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Speaker 1: Before we get into today's conversation, I want to speak

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Speaker 1: directly to somebody listening. We're discussing a very heavy subject,

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Speaker 1: the subject suicide, and if any part of this finds

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Speaker 1: you or your coworkers, or your friends or your family

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Speaker 1: members in a dark place, I need you to hear me.

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Speaker 1: I need them to hear me. I need all the

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Speaker 1: world to hear me. You are not alone, and your

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Speaker 1: life it matters. Nearly forty nine thousand Americans die by

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Speaker 1: suicide every year, and almost eight out of ten, eight

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Speaker 1: out of ten of them are men. We've got a

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Speaker 1: problem that has to change, and it starts with you

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Speaker 1: reaching out, keeping your eyes open and looking for people

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Speaker 1: who are distant, or disenfranchised or at their witsy. And

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Speaker 1: what can you do? It's simple. You can call or

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Speaker 1: text nine eight eight. That's the Suicide and Crisis Lifeline.

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Speaker 1: Train people available right now to help you get through this.

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Speaker 1: Don't carry this by yourself. Talk to somebody you trust.

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Speaker 1: It can be a friend, it can be a pastor,

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Speaker 1: it can be a professional, it can be a neighbor.

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Speaker 1: But don't let all of that stay bottled up inside

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Speaker 1: of you. There is help, and there is hope.

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Speaker 2: We're sitting down at the table, and this is true story,

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Speaker 2: he says.

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Speaker 3: He said, I had.

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Speaker 2: A weird dream last night, and I'm sitting at the

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Speaker 2: table like just kind of out of it. He said,

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Speaker 2: I had a dream you want to kill me now?

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Speaker 2: And I looked at him. I said, you dream right,

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Speaker 2: And I said this anger that I have. Man, if

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Speaker 2: I don't figure this out like one of us, are

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Speaker 2: not gonna be your wife.

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Speaker 1: Welcome everybody. I wanna welcome you to my next chapter.

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Speaker 1: I am so glad and so excited to have this

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Speaker 1: opportunity to share with you. Uh gift to all of us,

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Speaker 1: a gift who has been wedged out of troubled trials

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Speaker 1: and tribulations and been able to use it to help people.

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Speaker 1: From the NFL rooms to locker rooms to courtrooms. He

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Speaker 1: has literally gone around the country helping men to heal.

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Speaker 1: And he did it in such a profound and provocative way.

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Speaker 1: Then I'm blessed to have an opportunity to share with him.

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Speaker 1: Would you welcome Brother J Barry? And how are you? Oh?

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Speaker 1: Why are you doing? Man? I'm good good, It's good

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Speaker 1: to see you. How you been doing good? Good? I'm

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Speaker 1: I'm finally finding my rhythm, finding rhythm, Yeah, yeah, chapter

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Speaker 1: number one, finding yourself? What does that mean?

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Speaker 2: And I shared with you I think last year and

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Speaker 2: I started working on the book Pursuing Pace, and the

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Speaker 2: acronym that I created for pace is Pathways to Alleviating

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Speaker 2: Cognitive Exhaustion. And for me, pursuing Pace was about finding

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Speaker 2: my rhythm and finding my flow, not necessarily just slowing down,

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Speaker 2: but understanding the cadence. For me, I was seeing clients

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Speaker 2: pre and during and post pandemic, and I probably saw

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Speaker 2: about over a thousand individuals from twenty to twenty two.

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Speaker 2: And finding my flow was hard at that time because

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Speaker 2: we were in a crisis. Yeah, and I was trying

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Speaker 2: to help others manage a christ A while I myself

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Speaker 2: was in a crisis. So finding my rhythm has really

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Speaker 2: a uh been about finding a speed that I am

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Speaker 2: not necessarily just comfortable with the speed that uh, it's

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Speaker 2: for the time that I'm in doing this.

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Speaker 1: You know, if you're a really good therapist, a really

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Speaker 1: good counselor people who open up their dirtiest, darkest linen

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Speaker 1: and share it with you, yeah, and walk away, and

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Speaker 1: there's a residence that sticks with you, stays with you. Uh,

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Speaker 1: you can't just shake it off and being different about it.

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Speaker 1: Your heart gets involved in it, your emotions get involved

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Speaker 1: in it. How do you how do you shake that off?

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Speaker 1: It's it's hard.

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Speaker 2: When I first started being a clinician, I can remember

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Speaker 2: some of the traumatic stories and some of the traumatic

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Speaker 2: things that I was hearing, and uh, you know, they

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Speaker 2: they don't teach you in school how to process that, uh,

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Speaker 2: because everyone is different.

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Speaker 4: Now.

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Speaker 2: Some people are entering the space and their reason for

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Speaker 2: becoming a therapist is personal. Some people, Uh, there's a

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Speaker 2: family member that have suffered with mental health issues and

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Speaker 2: now they have an affinity for.

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Speaker 3: It and they have a passion. It was.

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Speaker 2: It was challenging for me because I understood, I understood

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Speaker 2: the transference, uh, which is where you begin to take

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Speaker 2: on the client pain or trauma or the energy or

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Speaker 2: that exchange where the session is over, but the words

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Speaker 2: the the session still lingers.

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Speaker 1: Yes.

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Speaker 3: Uh.

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Speaker 2: For me, it was hard, bishop because I saw a

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Speaker 2: lot of myself and a lot of these.

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Speaker 1: Clients right right, a.

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Speaker 2: Lot of u uh moments where they were needing a

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Speaker 2: sounding board, they were needing a voice, and they were

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Speaker 2: needing somebody to understand. And here I was having this,

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Speaker 2: this this moment with them to understand, but then they

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Speaker 2: were going back home to people who didn't understand.

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Speaker 1: Right.

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Speaker 2: And this is why whenever I was working with teens

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Speaker 2: and working with young people, I often told the parents,

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Speaker 2: you just can't send a child to me and and

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Speaker 2: and and asked me to fix the child and then

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Speaker 2: send a child back into the environment that is continuously

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Speaker 2: to break them all in some way trigger them. So

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Speaker 2: everybody has to be a part of this journey.

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Speaker 1: It's hard not to trauma bon it.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, it's it's hard.

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Speaker 2: And and particularly when you feel them, it's almost like

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Speaker 2: when you give a message that not only speaks to

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Speaker 2: your congregation, but it's speaking to you at the same time.

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Speaker 1: You're preaching it right right, right, So I found myself

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Speaker 1: processing while I was practicing speaking a messages. I met

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Speaker 1: you through a message, Yeah, I can remember. I was

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Speaker 1: preaching that never met you before and seen you before. Uh,

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Speaker 1: let's show just a little clip of that. Yes, sir,

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Speaker 1: ye man right there, and you're here in the blue

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Speaker 1: T shirt. You're one of them.

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Speaker 5: That's when I'm preaching your God just talking me exactly

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Speaker 5: to you, and I don't know you and I don't

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Speaker 5: know anything about you. But as I'm preaching this like

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Speaker 5: it's like there's a couple between us, there's a link

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Speaker 5: between us, that God is talking to your head, that

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Speaker 5: this is a message for you. It's to speak into

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Speaker 5: your life and then too, your circumstances, into your situation.

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Speaker 5: And you don't have nobody to really talk to your head.

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Speaker 5: And this is a moment between you and I and

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Speaker 5: I can feel God feeding you on another level.

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Speaker 6: And I don't know who you are, but the hand

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Speaker 6: of the Lord hasn't a gender for your life and

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Speaker 6: a plan for your life. How they knew your head,

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Speaker 6: nort thing of the Lord God, how they knew you.

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Speaker 6: I got to get to you. I got to get

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Speaker 6: to you. And I got to get to you. I

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Speaker 6: got to get to you. I got to get to you.

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Speaker 6: I got to pray to you. I got to pray

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Speaker 6: for you. The hand of the Lord be all over

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Speaker 6: you and over your life and over your sunset.

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Speaker 1: What was that like for you? Take your down, Oh man, Bishop,

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Speaker 1: I was man, I was at one of the hardest,

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Speaker 1: most difficult stage in my life. And I'm trying to

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Speaker 1: hold back these tears. It's okay, Friendish a friend of

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Speaker 1: mine had had.

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Speaker 2: I just went up. I just went through a public

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Speaker 2: break up and man, it was it was Man, it

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Speaker 2: did a number on me. And a friend of mine

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Speaker 2: who would tenage your church.

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Speaker 3: Said, I was.

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Speaker 2: I was living in Houston, and they said, you need

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Speaker 2: to come to church, you need to get up here.

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Speaker 2: So I got a plane ticket and flew up here.

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Speaker 2: I was just like, alright, just got a hotel room.

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Speaker 2: It's just like I'm I. It's like, I just feel like,

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Speaker 2: you need to be here, you need to bish you

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Speaker 2: got a word for you. You know, you hear people say that,

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Speaker 2: but you know, it's just when you're in a dark space,

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Speaker 2: you know, it just sounds cliche, like, yeah, you know

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Speaker 2: you're looking for something, so yeah, it's easy for somebody

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Speaker 2: to say, oh, there's a word for you. And were

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Speaker 2: walking the church that day and I didn't.

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Speaker 3: Know they were sitting there close.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 2: I was expected to go up in the in the

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Speaker 2: balcony and and they was like, no, we're sitting right here.

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Speaker 2: I said, oh, wow, y'all got good cease and I

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Speaker 2: began to sit down and I can feel the weight

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Speaker 2: of what I was going through and experiencing in real time.

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Speaker 2: And I think the message that day was the story

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Speaker 2: of Joseph that you was preaching about. And and I

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Speaker 2: think was it the Prince and the Pit or something

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Speaker 2: like that, Yeah, the Prince in the pit and that

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Speaker 2: I it's just to step back into that moment.

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Speaker 3: There was a lady that was standing in front of me,

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Speaker 3: and she was.

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Speaker 1: Standing up and I hope she doesn't see this, because

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Speaker 1: I was just like, lady, please sit down.

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Speaker 2: I'm trying to hear this word. Because I felt like

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Speaker 2: you were talking directly to me and we had locked

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Speaker 2: eyes and and as you were talking, I mean, it

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Speaker 2: was like I was feeling like Joseph. I felt like

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Speaker 2: I had been thrown into this this cave and and

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Speaker 2: been left, you know, uh to die. And when you

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Speaker 2: started speaking, I I was it was almost like it

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Speaker 2: was uh. The moment was surreal, yeah, because I was

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Speaker 2: like man, and and they was hitting me like no,

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Speaker 2: he's talking to you and I and I was just like,

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Speaker 2: I said, is this happening?

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Speaker 3: Yeah?

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Speaker 2: And and it didn't really register until you walked up

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Speaker 2: on me and begin praying for me, because I I

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Speaker 2: came to to get away, so I was called I

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Speaker 2: called myself hiding. Yeah, and and God found I. I

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Speaker 2: to this day, man, I still I. I replayed that

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Speaker 2: video several times a year, uh, to encourage myself, because

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Speaker 2: I said, Wow, God, you have a way of finding us.

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Speaker 1: Yes, in our darkest moments. You've been around me long

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Speaker 1: enough to know I don't do that all the time. Uh.

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Speaker 1: It felt like a metal to magnet. Uh. There was

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Speaker 1: just a pull I couldn't get away from. And Uh,

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Speaker 1: the Lord just tucked up my heart to call you out.

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Speaker 1: And I almost felt like an emergency. Uh. I felt

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Speaker 1: like it was a crisis and that I had to

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Speaker 1: do it right then. And so I didn't basically stopped

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Speaker 1: what I was preaching, and when went after you and

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Speaker 1: watch God touch touch your heart, tout your life. Yea,

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Speaker 1: it was a powerful, powerful moment, you know, never knowing

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Speaker 1: that you would end up here. Yeah, never knowing that

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Speaker 1: you would end up here and God would pick up

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Speaker 1: the pieces of your life and put it back together again.

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Speaker 1: That's not a one stop shop getting to that place,

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Speaker 1: is it. You go through a lot of changes and

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Speaker 1: setbacks and relapses getting to that place. Can you talk

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Speaker 1: about what a struggle it is to get to wholeness? H.

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Speaker 2: I think we were talking what's the name Carolyn the

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Speaker 2: preacher and yeah, and you talked about you know, what

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Speaker 2: did it call her to get there? Uh, to be

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Speaker 2: where she was? And what I think about is picking

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Speaker 2: up the pieces. Man, it cost you everything. It cost you,

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Speaker 2: uh not only your old self, but it cost you

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Speaker 2: to make new decisions.

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Speaker 1: The doctor Oliver Slack uh who uh is a neurologist.

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Speaker 2: And he wrote this book, uh back in twenty twelve

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Speaker 2: about a hallucination, and he's he talks about the complexities

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Speaker 2: of the brain and the mind and trying to decipher

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Speaker 2: on the perception and what is real and what it's not,

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Speaker 2: but what you believe. And he has this quote that

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Speaker 2: uh says, we see with our eyes, but we also

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Speaker 2: see with our brain as well. And it's hard to

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Speaker 2: pick up the pieces when what you remember keeps replaying

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Speaker 2: over and over in your head. And for the childhood Trumer,

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Speaker 2: being the son of a pastor and having endured so

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Speaker 2: much physical abuse after my mom re married to my

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Speaker 2: uh stepdad at the time, and just constantly feeling like,

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Speaker 2: you know, when am I'm going to be able to

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Speaker 2: have uh some understanding of life.

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Speaker 1: So you were the son of a pastor and it's

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Speaker 1: your biological FABLEM yes, sir. Then your mother remarried. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: another preacher, another preacher, another preacher. Oh god, yeah yeah.

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Speaker 1: And he gave me a tough time. Yeah yeah. Did

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Speaker 1: that make you bitter? It made me more angry and bitter.

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Speaker 1: I had a lot of angry issues, a lot of

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Speaker 1: angry issues.

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Speaker 2: And one of my books, Hello Kine, I talked about

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Speaker 2: almost took his life. And he would sleep one night

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Speaker 2: on the couch and I came out of my bedroom

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Speaker 2: and I had this trophy that had a very sharp

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Speaker 2: end on it, and he was just sleeping and I

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Speaker 2: was stood over him with the trophy and my plan

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Speaker 2: at the time was just to come down on his

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Speaker 2: chest and just and don't stop.

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Speaker 3: And I'm standing.

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Speaker 2: There, I'm for fourteen, fourteen, fifteen years old, and and

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Speaker 2: I'm just watching him breathe, and all I can think

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Speaker 2: about is what I was doing. Because at night he

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Speaker 2: would come in the room and his it's h he

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Speaker 2: he had this whole thing about he wanted to make

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Speaker 2: me tough, and as if I wasn't tough enough already,

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Speaker 2: so you know, his whole thing was, you know, this

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Speaker 2: physical just it was always just you know, just beating

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Speaker 2: on me, hitting on me. And so this night I

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Speaker 2: was like, man, I'm sick of it. And I go

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Speaker 2: to come down and literally there's a force or something

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Speaker 2: where I can't follow through.

