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Speaker 1: On the Dog Cast, the questions asked if movies have

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Speaker 1: women in them, are all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands,

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Speaker 1: or do they have individualism? The patriarchy? Zef in best

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Speaker 1: start changing it with the Bell Cast. Hey, hey, Jamie, Sorry,

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Speaker 1: I wasn't expecting that, But could you look? Did you

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Speaker 1: look out the window? It's it's us out there. There's

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Speaker 1: evil doppelgang er Caitlin and Jamie outside. Oh no, but

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Speaker 1: they're cute. But I like computer than us. What if

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Speaker 1: they're nicer than us? What if they're actually not evil?

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Speaker 1: What if we're the evil ones? It's open to interpretation. Well,

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Speaker 1: guess what. Here's the twist. I am the other. I

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Speaker 1: am the one outside is the one that you thought

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Speaker 1: was me? Oh my goodness. That was an effective opening.

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Speaker 1: That was our best on ye yet I think. Welcome

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Speaker 1: to the Bechtel Cast. My name is Caitlin Darante, names

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Speaker 1: Jamie Loftus, and this is our podcast about the representation

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Speaker 1: of of of of a lot of things in movies.

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Speaker 1: We we come to some of your favorite movies using

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Speaker 1: an intersectional lend, using the Bechtel test as a jumping

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Speaker 1: off point for a discussion, and the Bechtel Test, of course,

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Speaker 1: being if you're not familiar, if this is your first

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Speaker 1: episode ever and you've never heard I think this will

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Speaker 1: be a fun point of entry this. This would be

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Speaker 1: a fun first episode. Yeah, so welcome. The Bechtel Test

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Speaker 1: is a media metric uh sometimes known as the Bechtel

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Speaker 1: Wallace Test, was created by cartoonist Allison Bechtel, and it

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Speaker 1: requires for our purposes, this is our rendition of it,

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Speaker 1: because there are various versions of the test, but ours

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Speaker 1: is that two people of any marginalized gender, they have

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Speaker 1: to have names. They have to speak to each other

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Speaker 1: about something other than a man for at least two

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Speaker 1: lines of dialogue. That's our bar, my favorite, and I

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Speaker 1: suppose so this is just a jumping out point for discussion.

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Speaker 1: So I can already say this movie passes the Bechtel test.

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Speaker 1: But one of my favorite passes is when it's Lupete

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Speaker 1: and Younga and Elizabeth Moss talking to each other about

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Speaker 1: how Lupide doesn't really want to talk to her, and

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Speaker 1: Elizabeth pass is like, oh okay, totally, like that's a past.

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Speaker 1: She's like, are you okay, Lupeta, and She's just like,

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Speaker 1: I'm not good at talk I don't really want to

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Speaker 1: talk to you right It was one of my favorite

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Speaker 1: passes of this movie, or really of the cast at all. Like,

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Speaker 1: you know, two women agreeing that they don't really want

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Speaker 1: to talk right now, that's a pass um. And we're

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Speaker 1: so excited to bring back a a much beloved guest

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Speaker 1: for a movie that she was really excited to talk

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Speaker 1: about that is a much requested movie on the cast.

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Speaker 1: The movie, of course being US Jordan peels us from

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Speaker 1: and the guest, of course being writer, actor, co host

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Speaker 1: of the podcast Popcorn Book Club and recent guest on

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Speaker 1: our Cheetah Girls episode It's Karamadonqua. Hello and welcome back.

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Speaker 1: Thank you, thank you so much for having me back. Um,

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Speaker 1: I am so excited. Like Jamie said, I was very

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Speaker 1: excited to talk about this movie. I think I sent

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Speaker 1: you an email with seven different us is on it.

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Speaker 1: I was like, I can talk about any of these movies,

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Speaker 1: also US and this movie and also US and I know,

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Speaker 1: I don't know US. Maybe it's and it's been a

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Speaker 1: movie that has been requested by listeners since before it

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Speaker 1: came out. So we are we are so excited that

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Speaker 1: you're back. Welcome back. How are you I am good.

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Speaker 1: I am you know here, which is more than a

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Speaker 1: lot of people can say. And I'm very happy for

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Speaker 1: that have not been killed by an evil doubelganger or

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Speaker 1: a coronavirus yet, So knock on wood, knock on wood.

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Speaker 1: That keeps being true. So tell us what is your

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Speaker 1: relationship with the film US? Why of the list that

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Speaker 1: you provided was it on their seven times? Um? Well,

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Speaker 1: I saw US. I would just like to shout out

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Speaker 1: my friend Mike. He took me with him to an

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Speaker 1: advanced screening of US, so I got to see it

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Speaker 1: before it was officially released to the public. He works

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Speaker 1: at BuzzFeed, so they had like a little screening thing

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Speaker 1: for BuzzFeed people and he was like, do you want

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Speaker 1: to be my plus one? And I'm like, good because

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Speaker 1: if you would ask one of your white friends, I

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Speaker 1: would have felt funny. So I got to see I

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Speaker 1: think it was like a couple of weeks before it

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Speaker 1: was released to the public, and I was just struck

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Speaker 1: by And I love horror and growing up as a

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Speaker 1: black person not seeing myself in a ton of horror

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Speaker 1: or seeing myself as like definitely never a final girl

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Speaker 1: in horror. Uh sucked? Um Like I think Screen. I

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Speaker 1: love Scream. That's one of my favorite horror franchises. I'm

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Speaker 1: so excited they're making a new one because I've seen

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Speaker 1: all four Screen movies, all three seasons of the television show,

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Speaker 1: which no one watched. I was like, I totally forgot

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Speaker 1: that was the thing, yeah, for multiple seasons. So um.

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Speaker 1: I think Scream Too was the movie that was the

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Speaker 1: only Screen movie that had any black characters in it.

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Speaker 1: And they killed Jada Pinkett Smith in the cold open

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Speaker 1: in the movie theater. It was a beautiful scene, love her.

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Speaker 1: Like after acknowledging, they're like, wow, horror movies always killed

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Speaker 1: the black characters right away, and then the black characters

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Speaker 1: get killed right away immediately, like four seconds after they're

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Speaker 1: done saying that sentence. So just Jordan Peele bringing black

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Speaker 1: horror sort of to the forefront of the horror conversation

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Speaker 1: is exciting and like, I feel like this much more

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Speaker 1: than Get Out, leans into horror more than comedy, though

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Speaker 1: he is sort of on the line of both, which

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Speaker 1: I think is great, and I love that tradition, which

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Speaker 1: is one of the reasons I like the Scream franchise

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Speaker 1: so much. So I'm excited about talking about black horror

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Speaker 1: and I love Lupe Tonyongo just always forever, and so yeah,

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Speaker 1: I just love everything about this movie. And it's there

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Speaker 1: they have matching jumpsuits. I mean, it's fashioned forward, it's

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Speaker 1: got everything. Yeah, the I mean the tethered I think.

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Speaker 1: I mean from a well we'll talk about all the complexities,

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Speaker 1: but from a fashion perspective, I mean, hands down, you

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Speaker 1: gotta admire it. We deserve to die for not coordinating

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Speaker 1: our outfits, just like on that basis alone, it's like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: you guys underground and they got it together? Yeah, how

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Speaker 1: how did they do that? Where they get them? That

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Speaker 1: is my main question, Like, I have a lot of questions.

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Speaker 1: I do think that it's hard to talk about this

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Speaker 1: movie without talking about get Out because it was like

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Speaker 1: everybody's comparing it to get Out and get Out with

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Speaker 1: so critically acclaimed, and I think that it is not

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Speaker 1: as good of a movie as get Out in terms

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Speaker 1: of it's not as tight, but I like it better. Interesting. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'm I'm really excited. It's it's weird because it's like

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Speaker 1: because especially when it's like a director's second movie, it's

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Speaker 1: impossible to not be tempted to compare it to the first,

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Speaker 1: but in terms I mean the conversation surrounding the two

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Speaker 1: movies were also very, very different in ways that I

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Speaker 1: think are really interesting and excited to get into it. Kimmy,

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Speaker 1: what's your Wow, We're us, It's us. I saw this

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Speaker 1: movie shortly after I came out. I saw it in

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Speaker 1: theaters twice because I was really confused the first time,

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Speaker 1: and then did a little bit of reading, a little

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Speaker 1: bit of research, and then was really excited to go

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Speaker 1: back and see it again. And then when it hits streaming,

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Speaker 1: I think I've seen I think this was the fourth

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Speaker 1: or fifth time I've watched this movie. It is a

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Speaker 1: very rewarding movie on the rewatch. I think, like it

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Speaker 1: really is watched in theaters three times, I think, and

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Speaker 1: then I've watched it again like four or five times since,

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Speaker 1: so I've seen it almost ten and it's like free time.

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Speaker 1: It is. So I don't know, like I I really respect,

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Speaker 1: especially like a director that can put a lot of

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Speaker 1: references in their work without like feeling like they're being

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Speaker 1: like thrown at you and you're being back show Like

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Speaker 1: it doesn't feel like a Gilmore Girls episode kind of

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Speaker 1: level of we're just like, Okay, I love the Chudd

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Speaker 1: reference right right, Like but they're but they're so subtle,

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Speaker 1: and like there's a Goonies reference, but if you haven't

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Speaker 1: seen the Goonies, you don't really lose anything, Like I

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Speaker 1: just I don't know. I think his style of writing

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Speaker 1: in this movie in particular is really layered and cool,

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Speaker 1: and I like saw stuff on this viewing I didn't

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Speaker 1: realize on the first and yeah, I'm a big fan.

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Speaker 1: What about you, Caitlin. I also saw it numerous times

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Speaker 1: in theaters. The first time was with Jamie, our mutual

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Speaker 1: friend Bryant. We had to go to one of my

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Speaker 1: favorite bars that I haven't been to in what feels

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Speaker 1: like years now for obvious reasons. But afterwards we were like,

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Speaker 1: there's so much to talk about. So we went to

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Speaker 1: this bar and uh talked about the movie for like

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Speaker 1: three hours and we were just like, what did we

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Speaker 1: just watch? What did it all mean? No? No, I

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Speaker 1: missed doing that, I know. And then I saw it

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Speaker 1: again in theaters with my friend Nolan, and you know,

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Speaker 1: we had a similar like hours long discussion afterward and

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Speaker 1: both times, and I've also seen it about I think

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Speaker 1: four times. Now Here's the thing. I'll be completely honest

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Speaker 1: about this. I really really liked this movie for the

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Speaker 1: first of it, and then the last ten fifteen minutes

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Speaker 1: or so. And this is completely from a screenwriting standpoint,

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Speaker 1: it loses me. I think some choices were made in

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Speaker 1: the writing. I think this is a movie that you

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Speaker 1: didn't need to explain where the tethered come from or

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Speaker 1: what the origins are in like different like like. I

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Speaker 1: think it would have served the story a little bit

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Speaker 1: better if we had just not been given any explanation

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Speaker 1: of the origin. And and maybe that actually does something

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Speaker 1: to mess up the intent of the allegory and stuff

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Speaker 1: like that. I'm not totally sure, because I also don't

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Speaker 1: really know what the allegory is supposed to be entirely

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Speaker 1: not don't exactly because there's so many interpretations. Um. But

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Speaker 1: from a strictly screenwriting point of view, I was like,

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Speaker 1: oh man, I don't like that they tried to explain

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Speaker 1: some of the stuff that I felt could have just

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Speaker 1: been left unexplained. But for the first again, ninety percent

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Speaker 1: of the movie, I'm like, this is awesome. I love

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Speaker 1: this family, I love their journey. I've come I've come

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Speaker 1: around on the ending, This was the first viewing where

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Speaker 1: I'm like, I think the because I felt the same

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Speaker 1: way that you did. But then I like, weirdly turned

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Speaker 1: a corner at some point where maybe I was reading.

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Speaker 1: I read a lot of new analysis that had come

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Speaker 1: out since I last was seeking out analysis on this movie,

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Speaker 1: and I don't know, I'm excited to talk about it

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Speaker 1: because I've turned a corner on the ending of the

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Speaker 1: movie and now I'm pro, Wow, I'm fifty fifty. I

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Speaker 1: think it's depends on the day. I'm like, on a Tuesday,

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Speaker 1: I'm like, yeah, this is a great ending, but catch

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Speaker 1: me on a Thursday. Who knows, who know exactly. This

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Speaker 1: was also the first viewing of the movie too where

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Speaker 1: I like, I had never really sought out any information

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Speaker 1: on the music of this movie, but the story of

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Speaker 1: like how the music was composed as really interesting as well.

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Speaker 1: Michael Abels is an incredible composer. I loved him. I

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Speaker 1: think he's great. One of my friends actually wrote a

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Speaker 1: movie that Michael Labels did the music for that came

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Speaker 1: out in April. Yeah, it's called Bad Education. It's on HBO.

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Speaker 1: I've seen that movie. Yeah, Yeah, my movie is awesome. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: my friend Mike different Mike than took me to this

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Speaker 1: movie though, I did he get out with the mic

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Speaker 1: who wrote Bad Education? Uh? Yeah, my friend Mic wrote it.

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Speaker 1: He's incredible. Love him to death. Oh that's so everyone

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Speaker 1: should watch Bad Education. I really enjoyed it. That's so cool. Nice.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, Michael Abels is just like a genius. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's amazing. Like where I don't know, Like I we

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Speaker 1: don't talk about scoring very often on our feminist movie podcast,

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Speaker 1: which I guess fair enough, but there is like there's

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Speaker 1: just so much to talk about about. How where he

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Speaker 1: was pulling from And like I was, I was like, oh,

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Speaker 1: what are they saying in the in the theme and

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Speaker 1: it's nonsense, it's nothing. He made he made it up.

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Speaker 1: Like I don't know, there's so much cool stuff. Well

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Speaker 1: shall we dive in with the recap? It? All right?

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Speaker 1: So we open with text on the screen saying that

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Speaker 1: there are thousands of miles of underground tunnels in the US.

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Speaker 1: They're abandoned subways, service routes, mine shafts, and then others

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Speaker 1: that have no known purpose at all to be where

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Speaker 1: the tethered live. Every time I watched the movie, I

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Speaker 1: forget that that's the beginning, because my brain has to

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Speaker 1: forget that so that I can walk around on top

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Speaker 1: of these times. Yeah. Uh, now, it's like that. Every

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Speaker 1: time you watch it. It's like you think about that

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Speaker 1: non stuff for a week and then it just kind

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Speaker 1: of leaves you until the next time and you're like, oh, no,

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Speaker 1: the tunnels, because is that true? Yes, Oh my gosh, yeah,

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Speaker 1: there are a lot. I actually did some reading on tunnels,

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Speaker 1: and right around the time the movie came out, there

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Speaker 1: was a book that was released. I can't remember the author.

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Speaker 1: I didn't write it down because I was like, i'll remember, sure,

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Speaker 1: but it's called Underground and then it has a subtitle

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Speaker 1: and it talks about all of the various tunnels that

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Speaker 1: exist under major cities that are not being used and

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Speaker 1: I shouldn't say are not being used. A lot of

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Speaker 1: them are actually being occupied by people who are experiencing homelessness,

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Speaker 1: and some some of them are in New York City,

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Speaker 1: some of them are in Chicago. There's some in Los Angeles,

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Speaker 1: and I was like, no, oh, don't tell me that,

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Speaker 1: Like in downtown Los Angeles there are tunnels that were

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Speaker 1: possibly used by bootleggers, but were the original subway in

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Speaker 1: Los Angeles before it shut down, and then they made

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Speaker 1: a new subway, so the original Redline tunnels are just

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Speaker 1: abandoned and I didn't know that. I'm so curious how

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Speaker 1: one would even to one of these tunnels and figure

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Speaker 1: that out. Right, right, you go down an escalator that

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Speaker 1: is on the other side of the door at a

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Speaker 1: fun house of mirrors, well maintained escalator. I love the

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Speaker 1: escalator shot so much goodness. That's the opening. Then we

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Speaker 1: cut to a close up on like an eighties style TV.

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Speaker 1: We see an ad for hands across America, and then

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Speaker 1: we meet a little girl, adelaide A k Addie, the

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Speaker 1: cutest child. Shout out to all the child actors in

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Speaker 1: this movie because they all do a terrific job. Incredible,

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Speaker 1: so good and and it also made me just appreciate

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Speaker 1: Jordan Peel's directing again, where I know that he pulls

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Speaker 1: a lot from Kubrick, who is like so notoriously a

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Speaker 1: shitty person towards actors. But you can just tell, like

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Speaker 1: there were even certain shots because I think I've just

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Speaker 1: seen this movie enough times to notice the shot changes

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Speaker 1: and stuff where you're like, oh, if that was Kubrick,

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Speaker 1: he would have just let that kid walk into a mirror.

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Speaker 1: But Jordan Peel cuts to another shot and it's like,

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Speaker 1: don't hurt yourself. It's okay, Like, I don't know that

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Speaker 1: was I don't know why I'm an extra notice that

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Speaker 1: this time. Yeah, so we meet Addie. It's nineteen six,

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Speaker 1: which is the year I was born. Thank you so

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Speaker 1: much everybody. Um. Yes, actually hands across America happened like

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Speaker 1: a week after I was born. Um, I've just remembered

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Speaker 1: how close you were born to Robert Pattinson as well.

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Speaker 1: When I was just googling Robert Pattinson last night. Wait,

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Speaker 1: is he my age? Yeah? I think he's born like

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Speaker 1: the week the same week as you. Oh my god. Robert. Also,

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Speaker 1: Winston Duke is like, is my age? He's actually a

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Speaker 1: few months younger than me, So you should hang out.

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Speaker 1: I will say that was the one thing for me

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Speaker 1: where Winston Duke and Lupete and Youngo do not seem

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Speaker 1: old enough to have a teenage daughter. Yet I agree

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Speaker 1: on the first like four watches, I didn't think about it,

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Speaker 1: and then afterwards I was like, wait a Seger, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: we Robert Pattinson, Ma, whoa, he's like four days older

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Speaker 1: than me. Then oh my gosh, Robert, let's get married,

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Speaker 1: because that's how you know if you're compatible someone you

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Speaker 1: have similar birthdays. Okay, So Addie is with her parents

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Speaker 1: at like the boardwalk like carnivali area in Santa Cruz, California.

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Speaker 1: She wanders off and goes into this creepy house of

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Speaker 1: mirrors where she encounters another little girl who appears to

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Speaker 1: look exactly like her, and we're like, and then smash

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Speaker 1: cut to a close up of a rabbit and there's

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Speaker 1: like this creepy chanting uh, and then we pull out

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Speaker 1: to show hundreds of rabbits. That was the coolest scene

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Speaker 1: to see in the theater ever, because you do you're

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Speaker 1: not expecting it, and you're just like, oh my god,

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Speaker 1: there's there's more rabbits, and then there's even more rabbits,

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Speaker 1: and then it's and then so long and yeah, it's

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Speaker 1: like they're telling you you're going to go down a

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Speaker 1: rabbit hole. Wow. I had a lot of fun looking

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Speaker 1: for like this really deep layered symbolism of the rabbits,

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Speaker 1: which I did find. There's been a lot of writing

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Speaker 1: about it, but all I've been able to find from

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Speaker 1: Jordan Peelee is He's just like, I am personally afraid

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Speaker 1: of rabbits, and you're like, oh cool. It doesn't always

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Speaker 1: have to mean something sometimes sometimes Alfonso Korn is like,

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Speaker 1: the reason that green is a prominent color in The

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Speaker 1: Little Princess is because I like the color green. At

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Speaker 1: the end, you're like, oh yeah, it's dear a movie.

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Speaker 1: I guess you could do whatever you want. Um okay,

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Speaker 1: the rabbits and then we cut to adult Adelaide who's

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Speaker 1: played by Lupida and Yongo, and she has a husband

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Speaker 1: Gabe that's Winston Duke, a teenage daughter, Zora, and a

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Speaker 1: younger son, Jason. This family, the Wilsons, arrive at their

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Speaker 1: summer home that is not far from Santa Cruz, California.

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Speaker 1: Then we flashed to Addie as a child. Her parents

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Speaker 1: have brought her to a child psychologist because she hasn't

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Speaker 1: spoken since she went into this House of mirrors, but

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Speaker 1: we don't know why. We assume she's been traumatized by

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Speaker 1: this interaction with this other doppelgang or girl. Then we

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Speaker 1: cut back to the present um the family goes to

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Speaker 1: the beach in Santa Cruz against the same one where

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Speaker 1: this incident happened. They meet their friends Kitty and Josh,

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Speaker 1: played by Elizabeth Moss and Tim Hidecker, who you don't

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Speaker 1: think are going to work as a couple until they do.

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Speaker 1: Until they do, it just does it, just does work.

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Speaker 1: But also I'm like, they have teen Elizabeth Moss can't

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Speaker 1: have a seventeen year old daughter. I don't huh whatever,

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I guess I don't know how old. I

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Speaker 1: mean she has, she's had work done, so I guess

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Speaker 1: maybe we're supposed to think that she's older than she looks.

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Speaker 1: That's true, not the character Kitty has had work done.

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Speaker 1: I am not. No one sued me for accusings of

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Speaker 1: having worked on because she's thirty eight. I mean, I

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Speaker 1: guess if she and which means she would have been

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Speaker 1: like thirties six or seven. It doesn't matter. They have

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Speaker 1: teenage twins, is true. Becca and Lindsay are their names.

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Speaker 1: So they're on the beach. Jason sees this scary guy

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Speaker 1: on the beach is like hand is dripping with blood.

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Speaker 1: Adelaide freaks out because she thinks Jason has gone missing.

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Speaker 1: And there's all these other like weird coincidences that are

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Speaker 1: happening with like spiders and frisbees, and eleven eleven make

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Speaker 1: a wish, and I know eleven eleven is bad, and

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Speaker 1: this I was like, wait, it's not a junior high

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Speaker 1: school student making a wish. I can't relate because it's

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Speaker 1: a biblical reference that I don't remember the exact Jeremiah

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Speaker 1: eleven eleven, and I believe it was Jeremiah. Again. I

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Speaker 1: was like, I'll remember that. I don't need to write

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Speaker 1: that one down. I'm I'm over to I've got a

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Speaker 1: little analysis section on the on the bable versus because

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Speaker 1: I'm not I'm not very Bible literate myself. That someone was, um,

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Speaker 1: someone on the Great White Internet was kind enough to

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Speaker 1: break it down. Well, yeah, I think that I'm not

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Speaker 1: super vible literate. I will say my favorite translation is

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Speaker 1: definitely King James because I think it slaps and like

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Speaker 1: the new International version, I'm just like, this is boring.

