Speaker 1: There Are No Girls on the Internet. As a production
Speaker 1: of My Heart Radio and Unbust Creative. I'm Bridget Todd,
Speaker 1: and this is there Are No Girls on the Internet.
Speaker 1: We are popping in again from hiatus to have a
Speaker 1: much needed conversation all about de influencing. If you're on TikTok,
Speaker 1: you've probably already seen content about de influencing, which is
Speaker 1: pretty much exactly what it sounds like. We're influencing tries
Speaker 1: to influence you to buy certain things. D influencing says,
Speaker 1: wait a minute, actually, do you need to buy another
Speaker 1: water bottle when you already have five in your cabinet.
Speaker 1: I am fascinated by the phenomena that is de influencing,
Speaker 1: and more importantly, what this de influencing trend says about
Speaker 1: our current social and economic climate. So I joined my
Speaker 1: friends Samantha and Annie over at the podcast stuff. Mom
Speaker 1: never told you to dig into de influencing and why
Speaker 1: we are seeing it all over our social media feeds,
Speaker 1: So I hope you enjoy. I have a theory that,
Speaker 1: especially during times that are like turbulent or uncertain, the
Speaker 1: pandemic would definitely fit into this um. Many of us,
Speaker 1: myself very very much included really turned to online shopping
Speaker 1: for a quick serotonin boost or a quick you know
Speaker 1: this is gonna feel good, or like I got into
Speaker 1: this habit of enjoying the feeling of kind of giving
Speaker 1: myself Christmas every day, like, oh, there's gonna be when
Speaker 1: I come home, there's gonna be a present waiting for me,
Speaker 1: you know, from past me. And so this is not
Speaker 1: just my theory. I do have a little bit of
Speaker 1: research to back it up. People really leaned into online
Speaker 1: shopping during the pandemic. According to the most recent annual
Speaker 1: retail Trade Survey release from the Census, e commerce sales
Speaker 1: increased by two hundred and forty four point two billion
Speaker 1: dollars or um the first year of the pandemic, rising
Speaker 1: from five hundred and seventy one point to billion in
Speaker 1: nine to eight hundred and fifteen point four billion. Uh.
Speaker 1: And people again, myself, very shamefully included, uh, really relied
Speaker 1: on online retailers, specifically like Amazon. Unsurprisingly, Amazon stock hit
Speaker 1: a new all time high during and it's only now
Speaker 1: like pretty recently starting to fall from that huge booth
Speaker 1: during the beginning of the pandemic. And a quick disclaimer
Speaker 1: here that like I just people need to say that. Obviously,
Speaker 1: we're gon, we're gonna be talking about our online shopping habits,
Speaker 1: but there are a whole bunch of folks who rely
Speaker 1: on online shopping for very legitimate, real reasons. Folks with
Speaker 1: disabilities or chronic illnesses, you know. For them, online shopping
Speaker 1: can be a lifeline being a swamped parent or a
Speaker 1: caregiver who can't always you know, pop out to the
Speaker 1: store for one thing. It's also a reason why somebody
Speaker 1: might really really lean on online shopping. I don't want
Speaker 1: to make it seem like anybody who is pressing by
Speaker 1: online is just leaning into bad habits that they should question. Um,
Speaker 1: So I'm not talking about those folks. I'm really taught
Speaker 1: talking about the quick purchase of things that you really
Speaker 1: don't need or maybe even really don't want because an
Speaker 1: algorithm on social media told you to do so. And
Speaker 1: I want to talk about why the tide is maybe
Speaker 1: sort of turning on this a little bit. Okay, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean it has been. I have a friend who
Speaker 1: loves Target, not a sponsor, but she loves like the
Speaker 1: Target app, and like she will text me as if like, yeah,
Speaker 1: Christmas has come early. The Target app has updated, and
Speaker 1: I feel like this wasn't a thing during the pandemic,
Speaker 1: and we've talked about it because it is clearly like
Speaker 1: a emotional it's something she does when she's stressed, and
Speaker 1: then like, I feel that during the pandemic, I have
Speaker 1: seen that a lot more where people are like, I
Speaker 1: need something that will make me feel better for a
Speaker 1: little bit. Also, this is a great point that you
Speaker 1: brought out, because I did. I hate it when people
Speaker 1: are like judging folks for I don't know, getting groceries
Speaker 1: delivered or whatever. And there's a lot of impact of that.
Speaker 1: But for some people that's not like laziness, right. I mean,
Speaker 1: we definitely relied on it during the pandemic as something
Speaker 1: that when we didn't want to go out, we didn't
Speaker 1: want to spread things. We were very concerned people who
Speaker 1: were even compromised, and it was a resource that was
Speaker 1: necessary that really did help try to maintain the spread.
Speaker 1: And it's that that was the first time you really
Speaker 1: understood why this could be beneficial. But yeah, that definitely
Speaker 1: could be abused and I know this is a whole
Speaker 1: different thing, and that's the whole conversation of like people
Speaker 1: with disabilities have to rely on things like this, and
Speaker 1: it's a service that that should have been happening previously. Absolutely,
Speaker 1: we absolutely should not be like judging or shaming people
Speaker 1: for whom they really rely on this for a lifeline.
Speaker 1: And I think that's one of the reasons why it's
Speaker 1: so important that the people who are you know, doing
Speaker 1: the grocery delivery, who are the workers and the staff,
Speaker 1: they should be treated well, they should be compensated well,
Speaker 1: they should have protections like and people with disabilities should
Speaker 1: not have to rely on like private some pretty exploitative
Speaker 1: like grocery delivery apps like we like, everybody deserves better
Speaker 1: and we shouldn't be judging anybody who is just trying
Speaker 1: to live their life. Um. But I do think that
Speaker 1: we are in a place where people who again myself included,
Speaker 1: maybe got into some bad online shopping habits without really
Speaker 1: hitting pause and really thinking about whether those habits, you know,
Speaker 1: maybe got us through a tough time emotionally during but
Speaker 1: maybe aren't really serving us so well or wallets so
Speaker 1: well if you're me here right right. It's kind of
Speaker 1: interesting because I think we've talked about this for I'm
Speaker 1: a big fan of TikTok, I can get lost in
Speaker 1: it for hours and hours at a time. I get
Speaker 1: that so many things and like, yeah, it starts to
Speaker 1: read me and I'm like, okay, stop that. Why are
Speaker 1: you sitting at me? An add about this And it's
Speaker 1: not necessarily an add but it's someone that I trust,
Speaker 1: or say trust uh and quotes because it's someone that
Speaker 1: I like and follow and they seem like good people
Speaker 1: you never know, uh. And then they're like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: these are my five Amazon fines and these are my
Speaker 1: five Costco fines and I'm like, yes, you are correct.
