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Speaker 1: On the bed Cast, the questions asked if movies have

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Speaker 1: women and um are all their discussions just boyfriends and

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Speaker 1: husbands or do they have individualism the patriarchy? Zef in

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Speaker 1: best start changing it with the Bedel Cast. Hello and

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Speaker 1: welcome to the Bechtel Cast. My name is Jamie Loftus,

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Speaker 1: my name is Caitlin Darante, and this is our podcast

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Speaker 1: in which we discuss the role of women in famous

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Speaker 1: movies you've seen before. Today is a special one to

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Speaker 1: This is a special one. I mean, you're hearing us

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Speaker 1: on a Tuesday. You don't usually hear us on a Tuesday,

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Speaker 1: and it's it's okay. First of all, actually I'd like

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Speaker 1: to do a p s A right at the tippity.

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Speaker 1: If you're listening to this on election day and you're like, oh,

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Speaker 1: I'm just kicking back listening to the Betel Cast and

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Speaker 1: you have not yet voted, turn us the funk off

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Speaker 1: or listen to us on the way. Sorry, I I

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Speaker 1: couched it a little. Get on your bird scooter, get

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Speaker 1: in your car, get on your public dancy, get on

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Speaker 1: your free can, burn it on your you know, whatever

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Speaker 1: mode of transit you want. Just get out there and vote.

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Speaker 1: Hope you did your research. Yeah, well, okay, so so

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Speaker 1: that that a side. Welcome to the Beck dol Cast.

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Speaker 1: If you're not listening to this on election day, sorry

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Speaker 1: for coming in so hot, but the message rings true.

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Speaker 1: You should always vote every next opportunity you have. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: where that do ag in? Hey quick plug. At the

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Speaker 1: top of the show, we're gonna be doing a live

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Speaker 1: becktel Cast show here in Los Angeles, so hopefully you'll

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Speaker 1: live here. But if not, just travel, get with the program.

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Speaker 1: No big deal, just just you know, by flight. Didn't

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Speaker 1: come on down. But we're doing a show on Saturday,

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Speaker 1: November tenth at nine pm at the Ruby. This time

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Speaker 1: we'll be covering the Fifth Element, one of My Thieves,

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Speaker 1: with our guest and dear friend, Danielle Radford. Hell yeah.

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Speaker 1: For tickets, go to our website becktel cast dot com,

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Speaker 1: click on the live appearances tab and we will see

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Speaker 1: you there. It's a small venue, so grab your tickets asap. Wow, yes, queen,

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Speaker 1: go off. Okay, So this is our podcast about the

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Speaker 1: portrayal of women in movies. Um. We use the Bechdel

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Speaker 1: test as are jumping off point for discussion. Of course,

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Speaker 1: a test invented by cartoonist Alison Bechdel that for our

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Speaker 1: purposes requires that a piece of media has a scene

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Speaker 1: in which two female identifying characters with names talk about

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Speaker 1: something other than a man for two or more lines

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Speaker 1: of dialogue. Shall we demo? Yeah? Demo? Hey, Hey Jamie,

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Speaker 1: Hey Caitlin. Did you vote today? Yes, bitch, of course

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Speaker 1: I did? Well, me too. Wow, We're great. I only

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Speaker 1: voted for women, and that passes the Bechdel test. Okay,

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Speaker 1: I was like, well, but what if something? But also

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Speaker 1: this still goes. Some female candidates might have some horrible ideas,

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Speaker 1: so it's good to do your research at advice as well.

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Speaker 1: Darn Tuton, what a productive Bagel pass test passing conversation.

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Speaker 1: So that's where. But but we obviously expand the conversation

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Speaker 1: to cover many different topics related to how women are

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Speaker 1: portrayed in the movie. Today, we've got a great movie

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Speaker 1: and a great guest. Yes, indeed, let's introduce her. She

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Speaker 1: is a producer, writer, actor, and host of the Kind

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Speaker 1: of Dating podcast Natasha Shandel. Hello, I was just listening

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Speaker 1: to you in THEE. I hope I said something half decent.

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Speaker 1: It was an uplifting one. Yeah, great, then I'd take

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Speaker 1: full credit for it. So we're talking about Election, the

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Speaker 1: movie from director Alexander Payne, adapted from a novel by

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Speaker 1: Tom Peroda. I used to have a doctor named Dr Payne. Oh,

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Speaker 1: and I had it, and and I had a dentist

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Speaker 1: named Dr Vagenie, which is hilarious, which is horrible. Why

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Speaker 1: did my dentist Why was my dadists last name of Vagina?

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Speaker 1: We don't know. If Dr Vagenice gives me a root canal,

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Speaker 1: it does that pass? Then these are the real questions.

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Speaker 1: So Natasha tell us about your your history, your relationship

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Speaker 1: with this movie. I watched it around when it first

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Speaker 1: came out. I really have a horrible memory, so I

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Speaker 1: won't be the person who ever remembers me watching something

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Speaker 1: in a movie theater. But unless it was Titanic, I

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Speaker 1: oh my god, Titanic. Yeah, that's remember watching in the theater.

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Speaker 1: Everything else after that just is gone. Usually threepisodes like

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Speaker 1: usually Jamie, let's do another and I yeah, let's scratch election.

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Speaker 1: This is a Titanic podcast. Now, Usually it's one of

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Speaker 1: us to bring up Titanic, and our guest is always like,

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Speaker 1: why are they talking about Titanic? Well, I was just

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Speaker 1: gonna say we could bring it back to an election,

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Speaker 1: because really, if they were to have voted off, who

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Speaker 1: should have got off that fucking vote? It would not

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Speaker 1: have been half of those people who actually got off.

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Speaker 1: Can you imagine, like what a better world it would

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Speaker 1: be of some of those rich motherfucker's had drowned? Hot takes? Yep,

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Speaker 1: but and some working class women survived. Yes? Great, but yes,

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Speaker 1: I so I watched I watched Election again around when

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Speaker 1: it first came out. I thought it was hilarious. I

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Speaker 1: thought Reese Witherspoon was a great antiher, like it's the

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Speaker 1: kind of characters I like a lot um and I'm

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Speaker 1: still not sure. When I watched it again, I'm like,

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Speaker 1: do I like her? Do I not like her? Likes?

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Speaker 1: And I love that about her just as an actor,

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Speaker 1: And honestly, like, who thought when that movie came out?

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Speaker 1: Was that twenty something years or less than twenty years later?

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Speaker 1: I feel like it's the exact thing happening or happened. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: the parallels between this movie and the Clinton Trump campaign

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Speaker 1: are There's a lot to unpack there because I think

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Speaker 1: I think that I mean, we can get to this

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Speaker 1: in a bit, but I think that Tracy Flick is

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Speaker 1: already partially inspired by Hillary Clinton in this movie because

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Speaker 1: this is at the end of the Clinton administration, the

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Speaker 1: public is always already well aware that Hillary Clinton has

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Speaker 1: ambitions beyond what was the quote of making cookies and

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Speaker 1: right Also, I have some Wikipedia trivia for us hit

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Speaker 1: that the novel that this movie is based upon. The

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Speaker 1: novel was inspired by two key events. The first one

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Speaker 1: was the nine two Bush v. Clinton election campaign, this

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Speaker 1: of course being Bill Clinton and not Hillary, but I

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Speaker 1: think that that's when that quote may have first come

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Speaker 1: out though, like that she was not going to be

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Speaker 1: your average first lady if he was elected UM. And

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Speaker 1: then in that campaign Ross Perrot entered as a third

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Speaker 1: party candidate UM, which is echoed in the movie by

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Speaker 1: Tammy Metzler. Showing up was Tammy Metzler, the literal Green

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Speaker 1: Party is she like fucking Nager. That's crazy, well, Gary Johnson,

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Speaker 1: but if you fast forward her now, she'd be Trump.

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Speaker 1: She I started that that. That's what I was a disrupter, right,

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Speaker 1: like the one who's like, don't she's not really care

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Speaker 1: about this. You do this, don't do that. I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: drain the swamp. I'm going to get rid of this

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Speaker 1: no more student body whatever. I was crazy, right, That's

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Speaker 1: what I think I was thinking along those lines. But

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Speaker 1: that totally makes sense that she, I guess in this

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Speaker 1: context would be third party like Green Party. Yeah, whoa,

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Speaker 1: This movie is crazy, so I really liked it. The

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Speaker 1: other thing that the novel was inspired by was a

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Speaker 1: incident at a high school in Wisconsin where a pregnant

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Speaker 1: teenager was elected homecoming queen, but the staff announced a

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Speaker 1: different winner and burned the ballots to cover it up.

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Speaker 1: Horrible that that's so crazy, would so not work in

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Speaker 1: today's social media world. Absolutely, but in pulled it off.

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Speaker 1: I mean, thankfully homecoming doesn't define our lives. Speak for yourself.

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Speaker 1: We just did carry so a lot of very true

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Speaker 1: once your history with election. I didn't see it until

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Speaker 1: I think I was in college, so it would have

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Speaker 1: been like the mid two thousand's, so not that long

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Speaker 1: after it came up, but certainly not right away. But

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Speaker 1: I remember really enjoying it. But it was one of

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Speaker 1: those movies that I liked but just was like, Okay,

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Speaker 1: I've checked that off my list, move on to the

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Speaker 1: next one on our list. Didn't ever go back and

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Speaker 1: re visit it, but I'm kind of bummed that I didn't,

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Speaker 1: because upon rewatching it to prep for this episode, I

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Speaker 1: was like, oh, this is like a really this is

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Speaker 1: a fun movie. The Tammy character, especially, I I'm like,

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Speaker 1: so here for and uh yeah, I really I enjoy

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Speaker 1: this movie quite a bit. I saw this movie yesterday

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Speaker 1: for the first time, which listeners of the show will

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Speaker 1: not be shocked to hear. I've never I've only seen

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Speaker 1: the movie Doubt, plus any Titanic and Titanic plus all

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Speaker 1: the movies we've done here. Mine is The Majornks, which

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Speaker 1: I didn't actually watch, which is so often brought up

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Speaker 1: in our iTunes reviews. If you're leaving us it tuned reviews,

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Speaker 1: I encourage you to mention that as a plus as

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Speaker 1: a meta textual thing. I saw this movie the first

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Speaker 1: time yesterday, and I really really like it, especially like

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Speaker 1: I mean, there's so many great performances in that but

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Speaker 1: this is the only movie that I've seen anyways of Also,

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Speaker 1: Matthew Broderick playing like a really despicable guy that you're

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Speaker 1: supposed to hate, but he plays it so like, I

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Speaker 1: don't know, I really enjoyed his performance, especially, and I

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Speaker 1: just want to talk about how Reeseaway's potent. I think

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Speaker 1: it's like she's so, she's so talented and she's so

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Speaker 1: interesting where I feel like she's played a care her

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Speaker 1: that has kind of the same description every time, but

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Speaker 1: she plays this character so many different ways over the

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Speaker 1: years that it's just like, yeah, like making fifty different

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Speaker 1: recipes out of the same basic ingredients, right with her.

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Speaker 1: So including a couple of movies that we've covered, which

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Speaker 1: is our most recent episode of Cruel Intentions, where she's

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Speaker 1: like in high school, she's like the virginal but she's smart, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: like very smart, ambitious young woman going to a private

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Speaker 1: school and then getting tricked into having sex with Ryan

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Speaker 1: Philippi and usually men are like threatened by her. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and then l Woods of course, on our Bonus Matron

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Speaker 1: episode doing Legally Blonde, kind of a variation on this character,

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Speaker 1: but so entirely different all the way up to Big

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Speaker 1: Little Lies, like that was sort of like a like

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Speaker 1: returning to form a little bit of like that's a

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Speaker 1: more mature version of the characters she got famous for playing.

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Speaker 1: She's so she's very interesting to me, yes, indeed, And

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Speaker 1: this movie is great. Yeah, Yeah, I mean, the one

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Speaker 1: thing that really stuck out to me were like there

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Speaker 1: were so many themes that they talked about through it

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Speaker 1: that you know, even like right off the top through

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Speaker 1: Matthew Broderick's like narration, the talk of destiny at first,

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Speaker 1: and then they and then they talked about like morals,

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Speaker 1: it's just like a big one, and and then just

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Speaker 1: you know how much just too ambitious. It was like

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Speaker 1: so many things that are so relevant. And the ending,

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Speaker 1: I think, I know that we haven't even done the

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Speaker 1: recap yet, but the ending of this movie. I watched

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Speaker 1: it four times because it's just like the movie is

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Speaker 1: firing on all cylinders, and like the last five minutes

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Speaker 1: where you know, the whole time you're experiencing the movie

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Speaker 1: through unreliable narrators. But it's like in the last couple

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Speaker 1: of minutes where Matthew Project's narration is still so cocky,

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Speaker 1: and then you see like it's so stark at the

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Speaker 1: end that I one, I wish I had the time

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Speaker 1: to go back and watch the whole thing over with

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Speaker 1: that in mind of like, oh, you can't trust a

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Speaker 1: fucking word that comes out of this guy's mouth from

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Speaker 1: the moment, but what you know, but like, I can't

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Speaker 1: wait to watch this movie again. It's okay, yeah, so

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Speaker 1: I'll do the recap um. We meet Tracy Flick played

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Speaker 1: by Reese Witherspoon. Of course, she is in high school.

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Speaker 1: She's an overachiever. She is running for student council president.

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Speaker 1: We meet Mr McAllister played by Matthew Broderick. He's a history,

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Speaker 1: everyday guy. He likes his wife, and he likes his job.

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Speaker 1: He's just a nice Keith. Well, it starts out like

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Speaker 1: it's Matthew Broderick. You like him, right, he's a teacher

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Speaker 1: this time, Yeah, you like that probably, but he seems

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Speaker 1: to be perturbed by Tracy Flick. And then in the

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Speaker 1: back story we learned that Tracy had a sexual relationship

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Speaker 1: with another teacher, Mr. Nevatney, who got fired and he

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Speaker 1: moves away, but he and Mr McAllister were best friends.

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Speaker 1: Locker room talk, you get. We got a whole scene

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Speaker 1: of locker room talking where we'll talk about this too.

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Speaker 1: But that I think the movies pay us so well,

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Speaker 1: and like, you start to hate Matthew Bradgick character in

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Speaker 1: such specific increments where you're given a little bit of like, well,

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Speaker 1: I didn't do anything wrong, but he was complicit as

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Speaker 1: something wrong happened, where he's always the moral high ground,

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Speaker 1: even in that conversation where his best friends like, I'm

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Speaker 1: having sex with a minor cool, right, and then Jim

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Speaker 1: the Matthew Bradgick character says like, well, that's not ethical.

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Speaker 1: Fucking ethics teacher. He's like, well that's not ethical and

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Speaker 1: that's bad and dada, but he doesn't really do anything

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Speaker 1: about it. He just kind of stands by as it happens.

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Speaker 1: He's just tell me all the details, please describe it

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Speaker 1: even further, and then I'll go watch my creepy VH

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Speaker 1: exactly and I'll just tell you that this isn't right,

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Speaker 1: but keep going and picture Everything's like, I don't want

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Speaker 1: to hear that, but secretly we're pretty sure he does. Um.

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Speaker 1: And this is one of the reasons this relationship between

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Speaker 1: this teacher and student is one of the reasons that

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Speaker 1: Jim McAllister does not like Tracy, and we'll go into

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Speaker 1: other reasons, but so Mr. McAllister doesn't want Tracy to

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Speaker 1: win the student council president, so he approaches Paul played

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Speaker 1: by Chris Klein. What an interesting jock care I love

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Speaker 1: I can't wait to talk about him. Such an interesting right.

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Speaker 1: So he's a he's a popular kid. He's you know,

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Speaker 1: star of the football team. He I kind of love

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Speaker 1: if he's dumb as rock, but he's sweet. He's always

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Speaker 1: a character too, right, Yeah, that's kind of thing. He's

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Speaker 1: so good at it. What's the other Anyways, I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: dig up some other Chris Clin dum dummy parts, American

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Speaker 1: pie Yeah, yeah, yeah, big one. So Mr McAllister gets

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Speaker 1: Paul to run an opposing campaign for president and helps

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Speaker 1: that Paul will be Tracy Flick. So Paul starts campaigning,

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Speaker 1: and then we meet Paul's sister Tammy, who is getting

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Speaker 1: broken up with by this girl Lisa, who then starts

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Speaker 1: to date Paul and then to retaliate. Tammy also starts

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Speaker 1: running for student council president as Donald Trump sort of,

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Speaker 1: where she promises she's like I don't care, I just

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Speaker 1: want to do it to bother people. And she's literally

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Speaker 1: like Kanye Maga hat like just trolling everyone because she's mad.

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Speaker 1: Yeah basically yeah yeah, because she's running on the platform

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Speaker 1: that student government is stupid and if she wins, she

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Speaker 1: will dismantle it. Just an anarchy platform. Yeah, he's giving

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Speaker 1: me chills. But the people love it. The people are like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: Tammy here, I love it way more than Paul's campaign

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Speaker 1: because he is a terrible public speaker. But that's because

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Speaker 1: so my name is Paul. Who was that equivalent? That's

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Speaker 1: the one I was trying to figure out. That's like

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Speaker 1: Ted Cruz or something like. The guys like, oh, I'm

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Speaker 1: supposed to that's way more like, you know, he was

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Speaker 1: sort of the nicest Bush. And then you're like, okay, right,

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Speaker 1: there's even almost at like please clap moment where no

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Speaker 1: one says that allowed, but his like speech ends, there

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Speaker 1: are crickets, and then Mr McCallister has to be like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: if only we had found out, like almost twenty years

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Speaker 1: later that police clap actually came from election and Jeff

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Speaker 1: Bush love that well. Fun fact. According to according to

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Speaker 1: director Alexander Payne, Election is Obama's favorite political movie. I'm sorry,

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Speaker 1: I'm stuck. I haven't thought about police clap in a

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Speaker 1: long time. Jeb Bush implored people to clap for him,

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Speaker 1: and that's clap facts with Caitlin. Okay, um, so people

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Speaker 1: are loving Tammy also more than trace He's campaign because

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Speaker 1: she's just very you know, bureaucratic. By the book, she's

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Speaker 1: too prepared. Yeah, So Tracy is very frustrated and she

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Speaker 1: rips down all of Paul's campaign posters and then Tammy

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Speaker 1: sees Tracy throwing them away in a dumpster. But Tammy

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Speaker 1: decides to confess to Tracy's crime because that kind of

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Speaker 1: helps her platform to have, like, yeah, I don't give

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Speaker 1: a fuck. Yeah. The parallel to that is Bernie Sanderson.

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Speaker 1: We're finding the whole just like I just got to

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Speaker 1: figure out how this is all parallel to everything that

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Speaker 1: fired up. So meanwhile, Mr McAllister is falling in love

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Speaker 1: with Mr Nivatny's ex wife Linda, or he thinks he is.

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Speaker 1: They have sex once, but things very quickly fall apart

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Speaker 1: after that whenever Linda tells Jim's wife Diane, and then

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Speaker 1: he gets kicked out of the house. Um. And then

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Speaker 1: the next day is election day at the school, the

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Speaker 1: students are casting their votes, the committee is making their

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Speaker 1: count and then the chairman of this committee a student

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Speaker 1: named Larry. Larry, Yeah right, he's like really advocating for

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Speaker 1: Tracy because truths why is all about the truth? Because

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Speaker 1: Tracy wins the election by one vote, and Mr McAllister

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Speaker 1: he comply cannot allow this to help. He goes full

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Speaker 1: Florida like Florida two thousand young Man, the hanging Chad,

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Speaker 1: the chest, the cha chas. He pulls two of those

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Speaker 1: chats off and he throws them away so that it

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Speaker 1: looks like Paul wins the election. Tracy is devastated, but

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Speaker 1: Larry feminist icon, he's suspicious, so you know, he apparently

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Speaker 1: goes to investigate. The two ballots that were thrown away

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Speaker 1: are discovered, and then Jim McAllister has to submit his

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Speaker 1: resignation from Carter Hi, which I have so many thoughts.

