1 00:00:00,600 --> 00:00:03,000 Speaker 1: The True Story of the Fake Zombies is a production 2 00:00:03,080 --> 00:00:07,840 Speaker 1: of iHeart Podcasts, Talk House, and never Mind Media. A 3 00:00:07,920 --> 00:00:12,000 Speaker 1: note before we begin this episode. The same day that 4 00:00:12,080 --> 00:00:16,000 Speaker 1: this podcast debuted, The Zombies announced that the band's chief 5 00:00:16,079 --> 00:00:20,720 Speaker 1: songwriter and virtuoso keyboardist, Rod Argent suffered a stroke and 6 00:00:20,840 --> 00:00:24,400 Speaker 1: is retired from touring at age eighty. Anyone who's heard 7 00:00:24,400 --> 00:00:27,080 Speaker 1: The Zombies music knows Rod Argent's songs ranked among the 8 00:00:27,080 --> 00:00:30,240 Speaker 1: best ever written. Anyone who's ever seen The Zombies live 9 00:00:30,320 --> 00:00:32,479 Speaker 1: know that he was a force of nature, playing with 10 00:00:32,479 --> 00:00:35,360 Speaker 1: a tenacity and dedication that will be impossible to replicate. 11 00:00:36,280 --> 00:00:38,320 Speaker 1: We don't talk about keyboardists the way we talk about 12 00:00:38,360 --> 00:00:41,479 Speaker 1: guitar players, but if we did, Rod Argent would be 13 00:00:41,479 --> 00:00:43,480 Speaker 1: at the top of every best of all time list. 14 00:00:44,360 --> 00:00:45,839 Speaker 1: At the time of this writing, the future of The 15 00:00:45,920 --> 00:00:49,519 Speaker 1: Zombies is unclear, but Rod's contribution to the musical landscape 16 00:00:49,560 --> 00:00:52,479 Speaker 1: can't be diminished. We wish him a speedy recovery and 17 00:00:52,520 --> 00:01:05,520 Speaker 1: send our best to the Zombies family. Nineteen sixty nine 18 00:01:05,520 --> 00:01:09,759 Speaker 1: and nineteen seventy, the years of Fake Zombies toured, were 19 00:01:09,760 --> 00:01:14,320 Speaker 1: not particularly good ones for the Real Zombies. The band 20 00:01:14,360 --> 00:01:17,120 Speaker 1: had a hit in America, but were somehow unaware of 21 00:01:17,160 --> 00:01:20,600 Speaker 1: the fact. The successive time of the season on the 22 00:01:20,680 --> 00:01:24,800 Speaker 1: radio and the States was a total surprise. It would 23 00:01:24,800 --> 00:01:26,360 Speaker 1: take months for the band to catch wind of the 24 00:01:26,360 --> 00:01:29,800 Speaker 1: song's rides up the charts and the imposter group zigzagging 25 00:01:29,840 --> 00:01:34,200 Speaker 1: North America. When the Fake Zombies were touring at the 26 00:01:34,240 --> 00:01:36,800 Speaker 1: close of the sixties, living it up out on the road, 27 00:01:37,800 --> 00:01:41,679 Speaker 1: the real Zombies were breaking up. It looked like the end. 28 00:01:42,680 --> 00:01:46,640 Speaker 1: It almost was. This is the true story of the 29 00:01:46,680 --> 00:02:03,120 Speaker 1: Fake Zombies. I'm Daniel Ralston. Fifty five years ago. The 30 00:02:03,200 --> 00:02:07,360 Speaker 1: Zombies were, by all accounts, at the end of their rope. 31 00:02:07,480 --> 00:02:09,600 Speaker 1: It had been five years since their last Tait record, 32 00:02:10,000 --> 00:02:12,800 Speaker 1: and the album they released in nineteen sixty eight, Odyssey 33 00:02:12,840 --> 00:02:17,040 Speaker 1: an Oracle, was considered a flop. There was simply no 34 00:02:17,160 --> 00:02:23,960 Speaker 1: demand for the Zombies anymore. Internally, things weren't any better. 35 00:02:25,200 --> 00:02:28,120 Speaker 1: There was a huge disparity in the band's income, driving 36 00:02:28,160 --> 00:02:31,440 Speaker 1: a wedge between them. The guys who wrote the songs 37 00:02:31,720 --> 00:02:36,919 Speaker 1: had money and the other guys didn't. It created a divide. 38 00:02:38,040 --> 00:02:40,720 Speaker 1: It was time to move on. For some of the band, 39 00:02:41,320 --> 00:02:44,240 Speaker 1: including lead singer Colin Blunstone. That meant giving up on 40 00:02:44,320 --> 00:02:52,519 Speaker 1: music entirely Luckily, when the band found out about their 41 00:02:52,760 --> 00:02:57,079 Speaker 1: American guys impersonating us problem, it helped bring them back together. 42 00:02:57,760 --> 00:03:09,079 Speaker 1: Ladies and gentlemen, the Sobies, the Beatles may be the 43 00:03:09,080 --> 00:03:12,280 Speaker 1: biggest English band of all time, and the Stones and 44 00:03:12,320 --> 00:03:14,800 Speaker 1: the Who had more hits and more fame than the Zombies. 45 00:03:16,320 --> 00:03:18,160 Speaker 1: When it comes to who's the best British band of 46 00:03:18,160 --> 00:03:22,919 Speaker 1: all time, the Zombies are in the conversation. They made 47 00:03:22,919 --> 00:03:25,040 Speaker 1: some music that stands alongside the best of its era. 48 00:03:28,480 --> 00:03:30,560 Speaker 2: Well, no one told me about. 49 00:03:32,160 --> 00:03:35,840 Speaker 3: No no no no no no. 50 00:03:35,200 --> 00:03:39,000 Speaker 4: No no no no no no no no no no 51 00:03:39,000 --> 00:03:41,640 Speaker 4: no no no, no no no. 52 00:03:47,960 --> 00:03:50,520 Speaker 5: It's all the. 53 00:03:52,000 --> 00:03:52,560 Speaker 2: And for. 54 00:03:58,040 --> 00:04:01,240 Speaker 1: The Zombies resurrection and reappraisal of the past five decades 55 00:04:01,560 --> 00:04:06,000 Speaker 1: can be directly credited to how much other artists love them. 56 00:04:06,200 --> 00:04:08,440 Speaker 1: First it was people like Tom Petty. 57 00:04:09,160 --> 00:04:12,600 Speaker 6: Rod is one of the greatest keyboard players in the 58 00:04:12,720 --> 00:04:17,240 Speaker 6: history of rock, and Colin has a voice. If you've 59 00:04:17,240 --> 00:04:20,200 Speaker 6: heard the Zombies, you know that voice. Anytime it comes 60 00:04:20,240 --> 00:04:23,680 Speaker 6: along a fabulous singer one of my favorites ever. 61 00:04:24,560 --> 00:04:27,360 Speaker 1: Here's Tom's bandmate and the Heartbreakers, Mike Campbell. 62 00:04:27,600 --> 00:04:31,000 Speaker 6: I was enamored with the British invasion, all those bands 63 00:04:31,120 --> 00:04:33,719 Speaker 6: in the Zombies were right the top. 64 00:04:34,800 --> 00:04:37,320 Speaker 1: The next generation of artists discovered their music too, like 65 00:04:37,400 --> 00:04:40,720 Speaker 1: Post Malone and Harry Styles. Thanks to people like Mike 66 00:04:40,720 --> 00:04:43,719 Speaker 1: Campbell and Tom Petty preaching the gospel of the Zombies. 67 00:04:43,600 --> 00:04:48,479 Speaker 7: They certainly didn't have the same commercial success that the 68 00:04:48,480 --> 00:04:49,440 Speaker 7: Beatles had. 69 00:04:49,760 --> 00:04:51,920 Speaker 1: That's my friend Joe Wong. Joe is one of the 70 00:04:51,960 --> 00:04:54,279 Speaker 1: best drummers in the world and the leader of the 71 00:04:54,279 --> 00:04:55,200 Speaker 1: band Night Creatures. 72 00:04:55,320 --> 00:04:58,840 Speaker 7: That kind of frames them as underdogs to a certain extent, 73 00:04:59,320 --> 00:05:01,359 Speaker 7: and so I think I think that that's what attracted 74 00:05:01,480 --> 00:05:04,400 Speaker 7: people like me to the Zombies. It's more fun to 75 00:05:04,520 --> 00:05:08,880 Speaker 7: champion in a band that is not widely perceived to 76 00:05:08,920 --> 00:05:10,560 Speaker 7: be the greatest rock band of all time. 77 00:05:11,600 --> 00:05:15,640 Speaker 1: Joe's an encyclopedia of information about music, specifically the kind 78 00:05:15,640 --> 00:05:20,280 Speaker 1: of dreamy, baroque pop music the Zombies make. When I 79 00:05:20,320 --> 00:05:23,159 Speaker 1: said that fellow musicians love the Zombies, I wasn't kidding. 80 00:05:23,760 --> 00:05:25,720 Speaker 1: They are your favorite band's favorite band. 81 00:05:26,080 --> 00:05:36,080 Speaker 7: The Zombies are like the connoisseur's British invasion band your mind. 82 00:05:37,440 --> 00:05:42,240 Speaker 1: Joe makes big, complex, symphonic music. One of the reasons musicians, 83 00:05:42,600 --> 00:05:46,440 Speaker 1: really talented musicians love the Zombies is their song sounds simple, 84 00:05:47,080 --> 00:05:49,880 Speaker 1: but those hummable melodies and perfect choruses are found in 85 00:05:49,960 --> 00:05:53,640 Speaker 1: strange jazz chords and diminished knights. They have a gift 86 00:05:53,640 --> 00:05:54,440 Speaker 1: for originality. 87 00:05:55,080 --> 00:05:58,520 Speaker 7: I think that their sound is more haunting. It's more 88 00:05:58,520 --> 00:06:01,240 Speaker 7: haunting and a little bit darker, you know. I can 89 00:06:01,320 --> 00:06:03,919 Speaker 7: think of other contemporaries that were piano driven to and 90 00:06:04,040 --> 00:06:08,479 Speaker 7: the Zombies still stand apart from those folks, you know, 91 00:06:08,520 --> 00:06:12,120 Speaker 7: they were on a different trajectory, a little bit more unique. 92 00:06:13,880 --> 00:06:17,080 Speaker 1: In twenty nineteen, the Zombies achieved defeat that seemed impossible 93 00:06:17,160 --> 00:06:20,280 Speaker 1: during those dark days of nineteen sixty nine. They were 94 00:06:20,279 --> 00:06:23,960 Speaker 1: inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. In 95 00:06:24,000 --> 00:06:27,359 Speaker 1: this episode, Rod Argent and Colin Blunstone at the Zombies 96 00:06:27,760 --> 00:06:29,280 Speaker 1: tell us what it was like to learn about their 97 00:06:29,320 --> 00:06:33,720 Speaker 1: American impostors and how their collaboration, which started sixty three 98 00:06:33,800 --> 00:06:41,480 Speaker 1: years ago, continues to flourish. But first, I sit down 99 00:06:41,520 --> 00:06:45,640 Speaker 1: with Suzannah Hawks, lead singer, guitarist and songwriter in the Bengals, 100 00:06:46,200 --> 00:06:48,960 Speaker 1: who's the biggest Zombies fan I know, and the woman 101 00:06:49,000 --> 00:06:51,240 Speaker 1: responsible for inducting them into the Rock and Roll Hall 102 00:06:51,279 --> 00:06:58,880 Speaker 1: of Fame. I first met Suzannah Hawks a few years ago. 103 00:07:00,000 --> 00:07:02,040 Speaker 1: Directing a video series where I got artists to sing 104 00:07:02,080 --> 00:07:05,320 Speaker 1: their own songs in a karaoke bar. She said, Yes, 105 00:07:05,960 --> 00:07:08,640 Speaker 1: did an incredible version of the Bengals classic Eternal Flame 106 00:07:08,720 --> 00:07:11,640 Speaker 1: had a grimy karaoke joint in downtown Los Angeles. 