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Speaker 1: Where's the poetry? Where's the moving? King James keeps it

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Speaker 1: moving and I appreciate that. But I think the gist

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Speaker 1: of the Jeremiah eleven eleven passage is y'all are going

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Speaker 1: to cry out and I'm not gonna do ship. Love

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Speaker 1: you God. That is yeah, that the cliffs notes and

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Speaker 1: then if you go back averse to Jeremiah eleven ten,

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Speaker 1: there it's all like sins of the ancestors, sins of

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Speaker 1: the Father, and it's like for certain reads of this movie,

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Speaker 1: like if you're like, oh, I think Jordan Peele may

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Speaker 1: have read back a verse or two. Who knows Jeordan

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Speaker 1: Jordan Okay. So that night they're back at home and

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Speaker 1: Adelaide tells Gabe about the night that she saw a

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Speaker 1: little girl who looked just like her when she was

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Speaker 1: a child, and that how her whole life. She felt

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Speaker 1: that she's been coming for her, and that all these

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Speaker 1: little coincidences that have been happening to her, it feels

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Speaker 1: like this person is getting closer and closer, and then

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Speaker 1: suddenly they lose power. And then Jason is like, by

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Speaker 1: the way, there's a family in our driveway, And sure enough,

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Speaker 1: there's a family in their driveway, and this family invades

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Speaker 1: the Wilson home and they realize that it's them. It's Adelaide, Gabe, Zora,

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Speaker 1: and Jason. But it's like scary doppel ganger versions of

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Speaker 1: them who are wearing red jumpsuits and carrying scissors. Now,

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Speaker 1: scary doppelganger Adelaide ak Red explains that Adelaide and Red

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Speaker 1: are tethered together. Every thing that Adelaide did in her life,

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Speaker 1: Read also did, but like a horrible version of it.

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Speaker 1: So instead of eating warm meals and playing with nice toys,

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Speaker 1: she ate rabbits and had sharp toys. Instead of falling

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Speaker 1: in love and getting married and starting a family, Read

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Speaker 1: was forced to do these things. And now she wants

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Speaker 1: to become untethered, and the way to do that is

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Speaker 1: by killing Adelaide and her family. The pairs of the

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Speaker 1: Doppelgangers kind of break off. There's fighting, there's chasing their injuries.

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Speaker 1: There's the boat scene. I love them. I'm obsessed with

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Speaker 1: the boat. I love that the boat is called the Crawdaddy.

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Speaker 1: All the boats have great names in this um. Josh's

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Speaker 1: boat is called the b Yacht but with ch in

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Speaker 1: the middle. Um. And then I love how Winston Duke's

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Speaker 1: character gave when he's like, oh, this is a home invasion, Okay,

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Speaker 1: just give them what they want, protector bodily stuff, and

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Speaker 1: then just give them whatever they want, Like you can

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Speaker 1: have the boat and the daughters like dad, no one wants.

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Speaker 1: It's so good. Yeah, She's like, like, tears are streaming

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Speaker 1: down her face and she's like, shut up, dad, no

404
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Speaker 1: one wants your boat. Okay. So there's all these altercations,

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Speaker 1: but the Wilson's eventually managed to get away in the

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Speaker 1: boat and they head over to Josh and Kitties, who

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Speaker 1: surprise also have scary doppelgangers who have killed that whole family.

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Speaker 1: So when Adelaide and her family show up to Josh

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Speaker 1: and Kitties, they have to fight scary Tim Hidecker and

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Speaker 1: scary Elizabeth Moss. But do they think are the character names? Yes,

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Speaker 1: they do. They have been given names like on I

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Speaker 1: AMDB and like in the script, but I don't think

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Speaker 1: we ever hear those ones. It's like texts and Dahlia

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Speaker 1: and something else. So the Wilson's managed to kill them

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Speaker 1: and the twin daughters and stuff, and then they turn

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Speaker 1: on the TV and they learn that there are many,

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Speaker 1: many more of these doppelgangers. Basically, everyone alive on Earth,

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Speaker 1: or at least in the US, seems to have a

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Speaker 1: doppelganger in the US or the US. Think about it.

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Speaker 1: It makes you think. And so the doppelgangers have been

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Speaker 1: killing there above ground counterparts and then gathering and holding

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Speaker 1: hands not on like hands across America. So the Wilson

423
00:24:38,280 --> 00:24:42,119
Speaker 1: family takes off. They head to back to the boardwalk

424
00:24:42,160 --> 00:24:44,359
Speaker 1: area because they're going to like drive. The plan is

425
00:24:44,400 --> 00:24:47,760
Speaker 1: to drive to Mexico along the coast, but they get

426
00:24:47,880 --> 00:24:52,560
Speaker 1: interrupted because Jason scary. Jason is their a k a. Pluto,

427
00:24:53,240 --> 00:24:57,120
Speaker 1: But it's a trap that enables Read to kidnap Jason.

428
00:24:57,240 --> 00:25:00,600
Speaker 1: She takes him underground via the House of Mirror, so

429
00:25:00,680 --> 00:25:03,960
Speaker 1: Adelaide goes in after him and she ends up deep underground.

430
00:25:04,119 --> 00:25:07,399
Speaker 1: We see the dwelling, you know, these tunnels where the

431
00:25:07,440 --> 00:25:12,600
Speaker 1: tethered have been living. She finds Red, who explains that

432
00:25:12,680 --> 00:25:19,080
Speaker 1: the tethered are like clones or copies of people, but

433
00:25:19,160 --> 00:25:22,840
Speaker 1: they don't have souls. They were created. There's like the

434
00:25:22,880 --> 00:25:26,479
Speaker 1: illusions of this sort of like science experiment gone wrong,

435
00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:31,200
Speaker 1: but it was failed and the clones or the copies

436
00:25:31,359 --> 00:25:34,879
Speaker 1: were abandoned, but they kind of just had to live on,

437
00:25:35,160 --> 00:25:39,760
Speaker 1: remaining tethered to their above ground counterparts. As this is happening,

438
00:25:39,960 --> 00:25:45,520
Speaker 1: we get flashbacks where we see getting into the twist

439
00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:49,359
Speaker 1: is moment. But yes, yes, we're seeing like Addie as

440
00:25:49,359 --> 00:25:53,520
Speaker 1: a kid and Red as a kid, and the carnival

441
00:25:53,600 --> 00:25:55,920
Speaker 1: and how they sort of came together and met up,

442
00:25:56,560 --> 00:26:00,560
Speaker 1: but the tethered were like, oh, look at the little girl.

443
00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:03,600
Speaker 1: She's going to be the one to save us from

444
00:26:03,600 --> 00:26:07,080
Speaker 1: this misery. And Red explains how, you know, she had

445
00:26:07,200 --> 00:26:10,880
Speaker 1: orchestrated this whole movement where they would rise above and

446
00:26:11,320 --> 00:26:14,760
Speaker 1: kill their above ground counterparts, the untethering, she calls it

447
00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:17,720
Speaker 1: the untethering. And then you see this cool montage where

448
00:26:17,720 --> 00:26:19,720
Speaker 1: they get their suits, and you're like, where they get

449
00:26:19,720 --> 00:26:21,840
Speaker 1: the suits? Where they where they get the scissors? Where

450
00:26:21,840 --> 00:26:24,679
Speaker 1: did they get where they get the shoes? There might

451
00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:27,199
Speaker 1: be manufacturing down there. We don't we don't really know

452
00:26:27,240 --> 00:26:30,439
Speaker 1: what the what the system is like could be. And

453
00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:34,879
Speaker 1: then Adelaide and Red fight most of the time Red

454
00:26:34,960 --> 00:26:38,720
Speaker 1: has the upper hand. The score really shines here, and

455
00:26:38,760 --> 00:26:43,760
Speaker 1: then Adelaide finally kills Red and rescues Jason. Their back

456
00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:48,080
Speaker 1: above ground, the Wilson family reunites, and then we get

457
00:26:48,600 --> 00:26:52,960
Speaker 1: a flashback where the big twist is revealed. We see

458
00:26:53,119 --> 00:26:56,280
Speaker 1: Adelaide and Red when they have met in the House

459
00:26:56,280 --> 00:26:59,919
Speaker 1: of Mirrors as children, and we see that Red caps

460
00:27:00,480 --> 00:27:04,920
Speaker 1: Adelaide switched places with her, so that Addie has actually

461
00:27:04,960 --> 00:27:09,520
Speaker 1: been a tethered this whole time. And Red was actually

462
00:27:09,920 --> 00:27:13,160
Speaker 1: little Addie the whole time. And then we zoom out

463
00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:16,480
Speaker 1: and we see that the Tethered are holding hands across America.

464
00:27:18,000 --> 00:27:21,760
Speaker 1: And then that is the end of their helet afters

465
00:27:22,119 --> 00:27:26,480
Speaker 1: what are they doing? Who? Pilot? Who? Who is it? Tethereds?

466
00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:32,040
Speaker 1: I don't know, they don't know all that and more

467
00:27:32,400 --> 00:27:35,679
Speaker 1: will discuss, but first we're going to take a break,

468
00:27:36,040 --> 00:27:44,800
Speaker 1: and then we'll come right back and we're back. Where

469
00:27:44,880 --> 00:27:49,280
Speaker 1: to begin? Where to begin? Here's here's here's a fact

470
00:27:49,320 --> 00:27:52,639
Speaker 1: that's just pure fun. Sure, I get you know, you

471
00:27:52,640 --> 00:27:55,280
Speaker 1: know how at the beginning, Um, they're talking when they're

472
00:27:55,320 --> 00:27:57,800
Speaker 1: on the boardwalk in the eighties, they're like, oh, I

473
00:27:57,840 --> 00:27:59,960
Speaker 1: think a movie is shooting around here. It's the Law

474
00:28:00,000 --> 00:28:05,200
Speaker 1: Lost Boys. Yes, it's The Lost Boy That is fun.

475
00:28:07,640 --> 00:28:10,440
Speaker 1: I was like, Oh, that's it. That's Jordan Peel hides

476
00:28:10,440 --> 00:28:12,399
Speaker 1: so much cool stuff in here that I was like, wait,

477
00:28:13,040 --> 00:28:16,720
Speaker 1: that's the Last Boys. His little Easter eggs, which the

478
00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:18,920
Speaker 1: little rabbits. What if? What if those are just a

479
00:28:18,960 --> 00:28:21,639
Speaker 1: bunch of little Easter bunnies hiding all the Easter eggs

480
00:28:21,640 --> 00:28:26,440
Speaker 1: around his movies to find them. So that's that, Um,

481
00:28:26,520 --> 00:28:31,240
Speaker 1: anything else we want to discuss or Nope. At the end,

482
00:28:31,359 --> 00:28:35,160
Speaker 1: I find it interesting this time rewatching it. I rewatched

483
00:28:35,160 --> 00:28:39,120
Speaker 1: it twice before we talked, because why not. And I

484
00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:43,960
Speaker 1: realized on the second rewatch for this discussion that it

485
00:28:44,040 --> 00:28:47,160
Speaker 1: was ADDIE's birthday when they were at the board walk,

486
00:28:47,160 --> 00:28:49,760
Speaker 1: which was not something I had picked up on any

487
00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:54,600
Speaker 1: other viewing. Yes, because he wins her, her dad wins

488
00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:57,320
Speaker 1: her the Thriller shirt right, or she's like having to

489
00:28:57,360 --> 00:28:59,920
Speaker 1: pick what prize and then her mom's like, it's your birthday,

490
00:29:00,040 --> 00:29:03,160
Speaker 1: you do whatever you want. Yeah, it was like what

491
00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:07,400
Speaker 1: a day? What an intense birthday? Bad birthday? They made

492
00:29:07,400 --> 00:29:11,000
Speaker 1: me wonder do the tether to have any concept of birthdays?

493
00:29:11,040 --> 00:29:13,800
Speaker 1: Like they have to understand what they are because there's

494
00:29:14,120 --> 00:29:17,080
Speaker 1: it's a mirror, So whatever we're doing above ground, they're

495
00:29:17,120 --> 00:29:21,000
Speaker 1: doing underground. So it's like they're just doing the like

496
00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:23,280
Speaker 1: worst case scenario version. So I guess that they would

497
00:29:23,320 --> 00:29:27,560
Speaker 1: have worst case scenario birthdays. Yeah, I guess. So I

498
00:29:27,600 --> 00:29:30,960
Speaker 1: mean red mentions Christmas. She's like, on Christmas, I opened

499
00:29:30,960 --> 00:29:33,320
Speaker 1: my toys and they were sharp and cold and cut

500
00:29:33,320 --> 00:29:35,400
Speaker 1: my fingers when I played with them. So I think

501
00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:37,880
Speaker 1: they get the concept of holidays. Yeah, but Red also

502
00:29:37,960 --> 00:29:42,520
Speaker 1: wasn't above ground person before, so that also who knows.

503
00:29:42,920 --> 00:29:45,240
Speaker 1: I don't know, I don't know. I don't know anything,

504
00:29:45,400 --> 00:29:47,200
Speaker 1: And I love that I don't know anything. It's so

505
00:29:47,280 --> 00:29:50,680
Speaker 1: much to explore. It's like tunnels of movie reference and

506
00:29:51,360 --> 00:29:55,920
Speaker 1: so many tunnels. Also in that um that sequence on

507
00:29:56,360 --> 00:30:00,680
Speaker 1: the boardwalk, there's so I'll just go back and hit

508
00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:02,880
Speaker 1: the Bible verse really quick, well, because we were just

509
00:30:02,880 --> 00:30:07,120
Speaker 1: talking about it anyways. So you see an unhoused man

510
00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:10,440
Speaker 1: on the pier holding a sign that says Jeremiah eleven eleven,

511
00:30:10,880 --> 00:30:15,920
Speaker 1: which says, I mean charma. I think you honestly, uh,

512
00:30:16,120 --> 00:30:19,280
Speaker 1: summarize it pretty well, says Therefore, thus say it the Lord.

513
00:30:19,360 --> 00:30:21,560
Speaker 1: I will bring on them a disaster they cannot escape,

514
00:30:21,560 --> 00:30:23,120
Speaker 1: although they will cry out to me, I will not

515
00:30:23,200 --> 00:30:25,440
Speaker 1: listen to them. Then, if you go back a verse,

516
00:30:26,040 --> 00:30:29,520
Speaker 1: it says in Jeremiah one ten, they have returned to

517
00:30:29,560 --> 00:30:32,080
Speaker 1: the sins of their ancestors, who refused to listen to

518
00:30:32,160 --> 00:30:35,000
Speaker 1: MY words. They have followed other gods to serve them.

519
00:30:35,080 --> 00:30:38,360
Speaker 1: Both Israel and Judah have broken the covenant I made

520
00:30:38,360 --> 00:30:41,720
Speaker 1: with their ancestors. Don't know what the last sentence is,

521
00:30:42,440 --> 00:30:48,200
Speaker 1: but the read that I feel closest to on this view,

522
00:30:48,280 --> 00:30:50,920
Speaker 1: and again it's like changed over time, but the view

523
00:30:51,320 --> 00:30:54,000
Speaker 1: I've the read of the movie that I feel closest

524
00:30:54,040 --> 00:30:57,480
Speaker 1: to on this day, I felt like finding out that

525
00:30:57,640 --> 00:31:05,360
Speaker 1: verse was really helpful and kind of solidifying that interesting. Yeah, well,

526
00:31:05,400 --> 00:31:09,120
Speaker 1: I think before we maybe dive into the nitty gritty

527
00:31:09,160 --> 00:31:13,160
Speaker 1: of all the readings and the symbolism and allegories and things,

528
00:31:13,200 --> 00:31:16,960
Speaker 1: I kind of wanted to touch on the way that

529
00:31:17,360 --> 00:31:21,960
Speaker 1: horror movies have historically treated black people and black characters

530
00:31:22,920 --> 00:31:28,520
Speaker 1: because you wouldn't believe it, but it's been terrible. Um

531
00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:33,200
Speaker 1: there's a really good documentary called Horror Noir, A History

532
00:31:33,200 --> 00:31:37,400
Speaker 1: of Black Horror. That's a Shutter original documentary. UM So

533
00:31:37,440 --> 00:31:41,360
Speaker 1: I would recommend watching that to the listeners, but it

534
00:31:41,400 --> 00:31:44,280
Speaker 1: does a deep dive of this, but basically a very

535
00:31:44,320 --> 00:31:50,640
Speaker 1: brief overview of the representation of black characters in cinema historically,

536
00:31:50,680 --> 00:31:55,800
Speaker 1: again has been terrible. There's a long history of black

537
00:31:55,880 --> 00:32:00,360
Speaker 1: men in particular being shown as villains who brutal lies

538
00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:03,680
Speaker 1: white women. A lot of that was white actors in

539
00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:08,400
Speaker 1: black face. There is a long history of the magical

540
00:32:08,440 --> 00:32:12,320
Speaker 1: negro trope being used in horror films. There's the widely

541
00:32:12,360 --> 00:32:15,440
Speaker 1: known trope that we referenced earlier that gets called out

542
00:32:15,480 --> 00:32:19,520
Speaker 1: in screamed too and then acted out anyway, and then

543
00:32:19,640 --> 00:32:23,120
Speaker 1: and then and then followed through on where in an

544
00:32:23,280 --> 00:32:26,200
Speaker 1: ensemble horror movie where there's a bunch of people who

545
00:32:26,240 --> 00:32:29,840
Speaker 1: die throughout this story, there's often one black person in

546
00:32:29,880 --> 00:32:31,880
Speaker 1: the cast, and they are often the first to die.

547
00:32:32,400 --> 00:32:34,760
Speaker 1: So there's different things like that. That's only kind of

548
00:32:34,760 --> 00:32:38,600
Speaker 1: the tip of the iceberg. So a movie like Us,

549
00:32:39,000 --> 00:32:42,080
Speaker 1: a movie like get Out, a movie like the upcoming

550
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:45,240
Speaker 1: Candy Man, I'm very excited for. While they're not that

551
00:32:45,320 --> 00:32:47,560
Speaker 1: I know, I'm so excited for it. While they are

552
00:32:47,640 --> 00:32:52,719
Speaker 1: not the first movies to subvert all of these problems,

553
00:32:53,160 --> 00:32:55,960
Speaker 1: they are pretty unique and that they don't fall into

554
00:32:56,080 --> 00:32:59,040
Speaker 1: all these tropes, and you'll never guess why. It's because

555
00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:02,560
Speaker 1: they are made by black filmmakers. So I just wanted

556
00:33:02,600 --> 00:33:07,880
Speaker 1: to again just acknowledge the really reprehensible history in terms

557
00:33:08,040 --> 00:33:12,440
Speaker 1: of representation of black characters in horror films, because it's

558
00:33:12,480 --> 00:33:16,640
Speaker 1: been real bad. Uh. Not that non white filmmakers have

559
00:33:16,760 --> 00:33:21,080
Speaker 1: been forced to enact these tropes, they have just continued

560
00:33:21,160 --> 00:33:25,240
Speaker 1: to make the choice. And I think it's also marketing.

561
00:33:25,280 --> 00:33:27,800
Speaker 1: It's like, I don't know, are people gonna go for

562
00:33:27,840 --> 00:33:32,720
Speaker 1: a black final girl. Who's to say it's like I would? Yeah,

563
00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:36,040
Speaker 1: I like those movies. I mean yeah, it's like Us

564
00:33:36,040 --> 00:33:40,480
Speaker 1: and get Out where enormous box office successes. Yeah, I

565
00:33:40,520 --> 00:33:45,440
Speaker 1: mean it's and Karama, you probably have more thoughts than

566
00:33:45,480 --> 00:33:48,520
Speaker 1: we do because we every year when we do our

567
00:33:48,640 --> 00:33:51,800
Speaker 1: Month of Horror, where like we don't know enough about horror.

568
00:33:53,040 --> 00:33:55,560
Speaker 1: I don't want to say I'm like a horror expert.

569
00:33:55,600 --> 00:33:59,320
Speaker 1: I am, and I'm an enjoyer of horror and I've

570
00:33:59,360 --> 00:34:01,360
Speaker 1: loved it since I as a kid. Uh. It is

571
00:34:01,400 --> 00:34:03,880
Speaker 1: not something that was handed down to me. Neither of

572
00:34:03,920 --> 00:34:06,280
Speaker 1: my parents enjoy horror films. I was like, Mom, will

573
00:34:06,320 --> 00:34:07,960
Speaker 1: you watch Us with me? And she was like no,

574
00:34:08,040 --> 00:34:10,759
Speaker 1: I'm good because she saw she saw get Out and

575
00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:12,520
Speaker 1: that was scary for her. She was like, I heard

576
00:34:12,520 --> 00:34:14,960
Speaker 1: this one scarier and I'm like, oh much, and she

577
00:34:15,000 --> 00:34:19,120
Speaker 1: said no, thanks. So it's interesting that I just sort

578
00:34:19,160 --> 00:34:21,480
Speaker 1: of adopted that on my own and was like, yeah,

579
00:34:21,680 --> 00:34:24,640
Speaker 1: this is cool. I love the creepy Crawley's and the

580
00:34:24,719 --> 00:34:28,719
Speaker 1: killing and the monsters. I think the horror as a

581
00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:33,480
Speaker 1: genre is great because it allows and I think that

582
00:34:33,520 --> 00:34:36,040
Speaker 1: there's a really big love of horror in a lot

583
00:34:36,080 --> 00:34:39,279
Speaker 1: of black communities, despite the treatment of black people on

584
00:34:39,480 --> 00:34:43,160
Speaker 1: screen in horror, because it is a safe space to

585
00:34:43,239 --> 00:34:47,600
Speaker 1: be afraid and you know two hours this is what's

586
00:34:47,600 --> 00:34:49,520
Speaker 1: going to happen. And it's very it's almost like law

587
00:34:49,520 --> 00:34:52,200
Speaker 1: and order and procedural television where you know what the

588
00:34:52,200 --> 00:34:55,760
Speaker 1: beats are going to be and it's like very safe

589
00:34:55,760 --> 00:34:58,680
Speaker 1: and formulaic, but still good and still fresh and interesting

590
00:34:59,120 --> 00:35:02,160
Speaker 1: in various ways. Is and like the different monsters that

591
00:35:02,200 --> 00:35:04,160
Speaker 1: are going to come and kill you, like, oh, this

592
00:35:04,160 --> 00:35:06,840
Speaker 1: one's a haunted lake man, and this one is a

593
00:35:06,920 --> 00:35:10,239
Speaker 1: child molester that's been burned, and this one the one

594
00:35:10,239 --> 00:35:12,440
Speaker 1: that we see all the time, something that has a

595
00:35:12,520 --> 00:35:18,040
Speaker 1: vagina for a head. Uh, always has a lovely little

596
00:35:18,200 --> 00:35:20,560
Speaker 1: little vul the head. And it's like, I'm coming for you.

