1 00:00:01,440 --> 00:00:06,160 Speaker 1: Now from our nation's capital. This is Bloomberg Sound On. 2 00:00:07,240 --> 00:00:10,160 Speaker 1: I'm a little bit unimpressed of the discipline and the 3 00:00:10,200 --> 00:00:13,240 Speaker 1: training level of the Russian forces as it had and 4 00:00:13,280 --> 00:00:16,079 Speaker 1: as terrific as it is. We want to make sure 5 00:00:16,200 --> 00:00:20,400 Speaker 1: that we do not see an escalation. Bloomberg sound on Politics, 6 00:00:20,520 --> 00:00:24,480 Speaker 1: Policy and perspective from DC's top name. My senses the 7 00:00:24,520 --> 00:00:27,400 Speaker 1: commodity person were made very high. Elevated certainly over the 8 00:00:27,400 --> 00:00:29,040 Speaker 1: next year, but it's probably first half the year. You 9 00:00:29,160 --> 00:00:32,600 Speaker 1: Republicans want to give Democrat Day victory on getting public 10 00:00:32,760 --> 00:00:36,040 Speaker 1: China on a political basis, The answer is no. Bloomberg 11 00:00:36,200 --> 00:00:42,240 Speaker 1: Sound On with Joe Matthew on Bloomberg Radio, No more 12 00:00:42,440 --> 00:00:45,520 Speaker 1: Russian oil. That's the word from the White House today, 13 00:00:45,560 --> 00:00:48,640 Speaker 1: turning the screws evermore on Moscow. As the war in 14 00:00:48,760 --> 00:00:52,280 Speaker 1: Ukraine now approaches the two week mark, Welcome to the 15 00:00:52,320 --> 00:00:54,960 Speaker 1: Fastest Hour in Politics. Will have details for you on 16 00:00:54,960 --> 00:00:58,240 Speaker 1: this latest move against Russian energy and discussed it with 17 00:00:58,600 --> 00:01:01,840 Speaker 1: Senator Tina Smith. Demick had from Minnesota, spoke last weekend 18 00:01:01,840 --> 00:01:06,039 Speaker 1: with Ukrainian President Zelenski and has some strong feelings about this. Later, 19 00:01:06,640 --> 00:01:09,959 Speaker 1: we wade into the oil patch with Bob McNally, consultant 20 00:01:10,000 --> 00:01:12,880 Speaker 1: President of Rapid and Energy. As the US seeks to 21 00:01:12,920 --> 00:01:17,160 Speaker 1: replace Russian crewed now in prices move even higher, we 22 00:01:17,240 --> 00:01:19,640 Speaker 1: have a lot of questions that Bob can help us answer. 23 00:01:19,720 --> 00:01:24,440 Speaker 1: The panel today Bloomberg Politics contributor Democratic analyst Jeanie Schanzano, 24 00:01:24,880 --> 00:01:28,160 Speaker 1: along with Republican strategist Credit Joints of Hyatt Farber Shrek, 25 00:01:28,200 --> 00:01:32,520 Speaker 1: former advisor to the House Energy Subcommittee. President Biden had 26 00:01:32,520 --> 00:01:35,960 Speaker 1: a late addition to his schedule today. You heard it, 27 00:01:36,000 --> 00:01:38,319 Speaker 1: saw it as it happened on Bloomberg TV and radio. 28 00:01:38,360 --> 00:01:42,240 Speaker 1: Remarks from the Roosevelt Room five am. We got the schedules. 29 00:01:42,280 --> 00:01:45,800 Speaker 1: What's this? Well, it turned out to be the big 30 00:01:45,800 --> 00:01:50,320 Speaker 1: news we were waiting for. Also a lot later, Uh 31 00:01:50,480 --> 00:01:53,240 Speaker 1: then scheduled mercifully. It was a beautiful day on the 32 00:01:53,280 --> 00:01:56,240 Speaker 1: North Lawn where we all waited for almost forty five 33 00:01:56,280 --> 00:01:58,960 Speaker 1: minutes to hear. Joe Biden confirmed the news that broke 34 00:01:59,360 --> 00:02:03,960 Speaker 1: earlier today on Bloomberg. Here he is today, I'm announcing 35 00:02:03,960 --> 00:02:08,080 Speaker 1: the United States is targeting the main arder of Russian's economy. 36 00:02:08,240 --> 00:02:12,560 Speaker 1: We're banning all imports of Russian oil and gas and energy. 37 00:02:12,840 --> 00:02:15,200 Speaker 1: That means Russian oil will no longer be acceptable at 38 00:02:15,240 --> 00:02:19,280 Speaker 1: US ports, and the American people will deal another powerful 39 00:02:19,280 --> 00:02:23,400 Speaker 1: blow to Putin's war machine. Important to note here Bloomberg 40 00:02:23,480 --> 00:02:26,840 Speaker 1: is reporting the band applies immediately to new purchases, the 41 00:02:26,919 --> 00:02:30,680 Speaker 1: senior administration official saying it also allows for a forty 42 00:02:30,720 --> 00:02:35,160 Speaker 1: five day period to wind down deliveries of existing orders. 43 00:02:35,160 --> 00:02:39,640 Speaker 1: That's something that refiners were hoping to have. The President 44 00:02:39,680 --> 00:02:41,919 Speaker 1: did not take questions today, talked for about ten minutes 45 00:02:42,080 --> 00:02:44,040 Speaker 1: and prepared remarks and tried to get ahead of the 46 00:02:44,080 --> 00:02:47,960 Speaker 1: most obvious question, what about our allies in Europe? Here 47 00:02:47,960 --> 00:02:50,800 Speaker 1: he is again, we're moving forward with this band understanding 48 00:02:50,840 --> 00:02:53,720 Speaker 1: that many of our European allies and partners may not 49 00:02:53,919 --> 00:02:57,000 Speaker 1: be in a position to join us. The United States 50 00:02:57,040 --> 00:03:00,800 Speaker 1: produces far more oil domestically than all of your all 51 00:03:00,840 --> 00:03:04,880 Speaker 1: the European countries combined. In fact, we're a net exporter 52 00:03:04,960 --> 00:03:08,520 Speaker 1: of energy, so we can take this step when others cannot. 53 00:03:09,200 --> 00:03:11,680 Speaker 1: But we're working closely with Europe and our partners to 54 00:03:11,760 --> 00:03:15,440 Speaker 1: develop a long term strategy to reduce their dependence on 55 00:03:15,560 --> 00:03:19,840 Speaker 1: Russian energy as well. Remembering the UK earlier today announced 56 00:03:19,840 --> 00:03:24,960 Speaker 1: plans to phase out Russian oil over months. The Germans 57 00:03:25,000 --> 00:03:27,040 Speaker 1: and the French will rely so heavily on Russia. Of 58 00:03:27,040 --> 00:03:29,880 Speaker 1: the President's point, they simply cannot replace all of that oil, 59 00:03:29,960 --> 00:03:32,280 Speaker 1: not all at once, So we're deeply curious to know 60 00:03:32,400 --> 00:03:37,080 Speaker 1: what kind of alternate sources are being discussed. The announcement 61 00:03:37,080 --> 00:03:39,640 Speaker 1: today came as lawmakers also hammer out details of a 62 00:03:39,680 --> 00:03:43,720 Speaker 1: budget that will include some twelve billion dollars in aid 63 00:03:44,080 --> 00:03:47,680 Speaker 1: for Ukraine. And we want to bring in Senator Tina 64 00:03:47,760 --> 00:03:49,640 Speaker 1: Smith to talk about all of this. The Democrat from 65 00:03:49,640 --> 00:03:52,480 Speaker 1: Minnesota was on a zoom call with President vladimir's Lensky 66 00:03:52,640 --> 00:03:56,640 Speaker 1: last weekend and has been very focused on this. Senator, 67 00:03:56,680 --> 00:04:00,000 Speaker 1: welcome back to Bloomberg Radio. The administration has really done 68 00:04:00,000 --> 00:04:02,280 Speaker 1: and about face here banning Russian oil. Is it the 69 00:04:02,360 --> 00:04:04,800 Speaker 1: right one? Well, thank you, Joe. It is great to 70 00:04:04,800 --> 00:04:06,480 Speaker 1: be with you, and you know, I think that they 71 00:04:06,480 --> 00:04:10,520 Speaker 1: are making the right decision here. The this outrageous and 72 00:04:10,640 --> 00:04:14,200 Speaker 1: unprovoked attack on Ukraine by Russia needs to be met 73 00:04:14,240 --> 00:04:18,400 Speaker 1: with the full force of UM of UM of sanctions. 