Speaker 1: Welcome to Katie's Crib, a production of Shonda Land Audio
Speaker 1: in partnership with I Heart Radio. Dear kids, think you're funny,
Speaker 1: I don't know. I think so because they laugh at
Speaker 1: me when I'm trying to be strict with them. You know,
Speaker 1: I don't know what it's like having someone else like
Speaker 1: a lion, just like yell at you. Hi, everybody, and
Speaker 1: welcome back to Katie's Crib. This week's guest is ha Hilary. Yes,
Speaker 1: if you don't know where you should. Her name is
Speaker 1: Michelle Buteau and she is a mom of twins. She
Speaker 1: had an incredibly wild, five year long journey to parenthood
Speaker 1: that she shares all on this podcast, as well as
Speaker 1: all of her amazing stories about parenthood in a pandemic
Speaker 1: with a Dutch husband. We talk a lot about our
Speaker 1: foul mouths. You're gonna enjoy it, but let me tell
Speaker 1: you first about Michelle. She's a stand up comedian, she's
Speaker 1: an actress, she's a podcast host. She's one of the
Speaker 1: stars of the TV remake First Wives Club on b
Speaker 1: ET Plus, and the host Slashed the voice of the
Speaker 1: popular Netflix competition series The Circle. Michelle can also be
Speaker 1: seen stealing scenes in some of your favorite shows in
Speaker 1: films like Happiest Season, Always Be My, Maybe, Russian Doll,
Speaker 1: Someone Great, and the upcoming Marry Me with Jennifer Lopez.
Speaker 1: She also recently published her first book called Survival of
Speaker 1: the Thickest. It's hilarious. Get it now. She also has
Speaker 1: a one hour comedy special, Welcome to Beutopia. I Love
Speaker 1: It so much and streaming on Netflix now, and the
Speaker 1: special recently won the Critics Choice Television Award for Best
Speaker 1: Comedy Special. We are so lucky to have Michelle on
Speaker 1: Katie's Crib. This interview is going to make guys laugh. Michelle,
Speaker 1: thank you for coming on to Katie's Crib today. I
Speaker 1: mean wow, I am a huge fan of yours, like
Speaker 1: you have no idea. That is so nice. Thank you
Speaker 1: for those words. I am also a huge fan. Okay,
Speaker 1: you have two year old twins, Hazel and Otis. Yeah,
Speaker 1: did you know you always wanted to be a mom? Like,
Speaker 1: were you a kid that wanted to do this? Yeah?
Speaker 1: I oh, I knew that. I always wanted to be
Speaker 1: a mom and work before I even knew I wanted
Speaker 1: to get married. I never even thought about getting married.
Speaker 1: I couldn't picture who that person would be because I
Speaker 1: never liked people past three weeks and I'm like, I
Speaker 1: don't know what that is, but I know what motherhood
Speaker 1: is and I'm down for that. My uncle's the archbishop
Speaker 1: of Jamaican and he does more baptisms than weddings. So
Speaker 1: people are just out here having babies, but like not together.
Speaker 1: So I was like, yeah, that's what I want. But
Speaker 1: you know, wow, it's been a zay because the twins
Speaker 1: just started daycare a couple of weeks ago, haven't been
Speaker 1: sick for a year because they've been home, got another sick,
Speaker 1: then they have to be home with me this week.
Speaker 1: But I also come into my husband to take a
Speaker 1: boy's trip to Tijuana this week because he needs to
Speaker 1: get the funk out of the house because I'm like,
Speaker 1: I need to miss you. You need to go, Like,
Speaker 1: you know, it's bad when you can't even stand the
Speaker 1: way your husband breathes and I'm like, I'm glad he's
Speaker 1: got breath in his body. I don't need to hear it.
Speaker 1: I know, let's talk how has having your twins in
Speaker 1: a pandemic? How old are they there too? And just
Speaker 1: a couple few January so too yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 1: I know they're not paying taxes. They don't need to know.
Speaker 1: How was pandemic twindom for you? Yeah, We've had an
Speaker 1: amazing nanny who specializes in twins, so she basically taught
Speaker 1: us how to be parents, which is amazing. Um. But
Speaker 1: with the pandemic, she had to go on quarantine. We
Speaker 1: had to go on quarantine. There's always been people in
Speaker 1: the house, friends or family to help us, so I
Speaker 1: was like, how are we going to do this? It
Speaker 1: was scary at first because it was like snorkeling, you
Speaker 1: know where it's like it's beautiful, but I can't read.
Speaker 1: But then we just like it was all scheduled, so
Speaker 1: I was like, husband has in this hour. I have
Speaker 1: in this hour. We tag team to take a ship.
Speaker 1: Depending on what the day is, we go to this
Speaker 1: corner of the house. At eleven twelve o'clock, we go upstairs,
Speaker 1: you know, so we try to like make it fun
Speaker 1: for all of us. UM edibles help definitely after four o'clock.
Speaker 1: I timed it out with their bathtime and by the
Speaker 1: time they go to bed, no big deal. I don't
Speaker 1: do them all the time. I just did the whole
Speaker 1: bedtime routine, like on a really nice buzz and I
Speaker 1: was like, oh, this is so much more fucking fun,
Speaker 1: Like what have I been doing? Like why have I
Speaker 1: not been doing this? Um? Yeah, but it's true. It's true.
Speaker 1: So there are so many aspects of your memoir, survival
Speaker 1: of the thickest that did you read it? It's so
Speaker 1: fucking I've told you I'm a huge fan. What are
Speaker 1: you talking about? Damn it. I'm honored to get you.
Speaker 1: I think you're amazing. You know not everyone is very
Speaker 1: open um about their fertility experience, about their motherhood experience,
Speaker 1: And when someone is, I'm like, very very excited for
Speaker 1: me and for our Katie's Cript community, because I think
Speaker 1: a lot of women are. We suffer in silence. We suffer.
