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Speaker 1: Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera.

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Speaker 1: It's ready. Are you welcome to Stuff you Should Know

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Speaker 1: from House Stuff Works dot Com? Hey, and welcome to

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Speaker 1: the podcast. I'm Josh Clark with me as always is

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Speaker 1: Charles W. Chuck Bryant, and that makes this stuff you

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Speaker 1: should know right, Yes, yeah, the podcast. Have you noticed

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Speaker 1: this carbonated beverage that I'm drinking. It's just like carbonated water. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: the one that that rhymes with the boy. Um. I've

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Speaker 1: noticed that I've gotten probably burp year in podcasts since

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Speaker 1: I started drinking that. Yeah, that stuff is you know,

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Speaker 1: it's dizzy. I'm a fan. You can taste the CEO too,

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Speaker 1: Remember we talked about in the Taste episode. Oh, I

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Speaker 1: don't drink the plane one that much here at work

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Speaker 1: because when you drink, well, I drink the green tea

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Speaker 1: here at work iced, but I drink the lime flavored

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Speaker 1: at home. So you pay for that self? Yeah, wow,

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Speaker 1: Discovery Channel pays for it. What well, it's you know

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Speaker 1: who pays my bills? Oh? Gotcha? Yeah, but that's an

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Speaker 1: exchange for work. Yeah. They don't send me like a

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Speaker 1: stipend for the boy. They just send you the line

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Speaker 1: soda you are we done with that one? Yes, it

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Speaker 1: seems like we should be. Yes, Chuck Josh, I'm sure

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Speaker 1: you've heard the word karma bandied about a lot lately.

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Speaker 1: Oh man, Uh, you could probably find a pretty recent

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Speaker 1: spike in use on the internets in association with a

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Speaker 1: person's name. That would be Casey Anthony. Oh yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: Casey Anthony, the alleged killer of her daughter Kaylee, who

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Speaker 1: has let off, who is um found not guilty acquitted.

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Speaker 1: I guess you'd say, yeah, she's found guilty of something

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Speaker 1: else though today right, she was found guilty for counts

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Speaker 1: of lying to the police. Yeah. I didn't follow this

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Speaker 1: case set closely. Actually I didn't either, But I mean

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Speaker 1: like people were crazy over it. I saw, and uh,

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Speaker 1: I get the impression that most of people, well, don't

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Speaker 1: think that that justice was done necessarily. That's the impression

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Speaker 1: I get. So people have gone to their go to

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Speaker 1: recourse when you have no other recourse, and they are

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Speaker 1: giving it over to karma, the law of the universe. Yes,

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Speaker 1: karma will get you. That karma is gonna come around

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Speaker 1: and get Casey Anthony one day. Yeah, I say that

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Speaker 1: same thing. So it's a very new ag approach to karma,

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Speaker 1: like karma is gonna get you for wronging me, right,

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Speaker 1: or I did a good deed, so karma is gonna

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Speaker 1: smile on me, right, And that you can't really approach

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Speaker 1: karma from a true viewpoint as far as the viewpoint

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Speaker 1: of the people who created this concept are concerned without

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Speaker 1: the positive and the negative. And for the most part,

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Speaker 1: karma is actually very negative. It's something you want to

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Speaker 1: escape from. And if something bad happens to you, or

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Speaker 1: you are born disfigured or whatever, it's because you did

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Speaker 1: something in your past life. Westerners kind of find this distasteful, right,

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Speaker 1: so we've abandoned it largely and taken this new ag

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Speaker 1: approached karma. Let's talk about all forms of karma. It's

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Speaker 1: like mick karma in the Western world. It's exactly right.

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Speaker 1: That's a really great way to pick You should coin

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Speaker 1: that um chuck. Before we get started, I want to say,

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Speaker 1: if you had a problem with acupuncture, our acupuncture podcast,

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Speaker 1: our reincarnation podcast, our voodoo podcast, any podcast where we

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Speaker 1: showed um respect to other people's beliefs that are weird

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Speaker 1: or just you know, unlike yours, and you had a

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Speaker 1: real problem with it. Skip this one. We want you

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Speaker 1: to continue to like us. We respect your opinions, and

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Speaker 1: we don't want to bristle you. So just go ahead

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Speaker 1: and skip this one to go to the next one.

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Speaker 1: There's like three d and fifty other ones. Just listen

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Speaker 1: to us. Okay, listen to the Muppets one. That's a good,

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Speaker 1: good advice. No dissenters on that one. So let's give

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Speaker 1: everybody a second. Okay, But you know, we're works. We

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Speaker 1: explain how stuff works. That's what we do. Yeah, and

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Speaker 1: it's not up to us to assault um millennia of

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Speaker 1: beliefs that billions of people across the world hold. So

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Speaker 1: that's not what we're here for. We're here to explain it.

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Speaker 1: Like you said, So speaking from the eastern point of view,

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Speaker 1: we'll get to the western view and how we got

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Speaker 1: that later, how it got on. My name is Earl exactly. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's what the basis of the show is, right, So, um, yeah,

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Speaker 1: because he gets hit by a car. If you're winning

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Speaker 1: a lottery, uh no, he just won the lottery and

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Speaker 1: gets hit by a car and it gives him pause.

