1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:04,280 Speaker 1: Hello, dear listener. Today is like any other day. We 2 00:00:04,280 --> 00:00:07,560 Speaker 1: would normally be bringing you a new episode of Latino USA. 3 00:00:07,640 --> 00:00:10,640 Speaker 1: But today is a very, very very special day for 4 00:00:10,720 --> 00:00:15,920 Speaker 1: me because today, September fifteenth, is the official launch of 5 00:00:16,000 --> 00:00:19,000 Speaker 1: my new book. It's called Once I Was You, A 6 00:00:19,040 --> 00:00:21,239 Speaker 1: Memoir of Love and Hate in a Tour in America. 7 00:00:21,680 --> 00:00:23,639 Speaker 1: I've been working on the book for a couple of 8 00:00:23,680 --> 00:00:27,960 Speaker 1: years now, and I'm really excited and a little scared 9 00:00:28,000 --> 00:00:32,159 Speaker 1: to share it with everybody. The first official interview of 10 00:00:32,240 --> 00:00:35,239 Speaker 1: all interviews before the book came out was with the 11 00:00:35,320 --> 00:00:36,320 Speaker 1: fabulous Lure. 12 00:00:36,360 --> 00:00:38,040 Speaker 2: This this Garcia Navarro from. 13 00:00:37,880 --> 00:00:41,880 Speaker 1: Weekend edition at NPR, and we're going to bring you 14 00:00:41,960 --> 00:00:46,239 Speaker 1: an extended version of that interview. Lulu was just an 15 00:00:46,240 --> 00:00:49,000 Speaker 1: amazing interviewer and we wanted to share this with you. 16 00:00:49,080 --> 00:00:53,800 Speaker 1: So today a conversation between myself and Lulu Garcia Navarro 17 00:00:54,000 --> 00:00:56,800 Speaker 1: about my new book, Once I Was You, a Memoir 18 00:00:56,840 --> 00:00:59,080 Speaker 1: of Love and Hate in a Tour in America on 19 00:00:59,160 --> 00:01:01,720 Speaker 1: Latino USA. Enjoy and geus. 20 00:01:01,800 --> 00:01:09,240 Speaker 3: Yes, the one and only Maria you know, Josa joins me. 21 00:01:09,319 --> 00:01:12,080 Speaker 2: Now, Welcome, ho La, Lulu. It's great to be with you. 22 00:01:13,160 --> 00:01:15,720 Speaker 3: It's such a pleasure. It is such a pleasure to 23 00:01:15,760 --> 00:01:18,559 Speaker 3: have you on and to read this book. It's called 24 00:01:18,600 --> 00:01:20,840 Speaker 3: Once I Was You, and it is based around the 25 00:01:20,920 --> 00:01:24,679 Speaker 3: story of how you came to the United States for 26 00:01:24,720 --> 00:01:25,240 Speaker 3: the first time. 27 00:01:25,240 --> 00:01:26,039 Speaker 2: Tell us that story. 28 00:01:26,760 --> 00:01:30,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, well, it's an interesting story. I didn't actually know it. 29 00:01:31,120 --> 00:01:34,200 Speaker 1: Like a lot of us, we don't actually ask our parents. 30 00:01:34,280 --> 00:01:36,360 Speaker 1: So how exactly did I you know, you know that 31 00:01:36,400 --> 00:01:38,440 Speaker 1: you came. Like, for example, my whole family we were 32 00:01:38,440 --> 00:01:41,440 Speaker 1: born in Mexico, my dad in Tampico, the rest of 33 00:01:41,520 --> 00:01:44,440 Speaker 1: us in Mexico City. And Dad gets hired by the 34 00:01:44,520 --> 00:01:47,840 Speaker 1: University of Chicago. He's a medical doctor dedicated to research, 35 00:01:48,760 --> 00:01:52,120 Speaker 1: and long story short, he helps to create the cochlear implant. 36 00:01:52,440 --> 00:01:54,880 Speaker 2: He was an amazing human being. May he rest in peace. 37 00:01:56,000 --> 00:02:00,040 Speaker 1: So Dad was in Chicago, and my mom and the 38 00:02:00,080 --> 00:02:02,360 Speaker 1: four of us kids, I was the baby in her arms. 39 00:02:02,720 --> 00:02:05,400 Speaker 1: Get on a plane. It's the early nineteen sixties. We 40 00:02:05,440 --> 00:02:08,320 Speaker 1: fly from Mexico City to Dallas and change planes in 41 00:02:08,400 --> 00:02:10,799 Speaker 1: Dallas and then we're going to fly on to Chicago. 42 00:02:10,840 --> 00:02:13,720 Speaker 1: And when I finally found out this story when I 43 00:02:13,760 --> 00:02:17,040 Speaker 1: wrote Raising Raoul, which is a motherhood memoir that I 44 00:02:17,040 --> 00:02:20,120 Speaker 1: wrote like twenty years ago. You know, I found out 45 00:02:20,160 --> 00:02:22,120 Speaker 1: that there was this whole thing that happened at the 46 00:02:22,160 --> 00:02:26,320 Speaker 1: airport and that an immigration agent was like, you know, 47 00:02:26,440 --> 00:02:29,360 Speaker 1: saying that I had some weird skin thing and you know, 48 00:02:29,440 --> 00:02:31,960 Speaker 1: maybe had to put me in quarantine. And my mom 49 00:02:32,120 --> 00:02:33,760 Speaker 1: was like nah, And then I came and I saved 50 00:02:33,760 --> 00:02:35,000 Speaker 1: the day. You know, she didn't say it like this, 51 00:02:35,080 --> 00:02:35,800 Speaker 1: but basically it was. 52 00:02:35,800 --> 00:02:39,520 Speaker 2: Like me, Ma, Me, ma, Ma. You know, she's five 53 00:02:39,600 --> 00:02:40,160 Speaker 2: feet tall. 54 00:02:40,040 --> 00:02:41,520 Speaker 1: By the way, but stood up and like was like, 55 00:02:41,680 --> 00:02:44,400 Speaker 1: you know, had this kind of moment with this immigration agent, 56 00:02:44,440 --> 00:02:48,560 Speaker 1: and it was a story that I told kind of 57 00:02:48,600 --> 00:02:51,239 Speaker 1: like saying, wow, my mom is such a cool woman, 58 00:02:51,320 --> 00:02:54,200 Speaker 1: Like I understand where I get my powerful voice even 59 00:02:54,240 --> 00:02:56,959 Speaker 1: though she's tiny. She spoke back to an immigration agent. 60 00:02:58,040 --> 00:03:00,679 Speaker 1: And then in the writing of this book, is really 61 00:03:00,720 --> 00:03:04,560 Speaker 1: what happens is that I really understand what was happening there. 62 00:03:05,520 --> 00:03:08,080 Speaker 3: They were trying to separate you from your mother. I mean, 63 00:03:08,080 --> 00:03:10,360 Speaker 3: they basically told your mom that they were going to 64 00:03:10,480 --> 00:03:13,640 Speaker 3: take you away and put you in quarantine quote unquote, 65 00:03:14,040 --> 00:03:15,960 Speaker 3: and that she was free to go with her other children, 66 00:03:15,960 --> 00:03:17,320 Speaker 3: but that you would have to stay behind. 67 00:03:17,400 --> 00:03:22,359 Speaker 1: I mean, can you imagine like when my mom called 68 00:03:22,400 --> 00:03:25,440 Speaker 1: me in the midst of and you know, Lulu that 69 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:27,799 Speaker 1: I've been covering this story the entirety of my career. 70 00:03:27,840 --> 00:03:31,280 Speaker 1: Immigration writ large and. 71 00:03:31,320 --> 00:03:33,480 Speaker 2: My mom calls me at the airport. 