WEBVTT - How the Underground Railroad Worked 0:00:00.280 --> 0:00:02.840 Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera. 0:00:03.160 --> 0:00:07.560 It's ready. Are you welcome to Stuff you Should Know 0:00:08.160 --> 0:00:16.400 from House Stuff Works dot com? Hey, and welcome to 0:00:16.440 --> 0:00:19.240 the podcast. I'm Josh Clark and with me as always 0:00:19.280 --> 0:00:22.279 as Charles W. Chuck Bryant, which makes this stuff You 0:00:22.320 --> 0:00:25.680 should know the podcast because Chuck and I are the 0:00:25.680 --> 0:00:32.279 hosts of that hostesses no hosts, yep, Chuck, Yes, how 0:00:33.000 --> 0:00:35.560 are you? I'm great, man, How are you? I'm fine. 0:00:35.760 --> 0:00:39.320 It's you and I and Matt our guest producer Maddie 0:00:39.360 --> 0:00:42.839 and alone in this entire building. Yeah. This it's uh, 0:00:42.920 --> 0:00:46.440 the Friday before Memorial Day. Yeah, Friday afternoon even and 0:00:46.479 --> 0:00:50.720 it's pretty empty in here, Yes it is. There's lots 0:00:50.720 --> 0:00:53.040 of echoes that we're gonna have to adjust for and post. 0:00:54.120 --> 0:00:56.160 Do we do post anymore? Is this like basically this 0:00:56.320 --> 0:00:59.720 live to tape? At least we're not getting a hateful 0:00:59.760 --> 0:01:02.920 stay or since we walked through the office. Yeah, it's refreshing, 0:01:05.080 --> 0:01:07.720 so Chuck, as you know, I grew up in Ohio. 0:01:09.040 --> 0:01:10.959 I was hoping you've mentioned this. Well, I grew up 0:01:10.959 --> 0:01:14.800 in Ohio. Your hopes are are fulfilled. Well, another reason 0:01:14.840 --> 0:01:17.720 why well, Um, it turns out I recently learned from 0:01:17.720 --> 0:01:20.520 this article on how the underground Railroad, how the underground 0:01:20.640 --> 0:01:23.640 railroad worked. We talked about how this is gonna be problematic. 0:01:24.319 --> 0:01:31.000 Um that an estimated half of all underground railroad workers. Um, 0:01:31.160 --> 0:01:34.480 we're from Ohio or lived in Ohio. We're part of Ohio. 0:01:34.600 --> 0:01:36.959 I had no idea that, but reading that it makes 0:01:36.959 --> 0:01:40.000 sense because that was such a part of my um 0:01:40.120 --> 0:01:44.160 upbringing as a child. Everybody's house that was built in 0:01:44.319 --> 0:01:48.080 like the nineteenth or eighteenth century had like an oh, 0:01:48.080 --> 0:01:50.280 this is where they kept the freed slaves in the 0:01:50.360 --> 0:01:53.160 underground road road. Everybody's house had like a little spot 0:01:53.240 --> 0:01:57.400 that supposedly was part of the underground road heritage or 0:01:57.640 --> 0:02:01.680 some real some were um are believable than others. But 0:02:01.800 --> 0:02:04.040 normally it was like a public building or like a 0:02:04.160 --> 0:02:07.280 National Historic registered building that like they gave tours to 0:02:07.840 --> 0:02:10.880 that was part of the underground railroad. But like everybody's 0:02:11.040 --> 0:02:14.440 house like had like a little spot in the basement 0:02:14.480 --> 0:02:18.639 where like, yes, consumably human beings could stand here and 0:02:18.639 --> 0:02:20.919 and uh you know, hide out. But yeah, I see, 0:02:20.960 --> 0:02:23.079 I grew up in Georgia, so that we didn't have 0:02:23.120 --> 0:02:27.720 those talks no, And apparently in this article the author 0:02:27.800 --> 0:02:29.720 points out and I don't know where she got this, 0:02:29.840 --> 0:02:34.840 but um, that there's there's still blemishes on families who 0:02:34.840 --> 0:02:37.919 were known to have helped slaves on the underground road 0:02:37.960 --> 0:02:41.200 road in the South still today. I don't know if 0:02:41.200 --> 0:02:43.040 she's talking about I thought that was completely out of 0:02:43.080 --> 0:02:45.840 left field. It was I grew up in and have 0:02:46.000 --> 0:02:48.239 never heard anybody be like, yeah, that guy that lived 0:02:48.240 --> 0:02:52.839 down the street, their family used to hide slaves. Yeah, 0:02:53.040 --> 0:02:56.080 that that's not true. So so, um, but you you 0:02:56.160 --> 0:03:00.200 were familiar with the underground railroad before this article. I was, 