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Speaker 1: This program features the individual opinions of the hosts, guests,

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Speaker 1: and callers, and not necessarily those of the producer, the station,

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Speaker 1: it's affiliates or sponsors. This is True Crime Tonight.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to True Crime Tonight on iHeartRadio. We're talking true

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Speaker 2: crime all the time. I'm Stephanie Leidecker here as always

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Speaker 2: with Courtney Armstrong and body move in.

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Speaker 3: Now listen, everybody, we made it to Thursday.

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Speaker 2: It is Thursday, March twenty sixth, and yes we have

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Speaker 2: a stack knight of headlines. So the verdict is finally

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Speaker 2: in on the case we were discussing last night, the

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Speaker 2: cop on cop ooh attempted murder trial, So very big

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Speaker 2: one happening right now. Also, there's this incredibly wild story

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Speaker 2: about this Brazilian mom who has now been acquitted even

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Speaker 2: though she confessed to murdering her husbands and castrating him,

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Speaker 2: and now she is going to walk free. Lots to

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Speaker 2: unpack their Plus the jurors in the Corey Richins trial,

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Speaker 2: remember she's the mom who's now been found guilty for

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Speaker 2: killing her husbands and writing a children's book about it.

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Speaker 2: The jurors are speaking out. And then also we have

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Speaker 2: Kim Allen with us. Remember this astrologer in the psychic

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Speaker 2: she's been here before. She's going to be doing some

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Speaker 2: charts of some very notable people. By the way, by coincidence,

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Speaker 2: she's going to be doing rex Humorman's chart. You'll remember

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Speaker 2: Rex Humorman. He's the accused Long Island serial killer Gilgo Beach.

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Speaker 2: If you haven't been following it anyway, just by coincidence,

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Speaker 2: word is out that breaking news, rex Humorman may in

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Speaker 2: fact be negotiations for a plea deal. So he's been

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Speaker 2: awaiting his next hearing. Everybody's been waiting for this trial

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Speaker 2: to begin, frankly for decades, and here we are, so

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Speaker 2: breaking news, breaking news, ladies.

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Speaker 3: We made it to Thursday. I'm so happy to see you.

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Speaker 2: It's Friday today officially, it's Friday Junior acially, and we're

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Speaker 2: going to figure out what's going on with mercury and retrograde.

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Speaker 4: Oh good, or at least I've been wondering what that is.

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Speaker 4: I'm on the edge of my seat with that. I've

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Speaker 4: been wondering, I bet because things are not going well.

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Speaker 4: I mean things are a little bit crazy. Oh see,

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Speaker 4: see they're a little bit example.

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Speaker 3: Even Yoke's being a little crazy Yankees. It's been one

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Speaker 3: of those things.

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Speaker 2: I feel like every single thing I touched kind of

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Speaker 2: a breaks today. I've I've you know, broken a glass,

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Speaker 2: I've done them dopious things. No to me today though, Stephanie.

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Speaker 2: Today only no even body had to save me. Actually,

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Speaker 2: I'll make it very very quick. So you know, I'm

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Speaker 2: having a hard time falling asleep. After the show, we

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Speaker 2: get a little wound up. And yesterday was particularly an

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Speaker 2: exciting day. And I had two friends who had really

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Speaker 2: big news, Chris you Will and Paula Roman. They had

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Speaker 2: like a trailer for a project that they're going to drop.

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Speaker 2: So I had made a promise to myself that I

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Speaker 2: would not have any screens after the show. I little

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Speaker 2: like nighttime routine because I'm trying to, you know, do

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Speaker 2: all the things that you guys tell me to do.

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Speaker 3: So I was doing it.

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Speaker 2: I have my phone off and I take you know,

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Speaker 2: the shower, lavender shower, and you know, I'm like putting

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Speaker 2: a little hair treatment.

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Speaker 3: I have like an oil vo five scalp.

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Speaker 2: Treatments, so you gotta really scrib it in and I

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Speaker 2: put my you know, white strips on and I'm cozy

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Speaker 2: as and thinking all the happiest thoughts as I go

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Speaker 2: off to bed, and I'm like, oh, shoot, I didn't

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Speaker 2: I didn't. I didn't post this trailer that I was

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Speaker 2: going to post. I can't forget to do that. So

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Speaker 2: I go get my phone, and you know, I make

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Speaker 2: the post and I go and have sweet dreams. And

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Speaker 2: I wake up this morning bright and early, and my

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Speaker 2: phone is I turn it on. It's like there's a

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Speaker 2: million like wishes.

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Speaker 4: I was one of them. Whether how are you? Are

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Speaker 4: you okay?

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Speaker 3: Happy day, Steph.

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Speaker 2: Haven't heard from me a while, by the way, everybody

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Speaker 2: I've ever worked with, I'm talking like was it my birthday?

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Speaker 2: In fact, I was even like, thank goodness, Kim Allen

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Speaker 2: is coming because maybe this is in the stars and

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Speaker 2: it's my luckiest day. Turns out I didn't actually post

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Speaker 2: the trailer. Instead, I posted myself posting the trailer, so

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Speaker 2: it was like on selfie mode and here I am

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Speaker 2: in the ned with the war on my hair.

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Speaker 4: And then I'm like, are you all.

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Speaker 2: So all of those wishes from everybody under the sun

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Speaker 2: ps like everybody I've ever worked with or for, Like

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Speaker 2: everybody I've frankly i've ever known, has seen the craziest photo,

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Speaker 2: and then like midday, I get another one from from

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Speaker 2: Body who was like, dude, did you want to I'm

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Speaker 2: not sure this was intentional, and I'm like, no, no.

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Speaker 3: I took it down and it was on Facebook. I

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Speaker 3: was like, mercury is in retrograde kids.

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Speaker 4: But you looked cute though you didn't look I.

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Speaker 3: Look like I came out of a casket. People thought

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Speaker 3: I had like brains no no, no, around the world.

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Speaker 4: If anybody wants it, just let me know because I

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Speaker 4: wanted her to know. So I took a screenshot.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and then you know, Body is like hard at work.

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Speaker 2: We never want to bother during this very specific time.

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Speaker 2: I'm like ring Ring Ring in its emergency body he

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Speaker 2: answers it. She answers it like super sleuth, like Ocean's

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Speaker 2: eleven style, and she's like, all right, I'm refreshing. Those

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Speaker 2: are little things. She's like, nope, you're good, and then

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Speaker 2: I was off to the races.

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Speaker 4: Oh, good times, good times, well, Courtney.

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Speaker 2: So this long island cereal thing. I mean, there's so

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Speaker 2: many details to get to. I know, we'll really unpack

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Speaker 2: this on Sunday as things evolve, because this is all

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Speaker 2: breaking news.

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Speaker 5: Right, yeah, yes, and okay, so this is this is

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Speaker 5: kind of big Rex Huerman. He is the Long Island

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Speaker 5: architect who is accused of carrying out all of the

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Speaker 5: Giggle Gilgo Beach serial killings. Seems like he's now expected

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Speaker 5: to plead guilty. I want to be very clear, he

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Speaker 5: has not officially pled guilty, but it seems to be

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Speaker 5: going that way that sources say the prosecutors and Huerman's

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Speaker 5: defense team have been negotiating a plea deal ahead of

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Speaker 5: the upcoming court appearance.

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Speaker 2: I feel like we called this or saw this coming

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Speaker 2: for a while now, although on the one hand, it

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Speaker 2: seems like the odds were really no longer in his

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Speaker 2: favor thanks to that.

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Speaker 3: That's one of the mothers who band together.

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Speaker 2: But if you're looking at so much time behind bars anyway,

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Speaker 2: why not just roll the dice?

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Speaker 4: Right?

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Speaker 2: Like he's convinced people of his sanity for all of

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Speaker 2: these years. Who knows, But I'm really grateful, by the way,

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Speaker 2: if that's the case, he has been a monster.

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Speaker 3: If this is what he has done is really unthinkable.

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Speaker 5: I mean, the DNA evidence, all of the forensic evidence,

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Speaker 5: the digital records, they really seem to tie him pretty closely,

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Speaker 5: and I will say even the families of the victims

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Speaker 5: reportedly have been notified that a guilty plea could be coming.

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Speaker 4: So this would be really big, right. Well, we talked

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Speaker 4: about this a couple of weeks ago. Every motion that

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Speaker 4: the defense had been filing has been getting denied, Like

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Speaker 4: they keep wanting to exclude some of the digital evidence.

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Speaker 4: They wanted to exclude the DNA, then they wanted to

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Speaker 4: exclude the way the DNA was tested. I mean, one

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Speaker 4: thing after another was getting denied, and I feel like

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Speaker 4: this is a pre Coburger plea exactly. Everything was getting denied,

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Speaker 4: Like this is that time when the defense sits down

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Speaker 4: with their client and has a serious conversation with them, right, Like, listen, man,

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Speaker 4: you're facing seven counts of murder and the evidence is

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Speaker 4: not looking good. It's not looking in your favor. This

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Speaker 4: plea deal might be the way to go.

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Speaker 2: This smug guy, if this is true, I mean, he

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Speaker 2: had a wife and a daughter and a son with

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Speaker 2: special needs. He's been like singing his innocence this entire time.

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Speaker 2: He was all strutting on the Long Island railroad to

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Speaker 2: go to the city to work in his fancy job.

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Speaker 2: A guy was really living a very big double life,

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Speaker 2: and then to the bitter end he has played you know, innocent, innocent, innocent.

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Speaker 2: It's pretty disgusting, and hopefully he will have to allocate

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Speaker 2: in some way, meaning he will have to share what

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Speaker 2: happened in some way with the victims' families who have

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Speaker 2: been waiting for so long.

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Speaker 4: I mean, it's been so Steph' you're so on the

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Speaker 4: nose with this, it's been so long, and you know,

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Speaker 4: I know they can't force an elocution, but I wish

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Speaker 4: they could.

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Speaker 3: I really wish they don't have to write.

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Speaker 4: Is that just sort of they don't have to Yeah,

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Speaker 4: I mean you don't have to say anything. You just

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Speaker 4: have to say you're guilty and that's it. But I

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Speaker 4: feel like, you know, maybe you could give him extra

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Speaker 4: meat loaf if he allocutes. I think he'd take it

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Speaker 4: at this point. Yeah, you know, like I mean, give

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Speaker 4: some kind of peace to the families. I mean, knowing

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Speaker 4: at least that the killer is behind bars for the

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Speaker 4: rest of his natural born life has got to, you know,

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Speaker 4: of course, bring some kind of peace to them, but

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Speaker 4: knowing some of the details also might be something they

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Speaker 4: want to know.

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Speaker 2: You know, absolutely and even for his family, like so

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Speaker 2: that they could actually make a break, because somehow they're

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Speaker 2: all smitten with this guy still, and he must have

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Speaker 2: been pretty convincing. We saw the Peacock documentary where his

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Speaker 2: was good. Lisa gave that ASA, or Isa gave her

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Speaker 2: interview Asa, and she seemed very devoted and you know,

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Speaker 2: was going to be with him to the bitter end,

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Speaker 2: and was actually almost blaming herself because she had she

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Speaker 2: not gone to visit her family, then she wouldn't have

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Speaker 2: been out of town and that would have you know,

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Speaker 2: had she been home, her husband, who is so wonderful,

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Speaker 2: would have had an alibi as opposed to doing the

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Speaker 2: math in your head that hey, every time I'm out

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Speaker 2: of town, you know, a sex worker goes missing. What

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Speaker 2: a monster and how scary that must have been. He

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Speaker 2: is well tiging and he is dauntingly scary. He's he's

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Speaker 2: like a giant, and he was like number two. All

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Speaker 2: that data just came out recently from all the searches

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Speaker 2: that he was doing.

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Speaker 4: And remember we talked a couple of weeks ago about

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Speaker 4: he was looking up the victims' families while they were

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Speaker 4: mourning the their their loved ones. Right, so I just, yeah,

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Speaker 4: this is just all stacking up against him, and it's

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Speaker 4: another like I keep using this analogy like brick in

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Speaker 4: the wall, but it's their brick in that wall of

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Speaker 4: evidence that they have against him, and it's pretty tall.

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Speaker 4: It's a pretty tall wall.

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Speaker 2: And interestingly too, one of the girls that allegedly went

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Speaker 2: on a date with him because he was like soliciting

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Speaker 2: sex workers on Craigslist.

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Speaker 4: Type of stuff.

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Speaker 2: Right, so right, not too far from where I grew up,

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Speaker 2: and one of the you know, frankly, the survivors recognized

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Speaker 2: him now once he was arrested, and if you go

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Speaker 2: back to she a couple had had a really weird

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Speaker 2: feeling and removed themselves from this air quotes date because

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Speaker 2: this ogre like man and that was always the description.

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Speaker 2: And then when you see him, it's like actually out

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Speaker 2: of the scariest movie ever. And remember he had that

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Speaker 2: dungeon in his basement, like this is my god, silence

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Speaker 2: of the lamb stuff.

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Speaker 4: Yes, like all kinds of tools. Remember the push has

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Speaker 4: in the ceiling and yeah, like the drop down ceilings

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Speaker 4: with the not styrofilm. I don't know what the material is,

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Speaker 4: but they have those little pinholes in the ceiling dials,

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Speaker 4: and they were saying that he used those kinds of

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Speaker 4: dealing tiles on purpose to hide the pushpins that he

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Speaker 4: would use for like the plastic sheeting. He's like basically

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Speaker 4: his kill room, right, his kill like imagine dexter imagine

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Speaker 4: that's the plastic sheets and stuff.

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Speaker 2: Oh and like they were changed, right, so they were

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Speaker 2: being changed almost as if they were in eighteen.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, this guy was a real nutbag.

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Speaker 2: And you know what, the bad is not going to win,

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Speaker 2: you know yet again, you know, may justice finally prevail

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Speaker 2: and yeah, yeah, so we will keep you post.

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Speaker 5: Keep you posted, and hopefully indeed this plea comes out

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Speaker 5: and the families get the allocution and there is you know,

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Speaker 5: for this thirty plus year tragedy that's gone on. It

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Speaker 5: can be put to bed. If you're just joining us.

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Speaker 5: This is true crime tonight. We've been just talking about

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Speaker 5: the fact that Rex Huerman, who is accused of being

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Speaker 5: the Long Island serial killer, he's expected to plead guilty.

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Speaker 5: So again we'll keep you updated on that and we'd

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Speaker 5: love to hear from you. We are at eighty eight

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Speaker 5: three one crime and now body you have something else

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Speaker 5: to talk about.

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Speaker 4: I do. I feel like I always bring the bad news,

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Speaker 4: but I feel like I'm bringing some good news right now.

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Speaker 4: I feel like I'm bringing some good news. So well,

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Speaker 4: I think this is good news because I felt pretty

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Speaker 4: I felt one way about this case. So Kelly fitz

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Speaker 4: or Kelsey Fitzimmons, you know, she's the cop that has

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Speaker 4: been accused of attempted murder basically on another cop. Right well,

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Speaker 4: a Massachusetts judge has found her not guilty and ruling

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Speaker 4: that the prosecutors they couldn't prove a really key point, right,

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Speaker 4: they couldn't prove that she pointed a gun at an

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Speaker 4: officer during a twenty twenty five shooting at her house. Now,

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Speaker 4: this case states back all the way to June thirtieth

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Speaker 4: or twenty twenty five, when all the you know, her coworkers,

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Speaker 4: her police showed up at her house to serve her

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Speaker 4: a restraining order filed by her fiance. And this was

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Speaker 4: all during a rocky relationship and custody dispute, So they

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Speaker 4: were serving her this restraining order, which also included her son,

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Speaker 4: and I feel like she just went into like this

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Speaker 4: manic panic kind of mode, and she says that she

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Speaker 4: was reaching for a gun to kill herself because she

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Speaker 4: was just suffering from postpartum. She had just given birth

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Speaker 4: four months prior. Her fiance served her this restraining order,

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Speaker 4: which is including her son, so they're going to be

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Speaker 4: taking her son. While the cop says that she pointed

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Speaker 4: the gun at him and he shot her in the chest.

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Speaker 4: She survived, she got a collapse on what she survived. Well,

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Speaker 4: she was found not guilty. I think this is a

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Speaker 4: good verdict. I think the judge was you know, I mean,

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Speaker 4: obviously I'm not gonna who am I to question the judge, right,

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Speaker 4: but I feel like this was, you know, the way

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Speaker 4: to go. And it's interestingly enough, she chose this bench

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Speaker 4: trial and the reason that, you know, citing reasonable doubt

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Speaker 4: whether or not she aimed at the judge is citing

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Speaker 4: reasonable doubt because they don't have bodycam footage in this

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Speaker 4: police department. You know, oftentimes police unions are against bodycams,

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Speaker 4: and so it's really hard for some of these states

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Speaker 4: to kind of overcome that and mandate bodycams. But I

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Speaker 4: think this might change because you know, the state lost

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Speaker 4: this case.

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Speaker 2: State state lost this case, and there was a lot

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Speaker 2: of controversy because this was the same police department that

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Speaker 2: was circling the Karen Reid case.

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Speaker 3: Remember, so there was a.

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Speaker 2: Little like crossovers in the area. So why are we

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Speaker 2: not having body cameras? I do think they really are

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Speaker 2: the police.

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Speaker 4: Unions don't like them.

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Speaker 5: Well, but the judge who made the ruling, Judge Jeffrey Karp,

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Speaker 5: he actually said perhaps the Commonwealth could have easily met

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Speaker 5: its burden if the officers had been wearing body cameras.

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Speaker 4: Exactly right, right, So even the judges like, hey, this

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Speaker 4: would have been a no brainer and for me to decide,

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Speaker 4: but listen, reasonable, that's a thing. And I was kind

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Speaker 4: of nervous for her thinking that, you know, she got this.

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Speaker 4: She did not have a jury. She chose a vents trial,

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Speaker 4: meaning that her fate isn't he did. I agreed with him.

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Speaker 4: So I'm so glad. I feel good about this verdict.

