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Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind, a production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: Hey, welcome to Weird House Cinema. This is Rob Lamb

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Speaker 2: and this is Joe McCormick, and we're back with Yes,

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Speaker 2: another classic erotic vampire movie. I know it wasn't that

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Speaker 2: long ago that we covered nineteen eighty three's The Hunger,

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Speaker 2: but despite some thematic similarities, today's film, nineteen seventy one's

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Speaker 2: Daughters of Darkness is an entirely different cinematic experience. Like

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Speaker 2: The Hunger, it does paint with erotic cues while also

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Speaker 2: pursuing its own high minded ideas. It'd be easy to

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Speaker 2: dismiss this one, certainly if you just watch the trailers,

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Speaker 2: or maybe just look at a few posters as being

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Speaker 2: more in the exploitation zone. But this is a beautiful

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Speaker 2: and haunting film that is composed with deliberate style and intention.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I would agree with that. Despite its main things

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Speaker 3: being sort of love, sex and romance in the context

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Speaker 3: of murder and a vampire story, it's not a very

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Speaker 3: romantic film. Actually, it's like it shows a quite bleak

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Speaker 3: side of love, but is psychologically fascinating.

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Speaker 2: Yes, it's very, very fascinating. On the psychological front. Now

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Speaker 2: other ways that it ties in with past episodes of

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Speaker 2: Weird House. I think we could consider this another off

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Speaker 2: season European holiday horror film. Okay, similar in ways to

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Speaker 2: Footprints on the Moon. Hmmm, all right. I think it

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Speaker 2: is our first Belgian movie, though this was an international

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Speaker 2: co production, so ultimately like this was a multinational effort

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Speaker 2: to make Daughters of Darkness. We'll get into some of

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Speaker 2: the details of that as we go.

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Speaker 3: There's a lot of seemingly random correlation between accents and

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Speaker 3: where characters are supposed to be from.

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Speaker 2: Yes. Also, of note, this is our second Lady Bathory

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Speaker 2: Lady by film. This is a character that pops up

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Speaker 2: of course, is of course you know, has historical origins,

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Speaker 2: but often pops up in far from historically accurate horror

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Speaker 2: and horror related media. So you hear her name pronounced

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Speaker 2: in various ways, from Bathory to BATORI we get the

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Speaker 2: I think the much more convincing, buttry in this picture.

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Speaker 2: But a version of this character last popped up on

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Speaker 2: Weird House Cinema in the Paul Nashy film Night of

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Speaker 2: the Werewolf from nineteen eighty Oh.

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Speaker 3: Okay, I vaguely recall that did we ever talk about

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Speaker 3: how there's a metal band that I've actually never listened to,

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Speaker 3: can't vouch from, don't know if they're any good, but

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Speaker 3: a metal band called Bathory seems like right kind of theme,

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Speaker 3: you know, murder, bathing in blood, that kind of thing,

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Speaker 3: some kind of metal band. But they've got one of

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Speaker 3: those calligraphy fonts on their name and it looks like

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Speaker 3: it says bat lord.

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Speaker 2: Well, that couldn't help I think the already confused issue

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Speaker 2: of the pronunciation there.

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Speaker 3: Oh right, yeah, so you say but Torri, I say

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Speaker 3: bat lord.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, probably and batlrd you know it does? You know?

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Speaker 2: That's I think that's the confusing thing about it. Lady.

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Speaker 2: The stories of Lady Butri are often associated with a

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Speaker 2: bath of blood. Yeah, it's she's associated to some degree

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Speaker 2: with vampires and therefore vampires and bats. So you know,

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Speaker 2: things can get out of whack pretty quickly.

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Speaker 3: There's actually a scene in Daughters of Darkness where she

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Speaker 3: puts her cape up like a bat, even though she

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Speaker 3: never transforms.

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Speaker 2: Into a bat in the movie.

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Speaker 3: We get no animal transformations at all in the film,

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Speaker 3: but she's like standing up in a big sand dune

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Speaker 3: in the nighttime and we see the kind of purple

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Speaker 3: blue sky behind her and she just like puts up

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Speaker 3: the bat wings.

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Speaker 2: It's a beautiful shot. Yeah, yeah, classic. This is a

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Speaker 2: film that has a very strong cult following at this point.

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Speaker 2: It's been popping up on lists for me over the

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Speaker 2: years whenever I look up interesting vampire films, you know,

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Speaker 2: certainly from the nineteen seventies, and this one also came

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Speaker 2: highly recommended from the folks at Videodrome here in Atlanta,

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Speaker 2: who I believe hosted a screening of it just last year,

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Speaker 2: but I don't think I was in town at the time,

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Speaker 2: so I did not go.

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Speaker 3: Am I right that you ended up picking this because

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Speaker 3: you were asking them for French films and this is

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Speaker 3: this is as close as you could get to a

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Speaker 3: wee French movie you wanted.

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Speaker 2: They have a lot of French films, and there are

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Speaker 2: a lot of French horror films. I've found it challenging

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Speaker 2: over the years here to pick one, pick a French

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Speaker 2: weird house film that is also this sort of film

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Speaker 2: that would be fun for us to talk about. Like,

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Speaker 2: there's some really hard hitting French horror films, and they're

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Speaker 2: not necessarily my cup of tea or necessarily what we'd

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Speaker 2: want to talk about on the show. I don't know,

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Speaker 2: and some others just didn't feel like the right pick

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Speaker 2: at the right time. So I'm always open to listener

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Speaker 2: suggestions on this front. I've got a few on my list. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 2: maybe we'll get around to them.

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Speaker 3: But again what you said earlier. Daughters of Darkness, despite

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Speaker 3: being an international action, is mostly Belgian in origin, and

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Speaker 3: it takes place within Belgium as well. It takes place

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Speaker 3: at a seaside town or a seaside city on the

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Speaker 3: Belgian coast called Ostan or I think, depending on whether

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Speaker 3: you have the Dutch pronunciation or the French, it might

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Speaker 3: be Ostend as well. But it's yeah, this like deserted

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Speaker 3: seaside community, which is one of the bleakest types of

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Speaker 3: settings there is. I've realized, like being next to the ocean,

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Speaker 3: but there being nobody.

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Speaker 2: On the beach.

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Speaker 3: That's the thing that gives me chills when I see it.

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Speaker 3: I didn't I didn't realize that really until this movie.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I mean this, This film is very well shot.

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Speaker 2: A lot of intense selection went into the various scenes

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Speaker 2: that we have in the In the picture and so

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Speaker 2: they really lean into this idea of, you know, the

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Speaker 2: desolate seaside town of the of the coast being kind

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Speaker 2: of like the edge of civilization and time and so forth. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: definitely an off season vacation movie, though I'm to understand

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Speaker 2: they didn't necessarily shoot everything off season, like some of

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Speaker 2: this stuff was shot in July. Wow, huh.

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Speaker 3: To refine what I said a little bit, Actually, I

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Speaker 3: think it's specifically the fact that it's like a beach

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Speaker 3: made to be full of people. So you see chairs

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Speaker 3: and little changing houses and everything like it's it's usually populated.

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Speaker 3: I guess it would be less, it would have less

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Speaker 3: of this kind of impact if it were more of

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Speaker 3: a beach in a wilderness. But it's not that it's

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Speaker 3: a beach right in the right world. The hotels let out,

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Speaker 3: so it should be full of tourists, and it's not.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, even when they go to Bruges, Yeah, there's very

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Speaker 2: few people around. Like everything feels a little bit like

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Speaker 2: a ghost town for our characters here. The only different world.

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Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, the only local attraction in Bruges is the

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Speaker 3: the murder Victim. It's like, yeah, get your tickets to

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Speaker 3: see the hand to pop out of the gurney one

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Speaker 3: more time.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you guys didn't go to the museums. What's up? Oh?

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Speaker 2: They do ride what's it called? They ride one of

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Speaker 2: those little boats in the canals. Yeah. Is it a

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Speaker 2: gondola if it's in Bruges. I don't know technically, but

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Speaker 2: they do ride with the dude wearing.

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Speaker 3: The UFO Elvis sunglasses. They're crazy. Yeah, we will have

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Speaker 3: a lot to say. I'm sure about the fashion choices

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Speaker 3: throughout the film, because this movie is extremely invested in style.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, because it's not only a film full of

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Speaker 2: dismal landscapes, but also just dazzling splashes of color, generally

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Speaker 2: red and green, sometimes white, pure light even and of

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Speaker 2: course darkness. And often all of these elements seem to

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Speaker 2: be like speaking in a code, you know, like why

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Speaker 2: is this actor wearing red right now? And what does

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Speaker 2: that mean? When suddenly they're wearing white and this one's

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Speaker 2: wearing red. It doesn't feel random. It feels very intentional,

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Speaker 2: but like it's it's blinking a code to me that

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Speaker 2: I'm supposed to decipher.

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Speaker 3: Like the character Valerie is very coded as white and gold,

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Speaker 3: whereas the character of the Countess is very black, white

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Speaker 3: and red, which has some kind of unsavory associations. Even

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Speaker 3: if you don't make the connection consciously, I feel like

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Speaker 3: you can kind of sense it there. This looks like

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Speaker 3: a flag I've seen before.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I was watching some extras. I think I

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Speaker 2: was listening to the commentary track with the director and

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Speaker 2: one of the screenwriters, Harry Comel. He said, these are

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Speaker 2: the colors of dictatorship, and they're reflected throughout the film

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Speaker 2: and also in this character. But then also sometimes she's

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Speaker 2: a mirror.

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Speaker 3: Ball, that's true. Yeah, the full sequin dress. Yeah, she's

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Speaker 3: the disco ball. Yeah, some fabulous gowns, fabulous gowns. But

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Speaker 3: like some other romantically themed vampire movies, this movie also,

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Speaker 3: I think, is very concerned with the kind of subtleties

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Speaker 3: of power and domination within romantic relationships.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, as many have pointed out over the years and

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Speaker 2: will become obvious in our discussion but also in any

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Speaker 2: of your individual viewings of the picture, it's a film

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Speaker 2: deeply concerned with the patriarchal control. And we might very

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Speaker 2: roughly see Stephan, our lead male character, as paradoxically an

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Speaker 2: individual who exists on both sides of this control directly

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Speaker 2: subjicated by patriarchal control, and also exerting increasingly violent patriarchal

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Speaker 2: control over his new bride and any women who ventured

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Speaker 2: too close. But again, not all of this often feels

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Speaker 2: like it is very It's presented in at least a

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Speaker 2: semi cryptic fashion, so it's not too on the nose

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Speaker 2: with a lot of these points. Sometimes it's a little

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Speaker 2: on the nose, but a lot of it. It gives

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Speaker 2: you a lot to think about. It's a lot to

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Speaker 2: contemplate concerning the psychology of the picture.

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Speaker 3: I liked what you said about it feeling like it

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Speaker 3: takes place in another world that's really sinking in for me. Now,

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Speaker 3: I don't think I put it in those words myself,

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Speaker 3: but yes, this movie does feel like it is a

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Speaker 3: place where the characters have kind of ventured outside of

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Speaker 3: reality and outside of normal life into these otherwise deserted

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Speaker 3: play places like I think it's significant that most of

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Speaker 3: the film takes place in luxury environments, environments where people

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Speaker 3: go for recreation to have a good time a fancy

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Speaker 3: expensive hotel or these beachside resorts and tour buses and

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Speaker 3: train compartments, and you know, like a luxury train compartment,

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Speaker 3: private compartment. They're all like places where rich people play.

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Speaker 3: And our characters come into these places where rich people play,

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Speaker 3: but they're deserted of all the other people. It's like

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Speaker 3: they were set up as some kind of experiment, like

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Speaker 3: just to have these characters in particular kind of clash

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Speaker 3: together and interact. There's something that feels intentionally kind of

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Speaker 3: surreal and artificial about it, like that it is supposed

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Speaker 3: to feel that way, that like we're kind of dolls

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Speaker 3: being played with.

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Speaker 2: Does that make any sense? Yeah, yeah, it does. And

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Speaker 2: to the dreamlike aspect of things, the non reality aspects

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Speaker 2: of things. I mean, there was at one point in

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Speaker 2: one of the extras I was watching or listening to,

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Speaker 2: the director said films are not reality, they are dreams,

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Speaker 2: which I think is something that does reson It certainly

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Speaker 2: resonates throughout this picture.

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Speaker 3: That makes sense having seen this movie. Yeah, that spirit

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Speaker 3: is running through it. There is a.

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Speaker 2: Dream like quality where.

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Speaker 3: You know, actions aren't always fully explained, they're not always logical,

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Speaker 3: but they also make a kind of symbolic sense. It

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Speaker 3: feels like they mean something, even if you couldn't say

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Speaker 3: what it is.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and This is of course intensified by so many

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Speaker 2: of the different visual choices that are made. There are

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Speaker 2: these frequent red out transitions that I really liked in

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Speaker 2: the picture, which of course feels very appropriate for a

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Speaker 2: vampire film, a film concerned with blood, But it also

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Speaker 2: just adds to this feeling that like everything is some

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Speaker 2: sort of a fever dream, you know, and we're just

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Speaker 2: sort of, you know, redding out from one scene into

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Speaker 2: the next as the blood is surging to our head

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Speaker 2: or something.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that's interesting. There's another thing I was thinking about

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Speaker 3: the transitions in the movie.

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Speaker 2: Did you notice a kind.

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Speaker 3: Of weird pattern where a scene will kind of like

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Speaker 3: escalate to negativity, where characters, like at the end of

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Speaker 3: a scene are in maximal conflict, and then it'll cut

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Speaker 3: and that'll be the end of the scene. And then

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Speaker 3: the next time we see the characters again, they are

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Speaker 3: behaving cooperatively or even happily together, And do you know

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Speaker 3: what I'm talking about?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I know what you mean. Yeah, there's several

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Speaker 2: key examples of this, and they yeah, it does sort

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Speaker 2: of add to this kind of dreamlike quality, but also

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Speaker 2: in a way that I mean, it doesn't in the

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Speaker 2: sense that the dream we see here is a reflection

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Speaker 2: of real life. So it's not like the characters are

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Speaker 2: behaving like unrealistically, but we were getting that kind of

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Speaker 2: like kaleidoscope vision of their lives.

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Speaker 3: I'm thinking specifically of the kind of like horrible awkwardness

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Speaker 3: while while they're on the bus returning from Bruges, well,

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Speaker 3: Valerie and stephan they have this kind of argument about

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Speaker 3: something that really should be a major red flag about

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Speaker 3: Stephana and like this guy is oops, I'm married a

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Speaker 3: serial killer. Like this guy's not good, and then it

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Speaker 3: gets even weirder from there, and then we cut away

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Speaker 3: after that, and the next time we see them, they're

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Speaker 3: coming in the door from out of the rain, like

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Speaker 3: laughing and just you know, having a great time.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, I mean maybe they're they're kind of faking

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Speaker 2: it a little bit there, I don't know.

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Speaker 3: But we don't see the resolutions from those moments where

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Speaker 3: the terror or the awkwardness is just left hanging.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, which I think kind of works in a major

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Speaker 2: way because since we don't see resolution, we don't see

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Speaker 2: them patching it up. For us us, it feels all

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Speaker 2: the more unresolved. You know, we don't see the tender

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Speaker 2: moment that allows them to move on to the next

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Speaker 2: few hours. So we're like, what are you guys doing here?

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Speaker 2: This is not working. This is a this is a

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Speaker 2: doomed romance even without vampires involved.

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Speaker 3: Okay, So normally we would do some trailer audio about

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Speaker 3: the film that rob understand that you checked out the trailers,

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Speaker 3: then they're no good.

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Speaker 2: Oh they're they're terrible. Like, I'm so glad I watched

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Speaker 2: this movie without having seen a trailer for it, because

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Speaker 2: this is one of those cases where the trailers either

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Speaker 2: misrepresent things about the film or outright spoil things, and

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Speaker 2: certainly visually spoil a lot of the key moments. So

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Speaker 2: I would advise against the trailers. Just just pick up

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Speaker 2: the film if you want to see it. And if

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Speaker 2: you want to see it, you're in luck because this

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Speaker 2: one's presently available to stream, at least in the States

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Speaker 2: on a number of platforms, including Shutter and two B,

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Speaker 2: so like there are options at all, you know, budget levels.

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Speaker 2: And there was an excellent blu ray of it out

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Speaker 2: from Blue Underground from several years back, and that's what

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Speaker 2: I watched it on. I rented it from Videodrome and

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Speaker 2: it has a great array of extras and commentary tracks.

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Speaker 3: I just had to stream this one. But yeah, I

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Speaker 3: would say more than most of the movies we watched,

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Speaker 3: this is one where I really want to know more

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Speaker 3: about the process, so I would be interested in those extras.

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Speaker 3: I want to know what the creators were thinking.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's fascinating. I didn't have time to even explore

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Speaker 2: all of the extras. And because they're like three different

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Speaker 2: commentary tracks, you know, like multiple hours worth of content,

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Speaker 2: And you know, it seems like there's a lot of

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Speaker 2: interesting behind the scenes stories and you know, I'll pass

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Speaker 2: on some of those, but you know, this is a

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Speaker 2: film that people have been talking about ensuring their experiences

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Speaker 2: making it for decades at this point, and so you know,

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Speaker 2: there's a lot of lore out there. All right, let's

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Speaker 2: talk about the people who made the picture, starting at

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Speaker 2: the top with Harry Kommel, the director and one of

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Speaker 2: the screenwriters. Born nineteen forty Belgian film director, best known

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Speaker 2: for this film certainly internationally, which achieved cult status throughout

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Speaker 2: Europe and the United States and is now considered a

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Speaker 2: classic of its genre. He was active as a director

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Speaker 2: from around nineteen fifty three through two thousand and three,

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Speaker 2: and while Daughters of Darkness was his big cold hit,

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Speaker 2: his most critically successful film was the follow up I

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Speaker 2: believe it also came out in nineteen seventy one, The

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Speaker 2: Legend of doom House or it's also known as Malpatrie.

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Speaker 2: That one stars Orson Wells and Susan Hampshire.

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Speaker 3: I've had this one on the list for a bit,

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Speaker 3: but I've never seen it. Of course, it's seventies Orson Wells,

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Speaker 3: which I'm here for that, and it just looked like

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Speaker 3: it looked suitably weird, so I've been wanting to check

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Speaker 3: it out for a bit.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, supposed to be great. Another picture of his note

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Speaker 2: is nineteen sixty nine's Monsieur Howarden, which also has something

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Speaker 2: of a following concerning the tale of a nineteenth century

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Speaker 2: French female cross dresser whose two male lovers fight a

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Speaker 2: duel over her, apparently based on an historic person, but

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Speaker 2: I don't know the full story there. But as far

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Speaker 2: as Daughters of Darkness goes splendid work here and the

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Speaker 2: interview extras that I've watched and listened to, he comes

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Speaker 2: off as very detail oriented, and I know that others

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Speaker 2: have also talked about him being very detail oriented and

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Speaker 2: a bit weird, but he points out that with Daughters

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Speaker 2: of Darkness, they really wanted to make a film that

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Speaker 2: was not only artistically solid but also fun, giving its

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Speaker 2: genre trappings, and you know, I would I would say

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Speaker 2: that I agree with that. It's you know, it's not

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Speaker 2: you know, it's not you know, an explosion every minute

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Speaker 2: or anything like that. A lot of people have pointed

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Speaker 2: out that it has maybe kind of a slow burn

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Speaker 2: build in some respects, certainly for a genre picture. But yeah,

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Speaker 2: I feel like it was pretty fun throughout.

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Speaker 3: There are certainly sometimes when it gets it gets very dark,

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Speaker 3: but it's not. It's a very attention gripping picture. It

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Speaker 3: is easy to stick with, at least in my experience.

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Speaker 2: All Right, moving on to some of the other writers.

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Speaker 2: Pierre Drew born nineteen forty three was also associate producer.

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Speaker 2: He was also a director in his own right. In

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Speaker 2: the extras on the Blue Underground discs, he reminisces on

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Speaker 2: the three weeks he spent writing the script with Harry

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Speaker 2: before the director who's also present in this extra with him,

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Speaker 2: reminds him that it was actually three days. They were

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Speaker 2: somewhat older at this point. It had been a long time.

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Speaker 2: But that sounds like Roger Corman and Charles Griffith. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: it's different. Recollections on how this came together. Yeah, but

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Speaker 2: came together it did. Drew's other credits as a writer

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Speaker 2: include nineteen eighty seven's Mascara starring Charlotte Rampling Let's See Then.

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Speaker 2: Also Jean Ferry nineteen oh six through nineteen seventy four

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Speaker 2: also credit on the screen French writer who also contributed

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Speaker 2: to Malpatri that we referenced to earlier. And there are

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Speaker 2: a couple of other names that are also cited for

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Speaker 2: work on the screenplay. And I believe Kummel and Drew

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Speaker 2: also mentioned an American who did something. But I believe

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Speaker 2: that Kummel and Drew are considered like the main writers

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Speaker 2: on this picture.

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Speaker 3: But at the center of this movie, you've got a

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Speaker 3: bathory or a batty or a vampire. Let's say so,

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Speaker 3: who is our vampire countess?

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Speaker 2: It is Delphine Serik, who lived nineteen thirty two through

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Speaker 2: nineteen ninety And oh my goodness, she is amazing in this.

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Speaker 2: This is just this is just a breathtaking performance. This

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Speaker 2: is one of those performances where anytime she is on

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Speaker 2: the screen, and thankfully she's on the screen a lot.

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Speaker 2: You're just totally captivated by every little choice she's making,

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Speaker 2: you know, with her body language, with her voice. I mean,

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Speaker 2: her voice alone is just amazing. What are our eyes doing?

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Speaker 2: It's just such a complete and total performance.

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Speaker 3: Yes, Yes, the way she embodies a kind of violent glamour,

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Speaker 3: this kind of passive aggressive predation, the way she's always

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Speaker 3: the way she's always saying, like be nice to me.

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Speaker 3: Oh man, it's so evil and it's so good.