72 00:03:33,800 --> 00:03:35,680 Speaker 1: I was flying from one you know, back when we 73 00:03:35,680 --> 00:03:39,800 Speaker 1: were flying around and in the midst of the height 74 00:03:39,840 --> 00:03:42,600 Speaker 1: of babies being put into cages, and we were hearing 75 00:03:42,640 --> 00:03:45,080 Speaker 1: the voices. You know, we knew this was happening. This 76 00:03:45,160 --> 00:03:48,960 Speaker 1: is not this is not begin with the Trump administration. 77 00:03:49,440 --> 00:03:53,200 Speaker 1: But anyway, Mom calls me and she's crying. She's like'skay, 78 00:03:54,120 --> 00:03:57,000 Speaker 1: it could have been me? Is I'm a ma Fuillo? 79 00:03:57,200 --> 00:03:59,280 Speaker 1: She was like, that was I could have been one 80 00:03:59,280 --> 00:04:03,720 Speaker 1: of those moms. And I swear to Lulu that my 81 00:04:03,880 --> 00:04:04,640 Speaker 1: heart dropped. 82 00:04:04,680 --> 00:04:05,840 Speaker 2: I was like, oh my god. 83 00:04:06,800 --> 00:04:10,000 Speaker 1: So it's not a story of like my mom, you know, 84 00:04:10,200 --> 00:04:14,120 Speaker 1: speaking back, it's I realize now, a story of trauma. 85 00:04:14,200 --> 00:04:16,800 Speaker 2: And that wouldn't have happened. 86 00:04:16,920 --> 00:04:19,800 Speaker 1: I think had I not written the book and had 87 00:04:19,880 --> 00:04:27,160 Speaker 1: the horror of immigration policies becomes so crystal clear, so inhumane, 88 00:04:27,480 --> 00:04:32,520 Speaker 1: so hurtful, and frankly now finally so public. 89 00:04:34,520 --> 00:04:37,760 Speaker 3: You, as you mentioned, were brought to Chicago, which is 90 00:04:37,800 --> 00:04:40,560 Speaker 3: where you grew up, but you always maintained your connection 91 00:04:40,600 --> 00:04:43,360 Speaker 3: to Mexico and your roots. You would go back and forth. 92 00:04:44,240 --> 00:04:45,919 Speaker 3: You came here on a green card. When did you 93 00:04:45,960 --> 00:04:51,000 Speaker 3: become a citizen? I asked this simply because that transition 94 00:04:51,160 --> 00:04:55,960 Speaker 3: of becoming an American, you said, was difficult for you. 95 00:04:55,960 --> 00:05:00,280 Speaker 3: You found it hard to sort of occupy these two spaces. 96 00:05:00,920 --> 00:05:03,279 Speaker 1: So it was great because in the writing of the book, 97 00:05:03,360 --> 00:05:06,240 Speaker 1: I actually had to like do the timeline, and then 98 00:05:06,279 --> 00:05:10,240 Speaker 1: I had to go back and find my citizenship. It 99 00:05:10,400 --> 00:05:13,760 Speaker 1: was actually I had just come back from a reporting 100 00:05:13,760 --> 00:05:16,960 Speaker 1: trip with Scott Simon. Scott and I were down in Salvadord. 101 00:05:17,040 --> 00:05:20,720 Speaker 1: It was December of nineteen eighty nine. Lao Fenciva de 102 00:05:20,800 --> 00:05:24,560 Speaker 1: Rochentanuebe the FML and offensive, the Gorilla warfare was happening 103 00:05:24,600 --> 00:05:27,840 Speaker 1: in San Salabadod and I went down to produce. Scott 104 00:05:28,800 --> 00:05:31,560 Speaker 1: and I came back and just a few days later 105 00:05:31,600 --> 00:05:35,240 Speaker 1: I took the oath. Look, the reason why it was 106 00:05:35,279 --> 00:05:39,680 Speaker 1: complicated was because way back then, maybe now I'm beginning 107 00:05:39,720 --> 00:05:42,360 Speaker 1: to understand, maybe it was because of that traumatic experience 108 00:05:42,360 --> 00:05:46,240 Speaker 1: in the airport in Dallas. I always kind of knew, like, 109 00:05:46,760 --> 00:05:49,760 Speaker 1: this isn't a certain thing for you, this thing about 110 00:05:49,760 --> 00:05:51,480 Speaker 1: you being able to come in and out of the 111 00:05:51,560 --> 00:05:53,800 Speaker 1: United States, the way you've done your whole life. You know, 112 00:05:53,880 --> 00:05:56,360 Speaker 1: now you're a woman, you're a journalist. You've been to Cuba, 113 00:05:56,400 --> 00:06:00,120 Speaker 1: you've been to Nicaragua, you've been to El Salvador. You 114 00:06:00,120 --> 00:06:03,000 Speaker 1: you know, there may be a time when they just say, hey, 115 00:06:03,040 --> 00:06:05,640 Speaker 1: you can't come back. And I understood that, and so 116 00:06:05,800 --> 00:06:07,799 Speaker 1: I have to be honest as I am in the memoir. 117 00:06:08,200 --> 00:06:11,320 Speaker 1: It was motivated in large part by fear that my 118 00:06:11,400 --> 00:06:13,560 Speaker 1: Green card could be taken away and that I could 119 00:06:13,560 --> 00:06:16,640 Speaker 1: not be allowed. And this was before this whole conversation 120 00:06:16,720 --> 00:06:20,120 Speaker 1: of like what's happening now? You know, this was way before. 121 00:06:20,120 --> 00:06:21,839 Speaker 1: It was a different time, but I think I kind 122 00:06:21,839 --> 00:06:25,039 Speaker 1: of I kind of knew it. So the thing that 123 00:06:25,080 --> 00:06:27,120 Speaker 1: happens when you become a citizen in this country is 124 00:06:27,160 --> 00:06:29,520 Speaker 1: you have to raise your right hand and you have 125 00:06:29,600 --> 00:06:32,760 Speaker 1: to swear that you will bear arms for this country. 126 00:06:33,520 --> 00:06:35,640 Speaker 1: And people who are born in this country, like my 127 00:06:35,680 --> 00:06:38,000 Speaker 1: own kids, haven't had to do that. When you have 128 00:06:38,080 --> 00:06:41,440 Speaker 1: to do that, you take this thing really seriously, you know, 129 00:06:41,640 --> 00:06:44,400 Speaker 1: like the Constitution and the Bill of Rights and you know, 130 00:06:44,800 --> 00:06:48,120 Speaker 1: all like, you take it really seriously. And I think 131 00:06:48,200 --> 00:06:51,360 Speaker 1: that's why because the book is. Certainly it's about immigration, 132 00:06:51,440 --> 00:06:55,280 Speaker 1: but it's also about like my struggle for democracy and 133 00:06:55,320 --> 00:06:57,960 Speaker 1: being seen as a journalist and taken seriously to be 134 00:06:58,000 --> 00:07:00,560 Speaker 1: that's all a part of democracy, and it just becomes 135 00:07:01,080 --> 00:07:02,920 Speaker 1: I mean, I was living it with a green card. 136 00:07:02,960 --> 00:07:07,359 Speaker 1: I was definitely understanding my role as a participant. But 137 00:07:07,440 --> 00:07:09,840 Speaker 1: when you raise that right hand, it's at a whole 138 00:07:09,840 --> 00:07:10,400 Speaker 1: other level. 