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Speaker 1: I have heard Shaq tell the story seeing you on

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Speaker 1: the set of Blue Chips talking to you, then the

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Speaker 1: draft happens, and saying you gotta trade seaweb to get

4
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Speaker 1: Penny and all this stuff. What it was like from

5
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Speaker 1: your perspective.

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Speaker 2: When I was going to Blue Chip, I knew that

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Speaker 2: I was gonna get him the ball. Every time Shack

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Speaker 2: looks up, every time it's head raises, every time his

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Speaker 2: hand is up, that ball is gonna be hitting his hands,

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Speaker 2: because I want him to know this is exactly how

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Speaker 2: I would do it in the league. I definitely audition,

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Speaker 2: not only for the movie.

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Speaker 3: For him.

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Speaker 4: Two or three days in I'm like, yo, man, who

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Speaker 4: the fuck is this actor? The motherfuck throwing the ball

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Speaker 4: to me too much?

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Speaker 3: But he nice.

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Speaker 5: Yeah. I do a pig, big big, con tell me

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Speaker 1: I do a pig.

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Speaker 5: I do a big, big big say it again.

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Speaker 1: I do a big.

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Speaker 3: What is up?

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Speaker 4: What is good?

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Speaker 1: How you living? How you feeling?

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Speaker 4: How you doing?

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Speaker 1: Welcome to another episode of The Big Podcast Shack, where

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Speaker 1: we always do it big Big. This guest is very important,

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Speaker 1: very near and dear to your heart. So I want

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Speaker 1: to ask you, sincerely, may I give him the proper introduction?

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Speaker 4: Yes you may.

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Speaker 1: Our guest today is a god in grind City. No

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Speaker 1: matter the quarter, his dimes were oh so pretty. From

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Speaker 1: high school player of the Year to the big screen

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Speaker 1: with Shack, this magical duo put the nineties bulls on

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Speaker 1: their MF and back. This man dished around MJ. He

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Speaker 1: put that man on a poster. When you're talking about

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Speaker 1: freakish guards, he makes your best look like a coaster.

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Speaker 1: Give it up for Anthony Penny Hordaway.

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Speaker 3: I appreciate that man.

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Speaker 4: What's going on?

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Speaker 2: Brother?

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Speaker 3: Man? Always good to man.

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Speaker 4: I just want to say, you know, I love your brother.

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Speaker 4: I got much respect for you. The older we get,

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Speaker 4: we start to reflect and i'm i'm. I was thinking

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Speaker 4: about it one day because somebody asked me to compare,

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Speaker 4: and that's that. I forget the comparisons because a lot

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Speaker 4: of people don't understand is you came in him. It

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Speaker 4: took the other guy a couple of years to get him.

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Speaker 4: We don't go into that. But then I said to myself,

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Speaker 4: we never had a fucking argument. No, seriously, Adam, No,

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Speaker 4: never had an argument, never had a fight. He never

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Speaker 4: missed me in the past. I tried to never miss

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Speaker 4: me in the past. So the morning I think about it,

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Speaker 4: when I left, they tried to make it a me

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Speaker 4: and him think it was more about ego thing, and

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Speaker 4: it didn't.

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Speaker 3: It didn't.

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Speaker 4: It didn't take me till years after that that And

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Speaker 4: this is what I was trying to tell Jaylen Brown,

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Speaker 4: don't worry about useless titles. Penny had his people that

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Speaker 4: loved him. I had my people that loved him. And

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Speaker 4: not only could we coincide, we did coincide. But when

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Speaker 4: they start trying to oh, Penny got his money, you

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Speaker 4: didn't get that, Puny, it got to me. And you know,

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Speaker 4: when you're twenty four, you don't think about that. But

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Speaker 4: the older guy, I thought about it. And I will

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Speaker 4: always be be trying to prop you up, brother, because

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Speaker 4: you know, again they try to compare those guys. I

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Speaker 4: played with a lot of guys, but it's only a

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Speaker 4: few guys that came in him. I came in him,

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Speaker 4: and you came in him. So when they start talking

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Speaker 4: about Hall of Fame and all that shit, I don't

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Speaker 4: want to hear that. If he didn't get hurt. I'm

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Speaker 4: gonna definitely be throwing your name out there, and I

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Speaker 4: just want to say, I love you, brother.

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Speaker 3: You know I love you, I appreciate you. I love

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Speaker 3: you too. Bro.

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Speaker 2: The biggest thing Eric Thomas said this and it just

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Speaker 2: resonated with me. He said, I never don't think about

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Speaker 2: the obligation, think about the opportunity. And I knew what

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Speaker 2: I had in you. You were the best that I

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Speaker 2: ever played with. You pushed me to the highest level.

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Speaker 2: Whatever I had in me, you brought more out every

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Speaker 2: single night. You never settled for mediocrity. You al was

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Speaker 2: about being the greatest and the best from when you

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Speaker 2: stepped in and when I stepped into the locker room.

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Speaker 2: So my thing was the reason why we never got

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Speaker 2: into argument is because I understood the moment, I understood

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Speaker 2: who I was playing with, and I was always thinking

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Speaker 2: about the opportunity more so than the obligation. So that

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Speaker 2: made me, you know, be great at the same time.

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Speaker 4: And I want to say, because I'm older now I

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Speaker 4: get to reflect on so I made a lot of mistakes.

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Speaker 4: If I ever was an asshole of your brother, I

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Speaker 4: would like to take the time to apologize to you. Man.

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Speaker 4: The Mane, I know, but I probably you know, I

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Speaker 4: probably said some stuff I shouldn't have said. So if

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Speaker 4: I ever did rub it the wrong way, but I

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Speaker 4: would listen. I was reflecting, and I'm watching things, and

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Speaker 4: I hate to think about ifs. But the only question

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Speaker 4: that that that that really like is at the top

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Speaker 4: of my flits is how many with Shack and Penny

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Speaker 4: it would have got if they stayed together? That that

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Speaker 4: that question right there, That question right there burns the

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Speaker 4: most in any other question like I like, I could say, oh,

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Speaker 4: what if him and Stanley and Chris stayed in college?

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Speaker 4: How many collegs like that? That's a cool question. But

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Speaker 4: the only question that burns me to my soul is

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Speaker 4: this one. How many is Shack and Penny would have

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Speaker 4: got if they stayed together? And then the second burning

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Speaker 4: question is how many with Shaq and Kobe got if

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Speaker 4: they stay together? Like, those questions you can't answer because

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Speaker 4: things that happen, Those are the only questions that burn

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Speaker 4: my soul. But I just want to say, man the

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Speaker 4: man brother, because you know, in the life we live

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Speaker 4: sometimes they force us to be an asshole. If I

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Speaker 4: was an asshole to you and your crew, I apologize,

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Speaker 4: but you know I love your brother. You know I'm missya.

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Speaker 4: I'm happy for you, all right.

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Speaker 1: So again our friends at DraftKings, who they really want

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Speaker 1: me to teach to kill O'Neil how to bet? It's

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Speaker 1: white guy betting WGBS, because as Shack Is told us,

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Speaker 1: black guy betting is I can run over and touch

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Speaker 1: that door before you can straight up. So white guy betting,

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Speaker 1: There's been a lot of trades big including the New

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Speaker 1: York made that trade, and now suddenly their odds have

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Speaker 1: gotten a lot better. So who are the top four

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Speaker 1: teams in the Eastern Conference most likely to go to

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Speaker 1: the finals next year? Do you want to guess the

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Speaker 1: top four teams from the East most likely to go

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Speaker 1: to the finals, named by city.

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Speaker 4: They're going to put Boston in there.

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Speaker 1: Boston is the favorite at plus one forty.

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Speaker 4: They're going to put Milwaukee in there.

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Speaker 1: Milwaukee is three at plus five hundred.

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Speaker 4: And they're going to put Philadelphia in there.

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Speaker 1: Philadelphia is four at plus six.

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Speaker 4: Point fifty, and they're going to put New York there

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Speaker 4: at number two.

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Speaker 1: They are plus four hundred at number two, And for

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Speaker 1: the first time, Shack goes on the two, three, four

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Speaker 1: and he nails it. Incredible DraftKings. We're teaching Shaquille O'Neal

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Speaker 1: how to bet pretty good, shack, pretty good.

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Speaker 4: Thank you, my brother.

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Speaker 4: I'm getting into your business now, how do you deal

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Speaker 4: with all these kids and these nil deals? Like, how

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Speaker 4: do you deal with it? Because as the president of Reebok,

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Speaker 4: I'm trying to do old school AAU camps and I

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Speaker 4: can't talk to players because they're playing in the Adidas

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Speaker 4: League and the Nikes League, and I'm like, what the

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Speaker 4: fuck does that even mean? So, like, how do you

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Speaker 4: as a coach, how do you deal with all these

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Speaker 4: agents and nil players and all that stuff, because it's

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Speaker 4: kind of driving me crazy.

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Speaker 2: It's very difficult because you know, you got to do it.

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Speaker 2: We're in a world right now where it's happening. It's here,

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Speaker 2: there's nothing that we can do about it, and it's

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Speaker 2: survival of the fittest. You have to have a fan

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Speaker 2: have to have a president and ad that believe in

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Speaker 2: it and understand it. So it's a whole thing now,

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Speaker 2: and it's not about hooping anymore. Shaq, Who knows what

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Speaker 2: you would have gotten from LSU coming out right now.

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Speaker 2: That would have been crazy numbers. But at the end

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Speaker 2: of the day, think about now, the foundation that we

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Speaker 2: laid for these young men, they're able to get and

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Speaker 2: even the guys before us, they're able to get these

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Speaker 2: type of numbers in NIO And it's just a part

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Speaker 2: of the college life now, man.

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Speaker 3: And it's very.

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Speaker 2: Difficult because instead of talking to a guy about what

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Speaker 2: you can do for him from a basketball point of view,

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Speaker 2: of helping him become a young man to a man,

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Speaker 2: it's instantly talking about the number that everybody else is offering,

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Speaker 2: and what can you do?

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Speaker 4: You think we should have some type of nil governing

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Speaker 4: body because the only thing I don't like about it is,

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Speaker 4: let's just say I took three hundred thousand from from

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Speaker 4: Memphis University, University of Memphis. Excuse me and me and

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Speaker 4: you don't get along. Now I can go back into

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Speaker 4: portal and get some new money. You think I should

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Speaker 4: be able to say, Okay, if you're gonna sign with

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Speaker 4: Penny Hardaway and he gives you three hundred thousand, you

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Speaker 4: at least got to stay two or three years. Like,

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Speaker 4: do you think there needs to be like a nil

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Speaker 4: governing body?

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Speaker 3: Man?

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Speaker 2: You know what, I would love that because you know,

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Speaker 2: there should be a governing body, because I think that

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Speaker 2: what's making the donors and the boosters around the country

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Speaker 2: frown is because they could give a guy five six

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Speaker 2: SEPs eight hundred thousand and he could have the best

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Speaker 2: year of his life. But if someone offers him two

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Speaker 2: million next year, he's gone and that's what's you know

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Speaker 2: the problem with college sports right now.

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Speaker 1: I want to jump in because you said, imagine what

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Speaker 1: Diesel would get because you do know what these numbers

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Speaker 1: are like, and like we have what do you like,

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Speaker 1: give a roundabout number? What kind of offers do you

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Speaker 1: think Shaq would be getting in this nil era?

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Speaker 2: And Shaq would have got three four million? He would

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Speaker 2: have got that would have been the highest. He would

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Speaker 2: have been the highest paid ever. Seriously, his dominance, it

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Speaker 2: would have been way up there. I've seen some guys

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Speaker 2: get two shock getting four or five four or five

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Speaker 2: million easy from these.

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Speaker 1: As an eight as a high school kid.

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Speaker 3: Yes, yes, for sure.

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Speaker 4: But you know what I would it did. I would

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Speaker 4: have did it different. And let me tell you because

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Speaker 4: I had a conversation with my kids today. For example,

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Speaker 4: let's just say Leftco Industries want to give me a million, right,

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Speaker 4: and let's just say there's this house and my mom

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Speaker 4: in the neighborhood. My mom always wanted for six hundred thousand.

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Speaker 4: What I would do is say, I don't want you

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Speaker 4: a million, but can you buy my mom at this house.

