Speaker 1: And that's what you really missed with Jenna.
Speaker 2: And Kevin an iHeartRadio podcast.
Speaker 1: Welcome to and That's what you really missed fanfic addition.
Speaker 2: Yo, do people go fanfic? Yeah? Okay, fan fiction, fanfic.
Speaker 2: I am nervous.
Speaker 1: This is so fascinating to me because I've never I
Speaker 1: never would have come across fan fiction. I've got to
Speaker 1: be completely honest. It's just not something that would have come.
Speaker 2: Across my internet girly like.
Speaker 1: No and I. But I love learning about it and
Speaker 1: understanding why people are connected to it and why they
Speaker 1: do it. So I buckle up, everyone.
Speaker 2: Strap in. We are exploring the world of Glee fan fiction.
Speaker 2: We have three wonderful guests today that are going to
Speaker 2: take us through how they found fan fiction, what it
Speaker 2: means to them, and just explain the world to us
Speaker 2: because we don't know anything about this because I have
Speaker 2: sort of steered myself and others on the show away
Speaker 2: from it after accidentally stumbling across the story.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we had to debunk this.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so yeah, we want to hear about all the
Speaker 2: wonderful things fan fiction does.
Speaker 1: And is okay, So first, Kevin, we have Brie, who
Speaker 1: is the reason why we're doing this to begin with,
Speaker 1: so Bre reached out to our producer because she wants
Speaker 1: to debunk the fan fiction that we all hear about
Speaker 1: the misconceptions. Yes, misconceptions. She's a family trauma therapist and
Speaker 1: she's a Glee fan. She loves Britanna and she's into
Speaker 1: fanfic and I can't wait to hear from her.
Speaker 2: Yeah, who better to introduce us to the world. This
Speaker 2: is Bree.
Speaker 1: Hello, Bri. Hi, guys, Hi, how are you.
Speaker 3: I'm good, how are you?
Speaker 2: Nice to meet you.
Speaker 3: Wonderful meeting you.
Speaker 2: Thanks, thank you for being here, joining us.
Speaker 1: Reaching out with this awesome idea.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, I've heard you guys talk about it before, and
Speaker 3: I'm like, I really wish I could clear the air here.
Speaker 1: Let's clear the air.
Speaker 2: What we were talking about is fan fiction because we
Speaker 2: inadvertently are aware of it because obviously people wrote about
Speaker 2: the show we were on. But you wrote fan fiction?
Speaker 2: Yes I did, Okay, So just start at the beginning.
Speaker 3: Yes, absolutely, I will take you back. So I was
Speaker 3: a little a little bit older than the other guests
Speaker 3: you've had on the show. When the show was popular.
Speaker 3: I was in I was finishing up undergrad so I
Speaker 3: was in my twenties. Yeah, you're right, Yeah, so I
Speaker 3: you know, and when I heard about the show, I
Speaker 3: really wasn't aware of it in the first season. And
Speaker 3: I remember my ex came to me during second season
Speaker 3: when the Brittany Brittany episode aired and was like, these
Speaker 3: people are going to do these songs, you know, covering Brittany,
Speaker 3: and I was like, how dare they?
Speaker 4: Like, let's watch this because there's hate watch it right,
Speaker 4: So we tuned in and I wish it was this
Speaker 4: like magical, my eye opening moment, but no, I was like, no,
Speaker 4: that's trash.
Speaker 3: I can't watch the show. And I couldn't stop thinking
Speaker 3: about it, like it was. It was weeks and weeks.
Speaker 3: I was like, you know what, I was actually pretty good.
Speaker 3: And I went back and I watched the episode over again,
Speaker 3: and I was like, oh, damn, okay, all right, so
Speaker 3: let's figure out what this is all about. So I
Speaker 3: went back to the beginning and started to to rewatch slowly,
Speaker 3: and by the time that I had hit Your Guys'
Speaker 3: live airing, it was beginning a third season. So I
Speaker 3: missed the tour, I missed everything, and then I got
Speaker 3: really into it and something just clicked with you know,
Speaker 3: the show. It really hit me in a way and
Speaker 3: that I needed at the time. And just to talk
Speaker 3: about fan culture, I'm probably not going to use the
Speaker 3: word obsessive because it has a negative connotation to it.
Speaker 3: Some call it hyper fixation. So I became super hyper
Speaker 3: fixated with the show with certain storylines, and that really
Speaker 3: led me to start venturing into the internet, which is
Speaker 3: a dangerous place, definitely. And someone was like, hey, no,
Speaker 3: people write about this stuff. It's like what, So I
Speaker 3: went on. I read a few weirded me out at first,
Speaker 3: but I was always into creative writing, so I was like,
Speaker 3: wait a second, maybe I can do this. And it
Speaker 3: was pretty crappy writing in the beginning. I started writing.
Speaker 3: It was not good.
Speaker 1: Did you post that what you were writing?
Speaker 5: I did?
Speaker 3: Yes, really immature writing at first, and then I just
Speaker 3: dove into it and I got a lot better. And
Speaker 3: I was raised in a house where, you know, my
Speaker 3: grandmother had a master's in British lit and a master's
Speaker 3: in English, and so I was already pretty decent with
Speaker 3: with the writing piece. And I actually still write to
Speaker 3: this day.
Speaker 1: And you still do you write about any other characters
Speaker 1: outside of Glee. Yes, in the world.
Speaker 3: Okay, two shows have made it to that point in
Speaker 3: my brain.
Speaker 2: Wow, it's a good way to put it.
Speaker 3: Yes, okay, it's a great escape, honestly, and.
Speaker 2: What a great exercise also for creative writing. And you
Speaker 2: also like, when you were putting it up, what where
Speaker 2: would you post these things?
Speaker 3: Yeah? So this was all the way back when I
Speaker 3: started finding stories, was all the way back when live
Speaker 3: journal was a thing. I never was on live journal,
Speaker 3: but I moved onto fanfiction dot Net and then transferred
Speaker 3: over to a site called Archive of our Own, which
Speaker 3: is now really the primary site. There are others that
Speaker 3: are coming out, but that's a great one.
Speaker 1: So okay, I have so many questions. Oh no, I'm
Speaker 1: interested because you are a family trauma therapist, Chris.
Speaker 6: I am.
