1
00:00:01,120 --> 00:00:03,400
Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff you should know, a production of My

2
00:00:03,600 --> 00:00:12,480
Speaker 1: Heart Radios How Stuff Works. Hey, and welcome to the podcast.

3
00:00:12,520 --> 00:00:15,120
Speaker 1: I'm Josh Clark, and there's Charles w Chuck Bryant, there's

4
00:00:15,200 --> 00:00:19,880
Speaker 1: Jerry over there. Um, and it's just nice and pleasant,

5
00:00:20,400 --> 00:00:25,239
Speaker 1: isn't it? Chuck and Jerry? I mean it smells in here?

6
00:00:25,280 --> 00:00:29,040
Speaker 1: Is that what you're referencing? Yeah, gamey, I think, Yeah,

7
00:00:29,320 --> 00:00:31,520
Speaker 1: how about this. We won't say who was in here

8
00:00:32,720 --> 00:00:37,040
Speaker 1: just before us, but it was three men from our office.

9
00:00:37,159 --> 00:00:40,800
Speaker 1: And the room smells a little gamy, a little musky.

10
00:00:42,320 --> 00:00:45,560
Speaker 1: It's warm, and Jerry's headphones are hot, and her chair's

11
00:00:45,600 --> 00:00:51,480
Speaker 1: lot and she's so creeped out, yeah, getting a little sweaty. Yeah. So, um,

12
00:00:51,479 --> 00:00:53,599
Speaker 1: that's the last joke I'm gonna tell for this episode.

13
00:00:53,640 --> 00:00:55,400
Speaker 1: By the way. You know, every time we say that,

14
00:00:55,440 --> 00:00:58,560
Speaker 1: we end up like making jokes. So yeah, let's say it. Yes,

15
00:00:58,640 --> 00:01:00,440
Speaker 1: this is going to be a very serious episode and

16
00:01:00,480 --> 00:01:03,120
Speaker 1: there will be no jokes whatsoever. All right, hopefully we

17
00:01:03,160 --> 00:01:06,560
Speaker 1: can work in a funnier two that is clearly not

18
00:01:06,640 --> 00:01:09,760
Speaker 1: at anyone's expense. Yeah, yeah, I mean, it's gotta be organic,

19
00:01:09,920 --> 00:01:13,440
Speaker 1: it's gotta be good, it's gotta be worth it, I guess,

20
00:01:13,480 --> 00:01:18,319
Speaker 1: is what I'm trying to say, and about each other. Right. So, um,

21
00:01:18,760 --> 00:01:23,800
Speaker 1: we're talking today, Chuck about anorexia and bulimia, known in

22
00:01:23,920 --> 00:01:26,959
Speaker 1: the slang as anna and mia. Did you know that?

23
00:01:27,080 --> 00:01:31,000
Speaker 1: I did not know that. Yeah, And um, they are

24
00:01:31,080 --> 00:01:35,240
Speaker 1: actually very closely related eating disorders, so much so that

25
00:01:35,400 --> 00:01:37,919
Speaker 1: if you went to the big Book of Eating disorders,

26
00:01:37,959 --> 00:01:41,760
Speaker 1: the d s M five, and you said, ds M five,

27
00:01:41,920 --> 00:01:45,240
Speaker 1: tell me what is the difference between anna and mia,

28
00:01:46,440 --> 00:01:48,680
Speaker 1: the d s M five would just kind of shrug me, like,

29
00:01:48,680 --> 00:01:51,440
Speaker 1: I don't know, man, we we are, We're not a sure.

30
00:01:51,560 --> 00:01:55,240
Speaker 1: There are some big differences, but they are clearly connected

31
00:01:55,320 --> 00:01:58,960
Speaker 1: to some underlying degree. Yeah, I mean you know they

32
00:01:59,040 --> 00:02:07,000
Speaker 1: define anorexia as restrictive restrictive as in really restrictive, severely

33
00:02:07,080 --> 00:02:11,560
Speaker 1: limited intake of food. Um, and binging and purging, which

34
00:02:11,639 --> 00:02:13,400
Speaker 1: is if you don't know what that term is, that

35
00:02:13,480 --> 00:02:18,600
Speaker 1: means eating and then vomiting afterward, are using laxatives to

36
00:02:18,680 --> 00:02:22,840
Speaker 1: get that poop going really quickly. Uh. That is also

37
00:02:23,080 --> 00:02:26,640
Speaker 1: under anorexia in the d s M five. But that's

38
00:02:26,680 --> 00:02:30,600
Speaker 1: also binging and purging obviously characteristic of bolimia, which is

39
00:02:30,880 --> 00:02:35,240
Speaker 1: has its own categorytion, so categorization. So it's a little um,

40
00:02:35,280 --> 00:02:38,120
Speaker 1: I guess confusing is the best way to say it, right, right,

41
00:02:38,160 --> 00:02:39,919
Speaker 1: So I looked into a little more and it looks

42
00:02:39,960 --> 00:02:43,360
Speaker 1: like anorexia. Like you were saying, is is the hallmark

43
00:02:43,400 --> 00:02:46,440
Speaker 1: of it is calorie restriction. But apparently some people who

44
00:02:46,440 --> 00:02:49,160
Speaker 1: suffer from anorexia every once in a while binge and purge,

45
00:02:49,240 --> 00:02:52,680
Speaker 1: so it can include that. Okay, yes, but bolimia doesn't

46
00:02:52,720 --> 00:02:58,600
Speaker 1: necessarily involve any sort of even like weight component um,

47
00:02:58,960 --> 00:03:01,960
Speaker 1: and it doesn't ut any kind of calorie restriction. It

48
00:03:02,040 --> 00:03:05,800
Speaker 1: is strictly binging and purging. So you've got these two

49
00:03:05,800 --> 00:03:08,400
Speaker 1: different things, but they're both related in that your relationship

50
00:03:08,400 --> 00:03:10,520
Speaker 1: with food is just not healthy in any way, shape

51
00:03:10,600 --> 00:03:14,440
Speaker 1: or form. And the other thing that really kind of

52
00:03:14,480 --> 00:03:17,600
Speaker 1: ties the two things together is that they're based on

53
00:03:17,639 --> 00:03:21,320
Speaker 1: a disturbed body image where you look in the mirror

54
00:03:21,560 --> 00:03:25,280
Speaker 1: and what you see doesn't reflect reality at all. You

55
00:03:25,360 --> 00:03:27,760
Speaker 1: might see yourself as maybe normal if it's on a

56
00:03:27,760 --> 00:03:30,560
Speaker 1: good day, you probably more often than not see yourself

57
00:03:30,560 --> 00:03:34,600
Speaker 1: as overweight, fat, gross, disgusting, any number of horrible things

58
00:03:34,639 --> 00:03:37,440
Speaker 1: you can say about yourself, where if someone else is

59
00:03:37,480 --> 00:03:39,720
Speaker 1: looking at you, they would be like, Wow, this person

60
00:03:39,800 --> 00:03:42,880
Speaker 1: really needs to eat fast because they're emaciated their skin

61
00:03:42,960 --> 00:03:46,160
Speaker 1: and bones. But the aner and arexia patient or believe me,

62
00:03:46,200 --> 00:03:48,560
Speaker 1: a patient does not see that at all. And so

63
00:03:48,640 --> 00:03:51,840
Speaker 1: that kind of continues the cycle of either calorie restriction

64
00:03:52,240 --> 00:03:55,040
Speaker 1: or binging and purging. But they're they're both after the

65
00:03:55,080 --> 00:03:58,360
Speaker 1: same goal essentially, right and included. And we're going to

66
00:03:58,440 --> 00:04:01,560
Speaker 1: talk a lot about the symptoms and behaviors of people

67
00:04:01,600 --> 00:04:04,720
Speaker 1: that suffer from both of these. But a lot of

68
00:04:05,200 --> 00:04:09,520
Speaker 1: scale work. Weighing yourself a lot sometimes, you know, multiple

69
00:04:09,560 --> 00:04:13,320
Speaker 1: times during a day, obsessing over like you know, half

70
00:04:13,320 --> 00:04:17,280
Speaker 1: pounds I saw, like we're digital scales are really sort

71
00:04:17,279 --> 00:04:20,479
Speaker 1: of a culprit, and you know, obsessing over like a

72
00:04:20,520 --> 00:04:24,240
Speaker 1: tenth of a pound and eighth of a pound, um,

73
00:04:24,279 --> 00:04:28,640
Speaker 1: being really upset over the gaining of any weight, even

74
00:04:28,680 --> 00:04:31,120
Speaker 1: if it's just a half a pound, let's say. Uh.

75
00:04:31,200 --> 00:04:34,080
Speaker 1: And like you said, the language around food and body

76
00:04:34,120 --> 00:04:38,240
Speaker 1: and self image is really important, um, because this can

77
00:04:38,320 --> 00:04:41,760
Speaker 1: often be one of the early indicators or just an

78
00:04:41,800 --> 00:04:44,520
Speaker 1: indicator for friends and family if you listen to how

79
00:04:44,560 --> 00:04:46,880
Speaker 1: people talk, because a lot, you know, most of the

80
00:04:46,920 --> 00:04:50,000
Speaker 1: stuff is done behind closed doors, and one of the

81
00:04:50,560 --> 00:04:54,200
Speaker 1: big components, one of the sad components is is staying

82
00:04:54,200 --> 00:04:56,320
Speaker 1: in a lot and not eating out with people and

83
00:04:56,640 --> 00:04:58,839
Speaker 1: keeping all that very private. So the words are really

84
00:04:58,880 --> 00:05:01,440
Speaker 1: really important here, Yeah, because I mean, if you have

85
00:05:01,480 --> 00:05:05,919
Speaker 1: anorexia and you're engaging in like severe calorie restriction, you

86
00:05:05,960 --> 00:05:08,240
Speaker 1: know that doesn't just stop when you go out with friends.

87
00:05:08,279 --> 00:05:11,600
Speaker 1: It's like it is a part of you. I've seen

88
00:05:11,640 --> 00:05:15,479
Speaker 1: a uh described akin to a relationship, like a very

89
00:05:15,560 --> 00:05:20,440
Speaker 1: intense obsessive relationship where the patient and this disorder are

90
00:05:20,480 --> 00:05:23,960
Speaker 1: super tight. It's like their life, right. So if you're

91
00:05:23,960 --> 00:05:25,800
Speaker 1: out and you're hanging out with friends and trying to

92
00:05:25,839 --> 00:05:28,120
Speaker 1: appear normal, there's all sorts of stuff you have to

93
00:05:28,200 --> 00:05:30,920
Speaker 1: do to make it look like you've eaten, hiding food,

94
00:05:30,960 --> 00:05:34,279
Speaker 1: offering other people food, um, trying to make a big

95
00:05:34,320 --> 00:05:36,400
Speaker 1: deal about you know what you did eat, like really

96
00:05:36,400 --> 00:05:39,960
Speaker 1: showing everybody look I ate this. Um. Just just engaging

97
00:05:39,960 --> 00:05:44,000
Speaker 1: in kind of some obvious and bizarre behavior, and that's exhausting.

98
00:05:44,120 --> 00:05:46,200
Speaker 1: So it's kind of like what you said that ultimately

99
00:05:46,279 --> 00:05:49,720
Speaker 1: results in the person just withdrawing from social activities because

100
00:05:49,720 --> 00:05:52,840
Speaker 1: it's not worth like keeping up appearances. Yeah, and as

101
00:05:52,839 --> 00:05:57,200
Speaker 1: far as beliemia goes uh you know, intentionally vomiting after

102
00:05:57,240 --> 00:06:00,080
Speaker 1: a meal. Um. One of the hallmarks is excuse in

103
00:06:00,080 --> 00:06:03,120
Speaker 1: yourself very quickly after a meal. And that's if you

104
00:06:03,279 --> 00:06:05,800
Speaker 1: are over the social component you are actually eating out

105
00:06:05,800 --> 00:06:09,680
Speaker 1: with friends or family. Uh. And then those laxatives taking

106
00:06:10,040 --> 00:06:14,520
Speaker 1: you know, unhealthy doses of laxatives, laxatives to induce diarrhea

107
00:06:14,560 --> 00:06:18,920
Speaker 1: as quickly as possible, um, and some other stuff you know, uh,

108
00:06:19,080 --> 00:06:22,839
Speaker 1: trying to sweat off additional weight. Um. You know, wearing

109
00:06:22,920 --> 00:06:26,200
Speaker 1: like a plastic suit and sitting in a sauna, like

110
00:06:26,279 --> 00:06:31,039
Speaker 1: really extreme measures or just excessive exercise to try and

111
00:06:31,080 --> 00:06:35,000
Speaker 1: get rid of the extra weight. Right. So, so what

112
00:06:35,080 --> 00:06:38,599
Speaker 1: you have then is somebody who is convinced that they're overweight,

113
00:06:39,200 --> 00:06:42,160
Speaker 1: first of all, even when they're not, and secondly, is

114
00:06:42,200 --> 00:06:46,720
Speaker 1: obsessed with the idea of getting rid of that additional weight. Um.

115
00:06:46,760 --> 00:06:49,719
Speaker 1: And they do it by engaging in unhealthy behaviors with food.

116
00:06:49,760 --> 00:06:51,640
Speaker 1: And depending on how they do it, you've got anorexia

117
00:06:51,760 --> 00:06:55,719
Speaker 1: or you have bulimia. And UM. There's some symptoms, some

118
00:06:55,839 --> 00:06:57,960
Speaker 1: of which we kind of just went over, but some

119
00:06:58,040 --> 00:07:02,360
Speaker 1: are are kind of obvious. UM. Some are red flags. UM.

120
00:07:02,520 --> 00:07:05,240
Speaker 1: You know, like if somebody starts to become very thin

121
00:07:05,839 --> 00:07:08,920
Speaker 1: to where you can see their bones. Um, that's a

122
00:07:08,960 --> 00:07:13,360
Speaker 1: big sign that they have anorexia, but they you know,

123
00:07:13,560 --> 00:07:18,760
Speaker 1: you can have anorexia and not ever necessarily become emaciated. UM.

124
00:07:19,480 --> 00:07:22,320
Speaker 1: I think the diagnosis, as far as the American Psychological

125
00:07:22,360 --> 00:07:25,880
Speaker 1: Association is concerned, is if you if a patient comes

126
00:07:25,920 --> 00:07:28,720
Speaker 1: to you and they weigh fifteen percent less than their

127
00:07:28,760 --> 00:07:32,280
Speaker 1: normal weight for their heightened age, you would be able

128
00:07:32,360 --> 00:07:34,520
Speaker 1: to diagnose them with anorexia, or at the very least

129
00:07:34,520 --> 00:07:36,920
Speaker 1: you should start asking them questions about whether or not

130
00:07:36,960 --> 00:07:40,960
Speaker 1: they have anorexia. Yeah, and blieve me, is very complex too,

131
00:07:41,320 --> 00:07:44,920
Speaker 1: because there's not one pattern. It's not it's not always

132
00:07:44,960 --> 00:07:47,640
Speaker 1: just binge and purge every day, although it can mean

133
00:07:47,680 --> 00:07:52,040
Speaker 1: that sometimes if you suffer from bolimia, you will eat um.