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Speaker 2: So playing our Hungarian countess. We have yet. Lebanese born

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Speaker 2: French actress Delphine serig here Ye star of stage and screen,

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Speaker 2: also a film director in her own right, a major

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Speaker 2: European star in her day, as well as a prominent

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Speaker 2: French feminist. She rose to stardom with nineteen sixty one's

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Speaker 2: Last Year at Marimbad, which was based on the novel

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Speaker 2: by Alan Robe Grillat, an author that I've I've read

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Speaker 2: quite a bit of, but I've never watched any of

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Speaker 2: his films. This was an adaptation of his films, and

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Speaker 2: then he directed a number of films, but I have

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Speaker 2: not seen any of his film work. The picture in

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Speaker 2: question last year at Marion Bed was directed by Francis

384
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Speaker 2: alan Renee, who subsequently cast Sarigh in nineteen sixty threes

385
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Speaker 2: Muriel and subsequent films of note for her include nineteen

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Speaker 2: sixty nine's Mister Freedom, nineteen seventies Donkey Skin, seventy two's

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Speaker 2: The Discrete Charm of the Bourgeoisie, nineteen seventy threes, The

388
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Speaker 2: Day of the Jackal in nineteen seventy four's The Black Windmill.

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Speaker 3: Donkey Skin multiply recommended to us that's been on the

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Speaker 3: weird House list for a bit.

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Speaker 2: Well, if she's in it, all the more reason to

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Speaker 2: see it, because I had not seen her in anything before.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, she was at the time a big star

394
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Speaker 2: and the only actor that they actively tried to get

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Speaker 2: for this picture. And then we're kind of shocked that

396
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Speaker 2: they were able to get her attached to the film.

397
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Speaker 2: In some of the commentary tracks, like they point out

398
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Speaker 2: that apparently she was paid in cash, like a purse

399
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Speaker 2: is full of like a whole bunch of European cash.

400
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Speaker 2: I don't know what that means, but I like it.

401
00:22:04,840 --> 00:22:09,280
Speaker 2: It sounds like it means something. Yeah, so basically I'm

402
00:22:09,320 --> 00:22:13,800
Speaker 2: to understand. So again, this was a multinational production here,

403
00:22:14,320 --> 00:22:17,080
Speaker 2: and she was the only person who was intentionally cast

404
00:22:17,080 --> 00:22:21,440
Speaker 2: for the picture. Everyone else was provided. I believe Harry

405
00:22:21,480 --> 00:22:25,879
Speaker 2: Kumbo's words were sight unseen by the various international producers.

406
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Speaker 2: So Canada sent somebody, the US sent somebody, Germany sent

407
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Speaker 2: a couple of people, and then it had to come together,

408
00:22:34,640 --> 00:22:39,760
Speaker 2: you know. I believe it's the I believe John Carlin,

409
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Speaker 2: who plays stuff in the commentary track with him, he

410
00:22:43,040 --> 00:22:45,040
Speaker 2: pointed out that like the cast here was kind of

411
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Speaker 2: an accident, but then again it works, And he made

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Speaker 2: a great point. He said, like any good movie is

413
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Speaker 2: kind of an accident, like if it comes together and works,

414
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Speaker 2: like there's so many forces just completely out of anybody's control.

415
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Speaker 2: That's true.

416
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Speaker 3: A film is pretty much always a collaboration, so there

417
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Speaker 3: there's more chaos in how it comes together. And also

418
00:23:03,760 --> 00:23:06,120
Speaker 3: i'd say, because of that, a little bit more magic

419
00:23:06,280 --> 00:23:09,119
Speaker 3: than something that is an art project created by just

420
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Speaker 3: one person.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, Now, as far as I can tell, everyone

422
00:23:15,040 --> 00:23:19,600
Speaker 2: was excited to work with sarac on this, and everyone

423
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Speaker 2: just had really nice things to say about working with her.

424
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Speaker 2: By all accounts, she brought note on not only her

425
00:23:25,200 --> 00:23:28,439
Speaker 2: own sheer talent, and effortless charisma to the production. But

426
00:23:28,520 --> 00:23:31,199
Speaker 2: she was one of those actors that helped elevate everyone's craft,

427
00:23:31,400 --> 00:23:34,480
Speaker 2: you know, like in people she had scenes with, she

428
00:23:34,520 --> 00:23:38,119
Speaker 2: would go out of her way to improve their performance

429
00:23:38,160 --> 00:23:41,159
Speaker 2: and make them feel at ease. And then she would

430
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Speaker 2: even improve upon things, improve upon the direction that was

431
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Speaker 2: given her in ways where the director was like, well,

432
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Speaker 2: that was obviously the right choice because you made it work.

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00:23:49,119 --> 00:23:51,640
Speaker 3: There are so many things about her performance that really

434
00:23:51,680 --> 00:23:55,119
Speaker 3: work very well. But one of them, again that I

435
00:23:55,200 --> 00:23:58,560
Speaker 3: have to emphasize, is the way that she is so

436
00:23:58,880 --> 00:24:03,360
Speaker 3: flawlessly threatening in a subtle way. There's like a subtext

437
00:24:03,400 --> 00:24:07,280
Speaker 3: of threat in the way that she is overtly passive.

438
00:24:07,440 --> 00:24:10,040
Speaker 3: She will make a little kind of plea or a bid,

439
00:24:10,240 --> 00:24:13,359
Speaker 3: so she says multiple times to a character be nice

440
00:24:13,359 --> 00:24:16,399
Speaker 3: to me, or says like please about something, in a

441
00:24:16,440 --> 00:24:20,880
Speaker 3: way that has this kind of like undercurrent of violence

442
00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:21,760
Speaker 3: running through it.

443
00:24:22,480 --> 00:24:25,600
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, absolutely, all right. So we'll have more to

444
00:24:25,640 --> 00:24:28,720
Speaker 2: say about this performance as we roll on through the episode.

445
00:24:28,720 --> 00:24:31,119
Speaker 2: But you can't have a vampire without a vampire thrall,

446
00:24:31,480 --> 00:24:33,840
Speaker 2: and the Countess's thrall is in the form of Ilona,

447
00:24:34,160 --> 00:24:38,760
Speaker 2: played by Andrea Rau born nineteen forty seven, German actress

448
00:24:38,920 --> 00:24:44,000
Speaker 2: and former ballerina and model. Prior to this, she'd mostly

449
00:24:44,040 --> 00:24:47,160
Speaker 2: acted I believe in comedies and some like sexy comedies

450
00:24:47,760 --> 00:24:50,199
Speaker 2: in Germany. But this was one of a couple of

451
00:24:50,280 --> 00:24:52,720
Speaker 2: nineteen seventy one films that saw her branch out into

452
00:24:52,720 --> 00:24:57,520
Speaker 2: more serious work. Subsequent films included nineteen seventy fives than Net.

453
00:24:57,680 --> 00:24:59,760
Speaker 2: We not the one with Sandra Bolla. No, No, this

454
00:24:59,800 --> 00:25:03,440
Speaker 2: is woman had clothskin skin. It's so different net. I

455
00:25:03,520 --> 00:25:07,440
Speaker 2: think it's metaphorical. I don't think it involves the Internet

456
00:25:07,560 --> 00:25:11,160
Speaker 2: or an actual rope. Net a couple of notes from

457
00:25:11,600 --> 00:25:14,119
Speaker 2: interviews that I watched with her. She points out that

458
00:25:14,200 --> 00:25:16,000
Speaker 2: she ended up really liking her hair, so she kept

459
00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:18,480
Speaker 2: his hairstyle pretty you know, has kept it for the

460
00:25:18,560 --> 00:25:20,080
Speaker 2: rest of her life. It's kind of a.

461
00:25:20,000 --> 00:25:22,600
Speaker 3: Strange haircut, but it looks cool. It's like it's like

462
00:25:22,640 --> 00:25:25,000
Speaker 3: a sloped bob. I don't know what you call that.

463
00:25:25,400 --> 00:25:29,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, And her performance here is very physical, and I

464
00:25:29,359 --> 00:25:33,679
Speaker 2: can see where her dance background probably became useful, you know.

465
00:25:33,840 --> 00:25:36,480
Speaker 2: But at the same time, she was one of the

466
00:25:36,480 --> 00:25:39,360
Speaker 2: greener performers here, and so there's kind of an awkwardness

467
00:25:39,359 --> 00:25:42,240
Speaker 2: to her performance, but I don't know, I feel like

468
00:25:42,280 --> 00:25:44,639
Speaker 2: it kind of works well because this is kind of

469
00:25:44,680 --> 00:25:48,480
Speaker 2: a I mean, she's a vampire's thrall, She's in a

470
00:25:48,600 --> 00:25:51,480
Speaker 2: very unnatural place in her life, and therefore I feel

471
00:25:51,520 --> 00:25:54,439
Speaker 2: like a certain amount of the unnatural to the performance

472
00:25:54,960 --> 00:25:55,439
Speaker 2: is fitting.

473
00:25:55,640 --> 00:26:00,240
Speaker 3: She's a very sad and pitiable character, especially not just

474
00:26:00,280 --> 00:26:04,159
Speaker 3: in the fact that she is enslaved to a vampire queen,

475
00:26:04,359 --> 00:26:07,920
Speaker 3: but that the vampire queen insists on kind of treating

476
00:26:07,960 --> 00:26:11,720
Speaker 3: her like a little friend. Yeah, the way that that

477
00:26:11,800 --> 00:26:15,960
Speaker 3: makes it so much more cruel and the and so

478
00:26:16,080 --> 00:26:19,720
Speaker 3: in these little moments where she has she has these

479
00:26:19,720 --> 00:26:23,320
Speaker 3: great moments of a posture in her performance that like

480
00:26:23,440 --> 00:26:27,199
Speaker 3: diminish her in various ways and render her more pitiable.

481
00:26:28,000 --> 00:26:30,040
Speaker 3: Like there's a way that she kind of hugs up

482
00:26:30,080 --> 00:26:33,280
Speaker 3: against walls and furniture the way like a kid does

483
00:26:33,320 --> 00:26:34,280
Speaker 3: when they're ashamed.

484
00:26:35,040 --> 00:26:37,600
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, I think she mentioned that the director told

485
00:26:37,640 --> 00:26:39,719
Speaker 2: her to be a spider in some of these scenes,

486
00:26:39,760 --> 00:26:41,879
Speaker 2: and so she's trying to be kind of like spidery,

487
00:26:41,960 --> 00:26:44,399
Speaker 2: clinging to the walls and all. Oh yeah, yeah, I

488
00:26:44,400 --> 00:26:44,800
Speaker 2: can see that.

489
00:26:44,920 --> 00:26:47,199
Speaker 3: But also she's quite scary in one moment where she

490
00:26:47,320 --> 00:26:50,040
Speaker 3: like surprises Valerie out on the balcony. We just see

491
00:26:50,160 --> 00:26:52,359
Speaker 3: like a flash of her, and she's like she's like

492
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:55,600
Speaker 3: naked with her arms raised almost like a like vampire

493
00:26:55,840 --> 00:26:58,919
Speaker 3: kind of claw hands, but also like a ballet pose.

494
00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:01,680
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, and also I don't know, it feels like

495
00:27:01,720 --> 00:27:05,080
Speaker 2: it's something out of like a silent German expressionist film

496
00:27:05,080 --> 00:27:10,639
Speaker 2: as well. It has that kind of severity to it. Yeah.

497
00:27:10,800 --> 00:27:13,439
Speaker 2: All right, so those are that's our vampire queen and

498
00:27:13,560 --> 00:27:16,080
Speaker 2: her vampiric thrall. But we also have to have our

499
00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:20,960
Speaker 2: doomed honeymoon couple, and so let's get into them a

500
00:27:20,960 --> 00:27:21,320
Speaker 2: bit here.

501
00:27:21,440 --> 00:27:24,320
Speaker 3: They've got their own issues before the vampire even gets there.

502
00:27:24,560 --> 00:27:27,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, as others have pointed out, like even if the

503
00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:29,600
Speaker 2: vampires never showed up, this was not going to end

504
00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:32,040
Speaker 2: well and it could have easily still been a very

505
00:27:32,119 --> 00:27:35,080
Speaker 2: dramatic horror picture in its own right.

506
00:27:35,440 --> 00:27:37,960
Speaker 3: Okay, but this couple is Valerie and Stephan.

507
00:27:38,359 --> 00:27:41,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, let's start with Valorie. Valerie is played by Danielle

508
00:27:41,960 --> 00:27:46,120
Speaker 2: we Met born nineteen forty seven, Canadian actress who got

509
00:27:46,119 --> 00:27:48,920
Speaker 2: her start in a pair of notable Canadian erotic films

510
00:27:48,920 --> 00:27:51,920
Speaker 2: from sixty nine and seventy, and then she also did

511
00:27:51,920 --> 00:27:56,000
Speaker 2: some mainstream television work in Quebec before filming this, which

512
00:27:56,400 --> 00:27:58,720
Speaker 2: I believe it turned out to be her most iconic role.

513
00:27:59,480 --> 00:28:01,639
Speaker 2: She continued to work through the nineteen seventies and then

514
00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:04,800
Speaker 2: return to acting in the early two thousands. Other credits

515
00:28:04,800 --> 00:28:08,120
Speaker 2: of note include nineteen seventy two's The Possession of Virginia.

516
00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:11,959
Speaker 2: Never seen it. This is, I think for the only

517
00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:14,720
Speaker 2: thing I've seen her in. She's done a lot of

518
00:28:14,720 --> 00:28:17,199
Speaker 2: interviews over the years and has spoken very highly of

519
00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:19,760
Speaker 2: the film itself and certainly of her work with Sarreg,

520
00:28:20,640 --> 00:28:24,639
Speaker 2: But I believe her onset relationship with the director was

521
00:28:24,680 --> 00:28:28,080
Speaker 2: not great. Her performance here is certainly greener. I mean,

522
00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:30,800
Speaker 2: I mean, it's unfair to even compare to someone like Sarreg,

523
00:28:30,840 --> 00:28:34,680
Speaker 2: who was a seasoned actress of the stage and the screen.

524
00:28:35,840 --> 00:28:38,600
Speaker 2: But again, I think it ends up largely working here,

525
00:28:38,640 --> 00:28:40,880
Speaker 2: because it ends up we end up with this. There's

526
00:28:40,920 --> 00:28:44,520
Speaker 2: a strong sense of naivety about Valerie. You know, she

527
00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:48,360
Speaker 2: is being controlled and manipulated to varying degrees by two

528
00:28:48,440 --> 00:28:52,120
Speaker 2: different characters in the picture before you know, arguably truly

529
00:28:52,160 --> 00:28:53,040
Speaker 2: coming into her own.

530
00:28:53,840 --> 00:28:57,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think I alluded to this earlier in our intro,

531
00:28:57,160 --> 00:29:00,200
Speaker 3: but the movie is to a large extent about sort

532
00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:06,800
Speaker 3: of different pathological ways that anxiety can present in romantic relationships.

533
00:29:06,880 --> 00:29:10,240
Speaker 3: And so the character we're about to talk about in

534
00:29:10,240 --> 00:29:12,479
Speaker 3: a minute, Stephan, like he has a kind of like

535
00:29:12,680 --> 00:29:17,240
Speaker 3: externalizing anxiety which turns into violence and rage and fascination

536
00:29:17,400 --> 00:29:24,720
Speaker 3: with violence and all that. Meanwhile, Valerie's anxiety manifests as

537
00:29:24,840 --> 00:29:29,640
Speaker 3: a kind of passivity and insecurity that like she she's

538
00:29:29,680 --> 00:29:33,600
Speaker 3: always like trying to reconnect with the man that she

539
00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:38,160
Speaker 3: loves and trying to find ways of making the connection stronger,

540
00:29:38,560 --> 00:29:41,000
Speaker 3: even as he gives her just more and more reason

541
00:29:41,120 --> 00:29:43,840
Speaker 3: to doubt that he's really worthy of her at all.

542
00:29:44,080 --> 00:29:46,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I mean I think as viewers are, like,

543
00:29:47,000 --> 00:29:48,600
Speaker 2: we're watching this, who we're saying, girl, you need to

544
00:29:48,600 --> 00:29:50,320
Speaker 2: get out of this relationship. You've known a guy like

545
00:29:50,320 --> 00:29:52,520
Speaker 2: two days, I don't think you should have married him.

546
00:29:52,840 --> 00:29:56,560
Speaker 2: But but no, you're absolutely correct.

547
00:29:57,160 --> 00:29:59,680
Speaker 3: Yeah, the red flags really stack up with Stefan. But

548
00:29:59,720 --> 00:30:02,920
Speaker 3: the the way Valerie comes through I think is quite real.

549
00:30:02,960 --> 00:30:06,320
Speaker 3: I Mean, this is a way sometimes people can deal

550
00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:09,800
Speaker 3: with stress and anxiety and relationships is just is to

551
00:30:09,840 --> 00:30:15,120
Speaker 3: be increasingly kind of placating and increasingly trying to make

552
00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:17,400
Speaker 3: amends when it wasn't your fault to begin with.

553
00:30:18,240 --> 00:30:22,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, Now playing Stephan, we have John Carlin who

554
00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:26,480
Speaker 2: lived nineteen thirty three through twenty twenty American actor best

555
00:30:26,560 --> 00:30:30,680
Speaker 2: known for his American TV roles. He played Harvey Lacy

556
00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:33,000
Speaker 2: on Cagney and Lacy in the nineteen eighties. That would

557
00:30:33,000 --> 00:30:37,560
Speaker 2: be the husband of one of the title characters. Not

558
00:30:37,600 --> 00:30:41,200
Speaker 2: a show I ever watched, but I believe it was

559
00:30:41,520 --> 00:30:44,400
Speaker 2: a big hit during its day, and he also played

560
00:30:44,440 --> 00:30:47,360
Speaker 2: a number of different roles on Dark Shadows. I think

561
00:30:47,440 --> 00:30:50,520
Speaker 2: initially and mainly a character named Willie Loomis, who I

562
00:30:50,520 --> 00:30:52,600
Speaker 2: think is kind of like a con man who is

563
00:30:52,640 --> 00:30:57,080
Speaker 2: involved with accidentally bringing or maybe intentionally bringing Barnabas Collins

564
00:30:57,120 --> 00:31:00,320
Speaker 2: back from the grave, Barnabas Collins being a vampire. If

565
00:31:00,360 --> 00:31:02,120
Speaker 2: anyone out there is not aware, I don't know what

566
00:31:02,160 --> 00:31:05,000
Speaker 2: you're talking about, Oh, Barnabas Collins. I mean, I mean

567
00:31:05,080 --> 00:31:07,760
Speaker 2: I watched maybe one or two episodes of Dark Shadows

568
00:31:08,240 --> 00:31:10,200
Speaker 2: back in the day when it was aired on like

569
00:31:10,200 --> 00:31:14,040
Speaker 2: Sci Fi Channel, But you know, Gothic horror as a

570
00:31:14,080 --> 00:31:17,200
Speaker 2: soap opera as a concept, I'm totally on board with that.

571
00:31:17,320 --> 00:31:19,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm here for that. I've never seen it though.

572
00:31:19,320 --> 00:31:21,400
Speaker 2: They did a couple of movies and he's in those

573
00:31:21,440 --> 00:31:23,320
Speaker 2: as well, So maybe we can come back to some

574
00:31:23,360 --> 00:31:27,760
Speaker 2: Barnabas Collins in the future. Okay. Carlin also did a

575
00:31:27,920 --> 00:31:30,760
Speaker 2: number of other TV credits going back to the late

576
00:31:30,840 --> 00:31:33,760
Speaker 2: nineteen fifties. He pops up on Night Gallery, He's in

577
00:31:33,880 --> 00:31:37,840
Speaker 2: seventy five's Trilogy of Terror, He's in Super Train and

578
00:31:37,960 --> 00:31:41,080
Speaker 2: then later Matt about You Murder, she wrote. He was

579
00:31:41,120 --> 00:31:43,680
Speaker 2: also in the nineteen ninety three movie Surf Ninjas.

580
00:31:45,680 --> 00:31:47,480
Speaker 3: Now it's easy to confuse that with a couple of

581
00:31:47,520 --> 00:31:52,400
Speaker 3: other things. Yeah, Surf Ninjas is neither Surf Nazis Must Die,

582
00:31:52,840 --> 00:31:56,280
Speaker 3: nor is it the Three Ninjas of the nineties is

583
00:31:56,440 --> 00:31:57,320
Speaker 3: a separate thing.

584
00:31:57,400 --> 00:31:59,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I don't think there's a shared universe here.

585
00:32:02,000 --> 00:32:04,040
Speaker 2: I checked out a couple of interviews with him as

586
00:32:04,040 --> 00:32:07,000
Speaker 2: well part of his commentary track, and like everyone else,

587
00:32:07,040 --> 00:32:10,120
Speaker 2: had nothing but praise for Sarah had a lot of

588
00:32:10,120 --> 00:32:11,960
Speaker 2: great things to say about the finished product of the

589
00:32:12,000 --> 00:32:14,920
Speaker 2: film and various interesting stories about its production, though he

590
00:32:14,960 --> 00:32:17,160
Speaker 2: does point out that like he did, have to deal

591
00:32:17,160 --> 00:32:21,280
Speaker 2: with the fact that the director was obviously disappointed that

592
00:32:21,360 --> 00:32:24,640
Speaker 2: he was older than he looked in his head shots.

593
00:32:25,800 --> 00:32:27,479
Speaker 2: And this is something I didn't even think about, but

594
00:32:27,560 --> 00:32:29,200
Speaker 2: like he's I think the character is supposed to be

595
00:32:29,280 --> 00:32:32,120
Speaker 2: in his twenties and the actor was in his late thirties.

596
00:32:32,560 --> 00:32:36,960
Speaker 2: Really yeah, Oh, and so there was some tension there,

597
00:32:36,960 --> 00:32:39,040
Speaker 2: at least initially where the directors like, they sent me

598
00:32:39,080 --> 00:32:41,760
Speaker 2: this older guy, and he's too old for the part.

599
00:32:41,840 --> 00:32:45,440
Speaker 2: But I don't know. I'd always felt it seemed to

600
00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:48,080
Speaker 2: work for me as a viewer, So I don't know

601
00:32:48,120 --> 00:32:49,400
Speaker 2: that there was really an issue here.

602
00:32:49,680 --> 00:32:53,720
Speaker 3: That's interesting. Yeah, I wouldn't I would not have complained

603
00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:56,160
Speaker 3: about this about the movie, But now that you say it,

604
00:32:56,240 --> 00:32:58,959
Speaker 3: he does look a bit older than the part seems

605
00:32:59,000 --> 00:33:02,920
Speaker 3: to be written. It has written as like a role

606
00:33:03,080 --> 00:33:07,480
Speaker 3: for a young man I'm imagining like that Stephan is

607
00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:10,240
Speaker 3: supposed to be I don't know, twenty three or so,

608
00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:12,760
Speaker 3: but yeah, he is a good bit older than that.