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Speaker 1: I don't remember the car part. I just knew he

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Speaker 1: won the lottery, but he was a bad guy and

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Speaker 1: getting hit by the car made him think, I don't

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Speaker 1: remember that, and I think there was like a song

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Speaker 1: or something like karma, Like karma was on his mind

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Speaker 1: and he gets hit by a car and like that

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Speaker 1: was the sign from the universe that must have been

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Speaker 1: in the pilot episode. I don't know if I saw that.

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Speaker 1: So Eastern Eastern philosophy, and we're talking four main um

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Speaker 1: organized religions that believe in karma. That would be jaane

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Speaker 1: is Um, Sikhism, Jainism, yeah, John, yeah, joinis Um, Uh Sikhism, Hinduism,

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Speaker 1: and Buddhism. Right. Yes, the word karma itself. We like

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Speaker 1: to point out the roots sometimes of these words. It

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Speaker 1: stands script uh karman k r m A N, which

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Speaker 1: means act. Just kind of makes a lot of sense, right.

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Speaker 1: There's also a polly word, and polly is the original

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Speaker 1: language used for Buddhist text. I believe um it's kama

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Speaker 1: k A M m A and it means action, so

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Speaker 1: virtually the same thing. Yeah, Well, it all makes sense

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Speaker 1: because karma is all about You're the acts that you commit,

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Speaker 1: good or bad, coming back to bite you or elevate you.

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Speaker 1: Mostly to bite you. So where should we Where should

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Speaker 1: we start out here with I guess Hinduism we should.

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Speaker 1: We should also say, like the concept of karma is

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Speaker 1: similar in a lot of ways, but among these four

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of really interesting differences. Yes, if you

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Speaker 1: do remember our Reincarnation podcast, you remember us talking about

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Speaker 1: sam Sara, and that is the eternal cycle of birth

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Speaker 1: and rebirth that Hindus believe that humans go through. And

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Speaker 1: you're tied to that cycle through karma. Yes, until you

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Speaker 1: shed all your karma, as far as Hindus believe, you

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Speaker 1: will never achieve moksha, which is basically salvation. You're freed

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Speaker 1: from the cycle of rebirth. You don't have to waste

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Speaker 1: any time on earth any longer. Right, But here's where

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Speaker 1: I get confused. For some reason, this one confused me,

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Speaker 1: maybe because they're also similar but slightly different. I thought,

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Speaker 1: in Hinduism, does the karma reset after each rebirth? No,

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Speaker 1: it clings, it clings to the soul. Okay, So with

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Speaker 1: with Hindus, the soul survives transmutation. Okay, With Buddhists, karma

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Speaker 1: is well, we'll talk about it later, but yes, with Hindus,

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Speaker 1: it's it. Your soul goes from body to body and

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Speaker 1: the karma's attached to it. Yeah, okay, So moksha that

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Speaker 1: you said is the goal of salvation and that's the

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Speaker 1: ultimate goal. And this is one of those things in

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Speaker 1: Eastern religion a lot of Westerners can't even comprehend. It

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Speaker 1: can only be achieved after it is no longer desired.

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Speaker 1: It doesn't like it blows my mind. I know, that's

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Speaker 1: like sound of one hand clapping. Well, and that's why

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Speaker 1: they think ponder that for their lifetime, because it's hard

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Speaker 1: to wrap your head around it, right, And I wonder

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Speaker 1: the like, the best way to not want that is

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Speaker 1: to really enjoy your life on earth. But then moksha

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Speaker 1: is a bad thing, so I don't think it necessarily

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Speaker 1: happens like that. I think you're just kind of like whatever.

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Speaker 1: So for Hindu's good karma is you generally get good

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Speaker 1: karma if you uh perform the duties of your social

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Speaker 1: uh status, your cast, and if you perform those well,

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Speaker 1: then in your next life you will be born into

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Speaker 1: the next highest or maybe you'll skip a couple. Right,

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Speaker 1: But you have to, like you said, fulfill your duties, right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you have to be a good priest or good laborer

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Speaker 1: um or a good leader or whatever. Um. And the

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Speaker 1: one of the I guess aspects of Hindu karma is

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Speaker 1: that it's a universal law that's independent of God or

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Speaker 1: any of their gods. They have a pantheon obviously, um.

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Speaker 1: But none of their gods can mess with karma. It's

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Speaker 1: it's its own thing. So a god can't be like, Oh,

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna smack you down with some karma because you

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Speaker 1: irked me so bad. They can't do it, right, And

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I didn't I didn't notice whether or

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Speaker 1: not the gods are subject to karma. But um, I

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Speaker 1: would assume probably because it's a it's a natural law,

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Speaker 1: but they're subject to it as well. Possibly humans definitely are,

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Speaker 1: and gods can't mess with it. Right, that makes sense. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you're explaining this to me Buddhism. Well, hold on, there's

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Speaker 1: three Let me just say, there's three types of karma

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Speaker 1: in Hindu The stuff you do here in this life

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Speaker 1: does not affect this life. It's goes in store for

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Speaker 1: the next life or another life down the down the way, right,

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Speaker 1: So you have three kinds of karma. You have parada,

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Speaker 1: which is karma that you've experienced during your present life.

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Speaker 1: But it's from a past life, yes, but you're it's

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Speaker 1: you're going through right now. You're you're born with a

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Speaker 1: club foot. You did something in another life. This is

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Speaker 1: the idea behind karma. Um. There's sancta, which is the

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Speaker 1: store of karma that you have coming in future lives.