134
00:07:52,200 --> 00:07:54,560
Speaker 1: You won't bench, You'll just eat normal meals and then

135
00:07:54,600 --> 00:08:00,240
Speaker 1: purge those. Uh. Sometimes you will restrict eating um, just

136
00:08:00,400 --> 00:08:03,200
Speaker 1: sort of as a rule. But then occasionally you will

137
00:08:03,240 --> 00:08:06,080
Speaker 1: binge and then purge, like eat you know, a huge

138
00:08:06,200 --> 00:08:09,680
Speaker 1: enormous meal, which you know bene eating is a is

139
00:08:09,720 --> 00:08:13,320
Speaker 1: a whole different eating disorder that you know. All of

140
00:08:13,360 --> 00:08:16,240
Speaker 1: these are sort of related and have some overlap, but

141
00:08:16,800 --> 00:08:19,800
Speaker 1: I think for this uh, this show, we're just gonna

142
00:08:19,920 --> 00:08:24,920
Speaker 1: kind of concentrate on anorexia and bolimia, right yeah, yeah,

143
00:08:24,960 --> 00:08:28,000
Speaker 1: benj any disorder. I think it deserves its own thing

144
00:08:28,040 --> 00:08:30,840
Speaker 1: because it's so prevalent and so many people have it

145
00:08:30,880 --> 00:08:34,320
Speaker 1: and don't even realize it, which I suspect has to

146
00:08:34,360 --> 00:08:38,240
Speaker 1: do with the food supply. I think we've been inadvertently,

147
00:08:38,679 --> 00:08:43,120
Speaker 1: um addicted to food. Um have you I told you

148
00:08:43,160 --> 00:08:46,640
Speaker 1: about that that book, The Dorrito Effect, right, yeah, yeah, Well,

149
00:08:46,679 --> 00:08:48,400
Speaker 1: like in the premise of it is that, like, to

150
00:08:48,559 --> 00:08:51,800
Speaker 1: feed this many people, we've had to basically create frankin

151
00:08:51,920 --> 00:08:54,559
Speaker 1: foods and to make them taste good, we've had to

152
00:08:54,679 --> 00:08:58,599
Speaker 1: use these different additives and artificial flavors and colors and

153
00:08:58,640 --> 00:09:01,920
Speaker 1: all this stuff. And the kind of idea behind it

154
00:09:01,960 --> 00:09:05,920
Speaker 1: is that in doing this, we've accidentally created these things

155
00:09:05,920 --> 00:09:09,160
Speaker 1: that are super addictive, and people have become addicted to

156
00:09:09,200 --> 00:09:11,800
Speaker 1: foodis is a very common thing. Whether it was intentional

157
00:09:11,880 --> 00:09:15,000
Speaker 1: or unintentional. At this point, it doesn't really matter. People

158
00:09:15,040 --> 00:09:18,680
Speaker 1: are just addicted to terrible food that's really bad for them. Yeah.

159
00:09:19,400 --> 00:09:21,800
Speaker 1: So as far as the symptoms go, you know, if

160
00:09:21,840 --> 00:09:24,440
Speaker 1: we talked about some of them. Uh, you know, the

161
00:09:24,480 --> 00:09:26,720
Speaker 1: obvious ones that you could as a friend or family

162
00:09:26,720 --> 00:09:30,120
Speaker 1: member maybe notice, as far as the exercise, not eating

163
00:09:30,120 --> 00:09:33,320
Speaker 1: in public and stuff like that, the preoccupation with weight.

164
00:09:33,960 --> 00:09:37,960
Speaker 1: But um physically, you know, you you can lead the

165
00:09:37,960 --> 00:09:44,000
Speaker 1: things like brittle hair, um, difficulty thinking, fainting and passing out. Uh.

166
00:09:44,040 --> 00:09:47,960
Speaker 1: And that's you know, stuff that people might notice in public. Uh.

167
00:09:48,160 --> 00:09:52,839
Speaker 1: Something that they may not see on the inside is anemia, uh,

168
00:09:53,120 --> 00:09:58,480
Speaker 1: chronic fatigue, constipation, um, slowed pulse. Uh. And then I

169
00:09:58,520 --> 00:10:01,800
Speaker 1: hadn't heard of this. The growth of fine hair on

170
00:10:01,880 --> 00:10:06,240
Speaker 1: the body that lanugo that the newborn babies is one

171
00:10:06,280 --> 00:10:10,360
Speaker 1: of the most adorable little things, this little on a baby. Yeah,

172
00:10:10,440 --> 00:10:13,920
Speaker 1: Supposedly there's some waxy substance that covers the baby in

173
00:10:14,160 --> 00:10:17,840
Speaker 1: the womb and prevents them from getting chapped and chafed

174
00:10:17,920 --> 00:10:22,120
Speaker 1: by the amniotic fluid, and that lanugo hair kind of

175
00:10:22,160 --> 00:10:24,960
Speaker 1: grows in like this, this kind of downy fine fur

176
00:10:25,440 --> 00:10:29,640
Speaker 1: that lets that waxy substance stick to the skin. And again,

177
00:10:30,240 --> 00:10:33,719
Speaker 1: if you if you become malnourished, it triggers lenugo to

178
00:10:33,840 --> 00:10:37,280
Speaker 1: grow like later on in life. Yeah, that's a that's

179
00:10:37,280 --> 00:10:41,200
Speaker 1: a big sign. Another one is um a manorrhea, which

180
00:10:41,240 --> 00:10:45,079
Speaker 1: is the absence of um menstruation or menstrual periods. Right,

181
00:10:45,720 --> 00:10:47,840
Speaker 1: And that used to be like even I knew that

182
00:10:47,840 --> 00:10:50,160
Speaker 1: as like a sixth grade boy or something back in

183
00:10:50,200 --> 00:10:52,880
Speaker 1: the eighties, like that was like a huge thing. If

184
00:10:52,920 --> 00:10:54,600
Speaker 1: if a girl didn't have a period, I meant she

185
00:10:54,760 --> 00:10:58,480
Speaker 1: had anorexia. And apparently the d s M five, the

186
00:10:58,559 --> 00:11:00,520
Speaker 1: latest version, said now we're going to take that up

187
00:11:00,559 --> 00:11:03,080
Speaker 1: because it's not the case without everybody like, yes, it

188
00:11:03,120 --> 00:11:06,200
Speaker 1: definitely can lead to that. And if you have a manorrhea,

189
00:11:06,280 --> 00:11:10,800
Speaker 1: there's a possibility it's from anorexia. But if you have anorexia,

190
00:11:10,800 --> 00:11:14,280
Speaker 1: it doesn't mean you're going to um stop having your period. Yeah,

191
00:11:14,360 --> 00:11:17,960
Speaker 1: absolutely um. And you know, I wonder how many like

192
00:11:18,000 --> 00:11:20,160
Speaker 1: fourteen year old girls listening to this we just lost

193
00:11:20,200 --> 00:11:25,160
Speaker 1: because I said period twice. Hopefully there hanging there is

194
00:11:25,960 --> 00:11:29,040
Speaker 1: exactly who should be listening to the show. And if

195
00:11:29,040 --> 00:11:33,319
Speaker 1: we're talking about girls and women more, uh, and we'll

196
00:11:33,320 --> 00:11:35,760
Speaker 1: get to the stats. They suffer from anorexi and believe

197
00:11:35,760 --> 00:11:38,040
Speaker 1: me in more than men do. But that is not

198
00:11:38,080 --> 00:11:40,000
Speaker 1: to say that men don't suffer from it, and they

199
00:11:40,040 --> 00:11:43,319
Speaker 1: absolutely do. Um. I mean I might as well go

200
00:11:43,360 --> 00:11:45,200
Speaker 1: with a few of these. Have some other statistics. I

201
00:11:45,240 --> 00:11:49,120
Speaker 1: found at least thirty million people of all ages and

202
00:11:49,160 --> 00:11:52,480
Speaker 1: genders suffer from eating disorder in the United States. And

203
00:11:52,520 --> 00:11:56,240
Speaker 1: that's all eating disorders. Every sixty two minutes, at least

204
00:11:56,240 --> 00:12:00,160
Speaker 1: one person dies as a direct result from an eating disord.

205
00:12:01,160 --> 00:12:04,360
Speaker 1: Um the A few of these are just so sad.

206
00:12:04,679 --> 00:12:08,720
Speaker 1: Eating disorders have the highest mortality rate of any mental

207
00:12:08,760 --> 00:12:13,560
Speaker 1: illness period. Thirteen percent of women over the age of

208
00:12:13,600 --> 00:12:18,839
Speaker 1: fifty engage in eating disorder behaviors. I saw three and

209
00:12:18,880 --> 00:12:22,200
Speaker 1: a half percent can have UM like or have a

210
00:12:22,240 --> 00:12:25,600
Speaker 1: diagnosable eating disorder three and a half over the age

211
00:12:25,600 --> 00:12:29,800
Speaker 1: of fifty or forty. And that that midlife eating disorder

212
00:12:29,840 --> 00:12:33,000
Speaker 1: thing is like a big and growing problem right now. Yeah,

213
00:12:33,040 --> 00:12:34,959
Speaker 1: I mean, well, you know, we talked about adolescents a

214
00:12:35,000 --> 00:12:37,679
Speaker 1: lot in here, but it's not something restricted to uh

215
00:12:37,720 --> 00:12:41,280
Speaker 1: two young people. Um, this one is super sad as well.

216
00:12:41,400 --> 00:12:46,200
Speaker 1: Six of transgender college students have reported and eating disorder.

217
00:12:47,320 --> 00:12:49,520
Speaker 1: Uh boy, these are so sad to read out loud.

218
00:12:50,000 --> 00:12:56,079
Speaker 1: Um of the risk for either one is genetic. Uh.

219
00:12:56,120 --> 00:12:57,960
Speaker 1: And we'll talk about the genetics of it a little

220
00:12:58,040 --> 00:13:01,840
Speaker 1: later too, And then more and half of bolimia patients

221
00:13:02,320 --> 00:13:05,720
Speaker 1: have comorbid anxiety disorders. Yeah, I saw that too. It

222
00:13:05,800 --> 00:13:10,720
Speaker 1: was like I saw something like fifty of people with

223
00:13:10,760 --> 00:13:15,480
Speaker 1: anorexia have I think anxiety, and like percent or something

224
00:13:15,520 --> 00:13:21,120
Speaker 1: of people with bolimia have have anxiety disorder. Yeah, anxiety disorders,

225
00:13:21,160 --> 00:13:26,800
Speaker 1: mood disorders, substance abuse disorders. It says usually alcohol. It's

226
00:13:26,840 --> 00:13:30,320
Speaker 1: one in ten boliemia patients. So it's just, you know,

227
00:13:30,360 --> 00:13:32,280
Speaker 1: these are the worst kind of statistics to read off,

228
00:13:32,280 --> 00:13:34,840
Speaker 1: but it's important to know that it's it's across the

229
00:13:34,880 --> 00:13:39,320
Speaker 1: gender spectrum, across the age spectrum. Uh. If you think

230
00:13:39,400 --> 00:13:42,040
Speaker 1: that it's just something teenage girls go through, that's just

231
00:13:42,080 --> 00:13:44,280
Speaker 1: not the case. Yeah, and not just teenage girls. For

232
00:13:44,320 --> 00:13:46,959
Speaker 1: a long time, it was a teenage white girl problem.

233
00:13:47,000 --> 00:13:49,480
Speaker 1: And they're starting to realize, like, no, this is it

234
00:13:49,559 --> 00:13:55,840
Speaker 1: was like you were saying, like it it spans ethnicities, genders, nationalities, ages,

235
00:13:56,200 --> 00:13:58,520
Speaker 1: it's it's a much bigger problem than than we used

236
00:13:58,520 --> 00:14:00,440
Speaker 1: to think. And I don't know if it's become a

237
00:14:00,480 --> 00:14:03,920
Speaker 1: bigger problem or if just under awareness and understanding of

238
00:14:03,960 --> 00:14:06,080
Speaker 1: it has grown or something like that. But did you

239
00:14:06,120 --> 00:14:10,600
Speaker 1: mention suicide. I don't think I did, so you were

240
00:14:10,640 --> 00:14:12,840
Speaker 1: saying that this is this is one of the reasons

241
00:14:12,880 --> 00:14:16,280
Speaker 1: we're talking about this um. Anorexia and bolimia are one

242
00:14:16,280 --> 00:14:20,200
Speaker 1: of the maybe the deadliest mental disorder there is as

243
00:14:20,240 --> 00:14:22,560
Speaker 1: far as statistics go, like you were saying, and one

244
00:14:22,600 --> 00:14:25,320
Speaker 1: of the big reasons is because so many people with

245
00:14:25,360 --> 00:14:28,720
Speaker 1: anorexia or blieve me to die by suicide something like

246
00:14:28,840 --> 00:14:32,000
Speaker 1: two hundred times at a two hundred times greater rate

247
00:14:32,040 --> 00:14:35,160
Speaker 1: than the general population. Says here, one in five of

248
00:14:35,240 --> 00:14:39,200
Speaker 1: anorexia deaths is by suicide. And then if it's not

249
00:14:39,320 --> 00:14:42,240
Speaker 1: by suicide, there's a host of other ways that you

250
00:14:42,280 --> 00:14:45,320
Speaker 1: can die from anorexia. You can simply starve to death,

251
00:14:45,840 --> 00:14:50,200
Speaker 1: where your your you um, your heart can stop, your

252
00:14:50,360 --> 00:14:53,320
Speaker 1: organs can shut down, and it's from this lack of

253
00:14:53,680 --> 00:14:56,600
Speaker 1: energy that you're putting into your body. Your your body's

254
00:14:56,800 --> 00:15:01,760
Speaker 1: organs start to um kind of slow down, to metabolize

255
00:15:01,760 --> 00:15:04,200
Speaker 1: more slowly, to kind of conserve what little energy they

256
00:15:04,240 --> 00:15:07,760
Speaker 1: do have, and eventually it just doesn't work any longer.

