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Speaker 1: Pushkin. A few bands have experienced such extreme highs and

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Speaker 1: lows as The Beaches Throughout their decades long career, the

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Speaker 1: Band of Brothers managed to be both grossly underrated and

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Speaker 1: also one of the best selling live acts of all time.

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Speaker 1: M Barry Gibb and his younger twin brothers Maurice and

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Speaker 1: Robin started out in the late fifties as a teenaged

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Speaker 1: pop group in Australia. Their impeccable three part harmony caught

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Speaker 1: the ear of the prominent UK manager Robert Stigwood, but

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Speaker 1: a heavy hand and molding the Beegis into a world

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Speaker 1: renowned grew By nineteen sixty nine, though the band and

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Speaker 1: imploded due to power struggles and battles with addiction. A

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Speaker 1: year and a half later, the Bags were back together,

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Speaker 1: and after a few fits and starts, in nineteen seventy six,

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Speaker 1: Barry Gibb discovered his famed false set up. Their classic

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Speaker 1: run of disco hits followed, including the Saturday Night Fever soundtracks,

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Speaker 1: which was the highest selling soundtrack of all time until

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Speaker 1: The Bodyguard in nineteen ninety two. On today's episode, Rick

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Speaker 1: Ruban talks to Barry Gibb about his new Dave Cobb

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Speaker 1: produced Appum, which features country music inspired renditions of the

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Speaker 1: Gibbs Brothers Brilliant Songbook with guest features on every track.

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Speaker 1: They also talked through them making as some of Rick's

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Speaker 1: favorite big songs, and Barry recalls what it was like

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Speaker 1: producing Barbra streisand who wouldn't sing a single note before

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Speaker 1: two am? This is broken record liner notes for the

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Speaker 1: digital age. I'm justin Richmondson. Here's Rick Ruman with Barry gibb.

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Speaker 1: I have a question about songwriting. Yeah, Historically, do you

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Speaker 1: write songs with a purpose in mind? Or do songs

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Speaker 1: just come all the time? Well, they come more often

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Speaker 1: than not in the middle of the night, you know.

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Speaker 1: So if there's an idea or a chorus, you know

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Speaker 1: what the chorus is, you know what the message of

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Speaker 1: the song. I think that's the key is knowing what

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Speaker 1: the song is about and then working backwards, you know.

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Speaker 1: So you've got the chorus. And what I've always done is, okay,

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Speaker 1: make sure you've got the chorus recorded, because I have

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Speaker 1: a little thing next to my bed, and I if

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Speaker 1: I love it, I'll record it and tomorrow it may

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Speaker 1: be nonsense, but I got to record it. Anyway. Is

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Speaker 1: it both melody and lyrics or is it just melody? No, No,

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Speaker 1: it's it's it's all of the above. You've got to

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Speaker 1: know where you're going, You've got to know, you've got

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Speaker 1: to work. I like to work in levels because Roy

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Speaker 1: Orbison is my freak. I just love him and all

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Speaker 1: of his songs build all the time. And that was

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Speaker 1: the greatest lesson for me. Songwriting is to keep keep rising,

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Speaker 1: keep rising, reach some kind of climax, And to me,

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Speaker 1: that's a great song, you know. And that's why I

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Speaker 1: love Nashville because people are still writing great songs and

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Speaker 1: I really don't get too much of that anywhere else. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: do you remember the first time you heard Roy Orbison? Yes,

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Speaker 1: the first record I ever bought was Crying Wow. Just

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Speaker 1: destroyed me. And it wasn't just the song in itself,

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Speaker 1: it was the way he just kept slowing it down,

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Speaker 1: taking the tempo, not the tempo, but the mood down,

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Speaker 1: and then bringing it up again. And so for me,

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Speaker 1: that's the greatest songwriter, pop songwriter I've ever known, you know.

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Speaker 1: In Dreams Blew by You, Jesus unbelievable. And the voice,

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Speaker 1: the voice is just it was otherworldly and very spiritual.

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Speaker 1: And my father always said, yeah, but he's not in tune.

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Speaker 1: I'm feeling what. That doesn't matter, dad, You know, it

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Speaker 1: doesn't have to be bing Crosby, you know, it just

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Speaker 1: has to move you. And and Roy Orbison moved me

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Speaker 1: beyond anything I've ever known. Was was your dad a

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Speaker 1: musician as well? I mean he was a drummer. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so I got a Yeah, so I got a lot

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Speaker 1: of my rhythmic senses from my father, you know. So

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Speaker 1: I was always, you know, I was always doing something rhythmic.

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Speaker 1: I even had paint cans in the garden upside down

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Speaker 1: so I could play them, and I didn't I don't

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Speaker 1: know what the neighbors ever concerned about it, but it

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Speaker 1: was noisy. But that's you know, that was my father's

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Speaker 1: influence on me. There's an interesting history of great singers

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Speaker 1: who come from a more rhythmic background, you know, drumming,

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Speaker 1: like Steven Tyler, for example, was a drummer. And yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's often the case. It's it definitely adds something. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: It's it's something that's deep inside you and at some

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Speaker 1: point somebody says something about that and you rise to it,

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Speaker 1: you know. So the discovery of the falsetto and and

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Speaker 1: the nonsense that came from all of that was so

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Speaker 1: much rhythm involved, you know, and we had to kick

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Speaker 1: it up. We were told to kick it up or

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Speaker 1: we were gone, you know. So you know, I love

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Speaker 1: them all. I love I love record companies that tell

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Speaker 1: you they're gonna drop you. Wow, thank you. It's it's

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Speaker 1: amazing that you've had the most roller coaster ride maybe

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Speaker 1: of any artists I could think of, in terms of

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Speaker 1: how high the highs were. It's it's really unusual. And

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Speaker 1: I was thinking about it earlier. And the Bags are

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Speaker 1: one of the most successful groups in the history of

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Speaker 1: recorded music. Yeah, it's not arguable. It's you know, top three,

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Speaker 1: top you know, right right up there. It might have

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Speaker 1: been arguable in the past. But I think people, some

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Speaker 1: of our people who've always followed us come back around

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Speaker 1: and some of those songs really mean something now. And

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Speaker 1: I don't understand that. But that's okay. But what's interesting

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Speaker 1: about it is to be as successful as that and

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Speaker 1: still be underrated. There is no explanation for it. You know.

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Speaker 1: I think you can have maybe that you can have

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Speaker 1: too much success. Maybe that's got something to do with it,

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Speaker 1: and you can be overexposed and not know it. And

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Speaker 1: I think that's happened to other artists apart from us,

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Speaker 1: and we didn't really embrace that. You know. We were

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Speaker 1: raising children and life changed, and yeah, we were a

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Speaker 1: little pissed off, that's the right term. But you know,

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Speaker 1: it didn't change us. It didn't change us from who

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Speaker 1: we were. And really it wasn't me, it was the

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Speaker 1: It was the three of us, and the three of

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Speaker 1: us were determined and that's how it worked. And it's

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Speaker 1: more than a pulp group. It's a family, you know.

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Speaker 1: So pulp groups break up, families don't really break up,

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Speaker 1: you know. Yes, that's another part of it that's interesting

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Speaker 1: is that, yes, we've seen other artists reach tremendous highs

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Speaker 1: and then have a backlash, but then they very rarely survive,

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Speaker 1: and they very rarely come back to reach even the

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Speaker 1: higher peaks. Almost none. That's it's really an unbelievable trajectory.

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Speaker 1: And I'm just so happy that you did it. I

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Speaker 1: don't I don't know what happened, you know. I think

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Speaker 1: the connection with Dave Cobb and my love of Nashville

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Speaker 1: music and bluegrass music, My god, I still love the

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Speaker 1: Dixie Cheeks. I don't know what happens that I love

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Speaker 1: them and I love the record you made with them,

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Speaker 1: And I don't understand any of that crap, because that's

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Speaker 1: freedom of speech, you know. Tell me about Besides roy

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Speaker 1: were their other the earliest musical influences you can remember.

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Speaker 1: The first thing that hit me hard was teenage queen

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Speaker 1: Johnny Cash and his own legacy really affected me in

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Speaker 1: a lot of different ways. He was like the voice

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Speaker 1: of America, you know, and at that point and the

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Speaker 1: real story, the real story about all of that is

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Speaker 1: it's all stems from people like Frank Sinatra and Bing Crosby,

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Speaker 1: and there was no rock and roll, there was no

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Speaker 1: pop music. It was something that they led us all

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Speaker 1: into in their time, you know. But once mister Robison,

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Speaker 1: the big Oh, once he arrived, that was it changed

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Speaker 1: me forever. It's interesting how how much of a royal

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Speaker 1: country music played in your life when it didn't make

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Speaker 1: some I mean, there were songs along the way that

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Speaker 1: gave a clue, but it was never a feature in

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Speaker 1: the beg oh. I know, I know, because someone else

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Speaker 1: was always telling us what we should be recording. There

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Speaker 1: was always somebody telling us what direction we should be

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Speaker 1: going in, And I don't think we ever became independent

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Speaker 1: in that in that respect. In life now you can be,

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Speaker 1: but in those days you really couldn't. There was a

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Speaker 1: stage where the guy from the record company would be

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Speaker 1: sitting in the sound proof room making notes on what

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Speaker 1: we were recording. And that was a pure aggravation. You know,

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Speaker 1: you you just can't make it records like that. And

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Speaker 1: I heard that, I've heard other people say that, you know,

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Speaker 1: how can you be how can you be creatively independent

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Speaker 1: if someone's telling you what's wrong and what's right about

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Speaker 1: what you're doing. So that's part of it. With the

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Speaker 1: Everly Brothers, ever in influence, Oh, come on, the Everly

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Speaker 1: Brothers most powerful influence in our lives them and Royal Orbison.

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Speaker 1: But I met Phil Eveley a few years back at

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Speaker 1: BMI and I nearly fainted, you know. And the thing

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Speaker 1: was he was standing with Dwayne Eddie and I went

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Speaker 1: and grabbed Stephen and I said, Dwayne Eddie and Phil

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Speaker 1: Eveley are in the other room standing to go. Come on, listen,

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Speaker 1: let's go take a picture as fast as we can.

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Speaker 1: So I have this picture of Phil Evily you're Duane

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Speaker 1: Eddie in my study and an unforgettable moment. How great

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Speaker 1: is it to be a music fan? Isn't it great?

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Speaker 1: It's wonderful And you don't always have to be about yourself.

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Speaker 1: You know, you can love a lot of other things,

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Speaker 1: a lot of other artists, and it's okay. What would

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Speaker 1: have been the first place that you guys heard three

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Speaker 1: part harmony as opposed to Everley's two part harmony? Well,

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Speaker 1: that the two part thing came from Robin really not

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Speaker 1: wanting to sing socially. He would never sit in the

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Speaker 1: lounge and sing with Morrison. It was just something that

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Speaker 1: he just wasn't comfortable doing. But Morris and I, under

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Speaker 1: those circumstances, became the elderly brothers and we would sing

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Speaker 1: all of those songs, and my favorite is still let

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Speaker 1: It Be Me and devoted to you, And you could

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Speaker 1: not help it. If you couldn't be exactly like them,

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Speaker 1: you could try. Do you remember the first influence of

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Speaker 1: hearing three part harmony? Mills Brothers, Mills Mills brother Yeah,

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Speaker 1: And it was our father, who is a real Mills

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Speaker 1: Brothers fan, and he would bring these records home and

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Speaker 1: we got to know songs like till then and up

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Speaker 1: a lazy River and these amazing harmonies, and then they

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Speaker 1: would impersonate instruments and do things like that, and the

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Speaker 1: father was always on guitar at the back, and it

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Speaker 1: was a family beautiful. The vocals were remarkable for that time.