Speaker 1: We're supposed to be perfect and it's fucking not. We
Speaker 1: have really heavy periods, put on a tight dress, go
Speaker 1: to work, try to keep up with everybody else better
Speaker 1: than everybody else, making less money, doing all the things,
Speaker 1: have to apologize for being the smartest person in the room.
Speaker 1: So yeah, we suffer in silence. It's how we've been
Speaker 1: taught in almost in every country for thousands of thousands
Speaker 1: of years, and now I'm just like fun yeah, funck
Speaker 1: the noise, Fuck the noise. You were on a very
Speaker 1: long fertility journey, which is a part of your act too.
Speaker 1: I've seen you talk about like it was five years,
Speaker 1: five years, um, four miscarriages, countless needles. The way I
Speaker 1: look back on it is the way people look back
Speaker 1: on corn teen, where people are like, God, I didn't know.
Speaker 1: I was so busy, like running away from my family,
Speaker 1: like always doing this, always doing that, And so for
Speaker 1: me looking back on those five years, I'm just like God,
Speaker 1: I can't believe I'm still you know, I just had
Speaker 1: a d n C and then like hosted for Rosie
Speaker 1: O'Donnell like three days later, just because I needed some
Speaker 1: sense of normalcy. But also, like Base, you could barely walk.
Speaker 1: So your miscarriages were they far along? No, they were
Speaker 1: all between six and nine weeks. And I'm sure a
Speaker 1: lot of your listeners know with IVF it's like you're
Speaker 1: prepping your body for so many months to think it's pregnant.
Speaker 1: So all four of them were IVF. Also, yeah, every yeah,
Speaker 1: I've been a project that is also so expensive. It
Speaker 1: was beyond and out of pocket, because God forbid, you
Speaker 1: want to try to have a family going down an
Speaker 1: alternative route because just old white man, please stop. No,
Speaker 1: it's really bad our insurance, our health care system. It
Speaker 1: is a fleet disaster. Or the only country in the
Speaker 1: world that has no paid maternity leave. Great, isn't that
Speaker 1: so great? And my husband from Holland, these women get
Speaker 1: a whole year and when they come back to work,
Speaker 1: they can come back to work three days a week
Speaker 1: and still get paid for five because they appreciate parenthood
Speaker 1: motherhood so much. And that's why these motherfuckers live longer,
Speaker 1: all riding bikes, eating fish oil. They're riding so many bikes.
Speaker 1: It's too much. It's too much. It's unbelievable. So okay
Speaker 1: for miscarriages, And then how did you finally come to
Speaker 1: the decision that a surrogate was going to be your road?
Speaker 1: And then tell me about I think there was surrogacy
Speaker 1: loss situation because you were doing this in New York
Speaker 1: and there was probably a ton of barriers. I mean,
Speaker 1: I say, wasn't legal in New York unless you're related
Speaker 1: to the person, And I'm like, that is And it
Speaker 1: only became legal I think last year. Yeah, June was
Speaker 1: last year. So when I sort of went through this
Speaker 1: n and started talking about it. I was on Wendy
Speaker 1: Williams talking about it, and Andy Cohen saw the interview
Speaker 1: and he reached out to me and he's like, I
Speaker 1: have been trying to lobby for surrogacy in New York.
Speaker 1: It's in the budget. I need people on board. They're
Speaker 1: trying to make it like a rich thing, a gay things,
Speaker 1: just like so ridiculous. And so I went to all
Speaker 1: of me with him and a bunch of other fears,
Speaker 1: asked people just the stories. You know. It wasn't exhausting
Speaker 1: being out for eight hours just talking to people. It
Speaker 1: was exhausting, like living through people's grief all over again.
Speaker 1: And we've all been on this other side of it
Speaker 1: where we're like, Okay, now we can look back and
Speaker 1: talk about it. And now you have like this elevator
Speaker 1: pitch for your your trauma, which is what you need
Speaker 1: to go into these rooms to make sure happen. And
Speaker 1: it was like just fucking bananas, because I was like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I've narrowed it down to six sentences or less to
Speaker 1: try and keep people's attention. So I was like, I
Speaker 1: see all of you, and it was really bananas. And
Speaker 1: I even you know so hard not to cry every
Speaker 1: damn and but I was like, God, where were you
Speaker 1: people when I was going through this because there was
Speaker 1: no one to talk to, which was so crazy for
Speaker 1: me because I know way too many people. How do
Speaker 1: I have not one person I could talk to about this,
Speaker 1: not even my therapist. Why it's really, it's so ridiculous
Speaker 1: and it and it happens more than we know. Oh yeah,
Speaker 1: and and honestly, it's why I'm so appreciative of you
Speaker 1: being so open. Gabrielle Union was on last year and
Speaker 1: she had a surrogate, but she has U dinometriosis and
Speaker 1: she got the help that she needed because Lena Dunham
Speaker 1: has the same thing and posted something about it. So
Speaker 1: Gabrielle reached out to Lena and was like, please help,
Speaker 1: and Lena like and so it's like you keep paying
Speaker 1: it forward, you know what I mean. Now that you've
Speaker 1: made this step, it's like, now you influence other people.
Speaker 1: So oh of course, oh my gosh, of course you do.
Speaker 1: Um Okay, So how did you find your surrogate? How
Speaker 1: was the pregnancy experience? Was it insane? Like Ted, tell
Speaker 1: tell me about that, Tell me about the whole journey.
