1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:02,480 Speaker 1: Hi. This is new due to the virus. I'm recording 2 00:00:02,520 --> 00:00:05,440 Speaker 1: from home, so you may notice a difference in audio 3 00:00:05,559 --> 00:00:12,240 Speaker 1: quality on this episode of News World. This is our 4 00:00:12,400 --> 00:00:16,360 Speaker 1: third in a series I'm calling the Honest Election Chronicles 5 00:00:16,840 --> 00:00:19,800 Speaker 1: where we are going state by state looking at how 6 00:00:19,880 --> 00:00:24,239 Speaker 1: voting irregularities occur in our elections. In Wisconsin, the race 7 00:00:24,320 --> 00:00:27,800 Speaker 1: between President Trump and Vice President Biden is very close. 8 00:00:28,440 --> 00:00:32,320 Speaker 1: The margin was twenty thousand, five hundred and eight votes 9 00:00:33,040 --> 00:00:38,040 Speaker 1: out of three million, two hundred and forty thousand, seven 10 00:00:38,159 --> 00:00:41,400 Speaker 1: hundred and thirty eight votes cast. They are now undergoing 11 00:00:41,400 --> 00:00:47,159 Speaker 1: a recount and two key Wisconsin counties, Milwaukee and Dane, 12 00:00:47,159 --> 00:00:52,920 Speaker 1: which includes Madison. My guest understands Wisconsin politics inside and out, 13 00:00:53,400 --> 00:00:57,080 Speaker 1: and I'm really pleased to welcome him. Andrew Hit, chairman 14 00:00:57,320 --> 00:01:10,920 Speaker 1: of the Wisconsin Republican Party. I am pleased to welcome 15 00:01:10,959 --> 00:01:15,479 Speaker 1: my guest, Andrew Hit, chairman of the Wisconsin Republican Party. 16 00:01:15,959 --> 00:01:17,880 Speaker 1: Certainly one of the states that has been most in 17 00:01:17,959 --> 00:01:22,200 Speaker 1: play and has I think maybe the most complicated story. 18 00:01:22,800 --> 00:01:25,399 Speaker 1: The Trump campaign just filed a request for a recount 19 00:01:25,959 --> 00:01:30,640 Speaker 1: of two Wisconsin counties, Milwaukee, which includes the city of Milwaukee, 20 00:01:31,000 --> 00:01:33,319 Speaker 1: and Dane, which includes the city of Madison, and these 21 00:01:33,319 --> 00:01:36,680 Speaker 1: two counties are a huge part of the Democratic Party 22 00:01:36,680 --> 00:01:38,600 Speaker 1: in the state. So let me ask you, Andrew. First 23 00:01:38,600 --> 00:01:40,520 Speaker 1: of all, let me say thank you in the middle 24 00:01:40,520 --> 00:01:43,040 Speaker 1: of everything you're doing as chairman for taking the time 25 00:01:43,080 --> 00:01:45,160 Speaker 1: to explain to the rest of us exactly what's going 26 00:01:45,160 --> 00:01:47,480 Speaker 1: on in your state. The pleasure to be with you. 27 00:01:47,600 --> 00:01:50,720 Speaker 1: Thank you for having me on. Why did the party 28 00:01:50,800 --> 00:01:55,160 Speaker 1: focus on those two counties and not the whole state. Well, 29 00:01:55,200 --> 00:01:58,880 Speaker 1: if you look at what is going on in Wisconsin, 30 00:01:59,320 --> 00:02:04,120 Speaker 1: it started to become clear that in those two counties 31 00:02:04,560 --> 00:02:09,920 Speaker 1: this is where the most egregious instances have occurred. And 32 00:02:09,960 --> 00:02:14,080 Speaker 1: there are really three challenges that are going on here. 33 00:02:14,600 --> 00:02:21,120 Speaker 1: The first is in those counties, especially the clerks corrected 34 00:02:21,760 --> 00:02:25,960 Speaker 1: absentee ballot envelopes if things were missing. This is contrary 35 00:02:26,000 --> 00:02:29,240 Speaker 1: to state statute. They're not allowed to do this, but 36 00:02:29,280 --> 00:02:32,960 Speaker 1: the Wisconsin Elections Commission even said you can do it 37 00:02:33,000 --> 00:02:37,399 Speaker 1: based on personal knowledge or googling if you see somebody 38 00:02:37,440 --> 00:02:42,600 Speaker 1: who has an address missing or something missing on their envelope, 39 00:02:42,720 --> 00:02:48,000 Speaker 1: and we think that brings substantial opportunity for fraud. The 40 00:02:48,120 --> 00:02:53,919 Speaker 1: second is in these counties they did not require absentee 41 00:02:53,919 --> 00:02:58,600 Speaker 1: ballot applications to be filled out for somebody who voted 42 00:02:59,000 --> 00:03:03,120 Speaker 1: absentee and person. In Wisconsin, we don't have early vote. 43 00:03:03,320 --> 00:03:06,840 Speaker 1: We simply have absentee by mail or you can absentee 44 00:03:06,840 --> 00:03:11,560 Speaker 1: in person, both of which require an absentee ballot application. Now, 45 00:03:11,600 --> 00:03:14,120 Speaker 1: we think this may have happened elsewhere in the state, 46 00:03:14,400 --> 00:03:18,000 Speaker 1: but it is most egregious here in Milwaukee and Dane County, 47 00:03:18,240 --> 00:03:23,399 Speaker 1: where they had huge, huge numbers of absentee voting going on. 48 00:03:23,919 --> 00:03:27,720 Speaker 1: This is also clearly contrary to state statute, and there's 49 00:03:27,720 --> 00:03:32,079 Speaker 1: actually a Wisconsin Court of Appeals opinion on point that 50 00:03:32,200 --> 00:03:35,800 Speaker 1: says they have to fill out an absentee ballot application 51 00:03:36,120 --> 00:03:40,040 Speaker 1: if they vote in person absentee. And the third area 52 00:03:40,640 --> 00:03:44,640 Speaker 1: is under a portion of Wisconsin law, if you are 53 00:03:45,040 --> 00:03:49,000 Speaker 1: indefinitely confined, you don't have to submit your photo ID 54 00:03:49,600 --> 00:03:54,400 Speaker 1: when you request an absentee ballot. And Madison and Milwaukee 55 00:03:54,520 --> 00:03:57,080 Speaker 1: clerks in the run up to the April seventh our 56 00:03:57,120 --> 00:04:02,560 Speaker 1: spring election said that everybody was indefinitely confined because of 57 00:04:02,600 --> 00:04:07,880 Speaker 1: COVID nineteen and therefore nobody had to provide a photoid. 58 00:04:08,560 --> 00:04:12,640 Speaker 1: We actually previously sued on this and got a temporary 59 00:04:12,680 --> 00:04:16,920 Speaker 1: injunction currently in the Wisconsin Supreme Court for a remedy. 