:01,000 --> 00:03:04,360 Speaker 2: I go up to this guy. His name was it 51 00:03:04,400 --> 00:03:07,320 Speaker 2: was what's the name of the room. It was a company. 52 00:03:07,360 --> 00:03:10,000 Speaker 2: I go up and uh so, I say, hey, man, 53 00:03:10,040 --> 00:03:11,720 Speaker 2: how you doing it? I just want to you know, 54 00:03:12,000 --> 00:03:14,440 Speaker 2: and I'm paraphrasing, but I know this is how I 55 00:03:14,440 --> 00:03:16,520 Speaker 2: would think. Man, I want to sign you up. I 56 00:03:16,520 --> 00:03:18,400 Speaker 2: want your man and all, well, we have so much 57 00:03:18,400 --> 00:03:22,280 Speaker 2: and he's like everything pensing anew and you know you 58 00:03:22,400 --> 00:03:26,000 Speaker 2: name it we got and he's looking at me right 59 00:03:26,360 --> 00:03:29,680 Speaker 2: and he's asking me questions. Well, long story short, he's 60 00:03:29,720 --> 00:03:34,679 Speaker 2: he's really like, uh nutting me now, like he's he's 61 00:03:34,720 --> 00:03:37,880 Speaker 2: making fun of me, like he's really sucking me in. 62 00:03:38,440 --> 00:03:40,640 Speaker 2: Like I'm thinking, I'm doing this great job. He's listening. 63 00:03:40,760 --> 00:03:42,880 Speaker 2: I want to sign this guy. This guy's ready. But 64 00:03:43,120 --> 00:03:45,080 Speaker 2: now he's now he's getting crazy. Now he's getting a 65 00:03:45,080 --> 00:03:47,080 Speaker 2: little little bit weird. Now he's getting a little bit, 66 00:03:47,360 --> 00:03:50,680 Speaker 2: a little bit uh uh funny, like he's he's making 67 00:03:50,800 --> 00:03:53,400 Speaker 2: he's making a joke of me. Now, so he has 68 00:03:53,440 --> 00:03:55,120 Speaker 2: a smile. And I asked him, I said, do you 69 00:03:55,120 --> 00:03:57,960 Speaker 2: have that on insurts And he says, yes, I do. 70 00:03:58,040 --> 00:03:59,800 Speaker 2: I said, because you're going to need it in a minute. 71 00:04:02,160 --> 00:04:04,280 Speaker 2: I mean, look, and I can laugh about that now, 72 00:04:04,520 --> 00:04:05,440 Speaker 2: so I'll give you look. 73 00:04:05,320 --> 00:04:10,160 Speaker 3: At So, so back in. 74 00:04:10,120 --> 00:04:13,600 Speaker 2: The day, we're organism I'm not glorifying this. I mean 75 00:04:13,680 --> 00:04:14,080 Speaker 2: I'm not. 76 00:04:14,800 --> 00:04:19,520 Speaker 4: We're organizers, tough guys. Yeah, they needed to be tough guys, 77 00:04:19,640 --> 00:04:23,040 Speaker 4: I think so. Yeah, at charismatic but also toughness. So 78 00:04:23,120 --> 00:04:25,920 Speaker 4: they needed to be charismatic a little. 79 00:04:26,400 --> 00:04:31,040 Speaker 2: Listen, the Roofers Union was was the police force for 80 00:04:31,120 --> 00:04:34,000 Speaker 2: all the building trades back in the day. Really, yes, 81 00:04:34,560 --> 00:04:37,440 Speaker 2: we were the police force, no doubt. I mean we're 82 00:04:37,440 --> 00:04:40,800 Speaker 2: all we were all fighters. I was retired all we 83 00:04:40,839 --> 00:04:43,320 Speaker 2: had five or six guys on staff that were actual 84 00:04:43,440 --> 00:04:44,560 Speaker 2: professional fighters. 85 00:04:44,560 --> 00:04:44,920 Speaker 1: Holy. 86 00:04:45,320 --> 00:04:47,239 Speaker 2: So yeah, yeah, and it drew a lot of attention 87 00:04:47,400 --> 00:04:48,800 Speaker 2: from the FEDS. By the way, and then we. 88 00:04:48,720 --> 00:04:50,920 Speaker 1: Can get into that we're going to get there, right, 89 00:04:51,040 --> 00:04:52,520 Speaker 1: So you're doing organizing. 90 00:04:53,080 --> 00:04:55,240 Speaker 2: But but I but I love what I did. You know, 91 00:04:55,320 --> 00:04:59,159 Speaker 2: and time you really believe that you were doing you know, listen, 92 00:04:59,200 --> 00:05:01,920 Speaker 2: I'll give you an examp. Well, you know this guy, right, 93 00:05:03,720 --> 00:05:07,240 Speaker 2: he breaks a woman's jaw, He breaks a woman's he 94 00:05:07,600 --> 00:05:11,080 Speaker 2: punches a woman and breaks your jewel. The guy who 95 00:05:11,240 --> 00:05:15,480 Speaker 2: is a father, the father of her, is a serious guy. 96 00:05:15,640 --> 00:05:18,320 Speaker 2: He's a killer. You know, he's a guy who will. 97 00:05:18,440 --> 00:05:20,880 Speaker 1: Just break that woman's jaw an idiot. 98 00:05:20,960 --> 00:05:25,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, So I was asked to handle this this guy. 99 00:05:26,480 --> 00:05:29,120 Speaker 2: So I bring the guy in six o'clock in the morning, right. 100 00:05:29,040 --> 00:05:31,160 Speaker 1: Oh, the dad guy or the guy that broke the draw, 101 00:05:31,240 --> 00:05:32,159 Speaker 1: guy that broke the jawl. 102 00:05:32,279 --> 00:05:34,480 Speaker 2: So he came in. So he's sitting just as far 103 00:05:34,480 --> 00:05:36,040 Speaker 2: as it for me. So I got another guy here. 104 00:05:36,040 --> 00:05:38,000 Speaker 2: I'm here, and I'm saying I'm talking to him. So 105 00:05:38,640 --> 00:05:41,240 Speaker 2: so I know in my mind he's going to get handled, right, 106 00:05:41,279 --> 00:05:42,960 Speaker 2: He's gonna get He's going to get handled. So I said, 107 00:05:43,200 --> 00:05:46,120 Speaker 2: I'm talking to I just had this stand up, right, 108 00:05:46,200 --> 00:05:48,440 Speaker 2: stand up? I said, what did you bring? You know? 109 00:05:48,600 --> 00:05:50,440 Speaker 2: So I had to ask him why would you do that? 110 00:05:50,480 --> 00:05:52,280 Speaker 2: And he gave me this long story. As I recall, 111 00:05:52,560 --> 00:05:54,120 Speaker 2: I said, stand up, I go over here, he has 112 00:05:54,160 --> 00:05:56,600 Speaker 2: a loaded gun in his pocket, so I take the gun. 113 00:05:56,880 --> 00:06:00,640 Speaker 2: The door opens, and he just gets just slacked. I mean, 114 00:06:00,640 --> 00:06:04,039 Speaker 2: he gets beat up bad. So I'm like, yes, what 115 00:06:04,080 --> 00:06:06,200 Speaker 2: are you doing? You know, don't you know? So he 116 00:06:06,240 --> 00:06:09,200 Speaker 2: gets cut and then next thing you know, I'm afterwards, 117 00:06:09,200 --> 00:06:12,640 Speaker 2: I'm putting ice pack on his eye and stop his 118 00:06:12,640 --> 00:06:15,599 Speaker 2: his lip bleeding, his nose was, I guess, And and 119 00:06:16,160 --> 00:06:18,400 Speaker 2: give him a cup of coffee and out the door 120 00:06:18,440 --> 00:06:20,200 Speaker 2: he went. We held his gun. I told him I'll 121 00:06:20,200 --> 00:06:21,880 Speaker 2: never bring a gun in here. So it was stuff 122 00:06:22,000 --> 00:06:25,280 Speaker 2: like that constantly, Like we would, you know, we would. 123 00:06:25,320 --> 00:06:28,000 Speaker 2: We would handle beefs on the streets for people, you know, 124 00:06:28,040 --> 00:06:29,000 Speaker 2: because our guys. 125 00:06:29,160 --> 00:06:33,440 Speaker 1: Truth is, though, as violent and awful as that is, 126 00:06:33,520 --> 00:06:36,880 Speaker 1: you might have actually saved his life because if the 127 00:06:37,000 --> 00:06:38,800 Speaker 1: dad handled it, he's probably dead. 128 00:06:38,960 --> 00:06:43,480 Speaker 2: You're right, you're right. But there's that's yeah street Yeah, 129 00:06:43,520 --> 00:06:45,640 Speaker 2: that was a street code. Yeah, and we and that's 130 00:06:45,839 --> 00:06:49,880 Speaker 2: what That's the way it was, you know, And. 131 00:06:50,240 --> 00:06:54,040 Speaker 1: That is like the movies and stuff, bro, people don't 132 00:06:54,120 --> 00:06:56,080 Speaker 1: realize that's really the way things. 133 00:06:57,160 --> 00:07:01,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, well listen, there's it gets better, Okay, it gets 134 00:07:01,880 --> 00:07:07,600 Speaker 2: where it gets better. Yeah, we we we were we 135 00:07:07,600 --> 00:07:12,520 Speaker 2: were just it was amazing. I mean, well not not 136 00:07:12,640 --> 00:07:14,360 Speaker 2: in a way that was. When I look back on 137 00:07:14,440 --> 00:07:17,120 Speaker 2: it now, you know, it's interesting, you know, when you 138 00:07:17,160 --> 00:07:20,200 Speaker 2: look back on it now, you know. I'm just I'm 139 00:07:20,240 --> 00:07:22,679 Speaker 2: grateful for where I am, you know, and and where 140 00:07:23,160 --> 00:07:25,840 Speaker 2: where God has led me. And I say that the 141 00:07:25,880 --> 00:07:28,520 Speaker 2: Lord has led me in a place that no man 142 00:07:28,560 --> 00:07:32,680 Speaker 2: can take credit for, you know. And and that's why 143 00:07:32,680 --> 00:07:36,520 Speaker 2: I'm sitting across from you. Not anything I did in 144 00:07:36,560 --> 00:07:39,120 Speaker 2: and of itself, but what Christ has done in my life. 145 00:07:39,680 --> 00:07:47,240 Speaker 1: So let's get there. So you you were quote organizing 146 00:07:47,960 --> 00:07:51,280 Speaker 1: and then you end up in jail. Tell us how 147 00:07:51,440 --> 00:07:52,200 Speaker 1: that happened. 148 00:07:52,520 --> 00:07:55,560 Speaker 2: Well, so I tried to sign this guy up and 149 00:07:55,680 --> 00:07:58,200 Speaker 2: he and I said this, you have that insurance. So 150 00:07:58,320 --> 00:08:00,679 Speaker 2: one day I'm riding down the street. See his truck 151 00:08:00,680 --> 00:08:04,440 Speaker 2: outside of a a place where you go all your materials. 152 00:08:05,360 --> 00:08:07,120 Speaker 2: So we go, we cut all this. I cut all 153 00:08:07,200 --> 00:08:10,360 Speaker 2: his tires in this big truck. Cut clearly, he said, 154 00:08:11,000 --> 00:08:15,040 Speaker 2: I said, I said, I said, I, Hey, it's squirts 155 00:08:15,080 --> 00:08:16,800 Speaker 2: on the phone. It's like hey, corns, let's say hey, 156 00:08:16,760 --> 00:08:18,960 Speaker 2: you don't my name is Frank, I said, listen, I'm 157 00:08:18,960 --> 00:08:21,360 Speaker 2: with it. I worked for the Firestone tire, and I'm 158 00:08:21,360 --> 00:08:23,280 Speaker 2: wondering if you want to have some tires like we 159 00:08:23,360 --> 00:08:26,120 Speaker 2: got a big sale on it. What do you mean, well, 160 00:08:26,280 --> 00:08:28,120 Speaker 2: just because it looks like you got some problems with 161 00:08:28,160 --> 00:08:30,360 Speaker 2: your tires. He looks. I said, God, to take a 162 00:08:30,400 --> 00:08:34,200 Speaker 2: look you go, and he starts, how you know, and 163 00:08:34,280 --> 00:08:38,000 Speaker 2: we were laughing. Then uh so we want up signing them. 164 00:08:38,040 --> 00:08:40,840 Speaker 2: I want up sign them and got seventy five years. 165 00:08:40,880 --> 00:08:43,640 Speaker 2: He was non union and I was able to sign them. 166 00:08:43,800 --> 00:08:46,600 Speaker 2: A couple of the things happened that I recall, but 167 00:08:46,720 --> 00:08:51,440 Speaker 2: I signed them up. So so you know, I I 168 00:08:51,520 --> 00:08:52,880 Speaker 2: believed in what I was doing. 169 00:08:53,200 --> 00:08:53,440 Speaker 1: You know. 170 00:08:57,240 --> 00:09:00,760 Speaker 2: I purchased a duplex. I was twenty five at the time, 171 00:09:00,960 --> 00:09:05,680 Speaker 2: and and I have my own place. I'm outside of 172 00:09:05,760 --> 00:09:10,080 Speaker 2: the Night's out of Kensington now you know, you know, 173 00:09:10,200 --> 00:09:14,160 Speaker 2: dating a girl at the time, just living large. I 174 00:09:14,240 --> 00:09:19,160 Speaker 2: go to Florida for a week's vacation. I come back 175 00:09:19,200 --> 00:09:23,000 Speaker 2: from Florida, I receive a letter in the mail and 176 00:09:23,120 --> 00:09:26,439 Speaker 2: from the FBI if edri Bu says that I'm a target. 177 00:09:26,440 --> 00:09:28,840 Speaker 2: I didn't know what that was. I take it down 178 00:09:28,880 --> 00:09:32,400 Speaker 2: to the to my my boss, you know, and he said, 179 00:09:32,480 --> 00:09:35,440 Speaker 2: oh kit he so I'm so sorry. Now remember, mind you, 180 00:09:35,480 --> 00:09:38,080 Speaker 2: he was my he was my boxing coach, he was 181 00:09:38,120 --> 00:09:41,600 Speaker 2: my idol. You know. I said, that's nothing, Steve. 182 00:09:41,280 --> 00:09:42,600 Speaker 1: It's what are you to do? 183 00:09:42,720 --> 00:09:47,320 Speaker 2: So so that's that right, And uh, we had Steve 184 00:09:47,640 --> 00:09:51,480 Speaker 2: at the time was in his office and he was 185 00:09:51,679 --> 00:09:54,400 Speaker 2: talking with a couple of people and he looked up 186 00:09:54,640 --> 00:09:58,400 Speaker 2: and something didn't seem right. So he called us all 187 00:09:58,440 --> 00:10:01,440 Speaker 2: in and then we w into a conference room and 188 00:10:01,480 --> 00:10:04,480 Speaker 2: the Feds labeled at the rubber room because that's where 189 00:10:04,840 --> 00:10:07,160 Speaker 2: a lot of people would get beat up pretty. 