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Speaker 1: apply last minute tickets, lowest prices guaranteed. Well the extended
Speaker 1: Nick Wright session. So I was thinking about you the
Speaker 1: other day that this is an interesting topic. You know,
Speaker 1: how we both I really like I'm very much a
Speaker 1: windshield over a rearview mirror.
Speaker 2: Guy.
Speaker 1: I just don't care about the old days. I just
Speaker 1: don't care. But I was thinking about I love the
Speaker 1: NBA and this doesn't bother me, but I don't think
Speaker 1: it's great for their long term viability or growth. Zion
Speaker 1: and Jaw, We're going to be domestic stars, both due
Speaker 1: to immaturity, have fizzled now. Jaws hurt, Zion's hurt. And
Speaker 1: I do think you've done a little European travel, and
Speaker 1: my mom was European, and I've done a little bit.
Speaker 1: I do think their academy create more mature players at
Speaker 1: a younger age, higher skilled, more mature. They don't have
Speaker 1: an AU circuit like us. They don't gas their players up.
Speaker 1: And I think it's very difficult. If I was seventeen
Speaker 1: eighteen and being told how great I was, it would
Speaker 1: affect me. And I watched the league now with Yannis
Speaker 1: and Jokic and Luca and I mean even just SGAs Canadian,
Speaker 1: and I look at our domestic players and I'm not
Speaker 1: questioning their commitment or their excellence. But Steve Kuris said
Speaker 1: this repeatedly. AU basketball is not great for the ascension
Speaker 1: of young people. It's not collaborative. It's just about you
Speaker 1: and people gravy training you. And I look at the
Speaker 1: NBA right now. It doesn't bother me because I love
Speaker 1: bigs that can shoot handle. I love watching Yokic play.
Speaker 1: I know it's ugly, but I love it. But your
Speaker 1: thoughts in the crowded as we become more distracted on
Speaker 1: our phones and TikTok, and as the college football is
Speaker 1: growing bigger globally, where is NBA. Are you concerned at
Speaker 1: all about the NBA and the European growth and the
Speaker 1: domestic players shrinking?
Speaker 2: I don't so. To me, these are almost separate. So
Speaker 2: right now, first team All NBA would be five international guys.
Speaker 2: Right it'd be Luca and Shay as the guards and
Speaker 2: Giannis Yo Kitchen Embiid is your bigs. That would be that,
Speaker 2: and right now, that would be your first team All NBA.
Speaker 2: That would be your top five, probably MVP Ballot Tyrese
Speaker 2: Halliburton would probably be next next up, and right because
Speaker 2: of what's happened with John, I don't know who somebody's
Speaker 2: This wasn't my initial idea. These I read a tweet
Speaker 2: or heard a podcast. Sometimes I get a little sel
Speaker 2: conscious sometimes like I don't want to take someone's idea,
Speaker 2: but I also consume so much stuff, like I don't
Speaker 2: know where I first heard it, like and so some
Speaker 2: how he positive the idea is Anthony Davis the best
Speaker 2: American player and the and I stopped and I was
Speaker 2: at first, I'm like no, And then I thought about it,
Speaker 2: and I'm like, defensively, yes, well, like is it and
Speaker 2: is it between he and Tatum?
Speaker 1: Yes?
Speaker 2: Yeah? And if that's right, and if that's where we're at,
Speaker 2: that is a problem. That's not an indict I'm not
Speaker 2: saying those are Those guys are great players, but nobody
Speaker 2: thinks either one of them is in the discussion for
Speaker 2: best player in the league. And so and if we
Speaker 2: were to talk about the if we were to make
Speaker 2: a list of the eight best international players and the
Speaker 2: eight best American players, the other problem would be this,
Speaker 2: three of the eight Americans, maybe four of the eight
Speaker 2: Americans now I think about it, are old guys Steph
Speaker 2: lebron kd and Jimmy Butler, those are, you know what
Speaker 2: I mean, Jimmy's the youngest of the group, and so
Speaker 2: that is. But it's not like the NBA is not
Speaker 2: gonna have enough talent because it is such an international
Speaker 2: game and you're getting more and more guys from overseas.
Speaker 2: But like the you, there is a I think. And
Speaker 2: by the way, when we're talking about the best American players,
Speaker 2: the guy left out who's ascending there and would be
Speaker 2: the hope because of his age is Anthony Edwards. Yes,
Speaker 2: like could Anthony Edwards get there where we're talking about
Speaker 2: But from a pure strategic or popularity standpoint, I don't
Speaker 2: think it's great for the league if all of them.
Speaker 2: I think it's really good for the league. If some
Speaker 2: of the best players are international players. I don't think
Speaker 2: it's great for the league if all of the best
Speaker 2: players are international players and so and obviously people believe
Speaker 2: Wimby is gonna be on that track now he's that's
Speaker 2: to me, less about like the international game and more
Speaker 2: about the fact the guy's seventy five, you know what
Speaker 2: I mean, has is skilled and so I don't know
Speaker 2: the answer as to why I think AAU two often
Speaker 2: gets used as a boogeyman. You know, my son played
Speaker 2: high high level amateur basketball. They had really good experiences
Speaker 2: with it. The kid who I think is a really
Speaker 2: nice role player for the Knicks, I've talked to you
Speaker 2: about this, Quentin Grimes. Yeah, he was my son's teammate
Speaker 2: one summer. Those practices were good. That was a good team,
Speaker 2: that were good kids. So I think sometimes AU basketball
Speaker 2: gets a bad name. But there is something going on
Speaker 2: where the there is a different stylistic, you know, approach
Speaker 2: to basketball from many of them. I mean, Shoon is
Speaker 2: clearly like an international style of player. Now he's not
Speaker 2: a star, but he might be an All Star this year.
Speaker 2: And so I don't know the answer. And it does
Speaker 2: also feel like Shay almost should count as an American,
Speaker 2: like he's not you know what I mean, He's from Canada.
