WEBVTT - The Satan Bump with Penny Lane 0:00:03.800 --> 0:00:23.239 It's one am in Salem, Massachusetts, and you're listening Tonight Call. Hello, 0:00:23.360 --> 0:00:26.560 and welcome to Night Call, a podcast for your strange 0:00:26.640 --> 0:00:29.560 days and lonely nights. I am in Los Angeles. My 0:00:29.640 --> 0:00:32.640 name is Tess Lynch. With me is Molly Lamb. Right 0:00:32.720 --> 0:00:38.479 and over in New York, we have Emily Orshita. Hello, Hello, Hello, 0:00:40.240 --> 0:00:44.000 Hall Satan, Hale Satan. Now we don't have to laugh 0:00:44.040 --> 0:00:46.320 when we say Hall Satan, and you will find out 0:00:46.360 --> 0:00:50.559 why momentarily. So. Um, this week we have a very 0:00:50.600 --> 0:00:52.519 special guest on the pod. We talked to her just 0:00:52.600 --> 0:00:54.840 a little bit ago, but through the magic of editing, 0:00:54.920 --> 0:00:58.120 we are about to talk to her. Um. It's Penny Lane. 0:00:58.200 --> 0:01:00.520 She's a filmmaker we really like, and you did a 0:01:00.600 --> 0:01:04.360 movie we really like called Hail satan Ston. We'll be 0:01:04.440 --> 0:01:07.720 chatting with her in just a second, but first we 0:01:07.760 --> 0:01:09.720 wanted to take a moment to just tip our cowboy 0:01:09.720 --> 0:01:13.080 hats to the yeeha agenda, which we all at I 0:01:13.120 --> 0:01:17.000 Call have decided to support sure wholeheartedly. Yeah. The song 0:01:17.080 --> 0:01:21.320 of the Summer uh from Little Little nas X and 0:01:21.560 --> 0:01:24.680 Billy Ray Cyrus. I am um, I feel like this 0:01:24.760 --> 0:01:27.319 song of the Summer discourse is mostly dead and buried, 0:01:27.760 --> 0:01:30.559 but I am willing to exhume it. Uh this year 0:01:30.680 --> 0:01:33.360 for this song, especially this song coming out in um 0:01:33.440 --> 0:01:37.440 and on April, particularly the remix featuring Billy Ray Cyrus. 0:01:37.680 --> 0:01:40.480 The song has brought people together. The song is old 0:01:40.480 --> 0:01:44.120 Town Road by the way road circling around, saying it 0:01:44.200 --> 0:01:47.639 like it's um like the horses are circling the wagons around. Yeah. 0:01:47.800 --> 0:01:50.080 I heard someone refer to Little nos X as Little 0:01:50.160 --> 0:01:52.680 nas and X, and now I can't see that without 0:01:52.720 --> 0:01:58.760 being like Little Nasonets, which is also as its springs season. Yeah, wow, 0:01:58.880 --> 0:02:01.000 Little nos X, who may or may not have been 0:02:01.040 --> 0:02:04.360 a tweet decking Nicki Minaj. I don't care. I love 0:02:04.440 --> 0:02:06.480 it doesn't matter, it doesn't matter, get it, get it, 0:02:06.480 --> 0:02:09.240 get there anywhere you can. It's also like, that's just 0:02:09.280 --> 0:02:13.520 like working at Walgreens now, like, oh, from somewhere you 0:02:13.639 --> 0:02:16.880 used the internet to try and make yourself money. Welcome. 0:02:17.960 --> 0:02:20.120 I'm I'm a little less on board with this song 0:02:20.200 --> 0:02:22.760 itself than you guys. As you know, I do love 0:02:22.800 --> 0:02:25.440 a crossover hit, but this it's like I can't deal 0:02:25.480 --> 0:02:29.280 with the minor key songs down with nine inch nails, 0:02:29.840 --> 0:02:35.320 fucking fragile, right now is a banger though He's cut 0:02:35.320 --> 0:02:37.600 the horses in the back and Wrangler on his booty, 0:02:37.720 --> 0:02:41.799 Can't tell Me Nothing, and the Billy Ray Cyrus remix um, 0:02:41.840 --> 0:02:44.080 which truly elevates us the song of the Summer because 0:02:44.080 --> 0:02:47.120 the other reason is that it went to number one 0:02:47.120 --> 0:02:49.320 on the country charts and then Billboard decided it wasn't 0:02:49.320 --> 0:02:52.800 a country song because they are racist. Uh, and that 0:02:52.960 --> 0:02:55.600 is the reason why. Because there are so many songs 0:02:55.800 --> 0:03:00.080 on the country charts right now that are totally rap country. 0:02:59.600 --> 0:03:03.640 Oh yeah, yeah. Rap country has existed for a lot forever. 