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Speaker 1: But it's not come to fruition. As they say. You

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Speaker 1: got a safe deposit box chock full of whatever your

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Speaker 1: deeds are, right, but you hope that through good actions

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Speaker 1: in this life you can cut down on that store

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Speaker 1: necessarily um, and then the the present um karma that

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Speaker 1: you're sewing that's going to come to fruition will be

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Speaker 1: added to that store is called agaman. That's like the

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Speaker 1: stuff you're doing now, does that go into the storage

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Speaker 1: when you die? I don't know, Okay, I shouldn't have

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Speaker 1: that's that then it's all right, okay, But that's that's

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Speaker 1: Hindu karma alright. Buddhist karma believes They believe that the

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Speaker 1: soul accumulates karma and that it carries over to the

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Speaker 1: next life. Right, it makes this very cool, But there's

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Speaker 1: no soul in Buddhism. It's your karma. That that links

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Speaker 1: one life to the next, right right. They don't believe

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Speaker 1: in a soul like we think of a soul, no

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Speaker 1: here in the West. But the karma that you generate,

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Speaker 1: that you have when you die makes it to your

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Speaker 1: next life and becomes I think that just the coolest

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Speaker 1: three words ever. Nirvana. No, that's one word, the cool nirvana. No,

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Speaker 1: it's too okay. Germ of consciousness, yes, yes, I think

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Speaker 1: that's really awesome, Like that's informs what you do in

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Speaker 1: this life. Yeah, the vignana, I believe it's what they

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Speaker 1: call it. But it's not your soul transmigrating from one

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Speaker 1: life to the next, reincarnation, but it is a form

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Speaker 1: of reincarnation, yes, And the soul consists of the five

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Speaker 1: skandas uh sensation, body sensations, perceptions, impulses, and consciousness. But

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Speaker 1: that's not the same as the germ of consciousness right right, Okay, yeah,

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Speaker 1: all of them, all of the karma combined becomes the

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Speaker 1: germ of consciousness in the next life. Right in. Buddhists

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Speaker 1: like Hindus want to break the cycle of sam Sara

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Speaker 1: to ultimately reach Nirvana via the Middle Way or the

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Speaker 1: eight full Path, which we already talked about in reincarnation

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Speaker 1: as well. Right, See is this confusing to me? Like?

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Speaker 1: Am I weird? Because it's confusing? Not really? I mean

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Speaker 1: if you think about it, you can, really you can

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Speaker 1: break all of these beliefs down to this. You your

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Speaker 1: actions have consequences, Yeah, I get that part. And good

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Speaker 1: deeds will get you closer to not having these sticky

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Speaker 1: consequences from past lives any longer. At the very least,

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Speaker 1: you won't generate new stuff. And in most of these beliefs,

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Speaker 1: you can eventually shed all this or get rid of

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Speaker 1: it through either just time, good deeds, or the intervention

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Speaker 1: of God, depending on what your religion is. Right, Because

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Speaker 1: it's the same in Seekhis m they also want to

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Speaker 1: The whole goal is to exit the chain of reincarnation

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Speaker 1: once again. Right. Basically everybody thinks earth is just terrible, right,

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Speaker 1: so um, the the Buddhists, um, well, Buddha himself came

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Speaker 1: up with some pretty good thoughts on karma. He had

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Speaker 1: this famous quote saying we are the heirs of our

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Speaker 1: own actions, right. Um, But he was really big on

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Speaker 1: contradicting the idea that everything from our past lives informed

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Speaker 1: everything in our current lives and therefore we weren't. Um,

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Speaker 1: there's no such thing as free. Well, right, that's a

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Speaker 1: big sticky part of karma is that, depending on how

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Speaker 1: you look at it, where it's just completely fatalist right

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Speaker 1: to where there's nothing we could do any differently. This

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Speaker 1: is gonna happen to us anyway. So there's no reason

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Speaker 1: to stop being a pervert or a thief in this life.

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Speaker 1: And the way that that's um kind of uh, I

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Speaker 1: guess contradicted is um. That was one of his teachings

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Speaker 1: he said, He said pervert um, which stuck out to me.

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Speaker 1: I know the Buddhists, the Buddha knew what pervertstory um.

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Speaker 1: But uh, the way you get around that is to say, no,

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Speaker 1: stuff you're doing now you can control, and if it's bad,

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Speaker 1: it's gonna come back to bite you in your bottom

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Speaker 1: in the next life. And that was Buddha. Yeah, the

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Speaker 1: bite you in the bottom thing, that was I I

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Speaker 1: paraphrased him. Are we on daginism? Did I just kind

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Speaker 1: of briefly go overseeks? So should we cover that in

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Speaker 1: more detail? Um? Well, hold, let me tell you two

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Speaker 1: more things about Buddhis I found interesting. One is um

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Speaker 1: the paca is the result of karma, so karma's action,

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Speaker 1: but paca is the result. So it's like, um, the

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Speaker 1: karma is to vapaca's seed is to fruit. Is an

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Speaker 1: analogy I've seen nice, right, um, and then asana is

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Speaker 1: a type of karma, a good karma. You would hope

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Speaker 1: it'd be good. It's the karma, an act of karma

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Speaker 1: that you um commit on your deathbed. Right, so maybe

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Speaker 1: you will all of your money, your possessions to like

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Speaker 1: a local orphanage or something. They Buddhists give great import

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Speaker 1: to um asana because it's so close to the beginning

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Speaker 1: of the next life that it's just it's more potent,

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Speaker 1: I believe. And does that outweigh even the bad deeds

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Speaker 1: that you've done, Like no, can you store you know? No?