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Speaker 4: I'm happy for Kelsey. Hopefully she sees a light in

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Speaker 4: the happy life.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, I do, and I do think it's worth actually

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Speaker 5: carrying over till after the commercial break.

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Speaker 4: I mean.

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Speaker 5: One other thing that the judge said was he called

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Speaker 5: the case unusually difficult and one of the most exhausting

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Speaker 5: decisions of his career. So we'll have more details on that,

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Speaker 5: and later there's a Brazilian mother who admits to killing.

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Speaker 4: And then walks free. We'll find out why.

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Speaker 5: And the jury is breaking their silence on Corey Richan's

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Speaker 5: True Crime Tonight.

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Speaker 2: Welcome back to True Crime Tonight and iHeartRadio. We're talking

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Speaker 2: true crime all the time. I'm Stephanie Leidecker here with

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Speaker 2: Courtney Armstrong and Body Moven and of course we have

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Speaker 2: Taha with us in the producer's seat keeping us all

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Speaker 2: online and Sam and Adam in the control room waiting

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Speaker 2: for your call.

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Speaker 3: Eight eight eight three one crime.

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Speaker 2: So just to continue with what we were just speaking

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Speaker 2: about this case that we're all really relieved that Kelsey

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Speaker 2: Fitzgibbons has been found not guilty. It seemed like the

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Speaker 2: odds were a little bit stacking against her, you know,

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Speaker 2: and again, imagine getting your child taken away. I think

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Speaker 2: she lost her home because of this. Now she's being

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Speaker 2: kind of targeted at work. Obviously, maybe her comrades weren't

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Speaker 2: that into her. I feel like that was a little

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Speaker 2: of the chatter too, is that the judge at least

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Speaker 2: made note of it that there was nothing like there

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Speaker 2: were no shenanigans against her or there was nothing targeted

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Speaker 2: against her and their findings from the department, which I

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Speaker 2: was very glad to hear, and it sounds like the

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Speaker 2: judge did a very measured, excellent job.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, you're spot on again. Listen, I'm gonna start calling

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Speaker 4: you spot on, Stephanie. The judge, who, by the way,

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Speaker 4: his name is Jeffrey Park, he said that he saw

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Speaker 4: no evidence of conspiracy by law enforcement involved in her case, right,

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Speaker 4: So that is a very much of a relief because

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Speaker 4: that was a big thing too. People were, you know,

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Speaker 4: it's just coming right off the Karen Reid right literally,

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Speaker 4: and so there was a lot of the people who

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Speaker 4: were covering Karen Reid, like really hot and heavy, were

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Speaker 4: also covering this case as well. So I was very

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Speaker 4: relieved to see that there was no evidence of conspiracy.

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Speaker 4: The judge seemed very level headed and honestly pretty fair.

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Speaker 4: But I kind of I kind of knew this was

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Speaker 4: gonna happen a little bit, only because the judge had

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Speaker 4: let her out. Remember she was trying to get out

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Speaker 4: on bond, you know, coming trial, and you know, she

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Speaker 4: got like an apartment and and things like that. So

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Speaker 4: I feel like the judge was really kind of rooting

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Speaker 4: for her a little bit, and I.

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Speaker 2: Think, like, you know, I felt that way too, And

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Speaker 2: even it's seemed for Kelsey that she does see a

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Speaker 2: light at the end of the tunnel and that she

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Speaker 2: sort of feels like she's going to like start the

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Speaker 2: first day for life now, and who knows, maybe that's

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Speaker 2: a really big reset and she'll get whatever help she needs.

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Speaker 2: Clearly she deserves it, and you know, get her kid.

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Speaker 2: I mean, this has been a mess for her.

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Speaker 4: It's been a mess.

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Speaker 5: I mean after the verdict Kelsey Fitzsimmons, she said, I

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Speaker 5: got shot, I went to jail for one hundred and

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Speaker 5: three days. I haven't seen my son. I had to

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Speaker 5: sell my home. I worked very hard for This is

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Speaker 5: my first breath of fresh air and I feel like

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Speaker 5: I can breathe again.

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Speaker 4: Oh yeah, Like what more? Right?

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Speaker 2: I wonder if there's like a GoFundMe for her, I

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Speaker 2: would totally.

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Speaker 3: I want to really.

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Speaker 2: Donate, but it's like it's kind of a tough spot

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Speaker 2: to be in, right. You want to kind of get

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Speaker 2: your feedback on the ground. This is a police officer,

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Speaker 2: somebody who defends us, and you know, she really did

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Speaker 2: get left behind.

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Speaker 3: It seems emotionally at least, right, So.

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Speaker 4: The pros of the state said that, you know, Kelsey

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Speaker 4: was lying and that evidence made her version scientifically and

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Speaker 4: mechanically impossible. So they presented evidence, you know, forensics evidence,

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Speaker 4: because that's really the only thing they can go by here.

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Speaker 4: But the judge was not convinced, right, The judge was

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Speaker 4: just simply not convinced. Now, the defense, Kelsey's defense says that,

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Speaker 4: you know, they argued that the officer involved in this case,

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Speaker 4: officer Patrick Noonan, he's the guy who said that Kelsey

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Speaker 4: pointed a gun at him and he shot her, you know,

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Speaker 4: in self defense. The defense argued that he altered his

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Speaker 4: account to adjust for the narrative after realizing he made

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Speaker 4: a mistake.

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Speaker 6: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: Now, I don't know if the thing's going to happen there,

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Speaker 4: but you know, that's what.

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Speaker 3: It sounds like.

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Speaker 2: The judge decided that there was nothing to see there, right,

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Speaker 2: I kind of agree.

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Speaker 4: Is that kind of the verdict? Ultimately? I time, ultimately

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Speaker 4: right now, Kelsey, she testified she only pointed the gun

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Speaker 4: at her own head, She pulled the trigger. We meant

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Speaker 4: you know that that that click, right, yep, She pulled

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Speaker 4: the trigger unsuccessfully, and then she received a shot, one

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Speaker 4: in the chests, and again this was by the officer.

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Speaker 4: She admitted she lied to officers about the guns location

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Speaker 4: because they were knocking on her door. Right she opens

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Speaker 4: the door to coworkers. She knows these people. She answers

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Speaker 4: the door, and they're like, we have this restraining order

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Speaker 4: and we need you know, we're going to be taking

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Speaker 4: your son. Do you have any weapons? Where's your weapons?

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Speaker 4: And she says that they're down in the basement. So

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Speaker 4: they're like, okay, So they follow her upstairs, but the

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Speaker 4: guns were upstairs. She admitted she lied to them about

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Speaker 4: the guns location. She wants she was trying to buy

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Speaker 4: time to be alone and attempt suicide. You know, a

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Speaker 4: mist you know, this turmoil emotional distress that she was under.

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Speaker 4: So but yeah, the judge said there was. He just

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Speaker 4: wasn't convinced.

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Speaker 2: So and by the way, I feel bad for the

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Speaker 2: guy who had to shoot her, you know I do

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Speaker 2: too too, And yeah, it must have felt very terrible

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Speaker 2: to shoot somebody.

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Speaker 3: That you.

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Speaker 2: Know, used to work with and write, who you know

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Speaker 2: is a mother and you know it was right in

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Speaker 2: the chest. He could have killed her. Although he didn't

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Speaker 2: exactly apologize, it didn't seem like though yet. I didn't

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Speaker 2: really find them much empathy there.

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Speaker 5: But but how is he going to apologize that that's

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Speaker 5: not going to have happened?

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Speaker 4: Logically? Can't?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, because he said that she could be sorry that

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Speaker 2: she went through it and feel badly that happened and

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Speaker 2: just still have been following protocol. I'm not suggesting he

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Speaker 2: didn't follow protocol, but just that like it must even

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Speaker 2: then be very difficult if you shoot your friend, right,

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Speaker 2: this is your crime.

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Speaker 4: Tonight on iHeartRadio, I'm body movin and I'm here with

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Speaker 4: Courtney Armstrong and Stephanie Leidecker. We were just now talking

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Speaker 4: about this verdict in the Kelsey Fitzimmon's case. If you

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Speaker 4: have thoughts we want to hear from you, download the

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Speaker 4: iHeartRadio app and lease a little talk back. Courtney, I

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Speaker 4: literally have dying to hear about the case.

438
00:21:53,359 --> 00:21:56,360
Speaker 5: Well, you're not the only one people have actually been

439
00:21:56,400 --> 00:21:58,480
Speaker 5: asking about it, and let's go to a talk back

440
00:21:58,560 --> 00:21:59,960
Speaker 5: to set us all up.

441
00:22:00,720 --> 00:22:03,600
Speaker 7: Hey, true crime tonight. I was just wondering if you

442
00:22:03,680 --> 00:22:07,920
Speaker 7: had heard the story about the mom in Brazil who

443
00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:11,840
Speaker 7: murdered her boyfriend and cut his genials off. It's like

444
00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:14,760
Speaker 7: ninety three with Loreena Boba. I know there's always two

445
00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:19,040
Speaker 7: sides to every story, but as a mom with a daughter,

446
00:22:19,480 --> 00:22:22,480
Speaker 7: I would have probably done worse. I'm a true crime fan,

447
00:22:22,720 --> 00:22:24,080
Speaker 7: I'm a forensic.

448
00:22:23,680 --> 00:22:24,360
Speaker 3: Fan, right.

449
00:22:24,720 --> 00:22:27,400
Speaker 7: I would have kept him alive, baby, fed it to him,

450
00:22:27,760 --> 00:22:28,760
Speaker 7: those sorts of things.

451
00:22:28,800 --> 00:22:30,320
Speaker 4: So you don't want.

452
00:22:30,119 --> 00:22:33,400
Speaker 7: To mess with us, Mama bears anyhow, I would love

453
00:22:33,480 --> 00:22:34,959
Speaker 7: to know your thought. Bye.

454
00:22:35,760 --> 00:22:39,679
Speaker 3: We kind of all said the same thing, not to

455
00:22:39,720 --> 00:22:40,639
Speaker 3: out everybody during.

456
00:22:40,520 --> 00:22:42,800
Speaker 4: The I perfectly have not read anything about this case.

457
00:22:42,800 --> 00:22:45,760
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, hearing it for the first time.

458
00:22:45,920 --> 00:22:49,280
Speaker 2: Oh, get ready, so again, and she's referring to thank

459
00:22:49,320 --> 00:22:51,239
Speaker 2: you for the great call and for oh you know,

460
00:22:51,720 --> 00:22:55,359
Speaker 2: this is a great wild case and you know hearing

461
00:22:55,359 --> 00:22:57,320
Speaker 2: about it going down the rabbit hole.

462
00:22:58,040 --> 00:22:59,679
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean he may.

463
00:22:59,520 --> 00:23:03,120
Speaker 4: Have had a yeah. So here is the setup.

464
00:23:03,200 --> 00:23:07,360
Speaker 5: So a woman named Erica Vicente was charged with aggravated

465
00:23:07,440 --> 00:23:14,520
Speaker 5: homicide after she admittedly killed her boyfriend, but a Brazilian

466
00:23:14,600 --> 00:23:18,919
Speaker 5: jury has acquitted her. And they acquitted her because the

467
00:23:19,000 --> 00:23:24,040
Speaker 5: jury concluded that Erica Vicente acted to protect her daughter

468
00:23:24,119 --> 00:23:30,400
Speaker 5: from sexual assault. Okay, you may have had it coming, Yes, absolutely,

469
00:23:30,560 --> 00:23:33,399
Speaker 5: So the story, and we'll get into the fact that

470
00:23:33,440 --> 00:23:37,320
Speaker 5: there's some inconsistencies. They all lead to the same outcome.

471
00:23:38,000 --> 00:23:42,840
Speaker 5: But Erica of Acente, she discovered that her boyfriend, Everton

472
00:23:43,080 --> 00:23:48,440
Speaker 5: Amaro da Silva, he had been sending unsavory sexual messages

473
00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:50,439
Speaker 5: to her eleven year old daughter.

474
00:23:50,600 --> 00:23:55,160
Speaker 4: Oh stop the presses, right there, right's on, that's right,

475
00:23:55,280 --> 00:23:55,720
Speaker 4: that's right.

476
00:23:56,240 --> 00:24:01,400
Speaker 5: And in some accounts we have seen the mom Erica

477
00:24:01,440 --> 00:24:06,159
Speaker 5: Vicente she sort of came home after seeing those messages

478
00:24:06,480 --> 00:24:09,880
Speaker 5: and found her boyfriend on top of her eleven year

479
00:24:09,880 --> 00:24:17,760
Speaker 5: old daughter, and then she ended up drugging him with klonopin,

480
00:24:18,280 --> 00:24:22,800
Speaker 5: waiting till he fell asleep, clubbing him with wood.

481
00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:26,239
Speaker 4: A body's holding her hands up, go ahead, Okay. So

482
00:24:26,560 --> 00:24:28,280
Speaker 4: she comes home and.

483
00:24:30,240 --> 00:24:33,159
Speaker 2: Okay, so she trikes like a creepy spidey sense, but

484
00:24:33,320 --> 00:24:35,320
Speaker 2: you know, she maybe tries to deny it in her head,

485
00:24:35,400 --> 00:24:37,440
Speaker 2: maybe she's missed reading it, et cetera.

486
00:24:37,520 --> 00:24:41,119
Speaker 4: So then she comes home and she finds him attempting

487
00:24:41,160 --> 00:24:44,560
Speaker 4: to assault her daughter eleven years ald. She doesn't, she

488
00:24:44,600 --> 00:24:48,800
Speaker 4: doesn't do anything. She feeds it. It takes to work,

489
00:24:49,040 --> 00:24:52,600
Speaker 4: like what maybe there's something goofy there with the translation.

490
00:24:53,520 --> 00:24:56,679
Speaker 8: Well, that's part of what we were saying or Courtney

491
00:24:56,760 --> 00:25:00,280
Speaker 8: was touching on earlier. There's some inconsistencies. It is story

492
00:25:00,280 --> 00:25:03,560
Speaker 8: from Bill, so we're getting and one of the inconsistencies

493
00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:06,760
Speaker 8: is whether or not she actually walked in and caught

494
00:25:06,840 --> 00:25:09,800
Speaker 8: him in the act, or if there were something that

495
00:25:10,040 --> 00:25:12,760
Speaker 8: was she was aware of it and did something where

496
00:25:12,800 --> 00:25:15,680
Speaker 8: she drugged him and killed him once.

497
00:25:15,520 --> 00:25:16,280
Speaker 9: He was drugged.

498
00:25:16,920 --> 00:25:19,600
Speaker 8: There's a little confusion as to whether or not she

499
00:25:19,800 --> 00:25:21,719
Speaker 8: actually caught him in the act or not.

500
00:25:21,920 --> 00:25:24,320
Speaker 9: So there's different stories.

501
00:25:24,320 --> 00:25:26,720
Speaker 3: There is in confusion about the.

502
00:25:26,560 --> 00:25:29,959
Speaker 9: Act, the act, the end results. There's no confusion.

503
00:25:30,119 --> 00:25:32,880
Speaker 2: We know whether she physically saw it with her own

504
00:25:32,920 --> 00:25:34,560
Speaker 2: two eyes versus.

505
00:25:35,080 --> 00:25:37,600
Speaker 3: But the reports are accurate.

506
00:25:37,920 --> 00:25:42,560
Speaker 5: Correct, and the messages, Yeah, the messages are not in question.

507
00:25:43,560 --> 00:25:49,800
Speaker 5: So this woman's boyfriend was indeed totally inappropriately messaging.

508
00:25:49,400 --> 00:25:50,640
Speaker 4: Her eleven year old daughter.

509
00:25:51,320 --> 00:25:58,000
Speaker 5: So, after Erica Vicente beats her boyfriend with a block

510
00:25:58,040 --> 00:26:05,520
Speaker 5: of wood, a neighborhood teenager either here's here's what's happening

511
00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:08,680
Speaker 5: and says, hey, what's happening and then ends up helping

512
00:26:09,320 --> 00:26:11,879
Speaker 5: Erica bring this now deceased.

513
00:26:11,440 --> 00:26:13,160
Speaker 4: Body out to a wooded area.

514
00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:19,000
Speaker 5: Or in another scary movie, yeah, or in another equally

515
00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:22,720
Speaker 5: odd Erica sort of says, hey, teenage boy in the neighborhood,

516
00:26:22,760 --> 00:26:25,040
Speaker 5: come help me. So he either came up his own accord,

517
00:26:25,119 --> 00:26:27,600
Speaker 5: but either way, we don't know who he is.

518
00:26:27,920 --> 00:26:32,880
Speaker 4: Please haven't found him. So after this man is deceased.

519
00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:36,159
Speaker 5: He's brought to again a wooded area and at that

520
00:26:36,400 --> 00:26:42,000
Speaker 5: point Erica Vicente hut off her boyfriend, who you know,

521
00:26:42,200 --> 00:26:45,640
Speaker 5: was doing horrible things to her daughter, cut off his genitals,

522
00:26:45,880 --> 00:26:48,760
Speaker 5: put the genitals in his mouth, set him on fire,

523
00:26:49,280 --> 00:26:52,000
Speaker 5: and that led to some additional charges of corpse desecration.

524
00:26:52,160 --> 00:26:57,359
Speaker 9: Whips that the end results are all factual, so we

525
00:26:57,440 --> 00:26:58,160
Speaker 9: do know.

526
00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:02,200
Speaker 4: Oh my god, what.

527
00:27:03,280 --> 00:27:04,080
Speaker 9: It's not crazy.

528
00:27:04,160 --> 00:27:06,720
Speaker 2: I mean, Mama bear though, isn't going to mess around

529
00:27:06,720 --> 00:27:07,720
Speaker 2: on this one, by the way.

530
00:27:07,600 --> 00:27:09,920
Speaker 4: You know, but listen, you can't be doing that, of course,

531
00:27:10,040 --> 00:27:12,320
Speaker 4: of course, of course, of course, of course, of course.

