WEBVTT - Ep. 6 - Shattering The System: "A Disturbing Pattern" 0:00:00.400 --> 0:00:03.120 In this podcast, we're going to talk frankly but sensitively 0:00:03.160 --> 0:00:07.280 about issues some people might find disturbing, including rape and suicide. 0:00:07.880 --> 0:00:10.560 If you or someone you know is suicidal in the 0:00:10.720 --> 0:00:14.080 US down nine to eighty eight, check out this podcast 0:00:14.160 --> 0:00:18.040 notes page for information on LGBT plus mental health resources 0:00:18.079 --> 0:00:19.000 in your community. 0:00:28.920 --> 0:00:32.479 Something that I've heard nearly everyone admit about this story 0:00:32.560 --> 0:00:33.600 and the case of ed Buck. 0:00:34.720 --> 0:00:38.440 It's hard. The facts themselves hard. 0:00:39.280 --> 0:00:42.680 Two gay black men were found dead, two men dead 0:00:43.200 --> 0:00:47.559 eighteen months apart in ed Buck's West Hollywood apartment. Ed 0:00:47.560 --> 0:00:50.760 Buck was accused of torturing black men, getting them high 0:00:50.800 --> 0:00:53.960 and addicted to meth. He's accused of shooting them up 0:00:53.960 --> 0:00:56.800 with meth. And he would watch these black men wearing 0:00:56.840 --> 0:00:58.400 the white underwear that he gave. 0:00:58.200 --> 0:01:00.000 Them, writhe in pain. 0:01:01.320 --> 0:01:03.760 And even after Jamel Moore died of an overdose in 0:01:03.800 --> 0:01:07.400 at Buck's apartment, the local power structure let ed Buck 0:01:07.840 --> 0:01:09.280 keep endangering men. 0:01:10.000 --> 0:01:11.480 He kept torturing. 0:01:11.000 --> 0:01:15.039 Them and killing them. Eighteen months after Jamel Moore died, 0:01:15.080 --> 0:01:19.560 Timothy Dean was also found dead same circumstances. It's hard 0:01:19.600 --> 0:01:21.880 to wrap your head around that than it can make 0:01:21.920 --> 0:01:25.280 your heart sick. Now I've learned in journalism that even 0:01:25.319 --> 0:01:28.840 if you are not a victim, you can be traumatized. 0:01:30.000 --> 0:01:32.319 Later in this episode, we're going to take a deeper 0:01:32.400 --> 0:01:35.760 dive into trauma and mental health. We'll examine some of 0:01:35.800 --> 0:01:38.360 the psychological hurdles ed Buck's. 0:01:38.040 --> 0:01:40.120 Victims may have been navigating. 0:01:40.520 --> 0:01:43.160 For that matter, we'll take a look at social emotional 0:01:43.240 --> 0:01:46.880 challenges that are happening all around us. The challenge is 0:01:47.240 --> 0:01:51.480 so many of us are facing every single day. But first, 0:01:51.720 --> 0:01:54.040 we're going to try to make sense of the senseless, 0:01:54.560 --> 0:01:57.320 to try to explain why it took so long for 0:01:57.560 --> 0:02:03.560 ed Buck to be held accountable for his crimes. This 0:02:04.120 --> 0:02:07.040 is shattering the system. Today, we get a framework for 0:02:07.160 --> 0:02:10.600 understanding not only his victims, but also the perpetrators in 0:02:10.680 --> 0:02:11.160 this case. 0:02:12.440 --> 0:02:34.640 More after this break nine emergency. 0:02:36.680 --> 0:02:40.240 On January seventh, twenty nineteen, responding to a nine to 0:02:40.240 --> 0:02:43.360 one to one call from Aducks apartment, paramedics found a 0:02:43.400 --> 0:02:47.480 fifty five year old black man lying on responsive on 0:02:47.520 --> 0:02:50.680 a mattress on the floor. He was naked except for 0:02:50.800 --> 0:02:55.320 white briefs. His mouth was obscured by a dark purge 0:02:55.360 --> 0:02:58.600 of blood. This was the second time in eighteen months 0:02:58.600 --> 0:03:01.560 that police had responded to a call and found the 0:03:01.639 --> 0:03:04.919 man dead in ed Buck's apartment. Ed Buck once again 0:03:04.960 --> 0:03:10.399 told sheriff's deputies the dead man was his friend. Toxicology 0:03:10.440 --> 0:03:13.840 reports showed an overdose of methamphetamine mixed with alcohol that 0:03:14.040 --> 0:03:18.239 killed Timothy Dean. Here's La County District Attorney Jackie Lacy 0:03:18.360 --> 0:03:21.760 talking about why she wasn't able to arrest at Buck 0:03:21.919 --> 0:03:22.440 at the time. 0:03:23.200 --> 0:03:27.920 We can't file a criminal case based on who has 0:03:27.960 --> 0:03:29.359 the loudest voice. 