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Speaker 1: So I was in love. And eventually I met Donald

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Speaker 1: Mill who was the who was the very soft vocalist,

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Speaker 1: and Harry's brother was the rock and roller. You know.

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Speaker 1: Tell me about Robert Stigwood. I never got to meet him.

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Speaker 1: Well you better, Rath. Robert was a little bit um.

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Speaker 1: He was a little bit of a dictator, you know.

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Speaker 1: He was very very much believed in what he was saying.

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Speaker 1: He's very aristocratic. I've seen Robert throw absolute tantrums just

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Speaker 1: to get his own way. So oh yeah, he was.

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Speaker 1: He was an angry man, but he was creatively on fire.

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Speaker 1: And so I think that maybe was that one of

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Speaker 1: the last great managers that we've ever seen anyway, and

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Speaker 1: it did it did seem like he was really on

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Speaker 1: your side and really for it for you. Well, I

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Speaker 1: think Robert was on the side of great business, you know,

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Speaker 1: and that's the deal. That's how it is, and you're

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Speaker 1: better off just looking the other way and getting on

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Speaker 1: with what you do. But he was a businessman down

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Speaker 1: to the core, and we were lucky and fortunate to

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Speaker 1: be signed to EMS because that was the Beatles Company,

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Speaker 1: and so it all rubbed off on us in some way.

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Speaker 1: But I remember the days when you could dress anyway.

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Speaker 1: You felt like dressing flower power dictated everything. And my

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Speaker 1: favorite memory is being in the elevator at nem's going

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Speaker 1: up to Brian Epstein's offices with Eric Clapton, who was

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Speaker 1: dressed as a cowboy and I was dressed as a priest.

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Speaker 1: So you know, it's like I both looked at each

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Speaker 1: other and maybe we both send something crazy about all

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Speaker 1: of this, you know, fantastic. Was there something about growing

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Speaker 1: up in Australia that you think had an effect profoundly?

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Speaker 1: I don't know if you're aware of all these people,

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Speaker 1: but Johnny O'Keeffe, Cold Joy and eventually Billy Thorpe dominated

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Speaker 1: Australian radio and dominated Australian pop, and it was Cold

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Speaker 1: Joy and his brother Kevin Jacobson that got us our

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Speaker 1: first record contract. So the link is powerful, you know,

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Speaker 1: and the influences were powerful, and I could I could

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Speaker 1: name a dozen artists that influence does in Australia, but

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Speaker 1: you can't. You're better up being influenced and not really

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Speaker 1: dealing with all of it. But I love Carl and

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Speaker 1: I love all I love his family. We actually stayed

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Speaker 1: with his family and this was the biggest pop star

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Speaker 1: in Australia. You know, it's their own world. It's their

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Speaker 1: own world, and they don't take much notice of anything else. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: if you wouldn't mind when we finish, if you could

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Speaker 1: make a list of the songs from then, Yeah, because

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Speaker 1: we could share a playlist of Australian music that most

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Speaker 1: of the people listening have never heard anywhere. I love

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Speaker 1: I love it when we get to hear new music,

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Speaker 1: you know. Yeah, it will be a pleasure to do that.

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Speaker 1: And I can already think of half a dozen songs

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Speaker 1: that you might hear and go, oh wow, that's actually

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Speaker 1: really good, but no one ever heard of it outside

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Speaker 1: of Australia. Great. What were your first impressions when you

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Speaker 1: went to London. We were just delighted to be able

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Speaker 1: to get into the race. You know, we wanted to

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Speaker 1: be We just wanted to be famous. You know, it

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Speaker 1: sounds really silly, but that's what we wanted, you know,

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Speaker 1: and whatever we needed to do creatively to become famous.

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Speaker 1: We were ready, and that's not true. We were very naive,

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Speaker 1: but at the same time we were ready to learn.

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Speaker 1: We were ready to learn and grow, and so we

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Speaker 1: arrived in London a thrill of our lifetime. Personally, I

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Speaker 1: would have been just as happy to stay in Australia.

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Speaker 1: I really were the most incredible country, and we were

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Speaker 1: growing up there and I was still growing up there

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Speaker 1: when we left, so I missed that. When you went

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Speaker 1: back to Australia with the BGS, how was the welcome, Well,

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Speaker 1: it was always great. I mean, you know, sometimes you

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Speaker 1: sold out and sometimes you didn't. But that was early days,

255
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Speaker 1: about ninety seventy one, seventy two, and eventually over time

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Speaker 1: after Fever, we did the new Olympic Stadium and that

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Speaker 1: was the thrill of a lifetime because this was where

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Speaker 1: we came from in a way amazing beautiful. Yeah, great days.

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Speaker 1: So there's a beautiful song about to love somebody that

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Speaker 1: you wrote it for Otis Redding, Yes, sir, after he

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Speaker 1: passed and you had the song, was there any question

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Speaker 1: whether or not you should record it for yourself? Well,

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Speaker 1: only because we lost Odish Redding, you know, and we

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Speaker 1: wouldn't have touched it because it wasn't written for us,

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Speaker 1: were written for Otis Redding. And the only reason we

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Speaker 1: actually came around, oh let's just record it ourselves, you know.

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Speaker 1: And I missed the fact that he would have blown

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Speaker 1: it away, you know, and we all loved Odish Redding.

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Speaker 1: So that's another that's another incredible influence. It's it's such

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Speaker 1: an interesting thing because the song is such a quintessential

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Speaker 1: Beiji song. The idea that you might not have sung

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Speaker 1: it is a radical idea, right, But you can hear

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Speaker 1: me trying to sound like Otish Redding. Yeah, you know,

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Speaker 1: you can sort of hear that influence, you know, only

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Speaker 1: after hearing the story. Though I've never heard it until

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Speaker 1: hearing the story. Okay, I always heard that. And we

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Speaker 1: love Dotis reading, and Robin particularly love Dotish Reading. And

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Speaker 1: he had that kind of voice where he could deliver

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Speaker 1: that kind of thing, you know, Robin was unique. The

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Speaker 1: problem for rob was he didn't believe in it enough.

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Speaker 1: He didn't believe in his own voice enough, and so

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Speaker 1: over the years he tried to sound differently than he

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Speaker 1: really should have sounded because if he'd been honest to him,

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Speaker 1: if he'd been him, I think he would have seen

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Speaker 1: a lot of mileage, a lot of mileage. But he didn't.

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Speaker 1: He didn't believe in it enough. Wow, he's got one

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Speaker 1: of the most beautiful voices in the history of recorded music.

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Speaker 1: It's unbelievable. No argument from me. Would you mind if

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Speaker 1: we listen to a song? I don't mind it at all.

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna play you. I want to play one of

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Speaker 1: my favorite of your songs. It's not a well known song,

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Speaker 1: but it's one of my favorites. It's wanted to see

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Speaker 1: what it brings up, and then you can tell me

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Speaker 1: about it after. Could you please listen to lamp Light?

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Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, Yeah, II they am she to bye,

296
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Speaker 1: I close my hide and I die, said she, And

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Speaker 1: she said she lies. Keevy Wild is my lies? Keevy

298
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Speaker 1: like yoursis. I sat thelone with my ble li and

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Speaker 1: saw your face in the crime Rise keep on bur wild,

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Speaker 1: mind Rise keeper to. That's brilliant. It's incredible. I haven't

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Speaker 1: heard that since nineteen sixty nine. Wow, isn't that amazing?

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Speaker 1: It's epic majesty, It's monstrous, and it should have been

303
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Speaker 1: a single. There's no question about it. It's just brilliant,

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Speaker 1: and he was brilliant. And I think Robert was always

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Speaker 1: choosing singles. We didn't choose singles. Roberts chose choosing singles,

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Speaker 1: and that that was where it really became rivalry between us,

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Speaker 1: because he wanted that to be a single, and you

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Speaker 1: know what, he was dead right and Robert was dead wrong.

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Speaker 1: And it's just the way it was. You couldn't you

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Speaker 1: couldn't really make Robert put out something he didn't believe in.

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Speaker 1: But that was just madness. It's interesting, I'll say from

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Speaker 1: as a listener. Yeah, I don't always know who sings what,

313
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Speaker 1: and I never questioned who does what. It's just like

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Speaker 1: this is coming from the group and it's brilliant and

315
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Speaker 1: I didn't know, but it's I wanted to ask about,

316
00:21:13,396 --> 00:21:16,756
Speaker 1: just like the writing first of all, hearing the day

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Speaker 1: for this conversation, I would have never made the connection

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Speaker 1: to Roy Orbison, right. I do not claim any any

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Speaker 1: credit for the song. Robin came in with it, and

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Speaker 1: when Robert didn't choose it as a single, he was

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Speaker 1: really angry. And I think that we just didn't have

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Speaker 1: control over those things and so I think the single

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Speaker 1: became first of May, and now that I hear it again,

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Speaker 1: my god, there's no question that that should have been

325
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Speaker 1: an aside. I really want to know, how does this

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Speaker 1: song exist? Because it's just so beautiful. Well, it had

327
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Speaker 1: a lot to do with them, the fact that the

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Speaker 1: group had become really popular in Germany, and Robin loved

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Speaker 1: that whole aspect of music, and that, you know, the

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Speaker 1: the virile in type of song, the wartime types of songs.

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Speaker 1: He loved all that. So as long as Robin was

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Speaker 1: happy singing something, he blew it away. It was when

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Speaker 1: he tried to adapt to other kinds of music that

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00:22:14,876 --> 00:22:18,756
Speaker 1: wasn't rub It wasn't wrong, but this was wrong. We'll

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Speaker 1: be back with more from Barry Gibb and Rick Rubin.

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Speaker 1: After a break, We're back with more from Barry Gibb

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Speaker 1: and Rick Rubin. Should we listen to I can't see nobody?

338
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Speaker 1: Would that be a good one to listen to? Oh? Sure,

339
00:22:45,836 --> 00:22:55,316
Speaker 1: I'll walk below this streets. I'll watch the people I

340
00:22:55,556 --> 00:23:01,996
Speaker 1: used to smile, follow the far off dust a popping

341
00:23:02,356 --> 00:23:17,636
Speaker 1: up but still it bok. I'll just comple myself. I

342
00:23:17,876 --> 00:23:25,956
Speaker 1: guessing all just time to pay I can't see by

343
00:23:26,276 --> 00:23:34,196
Speaker 1: it now. I can't see now body. My eyes can't out.

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Speaker 1: Only love got you you. I used to have the play.

