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Speaker 1: Ruby.

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Speaker 2: There's nothing wrong about applying for benefits. You pay into

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Speaker 2: them during your employment. You need to get them if

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Speaker 2: you need them. That's what it's there for. A lot

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Speaker 2: of people need to just like set their pride aside

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Speaker 2: and get your unemployment benefits if you're eligible.

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Speaker 3: So let's say your boss schedules a mysterious quick check

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Speaker 3: in for four point thirty on a Friday.

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Speaker 4: Immediate stomach drop. No, nobody has ever heard quick check

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Speaker 4: in and thought, oh good, probably a surprise raise I

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Speaker 4: was hoping for, Not even once.

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Speaker 3: It usually means a layoff, and right now layoffs are

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Speaker 3: hitting a lot of industries, so the chances are someone

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Speaker 3: you know who's gone through it recently raises hand.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: And sometimes it's not even a quick check in with

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Speaker 4: your manager you find out via email. Quite rude, rude,

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Speaker 4: very rude. Which is why today we're talking about what

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Speaker 4: to actually do if you get laid off, like the

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Speaker 4: practical stuff that nobody explains in the moment because your

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Speaker 4: brain is too swirly to think straight.

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Speaker 3: You're thinking severance unemployment health insurance LinkedIn updates, whether or

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Speaker 3: not you should panic pivot to a new career.

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Speaker 4: Maybe, and how to handle the emotional side without immediately

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Speaker 4: spiraling into well, I guess it's seventy cent ramen for

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Speaker 4: me from now on.

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Speaker 3: And honestly, getting laid off can feel deeply personal, even

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Speaker 3: when it's through no fault of your own.

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Speaker 4: Welcome back to grown Up Stuff, the podcast where we

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Speaker 4: figure out all the things you feel like you should

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Speaker 4: know by now but maybe don't because I know I don't.

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Speaker 4: I'm Leah Palmery.

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Speaker 1: And I'm Matt Stillow.

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Speaker 3: So Today the grown up Guide to layoffs, What to

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Speaker 3: do first, what not to do, and how to make

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Speaker 3: a plan when your life suddenly gets very weird. Our

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Speaker 3: guest today is Page Sparks from Sparks Legal, an employment

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Speaker 3: lawyer who litigates cases for employees.

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Speaker 4: But first, a quick disclaimer before we get started.

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Speaker 2: I just want to say these are all just my thoughts,

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Speaker 2: and these are general questions we're answering. If you do

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Speaker 2: you have specific legal situation that you want legal advice on,

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Speaker 2: definitely check with the lawyer in your state.

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Speaker 5: I love it.

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Speaker 1: I could have set it better myself. Well so.

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Speaker 3: The Bureau of Labor Statistics says somewhere between fourteen and

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Speaker 3: twenty million people in the US get laid off or

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Speaker 3: let go every single year. And that number isn't just

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Speaker 3: the massive corporate layoffs you see in the headlines. It

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Speaker 3: includes everything from seasonal jobs ending, to companies downsizing, to

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Speaker 3: individual employees getting fired.

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Speaker 1: Basically, this is way.

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Speaker 3: More common than most of us realize until, of course

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Speaker 3: it happens to us.

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Speaker 4: Once you are laid off from a job, your head

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Speaker 4: is very swirly and there's a lot going on, and

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Speaker 4: you just have to put one foot in front.

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Speaker 1: Of the other.

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Speaker 4: So what should you absolutely not do in the first

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Speaker 4: forty eight hours after being laid off? And that's both

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Speaker 4: financially and emotionally great question.

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Speaker 2: So the first thing you should not do if you

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Speaker 2: get noticed that you're being laid off is do not panic.

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Speaker 2: This is not a scarlet letter on you. This is

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Speaker 2: actually quite common and the worst thing you can do

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Speaker 2: to yourself is panic and spiral from there. Instead, a

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Speaker 2: process you can start in is like review the paperwork.

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Speaker 5: They gave you.

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Speaker 2: Did they give you Cobra paperwork? Are you going to

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Speaker 2: opt into that? There's no need to panic. I know

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Speaker 2: it's easier said than done when you are in that situation,

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Speaker 2: but it's really a common thing and it can be

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Speaker 2: a lot less scarier than people think.

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Speaker 4: Okay, COBRA paperwork. So that has to do with health

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Speaker 4: insurance coverage, right, Can you explain that a little bit

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Speaker 4: more so.

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Speaker 2: Cobra is basically, if you get notified to your employments

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Speaker 2: ending what do they call it a qualifying event. So

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Speaker 2: if the certain events happen, they have to give you

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Speaker 2: COBRA notice and so using layoff as the example, they

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Speaker 2: have to give you the COBRA notice within a certain

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Speaker 2: amount of time. And it's basically a higher premium you're

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Speaker 2: paying to get your health insurance continued out. It can

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Speaker 2: be up to eighteen months. I've seen it a little

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Speaker 2: bit less. It's going to be depending on what you

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Speaker 2: agree to. You have to opt into it. But in

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Speaker 2: order to opt in, it's the employer's burden. It's their obligation.

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Speaker 2: They have to provide you all the information and the

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Speaker 2: COBRA paperwork on what to do, the timelines, the deadlines,

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Speaker 2: and when to opt in, and like the actual dollar amounts. Now,

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Speaker 2: a lot of these mom and pop places aren't doing

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Speaker 2: this lately. Yeah, and so there can be penalties. By

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Speaker 2: the day they could have like one hundred dollars fine

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Speaker 2: per day if this is an issue, and reimbursement for

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Speaker 2: costs if you have a lapse in coverage and you're

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Speaker 2: required to pay something out of pocket or you have bills.

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Speaker 4: Are there deadlines that people should be aware of when

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Speaker 4: it comes to continuing benefits.

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Speaker 2: So if you want to continue your benefits through Cobra,

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Speaker 2: you do have usually sixty days to opt in through

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Speaker 2: that paperwork if you want to extend the benefits. Now,

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Speaker 2: sometimes we see the employer doesn't provide the paper work

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Speaker 2: in time, so you can continue it from the date

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Speaker 2: you're finally giving it.

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Speaker 3: I didn't even know what it was, so like, I

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Speaker 3: just think it's an important thing for people that know

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Speaker 3: that if you do get laid off, there is a

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Speaker 3: path to continue your healthcare, not only for you but

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Speaker 3: for your family. It's a little bit of a difficult

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Speaker 3: process to navigate, but it is there.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, no wonder why it's named after a snake because

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Speaker 4: it's very slippery.

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Speaker 5: True and very scary.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, yes, but actually they should be more afraid

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Speaker 2: of you with the Cobra if they mess up to Obra.

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Speaker 5: But yeah, that is a good name for it.

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Speaker 2: It's a scary situation and it's expensive, so you don't

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Speaker 2: have to do the COBRA. You could look at marketplace

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Speaker 2: options or other options because it is expensive, but it's

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Speaker 2: better for some individuals to do that instead of not

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Speaker 2: having coverage and then you have all these medical debt

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Speaker 2: out of pocket.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and you may need to change your provider depending

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Speaker 3: on what's available in the marketplace or what you can afford,

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Speaker 3: and so yeah, to be able to stick with the.

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Speaker 1: Same insurance can be super helpful.

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Speaker 3: So that said, I think a lot of people feel

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Speaker 3: like they don't have any sort of rights. So what

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Speaker 3: is important for people to know? What rights do they

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Speaker 3: have when they're laid off.

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Speaker 2: One of the rights you have if your employer's eligible

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Speaker 2: is getting COBRA for an example. Your rights don't just

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Speaker 2: disappear when you're laid off. Still have employment rights as

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Speaker 2: an employee. You just have maybe what we would view

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Speaker 2: as less compared to the employer. Especially most states are

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Speaker 2: at will employment. That means you can be fired or

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Speaker 2: laid off anytime for any reason, as long as it's

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Speaker 2: not an illegal reason. An example we want to look

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Speaker 2: out for is when we're looking at even mass layoffs,

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Speaker 2: is that they're not selecting everyone with FMLA, and so

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Speaker 2: your rights don't disappear just because you get noticed you're

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Speaker 2: getting laid off. It's just there is a process you

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Speaker 2: have to follow. But if you have engaged in any

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Speaker 2: protected activity like reporting discrimination, retaliation, filing a whistleblower complaint,

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Speaker 2: or a worker's compensation claim for example, and then you're

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Speaker 2: laid off, then we may want to look at it

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Speaker 2: a little further because we want to make sure you're

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Speaker 2: not waiving any of those rights if you sign to

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Speaker 2: accept the severance, for example.

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Speaker 3: So let's take a quick second to define FMLA. That

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Speaker 3: stands for the Family and Medical Leave Act, and basically

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Speaker 3: it's a law that says if you're dealing with a

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Speaker 3: serious health issue or caring for a close family member

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Speaker 3: who is you may be entitled to take on paid

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Speaker 3: job protected leave without losing your position. It can also

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Speaker 3: apply after having a baby or adopting a child. Now

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Speaker 3: there are rules around who qualifies and how big the

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Speaker 3: company has to be, but the main idea is your

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Speaker 3: employer can't just write you off because you need time

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Speaker 3: away for legitimate medical or family reasons.

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Speaker 4: How does a layoff differ legally from being fired for cause?

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Speaker 4: And what are the implications because they both feel bad,

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Speaker 4: But like, what is actually the difference between those two categories.

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Speaker 2: Sure, it's never fun to end your employment no matter

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Speaker 2: what happens, like it's always going to be a transitional

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Speaker 2: period and it's always the unknown as scary. But it

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Speaker 2: is better to be laid off than fired for cause.