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Speaker 1: I cannot follow through and it was just almost.

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Speaker 2: Like like I couldn't follow through, and so I I

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Speaker 2: dropped the trophy and and went back in the bedroom

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Speaker 2: and just cried. And the next day We're sitting down

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Speaker 2: at the table and this is.

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Speaker 3: This is true s story, he says.

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Speaker 2: He says, I had a d weird dream last night,

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Speaker 2: and I'm sitting at the table like just kind of

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Speaker 2: out of it.

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Speaker 1: He said, I had a dream you wanted to kill me, man, And.

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Speaker 3: I looked at him.

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Speaker 2: I said, you dream right, And I said this anger

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Speaker 2: that I have, man, if I don't figure this out,

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Speaker 2: like one of us is not gonna be around. And

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Speaker 2: I left and so I moved in UH with UH

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Speaker 2: some family friends. UH a ga kid that I met

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Speaker 2: when we moved to Texas, and I stayed with his

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Speaker 2: UH family for the.

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Speaker 3: Duration of my high school years.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, I I had a lot of anger, and

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Speaker 2: and it took cause I battled so much with rejection

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Speaker 2: because I I desired my father's love, and I desired

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Speaker 2: to be fathered, you know, because I knew that when

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Speaker 2: my parents' divorces, I knew that if I didn't have

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Speaker 2: any guidance, I knew that I was not going to.

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Speaker 3: Find my way.

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Speaker 2: And that's why whenever I watched that video, it always

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Speaker 2: confirmed that God had a plan.

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Speaker 3: Even when I didn't understand my pain.

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Speaker 1: It always confirms to me that I lost a lot

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Speaker 1: of weight. Chapter number two, we're going to deal with

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Speaker 1: letting go of anger. When you talk about rage, and

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Speaker 1: it's not uncommon, rage is the safest emotion for us

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Speaker 1: to express. We almost get permission to be angry, not

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Speaker 1: to cry, not to hurt, not to love, not to

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Speaker 1: be confused, not to be perplexed, but be angry all

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Speaker 1: you want. That's on the street, you know, in the club,

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Speaker 1: anywhere you take that. That's almost considered masculine. How did

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Speaker 1: you begin to get rid of that rage? Man, I

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Speaker 1: could tell you this, it didn't. Uh. You know, Bishop,

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Speaker 1: It's interesting, right because just think about this.

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Speaker 2: How many people come down to the altar and they

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Speaker 2: come from prayer, and they come because your word or

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Speaker 2: the word that God has given you has in some

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Speaker 2: way touched their heart, It's moved them. And I can

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Speaker 2: remember praying about my anger but still having issues with it.

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Speaker 2: And you know, I talked about as I talk about,

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Speaker 2: you know, surviving to suicide, attempting the work that I

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Speaker 2: do with men. But for me, the anger was also

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Speaker 2: having an understanding what was the genesis of it, like

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Speaker 2: where did this anger start from? And working through my

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Speaker 2: anger was also working through what made me angry. And

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Speaker 2: I think a lot of men don't know what they're

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Speaker 2: angry about or who they're angry. They know that there

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Speaker 2: is something that I'm mad about, but it's like who

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Speaker 2: is it?

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Speaker 3: Is it Dad? The uncle? Is it? The aunt? Who

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Speaker 3: is it?

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Speaker 2: And when I was in therapy and the.

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Speaker 3: Journey was very unique.

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Speaker 2: I don't know if you saw the film Anton Fisher

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Speaker 2: with Denzel and Denzels is a psychiatrist and he's talking

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Speaker 2: to Anton and it's like about three or four sessions

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Speaker 2: where he really gets Anton to open up.

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Speaker 3: My experience was the same.

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Speaker 2: And when he began to ask me about my father,

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Speaker 2: I saw that thing just like it broke because in

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Speaker 2: that moment, what I realized is that I had spent

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Speaker 2: most of my life even the reason why I pursued.

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Speaker 2: Football was like I wanted to show him that I

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Speaker 2: can become without him to show him. But then also

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Speaker 2: football was a place where I can express my anger

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Speaker 2: without any repercussions. I can be as violid as I

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Speaker 2: wanted to be. I can be you know as I mean,

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Speaker 2: you can hit people. You ain't gonna jail because I

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Speaker 2: I had an Understanding's like you can't do this in

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Speaker 2: the streets, y, but I hear you put this helmet on,

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Speaker 2: I can run through you.

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Speaker 3: I mean it.

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Speaker 2: It was that thing, and then it gave me such satisfaction.

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Speaker 2: And and I can remember playing games where I never

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Speaker 2: saw an opponent. I would often see my father's face.

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Speaker 2: I would often see my stepdad face. I would often

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Speaker 2: see my aunt face, who I had a very traumatic

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Speaker 2: experience with. And so when I start to deal with

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Speaker 2: what made me angry, that allowed me to begin processing

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Speaker 2: and began asking myself what about this that made you angry?

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Speaker 2: And I think sometimes we don't have the space, but

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Speaker 2: that is men because you know, society want us to

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Speaker 2: be ready. It's like you don't have time to heal,

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Speaker 2: Like in fact, you know, whatever your issues are, deal

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Speaker 2: with them as you are working and making money right,

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Speaker 2: you know, you know, and so that is what I

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Speaker 2: hope men understand that they have the right to explore

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Speaker 2: where they angry, where they're angry stems from, and not

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Speaker 2: avoid it.

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Speaker 1: Well. You know, there's an old movie. I don't know

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Speaker 1: whether you saw it or not. Lynn Whitfield was in it.

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Speaker 1: It's called It's a Thin Line Between Levels Mardin Lawrens. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: one of my favorites. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think as

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Speaker 1: long as you have hate, it is the disappointed side

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Speaker 1: of love. And it is so intense because really you

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Speaker 1: it's like you said about football. I was trying to

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Speaker 1: show him. I was trying to prove that's still that's

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Speaker 1: still that love connection, that that idolatry almost of winning

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Speaker 1: him over. Have you ever confronted him? No?

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Speaker 2: And I think to confront him in some way I feel,

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Speaker 2: I know, I you know, I I I battle with

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Speaker 2: confronting and and and rather than confront, I think more

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Speaker 2: about confiding because I think that's a part of him

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Speaker 2: that I understand that generation because of the work that

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Speaker 2: I've done. You know, men that are fifty plus man,

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Speaker 2: guys came from a different generation, you know what I mean,

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Speaker 2: the generation is different in well, and I think for her,

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Speaker 2: I think confronting her, she was willing to open, you know.

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Speaker 2: And I think even when in a therapeutic process, when

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Speaker 2: families are trying to get you know, well, we got

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Speaker 2: to get John in here.

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Speaker 3: We need to get John to see before the intervention

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Speaker 3: take place.

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Speaker 2: Right, They tried to create a space where John is open,

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Speaker 2: where he can't run, and I think for me to

382
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Speaker 2: do that with him would have to be in a

383
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Speaker 2: space where he can't run, and not in a physical space,

384
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Speaker 2: but in a space where he can't run emotionally, because

385
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Speaker 2: there's also this dissonance that I know that's there, that's

386
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Speaker 2: from his childhood, which allows me to give grace and

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00:24:02,080 --> 00:24:06,639
Speaker 2: to extended grace. And moving to Dallas allowed me and

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Speaker 2: my mother to sort of walk and and and and

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Speaker 2: unites too where she was also seeing a son who

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Speaker 2: had evarved beyond his pain. Because I was gone for

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Speaker 2: about fifteen years, So when I came back to Dallas,

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Speaker 2: when we reconnected, I just moved back to the area.

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Speaker 3: Uh.

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Speaker 2: She was no longer looking at the little boy. She

395
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Speaker 2: was now looking at the man who had turned his

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Speaker 2: pain into work. And so he has to watch it

397
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Speaker 2: from a distance, and I know that there are there

398
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Speaker 2: are parts of him that probably bear some shame, and

399
00:24:49,800 --> 00:24:57,400
Speaker 2: so I'm a bit careful and understanding that it may

400
00:24:57,440 --> 00:25:01,480
Speaker 2: be tender. Now here's the thing. My sister has that

401
00:25:01,560 --> 00:25:07,600
Speaker 2: with him, and and and I would love to hear

402
00:25:07,640 --> 00:25:08,880
Speaker 2: your thought, because.

403
00:25:10,359 --> 00:25:11,840
Speaker 3: Nobody talks about when.

404
00:25:11,800 --> 00:25:17,119
Speaker 2: The relationships are different with the children and the different

405
00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:21,960
Speaker 2: and then too wherever that child fell. You know, I'm

406
00:25:22,000 --> 00:25:25,600
Speaker 2: the oldest, so I'm always looked at all. Jay got it,

407
00:25:26,119 --> 00:25:29,959
Speaker 2: and but I understand that his relationship with my sisters

408
00:25:30,000 --> 00:25:33,800
Speaker 2: is a lot different. And I've embraced that because he

409
00:25:33,960 --> 00:25:37,920
Speaker 2: opens up to them. I mean, they'll call it. They'll

410
00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:40,160
Speaker 2: tell me it's like, man, Dad is like so proud

411
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Speaker 2: of you.

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Speaker 1: Man.

413
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Speaker 3: He was saying this is saying that. I said, Well,

414
00:25:42,359 --> 00:25:45,440
Speaker 3: he saying that to me. But but there's.

415
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Speaker 1: As it's not a weight that comes with that.

416
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Speaker 2: He didn't say it to me. I get it now

417
00:25:51,160 --> 00:25:56,720
Speaker 2: because when he didn't get what he was unable to

418
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Speaker 2: give to me. I understand why he likes the emotional competency.

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Speaker 1: I noticed when you talk to your mother, she has

420
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Speaker 1: trouble expressing verbally her emotions. She can do it, but

421
00:26:12,920 --> 00:26:15,440
Speaker 1: she has to work at it. I imagine your father

422
00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:21,439
Speaker 1: is even harder than that. You can't live in a

423
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Speaker 1: house like that and not adopt some of that deafness,

424
00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:34,399
Speaker 1: that inability, that tone deafness to emotional language. Have you

425
00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:37,960
Speaker 1: have you ever told him you loved it? Yeah?

426
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Speaker 3: Yeah?

427
00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:40,719
Speaker 1: Was it hard for me?

428
00:26:40,840 --> 00:26:42,760
Speaker 3: No? Yeah, no, it wasn't hard.

429
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Speaker 1: Is it hard for you to express emotions? No?

430
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Speaker 2: No, I've gotten so much better at it. It was

431
00:26:49,760 --> 00:26:52,720
Speaker 2: before I begin therapy, before doing the work.

432
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Speaker 1: Yeah, therapy for you was getting emotional language.

433
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Speaker 2: Yeah, as most men, they don't have it right. Yeah, yeah,

434
00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:03,200
Speaker 2: they don't have it, and we don't have it because

435
00:27:03,240 --> 00:27:05,600
Speaker 2: we're not giving that as boys.

436
00:27:06,600 --> 00:27:08,560
Speaker 3: You know, when what.

437
00:27:08,840 --> 00:27:13,120
Speaker 2: People don't realize, when you're told to be quiet, that

438
00:27:14,320 --> 00:27:20,720
Speaker 2: develops again that dissonance, that lack of agreement between what

439
00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:25,280
Speaker 2: how you should feel as a human and when I

440
00:27:25,320 --> 00:27:28,600
Speaker 2: am told to be quiet. I am training my brain,

441
00:27:28,840 --> 00:27:34,159
Speaker 2: I am training my body. I'm training my mind to

442
00:27:34,720 --> 00:27:37,879
Speaker 2: not find any agreement with what I sense or feel,

443
00:27:38,280 --> 00:27:40,480
Speaker 2: Which is why when men come into therapy, when I'm

444
00:27:40,480 --> 00:27:42,359
Speaker 2: working with them, I have to take them through the

445
00:27:42,400 --> 00:27:45,960
Speaker 2: emotional chart because anger is what most of us know,

446
00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:48,680
Speaker 2: and as you know that's a low hanging fruit, right

447
00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:52,160
Speaker 2: and so and and helping them to understand is that

448
00:27:52,400 --> 00:27:54,840
Speaker 2: what if this anger is not really anger, and it's

449
00:27:54,840 --> 00:27:56,359
Speaker 2: really disappointment.

450
00:27:56,320 --> 00:27:59,400
Speaker 1: Right right, you know you're really.

451
00:28:00,800 --> 00:28:05,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's really the disappointment that dad didn't come pick

452
00:28:05,400 --> 00:28:08,280
Speaker 2: you up, dad didn't come to the game, or mom

453
00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:13,320
Speaker 2: didn't hold you, uh and comfort you. In fact, where

454
00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:17,520
Speaker 2: you should have been sort of cuddled with love, she

455
00:28:17,720 --> 00:28:22,240
Speaker 2: sort of created this very callous and very harsh exterior.

456
00:28:22,560 --> 00:28:25,800
Speaker 2: So it makes it difficult for you to express verbally.

457
00:28:25,920 --> 00:28:29,280
Speaker 2: So when the woman says, or anyone says, what's wrong,

458
00:28:30,040 --> 00:28:33,400
Speaker 2: I don't know. I'm good or I don't know because

459
00:28:33,440 --> 00:28:34,240
Speaker 2: they don't have the langes.

460
00:28:35,640 --> 00:28:41,680
Speaker 1: Was he one of those people who express love by provision? Yeah?

461
00:28:41,720 --> 00:28:44,480
Speaker 2: Absolutely, yeah, yeah, you know, I grew up in Mississippi,

462
00:28:44,520 --> 00:28:50,080
Speaker 2: so a lot of those men, you know, my grandfather's SHARECROPPERSPI,

463
00:28:50,400 --> 00:28:54,120
Speaker 2: So you know, they they they show love through telling

464
00:28:54,120 --> 00:28:55,000
Speaker 2: you ate them lights on.

465
00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:58,840
Speaker 1: Right right right right, you got food, refrigerator. I love

466
00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:02,760
Speaker 1: you boy, right right right right. That's love. That's all

467
00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:06,680
Speaker 1: you're gonna get. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I tried not to

468
00:29:06,760 --> 00:29:10,120
Speaker 1: do that with my children. I think it's very very important.

469
00:29:10,440 --> 00:29:14,120
Speaker 1: But I think you get better with your grand I

470
00:29:14,120 --> 00:29:18,080
Speaker 1: think you love your grandchildren the way you should have

471
00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:21,880
Speaker 1: loved your children, because by then you've gotten old enough

472
00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:26,560
Speaker 1: and you feel safe enough to express verbally, and you

473
00:29:26,680 --> 00:29:30,239
Speaker 1: have time enough, and the house is paid for and

474
00:29:30,280 --> 00:29:34,400
Speaker 1: the kids went through school because most back in our day,

475
00:29:35,080 --> 00:29:38,520
Speaker 1: the man was the breadwinner. So he had to make

476
00:29:38,640 --> 00:29:42,680
Speaker 1: bread for everybody. Yeah, okay, and he had to make

477
00:29:42,760 --> 00:29:51,040
Speaker 1: bread through racism, poor education, hardships, being called a boy

478
00:29:51,120 --> 00:29:55,440
Speaker 1: at work. He was enraged by some of the things

479
00:29:55,440 --> 00:29:58,400
Speaker 1: he had to take in order to bring home the bread.

