1 00:00:04,240 --> 00:00:07,240 Speaker 1: Welcome to tex Stuff, a production of I Heart Radios 2 00:00:07,320 --> 00:00:14,440 Speaker 1: How Stuff Works. Hey there, and welcome to tech Stuff. 3 00:00:14,560 --> 00:00:19,200 Speaker 1: I'm your host, Jonathan Strickland, executive producer with I Heart 4 00:00:19,360 --> 00:00:23,640 Speaker 1: Radio and I love all things tech, and today we're 5 00:00:23,640 --> 00:00:26,560 Speaker 1: going to look at a tech Stuff classic episode that 6 00:00:26,600 --> 00:00:30,560 Speaker 1: published back in February two thirteen. This one has the 7 00:00:30,600 --> 00:00:36,320 Speaker 1: title tech Stuff Plays with carbon Nanotubes. Yes, carbon nanotubes 8 00:00:36,400 --> 00:00:40,440 Speaker 1: the stuff of the future that is persistently the stuff 9 00:00:40,520 --> 00:00:43,200 Speaker 1: of the future and never seems to be the stuff 10 00:00:43,240 --> 00:00:46,920 Speaker 1: of right now. I mean that's not entirely fair. We've 11 00:00:46,960 --> 00:00:49,480 Speaker 1: done a lot of work in carbon nanotubes and there's 12 00:00:49,479 --> 00:00:51,919 Speaker 1: been a lot of progress made, but it's been one 13 00:00:51,920 --> 00:00:55,560 Speaker 1: of those futuristic things for a long time now. So 14 00:00:55,640 --> 00:00:59,120 Speaker 1: let's listen back on two thousand thirteen Jonathan joined by 15 00:00:59,240 --> 00:01:03,560 Speaker 1: Lauren Vogelball as we talk about carbon nanotubes. First, we 16 00:01:03,560 --> 00:01:05,160 Speaker 1: thought that we would talk a little bit about why 17 00:01:05,280 --> 00:01:08,679 Speaker 1: carbon is cool, because um so so it's it's an element, 18 00:01:09,840 --> 00:01:14,720 Speaker 1: incredibly uh popular element here on the planet Earth. It 19 00:01:14,920 --> 00:01:17,759 Speaker 1: is way up there, it is. It is in fact, 20 00:01:18,000 --> 00:01:20,919 Speaker 1: the fourth most abundant element in the universe by mass 21 00:01:21,120 --> 00:01:24,479 Speaker 1: um after hydrogen, helium, and oxygen and the second most 22 00:01:24,520 --> 00:01:27,280 Speaker 1: abundant element in the human body. Yeah yeah, we are 23 00:01:27,520 --> 00:01:31,000 Speaker 1: what is known as carbon based life forms. Yeah. Um. 24 00:01:31,040 --> 00:01:33,440 Speaker 1: And all of this is made possible because carbon atoms 25 00:01:33,440 --> 00:01:36,600 Speaker 1: are these nifty little hexagons made with six electrons um. 26 00:01:36,720 --> 00:01:42,640 Speaker 1: They they bond very easily with one another. Actually, if 27 00:01:42,680 --> 00:01:46,400 Speaker 1: they bond in a lattice structure, which is a hexagonal structure, 28 00:01:46,800 --> 00:01:48,400 Speaker 1: do you have a sheet of that? So you've got 29 00:01:48,400 --> 00:01:51,080 Speaker 1: a whole bunch of carbon atoms that are molecularly bonded 30 00:01:51,120 --> 00:01:54,520 Speaker 1: to one another in this hexagon pattern. Here in the South. 31 00:01:54,720 --> 00:01:59,120 Speaker 1: I like to call it chicken wire. Anyone who anyone 32 00:01:59,160 --> 00:02:01,320 Speaker 1: who lives in any story a rural environment who has 33 00:02:01,360 --> 00:02:04,400 Speaker 1: seen chicken wire, that's kind of what a sheet of 34 00:02:04,440 --> 00:02:07,840 Speaker 1: these carbon atoms and molecular structure look like. We call 35 00:02:08,000 --> 00:02:11,880 Speaker 1: that sheet graphing. So let's say say you've got this 36 00:02:12,160 --> 00:02:16,480 Speaker 1: sheet of graphing, which is essentially two dimensional, right, because 37 00:02:16,800 --> 00:02:19,800 Speaker 1: adams don't really have a lot of thickness to them, 38 00:02:19,919 --> 00:02:23,000 Speaker 1: so they are you're you're talking about with and length, 39 00:02:23,040 --> 00:02:25,160 Speaker 1: you're not talking about depth. And I mean that's you know, 40 00:02:25,360 --> 00:02:29,080 Speaker 1: one atom thick that's thin enough to call it two dimensional. Absolutely. 41 00:02:29,320 --> 00:02:32,040 Speaker 1: So you've got the sheet of graphing. Let's say, then 42 00:02:32,080 --> 00:02:36,080 Speaker 1: you roll the graphing into a I don't know, burrito 43 00:02:36,240 --> 00:02:39,960 Speaker 1: like structure. It's not necessarily going to be filled with 44 00:02:40,120 --> 00:02:44,640 Speaker 1: cheesy beany goodness. You know, I kind of want a 45 00:02:44,680 --> 00:02:48,120 Speaker 1: carbon nano to burrito now. I am craving burritos like 46 00:02:48,120 --> 00:02:51,320 Speaker 1: you wouldn't believe. But but no, No, that's what we 47 00:02:51,360 --> 00:02:53,440 Speaker 1: call a carbon nanotube. You take that sheet of graphing, 48 00:02:53,560 --> 00:02:56,920 Speaker 1: this this hexagonal molecular structure of carbon, and this is 49 00:02:56,960 --> 00:02:59,880 Speaker 1: just carbon you and you roll it up and that's 50 00:03:00,080 --> 00:03:02,400 Speaker 1: carbon nanotube. But you know, carbon is kind of an 51 00:03:02,400 --> 00:03:06,160 Speaker 1: amazing thing anyway, because carbon can take on so many 52 00:03:06,240 --> 00:03:09,440 Speaker 1: different forms, right right, Yeah, I mean it's what diamonds 53 00:03:09,520 --> 00:03:12,600 Speaker 1: and graphite are both made of, and it's totally different 54 00:03:12,760 --> 00:03:14,840 Speaker 1: a little little bit. I mean, you know that's you've got. 55 00:03:14,840 --> 00:03:18,160 Speaker 1: You've got the hardest substance, the hearts, natural substance known 56 00:03:18,480 --> 00:03:21,519 Speaker 1: on Earth, right, and then you've got what you put 57 00:03:21,520 --> 00:03:25,160 Speaker 1: in pencils. Essential So yeah, something soft enough that paper 58 00:03:25,320 --> 00:03:31,040 Speaker 1: is paper, paper is its match, right right? Yeah? Yeah, 59 00:03:31,120 --> 00:03:34,920 Speaker 1: So so this is something that we call allotropes. Now, 60 00:03:34,920 --> 00:03:37,480 Speaker 1: an allotrope you know, you're like, what the heck is that? Well, 61 00:03:37,600 --> 00:03:40,480 Speaker 1: if you if you've studied chemistry, you know. So I 62 00:03:40,480 --> 00:03:42,800 Speaker 1: apologize to all the chemists out there who are screaming 63 00:03:42,840 --> 00:03:44,640 Speaker 1: at me because I'm assuming they don't know what an 64 00:03:44,640 --> 00:03:47,400 Speaker 1: allotrop It's okay, I know. You know. Also, y'all can 65 00:03:47,440 --> 00:03:49,960 Speaker 1: go just get a soda for the next about So, 66 00:03:50,000 --> 00:03:54,160 Speaker 1: an allotrope is any of two or more physical forms 67 00:03:54,200 --> 00:03:57,360 Speaker 1: in which an element can exist. So you we have 68 00:03:57,400 --> 00:04:00,600 Speaker 1: these elements that can exist in different physical forms, and 69 00:04:00,720 --> 00:04:03,400 Speaker 1: carbon is a perfect example. Lauren was just pointing out 70 00:04:03,760 --> 00:04:07,600 Speaker 1: diamond versus versus a graph fite. So you've got these 71 00:04:07,760 --> 00:04:11,240 Speaker 1: two very different kinds of forms, but they're still the 72 00:04:11,280 --> 00:04:15,600 