74 00:04:18,520 --> 00:04:24,360 Speaker 1: And we know that Russia relies on its energy exports 75 00:04:24,400 --> 00:04:28,520 Speaker 1: to UM fuel its economy. UM. As President Biden said, 76 00:04:28,520 --> 00:04:32,480 Speaker 1: we can't UM. You know, the the importance of Russian 77 00:04:32,680 --> 00:04:36,400 Speaker 1: energy exports to Europe is really significant, and the President 78 00:04:36,440 --> 00:04:39,359 Speaker 1: has also worked hard to try to maximize the negative 79 00:04:39,360 --> 00:04:43,320 Speaker 1: impact on Russia while minimizing the negative impact on Americans 80 00:04:43,400 --> 00:04:45,200 Speaker 1: and our allies. And so I think the step that 81 00:04:45,200 --> 00:04:47,839 Speaker 1: he's taking today is there's the right one. I was 82 00:04:47,880 --> 00:04:51,320 Speaker 1: taken by your thread today on Twitter that starts by saying, 83 00:04:51,320 --> 00:04:52,880 Speaker 1: there's been a lot of talk about the need for 84 00:04:53,000 --> 00:04:56,320 Speaker 1: energy independence. Indeed, you go on uh to write the 85 00:04:56,400 --> 00:04:59,960 Speaker 1: obvious solution is to shift to energy that Putin cannot control, 86 00:05:00,160 --> 00:05:04,320 Speaker 1: referring to wind, solar, and other renewables. Senator, can you 87 00:05:04,320 --> 00:05:06,159 Speaker 1: help me what is the progressive view on all of 88 00:05:06,200 --> 00:05:09,320 Speaker 1: this right now that the whole world is seemingly changed 89 00:05:09,320 --> 00:05:11,960 Speaker 1: the last couple of weeks. Is it possible to favor 90 00:05:12,000 --> 00:05:15,880 Speaker 1: renewable energy but also support more domestic production to keep 91 00:05:15,920 --> 00:05:19,000 Speaker 1: prices in check. You know, absolutely it's possible. And I 92 00:05:19,040 --> 00:05:21,160 Speaker 1: think that we need to think about this in terms 93 00:05:21,200 --> 00:05:23,400 Speaker 1: of what is a short term crisis that we are 94 00:05:23,760 --> 00:05:25,800 Speaker 1: what what's the what what is the short term crisis 95 00:05:25,880 --> 00:05:29,960 Speaker 1: confronting us? While looking at the long term policies we 96 00:05:30,040 --> 00:05:32,640 Speaker 1: need to medium term and long term policies we need 97 00:05:32,680 --> 00:05:36,440 Speaker 1: to advance in order to cut ourselves free from a 98 00:05:36,520 --> 00:05:40,160 Speaker 1: reliance on international energy, which means that we will continue 99 00:05:40,200 --> 00:05:42,520 Speaker 1: to be sort of at the beck and call of 100 00:05:42,560 --> 00:05:48,000 Speaker 1: dictators around the world, like putin the power of being 101 00:05:48,200 --> 00:05:51,440 Speaker 1: energy independent and by doing that and doing that through 102 00:05:52,000 --> 00:05:56,600 Speaker 1: UM moving aggressively into clean power and renewable power. Is 103 00:05:56,640 --> 00:05:58,640 Speaker 1: that you know, the Putin has no say on whether 104 00:05:59,320 --> 00:06:01,400 Speaker 1: how much we pay for wind or solar. In fact, 105 00:06:01,400 --> 00:06:04,640 Speaker 1: that power is free. It gives us so much more resilience, 106 00:06:04,680 --> 00:06:09,080 Speaker 1: I think. But it also means more drilling domestically. Uh 107 00:06:09,080 --> 00:06:11,160 Speaker 1: where there's a conference going on in Houston right now. 108 00:06:11,160 --> 00:06:13,880 Speaker 1: The shale drillers are are are are drooling over this 109 00:06:14,400 --> 00:06:18,479 Speaker 1: potential opportunity to replace Russian crude. Is that something you 110 00:06:18,520 --> 00:06:21,760 Speaker 1: support if it gets us through this? Well, I might 111 00:06:21,920 --> 00:06:25,839 Speaker 1: want to point out that three percent of US imports 112 00:06:25,839 --> 00:06:28,680 Speaker 1: of fuel are from Russia. So the actual impact, as 113 00:06:28,720 --> 00:06:32,640 Speaker 1: you know, the actual impact on on domestic energy markets 114 00:06:32,680 --> 00:06:36,520 Speaker 1: by this action UM is relatively small. And we also 115 00:06:36,600 --> 00:06:39,279 Speaker 1: know that the price of UM oil and gas is 116 00:06:39,279 --> 00:06:42,040 Speaker 1: a global price, and so it is somewhat impacted by 117 00:06:42,040 --> 00:06:44,440 Speaker 1: what we UM, what we produce and drill here in 118 00:06:44,480 --> 00:06:47,000 Speaker 1: the United States, but fundamentally, the price is the price 119 00:06:47,040 --> 00:06:50,160 Speaker 1: based on what global supply is and that won't change. 120 00:06:50,600 --> 00:06:52,560 Speaker 1: But your point is a good one, and to this extent, 121 00:06:52,600 --> 00:06:54,640 Speaker 1: I want to just make clear that I know, I 122 00:06:54,680 --> 00:06:56,400 Speaker 1: think that we need to look for ways that we 123 00:06:56,480 --> 00:07:00,799 Speaker 1: can um uh protect Americans against the show of rising 124 00:07:00,880 --> 00:07:04,039 Speaker 1: energy prices right now. But let's understand that it's going 125 00:07:04,080 --> 00:07:07,000 Speaker 1: to take. You know, it's not like we can just 126 00:07:07,040 --> 00:07:10,560 Speaker 1: immediately start drilling and that that oil will be um 127 00:07:10,640 --> 00:07:13,760 Speaker 1: in people's gas tanks, um you know next week. It 128 00:07:13,840 --> 00:07:16,240 Speaker 1: has a lag time, just as building out renewables has 129 00:07:16,280 --> 00:07:18,560 Speaker 1: a lag time. So let's build out the Let's build 130 00:07:18,560 --> 00:07:20,080 Speaker 1: out the clean power that is going to give us 131 00:07:20,120 --> 00:07:23,240 Speaker 1: resilience over the long run. You've seen pulling. I'm sure 132 00:07:23,280 --> 00:07:25,960 Speaker 1: that I had the number from Quinipiac this week was incredible. 133 00:07:25,960 --> 00:07:29,239 Speaker 1: Americans of vast majority of Americans support this move, even 134 00:07:29,280 --> 00:07:33,400 Speaker 1: they say if it means higher gas prices, but that's today, Senator, 135 00:07:33,720 --> 00:07:35,640 Speaker 1: how long can that last? Do you worry about people 136 00:07:35,680 --> 00:07:39,080 Speaker 1: losing patients in the face of record high prices five 137 00:07:39,120 --> 00:07:43,080 Speaker 1: six dollars a gallon in the in the summer driving season. Well, 138 00:07:43,320 --> 00:07:47,320 Speaker 1: the impact of high gas prices and high energy prices 139 00:07:47,320 --> 00:07:50,200 Speaker 1: broadly speaking, on Americans is really something to be worried about. 140 00:07:50,240 --> 00:07:52,120 Speaker 1: And of course I want to point out that that 141 00:07:52,280 --> 00:07:55,640 Speaker 1: impact is felt most by people who are um lower 142 00:07:55,640 --> 00:07:59,320 Speaker 1: income communities, who have much less discretionary income for um 143 00:07:59,360 --> 00:08:02,240 Speaker 1: that that price surge, So we all have to be 144 00:08:02,640 --> 00:08:04,400 Speaker 1: we all have to be concerned about that. But I 145 00:08:04,440 --> 00:08:09,000 Speaker 1: think what you're seeing here is the Americans are watching 146 00:08:09,080 --> 00:08:13,360 Speaker 1: President Zelinski, and they are watching the incredible courage of 147 00:08:13,400 --> 00:08:16,560 Speaker 1: the Ukrainians, and they are feeling proud that we are 148 00:08:16,600 --> 00:08:18,720 Speaker 1: on their side, that we are standing with them in 149 00:08:18,760 --> 00:08:23,960 Speaker 1: the face of this violent, autocratic attack on another democracy. 150 00:08:24,040 --> 00:08:26,880 Speaker 1: And it gives me some hope that Americans today are saying, no, 151 00:08:26,960 --> 00:08:29,600 Speaker 1: I'm willing to I'm willing to make some sacrifices myself 152 00:08:29,680 --> 00:08:31,600 Speaker 1: in order to stand up again. Well, I see that 153 00:08:31,680 --> 00:08:33,920 Speaker 1: and here that as well. Senator. I just know how 154 00:08:33,960 --> 00:08:36,319 Speaker 1: short people's memories can be, especially when it starts to 155 00:08:36,400 --> 00:08:38,840 Speaker 1: hit him in the wallet. Does the President need to 156 00:08:38,880 --> 00:08:40,880 Speaker 1: do more? Do you need to do more to to 157 00:08:40,960 --> 00:08:43,760 Speaker 1: prepare people for what's coming? Well, I think we have 158 00:08:43,840 --> 00:08:45,920 Speaker 1: to be honest with the American people, and I think 159 00:08:46,000 --> 00:08:49,040 Speaker 1: the President did that today in his comments. We need 160 00:08:49,080 --> 00:08:51,640 Speaker 1: to make clear that people understand why this is happening. 