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Speaker 1: Welcome to The Away and the only soccer podcast that

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Speaker 1: regularly named checks Albert Camu and Tony Morrison. I'm Danielle Alarcon.

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Speaker 2: I'm John Green. Today we're doing something a little different,

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Speaker 2: something we haven't done before on this young podcast. We

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Speaker 2: have guests, not one guest, but two actual guests, a pair,

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Speaker 2: a duo. Also, if you're on YouTube, you might be

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Speaker 2: wondering where I am. I'm coming to you from a

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Speaker 2: bay in Jamaica. Are are you there doing research for

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Speaker 2: The Away and the Yeah? Yeah, oh it's work trip.

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Speaker 2: Thanks for asking one hundred percent of work trip. Both

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Speaker 2: research for my new novel which is set partly here,

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Speaker 2: no joke, and also uh yeah, I mean the Jamaica

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Speaker 2: national team, Daniel is it's all that anybody can talk

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Speaker 2: about here?

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Speaker 1: Still in the mix?

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Speaker 2: Are they going to make the World Cup? Are they not?

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Speaker 1: Yeah?

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Speaker 2: In the got to beat New Caledonia, but let's get

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Speaker 2: to our guests.

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Speaker 1: Got to find the New Caledonia first, and then played.

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Speaker 2: That I would beat them. I was stunned on my

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Speaker 2: research to learn that New Caledonia is in Oceania. I

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Speaker 2: mean I would have bet my life on New Caledonia

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Speaker 2: being off the coast of Spain.

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Speaker 1: Okay, Miguel and Alex, welcome to the Way End. You're

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Speaker 1: officially our first ever guests and we're super happy you

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Speaker 1: could join us. You are, Miguel, I know you. We

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Speaker 1: played soccer together. Miguel is an excellent player. Alex lovely

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Speaker 1: to meet you man. So you both are here because

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Speaker 1: you're starting this really crazy project. And I say crazy

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Speaker 1: because it's the print magazine in twenty twenty six and

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Speaker 1: it's called Golden Goal, And so I wonder if you

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Speaker 1: could just start by telling us sort of the idea

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Speaker 1: behind this beautiful project.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, thank you guys for having us on. We love

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Speaker 3: the pod. Very excited to be here. Yeah, Golden Goals

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Speaker 3: a magazine. Really, it's a magazine that we want to

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Speaker 3: kind of capture the World Cup feel like the World Cup.

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Speaker 3: We wanted to be fun, exciting, We wanted to cover

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Speaker 3: countries from all over the world. We have writers from

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Speaker 3: almost every continent besides Antarctica, and really we want it

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Speaker 3: to feel like what it feels like to be watching

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Speaker 3: the World Cup with people from around the world and

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Speaker 3: with commentary from around the world. But also we want

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Speaker 3: to we wanted to make something that feels like it

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Speaker 3: addressed the moment up it and to feel like a

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Speaker 3: serious publication but also something you want to hold in

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Speaker 3: your hands, something beautiful. It's for new fans to find

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Speaker 3: and team they want to support, but also seasoned supporters

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Speaker 3: who just want to hold something beautiful and read good

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Speaker 3: writing about soccer. So it is a bit ambitious, but

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Speaker 3: we are really excited to work on it.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 5: I've noticed something in recent World Cups, in particular, especially

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Speaker 5: the recently politically fraught World Cups, that there's a kind

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Speaker 5: of like a myopic intensity that defines them. That in

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Speaker 5: the lead up there's this sort of like manic fixation

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Speaker 5: on everything that's wrong and messed up with those tournaments,

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Speaker 5: and then once they start, that intensity just turns on

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Speaker 5: a dime and is focused on the games themselves. And

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Speaker 5: I think what you lose in a lot of that

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Speaker 5: process is a sense of perspective. And I think that

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Speaker 5: people get cynical and jaded and worn out or you

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Speaker 5: just can't deal with any of it, but you also

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Speaker 5: forget about the beauty of the World Cup itself. And

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Speaker 5: I feel slightly insane making this comparison, but I think

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Speaker 5: this is the podcast to do it, but I have

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Speaker 5: started to talk about the World Cup the way that

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Speaker 5: Quinn Coompson talks about the South and the end of

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Speaker 5: Absolum Absolum when he says, no, I don't hate this out.

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Speaker 2: I don't don't I don't hate the World cuss And

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Speaker 2: I think, you know, I mean, that is a very

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Speaker 2: personally moving and meaningful part of that book for me.

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Speaker 5: But it is sort of how I feel about it

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Speaker 5: that I'm like when I talk to people, especially people

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Speaker 5: who say, oh, I don't watch the World Cup anymore,

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Speaker 5: you know, I say, well, I don't hate the World Cup,

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Speaker 5: you know, but I kind.

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Speaker 4: Of want to figure out why. And this magazine is

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Speaker 4: about that.

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Speaker 1: It's so beautiful. There's a I know, Dan Friedman, a

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Speaker 1: writer also British guy, plays soccer with him on the

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Speaker 1: Brow West Side a bunch, and and he didn't watch

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Speaker 1: the last World Cup, and I just I admire him.

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Speaker 1: I admire that sort of like the kind of political

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Speaker 1: consistency of like, no, I can't be part of this.

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Speaker 1: And also I just know that I'm not able to

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Speaker 1: deny myself the pleasure, you know, because joy, yeah, exactly, yeah,

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Speaker 1: even though it's a corrupt form of joy. Because FIFA

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Speaker 1: is what it is and the world is what it is.

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Speaker 1: But you know, and maybe that's just like the sort

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Speaker 1: of like the compromise one makes with oneself, you know.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, coming to you from the edge of

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Speaker 2: Orkabasa Bay, I can tell you that a lot of

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Speaker 2: forms of joy are pretty corrupt.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure, for sure, Miguel and Alice, you want

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Speaker 1: to talk about like some of the stories, the kinds

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Speaker 1: of stories you guys are going to feature in the magazine.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, happy to do that. We have some we have

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Speaker 3: really cool writers. We have a big anchor piece we're

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Speaker 3: doing is eleven writers on eleven players. Some of the

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Speaker 3: names for that include Juasu, murvem Ray and novelists like

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Speaker 3: Gabriela Aleman in the Brazilian Ecuadorian writer. And we are

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Speaker 3: also having dispatches from different parts of the world from

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Speaker 3: writers from all over the world from writing it was Beka,

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Speaker 3: stan to Iran to Ecuador. But yeah, so we have

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Speaker 3: a lot of pieces coming in from all over. But

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Speaker 3: we also have some essays on what makes the World

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Speaker 3: Cup so special, including the Panini album. I don't know

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Speaker 3: if you guys ever put together one of the Panini

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Speaker 3: albums with the stickers. Yeah, that's for me, like I

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Speaker 3: growing up. I think I only did actually did one

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Speaker 3: as a kid in two thousand and six, but that

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Speaker 3: was it was like a super special part of the

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Speaker 3: World Cup for me. The whole experience and and so

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Speaker 3: the history of that Panini album and also kind of

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Speaker 3: just how it resonates with different people in different parts

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Speaker 3: of the world. That's one of our essays. Alex can

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Speaker 3: speak a little more on some of the other stuff

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Speaker 3: we have we have planned.

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Speaker 1: I just want to say parenthetically before you jump in, Alex,

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Speaker 1: like here in Bogota, like there's a really like intense

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Speaker 1: Panini sticker trading scene and there's like spots all over

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Speaker 1: town where people like in the plazas once you know

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Speaker 1: what my kid is like desperately waiting to like, you know,

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Speaker 1: he doesn't care about soccer, but he cares about the Panini,

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Speaker 1: you know, And they're gonna be like mobs of people

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Speaker 1: in different plazas around town like trading Panini's right right

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Speaker 1: up through the end of the World Cup.

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Speaker 2: And we should define what a Panini is for those

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Speaker 2: who don't know, it's these stickers of players, right that

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Speaker 2: that you build a sticker album.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, and it's kind of like, uh, like I

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Speaker 1: guess the soccer coolent of like trading baseball cards, except

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Speaker 1: usually stick them on and put them in the in

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Speaker 1: the in the album and they'll hold The goal, uh

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Speaker 1: is obviously to get as much money out of you

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Speaker 1: as possible, but also to fill the album and then

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Speaker 1: and then your extra as you trade with friends and

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Speaker 1: see what you can get. It's it's really, you know, fun.

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Speaker 4: I love it, Danielle.

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Speaker 3: I don't know if this was your experience in putting

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Speaker 3: together the sticker albums, but I feel like from what

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Speaker 3: I've heard from family and from what I experienced in six,

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Speaker 3: it was always difficult to find they. There would always

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Speaker 3: be one team, one country that was for some reason

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Speaker 3: the stickers were scarce impacts and you could barely find them.

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Speaker 3: And then six that team happened to be Italy, which

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Speaker 3: won the World Cup. And I'd heard that in O

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Speaker 3: two the team whose stickers were very scarce was Brazil.

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Speaker 3: So I don't know if this was your experience with

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Speaker 3: the Pennie album, but it is a theory that has

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Speaker 3: been floating in the Internet that Patini has denied. But

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Speaker 3: I think we're going to try to get to the

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Speaker 3: bottom of it. I don't know if we will, but yeah,

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Speaker 3: so getting a piece of.

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Speaker 1: That, See, that's the kind of harding reporting I can

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Speaker 1: get behind.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, Alex Oh, yeah, I mean I was just in

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Speaker 5: the last twelve hours, I think I've edited pieces on

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Speaker 5: Italian masculinity and the national team from two thousand and

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Speaker 5: six to the president. I edited one piece about the

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Speaker 5: rise of Fabrizzio Romano and what it says about the

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Speaker 5: change in soccer journalism and the sort of rise of

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Speaker 5: influencer culture.

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Speaker 4: Within that and many other things.

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Speaker 5: I'm excited about the title of that, or the working

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Speaker 5: title I should say that right now, which is you know,

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Speaker 5: from Aguero to Here we Go, which I think.

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Speaker 4: I captures a lot about that.

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Speaker 5: But one of the things I really liked about this

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Speaker 5: project is that Miguel and I will just like text

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Speaker 5: each other and we'll just be like, we need, you know,

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Speaker 5: who's an Iraqi novelist that we know that we can

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Speaker 5: pull into this, right, Who's someone in Haiti, Right, who's

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Speaker 5: someone in Uzbekistan that we can get? And I think

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Speaker 5: so much of this project for me has been about

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Speaker 5: challenging my own assumptions. I'm a political editor at the

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Speaker 5: liberal magazine The New Republic, and most of the soccer

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Speaker 5: writing I do is kind of myopically fixated on Giohnny

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Speaker 5: and Fentino and corruption and all these other questions. And

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Speaker 5: I think that's only a part of the way that

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Speaker 5: I see soccer, and that is only a minuscule part

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Speaker 5: of how.

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Speaker 4: The rest of the world sees soccer.

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Speaker 5: So I think that the way that the thing that

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Speaker 5: really excites you about this project is just getting to

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Speaker 5: interact with people that experience it completely differently, and again,

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Speaker 5: especially as an American, you know in New York City

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Speaker 5: for this World Cup, who are excited about it, I think,

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Speaker 5: and not ambivalent or something else. And I think that,

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Speaker 5: you know, colliding all those different perspectives into a physical

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Speaker 5: package is just like, it's really cool.

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Speaker 2: What are you going to be watching for at the

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Speaker 2: World Cup this year? I mean, what are the what

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Speaker 2: are the storylines you're looking to follow?

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Speaker 3: I mean, I think we're going to be focused, like

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Speaker 3: everyone else, on the actual soccer for sure. One thing

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Speaker 3: I mean we noticed from the Club World Cup, which

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Speaker 3: felt like a staging ground for this World Cup, was

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Speaker 3: early on just the expense of the ticket pricing I mean,

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Speaker 3: Trump's going to be all over this, we'd assume. I

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Speaker 3: don't know if you guys saw the celebrations when Chelsea

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Speaker 3: won the Club World Cup last year, but he was

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Speaker 3: front and center there and so I think we'll see

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Speaker 3: a lot of him at this World Cup. But more

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Speaker 3: than that, I think what interests me in particular is

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Speaker 3: seeing how the immigration situation plays out, who is going

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Speaker 3: to be able to attend the World Cup, what the

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Speaker 3: atmosphere is going to be.

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Speaker 5: Like.

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Speaker 3: There's been a lot of.

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Speaker 4: Just debate and.