0:03:29.440 --> 0:03:30.800 Did we go out there and arrest him? 0:03:30.840 --> 0:03:34.000 Now the clock starts ticking, and it wouldn't be ethical 0:03:34.080 --> 0:03:37.080 right now to arrest him until we really had the evidence. 0:03:37.720 --> 0:03:39.960 Eight months after Timothy Dean was found dead in ed 0:03:39.960 --> 0:03:43.560 Buck's apartment, yet another man implicated ed Buck in a 0:03:43.600 --> 0:03:47.360 serious crime. He said Buck offered him cash and marijuana 0:03:47.440 --> 0:03:51.120 exchange for sex, and according to prosecutors, Buck gave the 0:03:51.200 --> 0:03:54.680 young man a drink, saying it was vodka. The young 0:03:54.680 --> 0:03:58.160 man lost consciousness, awaking to ed Buck injecting him with 0:03:58.240 --> 0:04:02.440 a syringe while he had metal clamps placed on his 0:04:02.520 --> 0:04:05.600 body making it hard for him to move. Now, this 0:04:05.720 --> 0:04:09.280 victim lived to tell the story. He escaped or fled 0:04:09.360 --> 0:04:12.880 bus apartment and ran to a nearby gas station for help. 0:04:13.520 --> 0:04:16.080 Hank Scott covered West Hollywood over the years and the 0:04:16.240 --> 0:04:19.080 ed Buck case. He said ed Buck lrd men's his 0:04:19.160 --> 0:04:22.719 apartment in a variety of ways, using sites such as 0:04:23.040 --> 0:04:26.600 grinder or Adam for Adam. He enticed the men with 0:04:26.760 --> 0:04:29.960 offers of drugs and money, and he used words like 0:04:30.160 --> 0:04:31.839 generous in his profile. 0:04:32.680 --> 0:04:36.280 Generous means I'll pay you for sex, and ed Buck 0:04:36.360 --> 0:04:38.840 would do something like that. I'm sure because that's how 0:04:38.880 --> 0:04:42.080 he lured these people over through this sixty three year 0:04:42.160 --> 0:04:45.960 old white a man's apartment and put on the tidy 0:04:46.040 --> 0:04:48.479 white eats, the white underwear, and that was just one 0:04:48.480 --> 0:04:52.320 of his weird passions. He then would share a little 0:04:52.400 --> 0:04:55.120 drugs and there were some cases where apparently and with 0:04:55.320 --> 0:04:58.760 the testimony, he shared not of danger strugs with young 0:04:58.839 --> 0:05:00.880 men to get them in a state where. 0:05:00.680 --> 0:05:03.520 He could put out there being aware of it, slowly 0:05:04.839 --> 0:05:07.640 into their arms. Now, this was not meth comes in 0:05:07.720 --> 0:05:10.360 many forms. This was not a good that they sported 0:05:10.760 --> 0:05:14.640 drug until ed Buck liked to shoot them up. 0:05:15.040 --> 0:05:19.240 It's called slamming, and that was something that ed Buck 0:05:19.360 --> 0:05:20.719 had a strange passion for. 0:05:25.279 --> 0:05:28.000 I don't feel normal. I honestly think he has to 0:05:28.040 --> 0:05:32.280 do with the drugs. It makes me feel horrible. Ed 0:05:32.320 --> 0:05:34.520 Buck is the one to think he gave me my 0:05:34.600 --> 0:05:37.520 first injection of crystal myth. It was painful. 0:05:39.600 --> 0:05:42.400 I wasn't politically aligned with ed Buck. I didn't see 0:05:42.560 --> 0:05:47.920 I didn't share his worldview, and my experience was that 0:05:47.960 --> 0:05:51.720 anybody who was on the other side of him, he 0:05:51.800 --> 0:05:52.480 made an enemy. 0:05:52.760 --> 0:05:56.400 Lindsay Horvat served on West Hollywood City Council for many years. 0:05:56.640 --> 0:05:59.920 She's now on the La County Board of Supervisors Historic. 0:06:00.240 --> 0:06:03.680 The relationship between the sheriff and we hose gay community 0:06:03.880 --> 0:06:07.520 is problematic, says Horvath. The sheriff's office is in the 0:06:07.520 --> 0:06:09.200 heart of the gay nightlife district. 0:06:11.680 --> 0:06:15.120 But if you're at the LGBT nightlife destinations that most 0:06:15.160 --> 0:06:18.000 people associate with the city, you can probably see this 0:06:18.080 --> 0:06:18.720 sheriff station. 