0:03:00.280 --> 0:03:02.840 But it's a good time to point out that not 0:03:03.040 --> 0:03:07.520 nearly enough, because black history is so glossed over in 0:03:07.720 --> 0:03:12.119 American schools except in February, except in February, and it's 0:03:12.120 --> 0:03:14.240 still even in February that I went through all my 0:03:14.280 --> 0:03:17.680 schooling with just knowing like there was an underground railroad 0:03:17.720 --> 0:03:22.399 and Harriet Tubman ran it and that's it. Period. Yeah, 0:03:22.720 --> 0:03:25.960 never learned about Malcolm X. I think dread Scott may 0:03:25.960 --> 0:03:28.760 have been mentioned briefly, but yeah, it's very sad. Yeah, 0:03:28.880 --> 0:03:32.160 and hopefully that's changed some since then. Well for the 0:03:32.240 --> 0:03:36.720 listeners who had similar experiences. Um, we're about to remedy 0:03:36.760 --> 0:03:39.480 that because we're gonna tell you not only how it worked, 0:03:39.520 --> 0:03:41.160 we're gonna tell you in so much detail that you 0:03:41.200 --> 0:03:44.240 could conceivably go start your own right now, right. And 0:03:44.280 --> 0:03:48.440 there are some still around today. Yes. Human trafficking is 0:03:48.640 --> 0:03:53.440 the new word for UM slavery basically um where it 0:03:53.560 --> 0:03:58.480 usually it's forced into sex work right um. And there 0:03:58.520 --> 0:04:02.720 are groups who are dedicated to freeing sex workers from 0:04:02.800 --> 0:04:07.040 fourth labor. They're called Polaris, which is renaming of the 0:04:07.040 --> 0:04:12.160 North Star. Yeah. Um. And then and others. We should 0:04:12.160 --> 0:04:14.320 do a podcast on human trafficking. I think we have 0:04:14.360 --> 0:04:17.400 a good article on that that Molly wrote, if I'm 0:04:17.400 --> 0:04:21.120 not mistaken. Oh really yeah, okay, you're ready, Yeah, let's 0:04:21.120 --> 0:04:24.920 do it all right, so chuck. Um. Basically, the the 0:04:24.960 --> 0:04:31.520 origins of the underground railroad, which was the network by 0:04:31.600 --> 0:04:36.120 which escaped slaves ran along to freedom, almost always to 0:04:36.200 --> 0:04:38.720 Canada if they were going north. As it turns out, 0:04:39.080 --> 0:04:46.680 UM probably started before the eighteen twenties. Um, but it 0:04:46.800 --> 0:04:49.480 couldn't have possibly been called the underground road road until 0:04:49.520 --> 0:04:53.320 after the eighteen twenties because the actual railroad system wasn't 0:04:53.360 --> 0:04:55.480 invented until them either that or they were like way 0:04:55.520 --> 0:04:58.040 ahead of their time, but it may have had some 0:04:58.080 --> 0:05:00.360 sort of name. And we know that there were groups 0:05:00.360 --> 0:05:04.760 of people who were formed for the common purpose of 0:05:04.839 --> 0:05:09.279 aiding escaped slaves to go secure freedom, to get out 0:05:09.279 --> 0:05:11.600 of the South, or get out of a slave state 0:05:11.640 --> 0:05:16.799 into protection in a non slave state. Because George Washington 0:05:16.920 --> 0:05:19.599 complained about it in a letter in seventeen eighty six 0:05:19.960 --> 0:05:22.400 that he suspected some Quakers that helped some of his 0:05:22.800 --> 0:05:25.760 slaves escape. He was probably right on the money, tail, yeah, 0:05:25.800 --> 0:05:29.159 because Quakers were one of the earliest members of the 0:05:29.240 --> 0:05:34.560 underground Railroad and they were the um most trusted because 0:05:34.560 --> 0:05:37.360 they were so recognizable and everybody knew, hey, Quakers will 0:05:37.360 --> 0:05:41.240 help you out. Definitely the most trusted white people for sure. Um. 0:05:41.480 --> 0:05:44.840 We but we should probably point out, um, the reason 0:05:45.080 --> 0:05:48.480 everybody went to Canada was because there was a federal 0:05:48.560 --> 0:05:51.520 law in the US. Right, that's right. What was it called. 