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Speaker 1: Y'all welcomed to Zone seven. We are talking about the

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Speaker 1: case of Nancy Guthrie. This thing started Saturday, January thirty. First,

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Speaker 1: I have nothing but concerns over this case. I do

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Speaker 1: not think she's alive. And I've got some of the

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Speaker 1: best in the business joining me tonight so that we

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Speaker 1: can talk about it and bring to you as much

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Speaker 1: as we can. I've got Dan Murphy, retired NYPD homicide.

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Speaker 1: He ran it, he was over it. He knows it

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Speaker 1: better than anybody else. Tom Smith, retired NYPD decorated homicide.

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Speaker 1: He knows it. Got doctor Pria Banergy. I mean, she's

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Speaker 1: one of the best pathologists we have in the country.

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Speaker 1: So we're going to talk about this thing from a

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Speaker 1: three sixty one view. We're going to give you everything

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Speaker 1: that we think is pertinent, and I'm just gonna kind

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Speaker 1: of go slow and easy because there is so much

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Speaker 1: to this case. There's a lot of confusion, which I

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Speaker 1: think is unfortunate. There's a lot of misstaps which I

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Speaker 1: think are just unforgivable. And then there's some other optics

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Speaker 1: that we're going to talk about that I think if

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Speaker 1: you are a chief of police or you're a sheriff,

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Speaker 1: and you allow this to happen, I'm gonna call you out.

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Speaker 1: That's all there is to it. So Dan, I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: start with you. The very first thing that hit me

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Speaker 1: dead in my face was Savannah Guthrie does not come

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Speaker 1: out day one and use her platform. She is not

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Speaker 1: hollering to everybody, will you please help us search for

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Speaker 1: our mother she's missing? Did that resonate with you at all?

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Speaker 1: That here, She's got this built in media that she's

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Speaker 1: not utilizing.

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Speaker 2: That could go a lot of different ways, Cheryl.

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Speaker 3: She could be so traumatized by this event that she's

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Speaker 3: relying on the public safety officials and her friends and

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Speaker 3: the mediates do the job for her. And initially it

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Speaker 3: came out as a vulnerable adult missing. However, when you

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Speaker 3: break it down, if you're the first cop that responds

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Speaker 3: to that house in Tucson and you see the blood,

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Speaker 3: you don't have a missing person. You have a potential,

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Speaker 3: if not probable, abduction, you have suspicious circumstances.

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Speaker 2: It's a whole different.

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Speaker 1: Ballgame now, Tom. If you're going in that front door

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Speaker 1: to kidnap an eighty four year old woman and you're

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Speaker 1: going to leave by that same door, because that's your path.

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Speaker 1: You know where your vehicle is, you know where everything is.

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Speaker 1: Why are you going to smash the cameras in the

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Speaker 1: back of that house.

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Speaker 4: My view is that you're going to smash the cameras

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Speaker 4: if you know the area, you know the people involved,

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Speaker 4: who you're going after, and you know they have cameras there?

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Speaker 1: Did that look stay like? In other words, they're going

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Speaker 1: to come up to the house. Oh, the camera's all

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Speaker 1: around are smashed. That makes people freak out thinking, oh,

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Speaker 1: they were stalking her. They've got rid of any light

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Speaker 1: that would show they were coming up there. The back

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Speaker 1: of that house is so far from that front door,

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Speaker 1: you would never be on camera. It just seems stage

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Speaker 1: to me.

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Speaker 4: Right, that could have been it could have been a

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Speaker 4: diversion just to be to be looking in another direction.

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Speaker 4: But I think the overall thing is Dan's right. Me

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Speaker 4: and him actually talked about this. Just say, if we're

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Speaker 4: responding there and you see the blood that block that street,

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Speaker 4: that area immediately gets frozen, immediately blocked off. No one's

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Speaker 4: coming in and out, no one's coming up there, and

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Speaker 4: you get additional units to help you out because, like

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Speaker 4: Dan said, it is no longer a missing person. It

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Speaker 4: is now someone's assaulted, someone's bleeding, and the occupant of

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Speaker 4: that house is gone, so she is now the victim.

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Speaker 4: And you have to just start right there. And the

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Speaker 4: kidnapping abduction took place inside. And we've said this so

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Speaker 4: many times that a detective's dream is an interior crime scene.

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Speaker 4: What do you do?

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Speaker 2: You close the door and leave it.

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Speaker 4: Hundred that's it, spcure it, and then you just start

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Speaker 4: doing everything methodically that you have to to process that scene.

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Speaker 1: And Doctor Pria, here we have blood on the inside

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Speaker 1: and outside of the house. But I want you to

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Speaker 1: talk a little bit about an eighty four year old

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Speaker 1: woman that's on blood thinners, has a pacemaker, and can't

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Speaker 1: walk more than fifty yards by herself, ac cornder her children.

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Speaker 5: As soon as she was abducted. You know, I had

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Speaker 5: a not in my stomach. I hate to say it

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Speaker 5: and play armchair quarterback, but you know, to me it

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Speaker 5: was where I mean, she was deceased from the get go.

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Speaker 5: And why I say that is she's so vulnerable. She's

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Speaker 5: eighty four, she has multiple medical problems, is very weak,

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Speaker 5: and this happened in the middle of the night, and

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Speaker 5: so with or without blood. The blood obviously makes it

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Speaker 5: even that much more concerning. But you have to think

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Speaker 5: about just someone with natural medical problems who's under any

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Speaker 5: increased stress.

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Speaker 6: That can cause.

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Speaker 5: Death, and that would still be a homicide under our

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Speaker 5: thought process, right, just the stress of a crime. Right,

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Speaker 5: So it's homicide by heart attack is like what we

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Speaker 5: colloquially call it. But you know, it could be a stroke,

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Speaker 5: it could be just an arrhythmia. I mean, she has

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Speaker 5: a weakened heart, she's weak. So why this wasn't treated

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Speaker 5: with red flags all down the block is beyond me.

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Speaker 5: You know, any time that there's been a possible murder scene,

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Speaker 5: I mean I've spoken about this before, but I used

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Speaker 5: to go to crime scenes when they're questionable debts, when

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Speaker 5: there's any kind of body and I know there's no

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Speaker 5: body here at the moment, but sometimes they would have us.

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Speaker 5: They would definitely give us a heads up and day,

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Speaker 5: meaning homicide detectives, Hey, we have a very suspicious scene.

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Speaker 5: We're working it up, we're digging around. We're gonna need

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Speaker 5: you at any minute, right to come out. And then

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Speaker 5: they might also want another set of eyes. You know,

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Speaker 5: sometimes I see things differently, especially biological materials, blood spatter.

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Speaker 5: I mean we're ready to you know, we meaning the

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Speaker 5: medical Examiner's office. But often as a doc, I'll just

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Speaker 5: go out and say hey, and it's very helpful, Like

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Speaker 5: I might say, we should look at I've had a

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Speaker 5: body in a water environment like a tank or a sewer.

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Speaker 5: I've had fresh cement poured over. You know, I've recovered

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Speaker 5: bodies from cement or other structures. So trash cans, I mean,

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Speaker 5: you never know what the concealment is. And she's so weak.

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Speaker 5: I feel like it's not going to take much to

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Speaker 5: sort of weaken her and do something horrible to her.

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Speaker 5: So it's red flags to me everywhere, both medically and

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Speaker 5: sort of logically.

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Speaker 1: And Dan, she brings up some good points. And you know,

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Speaker 1: one thing I want to ask you about your career.

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Speaker 1: You've worked plenty of kidnappings on your podcast Goal Shields

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Speaker 1: that you have with Tom smith. Y'all talk to experts

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Speaker 1: all the time that maybe even work cases that you didn't.

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Speaker 1: Forty one minutes in that house.

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Speaker 3: That's a very long time for an abduction, an unusually

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Speaker 3: long time. It could mean many things. It could mean

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Speaker 3: that the persons involved were known to the victim. It

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Speaker 3: could mean that they were taking their time. But you see,

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Speaker 3: we haven't seen the crime scene. I haven't been to

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Speaker 3: the crime scene, and I don't like to comment on

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Speaker 3: it without having seen it. But it simply could be

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Speaker 3: that they were rifling through the house looking for certain

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Speaker 3: things that they were told were hidden, or were hidden

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Speaker 3: or were taken. And so much of that detail we

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Speaker 3: don't know, And frankly, it's probably a good thing we

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Speaker 3: don't know, because the police agency's involved shouldn't be releasing

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Speaker 3: all that information. But forty one minutes very long time,

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Speaker 3: Way too long for an abduction. I've never seen it

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Speaker 3: take more than a couple of minutes at best. Sometimes

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Speaker 3: there's simply seconds off the street. But I also have

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Speaker 3: to wonder did they know who this person was. If

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Speaker 3: she knew them, that's one thing, But if they were

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Speaker 3: strangers and they were simply seeing an opportunistic house that's

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Speaker 3: set alone in the Tucson Hills, was it an opportunity

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Speaker 3: that they had no idea that it would be a

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Speaker 3: media case. There's so many things about this case that

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Speaker 3: strike me as bizarre. It takes several days before a

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Speaker 3: ransom demand comes in. I've never seen that before either,

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Speaker 3: that's an odd one to me.

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Speaker 1: Tom, you and I have talked about that. Day one,

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Speaker 1: you're not notifying the family that you've got this person

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Speaker 1: in demanding ransom. Day two, day three. It's not until

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Speaker 1: basically everybody on the internet is saying, this ain't a

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Speaker 1: kidnappened that where she's been ransomed. I mean, nobody's asking

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Speaker 1: for anything. And then suddenly TMZ gets a ransom letter.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, and that point is odd. You know, like Dan said,

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Speaker 4: you know, kidnappings are quick kidnap because the longer the

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Speaker 4: kidnappers have the victim, the better chance it is for

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Speaker 4: law enforcement to track them down. You don't want to

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Speaker 4: have them too long. It's usually a quick turnaround of

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Speaker 4: we got them, give us some money within twenty four hours,

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Speaker 4: forty eight hours or whatever. This is the amount we want.

