1 00:00:08,600 --> 00:00:20,720 Speaker 1: Body Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan. I've worked out throughout 2 00:00:20,760 --> 00:00:23,840 Speaker 1: my life for any number of reasons, either you know, 3 00:00:24,800 --> 00:00:29,400 Speaker 1: in sports or military or just to try to stay 4 00:00:29,480 --> 00:00:32,400 Speaker 1: in shape or get back in shape. And it's hard 5 00:00:32,479 --> 00:00:36,360 Speaker 1: to stay the course. I'm sure that y'all. Y'all know this. 6 00:00:36,560 --> 00:00:39,400 Speaker 1: Everybody knows this. It's hard some days just to get 7 00:00:39,440 --> 00:00:44,240 Speaker 1: out and take a walk. I've always been fascinated by 8 00:00:44,360 --> 00:00:51,800 Speaker 1: people that have a level of commitment where they will 9 00:00:51,840 --> 00:00:56,360 Speaker 1: get up at four a m. You know, even in 10 00:00:56,920 --> 00:01:00,720 Speaker 1: the Army, we didn't get up until I think for 11 00:01:00,720 --> 00:01:05,760 Speaker 1: forty five. To get up at or show up at 12 00:01:06,000 --> 00:01:08,520 Speaker 1: four four am, that means that you would have had 13 00:01:08,560 --> 00:01:13,600 Speaker 1: to have started prepping, you know, at three point fifty 14 00:01:13,720 --> 00:01:15,479 Speaker 1: maybe if you're going to throw in your workout clothes 15 00:01:15,520 --> 00:01:19,560 Speaker 1: and then to lead to show up motivated. That's the 16 00:01:19,600 --> 00:01:24,120 Speaker 1: thing about it, to show up motivated, to drive people 17 00:01:24,319 --> 00:01:27,440 Speaker 1: to get in shape, and not just that, but call 18 00:01:28,480 --> 00:01:31,200 Speaker 1: you know, call this this program that you're involved in. 19 00:01:31,360 --> 00:01:35,080 Speaker 1: Camp Gladiator. Today, i want to discuss one of the 20 00:01:35,120 --> 00:01:38,120 Speaker 1: most baffling cases that has come down the pike in 21 00:01:38,160 --> 00:01:40,360 Speaker 1: a long long time. I've been covering it for years. 22 00:01:40,360 --> 00:01:42,280 Speaker 1: It's the first time I've ever done a body backs 23 00:01:42,319 --> 00:01:46,080 Speaker 1: on it. We're going to talk about, at least to 24 00:01:46,280 --> 00:01:55,240 Speaker 1: this time, the unsolved homicide of Missy Beavers. I'm Joseph 25 00:01:55,240 --> 00:02:01,400 Speaker 1: Scott Morgan and this is body Backs tell you about Joe. 26 00:02:01,440 --> 00:02:06,680 Speaker 2: Let me jump in real quick. Missy Bab's case exploded 27 00:02:06,760 --> 00:02:10,520 Speaker 2: in twenty sixteen because when it happened in a church 28 00:02:10,720 --> 00:02:14,320 Speaker 2: when she was all alone before five am, but two 29 00:02:14,360 --> 00:02:18,280 Speaker 2: because police released surveillance video of the person they believe 30 00:02:18,320 --> 00:02:21,079 Speaker 2: committed the murder. In the minutes before the murder took place, 31 00:02:21,160 --> 00:02:25,079 Speaker 2: we see a person walking throughout the church in mid Lothian, Texas, 32 00:02:25,120 --> 00:02:28,560 Speaker 2: wearing a police swat outfit, including a helmet and a vesta, 33 00:02:28,639 --> 00:02:31,720 Speaker 2: says police. On top of that, this video shows that 34 00:02:31,800 --> 00:02:34,560 Speaker 2: the person has an unusual walk, an unusual gait, and 35 00:02:34,600 --> 00:02:37,920 Speaker 2: police released the surveillance video for everybody to see it, 36 00:02:38,000 --> 00:02:40,639 Speaker 2: expecting somebody to go, I know who that is. That's 37 00:02:40,680 --> 00:02:44,320 Speaker 2: how unique the walk is. That's why this story went viral. 38 00:02:44,800 --> 00:02:46,880 Speaker 2: It's still not solved eight years later. That's why we're 39 00:02:46,880 --> 00:02:49,640 Speaker 2: digging into the story today now, Joe. She was there, 40 00:02:49,680 --> 00:02:52,360 Speaker 2: as you mentioned, to lead a workout, and I'm kind 41 00:02:52,400 --> 00:02:54,320 Speaker 2: of curious. A lot of us had to do chores 42 00:02:54,320 --> 00:02:56,239 Speaker 2: when we were kids. Do you look at working out 43 00:02:56,240 --> 00:02:59,360 Speaker 2: as entertainment or do you look at working out as 44 00:02:59,600 --> 00:02:59,960 Speaker 2: a show. 45 00:03:01,160 --> 00:03:04,560 Speaker 1: This to me is a chore. I mean, God, God 46 00:03:04,639 --> 00:03:08,040 Speaker 1: bless me. Missy Beavers and all those people that would 47 00:03:08,040 --> 00:03:11,120 Speaker 1: come and where I'm sure she she impacted people's lives 48 00:03:11,200 --> 00:03:15,080 Speaker 1: or that. We've heard this over and over and over again. 49 00:03:15,840 --> 00:03:18,119 Speaker 1: And David, look, I'm going to just throw this out 50 00:03:18,160 --> 00:03:24,200 Speaker 1: there just to begin this conversation. Given everything that she 51 00:03:24,480 --> 00:03:29,880 Speaker 1: did to help other people relative to their physical life, 52 00:03:30,000 --> 00:03:32,840 Speaker 1: all right, to try to improve them. Look, I'll take 53 00:03:32,880 --> 00:03:34,519 Speaker 1: the reins of it. I'm going to go out there. 54 00:03:34,520 --> 00:03:37,320 Speaker 1: I'm going to set this thing up. You know, you 55 00:03:37,440 --> 00:03:39,480 Speaker 1: show up. I'm going to be there every day, come 56 00:03:39,560 --> 00:03:41,680 Speaker 1: rain or come shine. By the way, it had been 57 00:03:41,800 --> 00:03:47,040 Speaker 1: raining hard that night. She said, we do not cancel, 58 00:03:47,600 --> 00:03:49,120 Speaker 1: and they were going to do it indoors. 59 00:03:49,440 --> 00:03:52,080 Speaker 2: Well, and you know all the plan was they did 60 00:03:52,120 --> 00:03:55,400 Speaker 2: it in the parking lot, the arrangement for Camp Gladiator 61 00:03:55,440 --> 00:03:58,320 Speaker 2: that Missy Beavers did. And by the way, her husband 62 00:03:58,800 --> 00:04:01,520 Speaker 2: actually Brandon talked to about the people who did this, 63 00:04:01,920 --> 00:04:05,560 Speaker 2: who joined Missy Beaver's class. They were called campers. That 64 00:04:05,720 --> 00:04:08,440 Speaker 2: is the way they related to them as their campers, 65 00:04:08,440 --> 00:04:10,720 Speaker 2: and they referred to them, I mean Brandon as well 66 00:04:10,720 --> 00:04:14,840 Speaker 2: as Missy called them our campers. And so the campers 67 00:04:14,880 --> 00:04:17,839 Speaker 2: would arrive at five am, which means that you know, 68 00:04:17,880 --> 00:04:19,719 Speaker 2: Missy had to be there forty five minutes to an 69 00:04:19,760 --> 00:04:22,200 Speaker 2: hour beforehand to get things set up. As you mentioned, 70 00:04:22,520 --> 00:04:25,080 Speaker 2: they normally did it in the parking lot, but because 71 00:04:25,120 --> 00:04:27,560 Speaker 2: of the torrential rains and by the way, it was 72 00:04:27,640 --> 00:04:31,520 Speaker 2: severe enough in mid Lothian, Texas where it had, the 73 00:04:31,560 --> 00:04:35,320 Speaker 2: weather had actually changed people's behavior because it just wasn't 74 00:04:35,360 --> 00:04:37,400 Speaker 2: something that they were used to having, you know, in 75 00:04:37,800 --> 00:04:41,359 Speaker 2: several days of nasty, rainy weather, and so moving it 76 00:04:41,440 --> 00:04:44,840 Speaker 2: indoors was something that Missy was able to arrange. And 77 00:04:45,160 --> 00:04:47,400 Speaker 2: that's where we begin, and you and I both started 78 00:04:47,400 --> 00:04:51,160 Speaker 2: talking about this show, this particular case when it happened. 79 00:04:51,360 --> 00:04:55,880 Speaker 2: We're talking about April eighteenth of twenty sixteen. That's when 80 00:04:55,920 --> 00:04:58,400 Speaker 2: you and I first heard of this case and by 81 00:04:58,400 --> 00:05:02,720 Speaker 2: the way, saw the video. You have a case where 82 00:05:02,760 --> 00:05:06,120 Speaker 2: Missy Beavers arrives at the church to set things up 83 00:05:06,839 --> 00:05:12,560 Speaker 2: and a camper finds her just after five am, finds 84 00:05:12,560 --> 00:05:18,440 Speaker 2: her body dead. Well, she was declared dead by the 85 00:05:18,480 --> 00:05:21,400 Speaker 2: paramedics that showed up. But the first call to nine 86 00:05:21,440 --> 00:05:23,840 Speaker 2: one one was at five point ten and it was 87 00:05:24,360 --> 00:05:27,159 Speaker 2: somebody's hurt, bad show up, you know. And then the 88 00:05:27,160 --> 00:05:30,000 Speaker 2: police as they're investigating, they released the video that we saw. 89 00:05:30,360 --> 00:05:33,680 Speaker 2: The video surveillance was from inside the church, and the 90 00:05:33,720 --> 00:05:36,880 Speaker 2: first thing we all saw a we know Missy Beavers 91 00:05:36,920 --> 00:05:42,200 Speaker 2: is dead. B we have video of a person walking 92 00:05:42,279 --> 00:05:45,320 Speaker 2: through this church that is not just the suspect. This 93 00:05:45,600 --> 00:05:50,080 Speaker 2: is the probable killer of Missy Beavers. And how often 94 00:05:50,120 --> 00:05:52,040 Speaker 2: do we have video of that medicine? 