190 00:10:06,920 --> 00:10:07,320 Speaker 1: Good, you know. 191 00:10:08,400 --> 00:10:10,760 Speaker 2: So yeah, so so what we did it was like 192 00:10:10,920 --> 00:10:14,720 Speaker 2: things like this, And so we found the the electronic surveillance. 193 00:10:15,160 --> 00:10:18,760 Speaker 2: So the FBI was two blocks away and they were 194 00:10:18,800 --> 00:10:23,720 Speaker 2: recording everything, including all the things that I was involved with, 195 00:10:23,800 --> 00:10:26,720 Speaker 2: you know, And so we didn't know that, but we 196 00:10:26,840 --> 00:10:29,800 Speaker 2: found that. We found the the bugs. We took the 197 00:10:29,840 --> 00:10:33,679 Speaker 2: bugs out. They were listening to us as they as 198 00:10:33,720 --> 00:10:36,240 Speaker 2: all this was happening. Yeah, so we get the bugs, 199 00:10:36,280 --> 00:10:39,559 Speaker 2: we take it and a guy Steve tells him take 200 00:10:39,600 --> 00:10:44,520 Speaker 2: it out, So he drives away over to Jersey and 201 00:10:45,080 --> 00:10:47,760 Speaker 2: here they had they had a GPS on it and 202 00:10:47,800 --> 00:10:51,400 Speaker 2: the Feds were fouling coming from all angles. And they 203 00:10:51,440 --> 00:10:53,880 Speaker 2: want to pulling them over and grabbing them. You know. 204 00:10:55,480 --> 00:10:57,840 Speaker 2: So now we we didn't know the extent of the 205 00:10:57,840 --> 00:11:02,360 Speaker 2: indictment or what the charges would be, or what they 206 00:11:02,600 --> 00:11:03,360 Speaker 2: evidence they. 207 00:11:03,240 --> 00:11:05,160 Speaker 1: Had, and when the hammer was coming. 208 00:11:05,280 --> 00:11:07,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I'm a young kid, you know 209 00:11:07,320 --> 00:11:09,920 Speaker 2: at the time. I'm on the street, you know, eighteen 210 00:11:09,960 --> 00:11:13,920 Speaker 2: months at the time. And and sure enough we got indicted. 211 00:11:14,240 --> 00:11:18,199 Speaker 2: And eighteen people were indicted, A couple judges of Philadelphia judges, 212 00:11:18,440 --> 00:11:22,440 Speaker 2: some lawyers, a couple of mob guys, and then thirteen 213 00:11:22,520 --> 00:11:25,160 Speaker 2: union officials. I was one of them. So when it 214 00:11:25,200 --> 00:11:27,400 Speaker 2: was come time, when it when it came time for 215 00:11:27,400 --> 00:11:31,440 Speaker 2: for for the for the indictment, I was in. It 216 00:11:31,480 --> 00:11:33,680 Speaker 2: was a Friday. I was in a wedding on Saturday, 217 00:11:34,920 --> 00:11:38,800 Speaker 2: and uh I go to the federal courthouse and to 218 00:11:38,880 --> 00:11:43,560 Speaker 2: post bail. We're all there, massive media, massive, So I 219 00:11:43,600 --> 00:11:46,800 Speaker 2: go and uh so we're all in this cell like 220 00:11:46,880 --> 00:11:49,520 Speaker 2: maybe maybe a little bigger than this, about all of 221 00:11:49,600 --> 00:11:51,280 Speaker 2: us were. And they would take two at a time. 222 00:11:52,280 --> 00:11:54,760 Speaker 2: So I'm back. I'm like, man, I must be I'm 223 00:11:54,760 --> 00:11:57,480 Speaker 2: like the last. Me and Steve were like, we're like 224 00:11:57,520 --> 00:12:01,640 Speaker 2: the last. He's my boss, he's my mentors. Everything to me, 225 00:12:01,760 --> 00:12:04,440 Speaker 2: you know, so they I go out with him. Guess 226 00:12:04,480 --> 00:12:06,680 Speaker 2: what they do. They revoke my baill because I was 227 00:12:06,720 --> 00:12:09,640 Speaker 2: a threat to the community in menace of society. They 228 00:12:09,640 --> 00:12:12,480 Speaker 2: wouldn't give me bail because they hit it no, and 229 00:12:12,520 --> 00:12:15,480 Speaker 2: they wouldn't give Steve baill. So they kept three of 230 00:12:15,559 --> 00:12:18,960 Speaker 2: us pre troud detention because of that. I couldn't believe it. 231 00:12:19,280 --> 00:12:22,360 Speaker 2: Here I am walking, I'm in I'm in the Marshall's van. 232 00:12:22,640 --> 00:12:25,160 Speaker 2: The news meetia was like something out of a movie. 233 00:12:25,640 --> 00:12:29,600 Speaker 2: And I'm shackled to Steve and and he looks at me, 234 00:12:29,640 --> 00:12:31,360 Speaker 2: and it's the first time he said this, he says, 235 00:12:31,679 --> 00:12:33,560 Speaker 2: he says, but the kid he called me Kit, He 236 00:12:33,559 --> 00:12:35,280 Speaker 2: said you were to you were to pick for the 237 00:12:35,360 --> 00:12:38,360 Speaker 2: to run this union. One day, I remember thinking, wow, 238 00:12:38,880 --> 00:12:42,480 Speaker 2: that's amazing this guy would say that to me, you know, 239 00:12:42,880 --> 00:12:46,240 Speaker 2: my you know. And here I am and I go 240 00:12:46,320 --> 00:12:46,840 Speaker 2: to prison. 241 00:12:49,760 --> 00:12:50,680 Speaker 1: We'll be right back. 242 00:13:02,960 --> 00:13:06,880 Speaker 2: So we get put in this This small salt was dark, 243 00:13:06,960 --> 00:13:10,120 Speaker 2: a smelly. A guy drops dead right in front of us. 244 00:13:10,520 --> 00:13:12,480 Speaker 2: They pull him out and they didn't know that we 245 00:13:12,720 --> 00:13:15,120 Speaker 2: you know, Once they found out it was Steve Trace, 246 00:13:15,800 --> 00:13:17,800 Speaker 2: they took us out of the cell and the and 247 00:13:17,840 --> 00:13:20,640 Speaker 2: they really hooked us up good, you know. So, so 248 00:13:21,760 --> 00:13:24,640 Speaker 2: now I got a cell that was a Friday. Come Saturday, 249 00:13:25,280 --> 00:13:28,240 Speaker 2: eleven o'clock at night, the guard opens the door and 250 00:13:28,240 --> 00:13:30,960 Speaker 2: he gives me cake, wedding cake because I was supposed 251 00:13:30,960 --> 00:13:33,240 Speaker 2: to be in a wedding. They got the cake in 252 00:13:33,360 --> 00:13:36,040 Speaker 2: for me. Made you know. So ultimately, Bill, I got out. 253 00:13:36,120 --> 00:13:39,319 Speaker 2: I got out of I got out with the stipulation 254 00:13:39,440 --> 00:13:42,120 Speaker 2: that I remained under house arrests, which I did for 255 00:13:42,160 --> 00:13:45,920 Speaker 2: twenty twenty. I was sentenced to eight years. I did 256 00:13:45,960 --> 00:13:49,640 Speaker 2: five years. I did five new fence. You know. It's 257 00:13:49,640 --> 00:13:53,320 Speaker 2: hard time, you know what, I went and trade one 258 00:13:53,400 --> 00:13:58,040 Speaker 2: second of it because of where I am now, I 259 00:13:58,040 --> 00:14:03,480 Speaker 2: wouldn't trade one second of it, not one So but yes, yeah, 260 00:14:03,520 --> 00:14:06,840 Speaker 2: it wasn't easy, man, It wasn't easy. But thinking back, 261 00:14:07,000 --> 00:14:10,760 Speaker 2: you know, I wrote, I got almost three hundred thousand 262 00:14:10,800 --> 00:14:13,320 Speaker 2: words written every day of my life I wrote in prison. 263 00:14:13,840 --> 00:14:16,240 Speaker 2: I sent it home and I just finished my fourth 264 00:14:16,400 --> 00:14:19,960 Speaker 2: edit for a memoir. I'm giving it to my daughter. 265 00:14:20,120 --> 00:14:22,240 Speaker 2: You know, she read the first year in eighty seven. 266 00:14:22,360 --> 00:14:24,200 Speaker 2: She was like, da, this is amazing. You know. 267 00:14:25,480 --> 00:14:29,600 Speaker 1: Well, anyways, tell me about the transformation, because that's when 268 00:14:29,640 --> 00:14:34,840 Speaker 1: it that's when the redemption of your life and all 269 00:14:34,880 --> 00:14:36,360 Speaker 1: that you do now really began. 270 00:14:36,600 --> 00:14:40,960 Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, well you know I was in the Creed movie. 271 00:14:41,080 --> 00:14:43,200 Speaker 2: I was the cupman in the Creed movie. I don't 272 00:14:43,240 --> 00:14:44,040 Speaker 2: know whether you knew that or not. 273 00:14:44,160 --> 00:14:45,800 Speaker 1: I did know that, Yeah you did. I did. 274 00:14:45,960 --> 00:14:50,880 Speaker 2: Oh, So I say this for this reason. So I'm 275 00:14:51,120 --> 00:14:53,320 Speaker 2: I'm in the I'm in the ring with Salon. 276 00:14:53,440 --> 00:14:53,600 Speaker 1: You know. 277 00:14:54,320 --> 00:14:56,240 Speaker 2: I was on set for like three and a half weeks, 278 00:14:56,240 --> 00:14:58,800 Speaker 2: four weeks, you know, for just a small little part. 279 00:14:58,880 --> 00:15:00,560 Speaker 2: You know. Thank the Lord for that, because I put 280 00:15:00,560 --> 00:15:01,560 Speaker 2: my daughter through college. 281 00:15:02,400 --> 00:15:03,520 Speaker 1: So that's awesome. 282 00:15:03,520 --> 00:15:06,680 Speaker 2: I still get residuals seven years later. Not a lot, 283 00:15:06,720 --> 00:15:10,200 Speaker 2: but that's awesome. So I remember, I said, I said, 284 00:15:10,640 --> 00:15:13,040 Speaker 2: I says, you know, I got to share this with you. 285 00:15:13,040 --> 00:15:17,400 Speaker 2: It was thirty eight days, thirty eight years, almost to 286 00:15:17,400 --> 00:15:22,720 Speaker 2: the day that he did Rocky in Kensington. I was 287 00:15:22,720 --> 00:15:23,520 Speaker 2: in that movie. 288 00:15:23,920 --> 00:15:24,600 Speaker 1: Were you really? 289 00:15:24,720 --> 00:15:27,840 Speaker 2: I was at seventeen year old kid with a black eye, right, 290 00:15:27,960 --> 00:15:31,440 Speaker 2: So I said, so that the so I jump over. 291 00:15:31,520 --> 00:15:33,920 Speaker 2: The guys knocked on my door and said they're making 292 00:15:33,960 --> 00:15:36,160 Speaker 2: a movie about this, right, I said, He says, Rookie 293 00:15:36,240 --> 00:15:40,000 Speaker 2: Duke fight, I'm a fight on Kensington Channel twelve, little doctor, 294 00:15:40,080 --> 00:15:42,560 Speaker 2: you know. So I jump over the rope they had 295 00:15:42,600 --> 00:15:45,040 Speaker 2: all roped off, and I start shadow boxing. Give me, 296 00:15:45,440 --> 00:15:47,760 Speaker 2: you know, and everyone was laughing. Everybody knew me, you know, 297 00:15:47,960 --> 00:15:50,680 Speaker 2: I was a kid, and Burgess, gimme here, a kid 298 00:15:50,680 --> 00:15:52,440 Speaker 2: I didn't even know who he was. Came here, kid, 299 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:56,160 Speaker 2: he says, I. God, so we so it's me, I said, 300 00:15:56,240 --> 00:15:58,400 Speaker 2: let my friend Timmy. So he gets into he gets 301 00:15:58,400 --> 00:16:00,680 Speaker 2: in the show and we're walking down still Loan walks up. 302 00:16:00,720 --> 00:16:04,840 Speaker 2: We heardship, no talking. Just so when it came time 303 00:16:04,920 --> 00:16:07,160 Speaker 2: for us to watch the movie and I told Slides 304 00:16:07,320 --> 00:16:09,560 Speaker 2: just like this, they cut us out. He was, so 305 00:16:10,120 --> 00:16:14,000 Speaker 2: he's so sorry, you know. Yeah, it was funny, but 306 00:16:14,080 --> 00:16:16,480 Speaker 2: it was it was the truth. Yeah, I love to 307 00:16:16,520 --> 00:16:18,480 Speaker 2: get that. I would love one day. I'd like to 308 00:16:18,480 --> 00:16:19,320 Speaker 2: get those. 309 00:16:19,040 --> 00:16:24,160 Speaker 1: People don't understand that Sylvester Salone's start to start him 310 00:16:24,320 --> 00:16:27,040 Speaker 1: was just basically him being him and Rocky because he 311 00:16:27,120 --> 00:16:29,600 Speaker 1: was just a meadheaded kind of guy from that area 312 00:16:29,720 --> 00:16:30,440 Speaker 1: in real life. 313 00:16:30,480 --> 00:16:34,240 Speaker 2: He was yeah, he was yeah, yeah, so it was 314 00:16:34,360 --> 00:16:36,680 Speaker 2: it was. It was good. So so out of that, 315 00:16:37,360 --> 00:16:42,920 Speaker 2: we get a an email from this guy named Irwin Winkler. 316 00:16:43,480 --> 00:16:46,720 Speaker 2: He he he was the producer of all the Rocky movies. 317 00:16:47,440 --> 00:16:49,640 Speaker 2: I think he did Raging Bull. He did so many 318 00:16:49,720 --> 00:16:53,040 Speaker 2: different movies, and he wanted to buy my He wanted 319 00:16:53,080 --> 00:16:58,000 Speaker 2: to do my life story. I said, this is five 320 00:16:58,080 --> 00:17:01,680 Speaker 2: years ago. I said, my life story. Are you kidding? 321 00:17:01,720 --> 00:17:03,760 Speaker 2: I said to my wife, we're gonna have to move now. 322 00:17:03,840 --> 00:17:05,720 Speaker 2: I'm going to get famous. I don't want to. I 323 00:17:05,720 --> 00:17:07,920 Speaker 2: don't really want to. I really don't want to do this. 324 00:17:08,320 --> 00:17:10,879 Speaker 2: So now I had to get a lawyer, and they 325 00:17:10,920 --> 00:17:15,720 Speaker 2: had thirteen pages of stuff. They got down to three things. 