480
00:29:58,560 --> 00:30:01,520
Speaker 1: So the bread seemed like because don't you know what

481
00:30:01,560 --> 00:30:05,080
Speaker 1: I went through to bring this bread on you see,

482
00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:07,600
Speaker 1: So he has that kind of feeling and no, you

483
00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:10,560
Speaker 1: don't know what he went through to bring the red home.

484
00:30:10,600 --> 00:30:12,719
Speaker 1: You just know he brought home some bread and you

485
00:30:12,760 --> 00:30:17,080
Speaker 1: thought it came easy. And he's wanting to be appreciated

486
00:30:18,560 --> 00:30:22,960
Speaker 1: for something he didn't even he didn't even see. He

487
00:30:23,680 --> 00:30:31,200
Speaker 1: didn't even see chapter number three, ending the pain when

488
00:30:31,240 --> 00:30:37,440
Speaker 1: you had those moments of suicide. Let's dig into that

489
00:30:37,520 --> 00:30:42,040
Speaker 1: because we the stats say that there's an overwhelming percentage

490
00:30:42,160 --> 00:30:46,280
Speaker 1: of men that commits suicide, much more so than women.

491
00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:54,600
Speaker 1: Were you trying to kill what had happened, or were

492
00:30:54,640 --> 00:30:59,520
Speaker 1: you trying to kill the hope of anything ever happening,

493
00:30:59,560 --> 00:31:02,560
Speaker 1: because they can be pain too. The hope of the

494
00:31:02,600 --> 00:31:05,800
Speaker 1: hope of something happening means you have to be optimistic,

495
00:31:06,400 --> 00:31:08,760
Speaker 1: and you start not to believe that it's possible.

496
00:31:09,600 --> 00:31:10,800
Speaker 3: I was trying to end the pain.

497
00:31:11,400 --> 00:31:11,760
Speaker 1: Uh.

498
00:31:11,840 --> 00:31:12,040
Speaker 3: Yeah.

499
00:31:12,040 --> 00:31:14,640
Speaker 2: The first time I slipped my wrist, it was like

500
00:31:14,680 --> 00:31:18,880
Speaker 2: twenty one, twenty two after I didn't get drafted. Quick story.

501
00:31:20,600 --> 00:31:24,000
Speaker 2: I was at church, Okay, on my draft day. It's

502
00:31:24,080 --> 00:31:28,520
Speaker 2: two thousand and three April. I wanna say twenty first,

503
00:31:28,600 --> 00:31:31,480
Speaker 2: I'm like, and I was up in the balcony. If

504
00:31:31,520 --> 00:31:35,080
Speaker 2: you were facing the congregation, I'm up to your left.

505
00:31:35,360 --> 00:31:36,280
Speaker 2: I'll never forget it.

506
00:31:36,360 --> 00:31:36,680
Speaker 3: Bishop.

507
00:31:37,320 --> 00:31:40,200
Speaker 2: You prease a message called potholes on the road. Yea

508
00:31:40,240 --> 00:31:44,480
Speaker 2: to success, Yes, sir, my phone ring at the moment

509
00:31:44,640 --> 00:31:51,000
Speaker 2: you saw your texts, and my agent says, I think

510
00:31:51,400 --> 00:31:53,240
Speaker 2: we're gonna have to settle for a re a free

511
00:31:53,240 --> 00:31:53,840
Speaker 2: agent deal.

512
00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:55,160
Speaker 3: You're not gonna get drafted.

513
00:31:55,920 --> 00:31:59,760
Speaker 2: And of course, you know, I go and through the

514
00:31:59,800 --> 00:32:03,160
Speaker 2: whole football thing, and and when I got sent home,

515
00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:06,560
Speaker 2: it was probably the most painful experience.

516
00:32:07,600 --> 00:32:08,120
Speaker 1: Because it.

517
00:32:08,360 --> 00:32:10,640
Speaker 3: They they never said that I couldn't play it.

518
00:32:10,800 --> 00:32:13,600
Speaker 1: I just didn't fit their system.

519
00:32:13,640 --> 00:32:19,000
Speaker 2: But what I heard was that I didn't fit and

520
00:32:19,080 --> 00:32:21,560
Speaker 2: that took me back to Dad.

521
00:32:22,360 --> 00:32:22,920
Speaker 3: And this is.

522
00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:28,480
Speaker 2: Why when I'm helping men understand what their emotions are

523
00:32:28,520 --> 00:32:34,400
Speaker 2: connected to, it's so vital to their healing. Because they

524
00:32:34,480 --> 00:32:36,680
Speaker 2: never said I couldn't play football. I just didn't fit

525
00:32:36,720 --> 00:32:39,960
Speaker 2: the system, right, But I heard something different through pain.

526
00:32:40,800 --> 00:32:43,480
Speaker 2: So the first time I slipped my wrists and the

527
00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:47,560
Speaker 2: second time I was living with my godmother. So now

528
00:32:47,800 --> 00:32:50,800
Speaker 2: as we know most men, the majority of them that

529
00:32:50,840 --> 00:32:54,760
Speaker 2: die by suicide are by the way, the use.

530
00:32:54,680 --> 00:32:56,000
Speaker 1: Of a firearm.

531
00:32:56,160 --> 00:32:59,560
Speaker 2: Now this is how I know God is real because

532
00:32:59,640 --> 00:33:03,080
Speaker 2: had I've been living by myself, I would definitely use

533
00:33:03,120 --> 00:33:05,880
Speaker 2: a fire arm, But because I was living with her

534
00:33:06,600 --> 00:33:11,560
Speaker 2: overdose on pills, because I did not want that scene

535
00:33:12,160 --> 00:33:14,800
Speaker 2: to be left in her head, because if I could

536
00:33:14,840 --> 00:33:18,400
Speaker 2: go through this overdose, it wasn't messy.

537
00:33:19,800 --> 00:33:22,800
Speaker 1: And for me, I was trying to end the pain.

538
00:33:24,000 --> 00:33:26,120
Speaker 2: And I think what happened with most of us as

539
00:33:26,200 --> 00:33:31,040
Speaker 2: men is that the pain becomes so unbearable that you

540
00:33:31,120 --> 00:33:33,200
Speaker 2: take your life. I don't think most of us are

541
00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:35,840
Speaker 2: trying to die but we're trying to end the pain,

542
00:33:36,800 --> 00:33:39,760
Speaker 2: and of course by ending the pain you in your

543
00:33:39,800 --> 00:33:40,920
Speaker 2: life too, which.

544
00:33:40,760 --> 00:33:43,600
Speaker 3: Is also right, this sort.

545
00:33:43,320 --> 00:33:52,880
Speaker 1: Of yeah, I don't want her to have this scene. Okay,

546
00:33:53,000 --> 00:34:00,760
Speaker 1: So you're loving her okay and hating you absolutely, yeah,

547
00:34:00,800 --> 00:34:03,120
Speaker 1: all at the same at the same time. And I

548
00:34:03,120 --> 00:34:06,880
Speaker 1: think sometimes it's easy to get to the point that

549
00:34:08,160 --> 00:34:10,560
Speaker 1: it's easier to love other people than it is to

550
00:34:10,640 --> 00:34:14,160
Speaker 1: love yourself. Absolutely. A lot of people who get into

551
00:34:14,640 --> 00:34:19,960
Speaker 1: social services, ministry, human services, whatever it is a lot

552
00:34:19,960 --> 00:34:22,319
Speaker 1: of times they're giving away to other people what they

553
00:34:22,320 --> 00:34:23,120
Speaker 1: wish they had.

554
00:34:22,960 --> 00:34:28,160
Speaker 2: Them absolutely bitious, yeah, yeah, yeah. What I get on

555
00:34:28,280 --> 00:34:32,279
Speaker 2: what I give to them brothers on stage, man, is.

556
00:34:33,800 --> 00:34:34,920
Speaker 3: Everything that I wanted.

557
00:34:35,160 --> 00:34:36,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah.

558
00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:41,560
Speaker 2: And an uncle and a father and a brother. Because

559
00:34:41,680 --> 00:34:47,279
Speaker 2: I was surrounded by men. My father has seven brothers.

560
00:34:48,360 --> 00:34:52,520
Speaker 2: I was surrounded by men, and no one never said, nephew,

561
00:34:52,560 --> 00:34:55,520
Speaker 2: we're gonna take you, and we're gonna guide you, and

562
00:34:55,560 --> 00:35:00,239
Speaker 2: we're gonna So when I get on stage and get

563
00:35:00,239 --> 00:35:03,200
Speaker 2: to pour into these men, there's a part of me

564
00:35:03,880 --> 00:35:10,520
Speaker 2: that is healed all over again. And I'm humble that

565
00:35:10,600 --> 00:35:13,600
Speaker 2: God chose me to do this work because I often

566
00:35:13,640 --> 00:35:19,200
Speaker 2: think if I wasn't seen during the pandemic, and I

567
00:35:19,200 --> 00:35:25,880
Speaker 2: think I did a video on men grieving that went viral,

568
00:35:26,480 --> 00:35:29,080
Speaker 2: and I think about if I wasn't open, and had

569
00:35:29,080 --> 00:35:30,920
Speaker 2: I not gone back to school, and had I not

570
00:35:31,000 --> 00:35:34,400
Speaker 2: done these things, because even all these things was really

571
00:35:35,520 --> 00:35:38,920
Speaker 2: a God thing. I was sitting in my office training

572
00:35:39,000 --> 00:35:41,759
Speaker 2: athletes and the spirit of Lord came to me and said,

573
00:35:41,840 --> 00:35:44,719
Speaker 2: go back to school. This is in twenty fifteen. Go

574
00:35:44,800 --> 00:35:48,319
Speaker 2: back to school. Something is coming. I was volunteering at

575
00:35:48,320 --> 00:35:51,360
Speaker 2: a group home, helping them out, doing their programs, and

576
00:35:51,400 --> 00:35:54,200
Speaker 2: the lady said, you doing the work of a therapist.

577
00:35:54,760 --> 00:35:56,959
Speaker 2: You ever thought about going back to school? I said, nah,

578
00:35:57,080 --> 00:35:59,160
Speaker 2: I'm thirty three years old. I'm going back to no school.

579
00:36:00,560 --> 00:36:02,200
Speaker 2: I got a bashelor that that's gonna have to do.

580
00:36:03,040 --> 00:36:05,440
Speaker 2: And I was in my office and God came in there.

581
00:36:05,480 --> 00:36:08,200
Speaker 2: He said something is coming. And that was twenty fifteen,

582
00:36:08,600 --> 00:36:15,799
Speaker 2: and five years later the pandemic hit, and there my

583
00:36:15,960 --> 00:36:20,560
Speaker 2: voice was emerging as it's black male therapist after the

584
00:36:20,800 --> 00:36:26,360
Speaker 2: George Floyd passion because we were experiencing so much secondary

585
00:36:26,400 --> 00:36:28,360
Speaker 2: trauma and no one could really break it down. And

586
00:36:29,640 --> 00:36:31,839
Speaker 2: I knew that God had called me to do a work,

587
00:36:31,880 --> 00:36:33,760
Speaker 2: but I didn't know that. But then this is also

588
00:36:33,840 --> 00:36:38,400
Speaker 2: two years after the video twenty eighteen July first, and

589
00:36:38,440 --> 00:36:41,280
Speaker 2: I'm like, well, god, I don't. And in that moment,

590
00:36:42,320 --> 00:36:46,320
Speaker 2: people were like, man, Bishop, call you out. There's something

591
00:36:46,320 --> 00:36:49,279
Speaker 2: on your life. He don't do that often. And what

592
00:36:49,600 --> 00:36:52,719
Speaker 2: people didn't understand is like, I've heard all my life

593
00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:56,600
Speaker 2: Bishop that I was chosen. But and people said, well

594
00:36:56,640 --> 00:36:58,000
Speaker 2: have you heard that? Why would you want to take

595
00:36:58,000 --> 00:36:59,960
Speaker 2: your life because I didn't know what I was chosen for?

596
00:37:00,440 --> 00:37:04,680
Speaker 1: Right, that's the battle in the conundrum for most of

597
00:37:04,760 --> 00:37:07,239
Speaker 1: us who are gifted and that are called You have

598
00:37:07,360 --> 00:37:09,960
Speaker 1: people that know that there's something unique about it, but

599
00:37:10,040 --> 00:37:11,080
Speaker 1: what about it?

600
00:37:11,440 --> 00:37:14,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, if nobody is helping guide you and there isn't

601
00:37:14,840 --> 00:37:18,040
Speaker 2: a blueprint or there isn't a you that comes along, I.

602
00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:21,760
Speaker 1: Would have never known. I tell you often, my favorite

603
00:37:21,800 --> 00:37:25,080
Speaker 1: message that I listened to every.

604
00:37:24,719 --> 00:37:27,439
Speaker 3: Other day, I didn't know I was me. Yeah, yeah,

605
00:37:28,680 --> 00:37:29,520
Speaker 3: I was Gideon.

606
00:37:29,680 --> 00:37:36,640
Speaker 1: Yeah Yeah, that's my favorite one, one of my top three. Anyway,

607
00:37:37,320 --> 00:37:46,720
Speaker 1: you know, you all were raised by baby boomers. Baby

608
00:37:46,760 --> 00:37:53,320
Speaker 1: boomers were raised by the silent generation. So my father's

609
00:37:53,360 --> 00:37:59,560
Speaker 1: generation said nothing nothing. They come home from work, they

610
00:37:59,600 --> 00:38:05,160
Speaker 1: said uh, and or they punish you, or they beat you,

611
00:38:05,320 --> 00:38:09,680
Speaker 1: or to punish your wives. Women had no rights, women

612
00:38:09,719 --> 00:38:14,320
Speaker 1: couldn't vote, most of them couldn't drive. They were trapped

613
00:38:14,320 --> 00:38:19,880
Speaker 1: in the house. The house was a hellhole, it really was.

614
00:38:20,960 --> 00:38:26,160
Speaker 1: And then out of that came the baby boomers, with

615
00:38:26,440 --> 00:38:32,880
Speaker 1: no skills and communication and no ability to understand rage,

616
00:38:32,920 --> 00:38:36,160
Speaker 1: and no ability to understand self. And we were not

617
00:38:36,280 --> 00:38:42,359
Speaker 1: taught that it was important to know yourself. Okay, we

618
00:38:42,360 --> 00:38:44,160
Speaker 1: weren't taught that I didn't need to care about that.