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Speaker 1: But how the exit system for male teachers work at

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Speaker 1: the school too? Oh yeah, we'll get into that. Also,

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Speaker 1: the side story about him getting it on with well,

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Speaker 1: he's lecturing Tracy, right, huh. He's he's trying to preach

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Speaker 1: morals and ethics. Meanwhile, friends, yeah, he's trying too. That's

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Speaker 1: so frustrating to It's just this movie is so so

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Speaker 1: that happens, and then we see something we never see

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Speaker 1: it in movies usually where it's like he loses his job,

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Speaker 1: he loses his wife, and then we kind of flash

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Speaker 1: forward for the end, right, because he starts his life over.

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Speaker 1: He moves to New York City, he gets a job

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Speaker 1: at like the Natural History Museum. He is still harboring

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Speaker 1: resentment for Tracy Flick and and he says he doesn't right,

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Speaker 1: he says he doesn't. He lives in a basement. But

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Speaker 1: he could not be more clear than that was triggering.

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Speaker 1: I was like, I used to live in New York.

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Speaker 1: I was like, I remember these times. Well. Um, so

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Speaker 1: he still hates Tracy. And it's even though he would

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Speaker 1: have you believe that his life is great, he actually

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Speaker 1: feels bad for her, right right, right, right right, Um,

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Speaker 1: But we'll talk all about that. But yeah, that's pretty

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Speaker 1: much the end of the film. So let's take a

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Speaker 1: quick break and then we'll come back to discuss woo

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Speaker 1: and we're back. So this story is basically a pathetic

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Speaker 1: man who ruins his life because he were since wimmen

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Speaker 1: and what it blames down to. Yeah, yeah, So we

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Speaker 1: see a female high school student who, unlike most high

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Speaker 1: school students in movies and certainly many that we've talked

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Speaker 1: about recently, Um, she has aspirations beyond wanting to get

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Speaker 1: a boyfriend or beyond wanting to go to prom. In fact,

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Speaker 1: we don't even know how she feels about prom because

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Speaker 1: she never mentions it. But we do know how she

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Speaker 1: feels about student council because the whole movie is about

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Speaker 1: her wanting to win. So if we're getting into the

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Speaker 1: Tracy discussion, there's there's so much about her that it's like,

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Speaker 1: I don't know, like unusual and like tricky to unpack

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Speaker 1: in the context of the story, or was for me

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Speaker 1: where I would argue almost every character in this movie

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Speaker 1: grows and changes very little, and like their situations change,

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Speaker 1: but they like I think almost part of the point

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Speaker 1: of the movie is no one really changes, where they

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Speaker 1: just kind of continue lying to themselves and others. And

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Speaker 1: that's politics, baby, Like I get it. But Tracy in

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Speaker 1: particular is is interesting because we're introduced with kind of

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Speaker 1: a common shorthand to characterize a female character, which is

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Speaker 1: you put her in a very fucked up, what seems

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Speaker 1: to be a statutory rape relationship that clearly does even

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Speaker 1: though it I think this movie avoids, certainly avoids making

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Speaker 1: it the center of her story, but it clearly affects

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Speaker 1: her a lot. And the way this movie plays that

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Speaker 1: storyline is very bizarre. I mean in terms of the metaphor,

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Speaker 1: I don't know if that's like a politician that has

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Speaker 1: a sex scandal or what that was supposed to symbolize.

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Speaker 1: But in terms of like in this story it is

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Speaker 1: an adult and a minor, I was a little confused

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Speaker 1: at why it didn't seem to affect Tracy Moore. If

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Speaker 1: the story is going to go out of its way

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Speaker 1: to be like, here's a statutory rape that happened, and

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Speaker 1: then it does seem like Tracy, to her credit but

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Speaker 1: also a little bit to my confusion, continue to do

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Speaker 1: everything in high school that she was going to do anyways,

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Speaker 1: almost unhindered by this relationship. I thought it was a

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Speaker 1: little weird. I don't know. Yeah, I had a hard

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Speaker 1: time kind of processing this component of the story is

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Speaker 1: well because she, as far as we can tell, as

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Speaker 1: far as the story presents it, she is a willing

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Speaker 1: and consenting participant of this relationship. That's that. And and

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Speaker 1: this is another place where the voiceover where you know

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Speaker 1: the voiceover is biased and not necessarily true. But I

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Speaker 1: think movies like Do This a lot where she literally

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Speaker 1: says I know what you're thinking, you know, and it's like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I know what I'm thinking. You're getting raped by your teacher,

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Speaker 1: And movies almost say like by acknowledging it, they get

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Speaker 1: a past. But it's like, no, that's still what's happening

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Speaker 1: in the movie. But she says, like, I know what

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Speaker 1: you're thinking. It basically says I was a fully consenting party.

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Speaker 1: Don't worry about it, did it? But like the breakup sucked.

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Speaker 1: But it's like she almost kind of it seems like

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Speaker 1: the relationship ends because her mother finds out about it,

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Speaker 1: and we don't see enough of the mother in this

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Speaker 1: movie either. It's very weird. Yeah, so the mother finds

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Speaker 1: out about it in a scene that happens off screen

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Speaker 1: because we only see the aftermath of it, which is

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Speaker 1: Dave Nevatney being very broken up over the relationship ending.

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Speaker 1: We don't play for laughs, Yeah you were in love,

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Speaker 1: Like that whole thing is played for I mean, he's

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Speaker 1: supposed to look pathetic and he's very clearly in context

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Speaker 1: of the story and the wrong but just was weird

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Speaker 1: that it fits the tone of the movie, but him

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Speaker 1: looking like pathetic and then being like, Okay, you gotta

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Speaker 1: work at a grocery store because when they bring it

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Speaker 1: back later. It's also played for laughs. I just didn't

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Speaker 1: like that this rape was continually played for laughs and

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Speaker 1: didn't impact the story really that right. And then the

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Speaker 1: way that Tracy responds to the relationship and the breakup

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Speaker 1: is that, oh, he had to go and get all mushy,

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Speaker 1: like I had to go with me, I miss our talks.

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Speaker 1: But otherwise, like what a loser kind of thing. So yeah,

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Speaker 1: I feel like that's not necessarily the most realistic way

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Speaker 1: in which that that type of relationship would play out,

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Speaker 1: especially as it pertains to how it would affect a

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Speaker 1: teen girl. Well, so I think the way that they think, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: my my issue was that they made it seem like

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Speaker 1: she based on her voiceover that that she was consenting

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Speaker 1: and she's like, oh, he didn't, you know, he didn't

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Speaker 1: do anything. And then clearly in the action you see

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Speaker 1: he convinced her, like, you know, by playing her emotions

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Speaker 1: and manipulating her. But then the scenes when they actually

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Speaker 1: start like progressing and are having sex, in the moment

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Speaker 1: when she's about to enter the room, she looks scared

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Speaker 1: and she looks like, oh my god, I have to

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Speaker 1: do this, okay, and he kind of has to pull

422
00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:41,760
Speaker 1: her into that and then later for her to come

423
00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:44,680
Speaker 1: back and be like, oh, well he caught feeling. It

424
00:25:44,840 --> 00:25:48,439
Speaker 1: was like I was like, I thought you were. That

425
00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:49,920
Speaker 1: was why I was like, I want to watch the

426
00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:54,000
Speaker 1: movie over knowing that all the voice over our lies,

427
00:25:54,520 --> 00:25:58,320
Speaker 1: because I guess now understanding that a little better, it's like, oh,

428
00:25:58,359 --> 00:26:02,320
Speaker 1: all that voiceover is not true necessarily because we see

429
00:26:02,359 --> 00:26:05,840
Speaker 1: her being coerced, and I think the movie understands that,

430
00:26:05,880 --> 00:26:08,200
Speaker 1: but it just like it just wasn't clear because it's

431
00:26:08,240 --> 00:26:10,399
Speaker 1: so early in the movie where and then even at

432
00:26:10,400 --> 00:26:12,920
Speaker 1: the end of her final scene though, when she sees

433
00:26:13,320 --> 00:26:17,800
Speaker 1: the teacher character again, she's like a young politician or

434
00:26:17,840 --> 00:26:20,480
Speaker 1: something and she's getting in a car with some senior

435
00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:24,760
Speaker 1: male politician and her look is almost like am I

436
00:26:24,840 --> 00:26:29,119
Speaker 1: fucking him? And you're just like, wait, are you what?

437
00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:31,320
Speaker 1: What is he? Because it's sort of like the teacher

438
00:26:31,359 --> 00:26:34,880
Speaker 1: insinuating it in a little bit with that, I thought, oh,

439
00:26:35,080 --> 00:26:38,800
Speaker 1: I didn't even thought of that. That's totally yeah, yeah,

440
00:26:38,840 --> 00:26:40,399
Speaker 1: I don't know. That's where I thought. I was like,

441
00:26:40,680 --> 00:26:42,879
Speaker 1: is he trying to say that she's like using somebody

442
00:26:42,880 --> 00:26:46,920
Speaker 1: again or you know, well, because it seems necess certainly,

443
00:26:46,960 --> 00:26:51,520
Speaker 1: how Jim McAllister perceives her, and I think how you

444
00:26:51,560 --> 00:26:55,080
Speaker 1: can definitely interpret this as that she will kind of

445
00:26:55,119 --> 00:26:57,639
Speaker 1: stop at nothing to get ahead, and if that means,

446
00:26:58,119 --> 00:27:00,440
Speaker 1: you know, sleeping her way to the top, I feel

447
00:27:00,480 --> 00:27:03,840
Speaker 1: like the movie is suggesting that that's a definite possibility

448
00:27:03,920 --> 00:27:07,040
Speaker 1: for her. Yeah that I mean that side of it.

449
00:27:07,119 --> 00:27:10,200
Speaker 1: I think that there It's not even like that needed

450
00:27:10,240 --> 00:27:12,199
Speaker 1: to be written out of the story entirely. It just

451
00:27:12,240 --> 00:27:15,080
Speaker 1: felt like that was one of the few subplots of

452
00:27:15,119 --> 00:27:18,679
Speaker 1: this movie that just like it wasn't handled responsibly or

453
00:27:18,720 --> 00:27:21,920
Speaker 1: satirically enough, or there was just something about it because

454
00:27:21,920 --> 00:27:25,679
Speaker 1: there's my kid, the teacher she was messing with, like

455
00:27:25,800 --> 00:27:29,040
Speaker 1: did he add something to her life? That I think

456
00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:32,399
Speaker 1: it's more for Jim than if that storyline affects Jim

457
00:27:32,480 --> 00:27:34,719
Speaker 1: more than it does her, because that opens up that

458
00:27:34,760 --> 00:27:39,119
Speaker 1: guy's ex wife and that's the president that, like Jim

459
00:27:39,160 --> 00:27:42,159
Speaker 1: is like this complicit kind of two faced God. It's

460
00:27:42,200 --> 00:27:45,800
Speaker 1: just weird that they used her as the catalyst for that,

461
00:27:45,920 --> 00:27:47,960
Speaker 1: like she's the bad one when she was the kid

462
00:27:48,280 --> 00:27:50,520
Speaker 1: getting or Jim resents I mean, and I think that

463
00:27:50,640 --> 00:27:53,879
Speaker 1: Jim secretly resents Tracy because now he doesn't work with

464
00:27:53,880 --> 00:27:57,080
Speaker 1: his friend anymore. That's to me, that's the main reason

465
00:27:57,280 --> 00:28:00,320
Speaker 1: narratively why this is in the story, because he needs

466
00:28:00,359 --> 00:28:02,920
Speaker 1: a reason. I mean, it's very clear that he does

467
00:28:02,960 --> 00:28:06,240
Speaker 1: not respect women, and he is very threatened and talks

468
00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:08,240
Speaker 1: his way around it for so long though he's like

469
00:28:08,280 --> 00:28:10,639
Speaker 1: he's like, I don't blame Tracy, and then spends the

470
00:28:10,680 --> 00:28:13,400
Speaker 1: rest of the people blaming her. Yeah. So to me,

471
00:28:14,080 --> 00:28:16,840
Speaker 1: the reason that this part of the story exists in

472
00:28:16,880 --> 00:28:20,439
Speaker 1: the movie is that he needs a compelling I guess

473
00:28:21,080 --> 00:28:26,080
Speaker 1: reason that he really actively represents her and yeah, has

474
00:28:26,119 --> 00:28:29,480
Speaker 1: to like it motivates him to retaliate. But I feel

475
00:28:29,480 --> 00:28:32,639
Speaker 1: like by making it a situation where she is the

476
00:28:32,720 --> 00:28:37,160
Speaker 1: victim of statutory rape is a weird choice and it's

477
00:28:37,200 --> 00:28:40,560
Speaker 1: I mean, like we see in many movies. It is

478
00:28:40,640 --> 00:28:43,920
Speaker 1: directed by a man, co written by two men, and

479
00:28:44,040 --> 00:28:47,240
Speaker 1: adapted from a novel written by a man. So right,

480
00:28:47,280 --> 00:28:50,360
Speaker 1: so we're three degrees of separation away from I mean,

481
00:28:50,440 --> 00:28:53,960
Speaker 1: we're a million degrees because no one was talking to uh,

482
00:28:54,400 --> 00:28:56,040
Speaker 1: not to get two stuck on this point, because there's

483
00:28:56,040 --> 00:28:57,840
Speaker 1: so much to talk about, but there was just the

484
00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:00,280
Speaker 1: way that relationship is were trayed. There was one scene

485
00:29:00,360 --> 00:29:03,880
Speaker 1: especially that like made my heart hurt a little bit

486
00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:06,480
Speaker 1: because I feel like there's like a lot of girls

487
00:29:06,480 --> 00:29:09,120
Speaker 1: who in high school, like, even if it's not the

488
00:29:09,200 --> 00:29:11,960
Speaker 1: extent of that experience, there's like a teacher who talks

489
00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:14,680
Speaker 1: to you some kind of way and goes out of

490
00:29:14,680 --> 00:29:16,640
Speaker 1: their way to make you feel special, and then you

491
00:29:16,680 --> 00:29:18,680
Speaker 1: look back on it and you're like, wait a second,

492
00:29:18,760 --> 00:29:23,840
Speaker 1: that was I literally had an art teacher who would

493
00:29:23,880 --> 00:29:26,120
Speaker 1: always be very complimentary of all the girls, and then

494
00:29:26,160 --> 00:29:28,600
Speaker 1: after school would be like, you should chug a bottle

495
00:29:28,640 --> 00:29:31,360
Speaker 1: of cough syrup and like come back tomorrow and tell

496
00:29:31,400 --> 00:29:35,560
Speaker 1: me what you did, Like just like that was that guy.

497
00:29:35,800 --> 00:29:40,240
Speaker 1: And you see, I mean people wonder why women, particularly

498
00:29:40,280 --> 00:29:44,120
Speaker 1: young women, have like this eternal fraud syndrome, and I

499
00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:46,640
Speaker 1: think this is like a very concise The way that

500
00:29:46,680 --> 00:29:49,400
Speaker 1: scene plays out, I thought was like effective to the

501
00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:52,400
Speaker 1: point of being a little painful to watch, where you know,

502
00:29:52,440 --> 00:29:55,760
Speaker 1: it's like here's this older man who Tracy clearly has

503
00:29:55,800 --> 00:29:57,680
Speaker 1: a lot of respect for and she's a crush on

504
00:29:57,760 --> 00:30:02,400
Speaker 1: him whatever, and he tells her she's smart, she's special,

505
00:30:02,800 --> 00:30:05,880
Speaker 1: she's attractive, and then it's just like this coercion thing.

506
00:30:06,280 --> 00:30:09,320
Speaker 1: It's basically the same speech that Jack gives Rose and

507
00:30:09,400 --> 00:30:13,240
Speaker 1: Titanic where he's like, you're the most outstandingly but wonderful.

508
00:30:13,320 --> 00:30:17,320
Speaker 1: It's not because he means then they're in love, but

509
00:30:17,400 --> 00:30:22,240
Speaker 1: there it hits the same piece because he's like, you're

510
00:30:22,280 --> 00:30:26,560
Speaker 1: the most wonderful, astounding girl woman I've ever known, and

511
00:30:26,600 --> 00:30:30,600
Speaker 1: then Dave Nevatny is like you're the most smart, sensitive,

512
00:30:30,760 --> 00:30:37,680
Speaker 1: attractive student person I've met. There it's just that is

513
00:30:37,760 --> 00:30:41,000
Speaker 1: so like if there's a one scene in a movie

514
00:30:41,040 --> 00:30:43,240
Speaker 1: I've seen in the past couple of years that concisely

515
00:30:43,280 --> 00:30:47,120
Speaker 1: puts like white we'll all actually smart talented women have

516
00:30:47,320 --> 00:30:50,360
Speaker 1: this kind of fraud syndrome. It's like maybe because men

517
00:30:50,480 --> 00:30:53,280
Speaker 1: say that just to fuck them, and then they feel

518
00:30:53,320 --> 00:30:55,440
Speaker 1: like it's not true because someone just said it. So

519
00:30:55,600 --> 00:30:58,280
Speaker 1: that I'll just add the tiniest point because again I

520
00:30:58,280 --> 00:30:59,600
Speaker 1: don't I don't want to see on this too long,

521
00:30:59,640 --> 00:31:05,040
Speaker 1: I'm sure, but when Jim Jim, when he talks about

522
00:31:05,360 --> 00:31:09,400
Speaker 1: like why he's upset, the first cut is to the

523
00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:12,280
Speaker 1: Dave guy saying like her pussy gets a wet or so,

524
00:31:13,000 --> 00:31:14,760
Speaker 1: and then you're like, oh, wait a minute, is he

525
00:31:14,840 --> 00:31:20,160
Speaker 1: talking about this kid? And then with this whole Kavanaugh thing, happening.

526
00:31:20,360 --> 00:31:23,680
Speaker 1: The headline has been you know, Trump says it's dangerous

527
00:31:23,760 --> 00:31:26,360
Speaker 1: to be a young man right now, and I was like,

528
00:31:27,040 --> 00:31:30,280
Speaker 1: is it dangerous to be a young man right now?