0:05:51.760 --> 0:05:56.159 It was called the Fugitive Slave Act of seventeen ninety three, 0:05:56.680 --> 0:06:00.599 and uh, it was around since seventeen ninety three, but 0:06:00.640 --> 0:06:02.920 it really got its teeth in eighteen fifty when it's 0:06:02.960 --> 0:06:08.279 strengthened the fines and basically made um helping a slave 0:06:08.440 --> 0:06:12.440 escape a federal crime, and then uh in non slave 0:06:12.480 --> 0:06:16.960 states as well, and uh pretty much meant if you 0:06:17.000 --> 0:06:18.839 were caught as a slave, you were going to be 0:06:18.880 --> 0:06:22.000 put to death and likely tortured in a public place. 0:06:22.640 --> 0:06:26.279 And maybe even your slave family or friends that you 0:06:26.279 --> 0:06:29.640 were with on the plantation were also punished, even though 0:06:29.640 --> 0:06:32.520 they didn't try to escape. So anyone involved in this 0:06:32.839 --> 0:06:35.680 and even not being involved, but being involved by relationship 0:06:35.800 --> 0:06:38.960 or something like that, UM, really had a lot to 0:06:39.120 --> 0:06:42.880 lose from this one person making it to freedom, which 0:06:42.920 --> 0:06:46.400 really um is it's just very heartening when you look 0:06:46.440 --> 0:06:49.400 back on what these people did. They risked a lot. 0:06:49.920 --> 0:06:56.320 Um in the eighteen fifties stiffening of the Slave Act, right, Um, 0:06:56.640 --> 0:07:00.000 if you armed a slave, which was routinely done because 0:07:00.120 --> 0:07:05.040 this is dangerous, UM, then you were subject to execution, 0:07:05.680 --> 0:07:09.000 no matter who you were, white, black, whatever um that 0:07:09.080 --> 0:07:11.360 was that was punishable by being executed. So people who 0:07:11.400 --> 0:07:15.040 were helping escape slaves were putting a lot on the line, 0:07:15.160 --> 0:07:17.040 right Yeah. And and one of the myths, there's a 0:07:17.040 --> 0:07:20.160 few myths that even this article kind of uh perpetuates 0:07:20.160 --> 0:07:24.560 a bit, but um rarely or not rarely, but more 0:07:24.640 --> 0:07:28.280 often than not, they were other black people or former 0:07:28.320 --> 0:07:31.800 slaves or current slaves helping the other slaves on the 0:07:31.880 --> 0:07:34.920 underground railroad. It was not a big happy group of 0:07:34.920 --> 0:07:38.520 white northern abolitionists risking their life to help out the slaves. 0:07:38.760 --> 0:07:42.400 They did that some, but it was usually quakers um 0:07:42.560 --> 0:07:47.120 or you know, like I said before, slaves or former slaves. Okay, 0:07:47.240 --> 0:07:51.120 so that's one myth. There's a few others. Well, let's 0:07:51.120 --> 0:07:53.160 go through this. What what did it an escape look 0:07:53.240 --> 0:07:56.560 like right along the underground railroad during its height in 0:07:56.600 --> 0:08:01.520 the mid nineteenth century. Uh, what would happen was free 0:08:01.760 --> 0:08:04.240 black people would send a field agent, what they called 0:08:04.240 --> 0:08:06.920 the field agent um. It was a lot of times 0:08:06.920 --> 0:08:09.440 a minister or a doctor posing as like a census 0:08:09.440 --> 0:08:13.000 taker to anybody who could move throughout a community undetected. 0:08:13.360 --> 0:08:17.040 So they would make contact with a current slave who 0:08:17.320 --> 0:08:19.960 supposedly wanted to escape, and they had to gain their trust, 0:08:20.080 --> 0:08:23.600 because this whole thing was about trust. You really had 0:08:23.640 --> 0:08:26.680 to trust because people would sell out their own own 0:08:26.760 --> 0:08:31.040 kind to gain favor with with the master sometimes, so 0:08:31.200 --> 0:08:34.000 sometimes you couldn't even trust your fellow slave, so you 0:08:34.000 --> 0:08:35.800 really had to gain their trust as the field agent 0:08:35.840 --> 0:08:38.080 and then they would eventually, once that trust was gained, 0:08:38.480 --> 0:08:43.960 arranged for the escape from the plantation to travel to 0:08:44.440 --> 0:08:48.960 the first safe house to a conductor. Actually, I'm sorry, 0:08:48.960 --> 0:08:51.000 they passed along to the conductor who would take you 0:08:51.040 --> 0:08:54.640 to your first station. Yes, and that was the beginning 0:08:54.840 --> 0:08:58.280 of the journey, right. And the station was basically somebody's 0:08:58.320 --> 0:09:01.440 house usually yeah, um, and the head of the household 0:09:01.440 --> 0:09:04.679 as a station master. And