161 00:08:51,679 --> 00:08:54,720 Speaker 1: This is this is being caused by you know, Putin's 162 00:08:54,920 --> 00:08:57,360 Speaker 1: brutal war. And I think we also need to maintain 163 00:08:57,480 --> 00:09:00,400 Speaker 1: the bipartisan support for the president's actions. You know, this 164 00:09:00,480 --> 00:09:03,079 Speaker 1: is not a democratic or a Republican idea, this is 165 00:09:03,120 --> 00:09:06,120 Speaker 1: a bipartisan idea. UM. And let me also just say 166 00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:08,720 Speaker 1: the President is taking the steps that he can to 167 00:09:08,920 --> 00:09:11,520 Speaker 1: mitigate the impacts of higher energy prices, and I think 168 00:09:11,520 --> 00:09:13,400 Speaker 1: that that is exactly what we need to do, whether 169 00:09:13,440 --> 00:09:18,160 Speaker 1: it is um you know, releasing um oil from the 170 00:09:18,160 --> 00:09:21,520 Speaker 1: Strategic Oil Reserve, other things that we can do. And 171 00:09:21,559 --> 00:09:24,280 Speaker 1: I think let's just be also honest. The United States 172 00:09:24,360 --> 00:09:27,840 Speaker 1: energy sector UM also needs to step up and do 173 00:09:27,920 --> 00:09:29,720 Speaker 1: their part. And we need to make sure that we're 174 00:09:29,760 --> 00:09:35,640 Speaker 1: not seeing excessive profits being UH being pulled down in 175 00:09:35,640 --> 00:09:38,880 Speaker 1: the midst of Americans struggling to buy gas and pay 176 00:09:38,880 --> 00:09:41,320 Speaker 1: their heating bills. Well, as we're discussing this, senator of 177 00:09:41,400 --> 00:09:44,520 Speaker 1: Poland says it's ready to transfer MiG twenty fighter jets 178 00:09:44,520 --> 00:09:48,360 Speaker 1: to Ukraine by way of a US military base in Germany. 179 00:09:48,400 --> 00:09:49,880 Speaker 1: It would be it would be up to us then 180 00:09:49,920 --> 00:09:53,800 Speaker 1: to to finish that transfer and then replace them with 181 00:09:54,200 --> 00:09:57,439 Speaker 1: used American made jets. Poland says it's ready to buy them. 182 00:09:57,520 --> 00:10:00,000 Speaker 1: This is something that President Zelenski is asking for. Maybe 183 00:10:00,040 --> 00:10:02,040 Speaker 1: he asked you for it directly last weekend? Are you 184 00:10:02,040 --> 00:10:05,560 Speaker 1: worried though Russia considers that an act of war by NATO? 185 00:10:06,760 --> 00:10:10,280 Speaker 1: The president? I know it's been widely reported that President 186 00:10:10,360 --> 00:10:15,640 Speaker 1: Zelenski specifically asked UM for UH protection for air protection. 187 00:10:15,679 --> 00:10:18,440 Speaker 1: And I think it's extremely important as we do everything 188 00:10:18,480 --> 00:10:22,360 Speaker 1: we can to provide security support and humanitarian support to Ukraine, 189 00:10:22,400 --> 00:10:25,480 Speaker 1: that we do not cross the line into having the 190 00:10:25,559 --> 00:10:30,560 Speaker 1: United States and a direct conflict with with Russia in Ukraine, 191 00:10:30,760 --> 00:10:35,960 Speaker 1: because that creates an escalation that I believe is extremely dangerous. 192 00:10:36,000 --> 00:10:38,600 Speaker 1: So I'm looking at what it is that is happening 193 00:10:38,600 --> 00:10:41,720 Speaker 1: with these Polish jets, and I know that the President 194 00:10:41,840 --> 00:10:44,520 Speaker 1: is very because I've spoken with him about this myself, UM, 195 00:10:44,559 --> 00:10:47,959 Speaker 1: that he is determined to not cross that line so 196 00:10:48,000 --> 00:10:50,920 Speaker 1: that we don't find ourselves in a direct conflict with Russia. 197 00:10:51,280 --> 00:10:53,679 Speaker 1: You're gonna get this aid package, I understand it will 198 00:10:53,679 --> 00:10:56,720 Speaker 1: be about twelve billion dollars passed through the budget on time. 199 00:10:56,800 --> 00:10:59,480 Speaker 1: Does does that drive with what you're hearing. I know 200 00:10:59,600 --> 00:11:02,760 Speaker 1: we have a deadline on Friday night and a lot 201 00:11:02,800 --> 00:11:04,760 Speaker 1: of work to be done between now and then to 202 00:11:04,800 --> 00:11:07,520 Speaker 1: make that happen. Well, there will be a huge amount 203 00:11:07,559 --> 00:11:09,840 Speaker 1: of work to make that happen, but all signs are 204 00:11:09,880 --> 00:11:12,640 Speaker 1: that we're on a path to getting that done. I'm 205 00:11:12,679 --> 00:11:15,000 Speaker 1: glad to see that we've been able to strike UM 206 00:11:15,000 --> 00:11:18,240 Speaker 1: as I understand it, a bipartisan agreement to provide UM 207 00:11:18,320 --> 00:11:22,000 Speaker 1: in addition to getting the federal budget UH done that 208 00:11:22,120 --> 00:11:26,360 Speaker 1: we will also be able to include UM UH aid 209 00:11:26,520 --> 00:11:31,839 Speaker 1: to Ukraine, including humanitarian aid UH and UM also UM 210 00:11:31,880 --> 00:11:36,240 Speaker 1: some additional relief for UM through a COVID relief package, 211 00:11:36,240 --> 00:11:38,840 Speaker 1: so that we are gonna not lose track of where 212 00:11:38,880 --> 00:11:40,560 Speaker 1: we are and remember that we need to continue to 213 00:11:40,559 --> 00:11:44,040 Speaker 1: prepare UM for what comes next. UM in our worries 214 00:11:44,040 --> 00:11:47,200 Speaker 1: about a global pandemic and no one's talking about a shutdown. 215 00:11:47,200 --> 00:11:50,640 Speaker 1: It's incredible. Senator Tina Smith, thank you for being with 216 00:11:50,760 --> 00:11:54,640 Speaker 1: us once again on sound on we'll assemble the panel next, 217 00:11:55,240 --> 00:12:02,480 Speaker 1: stay with us. I'm Joe Matthew. This is Bloomberg. This 218 00:12:03,000 --> 00:12:07,840 Speaker 1: is Bloomberg. So no with Joe Matthew on Bloomberg Radio 219 00:12:10,280 --> 00:12:14,679 Speaker 1: Helpline on the terminal US and UK banned Russia oil imports, 220 00:12:14,760 --> 00:12:19,320 Speaker 1: squeezing gluten on war. It's good headline, but I've got 221 00:12:19,360 --> 00:12:22,360 Speaker 1: some questions about this new messaging from the administration. It's 222 00:12:22,440 --> 00:12:26,520 Speaker 1: changed a lot in the last week. As we assemble 223 00:12:26,600 --> 00:12:31,360 Speaker 1: the panel for sound On Today, beginning with Bloomberg Politics contributor, 224 00:12:31,400 --> 00:12:36,400 Speaker 1: Democratic analyst Jennie Chanzano along with Gretta Joints today, Republican 225 00:12:36,440 --> 00:12:40,200 Speaker 1: strategists back with us from Brownstein Hyatt Farber Shreks technology 226 00:12:40,240 --> 00:12:44,520 Speaker 1: and telecom practice, formerly with the House Energy and Commerce Subcommittee, 227 00:12:44,840 --> 00:12:47,400 Speaker 1: where she was advising lawmakers. It's great to have both 228 00:12:47,400 --> 00:12:50,280 Speaker 1: of you with us here. Genie, let's get your first 229 00:12:50,360 --> 00:12:54,839 Speaker 1: blush reaction. We talked about this possibility last evening. Nobody 230 00:12:54,920 --> 00:12:56,840 Speaker 1: knew that it was coming this morning. It appears that 231 00:12:56,880 --> 00:13:00,440 Speaker 1: Congress really forced President Biden's hand on this. Do you 232 00:13:00,480 --> 00:13:02,480 Speaker 1: think he would have made this move if it hadn't 233 00:13:02,480 --> 00:13:04,719 Speaker 1: been for the breakthrough on Capitol Hill to do the 234 00:13:04,800 --> 00:13:07,840 Speaker 1: very same thing? You know, I don't think, you know, 235 00:13:07,920 --> 00:13:10,280 Speaker 1: I'm not sure he would have done this. I think 236 00:13:10,320 --> 00:13:14,120 Speaker 1: the fact that Congress came together in a bipartisan way 237 00:13:14,320 --> 00:13:16,920 Speaker 1: gave him the ability to go to his allies, our 238 00:13:16,960 --> 00:13:21,000 Speaker 1: allies overseas and say this is where the country is headed. 239 00:13:21,040 --> 00:13:22,840 Speaker 1: I'm going to have to go this alone. And of 240 00:13:22,880 --> 00:13:25,080 Speaker 1: course now we see that, you know, England and some 241 00:13:25,120 --> 00:13:28,120 Speaker 1: other countries may be coming at least in in the 242 00:13:28,160 --> 00:13:31,199 Speaker 1: future with us on this path. But I'm not sure 243 00:13:31,240 --> 00:13:34,360 Speaker 1: he would have gotten there if there wasn't widespread bipartisan support. 244 00:13:34,400 --> 00:13:37,240 Speaker 1: And let's look at the polls. Polls show by huge 245 00:13:37,280 --> 00:13:40,200 Speaker 1: margins the Americans public support this, which is why Congress 246 00:13:40,240 --> 00:13:42,640 Speaker 1: is on board. Well, Greta, how long are the polls 247 00:13:42,679 --> 00:13:44,960 Speaker 1: gonna stay like that? When people are going five six 248 00:13:45,000 --> 00:13:48,800 Speaker 1: dollars potentially a gallon in the tank this summer um, 249 00:13:48,840 --> 00:13:51,319 Speaker 1: I think that we're probably looking at once you hit 250 00:13:51,760 --> 00:13:55,200 Speaker 1: nationwide five dollars a gallon with no end in sight, 251 00:13:55,440 --> 00:13:57,680 Speaker 1: I think that gets really difficult for a lot of 252 00:13:57,720 --> 00:14:01,480 Speaker 1: American families. I think that illustration in particular needs to 253 00:14:01,520 --> 00:14:05,280 Speaker 1: figure out a better way to message around. We all 254 00:14:05,320 --> 00:14:08,199 Speaker 1: need to make a collective sacrifice, because I think that 255 00:14:08,240 --> 00:14:11,679 Speaker 1: works for a short period of time, but months and 256 00:14:11,800 --> 00:14:14,560 Speaker 1: months of high gas prices I think will be very 257 00:14:14,600 --> 00:14:17,560 Speaker 1: difficult for Americans to swallow, especially going into the summer. 