Speaker 1: Of like actually getting her pregnant. All of this, um well,
Speaker 1: um well, when you do I V f right. You
Speaker 1: have to go to the clinic at least three days
Speaker 1: a week for sonogram's blood tests, pay for your medicine
Speaker 1: out of pocket. You just feel like you're Carmela Soprano
Speaker 1: and you're like Tony any money, you know, and it's
Speaker 1: just like ridiculous. And so after the last miscarriage, my doctors,
Speaker 1: who are amazing, We're like, we want you to walk
Speaker 1: out of this office pregnant far along and they were
Speaker 1: so great, but my body was just so tired that
Speaker 1: I was like I can't do this anymore and I
Speaker 1: don't know what to do. And then they sit you
Speaker 1: down and give you the pamphlet with surrogacy and you're
Speaker 1: like what is this? And my doctor worked with a
Speaker 1: couple of surgacy agencies that he really trusted, and so
Speaker 1: I just I was like the girl who just got
Speaker 1: the license at the car dealership. I'm like, tell me
Speaker 1: where to go and tell me what to do. I
Speaker 1: can't make any more decisions for myself, and so I
Speaker 1: just called up this agency and it was really hard
Speaker 1: to just even get an appointment. I was like, oh
Speaker 1: my god, how long is this gonna take. It's still
Speaker 1: a whole step. And as things started to happen and
Speaker 1: we were meeting and they were like, do you have
Speaker 1: any more questions? It's sort of like going back to
Speaker 1: work with COVID. I can't think of questions for something
Speaker 1: that's never happened before. So it's really just as we
Speaker 1: go along, and then there's some questions. It's so personal
Speaker 1: you're like, am I even allowed to ask? As you know,
Speaker 1: it is a very weird, wild emotional experience um going
Speaker 1: through surrogacy without even knowing anyone that's done it. It
Speaker 1: feels like you're on a roller coaster ride in the dark,
Speaker 1: but people keep telling you it's gonna be beautiful, don't worry,
Speaker 1: keep holding on, but you don't know when the next
Speaker 1: thing happens. It's a it's a huge miracle of fact
Speaker 1: that anyone is born. Remember that when you have grown rage.
Speaker 1: The fact that anyone if born is crazy, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean. It's just like, oh damn, mo, I'm
Speaker 1: went through something I know and I'm so I'm sitting
Speaker 1: here just thinking, like my god, like this is a
Speaker 1: fucking journey. It was weird and everyone I know who's
Speaker 1: had IVF or even just egg freezing, the hormonal ship
Speaker 1: of Yeah, like getting your drugs and then having your
Speaker 1: partner or yourself or whoever putting them into your body
Speaker 1: and then feeling sick and bloated and all this, and
Speaker 1: you did that so many times, and then to go
Speaker 1: through a surrogacy um agency, I mean unbelievab Well, so
Speaker 1: how did you check in with your surrogate? We spoke
Speaker 1: every day. I would check in with her every day
Speaker 1: to see how she was feeling. Because at this point
Speaker 1: when the babies were born, I felt like I had
Speaker 1: already met them. When I was like going through IBM,
Speaker 1: between the miscarriages and everything, I was like, I need
Speaker 1: to meet these souls. You know, did you everything twins
Speaker 1: was a possibility? How did that information come your way?
Speaker 1: I did not know what was in store. I knew
Speaker 1: that we had um some embryos bank. I knew that.
Speaker 1: In terms of being safe about it and being sure
Speaker 1: about it, it's like, let's put it, yes, exactly, let's
Speaker 1: put in a few because the chances and the odds,
Speaker 1: and you know, one takes, one might not take ex exactly.
Speaker 1: It's kind of gross how people think we just wake
Speaker 1: up and we're just like, I don't want to ruin
Speaker 1: my body and I have money to spend. It's either
Speaker 1: kids or a boat, So let's get a kid with
Speaker 1: curly hair and make sure it's like that's not what
Speaker 1: we're out here doing. This is like a last ditch
Speaker 1: effort of I really hope I get to make this
Speaker 1: family happen and meet these souls that we've worked so
Speaker 1: hard to have, right, and so yeah, I mean it
Speaker 1: was just so crazy, like proper educated people asking me
Speaker 1: was like plaques on the wall making important decisions, asking
Speaker 1: me stuff like that, you know, like you know, it's
Speaker 1: just so crazy. Yeah, people are people just don't understand
Speaker 1: what it is or how it works because we're people
Speaker 1: are so selfish and never think outside of their like
Speaker 1: five mile radius in their head to say, oh, I
Speaker 1: don't want that, but you do, so it's still worthy
Speaker 1: and it's like, what the fuck? So when did you
Speaker 1: get the call that it was twins? Was it around
Speaker 1: the twelve week mark or something? Yeah, I think it
Speaker 1: was a couple of weeks, but it was because there
Speaker 1: was some bleeding. You We're like, oh no, in my mind,
Speaker 1: I'm like, here we go again. But when we did
Speaker 1: an ultrasound, there was two heartbeats and I was like what.
Speaker 1: But like, even up until the second they were born,
Speaker 1: I was like, I don't want the other shoe to
Speaker 1: fucking drop right right, because you've had you been through
Speaker 1: such trauma that you were like, there's no way this
Speaker 1: is going to work out. There's no way. It hasn't
Speaker 1: worked out up until now. So like at some point
Speaker 1: some ship is going to hit the fan that is
Speaker 1: unexpected or whatever. I have felt that so many I mean,
Speaker 1: I had miscarriages and stuff like that before. Um does
Speaker 1: it ever leieve you though? I mean you, yes, yes,
Speaker 1: for sure. I mean and even going through this year.
Speaker 1: I pregnant during the pandemic and it was just hard
Speaker 1: being pregnant and isolated and even my labor, I was like,
Speaker 1: something's going to go horribly wrong, right, Like, something's gonna
Speaker 1: go horribly wrong. There's no way that like you know, um, hello,
Speaker 1: here's my child. Hey, Albi, I'm busy talking to my
Speaker 1: friend Michelle. Okay, okay, we love you. Have a good
Speaker 1: day at school. All be just started school too, Oh
Speaker 1: my goodness, two weeks ago. I'll be this is my
Speaker 1: friend Michelle. Hi, ok are you what did he say? Hi?
Speaker 1: Poopy Michelle, You're welcome. We're big at the body talk
Speaker 1: right now. I had a good poopy too, Thanks for asking.
