Speaker 1: If you thought four hours a day, minutes a week
Speaker 1: was enough, I think again. He's the last remnants of
Speaker 1: the old republic, a sole fashion of fairness. He treats
Speaker 1: crackheads in the ghetto cutter the same as the rich
Speaker 1: pill poppers in the penthouse the clearing House of Hot
Speaker 1: takes break free for something special. The Fifth Hour with
Speaker 1: Ben Maller starts right now. That it does, and I
Speaker 1: hope you're doing well and happy social distancing weekend which
Speaker 1: is upon us as we present to you another edition
Speaker 1: of The Fifth Hour with Ben Mallard. Bonus coverage during
Speaker 1: the pandemic, and if this continues here, I guess we'll
Speaker 1: just do three shows a week for forever. But four
Speaker 1: hours not enough of the Overnight Show. We are proud
Speaker 1: to be in the air everywhere throwing audio tantrums via
Speaker 1: the vast power of the I Heart Podcasting Network, the
Speaker 1: Global Reach Podcasting and this podcast is originally was heard
Speaker 1: weekly and now it's heard every weekend, multiple days, Friday,
Speaker 1: Saturday and Sunday. You get your podcast right here and
Speaker 1: as always, for better or worse, I am joined by
Speaker 1: the gascon Man, the gag on Man, David Gascon. We're man,
Speaker 1: we're just loud, proud. I think about my friend uh
Speaker 1: In in Cincinnati, Justin, the guy that sprays and praise
Speaker 1: his uh his his viruses all over the place. But Ben,
Speaker 1: we're we're rocking it here. From March to April, we're
Speaker 1: up sixty eight percent. We are the hottest podcast within
Speaker 1: the Fox Sports Radio umbrella right now. We're kicking and screaming. Well,
Speaker 1: it's very nice that people are listening to the podcast.
Speaker 1: Of course, we have done more podcasts. The numbers are
Speaker 1: skewed quite a bit. We were doing one a week
Speaker 1: and now we're doing three a week, so the numbers
Speaker 1: have skyrocketed up, not to not to deflate the balloon,
Speaker 1: of course, but fair In September, October, November, we were
Speaker 1: doing Benny Versus the Penny as well. Yeah, that's sure.
Speaker 1: We were doing multiple podcast then. And uh it's it's
Speaker 1: awkward though, because people are listening more in part because
Speaker 1: of what's going on. There's not a lot of new
Speaker 1: content out there, so people are looking for anything, even
Speaker 1: audio content that's brand new, and everyone's losing their marbles,
Speaker 1: it seems like because what's going on, and so I
Speaker 1: it's this is an awkward situation, but we'll we'll take
Speaker 1: it um. Now. The real test is when things get
Speaker 1: back to normal. If you knuckleheads still listen, that's the
Speaker 1: real test. Uh. And we'll find out how how much
Speaker 1: you like to show once things get back to normal.
Speaker 1: I just had a thought in my head here you
Speaker 1: mentioned Justin and Cincinnati that inspired me. I had an
Speaker 1: epiphany the other day when I was walking to work.
Speaker 1: As I walked to work down starting environment and I
Speaker 1: was walking from my bedroom down the hallway, and then
Speaker 1: I had to make a left turn into the studio
Speaker 1: from my bedroom, and then I had to walk in
Speaker 1: the studio, walk into the chair, I had to sit down,
Speaker 1: I had to turn the computer on, turn on the
Speaker 1: big radio box that I have here. But in that time,
Speaker 1: the very short walk that I have to work, I thought,
Speaker 1: you know, Justin has always been the biggest bad guy
Speaker 1: on the Mallar Militia, the most negative guy. But I
Speaker 1: I believe that Mr Nice Guy and Angry Bill are
Speaker 1: giving him a run for his money, a legitimate run
Speaker 1: for bragging rights in the entire cosmos of the Malla Militia,
Speaker 1: for being the most negative person that contacts us during
Speaker 1: the show. Well to be fair, though they're also divided
Speaker 1: blue versus red, or in this case, two blues and
Speaker 1: one red. Yeah, well that's true because you've got angry
Speaker 1: Bill who calls up a couple of times a week
Speaker 1: with his horseplay, who thinks these are end times, that
Speaker 1: this is armageddon, it's some kind of biblical prophecy, and
Speaker 1: we're all dead and life will never come back to normal.
Speaker 1: And he's like the same mindset, Like there's certain guys
Speaker 1: that just think that life will never ever change, that
Speaker 1: whatever is going on right now is going to continue.
Speaker 1: It's called being a prisoner of the moment. Gast go on,
Speaker 1: that's the term. And these people and I have all people.
Speaker 1: You know, we're both guest gone. You're similar to me
Speaker 1: that you have a reputation of the business of being
Speaker 1: very negative, that that you're you're looking at the bad
Speaker 1: part of life. But in this case, I have somehow
Speaker 1: morphed into Mr Positive, which is very uncomfortable for me.
Speaker 1: And as I've said several times on the radio show,
Speaker 1: I love the fact that people are getting very upset
Speaker 1: when I say positive things. I haven't gone full Clay
Speaker 1: Travis because Clay has taken at next level, but I
Speaker 1: am optimistic. If people get upset, they get upset with me.
Speaker 1: It's it's crazy. The thing is is that's lost in
Speaker 1: a lot of people. As you have perspective and you
Speaker 1: have experience. So when you talk about some of these
Speaker 1: things that have gone on in life, you have the
Speaker 1: advantage of having seen or heard or been in the
Speaker 1: middle of certain situations. You have the opportunity to see
Speaker 1: it from not only the entry but also the exit.
Speaker 1: Or a lot of these people are only experienced in
Speaker 1: these situations for the first time ever, or they were
Speaker 1: just completely oblivious to things in the past. Well that's
Speaker 1: true to a point. But Mr. Nice Guy and Angry
Speaker 1: Bill or or they're they're older than me. They've been
Speaker 1: around longer than I have. They've lived life, They've seen things.