Speaker 1: So there's a lot of I'm sure of breaking down
Speaker 1: if you will, of this fan fiction. But I was
Speaker 1: wondering before we get into that portion of the interview,
Speaker 1: did you do you find there's a community that you
Speaker 1: connect with in the fan fiction world or is it
Speaker 1: kind of more individual and you share and read and
Speaker 1: write on your own.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a little bit of both actually. So in
Speaker 3: the very beginning it was a very connective piece where
Speaker 3: you were finding other authors. Sometimes you reached out to
Speaker 3: them and you're like, hey, love your story, this is great,
Speaker 3: and you connected with people. And Tumblr was a huge
Speaker 3: bridge for that as well. Uh, fan fiction and Tumblr
Speaker 3: are a very close relationship.
Speaker 2: And so I found that out by accident one time.
Speaker 1: Oh I want to know about that, he said, one time?
Speaker 1: Get off here.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and now this is obviously before the restrictions were
Speaker 3: put on Tumblr too.
Speaker 7: Yes, okay, there were illustrations. Oh yes, it's a world okay, sorry,
Speaker 7: a great sense of community.
Speaker 3: Right, So I did find a close group of friends
Speaker 3: that I have actually met, right, we just wrote together.
Speaker 3: So when you are writing a fan fiction story, you
Speaker 3: actually are encouraged to find what's called a beta and
Speaker 3: aa is somebody who edits and reads your story and
Speaker 3: gives you feedback. And so you can go ahead and
Speaker 3: let your beta read it and they give you the feedback,
Speaker 3: you make the changes, and then you post it. So
Speaker 3: you're pretty much partnered with somebody, which is really great,
Speaker 3: and you find that person yourself or people volunteer.
Speaker 5: Very cool.
Speaker 2: Wow, So do you read other people and like, oh
Speaker 2: I like their style, maybe they'd be a good fit
Speaker 2: with me to be beta.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, I used to. I am totally individual now, so
Speaker 3: now that I've gotten older and I have a family,
Speaker 3: I don't really have time for all that communication. So
Speaker 3: I do write on my own and I'm pretty confident
Speaker 3: in my writing now that i can do it without
Speaker 3: an editor. But yeah, so I'm solo.
Speaker 1: Now, Okay, yeah, okay, Jenna, No, I gotta. I'm so
Speaker 1: curious of what your analysis is of the psychology behind
Speaker 1: fan fiction. Great question, give it to us, all right.
Speaker 3: So there are so many reasons, right why someone might
Speaker 3: become deeply engrossed in something, whether it be an artist
Speaker 3: or a show or a movie. And I don't want
Speaker 3: to categorize these things to where people are like, no,
Speaker 3: that's not true for me. That's not true for me.
Speaker 3: There's a ton of things we don't have enough time
Speaker 3: in the world to get into the case. Yes, yeah,
Speaker 3: but for something that happened for me was when you're
Speaker 3: going through something traumatic or very heavily impactful, or you're
Speaker 3: unhappy or you're uncomfortable in your environment. Some people really
Speaker 3: like to become lost inside a world that isn't their own,
Speaker 3: whether it be books or painting or drawing or TV shows, music,
Speaker 3: whatever the medium. Right, there's the comfort in having somewhere
Speaker 3: to go that makes you feel safer than where you
Speaker 3: actually are. And it's not to say that there isn't
Speaker 3: a true appreciation for the art or the acting or whatever,
Speaker 3: you know, whatever it is, but it is an escape
Speaker 3: and it's a safe place. So we can, you know,
Speaker 3: we get lost in the space where you research and
Speaker 3: you overanalyze and you rewatch, and that's where sort of
Speaker 3: fan fiction comes in, is you sort of dive into
Speaker 3: a space where you don't have to deal with whatever
Speaker 3: it is it's going on. So that is a huge
Speaker 3: reason why people can become very lost. And I do
Speaker 3: want to say that just because someone gets hyper fixated,
Speaker 3: it's not really an excuse for them to bully or
Speaker 3: act in appropriately or violate your personal boundaries. Right, This
Speaker 3: is just a much safer way for them to have
Speaker 3: an outlet from what's really going on in the real world.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that makes sense. It's also I imagine too, when
Speaker 2: you're then you start getting into fan fiction, you're creating
Speaker 2: the narrative. You're creating the world world, the safe world
Speaker 2: maybe in which you wish was happening in your life world.
Speaker 3: Yes, totally. You can do that, or you can go
Speaker 3: completely fan you can go totally out of left field,
Speaker 3: which is also a huge thing that you see in
Speaker 3: fan fiction as well. And not to mention they you know,
Speaker 3: it's so much easier to write this story right when
Speaker 3: the characters are already established, the world already established, because
Speaker 3: world buildings really hard. So it is nice. It's not that,
Speaker 3: you know, we want to obsess over these characters necessarily,
Speaker 3: it's just that they're there for us and we know
Speaker 3: them and we feel like, you know, what's going on
Speaker 3: inside their heads. So you want to place that in
Speaker 3: a situation that you really want, you know, people to
Speaker 3: read about.
Speaker 2: Hmmm, well, now I'm I'm very curious.
Speaker 3: It's not all sketchy and it's well.
Speaker 1: I think that's important though, because not everybody knows about
Speaker 1: fan fiction, right. This is something that I learned about
Speaker 1: because of I was on Glee. I don't know that
Speaker 1: I would ever have learned about it otherwise. And so
Speaker 1: for people who don't know about fan fiction, can you
Speaker 1: debunk what what some of those myths and things are
Speaker 1: like some of the things that surround it.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, yeah, I mean one of the most common misconceptions
Speaker 3: about fan fiction is that it's all erotic literature. Right, Yeah,
Speaker 3: smut is a great fan fiction word. It's not promise.
Speaker 3: There is plenty of that. I'm not going to say
Speaker 3: it doesn't exist. There is a lot of it.
Speaker 2: There's something for everyone.
Speaker 3: There's something for everyone. And that's really it, right is
Speaker 3: there is something for everyone. If you want something more
Speaker 3: mild PG, a really nice fluff story is what they
Speaker 3: call it, something with a lot of happy feelings. You
Speaker 3: can find that, and then you can find something really
Speaker 3: angsty if you're feeling in a mood like you want
Speaker 3: to murder mystery. Honestly, you can go down that route
Speaker 3: as well. There's a lot of post apocalyptic stories. It's
Speaker 3: just people taking these characters and putting them into even
Speaker 3: other shows like Walking Dead or something like that, and
Speaker 3: really making you, you know, your careacters live out what
Speaker 3: they would react in that setting, which is really fun.