Speaker 1: I need those things. Have did I know that it existed? No?
Speaker 1: But I absolutely need those things, and it's getting to
Speaker 1: be more and more. The five Amazon stuff always gets me.
Speaker 1: And I have this thing with like there's so many
Speaker 1: creators on TikTok, which I'm also addicted to. Uh, so
Speaker 1: I feel you on that, Sam, but like TikTok ers
Speaker 1: who are all about you know, like, oh, here's like
Speaker 1: here's what my really organized desk or workspace looks like
Speaker 1: Like I clearly have some kind of emotional hang up
Speaker 1: around the way that work gets done in my life,
Speaker 1: and so I subsequently follow a lot of creators for
Speaker 1: who mets their niche, and so they're like, here's what
Speaker 1: my notion looks like, Here's what my dot journaling looks like.
Speaker 1: You're is what my laptop or workstation looks like, and
Speaker 1: that I clearly have some kind of a like hang
Speaker 1: up about that internally, and so I watch a lot
Speaker 1: of that, And so whenever they're like, my, you know,
Speaker 1: go to my Amazon store front my five you know,
Speaker 1: the five things that really helped me stay productive, I
Speaker 1: know that I'm kind of vulnerable and prime to just
Speaker 1: click by without even thinking about it because it speaks
Speaker 1: to some sort of internal like the issue I have
Speaker 1: where I'm like, I must think that, oh, the way
Speaker 1: that work gets done in my life is not up
Speaker 1: to par with the way that work gets done in
Speaker 1: the lives of other creative people or something. And so
Speaker 1: it's really I think part of it really is like
Speaker 1: knowing your triggers and knowing knowing the the vulnerabilities that
Speaker 1: you have that we're so likely to try to fill
Speaker 1: by hitting by now or by buying a thing that
Speaker 1: we really ultimately might not even need. And so you
Speaker 1: know that if I had to give this this conversation
Speaker 1: like a so what it's that we should really be
Speaker 1: in a headspace of asking some questions when it feels
Speaker 1: like the algorithm or the app or the platform is
Speaker 1: the one in control and we are passive. I think
Speaker 1: that what is really important is if we switch that
Speaker 1: dynamic so that we, the human, the person who makes
Speaker 1: the money and makes the decisions about how the money
Speaker 1: gets spent, is the one in control and that we
Speaker 1: are not, you know, at the behest of algorithms and
Speaker 1: influencers who we don't even know, and you know, apps
Speaker 1: and platforms, and so in service of that, I think
Speaker 1: it kind of makes sense to kind of talk about
Speaker 1: how we got here, like a little bit of a
Speaker 1: look back on influencing and how how we got to
Speaker 1: this point. Or maybe people are kind of starting to
Speaker 1: ask a few questions about the role that social media
Speaker 1: influencing has on our life. So if I had to
Speaker 1: ask you, what do you think used to be the
Speaker 1: main app on social media where a lot of influencing
Speaker 1: was taking place, what would you say? Instagram? Instagram? Instagram.
Speaker 1: It's absolutely Instagram. You know, back in the goals, the
Speaker 1: era of Instagram, it looked good, it had a good layout,
Speaker 1: it was easy to use, it was understandable. It was.
Speaker 1: It was it was a different time, right, and so
Speaker 1: I think like one it felt back then this one
Speaker 1: I'm gonna say, like this is liketeen is when I
Speaker 1: would kind of situate this. So it felt kind of
Speaker 1: clear how one would get engagement. So if you were
Speaker 1: on the if you were an influencer, if you were
Speaker 1: on the influencer side of things, you probably had a
Speaker 1: pretty clear sense of like what the algorithm was going
Speaker 1: to reward. It rewarded images of faces, for instance, and
Speaker 1: so the rules seemed pretty doable. You know, post every
Speaker 1: day post natively from the Instagram app as opposed to
Speaker 1: adding a picture later. Like it was pretty clear like
Speaker 1: what you needed to do to to do well on Instagram.
Speaker 1: Algorithmically speaking, I think that us, as the audience who
Speaker 1: was consuming the content that influencers made on Instagram, we
Speaker 1: also had a pretty good sense of what to expect.
Speaker 1: You know, you were gonna get conventionally attractive women who
Speaker 1: were giving you like life envy and making it seem like,
Speaker 1: oh well, if you bought this specific item, your life
Speaker 1: could be like mine, right, And like, obviously this is
Speaker 1: like a curated, manufactured lie that could absolutely be harmful
Speaker 1: to people who were consuming it um as researchers like
Speaker 1: very clear, but I would argue that there was something
Speaker 1: familiar to it, right, Like we understood what to expect
Speaker 1: as an audience who was consuming the content of influencers.
Speaker 1: But now here. There are two big things that are
Speaker 1: happening that I believe have really shifted this Golden Instagram
Speaker 1: age and thus shifted how folks are maybe feeling about influencers.
Speaker 1: The first is that the social media landscape is really
Speaker 1: really changing and really seeing some seismic shifts. We've seen
Speaker 1: this play out in a couple of ways. One, people
Speaker 1: just are not using Instagram like they were in the
Speaker 1: golden era of you know, a new report in the
Speaker 1: Atlantic that came out last month called Everyone Is Over
Speaker 1: Instagram said that Instagram is slowly and steadily losing its
Speaker 1: relevant specifically with young users, and like that's the user
Speaker 1: base that any social media platform really needs to court,
Speaker 1: like young people. You want young people to really be
Speaker 1: using your platform for to feel like really relevant, right right.
Speaker 1: And It's funny because I I am not on TikTok,
Speaker 1: but I've noticed that Instagram is just like videos now
Speaker 1: it's like to talk, which is a different thing. It's
Speaker 1: a different thing. Um, but it is interesting to me.
Speaker 1: I love I'm fascinated by kind of these like shifts.
Speaker 1: Why do people like, like why are people into TikTok
Speaker 1: over like Instagram? Why why is that happening? Um? But yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean why why is it that Instagram has lost favor?
Speaker 1: Why is it fading? That's a great question. I would
Speaker 1: say one is just that, like when the rules become
Speaker 1: less transparent or just less doable, I think people find
Speaker 1: it less kind of worth it to post there, right,
Speaker 1: And so I think that if the rules felt clear
Speaker 1: in Tony four teen, today, it seems like every month
Speaker 1: Instagram announces a new things are going to be prioritizing.