0:06:20.480 --> 0:06:23.120 It sort of goes without saying that you weren't pleased 0:06:23.160 --> 0:06:27.040 with how the sheriff's deputies handled ed Buck, which is 0:06:27.080 --> 0:06:29.920 why we're here absolutely so keeping them that train of 0:06:29.960 --> 0:06:34.440 thought of not being trained and not always being culturally competent. 0:06:34.880 --> 0:06:37.919 Help me understand what would frustrate you about, say the 0:06:37.920 --> 0:06:41.240 sheriff's deputies and dealing with the death of Jamel Moore. 0:06:42.320 --> 0:06:47.040 Well, it was more than frustration. It was absolutely devastating 0:06:47.080 --> 0:06:50.960 to hear about the death of Jamel Moore. The Sheriff's 0:06:51.000 --> 0:06:58.400 deputies who were involved in the investigation had indicated at 0:06:58.560 --> 0:07:01.040 some point thereafter that it it wasn't the first time 0:07:01.120 --> 0:07:05.560 that they had been called to that particular residence, and 0:07:05.680 --> 0:07:09.760 so not only in that specific investigation, but just knowing 0:07:10.040 --> 0:07:14.360 that there were ongoing issues with that residence and to 0:07:14.480 --> 0:07:17.960 know that ultimately it resulted in the death of now 0:07:17.960 --> 0:07:21.920 we know multiple people at that residence was just absolutely 0:07:22.000 --> 0:07:24.240 heartbreaking to know that it was something that was known 0:07:24.400 --> 0:07:27.440 to law enforcement and yet it still happened. 0:07:31.640 --> 0:07:34.840 Nixon said she was flabbergasted when she saw the surveillance 0:07:34.840 --> 0:07:38.880 images Fox eleven obtained exclusively from Bunk's apartment building the 0:07:39.000 --> 0:07:42.360 night her son was found dead. They allegedly show another 0:07:42.440 --> 0:07:45.160 young man trying to get up to Bunk's apartment while 0:07:45.240 --> 0:07:47.960 deputies were still on scene before. 0:07:47.680 --> 0:07:48.440 He shoot away. 0:07:51.400 --> 0:07:54.040 While Buck was showing up to bars and jo and 0:07:54.120 --> 0:07:57.120 the turnstile of black men into his apartment found no 0:07:57.320 --> 0:08:00.480 lack of men willing to enter his place. Something in 0:08:00.520 --> 0:08:04.760 the political landscape, though kind of shifted at bucks crimes 0:08:04.800 --> 0:08:08.320 began to attract the attention of the federal. 0:08:07.880 --> 0:08:13.840 Government, so I was very concerned. My first concern was 0:08:13.880 --> 0:08:17.240 making sure that he didn't do this to another victim. 0:08:17.600 --> 0:08:18.680 That's Chelsea NoREL. 0:08:18.840 --> 0:08:22.040 She's with the US Attorney's Office in the Central District 0:08:22.120 --> 0:08:26.320 of California. Even after the Los Angeles County District Attorney's Office, 0:08:26.520 --> 0:08:30.120 these are the local prosecutors failed to indict ed Buck, 0:08:30.320 --> 0:08:35.200 Norell says her office. The federal prosecutors could not turn 0:08:35.240 --> 0:08:37.559 the blind eye to the fact that two men had 0:08:37.679 --> 0:08:40.800 ended up dead in bucks apartment, and they began to 0:08:40.840 --> 0:08:41.280 watch his. 0:08:41.320 --> 0:08:45.320 Place, making sure that we had units on the house 0:08:45.520 --> 0:08:49.839 where we could observe him, where we could monitor the 0:08:50.040 --> 0:08:52.360 ingress and egress of people coming in and out of 0:08:52.360 --> 0:08:57.120 his apartment that go on for We came in in 0:08:57.200 --> 0:09:02.400 the summer of twenty nineteen and we immediately started taking 0:09:02.720 --> 0:09:05.960 measures to the extent we could with the resources that 0:09:06.000 --> 0:09:09.440 we had. We tried to monitor him as much as 0:09:09.480 --> 0:09:12.000 we could, but then not hit a fever pitch when 0:09:12.120 --> 0:09:16.040 he had another victim in September of twenty nineteen. 