60 00:04:17,040 --> 00:04:22,640 Speaker 1: We have evidence of people who claim to be indefinitely confined, 61 00:04:23,080 --> 00:04:26,680 Speaker 1: but then we're out at protests and outdoing other things 62 00:04:26,760 --> 00:04:31,920 Speaker 1: that clearly they were not indefinitely confined. How many people 63 00:04:32,560 --> 00:04:37,000 Speaker 1: would you guess come under the undefinitely confined group? So 64 00:04:37,480 --> 00:04:42,080 Speaker 1: before April seventh, before COVID, there are about seventy thousand 65 00:04:42,080 --> 00:04:45,200 Speaker 1: people in Wisconsin that we're on the indefinitely confined list. 66 00:04:45,839 --> 00:04:50,159 Speaker 1: Between this time period of that April election, in November third, 67 00:04:50,600 --> 00:04:54,480 Speaker 1: that number swelled to two hundred and forty thousand people 68 00:04:54,960 --> 00:04:59,520 Speaker 1: on the indefinite confined list. Interestingly enough, twenty five thousand 69 00:04:59,560 --> 00:05:03,440 Speaker 1: of those people didn't vote in any of the last 70 00:05:03,640 --> 00:05:08,279 Speaker 1: four general elections in Wisconsin, so they are not people 71 00:05:08,320 --> 00:05:13,640 Speaker 1: who regularly vote and maybe perhaps have a ID on 72 00:05:13,839 --> 00:05:17,920 Speaker 1: file and it just got missed. So those numbers are 73 00:05:18,080 --> 00:05:23,279 Speaker 1: obviously gigantic when you consider that right now the president 74 00:05:23,680 --> 00:05:27,520 Speaker 1: is losing Wisconsin by about twenty thousand votes. I saw 75 00:05:27,560 --> 00:05:31,919 Speaker 1: that there were three times as many people over ninety 76 00:05:32,000 --> 00:05:36,920 Speaker 1: years of age voting in Wisconsin this year. I don't 77 00:05:36,960 --> 00:05:40,520 Speaker 1: know if that'd him across the desk. Yeah, I have 78 00:05:40,640 --> 00:05:43,520 Speaker 1: not come across that. I will say that we definitely 79 00:05:43,600 --> 00:05:49,200 Speaker 1: did have historic turnout in Wisconsin. Interestingly, though we didn't 80 00:05:49,240 --> 00:05:53,520 Speaker 1: have historic turnout in the city of Milwaukee, the black community, 81 00:05:53,600 --> 00:05:56,919 Speaker 1: the Hispanic community was pretty flat for Joe Biden, but 82 00:05:57,080 --> 00:06:00,479 Speaker 1: the outer parts of the city of Milwaukee and the 83 00:06:00,520 --> 00:06:04,880 Speaker 1: outer portions of Milwaukee County came out substantially in favor 84 00:06:04,960 --> 00:06:09,520 Speaker 1: of Joe Biden. But across the state we saw historic turnout. 85 00:06:10,640 --> 00:06:15,240 Speaker 1: How will the recount itself be handled? So in Wisconsin, 86 00:06:15,800 --> 00:06:19,880 Speaker 1: in order to bring forward any challenge to an election, 87 00:06:20,640 --> 00:06:24,680 Speaker 1: you have to go through this very defined process. It 88 00:06:24,800 --> 00:06:28,360 Speaker 1: starts with a canvas, which is basically checking the math, 89 00:06:28,600 --> 00:06:31,920 Speaker 1: making sure that the number of ballots match the people 90 00:06:32,279 --> 00:06:34,800 Speaker 1: who signed the poll book, make sure that there were 91 00:06:34,800 --> 00:06:39,160 Speaker 1: no tabulation errors, that three hundred and sixty three votes 92 00:06:39,560 --> 00:06:42,360 Speaker 1: is three hundred and sixty three and not six thirty six, 93 00:06:42,440 --> 00:06:45,880 Speaker 1: and a number got transposed. That's the first step that 94 00:06:46,120 --> 00:06:50,320 Speaker 1: we completed. This Tuesday, the President filed a petition for 95 00:06:50,440 --> 00:06:54,480 Speaker 1: recount and we will begin that process. As we go 96 00:06:54,600 --> 00:07:00,200 Speaker 1: through that process, we will obviously recount the ballots, but 97 00:07:00,279 --> 00:07:03,800 Speaker 1: this is also where we bring forward the objections that 98 00:07:03,880 --> 00:07:08,880 Speaker 1: I talked about earlier those three objections, and those objections 99 00:07:08,880 --> 00:07:12,760 Speaker 1: will be adjudicated by the Board of Canvassers and they 100 00:07:12,840 --> 00:07:16,559 Speaker 1: will decide whether they grant or deny. Regardless of whether 101 00:07:16,640 --> 00:07:20,240 Speaker 1: or not they agree, this will become the subject likely 102 00:07:20,560 --> 00:07:24,120 Speaker 1: of a court case that will be filed sometime either 103 00:07:24,280 --> 00:07:28,360 Speaker 1: during this recount or at the end of the recount. Well, 104 00:07:28,400 --> 00:07:31,680 Speaker 1: I was very struck. I looked at several articles on 105 00:07:31,720 --> 00:07:36,240 Speaker 1: the role of the Wisconsin Election Commission, which my impression 106 00:07:36,440 --> 00:07:43,120 Speaker 1: is that they just blatantly ignored court orders. That's right, 107 00:07:43,200 --> 00:07:48,680 Speaker 1: the Wisconsin Elections Commission has disregarded the law. They have 108 00:07:48,800 --> 00:07:53,200 Speaker 1: disregarded the plane language of the law and provided guidance 109 00:07:53,320 --> 00:07:58,240 Speaker 1: documents for a number of years. This dates back a 110 00:07:58,320 --> 00:08:02,440 Speaker 1: while now. This action that the president is taking, whether 111 00:08:02,520 --> 00:08:05,200 Speaker 1: he is successful in his election in Wisconsin or not, 112 00:08:05,360 --> 00:08:10,000 Speaker 1: to his credit, he is helping fix these issues that 113 00:08:10,040 --> 00:08:15,240 Speaker 1: have been plaguing us and hurt Governor Walker's reelection. We 114 00:08:15,360 --> 00:08:18,600 Speaker 1: have to take a stand and say that the law 115 00:08:18,640 --> 00:08:21,920 Speaker 1: is the law and we can no longer continue to 116 00:08:22,000 --> 00:08:25,040 Speaker 1: go forward with them just sort of making it up 117 00:08:25,080 --> 00:08:29,160 Speaker 1: as they go. And we saw that in one of 118 00:08:29,200 --> 00:08:32,240 Speaker 1: the most egregious ways when they tried to pull this 119 00:08:32,320 --> 00:08:36,240 Speaker 1: emergency meeting and change the recount manual at the last minute. 120 00:08:37,400 --> 00:08:40,880 Speaker 1: This is the meeting on Wednesday, November eighteen, that's right. 121 00:08:41,040 --> 00:08:46,000 Speaker 1: So over the weekend we learned that they were considering 122 00:08:46,600 --> 00:08:50,280 Speaker 1: a meeting, but then they had actually decided that they 123 00:08:50,360 --> 00:08:52,640 Speaker 1: didn't need a meeting and they were just going to 124 00:08:52,679 --> 00:08:56,280 Speaker 1: move forward with the staff. So you can imagine if 125 00:08:56,280 --> 00:08:59,400 Speaker 1: the staff would have just changed the recount manual on 126 00:08:59,440 --> 00:09:02,560 Speaker 1: their own and not brought it forward to a meeting, 127 00:09:02,640 --> 00:09:04,960 Speaker 1: we would have never been able to actually stop it 128 00:09:05,040 --> 00:09:07,800 Speaker 1: like we did on Wednesday night. Thankfully, two of our 129 00:09:07,840 --> 00:09:12,040 Speaker 1: commissioners insisted that there be a meeting. The meeting was 130 00:09:12,200 --> 00:09:16,480 Speaker 1: noticed on Tuesday, twenty four hours in advance, but it 131 00:09:16,559 --> 00:09:20,680 Speaker 1: wasn't until Wednesday afternoon, three or four hours before the 132 00:09:20,760 --> 00:09:25,120 Speaker 1: meeting was about to begin, that the Elections Commission's staff 133 00:09:26,040 --> 00:09:32,880 Speaker 1: unexpectedly sent out a revised recount manual to the Elections commissioners. 