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Speaker 3: Like local kind of like disagreement over funding, how the

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Speaker 3: fan fests will be funded, how whether it's the security situation,

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Speaker 3: who's putting the bill essentially for the World Cup for

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Speaker 3: hosting it here in the US, And I think that's

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Speaker 3: going to be an ongoing question that, you know, I

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Speaker 3: don't know how it will play out in a few months,

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Speaker 3: but it's something that we're definitely going to keep our

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Speaker 3: eyes out for, along with what's going on in the

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Speaker 3: field and what's happening kind of around around it politically.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean not to I guess sound like a

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Speaker 5: philosine after that, But one of the things that interests

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Speaker 5: me is in the last few years, especially as soccer

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Speaker 5: has gotten more and more tactical. I've sort of been

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Speaker 5: drawn to international soccer and it's comparative simplicity. But I

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Speaker 5: am curious to see if the sort of set piecification

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Speaker 5: or the rise of the meat Wall, as my friends

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Speaker 5: at the Double Pivot podcast call it, will, will sort

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Speaker 5: of be drawn into that. I am, obviously, both for

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Speaker 5: professional and personal reasons, interested in the ways that the

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Speaker 5: President inserts himself into this World Cup. But I think also,

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Speaker 5: and I just wrote about this for our newsletter, I'm

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Speaker 5: interested in the ways that the World Cup reveals surprising

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Speaker 5: things about the world to us. I think that we

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Speaker 5: can predict that, you know, it will reveal a lot

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Speaker 5: of disturbing and troubling things about the way that this

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Speaker 5: country is run right now. But for the newsletter I

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Speaker 5: just wrote, I wrote about the US Iran game nineteen

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Speaker 5: ninety eight World Cup, which Iran won. It's one of

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Speaker 5: the bigger upsets and recent World Cup history. But you know,

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Speaker 5: in that game, the team was booed by dissident Iranians

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Speaker 5: Iranian expats in France the entire time they won, you know,

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Speaker 5: and they wept with joy as they were being sort

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Speaker 5: of mercilessly mocked and jeered the entire time. And I

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Speaker 5: think that, you know, for all of the rightful focus

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Speaker 5: on the you know, the increasing corruption and greed surrounding

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Speaker 5: the World Cup, it still has the capacity to reveal

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Speaker 5: unexpected and I think, complicated things about the world around

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Speaker 5: us that nothing else and sports and maybe culture at

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Speaker 5: large does.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, there was this passage in your in the editor's

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Speaker 1: note I really like I'm going to read here. It

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Speaker 1: says FIFA and Donald Trump can only alter the World

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Speaker 1: Cup so much because they only own part of it.

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Speaker 1: The rest of it belongs to everyone else. The players,

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Speaker 1: of course, but the fans too. There's miraculously still the

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Speaker 1: possibility of magic, of transcendence, of floating above the inevitable

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Speaker 1: scandals and abuses. No other sporting cultural event is as

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Speaker 1: laden with as much meaning or baggage. I love that.

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Speaker 1: I think that what I like about the project so

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Speaker 1: much is is not shying away from all the complicated stuff,

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Speaker 1: but also not letting the complicated stuff deprive one self

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Speaker 1: of access to the joy that the game itself can bring.

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Speaker 1: I wanted to ask you guys kind of a corollary

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Speaker 1: John's question, which is what you definitely not want to

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Speaker 1: happen at the World Cup. And this could be like

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Speaker 1: like I definitely don't want, like you know, France to win,

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Speaker 1: or it could be like I definitely don't want Christian

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Speaker 1: Policicis to get injured, like whatever.

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Speaker 3: You know, I definitely want Columbia to do well and

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Speaker 3: I want all of our players to stay fit before

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Speaker 3: I don't want any injuries. I'm still scarred from the

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Speaker 3: Falcao injury in twenty fourteen that I think would have

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Speaker 3: like I think he would have really helped us against

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Speaker 3: Brazil when we left to Brazil to one. I would

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Speaker 3: like for Argentina not to win. I think they have

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Speaker 3: enough World Cups. They won the last one. But yeah,

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Speaker 3: I think, I guess. I think it's hard to be hopeful.

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Speaker 3: It's hard to feel hopeful given the political situation sometimes

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Speaker 3: about the World Cup. But I just hope it can

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Speaker 3: be like a fun celebration. I mean, I'm going to

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Speaker 3: be here in New York, and I really hope to

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Speaker 3: like feel like I'm a part of the tournament, even

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Speaker 3: just walking around the city. I hope to be able

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Speaker 3: to speak with fans and and just like enjoy the tournament.

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Speaker 3: And I feel like that feels under threat because of funding,

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Speaker 3: because of the funding issues, the fan fests that are

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Speaker 3: being kind of broken up, and because of the political situation.

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Speaker 3: But I still feel like it's possible and really hope

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Speaker 3: feel hopeful for it.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 5: I mean, Miguel and I actually became friends during the

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Speaker 5: twenty eighteen World Cup, I think, but we were working

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Speaker 5: together at the New Republic and he had started fairly recently,

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Speaker 5: and we just kind of locked ourselves in a room

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Speaker 5: at work for a month and to the you know,

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Speaker 5: consternation and irritation of some of our colleagues, just yelled

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Speaker 5: for six hours a day while we were supposed to

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Speaker 5: be working. And I think, you know, what I'm hoping

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Speaker 5: for is to have interactions like that, right And I

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Speaker 5: think one of the things that is alarming about this

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Speaker 5: World Cup is that it's been hard to get to

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Speaker 5: the last couple and I think this should be one

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Speaker 5: that welcomes the rest of the world, and that's not

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Speaker 5: what's happening right now. And I think my hope is

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Speaker 5: that that still does happen. I have a piece going

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Speaker 5: up in the our most recent print edition, the April

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Speaker 5: issue of the New Republic, that is about I think

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Speaker 5: one of my concerns, which is just that it's not

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Speaker 5: just the possibility for geopolitical problems, but just for you know,

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Speaker 5: violence and chaos at this World Cup, just if you

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Speaker 5: look at you know, Minneapolis and the world around us

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Speaker 5: right now, and I think the lack of preparation for that,

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Speaker 5: lack of security funding at host cities is really scary

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Speaker 5: to me, And so that's sort of front of mine.

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Speaker 5: I hope that England doesn't win, mostly because I get

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Speaker 5: a perverse sense of joy from English media reactions to meltdowns,

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Speaker 5: and hope. I think what is most surprising to me,

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Speaker 5: as I'd written about this during the last World Cup,

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Speaker 5: but I had always been ambivalent about the US men's

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Speaker 5: team growing up, and I've come to really love them

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Speaker 5: in a way that surprises me.

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Speaker 4: And I hope that they do well.

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Speaker 5: And that feels kind of weird to say, because I

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Speaker 5: think that that kind of grows more politically fraught by

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Speaker 5: the week. But I think that even though they seem

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Speaker 5: to have taken a step back since the last World Cup,

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Speaker 5: they're still enormously talented, and I find the ways that

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Speaker 5: they have retained the US M and t's core kind

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Speaker 5: of brutality and sluggish identity with players of genuine technical

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Speaker 5: brilliance to be fascinating, and I just am kind of

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Speaker 5: excited to see how they play. The group draws very,

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Speaker 5: very kind to them.

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Speaker 1: I think it bums me out that love of country

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Speaker 1: and patriotism, which is I think can be beautifully expressed at

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Speaker 1: a tournament like this, can be sort of appropriated by

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Speaker 1: one or the other side of a political debate such

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Speaker 1: that you would feel ambivalent about like supporting your country,

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Speaker 1: you know, Like I think that's a bummer. But we

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Speaker 1: only have to look at the like you know what

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Speaker 1: happened with the hockey gold medals for women to know

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Speaker 1: that that's a reality.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I know. I mean, patriotism can be a cudgel, right,

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Speaker 2: And I remember over the years I've written in many

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Speaker 2: scripts of YouTube videos when I'm critical of the United

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Speaker 2: States that I love the United States, and my longtime

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Speaker 2: producing partner, who's British and Mexican all always cuts that

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Speaker 2: out of my scripts. She's like, that's a weird thing

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Speaker 2: to say. It's a weird position to take, and it

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Speaker 2: is a weird position to take, especially in twenty twenty six.

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Speaker 2: And yet I do feel a, yeah, you know, a

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Speaker 2: profound connection to the US men's national team. And I've

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Speaker 2: watched them since I was a kid, and I've rooted

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Speaker 2: for them since i was a kid. And you know,

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Speaker 2: I've never lived with success anywhere else. I remember when

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Speaker 2: I lived in the Netherlands, a Dutch friend of mindset.

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Speaker 2: It seems to me that you're sort of incurably American,

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Speaker 2: and that feeling of being incurably American is still with me.

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Speaker 2: I want to ask you guys about the golden goal

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Speaker 2: the name of the magazine. Do you think that FIFA

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Speaker 2: should bring back the golden goal rule for knockout games?

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Speaker 5: This is funny because I think it's been a long

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Speaker 5: time point of that. Maybe that contention in a group

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Speaker 5: chat that we have, but I am firmly against the

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Speaker 5: golden goal. And the editors note that you read from earlier.

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Speaker 5: I was like, Miguel, do we need to have an

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Speaker 5: asterisk here where I can make it clear that I

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Speaker 5: think that this produced bad soccer. I mean, you love

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Speaker 5: when it goes well, but I think I still have memories.

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Speaker 5: I'm just old enough to, you know, have clear memories

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Speaker 5: of sitting through some really turgid extra time where you

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Speaker 5: know nobody wanted to give it up.

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Speaker 4: I think.

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Speaker 5: I think the question of soccer rule changes is always

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Speaker 5: one where you try to you try to preserve the

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Speaker 5: possibility for transcendence without making people purposefully play bad. This

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Speaker 5: is one of the set piece questions too, And I

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Speaker 5: think that the golden goal rule is one of those

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Speaker 5: things that seems great on paper but in practice it doesn't.

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Speaker 4: But for the sake of marketing this magazine, I.

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Speaker 5: Hope that they bring it back for this World Cup.

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Speaker 1: As an Arsenal fan, I feel like I'm being targeted

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Speaker 1: here with all this.

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Speaker 2: Personally attacked here.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I got to say, vitrial.

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Speaker 2: If you hate set piece goals in walking pace football,

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Speaker 2: might I recommend the third tier of English football and

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Speaker 2: where every ball is long and misplaced?

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Speaker 1: Oh man, I will say, And just parenthetically again, Alex,

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Speaker 1: you were saying you love British soccer meltdowns like I

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Speaker 1: have been consuming Tottenham meltdown content in the last twenty

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Speaker 1: four hours. It's just been absolutely beautiful and and just

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Speaker 1: a joy, just an absolute joy because I'm that petty

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Speaker 1: Yes it's.

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Speaker 4: A Liverpool fan too.

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Speaker 5: It's been rare and you know, my whatever two plus

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Speaker 5: decades where I can I can sort of go scoreboard,

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Speaker 5: you know, or say, well, at you know, we just

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Speaker 5: won the league, so it doesn't really matter to me

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Speaker 5: what happens. So I am rooting for Arsenal to win,

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Speaker 5: just just to be clear right now. But but I

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Speaker 5: think it is also Liverpool's general mediocrity this year has

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Speaker 5: just made given me a sense of detachment where I

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Speaker 5: can just kind of enjoy everything right now, and maybe

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Speaker 5: nothing as much as the crisis at Spurs.

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Speaker 1: Because I forget if you were an Arsenal fan or not.

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Speaker 1: Did I just decide that you were because I like you.

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Speaker 3: I'm a Barcelona fan, but I feel like I've had

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Speaker 3: to choose in like a Premier League team just because

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Speaker 3: everyone I know in New York it watches DPL and

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Speaker 3: it's hard to get everyone to watch a Barcelona against

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Speaker 3: game at three am on a Saturday. So I've I've

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Speaker 3: been supporting Liverpool mostly because I also chose them when

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Speaker 3: Luis Diaz had joined, and now they have stabbed me

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Speaker 3: in the back and let him go to Byron and

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Speaker 3: he's doing great, so I'm I'm a little salty about that,

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Speaker 3: but I'm still I'm going to stand firm with Liverpool.

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Speaker 3: But my first team is Barcelona, of course, and I

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Speaker 3: know I have a lot of experience with shot and

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Speaker 3: fraud because my entire like watching watching soccer in Spain

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Speaker 3: is and half watching Barcelona and half watching Madrid hoping

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Speaker 3: they will lose every single game.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, you guys, Thank you so much. I am

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Speaker 1: a big fan of the magazine. I can't wait to

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Speaker 1: see it and hold in my hands. I'm gonna be

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Speaker 1: following you guys. You can find a supports magazine at

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Speaker 1: Goldengold dot world and of course we'll put a link

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Speaker 1: in the show notes so the folks can get there.

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Speaker 1: And yeah, I will enjoy the World Cup and I

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Speaker 1: hope all of our dreams come true.

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Speaker 4: Thanks guys, thank you so much.

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Speaker 1: Thank you awesome. Welcome back to the away End. Okay,

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Speaker 1: I want to start with this video that I sent you.