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Speaker 4: I'm gonna do business with you, but just pay my

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Speaker 4: mama's house off just in case I don't turn out

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Speaker 4: to be a great player. But at least my mama's

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Speaker 4: house is paid for. That's how I would do it.

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Speaker 4: Instead of taking four or five million. I'm going to

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Speaker 4: try to take care of family as much as I can.

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Speaker 4: After I get that black on black charger and that

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Speaker 4: black on black bens, after I get what I want.

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Speaker 4: You know, I gotta take care of mama. That five

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Speaker 4: million at seventeen, well, i'd have been crazy.

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Speaker 1: We have a question from the general, which is always

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Speaker 1: about the big break, Penny, When did you realize you

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Speaker 1: would be a successful coach? When did you look at

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Speaker 1: yourself and go, I think I could actually lead a

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Speaker 1: group of young men.

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Speaker 3: Well, I think I you know my basketball IQ.

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Speaker 2: I think I knew right away that I could be

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Speaker 2: successful because it's about building relationships, which I really have

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Speaker 2: a great field for building relationships, and the exit and

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Speaker 2: those is everything You've learned your entire life, all the

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Speaker 2: great coaches that I've played under, all the great players

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Speaker 2: that I've played with, all the great IQs and great minds.

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Speaker 2: Been a basketball historian and understand champions and studying how they.

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Speaker 3: Won, why they won.

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Speaker 2: The mentality, so right away I knew that when I

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Speaker 2: got with a group that I would be, you know,

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Speaker 2: a really good coach because of those things. Now, you

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Speaker 2: can't get out there and play for them, but obviously

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Speaker 2: you know how to how to you know how to

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Speaker 2: coach the game. Now, I think building relationships it's just

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Speaker 2: as important as doing exit and os the diesel.

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Speaker 4: First of all, Penny, I love your professional lism, but

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Speaker 4: that's not the real Adam answer at him. I knew

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Speaker 4: Penny was gonna be a great coach. And in huddle

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Speaker 4: situation where coach withdraw a play, we go back to

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Speaker 4: the court, Penny be like, man, fuck that, I'm gonna

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Speaker 4: do this. I'm gonna boom boom boom. Nick de Scott,

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Speaker 4: You'll be ready in the corner if the motherfucker don't

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Speaker 4: pick me up and take it all away. If he come,

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Speaker 4: I'm gonna get be ready to shoot shacks. Been up

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Speaker 4: a lot. That's why I knew he was gonna be

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Speaker 4: a great coach, because he'd like he would see things

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Speaker 4: the other guys and be so he gave you the

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Speaker 4: corporate answer, but the non corporate answer like and I'm

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Speaker 4: not gonna call a coach up, but the coach be

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Speaker 4: rolling to play soon as we get back out and

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Speaker 4: getting our huddle. Penny, be like, man, fuck that were

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Speaker 4: not doing that. I'm about to take about the dribblet. Nick,

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Speaker 4: you go up to the left corner, these guys you

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Speaker 4: go to the right corner, be ready to shoot. Well

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Speaker 4: two or three break?

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Speaker 1: Is there truth to that, Penny? Now, we don't want

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Speaker 1: your players right now.

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Speaker 3: Time.

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Speaker 2: We didn't do it every time, but there's some truth.

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Speaker 2: If I felt something, then, being the leader, I would

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Speaker 2: I would change it. Not to disrespect the coach, but

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Speaker 2: to be like, I know that this is gonna work,

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Speaker 2: and I knew that I had to make it work

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Speaker 2: or else coach is gonna get after me.

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Speaker 4: This episode of the Big Podcast with Shack is brought

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Speaker 4: to you by the General. You know, Shack loves the General.

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Speaker 1: I have heard Shack tell the story of seeing you

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Speaker 1: on the set of Blue Chips, talking to you, then

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Speaker 1: the draft happens and saying you got a trade seaweb

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Speaker 1: to get Penny and all this stuff. I've always wondered

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Speaker 1: what it was like from your perspective, where you meet

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Speaker 1: this guy and then he starts moving all these chess

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Speaker 1: pieces to get you. What was it like for you?

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Speaker 3: Well, here's the thing with me.

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Speaker 2: I was extremely smart when I knew I was on

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Speaker 2: a movie with Blue Chips, because I knew Shack was

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Speaker 2: the most dominant person in the league and to me,

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Speaker 2: and I wanted to play with him really badly because

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Speaker 2: I knew he would make my life easy. So when

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Speaker 2: I was going to Blue Chips, I knew that I

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Speaker 2: was going to get him the ball.

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Speaker 3: I was this.

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Speaker 2: It's the same thing that happened when I was in

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Speaker 2: the league. The late great Pete Newle and I had

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Speaker 2: a conversation and I told him every time Shaq looked

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Speaker 2: so every time it's head raises every time his hand

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Speaker 2: is up. That ball is gonna be hitting his hands

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Speaker 2: every single time, because I want him to know this

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Speaker 2: is exactly how I would do.

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Speaker 3: It in the league.

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Speaker 2: And William Freakin, who was our director, he allowed us

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Speaker 2: to play real basketball. We didn't do any acting until

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Speaker 2: the very last part when I threw shock the lob.

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Speaker 2: So it was real basketball every day, and they were

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Speaker 2: real basketball minds around and man, I was just diming

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Speaker 2: him every time. And you know what he's gonna do.

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Speaker 2: Wh he's getting the ball in scoring position. He's scoring

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Speaker 2: it every time. So he looked at that situation. I mean,

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Speaker 2: no knock on Chris Webber. We both love Chris Webber,

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Speaker 2: respect Chris Webber, but that the Guard Big combination was

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Speaker 2: better than the Big Big combination. And I definitely auditioned

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Speaker 2: not only for the movie, but for him.

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Speaker 1: Do you remember any acting tips that he gave you

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Speaker 1: back then since he had.

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Speaker 4: Done some stuff.

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Speaker 3: No, no, no, we're not gonna go there. No acting,

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Speaker 3: good acting tips.

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Speaker 4: And you know the great thing about that story, Adam

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Speaker 4: is this guy would always tell me, Man, you gotta

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Speaker 4: start taking over because I'm look, I'm kid. Whatever the

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Speaker 4: coach says, you do it right. Our team was not

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Speaker 4: even close being built for a championship. The guy's like, man,

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Speaker 4: you gotta take over. Now you got so he would

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Speaker 4: always say you got to take over. And I wouldn't

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Speaker 4: say it was shy, but I was always respectful. And

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Speaker 4: then I'm playing with Penny and like two or three

416
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Speaker 4: days in, I'm like, yo, man, who the fuck is

417
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Speaker 4: this actor? This motherfucker, this motherfucker throwing the ball to

418
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Speaker 4: me two much? But he nice, like the mother fucking

419
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Speaker 4: play And they say, yo, man, that that's Penny Hardaway

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Speaker 4: and I'm like, who who. Then they went back and

421
00:19:29,359 --> 00:19:31,639
Speaker 4: showed me his tape. I was like, oh shit, he

422
00:19:31,640 --> 00:19:33,399
Speaker 4: he's a college player and say yeah, he put his

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Speaker 4: name in the draft. They say he can go top three.

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Speaker 4: So now I said, okay, Now this guy telling me, hey,

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Speaker 4: you gotta do this, you gotta do I said, I'm

426
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Speaker 4: gonna try it. I'm gonna just try it. I picked

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Speaker 4: up the phone and I was I was terrified. I

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Speaker 4: was like, listen, John, I'm playing with this guy, Penny Hardaway.

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Speaker 4: You heard of him, Yeah, I heard him, but uh,

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Speaker 4: you know we're gonna go with see web, I said,

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Speaker 4: I don't think you should do that. I think you

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Speaker 4: should go with him. Huh. I said, listen, if you

433
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Speaker 4: don't pick this guy here with my deal up, I'm

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Speaker 4: gonna be looking somewhere else. And I hung up the

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Speaker 4: phone like I didn't want to do it because I'm

436
00:20:05,359 --> 00:20:07,480
Speaker 4: not that guy on I like to let my agent

437
00:20:07,560 --> 00:20:10,720
Speaker 4: have that. So now I'm at home, movies over. I'm

438
00:20:10,720 --> 00:20:13,639
Speaker 4: at home, and they didn't do it. So now I

439
00:20:13,760 --> 00:20:16,640
Speaker 4: was like, this guy set me up. My shit don't work.

440
00:20:16,680 --> 00:20:19,439
Speaker 4: I'm tearing my house up, busting mirror and no penny

441
00:20:19,680 --> 00:20:21,960
Speaker 4: you remember that, you know, little back, little pull outside.

442
00:20:22,400 --> 00:20:25,879
Speaker 4: I'm busting out windows. I'm mad. And then they did it,

443
00:20:25,920 --> 00:20:27,960
Speaker 4: and I was like, oh my god, it worked because

444
00:20:28,359 --> 00:20:31,159
Speaker 4: the way he was diming me up, I was thinking

445
00:20:31,240 --> 00:20:35,560
Speaker 4: New Magic Johnson and New Koreean because listen, I've never

446
00:20:35,640 --> 00:20:37,640
Speaker 4: had a guy that size. I always had the little

447
00:20:37,680 --> 00:20:39,680
Speaker 4: guys down me up. But this kid was sick nine

448
00:20:40,280 --> 00:20:42,680
Speaker 4: and Adam. When I'm telling you, he threw the bottle

449
00:20:42,680 --> 00:20:45,800
Speaker 4: of me. Every time. He actually gave me confidence to

450
00:20:45,840 --> 00:20:48,160
Speaker 4: be like, okay, go ahead and score, because I'm used

451
00:20:48,200 --> 00:20:52,720
Speaker 4: to you know, picking roll and I and okay, now

452
00:20:52,760 --> 00:20:56,200
Speaker 4: you score, playing with him, it's like no, score score again,

453
00:20:56,480 --> 00:20:59,480
Speaker 4: score again, scor So. I know a lot of people

454
00:20:59,520 --> 00:21:01,760
Speaker 4: know I put barbecue sauce on that start, but this

455
00:21:01,880 --> 00:21:03,879
Speaker 4: is the true story. I didn't know who Penny was.

456
00:21:04,280 --> 00:21:06,600
Speaker 4: I thought he was an actor and I asked some

457
00:21:06,760 --> 00:21:09,600
Speaker 4: dude and he looked at me. He said, he said, man,

458
00:21:09,600 --> 00:21:12,320
Speaker 4: that's Penny Horto. I'm like, who said, man? He played me.

459
00:21:12,359 --> 00:21:14,280
Speaker 4: I'm like, oh, so he's a real player. He was

460
00:21:14,320 --> 00:21:17,280
Speaker 4: like yeah. I said, well, ship, I gotta get him

461
00:21:17,280 --> 00:21:18,960
Speaker 4: on the squad. Yeah.

462
00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:20,959
Speaker 2: And from my side, it was basically the whole it

463
00:21:21,000 --> 00:21:22,760
Speaker 2: was a setup for me. I was like, if I

464
00:21:22,800 --> 00:21:25,040
Speaker 2: don't do it now, it's never going to happen. And

465
00:21:25,080 --> 00:21:26,800
Speaker 2: I really wanted to be in Orlando with Shack, so

466
00:21:27,280 --> 00:21:28,160
Speaker 2: that's how it worked out.

467
00:21:28,520 --> 00:21:31,879
Speaker 1: I know that Shaq is a very very proud fraternity

468
00:21:31,920 --> 00:21:34,159
Speaker 1: member of a mega sci fi and so when I

469
00:21:34,240 --> 00:21:37,000
Speaker 1: found out that Penny was a proud member of Kappa

470
00:21:37,080 --> 00:21:40,359
Speaker 1: Alpha PSI was that ever an issue because I know

471
00:21:40,400 --> 00:21:42,119
Speaker 1: how important fraternity.

472
00:21:41,600 --> 00:21:44,160
Speaker 4: Life is to you, a big fellow. Let me answer first.

473
00:21:44,240 --> 00:21:46,399
Speaker 4: One time I challenged him with that cane and he

474
00:21:46,520 --> 00:21:50,000
Speaker 4: set that thing off in the locker room. He he

475
00:21:50,080 --> 00:21:53,800
Speaker 4: went crazy. I was like, I would never disrespect him.