95 00:05:52,520 --> 00:05:56,120 Speaker 1: Never That's and you know I'd mentioned to you I've 96 00:05:56,160 --> 00:06:02,080 Speaker 1: had these weird confluences, David, through throughout my uh my 97 00:06:02,839 --> 00:06:05,839 Speaker 1: contact with Nancy Grace. For some reason, I don't know 98 00:06:05,920 --> 00:06:10,400 Speaker 1: why it happened. But going back to our hl N 99 00:06:10,520 --> 00:06:15,480 Speaker 1: days where I would appear as her forensics guy, there 100 00:06:15,480 --> 00:06:19,800 Speaker 1: were there are a number of these cases where I was. 101 00:06:20,080 --> 00:06:21,919 Speaker 1: I was on air with her the first night a 102 00:06:21,960 --> 00:06:26,280 Speaker 1: particular case was presented. This is one of them. And 103 00:06:26,320 --> 00:06:30,120 Speaker 1: that's why it's so baffling because, uh, you know, in 104 00:06:30,160 --> 00:06:33,039 Speaker 1: our off air discussions, I was telling you, look, that 105 00:06:33,279 --> 00:06:37,160 Speaker 1: night after I had covered this with Nancy, because this 106 00:06:37,200 --> 00:06:40,480 Speaker 1: is the first night we had the video, and it 107 00:06:40,560 --> 00:06:42,880 Speaker 1: was the first night that I heard Nancy use the 108 00:06:42,960 --> 00:06:46,600 Speaker 1: term slew footed, and I'd heard slew footed my entire life. 109 00:06:46,720 --> 00:06:49,279 Speaker 1: You know, for people to turn turn me, well, it 110 00:06:49,360 --> 00:06:52,720 Speaker 1: means that you you turn your feet out. It almost 111 00:06:52,720 --> 00:06:56,159 Speaker 1: looks like a duck walk. You turn your feet out 112 00:06:56,320 --> 00:07:00,560 Speaker 1: as you're as you're you know, ambulating along. It's very 113 00:07:00,640 --> 00:07:05,880 Speaker 1: distinctive posture. And there's all kinds of things that forensic 114 00:07:05,880 --> 00:07:10,480 Speaker 1: foot where people look at relative to how feet strike 115 00:07:10,520 --> 00:07:15,120 Speaker 1: the ground, wear patterns on shoes and boots, and all 116 00:07:15,120 --> 00:07:17,840 Speaker 1: these sorts of things. The impressions you live leave in 117 00:07:17,880 --> 00:07:21,320 Speaker 1: the mud are in fact, and not to mention that 118 00:07:21,480 --> 00:07:24,440 Speaker 1: you think about the weight distribution of people. So it 119 00:07:24,640 --> 00:07:27,640 Speaker 1: really stood out that night. That was just one of 120 00:07:27,680 --> 00:07:33,320 Speaker 1: the little indicators that for me all these years seven 121 00:07:33,400 --> 00:07:36,119 Speaker 1: years day is it seven years? It is seven years? 122 00:07:36,120 --> 00:07:39,000 Speaker 1: I think seven years since this eight years there you go, 123 00:07:39,720 --> 00:07:45,280 Speaker 1: since this occurred, and I just I knew that night, Look, 124 00:07:45,600 --> 00:07:48,280 Speaker 1: this is going to be somebody that is going to 125 00:07:48,320 --> 00:07:52,160 Speaker 1: be found out. Going back to the original you know, 126 00:07:53,120 --> 00:07:56,320 Speaker 1: I don't know underlying thesis here. If you think about 127 00:07:57,080 --> 00:08:01,640 Speaker 1: what she's doing who's gonna's going to kill this woman? Right? 128 00:08:01,720 --> 00:08:05,440 Speaker 1: And that sounds here, Yeah, that's the thing, because. 129 00:08:05,120 --> 00:08:07,480 Speaker 2: You're looking at a woman who's forty five years old, 130 00:08:07,560 --> 00:08:10,960 Speaker 2: has three kids, married and has been for a while, 131 00:08:11,400 --> 00:08:16,200 Speaker 2: and she's murdered by at her before her class is 132 00:08:16,240 --> 00:08:18,880 Speaker 2: set to begin. So the first thing that you and 133 00:08:18,920 --> 00:08:21,040 Speaker 2: I and everybody else that was working on we saw 134 00:08:21,080 --> 00:08:25,040 Speaker 2: the video of the positive probable murderer walking through a 135 00:08:25,120 --> 00:08:27,360 Speaker 2: church building with a long hammer. And we'll get into 136 00:08:27,400 --> 00:08:29,720 Speaker 2: this in a minute, but we see the video of 137 00:08:29,760 --> 00:08:32,240 Speaker 2: the possible suspect, the person that committed the murder, and 138 00:08:32,320 --> 00:08:34,960 Speaker 2: we know, well, we've got a lot of evidence here 139 00:08:34,960 --> 00:08:39,040 Speaker 2: pointing at who's guilty of this crime. But we also 140 00:08:39,160 --> 00:08:42,280 Speaker 2: have an individual that is walking through the church wearing 141 00:08:42,320 --> 00:08:45,360 Speaker 2: an outfit that looks like well not it looks like 142 00:08:45,400 --> 00:08:48,120 Speaker 2: it actually says police across the front best and it 143 00:08:48,120 --> 00:08:53,160 Speaker 2: appears to be police swat tactical gear including a helmet 144 00:08:53,559 --> 00:08:58,599 Speaker 2: that this individual is wearing. So back up, it's for 145 00:08:59,280 --> 00:09:02,319 Speaker 2: sixteen in the morning when Missy Beavers arrives at the 146 00:09:02,400 --> 00:09:06,120 Speaker 2: church and the video shows her unpacking things from her 147 00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:09,240 Speaker 2: truck and bringing it inside the church. We have the 148 00:09:09,360 --> 00:09:12,280 Speaker 2: video of the surveillance video of the person walking through 149 00:09:12,280 --> 00:09:16,280 Speaker 2: the church, and then we have the student the camper 150 00:09:16,520 --> 00:09:21,679 Speaker 2: arriving and calling nine to oneint one Our instructor is down, 151 00:09:22,240 --> 00:09:27,480 Speaker 2: and police arrive. She is pronounced dead at the scene. 152 00:09:27,720 --> 00:09:30,839 Speaker 2: Now we have the surveillance video that police released right away, 153 00:09:31,559 --> 00:09:34,559 Speaker 2: mainly because this is pretty big evidence and they didn't, 154 00:09:34,640 --> 00:09:36,120 Speaker 2: you know, in the first day or so, they hadn't 155 00:09:36,120 --> 00:09:38,600 Speaker 2: figured out who did it yet, so they released this 156 00:09:39,480 --> 00:09:42,480 Speaker 2: portions of it because the individual, and you said slew footed. 157 00:09:42,960 --> 00:09:45,440 Speaker 2: The person that is in the video has a very 158 00:09:45,520 --> 00:09:50,240 Speaker 2: distinctive gait gai t And it's not a term we 159 00:09:50,360 --> 00:09:54,880 Speaker 2: use very often to describe something, but it means the 160 00:09:54,920 --> 00:09:58,440 Speaker 2: way a person walks. I have an odd walk sometimes 161 00:09:58,440 --> 00:10:00,920 Speaker 2: because of my back. Some people have an odd walk 162 00:10:00,960 --> 00:10:04,280 Speaker 2: because they have an injury that it's only a temporary walk, 163 00:10:04,320 --> 00:10:07,560 Speaker 2: and that was something that investigators had to consider. Is 164 00:10:07,640 --> 00:10:11,560 Speaker 2: this a person who has this weird gait all the 165 00:10:11,640 --> 00:10:16,360 Speaker 2: time or are they recovering from an injury that has 166 00:10:16,480 --> 00:10:19,560 Speaker 2: created this gate. The whole thing the police are thinking 167 00:10:19,679 --> 00:10:23,560 Speaker 2: is somebody will notice this. Somebody will see this video 168 00:10:23,640 --> 00:10:26,600 Speaker 2: and say, hey, that looks like Joseph Scott Morgan I 169 00:10:26,600 --> 00:10:29,240 Speaker 2: saw him at the grocery store the other day. He 170 00:10:29,360 --> 00:10:32,319 Speaker 2: was walking like that. Somebody's going to call that in. 171 00:10:33,000 --> 00:10:36,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's very it's very distinctive. It's one of these 172 00:10:36,160 --> 00:10:38,679 Speaker 1: things that you know, you could say, how many let 173 00:10:38,679 --> 00:10:43,240 Speaker 1: me ask you something. Okay, we go to any you know, 174 00:10:43,320 --> 00:10:46,560 Speaker 1: any box store or anything like that. I won't mention 175 00:10:46,600 --> 00:10:50,120 Speaker 1: any names, but you know, like their initials are Walmart. Okay, 176 00:10:50,600 --> 00:10:53,680 Speaker 1: So you go to someplace like a Walmart or you 177 00:10:53,720 --> 00:10:57,360 Speaker 1: go to your local grocery store. How many? How many 178 00:10:57,360 --> 00:11:00,240 Speaker 1: times do you pay attention to the way people walk. 179 00:11:00,320 --> 00:11:04,400 Speaker 2: Only when they won't get out of my way? 180 00:11:04,440 --> 00:11:07,800 Speaker 1: Yeah, you're right, and you're wondering, Well, the first assessment 181 00:11:07,840 --> 00:11:11,240 Speaker 1: that you do is like, well are they encumbered by something? 