139 00:07:10,960 --> 00:07:13,640 Speaker 3: Let's talk about your road to becoming a journalist. That 140 00:07:13,720 --> 00:07:16,840 Speaker 3: road led through NPR. In fact, my colleague Scott Simon 141 00:07:16,960 --> 00:07:23,640 Speaker 3: hired you. What is striking about what you detail is 142 00:07:23,680 --> 00:07:27,000 Speaker 3: the consistency of it. An executive told you back then 143 00:07:27,080 --> 00:07:30,200 Speaker 3: that you were rare, a well educated, well traveled Latina. 144 00:07:30,760 --> 00:07:33,040 Speaker 3: You came into the business when it was whiter and 145 00:07:33,160 --> 00:07:34,680 Speaker 3: even more male than it was now. 146 00:07:38,600 --> 00:07:40,440 Speaker 2: Yeah, it was. 147 00:07:42,160 --> 00:07:46,720 Speaker 1: You know, when I think back to those moments, it 148 00:07:46,760 --> 00:07:50,760 Speaker 1: was just life like I understood. I think what happened 149 00:07:50,800 --> 00:07:55,240 Speaker 1: to me is that I understood privilege. I you know, 150 00:07:55,400 --> 00:07:57,960 Speaker 1: my dad was a medical doctor. I mean, we were 151 00:07:58,000 --> 00:08:00,640 Speaker 1: not wealthy at all because he was a real church doctor. 152 00:08:00,720 --> 00:08:03,120 Speaker 1: But I went to public school. But then I went 153 00:08:03,160 --> 00:08:06,880 Speaker 1: to the University Chicago high school. I ended up at 154 00:08:06,880 --> 00:08:09,600 Speaker 1: Barnard College, which I didn't really realize that it was 155 00:08:09,640 --> 00:08:12,280 Speaker 1: like a Seven Sisters Ivy league. You know, I just 156 00:08:12,280 --> 00:08:14,760 Speaker 1: wanted to be in New York. I get this job 157 00:08:14,840 --> 00:08:19,240 Speaker 1: at NPR. I'm the first Latina. I mean I know it, 158 00:08:19,320 --> 00:08:21,880 Speaker 1: like there had been no other Latinas at NPR who 159 00:08:21,920 --> 00:08:24,320 Speaker 1: were not cleaning the offices. I was the first one 160 00:08:24,360 --> 00:08:29,560 Speaker 1: in the newsroom. And it was terrifying, you know, it 161 00:08:29,640 --> 00:08:34,400 Speaker 1: was really terrifying. I remember another famous NPR personality once 162 00:08:34,400 --> 00:08:36,480 Speaker 1: said to me after now I had been around the 163 00:08:36,520 --> 00:08:39,560 Speaker 1: block a long time and I was doing reporting, you know, 164 00:08:39,640 --> 00:08:43,560 Speaker 1: in gritty communities, which I loved to be in and 165 00:08:43,600 --> 00:08:46,040 Speaker 1: dispel the myth that they're dangerous, and this person said 166 00:08:46,040 --> 00:08:49,199 Speaker 1: to me, weren't you terrified to be in the South 167 00:08:49,240 --> 00:08:53,080 Speaker 1: Bronx doing that reporting? And I was like, no, I 168 00:08:53,160 --> 00:08:55,520 Speaker 1: know those communities, but this person would have never thought 169 00:08:55,520 --> 00:08:57,839 Speaker 1: to ask me if I was terrified the first day 170 00:08:57,880 --> 00:09:01,520 Speaker 1: I stepped foot at NPR as the first Latina, and 171 00:09:01,559 --> 00:09:03,679 Speaker 1: I was like, that's what I'm talking about, Like, we 172 00:09:03,760 --> 00:09:06,800 Speaker 1: all see the world from different perspectives, and that's why 173 00:09:06,840 --> 00:09:10,200 Speaker 1: we need so much representation across the media. 174 00:09:10,320 --> 00:09:11,240 Speaker 2: That's what it's about. 175 00:09:11,679 --> 00:09:16,600 Speaker 1: And so I basically was able to understand, like, oh ya, Memikha, 176 00:09:16,720 --> 00:09:19,800 Speaker 1: you have extraordinary privilege here. 177 00:09:22,120 --> 00:09:22,920 Speaker 2: It's scary. 178 00:09:22,960 --> 00:09:24,800 Speaker 1: You don't get the jokes. You are the first one. 179 00:09:24,880 --> 00:09:26,680 Speaker 1: You don't have a lot of friends here, you know. 180 00:09:26,800 --> 00:09:30,400 Speaker 1: I mean I didn't get the neighborhoods or anything. I 181 00:09:30,520 --> 00:09:36,080 Speaker 1: was lonely, but I knew that that privilege gave me responsibility. 182 00:09:36,080 --> 00:09:39,360 Speaker 1: And that's how I fought through every single day. And 183 00:09:39,480 --> 00:09:44,359 Speaker 1: I write very publicly about you know, my Sombrasbrita, my 184 00:09:44,520 --> 00:09:47,000 Speaker 1: best friend that accompanied met me everywhere, which is my 185 00:09:47,000 --> 00:09:52,240 Speaker 1: imposter syndrome, and what allowed me to break that syndrome down, 186 00:09:52,440 --> 00:09:54,120 Speaker 1: you know, literally force my. 187 00:09:54,240 --> 00:09:56,400 Speaker 2: Arm up when I was in those NPR auditorial me. 188 00:09:56,480 --> 00:09:58,600 Speaker 1: I mean I would literally take my elbow and push 189 00:09:58,600 --> 00:10:00,600 Speaker 1: it up because I was so scared. I'm like, you 190 00:10:00,679 --> 00:10:03,400 Speaker 1: have to do this, because you're the only one. You 191 00:10:03,480 --> 00:10:04,120 Speaker 1: have to do this. 192 00:10:05,080 --> 00:10:06,880 Speaker 3: Is that what drove you because you faced the same 193 00:10:06,880 --> 00:10:09,800 Speaker 3: thing at CNN. I mean you faced it throughout your career. 194 00:10:10,120 --> 00:10:14,480 Speaker 3: You were always dedicated in telling stories about people of color, 195 00:10:14,600 --> 00:10:18,199 Speaker 3: about how they live their full lives, their complex lives. 196 00:10:18,480 --> 00:10:21,040 Speaker 3: You know, you were a pioneer in this work. And 197 00:10:21,640 --> 00:10:24,880 Speaker 3: you know now we're at a moment when there's a 198 00:10:24,920 --> 00:10:30,320 Speaker 3: media reckoning about this. But back then, you know, so 199 00:10:30,520 --> 00:10:32,319 Speaker 3: much of the media didn't even know what they were missing. 200 00:10:33,400 --> 00:10:36,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's why, you know, I recently had a conversation 201 00:10:36,400 --> 00:10:38,079 Speaker 1: with fellow journalism and we were kind of having a 202 00:10:38,120 --> 00:10:41,880 Speaker 1: reckoning moment because of things this person had said that 203 00:10:42,200 --> 00:10:46,079 Speaker 1: they didn't realize were actually really hurtful to a journalist 204 00:10:46,240 --> 00:10:49,960 Speaker 1: like me. When you're when a white colleague says something 205 00:10:50,000 --> 00:10:55,160 Speaker 1: to you and you're a journalist of color or the first, 206 00:10:55,679 --> 00:10:59,000 Speaker 1: this can break you. And I don't think that they 207 00:11:00,080 --> 00:11:01,800 Speaker 1: realize the power of their words. So when we talk 208 00:11:01,840 --> 00:11:04,440 Speaker 1: about allyship, that's one thing to do is to like 209 00:11:04,520 --> 00:11:06,520 Speaker 1: realize the power of your words. So I write about 210 00:11:06,520 --> 00:11:09,680 Speaker 1: you know, people were not saying nice things to me. 211 00:11:09,679 --> 00:11:12,240 Speaker 1: They would say, oh, you have an agenda. We know 212 00:11:12,280 --> 00:11:15,480 Speaker 1: your Latino agenda. We know you have an immigrant agenda. 