Speaker 1: It used to be static images, then it's going to
Speaker 1: be video. You know. It used to be like if
Speaker 1: you posted once a day, that was enough. Then Instagram
Speaker 1: put out guidance for creators that was like, oh, you
Speaker 1: need to be making four reels a day. That's a
Speaker 1: lot of content. It's just not possible. And so if
Speaker 1: Instagram decides we're going to algorithmically reward people who follow,
Speaker 1: this like difficult to follow and also difficult to understand
Speaker 1: and constantly changing set of guidelines, and if you don't
Speaker 1: follow those, we're not going to show your post to anybody,
Speaker 1: even your friends, even the people who want to see
Speaker 1: your posts. It just eventually starts to feel like, well,
Speaker 1: what's the point, right, Like that's one of the reasons
Speaker 1: why personally, like I've used Instagram less. It's because whatever
Speaker 1: the guidance is they give to creators to try to
Speaker 1: get more engagement on the platform, it's just too much.
Speaker 1: Right Like I have at work, I don't. It's like,
Speaker 1: Instagram is not my job. For some people, it is
Speaker 1: their job, and so I can understand, you know, playing
Speaker 1: the game a willle bit more, but it's not what
Speaker 1: I do. I have do other things in my life.
Speaker 1: And so if then I'm going to be kind of
Speaker 1: I use this word very lightly, but like punished algorithmically
Speaker 1: by having my content not shown to people, even people
Speaker 1: who I know, even people who are my friends who
Speaker 1: I know want to see that content. What is the point? Like?
Speaker 1: Why why jump through those hoops if that's how you're
Speaker 1: gonna gonna be treated on a platform, you know, right?
Speaker 1: You know? And I was thinking as with Instagram when
Speaker 1: we were talking about yes, there's all these reels and
Speaker 1: the younger people are getting frustrated. They also changed the algorithm.
Speaker 1: I know there was like a whole year long campaign
Speaker 1: of people just asking can you see this post um,
Speaker 1: And even for our posts at stuff mo, I've never
Speaker 1: told you we are verified. We have our thirty thousand followers.
Speaker 1: We rarely get more than four or five likes because
Speaker 1: we don't post but every other day. And like when
Speaker 1: you look up, how do you get you know, followers
Speaker 1: or views. It's literally like you said the post four things,
Speaker 1: but now it's adding post this, putting it on the reel,
Speaker 1: put it on the like the videos, and you have
Speaker 1: to do all three of those things. So you're literally
Speaker 1: taking four post times three to put it on the
Speaker 1: same site, and it doesn't sound like it's worth it anymore.
Speaker 1: And then the suppression alone with the algorithm, why just
Speaker 1: why exactly? And you have to basically be a one
Speaker 1: person like studio, right because like you have to make
Speaker 1: the post turn it into a real comments and it's
Speaker 1: like you have a job, dude, Like you're a podcaster.
Speaker 1: It's like your job is not doing Instagram. And I've
Speaker 1: actually worked with like um social media managers, like professional
Speaker 1: social media managers to help grow my account. And you know,
Speaker 1: this was a few years ago, so I can't speak
Speaker 1: to whether or not this is good advice now, So
Speaker 1: don't try this thinking this is this is how you
Speaker 1: grow Instagram now because I really don't know. But something
Speaker 1: that she did is like, oh yeah, I just spend
Speaker 1: a good amount of time commenting on content of accounts
Speaker 1: that are similar to you in what they post. And
Speaker 1: so you know, she would spend like two hours a
Speaker 1: day this being like great posts. Yeah, I love this,
Speaker 1: and like, who has time for that? Right? Like I
Speaker 1: was doing a little experiment to see if it woul help,
Speaker 1: and it actually did help grow my account. But like,
Speaker 1: am I going to sit there and do that? Absolutely not, right, Like,
Speaker 1: and so I can see why people are just like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna do that. Don't need that. And I
Speaker 1: think any I think that you mentioned that, um, when
Speaker 1: you go to Instagram now, what you've kind of see
Speaker 1: is a lot of reels that are really TikTok's that
Speaker 1: you saw on TikTok if you have that platform, you know,
Speaker 1: a week ago, and so it kind of I think separately,
Speaker 1: I think that Instagram is really confused about what role
Speaker 1: they are trying to play in our lives and in
Speaker 1: our social media diets. I don't think that they know.
Speaker 1: I think that like one day it will be images,
Speaker 1: one day it'll be real. It's like not clear and
Speaker 1: it's so funny because, um, someone else who is really
Speaker 1: impressed about this are the Kardashians. Folks might recall that
Speaker 1: over the summer, um, Kylie Jenner and Kim Kardashian both
Speaker 1: posted an image saying, make Instagram Instagram again. Stop trying
Speaker 1: to be TikTok. I just want to see cute photos
Speaker 1: of my friends. And this is really kind of not
Speaker 1: surprising to me because the Kardashians are so good at
Speaker 1: being Instagram friendly or the friendly for the version of
Speaker 1: Instagram that Instagram used to be, right, Like, they're all beautiful,
Speaker 1: they all take beautiful pictures. They're all really good at
Speaker 1: looking kind of Instagram perfect and polished. TikTok takes it
Speaker 1: in a completely different skill set. You kind of have
Speaker 1: to be funny or engaging, or you know, you have
Speaker 1: to have something that's gonna make Like, just looking good
Speaker 1: on TikTok is not enough. You have to bring something else.
Speaker 1: And no shade to the Kardashians that is not my
Speaker 1: skill set either, So I'm not I'm not trying to
Speaker 1: put them down or anything. And so what's interesting is
Speaker 1: that after the Kardashians said, like, oh, go back to
Speaker 1: cute pictures of my friends, the head of Instagram responded
Speaker 1: over the summer saying that Instagram they just needed to
Speaker 1: focus on video and reels to survive and grow as
Speaker 1: a platform. Um. But then just last week he posted
Speaker 1: that you know that was the wrong move. He did
Speaker 1: a complete about face, and he said that Instagram quote
Speaker 1: over folk is on video last year, and so now
Speaker 1: the platform is going back to balancing the amount of
Speaker 1: photos and video shown to users. UM. In one example
Speaker 1: that he gave, you said that Instagram will consider how
Speaker 1: often a person likes some comments on photos versus videos
Speaker 1: to determine which content will appear first in their feeds.
Speaker 1: And so this really tells me they're like, they don't
Speaker 1: know what they're doing. They're not sure of their strategy.
Speaker 1: You know, it's not clear to them what they're trying
Speaker 1: to be. And I think it's no wonder how people
Speaker 1: are like, yeah, I'll let y'all figure it out. And
Speaker 1: while you'll figure it out, I'm gonna be on TikTok
Speaker 1: or or just be getting rid of social media altogether.