182 00:11:11,720 --> 00:11:18,080 Speaker 1: Is there something to be? And so you're you're wondering, 183 00:11:18,679 --> 00:11:24,000 Speaker 1: You're wondering here is this? Is this how they normally 184 00:11:24,720 --> 00:11:27,880 Speaker 1: you know, walk? And the interesting thing and we you know, 185 00:11:27,960 --> 00:11:31,360 Speaker 1: I uh, full credit to Nancy here because she had 186 00:11:31,360 --> 00:11:33,720 Speaker 1: me on just this past week talking about this case. 187 00:11:35,960 --> 00:11:39,720 Speaker 1: She had brought up the potential for an injury, you know, 188 00:11:39,840 --> 00:11:44,520 Speaker 1: relative to how this person was stepping, and it was 189 00:11:44,520 --> 00:11:49,080 Speaker 1: fascinating she she actually had a forensic pediatrist on air 190 00:11:49,120 --> 00:11:52,800 Speaker 1: with us. This guy is fascinating and forgive me, his 191 00:11:52,960 --> 00:11:56,480 Speaker 1: name just flew out of my brain, but he his 192 00:11:56,600 --> 00:12:01,880 Speaker 1: assessment relative to this was quite was quite fascinating. And 193 00:12:02,120 --> 00:12:07,880 Speaker 1: I'm not saying that the totality of the evidence rest 194 00:12:07,960 --> 00:12:11,120 Speaker 1: in a way somebody might happen to stride on any 195 00:12:11,120 --> 00:12:14,920 Speaker 1: particular day or strike the ground with their heel or 196 00:12:14,960 --> 00:12:18,800 Speaker 1: their toe or maybe the arch area of their foot. 197 00:12:19,559 --> 00:12:23,080 Speaker 1: But I know this, this case, with all of the 198 00:12:23,120 --> 00:12:26,160 Speaker 1: evidence that we're about to talk about, and with this 199 00:12:26,240 --> 00:12:49,560 Speaker 1: strange gait, remains open and unsolved. I personally, I have 200 00:12:49,760 --> 00:12:54,600 Speaker 1: never put on any kind of tactical police gear in 201 00:12:54,640 --> 00:12:59,320 Speaker 1: my life. None. You wear stuff or back in my 202 00:12:59,400 --> 00:13:01,800 Speaker 1: day when Sorcer on the earth, he wore stuff in 203 00:13:01,800 --> 00:13:05,959 Speaker 1: the army that you know, I guess could be considered 204 00:13:06,160 --> 00:13:08,120 Speaker 1: was combat gear. What tactical gear? 205 00:13:08,920 --> 00:13:09,360 Speaker 2: Uh? 206 00:13:09,720 --> 00:13:14,720 Speaker 1: You know that consisted of a couple of suspenders, you know, 207 00:13:14,880 --> 00:13:17,120 Speaker 1: a web belt as they called it, with m O 208 00:13:17,240 --> 00:13:20,079 Speaker 1: pax and all that stuff. But this is something different, 209 00:13:20,160 --> 00:13:23,840 Speaker 1: you know. I'm looking at at the clothing that this 210 00:13:23,960 --> 00:13:30,280 Speaker 1: person on the videography is wearing, and the pediatriss that 211 00:13:30,320 --> 00:13:32,800 Speaker 1: I mentioned just a few months ago that did an 212 00:13:32,840 --> 00:13:39,400 Speaker 1: assessment on this, on this this outfit, that this individual had. 213 00:13:39,320 --> 00:13:41,840 Speaker 2: A doctor's name, the pediatrist show that you were looking for. 214 00:13:42,000 --> 00:13:45,160 Speaker 2: His name is doctor Michael Nyrenberg. 215 00:13:45,720 --> 00:13:49,360 Speaker 1: Doctor Nunberg. Hey, that's why I love you, Dave. You're 216 00:13:49,559 --> 00:13:52,079 Speaker 1: always there, You're ready with the ready with the info. 217 00:13:52,280 --> 00:13:54,679 Speaker 1: Thank you, because he deserves a lot of credit here. 218 00:13:54,679 --> 00:13:56,640 Speaker 1: I got to tell you. He you know, he went 219 00:13:56,679 --> 00:14:01,200 Speaker 1: to his local police department and asked if he could 220 00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:05,160 Speaker 1: videotape people that were dressed out in full kit as 221 00:14:05,200 --> 00:14:07,520 Speaker 1: they call it, and then he put the kid on. 222 00:14:07,600 --> 00:14:10,080 Speaker 1: You know what he said the same way, Dave, it 223 00:14:10,120 --> 00:14:14,360 Speaker 1: approximated forty pounds. Well imagine that, can you? Yeah, because 224 00:14:14,400 --> 00:14:16,720 Speaker 1: it's got a tactical vest which I guess has probably 225 00:14:16,760 --> 00:14:19,840 Speaker 1: got plates in it, you know, like bulletproof plates that 226 00:14:19,920 --> 00:14:23,280 Speaker 1: you find on the post ear and the anterior aspect. 227 00:14:23,840 --> 00:14:26,200 Speaker 1: And then not to mention, you know, any kind of 228 00:14:26,840 --> 00:14:30,720 Speaker 1: med kits, ammo, all the stuff that they flashlights, all 229 00:14:30,720 --> 00:14:34,160 Speaker 1: this stuff. And he said, and that changes the gate. 230 00:14:34,680 --> 00:14:37,680 Speaker 1: One of the things that Nancy's talked about is height comparison, 231 00:14:37,720 --> 00:14:42,120 Speaker 1: which is fascinating to me, where you know, how agencies 232 00:14:42,160 --> 00:14:45,400 Speaker 1: can take a rendering or can take a snap of 233 00:14:45,440 --> 00:14:50,440 Speaker 1: an individual in front of a doorframe. A doorframe is 234 00:14:50,480 --> 00:14:54,240 Speaker 1: a known it's a known, it's you get an idea 235 00:14:54,320 --> 00:14:57,920 Speaker 1: of height and width of this thing, and so they 236 00:14:58,280 --> 00:15:04,280 Speaker 1: can approximate heights with this. This pediatrist actually stated that 237 00:15:06,680 --> 00:15:11,240 Speaker 1: based upon the weight, it's going to perhaps compress your height. 238 00:15:11,840 --> 00:15:17,000 Speaker 1: So it might actually alter your height to a certain degree. 239 00:15:17,360 --> 00:15:19,000 Speaker 1: Now you know he deals with this sort of thing 240 00:15:19,680 --> 00:15:22,800 Speaker 1: every single day, you know, where they're having to make 241 00:15:22,840 --> 00:15:26,120 Speaker 1: adjustments to the feet and all these sorts of things, 242 00:15:26,160 --> 00:15:28,360 Speaker 1: special orthotics and all of that, and I'm sure that 243 00:15:28,440 --> 00:15:33,160 Speaker 1: he's probably worked with all manner of ostia pass out there. 244 00:15:36,280 --> 00:15:40,760 Speaker 1: When you think about this, that it could alter the 245 00:15:40,760 --> 00:15:45,440 Speaker 1: height of somebody if they divested themselves of this rig 246 00:15:45,520 --> 00:15:50,520 Speaker 1: that they're wearing, could their height change by half an inch? Maybe? 247 00:15:51,080 --> 00:15:52,920 Speaker 1: I don't know. I mean, you know they say that 248 00:15:52,960 --> 00:15:55,840 Speaker 1: astronauts get shorter when they're when they go into space. 249 00:15:56,000 --> 00:15:59,680 Speaker 1: I don't know, but they get taller or I'm thinking 250 00:15:59,720 --> 00:16:03,720 Speaker 1: about divers people that go that dive at deep desks 251 00:16:03,760 --> 00:16:06,160 Speaker 1: for depths for a protracted period of top. 252 00:16:06,480 --> 00:16:09,720 Speaker 2: But the suit you're talking about weighing the kit weighing 253 00:16:09,760 --> 00:16:13,000 Speaker 2: forty pounds itself. Yeah, in the pictures of the surveillance 254 00:16:13,080 --> 00:16:17,760 Speaker 2: video of the individual. That by the way, police released 255 00:16:17,960 --> 00:16:21,120 Speaker 2: certain videos right a couple of days into the investigation, 256 00:16:21,160 --> 00:16:24,120 Speaker 2: when they didn't have a suspect, they didn't put a 257 00:16:24,200 --> 00:16:25,920 Speaker 2: name to a suspect. In a couple of days they 258 00:16:25,960 --> 00:16:29,680 Speaker 2: released more of the video. I want to add two things. One, 259 00:16:30,880 --> 00:16:33,600 Speaker 2: the surveillance video only is from the inside of the church. 260 00:16:33,840 --> 00:16:37,320 Speaker 2: The surveillance cameras outside the church were not working, but 261 00:16:37,400 --> 00:16:42,400 Speaker 2: inside the church police did see how the individual got in. 262 00:16:43,320 --> 00:16:45,600 Speaker 2: Now we know that Missy Beaver's arrived around four to 263 00:16:45,680 --> 00:16:49,200 Speaker 2: sixteen am, and police have told us that they saw 264 00:16:50,120 --> 00:16:54,720 Speaker 2: cameras on the inside showing this person breaking into the 265 00:16:54,800 --> 00:16:58,960 Speaker 2: church at three point fifty am in full tactical gear. 266 00:16:59,400 --> 00:17:02,760 Speaker 2: And I keep I'm saying this person because at first 267 00:17:02,960 --> 00:17:05,919 Speaker 2: police were certain it was a man, as I was 268 00:17:06,000 --> 00:17:08,879 Speaker 2: the first time I watched it. It's only in watching 269 00:17:08,920 --> 00:17:11,320 Speaker 2: the video a couple of different times that you look 270 00:17:11,359 --> 00:17:15,639 Speaker 2: at this and think this might be a woman. Now 271 00:17:16,320 --> 00:17:18,760 Speaker 2: police were able to determine that he or she the 272 00:17:18,800 --> 00:17:21,880 Speaker 2: person broke into the building. They're not telling us how, 273 00:17:22,000 --> 00:17:25,600 Speaker 2: just saying that it was a forced entry, right. And 274 00:17:26,680 --> 00:17:32,040 Speaker 2: we also are going to tell you that police have 275 00:17:32,160 --> 00:17:35,720 Speaker 2: never released the attack on Missy Beavers. 