1
00:00:09,800 --> 00:00:13,080
Speaker 1: Hi guys, and welcome to a new episode of couch

2
00:00:13,160 --> 00:00:16,560
Speaker 1: Talks on You Need Therapy Podcast. My name is kat

3
00:00:16,600 --> 00:00:18,919
Speaker 1: I am the host and if you are new to

4
00:00:18,960 --> 00:00:21,960
Speaker 1: couch Talks, it is the bonus episode of You Need

5
00:00:22,000 --> 00:00:26,479
Speaker 1: Therapy where I answer questions that you guys send to me.

6
00:00:26,600 --> 00:00:30,360
Speaker 1: You can send those to Katherine at therapy podcast dot com.

7
00:00:30,600 --> 00:00:33,720
Speaker 1: Quick reminder before we get into today's episode, this podcast

8
00:00:34,360 --> 00:00:36,720
Speaker 1: does not serve as a replacement or a substitute for

9
00:00:36,760 --> 00:00:39,559
Speaker 1: any actual mental health services. However, we always hope that

10
00:00:39,600 --> 00:00:42,400
Speaker 1: it can help you in some way wherever you are

11
00:00:42,400 --> 00:00:45,279
Speaker 1: on whatever journey you are on at the moment. Now,

12
00:00:45,320 --> 00:00:48,400
Speaker 1: we usually do one question a week and I always

13
00:00:48,440 --> 00:00:51,760
Speaker 1: keep them anonymous. I'm going to stick with that today,

14
00:00:51,960 --> 00:00:55,600
Speaker 1: and since I have no announcements or anything else to share,

15
00:00:55,800 --> 00:01:00,959
Speaker 1: I say let's just get into today's question, hear it? Hi,

16
00:01:01,040 --> 00:01:03,480
Speaker 1: kat I made a really good friend out of a coworker.

17
00:01:03,880 --> 00:01:06,680
Speaker 1: Over the course of five years, our friendship got closer

18
00:01:06,680 --> 00:01:10,800
Speaker 1: and eventually turned into a really deep relationship. When we

19
00:01:10,840 --> 00:01:13,640
Speaker 1: first met, he was a few years married. A few

20
00:01:13,680 --> 00:01:17,000
Speaker 1: months after our relationship took a deeper turn, his wife

21
00:01:17,040 --> 00:01:19,919
Speaker 1: got pregnant and soon after they had their first child.

22
00:01:20,280 --> 00:01:22,959
Speaker 1: I was so crushed, but also juggled those feelings with

23
00:01:23,080 --> 00:01:26,000
Speaker 1: knowing I had no place to feel hurt because there's

24
00:01:26,080 --> 00:01:30,840
Speaker 1: never any commitment made between us, just deep connection. Watching

25
00:01:30,880 --> 00:01:33,119
Speaker 1: him live his life that way and be so deeply

26
00:01:33,280 --> 00:01:36,600
Speaker 1: entangled with me was unbearable, a feeling that would soon

27
00:01:36,720 --> 00:01:39,720
Speaker 1: come to feel like home. I got a temporary position

28
00:01:39,760 --> 00:01:41,920
Speaker 1: at a company all the way across the country, hoping

29
00:01:41,920 --> 00:01:44,800
Speaker 1: the distance would create some distance between us so that

30
00:01:44,840 --> 00:01:47,760
Speaker 1: I could move on. But at that point I didn't

31
00:01:47,760 --> 00:01:51,000
Speaker 1: know the first thing about setting a boundary. We talked

32
00:01:51,040 --> 00:01:53,880
Speaker 1: every single day for a year. He was always adamant

33
00:01:53,880 --> 00:01:57,040
Speaker 1: that his relationship with her was pretty much non existent,

34
00:01:57,120 --> 00:02:00,400
Speaker 1: and I had nothing to worry about. At the end

35
00:02:00,400 --> 00:02:02,800
Speaker 1: of the temporary position, I decided to move back home

36
00:02:02,840 --> 00:02:05,440
Speaker 1: and take a job working with him again. A few

37
00:02:05,520 --> 00:02:07,760
Speaker 1: days after I moved home, I found out she was

38
00:02:07,800 --> 00:02:13,400
Speaker 1: pregnant again. Obviously confused, crushed, and angry, but I just

