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Speaker 1: This is Mesters in Business with Very Renaults on Bluebird Radio.

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Speaker 1: This week on the podcast, I have another extra special guest.

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Speaker 1: Her name is Lisa Jones. She's CEO of Amunday US

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Speaker 1: that's the American division of French asset management giant Amundi.

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Speaker 1: They could be the largest asset manager that most people

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Speaker 1: are unfamiliar with. They run over two trillion dollars about

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Speaker 1: one point seven three trillion euros. That's a lot of money.

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Speaker 1: They're they're the second largest asset manager in Europe after Alians.

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Speaker 1: They're one of the top ten asset managers. They're they're

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Speaker 1: just immense. Uh. Lisa Jones division is over a hundred

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Speaker 1: billion dollars and she really has a unique perspective on

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Speaker 1: the asset management business. She has worked at a number

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Speaker 1: of places um usually uh switching jobs because her from

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Speaker 1: was required or she was offered a bigger job at

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Speaker 1: a at another shop. So she's been at places like

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Speaker 1: Eaton Vans and Pioneer Funds and and Morgan Stanley and MFS.

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Speaker 1: So she knows all there is to know about all

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Speaker 1: three parts of the industry, the what some people call

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Speaker 1: client facing, back office and and middle part of the office,

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Speaker 1: which is the actual asset management. She's uniquely qualified to

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Speaker 1: discuss what's going on in the industry, where it's been

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Speaker 1: and where it's likely to to end up. I found

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Speaker 1: the conversation to be absolutely fascinating, and I think you

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Speaker 1: will also so, with no further ado, my conversation with

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Speaker 1: a Mundy US is CEO Lisa Jones. This is Mesters

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Speaker 1: in Business with very Renaults on Bluebird Radio. My extra

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Speaker 1: special guest this week is Lisa Jones. She is the

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Speaker 1: CEO of A Monday US, the hundred billion dollar our

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Speaker 1: u S arm of Europe's second largest asset manager, A Monday.

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Speaker 1: A Monday proper manages over to trillion dollars in assets.

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Speaker 1: They're one of the ten largest asset managers in the world,

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Speaker 1: with over a hundred million clients in thirty six countries,

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Speaker 1: about forty hundred employees. Lisa Jones, Welcome to Bloomberg. Thanks Berry,

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Speaker 1: Thanks for having me here today. My pleasure. I've been

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Speaker 1: looking forward to chatting with you for a while. I

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Speaker 1: think of A Monday as as really one of the

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Speaker 1: largest asset managers that a lot of people, especially in

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Speaker 1: the US, haven't heard of. But before we get to

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Speaker 1: a Monday. Let's talk a little bit about your early

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Speaker 1: career experience. You come out of Trinity College with the

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Speaker 1: bachelor's in economics and you started MFS Investment Management. Tell

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Speaker 1: us a little bit about your early experiences in the industry.

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Speaker 1: So you know, I've been working for thirty years, so

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Speaker 1: when you say tell me about your early experiences, sure

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Speaker 1: we don't go on for so long. But actually, prior

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Speaker 1: to m f S, I started working at ef Hutton.

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Speaker 1: For those of your listeners who remember EF Hutton, Trinity

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Speaker 1: is in Hartford, and at that point in time, you

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Speaker 1: went to New York or you went to Boston, and

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Speaker 1: I was from Boston, so I wanted to take a

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Speaker 1: shot at working in New York City, and I started

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Speaker 1: working for E. F. Hutton and worked there for a

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Speaker 1: few years, really worked there through the Crisis of nineteen

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Speaker 1: eight you know, the stock market crash um in the

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Speaker 1: late nineteen eighties, and started in customer service of EF

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Speaker 1: Hutton for those brokerage accounts where shareholders wanted to call

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Speaker 1: and ask questions and get some answers. It was a

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Speaker 1: great introduction into being in a client facing role. And

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Speaker 1: so from there I went to work at MFS in Boston.

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Speaker 1: I joined MFS in I joined MFS as a whole

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Speaker 1: salor covering the bank channel. The territory was the northeast

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Speaker 1: and back then in the bank channel, the northeast was

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Speaker 1: really mained down to Virginia. And it was in the

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Speaker 1: early days there beyond bank trust departments, banks were beginning

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Speaker 1: to have licensed investment professionals sit in their lobbies to

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Speaker 1: offer alternatives to banking customers. And that was my first

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Speaker 1: experience working at MFS as a wholesaler. I then, as

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Speaker 1: the time went on, began to become in house more

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Speaker 1: in a management role and assume responsibility for running the

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Speaker 1: bank channel at MFS. And keep in mind, as we

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Speaker 1: think about the world of investing today and talking about

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Speaker 1: low interest rates, this is a period of time when

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Speaker 1: CDs were double digit, UH treasuries were double digit and

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Speaker 1: so it was quite a different vin erment for selling

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Speaker 1: investment products in yields of that at that point in time.

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Speaker 1: So is that MFEST for a total of sixteen or

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Speaker 1: so years years I'll suspend some time on the institutional

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Speaker 1: side running the global institutional business for at that time.

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Speaker 1: So so let's talk a little bit about that global

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Speaker 1: institutional business. Eventually you end up as global head of

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Speaker 1: distribution at Morgan Stanley's what enabled you to climb to

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Speaker 1: the top of that ladder? And how different is institutional

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Speaker 1: and distribution from what people typically think of as individual investments.

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Speaker 1: So today I would say that those lines between the

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Speaker 1: two groups are blurring. But let's go back to the

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Speaker 1: point in time of when I transition from what we

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Speaker 1: would call the kind of retailer the distribution side, to

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Speaker 1: the institutional side, being responsible for running the bank channel.

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Speaker 1: At that time, I was engaged with the bank trust

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Speaker 1: departments and they would be hiring external managers to offer

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Speaker 1: investment solutions to trust clients. And I began working very

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Speaker 1: closely with the portfolio managers and becoming more um understanding

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Speaker 1: and involved and frankly really intrigued with portfolio construction and

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Speaker 1: portfolio management. And so as the business at MFS grew,

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Speaker 1: the opportunity for me to transition to the institutional side

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Speaker 1: was presented to me. So I enjoyed how the pms

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Speaker 1: put portfolios together, how they thought about risks, how they

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Speaker 1: thought about buying cell discipline and the institutional side got

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Speaker 1: me much closer to overall portfolio construction and portfolio management,

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Speaker 1: and as ussset management firm began to want to go

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Speaker 1: global and enter international market. UM, my role was expanded

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Speaker 1: into global head of Institutional where MFS was in multiple

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Speaker 1: different markets kind of offering our investment solutions and strategies

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Speaker 1: to sovereign well fund central banks, UH and pension fund investors.

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Speaker 1: And so that was UH the opportunity to go from

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Speaker 1: retail to distribution when you bring those two together. UM.

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Speaker 1: I then from MFS, I actually went to eat Vance

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Speaker 1: to run the eat Vance Global institutional business, and I

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Speaker 1: got a call out of the blue from the former

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Speaker 1: CEO of MFS when I was there, Jeff Shames. Many

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Speaker 1: of your long time listeners may remember Jeff, and he

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Speaker 1: had taken a role at MFM at Morgan Stanley Investment

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Speaker 1: Management as an advisor, and at that time, Morgan Stanley

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Speaker 1: Investment Management was looking for a new role, global Head

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Speaker 1: of Distribution, which encompassed both institutional and retail distribution on

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Speaker 1: a global scale. So my experience at both MFFT any

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Speaker 1: evance on the retail on the institutional side gave me

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Speaker 1: the global awareness the retail in the institutional background serving

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Speaker 1: multiple different types of clients and it fully wrapped up

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Speaker 1: into that role at EMSUM on being global head of distribution.

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Speaker 1: So how do you make the leap from Morgan Stanley

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Speaker 1: where you're really on on what I think a lot

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Speaker 1: of people would perceive as an institutional sales side to

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Speaker 1: a Monday in where really you're running the whole shooting

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Speaker 1: match for at least for the US arm which is

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Speaker 1: you know, a hundred billion dollars is still real money.

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Speaker 1: Great question. So, as I've worked at different organizations, I

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Speaker 1: became familiar with and really became a student of culture.

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Speaker 1: And when you have the magic of a positive culture

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Speaker 1: and you can bring people together, you can create an

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Speaker 1: environment where people have fun. You you treat your clients

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Speaker 1: and your employees exceptionally well. And culture is a key

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Speaker 1: aspect of long term success. And having observed multiple cultures

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Speaker 1: across the many firms, I knew that I wanted to

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Speaker 1: be a champion of a culture. And it is easier

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Speaker 1: when you have influence over the entire organization rather than

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Speaker 1: when you have only influence over the distribution side, institutional

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Speaker 1: or retail. And in two thousand and fourteen, prior to

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Speaker 1: being known as a Monday, the firm was Pioneer Investments,

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Speaker 1: and Pioneer Investment has been just I mean, you know

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Speaker 1: Pioneer right. We've been in the market since nine, launched

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Speaker 1: one of America's first mutual funds, and having worked in

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Speaker 1: and around the Boston community in the asset management space

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Speaker 1: for a long time, always had tremendous respect for Pioneer Investments.

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Speaker 1: Knew some of the employees that were working at Pioneer Investment,

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Speaker 1: some of them have worked for me at other organizations,

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Speaker 1: and Pioneer was looking for a us CEO and wanted

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Speaker 1: the profile of the us CEO to be someone that

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Speaker 1: comes from a client facing background, and so the opportunity

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Speaker 1: for me was one. It was a profile that I had,

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Speaker 1: but number two because I knew that I had great

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Speaker 1: experience and bressed across multiple firms, working across an organization,

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Speaker 1: and the value I believe that I brought to the

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Speaker 1: firm you know at the time and hopefully fill today

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Speaker 1: as you talked to my employees, is an appreciation for

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Speaker 1: culture and appreciation of working together and in particular for

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Speaker 1: my investment team, having worked at such broad based asset

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Speaker 1: management firms in the way of investment offerings and product

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Speaker 1: in essence, I have been out of teams that have launched, sold, retained, defended,

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Speaker 1: closed all types of investment strategies across multiple market cycles,

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Speaker 1: to multiple geographies and multiple channels. So while I've never

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Speaker 1: had the opportunity to actually run money, all that's important

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Speaker 1: around it that is really important to portfolio managers, you know,

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Speaker 1: being investment lad consistency and repeatability of an investment process,

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Speaker 1: taking long term view. That was complementary to the investment

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Speaker 1: team here, and fortunately I was given the opportunity to

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Speaker 1: take the role in two thousand and fourteen, UH the

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Speaker 1: organization at that time, very interestingly, was up for sale.

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Speaker 1: It was owned by UniCredit Bank UH, a large Italian

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Speaker 1: based bank, who had acquired Pioneer in the year two thousand.

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Speaker 1: So the employees at Pioneer Investors had exposure and had

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Speaker 1: been familiar with going through an integration and being purchased

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Speaker 1: by a European based financial institution, and in two thousand

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Speaker 1: and seventeen the transaction closed with the money acquiring Pioneer

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Speaker 1: Investments got it. So, so I want to stay with culture,

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Speaker 1: which you've you've referenced a couple of times and asked

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Speaker 1: what was it like trying to maintain that sense of

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Speaker 1: corporate culture and objectives and the whole team all pulling

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Speaker 1: in the same direction. During the lockdown, during the pandemic,

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Speaker 1: when everybody had to work from home and there was

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Speaker 1: a lot of uncertainty as to what was going to

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Speaker 1: happen next, and people were genuinely nervous. Tell us what

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Speaker 1: you did to maintain that corporate culture. It's been one

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Speaker 1: of the greatest challenges in learnings, I think for anyone

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Speaker 1: who's in a position of leadership that we've experienced over

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Speaker 1: the West eighteen or twenty months. And if you recall

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Speaker 1: in March of when we all went home to work remotely,

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Speaker 1: we had put out messages that we expect to be

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Speaker 1: back in the office in thirty days. So when we

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Speaker 1: went remote, I didn't give it any thought other than

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Speaker 1: let's stay in contact with everyone, let's continue to have

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Speaker 1: our meetings. And it's thirty one to sixty to eighteen

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Speaker 1: months later. Immediately you had to kind of shift stage right.

