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Speaker 1: Hey, Renee Stubs Tennis podcast listeners, It's me Caitlin coming

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Speaker 1: to you with not one, but two solo podcasts. Renee

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Speaker 1: cannot be everywhere at all times, as much as we

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Speaker 1: all wish that were true. She was taping her show

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Speaker 1: when I was out ahead of her at the BNP

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Speaker 1: party bat Open, when we were activating our incredible space

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Speaker 1: with our partners there at the tournament, So before she arrived,

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Speaker 1: I got the chance to sit down with not one

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Speaker 1: but two incredible people, both of whom I will release

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Speaker 1: tonight as standalone episodes. The first one is Darya Kasakiina

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Speaker 1: aka Dasha. She is a Russian player who got into

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Speaker 1: the top echelon of the game for the second time

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Speaker 1: last year she made the WTA Tour finals. She was

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Speaker 1: fascinating to sit down and talk with, not least of

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Speaker 1: the reasons because she is one of the very outspoken

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Speaker 1: Russian players who has spoken out against Putin against the war. Obviously,

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Speaker 1: it's a situation where not every player has the luxury

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Speaker 1: of being able to do that or is willing to

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Speaker 1: sort of leave it all behind. But it's really courageous

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Speaker 1: to watch her do that, especially because she came out

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Speaker 1: of the closet last year and talked about her relationship

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Speaker 1: with her girlfriend, which we get into a little bit.

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Speaker 1: I do want to give you a bit of a

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Speaker 1: caveat my recorder and microphone had met but not yet

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Speaker 1: fallen in love and become married, as you will hear

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Speaker 1: in the next episode.

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Speaker 2: So bear with is a little bit.

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Speaker 1: There's some background noise, but really, really, what Dasha has

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Speaker 1: to say is super fascinating. She talks about obviously the

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Speaker 1: history of the tour. She gives me some marital advice.

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Speaker 1: She's a really fun, multifaceted person. I loved sitting down.

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Speaker 2: And talking with her.

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Speaker 1: So here it is live from the B and P

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Speaker 1: Parry about racket aces for Tree's tent on the grounds

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Speaker 1: of Indian Wells. Are sit down with Daria Kazakina. Okay,

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Speaker 1: so today on the show we have thank you so

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Speaker 1: much for joining us, Sasha.

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Speaker 2: I understand you've heard the show.

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Speaker 1: Before, so you know a little bit about what we're

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Speaker 1: up to.

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Speaker 3: Yes, you know, it's a little bit casual and a

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Speaker 3: little bit I mean that's cool.

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Speaker 4: I like this kind of you know, this format, So

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Speaker 4: I mean, I hope it's gonna be a fun one.

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Speaker 1: One of the things I want to talk to you

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Speaker 1: about is you have had traditionally a very good tournament here.

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Speaker 3: This is fun.

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Speaker 2: It seems like a good place for you.

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Speaker 1: What about the desert, what about the BNP carry about

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Speaker 1: open makes you feel maybe comfortable that you can have

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Speaker 1: you know, some of your better results.

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Speaker 4: Well, yeah, at the beginning of my career playing here,

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Speaker 4: I've had a few good runs. Yeah, then was a

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Speaker 4: bit you know, ups and downs, plus the COVID here,

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Speaker 4: so it was a bit weird.

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Speaker 3: But I mean I like it here. I like to

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Speaker 3: play in California.

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Speaker 4: Basically, I've got good results playing here in San Paset

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Speaker 4: for the past years.

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Speaker 1: So.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I like to play, you know, in the dry conditions,

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Speaker 4: not sweating much.

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Speaker 2: And also the court's pretty slow.

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Speaker 4: Courts are slow, but they both here with altitude, so yeah,

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Speaker 4: I mean, yeah, the conditions are pretty nice. At the

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Speaker 4: evening's super slow, so I may bee ple sure to

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Speaker 4: play in the first part of the day.

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Speaker 3: But this one you never know.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, but in general, I mean almost never rains, so

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Speaker 4: no delays, which makes it easier.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So you like California generally, This is a good vibe

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Speaker 1: for you.

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Speaker 2: It's sort of like Spain, I guess.

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Speaker 3: Right, No, no, no, in Spain it's super humid. Yeah, yeah, no,

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Speaker 3: it's different.

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Speaker 4: It's different, especially I mean in the morning and the

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Speaker 4: late evening is very cold.

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Speaker 3: Here is pretty freezing.

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Speaker 4: I think it's very good for in general for your health.

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Speaker 4: I think the conditions are much better than for example, Florida,

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Speaker 4: where you're just constantly in the in the sauna, you know,

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Speaker 4: and it's raining all.

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Speaker 3: The time as well. So I think, yeah, the climate twise,

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Speaker 3: it's better here.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's nice to be here.

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Speaker 1: Let's talk a little bit about the last year you had.

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Speaker 1: You had a great year twenty twenty two. You know,

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Speaker 1: anybody who plays I only played college sentence, so I'm

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Speaker 1: not a particularly good tennis player.

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Speaker 3: No college than is good, okay, but.