Speaker 2: Which just makes a lot of sense. I mean, it's
Speaker 2: all based off of fictional people, fictional settings and situations,
Speaker 2: and so it's I think it's like Jennifer, you and
Speaker 2: I I can see your wheels turning. I think sometimes
Speaker 2: it's hard to like separate ourselves from like characters that
Speaker 2: we may play because like we see ourselves doing it,
Speaker 2: and so then we correlate that to if people are
Speaker 2: writing about this, then we're picturing ourselves in those situations
Speaker 2: where it's like, well, no, these are fictional characters, right,
Speaker 2: doing fictional things. And people can put Already and Tina
Speaker 2: into the Walking Dead and like, how would they do?
Speaker 2: Good luck time? Not well, but I.
Speaker 3: Cannot imagine what it's like to something and picture yourself
Speaker 3: in it, right, But.
Speaker 2: I do understand though, Like as a fan of fiction,
Speaker 2: I read a lot, I watch a lot of TV,
Speaker 2: a lot of movies. How that could be appealing and
Speaker 2: how that could be like such a great creative outlet,
Speaker 2: a great community building, right, And also they have finding
Speaker 2: other stories of things you're interested in that you may
Speaker 2: not feel inclined to write about, but like, oh I
Speaker 2: want to see what that what that's all about?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Absolutely, well thanks for that.
Speaker 2: That didn't take me long to be sold on that,
Speaker 2: did it?
Speaker 5: And listen here?
Speaker 3: And I want to show you guys something and it's
Speaker 3: it's super weird and personal to me. But I not
Speaker 3: only love to write, but I love to edit. And
Speaker 3: I did edit a story for somebody once and it's
Speaker 3: my favoritely fan fiction I've ever edited, and so for myself,
Speaker 3: I got it published into a real.
Speaker 2: Book that is long.
Speaker 3: Yes, it's a full twenty seven chapter, four hundred page story,
Speaker 3: and you know, I've reread it five or six times
Speaker 3: in the last several years, and it sits on my
Speaker 3: shelf and I can pull it off and it feels
Speaker 3: like a real comfort story.
Speaker 1: Oh so vast. Oh my god, I'm sorry.
Speaker 2: We're sitting here with our mouths open.
Speaker 1: Wow.
Speaker 2: That's incredible.
Speaker 1: This is wow.
Speaker 2: Really bring back a lot of memories. Actually, because I
Speaker 2: have to say so back to like I don't know,
Speaker 2: teen closeted me. I would go on Tumblr and look
Speaker 2: for like gay fiction stories because I didn't know where
Speaker 2: to find them or I didn't have any gay friends,
Speaker 2: and so I would find and not like smut, as
Speaker 2: we said, but you know it's like what you might
Speaker 2: see now and a heart stopper or sex education, like
Speaker 2: these stories that I couldn't yes, And then I could
Speaker 2: search on Tumblr and like find these wonderful made up stories.
Speaker 2: And some of them were like more unrefined than others,
Speaker 2: more amateur sounding than others, but it didn't matter because
Speaker 2: you could tell these people were learning and as you
Speaker 2: were like reading these very they could be very long,
Speaker 2: as like you just held up that book and the
Speaker 2: chapters would get better and better and better because the
Speaker 2: writers were getting better and better. And it was like
Speaker 2: a really my favorite thing to like do, one line,
Speaker 2: was to read these stories.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and that's a huge reason too. And I, you know,
Speaker 3: we grew up I think in probably the same era.
Speaker 3: And I also was desperate for queer content, and for me,
Speaker 3: I think it came a little later. You know, as
Speaker 3: a lesbian there was a lot of lesbian representation. You
Speaker 3: had the L word, but I was seventeen. I was
Speaker 3: probably a little young for that. So I came. But
Speaker 3: you know, the first show that I really found was
Speaker 3: on a network called The En. I don't know if
Speaker 3: you remember that, yeah, yes, and it's a show called
Speaker 3: South of Nowhere.
Speaker 2: Yes, yep.
Speaker 3: That was my very first representation of a lesbian relationship
Speaker 3: on television that wasn't a side joke. You So, so
Speaker 3: when Glee came around and the whole Brittany and Santana
Speaker 3: relationship blew my mind, right, that was something that I
Speaker 3: needed in that moment. And I needed more and more
Speaker 3: of it, so down these paths as you just talked about.
Speaker 1: Yeah, totally. Well, this is thank you for sharing with
Speaker 1: us all of these wonderful things. This is so fascinating
Speaker 1: and you you're the one who you know, reached out
Speaker 1: to our producer to say, let's let's talk about this
Speaker 1: fan fiction thing. So thank you so much for opening
Speaker 1: up the conversation and you know, getting us to do
Speaker 1: this podcast episode. It's very, very cool, and we're so
Speaker 1: grateful for you and all of these wonderful things you've
Speaker 1: shared with us. So thank you so much.
Speaker 2: Grace having distinctly explained it to idiots like us, appreciate it.
Speaker 3: So listen, it's my job.
Speaker 1: Yes, true, I get that, we get that. Thank you
Speaker 1: so much. Gre's really nice to meet you, of course, anytime.
Speaker 1: Thank you.
Speaker 2: Okay, Next up, we have one of our old friends, Allison,
Speaker 2: co host of Gleek of the Week podcast. Who knew Alison,
Speaker 2: who is a host of a Glee podcast, dabbled in
Speaker 2: Glee fanfic. I'm very excited, very excited to have Alison back,
Speaker 2: so let's talk to her again.
Speaker 1: I'm sorry now, we're just she's been too much time
Speaker 1: to time together.
Speaker 3: How are you?
Speaker 1: How are you so great?
Speaker 8: So excited to speak with you all again.
Speaker 1: I know, thanks for coming on. We just we have
Speaker 1: talking about some fan fiction. You know, we.
Speaker 2: Decided because it keeps coming up and like we need
Speaker 2: to just hunker down here and figure out out because
Speaker 2: we know you read fan fiction. Oh yeah, you've written
Speaker 2: some fan fiction. Yeah, how did it come to you?