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Speaker 1: And what I ended up really bringing into the organ

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Speaker 1: bringing into this kind of leadership during a COVID environment

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Speaker 1: is my communication skills, and so I adapted my ability

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Speaker 1: to walk the halls and be with people to putting

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Speaker 1: together a series of programs on how do I remain

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Speaker 1: connected and how do we be transparent and how do

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Speaker 1: we communicate? So in the first several weeks, I sent

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Speaker 1: out a daily email message to the organization and it

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Speaker 1: was as soon as go out for a walk and

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Speaker 1: get some fresh air, or here is a final that

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Speaker 1: we participated in virtually, or here's what's going on in

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Speaker 1: the investment department. Are here's the news from our I

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Speaker 1: T department as we've all gone remotely and people were

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Speaker 1: positively responding to those daily email messages. And as the

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Speaker 1: days and weeks went on, the daily notes became too

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Speaker 1: tactical and we needed to shift a bit more strategically.

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Speaker 1: So I implemented both a weekly All America's conference call

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Speaker 1: with everyone dialing in and it was thirty minutes because

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Speaker 1: we were we were all starting to experience kind of

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Speaker 1: uh burnout fatigue with the multiple zoom calls fatigue right,

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Speaker 1: And I also launched weekly coffees with Lisa. It was

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Speaker 1: every Thursday from ten to ten forty five and I

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Speaker 1: limited the group to eight or ten people sign up.

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Speaker 1: My s watch your cat, you know one across your

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Speaker 1: your keyboard, Let's listen to the kids screaming in the background,

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Speaker 1: Let's talk about what it's like to work remotely, and

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Speaker 1: so culture for me during that pandemic was best supported

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Speaker 1: by being present in the new ways that we had

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Speaker 1: to be present, and we continued that really through still

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Speaker 1: to this day. While many of us are back in

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Speaker 1: the office still on a voluntary basis. My weekly calls

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Speaker 1: are now every two weeks. In fact, later on today

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Speaker 1: we're doing a virtual town hall. It's all employees, but

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Speaker 1: we've had to adapt our communication skills that we've developed

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Speaker 1: as leaders into new ways. I think it was the

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Speaker 1: Washington Post that had a column to this week that

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Speaker 1: workers are are putting on clothes and going back to

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Speaker 1: the office only to spend all day on zoom calls.

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Speaker 1: How do you avoid those circumstances, says or are you

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Speaker 1: guys going to continue UM to be a little bit

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Speaker 1: hybrid where people come into the office partly and work

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Speaker 1: from home partly. So we have rolled out a we're

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Speaker 1: all coming back into the office on October. Our offices

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Speaker 1: have been opened since June on a voluntary basis, and

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Speaker 1: we're seeing more and more people come into our offices.

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Speaker 1: UM in particular Boston in Durham, North Carolina. And what

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Speaker 1: we really talked about to your point is it doesn't

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Speaker 1: make sense if we're all commuting an hour to come

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Speaker 1: into the office to be on a zoom call. Because

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Speaker 1: what we know is productivity is super good working in

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Speaker 1: remote locations. So what we've tried to challenge ourselves with

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Speaker 1: is that the home office remains as a place of productivity,

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Speaker 1: then the physical office at sixty State Street remains the

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Speaker 1: place for collaboration. So as we go to a hybrid model,

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Speaker 1: and we're asking people to come back three days a week,

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Speaker 1: any three days that you want, but we're asking the

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Speaker 1: department heads to make sure that you're scheduling and hosting

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Speaker 1: your team meetings all on one day where you're asking

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Speaker 1: all employees to come back into the office of your

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Speaker 1: team so you can have that team meeting and you

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Speaker 1: can have that collaboration. Because the zoom calls work when

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Speaker 1: everyone is remote, it gets more challenging when some are

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Speaker 1: remote and some are sitting around a table. You you

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Speaker 1: end up getting a very different meeting dynamic that is

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Speaker 1: not all that productive. So we've thought about that and

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Speaker 1: that's the way that we're going to try to ensure

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Speaker 1: that you're not sitting all by yourself on zoom calls,

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Speaker 1: because frankly, you can do that from home. Quite quite interesting.

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Speaker 1: Tell us a little bit about your role. What do

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Speaker 1: you do as CEO of a Monda US so a

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Speaker 1: CEO of Amunda US variant all so, I bring in

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Speaker 1: Canada and Latin America as heads of those regions as well.

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Speaker 1: So we have offices that I'm responsible for from Montreal, Toronto, Boston, Durham,

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Speaker 1: North Carolina, Miami, Mexico City, in Santiago, Chile, so all

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Speaker 1: up and down the America's perimeter. From a US perspective,

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Speaker 1: we are a full organization of all the infrastructure you

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Speaker 1: would expect for a large asset management firm, portfolio management, trading,

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Speaker 1: legal compliance, i T, marketing, distribution, et cetera. So my

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Speaker 1: responsibility is across all of those aspects of front, middle

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Speaker 1: and back office as we distribute our investment solutions here

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Speaker 1: throughout the America's but we also, if you will, export

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Speaker 1: our investment capabilities outside of the America's And as a

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Speaker 1: member of the Global Executive Committee of a Monday, I

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Speaker 1: work very closely with the other countries and regions whose

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Speaker 1: clients are interested in US dollar denominated product. So so

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Speaker 1: let's talk a little bit about UM, the global giant

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Speaker 1: that is a mundy with over two trillion dollars an asset.

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Speaker 1: You know when I when I look at the company

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Speaker 1: and I research what they do, there really isn't an

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Speaker 1: area of the investment world that a mundy doesn't touch upon.

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Speaker 1: So let me ask you some some broad questions about that,

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Speaker 1: starting with what are you hearing from investors today, be

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Speaker 1: they US or international? What what sort of questions are

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Speaker 1: investors asking. I'm going to answer that in two ways. One, Strategically,

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Speaker 1: clients today are interested in working with firms where they

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Speaker 1: can develop a partnership with kind of a go to

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Speaker 1: asset management firm. If you have a challenge with pension

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Speaker 1: funding or you're distributing through finance and advisors, and you

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Speaker 1: want to work with a handful of companies that can

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Speaker 1: help you solve a problem. So one, clients want to

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Speaker 1: position with farms in a partnership way. Second, clients are

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Speaker 1: truly interested in problem solving. We're in a persistently low

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Speaker 1: right environment, So how do I seek yields on a

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Speaker 1: global basis, on a local basis how do I say

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Speaker 1: for retirement, how do I say for all of those

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Speaker 1: longer term aspects. Clients are also wanting transparency from their

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Speaker 1: asset management partners, like we're all very good as human

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Speaker 1: beings of sharing very good news, but when we have

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Speaker 1: bad news to share. I think that that's what this

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Speaker 1: thing was is some firms from others, and we try

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Speaker 1: to be extremely transparent and timely with all the information

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Speaker 1: that we're sharing with clients. And more specifically, over the

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Speaker 1: last few years, with the growth of e s G,

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Speaker 1: whether it's internationally or here in the United States, are

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Speaker 1: Elian's retail and institutional are asking many questions about e

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Speaker 1: s G and net zero and climate change, and we're

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Speaker 1: hoping to position ourselves as a trusted advisor with those clients.

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Speaker 1: So let's talk a little bit about e s G

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Speaker 1: because there's some really interesting things. First. I've been hearing

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Speaker 1: for decades, literally decades, that this is the next big

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Speaker 1: thing in asset management, And while it certainly has captured

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Speaker 1: a lot of mind share, I don't get the sense

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Speaker 1: that it's captured all that much in terms of capital flows.

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Speaker 1: And you see surveys of the next generation who's gonna

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Speaker 1: inherit wealth, either women as as the inheritors um from

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Speaker 1: the spouse or their kids. Everybody says they like the

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Speaker 1: idea of E s G investing, and everybody says they

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Speaker 1: want to put their money to work that way, but

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Speaker 1: it hasn't really shown up dramatically anyway in the capital flows.

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Speaker 1: What are your thoughts on that? So I share similar

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Speaker 1: perspectives um with you one having been in this business

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Speaker 1: for a long period of time five years ago when

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Speaker 1: E f G kind of really I would say in

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Speaker 1: a more pronounced way, became topical. I immediately thought back

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Speaker 1: to my earlier days on the institutional side, when socially

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Speaker 1: responsible investing on behalf of certain endowments or charitable organizations

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Speaker 1: or prevalent and many not all, many had disappointing experiences

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Speaker 1: from an investment returned perspective, and they did so because

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Speaker 1: some were completely eliminating. All sectors are all you know,

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Speaker 1: certain financial institutions, and so that lack of exposure or

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Speaker 1: that exclusionary approach created certain disappointing returns. So I immediately

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Speaker 1: thought of that that environment that I grew up in,

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Speaker 1: the big question started to say, can I have good

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Speaker 1: investment performance while also pursuing a path on E S

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Speaker 1: G investing, and many of those conversations, while they still exist,

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Speaker 1: I do believe that what we have seen over the

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Speaker 1: last few years, in particular from a US and I

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Speaker 1: can comment from outside of the United States, that investing

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Speaker 1: for the long term and investing your money so over

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Speaker 1: the long term you you grow your wealth for retirement

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Speaker 1: or saving for college. For many that is a primary

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Speaker 1: concern and that will always drive from capital flows. Increasingly,

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Speaker 1: what we're finding in from a fundamental investment perspective that

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Speaker 1: as you consider investing in a particular company, whether it's

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Speaker 1: on the equity of the death side, as you consider

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Speaker 1: all risks that can be involved, cash flow risk, change

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Speaker 1: of company management, investment in um you know, are in

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Speaker 1: d for certain sectors. Many of the risks that we

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Speaker 1: have always considered and increasingly are considering are some of

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Speaker 1: those E S and G risks and environmental disaster or

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Speaker 1: governance issue. So integrating those considerations into an investment process

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Speaker 1: is very good risk management. Now you come to the

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Speaker 1: point about kind of millennials, kind of our kids generations,

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Speaker 1: and we do find and the science and the statistics

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Speaker 1: support that that certain generations are very interested in doing

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Speaker 1: well for the planet, investing with the purpose, investing with intentionality,

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Speaker 1: and what we're experiencing and in fact in a Monday

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Speaker 1: you know we're considering this ourselves, is in launching particular

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Speaker 1: investment solutions that are impact oriented, so upfront, if someone

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Speaker 1: is interested in net zero or de harbonizing a footprint

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Speaker 1: or investing for clean water, that those investment objectives are

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Speaker 1: clear and stated right up front, so that there's no confusion.

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Speaker 1: We're all um eagerly anticipating and I would say welcoming

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Speaker 1: further regulation and clarity for both companies and asset management

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Speaker 1: firms around these definitions of terms, because there's still some

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Speaker 1: great confusion that um that does exist. And we know

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Speaker 1: that the change of administration with the Biden administration much

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Speaker 1: you know that administration is much more friendly towards E

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Speaker 1: s G investing or climate change and some regulation that's

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Speaker 1: coming out from a European perspective. And this is where

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Speaker 1: being based in Paris, France is of great interest to

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Speaker 1: our clients in the United States, whose Europe has been

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Speaker 1: forward thinking, forward looking, and well ahead of other regions

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Speaker 1: when it comes to E s G investing and when

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Speaker 1: our institutional clients are retail clients in the US are

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Speaker 1: are interested in a conversation or a different perspective. Being

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Speaker 1: based in Paris, you you get the Paris Accordy of

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Speaker 1: climate change. Of all of that, it's a it's a

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Speaker 1: unique glenn So you're right, there's so much talk about it.

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Speaker 1: There are some pretty considerable flows on a global basis.

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Speaker 1: So of our one point seven trillion euros that you mentioned,

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Speaker 1: eight hundred billion euros is in kind of E s

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Speaker 1: G type allocations. Almost half it's considerable. It is. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'm not I'm not surprised by that because a it

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Speaker 1: seems like Europe is far more um ahead of the

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Speaker 1: curve in terms of legislation. But that almost doesn't matter,

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Speaker 1: because if the generational surveys are accurate and the millennials

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Speaker 1: and their ilk are really going to put their money

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Speaker 1: where their mouths are, um, this is gonna happen organically anyway.

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Speaker 1: There will be beyond just just using E s G

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Speaker 1: as a risk factor. It appears that there's going to

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Speaker 1: be a lot of money moving in that direction. It

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Speaker 1: may take a couple of decades, but that's what we're

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Speaker 1: likely to see. UM as money moves from the boomers

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Speaker 1: to the gen X, gen y and and millennials. I

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Speaker 1: agree with you. So, so let's stick with the concept

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Speaker 1: of of the international perspective. UM. You mentioned UH your

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Speaker 1: headquartered UH the parent companies headquartered in Paris. Generally speaking,

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Speaker 1: overseas markets, be they developed or emerging, tend to be

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Speaker 1: either cheaper or much cheaper UH than the U S lately.