609
00:33:12,960 --> 00:33:16,000
Speaker 3: But I wouldn't have I don't know if I would

610
00:33:16,000 --> 00:33:18,200
Speaker 3: have called that out without knowing that fact.

611
00:33:18,480 --> 00:33:22,040
Speaker 2: I mean, part of it is that films do tend

612
00:33:22,080 --> 00:33:25,960
Speaker 2: to condition us to not question the male in a

613
00:33:26,200 --> 00:33:30,880
Speaker 2: relate on screen relationship. Being significantly older than a female counterpart.

614
00:33:31,600 --> 00:33:34,600
Speaker 2: But also we'll get into some of the details we

615
00:33:34,680 --> 00:33:37,280
Speaker 2: learn about Stephan, and I don't know, it felt kind

616
00:33:37,280 --> 00:33:40,800
Speaker 2: of in keeping that maybe he was a little older,

617
00:33:41,280 --> 00:33:44,280
Speaker 2: you know, while sort of being locked into this younger

618
00:33:44,320 --> 00:33:48,400
Speaker 2: phase of life, you know, like he's he's older than

619
00:33:48,440 --> 00:33:51,040
Speaker 2: someone should be to suddenly go off and marry somebody

620
00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:52,640
Speaker 2: on the fly that's sort on vacation.

621
00:33:52,880 --> 00:33:56,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, but now that you mentioned that it was written younger,

622
00:33:56,600 --> 00:33:59,080
Speaker 3: yeat would make sense if Stephan was supposed to be

623
00:33:59,160 --> 00:34:02,440
Speaker 3: like a guy in his early twenties who's traveling continental Europe.

624
00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:04,920
Speaker 3: He's a young, rich guy who's just out on holiday.

625
00:34:05,200 --> 00:34:08,719
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, So yeah, we'll get into more about this character.

626
00:34:08,800 --> 00:34:11,000
Speaker 2: But on the whole, I really liked his performance. I

627
00:34:11,040 --> 00:34:14,279
Speaker 2: thought it's pretty strong here there could because again, this

628
00:34:14,360 --> 00:34:17,919
Speaker 2: is not just your typical, oh, honeymooning couple, but they're

629
00:34:17,920 --> 00:34:21,320
Speaker 2: doomed because of some external force. They're like double doomed

630
00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:25,239
Speaker 2: the external force, but also a lot of a lot

631
00:34:25,239 --> 00:34:28,200
Speaker 2: of red flags in the relationship and some you know,

632
00:34:28,560 --> 00:34:32,759
Speaker 2: some some deep trauma and an anxiety that's going on

633
00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:35,320
Speaker 2: in both of them. So those are all the beautiful

634
00:34:35,320 --> 00:34:37,640
Speaker 2: people in the picture. Do you want to mention just

635
00:34:37,760 --> 00:34:40,839
Speaker 2: there aren't very many humans in this, not counting some

636
00:34:40,880 --> 00:34:43,560
Speaker 2: of the like extras in the background. But there's a

637
00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:47,160
Speaker 2: hotel clerk at the hotel, the po Yeah, and he

638
00:34:47,239 --> 00:34:50,759
Speaker 2: is played by Paul Esser, who lived nineteen thirteen through

639
00:34:50,840 --> 00:34:54,000
Speaker 2: nineteen eighty eight, German actor of stage and screen, who

640
00:34:54,040 --> 00:34:57,160
Speaker 2: also acted in the original Swedish West German Pippy long

641
00:34:57,200 --> 00:35:00,759
Speaker 2: Stalking TV series. I've not seen. I feel like the

642
00:35:00,800 --> 00:35:04,800
Speaker 2: Pippy long Stocking I can I consumed was maybe like

643
00:35:04,800 --> 00:35:08,160
Speaker 2: like later work, like the US of British production. But

644
00:35:08,920 --> 00:35:11,520
Speaker 2: it's been a long time since I've watched any Pippy

645
00:35:11,520 --> 00:35:14,560
Speaker 2: long Stocking. Same here. I don't know the provenance of

646
00:35:14,600 --> 00:35:19,359
Speaker 2: my Pippy. According to the director on this picture, he's

647
00:35:19,360 --> 00:35:21,719
Speaker 2: supposed to play, you know, an old man who's been

648
00:35:21,719 --> 00:35:24,719
Speaker 2: at the hotel for a long time, and Harry asked

649
00:35:24,760 --> 00:35:27,359
Speaker 2: him to if he would wear gray hair for it,

650
00:35:27,400 --> 00:35:30,960
Speaker 2: and he like flatly refused, perhaps out of vanity. I

651
00:35:30,960 --> 00:35:34,200
Speaker 2: don't know that he insisted no, I will play gray,

652
00:35:34,800 --> 00:35:38,800
Speaker 2: and he does. He plays old and tired very well. Yeah.

653
00:35:38,880 --> 00:35:44,080
Speaker 2: There's also a retired policeman who shows up and this

654
00:35:43,680 --> 00:35:45,759
Speaker 2: is this is a Belgian actor by the name of

655
00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:49,560
Speaker 2: George Gemmen who lived nineteen oh six through nineteen seventy one.

656
00:35:49,800 --> 00:35:54,080
Speaker 2: It's a minor part, but nice, very sweaty monologue. As

657
00:35:54,120 --> 00:35:57,120
Speaker 2: I recall, he's supposed to be soaked with rain. Oh yeah,

658
00:35:57,120 --> 00:35:59,040
Speaker 2: it's supposed to be rain. But he looks sweaty.

659
00:35:59,520 --> 00:36:04,680
Speaker 3: He's over say rig with just like wetness pouring down

660
00:36:04,680 --> 00:36:05,160
Speaker 3: his face.

661
00:36:05,200 --> 00:36:07,440
Speaker 2: It looks gross. But he is supposed to have come

662
00:36:07,480 --> 00:36:10,280
Speaker 2: out of the rain. Yeah, a retired policeman who's still

663
00:36:10,320 --> 00:36:13,839
Speaker 2: working cases in a kind of unsavory way.

664
00:36:14,160 --> 00:36:17,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, and then he has a really ignominious end in

665
00:36:17,160 --> 00:36:18,320
Speaker 3: the film.

666
00:36:19,360 --> 00:36:22,319
Speaker 2: We'll explain that later. All right. The director of photography

667
00:36:22,320 --> 00:36:24,080
Speaker 2: on this, because I mean, the look at the picture

668
00:36:24,120 --> 00:36:26,200
Speaker 2: is so great we have to call him out. Edward

669
00:36:26,280 --> 00:36:29,680
Speaker 2: van der Enden who lived nineteen twenty eight through twenty eleven.

670
00:36:29,800 --> 00:36:33,960
Speaker 2: Dutch cinematographer whose other other credits include Lifespan and nineteen

671
00:36:33,960 --> 00:36:38,000
Speaker 2: eighty two's Fake Out. He also worked in some capacity

672
00:36:38,040 --> 00:36:42,359
Speaker 2: on nineteen ninety three's Gettysburg I believe, credited with additional photography.

673
00:36:43,480 --> 00:36:48,000
Speaker 2: Oh and we don't always mention costuming, but Bernard Paris

674
00:36:48,160 --> 00:36:51,359
Speaker 2: is called out, who lived nineteen thirty six through twenty ten.

675
00:36:52,160 --> 00:36:57,200
Speaker 2: His credit is costumer Miss Syrih's gowns. Again, the gowns

676
00:36:57,200 --> 00:37:00,920
Speaker 2: in this picture are amazing, each more style eye catching

677
00:37:00,920 --> 00:37:04,800
Speaker 2: them the last until you were almost literally blinded by them.

678
00:37:04,840 --> 00:37:08,040
Speaker 2: Paris was apparently a notable name in French fashion back

679
00:37:08,040 --> 00:37:11,840
Speaker 2: in the day. And then finally, the music. The music

680
00:37:11,880 --> 00:37:16,120
Speaker 2: here was by composer of Francois de Robai, who lived

681
00:37:16,160 --> 00:37:20,680
Speaker 2: nineteen thirty nine through nineteen seventy five. French musician and composer.

682
00:37:20,800 --> 00:37:23,600
Speaker 2: Really splendid score on this one that is fortunately widely

683
00:37:23,600 --> 00:37:28,680
Speaker 2: available on digital and physical formats, including I learned a

684
00:37:28,800 --> 00:37:32,719
Speaker 2: vinyl edition that came out via Music on Vinyl. They

685
00:37:32,719 --> 00:37:36,120
Speaker 2: put out only six hundred and sixty six copies, so

686
00:37:36,840 --> 00:37:41,000
Speaker 2: you know that's fun. But anyway, it's a bleak, eerie

687
00:37:41,120 --> 00:37:46,719
Speaker 2: score that resonates with like antique European flair, like a

688
00:37:46,760 --> 00:37:50,920
Speaker 2: little bit of folk music, seventies weirdness, elements of jazz

689
00:37:50,960 --> 00:37:54,960
Speaker 2: and synthesizer, just amazing stuff. I was listening to this

690
00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:57,240
Speaker 2: one on its own a bit while working on notes.

691
00:37:57,960 --> 00:38:02,399
Speaker 3: Yeah, a good score and it the music incorporates the

692
00:38:02,400 --> 00:38:04,359
Speaker 3: themes like it sounds like.

693
00:38:06,239 --> 00:38:06,879
Speaker 2: Luxury.

694
00:38:07,040 --> 00:38:10,480
Speaker 3: It sounds like the idol rich and it sounds like danger.

695
00:38:11,040 --> 00:38:14,399
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, but it's like, yeah, it's like the it's

696
00:38:14,480 --> 00:38:18,360
Speaker 2: like the decadence on top, but turning the sludge underneath,

697
00:38:18,440 --> 00:38:21,799
Speaker 2: turning into like melting into unsavory sludge at like the

698
00:38:21,840 --> 00:38:26,200
Speaker 2: base level. Yeah. Yeah, so great work. This guy died

699
00:38:26,239 --> 00:38:29,839
Speaker 2: way too young, but his work is notable for its

700
00:38:29,840 --> 00:38:32,880
Speaker 2: synthesis of jazz, synth and folk elements. And I was

701
00:38:32,920 --> 00:38:35,080
Speaker 2: reading that he's sometimes held up as a forerunner of

702
00:38:35,120 --> 00:38:39,879
Speaker 2: French electronic music. And the score was apparently sampled by

703
00:38:39,880 --> 00:38:44,239
Speaker 2: Lil Wayne on a track called President Carter. I haven't

704
00:38:44,280 --> 00:38:47,839
Speaker 2: listened to any of Lil Wayne's music that I know of,

705
00:38:47,960 --> 00:39:00,400
Speaker 2: but you know, I always appreciate a good sample. All right,

706
00:39:00,400 --> 00:39:02,520
Speaker 2: You ready to talk about the plot? Yeah, let's get

707
00:39:02,520 --> 00:39:02,880
Speaker 2: into it.

708
00:39:03,320 --> 00:39:07,120
Speaker 3: So the action opens on a landscape after sunset, with

709
00:39:07,360 --> 00:39:10,879
Speaker 3: a deep blue twilight sky and a black tree limb

710
00:39:10,960 --> 00:39:13,680
Speaker 3: hanging in the foreground, and we can hear dogs barking

711
00:39:14,040 --> 00:39:16,799
Speaker 3: and a train approaching in the distance, and then the

712
00:39:16,840 --> 00:39:19,960
Speaker 3: train overtakes the camera and it becomes very loud as

713
00:39:19,960 --> 00:39:23,279
Speaker 3: it passes by. We cut inside the train to a

714
00:39:23,320 --> 00:39:27,440
Speaker 3: private passenger compartment where we see close ups of objects

715
00:39:27,520 --> 00:39:31,239
Speaker 3: that set the scene. You've got white flowers with drooping petals,

716
00:39:31,960 --> 00:39:36,200
Speaker 3: cream colored silk sheets, champagne flutes half full and no

717
00:39:36,280 --> 00:39:40,040
Speaker 3: longer bubbling. You got the champagne bottle dunked in a

718
00:39:40,040 --> 00:39:43,399
Speaker 3: silver ice bucket, a white leather purse spathed in red

719
00:39:43,480 --> 00:39:46,120
Speaker 3: light from the window, and then kind of some lace

720
00:39:46,200 --> 00:39:49,360
Speaker 3: garments heaped on the floor, so you get an idea

721
00:39:49,400 --> 00:39:51,880
Speaker 3: of the room. We can hear the train rattling on

722
00:39:51,960 --> 00:39:55,080
Speaker 3: the tracks, and the wine glasses clinking against one another

723
00:39:55,560 --> 00:39:55,879
Speaker 3: on a.

724
00:39:55,880 --> 00:39:59,919
Speaker 2: Table beside the bed. We hear a woman's voice say Sta,

725
00:40:00,920 --> 00:40:04,280
Speaker 2: and a man's voice say Valerie.

726
00:40:04,400 --> 00:40:08,120
Speaker 3: So here are our main characters, Stephan and Valerie. They

727
00:40:08,120 --> 00:40:11,000
Speaker 3: are newlyweds. They're here on their honeymoon. I think about

728
00:40:11,000 --> 00:40:14,240
Speaker 3: three hours after they got married, they say, and they're

729
00:40:14,280 --> 00:40:17,880
Speaker 3: having sex in the dark in their train compartment. And

730
00:40:18,000 --> 00:40:20,400
Speaker 3: I would say a combination of kind of the sharp

731
00:40:20,480 --> 00:40:25,520
Speaker 3: and ominous music and some staging in the sex scene

732
00:40:25,719 --> 00:40:28,600
Speaker 3: immediately makes Stephan maybe come off as a little bit

733
00:40:28,640 --> 00:40:30,640
Speaker 3: aggressive and perhaps dangerous.

734
00:40:31,440 --> 00:40:34,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's kind of a firal, almost loopine quality to

735
00:40:34,640 --> 00:40:35,040
Speaker 2: him here.

736
00:40:35,400 --> 00:40:39,239
Speaker 3: Yeah, now there's some interesting things about the colors in

737
00:40:39,280 --> 00:40:42,680
Speaker 3: the scene, Rob, I don't know if you know what

738
00:40:42,719 --> 00:40:44,440
Speaker 3: I'm talking about. A few times in the movie, I

739
00:40:44,440 --> 00:40:47,440
Speaker 3: would say, especially here in the train car, the air

740
00:40:47,680 --> 00:40:52,560
Speaker 3: somehow feels purple, not smoky. Sometimes air looks purple if

741
00:40:52,600 --> 00:40:55,520
Speaker 3: they're smoking, it doesn't look like there's any smoke. It's

742
00:40:55,560 --> 00:40:59,719
Speaker 3: like the air is thick with purpleness itself, and the

743
00:40:59,719 --> 00:41:03,120
Speaker 3: purple coolness kind of envelops the naked bodies of Stepan

744
00:41:03,200 --> 00:41:04,080
Speaker 3: and Valerie here.

745
00:41:04,680 --> 00:41:06,279
Speaker 2: Yeah, it almost gives it a kind of I don't know,

746
00:41:06,320 --> 00:41:09,040
Speaker 2: it feels more voyeuristic in a way, like I'm somehow

747
00:41:09,120 --> 00:41:12,040
Speaker 2: like seeing things through some sort of a purple limbs,

748
00:41:12,080 --> 00:41:16,120
Speaker 2: you know, I don't know, Like, yeah, it's it's it's

749
00:41:16,120 --> 00:41:18,640
Speaker 2: an interesting color choice for this sequence.

750
00:41:18,920 --> 00:41:20,600
Speaker 3: But at the same time, a lot of the little

751
00:41:20,680 --> 00:41:23,479
Speaker 3: items we see, like on the table beside the bed here,

752
00:41:23,680 --> 00:41:27,200
Speaker 3: have these color themes of white, gold, and pink that

753
00:41:27,239 --> 00:41:29,800
Speaker 3: are kind of associated with Valerie throughout the movie.

754
00:41:30,239 --> 00:41:32,160
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, and I think some of these are, like

755
00:41:32,160 --> 00:41:34,760
Speaker 2: they're flowers and so forth here. Yeah.

756
00:41:35,000 --> 00:41:38,080
Speaker 3: Now, later we see Stephan and Valerie lying in bed,

757
00:41:38,200 --> 00:41:41,759
Speaker 3: half asleep, and their first dialogue exchange apart from saying

758
00:41:41,800 --> 00:41:42,600
Speaker 3: each other's names.

759
00:41:42,640 --> 00:41:43,200
Speaker 2: Goes like this.

760
00:41:43,840 --> 00:41:48,080
Speaker 3: Valerie says, Stephan, tell me, do you love me? And

761
00:41:48,160 --> 00:41:51,400
Speaker 3: he kind of lazily mumbles, don't you know? But she

762
00:41:51,520 --> 00:41:53,840
Speaker 3: pleads with him to say it, and he takes a moment,

763
00:41:53,920 --> 00:41:57,520
Speaker 3: and then he says no. Then he asks her do

764
00:41:57,560 --> 00:42:01,440
Speaker 3: you love me? And she says, in a more playful tone,

765
00:42:01,600 --> 00:42:05,280
Speaker 3: what me? Of course I don't. And then Stephan says,

766
00:42:05,280 --> 00:42:07,480
Speaker 3: that's good, you don't love me. I don't love you.

767
00:42:07,760 --> 00:42:10,960
Speaker 3: We were made for each other. And I think this

768
00:42:11,040 --> 00:42:16,040
Speaker 3: is such an interesting, complex little moment, especially given what

769
00:42:16,080 --> 00:42:19,880
Speaker 3: we learn about the characters as the story progresses, we

770
00:42:19,920 --> 00:42:23,960
Speaker 3: get a little glimpse here of this subsurface drama about

771
00:42:24,080 --> 00:42:28,160
Speaker 3: power and dominance between them. And what I mean by

772
00:42:28,200 --> 00:42:31,919
Speaker 3: that is when she says she doesn't love him, it's

773
00:42:31,960 --> 00:42:34,400
Speaker 3: clear in her voice that she's just joking, like she

774
00:42:34,480 --> 00:42:36,640
Speaker 3: says it in a kind of sing songy voice, like

775
00:42:36,880 --> 00:42:40,600
Speaker 3: she's playing around. But is he only joking when he

776
00:42:40,640 --> 00:42:44,480
Speaker 3: says he doesn't love her? I'm not sure. And Valerie

777
00:42:44,560 --> 00:42:47,200
Speaker 3: does not laugh or even smile when he says no,

778
00:42:47,360 --> 00:42:51,319
Speaker 3: he doesn't love her. Her expression is totally blank. It

779
00:42:51,360 --> 00:42:54,880
Speaker 3: feels to me, especially watching it the second time, like

780
00:42:55,000 --> 00:42:59,600
Speaker 3: he might be denying he loves her. Maybe not because

781
00:42:59,640 --> 00:43:02,440
Speaker 3: he doesn't love her. I'm not sure what it means

782
00:43:02,440 --> 00:43:05,239
Speaker 3: for him to love her, but denying he loves her

783
00:43:05,719 --> 00:43:10,439
Speaker 3: as an expression of subtle sadism hidden behind a mask

784
00:43:10,520 --> 00:43:13,839
Speaker 3: of irony, Like he says it in part to undermine

785
00:43:13,840 --> 00:43:18,560
Speaker 3: her confidence and to make himself feel powerful. But of

786
00:43:18,560 --> 00:43:21,560
Speaker 3: course it's plausible that he's just kidding. She says it back,

787
00:43:21,560 --> 00:43:24,600
Speaker 3: and she's obviously kidding, and he could retreat to that

788
00:43:24,719 --> 00:43:28,560
Speaker 3: explanation if pressed on it. And then this even greater

789
00:43:28,719 --> 00:43:32,839
Speaker 3: feeling of dominance seems to accrue to him because Valerie's

790
00:43:32,840 --> 00:43:36,040
Speaker 3: anxiety forces her to interpret it as a joke and

791
00:43:36,120 --> 00:43:39,320
Speaker 3: respond in kind, like she doesn't have the confidence to

792
00:43:39,400 --> 00:43:41,840
Speaker 3: kind of get serious and press him on what he means.

793
00:43:42,600 --> 00:43:45,000
Speaker 3: And yet this is all while they're in this dreamy,

794
00:43:45,480 --> 00:43:49,399
Speaker 3: half awake, blissful state, very weird mood. And I think

795
00:43:49,480 --> 00:43:52,560
Speaker 3: this is illustrative of the kind of psychological drama that

796
00:43:52,600 --> 00:43:56,240
Speaker 3: continues throughout the movie that you can kind of zero

797
00:43:56,360 --> 00:43:59,880
Speaker 3: in on these little exchanges like this and then in

798
00:44:00,160 --> 00:44:01,520
Speaker 3: up reading a lot into them.

799
00:44:02,080 --> 00:44:04,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, especially on second viewing. This is also I

800
00:44:04,960 --> 00:44:08,080
Speaker 2: went back and rewatched this part of the film as well,

801
00:44:08,520 --> 00:44:11,279
Speaker 2: and yeah, I think at the first time through, I

802
00:44:11,360 --> 00:44:13,239
Speaker 2: was more sort of like, I wasn't sure that this

803
00:44:13,400 --> 00:44:15,480
Speaker 2: was going to be a film where this stuff mattered,

804
00:44:15,920 --> 00:44:20,160
Speaker 2: because the doomed couple on a honeymoon is so much

805
00:44:20,280 --> 00:44:25,279
Speaker 2: a cliche in the horror genre. I wasn't really sure

806
00:44:25,280 --> 00:44:28,560
Speaker 2: that their relationship mattered in a meaningful sense. But it is,

807
00:44:29,520 --> 00:44:31,400
Speaker 2: you know, it is very central to the plot of

808
00:44:31,400 --> 00:44:34,880
Speaker 2: the film. Like it it's not just window dressing for

809
00:44:35,080 --> 00:44:38,200
Speaker 2: the horrors to come, it is. It is interwoven with

810
00:44:38,239 --> 00:44:39,720
Speaker 2: the hors to come. Yeah.