597
00:35:21,560 --> 00:35:25,440
Speaker 1: Women are scarier. It's like, oh my god, take movies

598
00:35:25,480 --> 00:35:29,880
Speaker 1: away from men today. Um, no vulva heads in this movie.

599
00:35:29,960 --> 00:35:32,400
Speaker 1: And so you do have to you do have to

600
00:35:32,480 --> 00:35:37,240
Speaker 1: hand it to the restraint of Jordan Peel. That's true. Um,

601
00:35:37,280 --> 00:35:40,279
Speaker 1: but I mean, but what is going down into underground

602
00:35:40,360 --> 00:35:43,680
Speaker 1: into tunnels, but going into a vagina going into the

603
00:35:43,680 --> 00:35:49,880
Speaker 1: Earth's womb. The makes you think what I liked because

604
00:35:49,960 --> 00:35:53,600
Speaker 1: this is the way that this movie plays out does

605
00:35:53,680 --> 00:35:56,440
Speaker 1: inspire so much conversation, and I feel like it is

606
00:35:56,480 --> 00:35:59,120
Speaker 1: almost one of those movies that and it seems like

607
00:35:59,120 --> 00:36:01,040
Speaker 1: an interview is that and people kind of wanted it

608
00:36:01,080 --> 00:36:05,240
Speaker 1: to be like this, that how you read the ending

609
00:36:05,520 --> 00:36:07,520
Speaker 1: kind of like says more about you than it says

610
00:36:07,560 --> 00:36:09,680
Speaker 1: about the movie, which is always kind of fun and

611
00:36:09,760 --> 00:36:15,000
Speaker 1: terrifying to engage with. But in terms of like flipping

612
00:36:15,400 --> 00:36:19,360
Speaker 1: horror tropes here where horror, like you're saying, chroma is

613
00:36:19,400 --> 00:36:24,200
Speaker 1: so built around I don't know what what scares the filmmaker,

614
00:36:24,360 --> 00:36:26,880
Speaker 1: and in theory for horror movies to do well, what

615
00:36:27,080 --> 00:36:29,920
Speaker 1: scare the audience at a certain point in time and

616
00:36:29,960 --> 00:36:33,160
Speaker 1: taking the idea of the other. And I watched a

617
00:36:33,320 --> 00:36:36,280
Speaker 1: there's a really good analysis of this movie from the take,

618
00:36:37,280 --> 00:36:40,040
Speaker 1: which is just like an analysis YouTube channel where it

619
00:36:40,120 --> 00:36:44,000
Speaker 1: basically they make the point that the general horror UH

620
00:36:44,160 --> 00:36:49,839
Speaker 1: formula is to take the other and reoppressed them by

621
00:36:49,880 --> 00:36:52,239
Speaker 1: the end of the movie. So with the example of

622
00:36:52,280 --> 00:36:56,280
Speaker 1: like Michael Myers, he is the other villain of this movie.

623
00:36:56,640 --> 00:36:59,800
Speaker 1: And then the victory at the end is to oppress

624
00:36:59,840 --> 00:37:02,480
Speaker 1: him further than he was at the beginning of the

625
00:37:02,520 --> 00:37:07,920
Speaker 1: movie because he's bad and so what's cool and like

626
00:37:08,120 --> 00:37:11,919
Speaker 1: also like scrambles your brain about this movie is that

627
00:37:12,080 --> 00:37:18,040
Speaker 1: you it's unclear who, like who deserves what in this

628
00:37:18,200 --> 00:37:20,799
Speaker 1: where it's like the surface read of the movie is, Oh,

629
00:37:20,840 --> 00:37:25,040
Speaker 1: we love this family. They're not doing anything wrong that

630
00:37:25,080 --> 00:37:28,840
Speaker 1: we're seeing that is like they're not outwardly bad people,

631
00:37:29,760 --> 00:37:34,960
Speaker 1: but their existence is like it's just it it fox

632
00:37:35,000 --> 00:37:37,319
Speaker 1: with your head. But I do like messing around with

633
00:37:37,360 --> 00:37:40,320
Speaker 1: that there is not a clear cut hero or villain

634
00:37:40,520 --> 00:37:45,440
Speaker 1: to these families. Yeah, I find the more I watch it,

635
00:37:45,520 --> 00:37:50,799
Speaker 1: the less I'm sure. In that scene, um, which I love.

636
00:37:50,880 --> 00:37:53,400
Speaker 1: I love the sort of dance read of it because

637
00:37:53,440 --> 00:37:55,840
Speaker 1: as I've told you too, I love dance movies. I

638
00:37:55,880 --> 00:37:58,040
Speaker 1: love them so much. And it's like, look at a

639
00:37:58,080 --> 00:38:01,120
Speaker 1: little mini dance movie and the and my little scary movie.

640
00:38:01,120 --> 00:38:05,239
Speaker 1: It's beautiful too. Yeah, it is gorgeous. And the orchestration

641
00:38:05,520 --> 00:38:08,080
Speaker 1: of this sort of classical version of I Got five

642
00:38:08,120 --> 00:38:11,960
Speaker 1: on it is just Chef's kiss. But I don't know

643
00:38:12,120 --> 00:38:15,480
Speaker 1: who should win. And at the end, I'm like the

644
00:38:15,520 --> 00:38:19,319
Speaker 1: first time watching it, I was like, Yes, amazing, we

645
00:38:19,440 --> 00:38:23,480
Speaker 1: beat the bad person. And then I was like, oh no,

646
00:38:23,680 --> 00:38:25,680
Speaker 1: because you get that reveal at the end, and then

647
00:38:25,800 --> 00:38:29,080
Speaker 1: watching it every subsequent time and like, I don't is

648
00:38:29,120 --> 00:38:34,080
Speaker 1: this good? Who's good? I never know how to feel

649
00:38:34,600 --> 00:38:37,960
Speaker 1: I at this point, I'm like, I'm like team Tether.

650
00:38:38,360 --> 00:38:41,600
Speaker 1: I love the family, But I'm like, if this is

651
00:38:41,640 --> 00:38:43,960
Speaker 1: so like the read of the movie that I feel

652
00:38:44,080 --> 00:38:47,680
Speaker 1: closest to right now, is the story being like this

653
00:38:47,719 --> 00:38:53,600
Speaker 1: allegory for basically like the unacknowledged guilt of living in

654
00:38:53,640 --> 00:38:58,439
Speaker 1: a colonial society and in America specifically, which the more

655
00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:00,200
Speaker 1: I watched this movie and the more I read said

656
00:39:00,800 --> 00:39:03,920
Speaker 1: the hints of that are everywhere, not just in interviews

657
00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:07,680
Speaker 1: Jordan Peele has done about it, where he says, literally quote,

658
00:39:07,840 --> 00:39:09,400
Speaker 1: one of the central themes in Us is that we

659
00:39:09,440 --> 00:39:12,280
Speaker 1: can do a good job collectively of ignoring the ramifications

660
00:39:12,320 --> 00:39:16,520
Speaker 1: of privilege, and he's referencing the privilege of being a

661
00:39:16,600 --> 00:39:21,560
Speaker 1: modern American. But even from like really early in the

662
00:39:21,680 --> 00:39:24,680
Speaker 1: movie when she walks into the Hall of mirrors, that

663
00:39:24,760 --> 00:39:27,480
Speaker 1: hall of mirrors, when you look at and listen to

664
00:39:27,520 --> 00:39:32,680
Speaker 1: what's happening in there is the basically Cowboy American presentation

665
00:39:32,800 --> 00:39:35,440
Speaker 1: of false history that we all learn um as it

666
00:39:35,480 --> 00:39:41,000
Speaker 1: pertains to indigenous people in America, where it's like every lazy,

667
00:39:41,160 --> 00:39:45,000
Speaker 1: harmful stereotype is being laid out just in the background

668
00:39:45,040 --> 00:39:49,400
Speaker 1: of this scene. Yeah, it's called like Shaman's Vision Quest

669
00:39:49,600 --> 00:39:54,040
Speaker 1: and its imagery of like a native and you'll you'll

670
00:39:54,120 --> 00:39:56,239
Speaker 1: if you're fine intentional. Also at the end of the

671
00:39:56,280 --> 00:40:01,680
Speaker 1: movie that has been changed. It's now Merlin's Forest or

672
00:40:01,719 --> 00:40:04,520
Speaker 1: something like that, but it's still the same thing and

673
00:40:04,560 --> 00:40:11,280
Speaker 1: you can. Yeah. And when you when we see Adelaide

674
00:40:11,320 --> 00:40:14,879
Speaker 1: walk in, we hear this audio. And I always watch

675
00:40:14,920 --> 00:40:20,279
Speaker 1: everything with subtitles. Drag me. I love subtitles, um And

676
00:40:20,400 --> 00:40:23,200
Speaker 1: I don't understand why people hate subtitles so much. Like,

677
00:40:23,320 --> 00:40:25,160
Speaker 1: if you don't want them, that's fine, but don't hate

678
00:40:25,160 --> 00:40:27,760
Speaker 1: on me for using them, because I get extra layers.

679
00:40:28,160 --> 00:40:33,439
Speaker 1: But you get information about these hopie like mythological characters,

680
00:40:33,800 --> 00:40:36,880
Speaker 1: and so they're like, oh, we're gonna roote this and this,

681
00:40:37,120 --> 00:40:41,520
Speaker 1: and yeah, if we use these names that we barely researched,

682
00:40:41,760 --> 00:40:45,439
Speaker 1: it'll be fine. And while I was doing research because

683
00:40:45,480 --> 00:40:47,799
Speaker 1: I was like, oh, who are these names and where

684
00:40:47,800 --> 00:40:50,359
Speaker 1: did they come from? I read something that said that

685
00:40:50,719 --> 00:40:53,720
Speaker 1: all Hopie mythology that has been shared with non Hopie

686
00:40:53,760 --> 00:40:56,080
Speaker 1: people might just be big stuff that they tell us,

687
00:40:56,800 --> 00:41:00,680
Speaker 1: which I love. They're just like, yeah, this is what

688
00:41:00,760 --> 00:41:03,399
Speaker 1: we believe, um, and that there is a sort of

689
00:41:04,040 --> 00:41:06,680
Speaker 1: layered level of mythology where there's what's shared with outsiders

690
00:41:06,719 --> 00:41:09,359
Speaker 1: and then there's stuff that's never shared with outsiders. So

691
00:41:09,520 --> 00:41:12,680
Speaker 1: I find it interesting that these characters are from the

692
00:41:13,000 --> 00:41:18,279
Speaker 1: like foreigner friendly version of Hope mythology. That's incredible. Yeah,

693
00:41:18,320 --> 00:41:20,800
Speaker 1: I didn't. I didn't know. I mean, and I honestly

694
00:41:20,840 --> 00:41:23,480
Speaker 1: on my first I think like at least on my

695
00:41:23,520 --> 00:41:26,200
Speaker 1: first two viewings of this, I didn't really pick up

696
00:41:26,239 --> 00:41:29,440
Speaker 1: on that. But this time it's like another one of

697
00:41:29,440 --> 00:41:32,279
Speaker 1: those things where like the subtext is there and if

698
00:41:32,280 --> 00:41:34,319
Speaker 1: you engage with it, it's like a more a better

699
00:41:34,320 --> 00:41:37,200
Speaker 1: way to engage with the movie. Yeah. So yeah, if

700
00:41:37,200 --> 00:41:39,839
Speaker 1: we're if we're reading it, so I guess coming at

701
00:41:39,880 --> 00:41:44,200
Speaker 1: it from the idea of it being from this entrenched

702
00:41:45,000 --> 00:41:48,319
Speaker 1: basically like they're being more than one America and what

703
00:41:48,400 --> 00:41:50,400
Speaker 1: we're presented with the at the beginning of the movie

704
00:41:51,040 --> 00:41:54,920
Speaker 1: is a very comfortable middle class life. Um. And then

705
00:41:54,920 --> 00:41:58,200
Speaker 1: what is happening, and so I'm trying to think of

706
00:41:58,239 --> 00:42:02,799
Speaker 1: the way to like articular late this correctly, but essentially

707
00:42:02,880 --> 00:42:05,600
Speaker 1: it seems like this movie is playing on for every

708
00:42:05,600 --> 00:42:09,000
Speaker 1: person that has it that comes with a cost. You

709
00:42:09,040 --> 00:42:13,200
Speaker 1: don't just get that. And the direct allegory happening here

710
00:42:13,360 --> 00:42:16,120
Speaker 1: is like for us to have what we have, someone

711
00:42:16,160 --> 00:42:20,440
Speaker 1: that we don't know and very possibly are willfully ignoring

712
00:42:20,480 --> 00:42:25,239
Speaker 1: the existence of entirely are suffering for us to have

713
00:42:25,320 --> 00:42:30,799
Speaker 1: the lifestyle that we have, which is true and horrifying

714
00:42:30,920 --> 00:42:34,960
Speaker 1: to consider. And I really like that Jordan Peel wrights

715
00:42:35,560 --> 00:42:38,920
Speaker 1: likable characters so that it's not like, oh, well, like

716
00:42:39,040 --> 00:42:42,160
Speaker 1: these characters are like awful and suck and it's like, no,

717
00:42:42,400 --> 00:42:46,840
Speaker 1: they're good people. They love their family, They're like living

718
00:42:47,440 --> 00:42:51,120
Speaker 1: their lives, but just like us a lot of the time,

719
00:42:51,239 --> 00:42:55,560
Speaker 1: just in complete ignorance too. Well, how do you have

720
00:42:55,680 --> 00:42:59,920
Speaker 1: this lifestyle and who upholds it and whose labor um

721
00:43:00,080 --> 00:43:04,200
Speaker 1: affords you to have what you have? Yes, I too,

722
00:43:04,640 --> 00:43:08,440
Speaker 1: That is my read of the film, because there's a

723
00:43:08,480 --> 00:43:12,040
Speaker 1: few different ones that have been posited. You know, people

724
00:43:12,080 --> 00:43:14,800
Speaker 1: are like, okay, is it about you know, the socio

725
00:43:14,880 --> 00:43:18,560
Speaker 1: economic class and privilege divide, which is like what we're

726
00:43:18,600 --> 00:43:22,080
Speaker 1: talking about. There's the is it about, like the duality

727
00:43:22,200 --> 00:43:26,200
Speaker 1: of one's self as an individual? Is it about you

728
00:43:26,239 --> 00:43:30,000
Speaker 1: know how Americans are so polarized politically at this moment

729
00:43:30,080 --> 00:43:33,280
Speaker 1: during like the Trump presidency. There's a plenty of reads,

730
00:43:33,280 --> 00:43:36,600
Speaker 1: and I see like merit and all of them. But yeah,

731
00:43:36,840 --> 00:43:40,600
Speaker 1: as far as the one that I am closest to,

732
00:43:40,680 --> 00:43:45,000
Speaker 1: like you said, Jamie, is the one that we've just described,

733
00:43:45,239 --> 00:43:48,520
Speaker 1: I am also on board that. I I think that

734
00:43:48,600 --> 00:43:51,040
Speaker 1: it's the same thing. I feel like you have to

735
00:43:51,880 --> 00:43:54,399
Speaker 1: look at what Peel is giving us, and it's there's

736
00:43:54,400 --> 00:43:57,799
Speaker 1: so much stuff about that native imagery. Like even when

737
00:43:57,800 --> 00:44:00,279
Speaker 1: they're on the beach and kiddies and looking at a magazine,

738
00:44:00,560 --> 00:44:03,480
Speaker 1: there's an ad with a native headdress and she's like, oh,

739
00:44:03,480 --> 00:44:06,800
Speaker 1: that's so pretty and just moves on from it really quickly.

740
00:44:07,120 --> 00:44:09,279
Speaker 1: But I just like that stuck out to me the

741
00:44:09,280 --> 00:44:11,560
Speaker 1: first time I watched it. I was like, wait, you

742
00:44:11,600 --> 00:44:15,239
Speaker 1: can't ignore that it has to be about that, especially

743
00:44:15,360 --> 00:44:18,760
Speaker 1: knowing that The Shining is a movie that Jordan Peele

744
00:44:19,160 --> 00:44:22,359
Speaker 1: just absolutely adores, draws a lot of influence from, And

745
00:44:22,400 --> 00:44:24,960
Speaker 1: the whole thing about that was this sort of haunted

746
00:44:25,080 --> 00:44:27,760
Speaker 1: Indian burial ground trope, and this feels like a reversal

747
00:44:27,800 --> 00:44:29,960
Speaker 1: of that, where instead of being cursed because you're living

748
00:44:29,960 --> 00:44:32,759
Speaker 1: on top of dead Indigenous people, the bad luck comes

749
00:44:32,800 --> 00:44:35,440
Speaker 1: from living on top of alive people who are just

750
00:44:35,520 --> 00:44:38,360
Speaker 1: like you but speak another language that you can't understand.

751
00:44:38,400 --> 00:44:41,640
Speaker 1: And we are tethered to these Indigenous people whose land

752
00:44:41,680 --> 00:44:45,640
Speaker 1: we've built on top of. Right, Jordan Peele, I'm realizing

753
00:44:45,719 --> 00:44:48,279
Speaker 1: everything I just said. Jordanville has obviously said a much

754
00:44:48,320 --> 00:44:52,120
Speaker 1: more intelligent version of so I just wanted to read

755
00:44:52,160 --> 00:44:56,000
Speaker 1: a quote from him that there's a few different reads.

756
00:44:56,000 --> 00:44:59,440
Speaker 1: It's kind of funny because it's I wonder if you

757
00:44:59,560 --> 00:45:01,600
Speaker 1: both feel same way. I felt like when the movie

758
00:45:01,719 --> 00:45:05,160
Speaker 1: first came out, it was a little harder to find

759
00:45:05,400 --> 00:45:08,840
Speaker 1: quotes where Jordan's Peel was explicitly saying like, well, this

760
00:45:08,920 --> 00:45:10,560
Speaker 1: is what I was trying to do, because he seemed

761
00:45:10,600 --> 00:45:14,120
Speaker 1: to want the audience to have the discussion. And then

762
00:45:14,560 --> 00:45:18,040
Speaker 1: but there are like, in the year since I have

763
00:45:18,400 --> 00:45:20,759
Speaker 1: read about it, he's talked about it pretty extensively, and

764
00:45:20,800 --> 00:45:23,799
Speaker 1: now it feels like his um his thesis statement is

765
00:45:23,800 --> 00:45:25,760
Speaker 1: out there where it kind of wasn't at the beginning.

766
00:45:26,200 --> 00:45:29,480
Speaker 1: But to continue the quote I was reading from earlier,

767
00:45:29,520 --> 00:45:35,279
Speaker 1: which is from UH the Like DVD of Us. So

768
00:45:35,320 --> 00:45:37,400
Speaker 1: he says, one of the central themes in US is

769
00:45:37,440 --> 00:45:39,520
Speaker 1: that we can do a good job collectively of ignoring

770
00:45:39,520 --> 00:45:42,400
Speaker 1: the ramifications of privilege. I think it's the idea that

771
00:45:42,440 --> 00:45:45,200
Speaker 1: we that what we feel like we deserve comes, you know,

772
00:45:45,360 --> 00:45:48,480
Speaker 1: at the expense of someone else's freedom or joy. You know,

773
00:45:48,520 --> 00:45:50,759
Speaker 1: the biggest disservice we can do as a faction with

774
00:45:50,880 --> 00:45:53,520
Speaker 1: a collective privilege like the United States is to presume

775
00:45:53,560 --> 00:45:55,799
Speaker 1: that we deserve it and that it isn't luck that

776
00:45:55,880 --> 00:45:58,319
Speaker 1: has us born where we're born. For us to have

777
00:45:58,360 --> 00:46:01,560
Speaker 1: our privilege, someone suffers. That's where the tethered connection I

778
00:46:01,600 --> 00:46:04,200
Speaker 1: think resonates the most is that those who suffer and

779
00:46:04,239 --> 00:46:06,879
Speaker 1: those who prosper are two sides of the same coin.

780
00:46:07,200 --> 00:46:09,120
Speaker 1: You can never forget that we need to fight for

781
00:46:09,200 --> 00:46:14,040
Speaker 1: the less fortunate. So that is kind of his thesis statement,

782
00:46:14,080 --> 00:46:19,520
Speaker 1: which also makes the doppelganger even more resonant and cool,

783
00:46:19,560 --> 00:46:22,040
Speaker 1: and it like really hits on that point of like

784
00:46:22,520 --> 00:46:27,520
Speaker 1: we are no different. It's like what made uh Lupete

785
00:46:27,560 --> 00:46:31,440
Speaker 1: who lives above ground and Lupeta who lives below ground different?

786
00:46:32,040 --> 00:46:35,200
Speaker 1: Not much, to the point where when they swapped, no

787
00:46:35,239 --> 00:46:37,680
Speaker 1: one knew, like, no one noticed, and it was like

788
00:46:37,800 --> 00:46:42,120
Speaker 1: the circumstance that they were born into that shaped who

789
00:46:42,120 --> 00:46:44,600
Speaker 1: they became in so many ways. Right, you get the

790
00:46:44,640 --> 00:46:49,279
Speaker 1: sense that it it just took red after emerging back

791
00:46:49,360 --> 00:46:53,560
Speaker 1: above ground. And sorry, yeah, I keep saying upstairs, lupetea downstairs.

