Speaker 1: Hi.
Speaker 2: I'm Laura Vanderkamp. I'm a mother of five, an author, journalist,
Speaker 2: and speaker.
Speaker 3: And I'm Sarah hart Hunger, a mother of three, practicing physician,
Speaker 3: writer and course creator. We are two working parents who
Speaker 3: love our careers and our families.
Speaker 2: Welcome to best of both worlds. Here we talk about
Speaker 2: how real women manage work, family, and time for fun.
Speaker 2: From figuring out childcare to mapping out long.
Speaker 1: Term career goals.
Speaker 2: We want you to get the most out of life.
Speaker 1: Welcome to best of both worlds. This is Laura.
Speaker 2: This episode is airing toward the end of December twenty
Speaker 2: twenty four. This is going to be our annual year
Speaker 2: and review episode. Sarah and I are going to be
Speaker 2: reviewing twenty twenty four. It's been quite a year, of course, Sarah.
Speaker 2: Where do you as.
Speaker 1: Your review all this?
Speaker 2: Like, what were you looking back on to think about
Speaker 2: how twenty twenty four went for you?
Speaker 3: Yeah? So, Actually, I mean the thing that helped me
Speaker 3: the most was looking at our show notes from last
Speaker 3: year as well as listening to our episode, which I
Speaker 3: did on my run this morning. So that helped me
Speaker 3: to kind of know what I set out to do
Speaker 3: in terms of goals, and then I also went ahead
Speaker 3: and went to my photos on my phone and scrolled
Speaker 3: through to see the various travel and kind of highlights. Interestingly,
Speaker 3: the Apple Photos app now pulls up trips and like
Speaker 3: gives you these cute little vignette photos and like shows
Speaker 3: where you've been. It's not perfect, like it did not
Speaker 3: somehow know that I went to Philadelphia and that that
Speaker 3: was a trip. I mean, that was like, that was legit.
Speaker 1: It was a trip.
Speaker 3: Just because I saw Laura and had to record an
Speaker 3: episode doesn't mean that it was you know, work or
Speaker 3: something anyway. So it's not one hundred percent, but that
Speaker 3: was a fun way to just kind of scroll through.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, that was really awesome in twenty twenty four.
Speaker 2: Yeah, certainly looking through photo highlights people put on Instagram obviously,
Speaker 2: and look back through your recent posts there, just sort
Speaker 2: of thinking back, looking at the calendar. I listen to
Speaker 2: old episodes as well, look through our show notes for that.
Speaker 2: But it's good to spend a little bit of time reflecting.
Speaker 1: On the end of the year, right.
Speaker 2: I Mean we can sometimes we obviously get excited about
Speaker 2: setting our goals for the new year, but you know,
Speaker 2: we want to take a little bit of time to
Speaker 2: pause and reflect on what happened, what didn't happen, or
Speaker 2: what went right what went wrong. I mean, that's the
Speaker 2: whole thing with reflection.
Speaker 3: Season, right, And when do you do that, Laura.
Speaker 1: I mean basically to do this episode.
Speaker 2: Although you know, in the course of the year, I've
Speaker 2: certainly as I had set goals and then check them
Speaker 2: off or otherwise dealt with them, it was certainly in
Speaker 2: the back of my mind that, oh, yes, this is
Speaker 2: something I'm doing, And you know, you try to savor
Speaker 2: things as they're happening too. I mean, some things that
Speaker 2: happen in the course of the year aren't things that
Speaker 2: are planned ahead of time, and they aren't goals that
Speaker 2: you set for the year, and you want to enjoy
Speaker 2: those as well as they're happening and leave space in
Speaker 2: the course of the year for good things to happen.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, I will say during Best Laid Plans Live was
Speaker 3: the first time I formalized like kind of thinking through
Speaker 3: the year and what had gone well and what had
Speaker 3: gone poorly. The only difficulty is that it's in early November,
Speaker 3: so the year just doesn't quite feel like finished yet.
Speaker 3: But at the same time, I do think, just some
Speaker 3: sort of formalized ritual where you're really either journaling or
Speaker 3: thinking through it is just so helpful to me well.
Speaker 2: And the upside though of doing it in early November
Speaker 2: as you reflect back on the year, is if there's
Speaker 2: something you do still want to do, you have seven
Speaker 2: weeks to do it. And a great many things can
Speaker 2: in fact be accomplished in seven weeks, particularly if they
Speaker 2: are or specific goals of like something you needed to
Speaker 2: obtain or a short project you needed to do, or
Speaker 2: anything like that. I mean, you know, it would be
Speaker 2: quite doable to do many of those things before the
Speaker 2: end of the year if it still mattered to you.
Speaker 3: Yes, and we won't give any spoilers, but some of
Speaker 3: us did complete things towards the end of the year.
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly exactly. But that's we'll get there. We will
Speaker 2: get there. So highlights, let's start with our highlights of
Speaker 2: twenty twenty four. I mean, Sarah, what would you put
Speaker 2: on a highlight reel of the year?
Speaker 3: Yeah, there were a lot of highlights, and a lot
Speaker 3: of them do kind of fit into the goals category
Speaker 3: we're going to talk about. I mean, getting a little deep.
Speaker 3: It can be really deeply satisfying to meet goals that
Speaker 3: you've had for a long time, and thus I think
Speaker 3: it makes sense that those would end up as highlights,
Speaker 3: but kind of steering away from like the running and
Speaker 3: the career accomplishment type stuff. I mean, we just had
Speaker 3: some really wonderful, like family experiences, concerts. It was a
Speaker 3: most amazing concert year with the kids as well. So
Speaker 3: all of us went to Olivia Rodrigo together in August,
Speaker 3: which was definitely a highlight and extremely memorable. Annabelle and
Speaker 3: I saw Taylor Swift in October which was a highlight.
Speaker 3: My husband and I saw Mitzki and Ben Fold. So
Speaker 3: like just going to shows and like having that be
Speaker 3: a regular, like fairly regular thing was awesome. Also just
Speaker 3: celebrating things, so my parents had their fiftieth anniversary, my
Speaker 3: husband had his fiftieth birthday. I felt like we did
Speaker 3: our celebrations justice in twenty twenty four and that was wonderful.
Speaker 3: We had one fantastic family trip and one okay family trip.