0:03:04.000 --> 0:03:06.639 White people do it all the time. There's so much 0:03:06.680 --> 0:03:09.600 talk rapping, especially on mainstream country radio, which Tess I 0:03:09.680 --> 0:03:12.960 both secretly listened to all the time. It's all like 0:03:13.040 --> 0:03:16.960 getting my car. It's all just spoken like Sam Hunt, 0:03:17.080 --> 0:03:19.800 Sam Hunt does that Sam like a little girl, and 0:03:19.840 --> 0:03:23.400 then she came He's like the drake of country is 0:03:23.400 --> 0:03:27.560 not my favorite at all. But the Little Nazac song, 0:03:27.600 --> 0:03:30.720 when you hear it, it is like anthemic. It's an earworm. 0:03:30.760 --> 0:03:32.880 It just brings me down a nudge like I wanted 0:03:32.919 --> 0:03:35.440 to just lift me up. You know. There's a lot 0:03:35.440 --> 0:03:38.839 of sad songs about horses. That's my thing. They got 0:03:38.840 --> 0:03:41.360 to run away front free. I mean, he just wants 0:03:41.360 --> 0:03:44.280 to ride until he can't know more. I'm I'll allow it. 0:03:44.520 --> 0:03:47.560 And I also love that the visual for it on 0:03:47.680 --> 0:03:51.640 the official YouTube lak Dead Redemption, which just takes it 0:03:51.680 --> 0:03:53.360 to another place. I just feel like, I feel like 0:03:53.600 --> 0:03:56.440 the the crux of the h agenda, if that's what 0:03:56.440 --> 0:03:58.720 we're calling it right now, is like this reclamation of 0:03:58.800 --> 0:04:03.240 cowboy imagery for all people, um and like a post 0:04:03.240 --> 0:04:06.680 digital age, which is it's not like country music is 0:04:06.680 --> 0:04:08.840 not being popular, it's but this has been a thing 0:04:08.880 --> 0:04:11.360 I've been thinking about since they were mean to Beyonce 0:04:11.800 --> 0:04:14.800 at the c m A Awards, because that was right 0:04:14.800 --> 0:04:17.560 before the election. I remember thinking, like, what the funk 0:04:17.640 --> 0:04:20.960 is wrong with people? Why aren't they just like welcoming 0:04:21.040 --> 0:04:24.760 Beyonce for daging to give country music a bomp on 0:04:24.800 --> 0:04:28.000 the show? Uh? And they were so mean and racist 0:04:28.040 --> 0:04:30.000 about it, and I was like, maybe America has a 0:04:30.080 --> 0:04:32.880 lot of problems we haven't really dealt with yet. And 0:04:32.920 --> 0:04:36.680 then I couldn't be I couldn't listen to mainstream country 0:04:36.720 --> 0:04:39.120 music for a while after that because I was like, Wow, 0:04:39.160 --> 0:04:41.520 if I just think about all these people being racists. 0:04:41.600 --> 0:04:43.880 It makes me like, I don't think that it's necessarily 0:04:43.960 --> 0:04:46.760 the all the artists, but I think it's like a 0:04:46.800 --> 0:04:48.800 lot of the kind of powers that I went through. 0:04:49.080 --> 0:04:51.200 It's definitely a bunch of the I went through a 0:04:51.200 --> 0:04:54.520 period and not just old school people, which is what's weird. 0:04:54.680 --> 0:04:56.720 Rum and went and again. I went through a period 0:04:56.760 --> 0:04:58.599 where I was just like any song that had country 0:04:58.600 --> 0:05:00.479 in it, I would just like replace it with racist 0:05:00.480 --> 0:05:03.159 in my mind. And that was a fun game to 0:05:03.200 --> 0:05:06.200 allow me to listen to those songs. A little bit racist. Yeah, 0:05:06.200 --> 0:05:10.960 I'm a little bit racist. Whatever makes you racist, that's 0:05:11.000 --> 0:05:13.800 what makes Yeah. It works, it works, it works out. 0:05:13.960 --> 0:05:16.159 But um, this is the little no X and Billy 0:05:16.200 --> 0:05:20.479 race IRUs song has will allow country music to redeem itself. 