Speaker 1: I just remember back to I guess the comp for
Speaker 1: this would be nine eleven, And I remember after nine eleven,
Speaker 1: people are like, oh man, it's you know, we're gonna
Speaker 1: be It's never gonna be the same, It's gonna be yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, things A little things are different, like going
Speaker 1: to the airport is much different than before nine eleven,
Speaker 1: and there's more security at certain things. But relatively speaking,
Speaker 1: things are pretty much the same as they were before.
Speaker 1: There's a even more to mean this is but they're
Speaker 1: they're mild inconvenience. But see, here's the thing that I
Speaker 1: will agree with those guys on is a simple fact
Speaker 1: that now you have companies that want to track you.
Speaker 1: They want to put chips inside of you and track
Speaker 1: you and find out like your status, find out if
Speaker 1: you had contracted the coronavirus, if you are if you
Speaker 1: are healthy, if you have recovered that. Those things I'm
Speaker 1: not comfortable with at all. And now people are talking
Speaker 1: more and more about five G and how that's coming
Speaker 1: into you want to go full? You want to go
Speaker 1: full Alex Jones like you want to go down that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but we have a lot of time, and so there's
Speaker 1: things that do worry me. Thankfully here in California. And
Speaker 1: I know this is not in allowed kind of way,
Speaker 1: but there are a lot of people here in this state,
Speaker 1: this great state then that are locked and loaded, which
Speaker 1: is great because if ever they came a time or
Speaker 1: they needed to push back in this republic, I'm fully
Speaker 1: confident that California would rise above the rest. Uh well
Speaker 1: not you listen, there's there's many places that would rise
Speaker 1: above me and I. I've talked about this on the podcast.
Speaker 1: The last couple of weeks I go for a walks.
Speaker 1: I haven't been for a walk this week because it's
Speaker 1: been raining in l A. And I haven't been able
Speaker 1: to get out of my house, which blows. But that's
Speaker 1: a different problem. But every time I walked by, there
Speaker 1: a couple of gun shots. I live in the interesting
Speaker 1: part of town. I guess there's a couple of gun
Speaker 1: shots here. And it's like the It's like the Okay
Speaker 1: Corral out there, people just lining up to buy guns.
Speaker 1: Every every time I've walked by these guns stores, it's
Speaker 1: like the old west Man. People are loading up, trying
Speaker 1: to get ready for whatever they think, uh is coming,
Speaker 1: whatever they believe is coming there. And So now is
Speaker 1: this a perfect and proper segue to what we're getting
Speaker 1: into today? Uh? Yeah, I mean it could be. Uh
Speaker 1: it is time for ready for it? Another Mound film
Speaker 1: review we uh So, I did some commercials for the
Speaker 1: documentary The Scheme, which is currently broadcast on HBO that's
Speaker 1: Home Box Office. I watched it on HBO's on demand
Speaker 1: feature watched it a few days ago, and it is
Speaker 1: about college basketball I loved it. We're gonna get into
Speaker 1: some of the meat and potatoes of this. It follows
Speaker 1: around this guy named Christian Dawkins who was in the
Speaker 1: fifth grade. This guy was in the fifth grade. He
Speaker 1: read some book from Dan Wetzel about college basketball and
Speaker 1: corporate money and corruption of young people. And that book
Speaker 1: resonated so much. You know, he's in that golden era
Speaker 1: of your life where you read something and that just
Speaker 1: translates your life, you have an epiphany. And he decided
Speaker 1: right then that he wanted to get into becoming a
Speaker 1: basketball kind of agent, that kind of guy. And that's
Speaker 1: how the story starts, and it ends up with the
Speaker 1: fbo I being involved. We'll get into some of it
Speaker 1: before we give the Mallard film review. Now, normally you
Speaker 1: would wait till the end to say what the grade
Speaker 1: is of the podcast, you know, on the podcast, but um,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna actually give my my number grade one to
Speaker 1: ten with ten being mcmillions. I enjoyed Tiger King guest
Speaker 1: Guns to Elite is to watch Tiger King's two above that.
Speaker 1: But I I eat give the scheme on HBO. I'm
Speaker 1: giving in an aid out of ten on the Mallard
Speaker 1: scale of documentary. Now, it's not as good as mcmillions
Speaker 1: and some of the other stuff. It is obviously one side.
Speaker 1: It's that's the one thing we didn't hear from the
Speaker 1: other side. Um. There the reasons for that. We'll get
Speaker 1: into and we talk about the podcast, but I give
Speaker 1: it an aid out of ten, and I guess you
Speaker 1: watched it. What is the guestscon score. I'm gonna give
Speaker 1: it a little bit lower. I'm gonna give it a six.
Speaker 1: There was a lot of things they felt that were
Speaker 1: left out. And I also think that it really came
Speaker 1: flat towards the end when when we were waiting for
Speaker 1: that build up, it just never came. And I thought
Speaker 1: the way that it intro it was fantastic. But as
Speaker 1: we'll get into, I just thought the ending just it
Speaker 1: left me wanting a lot more. And I just thought,
Speaker 1: be sure to catch live editions of The Ben Meller
Speaker 1: Show weekdays at two am Eastern eleven pm Pacific on
Speaker 1: Fox Sports Radio and the I Heart Radio app. All right, well,
Speaker 1: let's get into it. So for those that do not
Speaker 1: know the story, we talked about this on the radio.
Speaker 1: It was a big story in sports media. The FBI
Speaker 1: was bringing down college sports. The jig was up right,
Speaker 1: all the debate and bickering that we've had over the
Speaker 1: years about student athletes, and uh, it turns out that
Speaker 1: these guys, many of the top basketball players, and let's
Speaker 1: be honest, football players, have been getting money under the
Speaker 1: table forever and as long as you can remember. And
Speaker 1: so it's technically illegal to do some of that stuff,
Speaker 1: depending on how you do it. And so this scandal
Speaker 1: was supposed to bring down college basketball and it began
Speaker 1: with Christian Dawkins. The FBI UH investigated this. They had
Speaker 1: wire taps, they were listening into dawkins phone conversations. And
Speaker 1: this was supposed to be a pioneering corruption scandal and
Speaker 1: as guests gone referred to at the end, it fizzled out.