134 00:09:32,920 --> 00:09:37,600 Speaker 1: There's three Republican commissioners, three Democrat commissioners. They sent us 135 00:09:37,679 --> 00:09:41,320 Speaker 1: thirty eight page manual out without any red line changes, 136 00:09:41,520 --> 00:09:45,400 Speaker 1: no track changes. So in just a few hours, these 137 00:09:45,440 --> 00:09:49,560 Speaker 1: commissioners are supposed to have memorized the twenty eighteen version 138 00:09:49,960 --> 00:09:52,720 Speaker 1: and be able to compare it to the changes made 139 00:09:52,720 --> 00:09:55,800 Speaker 1: in twenty twenty. We got it to our legal team immediately, 140 00:09:56,440 --> 00:09:59,680 Speaker 1: of course, really focused in on the areas that the 141 00:09:59,679 --> 00:10:05,079 Speaker 1: pres president is focused on, and quickly realized that they 142 00:10:05,080 --> 00:10:08,200 Speaker 1: were changing portions of the recount manual that would make 143 00:10:08,240 --> 00:10:11,360 Speaker 1: these objections that the President just put on the record 144 00:10:11,400 --> 00:10:14,880 Speaker 1: at eleven AM in his petition, They would make these 145 00:10:14,880 --> 00:10:19,920 Speaker 1: objections either more difficult or in most cases impossible to make. 146 00:10:20,200 --> 00:10:22,720 Speaker 1: So an effect, they're trying to change the rules of 147 00:10:22,760 --> 00:10:26,640 Speaker 1: the game after the President filed his petition, and after 148 00:10:26,720 --> 00:10:30,240 Speaker 1: the President paid three million dollars for a recount to 149 00:10:30,240 --> 00:10:35,160 Speaker 1: occur in both Dane County and Milwaukee County. First of all, 150 00:10:35,200 --> 00:10:39,280 Speaker 1: if the commission is three Democrats and three Republicans, why 151 00:10:39,320 --> 00:10:42,839 Speaker 1: does it seem to be so consistently biased in favor 152 00:10:42,840 --> 00:10:46,440 Speaker 1: of the Democrats. That is in large part because the 153 00:10:46,600 --> 00:10:51,760 Speaker 1: staff for years took so many liberties with how they operated. 154 00:10:51,960 --> 00:10:56,600 Speaker 1: Now the current commissioners have really pulled that back, and 155 00:10:57,160 --> 00:11:02,560 Speaker 1: there was significant delegation of authority that past commissioners had 156 00:11:02,640 --> 00:11:06,040 Speaker 1: given to the staff, and in the last year and 157 00:11:06,040 --> 00:11:10,560 Speaker 1: a half to two years that has been significantly curtailed. 158 00:11:11,040 --> 00:11:15,760 Speaker 1: But the culture there is really a culture of we 159 00:11:15,800 --> 00:11:19,120 Speaker 1: will do what we want, we will do whatever we 160 00:11:19,200 --> 00:11:23,560 Speaker 1: think the law is really in some instances regardless of 161 00:11:23,600 --> 00:11:27,800 Speaker 1: what the plane black Letter law says. And so it 162 00:11:27,920 --> 00:11:31,640 Speaker 1: is that culture that is there. It is that past 163 00:11:31,760 --> 00:11:35,920 Speaker 1: guidance some of these guidance that they are really putting 164 00:11:35,960 --> 00:11:38,679 Speaker 1: forward as guidance that's been out there for in some 165 00:11:38,720 --> 00:11:42,920 Speaker 1: cases four years. But we are really just seeing new 166 00:11:43,000 --> 00:11:46,280 Speaker 1: members of this commission being very proactive to try to 167 00:11:46,280 --> 00:11:49,720 Speaker 1: get this under control. One of those is Commissioner Spindell, 168 00:11:50,080 --> 00:11:54,320 Speaker 1: who did a phenomenal job on Wednesday night and making 169 00:11:54,400 --> 00:11:58,720 Speaker 1: sure that these changes would not go forward. Being Knutson, 170 00:11:58,800 --> 00:12:03,240 Speaker 1: also a commissioner, also really led the charge to ensure 171 00:12:03,320 --> 00:12:07,440 Speaker 1: that these didn't go forward. Who appoints the commissioners? So 172 00:12:07,480 --> 00:12:12,320 Speaker 1: the two Democrat commissioners are appointed by at this time 173 00:12:12,400 --> 00:12:16,840 Speaker 1: minority Democrat leaders in the State House, and two of 174 00:12:16,880 --> 00:12:20,840 Speaker 1: them are appointed by the majority leaders in the State House, 175 00:12:21,280 --> 00:12:23,880 Speaker 1: and then the other two members are pulled from a 176 00:12:23,920 --> 00:12:30,280 Speaker 1: pool that are gubernatorial appointments, and who puts the Republicans 177 00:12:30,280 --> 00:12:33,920 Speaker 1: into the pool? Those are put forward in that pool, 178 00:12:34,440 --> 00:12:37,120 Speaker 1: and you have to pick from a Republican pool and 179 00:12:37,200 --> 00:12:40,560 Speaker 1: a Democrat pool. In this case, former Governor Walker would 180 00:12:40,600 --> 00:12:46,480 Speaker 1: have appointed Marge Befelmann, who is the other Republican member 181 00:12:46,640 --> 00:12:51,560 Speaker 1: and she is a former Republican clerk in Wisconsin, and 182 00:12:51,600 --> 00:12:55,920 Speaker 1: Wisconsin clerks are actually a partisan election. They're either a 183 00:12:56,000 --> 00:13:09,120 Speaker 1: Democrat clerk or a Republican clerk. This is Giano Caldwell. 184 00:13:09,200 --> 00:13:11,440 Speaker 1: This week on Outline with Giano Caldwell, I talked to 185 00:13:11,480 --> 00:13:14,839 Speaker 1: someone who you've probably seen on TV, Lisa Booth. Lisa 186 00:13:14,880 --> 00:13:18,079 Speaker 1: is a prominent journalist, political analyst, and commentator who's currently 187 00:13:18,080 --> 00:13:21,040 Speaker 1: a Fox News contributor and Senior Fellow for The Independent 188 00:13:21,080 --> 00:13:24,120 Speaker 1: Woman's Voice. We discussed a crazy aftermath of the twenty 189 00:13:24,160 --> 00:13:27,240 Speaker 1: twenty election and have politicians have used COVID nineteen to 190 00:13:27,280 --> 00:13:30,600 Speaker 1: seize power and attack religion, especially in New York. Listen 191 00:13:30,640 --> 00:13:33,960 Speaker 1: to Outline with Giano Caldwell every Monday on the iHeartRadio app, 192 00:13:34,040 --> 00:13:42,080 Speaker 1: Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. I read 193 00:13:42,120 --> 00:13:46,040 Speaker 1: a report that there was one particular change that the 194 00:13:46,080 --> 00:13:50,560 Speaker 1: Commission imposed which is such a clearer violation of state law. 195 00:13:51,080 --> 00:13:55,040 Speaker 1: They could actually affect two hundred thousand ballots. By the way, 196 00:13:55,080 --> 00:13:59,480 Speaker 1: they had decided to do something. Historically, Wisconsin's