0:05:21.600 --> 0:05:26.120 Um by welcoming Little nozas into the country establishment as 0:05:26.160 --> 0:05:28.800 they should, as they should. I still agree with that. Yeah, 0:05:29.080 --> 0:05:32.039 they put the song. I believe the remix the Billboard 0:05:32.080 --> 0:05:34.160 decided also is not. They still won't put it on 0:05:34.200 --> 0:05:36.120 the country charts, but it went to number one on 0:05:36.160 --> 0:05:39.000 the Hot one hundred, so in a way, it's been 0:05:39.040 --> 0:05:42.200 good for the song's publicity. When they banned that sex 0:05:42.200 --> 0:05:44.840 pistol song and it made it be a hit. Shout 0:05:44.880 --> 0:05:49.400 out yeah, shout out jes uh. So I've heard it 0:05:49.440 --> 0:05:51.720 just playing out of every car I've driven pack. I mean, 0:05:51.760 --> 0:05:54.760 it's gonna be like the party song, like when they 0:05:54.839 --> 0:05:57.560 comes on and you're at a barbecue this summer you're 0:05:57.560 --> 0:06:02.719 gonna and it's like it's hay back for Post Malone. Yes, 0:06:02.960 --> 0:06:06.800 you know, also makes stuff that he claims is like 0:06:06.920 --> 0:06:09.600 sort of country, but it is essentially country rap, which 0:06:09.960 --> 0:06:13.560 counts the country. It's country. I entered a contest that 0:06:13.600 --> 0:06:15.920 like landed in my inbox to go to stage coach 0:06:16.839 --> 0:06:21.200 all expenses, and then immediately I was like, oh, it's 0:06:21.320 --> 0:06:25.240 so white, but I but I still want to go. 0:06:25.480 --> 0:06:27.159 I'm just like, oh, what if I get there and 0:06:27.240 --> 0:06:30.080 suddenly I'm like no, I mean like sun Night called 0:06:30.080 --> 0:06:32.720 the stage coach, Yeah, we would go. I have a 0:06:32.800 --> 0:06:35.360 lot of thoughts and feelings about it. Also, isn't it 0:06:35.360 --> 0:06:37.800 funny that, like just a few months ago people saw 0:06:37.880 --> 0:06:41.200 Stars Born. They're like, this isn't like realistic, this guy 0:06:41.240 --> 0:06:45.720 wouldn't be popular. Well, this was in Kate Rath's presentation 0:06:45.760 --> 0:06:48.119 that I was part of a stars Born takes place 0:06:48.200 --> 0:06:51.240 in a universe y ninal leven never happened. On One 0:06:51.279 --> 0:06:56.160 of her tenants was that um that country music would 0:06:56.160 --> 0:06:59.760 have continued to become more progressive in the non nine 0:07:00.000 --> 0:07:02.600 in universe instead of the reactionary swing to the right 0:07:02.720 --> 0:07:05.160 that it made after nine eleven with Toby Keith and 0:07:05.160 --> 0:07:08.240 all that stuff. Country music would have become more more welcoming. 0:07:08.360 --> 0:07:10.440 Tessed looking at me like I'm insane because I'm blowing 0:07:10.440 --> 0:07:16.320 your mind series. And since this has happened, I have 0:07:16.360 --> 0:07:19.880 been wondering if this means the universes are crossing back over. Yeah, 0:07:20.120 --> 0:07:22.559 I think maybe the good universe is trying to break 0:07:22.600 --> 0:07:26.640 on through. Oh it hurts my brain. I think you 0:07:26.760 --> 0:07:30.320 just created a neural pathway that did check graph. She's 0:07:30.320 --> 0:07:32.840 on Jack a m which is my favorite daily morning 0:07:32.880 --> 0:07:37.240 show podcast. UM and now onto our interview with Penny 0:07:37.320 --> 0:07:49.120 Lane eight trill trill. You guys, summer is coming. I 0:07:49.160 --> 0:07:51.640 know while you're in l A and summer is probably 0:07:51.680 --> 0:07:53.920 like already too much and you're probably melting on the 0:07:53.920 --> 0:07:56.360 heat already. But in New York it just got to 0:07:56.360 --> 0:07:58.360 be like seventy degrees for the first time, and it's 0:07:59.000 --> 0:08:04.360 incredibly exciting. I love to go to Prospect Park and um, 0:08:04.520 --> 0:08:07.800 maybe take a little bit of rose with me because 0:08:08.000 --> 0:08:12.080 I am basic. I enjoy being basic on occasion. And 0:08:12.280 --> 0:08:14.240 one of the things that is sort of a pet 0:08:14.280 --> 0:08:17.200 peeve of mine is on a hot summer day, you 0:08:17.200 --> 0:08:20.400 want to take your wine, your beer, whatever it is, 0:08:20.440 --> 0:08:23.360 to the park and about an hour in in the 0:08:23.400 --> 0:08:26.720 sweltering heat because of global warming and other things as well. 0:08:27.000 --> 0:08:30.840 Uh it is room temperature or warm, it's just a bummer. 