107 00:07:12,560 --> 00:07:15,440 Speaker 2: I'm Susannah Hoffs from the Bengals. I'm in the mall 108 00:07:15,560 --> 00:07:18,640 Speaker 2: in downtown LA, and I'm about to sing Eternal Flame 109 00:07:18,720 --> 00:07:21,000 Speaker 2: at this karaoke bar you're watching. 110 00:07:22,400 --> 00:07:26,520 Speaker 1: Was it a life highlight? Yes, so is getting to 111 00:07:26,520 --> 00:07:29,440 Speaker 1: hear from her about a band. We both love the Zombies. 112 00:07:30,720 --> 00:07:32,960 Speaker 1: The music Susannah makes is steeped in the sound and 113 00:07:33,040 --> 00:07:35,720 Speaker 1: style of the British Invasion. It's in her DNA. 114 00:07:36,960 --> 00:07:41,880 Speaker 2: I first heard the Zombies as a kid in the 115 00:07:41,880 --> 00:07:47,520 Speaker 2: backseat of a station wagon in LA. My mom always 116 00:07:47,520 --> 00:07:48,640 Speaker 2: had the radio playing. 117 00:07:50,280 --> 00:07:52,280 Speaker 1: Susannah is one of those musicians who helped bring the 118 00:07:52,320 --> 00:07:55,280 Speaker 1: Zombies back into the spotlight. She's been a fan most 119 00:07:55,280 --> 00:07:55,960 Speaker 1: of her life. 120 00:07:56,200 --> 00:07:58,840 Speaker 2: My mom had a best friend who lived in the neighborhood, 121 00:07:58,840 --> 00:08:01,760 Speaker 2: who worked at Capitol Record, who had brought copies for 122 00:08:01,840 --> 00:08:04,400 Speaker 2: her kids and my mom. You know, my brothers and 123 00:08:04,440 --> 00:08:10,000 Speaker 2: I were all like Beatle fanatics around that same time. 124 00:08:10,120 --> 00:08:13,080 Speaker 2: It must have been that I first heard the Zombies 125 00:08:13,680 --> 00:08:17,000 Speaker 2: coming out of the Tinny Carr radio in the station wagon. 126 00:08:20,480 --> 00:08:23,920 Speaker 1: Zombies music pulled Susanna in left a lasting impression on her. 127 00:08:24,320 --> 00:08:29,760 Speaker 2: I was instantly seduced by Collin's voice. He has a 128 00:08:29,800 --> 00:08:34,640 Speaker 2: singular voice. I mean, he's in the pantheon of great singers, 129 00:08:35,640 --> 00:08:40,400 Speaker 2: not only because he is fearless in emoting. And that 130 00:08:40,559 --> 00:08:45,720 Speaker 2: is something that has become like a lifelong obsession for 131 00:08:45,840 --> 00:08:48,560 Speaker 2: me as part of why I love music so much, 132 00:08:48,640 --> 00:08:52,640 Speaker 2: why I decided to become a musician. For some reason, 133 00:08:52,800 --> 00:08:57,120 Speaker 2: even as a very little girl, I was very moved 134 00:08:57,440 --> 00:08:59,120 Speaker 2: by the emotion in songs. 135 00:09:00,120 --> 00:09:05,960 Speaker 1: She watches your families while lovers come and go to 136 00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:18,880 Speaker 1: give each other roses from but not the rose. There's 137 00:09:18,920 --> 00:09:22,719 Speaker 1: an undeniable sweetness about the music of the Zombies. It's 138 00:09:22,760 --> 00:09:26,240 Speaker 1: what sets them apart from their contemporaries. That and the 139 00:09:26,240 --> 00:09:29,280 Speaker 1: fact that the band members were and still are musical 140 00:09:29,280 --> 00:09:32,839 Speaker 1: savants even in the sixties. They could play circles around 141 00:09:32,840 --> 00:09:33,480 Speaker 1: every other band. 142 00:09:34,320 --> 00:09:37,600 Speaker 2: It's extremely sophisticated. I mean a rose for Emily. This 143 00:09:37,840 --> 00:09:42,920 Speaker 2: is like a story. It's connecting to all sorts of 144 00:09:43,000 --> 00:09:48,280 Speaker 2: interesting traditions and literature and it's very intellectual, but yet 145 00:09:48,360 --> 00:09:59,880 Speaker 2: its beauty is unparalleled. The range of styles and flavors 146 00:10:00,960 --> 00:10:05,000 Speaker 2: that weave through the Zombies sound is extraordinary to me. 147 00:10:05,720 --> 00:10:09,400 Speaker 2: For such young boys, you know, to have tapped into that, 148 00:10:13,240 --> 00:10:15,360 Speaker 2: I mean, I think it was sort of wonderful that 149 00:10:15,520 --> 00:10:21,760 Speaker 2: Rod like unlike the Beatles, where it's like bass, two guitars, drums, vocals. 150 00:10:22,360 --> 00:10:28,400 Speaker 2: The element of his incredible expertise on piano and keyboards, 151 00:10:28,920 --> 00:10:33,360 Speaker 2: you know, brought a certain genesse qua to the Zombies sound. 152 00:10:47,480 --> 00:10:49,959 Speaker 1: The Zombies have always had this best kept secret thing 153 00:10:50,040 --> 00:10:53,920 Speaker 1: going on. Sure they have huge, undeniable hit songs, but 154 00:10:53,960 --> 00:10:57,600 Speaker 1: they've always flown just below the radar. When musicians like 155 00:10:57,600 --> 00:11:00,560 Speaker 1: Susanna started citing the band as a key influence, it 156 00:11:00,640 --> 00:11:04,520 Speaker 1: led people to rediscover their sound. Their legacy kept growing, 157 00:11:05,520 --> 00:11:09,520 Speaker 1: and on March nineteen fifty eight years after they formed, 158 00:11:09,920 --> 00:11:12,080 Speaker 1: the Zombies were inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall 159 00:11:12,120 --> 00:11:15,520 Speaker 1: of Fame. Susannah had the honor of being on the 160 00:11:15,520 --> 00:11:18,719 Speaker 1: stage that day. The long, strange journey that led the 161 00:11:18,760 --> 00:11:22,319 Speaker 1: band to this moment, the gravity of it wasn't lost 162 00:11:22,320 --> 00:11:22,560 Speaker 1: on her. 163 00:11:27,200 --> 00:11:31,440 Speaker 2: My heart was thumping like a cartoon bursting out of 164 00:11:31,440 --> 00:11:34,959 Speaker 2: my chest. It was very joyous, but at the same time, 165 00:11:35,200 --> 00:11:38,880 Speaker 2: probably one of the most nerve wracking moment. I was 166 00:11:38,920 --> 00:11:45,680 Speaker 2: standing backstage and I think Janelle Monet was inducting Janet Jackson. 167 00:11:45,800 --> 00:11:48,520 Speaker 2: You have to line up in the queue and then 168 00:11:48,559 --> 00:11:52,040 Speaker 2: you kind of are waiting while someone else is doing 169 00:11:52,080 --> 00:11:56,120 Speaker 2: some crazy magical charismatic thing on the stage, and you're going, 170 00:11:56,480 --> 00:11:59,640 Speaker 2: oh God, I'm next, I'm next, you know, but I 171 00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:03,640 Speaker 2: ah the screen. I'm remembering it now, the screen. 172 00:12:04,480 --> 00:12:07,360 Speaker 1: As Susanna waited in the wings moments from taking the stage, 173 00:12:07,840 --> 00:12:10,559 Speaker 1: a video tribute to the Zombies flashed across the screen. 174 00:12:10,920 --> 00:12:15,439 Speaker 2: In black and white of their childhoods and their early performances. 175 00:12:15,440 --> 00:12:18,760 Speaker 2: And I'm just like, I'm like a fan. I'm just 176 00:12:18,800 --> 00:12:21,079 Speaker 2: like a super fan watching and then I'm like, shit, 177 00:12:21,720 --> 00:12:23,920 Speaker 2: I got to walk out onto a stage and it's 178 00:12:23,960 --> 00:12:27,560 Speaker 2: like a sea of my peers and the music business 179 00:12:27,600 --> 00:12:30,720 Speaker 2: and other people, and I don't know, it's just like 180 00:12:30,800 --> 00:12:37,440 Speaker 2: a dream, and it's it's my great honor, a highlight 181 00:12:37,520 --> 00:12:41,280 Speaker 2: of my life to induct the Zombies into the rock 182 00:12:41,320 --> 00:12:45,960 Speaker 2: and roll hall and fair and then for them to 183 00:12:46,040 --> 00:12:48,880 Speaker 2: come up on the stage, and you know, I tear 184 00:12:48,920 --> 00:12:52,480 Speaker 2: it up as my little section ended, and just so 185 00:12:52,679 --> 00:12:56,960 Speaker 2: full of gratitude to even know them, to even know 186 00:12:57,080 --> 00:13:01,600 Speaker 2: them as human beings, and they're just such wonderful human beings, 187 00:13:01,640 --> 00:13:06,120 Speaker 2: but they're so humble. They really deserved that moment. 188 00:13:06,920 --> 00:13:09,480 Speaker 1: Susannah was tasked with summing up the band six decades 189 00:13:09,480 --> 00:13:12,199 Speaker 1: in her induction speech, which isn't an easy thing to do. 190 00:13:12,640 --> 00:13:15,880 Speaker 2: I mean, it was really daunting because I love the 191 00:13:15,960 --> 00:13:19,320 Speaker 2: Zombies so much, and it's hard to find words to 192 00:13:19,440 --> 00:13:25,000 Speaker 2: describe their artistry. What makes this song do its particular 193 00:13:25,200 --> 00:13:28,480 Speaker 2: brand of magic and cast spells over all of us. 194 00:13:28,640 --> 00:13:31,960 Speaker 2: It was daunting, though, to try to put to words 195 00:13:32,360 --> 00:13:36,040 Speaker 2: this magical spell they cast over me, starting with my 196 00:13:36,160 --> 00:13:40,960 Speaker 2: childhood and as a grown lady and musician myself. 197 00:13:41,920 --> 00:13:44,440 Speaker 1: Her speech was beautiful, a love letter to a band 198 00:13:44,440 --> 00:13:47,040 Speaker 1: that shaped her world from the backseat of her mom's 199 00:13:47,040 --> 00:13:49,439 Speaker 1: station wagon all the way to the stage the Rock 200 00:13:49,440 --> 00:13:50,360 Speaker 1: and Roll Hall of Fame. 201 00:13:51,040 --> 00:13:54,720 Speaker 2: Everybody should know about the Zombies, and if they are 202 00:13:54,760 --> 00:13:58,200 Speaker 2: discovering them now through your podcast, they will fall in love. 203 00:13:59,320 --> 00:14:02,679 Speaker 1: After the Break, I talked with the Zombies about their 204 00:14:02,760 --> 00:14:05,760 Speaker 1: unlikely late in life success and how the Fake Zombies 205 00:14:05,800 --> 00:14:35,160 Speaker 1: impacted their career more than a half century ago as 206 00:14:35,200 --> 00:14:37,720 Speaker 1: I followed the path of the Fake Zombies. One of 207 00:14:37,760 --> 00:14:39,840 Speaker 1: the best parts of this has been sharing what I 208 00:14:39,920 --> 00:14:44,040 Speaker 1: found with the real Zombies. So I'm gonna take you 209 00:14:44,080 --> 00:14:45,560 Speaker 1: guys through what I have here real quick. 