reputations are 197 00:13:59,559 --> 00:14:04,720 Speaker 1: very clean state, and it's almost as though the tension 198 00:14:04,800 --> 00:14:08,760 Speaker 1: and the fighting over Governor Walker and then just how 199 00:14:08,880 --> 00:14:11,480 Speaker 1: close the recent fights have been, has made the state 200 00:14:11,559 --> 00:14:15,680 Speaker 1: much more partisan, at least in my memory of it. Historically, 201 00:14:15,760 --> 00:14:18,679 Speaker 1: it has been a clean state and clean elections. And 202 00:14:19,160 --> 00:14:23,960 Speaker 1: you know, interestingly, these challenges are not like some of 203 00:14:24,080 --> 00:14:27,480 Speaker 1: the concerns or challenges that maybe we saw or are 204 00:14:27,560 --> 00:14:33,920 Speaker 1: seen in Philadelphia Unfold or Detroit unfold. These are instances 205 00:14:34,560 --> 00:14:39,520 Speaker 1: of a state agency that has a past practice of 206 00:14:40,120 --> 00:14:44,560 Speaker 1: disregarding plain language of the statute and taking liberties with it. 207 00:14:45,080 --> 00:14:47,880 Speaker 1: And one of the things that really has been unfolding 208 00:14:48,400 --> 00:14:52,600 Speaker 1: in Wisconsin over the last several years is how much 209 00:14:52,720 --> 00:14:57,200 Speaker 1: power state agencies have and how much power a governor 210 00:14:57,320 --> 00:15:01,640 Speaker 1: can delegate to a state agency, how much power ultimately 211 00:15:02,040 --> 00:15:07,440 Speaker 1: the legislature actually delegates to state agencies. We've seen that 212 00:15:08,080 --> 00:15:11,640 Speaker 1: kind of play out in our laws that are being developed. 213 00:15:11,960 --> 00:15:14,880 Speaker 1: There was one that Governor Walker put forward, known as 214 00:15:14,960 --> 00:15:19,200 Speaker 1: Act twenty one, that really reigned in state agencies and 215 00:15:19,360 --> 00:15:22,080 Speaker 1: said you only have the power to act if you 216 00:15:22,200 --> 00:15:27,600 Speaker 1: have explicit statutory authority, as opposed to relying on vague 217 00:15:28,080 --> 00:15:32,920 Speaker 1: opening statements of a statute to derive your authority. We've 218 00:15:33,000 --> 00:15:37,240 Speaker 1: seen it in court cases that have gone through and 219 00:15:37,480 --> 00:15:40,960 Speaker 1: really have dealt with this delegation of authority. So it 220 00:15:41,200 --> 00:15:45,960 Speaker 1: is a somewhat boring, quiet issue that really has been developing, 221 00:15:46,240 --> 00:15:49,640 Speaker 1: i would say, over the last fifteen years here in Wisconsin, 222 00:15:49,920 --> 00:15:53,040 Speaker 1: and we're really seeing it kind of boil over now 223 00:15:53,160 --> 00:15:56,240 Speaker 1: this year. In the court cases that have been tried 224 00:15:56,280 --> 00:16:00,920 Speaker 1: over the last few years, when the election Commission clearly 225 00:16:01,080 --> 00:16:04,960 Speaker 1: violates state law, if the courts reimposed the state law, 226 00:16:05,120 --> 00:16:09,760 Speaker 1: or have they been tolerant of the commission's interpretations. It 227 00:16:09,920 --> 00:16:13,000 Speaker 1: really has been a mix. There has been some success 228 00:16:13,280 --> 00:16:17,760 Speaker 1: in court cases, but in others there has been reliance 229 00:16:17,840 --> 00:16:22,360 Speaker 1: of courts to not grant relief on some technicalities such 230 00:16:22,440 --> 00:16:26,440 Speaker 1: as there is just no time to decide. That really 231 00:16:26,520 --> 00:16:31,040 Speaker 1: happened in the Green Party case this year, where the 232 00:16:31,200 --> 00:16:34,560 Speaker 1: Green Party tried to get on the Wisconsin ballot. The 233 00:16:34,760 --> 00:16:38,320 Speaker 1: person on the ballot had a change of address while 234 00:16:38,440 --> 00:16:41,360 Speaker 1: they were going through this process, so some of the 235 00:16:41,520 --> 00:16:45,280 Speaker 1: nomination papers were under the old address of this person, 236 00:16:45,760 --> 00:16:49,080 Speaker 1: and some of the nomination papers were of the new address. 237 00:16:49,520 --> 00:16:52,560 Speaker 1: The Elections Commission decided that they were only going to 238 00:16:52,680 --> 00:16:56,640 Speaker 1: count one of those addresses, and really the Green Party 239 00:16:56,800 --> 00:16:59,400 Speaker 1: should have been on the ballot here in Wisconsin, but 240 00:16:59,600 --> 00:17:04,159 Speaker 1: was off by the Commission. The Commission voted three three 241 00:17:04,800 --> 00:17:07,960 Speaker 1: on whether to put them on the ballot, and in 242 00:17:08,040 --> 00:17:12,040 Speaker 1: the very bizarre twist of our Wisconsin Elections Commission law, 243 00:17:12,680 --> 00:17:17,200 Speaker 1: when there isn't a prior decision or a prior document 244 00:17:17,520 --> 00:17:21,879 Speaker 1: or guidance or policy out there, when the Commission ties 245 00:17:22,040 --> 00:17:26,120 Speaker 1: three three, it goes back to the staff for decision. 246 00:17:26,680 --> 00:17:30,800 Speaker 1: So in this case, it's very troubling because the Commission 247 00:17:30,880 --> 00:17:34,160 Speaker 1: can't decide and a deadlocked whether or not a candidate 248 00:17:34,240 --> 00:17:37,720 Speaker 1: can actually be on the ballot. And because they're deadlocked, 249 00:17:37,880 --> 00:17:42,600 Speaker 1: it goes to unelected bureaucrats to make that decision. Those 250 00:17:42,680 --> 00:17:47,080 Speaker 1: unelected bureaucrats in that case made the decision to not 251 00:17:47,280 --> 00:17:50,159 Speaker 1: allow the Green Party on the ballot. This case was 252 00:17:50,520 --> 00:17:53,879 Speaker 1: taken to the Wisconsin Supreme Court, but because some of 253 00:17:53,960 --> 00:17:57,560 Speaker 1: the ballots had already been printed, although they weren't able 254 00:17:57,600 --> 00:18:00,880 Speaker 1: to confirm that any ballots were sent to any voter, 255 00:18:01,440 --> 00:18:04,800 Speaker 1: the Wisconsin's Frame Court said, we're not going to decide 256 00:18:04,840 --> 00:18:06,959 Speaker 1: this case we're not going to take it. It's simply 257 00:18:07,040 --> 00:18:10,800 Speaker 1: too late ballots have been printed, which is unfortunate. It 258 00:18:10,960 --> 00:18:14,840 Speaker 1: is contrary to some past court cases and practice, and 259 00:18:15,000 --> 00:18:19,480 Speaker 1: actually contrary to the statute which specifically says if ballots 260 00:18:19,520 --> 00:18:24,200 Speaker 1: are printed and there is an error, it specifically delineates 261 00:18:24,320 --> 00:18:26,920 Speaker 1: and lays out how you fix that and how you 262 00:18:27,080 --> 00:18:30,080 Speaker 1: reprint the ballots, even after they've already been in the 263 00:18:30,160 --> 00:18:33,680 Speaker 1: voters hands. This was significant, it goes, wasn't the Green 264 00:18:33,800 --> 00:18:40,200 Speaker 1: Party the margin by which Hillary lost four years ago? Right? 