Speaker 1: But it did bring down a bunch of assistant coaches
Speaker 1: and low level players in this. And so Dawkins, the guy,
Speaker 1: Christian Dawkins, who was the star of the documentary and
Speaker 1: the star of the story, Uh, he had a sports agency.
Speaker 1: Well he started out in the fifth grade. He was
Speaker 1: like that, I guess we should start with that because
Speaker 1: this guy was a hustler. Some of the highlights of
Speaker 1: this thing. I love people that just kind of go
Speaker 1: for it and you don't need a formal education. You
Speaker 1: just know what you want to do when you go
Speaker 1: for it. Christian Dawkins came from a Michigan family that
Speaker 1: had been very successful in basketball locally at the high
Speaker 1: school level. He started his own high school basketball scouting
Speaker 1: publication when he was eleven years old. Guest, because how
Speaker 1: great is that this church hustling? I love it? Coaches
Speaker 1: six hundred dollars for a subscription. That was fantastic. Forty
Speaker 1: year old coaches are paying eleven year old all this
Speaker 1: money for a subscription. How great is that he was making?
Speaker 1: He was making buco bucks. I thought. The best thing
Speaker 1: that he did with that publication. Two is he actually
Speaker 1: ranked himself numerous times, which is what you must do
Speaker 1: when you're eleven years old, right, I mean, why why
Speaker 1: would you do something like that? Uh, if you're eleven,
Speaker 1: you gotta rank yourself, all right. He also a little
Speaker 1: bit after that he organized his own traveling team. Um,
Speaker 1: and he did that he was he was in high school,
Speaker 1: and he put his own tournament. He had an entire
Speaker 1: fucking tournament that this kid put together while he was
Speaker 1: in high school. Like, what do you call what's the
Speaker 1: Dorian's cause. I thing it was Dorian's cause whatever, But
Speaker 1: that was based on his brother that passed away from
Speaker 1: a from a heart attack at the age of fourteen. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that was sad. He he died during a game when
Speaker 1: he told his brother point Blake when it was at
Speaker 1: the free throw line, I feel tired, and he collapsed
Speaker 1: on the court and they tried resuscitating him and then
Speaker 1: they couldn't do So, Yeah, that was sad. His parents
Speaker 1: weren't there. They were at a wedding or something like that,
Speaker 1: so it was sad. So but this guy, Christian Doctors,
Speaker 1: he didn't attend college. He ends up working because he
Speaker 1: had some connections already from his tournament and stuff. He
Speaker 1: starts working for this agent, Andy Miller, who was featured
Speaker 1: quite a bit in the documentary. He then ends up
Speaker 1: successfully and he's still not even you know, not even
Speaker 1: like twenty years old. He starts recruiting current NBA players
Speaker 1: are that are now in the NBA before they were
Speaker 1: in the NBA, and he signed Alfred Payton who's had
Speaker 1: a decent NBA crew, Rodney Hood who's played in the NBA.
Speaker 1: That was the there was like the first two guys
Speaker 1: he signed NBA players um Fred Vanvlee. They they interviewed
Speaker 1: Fred Vanvley to the Raptors. He was they interviewed him
Speaker 1: in this So the guy was very good. Christian Dawkins. Uh,
Speaker 1: I don't know how would you say he's the gift
Speaker 1: for gab. I guess would be one way to look
Speaker 1: at it. I think two things. One is he he's
Speaker 1: relatable and some of the players even said at point blank,
Speaker 1: it's a skin color. He said a lot of the
Speaker 1: guys that came into those rooms, if they weren't black,
Speaker 1: they weren't dealing with them. And I think Van Fleet
Speaker 1: was one of the guys who actually talked about Miller
Speaker 1: and he said, yeah, he did all the legal stuff,
Speaker 1: but it was Dawkins who handled everything prior to that,
Speaker 1: and he's the one that crafted the relationship. He wouldn't
Speaker 1: have done business with Lee had it not been for Dawkins. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so race was a part of this, but Dawkins also
Speaker 1: seemed like we've all known people like this, whether they're black, white,
Speaker 1: or whatever, who are just great each man, you know,
Speaker 1: and they just able to they got diarrhea of the mouth,
Speaker 1: and they're sweet talkers and he's got that going on.
Speaker 1: But see, here's the thing. This goes all the way
Speaker 1: back to what you mentioned with how he started his publication.
Speaker 1: Was this kid was all over the place. He was
Speaker 1: going to all these games, he was going to these practices,
Speaker 1: so he was in sight and in mind, like he
Speaker 1: was around these guys all the bleep in time. And
Speaker 1: so when you're around like that and you have people
Speaker 1: buttering you up and then all of a sudden writing
Speaker 1: about you in publications and getting all that juice from
Speaker 1: these coaches and then adds your credibility, and then you
Speaker 1: can show that to these prospective young student athletes that
Speaker 1: are hoping to go to the D one level. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: for sure. I mean it was very interesting to see
Speaker 1: how this works. Like I've known some of these people
Speaker 1: over my years being around when I used to go
Speaker 1: to NBA games all the time, and these guys would
Speaker 1: hang out at the NBA games also, so I've I've
Speaker 1: known a few of them, but I didn't really know
Speaker 1: like the meat and potatoes of what it was. Like.
Speaker 1: I had some ideas and this, you know, this is
Speaker 1: his story, so it's probably I'm not the same for everybody.
Speaker 1: But it's Christian Dawkins story, which is I would think
Speaker 1: similar to a lot of what goes on. And then
Speaker 1: we had our first scandal in this documentary, which was
Speaker 1: a reverence and I vaguely remember using this as a
Speaker 1: tease on the radio, and I don't even remember doing
Speaker 1: a monologue about it, but it was known as uber
Speaker 1: Gate and Christiandwkins. That was a scandal involving him a
Speaker 1: couple of years back in seventeen and he lost his job.