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Speaker 2: That's it. And that's usually how it goes.

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Speaker 4: You know, the one date of a deadline and then

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Speaker 4: another deadline and then hey, we'll get back to your

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Speaker 4: Friday is just bizarre. And the other part of how

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Speaker 4: are they communicating you know, all the reporting is it

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Speaker 4: was just a one sided kind of demand and negotiation.

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Speaker 4: Here it is, this is what we want, but no

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Speaker 4: one led to any direction of how they would say, Okay,

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Speaker 4: you're getting back to them. That's where I think the

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Speaker 4: the interviews and the statements from the families come in.

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Speaker 4: I think that was directed, just not known to everybody.

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Speaker 4: This is how you're going to communicate with us. You're

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Speaker 4: going to have a press conference, You're going to read

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Speaker 4: a statement and so on and so forth, and tell

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Speaker 4: us if you're okay with paying this, And that's how

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Speaker 4: you know. That's why these are so complex and so

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Speaker 4: sensitive to run because you can't get it out there.

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Speaker 4: Like Dan said, you can't lay out, you know, the

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Speaker 4: particulars of what's going on out there because of the

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Speaker 4: sensitivity to this. But the ransoms and the timelines and

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Speaker 4: all that are just very very bizarre. It's not your

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Speaker 4: prototypical kidnapping and ransom demands by any stretch.

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Speaker 1: Now, doctor Priya, we know she's on blood dinner. Assuming

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Speaker 1: that you've seen the blood drops in the front of

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Speaker 1: the house and then the one that looks like a spray.

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Speaker 1: Do you think that's something that would cause her to

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Speaker 1: bleed out on blood thinners or is it something that

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Speaker 1: could have been controlled?

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Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean that's a great question.

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Speaker 5: I don't think a lot of it looked like drops

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Speaker 5: to me, like vertical drops rather than arterial spray, like

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Speaker 5: like a stab wound or something. But I mean, even

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Speaker 5: a little nick on blood thinners can cause catastrophic loss, right,

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Speaker 5: and someone with a weakened heart can tolerate blood loss less. Okay,

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Speaker 5: they need all the oxygen the blood can deliver because

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Speaker 5: their heart has hard time pumping.

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Speaker 6: So the again, the.

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Speaker 5: Stress of any injury, the stress of the situation in

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Speaker 5: the middle of the night, the stress of you know, bleeding,

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Speaker 5: it's not it wasn't a ton of blood, but it

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Speaker 5: was fresh. You know, it looks red, and you know

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Speaker 5: they DNA tested it to her, And that's what's concerning

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Speaker 5: to me.

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Speaker 6: It doesn't look you know, like the.

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Speaker 5: Messy crime scenes. Well I haven't seen the crime scene,

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Speaker 5: but the picture on the outside, right, doesn't look like

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Speaker 5: a massive injury like an arterial stab wound or something.

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Speaker 5: Even a cut, even anything that causes her a little

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Speaker 5: something can stress her out on top of just the

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Speaker 5: stress of the situation, Like I can't stress that enough.

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Speaker 5: That how much pressure that puts on a failing heart

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Speaker 5: to begin with, you know, as a risk factor for

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Speaker 5: sudden death even without physical trauma and dan.

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Speaker 1: Something else that really stood out to me is with

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Speaker 1: they said the lights were own in the house, like

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Speaker 1: in the middle of the house. That again does not

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Speaker 1: sound like somebody going in in the dead and night

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Speaker 1: trying to take cover in the darkness. Why would you

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Speaker 1: go in after one in the morning and then just

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Speaker 1: start turning lights on. You don't know whether or not

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Speaker 1: the family has cameras on the inside, like a nanny cam.

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Speaker 3: A traditional perpetrator of a crime going into a residence

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Speaker 3: at night, whether it be a kidnapping or a burglary

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Speaker 3: or whatever, is typically armed with their own light, a

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Speaker 3: little flashlight of some sort to see what they need

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Speaker 3: to see. They want to be as unobtrusive as possible

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Speaker 3: in certain ways. In a kidnapping case, they don't want

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Speaker 3: to alert everybody else around if there is anybody that

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Speaker 3: can see the house. Lights are on at two o'clock

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Speaker 3: in the morning in Nancy Guthrie's house, what's that all about.

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Speaker 2: They're never on.

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Speaker 3: They're going to want to get in and get out

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Speaker 3: quickly and leave as little trace that they were there

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Speaker 3: as possible. Forty one minutes in the house, lights on

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Speaker 3: high heavens. This is thinking to high heavens. So many

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Speaker 3: things about this and that is just one of many

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Speaker 3: pieces that are bizarre behavior for a kidnapper.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, nothing is ringing true. And Tom, I will admit

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Speaker 1: I do not know a lot about this topic. But bitcoin.

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Speaker 1: When they said that, I was like, what, so you

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Speaker 1: want some of it in cash, some of it in bitcoin.

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Speaker 1: Now there's a bitcoin ATM down the street, which I

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Speaker 1: didn't even know was a thing until this case happened.

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Speaker 1: And I'm thinking this does not track for me. If

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Speaker 1: you take somebody at one thirty in the morning, their

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Speaker 1: family ought to know by two, there should be some communication,

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Speaker 1: I want my money by four o'clock in the afternoon,

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Speaker 1: don't call the police. None of that is happening here.

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Speaker 4: The only other thing I can think of, uh, And

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Speaker 4: you know, we talked about this too a couple of times.

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Speaker 4: If the kidnapping was a secondary thought and they went

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Speaker 4: in to just rob the place and Nancy recognized them,

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Speaker 4: maybe they did work at the house. There is something

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Speaker 4: to do with the knowledge of who she was, and

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Speaker 4: maybe some sort of valuable you know, valuables being in

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Speaker 4: the house. And then something went wrong, something triggered maybe

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Speaker 4: one of the guys that you know hit her, she

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Speaker 4: started bleeding. We got to take her because she knows

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Speaker 4: it's us. Then the next two days are spent with

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Speaker 4: that oh crap moment, what do we do? Okay, let's

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Speaker 4: get this together, you know, because it seems very amateurs

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Speaker 4: and Dan can talk about this a lot better than me,

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Speaker 4: the difference between an amateur kidnapping and induction and the pros.

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Speaker 4: The pros are on target. This is the time frame,

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Speaker 4: this is what I want, This is how you're delivering

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Speaker 4: it to me, whereas this looks like it could be

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Speaker 4: a secondary thought and just amateur hour pretty much of

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Speaker 4: not knowing what to do how to do it. Bitcoin

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Speaker 4: is a new fad. Let's throw that in there.

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Speaker 5: You know.

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Speaker 4: I think a professional, the very first or one of

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Speaker 4: the very first contacts you would hit would be either

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Speaker 4: Savannah herself or NBC not TMZ.

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Speaker 1: Correct.

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Speaker 6: Correct, And I just as a lay person in a

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Speaker 6: non medical setting.

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Speaker 5: But bitcoin has taken a financial hit recently, so it's

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Speaker 5: not even a I don't know, a wanted currency.

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Speaker 1: Really.

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Speaker 5: I don't know if they're thinking, oh this it won't

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Speaker 5: be te and that's why they're doing bitcoin.

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Speaker 6: But if it's a legit even ransom note, you know.

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Speaker 5: But from a bitcoin perspective, it's not been doing that

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Speaker 5: well in terms of worth, you know, so to ask

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Speaker 5: for a devalued currency seems odd too.

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Speaker 1: And doctor prep piggybacking on what Tom was saying, this

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Speaker 1: is something I wanted to ask you. With all due

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Speaker 1: respect to Tom and Dan, I'm gonna talk about men

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Speaker 1: for a minute.

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Speaker 2: I don't.

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Speaker 1: I don't know a man that's going to take an

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Speaker 1: eighty four year old woman that can't traverse on her

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Speaker 1: own steps or more than fifty yards. Now, I've got

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Speaker 1: to help get her up off whatever mattress on the floor.

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Speaker 1: I've got her own to get her to a bathroom.

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Speaker 1: She's moaning and carrying on because she doesn't have this

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Speaker 1: medicine for pain that she has to have every day.

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Speaker 1: She's bleeding. Now, I've got to feed her. Now, I've

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Speaker 1: got to listen to her cry and carry on. I

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Speaker 1: don't think that's happening here. I just don't want you

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Speaker 1: to talk about what type of medication she may be

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Speaker 1: owned with this pain, this suffering that the family keeps

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Speaker 1: talking about.

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Speaker 5: I mean, it breaks my heart, and I've spoken about

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Speaker 5: my very personal journey with my mother who's now passed.

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Speaker 5: But she had chronic pain. So I mean it could

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Speaker 5: be anything from something over the counter like a leave

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Speaker 5: but probably more like a prescription medication. It could be

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Speaker 5: a muscle relax or it could be an opiate of

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Speaker 5: some sort, like if you think about chronic arthritis, I

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Speaker 5: mean in your eighties. She could have osteoporosis. She could

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Speaker 5: have microfractures like she's as a walker from what I understood,

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Speaker 5: so she's not her mobility is incredibly limited. And whether

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Speaker 5: that's bone pain and or muscle related, you know, I

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Speaker 5: just can't imagine. First of all, think about when I

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Speaker 5: thought I sound like a broken record, but this cumulative

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Speaker 5: stress I was talking about on her body, just you know,

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Speaker 5: even if she is taken, if she is abducted alive,

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Speaker 5: that stress like not having her Let's say she has

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Speaker 5: a weak heart, so she's on blood dinners. That means

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Speaker 5: if they didn't take her medicine's her blood's not adequately thinned.