Speaker 1: She had a good poopy too, Thanks for asking, she said, yeah,
Speaker 1: I'll come tune. You can't. Started school also, and in
Speaker 1: two days was sick. Two days, I hold, my husband
Speaker 1: got a cold, my baby got a cold. I was like,
Speaker 1: is this a joke? This is what we're and also
Speaker 1: is it COVID? And are we freaking out? And what
Speaker 1: are we doing? And everyone told me, your kid's gonna
Speaker 1: get sick in the first two weeks. Oh my goodness.
Speaker 1: So it's for as far as school is concerned, Like,
Speaker 1: how did your kids adjust to being in school with
Speaker 1: other kids being around? It was so hard And this
Speaker 1: is the personal decision for me. But I was trying
Speaker 1: to find a daycare where they weren't required to wear
Speaker 1: masks because they're two years old. I'm in the same
Speaker 1: boat his his doesn't require masks either. Yeah, So the
Speaker 1: fact that I found one, I'm like dope. And then
Speaker 1: it was a whole kitten caboodle of just like they
Speaker 1: better be nice to my children. Are there are there
Speaker 1: cameras But they weren't cameras, but they sent you updates
Speaker 1: and there's an I'm like, send me updates all the time.
Speaker 1: So I was like that bitch, and I was like,
Speaker 1: oh they like it. Look at them porn stuff and
Speaker 1: listening and doing yoga and um yeah. They were the
Speaker 1: only two in the class, and I was like, where
Speaker 1: the rest of the kids. They're like, oh, this is it.
Speaker 1: The whole point was for them to be socialized. No way,
Speaker 1: there are no kids in the class. There's no kids
Speaker 1: in the class. And like, why am I saying there
Speaker 1: with no peanut butter if there's no kids in the class.
Speaker 1: So finally there's another kid, but he's only there, he's
Speaker 1: there part time. Where are the children? Where are they are?
Speaker 1: They all sick with the same cold that you gave
Speaker 1: your kids and they'll be back next week. No, there's
Speaker 1: you know, it's so fun. There's like a twenty four
Speaker 1: month cut off and then like a two year old thing,
Speaker 1: so all the kids, I have a fun twenty four
Speaker 1: months under That's why I'm like, this month is bullshit,
Speaker 1: that's not true. I I mean, I'm really whatever my school.
Speaker 1: I'm not trying to be like my school's better, but
Speaker 1: it's not. But I'm just saying probably it's mixed age
Speaker 1: and I and I fucking love it because my child
Speaker 1: is such like needs um. Although God like you have twins,
Speaker 1: they had each other during the pandemic. My child became
Speaker 1: a nightmare. But it was alone the entire pandemic, and
Speaker 1: the sun moon stars sets on this fucking kid and
Speaker 1: it's like he is needs to go to school, like
Speaker 1: he got bit yesterday, and I was thrilled about it.
Speaker 1: I was like for a little boy. They were fighting
Speaker 1: over a toy and a little boy like used his
Speaker 1: teeth not he didn't even break this like it wasn't
Speaker 1: a bad one. But I was like, yes, like my
Speaker 1: child needs to get out there and learn this ship
Speaker 1: like you can't hit your friends, you gotta fight over toys.
Speaker 1: You gotta learn to use your words, like I can't
Speaker 1: teach you that by yourself. That's you know what. I'm
Speaker 1: the only child, and I was I was just like,
Speaker 1: I hope to have siblings because it was so much
Speaker 1: I had to figure out by myself on that playground. Okay,
Speaker 1: you find out it's twins even on their birth you
Speaker 1: were like this ship is not going to work out.
Speaker 1: Something's gonna go something. I hope this ship works out,
Speaker 1: is what I was saying. But like baby girl came
Speaker 1: right out, Baby boy was reached. You know. Even then
Speaker 1: after like you don't sleep in the in the hospital,
Speaker 1: You're just looking at them and then like you fall
Speaker 1: asleep standing up like a horse. Started getting like all
Speaker 1: these like ailments. My ankles hurt, my knees hurt. You know,
Speaker 1: I had sciatica, and my husband's like, we have to
Speaker 1: put them in their room and you need to fucking sleep.
Speaker 1: I just was so paranoid. I had to like look
Speaker 1: in the crib every noise they made to make sure
Speaker 1: they're gonna be okay. Of course, of course, did you
Speaker 1: do the first bunch of weeks alone? Did you have
Speaker 1: a night nurse? Did you have any help? We were
Speaker 1: alone and I was doing like the adult NG podcast,
Speaker 1: and I did like a Drew Barrymore movie, and weren't
Speaker 1: you doing? Um? I think you were doing Always Be
Speaker 1: My Maybe, which I've also seen, and you were amazing
Speaker 1: and your character was fully pregnant. It was literally that
Speaker 1: week that the surrogate was getting transferred with the embryos, right, yeah,
Speaker 1: it was the week where I shot the scene where
Speaker 1: I had given birth where she was getting her transfer,
Speaker 1: and I was like, wow, this is crazy. I was
Speaker 1: like just so wild and thank god weed's legal and
Speaker 1: bank over and not like I bought it, but I
Speaker 1: was like, it's good to have options. I just got
Speaker 1: a seafood tower and cried it's here. So how did
Speaker 1: you feel when you first laid eyes on them? Was
Speaker 1: it an immediate love at first sight? Did it feel real?
Speaker 1: Did you feel outside of yourself? It still doesn't feel real.
Speaker 1: It's such a weird combination of like, I love you,
Speaker 1: your mind, I don't know you, who are you? You
Speaker 1: picture them when you like are in the cute phase
Speaker 1: with your partner, and then you see them, You're like,
Speaker 1: what the funk? That's not what I thought. But it's
Speaker 1: still so much better, But also what the So it's
Speaker 1: still I still feel like no one can do it
Speaker 1: better than me, and I still feel like I have
Speaker 1: no idea what I'm doing, Like all at the same time,
Speaker 1: and I don't know how to describe it any other
Speaker 1: way was pretty perfect. I know you, but I don't
Speaker 1: know you at all. And I know what I'm doing,
Speaker 1: but I don't know what I'm doing at all, Like
Speaker 1: it's really that is it? It's really what it is? Now?