Speaker 1: There was a big headline that was all over the
Speaker 1: internet at the time saying that an NBA they called
Speaker 1: him an agent, right, and they said he had stolen
Speaker 1: forty thou dollars in uber rides or something like that
Speaker 1: he had charged them to I think it was Alfred
Speaker 1: Payton's credit card. Yes, But here's the weird thing about this,
Speaker 1: as you know this, when you have a company website,
Speaker 1: if you go to any law firm or any kind
Speaker 1: of PR firm, and you have entities that are involved,
Speaker 1: and you have employees, usually gonna have the managing partner,
Speaker 1: You're gonna have the founder of the CEO, of the president,
Speaker 1: and they're gonna have all the underlings as well, and
Speaker 1: you'll have names and titles and probably a bioattached, right,
Speaker 1: But Dawkins didn't have any of that. He was on
Speaker 1: the company website, but just his name. There was no
Speaker 1: title underneath it, no bio, nothing of that. So he
Speaker 1: was they had guys in there that classified him as
Speaker 1: like a quote unquote runner and yeah, yeah, which is
Speaker 1: like it's like when you get into the movie business.
Speaker 1: You know, you're you're hanging out bringing food and going
Speaker 1: to the store, and you're you're helping out the people
Speaker 1: on the set, but you're not really like you don't
Speaker 1: have a defined role, right as I understand what your
Speaker 1: worked in the movies, but as when I understand the
Speaker 1: pas are like that too a lot. Yeah, yeah, we
Speaker 1: used to have interns, and I'm not allowed to have
Speaker 1: interns anymore, guests on it at our job, but years
Speaker 1: ago I had interns with some of them very successful interns.
Speaker 1: By the way, You've gone on and on great things,
Speaker 1: but I I'm no longer allowed to teach the younger generation.
Speaker 1: There's a reason for that, alright, us are you you're
Speaker 1: making that up? That's a lie. Back to the documentary,
Speaker 1: this guy Christian Dawkins were talking about it's pretty much
Speaker 1: all about him and his buddy, and they were the
Speaker 1: main players that were interviewed in this. So the let's
Speaker 1: get to the meat and potatoes here. So Dawkins claimed
Speaker 1: he did not want to bring in college coaches like that.
Speaker 1: The FBI's intent was clear that they wanted to bring
Speaker 1: down the big name coaches, and so Christian Dawkins, at
Speaker 1: least that's the way the documentary presented. So Dawkins joined
Speaker 1: some investors, this guy Jeff de'angelo and his partner Jill Bailey,
Speaker 1: a couple of good names there. Turns out they were
Speaker 1: the undercover FBI agents who were part of this. And
Speaker 1: then they had the financial advisor Munish sod is that
Speaker 1: his name? To get that right? I got that right? Um,
Speaker 1: And he was like the money guy. He was worked
Speaker 1: at a bank and he had connections to the cash
Speaker 1: and all that. Yeah, he was a financial advisor and
Speaker 1: yeah so um so he he I guess that he's
Speaker 1: the guy. Eventually later on he gave funds to Mark
Speaker 1: ll Folts, Kyle Kuzma's agent, some other people uh as well.
Speaker 1: But in the documentary, Dawkins talks about how the guy
Speaker 1: who was the FBI agent. D'Angelo was the one who
Speaker 1: was pushing to pay college coaches in order to steer
Speaker 1: players to sign with their company, and the way it
Speaker 1: was presenting the documentary was that he didn't want to
Speaker 1: do it, and Dawkins made a compelling argument. What I
Speaker 1: felt was a compelling argument. Obviously, he's biased, he's he's
Speaker 1: part of this, but his argument was he knew how
Speaker 1: the game was played guess gun, and the way the
Speaker 1: game was played was not involved the college coaches. That instead,
Speaker 1: it's just a transaction between the families and the players.
Speaker 1: The coaches are aware of it, and the coaches might
Speaker 1: set it up, but ultimately it it's a relationship between
Speaker 1: an agency and the player, which makes sense logically because
Speaker 1: ultimately that player is going to leave college, whether they
Speaker 1: go to Louisville, North Carolina, u C, l A, Duke,
Speaker 1: or wherever, and they're not gonna have a relationship with
Speaker 1: that school most likely other than just when they get
Speaker 1: introduced in an NBA game they say their name that
Speaker 1: they went to Duke or uh, you know, Oregon or
Speaker 1: Washington or Minnesota or something like that. But they want
Speaker 1: that guy's a client, so that personal relationship. But they
Speaker 1: would think that they're they're gambling that would carry over
Speaker 1: to when they get to the NBA and make the
Speaker 1: real money. And that's where I was confused on all
Speaker 1: this is because if they wanted to uproot the scandal
Speaker 1: that was in college basketball, I mean making that linear
Speaker 1: connection from from a broker to a player with a
Speaker 1: coach as they I don't want to say in between them,
Speaker 1: but just as that kind of conduit. I don't know.
Speaker 1: I don't understand why his motive would be like at
Speaker 1: and Dawkins was sniffing that thing out, which is intense.
Speaker 1: And there was at one point where he actually had
Speaker 1: a friend in the d a's office that was connected
Speaker 1: to the FBI and they ran a background check on D'Angelo.
Speaker 1: So it wasn't like he didn't trust what was going on,
Speaker 1: but he knew that something just wasn't adding up. Be
Speaker 1: sure to catch live editions of The Ben Maller Show
Speaker 1: weekdays at two am Eastern eleven pm Pacific. Yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean it was. It was one of those things.