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Speaker 1: But it would be like if you're compared maybe a

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Speaker 1: bad thing you did in your six to a good

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Speaker 1: thing you did on your deathbed, if the the asana

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Speaker 1: is gonna just be, it would be bigger in scale.

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Speaker 1: I guess that's the impression I have. Again, I'm not

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Speaker 1: Buddhist or Hindu or giant or seek so this is

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Speaker 1: all just outside research. I'm I'm I'm a strong member

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Speaker 1: of the Church of Josh. Okay, yeah, I am too.

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Speaker 1: That's weird of Josh. Wow my first member. Oh you've

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Speaker 1: got more than one of my friend. Uh So I

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Speaker 1: mentioned Sikhis and briefly, do you have anything else on that? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: I thought the Siek's got kind of a short shift shrift, shrift,

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Speaker 1: shrift in this article a little bit. Um, there's you know,

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Speaker 1: plenty of stuff out there. Um, there's actually a very

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Speaker 1: venerable scholar, Dr Gobin seeing Mansukhanika. He's a he's a

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Speaker 1: learned Sikh scholar. So Dr Mansukhani took on the same

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Speaker 1: idea that the your acts in a previous life are

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Speaker 1: having an effect on your current life, and that fatalistic

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Speaker 1: view of like, well, there's interesting is free will? Then

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Speaker 1: he took that on and said, no, there is such

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Speaker 1: a thing as fate and it is very strong. So

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Speaker 1: fate will look at like a river, right, but man

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Speaker 1: can still make waves in this In this river, your

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Speaker 1: actions are like a wave or like a whirlpool. So

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Speaker 1: it's within this flowing river of fate, but you're still

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Speaker 1: having a consequence through your actions. Do good things. And

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Speaker 1: Eddie was one of the ones that used. Yeah, so

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Speaker 1: so do good things, do good acts, and you will

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Speaker 1: gain favor with God. Um. The that's not unique to

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Speaker 1: seek is um, I think Um. The Hindus believe that God. No,

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Speaker 1: the Hindus believe God can't have anything to do with it.

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Speaker 1: That the gods can't. The Sikhs say, no, God can

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Speaker 1: create or destroy karma. And so if you find favor

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Speaker 1: with God through good acts or through prayer or whatever,

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Speaker 1: um you will there will be an effect of a

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Speaker 1: loss of karmic debt. Boy, they did get the short drift.

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Speaker 1: They totally did, and there their Their view of karma

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Speaker 1: is that it's the accumulation of effects of past deeds

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Speaker 1: on your character, and the character is tied to the

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Speaker 1: soul and so therefore the character survives death. Wow, so

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Speaker 1: you're you're you wake up in the next life with

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Speaker 1: the same character character that was assembled by your previous life.

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Speaker 1: All right, I like that one. Plus, they had the

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Speaker 1: cool turbans uh jiinism is where we get a little

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Speaker 1: star wars e with the whole thing. This sort of

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Speaker 1: reminded me of the Midichlorians how they explained the force

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Speaker 1: in which one it was. It was one of the

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Speaker 1: newer ones. You know, they explained the forces middy clorians

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Speaker 1: in the cells, and everyone was kind of like really, yeah,

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Speaker 1: like you had to explain that. Yeah. Anyway, Giantism actually

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Speaker 1: believes that karma is a an actual atomic substance with

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Speaker 1: actual particles that attach itself to the jiva or your soul.

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Speaker 1: And as long as your soul is burdened by karma

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Speaker 1: once again, you were trapped in that cycle of birth,

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Speaker 1: death and rebirth. But they believe it's a physical thing. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: like a particular matter. It can't be sensed or measured

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Speaker 1: in your words, um, and I took that well, the

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Speaker 1: vibrations of your words, your thoughts, and your deeds, they

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Speaker 1: collect it, right, They attract karma, these particular matters UM.

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Speaker 1: And Jainists UM have classified like I think, something like

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Speaker 1: a hundred and fifty eight sub types. So there's eight

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Speaker 1: types of karma, two main types physical, physical, and psychic. Uh,

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Speaker 1: there's eight types and a hundred and fifty eight subtypes.

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Speaker 1: And they do it to like a remarkable degree. So

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Speaker 1: like if you, um look at the number four subtype

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Speaker 1: of the body shape, Nam, you're a hunchback if you

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Speaker 1: have that kind of karma. Yeah, so like they have

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Speaker 1: it down to like that granular level. But the one

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Speaker 1: that what it reminded me of is epigenetics. House what

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Speaker 1: what do you mean? Well, they're they're saying, like karma,

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Speaker 1: this particulate matter is attracted to the soul and it

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Speaker 1: affects its function, but it doesn't change the nature of

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Speaker 1: the soul in just the same way that like these

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Speaker 1: proteins are attached to your genes and they affect its expression,

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Speaker 1: but they don't change the gene. They just change its

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Speaker 1: function how it functions. That weird, And they've been talking

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Speaker 1: about this for a whole Well, and Ginuts believed that

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Speaker 1: the bad deeds are more likely to stick so in

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Speaker 1: their life like sort of like you know, Hindu and Buddhist,

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Speaker 1: they live very meagerly, don't like seek out the material things.