Speaker 3: The wonderful one was in Montana going skiing, which I
Speaker 3: mentioned on the last episode. That's one of our favorite
Speaker 3: favorite things to do, so that was great. And then
Speaker 3: the Seattle trip. The Olivia part was great, so that
Speaker 3: was sort of a highlight. Lauren and I had a
Speaker 3: lovely trip to Naples working and reflecting and best laid
Speaker 3: plans live is always a highlight for me as well,
Speaker 3: so that was tons of fun. And then I'll throw
Speaker 3: in a random serendipitous one, which was that like three
Speaker 3: hours before the event was scheduled to happen, I was like,
Speaker 3: Simone Biles is here and we're gonna go see her,
Speaker 3: and I took both girls like there was a surprise,
Speaker 3: like they didn't really know we were going until right
Speaker 3: before I took both girls and we we saw the
Speaker 3: Goat Tour and it was super awesome. And just after
Speaker 3: enjoying the Olympics, getting to see those gymnasts like actually
Speaker 3: perform on a stage was it was awesome. So I
Speaker 3: would say it belonged to my highlight reel.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, well certainly if I'm thinking of experiences in
Speaker 2: the course of the year, I mean going to Spain
Speaker 2: over spring break with my two older boys. We had
Speaker 2: a ton of fun there. I took Ruth to Paris
Speaker 2: in May with a couple of friends of mine and
Speaker 2: their daughters and we all saw Taylor Swift there, which
Speaker 2: was I love Paris in springtime. I was standing to
Speaker 2: watch the Taylor Swift concert was maybe less of a
Speaker 2: highlight for reasons we can discuss later. But I saw
Speaker 2: Olivia Rodrigo with Ruth as well, and that was excellent.
Speaker 2: We had seats for that, So being able to sit
Speaker 2: at age forty five is a bonus for a concert,
Speaker 2: you know.
Speaker 1: I had one like really good.
Speaker 2: Nine mile run on the boardwalk this summer that I
Speaker 2: would probably put on my highlight reel. I saw the
Speaker 2: Northern Lights in Portland, Maine when I was there for
Speaker 2: you know what was a work trip but was also
Speaker 2: a fun trip as well, kind of like BLP Live.
Speaker 1: It's a combination of work and fun.
Speaker 2: Just you know, like seeing some of the kid victories
Speaker 2: over the course of the year and celebrating that with them.
Speaker 2: I mean, in particular, we just had a really good
Speaker 2: be vague here, but I have five children. I had
Speaker 2: a really good parent teacher conference for one of my kids.
Speaker 2: That has not always been our historic experience, but the
Speaker 2: teacher was saying how wonderful this child was, and I
Speaker 2: was excited about that. So yeah, there's been some real
Speaker 2: wins in terms of that, there's also been some low lights.
Speaker 2: I mean, Sarah, we don't want to be our all
Speaker 2: social media polished up fague here. We like to keep
Speaker 2: it at least somewhat real. What were some low lights
Speaker 2: of the year for you?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 3: I added this category because I don't think we included
Speaker 3: it last year. But it's not really fair to be
Speaker 3: like I won this and this was awesome and like
Speaker 3: nothing bad ever happens, because it does. That said, of course,
Speaker 3: low lights have to be more vague because often they
Speaker 3: involve other people, and no one wants their low lights
Speaker 3: broadcast on a podcast, So we're gonna vague pod. But
Speaker 3: just bear with us a little bit because I still
Speaker 3: think it's important to include. So, first of all, multiple
Speaker 3: people that are close to me are going through really crappy,
Speaker 3: hard things, different things, and that's hard. It's hard to
Speaker 3: know how to support people. It's just sad and things
Speaker 3: are ongoing. So that's no Number one. Number two was
Speaker 3: a low light slash maybe turned into a brighter kind
Speaker 3: of silver lining, which is that we just had some
Speaker 3: kid challenges. I will say, though, those we seem to
Speaker 3: have got, like the humps were in twenty twenty four,
Speaker 3: and they were real, and I think we're like making
Speaker 3: a lot of headway on them. So in many ways,
Speaker 3: I feel really good about having navigated that. And then finally,
Speaker 3: you guys know, I you know, I still will never
Speaker 3: really be able to give us specifics, but August and
Speaker 3: September ward bad bad, bad bad, and just low point
Speaker 3: mood wise, stress stuff going on. Didn't really get much
Speaker 3: done during that time period, and then I felt like
Speaker 3: it took me like a month to like recover from that.
Speaker 3: And so yeah, this year was like kind of a
Speaker 3: bit of a roller coaster where I feel like it
Speaker 3: started hard, got better, then like a really low point,
Speaker 3: and then like like ended on a high note for
Speaker 3: the most part.
Speaker 1: For the most part. Yeah, yeah, well, I mean my
Speaker 1: sort of low lights.
Speaker 2: I mean, it was kind of my year of chronic
Speaker 2: pain that longtime listeners know. I had this back and
Speaker 2: leg nerve pain episode in January that was really zero
Speaker 2: fun whatsoever. I could not walk for about a week,
Speaker 2: which is really a fun way to go through life.
Speaker 2: But then, of course the recovery from that has been
Speaker 2: long and fitfull and not straightforward. That the immediate nerve
Speaker 2: pain stuff was calmed in about two weeks with steroids
Speaker 2: and painkillers and stuff like that. But I was just
Speaker 2: clearly like not in great shape for much of the
Speaker 2: year with that, I mean, like unable to empty the
Speaker 2: dishwasher without it being excessively painful. So something like going
Speaker 2: to see Taylor Swift in Paris. You know, it was
Speaker 2: wonderful to see Paris, but standing at a concert for
Speaker 2: five hours was excruciating. And but you know, it's like
Speaker 2: I had to, you know, live my life with that
Speaker 2: because I didn't want to not live my life, or
Speaker 2: something like going to Disney like five weeks after the
Speaker 2: back pain episode. It was really a tough trip, and
Speaker 2: so much about the trip was like could have been great.
Speaker 2: I mean, our travel agent was wonderful. We had everything booked,
Speaker 2: like the rides, the dinners at the places. The kids
Speaker 2: were not perfectly well behaved. We'd thought it would be
Speaker 2: great because we'd gone when Alex was the age, Henri
Speaker 2: is and so, and you know, that had been a
Speaker 2: great trip.
Speaker 1: But I don't know if it's like having one more
Speaker 1: kid or it was like the weather.