0:09:16.240 --> 0:09:20.000 That victim identified as John Doe, that victim is the 0:09:20.000 --> 0:09:22.959 one who escaped Bucks apartment after he was injected with 0:09:23.080 --> 0:09:27.360 a dangerous dose of myth. John Doe very well may 0:09:27.440 --> 0:09:30.160 have saved his own life when he fled Bucks apartment 0:09:30.320 --> 0:09:34.160 and called nine to one one. John Doe is alive. 0:09:34.880 --> 0:09:37.679 His reports of what happened to him were just too 0:09:37.760 --> 0:09:41.400 hard to ignore. I'm Snari Glinton, and this is shattering 0:09:41.400 --> 0:09:58.120 the system more after a break, the li District Attorney 0:09:58.240 --> 0:10:01.120 Jackie Lacey was getting a lot of heat and one 0:10:01.160 --> 0:10:03.800 of the chief complaints against her office was well she 0:10:03.960 --> 0:10:07.400 didn't indict or prosecute at Buck. Now we need to 0:10:07.440 --> 0:10:12.520 talk about Jackie Lacy because she is a pioneer. Born 0:10:12.559 --> 0:10:14.959 and raised in Crenshaw and Los Angeles, she joined the 0:10:15.120 --> 0:10:19.360 lada's office in nineteen eighty six and spent twenty five 0:10:19.480 --> 0:10:22.880 years on a steady climb. Lacey was elected as the 0:10:22.920 --> 0:10:26.880 District Attorney for Los Angeles in twenty twelve, making history. 0:10:27.160 --> 0:10:30.479 She was the first woman and the first African American 0:10:30.679 --> 0:10:34.000 to hold that office. Jackie Lacey was actually an anomaly 0:10:34.080 --> 0:10:37.760 among the newer big city prosecutors. She had a reputation 0:10:37.840 --> 0:10:40.360 for being tough on crime. And while it's true that 0:10:40.480 --> 0:10:43.760 LA County has become a Democratic stronghold. It's kind of 0:10:43.760 --> 0:10:46.600 important to remember that while the city of La is 0:10:46.800 --> 0:10:49.959 deep blue and the city of West Hollywood, where ed 0:10:50.040 --> 0:10:53.400 Buck lived, is blue or still, there are eighty six 0:10:53.480 --> 0:10:56.440 other cities in La County, and the farther you get 0:10:56.559 --> 0:10:59.440 from the center of Los Angeles, the rehdder and redder 0:10:59.440 --> 0:11:03.160 of those cities get. Jackie Lacy, the district attorney, was 0:11:03.200 --> 0:11:07.280 a longtime Democratic operative inside the city, so she had 0:11:07.280 --> 0:11:10.720 to portray herself as a progressive there and outside the city. 0:11:11.000 --> 0:11:14.280 She wanted to portray an image that was tough on crime. 0:11:15.520 --> 0:11:19.720 The Sheriff's department, they saw that mister Moore was dead, 0:11:20.480 --> 0:11:24.000 but they investigated it sort of like an overdose, and 0:11:24.480 --> 0:11:27.800 we know they found some things, but we contend that 0:11:28.200 --> 0:11:28.800 it's illegal. 0:11:28.840 --> 0:11:29.680 How they searched for it. 0:11:29.720 --> 0:11:32.640 They needed a warrant and stake court could never come in. 0:11:38.400 --> 0:11:41.720 After the death of Jamel Moore, La County DA, the 0:11:41.760 --> 0:11:46.440 local prosecutor, Jackie Lacy, said there wasn't enough evidence to 0:11:46.600 --> 0:11:49.760 charge at Buck. There was still no charges after a 0:11:49.960 --> 0:11:53.240 second man, Timothy Dean, was found dead in Buck's apartment. 0:11:53.880 --> 0:11:59.000 Criticism of Jackie Lacy got intense activists and regular. 0:11:58.600 --> 0:12:00.839 People wanted buck prosecuted. 0:12:01.679 --> 0:12:04.719 Meanwhile, there were an array of changes to the way 0:12:04.760 --> 0:12:08.000 the government did business. Remember this is the Trump era 0:12:08.440 --> 0:12:11.480 when it came to drug policy. This shift in drug 0:12:11.520 --> 0:12:14.480 policy was a response to the opioid epidemic, and with 0:12:14.600 --> 0:12:18.000 a ballooning number of deaths, there was a shift to 0:12:18.080 --> 0:12:21.960 stop treating those overdoses as casualties of addiction and to 0:12:21.960 --> 0:12:23.600 start treating them as crime. 0:12:23.840 --> 0:12:29.040 And historically overdoses were treated more like an accident. 0:12:29.080 --> 0:12:33.240 In my judgment, Nick Hanna is the former US Attorney 0:12:33.280 --> 0:12:37.439 for the Central District of California, a Trump administration appointee. 