Speaker 1: same basic element. Uh well, carbon nanotubes are very similar 73 00:04:15,600 --> 00:04:18,040 Speaker 1: in that way. We'll talk a bit more about the 74 00:04:18,080 --> 00:04:22,480 Speaker 1: different properties that carbon nano tubes can have and why 75 00:04:22,560 --> 00:04:26,320 Speaker 1: they can have different properties, but we need to lead 76 00:04:26,400 --> 00:04:29,880 Speaker 1: up to that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, Well this entire carbon 77 00:04:29,960 --> 00:04:35,679 Speaker 1: nanotube business was discovered in by Sumio Ijima, I believe 78 00:04:35,760 --> 00:04:37,680 Speaker 1: is the way that you pronounce it. Um apologies to 79 00:04:37,680 --> 00:04:42,960 Speaker 1: my Japanese teacher. Um. Although research into into creating these 80 00:04:43,000 --> 00:04:46,640 Speaker 1: sheets of graphine stretches back into the nineteen fifties. Um, 81 00:04:46,680 --> 00:04:49,080 Speaker 1: and all of these are there. They're actually two processes 82 00:04:49,120 --> 00:04:52,240 Speaker 1: for making them. One of them I'm not extremely familiar with, 83 00:04:52,279 --> 00:04:53,679 Speaker 1: and it's written all the way down at the bottom 84 00:04:53,680 --> 00:04:55,120 Speaker 1: of my notes, so we're going to cover that one later. 85 00:04:55,440 --> 00:04:59,240 Speaker 1: That's a wet application, the general way of making carbon 86 00:04:59,320 --> 00:05:02,599 Speaker 1: nano tubes as a RYE application, and you thermally strip 87 00:05:02,640 --> 00:05:09,400 Speaker 1: carbon atoms off of carbon bearing compounds. Wow, that sounds complicated, 88 00:05:09,920 --> 00:05:13,400 Speaker 1: or at least violent and violent. Violent at an atomic level, 89 00:05:13,480 --> 00:05:18,240 Speaker 1: that is extremely violent. Yeah, and so this is well, 90 00:05:18,520 --> 00:05:21,800 Speaker 1: this is what produces these these extremely these atom thin 91 00:05:22,040 --> 00:05:25,960 Speaker 1: sheets UM that that you then roll into a tiny 92 00:05:26,000 --> 00:05:28,440 Speaker 1: tiny tube and by tiny tiny, I mean about a 93 00:05:28,600 --> 00:05:32,120 Speaker 1: nanometer or two in diameter UM and just you know, 94 00:05:32,360 --> 00:05:35,200 Speaker 1: just to just to recover this nanimeter is one millionth 95 00:05:35,320 --> 00:05:38,240 Speaker 1: of a millimeter, so it's one billionth of a meter, 96 00:05:38,400 --> 00:05:41,839 Speaker 1: So it's small, right, And then you at least for 97 00:05:41,880 --> 00:05:46,279 Speaker 1: the longest time, Uh, these these carbon nanotubes could be 98 00:05:46,600 --> 00:05:50,520 Speaker 1: at most about a millimeter long. Now that's changed recently, right, right, 99 00:05:50,560 --> 00:05:53,280 Speaker 1: But I mean even a millimeter long is pretty impressive 100 00:05:53,279 --> 00:05:56,000 Speaker 1: because that's that's a million times as long as it is. 101 00:05:56,040 --> 00:05:59,480 Speaker 1: Why that's I mean, that aspect ratio is incredible. I mean, 102 00:05:59,480 --> 00:06:02,120 Speaker 1: it's one of the things that really made carbon nanotubes 103 00:06:03,240 --> 00:06:05,760 Speaker 1: a fascinating thing to look at, because you're thinking, if 104 00:06:05,800 --> 00:06:08,280 Speaker 1: you're looking at the dimensions, by one dimension, this is 105 00:06:08,320 --> 00:06:12,119 Speaker 1: incredibly tiny, and by the other, in comparison, it is ginormous. 106 00:06:12,200 --> 00:06:14,719 Speaker 1: I mean, think about the technical term. Think if you 107 00:06:14,800 --> 00:06:18,680 Speaker 1: saw a bus that was a million times longer than 108 00:06:18,720 --> 00:06:21,320 Speaker 1: it was wide or or or long cat. If long 109 00:06:21,320 --> 00:06:24,599 Speaker 1: CAT were so long that it were a million times longer. 110 00:06:24,760 --> 00:06:27,640 Speaker 1: Thank you, Thank you Lauren for bringing it directly into 111 00:06:27,760 --> 00:06:31,680 Speaker 1: an analogy that is relatable to everybody. I was going 112 00:06:31,760 --> 00:06:34,480 Speaker 1: with the bus, What was I thinking? I was mostly 113 00:06:34,520 --> 00:06:36,479 Speaker 1: thinking I would not want to be behind that bus. 114 00:06:36,560 --> 00:06:39,359 Speaker 1: I bet they would make really wide right turns. Like 115 00:06:39,440 --> 00:06:41,760 Speaker 1: we're on we're on the internet, Okay, we if we 116 00:06:41,760 --> 00:06:45,159 Speaker 1: don't incorporate cats into the conversation, we're going to be fired, right, 117 00:06:45,200 --> 00:06:48,080 Speaker 1: We're lost. But anyway, Yes, this is one of those 118 00:06:48,120 --> 00:06:52,360 Speaker 1: amazing properties of of carbon ano tubes. The other thing 119 00:06:52,400 --> 00:06:55,920 Speaker 1: that I find really interesting is that carbon ano tubes 120 00:06:56,000 --> 00:07:00,839 Speaker 1: will have very different properties depending up on how they 121 00:07:00,880 --> 00:07:05,000 Speaker 1: are rolled. Because it's mostly the direction of the role. 122 00:07:05,120 --> 00:07:07,919 Speaker 1: So it really is the how that those hexagons I 123 00:07:07,960 --> 00:07:10,680 Speaker 1: was talking about in the graphing, how they are aligned 124 00:07:10,720 --> 00:07:15,160 Speaker 1: in comparison to the actual role of this sheet. Uh. 125 00:07:15,200 --> 00:07:17,720 Speaker 1: And depending on how you do it, it can behave 126 00:07:17,840 --> 00:07:21,520 Speaker 1: like uh, like a metal, so a conductor, so it 127 00:07:21,560 --> 00:07:24,720 Speaker 1: will conduct electricity. But if you roll it a different way, 128 00:07:24,840 --> 00:07:27,080 Speaker 1: like at a slightly different angle. And if you guys 129 00:07:27,160 --> 00:07:29,480 Speaker 1: are having trouble visualizing this, just take a sheet of 130 00:07:29,520 --> 00:07:33,080 Speaker 1: paper and roll it along the short side, or roll 131 00:07:33,120 --> 00:07:35,880 Speaker 1: it along the long side, or roll it along the diagonal. 132 00:07:36,400 --> 00:07:38,120 Speaker 1: These are all the different kinds of ways you can 133 00:07:38,200 --> 00:07:40,760 Speaker 1: roll sheets of graphing and you get different properties. So 134 00:07:41,200 --> 00:07:43,960 Speaker 1: you roll it one way, it acts metallic like a conductor, 135 00:07:44,000 --> 00:07:47,000 Speaker 1: so it's conducting electricity. You roll it another way it 136 00:07:47,000 --> 00:07:50,920 Speaker 1: acts like a semiconductor, which means that in some situations 137 00:07:50,960 --> 00:07:53,600 Speaker 1: it does conduct electricity and in other situations it acts 138 00:07:53,600 --> 00:07:57,520 Speaker 1: as an insulator. This gives it an incredible flexibility as 139 00:07:57,520 --> 00:07:59,880 Speaker 1: far as applications are concerned. You can use it in 140 00:08:00,200 --> 00:08:02,680 Speaker 1: all sorts of electronic applications, which we will get to 141 00:08:03,600 --> 00:08:06,480 Speaker 1: a little bit when. Yeah, and it also depends on 142 00:08:06,520 --> 00:08:08,080 Speaker 1: what kind of you can roll them into all kinds 143 00:08:08,080 --> 00:08:12,880 Speaker 1: of different interesting shapes using using an atomic force microscopes 144 00:08:13,080 --> 00:08:16,800 Speaker 1: also called scanning force microscopes, which are which are things 145 00:08:16,840 --> 00:08:19,520 Speaker 1: that have these these tiny bitty little nanimeter probes on 146 00:08:19,520 --> 00:08:21,040 Speaker 1: the end of them, and you can use them to 147 00:08:21,120 --> 00:08:25,400 Speaker 1: basically poke around a nanotube until it's the right shape, 148 00:08:25,440 --> 00:08:27,920 Speaker 1: the right shape for your process. This is pretty amazing. 