210 00:14:45,600 --> 00:14:49,080 Speaker 6: To start this, say, okay, yeah. 211 00:14:48,040 --> 00:14:53,000 Speaker 1: So these are the second fake Zombies. These are the 212 00:14:53,040 --> 00:14:56,280 Speaker 1: Michigan Boys. So these are the guys who could actually 213 00:14:56,360 --> 00:14:57,040 Speaker 1: play your music. 214 00:14:57,720 --> 00:15:00,320 Speaker 3: How you're saying that there was two two lots, should 215 00:15:00,320 --> 00:15:03,200 Speaker 3: we say, two bands at. 216 00:15:03,040 --> 00:15:05,440 Speaker 1: The same time from the same manager in. 217 00:15:05,400 --> 00:15:09,920 Speaker 5: Michigan learning stuff today. 218 00:15:10,280 --> 00:15:13,600 Speaker 1: That's Hugh Grundy and Chris White, the original rhythm section 219 00:15:13,680 --> 00:15:18,000 Speaker 1: in the Zombies. Unlike their bandmates Colin and Rod, Hugh 220 00:15:18,000 --> 00:15:22,920 Speaker 1: and Chris aren't touring anymore, their semi retired, only joining 221 00:15:22,960 --> 00:15:26,280 Speaker 1: the band on special occasions. I caught up with them 222 00:15:26,280 --> 00:15:29,240 Speaker 1: at south By Southwest in twenty twenty three, where The 223 00:15:29,320 --> 00:15:32,680 Speaker 1: Zombies were premiering their documentary Hung Up on a Dream. 224 00:15:33,000 --> 00:15:40,040 Speaker 1: Here's our boys. That is Dusty Hill here and Frank 225 00:15:40,080 --> 00:15:43,200 Speaker 1: Beard here, letting me as you can see, they didn't 226 00:15:43,280 --> 00:15:48,880 Speaker 1: quite have the equipment right here they are. That's their 227 00:15:48,880 --> 00:15:50,280 Speaker 1: fake Zombie stage attiring. 228 00:15:52,320 --> 00:15:58,320 Speaker 6: I don't think we would have worn that no done. 229 00:15:59,160 --> 00:16:01,720 Speaker 1: When it happened back in sixty nine. The Zombies had 230 00:16:01,720 --> 00:16:04,000 Speaker 1: no idea that there were actually two sets of American 231 00:16:04,040 --> 00:16:06,720 Speaker 1: guys pretending to be them, and that two of those 232 00:16:06,760 --> 00:16:09,360 Speaker 1: fake Zombies would go on to form Zzy Top, another 233 00:16:09,400 --> 00:16:13,800 Speaker 1: band with rock and Roll Hall of Fame status. It's 234 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:16,800 Speaker 1: been fun and a little daunting to fill the band 235 00:16:16,840 --> 00:16:19,680 Speaker 1: in on this strange, almost unbelievable chapter in their history, 236 00:16:19,920 --> 00:16:24,480 Speaker 1: fifty five years after it happened. If you want to 237 00:16:24,480 --> 00:16:27,320 Speaker 1: know how the fake Zombies came to be, you need 238 00:16:27,360 --> 00:16:30,360 Speaker 1: to know a little about the real Zombies. When I 239 00:16:30,400 --> 00:16:33,440 Speaker 1: sit down with Rod Argent, world class keyboardist and chief 240 00:16:33,480 --> 00:16:36,920 Speaker 1: songwriter in the Zombies, it's immediately clear that he doesn't 241 00:16:36,920 --> 00:16:40,360 Speaker 1: hold any grudges towards Frank Dusty or any other of 242 00:16:40,360 --> 00:16:41,600 Speaker 1: their American impostors. 243 00:16:43,040 --> 00:16:44,400 Speaker 5: My name is Rod Argent. 244 00:16:45,280 --> 00:16:47,960 Speaker 3: I got the first first group of guys together, which 245 00:16:48,040 --> 00:16:51,000 Speaker 3: turned out to be the Zombies, with one change, and 246 00:16:51,040 --> 00:16:55,040 Speaker 3: that change wasn't a Dusty Hill or Frank beard On 247 00:16:55,160 --> 00:16:56,520 Speaker 3: Hasten Twad There. 248 00:16:56,360 --> 00:16:56,800 Speaker 5: You Are. 249 00:16:58,880 --> 00:17:03,040 Speaker 1: Originally was the lead singer of the Zombies, and Colin Blunstone, 250 00:17:03,400 --> 00:17:05,760 Speaker 1: one of the greatest singers of all time, was just 251 00:17:05,800 --> 00:17:10,560 Speaker 1: the rhythm guitarist. After hearing Colin singer Ricky Nelson song 252 00:17:10,600 --> 00:17:12,920 Speaker 1: to himself at practice one day in nineteen sixty one, 253 00:17:13,480 --> 00:17:16,320 Speaker 1: Rod told Colin he absolutely had to be the front man. 254 00:17:17,680 --> 00:17:20,480 Speaker 1: Rod moved over to keyboards and the band developed their sound. 255 00:17:20,920 --> 00:17:24,159 Speaker 3: I said, lasting harmonies, and I sort out with harmonies 256 00:17:24,240 --> 00:17:29,120 Speaker 3: and things and and ar piano, and then for ages, 257 00:17:29,160 --> 00:17:31,520 Speaker 3: we just rehearsed and rehearsed. We did what Dave Groh 258 00:17:31,640 --> 00:17:34,399 Speaker 3: suggested people do. We just got a group of friends together, 259 00:17:35,320 --> 00:17:37,760 Speaker 3: went into a garage, although this was a US club, 260 00:17:37,800 --> 00:17:42,080 Speaker 3: and sucked, and we did suck. For a few months. 261 00:17:43,160 --> 00:17:45,400 Speaker 1: The band held their sound and became a local sensation 262 00:17:45,480 --> 00:17:48,240 Speaker 1: in their hometown of Saint Albans, a small city just 263 00:17:48,280 --> 00:17:49,159 Speaker 1: northwest of London. 264 00:17:49,680 --> 00:17:53,240 Speaker 3: Then we got good and we built an enormous following 265 00:17:53,240 --> 00:17:55,880 Speaker 3: instant Albans. And in fact, there was one the very 266 00:17:56,080 --> 00:17:58,000 Speaker 3: one of the very first gigs. There was a dance 267 00:17:58,080 --> 00:18:01,119 Speaker 3: band on that evening. It was probably thirty or forty 268 00:18:01,119 --> 00:18:05,280 Speaker 3: people there and we played in the interval for twenty 269 00:18:05,280 --> 00:18:07,120 Speaker 3: minutes and it went down the storm what we played 270 00:18:07,160 --> 00:18:11,080 Speaker 3: in the interval, playing rock and roll, and we got 271 00:18:11,080 --> 00:18:14,560 Speaker 3: booked back in a year they'd had to build a 272 00:18:14,600 --> 00:18:18,159 Speaker 3: marquee on the side of it, to take audiences of 273 00:18:18,200 --> 00:18:20,240 Speaker 3: four hundred people or more. 274 00:18:20,880 --> 00:18:22,120 Speaker 5: That was our first success. 275 00:18:23,200 --> 00:18:25,520 Speaker 1: Rod was young and ambitious, and the fact that he 276 00:18:25,560 --> 00:18:27,359 Speaker 1: had the hardest band in town gave him a boost 277 00:18:27,359 --> 00:18:31,960 Speaker 1: of confidence, so he started writing songs. His first attempt 278 00:18:32,200 --> 00:18:34,679 Speaker 1: would change his and his bandmates lives forever. 279 00:18:36,640 --> 00:18:38,720 Speaker 5: I went away and I wrote she Is Not There. 280 00:18:39,240 --> 00:18:42,080 Speaker 3: And I came back and played it to the guys 281 00:18:42,160 --> 00:18:45,240 Speaker 3: and they were all flabber casting. But in my naivety 282 00:18:45,240 --> 00:18:48,520 Speaker 3: and ignorance, I thought, yeah, I can write a song 283 00:18:48,560 --> 00:18:51,040 Speaker 3: that's as good as the Beatles, because they just hear 284 00:18:51,440 --> 00:18:55,679 Speaker 3: the UK a couple of years before the US. It 285 00:18:55,760 --> 00:18:59,040 Speaker 3: was as easy as that. And we went and recorded 286 00:18:59,040 --> 00:19:00,920 Speaker 3: it and I thought, yeah, look come out and it'd 287 00:19:00,960 --> 00:19:05,439 Speaker 3: be a huge hit everywhere, blowing me down. It was, 288 00:19:05,640 --> 00:19:10,520 Speaker 3: and it was wonderfully exciting, but I sort of expected 289 00:19:10,520 --> 00:19:12,960 Speaker 3: it because I was so young and green. 290 00:19:14,600 --> 00:19:17,800 Speaker 1: Rod was right, She's Not There ofvaulted them from local 291 00:19:17,840 --> 00:19:19,919 Speaker 1: band to bona fide stars. 292 00:19:20,480 --> 00:19:23,040 Speaker 3: I very soon came to my senses and realized that 293 00:19:23,080 --> 00:19:24,359 Speaker 3: things weren't always going to be like that. 294 00:19:27,160 --> 00:19:29,720 Speaker 1: They wouldn't feel the effects until years later, but the 295 00:19:29,720 --> 00:19:32,399 Speaker 1: fact that Rod and bassist Chris White wrote She's Not 296 00:19:32,480 --> 00:19:35,399 Speaker 1: There and the rest of the Zombies early catalog created 297 00:19:35,400 --> 00:19:39,040 Speaker 1: an unseen divide in the band. Rod and Chris had 298 00:19:39,080 --> 00:19:42,320 Speaker 1: publishing money. The rest of the band had to survive 299 00:19:42,359 --> 00:19:44,000 Speaker 1: on their meager live performance fees. 300 00:19:44,760 --> 00:19:48,200 Speaker 3: We were not managed in the best of ways, and 301 00:19:49,359 --> 00:19:54,200 Speaker 3: we had very honest publishers. So basically, from the publishing 302 00:19:54,200 --> 00:19:56,439 Speaker 3: point of view, the two songwriters in the band, and 303 00:19:56,480 --> 00:20:00,640 Speaker 3: particularly because I'd written the Hiss, were pretty well off 304 00:20:00,640 --> 00:20:04,159 Speaker 3: for money, so that was great as far as Chris 305 00:20:04,200 --> 00:20:05,440 Speaker 3: and I were concern. 