257
00:15:07,800 --> 00:15:11,160
Speaker 1: Your body stops basically, and you can die just from

258
00:15:11,200 --> 00:15:14,320
Speaker 1: not eating and not because there wasn't any food. There

259
00:15:14,360 --> 00:15:16,640
Speaker 1: was plenty of food and everyone who was around you

260
00:15:16,640 --> 00:15:19,200
Speaker 1: wanted you to eat, you just wouldn't do it because

261
00:15:19,280 --> 00:15:22,800
Speaker 1: you felt fat. Yeah, And I don't even think it's

262
00:15:22,840 --> 00:15:25,160
Speaker 1: a lot of times a matter of if. I mean,

263
00:15:25,200 --> 00:15:27,440
Speaker 1: if you don't get treated and you don't get help

264
00:15:28,360 --> 00:15:31,760
Speaker 1: and it gets bad enough, then you will die from

265
00:15:31,760 --> 00:15:34,840
Speaker 1: oregon failure at some point. Yes, But we have to

266
00:15:34,880 --> 00:15:37,440
Speaker 1: say we don't want to get all like horribly grim,

267
00:15:37,520 --> 00:15:39,720
Speaker 1: because there are studies that are coming out now that

268
00:15:39,760 --> 00:15:42,600
Speaker 1: are saying, actually, we've been studying these people for like

269
00:15:42,680 --> 00:15:45,760
Speaker 1: twenty five years, and we're finding that over the long haul,

270
00:15:46,320 --> 00:15:50,320
Speaker 1: you can cure anorexia for good. It just takes a while.

271
00:15:50,640 --> 00:15:52,880
Speaker 1: And it also, from what I've seen, takes a patient

272
00:15:52,920 --> 00:15:57,120
Speaker 1: who wants to be cured absolutely. Uh. And then one

273
00:15:57,120 --> 00:15:59,600
Speaker 1: more thing here, if we do need to talk about

274
00:15:59,640 --> 00:16:03,000
Speaker 1: puberty and adolescence because it can have really um long

275
00:16:03,080 --> 00:16:05,880
Speaker 1: lasting effects if that's the time of your life where

276
00:16:05,880 --> 00:16:09,800
Speaker 1: this is happening, long term effects on your development, um

277
00:16:09,840 --> 00:16:12,920
Speaker 1: on your growth. Uh. If you I think it says

278
00:16:12,960 --> 00:16:17,880
Speaker 1: if you have anorexia beginning at age ten all the

279
00:16:17,880 --> 00:16:21,480
Speaker 1: way through your twenties, you can have permanent stunted growth.

280
00:16:21,880 --> 00:16:25,800
Speaker 1: You can ever do sex secondary sexual characteristics like um,

281
00:16:25,840 --> 00:16:29,120
Speaker 1: your pubic care, won't grow in your breast won't develop. Uh.

282
00:16:29,120 --> 00:16:31,840
Speaker 1: And maybe a lack of menstruation from the beginning, not

283
00:16:31,880 --> 00:16:34,640
Speaker 1: like the cessation of menstruation, Like you may never get

284
00:16:34,720 --> 00:16:37,040
Speaker 1: your period right and you may be infertile as a

285
00:16:37,080 --> 00:16:39,800
Speaker 1: matter of fact as an adult. That's right. So yeah,

286
00:16:39,880 --> 00:16:44,400
Speaker 1: just because of the age that it's the um, the

287
00:16:44,520 --> 00:16:47,920
Speaker 1: age that it sets on, I guess, um, it's such

288
00:16:47,960 --> 00:16:50,520
Speaker 1: an important time for the development your body. It's like

289
00:16:50,560 --> 00:16:52,560
Speaker 1: the last time you should be like time, I'm just

290
00:16:52,600 --> 00:16:55,240
Speaker 1: not gonna eat for a couple of days. Yeah. Um.

291
00:16:55,400 --> 00:16:57,880
Speaker 1: It has some real sweeping effects for sure. Yeah. And

292
00:16:57,920 --> 00:17:01,600
Speaker 1: bulimia too, for for its part, UH is really rough

293
00:17:01,640 --> 00:17:06,480
Speaker 1: on the teeth, um, yellowing, decaying teeth, sensitive teeth, UH,

294
00:17:06,760 --> 00:17:11,320
Speaker 1: swollen sore throat, acid reflux like all the time. Um.

295
00:17:11,480 --> 00:17:14,360
Speaker 1: And then you know electrolyte imbalances being in the bathroom

296
00:17:14,359 --> 00:17:18,080
Speaker 1: a lot because you're you're you're tricking your body essentially

297
00:17:18,080 --> 00:17:21,119
Speaker 1: into thinking is getting some nutrition and then getting rid

298
00:17:21,160 --> 00:17:24,399
Speaker 1: of that food really quickly, and that nutrition really quickly. Uh.

299
00:17:24,440 --> 00:17:26,879
Speaker 1: And that can lead to you know, fainting, fatigue, and

300
00:17:26,960 --> 00:17:32,000
Speaker 1: eventually heart attacks and strokes. Serious stuff. Yeah, it is

301
00:17:32,040 --> 00:17:34,800
Speaker 1: extraordinarily serious stuff, and a lot of people are like, well,

302
00:17:34,840 --> 00:17:37,960
Speaker 1: it's just you know, this is how my daughter, my sister,

303
00:17:38,200 --> 00:17:40,440
Speaker 1: my friend likes to look. She likes to be skinny.

304
00:17:40,440 --> 00:17:43,679
Speaker 1: And this is a really persistent problem with dealing with

305
00:17:43,720 --> 00:17:46,760
Speaker 1: anorex he is that. Um, I've seen it multiple places.

306
00:17:46,880 --> 00:17:50,240
Speaker 1: It's not a lifestyle, it's a mental health disorder, and

307
00:17:50,280 --> 00:17:54,720
Speaker 1: it has to be treated because again, it is, statistically speaking,

308
00:17:55,040 --> 00:17:58,560
Speaker 1: the deadliest mental health disorder there is. Should we take

309
00:17:58,560 --> 00:18:01,400
Speaker 1: a break, Yes, we're gonna take a break, and we're

310
00:18:01,400 --> 00:18:28,719
Speaker 1: gonna come back with a whole list of jokes. That's right, Okay,

311
00:18:28,840 --> 00:18:31,359
Speaker 1: Chuck lay us the first joke on us. All right,

312
00:18:31,600 --> 00:18:35,600
Speaker 1: I have no jokes, although I will say, uh, I

313
00:18:35,600 --> 00:18:39,080
Speaker 1: think were it's time for a great sidebar. Um. You know,

314
00:18:39,200 --> 00:18:42,320
Speaker 1: we we got one of those uh home I'm not

315
00:18:42,359 --> 00:18:44,920
Speaker 1: gonna buzz market anyone, but one of those home units

316
00:18:44,960 --> 00:18:47,440
Speaker 1: that you speak to and it tells you the weather

317
00:18:47,520 --> 00:18:50,040
Speaker 1: and stuff, like one of those robots. Yeah, like a

318
00:18:50,080 --> 00:18:53,840
Speaker 1: little robot you put. I've been testing it out with

319
00:18:53,880 --> 00:18:57,080
Speaker 1: my daughter lately, and those robots that talk to you

320
00:18:57,119 --> 00:19:00,320
Speaker 1: can tell jokes. Did you know that? Yes? I did,

321
00:19:00,640 --> 00:19:02,399
Speaker 1: and they some of them are kind of funny, and

322
00:19:02,560 --> 00:19:05,040
Speaker 1: they're all kind of great for four year olds. Well

323
00:19:05,080 --> 00:19:07,240
Speaker 1: what you got, oh, I mean none of I mean

324
00:19:08,800 --> 00:19:11,840
Speaker 1: some Thanksgiving jokes around this time, and they I think

325
00:19:11,840 --> 00:19:15,040
Speaker 1: they try to be topical topical jokes. So there's like

326
00:19:15,119 --> 00:19:17,840
Speaker 1: Christmas and Thanksgiving jokes going on right now. But you're

327
00:19:17,880 --> 00:19:19,720
Speaker 1: not going to tell us one of the I'm trying

328
00:19:19,720 --> 00:19:21,920
Speaker 1: to remember some of them. I mean, trust me, they're

329
00:19:22,000 --> 00:19:23,960
Speaker 1: they're not great jokes for adults, but four year olds

330
00:19:23,960 --> 00:19:27,719
Speaker 1: eat it up. It's they're probably like deeply copyrighted too.

331
00:19:28,440 --> 00:19:30,760
Speaker 1: Maybe I don't know if you can copyright these kind

332
00:19:30,760 --> 00:19:33,240
Speaker 1: of dumb jokes. Thanksgiving joke, you're kidding me. It's like

333
00:19:33,280 --> 00:19:36,639
Speaker 1: what our country has founded on, all right, but writing Thanksgiving.

334
00:19:37,040 --> 00:19:38,760
Speaker 1: So that that's been going on at our house is

335
00:19:38,800 --> 00:19:41,720
Speaker 1: a lot of joke telling. And they can make Bourbon

336
00:19:41,800 --> 00:19:46,199
Speaker 1: noises and two noises and it's uh, I'm trying to

337
00:19:46,240 --> 00:19:48,840
Speaker 1: test the limits of how blue they can go. Remember

338
00:19:48,840 --> 00:19:51,679
Speaker 1: that little handheld box we had that would make different

339
00:19:51,720 --> 00:19:54,960
Speaker 1: like fart sounds and sharking sounds. So basically this is

340
00:19:55,000 --> 00:19:57,200
Speaker 1: what this is is a high tech kind of robot

341
00:19:57,240 --> 00:20:00,560
Speaker 1: butler that makes fart sounds. Yeah, it's great. Is it

342
00:20:00,600 --> 00:20:03,440
Speaker 1: on wheels? Now, it's not on wheels, it's it's it

343
00:20:03,480 --> 00:20:06,240
Speaker 1: sits on your nightstand or wherever you want it. I

344
00:20:06,280 --> 00:20:10,880
Speaker 1: got you, so all right, enough, enough fun and games. Yeah,

345
00:20:11,240 --> 00:20:13,679
Speaker 1: we should talk a little bit about the causes of anorexia,

346
00:20:13,720 --> 00:20:17,440
Speaker 1: because this is one of the more confounding. Um well,

347
00:20:17,480 --> 00:20:19,920
Speaker 1: I mean a lot of mental health disorders are confounding

348
00:20:19,920 --> 00:20:22,200
Speaker 1: in this way, actually, but we don't know the cause

349
00:20:22,240 --> 00:20:26,960
Speaker 1: of it. Um. It is probably a lot of causes. Um.

350
00:20:27,040 --> 00:20:29,840
Speaker 1: Some of them may conflict with one another, but it

351
00:20:29,960 --> 00:20:34,680
Speaker 1: is probably a very complex bag and mix of societal pressures,

352
00:20:34,840 --> 00:20:38,399
Speaker 1: which we're gonna talk about your environment, and then genetics

353
00:20:39,000 --> 00:20:42,320
Speaker 1: look like they do play a part. Yeah. They they

354
00:20:42,359 --> 00:20:44,679
Speaker 1: think that it's a this get this man, this is

355
00:20:44,680 --> 00:20:47,240
Speaker 1: what they call a grab bag catch all. That there

356
00:20:47,359 --> 00:20:52,840
Speaker 1: is a bio psycho social mechanism underlying anorexia and bolimia. Yeah,

357
00:20:53,359 --> 00:20:57,080
Speaker 1: it's biological, psychological, and social. And they're probably right. I mean,

358
00:20:57,119 --> 00:21:00,399
Speaker 1: there's probably components of all of them put together there,

359
00:21:00,480 --> 00:21:03,199
Speaker 1: which would explain why it's so hard to understand at

360
00:21:03,240 --> 00:21:05,639
Speaker 1: this point and so hard to treat. It's very tough

361
00:21:05,680 --> 00:21:07,720
Speaker 1: because it's not like you can point to one thing

362
00:21:08,560 --> 00:21:12,880
Speaker 1: and say, correct this part of your life, and uh yeah,

363
00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:15,720
Speaker 1: and it'll be better. It's like it's there's so many prongs.

364
00:21:15,760 --> 00:21:18,760
Speaker 1: It's really really tough. Yeah, absolutely, because let me think

365
00:21:18,760 --> 00:21:21,639
Speaker 1: about it, Like if you have a person who has

366
00:21:21,840 --> 00:21:24,919
Speaker 1: uh anorexia and they want to get better, but the

367
00:21:24,960 --> 00:21:27,320
Speaker 1: reason that they developed anna rixie in the first place

368
00:21:27,680 --> 00:21:29,600
Speaker 1: is because they have a parent who's on them about

369
00:21:29,600 --> 00:21:32,199
Speaker 1: their weight all the time. You have to correct the

370
00:21:32,240 --> 00:21:36,359
Speaker 1: parents behavior in addition to, you know, possibly treating the

371
00:21:37,119 --> 00:21:40,199
Speaker 1: patient in the hospital for malnourishment. Like, it is a

372
00:21:40,240 --> 00:21:43,639
Speaker 1: big complex ball of stuff, but there are there are

373
00:21:43,680 --> 00:21:46,359
Speaker 1: studies that have kind of turned up like little little

374
00:21:46,359 --> 00:21:48,840
Speaker 1: bits here. They're like, oh, here's a here's a little

375
00:21:49,600 --> 00:21:53,280
Speaker 1: a little I don't know, like a hot a matchbox

376
00:21:53,320 --> 00:21:57,600
Speaker 1: car or something. In a pile of rocks means what's

377
00:21:57,640 --> 00:22:01,920
Speaker 1: something you want? Like a diamond in the basically, Okay,

378
00:22:02,400 --> 00:22:04,240
Speaker 1: I haven't you ever found a match box kind of

379
00:22:04,280 --> 00:22:06,639
Speaker 1: pil of rocks. But like, I was really glad that

380
00:22:06,640 --> 00:22:08,560
Speaker 1: I found this. I thought it was just some dumb,

381
00:22:08,600 --> 00:22:11,800
Speaker 1: boring pile of rocks. I've never I had no idea

382
00:22:11,800 --> 00:22:14,040
Speaker 1: where you're going there. Well, but I'm glad, we gotta

383
00:22:14,080 --> 00:22:19,360
Speaker 1: laugh out of this. I was being serious. Oh sorry, um,

384
00:22:19,400 --> 00:22:21,840
Speaker 1: are you talking about the study the twin study, I'm

385
00:22:21,880 --> 00:22:24,919
Speaker 1: talking about all the studies. Okay, Well, they did do

386
00:22:24,960 --> 00:22:28,560
Speaker 1: a twin study, and they found as in studying human twins,

387
00:22:28,720 --> 00:22:32,480
Speaker 1: not two different studies that look alike. But uh, they

388
00:22:32,520 --> 00:22:34,840
Speaker 1: found that if and this is this is sort of

389
00:22:34,880 --> 00:22:37,920
Speaker 1: helps back up evidence of a genetic component. But if

390
00:22:37,920 --> 00:22:42,720
Speaker 1: one twin has anorexia, then they're identical twin, not fraternal

391
00:22:43,240 --> 00:22:50,120
Speaker 1: um um more likely to also have that same disorder. Right,

392
00:22:50,400 --> 00:22:53,480
Speaker 1: But not, like you said, among fraternal twins, because so

393
00:22:53,600 --> 00:22:55,440
Speaker 1: because I mean you'd think, like, you know, you see

394
00:22:55,960 --> 00:22:58,960
Speaker 1: identical twins and and think like what did your mother

395
00:22:59,040 --> 00:23:02,119
Speaker 1: do to you too? How? How could this be allowed

396
00:23:02,119 --> 00:23:03,800
Speaker 1: to go on? But if that's not the case with

397
00:23:03,840 --> 00:23:08,240
Speaker 1: fraternal twins, then that removes that environmental component, strongly suggests

398
00:23:08,240 --> 00:23:11,199
Speaker 1: that it's a genetic component. Yeah, and maybe to some

399
00:23:11,280 --> 00:23:14,280
Speaker 1: degree a social component. I mean not all the time,

400
00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:18,920
Speaker 1: but I would imagine fraternal twins are generally um subjected

401
00:23:18,960 --> 00:23:23,040
Speaker 1: to this or similar social components. Yes. The only thing

402
00:23:23,080 --> 00:23:26,040
Speaker 1: that would confound that is fraternal twins can also be

403
00:23:26,880 --> 00:23:30,480
Speaker 1: like like boy and girl So I mean if the

404
00:23:30,800 --> 00:23:33,000
Speaker 1: if they tossed out the boy and girl and just

405
00:23:33,040 --> 00:23:36,640
Speaker 1: had like fraternal twin girls or fraternal twin boys in study,

406
00:23:37,040 --> 00:23:39,840
Speaker 1: I would say that would strongly suggest it's a genetic component.