326 00:17:16,200 --> 00:17:20,359 Speaker 2: So my lawyer was up against another lawyer, apparently like 327 00:17:20,400 --> 00:17:24,320 Speaker 2: a powerful Hollywood lawyer. And so the only thing I 328 00:17:24,359 --> 00:17:27,240 Speaker 2: wanted was my faith to be. You can, you can, 329 00:17:27,320 --> 00:17:31,240 Speaker 2: you can embellish it anyway you want. But I want 330 00:17:31,240 --> 00:17:35,800 Speaker 2: my faith to be to be what the forefront, yes, right, 331 00:17:35,960 --> 00:17:38,439 Speaker 2: the transformation, the redemption, like you said, that's what I 332 00:17:38,480 --> 00:17:40,879 Speaker 2: want to. I had a conversation with home my phone. 333 00:17:40,920 --> 00:17:42,960 Speaker 2: My wife was here, my daughter's here, here, I am, 334 00:17:43,080 --> 00:17:45,400 Speaker 2: And then my lawyer said, why don't you talk to him? 335 00:17:45,560 --> 00:17:47,440 Speaker 2: So he said, hey, man, we're going to make you superstar. 336 00:17:47,520 --> 00:17:50,840 Speaker 2: And I feel like a Rocky thing. Come out, I said, 337 00:17:50,840 --> 00:17:52,840 Speaker 2: mister Winkle I appreciate it. They were going to give 338 00:17:52,880 --> 00:17:54,560 Speaker 2: me a lot of money up front. I didn't want 339 00:17:54,560 --> 00:17:56,840 Speaker 2: to take not one cent. I said, everything goes to 340 00:17:56,880 --> 00:17:59,800 Speaker 2: the Rock, you know. I said, I appreciate this, man, 341 00:17:59,840 --> 00:18:03,440 Speaker 2: but you know, my faith needs to be first and foremost. 342 00:18:03,960 --> 00:18:06,840 Speaker 2: You know, it's Christ in me, you know, you know, 343 00:18:07,040 --> 00:18:11,040 Speaker 2: and that's the bottom line, you know. And he said, wow, man, 344 00:18:11,119 --> 00:18:12,720 Speaker 2: it takes a lot of money to do this, but 345 00:18:12,920 --> 00:18:16,080 Speaker 2: I don't know. So they didn't. They didn't accept it, 346 00:18:16,080 --> 00:18:19,000 Speaker 2: and I said, okay. When I hung the phone up, 347 00:18:19,359 --> 00:18:22,920 Speaker 2: I hugged my wife and my daughter. And so we 348 00:18:22,960 --> 00:18:26,040 Speaker 2: had a building next to the Rock that we wanted 349 00:18:26,040 --> 00:18:31,359 Speaker 2: to buy, and and I was going to use the money. 350 00:18:31,400 --> 00:18:33,280 Speaker 2: I think they were going to give us a substantial, 351 00:18:33,760 --> 00:18:35,639 Speaker 2: a good bit. I was going to use that to 352 00:18:35,720 --> 00:18:38,199 Speaker 2: buy that because I don't own anything down there, you know. 353 00:18:39,080 --> 00:18:41,479 Speaker 2: And I said, okay, Well, two weeks later, we got 354 00:18:41,480 --> 00:18:45,240 Speaker 2: an anonymous check in the mail and we purchased that building. 355 00:18:45,440 --> 00:18:47,520 Speaker 2: And it wasn't nothing had nothing to do with the movie, 356 00:18:47,560 --> 00:18:49,520 Speaker 2: you know what I'm saying. So God was saying, listen, 357 00:18:49,600 --> 00:18:53,640 Speaker 2: I got this, get to that. Okay, yeah, you're in prison. 358 00:18:54,200 --> 00:18:59,760 Speaker 1: Let's get to Wow. Because gods prior to this Christ 359 00:19:00,240 --> 00:19:01,600 Speaker 1: in the central part of your life. 360 00:19:02,800 --> 00:19:05,440 Speaker 2: Well, so I went to church, but I didn't understand 361 00:19:05,760 --> 00:19:12,239 Speaker 2: what you take us there, Okay, So ultimately I was 362 00:19:13,000 --> 00:19:19,600 Speaker 2: setting d And then I went to prison and checked 363 00:19:19,640 --> 00:19:26,200 Speaker 2: into prison, and it was surreal too, you know. And 364 00:19:26,760 --> 00:19:30,560 Speaker 2: but as I'm there, I'll give you the short I was. 365 00:19:30,640 --> 00:19:32,840 Speaker 2: As I was there, I received a letter from a 366 00:19:32,920 --> 00:19:41,280 Speaker 2: lady and she said to me, she said, to me, buddy, 367 00:19:41,840 --> 00:19:46,320 Speaker 2: he said, she said, Jesus holds you in the palm 368 00:19:46,359 --> 00:19:53,320 Speaker 2: of his hand. And I'm like, man, that's interesting because 369 00:19:53,359 --> 00:19:55,879 Speaker 2: I was a practicing Catholic at the time, and you know, 370 00:19:55,960 --> 00:19:59,439 Speaker 2: and I'm going to church. In fact, I was, you know, 371 00:19:59,480 --> 00:20:02,120 Speaker 2: I was in a choir, I was elector, I read 372 00:20:02,000 --> 00:20:04,240 Speaker 2: that the reading. I was. I did everything I could, 373 00:20:04,280 --> 00:20:07,560 Speaker 2: you know, And and then I was I would I 374 00:20:07,600 --> 00:20:11,040 Speaker 2: would read the Bible, you know. And she would always 375 00:20:11,119 --> 00:20:14,640 Speaker 2: write me. And her name was Lucille, you know, and 376 00:20:14,920 --> 00:20:16,720 Speaker 2: she was the neighbor of a girl that I was 377 00:20:16,800 --> 00:20:19,000 Speaker 2: dating at the time, and she had left me. You know, 378 00:20:19,160 --> 00:20:23,280 Speaker 2: I was in prison, and it was a very very 379 00:20:23,280 --> 00:20:27,400 Speaker 2: difficult time for me. And uh, but I knew that 380 00:20:27,720 --> 00:20:31,080 Speaker 2: my transformation was taking place. Something was happened. I remember 381 00:20:31,160 --> 00:20:36,240 Speaker 2: walking the track with this guy, looked like Paul Newman, 382 00:20:36,440 --> 00:20:41,399 Speaker 2: pierced blue eyes, white hair, just thin, never wore a shirt. 383 00:20:41,440 --> 00:20:45,159 Speaker 2: We're in Louisiana and we're walking and I cursed like 384 00:20:45,200 --> 00:20:47,960 Speaker 2: a like like the like that's every other word out 385 00:20:47,960 --> 00:20:50,520 Speaker 2: of my mouth. And he said to me one day, 386 00:20:50,560 --> 00:20:52,879 Speaker 2: because I reason why I know this because I wrote 387 00:20:52,920 --> 00:20:56,080 Speaker 2: about it and I just saw about he said, how 388 00:20:56,280 --> 00:20:59,040 Speaker 2: there you use that language in my presence? You'd loud, 389 00:20:59,119 --> 00:21:02,439 Speaker 2: las sivious last it just loud. He said that to me. Wow, 390 00:21:03,000 --> 00:21:07,960 Speaker 2: I'm like, what woll you know? So it was little 391 00:21:07,960 --> 00:21:10,200 Speaker 2: things like that. So I gave I said, I said, 392 00:21:10,320 --> 00:21:13,119 Speaker 2: I'm giving up my cursing. I just wrote it. I 393 00:21:13,119 --> 00:21:16,840 Speaker 2: said nope, and I stuck to that. That's been so 394 00:21:16,880 --> 00:21:19,360 Speaker 2: many years, you know. So what happened was I did 395 00:21:19,400 --> 00:21:24,840 Speaker 2: my time. I get out. And it wasn't really until 396 00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:29,520 Speaker 2: December thirty first, nineteen ninety five, at a thirty at 397 00:21:29,640 --> 00:21:33,159 Speaker 2: night that I gave my life to Christ on the phone. 398 00:21:33,680 --> 00:21:36,840 Speaker 2: I just had I didn't hear his voice. I didn't 399 00:21:36,920 --> 00:21:39,479 Speaker 2: hear him, you know, I didn't see a vision. I 400 00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:42,400 Speaker 2: just knew that there was something that was lacking that 401 00:21:42,480 --> 00:21:46,520 Speaker 2: void that I had from a kid and all the 402 00:21:46,520 --> 00:21:48,800 Speaker 2: things that I've been through at this point now I'm 403 00:21:48,840 --> 00:21:51,720 Speaker 2: thirty six years old, about to be thirty seven, and 404 00:21:52,200 --> 00:21:57,600 Speaker 2: I'm empty. I'm just on empty. I'm empty. And six 405 00:21:57,640 --> 00:22:02,000 Speaker 2: months later, I'm in Siberia in the prison gulangs for kids, 406 00:22:02,320 --> 00:22:04,439 Speaker 2: you know, in prison because I was going I started 407 00:22:04,480 --> 00:22:07,719 Speaker 2: going to this church, a Bible teaching church, and I 408 00:22:07,800 --> 00:22:10,640 Speaker 2: ended up in Siberia. They I went on a missions 409 00:22:10,640 --> 00:22:13,520 Speaker 2: team for a month, and when I came back, I 410 00:22:13,560 --> 00:22:15,800 Speaker 2: started to go teach a Bible study at the House 411 00:22:15,840 --> 00:22:19,040 Speaker 2: of Corrections. In the meantime, Mike Tyson had got out 412 00:22:19,080 --> 00:22:21,560 Speaker 2: of prison and he was training at my friend's gym 413 00:22:21,800 --> 00:22:28,840 Speaker 2: in Philly. And so what happened was he I was 414 00:22:28,880 --> 00:22:32,159 Speaker 2: training this kid there and he made it to the 415 00:22:32,200 --> 00:22:34,800 Speaker 2: finals of the of the nationals of the Junior Olympics. 416 00:22:34,960 --> 00:22:38,880 Speaker 2: And what happened was he he got robbed the controversial decision. 417 00:22:39,000 --> 00:22:40,800 Speaker 2: I didn't see it for two weeks. Now. I never 418 00:22:40,880 --> 00:22:43,480 Speaker 2: shared my faith with anybody in this at the gym, 419 00:22:44,280 --> 00:22:47,800 Speaker 2: you're coaching kids, and I'm coaching kids now at this point. 420 00:22:47,600 --> 00:22:50,359 Speaker 1: But yeah, your faith, you're not sharing. 421 00:22:50,480 --> 00:22:53,320 Speaker 2: I'm not sharing it. Night you got this kid that's good. 422 00:22:53,480 --> 00:22:56,200 Speaker 1: He goes down, he loses a decision, and he doesn't 423 00:22:56,200 --> 00:22:58,560 Speaker 1: know anything about you, but your buddy, the badass boxer 424 00:22:58,600 --> 00:23:02,560 Speaker 1: guy who's done time. You've got the credibility from yes, 425 00:23:03,119 --> 00:23:07,200 Speaker 1: your boxing pedigree, you got the credibility from the street 426 00:23:07,240 --> 00:23:12,280 Speaker 1: cred you're a boxer guy, yes, and you're you're now training. 427 00:23:11,920 --> 00:23:13,960 Speaker 2: Kids, right, I'm training kids. 428 00:23:13,960 --> 00:23:17,200 Speaker 1: But you hadn't once shared, Yes, the transformation that took 429 00:23:17,240 --> 00:23:19,639 Speaker 1: a place in your life. This guy goes down and 430 00:23:19,680 --> 00:23:21,720 Speaker 1: loses his fight. You don't see him for two weeks. 431 00:23:21,880 --> 00:23:22,920 Speaker 2: Right, I'm on the prison. 432 00:23:23,040 --> 00:23:24,200 Speaker 1: Are you wondering if he's dead. 433 00:23:24,520 --> 00:23:25,640 Speaker 2: I didn't know where he was at. 434 00:23:25,800 --> 00:23:34,359 Speaker 1: Yeah, after the break, we'll we'll hear what happened to 435 00:23:34,440 --> 00:23:36,680 Speaker 1: this young man. We'll be right back. 436 00:23:42,880 --> 00:23:45,040 Speaker 2: I'm teaching the Bible study on Saturday, and it was 437 00:23:45,080 --> 00:23:47,879 Speaker 2: like twenty eight kids there, and he walks in with 438 00:23:47,920 --> 00:23:49,720 Speaker 2: an orange jump suit. I looked at him. 439 00:23:49,760 --> 00:23:52,520 Speaker 1: I said, you mean you're teaching the Bible study in prison? 440 00:23:52,600 --> 00:23:53,560 Speaker 2: In prison on the block. 441 00:23:53,640 --> 00:23:54,680 Speaker 1: Yeah, right, yeah? 442 00:23:55,040 --> 00:23:58,560 Speaker 2: And I said, what he killed somebody? He killed a 443 00:23:58,600 --> 00:24:02,400 Speaker 2: kid in a gang fight. And I was devastating. I cried, man, 444 00:24:02,680 --> 00:24:05,200 Speaker 2: I cried and I hugged the kid and I said, 445 00:24:05,200 --> 00:24:07,680 Speaker 2: sit down, I want to teach you about Jesus. That's 446 00:24:07,720 --> 00:24:12,920 Speaker 2: exact my exact words. And so you know, he he ultimately, 447 00:24:13,119 --> 00:24:16,000 Speaker 2: you know, actually caught a break because it was you know, 448 00:24:16,040 --> 00:24:18,000 Speaker 2: it was a gang fight and kids. He you know, 449 00:24:18,320 --> 00:24:20,199 Speaker 2: he was a juvenile, you know, so he's out to 450 00:24:20,240 --> 00:24:24,720 Speaker 2: that to this day. And but I stopped training kids 451 00:24:24,760 --> 00:24:27,640 Speaker 2: at that time. I didn't have I lost my desire 452 00:24:28,040 --> 00:24:30,439 Speaker 2: for some reason. I said, this doesn't make sense to me, 453 00:24:30,600 --> 00:24:32,520 Speaker 2: you know what I mean. You know, I was trained, 454 00:24:32,600 --> 00:24:34,720 Speaker 2: and I was I was taught to train to make 455 00:24:34,800 --> 00:24:37,960 Speaker 2: champions of the world. But I wasn't feeling that, man, 456 00:24:38,000 --> 00:24:40,680 Speaker 2: because you know, I just wasn't feeling that. So I stopped. 