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Speaker 1: What are your thoughts about valuations globally so on a

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Speaker 1: global perspective, you know, let's kind of stay at a

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Speaker 1: at a top line level for a moment. You know

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Speaker 1: that the pandemic and the environment that we've been in

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Speaker 1: over the last eighteen to twenty months or so has

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Speaker 1: uh been a positive for active management. So in the

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Speaker 1: United States, States were all about active management. That's what

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Speaker 1: we do. And prior to the pandemic, you saw um,

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Speaker 1: you know, five or six companies in particular from the

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Speaker 1: US perspective that was really driving the returns of the

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Speaker 1: S and P five hundred and making it so difficult

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Speaker 1: for active managers to really compete and outperform. And what

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Speaker 1: the pandemic has introduced over the last many months or

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Speaker 1: so is more breath across where we're seeing companies kind

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Speaker 1: of contribute to the overall growth and the earning. So

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Speaker 1: whether it's the stay at home boom and the things

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Speaker 1: that we were buying when we weren't going into stores.

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Speaker 1: Uh um. You know, the breath of the marketplace expanded,

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Speaker 1: and so unlike prior to the pandemic when you had

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Speaker 1: five stocks I think returning fifty five, fifty six and

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Speaker 1: two thousand and nineteen, you have a broader suite. So

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Speaker 1: active management and selecting those companies that are attractive in

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Speaker 1: this broader breath is appropriate both on a European basis

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Speaker 1: as well as from a US perspective. What we've also

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Speaker 1: seen the first half of the year to kind of

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Speaker 1: the second half of the year is that there was

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Speaker 1: great enthusiasm about the economy's reopening in the United States

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Speaker 1: and in Europe. The emerging markets a little bit further

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Speaker 1: behind because the pace by which vaccinations were occurring was

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Speaker 1: less behind than in the developed markets as we know,

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Speaker 1: and then all of a sudden, the delta variant kind

435
00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:55,760
Speaker 1: of started to pop up, and the exuberance and May

436
00:29:55,800 --> 00:30:01,040
Speaker 1: and Junes started to fall a little bit away. Um.

437
00:30:01,080 --> 00:30:04,080
Speaker 1: In the months of kind of July and August and

438
00:30:04,200 --> 00:30:07,080
Speaker 1: September as we've been experienced over the last several months

439
00:30:07,160 --> 00:30:10,840
Speaker 1: or so. So what we do expect on a global

440
00:30:10,880 --> 00:30:13,040
Speaker 1: basis is what we are seeing is a bit of

441
00:30:13,040 --> 00:30:17,400
Speaker 1: a reflation in the United States as a result of

442
00:30:17,920 --> 00:30:22,959
Speaker 1: more vaccinations, UM kind of a wider market contribution, and

443
00:30:23,000 --> 00:30:26,160
Speaker 1: we have the whole growth to value rotation which we

444
00:30:26,240 --> 00:30:29,960
Speaker 1: started to see earlier in the year slowed down a

445
00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:32,280
Speaker 1: little bit, but our view is that we are going

446
00:30:32,280 --> 00:30:34,880
Speaker 1: to see a bit more of that growth to value

447
00:30:34,960 --> 00:30:40,840
Speaker 1: rotation and that happened to support more positive views from

448
00:30:40,880 --> 00:30:45,040
Speaker 1: a European perspective, given the underlying economy and some of

449
00:30:45,240 --> 00:30:50,160
Speaker 1: the company so growth to value rotation UM the positivity rates.

450
00:30:50,280 --> 00:30:54,800
Speaker 1: I was in Paris most recently and I was super

451
00:30:54,840 --> 00:31:00,360
Speaker 1: impressed with how the pandemic, the vaccinations, the mass getting,

452
00:31:00,840 --> 00:31:05,000
Speaker 1: the walking about was really administered um there. And I

453
00:31:05,040 --> 00:31:09,400
Speaker 1: think that the economies are really quickly rebounding as well.

454
00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:13,800
Speaker 1: So in this environment and we are positive on equities,

455
00:31:14,080 --> 00:31:18,960
Speaker 1: we have to be careful evaluations, active management and selecting

456
00:31:19,160 --> 00:31:23,360
Speaker 1: those companies that are at an appropriate valuation that can

457
00:31:23,560 --> 00:31:27,800
Speaker 1: benefit from this psycho of where we are in. We're

458
00:31:27,840 --> 00:31:31,200
Speaker 1: still quite positive on over the long term, and it's

459
00:31:31,240 --> 00:31:34,719
Speaker 1: worth mentioning. In the beginning of the vaccine rollout, the

460
00:31:34,840 --> 00:31:40,000
Speaker 1: US was one of the fastest countries um UH top

461
00:31:40,120 --> 00:31:44,320
Speaker 1: three in terms of getting vaccinations out there, but over

462
00:31:44,360 --> 00:31:47,120
Speaker 1: the past six months, the US has fallen behind. I

463
00:31:47,120 --> 00:31:50,640
Speaker 1: think we're something like thirty seven now UM with a

464
00:31:50,680 --> 00:31:56,200
Speaker 1: total vaccination rate of fifty and an eligible vaccination rate

465
00:31:56,240 --> 00:32:00,320
Speaker 1: of about sixty. Europe far ahead of so a lot

466
00:32:00,320 --> 00:32:06,120
Speaker 1: of countries at how is that playing out in terms

467
00:32:06,120 --> 00:32:10,360
Speaker 1: of their economy? Is their reopening going appreciably better than

468
00:32:11,000 --> 00:32:13,440
Speaker 1: some of the faltering we're seeing here in the US

469
00:32:13,520 --> 00:32:18,040
Speaker 1: where we're along the Gulf coast in South Dakota and Idaho,

470
00:32:18,160 --> 00:32:22,480
Speaker 1: the hospitals are overwhelmed again. So we probably will all

471
00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:26,960
Speaker 1: agree that going back to full lockdowns is not something

472
00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:31,360
Speaker 1: that we went anticipation, and so learning to live with

473
00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:37,560
Speaker 1: the variant and getting vaccination rates up is really critically important.

474
00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:41,800
Speaker 1: And again, what I could experience when I was traveling

475
00:32:41,880 --> 00:32:44,800
Speaker 1: a week or so ago, you know, the lines for

476
00:32:44,880 --> 00:32:49,120
Speaker 1: the museums and the lovely little outdoor coffee shops and

477
00:32:49,160 --> 00:32:53,600
Speaker 1: just kind of walking about. Everyone is walking about, but

478
00:32:53,720 --> 00:32:57,880
Speaker 1: there continue to be pretty you know, pretty clear guidelines.

479
00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:00,920
Speaker 1: You've got to show your vaccination path to get into

480
00:33:01,360 --> 00:33:04,880
Speaker 1: museums or buildings and department stores. You know, you you

481
00:33:04,920 --> 00:33:08,640
Speaker 1: can go certain places and do certain things, and people

482
00:33:08,680 --> 00:33:13,080
Speaker 1: are all kind of masking up. So I do find

483
00:33:13,360 --> 00:33:16,200
Speaker 1: that they are much more serious. Again, I was only

484
00:33:16,240 --> 00:33:19,560
Speaker 1: in Paris that they are much more serious. And as

485
00:33:19,640 --> 00:33:22,640
Speaker 1: we know, in certain states in the United States. I'm

486
00:33:22,640 --> 00:33:24,560
Speaker 1: sitting here in Boston. You know, we're one of the

487
00:33:24,600 --> 00:33:28,200
Speaker 1: top three Massachusetts one of the top three or five

488
00:33:28,240 --> 00:33:32,200
Speaker 1: states in the country in the way of vaccination rate,

489
00:33:32,840 --> 00:33:37,160
Speaker 1: and just this morning, most recently, you know, the overall

490
00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:40,520
Speaker 1: kind of infection rate has fallen again below two percent.

491
00:33:40,680 --> 00:33:45,040
Speaker 1: So we're on the right trajectory. It's in some of

492
00:33:45,080 --> 00:33:48,600
Speaker 1: these states, as you suggest, where the hospitalizations and the

493
00:33:48,800 --> 00:33:53,360
Speaker 1: access to good health care is becoming problematic again. And

494
00:33:53,440 --> 00:33:58,840
Speaker 1: those states that are more aggressive and getting their population vaccinated,

495
00:33:59,360 --> 00:34:04,080
Speaker 1: are their economies kind of work and try to get

496
00:34:04,120 --> 00:34:07,440
Speaker 1: back to a bit of a normal lifestyle. Yeah, we're

497
00:34:07,480 --> 00:34:10,480
Speaker 1: recording this on a Tuesday. I have a dinner in

498
00:34:10,520 --> 00:34:14,080
Speaker 1: the city tonight with about a dozen people. And the

499
00:34:14,120 --> 00:34:18,319
Speaker 1: only reason I'm comfortable going to that dinner or for

500
00:34:18,480 --> 00:34:22,040
Speaker 1: a giant two thousand person conference I went to two

501
00:34:22,080 --> 00:34:25,120
Speaker 1: weeks ago. Is that New York City and New York

502
00:34:25,120 --> 00:34:29,399
Speaker 1: State both require proof of vaccination, uh for entry. Now,

503
00:34:29,440 --> 00:34:33,239
Speaker 1: that's not a guarantee, but at least I feel like

504
00:34:33,360 --> 00:34:39,239
Speaker 1: I'm not exposing myself to people who may be behaving recklessly.

505
00:34:39,480 --> 00:34:43,040
Speaker 1: If at this stage of the you know where here

506
00:34:43,080 --> 00:34:46,160
Speaker 1: we are, it's practically the fourth quarter of one. If

507
00:34:46,160 --> 00:34:48,960
Speaker 1: you're not vaccinated by now, I have to assume that

508
00:34:49,040 --> 00:34:53,360
Speaker 1: the rest of your daily behavior is not exactly risk averse,

509
00:34:53,400 --> 00:34:55,880
Speaker 1: and I don't want to be exposed to you. Forget

510
00:34:56,040 --> 00:35:00,760
Speaker 1: the politics. I'm concerned about the economic impact of those

511
00:35:00,800 --> 00:35:04,799
Speaker 1: folks and what it means for local businesses. Yeah, you know,

512
00:35:04,880 --> 00:35:08,880
Speaker 1: the science is pretty clear, and I understand their skepticism

513
00:35:08,960 --> 00:35:13,799
Speaker 1: for some around vaccinations, but my gosh, you know, where

514
00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:16,680
Speaker 1: an investment managers. So we have health care analysts coming

515
00:35:16,680 --> 00:35:20,000
Speaker 1: in here all the time, we have physicians given us updates.

516
00:35:20,040 --> 00:35:23,680
Speaker 1: The science is pretty clear on the safety and the

517
00:35:23,719 --> 00:35:28,520
Speaker 1: eck of efficacy of the vaccine. So what gives people comfort?

518
00:35:28,520 --> 00:35:30,399
Speaker 1: And I think New York is doing a brilliant job

519
00:35:30,400 --> 00:35:34,680
Speaker 1: of my doatalism Brooklyn, so I experienced the same you know,

520
00:35:34,680 --> 00:35:36,880
Speaker 1: knowing that when you're going into a place and you're

521
00:35:36,920 --> 00:35:40,360
Speaker 1: surrounded by people that are vaccinated. While nothing is a

522
00:35:41,640 --> 00:35:45,160
Speaker 1: it just allows you to feel more safe. Right are

523
00:35:45,160 --> 00:35:48,839
Speaker 1: You're putting the odds in your UM side. So so

524
00:35:48,920 --> 00:35:53,239
Speaker 1: let's let's move beyond UM the local economy and vaccination.