213 00:11:16,200 --> 00:11:17,960 Speaker 1: You know, why do you say your name like that? 214 00:11:18,080 --> 00:11:19,640 Speaker 1: Why do you say it in Spanish? I mean they 215 00:11:19,640 --> 00:11:23,480 Speaker 1: would write hate letters to NPR, just like you know 216 00:11:23,600 --> 00:11:27,319 Speaker 1: at CNN. They were criticizing the way I looked, you know, 217 00:11:27,600 --> 00:11:32,240 Speaker 1: my hair, all of these things, and that is first 218 00:11:32,240 --> 00:11:33,680 Speaker 1: of all, we didn't have context. Do you have to 219 00:11:33,679 --> 00:11:35,360 Speaker 1: remember I was the only one. So like, who was 220 00:11:35,360 --> 00:11:41,560 Speaker 1: I commiserating with? Like I had other Latina journalists. And 221 00:11:41,640 --> 00:11:43,719 Speaker 1: I love the fact that we are now public that 222 00:11:43,960 --> 00:11:46,400 Speaker 1: I write about this group that I helped to create, 223 00:11:46,440 --> 00:11:49,640 Speaker 1: which is called LIPS, along with Rossana Rossado, who is 224 00:11:49,679 --> 00:11:51,160 Speaker 1: now the Secretary of State of. 225 00:11:51,080 --> 00:11:52,800 Speaker 2: New York, a former journalist. 226 00:11:53,600 --> 00:11:57,160 Speaker 1: It's latinas in power, sort of just a group of 227 00:11:57,240 --> 00:12:01,480 Speaker 1: Latina journalists who wanted to see that's how we began 228 00:12:01,600 --> 00:12:03,920 Speaker 1: to commiserate. But I, in my ser I was the 229 00:12:03,960 --> 00:12:06,560 Speaker 1: only one. And so you just I mean, I don't 230 00:12:06,559 --> 00:12:08,640 Speaker 1: really like this saying you just kind of buckle up 231 00:12:08,679 --> 00:12:10,480 Speaker 1: and do it. But basically that's what we had. 232 00:12:11,240 --> 00:12:12,040 Speaker 2: We didn't. 233 00:12:13,640 --> 00:12:21,320 Speaker 1: I mean, sexual harassment comments, racist comments, degrading comments, belittling comments, 234 00:12:21,400 --> 00:12:26,480 Speaker 1: sexist comments, ooh all the things, Oh, all the things. 235 00:12:27,840 --> 00:12:29,640 Speaker 1: And then you would go home and just you know, 236 00:12:30,000 --> 00:12:31,920 Speaker 1: come back and try to do a great job of 237 00:12:31,960 --> 00:12:33,280 Speaker 1: being a journalist the next day. 238 00:12:34,280 --> 00:12:36,319 Speaker 3: I want to talk about something that is in the book, 239 00:12:36,520 --> 00:12:39,880 Speaker 3: very early on, what happened one summer when you were fifteen. 240 00:12:40,400 --> 00:12:43,160 Speaker 2: You went public about this when the Me Too movement 241 00:12:43,240 --> 00:12:44,400 Speaker 2: took off. You were raped. 242 00:12:46,720 --> 00:12:49,800 Speaker 3: I want to talk about the decision to talk about 243 00:12:49,840 --> 00:12:53,040 Speaker 3: it openly during the Me Too movement and to write 244 00:12:53,080 --> 00:12:55,720 Speaker 3: about it in this book, because in the book you 245 00:12:55,720 --> 00:12:57,959 Speaker 3: describe how you basically lie to yourself about what had 246 00:12:57,960 --> 00:13:00,960 Speaker 3: happened and you had hidden it is what is the 247 00:13:01,160 --> 00:13:05,320 Speaker 3: responsibility do you feel to talk about that publicly as 248 00:13:05,360 --> 00:13:06,160 Speaker 3: a public figure. 249 00:13:06,440 --> 00:13:07,800 Speaker 2: Yeah? No, that was hard. 250 00:13:07,840 --> 00:13:09,720 Speaker 1: I mean I have to say the reason why I 251 00:13:09,760 --> 00:13:11,760 Speaker 1: decided to write about it, honestly was because of what 252 00:13:11,840 --> 00:13:16,760 Speaker 1: happened with doctor Christine Blasi Ford and Brett Kevanaugh. I 253 00:13:16,800 --> 00:13:19,720 Speaker 1: think at that point I had already gone into therapy 254 00:13:20,360 --> 00:13:26,960 Speaker 1: a year before because my life, my marriage, my understanding 255 00:13:26,960 --> 00:13:29,439 Speaker 1: of who I was as a woman was being challenged. 256 00:13:30,480 --> 00:13:33,800 Speaker 1: I write about almost losing my family. I mean it 257 00:13:33,920 --> 00:13:36,160 Speaker 1: was like whoo, it was really I mean, you know, 258 00:13:36,240 --> 00:13:39,120 Speaker 1: there was death, it was it was a difficult time. 259 00:13:39,679 --> 00:13:41,920 Speaker 1: And so when I started doing therapy, you know, my 260 00:13:42,080 --> 00:13:44,400 Speaker 1: therapists start, we started talking about past drama and then 261 00:13:44,440 --> 00:13:47,360 Speaker 1: all of a sudden, You're like, geez. I mean I 262 00:13:47,480 --> 00:13:50,640 Speaker 1: used to refer to this Lulu. I it's a terrible thing, 263 00:13:50,679 --> 00:13:52,760 Speaker 1: but I used to call it a baby rape, like 264 00:13:52,840 --> 00:13:55,120 Speaker 1: it was a mini rape. It wasn't like a real rape, 265 00:13:55,440 --> 00:13:58,280 Speaker 1: you know, because like I went up there with him, No, 266 00:13:58,840 --> 00:14:02,760 Speaker 1: it was a rape. And that is the thing that 267 00:14:02,880 --> 00:14:07,000 Speaker 1: just kind of became unlocked when I saw thirteen Reasons Why, 268 00:14:07,360 --> 00:14:09,840 Speaker 1: and I was like, oh my god, I finally understand 269 00:14:09,880 --> 00:14:14,040 Speaker 1: like being triggered, that's what happened to me. And I 270 00:14:14,080 --> 00:14:16,720 Speaker 1: was in the midst of doing therapy, and thank god, 271 00:14:17,559 --> 00:14:20,720 Speaker 1: I have an amazing husband, the artist Ed mont Bettis, 272 00:14:21,040 --> 00:14:24,160 Speaker 1: who loves me and was, you know, patient, and we 273 00:14:24,240 --> 00:14:27,840 Speaker 1: did lots of therapy. And the reason why I want 274 00:14:27,880 --> 00:14:31,960 Speaker 1: to talk about it is because I held on to this, 275 00:14:32,040 --> 00:14:36,360 Speaker 1: I didn't realize how much it was impacting. Just like 276 00:14:36,520 --> 00:14:40,880 Speaker 1: doctor Christine blasi Ford, everybody was looking at her and like, yo, girl, 277 00:14:40,880 --> 00:14:42,560 Speaker 1: come on, this happened to you when you were fifteen. 