258 00:14:17,720 --> 00:14:19,120 Speaker 1: We want to get both of your take on the 259 00:14:19,160 --> 00:14:20,960 Speaker 1: messaging here. This is the part that really kind of 260 00:14:21,040 --> 00:14:22,960 Speaker 1: jumped out to me today because it was a big 261 00:14:23,000 --> 00:14:25,200 Speaker 1: deal last week when the White House said this was 262 00:14:25,240 --> 00:14:30,120 Speaker 1: a bad idea. Now it's happening because it's the only idea. 263 00:14:30,360 --> 00:14:35,240 Speaker 1: President Biden says today in the address today, we will 264 00:14:35,280 --> 00:14:40,040 Speaker 1: not subsidize Putin war by buying Russian oil. Right, We're 265 00:14:40,040 --> 00:14:45,560 Speaker 1: not gonna pay for this conflict by buying oil with 266 00:14:45,800 --> 00:14:48,560 Speaker 1: Ukrainian blood in it. But that does not line up 267 00:14:48,600 --> 00:14:51,280 Speaker 1: with what the White House was saying just last Thursday, 268 00:14:51,360 --> 00:14:52,960 Speaker 1: less than a week ago. I want to bring it 269 00:14:53,000 --> 00:14:55,960 Speaker 1: back to the briefing room Thursday, Press Secretary Jen Saki 270 00:14:56,000 --> 00:14:59,200 Speaker 1: here explaining why the administration at that point was choosing 271 00:14:59,280 --> 00:15:02,480 Speaker 1: not to say Russian energy. Here she is, we don't 272 00:15:02,480 --> 00:15:06,560 Speaker 1: have a strategic interest in reducing the global supply of energy. 273 00:15:07,120 --> 00:15:09,960 Speaker 1: Uh and that would raise prices at the gas pump 274 00:15:10,120 --> 00:15:13,520 Speaker 1: for the American people around the world, but also has 275 00:15:13,520 --> 00:15:16,880 Speaker 1: the potential to pad the pockets of President Putin, which 276 00:15:16,920 --> 00:15:20,240 Speaker 1: is exactly what we are not trying to do. Okay, 277 00:15:20,280 --> 00:15:23,160 Speaker 1: so we know it's going to send prices higher. White 278 00:15:23,160 --> 00:15:27,440 Speaker 1: House been consistent on that. That's elementary, but banning the oil, 279 00:15:27,480 --> 00:15:31,440 Speaker 1: as she said, would pad Putin's pockets a great alliteration, 280 00:15:31,480 --> 00:15:35,520 Speaker 1: by the way, but not banning it would pay for 281 00:15:35,640 --> 00:15:38,080 Speaker 1: Putin's war. I'm a little bit confused, Genie on how 282 00:15:38,080 --> 00:15:42,040 Speaker 1: that lines up or doesn't it. It doesn't line up 283 00:15:42,040 --> 00:15:44,280 Speaker 1: to your point, and and I think the White House 284 00:15:44,320 --> 00:15:47,920 Speaker 1: has to spend time getting their messaging together. You know, 285 00:15:48,120 --> 00:15:51,040 Speaker 1: Jen Saki was speaking last week when the administration was 286 00:15:51,080 --> 00:15:53,200 Speaker 1: firmly in the in the camp of not doing this. 287 00:15:53,320 --> 00:15:55,640 Speaker 1: They have now changed their mind. And I think, you know, 288 00:15:55,720 --> 00:15:57,760 Speaker 1: to a certain extent, the White House is missing a 289 00:15:57,800 --> 00:16:01,760 Speaker 1: big opportunity here, and that is the opportunity to say, 290 00:16:01,760 --> 00:16:04,880 Speaker 1: why are we in this position. We're in this position 291 00:16:05,040 --> 00:16:09,160 Speaker 1: because we've locked ourselves, hook line and sinker into a 292 00:16:09,240 --> 00:16:12,800 Speaker 1: gas future. And this is why we should have done 293 00:16:12,880 --> 00:16:15,520 Speaker 1: better with build back Better and the policies of the 294 00:16:15,560 --> 00:16:18,200 Speaker 1: administration coming out. Oh don't laugh, Joe Matthew. I know, 295 00:16:18,320 --> 00:16:20,680 Speaker 1: build that Better is dead, but you know, there is 296 00:16:20,680 --> 00:16:23,760 Speaker 1: an argument to say there's an opportunity here. We have 297 00:16:24,080 --> 00:16:27,040 Speaker 1: to look for other options, and I think Senator Smith 298 00:16:27,080 --> 00:16:29,680 Speaker 1: said rightly so there are short, medium and long term 299 00:16:29,720 --> 00:16:32,920 Speaker 1: things you can do to move more aggressively toward a 300 00:16:32,960 --> 00:16:37,800 Speaker 1: clean energy solution, which essentially allows us to unleash ourselves 301 00:16:37,880 --> 00:16:43,240 Speaker 1: from not just Vladimir Putin, but the authoritarian autocrats running 302 00:16:43,240 --> 00:16:46,120 Speaker 1: countries like Venezuelan, Saudi Arabia around the world, to whom 303 00:16:46,120 --> 00:16:49,280 Speaker 1: we are in locked in unless we figure out another 304 00:16:49,320 --> 00:16:52,440 Speaker 1: way to move to clean energy, Gretta, are these just 305 00:16:52,520 --> 00:16:55,480 Speaker 1: the perils of working in pr as I think we 306 00:16:55,520 --> 00:16:59,080 Speaker 1: can agree Jensaki is, even though it's politics here or 307 00:16:59,160 --> 00:17:01,520 Speaker 1: is there is there more were here? Does this expose 308 00:17:02,320 --> 00:17:05,399 Speaker 1: the conversations that were happening behind the scenes in the 309 00:17:05,400 --> 00:17:09,440 Speaker 1: White House with Congress. To go from from one extreme 310 00:17:09,480 --> 00:17:11,280 Speaker 1: to another in less than a week like that, with 311 00:17:11,400 --> 00:17:17,080 Speaker 1: different rationale is difficult for some people to understand. I 312 00:17:17,600 --> 00:17:20,480 Speaker 1: think that what it certainly points to is the lack 313 00:17:20,520 --> 00:17:23,440 Speaker 1: of conversations between the White House and Congress. I think 314 00:17:23,480 --> 00:17:27,000 Speaker 1: that Congressional Democrats really are struggling to figure out how 315 00:17:27,040 --> 00:17:31,119 Speaker 1: they can message appropriately to their constituents why high gas 316 00:17:31,119 --> 00:17:35,520 Speaker 1: prices are ultimately worth it for Americans going forward. I 317 00:17:35,680 --> 00:17:39,320 Speaker 1: think that the administration has had to reverse course on 318 00:17:39,400 --> 00:17:42,560 Speaker 1: a number of things around, not only build back better, 319 00:17:42,640 --> 00:17:46,320 Speaker 1: which I would agree with my friend is is certainly dead. 320 00:17:46,760 --> 00:17:50,160 Speaker 1: But I would think that there are a lot of 321 00:17:50,200 --> 00:17:53,840 Speaker 1: things that could have been message better around nord Stream too. 322 00:17:54,040 --> 00:17:57,680 Speaker 1: In particular, there was a lot of talk coming from 323 00:17:57,680 --> 00:18:00,800 Speaker 1: the White House on how it was impossible to reverse 324 00:18:00,840 --> 00:18:03,439 Speaker 1: nord Stream two, and then in the past week, you know, 325 00:18:03,480 --> 00:18:05,560 Speaker 1: we certainly found out that that was not the case. 326 00:18:06,200 --> 00:18:09,760 Speaker 1: I think when you look at what the messages around 327 00:18:09,760 --> 00:18:12,520 Speaker 1: short term energy costs, it doesn't really help that Secretary 328 00:18:12,760 --> 00:18:15,400 Speaker 1: to judge then out and basically suggest that that American 329 00:18:15,480 --> 00:18:19,600 Speaker 1: should my tel or just wait, just wait for this 330 00:18:19,640 --> 00:18:22,240 Speaker 1: summer when it's five or six a gallon. Bretta and 331 00:18:22,320 --> 00:18:25,120 Speaker 1: Jennie will be back the panel on Sound On. This 332 00:18:25,160 --> 00:18:31,840 Speaker 1: is Bloomberg, broadcasting live from our nation's capital, Bloomberg to 333 00:18:31,960 --> 00:18:36,080 Speaker 1: New York, Bloomberg eleven Frio to Boston, Bloomberg one O 334 00:18:36,240 --> 00:18:40,400 Speaker 1: six one to San Francisco, Bloomberg nine sixty to the Country, 335 00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:43,959 Speaker 1: Serious x M, General one ninety and around the globe 336 00:18:44,000 --> 00:18:47,920 Speaker 1: the Bloomberg Business app and Bloomberg Radio dot Com. This 337 00:18:48,320 --> 00:18:54,359 Speaker 1: is Bloomberg Sound On with Joe Matthew. Everyone