265 00:18:40,400 --> 00:18:45,320 Speaker 1: The Green Party Jill Stein in twenty sixteen got around 266 00:18:45,400 --> 00:18:50,160 Speaker 1: thirty five thousand votes, And that obviously is greater than 267 00:18:50,800 --> 00:18:53,560 Speaker 1: the twenty thousand that at this time the president is 268 00:18:53,600 --> 00:18:57,080 Speaker 1: losing by. It's also greater than what the president in 269 00:18:57,359 --> 00:19:00,919 Speaker 1: twenty sixteen won by. He won by twenty two five 270 00:19:01,000 --> 00:19:04,720 Speaker 1: hundred votes. Here in Wisconsin in twenty sixteen, What was 271 00:19:04,800 --> 00:19:08,760 Speaker 1: happening down ballot in Wisconsin? Could you sense a blue 272 00:19:08,800 --> 00:19:12,600 Speaker 1: tide or what was going on? There? Isn't a blue tide? Actually, 273 00:19:12,720 --> 00:19:18,760 Speaker 1: So in Wisconsin, all of our incumbent congressional members were 274 00:19:18,840 --> 00:19:22,680 Speaker 1: re elected, and they actually were re elected and got 275 00:19:22,840 --> 00:19:26,480 Speaker 1: more votes in their district than President Trump did. In 276 00:19:26,760 --> 00:19:31,240 Speaker 1: the state Senate, we picked up two seats and we're 277 00:19:31,320 --> 00:19:36,080 Speaker 1: one seat away from supermajority status. In the Wisconsin Assembly, 278 00:19:36,560 --> 00:19:41,320 Speaker 1: we were three seats away from supermajority status. Unfortunately, we 279 00:19:41,440 --> 00:19:45,200 Speaker 1: did lose two seats in the Milwaukee suburb areas close 280 00:19:45,240 --> 00:19:49,919 Speaker 1: to Milwaukee, but really count that more as a victory 281 00:19:50,080 --> 00:19:55,639 Speaker 1: because the Democrats here in Wisconsin spent an enormous amount 282 00:19:55,760 --> 00:20:00,280 Speaker 1: of money on these Assembly races, spending close to four 283 00:20:00,400 --> 00:20:02,880 Speaker 1: hundred to eight hundred thousand dollars in some of these 284 00:20:02,920 --> 00:20:06,560 Speaker 1: Assembly races, spending almost a million dollars in some of 285 00:20:06,600 --> 00:20:09,960 Speaker 1: these state Senate races, and all they could show for 286 00:20:10,160 --> 00:20:14,080 Speaker 1: it was losing two Senate races that we were able 287 00:20:14,160 --> 00:20:18,520 Speaker 1: to pick up and claiming two seats in the Assembly. 288 00:20:19,000 --> 00:20:23,879 Speaker 1: We still are within five seats away from supermajority status 289 00:20:23,960 --> 00:20:27,439 Speaker 1: in the Wisconsin Assembly. As a party here in Wisconsin, 290 00:20:27,760 --> 00:20:30,600 Speaker 1: we really see from this election how we win locally, 291 00:20:30,720 --> 00:20:35,080 Speaker 1: how we win regionally. We do need to focus on 292 00:20:35,240 --> 00:20:39,600 Speaker 1: how to win statewide. We obviously lost the governor walker race, 293 00:20:40,040 --> 00:20:42,800 Speaker 1: we won a state Supreme Court race in between there, 294 00:20:43,240 --> 00:20:46,440 Speaker 1: but then subsequently this year lost a Supreme Court race 295 00:20:46,560 --> 00:20:50,920 Speaker 1: and then currently losing the race for the presidency. What 296 00:20:51,040 --> 00:20:55,160 Speaker 1: are you hearing from Paul watchers and observers in terms 297 00:20:55,160 --> 00:20:58,200 Speaker 1: of what they thought they observed. That's sort of some 298 00:20:58,359 --> 00:21:02,359 Speaker 1: of the interesting things this recount is there are some 299 00:21:02,600 --> 00:21:07,200 Speaker 1: specific objections that are being made that wouldn't necessarily be 300 00:21:07,440 --> 00:21:11,120 Speaker 1: caught on election day while you're going through the process. 301 00:21:11,680 --> 00:21:15,159 Speaker 1: But we did have problems in a number of locations. 302 00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:18,800 Speaker 1: I mean in Milwaukee County during the day at the 303 00:21:18,880 --> 00:21:23,000 Speaker 1: central count location where they count the absentee ballots and 304 00:21:23,160 --> 00:21:26,760 Speaker 1: process them, we had to buy binoculars for our election 305 00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:30,440 Speaker 1: day observers because they were not allowed to get close enough. 306 00:21:30,720 --> 00:21:34,399 Speaker 1: Usually we work with the election officials to try to 307 00:21:34,480 --> 00:21:37,200 Speaker 1: work things out. We do have a new clerk in 308 00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:42,399 Speaker 1: Milwaukee that we're still really developing that relationship with, but 309 00:21:42,640 --> 00:21:46,440 Speaker 1: there were issues like that occurred. We worked through a 310 00:21:46,600 --> 00:21:49,920 Speaker 1: number of issues on election day, I would say kind 311 00:21:50,000 --> 00:21:53,040 Speaker 1: of one off issues that we had to work through. 312 00:21:53,720 --> 00:21:58,840 Speaker 1: But having to buy binoculars so somebody can try to observe, 313 00:21:59,440 --> 00:22:02,880 Speaker 1: which is just so inferior because it's not though you're 314 00:22:03,000 --> 00:22:05,920 Speaker 1: going to be able to see whether or not the 315 00:22:06,040 --> 00:22:09,920 Speaker 1: initials are proper, or whether or not specific things on 316 00:22:10,040 --> 00:22:15,560 Speaker 1: those absentee ballot envelopes are proper by using binoculars from 317 00:22:15,600 --> 00:22:19,040 Speaker 1: a distance. Some of the things just struck me as wild. 318 00:22:19,920 --> 00:22:22,920 Speaker 1: You have to have a voter ID to vote unless 319 00:22:23,680 --> 00:22:29,119 Speaker 1: you're indefinitely confirmed. But they must have had thousands of 320 00:22:29,200 --> 00:22:32,080 Speaker 1: people who clearly should have been showing up with their 321 00:22:32,160 --> 00:22:37,040 Speaker 1: voter ID, who chose this camouflage in a way that 322 00:22:37,200 --> 00:22:41,000 Speaker 1: has to be sort of illegal, doesn't it. Yes, absolutely. 