476
00:21:53,920 --> 00:21:56,600
Speaker 4: And man had that thing and he was twelveing that

477
00:21:56,680 --> 00:21:59,080
Speaker 4: thing and boombo. I was like, oh like he like

478
00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:02,000
Speaker 4: he like for a big guy. It was only one

479
00:22:02,040 --> 00:22:04,720
Speaker 4: other big guys seen rock and I was Montel Jordan's

480
00:22:05,320 --> 00:22:08,119
Speaker 4: so like I was just a mester. You can't stop,

481
00:22:08,200 --> 00:22:10,760
Speaker 4: you know, I says. I said, bro, you don't know

482
00:22:10,760 --> 00:22:12,480
Speaker 4: how to work. That came. He brought that thing in

483
00:22:12,520 --> 00:22:14,920
Speaker 4: one day and started touring that thing. I was like,

484
00:22:15,080 --> 00:22:18,879
Speaker 4: oh my god, I was actually mesmerized. I really was.

485
00:22:18,960 --> 00:22:21,840
Speaker 4: So we didn't have a problem. I definitely never respect

486
00:22:21,880 --> 00:22:23,640
Speaker 4: him for it, but he knew how to work that came.

487
00:22:24,359 --> 00:22:25,000
Speaker 4: Trust me, he do.

488
00:22:25,119 --> 00:22:27,000
Speaker 3: We never had any problems on the on the fraternity

489
00:22:27,040 --> 00:22:28,160
Speaker 3: side at him.

490
00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:32,760
Speaker 4: Never actually Penny got Penny got mad at me. One

491
00:22:32,800 --> 00:22:37,080
Speaker 4: time I did get mad. I'm gonna tell you why. No,

492
00:22:37,280 --> 00:22:39,560
Speaker 4: I'm gonna tell you why. Little Penny was hot.

493
00:22:39,760 --> 00:22:42,040
Speaker 1: Oh it was hot. Little Penny was everywhere.

494
00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:46,760
Speaker 4: Little was hot. So one time I was doing a

495
00:22:46,840 --> 00:22:48,920
Speaker 4: rebock commercial and I ain't gonna lie a little Penny.

496
00:22:49,480 --> 00:22:51,840
Speaker 4: A little Penny was out selling me, So now I

497
00:22:51,920 --> 00:22:54,119
Speaker 4: gotta make some noise. So I did like this reboy

498
00:22:54,160 --> 00:22:59,560
Speaker 4: commercial where a little Penny was at the end plant planet.

499
00:23:01,320 --> 00:23:03,679
Speaker 4: When I came in the locker room, Penny ain't say nothing,

500
00:23:04,000 --> 00:23:08,639
Speaker 4: but Penny was mad. I was like, oh, maybe I

501
00:23:08,640 --> 00:23:10,320
Speaker 4: shouldn't have did that, but like we used to do

502
00:23:10,400 --> 00:23:14,359
Speaker 4: pranks all the time. But Penny was mad as we.

503
00:23:14,359 --> 00:23:18,000
Speaker 3: Didn't apologize, but I was mad. I was okay, I got.

504
00:23:21,119 --> 00:23:25,199
Speaker 1: The old Penny was everywhere. But on the fraternity thing,

505
00:23:25,240 --> 00:23:27,280
Speaker 1: I remember when Shaq was telling me this story, and

506
00:23:27,320 --> 00:23:29,480
Speaker 1: Shaq was like, oh, I was pledging a fraternity. And

507
00:23:29,480 --> 00:23:31,440
Speaker 1: then the coach found out and was like, what are

508
00:23:31,440 --> 00:23:36,879
Speaker 1: you doing? The notion of you guys' top NBA draft

509
00:23:36,880 --> 00:23:40,960
Speaker 1: picks being in these fraternities now, I mean, now you're

510
00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:42,920
Speaker 1: a coach of Memphis, Like, I don't know if that'll

511
00:23:42,960 --> 00:23:45,920
Speaker 1: ever happen, But back then, I mean, this was part

512
00:23:45,960 --> 00:23:48,400
Speaker 1: of the process. This is what was happening. But now

513
00:23:48,440 --> 00:23:49,720
Speaker 1: it'll never happen, right.

514
00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:52,679
Speaker 2: I mean, like I said, back then, it was it

515
00:23:52,760 --> 00:23:55,400
Speaker 2: was a part of the game. Like the fraternities were,

516
00:23:55,440 --> 00:23:57,439
Speaker 2: they ran the yard, they athletest in the fraternity, so

517
00:23:58,240 --> 00:23:59,879
Speaker 2: you just chose when one you wanted, and that's what

518
00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:00,600
Speaker 2: it was about.

519
00:24:00,840 --> 00:24:02,000
Speaker 3: All the women love the athletes.

520
00:24:02,040 --> 00:24:04,679
Speaker 2: They love the praternities, and if you're an athlete that

521
00:24:04,720 --> 00:24:07,040
Speaker 2: got into a fraternity, then you had you had a

522
00:24:07,080 --> 00:24:10,359
Speaker 2: lot of cloud, a lot of cloud.

523
00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:12,560
Speaker 1: So it was like a step up, like you weren't

524
00:24:12,600 --> 00:24:15,000
Speaker 1: just a college athlete, you were even above that.

525
00:24:15,480 --> 00:24:17,920
Speaker 2: Oh absolutely, you're definitely above that when you're a fraternity

526
00:24:17,960 --> 00:24:18,960
Speaker 2: and you're a college athlete.

527
00:24:19,119 --> 00:24:21,639
Speaker 4: Because they had something that we wanted. They wanted that

528
00:24:21,760 --> 00:24:24,680
Speaker 4: status in that cloud. Of course you're gonna have status

529
00:24:24,680 --> 00:24:27,280
Speaker 4: in an athlete, but they had all the other Like

530
00:24:27,320 --> 00:24:29,160
Speaker 4: I would see guy like we had this little dude

531
00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:31,480
Speaker 4: named but a little dude but his name was Peanut.

532
00:24:32,119 --> 00:24:36,760
Speaker 4: Same size as the Penny Q dog. Respect out of

533
00:24:36,840 --> 00:24:38,800
Speaker 4: this world. So when I saw them, I was like, man,

534
00:24:38,800 --> 00:24:40,960
Speaker 4: I want to be part of them. That's what I

535
00:24:41,000 --> 00:24:44,120
Speaker 4: want to be with. So, yeah, it's but they were

536
00:24:44,200 --> 00:24:46,800
Speaker 4: kind of they were kind of knuckleheads on the yard.

537
00:24:47,400 --> 00:24:50,760
Speaker 4: So when you think about Nil and Brand and all that,

538
00:24:51,280 --> 00:24:52,920
Speaker 4: coach are trying to protect me, but I was I

539
00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:54,800
Speaker 4: don't want protection. I want to be you know, I

540
00:24:54,840 --> 00:24:58,040
Speaker 4: definitely want to be part of that. Today's episode is

541
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542
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543
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544
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545
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546
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547
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548
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549
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550
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551
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552
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Speaker 1: The Little Penny movement. I think it's actually interesting. I

553
00:25:40,680 --> 00:25:44,240
Speaker 1: am a sneaker head, and we are about to have

554
00:25:44,560 --> 00:25:48,560
Speaker 1: later this year the re release of these incredible things. Yes,

555
00:25:49,080 --> 00:25:53,640
Speaker 1: the Nike Phone Posit, dark Neon Royal. I mean this

556
00:25:53,680 --> 00:25:55,840
Speaker 1: is when I see these, I think of Penny Hardaway

557
00:25:56,359 --> 00:25:58,840
Speaker 1: and the phone Posit was a movement just from a

558
00:25:58,880 --> 00:26:01,520
Speaker 1: sneaker head perspective of Penny. What was that like to

559
00:26:01,560 --> 00:26:05,160
Speaker 1: be a part of so many big, iconic cultural sneakers.

560
00:26:05,160 --> 00:26:07,280
Speaker 2: You know, it's crazy how it all came about. Because

561
00:26:07,320 --> 00:26:11,399
Speaker 2: we were in the playoffs and then Ike brought the

562
00:26:11,440 --> 00:26:13,000
Speaker 2: sneaker to me and asked me that I like him.

563
00:26:13,040 --> 00:26:15,680
Speaker 2: I love them right away because I understood, I don't

564
00:26:15,720 --> 00:26:17,560
Speaker 2: know how that this was going to be.

565
00:26:17,520 --> 00:26:21,000
Speaker 3: More of a futuristic sneaker. Sneaker. It wasn't normal.

566
00:26:21,040 --> 00:26:23,320
Speaker 2: I had never seen that before, and I was like,

567
00:26:23,359 --> 00:26:25,480
Speaker 2: I want to be the first guy to rock these.

568
00:26:25,880 --> 00:26:27,600
Speaker 2: And I wore them in the game in a series

569
00:26:27,640 --> 00:26:32,040
Speaker 2: against the Philadelphia seventy six ers, and they made me

570
00:26:32,040 --> 00:26:35,479
Speaker 2: put the tape in between because it wasn't really a

571
00:26:35,560 --> 00:26:38,960
Speaker 2: road shoe, it was a home shoe. And I wore

572
00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:41,639
Speaker 2: them on the road and David Stern rest in Peace

573
00:26:42,240 --> 00:26:44,280
Speaker 2: called our equipment manager. Whoever from the NBA called our

574
00:26:44,320 --> 00:26:46,400
Speaker 2: equipment manager and said, Penny cannot wear those shoes again

575
00:26:46,400 --> 00:26:49,080
Speaker 2: on the road. So we put electrical tape. That's when

576
00:26:49,080 --> 00:26:51,720
Speaker 2: they called it the sharpie phone. We put electrical black

577
00:26:51,760 --> 00:26:57,840
Speaker 2: electrical tape. Oh seed check, yeah. Put the tape in

578
00:26:57,880 --> 00:27:02,080
Speaker 2: between the little the ridges and I wore them and

579
00:27:02,080 --> 00:27:04,120
Speaker 2: the tape was coming off, so we started filling in

580
00:27:04,160 --> 00:27:06,800
Speaker 2: where the tape was coming off with the sharpie just

581
00:27:06,800 --> 00:27:08,520
Speaker 2: to make them a black sneaker so they wouldn't find

582
00:27:08,520 --> 00:27:10,080
Speaker 2: me wow, and to.

583
00:27:09,960 --> 00:27:11,640
Speaker 3: Be a part of that movement. Was crazy.

584
00:27:11,720 --> 00:27:14,040
Speaker 1: Oh, the phone positive student. I live in New York.

585
00:27:14,400 --> 00:27:17,000
Speaker 1: Phone positive is like a New York shoe that people

586
00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:20,399
Speaker 1: will wear out on the street, Like that's a summer shoe.

587
00:27:20,480 --> 00:27:22,720
Speaker 1: I'm about to see that all the time in New York.

588
00:27:23,280 --> 00:27:24,280
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, and the DMB.

589
00:27:24,880 --> 00:27:27,080
Speaker 4: Penny, I've been knowing you twenty twenty five years. I've

590
00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:30,240
Speaker 4: never asked you this question. Where's the name Penny come from?

591
00:27:30,320 --> 00:27:30,800
Speaker 3: My grandmother?

592
00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:32,959
Speaker 2: My grandmother said I was pretty as a penny when

593
00:27:32,960 --> 00:27:34,919
Speaker 2: I was born. You know how grandmother's are shit. You

594
00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:37,240
Speaker 2: couldn't argue with grandmother pretty.

595
00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:41,320
Speaker 4: Yeah, you can't pretty as a penny. Okay, that makes sense.

596
00:27:42,760 --> 00:27:45,159
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, I looked it up to me.