345
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Speaker 1: I used to thin opennything. I watch the ball, Holy boad,

346
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Speaker 1: I listen to sleep PU see, don't ask me why

347
00:24:04,716 --> 00:24:11,956
Speaker 1: I love you time I told I can see every

348
00:24:12,036 --> 00:24:17,836
Speaker 1: breath that I'm doing. You are my months on my hand.

349
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Speaker 1: I dan't see now body now, I can't see no

350
00:24:26,876 --> 00:24:38,916
Speaker 1: body my eyes you you now. I can tell you

351
00:24:38,996 --> 00:24:42,596
Speaker 1: now how that came about? Yes, that that was written

352
00:24:43,076 --> 00:24:47,396
Speaker 1: in an Australian returned soldiers clubs in a room with strippers.

353
00:24:47,836 --> 00:24:51,356
Speaker 1: That should tell you something. It's amazing and they were

354
00:24:51,356 --> 00:24:54,876
Speaker 1: all changing and we're both just sitting there and that's

355
00:24:55,036 --> 00:24:58,356
Speaker 1: a song I can't see nobody became an obvious title.

356
00:24:59,276 --> 00:25:01,916
Speaker 1: It's amazing that it's it's got this tremendous R and

357
00:25:01,956 --> 00:25:05,556
Speaker 1: B melody. It's got almost like a breakbeat drum pattern

358
00:25:06,076 --> 00:25:10,396
Speaker 1: and strings. It doesn't really sound like anything else. It

359
00:25:10,476 --> 00:25:13,396
Speaker 1: sounds like the Beg's But yeah, one, what I'm hearing

360
00:25:13,476 --> 00:25:16,236
Speaker 1: now and that's a long time stuff heard that. What

361
00:25:16,316 --> 00:25:19,316
Speaker 1: I'm hearing now is too much orchestra. But I would

362
00:25:19,316 --> 00:25:21,996
Speaker 1: have loved no orchestra until at least the first chorus. So,

363
00:25:23,036 --> 00:25:25,676
Speaker 1: like Roy Orbison, it needed to take its time and

364
00:25:25,796 --> 00:25:28,396
Speaker 1: build and build, and so that that would be my

365
00:25:28,476 --> 00:25:32,476
Speaker 1: only thing. But boy, what a voice, what a song,

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Speaker 1: Just a beautiful song. And did you guys get involved

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00:25:35,796 --> 00:25:40,156
Speaker 1: in the orchestration. And I always did the strings with

368
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Speaker 1: Bill Shepherd, who first worked with us in Australia, and

369
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Speaker 1: when we came back, I did. I did things like

370
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Speaker 1: Massachusetts with Bill. Wow. I did a lot of different

371
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Speaker 1: orchestrations because Robin loved it, but he really didn't want

372
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Speaker 1: to be bothered with that. I understood, So that's I

373
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Speaker 1: did some of that stuff. But Bill, you know, he

374
00:26:00,756 --> 00:26:03,316
Speaker 1: was You couldn't control what Bill was going to do

375
00:26:03,556 --> 00:26:05,396
Speaker 1: until the day of the orchestra, day of the session.

376
00:26:05,516 --> 00:26:08,796
Speaker 1: So what I hear now is we would have been

377
00:26:08,836 --> 00:26:11,516
Speaker 1: real wise to have left the strings out until maybe

378
00:26:11,556 --> 00:26:13,876
Speaker 1: the second version. Well I love it. I love it

379
00:26:13,916 --> 00:26:15,676
Speaker 1: just the way it is. I tell you, it takes

380
00:26:15,756 --> 00:26:17,916
Speaker 1: me away. I love it. You know I do too,

381
00:26:18,076 --> 00:26:22,196
Speaker 1: It's just that I haven't heard it in what forty years? Yeah? Yeah, yeah, wow,

382
00:26:22,236 --> 00:26:24,676
Speaker 1: there's oldish reading for you right there, you know. Yeah.

383
00:26:25,436 --> 00:26:29,556
Speaker 1: His influences were strong beautiful. Do you remember any of

384
00:26:29,556 --> 00:26:32,036
Speaker 1: the other R and B singers that might have influenced

385
00:26:32,116 --> 00:26:35,956
Speaker 1: some of the singing Marvin Gay, No question, a lot

386
00:26:35,996 --> 00:26:38,716
Speaker 1: of the other people that were making records in those days.

387
00:26:38,756 --> 00:26:42,036
Speaker 1: Because once, once I met Armad Urchikin in New York,

388
00:26:42,076 --> 00:26:45,316
Speaker 1: he took me along with Robert to the Apollo and

389
00:26:45,396 --> 00:26:47,476
Speaker 1: I saw, for the first time in my life a

390
00:26:47,556 --> 00:26:52,196
Speaker 1: full black show, and Tammy Terrell and Marvin Gay and

391
00:26:52,796 --> 00:26:55,916
Speaker 1: Otis Redding blew my shocks off, you know so, and

392
00:26:55,996 --> 00:26:57,676
Speaker 1: I was sitting right in the middle of the theater,

393
00:26:58,516 --> 00:27:01,276
Speaker 1: so it couldn't have been more powerful to me than

394
00:27:01,316 --> 00:27:04,956
Speaker 1: it was. And I know that Robin Robin would have

395
00:27:04,996 --> 00:27:07,156
Speaker 1: loved it. Do you think Ahmed brought you with the

396
00:27:07,236 --> 00:27:11,276
Speaker 1: idea of potent soul for writing in that style, or

397
00:27:11,276 --> 00:27:12,876
Speaker 1: do you just bring you because he thought you'd enjoyed

398
00:27:12,876 --> 00:27:15,956
Speaker 1: the show. He did come to Miami when we were

399
00:27:15,956 --> 00:27:20,916
Speaker 1: recording Nights on Broadway and we our title was Lights

400
00:27:20,956 --> 00:27:24,796
Speaker 1: on Broadway, and he said, no, you can't call it

401
00:27:24,876 --> 00:27:27,076
Speaker 1: Lights on Broadway, but you can call it Nights on

402
00:27:27,156 --> 00:27:30,956
Speaker 1: Broadway because it's more sensual. It just has more meaning

403
00:27:30,996 --> 00:27:33,556
Speaker 1: to it. So he was good. He was good at

404
00:27:33,556 --> 00:27:35,036
Speaker 1: saying things like that to us. And he was a

405
00:27:35,076 --> 00:27:37,796
Speaker 1: great man, so he would come into town even if

406
00:27:37,836 --> 00:27:40,076
Speaker 1: he didn't need to. He was he was very dedicated

407
00:27:40,116 --> 00:27:43,556
Speaker 1: to his artists. And but he's the guy who said

408
00:27:43,996 --> 00:27:46,996
Speaker 1: it through Robert, if they don't kick it up and

409
00:27:46,996 --> 00:27:50,396
Speaker 1: we're going to drop them. Wow. So that's that's the

410
00:27:50,436 --> 00:27:54,556
Speaker 1: record industry, and it's it can be really angry at

411
00:27:54,556 --> 00:27:56,316
Speaker 1: it can be really ruthless if you're not doing what

412
00:27:56,356 --> 00:27:58,596
Speaker 1: they want you to do. Do you remember the first

413
00:27:58,636 --> 00:28:02,596
Speaker 1: time you met Ahmed my visits New York to meet

414
00:28:02,636 --> 00:28:06,436
Speaker 1: the Emperor people to meet Nat Weiss and Armored and

415
00:28:06,516 --> 00:28:10,236
Speaker 1: a Sue his brother. Yeah, I do. And we went

416
00:28:10,276 --> 00:28:14,476
Speaker 1: to his apartment and Robert insisted on playing bags first,

417
00:28:14,516 --> 00:28:17,756
Speaker 1: and I think it was all about making making Armored

418
00:28:17,756 --> 00:28:21,876
Speaker 1: happy to sign us up and represent us at Atlantic Records.

419
00:28:21,916 --> 00:28:25,076
Speaker 1: And that's how it worked. That's that's what happened. But

420
00:28:25,276 --> 00:28:27,156
Speaker 1: we were never in the light, we never we never

421
00:28:27,156 --> 00:28:30,636
Speaker 1: saw these things happening, and they just happened. Yeah, tell

422
00:28:30,676 --> 00:28:33,836
Speaker 1: me about a Reef Arif was wonderful. He was like

423
00:28:33,876 --> 00:28:37,036
Speaker 1: our uncle, you know, but he always played that role.

424
00:28:37,636 --> 00:28:41,236
Speaker 1: He was a genius and he started out with us

425
00:28:41,276 --> 00:28:44,476
Speaker 1: on an album called Mister Natural and it didn't pan out,

426
00:28:44,556 --> 00:28:47,596
Speaker 1: it wasn't successful, but bless his heart, he said, well,

427
00:28:47,676 --> 00:28:50,316
Speaker 1: let's do another, you know, let's do one more. And

428
00:28:51,036 --> 00:28:53,876
Speaker 1: of course he was the in house producer for Atlantic Records,

429
00:28:54,796 --> 00:28:57,556
Speaker 1: and main Course was the album and jive talking and

430
00:28:57,636 --> 00:29:00,836
Speaker 1: all this stuff. That was the album that we first

431
00:29:00,956 --> 00:29:03,236
Speaker 1: really worked with Armored. Well, we worked with him before,

432
00:29:03,276 --> 00:29:06,236
Speaker 1: but this was different, and I think he was taking

433
00:29:06,276 --> 00:29:11,316
Speaker 1: his instructions from Armored and at the end of main Course,

434
00:29:11,916 --> 00:29:13,836
Speaker 1: if I could be wrong, I don't think I am.

435
00:29:13,876 --> 00:29:17,756
Speaker 1: But I think that Saturday Night Fever featured jive talking,

436
00:29:18,436 --> 00:29:22,236
Speaker 1: but not the record, the live version, and I think

437
00:29:22,236 --> 00:29:25,876
Speaker 1: that that was maybe underhanded, and I think that Armored

438
00:29:25,916 --> 00:29:28,676
Speaker 1: was really upset about it, and so was a Reef.

439
00:29:29,436 --> 00:29:31,996
Speaker 1: So that caused a lot of friction between Robert and

440
00:29:32,036 --> 00:29:35,916
Speaker 1: Atlantic and Armored. We never saw it, but we knew it,

441
00:29:36,236 --> 00:29:41,876
Speaker 1: you know. And suddenly Armored canceled a Reef being our producer. So,

442
00:29:42,116 --> 00:29:44,196
Speaker 1: you know, if you want to get back at at

443
00:29:44,196 --> 00:29:47,676
Speaker 1: a manager hit the artist, you know, And that was

444
00:29:47,716 --> 00:29:50,356
Speaker 1: the way that the business worked then, that was the way.