323 00:22:41,200 --> 00:22:44,160 Speaker 1: I think it was March of this year when those 324 00:22:44,240 --> 00:22:48,840 Speaker 1: clerks in Madison and Milwaukee claimed that everybody was indefinitely 325 00:22:48,960 --> 00:22:53,040 Speaker 1: confined because of COVID. We went immediately to the Wisconsin 326 00:22:53,119 --> 00:22:56,879 Speaker 1: Supreme Court. But the damage that those clerks did, you know, 327 00:22:57,000 --> 00:23:00,640 Speaker 1: it wasn't just that they told their voters in Madison 328 00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:06,000 Speaker 1: and Milwaukee this egregious, clearly contrary to state law, that 329 00:23:06,160 --> 00:23:09,280 Speaker 1: everybody is indefinitely confined. It wasn't that they just told 330 00:23:09,359 --> 00:23:12,920 Speaker 1: their voters. We have one thousand, eight hundred and fifty 331 00:23:13,119 --> 00:23:16,600 Speaker 1: municipal clerks in Wisconsin, and they took the action to 332 00:23:16,760 --> 00:23:20,560 Speaker 1: send it out to all of those. So we had 333 00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:25,200 Speaker 1: people all over the state of Wisconsin selecting this indefinite 334 00:23:25,240 --> 00:23:30,440 Speaker 1: confinement improperly, and so we immediately went to the state 335 00:23:30,520 --> 00:23:35,800 Speaker 1: Supreme Court. And this is a case that was decided 336 00:23:36,000 --> 00:23:39,399 Speaker 1: very quickly because, quite frankly, it is a case that 337 00:23:39,480 --> 00:23:42,400 Speaker 1: a first year law student could figure out the law 338 00:23:42,680 --> 00:23:47,720 Speaker 1: clearly was not on their side. They clearly were in 339 00:23:47,920 --> 00:23:51,920 Speaker 1: violation of the law. We very very quickly got a 340 00:23:52,040 --> 00:23:56,840 Speaker 1: temporary injunction and in September, at the end of September, 341 00:23:57,480 --> 00:24:00,640 Speaker 1: we went to oral argument in the Wisconsin Supreme Court. 342 00:24:00,760 --> 00:24:03,640 Speaker 1: I was hopeful that we might see an order right 343 00:24:03,720 --> 00:24:08,320 Speaker 1: after that oral argument that would give a remedy such 344 00:24:08,480 --> 00:24:12,120 Speaker 1: that perhaps everybody who signed up and definitely can find 345 00:24:12,200 --> 00:24:14,119 Speaker 1: this year has to re up it now with the 346 00:24:14,240 --> 00:24:19,879 Speaker 1: understanding that COVID doesn't automatically make you indefinitely confined. We 347 00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:22,840 Speaker 1: didn't get that order. We're still actually at this time 348 00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:26,760 Speaker 1: waiting for the opinion from the Wisconsin Supreme Court, and 349 00:24:27,600 --> 00:24:31,120 Speaker 1: now that issue obviously is going to come back before 350 00:24:31,240 --> 00:24:35,879 Speaker 1: them much quicker during this recount and the likely legal 351 00:24:36,320 --> 00:24:39,040 Speaker 1: case that arises out of the recount for the president, 352 00:24:53,560 --> 00:24:56,639 Speaker 1: do you have any sense of among the thousands and 353 00:24:56,800 --> 00:25:02,840 Speaker 1: thousands of people who said that they were definitely in fine, 354 00:25:03,880 --> 00:25:05,480 Speaker 1: do you have any evidence of how many of those 355 00:25:05,520 --> 00:25:08,320 Speaker 1: actually are not legal voters because it strikes me, I mean, 356 00:25:08,359 --> 00:25:11,560 Speaker 1: the biggest advantage of claiming that is you don't have 357 00:25:11,640 --> 00:25:17,320 Speaker 1: to show an ID, right. We're still working to uncover that, 358 00:25:17,720 --> 00:25:22,040 Speaker 1: and it is not the easiest thing to uncover because 359 00:25:22,440 --> 00:25:25,560 Speaker 1: it is such a subjective standard. But what we want 360 00:25:25,560 --> 00:25:28,120 Speaker 1: to do is find out how many of these people 361 00:25:28,280 --> 00:25:31,879 Speaker 1: don't have a photo ID at all? How many of 362 00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:35,280 Speaker 1: these people I think it's very interesting that twenty five 363 00:25:35,400 --> 00:25:40,000 Speaker 1: thousand of them haven't voted in the last four general 364 00:25:40,080 --> 00:25:45,480 Speaker 1: elections here in Wisconsin. It makes me really question why 365 00:25:45,680 --> 00:25:50,680 Speaker 1: they decided now to vote when they don't have to 366 00:25:50,760 --> 00:25:54,400 Speaker 1: show a photoid. You don't think they were inspired by 367 00:25:54,480 --> 00:25:58,560 Speaker 1: the charisma of the Biden campaign, I don't you know. 368 00:25:58,720 --> 00:26:03,800 Speaker 1: And Madison, Wisconsin, the inspiration for Joe Biden was actually 369 00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:07,280 Speaker 1: a buss that they sent around the Capitol Square that 370 00:26:07,560 --> 00:26:11,240 Speaker 1: literally said settle for Biden. That was the extent of 371 00:26:11,359 --> 00:26:14,359 Speaker 1: their enthusiasm. There was a constant election version that I 372 00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:20,600 Speaker 1: remember correctly. Also just playing refused to remove voters from 373 00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:22,520 Speaker 1: the roles who were no longer eligible to stay on 374 00:26:22,600 --> 00:26:27,000 Speaker 1: the rules, and I think this was a direct rejection 375 00:26:27,080 --> 00:26:30,440 Speaker 1: of a court order. Do I have that right, they 376 00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:34,280 Speaker 1: did refuse to do that. We prevailed in the Circuit 377 00:26:34,359 --> 00:26:37,800 Speaker 1: court and got a order that said you need to 378 00:26:38,320 --> 00:26:41,040 Speaker 1: take these people off the rolls, and then declined to 379 00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:44,760 Speaker 1: issue a stay of his ruling. The Democrats appealed that 380 00:26:45,040 --> 00:26:49,480 Speaker 1: to the State Supreme Court. Unfortunately, despite the fact that 381 00:26:49,560 --> 00:26:54,560 Speaker 1: we have a four three generally conservative majority, we didn't 382 00:26:54,560 --> 00:26:58,840 Speaker 1: prevail in that case. The fourth Justice demurred and really 383 00:26:58,960 --> 00:27:02,960 Speaker 1: found a way to not decide the case. And that's 384 00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:08,080 Speaker 1: unfortunate because these are tens of thousands of people who 385 00:27:08,119 --> 00:27:11,760 Speaker 1: shouldn't be on the rolls. And our principal argument against 386 00:27:12,240 --> 00:27:16,240 Speaker 1: going vote by mail here in Wisconsin was simply that 387 00:27:16,400 --> 00:27:20,000 Speaker 1: our voter roles aren't prepared for it. They are a mess. 388 00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:24,600 Speaker 1: And even our executive director of the Wisconsin Elections Commission 389 00:27:25,040 --> 00:27:28,560 Speaker 1: even she said that there was no way we could 390 