306 00:20:05,920 --> 00:20:08,600 Speaker 1: That financial divide would become more apparent When the band 307 00:20:08,640 --> 00:20:11,960 Speaker 1: came to America in nineteen sixty four, She's Not There 308 00:20:12,080 --> 00:20:15,120 Speaker 1: was a huge hit in the US. This was an 309 00:20:15,119 --> 00:20:17,960 Speaker 1: era whin singles mattered, so rather than tour of the 310 00:20:18,000 --> 00:20:21,000 Speaker 1: States alone, the Zombies found themselves on a big package 311 00:20:21,040 --> 00:20:23,320 Speaker 1: tour where they shared the stage with dozens of other 312 00:20:23,320 --> 00:20:24,320 Speaker 1: popular acts. 313 00:20:24,720 --> 00:20:27,400 Speaker 3: From the actual performance point of view, when you considered 314 00:20:27,440 --> 00:20:30,639 Speaker 3: we'd had a number one record, we were the first 315 00:20:30,680 --> 00:20:33,600 Speaker 3: record after the Beatles for an English band to go 316 00:20:33,640 --> 00:20:36,439 Speaker 3: to number one with a self written composition, and we 317 00:20:36,440 --> 00:20:39,879 Speaker 3: were headlining these places where we're doing six shows a 318 00:20:39,920 --> 00:20:42,000 Speaker 3: day to thousands of people in the audience. 319 00:20:43,040 --> 00:20:46,280 Speaker 1: The band's first US shows were anything but glamorous. These 320 00:20:46,280 --> 00:20:48,960 Speaker 1: package tours were tough business, even for a band with 321 00:20:49,000 --> 00:20:52,720 Speaker 1: a hit record. There were no deluxe hotel suites or 322 00:20:52,760 --> 00:20:56,600 Speaker 1: private planes, just a bus packed full of musicians traveling 323 00:20:56,600 --> 00:20:59,560 Speaker 1: from town to town, playing multiple sets almost every night. 324 00:21:00,280 --> 00:21:03,119 Speaker 3: We used to travel in an ordinary passenger coach, no 325 00:21:03,760 --> 00:21:05,920 Speaker 3: beds or anything like that, and we only stayed in 326 00:21:05,960 --> 00:21:09,000 Speaker 3: the hotel every two nights, so the other nights we 327 00:21:09,040 --> 00:21:12,800 Speaker 3: would travel overnight to save money for these people that 328 00:21:12,840 --> 00:21:14,240 Speaker 3: were ripping us off. 329 00:21:14,320 --> 00:21:18,159 Speaker 1: Really, touring ended up being a zero sum game for 330 00:21:18,240 --> 00:21:18,840 Speaker 1: the band. 331 00:21:19,200 --> 00:21:21,560 Speaker 3: I mean that bit was magical, but from the point 332 00:21:21,600 --> 00:21:25,120 Speaker 3: of view of money, no one earned a penny. When 333 00:21:25,160 --> 00:21:28,360 Speaker 3: we finally split up the first incarnation of the Zombies, 334 00:21:28,840 --> 00:21:31,119 Speaker 3: I think we'd broken even. We hadn't lost money, but 335 00:21:31,160 --> 00:21:34,800 Speaker 3: that was all from performance, although I'd got a very 336 00:21:34,840 --> 00:21:37,040 Speaker 3: good living indeed, because of my writing. 337 00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:41,240 Speaker 1: By in eighteen sixty seven, that divide between Rod and Chris, 338 00:21:41,400 --> 00:21:44,480 Speaker 1: the songwriters and the rest of the band began to grow. 339 00:21:45,760 --> 00:21:48,800 Speaker 1: The Zombies were breaking apart, and the guys who didn't 340 00:21:48,800 --> 00:21:52,240 Speaker 1: write the songs were ready to move on to Day Japs. 341 00:21:53,160 --> 00:21:55,880 Speaker 3: We thought, if we are going to break up, we've 342 00:21:55,920 --> 00:21:58,680 Speaker 3: got to try and produce an album ourselves. So if 343 00:21:58,720 --> 00:22:00,320 Speaker 3: it works or if it doesn't. We don't if it's 344 00:22:00,320 --> 00:22:01,960 Speaker 3: going to work, but at least we'll have given it 345 00:22:02,040 --> 00:22:02,600 Speaker 3: a shot. 346 00:22:03,280 --> 00:22:06,639 Speaker 1: That last ditch effort would become the band's now legendary album, 347 00:22:06,880 --> 00:22:09,879 Speaker 1: Odyssey and Oracle. The band knew it was their last 348 00:22:09,960 --> 00:22:13,480 Speaker 1: and best shot. They were given a shoestring budget. 349 00:22:14,320 --> 00:22:16,159 Speaker 3: They were willing to give us one thousand pounds to 350 00:22:16,160 --> 00:22:18,000 Speaker 3: do it, which even then was a very small amount 351 00:22:18,040 --> 00:22:18,399 Speaker 3: of money. 352 00:22:19,040 --> 00:22:21,639 Speaker 1: The band assembled at Abbey Road, where the Beatles had 353 00:22:21,640 --> 00:22:24,880 Speaker 1: just completed Sergeant Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band. They worked 354 00:22:24,880 --> 00:22:27,680 Speaker 1: on Odyssey and Oracle in the studios off hours. 355 00:22:28,440 --> 00:22:30,520 Speaker 3: Even though it was recorded over a six month period 356 00:22:31,320 --> 00:22:33,520 Speaker 3: or something like that, we couldn't dedicate a lot of 357 00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:34,280 Speaker 3: time to each track. 358 00:22:34,280 --> 00:22:35,440 Speaker 5: We were writing as we went along. 359 00:22:35,520 --> 00:22:40,040 Speaker 1: Basically, the time constraints in the studio forced the band 360 00:22:40,080 --> 00:22:41,280 Speaker 1: to practice heart. 361 00:22:42,000 --> 00:22:46,200 Speaker 3: We would typically do a track in lesson three hours 362 00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:47,680 Speaker 3: we'd really prepared. 363 00:22:48,960 --> 00:22:51,600 Speaker 1: The Zombies completed Odyssee in Oracle over a six month 364 00:22:51,600 --> 00:22:54,320 Speaker 1: period in nineteen sixty seven, and the album was released 365 00:22:54,359 --> 00:22:59,240 Speaker 1: on April nineteenth, nineteen sixty eight. Rod said CBS's release 366 00:22:59,280 --> 00:23:03,119 Speaker 1: of the album felt like an afterthought. Nothing illustrates the 367 00:23:03,160 --> 00:23:06,600 Speaker 1: band's status at their label more than the album cover itself. 368 00:23:07,320 --> 00:23:11,720 Speaker 1: The word Odyssey is misspelled, the first y replaced with 369 00:23:11,760 --> 00:23:12,080 Speaker 1: an E. 370 00:23:13,080 --> 00:23:15,080 Speaker 3: It wasn't like they'd signed a wonderful new band or 371 00:23:15,119 --> 00:23:18,760 Speaker 3: anything like that. They put the album out, but it 372 00:23:18,800 --> 00:23:21,600 Speaker 3: wasn't like with the full weight of everything behind the company. 373 00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:23,919 Speaker 3: And then when the first single wasn't a hit, they 374 00:23:23,960 --> 00:23:24,880 Speaker 3: sort of lost interest. 375 00:23:25,640 --> 00:23:28,320 Speaker 1: The first single and the second single flopped in the 376 00:23:28,440 --> 00:23:32,159 Speaker 1: UK and the US, but in nineteen sixty nine, the 377 00:23:32,200 --> 00:23:35,400 Speaker 1: third single, Time of the Season caught on in America. 378 00:23:36,880 --> 00:23:39,040 Speaker 1: The Zombies were such a low priority at their label, 379 00:23:39,520 --> 00:23:43,520 Speaker 1: no one bothered to tell the band, and that is 380 00:23:43,520 --> 00:23:47,320 Speaker 1: how we get the fake zombies. Do you remember when 381 00:23:47,640 --> 00:23:49,760 Speaker 1: you found out that Colin was dead. 382 00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:56,400 Speaker 3: Yes, but we managed to revive him and made him 383 00:23:56,520 --> 00:23:59,760 Speaker 3: do his exercises and he's pretty much back where he 384 00:23:59,880 --> 00:24:00,359 Speaker 3: was something. 385 00:24:00,440 --> 00:24:02,080 Speaker 5: Yeah, So I'm very pleased with that. 386 00:24:02,320 --> 00:24:04,600 Speaker 1: Because the way this whole scheme happens is this shady 387 00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:09,040 Speaker 1: manager starts telling people that Colin has tragically passed away. 388 00:24:09,600 --> 00:24:11,200 Speaker 5: I know it's so funny. 389 00:24:11,600 --> 00:24:15,520 Speaker 1: It is funny and strange and a trip to be 390 00:24:15,560 --> 00:24:18,160 Speaker 1: telling the story of the fake Zombies to the real Zombies. 391 00:24:19,840 --> 00:24:22,600 Speaker 1: Rod Argent wrote the songs, so even though the band's 392 00:24:22,600 --> 00:24:25,840 Speaker 1: star was fading, the money he'd made from publishing softened 393 00:24:25,840 --> 00:24:31,120 Speaker 1: the blow. Rod immediately parlayed his success with the Zombies 394 00:24:31,119 --> 00:24:34,919 Speaker 1: into his next band, Argent, which took the psychedelic and 395 00:24:34,960 --> 00:24:37,560 Speaker 1: prog rock elements of his first band and turned them 396 00:24:37,560 --> 00:24:41,679 Speaker 1: all the way up. He had another hit record with 397 00:24:41,800 --> 00:24:52,240 Speaker 1: Argent right out of the gate. It wasn't so easy 398 00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:56,560 Speaker 1: for Zombie singer Colin Bluntstone. There was no smooth transition 399 00:24:56,600 --> 00:24:58,920 Speaker 1: to the next band for Colin like there was for Rod. 400 00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:02,040 Speaker 1: There were no royalty checks for the songs that made 401 00:25:02,040 --> 00:25:06,800 Speaker 1: the Zombies famous, and in nineteen sixty nine, Colin found 402 00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:11,480 Speaker 1: out about a rumor circulating in America shared by Delta Promotions, 403 00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:17,480 Speaker 1: that he was dead. When we return talk with the 404 00:25:17,480 --> 00:25:37,720 Speaker 1: man himself, Colin Blunstone. 405 00:25:41,640 --> 00:25:44,760 Speaker 4: The music industry likes to be able to categorize bands, 406 00:25:45,520 --> 00:25:49,320 Speaker 4: and I think that radio and the media in general, 407 00:25:49,520 --> 00:25:52,679 Speaker 4: magazines and so forth, found it difficult to categorize as 408 00:25:52,720 --> 00:25:55,960 Speaker 4: zumbas because we didn't play music like anybody else. 409 00:25:57,480 --> 00:25:59,560 Speaker 1: The first thing you notice when you become a Zombies 410 00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:06,439 Speaker 1: fan is that voice, that unmistakable, heartbreaking voice. Amazingly, at 411 00:26:06,480 --> 00:26:10,560 Speaker 1: age seventy nine, Colin Blunstone still sounds the same. His 412 00:26:10,640 --> 00:26:12,720 Speaker 1: voice has an age to day, and he still sings 413 00:26:12,720 --> 00:26:15,880 Speaker 1: their songs from the sixties and their original keys, something 414 00:26:15,960 --> 00:26:20,040 Speaker 1: true of almost no other frontman from their era. But 415 00:26:20,080 --> 00:26:23,480 Speaker 1: despite having one of the world's most beautiful voices, Colin 416 00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:25,879 Speaker 1: wasn't seeking out the spotlight when the Zombies formed. 