525
00:35:53,320 --> 00:35:55,640
Speaker 1: And I want to stick with the international theme and

526
00:35:55,680 --> 00:36:00,080
Speaker 1: ask you a couple of questions. UM about China and

527
00:36:00,280 --> 00:36:02,600
Speaker 1: is one of the biggest emerging markets there are. They're

528
00:36:02,640 --> 00:36:06,799
Speaker 1: the second largest economy in the world. A lot of

529
00:36:07,000 --> 00:36:12,239
Speaker 1: investors have been perplexed by their actions towards some of

530
00:36:12,280 --> 00:36:16,760
Speaker 1: their largest companies and best known tech companies. What should

531
00:36:16,800 --> 00:36:22,000
Speaker 1: investors make about this new crackdown coming from the world's

532
00:36:22,000 --> 00:36:26,239
Speaker 1: second largest economy. So I'm gonna have multiple personality when

533
00:36:26,280 --> 00:36:29,840
Speaker 1: I answer this question. It's there is no simple answers,

534
00:36:29,840 --> 00:36:33,960
Speaker 1: so feel free to You know, our listeners appreciate nuance,

535
00:36:34,040 --> 00:36:39,520
Speaker 1: so feel free to to be internally contradictory. So, on

536
00:36:39,560 --> 00:36:44,120
Speaker 1: the one hand, we know that geopolitical risk is something

537
00:36:44,160 --> 00:36:47,160
Speaker 1: that we have lived with and we will continue to

538
00:36:47,200 --> 00:36:51,960
Speaker 1: live with, and that the strain between US and China

539
00:36:52,239 --> 00:36:57,799
Speaker 1: relations is evident, and the crackdowns and the controls are

540
00:36:58,120 --> 00:37:03,160
Speaker 1: present UH with with our with A Monday being based

541
00:37:03,280 --> 00:37:09,000
Speaker 1: in Paris, being European and not necessarily having the same

542
00:37:09,280 --> 00:37:13,399
Speaker 1: temperature between you know, a US and a China relations.

543
00:37:13,440 --> 00:37:17,080
Speaker 1: Investing in China and growing our business in China is

544
00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:21,360
Speaker 1: of strategic importance for the organization and A Monday was

545
00:37:21,400 --> 00:37:25,040
Speaker 1: selected as I believe one of the first, maybe the

546
00:37:25,200 --> 00:37:30,520
Speaker 1: first foreign asset management firms to enter into UH you know,

547
00:37:30,560 --> 00:37:34,080
Speaker 1: a joint venture with the Bank of China and to

548
00:37:34,200 --> 00:37:37,040
Speaker 1: help kind of grow that business in that presence of

549
00:37:37,120 --> 00:37:42,600
Speaker 1: professional money management for Chinese investors. So it is something

550
00:37:42,640 --> 00:37:45,000
Speaker 1: that we have to watch, you know, from a portfolio

551
00:37:45,160 --> 00:37:50,920
Speaker 1: construction perspective UM and portfolio management perspective, the US and

552
00:37:51,000 --> 00:37:55,040
Speaker 1: most of our assets under management are US source or

553
00:37:55,200 --> 00:37:58,960
Speaker 1: US equities, US fixed income. However, we do manage global

554
00:37:59,000 --> 00:38:03,080
Speaker 1: equity portfolio as we manage global high nel portfolios that

555
00:38:03,320 --> 00:38:06,880
Speaker 1: can invest in some of these markets. We tend to

556
00:38:06,960 --> 00:38:11,440
Speaker 1: be more large cap, not as speculative UM, and we

557
00:38:11,600 --> 00:38:15,040
Speaker 1: always remain cautious when we don't have a clear understanding

558
00:38:15,120 --> 00:38:20,160
Speaker 1: of earnings or accounting principles and practices. So it's it's

559
00:38:20,200 --> 00:38:23,400
Speaker 1: one of those risks that will be with us for

560
00:38:23,560 --> 00:38:27,200
Speaker 1: a long period of time for some institutional investors, because

561
00:38:27,200 --> 00:38:31,560
Speaker 1: we have these conversations all the time. UM. Allocating to

562
00:38:32,320 --> 00:38:36,360
Speaker 1: the we to China in particular is both of tactical

563
00:38:36,520 --> 00:38:40,280
Speaker 1: as well as strategic long term importance, and we're happy

564
00:38:40,320 --> 00:38:43,040
Speaker 1: to have those conversations. What what sort of questions are

565
00:38:43,040 --> 00:38:51,160
Speaker 1: you getting from clients about cryptocurrencies? Does your institutional demands, um,

566
00:38:51,719 --> 00:38:55,400
Speaker 1: are you seeing that from clients for for cryptos? I

567
00:38:55,840 --> 00:38:59,320
Speaker 1: keep hearing from a lot of people who are crypto curious.

568
00:38:59,520 --> 00:39:01,440
Speaker 1: It's probed be the best phrase I've heard for that,

569
00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:08,759
Speaker 1: crypto crazy. Maybe. Yeah. I mean it's easy for us

570
00:39:08,800 --> 00:39:12,000
Speaker 1: because we don't offer it, we don't get involved with it.

571
00:39:12,480 --> 00:39:16,040
Speaker 1: We're not um in in the business of working with

572
00:39:16,080 --> 00:39:21,120
Speaker 1: our clients on cryptocurrency. You know, the view is today

573
00:39:21,239 --> 00:39:29,120
Speaker 1: that it's much too speculative for the conservative profile and um,

574
00:39:29,160 --> 00:39:33,440
Speaker 1: you know and platform that we put forth to institutional

575
00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:36,880
Speaker 1: clients into some of our retail clients. It's it's a

576
00:39:36,880 --> 00:39:42,160
Speaker 1: bit at a crossroad of uh, you know, interesting technology innovation.

577
00:39:43,040 --> 00:39:47,120
Speaker 1: Uh is it really money? Does it really have you

578
00:39:47,160 --> 00:39:53,839
Speaker 1: know the same value as currencies that we know of today. Uh.

579
00:39:53,880 --> 00:39:57,560
Speaker 1: So our view is clients, obviously you're talking about it,

580
00:39:57,560 --> 00:40:01,640
Speaker 1: but it's not something that we are offering today with

581
00:40:01,719 --> 00:40:05,880
Speaker 1: our clients, so I that doesn't surprise me. We we

582
00:40:06,200 --> 00:40:10,520
Speaker 1: whenever we get the question, the challenge is always how

583
00:40:10,520 --> 00:40:13,080
Speaker 1: do we custody this? How can we make sure that

584
00:40:13,480 --> 00:40:16,440
Speaker 1: you're not part of the Depending on which study you

585
00:40:16,480 --> 00:40:21,279
Speaker 1: see more of those people who have either lost the

586
00:40:21,320 --> 00:40:25,160
Speaker 1: password or have the hard um hardware damage so they

587
00:40:25,160 --> 00:40:30,360
Speaker 1: no longer can access that. That's nothing that we don't have.

588
00:40:30,680 --> 00:40:34,440
Speaker 1: Nobody has a solution for that yet, although I'd imagine

589
00:40:34,640 --> 00:40:40,040
Speaker 1: one would be coming eventually, most probably, and you know,

590
00:40:40,120 --> 00:40:42,960
Speaker 1: we'd rather not be a market leader in that. And

591
00:40:43,480 --> 00:40:48,399
Speaker 1: I think also as people talk about cryptocurrency, some automatically

592
00:40:48,440 --> 00:40:51,080
Speaker 1: believe it's just bitcoin or just this. I mean there's

593
00:40:51,200 --> 00:40:55,880
Speaker 1: there's multiple types of cryptocurrency, so it's not as straightforward

594
00:40:56,840 --> 00:41:00,680
Speaker 1: as well. So more to come for sure. Huh, really

595
00:41:00,800 --> 00:41:03,400
Speaker 1: really interesting. Let's talk a little bit about what it

596
00:41:03,440 --> 00:41:07,480
Speaker 1: takes to build a diverse team. You talk about the

597
00:41:07,520 --> 00:41:11,520
Speaker 1: importance of relationships and how trust is a two way

598
00:41:11,600 --> 00:41:15,400
Speaker 1: street and loyalty is important. How is that a business imperative?

599
00:41:15,440 --> 00:41:20,760
Speaker 1: How do those factors translate into a business environment. Well,

600
00:41:20,800 --> 00:41:23,919
Speaker 1: simply if we were to take it Barry from Let's

601
00:41:23,920 --> 00:41:27,080
Speaker 1: talk about portfolio management for a second. For anyone who

602
00:41:27,120 --> 00:41:30,560
Speaker 1: has sat down with a portfolio manager or with your

603
00:41:30,600 --> 00:41:35,279
Speaker 1: financial advisor looking to invest in a US equity portfolio,

604
00:41:35,800 --> 00:41:39,719
Speaker 1: what you constantly here is the benefits of diversification, That

605
00:41:39,880 --> 00:41:44,440
Speaker 1: diversification spreads out your risk. So not that I'm the

606
00:41:44,520 --> 00:41:47,760
Speaker 1: first to say this, but why doesn't that then matter

607
00:41:48,520 --> 00:41:52,759
Speaker 1: when it comes to the people who hire and the

608
00:41:52,840 --> 00:41:58,120
Speaker 1: diversification that you have on your teams and diversification today.

609
00:41:58,160 --> 00:42:01,120
Speaker 1: And I love where this whole discuss and around diversity,

610
00:42:01,200 --> 00:42:04,960
Speaker 1: equity inclusion has kind of gone over the last several years.

611
00:42:05,560 --> 00:42:11,480
Speaker 1: Diversification doesn't mean today solely whether I'm a man or

612
00:42:11,520 --> 00:42:14,480
Speaker 1: a woman, or I'm white or a non white. You know,

613
00:42:14,520 --> 00:42:18,600
Speaker 1: it's really diversification of thought, because we can get into

614
00:42:18,640 --> 00:42:23,280
Speaker 1: trouble when you have group think and you're not challenging

615
00:42:23,320 --> 00:42:28,160
Speaker 1: status quo. So I do believe that building a diversified

616
00:42:28,239 --> 00:42:33,920
Speaker 1: team is a great way to harness intellectual curitiosity, to

617
00:42:34,120 --> 00:42:37,600
Speaker 1: challenge status quo, and frankly just to look through look

618
00:42:37,600 --> 00:42:40,520
Speaker 1: at the world through the lens of our shareholders and

619
00:42:40,560 --> 00:42:46,040
Speaker 1: our institutional clients who aren't super diverse, and you mentioned

620
00:42:46,040 --> 00:42:49,439
Speaker 1: earlier some of the data and science around this. It's

621
00:42:49,480 --> 00:42:54,360
Speaker 1: been pretty clear from everybody who studied the space that

622
00:42:54,520 --> 00:42:58,040
Speaker 1: the more diverse points of view you take into any

623
00:42:58,080 --> 00:43:03,960
Speaker 1: sort of UH situation, the better the decision making tends

624
00:43:04,000 --> 00:43:07,600
Speaker 1: to be. I would agree with that. Now, obviously you're

625
00:43:07,600 --> 00:43:11,120
Speaker 1: preaching to the choir because I've grown up. I've grown

626
00:43:11,200 --> 00:43:15,040
Speaker 1: up in this industry for thirty years as a woman.

627
00:43:15,680 --> 00:43:19,359
Speaker 1: You know, I have the great honor of leading this organization,

628
00:43:20,160 --> 00:43:23,200
Speaker 1: but I've had many experiences, like others on the car,

629
00:43:23,320 --> 00:43:25,879
Speaker 1: where you walk into the room and you're the only

630
00:43:25,960 --> 00:43:28,440
Speaker 1: one of your kind. However you want to define that,

631
00:43:29,239 --> 00:43:34,080
Speaker 1: and how sometimes that can um silence you or it

632
00:43:34,360 --> 00:43:36,480
Speaker 1: never silenced to me, by the way, but it could

633
00:43:36,880 --> 00:43:39,880
Speaker 1: make it more difficult for some people to contribute and

634
00:43:40,000 --> 00:43:44,600
Speaker 1: to participate in a conversation. And that's where running an

635
00:43:44,719 --> 00:43:49,919
Speaker 1: organization and being more focused on inclusion, inclusion of thought,

636
00:43:50,160 --> 00:43:55,040
Speaker 1: inclusion of all perspectives. In building a respectful work environment,

637
00:43:55,520 --> 00:43:59,520
Speaker 1: you end up camping into all of your employees rather

638
00:43:59,560 --> 00:44:02,960
Speaker 1: than just a handful of the go to employees that

639
00:44:03,040 --> 00:44:05,960
Speaker 1: may stand out for one reason or another. I think

640
00:44:05,960 --> 00:44:08,680
Speaker 1: there's a lot of momentum in the market. I tend

641
00:44:08,719 --> 00:44:11,600
Speaker 1: to see the world with the glass half of I'm

642
00:44:11,640 --> 00:44:15,000
Speaker 1: an ultimate optimist, but I like what I'm seeing where

643
00:44:15,040 --> 00:44:17,000
Speaker 1: the energy is. We have a lot of work to do,

644
00:44:17,520 --> 00:44:21,080
Speaker 1: but there's definitely energy and commitment around it. Right. So

645
00:44:21,120 --> 00:44:25,160
Speaker 1: the upside is the overall trend moving in the right direction.