00:27:28,600 --> 00:27:31,399 Speaker 1: do vote by mail in Wisconsin. We aren't ready for it, 391 00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:34,320 Speaker 1: and in part we're not ready for it because our 392 00:27:34,440 --> 00:27:36,879 Speaker 1: voter roles are a mess. They are filled with people 393 00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:40,080 Speaker 1: that shouldn't be on there. They're filled with peoples that 394 00:27:40,280 --> 00:27:43,560 Speaker 1: are not at the right address, and that needs to 395 00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:46,720 Speaker 1: be cleaned up. One of the things that's going to 396 00:27:46,880 --> 00:27:51,359 Speaker 1: occur after This recount is an audit, and as I 397 00:27:51,560 --> 00:27:56,640 Speaker 1: said before, we have very solid clear majorities, almost supermajorities 398 00:27:56,680 --> 00:28:00,800 Speaker 1: in our Assembly and our Senate. Both of those oversight 399 00:28:01,080 --> 00:28:04,200 Speaker 1: of elections. They have committees that have oversight of elections 400 00:28:04,560 --> 00:28:08,440 Speaker 1: and the Elections Commission. I have been talking to legislative leaders, 401 00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:12,120 Speaker 1: I've been talking to the committee chairs, and we are 402 00:28:12,280 --> 00:28:15,920 Speaker 1: going to see a number of things brought forward in 403 00:28:16,119 --> 00:28:19,440 Speaker 1: this audit process. One of those is going to be 404 00:28:19,800 --> 00:28:22,760 Speaker 1: how much of a mess our voter roles are and 405 00:28:22,960 --> 00:28:25,280 Speaker 1: what we need to do to clean it up. Of course, 406 00:28:25,560 --> 00:28:28,280 Speaker 1: you know, we don't control the governor's office, but we 407 00:28:28,520 --> 00:28:32,200 Speaker 1: want to bring these forward and put pressure on because 408 00:28:32,200 --> 00:28:35,960 Speaker 1: I think when the people of Wisconsin understand some of 409 00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:39,280 Speaker 1: the issues that are there, they will demand not only 410 00:28:39,400 --> 00:28:42,959 Speaker 1: that Republicans help clean this up, but that Democrat Governor 411 00:28:43,040 --> 00:28:46,040 Speaker 1: Tony Evers step up to the plate and actually clean 412 00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:49,640 Speaker 1: this up so that there is once again confidence in 413 00:28:49,760 --> 00:28:53,600 Speaker 1: our election system here in Wisconsin. Are you able as 414 00:28:53,680 --> 00:28:57,600 Speaker 1: part of the recount to check to see whether or 415 00:28:57,640 --> 00:29:02,840 Speaker 1: not who should have encouraged when unto them actually voted. Yes, 416 00:29:02,960 --> 00:29:04,960 Speaker 1: there will be, and that will be done through the 417 00:29:05,240 --> 00:29:10,000 Speaker 1: audit committee process. As you know, the national media as 418 00:29:10,120 --> 00:29:13,200 Speaker 1: desperate for Trump to concede. Do you think it's a 419 00:29:14,360 --> 00:29:18,120 Speaker 1: legitimate service for the president to assist on this kind 420 00:29:18,200 --> 00:29:23,560 Speaker 1: of inaccurate recount and surfacing the various legal questions, or 421 00:29:23,600 --> 00:29:26,200 Speaker 1: do you think that it strains the system to continue 422 00:29:26,200 --> 00:29:29,640 Speaker 1: to keep this openness law. I can really only speak 423 00:29:29,680 --> 00:29:32,040 Speaker 1: to Wisconsin. That's what I know, and I know that 424 00:29:32,240 --> 00:29:36,560 Speaker 1: in Wisconsin he is following the process to the letter 425 00:29:36,640 --> 00:29:40,080 Speaker 1: of the law. Has not gone outside that process. Some 426 00:29:40,240 --> 00:29:42,560 Speaker 1: people have wondered, what's going on here? Why aren't we 427 00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:46,120 Speaker 1: doing anything? And that's because the president is following the process. 428 00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:48,840 Speaker 1: He's following the rule of law. We first had to 429 00:29:48,880 --> 00:29:52,720 Speaker 1: go through the canvas. He then submitted his petition for recount, 430 00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:55,320 Speaker 1: he paid the three million dollars, and now we are 431 00:29:55,400 --> 00:29:58,440 Speaker 1: going through that process. We've identified to everybody in a 432 00:29:58,600 --> 00:30:01,960 Speaker 1: very transparent way, the three objections that we're going to make. 433 00:30:02,480 --> 00:30:06,400 Speaker 1: Everything from President Trump and his campaign here in Wisconsin 434 00:30:07,080 --> 00:30:10,520 Speaker 1: is very transparent about what we're doing and where we're going. 435 00:30:11,000 --> 00:30:14,240 Speaker 1: I think it's going to build confidence in the system 436 00:30:14,440 --> 00:30:17,720 Speaker 1: and then the election by going through this. If we 437 00:30:17,880 --> 00:30:22,040 Speaker 1: have a court case, that too, will be clearly played 438 00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:27,320 Speaker 1: out in court, very transparent. I don't have those concerns 439 00:30:27,360 --> 00:30:30,400 Speaker 1: here in Wisconsin because of the process that the president 440 00:30:30,560 --> 00:30:33,320 Speaker 1: is following and the team he is brought in here. 441 00:30:33,800 --> 00:30:37,680 Speaker 1: Jim Troopers, former judge here in Wisconsin, has done several 442 00:30:37,880 --> 00:30:42,680 Speaker 1: recouncis very competent, excellent lawyer, and so I think we've 443 00:30:42,720 --> 00:30:46,000 Speaker 1: got a good team in following the process to the 444 00:30:46,120 --> 00:30:48,600 Speaker 1: letter of the law, and that should really give confidence 445 00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:52,320 Speaker 1: in the electoral system. So one last question, because you've 446 00:30:52,360 --> 00:30:54,960 Speaker 1: been at this a good while, as you remember that 447 00:30:55,440 --> 00:30:58,440 Speaker 1: I've had a long relationship going all the way back 448 00:30:58,480 --> 00:31:02,800 Speaker 1: to Tommy tom since first convention when he first ran 449 00:31:02,920 --> 00:31:06,880 Speaker 1: for governor, and then through rights previous years. In two 450 00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:11,520 Speaker 1: and sixteen, remember Clisson and I were in Wisconsin going 451 00:31:11,600 --> 00:31:15,080 Speaker 1: to visit her relatives of Steven's point from White House, 452 00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:18,440 