619
00:38:44,280 --> 00:38:47,040
Speaker 1: Take out the trash, do what you gotta do, move

620
00:38:47,120 --> 00:38:51,799
Speaker 1: those cinder blocks, not self examine yourself guarding. None of

621
00:38:51,840 --> 00:38:57,080
Speaker 1: that that's new. So the baby boomers passed on to

622
00:38:57,160 --> 00:39:01,160
Speaker 1: the millennials, okay, and the millennial started saying, you know,

623
00:39:01,320 --> 00:39:03,960
Speaker 1: I want to know who I am. I felt this

624
00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:08,960
Speaker 1: way you hurt me said, this was foreign language, this

625
00:39:09,160 --> 00:39:13,880
Speaker 1: was Greek, okay, this was Swaki okay, you know, because

626
00:39:13,920 --> 00:39:17,240
Speaker 1: we know we wouldn't have dared said to our parents

627
00:39:17,640 --> 00:39:20,360
Speaker 1: what we thought about nothing they did. I mean we wouldn't.

628
00:39:21,360 --> 00:39:23,040
Speaker 1: My mother used to say, I kill you and have

629
00:39:23,080 --> 00:39:25,880
Speaker 1: another one looked just like you. They won't even know

630
00:39:25,920 --> 00:39:31,160
Speaker 1: you going. So it wasn't even up for debate to

631
00:39:31,280 --> 00:39:35,560
Speaker 1: have discussions. So language as it is in the natural

632
00:39:35,680 --> 00:39:40,040
Speaker 1: language has progressed from era to era to error until

633
00:39:40,080 --> 00:39:42,520
Speaker 1: it became more fluent and it became written, and it

634
00:39:42,520 --> 00:39:45,760
Speaker 1: became books, and it became all The language didn't start

635
00:39:45,760 --> 00:39:48,759
Speaker 1: out where it is today. We didn't have websters, We

636
00:39:48,800 --> 00:39:52,759
Speaker 1: didn't have the affluency of speech like we do now.

637
00:39:53,880 --> 00:39:58,120
Speaker 1: That is also true about emotional language. From generation to generation,

638
00:39:58,239 --> 00:40:02,960
Speaker 1: the generation it has rested and gotten gotten better, kept

639
00:40:03,120 --> 00:40:09,040
Speaker 1: them before healing trauma. When you when you talk to

640
00:40:10,000 --> 00:40:13,799
Speaker 1: your clients, now, having gone through all that you've gone through,

641
00:40:13,920 --> 00:40:16,520
Speaker 1: let's talk a little bit about what you bring to

642
00:40:16,640 --> 00:40:20,520
Speaker 1: your clients. Uh is it? Do you bring that language

643
00:40:20,640 --> 00:40:23,920
Speaker 1: to them that enables them to be able to express

644
00:40:24,000 --> 00:40:24,960
Speaker 1: themselves in that way?

645
00:40:25,320 --> 00:40:26,120
Speaker 3: Yeah?

646
00:40:26,480 --> 00:40:30,240
Speaker 2: I I bring the lived experience along with the clinical insight. Okay,

647
00:40:30,560 --> 00:40:33,120
Speaker 2: it's the lived experience the clinical insight. Seventy percent of

648
00:40:33,160 --> 00:40:34,120
Speaker 2: my clients are believers.

649
00:40:34,440 --> 00:40:35,520
Speaker 1: Mm.

650
00:40:35,560 --> 00:40:39,480
Speaker 2: So seventy s percent of these individuals love God, but

651
00:40:39,520 --> 00:40:43,280
Speaker 2: they're also trying to understand life as it is happening

652
00:40:43,320 --> 00:40:44,839
Speaker 2: in real time right right.

653
00:40:44,920 --> 00:40:51,880
Speaker 3: Some of them are, uh, are are sort of in things. Uh,

654
00:40:51,960 --> 00:40:54,520
Speaker 3: it's so think of it this way. Visu. What this

655
00:40:54,520 --> 00:40:55,320
Speaker 3: descripture will.

656
00:40:55,160 --> 00:40:59,680
Speaker 1: Say, lay aside every weight and sin just stopped there. Right.

657
00:41:01,360 --> 00:41:04,680
Speaker 2: Most of these people are trying to lay aside weight, right,

658
00:41:06,000 --> 00:41:08,480
Speaker 2: and the weight that they're trying to lay side in

659
00:41:08,520 --> 00:41:11,960
Speaker 2: some ways and for some individuals have metastaside into what

660
00:41:12,000 --> 00:41:15,399
Speaker 2: we would call sin. So and we know what's sin

661
00:41:15,760 --> 00:41:19,479
Speaker 2: what it's just missing the mark. So this weight, which

662
00:41:19,560 --> 00:41:22,920
Speaker 2: is trauma. And for those that are not familiar, trauma

663
00:41:23,000 --> 00:41:26,759
Speaker 2: is not the event. It's what you're left with after

664
00:41:26,800 --> 00:41:31,040
Speaker 2: the molestation. It's what you're left with after the physical abuse.

665
00:41:31,600 --> 00:41:34,799
Speaker 2: Is that I don't have the trauma is I'm not

666
00:41:34,880 --> 00:41:36,680
Speaker 2: confident that somebody else will love me.

667
00:41:36,840 --> 00:41:38,360
Speaker 3: Matter of fact, let's take it spiritual.

668
00:41:38,920 --> 00:41:41,479
Speaker 2: I'm not confident that God is gonna love me after

669
00:41:41,520 --> 00:41:46,120
Speaker 2: I've sined. So the weight that I carry now from

670
00:41:46,160 --> 00:41:51,160
Speaker 2: the trauma now becomes that very thing that is causing

671
00:41:51,200 --> 00:41:52,040
Speaker 2: me to not.

672
00:41:52,160 --> 00:41:53,560
Speaker 3: Feel God's love.

673
00:41:54,480 --> 00:41:57,759
Speaker 2: So what I'm able to do with what God has

674
00:41:57,840 --> 00:42:02,680
Speaker 2: gifted me is to not insert me, but to take

675
00:42:02,920 --> 00:42:07,840
Speaker 2: a clinical insight and reframe it and say to them,

676
00:42:08,360 --> 00:42:13,680
Speaker 2: it's not that God doesn't love you. You feel a distance

677
00:42:13,760 --> 00:42:18,319
Speaker 2: from God. So it makes you feel that as if

678
00:42:18,360 --> 00:42:20,480
Speaker 2: you can't receive his love because you feel that he

679
00:42:20,520 --> 00:42:21,879
Speaker 2: doesn't love you because of the sin.

680
00:42:22,360 --> 00:42:27,480
Speaker 1: You know, I heard somebody say trouble doesn't last always,

681
00:42:28,360 --> 00:42:32,400
Speaker 1: but trauma sticks around, you know. Trauma stays with you.

682
00:42:32,520 --> 00:42:35,080
Speaker 1: It goes with you, it walks with you, and then

683
00:42:35,200 --> 00:42:39,040
Speaker 1: it repeats itself in your life. Absolutely, like post traumatic

684
00:42:39,080 --> 00:42:41,480
Speaker 1: stress disorder, it comes. You don't have to be a

685
00:42:41,560 --> 00:42:45,800
Speaker 1: soldier to have PTSD, and you find all these things triggers.

686
00:42:46,120 --> 00:42:49,399
Speaker 1: If you were there, you're traumatized, yeah yeah, yeah, yeah yeah,

687
00:42:49,440 --> 00:42:51,719
Speaker 1: and you might then shoot the gun. Yeah, but if

688
00:42:51,719 --> 00:42:54,640
Speaker 1: you heard the gun shot, it's traumatized. So what do

689
00:42:54,719 --> 00:42:57,640
Speaker 1: you say to the person who's married to somebody who

690
00:42:57,719 --> 00:43:01,080
Speaker 1: has that kind of trauma and they're center for watching

691
00:43:01,080 --> 00:43:03,919
Speaker 1: you right now, and they're in tears because everything you're

692
00:43:04,000 --> 00:43:07,520
Speaker 1: talking about they're living with right now. Not the person

693
00:43:08,160 --> 00:43:11,920
Speaker 1: that that is you, but the person who is married

694
00:43:12,040 --> 00:43:15,400
Speaker 1: to somebody like you. What do you what do you

695
00:43:15,560 --> 00:43:19,800
Speaker 1: say to them? That person?

696
00:43:22,800 --> 00:43:24,360
Speaker 3: Man, oh Bishop.

697
00:43:24,480 --> 00:43:26,520
Speaker 1: What do you give him? What? What? What are you

698
00:43:26,640 --> 00:43:30,520
Speaker 1: not giving? Is it space? Is it? What? What? How

699
00:43:30,560 --> 00:43:33,320
Speaker 1: do you handle that? Even if it could be your son,

700
00:43:34,200 --> 00:43:37,160
Speaker 1: it could be your dad, it could be your your boyfriend,

701
00:43:37,239 --> 00:43:42,520
Speaker 1: your husband. Women often pick men who have these kinds

702
00:43:42,560 --> 00:43:46,120
Speaker 1: of problems, and they pick them because they're handsome, or

703
00:43:46,239 --> 00:43:49,239
Speaker 1: because they're built, or because they're this sad or the other.

704
00:43:49,560 --> 00:43:54,000
Speaker 1: But then they when they get past the carton and

705
00:43:54,120 --> 00:43:57,719
Speaker 1: get down to the milk, you don't love that container

706
00:43:58,160 --> 00:44:01,319
Speaker 1: and all that stuff starts pouring out. They don't know

707
00:44:01,400 --> 00:44:03,960
Speaker 1: what to do with it. And often they treat they

708
00:44:04,000 --> 00:44:06,800
Speaker 1: talk to the man as if he were a woman,

709
00:44:07,480 --> 00:44:10,759
Speaker 1: and what works for the woman doesn't work for the man.

710
00:44:11,120 --> 00:44:12,560
Speaker 1: Am I right right?

711
00:44:12,920 --> 00:44:13,520
Speaker 3: It does not?

712
00:44:13,680 --> 00:44:18,360
Speaker 2: We we we women community. We communicate very linear. I

713
00:44:18,360 --> 00:44:22,560
Speaker 2: think women communicate very circular. It's like like, please land,

714
00:44:22,600 --> 00:44:23,240
Speaker 2: this plain.

715
00:44:24,680 --> 00:44:29,400
Speaker 1: Is playing and I wouldn't say that, I said because

716
00:44:29,440 --> 00:44:32,120
Speaker 1: I grew up around sisters. So my mom has twelve

717
00:44:32,200 --> 00:44:35,600
Speaker 1: sisters and you will be there all day. Uh, listen

718
00:44:35,719 --> 00:44:38,640
Speaker 1: to this story that has nothing to do with the groceries.

719
00:44:38,680 --> 00:44:41,400
Speaker 1: She just wants you to hear what she went through

720
00:44:41,440 --> 00:44:44,000
Speaker 1: and who she met on her way to the grocery store.

721
00:44:44,360 --> 00:44:48,160
Speaker 1: And we just like, did you buy the chicken or not? Yeah? Right, right, right,

722
00:44:48,280 --> 00:44:49,160
Speaker 1: right right?

723
00:44:49,920 --> 00:44:53,759
Speaker 3: I think and understanding that.

724
00:44:54,680 --> 00:44:57,480
Speaker 2: You know what's so interesting, Bishop is a lot of

725
00:44:57,480 --> 00:44:59,960
Speaker 2: women are that that will bring her husband and it

726
00:45:00,920 --> 00:45:02,920
Speaker 2: and they'll say, well, doctor J, you know, well this

727
00:45:02,960 --> 00:45:05,520
Speaker 2: is and I said, listen, please tell him what this

728
00:45:05,680 --> 00:45:10,080
Speaker 2: is gonna be, meaning like, don't blindside him with that.

729
00:45:10,360 --> 00:45:14,319
Speaker 2: Brothers don't like to be blindsided. Don't say we going

730
00:45:14,360 --> 00:45:16,080
Speaker 2: to a meeting and all of a sudden you click

731
00:45:16,120 --> 00:45:16,680
Speaker 2: on the zoom.

732
00:45:17,280 --> 00:45:20,360
Speaker 3: Hey, how you doing? The doctor J brother and the brother.

733
00:45:21,760 --> 00:45:21,960
Speaker 1: You know.

734
00:45:22,719 --> 00:45:26,520
Speaker 2: And what I said is that sometimes you have to

735
00:45:26,560 --> 00:45:30,439
Speaker 2: talk to us in ways that we're unable to speak

736
00:45:30,480 --> 00:45:33,560
Speaker 2: to ourselves. And so I often encourage women write notes

737
00:45:35,000 --> 00:45:40,439
Speaker 2: to your husband or spouses because if that man has

738
00:45:40,520 --> 00:45:43,919
Speaker 2: not been fathered, well, it's hard for him to take

739
00:45:44,200 --> 00:45:49,600
Speaker 2: anything remotely that may sound like criticism.

740
00:45:49,640 --> 00:45:51,520
Speaker 3: And we know this, I'm sure you.

741
00:45:52,520 --> 00:45:55,560
Speaker 2: I've seen this with Minti's and and I've seen this

742
00:45:55,719 --> 00:45:58,080
Speaker 2: with the pastors I work with. If they're talking or

743
00:45:58,080 --> 00:46:02,560
Speaker 2: correcting our spiritual son, it's because there's a part of

744
00:46:02,600 --> 00:46:08,760
Speaker 2: you that doesn't understand love, because with love, there's what correction.

745
00:46:09,480 --> 00:46:13,560
Speaker 1: He chasing those that he loves. So if I correct you'

746
00:46:14,280 --> 00:46:17,640
Speaker 1: that's me saying I care. And we know that's from sports.

747
00:46:17,880 --> 00:46:22,040
Speaker 1: If coach is all you, he like you. But if

748
00:46:22,040 --> 00:46:26,280
Speaker 1: he ever stopped talking to you, you better count your days.

749
00:46:26,520 --> 00:46:30,000
Speaker 1: There you go, there you go, You better count your days.

750
00:46:30,160 --> 00:46:35,320
Speaker 2: And so I would highly encourage them find subtle ways

751
00:46:35,440 --> 00:46:36,239
Speaker 2: to speak to him.

752
00:46:36,920 --> 00:46:42,080
Speaker 1: I think something else that's very helpful is you know,

753
00:46:42,320 --> 00:46:47,040
Speaker 1: you don't pick truth before it's right. And there are

754
00:46:47,120 --> 00:46:52,880
Speaker 1: moments of luciveness, even with the Alzheimer's face. There are

755
00:46:52,920 --> 00:46:56,920
Speaker 1: moments that they are lucid, and there are moments that

756
00:46:57,000 --> 00:46:59,759
Speaker 1: he opens up a little bit. You can't create that.