407
00:23:39,880 --> 00:23:42,119
Speaker 1: But I mean, in in any home, a boy and

408
00:23:42,160 --> 00:23:43,600
Speaker 1: a girl are going to be treating or a son

409
00:23:43,640 --> 00:23:45,280
Speaker 1: and a daughter is going to be treated differently. Is

410
00:23:45,359 --> 00:23:47,639
Speaker 1: just the way it is, unless you live in a

411
00:23:47,640 --> 00:23:52,360
Speaker 1: skinner box. Oh gosh, that that should lighten the mood, right,

412
00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:56,240
Speaker 1: unless you're dad shocks you for studies at home. Uh,

413
00:23:56,280 --> 00:23:59,160
Speaker 1: they did not have not found a gene they can pinpoint.

414
00:23:59,160 --> 00:24:02,320
Speaker 1: They have found thirty I'm sorry, forty three genes that

415
00:24:02,440 --> 00:24:06,240
Speaker 1: could potentially be of use when it comes to linking

416
00:24:06,320 --> 00:24:10,000
Speaker 1: genetics to these disorders, but they haven't. It's nothing is

417
00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:12,840
Speaker 1: very clear cut at this point. Right. So that's the

418
00:24:13,000 --> 00:24:17,000
Speaker 1: that's about as far as they've gotten on the biological component. UM.

419
00:24:17,040 --> 00:24:19,760
Speaker 1: As far as the psychological component, like you were saying,

420
00:24:20,040 --> 00:24:24,919
Speaker 1: they found there's a lot of comorbidity with other UM.

421
00:24:25,200 --> 00:24:30,760
Speaker 1: Other behavior disorders and personality disorders like depression, anxiety disorder,

422
00:24:30,920 --> 00:24:36,720
Speaker 1: obsessive compulsive disorder UM. They bear a lot of resemblance

423
00:24:36,760 --> 00:24:40,240
Speaker 1: to one another and that um, like with with anorexia

424
00:24:40,400 --> 00:24:45,760
Speaker 1: or bulimia, something called ritualized food behaviors develop where um,

425
00:24:45,840 --> 00:24:48,600
Speaker 1: you cut food into small pieces first to make it

426
00:24:48,600 --> 00:24:51,760
Speaker 1: seem like there's more or make it seem like you are,

427
00:24:52,000 --> 00:24:56,119
Speaker 1: um are like eating more than you actually are. But

428
00:24:56,840 --> 00:24:59,880
Speaker 1: the what makes it ritualizes you couldn't eat food any

429
00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:03,080
Speaker 1: their way, or you have to arrange food a certain

430
00:25:03,119 --> 00:25:05,160
Speaker 1: way on the plate before you eat it, or even

431
00:25:05,240 --> 00:25:10,359
Speaker 1: like religiously counting and tracking calories is considered a ritualized

432
00:25:10,359 --> 00:25:13,720
Speaker 1: food behavior, and it really kind of trapes is into

433
00:25:13,760 --> 00:25:18,160
Speaker 1: the realm of something like obsessive compulsive disorder or experience

434
00:25:18,240 --> 00:25:20,560
Speaker 1: the anxiety if you're forced to eat food on a

435
00:25:20,600 --> 00:25:22,840
Speaker 1: plate that's not arranged in the way that you're used to.

436
00:25:23,080 --> 00:25:25,199
Speaker 1: So the idea is that you eat one english pi

437
00:25:25,280 --> 00:25:27,359
Speaker 1: at a time, you are you are taking a lot

438
00:25:27,440 --> 00:25:30,880
Speaker 1: of bites and therefore, hey, look I'm eating a lot. Yeah,

439
00:25:31,040 --> 00:25:34,000
Speaker 1: that's kind of more deceptive behavior and that would probably

440
00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:36,920
Speaker 1: be like a two fer something. I mean self deceptive

441
00:25:36,960 --> 00:25:39,959
Speaker 1: even you know, sure, sure, but also deceptive like your

442
00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:42,040
Speaker 1: parents who might be watching you like a hawk or something.

443
00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:46,600
Speaker 1: You're like, no, no, exactly, really interesting. But if you

444
00:25:46,680 --> 00:25:50,480
Speaker 1: couldn't eat peas any other way but that then that

445
00:25:50,520 --> 00:25:54,440
Speaker 1: would be a ritualized food behavior. Right. Uh, this statistic

446
00:25:55,400 --> 00:25:57,520
Speaker 1: as far as meeting criteria for at least one other

447
00:25:57,560 --> 00:26:05,080
Speaker 1: mental health disorder, it's fifty of anorexia patients and for bolimia. Yeah,

448
00:26:05,119 --> 00:26:08,239
Speaker 1: that is really high. Yeah, and that's and you know,

449
00:26:08,320 --> 00:26:11,520
Speaker 1: that's what makes it weird that the two are so overlapped,

450
00:26:11,560 --> 00:26:15,400
Speaker 1: because so you've got anorexia nervosa and bolimia nervosa, and

451
00:26:15,440 --> 00:26:18,520
Speaker 1: again they each have their own separate entries in the

452
00:26:18,600 --> 00:26:21,600
Speaker 1: d s M. But then there's a kind of a

453
00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:26,600
Speaker 1: binge and purge bolimia component to anorexia. But the personality

454
00:26:26,680 --> 00:26:30,639
Speaker 1: disorders that are even the types of personalities that engage

455
00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:33,840
Speaker 1: in each one are really really different. Like with anorexia

456
00:26:33,920 --> 00:26:38,439
Speaker 1: nervosa UM, the patients are usually low novelty seeking, so

457
00:26:38,480 --> 00:26:40,960
Speaker 1: they're not like trying out new things. They have a

458
00:26:41,000 --> 00:26:47,120
Speaker 1: low emotional responsiveness, decreased pleasure, and reduce social spontaneity. That's

459
00:26:47,160 --> 00:26:51,359
Speaker 1: typical someone with anorexia nervosa. With bolimia nervosa, it's like

460
00:26:51,480 --> 00:26:54,120
Speaker 1: kind of the opposite. They tend to be impulsive, they

461
00:26:54,160 --> 00:26:57,320
Speaker 1: look for new experiences, and they can have characteristics of

462
00:26:57,320 --> 00:27:01,119
Speaker 1: a borderline personality disorder from whatever read So they're like

463
00:27:01,280 --> 00:27:04,359
Speaker 1: two totally different types of people but engage in the

464
00:27:04,400 --> 00:27:07,080
Speaker 1: same behavior. And it's one of those things where it's like, Okay,

465
00:27:07,200 --> 00:27:09,320
Speaker 1: if you have two different types of people who are

466
00:27:09,320 --> 00:27:11,240
Speaker 1: trying to do the same thing or trying to achieve

467
00:27:11,280 --> 00:27:15,040
Speaker 1: the same end, what you know, what commonalities do they have?

468
00:27:15,720 --> 00:27:18,920
Speaker 1: In exploring those commonalities, maybe we'll find like the answers

469
00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:22,800
Speaker 1: to what causes eating disorders like this. Yeah, it's interesting.

470
00:27:22,840 --> 00:27:24,600
Speaker 1: I mean it does make a little bit of sense

471
00:27:25,080 --> 00:27:29,960
Speaker 1: when you look at the you know, like someone suffering

472
00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:34,320
Speaker 1: from anorexia would avoid going out to eat spontaneously with friends,

473
00:27:34,400 --> 00:27:38,960
Speaker 1: let's say at all costs. Someone with bulimia might jump

474
00:27:39,080 --> 00:27:42,360
Speaker 1: right in there because in their mind they they may

475
00:27:42,400 --> 00:27:45,440
Speaker 1: think that they have a solve for that behavior, which

476
00:27:45,480 --> 00:27:48,439
Speaker 1: is I'll excuse myself to the bathroom right afterward, and

477
00:27:48,480 --> 00:27:50,520
Speaker 1: I can still go out with my friends and eat

478
00:27:51,000 --> 00:27:53,640
Speaker 1: a regular sized meal. I think that's a really good point.

479
00:27:53,680 --> 00:27:58,159
Speaker 1: So either way that the regardless of how that person

480
00:27:58,280 --> 00:28:01,439
Speaker 1: is personality wise, they're going to age in trying to

481
00:28:02,040 --> 00:28:05,440
Speaker 1: maintain their weight. But depending on their type of personality,

482
00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:08,200
Speaker 1: they're going to choose this route or that route. Yeah, yeah,

483
00:28:08,200 --> 00:28:11,400
Speaker 1: I think I think you're onto something. Dr Chuck. Well,

484
00:28:11,480 --> 00:28:13,919
Speaker 1: the other thing too, is with these personality traits, they

485
00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:18,439
Speaker 1: found correlation with things like perfectionism, irritability, and like you

486
00:28:18,480 --> 00:28:22,560
Speaker 1: were talking about this, sometimes being impulse over, sometimes the opposite.

487
00:28:23,160 --> 00:28:26,080
Speaker 1: But what they found too is, uh, you know, if

488
00:28:26,119 --> 00:28:29,120
Speaker 1: you're studying adolescence in puberty, a lot of these are

489
00:28:29,119 --> 00:28:32,600
Speaker 1: normal traits of adolescence, so it's really hard to distinguish

490
00:28:32,600 --> 00:28:36,159
Speaker 1: sometimes and a lot of times these things it's a

491
00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:38,280
Speaker 1: chicken or the egg, these are caused by the eating

492
00:28:38,280 --> 00:28:41,480
Speaker 1: disorder and not the other way around. Yeah. That also

493
00:28:41,520 --> 00:28:45,440
Speaker 1: applies to differences in brain structure too, Like they found

494
00:28:45,640 --> 00:28:49,680
Speaker 1: things like um reduction in the gray matter and the

495
00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:51,960
Speaker 1: white matter in the brain of people with one of

496
00:28:52,000 --> 00:28:56,040
Speaker 1: the nervosas or um they have more cerebral spinal fluid,

497
00:28:56,440 --> 00:28:59,000
Speaker 1: and then other regions of the brain are smaller compared

498
00:28:59,080 --> 00:29:02,560
Speaker 1: to people who don't have disorders, but they clear up

499
00:29:03,040 --> 00:29:07,720
Speaker 1: when the um anorexia is successfully treated. Yeah, so that's

500
00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:10,320
Speaker 1: it's kind of it really makes you wonder like where,

501
00:29:10,440 --> 00:29:13,400
Speaker 1: you know, did it cause it or its like it doesn't.

502
00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:15,880
Speaker 1: It doesn't prove or disprove it either way. It's just

503
00:29:16,280 --> 00:29:19,760
Speaker 1: the two are related and we're not sure which causes which. Yeah.

504
00:29:19,800 --> 00:29:21,920
Speaker 1: I thought this F m R I stuff was interesting

505
00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:25,520
Speaker 1: because you know, our motto went in doubt, go into

506
00:29:25,560 --> 00:29:29,400
Speaker 1: the wonder machine and see what's lighting up. Be very instructive.

507
00:29:30,120 --> 00:29:34,400
Speaker 1: And they did the longest motto, every t you can

508
00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:36,200
Speaker 1: fit on the front end, back of a T shirt,

509
00:29:36,920 --> 00:29:39,960
Speaker 1: not a hat, kind of peters out down the bottom,

510
00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:42,840
Speaker 1: that's right. Uh. And then the script just you know,

511
00:29:43,880 --> 00:29:46,800
Speaker 1: like a pen like you fall asleep all writings, right, yeah, right,

512
00:29:47,240 --> 00:29:52,160
Speaker 1: So the F m R I Wonder machine has found that, uh,

513
00:29:52,440 --> 00:29:54,840
Speaker 1: it lights up those reward centers in the brain show

514
00:29:54,920 --> 00:29:58,600
Speaker 1: increased activity. Um, if you have intorexy and you're shown

515
00:29:58,640 --> 00:30:03,760
Speaker 1: photos of someone who is drastically underweight, So that's a

516
00:30:04,240 --> 00:30:08,320
Speaker 1: pretty obvious you know sign right there. Another one is

517
00:30:08,840 --> 00:30:12,720
Speaker 1: noticing fine details when you are shown a picture of

518
00:30:12,760 --> 00:30:16,480
Speaker 1: your own face, that that reward response is just lighting

519
00:30:16,520 --> 00:30:19,080
Speaker 1: up the reward center. So that that means that they

520
00:30:19,080 --> 00:30:24,360
Speaker 1: are are hyper um aware of their appearance at all

521
00:30:24,440 --> 00:30:28,280
Speaker 1: times for sure, and like they noticed things that might

522
00:30:28,320 --> 00:30:32,600
Speaker 1: not even be there, right Um. And then finally you

523
00:30:32,640 --> 00:30:37,640
Speaker 1: get to the social part of the biopsychosocial components. UM

524
00:30:37,680 --> 00:30:41,280
Speaker 1: and that's the environmental factors. And one of the big

525
00:30:41,320 --> 00:30:44,080
Speaker 1: ones that has kind of emerged is the idea of

526
00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:49,280
Speaker 1: sexual abuse in creating antirects the universear starting it in

527
00:30:49,280 --> 00:30:52,760
Speaker 1: in UM people. I saw that. I think John's Hawkins

528
00:30:52,800 --> 00:30:57,280
Speaker 1: said sexual abuse has been reported in twenty of individuals

529
00:30:57,280 --> 00:31:01,400
Speaker 1: with antorexts inniversa and bolimia innivosa, right, um, And it

530
00:31:01,440 --> 00:31:05,080
Speaker 1: doesn't necessarily have to just be sexual abuse, but there

531
00:31:05,160 --> 00:31:09,680
Speaker 1: is a consistent UM reporting of some sort of trigger.