532
00:27:12,359 --> 00:27:14,840
Speaker 2: But it is a cautionary tale because sometimes a stepparent

533
00:27:14,920 --> 00:27:18,000
Speaker 2: coming in blended families aren't always perfect. If you look

534
00:27:18,000 --> 00:27:22,760
Speaker 2: at the statistics, they do say a stepfather is the

535
00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:28,639
Speaker 2: frequency with which sexual abuse occurs. Stepfather ness is a

536
00:27:28,800 --> 00:27:32,240
Speaker 2: very real statistic. So again that's not a stain on

537
00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:35,399
Speaker 2: all stepfathers. I have an extraordinary one. So you know,

538
00:27:35,560 --> 00:27:39,560
Speaker 2: blended family is high fives, but it is watchful eye.

539
00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:42,440
Speaker 2: There's a stranger in your home. They are not related,

540
00:27:43,000 --> 00:27:47,080
Speaker 2: and that can be very comfortable, uncomfortable and for the child,

541
00:27:47,280 --> 00:27:49,240
Speaker 2: the daughter. It's also one of those things that's really

542
00:27:49,240 --> 00:27:52,800
Speaker 2: scary to say to mom because sometimes mom looks the

543
00:27:52,840 --> 00:27:59,879
Speaker 2: other way. In this case, that's okay. Mom did not so.

544
00:27:58,040 --> 00:28:00,760
Speaker 4: She drives them out to the wood. But she does

545
00:28:01,359 --> 00:28:04,160
Speaker 4: what she does, She sets them up the fire as well.

546
00:28:04,920 --> 00:28:05,480
Speaker 4: That's correct.

547
00:28:05,560 --> 00:28:08,879
Speaker 8: Yeah, Now that she might have been doing the final

548
00:28:09,000 --> 00:28:10,600
Speaker 8: the fire might have been like, let me try to

549
00:28:10,640 --> 00:28:11,400
Speaker 8: hide the evidence.

550
00:28:11,560 --> 00:28:12,439
Speaker 9: It's possible.

551
00:28:13,200 --> 00:28:15,840
Speaker 4: Yeah, either that or I mean it's just another desecration,

552
00:28:16,000 --> 00:28:20,840
Speaker 4: it's another humiliation, right, yeah, right, what a point. That's

553
00:28:20,880 --> 00:28:22,640
Speaker 4: a good point. Wow.

554
00:28:22,880 --> 00:28:28,400
Speaker 5: And the prosecutors they argued that the killing showed hold premeditation,

555
00:28:29,240 --> 00:28:31,680
Speaker 5: that it did not show a blind rage. But again

556
00:28:31,840 --> 00:28:35,879
Speaker 5: the jury disagrees and the woman has been acquitted.

557
00:28:36,840 --> 00:28:39,520
Speaker 4: Let me tell you, the klonipin is the key there.

558
00:28:39,760 --> 00:28:42,760
Speaker 4: To me, she waited because it takes a while to

559
00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:43,800
Speaker 4: take effect.

560
00:28:44,560 --> 00:28:46,800
Speaker 2: Drug a man to sleep. Yeah, it seems like there

561
00:28:46,880 --> 00:28:48,120
Speaker 2: must have been a lot of that.

562
00:28:48,720 --> 00:28:49,640
Speaker 4: It's in meditation.

563
00:28:50,320 --> 00:28:52,080
Speaker 3: I told you that body to knock them out.

564
00:28:53,120 --> 00:28:55,960
Speaker 5: Well, we were talking about that earlier, the clonipin, because

565
00:28:55,960 --> 00:28:58,720
Speaker 5: we're like, hold on a second, this isn't seeming to

566
00:28:58,800 --> 00:29:02,520
Speaker 5: make sense, and we're pulling this from different newspapers of

567
00:29:02,640 --> 00:29:07,560
Speaker 5: record that we're reading about, but it wasn't particularly Ava producer,

568
00:29:07,840 --> 00:29:08,440
Speaker 5: just like, I.

569
00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:10,720
Speaker 4: Don't understand this timeline.

570
00:29:10,880 --> 00:29:14,280
Speaker 5: And so that's when we went to the Brazilian papers translated,

571
00:29:14,440 --> 00:29:18,600
Speaker 5: and that's they also told sort of different klonapin or not.

572
00:29:19,360 --> 00:29:21,960
Speaker 5: But the one account that makes the most sense to

573
00:29:22,200 --> 00:29:27,160
Speaker 5: me is that the mom saw the messages, came home,

574
00:29:27,320 --> 00:29:29,840
Speaker 5: Oh my gosh, I'm so upset, and then her boyfriend

575
00:29:29,960 --> 00:29:36,240
Speaker 5: came home already intoxicated, and she then beat him sort

576
00:29:36,280 --> 00:29:40,920
Speaker 5: of immediately with the wood to kill him.

577
00:29:40,960 --> 00:29:44,160
Speaker 4: Interesting because it is that it's just we don't have clarity.

578
00:29:44,360 --> 00:29:47,560
Speaker 4: It's just that the prosecutors mentioned cold meditation or cold

579
00:29:47,560 --> 00:29:53,200
Speaker 4: I'm sorry, cold premeditation, so to me mentioning that it does,

580
00:29:55,880 --> 00:29:57,320
Speaker 4: but I don't know, I don't know, you know.

581
00:29:57,400 --> 00:29:59,720
Speaker 2: Or there she's at home, maybe she had kolanapin. She

582
00:29:59,800 --> 00:30:01,800
Speaker 2: not them out with a piece of wood and then

583
00:30:01,840 --> 00:30:05,800
Speaker 2: shoved drugs in his mouth to like have him not

584
00:30:05,840 --> 00:30:06,239
Speaker 2: wake up.

585
00:30:07,360 --> 00:30:10,160
Speaker 9: I might do some more. I'm curious about the I'm

586
00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:11,720
Speaker 9: just nosy, I am.

587
00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:14,520
Speaker 4: I I just want to know.

588
00:30:15,120 --> 00:30:16,760
Speaker 8: I have a friend who lives in Brazil, so I'll

589
00:30:16,760 --> 00:30:19,120
Speaker 8: find out and say, can you get get dig into

590
00:30:19,160 --> 00:30:21,760
Speaker 8: this and let us know the sequence of events.

591
00:30:22,200 --> 00:30:22,760
Speaker 4: That'd be great.

592
00:30:22,800 --> 00:30:24,600
Speaker 2: Quit it with the eleven year old girls, like, let

593
00:30:24,600 --> 00:30:27,840
Speaker 2: the record that that is wildly inappropriate. And I don't

594
00:30:27,840 --> 00:30:29,640
Speaker 2: know where this got lost in the sauce in the

595
00:30:29,680 --> 00:30:34,760
Speaker 2: translation for boys or girls equally, So eleven years old

596
00:30:34,880 --> 00:30:40,040
Speaker 2: is inappropriate on all costs. And obviously I don't know,

597
00:30:40,560 --> 00:30:43,560
Speaker 2: I underscore exclamation point. I feel like we have to

598
00:30:43,960 --> 00:30:48,680
Speaker 2: get it probably done the same thing all of us,

599
00:30:48,720 --> 00:30:49,720
Speaker 2: I can't imagine.

600
00:30:50,200 --> 00:30:54,400
Speaker 4: So the jury was just like no big deal thing.

601
00:30:54,520 --> 00:30:57,520
Speaker 4: We all are yes, I mean yes, it's the answer.

602
00:30:58,360 --> 00:30:58,720
Speaker 10: All right.

603
00:30:58,760 --> 00:31:01,720
Speaker 2: Well, listen, we're so glad we made it till Thursday.

604
00:31:02,200 --> 00:31:04,440
Speaker 2: Hope you all have had a good one. Gearing up

605
00:31:04,480 --> 00:31:05,160
Speaker 2: for the weekend.

606
00:31:05,720 --> 00:31:07,440
Speaker 3: Let's go to a talk that ladies.

607
00:31:07,480 --> 00:31:08,680
Speaker 10: This is Ava in La.

608
00:31:09,240 --> 00:31:12,280
Speaker 11: I was just listening to your heated debate about the

609
00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:17,240
Speaker 11: social media and kids on social media body versus Stephanie

610
00:31:17,360 --> 00:31:19,920
Speaker 11: last night, and I know, Sephanie, you were saying it's

611
00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:22,800
Speaker 11: too late, but I just want to point out Australia

612
00:31:23,040 --> 00:31:26,040
Speaker 11: just banned all social media accounts for anyone under the

613
00:31:26,080 --> 00:31:29,640
Speaker 11: age of I believe it's sixteen nation laws. If they

614
00:31:29,640 --> 00:31:31,120
Speaker 11: can do it, we can do it.

615
00:31:31,240 --> 00:31:32,480
Speaker 10: I think it's for the best.

616
00:31:32,680 --> 00:31:35,720
Speaker 4: Thanks Bye, Sotnie. You should say that. I agree.

617
00:31:35,800 --> 00:31:38,960
Speaker 2: No, my point was that it's hard once your kid

618
00:31:39,040 --> 00:31:42,800
Speaker 2: has had it to say ooh, Jeaniette, as a parent,

619
00:31:42,960 --> 00:31:45,800
Speaker 2: I already mess this up. I'm going to try and

620
00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:48,520
Speaker 2: I'm trying to put myself in those same places too,

621
00:31:48,640 --> 00:31:50,240
Speaker 2: so yeah, bigger reevaluation.

622
00:31:50,840 --> 00:31:52,440
Speaker 4: So I just think that part.

623
00:31:52,240 --> 00:31:52,880
Speaker 3: Of it is hard.

624
00:31:53,320 --> 00:31:55,560
Speaker 2: And I thought that last night because I would love

625
00:31:55,640 --> 00:31:58,720
Speaker 2: to see those statistics about how well they must be

626
00:31:58,760 --> 00:32:01,040
Speaker 2: doing in Australia, because they just put a hard no

627
00:32:01,280 --> 00:32:04,600
Speaker 2: on it for everybody so nobody's can like how do

628
00:32:04,640 --> 00:32:06,800
Speaker 2: you you know, you know, in one of the school

629
00:32:06,840 --> 00:32:09,600
Speaker 2: like my son's school, like they don't have phones during

630
00:32:09,640 --> 00:32:11,480
Speaker 2: the day. It's like everybody has to PLoP it in

631
00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:14,720
Speaker 2: like a special bag. Literally nobody has it.

632
00:32:14,840 --> 00:32:17,040
Speaker 4: I think that's doing that. I can't remember what state

633
00:32:17,080 --> 00:32:18,680
Speaker 4: it is. Yeah, they're doing that.

634
00:32:18,680 --> 00:32:20,840
Speaker 2: Here, you know, so no one feels left out, and

635
00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:24,360
Speaker 2: then yes, you're moving forward to anybody who's entering this

636
00:32:24,480 --> 00:32:28,320
Speaker 2: twilight zone. You know, definitely try not to. I agree,

637
00:32:28,360 --> 00:32:31,320
Speaker 2: And by the way, I agree, and body is right

638
00:32:31,920 --> 00:32:32,600
Speaker 2: and well.

639
00:32:32,520 --> 00:32:34,840
Speaker 3: No listen, let the record show ding ding ding, But

640
00:32:34,880 --> 00:32:35,440
Speaker 3: I agree.

641
00:32:35,680 --> 00:32:37,719
Speaker 4: I mean, I just listen. I'm not a mom, so

642
00:32:37,800 --> 00:32:40,400
Speaker 4: I it's really easy for me to be like, you

643
00:32:40,440 --> 00:32:42,480
Speaker 4: shouldn't do this, and you shouldn't do that. You know,

644
00:32:42,520 --> 00:32:44,640
Speaker 4: I'm like judging from up on the hill, you know,

645
00:32:45,320 --> 00:32:47,440
Speaker 4: but yeah, dealing with kids day to day, I would

646
00:32:47,480 --> 00:32:50,400
Speaker 4: probably be yeah, yeah, but here's Facebook, here's Instagram, here,

647
00:32:50,480 --> 00:32:52,160
Speaker 4: snapchairs everything, you know.

648
00:32:55,120 --> 00:32:57,160
Speaker 2: You know, yeah, they have to go to school, and

649
00:32:57,520 --> 00:33:01,000
Speaker 2: this is how those kids socialized at one point, and

650
00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:03,080
Speaker 2: kind of it seemed a little harmless at one point,

651
00:33:03,160 --> 00:33:07,480
Speaker 2: and then certainly it isn't roadblocks got us through COVID.

652
00:33:08,200 --> 00:33:10,520
Speaker 4: I like, period, we would not have serviced.

653
00:33:12,720 --> 00:33:15,400
Speaker 2: Serious when I say that, like it was full lockdown,

654
00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:19,680
Speaker 2: no going outside, no friends, no little groups, nothing, It

655
00:33:19,760 --> 00:33:22,520
Speaker 2: was roadblocks. So those were days that it did seem

656
00:33:22,560 --> 00:33:24,360
Speaker 2: a little bit more innocent. And of course what a

657
00:33:24,400 --> 00:33:27,920
Speaker 2: bummer to find out that it's a feeding ground for predators,

658
00:33:27,960 --> 00:33:30,680
Speaker 2: like it's so gross. So yeah, now the proof is

659
00:33:30,680 --> 00:33:32,240
Speaker 2: out of the pudding. But we can't just be handing

660
00:33:32,320 --> 00:33:34,320
Speaker 2: our kids a pack of cigarettes and a loaded gun,

661
00:33:34,760 --> 00:33:37,040
Speaker 2: which is now what it's appearing to be. And like

662
00:33:37,200 --> 00:33:40,840
Speaker 2: note taken, it's more that I'm just frustrated that I

663
00:33:40,920 --> 00:33:42,760
Speaker 2: did to take that sooner, you know.

664
00:33:43,120 --> 00:33:46,440
Speaker 5: And I also think, you know, whatever any of our

665
00:33:46,520 --> 00:33:50,120
Speaker 5: circumstances are, if we have children of whatever age with

666
00:33:50,160 --> 00:33:55,520
Speaker 5: whatever kind of either social media or just internet access,

667
00:33:56,280 --> 00:34:00,160
Speaker 5: keep in mind what David Ryan, the federal prosecutor or

668
00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:04,160
Speaker 5: we spoke with the other day, which is open dialogue.

669
00:34:04,200 --> 00:34:07,320
Speaker 5: That is something that can happen kind of in any

670
00:34:07,360 --> 00:34:11,400
Speaker 5: and every situation, which is just open the dialogue. Here

671
00:34:11,480 --> 00:34:16,000
Speaker 5: is what is lurking online. Be aware of these bad

672
00:34:16,040 --> 00:34:20,120
Speaker 5: things and know that you can tell me anything. There's

673
00:34:20,120 --> 00:34:22,040
Speaker 5: no mistake you can't tell me about.

674
00:34:22,920 --> 00:34:25,160
Speaker 2: But it's like a different thing though, just like again,

675
00:34:25,239 --> 00:34:27,480
Speaker 2: I know this sounds really like I'm getting lost in

676
00:34:27,480 --> 00:34:30,560
Speaker 2: the sauce a bit. But if I'm saying to a child, Okay,

677
00:34:30,600 --> 00:34:33,439
Speaker 2: you're a little old enough now, can have a little independence.

678
00:34:33,440 --> 00:34:36,239
Speaker 2: You're at an age of whatever, high school, what have you,

679
00:34:36,239 --> 00:34:38,840
Speaker 2: you can go to that strip mall and go to

680
00:34:38,880 --> 00:34:41,200
Speaker 2: the CVS and go run a couple errands in this

681
00:34:41,280 --> 00:34:44,319
Speaker 2: little safe area. Sure, but I don't think there's like

682
00:34:44,400 --> 00:34:48,120
Speaker 2: a little strip joint in there that he's wandering into,

683
00:34:48,840 --> 00:34:52,160
Speaker 2: like a strip club or something. It's like suddenly the

684
00:34:52,239 --> 00:34:54,960
Speaker 2: rules changed on the internet. So like, not only that,

685
00:34:55,320 --> 00:34:57,680
Speaker 2: if we could all get off of it, the amount

686
00:34:57,719 --> 00:35:00,560
Speaker 2: of money these men have been made making on the

687
00:35:00,600 --> 00:35:02,920
Speaker 2: backs of our kids, in on us for that matter,

688
00:35:03,040 --> 00:35:06,960
Speaker 2: it's astounding and it is criminal, frankly, And the only

689
00:35:06,960 --> 00:35:09,600
Speaker 2: way we're really going to get any real action is

690
00:35:09,640 --> 00:35:14,200
Speaker 2: if we're constantly kind of keeping a tight watch on it. Unfortunately,

691
00:35:14,360 --> 00:35:17,120
Speaker 2: because they did lie, they really did.

692
00:35:17,520 --> 00:35:21,040
Speaker 8: Yeah, and body the school the state that you were

693
00:35:21,080 --> 00:35:23,720
Speaker 8: talking about earlier, Florida was one of the first states

694
00:35:23,719 --> 00:35:27,680
Speaker 8: to implement a statewide restriction on phones in schools. But

695
00:35:28,000 --> 00:35:30,760
Speaker 8: just to your point, like didn't we all say earlier

696
00:35:30,800 --> 00:35:33,960
Speaker 8: there was the idea that kids always find a work around,

697
00:35:34,040 --> 00:35:36,279
Speaker 8: so like in Australia, you know, they banned it for

698
00:35:36,360 --> 00:35:40,520
Speaker 8: someone sixteen and below, But kids are clever and smart,

699
00:35:40,520 --> 00:35:42,560
Speaker 8: and they're going to figure out a way to create

700
00:35:42,600 --> 00:35:45,920
Speaker 8: some kind of social media account, even if they're younger.