0:12:38.000 --> 0:12:41.000 You know, police would be called and it would be 0:12:41.800 --> 0:12:44.319 you know, somebody overdosed and that's tragic, but it wasn't 0:12:44.360 --> 0:12:46.640 treated sort of as a criminal offense. 0:12:46.720 --> 0:12:47.480 And what can be. 0:12:47.360 --> 0:12:51.439 Done On the federal side, there's a very powerful federal 0:12:51.480 --> 0:12:55.520 statute that makes it a crime to supply drugs that 0:12:55.600 --> 0:12:59.160 result in aid death. And that's a unique federal statute 0:12:59.400 --> 0:13:02.920 with a very heavy penalty, a twenty year mandatory minimum. 0:13:03.240 --> 0:13:05.480 It would be the response to the opioid crisis that 0:13:05.520 --> 0:13:09.000 would make that statue look attractive. All the officials we 0:13:09.080 --> 0:13:12.439 talked to from the US Attorney's office talk about cooperation 0:13:13.000 --> 0:13:15.720 almost as if it were Sesame Street. No one will 0:13:15.760 --> 0:13:20.120 breathe a word about politics, but there is always a 0:13:20.120 --> 0:13:24.120 bit of politics or one upsmanship between the various law 0:13:24.160 --> 0:13:28.240 enforcement agencies. So while Jackie Lacy, a local Democrat, was 0:13:28.240 --> 0:13:32.440 looking vulnerable in front of voters, the federal prosecutor, a 0:13:32.440 --> 0:13:37.080 Trump appointee, was going to handle her biggest headache again 0:13:37.400 --> 0:13:38.439 neck Hannah. 0:13:38.480 --> 0:13:40.840 We decided to set up this task force to try 0:13:40.840 --> 0:13:43.880 to see whether we could make an impact and stop 0:13:44.080 --> 0:13:47.560 people who were just making money and not caring whether 0:13:47.600 --> 0:13:50.880 they killed somebody or not. And in that context, I 0:13:50.920 --> 0:13:53.280 believe it was one of the task force officers who 0:13:53.320 --> 0:13:55.280 was assigned to that task force, one of the local 0:13:55.400 --> 0:14:00.360 sheriff's deputies, who brought the ed Buck investigation to the 0:14:00.400 --> 0:14:04.960 attention of our office and said, look, essentially, there's this 0:14:05.080 --> 0:14:08.160 case that I'm aware of. It's not a fentanyl case, 0:14:08.720 --> 0:14:12.080 but it's similar in the sense of somebody providing drugs 0:14:12.800 --> 0:14:15.400 that results in death. And you know, maybe you guys 0:14:15.400 --> 0:14:18.360 could take a look at it. And so I assigned 0:14:18.679 --> 0:14:21.640 prosecutors in my office to take a look at it, 0:14:21.680 --> 0:14:25.440 to work with the Sheriff's department and also with DEA 0:14:25.560 --> 0:14:27.840 to take a look at the case and see what 0:14:27.920 --> 0:14:30.840 we thought and see what the evidence was, what had 0:14:30.880 --> 0:14:34.560 already been gathered, what additional investigative steps could be taken, 0:14:35.040 --> 0:14:36.920 and whether or not we thought this was something that 0:14:37.120 --> 0:14:38.600 merited a federal prosecution. 0:14:39.560 --> 0:14:43.840 What's indisputable is that two black men had died of overdoses, 0:14:44.040 --> 0:14:47.840 and while federal prosecutors were investigating whether they could pursue charges, 0:14:48.280 --> 0:14:52.640 La County DA Jackie Lacy, the local prosecutor, was arguing 0:14:52.760 --> 0:14:56.000 that he didn't have a case against that Buck. Now 0:14:56.080 --> 0:14:58.960 the tension was building for a case against Buck, but 0:14:59.040 --> 0:15:01.760 the death of Timothy d the homicide Bureau in the 0:15:01.760 --> 0:15:05.720 Sheriff's department had launched a new investigation. Remember we just 0:15:05.720 --> 0:15:08.800 heard Nick Hannah, who was working at the US Attorney's office. 0:15:09.040 --> 0:15:12.200 Hannah is a Justice Department lawyer, and he says someone 0:15:12.240 --> 0:15:15.320 from the local sheriff's office is the one who flagged 0:15:15.360 --> 0:15:19.720 the case to the facts. Sound like politics, anyway, Let's 0:15:19.720 --> 0:15:22.400 take a listen to my interview with Lindsay Horrovab, who 0:15:22.440 --> 0:15:24.600 served twice as wes Hollywood's mayor. 