Speaker 2: It was rainy a big chunk of the time, so
Speaker 2: that was miserable. And then I was in a lot
Speaker 2: of pain walking around the parks for you know, twelve
Speaker 2: hours a day. So that was you know, stuff like
Speaker 2: that was pretty low point, even though we had some
Speaker 2: fun moments on that trip too. But I did manage
Speaker 2: to run a half marathon in October.
Speaker 1: I have.
Speaker 2: Like it just is a slow process. I do think
Speaker 2: my back is doing better. I can empty the dishwasher now,
Speaker 2: which is I don't know that I want to be
Speaker 2: emptying the dishwasher, but I can at least do it,
Speaker 2: and you know.
Speaker 1: So we'll see. Stay tuned on that.
Speaker 2: Cautiously optimistic, but yeah, not a fun experience. Would not
Speaker 2: want to wish that on anyone.
Speaker 3: Sounds like you're definitely ending the year in a better
Speaker 3: place with it than you started.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I'd like to think so, and not through
Speaker 2: anything that I could pinpoint of what it was.
Speaker 1: So that's I wish I could, because.
Speaker 2: Then I would have done it earlier or would know
Speaker 2: to do it again, you know.
Speaker 1: But well, life sometimes you just have to be patient.
Speaker 3: All right, Well, I'm wishing you the least pain containing
Speaker 3: year possible in twenty twenty five.
Speaker 2: All right, We're going to take a quick ad break
Speaker 2: and then we will be back to talk. About how
Speaker 2: some of our goals played out.
Speaker 1: Well, we are back.
Speaker 2: This is our twenty twenty four year in review episode,
Speaker 2: so we talked about some of our highlights and our
Speaker 2: low lights. But one of the things we always do
Speaker 2: is we set our goals for the upcoming year, and
Speaker 2: then we need to report back on how it went.
Speaker 2: So using last year's goals episode as a guide, we're
Speaker 2: going to talk through some of the categories. So, Sarah,
Speaker 2: why don't we start with your personal goals and what
Speaker 2: you managed to pull off?
Speaker 3: Oh my god, I had a lot of these. I'm
Speaker 3: gonna not delve deeply into all of them, but we
Speaker 3: will start with running. I wanted to make it a
Speaker 3: I wrote train with intent to BQ, continue to work
Speaker 3: with coach, and I'm reading for my actual show notes
Speaker 3: for last year. Would also like a new half marathon
Speaker 3: and five kPr. Well, yay, I did all of that,
Speaker 3: like all of it, five kPr, half marathon PR in
Speaker 3: February of twenty twenty four. I did qualify for the
Speaker 3: Boston Marathon running Bay Shore in May of twenty twenty four,
Speaker 3: and I worked with the coach to do that. So
Speaker 3: it was like, honestly, I feel very lucky I mentioned
Speaker 3: last year or something like or I'll get injured and
Speaker 3: none of it will happen, and I have to say, like,
Speaker 3: this is I'm jinxing myself again. But like the longest
Speaker 3: stretch of injury free running I may have had ever
Speaker 3: and I don't know. I can't take any credit. I
Speaker 3: have not been strength training, which I'll get to in
Speaker 3: just a second. But I do think the shoe tech
Speaker 3: is a lot better, and I think I'm better off
Speaker 3: running not on hills, and I live in Florida, so
Speaker 3: it's better than my old North Carolina running that was
Speaker 3: all over the place. So yeah, super super happy with
Speaker 3: my running year. I did have a goal to strength
Speaker 3: train twice a week. I mean I did that for
Speaker 3: like probably fifteen weeks out of the fifty two maybe,
Speaker 3: so I would say no. I wanted to go to
Speaker 3: a yoga class in person to try it out, and
Speaker 3: I went once and I recognized it was nice, but
Speaker 3: just like not efficient enough for my lifestyle, so not
Speaker 3: something I wanted to continue. But that's okay, I would
Speaker 3: say check, because my goal was.
Speaker 1: To do it once.
Speaker 3: I wanted to read every day and record the pages
Speaker 3: read and then also challenge myself sometimes with like harder
Speaker 3: nonfiction books. I did not do that at all. I mean,
Speaker 3: I just read what it seemed good. I could read
Speaker 3: some more academic like nonfiction, like there were a couple,
Speaker 3: and I definitely read some literary fiction. I read pretty
Speaker 3: steadily until I had all that stress in August and September,
Speaker 3: and then I just fell off a cliff completely and
Speaker 3: then I haven't really gotten back on yet, I guess.
Speaker 3: But I did read forty books, so it's not like
Speaker 3: I didn't read. And I do feel like I found
Speaker 3: a method that I really like for recording the pages
Speaker 3: I read, which is very simple, and I just like
Speaker 3: put it on a monthly calendar, and I did it
Speaker 3: for part of the year, so I wouldn't say I
Speaker 3: met the goal that I did all year, but I
Speaker 3: don't know. I kind of figured out the ritual that
Speaker 3: works for me for that so partial win. I wanted
Speaker 3: to update my wardrobe, did not do that at all.
Speaker 3: Fail I wanted to get a many petty every month,
Speaker 3: but I did note that it might not fit into
Speaker 3: my budget, and same with massages, and that is correct.
Speaker 3: They do not fit into my budget with the amount
Speaker 3: of running shoes and racing shoes that I purchased, so
Speaker 3: you know, I got manny petties, probably more than other years,
Speaker 3: but it wasn't like a regular ritual. Actually, haven't gotten
Speaker 3: a massage in many, many months. And I finally last
Speaker 3: things where I wanted to use screens thoughtfully, way too
Speaker 3: vague of a goal I should know better than that.
Speaker 3: I will say I did okay with this overall. I
Speaker 3: mean there were times of stress when I did kind
Speaker 3: of just allow myself to fall into a black hole
Speaker 3: specifically of Reddit use, which I've talked about. But I
Speaker 3: was able to climb out of that black hole. And
Speaker 3: I think I spent more of the year like not
Speaker 3: doing any scrolling than doing it, so I would call
Speaker 3: that a win. And then finally I wanted to keep
Speaker 3: an experience journal and I did it for five months
Speaker 3: and then was like, this is too repetitive, and I
Speaker 3: stopped because I just record so much on my daily
Speaker 3: pages of my home Innichi that I'm like, why am
Speaker 3: I writing the same thing? So I do like journaling,
Speaker 3: but I don't need like two places to put that stuff.
Speaker 3: And I will say my word of the year was experience.
Speaker 3: And even though I couldn't even come up with a word.
Speaker 3: When we were revealing our words of the year at
Speaker 3: Best Laid Plans Live, I was like, what did I pick?