701
00:35:46,480 --> 00:35:48,799
Speaker 2: I will say though, if you're a little stricter about it,

702
00:35:48,840 --> 00:35:51,879
Speaker 2: like in one this is a totally personal experience from

703
00:35:51,880 --> 00:35:54,799
Speaker 2: one school to another. The one school that like all

704
00:35:54,800 --> 00:35:56,719
Speaker 2: the kids were kind of like not allowed to but

705
00:35:57,400 --> 00:36:00,560
Speaker 2: probably had their phones out. It was sort of like

706
00:36:00,960 --> 00:36:03,480
Speaker 2: kind of still happening anyway. And then once it got

707
00:36:03,640 --> 00:36:06,439
Speaker 2: really buttoned up at a different school and nobody could

708
00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:09,440
Speaker 2: have it period the end, I think it actually added

709
00:36:09,480 --> 00:36:12,440
Speaker 2: to the happiness and everyone just stop stopped thinking about it.

710
00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:12,880
Speaker 4: Period.

711
00:36:13,040 --> 00:36:16,319
Speaker 8: Yeah, if everyone's on the same playing field, then I

712
00:36:16,320 --> 00:36:16,680
Speaker 8: I have to.

713
00:36:16,600 --> 00:36:18,479
Speaker 4: Tell you when they took when they took my phone

714
00:36:18,520 --> 00:36:20,239
Speaker 4: at first, when I was on the show, because you

715
00:36:20,280 --> 00:36:22,279
Speaker 4: have to go into a quester, when they took my

716
00:36:22,320 --> 00:36:26,719
Speaker 4: phone at first, I was almost like shaking, like addiction.

717
00:36:26,160 --> 00:36:26,359
Speaker 9: You know.

718
00:36:26,800 --> 00:36:30,719
Speaker 4: After like two weeks, I didn't miss it, you know

719
00:36:30,760 --> 00:36:33,239
Speaker 4: what I mean, I really And then they gave me

720
00:36:33,239 --> 00:36:34,759
Speaker 4: my phone because I had to pay my rent, you know,

721
00:36:34,800 --> 00:36:37,000
Speaker 4: and I can do it online, and so they gave

722
00:36:37,040 --> 00:36:39,080
Speaker 4: me my phone, and I had all the chaperones and

723
00:36:39,280 --> 00:36:41,520
Speaker 4: people like watching everything I do while I'm on it,

724
00:36:42,320 --> 00:36:44,360
Speaker 4: and I was like I could I couldn't remember like

725
00:36:44,400 --> 00:36:46,440
Speaker 4: how to open my bank gap, I couldn't remember what

726
00:36:47,440 --> 00:36:49,239
Speaker 4: I was like. Well, and then when I anyway, and

727
00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:51,279
Speaker 4: then when I got my phone back for for real,

728
00:36:51,360 --> 00:36:54,560
Speaker 4: for real, I was just I was like, oh this

729
00:36:54,640 --> 00:36:56,480
Speaker 4: is I didn't miss it. I don't know, I just

730
00:36:56,560 --> 00:36:58,960
Speaker 4: I didn't miss it.

731
00:36:57,480 --> 00:37:01,480
Speaker 2: That's it takes one week. One week of detox if

732
00:37:01,480 --> 00:37:02,480
Speaker 2: you just like left for me.

733
00:37:03,400 --> 00:37:07,759
Speaker 5: Yeah, I have to say, if no one's ever done this,

734
00:37:07,960 --> 00:37:10,400
Speaker 5: it is a mind trip. I'm not sure if you

735
00:37:10,400 --> 00:37:12,520
Speaker 5: don't have an iPhone, which is what I happen to have,

736
00:37:13,040 --> 00:37:16,360
Speaker 5: but if you put your your visual setting to grayscale,

737
00:37:16,719 --> 00:37:19,840
Speaker 5: which just means the colors go away, you will be

738
00:37:20,320 --> 00:37:22,640
Speaker 5: absolutely flabbergasted.

739
00:37:22,760 --> 00:37:23,680
Speaker 4: When you go back.

740
00:37:24,280 --> 00:37:25,080
Speaker 5: It is like.

741
00:37:26,560 --> 00:37:30,040
Speaker 4: It is so right, so many colors.

742
00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:34,840
Speaker 5: I highly recommend giving it a try because it's so much.

743
00:37:34,680 --> 00:37:37,080
Speaker 4: More appealing with all of that color. It really is

744
00:37:37,600 --> 00:37:38,680
Speaker 4: more than I imagined.

745
00:37:38,880 --> 00:37:41,200
Speaker 2: And it's almost like, how do you save our kids

746
00:37:41,200 --> 00:37:43,840
Speaker 2: from themselves? Right, It's like we have to also mimic

747
00:37:43,880 --> 00:37:48,200
Speaker 2: the same behavior. And then yeah, like I've seen families

748
00:37:48,239 --> 00:37:50,480
Speaker 2: and like tips and tricks to where you walk in

749
00:37:50,520 --> 00:37:53,200
Speaker 2: the door or during like a two hour time period

750
00:37:53,239 --> 00:37:55,759
Speaker 2: where dinner is happening, you have a family basket and

751
00:37:55,760 --> 00:37:58,000
Speaker 2: everybody puts their phones in it, and I think that's

752
00:37:58,040 --> 00:37:58,919
Speaker 2: really smart.

753
00:38:00,040 --> 00:38:00,840
Speaker 4: Think it's really smart.

754
00:38:00,880 --> 00:38:04,160
Speaker 2: So my hesitation is only coming from like hitting myself

755
00:38:04,200 --> 00:38:05,839
Speaker 2: on the head that you know.

756
00:38:07,360 --> 00:38:08,960
Speaker 4: We had a role growing up. You know, we used

757
00:38:08,960 --> 00:38:12,040
Speaker 4: to sit at the you know, eat dinner and watch TV. Right,

758
00:38:12,080 --> 00:38:14,520
Speaker 4: that was what we used to do. And one time

759
00:38:14,600 --> 00:38:16,239
Speaker 4: my mom one day, my mom was like, no more

760
00:38:16,280 --> 00:38:19,080
Speaker 4: TV while we reading dinner. And so from the time

761
00:38:19,120 --> 00:38:21,040
Speaker 4: I was like eleven until the time I left, we

762
00:38:21,040 --> 00:38:23,040
Speaker 4: didn't watch TV while we were in dinner and we

763
00:38:23,120 --> 00:38:26,680
Speaker 4: just had family talk. Yeah, And was that good kind

764
00:38:26,719 --> 00:38:28,960
Speaker 4: of well, I mean, I don't I don't remember how

765
00:38:29,000 --> 00:38:31,040
Speaker 4: I felt about it, but it was. It's a memory

766
00:38:31,040 --> 00:38:34,520
Speaker 4: for me, so I'll well, yeah, obviously, so.

767
00:38:37,360 --> 00:38:40,719
Speaker 8: Yeah, it's the same that same process. But oh, I

768
00:38:40,760 --> 00:38:42,560
Speaker 8: was just gonna set this one up real Q. Remember

769
00:38:42,600 --> 00:38:45,920
Speaker 8: we had a conversation about protecting yourself if you're on

770
00:38:46,040 --> 00:38:48,960
Speaker 8: dates and you have a drink with you, and someone

771
00:38:49,040 --> 00:38:51,880
Speaker 8: left a talk back that said like, just drink it

772
00:38:51,920 --> 00:38:52,359
Speaker 8: all down.

773
00:38:52,680 --> 00:38:56,080
Speaker 9: This is that following up. So she has a response,

774
00:38:56,560 --> 00:38:57,960
Speaker 9: So let's hear what she said.

775
00:38:58,040 --> 00:39:02,440
Speaker 12: Great, Hey from South Carolina, and I'm calling you to

776
00:39:02,480 --> 00:39:07,120
Speaker 12: clarify about my comment later, I said, we should just

777
00:39:07,680 --> 00:39:11,000
Speaker 12: drink our cocktaills and then go to the bathroom and

778
00:39:11,040 --> 00:39:13,879
Speaker 12: then we're fresh when we get back. What I meant

779
00:39:13,920 --> 00:39:18,440
Speaker 12: to say is just planned accordingly and bathroom and break

780
00:39:18,840 --> 00:39:22,640
Speaker 12: around your drinks, which isn't really that hard to do.

781
00:39:22,719 --> 00:39:25,640
Speaker 4: That's what I meant to oka. Just don't sit there

782
00:39:25,640 --> 00:39:30,120
Speaker 4: and pound them and then the yeah.

783
00:39:29,040 --> 00:39:31,279
Speaker 9: I tried that the other night wasn't a good idea.

784
00:39:31,360 --> 00:39:35,360
Speaker 2: It usually doesn't go well. I mean, you're probably a

785
00:39:35,400 --> 00:39:37,160
Speaker 2: fun little cocktail drunk.

786
00:39:37,200 --> 00:39:38,239
Speaker 9: I'd like to think so.

787
00:39:38,320 --> 00:39:40,359
Speaker 8: I mean, I haven't gotten any complaints as of yet,

788
00:39:40,400 --> 00:39:42,759
Speaker 8: but but I picture.

789
00:39:42,480 --> 00:39:44,520
Speaker 3: You with like an espresso martini.

790
00:39:44,880 --> 00:39:45,840
Speaker 9: How funny you should say that.

791
00:39:45,840 --> 00:39:49,120
Speaker 8: I literally have plans to have one tonight after We're

792
00:39:49,120 --> 00:39:51,240
Speaker 8: going to go out for a spresso martinis after the show.

793
00:39:51,360 --> 00:39:56,239
Speaker 9: So that really you said something that.

794
00:39:56,239 --> 00:39:58,520
Speaker 4: Is actually you know, I was like, I'm getting always

795
00:39:59,120 --> 00:40:01,880
Speaker 4: do you want every night after the show, because every

796
00:40:01,920 --> 00:40:04,719
Speaker 4: everything seems like every time we talk about like some

797
00:40:04,760 --> 00:40:07,120
Speaker 4: of your social life, you're like, oh, I'm going tonight

798
00:40:07,160 --> 00:40:08,799
Speaker 4: to a concert or oh I'm going to.

799
00:40:08,760 --> 00:40:11,799
Speaker 8: A I know premier party would be doing too much.

800
00:40:12,600 --> 00:40:15,000
Speaker 8: I try to eat a single it's just me. So

801
00:40:15,040 --> 00:40:16,960
Speaker 8: I'm like, let me go out and make sure I

802
00:40:17,320 --> 00:40:19,040
Speaker 8: interact with people and do something.

803
00:40:19,400 --> 00:40:20,080
Speaker 9: But I try to do.

804
00:40:20,239 --> 00:40:23,239
Speaker 8: This is our Friday because we're off tomorrow, so really

805
00:40:23,560 --> 00:40:27,160
Speaker 8: it's Thursday night, so you know, Friday, just paid.

806
00:40:27,160 --> 00:40:29,480
Speaker 4: You want to party all the time?

807
00:40:30,600 --> 00:40:30,799
Speaker 5: Time?

808
00:40:33,480 --> 00:40:33,640
Speaker 4: Right?

809
00:40:33,719 --> 00:40:37,320
Speaker 2: He is like busting out the white striped cavalry cheese

810
00:40:37,400 --> 00:40:42,960
Speaker 2: as we speak, exactly, jacket.

811
00:40:42,200 --> 00:40:47,960
Speaker 4: And going out of the wash wash collar.

812
00:40:48,320 --> 00:40:53,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, refreshing curl, get all nice.

813
00:40:53,760 --> 00:40:56,200
Speaker 8: But I have another talk back this one, Adam. We're

814
00:40:56,200 --> 00:40:57,560
Speaker 8: going to switch things up. I want to go to

815
00:40:57,600 --> 00:41:02,080
Speaker 8: the other one. Adam has a follow up with this,

816
00:41:02,200 --> 00:41:04,240
Speaker 8: so he's going to chime in, so say.

817
00:41:04,000 --> 00:41:06,120
Speaker 3: That I was just Adam.

818
00:41:06,120 --> 00:41:09,880
Speaker 13: You guys had seen that Lucy led the documentary on Netflix.

819
00:41:10,160 --> 00:41:12,880
Speaker 13: After hearing Amanda talk about it on the show, I

820
00:41:12,960 --> 00:41:16,120
Speaker 13: went and checked it out. And there is a disgusting

821
00:41:16,320 --> 00:41:20,560
Speaker 13: use of AI to cover up the face of someone

822
00:41:20,560 --> 00:41:24,600
Speaker 13: who doesn't want to be identified. It's buzz are check

823
00:41:24,640 --> 00:41:25,880
Speaker 13: it out of you? Thank you?

824
00:41:27,280 --> 00:41:32,239
Speaker 4: I am since yes have you seen so? I have?

825
00:41:32,360 --> 00:41:35,520
Speaker 2: So I woulntil everybody has seen it. We shouldn't even

826
00:41:35,520 --> 00:41:36,040
Speaker 2: talk about it.

827
00:41:36,160 --> 00:41:38,399
Speaker 4: Okay, what do you have to say that I don't

828
00:41:38,440 --> 00:41:42,120
Speaker 4: understand the AI AI thing. You guys explained the AI thing.

829
00:41:42,239 --> 00:41:43,960
Speaker 4: My comments a little uh.

830
00:41:44,080 --> 00:41:46,480
Speaker 9: It's Amanda adjacent.

831
00:41:46,640 --> 00:41:49,520
Speaker 8: But Stephanie, can you give a quick little idea of

832
00:41:49,520 --> 00:41:52,279
Speaker 8: what that AI is or what it just.

833
00:41:52,200 --> 00:41:53,960
Speaker 3: Adds to the suspicion of it.

834
00:41:54,000 --> 00:41:55,319
Speaker 2: I don't want to give it away because I think

835
00:41:55,400 --> 00:41:57,439
Speaker 2: we are It is like one of those cases, which

836
00:41:57,480 --> 00:41:59,919
Speaker 2: is why I think, listen the idea that Amanda Knox

837
00:42:00,040 --> 00:42:03,319
Speaker 2: as a podcast about the exact same case that a

838
00:42:03,400 --> 00:42:07,439
Speaker 2: documentary by a completely different set of hands has also

839
00:42:07,560 --> 00:42:11,960
Speaker 2: been made. They have very different perspectives put it down,

840
00:42:12,960 --> 00:42:16,200
Speaker 2: and I think I think they're both interesting. But I

841
00:42:16,320 --> 00:42:20,320
Speaker 2: tend to agree with Amanda Oh okay, and Joseph agrees

842
00:42:20,440 --> 00:42:24,440
Speaker 2: with has the opposite opinion. Joseph, we're forensics expert who

843
00:42:24,440 --> 00:42:26,680
Speaker 2: I always agree with. So this has been a real,

844
00:42:27,600 --> 00:42:28,839
Speaker 2: a real tug of my heart.

845
00:42:28,880 --> 00:42:29,160
Speaker 3: I don't know.

846
00:42:29,320 --> 00:42:31,319
Speaker 4: I want to know what the AI is.

847
00:42:31,440 --> 00:42:34,080
Speaker 8: Yeah, we're going to look into the AI part of things.

848
00:42:34,520 --> 00:42:36,359
Speaker 8: So we're going to follow that up on that part.

849
00:42:36,480 --> 00:42:42,560
Speaker 8: But yes, I think it's an AI. It's they did

850
00:42:42,600 --> 00:42:44,400
Speaker 8: something with the face. But we're going to circle back

851
00:42:44,440 --> 00:42:47,000
Speaker 8: to that. But Adam said that he recently got something

852
00:42:47,040 --> 00:42:49,120
Speaker 8: in the mail regarding Amanda Knox.

853
00:42:49,200 --> 00:42:52,440
Speaker 14: I was, what, I'll jump in here. I was, well,

854
00:42:52,480 --> 00:42:55,520
Speaker 14: I got an email the other day. It was just

855
00:42:55,600 --> 00:42:59,080
Speaker 14: like some poster for a comedy show that was in town.

856
00:43:00,000 --> 00:43:02,280
Speaker 14: And I'm looking at the poster and it says Amanda

857
00:43:02,320 --> 00:43:03,200
Speaker 14: Knox on the poster.

858
00:43:03,239 --> 00:43:03,960
Speaker 4: And I was like what.

859
00:43:04,239 --> 00:43:06,360
Speaker 14: And I was looking at her real close, and I'm like,

860
00:43:06,440 --> 00:43:09,080
Speaker 14: I'm pretty sure that's uh are Amanda NOx?

861
00:43:09,200 --> 00:43:09,239
Speaker 6: What?

862
00:43:09,719 --> 00:43:11,520
Speaker 4: Yeah? She does comedy, Yeah she does.

863
00:43:12,640 --> 00:43:16,360
Speaker 3: She's probably hilarious. I had a very fun feeling.

864
00:43:16,400 --> 00:43:17,920
Speaker 4: She's a very dry sense of humor.

865
00:43:18,000 --> 00:43:20,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, she was like locked away in then Italian prison

866
00:43:20,640 --> 00:43:22,640
Speaker 2: and had to learn a language. Give the girl a giggle,

867
00:43:23,120 --> 00:43:25,720
Speaker 2: you know, like she has a pretty good sport about it. Frankly,

868
00:43:26,360 --> 00:43:29,719
Speaker 2: you know, like to let her laugh.

869
00:43:29,520 --> 00:43:31,560
Speaker 4: For the rest of her life. May she just be

870
00:43:31,680 --> 00:43:34,080
Speaker 4: rolling in the aisles belly laugh.

871
00:43:34,760 --> 00:43:36,359
Speaker 9: That's something I mean.

872
00:43:36,520 --> 00:43:39,040
Speaker 8: I love Amanda and I love having her on, But

873
00:43:39,200 --> 00:43:41,520
Speaker 8: I don't know if there's something Is it too soon?

874
00:43:41,560 --> 00:43:43,200
Speaker 9: I don't know what that would you make jokes about

875
00:43:43,200 --> 00:43:44,200
Speaker 9: that scenario or that.

876
00:43:44,320 --> 00:43:45,719
Speaker 4: I don't think it's about the case.