532
00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:14,480
Speaker 1: Like the people who have bolimia and anorexia typically can

533
00:31:14,560 --> 00:31:17,640
Speaker 1: point to the moment that it started or the thing

534
00:31:17,800 --> 00:31:20,479
Speaker 1: that created this idea in their mind. It could be

535
00:31:20,760 --> 00:31:24,600
Speaker 1: apparent being overly critical of their weight. It oftentimes as

536
00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:27,320
Speaker 1: a parent, I think, yeah, it could be a coach

537
00:31:27,480 --> 00:31:30,160
Speaker 1: who is overly critical of their weight. Um. It can

538
00:31:30,200 --> 00:31:33,400
Speaker 1: be a bully teasing them about their way. It could

539
00:31:33,400 --> 00:31:35,320
Speaker 1: be a friend making a joke about their way. It

540
00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:38,000
Speaker 1: just depends on the moment, you know how, like how

541
00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:40,480
Speaker 1: something can bother you but it doesn't seem to bother

542
00:31:40,560 --> 00:31:43,920
Speaker 1: anybody else um and vice versa. You know something that

543
00:31:43,920 --> 00:31:45,800
Speaker 1: bothers someone else. You're like, that's not that big of

544
00:31:45,800 --> 00:31:48,080
Speaker 1: a deal. But it's all just based on the person,

545
00:31:48,120 --> 00:31:50,120
Speaker 1: in the context, in the setting, and maybe even just

546
00:31:50,200 --> 00:31:54,520
Speaker 1: that perfect combination of neurotransmitters that happened to be active

547
00:31:54,520 --> 00:31:57,200
Speaker 1: in their brain right then then just something got them

548
00:31:57,240 --> 00:32:01,680
Speaker 1: just right that has been on to kickstart an xi

549
00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:05,520
Speaker 1: and bolimia under a lot of circumstances. Yeah, and it's

550
00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:08,920
Speaker 1: just for parents. It's so important how they talk about

551
00:32:09,800 --> 00:32:12,520
Speaker 1: UH and not just to their kids, but any time

552
00:32:12,560 --> 00:32:15,840
Speaker 1: your kid can hear you speaking words, how you talk

553
00:32:15,880 --> 00:32:18,520
Speaker 1: about weight, and how you talk about your own body,

554
00:32:19,080 --> 00:32:22,480
Speaker 1: and how you talk about health and um, you know,

555
00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:24,800
Speaker 1: having a kid now, it's just it's made me realize

556
00:32:25,600 --> 00:32:30,120
Speaker 1: how unkind I can be to my own self being overweight,

557
00:32:30,280 --> 00:32:32,680
Speaker 1: and you you can't say those things in front of

558
00:32:32,680 --> 00:32:36,360
Speaker 1: a four year old. You have to talk about um

559
00:32:37,480 --> 00:32:41,719
Speaker 1: health and you know, daddy's exercising because daddy wants to

560
00:32:41,840 --> 00:32:45,840
Speaker 1: be healthier and stuff like that, because you'd be surprised

561
00:32:45,840 --> 00:32:48,640
Speaker 1: that you know, these little ears they hear it all.

562
00:32:48,760 --> 00:32:51,840
Speaker 1: And um, the last thing that you want is for

563
00:32:51,880 --> 00:32:55,680
Speaker 1: anything that you say to be UH two to have

564
00:32:55,760 --> 00:32:59,360
Speaker 1: an impact on your child, uh in an unhealthy way

565
00:32:59,360 --> 00:33:02,080
Speaker 1: about their body image. You know, it's just super super important,

566
00:33:02,080 --> 00:33:05,480
Speaker 1: and I think it's gotten much much better than than

567
00:33:05,520 --> 00:33:07,920
Speaker 1: the old days when you know, I know a lot

568
00:33:07,920 --> 00:33:10,560
Speaker 1: of women who talk about, you know, whether or not

569
00:33:10,640 --> 00:33:14,920
Speaker 1: they suffered from anorexi or not, uh, struggling with their

570
00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:19,480
Speaker 1: body image because um, most of the time mom talking

571
00:33:19,520 --> 00:33:22,720
Speaker 1: about it growing up. I'm sure Dad's played part two.

572
00:33:22,760 --> 00:33:26,080
Speaker 1: But I've heard a lot of anecdotal examples of women

573
00:33:26,120 --> 00:33:29,360
Speaker 1: talking about in this, you know, in the seventies, mom

574
00:33:29,400 --> 00:33:31,240
Speaker 1: talking about, you know, you can't eat this, you can't

575
00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:33,200
Speaker 1: eat that because you won't get a boyfriend, or this

576
00:33:33,240 --> 00:33:37,760
Speaker 1: won't happen or that won't happen, right, and um, that's yeah.

577
00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:41,280
Speaker 1: I've seen that a lot of places too for researching this.

578
00:33:41,360 --> 00:33:43,040
Speaker 1: But one of the other things I saw is like

579
00:33:43,080 --> 00:33:45,320
Speaker 1: what you were saying where you were talking about yourself.

580
00:33:45,360 --> 00:33:47,160
Speaker 1: You have to watch what you say around your daughter.

581
00:33:47,760 --> 00:33:50,520
Speaker 1: When you say disparaging things about your yourself, that's called

582
00:33:50,520 --> 00:33:54,760
Speaker 1: fat talk. And it is like a pastime in the West,

583
00:33:55,280 --> 00:33:58,960
Speaker 1: were like getting getting together with friends or just having

584
00:33:58,960 --> 00:34:01,240
Speaker 1: a couple of conver station around the water cooler or

585
00:34:01,240 --> 00:34:03,000
Speaker 1: something about how fat you are or how much you

586
00:34:03,200 --> 00:34:05,000
Speaker 1: ate and how much you you need to lose weight,

587
00:34:05,360 --> 00:34:07,760
Speaker 1: and that they found it can actually be a real

588
00:34:07,880 --> 00:34:12,200
Speaker 1: driver for leading to um eating disorders as well. Yeah,

589
00:34:12,200 --> 00:34:14,440
Speaker 1: I mean I make jokes all the time about that

590
00:34:14,520 --> 00:34:17,680
Speaker 1: with you and everyone I know, but I don't use

591
00:34:17,760 --> 00:34:21,080
Speaker 1: that word in my house. Uh. I have to stop

592
00:34:21,120 --> 00:34:23,719
Speaker 1: myself from making jokes about myself. It's just it's no

593
00:34:23,800 --> 00:34:27,400
Speaker 1: good for anyone. Know. One question I have though, is

594
00:34:27,600 --> 00:34:32,360
Speaker 1: like I was a pretty like husky boy. You were robust.

595
00:34:32,719 --> 00:34:36,240
Speaker 1: I was very like I had the Pillsbury doughboy nickname,

596
00:34:36,360 --> 00:34:38,000
Speaker 1: and like I mean like I was the fat in

597
00:34:38,160 --> 00:34:41,399
Speaker 1: class for sure, And uh it bothered me, like really

598
00:34:41,440 --> 00:34:44,040
Speaker 1: set the tone of my childhood in a lot of ways.

599
00:34:44,040 --> 00:34:46,160
Speaker 1: Like I had a really great childhood and I loved it,

600
00:34:46,400 --> 00:34:48,680
Speaker 1: but I also had like a real bummer childhood in

601
00:34:48,680 --> 00:34:53,239
Speaker 1: that sense too. Um But like, what do you do

602
00:34:53,400 --> 00:34:57,879
Speaker 1: when your kid is demonstrably overweight and needs to lose

603
00:34:57,880 --> 00:34:59,400
Speaker 1: weight or else they're going to spend the rest of

604
00:34:59,400 --> 00:35:02,160
Speaker 1: their life uggling with their weight, which is not fun

605
00:35:02,200 --> 00:35:05,719
Speaker 1: at all? Like what do you do? How do you

606
00:35:05,760 --> 00:35:09,120
Speaker 1: approach the little fragile ego of a kid and saying

607
00:35:09,440 --> 00:35:11,400
Speaker 1: we need to get some weight off you, you know,

608
00:35:11,520 --> 00:35:15,080
Speaker 1: without leading them down this path to an eating disorder.

609
00:35:15,120 --> 00:35:17,720
Speaker 1: That's got to be one of the trickiest things you

610
00:35:17,719 --> 00:35:19,719
Speaker 1: you would ever have to to talk about with your

611
00:35:19,760 --> 00:35:23,120
Speaker 1: kid in that in that situation. Yeah, and and also

612
00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:26,600
Speaker 1: especially now in a day where there's such a movement

613
00:35:26,600 --> 00:35:28,560
Speaker 1: to be accepting of who you are, no matter how

614
00:35:28,640 --> 00:35:31,960
Speaker 1: what size you are. Um, it's just such a fine

615
00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:37,000
Speaker 1: line to walk between good health and accepting who you are. Like,

616
00:35:37,360 --> 00:35:40,000
Speaker 1: I don't necessarily have a super poor self image, but

617
00:35:40,239 --> 00:35:42,920
Speaker 1: I want to be alive in thirty years for my daughter,

618
00:35:42,960 --> 00:35:45,480
Speaker 1: you know, right, sure, like the vanity is kind of

619
00:35:45,480 --> 00:35:48,920
Speaker 1: gone at this point. I'm for but I want to

620
00:35:48,960 --> 00:35:53,160
Speaker 1: be healthy. Uh and and those you know, a healthy

621
00:35:53,200 --> 00:35:55,920
Speaker 1: weight goes hand in hand with not having the stroke

622
00:35:55,960 --> 00:35:58,520
Speaker 1: in the heart attack later on exactly. But I think

623
00:35:58,560 --> 00:36:01,520
Speaker 1: a lot of people would say, like, Okay, yes, there

624
00:36:01,600 --> 00:36:04,560
Speaker 1: is health to be gained from eating better or from

625
00:36:04,560 --> 00:36:08,600
Speaker 1: exercising or doing both ideally. Um, but one of the

626
00:36:08,640 --> 00:36:11,399
Speaker 1: problems that we have is this ideal where it's like, well,

627
00:36:11,520 --> 00:36:14,120
Speaker 1: keep going until you have washboard abs, and until you

628
00:36:14,160 --> 00:36:18,279
Speaker 1: have like these amazing biceps, and until you just want

629
00:36:18,320 --> 00:36:20,600
Speaker 1: to do nothing but walk around in nospedo or something

630
00:36:20,640 --> 00:36:22,600
Speaker 1: like that. And the fact that like those are the

631
00:36:22,640 --> 00:36:25,479
Speaker 1: models that we see on the billboards, that drives even

632
00:36:25,520 --> 00:36:29,719
Speaker 1: that idea of health, healthiness to this kind of perverted,

633
00:36:29,800 --> 00:36:34,480
Speaker 1: weird place that can kind of develop eating disorders as well. Yeah,

634
00:36:34,520 --> 00:36:37,560
Speaker 1: that's not me. I have no illusions about ever having

635
00:36:37,560 --> 00:36:40,279
Speaker 1: a washboard stomach. I've given up on this. I don't

636
00:36:40,280 --> 00:36:43,799
Speaker 1: want a washboard's stomach. I want to want to see,

637
00:36:44,880 --> 00:36:47,640
Speaker 1: just to see what it's like, and then I'd be like,

638
00:36:47,719 --> 00:36:49,839
Speaker 1: all right, give me a donna. I like a little

639
00:36:49,840 --> 00:36:53,640
Speaker 1: softness to a body. It's nicer I hug on and

640
00:36:53,719 --> 00:36:55,960
Speaker 1: lay around with. I don't want I do too. I mean,

641
00:36:56,400 --> 00:36:58,000
Speaker 1: Emily didn't want to put her head down on a

642
00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:02,040
Speaker 1: washboard stomach, right, she doesn't want to bounce a nickel

643
00:37:02,120 --> 00:37:05,799
Speaker 1: off of the No, So I want I want to

644
00:37:05,840 --> 00:37:08,040
Speaker 1: see what it would look like on me, and then

645
00:37:08,200 --> 00:37:11,200
Speaker 1: that'd be fine. I mean, that's it. I don't really

646
00:37:11,200 --> 00:37:13,880
Speaker 1: have like any it's not my ideal look or anything

647
00:37:13,920 --> 00:37:15,319
Speaker 1: like that. I just want to see if I could

648
00:37:15,320 --> 00:37:17,120
Speaker 1: ever do it. Yeah, I just I just need to

649
00:37:17,160 --> 00:37:19,960
Speaker 1: get healthier and drop some weight and you know, feel

650
00:37:19,960 --> 00:37:22,240
Speaker 1: a little bit better day to day, like moving around

651
00:37:22,280 --> 00:37:24,439
Speaker 1: the world, because it has an impact on that stuff too.

652
00:37:24,800 --> 00:37:27,160
Speaker 1: That's the key is feeling better day to day, feeling

653
00:37:27,200 --> 00:37:29,919
Speaker 1: good in your clothes, feeling to the point where you're

654
00:37:29,920 --> 00:37:32,839
Speaker 1: not thinking about what you're eating or how much you're

655
00:37:32,880 --> 00:37:36,000
Speaker 1: exercising because you're getting enough. That's the key right there,

656
00:37:36,040 --> 00:37:40,120
Speaker 1: that's the goal. Yeah, So let's talk about social pressure

657
00:37:40,120 --> 00:37:41,880
Speaker 1: because that's kind of we're right in the middle of it.