792
00:46:54,360 --> 00:46:58,280
Speaker 1: I get what you mean. Um, she basically it seems

793
00:46:58,320 --> 00:47:01,040
Speaker 1: like it takes her maybe a few weeks or months

794
00:47:01,080 --> 00:47:05,279
Speaker 1: to assimilate, but she starts dancing, and she starts like

795
00:47:05,520 --> 00:47:10,640
Speaker 1: I suppose, learning to speak, and and then she is

796
00:47:10,760 --> 00:47:18,399
Speaker 1: indistinguishable from all the other upstairs people, the nontethered you know. So, yeah,

797
00:47:18,440 --> 00:47:20,560
Speaker 1: it's just commentary and like if you were in a

798
00:47:20,640 --> 00:47:25,279
Speaker 1: position of privilege, if you have access to things that

799
00:47:25,400 --> 00:47:28,919
Speaker 1: you need to be a boat called the bet the

800
00:47:29,000 --> 00:47:36,280
Speaker 1: what is it? The crowd beyond? Yeah, I always forget.

801
00:47:36,320 --> 00:47:38,799
Speaker 1: That's another thing that I just like always forget. And

802
00:47:38,800 --> 00:47:40,799
Speaker 1: then I see it again. I was like, oh, right,

803
00:47:40,920 --> 00:47:44,239
Speaker 1: that's the name of Tim Hidecker's boat. I love the

804
00:47:44,280 --> 00:47:48,359
Speaker 1: competition that sort of happens between Winston Duke and Tim

805
00:47:48,440 --> 00:47:52,399
Speaker 1: Hidecker and these two families, and just even above ground,

806
00:47:52,480 --> 00:47:55,200
Speaker 1: before we really get to the underground people the levels

807
00:47:55,239 --> 00:47:58,520
Speaker 1: of privilege between them, and they're both these middle class families,

808
00:47:58,520 --> 00:48:01,120
Speaker 1: Like there's no no one can argue that the Wilsons

809
00:48:01,120 --> 00:48:03,720
Speaker 1: are not doing well. They have a summer home, their kids,

810
00:48:03,719 --> 00:48:06,759
Speaker 1: they drug the Mercedes, their their kids are doing after

811
00:48:06,800 --> 00:48:11,480
Speaker 1: school activities and magic tricks and fun things like they're okay.

812
00:48:11,920 --> 00:48:14,080
Speaker 1: They have I love the sticker that they have on

813
00:48:14,120 --> 00:48:16,600
Speaker 1: the back of the car. That's like their little family sticker,

814
00:48:17,520 --> 00:48:19,960
Speaker 1: which I don't understand what anybody has those, because then

815
00:48:19,960 --> 00:48:22,840
Speaker 1: people know they can follow you and then murder your children.

816
00:48:22,920 --> 00:48:26,160
Speaker 1: That's how I think that's how the Tethered found them.

817
00:48:26,440 --> 00:48:28,960
Speaker 1: They're like that this this is the family. They have

818
00:48:29,040 --> 00:48:30,759
Speaker 1: the sticker, and this is how we know that they

819
00:48:30,800 --> 00:48:33,680
Speaker 1: live here. They shouldn't have been giving away their coordinates

820
00:48:33,719 --> 00:48:36,280
Speaker 1: like that. I think about that every time I post,

821
00:48:36,520 --> 00:48:39,560
Speaker 1: Like back in the before times when you would post

822
00:48:39,960 --> 00:48:42,480
Speaker 1: as like a comic, you would just post your location

823
00:48:42,600 --> 00:48:45,400
Speaker 1: every single night. I'm just like, this would be a

824
00:48:45,400 --> 00:48:49,080
Speaker 1: great way to get killed, like just thinking out out

825
00:48:49,600 --> 00:48:52,520
Speaker 1: or like the blame ring. That's how the blame ring

826
00:48:52,640 --> 00:48:55,160
Speaker 1: happened in real life because celebrities would be like going

827
00:48:55,200 --> 00:48:58,120
Speaker 1: on vacation, and then those teenage kids from the valley

828
00:48:58,120 --> 00:49:02,919
Speaker 1: were like, what if we robbed Paris, they'll to him anyway.

829
00:49:02,960 --> 00:49:07,400
Speaker 1: I digress um. I think that I love, though, the

830
00:49:07,440 --> 00:49:10,160
Speaker 1: difference between this white family and this black family that

831
00:49:10,239 --> 00:49:14,040
Speaker 1: are ostensibly the same in that they're both living these privileged,

832
00:49:14,120 --> 00:49:18,400
Speaker 1: middle class American lives, but we see the sort of

833
00:49:18,520 --> 00:49:21,520
Speaker 1: slight disparities and the jealousy and like the nicer boat

834
00:49:21,880 --> 00:49:24,879
Speaker 1: and the newer car and stuff like that, and how

835
00:49:24,920 --> 00:49:27,919
Speaker 1: Winston Duke is just like, well, I really wanna one

836
00:49:28,000 --> 00:49:30,480
Speaker 1: hup him and get to him. It's like I got

837
00:49:30,480 --> 00:49:32,239
Speaker 1: a boat that he has flares on his boat and

838
00:49:32,280 --> 00:49:34,160
Speaker 1: I don't have flares on my boat. And I thought

839
00:49:34,200 --> 00:49:36,480
Speaker 1: it was kind of also a fun touch that it's

840
00:49:36,520 --> 00:49:38,759
Speaker 1: like the families get along, but they don't seem to

841
00:49:38,840 --> 00:49:44,480
Speaker 1: actually like each other that much, Like, yeah, they don't.

842
00:49:44,480 --> 00:49:46,719
Speaker 1: They're not close that you get the sense that they

843
00:49:46,760 --> 00:49:49,839
Speaker 1: see each other once a year when they're both vacationing

844
00:49:49,920 --> 00:49:55,080
Speaker 1: together and that's it. And also, Okay, so I was

845
00:49:55,120 --> 00:49:58,479
Speaker 1: thinking about this where the Wilsons seem to own their

846
00:49:58,520 --> 00:50:01,879
Speaker 1: family home, but I think the other family of Kitty

847
00:50:01,920 --> 00:50:04,680
Speaker 1: and Josh, they're like air being being or like they

848
00:50:04,680 --> 00:50:07,200
Speaker 1: have a time share something because he says like, we

849
00:50:07,239 --> 00:50:09,120
Speaker 1: need to get out of here. So even though it's

850
00:50:09,120 --> 00:50:12,960
Speaker 1: a nicer house, it's like it's almost like the illusion

851
00:50:13,040 --> 00:50:16,280
Speaker 1: of them doing better because they have their only renting

852
00:50:16,920 --> 00:50:19,400
Speaker 1: this nicer house for a short amount of time because

853
00:50:19,400 --> 00:50:20,919
Speaker 1: he's like, oh, we have to be out of here

854
00:50:20,960 --> 00:50:24,440
Speaker 1: by ten am tomorrow, as if it's a rental versus

855
00:50:25,040 --> 00:50:27,000
Speaker 1: the Wilson's owning that. So it's like, I don't know,

856
00:50:27,040 --> 00:50:29,919
Speaker 1: it's like there's a there's this illusion that they're doing better,

857
00:50:29,960 --> 00:50:33,200
Speaker 1: but maybe they aren't even interesting. I didn't read that

858
00:50:33,280 --> 00:50:36,400
Speaker 1: as an Airbnb rental. I read that as a kids

859
00:50:36,440 --> 00:50:40,200
Speaker 1: take too long, I have a meeting I need to

860
00:50:41,320 --> 00:50:44,160
Speaker 1: so less is a checkout time, and more as a alright,

861
00:50:44,800 --> 00:50:47,799
Speaker 1: Gremlins could be that, but I didn't think about it

862
00:50:47,840 --> 00:50:51,719
Speaker 1: that way, and I think that could be true. Yeah, yeah,

863
00:50:51,840 --> 00:50:55,759
Speaker 1: that's I suppose open to interpretation. Like much of the movie, Yeah,

864
00:50:55,800 --> 00:51:00,719
Speaker 1: I like the kind of like subtle freak shin that

865
00:51:00,840 --> 00:51:05,200
Speaker 1: you see between these families where especially between the two

866
00:51:05,760 --> 00:51:09,520
Speaker 1: uh fathers, where I don't know, I mean, I feel

867
00:51:09,520 --> 00:51:11,920
Speaker 1: like it's something you see, but especially because it's between

868
00:51:12,120 --> 00:51:14,800
Speaker 1: a white middle class family and a black middle class family.

869
00:51:15,400 --> 00:51:18,480
Speaker 1: That friction there's like kind of another dimension to it

870
00:51:18,840 --> 00:51:21,440
Speaker 1: as well, and it's not one I've ever you really

871
00:51:21,480 --> 00:51:25,480
Speaker 1: see in movies that much at all. That's to me.

872
00:51:25,640 --> 00:51:30,280
Speaker 1: Gabe is a very interesting character because, like was mentioned,

873
00:51:30,920 --> 00:51:34,439
Speaker 1: when the Tethered first show up and invade their home,

874
00:51:35,120 --> 00:51:39,719
Speaker 1: Gabe he's like trying to reason with them and saying like,

875
00:51:40,160 --> 00:51:42,120
Speaker 1: we don't have much here. This is our summer home.

876
00:51:42,160 --> 00:51:43,879
Speaker 1: But you can have my wallet, you can have my money,

877
00:51:43,920 --> 00:51:45,239
Speaker 1: we can go to an a t m. You can

878
00:51:45,239 --> 00:51:47,120
Speaker 1: have the car, you can have the boat. You know.

879
00:51:47,200 --> 00:51:51,239
Speaker 1: He's trying to like his values are these like material possessions,

880
00:51:51,239 --> 00:51:53,080
Speaker 1: and that's what he thinks is going to be valuable

881
00:51:53,480 --> 00:51:55,279
Speaker 1: to the Tethers, and they're just like, I don't give

882
00:51:55,280 --> 00:51:58,560
Speaker 1: a ship about your money, Like we're here to kill

883
00:51:58,640 --> 00:52:02,880
Speaker 1: you know. We want to end this connection that's been happening.

884
00:52:02,880 --> 00:52:07,040
Speaker 1: That you've been bullissfully unaware of the friction between these

885
00:52:07,040 --> 00:52:09,560
Speaker 1: two families. Makes me wonder how they know each other

886
00:52:10,080 --> 00:52:13,000
Speaker 1: because I don't think it's from college, which is kind

887
00:52:13,040 --> 00:52:17,799
Speaker 1: of the generic assumption, because Winston Duke's character gave he

888
00:52:17,880 --> 00:52:23,120
Speaker 1: has a Howard university sweatshirt on, and something about Tim

889
00:52:23,160 --> 00:52:26,160
Speaker 1: Heidecker's character just doesn't read to me as white person

890
00:52:26,200 --> 00:52:31,160
Speaker 1: who went to Howard. It just I'm not getting that vibe.

891
00:52:32,040 --> 00:52:36,040
Speaker 1: Can you imagine that wasn't the case. I would be

892
00:52:36,120 --> 00:52:39,560
Speaker 1: fascinated to see that first semester, just that one. I

893
00:52:39,600 --> 00:52:41,719
Speaker 1: don't want to see anything beyond that, And I hope

894
00:52:41,760 --> 00:52:44,800
Speaker 1: there's a transfer after that, not because of white people,

895
00:52:45,120 --> 00:52:51,359
Speaker 1: because of that particular white person. Um So, I was

896
00:52:51,360 --> 00:52:53,439
Speaker 1: curious because, like you said, it seemed like they see

897
00:52:53,440 --> 00:52:57,680
Speaker 1: each other annually, because there's that line that Addie has

898
00:52:57,719 --> 00:52:59,200
Speaker 1: where she says, you look the same as you did

899
00:52:59,320 --> 00:53:03,440
Speaker 1: last year when the plastic surgery is discussed. So it's like,

900
00:53:03,520 --> 00:53:07,640
Speaker 1: who are these people to each other and what is

901
00:53:07,680 --> 00:53:10,680
Speaker 1: the positive of their relationship because it just seems like

902
00:53:10,719 --> 00:53:15,520
Speaker 1: they're there to compete. That is Yeah, like it, I

903
00:53:15,920 --> 00:53:19,759
Speaker 1: really I never really, like thought about their relationships to

904
00:53:19,800 --> 00:53:23,360
Speaker 1: each other too too much before preparing for this episode.

905
00:53:23,560 --> 00:53:26,719
Speaker 1: And even it's like the kids, clearly they have no

906
00:53:26,880 --> 00:53:29,680
Speaker 1: interest in each other, Like the twins only talk to

907
00:53:29,719 --> 00:53:34,840
Speaker 1: each other. They're like Jason's weird. Yeah, they're they're clearly

908
00:53:35,000 --> 00:53:40,120
Speaker 1: not even like Summertime friends. And Zora like has her

909
00:53:40,160 --> 00:53:43,439
Speaker 1: headphones and she has no interest in the chaotic high

910
00:53:43,440 --> 00:53:48,880
Speaker 1: Decker twins or whatever. Uh so it is like it is.

911
00:53:49,320 --> 00:53:51,400
Speaker 1: And also it's kind of she does not hesitate to

912
00:53:52,000 --> 00:53:58,320
Speaker 1: kill the ship out of them when they're She definitely

913
00:53:58,719 --> 00:54:03,160
Speaker 1: was like getting some Catharsis from killing these twins. Yeah,

914
00:54:04,080 --> 00:54:07,320
Speaker 1: I mean, based on what we see of those twins,

915
00:54:07,360 --> 00:54:14,080
Speaker 1: I get it. Yeah. Yeah. And and the relationship between Um,

916
00:54:14,400 --> 00:54:19,600
Speaker 1: Adelaide and Kitty I also think is pretty interesting where

917
00:54:20,160 --> 00:54:22,319
Speaker 1: I mean again, it's like they don't have I think

918
00:54:22,600 --> 00:54:26,000
Speaker 1: Kitty is like kind of doing a fakey attempt to

919
00:54:26,040 --> 00:54:30,439
Speaker 1: connect with Adelaide Um, and I kind of appreciate Adelaide's like, yeah,

920
00:54:30,440 --> 00:54:34,359
Speaker 1: I don't Yeah, we don't have to be chatting right now.

921
00:54:35,040 --> 00:54:37,560
Speaker 1: But I like, I thought it was kind of cool

922
00:54:37,640 --> 00:54:42,800
Speaker 1: that there was some commentary into how particularly Kitty story

923
00:54:42,920 --> 00:54:45,040
Speaker 1: plays out. I feel like, more so than anyone else

924
00:54:45,440 --> 00:54:47,360
Speaker 1: than anyone else in the Tyler family, I feel like

925
00:54:47,400 --> 00:54:50,400
Speaker 1: Kitty is the one character that you kind of see

926
00:54:50,480 --> 00:54:54,520
Speaker 1: something in her tether that is like reflective of like, oh,

927
00:54:54,560 --> 00:54:57,360
Speaker 1: if we're seeing this as like the haves and the

928
00:54:57,440 --> 00:55:03,000
Speaker 1: have nots on which America is built, the scene where

929
00:55:03,320 --> 00:55:09,879
Speaker 1: Kitty's tether whose name is Dahlia, pretty name. Uh so

930
00:55:10,520 --> 00:55:14,440
Speaker 1: Dahlia has this moment where we heard earlier that Kitty

931
00:55:14,480 --> 00:55:18,320
Speaker 1: has had like some work done. Whatever judgment isn't passed

932
00:55:18,560 --> 00:55:21,880
Speaker 1: either way, but it just is a fact um. But

933
00:55:21,960 --> 00:55:26,280
Speaker 1: then um, Dahlia, who has been playing out the actions

934
00:55:26,320 --> 00:55:30,239
Speaker 1: of Kitty her entire existence were assuming like, finally has

935
00:55:30,320 --> 00:55:33,120
Speaker 1: that moment of like holding that lip gloss and it

936
00:55:33,160 --> 00:55:36,520
Speaker 1: looks really scary, and like Elizabeth Moss is scary as

937
00:55:36,600 --> 00:55:39,839
Speaker 1: hell in this role, and I just I love her.

938
00:55:39,920 --> 00:55:42,480
Speaker 1: She I really like her in this movie as well.

939
00:55:42,560 --> 00:55:46,120
Speaker 1: But you get that moment of like, oh, this is

940
00:55:46,200 --> 00:55:49,600
Speaker 1: what I have been suffering for, is for this other

941
00:55:49,680 --> 00:55:52,359
Speaker 1: woman to look like this, And then you see her

942
00:55:52,400 --> 00:55:54,680
Speaker 1: cut her face open, which I'm pretty sure it's a

943
00:55:54,719 --> 00:55:59,879
Speaker 1: reference to Kitty's procedures, and like it all every time

944
00:55:59,880 --> 00:56:02,160
Speaker 1: I look at that seeing I'm like, okay, girl Joker,

945
00:56:02,200 --> 00:56:05,160
Speaker 1: we get it, but like, uh, do you want to

946
00:56:05,160 --> 00:56:07,799
Speaker 1: know how I got these guys? But it is a

947
00:56:07,800 --> 00:56:10,879
Speaker 1: little bit girl Joker the way it plays out, yea, oh,

948
00:56:10,920 --> 00:56:13,880
Speaker 1: it is very girl Joker, like very dark knight girl Joker.

949
00:56:13,960 --> 00:56:17,200
Speaker 1: But I yeah, noticing the scars on her face. The

950
00:56:17,239 --> 00:56:19,759
Speaker 1: second time I watched the movie, I was like, Oh,

951
00:56:19,960 --> 00:56:24,439
Speaker 1: she had to do her own plastic surgery underground. That's terrifying, right,

952
00:56:24,600 --> 00:56:28,240
Speaker 1: And I always get a little like if he around

953
00:56:28,760 --> 00:56:34,920
Speaker 1: uh male filmmakers making comments on women getting plastic surgery.

954
00:56:35,000 --> 00:56:37,680
Speaker 1: But it didn't feel I don't know, I certainly I

955
00:56:37,719 --> 00:56:39,880
Speaker 1: don't know. I didn't end up being really bothered by it.

956
00:56:39,920 --> 00:56:42,400
Speaker 1: In this particular movie. It didn't feel to me like

957
00:56:42,400 --> 00:56:45,520
Speaker 1: a judgment of plastic surgery. It felt more of a

958
00:56:45,640 --> 00:56:49,799
Speaker 1: judgment on these layers and how if you choose to

959
00:56:49,800 --> 00:56:52,759
Speaker 1: do this to yourself, do you think about the consequence

960
00:56:52,800 --> 00:56:55,520
Speaker 1: to the other person. So it was less about like

961
00:56:55,600 --> 00:56:59,800
Speaker 1: objective surgery bad surgery good, and more um consequences that

962
00:57:01,440 --> 00:57:08,239
Speaker 1: thinking and conscientiousness good. Good. Right, let's take another quick

963
00:57:08,280 --> 00:57:16,400
Speaker 1: break and then we'll come right back. I wanted to

964
00:57:16,440 --> 00:57:20,040
Speaker 1: talk a bit about just kind of like the characters

965
00:57:20,080 --> 00:57:25,600
Speaker 1: as individuals, starting with Addie, coming at it just from

966
00:57:25,640 --> 00:57:30,520
Speaker 1: a what do the characters do in the story as

967
00:57:30,560 --> 00:57:33,760
Speaker 1: it pertains to like their actions in the context of

968
00:57:33,800 --> 00:57:37,080
Speaker 1: being in this horror movie, because and we've talked about

969
00:57:37,120 --> 00:57:40,880
Speaker 1: this on various episodes in the past, where women in

970
00:57:40,960 --> 00:57:44,160
Speaker 1: horror movies will kind of be stripped of agency a

971
00:57:44,160 --> 00:57:48,800
Speaker 1: lot of the time, or they'll be and again I'm

972
00:57:48,800 --> 00:57:53,080
Speaker 1: always like worried about sounding victim blaming when I talk

973
00:57:53,160 --> 00:57:55,560
Speaker 1: about this, but they'll they'll be like kind of flailing

974
00:57:55,600 --> 00:57:57,919
Speaker 1: around and there's a killer right there, and they seem

975
00:57:58,080 --> 00:58:02,680
Speaker 1: completely oblivious of their impending doom and just like different

976
00:58:02,760 --> 00:58:05,800
Speaker 1: things like that where female characters were often just written

977
00:58:05,840 --> 00:58:10,400
Speaker 1: to seem oblivious of their surroundings for whatever reason, and

978
00:58:10,440 --> 00:58:13,360
Speaker 1: then they get killed about it. So this is sort

979
00:58:13,400 --> 00:58:20,640
Speaker 1: of here what we're used to seeing as horror going audiences.