149 00:08:27,920 --> 00:08:31,360 Speaker 1: I mean, we're talking about manipulating things that are just 150 00:08:31,680 --> 00:08:35,320 Speaker 1: slightly larger than the atomic scale, right, I mean, it's 151 00:08:35,360 --> 00:08:39,160 Speaker 1: something that's really difficult to to visualize. Now, there there 152 00:08:39,200 --> 00:08:41,880 Speaker 1: are some neat ways of kind of getting an idea 153 00:08:41,920 --> 00:08:44,559 Speaker 1: of how precise we can be these days. My favorite, 154 00:08:44,640 --> 00:08:46,640 Speaker 1: we've talked about it on the Tech Stuff podcast in 155 00:08:46,679 --> 00:08:52,160 Speaker 1: the past. My favorite illustration is that ibm UH several 156 00:08:52,240 --> 00:08:56,840 Speaker 1: years ago used a similar type of microscope to manipulate 157 00:08:57,000 --> 00:09:01,520 Speaker 1: individual atoms to spell out I B M on a 158 00:09:01,559 --> 00:09:05,200 Speaker 1: silicon wafer. That is delightful. Yeah, so you're talking about 159 00:09:05,240 --> 00:09:08,720 Speaker 1: being able to when when we're able to manipulate individual atoms, 160 00:09:09,080 --> 00:09:11,840 Speaker 1: then obviously this is we've got this level of precision 161 00:09:11,880 --> 00:09:15,080 Speaker 1: that to me is mind boggling. I mean, it's really exciting. 162 00:09:15,640 --> 00:09:18,199 Speaker 1: But some of the other properties of carbon nanotubes is 163 00:09:18,240 --> 00:09:21,319 Speaker 1: again depending upon the way you you you roll these tubes, 164 00:09:21,960 --> 00:09:26,400 Speaker 1: it can be an incredibly strong material, stronger and lighter 165 00:09:26,520 --> 00:09:30,560 Speaker 1: than say, steal, hundreds of times stronger than steel. Yeah, 166 00:09:30,720 --> 00:09:34,760 Speaker 1: according to to to some Well, you know, here's the thing. 167 00:09:35,280 --> 00:09:40,360 Speaker 1: There's a theoretical limit to the tensile strength of carbon nanotubes, 168 00:09:41,040 --> 00:09:45,760 Speaker 1: and then there's the limit that we've actually seen. Right, 169 00:09:45,840 --> 00:09:50,040 Speaker 1: and as we get better about creating nanotubes than those 170 00:09:50,080 --> 00:09:54,480 Speaker 1: two numbers get closer together. But in general, in the 171 00:09:54,520 --> 00:09:58,560 Speaker 1: experimental phase you might not see as incredible a display 172 00:09:58,600 --> 00:10:01,120 Speaker 1: of strength as you would aspect when you start running 173 00:10:01,120 --> 00:10:05,680 Speaker 1: the numbers via you know, mathe But for an example, 174 00:10:05,720 --> 00:10:09,040 Speaker 1: you could take a a cable that if you were 175 00:10:09,080 --> 00:10:11,280 Speaker 1: to cut the cable and look at and measure the 176 00:10:11,320 --> 00:10:14,720 Speaker 1: diameter you're talking about like a a one millimeter diameter 177 00:10:15,200 --> 00:10:20,800 Speaker 1: of this cable, nanotube of that size could hold approximately 178 00:10:21,080 --> 00:10:26,240 Speaker 1: six thousand fo or fourteen thousand pounds. And that's and 179 00:10:26,240 --> 00:10:28,040 Speaker 1: and and a millimeter, I mean, that's that's what like 180 00:10:28,040 --> 00:10:30,240 Speaker 1: like about the width of a human hair. Well, a 181 00:10:30,320 --> 00:10:34,160 Speaker 1: millimeter would be one millionth of a nano, one million 182 00:10:34,200 --> 00:10:36,839 Speaker 1: times the size of a nanometer. That really brings it 183 00:10:36,880 --> 00:10:39,920 Speaker 1: into perspective one million that I ruined my own joke. 184 00:10:41,480 --> 00:10:43,640 Speaker 1: To be fair, I'm not working on very much sleep, right, 185 00:10:43,679 --> 00:10:45,440 Speaker 1: I think I think a millimeter is about it's about 186 00:10:45,440 --> 00:10:47,640 Speaker 1: the size of a head of a pin. Actually, the 187 00:10:47,679 --> 00:10:51,920 Speaker 1: hair a human hair is like a few hundred thousand nanometers, 188 00:10:51,960 --> 00:10:54,920 Speaker 1: depending upon the person's hair, because human hair comes in 189 00:10:54,960 --> 00:10:59,440 Speaker 1: a but but yes, I mean, the point being that 190 00:10:59,480 --> 00:11:03,319 Speaker 1: you're talking about an incredibly thin cable that could hold 191 00:11:04,280 --> 00:11:08,680 Speaker 1: an amazing amount of weight considering the dimensions of the cable. Now, 192 00:11:08,880 --> 00:11:11,880 Speaker 1: granted again, this is theoretical, you know, when we talk 193 00:11:11,920 --> 00:11:15,120 Speaker 1: about real carbon nanotubes and the real experiences we've had, 194 00:11:15,559 --> 00:11:18,560 Speaker 1: it's a little bit different from that. But the potential 195 00:11:18,640 --> 00:11:22,679 Speaker 1: there is to build certain types of materials, certain types 196 00:11:22,760 --> 00:11:27,199 Speaker 1: of products using this stuff that can have fantastic properties. 197 00:11:27,559 --> 00:11:31,160 Speaker 1: And just to be clear, we're saying stronger than steel. 198 00:11:31,640 --> 00:11:35,760 Speaker 1: That's really mostly tension strength when you're talking about um 199 00:11:35,760 --> 00:11:41,199 Speaker 1: other types of impact. Because carbon nanotubes are hollow, they 200 00:11:41,200 --> 00:11:45,720 Speaker 1: can buckle. So let's say that you have just somehow 201 00:11:45,760 --> 00:11:48,520 Speaker 1: you have managed to make one carbon nanotube that's you know, 202 00:11:48,960 --> 00:11:53,640 Speaker 1: Lauren Height, and then you have a force impacting that 203 00:11:53,800 --> 00:11:56,719 Speaker 1: along the side of the carbon nanotube, so it's not 204 00:11:56,760 --> 00:11:59,680 Speaker 1: pulling on the nanotube, it's pushing against the side right 205 00:11:59,720 --> 00:12:02,319 Speaker 1: into the chewy center. Right. Well, that chewy center might 206 00:12:02,360 --> 00:12:05,559 Speaker 1: just buckle and the carbon nanotube bends and you think, well, 207 00:12:05,600 --> 00:12:08,360 Speaker 1: that was But it's the same sort of thing like 208 00:12:08,360 --> 00:12:10,160 Speaker 1: saying the strength of a rope. The strength of the 209 00:12:10,240 --> 00:12:14,520 Speaker 1: rope is how much weight it can pull, not pushing 210 00:12:14,559 --> 00:12:16,280 Speaker 1: against the rope in the middle of the middle of 211 00:12:16,280 --> 00:12:18,520 Speaker 1: the rope. It doesn't make any sense. And let's be 212 00:12:18,640 --> 00:12:21,000 Speaker 1: pulped taught, And that's a whole different version of physics 213 00:12:21,040 --> 00:12:23,400 Speaker 1: that we would need to get into right right exactly. 