278 00:14:42,600 --> 00:14:45,560 Speaker 1: Come on, you know, like lighten up, like come on, 279 00:14:45,680 --> 00:14:49,680 Speaker 1: and it's and that's easy for people to say until 280 00:14:49,720 --> 00:14:52,240 Speaker 1: you realize what happens when it happens to you. And 281 00:14:52,280 --> 00:14:56,080 Speaker 1: I think so many women in that moment in history, 282 00:14:56,200 --> 00:14:58,200 Speaker 1: all of us were kind of saying like whoa wait 283 00:14:58,240 --> 00:14:59,560 Speaker 1: a second, wait, that was? 284 00:15:00,080 --> 00:15:02,320 Speaker 2: That was? And so I wanted to write about it. 285 00:15:02,360 --> 00:15:07,200 Speaker 1: Also because Latinas we don't often talk about this very publicly. 286 00:15:07,280 --> 00:15:11,200 Speaker 1: We you know, this happened in Mexico. I mean, my 287 00:15:11,320 --> 00:15:16,400 Speaker 1: mom didn't know. I had to tell her and that 288 00:15:16,640 --> 00:15:17,520 Speaker 1: was really hard. 289 00:15:17,640 --> 00:15:18,280 Speaker 2: They were so. 290 00:15:18,400 --> 00:15:24,400 Speaker 1: Sad and I should have listened to my mom. She said, no, Muchaco, 291 00:15:25,400 --> 00:15:26,440 Speaker 1: don't don't go up. 292 00:15:26,360 --> 00:15:26,840 Speaker 2: There with him. 293 00:15:27,120 --> 00:15:30,000 Speaker 1: And I was like, Mom, I'm an independent, sixteen year 294 00:15:30,080 --> 00:15:33,360 Speaker 1: old American young woman. Don't tell me what to do, 295 00:15:33,800 --> 00:15:37,320 Speaker 1: even if I'm in Mexico. And I wish I had listened. 296 00:15:37,360 --> 00:15:41,000 Speaker 1: She could see something in him that I couldn't. And 297 00:15:41,080 --> 00:15:43,920 Speaker 1: he was a predator and he knew what he was 298 00:15:43,920 --> 00:15:46,560 Speaker 1: going to do, and that's like that really kind of 299 00:15:46,600 --> 00:15:48,400 Speaker 1: came to me when I was like, damn, you went 300 00:15:48,480 --> 00:15:50,640 Speaker 1: up there thinking this was going to be your first 301 00:15:50,680 --> 00:15:53,680 Speaker 1: time romantic and what you didn't realize is that you 302 00:15:53,720 --> 00:15:55,600 Speaker 1: were with a predator who had a plan and he 303 00:15:55,680 --> 00:15:59,160 Speaker 1: was going to assault you no matter what. The good news, 304 00:15:59,640 --> 00:16:03,120 Speaker 1: Lulu is that after you write about it and you 305 00:16:03,200 --> 00:16:06,360 Speaker 1: cry about it and you do therapy, you know, there's 306 00:16:06,520 --> 00:16:08,760 Speaker 1: there's a lot of there's healing on the other side. 307 00:16:08,840 --> 00:16:10,880 Speaker 2: And so I'm I'm. 308 00:16:10,760 --> 00:16:26,960 Speaker 1: A really happy, sensual, satisfied married woman coming up on 309 00:16:27,080 --> 00:16:32,720 Speaker 1: Latino USA. My conversation with Lulu Garcia Navarro of NPR continues, 310 00:16:33,120 --> 00:17:25,960 Speaker 1: stay with us, Hey, we're back. We're going to continue 311 00:17:26,000 --> 00:17:29,160 Speaker 1: now with an extended version of the conversation I had 312 00:17:29,200 --> 00:17:33,720 Speaker 1: with Lulu Garciana Varro for NPR's weekend edition. It's about 313 00:17:33,720 --> 00:17:36,720 Speaker 1: my book Once I Was You, a memoir of love 314 00:17:36,880 --> 00:17:39,760 Speaker 1: and hate in a tour in America. Let's get back 315 00:17:39,800 --> 00:17:40,560 Speaker 1: to the conversation. 316 00:17:41,600 --> 00:17:44,000 Speaker 3: I want to talk about this political moment because, among 317 00:17:44,040 --> 00:17:46,760 Speaker 3: your many hats as TV analysts, so much of the 318 00:17:46,800 --> 00:17:49,400 Speaker 3: book talks about the history of immigration in this country. 319 00:17:50,200 --> 00:17:52,240 Speaker 3: And you make the point that the erasure of Latinos 320 00:17:52,240 --> 00:17:54,960 Speaker 3: goes back to the so called discovery of this country 321 00:17:55,200 --> 00:17:58,879 Speaker 3: by Europeans. You know, we hear about the Pilgrims here, 322 00:17:58,880 --> 00:18:01,600 Speaker 3: but not about the first colonial settlement by the Spanish 323 00:18:01,680 --> 00:18:04,520 Speaker 3: in Florida. That it goes back to the very founding 324 00:18:04,560 --> 00:18:09,600 Speaker 3: of this country. How you know, Latino's contributions have been ignored. 325 00:18:10,160 --> 00:18:14,560 Speaker 1: Spanish was spoken on this land before English, first, all 326 00:18:14,640 --> 00:18:19,120 Speaker 1: respect right to the indigenous languages, multiple languages that existed 327 00:18:19,200 --> 00:18:23,040 Speaker 1: before anybody got here, so let's be clear. But then 328 00:18:23,080 --> 00:18:27,399 Speaker 1: it was the Spaniard's arrival in southern Florida that was 329 00:18:27,440 --> 00:18:33,000 Speaker 1: the first contact. The second encampment or community was actually 330 00:18:33,080 --> 00:18:39,359 Speaker 1: Santa Fe and then Jamestown, then the Pilgrims arrived. So 331 00:18:41,160 --> 00:18:43,919 Speaker 1: you know, I also say something that you know is 332 00:18:44,040 --> 00:18:46,439 Speaker 1: very shocking, but I want people to understand that if 333 00:18:46,520 --> 00:18:48,600 Speaker 1: you look at history, part of what I'm trying to 334 00:18:48,600 --> 00:18:50,440 Speaker 1: do with the book is, yeah, I'm talking about my life, 335 00:18:50,480 --> 00:18:52,439 Speaker 1: but I'm also trying to understand the history of this 336 00:18:52,480 --> 00:18:55,240 Speaker 1: country and how we're taught it. And so we are 337 00:18:55,280 --> 00:18:58,600 Speaker 1: taught about the Pilgrims, you know, I mean that's how 338 00:18:58,640 --> 00:19:01,920 Speaker 1: I learned, right, But you're you're not really taught about 339 00:19:02,119 --> 00:19:04,600 Speaker 1: how the lead up and you're always taught about this 340 00:19:04,680 --> 00:19:08,000 Speaker 1: perspective from frankly white men because they're the ones who 341 00:19:08,000 --> 00:19:11,239 Speaker 1: are writing the history books. The indigenous people could have 342 00:19:11,280 --> 00:19:13,639 Speaker 1: looked at the Pilgrims and said, hey, who are you? 343 00:19:13,640 --> 00:19:16,480 Speaker 1: You don't have any permission, who gave you papers, who 344 00:19:16,520 --> 00:19:19,560 Speaker 1: gave you a right to be here? So part of 345 00:19:19,600 --> 00:19:22,840 Speaker 1: what we tried to do is to reframe history. I 346 00:19:22,840 --> 00:19:25,040 Speaker 1: think that is the moment that we're living through right now, 347 00:19:25,760 --> 00:19:28,760 Speaker 1: where people are asking questions, and in that sense, this 348 00:19:28,840 --> 00:19:32,200 Speaker 1: is a beautiful time. You know, I was a kid 349 00:19:32,359 --> 00:19:35,640 Speaker 1: in the nineteen sixties, but I kind of felt that 350 00:19:35,760 --> 00:19:40,320 Speaker 1: and I'm feeling it now. And so as scary as 351 00:19:40,320 --> 00:19:44,160 Speaker 1: this moment is, if we place ourselves in history, then 352 00:19:44,200 --> 00:19:47,720 Speaker 1: we realize that we all have a role in this. 353 00:19:48,200 --> 00:19:51,440 Speaker 1: That's why I wanted to kind of write very intimately 354 00:19:51,520 --> 00:19:55,960 Speaker 1: about my experience connecting with democracy. You know, my mom 355 00:19:56,320 --> 00:19:58,520 Speaker 1: takes the four of us kids to a protest, to 356 00:19:58,560 --> 00:20:03,120 Speaker 1: a demonstration, a civil rights demonstration in High Park in Chicago. 