Speaker 1: You know, I think it's kind of funny because I
Speaker 1: think of this analogy. When you think of Instagram, I
Speaker 1: think of the elder millennials as me. Don't don't. I
Speaker 1: don't want to hear it, because I've been between the
Speaker 1: xers and the millennials. I came at the right of
Speaker 1: the cup. But like elder millennials trying to be cool
Speaker 1: and hip and talk to those gen z ears who
Speaker 1: would be the TikTok goods and all, that's what's happening.
Speaker 1: What we see is like Instagram trying to be really
Speaker 1: cool and really relevant. It's just kind of missing the
Speaker 1: mark because we are no longer at that point in life.
Speaker 1: And I find it funny because that's all I can
Speaker 1: think of TikTok versus Instagram. I'm trying to become TikTok,
Speaker 1: and TikTok's like I don't care about you, so nothing
Speaker 1: is like more. I mean, I love I love this
Speaker 1: contact because I think that like gen z younger folks,
Speaker 1: I like, I love it when they come for us
Speaker 1: elder millennials. Um, sometimes they'll be like things that millennials
Speaker 1: really need to stop doing on Instagram, and they I'm
Speaker 1: always like yes, drag me like like no more boomerang,
Speaker 1: you can fix us, thank you, and you know the
Speaker 1: other part of that. And again, I think this has
Speaker 1: a lot to do with the generational changes, and again
Speaker 1: I love it is like, yeah, Instagram really gave birth to,
Speaker 1: as we said, influencers and selling us things and selling
Speaker 1: us ideas and selling us things that we will never
Speaker 1: be and try to what what we try to still attain,
Speaker 1: which is the Kardashians. You know, they were really big
Speaker 1: force uh in that. But with TikTok, it seems like
Speaker 1: the younger generations that was really into it was like,
Speaker 1: we're tired of celebrities. We want a chance to see
Speaker 1: regular people who have a lot of good ideas and content.
Speaker 1: And the TikTok is for the people. Because I know
Speaker 1: there's been a lot of pushback as celebrities are not
Speaker 1: jumping on TikTok, but people, I stop it, this is
Speaker 1: not for you. Oh my god, I could talk about
Speaker 1: this for hours. This is something I find so fascinating.
Speaker 1: So I think because TikTok is a younger platform, they
Speaker 1: just have a completely different relationship with digital life than
Speaker 1: like them then millennials have and so I absolutely agree
Speaker 1: with you that, especially for younger folks who are spending
Speaker 1: time on TikTok, and TikTok is the is the fastest
Speaker 1: growing social media app out there right now. I think
Speaker 1: the audience is very different from the curated Instagram audience
Speaker 1: and that they do want more real stuff, but they
Speaker 1: want authenticity, not that like fake like oh my house
Speaker 1: is so messy, authenticity like really authenticity, and they are vocal,
Speaker 1: like they will call you out. There was a whole
Speaker 1: thing with um. I think it was Bethanie Frankel going
Speaker 1: on TikTok and her transition to TikTok wasn't very smooth,
Speaker 1: and I think part of it is because like celebrities
Speaker 1: maybe are used to being able to say certain things
Speaker 1: and get everybody fawning all over them on Instagram or
Speaker 1: on other social media platforms, and they're not finding that
Speaker 1: reception on TikTok. Like TikTok is the app for like
Speaker 1: regular people to talk, it's not for celebrities to like
Speaker 1: hawk their perfect lives. And there's actually a influencer right now,
Speaker 1: like a big influencer michaela Nigeria. I apologize I been
Speaker 1: saying her last name wrong, but um, it's in very
Speaker 1: hot water for trying to do a mascara brand like
Speaker 1: sponsored content while allegedly wearing false lashes. And so obviously
Speaker 1: you can't be like this. A mascara is so great.
Speaker 1: Look look at the way it should transform my lad
Speaker 1: to where it's like, I think those are freak flashes, um,
Speaker 1: And so people are calling this person out because that
Speaker 1: doesn't fly there, right, And so I think that, like,
Speaker 1: you're exactly right, Sam, that the audience that is big
Speaker 1: on TikTok is a lot more vocal, a lot more savvy,
Speaker 1: and they will call you out if they feel like
Speaker 1: they're being pushed something that's just like like a fantasy
Speaker 1: that's not real. Maybe on on Instagram you might get
Speaker 1: away with that, but not on TikTok. Well, I will
Speaker 1: say the thing about TikTok is there are TikTok sluts
Speaker 1: that that is their intent and entire content is like
Speaker 1: to call out the falsehood of other content. It is
Speaker 1: the rabbit holes I have gone down where I'm like,
Speaker 1: I don't even know this person. I have never even
Speaker 1: seen them on TikTok, but apparently they're faking having a
Speaker 1: scar to get clouts. I need to reach a thousand
Speaker 1: comments and spend six hours of my time on this
Speaker 1: despite only having one one life to live on this
Speaker 1: green nurse. And I know what you're talking about, and
Speaker 1: I hate that. I know what you're talking about out
Speaker 1: because I did the dance same thing. What is this
Speaker 1: that to do with it? Like, it has nothing to
Speaker 1: do with me. This isn't even somebody who I follow
Speaker 1: or I'm invested in, like you get you're like people
Speaker 1: the evidence that people compile. It's like, I'm fascinated if
Speaker 1: if anything ever happens to me. I guess I shouldn't
Speaker 1: say that, but like the way that like TikTok's flues
Speaker 1: are able to like investigate the nitty gritty, that really
Speaker 1: doesn't matter. My hats are off to them. The petty.
Speaker 1: The petty is real, and if it's all in good fun,
Speaker 1: there's definitely seriousness that we definitely talked about before. But
Speaker 1: the pettiness is real. And when you get invested in,
Speaker 1: you're just like, well, well well, and you can't help
Speaker 1: but be the voyor and you feel a little guilty.
Speaker 1: I will say that, um, but you can't put one
Speaker 1: over on them. And it continues to baffle me because
Speaker 1: as as you're talking about TikTok is one of the
Speaker 1: younger ones, the way that it has grown exponentially, I'm like,
Speaker 1: is it going to be able to keep up with
Speaker 1: that demand? Yeah, that's such a great question. I actually
Speaker 1: this is a this is a a fuego take. So
Speaker 1: you know, whatever is my opinion. I think that we
Speaker 1: are going to see government legislation of TikTok in This
Speaker 1: is like my big tech prediction. I think that it's
Speaker 1: growing so much. I think there are national security questions.