445
00:29:50,396 --> 00:29:52,396
Speaker 1: But we never saw it. We never We didn't know

446
00:29:52,476 --> 00:29:55,436
Speaker 1: what anybody was unhappy about until until we figured out

447
00:29:55,476 --> 00:29:58,116
Speaker 1: what had happened. That Robert was trying to avoid paying

448
00:29:58,396 --> 00:30:02,236
Speaker 1: Atlantic royalties on the record, I understood, and they used

449
00:30:02,236 --> 00:30:05,796
Speaker 1: the live version, which made everybody really angry. Yeah. Also

450
00:30:05,956 --> 00:30:11,676
Speaker 1: interesting that it led to some of your most successful work, Yeah,

451
00:30:11,716 --> 00:30:14,756
Speaker 1: even without our reef and that. And that's interesting too,

452
00:30:14,796 --> 00:30:18,276
Speaker 1: because you know, you can't tell, like what seems like

453
00:30:18,276 --> 00:30:21,476
Speaker 1: a bad thing in the moment leads to something different

454
00:30:21,516 --> 00:30:23,876
Speaker 1: and it turns out great. It's like, we don't know,

455
00:30:23,956 --> 00:30:26,356
Speaker 1: we can't predict, don't know. You don't know what's going

456
00:30:26,356 --> 00:30:29,636
Speaker 1: to happen with any records you make, and we didn't know.

457
00:30:29,836 --> 00:30:31,876
Speaker 1: We just we were asked to write a certain amount

458
00:30:31,876 --> 00:30:34,836
Speaker 1: of songs for this film. We never saw the script

459
00:30:35,516 --> 00:30:38,916
Speaker 1: and we just we had to reinvent ourselves because of

460
00:30:38,956 --> 00:30:43,836
Speaker 1: what Armord said. And the Falsetto was discovered basically on

461
00:30:43,956 --> 00:30:48,036
Speaker 1: Nights or Broadway, so didn't even know it existed. That's

462
00:30:48,476 --> 00:30:51,156
Speaker 1: very strange, but that's how it was. What was your

463
00:30:51,156 --> 00:30:54,996
Speaker 1: first introduction to disco music as disco music, Well, we

464
00:30:55,636 --> 00:30:57,876
Speaker 1: didn't know what disco music it was. I'm just telling

465
00:30:57,876 --> 00:31:00,476
Speaker 1: you exactly how we felt about it all. We didn't

466
00:31:00,516 --> 00:31:04,276
Speaker 1: know how the word disco never entered our heads until afterwards.

467
00:31:04,796 --> 00:31:07,236
Speaker 1: I actually agree with you that you should be dancing

468
00:31:07,236 --> 00:31:10,236
Speaker 1: and night fever word disco records, there's no question about that.

469
00:31:10,996 --> 00:31:13,276
Speaker 1: But there were party records to us, There were records

470
00:31:13,276 --> 00:31:16,636
Speaker 1: that were made in fun, you know. And and we

471
00:31:16,716 --> 00:31:19,036
Speaker 1: had to run away a little bit from the big

472
00:31:19,076 --> 00:31:22,116
Speaker 1: Pathos ballads because the record company didn't want us to

473
00:31:22,156 --> 00:31:25,916
Speaker 1: do that anymore. And that must have affected Rob, affected

474
00:31:25,956 --> 00:31:28,796
Speaker 1: all of us. But the discovery of this other voice

475
00:31:29,876 --> 00:31:33,036
Speaker 1: was in a way an incredible thing, because that's all

476
00:31:33,076 --> 00:31:38,316
Speaker 1: everybody wanted after that, including Rob, because Rob Rob's obsession

477
00:31:38,356 --> 00:31:42,476
Speaker 1: was hit records, hit records, he should Yeah, I don't

478
00:31:42,516 --> 00:31:44,596
Speaker 1: have to sing them, but I want to hit. I

479
00:31:44,636 --> 00:31:47,476
Speaker 1: want another hit, And so he would always say, along

480
00:31:47,516 --> 00:31:49,516
Speaker 1: with other people, go and do that voice again, go

481
00:31:49,556 --> 00:31:51,876
Speaker 1: to that voice again. So I think we were all

482
00:31:51,956 --> 00:31:54,676
Speaker 1: victims with the same thing. And we loved it. We

483
00:31:54,756 --> 00:31:57,276
Speaker 1: loved the adventure of it. We loved coming up with

484
00:31:57,316 --> 00:32:00,236
Speaker 1: things that people hadn't heard before. We loved the embellishment,

485
00:32:00,316 --> 00:32:04,796
Speaker 1: the multitracks. The new game was slaves and masters, you know,

486
00:32:05,436 --> 00:32:07,756
Speaker 1: and you know, you can have a tape full of

487
00:32:07,916 --> 00:32:10,076
Speaker 1: glee guitar and you bound what you like onto the

488
00:32:10,116 --> 00:32:12,596
Speaker 1: master that would be that had become the new norm

489
00:32:12,756 --> 00:32:17,236
Speaker 1: at that point. So I think we got trapped, accorded

490
00:32:18,036 --> 00:32:22,236
Speaker 1: into the adventure, you know, and we never knew what

491
00:32:22,276 --> 00:32:26,036
Speaker 1: was going to happen. And at some point we were

492
00:32:26,036 --> 00:32:28,596
Speaker 1: selling a million records a week, but it was a

493
00:32:28,596 --> 00:32:31,476
Speaker 1: double album, and it was a compilation album, so you

494
00:32:31,476 --> 00:32:34,516
Speaker 1: could never really say, oh, that's ours, you know, never

495
00:32:34,556 --> 00:32:37,276
Speaker 1: really affected us that way. We couldn't believe what was

496
00:32:37,316 --> 00:32:39,956
Speaker 1: happening because we were trying to make this movie called

497
00:32:39,956 --> 00:32:43,876
Speaker 1: Side from Pepper with Peter Brampton, and suddenly the dancers

498
00:32:44,436 --> 00:32:47,116
Speaker 1: in the film were dancing to Saturday Night Fever and

499
00:32:47,196 --> 00:32:50,596
Speaker 1: in the lunch breaks, what are they doing? You know,

500
00:32:51,316 --> 00:32:54,196
Speaker 1: and we all had you've probably heard it before. We

501
00:32:54,236 --> 00:32:56,796
Speaker 1: all had one win a bagel, and Peter Frampton had

502
00:32:56,796 --> 00:32:59,596
Speaker 1: his own win a bagel, and after about two weeks

503
00:32:59,716 --> 00:33:03,556
Speaker 1: we each had a winner bagel. So there was the

504
00:33:03,596 --> 00:33:05,996
Speaker 1: only reflection of success that we understood at that point.

505
00:33:07,196 --> 00:33:11,516
Speaker 1: It's interesting that you've some ways the bags have come

506
00:33:11,556 --> 00:33:15,396
Speaker 1: to define disco when it was never really what you

507
00:33:15,636 --> 00:33:18,796
Speaker 1: It's never really what you did and you and it's

508
00:33:18,876 --> 00:33:22,716
Speaker 1: it's also interesting that that people who were making disco

509
00:33:22,836 --> 00:33:27,356
Speaker 1: records while they were dance records tended not to be

510
00:33:28,036 --> 00:33:33,356
Speaker 1: song based records. I agree, I agree, And we didn't

511
00:33:33,396 --> 00:33:35,556
Speaker 1: know what we were doing or where we were going,

512
00:33:35,716 --> 00:33:37,916
Speaker 1: but we were loving the adventure of it. We were

513
00:33:37,956 --> 00:33:40,996
Speaker 1: loving doing something different, and I think the whole concept

514
00:33:40,996 --> 00:33:46,716
Speaker 1: of reinventing yourself came to us. Every Beatles album had

515
00:33:46,756 --> 00:33:49,276
Speaker 1: a different call it cover. They looked different every time

516
00:33:49,916 --> 00:33:52,836
Speaker 1: they didn't. They didn't think of music as something you heard.

517
00:33:53,116 --> 00:33:56,476
Speaker 1: They thought of music is something you saw. And that

518
00:33:56,556 --> 00:33:59,276
Speaker 1: was my lesson, that that a song has to be visual,

519
00:33:59,796 --> 00:34:01,676
Speaker 1: you know, and you have to know, you have to

520
00:34:01,716 --> 00:34:06,556
Speaker 1: be there to love a song. And that's where Royalbison

521
00:34:06,636 --> 00:34:09,836
Speaker 1: touched me. That's where the Beatles touched me. Eleanor Rigby

522
00:34:09,916 --> 00:34:11,836
Speaker 1: is probably one of my favorite records of all time,

523
00:34:12,916 --> 00:34:15,356
Speaker 1: not just because it's a great record, but because there

524
00:34:15,396 --> 00:34:18,236
Speaker 1: was a vision, There was a there was a storyline,

525
00:34:18,276 --> 00:34:21,396
Speaker 1: there was people in the story. And I loved all

526
00:34:21,396 --> 00:34:25,116
Speaker 1: of that and we may have even tried to imitate that,

527
00:34:25,196 --> 00:34:27,756
Speaker 1: but they were they were the only people who could

528
00:34:27,756 --> 00:34:32,036
Speaker 1: do that. Tell me about criteria, the studio criteria, Well,

529
00:34:32,076 --> 00:34:36,796
Speaker 1: we spent about five or six years between Main Course

530
00:34:37,036 --> 00:34:41,356
Speaker 1: and Fever and then Children of the World before Fever

531
00:34:42,396 --> 00:34:44,996
Speaker 1: and You Should Be Dancing and songs like that ended

532
00:34:45,076 --> 00:34:48,596
Speaker 1: up in the movie, So it wasn't like Fever was

533
00:34:48,636 --> 00:34:51,716
Speaker 1: directly written for the movie. There were songs taken from

534
00:34:51,836 --> 00:34:53,716
Speaker 1: like you Should Be Dancing was taken from Children of

535
00:34:53,756 --> 00:34:57,036
Speaker 1: the World. So I think, yes, we were very influenced

536
00:34:57,036 --> 00:35:00,036
Speaker 1: by whatever disco was, but we didn't understand that. We

537
00:35:00,036 --> 00:35:02,596
Speaker 1: didn't know about the word. It was only when disco

538
00:35:02,636 --> 00:35:06,716
Speaker 1: became bad a bad word. Yeah, about a year later,

539
00:35:06,796 --> 00:35:10,036
Speaker 1: maybe two years later, it became a bad a bad word,

540
00:35:10,476 --> 00:35:13,276
Speaker 1: and we just had to swallow hard and keep going

541
00:35:13,356 --> 00:35:15,996
Speaker 1: and keep trying. And it was always for us, it

542
00:35:16,036 --> 00:35:19,076
Speaker 1: was always well back to the studio, you know. Yeah,

543
00:35:19,236 --> 00:35:21,196
Speaker 1: were the Eagles recording at the same time as you

544
00:35:21,236 --> 00:35:23,956
Speaker 1: were recording that they did one of these nights a

545
00:35:24,116 --> 00:35:26,636
Speaker 1: criteria and that really triggered a lot of things for

546
00:35:26,756 --> 00:35:29,076
Speaker 1: us because they were using falsetto as well, so it

547
00:35:29,116 --> 00:35:30,916
Speaker 1: didn't feel like a sin. It didn't feel like we

548
00:35:30,916 --> 00:35:33,716
Speaker 1: shouldn't something we shouldn't do, and they didn't do it

549
00:35:33,796 --> 00:35:36,436
Speaker 1: much after that, so it was just one of these

550
00:35:36,556 --> 00:35:39,396
Speaker 1: nights and Hotel California was totally different type of record.