0:15:25.360 --> 0:15:26.960 She chose not to bring the case. 0:15:29.440 --> 0:15:29.960 Say more. 0:15:30.760 --> 0:15:34.320 I think well, for whatever reason, she chose not to 0:15:34.320 --> 0:15:37.480 pursue the case. I called her office after Jamel Moore's 0:15:37.480 --> 0:15:43.040 death several days in a row, asking her office to 0:15:43.160 --> 0:15:46.680 help create safety for people who wanted to come forward 0:15:46.680 --> 0:15:50.560 and testify and share information about what they knew about 0:15:50.560 --> 0:15:53.720 the circumstances surrounding Jammel's death, but what they also knew 0:15:53.760 --> 0:15:57.920 in terms of the circumstances of what happened at that residence. 0:15:58.480 --> 0:16:02.720 And it took many people coming forward, including my phone calls, 0:16:02.800 --> 0:16:06.400 not only including my phone calls, for her to even 0:16:06.440 --> 0:16:09.080 be willing to grant immunity for people to come forward 0:16:09.160 --> 0:16:10.800 and share valuable information. 0:16:13.640 --> 0:16:16.120 We have to remember the local politics at play here. 0:16:16.560 --> 0:16:19.640 Jackie Lacy, the local district attorney, was being hit on 0:16:19.880 --> 0:16:23.440 all sides politically. Now, to be criticized constantly on the 0:16:23.480 --> 0:16:27.480 West side of Los Angeles, that's dangerous for Democrats, not 0:16:27.560 --> 0:16:31.640 just in LA but national democrats. A significant portion of 0:16:31.680 --> 0:16:34.760 the money that Democrats from all across the country rays 0:16:35.120 --> 0:16:37.800 comes from homes that are just a turn off of 0:16:37.920 --> 0:16:42.400 Sunset Boulevard for miles and miles. And another thing often 0:16:42.520 --> 0:16:45.480 das can be the fall guys during politically dicey times. 0:16:45.720 --> 0:16:48.200 I mean, if you've seen an episode of Law and Order, 0:16:48.280 --> 0:16:51.840 you can get what I'm saying. District attorneys are very 0:16:51.920 --> 0:16:54.600 loath to bring cases that they aren't one hundred percent 0:16:54.680 --> 0:16:57.400 sure that they can win. Any loss will be the 0:16:57.440 --> 0:17:01.000 basis for an opponent's political ad and Lacey had an 0:17:01.080 --> 0:17:04.960 upcoming election. In many ways, she was stuck between a 0:17:05.080 --> 0:17:08.600 sheriff's office that had a tradition of cutting corners, a 0:17:08.640 --> 0:17:12.679 Trump appointed federal prosecutor, her own tough on crime image, 0:17:13.080 --> 0:17:14.840 and all those dead black bodies. 0:17:15.400 --> 0:17:19.240 I think, well, clearly, the United States government was able 0:17:19.320 --> 0:17:21.600 to bring a case in federal court based on the 0:17:21.640 --> 0:17:24.439 exact same evidence that she was able to review, and 0:17:24.520 --> 0:17:28.760 she elected, despite reviewing the same evidence, she elected not 0:17:28.800 --> 0:17:30.080 to pursue the case. 0:17:30.760 --> 0:17:33.920 The district attorney framed this as a problem of he said, 0:17:34.160 --> 0:17:38.000 he said, as if her hands were tied. Lindsay Horvath, 0:17:38.080 --> 0:17:41.040 the former mayor of West Hollywood, says, that's just not 0:17:41.160 --> 0:17:41.600 the case. 0:17:42.119 --> 0:17:45.280 I mean, the idea that there were people out there 0:17:45.400 --> 0:17:50.159 who were willing to tell their stories despite surviving traumatic experiences, 0:17:50.560 --> 0:17:52.480 and she wasn't going to create a safe place for 0:17:52.520 --> 0:17:55.639 them to come forward and testify was absolutely absurd to me. 0:17:56.160 --> 0:17:58.120 I'm glad that the US government did take up. 0:17:58.080 --> 0:17:58.680 The case. 0:18:00.640 --> 0:18:00.960 Again. 0:18:01.240 --> 0:18:04.680 Nick Hanna, the former US Attorney for the Central District 0:18:04.720 --> 0:18:05.640 of California. 