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Speaker 2: If you're fired for cause, you usually cannot get benefits

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Speaker 2: like unemployment benefits. If you're laid off due to no

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Speaker 2: fault of your own, you can apply for that and

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Speaker 2: as long as there's no issue, you probably receive it.

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Speaker 2: So I do think it is better, especially in a resume.

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Speaker 5: A lot of.

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Speaker 2: Employers are way more understanding of a company layoff maybe

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Speaker 2: gap in a resume instead of you explaining why you

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Speaker 2: got fired for popping off or policy violation or attendance

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Speaker 2: or something. I do think a lot of employers view

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Speaker 2: it a little more favorably than if you were terminated

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Speaker 2: for cause.

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Speaker 4: Popping off is the legal HR term that they use

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Speaker 4: when they have to fire somebody to let's just be

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Speaker 4: clear on that, right. I have popped off myself, so

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Speaker 4: I tell you it's not fun. There's consequences sometimes, you know,

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Speaker 4: but it's more common than a lot of people think

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Speaker 4: there's nothing to be ashamed of if you're laid off.

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Speaker 2: It's very normal. But I think that's why people view

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Speaker 2: it differently. As far as from the employer end of it,

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Speaker 2: it's a little more understandable. You had nothing to do

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Speaker 2: with it, You couldn't help it, right.

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Speaker 3: I wonder also, like within those two things, because it

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Speaker 3: does seem like you could get into like a he said,

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Speaker 3: she said thing where an employer is saying they fired

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Speaker 3: you for cause, but maybe there was underlying circumstances that

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Speaker 3: aren't coming to light. Is there like a way to

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Speaker 3: like fight that process if one person says one thing

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Speaker 3: versus another.

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Speaker 5: Absolutely?

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Speaker 2: So. I'll use unemployment benefits for an example. So if

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Speaker 2: you apply, which I would immediately do that, if you

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Speaker 2: get noticed that you're about to be laid off, I

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Speaker 2: would immediately apply for unemployment benefits because that can take

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Speaker 2: a while, the process can be slow, it will vary

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Speaker 2: on how your state is processing things. But in response

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Speaker 2: to that, once you get that process started, the employer

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Speaker 2: will get the opportunity to respond and say if you

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Speaker 2: were fired for cause, now when you fill out the paperwork,

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Speaker 2: I would be as specific as possible with the timeline

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Speaker 2: and attach the layoff documents like the notification. If you're

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Speaker 2: able to do that that way, you're kind of starting

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Speaker 2: setting the scene of I was not fired for cause,

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Speaker 2: I was notified on this date, I'm being terminated, I'm

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Speaker 2: eligible for benefits if they can test it.

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Speaker 5: They have to be able to back up what they say.

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Speaker 2: They can't just say no, you shouldn't get benefits because

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Speaker 2: you're fired for cause.

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Speaker 5: Period. They have to provide reasons why. Now.

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Speaker 2: I think that a lot of employers will probably have

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Speaker 2: a process and step in place that is going to

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Speaker 2: flag any unemployment claims from a layoff that they already

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Speaker 2: knew was coming. But for example, like with my employment cases,

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Speaker 2: that happens all the time where we say he was

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Speaker 2: fired because you wouldnt accommodate him, and they say, no,

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Speaker 2: he got too many attendance points. Well, the employer responds,

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Speaker 2: and then you can do what's called a rebuttal. You

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Speaker 2: have a window of time to do that, so make

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Speaker 2: sure you don't miss it. You get noticed in the mail,

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Speaker 2: send your appeal window, and then the next step would

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Speaker 2: be a hearing.

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Speaker 3: Because I can understand, like I'm sure most corporations it's

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Speaker 3: a pretty standard practice and there's all this documentation and stuff,

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Speaker 3: but I'm thinking like for smaller companies where there's only

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Speaker 3: a few employees that could maybe not have as much documentation,

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Speaker 3: and then there's more personal relationships kind of come into

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Speaker 3: the fray and so interesting.

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Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, we see that a lot. Not to segue

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Speaker 2: into too much personal stuff, but I love when a

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Speaker 2: company sends a non lawyer in that situation to represent

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Speaker 2: the company, because I'm like, Okay, I get to be

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Speaker 2: psycho for an hour, and my therapist that I can

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Speaker 2: because it's for work, so buckle up.

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Speaker 5: But yeah, some.

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Speaker 2: Definitely do or they'll send their poor HR person who

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Speaker 2: knows that stuff probably better than I do, but they

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Speaker 2: don't know how to do the questions in the lawn,

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Speaker 2: like what the burden and the statute is, So anyone

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Speaker 2: who's diying and unemployment appeal again, this is just informational

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Speaker 2: only if it's a phone hearing, ride it all down,

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Speaker 2: look up the statute. That way you know what your

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Speaker 2: requirements are to prove. So if you're strying to say

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Speaker 2: you get unemployment benefits and they say you're fired for cause,

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Speaker 2: google that write it all in a word document including

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Speaker 2: everything you want to say. That way, when you're panicking

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Speaker 2: on the phone, you can just read it and you

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Speaker 2: already did all your homework. But that's an example of

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Speaker 2: you have the same resources going into it as the

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Speaker 2: HR person showing up for the company. But yeah, sometimes

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Speaker 2: the smaller companies they just have to make do with

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Speaker 2: what they have if they even show up. A lot

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Speaker 2: of the times they don't even show up to the

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Speaker 2: appeal hearing.

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Speaker 4: I'm always here for a time for page to pop

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Speaker 4: off legally, so semi crazy, yes, exactly. One other element

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Speaker 4: I want to talk about too is severance. So a

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Speaker 4: lot of times if you are laid off, you will

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Speaker 4: get some severance hopefully. Is severance pay required or is

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Speaker 4: it just like a oh, look, how nice we are.

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Speaker 4: We're giving you some money because we're changing your whole

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Speaker 4: entire life right now. How much is a company required

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Speaker 4: to actually provide that versus is it just a nice to.

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Speaker 2: Have more of the second? Unless you have a contract

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Speaker 2: saying that you're entitled to employment during a certain time

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Speaker 2: period or some other kind of contractual obligation, or maybe

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Speaker 2: a state law. I know some states are kind of

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Speaker 2: the Wild West, like California, and Washington State may do

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Speaker 2: this a little differently, but normally you are not entitled

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Speaker 2: to receive a severance of employment ends unless you have

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Speaker 2: a contract stating otherwise. Now, if you're offered severance, that's

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Speaker 2: always great, like you said, a nice thing to have,

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Speaker 2: and usually it's like one pay period, sometimes less, sometimes

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Speaker 2: a little more. I would say that's pretty average. Now,

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Speaker 2: the only way we can really negotiate the severance is

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Speaker 2: if we have claims to leverage with it. So like

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Speaker 2: those examples I was saying earlier, if you reported sexual

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Speaker 2: harassment and then you could notice you're being laid off

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Speaker 2: two days later, obviously we're gonna want to leverage that

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Speaker 2: because that can add more value to the claim. Because

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Speaker 2: you engage in protected activity, now we can allege retaliation.

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Speaker 2: But your average person usually that hasn't happened. This usually

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Speaker 2: comes out of nowhere, and unfortunately, you usually do not

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Speaker 2: have a right to severance. There's some like myths going

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Speaker 2: around online that's like you get X amount of months

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Speaker 2: for every year you've been working. There's no such thing.

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Speaker 2: That'd be nice if they all followed it. There's no

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Speaker 2: like federal guideline or regulation requiring that though unfortunately, is.

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Speaker 4: There something that you should look for or negotiate within

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Speaker 4: a severance.

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Speaker 2: Package before you sign a severance obviously read it very carefully,

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Speaker 2: know what you're agreeing to. I would not sign a

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Speaker 2: severance agreement that didn't have mutual protection. So what you

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Speaker 2: want to look for is that if it's this confidentiality

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Speaker 2: in there, both parties should have equal duty and burden

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Speaker 2: under that. It shouldn't just be one sided. Now the

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Speaker 2: company's writing it, so they will always want to write

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Speaker 2: it in their favor. It may say like non disparagement,

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Speaker 2: but no one there is being limited from disparaging you

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Speaker 2: or things like that. So if you want to suggest

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Speaker 2: changes like that, you can always respond. You don't have

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Speaker 2: to sign it as is. Just know that usually under

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Speaker 2: contract law, making changes like that is considered a counter offer,

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Speaker 2: So they could revoke the severance altogether. I think that'd

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Speaker 2: be kind of unusual if we're dealing with like a

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Speaker 2: mass scale layoff, because they just want to button everything

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Speaker 2: up and move on.

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Speaker 5: But it's possible.

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Speaker 2: So if I was someone who wanted to change us

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Speaker 2: to an agreement, what's the saying. It's like hungry mouse,

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Speaker 2: don't get fed unless you ask or something like that.

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Speaker 1: I would ask, Squeaky Wheel, Yeah.

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Speaker 5: Squeaky Wheel gets the oil.

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Speaker 2: Yes, And so I would always ask, and probably the

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Speaker 2: worst case scenario is they're like, no, you can sign

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Speaker 2: it as is, though you have until Friday or whatever.

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Speaker 2: That's what I would do if it had any questionable terms.

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Speaker 2: I'd also look at the governing law of the severance agreement.

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Speaker 2: So usually any contract, if it's written by not AI

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Speaker 2: and like a real lawyer or person, it's going to

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Speaker 2: have a governing law. It'll be like, for example, here,

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Speaker 2: it'd be like this severance agreement is governed by the

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Speaker 2: state law of Missouri or something like that, and so

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Speaker 2: we want to make sure that if you're signing that,

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Speaker 2: I would only want to sign that if it was

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Speaker 2: in the state I was in keep an eye out

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Speaker 2: for that, because when we're looking at these bigger companies,

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Speaker 2: if you're working in Missouri and you sign a contract

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Speaker 2: governed by the laws of California, if you ever want

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Speaker 2: to enforce that contract or the company wants to enforce

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Speaker 2: that contract ensue you, it's going to be in California.