39
00:02:13,520 --> 00:02:15,640
Speaker 1: moved home and started this position. I didn't have the

40
00:02:15,680 --> 00:02:18,320
Speaker 1: resources to be a homewrecker at this point. There was

41
00:02:18,360 --> 00:02:20,639
Speaker 1: just something about us and the back and forth anger

42
00:02:20,720 --> 00:02:23,800
Speaker 1: and heightened joy and devastation and deepest connection I have ever,

43
00:02:23,840 --> 00:02:27,440
Speaker 1: felt continued until just the other day. The last few

44
00:02:27,440 --> 00:02:29,440
Speaker 1: months have been a turning point for me. In the sky,

45
00:02:29,560 --> 00:02:32,120
Speaker 1: we talked so much about how this is something that

46
00:02:32,160 --> 00:02:33,400
Speaker 1: we have to talk about.

47
00:02:33,160 --> 00:02:34,079
Speaker 2: Soon with other people.

48
00:02:34,560 --> 00:02:36,440
Speaker 1: We were making plans to do so in the coming

49
00:02:36,480 --> 00:02:39,560
Speaker 1: months in a healthy and unified way. My brother and

50
00:02:39,600 --> 00:02:42,960
Speaker 1: sister in law, largely involved in the place that we work,

51
00:02:43,440 --> 00:02:46,880
Speaker 1: got wind of this secret. When they confronted me about it,

52
00:02:46,919 --> 00:02:49,400
Speaker 1: I said I didn't want to talk details yet, that

53
00:02:49,480 --> 00:02:51,560
Speaker 1: I had control of the situation, and when I was

54
00:02:51,600 --> 00:02:53,720
Speaker 1: ready to talk about it, I would talk to my family.

55
00:02:54,600 --> 00:02:56,799
Speaker 1: It wasn't happening fast enough for my brother in law,

56
00:02:56,880 --> 00:02:59,120
Speaker 1: so a few days ago he confronted the guy, and

57
00:02:59,600 --> 00:03:01,760
Speaker 1: still to this day, I do not know what was

58
00:03:01,800 --> 00:03:06,800
Speaker 1: said in the confrontation. However, within twelve hours, his entire family,

59
00:03:07,400 --> 00:03:11,239
Speaker 1: including his dad who also worked in the same place,

60
00:03:11,840 --> 00:03:14,800
Speaker 1: and my entire family and many groups of friends were

61
00:03:14,840 --> 00:03:18,040
Speaker 1: made aware of our five year relationship. I was in

62
00:03:18,200 --> 00:03:20,320
Speaker 1: such shock and didn't know what to do. I had

63
00:03:20,360 --> 00:03:23,480
Speaker 1: literally three hours to process that this was happening right now,

64
00:03:23,520 --> 00:03:26,160
Speaker 1: and within another twelve hours had no more communication with

65
00:03:26,240 --> 00:03:29,080
Speaker 1: him at all. His wife texted me last night a

66
00:03:29,080 --> 00:03:31,000
Speaker 1: messages that will echo in my mind, probably for the

67
00:03:31,080 --> 00:03:33,960
Speaker 1: rest of my life. In quotes, respectfully, you are a

68
00:03:34,000 --> 00:03:37,600
Speaker 1: horrible person. I have zero idea how to handle this,

69
00:03:37,760 --> 00:03:40,040
Speaker 1: from processing the way I am now being perceived by

70
00:03:40,080 --> 00:03:42,600
Speaker 1: everyone to the grief of a relationship I didn't know

71
00:03:42,680 --> 00:03:45,280
Speaker 1: was about to end. Am I a horrible person?

72
00:03:45,680 --> 00:03:47,920
Speaker 2: I'm just scared? Okay?