Speaker 1: How um, how was it taking care of wins? You know, twins,
Speaker 1: no matter how old they are, you never really feel
Speaker 1: like you're giving them enough attention because um one, like
Speaker 1: baby girls definitely more outgoing than baby boy, but because
Speaker 1: we're always like clapping for her because she's doing a dance,
Speaker 1: like I want to make sure that baby boy knows
Speaker 1: that he's also you know, just yes, and so it's
Speaker 1: a lot of that. And also you know, she was
Speaker 1: sick first and then she gave it to him like
Speaker 1: child fleet. But she likes to be held more than him,
Speaker 1: but he needs to be held now that but he's
Speaker 1: the heavier one. So they have very different temperaments. They
Speaker 1: have very different temperaments. Do they play differently? Like do
Speaker 1: they are they? You know, I don't know. But what
Speaker 1: I is there like a big difference between girl boy
Speaker 1: stuff right now? Is she like super into girl like
Speaker 1: a doll and that sort of thing, and he's more
Speaker 1: into trucks? Do you is that existing in her household?
Speaker 1: For sure? I mean she's into all this stuff, she's
Speaker 1: also into anything he's into. I don't know, there's a
Speaker 1: whole god damn room of plastic for her to play with.
Speaker 1: She is very aware that are there are people around
Speaker 1: and likes to entertain, which is wild like rolling her
Speaker 1: eyes and can't say sentences, but has whole less opinions.
Speaker 1: Did she come out first or second? She came out first.
Speaker 1: So even in daycare, he'll cry when we drop him off,
Speaker 1: but she's like, let's go, motherfucker, these people like us
Speaker 1: and we'll like take his hand and like be like shush, shush. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So she's a really good old sister, even though even
Speaker 1: by sixteen minutes. But um and and he's just like
Speaker 1: a thoughtful, quiet, definitely only child. Is that like you
Speaker 1: and your husband? Well, she has the outgoing parts of
Speaker 1: both of us. Chis was very outgoing when he was little.
Speaker 1: Um and then sort of become he became like this quiet,
Speaker 1: I want to be behind the camera and a photographer. Dude. Um.
Speaker 1: You know has had the same friends for thirty years,
Speaker 1: and I'm just like, you know, all right, like I
Speaker 1: just freaks and Gates man, come on over. You know.
Speaker 1: I'm obsessed with twins. I mean we my husband like
Speaker 1: always wanted twins and I know you don't know. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I was like, no, you're gonna understand that, Like how
Speaker 1: fucking hard that is. I mean, it's a lot of
Speaker 1: I think for twins to No one told me that, Um,
Speaker 1: I would feel like I'm in a factory. Like sometimes
Speaker 1: I feel like that Lucy o ball like chocolate factory,
Speaker 1: just like you're just constantly putting out meals, You're constantly
Speaker 1: cleaning up meals, You're constantly cleaning this mess up, putting
Speaker 1: that out. Like it's just because that's how my life feels.
Speaker 1: And I have one three and a half and a baby,
Speaker 1: but I can't imagine two at the same age. Um,
Speaker 1: do you ever talk about the future? Like are they
Speaker 1: going to be in the same school? Are they going
Speaker 1: to be in separate schools? Like, how do you feel
Speaker 1: about that twins stuff? You? For me, I would love
Speaker 1: for them to be in the same room and the
Speaker 1: same school and have each other's back and ship like
Speaker 1: that and always have a witness and you can on
Speaker 1: this person your whole fucking life. But I know that's
Speaker 1: not reality. I mean, I feel like they're gonna be
Speaker 1: definitely in different schools, although I would love for them
Speaker 1: to be in this Oh, gosh, um, okay, did you
Speaker 1: go back to work right away when they were born?
Speaker 1: Kind of? I don't know why. I thought, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: bring twins home. I won't be doing the road, so
Speaker 1: I'll have time to write a book. The fun was
Speaker 1: I thinking, Oh my god, I don't know why I
Speaker 1: said that. I don't know why. And then I would
Speaker 1: beat myself up for taking a nap and not writing
Speaker 1: the book. And I'm just like, do I need to
Speaker 1: take the shower right now? And everyone's like, yes, we
Speaker 1: can spell you. And so it was such a weird
Speaker 1: come to Jesus of like, am I selfish? If I
Speaker 1: go off in a room and do this thing? And
Speaker 1: then I would hear them cry and I'm like, but
Speaker 1: this is how you hold her, and they're like, go away.
Speaker 1: I don't even remember what your question was. My question
Speaker 1: is how has it been like going back to work
Speaker 1: work life balance? Do you have that? I don't know
Speaker 1: anyone that does, so, No, it's fine. I'm wondering that
Speaker 1: you have the secret to that. No, I don't know
Speaker 1: what that is. I try to like make hardlines for myself,
Speaker 1: but you know what I would really love to do,
Speaker 1: and it's hard, right to pandemic. I would love to
Speaker 1: take a girl's trip word trip on myself, just to
Speaker 1: feel like I got this. But there's still so much
Speaker 1: stuff you have to do before you leave. Oh my god,
Speaker 1: he just prepping the family for you to be gone
Speaker 1: is almost not worth it sometimes, like it's like no,
Speaker 1: it's like just to set up your fucking household to
Speaker 1: run when you're not there because you do so much
Speaker 1: ship so to fill in other people on what you do,
Speaker 1: Like just this morning, to be able to record this
Speaker 1: podcast at eight am. Our morning routine is different than
Speaker 1: what it normally is, and it is a fucking ship
Speaker 1: show out there, like and I'm like, everybody just fucking survived.