that was somebody who was 0:09:04.720 --> 0:09:08.520 putting his life, in the life of his family's on 0:09:08.600 --> 0:09:12.360 the line, feed and housed and hide this person for 0:09:12.400 --> 0:09:15.559 a little while. Um, possibly set him up with the disguise, 0:09:15.640 --> 0:09:23.440 which um they got fairly Um. Yes, there's there's a 0:09:23.480 --> 0:09:26.440 story of one in a UM apparently with a seminal 0:09:26.480 --> 0:09:30.720 work on the Underground Railroad appropriately titled The Underground Railroad, 0:09:31.080 --> 0:09:35.600 written by Wilburt Sea Bird right, and he talks about how, um, 0:09:35.679 --> 0:09:39.439 a black woman was basically made up to look like 0:09:39.559 --> 0:09:43.120 a wealthy white woman and to complete this disguise, was 0:09:43.160 --> 0:09:48.400 given a white baby, um too for her journey. Yeah. 0:09:48.559 --> 0:09:51.960 So people were, you know, fanatic about this. I read 0:09:52.000 --> 0:09:57.200 another one, UM, a couple from Savannah. Um. The woman 0:09:57.400 --> 0:10:01.800 was the daughter of the slave, her slave owner and 0:10:01.920 --> 0:10:05.720 her mother was a slave, a house servant ever, UM. 0:10:05.760 --> 0:10:09.000 So she was light skinned, so they had her pose 0:10:09.160 --> 0:10:14.040 as a frail, aging white man, and her husband posed 0:10:14.080 --> 0:10:18.200 as like a you know, a loyal servant slave UM 0:10:18.240 --> 0:10:20.400 on their journey all the way from Savanna to I 0:10:20.400 --> 0:10:24.400 think Philadelphia or Boston. UM. But yeah, that was kind 0:10:24.400 --> 0:10:27.319 of harrowing. Apparently they were almost found out a bunch 0:10:27.320 --> 0:10:31.000 of times. Yeah, so I can imagine, like just trying 0:10:31.040 --> 0:10:33.840 to escape through the woods is scary enough, trying to 0:10:34.000 --> 0:10:37.880 escape disguised in plain sight has to just be nerve racking, 0:10:38.520 --> 0:10:41.000 you know, especially the lady with a white baby, because 0:10:41.120 --> 0:10:43.280 I imagine that whoever might have found her out would 0:10:43.320 --> 0:10:45.520 not have been too happy about that at the time. 0:10:45.559 --> 0:10:49.079 At least along the way if you did maybe encounter 0:10:49.120 --> 0:10:51.920 a train conductor who found you out but was willing 0:10:51.960 --> 0:10:55.000 to keep his mouth shut for money, you needed money. 0:10:55.280 --> 0:10:59.280 Most slaves didn't have money because they were not paid um. 0:10:59.440 --> 0:11:04.040 And uh this was I guess at the station. The 0:11:04.080 --> 0:11:06.240 station master might also hook you up with some money 0:11:06.240 --> 0:11:09.760 that came from what are called stockholders UM. And stockholders 0:11:09.760 --> 0:11:12.360 were probably wealthy abolitionists who didn't really want to get 0:11:12.360 --> 0:11:18.480 their hands dirty. But we're happy to support the cause financially. True, right, yeah, 0:11:18.520 --> 0:11:20.440 And I didn't get I mean, were they just people 0:11:20.440 --> 0:11:24.280 who supported the cause basically financially, yeah, but you know 0:11:24.320 --> 0:11:28.280 obviously in their in their hearts as well. Uh, now 0:11:28.280 --> 0:11:30.480 I know what you mean. Though they didn't risk you know, 0:11:30.840 --> 0:11:34.160 walking people through the woods. No. And abolitionists, despite you know, 0:11:34.200 --> 0:11:40.079 they're they're desire to end slavery were frequently accused, and 0:11:40.240 --> 0:11:43.280 rightfully so in a lot of cases of you know, saying, well, 0:11:43.400 --> 0:11:46.960 we we think slavery is vomitable, but you're freed, and 0:11:47.000 --> 0:11:50.079 that's great, but go live over there. We still want 0:11:50.120 --> 0:11:52.480 to just have our very lily white parties and lives 0:11:52.480 --> 0:11:56.240 and all that. Um. And there were a lot of 0:11:56.360 --> 0:11:59.520 abolitions like that. So I would imagine that just giving 0:11:59.559 --> 0:12:03.400 money two people to use for bribes or for travel 0:12:03.559 --> 0:12:07.360 or you know, to support these station houses probably really 0:12:07.480 --> 0:12:09.880 you know, hit home. It's the same thing