529
00:31:30,960 --> 00:31:34,400
Speaker 1: Like interesting, well, welcome to our life for all of time,

530
00:31:34,840 --> 00:31:38,040
Speaker 1: that it is dangerous to be a woman at all

531
00:31:38,200 --> 00:31:42,960
Speaker 1: times in all of history and eternity. One one more

532
00:31:43,000 --> 00:31:46,680
Speaker 1: point about this where there is such heavy and I

533
00:31:46,680 --> 00:31:48,880
Speaker 1: was annoyed about it until again the very end, Where'm like,

534
00:31:48,880 --> 00:31:51,920
Speaker 1: there's so much voice over in this movie, but voiceover

535
00:31:52,040 --> 00:31:56,040
Speaker 1: is used to introduce the characters as well. Another movie

536
00:31:56,080 --> 00:31:58,120
Speaker 1: where that where that happens that we did not too

537
00:31:58,120 --> 00:32:01,320
Speaker 1: long ago, as royal Ton and Bob's, And there was

538
00:32:01,680 --> 00:32:04,360
Speaker 1: a tendency in those movies where the male characters were

539
00:32:04,360 --> 00:32:08,040
Speaker 1: introducing voice over with their accomplishments and the women were

540
00:32:08,120 --> 00:32:13,640
Speaker 1: introduced with their sexual history. And this movie doesn't quite

541
00:32:14,160 --> 00:32:16,400
Speaker 1: do that. It's it was almost an inversion of it

542
00:32:16,480 --> 00:32:20,000
Speaker 1: where Tracy Flick is introduced with her accomplishments and she's

543
00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:24,000
Speaker 1: introducing herself, yes, and then there's a sudden flip where

544
00:32:24,000 --> 00:32:27,960
Speaker 1: it's like and here's the other stuff. I guess I

545
00:32:27,960 --> 00:32:29,800
Speaker 1: don't feel any which way about it, but it just

546
00:32:30,040 --> 00:32:34,400
Speaker 1: reminded me of at least at very least many facets

547
00:32:34,400 --> 00:32:36,280
Speaker 1: of her life were presented out and it wasn't like

548
00:32:36,520 --> 00:32:40,600
Speaker 1: here's the girl and here's who she fucked. Right. Yeah, yeah,

549
00:32:40,840 --> 00:32:44,160
Speaker 1: there's some of that, but it's not exclusively that. Right. Um.

550
00:32:44,200 --> 00:32:46,800
Speaker 1: I want to talk a little bit about how Jim

551
00:32:46,880 --> 00:32:51,760
Speaker 1: McAllister views women. It is very clear, especially as the

552
00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:57,000
Speaker 1: story goes on, that he feels extremely threatened by strong, smart,

553
00:32:57,040 --> 00:33:00,760
Speaker 1: ambitious women. He says in his poice over towards the

554
00:33:00,760 --> 00:33:03,280
Speaker 1: beginning that he does not blame Tracy for what happened

555
00:33:03,320 --> 00:33:05,960
Speaker 1: with Dave. How could I Dave was an adult over

556
00:33:06,000 --> 00:33:08,400
Speaker 1: twice her age. Sure, she got on my nerves once

557
00:33:08,440 --> 00:33:11,000
Speaker 1: in a while, but I admired I admired Tracy. I

558
00:33:11,040 --> 00:33:14,400
Speaker 1: really did. And as he's saying that, he's like throwing

559
00:33:14,400 --> 00:33:17,280
Speaker 1: away the signatures that she got to be able to

560
00:33:17,440 --> 00:33:20,560
Speaker 1: campaign for president, and it's obvious that he does not

561
00:33:20,720 --> 00:33:23,840
Speaker 1: admire her. That he does blame her and resent her

562
00:33:23,960 --> 00:33:28,480
Speaker 1: for the situation with Navatni being fired, but he places

563
00:33:28,520 --> 00:33:30,840
Speaker 1: none of the blame on him and he places all

564
00:33:30,840 --> 00:33:34,800
Speaker 1: of the blame on Tracy. Yeah, I mean, Jim, the

565
00:33:34,840 --> 00:33:39,920
Speaker 1: way I interpreted that character was like a demonstration of like,

566
00:33:40,120 --> 00:33:42,760
Speaker 1: here's the most average guy in the world who at

567
00:33:42,800 --> 00:33:46,360
Speaker 1: the beginning of the movie, you know, he's just he's average.

568
00:33:46,440 --> 00:33:50,760
Speaker 1: Is fuck, he seems relatively content ish, and then let's

569
00:33:50,800 --> 00:33:55,160
Speaker 1: peel back everything. Even in the most average of people,

570
00:33:56,000 --> 00:34:01,200
Speaker 1: is this deep seated hatred of certain people? Um, and

571
00:34:01,240 --> 00:34:03,800
Speaker 1: then they I mean it goes up to a fucking

572
00:34:04,080 --> 00:34:07,840
Speaker 1: eleven from there. But there was because he is so

573
00:34:08,880 --> 00:34:12,080
Speaker 1: average and he hates women, and he doesn't think he

574
00:34:12,120 --> 00:34:14,160
Speaker 1: hates women, and that I think there's a lot of

575
00:34:14,200 --> 00:34:17,680
Speaker 1: guys and Tracy points that out too right, and her

576
00:34:17,800 --> 00:34:20,560
Speaker 1: voiceover says that, I mean, I would hate my life

577
00:34:20,560 --> 00:34:23,680
Speaker 1: if I were him, and just like the monotony of

578
00:34:23,719 --> 00:34:26,399
Speaker 1: what he does all the time, and she and her

579
00:34:26,719 --> 00:34:31,920
Speaker 1: depiction was like on every student body, like any team,

580
00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:34,200
Speaker 1: and exactly she was like in the front of everything.

581
00:34:34,320 --> 00:34:37,600
Speaker 1: And and it's kind of hard to know, I guess,

582
00:34:37,640 --> 00:34:40,560
Speaker 1: because this was because it's so steeped in politics, like

583
00:34:40,600 --> 00:34:44,279
Speaker 1: the Monica Lewinsky scandal is a few years before this,

584
00:34:44,560 --> 00:34:47,239
Speaker 1: and so it's almost hard to know exactly how the

585
00:34:47,280 --> 00:34:51,279
Speaker 1: writers of this movie want these lines to come off,

586
00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:54,200
Speaker 1: which is interesting. I mean, I'd be interested in hearing

587
00:34:54,560 --> 00:34:57,799
Speaker 1: what Alexander Pain thought in verses now, because I think

588
00:34:57,800 --> 00:34:59,920
Speaker 1: the reading of this movie is very open to in

589
00:35:00,000 --> 00:35:02,640
Speaker 1: interpretation in a good way where you can kind of

590
00:35:02,640 --> 00:35:06,200
Speaker 1: see what you want in it. But they're really quick.

591
00:35:06,320 --> 00:35:09,600
Speaker 1: I want to go back to my buddy feminist icon

592
00:35:09,680 --> 00:35:14,200
Speaker 1: Roger Ebert, who almost always has the worst take and

593
00:35:14,280 --> 00:35:16,640
Speaker 1: the most stupid Like everyone was like he was the best,

594
00:35:16,719 --> 00:35:20,440
Speaker 1: but go back and read his stuff. He wasn't his.

595
00:35:20,440 --> 00:35:23,319
Speaker 1: His summary of the movie is so telling, where he

596
00:35:23,360 --> 00:35:25,040
Speaker 1: gave it a good review, but he says, here's a

597
00:35:25,040 --> 00:35:28,800
Speaker 1: movie that's not simply about an obnoxious student, but also

598
00:35:28,880 --> 00:35:33,000
Speaker 1: about an imperfect teacher, a difficult administration, and a student

599
00:35:33,040 --> 00:35:35,840
Speaker 1: body that's mostly just marking time until it can go

600
00:35:35,840 --> 00:35:40,480
Speaker 1: out into the world and occupy valuable space. That is his.

601
00:35:40,760 --> 00:35:43,680
Speaker 1: So all that to say, the reading of this movie

602
00:35:43,920 --> 00:35:47,440
Speaker 1: in the twenty years after it's probably changed a lot,

603
00:35:47,480 --> 00:35:50,200
Speaker 1: oh for sure. The next thing I want to say

604
00:35:50,239 --> 00:35:55,440
Speaker 1: about Jim McAllister and how he views women, specifically Tracy Flick,

605
00:35:55,840 --> 00:36:00,440
Speaker 1: is it not only does he resent her for you know,

606
00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:03,719
Speaker 1: his best friend getting fired, and not only does he

607
00:36:03,800 --> 00:36:08,480
Speaker 1: feel threatened by her ambitiousness, He has a bunch of

608
00:36:08,480 --> 00:36:12,160
Speaker 1: sexual fantasies about her. We has a lot of sexual

609
00:36:12,160 --> 00:36:15,880
Speaker 1: fantasies about a lot of people. Yes, every woman who

610
00:36:16,000 --> 00:36:19,000
Speaker 1: is not his wife, everyone next of the woman who

611
00:36:19,040 --> 00:36:22,200
Speaker 1: loves him, Well, is that anyone else besides Linda, because

612
00:36:22,200 --> 00:36:25,360
Speaker 1: I feel like Linda and Tracy, Linda Tracy, and then

613
00:36:25,480 --> 00:36:28,759
Speaker 1: he watches porn and but and it was also like

614
00:36:28,800 --> 00:36:32,200
Speaker 1: a teacher student porn, yes, or wasn't I thought it

615
00:36:32,239 --> 00:36:35,800
Speaker 1: was a football player and cheerleader, that they were both students,

616
00:36:35,880 --> 00:36:38,640
Speaker 1: and then he projects dave on Yeah, that's what I

617
00:36:38,640 --> 00:36:42,320
Speaker 1: thought it was. Yeah, it is mostly Tracy and Linda

618
00:36:42,360 --> 00:36:46,000
Speaker 1: who he takes stuff out on. But even based on

619
00:36:46,120 --> 00:36:49,160
Speaker 1: there's like a few shots and I kind of want

620
00:36:49,160 --> 00:36:52,080
Speaker 1: to compare this shot later on to a shot we

621
00:36:52,120 --> 00:36:55,600
Speaker 1: see of Tammy versus a shot of Jim, because those

622
00:36:55,680 --> 00:36:58,680
Speaker 1: characters balance each other out in this very bizarre way.

623
00:36:58,719 --> 00:37:03,040
Speaker 1: But there's a few shots where we see Jim's direct viewpoint,

624
00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:06,680
Speaker 1: so you know, some some male gazy shit. Some of

625
00:37:06,719 --> 00:37:09,160
Speaker 1: it's more obvious where that time, you know, like you

626
00:37:09,200 --> 00:37:12,520
Speaker 1: see that shot of like Linda's boobs. Oh yeah, he's

627
00:37:12,520 --> 00:37:16,520
Speaker 1: like hanging a fruit. She's framed sexually. His wife is

628
00:37:16,560 --> 00:37:20,360
Speaker 1: not framed sexually. Even during sex scenes, she's not framed sexually.

629
00:37:20,600 --> 00:37:23,839
Speaker 1: And then any time Jim's voice over is going and

630
00:37:23,880 --> 00:37:28,520
Speaker 1: we get those really unflattering shots of Tracy um So

631
00:37:28,719 --> 00:37:32,320
Speaker 1: the like the visual even the visual language is telling

632
00:37:32,320 --> 00:37:35,520
Speaker 1: you how Jim feels about the women around him. Yeah,

633
00:37:35,719 --> 00:37:38,200
Speaker 1: and then he's the type of person that after that

634
00:37:38,280 --> 00:37:41,080
Speaker 1: day that he spends with Linda, you know, he takes

635
00:37:41,080 --> 00:37:42,920
Speaker 1: her to the mall to go shopping, and he's like

636
00:37:42,960 --> 00:37:46,080
Speaker 1: helping her out around her house. He's like driving her back,

637
00:37:46,120 --> 00:37:48,160
Speaker 1: and then they see like a motel on the side

638
00:37:48,200 --> 00:37:50,600
Speaker 1: of the road and he's like, should we get a room?

639
00:37:50,840 --> 00:37:54,400
Speaker 1: And she's like, that's not funny. So he's like making

640
00:37:54,560 --> 00:37:58,160
Speaker 1: a sexual advance. She rejects it. And then when he's

641
00:37:58,200 --> 00:38:00,919
Speaker 1: back home and talking to his wife, she's like, oh,

642
00:38:00,920 --> 00:38:03,480
Speaker 1: how is your day? His wife? His wife, she's like,

643
00:38:03,520 --> 00:38:06,600
Speaker 1: how's your day? And he's like, oh, you know, Linda's great,

644
00:38:06,640 --> 00:38:09,319
Speaker 1: but she can be a little much sometimes. So he's

645
00:38:09,320 --> 00:38:12,600
Speaker 1: the type of when his advances are like rebuffed and

646
00:38:12,640 --> 00:38:16,680
Speaker 1: rejected by a woman, he starts talking shit. Yeah, oh yeah.

647
00:38:17,360 --> 00:38:21,759
Speaker 1: So he's a feminist title. There's I mean I think

648
00:38:21,760 --> 00:38:26,000
Speaker 1: that there's this is the same year American Beauty comes out.

649
00:38:26,120 --> 00:38:28,120
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure that also came out in ninety nine.

650
00:38:28,320 --> 00:38:31,960
Speaker 1: There are a few I like this movie a million

651
00:38:32,000 --> 00:38:34,080
Speaker 1: times more than I like American Beauty. I can't stand

652
00:38:34,120 --> 00:38:37,680
Speaker 1: up moving, but there are a few like recognizable qualities

653
00:38:37,719 --> 00:38:40,839
Speaker 1: in him. And then Kevin Spacey's character in that movie

654
00:38:40,920 --> 00:38:44,800
Speaker 1: where the small like micro punishments of the women around

655
00:38:44,920 --> 00:38:49,879
Speaker 1: them when he feels reduced or rejected or just in

656
00:38:50,200 --> 00:38:53,000
Speaker 1: that that line about Linda is so great because I'm like, oh,

657
00:38:53,080 --> 00:38:56,480
Speaker 1: I can picture almost any guy I know saying something

658
00:38:57,160 --> 00:39:00,400
Speaker 1: about someone else that way and not even having a

659
00:39:00,440 --> 00:39:04,360
Speaker 1: barely registered without getting personal. But my one, my exes,

660
00:39:04,520 --> 00:39:07,040
Speaker 1: who I've often talked about on my podcast Crazy One,

661
00:39:07,160 --> 00:39:09,360
Speaker 1: we'll just go with that. Um, he when he was

662
00:39:09,440 --> 00:39:12,719
Speaker 1: cheating on me, he would talk about the girl he

663
00:39:12,760 --> 00:39:15,560
Speaker 1: was cheating on me with, but he would keep saying

664
00:39:15,800 --> 00:39:19,040
Speaker 1: like shitty things about her and like always being like

665
00:39:19,120 --> 00:39:25,360
Speaker 1: she was she was. And then I didn't even know

666
00:39:25,400 --> 00:39:27,279
Speaker 1: that they were friends. And then when I found out,

667
00:39:27,280 --> 00:39:30,279
Speaker 1: I was like huh, And I was like, wait, so

668
00:39:30,320 --> 00:39:33,839
Speaker 1: all this time I had a grand do that? Fuck man? Well,

669
00:39:33,840 --> 00:39:35,680
Speaker 1: now you know I was trying to throw you off

670
00:39:35,680 --> 00:39:40,480
Speaker 1: the scent. Sometimes another fun thing happens where later on,

671
00:39:40,560 --> 00:39:44,160
Speaker 1: when Jim McAllister ruins his own life by cheating on

672
00:39:44,239 --> 00:39:48,120
Speaker 1: his his wife, he calls Linda and blames her for

673
00:39:48,280 --> 00:39:50,839
Speaker 1: ruining his life. So he is the type of person

674
00:39:50,880 --> 00:39:55,200
Speaker 1: who's not willing to accept any blame or to take

675
00:39:55,239 --> 00:39:58,680
Speaker 1: accountability for anything that he's done. He's always looking for

676
00:39:58,719 --> 00:40:02,600
Speaker 1: other people to us to blame onto, or he's resenting

677
00:40:02,680 --> 00:40:06,080
Speaker 1: everyone else for things that he is complicit in, or

678
00:40:06,160 --> 00:40:09,000
Speaker 1: that other things have done, other people have done wrong.

679
00:40:09,200 --> 00:40:10,920
Speaker 1: I think almost at the top of that is like

680
00:40:11,040 --> 00:40:15,920
Speaker 1: any woman exerting power over him, he's going to retaliate

681
00:40:15,960 --> 00:40:18,920
Speaker 1: against because even I mean, part of the reason I

682
00:40:18,920 --> 00:40:23,200
Speaker 1: thought he didn't he wasn't even being affectionate towards his wife, uh,

683
00:40:23,440 --> 00:40:27,040
Speaker 1: even though you know she certainly didn't do anything wrong,

684
00:40:27,480 --> 00:40:30,600
Speaker 1: was because she really wanted a baby. And that like

685
00:40:30,640 --> 00:40:35,440
Speaker 1: almost like, first of all, that's lazy writing for his

686
00:40:35,480 --> 00:40:39,719
Speaker 1: wife kind of character, but also just like the fact

687
00:40:39,760 --> 00:40:43,000
Speaker 1: that he wasn't the primary focus of her desire I

688
00:40:43,040 --> 00:40:45,520
Speaker 1: think is a pretty clear reason why he'd want to

689
00:40:45,520 --> 00:40:48,800
Speaker 1: retaliate against her. He wants to be the center of everything,

690
00:40:49,200 --> 00:40:52,440
Speaker 1: and he's so threatened and this is like fucking pathetic.

691
00:40:52,480 --> 00:40:55,600
Speaker 1: He's so threatened by Tracy wanting to be student body

692
00:40:55,680 --> 00:41:00,239
Speaker 1: president that he brings an election where there's that line

693
00:41:00,239 --> 00:41:02,640
Speaker 1: where he's like the sight of Tracy at that moment

694
00:41:02,640 --> 00:41:04,799
Speaker 1: affected me in a way. I can't explain who knew

695
00:41:04,800 --> 00:41:06,960
Speaker 1: how high should climb in life? How many people would

696
00:41:07,000 --> 00:41:09,160
Speaker 1: have to suffer because of her? I had to stop

697
00:41:09,160 --> 00:41:13,120
Speaker 1: her now, Like he's so afraid of female power in

698
00:41:13,440 --> 00:41:17,920
Speaker 1: any way that he and it just gets so pathetic.

699
00:41:17,960 --> 00:41:19,560
Speaker 1: And I love when he gets stung by a bee

700
00:41:19,840 --> 00:41:22,040
Speaker 1: and just like the fact that like he's saying, like

701
00:41:22,080 --> 00:41:25,120
Speaker 1: how many people would she affect in her life? And

702
00:41:25,160 --> 00:41:28,560
Speaker 1: it's like, while you know, you stay quiet while your

703
00:41:28,560 --> 00:41:32,400
Speaker 1: best friend was sucking a minor and her life is ruined.

704
00:41:32,440 --> 00:41:34,400
Speaker 1: His life is ruined, The wife's life is ruined, Your

705
00:41:34,400 --> 00:41:38,840
Speaker 1: wife's life is ruined, your baby's life that he Paul's

706
00:41:38,880 --> 00:41:42,920
Speaker 1: life is ruined. Well, also his wife never gets pregnant, right,

707
00:41:43,920 --> 00:41:45,520
Speaker 1: not that we see in the story. I think that

708
00:41:45,520 --> 00:41:48,279
Speaker 1: that's another parent he's impotent. I think that that was

709
00:41:48,320 --> 00:41:50,759
Speaker 1: like what that message. They were having baby sex every

710
00:41:50,880 --> 00:41:53,239
Speaker 1: night and head they were trying for a year and

711
00:41:53,800 --> 00:41:58,120
Speaker 1: ye never conceived. He's an impotent man. Yeah. Hey, let's

712
00:41:58,160 --> 00:42:00,319
Speaker 1: take a quick break and then we'll be back for more.