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Speaker 1: Um obviously live a sober life and don't harm other

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Speaker 1: living things. Yeah, I think they're the ones that have

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Speaker 1: There's a sect of Jains that have little brooms giants.

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Speaker 1: They have little brooms and they like dust off before

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Speaker 1: they sit down because they don't want to accidentally kill anything.

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Speaker 1: YEA interesting. Yeah, I've been letting moths out like crazy. Dude,

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Speaker 1: We're under attack. Really, yeah, you should, um turn out

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Speaker 1: your lights. Yeah. Uh so, now can we move on

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Speaker 1: to karma in the West, this interesting perversion, not a

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Speaker 1: perversion just here in the West. It's become a truth, yeah,

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Speaker 1: half truth of Mick Karma. It's become just a buzz word, um,

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Speaker 1: meaning you know how to how to increase your luck

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Speaker 1: basically by doing good things, right, like tipping. Yeah, like karma,

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Speaker 1: a karma jar is a tip jar. Yeah, yeah, that's

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Speaker 1: kind of awful little bit. Well, have you ever wished

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Speaker 1: bad karma on someone? For real? Like thought that or

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Speaker 1: said that, you mean, like schaden fraud? No, I actually

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Speaker 1: said like, man, you've got some bad karma coming. You're

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Speaker 1: wait for that? Oh yeah yeah yeah. I used to extensively,

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Speaker 1: Like really, that was my thing. It's just so easy.

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Speaker 1: You just relinquished power, like, oh well, I don't have

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Speaker 1: to do anything because carm is going to come back

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Speaker 1: or the universe is going to come back and get you. Well,

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Speaker 1: in a way, though, it's kind of good because it

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Speaker 1: means that you're not obsessed with revenge. So yeah, it

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Speaker 1: is very good in that sense. Yeah. I had a

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Speaker 1: lady in l A that sold us a treadmill. I

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Speaker 1: used treadmill that Her name was Joan, and that's all

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Speaker 1: I'll give you. But we remember the first and last name.

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Speaker 1: We still say it a yeah, was it Joan Crawford. Um,

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Speaker 1: but she sold us this. She wasn't famous. She sold

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Speaker 1: us a treadmill that um clearly did not work. When

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Speaker 1: we got at home, like you know, I ran out

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Speaker 1: under place. It was like, hey, this is cool. It

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Speaker 1: turns out after like six or eight minutes the thing

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Speaker 1: overheats and stop ops and it was just like that.

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Speaker 1: And we called her back and we're like, hey, you know,

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Speaker 1: we were just at your house for five minutes ago

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Speaker 1: and we bought this treadmill and it's not working. Overheats

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Speaker 1: and stops and you know, you knew this, and like

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Speaker 1: we'd like her two back or whatever. We'd like to

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Speaker 1: bring it back. And she said, I'm not a store,

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Speaker 1: That's what she said. And we were like really, like,

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Speaker 1: you know, you kind of known this thing didn't work,

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Speaker 1: like we just you know, you sell someone else or whatever.

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Speaker 1: Just we just want to make this right real quick.

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Speaker 1: We'll be back over there in thirty minutes. And she

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Speaker 1: was like no, She's like sorry, I'm not a store.

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Speaker 1: I don't accept returns, and I wanted to take the

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Speaker 1: treadmill and get some friends and go throw it to

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Speaker 1: you said this big bay window, throw it through her

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Speaker 1: window in the middle of the night. And Emily said,

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Speaker 1: I couldn't do that, And she just said, it's probably good.

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Speaker 1: Karma will get her one day. It's it's a good way.

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Speaker 1: It's a way to go. At the very least. You

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Speaker 1: can serve a lot of energy that you can use elsewhere.

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Speaker 1: I'm more productive things than the treadmill. Yeah. And plus

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Speaker 1: I'm mean, like accelerating or hastening karma by like burning

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Speaker 1: someone's house down, will get you in trouble. Some people

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Speaker 1: think that that generates bad karma for you weirdos. Uh So,

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Speaker 1: in the West, it's obviously become well, you called it

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Speaker 1: a new age. It is very new age. And what's

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Speaker 1: interesting is we can trace it back to pretty much

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Speaker 1: one person who introduced the idea, the concept of karma

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Speaker 1: to the West, Helena Blovotsky. Yeah, Madame Bolovotsky, Madame Bosky. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: She was. She was a she was a Russian. She

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Speaker 1: was very well traveled, she was very well read. She

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Speaker 1: was also um something of a huckster during the era

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Speaker 1: in the UM the Northeastern United States, where you could

400
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Speaker 1: basically say, hey, I'm a medium. Look at this um

401
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Speaker 1: cheesecloth that I'm pulling out of my throat. It's it's spirit.

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Speaker 1: Did she do that? She made a tea cup and

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Speaker 1: tea saucer up here early on and just performed a

404
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Speaker 1: few tricks, and they were like all sorts of um

405
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Speaker 1: spirits or depths that she worked with UM that we're

406
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Speaker 1: basically gave all these grand pronouncements and lessons that like

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Speaker 1: she issued to her cult of followers UM. But she

408
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Speaker 1: was very charismatic too. She was incredibly intelligent and very charming,

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Speaker 1: but she was also something of a fraud. But this

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Speaker 1: lady basically came up with this idea that she she

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Speaker 1: was coming down with this divine wisdom that was handed

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Speaker 1: down to her. Theosophy. Yeah, she founded the Theosophical Society,

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Speaker 1: and I thought it was interesting as she was a huckster.