today, like 0:12:09.920 --> 0:12:12.440 people don't go help like, say, the homeless, you're resolving 0:12:12.440 --> 0:12:16.120 your guilt, they give money to, you know, organizations that 0:12:16.160 --> 0:12:18.360 actually deal with the homeless. I think that this was 0:12:18.440 --> 0:12:21.880 very similar to that. I think you're probably right. Uh, runaways, 0:12:22.200 --> 0:12:26.560 um usually didn't travel alone, although again I read somewhere 0:12:26.559 --> 0:12:28.839 else on on one of the websites that a lot 0:12:28.880 --> 0:12:31.360 of times they were alone. Um, But when they weren't, 0:12:31.360 --> 0:12:33.760 they would have a conductor guide them to the next station, 0:12:34.280 --> 0:12:36.760 usually about a day away. They didn't want to make 0:12:36.800 --> 0:12:38.559 it like, you know, a three day journey because it 0:12:38.720 --> 0:12:40.920 just you know, you you probably don't have tons of 0:12:40.920 --> 0:12:43.000 food and water, and it's just more dangerous the further 0:12:43.040 --> 0:12:46.160 you're going, right, not between station houses. The journey itself 0:12:46.200 --> 0:12:49.960 to freedom last days, weeks, months. Yeah, each each station 0:12:50.040 --> 0:12:53.000 was about a day away. Ideally they would follow the 0:12:53.040 --> 0:12:59.080 north Star. Yeah, that's that's why that one, um modern hilarious. Yeah, 0:12:59.600 --> 0:13:04.200 that's why it's called that circle. When the clouds were out. Um, 0:13:04.280 --> 0:13:07.160 there's the old trick of looking where the moss grows 0:13:07.280 --> 0:13:10.320 because on tree trunks, moss usually grows on the north side, 0:13:10.840 --> 0:13:13.840 and you wanted to be headed north. There were instances 0:13:13.880 --> 0:13:16.680 where because they made it a very zig zagging route 0:13:16.760 --> 0:13:18.199 usually you know, they didn't want to make it a 0:13:18.240 --> 0:13:20.320 straight line. So it made it easier to track, but 0:13:20.400 --> 0:13:23.880 it also made it easier to get lost as a slave. 0:13:24.000 --> 0:13:27.280 It did. And actually there's a sidebar towards the end 0:13:27.320 --> 0:13:31.840 of this talking about quilt patterns and there are codes 0:13:31.880 --> 0:13:37.120 embedded within. I I found a substantial amount of it. 0:13:37.200 --> 0:13:39.840 Rele see, I found stuff saying that was like mythical 0:13:40.120 --> 0:13:43.720 that in the songs. Check out um os black history 0:13:43.840 --> 0:13:47.160 dot com. They have this list, this key of like 0:13:47.360 --> 0:13:49.600 what all of these different quilt patterns are and what 0:13:49.640 --> 0:13:53.120 they meant. Um two slaves who came upon a quilt 0:13:53.640 --> 0:13:57.040 and one of them was this um kind of zigzagged X. 0:13:57.160 --> 0:14:01.440 It's called them the drunken Path And basically it's saying 0:14:01.480 --> 0:14:05.040 like going his zigzag pattern because there's guys out there's 0:14:05.080 --> 0:14:09.200 slave hunters around, and if you say turned started walking south, 0:14:09.960 --> 0:14:12.000 they would be less likely to suspect that you were 0:14:12.040 --> 0:14:15.120 an escaped slave if you look like you were purposefully 0:14:15.120 --> 0:14:18.400 walking south, because what slave walk south? That's where the 0:14:18.440 --> 0:14:21.280 south is, right, right? But I mean, if it is 0:14:21.320 --> 0:14:23.600 made up, this guy did a good job of perpetuating 0:14:23.640 --> 0:14:26.200 it because it's very interesting. Well, even in here it 0:14:26.280 --> 0:14:29.400 says it's it's one of the well known legends or not. 0:14:29.520 --> 0:14:31.920 They just don't know because a lot of this stuff, 0:14:31.960 --> 0:14:34.200 and it's good that you bring that up. A lot 0:14:34.240 --> 0:14:36.720 we don't know about because the underground railroad was secret, 0:14:37.080 --> 0:14:38.840 so we don't know about a lot of the places. 0:14:39.200 --> 0:14:40.960 We don't know a lot of the routes or the 0:14:40.960 --> 0:14:44.440 people who worked there, or who actually started it. Oh 0:14:44.480 --> 0:14:47.080 and Josh also I mentioned the moss on the trees. 