658
00:37:42,800 --> 00:37:45,960
Speaker 1: Um well, actually, let's take a break. Okay, I'm gonna

659
00:37:46,000 --> 00:37:49,640
Speaker 1: go do some crunches, right, I'm gonna hold your feet down,

660
00:37:49,920 --> 00:37:52,360
Speaker 1: and we're gonna we're gonna talk about social pressure right

661
00:37:52,520 --> 00:38:18,879
Speaker 1: for this, So Chuck, those were pretty good. Crunches bad,

662
00:38:19,280 --> 00:38:21,880
Speaker 1: not bad at all. I'm gonna go with a B plus.

663
00:38:22,120 --> 00:38:25,120
Speaker 1: You know I started seeing a trainer, did you really? Yeah,

664
00:38:25,680 --> 00:38:27,680
Speaker 1: well that's pretty cool, man. I didn't know that. So,

665
00:38:27,920 --> 00:38:30,560
Speaker 1: like about a month then like like kind of cool

666
00:38:30,640 --> 00:38:34,279
Speaker 1: and supportive or like drill instructor type, like army. Well

667
00:38:34,360 --> 00:38:37,640
Speaker 1: she has former army funny enough, but she is cool

668
00:38:37,680 --> 00:38:39,920
Speaker 1: and supportive and more than anything, it's just like I

669
00:38:39,960 --> 00:38:41,880
Speaker 1: gotta show up at her house three days a week

670
00:38:42,280 --> 00:38:45,040
Speaker 1: and do it and I can't. You know, I can't

671
00:38:45,120 --> 00:38:47,200
Speaker 1: not do it. And that's I am one person who

672
00:38:47,239 --> 00:38:49,920
Speaker 1: will not do it if given any opportunity to not

673
00:38:50,000 --> 00:38:52,239
Speaker 1: do it. Yeah, it's so easy to just shirk on

674
00:38:52,280 --> 00:38:55,120
Speaker 1: that kind of stuff and just you know, there's always

675
00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:57,120
Speaker 1: reasons to not go or not do it or whatever.

676
00:38:57,200 --> 00:38:59,640
Speaker 1: But if you have somebody there then like, you know,

677
00:39:00,080 --> 00:39:02,879
Speaker 1: motivating you, that definitely helps. YEA, Thanks, good for you, man.

678
00:39:02,960 --> 00:39:05,920
Speaker 1: Thanks dude. It's she's killing me, she's kicking my butt,

679
00:39:06,960 --> 00:39:10,880
Speaker 1: but it's it's what I need right now. So one

680
00:39:10,920 --> 00:39:13,560
Speaker 1: of those two, admittedly throwing it out there, I'll give

681
00:39:13,560 --> 00:39:17,560
Speaker 1: you a number. Michelle, She's great. So, uh, social pressures

682
00:39:17,600 --> 00:39:21,000
Speaker 1: we're talking about, Uh, you know, this is from a

683
00:39:21,040 --> 00:39:25,320
Speaker 1: Western point of view here in the United States, uh, Canada,

684
00:39:26,160 --> 00:39:29,720
Speaker 1: some places in Europe, although that can vary pretty pretty

685
00:39:29,719 --> 00:39:32,840
Speaker 1: greatly on how they look at their bodies there, but

686
00:39:32,960 --> 00:39:39,320
Speaker 1: definitely in the United States, our culture has demonstrably said

687
00:39:39,920 --> 00:39:43,879
Speaker 1: loud and clear thin as in, you've got to be skinny,

688
00:39:43,920 --> 00:39:50,200
Speaker 1: whether it's TV or advertising or Instagram now or YouTube. Um,

689
00:39:50,239 --> 00:39:52,600
Speaker 1: it's starting to change a little bit more because there's

690
00:39:52,719 --> 00:39:55,480
Speaker 1: there's another whole wave that I was talking about about

691
00:39:55,480 --> 00:40:00,000
Speaker 1: accepting your accepting yourself and being happy with whatever side

692
00:40:00,080 --> 00:40:03,239
Speaker 1: you are. But that still can't counter the onslaught that

693
00:40:03,280 --> 00:40:05,840
Speaker 1: has happened for decades and decades in this country. No,

694
00:40:06,000 --> 00:40:08,359
Speaker 1: but it is gratifying to see it changing over time,

695
00:40:08,440 --> 00:40:11,759
Speaker 1: Like you see like plus size models everywhere, like they

696
00:40:11,760 --> 00:40:14,520
Speaker 1: don't there's not like some big right up in people

697
00:40:14,560 --> 00:40:18,080
Speaker 1: about how this daring um company clothing company used to

698
00:40:18,120 --> 00:40:20,919
Speaker 1: plus size modeling, where it's just become a normal thing. Yes,

699
00:40:21,200 --> 00:40:24,360
Speaker 1: it's becoming normalized. I think that's a big, big component

700
00:40:24,360 --> 00:40:26,920
Speaker 1: because a lot of people point to the mass media

701
00:40:27,360 --> 00:40:31,200
Speaker 1: in the West as the main driver for eating disorders

702
00:40:31,239 --> 00:40:36,719
Speaker 1: because they say this is the ideal weight, body mass index, UM,

703
00:40:36,960 --> 00:40:41,279
Speaker 1: body fat percentage, go attained to this, do whatever you

704
00:40:41,320 --> 00:40:42,919
Speaker 1: need to do to get here, and if you don't,

705
00:40:42,960 --> 00:40:46,680
Speaker 1: you're an ug face. Right. What I think is super

706
00:40:46,719 --> 00:40:50,879
Speaker 1: interesting about this um because everyone knows that it's like yeah, sure,

707
00:40:50,920 --> 00:40:56,040
Speaker 1: ads and models and and Instagram like that's that's stuff

708
00:40:56,080 --> 00:41:01,160
Speaker 1: you should know, chump change. But what's really interesting is

709
00:41:01,360 --> 00:41:03,480
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, we're not enlightening anyone as to

710
00:41:03,719 --> 00:41:05,879
Speaker 1: that's not breaking news. Oh, I got what you meant,

711
00:41:05,960 --> 00:41:09,600
Speaker 1: But uh, what's really interesting to me is to look

712
00:41:09,680 --> 00:41:14,080
Speaker 1: at all, right, if it is media, what about pre television,

713
00:41:14,719 --> 00:41:18,600
Speaker 1: like has this stuff increased? Or what about non Western cultures?

714
00:41:18,640 --> 00:41:20,719
Speaker 1: What about if someone were to move over here from

715
00:41:20,760 --> 00:41:25,279
Speaker 1: another country where Antorexi isn't very prevalent um, how would

716
00:41:25,320 --> 00:41:29,480
Speaker 1: they change? And it appears that that does have an impact.

717
00:41:30,200 --> 00:41:33,200
Speaker 1: It does, but not like h Night and Day kind

718
00:41:33,239 --> 00:41:36,080
Speaker 1: of thing like you expect, Like the studies aren't just

719
00:41:36,160 --> 00:41:39,279
Speaker 1: backing one another up left and right to where yes,

720
00:41:39,320 --> 00:41:42,040
Speaker 1: it's the mass media, and that doesn't necessarily mean it's

721
00:41:42,080 --> 00:41:44,640
Speaker 1: not the mass media. It just means that they haven't

722
00:41:44,640 --> 00:41:48,160
Speaker 1: figured out how to control for all these confounding factors

723
00:41:48,200 --> 00:41:51,000
Speaker 1: that also come along with something like moving to the

724
00:41:51,080 --> 00:41:54,239
Speaker 1: US as an immigrant um and all the things that

725
00:41:54,239 --> 00:41:57,360
Speaker 1: that come along with it in addition to being exposed

726
00:41:57,360 --> 00:42:00,800
Speaker 1: to Western mass media. Or you know what else changed

727
00:42:00,840 --> 00:42:04,279
Speaker 1: over time? Well, we got richer, food, got cheaper, junk

728
00:42:04,320 --> 00:42:07,040
Speaker 1: food became more abundant. Maybe that has something to do

729
00:42:07,080 --> 00:42:09,280
Speaker 1: with it and not just you know this this growing

730
00:42:09,320 --> 00:42:12,240
Speaker 1: of mass media in the middle to late twentieth century.

731
00:42:12,280 --> 00:42:14,879
Speaker 1: So there's a lot of studies that do say, yes,

732
00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:17,279
Speaker 1: there does seem to be a correlation, just there's never

733
00:42:17,320 --> 00:42:19,040
Speaker 1: been a smoking gun. It's like the same thing with

734
00:42:19,160 --> 00:42:23,279
Speaker 1: violence in in media or sex in media. Like the

735
00:42:23,280 --> 00:42:25,840
Speaker 1: the idea that the media just has no effect on

736
00:42:25,920 --> 00:42:29,600
Speaker 1: us whatsoever is is ridiculous to me. But I also

737
00:42:29,640 --> 00:42:32,399
Speaker 1: suspect it doesn't have quite the pronounced effect on us

738
00:42:32,400 --> 00:42:35,640
Speaker 1: that we like to think or just assume. Yeah, they're

739
00:42:35,680 --> 00:42:37,640
Speaker 1: like you said, they're just so many factors you can't

740
00:42:37,840 --> 00:42:40,160
Speaker 1: UM control all of them. But there are a couple

741
00:42:40,200 --> 00:42:43,319
Speaker 1: of interesting findings. This one study, they found a rate

742
00:42:43,320 --> 00:42:47,279
Speaker 1: of eating disorders UH in places like Iran, Singapore, and

743
00:42:47,360 --> 00:42:52,520
Speaker 1: Japan UM increased among women who were exposed to Western culture,

744
00:42:52,560 --> 00:42:54,479
Speaker 1: either by being there for a little while or living

745
00:42:54,480 --> 00:42:56,520
Speaker 1: there for a little while, even if it was just

746
00:42:56,560 --> 00:43:00,440
Speaker 1: a vacation, or through media. And another one found that

747
00:43:00,560 --> 00:43:03,960
Speaker 1: UM women who were at least one generation removed from

748
00:43:03,960 --> 00:43:07,560
Speaker 1: immigration into Canada thought about dieting more than women who

749
00:43:07,560 --> 00:43:11,719
Speaker 1: were immigrants themselves. Yeah, and and dieting behavior is UM

750
00:43:11,760 --> 00:43:14,880
Speaker 1: a very Western thing, and it's starting to spread elsewhere.

751
00:43:14,880 --> 00:43:17,480
Speaker 1: Like there's countries like Egypt and Iran and Japan and

752
00:43:17,600 --> 00:43:22,080
Speaker 1: China UM where they're studying to notice eating disorders UM

753
00:43:22,239 --> 00:43:25,520
Speaker 1: that are they're considered non Western cultures. But there again

754
00:43:25,560 --> 00:43:28,400
Speaker 1: they're like, well, has the Western media kind of infiltrated

755
00:43:28,440 --> 00:43:31,080
Speaker 1: those spaces more or is it people who have spent

756
00:43:31,160 --> 00:43:33,360
Speaker 1: time in the West who are now coming back home

757
00:43:33,800 --> 00:43:36,320
Speaker 1: and they've developed a neating disorder? What is it exactly?

758
00:43:36,600 --> 00:43:39,040
Speaker 1: But there's a really big point to this that I

759
00:43:39,080 --> 00:43:44,520
Speaker 1: think is easily overlooked. Is if if it is the

760
00:43:44,560 --> 00:43:48,960
Speaker 1: Western media and it is something like saying, here's this

761
00:43:49,000 --> 00:43:51,719
Speaker 1: ideal body image, get to it. However, you have to

762
00:43:52,360 --> 00:43:55,840
Speaker 1: a lot of people in the West engage in diets

763
00:43:56,360 --> 00:43:59,760
Speaker 1: and basically everybody in the West is exposed to that media.

764
00:44:00,080 --> 00:44:03,480
Speaker 1: And yet less than five percent of people in the

765
00:44:03,560 --> 00:44:06,719
Speaker 1: United States will ever develop an eating disorder in their lifetime.

766
00:44:07,280 --> 00:44:10,320
Speaker 1: Why isn't it more prevalent if it's just the media

767
00:44:10,520 --> 00:44:13,279
Speaker 1: or just trying to diet? You know, what is it

768
00:44:13,360 --> 00:44:15,560
Speaker 1: that makes that extra step? And that, I think is

769
00:44:15,600 --> 00:44:20,919
Speaker 1: where that um bio psycho component comes into the biopsychosocial thing.

770
00:44:21,120 --> 00:44:24,880
Speaker 1: I think it's just kind of like a triple whammy

771
00:44:24,920 --> 00:44:28,240
Speaker 1: that gets some people just right who may be genetically predisposed,

772
00:44:28,480 --> 00:44:31,759
Speaker 1: who who maybe um psychologically predisposed, and then the right

773
00:44:31,800 --> 00:44:35,640
Speaker 1: combination of social factors all converge to make somebody develop

774
00:44:35,640 --> 00:44:39,200
Speaker 1: an orrexa or bolimia. Yeah, if you're an athlete, Um,

775
00:44:39,200 --> 00:44:42,600
Speaker 1: this is interesting because you can have medical complications as

776
00:44:42,640 --> 00:44:46,719
Speaker 1: an athlete who has to drop weight. Um. Either you know,

777
00:44:46,800 --> 00:44:50,120
Speaker 1: some some sports you you have to have a lower weight,

778
00:44:50,160 --> 00:44:52,719
Speaker 1: like if you're a dancer or a jockey or a

779
00:44:52,719 --> 00:44:56,040
Speaker 1: gymnast or something like that. Other times, like if you're

780
00:44:56,040 --> 00:44:57,840
Speaker 1: a wrestler you have to make a certain weight or

781
00:44:57,880 --> 00:45:00,960
Speaker 1: a boxer a weight class. And this is not the

782
00:45:01,040 --> 00:45:03,960
Speaker 1: same thing. I mean that it can be unhealthy weight loss.