417 00:26:26,040 --> 00:26:28,760 Speaker 4: When we got together in nineteen sixty one, in our 418 00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:32,040 Speaker 4: first rehearsal, Rod was going to be the lead singer 419 00:26:32,359 --> 00:26:35,239 Speaker 4: and I was going to be a rhythm guitarist. And 420 00:26:35,320 --> 00:26:38,399 Speaker 4: in my mind's eye, I imagine me right at the 421 00:26:38,400 --> 00:26:42,520 Speaker 4: back of the stage rhythm guitarists looking at my shoes. 422 00:26:43,560 --> 00:26:46,320 Speaker 1: Even though they were just kids, Colin and Rod saw 423 00:26:46,359 --> 00:26:48,560 Speaker 1: something in each other that the other couldn't see and 424 00:26:48,560 --> 00:26:52,320 Speaker 1: brought it to the surface. At their first rehearsal, Colin 425 00:26:52,359 --> 00:26:53,680 Speaker 1: knew Rod had something special. 426 00:26:54,840 --> 00:26:56,919 Speaker 4: He went over to this broken down piano in the 427 00:26:56,920 --> 00:26:59,639 Speaker 4: corner of the rehearsal room and he played not rocker 428 00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:02,720 Speaker 4: by Bumbling the Stingers, which is you've got to be 429 00:27:02,800 --> 00:27:07,280 Speaker 4: an accomplished keyboard player to play It's a rock take 430 00:27:07,359 --> 00:27:12,199 Speaker 4: on a classical piece. And I was absolutely stunned. He 431 00:27:12,320 --> 00:27:15,960 Speaker 4: was in a completely different musical class to the rest 432 00:27:16,040 --> 00:27:16,640 Speaker 4: of us. 433 00:27:30,400 --> 00:27:32,080 Speaker 1: Rod saw something great in Colin too. 434 00:27:33,280 --> 00:27:36,679 Speaker 4: At the end of the rehearsal, I was just putting 435 00:27:36,680 --> 00:27:39,600 Speaker 4: my guitar away and I just started singing to myself. 436 00:27:40,040 --> 00:27:42,679 Speaker 4: I swear to you, I was not auditioning for the 437 00:27:42,720 --> 00:27:46,320 Speaker 4: Giga lead singer. I was just putting my guitar away 438 00:27:46,600 --> 00:27:49,720 Speaker 4: and I sang a Ricky Nelson song which I think 439 00:27:50,240 --> 00:27:53,440 Speaker 4: was It's Late. And Rod heard me and he said, 440 00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:56,439 Speaker 4: I'll tell you what. If you'll be the lead singer, 441 00:27:56,840 --> 00:28:00,320 Speaker 4: I'll play keyboards, And essentially that. 442 00:28:00,320 --> 00:28:01,320 Speaker 5: Was the Zombies. 443 00:28:02,440 --> 00:28:06,480 Speaker 1: Naturally soft spoken and reserved, Colin reluctantly became the voice 444 00:28:06,520 --> 00:28:10,080 Speaker 1: of the Zombies. She's not their hit and the band 445 00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:13,480 Speaker 1: became part of the British Invasion wave. When the band 446 00:28:13,480 --> 00:28:16,040 Speaker 1: came to America for the first time, they were already 447 00:28:16,080 --> 00:28:19,399 Speaker 1: rock stars, something Colin was clearly taken abackground. 448 00:28:21,880 --> 00:28:23,800 Speaker 4: We came over in the first place and we played 449 00:28:23,840 --> 00:28:27,200 Speaker 4: the Murray the k Christmas Show at the Brooklyn Fox. 450 00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:32,280 Speaker 4: We stayed in a hotel quite near to the Brooklyn Fox, 451 00:28:32,520 --> 00:28:34,800 Speaker 4: and I remember there were crowds around the block. We 452 00:28:34,840 --> 00:28:38,440 Speaker 4: couldn't go out in the daytime because the British invasion 453 00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:41,720 Speaker 4: had arrived and all that kind of thing. And Paul Atkinson, 454 00:28:41,760 --> 00:28:45,200 Speaker 4: our guitarists, went out through the stage door once and 455 00:28:45,280 --> 00:28:47,480 Speaker 4: he was pushed up against the play class window and 456 00:28:47,520 --> 00:28:50,080 Speaker 4: his shirt was ripped off in and the police came 457 00:28:50,120 --> 00:28:52,720 Speaker 4: and got him and said, look, we'll do this once. 458 00:28:53,080 --> 00:28:57,120 Speaker 1: That's it. Those early US gigs were a crash course 459 00:28:57,160 --> 00:29:00,720 Speaker 1: in performing live for the band. They played all day, 460 00:29:01,280 --> 00:29:03,800 Speaker 1: but somehow it never resulted in the band seeing any money. 461 00:29:04,720 --> 00:29:06,960 Speaker 4: The irony was that we had to stay in the 462 00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:09,720 Speaker 4: building all day, and the first show was very early 463 00:29:09,760 --> 00:29:11,880 Speaker 4: in the day. We played like six shows a day, 464 00:29:12,120 --> 00:29:14,520 Speaker 4: but you only played a couple of songs, so they're 465 00:29:14,560 --> 00:29:17,040 Speaker 4: like fourteen acts. But what it was struck me as 466 00:29:17,040 --> 00:29:19,520 Speaker 4: funny was that at the end of the day the 467 00:29:19,560 --> 00:29:22,000 Speaker 4: crowds had all gone. We didn't have any money. 468 00:29:23,880 --> 00:29:27,120 Speaker 1: Colin was young and incredibly green. Suddenly he was in 469 00:29:27,160 --> 00:29:30,440 Speaker 1: New York with no money, trying to navigate a strange 470 00:29:30,480 --> 00:29:31,320 Speaker 1: American city. 471 00:29:32,480 --> 00:29:34,280 Speaker 4: So you know, we couldn't go out at all in 472 00:29:34,320 --> 00:29:35,840 Speaker 4: the day, and that we would go home on the 473 00:29:35,880 --> 00:29:40,200 Speaker 4: Brooklyn Subway, which at the time we were told was 474 00:29:40,280 --> 00:29:41,560 Speaker 4: quite dangerous to do. 475 00:29:43,120 --> 00:29:45,360 Speaker 1: The truly great part of those early US dates for 476 00:29:45,440 --> 00:29:48,160 Speaker 1: Colin was learning from the incredible slate of artists on 477 00:29:48,200 --> 00:29:50,080 Speaker 1: those six show a day bills. 478 00:29:50,680 --> 00:29:52,480 Speaker 4: Some of the people that were on the bill with us, 479 00:29:52,560 --> 00:29:58,200 Speaker 4: but Deal Morrick, the Shangri Las, Benny King, the Cherells. 480 00:29:59,280 --> 00:30:02,560 Speaker 1: These packaged tours were wildly diverse, and the zombies were 481 00:30:02,600 --> 00:30:04,640 Speaker 1: sharing the stage with artists they'd idolized when they were 482 00:30:04,680 --> 00:30:08,160 Speaker 1: kids back in England. Their minds were blown regularly. 483 00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:12,880 Speaker 4: The one who was for us, the real star, Patty 484 00:30:12,960 --> 00:30:16,960 Speaker 4: LaBelle and the Blue Bells were on and they were 485 00:30:17,080 --> 00:30:20,880 Speaker 4: very kind to us. Remember some of us were eighteen 486 00:30:21,840 --> 00:30:25,080 Speaker 4: and to come to America, the home of rock and roll, 487 00:30:25,640 --> 00:30:28,560 Speaker 4: the home of the blues, the home of jazz, it 488 00:30:28,600 --> 00:30:32,120 Speaker 4: was a huge deal for us. It's where every British 489 00:30:32,480 --> 00:30:35,040 Speaker 4: musician wants to come and play. But it's a bit 490 00:30:35,080 --> 00:30:38,120 Speaker 4: of are inspiring to get up on a stage and 491 00:30:38,280 --> 00:30:40,680 Speaker 4: share the stage with these wonderful artists. 492 00:30:41,440 --> 00:30:44,480 Speaker 1: Colin was in heaven and he was listening when these 493 00:30:44,560 --> 00:30:46,640 Speaker 1: legends shared their time with him and his bandmates. 494 00:30:48,160 --> 00:30:51,080 Speaker 4: Patty LaBelle and the Blue Bells gave us a lot 495 00:30:51,120 --> 00:30:55,320 Speaker 4: of their time and they were really good and suggesting 496 00:30:56,160 --> 00:30:59,640 Speaker 4: you should try this new kid on the block, Aretha Franklin, 497 00:30:59,800 --> 00:31:03,480 Speaker 4: just she's just starting out, and maybe you should look 498 00:31:03,560 --> 00:31:06,360 Speaker 4: up for Nina Simone, the the two I remember from 499 00:31:06,400 --> 00:31:10,480 Speaker 4: our conversations, and of course we did. But we had 500 00:31:10,520 --> 00:31:13,640 Speaker 4: to follow Patti LaBelle and the Blue Bells, and I 501 00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:18,920 Speaker 4: have to tell you they were absolutely fabulous and they 502 00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:20,840 Speaker 4: brought the house down for every show. 503 00:31:22,080 --> 00:31:25,760 Speaker 1: It was daunting performing with people you considered gods. 504 00:31:26,200 --> 00:31:28,920 Speaker 4: There was a degree of anxiety, I think in the 505 00:31:28,920 --> 00:31:32,360 Speaker 4: wings before we went on, but the audiences were very kind, 506 00:31:32,480 --> 00:31:34,280 Speaker 4: and I mean we were helped by the fact that 507 00:31:34,360 --> 00:31:36,840 Speaker 4: we had the national number one record at the time, 508 00:31:37,320 --> 00:31:38,880 Speaker 4: so I mean that does help. 509 00:31:41,800 --> 00:31:44,640 Speaker 1: The Zombie second trip Stateside was for another package tour. 510 00:31:45,440 --> 00:31:47,600 Speaker 1: This time they left New York and hit the road. 511 00:31:48,440 --> 00:31:51,520 Speaker 4: We came back in nineteen sixty five and we were 512 00:31:51,600 --> 00:31:53,880 Speaker 4: on Dick Clark Caravan and Stars. 