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Speaker 1: Everybody has their ups and downs, and you know, really

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Speaker 1: having your last two years, coming back into.

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Speaker 2: The top ten, winning a couple of titles, becoming.

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Speaker 1: The Russian world number one, Like you've had a what

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Speaker 1: what is the sort of last couple of months eighteen

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Speaker 1: months or so, been like three.

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Speaker 4: Emotionally it's been a roller course. The honesty is where

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Speaker 4: too many things going.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, going on, I mean on court and off the

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Speaker 3: court in the world.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, so, I mean it's tough. Honestly, it's not just

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Speaker 4: their room for tennis. In my head, I'm thinking about

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Speaker 4: many other things. So, but from the tennis part, of course.

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Speaker 3: I mean the last year was one of the best

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Speaker 3: in my careerser part, and yeah, I've been working a

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Speaker 3: lot on the comeback.

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Speaker 4: Comeback, I mean come back back, yeah, kind of come back.

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Speaker 4: And I mean it's very tough, and I think it's

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Speaker 4: even more difficult to stay on this stage.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: One thing is to get there and another thing is

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Speaker 4: to stay there. So it's now I've got.

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Speaker 3: An other task. Yeah, I'm trying to complete it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, well, I think it's really for me. You've always

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Speaker 1: been one of my favorite players because you look like

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Speaker 1: a real athlete.

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Speaker 2: I've heard you're a very good soccer player. Everyone talks

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Speaker 2: about this.

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Speaker 3: Well, it depends on the level.

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Speaker 1: I mean, maybe you could have played for BARSA, but yeah,

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Speaker 1: you're probably on the turf field here.

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Speaker 2: One of the better tennis players.

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Speaker 3: Maybe, don't you think.

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Speaker 4: Maybe maybe it's also because not many girls likes.

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Speaker 3: To play football's yeah, maybe.

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Speaker 4: We can compete with probably yeah, yeah, or play for

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Speaker 4: the same team.

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Speaker 3: Probably I would prefer that.

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Speaker 1: I think that would be the most fun team ever.

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Speaker 2: I would buy tickets to that team.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean I would enjoy for sure playing like that.

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Speaker 4: Yeah yeah, I.

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Speaker 3: Mean I love football, not just to play, but to watch.

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Speaker 1: Well, you what I'm getting at is you're a real athlete,

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Speaker 1: like you can tell. So you play tennis, you play

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Speaker 1: like maybe it's a little bit more creative as somebody

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Speaker 1: who likes to take a result. As an athlete, I

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Speaker 1: don't have the most discipline on the court, and so

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Speaker 1: for me it's I watch you and I think it's myself.

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Speaker 1: She looks like she's having fun with the creativity. Does

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Speaker 1: it feel like that in your head?

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Speaker 2: Or maybe not so much?

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Speaker 4: It was more before I was more creative. In the

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Speaker 4: past few seasons, I've become more.

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Speaker 3: Disciplined player.

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Speaker 4: Because you know, we see the girls who are they're

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Speaker 4: bigger than me, I mean the sense of stronger, are

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Speaker 4: taller and stronger.

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Speaker 3: They can get much more free points than yeah, I

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Speaker 3: can have, So I mean I cannot just.

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Speaker 4: You know, loose few points, making some drop shots and

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Speaker 4: even not trying to go for a winner because it's just.

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Speaker 3: Then so I do that.

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Speaker 4: Plus the girls making winners and I'm not in the

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Speaker 4: best position, so I have to you know, I had

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Speaker 4: to change that a little bit and become more consistent player.

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Speaker 4: But of course there's a limit for everything. So now

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Speaker 4: I have again will become a bit more creative because

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Speaker 4: just with discipline, maybe it's also not enough. But as

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Speaker 4: I said, Raffa was saying that he has to improve

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Speaker 4: every time. If Raffa has to improve, of course.

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Speaker 2: Every one of us.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, so always always, and you feel it well, for example,

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Speaker 4: you go up up, yeah, and then you suddenly you

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Speaker 4: may maybe not start to go down, but stay on

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Speaker 4: the same spot.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, this is the moment when you have to think about.

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Speaker 4: Him, what you have to maybe not to maybe change

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Speaker 4: or maybe you just keeping focus on right.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: On one of our friends podcasts, then getting kept on

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Speaker 1: the cough said you have the best hands outside of

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Speaker 1: John McEnroe.

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Speaker 3: Did you know that?

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Speaker 2: No, I feel like that's a that's a complement like.

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Speaker 3: That, especially from me a guinea.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I felt like, oh ship, because he's pretty critical.

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Speaker 3: He's tough. Yeah, he's a tough guy. So yeah, I

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Speaker 3: get it. I take it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't take it too. That's that's what help.

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Speaker 2: So let's talk a little bit about the last year.

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Speaker 2: It was so inspiring to watch you come out.

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Speaker 1: I just have to say, as a person in the community,

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Speaker 1: it was really cool. And I know that you probably

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Speaker 1: had all sorts of fear and all sorts of complications

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Speaker 1: that came with that. But can you talk a little

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Speaker 1: bit about what has happened after talking about being opened?