713
00:42:05,560 --> 00:42:08,680
Speaker 1: And we're back. I just wanted to read some quick

714
00:42:08,960 --> 00:42:12,759
Speaker 1: stats about women in politics and then we can, you know,

715
00:42:12,880 --> 00:42:17,960
Speaker 1: talk about some more specific characters. Let's just use Congress

716
00:42:18,080 --> 00:42:22,120
Speaker 1: as an example microcosm of politics. If you will, well,

717
00:42:22,640 --> 00:42:26,000
Speaker 1: tell me more about this Congress in two thousand eighteen,

718
00:42:26,480 --> 00:42:29,520
Speaker 1: the year that we are currently living in, unless you

719
00:42:29,760 --> 00:42:35,239
Speaker 1: are listening to this podcast from you know, because this

720
00:42:35,360 --> 00:42:40,879
Speaker 1: podcast is gonna last and really hold up to Yeah,

721
00:42:40,920 --> 00:42:44,880
Speaker 1: this will be the last thing people here. Four. Yeah,

722
00:42:45,440 --> 00:42:47,680
Speaker 1: if you're listening to this podcast, you do have seven

723
00:42:47,760 --> 00:42:54,440
Speaker 1: days to look okay. So in two there are seven

724
00:42:54,560 --> 00:42:59,320
Speaker 1: women in Congress, making up only twenty of members of Congress.

725
00:42:59,400 --> 00:43:02,960
Speaker 1: Hot in nine, the year that this movie comes out,

726
00:43:03,520 --> 00:43:08,120
Speaker 1: there were only sixty three women in Congress. One hundred

727
00:43:08,239 --> 00:43:10,800
Speaker 1: years ago, guess how many were women were in Congress?

728
00:43:10,880 --> 00:43:14,560
Speaker 1: We couldn't vote, so that there was one, there was one.

729
00:43:15,160 --> 00:43:17,920
Speaker 1: There was not a Congress when we couldn't vote. How

730
00:43:17,960 --> 00:43:19,839
Speaker 1: did that happen? Who is that? I don't I don't,

731
00:43:19,880 --> 00:43:23,000
Speaker 1: I don't know. I need to do research. But Rutgers

732
00:43:23,080 --> 00:43:27,600
Speaker 1: dot E d you gave me some some hot info. Anyway. So,

733
00:43:29,880 --> 00:43:33,640
Speaker 1: m much like in movies, women are wildly underrepresented in

734
00:43:33,760 --> 00:43:37,840
Speaker 1: politics do wouldn't you know it? Except if you're listening

735
00:43:37,840 --> 00:43:40,120
Speaker 1: to this right now, a record number of women are

736
00:43:40,200 --> 00:43:46,360
Speaker 1: running for political positions this year mid terms today right now. Yeah. Also,

737
00:43:46,400 --> 00:43:50,200
Speaker 1: if you combine movies and politics to things that are

738
00:43:50,400 --> 00:43:54,520
Speaker 1: so good to women historically, the results are even worse.

739
00:43:54,680 --> 00:44:00,120
Speaker 1: A quick Google search of political movies will yield results

740
00:44:00,160 --> 00:44:03,719
Speaker 1: that show nearly every movie in that sort of sub

741
00:44:03,800 --> 00:44:08,920
Speaker 1: genre of political movies is about men, except for that

742
00:44:09,000 --> 00:44:12,080
Speaker 1: Sarah Palin movie Game Changer, and maybe a few others,

743
00:44:12,080 --> 00:44:14,160
Speaker 1: which for wild cards here and there is awesome in

744
00:44:14,280 --> 00:44:16,960
Speaker 1: rules I have seen to say, the one time wherever

745
00:44:17,040 --> 00:44:22,480
Speaker 1: like Sarah Palin fucking literally she's awesome. Her movie was

746
00:44:22,600 --> 00:44:26,000
Speaker 1: just about her. I loved her talk show about moose

747
00:44:26,160 --> 00:44:32,040
Speaker 1: or whatever it was literally what it was, it was

748
00:44:32,480 --> 00:44:34,840
Speaker 1: like Sarah Palin goes to the woods and French as

749
00:44:34,880 --> 00:44:37,719
Speaker 1: a moose. Remember where she could have been all heart

750
00:44:37,719 --> 00:44:40,920
Speaker 1: beat away from the presidency whatever. Um, I don't know.

751
00:44:40,960 --> 00:44:44,000
Speaker 1: That's almost one of those like ripple effects things where

752
00:44:44,040 --> 00:44:47,920
Speaker 1: if you're basing movies on real life events, would be

753
00:44:47,960 --> 00:44:51,759
Speaker 1: really hard to make movies about women, uh if, but

754
00:44:51,920 --> 00:44:56,760
Speaker 1: only if you're making movies about very high level politicians,

755
00:44:56,760 --> 00:45:01,200
Speaker 1: Like there's where where's the hidden figures of women working

756
00:45:01,280 --> 00:45:05,640
Speaker 1: in like women doing the actual work while Mr Guys

757
00:45:05,719 --> 00:45:10,239
Speaker 1: wearing his Mr suit and he's like that was me. Um.

758
00:45:10,280 --> 00:45:13,000
Speaker 1: So it's like one of those things where it's like, yeah,

759
00:45:13,000 --> 00:45:15,279
Speaker 1: it's hard to find. You have to really look for

760
00:45:15,280 --> 00:45:20,080
Speaker 1: those stories. But if there were more movies about women

761
00:45:20,120 --> 00:45:23,759
Speaker 1: in politics, little girls could have seen them and said, hey,

762
00:45:23,880 --> 00:45:27,279
Speaker 1: I see myself represented on screen. That's going to influence

763
00:45:27,360 --> 00:45:30,960
Speaker 1: my decision to go into politics. Because there was not

764
00:45:31,000 --> 00:45:37,080
Speaker 1: the representation, it perpetuates the cycle, right, And this this movie,

765
00:45:37,120 --> 00:45:39,840
Speaker 1: I mean, it's interesting because I mean, just based on

766
00:45:39,880 --> 00:45:43,200
Speaker 1: that Ebert review alone, I think that people's view of

767
00:45:43,440 --> 00:45:47,359
Speaker 1: Tracy tends to be all over the place, and I

768
00:45:47,400 --> 00:45:51,160
Speaker 1: was sort of having trouble placing how the movie feels

769
00:45:51,280 --> 00:45:54,799
Speaker 1: about her at times the same and I think that

770
00:45:54,800 --> 00:45:58,840
Speaker 1: that is intentional anyway, where I don't even think the

771
00:45:58,880 --> 00:46:02,399
Speaker 1: movie is totally okay with female power. And I think

772
00:46:02,400 --> 00:46:04,120
Speaker 1: that the movie wants you to feel like she's kind

773
00:46:04,120 --> 00:46:07,920
Speaker 1: of annoying and she's overly ambitious. I don't read that

774
00:46:08,040 --> 00:46:11,400
Speaker 1: character that way at all, but it seems like just

775
00:46:11,480 --> 00:46:15,799
Speaker 1: based on the time this movie came out and listeners,

776
00:46:15,840 --> 00:46:18,800
Speaker 1: if you have any opinions or more information, please let's know.

777
00:46:19,360 --> 00:46:21,800
Speaker 1: But it seems like this character, to an extent, I

778
00:46:21,840 --> 00:46:24,080
Speaker 1: mean down to the way she's styled, is supposed to

779
00:46:24,080 --> 00:46:29,080
Speaker 1: be a Hillary Clinton style character, where from so early

780
00:46:29,160 --> 00:46:31,400
Speaker 1: to her being in the public eye, whether you like

781
00:46:31,520 --> 00:46:33,719
Speaker 1: her or dislike her whatever, we're not even going to

782
00:46:33,800 --> 00:46:37,680
Speaker 1: get into that. But she was portrayed from moment one

783
00:46:37,760 --> 00:46:42,440
Speaker 1: as a power hungry woman who whose very existence was

784
00:46:42,480 --> 00:46:47,920
Speaker 1: emasculating her male counterpart, and like almost no matter what side,

785
00:46:48,320 --> 00:46:49,600
Speaker 1: didn't know, whether you were on the left or the

786
00:46:49,640 --> 00:46:52,319
Speaker 1: right or whatever, that was the general view was that

787
00:46:52,400 --> 00:46:55,040
Speaker 1: she was she wanted too much, she was trying to

788
00:46:55,080 --> 00:46:57,760
Speaker 1: be too powerful, and it seems like that is supposed

789
00:46:57,800 --> 00:47:00,920
Speaker 1: to be the exact same values that we see in Tracy,

790
00:47:01,040 --> 00:47:05,279
Speaker 1: even though with the benefit of time there's so much

791
00:47:05,320 --> 00:47:08,040
Speaker 1: more there. But it was I don't know, it just

792
00:47:08,040 --> 00:47:12,799
Speaker 1: seems like a weird, inconclusive commentary on something that I'm like,

793
00:47:12,920 --> 00:47:15,879
Speaker 1: I don't know how Alexander Paine feels about her, right,

794
00:47:15,920 --> 00:47:19,400
Speaker 1: I think he likes her but thinks she's annoying and

795
00:47:19,400 --> 00:47:23,360
Speaker 1: should go away right and then but there's some moments

796
00:47:23,440 --> 00:47:28,560
Speaker 1: where Tracy expresses different frustrations about, you know, working really

797
00:47:28,719 --> 00:47:33,200
Speaker 1: hard for something and saying stuff that really resonated with me,

798
00:47:33,360 --> 00:47:35,719
Speaker 1: where she says, uh, she's talking about her mom. She

799
00:47:35,719 --> 00:47:38,000
Speaker 1: says she likes to write letters to successful women like

800
00:47:38,040 --> 00:47:40,520
Speaker 1: Elizabeth Dole and Connie Chong and ask them how they

801
00:47:40,560 --> 00:47:42,879
Speaker 1: got to be where they are and what advice they

802
00:47:42,880 --> 00:47:45,600
Speaker 1: have for me, Tracy her daughter. Nine times out of ten,

803
00:47:45,680 --> 00:47:47,560
Speaker 1: they say, you have to hold on to your dreams

804
00:47:47,560 --> 00:47:50,680
Speaker 1: no matter what the pressures women face me, and you

805
00:47:50,719 --> 00:47:53,120
Speaker 1: have to work twice as hard and you can't let

806
00:47:53,160 --> 00:47:56,239
Speaker 1: anything or anyone stand in your way. So on one hand,

807
00:47:56,400 --> 00:47:59,319
Speaker 1: it's like, yeah, she seems like she's willing to kind

808
00:47:59,320 --> 00:48:01,439
Speaker 1: of like try to pull on some people to climb

809
00:48:01,520 --> 00:48:03,200
Speaker 1: her way to the top but up. And on the

810
00:48:03,200 --> 00:48:06,279
Speaker 1: other hand she's saying, yeah, like, as a woman she

811
00:48:06,360 --> 00:48:10,239
Speaker 1: has to work twice as hard, gets not nearly as

812
00:48:10,320 --> 00:48:13,640
Speaker 1: much of the recognition, and you know, it's always an

813
00:48:13,680 --> 00:48:16,880
Speaker 1: uphill battle for her. Well. I was also such a

814
00:48:16,960 --> 00:48:23,000
Speaker 1: mirror again of the election, where it was clearly out

815
00:48:23,040 --> 00:48:28,640
Speaker 1: of the two final candidates, the more experienced one who

816
00:48:28,680 --> 00:48:31,719
Speaker 1: had less of a personality but more you know what

817
00:48:31,800 --> 00:48:34,399
Speaker 1: I mean in terms of a magnanimous kind of thing.

818
00:48:34,600 --> 00:48:37,920
Speaker 1: Came off as a little bit yeah, you know that,

819
00:48:38,440 --> 00:48:41,680
Speaker 1: not as personable the way people perceived it. And then

820
00:48:41,719 --> 00:48:46,320
Speaker 1: the other person are less qualified. But this big person

821
00:48:46,360 --> 00:48:51,360
Speaker 1: who spoke in layman language and used you know, short

822
00:48:51,560 --> 00:48:55,640
Speaker 1: word words and descriptions for everything that related to a

823
00:48:55,680 --> 00:48:57,799
Speaker 1: lot of people, your name of George W. Bush a

824
00:48:57,800 --> 00:49:02,719
Speaker 1: few times where it was like he's simple, and that's like,

825
00:49:02,880 --> 00:49:05,879
Speaker 1: that's such a big part of elections nowadays, right, It's like,

826
00:49:06,800 --> 00:49:09,560
Speaker 1: is it about the quality of the candidate and their

827
00:49:09,600 --> 00:49:14,239
Speaker 1: policies and their experience or is it personality? Is this

828
00:49:14,520 --> 00:49:16,839
Speaker 1: who do you want to get a beer with? Like,

829
00:49:17,120 --> 00:49:20,200
Speaker 1: I don't want to get a beer with political candidates.

830
00:49:20,239 --> 00:49:24,000
Speaker 1: Please give me the best policies and then do your job.

831
00:49:24,080 --> 00:49:26,840
Speaker 1: Don't don't drink with me, don't come to the chachat

832
00:49:26,880 --> 00:49:32,000
Speaker 1: lounge with me, Senators go to work exactly um. And

833
00:49:32,040 --> 00:49:38,480
Speaker 1: then Tracy expresses this very sentiment and fairly long monologue

834
00:49:38,520 --> 00:49:42,719
Speaker 1: that I will paraphrase, but basically she's saying, you know,

835
00:49:42,840 --> 00:49:45,799
Speaker 1: you might think I'm upset that Paul Metzler decided to

836
00:49:45,880 --> 00:49:50,200
Speaker 1: run he doesn't have the qualifications that I do. Yet

837
00:49:50,200 --> 00:49:53,239
Speaker 1: it sucks that some people are just handed everything to

838
00:49:53,320 --> 00:49:56,200
Speaker 1: them and while other people like me, who have worked

839
00:49:56,320 --> 00:49:58,919
Speaker 1: very very hard for their entire lives, you know, trying

840
00:49:58,920 --> 00:50:00,719
Speaker 1: to get what they want. Blah. And she's like, it

841
00:50:00,800 --> 00:50:03,040
Speaker 1: doesn't bother me at all, And obviously it does, because

842
00:50:03,040 --> 00:50:05,880
Speaker 1: every every person who delivers any sort of voiceover narration

843
00:50:05,920 --> 00:50:10,880
Speaker 1: this movie is not unreliable to themselves and others. Uh.

844
00:50:10,880 --> 00:50:12,840
Speaker 1: And that I mean that. I'm sure that resonated with

845
00:50:12,880 --> 00:50:16,600
Speaker 1: all of us hearing that. And the reason, I guess

846
00:50:16,640 --> 00:50:19,000
Speaker 1: the reason I say it because it's weird, because stuff

847
00:50:19,040 --> 00:50:22,640
Speaker 1: like that is so clearly written, where you're like, whoever

848
00:50:22,719 --> 00:50:27,120
Speaker 1: is writing this story must you know, feel for tracing

849
00:50:27,239 --> 00:50:30,319
Speaker 1: and at least to some extent, understand her. But then

850
00:50:30,680 --> 00:50:33,680
Speaker 1: where that character is left, like you're saying a little

851
00:50:33,680 --> 00:50:36,000
Speaker 1: earlier in Natasha, it's like it's a little bit weird

852
00:50:36,160 --> 00:50:39,600
Speaker 1: where the last line I think we hear her speak

853
00:50:40,360 --> 00:50:43,080
Speaker 1: is like when she's at college and she's still the

854
00:50:43,160 --> 00:50:46,800
Speaker 1: implication at the end of like because she is intelligent

855
00:50:47,520 --> 00:50:52,360
Speaker 1: and has ambitions that she will be alone Forever was

856
00:50:52,400 --> 00:50:56,719
Speaker 1: a weird place to leave that character because that's one

857
00:50:56,719 --> 00:50:59,959
Speaker 1: of the few moments where you know, in the voice

858
00:51:00,040 --> 00:51:03,280
Speaker 1: sober she's like and it's totally fine, and that's the lie.

859
00:51:03,400 --> 00:51:06,719
Speaker 1: But you see reflective in the voiceover, and what happens,

860
00:51:07,520 --> 00:51:11,120
Speaker 1: that's what the movie thinks happens to her, is that

861
00:51:11,200 --> 00:51:13,200
Speaker 1: she doesn't really have friends in high school and people

862
00:51:13,239 --> 00:51:15,200
Speaker 1: point that out to work a few times, and it

863
00:51:15,760 --> 00:51:18,759
Speaker 1: clearly does affect her in small ways. And then we

864
00:51:18,840 --> 00:51:22,120
Speaker 1: see her flash forward to college and there's that voiceover line,

865
00:51:22,520 --> 00:51:24,680
Speaker 1: if you want to be great, you've got to be lonely,

866
00:51:24,840 --> 00:51:28,879
Speaker 1: and we see her alone and it's just like such

867
00:51:28,920 --> 00:51:31,360
Speaker 1: a weird It's like, then, how do you feel about

868
00:51:31,400 --> 00:51:35,480
Speaker 1: this woman movie? Because that is, you know, not necessarily true.

869
00:51:35,680 --> 00:51:38,399
Speaker 1: It's not I mean, it seems like it's like, this

870
00:51:38,480 --> 00:51:42,239
Speaker 1: is the truth for this kind of woman. And I mean,

871
00:51:42,760 --> 00:51:46,399
Speaker 1: my my guest would be that the writer, whoever, at

872
00:51:46,400 --> 00:51:50,640
Speaker 1: what point the like line of men that wrote this movie,

873
00:51:51,440 --> 00:51:53,879
Speaker 1: that must have been something that felt true to them

874
00:51:53,920 --> 00:51:57,879
Speaker 1: because it's presented like it's true. Well can I say so? Uh,

875
00:51:58,040 --> 00:52:00,360
Speaker 1: we've done two episodes of this in our pod cast

876
00:52:00,520 --> 00:52:03,520
Speaker 1: that we did one on the Science of Relationships and

877
00:52:03,600 --> 00:52:05,640
Speaker 1: another one with the author of a book called The

878
00:52:06,320 --> 00:52:11,399
Speaker 1: Love Gap of Why Smart Women Are Single? Yeah, okay, cool, Yeah,

879
00:52:11,520 --> 00:52:14,800
Speaker 1: And I think in that one she references the psychologists

880
00:52:14,920 --> 00:52:17,799
Speaker 1: from Signs of Relationships who is on our podcast, and

881
00:52:17,840 --> 00:52:21,400
Speaker 1: they talk about um their case studies that say, and

882
00:52:21,440 --> 00:52:24,320
Speaker 1: I'm going to funk up the ratio or the percentage,

883
00:52:24,320 --> 00:52:27,200
Speaker 1: but a large percentage if you ask guys what kind

884
00:52:27,200 --> 00:52:30,239
Speaker 1: of woman do you want of them say they want

885
00:52:30,239 --> 00:52:34,200
Speaker 1: a smart, independent, ambitious woman who like can think on

886
00:52:34,239 --> 00:52:36,920
Speaker 1: her own all that stuff. And I think it's like

887
00:52:37,080 --> 00:52:40,560
Speaker 1: less than fifty seven percent or something like that percent

888
00:52:40,600 --> 00:52:43,880
Speaker 1: of guys actually end up with a dependent woman and

889
00:52:43,920 --> 00:52:47,640
Speaker 1: they don't actually end up with the independent woman. And

890
00:52:47,719 --> 00:52:49,959
Speaker 1: so this is the whole book in case study around

891
00:52:50,000 --> 00:52:53,960
Speaker 1: the fact that like, theoretically you love the idea of this,

892
00:52:54,280 --> 00:52:57,279
Speaker 1: but when you're actually faced with this person, they make

893
00:52:57,360 --> 00:53:01,399
Speaker 1: you feel less then, which is like the a mechanistic character, right,

894
00:53:01,440 --> 00:53:05,120
Speaker 1: like he felt whenever he was around somebody like Tracy,

895
00:53:05,760 --> 00:53:09,200
Speaker 1: a reminder that he is living this monotonous life when

896
00:53:09,280 --> 00:53:13,120
Speaker 1: she chose to take steps to you know. Yeah, and

897
00:53:13,160 --> 00:53:15,920
Speaker 1: there's a line that he has in the very end

898
00:53:16,239 --> 00:53:20,560
Speaker 1: whenever he talks when he's seeing her in Washington, d C.