seems to 338 00:18:54,400 --> 00:18:57,920 Speaker 1: agree oil and gas prices will keep rising, and that's 339 00:18:58,000 --> 00:19:01,399 Speaker 1: after gas hit an all time bridge high in the 340 00:19:01,480 --> 00:19:05,800 Speaker 1: US yesterday. Now that America is banning Russian oil and gas, 341 00:19:05,800 --> 00:19:08,119 Speaker 1: where do we go? How high? And what will we 342 00:19:08,200 --> 00:19:11,280 Speaker 1: replace the Russian crude with? Could we do it on 343 00:19:11,280 --> 00:19:15,120 Speaker 1: our own? Maybe sells some to Europe, We'll ask Bob McNally, 344 00:19:15,160 --> 00:19:18,280 Speaker 1: consulted and president of Rapid and Energy Group. Coming up next, 345 00:19:18,560 --> 00:19:21,880 Speaker 1: gas prices at new highs nationally. We could be heading 346 00:19:21,880 --> 00:19:25,840 Speaker 1: into uncharted territory next days and weeks. As President Biden 347 00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:29,960 Speaker 1: made clear himself when he announced the Russian crude ban. 348 00:19:30,680 --> 00:19:33,760 Speaker 1: Here's what he said from the White House. The decision 349 00:19:33,800 --> 00:19:37,000 Speaker 1: today is not without cost here at home. Prudent's war 350 00:19:37,080 --> 00:19:40,120 Speaker 1: is already hurting American families at the gas pump since 351 00:19:40,160 --> 00:19:43,159 Speaker 1: Prudent began as military built up in Ukrainian borders. Just 352 00:19:43,320 --> 00:19:46,240 Speaker 1: since then, the price of the gas of the pump 353 00:19:46,240 --> 00:19:49,560 Speaker 1: in America and up seventy five cents, and with this 354 00:19:49,640 --> 00:19:52,280 Speaker 1: action is going to go up further. I'm gonna do 355 00:19:52,320 --> 00:19:55,280 Speaker 1: everything I can to minimize Prudent's price hike here at home. 356 00:19:56,640 --> 00:20:00,240 Speaker 1: Not that there's a lot that can be done to 357 00:20:00,240 --> 00:20:03,080 Speaker 1: help us understand the nuances in the energy market here 358 00:20:03,280 --> 00:20:06,720 Speaker 1: following this move is Bob McNally, consultant president of Rapid 359 00:20:06,720 --> 00:20:10,360 Speaker 1: and Energy Group, former senior policy official in the George W. 360 00:20:10,440 --> 00:20:14,000 Speaker 1: Bush administration, and author of the book Crude Volatility, The 361 00:20:14,119 --> 00:20:16,879 Speaker 1: History and the Future of Boom Bust Oil Prices. I 362 00:20:16,880 --> 00:20:19,440 Speaker 1: think we've got the right guy, Bob. Thank you for 363 00:20:19,560 --> 00:20:21,880 Speaker 1: being with us here. I'll start with the question nobody 364 00:20:21,920 --> 00:20:24,480 Speaker 1: really can answer, and that's how high you think we 365 00:20:24,520 --> 00:20:26,880 Speaker 1: can go? That The increases this week in the futures 366 00:20:26,920 --> 00:20:29,800 Speaker 1: markets have just been staggering. But when it when it 367 00:20:29,800 --> 00:20:33,399 Speaker 1: comes to crude w t I, for instance, is some 368 00:20:33,560 --> 00:20:39,480 Speaker 1: of this or maybe most of it baked in by now? Yeah? Well, 369 00:20:39,520 --> 00:20:40,959 Speaker 1: and it's great to be with you, Joe. I just 370 00:20:41,000 --> 00:20:44,840 Speaker 1: wish we were talking about a happier subject. I think, uh, 371 00:20:45,040 --> 00:20:48,199 Speaker 1: CREWD can go a lot higher. One of two things 372 00:20:48,480 --> 00:20:51,280 Speaker 1: is going to happen here on the way up. Either 373 00:20:52,040 --> 00:20:56,439 Speaker 1: hopefully will remove the sanctions risk because Russia will cease 374 00:20:56,480 --> 00:20:59,480 Speaker 1: and distist and will somehow get out of this escalation. 375 00:21:00,080 --> 00:21:03,000 Speaker 1: That does not seem likely. But if if that would happen, 376 00:21:03,119 --> 00:21:06,520 Speaker 1: the sanctions risk to Russia's almost eight million barrels a 377 00:21:06,560 --> 00:21:09,280 Speaker 1: day would go away. That's one way for crudal prices 378 00:21:09,359 --> 00:21:13,120 Speaker 1: to stop rising, and if that happened, krudal prices would fall. However, 379 00:21:13,160 --> 00:21:15,840 Speaker 1: it's more likely we're gonna rise toward what we call 380 00:21:16,000 --> 00:21:20,199 Speaker 1: demand destruction. We're gonna have to start hammering consumption of oil. 381 00:21:20,840 --> 00:21:23,480 Speaker 1: And while nobody can really predict it, I'll give it 382 00:21:23,480 --> 00:21:26,879 Speaker 1: a shot. At my company, we estimate that would start 383 00:21:26,920 --> 00:21:29,840 Speaker 1: to happen at about a hundred and fifty doll You know, 384 00:21:29,920 --> 00:21:33,160 Speaker 1: Brent or w t I so calls for three barrel. 385 00:21:33,200 --> 00:21:38,200 Speaker 1: You don't think that's realistic, but one, yeah, what three dollars? 386 00:21:38,240 --> 00:21:40,040 Speaker 1: I think we're going to hit a recession and demand 387 00:21:40,119 --> 00:21:43,840 Speaker 1: or collapse, Uh, well before three d because people will 388 00:21:43,880 --> 00:21:46,520 Speaker 1: cut back on their consumption. They're not going to take 389 00:21:46,560 --> 00:21:51,200 Speaker 1: the road trip necessarily this summer. Uh, people will start 390 00:21:51,240 --> 00:21:53,640 Speaker 1: maybe taking a different way to work, whatever it might be. 391 00:21:54,200 --> 00:21:58,640 Speaker 1: High gas prices, to your point, will cure high gas prices? Well, yes, 392 00:21:58,720 --> 00:22:00,480 Speaker 1: but there's the happy way to do that and the 393 00:22:00,560 --> 00:22:03,320 Speaker 1: sad way to do that. You know, when oil prices 394 00:22:03,400 --> 00:22:06,320 Speaker 1: nearly quintuckled from O three to oh eight, we were 395 00:22:06,359 --> 00:22:08,720 Speaker 1: doing stuff like that. We were as gasoline prices were 396 00:22:08,720 --> 00:22:10,960 Speaker 1: going up, We're becoming more efficient, We're buying more fuel 397 00:22:11,000 --> 00:22:15,200 Speaker 1: efficient cars. But unfortunately, when prices spike parabolically like they're 398 00:22:15,200 --> 00:22:17,760 Speaker 1: doing now, everybody goes out and buy as an escalator 399 00:22:17,920 --> 00:22:20,520 Speaker 1: to a recession. Yeah, you get a recession, usually an 400 00:22:20,520 --> 00:22:22,800 Speaker 1: oil price spike. At the scene of a recession. In history, 401 00:22:23,000 --> 00:22:25,120 Speaker 1: it will probably be the sad way, which is through 402 00:22:25,359 --> 00:22:29,359 Speaker 1: economic you know, downturn. Oh boy, well, this is not 403 00:22:29,600 --> 00:22:32,760 Speaker 1: what we want to be hearing. The question also is 404 00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:35,639 Speaker 1: what are we replace it with? Bob can the U 405 00:22:35,800 --> 00:22:38,879 Speaker 1: S crank up production enough to to replace seven hundred 406 00:22:38,920 --> 00:22:41,560 Speaker 1: thousand barrels or whatever it is roughly a day we 407 00:22:41,600 --> 00:22:43,760 Speaker 1: get from Russia. We're gonna have to start dealing with 408 00:22:44,280 --> 00:22:50,240 Speaker 1: other guys like Venezuela, Iran, Saudi Arabia as we've been hearing. Yeah, 409 00:22:50,480 --> 00:22:54,520 Speaker 1: you know, we can easily replace Russian imports. That's small potatoes. 410 00:22:54,840 --> 00:22:57,160 Speaker 1: That's not a problem at all. We only get about 411 00:22:57,200 --> 00:23:00,000 Speaker 1: three of our crude from them, at eight eight percent 412 00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:03,000 Speaker 1: of our product. That's no problem. The problem, though, is 413 00:23:03,320 --> 00:23:05,320 Speaker 1: the market is afraid that we're going to do more 414 00:23:05,320 --> 00:23:08,080 Speaker 1: than that. We're gonna start sanctioning. Russia's up to the 415 00:23:08,119 --> 00:23:10,800 Speaker 1: eight million barrels a day in a hundred million billiday 416 00:23:10,800 --> 00:23:13,520 Speaker 1: market that they export to the world. That's what's driving 417 00:23:13,800 --> 00:23:17,320 Speaker 1: crude and gasoline prices high. And the Biden administration has 418 00:23:17,359 --> 00:23:20,679 Speaker 1: been struggling to convince market participants. We don't want to 419 00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:23,760 Speaker 1: do that, but they're they're losing that battle. So as 420 00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:26,560 Speaker 1: long as the fear is out there and that these 421 00:23:26,560 --> 00:23:30,439 Speaker 1: symbolic actions like today's really amount to a threat to 422 00:23:30,520 --> 00:23:33,840 Speaker 1: the broad Russian commodity exports, not just oil but food 423 00:23:33,840 --> 00:23:36,560 Speaker 1: and other things, that's what's going to keep that upward 424 00:23:36,640 --> 00:23:40,040 Speaker 1: pressure on prices. Even though the teny amount of oil 425 00:23:40,080 --> 00:23:43,240 Speaker 1: will be banning really doesn't make much much of a difference. 