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Speaker 5: She may be on blood pressure medicine. She may be

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Speaker 5: on medications like nitroglycerine or something to make her heart

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Speaker 5: pump stronger.

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Speaker 6: You know.

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Speaker 5: Now we know she has chronic pain. So all of

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Speaker 5: those are just added medical stresses on the body. Right

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Speaker 5: to be in pain, to be in chronic pain without

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Speaker 5: the medication that you're on is a huge issue. You know,

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Speaker 5: affects her mobility, that affects her basic comfort, and that

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Speaker 5: her body's going to read as I mean, pain is

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Speaker 5: a known stress, right, so that's going to elevate her

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Speaker 5: blood pressure and then cause more strain on the heart.

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Speaker 6: So you're sort of this like horrible cycle, right, And.

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Speaker 5: That's I hate to say, assuming that she was taken

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Speaker 5: out of there alive, but I just can't imagine caring

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Speaker 5: for someone elderly, willingly or no kidnapping someone who's this fragile.

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Speaker 1: And dan For me, you know, we waited days and

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Speaker 1: then finally you see the three children and Savannah Guthrie

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Speaker 1: and her sister Annie read statements. Their brother doesn't read one.

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Speaker 1: What was your first thought when you saw the family

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Speaker 1: finally release in a video.

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Speaker 3: To appeal to the media like that as a family,

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Speaker 3: you can tell by the fact that it was it

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Speaker 3: was read, that it was written and drafted by someone

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Speaker 3: from the FBI, someone with behavioral expertise, someone who knew

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Speaker 3: what to say to potentially not make the situation worse,

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Speaker 3: but to appeal to them in a way that might

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Speaker 3: actually humanize her. A big part of that was our mother,

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Speaker 3: she means the world to us. She's eighty four, she's

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Speaker 3: in bed health. Trying to appeal to.

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Speaker 2: The humanness within them.

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Speaker 3: I thought it was strange that in three it took

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Speaker 3: three days to get the first ransom demand. And as

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Speaker 3: we can and see, we already have at least one

361
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Speaker 3: of those situations. The individual was a hoax, which is

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Speaker 3: to be expected in a high profile case. And it's

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Speaker 3: sad but true. They come out of the woodwork when

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Speaker 3: these things happen.

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Speaker 1: They did.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I felt like the Gufree family made that video

367
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Speaker 3: because they wanted to send a statement that they wanted

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Speaker 3: to cooperate. They had to follow the parameters by which

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Speaker 3: they're the FBI or whoever was in charge of writing that,

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Speaker 3: And it seems the FBI they had to follow those parameters,

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Speaker 3: and you could see on their face, you know, this

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Speaker 3: is not good.

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Speaker 2: There's no way. And I don't know. I'm not privy

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Speaker 2: to the inner parts of the investigation.

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Speaker 3: Has there been proof of life offered? Has anyone seen

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Speaker 3: a video? Has she gotten on a phone and said

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Speaker 3: it's me. I'm here. They've got me. We don't know that.

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Speaker 3: I would tend to think, no, I.

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Speaker 1: Agree and Tom for me. You know, one of the

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Speaker 1: very first things I said was, Tom is the biggest

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Speaker 1: factor we have in this thing, because of her age,

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Speaker 1: because of the blood everything. Well, I said, she hadn't

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Speaker 1: been ransomed. Well, this goes a couple of days. Everybody

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Speaker 1: starts saying, well, there's no ransom, so she has she

385
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Speaker 1: been kidnapped. Suddenly there's a ransom, and then we say, well,

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Speaker 1: we hadn't heard from the family. The family's made no plea.

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Speaker 1: Suddenly the family makes a plea. Well, then everybody says,

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Speaker 1: but the brother didn't say anything. Now the brother comes up.

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Speaker 1: Well then I'm like, oh, no, whoever is sending these

390
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Speaker 1: messages to them is paying attention. They're paying attention to

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Speaker 1: social media. And then it looks to me, and this

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Speaker 1: is my question for you, that law enforcement, the Sheriff's department,

393
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Speaker 1: and the FBI seem to be reactionary to whatever they're getting.

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Speaker 1: So they're going to go back to Nancy's house and

395
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Speaker 1: look in the sideyard with a K nine. Then they're

396
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Speaker 1: going into the daughter's house. Then they're going back to

397
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Speaker 1: Nancy's house and now look it into some I don't

398
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Speaker 1: know if it's a whale or a sewer or what

399
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Speaker 1: it is, but they've taken the lid off of something,

400
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Speaker 1: and you know they're trying to see some down there.

401
00:22:09,240 --> 00:22:11,960
Speaker 1: So this, to me, every single thing they have done

402
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Speaker 1: suggests nobody in this thing believes she's alive.

403
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Speaker 4: Yeah, I agree with you everything you said this day

404
00:22:20,680 --> 00:22:23,840
Speaker 4: and age. You know, the other party's the first part

405
00:22:23,920 --> 00:22:26,919
Speaker 4: and the first thing that you brought up. This is

406
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Speaker 4: a media driven world. Now everyone has access to it.

407
00:22:30,920 --> 00:22:34,239
Speaker 4: You can sit in a tree on your phone and

408
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Speaker 4: know what's going on in the world, much less sitting

409
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Speaker 4: in a house in front of a computer. So the

410
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Speaker 4: mobility of being out there is striking. And if you are,

411
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Speaker 4: you know, a kidnapper, you're involved in this, you would

412
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Speaker 4: be smart to watch every aspect because now every news

413
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Speaker 4: channel on every hour is talking about this, and someone

414
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Speaker 4: is giving a little piece of info here, piece of

415
00:23:00,480 --> 00:23:04,080
Speaker 4: info here, or making a statement here, so they're reacting

416
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Speaker 4: to it. The reactionary part of law enforcement sometimes when

417
00:23:09,800 --> 00:23:13,600
Speaker 4: you're dealing with these is a thing because if you

418
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Speaker 4: don't have anything and you're just waiting on the will

419
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Speaker 4: of the kidnappers. You do have to wait a bit

420
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Speaker 4: to see what the next steps are they are, you know,

421
00:23:25,119 --> 00:23:27,960
Speaker 4: that's one portion. You know, let's and we all know this.

422
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Speaker 4: You know, when you're dealing with a large case like this,

423
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Speaker 4: there's an enormous amount of police officers, detectives, agents who

424
00:23:34,680 --> 00:23:37,520
Speaker 4: are on this kind of team. Each team is tasked

425
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Speaker 4: with something different. So as you have a couple of

426
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Speaker 4: guys or part of the team waiting to hear back

427
00:23:43,560 --> 00:23:47,040
Speaker 4: from the kidnappers, there's other guys who are still working

428
00:23:47,160 --> 00:23:49,720
Speaker 4: and still running down leads and still checking evidence and

429
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Speaker 4: still doing all that.

430
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Speaker 2: So I think.

431
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Speaker 4: Sometimes part of the media of oh my god, they

432
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Speaker 4: went back to the residents. That could be a new

433
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Speaker 4: set of a new detective that just said, hey, I

434
00:24:02,640 --> 00:24:05,240
Speaker 4: just found this. Look did you do this? Oh crap,

435
00:24:05,280 --> 00:24:08,120
Speaker 4: we didn't, let's go and reacting to it. It could

436
00:24:08,119 --> 00:24:11,080
Speaker 4: be a tip from someone. So a lot of times

437
00:24:11,119 --> 00:24:15,040
Speaker 4: it does look reactionary with this, But there are a

438
00:24:15,080 --> 00:24:19,919
Speaker 4: group of detectives who are not going home, they're not eating,

439
00:24:19,960 --> 00:24:24,080
Speaker 4: they're not sleeping, and they're taking this personal in doing

440
00:24:24,119 --> 00:24:28,520
Speaker 4: everything they can. On the backstage part of finding anything

441
00:24:28,560 --> 00:24:32,399
Speaker 4: they can maybe before one of these ransoms, you know,

442
00:24:32,520 --> 00:24:33,440
Speaker 4: comes out.

443
00:24:34,520 --> 00:24:37,000
Speaker 1: Doctor Pray, I have got a question for you that

444
00:24:37,119 --> 00:24:40,720
Speaker 1: I have not been able to fully understand, and that

445
00:24:41,000 --> 00:24:45,400
Speaker 1: is the pacemaker. And here is my question. My understanding

446
00:24:45,440 --> 00:24:49,200
Speaker 1: of a pacemaker. It's a machine and it's just operating.

447
00:24:49,960 --> 00:24:53,800
Speaker 1: And I understand that her watch had some type of

448
00:24:53,880 --> 00:24:57,040
Speaker 1: app and it was SYNCD up and that if she

449
00:24:57,240 --> 00:25:00,400
Speaker 1: got far enough from the watch, it would alert that, hey,

450
00:25:00,720 --> 00:25:04,239
Speaker 1: you're too far. I can't read it. My question is

451
00:25:04,560 --> 00:25:06,560
Speaker 1: a couple of things. Anything you want to tell us

452
00:25:06,560 --> 00:25:09,359
Speaker 1: about a pacemaker. So we understand what law enforcement could

453
00:25:09,400 --> 00:25:12,199
Speaker 1: gain from it. But my question is could they not

454
00:25:12,880 --> 00:25:16,359
Speaker 1: take her cell phone or if the Apple Watch was

455
00:25:16,400 --> 00:25:20,280
Speaker 1: in fact left behind, ride around with it and see

456
00:25:20,280 --> 00:25:23,119
Speaker 1: if it would connect because the pacemaker is still working.