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Speaker 2: So it's just like one of the things I would

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Speaker 2: look at. I'd also keep an eye out for arbitration.

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Speaker 2: Agree men's being hidden in there. I've been seeing that

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Speaker 2: a lot in the severance that if you do bring

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Speaker 2: an enforcement action, they're trying to force arbitration now too.

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Speaker 3: And just to go a little bit deeper on that,

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Speaker 3: companies are adding language that says if you try to

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Speaker 3: sue them or bring some kind of legal claim later,

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Speaker 3: you have to go through arbitration instead of taking it

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Speaker 3: to court. And while arbitration might sound nicer than going

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Speaker 3: to full blown court, it can really change the playing field.

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Speaker 3: I mean usually it means the case stays private, there's

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Speaker 3: less discovery, and you're not appearing before a jury of

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Speaker 3: your peers. So it's one of those clauses people tend

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Speaker 3: to skim past when they're stressed and just trying to

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Speaker 3: sign the damn paperwork. But it can matter a lot

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Speaker 3: down the road. If there are any big issues with

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Speaker 3: your employment.

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Speaker 4: How about can you negotiate a severance after you've already

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Speaker 4: been laid off? And also, as you were talking, I

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Speaker 4: was wondering, should I be thinking, I know this is

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Speaker 4: maybe like gloomy, but a little bit along like a

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Speaker 4: prenup conversation, should I be thinking about including things when

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Speaker 4: I'm being hired that then says, oh, if you ever

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Speaker 4: lay me off, you have to give me x amount

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Speaker 4: for X amount of years I've been here or something.

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Speaker 5: You know what I mean?

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Speaker 4: Like, how can I be thinking about negotiating severance both

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Speaker 4: before I even start the job and then after I've

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Speaker 4: been laid off too?

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Speaker 2: Yes, we love a proactive queen. So what I would

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Speaker 2: do is, if you're going to be negotiating a contract

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Speaker 2: to start employment, absolutely you want to include those things

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Speaker 2: in there, like a notice period. We have been able

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Speaker 2: to negotiate severance just on that alone. Like if I

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Speaker 2: have a doctor who comes to me and they have

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Speaker 2: one hundred and eighty day notice period between ninety to

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Speaker 2: one hundred and eighty days a standard in that industry,

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Speaker 2: if the hospital wants to get rid of them earlier

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Speaker 2: and they break that contract, that's a claim we can

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Speaker 2: use to leverage higher severance payout. So those are terms

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Speaker 2: that you can request as part of that, and I

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Speaker 2: wouldn't put it like personally, I would make it a

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Speaker 2: notice period because that's where we're going to be able

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Speaker 2: to use it more broadly other than just like in

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Speaker 2: the event of layoff. Because they're going to call it

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Speaker 2: a restruct sure or something, you know what I mean.

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Speaker 2: So what I would do is just be like, in

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Speaker 2: the event employment end is this is what the notice period.

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Speaker 2: You could negotiate that, but it really just depends on

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Speaker 2: what you're being paid the notice period, and you can't

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Speaker 2: bleed a turn up. If the company is really folding

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Speaker 2: up and they cannot offer you more, you're not going

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Speaker 2: to be able to get more money. It really depends

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Speaker 2: on all the circumstances of the situation.

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Speaker 3: Okay, so let's just say we've got severance figured out,

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Speaker 3: or there isiness everance or whatever, you've been laid off.

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Speaker 3: What happens at that point to any unused PTO paid

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Speaker 3: time off, any bonuses that they're in your contract. Let's

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Speaker 3: say that you get fired like three quarters of the

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Speaker 3: way through the year and you've contributed to those sales goals,

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Speaker 3: any like equity or like stock options that you have

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Speaker 3: in the company that you're employed with.

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Speaker 1: What happens to all that stuff?

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Speaker 2: Those are all things I would immediately follow up what

403
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Speaker 2: they try to ask what they're going to be doing about,

404
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Speaker 2: because unfortunately, you do not have a right to have

405
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Speaker 2: PTO paid out in most states. Now, different states might

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Speaker 2: have different laws, but there's no federal requirement requiring PTO

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Speaker 2: to be paid out. So I'll use Missouri as an example.

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Speaker 2: In Missouri, if you get laid off, you don't get

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Speaker 2: to cash out your PTO unless the company has a

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Speaker 2: policy or different procedure that they will do on their own.

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Speaker 2: You don't have a right to have your PTO cashed out.

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Speaker 2: That's another reason why you want to use your PTO.

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Speaker 2: Don't be sitting on that that company will get ready

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Speaker 2: to you and replace you tomorrow.

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Speaker 5: Like use your PTO because it can be a user

416
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Speaker 5: or lose it kind.

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Speaker 2: Of thing if employment ends, But you can ask for

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Speaker 2: it to be paid out again.

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Speaker 5: Like we were just talking about this squeaky reel.

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Speaker 2: The worst case they're going to say is no, maybe

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Speaker 2: that they're not going to pay you the PTO.

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Speaker 3: In the same vein basically we talked about the PTO

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Speaker 3: and everything. A lot of people have a four oh

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Speaker 3: one K with their employer too, and so I'm curious

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Speaker 3: what's the best way to handle.

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Speaker 1: That when you part ways with an employer.

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Speaker 2: I don't have a lot of experience with like employee

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Speaker 2: benefits like the four oh one k. I know not

429
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Speaker 2: to be dangerous, but for some of my cases that's

430
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Speaker 2: been involved in, you can usually continue it with your

431
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Speaker 2: new employer. You just have to update the information. I've

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Speaker 2: also had people want to dip into it if they

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Speaker 2: need to, you do get a penalty, is my understanding

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Speaker 2: of that, if you tap into it too early. But

435
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Speaker 2: some people need that money to buy them time to

436
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Speaker 2: the next job. So everyone has to do what they

437
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Speaker 2: have to do. But that's part of what should be

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Speaker 2: included in the paperwork. If you are given that reduction

439
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Speaker 2: and forced notice or the layoff paperwork, they should give

440
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Speaker 2: you an itemized list and like how to roll over

441
00:19:16,000 --> 00:19:16,840
Speaker 2: your benefits.

442
00:19:17,119 --> 00:19:19,720
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I think it's just another super important thing

443
00:19:19,720 --> 00:19:21,480
Speaker 3: for people to remember. I mean, some people put like

444
00:19:21,480 --> 00:19:23,680
Speaker 3: a thousand bucks in therefore, okay, maybe they forget about

445
00:19:23,680 --> 00:19:25,919
Speaker 3: it whatever, but it is your money and you should

446
00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:28,040
Speaker 3: take it with you, Yes, especially for people who had

447
00:19:28,119 --> 00:19:30,600
Speaker 3: multiple jobs over the years, Like maybe you've set up

448
00:19:30,680 --> 00:19:33,040
Speaker 3: your personal IRA, right, you can roll your four oh

449
00:19:33,040 --> 00:19:34,359
Speaker 3: one k over into that.

450
00:19:34,400 --> 00:19:36,040
Speaker 1: And so that's just a super important thing to make

451
00:19:36,040 --> 00:19:36,800
Speaker 1: sure you take with you.

452
00:19:37,280 --> 00:19:39,920
Speaker 5: Yeah, don't leave your money behind, No, take everything.

453
00:19:40,440 --> 00:19:41,880
Speaker 4: Can you tell us a little bit too about who

454
00:19:41,920 --> 00:19:46,240
Speaker 4: qualifies for unemployment benefits and how do you apply sure.

455
00:19:46,040 --> 00:19:48,560
Speaker 2: So and again I'll just speak for Missouri as an example,

456
00:19:48,600 --> 00:19:51,119
Speaker 2: because you apply through the state. You just go online

457
00:19:51,160 --> 00:19:53,680
Speaker 2: and start the process, and it's a questionnaire you fill out.

458
00:19:54,160 --> 00:19:56,600
Speaker 2: Really want to caution everyone what you fill out on

459
00:19:56,640 --> 00:19:59,520
Speaker 2: the questionnaire in any state becomes part of the file.

460
00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:02,199
Speaker 2: So don't be ranting about how you hate everyone at

461
00:20:02,240 --> 00:20:03,560
Speaker 2: work and all this suff you know, like, stick to

462
00:20:03,600 --> 00:20:05,840
Speaker 2: the issues. Okay, Like I was fired on this date.

463
00:20:06,119 --> 00:20:07,840
Speaker 2: It wasn't my fault. This is what they said I

464
00:20:07,840 --> 00:20:08,400
Speaker 2: was fired for.

465
00:20:08,640 --> 00:20:09,480
Speaker 5: Can I have my money?

466
00:20:09,720 --> 00:20:12,440
Speaker 2: Keep it sweet and simple, Okay, we don't need dating

467
00:20:12,480 --> 00:20:13,479
Speaker 2: back to twenty twenty two.

468
00:20:13,920 --> 00:20:16,640
Speaker 5: How everyone there sucks. Okay, it's down twenty twenty six.