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Speaker 1: It isn't super high resolution, John, but for those of

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00:22:55,440 --> 00:22:57,480
Speaker 1: you who are listening and not watching on YouTube, I'm

438
00:22:57,480 --> 00:22:59,720
Speaker 1: gonna just gonna describe it. I think you already saw it,

439
00:22:59,720 --> 00:23:02,200
Speaker 1: but okay, So in the video, there's three grown men,

440
00:23:02,760 --> 00:23:07,440
Speaker 1: three Japanese internationals. Their names are Hutu Yamaguchi, Hiroshiki Yotoki

441
00:23:07,600 --> 00:23:10,800
Speaker 1: and Yosuki I Deguch. They were in the nationals uniform,

442
00:23:10,800 --> 00:23:16,119
Speaker 1: which is beautiful dark blue uniform of Japan, the Blue Samurai,

443
00:23:16,600 --> 00:23:21,040
Speaker 1: and they're playing against another team. So it's three players

444
00:23:21,040 --> 00:23:23,720
Speaker 1: adults and there's one hundred school children.

445
00:23:23,800 --> 00:23:28,720
Speaker 2: John, Yeah, one hundred Classic thirty thirty thirty ten formation.

446
00:23:29,680 --> 00:23:33,639
Speaker 1: Absolutely. I mean it's right there in the training coaching manual,

447
00:23:33,760 --> 00:23:37,280
Speaker 1: you know. So when you watch this video from a distance,

448
00:23:37,320 --> 00:23:39,240
Speaker 1: it's really kind of beautiful. You see this kind of

449
00:23:40,640 --> 00:23:43,840
Speaker 1: children swarming across the pitch, chasing after these three men,

450
00:23:44,240 --> 00:23:46,840
Speaker 1: this kind of the morphous cloud of red. It's like

451
00:23:46,920 --> 00:23:49,520
Speaker 1: it feels like the surface of a lake in a breeze,

452
00:23:49,560 --> 00:23:53,919
Speaker 1: just kind of these waves of red. But when you

453
00:23:53,920 --> 00:23:56,359
Speaker 1: look closer, you'd realize that these are children moving their

454
00:23:56,400 --> 00:23:59,560
Speaker 1: tiny little legs at like an extraordinary pace. And so

455
00:23:59,600 --> 00:24:03,520
Speaker 1: the image is both soothing and like deeply chaotic, and

456
00:24:03,560 --> 00:24:05,560
Speaker 1: it also reminds you know, if you've played, you know,

457
00:24:05,640 --> 00:24:08,680
Speaker 1: kiddie soccer, or if you coach your kids, you also

458
00:24:09,119 --> 00:24:13,440
Speaker 1: recognize that kind of inescapable child logic of like ball centrism,

459
00:24:13,720 --> 00:24:16,040
Speaker 1: where like the magnetism of the ball is such that

460
00:24:16,080 --> 00:24:18,520
Speaker 1: we all must get as close to it as possible,

461
00:24:19,880 --> 00:24:22,119
Speaker 1: and something that kids learn as they get older that

462
00:24:22,240 --> 00:24:24,440
Speaker 1: the use of space is as important as the use

463
00:24:24,440 --> 00:24:27,199
Speaker 1: of the ball. But that comes later, or you know,

464
00:24:27,320 --> 00:24:28,440
Speaker 1: sometimes it never comes at all.

465
00:24:29,480 --> 00:24:30,000
Speaker 2: Came me.

466
00:24:32,400 --> 00:24:35,720
Speaker 1: Now, all I got is space? Do anything else like

467
00:24:36,240 --> 00:24:40,680
Speaker 1: walk to the area where no one else is and wait. Okay.

468
00:24:40,720 --> 00:24:43,199
Speaker 1: So it takes these three grown men like literally like

469
00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:47,120
Speaker 1: half a minute to score, because the amazing.

470
00:24:46,800 --> 00:24:49,840
Speaker 2: Thing about them scoring is that there are ten goalkeepers.

471
00:24:49,960 --> 00:24:52,720
Speaker 2: There are ten goalies who can use their hands, and

472
00:24:53,119 --> 00:24:55,080
Speaker 2: somehow they still manage to score.

473
00:24:55,800 --> 00:24:59,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, and they also managed to not hurt a child

474
00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:03,200
Speaker 1: like they do these like gentle lofting chips over these

475
00:25:03,359 --> 00:25:07,000
Speaker 1: you know, clouds of little children and and control the

476
00:25:07,000 --> 00:25:09,280
Speaker 1: ball well. And then you know, there's a one hundred

477
00:25:09,280 --> 00:25:10,720
Speaker 1: of them, but no one thinks that I should, you know,

478
00:25:10,880 --> 00:25:13,800
Speaker 1: close down the adult and so then the player chips

479
00:25:13,840 --> 00:25:15,960
Speaker 1: it over and uh, you know, it's a it's a

480
00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:18,280
Speaker 1: it's a beautiful header that manages to elude you know,

481
00:25:18,320 --> 00:25:21,840
Speaker 1: the ten goalkeepers as a spectacle. This is obviously from

482
00:25:21,880 --> 00:25:25,679
Speaker 1: a Japanese game show. Uh, and it's it's silly and

483
00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:30,640
Speaker 1: joyful and totally meaningless. I would parenthetically recommend anyone who's

484
00:25:30,640 --> 00:25:34,480
Speaker 1: ever feeling down about anything or uninspired just put in

485
00:25:35,280 --> 00:25:38,520
Speaker 1: best Japanese game show into YouTube or something and just

486
00:25:38,560 --> 00:25:41,240
Speaker 1: give into the surrealism of it. It's really a lovely

487
00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:45,040
Speaker 1: way to spend an afternoon on a rainy day. Anyway,

488
00:25:45,119 --> 00:25:48,480
Speaker 1: I wanted to mention this because I love it. It

489
00:25:48,560 --> 00:25:52,159
Speaker 1: sort of says something about Japan and Japan's culture. It

490
00:25:52,240 --> 00:25:54,240
Speaker 1: has nothing at all to do with Japan's chances of

491
00:25:54,320 --> 00:25:57,320
Speaker 1: this World Cup, but the away end is about joy

492
00:25:57,400 --> 00:26:00,239
Speaker 1: and this is a joyful moment for me. And when

493
00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:02,000
Speaker 1: I started doing the deep dive, I went back to

494
00:26:02,040 --> 00:26:05,000
Speaker 1: this and I remembered this video and looked for it

495
00:26:05,119 --> 00:26:07,800
Speaker 1: and laughed, and you know, just like gave into it

496
00:26:07,880 --> 00:26:12,360
Speaker 1: all all over again. So I love Japan. I loved

497
00:26:12,359 --> 00:26:16,280
Speaker 1: the Japanese team because I love Japan. I was in

498
00:26:16,320 --> 00:26:19,600
Speaker 1: Tokyo a couple of years ago and I was amazed

499
00:26:19,600 --> 00:26:21,920
Speaker 1: by it. And I have close Japanese friends. I've played

500
00:26:21,920 --> 00:26:26,040
Speaker 1: over the years with several of them, most recently played

501
00:26:26,440 --> 00:26:29,840
Speaker 1: from Japan and Taku, who used to absolutely embarrass me

502
00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:31,720
Speaker 1: and lots of other people every Sunday. It was so

503
00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:35,920
Speaker 1: good I loved Murakami in my twenties, as I'm sure

504
00:26:35,960 --> 00:26:40,880
Speaker 1: you did. I love the food. The Japanese national team.

505
00:26:40,880 --> 00:26:43,159
Speaker 1: If you have no if you just strictly want like fashion,

506
00:26:43,240 --> 00:26:48,359
Speaker 1: the Japanese national team jerseys are always just absolute bangers.

507
00:26:48,640 --> 00:26:52,199
Speaker 1: But let's talk about the actual football, right. Japan have

508
00:26:52,280 --> 00:26:54,320
Speaker 1: now qualified for eight World Cups in a row, every

509
00:26:54,320 --> 00:26:57,639
Speaker 1: World Cup since ninety eight. They of course co hosted

510
00:26:57,680 --> 00:27:00,760
Speaker 1: the two thousand and two World Cup Month of Football,

511
00:27:00,760 --> 00:27:03,240
Speaker 1: which permanently altered my circadian rhythms.

512
00:27:04,240 --> 00:27:06,199
Speaker 2: Never have I woken up at two am with so

513
00:27:06,320 --> 00:27:06,919
Speaker 2: much joy?

514
00:27:07,880 --> 00:27:11,479
Speaker 1: Yeah? Yeah, the games were like at two, at four

515
00:27:11,520 --> 00:27:12,719
Speaker 1: and like six am.

516
00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:15,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, but I remember it was kind of great because

517
00:27:15,320 --> 00:27:17,280
Speaker 2: at the time I was working at Bookless magazine, and

518
00:27:17,320 --> 00:27:19,560
Speaker 2: so I would just wake up at two and then

519
00:27:19,600 --> 00:27:21,600
Speaker 2: by the time I got ready for work, the last

520
00:27:21,600 --> 00:27:22,840
Speaker 2: game would be wrapping up.

521
00:27:23,240 --> 00:27:24,680
Speaker 1: And when would you sleep at work?

522
00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:26,160
Speaker 2: Oh? Yeah, man, that job.

523
00:27:29,280 --> 00:27:34,240
Speaker 1: There you go. So Japan is today a powerhouse of

524
00:27:34,320 --> 00:27:38,240
Speaker 1: Asian soccer. The Japanese women are powers of global soccer.

525
00:27:38,280 --> 00:27:41,200
Speaker 1: But that's a discussion for another day. And there's a

526
00:27:41,200 --> 00:27:44,480
Speaker 1: bunch of milestones, right. So in twenty eighteen, Japan became

527
00:27:44,480 --> 00:27:46,320
Speaker 1: the first Asian team to beat a South American team

528
00:27:46,320 --> 00:27:48,520
Speaker 1: at a World Cup. It was Columbia in a group

529
00:27:48,560 --> 00:27:55,800
Speaker 1: stage game. They played Belgium in the round sixteen. I

530
00:27:55,840 --> 00:27:59,280
Speaker 1: don't know if you remember that game from twenty eighteen. Yeah,

531
00:27:59,440 --> 00:28:01,920
Speaker 1: incredible game, and I want to mention this game because

532
00:28:01,920 --> 00:28:05,280
Speaker 1: they were winning to nothing. Belgium, you know, was like

533
00:28:05,320 --> 00:28:08,280
Speaker 1: one of the top teams ranked by FIFA at the time.

534
00:28:09,720 --> 00:28:11,800
Speaker 1: They ended up losing three to two, but what was

535
00:28:11,840 --> 00:28:16,560
Speaker 1: remarkable is that they they had a corner kick in

536
00:28:16,600 --> 00:28:19,640
Speaker 1: like the ninety fourth minute and they were tying one

537
00:28:19,640 --> 00:28:22,080
Speaker 1: of the top European teams, like one of the favorites

538
00:28:22,119 --> 00:28:26,679
Speaker 1: to win in a knockout game. And also all the

539
00:28:26,680 --> 00:28:30,040
Speaker 1: Belgian players are giants. They're absolute, you know, gigantic players,

540
00:28:30,560 --> 00:28:34,320
Speaker 1: and so naturally, if you were the coach, you would say,

541
00:28:35,560 --> 00:28:38,560
Speaker 1: short kick, run out the clock, you know, live to

542
00:28:38,640 --> 00:28:42,000
Speaker 1: fight an extra time, right, That's what a normal sort

543
00:28:42,000 --> 00:28:47,360
Speaker 1: of tactic would be. Instead, they lost the kick directly

544
00:28:47,440 --> 00:28:51,080
Speaker 1: into the mixer right in the center, which is immediately

545
00:28:51,160 --> 00:28:57,920
Speaker 1: caught by their gigantic goalkeeper, the Belgian goalkeeper, and quick

546
00:28:57,960 --> 00:29:00,840
Speaker 1: fast break and like literally eight second later they're knocked out.

547
00:29:00,840 --> 00:29:05,440
Speaker 1: Of the World Cup in Belgium scores crazy, and then

548
00:29:05,480 --> 00:29:07,520
Speaker 1: of course there were these images that came after of

549
00:29:07,600 --> 00:29:09,760
Speaker 1: the Japanese fans cleaning up the air of the stadium

550
00:29:09,800 --> 00:29:15,600
Speaker 1: like in tears, which is also very beautiful. In twenty

551
00:29:15,760 --> 00:29:20,200
Speaker 1: twenty two, Japan had a legitimate group of death like

552
00:29:20,240 --> 00:29:25,520
Speaker 1: and absolutely like listeners Germany, Spain, Costa Rica, Japan.