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Speaker 2: You know, how's the last couple of months been for you?

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Speaker 1: It was July of last year that you gave that interview,

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Speaker 1: like the last six months.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, well, you know it was very complex interview.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I love you talked about a lot and then.

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Speaker 4: The thing's been saying. Yes, I've got some consequences for that,

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Speaker 4: of course, but I mean in general, I didn't regret

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Speaker 4: any seconds. Good for what I was saying and just

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Speaker 4: the best things what was happening inside of me.

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Speaker 3: And I mean in the I'm lucky that tennis is

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Speaker 3: quite very toleran.

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Speaker 1: I mean, one things that we talked about in the magazine,

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Speaker 1: so we make racket mega saying, we have podcasts and

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Speaker 1: all this stuff. And one thing that I'm very proud

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Speaker 1: of with tennis and I'm teaching my son and other

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Speaker 1: generations is tennis is not perfect, but it has often

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Speaker 1: been on the right side of history for inclusion. You know,

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Speaker 1: our first LGBT athletes were very prominent in tennis. We

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Speaker 1: have a good history and I and I have to imagine,

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Speaker 1: especially how dangerous being openly gay, openly by openly LGBTQ

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Speaker 1: is in Russia in particular. You, I hope it felt

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Speaker 1: like you had a family.

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Speaker 2: In tennis, and it feels like maybe it did a

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Speaker 2: little bit.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, sure, I mean, as I said, I've got just.

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Speaker 4: Of course, there was negativit for sure, maybe somewhere, but

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Speaker 4: I don't know.

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Speaker 3: Why didn't I didn't face it good. Yeah, I don't know.

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Speaker 3: I don't know why.

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Speaker 4: But if it's just the good things, the people they

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Speaker 4: supported me, I mean, the relationship with the people.

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Speaker 3: They didn't change, with the people, the close people to me. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: so that was the most important thing for me, because.

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Speaker 4: When you're in the closet, you I mean, you're scared

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Speaker 4: of the reaction, sure.

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Speaker 3: People, you you're.

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Speaker 4: Scared to lose the people you love, the people you

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Speaker 4: are a friend, because you never know how they're going

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Speaker 4: to react.

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Speaker 3: But I mean, in my case, I'm super lucky. I mean,

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Speaker 3: and you.

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Speaker 1: Also have a great partner who is also a very elite.

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Speaker 3: Athlete and probably better than well.

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Speaker 1: I was gonna say that must be a nice thing

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Speaker 1: to be traveling and with a person who can really

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Speaker 1: actually understand exactly what it is that you deal with

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Speaker 1: on a week two week basis, right, Is that a source.

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Speaker 4: Of Yeah, that's very important because I mean it's tough

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Speaker 4: because there are people who never did support the Yeah,

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Speaker 4: but it's okay, yeah, never did support They're not from

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Speaker 4: the let's see, not from this particular world. They just

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Speaker 4: it's normal that they don't understand some specific things. Yeah, no,

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Speaker 4: but teach them that they just don't know.

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Speaker 3: But yeah, I'm very lucking this way because not that.

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Speaker 4: FA mean she she she was I think most of

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Speaker 4: one of the most disciplined ever.

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Speaker 1: I feel like figure skating makes tennis look very relaxed.

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Speaker 2: Is that my impression?

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Speaker 1: Yeah?

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Speaker 4: Yeah, the price there is much higher as a mistake

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Speaker 4: as much higher. So yeah, she's actually the one who

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Speaker 4: is pushing me to drink what I means, yeah, you know,

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Speaker 4: make me more disciplined.

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Speaker 3: I mean I am quite disciplined, I must say, but

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Speaker 3: she will assume it to be even more. I think

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Speaker 3: in the gym she is working more than me still

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Speaker 3: and she's retired already. So yeah, if.

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Speaker 4: She can run more, probably she's a runner. I don't know,

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Speaker 4: maybe she wants to run away, so just.

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Speaker 2: In case, just in case, she's gonna happen.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, she's still great form. She always wants

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Speaker 4: to play tennis. She has opportunities.

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Speaker 2: Teaching her how to play talent my coach.

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Speaker 3: She's doing better than me.

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Speaker 1: I tried to teach my wife how to play tennis,

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Speaker 1: and it nearly maybe was added to a divorce.

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Speaker 2: So I was like, okay, well we'll go to tennis

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Speaker 2: camp together and you'll have your own coach.

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Speaker 3: I'm a support them from that side. That's why videos

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Speaker 3: making videos you can see Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, I

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Speaker 3: mean our.

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Speaker 4: Life is stuff in this way that we're traveling all

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Speaker 4: the time. I don't see her people like the family

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Speaker 4: and everything.

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Speaker 3: So we're lucky to have her around. That's you know.

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Speaker 4: Uh, it's just make I'm very happy, make it make

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Speaker 4: it better.

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Speaker 2: I'm very I'm very happy for you.

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Speaker 1: When you gave an interview to The New York Times,

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Speaker 1: you made the tour finals last year, like I said,

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Speaker 1: you'd break year, and it's so exciting to see as

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Speaker 1: somebody was watching for a long time. What you said

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Speaker 1: at the time, you hadn't been back home to Russia.