357 00:20:03,880 --> 00:20:07,320 Speaker 1: We all had green cards, but like she understood that 358 00:20:07,359 --> 00:20:11,479 Speaker 1: democracy is a verb, it is something you participate in. 359 00:20:11,600 --> 00:20:14,399 Speaker 1: And so I wanted to tell a lot of this 360 00:20:14,560 --> 00:20:16,360 Speaker 1: history because I wanted to reframe it. 361 00:20:17,080 --> 00:20:17,920 Speaker 2: This does bring us. 362 00:20:17,880 --> 00:20:20,960 Speaker 3: To today because this is the most anti immigrant government 363 00:20:21,000 --> 00:20:24,640 Speaker 3: in recent American history. Asylum has stopped, now legal immigration 364 00:20:24,680 --> 00:20:28,600 Speaker 3: has stopped because of the pandemic, supposedly, and we are 365 00:20:28,600 --> 00:20:31,200 Speaker 3: at a moment when immigration is at the very crux 366 00:20:31,400 --> 00:20:36,879 Speaker 3: of the country that America imagines itself to be. And 367 00:20:36,960 --> 00:20:39,680 Speaker 3: there is a huge portion of this country that does 368 00:20:39,720 --> 00:20:43,200 Speaker 3: not want this to be a nation of immigrants, and 369 00:20:43,720 --> 00:20:46,200 Speaker 3: many things have been done in the service of that 370 00:20:46,359 --> 00:20:50,320 Speaker 3: vision by this administration. And You've been very vocal about that, 371 00:20:50,560 --> 00:20:52,800 Speaker 3: and I'm wondering as we sit on the cusp of 372 00:20:52,840 --> 00:20:57,600 Speaker 3: an election that is very consequential, where you think that 373 00:20:57,720 --> 00:21:00,879 Speaker 3: vision is at. Because you use the word hate in 374 00:21:00,920 --> 00:21:03,879 Speaker 3: the title of this book after the Olpassive shooting, we 375 00:21:03,920 --> 00:21:05,760 Speaker 3: have certainly seen hate of. 376 00:21:05,680 --> 00:21:07,400 Speaker 2: Immigrants, but is it more than that? 377 00:21:08,240 --> 00:21:11,280 Speaker 1: Well, the reason why there is this continual hate is 378 00:21:11,320 --> 00:21:17,639 Speaker 1: because there's this continual, repetitive narrative about immigrants. So the 379 00:21:17,680 --> 00:21:19,760 Speaker 1: reason why I needed to understand this in this book 380 00:21:19,840 --> 00:21:22,679 Speaker 1: is because I where I'm sitting right now in Harlem, 381 00:21:22,800 --> 00:21:25,720 Speaker 1: New York City, is you know, literally a stone's throw 382 00:21:25,800 --> 00:21:30,240 Speaker 1: from the Statue of Liberty. So that's the message we're getting, right, Oh, 383 00:21:30,280 --> 00:21:32,960 Speaker 1: the Statue of Liberty, bring us your tired, you're poor, 384 00:21:33,080 --> 00:21:35,879 Speaker 1: those yearning to be free. And then it's like, you know, 385 00:21:35,920 --> 00:21:38,520 Speaker 1: the record that goes because it's like wait, but that 386 00:21:38,600 --> 00:21:42,000 Speaker 1: go that's not what we're living. And that's why I 387 00:21:42,040 --> 00:21:44,760 Speaker 1: needed to understand the policies. It's, you know, this notion 388 00:21:44,840 --> 00:21:47,880 Speaker 1: that this country is like welcoming immigrants and so open. 389 00:21:47,920 --> 00:21:50,480 Speaker 1: The numbers are very small. I mean now, as you say, 390 00:21:50,600 --> 00:21:57,680 Speaker 1: it's zero zero immigration into the United States legally, and 391 00:21:58,400 --> 00:22:01,280 Speaker 1: you know, for people applying for Regigi status, as you say, 392 00:22:01,640 --> 00:22:06,160 Speaker 1: supposedly because of the pandemic, but that was happening. It's 393 00:22:06,200 --> 00:22:11,240 Speaker 1: been the run up all the way to this point, so. 394 00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:13,120 Speaker 2: It's not new. 395 00:22:13,960 --> 00:22:16,560 Speaker 1: You know, if you think about the Chinese Exclusion Act, 396 00:22:16,880 --> 00:22:19,320 Speaker 1: it goes back all the way there. And then we 397 00:22:19,359 --> 00:22:21,520 Speaker 1: have to talk about this ugly thing, which is white 398 00:22:21,560 --> 00:22:25,359 Speaker 1: supremacy and why does it exist. And so the story 399 00:22:25,400 --> 00:22:29,359 Speaker 1: of this anti immigrant hatred is intimately tied to the 400 00:22:29,400 --> 00:22:32,760 Speaker 1: hatred of black bodies, to the hatred of indigenous bodies, 401 00:22:33,880 --> 00:22:37,000 Speaker 1: and so we have to make those connections. Right now, 402 00:22:37,000 --> 00:22:39,760 Speaker 1: we're living through a moment where the entire country is 403 00:22:40,280 --> 00:22:42,879 Speaker 1: yet again and for me, you know, the Black Lives 404 00:22:42,920 --> 00:22:47,919 Speaker 1: Matter movement began the day a black enslaved person arrived 405 00:22:47,920 --> 00:22:52,399 Speaker 1: at this country in chains trafficked here. But this anti 406 00:22:52,560 --> 00:22:55,800 Speaker 1: immigrant hatred and it is hatred. And I had to 407 00:22:55,840 --> 00:22:57,600 Speaker 1: I really struggled, like do I want to put hate 408 00:22:57,600 --> 00:22:58,080 Speaker 1: in the title? 