Speaker 1: The way it was presented was like, hey, he this guy,
Speaker 1: Christian Dawkins knew how the game was played. He knew
Speaker 1: that here's what you do you find the player, you
Speaker 1: pay off the family, do what you gotta do. You
Speaker 1: got the player. But this guy the FBI agents, so
Speaker 1: like when we gotta bring the coaches down, and so
Speaker 1: Dawkins ultimate is like to appease them because he wanted
Speaker 1: their money and he thought he didn't realize their FBI
Speaker 1: agents they were just And that's the other thing. The
Speaker 1: FBI spent how much money they were just handing money
Speaker 1: six figures. Yeah. The most yeah, the most alarming thing
Speaker 1: was the fact that these guys took money from federal
Speaker 1: agents are taxpayers money, and they spent a boatload of
Speaker 1: it on an actual yacht and in Vegas, gambling, going
Speaker 1: to strip clubs, you know, drinking, parting the whole fucking
Speaker 1: nine yards. And I'm like, this is absolutely bogus how
Speaker 1: this all went down. And later on not don't bear
Speaker 1: the lead, my mind, it's not really the lead. Um.
Speaker 1: Later on they determined that this guy, Jeff d'antel, who left,
Speaker 1: he had been one of the big players in this
Speaker 1: as an FBI agent, and then he vanished. They said
Speaker 1: he had a sick relative in Italy. But it turns
Speaker 1: out that he had been spending some of that FBI
Speaker 1: our money in Vegas. Apparently he was having a grand
Speaker 1: old time gambling and boozing and debauchery there in Vegas,
Speaker 1: misappropriation of government funds as they would call it. Ben Mallory.
Speaker 1: Now see, I was asking the chief about this, and
Speaker 1: I think you guys should chat about this a little
Speaker 1: bit longer too. But part of this goes to his
Speaker 1: argument about entrapment. And you've seen that movie Inception, right
Speaker 1: with Leonardo DiCaprio and uh he was in with Michael
Speaker 1: Caine and a couple other creatures. No, yes, I did not.
Speaker 1: I have not seen. Man, I watch it this weekend.
Speaker 1: You want me to watch it this week Well, I
Speaker 1: want you to watch The Wire first of all. But
Speaker 1: if you're not, watch the Wire. But okay, I know
Speaker 1: about in Trapping. We've seen enough in Trapping Christies. So
Speaker 1: Christopher Nolan was the director behind Inception. But it's a
Speaker 1: fantastic movie. But my dad's talking about and how you
Speaker 1: can't provoke. You can't be used as a government agent
Speaker 1: to provide that kind of idea. You can't plant that
Speaker 1: inside someone's mind that hey, you should be doing this
Speaker 1: to pay off these people to do that. And so
Speaker 1: that's why you're not allowed to your dad, who for
Speaker 1: those that don't know, guest gun dad was like the
Speaker 1: big he's the boss. He was the boss of the
Speaker 1: L A p. D. He knows the chief, so he
Speaker 1: knows everything there. Um so okay, so yeah, so you
Speaker 1: can't lead a horse to water. You have the horse
Speaker 1: has to lead you to water. Right is that the argument? Okay? Um?
Speaker 1: Interesting and according to the documentary that the way it
Speaker 1: was presented, that's not. Um what what you're saying happened.
Speaker 1: Happened that the Dawkins is claiming. The FBI is like,
Speaker 1: this is what we want, and Dawkins is like, well,
Speaker 1: I need the money, so I'll do what they want.
Speaker 1: But I wasn't gonna do it this way. Yeah. I
Speaker 1: mean it's like you saying, I'm gonna kill that guy.
Speaker 1: Well I heard you say that. So I'm gonna go
Speaker 1: buy the gun. I'm gonna go buy the bullets. I'm
Speaker 1: gonna put the gun in your hand. I just need
Speaker 1: you to pull the trigger like that. That's exactly what
Speaker 1: it came down to. Like, wait a minute, I didn't
Speaker 1: mean that. Literally, I didn't want to kill that person.
Speaker 1: Well here's the gun anyway, go shoot that person. Yeah, exactly. Um,
Speaker 1: And the documentary it's they had phone conversations between Dawkins
Speaker 1: and some big college coaches. And uh, really the fact
Speaker 1: that Sean Miller and will Wait, yeah Sean millerb Arizona,
Speaker 1: Will Wait of l s U have not lost their job?
Speaker 1: Is I mean? It's would think you would think anybody
Speaker 1: watched this would say, okay, it's not even up for
Speaker 1: debate that I can hear them talking in the documentary here. Um, now,
Speaker 1: Sean Miller, what a snake this guy appears to be.
Speaker 1: He he denied any involved me in in the bribery,
Speaker 1: but he can clearly be hurt. Even people that can't
Speaker 1: hear can hear Sean Miller discussing the recruitment of a
Speaker 1: couple of players who are currently in the NBA and
Speaker 1: I see you a little and nas Reid who's littles
Speaker 1: with the Trailblazers, I believe in read with the Timberwolves,
Speaker 1: and DeAndre Ayton too, Yeah, DeAndre Ayton the number one
Speaker 1: pick for the Sons, and the Arizona guy. And it
Speaker 1: was clear they hinted very openly in about compensation. And
Speaker 1: then you Will Wade was even more in your face.
Speaker 1: In the ls you coach on wire tap talking about
Speaker 1: playing paying players to come to l s U and
Speaker 1: saying could compensate the players better than a rookie minimum
Speaker 1: in the n b A, that they'd give them more
Speaker 1: than the D League if they came to bat tall
Speaker 1: rouge to play for LSU. Here's the bigger kick in
Speaker 1: the pants is Sean Miller's assistant book. Richardson was actually
Speaker 1: convicted on some charges. So when you mentioned in the
Speaker 1: Assistant Coaches, he was one of several that was convicted
Speaker 1: under the FEDS. So it was I think the Southern
Speaker 1: District of New York was the one that handled this
Speaker 1: entire case, and he was one of them. So the
Speaker 1: fact that you don't know what your assistant coach is
Speaker 1: doing is beyond it's beyond belief. But the fact that
Speaker 1: obviously you have the smoking gun wire taps, I don't
Speaker 1: know what the funk the n C Double A is
Speaker 1: thinking that they're even thinking at all. But it kind
Speaker 1: of goes back to what Dawkins mentions at the end. Hey,
Speaker 1: these guys are too powerful and they're two up there
Speaker 1: making that kind of coin for the n C Double
Speaker 1: A to have any kind of ramifications that would come
Speaker 1: down the wire because you you didn't mention it. But
Speaker 1: Rick Pettino, I mean he's also involved too, and you
Speaker 1: had the brothel incident with Louisville and the recruit. It's
Speaker 1: just ongoing. Yeah, absolutely, And and Dawkins the takeaway there
Speaker 1: towards the end, and this is kind of a theme.