Speaker 2: He's stayed bad luck, Yeah exactly. But yeah, so I
Speaker 2: don't I don't know what the solution. I don't know
Speaker 2: if there is a solution. I don't know what the
Speaker 2: answer to it is. But it's undeniable that it's trending
Speaker 2: in that direction. And it happened fast. Yeah, twenty years ago,
Speaker 2: European player meant soft and it was like, wow.
Speaker 1: No question, it was like Tony.
Speaker 2: One hundred, and it was and it was basically okay,
Speaker 2: aside from Akeem Olajuan, who by the way, went to
Speaker 2: college in America, you know what I mean, the had
Speaker 2: an American experience. Aside from him, if your best player
Speaker 2: as an international guy, you got no shot whatsoever. And
Speaker 2: it switched really fast, really really fast. I mean ten
Speaker 2: years ago, it was just Dirk and a Teme as
Speaker 2: far as the like, no doubt all time.
Speaker 1: Legends, and Dirk was considered kind of a soft offensive
Speaker 1: only yep, exactly right, and so it changed fast on us.
Speaker 2: And I don't I also there is I'm not sure
Speaker 2: that somebody should and maybe somebody has and I just
Speaker 2: haven't read it either written. This is like a Daryl
Speaker 2: Moury Sloan conference type of paper or maybe a book
Speaker 2: because the other thing is this the international guys again
Speaker 2: aside from Shay who's Canadian, but the European stars they're
Speaker 2: all six to eight or taller. It's big skilled guys. Yeah,
Speaker 2: you know, Luca is a guard, but he's big. We're
Speaker 2: not getting a bunch of like six two wizards with
Speaker 2: the basketball from Europe. It's all like Yannis is this
Speaker 2: point forward. Embiid Yo Kitch was such a unique player.
Speaker 2: So I don't know what it is, but it's clearly
Speaker 2: it's clearly happening. For good or for bad, It's happened.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and let's just acknowledge that eighteen months from now
Speaker 1: Wemby will be in that discussion. So absolutely, so it's
Speaker 1: not stopping. So I was thinking about this and I
Speaker 1: want to continue on with the MBA and I have
Speaker 1: said this is that people show you who they are
Speaker 1: very early.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: One of the things when I started the volume, I said,
Speaker 1: be careful about hi hiring people that could be difficult
Speaker 1: to fire, meaning they're temperamental, they are grudge holding their petty,
Speaker 1: they're on Twitter.
Speaker 2: For the role trying to burn you down, yes, on
Speaker 2: the way out the door.
Speaker 1: So we've had three or four people that we have
Speaker 1: discussed hiring and I said, what if you had to
Speaker 1: let that person go? They didn't drive revenue, they were difficult.
Speaker 1: I said, be careful about that. So people show you
Speaker 1: who they are very early and very early. In Jason
Speaker 1: Tatum's career, I like him a lot. I don't love him.
Speaker 1: I like him a lot, but very early in his career.
Speaker 1: He showed you something that Michael never illustrated, Kobe didn't,
Speaker 1: Lebron didn't, Wade didn't, is that he lacked confidence in
Speaker 1: big spots. You almost had to push him into taking shots.
Speaker 1: Is that in these big fourth quarter moments his second third,
Speaker 1: fourth year, we were all like, oh love, his body
Speaker 1: can put it on the floor. Good teammate plays real defense.
Speaker 1: Can kind of let Jalen Brown take control sometimes, Mark
Speaker 1: markets smart Mark a detensive place. Yeah, turn into the
Speaker 1: pseudo alpha yep. And I watch the Celtics and I
Speaker 1: still don't trust them. Years later, he is at least
Speaker 1: sixty seventy percent. It's his game, But there are moments
Speaker 1: still with Jason Tatum. This is never a Luca issue.
Speaker 1: It's not a Yannis issue. No.
Speaker 2: And it's weird. I mean, this is spot on, by
Speaker 2: the way, and it's a weird thing to say, because
Speaker 2: he had fifty in a game seven. We saw him
Speaker 2: have that amazing game films against last few years ago,
Speaker 2: So it's in there him as a rookie dunk on
Speaker 2: Lebron and seem fully confident peak twenty eighteen Lebron. We've
Speaker 2: seen all these things and Celtics fans will get very
Speaker 2: you know, parochial and territorial and defensive, but I think
Speaker 2: deep down everybody knows that the Celtics, it's not they
Speaker 2: can't win the title, but they have to win the
Speaker 2: title like the Four Pistons, meaning it's got to be
Speaker 2: a collective effort, yep. And that is the hardest title
Speaker 2: to win. The reason we always go to the Four
Speaker 2: Pistons is because every other champion from nineteen eighty to
Speaker 2: now has had a top twenty all time player. So
Speaker 2: it's not like an indictment to say Tatum's not that,
Speaker 2: because it's only been like sixteen guys in forty years
Speaker 2: to be the best player on a champion. The only
Speaker 2: other guy other than the Four Pistons you would say
Speaker 2: is Kawhi's championships, but he was a guy who was
Speaker 2: trending towards that, and injuries kind of under you know
Speaker 2: what I mean, undercut the player he was gonna be.
Speaker 2: Every other team literally had a legend. And I don't
Speaker 2: think anyone looks at Jason Tatum and says he's going
Speaker 2: to be a legend.
Speaker 1: That's right.
Speaker 2: We say his ceiling is MVP candidate. Yeah, all the
Speaker 2: other guys. The ceiling was how many MVPs? Okay, and
Speaker 2: that's the difference.
Speaker 1: Okay. So I threw this out last week. It's my
Speaker 1: favorite comp I think I've ever done in the last
Speaker 1: ye Wow. Andy Murray tennis player, great Britain. So there's
Speaker 1: Feeder is better than him, and he's like, okay, and
Speaker 1: then Feeder's getting old, and then Feeder's passed his prime
Speaker 1: and Andy Murray has this lit window. Oh crap, here
Speaker 1: comes the Joker and his window was about a year. Okay, okay, Tatum,
Speaker 1: Lebron Staff, he just doesn't have that savvy that game.
Speaker 1: It's like, ah, he's so close and he gets a
Speaker 1: little window. Finals against the Warriors, doesn't win, and here
Speaker 1: comes Jokic and Luca and Giannis. He's the Andy Murray
Speaker 1: of the NBA that his window was a sliver. He
Speaker 1: was there at home and the and and it's that
Speaker 1: close and in the final set.