551
00:35:39,796 --> 00:35:42,716
Speaker 1: Do you think they were influenced by you guys in

552
00:35:42,756 --> 00:35:45,036
Speaker 1: the making of that song. No, I think it was

553
00:35:45,076 --> 00:35:48,956
Speaker 1: the other way around. Feel it. Yeah, we thought, well,

554
00:35:48,956 --> 00:35:51,236
Speaker 1: if they can do that, we were already doing that,

555
00:35:51,596 --> 00:35:54,076
Speaker 1: so we shouldn't be We shouldn't be concerned about it.

556
00:35:54,356 --> 00:35:59,196
Speaker 1: We should just make music. So while the breakups of

557
00:35:59,236 --> 00:36:03,716
Speaker 1: the group are famous, right, the reality is you're only

558
00:36:03,756 --> 00:36:07,676
Speaker 1: apart very little time wise, really over the years for

559
00:36:09,316 --> 00:36:12,956
Speaker 1: ninety five percent, ninety eight percent of the time that

560
00:36:12,996 --> 00:36:15,156
Speaker 1: you were a band with the look a look at

561
00:36:15,156 --> 00:36:17,436
Speaker 1: how life was in those days, and there were all

562
00:36:17,516 --> 00:36:20,516
Speaker 1: kinds of substances, There were all kinds of ways of

563
00:36:20,556 --> 00:36:23,956
Speaker 1: getting high. We never could get hold of anything the

564
00:36:23,956 --> 00:36:28,316
Speaker 1: Beatles were taking, but that's become a truth. So, you know,

565
00:36:28,396 --> 00:36:30,596
Speaker 1: but we certainly had our fun. You know, we had

566
00:36:30,596 --> 00:36:34,596
Speaker 1: emphetamines and we had I think Morris was he loved

567
00:36:34,596 --> 00:36:38,476
Speaker 1: to drink. Robin and I both loved emphetamines, and I

568
00:36:38,676 --> 00:36:42,156
Speaker 1: particularly love grass. So these things come and go, and

569
00:36:42,596 --> 00:36:46,036
Speaker 1: you know, you grow. But I certainly remember that that

570
00:36:46,116 --> 00:36:50,676
Speaker 1: was a source of inspiration. But interesting that the breakup

571
00:36:50,756 --> 00:36:52,596
Speaker 1: that the time that you were a part was ended

572
00:36:52,676 --> 00:36:56,036
Speaker 1: up being short in the big picture, Yeah, about fifteen months,

573
00:36:56,036 --> 00:36:59,276
Speaker 1: fifteen to sixteen months. And I would say that's what

574
00:36:59,396 --> 00:37:01,676
Speaker 1: it was down to. That's what it was down to.

575
00:37:01,876 --> 00:37:06,716
Speaker 1: Those substances and an inability to understand each other, and

576
00:37:07,196 --> 00:37:10,116
Speaker 1: that there isn't one of us that's responsible for that.

577
00:37:10,156 --> 00:37:12,876
Speaker 1: It was all of us. And then you had management,

578
00:37:12,996 --> 00:37:17,236
Speaker 1: which was pretty crazy anyway, you know, And that's that's

579
00:37:17,276 --> 00:37:19,956
Speaker 1: just what happened. You can't, as you said, you don't know.

580
00:37:20,156 --> 00:37:22,436
Speaker 1: You just don't know what's going to happen in splitting

581
00:37:22,476 --> 00:37:25,956
Speaker 1: up lead vocal parts. Yeah, would it always be obvious

582
00:37:26,036 --> 00:37:28,796
Speaker 1: who would sing what? Or was the person who wrote

583
00:37:28,916 --> 00:37:31,916
Speaker 1: a part the person who sang it. Yes, always the

584
00:37:31,956 --> 00:37:33,716
Speaker 1: person who came in with the idea would be the

585
00:37:33,756 --> 00:37:37,116
Speaker 1: person who sang the song. And that's because that person

586
00:37:37,156 --> 00:37:40,276
Speaker 1: has already made a commitment to singing that song emotionally.

587
00:37:40,916 --> 00:37:43,636
Speaker 1: So you didn't take a song from away from each other. No,

588
00:37:44,156 --> 00:37:46,796
Speaker 1: if Robin came in with a song like Holiday or

589
00:37:46,916 --> 00:37:49,396
Speaker 1: like Saved by the Bell, which he eventually did as

590
00:37:49,436 --> 00:37:51,396
Speaker 1: a solo artist, but he did he did do it

591
00:37:51,396 --> 00:37:54,716
Speaker 1: with Mo, so it wasn't really it was twins, you know,

592
00:37:54,716 --> 00:37:56,836
Speaker 1: And that's how you had to deal with it. Well,

593
00:37:56,876 --> 00:37:58,996
Speaker 1: I was going to ask it often was the case

594
00:37:59,036 --> 00:38:01,956
Speaker 1: that you guys sang together as well? Oh, run to me?

595
00:38:02,556 --> 00:38:04,436
Speaker 1: We would have been apart. We've been apart for about

596
00:38:04,436 --> 00:38:07,876
Speaker 1: sixteen months, fifteen or sixteen months. And suddenly Robin. We

597
00:38:07,876 --> 00:38:11,556
Speaker 1: were living in Kensington, and Robin turned up at my

598
00:38:11,596 --> 00:38:16,076
Speaker 1: front door and we just got on immediately, and he

599
00:38:16,156 --> 00:38:19,356
Speaker 1: sat down in the kitchen with me and I said

600
00:38:20,036 --> 00:38:22,156
Speaker 1: to him, how I'm working on this song at the moment,

601
00:38:22,196 --> 00:38:23,636
Speaker 1: you want to do it with me? And he went, yeah,

602
00:38:23,636 --> 00:38:25,756
Speaker 1: of course, and that was how can your mend a

603
00:38:25,796 --> 00:38:28,916
Speaker 1: broken heart? And wow? And I said to him at

604
00:38:28,916 --> 00:38:32,076
Speaker 1: that point, why don't you sing the verse verse? Because

605
00:38:32,116 --> 00:38:33,756
Speaker 1: I was trying to reach out. I was trying to say,

606
00:38:33,796 --> 00:38:35,516
Speaker 1: you know what, I don't want to sing this whole song.

607
00:38:35,916 --> 00:38:38,516
Speaker 1: We're writing it together, let's sing it together. That's how

608
00:38:38,556 --> 00:38:41,516
Speaker 1: that one came about. So Robin sang the verse verse.

609
00:38:41,596 --> 00:38:44,316
Speaker 1: I sang the second verse, and it proved to be

610
00:38:44,356 --> 00:38:47,316
Speaker 1: something that was just interesting because it was varied, it

611
00:38:47,356 --> 00:38:50,156
Speaker 1: wasn't the same person all the time, but the message

612
00:38:50,236 --> 00:38:53,516
Speaker 1: was strong and really it was a personal message about

613
00:38:53,556 --> 00:38:55,796
Speaker 1: the three of us. Yeah, It's one of the secrets

614
00:38:55,796 --> 00:38:57,396
Speaker 1: of the Beatles as well, the fact that there were

615
00:38:57,516 --> 00:39:02,716
Speaker 1: multiple voices. Yeah allowed it. If you hear one person

616
00:39:02,996 --> 00:39:06,956
Speaker 1: sing twelve songs in a row, it has one effect.

617
00:39:07,476 --> 00:39:10,076
Speaker 1: Whereas if people take turns, even if you don't always

618
00:39:10,116 --> 00:39:13,836
Speaker 1: know who's singing, there's something in you that feels like

619
00:39:13,916 --> 00:39:17,316
Speaker 1: something new is happening all the time and it's exciting, right,

620
00:39:17,516 --> 00:39:19,756
Speaker 1: And that same thing applies to when you're not singing,

621
00:39:20,116 --> 00:39:23,756
Speaker 1: that something has to take over, something, some instrumental form

622
00:39:23,956 --> 00:39:27,636
Speaker 1: or some little riff or something or other that that

623
00:39:27,716 --> 00:39:30,676
Speaker 1: replaces the vocal for just ten seconds or five seconds.

624
00:39:31,276 --> 00:39:34,396
Speaker 1: And that worked really well for us, and we just

625
00:39:34,516 --> 00:39:37,556
Speaker 1: learned and learned and grew from that. But that's how

626
00:39:37,556 --> 00:39:40,956
Speaker 1: we came back together. We'll be right back with Barry Gibb.

627
00:39:41,356 --> 00:39:47,356
Speaker 1: After this quick break. We're back with the rest of

628
00:39:47,436 --> 00:39:51,436
Speaker 1: Rick Rubens conversation with Barry Gibb. They jump back in

629
00:39:51,516 --> 00:39:54,596
Speaker 1: by talking about Guilty, the album Barry co produced for

630
00:39:54,636 --> 00:39:59,116
Speaker 1: Barbara streisand in nineteen eighty tell me about working with Barbara.

631
00:39:59,276 --> 00:40:03,356
Speaker 1: Oh incredible, Well, you know you can you can imagine

632
00:40:03,396 --> 00:40:08,476
Speaker 1: what Barbara's likes. Very strong willed and very intentional about

633
00:40:08,516 --> 00:40:11,596
Speaker 1: what she's doing. But the issue was always for me

634
00:40:11,756 --> 00:40:14,476
Speaker 1: is when she wanted to sing. And of course, if

635
00:40:14,476 --> 00:40:17,436
Speaker 1: you're dealing with Barbara and you can't just say, okay,

636
00:40:17,476 --> 00:40:19,916
Speaker 1: it's time to sing Barbara, you know, it just never

637
00:40:19,956 --> 00:40:23,596
Speaker 1: worked that way. So the last record remade, you would say, well,

638
00:40:23,756 --> 00:40:25,636
Speaker 1: I don't like singing at two o'clock in the morning,

639
00:40:28,716 --> 00:40:30,476
Speaker 1: I said, I want to go to the last two nights.