73
00:03:48,040 --> 00:03:51,000
Speaker 1: So the first thing I want to say is thank

74
00:03:51,040 --> 00:03:54,240
Speaker 1: you for sharing this, because I can tell that there

75
00:03:54,280 --> 00:03:56,640
Speaker 1: are a million emotions you're going through right now, and

76
00:03:56,680 --> 00:03:59,480
Speaker 1: I can feel the fear that you mentioned at the

77
00:03:59,560 --> 00:04:02,600
Speaker 1: end of of your note to me. You're not a

78
00:04:02,640 --> 00:04:06,720
Speaker 1: horrible person. I think situations like this are very layered

79
00:04:06,880 --> 00:04:09,680
Speaker 1: and whether or not there's right or wrong in the

80
00:04:09,720 --> 00:04:12,440
Speaker 1: situation and if you did something wrong. I also want

81
00:04:12,480 --> 00:04:15,200
Speaker 1: to say this just out loud to anybody listening. In general,

82
00:04:16,040 --> 00:04:20,680
Speaker 1: doing one bad thing does not make you a bad person,

83
00:04:20,760 --> 00:04:22,320
Speaker 1: does not make you a horrible person.

84
00:04:23,279 --> 00:04:24,080
Speaker 2: We all make.

85
00:04:24,000 --> 00:04:26,800
Speaker 1: Mistakes, and we all do things at times that are

86
00:04:27,560 --> 00:04:30,440
Speaker 1: outside of our own moral compass and our own value system.

87
00:04:30,560 --> 00:04:33,440
Speaker 1: That does not make us bad people. If that were true,

88
00:04:33,560 --> 00:04:36,120
Speaker 1: then we all would be bad people. And if we're

89
00:04:36,120 --> 00:04:37,880
Speaker 1: all bad people, then like, what does it really matter.

90
00:04:38,560 --> 00:04:40,560
Speaker 1: But I do want people to hear because I hear

91
00:04:40,600 --> 00:04:42,760
Speaker 1: this over and over in my office, and you know what,

92
00:04:42,839 --> 00:04:45,360
Speaker 1: there's been times where I have asked that question as well.

93
00:04:46,000 --> 00:04:49,120
Speaker 1: But when we do something that does not align with

94
00:04:49,160 --> 00:04:51,480
Speaker 1: our value system and we have guilt about it and

95
00:04:51,520 --> 00:04:55,520
Speaker 1: we feel like I did a bad thing, that does

96
00:04:55,600 --> 00:04:59,279
Speaker 1: not then equal you or a bad person. One action,

97
00:04:59,560 --> 00:05:02,279
Speaker 1: one DECI decision, or even a couple of decisions does

98
00:05:02,320 --> 00:05:05,240
Speaker 1: not get to rewrite the history of who you are

99
00:05:05,279 --> 00:05:07,800
Speaker 1: and what is actually on your heart and what your

100
00:05:07,839 --> 00:05:12,520
Speaker 1: intentions overall in the world are. We are humans, so

101
00:05:12,560 --> 00:05:15,840
Speaker 1: we're imperfect. We're going to do things that you know,

102
00:05:15,960 --> 00:05:18,279
Speaker 1: looking back on don't really make a lot of sense

103
00:05:18,480 --> 00:05:20,680
Speaker 1: or do make sense, but we would just wish we

104
00:05:20,680 --> 00:05:23,600
Speaker 1: wouldn't have done those things, or we have a change

105
00:05:23,600 --> 00:05:25,680
Speaker 1: of heart and what might feel like a good thing

106
00:05:25,720 --> 00:05:28,640
Speaker 1: in one moment later looking back on things where like

107
00:05:28,720 --> 00:05:31,000
Speaker 1: maybe with the knowledge I have now, I wouldn't have

108
00:05:31,080 --> 00:05:33,479
Speaker 1: done that same thing. Those decisions do not make us

109
00:05:33,520 --> 00:05:36,840
Speaker 1: bad people. The good news is we have guilt, and

110
00:05:36,880 --> 00:05:39,479
Speaker 1: guilt is a feeling that we get to experience to

111
00:05:39,560 --> 00:05:42,240
Speaker 1: help us get back on track to the people and

112
00:05:42,279 --> 00:05:43,640
Speaker 1: to the person that we want to be.

113
00:05:44,240 --> 00:05:46,240
Speaker 2: And so as much as it is.