Speaker 3: I do feel like I like went all in on
Speaker 3: experiences in twenty twenty four. There were very few experiences
Speaker 3: that I or at least like things to go to
Speaker 3: that I would have said no to. I pretty much
Speaker 3: said yes to whatever. And I think I look at
Speaker 3: my list, because I made a list of like twenty
Speaker 3: four things and it's mostly filled out, Like I went
Speaker 3: to movies, I went to music, I hosted people, I
Speaker 3: tried some recipes. I have a cent. I had a
Speaker 3: cent on my list, which is that I identified a
Speaker 3: perfume that I like. So that's kind of fun anyway. Yeah,
Speaker 3: so those were my personal goals. I'm sorry that was
Speaker 3: a lot. I just talked for like four straight minutes.
Speaker 2: Well, I just have a question about the I mean,
Speaker 2: because you know, we do try to be sort of
Speaker 2: careful as we are setting goals, and so you would
Speaker 2: have known that you were spending on things that would
Speaker 2: make the massages less likely with the allowance.
Speaker 1: So I'm curious why you then set that as a goal.
Speaker 3: I mean, I know what my allowance is. And I
Speaker 3: guess I thought it would fit. I think I I mean,
Speaker 3: this is like so ridiculous, but I honestly think my
Speaker 3: biggest line item was I think I about like four
Speaker 3: pairs of like close to three hundred dollars shoes. Oh
Speaker 3: my god, I just like admitted that we're not talking
Speaker 3: about like prod of heels. We're talking about like Nike
Speaker 3: Alpha Fly and A six Meta speeds and yeah, because
Speaker 3: they really do help you race faster and train faster,
Speaker 3: and they add up. They added up to like a
Speaker 3: lot of massages. So at the end of the day,
Speaker 3: my budget didn't work, and I didn't We're really good
Speaker 3: about like not overdrawing our allowances, so it just didn't fit.
Speaker 1: Okay, But yeah, it was just curious because.
Speaker 2: I thought you knew you were going to be spending
Speaker 2: money on shoes, so I think I knew how much.
Speaker 1: You didn't know how much.
Speaker 3: Okay, But you're right. It actually wouldn't been really smart
Speaker 3: since some of these do involve personal spending. I should
Speaker 3: have like made a little budget in Google sheets or
Speaker 3: Excel or something to be like what actually fits here.
Speaker 3: Maybe I'll do that this year.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Okay, all right, good, Well A lot of experiences
Speaker 2: for twenty twenty four.
Speaker 1: That's good.
Speaker 2: So as my personal goals, I said I wanted to
Speaker 2: listen to all the works of Bach and twenty twenty four,
Speaker 2: and I have indeed done that. I ended the project
Speaker 2: in late November. I listened to all one thousand and
Speaker 2: eighty works in the original BWV category, which I think
Speaker 2: is bach Vik Verschneititis or something. I'm not going to
Speaker 2: ruin the German here, but there were works that are lost,
Speaker 2: so there are more than one thousand and eighty.
Speaker 1: There's some of the thousand and eighty turn out to
Speaker 1: not to be him.
Speaker 2: I mean we're talking sort of like nineteen hundred level
Speaker 2: historical stuff.
Speaker 1: But it is the main catalog of his work.
Speaker 2: And I listened to all of it at a rate
Speaker 2: of about thirty minutes a day over the course of
Speaker 2: the year. It was an amazing project. I'm really glad
Speaker 2: I did it. I so enjoyed it becoming more familiar
Speaker 2: with my favorite composer's works. I certainly knew some of
Speaker 2: the big ones, but I got to re listen to those.
Speaker 2: I got to listen to the works that came before
Speaker 2: the big works that I can hear him trying out themes.
Speaker 2: I can picture like this cantata just being composed in
Speaker 2: this church in Leipzig and just being debuted on a
Speaker 2: Sunday morning, and then the next Sunday there's going to
Speaker 2: be a different one. And a lot of this actually
Speaker 2: happened in seventeen twenty four, a lot of the kantatas.
Speaker 1: That was a big Kantata year.
Speaker 2: So it was sort of funny to I wish I
Speaker 2: had known that ahead of time, I would have maybe
Speaker 2: matched up Sundays.
Speaker 1: But oh, well I didn't, And it's I forget now.
Speaker 2: Is the seventeen twenty four was that before they did
Speaker 2: the ten day shift with time?
Speaker 3: Oh gosh, no, that's gonna be at this question, I
Speaker 3: feel like, yeah, you're the Well, there was.
Speaker 2: Sometime in the seventeen hundreds where they had like moved
Speaker 2: forward like ten days because or backwards, I forget what
Speaker 2: it was that time had gotten away from the solar.
Speaker 3: Maybe they didn't have leap years, and they got like.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because they weren't doing the right combination of leap years,
Speaker 2: and so it had to be reworked anyway. So it
Speaker 2: probably didn't match up exactly with the Sundays. That but
Speaker 2: that said, that was totally unrelated.
Speaker 1: It was fun. I really enjoyed it.
Speaker 2: I also got to hear a few concerts of box
Speaker 2: work in the course of the year. I am singing
Speaker 2: in a box concert coming up later this month, and
Speaker 2: I've been very carefully working through all the choral works
Speaker 2: in that piece and it's been really great.
Speaker 1: So I'm excited about that. Yay hit that one.
Speaker 2: I had another goal of continuing regular strength training plus
Speaker 2: do backstretches and exercises daily. And this is kind of
Speaker 2: the randomness of life because I had been doing back
Speaker 2: exercises and stretches for months before I had my back episode,
Speaker 2: so who knows, Like it doesn't necessarily stop anything, but
Speaker 2: I've continued to do regular strength training for another year.
Speaker 2: I work out with a trainer once a week, and
Speaker 2: I now am generally doing at least one more session
Speaker 2: a week of repeating the exercises my trainer gave me,
Speaker 2: maybe not quite as intense as he would have done,
Speaker 2: but I at least do most of them.
Speaker 1: So yeah, yes, I did both of those.
Speaker 3: Awesome. Well, it's been fun to see how much fun
Speaker 3: that you have had with bach, Like who knew but
Speaker 3: I love it for you. It was great.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was great. It was a great project, all right.
Speaker 1: So how about work?