Speaker 2: And he's just like, okay, that right, and that might
Speaker 2: be it and that might And so that's why I
Speaker 2: give the Celtics credit, because they have built a team that,
Speaker 2: if healthy, is so well rounded and has so many
Speaker 2: top fifty players on it. You know, of today's game.
Speaker 2: You know what I mean, Like they their their worst
Speaker 2: starter is still a really good player. Yes, you have
Speaker 2: Derek White, uh, Drew Holliday, Tatum Brown, and porzingis.
Speaker 1: Excellent starting five.
Speaker 2: It's it's a great starting five. They are banking on that. Again,
Speaker 2: that's the old four Pistons. The old four Pistons. You
Speaker 2: have Rip Hamilton, you have Tayshawn Prince, you have Rashid Wallace,
Speaker 2: you have Ben Wallace, you have Chauncey Phillips. Yeah, those
Speaker 2: are five excellent players, but nobody that is all holy shit. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and that's where and I think Tatum's probably right now
Speaker 2: better than any of those five guys so on that moment.
Speaker 2: But that is that's just the truth. Yeah, that's why
Speaker 2: the NBA is so unique. Like when I and I
Speaker 2: want to be make it clear to the audience, when
Speaker 2: I say nineteen eighty to now, like and I'll just
Speaker 2: do the like my own personal like off the top
Speaker 2: of my head rankings, I did that list the fifty
Speaker 2: best players last fifty years, So kareem to now. And
Speaker 2: if you go through the champions from eighty to now,
Speaker 2: you have the Lakers who had Kareem and Magic who
Speaker 2: are two and four. You had the Sixers who had
Speaker 2: Doctor J and Moses who are twelve and thirteen. You
Speaker 2: have the Celtics who had Larry Bird who's seven or eight.
Speaker 2: You had the Pistons who had Isaiah who's right around fifteen,
Speaker 2: and then you have the Bulls who had MJ, the
Speaker 2: Rockets who had a Keem, and then the Spurs who
Speaker 2: have Tim Duncan, the Lakers with Kobe and Shaq, the
Speaker 2: four Pistons, and then you have the heat who have
Speaker 2: d Wade who's right on the fringes, but Shaq who's
Speaker 2: firmly in it obviously, then the Lakers again with just Kobe,
Speaker 2: and then oh, the other team. You know, it's funny
Speaker 2: I left this out. The other team they're trying to
Speaker 2: be like, is the eight Celtics, who again they had Garnett,
Speaker 2: who is Garnett's better than Tatum, but he was, you
Speaker 2: know so, But it's the same type of thing, so
Speaker 2: I shouldn't have left them out. But Garnett's on the
Speaker 2: fringes of it. And then since then we know who
Speaker 2: it is. It's Lebron, it's Steph, it's Dirk who's right there. Uh,
Speaker 2: it's Giannis, it's Jokic, it's Durant, it's Kawhi, and it's
Speaker 2: not an indict. And this was why I didn't believe
Speaker 2: in the Nuggets, because it was the same map. I
Speaker 2: just underrated Jokic, right. The math was, okay, Yo is
Speaker 2: really good. He's not a legend and I was wrong.
Speaker 2: It's like, oh shit, he's pretty legendary. He's pretty great.
Speaker 2: And so I guess maybe it's self fulfilling in that
Speaker 2: if the Celtics get there, we'll look at Tatum like that.
Speaker 2: But I don't think we will. If the Celtics get there,
Speaker 2: I think it'll be like, wow, that was That was
Speaker 2: an awesome team they put together. And so it is
Speaker 2: why it's hard too. It's also why the Heat haven't
Speaker 2: gotten over the quite over the Hume, because the Heat
Speaker 2: have tried the same thing. They've got an awesome player
Speaker 2: in Jimmy and awesome starting five, much better coach than
Speaker 2: Boston as obviously, but it's so hard when you get
Speaker 2: in the finals for the Heat, when they've done it,
Speaker 2: you got in the finals, you got your team, all
Speaker 2: of it, and Lebron is sitting there and even old
Speaker 2: ass Lebron was like after two weeks, I can kick
Speaker 2: your ass. Then you get in the finals again and
Speaker 2: Jokich is like, yeah, I can kick your ass too.
Speaker 2: It's just hard when that guy's on the other side.
Speaker 2: And for the Celtic what's gonna be The tough thing
Speaker 2: is this? And the NBA doesn't always come down to this,
Speaker 2: but man, it's hard to overcome in one series, much
Speaker 2: less three in a row. I would argue the Celtics
Speaker 2: to win a title are probably gonna have to win
Speaker 2: three consecutive series, the second round, the conference finals, and
Speaker 2: the finals. We're the best player on the courts on
Speaker 2: the other team. Yep, speaking hard man, you know what
Speaker 2: I mean? Like because embiid or embiding the playoffs isn't
Speaker 2: the same, but still Giannis, any of those guys, Jimmy
Speaker 2: Butler has proven in the playoffs and then whoever you
Speaker 2: face off in the finals that you might have the
Speaker 2: better two, three, four, five, but the best player is
Speaker 2: gonna be on the other team. It's gonna be hard.
Speaker 2: Can we the I'm not trying to hijack your podcast,
Speaker 2: but can we talk about Philly for a second? The Eagles?
Speaker 1: Oh, you're not hijacking it?
Speaker 2: Philadelphia?
Speaker 1: Yeah, so much. I love about them, but I have
Speaker 1: a feeling Nick Seriani is closer to the opening press
Speaker 1: conference than the Super Bowl.
Speaker 2: Okay, so here's the thing there. So Wilds did an
Speaker 2: interesting thing on the TV show, which was he made
Speaker 2: the point that if the Patriots fired Bill Belichick and
Speaker 2: then surveyed this is before rabel got fired and surveyed
Speaker 2: the landscape, they're like, okay, who's the best coach available,
Speaker 2: they'd land on Bill Belichick. The idea on it me,
Speaker 2: he said. It was the same thing is the moment
Speaker 2: the Raiders cut Derek Carr, they're like, okay, we need
Speaker 2: a quarterback? Who should be signed? That someone would come
Speaker 2: and be like, well here's this guy, and it'd be
Speaker 2: Derek Carr. That the guy you're getting the best available.