513 00:31:54,960 --> 00:31:57,360 Speaker 1: It was on that Dick Clark tour that Tom Petty 514 00:31:57,400 --> 00:31:59,880 Speaker 1: and his bandmate Mike Campbell saw the real Zombies play 515 00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:04,360 Speaker 1: in Jacksonville, Florida. Seeing places like Florida the rest of 516 00:32:04,400 --> 00:32:07,240 Speaker 1: the American South was a real culture shock for Colin 517 00:32:07,360 --> 00:32:08,120 Speaker 1: and his bandmates. 518 00:32:10,080 --> 00:32:13,200 Speaker 4: It's difficult to tell because we were in and out 519 00:32:13,280 --> 00:32:16,800 Speaker 4: so quickly, but I saw strange signs that were very 520 00:32:16,840 --> 00:32:25,040 Speaker 4: alien to someone from England, you know, like white restaurants 521 00:32:25,120 --> 00:32:30,160 Speaker 4: and colored restrooms and things which seemed really strange. We 522 00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:33,360 Speaker 4: couldn't stay in some hotels, and because it was a 523 00:32:33,400 --> 00:32:37,400 Speaker 4: basically black tool and we couldn't go into some restaurants, 524 00:32:37,600 --> 00:32:43,880 Speaker 4: so it got a bit hairy sometimes. I remember coming 525 00:32:43,920 --> 00:32:46,440 Speaker 4: into a hotel and I had my arm around the 526 00:32:46,440 --> 00:32:50,440 Speaker 4: shoulder of Carolyn Gill, who was the lead singer in 527 00:32:50,480 --> 00:32:56,400 Speaker 4: the Valvelette, who were a wonderful tambler girl group, very underrated, 528 00:32:56,640 --> 00:33:00,000 Speaker 4: fantastic and our too. Manager came over to me said, Litten, 529 00:33:00,040 --> 00:33:02,920 Speaker 4: and I've just been told you have to move away 530 00:33:02,920 --> 00:33:04,800 Speaker 4: from Ky and Gil or you're going to get shot. 531 00:33:06,040 --> 00:33:08,280 Speaker 4: I never heard language like that before. I've never seen 532 00:33:08,280 --> 00:33:11,480 Speaker 4: a gun before I came to America. It was yeah, 533 00:33:11,840 --> 00:33:13,280 Speaker 4: focused your mind a little bit. 534 00:33:15,840 --> 00:33:17,920 Speaker 1: We know how the next few years go for the band. 535 00:33:18,720 --> 00:33:21,640 Speaker 1: The package tour phenomenon ends and the Zombies fall out 536 00:33:21,640 --> 00:33:24,080 Speaker 1: of favor with audiences in the US and back home 537 00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:27,600 Speaker 1: in England. Like Rod Argent said, by the time the 538 00:33:27,640 --> 00:33:30,040 Speaker 1: band got together to record Odissy and Oracle in nineteen 539 00:33:30,080 --> 00:33:33,719 Speaker 1: sixty seven, they knew it was their last shot, and Colin, 540 00:33:34,160 --> 00:33:36,840 Speaker 1: who didn't write the songs, was feeling the pressure. 541 00:33:38,040 --> 00:33:40,840 Speaker 4: Well, of course, you know, I only ever write a 542 00:33:40,840 --> 00:33:44,479 Speaker 4: couple of songs when the Zombies were together, and I 543 00:33:44,520 --> 00:33:46,760 Speaker 4: didn't write anything for Odissey and Oracle. 544 00:33:47,640 --> 00:33:49,880 Speaker 1: When the band came back together to record the album, 545 00:33:50,000 --> 00:33:52,480 Speaker 1: they had exactly enough material for a full length LP. 546 00:33:53,120 --> 00:33:54,440 Speaker 1: No more, no less. 547 00:33:55,520 --> 00:33:58,200 Speaker 4: There are twelve songs on audis and Oracle. I don't 548 00:33:58,200 --> 00:34:03,040 Speaker 4: think there was a thirteenth song. I can't remember it. You, 549 00:34:03,360 --> 00:34:06,240 Speaker 4: speaking as someone as a bit of an outsider in 550 00:34:06,280 --> 00:34:11,280 Speaker 4: the songwriter department, I think there's just twelve fabulous songs. 551 00:34:11,320 --> 00:34:14,480 Speaker 4: There are no fillers on that album. 552 00:34:14,719 --> 00:34:17,200 Speaker 1: Sonically, the band tried to match the quality of the 553 00:34:17,239 --> 00:34:20,640 Speaker 1: songs with inventive production. They had the house engineers at 554 00:34:20,640 --> 00:34:23,480 Speaker 1: Abbey Road, the best in the business, helping. 555 00:34:23,200 --> 00:34:27,960 Speaker 4: Them, using Peter Vince and Jeff Emmerick as recording engineers 556 00:34:28,080 --> 00:34:30,239 Speaker 4: who had just been working with the Beatles, They were 557 00:34:30,640 --> 00:34:34,360 Speaker 4: firstly lovely people, but also amongst the best recording engineers 558 00:34:34,400 --> 00:34:37,200 Speaker 4: in the world. We were so lucky to be in 559 00:34:37,200 --> 00:34:40,600 Speaker 4: Abbey Road at that time with those engineers that they 560 00:34:40,600 --> 00:34:43,520 Speaker 4: made it very easy, you know, to get a sound. 561 00:34:44,160 --> 00:34:47,840 Speaker 1: The album sounded incredible and it still does, but their label, 562 00:34:48,160 --> 00:34:51,600 Speaker 1: CBS felt that the Zombies were past their expiration point. 563 00:34:54,239 --> 00:34:58,400 Speaker 4: I don't think they were particularly enthusiastic. They issued a 564 00:34:58,480 --> 00:35:01,880 Speaker 4: first single, which was care of Cell forty four, which 565 00:35:01,960 --> 00:35:06,000 Speaker 4: I thought was the most commercial track on the album. 566 00:35:06,440 --> 00:35:10,560 Speaker 4: So never ask me to pick singles because I'm always wrong, 567 00:35:10,920 --> 00:35:13,600 Speaker 4: and it's actually got a very sad they're right, but 568 00:35:13,680 --> 00:35:16,440 Speaker 4: I just think it really works and I would have 569 00:35:16,480 --> 00:35:22,080 Speaker 4: thought that's a sure fire hit myself, but nothing happened. 570 00:35:23,520 --> 00:35:26,400 Speaker 4: And by this point we weren't managed, we didn't have 571 00:35:26,480 --> 00:35:29,920 Speaker 4: an agent, we weren't getting any enthusiasm from the record company. 572 00:35:30,560 --> 00:35:32,879 Speaker 1: Care of Cell forty four, the story of a man 573 00:35:32,920 --> 00:35:35,120 Speaker 1: writing to his lover from prison, is one of the 574 00:35:35,160 --> 00:35:37,840 Speaker 1: most beautiful songs in the Zombies catalog. It's one of 575 00:35:37,880 --> 00:35:41,480 Speaker 1: the most beautiful songs ever. A great songs don't always 576 00:35:41,480 --> 00:35:42,640 Speaker 1: find their audience. 577 00:35:44,280 --> 00:35:48,960 Speaker 4: When people talk in such hallowed terms about the Zombies now. 578 00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:52,840 Speaker 4: But if they were there then, I can remember we 579 00:35:53,000 --> 00:35:55,920 Speaker 4: lost our agent. I remember us going and seeing another 580 00:35:55,960 --> 00:36:00,279 Speaker 4: agent and he really wasn't interested. He really wasn't. There 581 00:36:00,320 --> 00:36:01,880 Speaker 4: was just nothing happening. 582 00:36:02,920 --> 00:36:05,920 Speaker 1: Care of CEL. Forty four came and went. The Zombies 583 00:36:05,920 --> 00:36:06,959 Speaker 1: were ready to throw in the towel. 584 00:36:08,960 --> 00:36:13,480 Speaker 4: We'd had several big disappointments before that that the band 585 00:36:13,719 --> 00:36:17,880 Speaker 4: were going through a difficult time. And when the single 586 00:36:17,880 --> 00:36:23,000 Speaker 4: didn't happen, we got together for you know, the meeting. 587 00:36:23,440 --> 00:36:26,080 Speaker 4: I think we all knew that something was going to happen, 588 00:36:26,440 --> 00:36:30,040 Speaker 4: but Paul Atkinson said, guys, you know I've just got married. 589 00:36:30,560 --> 00:36:33,440 Speaker 4: He was very bright, Paul, and he'd been offered a 590 00:36:33,520 --> 00:36:36,560 Speaker 4: job in a computer factor. This is nineteen sixty seven. 591 00:36:36,880 --> 00:36:40,640 Speaker 1: A quick note. Paul Atkinson is the only original Zombie 592 00:36:40,680 --> 00:36:43,720 Speaker 1: no longer with us. He would eventually leave the computer 593 00:36:43,800 --> 00:36:46,319 Speaker 1: business and return to music as an A and R man, 594 00:36:46,680 --> 00:36:50,200 Speaker 1: signing up and coming bands. He was pretty good at 595 00:36:50,200 --> 00:36:54,960 Speaker 1: his job. He signed Arbor now back to Carmen on Writers. 596 00:36:54,960 --> 00:36:59,800 Speaker 4: So Paul Atkinson, Hugh Grandier and myself from the live work, 597 00:37:00,280 --> 00:37:03,600 Speaker 4: we had never made any I don't mean any money 598 00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:07,880 Speaker 4: at all. We're having trouble just eating, you know, existing, 599 00:37:08,680 --> 00:37:12,520 Speaker 4: and Rod said, well, if Paul's leaving, I think the 600 00:37:12,560 --> 00:37:16,520 Speaker 4: band should finish. And I remember I wish I had 601 00:37:16,600 --> 00:37:21,360 Speaker 4: said something, but I didn't say anything at all and 602 00:37:21,560 --> 00:37:25,840 Speaker 4: left this meeting and I had no plan b at all. 603 00:37:26,239 --> 00:37:28,640 Speaker 4: I didn't know what I was going to do, and 604 00:37:28,680 --> 00:37:30,760 Speaker 4: I drove home. I was still living with my parents. 605 00:37:31,080 --> 00:37:34,480 Speaker 4: I had no money and no idea of what I 606 00:37:34,520 --> 00:37:37,319 Speaker 4: was going to do. I just didn't know what to do. 607 00:37:38,000 --> 00:37:41,000 Speaker 4: Rod and Chris wanted to stay in music, but they 608 00:37:41,200 --> 00:37:47,200 Speaker 4: developed careers as songwriters. They were successful songwriters. There was 609 00:37:47,360 --> 00:37:50,160 Speaker 4: no interest in me as an artist. I mean, I'm 610 00:37:50,200 --> 00:37:52,879 Speaker 4: embarrassed to say. The phone did not ring. 611 00:37:55,400 --> 00:37:58,480 Speaker 1: Colin had hit records and international tours under his belt, 612 00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:01,280 Speaker 1: but those don't exactly for good resume material. 