Speaker 1: You know, I had heard Dawkins talk about this a
Speaker 1: few times, but he believes that he did not break
Speaker 1: any laws by paying players, and he the FBI assumed
Speaker 1: that Dawkins was gonna play ball, right. They assumed he
Speaker 1: was going to cooperate, and Dawkins refused. Christian Dawkins did
Speaker 1: not rat out. He didn't really need to writ anybody
Speaker 1: out because everything was on tape they made. That was
Speaker 1: the other thing here. The FBI. Remember he told the
Speaker 1: story about his iPhone and he was in the meeting
Speaker 1: with the FBI when they were busting him, and he's
Speaker 1: getting a phone call and as his phone is ringing,
Speaker 1: one of the FBI agents, uh, one of the FBI
Speaker 1: agents over there, his phone starts ringing. Also, that's the same,
Speaker 1: the same setup that is unbelo. The phones were probably
Speaker 1: a proximity wise. I don't know what you think, but
Speaker 1: I think there were like five feet maybe even closer
Speaker 1: than that in proximity, and his phones ringing and the
Speaker 1: the FBI's phones ringing. That that was that was a
Speaker 1: kind of Jesus moment too. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah exactly.
Speaker 1: So he ended up being arrested. He was charged with
Speaker 1: a hindful of felonies, bribery, conspiracy, wire fraud, honest service fraud,
Speaker 1: conspiracy to commit wire fraud, money laundering, all of that
Speaker 1: was on the table. So okay, So my favorite part
Speaker 1: of all this, obviously, the convictions was was dreadful for him.
Speaker 1: But I thought the silver lining with the way that
Speaker 1: he uh defended himself and attacked the FEDS was he
Speaker 1: used that ninety thousand dollars he had in cash from
Speaker 1: the vaguest trip from the corrupt FBI agent to pay
Speaker 1: his attorneys for his defense. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah. He
Speaker 1: had said that money that the FBI thought was going
Speaker 1: to the coaches, he had just kept it at his
Speaker 1: house and he had cash piling up, and he used
Speaker 1: that money he claims to pay off his his attorneys.
Speaker 1: Here and the quote which is that we call it
Speaker 1: the money quote here, Um that there's no law in
Speaker 1: the world that says that breaking an n c A
Speaker 1: rule is a federal felony. There's no law that says that.
Speaker 1: And they twisted the law to make it work right
Speaker 1: and and so this is the argument here, and your
Speaker 1: old man would probably agree with me on this, that
Speaker 1: law enforcement they've got loaded dice, meaning that if there's
Speaker 1: no crime and they really want to get you on
Speaker 1: a crime, they've got in their back pocket, especially the FBI,
Speaker 1: I don't know about it, the l A, the local police,
Speaker 1: but they've got wire fraud and tax evasion and those
Speaker 1: are always in my life, those are the things that
Speaker 1: they get you. Because wire fraud is you doing a
Speaker 1: criminal act using electronic communications. Uh they have you know,
Speaker 1: interstate commerce, they call it. Right, So you communicate using
Speaker 1: a phone, call of facts, an email, a text, social
Speaker 1: media posting, any of that is considered if you you're
Speaker 1: doing something on there that is deemed illegal. It is
Speaker 1: all under the umbrella of wire fraud, as I understand it.
Speaker 1: So in the modern world, how does one do anything
Speaker 1: without using either a phone, an email, a text, or
Speaker 1: social media messaging. That's how the world communicates. So if
Speaker 1: you do anything on those platforms that is deemed untoward,
Speaker 1: you can be charged with a crime. And I hated
Speaker 1: the fact that when he got popped by the Feds,
Speaker 1: he was in a hotel room and the female federal
Speaker 1: agent uh no longer undercover, said hey, you can make
Speaker 1: a deal with us, and we can. We can obviously
Speaker 1: work some things out, but you need to to basically
Speaker 1: spit out what you have on all these coaches and
Speaker 1: all these programs and these athletes. It says, I want
Speaker 1: an attorney. And as soon as he said that, I
Speaker 1: think the biggest chicken ship moment of the DOC menories
Speaker 1: the fact that these federal agents come in armed to
Speaker 1: the teeth, not just one guy, but several. It was
Speaker 1: like a tactical unit came in with their M fors,
Speaker 1: their a K s or whatever they had. It brought
Speaker 1: me back to when Roger Stone was basically perp wocked
Speaker 1: out of his home. It's a seventy year old man
Speaker 1: in his pajamas in the in the wake of his sleep,
Speaker 1: and all of a sudden, you got these armed federal
Speaker 1: agents coming in, twenty thirty of them, and all of
Speaker 1: a sudden, CNN just magically shows up unprovoked by anybody
Speaker 1: or tipped off, and these guys are threatening to bring
Speaker 1: down Roger Stone. The same thing happened to Dawkins, and
Speaker 1: it was just straight intimidation and it was just supreme bullshit. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's like you you could have used a butter knife
Speaker 1: and instead you used the samurai sword. Yes, you could
Speaker 1: have had a water gun and you had a machine
Speaker 1: gun instead. You know, it's it's that kind of argument.