214 00:12:23,600 --> 00:12:25,880 Speaker 1: But but that's one of the other things to to 215 00:12:25,960 --> 00:12:28,199 Speaker 1: keep in mind is that even though it is an 216 00:12:28,200 --> 00:12:32,360 Speaker 1: incredibly strong material and theoretically one of the strongest materials 217 00:12:32,360 --> 00:12:37,120 Speaker 1: we've encountered, uh, that's only in specific use cases. It's 218 00:12:37,160 --> 00:12:40,640 Speaker 1: not like you would build a carbon nanotube wall and 219 00:12:40,679 --> 00:12:44,120 Speaker 1: it would be immune to everything else known to man, right, 220 00:12:44,800 --> 00:12:46,760 Speaker 1: although I'm sure there are ways you could do that, 221 00:12:47,160 --> 00:12:49,600 Speaker 1: like maybe with some sort of woven fabric made out 222 00:12:49,600 --> 00:12:53,880 Speaker 1: of carbon nanotubes, but an individual carbonanitude it's not the case. 223 00:12:55,040 --> 00:13:05,080 Speaker 1: Let's take a moment to thank our sponsor, and now 224 00:13:05,160 --> 00:13:10,120 Speaker 1: we'll return to our regularly scheduled tech stuff podcast. Alright, so, um, 225 00:13:10,120 --> 00:13:12,760 Speaker 1: so there are there are many many applications that these 226 00:13:12,840 --> 00:13:15,800 Speaker 1: nanotubes can be used for. Like, like we mentioned before, 227 00:13:16,559 --> 00:13:20,200 Speaker 1: their engineers are looking at incorporating them into building materials, 228 00:13:20,200 --> 00:13:22,600 Speaker 1: perhaps for vehicles. I mean, imagine if you had a 229 00:13:22,679 --> 00:13:25,840 Speaker 1: vehicle that was six times lighter than than the cars 230 00:13:25,840 --> 00:13:28,400 Speaker 1: that are running around today, right that and that. If 231 00:13:28,400 --> 00:13:30,440 Speaker 1: you're wondering why you would want a light car, one 232 00:13:30,480 --> 00:13:32,640 Speaker 1: reason is that it means that you don't have to 233 00:13:32,679 --> 00:13:36,120 Speaker 1: use as much fuel to push that car around. A 234 00:13:36,200 --> 00:13:38,600 Speaker 1: lighter car means less work for the engine to do. 235 00:13:38,960 --> 00:13:40,880 Speaker 1: If if the engine has to do less work, it 236 00:13:41,559 --> 00:13:45,640 Speaker 1: theoretically needs less fuel. So we could end up with 237 00:13:45,760 --> 00:13:50,120 Speaker 1: cars that are still gas powered but end up requiring 238 00:13:50,200 --> 00:13:54,520 Speaker 1: far less fuel have greater efficiency. Or we could of 239 00:13:54,559 --> 00:13:58,080 Speaker 1: course use it in other like hybrid cars and you 240 00:13:58,080 --> 00:14:01,360 Speaker 1: know you're again you're placing or even electric vehicles or 241 00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:04,240 Speaker 1: something like this airplane or yeah, yeah, there's some great 242 00:14:04,559 --> 00:14:07,800 Speaker 1: airplanes would be fantastic because, as anyone has pointed out, 243 00:14:07,800 --> 00:14:11,080 Speaker 1: if you're talking about someone who's who's green conscious and 244 00:14:11,120 --> 00:14:14,120 Speaker 1: they're trying very hard to live a green friendly life style. 245 00:14:14,200 --> 00:14:17,120 Speaker 1: They basically need to avoid airplanes entirely. One flight on 246 00:14:17,120 --> 00:14:19,480 Speaker 1: a plane and you have just like you know, you're 247 00:14:19,520 --> 00:14:24,000 Speaker 1: essentially erasing any good you're doing with your entire green 248 00:14:24,080 --> 00:14:26,920 Speaker 1: life at home. And that's that's just a hard reality 249 00:14:26,960 --> 00:14:31,800 Speaker 1: of what it takes to move. Yeah, so that's a 250 00:14:31,840 --> 00:14:34,640 Speaker 1: great example. You actually pointed out something else. A future 251 00:14:35,080 --> 00:14:37,680 Speaker 1: use of this technology could be something that we did 252 00:14:37,680 --> 00:14:40,680 Speaker 1: an episode of tech Stuff about a few years ago. 253 00:14:40,880 --> 00:14:44,560 Speaker 1: Space elevators. Space elevators. Yeah, these are these are really 254 00:14:44,640 --> 00:14:47,240 Speaker 1: nifty things. If you guys have not heard of this, um, 255 00:14:47,640 --> 00:14:49,600 Speaker 1: you you should have by now, you're a bad tech 256 00:14:49,640 --> 00:14:53,160 Speaker 1: stuff listener. But that's okay, because you can fix that. 257 00:14:53,800 --> 00:14:58,120 Speaker 1: I still love you, Yes, yes, no, No, I just 258 00:14:58,360 --> 00:15:01,760 Speaker 1: I had to. I had to moderated of Facebook thread 259 00:15:01,760 --> 00:15:04,080 Speaker 1: the other day. I am being the social media here. 260 00:15:04,080 --> 00:15:06,920 Speaker 1: It has stuff works. I'm if people are are being 261 00:15:07,040 --> 00:15:09,000 Speaker 1: jerks on Facebook, they I'm the one who has to 262 00:15:09,040 --> 00:15:11,800 Speaker 1: clean it up. So don't be jerks on Facebook, y'all. Um. 263 00:15:13,720 --> 00:15:18,480 Speaker 1: It's a very special episode of tech Stuff, But no elevator, 264 00:15:18,760 --> 00:15:21,600 Speaker 1: space space elevator. No, well, I mean, okay, the point 265 00:15:21,640 --> 00:15:24,440 Speaker 1: of my story here, I've start started to stutter. Excellent. Um, 266 00:15:25,120 --> 00:15:28,000 Speaker 1: the point of my of my story was that you 267 00:15:28,040 --> 00:15:30,440 Speaker 1: shouldn't be a jerk on Facebook. Now, No, I had 268 00:15:30,480 --> 00:15:32,400 Speaker 1: a point. My point, well, let me let me let 269 00:15:32,400 --> 00:15:35,080 Speaker 1: me at least explain what space elevator is. How about that? 270 00:15:35,160 --> 00:15:37,840 Speaker 1: Because I'm dying here, I can I can at least 271 00:15:37,840 --> 00:15:41,320 Speaker 1: give it a shot. So let's say. Let's let's say 272 00:15:41,360 --> 00:15:45,640 Speaker 1: you put an object into orbit, stationary orbit around the Earth. Okay, 273 00:15:45,720 --> 00:15:48,880 Speaker 1: so it has to be uh, it's the object is 274 00:15:48,920 --> 00:15:52,000 Speaker 1: sort of a counterweight, essentially, So you've got a counterweight 275 00:15:52,160 --> 00:15:55,080 Speaker 1: orbiting the Earth, and the thing connecting the counterweight to 276 00:15:55,280 --> 00:16:00,640 Speaker 1: Earth is a very strong cable, and you use the elevator, 277 00:16:00,640 --> 00:16:05,440 Speaker 1: which is essentially attached to the cable, to transport in anything. Really, 278 00:16:05,480 --> 00:16:08,040 Speaker 1: it could be people, although cargo would be a lot 279 00:16:08,120 --> 00:16:10,400 Speaker 1: easier than people, because with people you gotta worry about, 280 00:16:10,400 --> 00:16:12,840 Speaker 1: I don't know, keeping them alive and stuff, moving them 281 00:16:13,000 --> 00:16:16,720 Speaker 1: to Yeah, I guess if we're moving dead people, it's okay. 282 00:16:17,600 --> 00:16:20,040 Speaker 1: So if we want to have