469
00:20:17,280 --> 00:20:20,159
Speaker 2: So you really want to keep it basic on what

470
00:20:20,240 --> 00:20:23,240
Speaker 2: you're asking for and start that process online. They will

471
00:20:23,320 --> 00:20:26,159
Speaker 2: need some documents like your pay stub to name the

472
00:20:26,160 --> 00:20:30,200
Speaker 2: correct paying entity, some other items like that. Also, start

473
00:20:30,200 --> 00:20:33,440
Speaker 2: immediately applying for positions once you get your bearings, because

474
00:20:33,480 --> 00:20:36,240
Speaker 2: you will have to submit that to receive benefits once

475
00:20:36,280 --> 00:20:38,359
Speaker 2: you're past the waiting period. They want to know that

476
00:20:38,359 --> 00:20:41,119
Speaker 2: you're actively seeking new work, not just sitting around collecting

477
00:20:41,160 --> 00:20:43,399
Speaker 2: unemployment so you can get kind of ahead of the

478
00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:45,439
Speaker 2: curve because I don't know the exact amount off the

479
00:20:45,440 --> 00:20:47,040
Speaker 2: top of my head, but I know it's a requirement

480
00:20:47,119 --> 00:20:50,320
Speaker 2: like X amount of applications per week or something like that.

481
00:20:50,640 --> 00:20:52,639
Speaker 2: Those are things I would just get started and keep

482
00:20:52,680 --> 00:20:54,280
Speaker 2: it simple when you're filling out the form. That's where

483
00:20:54,280 --> 00:20:56,080
Speaker 2: I see a lot of people go wrong, and then

484
00:20:56,160 --> 00:20:57,800
Speaker 2: like I get it later when I'm helping them with

485
00:20:57,800 --> 00:20:59,119
Speaker 2: the thing, because I do have a case and I'm like,

486
00:20:59,119 --> 00:21:01,159
Speaker 2: why did you ran in here? Like now they have

487
00:21:01,200 --> 00:21:03,720
Speaker 2: all this information that they otherwise wouldn't have had. It's

488
00:21:03,760 --> 00:21:07,280
Speaker 2: also not relevant, but you're entitled to unemployment benefits if

489
00:21:07,320 --> 00:21:10,800
Speaker 2: you are fired or workstops due to no fault of

490
00:21:10,840 --> 00:21:13,360
Speaker 2: your own. Now, this can look like quiet quitting from

491
00:21:13,359 --> 00:21:15,440
Speaker 2: the employer. They just remove you from the schedule and

492
00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:17,840
Speaker 2: never schedule you to work again. That you may be

493
00:21:17,880 --> 00:21:20,920
Speaker 2: eligible for benefits. But if you were fired for violating

494
00:21:20,960 --> 00:21:24,880
Speaker 2: a known company policy like the attendance policy, no call,

495
00:21:24,960 --> 00:21:28,560
Speaker 2: no show, anything like that, then the employer can contest

496
00:21:28,560 --> 00:21:31,080
Speaker 2: your application for benefits and it goes through that hearing process.

497
00:21:31,119 --> 00:21:33,840
Speaker 2: If you appeal, like we talked about earlier, but generally,

498
00:21:33,960 --> 00:21:36,560
Speaker 2: as long as the reason you're not working isn't your

499
00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:39,720
Speaker 2: fault and you're able to work, you'll probably get benefits.

500
00:21:40,200 --> 00:21:42,800
Speaker 3: I also would want to address some stigma here. When

501
00:21:42,840 --> 00:21:44,679
Speaker 3: I got laid off, people are like, are you gonna

502
00:21:44,880 --> 00:21:47,240
Speaker 3: apply for unplanned benefits? And I was like, Oh, I'll

503
00:21:47,240 --> 00:21:50,000
Speaker 3: never do that. Like why, I'm so glad.

504
00:21:51,040 --> 00:21:54,359
Speaker 2: For Yes, there is some weird stigma about, like a

505
00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:56,919
Speaker 2: negative stigma, and there shouldn't be. I'm so glad you

506
00:21:56,920 --> 00:21:58,960
Speaker 2: brought that up because a lot of people say that

507
00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:01,200
Speaker 2: when I'm doing the consultation, because I need to know

508
00:22:01,280 --> 00:22:03,560
Speaker 2: if they're going to contest the benefits. When he said,

509
00:22:03,600 --> 00:22:06,960
Speaker 2: she said situation for example, there's nothing wrong about applying

510
00:22:06,960 --> 00:22:09,639
Speaker 2: for benefits. You pay into them during your employment. You

511
00:22:09,720 --> 00:22:11,199
Speaker 2: need to get them if you need them. That's what

512
00:22:11,240 --> 00:22:13,080
Speaker 2: it's there for a lot of people need to just

513
00:22:13,119 --> 00:22:15,679
Speaker 2: like set their pride aside and get your unemployment benefits

514
00:22:15,680 --> 00:22:18,359
Speaker 2: if you're eligible, because if not, you're not getting the

515
00:22:18,359 --> 00:22:19,600
Speaker 2: money that you've paid into.

516
00:22:19,960 --> 00:22:21,760
Speaker 3: Yeah, the amount of people who have lost their jobs

517
00:22:21,760 --> 00:22:23,720
Speaker 3: and told me like, oh, I'm not going to do that,

518
00:22:23,840 --> 00:22:25,560
Speaker 3: it just blows my mind because I'm like.

519
00:22:25,600 --> 00:22:27,680
Speaker 5: I hate hearing that is literally what it's there for.

520
00:22:27,720 --> 00:22:30,200
Speaker 3: And yeah, yeah, no one should be ashamed about taking

521
00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:33,000
Speaker 3: advantage of it, Like exactly, we pay into it. It's

522
00:22:33,080 --> 00:22:34,600
Speaker 3: kind of like Social Security. You pay into it, you

523
00:22:34,600 --> 00:22:36,439
Speaker 3: deserve to take advantage of it when it's your turn to.

524
00:22:36,800 --> 00:22:39,399
Speaker 2: It's also not public record, like, there's no reason to

525
00:22:39,400 --> 00:22:41,159
Speaker 2: be ashamed of it. No one will ever know that

526
00:22:41,200 --> 00:22:44,160
Speaker 2: you received it besides you and whoever prepares your taxes,

527
00:22:44,240 --> 00:22:47,360
Speaker 2: so there's no reason to be ashamed of it. It's

528
00:22:47,400 --> 00:22:48,680
Speaker 2: not like they can go up and be like, oh,

529
00:22:48,760 --> 00:22:51,520
Speaker 2: Matt got unemployment four years ago, he's going to be

530
00:22:51,560 --> 00:22:54,560
Speaker 2: a bad employee. That doesn't happen. There's no record of it.

531
00:22:54,840 --> 00:22:57,119
Speaker 2: And that's not how that works. If you're eligible, go

532
00:22:57,119 --> 00:22:58,040
Speaker 2: get your benefits.

533
00:22:58,240 --> 00:22:58,800
Speaker 5: No one will know.

534
00:22:59,240 --> 00:23:01,080
Speaker 3: Just go get your money, yeah, and then lie about

535
00:23:01,080 --> 00:23:02,720
Speaker 3: it on TikTok. You don't have to tell TikTok.

536
00:23:02,800 --> 00:23:04,680
Speaker 4: It's not that easy to do too. So it's not

537
00:23:04,760 --> 00:23:07,320
Speaker 4: like being abused in the way that you'll sometimes hear about.

538
00:23:07,359 --> 00:23:10,119
Speaker 4: It's like that is for all of us who contribute

539
00:23:10,119 --> 00:23:11,920
Speaker 4: to that, use it, get.

540
00:23:11,720 --> 00:23:12,800
Speaker 5: It, enjoy it.

541
00:23:13,280 --> 00:23:15,639
Speaker 2: Yeah, they don't just hand you a benefit. You have

542
00:23:15,720 --> 00:23:18,119
Speaker 2: to fill out the questions, you have to be eligible

543
00:23:18,200 --> 00:23:20,600
Speaker 2: and then you may receive them. So yeah, it's not

544
00:23:20,640 --> 00:23:22,919
Speaker 2: like a handout. There's nothing to be ashamed of for

545
00:23:22,920 --> 00:23:23,840
Speaker 2: getting unemployment.

546
00:23:27,680 --> 00:23:29,840
Speaker 4: We'll be right back after a quick break.

547
00:23:36,400 --> 00:23:39,639
Speaker 3: And we're back with more grown up stuff. How do

548
00:23:39,680 --> 00:23:44,840
Speaker 3: I don't I want to come to another kind of

549
00:23:45,160 --> 00:23:49,160
Speaker 3: gray area where you are laid off but there's just

550
00:23:49,320 --> 00:23:52,200
Speaker 3: this inkling in your head that like this doesn't feel right.

551
00:23:52,840 --> 00:23:55,840
Speaker 3: What are the signs that your termination might actually be

552
00:23:55,880 --> 00:23:57,919
Speaker 3: like a wrongful termination?

553
00:23:58,240 --> 00:23:59,640
Speaker 1: And then what can you do about that?

554
00:24:00,359 --> 00:24:04,480
Speaker 2: So the wrongful terminations we look for if a layoff happens,

555
00:24:04,560 --> 00:24:07,040
Speaker 2: or we're wanting to see if severance might be offered. First,

556
00:24:07,040 --> 00:24:09,320
Speaker 2: it's going to start if it involves a protected class.

557
00:24:09,359 --> 00:24:12,439
Speaker 2: And so protected class example is age between forty and

558
00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:17,720
Speaker 2: sixty nine years old, sex, disability, religion, pregnancy, those can

559
00:24:17,760 --> 00:24:21,280
Speaker 2: all be different protected classes. Now here's the myth. I've

560
00:24:21,280 --> 00:24:23,240
Speaker 2: been getting a lot of things lately. Or people will

561
00:24:23,240 --> 00:24:24,720
Speaker 2: write me and be like, hey, I was laid off.

562
00:24:25,000 --> 00:24:26,600
Speaker 2: I think it was due to my age. But they

563
00:24:26,640 --> 00:24:28,800
Speaker 2: just happen to be the age and the protected class.