640
00:40:31,276 --> 00:40:33,156
Speaker 1: If you do that, you know, Oh well I like

641
00:40:33,276 --> 00:40:36,396
Speaker 1: doing it that way. Okay, Well we still didn't and

642
00:40:37,276 --> 00:40:40,276
Speaker 1: and so what was a two week session became a

643
00:40:40,276 --> 00:40:42,516
Speaker 1: three week session because she didn't really feel like singing

644
00:40:42,636 --> 00:40:46,196
Speaker 1: until she felt like singing. But that's Barbara. She's unique

645
00:40:46,276 --> 00:40:51,356
Speaker 1: and special and there's a reason why everybody loves her,

646
00:40:51,596 --> 00:40:54,116
Speaker 1: and I'm one of them. I went to an event

647
00:40:54,196 --> 00:40:58,836
Speaker 1: that was a friend's passing right, and some of the

648
00:40:58,876 --> 00:41:03,276
Speaker 1: greatest artists of all times sang at this event, and

649
00:41:03,436 --> 00:41:06,276
Speaker 1: Barbara was the final person to sing. And this was

650
00:41:06,356 --> 00:41:09,756
Speaker 1: after all of the people who we consider the greatest

651
00:41:09,796 --> 00:41:13,156
Speaker 1: singers of all time. And I had not known much

652
00:41:13,156 --> 00:41:15,716
Speaker 1: about Barbara at that time. I mean, my mom loved Barbara,

653
00:41:15,756 --> 00:41:18,116
Speaker 1: but I didn't know much about her. And from the

654
00:41:18,196 --> 00:41:23,516
Speaker 1: moment she opened her voice before there from the first phrase,

655
00:41:24,996 --> 00:41:27,756
Speaker 1: she was the only person who existed. It was like

656
00:41:27,836 --> 00:41:32,276
Speaker 1: from another planet. It's it's magical. But when she decided

657
00:41:32,316 --> 00:41:35,316
Speaker 1: to commit to it, it was amazing. When we first

658
00:41:35,316 --> 00:41:38,716
Speaker 1: did guilty, she sang it once and I said, well,

659
00:41:38,796 --> 00:41:41,956
Speaker 1: can you give us like five takes so that we can,

660
00:41:42,756 --> 00:41:45,156
Speaker 1: you know, choose and pick and all that stuff. And

661
00:41:45,276 --> 00:41:51,196
Speaker 1: she said, well, I just sang it. I know you did, Barbara.

662
00:41:51,236 --> 00:41:55,236
Speaker 1: It's wonderful, but we need five takes because I don't know.

663
00:41:55,276 --> 00:41:57,196
Speaker 1: We want to amplify what you're doing. We want to

664
00:41:57,196 --> 00:42:01,276
Speaker 1: make it more, more passionate. And so she went out

665
00:42:01,276 --> 00:42:04,156
Speaker 1: and sang it five more times. But she didn't understand

666
00:42:04,196 --> 00:42:08,276
Speaker 1: that until I said, can you do it more than once? Well,

667
00:42:08,316 --> 00:42:11,396
Speaker 1: I just did it. I'm amazed. I'm amazed that you

668
00:42:11,476 --> 00:42:13,756
Speaker 1: got her to do it. Yeah. Well, we had well

669
00:42:13,796 --> 00:42:16,236
Speaker 1: to getting a cough sitting in the soundproof room and

670
00:42:16,316 --> 00:42:19,836
Speaker 1: Charles Copperman, so I think that you know, her clothe,

671
00:42:19,876 --> 00:42:22,436
Speaker 1: the closest people to her understood what we were doing.

672
00:42:23,236 --> 00:42:26,756
Speaker 1: And the only time she ever said anything about guilty

673
00:42:26,916 --> 00:42:29,996
Speaker 1: was when she didn't like the word battle. A battle

674
00:42:31,396 --> 00:42:34,436
Speaker 1: in that particular sentence. So we had to go find

675
00:42:34,436 --> 00:42:39,436
Speaker 1: another battle, and we did. Can we listen to a

676
00:42:39,556 --> 00:42:42,916
Speaker 1: woman in love? Would you mind? Not at all? Let's

677
00:42:42,956 --> 00:43:13,636
Speaker 1: hear that space when the dream is gone. It's a

678
00:43:13,716 --> 00:43:23,676
Speaker 1: lonely place. I kissed the morning good bye down inside.

679
00:43:23,996 --> 00:43:31,196
Speaker 1: You know, we never know why the road is narrow

680
00:43:31,476 --> 00:43:40,956
Speaker 1: and lone when eyes melins and the feeling strong. I

681
00:43:41,316 --> 00:43:47,276
Speaker 1: turned away from the wall. I stumbled at far, but

682
00:43:47,476 --> 00:43:54,116
Speaker 1: I gave you in O. I am no woman in

683
00:43:54,356 --> 00:44:00,316
Speaker 1: love and you waity to get you into my mind

684
00:44:01,436 --> 00:44:23,796
Speaker 1: and hold you with these Wow. Incredible, Yeah, what a

685
00:44:23,836 --> 00:44:28,276
Speaker 1: monster's vocal? My god, just incredible. Tell me about the

686
00:44:28,316 --> 00:44:31,596
Speaker 1: writing of the song. We were in a few houses

687
00:44:31,596 --> 00:44:35,356
Speaker 1: down the road, the three of us, and we were

688
00:44:35,356 --> 00:44:38,716
Speaker 1: in a spare bedroom, and we just found out that

689
00:44:38,836 --> 00:44:43,076
Speaker 1: Barbara wanted to do that album, and I was to

690
00:44:43,116 --> 00:44:44,796
Speaker 1: come up with five songs and I was to go

691
00:44:44,836 --> 00:44:48,596
Speaker 1: to La and play them to her. And that was

692
00:44:48,716 --> 00:44:51,276
Speaker 1: basically how it came about. That was the first thing

693
00:44:51,276 --> 00:44:56,596
Speaker 1: we wrote, actually, was guilty and then woman in Love. Yeah,

694
00:44:56,876 --> 00:45:00,436
Speaker 1: And then we took him to La and she sat

695
00:45:00,436 --> 00:45:03,196
Speaker 1: on a big pillow and everyone sat around and listened

696
00:45:03,236 --> 00:45:05,996
Speaker 1: to the first five songs and at the end she

697
00:45:06,036 --> 00:45:08,436
Speaker 1: said okay, said okay, let's do it. She said, can

698
00:45:08,476 --> 00:45:12,876
Speaker 1: you give me another five? I couldn't do that, and

699
00:45:12,916 --> 00:45:15,196
Speaker 1: she just said, well just give me another five. You know.

700
00:45:15,636 --> 00:45:18,196
Speaker 1: But that's Barbara and you went ahead and did it.

701
00:45:18,756 --> 00:45:21,596
Speaker 1: So so it was written specifically for her to sing. Yeah,

702
00:45:21,796 --> 00:45:25,756
Speaker 1: if if if you weren't tasked with writing something for Barbara,

703
00:45:25,916 --> 00:45:28,036
Speaker 1: that song might not have ever come it. Well, it

704
00:45:28,076 --> 00:45:30,356
Speaker 1: wouldn't have happened if it hadn't been for the falsetto.

705
00:45:30,916 --> 00:45:33,956
Speaker 1: Because what was what was what worked great for me

706
00:45:34,196 --> 00:45:36,396
Speaker 1: was that I could always do something in a woman's key.

707
00:45:36,996 --> 00:45:39,076
Speaker 1: And so if you're writing for a woman and you

708
00:45:39,196 --> 00:45:41,556
Speaker 1: happened to sing it in her key, it's much more

709
00:45:41,596 --> 00:45:44,436
Speaker 1: attractive to the person who you want to sing the song,

710
00:45:45,036 --> 00:45:47,716
Speaker 1: you know. So I was lucky in that respect. So,

711
00:45:47,836 --> 00:45:49,716
Speaker 1: but you don't want to hear me sing woman in Love?

712
00:45:51,076 --> 00:45:53,436
Speaker 1: You know? I think I'd rather hear Barbara do it.

713
00:45:53,796 --> 00:45:57,076
Speaker 1: Let's listen to another song that is um that we

714
00:45:57,156 --> 00:46:01,116
Speaker 1: might argue, is you singing a woman's part? Let's hear love?

715
00:46:01,156 --> 00:46:07,076
Speaker 1: So right? No, I did. It's beautiful. Oh I love

716
00:46:07,076 --> 00:46:19,476
Speaker 1: it too. She can't unlike the night and she held

717
00:46:19,756 --> 00:46:24,196
Speaker 1: on time and the world was right. When she made

718
00:46:24,356 --> 00:46:35,316
Speaker 1: love to me, we were and like a prayer starting

719
00:46:35,636 --> 00:46:40,276
Speaker 1: love and me and a thought of from my heaven

720
00:46:40,996 --> 00:46:47,716
Speaker 1: in her. But the morning when I I was here

721
00:46:47,876 --> 00:47:05,076
Speaker 1: and she was gone. Now hanging on so oh my God.

722
00:47:05,436 --> 00:47:25,716
Speaker 1: And so this is really what is it memory laying

723
00:47:25,796 --> 00:47:29,436
Speaker 1: for me Jesus. That's just that's the steal phonics and

724
00:47:29,476 --> 00:47:32,836
Speaker 1: the stylistics and all the people at that moment in

725
00:47:32,876 --> 00:47:37,716
Speaker 1: time that we're really influencing us. And so well, thank

726
00:47:37,756 --> 00:47:40,116
Speaker 1: you man, thank you. But you know, I heard that

727
00:47:40,196 --> 00:47:43,156
Speaker 1: Stevie Wonder likes that song the best, so that's a

728
00:47:43,236 --> 00:47:47,516
Speaker 1: huge compliment. Absolutely. That's also a different version of the

729
00:47:47,556 --> 00:47:50,996
Speaker 1: falsetto because usually I think of your falsetto as as

730
00:47:51,036 --> 00:47:56,396
Speaker 1: sort of a allowed it's essentially a rock falsetto. But

731
00:47:56,476 --> 00:48:02,196
Speaker 1: this was very tender ballad. Yeah. I mean I was

732
00:48:02,276 --> 00:48:05,476
Speaker 1: experimenting all over the place, so so you could we

733
00:48:05,556 --> 00:48:07,916
Speaker 1: could go from you should be dancing to love so right,

734
00:48:08,676 --> 00:48:11,676
Speaker 1: And they're all different, they're all different. Love so right

735
00:48:11,796 --> 00:48:14,716
Speaker 1: was our R and B passion. Did you ever get

736
00:48:14,756 --> 00:48:17,876
Speaker 1: to meet the people from t K Disco, because I

737
00:48:17,916 --> 00:48:21,076
Speaker 1: know you're in Florida in Miami and it's like, oh no, no,

738
00:48:21,116 --> 00:48:24,396
Speaker 1: I got to know Casey and the Sunshine Band and

739
00:48:24,476 --> 00:48:27,036
Speaker 1: we've been bumped into each other over the years, and

740
00:48:27,676 --> 00:48:30,796
Speaker 1: a really nice guy. And I love those records. And

741
00:48:30,916 --> 00:48:32,956
Speaker 1: they were party records, you know, they were made for

742
00:48:32,996 --> 00:48:37,116
Speaker 1: fun and great news astounding. The same with Nile Rogers,

743
00:48:37,156 --> 00:48:40,396
Speaker 1: I mean that was that was same era, you know,

744
00:48:40,556 --> 00:48:43,236
Speaker 1: and they just wanted to have They wanted to make

745
00:48:43,276 --> 00:48:46,676
Speaker 1: people downs, They wanted to make people. They wanted accuracy,

746
00:48:46,796 --> 00:48:49,156
Speaker 1: and so our mission became, how do we make the

747
00:48:49,196 --> 00:48:52,916
Speaker 1: drums exact? How do we get that accuracy and get

748
00:48:52,956 --> 00:48:55,236
Speaker 1: a groove? And that's how we came up with the

749
00:48:55,236 --> 00:48:58,596
Speaker 1: two track tape that was just a downbeat and a backbeat,

750
00:48:58,836 --> 00:49:01,196
Speaker 1: and it just repeated itself over and over again, and

751
00:49:01,236 --> 00:49:04,676
Speaker 1: we were able to vary the speed. So Woman in

752
00:49:04,756 --> 00:49:08,196
Speaker 1: Love more than a Woman Staying Alive is the same

753
00:49:08,236 --> 00:49:10,716
Speaker 1: based drum and back and what we would do is

754
00:49:10,756 --> 00:49:14,116
Speaker 1: we would just change the tempo and put the fills

755
00:49:14,156 --> 00:49:17,596
Speaker 1: in after the fact because that gave us accuracy. And

756
00:49:17,636 --> 00:49:20,436
Speaker 1: then the Roger Lyn drum machine came along. We never

757
00:49:20,436 --> 00:49:23,196
Speaker 1: thought that was as good, Yeah, but I know we've

758
00:49:23,316 --> 00:49:25,796
Speaker 1: used it a couple of times, But I'm overall that

759
00:49:26,196 --> 00:49:29,596
Speaker 1: I really love people playing. I love to hear people playing.