Speaker 3: Yeah's work, which, by the way, fun fact, I forgot
Speaker 3: that category when I made the notes for last year
Speaker 3: and you were like, what about work anyway? Okay, So
Speaker 3: I wanted to work on office efficiency and like the
Speaker 3: patient checkout for progress process process, thank you, and I
Speaker 3: kind of did in that. I went a step further
Speaker 3: worked with my front desk people, and now I don't
Speaker 3: do anything. I just put in my instructions and count
Speaker 3: on them to do everything. And so far there have
Speaker 3: been no catastrophes, so that's it's wonderful. I have streamlined
Speaker 3: the end of my visits quite a bit from the
Speaker 3: old days of like printing everything out and running around,
Speaker 3: and that's wonderful. I had Friday lunches on my goals
Speaker 3: list because we were still kind of establishing the habit
Speaker 3: of going out together with work colleagues, not out, but
Speaker 3: to the cafetia in the hospital on Fridays, and definitely
Speaker 3: that was like a regular thing. Wasn't every Friday, but
Speaker 3: it was certainly most Fridays. At least someone sent a
Speaker 3: tax saying lunch and then we would go I did
Speaker 3: not plan any work social events. That was a fun
Speaker 3: idea did not happen. And then for my kind of
Speaker 3: creative work, I wanted to set up a new seasonal
Speaker 3: planning series that I called Planning by Season. And yes,
Speaker 3: I did that in twenty twenty four. It was really
Speaker 3: really fun actually, in some ways like my favorite program
Speaker 3: to do, because I actually get another participants really really
Speaker 3: well because you see them all year long and you
Speaker 3: get to be like, Okay, how is that work goal
Speaker 3: going that you talked about two months ago? So that's
Speaker 3: been a lot of fun and I would call that
Speaker 3: a success. I wanted to reach out to podcasts that
Speaker 3: do interviews where i'd be able to contribute. I may
Speaker 3: have pitched like two podcasts in twenty twenty four. That's
Speaker 3: not nearly enough. But it's hard. And I even mentioned
Speaker 3: it my thing. It's like, h you can get rejected
Speaker 3: or it's not even responded to. That's the most common,
Speaker 3: by the way. I'm like, come on, just throw me up.
Speaker 3: Oh we're so busy, thank you so much, blah blah blah. No,
Speaker 3: So maybe I just need to get a thicker skin
Speaker 3: and work on that. And I wanted to ruthlessly block
Speaker 3: some non clinical days to do my own planning. I
Speaker 3: fit in my planning. I did my seasonal planning. I
Speaker 3: really need it, like I but it was more like, Okay,
Speaker 3: I'm going to do it on Thursday on these two hours,
Speaker 3: rather than having like a whole expansive block of time.
Speaker 3: And I just I did a lot of work in
Speaker 3: twenty twenty four, like a lot of creative work, a
Speaker 3: lot of content, a lot of writing, a lot of stuff.
Speaker 3: We'll talk about it and yeah, oh, I guess wait,
Speaker 3: can I are we talking about like what we did? Yeah,
Speaker 3: yess we are.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: But I didn't set it as a goalar That's why it's.
Speaker 1: Like, oh no, but that's okay.
Speaker 3: I mean it happened, so I ended up I think
Speaker 3: I actually did set it as a goal in our
Speaker 3: midyear check in because I was like, I know, I've
Speaker 3: talked about this on the podcast, but I wanted to
Speaker 3: write a book proposal, and I wanted to write a
Speaker 3: best laid plans book essentially, And it did end up happening.
Speaker 3: I wrote my proposal, it got accepted. I am still
Speaker 3: in the process of finalizing my contract, but I mean,
Speaker 3: I'm planning on going forward with it, and I have
Speaker 3: working with an editor already finished two thirds of the book,
Speaker 3: I mean draft draft, so we're not like done done here,
Speaker 3: and the tentative plan is it should be released in
Speaker 3: early twenty twenty six and you'll hear more details on that.
Speaker 3: But that is a really really big work thing that
Speaker 3: came up, and therefore my plans to have lots of
Speaker 3: blank space for rumination just didn't work out.
Speaker 1: But it's okay.
Speaker 2: Well, exactly when great opportunities come, it's it's good to
Speaker 2: seize them. So that was a definite highlight for you
Speaker 2: because this is something you'd wanted to do for a
Speaker 2: long time.
Speaker 3: Yes, many many years. It was on my one hundred
Speaker 3: dreams list. It's been kind of percolating around. It's been
Speaker 3: one of those goals that I've wanted to move forward
Speaker 3: but then kind of stalled out on many times. So
Speaker 3: it's been incredibly exciting to see it actually come to fruition.
Speaker 3: So yeah, I guess that was a very low key
Speaker 3: little announcement, but that's not the official announcement because again
Speaker 3: have to finalize some stuff. That's the pre announcement, So yay, yay, No.
Speaker 2: I love that I love. I can't wait to read
Speaker 2: the book. Very excited, very excited about that. Yeah, my well,
Speaker 2: I also had book related goals for my year. I
Speaker 2: said I wanted to finish my proposal, get a contract,
Speaker 2: and mostly write.
Speaker 1: A new book.
Speaker 2: And I did my new agent and I sold, We
Speaker 2: got a it's great to put the announcement as a
Speaker 2: two book deal at auction.
Speaker 1: In April, so that was exciting.
Speaker 2: I've written five out of eight chapters of my book,
Speaker 2: which will also be out in early twenty twenty six,
Speaker 2: so I guess I'll say that I've mostly written at
Speaker 2: this point.
Speaker 1: So yay. I had put that I wanted to speak.
Speaker 2: Somewhere internationally that did not wind up happening, and I,
Speaker 2: you know, put this that I turned down actually a
Speaker 2: few things, because it's not that can I go speak
Speaker 2: to some group somewhere, is that I wanted to do
Speaker 2: it as part of my commercial corporate speaking business. I
Speaker 2: still think I will wind up doing this fairly soon,
Speaker 2: but a lot of international speaking is also being done virtually,
Speaker 2: like I will speak to the entire global group of
Speaker 2: corporation because they can do that via zoom or by
Speaker 2: broadcasting from their American headquarters.
Speaker 1: So it's an interesting time.