877
00:43:45,760 --> 00:43:48,640
Speaker 2: I don't think she's giggling about her her I think

878
00:43:48,640 --> 00:43:52,120
Speaker 2: she's probably I'm assuming and correct me if I'm wrong,

879
00:43:52,160 --> 00:43:54,640
Speaker 2: Amanda or anybody who's seen the show, I would have

880
00:43:54,719 --> 00:43:58,319
Speaker 2: to assume she's jumping off of her name, but not

881
00:43:58,560 --> 00:44:01,960
Speaker 2: giggling about the four circumstance that she found herself and

882
00:44:01,960 --> 00:44:04,720
Speaker 2: she was like so sad it was her friend that died.

883
00:44:06,160 --> 00:44:08,440
Speaker 4: I've actually seen some of her stand up.

884
00:44:09,760 --> 00:44:13,440
Speaker 5: Yeah, not live, but i've me just before yeah, before

885
00:44:13,480 --> 00:44:16,560
Speaker 5: we were going to speak with her, and yeah, it

886
00:44:16,680 --> 00:44:19,920
Speaker 5: runs the gamut of all sorts of things.

887
00:44:20,480 --> 00:44:22,680
Speaker 2: She's funny, play a little. Can we play a little?

888
00:44:23,440 --> 00:44:26,520
Speaker 2: Give us an example of like a category does she giggle.

889
00:44:26,200 --> 00:44:30,480
Speaker 4: About right now? I don't remember, but I think it

890
00:44:30,520 --> 00:44:31,840
Speaker 4: was a parenting.

891
00:44:32,080 --> 00:44:35,759
Speaker 8: Yeah, like maybe being a mom okay and using that

892
00:44:35,800 --> 00:44:37,840
Speaker 8: okay in that case, then I'm more board and I

893
00:44:37,840 --> 00:44:39,279
Speaker 8: would love it, but it would be we might have

894
00:44:39,320 --> 00:44:41,719
Speaker 8: to go to her show, so Sam, I'm only going

895
00:44:41,760 --> 00:44:41,960
Speaker 8: to go.

896
00:44:41,960 --> 00:44:42,439
Speaker 4: To her show.

897
00:44:42,600 --> 00:44:46,160
Speaker 2: I feel like she was a very light energy. I

898
00:44:46,239 --> 00:44:49,160
Speaker 2: was very I thought Amanda killed her roommate. When this

899
00:44:49,200 --> 00:44:52,040
Speaker 2: all happened, I was like hook line and sinker with

900
00:44:52,120 --> 00:44:55,319
Speaker 2: the news and all the sensational coverage. I don't know

901
00:44:55,440 --> 00:44:57,719
Speaker 2: how old we were. This was pre us working in

902
00:44:57,800 --> 00:45:01,120
Speaker 2: this job. But when I was a consumer just of

903
00:45:01,160 --> 00:45:03,440
Speaker 2: the media, I was like, this girl kills her roommate,

904
00:45:03,640 --> 00:45:09,000
Speaker 2: the foxy noxie like I saw it, and boy I

905
00:45:09,120 --> 00:45:10,120
Speaker 2: was a part of that problem.

906
00:45:10,200 --> 00:45:12,319
Speaker 3: So it was such a great like gut check.

907
00:45:12,440 --> 00:45:15,359
Speaker 2: And then she comes back and she's so every time

908
00:45:15,400 --> 00:45:17,400
Speaker 2: she's been on our show, I'm always like so impressed

909
00:45:17,400 --> 00:45:17,960
Speaker 2: by how.

910
00:45:18,120 --> 00:45:19,520
Speaker 9: She's so.

911
00:45:20,920 --> 00:45:23,319
Speaker 3: Yeah in like light she is, she has a light.

912
00:45:23,400 --> 00:45:24,040
Speaker 4: She gets it.

913
00:45:24,640 --> 00:45:27,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, I guess that's what happens when your like life

914
00:45:27,120 --> 00:45:30,000
Speaker 2: is destroyed and you're accused of the unfakable.

915
00:45:30,120 --> 00:45:35,839
Speaker 3: But haha, thanks on who Amanda jokes on him?

916
00:45:37,520 --> 00:45:40,040
Speaker 4: Maybe that's her, Maybe that's her stick, right, Like the

917
00:45:40,440 --> 00:45:43,480
Speaker 4: jokes talk about turning the tables around exactly tables right,

918
00:45:43,480 --> 00:45:46,359
Speaker 4: because she really did turn everything around. I don't know

919
00:45:46,360 --> 00:45:51,000
Speaker 4: why I have done it.

920
00:45:49,400 --> 00:45:53,080
Speaker 3: And forgave the judge that targeted her.

921
00:45:53,800 --> 00:45:54,120
Speaker 2: Wow.

922
00:45:55,160 --> 00:45:56,359
Speaker 4: Right, Well, keep it here.

923
00:45:56,400 --> 00:45:57,960
Speaker 5: At the top of the hour, we're going to go

924
00:45:58,000 --> 00:46:00,440
Speaker 5: into the latest with the gunman who is in the

925
00:46:00,520 --> 00:46:04,680
Speaker 5: killing of Loyola's student Sheridan Gorman, and also find out

926
00:46:04,680 --> 00:46:08,239
Speaker 5: what went on inside the jury room of convicted Corey Richins.

927
00:46:08,880 --> 00:46:11,320
Speaker 5: Keep it here. True Crime Tonight, We're talking true crime

928
00:46:11,400 --> 00:46:12,120
Speaker 5: all the time.

929
00:46:23,080 --> 00:46:26,080
Speaker 2: Welcome back to True Crime Tonight on iHeartRadio. We're talking

930
00:46:26,120 --> 00:46:28,719
Speaker 2: true crime all the time. I'm Stephanie Leidecker here with

931
00:46:28,760 --> 00:46:31,600
Speaker 2: Courtney Armstrong and body move in, so listen. If you've

932
00:46:31,600 --> 00:46:33,759
Speaker 2: missed any of the show, keep in mind you could

933
00:46:33,800 --> 00:46:37,480
Speaker 2: always download it as a podcast every night after the show,

934
00:46:37,560 --> 00:46:40,640
Speaker 2: so please do. And you could also leave us a talkback.

935
00:46:40,880 --> 00:46:44,759
Speaker 2: Just download your iHeartRadio app and in the top right

936
00:46:44,760 --> 00:46:48,719
Speaker 2: hand corner there's a little like microphone icon. Just push

937
00:46:48,800 --> 00:46:52,200
Speaker 2: that button and leave a message that was a little

938
00:46:52,200 --> 00:46:54,920
Speaker 2: example in the background there and then boom. We can

939
00:46:54,920 --> 00:46:57,279
Speaker 2: get it anytime of day and then we'll play it

940
00:46:57,320 --> 00:47:00,359
Speaker 2: on the show. So we're so glad you're here. More

941
00:47:00,400 --> 00:47:05,440
Speaker 2: stories to get through. So Courtney, this other wild case,

942
00:47:05,440 --> 00:47:06,719
Speaker 2: which one do you want to begin with?

943
00:47:06,880 --> 00:47:07,200
Speaker 9: Next?

944
00:47:07,640 --> 00:47:10,400
Speaker 5: Yeah, So there's been some movement, big movement in the

945
00:47:10,480 --> 00:47:14,520
Speaker 5: Loyola shooting. So a suspect has now been charged with

946
00:47:14,600 --> 00:47:18,480
Speaker 5: the murder of eighteen year old Loyola University of Chicago's

947
00:47:18,480 --> 00:47:23,759
Speaker 5: student Sheridan Gorman. This happened just on March nineteenth, and

948
00:47:23,960 --> 00:47:27,480
Speaker 5: the authorities now say the shooting was deliberate, which we'll

949
00:47:27,520 --> 00:47:30,680
Speaker 5: get back to now. Eighteen year old Sheridan Gorman, she

950
00:47:30,880 --> 00:47:33,600
Speaker 5: was indeed fatally shot. She was walking with friends near

951
00:47:33,640 --> 00:47:38,799
Speaker 5: a pier in Chicago's Rogers Park neighborhood. Seems like they

952
00:47:38,800 --> 00:47:42,480
Speaker 5: had gone to just view the skyline. And what the

953
00:47:42,520 --> 00:47:46,439
Speaker 5: prosecutors say is that while they're out, the suspect.

954
00:47:46,640 --> 00:47:47,480
Speaker 4: Jose G.

955
00:47:47,800 --> 00:47:52,560
Speaker 5: Medina, that Medina emerged from behind a lighthouse, opened fire

956
00:47:52,760 --> 00:47:55,920
Speaker 5: and killed eighteen year old Sheridan Gorman at the scene.

957
00:47:56,920 --> 00:47:57,320
Speaker 3: Awful.

958
00:47:57,880 --> 00:48:00,600
Speaker 5: So, this twenty five year old Medina has been charged

959
00:48:00,880 --> 00:48:04,600
Speaker 5: with quite a few things, first degree murder, attempted first

960
00:48:04,680 --> 00:48:08,040
Speaker 5: degree murder. Again, there were multiple people, three counts of

961
00:48:08,080 --> 00:48:12,399
Speaker 5: aggravated assault, discharge of a firearm, and aggravated unlawful use

962
00:48:12,520 --> 00:48:16,640
Speaker 5: of a weapon. And he was found through security footage

963
00:48:16,680 --> 00:48:19,839
Speaker 5: that tracked him from after the shooting linked him to

964
00:48:19,880 --> 00:48:23,520
Speaker 5: his residence and at that time officers recovered a handgun.

965
00:48:23,840 --> 00:48:27,279
Speaker 5: The bullets matched those used in the killing, and he

966
00:48:27,400 --> 00:48:31,320
Speaker 5: was identified by a building engineer as well as his mother.

967
00:48:32,120 --> 00:48:36,120
Speaker 4: Oh god, his mom, his mom. How brutal is that?

968
00:48:37,760 --> 00:48:41,000
Speaker 2: You can imagine a worse scenario than having to turn

969
00:48:41,000 --> 00:48:44,719
Speaker 2: in your own kid or verify that that's him, you know.

970
00:48:46,000 --> 00:48:48,439
Speaker 4: Right right? And what are you to say?

971
00:48:48,480 --> 00:48:51,080
Speaker 5: I mean, I don't know obviously what happened, but if

972
00:48:51,120 --> 00:48:55,239
Speaker 5: someone shows you a picture or a clip from surveillance

973
00:48:55,360 --> 00:48:58,439
Speaker 5: and says, do you know this person and it's your son,

974
00:48:58,560 --> 00:49:00,960
Speaker 5: what are you going to say?

975
00:49:01,760 --> 00:49:04,960
Speaker 2: I used to say before the Idaho massacre and the

976
00:49:05,000 --> 00:49:07,640
Speaker 2: Idaho student murders that if it was like a really,

977
00:49:07,800 --> 00:49:09,400
Speaker 2: I know this is crazy to say, but if it

978
00:49:09,400 --> 00:49:12,720
Speaker 2: were my brothers or my parents, I would have mum's

979
00:49:12,719 --> 00:49:17,440
Speaker 2: the word. And then after years, oh okay, sorry.

980
00:49:17,239 --> 00:49:18,640
Speaker 4: Listen, I thank you, thankfully.

981
00:49:18,640 --> 00:49:21,560
Speaker 2: I hadn't like contemplated that Sophie's choice too many times,

982
00:49:21,560 --> 00:49:24,040
Speaker 2: and I haven't had that decision. But you know, I

983
00:49:24,080 --> 00:49:26,200
Speaker 2: really believe in the people that I love, and if

984
00:49:26,200 --> 00:49:28,200
Speaker 2: they say they didn't do something, I would believe them

985
00:49:28,200 --> 00:49:32,839
Speaker 2: to the death, and specifically very specific for people. But

986
00:49:33,440 --> 00:49:36,719
Speaker 2: after Idaho and kind of being down that rabbit hole

987
00:49:36,760 --> 00:49:39,680
Speaker 2: for so long, that is definitely not the answer. You

988
00:49:39,880 --> 00:49:44,560
Speaker 2: immediately have to notify authorities. You can support your loved

989
00:49:44,600 --> 00:49:48,640
Speaker 2: one and support them through this horrible process, but if

990
00:49:48,640 --> 00:49:53,040
Speaker 2: they've done something like that, immediately obviously, I know that

991
00:49:53,080 --> 00:49:54,600
Speaker 2: seems obvious.

992
00:49:54,440 --> 00:49:57,520
Speaker 5: No, But I mean, Stephanie, this is a conversation we've

993
00:49:57,520 --> 00:50:01,160
Speaker 5: had going on just nauseum, and I think.

994
00:50:01,040 --> 00:50:04,640
Speaker 2: Both of us get until you're in that situation really right.

995
00:50:04,680 --> 00:50:08,280
Speaker 2: For another, it's so brutal. I mean, it's so brutal.

996
00:50:08,880 --> 00:50:09,479
Speaker 4: I will say.

997
00:50:09,719 --> 00:50:14,440
Speaker 5: What's curious to me is that, again, the authorities say

998
00:50:14,800 --> 00:50:20,919
Speaker 5: that the shooting was deliberate for eighteen year old Sheridan Gorman.

999
00:50:20,960 --> 00:50:24,280
Speaker 3: And it was fandom, right, yeah, well if it was.

1000
00:50:24,480 --> 00:50:29,480
Speaker 5: If you were targeted, well do you remember that initially?

1001
00:50:29,520 --> 00:50:32,960
Speaker 5: And again, this only happened in March nineteenth, and among

1002
00:50:33,000 --> 00:50:37,160
Speaker 5: the initial reports, what authorities said was that they knew

1003
00:50:37,200 --> 00:50:43,319
Speaker 5: Sheridan was not the target before they had a suspect.

1004
00:50:43,920 --> 00:50:46,000
Speaker 3: Oh that's right. We were like, how does that name

1005
00:50:47,120 --> 00:50:48,200
Speaker 3: not endanger girls?

1006
00:50:49,520 --> 00:50:49,719
Speaker 11: Right?

1007
00:50:50,560 --> 00:50:53,239
Speaker 4: Right? I remember when we were doing a story. Didn't

1008
00:50:53,280 --> 00:50:55,479
Speaker 4: he shoot just into the crowd of girls that were

1009
00:50:56,520 --> 00:50:58,080
Speaker 4: That's what it seemed, Yes.

1010
00:50:57,880 --> 00:50:59,480
Speaker 8: And that's what it seemed, and that's why they were

1011
00:50:59,480 --> 00:51:01,920
Speaker 8: saying it was that she wasn't a target. But then

1012
00:51:02,000 --> 00:51:06,160
Speaker 8: if it was deliberate, deliberate doesn't necessarily mean you're a

1013
00:51:06,200 --> 00:51:07,560
Speaker 8: target targeted.

1014
00:51:07,400 --> 00:51:10,839
Speaker 3: Right, meaning he wanted to specifically someone? Yeah?

1015
00:51:10,920 --> 00:51:11,040
Speaker 5: Right?

1016
00:51:11,840 --> 00:51:12,520
Speaker 9: Any person.

1017
00:51:12,640 --> 00:51:14,360
Speaker 4: Okay, it could have been.

1018
00:51:14,239 --> 00:51:15,080
Speaker 3: Any woman.

1019
00:51:16,960 --> 00:51:20,440
Speaker 2: Or maybe any any woman, any grouping of women he

1020
00:51:20,560 --> 00:51:23,320
Speaker 2: wanted to have you know, revenge.

1021
00:51:22,880 --> 00:51:23,759
Speaker 3: With, but it wasn't.

1022
00:51:23,800 --> 00:51:26,200
Speaker 4: I That's that's how I'm pular, young woman.

1023
00:51:27,920 --> 00:51:31,440
Speaker 8: But there's still also the contradiction where they said everyone

1024
00:51:31,600 --> 00:51:35,279
Speaker 8: at the university is safe. So that's true, you know

1025
00:51:35,560 --> 00:51:41,160
Speaker 8: everyone is safe. If this was right, deliberate, senseless, Yeah,

1026
00:51:41,480 --> 00:51:44,839
Speaker 8: I think sometimes I say something to probably keep the

1027
00:51:44,880 --> 00:51:48,040
Speaker 8: masses a bit calm and keep everyone you know, it's

1028
00:51:48,120 --> 00:51:49,280
Speaker 8: you're fine, don't worry.

1029
00:51:49,800 --> 00:51:51,960
Speaker 3: That's what's happening now in a lot of places.

1030
00:51:52,480 --> 00:51:54,160
Speaker 9: True. Mm hmmm.

1031
00:51:54,760 --> 00:51:58,080
Speaker 5: So at this moment, the motive does remain unclear as

1032
00:51:58,120 --> 00:52:03,719
Speaker 5: we're discussing amongst ourselves, and a judge has ordered Medina

1033
00:52:03,760 --> 00:52:08,200
Speaker 5: to be detained, and there's a detension hearing for tomorrow.

1034
00:52:08,320 --> 00:52:10,279
Speaker 4: There's been a public defender appointed.

1035
00:52:11,000 --> 00:52:14,520
Speaker 5: He Medina actually was expected to appear in court but

1036
00:52:14,760 --> 00:52:19,640
Speaker 5: miss the appearance because he was hospitalized with tuberculosis.

1037
00:52:20,160 --> 00:52:24,160
Speaker 4: Tuberculosis, What the heck?

1038
00:52:24,480 --> 00:52:24,840
Speaker 5: Correct?

1039
00:52:24,960 --> 00:52:33,840
Speaker 15: Yeah, that's like I wasn't expecting it's tuberculosis, which actually

1040
00:52:34,040 --> 00:52:38,920
Speaker 15: in places, you know, if there's poor ventilation and crowded

1041
00:52:38,960 --> 00:52:40,080
Speaker 15: living situations.

1042
00:52:40,400 --> 00:52:42,200
Speaker 4: I don't know where Medina lives. You could live in

1043
00:52:42,239 --> 00:52:42,760
Speaker 4: a mansion.