426 00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:45,960 Speaker 1: So this is really about uncertainty here. Can I ask you, 427 00:23:46,000 --> 00:23:49,159 Speaker 1: how in the world could we sanction oil to the 428 00:23:49,200 --> 00:23:51,119 Speaker 1: extent that you're talking about if we're not buying it, 429 00:23:51,160 --> 00:23:54,159 Speaker 1: I mean, we're they're they're shipping five million I believe 430 00:23:54,200 --> 00:23:57,560 Speaker 1: barrels a day, uh two are to the United States 431 00:23:57,560 --> 00:24:00,880 Speaker 1: and our European allies combined. How gonna be affect more 432 00:24:00,920 --> 00:24:04,840 Speaker 1: than that? Well, so, yeah, Russia sends about five million 433 00:24:04,840 --> 00:24:08,119 Speaker 1: barrels a day of crude and that's mainly to Europe. 434 00:24:08,160 --> 00:24:12,080 Speaker 1: About that goes to Europe and China and the rest 435 00:24:12,160 --> 00:24:15,200 Speaker 1: basically into Asian Latin America, we get a very little 436 00:24:15,200 --> 00:24:18,200 Speaker 1: bit of it. Then they exported another two point seven 437 00:24:18,760 --> 00:24:21,440 Speaker 1: million barrels a day of product heating oil, diesel, nap 438 00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:24,000 Speaker 1: and so that most of that goes to Europe that 439 00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:26,520 Speaker 1: does not really come to us. The only way we 440 00:24:26,560 --> 00:24:28,879 Speaker 1: could really get at that, and the market fears, is 441 00:24:28,920 --> 00:24:33,080 Speaker 1: we do Iran style secondary sanctions. Right, so we say, 442 00:24:33,119 --> 00:24:35,520 Speaker 1: not only are we not going to import it, but 443 00:24:35,600 --> 00:24:40,040 Speaker 1: if we see you China, India or somebody else importing, 444 00:24:40,480 --> 00:24:44,080 Speaker 1: will freeze your central bankout or will some way sanction 445 00:24:44,160 --> 00:24:46,280 Speaker 1: you as well. So that's kind of what we did 446 00:24:46,320 --> 00:24:48,600 Speaker 1: with Iran, and that is what some people are calling 447 00:24:48,640 --> 00:24:51,880 Speaker 1: for with regard to Russia as well. Robert, I want 448 00:24:51,880 --> 00:24:54,959 Speaker 1: to ask you the same question I asked our panel, 449 00:24:54,960 --> 00:24:58,280 Speaker 1: and it has to do with messaging from the White House. Here. 450 00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:00,960 Speaker 1: We heard last week that it was bad idea to 451 00:25:01,040 --> 00:25:06,400 Speaker 1: ban Russian oil because it would pad Vladimir Putin's pockets 452 00:25:06,480 --> 00:25:10,080 Speaker 1: by sending global prices higher. Today the President says, we 453 00:25:10,119 --> 00:25:14,879 Speaker 1: will not subsidize putin war Putin's war by buying Russian oil. 454 00:25:15,240 --> 00:25:19,400 Speaker 1: How do you have both? There's an old expression in Washington, 455 00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:21,919 Speaker 1: non Capitol Hill. If you don't have the votes, you 456 00:25:22,040 --> 00:25:25,919 Speaker 1: deal or you die. And President Biden lost control on 457 00:25:25,960 --> 00:25:27,919 Speaker 1: the hill. He still didn't want to do what he 458 00:25:27,960 --> 00:25:30,280 Speaker 1: did today for exactly the reason we saw a crude 459 00:25:30,320 --> 00:25:32,760 Speaker 1: is up six dollars today. He didn't want to do it, 460 00:25:32,840 --> 00:25:35,840 Speaker 1: but the problem was the Congress wanted to. Congress forced 461 00:25:35,880 --> 00:25:39,040 Speaker 1: his hands. What's worse for Vladimir Putin banning the oil 462 00:25:39,160 --> 00:25:46,080 Speaker 1: or not? Well, Uh, I think banning the oil would 463 00:25:46,119 --> 00:25:47,840 Speaker 1: not be worse. I think be worse if we didn't. 464 00:25:47,880 --> 00:25:51,080 Speaker 1: Here's why. If we banned the oil, we will hurt 465 00:25:51,160 --> 00:25:54,320 Speaker 1: him badly, but we will hurt our consumers badly. And 466 00:25:54,359 --> 00:25:57,040 Speaker 1: while folks are saying they're willing to pay more to 467 00:25:57,280 --> 00:25:59,919 Speaker 1: hurt Putin, I know I would. I'm not sure for 468 00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:02,399 Speaker 1: want to pay a recession And the risk is that 469 00:26:02,480 --> 00:26:05,000 Speaker 1: if we ban oil, it hurts Putin, but then we 470 00:26:05,040 --> 00:26:08,960 Speaker 1: collapse our economy, then political support for supporting Ukraine, which 471 00:26:09,000 --> 00:26:11,720 Speaker 1: the importing might go away, So I'd be careful with it. 472 00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:16,320 Speaker 1: Great take from Robert McNally of Repidion Energy. This is Bloomberg. 473 00:26:19,880 --> 00:26:23,720 Speaker 1: You're listening to Bloomberg. You sound on with Joe Matthew 474 00:26:24,080 --> 00:26:30,720 Speaker 1: on Bloomberg Radio. We've got the annual threat assessments of 475 00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:34,320 Speaker 1: the U S Intelligence community today. This is something that 476 00:26:34,400 --> 00:26:37,760 Speaker 1: happens every year before the House Intelligence Committee. They bring 477 00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:41,960 Speaker 1: the chiefs of all of our intelligence agencies together to 478 00:26:42,080 --> 00:26:47,840 Speaker 1: testify before lawmakers and actually answer some honest questions about 479 00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:51,600 Speaker 1: what keeps them up at night. Russia is likely to 480 00:26:51,600 --> 00:26:56,959 Speaker 1: face a persistent and significant insurgency after Vladimir Putin misjudged 481 00:26:57,040 --> 00:27:03,600 Speaker 1: the war, according to the top US spy chief. We 482 00:27:03,720 --> 00:27:08,040 Speaker 1: heard from Abel Haines, the Director of National Intelligence. We 483 00:27:08,080 --> 00:27:11,960 Speaker 1: also heard from the head of the CIA, William Burns 484 00:27:13,520 --> 00:27:19,040 Speaker 1: fascinating testimony. The CIA director says Putin is stewing in 485 00:27:19,160 --> 00:27:25,360 Speaker 1: grievance and ambition, a dangerous combination, and he described if 486 00:27:25,359 --> 00:27:28,639 Speaker 1: you're curious, just how much Vladimir Putin has gotten wrong 487 00:27:29,119 --> 00:27:33,040 Speaker 1: over the last two weeks. The CIA director describes the 488 00:27:33,080 --> 00:27:35,840 Speaker 1: four assumptions that Putin made that turned out to be wrong. 489 00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:38,480 Speaker 1: Here he is first that Ukraine and his view was 490 00:27:38,520 --> 00:27:42,800 Speaker 1: weak and easily intimidated. Second, that the Europeans, especially the 491 00:27:42,800 --> 00:27:46,840 Speaker 1: French and Germans, were distracted by elections in France and 492 00:27:46,880 --> 00:27:50,760 Speaker 1: a leadership succession in Germany and risk averse. Third, he 493 00:27:50,840 --> 00:27:54,840 Speaker 1: believed he had sanctions proof to his economy um in 494 00:27:54,840 --> 00:27:57,439 Speaker 1: in the sense of creating a large worksest to foreign 495 00:27:57,440 --> 00:28:01,000 Speaker 1: currency reserves and forests. He is confident that he had 496 00:28:01,040 --> 00:28:04,359 Speaker 1: modernized his military and they were capable of a quick, 497 00:28:04,520 --> 00:28:10,040 Speaker 1: decisive victory at minimal cost. That's a lot to get wrong, 498 00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:13,320 Speaker 1: and so we reassembled the panel for more on all 499 00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:16,480 Speaker 1: of this. Bloomberg Politics contributor Jeanie Chanzano is with us 500 00:28:16,600 --> 00:28:20,160 Speaker 1: today along with Bread to Joints Republican strategist coach here 501 00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:24,000 Speaker 1: at Brownstein Hyatt Farber Stress Tech and Telecom practice, former 502 00:28:24,000 --> 00:28:28,320 Speaker 1: House Energy and Commerce Subcommittee adviser. Thanks again for both 503 00:28:28,359 --> 00:28:31,520 Speaker 1: of you being with us here. When you hear talk 504 00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:34,760 Speaker 1: like that, Genie, it makes you wonder what would have 505 00:28:34,840 --> 00:28:37,520 Speaker 1: happened if he had gotten at least one of those right. 