899
00:53:20,840 --> 00:53:23,719
Speaker 1: And he said something like, I feel sorry for her.

900
00:53:23,760 --> 00:53:26,000
Speaker 1: She's probably still waking up at five am every day

901
00:53:26,080 --> 00:53:29,520
Speaker 1: pursuing her stupid little dreams. And it's like and he's

902
00:53:29,560 --> 00:53:33,880
Speaker 1: like holding a fucking slurpee cup, no disrespect, but you know,

903
00:53:33,880 --> 00:53:36,799
Speaker 1: I love slurping nation. But he's out there, you know,

904
00:53:37,200 --> 00:53:41,080
Speaker 1: denigrating the visual of holding a slurpy cup. It's like

905
00:53:41,120 --> 00:53:44,160
Speaker 1: a forty five year old dude lying in a basement

906
00:53:44,160 --> 00:53:46,840
Speaker 1: in New York. But like, you know, he looks soap

907
00:53:47,400 --> 00:53:50,600
Speaker 1: and then he throws it, throws the slurpie at the lima.

908
00:53:50,920 --> 00:53:54,919
Speaker 1: He's like, I'm so mad. You mean me, I volunteer,

909
00:53:55,320 --> 00:53:59,400
Speaker 1: I'm a doze in. And he's got this like clinically

910
00:53:59,440 --> 00:54:03,799
Speaker 1: depressed new girlfriend, like she's recently out of her relationship,

911
00:54:03,880 --> 00:54:05,920
Speaker 1: and he in that shot. I don't know if you noticed.

912
00:54:06,200 --> 00:54:09,000
Speaker 1: She's talking about something and he stares at her tits

913
00:54:09,719 --> 00:54:13,200
Speaker 1: and so he just didn't even know. It's so like,

914
00:54:13,440 --> 00:54:17,400
Speaker 1: fuck this guy. But there's millions of him, yeah, and

915
00:54:17,440 --> 00:54:19,799
Speaker 1: we know some of them. Yeah. So as far as

916
00:54:19,880 --> 00:54:23,520
Speaker 1: Tracy goes, I liked her as a character quite a bit.

917
00:54:23,680 --> 00:54:26,239
Speaker 1: I identified with her because I feel like I was

918
00:54:26,640 --> 00:54:29,360
Speaker 1: not exactly like her in high school, but I was

919
00:54:29,440 --> 00:54:33,040
Speaker 1: like way too ambitious and taking things way too seriously,

920
00:54:33,480 --> 00:54:36,200
Speaker 1: and like my thing was like I want to graduate

921
00:54:36,239 --> 00:54:38,920
Speaker 1: in the top five percent of my class, and like

922
00:54:39,040 --> 00:54:42,040
Speaker 1: I was, you know, joining, I was doing mock trial.

923
00:54:42,200 --> 00:54:45,200
Speaker 1: I was, you know, playing the sports and doing all

924
00:54:45,200 --> 00:54:49,440
Speaker 1: the stuff. Pay for a VHS if you do. So,

925
00:54:49,640 --> 00:54:53,239
Speaker 1: I you know, related to her, And there were some

926
00:54:53,320 --> 00:54:55,279
Speaker 1: moments in high school where I also felt like a

927
00:54:55,360 --> 00:54:57,680
Speaker 1: loner because I was like, man, no one's taking their

928
00:54:57,719 --> 00:55:01,080
Speaker 1: studies as serious me, so I I can't let these

929
00:55:01,080 --> 00:55:04,320
Speaker 1: people slow me down. And like any case, this is

930
00:55:04,360 --> 00:55:08,000
Speaker 1: all to say that, um, I generally like the way

931
00:55:08,040 --> 00:55:11,200
Speaker 1: that she's written, and I find her to be, you know,

932
00:55:11,320 --> 00:55:15,560
Speaker 1: a fairly multidimensional, interesting character. We often don't see that,

933
00:55:16,000 --> 00:55:18,760
Speaker 1: especially in you know, kind of teen high school movies

934
00:55:19,000 --> 00:55:22,319
Speaker 1: like this. There's just a few blind spots exactly, Yeah,

935
00:55:22,440 --> 00:55:24,680
Speaker 1: for sure. One of the blind spots that I don't

936
00:55:24,680 --> 00:55:26,960
Speaker 1: know if it's a timing thing, but I feel like

937
00:55:27,000 --> 00:55:29,120
Speaker 1: we're kind of set up like Tracy's mom is going

938
00:55:29,160 --> 00:55:31,239
Speaker 1: to be an important character in this story, but then

939
00:55:31,280 --> 00:55:34,320
Speaker 1: she never really becomes that like she only actually speaks,

940
00:55:34,360 --> 00:55:37,560
Speaker 1: and I think like one scene, which is weird because

941
00:55:37,560 --> 00:55:40,960
Speaker 1: we she's introduced in voiceover, is like, my mom is awesome.

942
00:55:41,080 --> 00:55:44,000
Speaker 1: She raised me on her own, she contacts powerful women,

943
00:55:44,120 --> 00:55:46,440
Speaker 1: she's like supports me. It's a paralegal. You know, we

944
00:55:46,480 --> 00:55:48,239
Speaker 1: don't know what she does for a living. And then

945
00:55:48,280 --> 00:55:50,800
Speaker 1: the lazy writing of like I know what you're thinking.

946
00:55:51,080 --> 00:55:53,439
Speaker 1: I grew up without a dad, so I hate men,

947
00:55:53,560 --> 00:55:55,480
Speaker 1: And it's like, Okay, this is horrible writing. Why are

948
00:55:55,480 --> 00:55:59,640
Speaker 1: we doing this? But then the mom character there's blind

949
00:55:59,680 --> 00:56:03,640
Speaker 1: spots there too, because the mom gets so mad she

950
00:56:03,719 --> 00:56:07,280
Speaker 1: finds out that, you know, like her daughter's being taken

951
00:56:07,320 --> 00:56:10,720
Speaker 1: advantage of, to say the least, by her own teacher,

952
00:56:11,160 --> 00:56:15,239
Speaker 1: but then doesn't demand something beyond him being fired. Like

953
00:56:15,320 --> 00:56:19,680
Speaker 1: there's just a few weird like that were like a

954
00:56:19,880 --> 00:56:22,960
Speaker 1: mom that seems as on it as this mom is

955
00:56:23,000 --> 00:56:25,160
Speaker 1: presented to be. She would be trying to get this

956
00:56:25,239 --> 00:56:27,640
Speaker 1: dude and fucking jail. He would not be working at

957
00:56:27,680 --> 00:56:31,560
Speaker 1: a grocery. Maybe she did try to sue Jim. She

958
00:56:31,640 --> 00:56:34,759
Speaker 1: did at the end that they had like the newspaper

959
00:56:35,040 --> 00:56:37,120
Speaker 1: that said that she but not but not Dave, the

960
00:56:37,160 --> 00:56:41,879
Speaker 1: one who actually write assaulted home. Maybe it's a commentary

961
00:56:41,960 --> 00:56:45,040
Speaker 1: on how when women come forward about you know, abuse

962
00:56:45,080 --> 00:56:49,200
Speaker 1: and assaults, not there's no consequences, nothing happens, but it's

963
00:56:49,239 --> 00:56:51,040
Speaker 1: I don't think it is a credit. No, I don't

964
00:56:51,040 --> 00:56:53,799
Speaker 1: think it's active commentary on definitely, But yeah, it's weird.

965
00:56:53,840 --> 00:56:56,080
Speaker 1: I used to I when I first watched the movie.

966
00:56:56,440 --> 00:56:59,680
Speaker 1: I'll be honest, I didn't like Tracy when I was young.

967
00:57:00,040 --> 00:57:02,000
Speaker 1: I didn't know enough, and I was like, she's just

968
00:57:02,160 --> 00:57:05,360
Speaker 1: not nice, and I like the nice guy, and the

969
00:57:05,480 --> 00:57:08,080
Speaker 1: nice guy should have won, and I can't believe. And

970
00:57:08,080 --> 00:57:11,320
Speaker 1: then as I've grown older and become more obviously grown,

971
00:57:11,320 --> 00:57:14,920
Speaker 1: immatured to my own and I though I've always been ambitious,

972
00:57:14,960 --> 00:57:17,840
Speaker 1: I think the part of her that was very like

973
00:57:17,920 --> 00:57:21,040
Speaker 1: I would do anything to get their part never related

974
00:57:21,080 --> 00:57:23,440
Speaker 1: to me UM, and so I think I sort of

975
00:57:23,680 --> 00:57:26,480
Speaker 1: blacklisted her in that way. And this time when I

976
00:57:26,480 --> 00:57:31,400
Speaker 1: watched her, I really appreciated the passion she had and

977
00:57:31,400 --> 00:57:35,080
Speaker 1: and you know her actually not getting brought down by

978
00:57:35,080 --> 00:57:39,680
Speaker 1: the stupid teacher who did this horrible thing to her, um,

979
00:57:39,720 --> 00:57:43,200
Speaker 1: but to like not have lost all of her zeal

980
00:57:43,320 --> 00:57:47,080
Speaker 1: for it. Like I appreciated that part, UM and like

981
00:57:47,120 --> 00:57:49,000
Speaker 1: I mean at the end, even when she lost, for

982
00:57:49,040 --> 00:57:53,520
Speaker 1: a second, she was like, Okay, I accepted defeat. She

983
00:57:53,760 --> 00:57:59,840
Speaker 1: cries a lot, butrple pants suit the world wepped. It

984
00:57:59,480 --> 00:58:02,760
Speaker 1: was a tough morning for everyone, even though she did

985
00:58:02,880 --> 00:58:07,360
Speaker 1: she won the popular vote, but that damn electoral college.

986
00:58:08,440 --> 00:58:10,919
Speaker 1: That's an excellent point I would. I mean, for any

987
00:58:11,000 --> 00:58:14,240
Speaker 1: listener who hasn't seen this movie in a while, particularly

988
00:58:14,320 --> 00:58:17,200
Speaker 1: since the last election, probably go back and watch it

989
00:58:17,240 --> 00:58:19,400
Speaker 1: and see how your opinions of the characters have changed,

990
00:58:19,400 --> 00:58:21,200
Speaker 1: because if, especially if you saw it when it first

991
00:58:21,200 --> 00:58:27,520
Speaker 1: came out, chances are your brain has been scrambled upwards. Certainly. Yeah,

992
00:58:27,640 --> 00:58:31,439
Speaker 1: I want to talk about Tammy and the queerness that's

993
00:58:31,480 --> 00:58:36,040
Speaker 1: represented on the screen, because when we first are introduced

994
00:58:36,080 --> 00:58:41,800
Speaker 1: to Tammy Metzler, she and Lisa are kissing. Lisa's not

995
00:58:41,920 --> 00:58:46,480
Speaker 1: really into it, she leaves, and then we hear Tammy's

996
00:58:46,560 --> 00:58:48,720
Speaker 1: voice over, which is that it's not like I'm a

997
00:58:48,800 --> 00:58:51,880
Speaker 1: lesbian or anything. I'm attracted to the person. It's just

998
00:58:51,960 --> 00:58:54,440
Speaker 1: that all the people I've ever been attracted to happen

999
00:58:54,480 --> 00:58:57,640
Speaker 1: to be girls. She's yeah, she's struggling with company closet,

1000
00:58:58,160 --> 00:59:03,680
Speaker 1: figuring it out. Yeah, I really liked Tammy. I appreciated

1001
00:59:03,680 --> 00:59:10,080
Speaker 1: her whole like anarchy thing, where obviously that doesn't translate

1002
00:59:10,120 --> 00:59:13,880
Speaker 1: well into like current politics or like our actual situation,

1003
00:59:13,920 --> 00:59:18,080
Speaker 1: but as you know, as a high school student body,

1004
00:59:18,240 --> 00:59:21,520
Speaker 1: where what even is in my school at least, like

1005
00:59:21,720 --> 00:59:26,280
Speaker 1: the student body government got nothing accomplished, like didn't do anything.

1006
00:59:26,320 --> 00:59:28,560
Speaker 1: It was really just a title and in a popularity

1007
00:59:28,600 --> 00:59:31,280
Speaker 1: contest and that was it. So I kind of I

1008
00:59:31,320 --> 00:59:35,600
Speaker 1: like that she recognizes that. I like that she advocates

1009
00:59:35,640 --> 00:59:38,400
Speaker 1: for herself, she stands up for herself. She does call

1010
00:59:38,560 --> 00:59:42,800
Speaker 1: Tracy a kunt. That's Tammy's kind of a mixed baggie.

1011
00:59:44,960 --> 00:59:49,160
Speaker 1: There's I mean, it is so rare, I mean, especially

1012
00:59:49,200 --> 00:59:51,120
Speaker 1: in a movie at this time, to see any queer

1013
00:59:51,160 --> 00:59:54,320
Speaker 1: representation in a teen movie, as we kind of note

1014
00:59:54,480 --> 00:59:56,120
Speaker 1: based on I mean a lot of movies we've been

1015
00:59:56,120 --> 00:59:59,560
Speaker 1: doing recently, um our teen movies of this era, and

1016
01:00:00,120 --> 01:00:03,720
Speaker 1: very rarely see a fleshed out queer character who we

1017
01:00:03,760 --> 01:00:07,040
Speaker 1: know something about them other than they're queer. But a

1018
01:00:07,080 --> 01:00:09,520
Speaker 1: lot of I mean, it's there are some really good

1019
01:00:09,520 --> 01:00:11,880
Speaker 1: moments that she has, and then there's other stuff that

1020
01:00:11,880 --> 01:00:15,080
Speaker 1: it's like, really this is the I mean, this movie

1021
01:00:15,080 --> 01:00:18,680
Speaker 1: first of all, has no recognition of bisexuality. It's a

1022
01:00:18,800 --> 01:00:23,360
Speaker 1: very simplistic view of even I mean that line that

1023
01:00:23,400 --> 01:00:25,440
Speaker 1: you just said that, like I fall in love with

1024
01:00:25,480 --> 01:00:30,200
Speaker 1: the person, uh, could be interpreted to be kind of

1025
01:00:30,200 --> 01:00:33,960
Speaker 1: a forward thinking you know, that's a statement of like

1026
01:00:34,920 --> 01:00:39,880
Speaker 1: not recognizing the binary in that way. But the way

1027
01:00:39,920 --> 01:00:44,160
Speaker 1: we're supposed to read it is that she is uh,

1028
01:00:44,240 --> 01:00:46,520
Speaker 1: you know, strictly attracted to women and just doesn't want

1029
01:00:46,520 --> 01:00:49,480
Speaker 1: to admit it to herself or isn't right ready. The

1030
01:00:49,520 --> 01:00:54,320
Speaker 1: fact that she only enters the race for revenge against

1031
01:00:54,320 --> 01:00:59,320
Speaker 1: another woman who I don't totally understand the Lisa character

1032
01:00:59,440 --> 01:01:03,360
Speaker 1: was very confusing to me. Of like Wise, Lisa retaliating

1033
01:01:03,520 --> 01:01:06,920
Speaker 1: against Tammy so hard if we are supposed to believe

1034
01:01:06,960 --> 01:01:11,760
Speaker 1: that she is not queer in any way. But Lisa's

1035
01:01:11,800 --> 01:01:18,120
Speaker 1: motivations are not clear well defined or explained all, Like,

1036
01:01:18,200 --> 01:01:19,840
Speaker 1: I mean, the only thing you hear is Paul's like

1037
01:01:19,880 --> 01:01:24,720
Speaker 1: and then Lisa just came over and like it was like,

1038
01:01:25,000 --> 01:01:27,120
Speaker 1: I mean, the only way I pieced it together was

1039
01:01:27,160 --> 01:01:29,240
Speaker 1: she was using Tammy to get to her brother. But

1040
01:01:29,240 --> 01:01:32,280
Speaker 1: they should have just added some some line in that

1041
01:01:32,280 --> 01:01:34,200
Speaker 1: that like that's what she was doing and was like

1042
01:01:34,320 --> 01:01:36,720
Speaker 1: sort of experimenting with her and was like, I'm not

1043
01:01:36,760 --> 01:01:39,120
Speaker 1: really into this, really actually into but then she gets

1044
01:01:39,120 --> 01:01:42,800
Speaker 1: so into running Paul's campaign, and I'm like, maybe there's

1045
01:01:42,800 --> 01:01:45,880
Speaker 1: some political reference I'm not getting in this, like there

1046
01:01:45,960 --> 01:01:48,160
Speaker 1: was for every character that confused me, and like maybe

1047
01:01:48,200 --> 01:01:50,360
Speaker 1: this is a reference to a nineties politician that I

1048
01:01:50,480 --> 01:01:53,520
Speaker 1: just like, I'm not as aware of. But the fact

1049
01:01:53,560 --> 01:01:57,000
Speaker 1: that Tammy enters the race as kind of like a trumpy,

1050
01:01:57,080 --> 01:02:00,120
Speaker 1: rogue candidate that's like burn it all down because I

1051
01:02:00,160 --> 01:02:04,720
Speaker 1: want to get revenge against someone. And it was like, Okay,

1052
01:02:04,760 --> 01:02:07,640
Speaker 1: what else do we get Tammy? Like what else? And

1053
01:02:07,760 --> 01:02:14,000
Speaker 1: uh steins where she's stalking Lisa. She is stalking for love, hiding,

1054
01:02:14,080 --> 01:02:16,960
Speaker 1: hiding in trash cans, the whole fucking montage We've seen

1055
01:02:17,000 --> 01:02:20,200
Speaker 1: a million times. I was like, Okay, what else we

1056
01:02:20,360 --> 01:02:25,320
Speaker 1: get Tammy? And she yeah, he calls uh, I forget

1057
01:02:25,320 --> 01:02:28,240
Speaker 1: if it's a Tracy A bitch, Lisa A count Tracy

1058
01:02:28,280 --> 01:02:31,240
Speaker 1: ac count Lisa A bit that exchange is made U

1059
01:02:31,400 --> 01:02:34,480
Speaker 1: And then you're like, Okay, it's not like women aren't

1060
01:02:34,480 --> 01:02:37,080
Speaker 1: allowed to dislike other women. What else do we got?