Speaker 2: How did you find fan fiction?
Speaker 1: Tell us?
Speaker 8: How did I find fan fiction?
Speaker 1: Hm?
Speaker 8: I was heavily on. I think the.
Speaker 9: Glee fan to Tumblr pipeline to fanfiction dot net is
Speaker 9: like a straight line that steps one, two, and three.
Speaker 9: And because I remember following all of these Glee tumblers
Speaker 9: and they would like link, I think the people that
Speaker 9: would post on Tumblr were creative types, writing types, drawing types.
Speaker 8: So like, in addition to fan art, there was.
Speaker 9: Fan fiction and the people that I followed would post
Speaker 9: their fix or like.
Speaker 8: Or stories that they're like. This is like same to
Speaker 8: talk to Kevin mckalon, Janoshkow. It's about this is it's
Speaker 8: such a full circle moment. This feels so this is
Speaker 8: healing in many ways.
Speaker 2: Let it out.
Speaker 1: Yea, that is what our podcast is for.
Speaker 9: So yeah, that's how I kind of found it, and there,
Speaker 9: I mean fanfiction dot Net. I think Glee was like
Speaker 9: one of the biggest branches. I don't have the like statistics,
Speaker 9: but I think it has to be one of the
Speaker 9: biggest branches.
Speaker 8: I think Harry Potter is up there and the Glee world.
Speaker 1: Because because of the fan base.
Speaker 9: And I think the vent diagram for those fandoms is
Speaker 9: pretty close to being a circle totally. But yeah, that's
Speaker 9: how I found it and how I started writing it.
Speaker 8: There were just well, I have two stories.
Speaker 9: I have a fincial story called Fate Has this is
Speaker 9: hilarious to speak.
Speaker 8: About, called Fate Has dealt its cards.
Speaker 9: I when I wrote, I only wrote like four chapters
Speaker 9: per story.
Speaker 8: They're complete there. They don't wrap up.
Speaker 9: There's not like building action, a climax and then like
Speaker 9: denument like a resolution.
Speaker 8: It's just like stream out there exactly.
Speaker 9: And that's I have a fincial story and I have
Speaker 9: a claim story.
Speaker 8: And those are my two number ones.
Speaker 9: And I had like, like in twenty eleven, I was
Speaker 9: what fifteen so very much like do some creative writing
Speaker 9: with these these tropes that I love, because like my
Speaker 9: claim story is if what would happen if Blaine's dad
Speaker 9: enlisted him in the army and they were separated, which
Speaker 9: is like kind of my hair is my favorite musical
Speaker 9: And at fifteen, that's all I wanted to think about.
Speaker 9: I was very obsessed with like nineteen sixty eight, nineteen
Speaker 9: sixty nine, like woodstock hair, Vietnam War era.
Speaker 2: Blaine goes to war.
Speaker 1: Getsped drafted for the wary.
Speaker 9: Blaine gets drafted and yeah, and I had this beautiful
Speaker 9: scene in my head that I don't ever think made
Speaker 9: it to fan fiction.
Speaker 2: Done that, but it was like the goal, the guiding.
Speaker 8: Goal, the guiding light was going to be.
Speaker 9: Blaine is like for some reason, they're putting army musicians
Speaker 9: on the radio and Kurt would be just planning around
Speaker 9: with the radio and here Blaine, oh, from across the globe.
Speaker 1: Very good, very good, beautiful. Okay, Okay, well, thanks for
Speaker 1: sharing that. Have you written fan fiction since?
Speaker 10: No?
Speaker 1: I need to ask.
Speaker 2: It was like a fifteen year old thing for you
Speaker 2: in that.
Speaker 1: Creative writing moment.
Speaker 9: It was a fifteen year old creative writing moment. And
Speaker 9: since then, I mean I've had my like, oh.
Speaker 8: This would be such a good story.
Speaker 9: It's I'm a very big reader, and that hasn't changed,
Speaker 9: and so I still have these like little ideas in
Speaker 9: my head that are still very much kind of similar,
Speaker 9: like based in the nineteen sixties and that sort of
Speaker 9: era storyline. But I haven't written any fan fiction recently. However,
Speaker 9: I did in high school as like a little fun thing.
Speaker 8: And I haven't even like, I don't know even if
Speaker 8: I've told my co host Andrew.
Speaker 1: About this story, well, he's gonna find out exactly.
Speaker 9: I used to on Facebook Messenger write little blurbs about
Speaker 9: my best friend Carrie and Michael Buble. I used to
Speaker 9: write little blurbs that turned into a fan fiction, and
Speaker 9: one year, for her birthday, I turned those blurbs into
Speaker 9: a physical book and I gave her one final chapter
Speaker 9: and I gave that to a Runner birthday.
Speaker 2: Great. Do you ever go back and read these?
Speaker 8: Absolutely not. We did.
Speaker 9: We did read the Client Fact fan fiction for a
Speaker 9: bonus episode one time, and we've read some of the
Speaker 9: like most chaotic Glee fan fictions just for for ships
Speaker 9: and gigs. And it's reading my writing hurts the most.
Speaker 9: I think it's like it's like reading my diary age fifteen.
Speaker 1: It's just so interesting because we have, you know, We're
Speaker 1: spoken to a group of people who have shared their
Speaker 1: fan fiction experiences, and they're all so different. Right, some
Speaker 1: people are continuing to write it is an outlet, it
Speaker 1: is therapy. It is like something they're so proud of.
Speaker 1: And then you know your experience, which is like it hurts,
Speaker 1: it hurts, but fascinating, you know what. I get it.
Speaker 1: I get it.
Speaker 2: I get it. It's like I feel watching myself like Glee.
Speaker 1: Totally totally has hurts so much. I did.
Speaker 8: Yeah, who was that? I don't know who?
Speaker 1: That is exactly getting I was. I always say like,
Speaker 1: oh I wasn't trying there.
Speaker 2: Every Now I'm like, oh I showed up that day.
Speaker 2: So I imagine you go back and read writing.
Speaker 1: That's interesting, right if I.
Speaker 2: Know now now, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1: You talked to Robert Alight recently because you guys are
Speaker 1: watching the Glee Project, right.