0:08:30.880 --> 0:08:32.560 I mean, it's not going to stop me from drinking 0:08:32.559 --> 0:08:35.679 the wine, but I would prefer if it was still 0:08:35.800 --> 0:08:39.640 chili and refreshing the way that God intended. So that 0:08:39.880 --> 0:08:45.240 is why Broommate is such an incredible new invention to 0:08:45.320 --> 0:08:49.400 kind of save the summer picnic. Broommate makes super high 0:08:49.480 --> 0:08:55.960 quality insulated wine carriers, beer carriers, uh carafts, everything you 0:08:56.000 --> 0:08:59.760 need to bring your favorite adult and non adult all 0:09:00.080 --> 0:09:03.400 just beverages out in the world with you and keep 0:09:03.400 --> 0:09:06.760 them cold and refreshing. It also works for iced coffee 0:09:06.920 --> 0:09:09.240 just as well. If you're like me, not a big 0:09:09.240 --> 0:09:11.720 one drinker and more of an ice to your coffee person. 0:09:12.440 --> 0:09:14.640 You can even bring cold water in it if you 0:09:14.720 --> 0:09:18.439 just want to stay hydrated and have your water, stay hydrated, 0:09:18.559 --> 0:09:21.959 be cold. Yeah, it's good to be cold. Just stick 0:09:22.000 --> 0:09:25.920 some ice cubes in your broommate and you have a 0:09:25.960 --> 0:09:28.880 cold drink of water all day long. They also come 0:09:28.880 --> 0:09:31.640 in a lot of really nice designs. Yeah, there are 0:09:31.880 --> 0:09:37.320 literally zillions of designs. I got the white and marble 0:09:37.679 --> 0:09:40.760 carafe and matching cups to go with it, so that 0:09:40.840 --> 0:09:43.760 everything is matchy matchy, and I know which one one 0:09:43.840 --> 0:09:45.959 is mine when it's time to clean up the picnic. 0:09:46.160 --> 0:09:48.040 I got one in kind of a wood grain, which 0:09:48.080 --> 0:09:52.560 I like. It's a little natural selection, very outdoorsy of you. 0:09:53.559 --> 0:09:55.600 I love that we're both really into the idea of 0:09:55.679 --> 0:09:58.960 drinking cold beverages outside. If there's one thing we're enthusiastic 0:09:58.960 --> 0:10:02.280 about it, oh my god, having a picnic. Listen, it's 0:10:02.320 --> 0:10:04.720 about to be like a hundred and ten degrees in 0:10:04.760 --> 0:10:08.000 Los Angeles. It already is today. I wish I had 0:10:09.880 --> 0:10:12.760 coffee in my roommate right now. There's nothing more of 0:10:12.800 --> 0:10:14.840 a bummer than coming back into your car in l 0:10:14.880 --> 0:10:17.440 A on a hot day and you're only water you 0:10:17.520 --> 0:10:20.520 left in the car, and it's like boiling hot and 0:10:20.559 --> 0:10:23.559 also probably filled with B p A toxins because it's 0:10:23.600 --> 0:10:26.520 just like a flimsy plastic bottle. That's just a bad 0:10:26.800 --> 0:10:29.880 it's just a bad summer feeling. But with Broommate, you 0:10:29.920 --> 0:10:32.920 can keep all of your beverages the exact temperature you 0:10:32.920 --> 0:10:35.720 want them to be, preferably ice cold, for the next 0:10:35.760 --> 0:10:38.120 few months. Yeah, if you wanted it to be hot 0:10:38.160 --> 0:10:40.839 for some reason, it could also do that. I also 0:10:40.960 --> 0:10:44.199 drink hot tea from it. Yeah, it's it's fully insulated. 0:10:44.360 --> 0:10:47.559 So right now, Roommate is giving our listeners a special 0:10:47.559 --> 0:10:50.480 discount of off of your first order when you go 0:10:50.520 --> 0:10:54.840 to www dot broommate dot com and use our code nightcall. 0:10:55.640 --> 0:10:59.000 That's off. When you use our code night call and 0:10:59.120 --> 0:11:02.400 I g H T C A L l AT b 0:11:02.960 --> 0:11:06.880 r U M A t E dot com. Don't let 0:11:06.880 --> 0:11:09.200 the summer heat ruin your drink. Go to broommate dot 0:11:09.240 --> 0:11:16.319 com and beat the heat this summer twelve nine five, 0:11:18.440 --> 0:11:24.000 eighteen nineteen. So we are now joined here in the 0:11:24.040 --> 0:11:28.160 studio in New York with Penny Lane. She's a documentary filmmaker. 