564
00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:32,040
Speaker 2: They don't have any actual like specific example of oh,

565
00:24:32,200 --> 00:24:34,880
Speaker 2: only everyone over forty was selected, or oh, a week

566
00:24:34,920 --> 00:24:37,080
Speaker 2: ago I reported I thought I was being discriminated against

567
00:24:37,080 --> 00:24:38,719
Speaker 2: because I'm the oldest on the team, and then they

568
00:24:38,800 --> 00:24:41,119
Speaker 2: laid me off. Those are all little triggering events we

569
00:24:41,160 --> 00:24:43,199
Speaker 2: want to look for if you just happen to be

570
00:24:43,359 --> 00:24:46,320
Speaker 2: in a protected class. But it's never been an issue,

571
00:24:46,680 --> 00:24:48,600
Speaker 2: Probably not much we can do unless we find out

572
00:24:48,640 --> 00:24:51,840
Speaker 2: something we didn't know, like behind the scenes information. Also,

573
00:24:51,960 --> 00:24:53,760
Speaker 2: you want to look that they're not laying off the

574
00:24:53,800 --> 00:24:56,520
Speaker 2: oldest people on the team, or laying off only the women,

575
00:24:56,680 --> 00:24:59,320
Speaker 2: or only the men, or only the people working from home.

576
00:24:59,400 --> 00:25:01,920
Speaker 2: Is in a comedy for the disability, It's so hard.

577
00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:04,920
Speaker 2: There's no like bright line test to see if you

578
00:25:05,040 --> 00:25:07,679
Speaker 2: might have been wrongfully fired. So what I would say is,

579
00:25:07,840 --> 00:25:10,840
Speaker 2: if you have a gut feeling, trust your gut, if

580
00:25:10,840 --> 00:25:13,119
Speaker 2: your spider sense is tingling, it's for a reason, and

581
00:25:13,280 --> 00:25:15,600
Speaker 2: just do some research and ask do not spit it

582
00:25:15,640 --> 00:25:18,120
Speaker 2: in chat GBT. Please Dear God, for the love of God,

583
00:25:18,160 --> 00:25:20,560
Speaker 2: do not do that, because you waive off privilege. And

584
00:25:20,600 --> 00:25:22,800
Speaker 2: if you do have a case and you sue the employer,

585
00:25:22,800 --> 00:25:24,960
Speaker 2: you might have to produce that like, hey, chat GBT,

586
00:25:25,080 --> 00:25:26,399
Speaker 2: do I have a case, we'll have to produce that.

587
00:25:26,720 --> 00:25:29,120
Speaker 2: So don't spit it into the internet, but do some

588
00:25:29,160 --> 00:25:31,960
Speaker 2: research if you think it's suspicious timing or it might

589
00:25:32,000 --> 00:25:34,960
Speaker 2: involve one of those protected classes, and you do usually

590
00:25:35,000 --> 00:25:37,760
Speaker 2: get a consideration period before you sign the severance. And

591
00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:40,080
Speaker 2: that's with the time where I'd immediately apply for unemployment,

592
00:25:40,359 --> 00:25:42,960
Speaker 2: immediately start doing research if I thought I was illegally fired,

593
00:25:43,200 --> 00:25:45,359
Speaker 2: And like a lot of us do the free consults.

594
00:25:45,520 --> 00:25:47,920
Speaker 2: It doesn't hurt to reach out and just see worst

595
00:25:47,960 --> 00:25:50,160
Speaker 2: case scenario. You email it to me, I say, yeah,

596
00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:52,600
Speaker 2: I don't hear anything, I would sign it. Or if

597
00:25:52,600 --> 00:25:54,600
Speaker 2: you're not going to talk with another lawyer, you know,

598
00:25:54,680 --> 00:25:56,439
Speaker 2: that's a pretty good bad case scenario if you can

599
00:25:56,480 --> 00:25:57,200
Speaker 2: still get some money.

600
00:25:57,680 --> 00:25:59,840
Speaker 1: The amount of people that are just like chat GP

601
00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:01,480
Speaker 1: you take the wheel.

602
00:26:01,359 --> 00:26:02,440
Speaker 3: It's just.

603
00:26:04,320 --> 00:26:05,520
Speaker 5: And this keeps happening online.

604
00:26:05,520 --> 00:26:07,439
Speaker 2: They'll be like, oh, she's just saying that because she

605
00:26:07,480 --> 00:26:11,000
Speaker 2: doesn't want her job to be automated. And no, I'm

606
00:26:11,040 --> 00:26:13,200
Speaker 2: saying that because like two years from now, when we're

607
00:26:13,240 --> 00:26:15,719
Speaker 2: fighting about is going to trial, they're gonna subpoenat all

608
00:26:15,760 --> 00:26:18,960
Speaker 2: of your CHATGYBT records and like anything you've ever spit

609
00:26:19,000 --> 00:26:21,040
Speaker 2: in there which people talk to it like a person

610
00:26:21,119 --> 00:26:24,840
Speaker 2: until their deepest, darkest secrets. Why I don't know, but yeah,

611
00:26:24,960 --> 00:26:28,119
Speaker 2: it's all discoverable, especially like if me, as the lawyer

612
00:26:28,200 --> 00:26:31,119
Speaker 2: sends you as the client something and you put in chatgybt,

613
00:26:31,280 --> 00:26:33,639
Speaker 2: it waives the privilege. Now they get access to that.

614
00:26:33,760 --> 00:26:36,560
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, wow, good to know.

615
00:26:37,280 --> 00:26:39,760
Speaker 5: Yeah, do not put your legal things in chatgybt.

616
00:26:40,480 --> 00:26:43,159
Speaker 4: No, don't do that. Also, I think one of the

617
00:26:43,520 --> 00:26:46,399
Speaker 4: big things around a layoff too is like, yes, you

618
00:26:46,480 --> 00:26:48,400
Speaker 4: need to get your affairs in order as far as

619
00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:51,800
Speaker 4: like your money, your benefits, your cobra, all of that,

620
00:26:52,160 --> 00:26:54,880
Speaker 4: But there is such a mental aspect to this too.

621
00:26:55,400 --> 00:26:57,960
Speaker 4: Do you have advice for the best things that people

622
00:26:58,000 --> 00:27:01,520
Speaker 4: can do for their mental health during this time, because again,

623
00:27:01,560 --> 00:27:04,840
Speaker 4: it is a really confusing and disorienting moment.

624
00:27:05,440 --> 00:27:07,520
Speaker 2: Mental health is one of the most important things you

625
00:27:07,520 --> 00:27:09,800
Speaker 2: can manage in this kind of situation because it can

626
00:27:09,840 --> 00:27:12,560
Speaker 2: help you not spiral and think more clearly for how

627
00:27:12,600 --> 00:27:14,359
Speaker 2: you're going to move with next step. So I am

628
00:27:14,400 --> 00:27:16,920
Speaker 2: a big advocate of if you can do it, if

629
00:27:16,920 --> 00:27:19,320
Speaker 2: you can afford it and arrange for it, seek help

630
00:27:19,359 --> 00:27:23,280
Speaker 2: either through a counselor or psychiatrists. Again, not chut GPT. Okay,

631
00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:26,160
Speaker 2: some form of professional help that's going to tell you

632
00:27:26,200 --> 00:27:27,880
Speaker 2: and help you not spiral, and they can help put

633
00:27:27,920 --> 00:27:29,960
Speaker 2: things in place. Most of it's probably going to be

634
00:27:30,040 --> 00:27:32,280
Speaker 2: like talk therapy, where you walk through and you deal

635
00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:35,159
Speaker 2: with those shame thoughts or things like that. Sometimes I

636
00:27:35,200 --> 00:27:37,679
Speaker 2: have seen in layoff paperwork is where they'll have an

637
00:27:37,720 --> 00:27:41,960
Speaker 2: employee EAP program available for like thirty to sixty days

638
00:27:42,000 --> 00:27:44,720
Speaker 2: for the layoff class, or you can talk through those things,

639
00:27:45,040 --> 00:27:48,040
Speaker 2: or they'll have like job placement services also couched in

640
00:27:48,080 --> 00:27:50,800
Speaker 2: there too. That's going to depend on the company and

641
00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:53,480
Speaker 2: what they're offering and if a state law requires it

642
00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:55,359
Speaker 2: or not. But a lot of the bigger companies we

643
00:27:55,400 --> 00:27:58,199
Speaker 2: see them offer those benefits when they do the mass layoff.

644
00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:00,920
Speaker 2: So if it's available and pay for it, I would

645
00:28:00,920 --> 00:28:02,399
Speaker 2: sign up for that immediately.

646
00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:06,800
Speaker 4: And just to clarify, EAP stands for Employee Assistance Program.

647
00:28:07,119 --> 00:28:10,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, having resources or having a support group, those are

648
00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:12,679
Speaker 2: the things that you should look to so that you

649
00:28:12,680 --> 00:28:15,160
Speaker 2: don't spiral, because, like we said at the very beginning

650
00:28:15,160 --> 00:28:18,120
Speaker 2: of this, it's not a shameful thing. Layoffs happen. It's

651
00:28:18,160 --> 00:28:21,440
Speaker 2: nothing you did wrong. Probably it's just unfortunately how things go,

652
00:28:21,840 --> 00:28:24,480
Speaker 2: and so taking care of your mental health can help

653
00:28:24,520 --> 00:28:26,840
Speaker 2: you start the new place at the level up instead

654
00:28:26,880 --> 00:28:29,480
Speaker 2: of like beating yourself down ruminating on why you got

655
00:28:29,480 --> 00:28:31,879
Speaker 2: fired or all these things, and now you're starting at

656
00:28:31,880 --> 00:28:33,240
Speaker 2: a disadvantage and you hate yourself.

657
00:28:33,280 --> 00:28:33,840
Speaker 5: So don't do that.