276 00:17:36,280 --> 00:17:38,280 Speaker 1: I think it's there though, isn't it day? Yes, it is. 277 00:17:39,119 --> 00:17:41,320 Speaker 2: They have the video. It just serves no purpose to 278 00:17:41,359 --> 00:17:44,240 Speaker 2: release it to the public, right and you know, furryan 279 00:17:44,359 --> 00:17:46,960 Speaker 2: interest don't need to be served. They're trying to find 280 00:17:47,000 --> 00:17:49,439 Speaker 2: out the suspect. Anything other than that would just be 281 00:17:49,520 --> 00:17:52,080 Speaker 2: damaging to her children, her family and people who cared 282 00:17:52,080 --> 00:17:56,080 Speaker 2: about her. I didn't know what happened. So anyway, they 283 00:17:56,160 --> 00:17:59,160 Speaker 2: do have that though, and I'm imagining at some point 284 00:17:59,160 --> 00:18:01,840 Speaker 2: if it comes up at that that could be brought 285 00:18:01,840 --> 00:18:04,920 Speaker 2: in because it would have something to do about the 286 00:18:04,960 --> 00:18:09,320 Speaker 2: injury sustained by Missy Beavers, the height, the weight of 287 00:18:09,359 --> 00:18:13,439 Speaker 2: the individual that did this crime. But Joe, as we 288 00:18:13,480 --> 00:18:19,480 Speaker 2: were watching this video of the surveillance video, it appears 289 00:18:20,160 --> 00:18:24,560 Speaker 2: that the person that comes into this building is breaking windows, 290 00:18:25,320 --> 00:18:28,400 Speaker 2: is looking around at door opening doors and things like that. 291 00:18:29,040 --> 00:18:32,960 Speaker 2: Does it appear to you that this individual is waiting 292 00:18:33,359 --> 00:18:36,800 Speaker 2: for Missy Beavers to arrive, that this person knows she's 293 00:18:36,880 --> 00:18:41,399 Speaker 2: going to arrive before five am, And does person is 294 00:18:41,480 --> 00:18:43,520 Speaker 2: lying in wait by creating a mess? 295 00:18:43,800 --> 00:18:46,880 Speaker 1: Yeah? And look, how in the heck do you Okay, 296 00:18:46,960 --> 00:18:51,480 Speaker 1: this has been my contention all along, Dave, if you 297 00:18:51,640 --> 00:18:55,119 Speaker 1: have an individual that knows and you have to you 298 00:18:55,240 --> 00:18:58,800 Speaker 1: kind of have to factor this in to the equation. 299 00:18:59,400 --> 00:19:03,199 Speaker 1: They have to know that Missy is going to be 300 00:19:03,280 --> 00:19:08,040 Speaker 1: going there. They have to know that. And here's the 301 00:19:08,119 --> 00:19:16,280 Speaker 1: chilling part that I think that the workout had been 302 00:19:16,280 --> 00:19:21,280 Speaker 1: moved from outdoors to indoors. Okay, that's very intimate knowledge, day, 303 00:19:21,960 --> 00:19:25,840 Speaker 1: but how can you how do you how do you 304 00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:31,119 Speaker 1: marry all that up and and not narrow your field 305 00:19:31,200 --> 00:19:35,320 Speaker 1: any further than it's been narrowed. Because it's interesting to 306 00:19:35,480 --> 00:19:40,800 Speaker 1: know that this message had been had been sent out 307 00:19:41,040 --> 00:19:47,200 Speaker 1: relative to relative to visa Facebook, you know, and it 308 00:19:47,280 --> 00:19:50,679 Speaker 1: was You wonder if it's a hidden group, protected group, 309 00:19:51,119 --> 00:19:52,880 Speaker 1: you know, that that sort of thing where it's it's 310 00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:55,800 Speaker 1: only limited to or could the public see this? And 311 00:19:56,359 --> 00:20:00,280 Speaker 1: if so, who in that group that would have and 312 00:20:00,320 --> 00:20:05,520 Speaker 1: going might have passed that information on not knowing that 313 00:20:05,560 --> 00:20:08,440 Speaker 1: they had passed it on to someone that had an 314 00:20:08,480 --> 00:20:13,240 Speaker 1: in for Missy. Is it a randomized attack? I can't 315 00:20:13,240 --> 00:20:16,400 Speaker 1: imagine that it is, because the person showed showed up 316 00:20:16,840 --> 00:20:21,840 Speaker 1: prior to Missy's arrival. So the new timeframe, they're going 317 00:20:21,880 --> 00:20:24,760 Speaker 1: around their checking this. They're casing the joint, if you will, 318 00:20:26,600 --> 00:20:29,679 Speaker 1: to try to assess if there was anybody else in 319 00:20:29,720 --> 00:20:32,320 Speaker 1: the building. But boyd, did they really take a risk 320 00:20:32,359 --> 00:20:35,679 Speaker 1: by knocking a window out, you know, to gain access 321 00:20:35,720 --> 00:20:40,080 Speaker 1: in that way? That gives you the idea of how 322 00:20:40,240 --> 00:20:42,960 Speaker 1: motivated they were in order to do this. I'm going 323 00:20:43,040 --> 00:20:46,200 Speaker 1: to break something in order to make entry. But they're 324 00:20:46,240 --> 00:20:49,360 Speaker 1: being very safe in the sense that they've got this 325 00:20:49,600 --> 00:20:56,240 Speaker 1: their kit on their faces obscured, they're wearing gloves, you 326 00:20:56,280 --> 00:21:01,359 Speaker 1: never see who they are, and and the fact that 327 00:21:01,359 --> 00:21:04,560 Speaker 1: they're all kitted up. There's two things to take away 328 00:21:04,560 --> 00:21:07,640 Speaker 1: from that. First off, if you're wearing police gear, which 329 00:21:07,680 --> 00:21:10,440 Speaker 1: the thingk says police on the chest and the back, 330 00:21:13,880 --> 00:21:16,199 Speaker 1: are you looking to blend in? Are you looking to 331 00:21:16,280 --> 00:21:19,199 Speaker 1: be in a garment that is not going to make 332 00:21:19,240 --> 00:21:24,840 Speaker 1: you more suspicious? Or maybe taking her unaware? Hey I'm 333 00:21:24,840 --> 00:21:27,320 Speaker 1: with the police. We got a call here, and you 334 00:21:27,359 --> 00:21:30,239 Speaker 1: can creep up on her. You know, you can take 335 00:21:30,280 --> 00:21:33,439 Speaker 1: the victim, you know, by surprise. Even more, you're adding 336 00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:37,200 Speaker 1: another layer of the unknown there also, did they have 337 00:21:37,880 --> 00:21:41,159 Speaker 1: knowledge of indwelling cameras inside of this place, so they 338 00:21:41,200 --> 00:21:44,040 Speaker 1: have to protect their face, so they would have knowledge 339 00:21:44,440 --> 00:21:48,920 Speaker 1: of not just the timetable, but also points of view 340 00:21:49,359 --> 00:21:52,320 Speaker 1: in this environment. And the fact that the cameras were 341 00:21:52,359 --> 00:21:57,680 Speaker 1: not working outside. Oh my gosh, that is I can 342 00:21:57,720 --> 00:22:02,280 Speaker 1: only imagine that when when the police heard that, their 343 00:22:02,280 --> 00:22:04,119 Speaker 1: heart must have sunk, and the people that are in 344 00:22:04,200 --> 00:22:07,480 Speaker 1: charge of the cameras, they're probably like, oh my gosh, yeah, 345 00:22:07,680 --> 00:22:10,120 Speaker 1: why do we even have these things on the outside 346 00:22:10,160 --> 00:22:10,680 Speaker 1: of the church. 347 00:22:10,880 --> 00:22:13,240 Speaker 2: I never really thought about the kit, wearing the kit 348 00:22:13,320 --> 00:22:20,720 Speaker 2: inside Joe, but you know, wearing that full kit. If 349 00:22:20,760 --> 00:22:24,320 Speaker 2: somebody was in the building for some reason other than 350 00:22:24,359 --> 00:22:28,320 Speaker 2: Missy Beavers and he or she came upon that person, 351 00:22:28,440 --> 00:22:30,920 Speaker 2: they would be wearing, you know, the full body kit 352 00:22:31,320 --> 00:22:33,880 Speaker 2: and would actually have the upper hands say we got 353 00:22:33,920 --> 00:22:35,960 Speaker 2: a call and we came to check it out, sorry, 354 00:22:35,960 --> 00:22:38,119 Speaker 2: you know, and then they could kill that person. That 355 00:22:38,160 --> 00:22:41,040 Speaker 2: person would be if I saw somebody in swat tactical 356 00:22:41,080 --> 00:22:43,840 Speaker 2: gear with police written across the front, I would give 357 00:22:43,840 --> 00:22:46,000 Speaker 2: it a second look of oh, okay, I'm good, you know, 358 00:22:46,040 --> 00:22:48,560 Speaker 2: I'm not worried. If it's a person that just comes 359 00:22:48,560 --> 00:22:51,399 Speaker 2: in there swinging a big hammer, you know, dressed in 360 00:22:51,440 --> 00:22:54,760 Speaker 2: regular gear. Yeah, I'm immediately defensive, but somebody in a 361 00:22:54,840 --> 00:22:59,480 Speaker 2: swat that says police, I'm not really taking it back. 362 00:22:59,520 --> 00:23:01,640 Speaker 2: I'm kind of comforted by the fact that I've got 363 00:23:01,640 --> 00:23:03,840 Speaker 2: cops on hand in case there is something that went wrong. 