0:11:28.280 --> 0:11:32.120 She has a new film out this week. If you're 0:11:32.120 --> 0:11:34.520 listening to this, all right, that's right. I'm always in 0:11:34.559 --> 0:11:36.800 this weird time warper. I'm like, are we this weeker 0:11:36.880 --> 0:11:39.880 next week, UM called Hail Satan. It was at Sundance 0:11:39.960 --> 0:11:43.080 this year and now it's out in select theaters. It 0:11:43.320 --> 0:11:48.000 is highly recommended my team Nightcall. She's also done a 0:11:48.040 --> 0:11:51.480 bunch of other films were big fans of, particularly our Nixon. 0:11:51.520 --> 0:11:55.240 We were big our Nixon fans back in the day 0:11:55.240 --> 0:12:00.200 and Nixon h guys and like Everyone's Dad, Perfect are 0:12:00.280 --> 0:12:05.600 Everybody's Dad though? That's um And also Nuts, which is 0:12:05.679 --> 0:12:08.800 like a completely uh bonkers film. It was so fun 0:12:08.800 --> 0:12:10.840 that it was also another Sundance thing that I saw 0:12:10.920 --> 0:12:13.319 a couple of years ago. So you can't say what 0:12:13.360 --> 0:12:16.040 it is without describing it so that people know that 0:12:16.120 --> 0:12:20.920 it's a doctor who implanted goat testicles into human men 0:12:21.480 --> 0:12:27.120 to cure impotence. The more you know, the more you know. So, Penny, 0:12:27.160 --> 0:12:30.920 I didn't realize that you had a documentary about more Gellon's. 0:12:32.400 --> 0:12:35.840 I just found out Molly and I spent many hours 0:12:36.679 --> 0:12:38.920 back in the day being like, is it real? Is 0:12:38.960 --> 0:12:41.680 it not real? What is it? So I'm excited to 0:12:42.000 --> 0:12:45.280 see that next Yeah, one of the less fun topics 0:12:45.320 --> 0:12:49.280 that I've covered. Yeah, it's pretty in that film. Either. 0:12:49.400 --> 0:12:51.559 When did that, um, when did you just like last year, 0:12:51.720 --> 0:12:54.520 last year. Here, what's it called the pain of others? Others? 0:12:54.600 --> 0:12:58.240 That's your cue that it's like not that funny. This 0:12:58.440 --> 0:13:01.040 is also that was like a fountain that was musing 0:13:01.080 --> 0:13:04.920 mostly like first person YouTube. Yeah, the whole, the whole, 0:13:04.920 --> 0:13:08.280 the whole film is made up of these YouTube vlogs 0:13:08.320 --> 0:13:12.640 of more Gillan's sufferers. Yeah, yeah, which I've definitely spent 0:13:12.760 --> 0:13:17.120 a long time on you, like we all. That was 0:13:17.160 --> 0:13:19.120 one of the first things that drew us together. I 0:13:19.120 --> 0:13:25.040 think I didn't buy a hairbrush recently because the bristles 0:13:25.040 --> 0:13:31.200 were like rainbow colored plastic too. For people who don't know. 0:13:31.400 --> 0:13:34.080 Listeners who don't know, could there be anyone who doesn't know? 0:13:34.240 --> 0:13:39.120 We have we can say what it is. But yeah, 0:13:39.200 --> 0:13:43.679 well more Gillan's is a very mysterious illness that was 0:13:43.800 --> 0:13:47.960 discovered or first I guess happened to people about fifteen 0:13:48.040 --> 0:13:52.600 years ago. Um and the symptoms of the disease are 0:13:53.440 --> 0:13:55.680 like out of a sci fi movie. So the main 0:13:55.960 --> 0:14:01.360 diagnostic is that out of your skin grows multi colored 0:14:02.320 --> 0:14:05.760 fibers that are made of something too serious that don't 0:14:05.800 --> 0:14:09.080 burn under extremely high heat. It may or may not 0:14:09.920 --> 0:14:14.920 move around like little machines they look like little um. 0:14:14.960 --> 0:14:18.720 Everyone in this room looks really sick right now because 0:14:19.200 --> 0:14:24.760 a lot too ye describing it. That's the thing is 0:14:24.760 --> 0:14:28.200 like people describing it. It's impossible to tell apart from 0:14:28.240 --> 0:14:35.920 like methanetoma symptoms except we're the multiple colored the rainbow colorow. 