Speaker 9: Yes, Andrew just did a full interview with Robert Alric
Speaker 9: and it was amazing because we did just watch all
Speaker 9: ten episodes of Glee Project season one, Oh my yeah,
Speaker 9: and it was so so fun and it was The
Speaker 9: interview with Robert was kind of just a nice little
Speaker 9: stamp at the end to kind of summarize how we felt.
Speaker 8: But that was a journey.
Speaker 1: Oh, I'm sure that was truly a journey. I don't
Speaker 1: think I could watch it.
Speaker 9: To you, it was hard to watch at some points.
Speaker 9: It was very much like Sign of the Times.
Speaker 2: But I think i'd be stressed.
Speaker 10: Like these kids a lot, and the fact that we've
Speaker 10: like spoken with a lot of them, like we've spoke
Speaker 10: with Lindsay and Samue Larson and Damian McGinty, Like we've
Speaker 10: spoken with so many of them.
Speaker 9: It's it's kind of like again full circle, like it
Speaker 9: makes complete sense.
Speaker 1: Totally, Yeah, totally.
Speaker 9: But when what I wanted to ask you is when
Speaker 9: we did we did a whole fan fiction bonus episode,
Speaker 9: and I drew up some statistics, and I went to
Speaker 9: ourcove of our own and I made some graphs, and
Speaker 9: I do you know who the most Glee fan fiction
Speaker 9: is written about as a couple.
Speaker 8: Guess Clain for sure. Yeah, Clain is almost fifty percent.
Speaker 9: Yeah, more than fifty percent of Glee fan fictions that.
Speaker 8: Make every other category is like a nice little sliver
Speaker 8: fifty percent.
Speaker 9: Clain and Blaine and Kurt are the two are the
Speaker 9: two main stories. But then male male relationships are like
Speaker 9: almost seventy five percent of all Glee fan fiction.
Speaker 2: It's like, yeah, I believe that.
Speaker 1: Let me ask you, so, if clean Clean's written about
Speaker 1: a lot, right, do other characters from the world show
Speaker 1: up from Glee show up? Or is it really very
Speaker 1: like clean centric if it's a clean story. I'm so curious.
Speaker 9: It's that's a very good question, and I think absolutely yes,
Speaker 9: other characters show up in minor roles.
Speaker 8: I read a fan fiction and it was Blaine centric.
Speaker 9: But then you also have all the Warblers, like Wes
Speaker 9: comes in, You've got Sebastian smythe You've got Rachel coming
Speaker 9: in talking to Kurr. Got it, Okay, everybody else is there,
Speaker 9: but like it's focusing on and like Bert and Carol.
Speaker 1: Of course there were have to be given. Okay, fascinating, you.
Speaker 2: Can find it. There's a whole world out there for you.
Speaker 2: You can go find it.
Speaker 1: No, this is why I'm doing this in this in
Speaker 1: this podcast is because this is a space, safe space,
Speaker 1: fascinating to get to it. Interesting. I'm just touching the
Speaker 1: line and that's as far as all go.
Speaker 9: Yeah, but I have you found fan fiction that's like
Speaker 9: about not Tina and Artie.
Speaker 8: But Kevin and Jenna, well.
Speaker 1: We've heard about that certain Absolutely, it's even weirder.
Speaker 2: I keep saying that I did stumble across like Kevin
Speaker 2: and Chris One.
Speaker 1: No, I can't do it that time. It's weird enough
Speaker 1: to think like, oh, Tina, like Kevin was trying to
Speaker 1: explain this to me earlier, like it's like we imagine
Speaker 1: ourselves in it, right, because we're if we're being written about.
Speaker 1: But then it's like a whole other level if you're
Speaker 1: like talking about the person behind the character. Yeah, it's
Speaker 1: very strange. Yeah, but I'm I respect it. I I
Speaker 1: really do. I get it, you know what I mean?
Speaker 1: Like this is something I love it as a creating readers.
Speaker 1: I don't really makes me to read it, but I
Speaker 1: want to know about it. That's the thing. I'm so
Speaker 1: fascinated by it, and I'm.
Speaker 2: There's like there's a layer of protection. Yeah, Allison can tell.
Speaker 1: Us, yes, she's exactly. Honestly, though, I would read fan
Speaker 1: fiction if it wasn't about Glee or our characters much
Speaker 1: easier than I would if it was Tina and Artie
Speaker 1: or Jenna and Kavin. You know, why do you make sense?
Speaker 2: I do have a question though, and I don't. I know,
Speaker 2: you're not necessarily like the authority of No. Okay, she
Speaker 2: is all right as the authority figure of Lee fantic No.
Speaker 2: Why do you think it is seventy five percent male
Speaker 2: male relationships and clean?
Speaker 8: That's such a good question too.
Speaker 9: I mean, I think it's I think because of how
Speaker 9: monumental Kurt and Blaine's relationship was for television in general, right,
Speaker 9: I think that unlocked a door for Oh, I can
Speaker 9: write stories like that.
Speaker 8: Stories like that are okay to talk about.
Speaker 9: Oh, I'm also going to write stories, and I'm also
Speaker 9: going to take it like I think Curtain Blaine, for
Speaker 9: a lot of people, including myself, was like the reason
Speaker 9: that you watched the show and the reason that you
Speaker 9: like really got into it, and there are tumblers completely
Speaker 9: dedicated to them, and people were really, really, really all
Speaker 9: about those characters. And so I think that's probably why.
Speaker 9: And I think most of those male male relationships are
Speaker 9: Curtain Blaine or just exploring that, because fan fiction is
Speaker 9: you can make it whatever you want, and the little
Speaker 9: nuances of like oh I kind of saw Sam looking
Speaker 9: at Finn in the choir room. I'm going to take
Speaker 9: that nuance in the episode, and I'm going to make
Speaker 9: a whole entire story about it.
Speaker 2: Oh that made me want to look it up. No,
Speaker 2: maybe that's why I'm the target audience. People are starved
Speaker 2: for this content. Jenna. Oh, it's so good, Like you
Speaker 2: have the parameters set up right, like and so then
Speaker 2: it's like, oh, we needed this type of relationship, and
Speaker 2: now these characters exist in the world, exists, what else
Speaker 2: can we do with them?
Speaker 9: Exactly if it's not if not, it's not happening on
Speaker 9: TV like I wanted to.
Speaker 8: I'm just gonna make it myself.
Speaker 2: Makes sense, and I think.