980
00:58:20,920 --> 00:58:27,640
Speaker 1: So that you have Addie taking charge and making active

981
00:58:27,800 --> 00:58:32,720
Speaker 1: choices and knowing what danger she's in and knowing anticipating

982
00:58:32,720 --> 00:58:35,640
Speaker 1: what's going to happen, and we see her fighting and

983
00:58:36,160 --> 00:58:40,120
Speaker 1: we see her, you know, knowing that there there's this

984
00:58:40,320 --> 00:58:44,520
Speaker 1: scary family outside, let's call the cops immediately. Meanwhile, Gabe

985
00:58:44,600 --> 00:58:47,320
Speaker 1: is like, no, I'm gonna go out there. I'm gonna

986
00:58:47,360 --> 00:58:51,400
Speaker 1: exert my you know, masculinity at them and maybe scare

987
00:58:51,440 --> 00:58:53,600
Speaker 1: them off. And then that doesn't work, so then he

988
00:58:53,640 --> 00:58:56,240
Speaker 1: goes out again, this time with a weg Bin breaks

989
00:58:56,280 --> 00:59:00,720
Speaker 1: his leg and gets his knee broken, right, So like meanwhile,

990
00:59:00,880 --> 00:59:04,120
Speaker 1: like ADDIE's like I've already called the cops and we

991
00:59:04,200 --> 00:59:06,040
Speaker 1: know that that's not going to do anything, of course,

992
00:59:06,080 --> 00:59:08,480
Speaker 1: and then of course that they cops never show up

993
00:59:08,480 --> 00:59:11,280
Speaker 1: in this movie. Well, I think they all got stabbed

994
00:59:11,320 --> 00:59:14,080
Speaker 1: by Tether's in the cops defense, Like there was a

995
00:59:14,120 --> 00:59:17,560
Speaker 1: lot happening. I think that all if it had just

996
00:59:17,640 --> 00:59:20,200
Speaker 1: been one family that had Tethers to come, and I

997
00:59:20,240 --> 00:59:23,680
Speaker 1: think the cops maybe would have come eventually eventually, like

998
00:59:23,760 --> 00:59:28,600
Speaker 1: two later perhaps, But I do think it is cool,

999
00:59:28,680 --> 00:59:34,160
Speaker 1: and especially the dynamic between Gabe and Adelaide, where I

1000
00:59:34,200 --> 00:59:36,080
Speaker 1: think that he has and we were kind of talking

1001
00:59:36,080 --> 00:59:38,760
Speaker 1: about it with how he relates to Tim Heidecker's character,

1002
00:59:39,040 --> 00:59:42,800
Speaker 1: but he definitely has like this need to appear to

1003
00:59:42,920 --> 00:59:47,320
Speaker 1: be the dominant figure in the family, when if you know,

1004
00:59:47,440 --> 00:59:49,760
Speaker 1: the second you want to the family interact, you know

1005
00:59:50,040 --> 00:59:52,760
Speaker 1: that Adelaide is the one that makes the decisions, and

1006
00:59:53,440 --> 00:59:55,800
Speaker 1: the way their relationship is is like she doesn't necessarily

1007
00:59:55,840 --> 00:59:59,840
Speaker 1: need the credit for making the decisions, but she's making them,

1008
01:00:00,040 --> 01:00:03,840
Speaker 1: and that is like how how the story plays out

1009
01:00:04,120 --> 01:00:09,600
Speaker 1: down to like those subtle moments that happened between Gabe

1010
01:00:09,600 --> 01:00:12,800
Speaker 1: and Adelaide, and then also happens right before the Tethers

1011
01:00:12,880 --> 01:00:15,720
Speaker 1: arrived at the other house, at the Tyler House, where

1012
01:00:16,520 --> 01:00:20,800
Speaker 1: wife goes to her husband and says, something isn't right.

1013
01:00:21,080 --> 01:00:23,840
Speaker 1: I know, something isn't right. Something is going to go wrong,

1014
01:00:23,920 --> 01:00:26,920
Speaker 1: and then the husband is like, baby, baby, baby, relax,

1015
01:00:27,040 --> 01:00:29,880
Speaker 1: everything's fine, everything's great, it's good. Let's listen to the

1016
01:00:29,920 --> 01:00:32,600
Speaker 1: beach boys, and or let's just go to sleep or

1017
01:00:32,720 --> 01:00:35,880
Speaker 1: whatever it is. And which is I mean, I guess

1018
01:00:35,920 --> 01:00:38,120
Speaker 1: kind of like a horror classic of like don't believe

1019
01:00:38,160 --> 01:00:42,720
Speaker 1: women and then immediately get killed or injured, which I

1020
01:00:42,880 --> 01:00:47,040
Speaker 1: think there's a converse of that between Adelaide and Gabe,

1021
01:00:47,120 --> 01:00:50,680
Speaker 1: which I found was I thought was really interesting and thoughtless,

1022
01:00:50,720 --> 01:00:55,720
Speaker 1: handled better than what we see in most movies where so,

1023
01:00:55,920 --> 01:00:58,120
Speaker 1: you know, a lot of movies will have something that

1024
01:00:58,200 --> 01:01:01,960
Speaker 1: happens out of this world and that would be difficult

1025
01:01:02,040 --> 01:01:05,720
Speaker 1: to believe, probably by most people. It happens to the character,

1026
01:01:05,920 --> 01:01:08,960
Speaker 1: the character tells someone else about it, and then because

1027
01:01:08,960 --> 01:01:11,440
Speaker 1: it is difficult to believe, the other character is always

1028
01:01:11,480 --> 01:01:16,360
Speaker 1: like I don't believe you, and I and classic yep,

1029
01:01:16,480 --> 01:01:20,160
Speaker 1: amazing performance by me, Thank you so much. This happens

1030
01:01:20,160 --> 01:01:24,160
Speaker 1: with Adelaide where she's like, Gabe, I, as a kid,

1031
01:01:24,320 --> 01:01:27,600
Speaker 1: I had this experience. I feel like this person is

1032
01:01:27,680 --> 01:01:31,360
Speaker 1: coming after me. She's I feel like she's getting closer,

1033
01:01:31,400 --> 01:01:34,480
Speaker 1: and he's a little dismissive where he's like, well, you

1034
01:01:34,480 --> 01:01:35,880
Speaker 1: know you were in a house of mirrors. Are you

1035
01:01:35,960 --> 01:01:38,240
Speaker 1: sure it wasn't your reflection? And she's like, no, it

1036
01:01:38,360 --> 01:01:42,120
Speaker 1: was real. She's explaining all this stuff and then she realized.

1037
01:01:42,240 --> 01:01:45,040
Speaker 1: She's like, you don't believe me, and he's like I do.

1038
01:01:45,160 --> 01:01:48,800
Speaker 1: I'm just processing and I can't believe you kept this

1039
01:01:48,920 --> 01:01:51,840
Speaker 1: inside for so long. And then he makes a really

1040
01:01:52,520 --> 01:01:57,320
Speaker 1: joke in bad taste about it, like a domestic violence joke,

1041
01:01:58,040 --> 01:02:00,920
Speaker 1: and then he's like, oh, that was a bad joke. Sorry,

1042
01:02:01,080 --> 01:02:04,160
Speaker 1: just trying to lighten the mood. And I feel like that.

1043
01:02:04,520 --> 01:02:07,760
Speaker 1: I just liked that exchange because in most cases you

1044
01:02:07,880 --> 01:02:09,919
Speaker 1: just get like you'd be like, I don't believe you.

1045
01:02:09,920 --> 01:02:15,040
Speaker 1: You're being hysterical or whatever, and then there's no possible

1046
01:02:15,080 --> 01:02:18,840
Speaker 1: way that happened. What are you crazy? Should I call

1047
01:02:18,920 --> 01:02:24,840
Speaker 1: the doctor? Yeah? But then Gabe, Gabe comes at it.

1048
01:02:24,880 --> 01:02:27,440
Speaker 1: I feel like kiss. Caitlin and I have talked about

1049
01:02:27,440 --> 01:02:32,360
Speaker 1: this a bunch of like how sometimes when male character

1050
01:02:32,440 --> 01:02:36,160
Speaker 1: is being dismissive towards a woman or being kind of cruel,

1051
01:02:36,480 --> 01:02:38,920
Speaker 1: whether they mean to or not, that it's presented in

1052
01:02:38,920 --> 01:02:43,040
Speaker 1: a very broadway that male viewer could not really see

1053
01:02:43,040 --> 01:02:46,800
Speaker 1: themselves in. But in this it's like, I mean, I've

1054
01:02:46,840 --> 01:02:50,720
Speaker 1: been in that type of situation recently of just like

1055
01:02:50,760 --> 01:02:54,000
Speaker 1: someone being like that's okay, No, it's like what, I

1056
01:02:54,000 --> 01:02:56,320
Speaker 1: don't know what it's a soft nag. I don't know

1057
01:02:56,360 --> 01:02:59,480
Speaker 1: what I would call this situation, sure, but but something

1058
01:02:59,480 --> 01:03:04,640
Speaker 1: that is certain the recognizable behavior. So he's not dismissive,

1059
01:03:04,720 --> 01:03:07,400
Speaker 1: but he is. He's like he says, he's processing, he's

1060
01:03:07,440 --> 01:03:10,480
Speaker 1: trying to figure out what this could have been. And

1061
01:03:10,520 --> 01:03:13,600
Speaker 1: then two seconds later he would have to realize that

1062
01:03:13,640 --> 01:03:16,760
Speaker 1: she is was telling the truth and this did happen

1063
01:03:16,800 --> 01:03:19,240
Speaker 1: to her because who shows up on their doorstep but

1064
01:03:19,320 --> 01:03:22,320
Speaker 1: a family that looks exactly like them. So yeah, I

1065
01:03:22,360 --> 01:03:25,120
Speaker 1: just I thought that was interesting that way that was handled.

1066
01:03:25,200 --> 01:03:27,000
Speaker 1: It felt like it was handled with a lot more

1067
01:03:27,320 --> 01:03:31,200
Speaker 1: nuanced than it normally is. So I appreciated that. And

1068
01:03:31,760 --> 01:03:35,440
Speaker 1: Vincent Duke just is great. He's so he's like the

1069
01:03:35,520 --> 01:03:39,560
Speaker 1: funniest perform Like it just he's great, he's amazing. But

1070
01:03:39,720 --> 01:03:43,080
Speaker 1: in terms of Adelaide making decisions and not needing credit

1071
01:03:43,120 --> 01:03:46,720
Speaker 1: for them, I thought that was spot on. And we

1072
01:03:46,880 --> 01:03:49,960
Speaker 1: see sort of a reversal from that when they're in

1073
01:03:50,240 --> 01:03:52,960
Speaker 1: Josh and Kitty's house and he's like, we should stay here.

1074
01:03:53,320 --> 01:03:57,320
Speaker 1: We've got the backup generator, we've got food, We're safe,

1075
01:03:57,720 --> 01:04:00,440
Speaker 1: and she's like, really, are we safe? You don't get

1076
01:04:00,440 --> 01:04:03,200
Speaker 1: to make the decisions anymore. And she's like, I've been

1077
01:04:03,240 --> 01:04:06,280
Speaker 1: making decisions, and I've been fine with letting you think

1078
01:04:06,360 --> 01:04:08,720
Speaker 1: that it's happening. But she's just like, this is enough.

1079
01:04:08,960 --> 01:04:12,040
Speaker 1: I'm not going to die for your masculinity. We're going

1080
01:04:12,080 --> 01:04:15,760
Speaker 1: to take my advice and we're going to Mexico. Because

1081
01:04:15,840 --> 01:04:19,240
Speaker 1: his pitch was like, let's do home alone. Let's set

1082
01:04:19,360 --> 01:04:23,000
Speaker 1: some traps, do home alone thing. And she's like, really,

1083
01:04:23,040 --> 01:04:25,640
Speaker 1: did you just really reference home alone right now? And

1084
01:04:25,640 --> 01:04:27,640
Speaker 1: then of course the kids are like, what's home alone?

1085
01:04:27,680 --> 01:04:30,560
Speaker 1: What are micro machines? The kids are like, we are young,

1086
01:04:30,680 --> 01:04:35,800
Speaker 1: that is old. What is reference? It's like, really, you

1087
01:04:35,840 --> 01:04:38,280
Speaker 1: don't know what home alone is? Everyone knows what home alone.

1088
01:04:38,440 --> 01:04:40,640
Speaker 1: I was working with the kid once who was in

1089
01:04:40,680 --> 01:04:43,960
Speaker 1: I think ninth grade, last year. So he's like sixteen,

1090
01:04:44,280 --> 01:04:46,920
Speaker 1: had never seen The Little Mermaid, had never heard of

1091
01:04:46,920 --> 01:04:52,040
Speaker 1: the Little Mermaid. So yeah, and I was astonished. Yeah,

1092
01:04:52,160 --> 01:04:55,120
Speaker 1: I was like, one, this is a classic, but it's

1093
01:04:55,200 --> 01:04:59,880
Speaker 1: also very old. At this point, it's stated, yeah it's generating. Damn,

1094
01:05:00,320 --> 01:05:03,200
Speaker 1: we are simply old. So I believe they didn't know

1095
01:05:03,200 --> 01:05:07,720
Speaker 1: what Hamelan was there there is. And then I on

1096
01:05:07,800 --> 01:05:11,640
Speaker 1: the inverse of that, I like how I mean. I

1097
01:05:11,840 --> 01:05:14,520
Speaker 1: I think the child actors in this movie are really

1098
01:05:14,560 --> 01:05:18,480
Speaker 1: really talented and well directed. But even the way those

1099
01:05:18,560 --> 01:05:22,800
Speaker 1: characters are written, I felt like was unusual in a way.

1100
01:05:22,840 --> 01:05:25,960
Speaker 1: I really liked where I feel because you sort of

1101
01:05:26,000 --> 01:05:29,080
Speaker 1: get to know who Adelaide and Gabe are pretty quickly.

1102
01:05:29,800 --> 01:05:32,880
Speaker 1: I liked that it seemed like their daughter kind of

1103
01:05:32,920 --> 01:05:36,360
Speaker 1: took after Gabe a little more, and that Jason took

1104
01:05:36,400 --> 01:05:38,440
Speaker 1: a little more after Adelaide. I feel like that is

1105
01:05:38,480 --> 01:05:40,480
Speaker 1: not something you see in movies a lot. It's usually

1106
01:05:40,560 --> 01:05:43,840
Speaker 1: like daughter is like mother, son is like father, because

1107
01:05:44,400 --> 01:05:48,520
Speaker 1: gender binary where you can see I think, especially in Zora,

1108
01:05:48,640 --> 01:05:52,080
Speaker 1: you can see like both of her parents um, and

1109
01:05:52,120 --> 01:05:57,160
Speaker 1: then in in Jason, to have a younger son character

1110
01:05:57,520 --> 01:06:02,480
Speaker 1: who is like very sensitive and seems like resembles a lot.

1111
01:06:02,520 --> 01:06:05,919
Speaker 1: I think it's just kind of very much like how

1112
01:06:06,080 --> 01:06:08,640
Speaker 1: Addie was when she was a kid. I thought was

1113
01:06:08,680 --> 01:06:10,720
Speaker 1: really cool. You don't usually get to see a mother's

1114
01:06:10,720 --> 01:06:15,240
Speaker 1: son relationship that is like a mirror in in that way.

1115
01:06:15,480 --> 01:06:18,200
Speaker 1: Usually I feel like it's a little more gender like

1116
01:06:18,640 --> 01:06:22,320
Speaker 1: normative and strict about who resembles who in their actions.

1117
01:06:22,560 --> 01:06:25,800
Speaker 1: For sure, I think the fact that Jason is sensitive

1118
01:06:25,840 --> 01:06:28,680
Speaker 1: and different in many ways is one of the reasons

1119
01:06:28,760 --> 01:06:32,960
Speaker 1: that this big theory has come about where Jason is

1120
01:06:32,960 --> 01:06:36,720
Speaker 1: secretly it's heathered and um, I'm wondering if you were

1121
01:06:36,760 --> 01:06:40,160
Speaker 1: familiar with that theory and what you two thought about that.

1122
01:06:40,360 --> 01:06:42,760
Speaker 1: I read a little bit about it, but as soon

1123
01:06:42,840 --> 01:06:45,640
Speaker 1: I was reading in it in the same moment that

1124
01:06:45,720 --> 01:06:49,320
Speaker 1: I was also reading that Jordan Peel had completely dismissed

1125
01:06:49,360 --> 01:06:52,439
Speaker 1: that as a possibility, so I like, didn't even I'm like, yeah,

1126
01:06:52,480 --> 01:06:55,280
Speaker 1: I don't think so. I remember that was one of

1127
01:06:55,280 --> 01:06:58,520
Speaker 1: the first, I think one of the first popular theories

1128
01:06:58,560 --> 01:07:01,080
Speaker 1: I encounter after see in the movie the first time

1129
01:07:01,120 --> 01:07:06,960
Speaker 1: and was like, wait, what what there? It's interesting. I think, like,

1130
01:07:07,080 --> 01:07:09,760
Speaker 1: if you like draw that out, it is kind of interesting.

1131
01:07:10,760 --> 01:07:12,720
Speaker 1: But I think that yeah, it holds very little water.

1132
01:07:12,800 --> 01:07:17,240
Speaker 1: Jordan Peele was like, what, no, stop it. But I

1133
01:07:17,280 --> 01:07:20,640
Speaker 1: think it's interesting that this sensitivity and difference instead of

1134
01:07:20,680 --> 01:07:23,440
Speaker 1: just being like a sensitive boy was like, no, he

1135
01:07:23,520 --> 01:07:27,280
Speaker 1: must be a nightmare person from underground who has been replaced.

1136
01:07:27,840 --> 01:07:32,120
Speaker 1: So yeah, I don't like the applications of the theory. Yeah,

1137
01:07:32,160 --> 01:07:35,080
Speaker 1: that's how little leeway we're willing to give young boys

1138
01:07:35,080 --> 01:07:38,880
Speaker 1: in our society to be sort of soft, right, like

1139
01:07:38,920 --> 01:07:42,240
Speaker 1: it has to be has to be a conspiracy. Well,

1140
01:07:42,240 --> 01:07:46,840
Speaker 1: speaking of some other gender normative stuff, here's like one

1141
01:07:46,840 --> 01:07:48,960
Speaker 1: of the few things that bumped me a little bit

1142
01:07:49,320 --> 01:07:54,240
Speaker 1: was so they the family has decided after killing like

1143
01:07:54,360 --> 01:07:57,760
Speaker 1: evil Josh and Kitty in that family, add he's like,

1144
01:07:57,800 --> 01:07:59,160
Speaker 1: we have to be on the move again. We have

1145
01:07:59,200 --> 01:08:02,520
Speaker 1: to leave, we have to run. And they realized they

1146
01:08:02,520 --> 01:08:05,600
Speaker 1: don't have the car keys that they need. So Addie

1147
01:08:05,680 --> 01:08:08,880
Speaker 1: goes back inside and she realizes that one of the

1148
01:08:08,880 --> 01:08:13,960
Speaker 1: twins is still alive. Now Addie is holding a fireplace

1149
01:08:14,360 --> 01:08:19,240
Speaker 1: poker tool that we have seen her used before as

1150
01:08:19,280 --> 01:08:22,439
Speaker 1: a weapon. She's right by the sink and she so

1151
01:08:22,520 --> 01:08:24,800
Speaker 1: she was realizing that one of the twins is about

1152
01:08:24,840 --> 01:08:28,240
Speaker 1: to pounce on her, so she grabs a frying pan

1153
01:08:28,479 --> 01:08:32,559
Speaker 1: even though she's already holding holding the poker, and then

1154
01:08:32,680 --> 01:08:36,400
Speaker 1: uses the frying pan to hit the twin with. And

1155
01:08:36,439 --> 01:08:42,160
Speaker 1: we've talked countless times on the podcast about how oftentimes women,

1156
01:08:42,600 --> 01:08:44,920
Speaker 1: if they are allowed to fight back or use a

1157
01:08:44,920 --> 01:08:49,080
Speaker 1: weapon at all, it is often some sort of domestic item,

1158
01:08:49,320 --> 01:08:53,120
Speaker 1: often specifically a frying pan. I will argue that it's

1159
01:08:53,160 --> 01:08:55,439
Speaker 1: like I thought that too, But then I'm like, but

1160
01:08:55,479 --> 01:08:58,120
Speaker 1: then I was like, wait a second fire poker. I

1161
01:08:58,160 --> 01:09:01,280
Speaker 1: mean it's not it's not like as over the top

1162
01:09:01,439 --> 01:09:03,920
Speaker 1: as a frying pan, But I'm like, that's kind of

1163
01:09:03,960 --> 01:09:07,760
Speaker 1: a household object as well, Like it is, but it

1164
01:09:07,800 --> 01:09:11,320
Speaker 1: doesn't have necessarily like the same it's not the gender

1165
01:09:13,840 --> 01:09:16,679
Speaker 1: right to me, it felt a little bit more neutral.

1166
01:09:16,800 --> 01:09:19,439
Speaker 1: So but then I was like, why was she grab

1167
01:09:19,479 --> 01:09:21,720
Speaker 1: a frying pan? She's already holding this weapon, which she

1168
01:09:21,760 --> 01:09:25,799
Speaker 1: continues to hold and fight like that's how she kills

1169
01:09:26,800 --> 01:09:29,080
Speaker 1: that's what she uses to fight red with at the

1170
01:09:29,240 --> 01:09:33,280
Speaker 1: end and stuff. So I think that it's interesting because yes,

1171
01:09:33,320 --> 01:09:36,120
Speaker 1: they are both household items, and one could argue like

1172
01:09:36,479 --> 01:09:39,360
Speaker 1: in terms of like Goddess of the hearth and like

1173
01:09:39,640 --> 01:09:43,439
Speaker 1: fires are also historically in some cultures very feminine and

1174
01:09:43,479 --> 01:09:48,720
Speaker 1: like keeping your house warm. But the fire poker was

1175
01:09:49,040 --> 01:09:52,280
Speaker 1: an item of necessity that she was able to grab

1176
01:09:52,360 --> 01:09:56,519
Speaker 1: while she was tethered to the coffee table, and so

1177
01:09:56,640 --> 01:10:00,679
Speaker 1: like that she used that to extract herself from danger

1178
01:10:00,800 --> 01:10:03,080
Speaker 1: and then continue to use that. So I was like

1179
01:10:03,120 --> 01:10:04,920
Speaker 1: fine with that. I was like, this is what you

1180
01:10:04,920 --> 01:10:07,360
Speaker 1: were able to grab. But then having that already, then

1181
01:10:07,400 --> 01:10:11,400
Speaker 1: grabbing the frying pan definitely read is weird because it's like,

1182
01:10:12,120 --> 01:10:15,719
Speaker 1: you have a thing in your hand, why another weapon?