553
00:29:25,920 --> 00:29:26,400
Speaker 2: Wow.

554
00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:31,080
Speaker 1: Wow, that is a really like serious group of death Sean,

555
00:29:31,120 --> 00:29:32,760
Speaker 1: do you want to come on for a second, knowing

556
00:29:32,800 --> 00:29:38,360
Speaker 1: nothing as you do about I'm sorry. We actually got

557
00:29:38,400 --> 00:29:41,240
Speaker 1: a letter today saying stop making fun of Sean.

558
00:29:42,400 --> 00:29:42,640
Speaker 2: Yeah.

559
00:29:42,640 --> 00:29:45,800
Speaker 1: I feel like I feel like I'm biting you, both

560
00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:46,400
Speaker 1: of us.

561
00:29:46,680 --> 00:29:51,120
Speaker 2: Absolutely, we're just trying to Yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, let's

562
00:29:51,160 --> 00:29:53,280
Speaker 2: just leave it. If you can see Sean's beard. I

563
00:29:53,280 --> 00:29:55,120
Speaker 2: think the issue is that a lot of our listeners

564
00:29:55,120 --> 00:29:57,000
Speaker 2: are are audio only, and so they don't get to

565
00:29:57,000 --> 00:29:59,000
Speaker 2: see Sean's beard. Yeah.

566
00:29:59,040 --> 00:30:01,080
Speaker 1: I think I mention that part of the reason that

567
00:30:01,120 --> 00:30:02,880
Speaker 1: I don't like it least because they're also so handsome,

568
00:30:02,920 --> 00:30:05,080
Speaker 1: and here we have like a legitimate Italian.

569
00:30:04,760 --> 00:30:08,000
Speaker 2: Oh so good looking, so good. I was gonna say

570
00:30:08,040 --> 00:30:10,479
Speaker 2: great looking for his age, but actually just great looking

571
00:30:12,120 --> 00:30:13,880
Speaker 2: at any age at any age.

572
00:30:14,080 --> 00:30:18,520
Speaker 1: All right, so sean beautiful fan, Germany, Spain, Costa Rica, Japan.

573
00:30:19,800 --> 00:30:22,240
Speaker 1: Does Japan get out of the group? Only two teams

574
00:30:22,240 --> 00:30:24,080
Speaker 1: can get out of the group. Does Japan get out

575
00:30:24,080 --> 00:30:25,680
Speaker 1: of Germany, Spain, Costa Rica?

576
00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:31,120
Speaker 6: Well, I know that the running idea here is that

577
00:30:31,280 --> 00:30:34,200
Speaker 6: I don't know much or maybe anything at all. But

578
00:30:34,320 --> 00:30:37,040
Speaker 6: I can say that this is something that I know

579
00:30:37,440 --> 00:30:43,040
Speaker 6: because I remember watching these games, and I remember Japan

580
00:30:43,480 --> 00:30:51,280
Speaker 6: surprising everybody by defeating Germany and by defeating Spain. So

581
00:30:51,480 --> 00:30:53,200
Speaker 6: they did they did it.

582
00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:55,040
Speaker 1: They got out, They got out of the group in

583
00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:58,800
Speaker 1: first place. In fact, that is you're not doing a

584
00:30:58,800 --> 00:31:00,920
Speaker 1: good job of being the guy it doesn't know anything.

585
00:31:00,960 --> 00:31:01,920
Speaker 1: I mean, that's incredible.

586
00:31:02,000 --> 00:31:04,560
Speaker 6: From time to time I think I will. It depends

587
00:31:04,560 --> 00:31:06,880
Speaker 6: on the question, right whether or not I will I

588
00:31:06,920 --> 00:31:10,239
Speaker 6: will know something or not. I guess my question is

589
00:31:11,080 --> 00:31:15,600
Speaker 6: they I know they lost to Costa Rica. It was

590
00:31:15,680 --> 00:31:19,760
Speaker 6: that a game that they on paper should have won. Yeah,

591
00:31:19,960 --> 00:31:22,960
Speaker 6: and then then weirdly lost that game, but then beat

592
00:31:23,320 --> 00:31:24,240
Speaker 6: Germany and Spain.

593
00:31:24,360 --> 00:31:27,040
Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, Costca had a good team that year. Costa

594
00:31:27,080 --> 00:31:30,080
Speaker 1: Rica actually that was one of the most surprising groups ever,

595
00:31:30,280 --> 00:31:33,440
Speaker 1: probably because Germany, Spain Japan, Costa Rica. I think everyone

596
00:31:33,440 --> 00:31:36,000
Speaker 1: would have said Spain and Germany get out of the group,

597
00:31:36,440 --> 00:31:40,120
Speaker 1: and in fact it was it was Costa Rica and Japan.

598
00:31:40,480 --> 00:31:44,080
Speaker 1: So it was one wonderful surprise that sport gave us.

599
00:31:45,000 --> 00:31:48,440
Speaker 1: They went on, of course, to lose to Croatia in

600
00:31:48,560 --> 00:31:50,600
Speaker 1: penalty kicks on the round of sixty.

601
00:31:50,760 --> 00:31:55,800
Speaker 2: Very unfortunate, very unfortunate. Yeah, and then Croatia made it

602
00:31:55,840 --> 00:31:56,320
Speaker 2: all the way.

603
00:31:56,720 --> 00:32:00,880
Speaker 1: Croatia didn't make it all the way. You're thinking, twenty eight,

604
00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:01,160
Speaker 1: that's what.

605
00:32:01,800 --> 00:32:04,000
Speaker 2: That's all the that's all the way. That's all the way. Man.

606
00:32:04,200 --> 00:32:06,280
Speaker 1: The Sebomi finals is all the way. You're right, that's fair.

607
00:32:06,320 --> 00:32:08,880
Speaker 1: That's that's pretty much all the way. That's most of

608
00:32:08,920 --> 00:32:12,240
Speaker 1: the way, all right. So in twenty twenty six, Japan

609
00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:15,800
Speaker 1: absolutely rolled through qualifying. They were the first team outside

610
00:32:15,800 --> 00:32:19,280
Speaker 1: of the three hosts to qualify, and the friendlies since

611
00:32:19,320 --> 00:32:21,040
Speaker 1: then have been kind of a mixed bag. So they

612
00:32:21,040 --> 00:32:23,040
Speaker 1: lost the United States, which was a little weird, but

613
00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:27,440
Speaker 1: they also scored their first ever victory against Brazil, coming wow,

614
00:32:27,600 --> 00:32:30,719
Speaker 1: coming back from two down to win. It was one

615
00:32:30,760 --> 00:32:34,600
Speaker 1: of Machelotti's first games. He didn't look happy. They drew

616
00:32:34,680 --> 00:32:37,000
Speaker 1: with Paraguay, but they beat Ghana, so it's kind of

617
00:32:37,040 --> 00:32:39,280
Speaker 1: like up and down. They have a couple further warm

618
00:32:39,360 --> 00:32:43,320
Speaker 1: up games this month later this month against England and Scotland,

619
00:32:43,360 --> 00:32:45,560
Speaker 1: which should sort of give us a little more insight

620
00:32:45,600 --> 00:32:49,200
Speaker 1: into where the team stands. Now, I want to this

621
00:32:49,280 --> 00:32:52,320
Speaker 1: is this stat actually totally blew my mind. So as

622
00:32:52,320 --> 00:32:54,600
Speaker 1: of September twenty twenty five, there are over one hundred

623
00:32:54,600 --> 00:32:58,800
Speaker 1: and fourteen Japanese players active in European leagues in European teams.

624
00:32:58,880 --> 00:33:03,760
Speaker 1: That's a ninety percent increase over the past five years. Wow,

625
00:33:04,720 --> 00:33:07,360
Speaker 1: wow percent growth. It's crazy. So we in the United

626
00:33:07,360 --> 00:33:11,680
Speaker 1: States have like twenty five Yeah, exactly, exactly, So Japan

627
00:33:11,800 --> 00:33:14,080
Speaker 1: is a legit team. I mean, look, some of these

628
00:33:14,080 --> 00:33:18,160
Speaker 1: players you'll recognize. Karu Mintoma from Brighton. Love that player,

629
00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:23,640
Speaker 1: really great, takomimin Amino, late of your parish now at Monaco, Yeah,

630
00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:28,400
Speaker 1: a good player. Yep, Uhar Wataru Endo who currently is

631
00:33:28,440 --> 00:33:29,680
Speaker 1: on Liverpool.

632
00:33:30,280 --> 00:33:33,760
Speaker 2: Great player. I mean yeah, both Endo and Minnemino were

633
00:33:33,760 --> 00:33:36,080
Speaker 2: players you just loved rooting for.

634
00:33:36,760 --> 00:33:40,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely absolutely. So you have a real talent and

635
00:33:43,480 --> 00:33:47,080
Speaker 1: you know they have a group that I think is doable.

636
00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:51,440
Speaker 1: This time, right, So their group is Netherlands, Tunisia and

637
00:33:51,720 --> 00:33:56,120
Speaker 1: UEFA Playoff B, which could be either Ukraine, Sweden, Poland

638
00:33:56,240 --> 00:33:59,920
Speaker 1: or Albania, and I for one am hard pressed to

639
00:34:00,080 --> 00:34:02,600
Speaker 1: pick who would win there. I know I'm going to

640
00:34:02,640 --> 00:34:04,840
Speaker 1: be rooting for Ukraine, but I don't actually know.

641
00:34:07,000 --> 00:34:10,520
Speaker 2: Who's the favorite. Sweden and Poland are both also good.

642
00:34:10,560 --> 00:34:13,880
Speaker 2: Albania has good players. That's That's a tough group. So

643
00:34:13,920 --> 00:34:15,960
Speaker 2: who knows who that'll be, but it's probably going to

644
00:34:16,040 --> 00:34:20,000
Speaker 2: be somebody that Japan can can at least draw. You

645
00:34:20,040 --> 00:34:23,480
Speaker 2: think Tunisia is probably beatable. The Netherlands is an interesting

646
00:34:23,560 --> 00:34:25,680
Speaker 2: challenge for Japan, but not an impossible one.

647
00:34:26,440 --> 00:34:30,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm gonna say that. I mean Netherlands. What I

648
00:34:30,400 --> 00:34:32,160
Speaker 1: was taught as the child, Netherlands is the greatest team

649
00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:35,000
Speaker 1: that's never won a World Cup, and I think you

650
00:34:35,040 --> 00:34:38,080
Speaker 1: know we can agree on that they've been in the

651
00:34:38,120 --> 00:34:40,480
Speaker 1: World Cup final twice in seventy eight and twenty ten,

652
00:34:42,080 --> 00:34:49,120
Speaker 1: proud footballing heritage, and yet not imperious and not unbeatable.

653
00:34:50,040 --> 00:34:52,120
Speaker 1: I'm gonna say John that this year Japan is going

654
00:34:52,160 --> 00:34:54,480
Speaker 1: to get out of the group. Kind of does everyone's

655
00:34:54,480 --> 00:34:58,520
Speaker 1: getting out of the group and the round of sixteen

656
00:34:58,600 --> 00:35:00,160
Speaker 1: is no longer the rund of sixteen now the first

657
00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:01,919
Speaker 1: knockout round. Of course, it's the round of thirty two.

658
00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:04,600
Speaker 1: So the question is will they get past the first

659
00:35:04,640 --> 00:35:08,440
Speaker 1: knockout round, because they've never gotten past that despite being

660
00:35:09,040 --> 00:35:12,759
Speaker 1: a team that you know routinely wins Asian Cups, a

661
00:35:12,840 --> 00:35:14,960
Speaker 1: team that has this depth of talent, that they have

662
00:35:15,000 --> 00:35:17,760
Speaker 1: over one hundred players playing in the top leagues in Europe.

663
00:35:18,160 --> 00:35:23,480
Speaker 1: So now will they win the round of thirty two game?

664
00:35:24,080 --> 00:35:27,680
Speaker 1: Let's assume so check this out. The winner of Group

665
00:35:27,840 --> 00:35:31,160
Speaker 1: F gets the runner up of Group C, and the

666
00:35:31,200 --> 00:35:33,040
Speaker 1: winner of Group C gets the runner up of Group F.

667
00:35:33,280 --> 00:35:38,200
Speaker 1: So you're asking John, what's Group C? Brazil, Morocco, Haiti

668
00:35:38,280 --> 00:35:38,920
Speaker 1: and Scotland.

669
00:35:39,040 --> 00:35:42,600
Speaker 2: Oh no, right, Oh, that's a disaster. You're either going

670
00:35:42,680 --> 00:35:44,320
Speaker 2: to give to razila Morocco almost.

671
00:35:44,160 --> 00:35:46,360
Speaker 1: You're going to get almost certainly going to get Brazil

672
00:35:46,360 --> 00:35:49,120
Speaker 1: and Morocco with respect to our Scottish and Haitian friends.