114
00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:49,600
Speaker 1: Uncomfy to feel the feeling of guilt, I am very

115
00:05:49,600 --> 00:05:52,160
Speaker 1: grateful for it because without it, I think I would

116
00:05:52,200 --> 00:05:54,680
Speaker 1: do a lot of things that then maybe would make

117
00:05:54,720 --> 00:05:57,400
Speaker 1: me a bad person. Without guilt, we would have no

118
00:05:57,480 --> 00:06:00,680
Speaker 1: moral compass, we would have no values, or we have

119
00:06:00,920 --> 00:06:04,680
Speaker 1: very skewed, messed up, scary ones. Now there's a difference

120
00:06:04,680 --> 00:06:08,039
Speaker 1: between guilt and toxic shame. Toxic shame says, okay, I

121
00:06:08,080 --> 00:06:10,440
Speaker 1: did something bad, I'm a bad person. Gil says I

122
00:06:10,480 --> 00:06:11,920
Speaker 1: did something bad. I did something bad.

123
00:06:12,640 --> 00:06:15,520
Speaker 2: So shame tells you that it covers all of who

124
00:06:15,560 --> 00:06:18,480
Speaker 2: you are. Guilt says, hey, you kind of got off track.

125
00:06:18,560 --> 00:06:21,320
Speaker 1: Let's course correct for a second, and you might need

126
00:06:21,360 --> 00:06:23,320
Speaker 1: to make amends to somebody, or you might need to

127
00:06:23,760 --> 00:06:25,800
Speaker 1: do some digging about what led you to that thing,

128
00:06:26,600 --> 00:06:28,920
Speaker 1: might just need to process with a safe person what

129
00:06:29,000 --> 00:06:31,359
Speaker 1: was going on with you and how you got off track.

130
00:06:31,440 --> 00:06:34,000
Speaker 1: But you still can get back on track, and this

131
00:06:34,040 --> 00:06:36,599
Speaker 1: does not change the wholeness of who you are. I

132
00:06:36,640 --> 00:06:39,599
Speaker 1: think it's really really easy to simplify these kinds of things.

133
00:06:39,680 --> 00:06:42,159
Speaker 1: We want to simplify them because we want there to

134
00:06:42,160 --> 00:06:44,039
Speaker 1: be a good and a bad, a right and a wrong.

135
00:06:44,600 --> 00:06:47,440
Speaker 1: But really, when it comes down to I mean, we're

136
00:06:47,480 --> 00:06:52,320
Speaker 1: talking about like cheating, affairs, relation, infidelity.

137
00:06:52,160 --> 00:06:52,680
Speaker 2: All of that.

138
00:06:53,160 --> 00:06:56,880
Speaker 1: Rarely is it really that black and white and that simple.

139
00:06:57,000 --> 00:06:59,479
Speaker 1: Sometimes it is, but a lot of times it's not.

140
00:07:00,600 --> 00:07:02,560
Speaker 1: And like I said, you can act outside of your

141
00:07:02,600 --> 00:07:05,160
Speaker 1: value system and not be a bad person. We can

142
00:07:05,200 --> 00:07:08,479
Speaker 1: hold ourselves accountable for our behaviors that do not align

143
00:07:08,560 --> 00:07:10,800
Speaker 1: with the people we want to be and examine what

144
00:07:10,960 --> 00:07:15,440
Speaker 1: led us there and with this situation and why. I said,

145
00:07:15,640 --> 00:07:18,880
Speaker 1: it's so easy to simplify these things, but we can

146
00:07:18,920 --> 00:07:20,920
Speaker 1: simplify them when we don't have all the information, right,

147
00:07:20,960 --> 00:07:23,520
Speaker 1: it's like, oh, A plus B equals C. But what

148
00:07:23,640 --> 00:07:26,200
Speaker 1: about all of the other pieces that we don't have?

149
00:07:26,800 --> 00:07:29,280
Speaker 1: And I know with this email there's a couple of

150
00:07:29,320 --> 00:07:32,800
Speaker 1: things that this listener sent to me that I have

151
00:07:32,880 --> 00:07:35,840
Speaker 1: more information, but still not even all of the information

152
00:07:35,880 --> 00:07:39,200
Speaker 1: I would need to have. But the listeners especially aren't

153
00:07:39,200 --> 00:07:42,520
Speaker 1: seeing all the details here. And nobody knows if there

154
00:07:42,640 --> 00:07:45,760
Speaker 1: was manipulation involved, if the man you were working with

155
00:07:45,840 --> 00:07:49,160
Speaker 1: hold a position of power over you, if that position

156
00:07:49,240 --> 00:07:51,240
Speaker 1: of power was just in the workplace, if it was