Speaker 1: I guess I'll just put it that way. I think
Speaker 1: that you know, there have been there is like rarer
Speaker 1: bipartisan support for doing something about TikTok. It's already been
Speaker 1: banned on I think federal government devices can't have TikTok
Speaker 1: on them. A handful of states have banned having TikTok
Speaker 1: on state run devices, and that number is growing. Universities
Speaker 1: are the same at numbers growing of universities that have
Speaker 1: banned TikTok from state state owned devices. I think that
Speaker 1: we are seeing enough traction in government in a in
Speaker 1: a bipartisan way and also civil society and institutions that
Speaker 1: I do think that like something is going to happen
Speaker 1: or be done to combat TikTok's growth, because their growth
Speaker 1: has just been like if folks want to look it up,
Speaker 1: like it is wild, how many users it is gaining.
Speaker 1: It's just it's just like exploding. One of the things
Speaker 1: that I think about TikTok becoming kind of the new
Speaker 1: place where people are spending their time online on social media. Um,
Speaker 1: why that might be fueling a kind of backlash against
Speaker 1: influencing is that this moves a lot faster than Instagram,
Speaker 1: which fuels what they call micro trends. And so if
Speaker 1: a trend is something that it's in style for a
Speaker 1: little bit of time, a micro trend is something that
Speaker 1: becomes in style or in vogue very quickly and then
Speaker 1: burns out just as quickly. Something can be iconic and
Speaker 1: very popular one month, and by the end of the
Speaker 1: month people are talking about it being out of style.
Speaker 1: A great example is like, um, this clothing brand I
Speaker 1: really doubled down on and like went for a hard
Speaker 1: house of sunny. They make this like very bright colored
Speaker 1: clothing that really pops on social media, and I was like,
Speaker 1: oh my god, and I bought like a sweater and
Speaker 1: address and this and that. Maybe a month later people
Speaker 1: were like, oh, would already looks so dated. And so
Speaker 1: if you think about what is sort of in style,
Speaker 1: how quickly it becomes sort of pass I think that
Speaker 1: TikTok becoming a place where people spend more of their
Speaker 1: digital time online is one of the reasons why trends
Speaker 1: are kind of flaming out so quickly, and so if
Speaker 1: you're an influencer, you know that's just a lot having
Speaker 1: to like it is exhausting to be in even this
Speaker 1: in the audience, to be told you need to buy
Speaker 1: a new thing over and over and over again, and
Speaker 1: in in January, it's this water bottle. In February that
Speaker 1: water bottles out. Now it's this water bottle. It's it's
Speaker 1: no wonder that people can't really keep up with that
Speaker 1: because it's too fast. That's so funny. I feel like
Speaker 1: I'm the like millennial person that comes in like, oh,
Speaker 1: I finally got this thing, and they're like, that's three
Speaker 1: years ago, what are you doing. It does feel like
Speaker 1: it moves very very quickly, and actually an interesting implication
Speaker 1: of this kind of thing is like, because I also
Speaker 1: do a food podcast, is the thing like the feta pasta,
Speaker 1: like feta cheese, like couldn't you couldn't find it anywhere,
Speaker 1: And it was because of TikTok. And then a month
Speaker 1: later everyone was like, what are you talking about? But
Speaker 1: for that one month, nobody could find feta cheese. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I see it with food. It's so interesting when it
Speaker 1: happens with food because it does correlate with when you
Speaker 1: go to the grocery store. It's just like not there. Um,
Speaker 1: I've heard that tinned fish is like the new thing
Speaker 1: right now, which if you don't want to talk about
Speaker 1: like our economic climate, the fact that like tinned fish
Speaker 1: that go just having our tinned fish date that tells
Speaker 1: me something. I'm like, oh, people are thinking about our
Speaker 1: economic climate in some perhaps like less than cheery outlook,
Speaker 1: which brings us to what we've been talking about. Is
Speaker 1: another piece of this is like like like what I
Speaker 1: was saying with myself my friends, is this anxiety of
Speaker 1: this like maybe if I buy this thing, I'll feel better,
Speaker 1: like maybe this will make things better. And that's not
Speaker 1: unique absolutely, And so the second thing that we're seeing
Speaker 1: that's really I think shaping all this is this kind
Speaker 1: of feeling of like economic unease and uncertainty that is
Speaker 1: impacting the way that people are responding to influencing. I
Speaker 1: think that a lot of folks are concerned about an
Speaker 1: economic downturn. We're seeing like layoffs and a lot of
Speaker 1: sectors like tech and media. I don't I think people
Speaker 1: are perhaps wary about spending money on things that they
Speaker 1: see online and maybe doing it in a different way
Speaker 1: than maybe once we're in And I think that, like
Speaker 1: more importantly, I think that as we go into times
Speaker 1: that are uncertain, economically uncertain, economically unstable, people don't really
Speaker 1: want to open up their phone and see people living
Speaker 1: the high life, right Like, it just doesn't feel good
Speaker 1: to be worried about inflation, worried about food being on
Speaker 1: the shelves, worried about how you're gonna make rent, if
Speaker 1: you're gonna be laid off, and open your phone and
Speaker 1: see an influencer trying to sell you that their life
Speaker 1: is perfect and that your life can be perfect too
Speaker 1: if you buy this thing that you don't need, don't
Speaker 1: have money for, and don't even really want. I think
Speaker 1: that people are just not feeling that vibe anymore. I
Speaker 1: think there was a time where that had a time
Speaker 1: and a place and it felt very familiar. I think
Speaker 1: right now we're not loving it. Yeah, yeah, it just
Speaker 1: feels kind of like out of touch. And and and you
Speaker 1: brought up the Kardashians earlier, and they're big, like they've
Speaker 1: even been in the news recently for like lawsuits, but
Speaker 1: they were really big about this of like selling you
Speaker 1: a thing. It just felt like they weren't kind of
Speaker 1: reading the room. I guess, like totally. I remember they
Speaker 1: and I talked about this in an episode of There
Speaker 1: Are No Girls on the Internet, my own podcast Around
Speaker 1: the Holidays. I remember, I think it was last year
Speaker 1: or the year before, they posted their Easter spread, and
Speaker 1: it was like the most opulent thing, like even for
Speaker 1: Kardashian standards, the most opulent thing you've ever seen. It
Speaker 1: was like life like life size Teddy Bears, full size,
Speaker 1: like five full size gumball machine means, was like pink
Speaker 1: gum in them for bicycles. It was like the most
Speaker 1: elaborate and lavish opulent spread, even by Kardashian standards, that
Speaker 1: I have seen. And the response was not like, Wow,
Speaker 1: how cool for them. The response was over consume much like,
Speaker 1: and I think that that really shows us that we
Speaker 1: are in a place where when they posted that, they
Speaker 1: probably thought everyone was gonna love it, but in reality,
Speaker 1: most people were like, this is a little opulent, seems
Speaker 1: a little tacky, seems a lot of a little out
Speaker 1: of touch for one holiday, Like, at what point do
Speaker 1: we start asking questions about the value of over consumption
Speaker 1: and whether or not that's a value that is like
Speaker 1: inherently good or healthy or like serving us in our lives, right,
Speaker 1: And I mean Instagram and that that's kind of thing,
Speaker 1: is like you're presenting this really curated version of your life,
Speaker 1: um and then kind of at least in my case.