Speaker 2: I like to travel internationally, and so I thought that,
Speaker 2: you know, this will be a way to do it,
Speaker 2: and I will. But it's interesting to see how the
Speaker 2: speaking business is sort of evolving over time. So we'll
Speaker 2: keep stay tuned on that one. I wanted to keep
Speaker 2: writing my sonnets. I guess I put this in my
Speaker 2: work category, even though nobody is paying me for my poetry,
Speaker 2: so maybe this is more of a personal one. But
Speaker 2: I was writing in twenty twenty three. I also wrote
Speaker 2: a sonnet a week at a pace of two lines
Speaker 2: a day, so that comes out to fourteen lines a week,
Speaker 2: yam pentameter with a certain rhyming scheme. I enjoyed doing
Speaker 2: that in twenty twenty three, so I re upped for
Speaker 2: twenty twenty four. I wrote fifty two more sonnets by
Speaker 2: the end of the year. I guess when we're recording this,
Speaker 2: I've probably written forty nine or something. But yeah, it's
Speaker 2: been a lot of fun, and some are terrible, the
Speaker 2: vast majority are middling, And then in the course of
Speaker 2: a year of writing them, I get somewhere between five
Speaker 2: and ten that I really like. But if you keep
Speaker 2: cranking out five to ten poems you really like every year.
Speaker 2: In a couple of years you will have a full
Speaker 2: collection of poems that you really like. So hopefully I'll
Speaker 2: do something with that eventually.
Speaker 3: Oh, another book of poetry.
Speaker 1: Another Well again, I doubt anyone's going.
Speaker 2: To commercially publish my experimental poetry. But the good news
Speaker 2: of having built my platform writing about other things is
Speaker 2: I can simply distribute it to a large variety of people,
Speaker 2: possibly get more readers for my poetry than the vast
Speaker 2: majority poetry books. But anyway, so the last one was
Speaker 2: vander Hacks that I was saying, I wanted to start
Speaker 2: my newsletter through substack. This was the cool thing all
Speaker 2: the kids were doing in twenty twenty three is starting
Speaker 2: a substack newsletter, And I figure, what why not? So
Speaker 2: I started a daily short tip. It's come to a
Speaker 2: system where I have three free posts a week and
Speaker 2: two behind the paywall. I have about four hundred paying
Speaker 2: subscribers right now, a little over four thousand total subscribers now.
Speaker 2: So I've built that up and posted every day, and
Speaker 2: you probably we will keep doing that over the course
Speaker 2: of the ear It's been a lot of fun.
Speaker 3: I have enjoyed lots of them. I'm a paying subscriber.
Speaker 3: I just renewed, by the way, excellent. They're great. I
Speaker 3: mean I get inspiration from them, and I know you
Speaker 3: really well, so I highly recommend vander Hacks excellent.
Speaker 2: Well, we're going to take one more quick ad break
Speaker 2: and then we'll be back with the last part of
Speaker 2: our year in review. Well, we are back with our
Speaker 2: twenty twenty four year interview episode. Something of an annual
Speaker 2: tradition around here. In seven years of podcasting, you wind
Speaker 2: up with a fair number of annual traditions, kind of
Speaker 2: like going to see the Nutcracker or something like that. So, Sarah,
Speaker 2: let's talk about your relationship goals and what happened there.
Speaker 3: I think I met a lot of them, but I
Speaker 3: was not terribly specific about the amount of time I
Speaker 3: wanted to spend, so it's a little bit hard to
Speaker 3: gauge success. But I did want to carve out more
Speaker 3: one and one time with each family member, and I
Speaker 3: feel like I did with Annabelle, I think I did
Speaker 3: with Genevieve Cameron somewhat. I mean, the kids' activities sometimes
Speaker 3: do lend themselves to having one on one time because
Speaker 3: as we split them up and two of them go
Speaker 3: to gymnastics and one of them goes to soccer. Somebody's
Speaker 3: getting to spend that time without one kid. So I
Speaker 3: feel like maybe more last year than prior years, but
Speaker 3: still could be a little bit more. I wanted to
Speaker 3: do at least one date night a month with Josh.
Speaker 3: I think we did hit that milestone. I wanted to
Speaker 3: do two couples trips with him, and I did admit
Speaker 3: they might both be marathons, and that did end up happening,
Speaker 3: but turns out you can have lots of quality time
Speaker 3: even when you're preparing to run a lot of miles.
Speaker 3: And then I wanted to see my family in Philadelphia
Speaker 3: at least three times, but after the episode aired, I
Speaker 3: remember taking a last minute pivot and instead of going
Speaker 3: to visit them in January because our January was getting
Speaker 3: very full, I ended up going in late December. So
Speaker 3: that was kind of like my I only visited in
Speaker 3: the two times in twenty twenty four, but that last
Speaker 3: trip was supposed to be January, so kind of counts.
Speaker 3: Came in November, came in July, and then had come
Speaker 3: at the end of twenty twenty three. Yeah, that was it.
Speaker 3: From my relationship goals, they were kind of minimal compared
Speaker 3: to the others, but I think I did pretty well.
Speaker 3: Would give myself a B plus on the one on
Speaker 3: one time.
Speaker 2: Well, I'm always glad that you are resolving to come
Speaker 2: to Philadelphia because that means I get to see So
Speaker 2: we definitely saw Sarah several times in the course of
Speaker 2: her coming to Philadelphia, which is always great. Yeah, So
Speaker 2: my relationship goals for the years, I wanted to prioritize
Speaker 2: teen time, I mean in older kids in general, and
Speaker 2: putting that into my schedule. And I'd say that, yes,
Speaker 2: I got a lot of good time with my older kids.
Speaker 1: Obviously.
Speaker 2: I took the older two boys to Spain, as mentioned
Speaker 2: in a highlight in Paris with Ruth also a highlight.
Speaker 2: Great to do those things. I took Jasper to New
Speaker 2: York City in June. That was one of his Christmas presents.
Speaker 2: Michael took Sam diving on a trip that they went
Speaker 2: for a couple of days in the spring, so they
Speaker 2: got some time together. We did a lot of Starbucks runs,
Speaker 2: a lot of driving kids around. I mean, I do
Speaker 2: look for opportunities to sort of linger over dinner when
Speaker 2: we are having family dinner or something close to family dinner.
Speaker 2: Often the little boys run off at some point. They
Speaker 2: are very difficult to get to stay and the older
Speaker 2: kids are pretty good dinner companions at this point, so
Speaker 2: we often sit around and chatting, and I enjoy that.
Speaker 2: I like to think my relationships with them are reasonably strong,
Speaker 2: and I do not take that.
Speaker 1: For granted at all. I'm very glad for that.
Speaker 2: Another goal was to celebrate my twentieth anniversary with Michael.