157
00:07:51,240 --> 00:07:54,040
Speaker 1: in the community, if it was in different areas that

158
00:07:54,080 --> 00:07:56,560
Speaker 1: you show up in, if it wasn't a friend group, Like,

159
00:07:57,000 --> 00:07:59,400
Speaker 1: we don't know all of that, And I'm going to

160
00:07:59,480 --> 00:08:01,880
Speaker 1: let a little bit off script here, but on social

161
00:08:01,920 --> 00:08:04,400
Speaker 1: media lately, we've been hearing a lot about Zach Bryan

162
00:08:04,600 --> 00:08:08,480
Speaker 1: and his now ex girlfriend and what has transpired in

163
00:08:08,520 --> 00:08:11,880
Speaker 1: their relationship. And I'm not going to get into all

164
00:08:11,920 --> 00:08:14,240
Speaker 1: the details of it because when I don't, I.

165
00:08:14,200 --> 00:08:15,040
Speaker 2: Don't have all the details.

166
00:08:15,080 --> 00:08:17,440
Speaker 1: I know I have some of them that she's shared publicly,

167
00:08:17,960 --> 00:08:20,000
Speaker 1: and if you're interested, you can go look that up.

168
00:08:20,040 --> 00:08:22,240
Speaker 1: But she's sharing a lot of information that like, on

169
00:08:22,280 --> 00:08:24,720
Speaker 1: the outside, if we were judging her behavior and some

170
00:08:24,800 --> 00:08:26,920
Speaker 1: of the things that she was doing, we would be

171
00:08:27,000 --> 00:08:27,440
Speaker 1: like what.

172
00:08:27,680 --> 00:08:30,120
Speaker 2: And I think people were like, what's happening to Brianna?

173
00:08:30,640 --> 00:08:31,480
Speaker 2: Like what is she doing?

174
00:08:31,480 --> 00:08:33,560
Speaker 1: What's happening with her relationship with her friends and this

175
00:08:33,679 --> 00:08:37,360
Speaker 1: and that. But the more information you gather, the more

176
00:08:37,400 --> 00:08:39,440
Speaker 1: that she now is sharing about that relationship and what

177
00:08:39,480 --> 00:08:43,840
Speaker 1: was really happening, there's a better understanding of like, oh,

178
00:08:44,080 --> 00:08:47,800
Speaker 1: this guy was manipulating her. This guy was, from what

179
00:08:47,920 --> 00:08:54,240
Speaker 1: I can tell, emotionally psychologically abusing this girl. He was

180
00:08:54,280 --> 00:08:57,040
Speaker 1: isolating her he was gaslighting her, he was I mean,

181
00:08:57,040 --> 00:08:58,640
Speaker 1: there's a lot going on there that.

182
00:08:59,440 --> 00:09:01,320
Speaker 2: Okay, Well, she can still take.

183
00:09:01,200 --> 00:09:05,040
Speaker 1: Responsibility for her actions when it's appropriate. At the same time,

184
00:09:05,679 --> 00:09:08,920
Speaker 1: she can also have compassion and a better understanding of

185
00:09:08,960 --> 00:09:12,240
Speaker 1: what led her to act outside of her value system

186
00:09:12,320 --> 00:09:14,880
Speaker 1: in some of those areas, because it wasn't just like

187
00:09:14,960 --> 00:09:17,800
Speaker 1: everything was beautiful and easy and nice and wonderful, and

188
00:09:17,840 --> 00:09:20,040
Speaker 1: she just chose to do this thing that is so

189
00:09:20,160 --> 00:09:22,040
Speaker 1: outside of who she is, or she just chose to

190
00:09:22,120 --> 00:09:24,720
Speaker 1: cut off her friends, or she just chose to I mean,

191
00:09:24,800 --> 00:09:26,760
Speaker 1: I don't know all the things that she did and

192
00:09:27,040 --> 00:09:30,600
Speaker 1: that relationship, but I'm speaking more to you, the listener.

193
00:09:31,320 --> 00:09:33,640
Speaker 1: It's really easy for people to be like, oh, you

194
00:09:33,800 --> 00:09:36,160
Speaker 1: just chose to do this. Everything was fine, and you

195
00:09:36,200 --> 00:09:39,120
Speaker 1: had all of this, like you know, yellow brick road

196
00:09:39,200 --> 00:09:42,240
Speaker 1: laid out for you, and you just chose to do

197
00:09:42,280 --> 00:09:43,920
Speaker 1: this bad thing without any.