a space cemetery out there, 283 00:16:21,040 --> 00:16:23,360 Speaker 1: I wouldn't mind that, except that I actually plan on 284 00:16:23,560 --> 00:16:27,680 Speaker 1: donating my body to science fiction. Uh so the the Yeah, 285 00:16:27,760 --> 00:16:30,960 Speaker 1: you have an elevator that has this counterweight out there. Okay, 286 00:16:31,360 --> 00:16:33,400 Speaker 1: you're just pick up that. Now I'm with you. I'm 287 00:16:33,400 --> 00:16:36,880 Speaker 1: with you, and keep going so the elevator can travel 288 00:16:37,040 --> 00:16:39,160 Speaker 1: up the cable. The the nice thing about this is 289 00:16:39,280 --> 00:16:41,480 Speaker 1: the based on this design, you might be using things 290 00:16:41,560 --> 00:16:45,200 Speaker 1: like lasers to actually power this elevator. Uh. The elevator 291 00:16:45,240 --> 00:16:48,240 Speaker 1: wouldn't have things on it like thrusters, like rocket thrusters, 292 00:16:48,280 --> 00:16:50,680 Speaker 1: the way we would with a a traditional rocket ship 293 00:16:50,760 --> 00:16:53,120 Speaker 1: to get stuff into space. It would mean that it 294 00:16:53,160 --> 00:16:59,000 Speaker 1: would take uh less energy in theory to deliver payloads 295 00:16:59,040 --> 00:17:01,800 Speaker 1: to utter space. You wouldn't have to worry about problems 296 00:17:01,880 --> 00:17:07,119 Speaker 1: like uh catastrophic failure when you're talking about propellants that 297 00:17:07,200 --> 00:17:11,960 Speaker 1: can be incredibly dangerous under the wrong conditions. And also, 298 00:17:12,000 --> 00:17:13,520 Speaker 1: I mean, just like we were saying, if you if 299 00:17:13,520 --> 00:17:16,680 Speaker 1: you take one airline flight, you're basically erasing the entire 300 00:17:16,760 --> 00:17:18,600 Speaker 1: good that you've done on your carbon footprint all year. 301 00:17:19,160 --> 00:17:21,480 Speaker 1: You know, the cost of launch in terms of fuel 302 00:17:21,800 --> 00:17:26,359 Speaker 1: and and just people and manpower is is ten thousand 303 00:17:26,440 --> 00:17:30,480 Speaker 1: dollars per pound. That's per kilogram that's a bunch. So 304 00:17:31,040 --> 00:17:34,119 Speaker 1: you've got you've got this need to find a cheaper 305 00:17:34,160 --> 00:17:36,240 Speaker 1: way to get stuff into utter space if in fact 306 00:17:36,359 --> 00:17:38,960 Speaker 1: we want to do that thing that which we do, 307 00:17:39,400 --> 00:17:41,800 Speaker 1: I mean I do, yeah, because there's lots of fascinating 308 00:17:41,840 --> 00:17:45,600 Speaker 1: stuff out there. So space elevators are a good way 309 00:17:45,640 --> 00:17:47,240 Speaker 1: of doing that. But one of the problems is that 310 00:17:47,359 --> 00:17:49,480 Speaker 1: how do you create a cable that's going to be 311 00:17:49,600 --> 00:17:53,560 Speaker 1: strong enough and small enough to make this a reality? 312 00:17:53,640 --> 00:17:57,520 Speaker 1: And carbonano tubes might very well be the way that 313 00:17:57,600 --> 00:18:01,520 Speaker 1: we solve that problem. Now, for a long time everyone said, okay, 314 00:18:01,560 --> 00:18:05,680 Speaker 1: well here's the barrier, the barriers that we've got. We've 315 00:18:05,720 --> 00:18:08,720 Speaker 1: got this exactly. Yeah, yeah, we can make carbonano tubes, 316 00:18:08,840 --> 00:18:11,040 Speaker 1: but there are a millimeter long at most, and so 317 00:18:11,680 --> 00:18:13,479 Speaker 1: we don't have to make a whole bunch of them 318 00:18:13,560 --> 00:18:17,160 Speaker 1: and tie the ends together teeny little bows in order 319 00:18:17,240 --> 00:18:19,600 Speaker 1: to make a big, long one for the cable, but 320 00:18:19,920 --> 00:18:23,920 Speaker 1: relatively ineffective. Yeah, so we'll get into some some new 321 00:18:24,040 --> 00:18:28,240 Speaker 1: forms of manufacturer that have made that less of a problem. 322 00:18:28,359 --> 00:18:31,479 Speaker 1: But even now we're still talking about this is science 323 00:18:31,520 --> 00:18:35,040 Speaker 1: fiction as far as we're concerned. It's it's feasible, but 324 00:18:35,240 --> 00:18:39,159 Speaker 1: not possible. Given our technology right now, right now, But 325 00:18:39,200 --> 00:18:42,480 Speaker 1: there are other applications that we could use carbonanotubes and 326 00:18:42,560 --> 00:18:47,040 Speaker 1: including things like, uh like conductive plastics, So we can 327 00:18:47,119 --> 00:18:52,639 Speaker 1: make electronics out of plastic materials and run carbonano tubes 328 00:18:52,720 --> 00:18:56,760 Speaker 1: through the plastic, creating them a conductive layer, so that 329 00:18:57,400 --> 00:19:00,399 Speaker 1: you can actually make products even small more than they 330 00:19:00,400 --> 00:19:04,399 Speaker 1: are today. So instead of having a casing that is 331 00:19:04,600 --> 00:19:07,040 Speaker 1: covering up the electronics, the casing would be part of 332 00:19:07,080 --> 00:19:09,520 Speaker 1: the electronics. You could have you know, a credit card, 333 00:19:09,640 --> 00:19:13,240 Speaker 1: thin smartphone. Yeah, yeah, that would that would turn More's 334 00:19:13,280 --> 00:19:15,440 Speaker 1: law right on its point he had. Yeah, yeah, there's 335 00:19:15,480 --> 00:19:18,400 Speaker 1: some pretty neat stuff that could potentially happen. We also 336 00:19:18,480 --> 00:19:22,360 Speaker 1: could have things like smart fabrics, so clothing that could 337 00:19:22,400 --> 00:19:25,040 Speaker 1: have carbon nanotubes in it that might do things like 338 00:19:25,320 --> 00:19:29,640 Speaker 1: monitor conditions like it could it could end up powering 339 00:19:29,800 --> 00:19:33,400 Speaker 1: various sensors. This would obviously be very important in uniforms 340 00:19:33,440 --> 00:19:38,000 Speaker 1: like space suits or first responders outfits for things like firefighters, 341 00:19:38,080 --> 00:19:41,240 Speaker 1: things like that, you know, things that that could benefit 342 00:19:41,359 --> 00:19:45,080 Speaker 1: from this. But even from a more consumer standpoint, we 343 00:19:45,160 --> 00:19:47,960 Speaker 1: could even have I don't know, like clothing that tells 344 00:19:48,000 --> 00:19:49,760 Speaker 1: you how active you are and whether or not you're 345 00:19:49,760 --> 00:19:52,080 Speaker 1: getting enough exercise and don't even have to put on 346 00:19:52,160 --> 00:19:56,359 Speaker 1: a speedometer a little Nike fit wristband, right, you'd be fine. 347 00:19:56,440 --> 00:19:58,760 Speaker 1: You just you know, you put on your clothing, and 348 00:19:58,880 --> 00:20:02,800 Speaker 1: that tells you or may say things like, for Heaven's sake, 349 00:20:02,960 --> 00:20:07,360 Speaker 1: wash me. You know that that goes out to everyone 350 00:20:07,440 --> 00:20:11,919 Speaker 1: I went to college with. There other clothing applications. I mean, 351 00:20:12,000 --> 00:20:14,399 Speaker 1: maybe not so much for daily use, but but carbon 352 00:20:14,400 --> 00:20:17,040 Speaker 1: antotubes could be used to create some really terrific body armor. 