409 00:22:58,119 --> 00:22:58,880 Speaker 2: Do I want to put hate? 410 00:22:58,880 --> 00:23:01,000 Speaker 1: And I'm like, well, let's talk about it, because you 411 00:23:01,040 --> 00:23:03,640 Speaker 1: don't have to stay in hate too. You can transform 412 00:23:03,680 --> 00:23:08,560 Speaker 1: hate into love. And so that's why people have this. 413 00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:16,840 Speaker 1: They learned it from anti indigenous, anti black hatred. And 414 00:23:16,880 --> 00:23:21,920 Speaker 1: now it's focused on this particular group of immigrants, which, 415 00:23:21,960 --> 00:23:27,479 Speaker 1: by the way, are black, are brown, are from every 416 00:23:27,600 --> 00:23:30,160 Speaker 1: country in the world. So this notion that there are 417 00:23:30,200 --> 00:23:35,520 Speaker 1: not black immigrants, it's untrue. Many of those detention facilities 418 00:23:35,560 --> 00:23:39,160 Speaker 1: are filled with men and women from Africa and the Caribbean, 419 00:23:39,320 --> 00:23:46,440 Speaker 1: Jamaica for example. So we all now have to have 420 00:23:46,520 --> 00:23:50,600 Speaker 1: an awakening, you know, as we're doing with the Black 421 00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:55,200 Speaker 1: Lives Matter moment, everybody should be questioning their privilege, their 422 00:23:55,280 --> 00:23:59,280 Speaker 1: understanding of history, their role right, and in terms of immigration, 423 00:23:59,359 --> 00:24:02,439 Speaker 1: it's the same thing. Wait, how is this happening? And 424 00:24:02,560 --> 00:24:04,639 Speaker 1: it is happening in many ways. You know, you've seen 425 00:24:04,680 --> 00:24:09,359 Speaker 1: protests where where those two thoughts, right, black lives matter 426 00:24:09,480 --> 00:24:12,639 Speaker 1: and you know, and and stop ice from taking children 427 00:24:12,640 --> 00:24:17,720 Speaker 1: from their parents are connected. What was hard about this 428 00:24:17,800 --> 00:24:19,879 Speaker 1: book was really having to come to terms with the 429 00:24:19,880 --> 00:24:24,320 Speaker 1: fact that it's both the Republicans and the Democrats that 430 00:24:24,400 --> 00:24:28,280 Speaker 1: have which had been really really problematic for immigrants across 431 00:24:28,320 --> 00:24:30,480 Speaker 1: the board and historically. 432 00:24:31,040 --> 00:24:33,800 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, uh. There is a headline in The 433 00:24:33,800 --> 00:24:38,240 Speaker 3: Atlantic magazine right now called the Neglect of Latino Voters. 434 00:24:38,280 --> 00:24:41,560 Speaker 3: It's a familiar story of taking the Latino vote for granted, 435 00:24:42,160 --> 00:24:44,719 Speaker 3: but it's you know, wider than that. It's the erasure 436 00:24:44,760 --> 00:24:46,920 Speaker 3: of Latinos and their stories in the media, in every 437 00:24:46,920 --> 00:24:49,760 Speaker 3: corner of life, which you talk about in the book 438 00:24:50,560 --> 00:24:55,720 Speaker 3: and you have spoken about publicly. Why is this still happening? 439 00:24:56,160 --> 00:25:00,520 Speaker 3: Because you can talk about having a view of immigration 440 00:25:00,600 --> 00:25:03,800 Speaker 3: in this country and it being informed by your political stripe, 441 00:25:03,840 --> 00:25:07,120 Speaker 3: and you have a right to see things the way 442 00:25:07,119 --> 00:25:11,560 Speaker 3: that you see them, But Latinos and their stories really 443 00:25:11,560 --> 00:25:12,360 Speaker 3: do get ignored. 444 00:25:12,760 --> 00:25:15,919 Speaker 1: I mean, I don't I wish I had an answer, Lulu, 445 00:25:15,960 --> 00:25:18,320 Speaker 1: because that is like the sixty four million dollar question 446 00:25:18,359 --> 00:25:22,680 Speaker 1: here is like, wait a second, where are the weekly 447 00:25:22,840 --> 00:25:26,240 Speaker 1: or bi weekly columnists at every single major newspaper? 448 00:25:26,440 --> 00:25:27,960 Speaker 2: You know, it shouldn't be just one. 449 00:25:28,280 --> 00:25:31,400 Speaker 1: You publish one up ed by you know, a Latino 450 00:25:31,400 --> 00:25:33,440 Speaker 1: writer or Latino writer, and then you don't publish again 451 00:25:33,480 --> 00:25:38,679 Speaker 1: for another six months. Guess Isso my argument is that, look, 452 00:25:39,119 --> 00:25:42,120 Speaker 1: you're a journalist. I'm not giving it. I'm a journalist 453 00:25:42,200 --> 00:25:45,359 Speaker 1: at my core. You may see us, you you know, 454 00:25:45,560 --> 00:25:47,960 Speaker 1: want to politicize this and see us as Latinos and 455 00:25:48,040 --> 00:25:51,960 Speaker 1: Latins are we are journalists in our core, and so 456 00:25:52,440 --> 00:25:56,159 Speaker 1: us being invisible in the world of journalism means the 457 00:25:56,200 --> 00:26:01,080 Speaker 1: whole country suffers. Why because we are the fastest growing 458 00:26:01,119 --> 00:26:05,280 Speaker 1: demographic group in this country, along with Asians. Our GDP 459 00:26:05,560 --> 00:26:09,280 Speaker 1: were you to count, it is like larger than India's. 460 00:26:09,320 --> 00:26:12,680 Speaker 1: If you take the Latino market, we're trillions of dollars. 461 00:26:13,119 --> 00:26:17,160 Speaker 1: We are young and youthful and hopeful. If you look, 462 00:26:17,240 --> 00:26:19,480 Speaker 1: oh ya, may, I went to the deli the other day, 463 00:26:19,600 --> 00:26:22,600 Speaker 1: the Yemeni owned deli down the street. The Mexican guy 464 00:26:22,600 --> 00:26:25,200 Speaker 1: who makes the sandwiches, you know, and he's been working 465 00:26:25,240 --> 00:26:29,119 Speaker 1: through the pandemic. Get us up by sanmostas, you know, 466 00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:32,520 Speaker 1: and I'm always like, you know, well, democracy challenged, always 467 00:26:32,560 --> 00:26:35,160 Speaker 1: kind of like, you know, upset about things. 468 00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:35,880 Speaker 2: And he says, nope. 469 00:26:35,920 --> 00:26:38,800 Speaker 1: It's like, you know, Mastra, what is the ESBNN you know, 470 00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:42,120 Speaker 1: better days are coming. I'm like, oh ya, may that's 471 00:26:42,560 --> 00:26:45,320 Speaker 1: that's the Latino Latina spirit of like, but you know, 472 00:26:46,359 --> 00:26:48,960 Speaker 1: there's gonna be something better. And the fact that we 473 00:26:49,160 --> 00:26:53,199 Speaker 1: don't see that, that we're not on every single nightly 474 00:26:53,359 --> 00:26:57,119 Speaker 1: news program, national news program across the cable, not just 475 00:26:57,200 --> 00:27:01,800 Speaker 1: one anchor but several again, and it's frustrating for us. 476 00:27:02,680 --> 00:27:07,600 Speaker 1: It's debilitating to feel so invisible. But we're not going anywhere, 477 00:27:08,040 --> 00:27:12,000 Speaker 1: So y'all are suffering. Y'all are going to bear the consequences, 478 00:27:12,440 --> 00:27:15,240 Speaker 1: and there will be reckoning to that. And what we're 479 00:27:15,240 --> 00:27:17,840 Speaker 1: trying to do is, Hello, let's make it so that 480 00:27:17,840 --> 00:27:21,480 Speaker 1: we're like moving in this positive tip together as opposed 481 00:27:21,480 --> 00:27:25,960 Speaker 1: to making us feel so invisible that the anger gets 482 00:27:26,040 --> 00:27:26,920 Speaker 1: to be immeasurable. 