Speaker 1: And I think there's been some says about this, but
Speaker 1: like feeling bad because you'd see other people's pictures are
Speaker 1: like their life is way better than mine. But also,
Speaker 1: and I could be wrong about this, but I feel
Speaker 1: like a lot of the influencers I saw on Instagram
Speaker 1: were women, Like a lot of the people who were like, Hey,
Speaker 1: you need to buy this thing, And maybe that's just
Speaker 1: an algorithm for me, but it's not just you. I
Speaker 1: think this is inherently gendered. The lion share of influencers
Speaker 1: are women and girls. According to a study by the
Speaker 1: influencer marketing agency Isaiah, women accounted for more than of
Speaker 1: sponsorships made as influencers. But I should know if that,
Speaker 1: because this is America. There is also an influencer pay gap.
Speaker 1: Even though there are more like women make up the
Speaker 1: bulk of influencing, they're still paid less than men for influencing,
Speaker 1: which is a real head scratcher. But yeah, I think
Speaker 1: it's women and girls who are being sold all of
Speaker 1: this and they're not. It's we're not. It's being sold products.
Speaker 1: We are being sold products as a proxy for like
Speaker 1: getting your life together, or like succeeding being a woman,
Speaker 1: or or I think that we're being sold on the
Speaker 1: idea that you can consume your way into the kind
Speaker 1: of life that you want. And I think that capitalism
Speaker 1: and consumption as a means of perpetuating gender roles has
Speaker 1: always been a thing. And I think right now, I
Speaker 1: think a lot of women are just exhausted. We have
Speaker 1: been burdened with so much, we have had our rights,
Speaker 1: just like, it's not a very rosy time to be
Speaker 1: a woman. What I'm saying, I don't want. I feel
Speaker 1: like if I go into it, I'll be all here
Speaker 1: all day. But you know, I think that a lot
Speaker 1: of women are just like, on top of everything else
Speaker 1: that we have to shoulder. I don't have the emotional
Speaker 1: bandwidth two buy into this idea that tells me that
Speaker 1: I have to buy this product on Instagram to be
Speaker 1: a more complete woman. You know, I think more women
Speaker 1: are calling bs on this idea, especially younger women, right.
Speaker 1: I will say so immediately after the New Year. The
Speaker 1: first thing and what are the first and I think
Speaker 1: you were superviral. Is this girl laying down in bed
Speaker 1: in TikTok and saying you don't need this. Here are
Speaker 1: the five products you don't need and then goes down
Speaker 1: is of all the trends and that this is about you.
Speaker 1: You're not going to use this, You're not gonna ever
Speaker 1: see it again, don't buy it. You're only good Like
Speaker 1: that was the first video I saw. It was like,
Speaker 1: oh what is this? And the next one was the
Speaker 1: girl who was like, hey, I have a bought every
Speaker 1: single expensive hair product. These are both in Here are
Speaker 1: the products you should go to go to CVS. This
Speaker 1: is much better. Don't buy those expensive things. And I
Speaker 1: was like, what is happening. Yeah, so that is a
Speaker 1: great example of the influencing which is all over TikTok
Speaker 1: right now. So what is the influencing, Well, basically, again,
Speaker 1: it's exactly what it sounds like. Rather than trying to
Speaker 1: convince you to buy something, it's telling you you don't
Speaker 1: actually need to buy this. So creators will be telling
Speaker 1: you like, you don't need another water bottle if you're me,
Speaker 1: you don't need another notebook that you you know, are
Speaker 1: not gonna use when you already have like twenty on yourself,
Speaker 1: or telling you how different TikTok or social media famous
Speaker 1: products are actually not worth the money, not worth it.
Speaker 1: According to the newsletter Glossy, the hashtag de influencing has
Speaker 1: twenty one point four million views and has increased in
Speaker 1: popularity even in just the last week. They spoke to
Speaker 1: a creator who goes by L Gray or Basic of course,
Speaker 1: who pointed to the impact of the economy on consumer
Speaker 1: spending and the ability or lack thereof to buy based
Speaker 1: on influencer recommendations as one of the reasons why de
Speaker 1: influencing is becoming so popular. L says, in the last
Speaker 1: twelve months, we've seen an extreme slowdown in the global economy.
Speaker 1: As we enter into a recession, people are starting to
Speaker 1: feel the effects and are taking a closer look at
Speaker 1: their spending and consumption. Many people have gotten fed up
Speaker 1: with the constant barrage of micro trends and must have items,
Speaker 1: especially as they take a closer look at their bank accounts.
Speaker 1: And so, you know, I think that this creator is
Speaker 1: probably onto something that you know, we started this conversation
Speaker 1: today talking about the things that we and again myself
Speaker 1: very guilty of this uh over consumed online in I
Speaker 1: think that de influencing is a response to some of
Speaker 1: these over consumption habits that a lot of us just
Speaker 1: sort of picked up during the pandemic and like just
Speaker 1: kept having in our life. And now we're like, wait
Speaker 1: a minute, is this actually a good idea? Is it
Speaker 1: actually good that I, you know, we'll just click by
Speaker 1: now and get something without really thinking about if I
Speaker 1: need it, if I want it, Like, is that something
Speaker 1: I actually truly need? Probably not, I will say, I
Speaker 1: feel like and maybe it's just the side of TikTok
Speaker 1: I'm on because we know it is very curated. These
Speaker 1: the influencers who are trying to help you save money
Speaker 1: and tell you what it is and tell you what's working,
Speaker 1: what's not working. It's almost the way of women supporting women,
Speaker 1: or you know, the marginalized supporting the marginalized, Like you're
Speaker 1: the one, I know this is aimed towards you. Typically
Speaker 1: women are typically you know, those who are in like
Speaker 1: really harsh places. So I'm going to help you and
Speaker 1: tell you not to do this. And on top of that,
Speaker 1: the same conversation about the gen z ears again I'm
Speaker 1: still in all of them, is that they are all
Speaker 1: about calling out the bs. So when they see an
Speaker 1: influencers saying this is amazing, and then they start realizing
Speaker 1: this person is all about the money. This person is
Speaker 1: not genuinely doing things, kind of like the mascara, We're
Speaker 1: going to call you out until you don't do this
Speaker 1: again as a way to protect other consumers slash other women.