353 00:20:17,480 --> 00:20:20,280 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, sure, yeah. Again, we're talking about the incredible strength, 354 00:20:20,320 --> 00:20:23,159 Speaker 1: and if it's woven the right way, you're talking about 355 00:20:23,280 --> 00:20:27,760 Speaker 1: something that could have a great applications for anyone who 356 00:20:27,920 --> 00:20:31,119 Speaker 1: might be in military or law enforcement to provide a 357 00:20:31,240 --> 00:20:34,600 Speaker 1: level of protection that is really unheard of at this point. 358 00:20:34,640 --> 00:20:36,960 Speaker 1: I mean, we've got some great technology out there to 359 00:20:37,040 --> 00:20:39,840 Speaker 1: keep people protected, but this would be a step of 360 00:20:40,080 --> 00:20:44,280 Speaker 1: a huge step above that. Hey guys, twenty nineteen, Johnathan again, 361 00:20:44,600 --> 00:20:46,320 Speaker 1: you know the one you hate, because it's time for 362 00:20:46,440 --> 00:20:56,240 Speaker 1: us to take another quick break. Part of the problem 363 00:20:56,320 --> 00:20:59,680 Speaker 1: here is that we're talking about a material that's still 364 00:21:00,000 --> 00:21:03,840 Speaker 1: a little challenging to manufacture, especially in mass quantities. But 365 00:21:04,119 --> 00:21:10,639 Speaker 1: there have been improvements in carbon nanotube manufacturing processes very recently. Yeah, actually, 366 00:21:10,640 --> 00:21:13,000 Speaker 1: I'm we were, we were, and you know, we're recording 367 00:21:13,080 --> 00:21:16,280 Speaker 1: this in early January, UM two thousand and thirteen. And 368 00:21:16,480 --> 00:21:19,520 Speaker 1: actually just today the Internet told me that, um that 369 00:21:19,680 --> 00:21:24,040 Speaker 1: Rice University has announced a macroscopic hundreds of meters long 370 00:21:24,440 --> 00:21:29,200 Speaker 1: mass producible carnin carbon nanotube thread. Yeah, this is this 371 00:21:29,400 --> 00:21:32,200 Speaker 1: is incredible news because again, before we were talking about 372 00:21:32,720 --> 00:21:35,760 Speaker 1: nanotubes that were a millimeter long, and that was considered huge. 373 00:21:36,119 --> 00:21:41,000 Speaker 1: Now we're talking hundreds of meters. That is such an 374 00:21:41,160 --> 00:21:44,240 Speaker 1: enormous leap that it it boggles my mind. And it's 375 00:21:44,320 --> 00:21:47,879 Speaker 1: all through this this wet method that they used to 376 00:21:48,000 --> 00:21:51,800 Speaker 1: manufacture carbon nanotubes. Yeah, wet spinning method in which, um, 377 00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:53,920 Speaker 1: and I'm sorry, I'm going to read this directly from 378 00:21:53,920 --> 00:21:55,879 Speaker 1: my notes, which is probably a terrible thing to do, 379 00:21:56,359 --> 00:21:58,879 Speaker 1: but in which clumps of nanotubes are dissolved in a 380 00:21:58,960 --> 00:22:02,639 Speaker 1: bath of some acid stuff squirted through small holes to 381 00:22:02,720 --> 00:22:06,080 Speaker 1: create long strands, and then the strands are wound into 382 00:22:06,119 --> 00:22:09,320 Speaker 1: a big spool until they dry out. That's pretty incredible. 383 00:22:09,359 --> 00:22:12,080 Speaker 1: So really, the way I understand that is that we 384 00:22:12,359 --> 00:22:15,920 Speaker 1: have dissolved the carbon nanotubes until they're essentially a liquid. 385 00:22:16,440 --> 00:22:20,520 Speaker 1: You put them into what is essentially a nozzle, you 386 00:22:20,640 --> 00:22:23,840 Speaker 1: squirted out in what is essentially like a giant icing 387 00:22:24,080 --> 00:22:27,160 Speaker 1: thing where your favorite kind of cake, and you get 388 00:22:27,200 --> 00:22:31,080 Speaker 1: this long string of carbon nanotube. That's exactly the way 389 00:22:31,119 --> 00:22:34,280 Speaker 1: you wanted to be until you get that, you spoil 390 00:22:34,320 --> 00:22:36,040 Speaker 1: it up and there you got You got a hundreds, 391 00:22:36,320 --> 00:22:38,960 Speaker 1: hundreds of meters long carbon nanotube. Yeah, it's it's the 392 00:22:39,000 --> 00:22:41,520 Speaker 1: thickness of a human hair. Um uh And and not 393 00:22:41,680 --> 00:22:44,400 Speaker 1: like I was saying earlier that you know, that's that's big. 394 00:22:44,520 --> 00:22:48,440 Speaker 1: That's a bunch of a bunch of h space things 395 00:22:49,520 --> 00:22:53,920 Speaker 1: measurements of stuff. It's much much larger than say, you know, 396 00:22:54,240 --> 00:22:57,000 Speaker 1: a single carbon nanotube would normally be you know again 397 00:22:57,119 --> 00:23:00,320 Speaker 1: one billionth of a of a meter in die ameter. 398 00:23:00,880 --> 00:23:03,720 Speaker 1: It's larger than that. Yes, And there there's a video 399 00:23:03,800 --> 00:23:06,760 Speaker 1: and on the Internet of an LED lamp being both 400 00:23:06,920 --> 00:23:10,480 Speaker 1: suspended and powered by this thread, right, so so that 401 00:23:10,760 --> 00:23:16,280 Speaker 1: it's this tiny like human hair with cord that's holding 402 00:23:16,480 --> 00:23:20,000 Speaker 1: a lightbulb, and the light bulb is lit because power 403 00:23:20,480 --> 00:23:24,600 Speaker 1: is going going through and and it's it's completely suspended 404 00:23:24,680 --> 00:23:26,159 Speaker 1: that way. So you think about that and you're like, 405 00:23:26,880 --> 00:23:29,679 Speaker 1: all right, so we've got this very thin, very strong 406 00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:34,720 Speaker 1: stuff that can provide power across it. This could revolutionize electronics. 407 00:23:34,840 --> 00:23:37,280 Speaker 1: Oh absolutely. And there's also there's also been a bunch 408 00:23:37,280 --> 00:23:39,959 Speaker 1: of research into health applications for this. UM. It can 409 00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:42,360 Speaker 1: be used as a delivery system for drugs and vitamins 410 00:23:42,440 --> 00:23:45,040 Speaker 1: because carbon antitudes are are so bitty that they can 411 00:23:45,119 --> 00:23:46,879 Speaker 1: they can really get in there, you know, they you 412 00:23:46,920 --> 00:23:48,840 Speaker 1: can you can attach you can attach stuff to them 413 00:23:49,160 --> 00:23:51,720 Speaker 1: and send them in through things and and be really 414 00:23:51,760 --> 00:23:55,480 Speaker 1: effective as an antioxidant. UM they naturally pick up free 415 00:23:55,560 --> 00:23:58,680 Speaker 1: radicals in UH in blood systems. I used to do 416 00:23:58,800 --> 00:24:03,480 Speaker 1: that in college. Oh my, um you can. One of 417 00:24:03,560 --> 00:24:05,040 Speaker 1: one of the really cool bits of research that I 418 00:24:05,119 --> 00:24:10,000 Speaker 1: saw had people UM sticking an antibody onto the end 419 00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:13,480 Speaker 1: of a nanotube UM and then letting a blood sample 420 00:24:13,520 --> 00:24:16,920 Speaker 1: pass through it, and different kinds of tumor cells or 421 00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:20,399 