1044
00:52:43,440 --> 00:52:46,960
Speaker 2: But if okay, the fact that there was this bio

1045
00:52:47,120 --> 00:52:51,880
Speaker 2: lab discovered today in California, there was just now multiple

1046
00:52:52,280 --> 00:52:55,000
Speaker 2: have now been found. We've talked about this here or at

1047
00:52:55,000 --> 00:52:58,560
Speaker 2: least between the breaks, that these like straight up coolers

1048
00:52:58,760 --> 00:53:00,040
Speaker 2: of like action.

1049
00:53:00,640 --> 00:53:02,160
Speaker 4: Real viruses.

1050
00:53:02,600 --> 00:53:05,280
Speaker 3: Yeah, I remember I was telling you there.

1051
00:53:05,160 --> 00:53:07,440
Speaker 8: Was one in Vegas. I remember the Vegas one. I

1052
00:53:07,440 --> 00:53:08,440
Speaker 8: didn't know about the new one.

1053
00:53:08,560 --> 00:53:10,800
Speaker 3: No, I do not like it.

1054
00:53:11,440 --> 00:53:13,560
Speaker 9: You're viruses.

1055
00:53:13,960 --> 00:53:15,960
Speaker 4: Yeah, well, so they didn't say what the ones were

1056
00:53:16,040 --> 00:53:17,880
Speaker 4: in Vegas. I mean they might have by now, but

1057
00:53:18,160 --> 00:53:19,880
Speaker 4: they didn't tell us they were just like a bio

1058
00:53:20,000 --> 00:53:21,560
Speaker 4: lab was discovered in a residence.

1059
00:53:21,800 --> 00:53:24,960
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, there's a buyer's one just happened again, another

1060
00:53:25,040 --> 00:53:26,880
Speaker 2: one today in California.

1061
00:53:27,480 --> 00:53:30,120
Speaker 5: Is this when you I'm sorry, I'm just hearing about this.

1062
00:53:30,320 --> 00:53:33,840
Speaker 5: Is this like someone having a homegrown meth lab? Or

1063
00:53:33,880 --> 00:53:35,160
Speaker 5: are they like what is happening?

1064
00:53:36,040 --> 00:53:39,120
Speaker 2: Honestly, this wasn't on our conversation things to talk about.

1065
00:53:39,160 --> 00:53:41,719
Speaker 2: But I had just read earlier today that is there

1066
00:53:41,840 --> 00:53:44,600
Speaker 2: because I'm like somehow alerted to this. Now this is

1067
00:53:44,640 --> 00:53:47,759
Speaker 2: like the second or third time that I've seen this that,

1068
00:53:48,000 --> 00:53:49,640
Speaker 2: and I don't want to get the facts wrong, but

1069
00:53:49,680 --> 00:53:53,279
Speaker 2: it's some random house. Think of it like a meth

1070
00:53:53,320 --> 00:53:57,799
Speaker 2: house basically, and instead there's not meth. There's like what

1071
00:53:57,920 --> 00:54:01,200
Speaker 2: appeared to be like dirty coolers like you would see

1072
00:54:01,239 --> 00:54:04,040
Speaker 2: like on a fishing boat basically, you know, those big

1073
00:54:04,080 --> 00:54:04,720
Speaker 2: white ones.

1074
00:54:04,880 --> 00:54:06,560
Speaker 4: And yeah, those big white coolers.

1075
00:54:06,760 --> 00:54:08,480
Speaker 3: There are viruses.

1076
00:54:08,800 --> 00:54:10,960
Speaker 8: Well, yeah, we'll look into that one and maybe that's

1077
00:54:10,960 --> 00:54:13,520
Speaker 8: something we will talk about in Sunday and unpack it

1078
00:54:13,560 --> 00:54:15,200
Speaker 8: and we'll do some research into.

1079
00:54:15,719 --> 00:54:17,640
Speaker 9: Specifically, because my mind immediately goes.

1080
00:54:17,520 --> 00:54:20,240
Speaker 8: To, like, is this some sort of you know, biochemical

1081
00:54:20,520 --> 00:54:21,640
Speaker 8: warfare planning?

1082
00:54:21,840 --> 00:54:22,040
Speaker 4: Oh?

1083
00:54:22,120 --> 00:54:24,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, well it is, but I don't think it's unusual

1084
00:54:24,680 --> 00:54:27,000
Speaker 2: unfortunately either. I think this is now we've talked about

1085
00:54:27,000 --> 00:54:29,000
Speaker 2: it here multiple times at this point over the last

1086
00:54:29,520 --> 00:54:33,239
Speaker 2: nine months or seven months, so not particularly it's not

1087
00:54:33,280 --> 00:54:36,239
Speaker 2: particularly great, but I don't know that it's to sound

1088
00:54:36,320 --> 00:54:40,319
Speaker 2: the alarm situation, and thankfully, thankfully they were able to

1089
00:54:40,400 --> 00:54:44,320
Speaker 2: thwart whatever the plan was. Okay, And there was another

1090
00:54:44,360 --> 00:54:48,279
Speaker 2: scenario where one of these biolabs was found and the

1091
00:54:48,440 --> 00:54:52,239
Speaker 2: officers who went into the biolab to get these like,

1092
00:54:52,400 --> 00:54:54,839
Speaker 2: you know, it looks like a house like a crack house, right,

1093
00:54:54,840 --> 00:54:57,080
Speaker 2: and I think you know, maybe the first responders got

1094
00:54:57,120 --> 00:54:58,920
Speaker 2: a little set.

1095
00:54:58,520 --> 00:55:02,200
Speaker 5: Oh dear, well, we'll definitely look into that. And if

1096
00:55:02,200 --> 00:55:05,879
Speaker 5: you're just joining us, this is true crime tonight. We're

1097
00:55:05,920 --> 00:55:08,520
Speaker 5: talking about coolers full of biohazards.

1098
00:55:09,000 --> 00:55:09,680
Speaker 4: Don't be alarmed.

1099
00:55:09,680 --> 00:55:12,080
Speaker 3: Everyone knows anything more about it, please share.

1100
00:55:12,560 --> 00:55:14,080
Speaker 5: Yeah, give us a call eight A eight three to

1101
00:55:14,080 --> 00:55:18,120
Speaker 5: one crime And we are now going to go and

1102
00:55:18,200 --> 00:55:20,160
Speaker 5: body's going to fill us in what's going on with

1103
00:55:20,280 --> 00:55:21,759
Speaker 5: the Corey Richins case.

1104
00:55:22,440 --> 00:55:24,560
Speaker 4: So we got some jury tea. You guys want the

1105
00:55:24,640 --> 00:55:27,320
Speaker 4: jury tea. Of course I'm here for the jury t

1106
00:55:27,480 --> 00:55:31,600
Speaker 4: because I always like to know what compelled them to

1107
00:55:31,960 --> 00:55:35,080
Speaker 4: what piece of evidence did they find most compelling? So

1108
00:55:35,080 --> 00:55:36,960
Speaker 4: I always love when the jury comes forward. So of

1109
00:55:36,960 --> 00:55:40,560
Speaker 4: course we're going to cover this one. So jurors in,

1110
00:55:40,960 --> 00:55:44,280
Speaker 4: you know, this is the murder trial of the Utah

1111
00:55:44,520 --> 00:55:47,960
Speaker 4: mom and children's book author. I'm using air quotes when

1112
00:55:47,960 --> 00:55:51,920
Speaker 4: I say author Corey Richins are now speaking out about

1113
00:55:51,920 --> 00:55:55,560
Speaker 4: what they said behind those closed doors. Corey. For those

1114
00:55:55,560 --> 00:55:58,279
Speaker 4: who don't know Corey Richins, she's thirty five years old.

1115
00:55:59,080 --> 00:56:02,560
Speaker 4: She was accused of killing her husband Eric Richins in

1116
00:56:02,640 --> 00:56:06,040
Speaker 4: February of twenty twenty two by making him like a

1117
00:56:06,040 --> 00:56:10,720
Speaker 4: moscow mule and lacing it with fentanyl. The apparent motive

1118
00:56:10,920 --> 00:56:13,920
Speaker 4: was to collect insurance, gain control of the couple's finances,

1119
00:56:14,520 --> 00:56:17,960
Speaker 4: and continue this extra marital affair she was having. So

1120
00:56:18,080 --> 00:56:21,960
Speaker 4: on March sixteenth, a Utah jury found Corey Richins guilty

1121
00:56:22,560 --> 00:56:27,040
Speaker 4: of aggravated murder, insurance fraud, and forgery. Was sentencing scheduled

1122
00:56:27,080 --> 00:56:31,160
Speaker 4: for May thirteenth. So here's the tea. So the jury

1123
00:56:31,200 --> 00:56:33,359
Speaker 4: returned a guilty verdict and it was only like two

1124
00:56:33,400 --> 00:56:37,200
Speaker 4: and a half hours they were in deliberations. Yeah, yeah,

1125
00:56:37,360 --> 00:56:41,160
Speaker 4: the jury for person. It was a woman and her

1126
00:56:41,239 --> 00:56:44,600
Speaker 4: name is Laura. We now know, okay, So she said,

1127
00:56:44,640 --> 00:56:48,680
Speaker 4: we came into the We came into the deliberation fully

1128
00:56:48,719 --> 00:56:52,560
Speaker 4: loaded to evaluate the case. Jurors did not take an

1129
00:56:52,560 --> 00:56:55,439
Speaker 4: immediate vote. Initially, they didn't sit down and say, okay,

1130
00:56:55,440 --> 00:56:59,880
Speaker 4: what's everybody feel, But they did hold a roundtable discussion.

1131
00:57:00,080 --> 00:57:03,160
Speaker 4: They were focusing on the evidence and ignoring all the

1132
00:57:03,200 --> 00:57:06,560
Speaker 4: fluff and drama, which I appreciate, you know, just get

1133
00:57:06,680 --> 00:57:10,680
Speaker 4: right to the evidence. The jury four person Laura said

1134
00:57:10,680 --> 00:57:14,120
Speaker 4: that the panel hoped to acquit, noting people were really

1135
00:57:14,160 --> 00:57:16,640
Speaker 4: sad because they did not want to find her guilty

1136
00:57:17,160 --> 00:57:19,840
Speaker 4: and we couldn't come to the conclusion and it was

1137
00:57:19,920 --> 00:57:24,680
Speaker 4: really heartbreaking. That's incredible to me. They felt bad, probably

1138
00:57:24,720 --> 00:57:27,240
Speaker 4: because of the kids, right, Yes, of course, you know

1139
00:57:27,400 --> 00:57:31,080
Speaker 4: they felt bad about it. The jury four person Laura,

1140
00:57:31,200 --> 00:57:34,840
Speaker 4: said that the cell phone data and forensics evidence left

1141
00:57:35,080 --> 00:57:40,240
Speaker 4: no conclusion other than she was guilty. Too.

1142
00:57:40,600 --> 00:57:43,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, that did it for me too. For me, it

1143
00:57:43,360 --> 00:57:49,480
Speaker 2: was the housekeeper, but you know that kind of sealed

1144
00:57:49,520 --> 00:57:50,200
Speaker 2: her fate.

1145
00:57:51,520 --> 00:57:55,720
Speaker 4: Made me a combination with all the forensics. I'm sorry, please,

1146
00:57:57,040 --> 00:58:02,280
Speaker 4: I didn't mean to interrupt you, core Okay, So the

1147
00:58:02,360 --> 00:58:06,120
Speaker 4: jury reached. The jury reacted strongly to the fact that

1148
00:58:06,160 --> 00:58:10,440
Speaker 4: Corey had authored this children's book on grief for her sons.

1149
00:58:10,480 --> 00:58:13,280
Speaker 4: After the murder. She said, everyone felt like they were

1150
00:58:13,360 --> 00:58:17,160
Speaker 4: hit with the truck. It was so odd and so strange.

1151
00:58:17,720 --> 00:58:21,120
Speaker 4: So multiple jurors expressed sadness over the verdict, which, gosh,

1152
00:58:21,120 --> 00:58:23,400
Speaker 4: you know, they had this young woman's life in their hand.

1153
00:58:23,520 --> 00:58:26,320
Speaker 4: I really do appreciate that they took this so seriously.

1154
00:58:27,800 --> 00:58:31,400
Speaker 4: She said that this is this devastating reality that this

1155
00:58:31,440 --> 00:58:34,560
Speaker 4: family was torn apart and the poor kids will never

1156
00:58:34,640 --> 00:58:38,880
Speaker 4: have a dad or a mom, right, they really really,

1157
00:58:39,000 --> 00:58:42,360
Speaker 4: I really wicked though she killed their dad.

1158
00:58:43,000 --> 00:58:46,680
Speaker 2: You know there's a wicked in her to do that, right, Yeah,

1159
00:58:46,680 --> 00:58:49,160
Speaker 2: it wasn't to protect her kids either. It wasn't like,

1160
00:58:49,800 --> 00:58:51,600
Speaker 2: you know, I'm going to change my vote here because

1161
00:58:51,600 --> 00:58:54,240
Speaker 2: I know our earlier story maybe seemed as though we

1162
00:58:54,240 --> 00:58:58,000
Speaker 2: were being a big glib But this is one that

1163
00:58:58,080 --> 00:59:02,200
Speaker 2: I completely think she's z oh deserves where she's going.

1164
00:59:02,320 --> 00:59:05,360
Speaker 2: She got sympathy for this. She's the one that decided

1165
00:59:05,400 --> 00:59:07,960
Speaker 2: that her kids were going to grow up without a father,

1166
00:59:08,280 --> 00:59:10,720
Speaker 2: and he had done really nothing wrong other than he

1167
00:59:10,760 --> 00:59:13,440
Speaker 2: had money in his pocket that she wanted and she

1168
00:59:13,480 --> 00:59:16,440
Speaker 2: had like put herself in a financial hole and had

1169
00:59:16,480 --> 00:59:18,360
Speaker 2: fallen for somebody else who, by the way, she was

1170
00:59:18,400 --> 00:59:19,320
Speaker 2: going to torture that guy.

1171
00:59:19,440 --> 00:59:20,480
Speaker 4: Also, that was.

1172
00:59:20,480 --> 00:59:23,280
Speaker 2: Another one that like this man really loved her the

1173
00:59:23,280 --> 00:59:26,240
Speaker 2: boyfriend or you know, thought kind of highly of her.

1174
00:59:26,680 --> 00:59:29,959
Speaker 2: She could have twisted up his life too, So shame

1175
00:59:30,040 --> 00:59:31,800
Speaker 2: on you, Corey Richards. And then she wrote that darn

1176
00:59:31,800 --> 00:59:34,680
Speaker 2: book that she didn't actually really even right, pants on fire,

1177
00:59:34,800 --> 00:59:35,560
Speaker 2: Cory Richards.

1178
00:59:35,600 --> 00:59:39,080
Speaker 4: Right, So it's interesting that you bring up Josh the

1179
00:59:39,120 --> 00:59:42,920
Speaker 4: boyfriend because jurors they were really impacted by his emotional incessent.

1180
00:59:42,960 --> 00:59:45,640
Speaker 4: If you remember, he was like hit his head in

1181
00:59:45,680 --> 00:59:49,200
Speaker 4: his hands. He was he was mortified. He was mortified, Yeah,

1182
00:59:49,200 --> 00:59:53,480
Speaker 4: he was. It seemed like he felt guilty, but also

1183
00:59:53,640 --> 00:59:56,240
Speaker 4: like really just sad about the romance, you know, like

1184
00:59:56,480 --> 00:59:59,920
Speaker 4: he loved her. So they were impacted by his testimony,

1185
01:00:00,240 --> 01:00:02,960
Speaker 4: which really surprised some of the members. We heard from

1186
01:00:02,960 --> 01:00:07,600
Speaker 4: another juror, juror Christine. So Christine said that Corey appeared

1187
01:00:07,720 --> 01:00:12,160
Speaker 4: small and frail and emotionless, making it really difficult to gature,

1188
01:00:12,800 --> 01:00:15,880
Speaker 4: while Laura, the jury four person, described her as like

1189
01:00:15,920 --> 01:00:20,520
Speaker 4: a statue during the trial and the reading. Court filings

1190
01:00:20,520 --> 01:00:25,800
Speaker 4: are indicating that Corey's mom, Lisa, could have been involved

1191
01:00:25,840 --> 01:00:28,919
Speaker 4: and may have testified, prompting the defense to request court

1192
01:00:28,920 --> 01:00:31,880
Speaker 4: appointed counsel to protect her rights, but she didn't testify.

1193
01:00:32,360 --> 01:00:36,480
Speaker 4: A twenty twenty three after, David noted that Corey's mom, Lisa,

1194
01:00:36,680 --> 01:00:41,000
Speaker 4: Lisa's her mom, her partner died from an oxy toxicity

1195
01:00:41,040 --> 01:00:43,000
Speaker 4: in two thousand and six, raising suspicion.

1196
01:00:43,000 --> 01:00:46,120
Speaker 2: We talked about this off camera. Is it possible that

1197
01:00:46,200 --> 01:00:47,160
Speaker 2: she was raised.

1198
01:00:47,000 --> 01:00:53,680
Speaker 4: She learned from her mom? Right? So right? She disputed it,

1199
01:00:53,880 --> 01:00:57,160
Speaker 4: saying that the death was part of the overall opioid

1200
01:00:57,160 --> 01:01:00,360
Speaker 4: crisis that most of America was experiencing, and it so

1201
01:01:00,440 --> 01:01:03,160
Speaker 4: not very much into it. It is fair, but it

1202
01:01:03,200 --> 01:01:06,040
Speaker 4: is interesting, right right, It is interesting.

1203
01:01:06,240 --> 01:01:09,200
Speaker 2: I'm really curious about And again it does not matter

1204
01:01:09,240 --> 01:01:12,440
Speaker 2: because Corey did a very wicked bad thing and deserves

1205
01:01:12,480 --> 01:01:14,520
Speaker 2: the time that she's getting for the crime. But I'm

1206
01:01:14,560 --> 01:01:16,640
Speaker 2: just like, how does that go so sideways? Like what

1207
01:01:16,800 --> 01:01:19,840
Speaker 2: happened with Corey to get her to this point? She

1208
01:01:19,880 --> 01:01:22,680
Speaker 2: could have had a happy, healthy life. Greet There's lots

1209
01:01:22,720 --> 01:01:25,040
Speaker 2: of opportunities, beautiful.