457 00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:44,879 Speaker 2: But I got married to a girl named Lucille. Actually, 458 00:24:44,880 --> 00:24:49,719 Speaker 2: you know, I know that's interesting in it, Lucie, so so, 459 00:24:50,440 --> 00:24:55,199 Speaker 2: you know, I said, so, so I fast track it. 460 00:24:55,600 --> 00:25:00,040 Speaker 2: You know, I my my faith is increasing, and no 461 00:25:00,080 --> 00:25:02,840 Speaker 2: I'm on that prison block every week and I'm seeing 462 00:25:02,880 --> 00:25:06,920 Speaker 2: these kids in there with no fathers. You know, it's 463 00:25:06,960 --> 00:25:11,480 Speaker 2: breaking my heart. No fathers, None of them had a father, 464 00:25:12,680 --> 00:25:15,760 Speaker 2: And I'm thinking myself, how could I be more effective 465 00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:20,320 Speaker 2: on the street block? On the street block rather than 466 00:25:20,359 --> 00:25:24,399 Speaker 2: the prison block. I know what the recidism rate is, 467 00:25:24,440 --> 00:25:30,000 Speaker 2: it's eighty percent. How do you change that? How do 468 00:25:30,040 --> 00:25:34,000 Speaker 2: you change the recidism rate? Is an education? 469 00:25:34,200 --> 00:25:38,000 Speaker 1: How can you be more effective on the street block 470 00:25:38,440 --> 00:25:41,600 Speaker 1: rather than the prison block. Yes, there's a guy I 471 00:25:41,640 --> 00:25:46,160 Speaker 1: interviewed not long ago who said, we can work ourselves 472 00:25:46,200 --> 00:25:49,919 Speaker 1: silly doing the good work of pulling babies out of 473 00:25:49,920 --> 00:25:53,359 Speaker 1: the river, but eventually we need to go upstream and 474 00:25:53,359 --> 00:25:55,760 Speaker 1: find out why they're in the river in the first place. 475 00:25:56,080 --> 00:26:01,240 Speaker 2: Wow, wow, wow, same thing, you're yeah, it's the same thing. 476 00:26:01,359 --> 00:26:04,840 Speaker 1: Yeah, how do I reach them on the block the streets? 477 00:26:04,960 --> 00:26:07,560 Speaker 1: How do I reach them on the street block rather 478 00:26:07,640 --> 00:26:09,200 Speaker 1: than get them in the prison block. 479 00:26:09,680 --> 00:26:13,520 Speaker 2: So when I think about my life and what I've seen, 480 00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:18,119 Speaker 2: where I've been, that seminary to me, I went the seminary, 481 00:26:18,840 --> 00:26:21,399 Speaker 2: you know, from the prison from the hardest brit I 482 00:26:21,440 --> 00:26:23,360 Speaker 2: wasn't in no camp, I was behind was an FC, 483 00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:25,120 Speaker 2: I was behind a wall, you know what I mean? 484 00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:28,000 Speaker 2: And not bragging, that's just the way it was. But 485 00:26:28,200 --> 00:26:32,400 Speaker 2: all that to say this that God prepared me for this, 486 00:26:32,960 --> 00:26:35,040 Speaker 2: for this venture, that he would put me in ten. 487 00:26:35,160 --> 00:26:40,639 Speaker 1: Years so clear that growing up in bump beds with 488 00:26:40,720 --> 00:26:44,240 Speaker 1: nine kids, having to fight and scrap, having to spend 489 00:26:44,280 --> 00:26:48,760 Speaker 1: two years in a hospital room, wondering if you were 490 00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:52,200 Speaker 1: going to have a leg, to the boxing, to the organizing, 491 00:26:52,560 --> 00:26:58,000 Speaker 1: to the quote organizing strong arming is another way to 492 00:26:58,040 --> 00:27:02,199 Speaker 1: say it. I think yes to the prison time, to 493 00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:09,800 Speaker 1: Lucille writing you was as violent and dysfunctional and crazy 494 00:27:09,840 --> 00:27:13,399 Speaker 1: as all of that was. That was God preparing you 495 00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:14,000 Speaker 1: for today. 496 00:27:14,720 --> 00:27:17,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, And I don't think I could have said it 497 00:27:17,080 --> 00:27:19,280 Speaker 2: any better than that. I mean, that's right on point. 498 00:27:20,720 --> 00:27:23,560 Speaker 2: So I get the rock. 499 00:27:23,880 --> 00:27:29,240 Speaker 1: It's all about build your house on the rock, not 500 00:27:29,320 --> 00:27:33,960 Speaker 1: the sand, because the rock's gonna stand. Tell me how 501 00:27:34,880 --> 00:27:36,960 Speaker 1: we're gonna get to what the rock is and what 502 00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:40,640 Speaker 1: it's done, But tell me how it started and how 503 00:27:40,640 --> 00:27:42,679 Speaker 1: it came to you and what it looked like in 504 00:27:42,720 --> 00:27:43,320 Speaker 1: the earliest. 505 00:27:44,840 --> 00:27:48,040 Speaker 2: Well, so I had I would go into I would I. 506 00:27:48,280 --> 00:27:51,320 Speaker 2: I wound up going to this church in Philly called 507 00:27:51,359 --> 00:27:54,919 Speaker 2: Calbri Chapel. Philadelphia was the biggest non denominational church in 508 00:27:54,960 --> 00:27:57,960 Speaker 2: the city. And pastor's name is Joe Polish, and who 509 00:27:58,040 --> 00:28:01,119 Speaker 2: is my pastor today? He just teaches the word. That's 510 00:28:01,160 --> 00:28:03,560 Speaker 2: all he does, you know. But I would go in 511 00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:06,960 Speaker 2: there and and it was so different than because I 512 00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:09,399 Speaker 2: used to go to Catholic. I was Catholic, raised Catholic, 513 00:28:09,440 --> 00:28:11,479 Speaker 2: go to church. And I was like, okay, I mean 514 00:28:11,600 --> 00:28:13,960 Speaker 2: it's it's different though, you know, I go in, hear 515 00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:15,879 Speaker 2: the word, I like the music. But I would go 516 00:28:15,920 --> 00:28:18,439 Speaker 2: in and I was angry. I would be angry at times, 517 00:28:19,040 --> 00:28:22,600 Speaker 2: and I never knew why. I never knew why I 518 00:28:22,680 --> 00:28:25,480 Speaker 2: was angry. And I would saying to my wife, What's 519 00:28:25,520 --> 00:28:28,560 Speaker 2: wrong with me? Like why am I feeling this way? 520 00:28:29,800 --> 00:28:33,119 Speaker 2: So come to find out, I realized what it was 521 00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:37,280 Speaker 2: I was angry is because I was. I was. I 522 00:28:37,400 --> 00:28:41,520 Speaker 2: was comfortable. I was becoming comfortable, you know, you know 523 00:28:41,720 --> 00:28:48,600 Speaker 2: I I was getting comfortable with my life. And I 524 00:28:48,680 --> 00:28:51,800 Speaker 2: was married. Right at this point, I had a child 525 00:28:52,040 --> 00:28:55,760 Speaker 2: at forty years old, my first child. You know, you know, 526 00:28:56,320 --> 00:29:00,120 Speaker 2: I had opened a business bill. I wanted to be 527 00:29:00,480 --> 00:29:03,400 Speaker 2: a business owners owner so bad when I. 528 00:29:03,400 --> 00:29:07,200 Speaker 1: Was in what I opened, Yeah, don't tell me roofing, 529 00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:10,080 Speaker 1: well listen, so so hear me out. 530 00:29:10,120 --> 00:29:14,400 Speaker 2: Though I was, I was, I wanted. Look, remember I 531 00:29:14,880 --> 00:29:17,520 Speaker 2: got an eighth grade education. When I was in prison, 532 00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:20,720 Speaker 2: I got I walked down the aisle man I got 533 00:29:20,760 --> 00:29:25,960 Speaker 2: the cap and gown Switzerland, graduated. I wanted to at 534 00:29:26,000 --> 00:29:29,560 Speaker 2: Louisiana State. You know, took courses I was. I was 535 00:29:29,640 --> 00:29:33,480 Speaker 2: registered for Penn State. So I got twenty one diplomas. Man, 536 00:29:33,680 --> 00:29:37,320 Speaker 2: I I did everything you can imagine to better myself. 537 00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:41,480 Speaker 2: And I hooked up with some bright, brilliant men that 538 00:29:41,520 --> 00:29:45,560 Speaker 2: were articulate, and I learned from all of them. Now 539 00:29:45,600 --> 00:29:48,040 Speaker 2: I wasn't you know all of them. I learned everything 540 00:29:48,080 --> 00:29:52,640 Speaker 2: I could everybody. But I wanted to become I wanted 541 00:29:52,680 --> 00:29:55,520 Speaker 2: to be a contractor, a roof and contractor, you know, 542 00:29:56,160 --> 00:29:59,040 Speaker 2: because I wanted to be successful. I knew and as 543 00:29:59,080 --> 00:30:01,560 Speaker 2: I look at the right, I knew that I wanted 544 00:30:01,560 --> 00:30:06,560 Speaker 2: to be successful. But I was barred for life. So 545 00:30:07,160 --> 00:30:10,640 Speaker 2: I was barred for life in the construction industry. So 546 00:30:10,720 --> 00:30:14,400 Speaker 2: I get out and sure enough, up I wound up 547 00:30:14,440 --> 00:30:19,320 Speaker 2: working at an autobody shop and as a as a manager, 548 00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:21,640 Speaker 2: learning because I could always I was always good with men. 549 00:30:21,720 --> 00:30:26,280 Speaker 2: But I started to learn learn that I want up 550 00:30:26,360 --> 00:30:33,120 Speaker 2: managing to make O and then I became an insurance appraiser. Right, 551 00:30:33,920 --> 00:30:37,600 Speaker 2: I worked for all that. Like I I was a subcontractor, 552 00:30:37,680 --> 00:30:41,200 Speaker 2: you know, ten ninety nine employee I had my own name. 553 00:30:41,320 --> 00:30:44,360 Speaker 2: It was I loved it. I do like ten fifteen 554 00:30:44,400 --> 00:30:46,120 Speaker 2: cars at day. I made so much, you know, it 555 00:30:46,160 --> 00:30:49,280 Speaker 2: was great. Then they found out my conviction. They want 556 00:30:49,360 --> 00:30:51,200 Speaker 2: to take my license off me. I'm like, you got 557 00:30:51,200 --> 00:30:53,680 Speaker 2: to be kidding me. I was so so you know 558 00:30:53,680 --> 00:30:56,000 Speaker 2: what I said. I said, listen, I fought it and 559 00:30:56,040 --> 00:30:57,920 Speaker 2: I wanted and I got my license. I still have 560 00:30:58,000 --> 00:31:00,920 Speaker 2: it to this day. I opened up my home collision shop. 561 00:31:01,960 --> 00:31:03,200 Speaker 1: Wow, that's cool. 562 00:31:03,320 --> 00:31:07,800 Speaker 2: And so for the first But unbeknownst to me, God 563 00:31:07,880 --> 00:31:11,880 Speaker 2: allowed that to happen because at forty I opened my business. 564 00:31:12,240 --> 00:31:16,080 Speaker 2: At forty five, the rock started, and that was seed 565 00:31:16,160 --> 00:31:20,320 Speaker 2: money to purchase our first building. Now I don't own anything, 566 00:31:20,640 --> 00:31:22,640 Speaker 2: you know. Now you know at first I put my 567 00:31:22,680 --> 00:31:24,880 Speaker 2: house up. But now it's not my name. I don't 568 00:31:24,880 --> 00:31:27,480 Speaker 2: own anything. Something happens to me or it goes to 569 00:31:27,920 --> 00:31:34,600 Speaker 2: you know. So so but I was uncomfortable because God, 570 00:31:34,840 --> 00:31:36,440 Speaker 2: it was like the Lord was saying, you need to 571 00:31:36,440 --> 00:31:38,520 Speaker 2: get you. I got something else for you. So I 572 00:31:38,600 --> 00:31:42,960 Speaker 2: started the rock. It was okay, explain the start. It's 573 00:31:42,960 --> 00:31:45,600 Speaker 2: okay to start. Oh, so here, what's okay? So here's 574 00:31:45,600 --> 00:31:48,360 Speaker 2: what I did. I met with Joe hann right, and 575 00:31:48,400 --> 00:31:51,360 Speaker 2: I say his name because he like they do all 576 00:31:51,400 --> 00:31:54,240 Speaker 2: the UFC boxing all over the country. Right now, there's 577 00:31:54,240 --> 00:31:56,160 Speaker 2: a dear friend of mine, you know, and he just 578 00:31:56,200 --> 00:31:59,200 Speaker 2: recently passed and Junior is running it. They have an 579 00:31:59,240 --> 00:32:03,600 Speaker 2: amazing operation. So I said, Joe said listen, because I 580 00:32:03,680 --> 00:32:06,920 Speaker 2: left training at his gym before, I says, I want 581 00:32:06,960 --> 00:32:08,760 Speaker 2: to start this ministry. And I know you got you 582 00:32:08,840 --> 00:32:10,880 Speaker 2: got a second floor. He gave me the keys, and 583 00:32:10,880 --> 00:32:13,280 Speaker 2: that's where I started. So I went back to the 584 00:32:13,320 --> 00:32:15,840 Speaker 2: same gym that I started them are kidding, No, I 585 00:32:15,840 --> 00:32:18,800 Speaker 2: went right back there, right, But I gave the gospel 586 00:32:19,440 --> 00:32:22,200 Speaker 2: so I would bring the kids in and they can train. 587 00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:26,160 Speaker 2: But on Thursday we sip back. We we all get 588 00:32:26,200 --> 00:32:30,080 Speaker 2: together and I give a twenty minute message that there's 589 00:32:30,160 --> 00:32:32,280 Speaker 2: hope in the Lord and this is the reason why 590 00:32:32,440 --> 00:32:35,360 Speaker 2: and we and that was you know, that started and 591 00:32:35,520 --> 00:32:38,760 Speaker 2: that's the rock. So that's that's where it started there. 