Speaker 1: But this has always been the for show, right, It's
Speaker 1: for putting on a show and showing you you didn't
Speaker 1: make a deal with the FBI. Okay, we got seventeen
Speaker 1: guys with guns pointed at your head because you didn't
Speaker 1: make the deal, and and that's the way that it's
Speaker 1: going to go down. Um So, so anyway, the part
Speaker 1: of the documentary they indicated that there was a deal,
Speaker 1: that that they had the playbook I think that was
Speaker 1: the quote, right, They had the playbook of how corruption
Speaker 1: happened in college sports. And so it turns out, and
Speaker 1: you referred to the ending, not liking the ending there
Speaker 1: that none of the big name coaches, not Arizona, Sean Miller,
Speaker 1: not l s U. S. Will wait. I guess you
Speaker 1: could say Patino lost his job. So that was a
Speaker 1: win for the FBI. But they didn't bring down the
Speaker 1: college corruption. They didn't end college corruption. They they sent
Speaker 1: some low wrong people, some assistant coaches. They gave them
Speaker 1: a screwdriver and and that was it. They went to jail,
Speaker 1: some of them. Some of them didn't even go to jail.
Speaker 1: But it was a big nothing burger, and they had
Speaker 1: this big Alan news commerce, which we talked about on
Speaker 1: the radio show when it happened, and they made it
Speaker 1: seem you know, the southern quarter of Manhattan there they
Speaker 1: got everybody, hey, oh my, we've we're gonna get justice,
Speaker 1: and that justice. Yeah. The worst part for for Dawkins
Speaker 1: was he got I believe it was eighteen months when
Speaker 1: he was convicted on all three. See, he was charged
Speaker 1: with I think thirteen counts and he only got convicted
Speaker 1: on three of the charges. One of them was wire fraud,
Speaker 1: another one's conspiracy to commit wire fraud. I forget what
Speaker 1: the other one was. But Monice sawed he got probation. Uh.
Speaker 1: There was a couple other guys that got slaps on
Speaker 1: the wrist. But as you mentioned, hey, he even alluded
Speaker 1: to it to you talked about high school to college basketball.
Speaker 1: What about high school to college football? Fox Sports Radio
Speaker 1: has the best sports talk lineup in the nation. Catch
Speaker 1: all of our shows at Fox sports Radio dot com
Speaker 1: and within the I Heart Radio app search f s
Speaker 1: R to listen live. Yeah, yeah, that wasn't even part
Speaker 1: of this. But if you think about if you're one
Speaker 1: of these hot shot, cannon armed quarterbacks who is projected
Speaker 1: to be an NFL player, and you've got Alabama, Clemson,
Speaker 1: Ohio State, all these big powerhouse schools that are trying
Speaker 1: to get you, you're telling me that the same stuff
Speaker 1: is not going on there, that there's uh, you know,
Speaker 1: I'll scratch your back, you scratch my back, Come on, way,
Speaker 1: of course it's going absolutely Now one other addendum here.
Speaker 1: I loved the part of the end Dawkins. It turns
Speaker 1: out while he was going to federal court to fight this,
Speaker 1: he would go to court in the morning, and then
Speaker 1: when he was done with that, I guess it was
Speaker 1: that at lunch was he doing At lunch he would
Speaker 1: run over, he took a taxi or an uber appropriate enough,
Speaker 1: maybe it was a lift, and he would go and
Speaker 1: meet and he is now in the record business. He
Speaker 1: is now he's making music and he's signing acts and music.
Speaker 1: He was, while on federal trial, was working on his
Speaker 1: next job. How great is that? It was great? And
Speaker 1: the fact that he did because he was looking at
Speaker 1: the landscape of what he can do for employment with
Speaker 1: a felony conviction on his record, and he thought. The
Speaker 1: first thing was, well, music doesn't care. Yeah, I've been
Speaker 1: served right, Yeah, absolutely correct. Uh. And then the reaction
Speaker 1: of this, it seems like they're the people that are
Speaker 1: fully invested in college sports think well, we shouldn't watch
Speaker 1: this documentary. This guy's a convicted felon. It doesn't matter
Speaker 1: what he says, and they're like trying to downplay the
Speaker 1: whole thing like it was all nothing. In college sports
Speaker 1: is still still pure and innocent. And I'm like, really
Speaker 1: like my my entire life working in sports media. When
Speaker 1: I first started in Los Angeles back in the day,
Speaker 1: and I heard stories and even before that about Sam Gilbert. Now,
Speaker 1: if you don't know who Sam Gilbert is, look him up.
Speaker 1: He was a car dealer in l a who funded
Speaker 1: the Wizard of Westwood John Wooden. Right, I I getink
Speaker 1: he owned a construction business, Sam Gilbert, but he he
Speaker 1: wouldn't supply cars and all that stuff. And uh, he
Speaker 1: was the money guy behind the greatest dynasty in college
Speaker 1: basketball history, the nineteen sixties u c l A basketball team,
Speaker 1: and and uh and and he he was involved in
Speaker 1: I think the what's now known as the bicycle casino. UM.
Speaker 1: He he had some some business dealings with that. But
Speaker 1: but anyway, he would supply cars and all kinds of
Speaker 1: other stuff to u c l A recruits. UM took
Speaker 1: money out of his instruction company. And John Wooden, who
Speaker 1: has done many you know, in his day, he did
Speaker 1: many books about being holier than now and doing things
Speaker 1: the right way and you know, make every day your masterpiece.
Speaker 1: He he just looked the other way. He look the
Speaker 1: other way while the money flowed out from Sam Gilbert.
Speaker 1: And let's just say it hasn't stopped since Sam Gilbert.
Speaker 1: And he's been dead since the eighties. And I think
Speaker 1: he was banished in uh in the early eighties from
Speaker 1: from being able to pay out money. But there's always
Speaker 1: been some version of Sam Gilbert involved in college sports.
Speaker 1: I mean, but happens everywhere too, and every single sport.