Speaker 2: So the opposite of that thought exercise is this, it's
Speaker 2: about to be what half a dozen job opens, jobs open?
Speaker 2: If Nick Sirianni were fired, would anyone hire him to
Speaker 2: be their head coach? If the answer to that is no,
Speaker 2: then you have to ask yourself should he be ours?
Speaker 2: And I know that sounds harsh, and I know that
Speaker 2: sounds too much, but I would I would remind people
Speaker 2: in Philadelphia Andy Reid fourteen years, five conference championship games
Speaker 2: of Super Bowl appearance, nine playoff appearances, eight double digit
Speaker 2: win seasons, one bad year could be and c quarterbacks
Speaker 2: mostly one bad year gone, replaced by Chip Kelly. Chip
Speaker 2: Kelly ten and six, ten and six the next year
Speaker 2: didn't make it to the end of year three after
Speaker 2: back to back ten win seasons. Doug Peterson wins a
Speaker 2: Super Bowl with a backup quarterback. The next year, wins
Speaker 2: a playoff game with a backup quarterback. The next year
Speaker 2: makes the playoffs, the next year a bad season gone.
Speaker 2: So this idea that Sirianni's untouchable Gary Kubiak I looked
Speaker 2: it up today, was forty six and eighteen with the Broncos,
Speaker 2: went to the Division round four times, went to a
Speaker 2: Super Bowl, and they fired him. They were like, you
Speaker 2: know what, you're out of it. So if the Eagles
Speaker 2: lose six of seven down the stretch and the losses
Speaker 2: are the Niners by a million when that game, I'm
Speaker 2: gonna go through it because think about it, that Niners game,
Speaker 2: the Niners had three losses, the Eagles had won, that
Speaker 2: would have locked up the one seed with six weeks
Speaker 2: to go, you'd be four games up with five games left.
Speaker 2: You know what I mean? The Niners would have then
Speaker 2: had four losses in the tiebreaker would have been to you.
Speaker 2: They get blown out. Okay, that sucks. The next week
Speaker 2: they could have locked up the NFC East against Dallas.
Speaker 2: They would have swept Dallas. Dallas would have five losses.
Speaker 2: They get blown out. The next week, Drew Lock has
Speaker 2: the only relevant moment of his NFL career, ninety two
Speaker 2: yards to win the game. You then, you know, escape
Speaker 2: against Tommy DeVito. Then Kyler drives the field on you,
Speaker 2: hanging thirty five. Yeah, and then Tyrod Taylor is up
Speaker 2: twenty four to nothing at halftime on your starters. If
Speaker 2: then you lose to Baker, oh boy, like it is.
Speaker 2: It is rough and and there are real real questions
Speaker 2: about what is this team right now? Aside from a
Speaker 2: play that is likely going to be banned next year,
Speaker 2: what do you do well? And I don't know the answer.
Speaker 1: Hey, look at I can argue it's become Brandon Staley.
Speaker 1: At the end with Brandon Staley, he argued, hey, we're
Speaker 1: losing close games. We're not getting blown out his quote.
Speaker 1: Then they got blown out and it's like, okay, So
Speaker 1: Sirianni's like, hey, there these are go either way games
Speaker 1: and then you fall behind twenty four nothing to the Giants.
Speaker 1: So not that it was a mutiny, but with Staley
Speaker 1: and Nick. By the way, you know who the Eagles
Speaker 1: were going to hire, if not Nick Sirianni, they liked Staley,
Speaker 1: so they were looking for a young voice. And so
Speaker 1: when you start going from narrow narrow losses, there's two
Speaker 1: or three things that I always think about. You go
Speaker 1: from narrow, narrow losses okay, to ugly losses, and then
Speaker 1: you ask yourself, would the Chargers at the end Herbert
Speaker 1: before the injury had regressed, Jalen Hurts has regressed. There
Speaker 1: is nothing the Chargers or the Eagles do well. Now
Speaker 1: there's nothing well.
Speaker 2: And so then the other problem is it's like, well,
Speaker 2: let's not forget the year he just got last year
Speaker 2: out of Jalen Hurts. And then you ask yourself the
Speaker 2: really tough question of you watch Indy this year because
Speaker 2: Shane and you watch what Shane Steichen was able to
Speaker 2: cobble together with Gardner Minshew. I understand the last play
Speaker 2: of the last game didn't go well, but they were
Speaker 2: a yard away from maybe being in the playoffs with
Speaker 2: that indie roster. And there's your big chess move, was
Speaker 2: demoting your decordinator in promoting Patricia. And now your defense
Speaker 2: is worse than it was, your quarterback has regressed. You're
Speaker 2: not gonna have more talent in the future, the best
Speaker 2: offensive line, seven first round draft picks on your defensive line,
Speaker 2: two stud receivers, so I and now and folks, you
Speaker 2: know all eight mile myself here a bit. Folks think
Speaker 2: I don't like Sirianni because he told Chiefs fans to
Speaker 2: fuck off after they won that game. That is not it.
Speaker 2: But that is a noteworthy moment because that is it
Speaker 2: was the same way let and I pointed out last
Speaker 2: year in the lead up to the postseason when they're
Speaker 2: blowing the Giants out in the playoff game and that
Speaker 2: little skycam gets him and he does that mean mug
Speaker 2: like shaking his head yes. And then in the Super
Speaker 2: Bowl when they're going to get a challenge gone their
Speaker 2: way and he's kind of histrionically showing for like pointing
Speaker 2: one way, and Jalen Hurts has to stop him, like,
Speaker 2: hey man, what are you doing? He felt to me
Speaker 2: like a bit of a front runner, like a guy
Speaker 2: that is really good when things are going good. And
Speaker 2: in his defense, it was like, well, we don't know
Speaker 2: how he's gonna respond when things are going poorly because
Speaker 2: they've never gone poorly. Well, now they are and it's
Speaker 2: going disastrously. So I think it's at least a question
Speaker 2: if Philly loses.