646
00:44:25,880 --> 00:44:28,040
Speaker 1: And I don't want to use the word downside, but

647
00:44:28,120 --> 00:44:31,840
Speaker 1: the downside protection is sort of what you alluded to

648
00:44:31,960 --> 00:44:36,200
Speaker 1: earlier in terms of E s G as a risk factor.

649
00:44:36,360 --> 00:44:40,400
Speaker 1: Let's let's talk about that G in companies with a

650
00:44:40,480 --> 00:44:43,640
Speaker 1: broad governance, that it's not just run by an old

651
00:44:43,640 --> 00:44:48,319
Speaker 1: boys network, but where there's true diversity of thought and inclusion,

652
00:44:49,280 --> 00:44:53,080
Speaker 1: they tend to get into far less trouble than the

653
00:44:53,280 --> 00:44:58,800
Speaker 1: sort of groupthink organizations. Is that a fair statement, Well,

654
00:44:58,880 --> 00:45:02,480
Speaker 1: I'm sure there's lots of statistics to support that or

655
00:45:02,520 --> 00:45:04,960
Speaker 1: to challenge that. What I what I would agree with

656
00:45:05,000 --> 00:45:07,920
Speaker 1: you on, and what I would say is that by

657
00:45:08,040 --> 00:45:11,399
Speaker 1: having a diverse balance of people, and in particular now

658
00:45:11,520 --> 00:45:14,880
Speaker 1: I'm lending through the lens of a female of a woman,

659
00:45:15,640 --> 00:45:20,600
Speaker 1: I do think that the qualifications or some of the

660
00:45:20,719 --> 00:45:24,799
Speaker 1: awareness that I can bring to an organization is a

661
00:45:24,800 --> 00:45:26,719
Speaker 1: bit of a balance of that. We talked about the

662
00:45:26,760 --> 00:45:29,360
Speaker 1: balance of the e Q and the i Q. You know,

663
00:45:29,440 --> 00:45:33,560
Speaker 1: it's really listening, it's understanding, it's a different risk profile

664
00:45:34,520 --> 00:45:37,880
Speaker 1: that you can bring into It's it's thinking about some

665
00:45:38,040 --> 00:45:40,480
Speaker 1: of the risks and some of the factors and lending

666
00:45:40,520 --> 00:45:43,960
Speaker 1: that to a conversation. We may all end up arriving

667
00:45:44,040 --> 00:45:49,000
Speaker 1: at the same decision, but at least my my view

668
00:45:49,160 --> 00:45:52,439
Speaker 1: is that we would have considered many more factors when

669
00:45:52,440 --> 00:45:55,920
Speaker 1: you have diversity of of thought being brought to that discussion.

670
00:45:56,600 --> 00:45:59,400
Speaker 1: So what sort of advice do you give to women

671
00:45:59,719 --> 00:46:04,719
Speaker 1: who are struggling to become advocates for themselves and advocates

672
00:46:04,760 --> 00:46:09,640
Speaker 1: for women in the workplace, be it employment or promotion

673
00:46:10,080 --> 00:46:13,320
Speaker 1: or you know, governance as as part of the member

674
00:46:13,320 --> 00:46:16,360
Speaker 1: of the board or or c suite. This is a

675
00:46:16,440 --> 00:46:22,760
Speaker 1: question I'm constantly asked, and I offer myself to any

676
00:46:22,800 --> 00:46:26,040
Speaker 1: and all of the women in my company and you know,

677
00:46:26,120 --> 00:46:30,359
Speaker 1: friends and family. I'm the mother of two daughters eight

678
00:46:30,640 --> 00:46:37,120
Speaker 1: and five years old, and I try to provide them

679
00:46:37,160 --> 00:46:40,440
Speaker 1: with advice that frankly, I was never given, but I

680
00:46:40,480 --> 00:46:44,120
Speaker 1: had to learn on my own and what I do,

681
00:46:44,320 --> 00:46:48,080
Speaker 1: what I would love to see more women do is

682
00:46:48,760 --> 00:46:54,040
Speaker 1: really advocate for yourself. Don't allow decisions to take place

683
00:46:54,320 --> 00:46:59,080
Speaker 1: around you, but to really sit down with management and

684
00:46:59,360 --> 00:47:02,839
Speaker 1: communicate what are your career aspirations, where do you want

685
00:47:02,840 --> 00:47:05,600
Speaker 1: to go and how can I help you get there

686
00:47:06,600 --> 00:47:10,880
Speaker 1: and position yourself for being truly qualified for a position.

687
00:47:10,880 --> 00:47:13,960
Speaker 1: There's some other scientific work that's done that when there's

688
00:47:14,080 --> 00:47:17,120
Speaker 1: a job description out there in the marketplace and it says,

689
00:47:17,200 --> 00:47:20,200
Speaker 1: you know, need ten years of experience, that if a

690
00:47:20,239 --> 00:47:23,400
Speaker 1: woman has nine years and four months, she won't apply

691
00:47:23,480 --> 00:47:28,040
Speaker 1: for that job. But if others, maybe a man has

692
00:47:28,080 --> 00:47:31,320
Speaker 1: you know, seven years in nine months, you may apply

693
00:47:31,440 --> 00:47:34,520
Speaker 1: for that job thinking that she's totally overqualified for it.

694
00:47:34,719 --> 00:47:38,600
Speaker 1: So we've taken the practice out of Monday to be

695
00:47:38,760 --> 00:47:43,279
Speaker 1: a bit more flexible with job requirements. Instead of saying,

696
00:47:43,320 --> 00:47:46,240
Speaker 1: you know, ten years, maybe it's seven to ten years.

697
00:47:46,400 --> 00:47:50,160
Speaker 1: Or instead of looking for a graduate degree or a

698
00:47:50,280 --> 00:47:52,640
Speaker 1: be a just look for the skills and look for

699
00:47:52,680 --> 00:47:56,080
Speaker 1: the requirements. Because we also want to attract from some

700
00:47:56,160 --> 00:47:59,000
Speaker 1: of those urban communities and centers that may not be

701
00:47:59,040 --> 00:48:03,000
Speaker 1: a natural path for financial services and asset and asset

702
00:48:03,040 --> 00:48:07,520
Speaker 1: management SILL for women who are out there, network, find

703
00:48:07,560 --> 00:48:13,600
Speaker 1: an advocate, find a mentor and make your career ambitions

704
00:48:13,840 --> 00:48:16,680
Speaker 1: UM and the path that you want to pursue, let

705
00:48:16,840 --> 00:48:22,160
Speaker 1: people know about it, and volunteer for projects and initiatives

706
00:48:22,280 --> 00:48:27,279
Speaker 1: within the organization. Get involved across the organization and keep

707
00:48:27,280 --> 00:48:31,759
Speaker 1: working at US. Huh really really in uh intriguing. So

708
00:48:31,960 --> 00:48:37,920
Speaker 1: Amundy has made very specific efforts to improve its approach

709
00:48:38,000 --> 00:48:41,799
Speaker 1: to recruiting, be it women are people of color, but

710
00:48:42,000 --> 00:48:45,479
Speaker 1: generally looking for that sort of diverse background that leads

711
00:48:45,520 --> 00:48:48,320
Speaker 1: to better decision making. Tell us a little bit about

712
00:48:48,440 --> 00:48:52,359
Speaker 1: what Amundy is doing to UM put put their money

713
00:48:52,400 --> 00:48:56,320
Speaker 1: where their mouth is. So in I would I would

714
00:48:56,400 --> 00:49:00,080
Speaker 1: look back to I joined into fourteen to fifteen, and

715
00:49:00,080 --> 00:49:03,080
Speaker 1: I would say, in two thousand seventeen, early two thousand

716
00:49:03,120 --> 00:49:07,000
Speaker 1: and eighteen, I worked in earnest with my executive team

717
00:49:07,040 --> 00:49:10,600
Speaker 1: and my head of HR to put in place uh

718
00:49:10,920 --> 00:49:15,000
Speaker 1: d E and my framework for the entire organization, and

719
00:49:15,040 --> 00:49:16,920
Speaker 1: we wanted to take a look at what did we

720
00:49:16,960 --> 00:49:19,840
Speaker 1: need to do kind of internally in order to have

721
00:49:20,000 --> 00:49:24,120
Speaker 1: success with this. And you can come back to culture one.

722
00:49:24,520 --> 00:49:29,200
Speaker 1: I believe that a more diverse group is more positive culture.

723
00:49:29,320 --> 00:49:33,040
Speaker 1: It's more inclusive, it's more respectful. I also know that

724
00:49:33,080 --> 00:49:36,640
Speaker 1: You can't necessarily have success when something is topped down.

725
00:49:37,160 --> 00:49:40,040
Speaker 1: So we needed this, this movement, if you will, this

726
00:49:40,160 --> 00:49:43,120
Speaker 1: journey to be both top down and bottom up. The

727
00:49:43,200 --> 00:49:45,799
Speaker 1: first thing that we did is we put all of

728
00:49:45,840 --> 00:49:50,880
Speaker 1: my executive team and broader operating committees through unconscious biased training.

729
00:49:50,920 --> 00:49:53,960
Speaker 1: And this was in two seventeen to eighteen. Everybody has

730
00:49:54,000 --> 00:49:57,239
Speaker 1: done it, everyone is doing it. What we wanted to

731
00:49:57,239 --> 00:50:01,000
Speaker 1: do was to get some grassroots effort, so we created

732
00:50:01,000 --> 00:50:05,279
Speaker 1: an Ambassador program. We have to employees across the organization

733
00:50:05,840 --> 00:50:10,200
Speaker 1: who fell passionately about helping us to become a better

734
00:50:10,360 --> 00:50:15,080
Speaker 1: employer of people of color, or or gender or any

735
00:50:15,200 --> 00:50:18,839
Speaker 1: anything else for that matter, to volunteer on the Ambassador

736
00:50:18,880 --> 00:50:23,640
Speaker 1: program and they run monthly initiatives for the organization to

737
00:50:23,800 --> 00:50:29,160
Speaker 1: raise awareness on l GBP two, to raise awareness on disability,

738
00:50:29,239 --> 00:50:33,520
Speaker 1: to raise awareness on UM you know, Hispanic heritage months,

739
00:50:33,560 --> 00:50:37,000
Speaker 1: and to bring it awareness. What we recognize is that

740
00:50:37,160 --> 00:50:41,400
Speaker 1: externally this outreach. For a long time, the asset management

741
00:50:41,440 --> 00:50:45,160
Speaker 1: industry has said I'd love to hire more diverse candidates.

742
00:50:45,160 --> 00:50:48,560
Speaker 1: I'm just not getting their resumes, and to us into

743
00:50:48,600 --> 00:50:52,359
Speaker 1: the industry, that's just no longer a good reason. We've

744
00:50:52,400 --> 00:50:55,680
Speaker 1: got to figure out how do we get those resumes.