364 00:23:03,880 --> 00:23:05,760 Speaker 2: I didn't that did not occur to me till now. 365 00:23:05,880 --> 00:23:07,800 Speaker 1: I got to throw something else at you too. That 366 00:23:07,920 --> 00:23:11,560 Speaker 1: that's that's fascinating to me about this. Now the video 367 00:23:11,680 --> 00:23:14,399 Speaker 1: is okay, I mean it's not. We've certainly seen worse, 368 00:23:14,440 --> 00:23:19,200 Speaker 1: haven't we. I mean, you know, for a goodly portion 369 00:23:19,359 --> 00:23:23,359 Speaker 1: of my career, shameless plug coming up here, I wore 370 00:23:24,359 --> 00:23:28,920 Speaker 1: five to eleven gear, which is a uh it's it's 371 00:23:29,000 --> 00:23:35,080 Speaker 1: clothing that is made for people, for people in uh 372 00:23:35,359 --> 00:23:39,080 Speaker 1: police work. It's got interesting positions for pockets. You can 373 00:23:39,119 --> 00:23:42,000 Speaker 1: carry all kinds of things in it in you know, 374 00:23:42,040 --> 00:23:44,919 Speaker 1: in the pants. They have shirts, and they're they're made 375 00:23:45,240 --> 00:23:47,040 Speaker 1: for people that are going out kind of in the 376 00:23:47,119 --> 00:23:53,960 Speaker 1: rough and tumble world of working cases. They're you know, 377 00:23:54,000 --> 00:23:57,359 Speaker 1: it's it's like a it's they're almost they're made out 378 00:23:57,359 --> 00:23:59,760 Speaker 1: of the same thing. Well, they appear to be made 379 00:23:59,800 --> 00:24:01,440 Speaker 1: out of same thing as like many of them that 380 00:24:01,520 --> 00:24:04,080 Speaker 1: come in a variety of but just think old military 381 00:24:04,200 --> 00:24:07,320 Speaker 1: khaki uniform forms. But they come in multiple colors. You know, 382 00:24:07,359 --> 00:24:11,000 Speaker 1: you got forest green, you got blue, the police blue, 383 00:24:11,720 --> 00:24:16,960 Speaker 1: You've got black, khaki colored, all these sorts of things. Dave, 384 00:24:17,119 --> 00:24:19,399 Speaker 1: I got to tell you, I wore five to eleven 385 00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:24,200 Speaker 1: pants for a long long time. It takes a while 386 00:24:25,520 --> 00:24:28,120 Speaker 1: to break these things in. And I got to tell 387 00:24:28,119 --> 00:24:31,760 Speaker 1: you when I'm taking a look at this clothing, this 388 00:24:31,760 --> 00:24:36,960 Speaker 1: this gear looks new. It doesn't it doesn't have wear 389 00:24:37,000 --> 00:24:39,240 Speaker 1: on it, you know, like if you if because I 390 00:24:39,240 --> 00:24:41,960 Speaker 1: think some people have entertained the idea, well, is this 391 00:24:42,040 --> 00:24:44,639 Speaker 1: a police officer that just happened to have this gear 392 00:24:45,320 --> 00:24:47,160 Speaker 1: and they just pull it out of their unit, put 393 00:24:47,200 --> 00:24:50,639 Speaker 1: it on, and they go and assassinate this woman and 394 00:24:50,840 --> 00:24:53,440 Speaker 1: one of the most brutal methodologies that you can bring 395 00:24:53,480 --> 00:24:57,520 Speaker 1: to bear. You look at that and you begin to think, well, 396 00:24:58,640 --> 00:25:01,879 Speaker 1: did is it a police officer? It looks like something 397 00:25:01,920 --> 00:25:06,800 Speaker 1: that has been ordered recently. And again that's another thread 398 00:25:06,960 --> 00:25:10,399 Speaker 1: relative to this tactical gear. There are limited numbers of 399 00:25:10,440 --> 00:25:15,159 Speaker 1: places that you can purchase this from. And knowing what 400 00:25:15,240 --> 00:25:19,000 Speaker 1: I know of the FEDS, Okay, and we've talked about 401 00:25:19,000 --> 00:25:21,959 Speaker 1: this clothing with the FEDS, they do a big focus 402 00:25:22,119 --> 00:25:26,960 Speaker 1: FBI Lab does on identifying clothing, you know, button collections, 403 00:25:27,040 --> 00:25:32,240 Speaker 1: zipper collections, specific brands of clothing. And I really wonder 404 00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:36,439 Speaker 1: how deep down that rabbit hole they went relative to 405 00:25:37,520 --> 00:25:40,800 Speaker 1: all of those items that are being worn and going 406 00:25:40,840 --> 00:25:43,760 Speaker 1: back and tracing all this stuff. Now, I know that 407 00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:46,680 Speaker 1: other people have commented on this, but I think that 408 00:25:46,680 --> 00:25:51,840 Speaker 1: that is certainly an area that would narrow narrow your 409 00:25:51,840 --> 00:25:57,359 Speaker 1: field down here thinking about thinking about the origin of 410 00:25:57,400 --> 00:26:01,480 Speaker 1: this and this is a small unity. So if you 411 00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:10,359 Speaker 1: can extrapolate, you know, from that image specific branding, considering 412 00:26:10,359 --> 00:26:13,800 Speaker 1: that it might be new and did someone go to 413 00:26:13,840 --> 00:26:17,600 Speaker 1: a shop because you know they're only they're only twenty 414 00:26:17,640 --> 00:26:23,200 Speaker 1: five miles from Dallas Dave. There are police supply stores 415 00:26:23,280 --> 00:26:27,040 Speaker 1: all over the place. All right, did they roll into 416 00:26:27,080 --> 00:26:29,520 Speaker 1: a store or did they have it delivered to their house? 417 00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:34,560 Speaker 1: And you're going to draw attention this way, So you know, 418 00:26:34,640 --> 00:26:37,760 Speaker 1: that's another fascinating area of evidence here. And I think 419 00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:43,560 Speaker 1: that when this case, hopefully it's eventually solved, we're going 420 00:26:43,600 --> 00:26:45,520 Speaker 1: to find out a lot about that that we don't 421 00:26:45,520 --> 00:26:52,320 Speaker 1: have to this point. But to that end, when you 422 00:26:52,359 --> 00:26:54,600 Speaker 1: look at this gear that they're wearing, you know what 423 00:26:54,680 --> 00:26:59,280 Speaker 1: I don't see. I don't see a pistol belt. I 424 00:26:59,320 --> 00:27:05,119 Speaker 1: don't see a weapon that is there that would end 425 00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:10,679 Speaker 1: Missy's life in a quick and efficient manner. The weapon 426 00:27:10,680 --> 00:27:14,960 Speaker 1: I do see is perhaps one of the most ghastly 427 00:27:15,040 --> 00:27:18,679 Speaker 1: implements that you could use to perpetrate a crime like this. 428 00:27:36,640 --> 00:27:40,800 Speaker 1: I cannot imagine what it would be like to be 429 00:27:40,880 --> 00:27:45,639 Speaker 1: the finder, and a finder in our terms in the 430 00:27:45,640 --> 00:27:50,040 Speaker 1: medical legal world, we actually have a place on most 431 00:27:50,040 --> 00:27:52,760 Speaker 1: of our documents. There's kind of a standard sheet that 432 00:27:52,840 --> 00:27:56,000 Speaker 1: you fill out in a medical legal death investigation, and 433 00:27:56,119 --> 00:28:00,479 Speaker 1: there's a place that's listed on these documents that say finder. 434 00:28:00,640 --> 00:28:04,200 Speaker 1: Some will say finder of remains. I cannot even begin 435 00:28:04,280 --> 00:28:11,200 Speaker 1: to imagine being the finder of Missy's remains, particularly given 436 00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:13,200 Speaker 1: that it was one of her, as you said, Dave, 437 00:28:13,280 --> 00:28:17,479 Speaker 1: one of her campers, students who you know, let's face it, 438 00:28:17,960 --> 00:28:21,080 Speaker 1: Missy was probably driving her very hard. She probably respected 439 00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:25,119 Speaker 1: Missy and was trying to help her get better physically. 440 00:28:25,920 --> 00:28:28,120 Speaker 1: I can't imagine what it would be like to walk 441 00:28:28,200 --> 00:28:33,840 Speaker 1: in and you're there prepared that day to work out, 442 00:28:34,320 --> 00:28:36,760 Speaker 1: you know that it's been moved inside, you're ad to 443 00:28:36,840 --> 00:28:41,080 Speaker 1: rock and roll, and can you imagine just looking down 444 00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:46,440 Speaker 1: at the floor and seeing seeing your instructor's body, a term. 445 00:28:46,280 --> 00:28:50,400 Speaker 2: That we used, stumbled stumbled upon, that's the term that 446 00:28:50,520 --> 00:28:54,880 Speaker 2: is used. And because we don't know what we know 447 00:28:55,040 --> 00:28:57,880 Speaker 2: so much about this crime and so little about the 448 00:28:57,920 --> 00:29:02,640 Speaker 2: actual act of the crime. And I don't know if 449 00:29:02,680 --> 00:29:06,440 Speaker 2: time I've ever seen the video of a suspect before 450 00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:10,040 Speaker 2: the act took place like we did on this one, 451 00:29:10,080 --> 00:29:12,040 Speaker 2: which is why you and I are many many others 452 00:29:12,120 --> 00:29:14,480 Speaker 2: who covered the case thought, surely this is going to 453 00:29:14,520 --> 00:29:19,440 Speaker 2: be solved quickly. You've got a married woman working out 454 00:29:19,440 --> 00:29:22,720 Speaker 2: people early in the morning hours, and there are going 455 00:29:22,800 --> 00:29:24,360 Speaker 2: to be plenty of suspects. You're going to be able 456 00:29:24,360 --> 00:29:26,800 Speaker 2: to filter those out and boom, we're going to have 457 00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:29,400 Speaker 2: this solved in forty eight hours. But it didn't happen. 