658
00:28:34,480 --> 00:28:37,639
Speaker 4: No, it's also so competent. I feel like before it

659
00:28:37,720 --> 00:28:39,920
Speaker 4: used to be shameful for companies to do layoffs, and

660
00:28:39,960 --> 00:28:42,080
Speaker 4: now they almost brag about, like we let ten thousand

661
00:28:42,120 --> 00:28:44,040
Speaker 4: people go look at our stock price, and it's like,

662
00:28:44,480 --> 00:28:46,920
Speaker 4: what the hell, Like you should have some shame, not

663
00:28:47,040 --> 00:28:49,280
Speaker 4: you as a person, the company should have some shame

664
00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:52,320
Speaker 4: in like doing this practice. Oh we'll get off my

665
00:28:52,400 --> 00:28:54,080
Speaker 4: soapbox now, No, no.

666
00:28:53,960 --> 00:28:54,520
Speaker 1: Are you?

667
00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:57,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's funny you say that, because yeah, they are

668
00:28:57,520 --> 00:29:00,080
Speaker 2: proud of doing quarterly layoffs and things like that, and

669
00:29:00,080 --> 00:29:02,680
Speaker 2: then they march the hiring back up the next quarter.

670
00:29:03,040 --> 00:29:05,240
Speaker 2: That's why it's like nobody should read into it too much.

671
00:29:05,280 --> 00:29:07,840
Speaker 2: It's usually not a personal thing. It's just that you're

672
00:29:07,840 --> 00:29:10,280
Speaker 2: a number, unfortunately to a lot of these companies, and

673
00:29:10,360 --> 00:29:12,520
Speaker 2: sometimes that number gets laid off. But you should not

674
00:29:12,560 --> 00:29:14,280
Speaker 2: feel shame from being laid off.

675
00:29:14,560 --> 00:29:16,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, and the frustration is building because not to get

676
00:29:16,960 --> 00:29:19,040
Speaker 3: on my soapbox, but like, so many protections have been

677
00:29:19,040 --> 00:29:20,760
Speaker 3: taken away, and I'm curious to hear your thoughts as

678
00:29:20,800 --> 00:29:22,960
Speaker 3: an employment lawyer, but so many protections have been taken

679
00:29:22,960 --> 00:29:26,800
Speaker 3: away over the last sixty seventy years, Like pensions got

680
00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:28,600
Speaker 3: done away with and in its place got the four

681
00:29:28,640 --> 00:29:30,840
Speaker 3: O one K. But it's optional and some people didn't

682
00:29:30,840 --> 00:29:33,400
Speaker 3: take advantage of them, And a lot of protections are

683
00:29:33,400 --> 00:29:37,240
Speaker 3: built into contracts that employees assigned with employers, and so

684
00:29:37,560 --> 00:29:38,640
Speaker 3: at the end of the day, I feel like the

685
00:29:38,640 --> 00:29:40,480
Speaker 3: employees are getting the short end of the stick, and

686
00:29:40,560 --> 00:29:43,440
Speaker 3: so people's frustrations are obviously growing with that, and it

687
00:29:43,480 --> 00:29:46,480
Speaker 3: can be an incredibly difficult time, and I think it

688
00:29:46,560 --> 00:29:48,880
Speaker 3: really is best to put your best foot forward and

689
00:29:48,960 --> 00:29:50,800
Speaker 3: do what you can. Mental health is such a big

690
00:29:50,840 --> 00:29:52,760
Speaker 3: part of it, you know, it could be a stressful

691
00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:55,360
Speaker 3: time and taking some time to relax and chill out

692
00:29:55,360 --> 00:29:57,880
Speaker 3: as good, but just as important, I think as early

693
00:29:57,960 --> 00:30:00,200
Speaker 3: as you can is to set up what I I'd

694
00:30:00,240 --> 00:30:03,280
Speaker 3: like to call like an unemployment routine, which for me

695
00:30:03,360 --> 00:30:05,160
Speaker 3: that looked like one day I was just going to

696
00:30:05,280 --> 00:30:07,320
Speaker 3: update my resume and the next day I was going

697
00:30:07,400 --> 00:30:09,560
Speaker 3: to start even thinking about how I might build a

698
00:30:09,560 --> 00:30:11,720
Speaker 3: website for myself, you know, stuff like that. So I'm

699
00:30:11,760 --> 00:30:14,400
Speaker 3: curious to hear from you page, like what does a

700
00:30:14,440 --> 00:30:17,640
Speaker 3: good unemployment routine look like in your eyes?

701
00:30:18,400 --> 00:30:20,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I'll speak to this because you know how

702
00:30:20,200 --> 00:30:22,240
Speaker 2: we were joking off being popping off earlier. I got

703
00:30:22,240 --> 00:30:24,640
Speaker 2: fired once for popping off to a lawyer I worked for,

704
00:30:24,800 --> 00:30:25,920
Speaker 2: so I'll use that as an a game off.

705
00:30:26,040 --> 00:30:29,000
Speaker 5: Yes, Page, you know, I don't have to filter.

706
00:30:29,160 --> 00:30:31,760
Speaker 2: So I got fired once, and I treated getting a

707
00:30:31,800 --> 00:30:34,080
Speaker 2: new job like my job, so like nine to five,

708
00:30:34,240 --> 00:30:36,560
Speaker 2: I was clocked in once I updated things. I was

709
00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:39,720
Speaker 2: either applying for positions, asking people to network and connect,

710
00:30:39,760 --> 00:30:42,280
Speaker 2: because depending on your industry, that can be a pretty

711
00:30:42,280 --> 00:30:44,840
Speaker 2: easy way to get placed in a new position, especially

712
00:30:44,880 --> 00:30:46,600
Speaker 2: if you were laid off and not fired for cause.

713
00:30:47,080 --> 00:30:49,000
Speaker 2: So I treated it like my nine to five. You

714
00:30:49,000 --> 00:30:51,760
Speaker 2: don't want to apply just one place. Diversify where you're

715
00:30:51,800 --> 00:30:54,680
Speaker 2: applying because they have different algorithms, and that's kind of

716
00:30:54,720 --> 00:30:57,280
Speaker 2: so AI generated. Now, if you don't use the right buzzword,

717
00:30:57,360 --> 00:31:00,480
Speaker 2: your resume not even be viewed right and be one

718
00:31:00,480 --> 00:31:03,240
Speaker 2: of those you know, I know it's annoying, but post on. Indeed,

719
00:31:03,280 --> 00:31:07,000
Speaker 2: you don't have to be excited about being laid off, understandably,

720
00:31:07,120 --> 00:31:10,000
Speaker 2: but I think there's something to be said about posting like, hey,

721
00:31:10,040 --> 00:31:11,800
Speaker 2: it's sad news we got today that this is no

722
00:31:11,880 --> 00:31:12,880
Speaker 2: longer going to be a position.

723
00:31:13,240 --> 00:31:15,040
Speaker 5: I'm looking for work in this, this, and this.

724
00:31:15,120 --> 00:31:17,440
Speaker 2: I've heard a lot of people having success from even

725
00:31:17,680 --> 00:31:19,000
Speaker 2: doing something neutral like that.

726
00:31:19,160 --> 00:31:21,800
Speaker 5: I applied for every position, whether it was legal or not.

727
00:31:22,040 --> 00:31:23,600
Speaker 2: I was just trying to get a law firm on

728
00:31:23,640 --> 00:31:26,520
Speaker 2: my resume, especially because of how my employment ended and

729
00:31:26,560 --> 00:31:28,560
Speaker 2: mine was not in a nice way. I plied for

730
00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:32,240
Speaker 2: lawyer positions, paralegal, front desk, janitor. If it said law firm,

731
00:31:32,320 --> 00:31:35,080
Speaker 2: I was applying. Sometimes you just have to make that contact.

732
00:31:35,200 --> 00:31:36,960
Speaker 2: And that's what happened with one of the jobs is

733
00:31:37,360 --> 00:31:39,160
Speaker 2: they responded and they're like, well, we are hiring for

734
00:31:39,160 --> 00:31:40,960
Speaker 2: a lawyer, but we do have this, And I'm like,

735
00:31:40,960 --> 00:31:42,360
Speaker 2: if you could just get your foot in the door,

736
00:31:42,640 --> 00:31:45,200
Speaker 2: sometimes that might translate into a job, or am I

737
00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:47,360
Speaker 2: just translate into something that'll.

738
00:31:47,080 --> 00:31:48,160
Speaker 5: Help you later get a job.

739
00:31:48,240 --> 00:31:50,360
Speaker 2: But I treated it like my job to get a

740
00:31:50,360 --> 00:31:52,960
Speaker 2: new job, and it also was good for my mind,

741
00:31:53,080 --> 00:31:54,760
Speaker 2: like I felt like I was being productive and I

742
00:31:54,840 --> 00:31:56,200
Speaker 2: was doing things to help.

743
00:31:56,720 --> 00:31:59,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, I love that you said that. I couldn't agree more.

744
00:31:59,160 --> 00:32:01,280
Speaker 3: I have a lot of friends, unfortunately that are going

745
00:32:01,320 --> 00:32:03,880
Speaker 3: through this difficult time, and the number one thing that

746
00:32:03,920 --> 00:32:05,760
Speaker 3: I say to all of them is whatever you can

747
00:32:05,800 --> 00:32:08,520
Speaker 3: do to reach out to your network, to expand your network,

748
00:32:08,520 --> 00:32:11,520
Speaker 3: to go to networking events. I've never gotten a job

749
00:32:11,560 --> 00:32:14,280
Speaker 3: through applying to a job ever. I've only ever gotten

750
00:32:14,360 --> 00:32:16,000
Speaker 3: jobs through people that I knew, that I met, that

751
00:32:16,040 --> 00:32:19,200
Speaker 3: I worked with. Never burn bridges. Always show up and

752
00:32:19,240 --> 00:32:21,520
Speaker 3: do your best work because you just never ever know

753
00:32:21,960 --> 00:32:24,080
Speaker 3: where your next opportunity is going to come from. And

754
00:32:24,120 --> 00:32:26,480
Speaker 3: this is the time treating like your next job like

755
00:32:26,520 --> 00:32:27,120
Speaker 3: it is your job.