745
00:50:55,760 --> 00:50:58,759
Speaker 1: So instead of recruiting just at the best and the

746
00:50:58,840 --> 00:51:02,200
Speaker 1: brightest um you know, the all of the named schools,

747
00:51:02,680 --> 00:51:07,080
Speaker 1: we've created partnerships with different community colleges. With some of

748
00:51:07,120 --> 00:51:11,600
Speaker 1: the um you know historically Black College University Consortium that

749
00:51:11,640 --> 00:51:15,680
Speaker 1: exists in and around North Carolina. We have partnered with

750
00:51:15,760 --> 00:51:19,840
Speaker 1: an organization locally here in Boston called bottom Line, which

751
00:51:20,400 --> 00:51:25,040
Speaker 1: develops relationships with inner city students, you know, before they're

752
00:51:25,080 --> 00:51:28,359
Speaker 1: ready to graduate. So we've changed how we're reaching out

753
00:51:28,440 --> 00:51:32,319
Speaker 1: into the community. We've also, as I mentioned, modified how

754
00:51:32,360 --> 00:51:36,959
Speaker 1: we put together job descriptions and job requirements. And we're

755
00:51:37,239 --> 00:51:41,040
Speaker 1: extremely conscious that when we have a position open and

756
00:51:41,120 --> 00:51:44,440
Speaker 1: that person who is coming into the organization may be

757
00:51:44,880 --> 00:51:48,360
Speaker 1: a twenty seven year old white woman or a thirty

758
00:51:48,400 --> 00:51:52,359
Speaker 1: five year old African American male, that let's make sure

759
00:51:52,400 --> 00:51:56,200
Speaker 1: we don't have five fifty year old white men or

760
00:51:56,239 --> 00:52:00,120
Speaker 1: five fift year old white women being the people that

761
00:52:00,200 --> 00:52:03,960
Speaker 1: this individual is interviewing. So they want to see a

762
00:52:04,040 --> 00:52:08,239
Speaker 1: diverse organization. We've also the last thing Vary that we've

763
00:52:08,280 --> 00:52:12,600
Speaker 1: done is we've really started to measure by metrics, so

764
00:52:12,640 --> 00:52:17,359
Speaker 1: you can't manage what you can't measure, and we are

765
00:52:17,480 --> 00:52:23,880
Speaker 1: presently women men. That's kind of consistent with where the

766
00:52:23,960 --> 00:52:30,480
Speaker 1: industry is. We're non why why both of those numbers

767
00:52:30,840 --> 00:52:35,640
Speaker 1: need to get higher, need to improve, and these efforts

768
00:52:35,640 --> 00:52:38,640
Speaker 1: that we're putting in place is the is one of

769
00:52:38,680 --> 00:52:42,960
Speaker 1: the ways that we're looking to drive some change. Quite

770
00:52:43,120 --> 00:52:46,160
Speaker 1: quite fascinating. Let's let's talk a little bit about what's

771
00:52:46,160 --> 00:52:52,000
Speaker 1: going on um in investment today. Despite very low rates,

772
00:52:52,080 --> 00:52:57,359
Speaker 1: we continue to see huge flows into fixed income. Why

773
00:52:57,440 --> 00:53:00,279
Speaker 1: is there so much demand for yield and is that

774
00:53:00,320 --> 00:53:03,720
Speaker 1: going to put a cap on interest rates? So Barry,

775
00:53:03,760 --> 00:53:07,680
Speaker 1: I wonder if we're seeing the demand and the flows

776
00:53:07,719 --> 00:53:10,720
Speaker 1: in fixed income. Let's think about where we were almost

777
00:53:10,719 --> 00:53:15,200
Speaker 1: a year ago today. So in March of that kind

778
00:53:15,200 --> 00:53:18,440
Speaker 1: of March April time period, we saw such a significant

779
00:53:18,480 --> 00:53:22,120
Speaker 1: sell off in the fixed income in the credit markets,

780
00:53:22,320 --> 00:53:26,120
Speaker 1: you know, on securitized credit anywhere, down from twenty to

781
00:53:26,280 --> 00:53:32,160
Speaker 1: thirty plus percent, though part of the flow is in

782
00:53:32,200 --> 00:53:34,640
Speaker 1: the latter heart half of two thousand and twenty and

783
00:53:34,640 --> 00:53:37,360
Speaker 1: then continuing to shoot twenty one. Is a bit of

784
00:53:37,360 --> 00:53:41,759
Speaker 1: a rebound and a bit of an opportunity opportunistically to

785
00:53:41,880 --> 00:53:45,799
Speaker 1: kind of get exposure to some of the sell off

786
00:53:45,800 --> 00:53:49,560
Speaker 1: in the marketplace where fundamentals were really quite strong. It

787
00:53:49,680 --> 00:53:52,640
Speaker 1: was some of these technical shifts that we were seeing

788
00:53:52,640 --> 00:53:55,800
Speaker 1: in the marketplace. So investors on the fixed income side

789
00:53:55,960 --> 00:53:58,840
Speaker 1: who were able to jump back into the marketplace have

790
00:53:59,000 --> 00:54:03,840
Speaker 1: experienced them really attractive rates of return. What we're seeing

791
00:54:03,880 --> 00:54:06,560
Speaker 1: today though, if you think about the current state of

792
00:54:06,640 --> 00:54:09,600
Speaker 1: where we are, where we are with the potential for

793
00:54:09,719 --> 00:54:15,400
Speaker 1: inflation UM, you know, continuing and thinking about any you know,

794
00:54:15,440 --> 00:54:20,239
Speaker 1: any effects of a rising rate environment. More seeing considerable

795
00:54:20,280 --> 00:54:23,920
Speaker 1: flows in the short end of the marketplace in short

796
00:54:24,000 --> 00:54:29,120
Speaker 1: duration fixed income kind of ultrashort duration ext income. And

797
00:54:29,200 --> 00:54:33,000
Speaker 1: we're also seeing very selectively for clients who are looking

798
00:54:33,080 --> 00:54:38,960
Speaker 1: for still attractive yields looking at the agency market, the

799
00:54:39,000 --> 00:54:44,399
Speaker 1: agency mortgage back security marketplace, again where active management can

800
00:54:44,440 --> 00:54:50,560
Speaker 1: apply a selective approach. So, given your very heavily institutional

801
00:54:51,080 --> 00:54:55,719
Speaker 1: UM client base, both here and overseas, where else do

802
00:54:55,800 --> 00:55:01,839
Speaker 1: you see investors going to find yield? It's not just treasuries,

803
00:55:01,880 --> 00:55:05,799
Speaker 1: corporates and tips. They're obviously looking else where Where else

804
00:55:05,880 --> 00:55:11,560
Speaker 1: is that? So from a retail perspective, UM, there's attractive

805
00:55:11,560 --> 00:55:15,080
Speaker 1: opportunity in you know, as we've seen closed and funds

806
00:55:15,120 --> 00:55:19,400
Speaker 1: launched in the marketplace. The benefit of closed and funds,

807
00:55:19,400 --> 00:55:23,359
Speaker 1: as your listeners and you probably know, is that you

808
00:55:23,400 --> 00:55:28,600
Speaker 1: can apply some leverage, you know, selective live verge, so

809
00:55:28,800 --> 00:55:34,360
Speaker 1: you can take a fairly low rate and with leverage

810
00:55:34,480 --> 00:55:38,000
Speaker 1: achieve you know, on the tax exempt side, kind of

811
00:55:38,040 --> 00:55:40,160
Speaker 1: four percent. We launched a close and fund not too

812
00:55:40,160 --> 00:55:43,600
Speaker 1: long ago over the summertime that has over, uh, you know,

813
00:55:43,640 --> 00:55:47,160
Speaker 1: a four percent target yield on a tax exempt basis.

814
00:55:47,360 --> 00:55:51,880
Speaker 1: That's very attractive, especially during the threat of increases in

815
00:55:52,000 --> 00:55:56,360
Speaker 1: personal taxes that we may all experience. Security ties credit

816
00:55:56,800 --> 00:56:01,280
Speaker 1: is another place. But but from our perspective, investors don't

817
00:56:01,360 --> 00:56:04,640
Speaker 1: have to only stay in fixed income to look for

818
00:56:04,760 --> 00:56:08,799
Speaker 1: yield or to look for income. Multi asset portfolios, which

819
00:56:08,800 --> 00:56:13,239
Speaker 1: have grown in popularity over the last many years, is

820
00:56:13,280 --> 00:56:17,840
Speaker 1: a way to achieve a higher level of monthly income.

821
00:56:17,920 --> 00:56:21,720
Speaker 1: Some of the multi asset funds do pay monthly income,

822
00:56:21,880 --> 00:56:25,120
Speaker 1: and you can get levels that are much higher than

823
00:56:25,280 --> 00:56:29,440
Speaker 1: just in a traditional short duration product or an investment

824
00:56:29,440 --> 00:56:32,960
Speaker 1: grade product as well. Huh and and I just wanted

825
00:56:33,000 --> 00:56:37,560
Speaker 1: to clarify your The investments are typically through separately managed

826
00:56:37,560 --> 00:56:41,799
Speaker 1: accounts or they directly into mutual funds or other products

827
00:56:41,840 --> 00:56:47,400
Speaker 1: like that. We're vehicle agnostic, so you know, we any rapper,

828
00:56:47,719 --> 00:56:52,360
Speaker 1: any vehicle that we can put our active management into.

829
00:56:53,080 --> 00:56:57,120
Speaker 1: So we offer separate account, collective investment trust, mutual funds,

830
00:56:57,160 --> 00:57:00,080
Speaker 1: and then the use it's which is the sifter of

831
00:57:00,120 --> 00:57:05,440
Speaker 1: the mutual fund in the international markets. M interesting. So

832
00:57:05,440 --> 00:57:09,600
Speaker 1: so given your perspective from both the institutional side and

833
00:57:09,680 --> 00:57:13,080
Speaker 1: the individual side over the years, how do you see

834
00:57:13,120 --> 00:57:18,920
Speaker 1: asset management as having evolved? What's different in one from

835
00:57:19,000 --> 00:57:22,080
Speaker 1: say two thousand and one or or when you and

836
00:57:22,120 --> 00:57:26,680
Speaker 1: I were both in college, so that the lines between

837
00:57:27,280 --> 00:57:31,880
Speaker 1: the distribution channels, what was on one side institutional and

838
00:57:31,960 --> 00:57:34,919
Speaker 1: on one side retail and never the two show meet,

839
00:57:35,040 --> 00:57:40,640
Speaker 1: those lines have completely blurred. There is an institutionalization and

840
00:57:40,720 --> 00:57:47,480
Speaker 1: a professionalism of all investment management selection. So whether you

841
00:57:47,640 --> 00:57:50,960
Speaker 1: have an individual account at a wealth management firm, that

842
00:57:51,040 --> 00:57:56,480
Speaker 1: wealth management firm has a research department that is selecting

843
00:57:56,520 --> 00:57:59,640
Speaker 1: and doing the due diligence on the investment products that

844
00:57:59,760 --> 00:58:04,160
Speaker 1: they're are allowing to be kind of offered and distributed

845
00:58:04,440 --> 00:58:09,000
Speaker 1: through their channels, and that level of rigor, that level

846
00:58:09,040 --> 00:58:14,760
Speaker 1: of institutional due diligence is present today across all different channels.

847
00:58:15,600 --> 00:58:18,920
Speaker 1: The second aspect of change over the last twenty or

848
00:58:19,000 --> 00:58:22,720
Speaker 1: thirty years is with the growth of wealth, the growth

849
00:58:22,800 --> 00:58:27,520
Speaker 1: of the high net worth investor, and the focus on

850
00:58:28,080 --> 00:58:33,280
Speaker 1: maximizing after tax return. We have seen new vehicles come

851
00:58:33,320 --> 00:58:36,520
Speaker 1: to market that in the past were only for the

852
00:58:36,560 --> 00:58:41,360
Speaker 1: institutional account or only for the retail account. So keen.

853
00:58:41,400 --> 00:58:45,360
Speaker 1: Twenty years ago, it was less likely for large institutional

854
00:58:45,640 --> 00:58:49,120
Speaker 1: investors pension funds and the like to investor mutual funds,

855
00:58:49,160 --> 00:58:52,080
Speaker 1: and it was less likely for an individual investor to

856
00:58:52,160 --> 00:58:54,920
Speaker 1: access a separately managed account. So when I said that

857
00:58:55,000 --> 00:59:01,240
Speaker 1: where vehicle agnostic, it's because the investor, whether it since atitutional, individual,

858
00:59:01,960 --> 00:59:06,440
Speaker 1: everyone has different goals and outcomes and considerations. That the

859
00:59:06,680 --> 00:59:11,840
Speaker 1: growth of multiple vehicles and the desire for an asset

860
00:59:11,880 --> 00:59:16,800
Speaker 1: management firm to unwrap active management and to offer it

861
00:59:16,880 --> 00:59:19,560
Speaker 1: in a manner that helps to meet the outcome and

862
00:59:19,600 --> 00:59:23,400
Speaker 1: the goals of the clients, that's vastly different. And the

863
00:59:23,520 --> 00:59:27,680
Speaker 1: third aspect of what is vastly different is pricing. So

864
00:59:28,760 --> 00:59:31,440
Speaker 1: years ago you have front and loads that were let

865
00:59:31,440 --> 00:59:33,040
Speaker 1: me speak if I can remember the seven and a

866
00:59:33,160 --> 00:59:37,280
Speaker 1: quarter eight plus percent, and you now have today nine

867
00:59:39,520 --> 00:59:44,760
Speaker 1: US loads into our mutual funds comes into UM an

868
00:59:44,880 --> 00:59:47,840
Speaker 1: na V level, so without a front and sales charge.