458 00:29:29,400 --> 00:29:32,600 Speaker 2: And when police released the video of showing her his 459 00:29:32,760 --> 00:29:37,160 Speaker 2: or her gait the tackle gear, you said it looked 460 00:29:37,160 --> 00:29:39,320 Speaker 2: like maybe it was brand new. It didn't look like 461 00:29:39,360 --> 00:29:41,520 Speaker 2: it had really been worn much the outfit that the 462 00:29:42,120 --> 00:29:47,120 Speaker 2: suspect is wearing. But when the camper stumbles across the 463 00:29:47,160 --> 00:29:52,600 Speaker 2: body of Missy Beavers, the chaos that ensued in that 464 00:29:52,640 --> 00:29:55,720 Speaker 2: person's mind and calling for help calling nine one one. 465 00:29:55,920 --> 00:29:59,360 Speaker 2: There are actually two nine one one calls made. We 466 00:29:59,400 --> 00:30:02,640 Speaker 2: don't know the content of either one, except that there 467 00:30:02,760 --> 00:30:06,280 Speaker 2: was chaos in finding the body of Missy. Beavers and 468 00:30:06,400 --> 00:30:08,320 Speaker 2: police were on the way right away and she was 469 00:30:08,360 --> 00:30:11,640 Speaker 2: pronounced dead at the scene. But what we were told, Joe, 470 00:30:12,320 --> 00:30:16,280 Speaker 2: is that while we saw the suspect walking through the 471 00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:21,280 Speaker 2: halls of the building, that the suspect had a long hammer. 472 00:30:21,440 --> 00:30:24,640 Speaker 2: Is what it was described as a long hammer, and 473 00:30:24,800 --> 00:30:28,480 Speaker 2: that's what we were led to believe, was not led 474 00:30:28,520 --> 00:30:31,640 Speaker 2: to believe, actually told that was the murder weapon. But 475 00:30:31,960 --> 00:30:35,240 Speaker 2: around Missy's body, we haven't seen pictures of this, just 476 00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:37,080 Speaker 2: so you know, I know they exist, but we haven't 477 00:30:37,080 --> 00:30:41,200 Speaker 2: seen them. Around her body were other tools, and all 478 00:30:41,240 --> 00:30:45,160 Speaker 2: of the tools were from the church, meaning that this 479 00:30:45,240 --> 00:30:48,240 Speaker 2: suspect did not show up, as you mentioned, did not 480 00:30:48,280 --> 00:30:50,920 Speaker 2: have a gun belt on. But this suspect did not 481 00:30:51,080 --> 00:30:55,719 Speaker 2: show up with the tools that were found around Missy's body. 482 00:30:56,600 --> 00:30:58,520 Speaker 2: We don't know how many, but we know that it 483 00:30:58,560 --> 00:31:03,720 Speaker 2: was plural tools and it appeared that she had been 484 00:31:04,440 --> 00:31:10,200 Speaker 2: hit in the head and chest with the hammer. But 485 00:31:11,880 --> 00:31:16,520 Speaker 2: they talk they being the police and medical professionals, and 486 00:31:16,640 --> 00:31:19,600 Speaker 2: the autopsy at least the parts that we've seen, they 487 00:31:19,640 --> 00:31:23,040 Speaker 2: refer to puncture wounds. Joe, and having done this show 488 00:31:23,040 --> 00:31:27,000 Speaker 2: with you long enough now I know that what some 489 00:31:27,000 --> 00:31:30,400 Speaker 2: people call a puncture wound is not necessarily how you 490 00:31:30,440 --> 00:31:33,479 Speaker 2: refer to a puncture wound. And I certainly couldn't figure out, 491 00:31:33,560 --> 00:31:36,840 Speaker 2: other than using the claw end of a hammer, how 492 00:31:36,880 --> 00:31:39,280 Speaker 2: to create a puncture wound into a person's body or 493 00:31:39,320 --> 00:31:45,560 Speaker 2: head for that matter. So I'm hoping that based on 494 00:31:45,600 --> 00:31:47,920 Speaker 2: the limiteds off that we have about the death scene, 495 00:31:48,240 --> 00:31:50,720 Speaker 2: that you can explain what happened. 496 00:31:52,200 --> 00:31:54,560 Speaker 1: You know, when we talk about tools that are laying 497 00:31:54,600 --> 00:31:56,680 Speaker 1: about the body, let's start there just for a second, 498 00:31:56,720 --> 00:32:02,440 Speaker 1: because that gives you an end cation. If they're approximating 499 00:32:02,480 --> 00:32:06,560 Speaker 1: the body and they were from the church, then that 500 00:32:06,720 --> 00:32:11,760 Speaker 1: means that those implements are not burglary tools, because when 501 00:32:11,800 --> 00:32:19,000 Speaker 1: people burglarize a structure, people don't know this maybe, but 502 00:32:19,120 --> 00:32:22,000 Speaker 1: you know, it's just like a carpenter. If you're a 503 00:32:22,040 --> 00:32:25,720 Speaker 1: professional thief, you have a tool set that you use. 504 00:32:25,760 --> 00:32:27,440 Speaker 1: You get used to those tools. You know what they 505 00:32:27,440 --> 00:32:29,600 Speaker 1: feel like. You can actually find them in the dark, 506 00:32:30,040 --> 00:32:33,400 Speaker 1: just feeling the contents of a bag, and they'll have 507 00:32:33,440 --> 00:32:35,880 Speaker 1: a kit that they carry with them. So if this 508 00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:40,080 Speaker 1: is something that was acquired within the church, that goes 509 00:32:40,480 --> 00:32:43,720 Speaker 1: out of all the ways that this person was seemingly 510 00:32:43,800 --> 00:32:47,600 Speaker 1: prepared as far as timeline, clothing, all of this sort 511 00:32:47,640 --> 00:32:52,320 Speaker 1: of thing, they didn't show up. They acquire tools from 512 00:32:52,400 --> 00:32:55,840 Speaker 1: inside this place. Well, how would you know where in 513 00:32:55,840 --> 00:33:00,520 Speaker 1: the world to go into this Church of Christ, this 514 00:33:00,640 --> 00:33:03,200 Speaker 1: kind of far flung area, even though it's twenty five 515 00:33:03,240 --> 00:33:05,440 Speaker 1: miles from Dallas, it's out. I mean, once you get 516 00:33:05,480 --> 00:33:09,400 Speaker 1: out from Dallas, there's a whole lot of out Okay, 517 00:33:09,920 --> 00:33:11,760 Speaker 1: if you've never been there, there's a whole lot of 518 00:33:11,800 --> 00:33:12,840 Speaker 1: out out there. 519 00:33:14,000 --> 00:33:18,240 Speaker 2: Which means mid Lothian is a like from a community standpoint, 520 00:33:18,400 --> 00:33:20,960 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, it's self content is not just a suburb 521 00:33:21,120 --> 00:33:23,760 Speaker 2: of Dallas. It is a self contained area that when 522 00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:26,080 Speaker 2: you live in this area, you're not really required to 523 00:33:26,200 --> 00:33:28,560 Speaker 2: drive a whole lot of distance to find whatever you need. 524 00:33:28,720 --> 00:33:30,400 Speaker 2: It can all be done with right there. But you 525 00:33:30,440 --> 00:33:32,840 Speaker 2: have access to the big city life of a top 526 00:33:33,160 --> 00:33:34,760 Speaker 2: market like Dallas for it worth. 527 00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:38,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, you do. And you know any basic basic 528 00:33:38,240 --> 00:33:42,160 Speaker 1: needs can probably be met there. Okay, but you know 529 00:33:42,360 --> 00:33:45,240 Speaker 1: you think about why were these other tools there, and 530 00:33:45,280 --> 00:33:48,360 Speaker 1: then that goes to this idea of this so called 531 00:33:48,480 --> 00:33:52,000 Speaker 1: long hammer. When they're saying long hammer. Now I can 532 00:33:52,040 --> 00:33:57,520 Speaker 1: only base this upon what I am visualizing in in 533 00:33:57,800 --> 00:34:02,920 Speaker 1: the videography. When you consider this long hammer, it looks 534 00:34:02,960 --> 00:34:06,720 Speaker 1: as though when you say long hammer, or you wonder 535 00:34:06,800 --> 00:34:09,439 Speaker 1: if they're saying the handle is long, because it does 536 00:34:09,520 --> 00:34:14,200 Speaker 1: look longer than you would normally see for a hammer, 537 00:34:14,280 --> 00:34:17,400 Speaker 1: you know, a standard claw hammer that you know a 538 00:34:17,440 --> 00:34:20,319 Speaker 1: carpenter might use, or that you just use around your 539 00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:22,960 Speaker 1: house just to hang pictures with hammers come in all 540 00:34:23,000 --> 00:34:25,640 Speaker 1: shapes and sizes. But Dave, you know what really struck 541 00:34:25,640 --> 00:34:27,840 Speaker 1: me about the structure of this thing. It was not 542 00:34:27,960 --> 00:34:30,799 Speaker 1: the long handle. It was the head of this thing. 543 00:34:31,800 --> 00:34:34,719 Speaker 1: When I saw this, and I remember thinking about this 544 00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:40,480 Speaker 1: many years ago, it looked to me almost like a 545 00:34:40,560 --> 00:34:46,000 Speaker 1: geology hammer that you would see out in the field. 