673
00:35:50,760 --> 00:35:53,480
Speaker 1: So the real thing is this, they already beat Brazil

674
00:35:53,560 --> 00:35:57,439
Speaker 1: once in a friendly. It's entirely likely that Japan's gonna

675
00:35:57,440 --> 00:35:59,040
Speaker 1: have to do it again for real in a World

676
00:35:59,080 --> 00:36:02,120
Speaker 1: Cup if they want to break the hoodoo of getting

677
00:36:02,120 --> 00:36:03,399
Speaker 1: past the round of thirty two.

678
00:36:04,360 --> 00:36:09,880
Speaker 2: Imagine the size of the catastrophe if Brazil lost in

679
00:36:09,920 --> 00:36:11,080
Speaker 2: the round of thirty two.

680
00:36:11,640 --> 00:36:16,120
Speaker 1: Oo wow, yeah, I mean no, one.

681
00:36:15,960 --> 00:36:20,440
Speaker 2: Hundred and fifty million people would be oh my god,

682
00:36:20,480 --> 00:36:21,920
Speaker 2: I'd hate to be Carl Ancholotti.

683
00:36:22,040 --> 00:36:25,759
Speaker 1: Then unthinkable, It's unthinkable. I mean, that's like the the

684
00:36:26,320 --> 00:36:27,759
Speaker 1: you know, there are teams that are just happy to

685
00:36:27,760 --> 00:36:29,879
Speaker 1: be there and teams where if they win a game

686
00:36:30,000 --> 00:36:33,400
Speaker 1: or score a goal, that's enough. And then there's the

687
00:36:33,400 --> 00:36:36,520
Speaker 1: pressure that teams like Brazil face, you know, or Morocco

688
00:36:36,760 --> 00:36:38,560
Speaker 1: they were hosting afkon. We talked about this in the

689
00:36:38,560 --> 00:36:41,279
Speaker 1: first episode, and you know, the entire weight of the

690
00:36:41,360 --> 00:36:46,000
Speaker 1: nation is a lot is a lot to take, Yeah,

691
00:36:46,040 --> 00:36:49,520
Speaker 1: which maybe makes them beatable. I don't know, because Japan

692
00:36:49,600 --> 00:36:52,000
Speaker 1: is in that in between phase where they have real talent,

693
00:36:52,400 --> 00:36:56,160
Speaker 1: really good players, and the question is, but no one

694
00:36:56,200 --> 00:36:57,480
Speaker 1: actually thinks they're gonna win anything.

695
00:36:58,239 --> 00:36:59,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, they could win a knock out.

696
00:36:59,680 --> 00:37:03,239
Speaker 1: That yeah, I think I think they could do it.

697
00:37:03,320 --> 00:37:06,360
Speaker 1: I think they could do it. We'll see. So anyway,

698
00:37:06,520 --> 00:37:09,480
Speaker 1: that's that's my take on Japan. I'm really looking forward

699
00:37:09,480 --> 00:37:14,520
Speaker 1: to buying a japan Jersey and enjoying those games.

700
00:37:15,040 --> 00:37:16,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's gonna be great. All Right, we're gonna take

701
00:37:16,760 --> 00:37:18,440
Speaker 2: a break and then we'll be back with a story

702
00:37:18,480 --> 00:37:24,680
Speaker 2: from me about football and security funding, riveting. We'll do

703
00:37:24,760 --> 00:37:42,719
Speaker 2: right back, all right, Daniel, We're back with you away

704
00:37:42,760 --> 00:37:46,640
Speaker 2: in and I'm gonna tell you a story about a

705
00:37:46,680 --> 00:37:50,279
Speaker 2: small town New England select board. So if you've never

706
00:37:50,320 --> 00:37:52,680
Speaker 2: lived in New England, there are these town boards that

707
00:37:53,040 --> 00:37:54,920
Speaker 2: can be very powerful. In this case, it's a town

708
00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:57,560
Speaker 2: board of five people who are elected, but they're volunteers

709
00:37:58,239 --> 00:38:01,880
Speaker 2: in a little town called Foxborough, Masachusetts, which happens to

710
00:38:01,920 --> 00:38:05,560
Speaker 2: be home to a very large stadium where I believe

711
00:38:05,600 --> 00:38:07,840
Speaker 2: the New England Patriots play their football games.

712
00:38:08,239 --> 00:38:11,120
Speaker 1: I've heard of it. Yes, it's called Foxborough Stadium, or

713
00:38:11,120 --> 00:38:11,640
Speaker 1: it used to be.

714
00:38:11,719 --> 00:38:14,560
Speaker 2: I believe it's called Foxborough Stadium. Maybe it's got maybe

715
00:38:14,560 --> 00:38:17,879
Speaker 2: it's called Gillette Stadium because it's been papered over by

716
00:38:17,880 --> 00:38:19,960
Speaker 2: some kind of corporation. But in our hearts it will

717
00:38:20,000 --> 00:38:24,240
Speaker 2: always be Foxborough Stadium, got it. Well, the town board

718
00:38:24,400 --> 00:38:26,719
Speaker 2: there has has said, look, it's going to cost us

719
00:38:26,719 --> 00:38:30,279
Speaker 2: about seven point eight million dollars to do security for

720
00:38:30,440 --> 00:38:35,000
Speaker 2: this event that we're hosting I believe seven games of

721
00:38:35,040 --> 00:38:39,760
Speaker 2: the World Cup, and we're gonna need FIFA, which expects

722
00:38:39,800 --> 00:38:42,640
Speaker 2: to make eleven point seven billion with a B dollars

723
00:38:42,760 --> 00:38:45,600
Speaker 2: from the World Cup. We're gonna need FIFA or somebody

724
00:38:45,960 --> 00:38:51,040
Speaker 2: to pay that money. And it's very complicated. There are

725
00:38:51,040 --> 00:38:53,920
Speaker 2: a lot of different parties involved, including the Craft family

726
00:38:53,960 --> 00:38:56,919
Speaker 2: who owns the New England Patriots, and also this group

727
00:38:57,040 --> 00:39:01,359
Speaker 2: Boston Soccer that is a a a separate group from

728
00:39:01,480 --> 00:39:04,759
Speaker 2: FIFA but sort of aligned with FIFA, that's bringing the

729
00:39:04,800 --> 00:39:09,520
Speaker 2: World Cup to Boston, although technically to Foxborough, and they

730
00:39:09,560 --> 00:39:12,080
Speaker 2: cannot seem to come to an agreement on this seven

731
00:39:12,120 --> 00:39:15,440
Speaker 2: point eight million dollars now. They announced Boston Soccer and

732
00:39:15,480 --> 00:39:17,920
Speaker 2: the Craft family announced that they had come to an agreement,

733
00:39:17,920 --> 00:39:21,360
Speaker 2: but the Foxborough select Board immediately responded, you've come to

734
00:39:21,400 --> 00:39:25,040
Speaker 2: an agreement with yourselves, not with us. You have not,

735
00:39:25,160 --> 00:39:27,719
Speaker 2: in fact come to an agreement with us, got it?

736
00:39:28,600 --> 00:39:31,120
Speaker 2: And it is not at all clear if these games

737
00:39:31,160 --> 00:39:34,959
Speaker 2: which are now scheduled for I don't know ninety five

738
00:39:35,040 --> 00:39:38,040
Speaker 2: days from now, are actually going to happen because it's

739
00:39:38,040 --> 00:39:40,279
Speaker 2: the seven point eight million dollar disagreement.

740
00:39:40,840 --> 00:39:44,280
Speaker 1: Seven point eight million dollars when you're gonna make eleven billion.

741
00:39:44,760 --> 00:39:47,440
Speaker 1: Seems like like just you know, fish it out of

742
00:39:47,480 --> 00:39:49,600
Speaker 1: the you know, between the sofa cushions, you know, like

743
00:39:50,840 --> 00:39:53,560
Speaker 1: that's what like FIFA spends on, like SODA's at the offices,

744
00:39:53,640 --> 00:39:55,160
Speaker 1: Like just give them money.

745
00:39:56,280 --> 00:39:58,880
Speaker 2: Right, Yeah, that's how I feel, too, right like, And

746
00:39:58,920 --> 00:40:01,799
Speaker 2: it's not it's forced security, and I'm all like, I

747
00:40:01,840 --> 00:40:03,839
Speaker 2: want this to be a secure World Cup. That's something

748
00:40:03,880 --> 00:40:08,280
Speaker 2: I worry about and so I'm all for it. I

749
00:40:08,440 --> 00:40:10,759
Speaker 2: also feel like it's a solvable problem. But it's one

750
00:40:10,760 --> 00:40:14,600
Speaker 2: of those things where big, powerful institutions think they can

751
00:40:14,600 --> 00:40:17,319
Speaker 2: come up against a little select board and automatically win

752
00:40:17,920 --> 00:40:20,279
Speaker 2: just by throwing around their weight. And I sort of

753
00:40:20,320 --> 00:40:22,560
Speaker 2: love that these New England town councils are like, you

754
00:40:22,560 --> 00:40:26,320
Speaker 2: don't understand, We've been doing this since like seventeen fifty one.

755
00:40:28,680 --> 00:40:31,440
Speaker 1: It's like a it's like a Manhattan co op, you

756
00:40:31,440 --> 00:40:35,560
Speaker 1: know exactly. It won't be believed by the celebrity resident,

757
00:40:35,719 --> 00:40:36,760
Speaker 1: you know, your influencer.

758
00:40:36,880 --> 00:40:40,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, they were not getting a break on rent.

759
00:40:41,160 --> 00:40:44,239
Speaker 1: No no noise after eight pm, sorry, you know, no

760
00:40:44,320 --> 00:40:48,520
Speaker 1: smiling in the elevator, that's the rules. I love it.

761
00:40:48,600 --> 00:40:53,279
Speaker 1: I love it. Yeah, what who's the bad guy here?

762
00:40:53,600 --> 00:40:56,120
Speaker 1: And does it start with an F and in an A.

763
00:40:57,160 --> 00:40:58,560
Speaker 2: I think it starts with an F and NS in

764
00:40:58,560 --> 00:41:00,480
Speaker 2: an A, as it usually does. But all so, like,

765
00:41:00,640 --> 00:41:03,640
Speaker 2: I'm so biased at this point, you know that, Like

766
00:41:03,760 --> 00:41:06,279
Speaker 2: I haven't really looked deeply into the question of who's

767
00:41:06,320 --> 00:41:08,760
Speaker 2: the bad guy. It's just that the bad guys always FIFA,

768
00:41:09,560 --> 00:41:13,640
Speaker 2: so it has to be FIFA. But yeah, there's a

769
00:41:13,680 --> 00:41:16,440
Speaker 2: lot of a lot of a lot of mutual finger

770
00:41:16,480 --> 00:41:21,279
Speaker 2: pointing in this, in this and it's hard. It's hard

771
00:41:21,320 --> 00:41:26,200
Speaker 2: to know, except that it seems to me that it's

772
00:41:26,200 --> 00:41:28,880
Speaker 2: going to be expensive for the town to host the

773
00:41:28,920 --> 00:41:31,160
Speaker 2: fricking World Cup, and it makes sense that they're going

774
00:41:31,200 --> 00:41:32,480
Speaker 2: to need some support to do that.

775
00:41:33,719 --> 00:41:36,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, Okay, I'm gonna look this up because I think

776
00:41:36,440 --> 00:41:41,440
Speaker 1: that the listeners want to know. Okay, So the games

777
00:41:41,600 --> 00:41:44,920
Speaker 1: that are going to be held in Boston slash Foxborough,

778
00:41:45,920 --> 00:41:47,080
Speaker 1: hand versus Scotland.

779
00:41:47,440 --> 00:41:49,160
Speaker 2: Oh god, that's going to be a banger.

780
00:41:49,480 --> 00:41:54,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, Iraq of Bolivia, Yeah, that's gonna be a good one.

781
00:41:54,840 --> 00:41:57,239
Speaker 1: Haitian fans are gonna come. That's gonna be wonderful.

782
00:41:57,960 --> 00:41:58,240
Speaker 2: Okay.

783
00:41:58,280 --> 00:42:01,440
Speaker 1: That then there's the winner the playoff between Iraq, Bolivia

784
00:42:01,480 --> 00:42:07,800
Speaker 1: and Suranon versus Norway, Holland early Holland, our Noda Guards debut.