869
00:59:47,840 --> 00:59:52,680
Speaker 1: So pricing has also evolved in order to be appropriate

870
00:59:52,720 --> 00:59:56,240
Speaker 1: for the type of investor. That's interesting. So so that's

871
00:59:56,280 --> 01:00:00,040
Speaker 1: the past ten or twenty years. Let's talk about the

872
01:00:00,080 --> 01:00:04,800
Speaker 1: next decade or so. Now that you're running a large

873
01:00:05,200 --> 01:00:09,520
Speaker 1: group of investors and a hundred billion dollars, what are

874
01:00:09,560 --> 01:00:13,720
Speaker 1: you looking at as how the industry itself might change

875
01:00:14,120 --> 01:00:16,840
Speaker 1: over the next decade or two and what are you

876
01:00:16,880 --> 01:00:22,360
Speaker 1: doing to anticipate that. So pricing will always be front

877
01:00:22,400 --> 01:00:25,560
Speaker 1: and center for the industry on a going forward basis.

878
01:00:25,600 --> 01:00:30,120
Speaker 1: We have seen margins come down, but as an industry,

879
01:00:30,280 --> 01:00:35,200
Speaker 1: we still enjoy very attractive profit margins, and so we're

880
01:00:35,240 --> 01:00:39,280
Speaker 1: seeing pricing pressure come down. Whether it's driven by you

881
01:00:39,320 --> 01:00:44,000
Speaker 1: know zero you know zero fee e TF or where

882
01:00:44,040 --> 01:00:47,560
Speaker 1: the total expense ratio is on mutual funds visa V

883
01:00:47,840 --> 01:00:51,160
Speaker 1: where yields are. You know that that pressure will continue.

884
01:00:51,240 --> 01:00:54,280
Speaker 1: So we have to be relevant and competitive from a

885
01:00:54,400 --> 01:00:58,360
Speaker 1: pricing standpoint. We if we were to look out UM

886
01:00:58,440 --> 01:01:01,920
Speaker 1: and this has happened already to a certain degree and

887
01:01:01,960 --> 01:01:05,320
Speaker 1: in some parts of the world, but our industry is

888
01:01:05,440 --> 01:01:10,160
Speaker 1: right for disruption, whether it is an entrant from outside

889
01:01:10,160 --> 01:01:13,720
Speaker 1: of asset management who wants to come into this industry,

890
01:01:13,920 --> 01:01:17,560
Speaker 1: or how technology will disrupt our business, and we have

891
01:01:17,640 --> 01:01:21,160
Speaker 1: to think about how will our business be disrupted and

892
01:01:21,240 --> 01:01:24,480
Speaker 1: how do we as a firm who who frankly has

893
01:01:24,560 --> 01:01:28,840
Speaker 1: been running money and managing money since how do we

894
01:01:28,880 --> 01:01:32,640
Speaker 1: make sure that we're not disrupted, that we remain relevant.

895
01:01:33,280 --> 01:01:38,560
Speaker 1: Artificial intelligence will become a bigger part. It's already present,

896
01:01:38,760 --> 01:01:42,840
Speaker 1: but it will become a bigger part of portfolio management,

897
01:01:43,080 --> 01:01:50,400
Speaker 1: of trying to streamline operational efficiencies, and will also continue

898
01:01:50,440 --> 01:01:53,720
Speaker 1: to experience, you know, the big getting bigger so in

899
01:01:53,800 --> 01:01:56,800
Speaker 1: the marketplace over the last several weeks, whether it's here

900
01:01:56,800 --> 01:02:01,840
Speaker 1: in the United States or abroad, the consolidation that we're seeing,

901
01:02:02,400 --> 01:02:04,920
Speaker 1: you know, I believe will continue to occur. So the

902
01:02:05,080 --> 01:02:08,840
Speaker 1: bigger going to get bigger. The small will have to

903
01:02:08,880 --> 01:02:14,120
Speaker 1: be truly specialized in boutique and um offer to value

904
01:02:14,800 --> 01:02:18,240
Speaker 1: in the middle is what has been squeezed and will

905
01:02:18,280 --> 01:02:22,360
Speaker 1: continue to be squeezed in the future. Huh. That's really

906
01:02:22,440 --> 01:02:26,840
Speaker 1: quite intriguing. So so you mentioned things that might disrupt

907
01:02:27,920 --> 01:02:33,360
Speaker 1: the existing firmament of finance. What are your thoughts on apps?

908
01:02:33,440 --> 01:02:39,760
Speaker 1: Like Robin Hood and that generation of millennials who seem

909
01:02:39,840 --> 01:02:46,600
Speaker 1: to be there prime client base whom they've gamified investing for.

910
01:02:47,200 --> 01:02:50,720
Speaker 1: So um, let's think of a couple of points in history.

911
01:02:50,880 --> 01:02:55,480
Speaker 1: And and I've always learned that when we as an industry,

912
01:02:55,600 --> 01:03:01,200
Speaker 1: or when media as a reporting entity starts to talk

913
01:03:01,360 --> 01:03:05,000
Speaker 1: in terms of either or or versus or one or

914
01:03:05,040 --> 01:03:08,800
Speaker 1: the other, that whoever is on the other side of

915
01:03:08,840 --> 01:03:11,920
Speaker 1: that is quick to say, no, way, that's not happening.

916
01:03:12,200 --> 01:03:14,960
Speaker 1: So if you think back in the nineteen eighties, was

917
01:03:15,280 --> 01:03:21,960
Speaker 1: at the time active versus passive, load versus no load?

918
01:03:22,440 --> 01:03:25,880
Speaker 1: And what we see today in in all of our

919
01:03:25,880 --> 01:03:29,960
Speaker 1: own portfolios is that there is an appropriate place for passive,

920
01:03:30,000 --> 01:03:33,320
Speaker 1: there is an appropriate place for active, there's an appropriate

921
01:03:33,320 --> 01:03:36,480
Speaker 1: place beload, an appropriate place for no load, and I

922
01:03:36,480 --> 01:03:39,720
Speaker 1: would suggest that there is just as we as an

923
01:03:39,720 --> 01:03:43,800
Speaker 1: asset management firm or vehicle agnostic, I think for those

924
01:03:43,840 --> 01:03:49,240
Speaker 1: wealth management firms that make their services available to investors,

925
01:03:50,440 --> 01:03:54,560
Speaker 1: they need to be delivery agnostic. So if a client

926
01:03:54,720 --> 01:03:56,640
Speaker 1: wants to come in and sit down with me as

927
01:03:56,640 --> 01:04:01,040
Speaker 1: a financial advisor, fantastic. If they to do something over

928
01:04:01,080 --> 01:04:04,680
Speaker 1: an app terrific, if they want to do something over

929
01:04:04,720 --> 01:04:08,200
Speaker 1: you know, some type of a different you know, uh,

930
01:04:08,840 --> 01:04:11,920
Speaker 1: robin hood or or nutmeg or any of those others.

931
01:04:12,400 --> 01:04:15,680
Speaker 1: Than what you're really wanting to do is to understand

932
01:04:15,760 --> 01:04:19,920
Speaker 1: the client segmentation that's most attracted to that and taylor

933
01:04:19,960 --> 01:04:24,760
Speaker 1: and customize your offering to that client segmentation and how

934
01:04:24,960 --> 01:04:29,080
Speaker 1: they want to purchase what you're selling. So I think

935
01:04:29,120 --> 01:04:32,360
Speaker 1: I think it's all relevant. You just have to figure

936
01:04:32,400 --> 01:04:35,560
Speaker 1: out how to segment your offering and be appropriate on

937
01:04:35,600 --> 01:04:38,920
Speaker 1: how you deliver it. So, so you mentioned the sort

938
01:04:38,960 --> 01:04:43,480
Speaker 1: of tension between active and passive. You've managed to navigate

939
01:04:43,600 --> 01:04:47,680
Speaker 1: that pretty well and stayed on, uh, the right side

940
01:04:48,000 --> 01:04:51,280
Speaker 1: of mix between active and passive. Tell us how you

941
01:04:51,880 --> 01:04:55,480
Speaker 1: managed to do that well. It is a constant battle.

942
01:04:55,840 --> 01:04:59,760
Speaker 1: And uh, you know, one of the recent statistics that

943
01:04:59,800 --> 01:05:02,320
Speaker 1: I saw this might be you know, maybe a few

944
01:05:02,320 --> 01:05:06,120
Speaker 1: months older, so, but seven of the last ten years

945
01:05:07,080 --> 01:05:11,240
Speaker 1: actively managed mutual funds have been in net outflows at

946
01:05:11,280 --> 01:05:15,840
Speaker 1: the expense of kind of index and passive investing. And

947
01:05:16,000 --> 01:05:18,360
Speaker 1: as a you know, as as we've talked about you

948
01:05:18,440 --> 01:05:21,640
Speaker 1: and I earlier and before, when you take a look

949
01:05:21,680 --> 01:05:26,200
Speaker 1: at where the concentration in the market has been in

950
01:05:26,440 --> 01:05:31,600
Speaker 1: two thousand and nineteen where you saw UM such a

951
01:05:31,800 --> 01:05:36,240
Speaker 1: strong concentration of where the momentum was coming from. Really again,

952
01:05:36,240 --> 01:05:39,440
Speaker 1: and those five or six stocks that were returning some

953
01:05:39,600 --> 01:05:43,520
Speaker 1: fifty to sixty percent and their overall return. When you're

954
01:05:43,560 --> 01:05:48,120
Speaker 1: an active manager and the returns are so heavily skewed

955
01:05:48,240 --> 01:05:52,120
Speaker 1: in just a handful of stocks, you're gonna underperform. You're

956
01:05:52,160 --> 01:05:55,480
Speaker 1: not gonna because you're diversified. You know, you're you're looking

957
01:05:55,520 --> 01:06:00,000
Speaker 1: to put your conviction across UM, you know, multiple, multiple,

958
01:06:00,000 --> 01:06:04,600
Speaker 1: the different names. Today, when we're seeing more breasts and

959
01:06:04,800 --> 01:06:08,480
Speaker 1: what the market is delivering, we really believe that this

960
01:06:08,560 --> 01:06:12,520
Speaker 1: is an opportunity for active management to contribute. Part of

961
01:06:12,560 --> 01:06:16,600
Speaker 1: the other way that we've tried to fight this, Uh,

962
01:06:16,640 --> 01:06:20,280
Speaker 1: you know this, this headwind of remaining actively managed is

963
01:06:20,320 --> 01:06:23,479
Speaker 1: pricing is a key part of it. When you think

964
01:06:23,520 --> 01:06:27,520
Speaker 1: about how the tenure of some of the mutual funds

965
01:06:27,560 --> 01:06:30,880
Speaker 1: that are offered in the United States, and in particular

966
01:06:30,920 --> 01:06:33,160
Speaker 1: for some firms who have been in business for decades

967
01:06:33,240 --> 01:06:36,440
Speaker 1: like we have at a Monday US, the pricing for

968
01:06:36,520 --> 01:06:42,840
Speaker 1: those mutual phones were created thirty years ago when interest

969
01:06:42,920 --> 01:06:47,280
Speaker 1: rates were pent, when CDs were twelve percent in your

970
01:06:47,280 --> 01:06:52,280
Speaker 1: total expense ratio at that time was appropriate, and come

971
01:06:53,400 --> 01:06:57,200
Speaker 1: years later when you have interest rates in the single

972
01:06:57,280 --> 01:07:03,640
Speaker 1: digit and you have other attractively priced vehicles, pricing has

973
01:07:03,680 --> 01:07:07,400
Speaker 1: to be keen. So we're constantly evaluating, in particular with

974
01:07:07,440 --> 01:07:11,280
Speaker 1: our mutual funds, with my board of trustees, looking at

975
01:07:11,320 --> 01:07:15,680
Speaker 1: the market, looking where pricing is and making the necessary

976
01:07:15,720 --> 01:07:19,840
Speaker 1: decisions on reducing the pricing of our management fees and

977
01:07:19,880 --> 01:07:23,480
Speaker 1: our total expense ratios in order to be more competitive,

978
01:07:24,080 --> 01:07:27,720
Speaker 1: in order to have the best opportunity to achieve an

979
01:07:27,760 --> 01:07:31,200
Speaker 1: attractive total return for our shareholders. I know I only

980
01:07:31,240 --> 01:07:34,200
Speaker 1: have you for a few more minutes, so let's jump

981
01:07:34,240 --> 01:07:37,560
Speaker 1: to our favorite questions that we ask all of our guests,

982
01:07:38,240 --> 01:07:41,720
Speaker 1: starting with what are you streaming these days? Tell us

983
01:07:41,760 --> 01:07:46,000
Speaker 1: what's kept you entertained uh during lockdown? Be at Netflix

984
01:07:46,080 --> 01:07:49,640
Speaker 1: or Amazon or podcast or whatever. Well, thank goodness for

985
01:07:50,200 --> 01:07:53,440
Speaker 1: streaming right over the last year and a half or so,

986
01:07:53,440 --> 01:07:56,720
Speaker 1: so we you know the rules in the house. It's

987
01:07:56,720 --> 01:07:59,400
Speaker 1: something that my husband and I will enjoy and like

988
01:07:59,560 --> 01:08:04,640
Speaker 1: to watch. So it can have extreme violence or be

989
01:08:05,080 --> 01:08:08,320
Speaker 1: two sup be saucy. On the other hand, so some

990
01:08:08,400 --> 01:08:13,080
Speaker 1: of the um some of the streaming shows that we've watched, Uh,

991
01:08:13,200 --> 01:08:17,160
Speaker 1: we completed Ozark, we just completed what is it, Nine

992
01:08:17,200 --> 01:08:22,680
Speaker 1: Perfect Strangers. We've watched The Mayor of East Ham. I

993
01:08:22,720 --> 01:08:27,800
Speaker 1: think we also watched as well, and we just finished

994
01:08:27,880 --> 01:08:30,120
Speaker 1: Queen of the South. I don't know if you've seen

995
01:08:30,160 --> 01:08:31,800
Speaker 1: some of those, but maybe you can ask some of

996
01:08:31,800 --> 01:08:34,880
Speaker 1: those two here. That's A. That's an interesting list, likeright there.