546 00:34:46,320 --> 00:34:49,040 Speaker 1: That was my first blush, because it looked like it 547 00:34:49,120 --> 00:34:52,640 Speaker 1: had the regular head of a hammer, the business end 548 00:34:52,640 --> 00:34:54,520 Speaker 1: of the hammer, as you will, but on the backside 549 00:34:54,520 --> 00:34:57,200 Speaker 1: where you would normally have a claw. I swear, Dave, 550 00:34:57,360 --> 00:34:59,040 Speaker 1: this thing that looked like it had a pick on 551 00:34:59,080 --> 00:35:01,719 Speaker 1: the end of it. It did, you know? And I 552 00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:05,759 Speaker 1: can't I can't appreciate it fully. And you know, if 553 00:35:05,800 --> 00:35:11,920 Speaker 1: you've never seen a geology hammer, they're used for chipping 554 00:35:11,960 --> 00:35:16,040 Speaker 1: away stone, all right, and for accessing particular areas that 555 00:35:16,080 --> 00:35:20,560 Speaker 1: are different difficult for geologists to get in. And they 556 00:35:20,600 --> 00:35:24,239 Speaker 1: need both a wide a wide surface to strike with, 557 00:35:24,280 --> 00:35:26,839 Speaker 1: and then they need a very pointed surface to strike with. 558 00:35:27,560 --> 00:35:32,960 Speaker 1: So I was thinking relative to these puncture wounds that 559 00:35:33,000 --> 00:35:37,280 Speaker 1: were going that they have stated now that she had sustained, 560 00:35:37,280 --> 00:35:41,280 Speaker 1: and they were about the head and the chest. Puncture 561 00:35:41,280 --> 00:35:46,200 Speaker 1: wounds can be generated in any any number ways. As 562 00:35:46,239 --> 00:35:48,640 Speaker 1: a matter of fact, let me kind of let me 563 00:35:48,680 --> 00:35:51,360 Speaker 1: give you an insight into the tiniest puncture wound you 564 00:35:51,360 --> 00:35:53,680 Speaker 1: can have. Did you know, do you know what the 565 00:35:56,560 --> 00:36:03,080 Speaker 1: what the acronym for or what the acronym NPW stands 566 00:36:03,080 --> 00:36:09,359 Speaker 1: for no needle puncture wound. So if like, if we're 567 00:36:09,400 --> 00:36:13,239 Speaker 1: examining a body, you know, like somebody that has odd 568 00:36:14,320 --> 00:36:17,840 Speaker 1: or somebody that's had therapeutic intervention in a hospital, and 569 00:36:17,880 --> 00:36:21,320 Speaker 1: you look at their arms, okay, if they've got little 570 00:36:21,360 --> 00:36:24,560 Speaker 1: areas there where a needle has ended, that's actually a 571 00:36:24,560 --> 00:36:27,479 Speaker 1: puncture one, okay. And generally how it's defined is that 572 00:36:28,280 --> 00:36:33,200 Speaker 1: you have to have some type of leading pointed sharp 573 00:36:33,760 --> 00:36:37,560 Speaker 1: edge on it. Now you can't have I've had impalements 574 00:36:37,600 --> 00:36:39,600 Speaker 1: over the years where I've had people that have dropped 575 00:36:39,600 --> 00:36:44,480 Speaker 1: onto cast iron fencing. I've had people that have had 576 00:36:44,560 --> 00:36:47,480 Speaker 1: logs driven through their body and those technically are puncture 577 00:36:47,480 --> 00:36:52,120 Speaker 1: wounds or impalements with associated puncture ones. But they're seeing 578 00:36:52,200 --> 00:36:57,040 Speaker 1: multiple puncture wounds here, and you have to think about 579 00:36:57,440 --> 00:37:00,000 Speaker 1: what does that mean, because if if you were used 580 00:37:00,200 --> 00:37:03,080 Speaker 1: that hammer, and you're using what we commonly refer to 581 00:37:03,080 --> 00:37:05,280 Speaker 1: as the business end of the hammer, that blended area, 582 00:37:05,880 --> 00:37:11,320 Speaker 1: you're going to have a strike that will lacerate the skin, 583 00:37:11,760 --> 00:37:15,160 Speaker 1: It'll tear the skin, and also, particularly with head strikes, 584 00:37:15,680 --> 00:37:19,239 Speaker 1: you're going to have underlying fractures and these things will 585 00:37:19,280 --> 00:37:23,319 Speaker 1: be very robust. Dave hammer attacks are some of the 586 00:37:23,360 --> 00:37:30,279 Speaker 1: most brutal that you can ever encounter out out in 587 00:37:30,320 --> 00:37:34,799 Speaker 1: the field. With a puncture wound, it doesn't look like 588 00:37:34,880 --> 00:37:39,040 Speaker 1: a stab wound. These are not stabs all right. Even 589 00:37:39,040 --> 00:37:42,920 Speaker 1: though a blade, which is what stab wounds are associated with, 590 00:37:43,440 --> 00:37:47,080 Speaker 1: has a leading pointed edge, it also broadens out as 591 00:37:47,320 --> 00:37:50,440 Speaker 1: the knife or the sharp instrument. It could be a machedy, 592 00:37:50,440 --> 00:37:53,160 Speaker 1: a sword, a knife as it enters the body, it 593 00:37:53,160 --> 00:37:58,319 Speaker 1: will make a slit, like a slit like insult to 594 00:37:58,400 --> 00:38:02,840 Speaker 1: the body. There was a period of time in my 595 00:38:02,920 --> 00:38:08,319 Speaker 1: career where I worked several cases involving homeless people that 596 00:38:08,360 --> 00:38:12,919 Speaker 1: have taken rebar off of partially collapsed buildings, cut them 597 00:38:12,920 --> 00:38:17,080 Speaker 1: off and wrapped one end of the rebar with duct 598 00:38:17,120 --> 00:38:21,520 Speaker 1: tape and filed the tip of steel rebar down so 599 00:38:21,560 --> 00:38:24,080 Speaker 1: that it makes a very sharp point and they can 600 00:38:24,080 --> 00:38:26,160 Speaker 1: carry in their pocket like a shift you know, like 601 00:38:26,200 --> 00:38:29,640 Speaker 1: you see in prison. And the interesting thing about now, 602 00:38:29,719 --> 00:38:32,960 Speaker 1: those are puncture wounds. The interesting thing about it is 603 00:38:32,960 --> 00:38:36,719 Speaker 1: when you essentially insert this into somebody's body, guess what 604 00:38:36,760 --> 00:38:41,239 Speaker 1: it looks like. Looks like gunshot wound because it's that caliber. 605 00:38:41,880 --> 00:38:45,759 Speaker 1: So when they're saying puncture wound, this is very very specific. Now, 606 00:38:46,440 --> 00:38:48,920 Speaker 1: are there other things out there that could create a 607 00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:55,959 Speaker 1: puncture womb? Well, I've heard some people mentioned the term 608 00:38:56,280 --> 00:39:00,640 Speaker 1: screwdriver is a screwed a street. 609 00:39:01,600 --> 00:39:04,279 Speaker 2: Yeah, but let me back up. Could you say screwdriver? Joe? 610 00:39:04,280 --> 00:39:07,040 Speaker 2: And we have covered this story again as I mentioned 611 00:39:07,080 --> 00:39:10,000 Speaker 2: a minute ago, you run with the Nancy Grace Yeah 612 00:39:10,040 --> 00:39:13,680 Speaker 2: on her by the way, shameless plug Nancy had her 613 00:39:13,760 --> 00:39:17,000 Speaker 2: show is now on the network that Doctor Phil has 614 00:39:17,040 --> 00:39:20,719 Speaker 2: launched Merritt Street Media, And on that show, you heard 615 00:39:20,760 --> 00:39:25,759 Speaker 2: Something by Scott Brooks. Scott Brooks is a friend of 616 00:39:28,280 --> 00:39:30,760 Speaker 2: Missy Beaver's husband and has been for a long Brandon 617 00:39:30,760 --> 00:39:33,880 Speaker 2: Beaver's and Brandon Beaver sat down with Scott Brooks and 618 00:39:33,880 --> 00:39:37,840 Speaker 2: did a long form interview. He hasn't talked to police 619 00:39:37,920 --> 00:39:40,239 Speaker 2: much over the last several years. I mean, he has 620 00:39:40,280 --> 00:39:42,680 Speaker 2: not talked to the public much over the last several years. 621 00:39:43,160 --> 00:39:45,840 Speaker 2: And here coming up on the eight year anniversary or 622 00:39:45,920 --> 00:39:49,880 Speaker 2: marking of her murder, Brandon sat down with Scott Brooks 623 00:39:49,960 --> 00:39:52,560 Speaker 2: and these things came out. So Scott Brooks was booked 624 00:39:52,600 --> 00:39:55,560 Speaker 2: onto the show as a guest along with you and 625 00:39:55,960 --> 00:40:00,200 Speaker 2: miss and Nancy Grace, and he said, the screwdriver, this 626 00:40:00,280 --> 00:40:02,640 Speaker 2: is not anything I had ever heard. And I've covered 627 00:40:02,640 --> 00:40:06,040 Speaker 2: this story since it began, Joe, and the only thing 628 00:40:06,080 --> 00:40:08,880 Speaker 2: I had ever heard until Nancy Gray show this past 629 00:40:08,920 --> 00:40:14,080 Speaker 2: week was that long hammered that he or she was 630 00:40:14,160 --> 00:40:17,600 Speaker 2: carrying throughout the building. That's what I thought was the weapon. 631 00:40:17,640 --> 00:40:22,279 Speaker 2: But then Scott Brooks says, it's a screwdriver. That's a 632 00:40:22,280 --> 00:40:23,520 Speaker 2: big difference to me, Joe. 633 00:40:23,920 --> 00:40:28,280 Speaker 1: It is and screwdriver injuries are going to be Now, Okay, 634 00:40:28,440 --> 00:40:31,840 Speaker 1: first off, we have to categorize the screwdriver because as 635 00:40:32,200 --> 00:40:37,560 Speaker 1: you and I both know honeydew List, right, Yeah, if 636 00:40:38,600 --> 00:40:42,400 Speaker 1: are you using a Phillips or are you using a 637 00:40:42,400 --> 00:40:47,200 Speaker 1: flathead traditional screwdriver? Okay, those two injuries are going to 638 00:40:47,239 --> 00:40:50,200 Speaker 1: look different, all right. So if you think about a 639 00:40:50,239 --> 00:40:54,080 Speaker 1: Phillips which comes to a very distinct point on the end, 640 00:40:55,080 --> 00:41:01,920 Speaker 1: that again can generate a classic look puncture wound. And 641 00:41:01,960 --> 00:41:05,399 Speaker 1: so if you get those in tight well, I don't 642 00:41:05,400 --> 00:41:07,040 Speaker 1: want to get off into that yet, because there's a 643 00:41:07,080 --> 00:41:11,799 Speaker 1: whole there's a whole, a whole profile that comes up 644 00:41:11,840 --> 00:41:14,320 Speaker 1: with puncture winds like this in a very intimate space. 