785
00:42:08,400 --> 00:42:10,680
Speaker 1: All the wonderful players from Bodo Glimpse are just going

786
00:42:10,760 --> 00:42:13,560
Speaker 1: to be there, just you know, playing. Can they play

787
00:42:13,560 --> 00:42:15,440
Speaker 1: in the heat? Are they able to? I don't know,

788
00:42:16,239 --> 00:42:21,960
Speaker 1: who knows? Who knows? Yeah, Norwegians. In June in Boston,

789
00:42:22,440 --> 00:42:27,759
Speaker 1: we'll see h Scotland versus Morocco. That's a great game. Yeah,

790
00:42:28,040 --> 00:42:33,000
Speaker 1: England versus Ghana that's also a great game, a class

791
00:42:33,120 --> 00:42:37,080
Speaker 1: colonial matchup. Yeah. And then this one is going to

792
00:42:37,160 --> 00:42:40,560
Speaker 1: be another banger here Norway versus France.

793
00:42:41,520 --> 00:42:41,800
Speaker 5: Wow.

794
00:42:42,560 --> 00:42:45,239
Speaker 2: I mean those are good games that Boston has if

795
00:42:45,280 --> 00:42:47,080
Speaker 2: I now see, if I were Foxborough would come to

796
00:42:47,120 --> 00:42:49,080
Speaker 2: some kind of agreement just so I could host those games.

797
00:42:49,520 --> 00:42:52,360
Speaker 2: I mean they count Select Kennedy free tickets.

798
00:42:52,719 --> 00:42:55,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, I would, I would probably. You know, you only

799
00:42:55,080 --> 00:42:58,320
Speaker 1: need three votes, FIFA, make.

800
00:42:57,719 --> 00:43:00,759
Speaker 2: It work, FIFA. If there's anything you're good at, it's

801
00:43:00,840 --> 00:43:02,240
Speaker 2: bribing elected officials.

802
00:43:02,800 --> 00:43:08,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, like that's like one of the tenants of the organization. Yeah.

803
00:43:08,680 --> 00:43:10,520
Speaker 1: I hope they come to an agreement. I hope Foxboro

804
00:43:10,600 --> 00:43:12,360
Speaker 1: gets the money it needs. When I read about this,

805
00:43:12,440 --> 00:43:16,840
Speaker 1: I thought, what was remarkable was that the Boston Soccer

806
00:43:17,360 --> 00:43:19,160
Speaker 1: which is kind of what I understood was kind of

807
00:43:19,160 --> 00:43:22,279
Speaker 1: an offshoot of FIFA that was like a nonprofit that

808
00:43:22,360 --> 00:43:25,960
Speaker 1: was created just for this to put on these seven games.

809
00:43:26,200 --> 00:43:29,279
Speaker 1: They basically said, yeah, you'll get your money, you know,

810
00:43:29,480 --> 00:43:32,480
Speaker 1: June first, and the town council was like, oh, hell no,

811
00:43:32,960 --> 00:43:36,799
Speaker 1: we're not going to start ordering the equipment that we

812
00:43:36,880 --> 00:43:41,480
Speaker 1: need to make these games flow safely, like twelve days

813
00:43:41,520 --> 00:43:44,960
Speaker 1: before the tournament starts. That's preposterous. And you know what,

814
00:43:45,080 --> 00:43:47,839
Speaker 1: I think they're right. I think they're absolutely right, and

815
00:43:48,239 --> 00:43:52,439
Speaker 1: I hope they get their money. Yeah, yeah, thank you. John.

816
00:43:52,840 --> 00:43:54,320
Speaker 1: We have a couple of letters before we go. Do

817
00:43:54,320 --> 00:43:55,920
Speaker 1: you want to hear them? I'll read this one for

818
00:43:55,960 --> 00:43:59,400
Speaker 1: you because it's a question just for you, Dear Daniel,

819
00:43:59,719 --> 00:44:02,040
Speaker 1: John and Sean. We would love to hear John's answer

820
00:44:02,080 --> 00:44:04,400
Speaker 1: to the question of which, if any domestic team he supports.

821
00:44:04,719 --> 00:44:07,000
Speaker 1: We know about his support for Wimbledon and Liverpool because

822
00:44:07,000 --> 00:44:10,919
Speaker 1: he won't shut up about fucking Liverpool. But there's nothing

823
00:44:10,960 --> 00:44:13,000
Speaker 1: like going to your hometown team's game. I can honestly

824
00:44:13,000 --> 00:44:15,920
Speaker 1: say my soccer interest sword into soccer obsession during my

825
00:44:16,000 --> 00:44:17,759
Speaker 1: visits the Red bull Areno while I lived in New York,

826
00:44:18,239 --> 00:44:20,840
Speaker 1: joining the crowd and singing for Columbian star Juan Pablank,

827
00:44:21,080 --> 00:44:23,560
Speaker 1: future American star Josie Altadoor and a cast of guys

828
00:44:23,560 --> 00:44:26,759
Speaker 1: like John Wolgek, who they might have just found playing

829
00:44:26,760 --> 00:44:29,560
Speaker 1: pick up on the Opper West Side. Took my consumerist

830
00:44:29,600 --> 00:44:32,319
Speaker 1: interest and turned it into ritual participation in community action,

831
00:44:32,440 --> 00:44:34,520
Speaker 1: a switch which felt like learning to live.

832
00:44:34,800 --> 00:44:34,960
Speaker 2: Man.

833
00:44:35,040 --> 00:44:35,719
Speaker 1: This guy can write.

834
00:44:35,800 --> 00:44:36,000
Speaker 2: Yes.

835
00:44:36,719 --> 00:44:41,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, so, Luke asks, has John been to an Indie

836
00:44:41,320 --> 00:44:43,759
Speaker 1: eleven game? Their next game home game is the US

837
00:44:43,800 --> 00:44:46,400
Speaker 1: Open Cup against Des Moines Menace on the seventeenth, and

838
00:44:46,480 --> 00:44:48,879
Speaker 1: they host Detroit in the League on the twenty first.

839
00:44:48,880 --> 00:44:50,320
Speaker 1: We'd love to hear about that experience.

840
00:44:51,640 --> 00:44:53,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, I have been to several India eleven games. I

841
00:44:53,840 --> 00:44:58,000
Speaker 2: mean the issue with American soccer teams for me, and look,

842
00:44:58,000 --> 00:45:00,120
Speaker 2: this is also an issue with Liverpool Football Club not

843
00:45:00,120 --> 00:45:05,160
Speaker 2: going to pretend otherwise, is that they are franchises. Now

844
00:45:05,440 --> 00:45:08,080
Speaker 2: usl is opening itself up to promotion and relegation, which

845
00:45:08,120 --> 00:45:10,680
Speaker 2: is really exciting, and I think I'll go to more

846
00:45:10,719 --> 00:45:12,919
Speaker 2: Indie eleven games in the future now that that's part

847
00:45:12,960 --> 00:45:15,680
Speaker 2: of the now that there's some real jeopardy. So there's

848
00:45:15,680 --> 00:45:18,879
Speaker 2: some meaningful jeopardy for these very wealthy people who own

849
00:45:18,960 --> 00:45:22,719
Speaker 2: these institutions. But it's hard for me with MLS a

850
00:45:22,719 --> 00:45:26,680
Speaker 2: little bit because they're guaranteed their league spot and they

851
00:45:26,800 --> 00:45:30,920
Speaker 2: paid hundreds of millions of dollars to basically create a monopoly.

852
00:45:32,520 --> 00:45:36,120
Speaker 2: English football's a little different, but still there's a sense

853
00:45:36,160 --> 00:45:42,640
Speaker 2: in which these community assets are the playthings of billionaires.

854
00:45:43,280 --> 00:45:45,960
Speaker 2: I think that what makes it a little different for

855
00:45:46,040 --> 00:45:49,120
Speaker 2: me than most American sports is that one there's the

856
00:45:49,200 --> 00:45:52,360
Speaker 2: jeopardy of relegation. Even a team like Spurs can get relegated,

857
00:45:52,760 --> 00:45:58,640
Speaker 2: as we may find out in May. But secondly, there's

858
00:45:58,719 --> 00:46:01,880
Speaker 2: the fact that they are still treated as community institutions.

859
00:46:02,520 --> 00:46:04,760
Speaker 2: You know, they're not moved around the way the Baltimore

860
00:46:04,800 --> 00:46:07,399
Speaker 2: cults become, the Indianapolis cults become the God only knows

861
00:46:07,440 --> 00:46:12,600
Speaker 2: what's cults, and so I struggle a little bit with that.

862
00:46:12,800 --> 00:46:14,839
Speaker 2: I mean, the reason I love AFC Wimbledon is because

863
00:46:14,840 --> 00:46:18,319
Speaker 2: we're owned by our fans. There is no rich guy

864
00:46:18,520 --> 00:46:22,319
Speaker 2: in charge, you know, it's all the fans who make

865
00:46:22,400 --> 00:46:25,400
Speaker 2: the big decisions, and I think that's really beautiful and

866
00:46:25,440 --> 00:46:27,120
Speaker 2: should be a model for the rest of the world

867
00:46:27,160 --> 00:46:29,080
Speaker 2: and is a model in some parts of Europe, but

868
00:46:29,120 --> 00:46:32,640
Speaker 2: not most, and so it's something I struggle with. But

869
00:46:32,680 --> 00:46:34,880
Speaker 2: I do enjoy the INDI eleven games a lot, and

870
00:46:35,000 --> 00:46:38,960
Speaker 2: I enjoy I think, to Luke's question, that feeling of

871
00:46:39,040 --> 00:46:42,759
Speaker 2: ritual participation in community action is really really powerful.

872
00:46:43,680 --> 00:46:45,719
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, it's the best thing.

873
00:46:45,719 --> 00:46:47,000
Speaker 2: What about you, I mean, do you have a do

874
00:46:47,000 --> 00:46:47,920
Speaker 2: you have a team?

875
00:46:48,680 --> 00:46:52,279
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean I have a well, okay, I'll say

876
00:46:52,280 --> 00:46:55,239
Speaker 1: a couple of things. I spent a lot of time

877
00:46:55,280 --> 00:46:58,560
Speaker 1: read beul Arena when my older son, who loves football,

878
00:46:58,680 --> 00:47:02,480
Speaker 1: was was not you know, it was in middle school,

879
00:47:02,520 --> 00:47:07,919
Speaker 1: in high school. My youngest son, who's turning thirteen later

880
00:47:08,000 --> 00:47:12,279
Speaker 1: this month, doesn't care really about club soccer, only cares

881
00:47:12,280 --> 00:47:15,600
Speaker 1: about the World Cup, and so I could never interest

882
00:47:15,680 --> 00:47:18,880
Speaker 1: him in like taking the train to Harrison, New Jersey

883
00:47:18,880 --> 00:47:22,680
Speaker 1: to watch the Red Bulls games. There's a new USL

884
00:47:22,719 --> 00:47:25,640
Speaker 1: team in New York called Brooklyn FC, which when we

885
00:47:25,640 --> 00:47:28,200
Speaker 1: move back to New York, I'll probably go see a

886
00:47:28,239 --> 00:47:32,000
Speaker 1: couple of those games, see what that's like. But then

887
00:47:32,040 --> 00:47:35,600
Speaker 1: here in BA where we're living now, I just found

888
00:47:35,600 --> 00:47:41,759
Speaker 1: the the Colombian Gooner's Club and the bar that they

889
00:47:41,880 --> 00:47:45,200
Speaker 1: watched the games at and and I went to one

890
00:47:45,239 --> 00:47:48,480
Speaker 1: of the games. I went to the to the Chelsea game.

891
00:47:49,880 --> 00:47:53,520
Speaker 1: Not a classic. Not many Arsenal games are classics these days,

892
00:47:53,560 --> 00:47:56,839
Speaker 1: I will say, but it was beautiful. Man. They one

893
00:47:56,840 --> 00:48:00,279
Speaker 1: of the guys takes out of cornet and plays every

894
00:48:00,280 --> 00:48:03,600
Speaker 1: time Marsenal scores, he plays like a fanfare. There was

895
00:48:03,640 --> 00:48:07,399
Speaker 1: a man literally crying at the end of the game

896
00:48:07,440 --> 00:48:09,719
Speaker 1: because the last few minutes were so tense and ry

897
00:48:09,719 --> 00:48:11,840
Speaker 1: I had to make a couple of really brilliant saves

898
00:48:11,880 --> 00:48:17,880
Speaker 1: to to keep our our slim margin of victory. And

899
00:48:17,920 --> 00:48:19,719
Speaker 1: also this was remarkable to me was that there were

900
00:48:19,719 --> 00:48:23,400
Speaker 1: people there who recognized me as the host of and

901
00:48:23,440 --> 00:48:26,680
Speaker 1: so people kept sending me beers over, which was great.

902
00:48:27,800 --> 00:48:29,600
Speaker 2: That's fun, it is.

903
00:48:29,680 --> 00:48:33,239
Speaker 1: It was really fun. And and so it's great to.