Speaker 1: Well, you know it's here's another topic. First, impressions matter.
Speaker 1: I've used the American Idol example a million times. I
Speaker 1: don't know anything about music other than I enjoy it,
Speaker 1: but I can I can listen. I can watch American
Speaker 1: Idol and say that's a hack, that's a star, that's
Speaker 1: an employable lounge singer. And I know nothing about music that.
Speaker 1: Dan Campbell has sort of a blue collar work ethos
Speaker 1: and a likability where the average fan who's busting is
Speaker 1: asked for a living is going to love him. He's
Speaker 1: really a guy a fan would like to have a
Speaker 1: beer with. Dan's opening press conference was embarrassing, like just
Speaker 1: like Novice, like eat your knee caps. Yeah, is bad,
Speaker 1: and he was four nineteen and one to start, and
Speaker 1: then you know, things start working out. He gets I've
Speaker 1: said this before. The star of that franchise is not Goffer,
Speaker 1: Dan Campbell or Ben Johnson. It's the front office. They've
Speaker 1: had like back to back to back incredible drafts, like
Speaker 1: great drafts, and so then he gets a bunch of
Speaker 1: good players and they start winning a wonky division where
Speaker 1: Aaron Rodgers leaves, the Bears are a tire fire and
Speaker 1: Kirk Cousins is you know, sort of okay, and they
Speaker 1: win and they deserve credit for it. But now you're
Speaker 1: watching Dan Campbell and you're going, he's a little over
Speaker 1: a skis, he's a bit of a meathead. Sarahani had
Speaker 1: the worst press conference I've ever seen, could not speak
Speaker 1: acknowledged that very turbulent like Dan Campbell, Early Steiken comes in,
Speaker 1: elevates the offense, he leaves, they stink. And in both
Speaker 1: instances I ripped both. I said, you know, Dan came
Speaker 1: off as sort of a very limited meet him and
Speaker 1: we've seen examples that he's sort of he's the.
Speaker 2: Overly emotional, emotional Listen, he's emotional, he's a fan.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's Siahanni looks completely over his head. Is
Speaker 1: that first impressions do matter? You ever watch Sean mcvay's
Speaker 1: first press conference, Obama wasn't that slick. I mean, it
Speaker 1: was like it was on a prompter. I was like
Speaker 1: chest face forward looking at the camera. I mean I
Speaker 1: literally thought, my god, I run through a who is
Speaker 1: this like nineteen?
Speaker 2: It was like thirty two. Yeah, I was just.
Speaker 1: Like, holy hell, first impressions matter. Mcvey's first press conference
Speaker 1: knocks your sock off. And then I think that if
Speaker 1: you go back to Sirianni and Dan Campbell, there are
Speaker 1: qualities about both that are endearing. But man, if you
Speaker 1: can't get the opening presser right, it said said.
Speaker 2: This, it's a real thing.
Speaker 1: It's a nobody wants to say this, but it does matter.
Speaker 1: We elect people based on are they telegenic? Are they
Speaker 1: good at the podium? If you can't get through four
Speaker 1: and a half to eight minutes on a podium, by
Speaker 1: the way, you've flown in, you've thought about it, you
Speaker 1: know there's gonna be tough. Point you're preparing for it.
Speaker 2: Well. So that's so that last part I think is
Speaker 2: the most interesting because I wonder if some of these
Speaker 2: guys would be better if they weren't, if they didn't
Speaker 2: know it was that day, if it was off the cuff,
Speaker 2: like Siriani's thing to me, Campbell was a different story.
Speaker 2: Campbell was, this guy's a form of player. I think
Speaker 2: players are gonna I looked at that press conference and said,
Speaker 2: I totally get why motivationally he's gonna be excellent, why
Speaker 2: players might relate to him. And that very moment I said,
Speaker 2: and I listen, I get it. I'm a nerd. I
Speaker 2: didn't play, I understand, but in that moment I was like,
Speaker 2: my guess is he's not gonna be great at the
Speaker 2: situational football stuff. Now he actually has been shockingly good
Speaker 2: at He does follow the quote analytics, but it's just
Speaker 2: really what he's doing is he just wants to go
Speaker 2: for it every time, and the analytics support going for it.
Speaker 2: But like so like, I think it's almost by accident
Speaker 2: that he's following me because it's like super aggressive, go
Speaker 2: go go. But you saw the cartoonish end result of
Speaker 2: that when he went for that two point converted yard line,
Speaker 2: which is one of the worst decisions exactly. He was
Speaker 2: an angry fan that was like, this is bullshit. I
Speaker 2: got screwed. I'm gonna show you. So that's different. Sirianni's
Speaker 2: thing was he seemed nervous, like I bet Siriani if
Speaker 2: he had not been told there was a press conference coming.
Speaker 2: I think he was hurt by the fact he had
Speaker 2: thought about it all night. But that's a different type
Speaker 2: of concern. That means when things get tight, are you
Speaker 2: gonna get tight? When that means, you know what I mean,
Speaker 2: when the pressure up, are you going to respond or not?
Speaker 2: So that was a different level of concern. So the
Speaker 2: reason I brought the whole Sirianni thing up was I
Speaker 2: have a different kind of galaxy brain question for you,
Speaker 2: which is this, if they lose to Tampa and they
Speaker 2: fire him, isn't that the perfect spot for Belichick? You
Speaker 2: have all that talent on defense, the offensive skill position
Speaker 2: guys are there and they're already there.
Speaker 1: And your weakness is drafting. Howie Roseman's an expert at.