0:14:47.560 --> 0:14:49.800 Clear knights were better to see the stars, but traveling 0:14:49.840 --> 0:14:53.280 in the rain was pretty good too, because fat white 0:14:53.280 --> 0:14:55.520 plantation owner probably wanted to be inside by the fire 0:14:56.280 --> 0:14:59.960 when it was raining and not chasing after his slaves. 0:15:00.080 --> 0:15:04.000 So let's talk about um the laws. We we mentioned 0:15:04.040 --> 0:15:08.600 it kind of specifically UM earlier about some of the 0:15:08.680 --> 0:15:13.680 I guess the punishment that that could befall anyone helping somebody, right, Um, 0:15:14.600 --> 0:15:20.880 And in see the Fugitive Slave Act, UM basically created 0:15:20.880 --> 0:15:24.840 the first laws that said this an escape slave can 0:15:24.880 --> 0:15:28.880 be gone and gotten legally. Right. But there were slave 0:15:28.920 --> 0:15:31.360 states and there were non slave states, and the non 0:15:31.400 --> 0:15:34.720 slave states said, well, yeah, that's a great law, and 0:15:34.760 --> 0:15:36.800 you do whatever you want down in the South, but 0:15:36.880 --> 0:15:38.960 we're not really going to enforce it, and when we do, 0:15:39.040 --> 0:15:43.480 it's going to be very light. Well, in eighteen fifty, 0:15:43.560 --> 0:15:46.160 this thing got a lot of teeth, um, like you 0:15:46.200 --> 0:15:49.440 were saying, and the fines were that were stepped up. 0:15:49.520 --> 0:15:53.800 The penalties were harsher execution. UM was it was a 0:15:53.840 --> 0:15:59.320 lot more UM doable, I guess. And then um, it 0:15:59.440 --> 0:16:01.920 also became illegal for slave hunters to walk into a 0:16:02.400 --> 0:16:05.520 free state, a non slave state and be like, Hey, 0:16:05.560 --> 0:16:07.880 that black guy right there, I think he's an escaped slave. 0:16:07.920 --> 0:16:11.280 He should come with me to anybody he could legally 0:16:11.320 --> 0:16:13.520 claim it without having to justify even if they were 0:16:13.520 --> 0:16:16.800 free men. Yes, um. And apparently there were rumors of 0:16:16.840 --> 0:16:22.400 like slave traders like luring um, young black kids in 0:16:22.680 --> 0:16:25.720 free states onto boats and then like taking them off 0:16:25.720 --> 0:16:27.400 to the Deep South. It's like, what are you gonna do? 0:16:27.840 --> 0:16:30.000 How are you gonna find these people? There's no documentation 0:16:30.120 --> 0:16:33.800 like this. Um. So basically the North came to really 0:16:33.840 --> 0:16:38.400 resent this change in the law in eighteen fifty because 0:16:38.800 --> 0:16:42.160 people who were complacent living in non slave states suddenly 0:16:42.160 --> 0:16:45.320 we're kind of having slavery imposed upon them a little more. 0:16:45.960 --> 0:16:48.680 And then the dread Scott case like you mentioned earlier, 0:16:48.800 --> 0:16:53.200 that really sealed the deal and really got abolitionists. UM. 0:16:53.240 --> 0:16:57.120 I guess their their roles expanded tremendously after that. And 0:16:57.160 --> 0:17:00.640 then as a result, also the underground railroad became much 0:17:00.680 --> 0:17:05.960 more organized yeah, that is dread Scott v. Sandford, and uh. 0:17:05.960 --> 0:17:09.760 It was famous because dread Scott, a slave, sued for 0:17:09.800 --> 0:17:12.960 his freedom for himself and his wife and his two daughters, 0:17:13.640 --> 0:17:17.320 and on the grounds that they lived quite a bit 0:17:17.320 --> 0:17:21.119 of their lives in places like Wisconsin and Minnesota, in 0:17:21.160 --> 0:17:25.240 these outlying Northwest territories that or northern territories that had 0:17:25.840 --> 0:17:28.720 where it was illegal. Slavery was actually illegal. So he 0:17:28.760 --> 0:17:31.240 sued on those grounds, and in one of probably the 0:17:31.280 --> 0:17:33.640 worst Supreme Court decisions in the history of this country, 0:17:34.280 --> 0:17:39.480 they decided because the panel was full of Southerners. The 0:17:39.520 --> 0:17:43.440 panel Supreme Court justices were a lot of Southerners, and 0:17:43.480 --> 0:17:46.439 they ruled it Black people were not or people of 0:17:46.440 --> 0:17:50.040 African descent were not citizens of the United States, free 0:17:50.680 --> 