613 00:38:01,960 --> 00:38:05,080 Speaker 4: I was just sitting at home nothing. I just had 614 00:38:05,120 --> 00:38:08,520 Speaker 4: to try and get a job. And I went to 615 00:38:08,880 --> 00:38:14,120 Speaker 4: three interviews, and on the third interview, I got this 616 00:38:14,280 --> 00:38:18,520 Speaker 4: job in an office not selling insurance. What do I 617 00:38:18,560 --> 00:38:21,840 Speaker 4: know about insurance? I didn't know anything about insurance, but 618 00:38:21,920 --> 00:38:25,239 Speaker 4: I did have to answer the phone, and by sort 619 00:38:25,239 --> 00:38:27,200 Speaker 4: of the middle of the afternoon, I'd been introduced to 620 00:38:27,280 --> 00:38:30,800 Speaker 4: everyone in this huge office, and I was just sitting 621 00:38:30,800 --> 00:38:33,360 Speaker 4: at this desk by myself, and the phone rang in 622 00:38:33,400 --> 00:38:39,120 Speaker 4: front of me. Sorry, this makes me laught. Now I 623 00:38:39,160 --> 00:38:45,920 Speaker 4: had to answer it. I couldn't spell insurance. But I mean, 624 00:38:45,920 --> 00:38:49,239 Speaker 4: if the music business teaches you anything, it teaches you 625 00:38:49,719 --> 00:38:50,480 Speaker 4: how to bluff. 626 00:38:51,960 --> 00:38:56,000 Speaker 1: So we did just that. This was fifty five years ago, 627 00:38:56,560 --> 00:38:59,520 Speaker 1: so now the truth can be known. Colin was not 628 00:38:59,640 --> 00:39:01,000 Speaker 1: a very good insurance agent. 629 00:39:02,880 --> 00:39:07,200 Speaker 4: One of the richest men in the country. We ensured 630 00:39:07,400 --> 00:39:11,160 Speaker 4: the home of his daughter, who was also incredibly wealthy, 631 00:39:11,680 --> 00:39:16,680 Speaker 4: and she had statues and wonderful paintings. So I'm sitting 632 00:39:16,680 --> 00:39:22,000 Speaker 4: there adding up a money to a Dega to Picasso. 633 00:39:22,880 --> 00:39:25,720 Speaker 4: The first time it came at it twenty five million, 634 00:39:26,440 --> 00:39:28,040 Speaker 4: so I thought, well, I better add it up again. 635 00:39:29,200 --> 00:39:35,680 Speaker 4: It's fifteen million the next time, best of three, and 636 00:39:35,719 --> 00:39:39,160 Speaker 4: it's a completely different figure. So in the end, I 637 00:39:39,239 --> 00:39:41,800 Speaker 4: just took something in the middle. She either got away 638 00:39:41,800 --> 00:39:44,680 Speaker 4: with a very light premium, or she may it may 639 00:39:44,680 --> 00:39:47,640 Speaker 4: have been a bit expensive. I'm not quite sure, but 640 00:39:48,920 --> 00:39:52,799 Speaker 4: I wasn't made for insurance. I bluff for about nine months, 641 00:39:53,000 --> 00:39:56,280 Speaker 4: and then a very strange thing happened. 642 00:39:58,840 --> 00:39:59,880 Speaker 5: Without al Cooper. 643 00:40:00,360 --> 00:40:04,880 Speaker 4: None of what happened with that album would. 644 00:40:03,960 --> 00:40:04,880 Speaker 5: Have happened. 645 00:40:06,239 --> 00:40:10,600 Speaker 1: Al Cooper in nineteen sixty nine. Nobody had more cloud, 646 00:40:11,320 --> 00:40:14,520 Speaker 1: nobody had more sway in the music industry than Al Cooper. 647 00:40:16,080 --> 00:40:17,920 Speaker 1: If you don't know his name, you probably know his 648 00:40:17,960 --> 00:40:21,640 Speaker 1: work as a musician. That's him playing organ on Bob 649 00:40:21,719 --> 00:40:25,440 Speaker 1: Dylan's Like a Rolling Stone. Cooper moonlighted as an A 650 00:40:25,520 --> 00:40:28,480 Speaker 1: and R man for CBS Columbia Records when he wasn't 651 00:40:28,480 --> 00:40:32,960 Speaker 1: playing with Dylan, The Rolling Stones or Jimi Hendrix. On 652 00:40:33,000 --> 00:40:35,440 Speaker 1: a trip to England, Cooper picked up a stack of 653 00:40:35,480 --> 00:40:38,840 Speaker 1: albums by undersung British bands, hoping to find a diamond 654 00:40:38,840 --> 00:40:42,200 Speaker 1: in the rough. He happened to pick up a copy 655 00:40:42,200 --> 00:40:43,200 Speaker 1: of Odyssey in Oracle. 656 00:40:44,000 --> 00:40:47,760 Speaker 4: There's so much chance in the story of it, seems 657 00:40:47,800 --> 00:40:50,080 Speaker 4: to me. Al Cooper went back to New York. On 658 00:40:50,360 --> 00:40:54,360 Speaker 4: his first day of work. He went to see Clive Davis, 659 00:40:54,840 --> 00:40:58,000 Speaker 4: mister big in the music business, and he said, I 660 00:40:58,200 --> 00:41:02,080 Speaker 4: found this album, and what ever it costs, we have 661 00:41:02,200 --> 00:41:04,080 Speaker 4: to get this album. 662 00:41:04,360 --> 00:41:07,359 Speaker 1: It turned out Columbia CBS already owned it. 663 00:41:08,760 --> 00:41:11,960 Speaker 4: And Clive Davis said to him, we owned that album. 664 00:41:12,520 --> 00:41:13,960 Speaker 4: We weren't even going to release it. 665 00:41:14,600 --> 00:41:16,160 Speaker 1: Cooper dug in his heels. 666 00:41:16,320 --> 00:41:18,319 Speaker 4: And how Cooper said, you have to release it. 667 00:41:19,800 --> 00:41:23,000 Speaker 1: At first, it looked like how Cooper was wrong and 668 00:41:23,040 --> 00:41:24,720 Speaker 1: the Zombie Star would continue to fade. 669 00:41:25,400 --> 00:41:29,040 Speaker 4: The CBS chose two singles. I think the first one 670 00:41:29,160 --> 00:41:33,680 Speaker 4: was Butcherstow, which is a kind of an unlikely track 671 00:41:33,880 --> 00:41:35,960 Speaker 4: as a single. I think they thought of it as 672 00:41:36,000 --> 00:41:41,399 Speaker 4: a song about Vietnam. It's about war, the horrors of war, 673 00:41:41,480 --> 00:41:44,560 Speaker 4: but it's more specifically about the First World War. 674 00:41:54,440 --> 00:41:56,879 Speaker 7: Yes, that was right. 675 00:42:02,040 --> 00:42:05,239 Speaker 1: The second single released in America was care Ofsel forty four, 676 00:42:06,080 --> 00:42:10,760 Speaker 1: and just like in England, it didn't move the needle. Luckily, 677 00:42:11,160 --> 00:42:12,239 Speaker 1: Cooper was persistent. 678 00:42:13,840 --> 00:42:16,360 Speaker 4: Al Cooper went back again and said, you have to 679 00:42:16,440 --> 00:42:17,440 Speaker 4: release a third single. 680 00:42:17,440 --> 00:42:18,160 Speaker 5: They didn't want to. 681 00:42:18,920 --> 00:42:23,239 Speaker 1: That third single, the Zombiees' last chance at success, would 682 00:42:23,280 --> 00:42:25,359 Speaker 1: change everything for Colin and his band. 683 00:42:25,480 --> 00:42:27,840 Speaker 4: He said, you have to release Time of the Season. 684 00:42:28,880 --> 00:42:31,200 Speaker 1: Time of the Season, a song that would go on 685 00:42:31,280 --> 00:42:34,239 Speaker 1: to define the era and become a classic, almost didn't 686 00:42:34,239 --> 00:42:37,120 Speaker 1: make it to the airwaves of American radio. When it 687 00:42:37,160 --> 00:42:40,640 Speaker 1: did get released, it didn't exactly set the world on fire. 688 00:42:41,440 --> 00:42:44,399 Speaker 4: Even then, there wasn't an immediate reaction. I mean, when 689 00:42:44,560 --> 00:42:48,160 Speaker 4: DJ in boyse the Idaho started playing the record and 690 00:42:48,200 --> 00:42:51,480 Speaker 4: he wouldn't stop. And in those days you could get 691 00:42:51,560 --> 00:42:54,480 Speaker 4: a ripple effect where he kept playing it and other 692 00:42:54,600 --> 00:42:57,480 Speaker 4: stations picked up Time of the Season and over a 693 00:42:57,560 --> 00:42:59,279 Speaker 4: period of months, I mean I got one or two 694 00:42:59,320 --> 00:43:02,120 Speaker 4: phone calls from the States. People were saying Time of 695 00:43:02,120 --> 00:43:04,560 Speaker 4: the Season is being played, you know, and you think 696 00:43:05,600 --> 00:43:07,960 Speaker 4: I can't be true, that people have just been nice. 697 00:43:08,440 --> 00:43:09,520 Speaker 5: I didn't believe. 698 00:43:09,239 --> 00:43:11,440 Speaker 1: It, and that is how we end up with the 699 00:43:11,480 --> 00:43:14,800 Speaker 1: fake Zombies. Those months when Time of the Season spread 700 00:43:14,800 --> 00:43:18,200 Speaker 1: from city to city, the station to station will create 701 00:43:18,200 --> 00:43:21,080 Speaker 1: the perfect conditions for adults promotions to assemble their touring 702 00:43:21,160 --> 00:43:49,160 Speaker 1: versions of a band that didn't exist. Time of the 703 00:43:49,200 --> 00:43:51,840 Speaker 1: Season was a hit in America, and the fake Zombies 704 00:43:51,880 --> 00:43:54,000 Speaker 1: were getting paid more than the real Zombies ever did 705 00:43:54,040 --> 00:43:58,480 Speaker 1: to perform. Colin, back in England was still going to 706 00:43:58,480 --> 00:44:01,560 Speaker 1: work at the insurance office, but after nine months of 707 00:44:01,560 --> 00:44:04,640 Speaker 1: answering phones and filing paperwork, he was ready to get 708 00:44:04,640 --> 00:44:05,920 Speaker 1: back in front of a microphone. 709 00:44:06,239 --> 00:44:11,040 Speaker 4: So after insurance, I would go to Olympic Studios in Bonds, 710 00:44:11,239 --> 00:44:16,520 Speaker 4: that's the southwest of London, and the Stones had been recording. 711 00:44:16,080 --> 00:44:19,680 Speaker 1: The encouraged by producer Mike Hurst, Colin went solo. 712 00:44:21,000 --> 00:44:24,360 Speaker 4: It was very much driven by him, and you know, 713 00:44:24,600 --> 00:44:27,440 Speaker 4: thank Cambers. It was because I didn't even know if 714 00:44:27,440 --> 00:44:29,880 Speaker 4: I wanted to get back into the music business. But 715 00:44:29,960 --> 00:44:32,359 Speaker 4: he had this idea of re recording She's Not There, 716 00:44:33,320 --> 00:44:37,319 Speaker 4: which seemed a little bit strange, but it was a 717 00:44:37,400 --> 00:44:40,120 Speaker 4: way to get back into the studio. And then someone 718 00:44:40,239 --> 00:44:43,040 Speaker 4: decided I should change my name, probably because we were 719 00:44:43,080 --> 00:44:44,439 Speaker 4: re recording She's Not There. 