597
00:27:45,240 --> 00:27:48,680
Speaker 4: No, no, I never asked him. And then Penny, I

598
00:27:50,840 --> 00:27:54,080
Speaker 4: talked about this the other day. You know, intelligent people

599
00:27:54,119 --> 00:27:57,080
Speaker 4: like us understood it, but the non intelligent people didn't

600
00:27:57,160 --> 00:28:02,760
Speaker 4: understand it. I've always used national jealousy as long as

601
00:28:02,800 --> 00:28:07,560
Speaker 4: you respect, I've always used that as motivation. For example,

602
00:28:08,119 --> 00:28:10,720
Speaker 4: when I got there, it was all by myself. Now

603
00:28:10,720 --> 00:28:15,480
Speaker 4: here comes Penny Hardaway. He's selling similar jersey sales. He's

604
00:28:15,480 --> 00:28:19,040
Speaker 4: selling similar shoe sales. Did you did you think like

605
00:28:19,080 --> 00:28:21,560
Speaker 4: that and also use it as motivation being on the

606
00:28:21,600 --> 00:28:24,600
Speaker 4: team with me, because listen, even though we were friends

607
00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:26,640
Speaker 4: and then and then one thing about me, I'm never

608
00:28:26,680 --> 00:28:30,879
Speaker 4: gonna disrespect you, but I knew I had competition. But

609
00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:33,720
Speaker 4: I use that because like my thing was saying, Okay,

610
00:28:33,800 --> 00:28:35,679
Speaker 4: Penny coming in here is still in my shye, I

611
00:28:35,720 --> 00:28:38,400
Speaker 4: still got average twenty eight thirty like that. That's that's

612
00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:41,000
Speaker 4: how I that's how I've all you know what I'm saying,

613
00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:43,960
Speaker 4: Like you know, like you know, the time we beat Mike.

614
00:28:44,400 --> 00:28:46,600
Speaker 4: My whole process was they always talking about Mic. They

615
00:28:46,640 --> 00:28:49,479
Speaker 4: always talking about Mic. Forget that is me and Penny's time.

616
00:28:49,600 --> 00:28:52,440
Speaker 4: So do you use and I hope you'd use that

617
00:28:52,480 --> 00:28:55,240
Speaker 4: at the center, do you use the term professional jealousy

618
00:28:55,800 --> 00:28:56,480
Speaker 4: as motivation?

619
00:28:57,240 --> 00:28:59,080
Speaker 2: I mean, how can you not when you were when

620
00:28:59,080 --> 00:29:02,760
Speaker 2: you have that drive and you see things, it just

621
00:29:02,840 --> 00:29:05,080
Speaker 2: it just burns you. You know, it should burn you

622
00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:07,080
Speaker 2: to be better. It should, it burns you should to

623
00:29:07,160 --> 00:29:10,480
Speaker 2: greatness really and for sure, even like you said, with

624
00:29:10,520 --> 00:29:14,000
Speaker 2: the Rebounk deal versus the Nike deal, and I felt

625
00:29:14,040 --> 00:29:15,480
Speaker 2: like I wanted to be the best in the world.

626
00:29:16,160 --> 00:29:18,520
Speaker 2: And like I said, it was never disrespect but there's

627
00:29:18,560 --> 00:29:20,080
Speaker 2: no way you respect me as a man if I'm

628
00:29:20,080 --> 00:29:22,440
Speaker 2: not trying to be the best in my craft. You know,

629
00:29:22,440 --> 00:29:25,520
Speaker 2: it wasn't bound to anybody because we were both fighting

630
00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:27,560
Speaker 2: for the same things in the league and everywhere. Because

631
00:29:27,560 --> 00:29:29,000
Speaker 2: I wanted to be the best guard in the world.

632
00:29:29,040 --> 00:29:30,920
Speaker 2: So at the end of the day, I knew I

633
00:29:30,960 --> 00:29:32,360
Speaker 2: had to handle my business. I knew you were going

634
00:29:32,400 --> 00:29:35,440
Speaker 2: to handle yours, and that was motivation at all times

635
00:29:35,480 --> 00:29:35,880
Speaker 2: for sure.

636
00:29:36,320 --> 00:29:39,880
Speaker 1: Since nobody knows Memphis quite like you. We had this

637
00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:43,040
Speaker 1: in the NBA draft where Zach Edie gets drafted by

638
00:29:43,080 --> 00:29:46,920
Speaker 1: the Memphis Grizzlies. And I'm curious, since you know the

639
00:29:46,920 --> 00:29:49,920
Speaker 1: college game really well, how do you think he'll translate.

640
00:29:50,040 --> 00:29:52,200
Speaker 1: What do you think about him with John Morant and

641
00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:52,760
Speaker 1: that roster.

642
00:29:53,440 --> 00:29:57,800
Speaker 2: Well, I think that the Grizzlies, you know, had to

643
00:29:57,800 --> 00:29:59,800
Speaker 2: make a decision on the center because we needed a center.

644
00:30:00,040 --> 00:30:00,520
Speaker 3: Zach Edie.

645
00:30:00,560 --> 00:30:03,200
Speaker 2: Come on, man, he's not some bombs Zakidie can really

646
00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:06,800
Speaker 2: play now on this level of the NBA, it's going

647
00:30:06,880 --> 00:30:08,320
Speaker 2: to be faster, guys are going to be pulling them

648
00:30:08,320 --> 00:30:09,719
Speaker 2: out of the pain and bring him on the perimeter.

649
00:30:10,040 --> 00:30:11,640
Speaker 2: But if you watch him, he's pretty mobile.

650
00:30:11,680 --> 00:30:14,800
Speaker 3: To be that big. He's not this slow guy that

651
00:30:14,920 --> 00:30:15,400
Speaker 3: can't move.

652
00:30:15,520 --> 00:30:17,760
Speaker 2: So I think for the times if they pull him

653
00:30:17,760 --> 00:30:19,880
Speaker 2: out to the perimeter, he will have to go out

654
00:30:19,880 --> 00:30:22,000
Speaker 2: there and learn how to play. But anything coming to

655
00:30:22,040 --> 00:30:23,800
Speaker 2: that basket, man, he's coming weak side and is going

656
00:30:23,880 --> 00:30:26,720
Speaker 2: to protect the rim. So for me rebounding and protecting

657
00:30:26,720 --> 00:30:29,880
Speaker 2: the rim being in that drop coverage, it might hurt

658
00:30:29,920 --> 00:30:31,920
Speaker 2: them sometimes maybe not, But at the end of the day,

659
00:30:31,960 --> 00:30:35,920
Speaker 2: I think he'll be a bigger force offensively for them because, man,

660
00:30:35,920 --> 00:30:37,360
Speaker 2: you got to account for him on that role. You

661
00:30:37,400 --> 00:30:39,120
Speaker 2: got account for him getting too that basket.

662
00:30:39,520 --> 00:30:42,560
Speaker 4: What do you think, Shaq? Coach Penny, I want to

663
00:30:42,560 --> 00:30:45,680
Speaker 4: ask the coach question, when are we going back to

664
00:30:45,760 --> 00:30:48,560
Speaker 4: old school basketball? You just talked about the drop coverage

665
00:30:48,560 --> 00:30:51,440
Speaker 4: and doing all the switching. Why don't we go back

666
00:30:51,480 --> 00:30:54,520
Speaker 4: to old school? You're seven foot I don't want your garden.

667
00:30:54,800 --> 00:30:57,720
Speaker 4: I don't want your garden, Dame Lillard when they go

668
00:30:57,800 --> 00:30:59,480
Speaker 4: to the one to five pick and roll, so win.

669
00:30:59,640 --> 00:31:02,240
Speaker 4: As a coach, when do you decide? Because back in

670
00:31:02,280 --> 00:31:04,480
Speaker 4: our day it was all about adjustments. When are we

671
00:31:04,560 --> 00:31:07,239
Speaker 4: gonna make real adjustments again rather than just doing what

672
00:31:07,280 --> 00:31:09,640
Speaker 4: everybody else is doing. If you're a small team like

673
00:31:09,680 --> 00:31:12,000
Speaker 4: Golden State, one in five is okay. But if you

674
00:31:12,080 --> 00:31:14,920
Speaker 4: got Zach Edy on the court, you know, you know

675
00:31:15,640 --> 00:31:18,080
Speaker 4: Milwaukee will play Milwaukee. They're gonna they ain't gonna go

676
00:31:18,120 --> 00:31:20,200
Speaker 4: to one five pick and roll to see what you're

677
00:31:20,240 --> 00:31:22,280
Speaker 4: gonna do. So, as a coach, when are we going

678
00:31:22,320 --> 00:31:23,360
Speaker 4: back to the old school? Didit?

679
00:31:23,440 --> 00:31:25,320
Speaker 2: I think it's coming soon, to be very honest with you,

680
00:31:25,360 --> 00:31:27,240
Speaker 2: They have to evolve if they're gonna draft guys like

681
00:31:27,320 --> 00:31:29,800
Speaker 2: Zach Edy, because think about it, he can't switch one

682
00:31:29,840 --> 00:31:32,400
Speaker 2: through five. You just can't switch one through five with him.

683
00:31:32,840 --> 00:31:35,320
Speaker 2: You have to go back to a hard show. You

684
00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:37,240
Speaker 2: gotta go back to maybe a corral and then get

685
00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:38,600
Speaker 2: back and then the rest of the guys just kind

686
00:31:38,600 --> 00:31:40,360
Speaker 2: of hold it down until it gets back and then

687
00:31:40,400 --> 00:31:42,000
Speaker 2: you got to put that guard under pressure to make

688
00:31:42,040 --> 00:31:44,160
Speaker 2: him make passes. Nowadays, I don't trust guards can make

689
00:31:44,200 --> 00:31:46,040
Speaker 2: passes through those type of situations anymore.

690
00:31:46,440 --> 00:31:47,560
Speaker 3: I think they have the easy route.

691
00:31:47,560 --> 00:31:49,680
Speaker 2: When it's a drop coverage or switch one through five,

692
00:31:50,280 --> 00:31:51,920
Speaker 2: they have it really easy. But if you get back

693
00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:54,360
Speaker 2: to some old school coverage, because everybody's not gonna be

694
00:31:55,040 --> 00:31:57,800
Speaker 2: the stretch big, you know you have some guys in

695
00:31:58,080 --> 00:32:01,240
Speaker 2: the NBA this year in the playoffs, they weren't stretched bigs.

696
00:32:01,480 --> 00:32:03,960
Speaker 2: They were pick and roll guys. They weren't picking pop guys.

697
00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:06,680
Speaker 2: So how are those guys gonna survive? You know, on

698
00:32:06,720 --> 00:32:09,120
Speaker 2: the defensive band? And to me, when you get Zach Edie,

699
00:32:09,360 --> 00:32:10,840
Speaker 2: you have to adjust, And I don't think that's a

700
00:32:10,880 --> 00:32:11,280
Speaker 2: bad thing.

701
00:32:11,400 --> 00:32:14,280
Speaker 1: So one thing that cracks me up about Shack all

702
00:32:14,320 --> 00:32:17,920
Speaker 1: the time is We'll be doing TV and I'll say,

703
00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:20,800
Speaker 1: this is unacceptable. All you need to do is average

704
00:32:20,840 --> 00:32:24,000
Speaker 1: eight points a quarter and you get thirty two points,

705
00:32:24,240 --> 00:32:27,080
Speaker 1: and that's how you become great. And I've always left

706
00:32:27,120 --> 00:32:30,560
Speaker 1: because it has always seemed so easy in Shack's brain,

707
00:32:30,720 --> 00:32:33,320
Speaker 1: because he's Shack. Yeah, I was curious, as like the

708
00:32:33,400 --> 00:32:37,520
Speaker 1: running mate did what was it like to be teammates

709
00:32:37,520 --> 00:32:40,600
Speaker 1: with someone that really could do whatever they wanted out there?

710
00:32:40,920 --> 00:32:43,479
Speaker 1: How would you embrace that? And then also what did

711
00:32:43,560 --> 00:32:45,120
Speaker 1: you have to deal with with somebody like that?