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Speaker 1: She co founded it with Henry Steele Allcott, who was

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Speaker 1: an attorney and a journalist. So you're going to hook

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Speaker 1: up with something in a in a huckstery way, you're

417
00:24:41,600 --> 00:24:44,240
Speaker 1: really ce o a if you have an attorney on

418
00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:46,040
Speaker 1: one side, and then you can get depressed by the

419
00:24:46,119 --> 00:24:48,679
Speaker 1: fact that he's a journalist. So I don't know if

420
00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:52,879
Speaker 1: this woman was if she bought her own hype. She

421
00:24:53,160 --> 00:24:55,399
Speaker 1: from what I understand, I just read an entry on

422
00:24:55,480 --> 00:24:58,639
Speaker 1: her in the Skeptics Dictionary. Um. But the from what

423
00:24:58,680 --> 00:25:03,800
Speaker 1: I understand, she's she seemed fairly um committed. She was

424
00:25:03,840 --> 00:25:06,920
Speaker 1: finally run out of like the Um, the organization that

425
00:25:07,119 --> 00:25:12,119
Speaker 1: the theosofts. Yeah, like in five or six. Don't they

426
00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:16,480
Speaker 1: still exist today, Yeah, because they accused her of trickery

427
00:25:16,600 --> 00:25:20,480
Speaker 1: or something like that. But um, by the time this happened,

428
00:25:20,520 --> 00:25:22,840
Speaker 1: they were in India. So like, she seemed very committed

429
00:25:22,920 --> 00:25:25,879
Speaker 1: to the idea of you know, this Hindu teachings. But

430
00:25:26,000 --> 00:25:31,359
Speaker 1: basically her idea was too that all all of this

431
00:25:31,640 --> 00:25:38,000
Speaker 1: occult um scripture of like Zoroaster, and it's just just

432
00:25:38,280 --> 00:25:41,600
Speaker 1: in the n Gnostic texts, all that Um could all

433
00:25:41,600 --> 00:25:45,440
Speaker 1: be reconciled with like um the idea of Atlantis and

434
00:25:45,520 --> 00:25:49,400
Speaker 1: this where these supreme beings lived and there's astral projections

435
00:25:49,440 --> 00:25:51,840
Speaker 1: and all of this, all the stuff that we take

436
00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:55,720
Speaker 1: for granted today came from this lady in this era.

437
00:25:56,200 --> 00:25:58,040
Speaker 1: And one of the things that she introduced was the

438
00:25:58,080 --> 00:26:01,159
Speaker 1: concept of karma, right, and it was to prepare us

439
00:26:01,160 --> 00:26:03,399
Speaker 1: for what she called the Aquarian Age, which was the

440
00:26:03,720 --> 00:26:07,000
Speaker 1: ultimate enlightenment or time of brotherhood. I guess a k

441
00:26:07,160 --> 00:26:10,879
Speaker 1: a the nineteen fifties right, well was she was? It

442
00:26:10,960 --> 00:26:14,119
Speaker 1: sort of like akin to the Rapture? Is that now?

443
00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:18,359
Speaker 1: I think it was just a change in consciousness among

444
00:26:19,280 --> 00:26:23,240
Speaker 1: a humanity as a whole. It's like the sixties. You know,

445
00:26:23,320 --> 00:26:26,280
Speaker 1: it's the coming of the Age of Aquarius. Yeah, what

446
00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:31,359
Speaker 1: was that from hair? Yeah, so there you go. Age

447
00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:36,560
Speaker 1: of Aquarius meant everybody was on acid. That's right. John

448
00:26:36,640 --> 00:26:39,919
Speaker 1: Lennon Instant Karma is Gonna Get You number three hit.

449
00:26:39,960 --> 00:26:41,000
Speaker 1: I didn't know it was that big of a hit.

450
00:26:41,040 --> 00:26:42,960
Speaker 1: I've never heard it before. Oh, yes, you had. I

451
00:26:43,080 --> 00:26:46,040
Speaker 1: have not shot I'm not kidding. And we All shine on.

452
00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:48,240
Speaker 1: You've never heard that chorus? Oh, I didn't know that

453
00:26:48,280 --> 00:26:50,479
Speaker 1: it was the name of the song. Well, yeah, Instant

454
00:26:50,520 --> 00:26:52,159
Speaker 1: Karma's Gonna Get You, And then the chorus was and

455
00:26:52,280 --> 00:26:54,639
Speaker 1: we All shine On. I had no idea that was

456
00:26:54,720 --> 00:26:57,360
Speaker 1: the song. It's also a Nike commercial. Yeah, that's where

457
00:26:57,359 --> 00:27:00,679
Speaker 1: I've heard it. Yeah, of which my name is a Royal,

458
00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:04,679
Speaker 1: which we've already covered. Eventually it became fodder for television

459
00:27:05,240 --> 00:27:10,919
Speaker 1: mustachioed guys who was also a scientologist. Who Jason Lee

460
00:27:11,040 --> 00:27:15,080
Speaker 1: isn't ye? Man, have you seen that Memphis Beach Show. No,

461
00:27:15,920 --> 00:27:18,600
Speaker 1: he's on that. He stars in it, and apparently when

462
00:27:18,640 --> 00:27:21,640
Speaker 1: he has a rough day work in the homicide beat,

463
00:27:22,160 --> 00:27:24,320
Speaker 1: he goes out at night and like plays the blues.