720 00:44:46,000 --> 00:44:46,719 Speaker 1: I saw. 721 00:44:48,120 --> 00:44:50,840 Speaker 2: Sign Chin contriam on. 722 00:44:55,360 --> 00:44:58,879 Speaker 1: Colin re recorded She's Not There, the Zombie's first big hit, 723 00:44:59,520 --> 00:45:03,799 Speaker 1: including version in Italian. Colin's cover if She's Not There 724 00:45:03,880 --> 00:45:07,880 Speaker 1: is truly incredible. It's a harder, more psychedelic version with 725 00:45:07,920 --> 00:45:11,200 Speaker 1: a swagger that the original doesn't quite achieve. It's worth 726 00:45:11,200 --> 00:45:15,160 Speaker 1: seeking out. And in a twist worthy of the Fake Zombies, 727 00:45:15,719 --> 00:45:18,960 Speaker 1: he would no longer be known as Colin Blunstone. He 728 00:45:19,040 --> 00:45:21,040 Speaker 1: became Neil MacArthur. 729 00:45:21,600 --> 00:45:24,680 Speaker 4: I was going to be James MacArthur. And then like 730 00:45:24,840 --> 00:45:28,000 Speaker 4: the day before the record was going to be pressed, 731 00:45:28,560 --> 00:45:32,520 Speaker 4: they discovered that there was an actor in Hawaii Fi 732 00:45:32,520 --> 00:45:36,640 Speaker 4: I called James MacArthur, and so so arbitrary, you're not 733 00:45:36,719 --> 00:45:39,680 Speaker 4: James macarthor anymore. You're Neil MacArthur, and you know, I'm 734 00:45:39,680 --> 00:45:43,640 Speaker 4: just getting fine fine. So I became Neil MacArthur for 735 00:45:43,640 --> 00:45:46,239 Speaker 4: a year and that first record, if She's Not There, 736 00:45:46,280 --> 00:45:50,440 Speaker 4: by Neil MacArthur. It was top thirty single took everyone 737 00:45:50,480 --> 00:45:54,719 Speaker 4: by surprise, most of all me, and I was back 738 00:45:54,760 --> 00:45:55,720 Speaker 4: in the music business. 739 00:45:56,280 --> 00:45:58,000 Speaker 1: Did you tour as Neil MacArthur? 740 00:45:58,160 --> 00:46:03,880 Speaker 4: No, No, I didn't. Actually, poor Neil, he had three singles. 741 00:46:04,160 --> 00:46:08,040 Speaker 4: The other two singles were conspicuous by their lack of 742 00:46:08,920 --> 00:46:11,080 Speaker 4: chart success. 743 00:46:12,440 --> 00:46:15,920 Speaker 1: The Neil MacArthur experience was short lived, but it got 744 00:46:15,920 --> 00:46:19,319 Speaker 1: Colin back in the studio. He would soon reconnect with 745 00:46:19,360 --> 00:46:22,280 Speaker 1: his old bandmates, who helped him regain his confidence. 746 00:46:23,840 --> 00:46:26,120 Speaker 4: I was coming home from a party with Chris White 747 00:46:27,160 --> 00:46:30,120 Speaker 4: and he said to me, you know, Rod and I 748 00:46:30,120 --> 00:46:35,279 Speaker 4: have got a production company together forget Neil MacArthur, you know, 749 00:46:35,440 --> 00:46:37,239 Speaker 4: to get all that. Why didn't you. 750 00:46:37,200 --> 00:46:38,919 Speaker 5: Come and record with us? 751 00:46:39,440 --> 00:46:43,160 Speaker 4: And I just thought it sounded like a really great idea. 752 00:46:43,280 --> 00:46:45,200 Speaker 4: And remember I was the guy who wanted to stand 753 00:46:45,239 --> 00:46:47,200 Speaker 4: at the back of the stage looking at his shoes. 754 00:46:48,960 --> 00:46:51,719 Speaker 4: I wasn't born to be a lead singer, and now 755 00:46:51,760 --> 00:46:53,160 Speaker 4: suddenly I'm a solo singer. 756 00:46:53,239 --> 00:46:54,400 Speaker 5: This is getting serious. 757 00:46:55,320 --> 00:46:58,200 Speaker 4: And it was great to be back with Rod and 758 00:46:58,280 --> 00:47:01,680 Speaker 4: Chris producing my first set of album with them. 759 00:47:02,640 --> 00:47:05,600 Speaker 1: By the time Colin reconnected with his Zombies bandmates, the 760 00:47:05,680 --> 00:47:08,400 Speaker 1: time of the season was a smash in America. It 761 00:47:08,480 --> 00:47:11,040 Speaker 1: went to number three on the Billboard charts and number 762 00:47:11,040 --> 00:47:14,200 Speaker 1: one on cash Box. The band still had no idea 763 00:47:14,239 --> 00:47:17,319 Speaker 1: they had to hit until they got a call from 764 00:47:17,400 --> 00:47:21,719 Speaker 1: Rolling Stone magazine. And at some point in this process, 765 00:47:22,719 --> 00:47:25,600 Speaker 1: a journalist from Rolling Stone gets in touch with the 766 00:47:25,600 --> 00:47:29,960 Speaker 1: band and tells you some a piece of news about yourself. 767 00:47:30,000 --> 00:47:31,960 Speaker 1: Do you remember what he might have told you? 768 00:47:32,920 --> 00:47:36,960 Speaker 4: Yes, oh, I remember very well. Chris White was in 769 00:47:37,000 --> 00:47:39,360 Speaker 4: New York at the time and he'd gone to the 770 00:47:39,640 --> 00:47:42,279 Speaker 4: offices of Rolling Stone and they said that there were 771 00:47:42,719 --> 00:47:50,440 Speaker 4: at least two bands touring as the Zombies and the 772 00:47:50,560 --> 00:47:53,840 Speaker 4: Rolling Stone people in the office got Chris White, original 773 00:47:53,840 --> 00:47:57,040 Speaker 4: base player, to ring the manager of one of these 774 00:47:57,040 --> 00:47:59,800 Speaker 4: bands to engage them in conversation and see what he 775 00:47:59,840 --> 00:48:03,399 Speaker 4: had to say. And the manager said to Chris, well, yes, 776 00:48:03,440 --> 00:48:08,200 Speaker 4: we've started up as Zombies in honor of Colin Blunstone, 777 00:48:08,400 --> 00:48:11,400 Speaker 4: the lead singer from the band, who was tragically killed 778 00:48:11,560 --> 00:48:17,240 Speaker 4: in a car crash. And this was reported in Stone. 779 00:48:17,640 --> 00:48:19,880 Speaker 4: I mean they knew I hadn't been killed in a 780 00:48:19,920 --> 00:48:23,400 Speaker 4: car crash. For years, I carried that clipping around with me. 781 00:48:23,480 --> 00:48:25,880 Speaker 4: I've lost it now. I'm not sure it's really healthy 782 00:48:25,920 --> 00:48:32,960 Speaker 4: to carry your own obituary around with you, but I've 783 00:48:33,000 --> 00:48:35,279 Speaker 4: got it somewhere. But it was in a guitar case 784 00:48:35,320 --> 00:48:37,440 Speaker 4: I used to carry around. So that was this guy's 785 00:48:37,480 --> 00:48:40,520 Speaker 4: story that I'd been killed in a car crash, and 786 00:48:41,719 --> 00:48:51,080 Speaker 4: fortunately I hadn't. Fortunately for me anyway. 787 00:48:49,160 --> 00:48:52,759 Speaker 1: They say you shouldn't meet your heroes. Colin Blunstone disproves 788 00:48:52,760 --> 00:48:56,800 Speaker 1: that rule. He's gracious and humble on and off stage. 789 00:48:58,200 --> 00:49:01,359 Speaker 1: Listening to that voice, counting a faded memory of something 790 00:49:01,400 --> 00:49:04,480 Speaker 1: that happened fifty five years ago, I can't help but 791 00:49:04,520 --> 00:49:07,880 Speaker 1: feel incredibly lucky. The Zombies' music is soundtracked some of 792 00:49:07,880 --> 00:49:11,400 Speaker 1: the biggest moments of my life. Feels like a weird dream. 793 00:49:12,440 --> 00:49:15,120 Speaker 1: My favorite singer on a hotel bad across from me, 794 00:49:15,880 --> 00:49:18,719 Speaker 1: recalling the time when some kids in America pretended to 795 00:49:18,719 --> 00:49:26,560 Speaker 1: be him. I picture Bill Keho sitting in the Delta 796 00:49:26,600 --> 00:49:30,719 Speaker 1: Promotions offices one night, listening to the radio. In time 797 00:49:30,719 --> 00:49:35,080 Speaker 1: of the season drifted across the airwaves, he heard Colin's 798 00:49:35,160 --> 00:49:39,920 Speaker 1: voice and a light bulb went off. Not long after, 799 00:49:40,960 --> 00:49:44,200 Speaker 1: he'd create two versions of the Zombies filled with young 800 00:49:44,320 --> 00:49:51,000 Speaker 1: talented kids from Texas and Michigan. The tale of the 801 00:49:51,040 --> 00:49:54,239 Speaker 1: fake Zombies is about as unlikely as they come, but 802 00:49:54,320 --> 00:49:56,959 Speaker 1: the story of the real Zombies feels pretty unlikely too. 803 00:49:58,000 --> 00:50:00,000 Speaker 1: The zombies have always been in it for the music. 804 00:50:01,360 --> 00:50:03,680 Speaker 1: When the impetus for the creation of a band's primarily 805 00:50:03,719 --> 00:50:06,880 Speaker 1: to make money and make it fast, well, it's a 806 00:50:06,920 --> 00:50:10,840 Speaker 1: lot harder to have any longevity whatsoever, as Delta Promotions 807 00:50:10,840 --> 00:50:15,360 Speaker 1: would soon find out. On the next and final episode 808 00:50:15,400 --> 00:50:18,920 Speaker 1: of the true Story of the Fake Zombies, Delta and 809 00:50:18,960 --> 00:50:21,839 Speaker 1: their whole fake band operation comes to a crashing end 810 00:50:22,440 --> 00:50:24,839 Speaker 1: when they try to start a fake version of a 811 00:50:24,840 --> 00:50:31,080 Speaker 1: cartoon band. Do the words sugar, sugar, honey, honey mean 812 00:50:31,120 --> 00:50:36,960 Speaker 1: anything to you? If you want to get in touch 813 00:50:36,960 --> 00:50:39,840 Speaker 1: about the Fake Zombies, We've set up an email address, 814 00:50:40,440 --> 00:50:44,280 Speaker 1: Fake Zombiespod at gmail dot com. This podcast was written 815 00:50:44,320 --> 00:50:48,400 Speaker 1: by Daniel Ralston. Executive produced by Ian Wheeler, Melissa Locker 816 00:50:48,640 --> 00:50:53,160 Speaker 1: and Daniel Ralston. Produced by Anna McClain and Nick Dawson. Score, 817 00:50:53,440 --> 00:50:57,600 Speaker 1: original music and additional audio engineering by Robin Hatch additional 818 00:50:57,640 --> 00:51:01,600 Speaker 1: production support from Cooper Malt in Los Angeles. Additional recording 819 00:51:01,600 --> 00:51:05,200 Speaker 1: by Joey Armin in Dallas, Texas. The True Story of 820 00:51:05,200 --> 00:51:08,600 Speaker 1: the Fake Zombies is a production of iHeart Podcasts, Talk 821 00:51:08,640 --> 00:51:13,960 Speaker 1: House and Nevermind Media. For more podcasts from iHeart Podcasts, 822 00:51:14,239 --> 00:51:17,960 Speaker 1: visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get 823 00:51:17,960 --> 00:51:18,680 Speaker 1: your podcasts.