1183
01:10:15,920 --> 01:10:19,600
Speaker 1: And it's like her signature weapon too. Yeah, so it

1184
01:10:19,720 --> 01:10:23,040
Speaker 1: was just like why what a weird choice, especially because again,

1185
01:10:23,080 --> 01:10:27,280
Speaker 1: I mean we could ratle off several movies right now

1186
01:10:27,320 --> 01:10:30,360
Speaker 1: where a woman uses a frying pan specifically, we see

1187
01:10:30,360 --> 01:10:33,040
Speaker 1: it and Tangled, we see it in Roger Rabbit, we

1188
01:10:33,080 --> 01:10:35,479
Speaker 1: see it in Raiders of the Last Dark, we see

1189
01:10:35,520 --> 01:10:40,400
Speaker 1: it in Shako La, you know, like it's always and

1190
01:10:40,560 --> 01:10:44,519
Speaker 1: Alfred Molina's shock. Okay, I got my little alf now

1191
01:10:44,560 --> 01:10:47,360
Speaker 1: in my recording area. I have my little Alfred Molina

1192
01:10:47,439 --> 01:10:51,200
Speaker 1: at already. I love Alfred Molina. I saw him in

1193
01:10:51,240 --> 01:10:54,000
Speaker 1: a play when plays were still a thing, the last

1194
01:10:54,600 --> 01:10:56,839
Speaker 1: the last play I ever saw a start. Alfred Molina

1195
01:10:56,920 --> 01:10:59,080
Speaker 1: in it. He's great. Wait the last play? Did you

1196
01:10:59,080 --> 01:11:01,920
Speaker 1: see the one in passive? I did, Yeah, the Father

1197
01:11:02,240 --> 01:11:05,240
Speaker 1: I saw it too. He was so good. He was good.

1198
01:11:05,280 --> 01:11:10,759
Speaker 1: Everyone else was okay, everyone else was okay. I don't

1199
01:11:10,800 --> 01:11:13,800
Speaker 1: see I don't see a lot of like live like plays,

1200
01:11:13,800 --> 01:11:16,040
Speaker 1: but I was so glad I got to see that.

1201
01:11:16,479 --> 01:11:18,799
Speaker 1: It was a weird play. I don't know if I

1202
01:11:18,840 --> 01:11:22,560
Speaker 1: liked the play. It was weird and sad, and ultimately

1203
01:11:22,560 --> 01:11:25,200
Speaker 1: I was like, Okay, I could have not seen this

1204
01:11:25,280 --> 01:11:29,240
Speaker 1: and felt better, but it was. It was well acted.

1205
01:11:29,479 --> 01:11:32,680
Speaker 1: But anyway, back to the movie, Um, I wanted to

1206
01:11:33,560 --> 01:11:36,400
Speaker 1: just really quickly say something that was a reference to

1207
01:11:36,479 --> 01:11:38,840
Speaker 1: something I said earlier. So and I because I just

1208
01:11:38,880 --> 01:11:40,519
Speaker 1: figured it out in real time. I was like, why

1209
01:11:40,560 --> 01:11:43,800
Speaker 1: does this bother me so much? And it's the my

1210
01:11:43,800 --> 01:11:47,519
Speaker 1: my criticism of female characters being written in a certain

1211
01:11:47,520 --> 01:11:51,760
Speaker 1: way in horror movies where they do seem unaware of

1212
01:11:51,800 --> 01:11:56,000
Speaker 1: their surroundings, or that they make questionable choices things like that.

1213
01:11:56,600 --> 01:12:02,360
Speaker 1: And this is almost always a male writer director presenting

1214
01:12:02,520 --> 01:12:06,479
Speaker 1: female characters this way. And I'll use one of the

1215
01:12:06,479 --> 01:12:09,120
Speaker 1: worst horror movies I've ever seen as an example. A

1216
01:12:09,160 --> 01:12:12,439
Speaker 1: movie called The Terror Fire, which is about a killer

1217
01:12:12,479 --> 01:12:18,559
Speaker 1: clown who reaks havoc around the city and is specifically

1218
01:12:18,600 --> 01:12:21,479
Speaker 1: trying to kill this young woman and her friend. I

1219
01:12:21,520 --> 01:12:24,000
Speaker 1: would watch it. I will say it would get a

1220
01:12:24,080 --> 01:12:28,920
Speaker 1: negative one zillion nipples on the Bechtel cast, so stopped us.

1221
01:12:31,400 --> 01:12:34,240
Speaker 1: In that movie, you see the protagonist, who as a woman,

1222
01:12:34,640 --> 01:12:38,280
Speaker 1: making countless choice after choice after choice of just you

1223
01:12:38,360 --> 01:12:40,360
Speaker 1: as the audience would be like, why would you do that?

1224
01:12:40,400 --> 01:12:43,439
Speaker 1: Why would you go back into the scary warehouse where

1225
01:12:43,439 --> 01:12:45,360
Speaker 1: you know a killer is Why would you do any

1226
01:12:45,400 --> 01:12:47,920
Speaker 1: of what you're doing besides running away and trying to

1227
01:12:47,960 --> 01:12:51,439
Speaker 1: find safety? And that is the thing that I take

1228
01:12:51,479 --> 01:12:55,600
Speaker 1: issue with because it's like, as women, we are constantly

1229
01:12:55,600 --> 01:12:57,960
Speaker 1: on high alert for our safety, right, we know the

1230
01:12:58,080 --> 01:13:03,000
Speaker 1: dangers lurking out there, and we're not just like obliviously

1231
01:13:03,160 --> 01:13:07,960
Speaker 1: making horrible choices all the time to go into scary

1232
01:13:07,960 --> 01:13:11,439
Speaker 1: warehouses where we just almost got murdered. Right. So yeah,

1233
01:13:11,640 --> 01:13:13,280
Speaker 1: Like I I just said I wouldn't put one of

1234
01:13:13,320 --> 01:13:15,800
Speaker 1: those family stickers on my car because somebody might come

1235
01:13:15,800 --> 01:13:21,280
Speaker 1: and murder my family, right, Yeah, we're all on the

1236
01:13:21,320 --> 01:13:24,479
Speaker 1: defensive now. I'm like, damn, I hadn't thought about that

1237
01:13:24,640 --> 01:13:27,040
Speaker 1: about the stickers, but now I'm off them for life,

1238
01:13:27,320 --> 01:13:29,639
Speaker 1: or I'll put a different sticker to throw them off

1239
01:13:29,680 --> 01:13:34,320
Speaker 1: my track, right right, Like we have eighteen kids and

1240
01:13:34,320 --> 01:13:38,600
Speaker 1: we all have guns, stay away. So yeah, So the

1241
01:13:38,640 --> 01:13:40,760
Speaker 1: point is, like I just I get so annoyed when

1242
01:13:40,880 --> 01:13:45,799
Speaker 1: like against specifically men who are making horror movies don't

1243
01:13:45,920 --> 01:13:50,080
Speaker 1: even know to take into consideration the high alert that

1244
01:13:50,160 --> 01:13:54,599
Speaker 1: women have to be on just in everyday life, especially

1245
01:13:54,640 --> 01:13:57,439
Speaker 1: at night, you know, and then make the assumption that

1246
01:13:57,520 --> 01:14:02,040
Speaker 1: it's irrational at its core. So that's I just wanted

1247
01:14:02,040 --> 01:14:04,360
Speaker 1: to clarify because I'm always like I sound so like

1248
01:14:04,520 --> 01:14:07,760
Speaker 1: victim blamey no. And I think that's one of the

1249
01:14:07,760 --> 01:14:10,120
Speaker 1: reasons that I like the Scream franchise so much, because

1250
01:14:10,120 --> 01:14:14,519
Speaker 1: Sidney Prescott is always very aware and hyper aware, and

1251
01:14:14,560 --> 01:14:18,240
Speaker 1: she's had multiple killers come after her. So as each

1252
01:14:18,280 --> 01:14:21,240
Speaker 1: movie gets on and she becomes smarter and more creative.

1253
01:14:21,320 --> 01:14:23,600
Speaker 1: But it's like basically about a woman who continues to

1254
01:14:23,640 --> 01:14:27,160
Speaker 1: be stalked and like how she fights against that as

1255
01:14:27,200 --> 01:14:30,120
Speaker 1: opposed to like, oh, Ladi da, I'm finding myself in

1256
01:14:30,120 --> 01:14:32,320
Speaker 1: this situation, like she becomes a target for these people

1257
01:14:32,320 --> 01:14:35,160
Speaker 1: who become obsessed with her, especially after a film about

1258
01:14:35,160 --> 01:14:39,120
Speaker 1: her life is made, So I think that that's really intriguing. Also,

1259
01:14:39,120 --> 01:14:41,920
Speaker 1: I love the movie Stab, which is the screen movies

1260
01:14:42,080 --> 01:14:47,520
Speaker 1: inside the screen movies, um, and I love that inside

1261
01:14:47,560 --> 01:14:49,280
Speaker 1: the movie in the fourth screen they have like a

1262
01:14:49,320 --> 01:14:52,920
Speaker 1: stab fest. But anyway back to us, I love screen

1263
01:14:53,000 --> 01:14:56,720
Speaker 1: and going off what you're saying, Caitlin, I am encouraged

1264
01:14:56,800 --> 01:15:00,920
Speaker 1: by seeing movies like us, and even because it's like,

1265
01:15:01,040 --> 01:15:06,880
Speaker 1: you know, we can't necessarily stop men from writing movies, right,

1266
01:15:07,200 --> 01:15:09,559
Speaker 1: so if we're going off of that, it is nice

1267
01:15:09,600 --> 01:15:12,960
Speaker 1: that they seem to be getting a little bit better

1268
01:15:13,000 --> 01:15:15,960
Speaker 1: about at least recognizing the tropes of the genre that

1269
01:15:16,080 --> 01:15:19,120
Speaker 1: are irrational and harmful and have everything to do with

1270
01:15:19,160 --> 01:15:22,400
Speaker 1: their writing versus what the reality is. I feel like

1271
01:15:22,400 --> 01:15:25,080
Speaker 1: another example you could point to is the new Halloween movie,

1272
01:15:25,280 --> 01:15:31,160
Speaker 1: where you know Laurie Laurie strode Um in the original franchise,

1273
01:15:31,280 --> 01:15:35,439
Speaker 1: like her actions are made to seem somewhat irrational, very

1274
01:15:35,479 --> 01:15:38,200
Speaker 1: like final girly, and then in the new one you

1275
01:15:38,240 --> 01:15:41,080
Speaker 1: see that she's been like living this life of fear

1276
01:15:41,600 --> 01:15:44,760
Speaker 1: and like what are the ramifications of that and examining

1277
01:15:45,320 --> 01:15:48,439
Speaker 1: at least and it's I will say that horror movies.

1278
01:15:48,600 --> 01:15:52,040
Speaker 1: Recent horror movies have done it with mixed results, but

1279
01:15:52,200 --> 01:15:59,120
Speaker 1: examining the PTSD aspect of being pursued by something terrifying

1280
01:15:59,280 --> 01:16:03,760
Speaker 1: and how that affects you psychologically, I will say that

1281
01:16:03,800 --> 01:16:07,439
Speaker 1: I don't think. I don't. There's not a lot of

1282
01:16:07,479 --> 01:16:10,920
Speaker 1: horror movies that do it extremely well. The Babba Dick

1283
01:16:11,000 --> 01:16:13,759
Speaker 1: comes to mind of like one horror movie that deals

1284
01:16:13,840 --> 01:16:20,040
Speaker 1: with PTSD and and just like a fear really really well.

1285
01:16:20,120 --> 01:16:22,639
Speaker 1: I thought, or at least when we did the episode,

1286
01:16:22,760 --> 01:16:26,280
Speaker 1: wasn't I thought it was postpartum. Yeah, but I mean

1287
01:16:26,320 --> 01:16:31,599
Speaker 1: like a form of psychological stress and trauma here in

1288
01:16:31,600 --> 01:16:36,320
Speaker 1: in US. I it's kind of muddled for me. Where

1289
01:16:37,439 --> 01:16:43,200
Speaker 1: So we see young Addie, who actually is young Red,

1290
01:16:44,320 --> 01:16:47,760
Speaker 1: come up to the service and then she's put into

1291
01:16:48,560 --> 01:16:51,640
Speaker 1: therapy because she's not speaking. This is perceived to be

1292
01:16:51,720 --> 01:16:55,760
Speaker 1: a result of PTSD. It also appears to be a

1293
01:16:55,800 --> 01:17:00,320
Speaker 1: stressor on her parents marriage, which is every child of

1294
01:17:00,439 --> 01:17:04,040
Speaker 1: divorce is worst fear, although they seemed to have some

1295
01:17:04,120 --> 01:17:08,439
Speaker 1: issues before. Also, Oh yeah, because there's like it sounds

1296
01:17:08,479 --> 01:17:11,759
Speaker 1: like he you know, like there's there's some drinking going

1297
01:17:11,800 --> 01:17:17,640
Speaker 1: on and other other stresses on the relationship. Um, but

1298
01:17:17,720 --> 01:17:19,800
Speaker 1: I don't know. I'm curious of like what you both

1299
01:17:19,880 --> 01:17:24,519
Speaker 1: made of that plot point. I felt I felt like

1300
01:17:24,560 --> 01:17:29,840
Speaker 1: it was less about developing PTSD and more about setting

1301
01:17:29,920 --> 01:17:32,960
Speaker 1: up for the reveal. And also I do like that

1302
01:17:33,120 --> 01:17:35,639
Speaker 1: it was she was gone for fifteen minutes. What can

1303
01:17:35,680 --> 01:17:39,920
Speaker 1: happen in fifteen minutes? And when we are in real

1304
01:17:39,960 --> 01:17:43,200
Speaker 1: time and the invasion is happening, Uh, they call the

1305
01:17:43,240 --> 01:17:44,800
Speaker 1: police and the police say they will be there in

1306
01:17:44,920 --> 01:17:48,400
Speaker 1: fifteen minutes, and we already know what is going to

1307
01:17:48,439 --> 01:17:51,280
Speaker 1: happen or what can happen in fifteen minutes. If you're

1308
01:17:51,320 --> 01:17:54,479
Speaker 1: rewatching it, you're like, fifteen minutes is not good. You

1309
01:17:54,560 --> 01:17:57,559
Speaker 1: need to be there sooner. Bad things can happen. And

1310
01:17:57,600 --> 01:17:59,800
Speaker 1: I thought it was interesting that it was the dad

1311
01:18:00,000 --> 01:18:01,800
Speaker 1: who was like, what could have happened? It was only

1312
01:18:01,840 --> 01:18:05,200
Speaker 1: fifteen minutes, and the mom was like, a lot can

1313
01:18:05,240 --> 01:18:09,280
Speaker 1: happen in fifteen minutes, Like ADDIE's mom like knows, and

1314
01:18:09,400 --> 01:18:13,479
Speaker 1: that's why she's so concerned for her daughter. Yeah, because

1315
01:18:13,479 --> 01:18:15,160
Speaker 1: they have no clue what's happened to her, and it's

1316
01:18:15,240 --> 01:18:19,280
Speaker 1: far worse than they could have even imagined, Like they

1317
01:18:19,439 --> 01:18:22,519
Speaker 1: don't they never see their daughter again actually, and the

1318
01:18:22,600 --> 01:18:25,479
Speaker 1: other the other read that I was and this isn't.

1319
01:18:25,520 --> 01:18:27,840
Speaker 1: I don't have this backed up by anywhere. So maybe

1320
01:18:27,880 --> 01:18:34,439
Speaker 1: I'm just my brain is just turning into putting over time. Um,

1321
01:18:35,040 --> 01:18:37,800
Speaker 1: But I was. I was thinking, um just in terms

1322
01:18:37,880 --> 01:18:42,280
Speaker 1: of how it seems like ADDIE's parents want to get

1323
01:18:42,320 --> 01:18:47,840
Speaker 1: her help from a therapist. But the pts D, while

1324
01:18:47,880 --> 01:18:50,200
Speaker 1: it it's made I feel I feel like it sort

1325
01:18:50,240 --> 01:18:52,040
Speaker 1: of ties into what the message of the movie is,

1326
01:18:52,040 --> 01:18:56,080
Speaker 1: where it's they're ascribing PTSD to an individual when it

1327
01:18:56,120 --> 01:19:01,040
Speaker 1: actually represents something that is far larger, where it's like

1328
01:19:01,080 --> 01:19:05,880
Speaker 1: read is representative of this whole unseen population that is

1329
01:19:05,920 --> 01:19:10,680
Speaker 1: being actively oppressed and that is where this like stress

1330
01:19:10,720 --> 01:19:13,960
Speaker 1: and trauma is coming from. And also she can't communicate

1331
01:19:14,400 --> 01:19:17,400
Speaker 1: with her parents and she cannot describe what the problem is.

1332
01:19:17,479 --> 01:19:20,280
Speaker 1: And for self preservation issues, even when she has the

1333
01:19:20,280 --> 01:19:23,400
Speaker 1: tools to communicate, she doesn't because she wants to thrive

1334
01:19:23,720 --> 01:19:28,519
Speaker 1: in ADDIE's place. And I don't know, it's dense. Yeah,

1335
01:19:28,880 --> 01:19:33,840
Speaker 1: here's a question. Do we think that Addie when she

1336
01:19:34,000 --> 01:19:37,200
Speaker 1: is newly Addie, when she's come from underground, do we

1337
01:19:37,240 --> 01:19:40,600
Speaker 1: think that she has repressed the fact that she was

1338
01:19:40,640 --> 01:19:44,040
Speaker 1: originally a tethered because I felt like that was supposed

1339
01:19:44,040 --> 01:19:46,880
Speaker 1: to be something we were believing. Yeah, I thought that

1340
01:19:47,000 --> 01:19:49,519
Speaker 1: was how That's how I thought we were supposed to

1341
01:19:49,520 --> 01:19:52,519
Speaker 1: see it. I don't know. I was focused far more

1342
01:19:52,560 --> 01:19:55,360
Speaker 1: on and again, maybe this is just me trying to

1343
01:19:55,400 --> 01:19:59,080
Speaker 1: make sense of something too hard, but I was focused

1344
01:19:59,120 --> 01:20:03,200
Speaker 1: more on, well, why doesn't real Addie, who has now

1345
01:20:03,280 --> 01:20:07,360
Speaker 1: been trapped underground and made to live among the tethereds,

1346
01:20:07,360 --> 01:20:10,160
Speaker 1: even though she is not a tethered why does she

1347
01:20:10,280 --> 01:20:13,799
Speaker 1: never try to escape and just go all? It seems

1348
01:20:13,800 --> 01:20:15,320
Speaker 1: like all she would have had to do is like

1349
01:20:15,760 --> 01:20:19,320
Speaker 1: run up an escalator that is going in the downward motion,

1350
01:20:19,439 --> 01:20:21,280
Speaker 1: But it seems I was like, why doesn't she she

1351
01:20:21,360 --> 01:20:24,479
Speaker 1: knows where she comes from, why doesn't she ever try

1352
01:20:24,520 --> 01:20:29,080
Speaker 1: to leave this terrifying place? I that was curious for

1353
01:20:29,160 --> 01:20:34,040
Speaker 1: me too, because so the tethered are mirrors of what's

1354
01:20:34,080 --> 01:20:35,840
Speaker 1: going on above ground. They're doing all the things that

1355
01:20:35,880 --> 01:20:38,679
Speaker 1: they're above ground people are doing, and then they switch places.

1356
01:20:39,040 --> 01:20:43,160
Speaker 1: So when they switch places, is now underground Addie and

1357
01:20:43,240 --> 01:20:46,000
Speaker 1: tethered to above ground Addie. Because there is also the

1358
01:20:46,000 --> 01:20:48,599
Speaker 1: speculation that they're sharing one soul, so it's not even

1359
01:20:48,640 --> 01:20:52,080
Speaker 1: that they are soulless. It's that they're like everybody's got

1360
01:20:52,120 --> 01:20:55,040
Speaker 1: half a soul sort of split between them, So like,

1361
01:20:55,560 --> 01:20:58,840
Speaker 1: is the soul stationary and it lives above ground? Like

1362
01:20:58,920 --> 01:21:01,719
Speaker 1: what is what the deal? Well, that's what Red seems

1363
01:21:01,800 --> 01:21:04,920
Speaker 1: to explain in the when they first invade the home,

1364
01:21:05,280 --> 01:21:07,760
Speaker 1: and she's like, I was tethered to you, and that's

1365
01:21:07,760 --> 01:21:11,880
Speaker 1: why I'm trying to become untethered, so I I think,

1366
01:21:11,920 --> 01:21:14,639
Speaker 1: but yeah, I guess that that's why I don't really

1367
01:21:14,680 --> 01:21:17,360
Speaker 1: like the ending. There's so many story logic issues that

1368
01:21:17,439 --> 01:21:21,720
Speaker 1: come up for me, and I'm just like, oh, what well,

1369
01:21:21,800 --> 01:21:24,760
Speaker 1: And the dance is the big lynchpin. When she's like

1370
01:21:24,760 --> 01:21:27,280
Speaker 1: fourteen years old and she has this dance recital where

1371
01:21:27,320 --> 01:21:30,240
Speaker 1: she ends up getting injured, and my understanding of that

1372
01:21:30,680 --> 01:21:35,200
Speaker 1: was that Red underground version read was able to take

1373
01:21:35,280 --> 01:21:38,919
Speaker 1: control during that dance and that's how she was ultimately injured,

1374
01:21:39,200 --> 01:21:40,760
Speaker 1: because she has that line where she's like, oh, I

1375
01:21:40,800 --> 01:21:44,240
Speaker 1: piked at fourteen with her leg as a dancer, and

1376
01:21:44,840 --> 01:21:47,120
Speaker 1: that's when they realized she was special because she could

1377
01:21:47,160 --> 01:21:50,080
Speaker 1: control her above ground or she could break from the tethering.