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Speaker 1: Is that still true? You've not been back home?

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: Last time I've been in Russia was in February last year,

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Speaker 4: So was this tournaments and Petersburg. So the last memories

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Speaker 4: of Russia wasn't actually great be there?

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Speaker 3: So yeah, so it was February twenty twenty two and since.

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Speaker 2: Then, Yeah, And any plans to go back anytime.

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Speaker 4: To No, Yeah, honestly know because first of all, this situation,

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Speaker 4: the war still goes on.

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Speaker 3: I mean the it's just yeah, I don't want to

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Speaker 3: I don't want to go there now.

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Speaker 4: Fair First, A second of all, it's very difficult, it's

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Speaker 4: not convenient. It's easier to kind.

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Speaker 3: Of the way.

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Speaker 4: To Russia right now, right, Yeah, plus the many things

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Speaker 4: I've been saying, right, it's just now, it's just not

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Speaker 4: the time to do it.

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Speaker 1: But you are based I know you're a resident of Dubai,

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Speaker 1: but you're mostly based in Barcelona.

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Speaker 4: No, no, opposite, Yeah, yeah, I'm in Dubai.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, practicing in Dubai and Barcelona is a place first

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Speaker 3: where we go when we when it's convenient. So it's yeah,

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Speaker 3: kind of a stuff because of my explosion. And he

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Speaker 3: was Yeah, he was there.

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Speaker 1: So I'm asking personally. I'm trying to get my wife

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Speaker 1: to move to Barcelona with me. That's where I studied.

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Speaker 1: It's a great place. I used to live there.

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Speaker 2: I have a tennis court.

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Speaker 3: I can talk to her.

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Speaker 2: She's very stubborn, she's very very really in New York.

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Speaker 3: In New York, Yeah, no, you have to move, I

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Speaker 3: think so.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, you cannot compare. I know that if

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Speaker 4: you're looking for something like relaxed, you know, like sunny, cheaper, cheaper.

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Speaker 3: Yes, see, just the.

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Speaker 2: Way I want my ocean.

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Speaker 1: I want to play the tennis court.

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Speaker 4: And yeah, I mean to leave maybe for business. New

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Speaker 4: York is much better, but to leave Barcelona it's the best.

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Speaker 3: It's the best way. Yeah, it's the best.

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Speaker 2: I love it so much.

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Speaker 1: That's why I wanted to ask you about it, just

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Speaker 1: because it's so wonderful. And also I'm going to tell

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Speaker 1: her that you said this, so now she has more.

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Speaker 1: But she's very stubborn and she works for the City

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Speaker 1: of New York. Yeah, so one day, maybe.

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Speaker 3: I guess, yeah, maybe. Yeah, it's difficult when you're working

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Speaker 3: some place and it's very difficult to change. But I

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Speaker 3: mean if.

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Speaker 4: Once you go on a distant job for example, or

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Speaker 4: that it's Yeah, I think to move to.

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Speaker 3: Europe, it's so much, it's a very good thing.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Well, I feel like for me, the openness of that

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Speaker 1: city is what's so inspiring.

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Speaker 2: I mean, New York is alually very.

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Speaker 1: Open, but personally I feel like they really encourage creativity

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Speaker 1: and I can imagine why you felt very comfortable there.

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Speaker 2: You want to spend a lot.

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Speaker 4: Of time there, you know, Yeah, the same I mean Italy, Yeah,

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Speaker 4: but it is very nice. But as a tourist maybe,

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Speaker 4: but to leave, I think it's Spain is better.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it's really great, but Dubai is more

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Speaker 1: where you're spending most of years. Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: And then in terms of your own sort of mental

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Speaker 1: you know, headspace, it seems like you're in a really

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Speaker 1: wonderful place, like it's really fun to watch you, uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, be you know, I don't want to say

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Speaker 1: becoming an adult, but I'm forty too, so I feel

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Speaker 1: like as an older person, I can say it's really

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Speaker 1: fun to watch you sort of evolve, and it seems

354
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Speaker 1: like you're playing with a freedom and a happiness that

355
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Speaker 1: is very evident. And so you know, how do you

356
00:16:24,560 --> 00:16:26,440
Speaker 1: how are you approaching this year? It seems like you're

357
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Speaker 1: you know, enjoying the moments, and it would you say

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Speaker 1: that that's kind of where your where your head is.

359
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Speaker 3: Uh, well, enjoying.

360
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Speaker 4: I mean there was a beginning of this season and

361
00:16:35,200 --> 00:16:38,600
Speaker 4: I mean, uh, speak with the coach. It's never easy

362
00:16:38,640 --> 00:16:42,440
Speaker 4: and all these things. Yeah, I was, it's struggling and

363
00:16:42,880 --> 00:16:44,840
Speaker 4: you know, it's never easy. We've been working us for

364
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Speaker 4: four years.

365
00:16:45,640 --> 00:16:48,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, and now I have to change it.

366
00:16:48,440 --> 00:16:50,080
Speaker 3: So, I mean you've got a habits, you.