Speaker 9: It in turn reinforces the watching of the actual content, right,
Speaker 9: because you've got these like head canons now in your head,
Speaker 9: like oh yeah, Salmon Finn, They're definitely.
Speaker 2: Yes yeah, which explained about like eighty percent of the
Speaker 2: tweets I get, oh yeah, Like I knew somewhere that
Speaker 2: this was a part of it, but I think I
Speaker 2: didn't realize it was a huge of it. Yeah, because
Speaker 2: people ask me crazy shit, I'm like what, like what, No,
Speaker 2: Like we're just that sort of thing like Sam and Lardy.
Speaker 2: Sam's bisexual, Like No, I don't.
Speaker 5: Think where does that come from.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but I'm sure that's all because there was a look,
Speaker 2: a comment and then.
Speaker 1: And then some fan fiction.
Speaker 9: Yeah, and I think people want to see themselves in
Speaker 9: those characters totally.
Speaker 8: They want to relate.
Speaker 1: So Alison, thank you so much for coming and sharing
Speaker 1: with us. This is always wonderful to see you. Yeah,
Speaker 1: come back soon, good to see you.
Speaker 8: Thank you so much for you.
Speaker 6: Up.
Speaker 1: Of course they had Andrew. She's so great, she's the best.
Speaker 2: This makes so much sense to me, Jenna does it.
Speaker 2: It does. So There's my favorite teen show of all
Speaker 2: time is called Scom. It's from Norway and each episode
Speaker 2: each season focused on a different person within like a
Speaker 2: friend group. And then the third season was a gay
Speaker 2: storyline and it became the massive fiction tumbled tumblred thing
Speaker 2: that year. And that was like six or seven years ago,
Speaker 2: I think, And so that was, you know, post Glee,
Speaker 2: and I think that, yeah, it all makes sense. That's
Speaker 2: because like when there's a hunger for these types of
Speaker 2: relationships and then when they're on screen and then.
Speaker 1: They there's just a world in which they're then creating.
Speaker 2: The male mayor relationship though and not like the Britney
Speaker 2: Santana relationship.
Speaker 1: I think they're popular as well, though I would imagine.
Speaker 2: But maybe in different mediums, Like maybe in a different form.
Speaker 2: It's not necessarily the fan fiction, right.
Speaker 1: Okay, So last time we have Pamela. Pamela is one
Speaker 1: of our og Glee fans. Very exciting and she's an
Speaker 1: og when it comes to fan fiction as well. She's
Speaker 1: also has your dream job, Kevin. She's a manager of
Speaker 1: a bookstore. So, I mean, there's not a lot else
Speaker 1: that we have to say.
Speaker 2: I can't wait to talk to her.
Speaker 1: Yeah, she writes fan fake and she's part of the
Speaker 1: fandom since she was a kid. So let's do it.
Speaker 2: Hello, Hi, Hi Pama. How's it going.
Speaker 5: I'm a little overwhelmed.
Speaker 6: That's like, Oh, I'm contributing some wonderful people. Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2: Thank you for taking the time too. Yeah talk to us.
Speaker 5: Oh well, thank you.
Speaker 2: Very excited to talk to you because so we're talking.
Speaker 1: About fan fiction all day today.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because it keeps coming up as we're doing this podcast.
Speaker 5: Okay.
Speaker 2: And a couple of things. One, yes, you're like an
Speaker 2: og gleek. Yes, like Glee fan.
Speaker 5: I am, yes.
Speaker 2: Og sort of dabbler in the fan fiction. Yeah, And
Speaker 2: also you have like my dream job of like working
Speaker 2: like managing a bookstore.
Speaker 5: Yes, I run a bookstore.
Speaker 2: Wow, you were just like surrounded by all this literary
Speaker 2: creativity all the time, which I'm very jealous of. I
Speaker 2: just wanted, like, how we'll start at the beginning and
Speaker 2: then we'll see because I feel like there's a beautiful
Speaker 2: line here. But so you started watching Glee when it
Speaker 2: was originally on.
Speaker 5: Right, Yes, I did, Yes, I did?
Speaker 2: What and or how did you find the fan fiction
Speaker 2: while you were watching? Like what brought you to finding
Speaker 2: fan fiction? How did you stumble across it?
Speaker 6: Okay, Well, the thing about it is that, I mean
Speaker 6: I'm an older fan, and uh, the gleeve was not
Speaker 6: my first fandom experience, so like I started the one
Speaker 6: before I was in the office, so I had like
Speaker 6: we're a office fan fiction too, and like before and
Speaker 6: all that. And I've been writing stories and can fiction
Speaker 6: since I was nine years old, I mean like getting
Speaker 6: on like onto like the internet and like in nineteen
Speaker 6: ninety eight and nine.
Speaker 1: And like getting something.
Speaker 6: So so you know, I started watching the show and
Speaker 6: about halfway through it, I was like, Okay, I want
Speaker 6: to read more stories about these characters that.
Speaker 5: I love and I mean I love the show.
Speaker 6: I know there's ups and downs and everything, but like
Speaker 6: you kind of just want more of it, and so
Speaker 6: it's like okay, I so I started seaking it out
Speaker 6: and I got on and I mean back then there
Speaker 6: was something called the Glee Form. It's now defunct, unfortunately,
Speaker 6: but started there there was live journals. I don't know
Speaker 6: if you guys know a live journal, yes, and.
Speaker 5: Went to there and there was a really there are
Speaker 5: all these little communities.
Speaker 6: For all the characters, for all the ships, for all
Speaker 6: of everything, and you just would like find your community
Speaker 6: and then you would just start wrecking people would wreck stuff.
Speaker 6: So you'd find your favorite authors. And then it was like, well,
Speaker 6: you know, I can do this too, So I started
Speaker 6: writing my own and you know, you kind of find
Speaker 6: your little place in the community in the world.
Speaker 2: Wow, that's amazing. So you had written and read for
Speaker 2: several TV series for yes ideas, why do you think it?
Speaker 2: Because Mike qu like, what was it about? Maybe halfway
Speaker 2: through the series that's sort of like, is it the
Speaker 2: series now is not going how I wanted to go,
Speaker 2: And maybe.