783
00:45:04,280 --> 00:45:07,759
Speaker 1: It's not the same thing necessarily as anorexia. But it

784
00:45:07,800 --> 00:45:11,719
Speaker 1: looks like that could be a trigger for uh, anorexia,

785
00:45:11,920 --> 00:45:15,239
Speaker 1: you know, after you stop your athletic career. Yeah, it's

786
00:45:15,280 --> 00:45:18,240
Speaker 1: like that part in um, what was that that Channing

787
00:45:18,280 --> 00:45:21,399
Speaker 1: Tatum Steve Carell movie set in the eighties where he's

788
00:45:21,440 --> 00:45:26,160
Speaker 1: the wrestler. Oh yeah, the Fox whatever Yeah, Fox Hawk

789
00:45:26,280 --> 00:45:30,799
Speaker 1: or something like that. Anyway, where that part where he

790
00:45:30,840 --> 00:45:33,880
Speaker 1: loses a match and he goes and just binges, and

791
00:45:33,920 --> 00:45:36,279
Speaker 1: I think his brother comes up and makes him like

792
00:45:36,400 --> 00:45:39,600
Speaker 1: throw up because he's gotta keep wrestling and he needs

793
00:45:39,640 --> 00:45:43,000
Speaker 1: to make that that class, that weight class. So the

794
00:45:43,040 --> 00:45:46,040
Speaker 1: idea that that some people who engage in these sports

795
00:45:46,400 --> 00:45:50,279
Speaker 1: kind of internalize that idea and that behavior and can

796
00:45:50,360 --> 00:45:55,000
Speaker 1: become anorexic or um belimic. Uh. That like that just

797
00:45:55,120 --> 00:45:58,160
Speaker 1: kind of makes uttering complete sense. Yeah, same with the

798
00:45:58,280 --> 00:46:00,560
Speaker 1: army too, or not just the army, but the military

799
00:46:01,000 --> 00:46:04,359
Speaker 1: where they have you know, weigh ends and fitness benchmarks.

800
00:46:04,760 --> 00:46:07,600
Speaker 1: If you miss those, you're in big trouble. So people

801
00:46:07,640 --> 00:46:11,400
Speaker 1: will engage in this this kind of eating disorder like behavior,

802
00:46:11,719 --> 00:46:14,600
Speaker 1: but they don't necessarily develop in eating disorder, although some

803
00:46:14,640 --> 00:46:17,279
Speaker 1: people go on to do just that. Yeah, it says

804
00:46:17,360 --> 00:46:19,640
Speaker 1: there's this there's one study that found enrolling in the

805
00:46:19,680 --> 00:46:24,400
Speaker 1: military led to an increase and eating disorders. Yeah, it's interesting,

806
00:46:24,640 --> 00:46:27,719
Speaker 1: um and true stuff. He should know. Fashion. We'll talk

807
00:46:27,719 --> 00:46:31,560
Speaker 1: about history here at the end, because I think all

808
00:46:31,560 --> 00:46:34,520
Speaker 1: the other stuff was probably more important than the history

809
00:46:34,640 --> 00:46:37,000
Speaker 1: and who first named it, but we like to cover

810
00:46:37,040 --> 00:46:42,280
Speaker 1: our bases. And Anorexia nervosa was named by Sir William Gull.

811
00:46:42,960 --> 00:46:46,880
Speaker 1: He was Queen Victoria's doctor, and he published a paper

812
00:46:46,920 --> 00:46:49,359
Speaker 1: and this was, well, you're just walking my past, like

813
00:46:49,360 --> 00:46:52,279
Speaker 1: one of the most interesting facts of the podcast. You

814
00:46:52,360 --> 00:46:55,200
Speaker 1: like that fact? Yes, you take it man, I was

815
00:46:55,239 --> 00:47:01,120
Speaker 1: being so generous. Oh, thank you, sir. He uh he

816
00:47:01,360 --> 00:47:04,200
Speaker 1: Sir William Gull is one of the dudes who they

817
00:47:04,400 --> 00:47:07,359
Speaker 1: all right, you think this is interesting? Fine? He may

818
00:47:07,480 --> 00:47:11,040
Speaker 1: or may not have been Jack the Ripper. Yes, this

819
00:47:11,080 --> 00:47:14,400
Speaker 1: guy who coined the term anorexia, was one of the

820
00:47:14,520 --> 00:47:19,040
Speaker 1: first to to describe it in a scientific paper, is

821
00:47:19,080 --> 00:47:22,080
Speaker 1: also one of the one of the people that is

822
00:47:22,120 --> 00:47:24,960
Speaker 1: liked for Jack the Ripper. Yeah, you just said it again.

823
00:47:25,040 --> 00:47:28,160
Speaker 1: So why did I even bother because you didn't You

824
00:47:28,200 --> 00:47:31,560
Speaker 1: didn't enjoy it enough, you didn't relish it enough. Okay,

825
00:47:31,640 --> 00:47:34,880
Speaker 1: I got you. So Jack the Ripper published a paper,

826
00:47:35,760 --> 00:47:39,120
Speaker 1: uh in eighteen seventy three, and this is after treating

827
00:47:39,640 --> 00:47:43,360
Speaker 1: young women who, by all appearances had anorexia what we

828
00:47:43,400 --> 00:47:45,759
Speaker 1: now know is anorexia, right, And you could tell it

829
00:47:45,800 --> 00:47:48,200
Speaker 1: was he was Jack the Ripper because the paper started

830
00:47:48,320 --> 00:47:54,280
Speaker 1: dear boss, how long have you been sitting on that one, buddy?

831
00:47:54,360 --> 00:47:57,200
Speaker 1: That just came up right now? Yeah? Why does this

832
00:47:57,239 --> 00:48:01,759
Speaker 1: say dear boss on your paper? So? Uh? He had

833
00:48:02,120 --> 00:48:05,040
Speaker 1: drawings in there. Um, eventually he had photos in there

834
00:48:05,200 --> 00:48:09,240
Speaker 1: before and after treatments, and um, just like us today,

835
00:48:09,480 --> 00:48:12,880
Speaker 1: he was uncertain about the nature of the disorder to

836
00:48:12,920 --> 00:48:16,440
Speaker 1: begin with. Um, what we do know historically is the

837
00:48:16,520 --> 00:48:19,920
Speaker 1: nineteen seventies here in America is where it really kind

838
00:48:19,920 --> 00:48:22,560
Speaker 1: of became a big thing. And thanks to a couple

839
00:48:22,600 --> 00:48:25,359
Speaker 1: of things. In nineteen seventy eight, there was a very

840
00:48:25,400 --> 00:48:31,480
Speaker 1: popular book published by Hilda Brutsch, the Golden Cage Colon

841
00:48:31,920 --> 00:48:38,880
Speaker 1: the Enigma of Anorexia Nervosa and obviously and super sad Um.

842
00:48:39,160 --> 00:48:43,680
Speaker 1: Karen Carpenter was the face of anorexia in America, and

843
00:48:43,760 --> 00:48:46,520
Speaker 1: America got to see her struggle off and on with

844
00:48:46,560 --> 00:48:51,440
Speaker 1: this for years until she died from complications from anorex

845
00:48:51,640 --> 00:48:55,120
Speaker 1: in nine eight three. Yeah, she died basically from oregon

846
00:48:55,200 --> 00:48:58,239
Speaker 1: failure from drinking too much ipecac over the course of

847
00:48:58,239 --> 00:49:00,680
Speaker 1: her life. It was a big deal in the United States.

848
00:49:00,680 --> 00:49:02,360
Speaker 1: I mean that really put it on the map in

849
00:49:02,400 --> 00:49:04,799
Speaker 1: a big, big way. Yeah. So there is like, if

850
00:49:04,800 --> 00:49:07,160
Speaker 1: there's a silver lining to the death of Karen Carpenter,

851
00:49:07,200 --> 00:49:09,080
Speaker 1: and there are very few of those. And if you're

852
00:49:09,120 --> 00:49:11,160
Speaker 1: too young to know who Karen Carpenters, do yourself a

853
00:49:11,200 --> 00:49:14,279
Speaker 1: favor and go look up the Carpenters right now and

854
00:49:14,320 --> 00:49:17,440
Speaker 1: have fun listening to that. Yeah. But ipocac is an

855
00:49:17,440 --> 00:49:19,520
Speaker 1: a medic, which means you drink it and it makes

856
00:49:19,520 --> 00:49:22,160
Speaker 1: you throw up. And for the twentieth century, maybe even

857
00:49:22,200 --> 00:49:25,720
Speaker 1: the nineteenth century, to doctors recommended parents keep that stuff

858
00:49:25,719 --> 00:49:28,279
Speaker 1: around their house. So if they're dumb little kid, you know,

859
00:49:28,680 --> 00:49:31,320
Speaker 1: rat poison under the sink, you've give them some ipocactu

860
00:49:31,360 --> 00:49:33,359
Speaker 1: they throw it up in their life would be safe. Well,

861
00:49:33,360 --> 00:49:36,600
Speaker 1: they started to realize, especially after Karen Carpenter, that this

862
00:49:36,719 --> 00:49:41,080
Speaker 1: epocac serve was being abused by UM and XIA patients

863
00:49:41,080 --> 00:49:44,680
Speaker 1: and believe me, A patients all over the US. And

864
00:49:44,719 --> 00:49:48,800
Speaker 1: they apparently called for a band on over the counter

865
00:49:48,840 --> 00:49:53,040
Speaker 1: sales of ipocac, and that directly came from Karen Carpenter's death.

866
00:49:53,239 --> 00:49:55,520
Speaker 1: But I didn't see that it actually ever went through.

867
00:49:55,920 --> 00:49:58,839
Speaker 1: Oh really, Yeah, as as recently as two thousand three

868
00:49:58,880 --> 00:50:02,960
Speaker 1: they were calling for a ban on non prescription epocac sales.

869
00:50:03,440 --> 00:50:06,920
Speaker 1: And unless over the counter and non prescription are not

870
00:50:06,960 --> 00:50:09,560
Speaker 1: the same thing, then no, they didn't get it pushed through.

871
00:50:10,520 --> 00:50:13,160
Speaker 1: Can you buy it today? Do you know at all? Yeah?

872
00:50:13,200 --> 00:50:15,399
Speaker 1: I mean I believe at the very least you could

873
00:50:15,400 --> 00:50:18,399
Speaker 1: get it from a pharmacist, but I think you might

874
00:50:18,440 --> 00:50:21,320
Speaker 1: be able to still buy it in a in a

875
00:50:21,400 --> 00:50:24,040
Speaker 1: drug store. I'm not sure. I haven't tried, and this

876
00:50:24,120 --> 00:50:26,400
Speaker 1: was two thousand three, but I didn't see anything about

877
00:50:26,400 --> 00:50:30,520
Speaker 1: it actually being banned. Well, I just really quickly as

878
00:50:30,560 --> 00:50:33,520
Speaker 1: you can see here two thousand eight as an article

879
00:50:33,560 --> 00:50:40,080
Speaker 1: called epochac the most dangerous over the counter drug. So um. Interesting. Yeah,

880
00:50:40,120 --> 00:50:44,120
Speaker 1: so they've basically just in to that tarnished Karen Carpenter's memory.

881
00:50:45,560 --> 00:50:49,000
Speaker 1: So treatment is tough because, like we said, there are

882
00:50:49,000 --> 00:50:51,759
Speaker 1: so many prongs, um, and we don't want to be

883
00:50:51,800 --> 00:50:55,200
Speaker 1: down on it, because you can overcome this. But the

884
00:50:55,400 --> 00:50:59,640
Speaker 1: obviously the end goal is is multi pronged as well.

885
00:50:59,680 --> 00:51:03,960
Speaker 1: What obviously you want just physically is um to eat

886
00:51:03,960 --> 00:51:07,560
Speaker 1: healthily again, um. But another big part of that is

887
00:51:07,640 --> 00:51:10,439
Speaker 1: to feel better about yourself and to have a better

888
00:51:11,160 --> 00:51:14,400
Speaker 1: self image and to overcome this mental illness that's the

889
00:51:14,480 --> 00:51:18,799
Speaker 1: underlying cause of these physical symptoms. Yeah. UM, if you

890
00:51:18,880 --> 00:51:21,520
Speaker 1: have a friend or a loved one or somebody you

891
00:51:21,600 --> 00:51:26,839
Speaker 1: care about that has anorexia UM or bulimia UM, one

892
00:51:26,880 --> 00:51:29,080
Speaker 1: of the things you can do is just be supportive

893
00:51:29,200 --> 00:51:32,520
Speaker 1: and non judgmental in the hopes of, like you were saying,

894
00:51:32,600 --> 00:51:34,840
Speaker 1: kind of help build their self esteem because it is

895
00:51:34,880 --> 00:51:37,320
Speaker 1: definitely a crisis of self esteem is a big component

896
00:51:37,400 --> 00:51:39,759
Speaker 1: of it. But what you don't want to do is

897
00:51:39,840 --> 00:51:43,960
Speaker 1: make them feel bad or shameful for not eating. Um.

898
00:51:44,040 --> 00:51:47,200
Speaker 1: You don't want to focus on the food because it's

899
00:51:47,239 --> 00:51:49,160
Speaker 1: really not the food. The food is almost like a

900
00:51:49,200 --> 00:51:54,399
Speaker 1: convenient UM. Basically, the food is the one thing that, say,

901
00:51:54,440 --> 00:51:57,160
Speaker 1: a teenage girl can control in her life in some

902
00:51:57,239 --> 00:52:00,600
Speaker 1: cases how much she eats or doesn't eat, and this

903
00:52:00,719 --> 00:52:04,719
Speaker 1: becomes manifested in interacts the nervosa. So the idea that

904
00:52:04,719 --> 00:52:07,120
Speaker 1: that no, just eat the food. What's your problem with food?

905
00:52:07,200 --> 00:52:08,920
Speaker 1: It really doesn't have much to do with the food.

906
00:52:09,160 --> 00:52:11,720
Speaker 1: The food is just this um kind of red herring

907
00:52:11,760 --> 00:52:14,160
Speaker 1: in the whole thing. Yeah, the food is almost like

908
00:52:14,200 --> 00:52:18,320
Speaker 1: the drug, except the ideas to not take the drug.

909
00:52:18,360 --> 00:52:22,719
Speaker 1: If that makes any sense. It does not. I thought

910
00:52:22,719 --> 00:52:24,560
Speaker 1: that was making sense as it was coming out of

911
00:52:24,600 --> 00:52:26,840
Speaker 1: my mouth. I started to realize it didn't. Right up

912
00:52:26,880 --> 00:52:30,680
Speaker 1: to the end. Uh, treating it is can be done

913
00:52:30,719 --> 00:52:34,560
Speaker 1: on an outpatient basis. UM. They have high calorie supplements,

914
00:52:34,800 --> 00:52:39,439
Speaker 1: dietary recommendations. Obviously, UM, if you have serious medical complications,

915
00:52:39,480 --> 00:52:42,359
Speaker 1: you might have to have a hospital stay. But they

916
00:52:42,360 --> 00:52:46,000
Speaker 1: have shown that just putting someone in the hospital has

917
00:52:46,040 --> 00:52:49,080
Speaker 1: no improvement on the outcome of their mental health. Like

918
00:52:49,120 --> 00:52:52,439
Speaker 1: you've you've really have to attack it from all angles. Yeah,

919
00:52:52,440 --> 00:52:54,400
Speaker 1: and that's a big problem too. Is like when you

920
00:52:54,680 --> 00:52:58,560
Speaker 1: have a medical like medical issues like a low pulse

921
00:52:59,200 --> 00:53:02,480
Speaker 1: UM and you you are say emaciated, like they're going

922
00:53:02,560 --> 00:53:04,600
Speaker 1: to take you the hospital, and the doctors are not

923
00:53:04,640 --> 00:53:09,040
Speaker 1: necessarily psychologists or psychiatrists. Their doctors who are going to

924
00:53:09,120 --> 00:53:13,640
Speaker 1: try to treat your emaciation or treat your low pulse UM.