367
00:16:50,120 --> 00:16:52,960
Speaker 4: Have everything, everything and everything, and then you have to

368
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Speaker 4: change it, you know, to get in touch with a

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Speaker 4: new person and everything.

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Speaker 3: So but everything's happening seven for better.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: So now I feel good and you know, yeah, enjoying,

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Speaker 3: enjoying my time here, enjoying. You know, I realized it.

374
00:17:14,000 --> 00:17:16,800
Speaker 3: I'm so likely to do that thing, which most of

375
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Speaker 3: the times I love.

376
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Speaker 2: No, anybody who plays tennis doesn't love it every single.

377
00:17:21,040 --> 00:17:24,159
Speaker 3: Day, and for sure, if it's fifty to fifty, very good.

378
00:17:24,240 --> 00:17:26,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, yesterday I played terrible. I hated it. This morning

379
00:17:26,240 --> 00:17:28,320
Speaker 2: I played very well. And I loved it. So you know,

380
00:17:28,359 --> 00:17:28,840
Speaker 2: every day.

381
00:17:28,760 --> 00:17:30,720
Speaker 4: It's a different experience on the word. I mean, I'm

382
00:17:30,720 --> 00:17:34,679
Speaker 4: surrounded by great people and it's the most important and

383
00:17:35,800 --> 00:17:39,720
Speaker 4: just you know, you always have to compare, like where

384
00:17:39,760 --> 00:17:45,400
Speaker 4: you are and what's going on in my country for example,

385
00:17:46,160 --> 00:17:47,840
Speaker 4: like yeah.

386
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Speaker 1: Yeah, well there's one more thing that I want to

387
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Speaker 1: ask you, just because we happen to be in the

388
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Speaker 1: B and P tent and they are lucky up to

389
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Speaker 1: sort of I think put a lot of resources towards tennis.

390
00:17:56,800 --> 00:17:57,200
Speaker 3: This is the.

391
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Speaker 2: Fiftieth year of the.

392
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Speaker 1: Wtare do you think you know we talked a little

393
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Speaker 1: bit about inclusivity. We talked about the fact that tennis

394
00:18:04,240 --> 00:18:06,679
Speaker 1: is more often in.

395
00:18:06,520 --> 00:18:08,159
Speaker 2: The good rather than the bad.

396
00:18:08,280 --> 00:18:10,879
Speaker 1: Where do you think, as somebody who obviously is a

397
00:18:10,960 --> 00:18:15,200
Speaker 1: very thoughtful person, tennis, Uh, sort of could could improve

398
00:18:15,240 --> 00:18:17,160
Speaker 1: a little bit more in terms of you know, maybe

399
00:18:17,160 --> 00:18:19,440
Speaker 1: some of the gender parody stuff do Where do you think?

400
00:18:19,480 --> 00:18:21,120
Speaker 2: How do you think we're doing? And where can we go?

401
00:18:23,760 --> 00:18:26,840
Speaker 4: Well, we we always talk in the players lounges.

402
00:18:27,080 --> 00:18:28,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, we always have the same topics.

403
00:18:29,600 --> 00:18:38,400
Speaker 4: Uh, of course, now it's the main topic is the.

404
00:18:35,560 --> 00:18:39,320
Speaker 3: The same pay? Yeah, yeah, th men's of course I mean,

405
00:18:39,440 --> 00:18:42,560
Speaker 3: I'm not stupid. I know that the men's de generate.

406
00:18:42,680 --> 00:18:45,240
Speaker 4: For example, the five hundred to something, they gener more money,

407
00:18:46,040 --> 00:18:48,200
Speaker 4: they get more money. But I think that we don't

408
00:18:49,080 --> 00:18:51,879
Speaker 4: we don't get enough on the tournaments like two hundred

409
00:18:51,920 --> 00:18:55,199
Speaker 4: and fifties. We don't have enough five hundreds. I mean,

410
00:18:55,240 --> 00:18:57,360
Speaker 4: we don't have enough quantity of the tournaments. I mean,

411
00:18:57,680 --> 00:19:00,360
Speaker 4: I don't think it's okay that we have a five

412
00:19:00,400 --> 00:19:03,040
Speaker 4: hundred in Doha and the cut off it's twenty two.

413
00:19:03,480 --> 00:19:07,240
Speaker 4: And I mean it's like a World Cup and yeah,

414
00:19:07,320 --> 00:19:11,600
Speaker 4: the winner gets you know, a third of what?

415
00:19:11,880 --> 00:19:14,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, and then yeah, and then you go.

416
00:19:14,160 --> 00:19:18,920
Speaker 4: Same to playing Dubai's the same players, and then you go, okay,

417
00:19:19,400 --> 00:19:20,040
Speaker 4: it's a big jow.

418
00:19:20,080 --> 00:19:23,800
Speaker 3: You go Madrid, it's the same players. So why is that.