1061
01:02:37,160 --> 01:02:40,960
Speaker 1: And the one scene with Tammy a character I do

1062
01:02:41,080 --> 01:02:46,040
Speaker 1: genuinely like and seeing like representation and her being there

1063
01:02:46,280 --> 01:02:49,360
Speaker 1: is powerful in itself, but the way the movie treats

1064
01:02:49,360 --> 01:02:53,040
Speaker 1: the character and the choices that she makes, I feel

1065
01:02:53,040 --> 01:02:56,720
Speaker 1: like villainizes her in a way that's not necessary. The

1066
01:02:56,800 --> 01:02:59,440
Speaker 1: one moment I really liked of hers that to me,

1067
01:02:59,480 --> 01:03:03,000
Speaker 1: I'm as stand and then like direct opposition to the

1068
01:03:03,040 --> 01:03:06,880
Speaker 1: way we see Jim all the time is that scene

1069
01:03:06,960 --> 01:03:10,000
Speaker 1: where I forget what motivates her leaving the house. I

1070
01:03:10,000 --> 01:03:12,240
Speaker 1: think it's when like Tammy finds out she has to

1071
01:03:12,240 --> 01:03:15,040
Speaker 1: go to Catholic school or something, she's going to have

1072
01:03:15,080 --> 01:03:18,000
Speaker 1: to drop out of the election, and she sees a

1073
01:03:18,000 --> 01:03:21,680
Speaker 1: soccer field full of girls and she's looking at them,

1074
01:03:21,760 --> 01:03:24,120
Speaker 1: and so it is a gazy shot that it's not

1075
01:03:24,240 --> 01:03:28,320
Speaker 1: an exploitative shot, right, There's like she's standing far away

1076
01:03:28,400 --> 01:03:30,400
Speaker 1: and she's looking, you know, and you can tell like

1077
01:03:30,440 --> 01:03:35,880
Speaker 1: she's interested and possibly attracted, but it's not creepy and

1078
01:03:35,920 --> 01:03:38,960
Speaker 1: it's and then you see anytime Jim looks at a woman,

1079
01:03:39,080 --> 01:03:42,840
Speaker 1: it's very creepy and cropped and whatever. And I was like,

1080
01:03:43,400 --> 01:03:46,560
Speaker 1: that was my favorite scene with Tammy where you saw

1081
01:03:46,720 --> 01:03:49,240
Speaker 1: like that felt like, I mean, I would be interested

1082
01:03:49,240 --> 01:03:51,400
Speaker 1: in what our listeners think, that felt like the closest

1083
01:03:51,400 --> 01:03:58,200
Speaker 1: thing to like positive progressive representation of just like a

1084
01:03:58,240 --> 01:04:04,080
Speaker 1: girl recognizing her own sexuality and you know, being semi

1085
01:04:04,200 --> 01:04:07,480
Speaker 1: okay with it. But I feel like that character is

1086
01:04:07,480 --> 01:04:10,760
Speaker 1: is weird in a lot of ways. Well, she's just

1087
01:04:10,920 --> 01:04:15,360
Speaker 1: as kind of it seems as unreliable of a narrator

1088
01:04:15,440 --> 01:04:18,640
Speaker 1: is everyone else where you know, she at the end,

1089
01:04:18,720 --> 01:04:21,720
Speaker 1: she goes to Catholic school and she meets another girl

1090
01:04:21,760 --> 01:04:25,840
Speaker 1: whose name I forget, but just a little alright, Jennifer

1091
01:04:26,520 --> 01:04:30,840
Speaker 1: Junith right where she's like, we're soulmates and we're never

1092
01:04:30,880 --> 01:04:32,479
Speaker 1: going to be a part, and we're you know, best

1093
01:04:32,520 --> 01:04:35,000
Speaker 1: friends and we love each other. And you can kind

1094
01:04:35,000 --> 01:04:37,840
Speaker 1: of imagine that that story will play out a very

1095
01:04:37,880 --> 01:04:41,000
Speaker 1: similar way as her relationship with Lisa, because she keeps

1096
01:04:41,800 --> 01:04:46,120
Speaker 1: seems like she's kind of chasing after girls who may

1097
01:04:46,120 --> 01:04:49,280
Speaker 1: be open to experimenting who or who may be questioning,

1098
01:04:49,360 --> 01:04:53,200
Speaker 1: but ultimately end up you know, identifying as had to

1099
01:04:53,320 --> 01:04:56,120
Speaker 1: row and that like lines her up with all the

1100
01:04:56,160 --> 01:04:59,760
Speaker 1: other characters who basically end where they started at the

1101
01:04:59,840 --> 01:05:02,320
Speaker 1: end the movie too, where it's like this could have

1102
01:05:02,320 --> 01:05:04,760
Speaker 1: been an opportunity for her to you know, learn and grow,

1103
01:05:04,880 --> 01:05:07,919
Speaker 1: but she simply does not. The only yeah, the only

1104
01:05:07,960 --> 01:05:11,160
Speaker 1: thing I felt with like the three candidates was the

1105
01:05:11,240 --> 01:05:16,000
Speaker 1: girl's all seem angsty and like the one Paul goes

1106
01:05:16,200 --> 01:05:18,800
Speaker 1: just so cool and laid back, and he's just like

1107
01:05:18,960 --> 01:05:22,360
Speaker 1: wants to be this cool dude and like, man, I

1108
01:05:22,440 --> 01:05:26,959
Speaker 1: just just became Homecoming King and everybody loves me. And

1109
01:05:27,800 --> 01:05:30,120
Speaker 1: you know, Lisa one will have to find somebody else.

1110
01:05:30,120 --> 01:05:33,120
Speaker 1: But I guess that's life. Like he's so cool and

1111
01:05:33,120 --> 01:05:35,640
Speaker 1: and like the girls are like she's like the the

1112
01:05:35,800 --> 01:05:38,600
Speaker 1: angsty lesbian trying to figure her life out, and I'm like,

1113
01:05:38,640 --> 01:05:42,520
Speaker 1: why is it? Like her whole thing is like anger?

1114
01:05:42,680 --> 01:05:45,360
Speaker 1: And but then he also turns to camera at the

1115
01:05:45,440 --> 01:05:47,280
Speaker 1: end and he's like maybe my life would have been different,

1116
01:05:47,360 --> 01:05:51,040
Speaker 1: He's like, or maybe i'd be did Why did they

1117
01:05:51,120 --> 01:05:55,760
Speaker 1: choose to because he's the only person that does that, right. Yeah,

1118
01:05:56,320 --> 01:05:59,640
Speaker 1: And I don't know if that line even like me, Yeah,

1119
01:05:59,680 --> 01:06:03,480
Speaker 1: the character there's something cognitive dissonance there. I don't know,

1120
01:06:03,720 --> 01:06:06,600
Speaker 1: there's a whole other movie in that line. Its like

1121
01:06:06,760 --> 01:06:12,840
Speaker 1: is he secretly very deep and like nihilistic and things there?

1122
01:06:13,560 --> 01:06:16,840
Speaker 1: I do. I totally see your point of Tammy is

1123
01:06:17,080 --> 01:06:20,840
Speaker 1: just as fucked up as anyone in the movie. I

1124
01:06:20,840 --> 01:06:24,160
Speaker 1: guess it's just the main person we have to compare

1125
01:06:24,200 --> 01:06:29,120
Speaker 1: her to is Tracy, who is not as conniving she is,

1126
01:06:29,160 --> 01:06:31,960
Speaker 1: I think, just as frustrated and angry. But I think

1127
01:06:32,000 --> 01:06:34,000
Speaker 1: it just gets back to the problem of like, well,

1128
01:06:34,040 --> 01:06:37,800
Speaker 1: because Tammy is the only queer character we see represented

1129
01:06:38,600 --> 01:06:42,720
Speaker 1: everything she does, it's almost hard to keep an individual

1130
01:06:43,200 --> 01:06:45,760
Speaker 1: because queer people are never represented, and so when you

1131
01:06:45,840 --> 01:06:48,520
Speaker 1: do see like the one queer character doing all these

1132
01:06:48,640 --> 01:06:54,760
Speaker 1: like this petty bullshit, you're like, man, yeah, yeah, that's dangerous.

1133
01:06:55,120 --> 01:06:57,160
Speaker 1: I guess I just like looking at it on the

1134
01:06:57,200 --> 01:07:02,720
Speaker 1: surface and not analyzing her after any deeper than that,

1135
01:07:02,920 --> 01:07:05,400
Speaker 1: like what we've just done, but just kind of very

1136
01:07:05,440 --> 01:07:08,800
Speaker 1: surface level, like her speech that she gives and then

1137
01:07:08,920 --> 01:07:11,360
Speaker 1: the scene where she's like praying and saying like, hey God,

1138
01:07:11,400 --> 01:07:13,000
Speaker 1: I know I don't believe in you, but I'm going

1139
01:07:13,000 --> 01:07:15,360
Speaker 1: to Catholic school soon, so like, I guess a bit

1140
01:07:15,400 --> 01:07:17,600
Speaker 1: of practice, and then you know, her speech is all

1141
01:07:17,640 --> 01:07:20,240
Speaker 1: like who cares, Like I don't even want to be

1142
01:07:20,320 --> 01:07:22,600
Speaker 1: running for this, you know, I'm just going to dismantle

1143
01:07:22,680 --> 01:07:26,840
Speaker 1: this institution, and like, don't vote. I don't care, and

1144
01:07:27,200 --> 01:07:31,120
Speaker 1: I was just like, she's cool, right, don't don't listen

1145
01:07:31,120 --> 01:07:35,040
Speaker 1: to Tanny. You should vote and you should care counts.

1146
01:07:35,640 --> 01:07:42,360
Speaker 1: Can we talk about Paul? Where to begin with Paul? Well,

1147
01:07:42,520 --> 01:07:48,680
Speaker 1: he can start by saying that he unlike many jock

1148
01:07:48,800 --> 01:07:52,360
Speaker 1: football player type characters that we see in teen movies,

1149
01:07:53,280 --> 01:07:59,000
Speaker 1: he is not this like gross misogynist, toxic masculinity poster child.

1150
01:07:59,120 --> 01:08:04,360
Speaker 1: It's a blank slate. He's he's sweet and he's sensitive,

1151
01:08:04,600 --> 01:08:08,440
Speaker 1: and he like loves his sister and he like is

1152
01:08:08,560 --> 01:08:12,320
Speaker 1: originally opposed to running against Tracy and her and he's like,

1153
01:08:12,400 --> 01:08:15,200
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna run against her. You know that's she's

1154
01:08:15,240 --> 01:08:17,680
Speaker 1: good at that and I'm not gonna, you know, interfere.

1155
01:08:17,920 --> 01:08:21,759
Speaker 1: And there's a few lines where he approaches his sister Tammy.

1156
01:08:22,160 --> 01:08:24,200
Speaker 1: He says, it's kind of weird that you're running against

1157
01:08:24,240 --> 01:08:25,880
Speaker 1: me and you haven't told me why you're doing it,

1158
01:08:25,920 --> 01:08:28,000
Speaker 1: But that's okay. I respect your privacy and I want

1159
01:08:28,000 --> 01:08:30,240
Speaker 1: you to know whoever wins you or me, there's no

1160
01:08:30,320 --> 01:08:34,000
Speaker 1: hard feelings. Were still brother and sister. Also, the weird addition,

1161
01:08:34,400 --> 01:08:36,479
Speaker 1: like that weird moment where he's like, well you are adopted.

1162
01:08:36,520 --> 01:08:39,200
Speaker 1: I was like, why is that there that It's like,

1163
01:08:39,280 --> 01:08:41,880
Speaker 1: I guess that's just another thing we know. Yeah, and

1164
01:08:41,920 --> 01:08:44,840
Speaker 1: then you know, when he's praying for her, he's asking

1165
01:08:44,880 --> 01:08:48,200
Speaker 1: God to make Tammy happier because she's so smart and

1166
01:08:48,240 --> 01:08:50,360
Speaker 1: sensitive and I love her so much. Like but then

1167
01:08:50,360 --> 01:08:52,640
Speaker 1: also he's clueless because he doesn't seem to realize that

1168
01:08:52,680 --> 01:08:55,880
Speaker 1: his sister is queer. There's like some moments where I

1169
01:08:55,880 --> 01:08:58,680
Speaker 1: was like, Paul, you missed that, and he's like, and

1170
01:08:58,720 --> 01:09:01,240
Speaker 1: I don't know how he send it up here. I mean,

1171
01:09:01,640 --> 01:09:04,600
Speaker 1: she got in a fight with Tanny and next to

1172
01:09:04,680 --> 01:09:07,880
Speaker 1: the next thing, I know, she's a I was like,

1173
01:09:07,960 --> 01:09:13,120
Speaker 1: Paul read the room. Yeah, So he's just clueless and stupid.

1174
01:09:13,120 --> 01:09:15,519
Speaker 1: And then also a line that he need delivers I

1175
01:09:15,560 --> 01:09:17,559
Speaker 1: think in voice over pretty early on in the movie,

1176
01:09:18,040 --> 01:09:20,640
Speaker 1: he says, you know, Mr McAllister changed my life, and

1177
01:09:20,960 --> 01:09:24,400
Speaker 1: whatever they say he did or didn't do, I believe

1178
01:09:24,439 --> 01:09:28,400
Speaker 1: he's a good man. So he almost just like sees

1179
01:09:28,720 --> 01:09:32,439
Speaker 1: the good in people to a fault because he's never

1180
01:09:32,800 --> 01:09:35,400
Speaker 1: like it's sort of like that, you know, there there's

1181
01:09:35,520 --> 01:09:38,200
Speaker 1: guys out there like this, who are you know, they

1182
01:09:38,240 --> 01:09:40,960
Speaker 1: have a good heart, they mean the best, they're generally

1183
01:09:41,000 --> 01:09:43,759
Speaker 1: respectful of women, but nothing bad has ever really happened

1184
01:09:43,800 --> 01:09:46,840
Speaker 1: to them, and so they're not going to assume that

1185
01:09:46,920 --> 01:09:50,680
Speaker 1: anyone would do anything against anyone's better interest because I

1186
01:09:50,840 --> 01:09:53,680
Speaker 1: just don't have that experience. I mean, the one thing

1187
01:09:53,680 --> 01:09:56,920
Speaker 1: that he did that was very poignant was at the

1188
01:09:57,120 --> 01:10:01,080
Speaker 1: end when they were voting, He's like, everybody says that

1189
01:10:01,120 --> 01:10:05,479
Speaker 1: you should vote for yourself, but I don't think that

1190
01:10:05,479 --> 01:10:08,320
Speaker 1: that's what I think. That's just he literally was the

1191
01:10:08,360 --> 01:10:13,799
Speaker 1: one who voted Tracy in. She won by Paul's vote. Oh,

1192
01:10:13,840 --> 01:10:16,280
Speaker 1: he's a good guy. And then he wants to have

1193
01:10:16,360 --> 01:10:20,200
Speaker 1: a fund a carnival that fundraises for muscular distrophe at

1194
01:10:20,240 --> 01:10:23,000
Speaker 1: the and that scene kind of broke my heart too,

1195
01:10:23,080 --> 01:10:26,320
Speaker 1: of like he does end up caring, like you know,

1196
01:10:26,360 --> 01:10:28,360
Speaker 1: and not supposed to be like a funny moment where Mr.

1197
01:10:28,439 --> 01:10:32,920
Speaker 1: Mcallaster's stooge ends up being motivated and does want to

1198
01:10:32,960 --> 01:10:36,080
Speaker 1: make a difference. But you're like, man, that like seems

1199
01:10:36,120 --> 01:10:39,080
Speaker 1: like pretty true to how you know, like when men

1200
01:10:39,240 --> 01:10:43,759
Speaker 1: usually only choose to support younger versions of themselves and

1201
01:10:44,000 --> 01:10:47,759
Speaker 1: bring them in and it just perpetuates this Oh god,

1202
01:10:47,880 --> 01:10:53,400
Speaker 1: that whole scene was like, oh Paul, baby, Paul won't

1203
01:10:53,479 --> 01:10:59,320
Speaker 1: drop the ball, and I loved that smogan. It's a

1204
01:10:59,320 --> 01:11:08,320
Speaker 1: little defend. Another one was Paul Metzler, you Betsler, precious,

1205
01:11:08,360 --> 01:11:11,040
Speaker 1: But oh one another this is just a quick thing

1206
01:11:11,040 --> 01:11:13,600
Speaker 1: and we hardly know anything about this character. But the

1207
01:11:14,479 --> 01:11:19,160
Speaker 1: student who was running for vice president Jerry Um. We

1208
01:11:19,200 --> 01:11:21,640
Speaker 1: see representation on screen of a person with a disability.

1209
01:11:21,800 --> 01:11:24,759
Speaker 1: I love Jerry and he's running on a freaking post

1210
01:11:24,920 --> 01:11:29,519
Speaker 1: and opposed. He cracks jokes, he's anyways, yeah, Jered basically

1211
01:11:29,560 --> 01:11:32,439
Speaker 1: gets a standing uh yeah yeah, because what he says

1212
01:11:32,800 --> 01:11:36,120
Speaker 1: like I can't stand, but I stand for you, and

1213
01:11:36,120 --> 01:11:39,519
Speaker 1: everyone's like, this are Jerry. Another character we see for

1214
01:11:39,560 --> 01:11:41,720
Speaker 1: like two seconds that was like, oh, there's a whole

1215
01:11:41,720 --> 01:11:45,599
Speaker 1: other thing in there. Uh Tammy's mom. There's that scene

1216
01:11:45,600 --> 01:11:50,640
Speaker 1: where the parents find out that she's been election tampering

1217
01:11:50,840 --> 01:11:55,080
Speaker 1: and she's been disrupting coming down the escalator with Mulanni

1218
01:11:55,160 --> 01:11:58,280
Speaker 1: and the whole ship. But there's a scene with the

1219
01:11:58,320 --> 01:12:01,240
Speaker 1: parents where it seems pretty point. The mom's sitting there

1220
01:12:01,280 --> 01:12:03,200
Speaker 1: like with a martini. I think she's supposed to be like,

1221
01:12:03,200 --> 01:12:07,519
Speaker 1: oh wine, mom who is exhausted with her blow hard husband. Um,

1222
01:12:07,560 --> 01:12:10,080
Speaker 1: and he's you know, yelling He's like, where where are

1223
01:12:10,160 --> 01:12:13,479
Speaker 1: you sucking? You're going to a new school, and Tammy's

1224
01:12:13,479 --> 01:12:18,040
Speaker 1: mom keeps almost saying something's cut off, and then eventually

1225
01:12:18,040 --> 01:12:22,639
Speaker 1: she finally does say something and is you know, not

1226
01:12:22,880 --> 01:12:25,800
Speaker 1: a dumb person at all. Is very well spoken and

1227
01:12:25,840 --> 01:12:28,680
Speaker 1: starts to say make a cogent point, and then the

1228
01:12:28,760 --> 01:12:30,960
Speaker 1: dad cuts her off again. You're just like interrupting, You're

1229
01:12:30,960 --> 01:12:34,720
Speaker 1: going to Sacred Heart or whatever the spot just like

1230
01:12:34,760 --> 01:12:38,439
Speaker 1: whoa oh. They say something like yeah, we're gonna straighten

1231
01:12:38,479 --> 01:12:40,760
Speaker 1: you out, and then she's like giggling because I don't

1232
01:12:40,760 --> 01:12:45,519
Speaker 1: know if it's because of like right like I'm pants

1233
01:12:45,560 --> 01:12:52,120
Speaker 1: sexually and it's like all right, Tammy, we okay. Does

1234
01:12:52,160 --> 01:12:55,719
Speaker 1: anyone have any other thoughts about the film? Whof there's

1235
01:12:55,720 --> 01:13:00,240
Speaker 1: a there's a lot just The last a Shotover really

1236
01:13:00,240 --> 01:13:03,200
Speaker 1: liked was the shot of the dick at the end.

1237
01:13:03,400 --> 01:13:07,760
Speaker 1: He's like, what happens when a man loses everything? It's

1238
01:13:07,760 --> 01:13:12,600
Speaker 1: like literally a straight up castration shot. Um oh, I

1239
01:13:12,600 --> 01:13:14,920
Speaker 1: guess The last thing I wanted to say in terms

1240
01:13:14,920 --> 01:13:20,200
Speaker 1: of just like you know, unwrapping a pretty clear commentary is, uh,

1241
01:13:20,280 --> 01:13:24,800
Speaker 1: the idea of second chances where Jim's character at the end.