Speaker 2: We celebrated our twentieth wedding anniversary in September, so what
Speaker 2: we actually did is we took a trip together to
Speaker 2: Bar Harbor, Maine and Acadia in October, sort of peak
Speaker 2: leaf season. We ran the half marathon together then. It
Speaker 2: was pretty good trip. I mean, the race itself was
Speaker 2: not my favorite. I do not believe I will be
Speaker 2: setting any running goals for twenty twenty five, but we did,
Speaker 2: in fact take that trip to celebrate our anniversary, so
Speaker 2: I guess I would count that as having done that.
Speaker 2: I also wanted to just do more regular friends stuff,
Speaker 2: which I guess is a pretty vague goal. Also that
Speaker 2: I could travel to see people, and I think I
Speaker 2: did pretty well on this most weeks I do something
Speaker 2: friend related. I definitely saw some folks in person that
Speaker 2: I enjoyed that I don't live near. I was glad
Speaker 2: to see a handful of folks in the course of
Speaker 2: the year and various trips. So yeah, I would say
Speaker 2: that was a positive. I'd give myself a fairly good
Speaker 2: grade on that one. And some of that was just
Speaker 2: like things come up, like other people suggest trips, and
Speaker 2: it was one reason to leave some space as you're
Speaker 2: planning the year. Like a friend from college suggested the
Speaker 2: Paris trip, and you know, then I got to spend
Speaker 2: time with her, and you know, also spend time with
Speaker 2: Ruth while I was there.
Speaker 1: Some of our.
Speaker 2: Listeners had to get together in New York City in
Speaker 2: April that I went to and really enjoyed seeing them
Speaker 2: and going to the Botanical Garden there and going out
Speaker 2: to eat and all that good stuff.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: I got together with some friends and work friends in Portland,
Speaker 2: Maine and October and enjoyed that, you know.
Speaker 1: So yeah, it was a good year.
Speaker 3: We did our Philadelphia meetup that year. This year, didn't
Speaker 3: we In July twenty twenty three, Oh no, we just
Speaker 3: went on a date together.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yes, okay, we enjoyed that as well. We went
Speaker 1: to a relationships one.
Speaker 3: No. I had a flashback to the photo that we
Speaker 3: took all together, and I'm like, wasn't that from a
Speaker 3: big party? You know, the party was a year before,
Speaker 3: but that was the same restaurant. Yes, I like relationship highlight.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we go to this Mexican place. And I'm always
Speaker 2: up for going to this Mexican place with friends. So
Speaker 2: glad we were able to do that too. That was
Speaker 2: a definite highlight this summer of seeing you and Josh
Speaker 2: and getting to do that. All right, Sarah, household goals.
Speaker 2: Let's hear what you have there.
Speaker 3: I forced in there against your will, but that's okay,
Speaker 3: all right. I wanted to establish a family reading routine. Nope,
Speaker 3: didn't at all. I'm sad about that. Actually, that was
Speaker 3: such a great goal. I may have to try it again.
Speaker 3: I wanted to do more formal family meetings, and I
Speaker 3: would say we did get like into a better root
Speaker 3: of really reviewing what's coming in the week most Sundays
Speaker 3: because I'd complete the board, the board on our the
Speaker 3: bullet the like white board in our hallway and it's
Speaker 3: right near the dinner table, and it's just like it
Speaker 3: was a natural thing. So it kind of evolved that
Speaker 3: we would talk about what was coming. And I feel
Speaker 3: like we got it to a functional place, so that's great.
Speaker 3: I wanted to complete our estate planning, and I had
Speaker 3: that on my list for a million years and we
Speaker 3: did finish it. Yay, okay, to be fair, like, I
Speaker 3: think there's some other like to do items associated with
Speaker 3: the planning, but I was reassured by our lawyer. He
Speaker 3: said if we did nothing else from here on out,
Speaker 3: we would still have our kids dealt with. We would
Speaker 3: have avoid probate. Like everything's good, Like everything else is bonus.
Speaker 3: So I will call it a check, a big win,
Speaker 3: a struggle. This was really on my list for a
Speaker 3: lot of years, but I found it emotionally fraught. I
Speaker 3: found it really vague, and I'm just glad we were
Speaker 3: able to make it happen. And you know, I thought
Speaker 3: I had resolved to organize my home, but that's just
Speaker 3: every single other year. I must have given myself a
Speaker 3: break in twenty twenty four from that.
Speaker 2: So good because it's not yeah, that's I mean, not
Speaker 2: setting goals is one way to achieve them, and I
Speaker 2: set no household goals, and no goals are easy to hit.
Speaker 2: Although I will say I've been enjoying my house this year.
Speaker 2: You know, a lot of the projects we did over
Speaker 2: the past few years have finished come to fruition. It's
Speaker 2: been fun to see, like the yard, you know, we
Speaker 2: decorated for Christmas this year. We got professional decorating with
Speaker 2: the lights out in the yard. It has been enjoyable
Speaker 2: seeing that I now have five Christmas trees in the house,
Speaker 2: only two big ones. The others are smaller, but they
Speaker 2: are all decorated, so I get into things like that.
Speaker 2: It wasn't a goal, but it's been a highlight of
Speaker 2: the year real quickly. Another highlight for us has been
Speaker 2: our Patreon community. We have really enjoyed getting to know
Speaker 2: the people who are part of that. We have great
Speaker 2: discussions over on our site. If you're looking for sort
Speaker 2: of an alternative to social media. We often have long
Speaker 2: discussion threads there. We have monthly meetups, our annual goal setting,
Speaker 2: our goal setting workshops. We've had a book club this year.
Speaker 2: We've done a lot of things talking about like meal
Speaker 2: planning or organization. Really enjoyed that. We will be posting
Speaker 2: our curriculum for the upcoming year soon. But two things
Speaker 2: that Sarah's indulging me that we will be doing is
Speaker 2: in lieu.
Speaker 1: Of sort of a regular book club.
Speaker 2: We were going to do a book club discussion of
Speaker 2: one hundred and sixty eight Hours in May because that
Speaker 2: will be the fifteen year anniversary of one hundred and
Speaker 2: sixty eight Hours coming out. And we'll also do a
Speaker 2: book club discussion of I Know How She Does It
Speaker 2: in June because that will be the tenth anniversary of
Speaker 2: that book coming out.
Speaker 1: So if you.
Speaker 2: Happen to have read either of those books or we'd
Speaker 2: like to and want to discuss that with me and Sarah,
Speaker 2: we would welcome that. And of course, you know, our
Speaker 2: December Annual Goals Workshop is a great way to test
Speaker 2: out Sarah's course offerings.