904
00:48:33,160 --> 00:48:35,759
Speaker 2: Be recognized as the host of a radio show, you know,

905
00:48:35,960 --> 00:48:38,359
Speaker 2: like that's when you've really made it, Daniel, Like it's

906
00:48:38,360 --> 00:48:41,520
Speaker 2: you and Ira Glass who are known for being the

907
00:48:41,640 --> 00:48:44,040
Speaker 2: visible hosts of radio shows.

908
00:48:44,520 --> 00:48:47,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a it's an odd thing. It's an odd thing,

909
00:48:47,920 --> 00:48:50,239
Speaker 1: you know. I I loved it, and I think that

910
00:48:50,640 --> 00:48:55,239
Speaker 1: to answer Luke's question, the switch that Phil feels like

911
00:48:55,320 --> 00:48:59,040
Speaker 1: learning to live. I think you can create that experience

912
00:48:59,440 --> 00:49:02,879
Speaker 1: of like watching the game with friends, watching the game

913
00:49:02,920 --> 00:49:04,920
Speaker 1: with community, watching the game with other fans of the

914
00:49:04,960 --> 00:49:10,359
Speaker 1: same team sort of scratches that same itch as being

915
00:49:10,400 --> 00:49:14,960
Speaker 1: at the stadium. Sometimes it can. I have great memories

916
00:49:14,960 --> 00:49:18,120
Speaker 1: of watching you know, World Cup Finals with friends, you know,

917
00:49:18,160 --> 00:49:21,400
Speaker 1: at our house, at other people's houses, are watching big games,

918
00:49:21,480 --> 00:49:24,440
Speaker 1: even with one, you know. I remember watching the Arsenal

919
00:49:24,440 --> 00:49:28,239
Speaker 1: against the Madrid first leg last year at a bar

920
00:49:28,400 --> 00:49:30,719
Speaker 1: in Manhattan with a with ib, a friend of mine,

921
00:49:31,280 --> 00:49:34,440
Speaker 1: and man, you know, it was like we were good

922
00:49:34,440 --> 00:49:36,440
Speaker 1: friends before that and we're better friends now, you know,

923
00:49:36,560 --> 00:49:39,120
Speaker 1: like we went through that, so I didn't there's something

924
00:49:39,160 --> 00:49:42,760
Speaker 1: about that. But you know, John, if I come position

925
00:49:42,760 --> 00:49:44,759
Speaker 1: you in Annapolis, we'll go to any eleven game. How

926
00:49:44,760 --> 00:49:45,200
Speaker 1: about that?

927
00:49:45,560 --> 00:49:47,000
Speaker 2: I love it. Yeah, you got to come visit me.

928
00:49:47,960 --> 00:49:49,880
Speaker 2: We got a guest room and everything. All right, We're

929
00:49:49,920 --> 00:49:53,240
Speaker 2: gonna read this email from Raoul as well. I suspect

930
00:49:53,280 --> 00:49:57,720
Speaker 2: this Raoul is a friend of ours actually, but he writes, greetings, gentlemen.

931
00:49:58,000 --> 00:49:59,320
Speaker 2: I've been enjoying the pot of great deal, and I

932
00:49:59,320 --> 00:50:01,080
Speaker 2: have noticed a recur theme. Both of you have spoken

933
00:50:01,080 --> 00:50:02,920
Speaker 2: about the role that football has played in your relationship

934
00:50:02,960 --> 00:50:04,880
Speaker 2: with your father's not your mother's, though, and how it

935
00:50:04,880 --> 00:50:06,879
Speaker 2: has influenced your relationship with your own children. I wonder

936
00:50:06,920 --> 00:50:08,560
Speaker 2: if you could expand on the ways that football is

937
00:50:08,600 --> 00:50:11,280
Speaker 2: affected you're parenting. As I write this, I've just returned

938
00:50:11,320 --> 00:50:14,520
Speaker 2: from watching my oldest, my older daughter's final high school

939
00:50:14,520 --> 00:50:16,840
Speaker 2: basketball game. They were eliminating in the quarterfinals of the

940
00:50:16,840 --> 00:50:19,960
Speaker 2: city Championship, playing away at a school in far Rock,

941
00:50:20,040 --> 00:50:22,479
Speaker 2: Away more than twenty miles from the Upper West Side

942
00:50:22,480 --> 00:50:25,239
Speaker 2: but still technically in New York City. Cleo played amazingly well,

943
00:50:25,239 --> 00:50:26,759
Speaker 2: probably your best game of the season. And I don't

944
00:50:26,800 --> 00:50:28,719
Speaker 2: know who is sad or basketball has given her and

945
00:50:28,800 --> 00:50:30,960
Speaker 2: our family so much, and I imagine that football is

946
00:50:31,000 --> 00:50:32,719
Speaker 2: not the same for your family, so, though perhaps not

947
00:50:32,760 --> 00:50:35,120
Speaker 2: in the same way as so, can we talk about

948
00:50:35,120 --> 00:50:35,759
Speaker 2: that a little bit?

949
00:50:36,640 --> 00:50:41,239
Speaker 1: In Yeah, I think that's lovely. I mean, I, you know,

950
00:50:42,400 --> 00:50:46,840
Speaker 1: I really identify with this the kind of sense of

951
00:50:47,160 --> 00:50:54,760
Speaker 1: purpose that high school sports gave me, and the camaraderie

952
00:50:55,200 --> 00:50:59,359
Speaker 1: and the discipline. So I know sort of a lot

953
00:50:59,400 --> 00:51:03,719
Speaker 1: about what role was talking about. And I missed that

954
00:51:03,880 --> 00:51:09,120
Speaker 1: for my kids a little bit. Because Elisel plays chess,

955
00:51:09,360 --> 00:51:10,960
Speaker 1: you know, so there's a team aspect to it, but

956
00:51:10,960 --> 00:51:12,839
Speaker 1: it's very much one on one and that's his his

957
00:51:13,040 --> 00:51:15,600
Speaker 1: you know, sport. To the extent that it is a sport,

958
00:51:15,640 --> 00:51:18,440
Speaker 1: we could debate, but I mean he'll say it is,

959
00:51:18,480 --> 00:51:22,000
Speaker 1: of course. And then the thing he likes to do

960
00:51:22,080 --> 00:51:24,520
Speaker 1: is like rock climbing, which again is very individual, you know.

961
00:51:24,560 --> 00:51:26,640
Speaker 1: So I feel like that the like I wish he

962
00:51:26,719 --> 00:51:28,600
Speaker 1: were in a team because I think being part of

963
00:51:28,640 --> 00:51:31,680
Speaker 1: a team is an important thing. How about you, y'all?

964
00:51:32,880 --> 00:51:36,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, my son is a boxer, and so he loves,

965
00:51:37,440 --> 00:51:42,120
Speaker 2: really loves boxing and watching boxing and the science of

966
00:51:42,160 --> 00:51:46,440
Speaker 2: it and the you know the complexity of movement and

967
00:51:47,120 --> 00:51:51,080
Speaker 2: defense and all that stuff. But again, there's not that

968
00:51:51,160 --> 00:51:53,600
Speaker 2: sense of camaraderie that you have when you're on a team,

969
00:51:54,360 --> 00:51:56,480
Speaker 2: especially a team that spends a lot of time together.

970
00:51:57,160 --> 00:51:58,680
Speaker 2: You know. He has a sense of camaraderie with the

971
00:51:58,680 --> 00:52:00,920
Speaker 2: people he shares the gym with, but it's a little different.

972
00:52:00,960 --> 00:52:04,759
Speaker 1: I think, I think there to hit each other. Yeah,

973
00:52:04,800 --> 00:52:06,920
Speaker 1: I was gonna say that. I think that watching your

974
00:52:07,000 --> 00:52:09,680
Speaker 1: kid play basketball, although of course injuries can always happen,

975
00:52:09,760 --> 00:52:12,799
Speaker 1: is different from watching your child in a ring with

976
00:52:12,840 --> 00:52:14,560
Speaker 1: another person. That wants to punch him in the face.

977
00:52:15,400 --> 00:52:20,320
Speaker 2: Uh is it hard to watch some box? He doesn't

978
00:52:20,360 --> 00:52:24,479
Speaker 2: box much. He's not really allowed to box the way

979
00:52:24,520 --> 00:52:27,160
Speaker 2: that he wishes he were, and indeed the way that

980
00:52:27,200 --> 00:52:29,920
Speaker 2: his coach wishes he were. He's his coach is always like,

981
00:52:31,120 --> 00:52:34,120
Speaker 2: she's always like he's so good, and I was, I'm like,

982
00:52:34,200 --> 00:52:36,120
Speaker 2: I don't. I don't really care how good he is.

983
00:52:36,640 --> 00:52:40,680
Speaker 2: You know, it doesn't really matter. He's not he's not

984
00:52:40,719 --> 00:52:44,240
Speaker 2: going to go pro in this because his dad will

985
00:52:44,680 --> 00:52:47,919
Speaker 2: do everything in his power to prevent that. Right.

986
00:52:48,040 --> 00:52:51,239
Speaker 1: It's like, right before the boxing match, you know, a

987
00:52:51,320 --> 00:52:55,200
Speaker 1: streaker comes on the ring and it's like.

988
00:52:55,160 --> 00:52:55,560
Speaker 2: Who's that.

989
00:52:55,680 --> 00:53:00,600
Speaker 1: Oh, it's you know, the box his dad. He's oh,

990
00:53:00,640 --> 00:53:04,160
Speaker 1: now he's changed himself to the to the to the ring.

991
00:53:04,239 --> 00:53:04,960
Speaker 1: He won't get up.

992
00:53:07,239 --> 00:53:07,479
Speaker 2: Yeah.

993
00:53:07,480 --> 00:53:08,600
Speaker 1: I would do the same thing.

994
00:53:08,560 --> 00:53:11,239
Speaker 2: John, you know, like thank you, you know, thank you.

995
00:53:11,840 --> 00:53:14,399
Speaker 1: Chess is a non contact sport, but any sale takes

996
00:53:14,400 --> 00:53:17,880
Speaker 1: every loss very seriously. There's emotional pain. It's not a

997
00:53:18,160 --> 00:53:18,799
Speaker 1: physical pain.

998
00:53:18,880 --> 00:53:21,400
Speaker 2: It's not physical pain. Yeah. And then my daughter is

999
00:53:21,760 --> 00:53:24,759
Speaker 2: a really good volleyball player, and I do love that

1000
00:53:24,920 --> 00:53:27,440
Speaker 2: for her. I love that she's able to be on

1001
00:53:27,480 --> 00:53:29,840
Speaker 2: a team that they're so encouraging of each other, that

1002
00:53:29,880 --> 00:53:32,000
Speaker 2: they fight for each other, that they love each other.

1003
00:53:32,640 --> 00:53:37,040
Speaker 2: That's all you want from your experience of adolescence, I think,

1004
00:53:37,239 --> 00:53:41,239
Speaker 2: is to have friends who love you with that ferocity

1005
00:53:41,440 --> 00:53:47,000
Speaker 2: that you experience in high school, you know. And I

1006
00:53:47,040 --> 00:53:49,200
Speaker 2: was really lucky to have those friends, even though I

1007
00:53:49,360 --> 00:53:53,640
Speaker 2: wasn't on the soccer team or the basketball team. And

1008
00:53:53,680 --> 00:53:55,960
Speaker 2: I know you feel that way about the folks that

1009
00:53:56,040 --> 00:53:57,239
Speaker 2: were on the soccer team with you.

1010
00:53:57,920 --> 00:54:00,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure, for sure. And you know, you know,

1011
00:54:00,800 --> 00:54:03,160
Speaker 1: if all goes well, thirty years later you can have

1012
00:54:03,200 --> 00:54:04,240
Speaker 1: a podcast together.

1013
00:54:04,360 --> 00:54:07,680
Speaker 2: So yeah, I mean, if you're really lucky, if.

1014
00:54:07,600 --> 00:54:10,800
Speaker 1: You're really lucky. Okay, Roll continues, and I want to

1015
00:54:10,840 --> 00:54:14,200
Speaker 1: read the last bit here. He says, in two episodes,

1016
00:54:14,200 --> 00:54:16,120
Speaker 1: at least you spoke about talent and effort as they

1017
00:54:16,120 --> 00:54:18,440
Speaker 1: relate to success, and I'm curious what you think about

1018
00:54:18,480 --> 00:54:20,840
Speaker 1: what I see as a bit of a contradiction. On

1019
00:54:20,880 --> 00:54:22,640
Speaker 1: the one hand, we as parents often tell our kids

1020
00:54:22,680 --> 00:54:24,760
Speaker 1: that if they just work hard at something, usually school,

1021
00:54:24,800 --> 00:54:27,239
Speaker 1: but it could be art, music, theater, even writing, they

1022
00:54:27,239 --> 00:54:29,400
Speaker 1: will succeed, and the same is often true for sport.