Speaker 1: And that's one hour. But normally do the mornings, you know.
Speaker 1: So my son's screaming, he's so upset. The dad's waking
Speaker 1: him up and it's not me. And I did all
Speaker 1: the things. I packed the lunch last night, I put
Speaker 1: out his breakfast for this morning, fucking last night, SHU,
Speaker 1: that wouldn't go bad, Like everything set up ridiculous and
Speaker 1: still ridiculous, ridiculous. And that's like imagine a trip. It's
Speaker 1: like I don't even I want one too. I would
Speaker 1: like to sleep in. All I want to do is
Speaker 1: sleep in. That's all I want. Even till seven, even
Speaker 1: till seven thirty would be an absolute miracle. Can you
Speaker 1: tell me, um, what's something you've discovered about guys as
Speaker 1: a father? Do you match each other's strengths and weaknesses?
Speaker 1: She's giving me a face you guys can see, she's
Speaker 1: giving me a face like face like, what the who? No,
Speaker 1: I mean, we're working on it. I think we didn't
Speaker 1: realize how opposite we were. Well, you come from such
Speaker 1: different backgrounds to like, Okay, so he's Dutch, he's Dutch,
Speaker 1: I'm American. Dutch people are way more laid back and
Speaker 1: lenient with their kids to sort of wasn't in the
Speaker 1: New York Times about how you're a hell you're more helicopter.
Speaker 1: He's much more laid back, which, okay, tell me or
Speaker 1: is that a huge source of tension between you guys.
Speaker 1: I mean he was right there with me too, but
Speaker 1: it wasn't his body that we had a prep to go,
Speaker 1: you know, through this surgery or through this thing or
Speaker 1: through that you know procedure. Yes, and so you know,
Speaker 1: we definitely compliment each other where I'm just like he's
Speaker 1: gonna hit her head with that rock. Just watch and
Speaker 1: he's like, no, it's no. And then sure enough, I'm like,
Speaker 1: see how you stone rocks? And then he's like, let
Speaker 1: them run. They'll stop at the edge of the sea wall.
Speaker 1: You'll see. And I'm like will I He's like sand
Speaker 1: us soft. I'm like is it? So it also get
Speaker 1: caught in your eye for all of time? So um,
Speaker 1: we do complement each other in that way. But you know,
Speaker 1: I didn't realize that I would become like this, like
Speaker 1: Everyone Loves Raymond episode where I'm getting the kids ready
Speaker 1: for daycare and I'm making two breakfasts and two lunches
Speaker 1: at the same time, and I finally get to sit
Speaker 1: on the couch while I'm doing something. Of course, I'm
Speaker 1: giving them kisses and I'm just like, I love you.
Speaker 1: And then he'll bust out with the well, where is
Speaker 1: my breakfast? Don't you love me? And I'm like, where
Speaker 1: the funk is my breakfast? Where the funk are my waffles?
Speaker 1: So you know what I mean. So I feel like,
Speaker 1: you know, I think we thought we had it all
Speaker 1: figured out, especially looking at all our friends who are
Speaker 1: fun ups have babies. We're like we're cool, We're not
Speaker 1: gonna do it like that. But here we are deep
Speaker 1: in quarantine, you know, trying to figure out who we
Speaker 1: are as parents together our relationship with them. Also didn't
Speaker 1: even think of all the relationships that spawn in the family.
Speaker 1: The kids are not the same with me as they
Speaker 1: are with him, as they are with the both of us.
Speaker 1: That's definitely true, and so you know, we have definitely
Speaker 1: taken tons of moments to be like, how do we
Speaker 1: fix this? There's always a partner who feels like they're
Speaker 1: being forgotten, and they're not just that other person isn't
Speaker 1: even taking care of themselves. They're just like trying to
Speaker 1: get through it. I feel like you and I are
Speaker 1: very in the similar boats in our relationships. Oh my god.
Speaker 1: Like I'm far more of a helicopter parent and my
Speaker 1: husband is far more like laid back and relax But
Speaker 1: my husband's also better at discipline than I am. Who
Speaker 1: is that in your relationship? I think both. I think
Speaker 1: both because he speaks touch to them and I speak
Speaker 1: English to them. So you know, so he only speaks
Speaker 1: touch to them. That's fucking amazing, Like it's good. So
Speaker 1: that's why there's speech is a bit delayed, But I'm
Speaker 1: cool with that. No, it's fine. I have like so
Speaker 1: many families who are doing similar things, who have three
Speaker 1: and a half year olds, and there it's great. It's
Speaker 1: like their speech might be a little bit delayed and
Speaker 1: then they're all of a sudden speaking two languages and
Speaker 1: you're like, ha ha, yeah, fuck you. I know. I know.
Speaker 1: Seth Meyers the other night was just like, do you
Speaker 1: ever feel like they're gonna be talking behind your back?
Speaker 1: I'm like, do it. Thank god, I don't need to
Speaker 1: be a part of everyday of conversation. Figure it out.
Speaker 1: What have you found to be your strengths as a mom? Um?
Speaker 1: Oh god, to say something nice about myself, yes, come on, Michelle,
Speaker 1: you deserve it. I mean, I'm I'm a hustler. I
Speaker 1: guess it done, and I make people feel good at
Speaker 1: you know that that's my gift in life. And so
Speaker 1: I feel like if my kids are talking about me
Speaker 1: on a podcast forty years from now, you know, I know,
Speaker 1: definitely the're gonna be like my mom loves this ship
Speaker 1: out of me, maybe too much? Are you a fun,
Speaker 1: playful parent? Like I'm not. I'm like terrible at that.