Speaker 6: Like, let's put all the cards on the table. You know,
Speaker 6: my favorite character's cart and then of course season four
Speaker 6: happens and you're like, yeah, going on, like what are
Speaker 6: the writers doing to all of these like just like
Speaker 6: broke everybody up. So you're like, okay, how can you
Speaker 6: like a some people want to fix it or be
Speaker 6: like what is the mental? Like how did you get
Speaker 6: from A to B? And so you just want to
Speaker 6: start feeling in the blinks. And you know there's always
Speaker 6: i mean season once, there's a ton of fan fiction,
Speaker 6: and then in season four it just blew up to
Speaker 6: everybody wanted to just fill in the blinks. And there's
Speaker 6: all these characters and people are leaving and people are
Speaker 6: coming in, and everybody's breaking up, and so it just
Speaker 6: becomes this like mecca of creativity. Like me just start
Speaker 6: wanting to like expand on and explore it and see
Speaker 6: what the characters are thinking and you.
Speaker 5: Know, why did this character do this thing?
Speaker 6: And you just keep going And that's kind of what
Speaker 6: got me into it, is like this the possibility of
Speaker 6: creativity and seeing what I can do with the characters.
Speaker 1: I mean, you started writing when you were nine, Yeah,
Speaker 1: what about it? Like were you always like interested in
Speaker 1: writing at that point or was it more about the
Speaker 1: world itself, and like creating, you know, the creativity aspect
Speaker 1: of it, because you're still writing now. So I'm just
Speaker 1: curious what's like, what was it when you started, and
Speaker 1: then what's carried you through?
Speaker 8: Oh?
Speaker 6: Sure, I love storytelling. I write original book as well,
Speaker 6: and I just love stories.
Speaker 5: I mean, you know.
Speaker 6: It's for me, like you know, I love books obviously,
Speaker 6: I love reading books, but also I like having control
Speaker 6: over the characters.
Speaker 5: I love being able to, like you know.
Speaker 6: Move them in the direction like dolls and direct and
Speaker 6: put people in places that I want to put them
Speaker 6: in and see them. And I just have always had
Speaker 6: that kind of creative spirit and so you know, it
Speaker 6: just translates into all of these other mediums and stuff
Speaker 6: like that.
Speaker 2: So amazing.
Speaker 1: Wow, And what kind of original stories do you write?
Speaker 5: Oh? Everything?
Speaker 6: I mean I've been writing a fantasy series and it's
Speaker 6: a reaction a little bit, like you read so much
Speaker 6: and then you're like, oh, I want to see this
Speaker 6: kind of thing in fiction. I want to see you know,
Speaker 6: this kind of a character. I want to see you
Speaker 6: know myself, or I want to see you know something
Speaker 6: that I don't see in published fiction or even band fiction.
Speaker 5: You know, and that's what that's why I write.
Speaker 2: When you are, you know, in sort of these other communities.
Speaker 2: Are those relationships now that like we learned today that
Speaker 2: you have like a beta or somebody that can no.
Speaker 1: I was curious, we've learned about betas, and are you
Speaker 1: a beta for other people? Do you have betas or
Speaker 1: are you more of an individual writer?
Speaker 8: I do?
Speaker 6: I really have like some people in my life that
Speaker 6: will read my writing. I'm terrible at it. There's two
Speaker 6: different there're two different skill sets to be able to
Speaker 6: like write something down and then able to like look
Speaker 6: at somebody's work and go, okay, normally does this common
Speaker 6: here or there?
Speaker 5: But also.
Speaker 6: You know, you know what, I don't think that this
Speaker 6: thematic thing is going with the way you want it
Speaker 6: and stuff like that, and you know, taking yourself out
Speaker 6: of it. So I have I work with a woman
Speaker 6: who I've known for years now and she's in the
Speaker 6: fandom as well, and she is my beta, and we
Speaker 6: work on all sorts of things, like you know, anytime
Speaker 6: I write something, her name is in near mind because
Speaker 6: she's always helping me with this.
Speaker 5: So it's again it's what.
Speaker 6: That community aspect, we just cultivate all of these relationships
Speaker 6: with each other and share it and prompt each other
Speaker 6: and like, hey, maybe you want to try writing this,
Speaker 6: or I know you're really good at writing this kind
Speaker 6: of story and stuff like that.
Speaker 2: So it's also amazing that it's there. Are you know,
Speaker 2: all these people who are writing, like and reading and
Speaker 2: doing all these wonderfully creative things where I think it's
Speaker 2: so easy. If you're not on that side of the
Speaker 2: internet and you don't know about it, then people that
Speaker 2: doesn't exist to them, right, and you get caught up
Speaker 2: and like, oh, social media is bad, all this internet stuff.
Speaker 2: But like, what you guys are doing is incentivizing each
Speaker 2: other to be creative, express these things, find those places
Speaker 2: and the mediums that you haven't seen and want to fill,
Speaker 2: which I think is so beautiful, and like building these
Speaker 2: friendships based off of that.
Speaker 6: It's and it's kind of a I mean, it's kind
Speaker 6: of an interesting thing because yeah, we're doing it for
Speaker 6: ourselves and each other. And every time I hear like,
Speaker 6: you know, I'm going to share my stuff with Kevin
Speaker 6: and Jenna, and I'm like, oh my gosh.
Speaker 5: Why it's not for them? You know that I don't
Speaker 5: want you guys to read it or be involved.
Speaker 6: I think that's really cool that you guys want to
Speaker 6: like understand and know more about it. But it's one
Speaker 6: of those things where it's like, you know, this is
Speaker 6: the stuff that we do and it isn't meant for
Speaker 6: you guys. But I mean, I think it's amazing that
Speaker 6: you guys are coming with an open mind and being like.
Speaker 5: What is this, what's going on? What I have about it?
Speaker 5: I think that is so cool.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we're huge consumers and fans and of other things,
Speaker 1: and so we're just it's hard for us to kind
Speaker 1: of take ourselves out of it, especially with any fanfic, right,
Speaker 1: it's very hard to relate or understand it. And so
Speaker 1: but as fans of other shows, I could totally understand
Speaker 1: how I want more, I wish that happened this character.
Speaker 1: So I totally get it. But it's it's like we
Speaker 1: were explaining to some other people, Like it's kind of
Speaker 1: hard becase is in the fan fiction, Like even if
Speaker 1: it's Tina and Lartie and not Jenna and Kevin, you
Speaker 1: still imagine yourself. You put yourself in that position, right,
Speaker 1: you're imagining yourself in.