198
00:09:43,720 --> 00:09:46,400
Speaker 2: Other influences or voices or anything like that.

199
00:09:46,440 --> 00:09:49,360
Speaker 1: And we do not know, and I personally do not

200
00:09:49,559 --> 00:09:51,680
Speaker 1: know what was said to you, how it was said

201
00:09:51,720 --> 00:09:54,000
Speaker 1: to you, like the things that it sounds like there

202
00:09:54,080 --> 00:09:57,840
Speaker 1: was manipulation. And yes, we can take responsibility for our actions,

203
00:09:57,880 --> 00:10:00,679
Speaker 1: and at the same time, gain and under standing for

204
00:10:00,800 --> 00:10:03,800
Speaker 1: why we chose those actions and did we have full

205
00:10:03,840 --> 00:10:05,000
Speaker 1: control at that time?

206
00:10:05,640 --> 00:10:07,080
Speaker 2: Did we have all the information?

207
00:10:07,240 --> 00:10:10,200
Speaker 1: Was I making an informed decision based on facts or

208
00:10:10,280 --> 00:10:13,440
Speaker 1: was I making an informed decision based on lives that

209
00:10:13,520 --> 00:10:16,400
Speaker 1: somebody was telling me? And I think that's a really

210
00:10:16,440 --> 00:10:19,800
Speaker 1: important thing to look at when we're trying to judge

211
00:10:19,800 --> 00:10:22,840
Speaker 1: ourselves or other people. If you were making an informed

212
00:10:22,840 --> 00:10:28,000
Speaker 1: decision but you weren't given the truth, then okay, that's

213
00:10:28,120 --> 00:10:31,240
Speaker 1: a little unfair to judge so harshly. Humans want to

214
00:10:31,280 --> 00:10:33,560
Speaker 1: believe the best in people. A lot of times that's me.

215
00:10:34,120 --> 00:10:35,599
Speaker 1: I've had to learn the hard way to be a

216
00:10:35,640 --> 00:10:40,720
Speaker 1: little bit more cautiously optimistic and be skeptical because not

217
00:10:40,840 --> 00:10:43,560
Speaker 1: everybody has the best intentions and not everybody is giving

218
00:10:43,600 --> 00:10:46,080
Speaker 1: you all of the truth. And I don't want people

219
00:10:46,120 --> 00:10:48,280
Speaker 1: to have to walk around the world jaded, but I

220
00:10:48,320 --> 00:10:53,800
Speaker 1: think experiences like these help you not trust blindly, as

221
00:10:54,240 --> 00:10:56,320
Speaker 1: a lot of us would like to be able to live.

222
00:10:56,559 --> 00:10:58,400
Speaker 1: I'm getting a little bit off track here, but what

223
00:10:58,480 --> 00:11:01,400
Speaker 1: I want to kind of say and is it sounds

224
00:11:01,400 --> 00:11:04,480
Speaker 1: like it would be really helpful for you to find someone.

225
00:11:04,559 --> 00:11:06,280
Speaker 1: It could be a therapist, it doesn't have to be.

226
00:11:06,360 --> 00:11:09,040
Speaker 1: But find somebody that you can trust to help you

227
00:11:09,120 --> 00:11:11,720
Speaker 1: tease out how you got to this place, how you

228
00:11:11,760 --> 00:11:15,280
Speaker 1: found yourself in this position. Not to blame you, not

229
00:11:15,400 --> 00:11:18,360
Speaker 1: to shame you, but to help you understand more about

230
00:11:18,360 --> 00:11:21,880
Speaker 1: your own story. And if you're feeling guilt again, that's

231
00:11:21,920 --> 00:11:25,880
Speaker 1: not always a bad thing. Guilt helps us look inward

232
00:11:26,200 --> 00:11:28,840
Speaker 1: when we act in ways that are outside of the

233
00:11:28,880 --> 00:11:31,200
Speaker 1: people that we really want to be, and when we

234
00:11:31,280 --> 00:11:33,360
Speaker 1: do something that doesn't align with our morals and values.