712
00:32:45,160 --> 00:32:47,840
Speaker 2: No, So for me, that was his mentality to get

713
00:32:47,880 --> 00:32:49,760
Speaker 2: eight a quarter, and I was feeding him, but he

714
00:32:49,800 --> 00:32:51,480
Speaker 2: had to go to the bench. When he went to

715
00:32:51,520 --> 00:32:53,280
Speaker 2: the bench, I got my six per quarter. That was

716
00:32:53,320 --> 00:32:55,840
Speaker 2: my number. When he went to the bench, I got

717
00:32:55,840 --> 00:32:57,320
Speaker 2: my six per quarter. There was no way you weren't

718
00:32:57,320 --> 00:32:59,680
Speaker 2: stopping me from getting six per quarter. So and you

719
00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:01,200
Speaker 2: got to we were in multiple ways. If you're just

720
00:33:01,200 --> 00:33:03,080
Speaker 2: a shot attemp guy, I went to the offensive glass,

721
00:33:03,120 --> 00:33:04,760
Speaker 2: I called lives, I shot threes, I got to the

722
00:33:04,760 --> 00:33:05,880
Speaker 2: fire line, I posted up.

723
00:33:06,240 --> 00:33:07,320
Speaker 3: I scored multiple ways.

724
00:33:07,360 --> 00:33:09,040
Speaker 2: So when you do that, it's easy to get six,

725
00:33:09,280 --> 00:33:10,880
Speaker 2: it's easy to get eight. But when you're just a

726
00:33:10,920 --> 00:33:13,160
Speaker 2: shooter and you were lying on the jump shot every time,

727
00:33:13,200 --> 00:33:14,840
Speaker 2: it's hard to get six and eight a quarter unless

728
00:33:14,840 --> 00:33:17,719
Speaker 2: you're just so efficient like Steff and Claying those guys.

729
00:33:19,320 --> 00:33:20,880
Speaker 1: Do you ever have a moment where you were out

730
00:33:21,280 --> 00:33:24,920
Speaker 1: with Shaq and Shaq put the big bear claw on

731
00:33:25,000 --> 00:33:26,920
Speaker 1: you and was like you got to get out of here,

732
00:33:27,360 --> 00:33:29,480
Speaker 1: like he kind of was like the guardian angel that

733
00:33:29,760 --> 00:33:30,600
Speaker 1: got you out of trouble.

734
00:33:31,760 --> 00:33:33,720
Speaker 3: No, we really never really got in any trouble.

735
00:33:33,760 --> 00:33:33,880
Speaker 5: Man.

736
00:33:33,920 --> 00:33:36,000
Speaker 2: We were we were like the cool kids. Man, I

737
00:33:36,000 --> 00:33:38,200
Speaker 2: ain't gonna even lie to you. We were the cool kids,

738
00:33:38,240 --> 00:33:40,200
Speaker 2: and back then everybody loved us. So everywhere again, it

739
00:33:40,240 --> 00:33:42,160
Speaker 2: was a friends. Everywhere we went, it was like a frenzy.

740
00:33:42,480 --> 00:33:44,280
Speaker 2: And that you asked me the question earlier, just playing

741
00:33:44,280 --> 00:33:46,880
Speaker 2: with Shaq was like the traveling beetles Man.

742
00:33:46,880 --> 00:33:50,080
Speaker 3: Everywhere we went, it was packed everywhere.

743
00:33:50,120 --> 00:33:52,040
Speaker 2: So at the end of the day, I enjoyed it

744
00:33:52,080 --> 00:33:54,680
Speaker 2: because again I was in the moment.

745
00:33:54,800 --> 00:33:55,640
Speaker 3: I took all of it.

746
00:33:55,600 --> 00:33:58,600
Speaker 2: In because I knew that disrespectful what we had with

747
00:33:58,800 --> 00:34:02,280
Speaker 2: every winter, every hotel outside of the hotels inside, it

748
00:34:02,360 --> 00:34:05,840
Speaker 2: was always packing wherever you went, people screaming, people chasing,

749
00:34:05,880 --> 00:34:07,840
Speaker 2: people wanted to get a picture on autograph.

750
00:34:07,960 --> 00:34:09,800
Speaker 3: So I understood what that was about.

751
00:34:10,120 --> 00:34:12,839
Speaker 1: Shac has talked before about how after you guys beat

752
00:34:12,880 --> 00:34:15,359
Speaker 1: the bulls, maybe you celebrated too hard because it was,

753
00:34:15,760 --> 00:34:18,359
Speaker 1: you know, what a great moment for both of you

754
00:34:18,400 --> 00:34:21,680
Speaker 1: guys to grow up and to watch somebody like Michael

755
00:34:21,760 --> 00:34:25,120
Speaker 1: Jordan and then to knock them off. I just want

756
00:34:25,160 --> 00:34:29,040
Speaker 1: to know what was that feeling like, because those nineties

757
00:34:29,040 --> 00:34:32,600
Speaker 1: bulls teams in retrospect, we put them on such a pedestal.

758
00:34:32,239 --> 00:34:38,320
Speaker 4: And I'll go first. You gotta have dogs, right. I

759
00:34:38,400 --> 00:34:42,080
Speaker 4: knew what my mentality was. Now when I'm looking at Penny,

760
00:34:42,520 --> 00:34:46,120
Speaker 4: I know that's his mentality. Now we had this little

761
00:34:46,120 --> 00:34:49,080
Speaker 4: fun thing that we would do. Penny. Penny was the

762
00:34:49,080 --> 00:34:52,239
Speaker 4: master of the of the guard alliance, right, So b

763
00:34:52,440 --> 00:34:55,400
Speaker 4: shaw lolo, they listened to Penny. These guys, they listened

764
00:34:55,400 --> 00:34:58,359
Speaker 4: to Penny. I held the big man lives the power forward,

765
00:34:58,480 --> 00:35:01,359
Speaker 4: the power forward in the senters. So if your two

766
00:35:01,440 --> 00:35:05,000
Speaker 4: main guys are believing that we can win, everybody else

767
00:35:05,040 --> 00:35:07,960
Speaker 4: is gonna believe. Penny is the only guy that I've

768
00:35:08,000 --> 00:35:10,640
Speaker 4: seen that didn't really care. He was playing against Michael

769
00:35:10,719 --> 00:35:14,919
Speaker 4: Jordan like it really like and and that's how I

770
00:35:14,960 --> 00:35:18,399
Speaker 4: was so and now the only thing because we match

771
00:35:18,520 --> 00:35:21,799
Speaker 4: up with him pretty well. So now I know I

772
00:35:21,840 --> 00:35:23,719
Speaker 4: got to do a little bit better at the free

773
00:35:23,719 --> 00:35:25,960
Speaker 4: throw line because that because they're already telling us their

774
00:35:26,000 --> 00:35:29,160
Speaker 4: game plan, three headed monster, We're gonna use our eighteen foules.

775
00:35:29,520 --> 00:35:32,680
Speaker 4: So I called my boy Buzzy Brayman, and I really

776
00:35:32,760 --> 00:35:35,120
Speaker 4: shot a lot of free throws. A lot I shot.

777
00:35:35,200 --> 00:35:37,160
Speaker 4: I shot so many free throws. I hated it, but

778
00:35:37,840 --> 00:35:40,160
Speaker 4: it worked. And so you know, a couple of good games,

779
00:35:40,200 --> 00:35:42,040
Speaker 4: I would have really good free throw lines and they

780
00:35:42,080 --> 00:35:44,319
Speaker 4: had no answer for that. So now when it comes

781
00:35:44,360 --> 00:35:47,480
Speaker 4: down like we're upper game, now, Penny got to have

782
00:35:47,520 --> 00:35:49,359
Speaker 4: a great game, and I gotta have a great game.

783
00:35:49,360 --> 00:35:51,480
Speaker 4: And those last two games, which is easy for us.

784
00:35:51,520 --> 00:35:53,759
Speaker 4: That's how we was able to beat them that year.

785
00:35:54,320 --> 00:35:56,480
Speaker 4: Of course they're gonna say, hey, Mike was forty five,

786
00:35:56,520 --> 00:35:58,880
Speaker 4: he wasn't the same mic. It don't matter whoever's on

787
00:35:58,880 --> 00:36:01,480
Speaker 4: the court at what happened. Like you know, you talk

788
00:36:01,520 --> 00:36:04,440
Speaker 4: about Boston championship this year, It don't matter that the

789
00:36:04,520 --> 00:36:07,200
Speaker 4: other guys were not healthy. That's that's not our problem,

790
00:36:07,320 --> 00:36:10,040
Speaker 4: not our fault. Whoever stepped on the court. Boston had

791
00:36:10,080 --> 00:36:13,160
Speaker 4: to go through seven, get multiple seven game series and

792
00:36:13,200 --> 00:36:16,200
Speaker 4: they won the championship. So Penny and I two guys

793
00:36:16,200 --> 00:36:19,279
Speaker 4: with the same attitude that year and we were able

794
00:36:19,280 --> 00:36:19,560
Speaker 4: to win.

795
00:36:19,800 --> 00:36:22,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, from my point of view, it was a respect,

796
00:36:22,800 --> 00:36:25,600
Speaker 2: but it wasn't a fear. You know, the Bulls had

797
00:36:25,680 --> 00:36:27,920
Speaker 2: they had fearing people, And for me, it was an

798
00:36:27,920 --> 00:36:30,640
Speaker 2: anxiousness to get to it because if you're the greatest

799
00:36:30,640 --> 00:36:33,040
Speaker 2: of all time, which I respect, then you're gonna have

800
00:36:33,040 --> 00:36:35,240
Speaker 2: to show me. That just was my mentality. I wanted

801
00:36:35,280 --> 00:36:37,680
Speaker 2: to play against Michael Jordan. It was if we were

802
00:36:37,680 --> 00:36:39,200
Speaker 2: going to get to a championship, it was gonna have

803
00:36:39,200 --> 00:36:41,480
Speaker 2: to go through him, and we had already played half

804
00:36:41,520 --> 00:36:44,279
Speaker 2: the season. It's like that the favorites kind of we

805
00:36:44,360 --> 00:36:46,200
Speaker 2: were we were rolling, we were we were in our

806
00:36:46,239 --> 00:36:46,840
Speaker 2: own lane.

807
00:36:47,360 --> 00:36:48,000
Speaker 3: And again it.

808
00:36:47,960 --> 00:36:50,600
Speaker 2: Wasn't disrespect, it was just we were ready to get

809
00:36:50,600 --> 00:36:52,520
Speaker 2: after it and ready to go at the bulls. And

810
00:36:52,600 --> 00:36:57,160
Speaker 2: again Michael Jordan came on the court. Is Michael Jordan?

811
00:36:57,480 --> 00:37:00,000
Speaker 2: I mean, obviously he had a full summer with revenge

812
00:37:00,200 --> 00:37:02,399
Speaker 2: on his mind. After we beat him on his mind,

813
00:37:02,880 --> 00:37:04,719
Speaker 2: came back a different mindset and locked in.

814
00:37:04,800 --> 00:37:07,040
Speaker 3: But at the end of the day, we played.

815
00:37:06,800 --> 00:37:09,800
Speaker 2: Against the bull teams, the bulls that won championships, and

816
00:37:10,080 --> 00:37:11,600
Speaker 2: we're able to, you know, to conquer that.

817
00:37:12,719 --> 00:37:15,759
Speaker 4: And you see that attitude. Yeah, that's great that that

818
00:37:15,920 --> 00:37:18,520
Speaker 4: made a refreshing for me because I already know what

819
00:37:18,520 --> 00:37:19,960
Speaker 4: I'm going to do. So when you get a young

820
00:37:20,040 --> 00:37:21,600
Speaker 4: kid going lock and sign I don't give a fuck

821
00:37:21,600 --> 00:37:24,480
Speaker 4: are we playing, I'm like, oh, okay, well shit, you

822
00:37:24,480 --> 00:37:26,080
Speaker 4: you want to go to the hood and get a cracking,

823
00:37:26,160 --> 00:37:28,560
Speaker 4: Let's go get it cracking. And then you got you know,

824
00:37:28,600 --> 00:37:31,120
Speaker 4: you got guys following him, You got guys follow me,

825
00:37:31,120 --> 00:37:32,280
Speaker 4: and it was so beautiful.

826
00:37:33,440 --> 00:37:37,640
Speaker 1: Game's over and you you look and the Pinstripes are

827
00:37:37,680 --> 00:37:40,719
Speaker 1: successful and Michael Jordan's walking off with his head down.

828
00:37:41,280 --> 00:37:44,040
Speaker 1: You said you wanted that challenge. What was it like

829
00:37:44,200 --> 00:37:46,880
Speaker 1: after accepting and completing the challenge?