506 00:28:37,680 --> 00:28:40,000 Speaker 1: This could in fact go down. While I know we're 507 00:28:40,000 --> 00:28:43,880 Speaker 1: in for some very difficult days, this could go down 508 00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:46,520 Speaker 1: as the beginning of the end or will for Vladimir Putin, 509 00:28:46,560 --> 00:28:50,200 Speaker 1: though it absolutely could and it is chilling to listen 510 00:28:50,320 --> 00:28:53,320 Speaker 1: to William Burns list through that, tick through that, and 511 00:28:53,400 --> 00:28:55,240 Speaker 1: to your point, had he gotten any one of those 512 00:28:55,280 --> 00:28:57,760 Speaker 1: things right, um, that we could be in a very 513 00:28:57,760 --> 00:29:00,920 Speaker 1: different position right now. And I think my big question here, 514 00:29:01,400 --> 00:29:04,479 Speaker 1: and I've asked so many people, and nobody has a 515 00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:08,000 Speaker 1: very positive answer, what is the pathway out of this? 516 00:29:08,240 --> 00:29:11,160 Speaker 1: Is there any pathway? You know, Sanctions, all these things, 517 00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:15,000 Speaker 1: they're designed to change behavior, and by every estimation, none 518 00:29:15,000 --> 00:29:18,000 Speaker 1: of that is going to change Putin's trajectory here. And 519 00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:21,160 Speaker 1: so it all feels very very dark as you listen 520 00:29:21,200 --> 00:29:24,640 Speaker 1: to these threat assessments. Well, it sure does. Greta being wrong. 521 00:29:24,760 --> 00:29:27,960 Speaker 1: I can only assume motivates someone like Vladimir Putin to 522 00:29:28,040 --> 00:29:32,520 Speaker 1: double down. Uh, It's a pretty difficult thing to imagine here, 523 00:29:32,520 --> 00:29:34,200 Speaker 1: but we know we're in for worse. We know that 524 00:29:34,360 --> 00:29:37,360 Speaker 1: Ukraine is To Genie's question, is there an off ramp 525 00:29:37,360 --> 00:29:39,400 Speaker 1: at this point or we have to go through this? 526 00:29:40,680 --> 00:29:44,480 Speaker 1: I don't think there is a articulated off ramp. I 527 00:29:44,520 --> 00:29:48,400 Speaker 1: think either for NATO, for the US, or for President Putin. 528 00:29:48,520 --> 00:29:51,400 Speaker 1: I think that he is certainly trying to respond in 529 00:29:51,400 --> 00:29:55,320 Speaker 1: a way that you know, enables him to look strong 530 00:29:55,400 --> 00:29:58,320 Speaker 1: and powerful. But there are some people who are going 531 00:29:58,360 --> 00:30:01,760 Speaker 1: to suffer in Russia because of these mistakes. I would 532 00:30:01,760 --> 00:30:04,520 Speaker 1: imagine that he's going to blame a lot of the 533 00:30:04,560 --> 00:30:07,640 Speaker 1: generals and and other people beneath him for for some 534 00:30:07,720 --> 00:30:10,960 Speaker 1: of these challenges. But in terms of you know what 535 00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:16,360 Speaker 1: restarts US Russian relations, I don't know, and I don't 536 00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:20,520 Speaker 1: think anyone knows at this point. I want to get 537 00:30:20,560 --> 00:30:23,480 Speaker 1: into this matter of aid for Ukraine while we have 538 00:30:23,640 --> 00:30:25,880 Speaker 1: some time here as well, because we we discussed this 539 00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:28,680 Speaker 1: earlier with Senator Tina Smith. She seems to think this 540 00:30:28,760 --> 00:30:32,200 Speaker 1: is on track to pass twelve billion dollars. It's doubled, 541 00:30:32,280 --> 00:30:35,680 Speaker 1: almost doubled in just the span of a week. It 542 00:30:35,800 --> 00:30:37,840 Speaker 1: was six and a half billion a week ago when 543 00:30:37,880 --> 00:30:40,920 Speaker 1: the request went in from the administration. So here we are. 544 00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:43,200 Speaker 1: It's going to be part of this omnibus budget. And Genie, 545 00:30:43,280 --> 00:30:45,840 Speaker 1: we've talked about this up and down. None of it's 546 00:30:45,840 --> 00:30:48,400 Speaker 1: coming easily, but at least lawmakers seem to think they 547 00:30:48,440 --> 00:30:50,720 Speaker 1: can pass something by the deadline on Friday. No one's 548 00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:54,120 Speaker 1: talking about a shutdown. And inside this funding is this 549 00:30:54,240 --> 00:31:00,360 Speaker 1: mechanism to basically send fighter jets to Ukraine poland take 550 00:31:00,400 --> 00:31:02,680 Speaker 1: their MiG twenty nine. They've already said they're ready to 551 00:31:02,720 --> 00:31:05,200 Speaker 1: do it. They sent it to a US base in Germany. 552 00:31:05,280 --> 00:31:08,680 Speaker 1: America repaints those jets and sends them to Ukraine where 553 00:31:08,680 --> 00:31:10,959 Speaker 1: they will be used in the war effort, and then 554 00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:15,600 Speaker 1: we'll replace those jets on behalf of Poland with some 555 00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:19,400 Speaker 1: some nice shiny American made fighter jets. This came up 556 00:31:20,160 --> 00:31:24,760 Speaker 1: on Capitol Hill Senator Marco Rubio, Republican from Florida, talking about, however, 557 00:31:25,720 --> 00:31:29,560 Speaker 1: the many complications that come with this concept. There are 558 00:31:29,560 --> 00:31:31,640 Speaker 1: a lot of questions that have yet to be answered, 559 00:31:31,960 --> 00:31:35,560 Speaker 1: as Senator Rubio illustrates here, and who's gonna fly them, 560 00:31:35,640 --> 00:31:37,280 Speaker 1: and where you're gonna base them from and can you 561 00:31:37,360 --> 00:31:41,200 Speaker 1: protect them from you know, Russian efforts to target supply lines. 562 00:31:41,320 --> 00:31:43,720 Speaker 1: And at some point I anticipate you're gonna start to 563 00:31:43,720 --> 00:31:47,560 Speaker 1: see the Russians targeting the supply lines that are bringing 564 00:31:47,600 --> 00:31:51,280 Speaker 1: in what is being provided to Ukraine. And and when 565 00:31:51,320 --> 00:31:55,560 Speaker 1: that happens, there's a real high potential that of a 566 00:31:55,680 --> 00:31:59,640 Speaker 1: NATO country could be hit as collateral damage. And suddenly, um, 567 00:31:59,720 --> 00:32:02,520 Speaker 1: you got a big problem on your hands, a big problem, jie. 568 00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:06,000 Speaker 1: What what do we do here before there's a problem 569 00:32:06,040 --> 00:32:08,560 Speaker 1: to keep this from happening. Does Vladimir Putin see that 570 00:32:08,600 --> 00:32:11,080 Speaker 1: as an act of war? Is that an escalation? You know? 571 00:32:11,160 --> 00:32:13,600 Speaker 1: I don't often say this, But I happen to agree 572 00:32:13,640 --> 00:32:16,960 Speaker 1: with Senator Rubio on this. Um. You know, it is 573 00:32:17,000 --> 00:32:19,920 Speaker 1: a very important point he's making. This is why I 574 00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:23,400 Speaker 1: am a firm believer that I don't feel that Congress 575 00:32:23,520 --> 00:32:27,440 Speaker 1: should be making decisions like this about how we conduct 576 00:32:27,520 --> 00:32:31,800 Speaker 1: military operations. They should stick to what they do. This is, 577 00:32:32,200 --> 00:32:35,520 Speaker 1: you know, this is something that is fraught with potential 578 00:32:35,600 --> 00:32:39,320 Speaker 1: challenges and could get us directly involved in a conflict. 