Speaker 1: viruses will get trapped by that antibody and then UM, 422 00:24:20,520 --> 00:24:22,240 Speaker 1: so you can you can test for all kinds of 423 00:24:22,280 --> 00:24:25,359 Speaker 1: things without having to do any expensive lab work in 424 00:24:25,480 --> 00:24:29,080 Speaker 1: the field in a couple hours. Interesting. Of course, this 425 00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:34,160 Speaker 1: also leads to a dark discussion in that carbon nanotubes 426 00:24:34,320 --> 00:24:39,720 Speaker 1: may also be depending upon their their structure, may be 427 00:24:40,040 --> 00:24:43,720 Speaker 1: extremely hazardous to our health. And uh, there are a 428 00:24:43,720 --> 00:24:45,800 Speaker 1: couple of reasons for this. One is that when you're 429 00:24:45,800 --> 00:24:48,240 Speaker 1: talking about things that are on the nano scale, their 430 00:24:48,280 --> 00:24:51,880 Speaker 1: properties change fairly dramatically. You can have materials that act 431 00:24:51,960 --> 00:24:55,320 Speaker 1: as conductors in the macro scale, but on the nano 432 00:24:55,400 --> 00:24:58,880 Speaker 1: scale they might be insulators. You also may have things 433 00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:01,119 Speaker 1: that on the macro scale are perfectly safe, but on 434 00:25:01,160 --> 00:25:04,280 Speaker 1: the nanoscale are toxic. And one of the things that 435 00:25:04,400 --> 00:25:07,919 Speaker 1: concerned people fairly early on in the research of carbon nanotubes, 436 00:25:08,000 --> 00:25:12,800 Speaker 1: and has been studied extensively since then, is that carbon nanotubes, 437 00:25:12,840 --> 00:25:16,520 Speaker 1: depending again on the specific structure that you've designed for them, 438 00:25:17,680 --> 00:25:24,000 Speaker 1: bear a striking resemblance to this substance called asbestos. And 439 00:25:24,359 --> 00:25:26,240 Speaker 1: and for for for those young uns out there, this 440 00:25:26,359 --> 00:25:28,240 Speaker 1: was an asbestos is a substance that used to be 441 00:25:28,359 --> 00:25:31,440 Speaker 1: used in a lot of insulation. Um. Yes, it's fire retardant. 442 00:25:31,680 --> 00:25:34,880 Speaker 1: Fire retardant, which which is great. I mean that's less 443 00:25:34,960 --> 00:25:39,359 Speaker 1: fire good. Yes, yes, fire fire bad. As Frankenstein's Monster 444 00:25:39,640 --> 00:25:42,879 Speaker 1: taught us. However, Um, you know it was made up 445 00:25:42,920 --> 00:25:46,680 Speaker 1: of these of these small, pointy particles that people would 446 00:25:46,680 --> 00:25:49,520 Speaker 1: aspirate and it would get stuck in the linings of 447 00:25:49,880 --> 00:25:53,520 Speaker 1: your lungs and your other internal organs and cause cause 448 00:25:53,640 --> 00:25:59,240 Speaker 1: lesions and metalalithiomia. No, that was not the word mesol. Yes, yes, 449 00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:04,159 Speaker 1: the form of cancer that the lining around your organs, 450 00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:06,879 Speaker 1: that's specifically what what we're talking about here, but but 451 00:26:07,240 --> 00:26:10,760 Speaker 1: more specifically the lungs because you would breathe in these particles, 452 00:26:11,440 --> 00:26:14,560 Speaker 1: and they're small enough so that they can, uh, they 453 00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:19,080 Speaker 1: can infect a cell. Essentially, they can, uh, they can 454 00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:21,640 Speaker 1: penetrate a cell. That's the best word for it, penetrate 455 00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:25,040 Speaker 1: a cell. But they are large enough so that the 456 00:26:25,640 --> 00:26:28,880 Speaker 1: body's immune system cannot easily get rid of them, which 457 00:26:28,960 --> 00:26:33,359 Speaker 1: is why it becomes a very dangerous substance. And the 458 00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:39,280 Speaker 1: carbonanotubes bear some physical resemblance to those needle pointing fibers. Now, 459 00:26:40,000 --> 00:26:43,640 Speaker 1: according to at least some research, I was reading one 460 00:26:44,359 --> 00:26:47,719 Speaker 1: report that was kind of interesting, and I cannot pretend 461 00:26:47,800 --> 00:26:51,520 Speaker 1: that I follow it completely because my my medical knowledge 462 00:26:51,680 --> 00:26:54,920 Speaker 1: is uh, plucky and adventury. No wait, I'm sorry, that's 463 00:26:54,960 --> 00:26:58,320 Speaker 1: my military knowledge. Um by the very model of a 464 00:26:58,440 --> 00:27:03,119 Speaker 1: modern tech stuff. Podcaster they it was from an online library, 465 00:27:03,200 --> 00:27:06,680 Speaker 1: is actually from the Cancer and Aging Handbook. And the 466 00:27:07,240 --> 00:27:13,600 Speaker 1: study suggested that carbon nanotubes could penetrate cells, but they 467 00:27:13,680 --> 00:27:18,080 Speaker 1: did so in a different way than asbestos particles did, 468 00:27:18,200 --> 00:27:21,400 Speaker 1: Like they both could penetrate cells, and they both could 469 00:27:21,480 --> 00:27:24,720 Speaker 1: cause similar outcomes. So, in other words, there is some 470 00:27:24,920 --> 00:27:29,159 Speaker 1: evidence that carbon nanotubes could in fact be carcinogenic, but 471 00:27:29,320 --> 00:27:32,600 Speaker 1: they do it in a different mechanism, Like there's a 472 00:27:32,680 --> 00:27:36,359 Speaker 1: different mechanism for how they are they get enveloped by 473 00:27:36,400 --> 00:27:39,560 Speaker 1: other cells or by cells, I should say not other cells, 474 00:27:39,600 --> 00:27:43,560 Speaker 1: but by cells. And so the research actually suggests that 475 00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:46,639 Speaker 1: there might be ways of creating carbon anotubes where they 476 00:27:46,680 --> 00:27:51,080 Speaker 1: do not behave in this way where they are causing cancer. 477 00:27:51,280 --> 00:27:53,719 Speaker 1: They just kind of hang out, right, And that's one 478 00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:56,040 Speaker 1: of the other problems about carbonano tubes is they have 479 00:27:56,320 --> 00:28:00,320 Speaker 1: this bio persistence, meaning that if they are in a 480 00:28:00,359 --> 00:28:03,880 Speaker 1: biological entity, they do not tend to break down right there. 481 00:28:03,920 --> 00:28:07,160 Speaker 1: They're so strong and sturdy. Yeah, they don't react. They're 482 00:28:07,280 --> 00:28:09,960 Speaker 1: nonreactive when it comes to that too, So you don't 483 00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:13,000 Speaker 1: have it just you know, decompose into some other material 484 00:28:13,160 --> 00:28:16,840 Speaker 1: or get absorbed and then you know, they're harmless, that's 485 00:28:16,880 --> 00:28:20,159 Speaker 1: the problem. They don't do that. So, but there might 486 00:28:20,240 --> 00:28:23,840 Speaker 1: be ways of engineering carbon nanotubes so that they are 487 00:28:23,960 --> 00:28:29,000 Speaker 1: not hazardous, right. And also all research I've read has 488 00:28:29,040 --> 00:28:32,520 Speaker 1: suggested that it's not that we shouldn't go into making 489 00:28:32,560 --> 00:28:35,399 Speaker 1: carbon nanotubes. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's it's most people are 490 00:28:35,440 --> 00:28:37,560 Speaker 1: saying that, yes, it's a danger, but these things are 491 00:28:37,640 --> 00:28:40,680 Speaker 1: so useful that we we almost can't afford to to 492 00:28:40,880 --> 00:28:43,120 Speaker 1: not continue researching them. And that most most of the 493 00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:45,959 Speaker 1: most of the danger comes to people who are going 494 00:28:46,040 --> 00:28:50,479 Speaker 1: to be working in development development labs creating them. Um 495 00:28:50,600 --> 00:28:53,840 Speaker 1: And that there are definitely lots of different air filters 496 00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:56,720 Speaker 1: and other precautions that could be used to to lessen 497 00:28:56,800 --> 00:29:00,480 Speaker 1: the danger to these important workers. Um And And that 498 00:29:00,920 --> 00:29:04,560 Speaker 1: ultimately we may find ways of creating these as you know, 499 00:29:04,720 --> 00:29:08,560 Speaker 1: so safely that it becomes a non issue. Um. Not 500 00:29:08,800 --> 00:29:10,920 Speaker 1: that you know, we can ignore it. That's the important 501 00:29:10,960 --> 00:29:13,080 Speaker 1: part is don't ignore the fact that there's a danger, 502 00:29:13,360 --> 00:29:16,360 Speaker 1: but but understand that there may be ways of working 503 00:29:16,480 --> 00:29:19,480 Speaker 1: around that so that we minimize the danger to ourselves 504 00:29:19,520 --> 00:29:23,960 Speaker 1: while maximizing the benefit that these things could provide us. So, yeah, 505 00:29:24,360 --> 00:29:26,480 Speaker 1: I mean, it's it's you know, one of the things 506 00:29:26,520 --> 00:29:29,720 Speaker 1: that definitely we have to keep in mind about technology. 507 00:29:29,760 --> 00:29:32,640 Speaker 1: I mean, just like your computer at home, assuming you 508 00:29:32,760 --> 00:29:35,320 Speaker 1: have one, has some material in it that can be 509 00:29:35,720 --> 00:29:39,000 Speaker 1: extremely toxic if you are if you're exposed to it directly. 510 00:29:39,640 --> 00:29:43,400 Speaker 1: But computers are incredible benefit too. It's just that it's 511 00:29:43,480 --> 00:29:46,360 Speaker 1: under specific circumstances that you can become very dangerous. Like 512 00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:49,480 Speaker 1: let's say you catch it, it catches on fire, that 513 00:29:49,600 --> 00:29:51,680 Speaker 1: kind of thing, or you're taking it apart to try 514 00:29:51,760 --> 00:29:56,720 Speaker 1: and harvest the various uh metals and minerals that are 515 00:29:56,720 --> 00:30:00,320 Speaker 1: inside your computer. That would be a bad thing to do. 516 00:30:01,440 --> 00:30:04,520 Speaker 1: Don't do that. So yeah, I mean it's just one 517 00:30:04,560 --> 00:30:06,160 Speaker 1: of those things where you've got to keep in mind 518 00:30:06,520 --> 00:30:10,400 Speaker 1: the various scenarios and uh and and remember to to 519 00:30:10,480 --> 00:30:14,680 Speaker 1: treat it carefully. So guys, if you're out there playing 520 00:30:14,720 --> 00:30:19,800 Speaker 1: with carbonano tubes, just you know, be careful. Yeah, you know, 521 00:30:19,880 --> 00:30:21,680 Speaker 1: what you do in your spare time. Leave it to 522 00:30:21,720 --> 00:30:24,920 Speaker 1: the professionals. Probably, I think it's it's probably the important 523 00:30:24,960 --> 00:30:27,440 Speaker 1: important thing there. But I find this this whole area 524 00:30:27,440 --> 00:30:30,440 Speaker 1: of study very interesting. I mean, it does have the 525 00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:35,040 Speaker 1: the potential to completely revolutionize everything that has to do 526 00:30:35,080 --> 00:30:36,840 Speaker 1: with electronics. I mean you sit there and you think 527 00:30:36,840 --> 00:30:39,600 Speaker 1: about how incredible things are right now, go and go 528 00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:43,040 Speaker 1: to like see yes one year and take a look 529 00:30:43,080 --> 00:30:46,160 Speaker 1: at a TV, and you see how thin they've become. Well, 530 00:30:46,280 --> 00:30:50,240 Speaker 1: with this sort of technology, they could be even even, 531 00:30:50,600 --> 00:30:52,760 Speaker 1: you know, so thin that when you mounted against a wall, 532 00:30:52,880 --> 00:30:54,600 Speaker 1: you wouldn't be able to see the difference between the 533 00:30:54,640 --> 00:30:57,120 Speaker 1: wall and the TV. I mean, that's that's how thin 534 00:30:57,200 --> 00:31:01,120 Speaker 1: we're talking basically basically a sticker. Just yeah, think. I mean, 535 00:31:01,200 --> 00:31:03,400 Speaker 1: it's gonna take a while before we ever get there, 536 00:31:03,600 --> 00:31:05,200 Speaker 1: so we can at least get to a point where 537 00:31:05,200 --> 00:31:07,560 Speaker 1: it's gonna look like a piece of paper. And that 538 00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:10,240 Speaker 1: wraps up another classic episode of tech Stuff. Hope you 539 00:31:10,280 --> 00:31:14,800 Speaker 1: guys enjoyed it, and I look forward to revisiting carbon nanotubes. 540 00:31:14,800 --> 00:31:17,640 Speaker 1: I think it's about time I do an update on 541 00:31:17,800 --> 00:31:22,200 Speaker 1: that particular topic, because I guarantee a lot has happened 542 00:31:22,240 --> 00:31:26,480 Speaker 1: since two thousand. But if you guys have suggestions for 543 00:31:26,680 --> 00:31:31,040 Speaker 1: future topics of tech stuff beyond carbon nanotubes, let me know. 544 00:31:31,480 --> 00:31:34,040 Speaker 1: Send me an email the addresses tech stuff at how 545 00:31:34,160 --> 00:31:36,640 Speaker 1: stuff works dot com, or drop me a line on 546 00:31:36,680 --> 00:31:39,800 Speaker 1: Facebook or Twitter handle his text stuff h s W. 547 00:31:40,080 --> 00:31:42,600 Speaker 1: I look forward to hearing from you, and don't forget 548 00:31:42,640 --> 00:31:46,320 Speaker 1: to visit our website that's text stuff podcast dot com. 549 00:31:46,520 --> 00:31:51,280 Speaker 1: You'll find an archive of over every episode, all every episode, 550 00:31:51,360 --> 00:31:53,760 Speaker 1: as I was just about to try and say, of 551 00:31:53,920 --> 00:31:58,040 Speaker 1: tech stuff, including the ones where I make goofy mistakes 552 00:31:58,080 --> 00:32:00,840 Speaker 1: like that one, and you can search that archive, although 553 00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:04,480 Speaker 1: not by mistakes because you get way too many results 554 00:32:04,600 --> 00:32:06,600 Speaker 1: in that case. 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