592 00:32:38,800 --> 00:32:41,640 Speaker 2: So then nine months later we go into this into 593 00:32:41,680 --> 00:32:47,720 Speaker 2: this building, right, no windows, it was it was a 594 00:32:47,800 --> 00:32:50,080 Speaker 2: sporting goods store for many years in Philly. So we 595 00:32:50,160 --> 00:32:53,320 Speaker 2: go in, no windows, no nothing, prostitutes in there. I 596 00:32:53,320 --> 00:32:56,840 Speaker 2: mean crazy crazy, and people thought I was nuts put 597 00:32:56,920 --> 00:32:59,600 Speaker 2: the house up, and you know, I just knew that's 598 00:32:59,600 --> 00:33:01,320 Speaker 2: something good can come out a US. I didn't know 599 00:33:01,360 --> 00:33:03,920 Speaker 2: what I think we can establish by now you've been 600 00:33:04,000 --> 00:33:13,120 Speaker 2: nuts from anyway. So we we get in there and 601 00:33:13,360 --> 00:33:16,840 Speaker 2: so the first guy I see in the back, he's 602 00:33:16,840 --> 00:33:22,440 Speaker 2: got two rot Willer's dogs with a an SU Mercedes 603 00:33:22,600 --> 00:33:31,520 Speaker 2: s UV. And I look at him. I said, okay, 604 00:33:32,640 --> 00:33:39,520 Speaker 2: all right, you see nine years before that he uh 605 00:33:40,400 --> 00:33:41,720 Speaker 2: he testified against me. 606 00:33:42,360 --> 00:33:42,840 Speaker 1: No way. 607 00:33:44,080 --> 00:33:48,560 Speaker 2: And the FBI agent leans back and he turns up 608 00:33:48,600 --> 00:33:53,840 Speaker 2: this tape of him getting brutalized because he was doing 609 00:33:53,880 --> 00:33:56,400 Speaker 2: something on a on a in Kensington on a Saturday. 610 00:33:56,400 --> 00:33:58,240 Speaker 2: I'm an organizer. I see, I said, what are you doing? 611 00:33:58,240 --> 00:34:00,760 Speaker 2: I'm playing baseball? Said can I get get on a team? 612 00:34:01,120 --> 00:34:02,960 Speaker 2: And he come down. So I told my talk to 613 00:34:03,080 --> 00:34:06,320 Speaker 2: my boss. He said handle it. Well. He came in 614 00:34:06,320 --> 00:34:10,600 Speaker 2: in the rock from other room, but this time the 615 00:34:10,719 --> 00:34:13,960 Speaker 2: FBI was listening, and and so he came in and 616 00:34:14,000 --> 00:34:15,960 Speaker 2: he got he got he got a shell akan you 617 00:34:16,000 --> 00:34:18,839 Speaker 2: know what I mean? He had handled you know. And 618 00:34:18,920 --> 00:34:20,920 Speaker 2: I said to my code defender as he was saying, yeah, 619 00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:22,640 Speaker 2: that's him, buddy OS when I says, if I ever 620 00:34:22,680 --> 00:34:24,560 Speaker 2: see him again, I'm going to take his tongue out 621 00:34:24,560 --> 00:34:26,200 Speaker 2: of his mouth and I'm going to kill him with 622 00:34:26,280 --> 00:34:28,799 Speaker 2: his tongue. I'll strangle him with his tongue. That's how 623 00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:31,279 Speaker 2: angry I was. And sure enough I saw him. I 624 00:34:31,320 --> 00:34:34,239 Speaker 2: hugged him. I said, I love you, man, And he 625 00:34:34,440 --> 00:34:38,160 Speaker 2: was my neighbor to this day. We personally when you 626 00:34:38,200 --> 00:34:40,680 Speaker 2: walked up to him, did he oh yeah, he knew 627 00:34:40,680 --> 00:34:45,480 Speaker 2: what I was. Yeah, yeah, yeah, he probably yeah, oh yeah, No, 628 00:34:45,640 --> 00:34:49,120 Speaker 2: he was definitely shaken by it. But I grabbed him, man, 629 00:34:49,160 --> 00:34:51,600 Speaker 2: I said, I'm a new creation. I'm a new man. 630 00:34:51,920 --> 00:34:54,320 Speaker 2: I ain't. I thought my old ways had passed away. Behold, 631 00:34:54,360 --> 00:34:59,000 Speaker 2: the Bible says everything becomes new. So so he he 632 00:34:59,160 --> 00:35:03,600 Speaker 2: was like, Wow, but his building that we have as 633 00:35:03,640 --> 00:35:07,439 Speaker 2: our sanctuary on a Sunday, where's two three hundred people 634 00:35:07,480 --> 00:35:11,799 Speaker 2: who come on a Sunday. That was his building that 635 00:35:11,840 --> 00:35:12,560 Speaker 2: we purchased. 636 00:35:13,480 --> 00:35:16,960 Speaker 1: Yes, Yes, the guy that testified against you, Yes, that 637 00:35:17,080 --> 00:35:19,760 Speaker 1: you were going to choke him out with his own tongue. 638 00:35:20,320 --> 00:35:24,640 Speaker 2: I would have done that too, and back then, not now, 639 00:35:24,960 --> 00:35:25,400 Speaker 2: of course. 640 00:35:26,800 --> 00:35:27,160 Speaker 1: Yeah. 641 00:35:27,239 --> 00:35:29,400 Speaker 2: So that's that's that's kind of interesting. 642 00:35:29,520 --> 00:35:33,360 Speaker 1: So that's that kind of interesting, buddy, that's crazy. 643 00:35:33,560 --> 00:35:37,080 Speaker 2: I know. Well, so we take this building over and 644 00:35:37,719 --> 00:35:40,560 Speaker 2: we have little we had little or nothing. We and 645 00:35:40,560 --> 00:35:43,759 Speaker 2: and and people thought that I was, you know what's 646 00:35:43,800 --> 00:35:46,480 Speaker 2: going on? You know what's not with this kid? You 647 00:35:46,520 --> 00:35:49,920 Speaker 2: know what's going on? Because I moved out to Philadelphia, 648 00:35:50,120 --> 00:35:53,160 Speaker 2: I got it. I wound up buying a house, beautiful home, 649 00:35:53,200 --> 00:35:56,920 Speaker 2: a single home you know, called place called Yardley. It's 650 00:35:56,960 --> 00:36:00,279 Speaker 2: beautiful place, suburbs. You know. 651 00:36:01,320 --> 00:36:03,560 Speaker 1: My kid lived in Philly for about two years, one 652 00:36:03,560 --> 00:36:07,560 Speaker 1: of my four kids. Yeah, no way. And we went 653 00:36:07,640 --> 00:36:10,120 Speaker 1: all over Philly looking around and stuff. I've been through 654 00:36:10,200 --> 00:36:11,040 Speaker 1: yard Oh. 655 00:36:10,840 --> 00:36:14,320 Speaker 2: Wow, that is amazing. That is so funny. 656 00:36:14,600 --> 00:36:18,640 Speaker 1: Another person we highlighted once called that, Uh that's great. 657 00:36:19,120 --> 00:36:23,040 Speaker 1: A lady named Anne Mallam who started a thing called 658 00:36:23,080 --> 00:36:26,720 Speaker 1: Back on my Feet. She started that in Philly too. Really, 659 00:36:26,800 --> 00:36:28,840 Speaker 1: it's a running club for the homeless. I don't know 660 00:36:28,840 --> 00:36:31,719 Speaker 1: if you've ever heard of it, but it's amazing. Yeah yeah, 661 00:36:31,760 --> 00:36:32,480 Speaker 1: yeah yeah. 662 00:36:32,520 --> 00:36:36,000 Speaker 2: So anyway, so we buy, you know, and then I 663 00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:39,960 Speaker 2: have my business brother. I became the worst business owner. 664 00:36:41,400 --> 00:36:43,799 Speaker 2: I was doing great for a minute there, I'm like, 665 00:36:43,800 --> 00:36:49,520 Speaker 2: what is happening? So I remember calling my wife untelling. 666 00:36:49,840 --> 00:36:53,880 Speaker 2: I said, so we got to sell our house, so 667 00:36:53,920 --> 00:36:57,680 Speaker 2: I sold the business. I sold my house. I want 668 00:36:57,760 --> 00:36:59,720 Speaker 2: to move right into Kensington, but I had to settle 669 00:36:59,719 --> 00:37:02,960 Speaker 2: for miles away. I wanted to be in walking distance, 670 00:37:03,000 --> 00:37:06,080 Speaker 2: you know. So we we grabbed a row home, you know. 671 00:37:06,360 --> 00:37:09,880 Speaker 2: And my wife didn't say a word. She came with me. 672 00:37:10,120 --> 00:37:11,160 Speaker 1: And I'm a good woman. 673 00:37:11,680 --> 00:37:16,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, amazing. And I remember the first year brother, I 674 00:37:16,120 --> 00:37:20,320 Speaker 2: was living below poverty level. I had savings and I 675 00:37:21,080 --> 00:37:23,359 Speaker 2: didn't own the bricks to the building. So I owned 676 00:37:23,360 --> 00:37:25,719 Speaker 2: the business. So I sold the business to the guy 677 00:37:25,760 --> 00:37:27,960 Speaker 2: and he was supposed to pay every month, you know, 678 00:37:28,080 --> 00:37:31,120 Speaker 2: and this and that and that didn't work out. But 679 00:37:31,200 --> 00:37:33,680 Speaker 2: I remember somebody telling me saying, look, you do the 680 00:37:33,719 --> 00:37:37,600 Speaker 2: Lord's work, I will provide, you know. And I didn't 681 00:37:37,680 --> 00:37:40,520 Speaker 2: understand that whole thing of trusting in that, you know, 682 00:37:40,640 --> 00:37:44,480 Speaker 2: and and I ultimately I trust it. And God provides 683 00:37:44,760 --> 00:37:47,680 Speaker 2: all the time. Where he guides, He provides. They tell 684 00:37:47,719 --> 00:37:49,799 Speaker 2: all of our missionaries to come in, and we got 685 00:37:49,840 --> 00:37:51,600 Speaker 2: them from all over the country. They live there, you 686 00:37:51,640 --> 00:37:54,799 Speaker 2: know where. God if you if you're called and you're 687 00:37:54,800 --> 00:37:57,440 Speaker 2: called to do a work, he will provide all of 688 00:37:57,440 --> 00:37:58,719 Speaker 2: your needs. 689 00:38:02,040 --> 00:38:22,160 Speaker 1: We'll be right back. H H. So in the early days, 690 00:38:22,280 --> 00:38:23,640 Speaker 1: what the rock do. 691 00:38:24,520 --> 00:38:29,680 Speaker 2: Okay, so the whole idea and we in the early days, 692 00:38:29,800 --> 00:38:31,640 Speaker 2: it was all just boxing. 693 00:38:32,880 --> 00:38:35,640 Speaker 1: And you reaching out to kids in boxing and trying 694 00:38:35,680 --> 00:38:37,239 Speaker 1: to share the gospel with them. 695 00:38:37,520 --> 00:38:41,160 Speaker 2: Yes, that's the whole Thousands of kids have heard heard 696 00:38:41,200 --> 00:38:44,960 Speaker 2: the gospel. It's not my responsibility to make somebody a Christian. 697 00:38:45,880 --> 00:38:49,800 Speaker 2: That's not who you know, we're not robots. Give them, 698 00:38:50,560 --> 00:38:52,400 Speaker 2: give them the hope in Christ that he has a 699 00:38:52,440 --> 00:38:55,200 Speaker 2: purpose and a plan for their lives. There's no throwaways. 700 00:38:55,360 --> 00:38:57,640 Speaker 2: So when I see these kids you know that have 701 00:38:57,719 --> 00:39:02,200 Speaker 2: no father figures, that have no goals, that have nothing planned, 702 00:39:02,200 --> 00:39:05,359 Speaker 2: that that that don't know that there they don't have 703 00:39:05,440 --> 00:39:09,239 Speaker 2: nothing going for their lives. And uh and then it 704 00:39:09,400 --> 00:39:13,080 Speaker 2: then it becomes life skills and teaching them let your 705 00:39:13,160 --> 00:39:15,360 Speaker 2: yes be yes and you know be non. So we 706 00:39:15,480 --> 00:39:18,080 Speaker 2: come into a building it wasn't fit for a ghetto 707 00:39:18,160 --> 00:39:21,359 Speaker 2: rat to live in, and and we took it one 708 00:39:21,480 --> 00:39:25,200 Speaker 2: room at a time, and when we got materials, you know, 709 00:39:25,360 --> 00:39:28,359 Speaker 2: we we we showed the kids, Okay, this is what 710 00:39:28,440 --> 00:39:30,799 Speaker 2: you have when you pray, this is what you have. 711 00:39:30,960 --> 00:39:33,920 Speaker 2: We had currosene heaters. It was just a you know, 712 00:39:34,040 --> 00:39:36,000 Speaker 2: one room at a time Boom it was you know, 713 00:39:36,480 --> 00:39:39,640 Speaker 2: twenty one. It's an eighteen thousand square foot foot building 714 00:39:39,640 --> 00:39:42,839 Speaker 2: with three stories, you know, and and they would see 715 00:39:42,880 --> 00:39:47,360 Speaker 2: us one room. This was four we purchased it. The 716 00:39:47,440 --> 00:39:52,760 Speaker 2: center now well, I mean it now it's it's it's old, 717 00:39:53,280 --> 00:39:56,360 Speaker 2: but it's nice. It's clean, like you eat up the floors. 718 00:39:56,400 --> 00:39:58,360 Speaker 2: I mean, people when people come in. We've had the 719 00:39:58,400 --> 00:40:01,399 Speaker 2: governors of Pennsylvania may we just had the Maridown as 720 00:40:01,400 --> 00:40:06,120 Speaker 2: she did her second a town hall like we have 721 00:40:06,280 --> 00:40:08,399 Speaker 2: every You wouldn't believe the people to come in there. 722 00:40:08,440 --> 00:40:12,640 Speaker 2: I mean, you know, like but not not not not bragging. 723 00:40:12,760 --> 00:40:15,239 Speaker 2: It's just a fact. We have tremendous favor now, you know, 724 00:40:15,280 --> 00:40:18,040 Speaker 2: because they don't. Now they know I'm not nuts, you know, well, 725 00:40:18,080 --> 00:40:22,200 Speaker 2: I mean I'm nuts for Jesus right now. That's you know, 726 00:40:22,280 --> 00:40:23,680 Speaker 2: I'm not for Jesus. 