Speaker 3: Yes, it's been really fun. I do feel like our
Speaker 3: Patreon has like gelled a lot this year. Like a
Speaker 3: lot of people, I've just seen them frequently comment. I'm
Speaker 3: sure there's some people who comment less, but then they
Speaker 3: join in the conversation when they feel like it. Our
Speaker 3: threads have been a lot of times instigated by people
Speaker 3: being like, hey can you crowdsource I need gift ideas
Speaker 3: for an eight year old boy, and then we put
Speaker 3: it up there and we get so many awesome ideas
Speaker 3: in this group, and yet it really does lack the
Speaker 3: addictive qualities of social media, at least for me. So
Speaker 3: if that is something you're thinking about, like, I don't
Speaker 3: want to be doing as much of that. What could
Speaker 3: I do instead? That feels more enriching, feels positive. This
Speaker 3: is a great place, So we would love to have you. Yeah,
Speaker 3: and I'm very excited to finalize our curriculum.
Speaker 1: I love the word parculum. All right.
Speaker 3: The question the question all right, we and this one
Speaker 3: I think does come from someone who was in Patreon
Speaker 3: so amazing. This person asked, what exactly is a house
Speaker 3: manager and what's the difference between that and a nanny?
Speaker 3: How would you go about finding one?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 2: Well, so this is if you think about what is
Speaker 2: required to run a household, there are often a lot
Speaker 2: of things like grocery shopping or organizing or taking returns back,
Speaker 2: or meeting contractors, getting bids on things like especially if
Speaker 2: you're doing any sort of home renovation projects, or you
Speaker 2: have appliances that break, or you know, anything along those lines.
Speaker 1: Are just general.
Speaker 2: Upkeep of a space, and it takes a lot of time.
Speaker 2: It takes a lot of work. And when people have
Speaker 2: full time childcare, sometimes because that person is home during
Speaker 2: the day, they may be able to handle some of it,
Speaker 2: especially if you have kids who are in school for
Speaker 2: any amount of hours. So a lot of times what
Speaker 2: happens is like your youngest kid goes to preschool for
Speaker 2: three days a week for four hours a day, and
Speaker 2: so it's like you still need full time childcare because
Speaker 2: that does not cover your work hours. But the person
Speaker 2: has some time then that they could do various things,
Speaker 2: and so often what people wind up doing is having
Speaker 2: their nanny take on more of this house manager type role.
Speaker 2: But if you are aging out of the time when
Speaker 2: you even need childcare, along those lines, you could consider
Speaker 2: hiring someone for a certain number of hours a week
Speaker 2: to deal with these sorts of things. So maybe the
Speaker 2: person works let's say Wednesdays and Fridays, and so you
Speaker 2: always have them arranged to have contractors or deliveries or
Speaker 2: anything like that happen on Wednesdays and Fridays, and then
Speaker 2: they can do various things like resetting the house or
Speaker 2: you know, noticing what you're out of and say, oh,
Speaker 2: well the light bulb up there is out, I will
Speaker 2: go fix it. Things like that that you would do
Speaker 2: if you were focused on your home full time, but
Speaker 2: because you are not focused on your home full time.
Speaker 1: You won't.
Speaker 2: And I mean this is the sort of thing that like,
Speaker 2: I mean, people who are like stay at home moms
Speaker 2: wind up doing and then when they feel that they
Speaker 2: are not, like people like, well, your kids are in school,
Speaker 2: like what are you actually doing? Like, there's still a
Speaker 2: lot of work to be done, especially you know, for
Speaker 2: people who have bigger families or bigger houses even you know,
Speaker 2: or things like that.
Speaker 1: So yeah, that's what they would do. I would.
Speaker 2: As for finding people, I mean, I think it's just
Speaker 2: a lot of networking, like anything else, asking other people.
Speaker 2: You know, maybe somebody else has somebody who's working two
Speaker 2: days a week and they'd like to work more, and
Speaker 2: you know, then you could have them for two days
Speaker 2: a week as well, or you know, you could post
Speaker 2: on the various places like care dot com or anything
Speaker 2: along those lines.
Speaker 3: Probably a regular job board too, maybe like indeed or yeah.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah cool, certainly. Or there are agencies, I mean,
Speaker 2: there's household staffing agencies. If you wanted to go that
Speaker 2: route as well, same as you know with finding a nanny.
Speaker 2: Obviously you can post somewhere like care dot com. You
Speaker 2: can go through a large number of agencies that will
Speaker 2: help you find people, and so it'd be very similar.
Speaker 3: I think one thing you mentioned that I didn't really
Speaker 3: know about house managers with that you could have a
Speaker 3: part time one. So that's really interesting, like the idea
Speaker 3: that like, you know, you don't eat childcare anymore, but
Speaker 3: you do, you have enough of those loose ends things
Speaker 3: and maybe they just always do your grocery shopping as
Speaker 3: well or something like that. But two days a week
Speaker 3: or ten hours a week or something like that might
Speaker 3: be achievable for a lot of people.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, and can certainly make life a little bit
Speaker 2: more calm when your light bulbs aren't all out so well,
Speaker 2: I guess this is we're even thinking Love of the Week,
Speaker 2: but kind of a lot. This has been all Love
Speaker 2: of the Week again, our year and their VEO home.
Speaker 2: We love twenty twenty four mostly.
Speaker 3: Yes, we love twenty twenty four. We love our Patreon members,
Speaker 3: we love our listeners. Thank you so much for anyone
Speaker 3: who's followed our journey from the twenty seventeen beginning of
Speaker 3: this podcast, but also welcome anyone who joined us new
Speaker 3: in twenty twenty four. We're grateful for all of you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we can see that our listenership has gone up
Speaker 2: a bit in twenty twenty four, so we're excited about
Speaker 2: that to welcome new peace people to the community.
Speaker 1: So yeah, you are our love of the week.
Speaker 2: Thanks for joining us, and we will be back next
Speaker 2: week with more on making work and life fit together.
Speaker 3: Thanks for listening. You can find me Sarah at the
Speaker 3: shoebox dot com or at the Underscore Shoebox on Instagram.
Speaker 2: And you can find me Laura at Laura vandercam dot com.
Speaker 2: This has been the best of both worlds podcasts. Please
Speaker 2: join us next time for more on making work and
Speaker 2: life work together.