1023
00:54:29,880 --> 00:54:33,040
Speaker 1: There are, however, cruel limitations which when it comes to sport,

1024
00:54:33,200 --> 00:54:35,720
Speaker 1: we usually have no trouble recognizing and explaining to our children.

1025
00:54:35,960 --> 00:54:37,839
Speaker 1: When it comes to school work, I'm reluctant to tell

1026
00:54:37,840 --> 00:54:39,800
Speaker 1: them that hard work may not lead to the results

1027
00:54:39,840 --> 00:54:42,359
Speaker 1: they want. Sometimes people are just talented, and talents are

1028
00:54:42,360 --> 00:54:45,280
Speaker 1: not equally distributed throughout a population. Have you come across

1029
00:54:45,280 --> 00:54:47,760
Speaker 1: this issue in your parenting? And if so, has football

1030
00:54:47,800 --> 00:54:50,279
Speaker 1: provided you any guidance? Keep up the good work, both

1031
00:54:50,320 --> 00:54:52,440
Speaker 1: with the pod and everything else, and Roll says, stop

1032
00:54:52,480 --> 00:54:55,560
Speaker 1: making fun of Sean. I just don't feel like we're

1033
00:54:55,560 --> 00:54:55,759
Speaker 1: making it.

1034
00:54:56,200 --> 00:54:57,200
Speaker 2: We're making fun of Sean.

1035
00:54:57,480 --> 00:54:59,080
Speaker 1: We love Sean. We love Sean.

1036
00:54:59,280 --> 00:55:02,280
Speaker 2: Sean is my fa hey saw no respected, No disrespect

1037
00:55:02,280 --> 00:55:04,719
Speaker 2: to Daniel, but Seawan is my favorite person on the podcast.

1038
00:55:05,280 --> 00:55:10,000
Speaker 1: Absolutely, yeah mine too? Yeah disrespected? John, Yeah, I'm taking it.

1039
00:55:10,000 --> 00:55:12,600
Speaker 2: Well, all right, okay, heard heard?

1040
00:55:13,160 --> 00:55:16,880
Speaker 1: Yes, thank you Rol for your question. And yeah, do

1041
00:55:17,000 --> 00:55:18,920
Speaker 1: do you have any any guidance on that?

1042
00:55:19,560 --> 00:55:21,759
Speaker 2: Yeah? I mean I think a lot of times, the

1043
00:55:21,800 --> 00:55:24,400
Speaker 2: stuff that we're talented at and the stuff that we

1044
00:55:24,440 --> 00:55:27,880
Speaker 2: get positive feedback for are the same stuff. And you know,

1045
00:55:27,960 --> 00:55:29,560
Speaker 2: at least when I was a kid, all I want

1046
00:55:29,760 --> 00:55:31,279
Speaker 2: I don't even know if I'm a good writer. I

1047
00:55:31,320 --> 00:55:32,680
Speaker 2: was just told that I was a good writer when

1048
00:55:32,680 --> 00:55:34,319
Speaker 2: I was in third grade, and as a result, I

1049
00:55:34,360 --> 00:55:36,399
Speaker 2: worked really hard on writing. It's hard to know what

1050
00:55:36,440 --> 00:55:39,960
Speaker 2: the what the line was, you know, was I was

1051
00:55:40,000 --> 00:55:42,040
Speaker 2: I actually talented? Or was I just told that I

1052
00:55:42,080 --> 00:55:43,960
Speaker 2: was talented? And so I worked really hard on it

1053
00:55:44,000 --> 00:55:46,719
Speaker 2: because I wanted the affirmation of adults. I never know

1054
00:55:47,640 --> 00:55:50,560
Speaker 2: where that falls, do you right?

1055
00:55:51,000 --> 00:55:52,759
Speaker 1: Yeah, No, I think that's fair. I mean I think

1056
00:55:52,800 --> 00:55:55,880
Speaker 1: that that it's you know, you can ever do a

1057
00:55:55,880 --> 00:55:58,600
Speaker 1: double blind study with your kids in terms of like

1058
00:55:58,840 --> 00:56:01,640
Speaker 1: different ways to raise them, and you're always sort of

1059
00:56:01,640 --> 00:56:03,200
Speaker 1: trying to figure out the right way to do it,

1060
00:56:03,239 --> 00:56:09,520
Speaker 1: and and you know, the between pushing them and encouraging them.

1061
00:56:09,719 --> 00:56:11,160
Speaker 1: I was just thinking about that, you know, the intense

1062
00:56:11,200 --> 00:56:14,359
Speaker 1: academic pressure that I was raised in, you know, with

1063
00:56:14,680 --> 00:56:20,120
Speaker 1: uh and that caused me grave anxiety. It's so different

1064
00:56:20,600 --> 00:56:23,760
Speaker 1: like what the way I raised my kids, you know. Yeah,

1065
00:56:23,960 --> 00:56:26,400
Speaker 1: but there's no way too, there's no way I have

1066
00:56:26,480 --> 00:56:30,759
Speaker 1: of knowing if I am who I am because I

1067
00:56:30,960 --> 00:56:34,880
Speaker 1: was told that I had to, you know, get perfect grades,

1068
00:56:36,000 --> 00:56:39,239
Speaker 1: and if that sort of learning to deal with that

1069
00:56:39,320 --> 00:56:42,000
Speaker 1: anxiety and that pressure when I was young has helped

1070
00:56:42,040 --> 00:56:45,120
Speaker 1: me in situations as an adult. Having said that, I

1071
00:56:45,120 --> 00:56:47,560
Speaker 1: have a much more lesly fair attitude with my kids

1072
00:56:48,400 --> 00:56:51,560
Speaker 1: or and I find it difficult to implement the kind

1073
00:56:51,600 --> 00:56:54,279
Speaker 1: of pressure that my parents put on me with great

1074
00:56:54,280 --> 00:56:57,360
Speaker 1: intentions and you know, with with you know, decent results

1075
00:56:58,000 --> 00:57:00,640
Speaker 1: on my own children. I just don't see how how

1076
00:57:00,680 --> 00:57:01,120
Speaker 1: to do it.

1077
00:57:01,360 --> 00:57:02,919
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm very much in the same boat.

1078
00:57:02,960 --> 00:57:03,920
Speaker 1: It doesn't feel natural to me.

1079
00:57:04,320 --> 00:57:06,440
Speaker 2: It doesn't feel natural to me, it doesn't feel right

1080
00:57:06,480 --> 00:57:08,920
Speaker 2: to me. And so I'm raising my kids very differently

1081
00:57:08,920 --> 00:57:12,799
Speaker 2: from how I was raised. Probably that said, like, my

1082
00:57:12,920 --> 00:57:17,120
Speaker 2: parents were very supportive of my writing. They just wanted

1083
00:57:17,160 --> 00:57:19,200
Speaker 2: me to take it as seriously as I would take

1084
00:57:19,200 --> 00:57:21,760
Speaker 2: going to med school. You know. They were very supportive

1085
00:57:21,760 --> 00:57:23,240
Speaker 2: of the idea of me being a writer or a

1086
00:57:23,280 --> 00:57:26,360
Speaker 2: creator or whatever. But they wanted me to take it

1087
00:57:26,400 --> 00:57:29,040
Speaker 2: as seriously as as I would, you know, being a

1088
00:57:29,040 --> 00:57:32,760
Speaker 2: warrior or whatever. And I kind of have. And yeah,

1089
00:57:32,800 --> 00:57:37,120
Speaker 2: to your point, it's it's been effective in a lot

1090
00:57:37,160 --> 00:57:39,600
Speaker 2: of ways. But the way that we raise our kids

1091
00:57:39,640 --> 00:57:43,800
Speaker 2: is very much to school is important, you know, But

1092
00:57:44,160 --> 00:57:49,000
Speaker 2: but school is not the only important thing in your life. Yeah, right,

1093
00:57:49,800 --> 00:57:51,960
Speaker 2: I hear you, And you know, and I just want

1094
00:57:52,000 --> 00:57:53,840
Speaker 2: to I just want to take a second, Daniel, if

1095
00:57:53,840 --> 00:57:56,200
Speaker 2: I can to say how disappointed I am in you

1096
00:57:56,240 --> 00:57:57,360
Speaker 2: for not becoming a doctor.

1097
00:57:58,640 --> 00:58:03,080
Speaker 1: It's a huge letdown. Yeah, you know what. The die

1098
00:58:03,200 --> 00:58:07,560
Speaker 1: was cast and we had to dissect the like and like.

1099
00:58:10,080 --> 00:58:10,320
Speaker 2: Pig.

1100
00:58:10,960 --> 00:58:11,160
Speaker 5: Yeh.

1101
00:58:12,120 --> 00:58:14,280
Speaker 2: When we had to dissect that fetal pig, I was like,

1102
00:58:14,360 --> 00:58:16,520
Speaker 2: this is all over for me, Sean. Can you come

1103
00:58:16,560 --> 00:58:18,440
Speaker 2: back on so we can talk quickly about dissecting the

1104
00:58:18,480 --> 00:58:19,640
Speaker 2: fetal pig. Do you remember that.

1105
00:58:20,000 --> 00:58:28,520
Speaker 6: I just got a waft of formaldehyde and uh psychosomatic formaldehyde.

1106
00:58:28,560 --> 00:58:31,560
Speaker 6: That's uh yeah, I may or may not be in

1107
00:58:31,600 --> 00:58:34,960
Speaker 6: my in my office, but yeah, that was uh, that's

1108
00:58:35,080 --> 00:58:37,840
Speaker 6: that too, is why I that's the only reason I

1109
00:58:37,880 --> 00:58:38,880
Speaker 6: did not become a doctor.

1110
00:58:39,560 --> 00:58:47,480
Speaker 2: Yes, otherwise otherwise yeah, yeah, just three people pursuing the

1111
00:58:47,560 --> 00:58:49,880
Speaker 2: creative life for fear of fetal pigs.

1112
00:58:50,040 --> 00:58:53,440
Speaker 1: Exactly, exactly. Now. Just to finish with with Raoul's question,

1113
00:58:53,520 --> 00:58:55,600
Speaker 1: I think that you always I mean, at least I

1114
00:58:55,840 --> 00:58:57,840
Speaker 1: would never tell my kids there's something that they can't do.

1115
00:58:59,320 --> 00:59:01,240
Speaker 1: I think I would always sort of be upfront with

1116
00:59:01,280 --> 00:59:04,520
Speaker 1: my kids about the risks and the challenges and the

1117
00:59:04,880 --> 00:59:08,560
Speaker 1: work that would be required to do. It. But I

1118
00:59:08,600 --> 00:59:11,480
Speaker 1: can't imagine never telling my kids they weren't talented enough

1119
00:59:11,480 --> 00:59:15,560
Speaker 1: to pull something off because people surprise you, and you know,

1120
00:59:15,680 --> 00:59:18,560
Speaker 1: who are you really to say? I have heard many

1121
00:59:18,600 --> 00:59:23,880
Speaker 1: examples of famous, successful writers who have or this, even

1122
00:59:23,880 --> 00:59:25,800
Speaker 1: a guy on my staff at Roan Bulante who was

1123
00:59:25,840 --> 00:59:29,760
Speaker 1: told by a journalism professor that he would never be

1124
00:59:29,800 --> 00:59:30,480
Speaker 1: a journalist.

1125
00:59:30,760 --> 00:59:33,400
Speaker 2: I didn't get into the advanced fiction writing class at

1126
00:59:33,440 --> 00:59:36,600
Speaker 2: Kendon College. There were fifteen applicants for twelve spots and

1127
00:59:36,640 --> 00:59:40,600
Speaker 2: I didn't get in. I remember that, and look, yeah,

1128
00:59:40,600 --> 00:59:45,640
Speaker 2: I know you remembered it. I told everybody, yeah, traumatic

1129
00:59:46,880 --> 00:59:50,439
Speaker 2: and look now, man, yeah you're yeah, God, I still

1130
00:59:50,440 --> 00:59:51,160
Speaker 2: couldn't get in.

1131
00:59:51,560 --> 00:59:53,200
Speaker 1: You're like the abes.

1132
00:59:54,080 --> 00:59:58,600
Speaker 2: Of writers said, I couldn't make it, but I did.

1133
00:59:59,320 --> 01:00:02,480
Speaker 1: He sed it, all right, all right, that's all the

1134
01:00:02,520 --> 01:00:05,480
Speaker 1: time we have for today. On the away end, remember

1135
01:00:05,520 --> 01:00:08,480
Speaker 1: to keep sending us your emails away ndpod at gmail

1136
01:00:08,560 --> 01:00:13,560
Speaker 1: dot com. Sean, thank you, John in Jamaica. Thank you.

1137
01:00:14,480 --> 01:00:16,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, thanks everybody for listening this.

1138
01:00:16,360 --> 01:00:17,200
Speaker 1: We'll see you next week.