579 00:32:39,640 --> 00:32:42,880 Speaker 1: And so I would be more comfortable with military leaders, 580 00:32:43,040 --> 00:32:46,560 Speaker 1: the Air Force, Army, Davy them making these decisions and 581 00:32:46,640 --> 00:32:49,720 Speaker 1: not Congress. I think Congress should fund and these decisions 582 00:32:49,720 --> 00:32:52,120 Speaker 1: should be made at least in the White House, if 583 00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:54,240 Speaker 1: not in the military. Even if that was the case, 584 00:32:54,400 --> 00:32:57,920 Speaker 1: let's say the Pentagon is making this decision. Uh my goodness. 585 00:32:58,360 --> 00:33:01,880 Speaker 1: The potential here for a backfire, Greta is great. And 586 00:33:01,880 --> 00:33:05,880 Speaker 1: it's not just you know, Vladimir Putin gets upset because 587 00:33:05,880 --> 00:33:07,600 Speaker 1: he sees the planes in the air and he says, 588 00:33:07,640 --> 00:33:10,040 Speaker 1: that's an act of war. What if this idea of 589 00:33:10,120 --> 00:33:13,520 Speaker 1: attacking supply chains becomes a real one. Now we're crossing borders. 590 00:33:13,560 --> 00:33:15,440 Speaker 1: We don't know where these planes are going to be 591 00:33:15,520 --> 00:33:19,200 Speaker 1: launching from. Who's going to be re arming them, refueling them, 592 00:33:19,240 --> 00:33:23,520 Speaker 1: and so forth. But it's the very thing that President 593 00:33:23,600 --> 00:33:27,600 Speaker 1: Zelenski says he needs. So what do you do, Greta. 594 00:33:28,200 --> 00:33:31,320 Speaker 1: It's it's very difficult, and I think in particular when 595 00:33:31,360 --> 00:33:35,000 Speaker 1: you talk about this issue with Poland, apparently they made 596 00:33:35,000 --> 00:33:38,160 Speaker 1: this announcement about the transfer of the planes to the 597 00:33:38,280 --> 00:33:45,120 Speaker 1: US without actually informing the US prior to announcing it. So, um, 598 00:33:45,160 --> 00:33:48,520 Speaker 1: we we are certainly in an interesting situation, and how 599 00:33:48,560 --> 00:33:52,840 Speaker 1: do we respond? You know, obviously Americans are are very 600 00:33:53,280 --> 00:33:56,880 Speaker 1: um concerned and wants to be helpful to Zelensky, But 601 00:33:57,360 --> 00:34:00,000 Speaker 1: there there are a lot of cooks in the kitchen, 602 00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:02,800 Speaker 1: and I absolutely agree that, you know, Congress needs to 603 00:34:02,840 --> 00:34:06,440 Speaker 1: provide oversight here versus strategic guidance into into some of 604 00:34:06,440 --> 00:34:11,120 Speaker 1: these military decisions. It's it's going to be very challenging 605 00:34:11,160 --> 00:34:15,520 Speaker 1: and honestly, my my biggest concern going forward is is 606 00:34:15,600 --> 00:34:19,040 Speaker 1: how China and Russia are going to cozy up in 607 00:34:19,160 --> 00:34:23,080 Speaker 1: absence of American engagement. And and that is a big 608 00:34:23,120 --> 00:34:26,560 Speaker 1: concern I think going forward for supply chains and also 609 00:34:26,719 --> 00:34:31,239 Speaker 1: for military engagement beyond just Ukraine. Well, it does make 610 00:34:31,280 --> 00:34:33,160 Speaker 1: you worry about how this is going to end with 611 00:34:33,280 --> 00:34:36,399 Speaker 1: regard to that particular issue, Genie. But there's a lot 612 00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:38,319 Speaker 1: more in the twelve billion dollars. There's a lot more 613 00:34:38,320 --> 00:34:40,759 Speaker 1: in the budget. Are we going to get this done here? 614 00:34:40,760 --> 00:34:44,360 Speaker 1: How come nobody's capitalizing on this moment to threaten the 615 00:34:44,400 --> 00:34:51,520 Speaker 1: government shutdown. It appears as if the reality of the 616 00:34:51,640 --> 00:34:55,120 Speaker 1: Ukrainian bill, this you know, twelve to fourteen billion that 617 00:34:55,160 --> 00:34:58,879 Speaker 1: they've agreed on, is what is pushing the omnibus potentially 618 00:34:59,320 --> 00:35:01,680 Speaker 1: over the mark here by Friday, I mean, as you said, 619 00:35:01,680 --> 00:35:05,200 Speaker 1: people are optimistic, but I renew my frustration with the 620 00:35:05,239 --> 00:35:08,319 Speaker 1: way that Congress works. I mean, this is we are 621 00:35:08,440 --> 00:35:12,560 Speaker 1: three days out, it's one point five trillion dollars, thousands 622 00:35:12,560 --> 00:35:15,480 Speaker 1: of pages long. We're just seeing some of the initial wording. 623 00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:18,400 Speaker 1: Now the House Dems are going away on their retreat. 624 00:35:18,440 --> 00:35:21,120 Speaker 1: Are they coming back? You have people saying, don't try 625 00:35:21,160 --> 00:35:23,160 Speaker 1: to take planes from Philly because you'll need to be 626 00:35:23,239 --> 00:35:25,400 Speaker 1: back in d c Uh. You know, this is no 627 00:35:25,680 --> 00:35:28,920 Speaker 1: way to run a household, let alone a government. And 628 00:35:29,320 --> 00:35:32,600 Speaker 1: the frustration, um, I think with the American public if 629 00:35:32,719 --> 00:35:34,560 Speaker 1: if they take a look at this, the way this 630 00:35:34,640 --> 00:35:37,719 Speaker 1: is being done is absolutely very real. You know, we're 631 00:35:37,719 --> 00:35:40,439 Speaker 1: all gonna be paying taxes in mid April, and the 632 00:35:40,440 --> 00:35:42,319 Speaker 1: the I R. S isn't going to let us take 633 00:35:42,360 --> 00:35:45,280 Speaker 1: the amount of time Congress is taking to pass these budgets. 634 00:35:45,280 --> 00:35:48,480 Speaker 1: So it's something I think that you know, it's a 635 00:35:48,600 --> 00:35:51,000 Speaker 1: very real frustration. We've got to get our house in order. 636 00:35:51,160 --> 00:35:52,960 Speaker 1: Looks like we'll have a vote in the House as 637 00:35:53,000 --> 00:35:54,759 Speaker 1: soon as tomorrow, and of course we'll update you on 638 00:35:54,800 --> 00:35:57,160 Speaker 1: this here on sound On at this very time tomorrow. 639 00:35:57,440 --> 00:35:59,960 Speaker 1: Big thanks to Jennie and Gretta for the insights. Today 640 00:36:00,520 --> 00:36:03,080 Speaker 1: it's International Women's Day and as we've been reminding you, 641 00:36:03,160 --> 00:36:06,080 Speaker 1: March is Women's History Month. Every day this month we're 642 00:36:06,120 --> 00:36:09,239 Speaker 1: celebrating with an update here in a Great Moment in 643 00:36:09,320 --> 00:36:13,520 Speaker 1: History with Ranita Young. Happy International Women's Day on today. 644 00:36:13,520 --> 00:36:17,880 Speaker 1: In Women's History in ten, the Fearless Girls sculpture is revealed, 645 00:36:17,880 --> 00:36:21,040 Speaker 1: a cross from the Charging Bull statue on Wall Street, 646 00:36:21,480 --> 00:36:26,080 Speaker 1: Kristin Visbaald sculpture depicted a young, defiant girl standing confidently. 647 00:36:26,560 --> 00:36:29,520 Speaker 1: The sculpture was installed late the night before it was 648 00:36:29,560 --> 00:36:31,960 Speaker 1: placed there to draw attention to the lack of gender 649 00:36:31,960 --> 00:36:36,919 Speaker 1: diversity and equality in the workplace, particularly in large, powerful institutions. 650 00:36:36,920 --> 00:36:39,840 Speaker 1: In New York City. The plaque under the sculpture reads, 651 00:36:40,040 --> 00:36:43,680 Speaker 1: know the Power of Women in Leadership. She makes a difference. 652 00:36:44,080 --> 00:36:47,160 Speaker 1: It was commissioned by State Street Global Advisors, who wanted 653 00:36:47,200 --> 00:36:51,040 Speaker 1: to advertise an index fund that promotes gender diverse companies 654 00:36:51,080 --> 00:36:55,800 Speaker 1: with higher percentages of female leadership. That's today in women's history. 655 00:36:56,120 --> 00:37:00,560 Speaker 1: I'm Rnita Young Bloomberg Radio. Alright, Radia, we thank you. 656 00:37:00,680 --> 00:37:03,600 Speaker 1: We'll have another update from Rnita tomorrow, another panel and 657 00:37:03,680 --> 00:37:07,719 Speaker 1: another fastest hour in politics. This is sound On. I'm Joe, 658 00:37:07,719 --> 00:37:11,360 Speaker 1: Matthew and Washington. We'll have an update on markets and 659 00:37:11,400 --> 00:37:13,719 Speaker 1: traffic straight ahead. We'll meet you back here tomorrow. As 660 00:37:13,760 --> 00:37:17,279 Speaker 1: I say, this is gloomy.