645 00:41:15,000 --> 00:41:20,040 Speaker 1: But those injuries generated by safer instance, a classic Phillips 646 00:41:20,120 --> 00:41:26,840 Speaker 1: head screwdriver are going to appear completely different than safer instance, 647 00:41:26,880 --> 00:41:28,960 Speaker 1: a flathead. And as a matter of fact, do you 648 00:41:29,000 --> 00:41:32,000 Speaker 1: know what they call the tip of a flathead screwdriver? 649 00:41:32,120 --> 00:41:35,200 Speaker 1: They call it a blade. It's actually referred Yeah, that's 650 00:41:35,200 --> 00:41:37,440 Speaker 1: actually referred to a blade. And you think about it, 651 00:41:37,760 --> 00:41:39,560 Speaker 1: and you put it in the slot, and you can 652 00:41:39,600 --> 00:41:41,680 Speaker 1: tighten and you can loosen and all that sort of thing. 653 00:41:42,040 --> 00:41:47,280 Speaker 1: It's not as ergonomically effective, I don't think as a Phillips. 654 00:41:47,320 --> 00:41:50,799 Speaker 1: That's why Phillips was developed. And there have been other 655 00:41:50,840 --> 00:41:52,640 Speaker 1: iterations of these things a long way. 656 00:41:52,920 --> 00:41:55,600 Speaker 2: Like you and me know that the butter knife also 657 00:41:55,680 --> 00:41:56,920 Speaker 2: can serve as a bit. 658 00:41:56,800 --> 00:42:00,760 Speaker 1: It can used on this, yes it can. And spoons 659 00:42:00,760 --> 00:42:01,800 Speaker 1: work real well too. 660 00:42:01,680 --> 00:42:04,640 Speaker 2: As a matter of fact, but that's I guess. I 661 00:42:04,920 --> 00:42:07,160 Speaker 2: just had never heard screw to ever mentioned in this 662 00:42:07,280 --> 00:42:08,120 Speaker 2: case at. 663 00:42:07,920 --> 00:42:10,400 Speaker 1: All, and I had neither, and so I was And 664 00:42:10,640 --> 00:42:12,480 Speaker 1: that's one of the reasons I kind of wanted to 665 00:42:12,480 --> 00:42:16,440 Speaker 1: explore this with you because when he drops this information, 666 00:42:16,640 --> 00:42:18,000 Speaker 1: and I know that there are a lot of people 667 00:42:18,040 --> 00:42:19,960 Speaker 1: out there that have been following this case for years. 668 00:42:20,440 --> 00:42:22,640 Speaker 1: Maybe other people have heard this and maybe other people 669 00:42:22,680 --> 00:42:26,440 Speaker 1: have commented on it, but from a forensic standpoint, it 670 00:42:26,480 --> 00:42:31,640 Speaker 1: is very unique. I, like you, had always thought that 671 00:42:31,640 --> 00:42:36,120 Speaker 1: it was the hammer and to facilitate this kind of 672 00:42:37,360 --> 00:42:41,480 Speaker 1: multiple injuries. And here's the other thing. Day. Now, this 673 00:42:41,560 --> 00:42:51,400 Speaker 1: goes into the nature of this attack. Bludgeonings and knife attacks, 674 00:42:51,800 --> 00:42:55,680 Speaker 1: sharp force injury attacks, as you and I have discussed, 675 00:42:55,960 --> 00:43:01,160 Speaker 1: are the most intimate of all kinds of homicides. It's 676 00:43:01,200 --> 00:43:03,719 Speaker 1: not like you're shooting somebody from across the room, Dave. 677 00:43:04,880 --> 00:43:07,200 Speaker 1: And again we go back to what did I say 678 00:43:07,239 --> 00:43:09,880 Speaker 1: earlier in the video. I'm seeing there, I ain't wearing 679 00:43:09,880 --> 00:43:11,439 Speaker 1: a gun belt. Doesn't mean they don't have a gun 680 00:43:11,480 --> 00:43:14,560 Speaker 1: on them. I'm just saying I didn't show up with 681 00:43:14,680 --> 00:43:19,600 Speaker 1: a gun to dispatch Missy. And I'm not going to 682 00:43:19,680 --> 00:43:24,880 Speaker 1: use the term humane in a quick manner. Okay. This 683 00:43:25,000 --> 00:43:28,160 Speaker 1: is not like we're talking about headshot, all right. We're 684 00:43:28,239 --> 00:43:34,040 Speaker 1: talking about being in her space. We're talking about being 685 00:43:34,160 --> 00:43:37,320 Speaker 1: up close and personal. Maybe after you've gotten the upper hand, 686 00:43:37,640 --> 00:43:41,840 Speaker 1: because this person obviously weighs more than Missy. Now Missy 687 00:43:41,960 --> 00:43:46,480 Speaker 1: is you know, she's well defined, she's in shape. But 688 00:43:47,000 --> 00:43:49,319 Speaker 1: if that person got leverage on her and got her 689 00:43:49,360 --> 00:43:54,600 Speaker 1: down to the ground and starts attacking her with the 690 00:43:54,600 --> 00:43:59,000 Speaker 1: scene which I've worked hammer attacks before, where the individual 691 00:43:59,160 --> 00:44:04,640 Speaker 1: was on top of the individual, just pounding away, this 692 00:44:04,760 --> 00:44:10,120 Speaker 1: is going to be markedly gruesome. And what you're going 693 00:44:10,160 --> 00:44:14,680 Speaker 1: to see is you'll see perhaps and this is kind 694 00:44:14,719 --> 00:44:17,279 Speaker 1: of the way we interpret these things. Many times, if 695 00:44:17,280 --> 00:44:21,480 Speaker 1: there's an initial attack with an instrument, you might have, 696 00:44:24,280 --> 00:44:29,640 Speaker 1: you might have weapons or injuries that are kind of diffuse. Okay, 697 00:44:29,800 --> 00:44:32,480 Speaker 1: they're away from a central area. That might be the 698 00:44:32,520 --> 00:44:35,920 Speaker 1: initial injuries because you're trying to wound the person. But 699 00:44:35,960 --> 00:44:38,239 Speaker 1: once they get wounded, say they grip an area like 700 00:44:38,280 --> 00:44:40,600 Speaker 1: a shoulder or something like that. After they've been injured, 701 00:44:40,600 --> 00:44:43,160 Speaker 1: the next thing, you know, the perpetrator, who has a 702 00:44:43,160 --> 00:44:46,719 Speaker 1: tremendous amount of will about them, wrestles this individual to 703 00:44:46,760 --> 00:44:49,200 Speaker 1: the floor. Now you're on top of them, and these 704 00:44:49,520 --> 00:44:54,160 Speaker 1: injuries suddenly become concentrated. Day almost like a shot group 705 00:44:54,400 --> 00:44:58,040 Speaker 1: with finding a pistol where you're trying to tighten that 706 00:44:58,080 --> 00:45:01,200 Speaker 1: group down. Well, now you're right on top them. You're 707 00:45:01,280 --> 00:45:05,359 Speaker 1: driving this instrument into her body over and over and Dave, 708 00:45:05,560 --> 00:45:08,720 Speaker 1: here's the thing. It wasn't like it was just driven 709 00:45:08,760 --> 00:45:13,840 Speaker 1: into her chest. We're talking about she's got these puncture 710 00:45:13,880 --> 00:45:18,640 Speaker 1: wounds to her head. That you're off into a completely 711 00:45:18,680 --> 00:45:22,319 Speaker 1: different area here, because now you're in an area that 712 00:45:22,640 --> 00:45:29,080 Speaker 1: could imply disfigurement, maiming, destruction, those sorts of things where 713 00:45:29,080 --> 00:45:34,799 Speaker 1: you're trying to really damage her to the point you're 714 00:45:34,840 --> 00:45:37,480 Speaker 1: not just simply trying to end her life at this 715 00:45:37,560 --> 00:45:42,160 Speaker 1: point in time. And again we're left with again more 716 00:45:42,480 --> 00:45:46,360 Speaker 1: questions than answers because we don't know the specifics around 717 00:45:46,400 --> 00:45:51,600 Speaker 1: the case as far as some of the more pointed 718 00:45:51,640 --> 00:45:54,080 Speaker 1: bits of evidence along the way that the police do know. 719 00:45:55,120 --> 00:45:59,600 Speaker 1: I'm still baffled. I think to this point that we're 720 00:45:59,719 --> 00:46:04,560 Speaker 1: given a very small population in this area, at a 721 00:46:04,640 --> 00:46:09,799 Speaker 1: very specific location, at a very specific time, and with 722 00:46:10,719 --> 00:46:17,720 Speaker 1: a very apparently concentrated attack on this woman with something 723 00:46:17,760 --> 00:46:23,320 Speaker 1: that could be termed not the most merciful way to 724 00:46:23,440 --> 00:46:27,479 Speaker 1: kill somebody. And we're talking about a person that showed 725 00:46:27,560 --> 00:46:31,759 Speaker 1: up prepared, prepared from the perspective of understanding what was 726 00:46:31,800 --> 00:46:36,120 Speaker 1: going on outside the church, in that the classes had 727 00:46:36,120 --> 00:46:39,439 Speaker 1: been moved indoors, they knew about the weather, they knew 728 00:46:39,440 --> 00:46:42,239 Speaker 1: that it was happening at that particular time, and they're 729 00:46:42,239 --> 00:46:47,000 Speaker 1: wearing very specific garb. It seems as though that there 730 00:46:47,120 --> 00:46:50,760 Speaker 1: is a huge collection of breadcrumbs here. I just don't 731 00:46:50,800 --> 00:46:55,120 Speaker 1: know if they found the path to quite follow yet. 732 00:46:56,840 --> 00:47:01,000 Speaker 1: I'm Joseph Scott Morgan and this is body packs 733 00:47:05,560 --> 00:47:05,960 Speaker 2: Mm hmm.