727 00:40:23,680 --> 00:40:28,200 Speaker 1: So tell me what It started with just outreach and 728 00:40:28,280 --> 00:40:30,920 Speaker 1: trying to minister to kids who were in boxing, who 729 00:40:31,040 --> 00:40:34,480 Speaker 1: had holes in their life. And let's be honest. You know, 730 00:40:35,239 --> 00:40:37,400 Speaker 1: kids that grow up with silver spoons in their mouth 731 00:40:37,880 --> 00:40:41,360 Speaker 1: rarely put on headgear. The kids that are in the 732 00:40:41,400 --> 00:40:46,840 Speaker 1: boxing world come from lower to middle income status. Typically. 733 00:40:46,920 --> 00:40:49,040 Speaker 1: I mean, that's just the truth. You just don't see 734 00:40:49,080 --> 00:40:51,960 Speaker 1: a lot of guys in boxing that came up, you know. 735 00:40:52,560 --> 00:40:58,640 Speaker 1: So and the truth about that is that's where the 736 00:40:58,719 --> 00:41:02,920 Speaker 1: largest group of young, strapping boys trying to figure it 737 00:41:02,960 --> 00:41:08,040 Speaker 1: out that have holes in their lives. Yes, and so 738 00:41:08,160 --> 00:41:10,920 Speaker 1: you start filling those yes, and. 739 00:41:12,280 --> 00:41:16,680 Speaker 2: Tell me the progression. Yeah, I mean the first time 740 00:41:17,960 --> 00:41:21,440 Speaker 2: is that you know, I developed, We developed a team 741 00:41:21,560 --> 00:41:24,320 Speaker 2: of kids, you know, and there was probably like maybe 742 00:41:24,560 --> 00:41:28,879 Speaker 2: thirteen fourteen solid kids, you know, and that's the key. 743 00:41:28,960 --> 00:41:30,680 Speaker 2: You got to get a core. You got to get 744 00:41:30,680 --> 00:41:33,600 Speaker 2: that core. And so we've had several cores over the 745 00:41:33,680 --> 00:41:37,319 Speaker 2: last twenty years. Many of our kids are homeowners now, 746 00:41:38,040 --> 00:41:41,520 Speaker 2: you know, many of our kids have have trade jobs 747 00:41:41,600 --> 00:41:48,279 Speaker 2: that whether it's operating, engineer, carpenter, plumber, electrician. I mean, yeah, 748 00:41:48,320 --> 00:41:51,120 Speaker 2: it is amazing, man, it's amazing. Where do those kids 749 00:41:51,239 --> 00:41:56,160 Speaker 2: go had they not well, well, listen, dead or prison 750 00:41:57,160 --> 00:42:00,800 Speaker 2: dead or prison Like we're literally we're a war zone 751 00:42:01,160 --> 00:42:01,640 Speaker 2: right now. 752 00:42:02,040 --> 00:42:02,879 Speaker 1: Tell me about that. 753 00:42:03,160 --> 00:42:04,720 Speaker 2: We're in a war zone right now. 754 00:42:04,880 --> 00:42:07,680 Speaker 1: You mean the Rock and the Kensington where where. 755 00:42:07,640 --> 00:42:10,520 Speaker 2: Are where our ministry is. We're in the center of 756 00:42:10,560 --> 00:42:15,320 Speaker 2: a war zone where we're literally the New York Times 757 00:42:15,360 --> 00:42:18,439 Speaker 2: and the Post Post or Times that this thing where 758 00:42:18,480 --> 00:42:21,719 Speaker 2: they want to see where the most murders were in 759 00:42:21,800 --> 00:42:26,480 Speaker 2: the country. So they found this place. Sixty three homicides 760 00:42:26,520 --> 00:42:30,080 Speaker 2: within a two block radius. It's two blocks from the rock. 761 00:42:30,719 --> 00:42:34,680 Speaker 2: Sixty three homicides in three years right there. Yeah, it's 762 00:42:34,719 --> 00:42:37,880 Speaker 2: a gang gang. No, it's it's no, it's not gangs. 763 00:42:37,920 --> 00:42:41,160 Speaker 2: But it's well, it's drug territorials, not gangs. It's it's 764 00:42:41,239 --> 00:42:46,920 Speaker 2: just it's just uh, stupidity, it's it's arrogance, it's ignorance, 765 00:42:47,000 --> 00:42:53,000 Speaker 2: it's it's territorial beefs. It's you know, it's it's it's you. 766 00:42:52,960 --> 00:42:57,480 Speaker 1: Know where they're at. Oh yeah, I see this. 767 00:42:58,520 --> 00:43:01,560 Speaker 2: Listen, listen, listen, see it. Look, look, let me tell 768 00:43:01,560 --> 00:43:04,600 Speaker 2: you something. You know right now where where it's an 769 00:43:04,600 --> 00:43:07,279 Speaker 2: open air drug market where I mean we we've been 770 00:43:07,320 --> 00:43:10,799 Speaker 2: designated number one in the country, Like right where we're at. 771 00:43:10,960 --> 00:43:14,640 Speaker 2: People go down there and they shoot documentaries all the time. 772 00:43:15,239 --> 00:43:17,920 Speaker 2: In fact, we don't do that anymore. We don't let 773 00:43:17,960 --> 00:43:20,440 Speaker 2: people come in unless they're going to talk about the solution. 774 00:43:21,440 --> 00:43:23,600 Speaker 2: I'll talk about I don't want the problem. We know 775 00:43:23,640 --> 00:43:26,319 Speaker 2: what the problem is. But there's a solution. Let's talk 776 00:43:26,360 --> 00:43:29,239 Speaker 2: about that. Let's put that on your camera. Let's talk 777 00:43:29,239 --> 00:43:32,919 Speaker 2: about the solution. So right now, what's going on down 778 00:43:32,960 --> 00:43:38,160 Speaker 2: there is that the the the the addicted population down there. 779 00:43:38,560 --> 00:43:40,920 Speaker 2: You can get anything you want. You want needles, you 780 00:43:41,040 --> 00:43:43,600 Speaker 2: got them. You want a crack pipe, you got them. 781 00:43:43,840 --> 00:43:45,959 Speaker 2: In fact, you want condoms, you got it. You want 782 00:43:46,239 --> 00:43:49,239 Speaker 2: you want whatever, you want to detox you got it. 783 00:43:49,280 --> 00:43:53,120 Speaker 2: You want housing, you can get anything, food, anything you want, tens. 784 00:43:53,200 --> 00:43:56,000 Speaker 1: Who's providing all those everybody? 785 00:43:56,400 --> 00:43:58,960 Speaker 2: There's there's all kinds of agencies down there that will 786 00:43:58,960 --> 00:44:03,160 Speaker 2: provide this point and CEO, no, they're all different types 787 00:44:03,160 --> 00:44:06,560 Speaker 2: of people. But my point is that they have opportunity. 788 00:44:06,960 --> 00:44:10,360 Speaker 2: The addictive population have opportunity. Okay, they have a voice 789 00:44:10,680 --> 00:44:14,640 Speaker 2: that's louder than anyone the community of Kensington right now. 790 00:44:15,120 --> 00:44:18,320 Speaker 2: They they have that that that voice about that much, 791 00:44:18,600 --> 00:44:22,480 Speaker 2: but you know, has no voice the children, they have 792 00:44:22,600 --> 00:44:29,160 Speaker 2: no voice. That's infuriating me at this point. So what so, so, 793 00:44:29,200 --> 00:44:30,719 Speaker 2: how what are we going to do about this? Is 794 00:44:30,719 --> 00:44:33,600 Speaker 2: what I feel led to do. So The Rock was 795 00:44:33,640 --> 00:44:37,920 Speaker 2: started twenty years ago through boxing, through combat sports, and 796 00:44:37,960 --> 00:44:39,720 Speaker 2: we've reached thousands of them. 797 00:44:40,480 --> 00:44:43,840 Speaker 1: I've been told okay, if you've literally reached eleven thousand, 798 00:44:44,120 --> 00:44:46,680 Speaker 1: So that's that's that's a that's an old number. 799 00:44:46,880 --> 00:44:48,040 Speaker 2: That's an old and some. 800 00:44:47,960 --> 00:44:50,360 Speaker 1: Of these kids who are street kids are now engineers 801 00:44:50,440 --> 00:44:54,080 Speaker 1: and hundred percent and you're plucking them out of that 802 00:44:54,160 --> 00:44:55,960 Speaker 1: area and doing it and you feel great about it. 803 00:44:56,000 --> 00:44:58,600 Speaker 2: But one hundred percent. But here's my point. But not 804 00:44:58,719 --> 00:45:02,440 Speaker 2: everybody wants to do comp at sports. Okay, So what 805 00:45:02,640 --> 00:45:06,920 Speaker 2: happened was or what is what's happening now is that, Okay, 806 00:45:06,960 --> 00:45:10,480 Speaker 2: we need to expand that so we can reach every kid. 807 00:45:11,400 --> 00:45:15,680 Speaker 2: So we need another building. And so there was a 808 00:45:15,719 --> 00:45:19,239 Speaker 2: building that was in the back of us that a 809 00:45:19,320 --> 00:45:21,560 Speaker 2: couple of years ago, I heard that they were selling 810 00:45:22,200 --> 00:45:25,680 Speaker 2: is the oldest boxing venue in America. From nineteen seventeen 811 00:45:25,719 --> 00:45:28,560 Speaker 2: and nineteen sixty three. They had shows every Friday there 812 00:45:28,719 --> 00:45:31,520 Speaker 2: without stop, and more world champions come out of that 813 00:45:31,640 --> 00:45:35,399 Speaker 2: place than anywhere in the country. It's unbelievable. I went 814 00:45:35,440 --> 00:45:39,120 Speaker 2: around to the building, went into the guy and he 815 00:45:39,280 --> 00:45:42,560 Speaker 2: was like Marlon Brando on the waterfront. He said, hey, 816 00:45:42,960 --> 00:45:44,560 Speaker 2: I have a hard time my guys. 817 00:45:44,239 --> 00:45:45,200 Speaker 1: Like said hey. 818 00:45:45,480 --> 00:45:47,120 Speaker 2: I said, hey, I hear you're going to sell to eat. 819 00:45:47,200 --> 00:45:50,520 Speaker 2: He says, yeah, yeah, I'm going to show it. I said, 820 00:45:51,120 --> 00:45:53,359 Speaker 2: what do you want you? What do you asking for? 821 00:45:54,320 --> 00:45:58,400 Speaker 2: Six hind of one thousand? I said, you firm with that? 822 00:45:58,880 --> 00:45:59,160 Speaker 1: Yeah? 823 00:45:59,400 --> 00:46:05,960 Speaker 2: I'm firm. I said, Can I say something to you? 824 00:46:06,080 --> 00:46:06,279 Speaker 1: Yeah? 825 00:46:06,320 --> 00:46:09,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, what's that? I said? And I got my guy 826 00:46:09,200 --> 00:46:14,479 Speaker 2: with me. He's my youth pastor. I says, if God 827 00:46:14,560 --> 00:46:17,560 Speaker 2: wants us to have this building, you can't do nothing 828 00:46:17,560 --> 00:46:20,319 Speaker 2: about it. I grabbed his head, I shook his hand. 829 00:46:20,480 --> 00:46:24,200 Speaker 2: You take care, we're going to pray. And he laughed. 830 00:46:24,280 --> 00:46:24,520 Speaker 1: Right. 831 00:46:24,600 --> 00:46:26,839 Speaker 2: Well, two months later we got anonymous chef for five 832 00:46:26,920 --> 00:46:30,520 Speaker 2: hundred thousand. We paid the other one. We purchased it 833 00:46:30,520 --> 00:46:33,120 Speaker 2: out right, So now we have a building right now. 834 00:46:33,160 --> 00:46:34,160 Speaker 1: That are you kidding? 835 00:46:34,239 --> 00:46:35,600 Speaker 2: No, we have a building right now. 836 00:46:35,760 --> 00:46:38,200 Speaker 1: And this is an Annas check that comes up after 837 00:46:38,360 --> 00:46:41,319 Speaker 1: you walk from the movie deal because they won't talk 838 00:46:41,360 --> 00:46:41,960 Speaker 1: about yourself. 839 00:46:42,000 --> 00:46:44,000 Speaker 2: That was the first one that happened. But this is 840 00:46:44,040 --> 00:46:44,680 Speaker 2: another one. 841 00:46:44,760 --> 00:46:46,600 Speaker 1: No kidding, Yeah, this was another one. 842 00:46:46,680 --> 00:46:51,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, that's an anonymous anonymous million anonymous. 843 00:46:51,560 --> 00:46:53,439 Speaker 1: Do you know where it came from? I wouldn't ask, 844 00:46:54,480 --> 00:46:57,360 Speaker 1: I think, but you don't really know for sure? 845 00:46:57,960 --> 00:46:58,560 Speaker 2: I think. 846 00:46:58,960 --> 00:47:02,040 Speaker 1: Okay, So but if you get a check and you 847 00:47:02,120 --> 00:47:04,120 Speaker 1: tell Marlon Brando, I'm buying your building. 848 00:47:04,440 --> 00:47:07,439 Speaker 2: Yeah, so we went over. No, So what happened was, see, 849 00:47:07,440 --> 00:47:10,960 Speaker 2: I don't do good with with with I have a 850 00:47:11,000 --> 00:47:14,279 Speaker 2: hard with tough guys who think they're tough. I just 851 00:47:14,400 --> 00:47:15,920 Speaker 2: I got to just back out of that, you know 852 00:47:15,960 --> 00:47:18,520 Speaker 2: what I mean. So my man here, my man, Kevin, 853 00:47:18,600 --> 00:47:21,439 Speaker 2: he went I said, yeah, yeah, he went over. He's 854 00:47:21,440 --> 00:47:24,320 Speaker 2: suave talks so like you know, he just has it. 855 00:47:24,400 --> 00:47:26,040 Speaker 2: He'll talk to you for five hours. I'll talk to 856 00:47:26,040 --> 00:47:29,239 Speaker 2: you for five minutes. That's it, you know what I mean. 857 00:47:29,480 --> 00:47:32,720 Speaker 2: So but but in all, in all fairness, it really 858 00:47:32,760 --> 00:47:36,000 Speaker 2: worked out. He got his number. I said that everybody, 859 00:47:36,080 --> 00:47:38,480 Speaker 2: you know, look, is it two months? It probably was, 860 00:47:38,560 --> 00:47:40,160 Speaker 2: But man, you can't put a price that on a 861 00:47:40,239 --> 00:47:43,640 Speaker 2: kid's head. So we've had it for you know, it's 862 00:47:43,680 --> 00:47:47,160 Speaker 2: been i mean maybe three years, and we're so we 863 00:47:47,239 --> 00:47:50,440 Speaker 2: now have a contract on record. We have a million dollars. 