811
00:44:39,800 --> 00:44:44,440
Speaker 3: Yeah, Anyway, the train stops unexpectedly while they're here in

812
00:44:44,480 --> 00:44:48,080
Speaker 3: the compartment, and they haven't gone far. They say they

813
00:44:48,080 --> 00:44:50,520
Speaker 3: are only a few hours from their departure in Switzerland,

814
00:44:50,920 --> 00:44:53,360
Speaker 3: and Stefan gets up to go find out what's happening.

815
00:44:53,520 --> 00:44:53,640
Speaker 2: Now.

816
00:44:53,640 --> 00:44:57,000
Speaker 3: When he flips on the light, we suddenly exit the

817
00:44:57,000 --> 00:44:59,840
Speaker 3: purple twilight world and we come into the world of

818
00:45:00,040 --> 00:45:03,319
Speaker 3: harsh electric light. And when the light comes on, we

819
00:45:03,360 --> 00:45:07,000
Speaker 3: see Valerie physically recoil like when it falls over her,

820
00:45:07,040 --> 00:45:10,880
Speaker 3: which I thought was nice because nobody's a vampire yet.

821
00:45:11,920 --> 00:45:13,719
Speaker 3: But she does she almost kind of hisses. You know,

822
00:45:13,800 --> 00:45:17,680
Speaker 3: she like puts her hand up to shield herself, like ah.

823
00:45:17,719 --> 00:45:21,200
Speaker 3: But Stepan Stephan takes a look outside the train window

824
00:45:21,800 --> 00:45:25,840
Speaker 3: and he sees a flat, muddy field lined with skeletal

825
00:45:25,920 --> 00:45:29,560
Speaker 3: trees and half melted drifts of snow.

826
00:45:29,760 --> 00:45:30,080
Speaker 2: Uh.

827
00:45:30,120 --> 00:45:33,360
Speaker 3: And this might be another good place. We alluded to

828
00:45:33,400 --> 00:45:36,520
Speaker 3: this earlier, but I just want to emphasize again that

829
00:45:36,640 --> 00:45:41,880
Speaker 3: the exterior landscape shots in this movie are generally not beautiful.

830
00:45:42,160 --> 00:45:47,640
Speaker 3: They are bleak, cold, dark, unlovely, drained of color.

831
00:45:48,360 --> 00:45:48,480
Speaker 2: Uh.

832
00:45:48,719 --> 00:45:52,640
Speaker 3: And that's interesting because Daughters of Darkness is not a

833
00:45:52,680 --> 00:45:56,320
Speaker 3: movie unconcerned with beauty. It is highly concerned with beauty,

834
00:45:56,880 --> 00:46:00,160
Speaker 3: but not much with natural beauty. It's like beauty it

835
00:46:00,200 --> 00:46:04,360
Speaker 3: doesn't feel good the way that outdoor settings and landscapes do.

836
00:46:04,960 --> 00:46:07,920
Speaker 3: The beauty in this movie is all things that like

837
00:46:08,080 --> 00:46:11,640
Speaker 3: die and decay. It's all like human bodies, of course,

838
00:46:11,680 --> 00:46:14,680
Speaker 3: you know, they're beautiful people in the movie, but also

839
00:46:15,760 --> 00:46:21,319
Speaker 3: like decadent old world luxury items made by humans, you know,

840
00:46:21,480 --> 00:46:26,600
Speaker 3: fancy clothes and jewelry and furniture and cocktails and expensive

841
00:46:26,640 --> 00:46:30,759
Speaker 3: hotel rooms and lobbies and the outside world or the

842
00:46:30,840 --> 00:46:34,440
Speaker 3: natural world. Here is just a place of darkness and

843
00:46:34,640 --> 00:46:37,520
Speaker 3: cold wind where dead bodies are dumped.

844
00:46:37,960 --> 00:46:39,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

845
00:46:40,320 --> 00:46:43,520
Speaker 3: Anyway, so Stephan he leaves the train the compartment and

846
00:46:43,560 --> 00:46:45,759
Speaker 3: he gets the scoop. He finds out that a train

847
00:46:45,840 --> 00:46:47,680
Speaker 3: has gone off the tracks up ahead and they are

848
00:46:47,680 --> 00:46:50,000
Speaker 3: stuck behind it, and this means they are going to

849
00:46:50,040 --> 00:46:52,240
Speaker 3: miss the boat that they were going to take to England,

850
00:46:52,320 --> 00:46:56,400
Speaker 3: where Stephan's family lives. And the backstory, as we gather

851
00:46:56,719 --> 00:47:01,160
Speaker 3: is that Stephan is the sun of a wealthy aristocratic family.

852
00:47:01,200 --> 00:47:03,680
Speaker 3: I think they're supposed to be Americans but living in

853
00:47:03,719 --> 00:47:08,200
Speaker 3: England there the chilterns of Chilton manor uh and that

854
00:47:08,480 --> 00:47:10,880
Speaker 3: I rob Did you interpret it the same way? That

855
00:47:10,920 --> 00:47:14,759
Speaker 3: Stephan met Valerie while traveling and they had a very

856
00:47:14,800 --> 00:47:17,799
Speaker 3: brief romance and then got married in Switzerland basically right

857
00:47:17,840 --> 00:47:18,520
Speaker 3: after they met.

858
00:47:19,120 --> 00:47:20,879
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's that's what I got here. In a way,

859
00:47:20,920 --> 00:47:22,520
Speaker 2: this is kind of like a sequel to a non

860
00:47:22,560 --> 00:47:24,680
Speaker 2: existent rom com. Yes, that's good.

861
00:47:24,680 --> 00:47:26,719
Speaker 3: Oh, you often don't get to see what happens after

862
00:47:26,760 --> 00:47:29,200
Speaker 3: the wrong, after the meat cute wears off, and then

863
00:47:29,239 --> 00:47:30,840
Speaker 3: you know, you really got to actually get to know

864
00:47:30,880 --> 00:47:31,279
Speaker 3: each other.

865
00:47:31,440 --> 00:47:34,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, when you really start figuring out what each other's

866
00:47:34,160 --> 00:47:36,719
Speaker 2: sense of humor is or isn't, And then the red

867
00:47:36,760 --> 00:47:38,080
Speaker 2: flags become more apparent.

868
00:47:38,680 --> 00:47:41,840
Speaker 3: Now Stephan has promised to take Valerie back to England

869
00:47:41,960 --> 00:47:45,640
Speaker 3: to meet his family, primarily his mother, whom is repeatedly

870
00:47:45,680 --> 00:47:48,440
Speaker 3: mentioned in a kind of ominous tone. But they have

871
00:47:48,560 --> 00:47:51,000
Speaker 3: missed the boat because of the delay on the rail,

872
00:47:51,160 --> 00:47:54,320
Speaker 3: and so Stephan suggests that they stay in a hotel

873
00:47:54,600 --> 00:47:58,080
Speaker 3: in Hostan, which is a coastal city in Belgium, until

874
00:47:58,120 --> 00:48:00,160
Speaker 3: they can catch another boat.

875
00:47:59,640 --> 00:48:03,960
Speaker 2: And the exterior locations that we see in certainly concerning

876
00:48:03,960 --> 00:48:07,279
Speaker 2: the hotel itself is in fact in Austin, and this

877
00:48:07,360 --> 00:48:11,600
Speaker 2: place is a legit cy side vacation destination during summer months.

878
00:48:12,200 --> 00:48:14,640
Speaker 2: The interiors of the hotel that we see, though, are

879
00:48:14,680 --> 00:48:16,600
Speaker 2: the Hotel Astoria in Brussels.

880
00:48:18,000 --> 00:48:22,200
Speaker 3: Now Here on the train, Stephan and Valerie have a conversation.

881
00:48:23,120 --> 00:48:27,240
Speaker 3: It's clear that Stephan has not yet broken the news

882
00:48:27,440 --> 00:48:32,200
Speaker 3: about Valerie to his mother, and there is an understanding

883
00:48:32,360 --> 00:48:35,600
Speaker 3: that his mother would not approve either of the speed

884
00:48:35,640 --> 00:48:41,440
Speaker 3: of their courtship or implicitly of who Valerie is. On

885
00:48:41,600 --> 00:48:43,920
Speaker 3: first watch, I was wondering, It was like, is there

886
00:48:43,960 --> 00:48:48,000
Speaker 3: something unsavory about Valerie? But I don't think so. I

887
00:48:48,040 --> 00:48:51,440
Speaker 3: think the understanding is that Stephan is rich and he's

888
00:48:51,440 --> 00:48:54,319
Speaker 3: supposed to marry some wealthy heiress or something, keep to

889
00:48:54,360 --> 00:48:56,800
Speaker 3: his class, and Valerie is just a regular person.

890
00:48:57,080 --> 00:48:59,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, you get the impression like that he's marrying

891
00:48:59,560 --> 00:49:02,720
Speaker 2: for fun here, and he shouldn't just be marrying based

892
00:49:02,760 --> 00:49:05,480
Speaker 2: on fun or love or something like that. It should

893
00:49:05,480 --> 00:49:07,840
Speaker 2: be some sort of yeah, some sort of proper connection.

894
00:49:08,640 --> 00:49:12,600
Speaker 3: Valerie is uncomfortable that Stefan's mother doesn't know about her.

895
00:49:12,800 --> 00:49:15,720
Speaker 3: She sort of gently presses him to break the news

896
00:49:15,760 --> 00:49:18,680
Speaker 3: to his mother, but Stephan keeps making excuses. You know,

897
00:49:18,719 --> 00:49:20,640
Speaker 3: it's not the right time to call. She has a

898
00:49:20,640 --> 00:49:23,800
Speaker 3: heart condition. The surprise could kill her, and it seems

899
00:49:23,840 --> 00:49:26,400
Speaker 3: like missing the boat to England was a great relief

900
00:49:26,480 --> 00:49:30,239
Speaker 3: to Stefan. Yeah, Valerie says to him, You'll have to

901
00:49:30,280 --> 00:49:33,480
Speaker 3: tell her eventually, and he says in reply, quote every

902
00:49:33,560 --> 00:49:37,200
Speaker 3: year she's been telling me, Stephan, we are different. That

903
00:49:37,400 --> 00:49:40,319
Speaker 3: is God's gift to us. We must never debase it.

904
00:49:41,080 --> 00:49:44,320
Speaker 3: The implication being that Valerie is not worthy of Stefan,

905
00:49:44,400 --> 00:49:47,839
Speaker 3: and she will she will reduce the precious metal within him,

906
00:49:48,040 --> 00:49:51,640
Speaker 3: clipping the silver, so to speak. So at the end

907
00:49:51,680 --> 00:49:55,080
Speaker 3: of the conversation, she asks Stepan if he is truly

908
00:49:55,120 --> 00:49:58,680
Speaker 3: afraid of his mother, and he seems to be genuinely

909
00:49:58,719 --> 00:50:01,560
Speaker 3: a little threatened by the accusation that he is afraid,

910
00:50:01,640 --> 00:50:04,320
Speaker 3: so he promises to call his mother on the telephone.

911
00:50:04,320 --> 00:50:08,000
Speaker 3: When they reach Ostan, the arrival here in the city

912
00:50:08,080 --> 00:50:10,759
Speaker 3: is marked by an establishing shot of the shore. I

913
00:50:10,800 --> 00:50:13,640
Speaker 3: talked about this earlier, but it's horrifyingly bleak. It's an

914
00:50:13,680 --> 00:50:17,040
Speaker 3: off season. The beach is empty, and the water washing

915
00:50:17,120 --> 00:50:20,680
Speaker 3: up on the sand is just gray on gray shadows

916
00:50:20,800 --> 00:50:24,480
Speaker 3: and beige building facades and dark window glass.

917
00:50:25,880 --> 00:50:28,520
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, frequent shots that really drive home this kind

918
00:50:28,560 --> 00:50:32,279
Speaker 2: of like low tide, off season vibe. And yeah, it

919
00:50:32,360 --> 00:50:34,160
Speaker 2: leads us to They show us enough of it, and

920
00:50:34,200 --> 00:50:36,359
Speaker 2: they show it to us frequently enough that we are

921
00:50:36,440 --> 00:50:39,640
Speaker 2: left to ruminate on the meaning of these beautiful, dreary shots,

922
00:50:39,719 --> 00:50:44,880
Speaker 2: you know, like seasonal isolation, seasonal withdrawal of life from

923
00:50:45,040 --> 00:50:46,359
Speaker 2: a region, that sort of thing.

924
00:50:47,680 --> 00:50:51,000
Speaker 3: So they arrive at their seaside luxury hotel, and so

925
00:50:51,080 --> 00:50:53,760
Speaker 3: the hotel is completely empty apart from them, and they

926
00:50:53,920 --> 00:50:56,399
Speaker 3: enter in style. They're kind of dressed like celebrities. He's

927
00:50:56,440 --> 00:50:59,480
Speaker 3: wearing this cool leather trench coat and he has the

928
00:50:59,520 --> 00:51:04,240
Speaker 3: fashion shaggy Hares nineteen seventy one and Valeries, all dressed

929
00:51:04,280 --> 00:51:07,279
Speaker 3: in white with a long coat lined with pale fur,

930
00:51:07,800 --> 00:51:09,920
Speaker 3: and her face is kind of hidden behind big movie

931
00:51:09,920 --> 00:51:13,239
Speaker 3: star sunglasses, and Stephan even picks her up to carry

932
00:51:13,280 --> 00:51:16,440
Speaker 3: her across the threshold into the lobby. This is one

933
00:51:16,440 --> 00:51:18,480
Speaker 3: of those scenes where like, the last time we saw them,

934
00:51:18,560 --> 00:51:20,719
Speaker 3: there was like there was some strain now and now

935
00:51:20,760 --> 00:51:22,920
Speaker 3: they're just like happily coming over the threshold.

936
00:51:23,000 --> 00:51:25,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, they pushed through it somehow, but yeah, they look

937
00:51:25,680 --> 00:51:28,239
Speaker 2: quite fetching here. They're very mad, very fashionable.

938
00:51:28,600 --> 00:51:31,560
Speaker 3: At check in, we meet an interesting character, the hotel

939
00:51:31,600 --> 00:51:35,600
Speaker 3: Concierge Pierre. He is a large, soft spoken man in

940
00:51:35,960 --> 00:51:38,839
Speaker 3: late middle age. I think this is the character the

941
00:51:38,840 --> 00:51:42,040
Speaker 3: director was expecting to be somebody even older, but he's like,

942
00:51:42,080 --> 00:51:42,960
Speaker 3: I will play.

943
00:51:42,760 --> 00:51:44,960
Speaker 2: Gray, and so he does play gray.

944
00:51:45,200 --> 00:51:49,520
Speaker 3: I would say Pierre has an interesting sadness about him,

945
00:51:49,719 --> 00:51:52,399
Speaker 3: almost as if it's kind of connected to his role

946
00:51:52,440 --> 00:51:55,640
Speaker 3: here at the hotel. He sees the careless rich come

947
00:51:55,680 --> 00:51:58,960
Speaker 3: and go every season, year after year, but he's always here,

948
00:51:59,560 --> 00:52:01,719
Speaker 3: and in fact, we learned that he has worked at

949
00:52:01,719 --> 00:52:03,319
Speaker 3: the same hotel since he was a boy.

950
00:52:03,760 --> 00:52:06,359
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, there is an inherent sadness to him. You know,

951
00:52:06,400 --> 00:52:10,160
Speaker 2: it's like he almost he haunts this place totally. Yeah.

952
00:52:10,239 --> 00:52:13,640
Speaker 3: So, while they're checking in, Pierre mentions that the hotel

953
00:52:13,880 --> 00:52:17,719
Speaker 3: is mostly empty. Actually, he says, the quote is it

954
00:52:17,800 --> 00:52:22,200
Speaker 3: is dead due to the season. But Valerie smiles and she,

955
00:52:22,560 --> 00:52:26,080
Speaker 3: in her kind of agreeable way, she says, actually she

956
00:52:26,200 --> 00:52:29,360
Speaker 3: loves the seaside in winter, and Pierre says, Madame is

957
00:52:29,400 --> 00:52:30,000
Speaker 3: quite right.

958
00:52:30,080 --> 00:52:30,800
Speaker 2: It is much.

959
00:52:30,719 --> 00:52:35,480
Speaker 3: Quieter, with probably some amount of back pain. Pierre lifts

960
00:52:35,520 --> 00:52:37,600
Speaker 3: their luggage up and begins to carry it up to

961
00:52:37,640 --> 00:52:39,960
Speaker 3: the room. No so, no bell, hop, no cart. It

962
00:52:40,040 --> 00:52:42,640
Speaker 3: is all raw Pierre muscle at this hotel. He's got

963
00:52:42,680 --> 00:52:43,880
Speaker 3: like five suitcases.

964
00:52:44,239 --> 00:52:47,879
Speaker 2: Yeah, and we see the stairs right there. I mean, yeah,

965
00:52:48,520 --> 00:52:51,680
Speaker 2: this location is tremendous and this stairway is very dramatic,

966
00:52:52,239 --> 00:52:55,239
Speaker 2: at least if you're fashionably walking down those stairs and

967
00:52:55,280 --> 00:52:58,080
Speaker 2: not lugging all of this luggage up those stairs. I

968
00:52:58,080 --> 00:53:00,680
Speaker 2: don't think there's an elevator in this hotel, or is there.

969
00:53:00,920 --> 00:53:02,000
Speaker 2: I don't know. We don't see it.

970
00:53:02,040 --> 00:53:05,480
Speaker 3: Do Anyway, While Pierre has taken the bags up a

971
00:53:05,560 --> 00:53:08,759
Speaker 3: Valerie reminds Stephan that he promised to phone his mother

972
00:53:08,840 --> 00:53:12,440
Speaker 3: when they arrived. Stephan first tries to make an excuse,

973
00:53:12,520 --> 00:53:15,640
Speaker 3: but then he reluctantly agrees. So he chases down Pierre,

974
00:53:15,680 --> 00:53:17,920
Speaker 3: who's in the middle of going up the staircase with

975
00:53:18,000 --> 00:53:20,480
Speaker 3: the bags, and he interrupts him while he's holding all

976
00:53:20,520 --> 00:53:24,280
Speaker 3: of this weight. And here's Stefan pulls a trick. He writes,

977
00:53:24,719 --> 00:53:27,040
Speaker 3: he writes on a piece of paper and hands it

978
00:53:27,080 --> 00:53:29,120
Speaker 3: to Pierre, and he asks him to call this number

979
00:53:29,160 --> 00:53:31,440
Speaker 3: and put him through at the room. But the slip

980
00:53:31,480 --> 00:53:33,920
Speaker 3: of paper, we can see it, and it actually says

981
00:53:34,160 --> 00:53:37,000
Speaker 3: say there is no reply, and he hands Pierre some

982
00:53:37,080 --> 00:53:39,600
Speaker 3: money with it. So there are kind of two levels

983
00:53:39,600 --> 00:53:42,560
Speaker 3: of drama here, Like the main one is between Stefan,

984
00:53:42,960 --> 00:53:46,840
Speaker 3: Stephan and Valerie. We're seeing Stefan pull a trick to

985
00:53:47,040 --> 00:53:49,480
Speaker 3: deceive the woman he just got married to, and wonder

986
00:53:49,560 --> 00:53:51,759
Speaker 3: We're wondering why is he lying? What's going to happen

987
00:53:51,800 --> 00:53:54,680
Speaker 3: if Valerie finds out? But the second level of drama

988
00:53:54,719 --> 00:53:57,359
Speaker 3: is more subtle. It's that you've got this creaky old

989
00:53:57,440 --> 00:54:01,200
Speaker 3: concierge carrying like five suitcases at once. He's going up

990
00:54:01,239 --> 00:54:03,799
Speaker 3: the stairs for the millionth time in his life, and

991
00:54:03,880 --> 00:54:07,800
Speaker 3: the young strong Stefan is just carelessly making him stop

992
00:54:07,840 --> 00:54:11,400
Speaker 3: in the middle of this climb holding his bags to

993
00:54:12,040 --> 00:54:14,720
Speaker 3: enlist him against his will in a plot to deceive

994
00:54:14,760 --> 00:54:15,280
Speaker 3: his wife.

995
00:54:15,640 --> 00:54:16,200
Speaker 2: Yeah.

996
00:54:16,280 --> 00:54:18,960
Speaker 3: There, this was many years before The White Lotus. But

997
00:54:19,000 --> 00:54:22,919
Speaker 3: I feel some thematic kinship here. Yeah, that that sort

998
00:54:22,920 --> 00:54:26,040
Speaker 3: of theme I guess is more certain top level or

999
00:54:26,040 --> 00:54:28,920
Speaker 3: primary in White Lotus. Kind of a subtext here, But

1000
00:54:29,200 --> 00:54:31,080
Speaker 3: I don't know. I was getting some overlap.

1001
00:54:31,280 --> 00:54:32,279
Speaker 2: No, no, that's a good call.

1002
00:54:32,880 --> 00:54:36,080
Speaker 3: In their room, Stefan gets the call and he feigns surprised.

1003
00:54:36,080 --> 00:54:38,680
Speaker 3: What do you mean you can't connect? Well, keep trying.

1004
00:54:38,760 --> 00:54:41,560
Speaker 3: He orders Pierre to keep it up. And then later

1005
00:54:41,680 --> 00:54:45,600
Speaker 3: we see Valerie and Stephan having supper in an otherwise deserted,

1006
00:54:45,680 --> 00:54:49,200
Speaker 3: white tablecloth dining room. And despite the luxury, I'm sure

1007
00:54:49,200 --> 00:54:51,920
Speaker 3: this is supposed to be like a Michelin Star kitchen,

1008
00:54:52,280 --> 00:54:54,440
Speaker 3: something is just rather cursed in this room.

1009
00:54:54,560 --> 00:54:57,879
Speaker 2: I would hate to be in this room. It's awful. Now,

1010
00:54:57,920 --> 00:55:01,520
Speaker 2: this dining room, I believe is one off, if not

1011
00:55:01,640 --> 00:55:04,759
Speaker 2: the only interior location that is at the hotel. And

1012
00:55:04,800 --> 00:55:08,120
Speaker 2: I'll stend Oh, okay, so but it I mean it

1013
00:55:08,120 --> 00:55:12,400
Speaker 2: has a beautiful windows, but uh yeah, it is very depopulated,

1014
00:55:12,520 --> 00:55:15,319
Speaker 2: and so there is an inherent kind of sadness to it.