457
00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:25,960
Speaker 6: Sure, so all of this is great.

458
00:25:26,040 --> 00:25:28,280
Speaker 5: I mean my phone, just like you guys, My phone

459
00:25:28,280 --> 00:25:31,639
Speaker 5: has been bombarded this week right with questions and comments

460
00:25:31,760 --> 00:25:34,520
Speaker 5: and you know, and so this was one that many

461
00:25:34,680 --> 00:25:37,560
Speaker 5: audience members have reached out. And I think there was

462
00:25:37,600 --> 00:25:42,760
Speaker 5: actually some miss words misspoken about it on another platform.

463
00:25:42,800 --> 00:25:43,960
Speaker 6: So I want to clarify this.

464
00:25:44,040 --> 00:25:48,520
Speaker 5: So the beauty of a pacemaker is that it is

465
00:25:49,119 --> 00:25:52,679
Speaker 5: there and doing its job with its internal battery. Okay,

466
00:25:52,760 --> 00:25:56,280
Speaker 5: so it is there because her heart is weak and

467
00:25:56,359 --> 00:26:01,439
Speaker 5: the natural electrical signals that we have right, bump, bump, bump.

468
00:26:01,880 --> 00:26:03,800
Speaker 5: We don't have to think about our heartbeat, right, It

469
00:26:03,880 --> 00:26:07,880
Speaker 5: automatically happens with this native electrical signal of the heart.

470
00:26:08,119 --> 00:26:10,960
Speaker 5: So the heart has something that's called an innate or

471
00:26:11,040 --> 00:26:12,840
Speaker 5: internal pacemaker. That's what we all have.

472
00:26:13,040 --> 00:26:13,960
Speaker 6: That's how we're alive.

473
00:26:14,359 --> 00:26:17,840
Speaker 5: When that doesn't work, doctors have to put in a device,

474
00:26:17,920 --> 00:26:22,240
Speaker 5: which is what we know as an external or implanted pacemaker.

475
00:26:22,280 --> 00:26:25,119
Speaker 5: So this is a little computer with wires to the

476
00:26:25,119 --> 00:26:34,960
Speaker 5: heart that now override the natural hearts you know, incorrect

477
00:26:35,040 --> 00:26:38,920
Speaker 5: or abnormal heartbeat. So it's gonna start sending signals all

478
00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:41,400
Speaker 5: the time. And basically she's alive because of the pacemaker.

479
00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:44,240
Speaker 5: And that's why we can't have it fail. So the

480
00:26:44,400 --> 00:26:47,159
Speaker 5: disconnection from the Apple Watch, and this is what was

481
00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:50,520
Speaker 5: mistake mistaken on. I think what I've heard before is

482
00:26:50,560 --> 00:26:53,879
Speaker 5: not that the pacemaker stopped. It's just that, like you

483
00:26:53,960 --> 00:26:55,800
Speaker 5: have to be it's a bluetooth, right, so you have

484
00:26:55,840 --> 00:26:58,199
Speaker 5: to be within a vicinity of the Apple Watch for

485
00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:03,000
Speaker 5: it to communicate Now, well, I think with as powerful

486
00:27:03,040 --> 00:27:06,320
Speaker 5: as technology is anything that has a tracker like find

487
00:27:06,320 --> 00:27:09,760
Speaker 5: my phone, find my pacemaker. Maybe there is a setting

488
00:27:09,800 --> 00:27:12,160
Speaker 5: like that. I don't know exactly, but why not ride

489
00:27:12,160 --> 00:27:12,840
Speaker 5: around with it?

490
00:27:12,960 --> 00:27:15,639
Speaker 6: Right? Why not walk around the property to see if

491
00:27:15,680 --> 00:27:16,320
Speaker 6: it'll connect.

492
00:27:16,359 --> 00:27:20,960
Speaker 5: Now, know that even if someone is deceased, the pacemaker

493
00:27:21,040 --> 00:27:23,919
Speaker 5: is still active, okay, so you can still target it

494
00:27:24,400 --> 00:27:27,800
Speaker 5: such that before someone is cremated, we have to take

495
00:27:27,840 --> 00:27:31,360
Speaker 5: out the pacemaker or demagnetize it. So run this very

496
00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:33,159
Speaker 5: heavy magnet over it to stop it.

497
00:27:33,400 --> 00:27:33,800
Speaker 6: Okay.

498
00:27:34,160 --> 00:27:38,520
Speaker 5: So it is basically a default electrical signal to the

499
00:27:38,560 --> 00:27:39,240
Speaker 5: heart even.

500
00:27:39,040 --> 00:27:40,199
Speaker 6: When someone's not alive.

501
00:27:41,119 --> 00:27:43,959
Speaker 5: The other thing that I know about pacemakers is that

502
00:27:44,119 --> 00:27:48,920
Speaker 5: like it can talk remotely to the cardiologists. So I'm

503
00:27:48,960 --> 00:27:52,240
Speaker 5: curious if police have tracked down her cardiologists to then

504
00:27:52,720 --> 00:27:55,520
Speaker 5: find out information who makes the pacemaker, if there's any

505
00:27:55,560 --> 00:27:58,679
Speaker 5: way to interrogate it from afar to find her, you know,

506
00:27:58,760 --> 00:28:03,080
Speaker 5: if there's remote signs. So, oh that's really critical. Obviously

507
00:28:03,119 --> 00:28:06,560
Speaker 5: her heart is very ill. If she needs a pacemaker,

508
00:28:06,600 --> 00:28:12,639
Speaker 5: it cannot sustain a normal heartbeat without this external medical device,

509
00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:16,000
Speaker 5: so it's life saving. So that in and of itself

510
00:28:16,040 --> 00:28:17,400
Speaker 5: should be a key focus.

511
00:28:19,000 --> 00:28:25,520
Speaker 1: Dan Murphy, you were in charge of a squad, You

512
00:28:25,640 --> 00:28:29,080
Speaker 1: had people that answered to you, you were running the show.

513
00:28:30,640 --> 00:28:35,000
Speaker 1: Have you ever in your life said to the men

514
00:28:35,040 --> 00:28:41,160
Speaker 1: and women under you on a major case? Oh yeah,

515
00:28:41,200 --> 00:28:44,040
Speaker 1: my wife showed that to me. You know, I mean,

516
00:28:44,800 --> 00:28:47,320
Speaker 1: would you ever recover from that on it?

517
00:28:47,520 --> 00:28:50,360
Speaker 2: Tell me honestly, now, honestly, you wouldn't.

518
00:28:50,480 --> 00:28:52,840
Speaker 3: You wouldn't, And you know what, maybe you shouldn't, because

519
00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:55,800
Speaker 3: this is not amateur hour. This is somebody's life. And

520
00:28:56,240 --> 00:28:58,760
Speaker 3: I worked over one hundred kidnappings, and every single one

521
00:28:58,800 --> 00:29:01,320
Speaker 3: of them we took socier. Like Tom said, you don't

522
00:29:01,320 --> 00:29:04,080
Speaker 3: go home, You eat when you can, you grab coffee,

523
00:29:04,120 --> 00:29:07,000
Speaker 3: You keep going because that victim is still breathing.

524
00:29:07,040 --> 00:29:09,360
Speaker 2: That's the assumption. And if you have proof of life,

525
00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:09,800
Speaker 2: you know that.

526
00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:12,720
Speaker 3: And your job, your number one job, is to get

527
00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:14,240
Speaker 3: that victim released safely.

528
00:29:14,640 --> 00:29:17,640
Speaker 2: Everything else is a distance second. So that's your hard

529
00:29:17,720 --> 00:29:20,440
Speaker 2: charging motive.

530
00:29:20,600 --> 00:29:24,200
Speaker 3: You have to get her released and until such time.

531
00:29:24,280 --> 00:29:27,280
Speaker 3: There are certain elements of the law and constitutional law

532
00:29:27,640 --> 00:29:30,200
Speaker 3: that take a seat for a second when you have

533
00:29:30,280 --> 00:29:34,920
Speaker 3: a life on the on the line. Let's say, for example,

534
00:29:34,960 --> 00:29:37,680
Speaker 3: you get indication that you have reason to believe she

535
00:29:37,800 --> 00:29:41,320
Speaker 3: may be inside House number one. You can go and

536
00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:43,440
Speaker 3: you can put your foot right to the door and

537
00:29:43,520 --> 00:29:45,440
Speaker 3: stream into the house and search for her without a

538
00:29:45,440 --> 00:29:49,040
Speaker 3: search warrant because you don't have to wait. You have

539
00:29:49,080 --> 00:29:52,400
Speaker 3: a life on the line. Once you release the victim.

540
00:29:52,440 --> 00:29:54,479
Speaker 3: Once we have rescued the victim, I've done this so

541
00:29:54,560 --> 00:29:58,240
Speaker 3: many times. Then you get in touch with the DA's office,

542
00:29:58,280 --> 00:29:59,960
Speaker 3: tell them this's what we have. We need search warran,

543
00:30:00,160 --> 00:30:02,680
Speaker 3: we need subpoenas, we need et cetera. Then you do that,

544
00:30:02,720 --> 00:30:05,400
Speaker 3: But until then you have a lot of latitude under

545
00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:06,719
Speaker 3: the law to find that person.

546
00:30:06,760 --> 00:30:09,720
Speaker 2: And I hope they're doing that now in this case.