756
00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:29,200
Speaker 1: Getting your next job like it is your job is

757
00:32:29,240 --> 00:32:30,040
Speaker 1: a huge part of that.

758
00:32:30,440 --> 00:32:33,680
Speaker 4: Speaking of your next job too, how do you address

759
00:32:33,800 --> 00:32:37,880
Speaker 4: your layoff, whether that's on LinkedIn, on your resume or

760
00:32:37,920 --> 00:32:40,480
Speaker 4: in your future job interviews? Like, how should you be

761
00:32:40,560 --> 00:32:41,360
Speaker 4: talking about it?

762
00:32:42,120 --> 00:32:45,200
Speaker 2: I would not have any kind of shame or over

763
00:32:45,280 --> 00:32:47,400
Speaker 2: explain the layoff. A lot of employers are going to

764
00:32:47,480 --> 00:32:50,200
Speaker 2: understand that, especially in today's world, in this economy, they're

765
00:32:50,200 --> 00:32:52,760
Speaker 2: not that rare anymore, like we were talking about, So

766
00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:55,240
Speaker 2: just say it if you're in an interview and you

767
00:32:55,280 --> 00:32:57,120
Speaker 2: have a gap in your resume and they say, where

768
00:32:57,120 --> 00:32:58,880
Speaker 2: were you working from here to here? I was laid

769
00:32:58,920 --> 00:33:00,720
Speaker 2: off at this position, but I found work here after.

770
00:33:00,880 --> 00:33:02,400
Speaker 2: Or I'd love to work here, but we were laid

771
00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:04,560
Speaker 2: off here. Don't beat around the bush. Don't try to

772
00:33:04,600 --> 00:33:06,360
Speaker 2: ignore it or hide it. I think that's weird and

773
00:33:06,400 --> 00:33:08,160
Speaker 2: can come off as like a red flag to a

774
00:33:08,200 --> 00:33:11,160
Speaker 2: prospective employer. But just say what it is. You were

775
00:33:11,240 --> 00:33:13,960
Speaker 2: laid off with ex other people at the company, you

776
00:33:14,000 --> 00:33:16,680
Speaker 2: really liked working there. Don't bad talk your employer. Okay,

777
00:33:16,760 --> 00:33:19,120
Speaker 2: that's like going on a first date talking about your ex.

778
00:33:19,200 --> 00:33:22,040
Speaker 5: Don't do that. Okay, that's not going to look good.

779
00:33:22,120 --> 00:33:23,000
Speaker 5: That's not going to sound good.

780
00:33:23,400 --> 00:33:25,200
Speaker 2: Just be honest, Be like I was working here in

781
00:33:25,240 --> 00:33:28,160
Speaker 2: this department, our whole whatever was laid off, and I'd

782
00:33:28,160 --> 00:33:29,920
Speaker 2: love to work here, and I can do this and this,

783
00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:32,440
Speaker 2: Like just frame it that way. I would not come

784
00:33:32,480 --> 00:33:35,240
Speaker 2: in grumpy or with your real feelings or anything with

785
00:33:35,280 --> 00:33:37,479
Speaker 2: how you probably feel about being laid off, and just

786
00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:39,360
Speaker 2: be like, Yep, that's in the past, I'm ready for

787
00:33:39,400 --> 00:33:41,479
Speaker 2: new employment. That's how I would personally handle it.

788
00:33:42,000 --> 00:33:44,200
Speaker 4: On that note, too, Is it weird to talk nice

789
00:33:44,240 --> 00:33:47,360
Speaker 4: about your last employer, Like, I know you shouldn't talk

790
00:33:47,400 --> 00:33:50,640
Speaker 4: negatively about them, but is it weird to be like, Oh,

791
00:33:50,680 --> 00:33:53,360
Speaker 4: I'm so sad I was laid off. I loved that company.

792
00:33:53,560 --> 00:33:54,680
Speaker 4: What's your perspective on that?

793
00:33:55,280 --> 00:33:58,200
Speaker 2: Sure, as someone who interviews people for jobs, like if

794
00:33:58,200 --> 00:34:00,800
Speaker 2: they're looking to work with me, it's definitely a fine

795
00:34:00,840 --> 00:34:04,400
Speaker 2: line between being genuine if you really did like where

796
00:34:04,400 --> 00:34:07,120
Speaker 2: you were working, or just being like pleasant and neutral

797
00:34:07,160 --> 00:34:09,320
Speaker 2: and like, you know, a normal part of the conversation.

798
00:34:09,840 --> 00:34:12,080
Speaker 2: So I would not go on and on about how

799
00:34:12,080 --> 00:34:12,879
Speaker 2: you love your old place.

800
00:34:13,000 --> 00:34:13,799
Speaker 1: Let's stick with the X.

801
00:34:14,920 --> 00:34:15,600
Speaker 5: Think of the date.

802
00:34:15,640 --> 00:34:17,480
Speaker 2: Would your new date like to hear how much you

803
00:34:17,520 --> 00:34:19,920
Speaker 2: missed your ex? Probably not, But would they like to

804
00:34:19,920 --> 00:34:22,320
Speaker 2: hear you didn't try to light their car on fire? Yeah,

805
00:34:22,360 --> 00:34:24,960
Speaker 2: So like I would just stick to like, we liked

806
00:34:25,000 --> 00:34:27,759
Speaker 2: working there, but for whatever reason it didn't work out.

807
00:34:27,800 --> 00:34:29,920
Speaker 2: I wouldn't spend a lot of time looking at the

808
00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:32,719
Speaker 2: past again pivot toward being like, this is why un

809
00:34:32,719 --> 00:34:35,160
Speaker 2: employment ended there, this is what I was working on there,

810
00:34:35,200 --> 00:34:37,359
Speaker 2: like these skills or these projects, and this is why

811
00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:39,040
Speaker 2: I'd like to do it for your company. I noticed

812
00:34:39,080 --> 00:34:41,000
Speaker 2: you have this in this just try to see how

813
00:34:41,000 --> 00:34:42,880
Speaker 2: you could flow that in. But it has to be

814
00:34:42,960 --> 00:34:45,239
Speaker 2: genuine or it's going to come off weird. Right If

815
00:34:45,280 --> 00:34:47,520
Speaker 2: you just go on and on how much you liked

816
00:34:47,520 --> 00:34:49,560
Speaker 2: working there, you can do too much. A little goes

817
00:34:49,600 --> 00:34:51,759
Speaker 2: a long way when you're talking about your ex in

818
00:34:51,800 --> 00:34:53,160
Speaker 2: any setting, I think.

819
00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:58,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, And i'd say this, especially to my fellow high

820
00:34:59,000 --> 00:35:03,200
Speaker 3: EQ people out. Their emotions really don't serve you well

821
00:35:03,239 --> 00:35:06,600
Speaker 3: in moments like this. In America, it's just a thing.

822
00:35:06,960 --> 00:35:09,440
Speaker 3: We tie a lot of our identity to our jobs,

823
00:35:09,920 --> 00:35:13,360
Speaker 3: so much so that getting laid off can feel deeply personal.

824
00:35:13,640 --> 00:35:15,879
Speaker 3: But as hard as it is, try to approach these

825
00:35:15,880 --> 00:35:21,839
Speaker 3: situations as unemotionally as possible. Don't burn bridges, don't react impulsively,

826
00:35:22,360 --> 00:35:25,960
Speaker 3: and always stay professional and positive. That mindset goes a

827
00:35:26,000 --> 00:35:28,920
Speaker 3: really long way, whether you're leaving a job or interviewing

828
00:35:28,920 --> 00:35:30,680
Speaker 3: for the next one.

829
00:35:32,680 --> 00:35:34,000
Speaker 5: I would also do interviews.

830
00:35:34,040 --> 00:35:37,400
Speaker 2: You don't necessarily want as practice to not be emotional

831
00:35:37,440 --> 00:35:38,960
Speaker 2: for the ones that you do, And I know a

832
00:35:38,960 --> 00:35:41,200
Speaker 2: lot of people probably aren't turning down job offers in

833
00:35:41,239 --> 00:35:43,759
Speaker 2: our economy right now, but I would do interviews with

834
00:35:43,800 --> 00:35:45,760
Speaker 2: whoever responds to you, even if you're not one hundred

835
00:35:45,760 --> 00:35:48,359
Speaker 2: percent interested in it, because maybe that's where you'll get

836
00:35:48,360 --> 00:35:51,120
Speaker 2: that venting or that little emotion part out and you're like, ah,

837
00:35:51,160 --> 00:35:52,480
Speaker 2: I don't want to do that when I want this

838
00:35:52,560 --> 00:35:54,560
Speaker 2: important interview for the job I really want. So I

839
00:35:54,560 --> 00:35:57,239
Speaker 2: would just take everything like a practice opportunity when you're

840
00:35:57,239 --> 00:35:57,960
Speaker 2: in that transition.

841
00:35:58,400 --> 00:36:01,120
Speaker 3: I think in all things, keeping emotion toned when it

842
00:36:01,160 --> 00:36:02,480
Speaker 3: comes to employment is good advice.

843
00:36:02,640 --> 00:36:04,840
Speaker 1: Be a chill dude. Just chill out.