235
00:11:33,440 --> 00:11:36,280
Speaker 1: And at the same time, you can discover what impacted

236
00:11:36,320 --> 00:11:40,720
Speaker 1: those decisions to better understand that you aren't just a

237
00:11:40,720 --> 00:11:44,480
Speaker 1: bad person that did X, y Z. Maybe there was coercion,

238
00:11:44,520 --> 00:11:48,720
Speaker 1: Maybe there was manipulation, lying, psychological abuse, I'm not sure,

239
00:11:48,840 --> 00:11:52,400
Speaker 1: but to find out more information. Maybe there was some

240
00:11:52,559 --> 00:11:55,880
Speaker 1: trauma that was preyed upon, I'm not sure, or maybe

241
00:11:55,920 --> 00:11:58,720
Speaker 1: there was stuff from your past that you're reenacting.

242
00:11:59,040 --> 00:12:00,439
Speaker 2: Could be a million things, but.

243
00:12:00,400 --> 00:12:02,360
Speaker 1: It does not have to mean that you're a bad person.

244
00:12:03,120 --> 00:12:05,680
Speaker 1: I think we can honor when we do something not

245
00:12:05,720 --> 00:12:09,920
Speaker 1: great and take accountability and not turn ourselves into evil people.

246
00:12:10,679 --> 00:12:12,679
Speaker 1: Toxic shame says you're bad. Guilt says I did a

247
00:12:12,720 --> 00:12:16,480
Speaker 1: bad thing. I remember that humans do bad things from

248
00:12:16,480 --> 00:12:18,680
Speaker 1: time to time. This is not an excuse. This is

249
00:12:18,720 --> 00:12:20,960
Speaker 1: not getting you off the hook. It's not any of that.

250
00:12:21,000 --> 00:12:23,120
Speaker 1: And I'm not even saying I'm not giving an opinion

251
00:12:23,280 --> 00:12:25,520
Speaker 1: of whether you did something wrong or not.

252
00:12:26,600 --> 00:12:28,360
Speaker 2: If you decide that you did something wrong.

253
00:12:28,160 --> 00:12:30,839
Speaker 1: And you acted outside of your value system and your

254
00:12:30,920 --> 00:12:33,440
Speaker 1: morals and you are not sitting well with that, I

255
00:12:33,480 --> 00:12:36,679
Speaker 1: want you to know that we can do bad things

256
00:12:36,840 --> 00:12:41,880
Speaker 1: and not completely tear ourselves apart. We are more than

257
00:12:42,679 --> 00:12:45,960
Speaker 1: one decision that we make. We are more than one

258
00:12:46,000 --> 00:12:49,760
Speaker 1: thing that happens to us. We are a compilation of

259
00:12:49,800 --> 00:12:52,480
Speaker 1: a lot of things. A lot of times I tell clients,

260
00:12:52,679 --> 00:12:55,800
Speaker 1: feeling guilt tells us that we're good people. Not much

261
00:12:55,800 --> 00:13:00,560
Speaker 1: as it's uncomfortable, it's helpful to know that. So I

262
00:13:00,600 --> 00:13:03,360
Speaker 1: hope this was helpful, and I hope you can find

263
00:13:03,360 --> 00:13:06,320
Speaker 1: some grace and understanding for yourself through this really, really,

264
00:13:06,360 --> 00:13:10,400
Speaker 1: really hard season that you're experiencing, because yeah, I didn't

265
00:13:10,400 --> 00:13:14,240
Speaker 1: even get into the fact that this thing happened, and

266
00:13:14,320 --> 00:13:16,760
Speaker 1: that includes the ending of a relationship that was meaningful

267
00:13:16,800 --> 00:13:20,199
Speaker 1: to you, and ending of relationships are hard enough.

268
00:13:20,679 --> 00:13:21,640
Speaker 2: That's going to do it for me.

269
00:13:21,880 --> 00:13:24,280
Speaker 1: If you guys have any feedback, comments, questions, anything, you

270
00:13:24,320 --> 00:13:28,960
Speaker 1: can send those to Katherine at Unitherapy podcast dot com.

271
00:13:29,000 --> 00:13:31,719
Speaker 1: And as always, I hope you guys have the day

272
00:13:31,880 --> 00:13:43,280
Speaker 1: you need to have by