547
00:30:09,800 --> 00:30:12,800
Speaker 3: If I was running this investigation, the first thing you

548
00:30:12,800 --> 00:30:14,400
Speaker 3: need to know about any victim of a crime is

549
00:30:14,440 --> 00:30:17,480
Speaker 3: about their life. I'm going to want to know everybody

550
00:30:17,520 --> 00:30:20,880
Speaker 3: she texts with, everybody she has lunch with, who works

551
00:30:20,960 --> 00:30:24,560
Speaker 3: in and around her house, who is she talking to,

552
00:30:25,080 --> 00:30:28,000
Speaker 3: Are there any financial issues or other problems in her

553
00:30:28,040 --> 00:30:31,040
Speaker 3: life at the moment. Get a picture of where she

554
00:30:31,280 --> 00:30:33,320
Speaker 3: is at this moment in her life and who's in

555
00:30:33,360 --> 00:30:35,400
Speaker 3: her life, and.

556
00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:36,920
Speaker 2: Then you work out from there.

557
00:30:37,400 --> 00:30:39,080
Speaker 3: They're going to be going through with a fine tooth

558
00:30:39,120 --> 00:30:42,640
Speaker 3: comb all of her financial statements to see what's going on.

559
00:30:42,760 --> 00:30:45,960
Speaker 3: Did she owe people money, did people owe her money?

560
00:30:46,000 --> 00:30:48,400
Speaker 3: What was going on? What could be the motive for

561
00:30:48,440 --> 00:30:50,200
Speaker 3: taking an eighty four year old woman in the middle

562
00:30:50,200 --> 00:30:52,800
Speaker 3: of the night out of her house, endangering her life,

563
00:30:53,440 --> 00:30:56,440
Speaker 3: possibly ending her life for what?

564
00:30:56,840 --> 00:30:57,080
Speaker 2: For what?

565
00:30:57,360 --> 00:30:59,400
Speaker 3: And then three days later you call for rins. And

566
00:30:59,440 --> 00:31:02,240
Speaker 3: this is one one of those real cases where I

567
00:31:02,240 --> 00:31:04,200
Speaker 3: would say, at the end of it, when we finally

568
00:31:04,240 --> 00:31:07,480
Speaker 3: get the answers, and I hope we do, it could

569
00:31:07,560 --> 00:31:11,040
Speaker 3: be something very different than what we're all talking about

570
00:31:11,120 --> 00:31:11,560
Speaker 3: right now.

571
00:31:12,240 --> 00:31:16,360
Speaker 1: That's right, And Tom, you know, I'm not trying to

572
00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:20,160
Speaker 1: just go after the sheriff. But when he even followed

573
00:31:20,240 --> 00:31:23,960
Speaker 1: up and said, well, your guests as good as mine,

574
00:31:24,520 --> 00:31:28,080
Speaker 1: this is something that if I were the Guthrie family,

575
00:31:28,800 --> 00:31:32,600
Speaker 1: I would have I would have zero faith in his ability.

576
00:31:33,080 --> 00:31:36,080
Speaker 1: I mean I would have lost all hope that he

577
00:31:36,160 --> 00:31:41,720
Speaker 1: could handle what we were facing. And you know, I

578
00:31:41,800 --> 00:31:44,640
Speaker 1: watch what happened with TMZ. You know they get the

579
00:31:44,720 --> 00:31:47,720
Speaker 1: letter they want to come out. Ashley Banfield got some

580
00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:50,560
Speaker 1: information from a high ranking person. She wants to put

581
00:31:50,600 --> 00:31:54,560
Speaker 1: it out. I get that's going to happen, But tell

582
00:31:54,640 --> 00:31:58,880
Speaker 1: us if you're running this investigation. How do those things

583
00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:02,600
Speaker 1: hamper you when you now have to stop and answer

584
00:32:02,680 --> 00:32:05,800
Speaker 1: phone calls about what TMZ is saying and what Ashley

585
00:32:05,800 --> 00:32:08,240
Speaker 1: Banfield is saying, and do you have a person of

586
00:32:08,280 --> 00:32:10,720
Speaker 1: interest and is it the son in law? I mean,

587
00:32:11,360 --> 00:32:14,640
Speaker 1: let's be honest, y'all. Before Tom even answers the last

588
00:32:14,680 --> 00:32:17,280
Speaker 1: person to see you, you're going to be a suspect.

589
00:32:18,360 --> 00:32:20,480
Speaker 1: The son in law is going to be on the list.

590
00:32:20,640 --> 00:32:23,440
Speaker 1: There's no doubt about it. We don't have to say

591
00:32:23,480 --> 00:32:26,920
Speaker 1: it as though we have just solved the greatest mystery

592
00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:30,160
Speaker 1: in the world. Of course he's being looked at, But

593
00:32:30,240 --> 00:32:34,240
Speaker 1: I'm talking about when Tom is actively working a lead

594
00:32:34,960 --> 00:32:38,880
Speaker 1: and has to stop and address what TMZ has just released.

595
00:32:39,640 --> 00:32:42,280
Speaker 4: Listen the first, the first and second. You know, uh,

596
00:32:42,600 --> 00:32:45,560
Speaker 4: press conferences were not good. You know you have to

597
00:32:46,120 --> 00:32:48,040
Speaker 4: I don't care if you're a small agency or the

598
00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:51,040
Speaker 4: NYPD or the LAPD. You have to take a breath

599
00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:54,880
Speaker 4: and understand what's at stake and what you're representing. And

600
00:32:54,920 --> 00:32:58,000
Speaker 4: this is all about leadership. You have to show who's

601
00:32:58,040 --> 00:33:01,880
Speaker 4: in charge, who's got it, put everyone at ease that

602
00:33:02,240 --> 00:33:06,760
Speaker 4: we have this and the complete opposite happened. Once you

603
00:33:07,000 --> 00:33:11,960
Speaker 4: have that crack in the armor of leadership and everyone's

604
00:33:12,240 --> 00:33:16,560
Speaker 4: thought and comfort level of who's running this goes down.

605
00:33:17,200 --> 00:33:19,560
Speaker 4: That's when everyone takes it upon themselves to do their

606
00:33:19,600 --> 00:33:24,040
Speaker 4: own stuff, because you can't rely on the person flaring

607
00:33:24,360 --> 00:33:28,040
Speaker 4: their arms around and making the statement of well, I

608
00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:32,200
Speaker 4: hope she's alive, you know, and just idiotic things like that.

609
00:33:33,240 --> 00:33:39,200
Speaker 4: We're just that's the signal to these other entities TMZ

610
00:33:39,800 --> 00:33:42,360
Speaker 4: Ashley all those to go, Okay, well, we're going to

611
00:33:42,400 --> 00:33:46,120
Speaker 4: do this on our own and as a detective, and

612
00:33:46,240 --> 00:33:48,240
Speaker 4: you know, Dan and I worked together and had to

613
00:33:48,320 --> 00:33:52,400
Speaker 4: deal with this. You know, you get distracted because you're

614
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:55,480
Speaker 4: focusing on one thing and then someone else comes and

615
00:33:55,560 --> 00:33:59,280
Speaker 4: running in the room go hey, someone on whatever network

616
00:33:59,360 --> 00:34:02,000
Speaker 4: just said this, and you're like, all right, how why

617
00:34:02,160 --> 00:34:04,680
Speaker 4: you know? So you have to stop what you're doing,

618
00:34:05,680 --> 00:34:07,760
Speaker 4: or has someone else to do it? Why you address

619
00:34:07,800 --> 00:34:10,000
Speaker 4: something else that may not have anything to do with

620
00:34:10,040 --> 00:34:16,239
Speaker 4: what you're looking at, but you have to instill that, hey,

621
00:34:16,280 --> 00:34:18,920
Speaker 4: we have this, we have this, we have this. Let

622
00:34:19,000 --> 00:34:21,160
Speaker 4: us do our job and we'll get back to when

623
00:34:21,239 --> 00:34:24,840
Speaker 4: we have something. And when more entities get involved in it,

624
00:34:24,880 --> 00:34:26,560
Speaker 4: the messier it gets.

625
00:34:26,880 --> 00:34:29,880
Speaker 1: And doctor Priya. They have gone back to the house

626
00:34:29,920 --> 00:34:31,680
Speaker 1: and back to the house and back to the house.

627
00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:35,120
Speaker 1: I think at some point the medical examiner is going

628
00:34:35,200 --> 00:34:35,840
Speaker 1: to be called.

629
00:34:35,600 --> 00:34:39,920
Speaker 5: Out, definitely if they haven't been already. Because that's what

630
00:34:39,960 --> 00:34:42,319
Speaker 5: I was getting at too. The scene visit with more

631
00:34:42,400 --> 00:34:43,560
Speaker 5: eyes are key.

632
00:34:44,320 --> 00:34:46,880
Speaker 1: And when you have calls that have no decals on

633
00:34:46,960 --> 00:34:49,800
Speaker 1: them and you've got people that are wearing playing clothes,

634
00:34:50,200 --> 00:34:52,839
Speaker 1: sometimes that's deliberate. They don't want you to know where

635
00:34:52,840 --> 00:34:56,040
Speaker 1: they're from. And that's what I've been thinking when I've

636
00:34:56,040 --> 00:35:00,239
Speaker 1: watched some of these folks show up. But when you

637
00:35:00,280 --> 00:35:02,360
Speaker 1: know law enforcement has to go back and back and

638
00:35:02,440 --> 00:35:07,000
Speaker 1: back again, how does that hamper your investigation when you

639
00:35:07,040 --> 00:35:09,640
Speaker 1: finally get to the scene, because you have an investigation too,

640
00:35:09,760 --> 00:35:10,800
Speaker 1: not just law enforcement.

641
00:35:11,360 --> 00:35:11,880
Speaker 6: Correct.