1242
01:13:25,240 --> 01:13:26,559
Speaker 1: You know, it's like and then I moved to New

1243
01:13:26,640 --> 01:13:29,360
Speaker 1: York and I got dissed and it's not perfect. Clearly

1244
01:13:29,400 --> 01:13:32,280
Speaker 1: his life kind of sucks, but you know he's not

1245
01:13:32,479 --> 01:13:36,000
Speaker 1: really punished. He just has to start over. That is,

1246
01:13:36,040 --> 01:13:40,080
Speaker 1: I mean clear political allegory of like, hey, just I mean,

1247
01:13:40,160 --> 01:13:42,559
Speaker 1: I think applies to what a lot of guys are

1248
01:13:42,600 --> 01:13:46,599
Speaker 1: trying to do after their me too moment, to like

1249
01:13:46,800 --> 01:13:49,840
Speaker 1: I just gotta go somewhere else or wait a little

1250
01:13:50,000 --> 01:13:54,479
Speaker 1: while and then I can just keep on. Louis k

1251
01:13:54,760 --> 01:13:57,639
Speaker 1: keeps doing drop in sets at the Comedy Cellar. He's

1252
01:13:57,640 --> 01:14:00,760
Speaker 1: addicted to it. He won't stop. And yeah, so that

1253
01:14:00,760 --> 01:14:03,400
Speaker 1: that was like a moment that I think feels like

1254
01:14:03,520 --> 01:14:06,400
Speaker 1: especially timely right now to just like and I just

1255
01:14:06,439 --> 01:14:10,599
Speaker 1: went somewhere else and did the same ship forever. Awesome.

1256
01:14:12,080 --> 01:14:15,160
Speaker 1: So I do appreciate the one kid, the truth kid

1257
01:14:15,520 --> 01:14:20,439
Speaker 1: who looks spits on this Larry feminist Larry, and Larry

1258
01:14:20,520 --> 01:14:23,280
Speaker 1: wants women when on Jim is like still driving on

1259
01:14:23,360 --> 01:14:26,360
Speaker 1: the streets after all of this has happened. He's divorced,

1260
01:14:26,479 --> 01:14:29,360
Speaker 1: he lost everything. He's in the car and he sees

1261
01:14:29,840 --> 01:14:33,120
Speaker 1: Larry and they both just like lock eyes and He's

1262
01:14:33,160 --> 01:14:36,840
Speaker 1: like tries to give him a little smile. Larry's like,

1263
01:14:38,240 --> 01:14:42,040
Speaker 1: I'm like, yeah, much like what Rose does to Billy

1264
01:14:42,160 --> 01:14:46,800
Speaker 1: Zane in the end of Titanic Tooey, Yeah, where was

1265
01:14:46,800 --> 01:14:49,000
Speaker 1: Billy's and in this movie? Where was the Boba duke

1266
01:14:49,040 --> 01:14:52,839
Speaker 1: in this movie? Where in this movie? Yeah, there's a mistake.

1267
01:14:53,479 --> 01:14:56,599
Speaker 1: Not everyone's always available. But I hope that I love

1268
01:14:56,880 --> 01:14:59,160
Speaker 1: I love Alfre Billina to you know, to my dying day.

1269
01:14:59,240 --> 01:15:01,679
Speaker 1: I think Matthew it is so good in this movie.

1270
01:15:03,640 --> 01:15:06,920
Speaker 1: This movie was excellently cast. It's like a perfect inversion

1271
01:15:06,960 --> 01:15:09,400
Speaker 1: of who people perceived him to be. Oh, I would

1272
01:15:09,439 --> 01:15:12,160
Speaker 1: be remiss not to just remind everyone, as I do

1273
01:15:12,200 --> 01:15:16,120
Speaker 1: every time we mentioned Matthew Brodrick. Matthew Broderick did hit

1274
01:15:16,360 --> 01:15:18,439
Speaker 1: two women with his car once and killed them both.

1275
01:15:18,439 --> 01:15:20,719
Speaker 1: Oh my god, I didn't know that about him, guys,

1276
01:15:20,760 --> 01:15:23,000
Speaker 1: Matthew Brodercks. I mean, he didn't do it on purpose,

1277
01:15:23,640 --> 01:15:26,479
Speaker 1: but he was in a car with Jennifer Gray in

1278
01:15:26,640 --> 01:15:33,719
Speaker 1: Ireland and uh so, just yeah, enjoy Matthew brodjeckts never water.

1279
01:15:34,479 --> 01:15:37,559
Speaker 1: It's uh, you know videos Matthew Brodicks. So nothing happened.

1280
01:15:38,320 --> 01:15:41,160
Speaker 1: M just a fun fact about Matthew Broderick, he'd killed

1281
01:15:41,160 --> 01:15:45,480
Speaker 1: the lady. Well, that really sucks. Well to bring that note, Yeah,

1282
01:15:45,520 --> 01:15:48,960
Speaker 1: well a fun to to uplift our spirits again after

1283
01:15:49,040 --> 01:15:51,160
Speaker 1: hearing that, I just wanted to point out. I don't

1284
01:15:51,160 --> 01:15:54,200
Speaker 1: know if anyone else noticed, but um, whenever you first

1285
01:15:54,280 --> 01:15:57,880
Speaker 1: are introduced to Paul and he's like tumbling down a

1286
01:15:57,960 --> 01:16:03,000
Speaker 1: mountain as he's skiing, you see two different shots of

1287
01:16:03,040 --> 01:16:06,559
Speaker 1: what is obviously stock footage of a skier because they're

1288
01:16:06,720 --> 01:16:09,800
Speaker 1: wearing different coats. And then when it cuts to a

1289
01:16:09,840 --> 01:16:13,639
Speaker 1: close on Paul, he's wearing a different coat from both

1290
01:16:13,680 --> 01:16:17,800
Speaker 1: of the previous two shots. So it's so funny. I

1291
01:16:17,880 --> 01:16:23,000
Speaker 1: didn't see that. I love that. That's great continuity, and

1292
01:16:23,000 --> 01:16:25,160
Speaker 1: it's clear that they didn't try to do they didn't

1293
01:16:25,160 --> 01:16:27,080
Speaker 1: do anything to try because I easily just could have

1294
01:16:27,280 --> 01:16:31,080
Speaker 1: taken the one stock footage shot and then matched the

1295
01:16:31,120 --> 01:16:34,160
Speaker 1: coat with whatever that person was wearing. But it seemed

1296
01:16:34,200 --> 01:16:37,240
Speaker 1: like an almost deliberate joke for like it to be

1297
01:16:37,320 --> 01:16:40,200
Speaker 1: three different coats, because those shots are so long that

1298
01:16:40,520 --> 01:16:44,479
Speaker 1: you could have just used the one so anyway. And

1299
01:16:44,479 --> 01:16:48,439
Speaker 1: then finally, for anyone who's keeping track of the name

1300
01:16:48,479 --> 01:16:53,719
Speaker 1: anagrams of what Caitlin Durante anagrams too relevant to this movie.

1301
01:16:54,040 --> 01:16:59,360
Speaker 1: Caitlin Durante anagrams to run lit candidate if you misspell

1302
01:16:59,479 --> 01:17:03,240
Speaker 1: candidate and only spell it with one D. So for example,

1303
01:17:04,000 --> 01:17:06,320
Speaker 1: you know, if someone's like, hey, I don't know if

1304
01:17:06,360 --> 01:17:10,280
Speaker 1: I should run or not, I would say to you,

1305
01:17:10,840 --> 01:17:16,559
Speaker 1: run lit candidate, because you're lit and you're a potential candidate,

1306
01:17:16,560 --> 01:17:19,960
Speaker 1: you should. Right in my sub rating now, I'm rating

1307
01:17:19,960 --> 01:17:23,280
Speaker 1: things twice an episode. Uh and and that's a two

1308
01:17:23,320 --> 01:17:26,479
Speaker 1: for me, a two out of five. Wow, Jamie harsh

1309
01:17:26,600 --> 01:17:30,200
Speaker 1: as a stretch. No, listen, there's been there's been great ones,

1310
01:17:31,160 --> 01:17:34,439
Speaker 1: and I hold them to that gold standard. Okay, I understand, well,

1311
01:17:34,479 --> 01:17:37,880
Speaker 1: I think this is one of my better ones. So like,

1312
01:17:37,960 --> 01:17:41,320
Speaker 1: I guess we're there's we can you know, disagree from

1313
01:17:41,360 --> 01:17:44,400
Speaker 1: time to time. But um yeah, that's that's the one

1314
01:17:44,479 --> 01:17:46,599
Speaker 1: I got for this one. The last thing I wanted

1315
01:17:46,600 --> 01:17:49,880
Speaker 1: to mention to this movie's credit, this is one of

1316
01:17:49,920 --> 01:17:53,040
Speaker 1: the few because we didn't discuss Jim's wife, Diane really

1317
01:17:53,080 --> 01:17:56,320
Speaker 1: at all, because we're not given much other than her

1318
01:17:56,360 --> 01:17:59,240
Speaker 1: husband's a sucking asshole and she would like a baby

1319
01:17:59,280 --> 01:18:02,680
Speaker 1: and she uses a sex phrase clearly written by a

1320
01:18:02,720 --> 01:18:08,120
Speaker 1: man film what woman in her right? It wouldn't happen. Ever,

1321
01:18:08,280 --> 01:18:13,080
Speaker 1: I say that every day, what if? What if? Caleb

1322
01:18:13,160 --> 01:18:15,120
Speaker 1: was like, I'd like to come out in strong opposition.

1323
01:18:15,320 --> 01:18:18,479
Speaker 1: That's my only sex phrase. It's my campaign slogan really

1324
01:18:18,560 --> 01:18:23,920
Speaker 1: for when I when I a lit candidate, run filed

1325
01:18:24,000 --> 01:18:26,720
Speaker 1: me up. The one thing I wanted to say to

1326
01:18:26,760 --> 01:18:29,559
Speaker 1: that point, other than the fact that you just lost

1327
01:18:29,640 --> 01:18:33,920
Speaker 1: my vote, is that that this is one of the

1328
01:18:34,040 --> 01:18:38,839
Speaker 1: rare movies where, you know, Linda tells Diane your husband

1329
01:18:38,880 --> 01:18:43,000
Speaker 1: and I had sex, and Diane breaks up with her husband,

1330
01:18:43,200 --> 01:18:46,960
Speaker 1: doesn't seem to actively punish the other woman, which I

1331
01:18:47,000 --> 01:18:51,160
Speaker 1: think is usually well so I appreciated that. Yeah, we

1332
01:18:51,720 --> 01:18:56,080
Speaker 1: see them having presumably just interacted and probably not passing

1333
01:18:56,080 --> 01:18:59,240
Speaker 1: the Bectel test because it's probably talking about Jim. But

1334
01:19:00,080 --> 01:19:02,479
Speaker 1: it seems like they are consoling each other. They're you know,

1335
01:19:02,479 --> 01:19:06,080
Speaker 1: they're crying and comforting each other, and they are placing

1336
01:19:06,120 --> 01:19:10,320
Speaker 1: the blame rightfully on Jim, who I don't know if

1337
01:19:10,320 --> 01:19:12,960
Speaker 1: this happens right before right after when he has a

1338
01:19:13,000 --> 01:19:16,880
Speaker 1: conversation with Linda and is like, you ruined my life

1339
01:19:16,920 --> 01:19:20,519
Speaker 1: and she's like you, like you took advantage of me, like,

1340
01:19:20,680 --> 01:19:23,080
Speaker 1: and he's like, well, you took advantage of me, you

1341
01:19:23,200 --> 01:19:25,360
Speaker 1: kiss me, you hugged me, and like, I think that

1342
01:19:25,439 --> 01:19:28,000
Speaker 1: they should have acknowledged that they both had a partner.

1343
01:19:28,120 --> 01:19:30,240
Speaker 1: There was one thing I was like, Linda was an

1344
01:19:30,240 --> 01:19:33,120
Speaker 1: active participant in that. But I think that that also

1345
01:19:33,200 --> 01:19:35,840
Speaker 1: spoke to her not being a very well written character,

1346
01:19:36,000 --> 01:19:38,880
Speaker 1: because she pretty clearly rejects him and then all of

1347
01:19:38,960 --> 01:19:42,080
Speaker 1: a sudden seems not just on board to have sex

1348
01:19:42,080 --> 01:19:43,960
Speaker 1: with him, but on board to have sex with him

1349
01:19:44,000 --> 01:19:47,719
Speaker 1: in front of her baby, which is such a leap,

1350
01:19:47,800 --> 01:19:50,559
Speaker 1: and the character were introduced to that, it seems like

1351
01:19:50,600 --> 01:19:53,280
Speaker 1: that character was sold out at some point, right, But

1352
01:19:53,400 --> 01:19:57,439
Speaker 1: we're Linda Land. She should definitely own some of the blame.

1353
01:19:57,840 --> 01:19:59,360
Speaker 1: But she's right. I mean, I think she's right to

1354
01:19:59,400 --> 01:20:03,000
Speaker 1: not for like, obviously she didn't ruin Jim's life, but

1355
01:20:03,040 --> 01:20:05,880
Speaker 1: she was an active participant. She literally fund the guy

1356
01:20:05,920 --> 01:20:07,240
Speaker 1: in front of her baby. No, I should do that

1357
01:20:07,800 --> 01:20:11,800
Speaker 1: with with Linda. There's no catalyst for the audience to

1358
01:20:11,880 --> 01:20:15,200
Speaker 1: understand why she suddenly changes her mind about wanting to

1359
01:20:15,240 --> 01:20:18,360
Speaker 1: sleep with Jim. Why does she even invite him over

1360
01:20:18,520 --> 01:20:20,920
Speaker 1: after he hit on her? And right he would think

1361
01:20:21,000 --> 01:20:23,760
Speaker 1: that that would put an end to that friendship. Well

1362
01:20:23,800 --> 01:20:25,960
Speaker 1: she said that, She's like, I was just lonely and

1363
01:20:26,040 --> 01:20:28,240
Speaker 1: made a mistake and you know, and that's the thing

1364
01:20:28,280 --> 01:20:31,880
Speaker 1: again about this moral ethics, and it does happen. And

1365
01:20:32,200 --> 01:20:34,280
Speaker 1: that's the thing I liked about this, Like I like

1366
01:20:34,360 --> 01:20:37,479
Speaker 1: in general about this movie so much is I think

1367
01:20:37,479 --> 01:20:40,960
Speaker 1: the overarching message is also about like how so much

1368
01:20:41,200 --> 01:20:44,320
Speaker 1: everything is gray. There isn't so much of like black

1369
01:20:44,320 --> 01:20:46,280
Speaker 1: and white, and there is a lot of gray space.

1370
01:20:46,360 --> 01:20:52,080
Speaker 1: And it does come to moral ambiguity. Like with every

1371
01:20:52,160 --> 01:20:55,559
Speaker 1: character there's like they're all you could see the good

1372
01:20:55,600 --> 01:20:57,360
Speaker 1: side and then you're like, oh, we did this shitty

1373
01:20:57,400 --> 01:21:02,360
Speaker 1: thing and that literally everybody totally poor filming up, she

1374
01:21:02,439 --> 01:21:09,400
Speaker 1: did nothing. Hey does this movie pass the Bechtel test? Yes? Yes.

1375
01:21:10,080 --> 01:21:14,160
Speaker 1: Women do not interact nearly as much as I was expecting,

1376
01:21:14,200 --> 01:21:18,560
Speaker 1: considering there are a fair number of female identifying characters.

1377
01:21:19,400 --> 01:21:24,680
Speaker 1: I only clocked one scene where it passes, which is

1378
01:21:24,760 --> 01:21:29,799
Speaker 1: between Tammy and Lisa in the beginning. Whenever they are kissing,

1379
01:21:29,880 --> 01:21:32,559
Speaker 1: Lisa pulls away. She says, I told you, and she's

1380
01:21:32,600 --> 01:21:34,599
Speaker 1: like what She's like, it doesn't feel right anymore, and

1381
01:21:34,640 --> 01:21:37,320
Speaker 1: she's like Tammy's like, but I love you. And then

1382
01:21:37,360 --> 01:21:39,720
Speaker 1: a few seconds later, Lisa is getting into a car

1383
01:21:39,800 --> 01:21:42,360
Speaker 1: and starting to drive away and Tammy's like, where are

1384
01:21:42,360 --> 01:21:45,599
Speaker 1: you going? And she's like, I'm not like you. I'm

1385
01:21:45,640 --> 01:21:50,840
Speaker 1: not a insert homophobic slur here. Yeah, we're not in love.

1386
01:21:50,920 --> 01:21:54,679
Speaker 1: We were just experimenting. So nothing is called into question

1387
01:21:54,760 --> 01:21:57,080
Speaker 1: here in terms of hey, is this is a man

1388
01:21:57,240 --> 01:22:01,120
Speaker 1: mentioned here? Like this is about women kissing each other

1389
01:22:01,720 --> 01:22:05,200
Speaker 1: an interesting past? Did you not have Tracy and her

1390
01:22:05,240 --> 01:22:09,080
Speaker 1: mom passing at least once in that scene? No, because

1391
01:22:09,200 --> 01:22:13,920
Speaker 1: unless I am just misremembering something. But the only scene

1392
01:22:14,000 --> 01:22:17,920
Speaker 1: I noticed where Tracy and her mom interact on screen

1393
01:22:18,120 --> 01:22:22,600
Speaker 1: is after Tracy finds out she loses the election and

1394
01:22:22,680 --> 01:22:24,639
Speaker 1: she's crying, and then her mom comes in and she's

1395
01:22:24,640 --> 01:22:28,200
Speaker 1: when she's stuff to her right. She's like, uh, there there,

1396
01:22:28,720 --> 01:22:31,320
Speaker 1: lie down, take my pill, you know, and then she's like,

1397
01:22:31,320 --> 01:22:33,320
Speaker 1: maybe you needed more posters or you should have taken

1398
01:22:33,320 --> 01:22:37,160
Speaker 1: my suggestions about your speech, But Tracy never verbally responds

1399
01:22:37,640 --> 01:22:41,280
Speaker 1: she's crying. Yeah, I wish that mom. I don't understand

1400
01:22:41,320 --> 01:22:43,519
Speaker 1: why that mom character wasn't more present, And that was

1401
01:22:43,560 --> 01:22:45,519
Speaker 1: like a weird thing for me. So yes, this movie

1402
01:22:45,560 --> 01:22:49,519
Speaker 1: does pass the Bechdel test, but as far as I

1403
01:22:49,560 --> 01:22:54,000
Speaker 1: can tell, only in one scene. Unless I'm missing something,

1404
01:22:54,560 --> 01:22:58,000
Speaker 1: it's not okay. That's that's the way the cookie crumbles

1405
01:22:58,360 --> 01:23:03,559
Speaker 1: will take one for Yeah, now we rate on our

1406
01:23:03,640 --> 01:23:06,760
Speaker 1: nipple scale, where we rate the movie based on its

1407
01:23:06,760 --> 01:23:10,160
Speaker 1: portrayal of women based on a scale of zero to

1408
01:23:10,400 --> 01:23:13,880
Speaker 1: five nipples. This is another like kind of landing right

1409
01:23:13,920 --> 01:23:17,400
Speaker 1: in the middle for me, where to me, it's not

1410
01:23:17,880 --> 01:23:23,759
Speaker 1: especially progressive, it's not especially re aggressive. It has interesting

1411
01:23:24,200 --> 01:23:30,960
Speaker 1: female characters, more time and care was spent to develop them,

1412
01:23:31,000 --> 01:23:34,960
Speaker 1: certainly more than other similar kind of teen movies, especially

1413
01:23:35,000 --> 01:23:38,559
Speaker 1: of this era. But also there are choices that were made,

1414
01:23:39,000 --> 01:23:43,519
Speaker 1: like the statutory affair that happens between the teacher and

1415
01:23:43,520 --> 01:23:46,400
Speaker 1: the student, and I don't know, this is just like

1416
01:23:46,600 --> 01:23:48,479
Speaker 1: it's a hard this is a hard one. This is

1417
01:23:48,520 --> 01:23:51,600
Speaker 1: some of them are it's very easy, and this is

1418
01:23:51,600 --> 01:23:53,400
Speaker 1: a hard one because as you were kind of touching

1419
01:23:53,400 --> 01:23:57,080
Speaker 1: on Natasha, it's like there's a lot of ambiguity and

1420
01:23:57,120 --> 01:24:01,599
Speaker 1: gray area that is honestly are realistic. I mean, we

1421
01:24:01,840 --> 01:24:05,720
Speaker 1: as as people find ourselves having to make difficult decisions

1422
01:24:05,720 --> 01:24:09,160
Speaker 1: and and being faced with things that we don't exactly

1423
01:24:09,160 --> 01:24:11,640
Speaker 1: know what the right and moral and ethical thing to

1424
01:24:11,720 --> 01:24:14,800
Speaker 1: do is in the moment, and maybe making mistakes here

1425
01:24:14,800 --> 01:24:18,519
Speaker 1: and there. So I think all of those aspects of

1426
01:24:18,520 --> 01:24:22,200
Speaker 1: the film are interesting. Um Worth noting that this is

1427
01:24:22,240 --> 01:24:27,639
Speaker 1: an extremely white movie that could be um maybe explained

1428
01:24:27,640 --> 01:24:29,879
Speaker 1: away the fact that this takes place in a suburb

1429
01:24:30,040 --> 01:24:41,240
Speaker 1: of Oh Maha, Um, where do we share? But we're everywhere. Yeah,

1430
01:24:41,880 --> 01:24:46,600
Speaker 1: replace the Indians. I'm sure we found our way somewhere there.