757
00:47:00,840 --> 00:47:03,440
Speaker 1: He has to create that moment. When he creates that moment,

758
00:47:03,920 --> 00:47:08,040
Speaker 1: that's an opportunity to slip in there with help, or

759
00:47:08,080 --> 00:47:10,479
Speaker 1: to put him in a situation where there is some

760
00:47:10,560 --> 00:47:14,760
Speaker 1: help because he has decided. Because we need to feel

761
00:47:14,760 --> 00:47:17,640
Speaker 1: like it's our choice. There it is. We need to

762
00:47:17,640 --> 00:47:20,560
Speaker 1: feel like it's our cho We don't want to feel

763
00:47:20,600 --> 00:47:23,000
Speaker 1: like you're telling us what to do. Yeah, I didn't

764
00:47:23,040 --> 00:47:25,680
Speaker 1: marry my mother. You're not my mother. Get out of

765
00:47:25,719 --> 00:47:28,640
Speaker 1: my face. No, no, no, no no. We want to feel

766
00:47:28,680 --> 00:47:33,160
Speaker 1: like I'm at the breaking point, I'm in trouble. I

767
00:47:33,239 --> 00:47:36,640
Speaker 1: need help. And then when he opens up to that help,

768
00:47:36,680 --> 00:47:39,520
Speaker 1: he's much more receptive. Do you agree, Absolutely?

769
00:47:39,719 --> 00:47:43,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, That's why when I wrote just He'll bro

770
00:47:43,960 --> 00:47:48,480
Speaker 2: it's a book that's a journal. It's not inundated with

771
00:47:48,560 --> 00:47:51,840
Speaker 2: a bunch of questions. But the prompts are very simple,

772
00:47:52,080 --> 00:47:55,360
Speaker 2: but they're also very challenging because they challenge the brother

773
00:47:55,880 --> 00:47:57,960
Speaker 2: to kind of sit with himself and he can write

774
00:47:58,200 --> 00:48:01,480
Speaker 2: as less as much as whatever he wants to do,

775
00:48:03,400 --> 00:48:06,000
Speaker 2: because I also understand, brothers are not picking up anything

776
00:48:06,320 --> 00:48:10,520
Speaker 2: over the two hundred pages, like listen, if we've been honest.

777
00:48:10,880 --> 00:48:12,880
Speaker 2: Only I was when I was playing Arena ball, I

778
00:48:12,880 --> 00:48:15,440
Speaker 2: was reading your book Hemotions, but you know, and I

779
00:48:15,480 --> 00:48:17,600
Speaker 2: was interested in my emotion at the time, but you know,

780
00:48:17,640 --> 00:48:20,400
Speaker 2: I was like, that's this is a big book to finish.

781
00:48:20,520 --> 00:48:24,839
Speaker 2: But the powerful thing about that book, Bishop is that

782
00:48:24,920 --> 00:48:28,239
Speaker 2: these brothers they're sending dms man.

783
00:48:28,280 --> 00:48:29,560
Speaker 3: They fell the pages.

784
00:48:30,640 --> 00:48:33,719
Speaker 2: And one of the first questions that I asked my

785
00:48:34,000 --> 00:48:37,920
Speaker 2: good brother Lincoln wrote the forward, and that forward was

786
00:48:38,000 --> 00:48:43,600
Speaker 2: so inviting that as he's sharing his story of finding

787
00:48:43,680 --> 00:48:48,040
Speaker 2: vulnerability and feeling comfortable with it, is there's this invitation

788
00:48:48,280 --> 00:48:51,560
Speaker 2: and I share just a small story. And I asked

789
00:48:51,600 --> 00:48:54,920
Speaker 2: a brother, what event took place in your life that

790
00:48:55,120 --> 00:48:59,880
Speaker 2: change your trajectory or change the where you And it

791
00:49:00,160 --> 00:49:06,000
Speaker 2: opens them up and they're not forced that nobody's on them.

792
00:49:06,120 --> 00:49:09,240
Speaker 2: Come on, Tyrone, tell me how you feel, Tyrone, Come on, Tyrell,

793
00:49:09,360 --> 00:49:10,279
Speaker 2: come on, come on.

794
00:49:10,320 --> 00:49:10,800
Speaker 3: What's wrong?

795
00:49:10,880 --> 00:49:11,040
Speaker 1: Now?

796
00:49:11,080 --> 00:49:11,520
Speaker 3: What's wrong?

797
00:49:11,560 --> 00:49:11,719
Speaker 1: Now?

798
00:49:11,760 --> 00:49:12,319
Speaker 3: Why you cry?

799
00:49:12,600 --> 00:49:12,799
Speaker 1: You know?

800
00:49:13,400 --> 00:49:17,640
Speaker 2: And they get to take their own journey in bitruit

801
00:49:17,719 --> 00:49:20,319
Speaker 2: to see these men send pictures of like man, brother,

802
00:49:21,000 --> 00:49:25,560
Speaker 2: these questions man, because they get to ask themselves these

803
00:49:25,640 --> 00:49:28,560
Speaker 2: questions while they're going through the book. And I was

804
00:49:28,719 --> 00:49:34,960
Speaker 2: very intentional to make sure that these brothers didn't feel judged.

805
00:49:35,480 --> 00:49:38,759
Speaker 2: That's the fear that we have as men, it is

806
00:49:38,800 --> 00:49:44,319
Speaker 2: to feel judge because trust me, there's a lot of us.

807
00:49:44,320 --> 00:49:44,520
Speaker 3: Man.

808
00:49:44,600 --> 00:49:46,719
Speaker 1: We know we're not where we want to be.

809
00:49:47,239 --> 00:49:51,279
Speaker 3: And that hurts. That hurts. It hurted me to.

810
00:49:51,280 --> 00:49:54,319
Speaker 2: Know that the man that I desired to be I

811
00:49:54,320 --> 00:49:56,680
Speaker 2: hadn't seen anybody be that.

812
00:49:57,440 --> 00:50:02,000
Speaker 1: The other thing is, it's not just we talked about timing.

813
00:50:02,239 --> 00:50:06,480
Speaker 1: Timing is important, but you alluded to tone.

814
00:50:07,160 --> 00:50:07,520
Speaker 3: Tone.

815
00:50:08,400 --> 00:50:11,160
Speaker 1: The tone of voice in which you make this statement

816
00:50:11,239 --> 00:50:14,760
Speaker 1: has a lot to do with my reaction. A lot, okay,

817
00:50:14,880 --> 00:50:17,799
Speaker 1: a lot, you know. And if you're talking down to me,

818
00:50:18,640 --> 00:50:22,040
Speaker 1: and and and and rightfully, so you're frustrated you're talking

819
00:50:22,120 --> 00:50:24,440
Speaker 1: down to me. But the problem is you're not going

820
00:50:24,520 --> 00:50:25,960
Speaker 1: to get the results that you want.

821
00:50:26,040 --> 00:50:26,839
Speaker 3: No, we're shut down.

822
00:50:26,920 --> 00:50:30,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, we're shut down because the tone triggers something else,

823
00:50:31,120 --> 00:50:34,080
Speaker 1: you know, and you get that that that that that

824
00:50:34,239 --> 00:50:36,840
Speaker 1: thing that starts, and it becomes a bit of a problem,

825
00:50:37,280 --> 00:50:39,759
Speaker 1: and you find yourself in trouble and you're trying to

826
00:50:39,760 --> 00:50:42,520
Speaker 1: figure out what to do and what to say and

827
00:50:41,960 --> 00:50:44,600
Speaker 1: and and how to get it. I don't think. I

828
00:50:44,600 --> 00:50:48,040
Speaker 1: don't think we often. Let's face it, most of the

829
00:50:48,080 --> 00:50:51,160
Speaker 1: women that we end up married to weren't raised in

830
00:50:51,239 --> 00:50:58,760
Speaker 1: the house with a man, so they don't know male language. Okay, yeah,

831
00:50:58,800 --> 00:51:03,400
Speaker 1: so that's the next problem them. Okay, so so she

832
00:51:04,120 --> 00:51:07,000
Speaker 1: wants you to be a guy, but that she treats

833
00:51:07,080 --> 00:51:10,280
Speaker 1: like her girlfriend. You know. You know, let's go shopping,

834
00:51:10,400 --> 00:51:13,440
Speaker 1: let's go here, let's go there, let's talk about this,

835
00:51:13,560 --> 00:51:16,080
Speaker 1: let's talk about I told my daughter the other day,

836
00:51:16,400 --> 00:51:18,680
Speaker 1: I said, I'm getting kind of sick of you calling

837
00:51:18,760 --> 00:51:21,360
Speaker 1: your mother. You don't never call me. And she said, oh, daddy,

838
00:51:21,719 --> 00:51:23,440
Speaker 1: she said, you don't want to hear what me and

839
00:51:23,480 --> 00:51:27,200
Speaker 1: mama talking about. We talking about lipstick and make up

840
00:51:27,280 --> 00:51:29,920
Speaker 1: and where we've got our hair done, and all I said, no,

841
00:51:30,160 --> 00:51:33,960
Speaker 1: call your Mama. Yeah, that's okay, I'm okay with that.

842
00:51:34,880 --> 00:51:36,799
Speaker 1: With that, let's I want to cover as much ground

843
00:51:36,840 --> 00:51:40,759
Speaker 1: with you as I can. Chapter number five, Let's talk

844
00:51:40,800 --> 00:51:48,560
Speaker 1: about the imposter syndrome. Imposter syndrome. You can't grow and

845
00:51:48,600 --> 00:51:51,520
Speaker 1: not run into it. Every time you step into a

846
00:51:51,560 --> 00:51:55,239
Speaker 1: new stage of life, you have to you have to

847
00:51:55,400 --> 00:51:58,239
Speaker 1: rustle down. Am I good enough? Do I deserve to

848
00:51:58,280 --> 00:52:02,200
Speaker 1: be here? Do I deserve to be nominated for the

849
00:52:02,280 --> 00:52:07,440
Speaker 1: NAACP Image of Award for podcast? He just he just

850
00:52:07,520 --> 00:52:11,719
Speaker 1: got nominated? Okay, you know the imposter syndrome? Am I

851
00:52:11,920 --> 00:52:15,279
Speaker 1: there yet? Uh? How do you treat that?

852
00:52:17,560 --> 00:52:21,960
Speaker 2: You gotta lean into it? Okay, because I think that

853
00:52:22,000 --> 00:52:27,719
Speaker 2: there's parts of it that is I think there is

854
00:52:29,160 --> 00:52:34,440
Speaker 2: a difference in understanding that you being prepared because you

855
00:52:34,440 --> 00:52:37,120
Speaker 2: have the education, you have the training, you have the skills.

856
00:52:37,280 --> 00:52:40,560
Speaker 2: But the other question is is really am I ready?

857
00:52:41,760 --> 00:52:44,560
Speaker 2: And I think that's a bigger question. And I think

858
00:52:44,680 --> 00:52:48,120
Speaker 2: for me again, and you and I talk about this

859
00:52:48,280 --> 00:52:51,600
Speaker 2: all the time, like you have helped me because I've

860
00:52:51,640 --> 00:52:57,000
Speaker 2: never seen them meet. I'm in movies, I'm podcasting, writing

861
00:52:57,040 --> 00:53:01,640
Speaker 2: books and stage and so I've never seen of me

862
00:53:02,440 --> 00:53:05,799
Speaker 2: And I was listening to you share once about when

863
00:53:05,840 --> 00:53:08,600
Speaker 2: you begin, when you first begin preaching, and how your

864
00:53:08,640 --> 00:53:11,879
Speaker 2: hands were shaken and you would start off with.

865
00:53:11,920 --> 00:53:12,560
Speaker 1: A bid.

866
00:53:17,040 --> 00:53:19,000
Speaker 2: And you said, you put your hands behind your back,

867
00:53:19,400 --> 00:53:21,640
Speaker 2: you know what I mean, until enough annoying came on

868
00:53:21,680 --> 00:53:25,680
Speaker 2: you and then you just and really, I think whether

869
00:53:26,520 --> 00:53:29,640
Speaker 2: you are believe in you believe that the annoyinging has to.

870
00:53:31,080 --> 00:53:32,000
Speaker 3: Ascend on you.

871
00:53:33,440 --> 00:53:37,239
Speaker 2: Or descend or descent on you, or or you are

872
00:53:37,400 --> 00:53:39,839
Speaker 2: a person that feels like man, I have to have

873
00:53:40,080 --> 00:53:43,719
Speaker 2: a conversation with self. It is that inner dialogue. What

874
00:53:43,760 --> 00:53:46,680
Speaker 2: are you saying to yourself? And what I had to

875
00:53:46,760 --> 00:53:49,400
Speaker 2: learn to say to myself, Bishop, is I am ready

876
00:53:49,440 --> 00:53:52,520
Speaker 2: for this moment. Even if there's part of me that

877
00:53:52,680 --> 00:53:57,640
Speaker 2: don't believe that I'm right, I still have to say

878
00:53:58,120 --> 00:54:02,480
Speaker 2: I'm ready because what I've learned about in those moments,

879
00:54:02,920 --> 00:54:05,319
Speaker 2: and I think we had talked about this is when

880
00:54:05,320 --> 00:54:08,120
Speaker 2: I was doing all of those television interviews and you said,

881
00:54:08,160 --> 00:54:12,560
Speaker 2: in that moment, hear the question, yeah, process.

882
00:54:12,080 --> 00:54:14,959
Speaker 3: It, then release what you gotta say.

883
00:54:15,239 --> 00:54:18,560
Speaker 1: And two things that I think is important to note.

884
00:54:18,600 --> 00:54:22,479
Speaker 1: All men don't deal with imposter syndrome the same. Some

885
00:54:22,560 --> 00:54:27,440
Speaker 1: of them overcompensate with arrogance and dominance and act like

886
00:54:27,520 --> 00:54:30,440
Speaker 1: they got it all together, when in truth, they're really

887
00:54:30,640 --> 00:54:34,560
Speaker 1: not what they say they are. They don't feel sure themselves,

888
00:54:34,640 --> 00:54:37,560
Speaker 1: so to cover it up they go to the other extreme.

889
00:54:38,120 --> 00:54:40,319
Speaker 1: So you have to be able to decode that. The

890
00:54:40,400 --> 00:54:42,759
Speaker 1: other one doesn't want to leave the house and go

891
00:54:42,840 --> 00:54:45,120
Speaker 1: out there and confront it because they don't feel worthy.

892
00:54:45,280 --> 00:54:48,759
Speaker 1: The other one sits over in the corner at a

893
00:54:48,920 --> 00:54:51,920
Speaker 1: congregation of people gathering together, not a church, but a

894
00:54:52,200 --> 00:54:54,839
Speaker 1: party anything. They kind of say out of the way.