844
00:36:06,560 --> 00:36:06,840
Speaker 5: Again.

845
00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:09,200
Speaker 2: Back to the dating example. You got to act like

846
00:36:09,239 --> 00:36:11,400
Speaker 2: you want it less than they do. That way, you

847
00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:13,520
Speaker 2: have negotiating power if you want to raise Yeah, because

848
00:36:13,520 --> 00:36:15,680
Speaker 2: if they think you will leave, maybe they'll pay you more.

849
00:36:16,120 --> 00:36:17,800
Speaker 5: Or if they know that you're really.

850
00:36:17,600 --> 00:36:19,560
Speaker 2: Like the work from home schedule and you're never gonna leave,

851
00:36:19,600 --> 00:36:20,799
Speaker 2: they're gonna abuse you with that.

852
00:36:21,120 --> 00:36:22,080
Speaker 5: I totally agree.

853
00:36:22,200 --> 00:36:22,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, Paige.

854
00:36:22,960 --> 00:36:25,600
Speaker 4: Wait, and you were talking before about treating unemployment like

855
00:36:25,640 --> 00:36:27,880
Speaker 4: your full time job in the day, like nine to

856
00:36:27,920 --> 00:36:31,719
Speaker 4: five is dedicated to networking and sending resumes. I'll add

857
00:36:31,719 --> 00:36:34,680
Speaker 4: to that too. Use the evenings or the mornings or

858
00:36:34,680 --> 00:36:37,560
Speaker 4: whatever your lunch break for your hobbies as well, because

859
00:36:37,600 --> 00:36:40,400
Speaker 4: like that's a great time to still have that balance.

860
00:36:40,440 --> 00:36:43,880
Speaker 4: And then also you're like, wait, I love knitting, should

861
00:36:43,880 --> 00:36:46,839
Speaker 4: I be a professional scarf maker? Like maybe you should be.

862
00:36:46,840 --> 00:36:49,160
Speaker 1: On TikTok Yes exactly, yes.

863
00:36:48,960 --> 00:36:52,719
Speaker 2: Exactly, and you can make money off your videos of knitting. Yes, yeah,

864
00:36:52,920 --> 00:36:54,840
Speaker 2: that's great to add. Yeah, I think that helps you

865
00:36:54,920 --> 00:36:57,560
Speaker 2: not spiral and lose yourself if you keep a structure,

866
00:36:57,719 --> 00:37:01,040
Speaker 2: keep your hobbies, absolutely, but any way you could diversify

867
00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:03,560
Speaker 2: your income. It can make you bolder in that period

868
00:37:03,600 --> 00:37:05,200
Speaker 2: if you can have something else to rely on.

869
00:37:05,320 --> 00:37:05,680
Speaker 5: Yeah.

870
00:37:05,719 --> 00:37:06,480
Speaker 1: Absolutely, well.

871
00:37:06,480 --> 00:37:09,520
Speaker 4: Put and just to put a bow on this whole topic,

872
00:37:09,680 --> 00:37:12,120
Speaker 4: can you share just a few final thoughts on how

873
00:37:12,120 --> 00:37:13,640
Speaker 4: to react if you get laid off.

874
00:37:14,120 --> 00:37:16,360
Speaker 2: I think the most important thing is do not be

875
00:37:16,520 --> 00:37:19,239
Speaker 2: your own worst enemy if you get laid off. This

876
00:37:19,320 --> 00:37:21,440
Speaker 2: isn't a you thing. This is just a business thing.

877
00:37:21,760 --> 00:37:24,120
Speaker 2: Let's hit the ground running and apply. Don't sit there

878
00:37:24,120 --> 00:37:26,080
Speaker 2: and wallow for months. You're not going to help yourself

879
00:37:26,120 --> 00:37:28,200
Speaker 2: with that, and you're going to give yourself a disadvantage.

880
00:37:28,320 --> 00:37:30,160
Speaker 2: That's the only thing that I would like to add

881
00:37:30,560 --> 00:37:32,520
Speaker 2: is take it as a blessing in disguise and move

882
00:37:32,560 --> 00:37:34,960
Speaker 2: forward from there. It really depends on your attitude and

883
00:37:35,000 --> 00:37:36,799
Speaker 2: it's going to come across in your interviews. When you're

884
00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:39,440
Speaker 2: looking for new employment, you have to just be okay

885
00:37:39,480 --> 00:37:41,560
Speaker 2: with it and move on. And so take the steps

886
00:37:41,560 --> 00:37:44,279
Speaker 2: you need to do to get there and then start applying. Great,

887
00:37:44,800 --> 00:37:48,799
Speaker 2: And when are the times that somebody would need an

888
00:37:48,840 --> 00:37:53,120
Speaker 2: employment lawyer? I think anytime that something weird is happening

889
00:37:53,120 --> 00:37:55,560
Speaker 2: at work. You don't have to be fired to contact

890
00:37:55,600 --> 00:37:58,080
Speaker 2: an employment lawyer. And in fact, sometimes we can help

891
00:37:58,200 --> 00:38:01,440
Speaker 2: before it even gets there. If someone needs accommodations and

892
00:38:01,480 --> 00:38:03,480
Speaker 2: you reach out to me because they're not giving them

893
00:38:03,480 --> 00:38:05,919
Speaker 2: to you, I can send you the language that kind

894
00:38:05,920 --> 00:38:08,600
Speaker 2: of scares them. Boom, you're accommodated. Never have to see

895
00:38:08,640 --> 00:38:10,600
Speaker 2: me again. That's great. I hope you have a great life.

896
00:38:10,840 --> 00:38:13,280
Speaker 2: Don't wait for the bad thing to have already happened

897
00:38:13,360 --> 00:38:16,359
Speaker 2: to contact a lawyer. Like most of us work on contingency.

898
00:38:16,600 --> 00:38:19,319
Speaker 2: Most of us provide free consultations. Just reach out and

899
00:38:19,360 --> 00:38:21,320
Speaker 2: be like, hey, this is weird stuff happening at work.

900
00:38:21,600 --> 00:38:23,399
Speaker 2: I don't know if it'll be a thing or not. Again,

901
00:38:23,400 --> 00:38:25,279
Speaker 2: it's better to be proactive. So if you think you

902
00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:27,120
Speaker 2: might need a lawyer, I would not delay it. I

903
00:38:27,120 --> 00:38:29,320
Speaker 2: would reach out before the bad thing happens.

904
00:38:29,680 --> 00:38:31,440
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I just wanted to quickly shout this out

905
00:38:31,480 --> 00:38:34,120
Speaker 3: because I think it matters so much when lawyers work

906
00:38:34,160 --> 00:38:37,879
Speaker 3: on contingency. There are so many situations when people need

907
00:38:37,960 --> 00:38:41,239
Speaker 3: legal help, but the system is built around representing the

908
00:38:41,280 --> 00:38:45,440
Speaker 3: companies with money. I've looked for tenants rights lawyers before

909
00:38:45,760 --> 00:38:49,600
Speaker 3: and realize that most of them represent the landlords. It's

910
00:38:49,640 --> 00:38:51,520
Speaker 3: the same thing with healthcare. When my wife and I

911
00:38:51,560 --> 00:38:54,120
Speaker 3: were dealing with insurance issues during her pregnancy, I tried

912
00:38:54,160 --> 00:38:58,120
Speaker 3: finding someone focused on patience rights and it was surprisingly difficult.

913
00:38:58,560 --> 00:39:01,720
Speaker 3: So having attorneys who can actually advocate for regular people

914
00:39:01,880 --> 00:39:04,520
Speaker 3: and make it financially possible to pursue a case, it's

915
00:39:04,520 --> 00:39:07,239
Speaker 3: incredibly important. So seriously, paiged thank you so much for

916
00:39:07,320 --> 00:39:08,000
Speaker 3: doing this work.

917
00:39:08,160 --> 00:39:10,600
Speaker 2: I'm glad you could put some information together and hopefully

918
00:39:10,640 --> 00:39:12,520
Speaker 2: help people navigate getting laid off.

919
00:39:12,640 --> 00:39:13,680
Speaker 5: It's not the end of the world.

920
00:39:18,920 --> 00:39:21,360
Speaker 4: As always, I learned a ton, so thank you so

921
00:39:21,440 --> 00:39:24,080
Speaker 4: much to Paige Sparks from Sparks Legal. You can find

922
00:39:24,120 --> 00:39:26,040
Speaker 4: her online and on TikTok.

923
00:39:25,800 --> 00:39:28,880
Speaker 3: And if you happen to find yourself currently unemployed, maybe

924
00:39:29,040 --> 00:39:30,879
Speaker 3: join us again in two weeks where we'll be talking

925
00:39:30,920 --> 00:39:33,880
Speaker 3: about all the things you need to know to travel internationally.

926
00:39:34,200 --> 00:39:36,920
Speaker 4: First step, get yourself a passport. If you don't already

927
00:39:36,960 --> 00:39:41,520
Speaker 4: have one, you'll want it. I'm Leah Palmery. This episode

928
00:39:41,560 --> 00:39:45,400
Speaker 4: was produced by Pamela Lawrence. Our post producer is Sierra Spreen,

929
00:39:45,680 --> 00:39:47,720
Speaker 4: with additional engineering by Mac Wido

930
00:39:48,160 --> 00:39:50,080
Speaker 3: And a special thank you to all our teammates at

931
00:39:50,160 --> 00:39:53,960
Speaker 3: Ruby's Studio, including Sarah You, Ethan Fixel, Rachel Swan Krasnov,

932
00:39:54,040 --> 00:39:57,760
Speaker 3: Lydia Kim and Medylan Harper, Wayne, Deborah Garrett, and mister

933
00:39:57,920 --> 00:40:07,840
Speaker 3: Andy Kelly