0:17:53.320 or not, they are not citizens. Therefore they cannot sue 0:17:53.840 --> 0:17:57.159 for their freedom right. They don't have any rights, so 0:17:57.200 --> 0:18:00.679 they can be basically captured and taken to yes, a 0:18:00.720 --> 0:18:02.960 life of slavery again. But if it hadn't been for 0:18:02.960 --> 0:18:06.320 the dread Scott case, we may never have well we 0:18:06.359 --> 0:18:08.520 may have, but it really sped up the process of 0:18:08.600 --> 0:18:11.720 the Thirteenth Amendment in the Emancipation Proclamation, and hence the 0:18:11.800 --> 0:18:14.240 Civil War and hence the Civil War, and some of 0:18:14.320 --> 0:18:18.280 his descendants still live in St. Louis today. Well, shout 0:18:18.280 --> 0:18:22.280 out to the Scots of St. Louis. UM and Chuck, 0:18:22.320 --> 0:18:25.480 we said that this this um precipitated the Civil War. 0:18:26.000 --> 0:18:29.440 The underground railroad helped move it along. The dread Scott case. 0:18:29.480 --> 0:18:37.600 It it basically these things, Um, Northerners actively subverting federal law. UM. 0:18:37.760 --> 0:18:41.800 And the South economic cloud really ticked the South off 0:18:42.440 --> 0:18:46.199 the the South imposing its views on slavery on the 0:18:46.240 --> 0:18:51.560 North through this eighteen fifty strengthening and the dread Scott case. UM, 0:18:51.560 --> 0:18:55.040 it really ticked off the North. So this division was 0:18:55.040 --> 0:18:58.480 was Um. It's very much part of what led up 0:18:58.480 --> 0:19:01.920 to the Civil War. Yeah, pencil any even I thought 0:19:01.960 --> 0:19:06.679 about ah nullifying the Fugitive Slave Act. They didn't like 0:19:06.720 --> 0:19:08.399 it so much, But then they decided, you know, a 0:19:08.400 --> 0:19:11.000 better way to do this. It's probably to be subversive 0:19:11.400 --> 0:19:13.560 and to support things like the underground railroad on the 0:19:13.600 --> 0:19:16.960 down low, rather than cause some big political snake write 0:19:16.960 --> 0:19:22.959 a check. Exactly right. Um. So we say that because 0:19:23.040 --> 0:19:26.680 the Civil Wars. Whenever you ask a kid, you know 0:19:26.960 --> 0:19:30.560 why the Civil War happened? So slavery. I mean, that's 0:19:30.560 --> 0:19:32.280 a that's a big part of it. But that's why 0:19:32.320 --> 0:19:35.440 it's not just slavery. It wasn't like the North was like, 0:19:35.520 --> 0:19:37.439 slavery is wrong and we're gonna go to war with 0:19:37.520 --> 0:19:40.359 you over it, or the South was like, we love slavery, 0:19:40.400 --> 0:19:44.200 We're not part of you any longer. Although the latter 0:19:44.240 --> 0:19:47.240 I've heard recently was um much closer to the point 0:19:47.680 --> 0:19:50.360 that the South was perfectly happy with succeeding creating its 0:19:50.359 --> 0:19:54.040 own country and basically creating an economic empire based on 0:19:54.160 --> 0:19:57.639 free labor, that that took over the entire Caribbean, and 0:19:57.680 --> 0:20:01.080 that the Southern US. Yeah, I wish I was more 0:20:01.080 --> 0:20:04.960 of a civil war. Buff. I'm glad you're not. Chuck. Yeah, 0:20:05.000 --> 0:20:08.639 they're I wouldn't say obnoxious, but man, do they know 0:20:08.680 --> 0:20:10.920 a lot about the Civil War and they like correcting 0:20:10.920 --> 0:20:14.400 people too. Yeah, and we're going to hear from them, 0:20:14.440 --> 0:20:17.520 so Chuck. Um. When you did finally make it out 0:20:17.560 --> 0:20:20.679 along this this route um up to the northern the 0:20:20.720 --> 0:20:25.120 extreme Northern States, the northern part of the Extreme Northern States, 0:20:25.520 --> 0:20:30.400 and to Canada. Um, it could take days, weeks, months, 0:20:30.440 --> 0:20:32.359 It could take twenty four hours if you happen to 0:20:32.840 --> 0:20:35.480 have the money and the gaul to ride a train, 0:20:35.880 --> 0:20:38.560 or if you live in a border state. Yeah, which 0:20:38.560 --> 0:20:41.399 apparently is why a lot of slaves never escaped from 0:20:41.440 --> 0:20:45.119 the Deep South. It was longer ago, and they didn't. 0:20:45.240 --> 0:20:48.840 They wouldn't have taken the underground railroad which went exclusively north. 