1015
00:55:15,600 --> 00:55:18,239
Speaker 3: Maybe that's it's just that it's empty, and I don't know.

1016
00:55:18,360 --> 00:55:21,880
Speaker 3: Something about the the emptiness and the combination of colors

1017
00:55:21,920 --> 00:55:22,920
Speaker 3: and the lighting.

1018
00:55:23,440 --> 00:55:25,879
Speaker 2: I don't know. It's like they've come to stay at

1019
00:55:25,880 --> 00:55:30,200
Speaker 2: the Overlook Hotel during the office. Yes, yeah, yeah, you know.

1020
00:55:30,480 --> 00:55:34,719
Speaker 3: Food somehow never looks good in European movies from the seventies.

1021
00:55:34,760 --> 00:55:37,120
Speaker 3: I don't know exactly why this is, no matter how

1022
00:55:37,160 --> 00:55:41,040
Speaker 3: good it must have looked in real life. This film

1023
00:55:41,080 --> 00:55:44,280
Speaker 3: grain or something just makes it look like wretched mush.

1024
00:55:44,640 --> 00:55:47,480
Speaker 3: And there is a scene later where Valerie is she's

1025
00:55:47,520 --> 00:55:49,800
Speaker 3: cutting up a roll or a bun of some kind

1026
00:55:49,880 --> 00:55:53,440
Speaker 3: in bed, and I despise this bun. It looks hard

1027
00:55:53,600 --> 00:55:56,480
Speaker 3: and dense and awful, just some kind of disgusting like

1028
00:55:56,600 --> 00:55:58,640
Speaker 3: pretzel brick as big as a fist.

1029
00:55:58,880 --> 00:56:00,719
Speaker 2: Yeah. I could never really make out what they're eating.

1030
00:56:00,719 --> 00:56:03,239
Speaker 2: Even in this scene. It's like they're in tearing into

1031
00:56:03,239 --> 00:56:06,680
Speaker 2: a fish and I'm not sure if it's breakfast or dinner.

1032
00:56:06,719 --> 00:56:09,120
Speaker 2: And then the scene in bed, I feel like a

1033
00:56:09,160 --> 00:56:10,960
Speaker 2: bowl of shrimp and I was like, are they having

1034
00:56:11,000 --> 00:56:13,479
Speaker 2: shrimp for breakfast? I don't know what's going on here.

1035
00:56:13,560 --> 00:56:18,200
Speaker 2: We definitely see some gray lobsters later. It's just it

1036
00:56:18,200 --> 00:56:18,919
Speaker 2: doesn't look good.

1037
00:56:19,560 --> 00:56:22,359
Speaker 3: But yeah, the foods, the foods on the platters are

1038
00:56:22,440 --> 00:56:25,759
Speaker 3: nicely covered by these crystal domes. I'm sure that keeps

1039
00:56:25,760 --> 00:56:26,680
Speaker 3: it real nice and warm.

1040
00:56:26,880 --> 00:56:28,560
Speaker 2: Remember that. Oh.

1041
00:56:28,600 --> 00:56:31,800
Speaker 3: Also at the dinner scene, more questions about Chilton man or.

1042
00:56:31,880 --> 00:56:34,319
Speaker 3: Valeriees like, don't you think it's odd that no one's

1043
00:56:34,400 --> 00:56:37,560
Speaker 3: answering the phone at your house? And he's like, taste

1044
00:56:37,680 --> 00:56:38,520
Speaker 3: my gray fish.

1045
00:56:38,680 --> 00:56:41,359
Speaker 2: You know, he holds the fish up, and he's living

1046
00:56:41,400 --> 00:56:44,280
Speaker 2: in the moment in like the least healthy way possible

1047
00:56:44,680 --> 00:56:45,239
Speaker 2: this whole time.

1048
00:56:45,600 --> 00:56:48,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, so Stephan says, I don't see why you make

1049
00:56:48,680 --> 00:56:51,680
Speaker 3: such a fuss about my mother's opinion. The fact is

1050
00:56:51,920 --> 00:56:56,120
Speaker 3: she already hates you without knowing you exist. And eventually

1051
00:56:56,200 --> 00:56:58,120
Speaker 3: Valerie gets him to promise that he's going to go

1052
00:56:58,239 --> 00:57:01,200
Speaker 3: ahead of her to England to prepare his mother to

1053
00:57:01,200 --> 00:57:04,200
Speaker 3: meet her, and he's going to leave tomorrow or maybe

1054
00:57:04,200 --> 00:57:06,719
Speaker 3: the day after or maybe the day after that.

1055
00:57:07,239 --> 00:57:10,600
Speaker 2: But soon also sounds problematic, sounds a little bit like

1056
00:57:10,719 --> 00:57:11,759
Speaker 2: I'm going to leave you.

1057
00:57:12,120 --> 00:57:15,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, but of course into their life. A storm is

1058
00:57:15,840 --> 00:57:18,520
Speaker 3: about to blow, because here we get to the arrival

1059
00:57:18,720 --> 00:57:23,760
Speaker 3: of Countess Bathory. She arrives at speed, driven in this

1060
00:57:23,840 --> 00:57:27,000
Speaker 3: old fashioned European luxury sedan rob I don't know if

1061
00:57:27,000 --> 00:57:28,720
Speaker 3: you know anything about cars or what kind of car

1062
00:57:28,800 --> 00:57:30,760
Speaker 3: this is, but it seems like a kind of fancy,

1063
00:57:30,880 --> 00:57:34,000
Speaker 3: old old style car, like it's from a different age.

1064
00:57:34,200 --> 00:57:35,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, it looks sporty.

1065
00:57:35,440 --> 00:57:38,840
Speaker 3: It's being driven by a young woman named Ilona, whom

1066
00:57:39,360 --> 00:57:43,680
Speaker 3: the Countess calls her assistant or secretary. We first see

1067
00:57:43,720 --> 00:57:46,040
Speaker 3: the Countess as a dark silhouette in the car, and

1068
00:57:46,080 --> 00:57:49,840
Speaker 3: then as she's getting out, we see just these gleaming

1069
00:57:50,000 --> 00:57:53,920
Speaker 3: strips of polished black leather. That's her tall boots, and

1070
00:57:53,960 --> 00:57:56,120
Speaker 3: she's climbing out of the car one leg at a time.

1071
00:57:56,440 --> 00:57:59,360
Speaker 3: We pan up across her body. She's dressed mostly in

1072
00:57:59,440 --> 00:58:03,200
Speaker 3: black with furs leather, I think some feathers in there too,

1073
00:58:03,840 --> 00:58:06,160
Speaker 3: And then when we get to her face, we don't

1074
00:58:06,160 --> 00:58:10,840
Speaker 3: see her eyes at all. It's just pale skin and

1075
00:58:10,960 --> 00:58:14,360
Speaker 3: cherry red lips behind a black mesh veil, and it's

1076
00:58:14,560 --> 00:58:17,000
Speaker 3: just a mouth. The top half of her face is

1077
00:58:17,240 --> 00:58:19,680
Speaker 3: hidden in shadow. There's just the red mouth.

1078
00:58:20,480 --> 00:58:23,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, what a presentation. I think. Towards the end of

1079
00:58:23,040 --> 00:58:25,240
Speaker 2: this shot we see like the glistening of her eyes

1080
00:58:25,280 --> 00:58:31,200
Speaker 2: and they almost look black. Yeah, both the filmmakers and

1081
00:58:31,400 --> 00:58:35,920
Speaker 2: sarag here apparently took inspiration like direct homage to German

1082
00:58:35,960 --> 00:58:40,320
Speaker 2: and American actress and icon Marlene Dietrich. So that's, you know,

1083
00:58:40,720 --> 00:58:45,320
Speaker 2: interwoven throughout the picture, you know, very overt shades of

1084
00:58:45,360 --> 00:58:46,360
Speaker 2: Marlene Dietrich. Here.

1085
00:58:47,360 --> 00:58:50,480
Speaker 3: Elona is also, by the way, pale and dressed in black,

1086
00:58:50,720 --> 00:58:53,760
Speaker 3: but with an energy of perpetual anxiety. She's got a

1087
00:58:53,880 --> 00:58:58,120
Speaker 3: kind of learned helplessness. And the first thing she says

1088
00:58:58,160 --> 00:59:01,160
Speaker 3: is something kind of desperate about how she hopes this

1089
00:59:01,240 --> 00:59:04,680
Speaker 3: place will prove acceptable so they can stop traveling, And

1090
00:59:04,720 --> 00:59:09,000
Speaker 3: the Countess is exactly the opposite. She just oozes confidence

1091
00:59:09,080 --> 00:59:12,920
Speaker 3: and domination. She tells Ilona to unpack their luggage and

1092
00:59:12,960 --> 00:59:16,560
Speaker 3: she goes inside, and then once she's inside the hotel,

1093
00:59:16,600 --> 00:59:18,600
Speaker 3: we really get a good look at her where she's

1094
00:59:18,600 --> 00:59:23,320
Speaker 3: like hidden behind this meshure veil, and she she looks

1095
00:59:23,440 --> 00:59:27,280
Speaker 3: at people with this little smile like she could just

1096
00:59:27,440 --> 00:59:30,880
Speaker 3: like disassemble them and like make make furniture out of

1097
00:59:30,920 --> 00:59:31,680
Speaker 3: their organs.

1098
00:59:33,600 --> 00:59:36,880
Speaker 2: It is just such a like a pitch perfect you know,

1099
00:59:37,240 --> 00:59:40,640
Speaker 2: iconic fem fatale presentation. Here, I mean the look, but

1100
00:59:40,720 --> 00:59:46,440
Speaker 2: also her performance of this character is just so pitch perfect. Yeah.

1101
00:59:46,480 --> 00:59:49,320
Speaker 3: So she meets Pierre, the concierge, and asks him for

1102
00:59:49,400 --> 00:59:52,040
Speaker 3: the royal suite. It's the best, the best suite in

1103
00:59:52,080 --> 00:59:55,680
Speaker 3: the place. Unfortunately he has already rented it out to

1104
00:59:55,720 --> 00:59:58,040
Speaker 3: the only other couple in the hotel, pointing them out

1105
00:59:58,080 --> 01:00:01,200
Speaker 3: in the dining room. And when the Countess looks in

1106
01:00:01,280 --> 01:00:05,080
Speaker 3: through the glass at Stefan and Valerie, uh, they're well,

1107
01:00:05,080 --> 01:00:08,560
Speaker 3: they're I think they're biting pieces of fruit. If that's

1108
01:00:08,760 --> 01:00:10,440
Speaker 3: some Garden of Eden imagery or not.

1109
01:00:10,880 --> 01:00:13,560
Speaker 2: He has a green apple, yes, yes, uh.

1110
01:00:13,760 --> 01:00:17,120
Speaker 3: But the Countess's eyes like turn into laser beams, like

1111
01:00:17,200 --> 01:00:20,480
Speaker 3: she sees what she wants. But is it Valerie or

1112
01:00:20,520 --> 01:00:23,760
Speaker 3: is it Stefan. Well we'll have to learn later. But

1113
01:00:23,840 --> 01:00:27,000
Speaker 3: the Countess says to Pierre like, oh, no matter that

1114
01:00:27,040 --> 01:00:28,600
Speaker 3: I can't have the royal suite, I just want the

1115
01:00:28,600 --> 01:00:31,640
Speaker 3: suite adjoining theirs. And I have to say that is

1116
01:00:31,760 --> 01:00:32,640
Speaker 3: bad manners.

1117
01:00:34,600 --> 01:00:36,480
Speaker 2: But as we're about to learn, she gets what she

1118
01:00:36,560 --> 01:00:38,320
Speaker 2: wants here. That is true.

1119
01:00:38,360 --> 01:00:40,880
Speaker 3: I think there's similar rules about like bathroom stalls and

1120
01:00:41,000 --> 01:00:43,800
Speaker 3: urinals and stuff like, you don't if there are a

1121
01:00:43,800 --> 01:00:45,600
Speaker 3: bunch of empty ones, you don't go to the one

1122
01:00:45,680 --> 01:00:47,040
Speaker 3: right next to the occupied one.

1123
01:00:47,120 --> 01:00:49,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, we can space things out a little bit sweet

1124
01:00:49,120 --> 01:00:51,080
Speaker 2: wise in this place. Yeah.

1125
01:00:51,120 --> 01:00:55,200
Speaker 3: Also, Pierre is shaken in this scene. He because he

1126
01:00:55,320 --> 01:00:58,760
Speaker 3: says he remembers the Countess. He says he's seen her before.

1127
01:00:59,760 --> 01:01:02,760
Speaker 3: She stayed at the hotel once many years ago when

1128
01:01:02,840 --> 01:01:05,320
Speaker 3: he was a boy. But that doesn't make any sense

1129
01:01:05,400 --> 01:01:08,160
Speaker 3: because he was a boy then and now he is old,

1130
01:01:08,280 --> 01:01:10,600
Speaker 3: and she looks the same as she did when he

1131
01:01:10,640 --> 01:01:11,320
Speaker 3: first saw her.

1132
01:01:12,200 --> 01:01:13,280
Speaker 2: But she is unmoved.

1133
01:01:13,320 --> 01:01:16,880
Speaker 3: She says, my mother, Perhaps Pierre is freaked out.

1134
01:01:17,320 --> 01:01:20,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I thought it was a very convincing free cap,

1135
01:01:20,080 --> 01:01:24,160
Speaker 2: Like there's a he seems to be not only confronting

1136
01:01:24,200 --> 01:01:26,960
Speaker 2: the supernatural in this, but confronting his own mortality, you know,

1137
01:01:27,080 --> 01:01:30,520
Speaker 2: Like it's really I mean, he's really shaken here. Yeah.

1138
01:01:30,600 --> 01:01:33,240
Speaker 3: Now, later, Ilona comes in with their bags and the

1139
01:01:33,280 --> 01:01:35,800
Speaker 3: Countess points out the couple to hers. She says, look

1140
01:01:35,840 --> 01:01:39,320
Speaker 3: how perfect they are. And then Valerie looks up and

1141
01:01:39,360 --> 01:01:42,160
Speaker 3: catches the two creeps just staring straight at her.

1142
01:01:43,000 --> 01:01:44,760
Speaker 2: But later that night, Valerie.

1143
01:01:44,440 --> 01:01:47,120
Speaker 3: And Stephan talked to Pierre. They learned the countess's name.

1144
01:01:47,200 --> 01:01:51,160
Speaker 3: Why it is the Countess Elizabeth Battori, and Stefan seems

1145
01:01:51,200 --> 01:01:54,600
Speaker 3: to make something of this. Now we do get a

1146
01:01:54,640 --> 01:01:57,760
Speaker 3: scene of the Countess and Elona together in their room.

1147
01:01:57,920 --> 01:02:01,960
Speaker 3: Elona is staring at the window and Valerie is. They're

1148
01:02:02,000 --> 01:02:05,040
Speaker 3: actually outside walking on the beach in the dark down below,

1149
01:02:05,760 --> 01:02:09,040
Speaker 3: and Elona says she can't wait another day. She is

1150
01:02:09,080 --> 01:02:12,040
Speaker 3: in need right now, in need for what. I think

1151
01:02:12,040 --> 01:02:15,480
Speaker 3: we're going to assume blood, But the Countess says no,

1152
01:02:15,720 --> 01:02:18,440
Speaker 3: they will wait, and then she keeps talking about how

1153
01:02:18,480 --> 01:02:22,080
Speaker 3: perfect Valerie is. She's maybe not interested in Stepan quite

1154
01:02:22,120 --> 01:02:27,720
Speaker 3: as much as Valerie, and Elona is jealous and again

1155
01:02:27,880 --> 01:02:31,440
Speaker 3: mirroring the kind of the flashes of sadism we saw

1156
01:02:31,560 --> 01:02:35,760
Speaker 3: in Stephan earlier, with like enjoying the situations of power

1157
01:02:35,840 --> 01:02:40,560
Speaker 3: he could create over Valerie, there seems to be something

1158
01:02:40,600 --> 01:02:42,880
Speaker 3: similar going on with the Countess here. I detect that

1159
01:02:42,920 --> 01:02:46,920
Speaker 3: the Countess is taking pleasure in Elona's jealousy, that's like

1160
01:02:47,040 --> 01:02:50,440
Speaker 3: making her happy. And then Elona says, I wish I

1161
01:02:50,440 --> 01:02:53,840
Speaker 3: could die, and the Countess just replied does not address

1162
01:02:53,920 --> 01:02:56,720
Speaker 3: this and just says the light. The light hurts my eyes.

1163
01:02:57,280 --> 01:03:00,480
Speaker 3: So Elona takes her off her red scarf from her

1164
01:03:00,520 --> 01:03:03,400
Speaker 3: neck and droops it over the lamp, tinting the room red.

1165
01:03:04,240 --> 01:03:04,760
Speaker 2: Beautiful.

1166
01:03:05,400 --> 01:03:09,680
Speaker 3: So there are curious emerging symmetries in these two relationships.

1167
01:03:10,200 --> 01:03:15,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely neat, But both are very unhealthy relationships and

1168
01:03:15,160 --> 01:03:27,080
Speaker 2: in very similar mirroring ways. Absolutely so.

1169
01:03:27,280 --> 01:03:29,280
Speaker 3: I was thinking, maybe this is a good place. This

1170
01:03:29,320 --> 01:03:32,000
Speaker 3: is sort of the end of act one here, Maybe

1171
01:03:32,000 --> 01:03:34,600
Speaker 3: this is a good place to break and now recount

1172
01:03:34,640 --> 01:03:37,720
Speaker 3: things in a little bit less chronological scene by seeing

1173
01:03:37,760 --> 01:03:41,000
Speaker 3: detail and instead give a broader summary of the rest

1174
01:03:41,000 --> 01:03:43,520
Speaker 3: of the plot, and then maybe we can come back

1175
01:03:43,600 --> 01:03:46,120
Speaker 3: and talk about individual scenes that stand out.

1176
01:03:46,480 --> 01:03:48,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely so.

1177
01:03:48,160 --> 01:03:51,560
Speaker 3: From here, while Valerie and Stephan continue their stay at

1178
01:03:51,560 --> 01:03:56,680
Speaker 3: the hotel, the Countess and Ilona insinuate themselves into Valerie

1179
01:03:56,720 --> 01:03:59,760
Speaker 3: and Stephan's lives. There's a scene where they have a

1180
01:03:59,800 --> 01:04:02,640
Speaker 3: long conversation in the hotel lobby that we can come

1181
01:04:02,680 --> 01:04:06,040
Speaker 3: back and revisit. But they talk while enjoying some bizarre

1182
01:04:06,040 --> 01:04:09,840
Speaker 3: looking cocktails, some green stuff, and I don't know what

1183
01:04:09,880 --> 01:04:13,040
Speaker 3: all this is, but the Countess explains that she is

1184
01:04:13,040 --> 01:04:16,960
Speaker 3: the descendant of the Blood Countess Ershabette Battori of the

1185
01:04:17,040 --> 01:04:20,240
Speaker 3: sixteenth century. I think I was saying that right Erzhabet,

1186
01:04:20,360 --> 01:04:23,120
Speaker 3: meaning the same as Elizabeth, just happens to have the

1187
01:04:23,160 --> 01:04:26,440
Speaker 3: exact same name as her descendant here, who is famous

1188
01:04:26,480 --> 01:04:30,000
Speaker 3: for kidnapping and murdering young girls in a bizarre ritual

1189
01:04:30,080 --> 01:04:33,920
Speaker 3: that involved torture, mutilation, and bathing in her victim's blood.

1190
01:04:34,720 --> 01:04:40,000
Speaker 3: Valerie is more than a little distressed that Stefan is

1191
01:04:40,160 --> 01:04:44,440
Speaker 3: visibly sexually excited by this conversation about murder and mutilation,

1192
01:04:45,080 --> 01:04:47,800
Speaker 3: and then also that he and the Countess start, I

1193
01:04:47,800 --> 01:04:49,960
Speaker 3: don't know what they're doing, some kind of like murder

1194
01:04:50,040 --> 01:04:52,720
Speaker 3: lore foreplay right in front of everybody in the middle

1195
01:04:52,720 --> 01:04:53,880
Speaker 3: of the lobby in.

1196
01:04:53,800 --> 01:04:59,000
Speaker 2: A very like, physically believable and yet outrageous way. The

1197
01:04:59,040 --> 01:05:02,680
Speaker 2: Countess is basic like, let me touch your nipples whilst

1198
01:05:02,680 --> 01:05:06,080
Speaker 2: I tell you about the many crimes of my ancestor

1199
01:05:06,200 --> 01:05:07,280
Speaker 2: aka myself.

1200
01:05:07,560 --> 01:05:11,200
Speaker 3: Yes, and Stephan is like he is having an out

1201
01:05:11,200 --> 01:05:12,320
Speaker 3: of body experience.

1202
01:05:12,560 --> 01:05:17,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, and Valerie is understandably creeped out by Yeah.

1203
01:05:17,320 --> 01:05:21,040
Speaker 3: So after this, Valerie convinces Stepan to call his mother

1204
01:05:21,080 --> 01:05:23,280
Speaker 3: on the phone for real, but the call does not

1205
01:05:23,520 --> 01:05:26,080
Speaker 3: go very well, and there is a big twist, a

1206
01:05:26,120 --> 01:05:30,280
Speaker 3: big revelation here. The person that Stepan calls is in

1207
01:05:30,320 --> 01:05:34,360
Speaker 3: fact an older man lounging in this lavish conservatory in

1208
01:05:34,680 --> 01:05:37,960
Speaker 3: Chilton manner as this place filled with plants, who kind

1209
01:05:37,960 --> 01:05:40,480
Speaker 3: of reacts with a raised eyebrow at the news that

1210
01:05:40,520 --> 01:05:43,400
Speaker 3: Stefan is married and sort of mocks him for it.

1211
01:05:44,080 --> 01:05:46,400
Speaker 3: I believe a lot has been made of this scene

1212
01:05:46,400 --> 01:05:49,080
Speaker 3: with the phone call, and there are questions about how

1213
01:05:49,120 --> 01:05:51,560
Speaker 3: to interpret it. Robert, I wonder if you read it

1214
01:05:51,600 --> 01:05:53,200
Speaker 3: the same way I did. Did you take it that

1215
01:05:53,320 --> 01:05:58,120
Speaker 3: this character is actually not supposed to be Stephan's parent

1216
01:05:58,240 --> 01:06:00,960
Speaker 3: in any way, but is being called mother, but is

1217
01:06:01,000 --> 01:06:04,760
Speaker 3: actually Stefan's former lover and financial benefactor.