419
00:19:24,680 --> 00:19:28,880
Speaker 4: It's more difficult to win Doha, Yeah, for example than

420
00:19:29,960 --> 00:19:33,880
Speaker 4: the Madrid Dubai for example, and Dubai get buy Yeah,

421
00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:36,720
Speaker 4: you get eight buys. Yeah, you can get the first

422
00:19:36,800 --> 00:19:40,360
Speaker 4: round someone I don't know, I don't want to say,

423
00:19:40,640 --> 00:19:44,680
Speaker 4: but not the twenty because for example, in Doha.

424
00:19:45,760 --> 00:19:50,439
Speaker 3: I was as a eighth ranked, I was fifth seeded.

425
00:19:50,720 --> 00:19:55,320
Speaker 4: Yeah, so first round you could get number fifteen who

426
00:19:55,320 --> 00:19:55,880
Speaker 4: was unseated.

427
00:19:56,000 --> 00:19:57,720
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, who's a tough.

428
00:19:57,880 --> 00:19:59,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a final.

429
00:19:59,800 --> 00:20:02,320
Speaker 3: Yeah. In Dubai, you see the drove Barbara.

430
00:20:02,440 --> 00:20:06,879
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, I mean a Grand Slam, you get easier.

431
00:20:07,320 --> 00:20:11,440
Speaker 1: That's interesting, that's a good Yeah.

432
00:20:11,680 --> 00:20:15,240
Speaker 4: Honestly, I think Okay, now we have like thousands, thousand dollars,

433
00:20:15,800 --> 00:20:18,880
Speaker 4: very easy for fans. Yeah, for us, it's still struggle

434
00:20:18,920 --> 00:20:23,800
Speaker 4: because not all of them are the same.

435
00:20:23,920 --> 00:20:27,720
Speaker 3: Yeah. We have Indian wells, Miami, Madrid, uh.

436
00:20:28,040 --> 00:20:28,760
Speaker 2: Used to Beijing.

437
00:20:30,119 --> 00:20:33,960
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's like a masters yeah for mats. And then

438
00:20:33,960 --> 00:20:36,879
Speaker 4: we have thousands which are lower. Yeah, people don't know

439
00:20:36,920 --> 00:20:42,359
Speaker 4: about it, but with there is three three and a

440
00:20:42,400 --> 00:20:43,960
Speaker 4: half times less price money.

441
00:20:44,040 --> 00:20:46,520
Speaker 2: It's crazy. Cincinnati is one of them.

442
00:20:46,760 --> 00:20:53,119
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's a Cincinnati Rome Dubai. Yeah, all these tournaments

443
00:20:54,359 --> 00:20:55,480
Speaker 4: and it's the same players.

444
00:20:55,640 --> 00:20:56,320
Speaker 2: It's the same players.

445
00:20:56,359 --> 00:20:59,320
Speaker 1: But also the joint events, the men's and womens together

446
00:20:59,400 --> 00:21:01,920
Speaker 1: make the most. That's what fans want. I want the

447
00:21:02,320 --> 00:21:04,760
Speaker 1: women's playing together. That's why these tournaments are I think

448
00:21:04,760 --> 00:21:07,440
Speaker 1: are the best ones because they're there. You can see

449
00:21:07,480 --> 00:21:09,919
Speaker 1: all the players and they're playing together, and it's a

450
00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:12,480
Speaker 1: cool thing in tennis that you can see men and

451
00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:14,640
Speaker 1: women on the same court. You can't see that at

452
00:21:14,640 --> 00:21:18,159
Speaker 1: a you know, at a single single generalman to me,

453
00:21:18,680 --> 00:21:19,320
Speaker 1: so it's a.

454
00:21:19,359 --> 00:21:21,640
Speaker 3: Bit like I don't see the logic why.

455
00:21:21,840 --> 00:21:25,560
Speaker 4: For example, that was Miami Madrid. Yeah, so they are

456
00:21:25,600 --> 00:21:29,959
Speaker 4: able to generate the same prize money in the combined tournament, right,

457
00:21:30,359 --> 00:21:32,320
Speaker 4: and for example Cincinnati.

458
00:21:32,840 --> 00:21:37,760
Speaker 3: Rome, Yeah, and the couple of others, Yeah they're not.

459
00:21:38,080 --> 00:21:41,000
Speaker 4: I'm pretty sure they're able to. But just I don't

460
00:21:41,040 --> 00:21:42,440
Speaker 4: know where it's like to use the problem.

461
00:21:42,600 --> 00:21:42,840
Speaker 2: Right.

462
00:21:43,040 --> 00:21:45,760
Speaker 1: Well, I think we maybe need a new Commissioner of Tennis,

463
00:21:45,840 --> 00:21:47,399
Speaker 1: and I maybe think it should.

464
00:21:47,119 --> 00:21:51,640
Speaker 4: Be you know, I'm not a you are.

465
00:21:52,800 --> 00:21:55,360
Speaker 1: I think you've probably last year that you're very very

466
00:21:55,480 --> 00:21:56,119
Speaker 1: unspoken and.

467
00:21:56,600 --> 00:21:58,440
Speaker 3: Yeah, you see, I'm good talking about.

468
00:21:59,359 --> 00:22:00,879
Speaker 1: Well, then you get the other people to just do

469
00:22:00,920 --> 00:22:01,680
Speaker 1: all the actual work.