1210
01:01:24,680 --> 01:01:28,600
Speaker 5: Kids, Listen, stick around. We have astrologist Kim Allen joining us.

1211
01:01:39,640 --> 01:01:42,840
Speaker 2: Welcome back to True Crime tonight on iHeartRadio. We're talking

1212
01:01:42,840 --> 01:01:45,840
Speaker 2: true crime all the time. I'm Stephanie Leidecker here with

1213
01:01:45,960 --> 01:01:48,080
Speaker 2: Courtney Armstrong and body.

1214
01:01:47,760 --> 01:01:48,840
Speaker 3: Move in and listen.

1215
01:01:49,040 --> 01:01:51,880
Speaker 2: I don't know about you, but the stars have been

1216
01:01:51,960 --> 01:01:55,920
Speaker 2: making me crazy. So we have our favorite psychic and astrologer,

1217
01:01:56,000 --> 01:01:57,000
Speaker 2: Kim Allen back.

1218
01:01:57,760 --> 01:01:58,120
Speaker 4: Courtney.

1219
01:01:58,120 --> 01:01:59,320
Speaker 3: Do you want to give us a little bit of

1220
01:01:59,320 --> 01:01:59,960
Speaker 3: a setup?

1221
01:02:00,280 --> 01:02:04,720
Speaker 5: I do, Kim. We have been so collectively excited. Kim

1222
01:02:04,920 --> 01:02:06,960
Speaker 5: Allen is who were joined by and she is an

1223
01:02:06,960 --> 01:02:10,920
Speaker 5: astrologer in psychic with more than twenty years of experience

1224
01:02:10,960 --> 01:02:14,080
Speaker 5: helping people, really helping people make sense out of all

1225
01:02:14,120 --> 01:02:18,080
Speaker 5: of life's mysteries through the stars. And Kim has been

1226
01:02:18,120 --> 01:02:21,640
Speaker 5: featured in Vanity Fair and named one of New York's

1227
01:02:21,640 --> 01:02:25,760
Speaker 5: top psychics by Time Out. And you can also hear

1228
01:02:25,920 --> 01:02:30,840
Speaker 5: Kim on Nashally syndicated radio. So tonight, we're so excited

1229
01:02:30,840 --> 01:02:33,800
Speaker 5: to have you to break down how astrology may connect

1230
01:02:33,800 --> 01:02:37,720
Speaker 5: to sort of behavior, decision making, and true crime. Since

1231
01:02:37,720 --> 01:02:40,120
Speaker 5: we are true crime tonight, so welcome from all of us.

1232
01:02:40,240 --> 01:02:43,000
Speaker 10: Kim, Yes, thank you, I'm so honored to be here.

1233
01:02:43,520 --> 01:02:44,720
Speaker 4: Can you start out?

1234
01:02:44,800 --> 01:02:47,880
Speaker 5: Okay, this isn't crime, but sometimes the effects feel criminal.

1235
01:02:48,080 --> 01:02:51,320
Speaker 5: Can you, in simple terms, tell us what is mercury

1236
01:02:51,400 --> 01:02:52,200
Speaker 5: and retrograde?

1237
01:02:52,520 --> 01:02:56,000
Speaker 10: Oh, mercury and retrograde, his pliant. The planet Mercury, the

1238
01:02:56,040 --> 01:03:00,480
Speaker 10: planet of communication, is thinking and short distance travel. It

1239
01:03:00,680 --> 01:03:04,160
Speaker 10: takes a sort of like a vacation three times a year,

1240
01:03:04,440 --> 01:03:07,200
Speaker 10: and that is called the Mercury retrograde. It's an optical

1241
01:03:07,240 --> 01:03:10,600
Speaker 10: illusion a planet, a scene as though it's going backwards

1242
01:03:11,000 --> 01:03:13,400
Speaker 10: in the sky, but it's not really going backwards. But

1243
01:03:13,520 --> 01:03:17,560
Speaker 10: what happens is that the energies go inwards and you

1244
01:03:17,640 --> 01:03:21,240
Speaker 10: can feel the change. It affects how we think, how

1245
01:03:21,280 --> 01:03:23,920
Speaker 10: we speak, you know, it affects a lot of things

1246
01:03:23,920 --> 01:03:28,040
Speaker 10: that are around us, like computers and know our thinking

1247
01:03:28,160 --> 01:03:30,800
Speaker 10: process and how we relate to others. That's what's going

1248
01:03:30,840 --> 01:03:32,240
Speaker 10: on during the Mercury retrograde.

1249
01:03:33,120 --> 01:03:36,160
Speaker 2: Like all your tech can break right, or your your

1250
01:03:36,240 --> 01:03:39,480
Speaker 2: laptop suddenly doesn't work, or you can't log on all

1251
01:03:39,520 --> 01:03:40,720
Speaker 2: of the stuff.

1252
01:03:40,880 --> 01:03:44,040
Speaker 10: Apparently anything floating in the air the Mercury retrograde will

1253
01:03:44,040 --> 01:03:48,080
Speaker 10: have something to do with it. It also affects things

1254
01:03:48,120 --> 01:03:50,360
Speaker 10: happening with the airline industry.

1255
01:03:52,120 --> 01:03:53,040
Speaker 4: All that tracks.

1256
01:03:53,240 --> 01:03:56,360
Speaker 10: There's a lot of disruptions, a lot of disruption with

1257
01:03:56,480 --> 01:03:59,600
Speaker 10: the airline industries during the Mercury retrograde.

1258
01:04:00,120 --> 01:04:00,640
Speaker 3: Explanation.

1259
01:04:00,960 --> 01:04:04,520
Speaker 5: Yeah, well, we are certainly seeing that bear out times

1260
01:04:04,800 --> 01:04:08,680
Speaker 5: a very large number. But thank you for clarifying, if

1261
01:04:08,720 --> 01:04:11,320
Speaker 5: you will. We'd love to turn to the world of

1262
01:04:11,360 --> 01:04:15,960
Speaker 5: true crime. So, okay, my understanding is that you took

1263
01:04:16,040 --> 01:04:19,400
Speaker 5: a look into Rex Huerman, who we were talking about

1264
01:04:19,440 --> 01:04:23,280
Speaker 5: earlier tonight, because by chance or not, he is accused

1265
01:04:23,280 --> 01:04:25,480
Speaker 5: of being the Long Island serial killer, and it seems

1266
01:04:25,480 --> 01:04:29,480
Speaker 5: he may be pleading guilty. But when you looked at

1267
01:04:29,560 --> 01:04:35,120
Speaker 5: him what stands out to you sort of behaviorally or astrologically, So.

1268
01:04:35,200 --> 01:04:37,840
Speaker 10: It's very interesting. He is a Virgo. He was born

1269
01:04:37,960 --> 01:04:41,600
Speaker 10: nine thirteen, nineteen sixty three. He was born on Friday

1270
01:04:41,640 --> 01:04:44,919
Speaker 10: the thirteenth, Just a little pigot for you. And when

1271
01:04:44,920 --> 01:04:48,440
Speaker 10: you look at a chart, he has five planets in Virgo.

1272
01:04:49,000 --> 01:04:52,520
Speaker 10: Five plans in Virgo. That's a stelium and what Virgo

1273
01:04:52,720 --> 01:04:56,560
Speaker 10: is a planet of meticulousness and details and you know,

1274
01:04:57,480 --> 01:05:00,920
Speaker 10: having things in order, and with so as many planets

1275
01:05:00,920 --> 01:05:04,640
Speaker 10: in Virgo, he can become very obsessive. He has a

1276
01:05:04,800 --> 01:05:08,400
Speaker 10: very interesting chart because his chart is very dark. He

1277
01:05:08,480 --> 01:05:11,720
Speaker 10: has he has his nest zone, which is his planets,

1278
01:05:11,760 --> 01:05:16,400
Speaker 10: a planet of illusions in Scorpio that's very sexual. He

1279
01:05:16,480 --> 01:05:21,240
Speaker 10: also has his Mars in Scorpio, which is also very sexual.

1280
01:05:21,680 --> 01:05:24,320
Speaker 10: So but it's in his twelve house, the house of

1281
01:05:24,520 --> 01:05:28,400
Speaker 10: hidden secrets. So he was a very obsessed person and

1282
01:05:28,560 --> 01:05:31,840
Speaker 10: keeping things very quiet and very private with you know,

1283
01:05:31,920 --> 01:05:37,120
Speaker 10: his obsessions with sexual relationship and constantly thinking about saying.

1284
01:05:37,480 --> 01:05:39,840
Speaker 10: The other thing that's very interesting about his chart is

1285
01:05:39,880 --> 01:05:42,240
Speaker 10: that he has Pluto, the planet of power and control

1286
01:05:42,320 --> 01:05:46,880
Speaker 10: and transformation, conjuncting his son, which means he was able

1287
01:05:46,960 --> 01:05:50,840
Speaker 10: to hide. He was very good at disguising himself, but

1288
01:05:51,000 --> 01:05:54,400
Speaker 10: because of the affussness, he was not able to really

1289
01:05:54,680 --> 01:05:58,160
Speaker 10: stop doing what he was doing, and he eventually got caught.

1290
01:05:58,360 --> 01:06:01,320
Speaker 5: That is so in I'm I'm literally just kind of

1291
01:06:01,680 --> 01:06:06,040
Speaker 5: jaw dropped here. And also with the attention to detail,

1292
01:06:06,080 --> 01:06:08,880
Speaker 5: and I believe he said five planets were focused on that,

1293
01:06:09,240 --> 01:06:12,960
Speaker 5: even his chosen profession of being an architect, with the

1294
01:06:13,000 --> 01:06:15,280
Speaker 5: amount of details that all.

1295
01:06:15,200 --> 01:06:17,800
Speaker 2: Seems to sort of time I forget even the crime

1296
01:06:17,840 --> 01:06:20,440
Speaker 2: scenes and things or like. For example, we were talking

1297
01:06:20,480 --> 01:06:24,080
Speaker 2: about this earlier, he had an Excel document of like

1298
01:06:24,120 --> 01:06:27,520
Speaker 2: a murder list that basically listed all of the different

1299
01:06:27,560 --> 01:06:30,840
Speaker 2: items he would need. It's several pages long, I might add,

1300
01:06:30,840 --> 01:06:32,960
Speaker 2: and it's down to the kind of tape, the rope,

1301
01:06:33,040 --> 01:06:39,120
Speaker 2: the nails seems to do categorized like real, real detail,

1302
01:06:39,240 --> 01:06:41,720
Speaker 2: to the point of it being extraordinarily haunting.

1303
01:06:42,120 --> 01:06:44,480
Speaker 10: He was really a character. He really is a character.

1304
01:06:44,840 --> 01:06:46,560
Speaker 2: Can I ask a quick question before we move on

1305
01:06:46,600 --> 01:06:49,960
Speaker 2: from Rex. If you're looking at someone's charts and it's

1306
01:06:50,000 --> 01:06:51,960
Speaker 2: based on their birth date and their time, I don't

1307
01:06:52,000 --> 01:06:54,320
Speaker 2: have my time of birth, so I'm never able to

1308
01:06:54,360 --> 01:06:56,680
Speaker 2: actually figure this out. But if you look at someone's chart,

1309
01:06:57,040 --> 01:06:59,400
Speaker 2: can you tell like, wow, this is a real psychopath

1310
01:06:59,520 --> 01:07:00,240
Speaker 2: or this person.

1311
01:07:00,160 --> 01:07:01,960
Speaker 3: And has killer instincts.

1312
01:07:02,080 --> 01:07:04,720
Speaker 2: That is that that's a little too dark when you

1313
01:07:04,720 --> 01:07:06,680
Speaker 2: said he had a lot of darkness in his chart.

1314
01:07:07,120 --> 01:07:08,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, interesting.

1315
01:07:08,360 --> 01:07:10,600
Speaker 10: So what you can do with a person's charge who

1316
01:07:10,640 --> 01:07:13,360
Speaker 10: doesn't have their birth time, You do a solar chart

1317
01:07:13,680 --> 01:07:16,320
Speaker 10: and that is based on the planet in the sky

1318
01:07:16,520 --> 01:07:20,000
Speaker 10: during during that day, and based on how the planet

1319
01:07:20,120 --> 01:07:23,000
Speaker 10: interacts with one another, you can tell a lot about

1320
01:07:23,000 --> 01:07:26,280
Speaker 10: what is going on with their personality. And with his chart,

1321
01:07:26,360 --> 01:07:28,600
Speaker 10: a lot of people don't have this to his time

1322
01:07:28,640 --> 01:07:31,000
Speaker 10: of birth, so you know, so you know we do.

1323
01:07:32,280 --> 01:07:34,880
Speaker 10: So I did a daytime chart and a night time

1324
01:07:34,960 --> 01:07:37,560
Speaker 10: chart and sort of came up to what really thick

1325
01:07:37,600 --> 01:07:40,680
Speaker 10: what was going on. And what was really remarkable to

1326
01:07:40,720 --> 01:07:43,800
Speaker 10: me is that he those planets in his twelve house

1327
01:07:43,920 --> 01:07:47,040
Speaker 10: really was the key in the you know, the key

1328
01:07:47,360 --> 01:07:51,160
Speaker 10: and opening the door, because it really displayed what he

1329
01:07:51,320 --> 01:07:54,600
Speaker 10: was hiding and what his obsessiveness was. And the twelve

1330
01:07:54,640 --> 01:07:57,360
Speaker 10: house is the house of the undoing. So his sexual

1331
01:07:57,400 --> 01:08:00,640
Speaker 10: behavior and his sexual secrets were really the thing that

1332
01:08:01,360 --> 01:08:04,040
Speaker 10: unchanged his life and a thing that really broke him down.

1333
01:08:04,200 --> 01:08:07,760
Speaker 4: Wow, does everyone have a house of undoing?

1334
01:08:08,120 --> 01:08:08,280
Speaker 16: Oh?

1335
01:08:08,360 --> 01:08:11,360
Speaker 10: Yes, everyone has twelve houses, and that twelve house is

1336
01:08:11,400 --> 01:08:13,800
Speaker 10: a house of secrets and the house is undoing, and

1337
01:08:13,880 --> 01:08:16,680
Speaker 10: it depends on what planets are floating through there that

1338
01:08:16,760 --> 01:08:19,040
Speaker 10: you can really say, you know, you have to be

1339
01:08:19,040 --> 01:08:21,080
Speaker 10: careful with this or you should keep an eye on that.

1340
01:08:21,880 --> 01:08:24,360
Speaker 10: And it also relates to your past life. The twelve

1341
01:08:24,400 --> 01:08:26,120
Speaker 10: house can tell you a lot about what was going

1342
01:08:26,160 --> 01:08:29,320
Speaker 10: on in your twelve line, your past life. For instance,

1343
01:08:29,400 --> 01:08:32,200
Speaker 10: if a person has like a Jupiter or like a

1344
01:08:32,280 --> 01:08:34,720
Speaker 10: Venus in the twelve house, you know you can say

1345
01:08:34,760 --> 01:08:36,880
Speaker 10: that this person has a guardian angel. They brought a

1346
01:08:36,880 --> 01:08:39,760
Speaker 10: guardian angel over from their pastline. They have some good

1347
01:08:39,840 --> 01:08:43,240
Speaker 10: karma that's always going to be looking after him after them.

1348
01:08:43,240 --> 01:08:45,160
Speaker 10: So I always look at the twelve house and see

1349
01:08:45,280 --> 01:08:47,559
Speaker 10: what is it that you have brought with you, good

1350
01:08:47,680 --> 01:08:50,200
Speaker 10: or bad, and so you'll know how to deal with it.

1351
01:08:50,400 --> 01:08:53,320
Speaker 3: I think I have that very good. I have a

1352
01:08:53,360 --> 01:08:54,200
Speaker 3: guardian angels.

1353
01:08:54,200 --> 01:08:56,040
Speaker 2: I'm thinking I feel like I've been in some sticky

1354
01:08:56,080 --> 01:08:58,920
Speaker 2: situations and if not for the angels.

1355
01:08:58,520 --> 01:09:03,800
Speaker 4: Above, absolutely think that bears out for you. Stephanie.

1356
01:09:04,000 --> 01:09:07,360
Speaker 5: Oh interesting, listen if anyone happens to be joining us

1357
01:09:07,439 --> 01:09:09,639
Speaker 5: right now. This is true crime tonight. We're so very

1358
01:09:09,680 --> 01:09:12,519
Speaker 5: pleased to be joined by Kim Allen. She is an

1359
01:09:12,560 --> 01:09:17,400
Speaker 5: astrologer and psychic with two decades of experience and ps.

1360
01:09:17,520 --> 01:09:22,360
Speaker 5: She's been featured in Vanity Fair. I think, Stephanie, you

1361
01:09:22,400 --> 01:09:26,640
Speaker 5: brought up Jeffrey Epstein. Do we want to turn our attentions?

1362
01:09:26,760 --> 01:09:27,160
Speaker 4: Yeah?

1363
01:09:27,240 --> 01:09:29,320
Speaker 2: I mean so last time Kim was here, she went

1364
01:09:29,320 --> 01:09:33,479
Speaker 2: through Jeffrey Epstein's chart in Gileen Maxwell's chart, which again

1365
01:09:33,560 --> 01:09:37,080
Speaker 2: also had sort of this magnetism between them. It seems like,

1366
01:09:37,320 --> 01:09:42,040
Speaker 2: you know, there were some deviant undertones for certain right trickery,

1367
01:09:42,520 --> 01:09:45,040
Speaker 2: all of these like not so great qualities, right, So

1368
01:09:45,080 --> 01:09:47,320
Speaker 2: it seems like those two are two peas in a pod.