997
01:08:35,200 --> 01:08:41,160
Speaker 1: People are always asking that question. Uh, they want some

998
01:08:41,160 --> 01:08:46,280
Speaker 1: some perspective. That's A. That's a pretty interesting list. Tell

999
01:08:46,360 --> 01:08:49,320
Speaker 1: us about some of your early mentors who helped shape

1000
01:08:49,640 --> 01:08:54,680
Speaker 1: your career. So the early mentor that helped shape my

1001
01:08:54,840 --> 01:08:58,120
Speaker 1: career was when I was at mf S. She actually

1002
01:08:58,200 --> 01:09:02,240
Speaker 1: just retired not to long ago. It's Jerry Potts. He

1003
01:09:02,479 --> 01:09:06,599
Speaker 1: was the head of the bank distribution channel. He hired

1004
01:09:06,680 --> 01:09:12,000
Speaker 1: me at MFF and he was just a super mentor

1005
01:09:12,240 --> 01:09:15,519
Speaker 1: to me. He saw my strengths, He picked me up

1006
01:09:15,520 --> 01:09:18,680
Speaker 1: when I was down, He challenged me when I was

1007
01:09:18,760 --> 01:09:22,920
Speaker 1: getting too comfortable. He always had a super sense of humor,

1008
01:09:23,439 --> 01:09:26,639
Speaker 1: and he was always my advocate and he was someone

1009
01:09:26,840 --> 01:09:31,400
Speaker 1: that um that really helped me move throughout the organization.

1010
01:09:31,680 --> 01:09:34,960
Speaker 1: And as I've gone on in time, I would say

1011
01:09:35,040 --> 01:09:39,720
Speaker 1: that mentoring Um. As you achieve kind of growth in

1012
01:09:39,760 --> 01:09:43,400
Speaker 1: your career comes less from people, at least for me

1013
01:09:43,720 --> 01:09:47,960
Speaker 1: in and around my organization, and more from people that

1014
01:09:48,120 --> 01:09:52,160
Speaker 1: I've reached out to. Either it's other leaders and asset

1015
01:09:52,240 --> 01:09:56,120
Speaker 1: management firms where we're sharing certain challenges. It's kind of

1016
01:09:56,120 --> 01:09:59,120
Speaker 1: affinity groups that you may belong to you can kind

1017
01:09:59,120 --> 01:10:01,120
Speaker 1: of share some of your challenges. But to me, that

1018
01:10:01,280 --> 01:10:05,080
Speaker 1: mentoring in your first ten or fifteen years of your

1019
01:10:05,120 --> 01:10:08,840
Speaker 1: career is super important. So shout out to Mr Jerry Pots.

1020
01:10:09,200 --> 01:10:10,880
Speaker 1: What are some of your favorite books? What are you

1021
01:10:10,920 --> 01:10:14,840
Speaker 1: reading right now? So? I didn't I haven't opened it yet,

1022
01:10:14,960 --> 01:10:19,240
Speaker 1: but I did UM order recently. UM the new Chris

1023
01:10:19,280 --> 01:10:23,040
Speaker 1: Wallace book The Countdown Bin Laden Um. That one is

1024
01:10:23,080 --> 01:10:25,720
Speaker 1: something that I want to pick up. And then a

1025
01:10:25,920 --> 01:10:29,240
Speaker 1: very quick read. I got together with a group of

1026
01:10:29,720 --> 01:10:32,760
Speaker 1: high school and junior high school friends not too long ago,

1027
01:10:33,479 --> 01:10:36,160
Speaker 1: and one of my friends gave each and every one

1028
01:10:36,200 --> 01:10:40,200
Speaker 1: of us a book by Charlie McAfee I think is

1029
01:10:40,200 --> 01:10:42,920
Speaker 1: his last name. It's called The Boy, the Mole, the

1030
01:10:43,000 --> 01:10:46,360
Speaker 1: Fox and the Horse. You literally can read it in

1031
01:10:47,080 --> 01:10:50,160
Speaker 1: if it takes you longer than fifteen minutes, you've you know,

1032
01:10:50,280 --> 01:10:54,040
Speaker 1: you've daydreamed. It's a quick read, but it is so

1033
01:10:54,360 --> 01:11:01,160
Speaker 1: uplifting about um, hope and generosity and year and it

1034
01:11:01,280 --> 01:11:04,479
Speaker 1: was one of those great little field book feel good

1035
01:11:04,479 --> 01:11:07,680
Speaker 1: books in the middle of a pandemic. I've given it

1036
01:11:07,720 --> 01:11:09,639
Speaker 1: to my girls, and I've given it to a couple

1037
01:11:09,640 --> 01:11:13,000
Speaker 1: of other other friends as well, so that those are

1038
01:11:13,040 --> 01:11:15,280
Speaker 1: a couple that just come to come to mind. Barry,

1039
01:11:16,200 --> 01:11:19,719
Speaker 1: very very intriguing. What sort of advice would you give

1040
01:11:19,760 --> 01:11:22,960
Speaker 1: to a recent college grad who was interested in a

1041
01:11:23,080 --> 01:11:28,880
Speaker 1: career in either investment or financial management. One. I would

1042
01:11:28,920 --> 01:11:34,720
Speaker 1: say it is a fantastic career path that is professionally

1043
01:11:34,800 --> 01:11:41,120
Speaker 1: an intellectually rewarding where you surround yourself with smart, capable,

1044
01:11:41,920 --> 01:11:45,360
Speaker 1: engaging people. So I think it's a It's just a

1045
01:11:45,479 --> 01:11:51,519
Speaker 1: terrific career path. Start networking before you graduate, so use

1046
01:11:51,760 --> 01:11:55,920
Speaker 1: your college alumni networks, use linked in. Linked In. I mean,

1047
01:11:55,920 --> 01:12:00,799
Speaker 1: it sounds so basic, but I'm surprised of how many

1048
01:12:01,000 --> 01:12:04,600
Speaker 1: don't use it. And let's not forget the art of handwriting.

1049
01:12:05,040 --> 01:12:09,559
Speaker 1: We're all getting, especially in this day and environment, phone

1050
01:12:09,560 --> 01:12:12,360
Speaker 1: calls have gotten away, but we're getting hundreds and hundreds

1051
01:12:12,360 --> 01:12:16,519
Speaker 1: of emails. Uh, it's okay to drop a handwritten note

1052
01:12:17,040 --> 01:12:20,160
Speaker 1: and be persistent. Part of what an employer wants to

1053
01:12:20,160 --> 01:12:24,600
Speaker 1: see is your ability to have tenacity and overcome objections.

1054
01:12:25,040 --> 01:12:27,840
Speaker 1: So if after one, two or three tries you're not

1055
01:12:27,880 --> 01:12:32,080
Speaker 1: getting a response, don't just walk away. Keep going at it,

1056
01:12:32,160 --> 01:12:34,840
Speaker 1: figure out a different way to get in front of

1057
01:12:34,880 --> 01:12:40,080
Speaker 1: the company that you're interested in, and left. But not least,

1058
01:12:40,080 --> 01:12:42,599
Speaker 1: and this should be in the wheelhouse of the young,

1059
01:12:43,160 --> 01:12:45,599
Speaker 1: the young colleagues who are coming out of college. Do

1060
01:12:45,720 --> 01:12:48,880
Speaker 1: your due diligence and research on a company ever reason

1061
01:12:48,960 --> 01:12:52,400
Speaker 1: is available online. Please don't come and sit down with

1062
01:12:52,479 --> 01:12:55,559
Speaker 1: me and say you know how many assets under management

1063
01:12:55,560 --> 01:12:57,559
Speaker 1: do you have? Or how many countries are you in?

1064
01:12:57,800 --> 01:13:01,040
Speaker 1: Like the understand the company me that you're talking to,

1065
01:13:01,840 --> 01:13:04,120
Speaker 1: good good advice to say the very least. And our

1066
01:13:04,160 --> 01:13:07,640
Speaker 1: final question, what do you know about the world of

1067
01:13:07,720 --> 01:13:11,639
Speaker 1: investment management today that you wish you knew thirty years

1068
01:13:11,720 --> 01:13:14,160
Speaker 1: or so ago when you were first getting started. So

1069
01:13:14,520 --> 01:13:19,320
Speaker 1: I wish today what is so clear to me only

1070
01:13:19,360 --> 01:13:22,360
Speaker 1: by trial and error. And I would say, broadly from

1071
01:13:22,400 --> 01:13:27,000
Speaker 1: a career perspective, it's okay to take risks. You're either

1072
01:13:27,040 --> 01:13:30,280
Speaker 1: going to fail and you'll learn from it or taking

1073
01:13:30,280 --> 01:13:35,120
Speaker 1: the risk will be rewarded. And at the time I

1074
01:13:35,160 --> 01:13:39,599
Speaker 1: didn't realize risks. I may have been taking changing jobs,

1075
01:13:39,640 --> 01:13:43,720
Speaker 1: changing companies, changing profiles, um. But I think taking a

1076
01:13:43,840 --> 01:13:49,160
Speaker 1: risk is really important and and that's more career advice

1077
01:13:49,400 --> 01:13:52,960
Speaker 1: that I would offer from a world of investing perspective.

1078
01:13:53,800 --> 01:13:58,519
Speaker 1: Is you know, thirty years ago the market was pretty

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Speaker 1: domestic and not as global or as connected geo politically,

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Speaker 1: or as multinational and um. Whether it was something I

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Speaker 1: wish I knew thirty years ago or thought about, or

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Speaker 1: maybe we just needed to all evolve over time, but

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Speaker 1: today thinking beyond your borders is super important, really really fascinating.

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Speaker 1: Thank you Lisa Jones for being so generous with your time.

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Speaker 1: If you enjoy this conversation, well, be sure to check

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01:14:28,680 --> 01:14:33,400
Speaker 1: out any of the six prior discussions we've had. You

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Speaker 1: can find those at iTunes, Spotify, all the usual podcast places.

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Speaker 1: We love your comments, feedback and suggestions. You can write

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Speaker 1: to us at M I B Podcast at Bloomberg dot net.

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Speaker 1: Sign up from my daily reads at Rid Halts dot com.

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01:14:51,280 --> 01:14:55,040
Speaker 1: Check out my weekly column at Bloomberg dot com slash Opinion.

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Speaker 1: Follow me on Twitter at rid Halts. I would be

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Speaker 1: remiss if I did not thank our team that helps

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Speaker 1: put together this conversation each week. Mohammed is my audio engineer.

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01:15:07,040 --> 01:15:10,920
Speaker 1: Michael Batnick is my head of research. Paris Wold is

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Speaker 1: my booker slash producer. Atika Valbron is my project manager.

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Speaker 1: I'm Barry Rehults. You've been listening to Master's in Business

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Speaker 1: on Bloomberg Radio