464
00:27:26,440 --> 00:27:28,960
Speaker 1: I saw him in a Granddaddy show in l A, Yeah,

465
00:27:29,240 --> 00:27:32,080
Speaker 1: and thought, oh, man, I love Jason Lee. Did they

466
00:27:32,119 --> 00:27:36,440
Speaker 1: play that one song? Did they have a hit Granddaddy? Yeah? Yeah,

467
00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:38,680
Speaker 1: I was in twenty eight days later when they're in

468
00:27:38,720 --> 00:27:41,000
Speaker 1: the Girls. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, they played that song. Yeah,

469
00:27:41,040 --> 00:27:43,160
Speaker 1: it's a good one. I never heard any other Granddaddy songs,

470
00:27:43,160 --> 00:27:46,280
Speaker 1: but that's a good song. They can't top that one now,

471
00:27:46,359 --> 00:27:49,280
Speaker 1: actually I think they have. Well I'll have to go listen.

472
00:27:50,119 --> 00:27:52,639
Speaker 1: Um what else you got, Chuck? I got nothing, man,

473
00:27:52,720 --> 00:27:55,280
Speaker 1: This one just the followed me for some reason. I apologize,

474
00:27:55,760 --> 00:27:58,240
Speaker 1: you do great, thank you. So I guess the lesson

475
00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:02,600
Speaker 1: here is, um, anytime you about karma and you sure

476
00:28:03,040 --> 00:28:06,359
Speaker 1: tipping somebody an extra dollar is a good idea. But

477
00:28:06,600 --> 00:28:09,840
Speaker 1: don't forget the other aspect of karma where if there's

478
00:28:10,920 --> 00:28:13,280
Speaker 1: something bad has happened to you or somebody who's born

479
00:28:13,400 --> 00:28:17,879
Speaker 1: disfigured or just dismembered somewhere somewhere in life, or just

480
00:28:18,119 --> 00:28:21,720
Speaker 1: where it was killed or abused, people believe that that's

481
00:28:21,800 --> 00:28:24,320
Speaker 1: karma too. So do you believe in karma in the

482
00:28:24,640 --> 00:28:26,760
Speaker 1: very loosest sense of like if you do good things,

483
00:28:26,880 --> 00:28:30,800
Speaker 1: like good things will return your way. I don't even know.

484
00:28:31,040 --> 00:28:33,200
Speaker 1: To be honest, I think you should do good things

485
00:28:33,480 --> 00:28:35,159
Speaker 1: because that's the right thing to do. But you know

486
00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:37,720
Speaker 1: what I do, But I don't believe it's any kind

487
00:28:37,760 --> 00:28:41,840
Speaker 1: of natural law or cosmic force. I believe it's more

488
00:28:42,240 --> 00:28:49,560
Speaker 1: like doing good deeds brings out a level of consciousness

489
00:28:49,600 --> 00:28:52,520
Speaker 1: where you're attuned to goodness, so you notice that in

490
00:28:52,600 --> 00:28:55,240
Speaker 1: other people in life more so you open up that

491
00:28:55,360 --> 00:28:58,120
Speaker 1: door very much. So, yes, whereas like if you judge

492
00:28:58,160 --> 00:29:01,240
Speaker 1: other people, you are you become consumed with the idea

493
00:29:01,280 --> 00:29:04,080
Speaker 1: of being judged, and that like dwell down there where

494
00:29:04,120 --> 00:29:05,959
Speaker 1: did I agree with you there? That's what I think

495
00:29:06,040 --> 00:29:08,880
Speaker 1: it is. I think I agree with you completely Church

496
00:29:08,920 --> 00:29:11,920
Speaker 1: and Josh exactly. Well. If you want to read more

497
00:29:11,960 --> 00:29:14,920
Speaker 1: about how karma works, type in karma with a k

498
00:29:15,640 --> 00:29:18,920
Speaker 1: don't be dumb with a k uh in the handy

499
00:29:18,960 --> 00:29:21,960
Speaker 1: search bar at how stuff works dot com and that

500
00:29:22,040 --> 00:29:24,840
Speaker 1: will bring up that article written by Saradwiti of stuff

501
00:29:24,840 --> 00:29:28,040
Speaker 1: you missed in History Glass that is right, and Chuck,

502
00:29:28,120 --> 00:29:32,360
Speaker 1: I said, uh, search bar and they're somewhere. So Listener Mail,

503
00:29:34,760 --> 00:29:38,960
Speaker 1: Listener Mail. We asked for calls from people in the

504
00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:43,080
Speaker 1: First Murderer podcast who might be related to John Billington

505
00:29:43,720 --> 00:29:46,400
Speaker 1: and lo and behold we have one. Yeah. And also

506
00:29:46,560 --> 00:29:49,840
Speaker 1: can we mention what dorcas means? Yeah, what does it mean?