483 00:27:26,920 --> 00:27:28,119 Speaker 2: And we're not there yet. 484 00:27:28,800 --> 00:27:31,560 Speaker 3: You are the only Latina who heads a nonprofit news organization, 485 00:27:31,640 --> 00:27:34,720 Speaker 3: Futuro Media, which makes Latino USA. And I know you 486 00:27:34,760 --> 00:27:37,000 Speaker 3: get asked this all the time, but I'm going to 487 00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:40,679 Speaker 3: ask it again because I think it's important. What advice 488 00:27:40,720 --> 00:27:43,640 Speaker 3: do you have for those coming up in this business, 489 00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:47,240 Speaker 3: but really any business for Latinos, for people of color 490 00:27:47,600 --> 00:27:48,639 Speaker 3: right now in this moment. 491 00:27:48,760 --> 00:27:50,680 Speaker 2: Don't give up. Don't give up. 492 00:27:50,840 --> 00:27:53,080 Speaker 1: Oh my god, this is what I because, you know, Lulu, 493 00:27:53,080 --> 00:27:56,119 Speaker 1: I'm also a professor at Barnard because I love to 494 00:27:56,160 --> 00:27:58,520 Speaker 1: say I'm Mexican. I have sixteen jobs. I always say 495 00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:02,240 Speaker 1: yes to work, so you know, I tell my students, 496 00:28:02,280 --> 00:28:07,320 Speaker 1: my staff, you know, don't give up. You know we 497 00:28:07,480 --> 00:28:10,720 Speaker 1: created I helped to create the newsroom that I envisioned 498 00:28:11,000 --> 00:28:14,160 Speaker 1: when I first stepped into NPR and I was like, wait, 499 00:28:14,200 --> 00:28:16,800 Speaker 1: this doesn't look like the newsroom. Wait, this is like 500 00:28:16,880 --> 00:28:21,360 Speaker 1: it's frankly too white. Our newsroom is so diverse. It's 501 00:28:21,440 --> 00:28:23,840 Speaker 1: like the newsroom we would say of the future of 502 00:28:23,840 --> 00:28:26,080 Speaker 1: the fudu. But the fuduo is right here, right present. 503 00:28:27,080 --> 00:28:32,159 Speaker 1: And so we need you. We need you to power 504 00:28:32,320 --> 00:28:35,320 Speaker 1: through the invisibility that you feel. 505 00:28:35,960 --> 00:28:36,600 Speaker 2: It is real. 506 00:28:37,280 --> 00:28:40,840 Speaker 1: We're not going to gaslight you. You being invisible, feeling invisible 507 00:28:41,320 --> 00:28:44,800 Speaker 1: as immigrants, Latinos, latin As, people of color, queer people, 508 00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:51,440 Speaker 1: trans people, yes, Muslim people. Yes, we understand your invisibility, 509 00:28:51,800 --> 00:28:56,320 Speaker 1: but you cannot give up. This is like a historical 510 00:28:56,560 --> 00:29:00,560 Speaker 1: requirement and do reading right. That's one of the things 511 00:29:00,560 --> 00:29:02,600 Speaker 1: that helped me to understand my role as a journalist 512 00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:04,200 Speaker 1: and why I was never going to give up. Is 513 00:29:04,240 --> 00:29:07,840 Speaker 1: my continuum. I am tied to Frederick Douglass. I am 514 00:29:07,960 --> 00:29:12,440 Speaker 1: tied to Hoovita Ida, an American Latina journalist from Atbaso. 515 00:29:12,520 --> 00:29:14,280 Speaker 1: I am tied to Ida b. 516 00:29:14,440 --> 00:29:14,840 Speaker 2: Wells. 517 00:29:15,560 --> 00:29:18,440 Speaker 1: I am tied to Ed Bradley, May he rest in 518 00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:22,400 Speaker 1: peace from sixty minutes. I am part of that legacy 519 00:29:23,520 --> 00:29:27,040 Speaker 1: of journalists. So for the journalists, you are part of 520 00:29:27,080 --> 00:29:29,680 Speaker 1: that legacy. And that's why you don't give up. Go 521 00:29:29,760 --> 00:29:32,640 Speaker 1: stand at the Frederick Douglas statue and get his wisdom. 522 00:29:33,040 --> 00:29:35,120 Speaker 1: And for the rest of you who are in other fields, 523 00:29:36,200 --> 00:29:38,640 Speaker 1: you can't even realize how important you are because you 524 00:29:38,720 --> 00:29:40,880 Speaker 1: are never being told how important you are. 525 00:29:40,920 --> 00:29:41,880 Speaker 2: But look at the data. 526 00:29:42,280 --> 00:29:45,720 Speaker 1: You're leading the country in terms of politics, in terms 527 00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:50,000 Speaker 1: of movement, in terms of arts culture. So own your power, 528 00:29:50,240 --> 00:29:55,160 Speaker 1: own your voice, get quiet, connect with your ancestral power 529 00:29:55,360 --> 00:29:57,680 Speaker 1: the way I had to to write this book because 530 00:29:57,680 --> 00:29:59,440 Speaker 1: we all have it and we need you. 531 00:29:59,480 --> 00:30:00,280 Speaker 2: So don't give up. 532 00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:09,040 Speaker 3: Maria Youojosa of Latino USA. Her book is Once I 533 00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:11,240 Speaker 3: Was You, a memoir of love and hate in a 534 00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:14,880 Speaker 3: torn America. Muchisi maracas I at the Lulu, Thank you 535 00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:15,360 Speaker 3: so much. 536 00:30:21,040 --> 00:30:24,560 Speaker 1: This interview was produced by Hiba Ahmad and edited by 537 00:30:24,680 --> 00:30:29,440 Speaker 1: Kitty Issley for NPR's weekend edition Sunday, hosted by Lulu 538 00:30:29,480 --> 00:30:30,440 Speaker 1: Garcia Navarro. 539 00:30:30,760 --> 00:30:31,720 Speaker 2: Thanks again, Lulu. 540 00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:39,000 Speaker 1: Join us again on our next episode here at Latino USA. 541 00:30:39,400 --> 00:30:41,800 Speaker 1: And in the meantime, you can find us on all 542 00:30:41,840 --> 00:30:50,840 Speaker 1: of your social media. I los BeO chao. I'm Maria 543 00:30:51,080 --> 00:30:53,320 Speaker 1: Josa next time on Latino USA. 544 00:30:53,560 --> 00:30:54,800 Speaker 2: He's considered to be. 545 00:30:54,840 --> 00:30:59,120 Speaker 1: The mastermind behind President Trump's anti immigrant agenda. We speak 546 00:30:59,120 --> 00:31:03,000 Speaker 1: with author Gingere about her new book, Hate Monger Stephen Miller, 547 00:31:03,080 --> 00:31:05,480 Speaker 1: Donald Trump and the White Nationalist Agenda. 548 00:31:05,680 --> 00:31:09,040 Speaker 2: It's a case study and radicalization. What happens when someone 549 00:31:09,240 --> 00:31:11,200 Speaker 2: is consumed by an ideology. 550 00:31:11,400 --> 00:31:13,640 Speaker 1: That's next time on Latino USA.