470
00:22:01,760 --> 00:22:04,000
Speaker 3: Yeah. Maybe I can come up with the ideas, but

471
00:22:04,400 --> 00:22:06,719
Speaker 3: you do that idea. Yeah, but as we see, now

472
00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:07,199
Speaker 3: we've got it.

473
00:22:07,840 --> 00:22:14,760
Speaker 4: I mean two sponsors, yeah, yeah, better yeah, CBC.

474
00:22:13,840 --> 00:22:17,280
Speaker 3: CBC, Yeah, Marilyn. Then yesterday I.

475
00:22:17,200 --> 00:22:19,520
Speaker 4: Think another new comes up with a more than three

476
00:22:19,600 --> 00:22:20,240
Speaker 4: hundred million.

477
00:22:20,359 --> 00:22:22,280
Speaker 3: I want to see where this money goes.

478
00:22:22,600 --> 00:22:23,920
Speaker 2: I want to see where this kind of goes too.

479
00:22:23,960 --> 00:22:28,760
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, we have to come up with this question.

480
00:22:28,840 --> 00:22:32,600
Speaker 4: The problem is that it's too many players and not

481
00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:34,960
Speaker 4: of and not which is normal.

482
00:22:35,080 --> 00:22:37,040
Speaker 3: Not all of us are united.

483
00:22:36,840 --> 00:22:41,640
Speaker 4: Right, So yeah, if it would be like Team Yeah,

484
00:22:41,880 --> 00:22:46,400
Speaker 4: I mean Team Nobody would be much easier. But yeah,

485
00:22:46,880 --> 00:22:49,520
Speaker 4: you know, it's always the same thing. I don't call

486
00:22:49,640 --> 00:22:52,600
Speaker 4: anything if ten percent will not do it.

487
00:22:52,920 --> 00:22:57,440
Speaker 1: I'm optimistic that a younger generation of athletes understands that

488
00:22:57,520 --> 00:22:59,960
Speaker 1: the sport is stronger when people are together, and it's

489
00:23:00,440 --> 00:23:03,320
Speaker 1: is I hope that's true, but you know, maybe I'm wrong,

490
00:23:03,600 --> 00:23:05,400
Speaker 1: But it does seem like the you know.

491
00:23:05,359 --> 00:23:08,280
Speaker 2: There's a little bit more cohesiveness between. Maybe that's not

492
00:23:08,320 --> 00:23:10,399
Speaker 2: what you see in the locker room from the outside.

493
00:23:10,400 --> 00:23:11,640
Speaker 2: It looks like it's getting better.

494
00:23:12,760 --> 00:23:16,960
Speaker 3: From the outside. Yet maybe, yeah, for sure more.

495
00:23:16,800 --> 00:23:20,560
Speaker 4: Than before when right, some of the players were not

496
00:23:20,640 --> 00:23:23,120
Speaker 4: even practicing, you know with the other players.

497
00:23:23,160 --> 00:23:28,159
Speaker 3: Before. Now it's different. We're all, you know, we're more

498
00:23:28,160 --> 00:23:29,040
Speaker 3: more close now.

499
00:23:32,040 --> 00:23:36,080
Speaker 4: But it's it's complicated also, I mean after COVID's I

500
00:23:36,160 --> 00:23:39,840
Speaker 4: understand that it's not easy. The many companies they're struggling,

501
00:23:39,920 --> 00:23:43,240
Speaker 4: the associations they're struggling. But still now we are on

502
00:23:43,280 --> 00:23:48,080
Speaker 4: the I think, on the way up. So maybe that's

503
00:23:48,119 --> 00:23:50,920
Speaker 4: the time to start to talk about.

504
00:23:52,680 --> 00:23:53,600
Speaker 3: Higher pay again.

505
00:23:54,760 --> 00:23:57,800
Speaker 1: Well, I mean the world I see is where tennis

506
00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:02,320
Speaker 1: has been undervalued and we have so much. It's the

507
00:24:02,359 --> 00:24:03,879
Speaker 1: third most popular global sport.

508
00:24:04,119 --> 00:24:09,000
Speaker 3: It should be what was talking about people wat Yeah.

509
00:24:08,960 --> 00:24:12,919
Speaker 1: So for me, there's there's it's an under optimized entity.

510
00:24:13,119 --> 00:24:15,280
Speaker 1: And I think especially for women's sports, now that we

511
00:24:15,400 --> 00:24:18,560
Speaker 1: know how much value there is in women's football, how

512
00:24:18,640 --> 00:24:20,600
Speaker 1: much value there is in women's basketball, how much value

513
00:24:20,640 --> 00:24:24,000
Speaker 1: there is in women as athletes. To me, it can't

514
00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:27,960
Speaker 1: stay unequal forever. And I hope that. And it sounds

515
00:24:27,960 --> 00:24:30,520
Speaker 1: like you know, you're you're definitely not shy about sharing

516
00:24:30,520 --> 00:24:32,520
Speaker 1: your thoughts, which I think is awesome. That's why I

517
00:24:32,520 --> 00:24:34,040
Speaker 1: wanted to talk to you and not somebody else.