830
00:37:47,040 --> 00:37:49,320
Speaker 2: Now, it was a beautiful thing because we won again.

831
00:37:49,560 --> 00:37:52,480
Speaker 2: I'm a basketball guy, I'm a basketball historian. I'm understanding

832
00:37:52,520 --> 00:37:54,960
Speaker 2: in the moment what we're doing. And I watched so

833
00:37:55,040 --> 00:37:57,560
Speaker 2: much Countless film on Scotty. I had watched some Countless

834
00:37:57,560 --> 00:38:01,560
Speaker 2: film on MJ. And I just knew, you know, their

835
00:38:01,600 --> 00:38:03,320
Speaker 2: sweet spots. I knew what they were gonna do. I

836
00:38:03,400 --> 00:38:06,279
Speaker 2: knew that the ball healing and the rhythm that they

837
00:38:06,400 --> 00:38:07,799
Speaker 2: liked to be in, and we just tried to make

838
00:38:07,840 --> 00:38:12,120
Speaker 2: it hard. And for me, once we overcame that that hurdle,

839
00:38:12,600 --> 00:38:14,319
Speaker 2: it was like, man, we just beat the bulls. At

840
00:38:14,320 --> 00:38:17,160
Speaker 2: that time, it's like we just beat the bulls. Now

841
00:38:17,200 --> 00:38:19,200
Speaker 2: it's time to go on and you know, and face

842
00:38:19,239 --> 00:38:20,399
Speaker 2: the pas.

843
00:38:20,719 --> 00:38:22,840
Speaker 4: And I think what it taught me though, was to

844
00:38:23,960 --> 00:38:28,000
Speaker 4: never celebrate until the job is done. Because after we

845
00:38:28,120 --> 00:38:32,040
Speaker 4: beat them, we were happy. Pacers knock us around. We

846
00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:34,319
Speaker 4: eventually got it back. But now that we got to

847
00:38:34,360 --> 00:38:37,560
Speaker 4: the finals, me personally, I don't know what Penny and

848
00:38:37,600 --> 00:38:39,520
Speaker 4: his crew is doing, but me personally, I was doing

849
00:38:39,560 --> 00:38:41,839
Speaker 4: way too much because Penny, if you remember, I think

850
00:38:41,840 --> 00:38:43,319
Speaker 4: we had like seven or eight days off.

851
00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:45,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, we did. We had a lot of days off.

852
00:38:45,360 --> 00:38:48,520
Speaker 4: So so so Coach Hill gave us three days off.

853
00:38:49,000 --> 00:38:51,240
Speaker 4: The statue of limitations up. So I'm gonna gohead snitch

854
00:38:51,280 --> 00:38:53,879
Speaker 4: on myself. Me and d S Guy jumped in the flight.

855
00:38:54,520 --> 00:38:58,359
Speaker 4: We was at Magic City. We was in Atlanta. We

856
00:38:58,360 --> 00:39:01,680
Speaker 4: were chilling all night partying, and then we tried to

857
00:39:01,680 --> 00:39:04,400
Speaker 4: come back there on day four for the practice. Had

858
00:39:04,440 --> 00:39:07,400
Speaker 4: a terrible practice. It didn't matter. I had an appearance

859
00:39:07,400 --> 00:39:11,000
Speaker 4: at Universal Studios. I had a pre parade at Disney Like.

860
00:39:11,080 --> 00:39:13,840
Speaker 4: I was working all the way until the night before

861
00:39:13,840 --> 00:39:15,400
Speaker 4: the game, and then I tried to go through my

862
00:39:15,680 --> 00:39:18,920
Speaker 4: regular retro stay up all night DJ at the music.

863
00:39:19,040 --> 00:39:21,720
Speaker 4: So the next game, I was tired. We played well,

864
00:39:21,800 --> 00:39:24,120
Speaker 4: we got off to a good start and then you know,

865
00:39:24,280 --> 00:39:27,120
Speaker 4: something happened at the end. But once we lost that momentum,

866
00:39:27,280 --> 00:39:30,320
Speaker 4: it was hard to get back. So I blamed myself

867
00:39:30,840 --> 00:39:32,840
Speaker 4: for us not getting that fir A championship.

868
00:39:35,320 --> 00:39:35,720
Speaker 1: Studying.

869
00:39:36,080 --> 00:39:38,960
Speaker 2: I was studying family sleep. I'm telling you, man, that

870
00:39:39,040 --> 00:39:41,479
Speaker 2: was just how I was. And I respected Sam.

871
00:39:41,520 --> 00:39:44,319
Speaker 4: Sam and I never went out.

872
00:39:43,760 --> 00:39:45,359
Speaker 2: Sam and I Now I didn't go out one time

873
00:39:45,520 --> 00:39:47,920
Speaker 2: Sam Cassell and I used to be in Houston in

874
00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:50,120
Speaker 2: the summertime playing one on one full court, so Sam

875
00:39:50,160 --> 00:39:52,640
Speaker 2: and I were close and we would challenge each other

876
00:39:52,719 --> 00:39:55,240
Speaker 2: because my agent was in Houston, and we would challenge

877
00:39:55,239 --> 00:39:56,840
Speaker 2: each other playing one on one full court. So I

878
00:39:56,960 --> 00:39:59,600
Speaker 2: knew all about Sam. Obviously had nothing but respect for

879
00:39:59,680 --> 00:40:03,239
Speaker 2: Kennich and Vernon Maxwell and Mario Elly and Robert Oriy

880
00:40:03,280 --> 00:40:04,799
Speaker 2: those guys, but not once that I think we were

881
00:40:04,800 --> 00:40:07,360
Speaker 2: gonna lose. We got up I think twenty points in

882
00:40:07,400 --> 00:40:12,120
Speaker 2: the first half, and we just lost whatever rhythm we had.

883
00:40:12,160 --> 00:40:14,600
Speaker 2: And at the very end, we were supposed to take

884
00:40:14,600 --> 00:40:16,600
Speaker 2: a delay a game. Manshac talked about this before we

885
00:40:16,600 --> 00:40:18,839
Speaker 2: were up three, and Kenny Smith made the three on

886
00:40:18,880 --> 00:40:20,920
Speaker 2: me because our relax because Nick was supposed to take

887
00:40:20,920 --> 00:40:22,760
Speaker 2: a delay a game and we didn't take it delay

888
00:40:22,760 --> 00:40:25,080
Speaker 2: a game. He made that shot and then we never

889
00:40:25,120 --> 00:40:27,120
Speaker 2: recovered from him, and I'll never forget that. That's one

890
00:40:27,120 --> 00:40:29,759
Speaker 2: of my biggest regrets was losing that game on If

891
00:40:29,800 --> 00:40:31,279
Speaker 2: I could have one game over, it would have been

892
00:40:31,280 --> 00:40:32,120
Speaker 2: that game one.

893
00:40:32,440 --> 00:40:33,280
Speaker 4: Kenny Smith.

894
00:40:34,640 --> 00:40:41,480
Speaker 1: So Jitch, you brought up Sam Cassell. I don't want

895
00:40:41,520 --> 00:40:44,120
Speaker 1: to talk bad about JJ Reddick because he has his

896
00:40:44,200 --> 00:40:47,080
Speaker 1: opportunity with the Lakers, and congratulations to him and good

897
00:40:47,160 --> 00:40:49,840
Speaker 1: luck to him. But this is the third straight coaching

898
00:40:49,880 --> 00:40:52,120
Speaker 1: cycle where Sam Cassell is supposed to be one of

899
00:40:52,120 --> 00:40:55,359
Speaker 1: the coaching candidates for one of these vacancies, and it's

900
00:40:55,400 --> 00:40:59,200
Speaker 1: another opportunity that doesn't actually get fulfilled. He gets brought on,

901
00:40:59,440 --> 00:41:03,640
Speaker 1: he gets rid tam with the Boston Celtics. What do

902
00:41:03,680 --> 00:41:05,520
Speaker 1: you think about a guy like Sam who has been

903
00:41:05,560 --> 00:41:07,759
Speaker 1: one of the top coaching prospects, but he just never

904
00:41:07,840 --> 00:41:10,399
Speaker 1: gets that call to be a head coach in the end.

905
00:41:10,440 --> 00:41:11,239
Speaker 3: Long overdue, bro.

906
00:41:11,480 --> 00:41:14,480
Speaker 2: They just don't respect the old school as much the

907
00:41:14,520 --> 00:41:18,879
Speaker 2: new school guys they respect. And again, congratulations to JJ.

908
00:41:18,960 --> 00:41:21,839
Speaker 2: I think he's a brilliant mind, basketball mind. But Sam

909
00:41:21,880 --> 00:41:25,600
Speaker 2: Conseil has gone through the entire whatever you need him

910
00:41:25,640 --> 00:41:28,120
Speaker 2: to do as far as being an assistant coach under

911
00:41:28,200 --> 00:41:32,080
Speaker 2: so many different guys and winning championships as a player

912
00:41:32,120 --> 00:41:32,840
Speaker 2: and as a coach.

913
00:41:33,400 --> 00:41:36,640
Speaker 3: He's definitely deserving, man. But I think that's pretty sad.

914
00:41:36,680 --> 00:41:36,799
Speaker 4: Man.

915
00:41:36,840 --> 00:41:39,160
Speaker 3: That guy works hard than anyone. He knows the game.

916
00:41:39,800 --> 00:41:41,839
Speaker 2: He's done everything that he was supposed to do as

917
00:41:41,880 --> 00:41:44,480
Speaker 2: a coach to be afforded to have a job and

918
00:41:44,560 --> 00:41:45,600
Speaker 2: just hadn't gotten the job yet.

919
00:41:45,640 --> 00:41:46,520
Speaker 3: I think that's sad.

920
00:41:47,520 --> 00:41:50,880
Speaker 4: I would like to see equal coverage as well as

921
00:41:50,920 --> 00:41:55,880
Speaker 4: equal opportunity, Like I didn't know Sam Consell wanted to

922
00:41:55,920 --> 00:41:58,839
Speaker 4: be a coach. He didn't get the same. Like as

923
00:41:58,840 --> 00:42:01,920
Speaker 4: soon as JJ announced that on this podcast, it went

924
00:42:02,000 --> 00:42:04,960
Speaker 4: crazy and everybody's talking about everybody talk about I would

925
00:42:05,000 --> 00:42:06,759
Speaker 4: like to whoever wants to be the coach for the

926
00:42:06,760 --> 00:42:09,960
Speaker 4: next team. I want equal coverage. I want to know.

927
00:42:10,080 --> 00:42:12,839
Speaker 4: I want to know that Sam Cassell's been assistant coach

928
00:42:12,880 --> 00:42:14,680
Speaker 4: for fifteen years. I want to know this. I want

929
00:42:14,680 --> 00:42:17,160
Speaker 4: to know Brian Hill is coming back. I want to know,

930
00:42:17,280 --> 00:42:19,640
Speaker 4: like I want to know, like like I didn't even know.

931
00:42:19,960 --> 00:42:22,680
Speaker 1: So Sam is such a good assistant coach that the

932
00:42:22,719 --> 00:42:25,719
Speaker 1: Boston Celtics just paid him a salary so high so

933
00:42:25,760 --> 00:42:28,759
Speaker 1: that nobody could steal him. That's how well regarded he

934
00:42:28,880 --> 00:42:29,799
Speaker 1: is as an assistant.

935
00:42:30,239 --> 00:42:32,920
Speaker 4: Yeah, but it just it just makes you pay more

936
00:42:32,920 --> 00:42:37,520
Speaker 4: attention to the conversation about equal opportunity as coaches. Like

937
00:42:38,360 --> 00:42:40,680
Speaker 4: if you think about it, JJ Reddick, who I like,

938
00:42:40,760 --> 00:42:43,239
Speaker 4: you really don't have a lot of experience, but he

939
00:42:43,640 --> 00:42:46,920
Speaker 4: jumps to the front. So you know, people like us

940
00:42:46,920 --> 00:42:49,880
Speaker 4: who are basketball historians and minds were saying, Okay, how

941
00:42:49,920 --> 00:42:52,480
Speaker 4: do you how does this guy jump to the front

942
00:42:52,560 --> 00:42:54,719
Speaker 4: and this guy been boom boom boom. So that's why

943
00:42:54,760 --> 00:42:56,600
Speaker 4: I said, I want equal coverage. I want to know

944
00:42:57,000 --> 00:42:59,520
Speaker 4: who's who who's who, so we can make a you know,

945
00:42:59,640 --> 00:43:01,880
Speaker 4: proper or you know, decision.