642
00:35:12,120 --> 00:35:15,120
Speaker 5: So you know, when I've handled these sort of more

643
00:35:15,160 --> 00:35:18,520
Speaker 5: complex cases, I always want to be in the loop,

644
00:35:18,600 --> 00:35:20,440
Speaker 5: Like I said, give me a heads up or digging

645
00:35:20,520 --> 00:35:22,680
Speaker 5: up a body or this is what we know?

646
00:35:23,400 --> 00:35:25,720
Speaker 6: You know, I would at least want.

647
00:35:25,560 --> 00:35:28,440
Speaker 5: To be briefed with photos and what's been done, because

648
00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:31,399
Speaker 5: obviously the scene is now changed, correct from what it's

649
00:35:31,440 --> 00:35:36,799
Speaker 5: initially found as. And you never know, like when I

650
00:35:37,360 --> 00:35:41,000
Speaker 5: look at something, I might realize, hey, that's a potential weapon,

651
00:35:41,200 --> 00:35:44,640
Speaker 5: or that has you know, that medication might tell me

652
00:35:44,719 --> 00:35:47,320
Speaker 5: something that police may not be as keyed into.

653
00:35:48,120 --> 00:35:50,279
Speaker 6: And so I just.

654
00:35:50,239 --> 00:35:52,640
Speaker 5: Want to know what was moved, what was collected, what

655
00:35:52,920 --> 00:35:54,040
Speaker 5: was you know.

656
00:35:54,080 --> 00:35:55,840
Speaker 6: Just so we can be on the same page.

657
00:35:56,520 --> 00:36:00,200
Speaker 5: And that's really where we're going at. And you know,

658
00:36:00,239 --> 00:36:03,239
Speaker 5: at some point bringing the emmy through even before the

659
00:36:03,280 --> 00:36:08,880
Speaker 5: body is found, may be useful again, not only to

660
00:36:09,000 --> 00:36:12,680
Speaker 5: set a foundation, but to bring in if you want

661
00:36:12,719 --> 00:36:18,000
Speaker 5: fresh eyes to the scene. You know what kenon, what

662
00:36:18,040 --> 00:36:20,279
Speaker 5: could or could not have happened. Let's think about this,

663
00:36:20,440 --> 00:36:24,279
Speaker 5: Let's see what else is there. I know I've been

664
00:36:24,320 --> 00:36:26,799
Speaker 5: on homicide scenes and I'm like, hey, look in the

665
00:36:26,800 --> 00:36:30,359
Speaker 5: trash can or look at that drink, and they never

666
00:36:30,440 --> 00:36:33,080
Speaker 5: realize it until I said something, Because you know, our

667
00:36:33,120 --> 00:36:35,920
Speaker 5: minds work differently, and that's the expertise we all bring.

668
00:36:36,480 --> 00:36:40,160
Speaker 5: So in some ways without trampling a crime scene, the

669
00:36:40,160 --> 00:36:43,080
Speaker 5: more eyes, the more skilled eyes, it may help. Now,

670
00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:45,280
Speaker 5: especially as it's lingered.

671
00:36:44,920 --> 00:36:50,560
Speaker 1: On and Dan, did the fifty thousand dollars reward that

672
00:36:50,680 --> 00:36:56,840
Speaker 1: law enforcement finally put up? Did that number mean anything

673
00:36:56,920 --> 00:36:57,279
Speaker 1: to you?

674
00:36:58,320 --> 00:36:59,360
Speaker 2: It doesn't mean anything.

675
00:36:59,400 --> 00:37:02,759
Speaker 3: To me, because to me, it's shockingly low given the

676
00:37:02,800 --> 00:37:07,520
Speaker 3: profile and the net value of the Guthrie family, et cetera,

677
00:37:08,520 --> 00:37:11,440
Speaker 3: and to somebody who might be involved or know somebody

678
00:37:11,440 --> 00:37:15,080
Speaker 3: in this case, to me, that's not going to induce

679
00:37:15,160 --> 00:37:18,839
Speaker 3: anyone to come forward on their friends or you know,

680
00:37:19,320 --> 00:37:20,120
Speaker 3: co conspirators.

681
00:37:20,160 --> 00:37:23,200
Speaker 2: I don't see that happening. To me, it seemed a

682
00:37:23,239 --> 00:37:24,080
Speaker 2: really low number.

683
00:37:24,520 --> 00:37:28,880
Speaker 1: Well, that's why it was key to me. I thought,

684
00:37:29,600 --> 00:37:34,160
Speaker 1: that tells me a demographic almost, That tells me what

685
00:37:34,280 --> 00:37:39,000
Speaker 1: kind of economic situation they believe a witness might be in.

686
00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:43,359
Speaker 1: And so it kind of made me think, oh, it's

687
00:37:43,360 --> 00:37:47,560
Speaker 1: maybe somebody over here. Forget the six million dollars in bitcoin,

688
00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:55,560
Speaker 1: we're really looking at a lower economic status person friendship wise. Anyway,

689
00:37:55,600 --> 00:37:57,440
Speaker 1: That's just what it made me think, because I had

690
00:37:57,480 --> 00:38:01,000
Speaker 1: the same feeling you did. Fifty thousand dollars when year

691
00:38:01,120 --> 00:38:04,000
Speaker 1: going from six million, that doesn't even make sense.

692
00:38:04,239 --> 00:38:06,240
Speaker 2: So no, it doesn't.

693
00:38:06,280 --> 00:38:08,360
Speaker 3: And you know, another thing, just to go back for

694
00:38:08,400 --> 00:38:11,640
Speaker 3: a second to the crime scene itself, something that has

695
00:38:12,880 --> 00:38:14,360
Speaker 3: jumped out at me, and I know it has a

696
00:38:14,440 --> 00:38:18,759
Speaker 3: time as well, when you establish a crime scene at

697
00:38:18,760 --> 00:38:22,080
Speaker 3: an event like this. I remember the press conference it

698
00:38:22,080 --> 00:38:24,520
Speaker 3: feels like a long time ago when the sheriff came

699
00:38:24,520 --> 00:38:27,360
Speaker 3: out and said, once we established there was a crime

700
00:38:27,520 --> 00:38:30,520
Speaker 3: scene and a crime had occurred, well, to me, the

701
00:38:30,520 --> 00:38:32,120
Speaker 3: blood would be what you call a clue.

702
00:38:32,200 --> 00:38:32,799
Speaker 2: When you see the.

703
00:38:32,800 --> 00:38:35,399
Speaker 1: Blood, you have a crime scene, yes, sir.

704
00:38:36,080 --> 00:38:38,040
Speaker 3: So as soon as you have a crime scene, you

705
00:38:38,120 --> 00:38:42,080
Speaker 3: lock it up. It's Fort Knox. You have a cop

706
00:38:42,160 --> 00:38:47,440
Speaker 3: standing with a with a notebook, taking names and identification

707
00:38:47,560 --> 00:38:49,719
Speaker 3: of anyone who goes in, and only certain people are

708
00:38:49,760 --> 00:38:51,600
Speaker 3: allowed in. You can't just be a LOOKI lieu and

709
00:38:51,640 --> 00:38:53,200
Speaker 3: just you know what a massergent, I want to go

710
00:38:53,239 --> 00:38:53,959
Speaker 3: see the crime scene.

711
00:38:54,000 --> 00:38:56,759
Speaker 2: Doesn't work that way. There are regulations.

712
00:38:56,760 --> 00:38:59,239
Speaker 3: You cannot just bounce into a crime scene, and it

713
00:38:59,280 --> 00:39:02,080
Speaker 3: should never have been released early. There have been cases

714
00:39:02,120 --> 00:39:04,000
Speaker 3: where crime scenes have been kept taped up for a

715
00:39:04,160 --> 00:39:05,080
Speaker 3: long long time.

716
00:39:05,200 --> 00:39:08,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, this is an active case. Letting it go.

717
00:39:08,920 --> 00:39:11,600
Speaker 3: What you just did effectively and by letting all those

718
00:39:11,640 --> 00:39:13,880
Speaker 3: people trapes through, and I doubt they kept track of

719
00:39:13,880 --> 00:39:14,879
Speaker 3: everybody that's been in there.

720
00:39:14,880 --> 00:39:16,040
Speaker 2: Maybe they have since then.

721
00:39:16,640 --> 00:39:19,480
Speaker 3: What they have effectively done is they've taken whatever evidence

722
00:39:19,960 --> 00:39:23,000
Speaker 3: that's going to be recovered after they released it.

723
00:39:23,040 --> 00:39:24,600
Speaker 2: When they go back in and they.

724
00:39:24,440 --> 00:39:27,360
Speaker 3: Have put it into the status of questioned and it

725
00:39:27,400 --> 00:39:31,000
Speaker 3: will be fought in court by attorneys, possibly very successfully.

726
00:39:31,520 --> 00:39:33,200
Speaker 2: How can you say that this.

727
00:39:33,120 --> 00:39:35,920
Speaker 3: Is from the scene the way it was when one

728
00:39:35,960 --> 00:39:38,440
Speaker 3: hundred people have been trapsing through here and we released

729
00:39:38,440 --> 00:39:41,360
Speaker 3: the scene back to the family, anybody could have placed

730
00:39:41,400 --> 00:39:44,120
Speaker 3: anything in there. It puts all of it in jeopardy legally.

731
00:39:44,400 --> 00:39:45,399
Speaker 3: It was a terrible move.