518
00:24:35,359 --> 00:24:41,959
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, sure, okay, I'm not gonna compare the

519
00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:44,840
Speaker 4: best football player in the world may see with the

520
00:24:44,840 --> 00:24:46,560
Speaker 4: best women's football player with the.

521
00:24:46,600 --> 00:24:49,680
Speaker 3: Playing I mean, it's yeah, it makes no sense. I'm

522
00:24:49,680 --> 00:24:51,400
Speaker 3: not commoration.

523
00:24:51,560 --> 00:24:55,600
Speaker 4: But I mean in thingus with the price money, I

524
00:24:55,600 --> 00:24:58,919
Speaker 4: think it's easier for sure. It's okay, Yeah, the constructs,

525
00:24:59,000 --> 00:25:01,120
Speaker 4: it's we don't talk about contracts.

526
00:25:01,160 --> 00:25:02,800
Speaker 3: The company decide how much they want to pay it

527
00:25:03,040 --> 00:25:04,880
Speaker 3: and then just yeah, it's.

528
00:25:04,840 --> 00:25:07,680
Speaker 4: Also a lot depends on generationality and all these things,

529
00:25:07,680 --> 00:25:08,760
Speaker 4: so that's different things.

530
00:25:08,920 --> 00:25:09,120
Speaker 3: Yeah.

531
00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:11,800
Speaker 1: But also you can't look at the numbers the Australian

532
00:25:11,840 --> 00:25:15,240
Speaker 1: Open Women's final, yeah, and the ratings and the viewership

533
00:25:15,400 --> 00:25:15,680
Speaker 1: you know.

534
00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:20,120
Speaker 3: Also use Open, I say US finals was higher.

535
00:25:20,760 --> 00:25:26,000
Speaker 4: So okay, for sure some of the events, yes, men's generate.

536
00:25:25,640 --> 00:25:27,520
Speaker 1: More, maybe them.

537
00:25:27,280 --> 00:25:33,200
Speaker 4: Yeah, but some of the competition generate movements, they generate more.

538
00:25:33,280 --> 00:25:38,320
Speaker 4: So I think at the end, I hope it will

539
00:25:38,800 --> 00:25:42,000
Speaker 4: come up to equal medium equal pay.

540
00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:46,119
Speaker 3: I mean, w say.

541
00:25:46,040 --> 00:25:48,360
Speaker 4: They're saying that they're trying to do their best, and

542
00:25:48,400 --> 00:25:51,480
Speaker 4: the of course going the direction and they want to

543
00:25:51,600 --> 00:25:57,879
Speaker 4: make equal pay on thousands by twenty twenty seven.

544
00:25:58,080 --> 00:25:59,879
Speaker 2: That's not soon, it's not.

545
00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:06,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, I hope. I'm still going. So yeah, I don't

546
00:26:06,640 --> 00:26:07,040
Speaker 3: know what to.

547
00:26:07,080 --> 00:26:10,280
Speaker 4: Say, because of course I don't know many many things

548
00:26:10,320 --> 00:26:11,960
Speaker 4: I don't know in the business.

549
00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:13,119
Speaker 3: I'm not the business woman.

550
00:26:13,920 --> 00:26:14,240
Speaker 4: I don't know.

551
00:26:14,280 --> 00:26:16,359
Speaker 1: You're making a pretty good case. But yeah, yeah, but

552
00:26:17,520 --> 00:26:19,840
Speaker 1: uh we'll tell you maybe.

553
00:26:19,680 --> 00:26:20,320
Speaker 3: They could do better.

554
00:26:20,440 --> 00:26:23,120
Speaker 1: Maybe Listen, I think to me, the idea that we're

555
00:26:23,160 --> 00:26:27,520
Speaker 1: talking about this and that we have dialogues and people

556
00:26:27,560 --> 00:26:28,480
Speaker 1: are paying attention to it.

557
00:26:28,560 --> 00:26:31,080
Speaker 2: I hope is a good sign. I think we only

558
00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:32,280
Speaker 2: have another second with you, So I.

559
00:26:32,320 --> 00:26:34,840
Speaker 1: Just want to say everybody who listens to our podcast

560
00:26:34,920 --> 00:26:36,200
Speaker 1: has been asking us to have you on.

561
00:26:36,560 --> 00:26:37,720
Speaker 3: Thank you so much for coming on.

562
00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:40,240
Speaker 1: Maybe we can continue the conversation with Charleston. Yeah. Sure,

563
00:26:40,280 --> 00:26:42,080
Speaker 1: we are rooting for you. We're so happy to have you.

564
00:26:42,240 --> 00:26:44,760
Speaker 1: Thank you so much again, and also thanks for being you.

565
00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:47,639
Speaker 1: You're really fun to root for off the court but

566
00:26:47,800 --> 00:26:48,000
Speaker 1: also

567
00:26:48,080 --> 00:26:51,760
Speaker 2: On So thanks do, thank you, Thanks super nice, amazing,

568
00:26:51,920 --> 00:26:52,159
Speaker 2: Thank you.