1431
01:24:47,720 --> 01:24:51,599
Speaker 1: But yeah, every major speaking role, in fact, maybe even

1432
01:24:51,640 --> 01:24:56,400
Speaker 1: every speaking role period is spoken by a white person. Um.

1433
01:24:56,439 --> 01:24:59,960
Speaker 1: I do appreciate that there is clear and not code

1434
01:25:00,000 --> 01:25:03,320
Speaker 1: did because if there is queer characters in movies, usually

1435
01:25:03,320 --> 01:25:06,760
Speaker 1: they're just coded that way. But we do see someone who,

1436
01:25:06,840 --> 01:25:10,559
Speaker 1: even though she perhaps is not totally sure how she

1437
01:25:10,640 --> 01:25:15,000
Speaker 1: identifies at this stage in her life, she is queer. Yeah,

1438
01:25:15,520 --> 01:25:19,519
Speaker 1: although as we discussed, you know, she kind of falls

1439
01:25:19,520 --> 01:25:22,360
Speaker 1: into a sort of trophy character of like kind of

1440
01:25:22,400 --> 01:25:27,320
Speaker 1: the angry lesbian type. So you know, more care and

1441
01:25:27,520 --> 01:25:30,280
Speaker 1: time could have been spent to develop these characters just

1442
01:25:30,320 --> 01:25:34,559
Speaker 1: a little bit more. Um Yeah. So overall, this was

1443
01:25:34,960 --> 01:25:37,800
Speaker 1: a very long winded way to say that I give

1444
01:25:37,840 --> 01:25:41,160
Speaker 1: this movie. I'm going to give this movie. I think

1445
01:25:41,160 --> 01:25:45,040
Speaker 1: two and a half nips. I'll give one to Tracy Flick,

1446
01:25:45,160 --> 01:25:48,960
Speaker 1: I'll give one to Tammy, and I will give my

1447
01:25:49,520 --> 01:25:55,320
Speaker 1: remaining half nipple too Diane Jim's wife and then ex

1448
01:25:55,400 --> 01:25:58,519
Speaker 1: wife because I feel like we should have his wife,

1449
01:25:59,200 --> 01:26:01,840
Speaker 1: because I feel like we should have learned more about her,

1450
01:26:01,920 --> 01:26:04,360
Speaker 1: and more about the mom character, more about many characters.

1451
01:26:04,439 --> 01:26:06,439
Speaker 1: But you know, you only have so much time in

1452
01:26:06,479 --> 01:26:11,040
Speaker 1: a movie, so I'm gonna go. I'm very close to

1453
01:26:11,080 --> 01:26:15,839
Speaker 1: wanting to do with three and a half for this one. Natasha,

1454
01:26:15,880 --> 01:26:17,880
Speaker 1: you made a great point at the end for all

1455
01:26:17,920 --> 01:26:22,280
Speaker 1: the like nitpicky things they have about this movie, by

1456
01:26:22,360 --> 01:26:28,240
Speaker 1: and large, every character in this movie is presented as flawed,

1457
01:26:28,880 --> 01:26:32,840
Speaker 1: and that is, I think, in general, a positive in

1458
01:26:32,880 --> 01:26:37,120
Speaker 1: that we have female characters that we know well enough

1459
01:26:37,360 --> 01:26:41,639
Speaker 1: to know that they're flawed. Usually it's the only thing

1460
01:26:41,680 --> 01:26:43,559
Speaker 1: we know about them, or we know nothing at all.

1461
01:26:43,720 --> 01:26:47,639
Speaker 1: So where where I do have like certain like thoughts

1462
01:26:47,680 --> 01:26:49,720
Speaker 1: of like, I think that Tammy's character could have been

1463
01:26:49,720 --> 01:26:53,479
Speaker 1: handled better, You're totally right. She's a very flawed character,

1464
01:26:54,160 --> 01:26:59,160
Speaker 1: as is the entire main cast. And for any criticism

1465
01:26:59,200 --> 01:27:03,520
Speaker 1: of like everyone like, it's not just the female identifying

1466
01:27:03,600 --> 01:27:07,080
Speaker 1: characters in this movie. That and where they started. Everyone's

1467
01:27:07,080 --> 01:27:10,160
Speaker 1: in a vicious cycle that they made themselves, and that's

1468
01:27:10,200 --> 01:27:13,360
Speaker 1: you know, suppressing, but it feels real and at least

1469
01:27:13,680 --> 01:27:17,200
Speaker 1: is uniformly applied to almost every character you know. There

1470
01:27:17,320 --> 01:27:20,040
Speaker 1: there are a few misses with I absolutely agree that

1471
01:27:20,080 --> 01:27:26,360
Speaker 1: the statutory rape storyline is mishandled, and there's I mean,

1472
01:27:26,400 --> 01:27:29,000
Speaker 1: I think that there's space inside of it this movie

1473
01:27:29,439 --> 01:27:33,120
Speaker 1: for it to be handled well, but it's not. And

1474
01:27:33,160 --> 01:27:37,120
Speaker 1: then there's a few uncanny valley characters like Linda where

1475
01:27:37,520 --> 01:27:39,600
Speaker 1: I could understand where you're coming from, but we just

1476
01:27:39,640 --> 01:27:43,639
Speaker 1: haven't spent enough time with you to understand why these

1477
01:27:43,680 --> 01:27:47,120
Speaker 1: sudden switches were made. Uh, And just that I don't

1478
01:27:47,160 --> 01:27:51,200
Speaker 1: see any reason why Tracy's mom couldn't have been more present. Uh,

1479
01:27:51,520 --> 01:27:54,880
Speaker 1: little stuff like that. Obviously, it is a very white movie,

1480
01:27:55,400 --> 01:27:59,200
Speaker 1: and there's no reason in a high school setting for

1481
01:27:59,280 --> 01:28:05,479
Speaker 1: their now, although my high school had white people in it.

1482
01:28:05,600 --> 01:28:08,639
Speaker 1: So I don't like not to defend this choice at all.

1483
01:28:09,280 --> 01:28:12,280
Speaker 1: It might be a regional thing, who knows. But also

1484
01:28:12,360 --> 01:28:16,599
Speaker 1: in movies you can make choices to you know, misrepresent things,

1485
01:28:16,640 --> 01:28:19,639
Speaker 1: because movies do it all the time. Right. And also

1486
01:28:19,720 --> 01:28:22,760
Speaker 1: it's like, how would it have affected the story negatively?

1487
01:28:22,920 --> 01:28:26,439
Speaker 1: Like it it wouldn't you know? You could have the

1488
01:28:26,560 --> 01:28:29,000
Speaker 1: movie happen the exact same way and have included people

1489
01:28:29,040 --> 01:28:32,639
Speaker 1: of color at any point. But I'll go three three

1490
01:28:32,640 --> 01:28:35,559
Speaker 1: and a half because it's hard to find. It's hard

1491
01:28:35,600 --> 01:28:40,040
Speaker 1: to find complicated depictions of women in movies at all,

1492
01:28:40,760 --> 01:28:44,479
Speaker 1: and we've got we've got a few here, and I

1493
01:28:44,560 --> 01:28:47,680
Speaker 1: really really enjoyed this movie and I'm looking forward to

1494
01:28:47,680 --> 01:28:50,720
Speaker 1: seeing it again. Um, and also sorry, what I was

1495
01:28:50,720 --> 01:28:54,680
Speaker 1: gonna say is not just a complicated woman, but the

1496
01:28:54,840 --> 01:28:57,639
Speaker 1: kind of character you can keep revisiting and take something

1497
01:28:57,760 --> 01:29:00,439
Speaker 1: new away every time. I think that that is something

1498
01:29:00,640 --> 01:29:05,120
Speaker 1: very commonly applied to male characters. Um, I go right

1499
01:29:05,160 --> 01:29:07,320
Speaker 1: to TV. But like you know, you're don drapers of

1500
01:29:07,400 --> 01:29:11,920
Speaker 1: like revisiting this guy we all thought was so fucking cool.

1501
01:29:12,320 --> 01:29:14,160
Speaker 1: There's not a lot of female characters that are written

1502
01:29:14,160 --> 01:29:16,200
Speaker 1: well enough to be able to go back and have

1503
01:29:16,240 --> 01:29:19,160
Speaker 1: new takers. So I'll go three and a half. M

1504
01:29:19,160 --> 01:29:22,479
Speaker 1: I mean to give two to Tracy flick uh, and

1505
01:29:22,520 --> 01:29:27,519
Speaker 1: I give that half to Diane, and I'm given the

1506
01:29:27,600 --> 01:29:31,559
Speaker 1: last of that poor baby who had to see Matthew

1507
01:29:31,600 --> 01:29:37,000
Speaker 1: brodack of sex. Um, you guys said everything. Now, I

1508
01:29:37,040 --> 01:29:41,880
Speaker 1: would give it three also because I appreciate that they

1509
01:29:42,080 --> 01:29:45,760
Speaker 1: were telling a female sort of driven story. I appreciate

1510
01:29:45,800 --> 01:29:48,719
Speaker 1: that there were multiple female characters. I mean, we talked

1511
01:29:48,720 --> 01:29:52,439
Speaker 1: about well five or so, and you know the reason

1512
01:29:52,520 --> 01:29:55,760
Speaker 1: I wouldn't give it a full five is because they

1513
01:29:55,800 --> 01:29:59,680
Speaker 1: were portrayed to be like the parts of us that

1514
01:29:59,720 --> 01:30:04,479
Speaker 1: could be embraced. We're sort of underappreciated, so even and

1515
01:30:04,880 --> 01:30:06,680
Speaker 1: I get it. I mean, as a writer, like, when

1516
01:30:06,720 --> 01:30:10,040
Speaker 1: you're writing a character, you just gotta go like all in.

1517
01:30:10,520 --> 01:30:13,680
Speaker 1: You can't be like, oh, the um, you know, the

1518
01:30:13,760 --> 01:30:16,960
Speaker 1: ambitious student, and the log line has to be the

1519
01:30:17,120 --> 01:30:21,080
Speaker 1: over ambitious student, um, the obnoxious student. Like it has

1520
01:30:21,120 --> 01:30:23,760
Speaker 1: to do. And I get it, Um, but I wish that,

1521
01:30:23,920 --> 01:30:26,560
Speaker 1: you know, if we had the platform, we weren't portrayed

1522
01:30:26,640 --> 01:30:30,679
Speaker 1: as that. Otherwise I feel like all your points are valid. Um.

1523
01:30:30,720 --> 01:30:34,040
Speaker 1: I'm always an advocate for diversity. Um. That's that. I

1524
01:30:34,080 --> 01:30:39,479
Speaker 1: completely get that. I'm from Canada and and uh, I see,

1525
01:30:39,680 --> 01:30:42,400
Speaker 1: I think it's a lot more common there, um to

1526
01:30:42,560 --> 01:30:44,840
Speaker 1: see all sorts of people. But I've learned as I've

1527
01:30:44,880 --> 01:30:48,679
Speaker 1: come to America, that there are cities here where people

1528
01:30:48,840 --> 01:30:51,759
Speaker 1: didn't have people of color um at all, like until

1529
01:30:51,800 --> 01:30:54,880
Speaker 1: college and stuff. So I understand that. And I'm just

1530
01:30:54,960 --> 01:30:59,960
Speaker 1: kidding sometimes and sometimes not um that everybody should have diversity,

1531
01:31:00,520 --> 01:31:04,479
Speaker 1: but it's you know, back it was, it's all good. Um. Yeah.

1532
01:31:04,520 --> 01:31:09,519
Speaker 1: So three, I'll give two and a half to Tracy

1533
01:31:09,920 --> 01:31:14,200
Speaker 1: just because she's a bull buster and she you know,

1534
01:31:14,400 --> 01:31:17,840
Speaker 1: didn't let anybody stop her, and she had a lot

1535
01:31:17,920 --> 01:31:21,240
Speaker 1: of ship happened to her and she pushed on. She

1536
01:31:21,400 --> 01:31:25,439
Speaker 1: was also a human being who was flawed, and I

1537
01:31:25,479 --> 01:31:28,679
Speaker 1: think there's a lot to take away from her. Um,

1538
01:31:28,720 --> 01:31:31,800
Speaker 1: and fucking Reese Witherspoon plays her, so you have to

1539
01:31:31,800 --> 01:31:37,519
Speaker 1: love her. The other quarters I'll give to Tammy because,

1540
01:31:37,560 --> 01:31:40,840
Speaker 1: like you said, it's it's great that they had um

1541
01:31:40,880 --> 01:31:45,320
Speaker 1: an openly queer character on camera, and and her depiction

1542
01:31:45,439 --> 01:31:47,840
Speaker 1: was honest in the beginning of her struggling, you know,

1543
01:31:47,840 --> 01:31:50,719
Speaker 1: and trying to figure it out. Um, Diane, I feel

1544
01:31:50,760 --> 01:31:53,120
Speaker 1: bad for her. I feel bad for her, and so

1545
01:31:53,439 --> 01:31:55,840
Speaker 1: I don't think the math added up. Guys, don't judge me.

1546
01:31:55,880 --> 01:31:57,840
Speaker 1: I'm Indian. I should have known the math, but they didn't.

1547
01:31:58,320 --> 01:32:02,720
Speaker 1: I think that I'm also half hungover, but I'm not.

1548
01:32:03,320 --> 01:32:06,720
Speaker 1: I'm just really sleepy. Well, thank you so much for

1549
01:32:06,760 --> 01:32:10,080
Speaker 1: being here. Much fun. What would you like to plug?

1550
01:32:10,080 --> 01:32:12,679
Speaker 1: Where can people find you? On mond um, you guys

1551
01:32:12,760 --> 01:32:15,519
Speaker 1: can check out the Kind of Dating podcast. We are

1552
01:32:16,000 --> 01:32:19,320
Speaker 1: everywhere you find podcasts, and we're also on YouTube. You

1553
01:32:19,360 --> 01:32:21,519
Speaker 1: can follow us on social media where at Kind of

1554
01:32:21,600 --> 01:32:25,759
Speaker 1: Dating across the board. Um, I'm at Natasha Chandel on

1555
01:32:25,760 --> 01:32:30,679
Speaker 1: Facebook and Instagram and Natasha underscore Chandel on Twitter because

1556
01:32:30,720 --> 01:32:34,479
Speaker 1: some other bitch took my name. I'm getting unbelievable. Never

1557
01:32:34,600 --> 01:32:39,160
Speaker 1: use this Twitter, give me my handle that I'm kidding awesome.

1558
01:32:39,840 --> 01:32:44,040
Speaker 1: You can follow the Bechtel Cast on the various platforms

1559
01:32:44,160 --> 01:32:48,040
Speaker 1: on Twitter and Instagram at Bechtel Cast. You can write

1560
01:32:48,080 --> 01:32:51,519
Speaker 1: and review us on iTunes. You can subscribe to our

1561
01:32:51,920 --> 01:32:55,840
Speaker 1: patreon a k R Matreon by going to patreon dot

1562
01:32:55,880 --> 01:32:59,880
Speaker 1: com slash backtel Cast and you pay five dollars and

1563
01:33:00,000 --> 01:33:03,880
Speaker 1: you get to bonus episodes every single month. It's November,

1564
01:33:04,160 --> 01:33:08,880
Speaker 1: so you're going to be thankful for that you did.

1565
01:33:09,000 --> 01:33:11,040
Speaker 1: Oh and also don't forget you can now that we're

1566
01:33:11,040 --> 01:33:14,559
Speaker 1: getting into holiday season, you can also gift someone else

1567
01:33:14,840 --> 01:33:18,200
Speaker 1: uh Patreon subscription. We had some of that last year.

1568
01:33:18,280 --> 01:33:20,599
Speaker 1: Also last year and thanks getting fun no member fact,

1569
01:33:20,840 --> 01:33:25,599
Speaker 1: Caitlin and I got violently drunk and watched every version

1570
01:33:25,640 --> 01:33:29,679
Speaker 1: of The Grinch efforts and also watched and recorded and

1571
01:33:29,840 --> 01:33:34,400
Speaker 1: as still unreleased Titanic episode because we were too we

1572
01:33:34,439 --> 01:33:36,880
Speaker 1: were too drunk. So all I had to say, we

1573
01:33:36,880 --> 01:33:39,200
Speaker 1: put a lot of loving care into the Patreon and

1574
01:33:39,240 --> 01:33:44,640
Speaker 1: if we are too drug, we will not release it. Yeah,

1575
01:33:44,760 --> 01:33:47,679
Speaker 1: unless I know, maybe the it's funny. We've gotten requests

1576
01:33:47,720 --> 01:33:50,519
Speaker 1: for like when when are you releasing this? I think

1577
01:33:50,520 --> 01:33:53,920
Speaker 1: the people might want it. We'll see, you know. If

1578
01:33:53,960 --> 01:33:57,000
Speaker 1: some of our listeners wanted to donate substantially to an

1579
01:33:57,160 --> 01:34:01,040
Speaker 1: organization we love, they can here and we'll just hope

1580
01:34:01,040 --> 01:34:04,920
Speaker 1: they don't asslaunge it, just keep it to themselves. Yeah. Yeah,

1581
01:34:06,640 --> 01:34:11,200
Speaker 1: Also you can go to our merch store, UM Gift Season,

1582
01:34:11,760 --> 01:34:16,919
Speaker 1: t public dot com, slash the Bectel Cast and by

1583
01:34:16,960 --> 01:34:21,800
Speaker 1: all of our goodies there. Holiday shopping will be introducing

1584
01:34:21,840 --> 01:34:26,920
Speaker 1: some new designs and so get ready for what is it?

1585
01:34:27,160 --> 01:34:32,400
Speaker 1: Cyber Monday? Cyber wonder. Okay, we love you so much.

1586
01:34:33,040 --> 01:34:34,360
Speaker 1: By by vote