Speaker 1: I love how you put that. I absolutely have seen
Speaker 1: a million times that women and other marginalized people telling
Speaker 1: each other the truth and leveling with each other and
Speaker 1: breaking down for each other. That is more powerful than
Speaker 1: a million dollar pr AT campaign, than a million well
Speaker 1: paid like you know, pr agents working over time. Nothing
Speaker 1: is more powerful than women sharing their truths with each other,
Speaker 1: and that can like, yeah, it doesn't, It doesn't matter
Speaker 1: what like expensive marketing firm that you've that you've contracted.
Speaker 1: Women sharing each other's truths with each other will always
Speaker 1: be more powerful. Absolutely, yeah. And I find it interesting
Speaker 1: because it's those kind of like that same girl I
Speaker 1: was talking about who was saying don't buy does, and
Speaker 1: she's now gone viral. Being honest, being truthful and trying
Speaker 1: to protect others has really built her audience, and she's
Speaker 1: become an influencer slash the influencer and is now getting
Speaker 1: credibility and may be able to go viral enough to
Speaker 1: like start having her own outlets. Whether it is who knows.
Speaker 1: I know several people from TikTok as well as YouTube,
Speaker 1: but that's the whole thing. Have shows, get shows, get
Speaker 1: brand deals, and get specific deals that are genuinely good
Speaker 1: because they are honest, and it's building them up. So
Speaker 1: it's interesting to see how this the opposite of that
Speaker 1: has grown them. That makes sense. It makes so much
Speaker 1: sense that I've been I think it's I think it
Speaker 1: marks a shift, and I think it's good. I think
Speaker 1: that like we should question why the powers that be
Speaker 1: are so quick to reward people who make their entire
Speaker 1: thing about stuff that you should buy over consumption. We
Speaker 1: could be instead building up honest platforms and platforms that
Speaker 1: say like, well, you really aren't going to use this,
Speaker 1: or you really don't need this. Like I love watching
Speaker 1: on TikTok people who do closet clean out and they're like,
Speaker 1: these are the top five things I like remove from
Speaker 1: people's closets, or like the top ten things people don't
Speaker 1: actually wear, because it might actually help create that shift
Speaker 1: of being a little bit more in tuned and intentional
Speaker 1: about what you buy. And I think that's really important.
Speaker 1: I mean, like, it has so many implications, not you know,
Speaker 1: not the least of which is the environmental impact of Like,
Speaker 1: you know, I had a little bit of a of
Speaker 1: a fast fashion thing myself, like I would buy from
Speaker 1: this brand she she in, where you know, it's like
Speaker 1: it's so it's so cheap, but it like it looks
Speaker 1: it looks like the fancier stuff, but it's so cheap.
Speaker 1: Then it's like, well, you're like, actually it is one
Speaker 1: of the biggest offenders a fast fashion that ends up
Speaker 1: you know, polluting our world. And it's like I don't
Speaker 1: want to be I don't. I don't want, like, I
Speaker 1: don't want my unexamined emotional need to translate to a
Speaker 1: worst world for the next generation to come. And so
Speaker 1: I really kind of solve the like need for me
Speaker 1: to do a little bit of thinking and unpacking and
Speaker 1: intention around my own consumption habits and what I was
Speaker 1: trying to fill by buying things and the longer term
Speaker 1: consequences for generations to come. I know that sounds like
Speaker 1: a lot, but like you're gonna start somewhere right, No,
Speaker 1: it is absolutely goes hand in hand again with the
Speaker 1: new creators that the people who are getting big on
Speaker 1: TikTok are those who are like, hey, you're doing these
Speaker 1: things and it could be of course, this is a
Speaker 1: whole different conversation about diagnosing and assuming everybody's one thing
Speaker 1: or another, but it does call call out to be like, hey,
Speaker 1: you have this reaction which could be costing you money,
Speaker 1: costing your time because of a trauma, so you're focusing
Speaker 1: on the wrong thing. Like I do love seeing them
Speaker 1: correlate actual action to internalized trauma or uh maybe reasoning
Speaker 1: however you want to say it. But it is encouraging
Speaker 1: to see that there's more correlations that these influencers slash
Speaker 1: TikTok people are talking about out loud, So you start
Speaker 1: considering the actual basis of trying consuming too much or
Speaker 1: consuming way too fast, or not thinking about it. It's
Speaker 1: both encouraging and kind of scary to see how quickly
Speaker 1: this can flip, because we really did go from a
Speaker 1: generation of we have to be perfect, we have to
Speaker 1: look perfect, we have to be the Kardashians, uh, white
Speaker 1: girl version of what I mean by that is the
Speaker 1: skinny skinny version you you know, yeah, I know what
Speaker 1: I'm talking about um too. But to like coming into
Speaker 1: loving your body, do things that are healthy for you,
Speaker 1: do things that make you happy, do things that bring
Speaker 1: you joy, and then going into and that comes to
Speaker 1: having peace of mind. And this is how you do it.
Speaker 1: And so it's kind of interesting to see how we
Speaker 1: flip there. But we are at this cusp of like
Speaker 1: it could flip again, and is it going to be
Speaker 1: healthy or unhealthy? I think again, TikTok is being is
Speaker 1: encouraging to me to see the creators that I'm seeing.
Speaker 1: That's such a good point and I think, you know,
Speaker 1: the bottom line of this is that you cannot consume
Speaker 1: yourself into feeling like a complete version of yourself to
Speaker 1: feeling whole. You know, I talked earlier about how I
Speaker 1: get really kind of stuck on these like people who
Speaker 1: are full time creatives or full time creative professionals and
Speaker 1: and the way that that work gets done in their lives,
Speaker 1: and how it looks so good to me. It looks
Speaker 1: like they're very together, like they've got lists, they look
Speaker 1: very organized and very cozy and very peaceful. And that
Speaker 1: clearly that is speaking that some kind of perception that
Speaker 1: I have internally that I am not enough. There's something
Speaker 1: I can buy that it's going to make me feel enough.