Speaker 1: My husband like like I love I'm a produced oreal mom, right,
Speaker 1: So I love you know, making sure everyone's safe and
Speaker 1: needs are met and like all of that. But when
Speaker 1: my son is like, let's play hide and see it,
Speaker 1: I'm like I want to blow my brains out. Or
Speaker 1: or if he's like I want to make a craft
Speaker 1: or something, I'm like, oh fucking fuck. Like I know
Speaker 1: that paint is so especially when it's not for me,
Speaker 1: but some mothers love it, like they really do. I mean,
Speaker 1: where are you at on that? I'm a little bit
Speaker 1: of both. I definitely like to produce, Like I love Pinterest,
Speaker 1: I love toddler meals. I love figuring out what they
Speaker 1: like to eat, and like seeking in the vegetables. I
Speaker 1: got that ship down that it is. Then I also like,
Speaker 1: you know, trying to figure out how to make them
Speaker 1: do big girl and big boy stuff, like isn't that fun?
Speaker 1: Look at that hamper? That hamper. So yes, you know
Speaker 1: a little bit of both. But um, I also like
Speaker 1: when people take over and play with them and they
Speaker 1: have like a moment and experience with them. But um,
Speaker 1: I've been told by my mom, who was not that person.
Speaker 1: My mom like will teach me how to she taught
Speaker 1: me how to balance a checkbook and went my butt.
Speaker 1: She was not trying to be out here singing Patty
Speaker 1: Cake with me, you know, or even her lover. But
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. But um, she has told me,
Speaker 1: and a few of my friends have told me, they're
Speaker 1: just like, you're just hard to follow, you know you.
Speaker 1: I could watch you do the alphabit all goddamn day.
Speaker 1: I can't do this with you, and I'm like, just
Speaker 1: puttal effort into it, make it your own. So I
Speaker 1: am fun, but not all the fun time. Dear kids
Speaker 1: think you're funny. I don't know. I think so because
Speaker 1: they laugh at me when I'm trying to be strict
Speaker 1: with them. You know, I don't know what it's like
Speaker 1: having someone looks like a lion just like yell at you. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm oh my god, I can't. I can't imagine you
Speaker 1: being like really good at being strict. But I'm but
Speaker 1: I'm trying, because I'm out here horrible at it. I
Speaker 1: am trying. Yeah, I have to do it with Hazel
Speaker 1: more than anyone else because I give her the count
Speaker 1: of three. I do the count of three to which
Speaker 1: is a great tool. And I never ever thought i'd
Speaker 1: be account to three. Mom. Ever, I'm such a fucking hippie.
Speaker 1: I was like, no, I don't believe in this stuff,
Speaker 1: like absolutely, like we're all just free loving and out here,
Speaker 1: you know, forest here for flute here. And then my
Speaker 1: son is such a challenger and tester and boundary breaker
Speaker 1: and hates authority and rules and I have had to
Speaker 1: learn real quick, like he has a stick and he's
Speaker 1: about to smash someone in the face with it, and
Speaker 1: I'm like, I'm about I'm giving you to the count
Speaker 1: of three, or I'm taking that stick away, where I'm
Speaker 1: taking television away or whatever, like I've become the consequences.
Speaker 1: Time ends. It's really just just time fucking out. But
Speaker 1: I'm trying. Wow, I never thought i'd be the corner mom.
Speaker 1: I'm like, we're going to the corner. It's great. She'll
Speaker 1: take her milk and pour it out while looking at me.
Speaker 1: I'm like, are you a psychopath? Oh no, but that's
Speaker 1: my hutest psychopath I've ever seen. Yeah, that's my son.
Speaker 1: Like sitting on the pool steps and me being like,
Speaker 1: if you drink pool water one more time, and he
Speaker 1: literally stares down the barrel like into my soul and
Speaker 1: takes a huge pail of water while he drinks it.
Speaker 1: It's so crazy, that's their job. Like Hazel will put
Speaker 1: in bathtime, She'll pour water all over Otis and he's
Speaker 1: just out here trying to play with the red car
Speaker 1: Ah and then he starts crying and like, I really
Speaker 1: want to take water important on her and be like
Speaker 1: did you like it? But I haven't done that yet.
Speaker 1: I might because I'm just like I can't keep pulling
Speaker 1: her out of the bathtub because it's so hard. We
Speaker 1: just had someone on the podcast who's like, teach them
Speaker 1: how it makes someone else feel. I mean, that's what's
Speaker 1: so great about her having a twin. I've been trying
Speaker 1: this new thing. I'll let you know if it works.
Speaker 1: Where when my son is a dick to my four
Speaker 1: month old, not a twin, and she starts to make upset,
Speaker 1: I'm like, look at her face. She looks really upset,
Speaker 1: Like do you see that? You know, we don't want
Speaker 1: to have our friend or our family look upset. But
Speaker 1: it's really fucking hard because they just want attention and
Speaker 1: they don't care if it's good or bad. It's all
Speaker 1: the same to them. So the fact that she dumps
Speaker 1: water on Otis's head and then the whole world like
Speaker 1: gets shooken up in her face like she's like, yes,
Speaker 1: this is fucking awesome. I I know, I mean there's
Speaker 1: not enough rose, Like just give me an ivy, you know,
Speaker 1: I completely agree. Can you can you tell me about
Speaker 1: like diaper duty with twins, how do you split up
Speaker 1: the responsibilities any other thing I'm curious about, how do
Speaker 1: you split it up? You don't. I mean again, he's
Speaker 1: more laid back, so he'll wait till like a diaper's
Speaker 1: falling off. Practically, Oh god, that would fucking kill me.
Speaker 1: It it um. You know, stress makes me sick. So
Speaker 1: I'm really trying to pick my motherfucking battles because you know,
Speaker 1: if he's loading the dishwasher, and I know he's a
Speaker 1: good person, then I have to hold onto that he does.