895
00:54:54,840 --> 00:54:57,600
Speaker 1: They don't feel worthy to be in the room. And

896
00:54:58,080 --> 00:55:00,880
Speaker 1: when you look for either one of those three signs,

897
00:55:01,080 --> 00:55:04,480
Speaker 1: and there's probably more, you want to be able to

898
00:55:04,600 --> 00:55:07,280
Speaker 1: embrace that person and bring them in. And the hardest

899
00:55:07,320 --> 00:55:12,319
Speaker 1: one to embrace is a brother who's arrogant. The brother

900
00:55:12,360 --> 00:55:16,440
Speaker 1: who's arrogant, it's hard to embrace because he's acting the

901
00:55:16,480 --> 00:55:20,719
Speaker 1: antithesis of how he really feels. So you're giving him

902
00:55:20,760 --> 00:55:23,839
Speaker 1: something that he needs, but he doesn't know how to

903
00:55:23,880 --> 00:55:26,600
Speaker 1: receive it, you know, And you have to have a

904
00:55:26,640 --> 00:55:29,680
Speaker 1: lot of patience to be able to deal with that, yeah,

905
00:55:29,719 --> 00:55:36,200
Speaker 1: because he anytime you see somebody acting bigger than they are,

906
00:55:36,800 --> 00:55:42,239
Speaker 1: it's because they're not, and so to compensate for it,

907
00:55:42,480 --> 00:55:45,200
Speaker 1: I'm gonna stand on the step ladder make me look

908
00:55:45,239 --> 00:55:49,680
Speaker 1: real tall, but really inside I feel real short. And

909
00:55:50,719 --> 00:55:55,400
Speaker 1: it's hard to give compliments to somebody who is complimenting themselves,

910
00:55:55,840 --> 00:55:59,280
Speaker 1: but in reality, sometimes they need it the most because

911
00:55:59,320 --> 00:56:04,360
Speaker 1: they're saying about themselves that they don't believe. The ultimate

912
00:56:04,440 --> 00:56:08,200
Speaker 1: thing to me that I use is you have to

913
00:56:08,280 --> 00:56:11,480
Speaker 1: believe it, and it takes time to believe it. And

914
00:56:11,520 --> 00:56:14,000
Speaker 1: at first when you put it on, you don't believe it,

915
00:56:14,040 --> 00:56:16,320
Speaker 1: and after why you walk around in it long enough.

916
00:56:16,480 --> 00:56:19,719
Speaker 1: It took David a long time to believe that he

917
00:56:19,880 --> 00:56:22,960
Speaker 1: was king. You know, it takes a long time to

918
00:56:23,000 --> 00:56:25,200
Speaker 1: believe a lot of times you have a title but

919
00:56:25,280 --> 00:56:28,200
Speaker 1: you don't believe it. People say you help me, but

920
00:56:28,239 --> 00:56:31,000
Speaker 1: you don't believe it. People say, oh, you change my life,

921
00:56:31,000 --> 00:56:33,040
Speaker 1: but you don't believe it. And it takes a whole

922
00:56:33,080 --> 00:56:35,640
Speaker 1: lot of that to get you to believe it. Because

923
00:56:36,080 --> 00:56:39,279
Speaker 1: because you have a doctorate, because you have this sad

924
00:56:39,440 --> 00:56:42,960
Speaker 1: or the other people don't think that you need reinforcement

925
00:56:43,160 --> 00:56:46,799
Speaker 1: or encouragement, but you do. It's just trusting somebody to

926
00:56:46,840 --> 00:56:50,319
Speaker 1: know how to receive it, because often you didn't get it,

927
00:56:50,719 --> 00:56:53,840
Speaker 1: and often you are your own worst enemy in of me,

928
00:56:54,760 --> 00:56:58,000
Speaker 1: and you're inside of yourself, just picking yourself apart. You

929
00:56:58,080 --> 00:57:02,360
Speaker 1: agree with that absolutely, Vichael, Like when you first, like,

930
00:57:02,400 --> 00:57:03,600
Speaker 1: how did you deal with imposter?

931
00:57:03,719 --> 00:57:05,799
Speaker 3: Syn John? How did you deal with that?

932
00:57:06,680 --> 00:57:12,080
Speaker 1: You know, I worked worked myself to death trying to

933
00:57:12,640 --> 00:57:17,640
Speaker 1: overcompensate for my own insecurities, and I really didn't learn

934
00:57:17,720 --> 00:57:20,040
Speaker 1: who I was until after it was over, and I

935
00:57:20,080 --> 00:57:23,000
Speaker 1: looked back at it and thought, Wow, that was amazing,

936
00:57:23,280 --> 00:57:26,120
Speaker 1: But in real time it didn't seem amazing to me.

937
00:57:26,440 --> 00:57:30,560
Speaker 1: I wasn't there. I wasn't on the movie set. I

938
00:57:30,640 --> 00:57:34,680
Speaker 1: wasn't I wasn't at Megafest. I wasn't there. I was

939
00:57:34,680 --> 00:57:38,040
Speaker 1: trying to run. It wasn't a mega fist. I didn't

940
00:57:38,040 --> 00:57:41,560
Speaker 1: see Megafest till years after it was over. After it

941
00:57:41,640 --> 00:57:44,360
Speaker 1: was over, I walked down the hallway and saw a

942
00:57:44,400 --> 00:57:48,600
Speaker 1: picture and looked at it and said, oh my god, wow,

943
00:57:48,920 --> 00:57:51,760
Speaker 1: because I think if I would have looked at it

944
00:57:51,840 --> 00:57:55,040
Speaker 1: head on, it would have been too much for me. Yeah,

945
00:57:55,080 --> 00:57:58,320
Speaker 1: I was so busy trying to manage it. You can't.

946
00:57:58,520 --> 00:58:02,640
Speaker 1: You can't savors something and manage it at the same time.

947
00:58:02,680 --> 00:58:05,040
Speaker 1: And I was so afraid that it was going to

948
00:58:05,080 --> 00:58:07,200
Speaker 1: get out of control and I was gonna lose control

949
00:58:07,280 --> 00:58:09,600
Speaker 1: of it, that I was trying to man up to

950
00:58:09,640 --> 00:58:12,320
Speaker 1: it and handle it. But even after doing it, then

951
00:58:12,440 --> 00:58:14,520
Speaker 1: you're exhausted. You're just exhausted.

952
00:58:14,640 --> 00:58:17,640
Speaker 2: I'm saying, you didn't make a fest several times, oh right, right,

953
00:58:17,840 --> 00:58:19,120
Speaker 2: and you would never do anything.

954
00:58:19,400 --> 00:58:22,360
Speaker 1: I wasn't there. I wasn't I wasn't there like that

955
00:58:22,600 --> 00:58:27,800
Speaker 1: to enjoy it. I was there to manage it. I

956
00:58:27,920 --> 00:58:32,840
Speaker 1: wasn't there to enjoy it. And and because I didn't

957
00:58:32,880 --> 00:58:38,680
Speaker 1: come from a home that celebrated much, okay, celebration wasn't

958
00:58:39,000 --> 00:58:43,000
Speaker 1: on my menu, so I didn't celebrate it. I survived it.

959
00:58:44,360 --> 00:58:48,520
Speaker 1: I survived it, and I thought, oh, it's over. I

960
00:58:48,640 --> 00:58:52,680
Speaker 1: made it. It's over. And I teached my sons to

961
00:58:52,960 --> 00:58:57,280
Speaker 1: celebrate the little triums. The evening and the morning of

962
00:58:57,320 --> 00:58:59,240
Speaker 1: the fruit were the first day, and God said it

963
00:58:59,320 --> 00:59:02,080
Speaker 1: was good. He didn't wait till everything was done before

964
00:59:02,080 --> 00:59:06,640
Speaker 1: he said it was good to incrementally appreciate what you

965
00:59:06,800 --> 00:59:10,920
Speaker 1: have done, because that appreciation, that gratitude, releases strength for

966
00:59:11,040 --> 00:59:12,800
Speaker 1: you to go on to the next level and do

967
00:59:12,880 --> 00:59:15,160
Speaker 1: the next thing and do that. But I didn't know.

968
00:59:15,240 --> 00:59:16,520
Speaker 1: I didn't know how to handle that.

969
00:59:16,920 --> 00:59:19,360
Speaker 2: So the therapist in me, as I'm listening to you

970
00:59:19,400 --> 00:59:23,000
Speaker 2: say that, bitch, I'm like, so do you. So are

971
00:59:23,040 --> 00:59:27,040
Speaker 2: you celebrating everything now as you're looking back?

972
00:59:27,920 --> 00:59:35,280
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, I'm celebrating. I'm proud.

973
00:59:38,040 --> 00:59:41,440
Speaker 1: It was worth it. I couldn't answer that for a

974
00:59:41,480 --> 00:59:45,880
Speaker 1: long time. Now I can see it was worth it.

975
00:59:48,760 --> 00:59:52,800
Speaker 1: A lot of times you try to get something, you

976
00:59:52,840 --> 00:59:55,920
Speaker 1: can't just something before it's time. I can't see it

977
00:59:56,000 --> 00:59:59,000
Speaker 1: till I see it. I don't know I'm tall to

978
00:59:59,320 --> 01:00:01,520
Speaker 1: I try to put my coat and my arms are

979
01:00:01,600 --> 01:00:04,439
Speaker 1: way up here and my sleeves are short in mine.

980
01:00:04,760 --> 01:00:07,440
Speaker 1: I don't know that I'm growing. I don't know it.

981
01:00:08,040 --> 01:00:10,480
Speaker 1: So you will be attacked for something you didn't even

982
01:00:10,520 --> 01:00:13,480
Speaker 1: know you had. People will be jealousy you, and you

983
01:00:13,520 --> 01:00:16,280
Speaker 1: didn't even know you had. They'll set trap toure you

984
01:00:16,320 --> 01:00:18,360
Speaker 1: and try to destroy you. You didn't even know you

985
01:00:18,520 --> 01:00:21,120
Speaker 1: had it, And there you are having to fight them

986
01:00:21,160 --> 01:00:23,600
Speaker 1: off for something that you can't even figure out why

987
01:00:23,600 --> 01:00:26,600
Speaker 1: they're fighting you because you don't even feel worthy of

988
01:00:26,800 --> 01:00:30,720
Speaker 1: having it, and to feel worthy to be in the

989
01:00:30,840 --> 01:00:33,200
Speaker 1: room you wouldn't be in the room if you weren't

990
01:00:33,240 --> 01:00:35,520
Speaker 1: worthy to be in the room. And I had to

991
01:00:35,720 --> 01:00:40,720
Speaker 1: learn that. And I didn't have a me. I didn't

992
01:00:40,720 --> 01:00:45,160
Speaker 1: have a me. I didn't have a mean. When you trailblaze,

993
01:00:45,560 --> 01:00:48,440
Speaker 1: you go first, you run into every sticker, every brier,

994
01:00:48,680 --> 01:00:51,680
Speaker 1: every branch, everything. The person who comes behind you, they

995
01:00:51,720 --> 01:00:55,360
Speaker 1: got a path. But when you're trailblazing into an area,

996
01:00:55,920 --> 01:00:58,600
Speaker 1: either there's nobody there or the people who were there

997
01:00:58,640 --> 01:01:03,320
Speaker 1: won't tell you. Either way, they won't tell you. That's

998
01:01:03,320 --> 01:01:05,840
Speaker 1: a bar, Bishop, Yeah, that's a bar. That's a bar.

999
01:01:06,160 --> 01:01:08,200
Speaker 1: They won't tell you. They won't tell you. And so

1000
01:01:08,280 --> 01:01:10,160
Speaker 1: you got to figure it out for yourself. And it

1001
01:01:10,240 --> 01:01:13,080
Speaker 1: is lonely, and it brings me to what I want

1002
01:01:13,160 --> 01:01:20,040
Speaker 1: to ask you. Chapter number six, Emotional Revolution. It is

1003
01:01:20,200 --> 01:01:24,040
Speaker 1: seldom for men over thirty to have friends, to have

1004
01:01:24,160 --> 01:01:28,640
Speaker 1: somebody they can talk to. Talk to me about how

1005
01:01:28,720 --> 01:01:33,760
Speaker 1: you open up to trust somebody, to be friends, to

1006
01:01:33,840 --> 01:01:34,760
Speaker 1: really be friends.

1007
01:01:36,160 --> 01:01:40,040
Speaker 2: You know, they're they're seeing this. They're calling this a

1008
01:01:40,080 --> 01:01:44,200
Speaker 2: loneliness epidemic with men. And really a lot of the

1009
01:01:44,360 --> 01:01:51,680
Speaker 2: stems back to childhood. It is connected to again the

1010
01:01:51,760 --> 01:01:55,080
Speaker 2: little boy not having language. This is why I am

1011
01:01:55,200 --> 01:01:59,439
Speaker 2: so adamant about the schools and the things that I'm

1012
01:01:59,440 --> 01:02:02,600
Speaker 2: developing for the future. Is we have to teach social

1013
01:02:02,680 --> 01:02:07,000
Speaker 2: and emotional learning from boys because it helps a man

1014
01:02:07,120 --> 01:02:12,160
Speaker 2: to develop his emotional capacity to understand he needs to

1015
01:02:12,200 --> 01:02:14,880
Speaker 2: feel love, he needs to feel appreciated, and he needs

1016
01:02:14,880 --> 01:02:18,640
Speaker 2: to feel belonging. And you know this whole, John Wayne,

1017
01:02:18,680 --> 01:02:23,440
Speaker 2: And you know, you know on your own, man, it's dangerous.

1018
01:02:24,640 --> 01:02:28,200
Speaker 2: And I think for me it was it was healing

1019
01:02:28,240 --> 01:02:32,000
Speaker 2: the father womb, but also healing a part of me

1020
01:02:32,400 --> 01:02:36,600
Speaker 2: that longed to be a son. Because as I was

1021
01:02:36,880 --> 01:02:40,440
Speaker 2: healing that wound, I realized I didn't need a brother,

1022
01:02:41,000 --> 01:02:44,280
Speaker 2: I did need a friend. Yes, and and men of

1023
01:02:44,840 --> 01:02:49,800
Speaker 2: are you know, men thrive in the community when we have.

1024
01:02:49,840 --> 01:02:53,560
Speaker 1: It, Yo, makes all the difference in the world. Thrive

1025
01:02:53,640 --> 01:02:55,800
Speaker 1: in the community makes all the difference in the world.

1026
01:02:55,800 --> 01:02:57,640
Speaker 1: To have somebody you can talk to and know you

1027
01:02:57,760 --> 01:03:01,520
Speaker 1: on it again, to be able to share even a

1028
01:03:01,560 --> 01:03:04,160
Speaker 1: good thing. It doesn't even have to be a bad thing.