0:18:06.000 --> 0:18:10.680 So we started, in conjunction with the DEA a Opioid 0:18:10.800 --> 0:18:15.439 Overdose Task Force in the fall of twenty eighteen, and 0:18:15.480 --> 0:18:18.439 we brought in some state and local officers to that 0:18:18.560 --> 0:18:23.119 task force, with the goal being to investigate overdose deaths 0:18:23.520 --> 0:18:27.000 like the crime scene they really are right, and to 0:18:27.200 --> 0:18:32.320 determine whether or not someone should be held accountable for 0:18:32.560 --> 0:18:35.360 providing drugs that killed somebody. 0:18:35.600 --> 0:18:38.760 The FEDS were building the scaffolding to prosecute people in 0:18:38.840 --> 0:18:42.680 drug cases that end in overdose deaths. They were creating 0:18:42.680 --> 0:18:44.840 a pathway to charging at Buck. 0:18:45.440 --> 0:18:49.920 So in the summer of twenty nineteen, the Sheriff's office 0:18:50.600 --> 0:18:55.840 approached the US Attorney's Office regarding the overdose deaths of 0:18:56.000 --> 0:19:00.320 Jimmelmore and Timothy Dean, who died in twenty seventeen and 0:19:00.440 --> 0:19:02.000 twenty nineteen, respectively. 0:19:02.520 --> 0:19:05.240 Chelsea Norrel is a federal prosecutor. 0:19:05.960 --> 0:19:10.800 The DA's office at that point had declined the Jammel 0:19:10.960 --> 0:19:15.280 Moore investigation, but it was my understanding that they had 0:19:15.400 --> 0:19:19.320 reopened the investigation of both deaths. At the same time, 0:19:19.520 --> 0:19:23.760 the sheriffs brought the investigation to the US Attorney's office, 0:19:23.920 --> 0:19:27.280 so we were working in parallel together at the outset 0:19:27.359 --> 0:19:31.800 of the investigation, starting in the summer of twenty nineteen. 0:19:33.560 --> 0:19:38.160 The chief of International Money Laundering and International Narcotics recruited 0:19:38.200 --> 0:19:39.920 NoREL to look into Buck. 0:19:40.359 --> 0:19:45.440 I initially reviewed all of the reports from witnesses from 0:19:45.880 --> 0:19:51.280 the scene at Box apartment after the deaths and immediately 0:19:51.359 --> 0:19:56.679 saw that we had a disturbing pattern of what I 0:19:56.880 --> 0:20:00.520 later learned to be party in play, which was Buck 0:20:00.960 --> 0:20:05.960 luring his victims to his apartment to inject them with 0:20:06.200 --> 0:20:10.880 methamphetamine and then on some occasions sexually assault his victims. 0:20:11.200 --> 0:20:14.119 So as soon as I saw that, I knew that 0:20:14.160 --> 0:20:16.840 there were aspects of the case where we didn't have jurisdiction, 0:20:17.119 --> 0:20:21.000 but that if we could show he distributed the drugs 0:20:21.240 --> 0:20:26.720 that ultimately killed his victims, that we had drug distribution 0:20:26.880 --> 0:20:30.360 resulting in death charges that could carry severe penalties. 0:20:39.240 --> 0:20:43.040 Seven hundred and eighty two days after Jammel Moore died, 0:20:43.520 --> 0:20:46.840 but only six days after the surviving victim called the 0:20:46.840 --> 0:20:52.800 police ed Buck was finally arrested September seventeenth, twenty nineteen. 0:20:53.359 --> 0:20:57.320 He was charged with maintaining a drug house, battery causing 0:20:57.440 --> 0:20:59.960 serious injury, and administering me. 0:21:00.119 --> 0:21:04.040 Then fetamine, all felonies. The judge set his bail for 0:21:04.160 --> 0:21:06.240 four million dollars, and. 0:21:06.080 --> 0:21:09.000 While ed Buck was held up in jail all that time, 0:21:09.040 --> 0:21:12.719 he went free would have serious consequences for Jackie Lacy. 0:21:13.280 --> 0:21:16.560 She would be one of several officials whose eventual election 0:21:16.720 --> 0:21:19.800 loss could be directly related at least in part to 0:21:20.000 --> 0:21:23.240 ed Buck. Now Jackie Lacy became the face of what 0:21:23.359 --> 0:21:26.200 was broken in the system. One of the leading voices 0:21:26.240 --> 0:21:30.239 in this story is Jasminchanic. Kanick was an early and 0:21:30.440 --> 0:21:33.480 very visible leader in the campaign to put public pressure 0:21:33.640 --> 0:21:37.560 on officials after