Speaker 1: So I mean, you either got to be completely naive
Speaker 1: or just oblivious to the fact that these guys and
Speaker 1: some females are getting paid. There's so much money out there,
Speaker 1: and of course if you're making millions beyond millions of
Speaker 1: I mean in the documentary they talked about smaller major
Speaker 1: programs like Creighton shelling out over a hundred thousand dollars
Speaker 1: for for prospects and Creighton there's a rip about Creighton.
Speaker 1: And so when you have all that money that's involved
Speaker 1: and you're invested, I mean, Dan Watson brought up a
Speaker 1: great point because if you're if you're a shoe company
Speaker 1: and you're giving U. C. L a. A Or Louisville
Speaker 1: or Texas or Southern cal a certain amount of money, Yeah,
Speaker 1: you control what they do. I mean, long story short,
Speaker 1: you control how they distribute, how they coach, how they recruit,
Speaker 1: all those things that comes into play. Of course. Yeah. Absolutely.
Speaker 1: And then one final final point in all this, as
Speaker 1: we talked about the scheme our big documentary review here,
Speaker 1: I gave it an eight out of ten. Guestcon says
Speaker 1: a six only a six out of ten. Um is
Speaker 1: when when when you look at the scheme and you
Speaker 1: go through point by point and all this stuff, and uh,
Speaker 1: you know what was I guess I'll ask you this,
Speaker 1: Like you said you were upset, what were you upset about? This?
Speaker 1: Only gave it a six? I gave it an eight.
Speaker 1: I thought it was well done, the production value was
Speaker 1: good on this. It was obviously one sided, But why
Speaker 1: did you only go six? So my biggest reason for
Speaker 1: this is because Dawkins was represented by an attorney by
Speaker 1: the I think his name was Steve Haney, and they
Speaker 1: mentioned it a little bit. But my problem is is
Speaker 1: when the when the government made its case against Dawkins
Speaker 1: and against everyone else that was involved, is that de'angelo
Speaker 1: was never called to testify, and when Haney subpoenaed to
Speaker 1: him to testify, he was not available or they did
Speaker 1: not allow him to testify. And I thought there could
Speaker 1: have been more to that back story, because you're talking
Speaker 1: about not only being accused, but you should have obviously
Speaker 1: the right to to face your accuser, which in this
Speaker 1: case it's the Southern District of New York, but also
Speaker 1: the witnesses that were involved. Well, he was the key witness,
Speaker 1: He was the he was the motor behind this entire
Speaker 1: thing getting underweight. He was the key broker to to
Speaker 1: sod being introduced to obviously two Dawkins, introducing him to
Speaker 1: other players that were involved, to the coaches, to the
Speaker 1: assistant coaches, everybody else that came in. It was all
Speaker 1: general it off of D'Angelo the number one key informant
Speaker 1: or they undercover FBI agent, and he wasn't able to
Speaker 1: testify in court. Like I thought, there was more to
Speaker 1: that that should have been done. Obviously, at the end
Speaker 1: they disclosed that the FBI didn't make any comments on this.
Speaker 1: The n C double A didn't either, but with the
Speaker 1: way that they were doing, that's investigative journalism involved with Dawkins.
Speaker 1: I thought there was more that you could have peeled
Speaker 1: off of that onion that would have helped. That's true.
Speaker 1: So there's two things here and we'll wrap it up
Speaker 1: with this. Either A, the FBI realized they had nothing
Speaker 1: because Dawkins was corrupt, and that if they had gone
Speaker 1: forward and tried to take down Sean Miller and Will Wade,
Speaker 1: that would have come out more somehow in that situation.
Speaker 1: And they said, well, D'Angelo, um, he was he was dirty,
Speaker 1: so you can't believe anything that he did while he
Speaker 1: was involved in this investigation. There's either that or the
Speaker 1: other Deep State Illuminati is that Rick Pattino knows people,
Speaker 1: um we Wade I'm assuming in the South knows some
Speaker 1: people down in the Bayou. And Sean Miller has been
Speaker 1: a big college basketball These guys, uh scratched the back
Speaker 1: of somebody who needed their back scratched, and it just
Speaker 1: kind of went away. But the fact that these guys
Speaker 1: come out here touting their record and how seven percent
Speaker 1: of their cases result in a conviction and they carry
Speaker 1: the heavy hammer and then they I mean, they were
Speaker 1: over zealous with how they attacked Dawkins and then he
Speaker 1: got off with what what it was like a slap
Speaker 1: on the wrist. If you're gonna be that ambitious and
Speaker 1: you want to make a career case out of this,
Speaker 1: then you need to chop off the head. You don't
Speaker 1: go after the fingers. Yeah. Yeah, it was disheartening considering
Speaker 1: how much money taxpayer money was spent and uh, next
Speaker 1: to nothing, next to nothing. And it didn't make for
Speaker 1: a good documentary though, So we got a good documentary
Speaker 1: to watch during this two hours time again. It's called
Speaker 1: The Scheme. It's on HBO. Check it out. You want
Speaker 1: to know we gave you all the good stuff, but
Speaker 1: there it is all right, thank you podcast all weekend.
Speaker 1: We are here for you again. Follow us on social media.
Speaker 1: I am on Twitter at Ben Maller. My Instagram page
Speaker 1: is Ben Maller on Fox and our Facebook page. We
Speaker 1: get a lot of questions. We'll have another podcast sometime
Speaker 1: this weekend with grab Bag and questions and answers and
Speaker 1: all that. And those are questions that are submitted on Facebook,
Speaker 1: which is Ben Mallard's show on Facebook and guest gons
Speaker 1: on social media. Not on Facebook though, you know, thank god.
Speaker 1: I'm on Instagram at Dave Gascon and twitters at David J.
Speaker 1: Just the letter J David J. Gascon. Alright, have a
Speaker 1: great today. Whatever you do today, don't well you can't
Speaker 1: really do anything, so don't do anything just to hang around.
Speaker 1: Just don't do nothing. Alright, have a have a good
Speaker 1: We'll talk to you next time.