1378
01:21:50,720 --> 01:21:53,519
Speaker 1: And I don't understand what that was because they would

1379
01:21:53,520 --> 01:21:56,160
Speaker 1: all have to have eventually broken from the tethering to

1380
01:21:56,200 --> 01:21:58,280
Speaker 1: be able to even plan this and put on these

1381
01:21:58,560 --> 01:22:03,479
Speaker 1: fashionable jumpsuits, so that the moment where everything switches, the

1382
01:22:03,640 --> 01:22:09,559
Speaker 1: ending worked for me on this viewing, going with the

1383
01:22:09,600 --> 01:22:13,680
Speaker 1: read of the movie that I'm currently going with, um

1384
01:22:13,800 --> 01:22:16,360
Speaker 1: in that way, I feel like it really works. Where

1385
01:22:16,400 --> 01:22:20,880
Speaker 1: if you're going off of Jordan's Peel's kind of thesis

1386
01:22:21,680 --> 01:22:25,040
Speaker 1: that this is a movie about, like you, you know,

1387
01:22:25,080 --> 01:22:29,240
Speaker 1: American exceptionalism, like I deserve this lifestyle, this is I'm

1388
01:22:29,400 --> 01:22:33,200
Speaker 1: entitled to this, and just kind of I don't know,

1389
01:22:33,320 --> 01:22:37,639
Speaker 1: like exploring that fallacy of like, oh there's enough, there's

1390
01:22:37,760 --> 01:22:42,680
Speaker 1: enough prosperity to go around, where the reality of what

1391
01:22:42,840 --> 01:22:46,720
Speaker 1: I mean, I we've gotten this far without saying capitalism,

1392
01:22:46,800 --> 01:22:50,560
Speaker 1: so sorry, but like the reality of like American capitalism

1393
01:22:50,680 --> 01:22:53,080
Speaker 1: is that it's designed so that there's not enough room

1394
01:22:53,080 --> 01:22:56,120
Speaker 1: for everybody, and so for one person to prosper by

1395
01:22:56,160 --> 01:22:59,160
Speaker 1: this movie's logic and buy a lot of reality, another

1396
01:22:59,240 --> 01:23:02,240
Speaker 1: person has to be oppressed and suffer. So in that way,

1397
01:23:02,280 --> 01:23:06,640
Speaker 1: I felt like the swap ending works if that is

1398
01:23:06,680 --> 01:23:08,720
Speaker 1: supposed to be the message of the core, But like

1399
01:23:09,080 --> 01:23:14,280
Speaker 1: logistically there's for sure, I'm like, huh what And also

1400
01:23:14,400 --> 01:23:16,280
Speaker 1: there every time I do have to say it's an

1401
01:23:16,320 --> 01:23:20,679
Speaker 1: incredible line read from Lupete and Youngo. But every time

1402
01:23:21,800 --> 01:23:26,160
Speaker 1: reds like we are Americans, I'm like, okay, all right,

1403
01:23:27,360 --> 01:23:31,880
Speaker 1: Hitn't it real hard? There? Jordan's Well, that transitions into

1404
01:23:32,560 --> 01:23:37,000
Speaker 1: talking point that I wanted to hit on, which is, um,

1405
01:23:37,120 --> 01:23:43,040
Speaker 1: the use of disability equals evil in a horror movie.

1406
01:23:43,640 --> 01:23:48,639
Speaker 1: This is an enormous, widespread trope because what happened here

1407
01:23:49,000 --> 01:23:53,480
Speaker 1: is that Lupeta revealed at some point that as inspiration

1408
01:23:53,640 --> 01:23:58,960
Speaker 1: for the way she made Red's voice sound, she used

1409
01:23:59,360 --> 01:24:04,559
Speaker 1: the symptoms of spasmodic dysphonia, which is a neurological disorder

1410
01:24:04,600 --> 01:24:09,240
Speaker 1: that causes involuntary spasms of the larynx um. And her

1411
01:24:09,479 --> 01:24:15,680
Speaker 1: revealing this received understandably backlash. And uh, I'm pulling from

1412
01:24:15,720 --> 01:24:19,759
Speaker 1: an article in The Guardian entitled Lupida Nyongo's under fire

1413
01:24:19,960 --> 01:24:25,280
Speaker 1: from disability groups for quote evil voice in us SO.

1414
01:24:25,400 --> 01:24:30,040
Speaker 1: Respectability is a nonprofit organization that works to fight stigmas

1415
01:24:30,080 --> 01:24:35,400
Speaker 1: against people with disabilities. The president of Respectability, Jennifer Laslow

1416
01:24:35,840 --> 01:24:41,679
Speaker 1: ms Rahi, said, quote connecting disabilities to characters who are evil.

1417
01:24:41,880 --> 01:24:47,080
Speaker 1: Even further marginalizes people with disabilities who also have significant

1418
01:24:47,160 --> 01:24:51,240
Speaker 1: abilities and want to contribute to their communities just like

1419
01:24:51,280 --> 01:24:54,200
Speaker 1: anyone else dot dot dot. What is difficult for us

1420
01:24:54,240 --> 01:24:57,440
Speaker 1: and for the thousands of people living with spasmodic dysphonia

1421
01:24:57,880 --> 01:25:01,559
Speaker 1: is this association to their voice with what might be

1422
01:25:01,840 --> 01:25:06,240
Speaker 1: considered haunting end quote. So again, this is just another

1423
01:25:06,280 --> 01:25:10,040
Speaker 1: movie that describes a disability or a characteristic of a

1424
01:25:10,080 --> 01:25:14,759
Speaker 1: disability to a character who is evil, who is violent,

1425
01:25:14,880 --> 01:25:18,599
Speaker 1: who murders people. And this isn't just a horror movie thing.

1426
01:25:18,680 --> 01:25:22,120
Speaker 1: This happens in action movies. This happens in sci fi movies.

1427
01:25:22,479 --> 01:25:26,200
Speaker 1: This happens fantasy a lot ton basically across film in general,

1428
01:25:26,320 --> 01:25:32,479
Speaker 1: where disability could be demonize. Yeah, fiction across the world,

1429
01:25:32,680 --> 01:25:37,720
Speaker 1: in every aspect, disability will be demonized. I will say

1430
01:25:37,840 --> 01:25:40,280
Speaker 1: I love How To Train Your Dragon Too, because I

1431
01:25:40,320 --> 01:25:43,120
Speaker 1: feel like it's sort of goes against that where in

1432
01:25:43,160 --> 01:25:45,760
Speaker 1: How to Train Your Dragon Too? What's his face? I

1433
01:25:45,840 --> 01:25:49,840
Speaker 1: just forgot his name? Hiccup the main character. He has

1434
01:25:49,880 --> 01:25:53,400
Speaker 1: lost the leg and he modifies his dragon so that

1435
01:25:53,439 --> 01:25:56,160
Speaker 1: he can ride his dragon even with the missing leg.

1436
01:25:56,200 --> 01:25:59,600
Speaker 1: And he has like a prosthesis, and the villain of

1437
01:25:59,600 --> 01:26:01,920
Speaker 1: How To In Your Dragon Too also has a disability,

1438
01:26:01,960 --> 01:26:04,280
Speaker 1: but refuses to accept that their disability is a part

1439
01:26:04,320 --> 01:26:06,360
Speaker 1: of who they are, and like that's why they're bad,

1440
01:26:06,960 --> 01:26:10,360
Speaker 1: not because of disability. I like, I literally wept when

1441
01:26:10,360 --> 01:26:11,920
Speaker 1: I saw How To Train Your Dragon Too. It's like,

1442
01:26:12,000 --> 01:26:17,519
Speaker 1: this is beautiful, that they're pretty good, but I mean

1443
01:26:17,560 --> 01:26:22,920
Speaker 1: even speaking to how disability is portrayed, and then and

1444
01:26:22,960 --> 01:26:27,479
Speaker 1: the fact that it's it's like the demonization of disabled

1445
01:26:27,520 --> 01:26:30,720
Speaker 1: people is so normalized that Lupete and Youngo didn't think

1446
01:26:30,760 --> 01:26:35,040
Speaker 1: twice about saying that is I mean, it goes I'm

1447
01:26:35,040 --> 01:26:37,040
Speaker 1: glad she was called out for that, but it speaks

1448
01:26:37,080 --> 01:26:40,120
Speaker 1: to something that is much larger, where it's like, this

1449
01:26:40,200 --> 01:26:45,440
Speaker 1: is a horror movie that subverts so many common pitfalls,

1450
01:26:45,960 --> 01:26:50,280
Speaker 1: but there still wasn't really thought of or discussion about

1451
01:26:50,320 --> 01:26:54,720
Speaker 1: how disability is presented by by the filmmakers or by

1452
01:26:54,720 --> 01:26:57,200
Speaker 1: the actors or kind of on any level, which I

1453
01:26:57,240 --> 01:27:00,400
Speaker 1: feel like speaks to just how cooked in it is,

1454
01:27:00,479 --> 01:27:03,840
Speaker 1: to what is quote unquote okay to do for movie.

1455
01:27:04,240 --> 01:27:08,960
Speaker 1: And Lupida apologized, and I have this quote here as well.

1456
01:27:09,120 --> 01:27:12,040
Speaker 1: She said, quote it's a very marginal group of people

1457
01:27:12,080 --> 01:27:15,160
Speaker 1: who suffer from this, which sidebar. It's like, well, that

1458
01:27:15,200 --> 01:27:17,080
Speaker 1: doesn't make it okay. It's almost like, are you saying

1459
01:27:17,120 --> 01:27:21,120
Speaker 1: that that makes it okay? That it's only or offended,

1460
01:27:21,200 --> 01:27:23,400
Speaker 1: like who are this affected? But it's like I was

1461
01:27:23,520 --> 01:27:29,000
Speaker 1: only going to hurt seventeen people to continue the quote.

1462
01:27:29,560 --> 01:27:32,000
Speaker 1: The thought that I would in a way offend them

1463
01:27:32,160 --> 01:27:35,679
Speaker 1: was not my intention. In my mind, I wasn't interested

1464
01:27:35,720 --> 01:27:39,280
Speaker 1: in vilifying or demonizing the condition. I crafted read with

1465
01:27:39,400 --> 01:27:43,080
Speaker 1: love and care. As much as it was a genre

1466
01:27:43,120 --> 01:27:45,759
Speaker 1: specific world, I really wanted to ground her in something

1467
01:27:45,760 --> 01:27:49,320
Speaker 1: that felt real. For all that I say sorry to

1468
01:27:49,400 --> 01:27:54,320
Speaker 1: anyone I may have offended. End quote. So I don't

1469
01:27:54,400 --> 01:27:58,599
Speaker 1: love this apology. I feel like she's it's kind of

1470
01:27:58,640 --> 01:28:03,280
Speaker 1: like well in my the ends, but also I'm sorry, yeah,

1471
01:28:03,479 --> 01:28:06,439
Speaker 1: but it's like love and care for how like that's

1472
01:28:06,479 --> 01:28:09,280
Speaker 1: such a weird thing to add that the aircrafted red

1473
01:28:09,320 --> 01:28:15,559
Speaker 1: with love and care, Like ah that Lupeta. I mean,

1474
01:28:15,840 --> 01:28:18,479
Speaker 1: I mean it's like if we're giving I don't know.

1475
01:28:18,640 --> 01:28:22,040
Speaker 1: That was like not a great apology, But I do

1476
01:28:22,280 --> 01:28:26,519
Speaker 1: hope that, like she's, she is going to carry this forward,

1477
01:28:26,560 --> 01:28:28,760
Speaker 1: and I hope that, you know, other actors saw this

1478
01:28:28,840 --> 01:28:32,120
Speaker 1: almost we're you know, we'll think twice. It's it's an

1479
01:28:32,120 --> 01:28:34,559
Speaker 1: easy It's just again, it's like it's so easy to

1480
01:28:34,720 --> 01:28:38,960
Speaker 1: just not do this and be respectful of other people. Um,

1481
01:28:39,000 --> 01:28:42,639
Speaker 1: and yeah, it's not like it's usually people's intention to

1482
01:28:42,680 --> 01:28:46,240
Speaker 1: demonize things like this, but because, like you said, Jamie,

1483
01:28:46,280 --> 01:28:49,559
Speaker 1: it's become so normalized that people just do it without

1484
01:28:49,640 --> 01:28:52,240
Speaker 1: even giving it a second thought about who would be

1485
01:28:52,640 --> 01:28:56,240
Speaker 1: negatively affected by these kinds of misrepresentations, which is kind

1486
01:28:56,240 --> 01:28:59,360
Speaker 1: of fascinating because that's like what the movie is about

1487
01:29:00,600 --> 01:29:05,599
Speaker 1: that she's in is like how the whatever upstairs Lupeta

1488
01:29:05,680 --> 01:29:07,800
Speaker 1: has nothing but good intentions and is trying to do

1489
01:29:07,880 --> 01:29:11,920
Speaker 1: well but is ignoring what is going on elsewhere and

1490
01:29:12,000 --> 01:29:14,240
Speaker 1: is willfully ignorant of what's going on elsewhere. And this

1491
01:29:14,280 --> 01:29:16,599
Speaker 1: is like, I guess, not a one to one example,

1492
01:29:16,600 --> 01:29:19,520
Speaker 1: but a microcosm, but he is not even willfully ignorant.

1493
01:29:19,560 --> 01:29:21,559
Speaker 1: I mean maybe, but it's is it comes down to

1494
01:29:21,600 --> 01:29:24,400
Speaker 1: the question of is she has she repressed all of

1495
01:29:24,400 --> 01:29:28,519
Speaker 1: those memories of when she did live among the tethers

1496
01:29:28,560 --> 01:29:32,760
Speaker 1: underground or I guess I'm guess more just like those

1497
01:29:32,840 --> 01:29:36,240
Speaker 1: characters in general, not not the swaps well, And the

1498
01:29:36,520 --> 01:29:38,920
Speaker 1: frustrating thing for me is that there's also a plot

1499
01:29:38,960 --> 01:29:42,080
Speaker 1: based reason for Red to have a voice like that.

1500
01:29:42,560 --> 01:29:46,920
Speaker 1: She gets choked, she gets choked out and dragged down there.

1501
01:29:47,160 --> 01:29:51,200
Speaker 1: And she also has not spoken English in presumably many

1502
01:29:51,240 --> 01:29:55,360
Speaker 1: many years, so she's been using this other language that

1503
01:29:55,520 --> 01:30:00,880
Speaker 1: is very throat based, and she has throat injuries. And like,

1504
01:30:01,040 --> 01:30:04,479
Speaker 1: I don't understand why it had to be, Oh, there's

1505
01:30:04,520 --> 01:30:07,960
Speaker 1: this disease that looks interesting for me to copy. It

1506
01:30:08,280 --> 01:30:10,800
Speaker 1: just doesn't make sense because there's so many things that

1507
01:30:10,800 --> 01:30:13,439
Speaker 1: are based in the character and in the text that

1508
01:30:13,479 --> 01:30:17,840
Speaker 1: would make crafting that more sense. Like I don't could

1509
01:30:17,880 --> 01:30:22,360
Speaker 1: have just done an Andy Circus Golemn voice or something.

1510
01:30:23,800 --> 01:30:29,120
Speaker 1: I love Andy Circus, Yeah, okay, Circus hive over here.

1511
01:30:30,600 --> 01:30:32,519
Speaker 1: It feels like he'd be so much fun to like

1512
01:30:32,640 --> 01:30:34,599
Speaker 1: go to a party with and just hang out with

1513
01:30:34,680 --> 01:30:37,000
Speaker 1: him the whole time and talk to no one else

1514
01:30:37,040 --> 01:30:39,240
Speaker 1: at the party. I got to interview him a couple

1515
01:30:39,280 --> 01:30:42,040
Speaker 1: of years ago, and it was I think my favorite

1516
01:30:42,080 --> 01:30:47,240
Speaker 1: interview I've ever done with anyone. Just such a pleasant, smart,

1517
01:30:47,640 --> 01:30:51,240
Speaker 1: thoughtful I could go on. I spent one hour with him,

1518
01:30:51,240 --> 01:30:52,960
Speaker 1: and I just have carried it for like I don't

1519
01:30:52,960 --> 01:30:54,519
Speaker 1: even know how long it was. It could have been

1520
01:30:54,520 --> 01:30:57,280
Speaker 1: like four years ago. But I was just like he

1521
01:30:57,520 --> 01:31:03,400
Speaker 1: was so nice, so my taller than him, exciting. The

1522
01:31:03,479 --> 01:31:05,760
Speaker 1: other things I had to mention were kind of I mean,

1523
01:31:05,840 --> 01:31:10,160
Speaker 1: I wanted to touch on the music, not really for

1524
01:31:10,880 --> 01:31:13,240
Speaker 1: uh intersectional feminism, but just because I think it's really

1525
01:31:13,280 --> 01:31:17,519
Speaker 1: fascinating the use of music and um karama, like you

1526
01:31:17,560 --> 01:31:22,599
Speaker 1: were saying this composer Michael Ables, I have no idea

1527
01:31:22,640 --> 01:31:24,960
Speaker 1: how it's pronounced. I just made a choice and went

1528
01:31:25,040 --> 01:31:28,280
Speaker 1: with it. Sorry, Michael, I don't know how to pronounce

1529
01:31:28,280 --> 01:31:31,840
Speaker 1: his last name Ables or abouts uh. I mean, his

1530
01:31:32,040 --> 01:31:36,479
Speaker 1: composition is incredible. He pulls from just like learning even

1531
01:31:36,520 --> 01:31:41,600
Speaker 1: about the music, he pulls from Tchaikovsky for that ending,

1532
01:31:41,800 --> 01:31:46,200
Speaker 1: he's like blending. I got five on it with Tchaikovsky,

1533
01:31:46,240 --> 01:31:49,120
Speaker 1: and it's like a section of Tchaikovsky from The Nutcracker

1534
01:31:49,479 --> 01:31:52,320
Speaker 1: where Clara is being pulled into a mirror world. So

1535
01:31:52,439 --> 01:31:57,160
Speaker 1: there's like that whole thing. It's so smart and so cool.

1536
01:31:57,400 --> 01:32:01,479
Speaker 1: And I also really liked um that there is a

1537
01:32:01,520 --> 01:32:05,000
Speaker 1: black ballerina like a motif in this movie. You like,

1538
01:32:05,120 --> 01:32:07,519
Speaker 1: that's like such a rare thing you never get to

1539
01:32:07,560 --> 01:32:11,400
Speaker 1: see in movies and especially in professional ballet. That's like

1540
01:32:11,479 --> 01:32:15,280
Speaker 1: a huge discussion that is ongoing in the ballet community.

1541
01:32:15,439 --> 01:32:19,000
Speaker 1: And I just love ballet in general. The dancing in

1542
01:32:19,000 --> 01:32:26,040
Speaker 1: this movie, it's upstairs, downstairs, it's all beautiful. I loved it. Okay,

1543
01:32:26,080 --> 01:32:27,840
Speaker 1: I think that that was That was just a small

1544
01:32:27,920 --> 01:32:31,839
Speaker 1: rant I saved for the end at least. Thank you, Karma.

1545
01:32:31,880 --> 01:32:34,639
Speaker 1: Do you have anything else you wanted to discuss. I

1546
01:32:34,680 --> 01:32:37,880
Speaker 1: wanted to just discuss how I think Jordan Peel does

1547
01:32:37,920 --> 01:32:42,720
Speaker 1: a really great job of integrating visual clues and like

1548
01:32:42,880 --> 01:32:46,800
Speaker 1: just a lot of visual symbols and elevens coming up

1549
01:32:46,840 --> 01:32:50,880
Speaker 1: a lot, Like it's the first scene, the first scene

1550
01:32:50,880 --> 01:32:53,640
Speaker 1: on the boardwalk. Yes, we have the eleven eleven. We

1551
01:32:53,720 --> 01:32:56,360
Speaker 1: have the people playing rock paper scissors who keep doing scissors,

1552
01:32:56,360 --> 01:32:58,160
Speaker 1: which is also like a two. There are a lot

1553
01:32:58,160 --> 01:33:03,720
Speaker 1: of twos and elevens throughout the movie. Yeah, and uh,

1554
01:33:03,840 --> 01:33:07,559
Speaker 1: it's her birthday. She gets number eleven, which is the

1555
01:33:07,600 --> 01:33:10,960
Speaker 1: thriller one, which is sort of about the like real

1556
01:33:11,160 --> 01:33:14,720
Speaker 1: the like good Michael Jackson turning into the bad Michael Jackson. Uh,

1557
01:33:14,720 --> 01:33:17,599
Speaker 1: there's just like a lot that's happening there. When she's

1558
01:33:17,640 --> 01:33:20,240
Speaker 1: watching the news, it's like Channel eleven news. You see

1559
01:33:20,240 --> 01:33:24,679
Speaker 1: the little elevens um, although they say channel seven I think,

1560
01:33:24,800 --> 01:33:27,240
Speaker 1: or they say channel four channel seven instead, but it

1561
01:33:27,240 --> 01:33:29,960
Speaker 1: says eleven on the screen, which was like I was like, huh,

1562
01:33:30,080 --> 01:33:35,599
Speaker 1: somebody missed that or I'm missing something. Um. And just

1563
01:33:35,680 --> 01:33:40,400
Speaker 1: like the ambulance, the ambulance that gets the Jeremiah eleven

1564
01:33:40,439 --> 01:33:44,519
Speaker 1: eleven guy at the beginning of like the current day stuff,

1565
01:33:45,000 --> 01:33:47,519
Speaker 1: it's ambulance number two, which is the same ambulance that

1566
01:33:47,560 --> 01:33:49,760
Speaker 1: they end up getting in and driving away in in

1567
01:33:49,840 --> 01:33:54,560
Speaker 1: the end. Um, there's there's so much just with elevens

1568
01:33:54,600 --> 01:33:58,280
Speaker 1: and twos that happens there. And like I said, the

1569
01:33:58,280 --> 01:34:01,160
Speaker 1: fifteen minutes thing that I mentioned earlier, how that became

1570
01:34:01,160 --> 01:34:04,000
Speaker 1: a mirror of what can happen in fifteen minutes with

1571
01:34:04,120 --> 01:34:06,639
Speaker 1: the disappearance at the beginning and then with the police

1572
01:34:06,640 --> 01:34:10,559
Speaker 1: coming in fifteen minutes. Just I think that it's really

1573
01:34:10,600 --> 01:34:13,040
Speaker 1: cool to see him sneak all that stuff in there,

1574
01:34:13,400 --> 01:34:16,080
Speaker 1: and I just think it's a pretty it's pretty tight,

1575
01:34:16,240 --> 01:34:19,040
Speaker 1: except for like you said, Caitlin, that last like ten

1576
01:34:19,200 --> 01:34:24,760
Speaker 1: fifteen minutes where it's like you explained too much, right right, Yeah,

1577
01:34:25,080 --> 01:34:29,080
Speaker 1: Just like Jordan's do another rewrite of the end. Um

1578
01:34:29,800 --> 01:34:32,559
Speaker 1: they're just going off of because I think we like

1579
01:34:33,120 --> 01:34:35,400
Speaker 1: vaguely referenced it at the very beginning of the episode.