732
00:39:46,040 --> 00:39:48,560
Speaker 5: The other thing I want to say is, as I've said,

733
00:39:48,680 --> 00:39:53,600
Speaker 5: you know, working having worked homicide scenes alongside detectives, or

734
00:39:53,680 --> 00:39:57,279
Speaker 5: having sort of even once I've had the body, I've

735
00:39:57,280 --> 00:40:03,360
Speaker 5: had sort of evolving I have held homicide or you know,

736
00:40:03,400 --> 00:40:06,960
Speaker 5: potential suspicious scenes for days to weeks, and I know

737
00:40:07,080 --> 00:40:10,040
Speaker 5: that's a financial strain on a police department, but I

738
00:40:10,040 --> 00:40:13,160
Speaker 5: don't care. Right So, there have been findings when I said,

739
00:40:13,200 --> 00:40:16,320
Speaker 5: I've called the police immediately after autopsy and said secure

740
00:40:16,360 --> 00:40:18,719
Speaker 5: the scene and put you know, put someone at the

741
00:40:18,760 --> 00:40:22,960
Speaker 5: door twenty four to seven. And sometimes I get grumbling,

742
00:40:23,040 --> 00:40:25,440
Speaker 5: but in this case, there should not be a question

743
00:40:26,239 --> 00:40:30,600
Speaker 5: about securing the as you go, gentlemen said the block,

744
00:40:30,719 --> 00:40:34,759
Speaker 5: but even the house, right, I mean, it's an evolving,

745
00:40:34,880 --> 00:40:39,840
Speaker 5: high profile case. I don't understand why it's it was

746
00:40:39,920 --> 00:40:42,440
Speaker 5: released and you know things are now still in question.

747
00:40:42,560 --> 00:40:48,400
Speaker 5: That's gonna you know, jeopardize any potential prosecution down the line.

748
00:40:48,440 --> 00:40:51,640
Speaker 5: It really worries me from you know, as you said

749
00:40:51,680 --> 00:40:54,719
Speaker 5: mac right, the scene is not the same anymore. How

750
00:40:54,840 --> 00:40:58,000
Speaker 5: is the investigation hindered? I mean, these are the things

751
00:40:58,000 --> 00:40:59,760
Speaker 5: that are going to be brought up in court.

752
00:41:00,000 --> 00:41:01,520
Speaker 1: That's just not a good look that you have to

753
00:41:01,600 --> 00:41:03,359
Speaker 1: keep going back. It's just not right.

754
00:41:03,480 --> 00:41:06,000
Speaker 5: And then it's going to be chain of custody and

755
00:41:06,120 --> 00:41:08,600
Speaker 5: all these things. And when her body, if and when

756
00:41:08,640 --> 00:41:11,600
Speaker 5: her body is found, that's going to be an issue too.

757
00:41:11,719 --> 00:41:14,880
Speaker 5: So like right, just chain of custody and you know,

758
00:41:15,280 --> 00:41:18,280
Speaker 5: are they going to even fight any kind of evidentiary

759
00:41:18,360 --> 00:41:21,400
Speaker 5: finding because when was that introduced?

760
00:41:21,400 --> 00:41:22,680
Speaker 6: How reliable is it?

761
00:41:22,760 --> 00:41:27,239
Speaker 5: And you know that's the contamination or anything like that

762
00:41:27,600 --> 00:41:28,680
Speaker 5: really worries.

763
00:41:32,000 --> 00:41:35,440
Speaker 1: Tom. I wanted to get your opinion on how the

764
00:41:35,520 --> 00:41:39,960
Speaker 1: family has changed the way they're speaking. You know, they

765
00:41:40,120 --> 00:41:43,680
Speaker 1: spoke directly to their mom until this last video, they

766
00:41:43,680 --> 00:41:47,640
Speaker 1: didn't speak directly to her. And when they said returner,

767
00:41:48,680 --> 00:41:51,920
Speaker 1: we want to celebrate with her, well, you know in

768
00:41:51,960 --> 00:41:57,400
Speaker 1: our world that word with is concerning you know, you're distancing.

769
00:41:57,719 --> 00:42:00,680
Speaker 1: You're not putting it right here or with me. You're

770
00:42:00,719 --> 00:42:03,560
Speaker 1: not saying, you know, we'll come pick her up. They

771
00:42:03,600 --> 00:42:04,160
Speaker 1: didn't say that.

772
00:42:04,920 --> 00:42:05,120
Speaker 2: No.

773
00:42:05,239 --> 00:42:08,520
Speaker 4: I think the second video was dramatically different than the first.

774
00:42:08,560 --> 00:42:11,080
Speaker 4: If you their body language.

775
00:42:10,840 --> 00:42:11,440
Speaker 2: Their mood.

776
00:42:12,239 --> 00:42:15,279
Speaker 4: They were all holding hands that they didn't do in

777
00:42:15,320 --> 00:42:19,520
Speaker 4: the first video. It was more of a family gathering

778
00:42:20,400 --> 00:42:24,200
Speaker 4: of inevitable news than a plea to something.

779
00:42:24,960 --> 00:42:25,080
Speaker 2: Uh.

780
00:42:25,719 --> 00:42:28,319
Speaker 4: It was just it was a stark difference their their

781
00:42:28,360 --> 00:42:31,640
Speaker 4: tone of voice there. Even if you just you know,

782
00:42:31,760 --> 00:42:34,600
Speaker 4: break down and just really listen to what they say,

783
00:42:35,400 --> 00:42:40,080
Speaker 4: you know, let us have her to celebrate peace. You

784
00:42:40,080 --> 00:42:43,560
Speaker 4: know those are all finality words.

785
00:42:43,680 --> 00:42:46,000
Speaker 1: Good and faithful, servant, that's a funeral.

786
00:42:46,560 --> 00:42:47,759
Speaker 4: Yeah, yep.

787
00:42:48,120 --> 00:42:52,160
Speaker 5: It was very somber, you know that as again as

788
00:42:52,160 --> 00:42:55,560
Speaker 5: a non psychiatrist, but just going with the vibe if

789
00:42:55,560 --> 00:42:55,959
Speaker 5: you will.

790
00:42:56,680 --> 00:43:00,440
Speaker 6: It was the hope there was. It was hopeless, right.

791
00:43:00,480 --> 00:43:05,280
Speaker 5: The hopelessness and the somberness was just so overarching from

792
00:43:05,840 --> 00:43:09,440
Speaker 5: all of them. That really sets a different tone for

793
00:43:09,880 --> 00:43:14,880
Speaker 5: what they are looking to do with that second one, y'all.

794
00:43:14,960 --> 00:43:20,640
Speaker 1: The ransom said that the final deadline is going to

795
00:43:20,680 --> 00:43:23,719
Speaker 1: be Monday. What do you think we're looking at? Doctor Priya.

796
00:43:24,600 --> 00:43:26,839
Speaker 5: You know, I'm not as well versed in ransom notes,

797
00:43:26,880 --> 00:43:30,160
Speaker 5: but I'm well versed in the medical side of things,

798
00:43:30,239 --> 00:43:33,600
Speaker 5: autopsy side. And I am thinking now that they are

799
00:43:33,640 --> 00:43:38,640
Speaker 5: looking in more hidden areas on the property, that this

800
00:43:38,760 --> 00:43:45,400
Speaker 5: is now a body recovery aspect rather than a you know,

801
00:43:45,560 --> 00:43:48,400
Speaker 5: return if you will return the body to the family.

802
00:43:48,480 --> 00:43:50,920
Speaker 5: So I again am on the lines that she has

803
00:43:51,040 --> 00:43:56,279
Speaker 5: passed and this kind of recovery now that they're back

804
00:43:56,320 --> 00:43:57,239
Speaker 5: on the scene.

805
00:43:56,960 --> 00:43:59,040
Speaker 6: I hope it is.

806
00:44:00,480 --> 00:44:05,320
Speaker 5: Done properly and thoroughly and lasts until she is found,

807
00:44:05,760 --> 00:44:09,239
Speaker 5: you know, not with any interruption. And then the other

808
00:44:09,520 --> 00:44:12,200
Speaker 5: question that I have been asked and really thought about

809
00:44:12,360 --> 00:44:15,720
Speaker 5: is if and when she's returned. The time of death

810
00:44:15,760 --> 00:44:19,360
Speaker 5: is going to be a huge question, and you know,

811
00:44:19,400 --> 00:44:22,240
Speaker 5: the further out we get, the more complicated it gets.

812
00:44:22,840 --> 00:44:24,000
Speaker 6: And then if we have.

813
00:44:23,960 --> 00:44:26,880
Speaker 5: Decomposition, like if she's found in a water like a

814
00:44:26,920 --> 00:44:30,279
Speaker 5: sewer or tank, water tank or or I mean Arizona

815
00:44:30,360 --> 00:44:33,200
Speaker 5: has very dry weather, I mean, so decomp can happen

816
00:44:33,320 --> 00:44:33,960
Speaker 5: very fast.

817
00:44:35,400 --> 00:44:37,120
Speaker 6: That's going to be an issue as well.

818
00:44:37,200 --> 00:44:42,080
Speaker 5: So you know, I would love to be pleasantly surprised

819
00:44:42,160 --> 00:44:44,600
Speaker 5: that this fragile old lady is alive. But again, my

820
00:44:44,680 --> 00:44:48,480
Speaker 5: gut feeling and my professional opinion is that she isn't.

821
00:44:48,840 --> 00:44:51,520
Speaker 6: And then we have the complexities.

822
00:44:50,680 --> 00:44:54,600
Speaker 5: Of, you know, when was she killed, how was she killed,

823
00:44:54,640 --> 00:44:56,560
Speaker 5: and all those questions to be answered.

824
00:44:56,560 --> 00:44:59,480
Speaker 6: So those are to me the big issues that will

825
00:44:59,520 --> 00:45:01,560
Speaker 6: develop as we move forward.