1218
01:06:05,400 --> 01:06:08,880
Speaker 2: Yes, I believe that's the interpretation that most have made,

1219
01:06:08,880 --> 01:06:12,280
Speaker 2: and that's that's what I read to hear. It's just

1220
01:06:12,440 --> 01:06:15,600
Speaker 2: one scene and the character that we don't even know

1221
01:06:15,600 --> 01:06:18,800
Speaker 2: what this character's actual name is. The code named mother

1222
01:06:19,400 --> 01:06:23,880
Speaker 2: is played by the male actor Fonz Rademachers, who lived

1223
01:06:23,920 --> 01:06:26,760
Speaker 2: nineteen twenty through two thousand and seven, notable Dutch actor

1224
01:06:26,800 --> 01:06:30,160
Speaker 2: and director. As an actor, his other credits include nineteen

1225
01:06:30,160 --> 01:06:33,880
Speaker 2: seventy five lifespan with Kloskinsky, which I think I referenced earlier,

1226
01:06:34,320 --> 01:06:37,200
Speaker 2: and as a director, his most notable achievement was nineteen

1227
01:06:37,200 --> 01:06:39,800
Speaker 2: eighty six Is the Assault, which won an Oscar for

1228
01:06:39,880 --> 01:06:43,520
Speaker 2: Best Foreign Language Film. His performance is quite interesting, not

1229
01:06:43,680 --> 01:06:46,720
Speaker 2: only because of this twist, but because even though I

1230
01:06:46,760 --> 01:06:49,160
Speaker 2: think there's supposed to be nothing at all supernatural about

1231
01:06:49,160 --> 01:06:53,880
Speaker 2: this character, he also kind of has vampire energy. Yes, absolutely,

1232
01:06:54,800 --> 01:06:57,680
Speaker 2: I believe it was. Yeah. I was reading about this

1233
01:06:58,600 --> 01:07:01,240
Speaker 2: in the book V for Vampire by David J. Skall,

1234
01:07:01,720 --> 01:07:05,560
Speaker 2: and he describes this character as an androgynist amalgam of

1235
01:07:05,600 --> 01:07:09,160
Speaker 2: Oscar Wilde and Bella Lagosi. Yeah, I'd say that's about right.

1236
01:07:09,480 --> 01:07:11,880
Speaker 2: Though to be clear, this character is not and is

1237
01:07:11,920 --> 01:07:15,840
Speaker 2: not implied to be a vampire right right. Interestingly, this

1238
01:07:15,840 --> 01:07:20,680
Speaker 2: this whole scene with the reveal of who Mother is

1239
01:07:20,680 --> 01:07:23,080
Speaker 2: is you know, it's just a phone call. This character

1240
01:07:23,120 --> 01:07:26,440
Speaker 2: shares no actual physical scenes with any other actor in

1241
01:07:26,480 --> 01:07:30,440
Speaker 2: the film, and John Carlin has has pointed out that

1242
01:07:30,440 --> 01:07:35,919
Speaker 2: that the director intentionally didn't want him to know the

1243
01:07:35,960 --> 01:07:40,080
Speaker 2: identity of Mother and kept it from him, but one

1244
01:07:40,120 --> 01:07:43,000
Speaker 2: of the producers got in touch with Carlin and told

1245
01:07:43,080 --> 01:07:45,400
Speaker 2: him because he's like you know, because like, hey, you're

1246
01:07:45,400 --> 01:07:48,000
Speaker 2: an actor, you need to know like your actual role.

1247
01:07:48,720 --> 01:07:50,440
Speaker 2: But also he's like he didn't want it there to

1248
01:07:50,480 --> 01:07:52,760
Speaker 2: be any like any like weird feelings, like after the

1249
01:07:52,760 --> 01:07:54,760
Speaker 2: fact of the movie comes out and then and then

1250
01:07:54,760 --> 01:07:58,440
Speaker 2: he finds out the twist. So he actually played this

1251
01:07:58,560 --> 01:07:59,960
Speaker 2: scene knowing what the twist was.

1252
01:08:00,680 --> 01:08:05,600
Speaker 3: Oh okay, Well, so I think this scene is very

1253
01:08:05,640 --> 01:08:08,320
Speaker 3: open to interpretation and there are a lot of unanswered

1254
01:08:08,400 --> 01:08:10,400
Speaker 3: questions about it. Maybe we can address that a little

1255
01:08:10,440 --> 01:08:14,160
Speaker 3: bit more in a few minutes, but it's clear that

1256
01:08:14,360 --> 01:08:18,520
Speaker 3: it does. It's a source of kind of like unresolved

1257
01:08:18,560 --> 01:08:22,400
Speaker 3: anxiety and pain for the character of Stepan, like that

1258
01:08:22,640 --> 01:08:25,760
Speaker 3: he is he is not happy with this conversation.

1259
01:08:26,439 --> 01:08:29,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, you'd definitely get the feeling that everything that he

1260
01:08:29,800 --> 01:08:34,640
Speaker 2: is doing right now is in response to problems with

1261
01:08:34,720 --> 01:08:38,920
Speaker 2: his relationship with this individual, with the person we're referring

1262
01:08:38,960 --> 01:08:39,519
Speaker 2: to his mother.

1263
01:08:40,080 --> 01:08:44,479
Speaker 3: And but Stephan he does not deal with this pain well. Instead,

1264
01:08:44,560 --> 01:08:47,680
Speaker 3: he has some kind of emotional episode which turns into

1265
01:08:47,840 --> 01:08:51,519
Speaker 3: rage and then violence directed toward Valerie, and he beats

1266
01:08:51,600 --> 01:08:54,800
Speaker 3: and rapes her. The rape happens off screen, but it's

1267
01:08:55,000 --> 01:08:59,160
Speaker 3: he turns violent toward her after the scene, Valerie wakes

1268
01:08:59,240 --> 01:09:02,400
Speaker 3: up while steph And is still sleeping and tries to

1269
01:09:02,479 --> 01:09:06,000
Speaker 3: leave town by herself to escape the situation, but the

1270
01:09:06,040 --> 01:09:10,360
Speaker 3: Countess then intervenes, meets her at the train station and

1271
01:09:10,439 --> 01:09:13,200
Speaker 3: prevents her from leaving. She's trying to talk her into staying,

1272
01:09:13,640 --> 01:09:17,400
Speaker 3: not into staying with Stephan, but into staying maybe with

1273
01:09:17,479 --> 01:09:21,280
Speaker 3: her Yeah, and they spend time together at some kind

1274
01:09:21,280 --> 01:09:25,560
Speaker 3: of spa or mineral spring, where they discuss Valerie's relationship

1275
01:09:25,600 --> 01:09:29,360
Speaker 3: with Stefan and the many dangers he presents, but it's

1276
01:09:29,760 --> 01:09:35,320
Speaker 3: increasingly clear over time that the Countess wants Valerie for herself. Meanwhile,

1277
01:09:35,360 --> 01:09:39,920
Speaker 3: at the Hotel, Ilona, on the Countess's instruction she's been

1278
01:09:39,960 --> 01:09:43,519
Speaker 3: told to do this, goes to Stephan and seduces him.

1279
01:09:44,160 --> 01:09:44,840
Speaker 2: And after this.

1280
01:09:44,880 --> 01:09:48,240
Speaker 3: They're they're in the bathroom and they're sort of messing

1281
01:09:48,280 --> 01:09:52,280
Speaker 3: around and Stephan sort of he's he thinks he's being playful,

1282
01:09:52,320 --> 01:09:54,559
Speaker 3: but once again there's this blurred line between kind of

1283
01:09:54,600 --> 01:09:57,959
Speaker 3: flirtation and aggression with him, where he's like being playful

1284
01:09:58,000 --> 01:10:00,519
Speaker 3: but he's actually being violent. And he's trying to put

1285
01:10:00,560 --> 01:10:03,600
Speaker 3: Ilona in the shower and he's laughing while he's doing it.

1286
01:10:03,600 --> 01:10:07,760
Speaker 3: And she's screaming no, seemingly in this case because the

1287
01:10:08,200 --> 01:10:11,640
Speaker 3: shower water actually might harm her. They mentioned earlier that

1288
01:10:11,760 --> 01:10:13,800
Speaker 3: vampires shrink from clear running water.

1289
01:10:14,200 --> 01:10:17,439
Speaker 2: Yeah, yah yah. Running moving water is sometimes like the

1290
01:10:17,479 --> 01:10:21,080
Speaker 2: deeper cut of a vampire weakness that isn't always employed

1291
01:10:21,080 --> 01:10:23,960
Speaker 2: because I don't think storytellers often know what to do

1292
01:10:24,000 --> 01:10:27,040
Speaker 2: with it, or it seems like too potent of a weakness.

1293
01:10:27,520 --> 01:10:29,080
Speaker 2: But it's nicely used here.

1294
01:10:29,520 --> 01:10:34,400
Speaker 3: But in the struggle, Ilona falls on his shaving razor

1295
01:10:34,560 --> 01:10:38,080
Speaker 3: and she is killed. The Countess and Valerie arrive back

1296
01:10:38,120 --> 01:10:40,559
Speaker 3: at the hotel room just in time to see this,

1297
01:10:40,800 --> 01:10:43,519
Speaker 3: to see the body. This seems to be going almost

1298
01:10:43,560 --> 01:10:45,120
Speaker 3: exactly as the count has planned.

1299
01:10:45,479 --> 01:10:47,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I kind of I was thinking about this.

1300
01:10:47,720 --> 01:10:51,040
Speaker 2: You can easily imagine that they were supposed to walk

1301
01:10:51,080 --> 01:10:54,320
Speaker 2: in on the two of them in bed together or

1302
01:10:54,360 --> 01:10:59,280
Speaker 2: showering together or something. But ope, surprise, she's managed to

1303
01:10:59,280 --> 01:11:02,519
Speaker 2: get herself killed by him, and the Countess is probably like, well,

1304
01:11:02,560 --> 01:11:04,679
Speaker 2: this is even better. This has worked out even better

1305
01:11:04,720 --> 01:11:05,400
Speaker 2: than I planned.

1306
01:11:06,080 --> 01:11:09,479
Speaker 3: So now the Countess takes control, She takes control of

1307
01:11:09,520 --> 01:11:12,040
Speaker 3: the situation. We get the sense that she's probably disposed

1308
01:11:12,080 --> 01:11:12,719
Speaker 3: of a body.

1309
01:11:12,560 --> 01:11:14,120
Speaker 2: Or two before, I think so.

1310
01:11:14,439 --> 01:11:17,479
Speaker 3: And she instructs Valerie and Stephan in how to clean

1311
01:11:17,520 --> 01:11:19,840
Speaker 3: up the crime scene and how to get Alonea's body

1312
01:11:19,880 --> 01:11:22,519
Speaker 3: into her car, and then they drive out to this

1313
01:11:22,680 --> 01:11:24,000
Speaker 3: desolate beach.

1314
01:11:23,800 --> 01:11:24,639
Speaker 2: Far from town.

1315
01:11:25,360 --> 01:11:29,679
Speaker 3: Again, all the locations that should be beautiful are actually

1316
01:11:29,720 --> 01:11:30,920
Speaker 3: just horrible and bleak.

1317
01:11:31,240 --> 01:11:32,080
Speaker 2: This is one of them.

1318
01:11:32,360 --> 01:11:34,559
Speaker 3: They go out to this horrible beach and they bury

1319
01:11:34,600 --> 01:11:37,320
Speaker 3: her body in the sand. By the way, here, they're

1320
01:11:37,320 --> 01:11:41,439
Speaker 3: being watched by this older detective character we mentioned earlier,

1321
01:11:41,560 --> 01:11:44,080
Speaker 3: who's he shows up in the scene where they're having

1322
01:11:44,120 --> 01:11:46,920
Speaker 3: the conversation and the lobby also maybe we can talk

1323
01:11:46,920 --> 01:11:50,240
Speaker 3: about that, but he's sort of been on the case

1324
01:11:50,280 --> 01:11:53,360
Speaker 3: of the countess, we are led to believe. And then

1325
01:11:53,479 --> 01:11:55,920
Speaker 3: on the way back from this, the countess just like

1326
01:11:56,040 --> 01:11:58,840
Speaker 3: runs him down with her car while he's on a bicycle.

1327
01:12:00,520 --> 01:12:05,640
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, there's no nobody's coming to save them. The

1328
01:12:05,680 --> 01:12:09,040
Speaker 2: beach you mentioned, like the desolate beach sequence here, I

1329
01:12:09,080 --> 01:12:13,120
Speaker 2: mean tremendous in many ways. I love, like you see

1330
01:12:13,120 --> 01:12:16,200
Speaker 2: the big concrete reinforcements of the beach. So even the

1331
01:12:16,240 --> 01:12:20,840
Speaker 2: beach here is like reinforced by domination and man made violence. Yea.

1332
01:12:21,520 --> 01:12:24,519
Speaker 2: And then and then the burying of the body is

1333
01:12:24,560 --> 01:12:30,240
Speaker 2: just really perfectly executed, like the harshness of her body

1334
01:12:30,280 --> 01:12:33,000
Speaker 2: being thrown in on top of Steph and it almost

1335
01:12:33,000 --> 01:12:34,880
Speaker 2: seems that for a moment there that they're intending to

1336
01:12:34,920 --> 01:12:36,280
Speaker 2: bury him alive with her.

1337
01:12:36,720 --> 01:12:39,960
Speaker 3: I think they're considering it, and they kind of back away,

1338
01:12:40,040 --> 01:12:42,599
Speaker 3: but I don't know. I think they'll get there eventually.

1339
01:12:43,720 --> 01:12:45,920
Speaker 3: So the three of them go back to the Countess's

1340
01:12:46,000 --> 01:12:49,519
Speaker 3: room after this. Actually first I think Stefan and Valerie

1341
01:12:49,600 --> 01:12:50,040
Speaker 3: go back.

1342
01:12:49,880 --> 01:12:52,680
Speaker 2: To their room, but Valerie.

1343
01:12:52,240 --> 01:12:55,560
Speaker 3: Is beginning to fall under the sway of the Countess,

1344
01:12:55,600 --> 01:12:58,720
Speaker 3: and I think there are interesting questions, Rob, I don't

1345
01:12:58,760 --> 01:13:00,960
Speaker 3: know if this is a good place to talk about

1346
01:13:00,960 --> 01:13:04,800
Speaker 3: it might as well. To what extent do you think

1347
01:13:05,439 --> 01:13:10,280
Speaker 3: Valerie's submission to the Countess is supposed to be like

1348
01:13:10,439 --> 01:13:13,720
Speaker 3: magical vampire hypnotism in nature, or what part of it

1349
01:13:13,800 --> 01:13:17,000
Speaker 3: is just a kind of like a kind of helplessness

1350
01:13:17,000 --> 01:13:20,720
Speaker 3: and expression, further expression of what she's already shown but

1351
01:13:21,400 --> 01:13:23,600
Speaker 3: from her personality, but taken to the extreme.

1352
01:13:24,320 --> 01:13:27,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's a lot of ambiguity to this, like is

1353
01:13:27,120 --> 01:13:31,240
Speaker 2: this just further domination? Is it to some degree liberation

1354
01:13:33,040 --> 01:13:33,679
Speaker 2: in a way?

1355
01:13:33,840 --> 01:13:38,719
Speaker 3: I mean liberation, yes, from Stephan, who is she needs

1356
01:13:38,800 --> 01:13:41,880
Speaker 3: liberating from, but also it seems to be putting her

1357
01:13:41,960 --> 01:13:44,480
Speaker 3: under the control of a new oppressor.

1358
01:13:44,320 --> 01:13:47,640
Speaker 2: Right, and we've already seen the end result of the

1359
01:13:47,800 --> 01:13:50,800
Speaker 2: of oppression by the Countess, you know, like she has

1360
01:13:50,920 --> 01:13:54,280
Speaker 2: she has clearly disposed of many thralls over the years,

1361
01:13:54,320 --> 01:13:57,200
Speaker 2: and they eventually just become tools and not darlings to her.

1362
01:13:57,640 --> 01:14:00,000
Speaker 3: But anyway, well, so Valerie is in this state while

1363
01:14:00,160 --> 01:14:04,840
Speaker 3: where she's becoming increasingly entrall to the Countess, and you know,

1364
01:14:05,120 --> 01:14:08,400
Speaker 3: she and Stephan in some way also they're both seemingly

1365
01:14:08,439 --> 01:14:12,280
Speaker 3: having their wills kind of reduced, and Stephan wants to

1366
01:14:12,320 --> 01:14:15,479
Speaker 3: reassert control over Valerie and commands her to leave with him,

1367
01:14:15,479 --> 01:14:18,040
Speaker 3: but she won't go, so they end up in the

1368
01:14:18,040 --> 01:14:23,080
Speaker 3: Countess's room having another horrible hotel room service dinner, and

1369
01:14:23,960 --> 01:14:27,760
Speaker 3: a fight erupts and Stephan is killed after the two

1370
01:14:27,760 --> 01:14:31,639
Speaker 3: women smash a crystal bowl on his face and cut

1371
01:14:31,760 --> 01:14:34,400
Speaker 3: him up with the shards, and then they just both

1372
01:14:35,000 --> 01:14:36,559
Speaker 3: drink the blood from his wounds.

1373
01:14:36,840 --> 01:14:43,479
Speaker 2: This sequence here, the killing slash sacrificing of Stefan. It's

1374
01:14:43,479 --> 01:14:45,839
Speaker 2: a scene that is both ridiculed, like when it happened.

1375
01:14:46,760 --> 01:14:48,679
Speaker 2: I think my job dropped and I kind of laughed

1376
01:14:48,680 --> 01:14:51,240
Speaker 2: a little because, Yeah, they push it down on his face.

1377
01:14:51,520 --> 01:14:56,439
Speaker 2: It even the crystal plate cover like cleanly snaps in two.

1378
01:14:56,960 --> 01:15:00,400
Speaker 2: The two snapped sides flip around and land on his risks,

1379
01:15:00,439 --> 01:15:03,280
Speaker 2: slicing them open, and then they both begin to feed.

1380
01:15:03,640 --> 01:15:07,280
Speaker 2: But it's so perfect in its execution too. It feels

1381
01:15:07,400 --> 01:15:11,400
Speaker 2: like it feels like a sacred symbol. It feels like

1382
01:15:11,479 --> 01:15:14,160
Speaker 2: there's a there's a there's a structural completeness to it

1383
01:15:14,160 --> 01:15:15,000
Speaker 2: that I really liked.

1384
01:15:15,160 --> 01:15:18,800
Speaker 3: A very similar thing happened when when Ilona fell on

1385
01:15:18,840 --> 01:15:21,040
Speaker 3: the razor in the earlier scene, there was a kind

1386
01:15:21,120 --> 01:15:24,000
Speaker 3: of almost a magical hand guiding it through the scene.

1387
01:15:24,040 --> 01:15:27,719
Speaker 3: It just like perfectly happens that it slices her wrists

1388
01:15:28,040 --> 01:15:29,960
Speaker 3: and then she falls on it in this kind of

1389
01:15:29,960 --> 01:15:32,439
Speaker 3: implausible way. But it's all kind of done in a

1390
01:15:32,520 --> 01:15:36,720
Speaker 3: slow motion with these short close up shots. Uh yeah,

1391
01:15:36,920 --> 01:15:37,960
Speaker 3: a similar thing going on.

1392
01:15:38,600 --> 01:15:42,519
Speaker 2: Yeah, the and these and these implausible, possibly implausible deaths

1393
01:15:42,520 --> 01:15:44,559
Speaker 2: are not not through and when they do it right,

1394
01:15:45,200 --> 01:15:46,679
Speaker 2: they do feel like destiny.

1395
01:15:47,240 --> 01:15:50,960
Speaker 3: I thought it was interesting the absolutely unceremonious dumping of

1396
01:15:51,000 --> 01:15:53,519
Speaker 3: Stephan's corpse where they just like throw them over a

1397
01:15:53,560 --> 01:15:54,719
Speaker 3: wall under the road.

1398
01:15:55,200 --> 01:15:57,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, they're just done with him. Yeah.

1399
01:15:57,640 --> 01:16:00,280
Speaker 3: So after this, Valerie and the Countess escape the scene

1400
01:16:00,280 --> 01:16:03,040
Speaker 3: of the crime in the Countess's car, with Valerie driving,

1401
01:16:03,600 --> 01:16:06,439
Speaker 3: and the Countess is becoming desperate that they've they've got

1402
01:16:06,439 --> 01:16:09,559
Speaker 3: to get to safety before daylight. But they don't make it.

1403
01:16:09,640 --> 01:16:12,599
Speaker 3: And so here we get to the ending where where

1404
01:16:12,640 --> 01:16:15,080
Speaker 3: I think the sun is rising and coming through the trees.

1405
01:16:15,120 --> 01:16:17,719
Speaker 3: They're like driving along a road that's lined by trees,

1406
01:16:18,040 --> 01:16:21,040
Speaker 3: and as the sun comes in, Valerie is blinded and

1407
01:16:21,120 --> 01:16:25,479
Speaker 3: wrecks the car. Questionable whether she meant to wreck the

1408
01:16:25,520 --> 01:16:27,400
Speaker 3: car or not, I couldn't quite tell. I don't know

1409
01:16:27,400 --> 01:16:28,439
Speaker 3: if you have thoughts about that.

1410
01:16:28,720 --> 01:16:32,800
Speaker 2: I interpreted it as accidental, but I think this is

1411
01:16:32,840 --> 01:16:34,720
Speaker 2: an unacceptable read as well.

1412
01:16:34,960 --> 01:16:38,439
Speaker 3: Yeah, either way, Valerie is I think she was wearing

1413
01:16:38,439 --> 01:16:42,120
Speaker 3: her seat belt and she is okay. But the Countess

1414
01:16:42,520 --> 01:16:45,920
Speaker 3: is thrown through the windshield and impaled through the heart

1415
01:16:45,960 --> 01:16:48,680
Speaker 3: on a branch from a fallen tree, and then she

1416
01:16:48,800 --> 01:16:50,240
Speaker 3: catches fire and explodes.