946
00:43:04,239 --> 00:43:07,160
Speaker 1: Retrospect question. And it's I'm sure a lot of people

947
00:43:07,200 --> 00:43:08,759
Speaker 1: come up to your penny and they're like, man, can

948
00:43:08,800 --> 00:43:11,440
Speaker 1: you imagine if you didn't get hurt? And you're like, okay,

949
00:43:11,440 --> 00:43:13,839
Speaker 1: I've I've dealt with this so many times. But when

950
00:43:13,880 --> 00:43:16,799
Speaker 1: you're with somebody like let's say Grant Hill, and you

951
00:43:16,840 --> 00:43:18,759
Speaker 1: guys both kind of get talked.

952
00:43:18,440 --> 00:43:19,239
Speaker 4: About that way.

953
00:43:19,360 --> 00:43:23,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, what kind of communication can you guys have that

954
00:43:23,440 --> 00:43:26,160
Speaker 1: people like myself will never fucking understand.

955
00:43:26,320 --> 00:43:28,040
Speaker 2: You know, what happens when me and he are together.

956
00:43:28,600 --> 00:43:30,279
Speaker 2: We just talk about the good time. We don't even

957
00:43:30,280 --> 00:43:32,960
Speaker 2: talk about the injuries. We talk about how fun it

958
00:43:33,160 --> 00:43:36,040
Speaker 2: was dominating the game, how great it was to be

959
00:43:36,040 --> 00:43:38,640
Speaker 2: able to play the game and be afforded that, you know,

960
00:43:38,640 --> 00:43:39,520
Speaker 2: and be blessed enough for that.

961
00:43:39,520 --> 00:43:39,799
Speaker 3: That's all.

962
00:43:39,880 --> 00:43:42,719
Speaker 2: G and I talk about families and about the great times.

963
00:43:42,719 --> 00:43:44,680
Speaker 2: We've never talked about man, what if because we already

964
00:43:44,680 --> 00:43:47,040
Speaker 2: that's already understood, you know what I mean, that's already

965
00:43:47,120 --> 00:43:50,399
Speaker 2: understood between us, like we know where we were if

966
00:43:50,440 --> 00:43:51,320
Speaker 2: we don't get injured.

967
00:43:51,880 --> 00:43:52,799
Speaker 3: And I agree with Shaq.

968
00:43:52,880 --> 00:43:55,759
Speaker 2: You know, everybody wants to put this this label on me,

969
00:43:56,239 --> 00:43:58,400
Speaker 2: Well he would have been this man. I dominated the

970
00:43:58,400 --> 00:44:01,160
Speaker 2: game for a minute, I mean long enough. I dominated

971
00:44:01,200 --> 00:44:03,759
Speaker 2: the game, and anybody that said I didn't it is

972
00:44:03,800 --> 00:44:05,880
Speaker 2: what it is. But he and I already have the

973
00:44:06,000 --> 00:44:12,040
Speaker 2: understanding because he has been actually elevated to have more

974
00:44:12,080 --> 00:44:14,239
Speaker 2: respect of the game and being in the Hall of

975
00:44:14,239 --> 00:44:17,480
Speaker 2: Fame and doing things of that nature because of who

976
00:44:17,480 --> 00:44:19,759
Speaker 2: he is and rightfully deserving of so.

977
00:44:20,440 --> 00:44:22,440
Speaker 3: But for me, I'm just grinding it out.

978
00:44:22,480 --> 00:44:24,200
Speaker 2: Man, and again when I see my man, it's all

979
00:44:24,239 --> 00:44:26,919
Speaker 2: about the good stuff, and we really never talk about

980
00:44:26,960 --> 00:44:27,640
Speaker 2: the bad stuff.

981
00:44:28,080 --> 00:44:30,200
Speaker 4: Penny, because of you, I have to carry so many

982
00:44:30,440 --> 00:44:34,799
Speaker 4: little kids out. No, certainly, because the reason why is

983
00:44:35,440 --> 00:44:37,840
Speaker 4: they asked me all the time, they say who's better

984
00:44:38,040 --> 00:44:41,680
Speaker 4: Penny and Kobe, and I always say Penny was Kobe

985
00:44:41,719 --> 00:44:45,719
Speaker 4: before Kobe and the kids before the social media era.

986
00:44:45,840 --> 00:44:48,000
Speaker 4: They act like that understand what I'm telling them. Then

987
00:44:48,000 --> 00:44:50,000
Speaker 4: I have to tell them. Do you have Google you

988
00:44:50,000 --> 00:44:54,400
Speaker 4: a little stupid look and see who Penny was. And

989
00:44:54,440 --> 00:44:58,160
Speaker 4: remember Penny came in day one and like this, Kobe

990
00:44:58,280 --> 00:45:02,279
Speaker 4: first year didn't start, second year, didn't start, third year

991
00:45:02,400 --> 00:45:04,680
Speaker 4: upstairs saying okay, hey, it's time for him to play.

992
00:45:04,800 --> 00:45:07,640
Speaker 4: Then he started. Took him six hundred to nine hundred

993
00:45:07,719 --> 00:45:11,440
Speaker 4: days to become the black Mama. Penny came in Penny.

994
00:45:13,400 --> 00:45:15,799
Speaker 4: When I met Penny hardaway before he was on my team,

995
00:45:15,840 --> 00:45:18,040
Speaker 4: he was Penny. He was a shiny brand. So I

996
00:45:18,080 --> 00:45:20,600
Speaker 4: have to explain that to them all the time. So

997
00:45:21,080 --> 00:45:23,000
Speaker 4: I always want to give you your love. I'm always

998
00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:25,200
Speaker 4: going to give you your props. I'm always gonna remind

999
00:45:25,239 --> 00:45:28,640
Speaker 4: these little dumb ass kids what greatness is all about.

1000
00:45:28,920 --> 00:45:31,719
Speaker 4: And I appreciate your brother. And again, if I was

1001
00:45:31,760 --> 00:45:34,879
Speaker 4: an asshole to you any time in my career, I apologize.

1002
00:45:34,960 --> 00:45:38,600
Speaker 4: I'm older now I can reflect. Like I said, when

1003
00:45:38,640 --> 00:45:40,600
Speaker 4: you first came on, it was crazy. I was sitting

1004
00:45:40,800 --> 00:45:43,040
Speaker 4: back thinking about, Okay, what am I gonna ask Penny?

1005
00:45:43,400 --> 00:45:46,600
Speaker 4: What if people want to hear? And then I realized, like, bro,

1006
00:45:46,719 --> 00:45:50,120
Speaker 4: we never had a fucking fight. We never had an argument.

1007
00:45:50,200 --> 00:45:54,280
Speaker 4: The other guy every day once he became that black

1008
00:45:54,320 --> 00:45:59,200
Speaker 4: mama every day the Wade. Our relationship was just like yours.

1009
00:45:59,280 --> 00:46:01,640
Speaker 4: Then tours the end, I'm like, hey, man, you want

1010
00:46:01,640 --> 00:46:04,160
Speaker 4: to be the man. Okay, do something like We had

1011
00:46:04,160 --> 00:46:06,640
Speaker 4: that one argument after we got blown out in game

1012
00:46:06,680 --> 00:46:09,000
Speaker 4: two because they looking at me to do it. I'm like, bro,

1013
00:46:09,040 --> 00:46:12,120
Speaker 4: I'm getting quadruple team. I ain't shack no more. Motherfucker.

1014
00:46:12,160 --> 00:46:14,799
Speaker 4: You do something, d Way and he took off. So

1015
00:46:15,080 --> 00:46:17,960
Speaker 4: me and d Way one argument, me and you know, argument,

1016
00:46:18,040 --> 00:46:18,720
Speaker 4: me and the other.

1017
00:46:18,600 --> 00:46:21,200
Speaker 1: Guy except for the except for the little penny.

1018
00:46:20,880 --> 00:46:25,520
Speaker 4: When listen, listen. He he was mad. He didn't talk

1019
00:46:25,560 --> 00:46:27,320
Speaker 4: to me for a week, but he never said anything.

1020
00:46:27,360 --> 00:46:29,799
Speaker 4: But I knew he was mad. I knew he was mad.

1021
00:46:31,080 --> 00:46:33,680
Speaker 4: I love you coaching. If you ever need anything from me, brother,

1022
00:46:34,320 --> 00:46:35,000
Speaker 4: you know I'm there.

1023
00:46:35,080 --> 00:46:37,840
Speaker 2: Brother, contained successful man. I all love keep working like

1024
00:46:37,880 --> 00:46:39,839
Speaker 2: I know you will. Adam appreciate it.

1025
00:46:39,880 --> 00:46:41,640
Speaker 1: And I want to say I want to say one

1026
00:46:41,640 --> 00:46:44,520
Speaker 1: more thing. I want to say congratulations because the one

1027
00:46:44,560 --> 00:46:46,239
Speaker 1: thing that we really do care about on the Big

1028
00:46:46,280 --> 00:46:49,200
Speaker 1: Podcast is family, and we really care about our moms.

1029
00:46:49,560 --> 00:46:52,640
Speaker 1: And I read recently that your mom's cancer is in remission. Yes,

1030
00:46:52,719 --> 00:46:55,719
Speaker 1: And I want to say congratulations. I hope that you

1031
00:46:55,800 --> 00:46:58,000
Speaker 1: have so much time with her and so much love,

1032
00:46:58,040 --> 00:47:00,000
Speaker 1: because that's a beautiful thing that I got to read. Man,

1033
00:47:00,080 --> 00:47:00,560
Speaker 1: So God.

1034
00:47:00,440 --> 00:47:02,160
Speaker 3: Bless, I appreciate that.

1035
00:47:07,160 --> 00:47:07,520
Speaker 4: Thank you.

1036
00:47:10,320 --> 00:47:14,239
Speaker 1: That was Penny Hardaway, really really cool to see you

1037
00:47:14,280 --> 00:47:18,479
Speaker 1: guys talk. But I gotta admit, Shack Little Penny would

1038
00:47:18,480 --> 00:47:21,920
Speaker 1: have made me jealous too, because that whole ad campaign

1039
00:47:22,040 --> 00:47:25,520
Speaker 1: with Chris Rock walking around me, I got little Pennies

1040
00:47:25,840 --> 00:47:28,359
Speaker 1: that was man, that was everywhere.

1041
00:47:28,280 --> 00:47:34,120
Speaker 4: And and again that that messed up history, It messed

1042
00:47:34,160 --> 00:47:37,399
Speaker 4: up unknown history. What I mean by that, how many

1043
00:47:37,760 --> 00:47:41,000
Speaker 4: you think me and Penny could have won if we stayed.

1044
00:47:40,760 --> 00:47:43,520
Speaker 1: Together and the team started being built around you guys,

1045
00:47:43,760 --> 00:47:45,480
Speaker 1: I mean as Penny as you have now.

1046
00:47:46,880 --> 00:47:50,240
Speaker 4: And and I feel that. But because of ego and

1047
00:47:50,880 --> 00:47:54,160
Speaker 4: useless titles and this and that and this is what

1048
00:47:54,239 --> 00:47:56,880
Speaker 4: I was trying to barn Jaden Brown about and he

1049
00:47:56,960 --> 00:47:58,719
Speaker 4: wasn't paying attention. He still didn't know what I was

1050
00:47:58,719 --> 00:48:03,560
Speaker 4: talking about. But it's useless, Like, for example, you got

1051
00:48:03,560 --> 00:48:07,200
Speaker 4: the number one podcast, what does that mean? What does

1052
00:48:07,200 --> 00:48:07,520
Speaker 4: it mean?

1053
00:48:07,600 --> 00:48:08,720
Speaker 1: Doesn't really mean anything?

1054
00:48:09,719 --> 00:48:13,440
Speaker 4: Adam, You're the you're the number one upcoming NBA commentary.

1055
00:48:13,600 --> 00:48:17,640
Speaker 4: What does that mean? Shack, You're the best big man

1056
00:48:17,680 --> 00:48:20,560
Speaker 4: ever that what does that really mean? Doesn't mean nothing?