Speaker 1: He takes a trash out like I'm trying, you know,
Speaker 1: and he is hard, like he hates hoop diapers. He'll
Speaker 1: do it, He's done it, he will do it, but
Speaker 1: he can't breathe. He starts a gag, and I'm just like,
Speaker 1: get me in there, you know, like because for me, again,
Speaker 1: I want to give the kids a good experience. I
Speaker 1: don't want them to be like, you know, I don't
Speaker 1: like this because they don't like it. You know, I'm
Speaker 1: just like, look at you, you had a good as
Speaker 1: let's see. Yeah, I'm like those are those veggie muffins
Speaker 1: and trying to make it a good experience. You don't
Speaker 1: want them to have your such a great mom, Like
Speaker 1: I can really tell I love that you've even given
Speaker 1: thought to like the diapering situation, where it's like, if
Speaker 1: I've got good vibes about the ship and pe, then
Speaker 1: they're going to have good vibes. Look, it's a big
Speaker 1: thing because my mom trying to teach me how to
Speaker 1: put a tamp on in and she it was like
Speaker 1: she had to walk like a tight rope. It was
Speaker 1: like she was that scene of like, um, what is
Speaker 1: it called Indiana Indiana Jones where she was like which
Speaker 1: cup did Jesus have? I Huh? She's like, God, what
Speaker 1: are we gonna do for when that happens? Can you
Speaker 1: tell me what are we gonna do? Well? Probably tamplus
Speaker 1: will be obsolete anyway, You're already even like a cup
Speaker 1: in your lunch box. Don't lose them, but um do
Speaker 1: you have any tips from your own journey for moms
Speaker 1: out there who are struggling to concede can see Oh yeah,
Speaker 1: yeah I do. UM. Research is your best tool. You know,
Speaker 1: if you can't get it done in your state or
Speaker 1: even your neighborhood, it doesn't mean that you can't get
Speaker 1: it done elsewhere. You have options basically. And one thing
Speaker 1: my friend Jordan's wife, well, Jordan's wife told me when
Speaker 1: I was down and out a lot, She's like, you're
Speaker 1: a crazy bitch and you will get what you want.
Speaker 1: That helped a lot. I held on to that and
Speaker 1: Jordan told me, you've had bad days, but sometimes it
Speaker 1: could be a happy ending. Don't forget that, And so
Speaker 1: I remember that always as well. Um. But yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: I'm not a big research person, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: I'm not a Aaron Brockovitch. I'm not like, how dare
Speaker 1: you say that, Sarah. I'm gonna go prove you wrong.
Speaker 1: I'm not that bitch, you know. You tell me. I'm like, oh,
Speaker 1: I'm sad. You mean I can't have kids, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean? Like I A lot of us don't
Speaker 1: know how to advocate for ourselves right, especially as women
Speaker 1: and especially in the healthcare industry. It's like it's really
Speaker 1: a lot of work, and it's a lot of being
Speaker 1: talked at, and it's a lot of um people not
Speaker 1: having the information and being exhausted and overwhelmed and not
Speaker 1: even knowing where to go. And so, yes, you have
Speaker 1: to have a little bit of Aaron Brockovich in there
Speaker 1: to sort of not not let it stop you. Keep going,
Speaker 1: keep seeing other specialists, keep asking friends about it, keep
Speaker 1: if you And that's the thing, if you talk about it,
Speaker 1: someone will have information that might yes, who and there
Speaker 1: this way, who talked to this specialist, who talked to
Speaker 1: this doctor, And it's like this is the ultimate recipe
Speaker 1: exchange that needs to happen. You know what I mean?
Speaker 1: Fucking cast roles, that's what That's what it is. That's
Speaker 1: like what it is. Um. Okay, do you have any
Speaker 1: general advice for our parent listeners about parenting right now? Yeah,
Speaker 1: don't listen to people who don't know what the funk
Speaker 1: they're talking about. You know who loves to tell you
Speaker 1: what advice people who don't know what the funk they're
Speaker 1: talking about. People are like, if you work less, if
Speaker 1: you lost weight, if you it was always somehow my fault.
Speaker 1: And I'm like, do you have a degree on your wall?
Speaker 1: You know? No you don't. So that ship, you know,
Speaker 1: it's like, yes, we have to talk to people, but
Speaker 1: when you talk to people, they feel like they want
Speaker 1: to give you some jankie acid advice or some ship
Speaker 1: and uh that part. Don't listen to people. It's all
Speaker 1: like grain of salt, you know, yea love that. Um
Speaker 1: finish this sentence. Parenthood is so are as crazy as fun?
Speaker 1: That's the Michelle Bouto quote I wanted is crazy as fun.
Speaker 1: Put it on a T shirt, Put it on a magnet,
Speaker 1: put it on a fucking magnet. Oh my, I hear
Speaker 1: baby boy crying at my phone, like what is going on?
Speaker 1: And um okay, so we'll have you on again, and
Speaker 1: you're gonna tell me about when Otis and Hazel start
Speaker 1: speaking like you and they are like they seek and
Speaker 1: Dutch and then they're like, this is just fucking me
Speaker 1: right right right here. They are actually, oh I thought
Speaker 1: they were. See what are they doing? Hi? Hi you guys?
Speaker 1: Hi you see it is hi? Oh my gosh, they
Speaker 1: are Oh my gun Is. Look at that blue thing.
Speaker 1: That's beautiful. Hi? Hi friends, Hi, Hazel hid at me. Um,
Speaker 1: it's lunch shime. You're the best. You're the best. Thank
Speaker 1: you so much for this. I hope you guys loved
Speaker 1: that episode. I sure did. I want to hang out
Speaker 1: with Michelle all the time and her amazing twins, and
Speaker 1: I want to hear from you what topics you want
Speaker 1: to discuss this season? What guests should we have on
Speaker 1: You can always reach me at Katie's Crib at Shonda
Speaker 1: land dot com. Katie's Crib is a production of Shonda
Speaker 1: Land Audio in partnership with I heart Radio. For more
Speaker 1: podcasts from Shonda Lanadi, visit the I heart Radio app,
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Speaker 1: You never know never until you try me right,