760
00:49:29,676 --> 00:49:32,876
Speaker 1: Now I'm not interested in programming at all. Interesting though,

761
00:49:32,876 --> 00:49:35,356
Speaker 1: that that was really before there was such a thing

762
00:49:35,356 --> 00:49:39,516
Speaker 1: as sampling. You guys were doing it well before. It's experimenting.

763
00:49:39,836 --> 00:49:43,436
Speaker 1: And once we realized that making a record that was

764
00:49:43,516 --> 00:49:47,956
Speaker 1: fun or fun to dance too, or just fun in itself,

765
00:49:49,196 --> 00:49:52,316
Speaker 1: we needed to create a way to have accurate drums

766
00:49:52,996 --> 00:49:55,396
Speaker 1: or a drum groove. And Dennis always did a fantastic

767
00:49:55,476 --> 00:49:57,596
Speaker 1: job of doing the turns on top of that. But

768
00:49:57,796 --> 00:50:00,036
Speaker 1: that's that was our basis of it. Do you remember

769
00:50:00,036 --> 00:50:02,676
Speaker 1: the first time you saw Saturdayight Fever with all the

770
00:50:02,756 --> 00:50:06,516
Speaker 1: music in it? Yeah, at the Chinese Theater standing at

771
00:50:06,516 --> 00:50:09,156
Speaker 1: the back of the audience with John Travolta and and

772
00:50:10,156 --> 00:50:12,276
Speaker 1: if I remember it well, I remember the two of

773
00:50:12,356 --> 00:50:14,956
Speaker 1: us not really enjoying the fact that you could hear people.

774
00:50:15,556 --> 00:50:19,556
Speaker 1: You could hear the people's feet dancing louder than the music. Wow.

775
00:50:19,596 --> 00:50:22,476
Speaker 1: And so we went up to Stiggy and said, you know,

776
00:50:23,076 --> 00:50:26,196
Speaker 1: the music should be the loudest thing you hear. You

777
00:50:26,276 --> 00:50:29,636
Speaker 1: never hear people dancing in the club. The music's always

778
00:50:29,636 --> 00:50:33,196
Speaker 1: the dominant factor. You know, turn up the music and

779
00:50:33,276 --> 00:50:37,076
Speaker 1: turn down the feet. So that's what they did great,

780
00:50:37,276 --> 00:50:39,316
Speaker 1: and I think that was something that John and I

781
00:50:39,356 --> 00:50:42,796
Speaker 1: both felt really strongly about. You can't you can't dance

782
00:50:42,836 --> 00:50:45,396
Speaker 1: to something you can hardly hear. What was the audience

783
00:50:45,476 --> 00:50:48,836
Speaker 1: reaction to that first screening? As far as I could tell,

784
00:50:49,156 --> 00:50:52,556
Speaker 1: you know, they all loved it. John and I loved it,

785
00:50:52,596 --> 00:50:54,996
Speaker 1: and that was our only critique, if you like. And

786
00:50:55,756 --> 00:50:58,796
Speaker 1: that led to things like Greece and you know, so

787
00:50:58,916 --> 00:51:03,796
Speaker 1: between between seventy five and maybe eighty one, starting with

788
00:51:04,036 --> 00:51:07,476
Speaker 1: maybe main Course and ending with Grease or Emotion and

789
00:51:07,596 --> 00:51:09,956
Speaker 1: things like that. So it was just one record after another,

790
00:51:10,116 --> 00:51:12,676
Speaker 1: and we became a little tainted because everything we were

791
00:51:12,676 --> 00:51:16,676
Speaker 1: doing was going to number one and we just couldn't focus.

792
00:51:16,716 --> 00:51:19,476
Speaker 1: And these records as well, you know, we were dealing

793
00:51:19,516 --> 00:51:21,276
Speaker 1: with that as well at the same time. So they

794
00:51:21,316 --> 00:51:24,916
Speaker 1: were incredible records as well. Incredible, yeah, but you know,

795
00:51:25,036 --> 00:51:27,956
Speaker 1: we were also pretty dazed. And so about six years

796
00:51:27,956 --> 00:51:32,316
Speaker 1: in we were having this incredible success, but we were

797
00:51:32,316 --> 00:51:35,476
Speaker 1: getting dazed. We were getting dazed and confused and I'll

798
00:51:35,516 --> 00:51:37,356
Speaker 1: be wanted to I want to want to salute I'll

799
00:51:37,636 --> 00:51:40,876
Speaker 1: I'll be a Carl because they were fantastic co producers.

800
00:51:40,876 --> 00:51:43,796
Speaker 1: In my opinion, we was a team, but that wore

801
00:51:43,836 --> 00:51:46,916
Speaker 1: itself out too. So Carl wanted to didn't want to

802
00:51:46,956 --> 00:51:49,036
Speaker 1: have to travel the studio every day and wanted to

803
00:51:49,076 --> 00:51:51,716
Speaker 1: have a happy life with Candy, and i'll be wanted

804
00:51:51,756 --> 00:51:55,116
Speaker 1: to go to California because he loved windsurfing, and they

805
00:51:55,156 --> 00:51:58,276
Speaker 1: had their own personal things in life that were becoming

806
00:51:58,316 --> 00:52:01,196
Speaker 1: more interesting for them. And that's just how it worked out.

807
00:52:01,396 --> 00:52:04,356
Speaker 1: You know. It was a six year span of incredible

808
00:52:04,396 --> 00:52:08,036
Speaker 1: records in my opinion, but everything has an ending to it.

809
00:52:08,116 --> 00:52:11,756
Speaker 1: By the way, congratulates it's on the documentary, which is spectacular. Well,

810
00:52:11,836 --> 00:52:14,276
Speaker 1: thank you. Yeah, you know, I've never heard a negative

811
00:52:14,276 --> 00:52:16,516
Speaker 1: word about it, except from one person, and I won't

812
00:52:16,516 --> 00:52:19,476
Speaker 1: even mention his name. Yeah, it's I think it's magnificent.

813
00:52:20,076 --> 00:52:24,716
Speaker 1: It's interesting to see that that period is following a

814
00:52:24,916 --> 00:52:29,156
Speaker 1: real fall. Oh absolutely, the rise and fall and rise

815
00:52:29,396 --> 00:52:33,956
Speaker 1: are shocking. Absolutely, And it also what it negated for you,

816
00:52:34,036 --> 00:52:36,916
Speaker 1: It was it negated the idea of having an ego,

817
00:52:37,676 --> 00:52:40,596
Speaker 1: because every time you had success, your head would blow

818
00:52:40,676 --> 00:52:43,516
Speaker 1: up and then something bad would happen and you just

819
00:52:43,556 --> 00:52:46,636
Speaker 1: came down to earth again. You know, so everything I do,

820
00:52:46,996 --> 00:52:49,796
Speaker 1: I often say to my son Steepe, I'm just waiting

821
00:52:49,796 --> 00:52:52,036
Speaker 1: to get dropped on my head again, you know, because

822
00:52:52,876 --> 00:52:55,676
Speaker 1: because that's the nature of what we do know and

823
00:52:55,796 --> 00:52:59,516
Speaker 1: something really works or something really doesn't. And that time

824
00:52:59,556 --> 00:53:03,036
Speaker 1: period what everyone calls the backlash. I don't like the word,

825
00:53:03,036 --> 00:53:06,836
Speaker 1: but there you go. You know, once again, I really

826
00:53:06,876 --> 00:53:09,476
Speaker 1: believe more than anything else that we were over posed.

827
00:53:10,276 --> 00:53:13,476
Speaker 1: And I've seen it with other artists. Yes, I've seen

828
00:53:13,476 --> 00:53:16,196
Speaker 1: it with Michael, and I got to know Michael pretty well,

829
00:53:16,556 --> 00:53:19,876
Speaker 1: but he began to become dazed. He became dazed by

830
00:53:19,876 --> 00:53:22,876
Speaker 1: all of it. And you can have too much success,

831
00:53:23,036 --> 00:53:26,116
Speaker 1: you know, it affects your head. Yeah, well, it's like

832
00:53:26,156 --> 00:53:31,556
Speaker 1: a lack of reality because, yeah, it's so unnatural. Yeah well,

833
00:53:31,596 --> 00:53:33,276
Speaker 1: you know, you're throwing the dice every time you go

834
00:53:33,316 --> 00:53:36,036
Speaker 1: in the studio and you don't know what's going to happen.

835
00:53:36,396 --> 00:53:38,316
Speaker 1: But you know, I think about Elvis, and I think

836
00:53:38,316 --> 00:53:41,836
Speaker 1: about the Beatles, and I think about that period, that

837
00:53:42,116 --> 00:53:46,076
Speaker 1: end period where things just fragmented, you know, for any

838
00:53:46,156 --> 00:53:50,796
Speaker 1: kind of reason, and the choosing a material also became

839
00:53:50,836 --> 00:53:54,996
Speaker 1: an element where the artist wasn't choosing, wasn't doing the

840
00:53:55,076 --> 00:53:57,476
Speaker 1: right songs anymore. They were just trying to do something

841
00:53:57,876 --> 00:54:00,836
Speaker 1: that wasn't quite working the same way. And I think

842
00:54:00,876 --> 00:54:02,716
Speaker 1: that that's what happened to Michael, and I think that's

843
00:54:02,756 --> 00:54:06,396
Speaker 1: what happened to Elvis, and I think that's probably what

844
00:54:06,436 --> 00:54:09,716
Speaker 1: happened does and we had to come back around and

845
00:54:10,556 --> 00:54:13,636
Speaker 1: kick ourselves in the backside and get back in the

846
00:54:13,676 --> 00:54:17,236
Speaker 1: studio and do something, do something exciting again. You know,

847
00:54:17,756 --> 00:54:20,436
Speaker 1: have you ever been surprised in either direction with either

848
00:54:20,476 --> 00:54:22,556
Speaker 1: a song that you thought, this is the best song

849
00:54:22,556 --> 00:54:25,836
Speaker 1: we've ever wrote it and it doesn't work, or a

850
00:54:25,836 --> 00:54:29,476
Speaker 1: song that you don't think much about that really takes off. Oh,

851
00:54:29,756 --> 00:54:33,996
Speaker 1: my favorite song is Immortality that Selene did So I

852
00:54:34,356 --> 00:54:36,716
Speaker 1: can't I can't critique that because the fact that she

853
00:54:36,836 --> 00:54:39,956
Speaker 1: recorded it was an enormous compliment. You know. So, but

854
00:54:39,996 --> 00:54:43,276
Speaker 1: that's my favorite song because it reflects how we feel

855
00:54:43,316 --> 00:54:46,276
Speaker 1: about our lives no matter what. So this is who

856
00:54:46,276 --> 00:54:49,236
Speaker 1: I am, This is all I know. You know, that's

857
00:54:49,276 --> 00:54:52,596
Speaker 1: my favorite. A lyric, Wow, the whole song is my favorite.