Speaker 2: It exactly right, and it's like, hey, you've got, however
Speaker 2: limited Jalen Hurts might be, even if last year was
Speaker 2: an aberration, the best quarterback he will have had in
Speaker 2: a half decade. He will look at Jalen Hurts like
Speaker 2: he is Patrick Mahomes two point zero. When he's been
Speaker 2: able with Mac Jones and Bailey Zappi and the last
Speaker 2: you know legs of Cam Newton. The offense is in place,
Speaker 2: the defense has all this blue chip town up front,
Speaker 2: and Belichick's been getting the most out of secondary players
Speaker 2: and linebackers for twenty years. This Patriots deepens doesn't have
Speaker 2: stars on it, and they're awesome, Like the stars are
Speaker 2: hurt Judean and Gonzales. And that is why if I
Speaker 2: were filling and I lose to Tampa, I wouldn't fire Sirianni.
Speaker 2: To fire Sirianni, but I'm sure a shit would consider
Speaker 2: it if I got on good you know, good intel.
Speaker 2: Bill Belichick, he wants to stay in the Northeast. Yeah,
Speaker 2: he wants to go with the blue chip. People are like, ah,
Speaker 2: maybe Atlanta. Like Bill Belichick doesn't want to coach the Falcons,
Speaker 2: be in the set like he was staying a cold
Speaker 2: weather Northeastern city with a blue chip franchise. Chance to
Speaker 2: frictionals record, chance to get to the super Bowl. That
Speaker 2: to me is a hand and glove fit that I
Speaker 2: would strongly consider if I were all parties.
Speaker 1: I had a very good gambling year, so I was
Speaker 1: O nine and one to start from that point four
Speaker 1: fourteen of sixteen weeks, I was five hundred or better.
Speaker 1: I was sixteen four percent, sixteen three. That's a really
Speaker 1: good year. So that's unbelievable. Ye, that's unbelievable. I had
Speaker 1: a great, great, blazing fire. I had a guy come
Speaker 1: up to me yesterday in the grocery store. He's like, man,
Speaker 1: you were cooking this year. Let me buy you blankety blank.
Speaker 1: And I'm like, I'm good, this is my job. Don't
Speaker 1: worry about it. And he was like, he goes calling,
Speaker 1: I've been following you for a lot of years. He goes, Man,
Speaker 1: he goes, you had a year about ten years ago
Speaker 1: like this, which I remember, And I said.
Speaker 2: Well, the year ten years ago or whenever it was
Speaker 2: right before you came to Fox Sports, that was a
Speaker 2: year you might have been on the record the best
Speaker 2: handicapper in the country. That was a year with the
Speaker 2: blazing five. Would change lines a bit, that was that
Speaker 2: was a historic run. And then I didn't know. You
Speaker 2: know what's funny, and this is now going to sound
Speaker 2: like a bitter man. Uh, this is you know, the
Speaker 2: modern media. There was a lot of public you know,
Speaker 2: publicity about your first two weeks, not nearly a long
Speaker 2: the following sixteen a lot the coward hasn't made a
Speaker 2: bat in two weeks, just getting roasted well by the meanwhile,
Speaker 2: just went two and three every fucking week I did.
Speaker 2: I had my worst year in forever, just and it
Speaker 2: was just the same thing, two and three, three and
Speaker 2: two everyone.
Speaker 1: Well, by the way, horrible had a losing record in COVID.
Speaker 1: I had a shit COVID year. My takeaway was folks
Speaker 1: Sunday morning, they'd be like, oh yeah, these eight starters
Speaker 1: don't play. It's like that doesn't count.
Speaker 2: You got it.
Speaker 1: But you know, it's funny when the media and I
Speaker 1: don't care because I literally am not on my phone,
Speaker 1: like just not. I once Elon must took it over.
Speaker 1: I gave him about two months. It's a mess. I'm
Speaker 1: just not on it. I use it for promotion for
Speaker 1: my podcast with a volume. I'm not on it. But
Speaker 1: it is interesting that the blogg A sphere, which claims
Speaker 1: shows like our clickbait went over the moon on my
Speaker 1: own nine and one start nothing in sixteen weeks or
Speaker 1: not hot nothing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but go ahead, sorry, I well, of course, but
Speaker 2: I mean you want to hear, you want to hear
Speaker 2: my theory. This year.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So what I did every weekend and it didn't
Speaker 1: Noah's work. Like this weekend, I said, Justin Fields is
Speaker 1: not as good as Jordan Love, but Justin Field's with
Speaker 1: that atrocious Green Bay defense will look better than Love
Speaker 1: against the good defense.
Speaker 2: It didn't happen. That's what I thought too, Yep.
Speaker 1: But what I really started to do by week three,
Speaker 1: I said, you're overthinking the room. When you can get
Speaker 1: the best quarterback in value, just bet him. And I
Speaker 1: started just betting four to my five picks. I bet
Speaker 1: a lot of Kyler Murray. It's like I bet some
Speaker 1: Tyrod Taylor. I'm like Tyrod Taylor against Philadelphia's defense.
Speaker 2: He's gonna move the ball.
Speaker 1: He's everaged three hundred and sixty yards against better defenses.
Speaker 1: And I already started coming down to almost like I
Speaker 1: picked divisions who will be the better quarterbacks in these games.
Speaker 1: And it's amazing how simple, Like for instance, Texans Colts
Speaker 1: this weekend, whise guys love the Colts, and I'm like, folks,
Speaker 1: it's a.
Speaker 2: Win, you're in game. C J.
Speaker 1: Stroud's better. I would take c J.
Speaker 2: Stroud.
Speaker 1: I talked myself out of it because jam are like
Speaker 1: no but in the end, I watched it. I went
Speaker 1: first play the game, last drive. It was won by C. J.
Speaker 2: Stroud. Yeah, all right, last last thing. I don't know
Speaker 2: what the and I might have said this to you
Speaker 2: on TV today, I don't remember I so I apologize
Speaker 2: if I'm in reruns I said it to someone today.
Speaker 2: I don't know who's going what the division, No, I
Speaker 2: didn't say this to you. What the division around matchups
Speaker 2: are going to be. I know what the best ones
Speaker 2: would be. The ideal outcomes are the Rams beating the Lions,
Speaker 2: because then you get the Rams playing the Niners, and
Speaker 2: that's a real scare for the Niners. That is a
Speaker 2: real legitimate scare. And I love CJ. Stroud. I love
Speaker 2: that story. If we assume the Bills and Chiefs are
Speaker 2: gonna win, which I think they both will, and that
Speaker 2: is a great right round two Chiefs having to go
Speaker 2: to Buffalo for the first time. Everyone I am as
Speaker 2: America's most noteworthy you know, Buffalo antagonist. I'm rooting for
Speaker 2: the Bills. I want to see Chiefs Bills in Buffalo.