0:14:37.160 --> 0:14:39.480 There's also a touch of like, would anyone think they 0:14:39.520 --> 0:14:41.680 had this if the Internet didn't tell them it was 0:14:41.680 --> 0:14:43.600 a thing they could have. Yeah. It's one of those 0:14:43.640 --> 0:14:46.400 things where you start googling symptoms and then you're like, oh, 0:14:46.480 --> 0:14:51.400 wait a second, could it be this? Also, Joni Mitchell 0:14:51.440 --> 0:14:54.600 has it and has talked about it interviews, which I 0:14:54.640 --> 0:14:58.080 think boosted it. It's signal a bit. I think I'm 0:14:58.120 --> 0:15:01.720 having imaginary to see this is unfortunately going to become 0:15:01.760 --> 0:15:08.760 even more popular in forthcoming years. Womp, No thanks, I'm 0:15:08.800 --> 0:15:11.600 just I just think it's true. Well, way more fun 0:15:11.600 --> 0:15:14.440 than that was were the Satanists that we met in 0:15:14.520 --> 0:15:20.160 Hail State. Hail Satan. Yeah, how do you pronounce it 0:15:20.200 --> 0:15:22.720 when you actually have to say the name of your 0:15:22.920 --> 0:15:25.920 your film? I just say Hal Satan, Okay, But I 0:15:25.960 --> 0:15:28.800 like watching other people pronounce it, like with the question 0:15:28.840 --> 0:15:32.120 mark at the end of it, because it's really funny. Well, 0:15:32.120 --> 0:15:34.840 the question mark is like kind of the crux of 0:15:34.880 --> 0:15:38.040 the film, right, yeah, sure, because the film is uh 0:15:38.480 --> 0:15:40.800 so it's about the Satanic Temple, which, as we were 0:15:40.840 --> 0:15:43.560 discussing off pod, it is very different and we must 0:15:43.640 --> 0:15:45.800 make the distinction between it and the Church of Satan. 0:15:46.560 --> 0:15:49.240 Uh yeah. And so tell us a little bit just 0:15:49.320 --> 0:15:52.240 for people who haven't seen the film, um, because I 0:15:52.240 --> 0:15:55.280 guess that'll be everybody when this comes up, but just 0:15:55.320 --> 0:15:57.520 about like the basic premise and this group of people 0:15:57.560 --> 0:16:01.040 that you kind of followed for how long about three years? 0:16:01.080 --> 0:16:05.760 Three years at the Satanic Temple is a new religious 0:16:05.800 --> 0:16:11.200 movement that started in basically as a joke like amongst 0:16:11.240 --> 0:16:14.160 a few people with a sense of humor and like 0:16:14.200 --> 0:16:17.760 a political activist bent. And then within months of that 0:16:17.880 --> 0:16:23.440 sort of initial joke had blossomed into an internationally recognized 0:16:23.560 --> 0:16:26.320 organized religious movement with hundreds of thousands of members. And 0:16:26.360 --> 0:16:30.320 so I was like, what, how how did they get 0:16:30.400 --> 0:16:32.360 from A to B? And that was definitely like the 0:16:32.480 --> 0:16:34.720 question that I was trying to answer with the movie was, 0:16:34.800 --> 0:16:36.880 you know, sort of what is going on here? Like 0:16:36.960 --> 0:16:38.480 is it a joke or not? You know, that was 0:16:38.560 --> 0:16:44.080 kind of my initial thing and it's the opening scene 0:16:44.840 --> 0:16:46.760 that must have been really really early on. Yeah, and 0:16:46.760 --> 0:16:49.120 I wasn't there, right, So, like if this is a 0:16:49.160 --> 0:16:52.920 six year story because they got started in I showed 0:16:53.000 --> 0:16:58.080 up in Yeah, because that was before that was still 0:16:58.200 --> 0:17:00.960 when it was kind of just a conceptual thing at 0:17:00.960 --> 0:17:03.400 a movement for to basically like prove a point about 0:17:03.440 --> 0:17:07.240 religious freedom in America. And uh, it definitely has a 0:17:07.280 --> 0:17:12.160 different look. It's definitely a little more Halloween Store than 0:17:12.240 --> 0:17:14.119 how it gets to be later on, although there's always 0:17:14.160 --> 0:17:17.560 like a tinge of Halloween Store. The Halloween Store never 0:17:17.560 --> 0:17:22.399 really goes right right. That's what's great about Satanism. So 0:17:22.560 --> 0:17:24.679 for our audience, let's do a brief explainer on the 0:17:24.760 --> 0:17:30.960 history of Satanism. Anton LaVey, Yes, founded the Church of 0:17:31.000 --> 0:17:34.960 Satan in Penny. Do we know what what does in 0:17:35.440 --> 0:17:41.360 six right, and also kind of invented the idea of 0:17:41.440 --> 0:17:45.119 like the media, the using Satanism as a vehicle to 0:17:45.240 --> 0:17:48.000 