0:20:48.880 --> 0:20:51.760 I believe they would have gone to Florida or to Mexico. 0:20:52.160 --> 0:20:55.800 Never knew that. So Mexico in eighty nine outlawed slavery 0:20:55.840 --> 0:21:00.880 and became active in protecting slaves who escaped to Mexico. Yeah. 0:21:00.960 --> 0:21:05.560 Native American Indians go figure, we're very empathetic. They were 0:21:05.560 --> 0:21:08.639 probably like, join the club, my man, come on in 0:21:09.280 --> 0:21:15.359 almost literally chuck so in Florida in Spain said we're 0:21:15.359 --> 0:21:19.520 issuing a decree here that says any any slave or 0:21:19.600 --> 0:21:23.119 Native American who leaves an English colony and makes it 0:21:23.160 --> 0:21:27.520 to Florida is a free Floridian, a free a free 0:21:27.520 --> 0:21:30.320 member of the Spanish crown. Right right. All we want 0:21:30.359 --> 0:21:33.199 from you is that you convert to a Catholic convert 0:21:33.240 --> 0:21:36.040 to Catholicism, and become a member of the military for 0:21:36.520 --> 0:21:40.000 a prescribed amount of time, right um, And in return, 0:21:40.160 --> 0:21:43.680 you're a citizen here, right. So that's why Florida attracted 0:21:43.720 --> 0:21:45.040 a bunch of people. And the reason they did it 0:21:45.080 --> 0:21:49.400 was specifically to attract people from um England, the English 0:21:49.480 --> 0:21:52.399 territories like Georgia or South Carolina, because they wanted to 0:21:52.480 --> 0:21:54.919 jump start the economic engine, but they weren't going to 0:21:54.960 --> 0:21:57.960 do it on slavery. Right. I wonder what impact that 0:21:58.040 --> 0:22:00.479 has today. I wonder if there are more are African 0:22:00.480 --> 0:22:04.280 American Catholics in Florida proportionately because of that. Well, one 0:22:04.280 --> 0:22:06.520 of the impacts that it had that's still around the 0:22:06.600 --> 0:22:09.680 day are the Seminoles. The Seminoles were a recent tribe 0:22:09.720 --> 0:22:13.439 that started in about the eighteenth century um based on 0:22:13.800 --> 0:22:16.280 displaced Creek Indians who made it to Florida to take 0:22:16.359 --> 0:22:20.600 Spain up on their offer and escaped slaves. And now 0:22:20.680 --> 0:22:23.320 there's a division in the Seminole tribe between Black Seminoles 0:22:23.359 --> 0:22:26.000 and Red Seminoles, and it's not they don't always get along. 0:22:26.080 --> 0:22:31.760 But during this time, the Seminole Indians came up because 0:22:31.920 --> 0:22:34.639 in a lot of cases, black slaves, freed slaves or 0:22:34.720 --> 0:22:37.440 escaped slaves would come up to an Indian Indian sentiment, 0:22:37.680 --> 0:22:40.480 lived near it or be absorbed into it and that's 0:22:40.480 --> 0:22:42.879 where the seminoles came from. That's pretty cool, didn't it. 0:22:43.359 --> 0:22:45.359 There's really one jerk in this whole thing, and that's 0:22:45.359 --> 0:22:51.840 that's Yeah, our ancestors. They were white Northerners too. It's 0:22:51.840 --> 0:22:56.800 not all in the South, white jerk, white Northerners probably. 0:22:56.960 --> 0:23:00.200 Uh yeah, Anyway, I'm just always stick up for the South. Well, 0:23:00.280 --> 0:23:02.760 think about it that there were an estimated two thousand 0:23:02.760 --> 0:23:08.240 to three thousand underground railroad workers there. There are a 0:23:08.240 --> 0:23:10.119 lot more people in the US and the North and 0:23:10.240 --> 0:23:12.400 the South than that at the time. Buddy. Yeah, that's 0:23:12.400 --> 0:23:15.040 a good point. Uh. It is interesting though to me 0:23:15.080 --> 0:23:17.720 that you said Canada, because that was where many of 0:23:17.760 --> 0:23:19.600 them ended up. And I never knew that. I never 0:23:19.680 --> 0:23:25.200 knew that. And it made sense because why go to Pennsylvania, 0:23:25.280 --> 0:23:28.080 even though they're sympathetic to a certain degree, when the 0:23:28.119 --> 0:23:30.919 Fugitive Slave Act still is hanging over my head and 0:23:30.960 --> 0:23:32.639 somebody could turn me in for some dough if they 0:23:32.640 --> 0:23:35.800 wanted to. Yeah, let's just go to Canada where they 0:23:35.880 --> 0:23:38.680