1417
01:16:50,880 --> 01:16:54,360
Speaker 2: Yeah. It's pretty stunning and again improbable in one sense,

1418
01:16:54,360 --> 01:16:57,880
Speaker 2: but also it feels like destiny. And there are some

1419
01:16:58,000 --> 01:17:00,880
Speaker 2: dialogue lines from the Countess earlier kind of allude to this.

1420
01:17:01,000 --> 01:17:04,840
Speaker 2: She talks about about like death following her, like death

1421
01:17:04,920 --> 01:17:07,120
Speaker 2: is always coming for her, and like this is a

1422
01:17:07,160 --> 01:17:09,960
Speaker 2: scene where death catches up and claims her, and so

1423
01:17:10,000 --> 01:17:13,720
Speaker 2: she seems like a little shocked, but also you know,

1424
01:17:14,360 --> 01:17:17,240
Speaker 2: realizing as well that like this, this was always going

1425
01:17:17,280 --> 01:17:18,280
Speaker 2: to happen, and here it is.

1426
01:17:18,640 --> 01:17:21,240
Speaker 3: She's been living on credit from the balance of death

1427
01:17:21,320 --> 01:17:25,200
Speaker 3: for centuries now, and it's it's been coming. It's finally

1428
01:17:25,240 --> 01:17:26,000
Speaker 3: come to collect.

1429
01:17:26,640 --> 01:17:28,920
Speaker 2: But for Valerie though, that's right, son.

1430
01:17:29,320 --> 01:17:32,800
Speaker 3: Yes, there is also a coda where Valerie has now

1431
01:17:32,840 --> 01:17:37,000
Speaker 3: become a vampire queen and we see her essentially repeating,

1432
01:17:37,520 --> 01:17:40,680
Speaker 3: repeating what the Countess did to them. We see her

1433
01:17:41,000 --> 01:17:43,479
Speaker 3: making friends with a young man and a young woman

1434
01:17:43,560 --> 01:17:47,040
Speaker 3: at a luxury resort, these nice hot people dressed up

1435
01:17:47,400 --> 01:17:51,160
Speaker 3: in like tennis clothes, the tennis rackets, and she she

1436
01:17:51,280 --> 01:17:52,240
Speaker 3: is recruiting them.

1437
01:17:52,280 --> 01:17:56,040
Speaker 2: It seems like she's the new bathroom. Yeah. Yeah, And

1438
01:17:56,080 --> 01:17:58,519
Speaker 2: it leaves us and this is the end of the picture,

1439
01:17:58,560 --> 01:18:01,559
Speaker 2: and it leads us to contemplate, like so many things,

1440
01:18:02,080 --> 01:18:04,240
Speaker 2: but one thing I kept wondering about is like what

1441
01:18:04,400 --> 01:18:08,120
Speaker 2: is the like what did the countess see as her mission,

1442
01:18:08,120 --> 01:18:10,200
Speaker 2: and what is Valorie seeing as her mission here when

1443
01:18:10,240 --> 01:18:14,040
Speaker 2: she sees two young people, like is is she identifying

1444
01:18:15,160 --> 01:18:19,160
Speaker 2: like a woman that she wants to free from from

1445
01:18:19,280 --> 01:18:23,040
Speaker 2: a dominating relationship? Is it like a you know, an

1446
01:18:23,160 --> 01:18:27,680
Speaker 2: unending war against patriarchy? Is it? But is it? Or

1447
01:18:27,720 --> 01:18:29,519
Speaker 2: is it something else? It's just like here is just

1448
01:18:29,720 --> 01:18:32,000
Speaker 2: there is here's an attractive person that I want to

1449
01:18:32,040 --> 01:18:35,240
Speaker 2: dominate with my will, Like, you know, where where is

1450
01:18:35,240 --> 01:18:37,880
Speaker 2: the domination? Where is the liberation? How does it all

1451
01:18:37,880 --> 01:18:39,360
Speaker 2: come together in this picture?

1452
01:18:39,520 --> 01:18:42,320
Speaker 3: Good question. I think that is somewhat left open mm

1453
01:18:42,400 --> 01:18:53,559
Speaker 3: hm to talk about a few individual scenes. I wanted

1454
01:18:53,600 --> 01:18:57,400
Speaker 3: to dwell for just a moment on the trip to Bruges. Yeah,

1455
01:18:57,439 --> 01:19:00,919
Speaker 3: so there's this time when they like read some articles

1456
01:19:00,920 --> 01:19:03,759
Speaker 3: in the newspaper about ooh, there have been horrible murders

1457
01:19:03,760 --> 01:19:07,840
Speaker 3: in Bruges, girls getting their throats slashed. Uh, And then

1458
01:19:08,160 --> 01:19:09,599
Speaker 3: what do you know, It's time to do a little

1459
01:19:09,640 --> 01:19:11,800
Speaker 3: day trip. Let's go to Bruges. So they go there,

1460
01:19:12,840 --> 01:19:15,000
Speaker 3: they do a boat ride on the canals, and then

1461
01:19:15,040 --> 01:19:17,120
Speaker 3: they just stop to look at a murder scene, like

1462
01:19:17,240 --> 01:19:19,559
Speaker 3: the police are around a house and a body is

1463
01:19:19,600 --> 01:19:23,400
Speaker 3: being brought out, and Stephan is just obsessed. He's like

1464
01:19:23,560 --> 01:19:26,960
Speaker 3: insatiably curious to get up close and see the flesh

1465
01:19:26,960 --> 01:19:30,080
Speaker 3: of the corpse. There's this older man there who's telling

1466
01:19:30,120 --> 01:19:32,080
Speaker 3: him the details of the crimes, and it turns out

1467
01:19:32,120 --> 01:19:34,240
Speaker 3: this is the inspector guy who's been on the trail

1468
01:19:34,320 --> 01:19:37,320
Speaker 3: of the countess. Are we to understand I think that

1469
01:19:37,360 --> 01:19:39,639
Speaker 3: the countess is responsible for these murders?

1470
01:19:39,720 --> 01:19:41,880
Speaker 2: I believe, so yeah, there's some illusion later on to

1471
01:19:41,960 --> 01:19:44,360
Speaker 2: the fact that she has been in bruses recently and

1472
01:19:44,680 --> 01:19:47,240
Speaker 2: was clearly feasting.

1473
01:19:48,000 --> 01:19:51,799
Speaker 3: So Stephan is he gets really absorbed as the girl's

1474
01:19:51,880 --> 01:19:54,080
Speaker 3: body is taken by under a sheet, though her hand

1475
01:19:54,200 --> 01:19:56,679
Speaker 3: keeps falling out and then they keep stuffing it back

1476
01:19:56,720 --> 01:19:59,120
Speaker 3: under the sheet. But he's so wrapped up that he

1477
01:19:59,320 --> 01:20:02,400
Speaker 3: like freaks out and he hits Valerie when she interferes

1478
01:20:02,439 --> 01:20:06,960
Speaker 3: with him. And so when they're on the bus on

1479
01:20:07,040 --> 01:20:10,240
Speaker 3: the way back, Valerie says to him, Stephan, I'm frightened,

1480
01:20:10,280 --> 01:20:13,240
Speaker 3: and he says, of what she says of you, and

1481
01:20:13,280 --> 01:20:16,000
Speaker 3: he's dismissive. He says, don't be ridiculous. I was just

1482
01:20:16,120 --> 01:20:20,080
Speaker 3: looking like everyone else, and Valerie says, don't lie to yourself.

1483
01:20:20,160 --> 01:20:23,639
Speaker 3: You were pleased. It gave you pleasure. You actually enjoyed

1484
01:20:23,680 --> 01:20:27,240
Speaker 3: to see that dead girl's body, And Stephan says, and

1485
01:20:27,320 --> 01:20:30,720
Speaker 3: you enjoyed telling me. We're getting to know each other,

1486
01:20:32,320 --> 01:20:36,439
Speaker 3: which is interesting because it's this dark dynamic where I

1487
01:20:36,439 --> 01:20:39,840
Speaker 3: think he's sort of right there. There's something that's she's

1488
01:20:39,880 --> 01:20:43,439
Speaker 3: getting fulfillment out of, like recognizing this about him in

1489
01:20:43,600 --> 01:20:47,800
Speaker 3: some way. And then after this conversation, she kind of

1490
01:20:47,920 --> 01:20:51,000
Speaker 3: leans into him and then starts trying to get frisky

1491
01:20:51,080 --> 01:20:53,559
Speaker 3: on the bus, I think, but Stepan like pushes her

1492
01:20:53,600 --> 01:20:56,479
Speaker 3: hand away. And this is one of those scenes where

1493
01:20:56,479 --> 01:20:58,800
Speaker 3: there's like it cuts there, and then the next time

1494
01:20:58,840 --> 01:21:00,400
Speaker 3: we see them, they're like coming in out of the

1495
01:21:00,479 --> 01:21:04,080
Speaker 3: rain and they're like laughing and everything's good again. But

1496
01:21:04,920 --> 01:21:06,639
Speaker 3: the next scene, by the way, we should also mention

1497
01:21:06,760 --> 01:21:10,000
Speaker 3: because this is the meeting in the lobby where where

1498
01:21:10,400 --> 01:21:12,840
Speaker 3: the Countess and our young couple first get to know

1499
01:21:12,920 --> 01:21:15,240
Speaker 3: each other. And the Countess when we first meet her here,

1500
01:21:15,280 --> 01:21:17,719
Speaker 3: she's sitting in a red velvet chair and she's knitting.

1501
01:21:17,880 --> 01:21:20,880
Speaker 3: She has two arn balls with knitting needles, and she's

1502
01:21:20,920 --> 01:21:21,559
Speaker 3: going to town.

1503
01:21:22,200 --> 01:21:24,200
Speaker 2: Yeah. I love the implied I mean, in a way,

1504
01:21:24,240 --> 01:21:28,439
Speaker 2: they're like two vampire fangs. I guess right, Oh I

1505
01:21:28,479 --> 01:21:31,559
Speaker 2: didn't think about that. Yeah, now is this also refreshed

1506
01:21:31,560 --> 01:21:35,120
Speaker 2: my memories? This also the scene with the bright green drink.

1507
01:21:35,600 --> 01:21:39,959
Speaker 3: Yes, okay, yes, we're not there yet, so like at first, first,

1508
01:21:40,000 --> 01:21:41,880
Speaker 3: she has a little exchange with the loona a Lona

1509
01:21:42,000 --> 01:21:44,160
Speaker 3: comes out and she's like, you know, I'm trying to

1510
01:21:44,240 --> 01:21:45,200
Speaker 3: leave you, Countess.

1511
01:21:45,360 --> 01:21:47,240
Speaker 2: I'm going to leave you and I'm going to go away.

1512
01:21:47,479 --> 01:21:49,559
Speaker 3: She says, let me go away, and the Countess says,

1513
01:21:49,640 --> 01:21:53,000
Speaker 3: I never would and you never could. And Alona is like,

1514
01:21:53,040 --> 01:21:55,439
Speaker 3: but you can have them, the new ones, the beautiful ones.

1515
01:21:55,600 --> 01:21:58,200
Speaker 3: With them, you don't need me anymore. And the Countess says,

1516
01:21:58,240 --> 01:22:01,240
Speaker 3: without me, you'd have no life. And Delna says, you

1517
01:22:01,320 --> 01:22:04,439
Speaker 3: call this a life. But the Countess again is just

1518
01:22:04,520 --> 01:22:06,960
Speaker 3: kind of cold to her, unfeeling to her needs. And

1519
01:22:07,280 --> 01:22:11,639
Speaker 3: the Countess meets Stefan and Valerie as they come in

1520
01:22:11,680 --> 01:22:14,639
Speaker 3: from Bruges and invites them for drinks in the lounge.

1521
01:22:15,400 --> 01:22:17,200
Speaker 3: I like the part where she kind of fusses over

1522
01:22:17,240 --> 01:22:19,680
Speaker 3: them being wet from the rain. She's like, oh no, no,

1523
01:22:19,720 --> 01:22:21,920
Speaker 3: you must go up and get yourselves dry clothes. If

1524
01:22:21,960 --> 01:22:23,719
Speaker 3: you came down with the slightest bit of a cold

1525
01:22:23,760 --> 01:22:27,479
Speaker 3: I'd never be able to forgive myself. She also demands

1526
01:22:27,520 --> 01:22:29,120
Speaker 3: that Pierre bring them hot rum.

1527
01:22:29,600 --> 01:22:32,559
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, so they get hot rum, and yeah, she

1528
01:22:32,680 --> 01:22:35,800
Speaker 2: gets this bright green drink that I think a lot

1529
01:22:35,840 --> 01:22:41,240
Speaker 2: of you would recognize as a grasshopper. But in one

1530
01:22:41,280 --> 01:22:43,120
Speaker 2: of the extras where they were talking about this, they

1531
01:22:43,160 --> 01:22:45,599
Speaker 2: referred to it as an Alexander, and I was looking

1532
01:22:45,640 --> 01:22:48,120
Speaker 2: it up, and they're different like Alexander drinks, not all

1533
01:22:48,160 --> 01:22:52,200
Speaker 2: of which are green summer green, and I get the

1534
01:22:52,200 --> 01:22:55,080
Speaker 2: impression it's essentially the same as a grasshopper. I don't know.

1535
01:22:55,080 --> 01:22:59,080
Speaker 2: Once that much cream dement is in something, I think

1536
01:22:59,120 --> 01:23:03,800
Speaker 2: we're all these drinks are the same, equally undrinkable by

1537
01:23:03,880 --> 01:23:05,040
Speaker 2: humans or vampires.

1538
01:23:05,240 --> 01:23:08,080
Speaker 3: I considered trying to make myself one of these this week,

1539
01:23:08,600 --> 01:23:10,439
Speaker 3: but I was not it. I didn't have time to

1540
01:23:10,439 --> 01:23:12,360
Speaker 3: go out to the store and get the ingredients needed.

1541
01:23:13,120 --> 01:23:16,000
Speaker 2: No shame on anyone who enjoys a good grasshopper, but

1542
01:23:16,040 --> 01:23:18,080
Speaker 2: it's it's never been my beverage of choice.

1543
01:23:18,400 --> 01:23:20,160
Speaker 3: I don't know what I would do with the rest

1544
01:23:20,160 --> 01:23:21,320
Speaker 3: of the bottle of a crim dement.

1545
01:23:21,800 --> 01:23:24,840
Speaker 2: It would it would outlive you. That's the tragedy of

1546
01:23:24,840 --> 01:23:26,960
Speaker 2: getting a bottle of crim dementth is like you know

1547
01:23:27,080 --> 01:23:30,080
Speaker 2: that this will have to be passed on to another generation,

1548
01:23:30,160 --> 01:23:32,880
Speaker 2: and there's you know, it's it's like seeing an ancient

1549
01:23:33,000 --> 01:23:34,920
Speaker 2: vampire queen walk into your parlor.

1550
01:23:35,120 --> 01:23:37,439
Speaker 3: It's like having a vampire lover. They'll be around when

1551
01:23:37,479 --> 01:23:38,160
Speaker 3: you're gone.

1552
01:23:38,240 --> 01:23:42,240
Speaker 2: Yeah. But I also love how she never drinks this

1553
01:23:42,320 --> 01:23:45,519
Speaker 2: beverage and then eventually just hands it to Alona, who

1554
01:23:45,560 --> 01:23:49,599
Speaker 2: just dumps it into a potted plant, which seemed even

1555
01:23:49,680 --> 01:23:52,200
Speaker 2: worse right because like other drinks, you can dump dump

1556
01:23:52,200 --> 01:23:55,120
Speaker 2: into a plant and it's like, Okay, that plant probably

1557
01:23:55,160 --> 01:23:57,800
Speaker 2: doesn't need a gin and tonic, but very well. But

1558
01:23:57,840 --> 01:24:01,200
Speaker 2: this is like a bright green, clumpy beverage.

1559
01:24:01,520 --> 01:24:07,840
Speaker 3: It's made with heavy cream. Yeah, but oh yeah yeah.

1560
01:24:07,880 --> 01:24:10,040
Speaker 3: So they have this whole conversation and it goes to

1561
01:24:10,040 --> 01:24:12,519
Speaker 3: a bunch of different places. She's she's so kind of

1562
01:24:14,680 --> 01:24:18,200
Speaker 3: coy and coquettish in a way, Like she she's talking

1563
01:24:18,200 --> 01:24:21,240
Speaker 3: about how, you know, oh, I have to say whatever

1564
01:24:21,280 --> 01:24:21,759
Speaker 3: I'm thinking.

1565
01:24:21,800 --> 01:24:23,439
Speaker 2: I just can't keep it to myself. You know.

1566
01:24:23,640 --> 01:24:27,600
Speaker 3: The Archduke said to me, Elizabeth, you are an innocent.

1567
01:24:28,680 --> 01:24:29,519
Speaker 2: And yeah.

1568
01:24:29,840 --> 01:24:31,720
Speaker 3: She also talks about how she hates it when there's

1569
01:24:31,720 --> 01:24:34,519
Speaker 3: no one around. It's so lonely. She's the opposite of Pierre.

1570
01:24:35,640 --> 01:24:39,559
Speaker 3: But let's see. Oh, this scene eventually works it up

1571
01:24:39,600 --> 01:24:43,360
Speaker 3: to the spot where Valerie storms out. Well well, like

1572
01:24:43,439 --> 01:24:47,320
Speaker 3: the Countess and Steffan are going wild about the mutilation stories.

1573
01:24:48,560 --> 01:24:51,400
Speaker 3: But this also leads up to that moment I mentioned

1574
01:24:51,400 --> 01:24:54,200
Speaker 3: earlier that is so such a good horror moment where

1575
01:24:54,320 --> 01:24:57,080
Speaker 3: Valerie goes back to her room alone because you know,

1576
01:24:57,120 --> 01:24:59,960
Speaker 3: her husband's like getting busy with the Countess about talking

1577
01:25:00,040 --> 01:25:03,640
Speaker 3: about getting cutting people's fingers off, and she goes up

1578
01:25:03,680 --> 01:25:06,519
Speaker 3: to her room alone and suddenly Alona comes in at

1579
01:25:06,520 --> 01:25:09,320
Speaker 3: the balcony, I think, wanting to drink her blood, but

1580
01:25:09,400 --> 01:25:14,479
Speaker 3: she's like naked and doing this weird ballerina pose and

1581
01:25:14,960 --> 01:25:18,200
Speaker 3: we hear Valerie scream. But then when we come to

1582
01:25:18,240 --> 01:25:21,200
Speaker 3: her later, she's like in bed and you don't know

1583
01:25:21,240 --> 01:25:23,760
Speaker 3: what happened in between. Also, when we see Alona later,

1584
01:25:23,880 --> 01:25:27,559
Speaker 3: she's like leaning naked over a toilet and vomiting. I think,

1585
01:25:28,160 --> 01:25:31,559
Speaker 3: so it's like, what is what happened? While while they

1586
01:25:31,560 --> 01:25:33,960
Speaker 3: were off screen it's not quite clear, it seems like

1587
01:25:34,160 --> 01:25:35,120
Speaker 3: something happened.

1588
01:25:35,600 --> 01:25:38,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know. I mean, maybe alone is just

1589
01:25:38,840 --> 01:25:43,439
Speaker 2: sick from not feeding something to that. Maybe. But then yeah,

1590
01:25:43,479 --> 01:25:46,200
Speaker 2: the countess comes in chastises and like tells her like,

1591
01:25:46,240 --> 01:25:49,519
Speaker 2: oh you couldn't wait, could you? And so forth, let's

1592
01:25:49,520 --> 01:25:50,040
Speaker 2: see anything.

1593
01:25:50,080 --> 01:25:51,880
Speaker 3: Oh we said we were going to say a little

1594
01:25:51,880 --> 01:25:55,479
Speaker 3: bit more about the call with quote mother this character.

1595
01:25:55,720 --> 01:25:57,880
Speaker 3: One thing I had to say about the scene is

1596
01:25:57,960 --> 01:26:00,000
Speaker 3: not at all about the themes. I was curious how

1597
01:26:00,080 --> 01:26:03,000
Speaker 3: the phone call was gonna work. Is the butler brings

1598
01:26:03,040 --> 01:26:06,080
Speaker 3: the telephone out to the conservatory on a platter, like it's.

1599
01:26:05,960 --> 01:26:07,240
Speaker 2: Almost not slunged into anything.

1600
01:26:07,280 --> 01:26:09,320
Speaker 3: It's not plugged into anything, And I was like, where's

1601
01:26:09,320 --> 01:26:11,800
Speaker 3: the cord? I was like, this is unrealistic. But then

1602
01:26:12,000 --> 01:26:15,160
Speaker 3: it all came around because the butler kneels down, gives

1603
01:26:15,200 --> 01:26:17,640
Speaker 3: the phone, hands the phone over, and then plugs the

1604
01:26:17,640 --> 01:26:20,080
Speaker 3: phone into a jack in the floor. I was like, Oh,

1605
01:26:20,120 --> 01:26:22,400
Speaker 3: that's how they do it. They're just jacks everywhere. You

1606
01:26:22,479 --> 01:26:24,519
Speaker 3: plug it in, wherever you bring it. That's smart.

1607
01:26:24,880 --> 01:26:28,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, it took so much work to have a phone

1608
01:26:28,280 --> 01:26:29,920
Speaker 2: call in those days. Yeah.

1609
01:26:29,960 --> 01:26:34,920
Speaker 3: But anyway, seriously, when the conversation begins, the surprise is

1610
01:26:34,960 --> 01:26:38,559
Speaker 3: it shows this this older middle aged man who's like

1611
01:26:38,960 --> 01:26:41,439
Speaker 3: you know, he's in a hammock in the conservatory, surrounded

1612
01:26:41,439 --> 01:26:43,760
Speaker 3: by beautiful plants and flowers, and he's like on a

1613
01:26:43,800 --> 01:26:47,400
Speaker 3: pink and purple pillow and he's wearing a scarf, and

1614
01:26:47,439 --> 01:26:49,479
Speaker 3: he says on the phone, he's like, Steffan, I hope

1615
01:26:49,479 --> 01:26:53,759
Speaker 3: you didn't do anything foolish in Switzerland, and Stefan breaks

1616
01:26:53,800 --> 01:26:57,559
Speaker 3: the news that he got married, and there is kind

1617
01:26:57,600 --> 01:27:01,720
Speaker 3: of derision and cruel amuse meant in the response it's

1618
01:27:01,760 --> 01:27:03,800
Speaker 3: just kind of like, oh, what a nice surprise. What

1619
01:27:03,840 --> 01:27:06,920
Speaker 3: you did wasn't foolish, it was merely unrealistic.