Speaker 2: Let's get mahomes Allen. So let's assume that's it. As
Speaker 2: much as I like C. J. Stroud. I'm rooting for
Speaker 2: the Browns because Brown's Ravens is another one that is
Speaker 2: a shitty first game for Baltimore. It's like, wait a minute,
Speaker 2: we got to play the only quarterback in the conference
Speaker 2: with a deep playoff experience otherin Mahomes in a first
Speaker 2: game in a divisional matchup with that defense, and they're
Speaker 2: hot coming off a win. And then I don't really
Speaker 2: care who wins Eagles, Bucks, because I think either team's
Speaker 2: drawing dead. But it's probably better if the Eagles win.
Speaker 2: You get Cowboys Eagles, but Niners, Rams, Chiefs, Bills. Brown's
Speaker 2: Ravens would be an unbelievable Divisional round weekend as far
Speaker 2: as where you could make a credible case for any
Speaker 2: of those six teams in those matchups, and you could
Speaker 2: make a credible case for any of those teams making
Speaker 2: the super Bowl. Like I think the Rams can make
Speaker 2: the super Bowl. I'm not picking them to make the
Speaker 2: super Bowl, but I think that it is. They've won
Speaker 2: seven of eight and the one losses to Baltimore and Overton.
Speaker 2: I mean that's with Sean McVay and Matt Stafford, Like
Speaker 2: that's a real thing. And Baltimore's defense, I mean, sorry,
Speaker 2: Cleveland's defense, Baltimore. I don't know. I'm super excited. So
Speaker 2: that's what I'm hoping happens. I don't know if it's
Speaker 2: what will happen, that's what I'm hoping.
Speaker 1: So it's interesting. I mentioned you at the end of
Speaker 1: the show today. I said, Nick Wright, two weeks in
Speaker 1: a row has said you're gonna bet the Rams over
Speaker 1: the lines, and I'm like, no, contreremont for that's not
Speaker 1: gonna happen. And today I got my notepad out coach
Speaker 1: quarterback defense Laporta is out and I'm like, oh, Shitta.
Speaker 2: You're gonna take the Rams, certainly plus the points. I mean,
Speaker 2: certainly with the.
Speaker 1: Points out Dan Campbell McVeigh, that's a two and a
Speaker 1: half to three point advantage.
Speaker 2: Yeah, sapor golf.
Speaker 1: Two and a half to three points. You have to
Speaker 1: take the points of the Rams. You have to take
Speaker 1: the points.
Speaker 2: You have to take the points with the Rams. I
Speaker 2: think that have to do is points with the rams.
Speaker 2: I think that when the Chiefs were did you see
Speaker 2: what the Chiefs line opened at two and a half
Speaker 2: available one and a half and it was available for
Speaker 2: ninety seconds. You know what I mean? Now four is
Speaker 2: a different story because you know what I mean, Well,
Speaker 2: I think the Dolphins might fold in the cold. The
Speaker 2: Chiefs haven't blown anybody out in forever, you know what
Speaker 2: I mean, Like I that's that's not an obvious one.
Speaker 2: I think the next best bet is Tampa getting points
Speaker 2: at home. The Eagles teem that's fall.
Speaker 1: I don't think it's I think the Kansas City Listen,
Speaker 1: you're gonna play poker when you're retired. I'm gonna do
Speaker 1: a podcast a week with a volume and bet football
Speaker 1: and and so when you bet football professionally, I wouldn't
Speaker 1: be on the air. I would wait for the lines
Speaker 1: to come out and pounce on him. I would live
Speaker 1: in a state rocking gamble and I would just pounce.
Speaker 1: So you know, like there are the best lines of
Speaker 1: the week, or OW was Sunday night, Monday, those are
Speaker 1: the best lines. OHA's and the sharps jump on him.
Speaker 1: And I've always said, if I hit sixty three percent
Speaker 1: from weeks you know, three to the end of the year,
Speaker 1: I'd hit sixty four to sixty five percent. If I
Speaker 1: could bet them. If I did blazing five on Monday,
Speaker 1: I would get it wouldn't be dramatically different. But you
Speaker 1: would get like six to seven games a year where
Speaker 1: you just get a team you like. Because I lost
Speaker 1: several games, I pushed on like four games that the
Speaker 1: line just was and I would say, I say on
Speaker 1: the air Friday, this is not the best of the line.
Speaker 1: But I still like them. But I will say is
Speaker 1: that these games are tough bets. I don't love any
Speaker 1: of them. I tend to think Philadelphia. I mean, I
Speaker 1: watched Baker last week. They were they were bad.
Speaker 2: I mean, that's true, and he's hurt.
Speaker 1: I mean, if you go look at this run, they
Speaker 1: got two wins over Carolina like that division.
Speaker 2: No, no, no, that's true. That's true. So my set. So
Speaker 2: then if you take that out the the next one
Speaker 2: that I think is.
Speaker 1: I think Kansas City hosting a warm weather team that
Speaker 1: is depleted is a I would go up to four
Speaker 1: and a half, I think.
Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, Kansas City healthy, which they are, Kansas
Speaker 2: City rested like It's It's one thing for this Chiefs
Speaker 2: team to not be the team that it was projected
Speaker 2: to be before the season, which is the super Bowl favorite.
Speaker 2: It's another thing for them to fully healthy lose a
Speaker 2: home wild card game, you know what I mean. Like
Speaker 2: the the reason the line concerns me is even if
Speaker 2: I'm even if I'm right, that Kancity controls the game.
Speaker 2: Once you lay four, you're susceptible to being up ten.
Speaker 2: And that shitty back door cover at the end, you
Speaker 2: know what I mean, at the end, that just guts you.
Speaker 2: I think the Cowboys are gonna score thirty five points
Speaker 2: on green Bet.