507
00:29:49,920 --> 00:29:53,400
Speaker 1: It means gazelle in great And we heard from quite

508
00:29:53,400 --> 00:29:55,960
Speaker 1: a few people who have family members named Dorcas. Yeah,

509
00:29:56,160 --> 00:30:02,000
Speaker 1: grandmothers usually Dorcas, Dorcas Minorcas. Yeah, all right. Uh, this

510
00:30:02,160 --> 00:30:06,400
Speaker 1: is from Wren in Elburne, Illinois. Hey, Josh and Chuck

511
00:30:06,440 --> 00:30:07,960
Speaker 1: and Jerry. You said you wanted to hear from people

512
00:30:08,000 --> 00:30:10,960
Speaker 1: who related to John Billington. Well, here I am my aunt.

513
00:30:11,040 --> 00:30:13,640
Speaker 1: Researched our family history a few years ago, put it

514
00:30:13,680 --> 00:30:15,280
Speaker 1: all together in a book and gave it to the

515
00:30:15,320 --> 00:30:19,240
Speaker 1: family members for Christmas. It's a great gift. When I

516
00:30:19,320 --> 00:30:22,120
Speaker 1: first got it, the billing Things Billington's story was for sure,

517
00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:25,320
Speaker 1: the most intriguing the girls from Stuff you missed in

518
00:30:25,400 --> 00:30:27,160
Speaker 1: History class at a podcast about it a couple of

519
00:30:27,200 --> 00:30:29,560
Speaker 1: years ago as well, and I love that edition and

520
00:30:29,600 --> 00:30:32,640
Speaker 1: played it for my dad, who thought it was cool. Um.

521
00:30:32,840 --> 00:30:34,640
Speaker 1: I have played it for almost everyone I know, saying

522
00:30:34,680 --> 00:30:36,800
Speaker 1: at the end of the episode, and that's my family

523
00:30:37,080 --> 00:30:39,400
Speaker 1: in a nutshell. I'm one of those people who was

524
00:30:39,440 --> 00:30:41,840
Speaker 1: super excited to say I'm related to the first murderer

525
00:30:42,280 --> 00:30:44,000
Speaker 1: in the New World, and also love to tell the

526
00:30:44,040 --> 00:30:47,480
Speaker 1: story about his son almost blowing up the Mayflower. I

527
00:30:47,560 --> 00:30:49,480
Speaker 1: told my sister when she was pregnant that if she

528
00:30:49,600 --> 00:30:54,160
Speaker 1: was having a girl, she shouldn't name the baby Dorcas Dorcas.

529
00:30:54,520 --> 00:30:56,600
Speaker 1: She didn't find it amusing and had a son anyway

530
00:30:56,920 --> 00:31:00,640
Speaker 1: and named Dorcas just dork. I think this mail merchant

531
00:31:01,440 --> 00:31:03,880
Speaker 1: d O r C. Anyway. I just want to express

532
00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:06,640
Speaker 1: my excitement for the episode. I really love all the episodes.

533
00:31:06,720 --> 00:31:09,840
Speaker 1: Keep it up. Ran from Elburn, Illinois. Nice well, thanks

534
00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:14,160
Speaker 1: a lot, RN Billington, I don't think that was Yeah,

535
00:31:14,400 --> 00:31:17,160
Speaker 1: if you've got a good deed that you did to

536
00:31:17,280 --> 00:31:21,360
Speaker 1: somebody that you would consider good karma, right, do you

537
00:31:21,440 --> 00:31:23,520
Speaker 1: think you deserve a little good karma for it. Let's

538
00:31:23,520 --> 00:31:26,400
Speaker 1: have a karma off, or how about this and have

539
00:31:26,600 --> 00:31:29,800
Speaker 1: evidence of that return, like you did a good deed

540
00:31:29,840 --> 00:31:31,680
Speaker 1: and you won the lottery, like the good one. That's

541
00:31:31,720 --> 00:31:34,680
Speaker 1: a good one. Um, well, we're holding a little mini contests.

542
00:31:34,920 --> 00:31:36,959
Speaker 1: Whoever has the best one in our opinion will make

543
00:31:36,960 --> 00:31:38,760
Speaker 1: it to listener mail. That's right. But it's not a

544
00:31:38,800 --> 00:31:41,880
Speaker 1: real contest. It's unsanctioned. That's right. I didn't even use

545
00:31:41,960 --> 00:31:44,680
Speaker 1: the word contest just now, did I know? There's no prize,

546
00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:47,600
Speaker 1: no nothing. It's a karma off. Anyway. If you want

547
00:31:47,640 --> 00:31:50,080
Speaker 1: to let us know about that, you can tweet it

548
00:31:50,160 --> 00:31:52,840
Speaker 1: to us at s y s K podcast. You can

549
00:31:52,920 --> 00:31:55,800
Speaker 1: also go on to our Facebook, Facebook dot com slash

550
00:31:55,840 --> 00:31:58,120
Speaker 1: stuff you Should Know, or you can send it old

551
00:31:58,160 --> 00:32:02,600
Speaker 1: fashioned email at stuff Podcast at how Stuff works dot com.

552
00:32:07,800 --> 00:32:10,400
Speaker 1: Be sure to check out our new video podcast, Stuff

553
00:32:10,440 --> 00:32:13,000
Speaker 1: from the Future. Join how Stuff Work staff as we

554
00:32:13,120 --> 00:32:19,600
Speaker 1: explore them as promising and perplexing possibilities of tomorrow. Brought

555
00:32:19,600 --> 00:32:22,800
Speaker 1: to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera. It's ready,

556
00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:23,280
Speaker 1: are you