925
00:53:13,760 --> 00:53:16,600
Speaker 1: And that's good, you need that kind of treatment, but

926
00:53:16,640 --> 00:53:20,520
Speaker 1: it doesn't actually heal the anorexia at all. UM. So

927
00:53:20,560 --> 00:53:23,200
Speaker 1: there has to be a multi pronged approach. And in particular,

928
00:53:23,239 --> 00:53:26,359
Speaker 1: if you do need to be nourished, like you're at

929
00:53:26,400 --> 00:53:28,920
Speaker 1: death store because you haven't eaten and too long and

930
00:53:29,000 --> 00:53:31,400
Speaker 1: your body has become malnourished in your organs are starting

931
00:53:31,440 --> 00:53:35,440
Speaker 1: to fail um, you have to go to a specialist

932
00:53:35,520 --> 00:53:37,560
Speaker 1: in this because I think we talked about in the

933
00:53:37,560 --> 00:53:42,080
Speaker 1: Angus Barbieri short stuff the idea of refeeding syndrome, where

934
00:53:42,120 --> 00:53:45,399
Speaker 1: if you introduce nutrients too quickly to somebody who hasn't

935
00:53:45,440 --> 00:53:48,920
Speaker 1: eaten in too long, they can die basically from overdosing

936
00:53:48,920 --> 00:53:51,440
Speaker 1: on nutrients. So you have to go to a specialist

937
00:53:51,480 --> 00:53:54,200
Speaker 1: in in refeeding. It's not just something that anybody can do.

938
00:53:54,560 --> 00:53:57,879
Speaker 1: The ideally you will catch this long before you could

939
00:53:57,880 --> 00:54:01,640
Speaker 1: die from refeeding syndrome or anything like that. But it is,

940
00:54:01,760 --> 00:54:03,840
Speaker 1: it is. It is a concern in an issue that

941
00:54:03,880 --> 00:54:07,239
Speaker 1: you would want to go to a specialist physician for refeating. Yeah,

942
00:54:07,239 --> 00:54:09,359
Speaker 1: and it's um we were talking about parents earlier too.

943
00:54:09,400 --> 00:54:13,280
Speaker 1: It's also interesting that early on Gull and this continued

944
00:54:13,320 --> 00:54:15,960
Speaker 1: for a while, UM felt that you know, the parents

945
00:54:16,640 --> 00:54:18,719
Speaker 1: were could be a big part of the problem in

946
00:54:18,760 --> 00:54:22,840
Speaker 1: this negative influence, especially if like it's all of a

947
00:54:22,880 --> 00:54:25,520
Speaker 1: sudden it is being treated and parents like, you know,

948
00:54:25,560 --> 00:54:26,840
Speaker 1: you need to eat and need to eat this, you

949
00:54:26,840 --> 00:54:29,520
Speaker 1: need to eat that. Uh. And so they would they

950
00:54:29,520 --> 00:54:32,239
Speaker 1: would move kids out of the home in order to

951
00:54:32,280 --> 00:54:35,160
Speaker 1: treat them more successfully because a lot of times the

952
00:54:35,239 --> 00:54:38,040
Speaker 1: parents were contributing to the the whole cause. And to

953
00:54:38,160 --> 00:54:40,880
Speaker 1: begin with, you know, yep, they would call that a

954
00:54:40,920 --> 00:54:46,239
Speaker 1: parent ectomy. Oh really, yeah, that's what Goal called it. UM.

955
00:54:46,440 --> 00:54:49,560
Speaker 1: And so that's like one theory of treatment that the

956
00:54:49,600 --> 00:54:51,040
Speaker 1: parents are the problem and you need to get the

957
00:54:51,120 --> 00:54:53,920
Speaker 1: kid away from the parents, not not like get them

958
00:54:53,920 --> 00:54:56,480
Speaker 1: into foster care or anything like that, but more that

959
00:54:56,600 --> 00:54:59,680
Speaker 1: the the kids are are being oppressed in some wave

960
00:55:00,080 --> 00:55:04,480
Speaker 1: by the parents. And Hilda Brooke b r U c H.

961
00:55:04,800 --> 00:55:08,560
Speaker 1: I'm going with Brooke, Um, yeah, the one who wrote

962
00:55:08,600 --> 00:55:12,080
Speaker 1: who wrote The Golden Cage. She concluded that the reason

963
00:55:12,120 --> 00:55:17,799
Speaker 1: for anorexia was that the teenagers were afraid of becoming teenagers,

964
00:55:17,880 --> 00:55:20,440
Speaker 1: that they just pleased the adults in their parents their

965
00:55:20,480 --> 00:55:22,960
Speaker 1: whole life, and they were afraid to kind of venture

966
00:55:23,000 --> 00:55:25,400
Speaker 1: out on their own. Um. And so this was some

967
00:55:25,480 --> 00:55:28,200
Speaker 1: means of control. Maybe I'm not sure, but it definitely

968
00:55:28,200 --> 00:55:30,759
Speaker 1: goes in with that paran ectomy thing where if you

969
00:55:30,840 --> 00:55:34,240
Speaker 1: take the kid out and um teach them to take

970
00:55:34,280 --> 00:55:37,040
Speaker 1: on this disorder on their own, it can really boost

971
00:55:37,040 --> 00:55:40,319
Speaker 1: their self esteem quite a bit and potentially cure anorexia.

972
00:55:40,360 --> 00:55:44,480
Speaker 1: As it is, that's one theory. There's another that basically

973
00:55:44,520 --> 00:55:47,200
Speaker 1: is the opposite. It says, hey, family, let's let's get

974
00:55:47,200 --> 00:55:49,760
Speaker 1: together and help this. That's right, it's like a family therapy.

975
00:55:49,800 --> 00:55:53,880
Speaker 1: It's it's the Maudsley method. And this was based on

976
00:55:54,080 --> 00:56:02,399
Speaker 1: the work of psychiatrist named Salvador, not Maudsley. Salvador uh, Menuchin. Yes,

977
00:56:02,719 --> 00:56:04,960
Speaker 1: it's not the Manuchian method, though no one knows who

978
00:56:05,040 --> 00:56:08,480
Speaker 1: Monsley is. Maybe that was his hotel pseudonym maybe. But

979
00:56:08,640 --> 00:56:10,520
Speaker 1: this is like you said this, and this makes a

980
00:56:10,520 --> 00:56:13,279
Speaker 1: lot of sense to like getting the whole family in there,

981
00:56:13,320 --> 00:56:16,600
Speaker 1: because uh, if you go to therapy as a family

982
00:56:17,120 --> 00:56:22,000
Speaker 1: or as metallica, uh, it's gonna it's gonna bear fruit

983
00:56:22,200 --> 00:56:26,200
Speaker 1: most likely because especially with something like Interrexi and bolimia,

984
00:56:26,280 --> 00:56:29,440
Speaker 1: that's there may be a lot of tendrils throughout your

985
00:56:29,480 --> 00:56:33,680
Speaker 1: family that is, uh is potentially causing some of this

986
00:56:33,760 --> 00:56:36,359
Speaker 1: to begin with. So get mom and dad in there,

987
00:56:36,440 --> 00:56:39,319
Speaker 1: get brothers and sisters in there, and and I'll talk

988
00:56:39,320 --> 00:56:41,959
Speaker 1: it out. It will probably help everyone involved. Get weird

989
00:56:42,040 --> 00:56:45,239
Speaker 1: uncle al in there, oh no, never, just keep him

990
00:56:45,239 --> 00:56:47,759
Speaker 1: at Thanksgiving and keep them quiet. But one of the

991
00:56:47,760 --> 00:56:50,120
Speaker 1: things I saw about that family method is one of

992
00:56:50,120 --> 00:56:53,640
Speaker 1: the techniques to use is called externalizing, where they're saying

993
00:56:53,640 --> 00:56:56,520
Speaker 1: where they basically say, you have an interloper in your

994
00:56:56,560 --> 00:57:00,440
Speaker 1: family known as this eating disorder, and need to come

995
00:57:00,480 --> 00:57:02,960
Speaker 1: together as a family to get this eating disorder out

996
00:57:03,000 --> 00:57:05,920
Speaker 1: of your family. You like, you guys, gang up as

997
00:57:05,960 --> 00:57:08,640
Speaker 1: a family against the eating disorder, not against the person

998
00:57:08,680 --> 00:57:11,520
Speaker 1: with the eating disorder or against one another, getting up

999
00:57:11,520 --> 00:57:13,719
Speaker 1: on the eating disorder and support the person with it

1000
00:57:13,760 --> 00:57:16,760
Speaker 1: to help him right, Which is great. And like we said,

1001
00:57:17,040 --> 00:57:21,600
Speaker 1: you can recover from an eating disorder. JOHNS. Hopkins says

1002
00:57:21,720 --> 00:57:25,840
Speaker 1: that fifty to seventy five of patients with anorexia or

1003
00:57:25,840 --> 00:57:32,400
Speaker 1: bulimia will eventually recover. It's a lot. It's a really

1004
00:57:32,440 --> 00:57:36,520
Speaker 1: great recovery rate for what is ultimately, um a chronic

1005
00:57:36,760 --> 00:57:40,880
Speaker 1: mental disorder. Yeah, and can we shout out a website here? Yeah,

1006
00:57:41,200 --> 00:57:46,040
Speaker 1: there is a website called alsana dot com and it

1007
00:57:46,200 --> 00:57:53,800
Speaker 1: is an eating disorder Helpline of all stripes. So anorexia, bulimia, UM,

1008
00:57:53,880 --> 00:57:56,800
Speaker 1: I imagine bench eating, any kind of eating disorders. You

1009
00:57:56,840 --> 00:57:59,959
Speaker 1: can call eight eight eight eight to two eight nine

1010
00:58:00,040 --> 00:58:02,720
Speaker 1: three eight at any time and someone is going to

1011
00:58:02,800 --> 00:58:05,600
Speaker 1: be there and try and help you out. And you

1012
00:58:05,600 --> 00:58:07,240
Speaker 1: know we talked about all the time, just that first

1013
00:58:07,280 --> 00:58:14,720
Speaker 1: step super crucial. Yep, good job, thanks you too. Uh. Well,

1014
00:58:14,760 --> 00:58:17,080
Speaker 1: if you want to know more about eating disorders like

1015
00:58:17,120 --> 00:58:20,720
Speaker 1: an rexia or bulimia, you can go to where Chuck

1016
00:58:20,760 --> 00:58:22,640
Speaker 1: just sent you, or you pick up the phone and

1017
00:58:22,680 --> 00:58:25,760
Speaker 1: call and uh you can also just hold tight and

1018
00:58:25,760 --> 00:58:28,480
Speaker 1: wait for listener mail, which is coming right now. That's right,

1019
00:58:28,560 --> 00:58:31,000
Speaker 1: And yeah, we we should mention there are there are many, many,

1020
00:58:31,000 --> 00:58:35,760
Speaker 1: many helplines and many organizations. But again, everything I've seen

1021
00:58:35,840 --> 00:58:38,080
Speaker 1: is if you suspect that your friend or loved wine

1022
00:58:38,160 --> 00:58:41,520
Speaker 1: or sister or son or daughter has a eating disorder,

1023
00:58:41,640 --> 00:58:44,240
Speaker 1: like you need to confront it. They don't just clear

1024
00:58:44,320 --> 00:58:47,240
Speaker 1: up on their own. And it's not just a lifestyle choice. Yeah,

1025
00:58:47,280 --> 00:58:51,920
Speaker 1: that's right. The National Eating Disorder Helpline is another one

1026
00:58:50,800 --> 00:58:55,160
Speaker 1: E two to seven. N's to put that in our

1027
00:58:55,160 --> 00:58:58,240
Speaker 1: in our slogan or motto on the T shirt. Well,

1028
00:58:58,240 --> 00:59:01,120
Speaker 1: how about this, UH have a great listener mail today.

1029
00:59:01,160 --> 00:59:04,320
Speaker 1: So let's just encourage everyone to look out for their

1030
00:59:04,360 --> 00:59:07,080
Speaker 1: friends and family. And if you have someone in your

1031
00:59:07,120 --> 00:59:09,000
Speaker 1: family that you think may be suffering from one of

1032
00:59:09,000 --> 00:59:14,480
Speaker 1: these disorders, then UH reach out to them with compassion.

1033
00:59:14,960 --> 00:59:16,640
Speaker 1: And if you have one of these disorders, call one

1034
00:59:16,680 --> 00:59:19,160
Speaker 1: of those numbers and just take that first step toward

1035
00:59:19,200 --> 00:59:22,240
Speaker 1: getting some help. Yeah, very nice, Chuck, Thanks. I think

1036
00:59:22,280 --> 00:59:24,760
Speaker 1: that was even better than any listener mail. Of course,

1037
00:59:25,120 --> 00:59:27,200
Speaker 1: I've heard a lot of listener mail. Anything is better

1038
00:59:27,200 --> 00:59:31,280
Speaker 1: than listener mail. Tops. We're just kidding. We love listener

1039
00:59:31,320 --> 00:59:32,919
Speaker 1: mail And if you want to get in touch with us,

1040
00:59:32,960 --> 00:59:35,360
Speaker 1: you can go onto stuff you Should Know dot com

1041
00:59:35,400 --> 00:59:37,760
Speaker 1: and we've got all our social links hanging out around there,

1042
00:59:38,080 --> 00:59:40,320
Speaker 1: and you can also send us a good old fashioned email,

1043
00:59:40,600 --> 00:59:42,760
Speaker 1: wrap it up, spank it on the bottom, and send

1044
00:59:42,760 --> 00:59:48,880
Speaker 1: it off to stuff podcast at iHeart radio dot com.

1045
00:59:48,960 --> 00:59:51,120
Speaker 1: Stuff you Should Know is a production of iHeart Radios.

1046
00:59:51,120 --> 00:59:53,680
Speaker 1: How stuff works for more podcasts for my heart Radio

1047
00:59:53,720 --> 00:59:56,320
Speaker 1: because at the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever

1048
00:59:56,360 --> 00:59:57,640
Speaker 1: you listen to your favorite shows,