864 00:47:50,560 --> 00:47:53,960 Speaker 2: Now that that's and you know we're looking we're we're 865 00:47:53,960 --> 00:47:56,480 Speaker 2: looking at more of the labor now. So here's the thing. 866 00:47:56,560 --> 00:48:00,240 Speaker 2: Here's the beautiful part about the other half. So you 867 00:48:00,239 --> 00:48:04,040 Speaker 2: you remember me many years ago as an organizer barred 868 00:48:04,040 --> 00:48:07,759 Speaker 2: for life. I'm the chaplain for all the unions, all 869 00:48:07,800 --> 00:48:12,160 Speaker 2: the trade unions in the city shut off. You come on, brother, 870 00:48:12,760 --> 00:48:13,719 Speaker 2: that's crazy. 871 00:48:14,560 --> 00:48:19,360 Speaker 1: So the point was you're reaching these kids through combat sports, 872 00:48:19,760 --> 00:48:22,200 Speaker 1: and you say, these kids don't have a voice. What 873 00:48:22,239 --> 00:48:24,360 Speaker 1: are kids who don't want to box but are into 874 00:48:24,520 --> 00:48:26,200 Speaker 1: arts or baseball or. 875 00:48:26,160 --> 00:48:27,440 Speaker 2: That's our that's our spot. 876 00:48:27,680 --> 00:48:30,280 Speaker 1: So now you have the second building for the non 877 00:48:30,360 --> 00:48:36,960 Speaker 1: combat sports because and now you have art programs and music, everything. 878 00:48:36,600 --> 00:48:40,480 Speaker 2: You can imagine. So so that to me, that's where 879 00:48:40,840 --> 00:48:45,160 Speaker 2: you know, my prayer I should say is is well, 880 00:48:45,480 --> 00:48:47,400 Speaker 2: we want to hear the voices of the kids be 881 00:48:47,440 --> 00:48:51,399 Speaker 2: heard because they're born into this poverty. They didn't ask 882 00:48:51,520 --> 00:48:54,960 Speaker 2: for this, man and what And there's so many kids 883 00:48:55,000 --> 00:48:57,720 Speaker 2: that that are that are dealing with post traumaunt of stress, 884 00:48:57,719 --> 00:48:59,839 Speaker 2: this order because of what they've seen over the years. 885 00:49:00,080 --> 00:49:02,959 Speaker 1: Unshot Bang kind of like kind of like a young 886 00:49:03,000 --> 00:49:07,000 Speaker 1: buddy at thirteen, he and his four buddies watching the goshevn. 887 00:49:07,640 --> 00:49:10,240 Speaker 2: It's the same, it's the same, it's the same. Same, 888 00:49:10,400 --> 00:49:13,120 Speaker 2: it's the same. Yeah, it's the same, just a different date. 889 00:49:13,960 --> 00:49:16,720 Speaker 2: So I'm in a situation now. Man, I'm getting hills 890 00:49:16,760 --> 00:49:19,120 Speaker 2: thinking about it. You know, it's like you know, we 891 00:49:19,120 --> 00:49:22,359 Speaker 2: we are. We have a contract on record where we're 892 00:49:22,360 --> 00:49:24,360 Speaker 2: like ready to go, Lord Will in the first quarter 893 00:49:24,440 --> 00:49:27,600 Speaker 2: of twenty twenty five, we will be breaking ground and 894 00:49:27,920 --> 00:49:30,480 Speaker 2: getting this thing done for these kids. I'm excited about it. 895 00:49:30,520 --> 00:49:33,799 Speaker 2: We we we have two we purchased two two more 896 00:49:34,360 --> 00:49:38,120 Speaker 2: storefront properties we have. We own two. It's four in 897 00:49:38,160 --> 00:49:42,000 Speaker 2: a row, right storefront properties. Right one is a we 898 00:49:42,120 --> 00:49:45,640 Speaker 2: use for a homeless for the homeless population and for 899 00:49:46,280 --> 00:49:50,440 Speaker 2: addiction Bible studies all week long. The next one is 900 00:49:50,480 --> 00:49:54,000 Speaker 2: a woman's care center that we have an ultrasound and 901 00:49:54,040 --> 00:49:55,799 Speaker 2: what we deal with the women that are caught up 902 00:49:55,840 --> 00:49:59,840 Speaker 2: in pregnancies or all kind of you know, women's health issues, 903 00:50:00,080 --> 00:50:02,920 Speaker 2: women that walk in the streets. So we bring them 904 00:50:02,960 --> 00:50:06,080 Speaker 2: in and we give them an alternative you know, to 905 00:50:06,480 --> 00:50:09,200 Speaker 2: a boarding to aboarding a child. You know. So we 906 00:50:09,280 --> 00:50:11,839 Speaker 2: believe strongly in that. You know. We pray with them 907 00:50:11,880 --> 00:50:14,200 Speaker 2: and we help them in any area we can to 908 00:50:15,000 --> 00:50:18,040 Speaker 2: to to to take care of their take care of themselves. 909 00:50:18,040 --> 00:50:18,279 Speaker 1: You know. 910 00:50:18,520 --> 00:50:22,040 Speaker 2: We don't charge any money, no money. So we purchase 911 00:50:22,160 --> 00:50:26,200 Speaker 2: two more buildings too. They're just to give us. They're 912 00:50:26,239 --> 00:50:28,560 Speaker 2: twenty feet wide, one hundred and twenty deep. 913 00:50:29,120 --> 00:50:30,839 Speaker 1: Store shotgun storefront. 914 00:50:31,040 --> 00:50:33,239 Speaker 2: So the first floor of this first building is going 915 00:50:33,280 --> 00:50:36,279 Speaker 2: to be a barber shop because so many kids they 916 00:50:36,320 --> 00:50:38,160 Speaker 2: want to learn how to cut hair, So we're going 917 00:50:38,200 --> 00:50:41,680 Speaker 2: to open that up. And then the second the second 918 00:50:41,880 --> 00:50:45,560 Speaker 2: building is going to be a bakery, like we're going 919 00:50:45,600 --> 00:50:47,600 Speaker 2: to all he bro and then here do you hear this? 920 00:50:47,719 --> 00:50:50,640 Speaker 2: Now I'm excited about this. We have an opportunity to 921 00:50:50,760 --> 00:50:55,919 Speaker 2: build three apartments on each floor at six and two 922 00:50:55,960 --> 00:50:58,399 Speaker 2: efficiencies on the first floor, so we're going to build 923 00:50:58,520 --> 00:51:03,640 Speaker 2: affordable housing. We have a lot next door to the rock. 924 00:51:03,719 --> 00:51:05,960 Speaker 2: Now we have a huge tent where we would all 925 00:51:06,040 --> 00:51:08,520 Speaker 2: where we would sleep the homeless in code blue and 926 00:51:08,560 --> 00:51:11,320 Speaker 2: they would have that was unbelievable when COVID came that 927 00:51:11,400 --> 00:51:15,080 Speaker 2: shut down. So we have a donation tent so if 928 00:51:15,120 --> 00:51:18,640 Speaker 2: you came in, you you won't have to pay for anything, 929 00:51:19,000 --> 00:51:21,160 Speaker 2: but if you can afford a dollar to pay for 930 00:51:21,200 --> 00:51:24,480 Speaker 2: a coat, we would accept that donation because all that 931 00:51:24,560 --> 00:51:28,560 Speaker 2: money goes into a benevolence fund. So if somebody needs 932 00:51:28,600 --> 00:51:30,440 Speaker 2: to go to a plane ride to get home to 933 00:51:30,520 --> 00:51:33,160 Speaker 2: California because they haven't seen their parents, we like we 934 00:51:33,280 --> 00:51:36,520 Speaker 2: use that for the for that. But we just got 935 00:51:36,520 --> 00:51:40,759 Speaker 2: a grant for a five hundred thousand that's going to 936 00:51:40,760 --> 00:51:44,279 Speaker 2: allow us to build the first floor, second and the 937 00:51:44,320 --> 00:51:45,279 Speaker 2: third floor of. 938 00:51:46,840 --> 00:51:50,920 Speaker 1: You know, so from serving thirteen kids in a boxing 939 00:51:50,960 --> 00:51:54,960 Speaker 1: arena upstairs, how many people you serving now on it? 940 00:51:55,200 --> 00:51:59,040 Speaker 2: Thousands? Yeah? Oh well, well we average about one hundred 941 00:51:59,120 --> 00:52:02,719 Speaker 2: kids a night. And then we have after school we 942 00:52:02,760 --> 00:52:06,759 Speaker 2: do homeware club. Uh uh And I and and to me, 943 00:52:07,080 --> 00:52:13,160 Speaker 2: at this point, we we we are expanding like exponentiously, 944 00:52:13,320 --> 00:52:15,760 Speaker 2: like with with our with the programs, and the kids 945 00:52:15,760 --> 00:52:18,279 Speaker 2: are they're seeing hope. You see, look at you can 946 00:52:18,360 --> 00:52:20,680 Speaker 2: sell all the dope you want. I tell the dealers this, 947 00:52:21,640 --> 00:52:25,600 Speaker 2: I mean, that's that's what you do. I'm going to 948 00:52:25,680 --> 00:52:28,840 Speaker 2: give you hope. And the hope is in Christ. He 949 00:52:28,880 --> 00:52:30,880 Speaker 2: has a purpose and a plan for your life, and 950 00:52:30,880 --> 00:52:33,640 Speaker 2: that's not to see you destroy it. You know, when 951 00:52:33,680 --> 00:52:36,120 Speaker 2: you come into a relationship with Jesus, when you come 952 00:52:36,200 --> 00:52:38,560 Speaker 2: into an understanding that he loves you, that he died 953 00:52:38,600 --> 00:52:40,799 Speaker 2: on the cross for your sins, that he loves you 954 00:52:40,960 --> 00:52:43,839 Speaker 2: so much, and that he cares about you well and 955 00:52:43,840 --> 00:52:46,800 Speaker 2: and and you know, to me, they know it's real. 956 00:52:46,960 --> 00:52:50,200 Speaker 2: You know, I'm an old you know, city kid, you know, 957 00:52:50,320 --> 00:52:52,720 Speaker 2: and I don't earn. I mean, I don't get anything 958 00:52:52,719 --> 00:52:54,880 Speaker 2: to do this other than the joy of the Lord. 959 00:52:54,960 --> 00:52:55,200 Speaker 1: Man. 960 00:52:55,600 --> 00:52:59,880 Speaker 2: You know, it's powerful. It's powerful. Brother. 961 00:53:02,719 --> 00:53:15,600 Speaker 1: We'll be right back. This has become this has to 962 00:53:15,640 --> 00:53:20,920 Speaker 1: have become a This can't be cheap. Do you have 963 00:53:21,040 --> 00:53:23,760 Speaker 1: people helping you? Do you go out and raise money? 964 00:53:23,840 --> 00:53:27,200 Speaker 1: I mean we've never done that. We never raised money. 965 00:53:27,200 --> 00:53:29,880 Speaker 2: You know. The governor Wolf when he came in, he 966 00:53:29,920 --> 00:53:31,960 Speaker 2: came in like two years ago, when he was still 967 00:53:32,080 --> 00:53:33,640 Speaker 2: he was on his way out. He had about a 968 00:53:33,680 --> 00:53:36,160 Speaker 2: year ago, and he asked, he says, well, he said, 969 00:53:36,160 --> 00:53:38,799 Speaker 2: where does all this come from? And I grabbed his 970 00:53:38,920 --> 00:53:40,920 Speaker 2: hand and I knelt down with everybody there, and I 971 00:53:41,000 --> 00:53:43,560 Speaker 2: just prayed. I said, that's where it comes from. The 972 00:53:43,600 --> 00:53:47,120 Speaker 2: power prayer. I don't rely on man. I rely on 973 00:53:47,160 --> 00:53:50,000 Speaker 2: the Lord to speak to man's heart, you know, because 974 00:53:50,040 --> 00:53:55,360 Speaker 2: when that happens, it's it's it's just an amazing blessing 975 00:53:55,400 --> 00:53:57,719 Speaker 2: for that person. Because the scripture says it's better to 976 00:53:57,760 --> 00:54:00,440 Speaker 2: give than receive. That's a blessing that they have, you know. 977 00:54:00,520 --> 00:54:04,040 Speaker 2: So when people realize that, recognize that we all win, 978 00:54:04,320 --> 00:54:07,640 Speaker 2: you know. So I don't I don't know how to 979 00:54:07,680 --> 00:54:10,600 Speaker 2: ask Honestly, I'm not good at it, but it is 980 00:54:10,640 --> 00:54:11,120 Speaker 2: what it is. 981 00:54:11,719 --> 00:54:12,680 Speaker 1: How many I dos pray? 982 00:54:13,520 --> 00:54:17,759 Speaker 2: We have about we have about sixty five volunteers. We 983 00:54:17,920 --> 00:54:21,400 Speaker 2: have ninety percent if you look at our nine nineties, 984 00:54:21,600 --> 00:54:24,960 Speaker 2: ninety percent of everything that comes in goes out into outreach. 985 00:54:25,719 --> 00:54:29,479 Speaker 2: A ten percent is for salary employees. We only have two, 986 00:54:30,280 --> 00:54:33,239 Speaker 2: you know, so everybody else and then the missionary is 987 00:54:33,280 --> 00:54:37,880 Speaker 2: what they do is they they you know, they pray 988 00:54:38,400 --> 00:54:43,520 Speaker 2: and people support them, right and then through a ten 989 00:54:43,600 --> 00:54:46,560 Speaker 2: ninety nine as a ten ninety nine employee, you know, 990 00:54:46,719 --> 00:54:48,480 Speaker 2: So yeah. 991 00:54:47,800 --> 00:54:49,920 Speaker 1: What's the change in the neighborhood as a results of 992 00:54:49,960 --> 00:54:50,400 Speaker 1: this work? 993 00:54:52,640 --> 00:55:01,280 Speaker 2: Well, I look at it this way, brother, it's one child, 994 00:55:02,840 --> 00:55:08,200 Speaker 2: one family, one block at a time, and it's the 995 00:55:08,280 --> 00:55:14,919 Speaker 2: long haul. You know, God redeems us boxing don't do that, 996 00:55:15,719 --> 00:55:18,799 Speaker 2: you know, God. And when a person is tapped into 997 00:55:18,840 --> 00:55:23,879 Speaker 2: the vertical and understands you know that, you know, they 998 00:55:23,880 --> 00:55:27,480 Speaker 2: can do all things through Christ, whose strengthens and they 999 00:55:27,480 --> 00:55:29,960 Speaker 2: buy into that in a way and they believe it. 1000 00:55:31,239 --> 00:55:32,400 Speaker 2: Their world will change. 