1029
01:03:04,440 --> 01:03:06,400
Speaker 1: I can have something good happened to me and pick

1030
01:03:06,480 --> 01:03:10,600
Speaker 1: up the phone to call somebody thinking I say nothing

1031
01:03:10,640 --> 01:03:15,000
Speaker 1: there you know, you know, so you have to choose

1032
01:03:15,400 --> 01:03:20,360
Speaker 1: who you can tell something. Man, Okay, am I telling

1033
01:03:20,400 --> 01:03:23,640
Speaker 1: the truth? If you get two or three people that

1034
01:03:24,240 --> 01:03:27,919
Speaker 1: can really rejoice with you, you're a rich man. You're

1035
01:03:27,920 --> 01:03:30,800
Speaker 1: a rich man. One of the things that you when

1036
01:03:30,840 --> 01:03:32,800
Speaker 1: you were listening to all those other things that men

1037
01:03:32,880 --> 01:03:35,840
Speaker 1: need to have that I think the reason that our

1038
01:03:35,920 --> 01:03:40,160
Speaker 1: marriages are down to thirty percent of our people are

1039
01:03:40,280 --> 01:03:46,240
Speaker 1: married have successful marriages. We don't learn conflict resolution the

1040
01:03:46,320 --> 01:03:48,600
Speaker 1: first time we have an argument. It could be over

1041
01:03:48,640 --> 01:03:52,440
Speaker 1: a glass of beer. I shoot you, I shoot you

1042
01:03:52,480 --> 01:03:55,600
Speaker 1: over a glass of beer. I shoot you because you

1043
01:03:55,680 --> 01:04:00,320
Speaker 1: stepped on my shoe. I shoot you because you didn't

1044
01:04:00,320 --> 01:04:04,080
Speaker 1: invite me to the movies. We don't have conflict resolutions.

1045
01:04:04,360 --> 01:04:07,320
Speaker 1: We don't know how to have a disagreement that doesn't

1046
01:04:07,480 --> 01:04:10,920
Speaker 1: end in blood. That's terrible.

1047
01:04:12,040 --> 01:04:15,720
Speaker 2: You know that that's associated with the limbic system is

1048
01:04:15,760 --> 01:04:18,200
Speaker 2: what we know as the migdala you talked about.

1049
01:04:18,360 --> 01:04:20,040
Speaker 3: It's in a migdala hijack.

1050
01:04:20,080 --> 01:04:26,640
Speaker 2: Where you're so overwhelmed with such an emotional charge that

1051
01:04:26,800 --> 01:04:31,320
Speaker 2: it rules out any practical or or any thought process

1052
01:04:31,360 --> 01:04:36,720
Speaker 2: to make a rational decision. And when I tell couples,

1053
01:04:37,840 --> 01:04:41,320
Speaker 2: if you have not practiced this as a single person,

1054
01:04:41,520 --> 01:04:43,800
Speaker 2: I often tell married people when they come to therapy.

1055
01:04:44,080 --> 01:04:49,320
Speaker 2: Most marital problems are single people issues, the issues that

1056
01:04:49,400 --> 01:04:54,240
Speaker 2: you have singular within self and understanding conflict resolution is

1057
01:04:54,280 --> 01:04:57,240
Speaker 2: also understanding how do you de escalate.

1058
01:04:56,960 --> 01:04:59,560
Speaker 1: How do you de escalate, and how do you set

1059
01:04:59,600 --> 01:05:04,040
Speaker 1: parate air The difference between I was wrong and I

1060
01:05:04,120 --> 01:05:09,320
Speaker 1: am wrong? Yes, because most of the time to admit

1061
01:05:09,400 --> 01:05:13,080
Speaker 1: that I was wrong about that is to admit we

1062
01:05:13,160 --> 01:05:17,120
Speaker 1: hear I am wrong wrong, I am wrong. So if

1063
01:05:17,160 --> 01:05:23,280
Speaker 1: you confront me, you confront you confront the individual about

1064
01:05:23,360 --> 01:05:26,600
Speaker 1: the issue, But rather than to deal with the issue,

1065
01:05:26,640 --> 01:05:29,840
Speaker 1: you end up fighting the individual. Now, if we make

1066
01:05:29,880 --> 01:05:34,120
Speaker 1: the issue the item that we're going to fight, we

1067
01:05:34,240 --> 01:05:37,520
Speaker 1: can team work. We can work together, we can be

1068
01:05:37,640 --> 01:05:39,640
Speaker 1: together on it, we can gang up on it and

1069
01:05:39,680 --> 01:05:42,160
Speaker 1: beat it up. But if you let the issue go

1070
01:05:42,280 --> 01:05:47,920
Speaker 1: free and attack the individual, or the individual perceives that

1071
01:05:48,040 --> 01:05:51,240
Speaker 1: you are attacking them, you have to work twice as hard.

1072
01:05:51,280 --> 01:05:53,720
Speaker 1: If you've got somebody sensitive to say, this is not

1073
01:05:53,840 --> 01:05:57,280
Speaker 1: about you. This is not that I don't think you're attractive.

1074
01:05:57,360 --> 01:05:59,120
Speaker 1: This is not that I want to be married to

1075
01:05:59,200 --> 01:06:02,160
Speaker 1: somebody else. This is not that you're getting old, this

1076
01:06:02,280 --> 01:06:04,320
Speaker 1: is not so and so on. So I just don't

1077
01:06:04,320 --> 01:06:07,240
Speaker 1: think you should wear that jacket. You know, it's not

1078
01:06:07,320 --> 01:06:10,200
Speaker 1: about let's talk about the jacket. Let me see what

1079
01:06:10,240 --> 01:06:12,320
Speaker 1: it looks like in a blue. Let me see what

1080
01:06:12,360 --> 01:06:15,160
Speaker 1: it looks like in a brown. Oh you look good

1081
01:06:15,240 --> 01:06:17,520
Speaker 1: and brown like. You gotta do all that kind of

1082
01:06:17,520 --> 01:06:20,560
Speaker 1: stuff because otherwise he walks away thinking.

1083
01:06:20,480 --> 01:06:23,280
Speaker 2: Oh, you don't like me, you know, And now he's

1084
01:06:23,320 --> 01:06:27,240
Speaker 2: having thoughts of inadequacy. Yeah, and thoughts as if the

1085
01:06:27,360 --> 01:06:30,120
Speaker 2: issue is something that he has.

1086
01:06:30,160 --> 01:06:33,000
Speaker 1: And that's not just man. No, that's not just man,

1087
01:06:33,040 --> 01:06:36,680
Speaker 1: that's just people. It's just people in general. I want

1088
01:06:36,680 --> 01:06:40,240
Speaker 1: to read this quote. You said, the revolution starts when

1089
01:06:40,240 --> 01:06:43,840
Speaker 1: a man decsts to examine his own heart before he

1090
01:06:43,960 --> 01:06:47,760
Speaker 1: tries to fix the world. Break that down for me.

1091
01:06:50,840 --> 01:06:52,200
Speaker 3: It starts with us. Bishop.

1092
01:06:53,760 --> 01:06:55,840
Speaker 2: When you think about the revolution, and when you think

1093
01:06:55,840 --> 01:07:00,640
Speaker 2: about revolutionizing something, you think about a right change, a

1094
01:07:00,760 --> 01:07:05,520
Speaker 2: radical shift, and that can only start when a man

1095
01:07:05,560 --> 01:07:09,280
Speaker 2: begins to examine his heart. You know, one of the

1096
01:07:09,360 --> 01:07:12,360
Speaker 2: favorite scriptures that I love to break down when I'm

1097
01:07:12,480 --> 01:07:15,160
Speaker 2: talking in churches and talking about faith and mental health

1098
01:07:15,240 --> 01:07:18,840
Speaker 2: is when Jeremiah is talking about, you know, the heart

1099
01:07:18,920 --> 01:07:22,880
Speaker 2: being deceitful, and then he says, it's a puzzle that

1100
01:07:22,960 --> 01:07:26,800
Speaker 2: no one can figure out, but I God judge the

1101
01:07:26,880 --> 01:07:31,320
Speaker 2: heart and examine the mind. And then later on in

1102
01:07:31,360 --> 01:07:33,720
Speaker 2: that scripture talks about he says, I look at the

1103
01:07:33,720 --> 01:07:36,240
Speaker 2: heart of the human I get to the root of

1104
01:07:36,320 --> 01:07:41,040
Speaker 2: the issue. And what we as men have to understand

1105
01:07:41,080 --> 01:07:44,720
Speaker 2: that most of the battles that we have here starts

1106
01:07:45,120 --> 01:07:49,920
Speaker 2: here in our hearts. We often think that it's the head,

1107
01:07:50,000 --> 01:07:53,440
Speaker 2: but that the brain, But the heart is sending just

1108
01:07:53,480 --> 01:07:56,760
Speaker 2: as many messages to your brain as the brain is

1109
01:07:56,800 --> 01:07:57,960
Speaker 2: sending messages.

1110
01:07:57,560 --> 01:07:58,080
Speaker 3: To your heart.

1111
01:07:58,400 --> 01:08:01,520
Speaker 2: So when you begin to examin in your heart, you

1112
01:08:01,600 --> 01:08:04,720
Speaker 2: begin to open this thing up and you begin to say, man,

1113
01:08:05,320 --> 01:08:10,120
Speaker 2: where are those areas that there's a deficit, the areas

1114
01:08:10,200 --> 01:08:14,280
Speaker 2: that I'm lacking, And And what I want brothers to understand,

1115
01:08:14,600 --> 01:08:18,400
Speaker 2: just because you have these deficiencies, whatever your proclivities, or

1116
01:08:18,400 --> 01:08:21,599
Speaker 2: whatever your iterate syncrecies, whatever whatever term you want to get,

1117
01:08:21,720 --> 01:08:27,120
Speaker 2: whatever it is, it's okay. We often feel like we

1118
01:08:27,520 --> 01:08:33,920
Speaker 2: can't become because we have these deficits. And what we

1119
01:08:34,000 --> 01:08:37,040
Speaker 2: do is we try to go out to the world

1120
01:08:37,400 --> 01:08:40,479
Speaker 2: to fix the world, whether it's through our work. Because

1121
01:08:40,520 --> 01:08:43,120
Speaker 2: now I can hold up this sign to say, do

1122
01:08:43,200 --> 01:08:46,439
Speaker 2: you see me, I'm providing I'm performing.

1123
01:08:46,680 --> 01:08:53,799
Speaker 1: Performing, there you go, performing versus presence, So we're always

1124
01:08:53,880 --> 01:08:58,200
Speaker 1: on the stage until we finally burn out and when

1125
01:08:58,320 --> 01:09:03,040
Speaker 1: and when you stop? Yeah, when that's yeah, yeah, yeah,

1126
01:09:03,200 --> 01:09:06,320
Speaker 1: that's scary. That's a whole exubject. We have to do

1127
01:09:06,400 --> 01:09:11,280
Speaker 1: a whole other show on performance versus presence and how

1128
01:09:11,320 --> 01:09:14,080
Speaker 1: we don't think that our presence matters. So we perform

1129
01:09:14,200 --> 01:09:18,760
Speaker 1: for people. But eventually you get exhausted because there's no

1130
01:09:18,840 --> 01:09:22,719
Speaker 1: place where you're not putting on a show. You should

1131
01:09:22,720 --> 01:09:25,639
Speaker 1: be able to come home and just be you, but

1132
01:09:25,720 --> 01:09:27,760
Speaker 1: you don't feel safe to be you and your own

1133
01:09:27,800 --> 01:09:30,240
Speaker 1: space because you feel like you're going to be judged.

1134
01:09:30,280 --> 01:09:33,400
Speaker 1: You feel like you're going to be ashamed or penalized.

1135
01:09:33,520 --> 01:09:36,519
Speaker 1: And it's not always the other person's fault. The enemy

1136
01:09:36,600 --> 01:09:39,799
Speaker 1: might be in you, but it's still just as effective.

1137
01:09:40,560 --> 01:09:46,040
Speaker 1: Chapter number seven, Ready to Heal. I'm going to wrap

1138
01:09:46,120 --> 01:09:47,680
Speaker 1: up my time with you, but I want to ask

1139
01:09:47,760 --> 01:09:51,439
Speaker 1: you something. You went all over this nation teaching just

1140
01:09:51,560 --> 01:09:56,560
Speaker 1: heal bro all over this country everywhere, showed up everywhere

1141
01:09:56,600 --> 01:10:01,000
Speaker 1: with groups of men working with men. What did you learn?

1142
01:10:02,120 --> 01:10:06,439
Speaker 1: I know what you taught. What did you learn about

1143
01:10:06,520 --> 01:10:07,759
Speaker 1: where men are today?

1144
01:10:09,000 --> 01:10:14,759
Speaker 2: I learned that men are ready to grow, they're ready

1145
01:10:14,800 --> 01:10:18,280
Speaker 2: to heal. They just needed somebody to give them permission.

1146
01:10:20,400 --> 01:10:25,599
Speaker 1: Do you feel guilty that you started something that probably

1147
01:10:25,680 --> 01:10:29,320
Speaker 1: is gonna take six years and you you're gone in

1148
01:10:29,400 --> 01:10:29,800
Speaker 1: the day.

1149
01:10:31,560 --> 01:10:32,320
Speaker 3: I do.

1150
01:10:34,880 --> 01:10:37,000
Speaker 2: When we reconnected, and I think we were standing in

1151
01:10:37,000 --> 01:10:39,439
Speaker 2: the hall at the church and you you said to

1152
01:10:39,479 --> 01:10:45,000
Speaker 2: me that I was healing ancient wounds, and man, it's it.

1153
01:10:45,000 --> 01:10:46,960
Speaker 3: It. It was a.

1154
01:10:46,920 --> 01:10:53,640
Speaker 2: Gut punch because I'm thinking, like God, this is a task. Yeah,

1155
01:10:53,800 --> 01:10:57,160
Speaker 2: And sometime it bothers me that I have to leave them.

1156
01:10:57,160 --> 01:11:00,759
Speaker 2: And so now I'm in the process of of building

1157
01:11:00,840 --> 01:11:04,880
Speaker 2: things that in systems where they can continue to feel

1158
01:11:04,880 --> 01:11:07,759
Speaker 2: the support, because you know, it's.

1159
01:11:07,600 --> 01:11:08,679
Speaker 3: Like a one night stand.

1160
01:11:09,000 --> 01:11:09,240
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1161
01:11:09,400 --> 01:11:14,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, you come in and and and this is not

1162
01:11:15,000 --> 01:11:18,360
Speaker 2: even scratching the surface. You got men that are fifty

1163
01:11:18,400 --> 01:11:21,600
Speaker 2: plus that are saying, young man, you help me to

1164
01:11:21,680 --> 01:11:24,280
Speaker 2: understand something I've been dealing with since I was fourteen.

1165
01:11:25,280 --> 01:11:28,439
Speaker 2: You know brothers that are like man. Now I know

1166
01:11:28,560 --> 01:11:32,280
Speaker 2: that I wasn't tripping. I just didn't have the language.

1167
01:11:32,320 --> 01:11:34,040
Speaker 2: You gave me the language. Now I can communicate with

1168
01:11:34,080 --> 01:11:36,479
Speaker 2: my wife, I can communicate with my children. Now I

1169
01:11:36,560 --> 01:11:39,640
Speaker 2: know what safe feels like and so, yeah, I do

1170
01:11:39,680 --> 01:11:45,680
Speaker 2: feel guilty, and it's you know, sort of in a

1171
01:11:45,720 --> 01:11:49,400
Speaker 2: way paradoxical. So as I'm feeling guilty, there's also a

1172
01:11:49,439 --> 01:11:53,800
Speaker 2: sense of joy that I've at least.