1057
00:48:20,760 --> 00:48:23,680
Speaker 4: Are you a good person, you take care of people,

1058
00:48:23,960 --> 00:48:26,120
Speaker 4: you respect people. This is what life is all about.

1059
00:48:26,160 --> 00:48:29,320
Speaker 4: And and then when I said, we never had an argument.

1060
00:48:30,360 --> 00:48:32,320
Speaker 4: So now I'm looking back, why the fuck did we

1061
00:48:32,400 --> 00:48:37,799
Speaker 4: break up? Egos? Yeah, other people talking and and like

1062
00:48:38,280 --> 00:48:41,880
Speaker 4: that was the only time I broke the the professional

1063
00:48:42,000 --> 00:48:46,840
Speaker 4: jealousy thing because Penny was on my ass jersey sales.

1064
00:48:48,040 --> 00:48:50,560
Speaker 4: So I'm I'm you know, I'm gonna make a confession.

1065
00:48:51,280 --> 00:48:53,400
Speaker 4: When they said it wasn't my team no more, it

1066
00:48:53,520 --> 00:48:56,719
Speaker 4: hurt a little bit. So since they said it wasn't

1067
00:48:56,760 --> 00:49:00,399
Speaker 4: my team, it's his team. Now this seems the other

1068
00:49:00,440 --> 00:49:03,200
Speaker 4: teams went offer me. So the other teams offered me

1069
00:49:03,280 --> 00:49:05,560
Speaker 4: more than what my team was willing to offer, and

1070
00:49:06,200 --> 00:49:08,600
Speaker 4: I took advantage of it. But again, if I didn't

1071
00:49:08,640 --> 00:49:11,479
Speaker 4: have that attitude, how many could we have one? Because

1072
00:49:11,680 --> 00:49:13,680
Speaker 4: I was really when I tell you I was thinking

1073
00:49:13,719 --> 00:49:17,360
Speaker 4: about it. I was like, I'm like really smoking my

1074
00:49:17,440 --> 00:49:21,680
Speaker 4: hookah trying to go back like, no, bro, we never

1075
00:49:21,760 --> 00:49:25,560
Speaker 4: had a fight or argument. Ever, it wasn't no and

1076
00:49:25,600 --> 00:49:27,880
Speaker 4: it was no lover moth pat the ball. It was

1077
00:49:27,960 --> 00:49:32,680
Speaker 4: never that. Ever, when I say zero zero the four

1078
00:49:32,760 --> 00:49:34,400
Speaker 4: years we played together, I never had to go to

1079
00:49:34,480 --> 00:49:35,640
Speaker 4: him and say, hey, man, I'm open.

1080
00:49:36,239 --> 00:49:40,640
Speaker 1: It's it's easy to look back and have retrospect and

1081
00:49:40,680 --> 00:49:42,880
Speaker 1: to get upset at our younger selves. I think the

1082
00:49:42,880 --> 00:49:46,040
Speaker 1: thing that I always think about is I never want

1083
00:49:46,080 --> 00:49:50,960
Speaker 1: to define myself by something that you said, oh, I'm

1084
00:49:51,000 --> 00:49:54,239
Speaker 1: the best broadcast or whatever, because then what happens when

1085
00:49:54,239 --> 00:49:58,680
Speaker 1: you're not broadcasting you lose yourself. And so for me,

1086
00:49:59,360 --> 00:50:03,200
Speaker 1: I never want to identify with someone else's rankings because

1087
00:50:03,200 --> 00:50:06,200
Speaker 1: then I'm always going for their approval and that's not

1088
00:50:06,239 --> 00:50:07,400
Speaker 1: how I want to live my life.

1089
00:50:07,920 --> 00:50:09,440
Speaker 4: And this is what I and this is why I

1090
00:50:09,480 --> 00:50:13,000
Speaker 4: have problems that all these podcasts out now, everybody's going

1091
00:50:13,000 --> 00:50:15,279
Speaker 4: for these uses titles, so they break a lot of

1092
00:50:15,360 --> 00:50:16,879
Speaker 4: rules to maintain that.

1093
00:50:17,560 --> 00:50:20,600
Speaker 1: I really don't like. It's okay, well past.

1094
00:50:22,560 --> 00:50:26,319
Speaker 4: No, it's not him, it's other people. Like I can tell,

1095
00:50:26,680 --> 00:50:29,319
Speaker 4: I could tell the famous podcasters that really like being

1096
00:50:29,360 --> 00:50:31,719
Speaker 4: a podcaster. I don't want to be known for having

1097
00:50:31,719 --> 00:50:32,680
Speaker 4: a podcast.

1098
00:50:32,920 --> 00:50:36,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, well that you can stop saying that because it's offending.

1099
00:50:37,400 --> 00:50:40,640
Speaker 4: Let me tell you this is fun. It's a fun opportunity.

1100
00:50:40,960 --> 00:50:43,239
Speaker 4: I'm doing it with my best friends. I don't want

1101
00:50:43,239 --> 00:50:45,160
Speaker 4: to be known for this. I'm already known for. What

1102
00:50:45,200 --> 00:50:48,480
Speaker 4: the hell I'm known for. I'm I'm known for two things,

1103
00:50:48,800 --> 00:50:52,200
Speaker 4: most dominant ever and Shack's a nice fucking guy. That's it.

1104
00:50:52,800 --> 00:50:57,600
Speaker 4: Number one listen, number one podcast, number two podcasts. I

1105
00:50:57,600 --> 00:51:00,000
Speaker 4: hate to be arrogant. Doesn't affect my money either way.

1106
00:51:00,120 --> 00:51:03,279
Speaker 4: You know, when you get older, you reflect those only

1107
00:51:03,360 --> 00:51:10,840
Speaker 4: questions I I really think about. The second one is

1108
00:51:10,880 --> 00:51:13,280
Speaker 4: The second one is how many would I have wanted

1109
00:51:13,440 --> 00:51:17,800
Speaker 4: me and Kobe stuck together? That was that's sixty percent.

1110
00:51:18,320 --> 00:51:20,360
Speaker 4: But the one that's one thousand percent of my brain,

1111
00:51:20,840 --> 00:51:23,319
Speaker 4: how many championships with Shack and Penny I one if

1112
00:51:23,320 --> 00:51:24,040
Speaker 4: they stayed.

1113
00:51:23,760 --> 00:51:27,080
Speaker 1: Together, especially because the East started to fall apart.

1114
00:51:27,480 --> 00:51:29,959
Speaker 4: No forget, no, forget that. We never had a fight.

1115
00:51:30,080 --> 00:51:30,279
Speaker 3: Bro.

1116
00:51:30,480 --> 00:51:35,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, Ever, I can't say that about a lot of people.

1117
00:51:35,960 --> 00:51:39,279
Speaker 4: I was never mad at him, ever, he was never

1118
00:51:39,320 --> 00:51:45,920
Speaker 4: mad at me. Ever, I was upset because when he

1119
00:51:47,000 --> 00:51:53,239
Speaker 4: signed and sat out, I stuck up for when I

1120
00:51:53,560 --> 00:51:56,680
Speaker 4: signed and was sitting out. Maybe he was sticking up

1121
00:51:56,680 --> 00:51:59,040
Speaker 4: for me. Maybe he wasn't, but I didn't see it.

1122
00:52:00,160 --> 00:52:02,560
Speaker 4: And then you're hearing all that, Oh it ain't his teenamore.

1123
00:52:02,560 --> 00:52:05,319
Speaker 4: It ain't no teinamore. So I'm like, okay, it ain't

1124
00:52:05,360 --> 00:52:07,600
Speaker 4: my team. What the other team is going to do?

1125
00:52:07,800 --> 00:52:10,640
Speaker 4: And then somebody else offered me more money and I

1126
00:52:10,760 --> 00:52:14,960
Speaker 4: went never had a fight, Yeah, so it was more

1127
00:52:15,000 --> 00:52:17,280
Speaker 4: of a and you know, but you know it's crazy

1128
00:52:17,280 --> 00:52:20,600
Speaker 4: about greatness. Sometimes you have to do that to become great.

1129
00:52:20,719 --> 00:52:23,480
Speaker 4: So even though I'm sitting here being hard on myself.

1130
00:52:23,200 --> 00:52:26,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, we wouldn't have had the Shack and Kobe Lakers.

1131
00:52:27,320 --> 00:52:31,040
Speaker 4: You wouldn't. You wouldn't. And then and then to get it,

1132
00:52:31,160 --> 00:52:34,520
Speaker 4: make it, to make it all grace. If I don't

1133
00:52:34,560 --> 00:52:39,640
Speaker 4: go there, oh boy, not a Laker anyway, oh Kobe.

1134
00:52:40,680 --> 00:52:43,799
Speaker 4: And if I don't go there, no, he's in Charlotte.

1135
00:52:45,320 --> 00:52:49,120
Speaker 4: He's in Charlotte. So you know what I'm saying. Everything

1136
00:52:49,160 --> 00:52:51,879
Speaker 4: happened for Reem, but do your research. If I don't

1137
00:52:51,920 --> 00:52:54,160
Speaker 4: go there, he's not there.

1138
00:52:55,040 --> 00:52:58,600
Speaker 1: Well, our guy Penny hardaway coach in Memphis. We wish

1139
00:52:58,680 --> 00:53:02,160
Speaker 1: him all the luck. Great dude. I love that you

1140
00:53:02,200 --> 00:53:05,040
Speaker 1: guys can continue talking and uh, we'll keep it.

1141
00:53:05,440 --> 00:53:08,320
Speaker 4: Never had a fight, bro, I heard you.

1142
00:53:08,360 --> 00:53:10,239
Speaker 1: No, we're about to have a fight. If you say

1143
00:53:10,320 --> 00:53:10,919
Speaker 1: one more time.

1144
00:53:11,080 --> 00:53:14,400
Speaker 4: No, it's just crazy. Like no, I'm you know it's crazy.

1145
00:53:14,440 --> 00:53:17,440
Speaker 4: I was. Somebody asked me if I met Q Tip,

1146
00:53:17,520 --> 00:53:19,480
Speaker 4: one of my favorite has only met him twice. I'm

1147
00:53:19,480 --> 00:53:22,120
Speaker 4: fifty years old. I was with my boy chipped food

1148
00:53:22,120 --> 00:53:23,799
Speaker 4: from the food shaking the other day. I only seen

1149
00:53:23,840 --> 00:53:28,520
Speaker 4: Busta Rhymes once, only seen ll Like, only seeing Rihanna once,

1150
00:53:29,200 --> 00:53:34,080
Speaker 4: only seen Janet Jackson three times. Somebody asked me if

1151
00:53:34,080 --> 00:53:38,719
Speaker 4: I used to attend Old Boys party, never went, never went,

1152
00:53:39,840 --> 00:53:42,799
Speaker 4: never went neither. Did I know it's crazy? I only

1153
00:53:42,840 --> 00:53:47,480
Speaker 4: met him once one time. What happened? It's crazy? Now

1154
00:53:47,680 --> 00:53:51,000
Speaker 4: just chick her out. But I was. I was like, damn,

1155
00:53:51,239 --> 00:53:53,239
Speaker 4: I know all these people. I only met him one time.

1156
00:53:53,360 --> 00:53:54,000
Speaker 4: And that's it.

1157
00:53:54,080 --> 00:53:56,440
Speaker 1: For the episode of the Pig Podcast, We'll holler at

1158
00:53:56,440 --> 00:53:58,720
Speaker 1: you a letter for the Big Shack deesel for Penny Hardaway.

1159
00:53:58,760 --> 00:53:59,359
Speaker 4: I'm the l E.

1160
00:53:59,440 --> 00:54:01,960
Speaker 1: Fko Mana.

1161
00:54:02,400 --> 00:54:04,840
Speaker 4: Make sure you check out Shack dot com.

1162
00:54:04,440 --> 00:54:06,080
Speaker 1: Shack dot com, get that merch.

1163
00:54:06,840 --> 00:54:42,200
Speaker 4: Yeah, two or three days in, I'm like, yo, man,

1164
00:54:42,239 --> 00:54:43,360
Speaker 4: who the fuck is this actor?