1580
01:34:35,680 --> 01:34:37,840
Speaker 1: But um, something that has been coming up a lot

1581
01:34:37,960 --> 01:34:40,880
Speaker 1: in this year's month of Horror movies is the fact

1582
01:34:40,920 --> 01:34:43,479
Speaker 1: that there is an unhoused person that is dead at

1583
01:34:43,479 --> 01:34:45,599
Speaker 1: the or really injured at the beginning of the movie

1584
01:34:45,720 --> 01:34:49,719
Speaker 1: as like a warning. UM. I think is something that

1585
01:34:49,800 --> 01:34:52,080
Speaker 1: we have been seeing pop up in a lot of

1586
01:34:52,160 --> 01:34:54,519
Speaker 1: horror movies, or at least two out of the four

1587
01:34:54,560 --> 01:34:58,840
Speaker 1: we're covering this month UM feature a story beat where

1588
01:34:59,120 --> 01:35:03,599
Speaker 1: an unhoused person and as UM brutalized or killed as

1589
01:35:04,000 --> 01:35:07,519
Speaker 1: a vague plot point to keep the protagonist story moving.

1590
01:35:07,560 --> 01:35:09,920
Speaker 1: We also saw this in A Girl Walks home alone

1591
01:35:09,920 --> 01:35:15,080
Speaker 1: at night and Uh, just right, better, you don't have

1592
01:35:15,200 --> 01:35:19,639
Speaker 1: to do that. Yeah, I agree. I think. The last

1593
01:35:19,640 --> 01:35:21,680
Speaker 1: thing I wanted to say was that I don't know

1594
01:35:21,680 --> 01:35:26,360
Speaker 1: if anyone noticed ADDIE's dad at the very beginning of

1595
01:35:26,400 --> 01:35:29,160
Speaker 1: the movie playing whack a mole and how bad he

1596
01:35:29,280 --> 01:35:32,160
Speaker 1: was at it. He really sucked. He didn't he wasn't

1597
01:35:32,400 --> 01:35:35,400
Speaker 1: moving the mallet around, he was just hitting the same

1598
01:35:35,479 --> 01:35:38,880
Speaker 1: empty hole over the mole hole over and over again,

1599
01:35:38,880 --> 01:35:41,200
Speaker 1: and nothing was popping out of it. I'm just like sir.

1600
01:35:41,479 --> 01:35:44,559
Speaker 1: He also stopped playing in the middle, where I don't

1601
01:35:44,560 --> 01:35:46,320
Speaker 1: know why I got so, but I was just like,

1602
01:35:46,600 --> 01:35:49,080
Speaker 1: you just gave them two tickets to play, and you're

1603
01:35:49,120 --> 01:35:53,360
Speaker 1: stopping in the middle. You waste You're wasting time. And

1604
01:35:53,400 --> 01:35:56,360
Speaker 1: oh it was too tickets. Like my inner Chucky cheese stand,

1605
01:35:56,840 --> 01:35:59,920
Speaker 1: it was two tickets. Also to play the game, two ticket.

1606
01:36:00,000 --> 01:36:04,519
Speaker 1: It was two tickets a lot of Jordan Peele is

1607
01:36:04,600 --> 01:36:09,080
Speaker 1: a terrific writer. I love get Out. I wish the

1608
01:36:09,439 --> 01:36:12,120
Speaker 1: ending of US was as solid as the ending of

1609
01:36:12,680 --> 01:36:17,960
Speaker 1: get Out, but most again, most of the much discussion. Yes,

1610
01:36:18,160 --> 01:36:21,240
Speaker 1: for sure, I just yeah, I can't wait to see

1611
01:36:21,960 --> 01:36:25,200
Speaker 1: more of his work. I also, I feel like US

1612
01:36:25,400 --> 01:36:28,840
Speaker 1: has more rewatch value than get Out. I feel like

1613
01:36:29,120 --> 01:36:32,639
Speaker 1: because there's so much that you notice different times. In

1614
01:36:32,680 --> 01:36:35,120
Speaker 1: a way, I feel like get Out is almost because

1615
01:36:35,200 --> 01:36:38,920
Speaker 1: it's so tight, you're like, oh, I see everything, it's there, Yep, yep, good, okay,

1616
01:36:39,120 --> 01:36:42,000
Speaker 1: got it, And with US it's sort of like, oh,

1617
01:36:42,040 --> 01:36:44,640
Speaker 1: there's so much that I don't understand, and maybe if

1618
01:36:44,680 --> 01:36:46,760
Speaker 1: I watch it again, i'll understand it a little bit

1619
01:36:46,760 --> 01:36:48,880
Speaker 1: more like I feel like there's a secret message and

1620
01:36:48,880 --> 01:36:50,519
Speaker 1: I don't quite have it yet, but if I watch

1621
01:36:50,520 --> 01:36:54,000
Speaker 1: it eighteen times, maybe i'll get it right. Yeah, it's fun,

1622
01:36:54,160 --> 01:36:56,160
Speaker 1: it's cool. It's weird because it's like it's the same

1623
01:36:56,240 --> 01:36:59,920
Speaker 1: genre as his first movie, but it's like completely different,

1624
01:37:00,160 --> 01:37:04,760
Speaker 1: Like it's yeah, you love to see range, Yes, you

1625
01:37:04,840 --> 01:37:08,400
Speaker 1: love to see the range. Uh does this movie pass

1626
01:37:08,439 --> 01:37:11,160
Speaker 1: the Bechdel test? We already said yes it does. Between

1627
01:37:11,720 --> 01:37:19,080
Speaker 1: um Addie and her daughter Zora between well, my question

1628
01:37:19,120 --> 01:37:22,719
Speaker 1: about that with Red? They never say Red's name on camera,

1629
01:37:22,920 --> 01:37:25,280
Speaker 1: So does she count as a named character if they

1630
01:37:25,320 --> 01:37:29,000
Speaker 1: don't say the character's name? That's my question. Well, my

1631
01:37:29,080 --> 01:37:31,400
Speaker 1: take on that is always like, even if the character

1632
01:37:31,600 --> 01:37:35,800
Speaker 1: isn't given a name, are they narratively significant enough that

1633
01:37:35,880 --> 01:37:38,880
Speaker 1: they matter to the story because the name the naming

1634
01:37:39,040 --> 01:37:42,080
Speaker 1: caveats always like, oh, are they like a barista who

1635
01:37:42,240 --> 01:37:45,160
Speaker 1: who you see for five seconds in the movie? Uh,

1636
01:37:45,200 --> 01:37:47,479
Speaker 1: and they don't have a name because they are not

1637
01:37:47,560 --> 01:37:51,000
Speaker 1: an important character? I think it's yeah, So I yeah,

1638
01:37:51,000 --> 01:37:54,160
Speaker 1: I count any interactions between Addie and Red as passing.

1639
01:37:55,040 --> 01:37:57,840
Speaker 1: And as far as our nipple scale goes, the zero

1640
01:37:57,880 --> 01:38:01,240
Speaker 1: to five nipples based on its based on an examination

1641
01:38:01,280 --> 01:38:06,240
Speaker 1: of intersectional feminism. UM. For this one, I think I

1642
01:38:06,280 --> 01:38:09,559
Speaker 1: would go like a three and a half. I do

1643
01:38:10,040 --> 01:38:17,439
Speaker 1: appreciate its exploration of class, uh and privilege and kind

1644
01:38:17,479 --> 01:38:21,840
Speaker 1: of the the what is the word that I'm trying

1645
01:38:21,880 --> 01:38:25,400
Speaker 1: to think of, the fallacy? I think of the American

1646
01:38:25,520 --> 01:38:28,080
Speaker 1: dream and and things like that as sort of like

1647
01:38:28,200 --> 01:38:32,520
Speaker 1: an allegorical presence in the story. I do really appreciate

1648
01:38:32,600 --> 01:38:39,800
Speaker 1: the way that Adelaide's character is the protagonist and the

1649
01:38:39,840 --> 01:38:45,920
Speaker 1: most active character. Uh. We see her do things uh

1650
01:38:45,960 --> 01:38:52,240
Speaker 1: that are my brain is also putting. UM. I also

1651
01:38:52,320 --> 01:38:55,160
Speaker 1: love how active Red is. I mean, both of Lapida's

1652
01:38:55,240 --> 01:38:59,000
Speaker 1: characters are like the people in charge of their respective situations,

1653
01:38:59,200 --> 01:39:02,120
Speaker 1: which makes sense because they're tethered together, you know, they

1654
01:39:02,160 --> 01:39:05,880
Speaker 1: share the same soul. But they are the ones who

1655
01:39:06,040 --> 01:39:09,559
Speaker 1: are making the most active choices. They're the ones who

1656
01:39:09,560 --> 01:39:12,719
Speaker 1: are calling the shots in whatever it is they're trying

1657
01:39:12,760 --> 01:39:17,760
Speaker 1: to do. Zora also we see doing a lot of fighting.

1658
01:39:18,040 --> 01:39:21,920
Speaker 1: She attacks three different characters there. There's at one point

1659
01:39:21,960 --> 01:39:23,920
Speaker 1: they're talk about like their kill counts, and they're almost

1660
01:39:23,920 --> 01:39:26,040
Speaker 1: like kind of being like, well, I get to drive

1661
01:39:26,040 --> 01:39:30,880
Speaker 1: because I've killed the most people and she kills two, uh,

1662
01:39:30,920 --> 01:39:33,519
Speaker 1: and then she thought she killed three, but then yeah,

1663
01:39:33,720 --> 01:39:35,760
Speaker 1: she thought she had three, but she actually had too.

1664
01:39:35,920 --> 01:39:38,479
Speaker 1: That seems really funny. Yeah. I like that you see

1665
01:39:38,560 --> 01:39:42,519
Speaker 1: female characters in a horror movie, like knowing the danger

1666
01:39:42,520 --> 01:39:48,360
Speaker 1: they're in, immediately responding appropriately to that, making active choices,

1667
01:39:49,080 --> 01:39:52,160
Speaker 1: doing fighting that feels appropriate to what they would be

1668
01:39:52,240 --> 01:39:56,280
Speaker 1: capable of doing. Um. Nothing felt like how did how

1669
01:39:56,320 --> 01:40:00,360
Speaker 1: does she suddenly like a martial arts master with this

1670
01:40:01,040 --> 01:40:03,680
Speaker 1: uh fire poker? Like, we don't say anything like the

1671
01:40:03,760 --> 01:40:08,280
Speaker 1: Mary sus stuff. It's all it's all pretty grounded. So yeah,

1672
01:40:08,439 --> 01:40:13,400
Speaker 1: I I just wish the ending was a little bit different. Um.

1673
01:40:13,479 --> 01:40:15,160
Speaker 1: But other than that, I do really enjoy this movie.

1674
01:40:15,600 --> 01:40:19,840
Speaker 1: I'd give it three and a half nipples. I will

1675
01:40:19,880 --> 01:40:25,519
Speaker 1: give two of them to Lapita on the condition that

1676
01:40:25,640 --> 01:40:30,280
Speaker 1: she learns from her mistake of demonizing a characteristic of

1677
01:40:30,280 --> 01:40:35,719
Speaker 1: a disability. Uh. And I'll give one to the actor

1678
01:40:35,760 --> 01:40:41,280
Speaker 1: who played Zora, whose name is Hattie write Joseph, I think,

1679
01:40:41,880 --> 01:40:45,960
Speaker 1: yes exactly. And I'll give my remaining half nipple to

1680
01:40:46,560 --> 01:40:51,639
Speaker 1: the actor who played young Red slash Addie and her

1681
01:40:52,120 --> 01:40:55,960
Speaker 1: name I also wrote it down is Madison Curry. So

1682
01:40:56,560 --> 01:41:02,120
Speaker 1: those are my distributions. I think I'm gonna go for

1683
01:41:02,520 --> 01:41:07,559
Speaker 1: on this movie. Um, I yeah, I mean there's there's

1684
01:41:07,600 --> 01:41:10,120
Speaker 1: definitely some small things and a lot of it were

1685
01:41:10,400 --> 01:41:12,519
Speaker 1: had a little more to do with the production than

1686
01:41:12,520 --> 01:41:17,840
Speaker 1: the movie itself. But I mean Lupida marginalizing disabled people

1687
01:41:17,840 --> 01:41:22,400
Speaker 1: in that way, that's, uh, you gotta docket. Um and there.

1688
01:41:22,479 --> 01:41:24,599
Speaker 1: I mean we discussed a few things, but I think

1689
01:41:24,640 --> 01:41:27,439
Speaker 1: by and large, I mean, this movie does so many

1690
01:41:27,520 --> 01:41:31,760
Speaker 1: things that your average horror movie isn't doing in terms

1691
01:41:31,840 --> 01:41:36,200
Speaker 1: of like, you could not have a more complicated dual

1692
01:41:36,560 --> 01:41:41,200
Speaker 1: shared soul character than Red and Adelaide. There's so much

1693
01:41:41,280 --> 01:41:45,760
Speaker 1: being examined just within these two characters and how they

1694
01:41:45,800 --> 01:41:51,040
Speaker 1: interact with each other. Like it's, uh, it's slightly confusing

1695
01:41:51,120 --> 01:41:54,599
Speaker 1: at the end, but it's still it's I mean, show me,

1696
01:41:54,800 --> 01:41:59,720
Speaker 1: show me more layers. I don't think it's possible. I

1697
01:41:58,800 --> 01:42:02,920
Speaker 1: I I don't know. I like how I guess kind

1698
01:42:02,920 --> 01:42:06,040
Speaker 1: of like the reflection of a lot of family dynamics,

1699
01:42:06,120 --> 01:42:09,360
Speaker 1: of like Adelaide is very much in charge of her family,

1700
01:42:09,479 --> 01:42:12,720
Speaker 1: but has I mean, even the reflections on masculinity that

1701
01:42:12,800 --> 01:42:16,639
Speaker 1: this movie has I thought were pretty effective. Of Um,

1702
01:42:16,840 --> 01:42:19,439
Speaker 1: you know, you understand why Gabe is kind of in

1703
01:42:19,520 --> 01:42:22,920
Speaker 1: this standoff with Tim Hidecker whose name I never remember,

1704
01:42:23,600 --> 01:42:29,680
Speaker 1: uh Josh, but it is an impediment to the family ultimately.

1705
01:42:30,160 --> 01:42:34,599
Speaker 1: And I like the showing of masculinity in um Jason,

1706
01:42:34,680 --> 01:42:39,519
Speaker 1: whereby being more sensitive and more receptive to things, he

1707
01:42:39,560 --> 01:42:44,360
Speaker 1: sees things that other characters just don't. Uh. Zora is

1708
01:42:44,400 --> 01:42:47,440
Speaker 1: super active, I choose like one of the funniest characters,

1709
01:42:48,160 --> 01:42:50,759
Speaker 1: very able to call her dad out on his book

1710
01:42:50,920 --> 01:42:54,439
Speaker 1: bullshit and like, I don't know, I just like that

1711
01:42:54,760 --> 01:42:58,480
Speaker 1: and and I and I enjoyed most of the commentary

1712
01:42:58,560 --> 01:43:02,759
Speaker 1: being made with Pittie Tyler as well. I didn't really

1713
01:43:03,439 --> 01:43:07,280
Speaker 1: I was touch and go on the face the girl

1714
01:43:07,400 --> 01:43:10,040
Speaker 1: Joker moment wasn't my favorite thing in the world, but

1715
01:43:10,680 --> 01:43:15,040
Speaker 1: I I think, I mean, for especially for a movie

1716
01:43:15,080 --> 01:43:18,840
Speaker 1: that's written and directed by a man, that it's largely

1717
01:43:19,080 --> 01:43:22,599
Speaker 1: I mean, the portrayal of femininity and masculinity I thought

1718
01:43:22,680 --> 01:43:26,080
Speaker 1: was really effective and cool and used to examine a

1719
01:43:26,160 --> 01:43:29,960
Speaker 1: larger thing of pretty effectively. So I'm gonna go four.

1720
01:43:30,600 --> 01:43:35,960
Speaker 1: I'll give one to Adelaide, one to Red, one to Zorah,

1721
01:43:36,880 --> 01:43:41,559
Speaker 1: and then half of one to Kitty, and then the

1722
01:43:41,640 --> 01:43:44,160
Speaker 1: last half the little adelaide sorry for cutting a nipple

1723
01:43:44,160 --> 01:43:48,719
Speaker 1: and half, so it must be done. I am going

1724
01:43:48,800 --> 01:43:52,400
Speaker 1: to like two to others standing together, give four nipples,

1725
01:43:53,120 --> 01:43:58,000
Speaker 1: um two and two. They two twos everywhere nipple nipple

1726
01:43:58,040 --> 01:44:01,719
Speaker 1: nipple npples. Also eleven eleven is one one, which adds

1727
01:44:01,800 --> 01:44:05,320
Speaker 1: up to four. Yep, the number of nipples I'm giving.

1728
01:44:06,720 --> 01:44:11,320
Speaker 1: I like the commentary and how there's an acknowledgement of

1729
01:44:11,360 --> 01:44:13,679
Speaker 1: the fact that we are all living on stolen land

1730
01:44:14,280 --> 01:44:16,519
Speaker 1: and how that is going to bite us in the

1731
01:44:16,560 --> 01:44:20,920
Speaker 1: butt if we do not acknowledge it. And UH should

1732
01:44:20,920 --> 01:44:23,960
Speaker 1: be acknowledged because of the way that people are treating

1733
01:44:24,000 --> 01:44:28,920
Speaker 1: each other. And I would like to see less of

1734
01:44:28,960 --> 01:44:34,519
Speaker 1: the issues with the unhoused people and the the issue

1735
01:44:34,640 --> 01:44:40,280
Speaker 1: with the demonization of this disability. So that's automatically a

1736
01:44:40,400 --> 01:44:44,280
Speaker 1: nipple off in terms of not hitting the five nipples.

1737
01:44:44,320 --> 01:44:48,200
Speaker 1: But I will give a nipple to the shared nipple

1738
01:44:48,320 --> 01:44:53,040
Speaker 1: between the lupidas UH. Two nipples for Shahari, right, Joseph,

1739
01:44:53,240 --> 01:44:56,000
Speaker 1: because I honestly, every time I watch it, I have

1740
01:44:56,040 --> 01:44:58,400
Speaker 1: to remind myself that she is one person playing two

1741
01:44:58,479 --> 01:45:01,280
Speaker 1: characters and not two different actors. I feel like she

1742
01:45:01,400 --> 01:45:05,320
Speaker 1: and her were the most different for me. So she

1743
01:45:05,439 --> 01:45:07,960
Speaker 1: gets two nipples and then I'm going to give the

1744
01:45:08,040 --> 01:45:12,479
Speaker 1: last nipple to uh to Jason for the line kiss

1745
01:45:12,520 --> 01:45:18,360
Speaker 1: my anus, which is beautiful line or like, where did

1746
01:45:18,400 --> 01:45:22,519
Speaker 1: you even learn that word? He doesn't want to get

1747
01:45:22,520 --> 01:45:25,760
Speaker 1: in trouble for swearing, so he goes to the anatomically

1748
01:45:25,800 --> 01:45:33,720
Speaker 1: correct terms and I love it. So those are my

1749
01:45:33,760 --> 01:45:39,160
Speaker 1: four nipples. Um. Great exploration of privileged disparities, uh, and

1750
01:45:39,920 --> 01:45:44,520
Speaker 1: not great exploration of privilege disparities between people with disabilities

1751
01:45:44,720 --> 01:45:48,559
Speaker 1: and able bodied people. But you know, overall, good stuff,

1752
01:45:48,600 --> 01:45:53,840
Speaker 1: good story, good characters, fun time. Thank you for being here, Gramos,

1753
01:45:54,479 --> 01:45:58,639
Speaker 1: thank you for having me. Yes, I'm so glad. Tell

1754
01:45:58,760 --> 01:46:04,280
Speaker 1: us Swear Bowl can check out your stuff online. You

1755
01:46:04,320 --> 01:46:07,360
Speaker 1: can check me out at Karama Drama k O r

1756
01:46:07,479 --> 01:46:10,160
Speaker 1: A m A d r A m A it rhymes

1757
01:46:10,240 --> 01:46:13,760
Speaker 1: for your pleasure. And I'm on Twitter and Instagram that

1758
01:46:13,840 --> 01:46:16,719
Speaker 1: I do not frequently post on Instagram because it makes

1759
01:46:16,760 --> 01:46:20,519
Speaker 1: me sad, but Twitter is great. Follow me on Twitter.

1760
01:46:20,600 --> 01:46:23,799
Speaker 1: I make jokes about Batman stick. It's fun. Oh yes, good,

1761
01:46:24,080 --> 01:46:30,519
Speaker 1: hell yeah yeah uh. You can follow us as well

1762
01:46:30,600 --> 01:46:35,440
Speaker 1: on Twitter and Instagram. At becktel Cast you can subscribe

1763
01:46:35,439 --> 01:46:38,559
Speaker 1: to our Patreon aka Matreon. It's five dollars a month.

1764
01:46:38,720 --> 01:46:45,880
Speaker 1: It is UH to to wow to bonus episodes every month,

1765
01:46:46,640 --> 01:46:50,640
Speaker 1: including access to the entire back catalog. You can do.

1766
01:46:50,680 --> 01:46:53,000
Speaker 1: You can get our merge at public dot com slash

1767
01:46:53,120 --> 01:46:57,400
Speaker 1: the back del cast UH and we also have a

1768
01:46:57,520 --> 01:47:00,599
Speaker 1: face masks there. So if you're looking for a fun

1769
01:47:00,720 --> 01:47:05,400
Speaker 1: and fashionable way to UH live in the scariest timeline,

1770
01:47:05,840 --> 01:47:11,040
Speaker 1: that's a way to do it. Yes, indeed, and now

1771
01:47:11,320 --> 01:47:17,040
Speaker 1: we go, we scuttle back underground and stay tethered. I

1772
01:47:17,080 --> 01:47:22,000
Speaker 1: don't know my brain, it's tired. Fine,