826
00:45:02,800 --> 00:45:06,600
Speaker 1: And Dan, you know, like doctor Prias said, that's one

827
00:45:06,640 --> 00:45:09,640
Speaker 1: thing I thought about when I saw them finally get

828
00:45:09,640 --> 00:45:12,879
Speaker 1: her mail out of her mailbox. They're putting together that

829
00:45:13,040 --> 00:45:16,960
Speaker 1: when was she no longer active? Was it Saturday or not?

830
00:45:17,640 --> 00:45:19,120
Speaker 1: But what do you think we're looking at?

831
00:45:19,719 --> 00:45:21,800
Speaker 3: I would love to be a fly on the wall,

832
00:45:21,960 --> 00:45:26,520
Speaker 3: or be in the squad room where this headquarters, that

833
00:45:26,640 --> 00:45:30,279
Speaker 3: the war room, wherever it is that's running this investigation,

834
00:45:30,640 --> 00:45:32,319
Speaker 3: because there's so many things I don't know that I'd

835
00:45:32,360 --> 00:45:34,759
Speaker 3: like to know before I form certain opinions. I'd like

836
00:45:34,800 --> 00:45:36,719
Speaker 3: to know whether or not there has been actual contact

837
00:45:36,760 --> 00:45:38,560
Speaker 3: and there has been proof of life at any point

838
00:45:38,560 --> 00:45:41,960
Speaker 3: in this investigation. I'd like to know how many of

839
00:45:42,000 --> 00:45:45,799
Speaker 3: the notes, if any of them, are real, what is

840
00:45:45,920 --> 00:45:48,359
Speaker 3: really going on behind the scenes with regards to that.

841
00:45:50,760 --> 00:45:54,480
Speaker 3: I think that this case it just may surprise us.

842
00:45:54,560 --> 00:45:58,200
Speaker 3: I did work at kidnapping once many years ago when

843
00:45:58,239 --> 00:46:01,640
Speaker 3: I was detective where we had a kidnap victim who

844
00:46:01,719 --> 00:46:06,399
Speaker 3: was killed during the abduction, and the kidnappers negotiated. They

845
00:46:06,440 --> 00:46:09,399
Speaker 3: still wanted to negotiate for ransom. They were pretending that

846
00:46:09,560 --> 00:46:12,640
Speaker 3: the victim was alive, and when they failed to be

847
00:46:12,680 --> 00:46:14,880
Speaker 3: able to come forward with proof of life and we

848
00:46:15,000 --> 00:46:18,319
Speaker 3: called their bluff, they scattered and we ended up catching them.

849
00:46:18,800 --> 00:46:22,720
Speaker 3: But it's if they don't have proof of life, there's

850
00:46:22,719 --> 00:46:27,120
Speaker 3: no reason to pay. And in this case, if there

851
00:46:27,200 --> 00:46:31,000
Speaker 3: is proof of life, which I think we all agree,

852
00:46:31,080 --> 00:46:33,759
Speaker 3: we kind of doubt sadly, and it's not wishing it,

853
00:46:33,800 --> 00:46:36,680
Speaker 3: but we kind of we really do tend to think

854
00:46:36,719 --> 00:46:39,280
Speaker 3: that it doesn't look like a good situation that Nancy

855
00:46:39,280 --> 00:46:41,360
Speaker 3: Guthrie is still with us, and I hate to say that,

856
00:46:41,400 --> 00:46:44,960
Speaker 3: but it just doesn't. I would like to see this

857
00:46:45,040 --> 00:46:49,880
Speaker 3: investigation continue very thoroughly so that anyone anywhere who's involved

858
00:46:49,880 --> 00:46:53,520
Speaker 3: has brought to justice, but I feel that that might

859
00:46:53,560 --> 00:46:56,799
Speaker 3: be very problematic based upon the initial steps taken in

860
00:46:56,840 --> 00:46:59,680
Speaker 3: the case. Sometimes you can't overcome their hurdles from the

861
00:46:59,680 --> 00:47:03,360
Speaker 3: mistake should make in the beginning at least evidentrary was

862
00:47:04,440 --> 00:47:09,279
Speaker 3: return of the victim live or not identification of the

863
00:47:09,320 --> 00:47:12,799
Speaker 3: persons who did this and put the best case forward

864
00:47:12,840 --> 00:47:13,080
Speaker 3: you can.

865
00:47:13,160 --> 00:47:14,640
Speaker 2: That's what I'm hoping to see out of this.

866
00:47:15,560 --> 00:47:18,719
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm just going to kind of echo him. Regardless

867
00:47:18,719 --> 00:47:20,880
Speaker 4: of the outcome of this case, this is going to

868
00:47:20,880 --> 00:47:26,319
Speaker 4: be an ongoing case because whatever the outcome of Nancy is,

869
00:47:27,239 --> 00:47:29,920
Speaker 4: it's still going to be an open investigation. Now you

870
00:47:30,040 --> 00:47:34,239
Speaker 4: have to track down who's ever responsible, the financing of it,

871
00:47:34,480 --> 00:47:37,399
Speaker 4: the planning of it, the communication of it, so all

872
00:47:37,440 --> 00:47:41,760
Speaker 4: that is going to continue. So regardless of the outcome

873
00:47:41,800 --> 00:47:43,480
Speaker 4: of Nancy, and we're all kind of, i think, on

874
00:47:43,520 --> 00:47:44,120
Speaker 4: the same.

875
00:47:43,920 --> 00:47:44,640
Speaker 2: Page with that.

876
00:47:45,320 --> 00:47:47,960
Speaker 4: This investigation is still going to continue and be open,

877
00:47:48,760 --> 00:47:52,480
Speaker 4: and they're still not going to stop working to get

878
00:47:52,840 --> 00:47:57,080
Speaker 4: either the people responsible or justice for Nancy and and

879
00:47:57,120 --> 00:48:01,200
Speaker 4: her family and so forth. That is an oath that

880
00:48:01,560 --> 00:48:06,359
Speaker 4: every detective, investigator, agent, or whatever took when they got

881
00:48:06,360 --> 00:48:09,680
Speaker 4: involved in this case. They're not going to stop. And

882
00:48:10,600 --> 00:48:14,600
Speaker 4: you know, we all pray for the good outcome of this.

883
00:48:14,840 --> 00:48:18,239
Speaker 4: But the video, I think for me, just painted a

884
00:48:19,280 --> 00:48:22,520
Speaker 4: completely different picture of what we're looking at when it

885
00:48:22,600 --> 00:48:24,319
Speaker 4: comes to the outcome of this.

886
00:48:25,120 --> 00:48:28,319
Speaker 1: Yeah, my opinion has it changed. She wasn't ransom. This

887
00:48:28,480 --> 00:48:31,879
Speaker 1: was never about money. Still ain't about money. They're not

888
00:48:31,920 --> 00:48:36,120
Speaker 1: trying to get any money. And you know, I've thought

889
00:48:36,239 --> 00:48:39,720
Speaker 1: it's somebody close to her, and I've thought she's inside something.

890
00:48:39,840 --> 00:48:41,640
Speaker 1: I said, she might be in a mind shaft or

891
00:48:41,680 --> 00:48:44,359
Speaker 1: a shallow grave, because what's the best way to get

892
00:48:44,440 --> 00:48:46,120
Speaker 1: rid of somebody quick? I mean, you ain't got a

893
00:48:46,120 --> 00:48:49,719
Speaker 1: lot of time. You know, daylight's coming. People are up

894
00:48:49,760 --> 00:48:53,799
Speaker 1: early for different reasons. So you know, I'm not as

895
00:48:53,840 --> 00:48:57,759
Speaker 1: hopeful as some folks still are. But I love to

896
00:48:57,800 --> 00:49:02,279
Speaker 1: be wrong in these situations, and I am wrong. But

897
00:49:02,600 --> 00:49:07,120
Speaker 1: doctor Pria, Tom Smith, Dan Murphy, I respect all of you.

898
00:49:07,400 --> 00:49:09,719
Speaker 1: I appreciate all of you the work that y'all have

899
00:49:09,800 --> 00:49:13,600
Speaker 1: done throughout your entire career, and I thank y'all for

900
00:49:13,640 --> 00:49:16,120
Speaker 1: weighing in on this one because this is this is

901
00:49:16,160 --> 00:49:17,480
Speaker 1: the case. It's going to be studied.

902
00:49:18,360 --> 00:49:20,880
Speaker 5: I just want to end with that saying, I hope

903
00:49:20,920 --> 00:49:23,400
Speaker 5: I'm wrong, and I hope I learned something new, and

904
00:49:23,880 --> 00:49:27,280
Speaker 5: I pray some miracle that she's returned.

905
00:49:26,880 --> 00:49:31,080
Speaker 6: Alive, and I hope I'm wrong. I want to eat

906
00:49:31,120 --> 00:49:33,760
Speaker 6: my words. That would make nothing would make me happier

907
00:49:33,920 --> 00:49:34,359
Speaker 6: me either.

908
00:49:34,520 --> 00:49:37,799
Speaker 1: I would enjoy it absolutely all right, y'all. I'm going

909
00:49:37,840 --> 00:49:39,919
Speaker 1: to end Zone seven the way that I always do

910
00:49:40,160 --> 00:49:43,600
Speaker 1: with a quote. At the request of the Guthrie family,

911
00:49:44,200 --> 00:49:48,000
Speaker 1: the Pema County Sheriff's Department will maintain a presence at

912
00:49:48,080 --> 00:49:55,120
Speaker 1: Nancy Guthrie's residence for security purposes going forward. I'm Cheryl McCollum,

913
00:49:55,239 --> 00:50:04,040
Speaker 1: and this is Zone seven.