Jamel Moore died, and Jasminchanic has been 0:21:37.560 --> 0:21:40.159 doing her work as a journalist and an activist for 0:21:40.200 --> 0:21:42.959 nearly two decades in Los Angeles, and there are a 0:21:42.960 --> 0:21:46.320 few voices that have been more consistent in the fight 0:21:46.400 --> 0:21:50.520 to bring ed Buck to justice. Jasminkanic was instrumental in 0:21:50.600 --> 0:21:54.600 bringing about national attention. Among other things, she pointed out 0:21:54.600 --> 0:21:58.440 at Buck's political donations. We reached out to jaz Mechanic 0:21:58.480 --> 0:22:01.960 for an interview or for any person anticipation. She declined 0:22:02.000 --> 0:22:05.800 our requests. We also reached out to Letitia Nixon. She 0:22:05.960 --> 0:22:09.679 was also a very strong advocate demanding justice for the 0:22:09.720 --> 0:22:12.399 death of her son Jamelle Moore. We did not receive 0:22:12.520 --> 0:22:17.400 a response from Nixon after multiple requests for an interview. Now, 0:22:17.480 --> 0:22:20.480 while Lacey was handling or not handling the deaths and 0:22:20.560 --> 0:22:23.800 at Buck's apartment, she'd been fighting for her political life. 0:22:23.920 --> 0:22:26.000 She was challenged on the left by a progressive. He 0:22:26.119 --> 0:22:28.000 was one of many progressors who were part of a 0:22:28.080 --> 0:22:32.120 trend nationwide at the time. Then, on election day, as 0:22:32.200 --> 0:22:35.119 voters were waiting to cast their ballots, and I have 0:22:35.160 --> 0:22:37.000 to say that this is one of the most bizarre 0:22:37.040 --> 0:22:40.320 things I've seen in local politics, or most people have 0:22:40.400 --> 0:22:45.200 seen in local politics, the district attorney's husband pulled a 0:22:45.520 --> 0:22:51.640 gun on Black Lives Matter protesters on primary election day. 0:22:51.720 --> 0:22:55.760 She would lose her reelection by nearly a quarter million votes. 0:22:55.760 --> 0:23:02.439 In twenty twenty, Jackie Lacy declined to be interviewed for 0:23:02.480 --> 0:23:06.359 this podcast. Her husband, David Lacey, died in September of 0:23:06.359 --> 0:23:08.880 twenty twenty two, and she said she didn't think that 0:23:08.960 --> 0:23:11.760 this would be a good time to do interviews, but 0:23:11.880 --> 0:23:15.840 she did send a statement which I will read in full. 0:23:15.920 --> 0:23:18.040 I've given my remarks on the Ed Buck case in 0:23:18.080 --> 0:23:21.960 the past. I stand by my statements. Unfortunately, there are 0:23:21.960 --> 0:23:24.719 a number of people who cling to the misguided belief 0:23:25.080 --> 0:23:28.359 that Buck had influence on the lada's office. 0:23:28.480 --> 0:23:29.000 He did not. 0:23:29.760 --> 0:23:32.640 Prior to the death of Jamel Moore, I had never 0:23:32.680 --> 0:23:35.440 heard of him. When I found out Buck had donated 0:23:35.480 --> 0:23:38.600 one hundred dollars to my campaign in twenty twelve, I 0:23:38.680 --> 0:23:41.920 returned it. I am grateful that the United States Attorney 0:23:42.200 --> 0:23:46.080 used their resources and laws to convict Buck of his 0:23:46.240 --> 0:23:50.160 despicable conduct. I am glad the families of the victims 0:23:50.160 --> 0:23:54.280 got justice at the state level. We simply did not 0:23:54.480 --> 0:23:59.160 have the evidence and laws to prosecute him. Sadly, this 0:23:59.240 --> 0:24:03.600 type of conduct sextra drugs continues. Most of the time, 0:24:03.800 --> 0:24:07.520 these deaths are written off by the coroner as overdoses. 0:24:08.080 --> 0:24:10.960 Proposed changes to the law to make furnishing drugs to 0:24:11.000 --> 0:24:15.000 others are often rejected as an attempt to bring back 0:24:15.040 --> 0:24:18.560 and she has in quotations the war on drugs. We 0:24:18.640 --> 0:24:22.280 as a society want this behavior to stop, but we 0:24:22.359 --> 0:24:25.800 are not courageous enough to enact laws to stop it. 0:24:28.640 --> 0:24:32.080 That statement from Jackie Lacy, the first black woman to 0:24:32.119 --> 0:24:37.480