like get on talk shows, yeah, and then use it 0:17:48.000 --> 0:17:52.120 to your own ends. And so the Satanic Temple, which 0:17:52.160 --> 0:17:54.720 is not the Church of Satan, the Satanic Temple took 0:17:54.840 --> 0:17:58.280 that kind of template to talk about free speech and 0:17:58.280 --> 0:18:03.240 the idea of America being like supposedly a pluralistic religious 0:18:03.320 --> 0:18:07.240 country and the reality that it is a very prejudiced country, 0:18:07.400 --> 0:18:10.239 and be like, let's force people who want to have 0:18:10.359 --> 0:18:13.760 the Ten Commandments as a statue to put up our 0:18:13.920 --> 0:18:22.359 satan statue. I liked somebody at one point pronounced it. Well. 0:18:22.400 --> 0:18:24.600 I was a little upset when they were like, we 0:18:24.640 --> 0:18:26.240 gave it the abs of iggy pop and like it's 0:18:26.240 --> 0:18:28.160 supposed to have breasts, but we didn't give it break. 0:18:28.600 --> 0:18:31.119 That would be overkill. I was totally like, Wow, I 0:18:31.200 --> 0:18:35.040 must be a real like you know, purist, Yeah, like 0:18:35.119 --> 0:18:37.359 a purist Satanist. Yeah. I was like, well, if it 0:18:37.400 --> 0:18:40.960 doesn't at breast, it's not you are not alone. You 0:18:41.000 --> 0:18:43.040 can go on the internet and find many people who 0:18:43.080 --> 0:18:45.600 are happy to complain about the lack of breast with you, 0:18:46.680 --> 0:18:49.439 the other baffo mat purists out there. When the Satanic 0:18:49.560 --> 0:18:53.000 feminists break off, I think Night Call is ready for them. 0:18:53.160 --> 0:18:56.520 Also the crops Um. Speaking of nudity, the Satanic Temple 0:18:56.880 --> 0:18:59.960 was featuring a lot of the pain in the performance 0:19:00.080 --> 0:19:03.400 art that a company I think Jack Lash was the 0:19:03.440 --> 0:19:08.399 Detroit chapter. They were big a male body, which I appreciated. Yes, 0:19:08.520 --> 0:19:11.840 so Night caall also all for equal nudity, All for 0:19:11.880 --> 0:19:14.479 equal nudity. We've been on a neurotic odyssey. I was like, 0:19:14.560 --> 0:19:18.600 this is we weren't trying to bring Yeah, but documentaries 0:19:18.640 --> 0:19:21.160 often show a lot more penis than anything else will show. 0:19:21.240 --> 0:19:25.080 It's right, yeah, it's true for depicting waiting for our 0:19:25.080 --> 0:19:27.840 distributor to, like, you know, say, when are you planning 0:19:27.880 --> 0:19:31.520 on blurring out those flopping penises all over the movie? 0:19:31.520 --> 0:19:33.280 And they were like, what, no, when I was like, 0:19:33.320 --> 0:19:38.719 a great, great, good documentary. Better I mean I do 0:19:38.800 --> 0:19:41.240 kind of like how whenever somebody does say hal Satan 0:19:41.240 --> 0:19:43.080 and the movie there is sort of a giggle after, 0:19:43.520 --> 0:19:47.639 Like it's always like everybody can be completely straight faced 0:19:47.680 --> 0:19:51.119 about the actual principles that the that the temple is 0:19:51.119 --> 0:19:53.920 standing for because they are very real. Like that's kind 0:19:53.920 --> 0:19:55.679 of the amazing thing about the film is that what 0:19:55.760 --> 0:19:58.439 starts off as like a conceptual gag becomes like a 0:19:58.560 --> 0:20:02.080 very real and like something that everybody is deeply invested 0:20:02.080 --> 0:20:05.840 in within the Temple because they are. It's like, I 0:20:05.880 --> 0:20:08.400 think it's especially interesting like how many you know, kind 0:20:08.440 --> 0:20:10.920 of people who said they didn't have any anything that 0:20:10.960 --> 0:20:13.520 they felt that they were not privileged about or like 0:20:13.600 --> 0:20:16.600 out like another or something. Uh, and then becoming a 0:20:16.640 --> 0:20:21.840 part of the church or the temple rather, I can't say, um, 0:20:22.119 --> 0:20:24.480 becoming a part of the temple and suddenly being involved 0:20:24.480 --> 0:20:26.280 in this struggle. It's like, oh, this must be what 0:20:26.359 --> 0:20:28.600 it's like for everybody