Speaker 1: I do too. I just the question is, can Green
Speaker 1: Bay score thirty That game feels like thirty three, thirty
Speaker 1: four to twenty six. That's what it feels like.
Speaker 2: Right right that the line is exactly right. That's the
Speaker 2: thing of listening the NFL in general, lines are never wrong.
Speaker 2: NFL playoffs, well, it's ever like, oh my god, look
Speaker 2: at this bet. Like no, I mean that never is there.
Speaker 2: The only one is I think the Rams are better
Speaker 2: than Detroit. I just flatly believe the Rams are better than.
Speaker 1: Well, they certainly have components without Laporta. That's Laporta is
Speaker 1: the rare tight end. I mean, Travis Kelcey has sixteen
Speaker 1: touchdowns on fourteen playoff games. It matters. He's better in
Speaker 1: the playoffs.
Speaker 2: He also, Colin is the NFL's all time leader in
Speaker 2: playoff yards per game, not amongst tight ends, amongst everyone,
Speaker 2: amongst receivers with at least ten games, he's the all
Speaker 2: time leader in playoff yards per game. So yeah, I
Speaker 2: mean and Kelsey. Listen, Kelsey hasn't been right all year.
Speaker 2: But I also think if you look at his snap count,
Speaker 2: if you look at things the Chiefs have been despite
Speaker 2: the fact that they've needed these games, they've blown some games.
Speaker 2: They have been, to my eye, a team that has
Speaker 2: been holding certain thing. They have not broken the glass.
Speaker 2: They clearly have not yet felt we are in full emergency.
Speaker 2: Because Kelsey hadn't played ninety percent of the snaps in
Speaker 2: any games. You've only seen Mahomes run a lot, and
Speaker 2: you saw it for the first time in the Bengals game,
Speaker 2: which was to lock up the division and be able
Speaker 2: to rest in Week eighteen. I still think Kansas City
Speaker 2: has a gear just like you saw Buffalo here this
Speaker 2: last few months. All of a sudden, Josh Allen is
Speaker 2: running all the time, and you know why, because they
Speaker 2: have to win, and it's like that is always their
Speaker 2: most dangerous play. They don't do it because it's dangerous
Speaker 2: for them. They can get the guy hurt, no matter
Speaker 2: how big he is, I think can. I'm always leery
Speaker 2: of teams that I think might have an extra gear.
Speaker 2: I think Kansas City might have an extra gear, and
Speaker 2: I do. The Kansas City stat that jumps out to
Speaker 2: me or two of them, one is they are this
Speaker 2: year they have one loss when they either tie if
Speaker 2: they don't lose the turnover back. And that one loss
Speaker 2: was the first game of the year, and their turnover,
Speaker 2: by the way, was a pick six the other way
Speaker 2: off a bobble pass. Everybody talks about all these issues
Speaker 2: they have. The sneaky problem for Kansas City is top
Speaker 2: five most turnovers, bottom five fewest force turnovers. They have
Speaker 2: the third worst plus minus in football. Every other team
Speaker 2: in that bottom ten is some shit team that is
Speaker 2: drafting early. You can't overcome that. Typically the Chiefs have.
Speaker 2: So maybe that kills them, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2: Maybe in the playoffs they keep turning the ball over,
Speaker 2: that kills them. But if they don't, they don't lose.
Speaker 2: And do I trust them a little bit more come
Speaker 2: the playoffs? I do? And so I think kan City's
Speaker 2: super dangerous, and I think the Rams are super dangerous
Speaker 2: and if the Rams. Man, if the Rams beat San Francisco,
Speaker 2: that then means Dallas doesn't have to leave home the
Speaker 2: whole playoffs, and so like they are sneaky. I thought
Speaker 2: one of the most important moments of the weekend was
Speaker 2: San Francisco or the Rams beating San Francisco, because that
Speaker 2: made the Rams the sixty instead of the seven. Because
Speaker 2: I think the Rams could have gone to Dallas and
Speaker 2: caused some real problems for the same reason they can
Speaker 2: go to Detroit and cause problems. So yeah, I don't know,
Speaker 2: means a.
Speaker 1: Very sneaky MVP. Is Matt Stafford not gonna win it.
Speaker 1: He has been on fire for about nine weeks, and
Speaker 1: I mean arm Angeles, I mean he has been. It's amazing.
Speaker 1: One of the reasons the NFL is so great. A
Speaker 1: baseball draft or an NBA draft, you have to be patient.
Speaker 1: Pukunakua has changed the receiving corps. They got a left
Speaker 1: tackle who's great, two defensive linemen who have been excellent
Speaker 1: as rookies. It's like they got like four players who
Speaker 1: are impactful in the draft, and Stafford's healthy, and it's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: they their rosters suddenly really interesting.
Speaker 2: The Rams draft this year is the Chiefs draft. Last year,
Speaker 2: it's like, oh, you got four guys that are helping
Speaker 2: you right now. Yes, you know what I mean, Like
Speaker 2: four guys that are right now making a difference. Not like, oh,
Speaker 2: they're going to be good. It's like, no, they are
Speaker 2: good right now. When that happens, it changes the math
Speaker 2: on your team. It significantly changes the math on your team.
Speaker 2: It took too long here.
Speaker 1: Now, no, no, no, an hour twy I was good. Listen,
Speaker 1: you sit in the snow. I got sixty two degrees. Yeah, exactly,
Speaker 1: A shrimp s well, a shrimp salad. Oh my goodness,
Speaker 1: tell your wonderful wife. I say hello, uh, and I will.
Speaker 1: I hope to see you in Los Angeles again soon.
Speaker 1: The if I gotta find a way, because I still
Speaker 1: believe the Chiefs are going to go to the super Bowl,
Speaker 1: I gotta find a way to go to the super
Speaker 1: Bowl when the Chiefs are there going for back to back,
Speaker 1: And if that happens, maybe I can do my show
Speaker 1: from Los Angeles and I'll get to see you. But
Speaker 1: it's always great to talk to you. I'll talk to you,
Speaker 1: so I write that pencil, not Pennis.
Speaker 2: Okay, all right, I'll talk to you later. The volume