1620
01:27:07,200 --> 01:27:08,920
Speaker 2: What in the world would we do with her?

1621
01:27:09,680 --> 01:27:12,320
Speaker 3: And he, you know, he says, he says, like when

1622
01:27:12,320 --> 01:27:15,200
Speaker 3: she hears about us, oh, I hate to think about that,

1623
01:27:15,560 --> 01:27:19,120
Speaker 3: kind of seemingly threatening him or or something. But it's

1624
01:27:19,400 --> 01:27:22,680
Speaker 3: never made fully explicit what he means here. You just

1625
01:27:22,760 --> 01:27:25,400
Speaker 3: have to kind of read the scene and make your

1626
01:27:25,439 --> 01:27:28,840
Speaker 3: own interpretation. But he ends saying, be sure to tell

1627
01:27:28,920 --> 01:27:33,599
Speaker 3: that young woman that mother sends regards. And then after

1628
01:27:33,640 --> 01:27:36,240
Speaker 3: the call of course, this is when we see Stephan

1629
01:27:36,479 --> 01:27:40,800
Speaker 3: first turn really violent with Valerie. And it's interesting, like,

1630
01:27:40,880 --> 01:27:43,559
Speaker 3: before the violence actually starts, you see these kind of

1631
01:27:43,600 --> 01:27:47,240
Speaker 3: two waves come over him that I think are interesting

1632
01:27:47,280 --> 01:27:50,000
Speaker 3: in the performance, like you see you see him by

1633
01:27:50,080 --> 01:27:55,559
Speaker 3: turns internalize his feelings and then a change happens, and

1634
01:27:55,600 --> 01:27:59,160
Speaker 3: then he externalizes them and then that's when he becomes violent.

1635
01:27:59,800 --> 01:28:03,439
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, I think it's very interesting here that again

1636
01:28:03,640 --> 01:28:08,559
Speaker 2: mother is portrayed as a male character, and yet the

1637
01:28:08,600 --> 01:28:12,000
Speaker 2: actors were originally not told this detail. In fact, we're

1638
01:28:12,240 --> 01:28:16,120
Speaker 2: left to to infer that it was a female character,

1639
01:28:16,160 --> 01:28:19,280
Speaker 2: perhaps the character's mother, that he actual mother that he

1640
01:28:19,360 --> 01:28:23,280
Speaker 2: was on the phone with. So, you know, it's it's

1641
01:28:23,320 --> 01:28:25,280
Speaker 2: it's an interesting exercise to try and figure out, like

1642
01:28:25,320 --> 01:28:28,000
Speaker 2: why did they make this choice? And my read on

1643
01:28:28,040 --> 01:28:30,600
Speaker 2: this is that part of it might be, you know,

1644
01:28:30,600 --> 01:28:33,960
Speaker 2: it might come back again to this theme of victimization

1645
01:28:34,080 --> 01:28:36,920
Speaker 2: and patriarchal rule. So, you know, we we have our

1646
01:28:37,000 --> 01:28:42,320
Speaker 2: character Stephan here who is seemingly like both a perpetrator

1647
01:28:42,400 --> 01:28:46,000
Speaker 2: and a victim of patriarchal power, Like there is this

1648
01:28:46,600 --> 01:28:49,880
Speaker 2: older man in his life that he is he at

1649
01:28:49,960 --> 01:28:55,080
Speaker 2: least feels control by and is rebelling against and has

1650
01:28:55,120 --> 01:28:57,439
Speaker 2: gone out into the world and sort of like found

1651
01:28:57,520 --> 01:28:59,720
Speaker 2: someone that maybe on some you know, on some level,

1652
01:28:59,720 --> 01:29:03,519
Speaker 2: definitely felt liberating and freeing to be around. But then

1653
01:29:03,600 --> 01:29:06,519
Speaker 2: it comes back around to how can I control this

1654
01:29:06,560 --> 01:29:09,800
Speaker 2: person and in doing so feel free from how I

1655
01:29:09,840 --> 01:29:14,320
Speaker 2: was being control Yeah, and I guess like, like, clearly

1656
01:29:14,920 --> 01:29:19,040
Speaker 2: the gender divide is was important to this film's vision,

1657
01:29:19,640 --> 01:29:22,439
Speaker 2: with the Countest being kind of like this female force

1658
01:29:22,439 --> 01:29:27,559
Speaker 2: of liberation or another form of domination, and therefore they

1659
01:29:27,720 --> 01:29:30,679
Speaker 2: that they thought it was important to have the figure

1660
01:29:30,720 --> 01:29:33,599
Speaker 2: that it was controlling Stephan to be you know, equally

1661
01:29:33,600 --> 01:29:38,240
Speaker 2: a male force. And therefore, you know, beating into this idea.

1662
01:29:38,400 --> 01:29:42,280
Speaker 2: You know that it is patriarchal oppression, that is, that

1663
01:29:42,400 --> 01:29:45,280
Speaker 2: is you know, weaving its its roots through everything. But

1664
01:29:45,400 --> 01:29:48,599
Speaker 2: at the same time, it's definitely worth noting that there

1665
01:29:48,680 --> 01:29:53,559
Speaker 2: are there, definitely do seem to be some homophobic tropes

1666
01:29:53,640 --> 01:29:58,640
Speaker 2: wound up in this mother Stephan relationship that were presented

1667
01:29:58,720 --> 01:30:02,920
Speaker 2: with and you know, this could have quite possibly been

1668
01:30:03,720 --> 01:30:07,680
Speaker 2: incorporated indirectly for a number of reasons, but David J.

1669
01:30:07,800 --> 01:30:11,000
Speaker 2: Skall does call it out en VFA vampire. The late

1670
01:30:11,040 --> 01:30:15,160
Speaker 2: David Jay Skull was himself openly gay and often wrote

1671
01:30:15,160 --> 01:30:19,679
Speaker 2: about the intersect of homophobia, gay culture, and vampire media,

1672
01:30:20,200 --> 01:30:24,480
Speaker 2: with observations based on everything from homo eroticism in mainstream

1673
01:30:24,560 --> 01:30:28,880
Speaker 2: Dracula films to its overt treatment in counterculture art house

1674
01:30:28,960 --> 01:30:32,559
Speaker 2: or even pornographic films that had vampire characters in them.

1675
01:30:33,080 --> 01:30:37,759
Speaker 2: And he describes Daughters of Darkness as by saying that quote,

1676
01:30:37,800 --> 01:30:42,000
Speaker 2: the politics are ambiguous, if suspiciously homophobic, But the film

1677
01:30:42,000 --> 01:30:44,519
Speaker 2: contains a sufficient number of stylish set pieces to have

1678
01:30:44,560 --> 01:30:48,519
Speaker 2: earned it the reputation of a minor classic. So again,

1679
01:30:49,400 --> 01:30:50,880
Speaker 2: I do tend to agree with schol here. I think

1680
01:30:50,880 --> 01:30:53,559
Speaker 2: there are some homophobic tropes wound up in the portrayal

1681
01:30:53,560 --> 01:30:55,720
Speaker 2: of this character. I don't know how meant much of

1682
01:30:55,760 --> 01:30:59,919
Speaker 2: it was itself directly intentional or kind of a bypropu

1683
01:31:00,439 --> 01:31:03,200
Speaker 2: of other things the film was trying to say, and

1684
01:31:03,280 --> 01:31:07,040
Speaker 2: maybe just incorporating tropes that were just present everywhere anyway

1685
01:31:07,080 --> 01:31:09,200
Speaker 2: in the in the early nineteen seventies and a lot

1686
01:31:09,200 --> 01:31:12,760
Speaker 2: of films and storytelling. I think it would have been.

1687
01:31:12,800 --> 01:31:15,720
Speaker 2: It's interesting to try to imagine different versions of this

1688
01:31:15,800 --> 01:31:19,320
Speaker 2: film where the reveal here of mother was a little different,

1689
01:31:19,400 --> 01:31:22,920
Speaker 2: Like what if the scene had him talking to an

1690
01:31:22,920 --> 01:31:26,760
Speaker 2: older woman that was that was his actual mother, or

1691
01:31:27,240 --> 01:31:29,920
Speaker 2: an older woman or even a woman his own age.

1692
01:31:30,680 --> 01:31:35,760
Speaker 2: That seems to be a past romantic partner who is

1693
01:31:35,840 --> 01:31:38,760
Speaker 2: domineering and he's trying to escape from. Like, what would

1694
01:31:38,800 --> 01:31:40,479
Speaker 2: it have changed that much? Would it have had that

1695
01:31:40,560 --> 01:31:43,960
Speaker 2: much of an impact or what if regardless, what if

1696
01:31:44,000 --> 01:31:48,200
Speaker 2: there was like some element of tenderness to the relationship

1697
01:31:48,240 --> 01:31:50,080
Speaker 2: implied as well, because what we see here is just

1698
01:31:50,120 --> 01:31:51,439
Speaker 2: a relationship of domination.

1699
01:31:52,280 --> 01:31:55,559
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean you could imagine a version of the

1700
01:31:55,600 --> 01:31:57,920
Speaker 3: scene where he makes the call and the character is

1701
01:31:57,960 --> 01:32:00,920
Speaker 3: the same, but the character is like anger, you know,

1702
01:32:01,240 --> 01:32:05,599
Speaker 3: is like showing like real like a sense of having

1703
01:32:05,640 --> 01:32:09,080
Speaker 3: been betrayed or something that Stephan went and married somebody else.

1704
01:32:09,880 --> 01:32:13,360
Speaker 3: But you don't get that. There's just kind of a

1705
01:32:13,840 --> 01:32:18,479
Speaker 3: confident dismissal of him, you know, just like kind of

1706
01:32:18,520 --> 01:32:23,280
Speaker 3: like this, this is silly. I'm disappointed in you. You'll

1707
01:32:23,320 --> 01:32:24,639
Speaker 3: be back under my thumb soon.

1708
01:32:25,160 --> 01:32:28,479
Speaker 2: Yeah, things like this have happened before. This may be

1709
01:32:28,560 --> 01:32:32,680
Speaker 2: more severe, but I'm not surprised. Yeah, you'll be back

1710
01:32:32,760 --> 01:32:33,200
Speaker 2: next week.

1711
01:32:33,479 --> 01:32:35,719
Speaker 3: And it's in fact, it's kind of like the exchange

1712
01:32:35,720 --> 01:32:37,040
Speaker 3: with Alona and the Countess.

1713
01:32:37,120 --> 01:32:39,160
Speaker 2: Yes, when Alona, I mean there are.

1714
01:32:39,120 --> 01:32:41,160
Speaker 3: Multiple things like that, like when she threatens to leave

1715
01:32:41,160 --> 01:32:44,640
Speaker 3: and the Countess almost completely ignores her, it's just like, yeah, yeah, no,

1716
01:32:44,800 --> 01:32:47,479
Speaker 3: you need me, You're not going anywhere, Or in the

1717
01:32:47,479 --> 01:32:49,320
Speaker 3: scene where she says I want to die and the

1718
01:32:49,360 --> 01:32:51,400
Speaker 3: Countess just says, the light's hurting my eyes.

1719
01:32:52,600 --> 01:32:55,040
Speaker 2: Yeah. There's so many ways that the relationships that these

1720
01:32:55,080 --> 01:32:58,320
Speaker 2: characters have mirror each other, the living and the undead.

1721
01:32:59,000 --> 01:33:02,320
Speaker 3: Another kind of interesting mirrorring that's worth talking about is

1722
01:33:02,360 --> 01:33:07,160
Speaker 3: how Valerie's romance in a way with the Countess, though

1723
01:33:07,200 --> 01:33:10,919
Speaker 3: it seems to be a kind of maybe magically controlled romance,

1724
01:33:11,800 --> 01:33:15,640
Speaker 3: because when the Countess is first like trying to seduce Valerie,

1725
01:33:16,520 --> 01:33:18,880
Speaker 3: the Countess says what she says many times. She says,

1726
01:33:18,920 --> 01:33:20,920
Speaker 3: you must be nice to me. Soon you will love

1727
01:33:20,960 --> 01:33:23,439
Speaker 3: me as I love you now, and Valerie says, I

1728
01:33:23,520 --> 01:33:28,160
Speaker 3: despise you. You're disgusting now. Maybe you could think that Valerie

1729
01:33:28,280 --> 01:33:32,280
Speaker 3: is I don't know, maybe covering up her feelings. Maybe

1730
01:33:32,280 --> 01:33:35,439
Speaker 3: that's not really how she feels, but I don't know.

1731
01:33:35,680 --> 01:33:37,479
Speaker 3: I take it as that there is some amount of

1732
01:33:37,600 --> 01:33:41,560
Speaker 3: magical coercion of some kind going on as she continues.

1733
01:33:41,600 --> 01:33:45,559
Speaker 3: She falls for the Countess after this, but there's like

1734
01:33:45,600 --> 01:33:48,400
Speaker 3: a similar arc to how she seems to fall for

1735
01:33:48,479 --> 01:33:51,640
Speaker 3: Stefan in the first place, and then there's a similarity

1736
01:33:51,800 --> 01:33:55,719
Speaker 3: when like by the end of the movie, Valerie first

1737
01:33:55,800 --> 01:33:59,320
Speaker 3: becomes the countess's new Ilona, and then she kills the

1738
01:33:59,360 --> 01:34:04,760
Speaker 3: countess becomes the new Countess herself. Yeah, so yeah, it

1739
01:34:04,760 --> 01:34:07,160
Speaker 3: almost it's kind of the sith lord thing right there.

1740
01:34:07,280 --> 01:34:10,360
Speaker 3: There are always two and then one kills the other. Yeah,

1741
01:34:10,479 --> 01:34:12,679
Speaker 3: it makes you wonder how many times this has happened

1742
01:34:12,680 --> 01:34:16,440
Speaker 3: as well. We since that the countess has killed many Elona's,

1743
01:34:16,479 --> 01:34:20,160
Speaker 3: but was the countess once some other countesses Ilona.

1744
01:34:20,680 --> 01:34:23,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a great point. That's a great point. And

1745
01:34:23,880 --> 01:34:25,680
Speaker 2: the magical coersion. I do want to come back to

1746
01:34:25,720 --> 01:34:29,400
Speaker 2: that scene where where they end up finally killing and

1747
01:34:29,439 --> 01:34:33,760
Speaker 2: feasting on stuff, and again we have the crystal the

1748
01:34:33,800 --> 01:34:36,639
Speaker 2: crystal glass that they press over his face. But also

1749
01:34:36,800 --> 01:34:38,960
Speaker 2: this is the sequence I believe where she's wearing that

1750
01:34:39,120 --> 01:34:43,680
Speaker 2: just magnificent sequin gown. It's like a disco ball and

1751
01:34:43,720 --> 01:34:46,080
Speaker 2: the light like they the way they lit this scene,

1752
01:34:46,120 --> 01:34:50,320
Speaker 2: like the light is just it's just just bouncing off

1753
01:34:50,360 --> 01:34:53,000
Speaker 2: of her, and you really get this sense that she

1754
01:34:53,240 --> 01:34:57,880
Speaker 2: is like this bewildering lamp. She is like a lighthouse

1755
01:34:58,640 --> 01:35:01,559
Speaker 2: that has completely and sore both of them. But also

1756
01:35:01,720 --> 01:35:03,879
Speaker 2: the movie is packed with mirrors.

1757
01:35:03,920 --> 01:35:08,200
Speaker 3: Almost almost every scene or every other scene has a mirror,

1758
01:35:08,200 --> 01:35:11,920
Speaker 3: and its constantly characters looking in mirrors or being across

1759
01:35:11,920 --> 01:35:14,559
Speaker 3: from mirrors. And in this final scene here with the

1760
01:35:14,600 --> 01:35:18,880
Speaker 3: three of them, the Countess becomes a mirror. It's like

1761
01:35:18,960 --> 01:35:22,400
Speaker 3: she her body is a disco ball mirror from top

1762
01:35:22,439 --> 01:35:25,479
Speaker 3: to bottom. It's reflecting all of delight, and it's reflecting them,

1763
01:35:26,080 --> 01:35:28,559
Speaker 3: And it's kind of that that she shows them what

1764
01:35:28,600 --> 01:35:29,559
Speaker 3: they are in a way.

1765
01:35:30,160 --> 01:35:32,720
Speaker 2: It's fabulous. Yeah, it's it is a great movie to

1766
01:35:33,439 --> 01:35:36,519
Speaker 2: read and reread. It has so many you know, like

1767
01:35:36,520 --> 01:35:38,280
Speaker 2: I say, it feels like it's speaking to you in

1768
01:35:38,320 --> 01:35:41,639
Speaker 2: some sort of a code and you're left to decipher

1769
01:35:41,680 --> 01:35:43,840
Speaker 2: it in your subsequent viewings and reviewings.

1770
01:35:44,280 --> 01:35:47,200
Speaker 3: Also, just I gotta throw it out there, the shot

1771
01:35:47,320 --> 01:35:50,880
Speaker 3: where they show her after her body gets thrown out

1772
01:35:50,920 --> 01:35:52,880
Speaker 3: of the car in the wreck and she's just hanging

1773
01:35:52,960 --> 01:35:53,960
Speaker 3: on that branch.

1774
01:35:54,000 --> 01:35:57,720
Speaker 2: It looks amazing. Yeah, yeahs as does that shot that

1775
01:35:57,720 --> 01:36:00,479
Speaker 2: we alluded to much earlier in the episode where she

1776
01:36:00,600 --> 01:36:03,559
Speaker 2: finally raises up her cape there on the beach. Oh yeah,

1777
01:36:03,600 --> 01:36:07,479
Speaker 2: and it's like she has bat wings, revealing her vampiric nature,

1778
01:36:07,520 --> 01:36:10,000
Speaker 2: at least to us the viewer, and it's just so

1779
01:36:10,000 --> 01:36:13,600
Speaker 2: splendid and yet to be clear. She's one of the

1780
01:36:13,640 --> 01:36:16,680
Speaker 2: villains of the piece, but you can't help but love

1781
01:36:16,680 --> 01:36:19,559
Speaker 2: her style. Is everybody a villain by the end? I

1782
01:36:19,600 --> 01:36:20,840
Speaker 2: think Valerie.

1783
01:36:20,520 --> 01:36:22,439
Speaker 3: Seems to be up to no good by the end.

1784
01:36:22,680 --> 01:36:26,680
Speaker 3: So the characters that don't start off villains become villains everyone.

1785
01:36:27,240 --> 01:36:30,000
Speaker 3: All four of our main characters have killed or tried

1786
01:36:30,040 --> 01:36:34,960
Speaker 3: to kill somebody. So yeah, nobody's completely squeaky clean here,

1787
01:36:35,000 --> 01:36:39,680
Speaker 3: are they? Just Pierre, Pierre, poor Pierre. Oh yeah, I

1788
01:36:39,800 --> 01:36:43,400
Speaker 3: like Pierre. Okay, well, I guess that's Daughters of Darkness.

1789
01:36:44,080 --> 01:36:45,800
Speaker 2: All right, we're gonna go and close it out here,

1790
01:36:45,800 --> 01:36:48,519
Speaker 2: but we'd love to hear everyone's thoughts on this picture.

1791
01:36:48,880 --> 01:36:53,519
Speaker 2: If you have the story about your history with Daughters

1792
01:36:53,520 --> 01:36:55,240
Speaker 2: of Darkness, if you have thoughts and some of the

1793
01:36:55,240 --> 01:36:57,080
Speaker 2: themes we've discussed here right in, we would love to

1794
01:36:57,120 --> 01:37:00,280
Speaker 2: hear from you. Let's see, just to remind her that stuff.

1795
01:37:00,280 --> 01:37:02,640
Speaker 2: To Blow Your Mind is primarily a science, science, and

1796
01:37:02,680 --> 01:37:05,400
Speaker 2: culture podcast, with core episodes on Tuesdays and Thursdays, but

1797
01:37:05,439 --> 01:37:07,720
Speaker 2: on Fridays we set aside most serious concerns to just

1798
01:37:07,720 --> 01:37:10,720
Speaker 2: talk about a weird film on Weird House Cinema as

1799
01:37:10,720 --> 01:37:13,439
Speaker 2: an experiment. Right now, we are also running Weird House

1800
01:37:13,439 --> 01:37:16,280
Speaker 2: Cinema as its own playlist, which means it will come

1801
01:37:16,400 --> 01:37:19,360
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1802
01:37:19,400 --> 01:37:22,439
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1803
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1804
01:37:24,760 --> 01:37:27,639
Speaker 2: and just get Weird House Cinema. So we're trying that out,

1805
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Speaker 2: So try it out, tell us what you think, what

1806
01:37:30,080 --> 01:37:32,559
Speaker 2: your thoughts are on it. Also, if you want to

1807
01:37:32,680 --> 01:37:36,639
Speaker 2: follow us on letterboxed, our username is weird House. Follow

1808
01:37:36,720 --> 01:37:38,360
Speaker 2: us there, take a look at all the films we've

1809
01:37:38,400 --> 01:37:40,240
Speaker 2: covered over the years, and sometimes a peek ahead at

1810
01:37:40,240 --> 01:37:41,960
Speaker 2: what comes next. Huge things.

1811
01:37:42,000 --> 01:37:45,519
Speaker 3: As always to our excellent audio producer JJ Posway. If

1812
01:37:45,560 --> 01:37:47,000
Speaker 3: you would like to get in touch with us with

1813
01:37:47,120 --> 01:37:49,479
Speaker 3: feedback on this episode or any other, to suggest a

1814
01:37:49,520 --> 01:37:51,920
Speaker 3: topic for the future, or just to say hello, you

1815
01:37:51,920 --> 01:37:54,680
Speaker 3: can email us at contact at stuff to Blow your

1816
01:37:54,720 --> 01:38:02,200
Speaker 3: Mind dot com.

1817
01:38:02,400 --> 01:38:05,360
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1818
01:38:05,439 --> 01:38:09,280
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1819
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