1001 00:55:32,480 --> 00:55:32,680 Speaker 1: Man. 1002 00:55:32,760 --> 00:55:35,800 Speaker 2: You know. So we're taking one kid at a time, 1003 00:55:36,400 --> 00:55:40,279 Speaker 2: you know, and we're seeing a lot of change, you know, 1004 00:55:41,120 --> 00:55:43,960 Speaker 2: because to me, you know, like I think, like you know, 1005 00:55:44,000 --> 00:55:46,440 Speaker 2: when a family, when a family gets like we have 1006 00:55:46,600 --> 00:55:49,400 Speaker 2: now we have kids because I always wanted the kids. 1007 00:55:49,680 --> 00:55:53,000 Speaker 2: Now it's the families that are coming at church. So 1008 00:55:53,080 --> 00:55:56,560 Speaker 2: on Sunday we have a you know, yeah, half the 1009 00:55:56,640 --> 00:56:02,880 Speaker 2: population in our church where former drug deal there's drug addicts, prostitutes. 1010 00:56:03,320 --> 00:56:07,920 Speaker 1: I bet church at this place is quite diverse. 1011 00:56:08,719 --> 00:56:12,040 Speaker 2: It is, it is, it is starting with the pastor 1012 00:56:12,320 --> 00:56:17,760 Speaker 2: on down. Really yeah, yeah, yeah, oh yeah. 1013 00:56:18,320 --> 00:56:20,840 Speaker 1: One of the one of the things I've read and 1014 00:56:20,920 --> 00:56:24,320 Speaker 1: heard the many times, and nothing I'm saying here is unique, 1015 00:56:24,400 --> 00:56:30,160 Speaker 1: but that the most segregated day in the United States 1016 00:56:30,200 --> 00:56:34,760 Speaker 1: is Sunday, and that that is, that is the irony 1017 00:56:34,800 --> 00:56:39,120 Speaker 1: of that, is that that is a sin of sinners. 1018 00:56:40,000 --> 00:56:45,799 Speaker 1: You know, that's a major sin. That the that the 1019 00:56:45,920 --> 00:56:53,200 Speaker 1: very people who are called to be hopeful and peaceful 1020 00:56:54,080 --> 00:57:00,839 Speaker 1: and full of grace worship in a way that is 1021 00:57:02,280 --> 00:57:08,319 Speaker 1: unbelievably segregated. But then I hear what you're doing, and 1022 00:57:08,800 --> 00:57:11,200 Speaker 1: I gotta believe y'all are the antithesis of that. 1023 00:57:14,040 --> 00:57:19,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, we you come as you are, you know, you 1024 00:57:19,120 --> 00:57:22,200 Speaker 2: come and take all comers, all comers. We don't, we 1025 00:57:22,240 --> 00:57:26,320 Speaker 2: don't everyone. I don't care if you smell. You know 1026 00:57:26,520 --> 00:57:32,080 Speaker 2: you're you know you're homeless. You have no shoes, but 1027 00:57:32,360 --> 00:57:36,080 Speaker 2: when you leave, you'll have shoes. You need to shower, 1028 00:57:36,160 --> 00:57:40,800 Speaker 2: will get your shower. But at some point, at some point, 1029 00:57:40,840 --> 00:57:42,760 Speaker 2: look at you can give a kid, a person a 1030 00:57:42,840 --> 00:57:44,760 Speaker 2: fish for a day, to feed them for a day, 1031 00:57:44,840 --> 00:57:46,480 Speaker 2: but you teach them how to fish. You've heard that. 1032 00:57:47,040 --> 00:57:49,760 Speaker 2: It's a lot of truth to that. And so when 1033 00:57:49,760 --> 00:57:51,960 Speaker 2: it when a person comes in, I'll give you an example. 1034 00:57:51,960 --> 00:57:53,800 Speaker 2: I'll give you an example. So we're on the radio, 1035 00:57:54,440 --> 00:57:58,680 Speaker 2: we just actually just stop that. We run for several years, 1036 00:57:58,720 --> 00:58:03,280 Speaker 2: you know, But one one Saturday, one Sunday, rather, I said, 1037 00:58:03,280 --> 00:58:07,200 Speaker 2: look at, give me three couples. So three couples come up, 1038 00:58:08,360 --> 00:58:11,480 Speaker 2: and unbeknown I married all three of them. These I 1039 00:58:11,760 --> 00:58:17,800 Speaker 2: didn't pick this, and within seven years all the women 1040 00:58:17,840 --> 00:58:23,520 Speaker 2: were former prostitutes. One was was taking in by her 1041 00:58:23,640 --> 00:58:27,240 Speaker 2: John into his house for a year. And you know 1042 00:58:27,280 --> 00:58:31,840 Speaker 2: what I mean, she was she was captive. Yes, she married. 1043 00:58:32,080 --> 00:58:35,120 Speaker 2: I married her with a guy who was locked up 1044 00:58:35,160 --> 00:58:39,800 Speaker 2: forty nine times. All three of them, the couples, it 1045 00:58:40,040 --> 00:58:43,720 Speaker 2: just their lives were transformed because of what Christ did 1046 00:58:43,840 --> 00:58:47,080 Speaker 2: and the and they and what they believe to me. 1047 00:58:48,400 --> 00:58:51,640 Speaker 2: That's a powerful statement. And that's what happens every week. 1048 00:58:52,640 --> 00:58:56,040 Speaker 2: You know, that's what makes change. That's what's going to change. Uh, 1049 00:58:56,120 --> 00:58:58,480 Speaker 2: you know, community, I think that's that's I don't know 1050 00:58:58,520 --> 00:59:02,000 Speaker 2: of any other way. I mean, I'll do my part. 1051 00:59:03,720 --> 00:59:06,440 Speaker 2: Then when they tap into the vine to that vertical. 1052 00:59:06,880 --> 00:59:09,640 Speaker 2: That's why you know, I was raised as a Democrat 1053 00:59:09,760 --> 00:59:15,040 Speaker 2: not to get into politics, you know, signed on as 1054 00:59:15,320 --> 00:59:18,640 Speaker 2: a republic Republican because of the you know, the sanctity 1055 00:59:18,720 --> 00:59:21,160 Speaker 2: of life and all that. But now I'm a vertecrat. 1056 00:59:21,960 --> 00:59:25,000 Speaker 2: You know, Now you're a what a vertecrat? A verticraate? 1057 00:59:27,680 --> 00:59:32,720 Speaker 1: If he said, yeah, you know, I don't want to 1058 00:59:32,720 --> 00:59:35,520 Speaker 1: get too deep into my own narrative on that, but 1059 00:59:35,640 --> 00:59:40,000 Speaker 1: there is there is political law. There's man law, and 1060 00:59:40,040 --> 00:59:44,640 Speaker 1: there's God's God's law, and they often intersect, but they 1061 00:59:44,840 --> 00:59:48,400 Speaker 1: rarely completely agree. And you got to decide what law 1062 00:59:48,480 --> 00:59:49,560 Speaker 1: is going to govern your life. 1063 00:59:50,640 --> 00:59:54,480 Speaker 2: Man. That's that's a that's a plaque. That's plaque material. Bro, 1064 00:59:54,600 --> 00:59:57,960 Speaker 2: Do you have right on a plaque? Man? That is nice? 1065 00:59:58,720 --> 00:59:59,520 Speaker 2: Isn't that nice? 1066 01:00:00,080 --> 01:00:03,680 Speaker 1: Hey? Man? If somebody wants to hear more about the 1067 01:00:03,760 --> 01:00:07,360 Speaker 1: rock or hear more about you, it's our website. Is 1068 01:00:07,400 --> 01:00:10,400 Speaker 1: there an email? What? How do people find the Rock 1069 01:00:10,480 --> 01:00:13,600 Speaker 1: and find buddy after listening this that want to learn more, 1070 01:00:13,680 --> 01:00:16,480 Speaker 1: especially folks fromout the northeast that might want to support you. 1071 01:00:16,600 --> 01:00:20,120 Speaker 2: Yeah, well, you know they can go on w w 1072 01:00:20,400 --> 01:00:24,040 Speaker 2: W the Rockphilly dot org and that'll give you everything 1073 01:00:24,080 --> 01:00:27,480 Speaker 2: you need to know, you know, and uh, that's our website. 1074 01:00:27,560 --> 01:00:28,720 Speaker 2: And I don't know what else. 1075 01:00:29,200 --> 01:00:31,440 Speaker 1: You know, get somebody email you if they got questions. 1076 01:00:31,720 --> 01:00:34,240 Speaker 2: There's an email right there that goes right into our 1077 01:00:34,440 --> 01:00:36,280 Speaker 2: into our and I'll get it. You know, it goes 1078 01:00:36,360 --> 01:00:38,680 Speaker 2: right in there. It's got an email right there. Any questions, 1079 01:00:38,880 --> 01:00:43,560 Speaker 2: absolutely rock filling. It's it's the Rockphilly dot org. 1080 01:00:43,760 --> 01:00:47,000 Speaker 1: ROTA r O C D t h E r O 1081 01:00:47,040 --> 01:00:52,000 Speaker 1: c K p h I L l Y dot org. Yes, yeah, 1082 01:00:52,040 --> 01:00:54,040 Speaker 1: and they can find all about. 1083 01:00:53,880 --> 01:00:56,720 Speaker 2: Everything they want. Everything they can find out. We're on there. 1084 01:00:57,080 --> 01:01:01,760 Speaker 2: My mog shot are most every everything. No, it's good. Yeah, 1085 01:01:01,840 --> 01:01:04,200 Speaker 2: I appreciate this, an opportunity to meet with you. 1086 01:01:04,200 --> 01:01:05,640 Speaker 1: You know, I loved it, buddy. 1087 01:01:05,720 --> 01:01:08,640 Speaker 2: Now we're starting a podcast at the Rock. 1088 01:01:08,920 --> 01:01:09,280 Speaker 1: Good. 1089 01:01:09,440 --> 01:01:11,480 Speaker 2: So we're gonna have to fly you down here one day. 1090 01:01:11,760 --> 01:01:15,160 Speaker 1: Maybe one day I'll come visit you. I'd love to, buddy. 1091 01:01:15,200 --> 01:01:20,160 Speaker 1: It's close to the holidays, and I cannot tell you 1092 01:01:20,200 --> 01:01:23,320 Speaker 1: how much I appreciate you taking time to come down 1093 01:01:23,400 --> 01:01:26,280 Speaker 1: and visit with us and share your story. And you 1094 01:01:26,440 --> 01:01:32,320 Speaker 1: are my friend, an inspiration. To think of it, of 1095 01:01:32,400 --> 01:01:34,600 Speaker 1: a kid growing up in a broken home, one of 1096 01:01:34,640 --> 01:01:39,560 Speaker 1: eleven who that gum near got their leg amputated, who 1097 01:01:39,640 --> 01:01:42,680 Speaker 1: ended up finding purpose and boxing, who fought all over 1098 01:01:42,720 --> 01:01:47,560 Speaker 1: the world, represented the country, who then became a union 1099 01:01:47,720 --> 01:01:50,040 Speaker 1: You can call it a recruiter or whatever, but it's 1100 01:01:51,120 --> 01:01:54,600 Speaker 1: that job title has a lot, but used your skills 1101 01:01:54,640 --> 01:01:56,920 Speaker 1: for violence and a job, who ended up in the 1102 01:01:57,080 --> 01:02:03,800 Speaker 1: pin and is now engaged in saving lives in his hometown. Man, 1103 01:02:04,680 --> 01:02:08,040 Speaker 1: what a trip, what a story. And we always talk 1104 01:02:08,080 --> 01:02:10,400 Speaker 1: about it's going to take an army of normal folks 1105 01:02:10,400 --> 01:02:12,800 Speaker 1: to fix stuff. And I can't think of anybody more 1106 01:02:13,800 --> 01:02:16,840 Speaker 1: average and normal than where you came from. And look 1107 01:02:16,880 --> 01:02:20,440 Speaker 1: at what you're doing now. And I just want to 1108 01:02:20,480 --> 01:02:22,600 Speaker 1: thank you for being here and tell you I'm really 1109 01:02:22,600 --> 01:02:25,959 Speaker 1: really inspired by your life and what you do well. 1110 01:02:26,800 --> 01:02:30,200 Speaker 2: I appreciate you, brother, and I thank you for the invitation. 1111 01:02:30,560 --> 01:02:31,320 Speaker 2: God bless you by it. 1112 01:02:31,360 --> 01:02:41,440 Speaker 1: Thank you, my men, and thank you for joining us 1113 01:02:41,560 --> 01:02:46,280 Speaker 1: this week. If Buddy Osborne or other guests have inspired 1114 01:02:46,320 --> 01:02:49,600 Speaker 1: you in general, or better yet, to take action by 1115 01:02:49,800 --> 01:02:54,800 Speaker 1: volunteering at the Rock, becoming a missionary there, donating to them, 1116 01:02:55,320 --> 01:02:58,800 Speaker 1: getting involved in something similar in your own community, starting 1117 01:02:58,840 --> 01:03:03,360 Speaker 1: something like it, or something else entirely, please let me 1118 01:03:03,440 --> 01:03:06,320 Speaker 1: know I want to hear about it. You can write 1119 01:03:06,400 --> 01:03:10,800 Speaker 1: me anytime at Bill at normalfolks dot us, and I 1120 01:03:10,840 --> 01:03:15,240 Speaker 1: guarantee you this I will respond. If you enjoyed this episode, 1121 01:03:15,640 --> 01:03:19,840 Speaker 1: would you please share it with friends and on social guys, 1122 01:03:20,160 --> 01:03:25,760 Speaker 1: Subscribe it to our podcast, rate it, review it, join 1123 01:03:25,840 --> 01:03:29,800 Speaker 1: the Army at normalfolks dot us, consider becoming a premium 1124 01:03:29,800 --> 01:03:33,120 Speaker 1: member there all of these things that can help us 1125 01:03:33,200 --> 01:03:37,400 Speaker 1: grow an army of normal folks thanks to our producer, 1126 01:03:37,520 --> 01:03:42,200 Speaker 1: Ironlight Labs. I'm Bill Courtney, and until next time, let's 1127 01:03:42,240 --> 01:03:42,959 Speaker 1: do what we can