who's not a part of like 0:20:28.760 --> 0:20:34.120 the quote unquote majority American culture. Um, they kind of 0:20:34.160 --> 0:20:40.040 are like Juggalos. They're a little bit Juggalo adjacent insiders, 0:20:40.160 --> 0:20:42.600 you mean, Like, but yeah, and like maybe in the 0:20:42.680 --> 0:20:45.400 service of good of just like people that like need 0:20:45.440 --> 0:20:49.359 to put their energy towards something, and like especially maybe 0:20:49.400 --> 0:20:52.119 some young white men who would otherwise go in some 0:20:52.240 --> 0:20:55.399 bad directions to direct it towards like, oh, freedom of 0:20:55.440 --> 0:20:57.840 religion is good. Well, first a lot of them were 0:20:57.880 --> 0:21:01.439 coming out of the church like dy, which is like, 0:21:01.560 --> 0:21:04.480 of course, but it was fascinating to me also. But 0:21:04.520 --> 0:21:06.680 then a lot of them also went through some kind 0:21:06.680 --> 0:21:09.080 of atheist stage, and I thought that was also interesting 0:21:09.480 --> 0:21:12.159 that they said didn't offer the community that being a 0:21:12.200 --> 0:21:14.760 part of a temple, being a part of an organized 0:21:14.800 --> 0:21:18.320 religion offers. And I think that that like that becomes 0:21:18.400 --> 0:21:21.080 sort of lost. I think in a lot of especially 0:21:21.080 --> 0:21:24.359 like debates over secularism and stuff. Is that there are 0:21:24.400 --> 0:21:28.520 like good aspects to organize religion that like build community 0:21:28.680 --> 0:21:30.680 and like make you feel accountable to like a group 0:21:30.760 --> 0:21:35.359 of people. It's just people crave human connection and groups. Penny, 0:21:35.359 --> 0:21:37.560 I wanted to ask you what you saw over the 0:21:37.560 --> 0:21:39.760 course of your three years with them in terms of 0:21:39.800 --> 0:21:42.159 like the evolution of this group, because it is so 0:21:42.280 --> 0:21:45.000 new and it was really interesting to see how, you know, 0:21:45.280 --> 0:21:47.480 it kind of came together and then in a way 0:21:47.680 --> 0:21:50.120 like they had to worry about brand messaging and all 0:21:50.160 --> 0:21:52.280 of this kind of like they were using like corporate 0:21:52.320 --> 0:21:54.679 speak and these meetings. So what kind of things did 0:21:54.720 --> 0:21:56.879 you see change within the group and like where do 0:21:56.920 --> 0:21:59.720 you think they're going from here? I think exactly what 0:21:59.760 --> 0:22:02.080 you said was the main change, right. I mean, if 0:22:02.080 --> 0:22:05.119 you look at just say Lucian Grieves, who is the 0:22:05.240 --> 0:22:08.159 co founder and spokesperson of the Satanic Temple. In the 0:22:08.200 --> 0:22:11.240 first few minutes of our film, he you know, busts 0:22:11.240 --> 0:22:14.600 out at the grave site of Fred Phelps's mother and 0:22:14.680 --> 0:22:19.080 like tea bags her grave. So he's clearly like kind 0:22:19.119 --> 0:22:21.000 of a wacky, out there kind of guy who just 0:22:21.040 --> 0:22:24.840 does whatever crazy thing seems appealing to him a bit anarchistic, 0:22:24.920 --> 0:22:26.840 like let's bring more chaos into the world, But by 0:22:26.840 --> 0:22:30.040 the end of the film he has to perhaps reluctantly 0:22:31.119 --> 0:22:35.160 excommunicate people who are doing things that are really radical 0:22:35.359 --> 0:22:38.480 and really aren't kind of on message with their their 0:22:38.560 --> 0:22:42.200 kind of whole institutional idea. So, I mean that's what 0:22:42.240 --> 0:22:44.080 was interesting. I mean, you know, the whole kind of 0:22:44.119 --> 0:22:51.080 basic irony and questionable sustainability of an organized Satanic religion, 0:22:51.600 --> 0:22:54.840 you know, manifesting into an institution when like kind of 0:22:54.880 --> 0:22:57.239 your m O if you're a Satanist is that you 0:22:57.320 --> 0:23:00.399 hate institutions and like don't want to be part of 0:23:00.400 --> 0:23:02.640 a group, Like how is that going to move into 0:23:02.720 --> 0:23:06.080