Speaker 1: who were driving through rural Wisconsin, and we ended up 453 00:31:18,560 --> 00:31:21,560 Speaker 1: on a Saturday before the election calling rins and saying, 454 00:31:21,600 --> 00:31:24,840 Speaker 1: you know, it just felt like there was a tide 455 00:31:24,960 --> 00:31:29,360 Speaker 1: building for Trump, particularly in rural Wisconsin. On election day, 456 00:31:29,600 --> 00:31:32,480 Speaker 1: were you optimistic about carrying the state or what was 457 00:31:32,560 --> 00:31:35,360 Speaker 1: your sense of the campaign at that point. I knew 458 00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:38,760 Speaker 1: it was going to be extremely close it's hard to 459 00:31:38,880 --> 00:31:42,360 Speaker 1: kind of feel twenty thousand votes right. You've been through 460 00:31:42,600 --> 00:31:46,440 Speaker 1: lots of elections and lots of races. We knew it 461 00:31:46,760 --> 00:31:50,160 Speaker 1: was a razor close race. These public polls, the ABC 462 00:31:50,400 --> 00:31:53,800 Speaker 1: poll that said the president was down by seventeen points 463 00:31:53,840 --> 00:31:57,280 Speaker 1: in Wisconsin, we knew it was ludicrous. We were looking 464 00:31:57,400 --> 00:32:00,480 Speaker 1: at our data, we were looking at our modeling. We 465 00:32:00,640 --> 00:32:03,800 Speaker 1: knew that if this election were held in September and Wisconsin, 466 00:32:03,880 --> 00:32:06,400 Speaker 1: the president would have won. He dipped a little bit 467 00:32:06,520 --> 00:32:09,640 Speaker 1: at the end of September early October, he was kind 468 00:32:09,720 --> 00:32:13,320 Speaker 1: of moving back, trying to gain that lead again, and 469 00:32:13,480 --> 00:32:15,719 Speaker 1: it was really a question of whether or not there 470 00:32:15,920 --> 00:32:19,680 Speaker 1: was enough time to recapture the lead. And that's what 471 00:32:19,880 --> 00:32:22,680 Speaker 1: we were watching. That's what we were up against. We 472 00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:26,160 Speaker 1: had all the energy, we had all the momentum. We 473 00:32:26,360 --> 00:32:29,560 Speaker 1: have the biggest field program we ever had in the 474 00:32:29,680 --> 00:32:33,960 Speaker 1: history of presidential politics here in Wisconsin. We knocked on 475 00:32:34,120 --> 00:32:37,480 Speaker 1: over two million doors, which is about two million more 476 00:32:37,560 --> 00:32:41,320 Speaker 1: than the Democrats knocked on because they actually never came back. 477 00:32:41,440 --> 00:32:45,440 Speaker 1: After COVID we went virtual until about mid June, but 478 00:32:45,600 --> 00:32:49,040 Speaker 1: after mid June, we were back on the doors doing events, 479 00:32:49,560 --> 00:32:53,040 Speaker 1: talking to people, meeting people where they are talking about 480 00:32:53,200 --> 00:32:56,640 Speaker 1: issues that they care about, and the Democrats were hiding 481 00:32:56,680 --> 00:33:00,200 Speaker 1: in their houses, and so we really felt like this 482 00:33:00,640 --> 00:33:02,720 Speaker 1: was a race that could be one, but we knew 483 00:33:02,720 --> 00:33:05,400 Speaker 1: it was going to be close, and right now we're 484 00:33:05,560 --> 00:33:09,200 Speaker 1: obviously just a little short. But I'm still hopeful that 485 00:33:09,600 --> 00:33:13,080 Speaker 1: through this process, one the legal votes are counted and 486 00:33:13,200 --> 00:33:16,200 Speaker 1: the votes that are not legally cast are excluded, the 487 00:33:16,320 --> 00:33:20,440 Speaker 1: president will actually have won Wisconsin. I want to thank 488 00:33:20,480 --> 00:33:24,240 Speaker 1: you personally for being so involved as a citizen and 489 00:33:24,400 --> 00:33:27,280 Speaker 1: for working so hard to get it to truth. We'll 490 00:33:27,360 --> 00:33:31,120 Speaker 1: find out presently whether that means the President carried it 491 00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:33,880 Speaker 1: or failed, but at least we'll know that we went 492 00:33:33,920 --> 00:33:37,720 Speaker 1: through a process that was legitimate and ruin, one where 493 00:33:37,760 --> 00:33:40,600 Speaker 1: you played a key role. So thank you very very 494 00:33:40,680 --> 00:33:43,440 Speaker 1: much for chatting with us today, and thank you for 495 00:33:43,560 --> 00:33:46,800 Speaker 1: the work you're continuing to do in Wisconsin. Well, thank you, 496 00:33:46,880 --> 00:33:50,200 Speaker 1: mister speaker. I really appreciate that very much. Thank you 497 00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:53,680 Speaker 1: for having me on and covering this very very important 498 00:33:53,760 --> 00:33:59,920 Speaker 1: story and a very important state. Thank you to my guest, 499 00:34:00,160 --> 00:34:03,360 Speaker 1: to Andrew Hitt. You can read more about the Wisconsin 500 00:34:03,440 --> 00:34:08,040 Speaker 1: presidential election and the recount on our showpage at Newtsworld 501 00:34:08,120 --> 00:34:11,520 Speaker 1: dot com. News World is produced by Gingwish, Sweet sixty 502 00:34:11,880 --> 00:34:16,280 Speaker 1: and iHeartMedia. Our executive producer is Debbie Myers, our producer 503 00:34:16,400 --> 00:34:19,520 Speaker 1: is Guards and Sloan, and our researcher is Rachel Peterson. 504 00:34:20,120 --> 00:34:22,680 Speaker 1: The artwork for the show was created by Steve Henley. 505 00:34:23,320 --> 00:34:26,480 Speaker 1: Special thanks to the team at Gingwish, Sweet sixty. Please 506 00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:29,879 Speaker 1: email me with your questions at English three sixty dot 507 00:34:29,920 --> 00:34:33,759 Speaker 1: com slash questions. I'll answer a selection of questions in 508 00:34:33,960 --> 00:34:37,319 Speaker 1: future episodes. If you've been enjoying news World, I hope 509 00:34:37,320 --> 00:34:40,040 Speaker 1: you'll go to Apple Podcast and both rate us with 510 00:34:40,200 --> 00:34:43,239 Speaker 1: five stars and give us a review so others can 511 00:34:43,400 --> 00:34:46,480 Speaker 1: learn what it's all about. I'm new English. This is 512 00:34:46,560 --> 00:34:58,880 Speaker 1: news World. This episode of newts World was originally recorded 513 00:34:58,960 --> 00:35:02,279 Speaker 1: on Friday, November twentieth. Since then, the results of the 514 00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:06,000 Speaker 1: Wisconsin election recount in Milwaukee County have been published and 515 00:35:06,080 --> 00:35:09,439 Speaker 1: can be found on our show page at newtsworld dot com. 516 00:35:10,040 --> 00:35:13,440 Speaker 1: The Dane County election recount results are due out shortly