858
00:54:53,156 --> 00:54:56,716
Speaker 1: It's a it's a it's coming to a conclusion about yourself. Beautiful.

859
00:54:57,316 --> 00:54:59,436
Speaker 1: So let's talk about the new album. How did it

860
00:54:59,476 --> 00:55:03,916
Speaker 1: come about. Well, it's a it's a fantasy that that's

861
00:55:03,956 --> 00:55:06,596
Speaker 1: gone on for a couple of years for me, not

862
00:55:06,636 --> 00:55:08,796
Speaker 1: knowing about a pandemic. You know that it was which

863
00:55:08,796 --> 00:55:11,996
Speaker 1: I found us. And then one day my eldest son,

864
00:55:12,076 --> 00:55:15,796
Speaker 1: Stephen came to me and played me a Chris Stapleton

865
00:55:15,876 --> 00:55:19,196
Speaker 1: song and I went, oh, Jesus Christ, you know that's

866
00:55:19,676 --> 00:55:23,076
Speaker 1: that's people actually playing and people someone actually singing, you know,

867
00:55:23,996 --> 00:55:26,716
Speaker 1: So that became our dream. He made a point of

868
00:55:26,756 --> 00:55:30,796
Speaker 1: going to Nashville meeting with different people. Jay Landers came

869
00:55:30,836 --> 00:55:34,116
Speaker 1: on board and helped us put there, put the artists together,

870
00:55:35,036 --> 00:55:39,996
Speaker 1: and everyone nobody said no, a couple of people, Chris

871
00:55:40,116 --> 00:55:45,196
Speaker 1: being one of them. He was the inspiration. So he's

872
00:55:45,276 --> 00:55:48,476
Speaker 1: like involved in spirit, Yes he is, and there's no

873
00:55:48,556 --> 00:55:52,236
Speaker 1: question about that. But you know, from Brandy Carlyle, Tolivan Newton,

874
00:55:52,316 --> 00:55:58,476
Speaker 1: John to Jason Isabel j. Buchanan, beautiful, all of these

875
00:55:58,516 --> 00:56:01,956
Speaker 1: amazing artists and Gillian Welch and Dave Rowling has come

876
00:56:01,996 --> 00:56:04,996
Speaker 1: on and they didn't want to do a well known song,

877
00:56:05,836 --> 00:56:08,276
Speaker 1: so they chose Butterfly, which was something we wrote in

878
00:56:08,436 --> 00:56:13,396
Speaker 1: ninety sixties. So this album was recorded all live in

879
00:56:13,436 --> 00:56:17,316
Speaker 1: the studio, yeah, probably most like the very first recordings

880
00:56:17,316 --> 00:56:21,236
Speaker 1: you ever made. Yep. Yeah, it was totally live and

881
00:56:22,236 --> 00:56:24,796
Speaker 1: there was no multi tracking. But it really this whole

882
00:56:24,836 --> 00:56:27,036
Speaker 1: album made me fall back in love. Not that I

883
00:56:27,076 --> 00:56:28,756
Speaker 1: was ever out of love, but I fell back into

884
00:56:28,756 --> 00:56:32,596
Speaker 1: the idea that people just play you know beautiful. I'm

885
00:56:32,636 --> 00:56:34,876
Speaker 1: so glad you get to have this experience now was

886
00:56:34,916 --> 00:56:38,916
Speaker 1: it Was there ever a choice to write new songs

887
00:56:38,956 --> 00:56:41,996
Speaker 1: for it, as opposed to using classic songs. There was

888
00:56:42,036 --> 00:56:44,756
Speaker 1: only the idea of doing words of a Fool adjacent.

889
00:56:45,836 --> 00:56:48,236
Speaker 1: I played that to Dave and he listened to maybe

890
00:56:48,276 --> 00:56:51,756
Speaker 1: six bars and he said, let's cut that great. Okay,

891
00:56:52,076 --> 00:56:53,516
Speaker 1: don't you want to hear the song? You know? He

892
00:56:53,556 --> 00:56:55,316
Speaker 1: said no, no, he said, I love I love where

893
00:56:55,316 --> 00:56:57,276
Speaker 1: it is, I love what you're doing. Let's do it.

894
00:56:57,396 --> 00:57:00,716
Speaker 1: And those two songs that that one on Butterfly were

895
00:57:00,756 --> 00:57:03,436
Speaker 1: the only songs that I didn't think anyone had ever heard.

896
00:57:04,116 --> 00:57:06,196
Speaker 1: And that was the that was the target for me,

897
00:57:06,676 --> 00:57:08,396
Speaker 1: is to feature a couple of songs that were really

898
00:57:08,396 --> 00:57:11,356
Speaker 1: abstract and very well known. And if we ever do

899
00:57:11,396 --> 00:57:15,516
Speaker 1: another one, you know, maybe maybe it'll be time. And

900
00:57:15,556 --> 00:57:17,516
Speaker 1: I would love to write with Jason, and I would

901
00:57:17,516 --> 00:57:21,116
Speaker 1: love to write with Jay because their voices are just amazing,

902
00:57:21,676 --> 00:57:24,076
Speaker 1: and singing with Gillian and Dave is sort of like

903
00:57:24,116 --> 00:57:26,716
Speaker 1: singing with my brothers. I would love to hear that album.

904
00:57:26,756 --> 00:57:29,356
Speaker 1: I would love the next album to be all original

905
00:57:29,396 --> 00:57:32,716
Speaker 1: material written by you and the collaborators. That would be

906
00:57:33,076 --> 00:57:35,076
Speaker 1: That would be a beautiful thing to put in the world.

907
00:57:35,436 --> 00:57:37,636
Speaker 1: I think that's the only way to go. I agree

908
00:57:37,676 --> 00:57:39,076
Speaker 1: with you. I don't think we should try to do

909
00:57:39,276 --> 00:57:42,156
Speaker 1: the same thing again in any way. Yeah, great idea,

910
00:57:42,356 --> 00:57:44,916
Speaker 1: I'll do that. We want to hear it. We want

911
00:57:44,956 --> 00:57:47,916
Speaker 1: to hear it's by popular demand. That's why you know

912
00:57:47,996 --> 00:57:51,236
Speaker 1: who you are. You know that's a great idea, and

913
00:57:51,276 --> 00:57:53,836
Speaker 1: that's what we should do. Well, it's a pleasure seeing

914
00:57:53,876 --> 00:57:56,916
Speaker 1: you again, Yes, sir, you want You wanted Robin and

915
00:57:56,996 --> 00:57:59,196
Speaker 1: I to make an album, but I knew that Robin

916
00:57:59,356 --> 00:58:02,356
Speaker 1: wasn't well. But I couldn't say that to you. I understood,

917
00:58:02,436 --> 00:58:04,436
Speaker 1: you know, but I knew. I felt like I just

918
00:58:04,476 --> 00:58:07,476
Speaker 1: felt like there was potential for something that there was

919
00:58:07,756 --> 00:58:10,396
Speaker 1: I don't know. Again, I wanted to hear it. I wanted, Yeah,

920
00:58:10,516 --> 00:58:12,276
Speaker 1: I know I did too, but he was just too

921
00:58:12,316 --> 00:58:14,756
Speaker 1: sick and he would never admit to that you know, yeah,

922
00:58:15,276 --> 00:58:17,476
Speaker 1: and so you know, we never really knew there was

923
00:58:17,476 --> 00:58:19,636
Speaker 1: anything wrong. We were up until about six months before

924
00:58:19,636 --> 00:58:22,396
Speaker 1: you passed. So that's just the way it was. Some

925
00:58:22,436 --> 00:58:24,596
Speaker 1: people don't want to be ill, they don't want to

926
00:58:24,676 --> 00:58:27,356
Speaker 1: they don't want to tell anybody the earl. Yes, so

927
00:58:27,516 --> 00:58:29,596
Speaker 1: you get to it. You get those two things. But

928
00:58:29,676 --> 00:58:32,836
Speaker 1: that's what happened, beautiful. Well, it's great seeing you and

929
00:58:32,956 --> 00:58:34,676
Speaker 1: I hope to see you in person and can give

930
00:58:34,716 --> 00:58:36,236
Speaker 1: you a hug as soon as we're allowed to do that.

931
00:58:36,556 --> 00:58:39,116
Speaker 1: You too. I love you, my friend. I see you soon.

932
00:58:42,316 --> 00:58:44,476
Speaker 1: Thanks to Barry Gibbs for sharing so much of his

933
00:58:44,596 --> 00:58:48,116
Speaker 1: incredible story with Rick. To hear a playlist of Barry

934
00:58:48,116 --> 00:58:51,636
Speaker 1: gibbs favorite Australian songs from growing up head to Broken

935
00:58:51,676 --> 00:58:54,716
Speaker 1: Record podcast dot com. We also find a playlist we

936
00:58:54,836 --> 00:58:58,036
Speaker 1: put together of our favorite BG's cuts. Be sure to

937
00:58:58,076 --> 00:59:00,956
Speaker 1: subscribe to our YouTube channel at YouTube dot com slash

938
00:59:01,076 --> 00:59:03,996
Speaker 1: Broken Record Podcast, where you can find extended cuts of

939
00:59:04,076 --> 00:59:07,036
Speaker 1: new and old episodes. You can follow us on Twitter

940
00:59:07,116 --> 00:59:10,756
Speaker 1: at broken Record. Broken Record is producers help from Leah Rose,

941
00:59:11,036 --> 00:59:16,076
Speaker 1: Jason Gambrell, Martin Gonzalez, Eric Sandler, and Jennifer Sanchez with

942
00:59:16,236 --> 00:59:19,956
Speaker 1: engineering help from Nick Chaffee. Our executive producer is Maylam.

943
00:59:20,796 --> 00:59:23,396
Speaker 1: Broken Record is a production of Pushkin Industries and if

944
00:59:23,396 --> 00:59:25,556
Speaker 1: you like the show, please remember to share, rate, and

945
00:59:25,596 --> 00:59:28,916
Speaker 1: review us on your podcast app Our theme music's by

946
00:59:28,956 --> 00:59:31,316
Speaker 1: Kenny Beats. I'm justin Richmond face