Speaker 1: I have to just get there through self work, through growth,
Speaker 1: through introspection. I I completely understand the need to like
Speaker 1: just hit by now and like if I get everything
Speaker 1: that this woman has in her house, maybe I'll get it,
Speaker 1: but I won't. You can't consume your way into I guess,
Speaker 1: feel good about what you've got, feeling good about who
Speaker 1: you are, you know, feeling good at like feeling like
Speaker 1: yourself and feeling like that's enough. There's just not a
Speaker 1: product that's going to do that. It's gonna take It's
Speaker 1: gonna take work, and so I think, you know that's
Speaker 1: it's definitely easier to just buy a thing, and I,
Speaker 1: boy do I keep trying, but I know I just
Speaker 1: got some tease that I went viral. We won't talk
Speaker 1: about that more. Oh, it's like this is I don't
Speaker 1: want this to sound judging, because like who amongst us right,
Speaker 1: like I am, we're all works on progress. But but
Speaker 1: if you were interested in trying to unwork, unpack some
Speaker 1: of this, like de influence yourself, first, I should say, like,
Speaker 1: I'm not a professional. So if you if you are
Speaker 1: someone listening and you think that you really might have
Speaker 1: a true issue with like buying things and shopping that
Speaker 1: you might need to talk to somebody about, you should
Speaker 1: do that. Talk to a professional if you feel like
Speaker 1: your issue rises beyond you know what we're talking about here.
Speaker 1: But a couple of tips that might help folks de
Speaker 1: influence themselves. My favorite sleeper tip is that if you
Speaker 1: have an I phone or I think I think it
Speaker 1: works on injury to um using your phone in gray scale.
Speaker 1: My phone is in gray scale probably of the time.
Speaker 1: You can go into your accessibility settings on your iPhone
Speaker 1: and change your your phone to gray scale, and I
Speaker 1: have it so that the little button on the side,
Speaker 1: the power button, if I hit that three times, it
Speaker 1: flips from gray scale to color. So if somebody sends
Speaker 1: me a picture where it's like, oh, I need to
Speaker 1: see this in color to get the context, I can easily,
Speaker 1: you know, flip it to color, flip it back. When
Speaker 1: I tell you that, it makes things on your phone
Speaker 1: looks so much less enticing and less appealing. And I
Speaker 1: can absolutely feel it when I'm looking at my phone
Speaker 1: and color. I can feel the little synapses and neurons
Speaker 1: going off in my brain that tell me by this,
Speaker 1: click that, look at that, read that, And it makes
Speaker 1: the experience of using social media more boring, but in
Speaker 1: a good way. I'm just I feel a lot more
Speaker 1: in control when all of these bright colors that are
Speaker 1: literally designed by people who make lots and lots of
Speaker 1: money to to like, you know, fire things in your
Speaker 1: brain and to get you to be as as as
Speaker 1: tuned in and it's plugged in as you can. And
Speaker 1: so I'm a big fan of like trying to to
Speaker 1: throw our wrench in this techno hacking that messes with
Speaker 1: all of our brains. So trying to put your phone
Speaker 1: in gray scale. I love it. Another one is that
Speaker 1: when you feel that twitch in your brain that says
Speaker 1: I need this, don't click by right away, right like,
Speaker 1: ask yourself, does this fill a legitimate need in my life?
Speaker 1: If you're Samantha's partner? Is it just another vessel with
Speaker 1: which to drink coffee or liquids? That do? I already
Speaker 1: have a vessel or several vessels that make that need.
Speaker 1: I throw it out and then like, notice your emotions,
Speaker 1: like when you feel influenced, really asked, like, do I
Speaker 1: feel the need to buy this because it is serving
Speaker 1: an emotional need or feeling an emotional hole that I have?
Speaker 1: And what's that about? You can really just start small,
Speaker 1: just asking isn't that interesting? Be curious about the emotions
Speaker 1: that are sparked for you when you're using social media.
Speaker 1: My therapist always says that judgment and curiosity cannot coexist.
Speaker 1: And so rather than being like, oh, you just are
Speaker 1: so bad with the money, you just throw money away,
Speaker 1: You just cannot stop shopping online. That's judgment. And so
Speaker 1: when you're judging the way that you feel, when you're
Speaker 1: judging your emotions, you can't be curious about them. Curiosity
Speaker 1: is how we get to some place better and like
Speaker 1: move forward, and then lastly, learn to love what you
Speaker 1: already have. You know, I spent so long chasing micro
Speaker 1: trends and quick hit trends that when I look at
Speaker 1: my closet, there are things in there that I love
Speaker 1: that I don't even really know where they are. I
Speaker 1: don't even have access to them or see them because
Speaker 1: my closet is so full of the stuff that I
Speaker 1: bought that I didn't even really think about, and so
Speaker 1: it makes it harder for me to love the things
Speaker 1: that I actually do have that feel good and so
Speaker 1: the things that I really do value in life. Because
Speaker 1: there are plenty of things that I bought where I'm like,
Speaker 1: oh that was I do not regret that choice. That
Speaker 1: was a goodbye. It makes it harder to really appreciate
Speaker 1: the things that are good byes and have them stand
Speaker 1: out when you just buy so much crap that you
Speaker 1: don't even really need right organized, because you will find
Speaker 1: that thing you love that you forgot about for two.
Speaker 1: If you do that, you shop your closet exactly. Yes,
Speaker 1: during the pandemic, I remember there were a couple of
Speaker 1: times where I was like I really really want this thing,
Speaker 1: and then I would look through my closet. I already
Speaker 1: have that thing. Yes, I can't tell you how many
Speaker 1: times it's happened. Where'm like, I'm like doing reruns, Like
Speaker 1: I like, I'm already in reruns on my closet, like
Speaker 1: what is this? And then like, if you're me anyway,
Speaker 1: I wear like the same T shirt like for an
Speaker 1: entire week. So yeah, buying new clothes just to wear
Speaker 1: your uniform every day? Like what are we doing? Right? Yes? Well,
Speaker 1: thank you as always for it for bringing this topic
Speaker 1: to us. It was very informative for me. I've not
Speaker 1: heard of this. This is amazing. I love it. I
Speaker 1: love it. I love it. Yes, where can the good
Speaker 1: listeners find you? Well, you can always tune into my
Speaker 1: podcast on this very same network. There are no girls
Speaker 1: on the internet. You can follow me on Instagram at
Speaker 1: Bridget Brian d C. I will not influence you. I
Speaker 1: can't promise that I will never, but you know, like
Speaker 1: we gotta eat. No, I'm just kidding. On Twitter at
Speaker 1: Bridget Murray I love it. Yes, go go check that
Speaker 1: us out if you haven't already, listeners, thank you again
Speaker 1: Bridget for coming. We love having you, can't wait to
Speaker 1: have you again. Yes, yes uh. And the listeners I
Speaker 1: who would like to contact us, you can or email.
Speaker 1: It's definitely a mom Stuff that I Hurt Me dot com.
Speaker 1: You can find us on Twitter at moms to podcast,
Speaker 1: or on Instagram and TikTok what that stuff Mom Never
Speaker 1: told You? Thanks as always to our super producer Christina,
Speaker 1: Thank you, and thanks to you for listening Stuff When
Speaker 1: Never Told You. Protection by Heart Radio. For more podcast
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