Speaker 5: That writing it. I you know, I disassociate.
Speaker 6: I don't you know, if I'm writing Tina or already,
Speaker 6: I still think, Okay, how are Kevin and.
Speaker 5: Jenna are going to hear?
Speaker 6: Like?
Speaker 5: How are they sound? In my head?
Speaker 1: Because it's you guys.
Speaker 5: I don't think of you guys. I know you guys
Speaker 5: are separate people. I'm not right, But it's still the character.
Speaker 6: Like the things and choices acting choices that you do
Speaker 6: actually reflect on the fan fiction that I write because
Speaker 6: I want to incorporate what you're doing on screen, and
Speaker 6: I can't imagine that's got to be a weird disassociative
Speaker 6: thing that happens, because totally like that is you, essentially
Speaker 6: or you guys put so much into it yourself and
Speaker 6: creating these characters to see them go in a direction
Speaker 6: that they may not be what your head canon is.
Speaker 5: That's got to be surreal.
Speaker 2: But I think what you said is important though, because
Speaker 2: you're creating these stories regardless of how you yeah for yourselves,
Speaker 2: for the community, So like, within that context, you all
Speaker 2: know because you're all doing it, what goes into making
Speaker 2: it and sort of the dissociation that you're taking from
Speaker 2: people in real life sort of. And so I do
Speaker 2: think you know. I think it's I understand why you're
Speaker 2: sort of protective of that community of like Jen and
Speaker 2: Kevin don't need to read these things. Yeah, you guys
Speaker 2: support each other. It's a full, like you know, ecosystem
Speaker 2: within itself, and I think that's like it the more
Speaker 2: and more I hear about it. One, I'm jealous that
Speaker 2: I haven't been writing fanfic for years. Two is that
Speaker 2: it's like a really beautiful, like culture and like healthy
Speaker 2: culture on the internet. Totally that is not always easy
Speaker 2: to find.
Speaker 5: Totally it is well, I mean google it, you can.
Speaker 5: You can find anything by Google.
Speaker 6: But I think it's you know, I I've been talking
Speaker 6: to people about it, and there's so many reasons why
Speaker 6: it's not just okay, I mean, yeah, part of it
Speaker 6: can be Oh, I want to see my two favorite
Speaker 6: hot characters make out.
Speaker 1: Okay, that's a real thing.
Speaker 6: But you know, I've known people who've explored their own
Speaker 6: sexualities through their writing. I know people who like read
Speaker 6: stuff and they're like, you know what that this reflects
Speaker 6: to me? And just like are in published form, fanfic
Speaker 6: does the same thing. But it is already a built world,
Speaker 6: like it takes out when you're writing something you know original.
Speaker 6: You have to build the world here. You can take
Speaker 6: characters that you're already familiar with and work with them
Speaker 6: and then find exactly this is.
Speaker 5: The good stuff.
Speaker 6: But yeah, and it's on it well that is joking aside,
Speaker 6: you know that it's on edited and not in a
Speaker 6: like literary way, but like we're not constrained to network
Speaker 6: notes or editors telling us that you can't publish this,
Speaker 6: or that we can write whatever we want and it
Speaker 6: can mat or anything.
Speaker 5: But it's open and limitless.
Speaker 1: Really good point. Good point.
Speaker 2: Do you still have shows that you watch currently that
Speaker 2: you write fan fix for?
Speaker 5: I don't.
Speaker 6: I've been really really busy with my job and stuff
Speaker 6: like that. So I mean, I do you still to
Speaker 6: write some Glee stuff? But I like, there's a lot
Speaker 6: of things I love, but I haven't really gotten kind
Speaker 6: as much into it as like, you know, it's time consuming,
Speaker 6: it is, you can you know, when I was in
Speaker 6: my twenties, sure I had a lot more time.
Speaker 5: But now that I'm in my forties, I have to
Speaker 5: like actually to my.
Speaker 4: Adult live, like real life you know, adult life responsibilities.
Speaker 2: Right now, I want to know all your like book recommendations,
Speaker 2: I'm like, I gotta yeah, let me find books though
Speaker 2: I have too many. Going to the bookstore is my
Speaker 2: favorite thing in the world.
Speaker 6: Oh yeah, I mean I have eight bookcases. If you're
Speaker 6: any recommendations, you guys, just let me know.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Thanks you well, Pamela, thank you so much for sharing
Speaker 1: all about fan fa and for you know, your contributions,
Speaker 1: and it's just really nice to meet you and chat
Speaker 1: with you.
Speaker 5: Oh it's been I can't believe. It's like a dream.
Speaker 5: Thank you so much for that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, thank you, and thanks for what you do keep
Speaker 2: the world reading important. It's great, it is.
Speaker 1: Thanks so much by Yeah, I'm coming out smarter, more
Speaker 1: well just versed fan fiction, but I am. I appreciate it.
Speaker 1: I'm so grateful to our friends Pamela, Bree Allison who
Speaker 1: came and shared with us their experience with man fiction.
Speaker 1: It's it's actually a really cool community and at the
Speaker 1: end of the day, people are just looking for connection,
Speaker 1: whether that's in their own world or with other people.
Speaker 1: It's pretty cool.
Speaker 2: I think it's wonderful. I also love even with the
Speaker 2: three of them, I'll have three different relationships to fan
Speaker 2: fiction and what they like, what they write about their experiences,
Speaker 2: and thank you so much to the three of you
Speaker 2: for joining us today and for opening up and sharing
Speaker 2: this part of yourselves with us and with all the listeners.
Speaker 2: I hope you all enjoyed that. I know loved that.
Speaker 1: Very cool, very very cool.
Speaker 2: Do I go and look for things, Jenna.
Speaker 1: That's up to you, Kevin.
Speaker 2: I don't know. Maybe I could do a light skin.
Speaker 1: I don't know that there's a light scan. I didn't
Speaker 1: know there's like chapters and not like actual like journeys.
Speaker 1: I just thought it was kind of like live journal.
Speaker 1: You don't mean in the beginning when it's like you
Speaker 1: you post a one off kind of thing. But I
Speaker 1: am just I'm so it's so intricate and complex and fun. Okay, Well,
Speaker 1: good luck on your search, Kevin. And that's what you
Speaker 1: really missed.
Speaker 2: See ya.
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