1173
01:11:53,800 --> 01:11:54,559
Speaker 3: Planned to see.

1174
01:11:55,120 --> 01:11:57,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I know somebody else is gonna come to

1175
01:11:57,080 --> 01:12:00,479
Speaker 2: the water and God to get the increase. And that

1176
01:12:00,520 --> 01:12:05,000
Speaker 2: helps me to sleep at night, because that's not a

1177
01:12:05,080 --> 01:12:07,679
Speaker 2: day goes by that I don't wake up with dms

1178
01:12:07,680 --> 01:12:14,120
Speaker 2: from brothers, yeah, from moms, wives, sisters, can can you

1179
01:12:14,280 --> 01:12:17,519
Speaker 2: come see about my my, my, my son, my husband?

1180
01:12:17,920 --> 01:12:20,880
Speaker 2: And I think the toughest thing is that the people

1181
01:12:20,880 --> 01:12:22,560
Speaker 2: that were waiting on me that I didn't get a

1182
01:12:22,680 --> 01:12:23,320
Speaker 2: chance to see.

1183
01:12:23,560 --> 01:12:25,360
Speaker 3: Yeah, And that happened a few times.

1184
01:12:25,400 --> 01:12:29,680
Speaker 2: There was a kid that wanted to see me and

1185
01:12:29,840 --> 01:12:34,200
Speaker 2: one on one and unfortunately his life ended by way

1186
01:12:34,200 --> 01:12:36,240
Speaker 2: of suicide. And the family when they reached out and

1187
01:12:36,240 --> 01:12:38,040
Speaker 2: they said we and of course I was on the

1188
01:12:38,120 --> 01:12:40,600
Speaker 2: road and the family says, you know, doctor j he

1189
01:12:40,720 --> 01:12:41,400
Speaker 2: was waiting on you.

1190
01:12:41,520 --> 01:12:45,479
Speaker 3: And man, that bishop that took me. Man that took

1191
01:12:45,560 --> 01:12:46,560
Speaker 3: me about.

1192
01:12:47,880 --> 01:12:51,400
Speaker 2: Two years of therapy m to to resolve or just

1193
01:12:51,439 --> 01:12:53,799
Speaker 2: tryna say to reconcile that.

1194
01:12:55,520 --> 01:12:58,400
Speaker 1: I'm just the instrument. I'm not the savior. No, you

1195
01:12:58,439 --> 01:13:01,400
Speaker 1: can't do it. You can't do it. You can't do it.

1196
01:13:01,600 --> 01:13:03,920
Speaker 1: You can't do it. God has to do it. But

1197
01:13:04,000 --> 01:13:09,480
Speaker 1: I want to say something. Through your books, through your materials,

1198
01:13:09,680 --> 01:13:12,200
Speaker 1: we shy away because we don't want to read a book.

1199
01:13:12,920 --> 01:13:14,920
Speaker 1: I tell men all the time, don't read the book.

1200
01:13:14,960 --> 01:13:19,839
Speaker 1: Read a chapter. Just put the book in the bathroom,

1201
01:13:19,960 --> 01:13:24,680
Speaker 1: read a chapter, and then you come along maybe two

1202
01:13:24,720 --> 01:13:28,720
Speaker 1: weeks later, read another chapter. Take a pen in there

1203
01:13:28,720 --> 01:13:31,519
Speaker 1: and mark up the chapter you read that really stuck

1204
01:13:31,560 --> 01:13:35,800
Speaker 1: out to you. You don't have to you don't have

1205
01:13:35,880 --> 01:13:38,840
Speaker 1: to eat the whole elephant. No, you know, break it

1206
01:13:38,880 --> 01:13:42,559
Speaker 1: down into small bits and pieces and see what food

1207
01:13:42,640 --> 01:13:45,160
Speaker 1: you can get, what nourishment you can get, and then

1208
01:13:45,280 --> 01:13:48,880
Speaker 1: how you can reinforce it and better determine. We don't

1209
01:13:48,920 --> 01:13:53,000
Speaker 1: even know who's safe to friend to be friend. So

1210
01:13:53,280 --> 01:13:55,560
Speaker 1: you know, thank God for the books, thank God for

1211
01:13:55,640 --> 01:13:59,640
Speaker 1: the materials. Thank God that they can stream interviews like

1212
01:13:59,680 --> 01:14:02,479
Speaker 1: this and they can do You may not even take

1213
01:14:02,520 --> 01:14:04,320
Speaker 1: all of this at one time. You may take it

1214
01:14:04,360 --> 01:14:07,400
Speaker 1: in section, you may take it in parts. But if

1215
01:14:07,400 --> 01:14:09,559
Speaker 1: you if you just take it in parts, you can

1216
01:14:09,600 --> 01:14:12,800
Speaker 1: get food now in a way, that you couldn't get

1217
01:14:12,800 --> 01:14:16,400
Speaker 1: food before, and I think that's real important if you

1218
01:14:16,800 --> 01:14:21,240
Speaker 1: if you go from this place, you earn your doctorate.

1219
01:14:21,280 --> 01:14:27,560
Speaker 1: Congratulations on your earning your doctorate. Congratulations on being nominated

1220
01:14:27,640 --> 01:14:32,480
Speaker 1: for the NAACP Image of World, Congratulations on all your successes.

1221
01:14:33,479 --> 01:14:42,800
Speaker 1: Hear me. Congratulations sir, thank you, congratulations. Let that in.

1222
01:14:44,960 --> 01:14:51,280
Speaker 1: Let that in. You did that. That was good. Yes, sir,

1223
01:14:53,439 --> 01:15:00,760
Speaker 1: that was good. I'm proud of you. That means a

1224
01:15:00,800 --> 01:15:09,400
Speaker 1: lot so better because sometimes we just cast it off.

1225
01:15:11,760 --> 01:15:13,960
Speaker 1: Have you ever gone on the internet and gone through

1226
01:15:14,000 --> 01:15:16,920
Speaker 1: all the good comments, just rush right through all the

1227
01:15:16,920 --> 01:15:21,800
Speaker 1: good comments looking for somebody who says something smart, not

1228
01:15:21,880 --> 01:15:25,599
Speaker 1: really taking the time to take in all the many

1229
01:15:25,640 --> 01:15:32,800
Speaker 1: many people who said something positive. You've done amazing things.

1230
01:15:32,840 --> 01:15:36,720
Speaker 1: You've come so far since that guy that I met.

1231
01:15:37,840 --> 01:15:42,679
Speaker 1: And when you get by yourself, just celebrate that. Yes,

1232
01:15:43,360 --> 01:15:47,400
Speaker 1: let that in. Let that in. You may be a

1233
01:15:47,520 --> 01:15:52,519
Speaker 1: guy who never had an older man tell you you're

1234
01:15:52,560 --> 01:16:02,040
Speaker 1: doing good. Thank you, you're doing good. It's okay to

1235
01:16:02,080 --> 01:16:16,040
Speaker 1: be happy. Yeah, it's okay. It it's okay to celebrate. Yeah,

1236
01:16:16,160 --> 01:16:28,680
Speaker 1: it's okay. It's okay. You did good. We made the

1237
01:16:28,760 --> 01:16:39,920
Speaker 1: home run. You have to let that in. Yeah, you

1238
01:16:39,960 --> 01:16:43,080
Speaker 1: have to let that happen. You have to know what

1239
01:16:43,120 --> 01:16:51,040
Speaker 1: that feeling is, of jubilation, of appreciation of somebody saying

1240
01:16:51,160 --> 01:17:01,880
Speaker 1: you matter, you matter, You change lives, You saved marriages,

1241
01:17:03,400 --> 01:17:10,120
Speaker 1: You stop people from killing themselves. You made a massive difference.

1242
01:17:11,040 --> 01:17:17,360
Speaker 1: And they're like, you turn your pain into power. You

1243
01:17:17,439 --> 01:17:23,120
Speaker 1: touch somebody, You touch somebody in such a way that

1244
01:17:23,160 --> 01:17:29,160
Speaker 1: you made them want to live. Don't miss that moment, Yes, sir,

1245
01:17:32,280 --> 01:17:48,120
Speaker 1: enjoy that moment. Just here, bruh, just here, just here.

1246
01:17:52,680 --> 01:17:55,000
Speaker 1: You learn how to live with the darkness so long

1247
01:17:55,080 --> 01:18:02,720
Speaker 1: that you can't handle the light. Let the light come in.

1248
01:18:06,920 --> 01:18:21,599
Speaker 2: You did round it, I did, I did, oh, I

1249
01:18:21,640 --> 01:18:29,800
Speaker 2: did good with sometimes feln't like no examples and your

1250
01:18:29,880 --> 01:18:36,040
Speaker 2: messages like, I mean, I'm just thinking back twenty eighteen, man,

1251
01:18:37,160 --> 01:18:41,920
Speaker 2: and to be here now, and I think in twenty

1252
01:18:41,920 --> 01:18:43,840
Speaker 2: twenty two when you said you done all of this

1253
01:18:44,000 --> 01:18:45,920
Speaker 2: Since that time.

1254
01:18:46,160 --> 01:18:52,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, look at us, and my shit, you've changed. Let

1255
01:18:52,240 --> 01:18:57,960
Speaker 1: that in and be happy for you through yourself, a party,

1256
01:18:59,479 --> 01:19:05,360
Speaker 1: celebrate yourself. Yeah, can't nobody give you this, but you

1257
01:19:06,720 --> 01:19:09,519
Speaker 1: can't nobody make you happy. But you don't nobody know

1258
01:19:09,640 --> 01:19:13,839
Speaker 1: what you need, but you no This is a moment

1259
01:19:14,640 --> 01:19:19,559
Speaker 1: of celebration and exuberation and where you begin to find

1260
01:19:19,600 --> 01:19:26,519
Speaker 1: out and realize it's okay to be happy.

1261
01:19:29,040 --> 01:19:31,200
Speaker 2: I think when you a survival mode, Bishop, you don't

1262
01:19:31,200 --> 01:19:32,599
Speaker 2: even know what happiness is.

1263
01:19:33,040 --> 01:19:36,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, I know, I've been there. I'm not telling you

1264
01:19:36,200 --> 01:19:38,920
Speaker 1: because I ain't never been there. I'm telling you because

1265
01:19:38,960 --> 01:19:42,480
Speaker 1: I've been there. I'm telling you because I understand the signs.

1266
01:19:43,280 --> 01:19:46,920
Speaker 1: I'm telling you because I know how badly it is

1267
01:19:48,080 --> 01:19:54,120
Speaker 1: to need somebody older to tell you when you're younger.

1268
01:19:56,439 --> 01:20:04,280
Speaker 1: I'm so proud of you. Oh, I'm so proud of you.

1269
01:20:05,640 --> 01:20:08,240
Speaker 1: Without that, you just keep running and running and running

1270
01:20:08,280 --> 01:20:11,840
Speaker 1: and running and running and running and running and run, running, running, running.

1271
01:20:12,080 --> 01:20:15,360
Speaker 1: The race is never over cause you never can hear

1272
01:20:15,640 --> 01:20:20,599
Speaker 1: anybody shoot the gun. Throw the confetti in the here

1273
01:20:22,200 --> 01:20:29,920
Speaker 1: and celebrate it when you do that, when you get

1274
01:20:30,040 --> 01:20:36,880
Speaker 1: through having that party, that celebration, that victory lap. Take

1275
01:20:36,960 --> 01:20:39,760
Speaker 1: a victory lap if you gotta take it by yourself,

1276
01:20:40,840 --> 01:20:44,080
Speaker 1: then get your breath in the side. What's gonna be

1277
01:20:44,200 --> 01:20:50,000
Speaker 1: my next chapter? Hm, Scott's got something else for you.

1278
01:20:51,840 --> 01:20:54,439
Speaker 1: And maybe you listening to me right now and and

1279
01:20:54,479 --> 01:20:58,360
Speaker 1: you're relating to what I'm saying, maybe it struck a

1280
01:20:58,400 --> 01:21:02,479
Speaker 1: nerve somewhere down inside of you. Maybe you were wondering,

1281
01:21:04,560 --> 01:21:08,280
Speaker 1: how do I celebrate myself. I don't feel good about me.

1282
01:21:08,479 --> 01:21:11,439
Speaker 1: I don't care what I do. I don't know how

1283
01:21:11,439 --> 01:21:16,240
Speaker 1: to congratulate myself because I have never been congratulated. Take

1284
01:21:16,400 --> 01:21:23,240
Speaker 1: this time to receive this award, this trophy, this honor, disappreciation.

1285
01:21:23,800 --> 01:21:26,040
Speaker 1: Maybe you're in mid life crisis and you feel like

1286
01:21:26,120 --> 01:21:28,760
Speaker 1: it was all for nothing because the people you did

1287
01:21:28,760 --> 01:21:33,880
Speaker 1: it for broke your heart. Take this time and celebrate yourself.

1288
01:21:34,240 --> 01:21:37,479
Speaker 1: You did it because it was right. You didn't do

1289
01:21:37,520 --> 01:21:40,479
Speaker 1: it for them to clap. You did it because it

1290
01:21:40,600 --> 01:21:48,680
Speaker 1: was right. It's time for you to just healed, bro

1291
01:21:52,360 --> 01:22:02,519
Speaker 1: and start planning. It's gonna be your next chapter. What's

1292
01:22:02,600 --> 01:22:03,200
Speaker 1: next for you?

1293
01:22:07,040 --> 01:22:07,759
Speaker 3: What's next?

1294
01:22:08,120 --> 01:22:27,080
Speaker 1: I'm TV Jax, and this is your next chapter. Give

1295
01:22:27,120 --> 01:22:31,559
Speaker 1: me a hub man that sir, come me.

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Speaker 4: M H, thank you? I love you, why TV.

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Speaker 1: I'm proud of here. I am present you, sir man.

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01:22:55,560 --> 01:22:58,800
Speaker 1: Thank you man. It's been a jaranty pitch. I know

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01:23:01,080 --> 01:23:03,760
Speaker 1: all the messages is your favorite message? You say my

1300
01:23:03,920 --> 01:23:10,080
Speaker 1: favorite messages too. It's gonna chid Hey, everybody, I want

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01:23:10,120 --> 01:23:12,400
Speaker 1: to take this time to thank you for watching the

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01:23:12,520 --> 01:23:17,720
Speaker 1: Next Chapter podcast. If this conversation inspired you, helped you

1303
01:23:18,479 --> 01:23:22,840
Speaker 1: reflect on an idea, or spark something new inside of you,

1304
01:23:23,000 --> 01:23:27,679
Speaker 1: make sure to like, comment, and subscribe so you don't

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01:23:27,880 --> 01:23:33,960
Speaker 1: miss future episodes. Remember, life isn't about how you begin,

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Speaker 1: It's about how you finished strong. So start your next

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01:23:39,160 --> 01:23:43,759
Speaker 1: chapter with us right here every week