1369
01:09:48,040 --> 01:09:50,439
Speaker 2: So who should we think about next in the world

1370
01:09:50,479 --> 01:09:53,160
Speaker 2: of Epstein. I guess whether or not he committed suicide.

1371
01:09:53,200 --> 01:09:56,759
Speaker 2: Like that's a big, like never ending debate. It actually

1372
01:09:56,800 --> 01:10:00,240
Speaker 2: seems like it's so divided, you know, based on what

1373
01:10:00,320 --> 01:10:02,960
Speaker 2: a report was is that he took his own life

1374
01:10:03,240 --> 01:10:06,519
Speaker 2: and that there was just this myriad of very bad

1375
01:10:06,640 --> 01:10:10,280
Speaker 2: things that went wrong that evening at the facility that

1376
01:10:10,320 --> 01:10:11,479
Speaker 2: he was being housed at.

1377
01:10:11,560 --> 01:10:13,880
Speaker 3: The officers fell asleep at.

1378
01:10:13,760 --> 01:10:17,479
Speaker 2: The guards they were napping, and like everything that could

1379
01:10:17,479 --> 01:10:20,080
Speaker 2: have gone wrong that night went wrong right, and they

1380
01:10:20,120 --> 01:10:24,000
Speaker 2: did an investigation and it was deemed a suicide. However,

1381
01:10:24,479 --> 01:10:28,080
Speaker 2: we've had other forensics experts ours included Joseph Scott Morgan

1382
01:10:28,320 --> 01:10:31,040
Speaker 2: and by the way, like the guys, like the many

1383
01:10:31,120 --> 01:10:34,960
Speaker 2: many have come forward to say no, no, no, there's

1384
01:10:35,000 --> 01:10:38,840
Speaker 2: a cover up and he was either killed or he

1385
01:10:39,120 --> 01:10:43,040
Speaker 2: was pretend killed, and there was I mean, this is

1386
01:10:43,080 --> 01:10:46,320
Speaker 2: like the online conspiracy chatter that he's somehow still alive

1387
01:10:46,479 --> 01:10:48,320
Speaker 2: and his body is not dead.

1388
01:10:48,880 --> 01:10:50,400
Speaker 3: There you have it, Caim, What do you think? Tell

1389
01:10:50,439 --> 01:10:51,640
Speaker 3: us what the stars say about it?

1390
01:10:52,479 --> 01:10:57,240
Speaker 10: The thing is that it's very suspect about his death. Yes,

1391
01:10:57,280 --> 01:11:02,000
Speaker 10: so many things are beginning to to light, especially over

1392
01:11:02,040 --> 01:11:05,200
Speaker 10: the last couple of days. They have found evidence of

1393
01:11:05,640 --> 01:11:09,360
Speaker 10: his files being shredded, and all sorts of weird things

1394
01:11:09,400 --> 01:11:12,839
Speaker 10: have been going on with the guard that was supposed

1395
01:11:12,880 --> 01:11:15,800
Speaker 10: to be had supposed to have been on duty, and

1396
01:11:15,920 --> 01:11:18,280
Speaker 10: she was receiving this money in her all of a sudden,

1397
01:11:18,280 --> 01:11:22,679
Speaker 10: her savings accounting account. So there's a lot of things coming.

1398
01:11:22,800 --> 01:11:24,840
Speaker 10: So what I took a look at his chart, what

1399
01:11:24,920 --> 01:11:28,080
Speaker 10: ide is I did a psychic reading on Jeffrey. And

1400
01:11:28,680 --> 01:11:31,479
Speaker 10: the thing is is that I believe that the ghost

1401
01:11:31,560 --> 01:11:35,120
Speaker 10: of Jeffrey Epstein is helping this case. There is somebody

1402
01:11:35,200 --> 01:11:38,280
Speaker 10: is going to either talk or there's going to be

1403
01:11:38,400 --> 01:11:42,280
Speaker 10: some information related to it that's going to come clear,

1404
01:11:42,640 --> 01:11:45,160
Speaker 10: and we're going to see what happens this summer. You know.

1405
01:11:45,240 --> 01:11:47,760
Speaker 10: The interesting thing is also the autopsy. There was a

1406
01:11:47,800 --> 01:11:50,720
Speaker 10: lot of disagreements with the autopsy. You know, there was

1407
01:11:50,800 --> 01:11:53,960
Speaker 10: no the way he was supposed to have killed himself

1408
01:11:54,120 --> 01:11:57,080
Speaker 10: did not go along with the finding. So just everything

1409
01:11:57,240 --> 01:11:59,559
Speaker 10: is suspicious. But we're going to see what happens over

1410
01:11:59,600 --> 01:12:02,879
Speaker 10: the summer. As you can see, and this is very interesting.

1411
01:12:02,920 --> 01:12:05,960
Speaker 10: This information has been leaked during the mercury retrograde, which

1412
01:12:06,000 --> 01:12:09,800
Speaker 10: is also good for releasing information. That's one of the

1413
01:12:09,840 --> 01:12:13,080
Speaker 10: good things about a mercury retrograde is that his information

1414
01:12:13,479 --> 01:12:15,439
Speaker 10: come to the light. And that's what's been happening over

1415
01:12:15,439 --> 01:12:16,519
Speaker 10: the past few days.

1416
01:12:16,640 --> 01:12:20,120
Speaker 2: It's so true we're seeing some real like justice wins,

1417
01:12:20,200 --> 01:12:23,479
Speaker 2: whether it's the meta you know conversations and again like

1418
01:12:23,760 --> 01:12:27,360
Speaker 2: we're having this new conversations about meta right, like that

1419
01:12:27,439 --> 01:12:29,439
Speaker 2: was a very big victory as we're heading into a

1420
01:12:29,520 --> 01:12:30,880
Speaker 2: time that are going to write.

1421
01:12:31,040 --> 01:12:33,080
Speaker 3: They're like, oh, well AI is taking her jobs.

1422
01:12:33,120 --> 01:12:34,960
Speaker 2: I'm like, okay, so can we get ahead of that

1423
01:12:35,160 --> 01:12:36,840
Speaker 2: because I would like to have a job. I think

1424
01:12:36,880 --> 01:12:39,960
Speaker 2: we all would agree. But like, so now there's maybe

1425
01:12:40,000 --> 01:12:43,400
Speaker 2: this recalibration the serial killers, you know, people that are

1426
01:12:43,479 --> 01:12:45,160
Speaker 2: kind of doing dirty things.

1427
01:12:45,200 --> 01:12:46,280
Speaker 4: It's sort of coming out.

1428
01:12:46,360 --> 01:12:50,719
Speaker 2: I can't believe that any adversary hasn't sort of shared

1429
01:12:51,080 --> 01:12:53,960
Speaker 2: more photographs or files because there has been also some

1430
01:12:54,040 --> 01:12:57,760
Speaker 2: recent reports that some of the files have been compromised.

1431
01:12:57,800 --> 01:12:59,600
Speaker 2: This is now many years ago that there were like

1432
01:12:59,760 --> 01:13:02,880
Speaker 2: poor that have been eliminated, like they got hacked at

1433
01:13:02,920 --> 01:13:06,080
Speaker 2: some point. To me, that's like a foreign government, why

1434
01:13:06,080 --> 01:13:08,439
Speaker 2: not just release that? You know, that's like the biggest

1435
01:13:08,520 --> 01:13:11,880
Speaker 2: espionage of all time, right, I don't know.

1436
01:13:11,920 --> 01:13:15,440
Speaker 10: We shall see, but that is one of the biggest secrets.

1437
01:13:15,720 --> 01:13:19,600
Speaker 10: And there is the secret that Putin has certain information

1438
01:13:19,920 --> 01:13:22,040
Speaker 10: that he's been holding on too, so we shall see

1439
01:13:22,040 --> 01:13:23,240
Speaker 10: what happens with that also.

1440
01:13:23,680 --> 01:13:24,760
Speaker 3: That's my prediction too.

1441
01:13:25,080 --> 01:13:25,400
Speaker 4: Okay.

1442
01:13:25,479 --> 01:13:28,479
Speaker 5: I am marking my calendar for this summer and I

1443
01:13:28,560 --> 01:13:32,679
Speaker 5: cannot wait to see we have time if you're willing,

1444
01:13:32,840 --> 01:13:37,400
Speaker 5: Kim for a talkback for you, Yes, someone called in.

1445
01:13:37,960 --> 01:13:40,800
Speaker 6: Hi, guys, it's producer Ava. I know we're having kim

1446
01:13:40,800 --> 01:13:44,360
Speaker 6: on tonight, and I personally am obsessed with astrology, so

1447
01:13:44,479 --> 01:13:47,080
Speaker 6: I wanted to ask kind of a selfish question. I

1448
01:13:47,120 --> 01:13:50,120
Speaker 6: am Sagittarius. My boyfriend is a Leo. I know that

1449
01:13:50,160 --> 01:13:53,040
Speaker 6: we're both fire signs. So I'm just wondering, like our

1450
01:13:53,080 --> 01:13:56,519
Speaker 6: sagittarians and Leo's compatible, is it.

1451
01:13:56,360 --> 01:13:58,439
Speaker 4: A good thing that we're both fire signs? Isn't a

1452
01:13:58,479 --> 01:13:58,960
Speaker 4: bad thing?

1453
01:13:59,360 --> 01:14:02,120
Speaker 6: Do you have any right for our relationship?

1454
01:14:02,360 --> 01:14:04,719
Speaker 4: I would love to know. Thank you, Richard.

1455
01:14:09,360 --> 01:14:13,000
Speaker 10: It's so interesting, you know you so there's so much

1456
01:14:13,080 --> 01:14:15,800
Speaker 10: fire between the two of you. I'm supprised that the

1457
01:14:15,800 --> 01:14:23,519
Speaker 10: two of you have not combusted energy passionate relationship. It

1458
01:14:23,600 --> 01:14:27,080
Speaker 10: is so much fun. So so Ava has three planets

1459
01:14:27,080 --> 01:14:30,519
Speaker 10: in fire and her boyfriend has four planets in fire,

1460
01:14:31,000 --> 01:14:34,000
Speaker 10: and oh a lot of their their planets interact with

1461
01:14:34,160 --> 01:14:37,600
Speaker 10: one another beautifully. And I would say to myself that

1462
01:14:37,680 --> 01:14:40,560
Speaker 10: they this is so may type of energy because his

1463
01:14:40,840 --> 01:14:43,920
Speaker 10: un conjuncts her move. Anybody you know you have a

1464
01:14:44,000 --> 01:14:48,240
Speaker 10: Leo move and his mercury conjuncture moves, and I have

1465
01:14:48,320 --> 01:14:51,880
Speaker 10: lots to talk about their very comfortable communicating they feel

1466
01:14:51,960 --> 01:14:55,960
Speaker 10: lucky together because his Venus is very close to her Jupiter.

1467
01:14:56,320 --> 01:14:59,759
Speaker 17: When you're talking about feeling good and doing things together,

1468
01:15:00,080 --> 01:15:03,040
Speaker 17: this couple should be a world traveling type of couple

1469
01:15:03,320 --> 01:15:05,040
Speaker 17: because they like to get out in the world and

1470
01:15:05,080 --> 01:15:07,400
Speaker 17: see what else is going on. And let's not mention

1471
01:15:07,560 --> 01:15:12,520
Speaker 17: the chemistry. Oh my goodness, let's talk about it.

1472
01:15:12,720 --> 01:15:13,639
Speaker 9: Oh, I love it.

1473
01:15:14,120 --> 01:15:16,000
Speaker 10: I don't see a lot of earth in their charts.

1474
01:15:16,160 --> 01:15:19,320
Speaker 10: So once they get going, they get going. Okay, it's

1475
01:15:19,400 --> 01:15:23,000
Speaker 10: kind of hard to ground to earth a grind ground

1476
01:15:23,000 --> 01:15:27,480
Speaker 10: this relationship. But you're talking about a fun, exuberant experience

1477
01:15:27,520 --> 01:15:31,760
Speaker 10: between these two people boys. I mean, I'm sure everybody

1478
01:15:31,920 --> 01:15:33,920
Speaker 10: is in awe of them when they are in the

1479
01:15:34,000 --> 01:15:34,559
Speaker 10: room together.

1480
01:15:34,920 --> 01:15:37,800
Speaker 2: I am obsessed with this. By the way, now I

1481
01:15:37,960 --> 01:15:39,960
Speaker 2: really did call it. She was very happy.

1482
01:15:40,120 --> 01:15:42,639
Speaker 4: She really did that. She's like a real catch. It's

1483
01:15:42,720 --> 01:15:43,759
Speaker 4: so great.

1484
01:15:44,040 --> 01:15:44,920
Speaker 3: By the way, Kim Allen.

1485
01:15:44,960 --> 01:15:47,559
Speaker 2: By the way, Kim Allen can do love charts, that's

1486
01:15:47,560 --> 01:15:51,799
Speaker 2: also like her real gift. Also, So if anybody listening

1487
01:15:52,000 --> 01:15:55,439
Speaker 2: has some like love questions about their partner, is this

1488
01:15:55,520 --> 01:15:59,120
Speaker 2: the one or somebody in the air, We're gonna have Kim.

1489
01:15:59,160 --> 01:16:01,320
Speaker 2: So just like you just give us some talkbacks and

1490
01:16:01,360 --> 01:16:03,479
Speaker 2: we'll start stacking them and then we'll get your charts

1491
01:16:03,479 --> 01:16:05,040
Speaker 2: and Kim's gonna come on and tell you what's up

1492
01:16:05,080 --> 01:16:05,880
Speaker 2: in the land of love.

1493
01:16:06,280 --> 01:16:11,080
Speaker 4: Yay, oh I love it. Thank you, Kim Aloud, thank you,

1494
01:16:11,200 --> 01:16:11,559
Speaker 4: thank you.

1495
01:16:22,040 --> 01:16:25,120
Speaker 2: Welcome back to True Crime tonight on iHeartRadio. We're talking

1496
01:16:25,160 --> 01:16:27,759
Speaker 2: true crime all the time. I'm staff here with Courtney

1497
01:16:27,760 --> 01:16:30,960
Speaker 2: and Body and yes we have Taha and Sam and Adam.

1498
01:16:31,439 --> 01:16:34,440
Speaker 2: First of all, how cute is Kim Allen the astrologer

1499
01:16:34,479 --> 01:16:38,640
Speaker 2: in psychic and that Ava is our little Ava is

1500
01:16:38,680 --> 01:16:41,120
Speaker 2: in love by the way, you most that was a

1501
01:16:41,120 --> 01:16:45,200
Speaker 2: lot of detail about Ava gallasvanting around the world.

1502
01:16:46,200 --> 01:16:50,639
Speaker 4: I'm gonna say, watch just right now, I'm true Love tonight.

1503
01:16:50,760 --> 01:16:51,880
Speaker 4: That's what's gonna love tonight.

1504
01:16:51,960 --> 01:16:52,599
Speaker 3: That's what we're doing.

1505
01:16:52,720 --> 01:16:55,000
Speaker 4: We are gonna people are gonna call in with these talkbacks.

1506
01:16:55,040 --> 01:16:58,439
Speaker 4: We're gonna stack them up for Kim. Yes Love tonight. Okay,

1507
01:16:58,439 --> 01:17:01,599
Speaker 4: because it's very important because you're why everybody entered. I'm

1508
01:17:01,680 --> 01:17:03,800
Speaker 4: learning this from Kim Allen. So the energy of the

1509
01:17:03,840 --> 01:17:06,799
Speaker 4: world is really chaotic right now. It's a little like uneasy.

1510
01:17:06,840 --> 01:17:09,200
Speaker 4: We're all like feeling it right it's.

1511
01:17:10,200 --> 01:17:11,360
Speaker 3: So exactly so.

1512
01:17:11,439 --> 01:17:14,760
Speaker 2: But if we're like at least throwing some love on

1513
01:17:14,880 --> 01:17:18,439
Speaker 2: top of that, like that's the only real mutualizer at

1514
01:17:18,439 --> 01:17:18,840
Speaker 2: this point.

1515
01:17:18,920 --> 01:17:21,519
Speaker 3: Yeah, like it's gonna turn. The tides are going to turn.

1516
01:17:21,640 --> 01:17:25,519
Speaker 2: So yeah, if anybody has let's do true love tonight

1517
01:17:26,160 --> 01:17:29,759
Speaker 2: and then yes, we'll do a little weekly love maybe

1518
01:17:29,800 --> 01:17:35,800
Speaker 2: some either we can do some matching or let's yeah

1519
01:17:35,840 --> 01:17:40,479
Speaker 2: there's hole in the market. Yes, okay, So I am

1520
01:17:40,680 --> 01:17:44,639
Speaker 2: so into it, and people, you know, everybody, we all

1521
01:17:44,960 --> 01:17:48,160
Speaker 2: we need more love around here in this life. So

1522
01:17:48,720 --> 01:17:52,519
Speaker 2: let's get some love bumpers. So anybody who has, you know,

1523
01:17:52,560 --> 01:17:55,800
Speaker 2: any astrology questions period, please.

1524
01:17:55,800 --> 01:17:58,040
Speaker 3: Send them ourway. But also let's figure out this love thing.

1525
01:17:58,840 --> 01:18:03,000
Speaker 5: I think it's fenantastic and listen for anyone who wants

1526
01:18:03,040 --> 01:18:05,559
Speaker 5: to learn more about Kim and I am number one

1527
01:18:05,920 --> 01:18:09,120
Speaker 5: on the list of that's a normal. So if you

1528
01:18:09,120 --> 01:18:11,400
Speaker 5: want to learn more or even if you want to connect,

1529
01:18:12,280 --> 01:18:16,120
Speaker 5: you can go ahead and visit Kimallen dot com. It's

1530
01:18:16,240 --> 01:18:19,160
Speaker 5: just like it sounds k I am a L L

1531
01:18:19,280 --> 01:18:22,000
Speaker 5: E N dot com and I as soon as we

1532
01:18:22,120 --> 01:18:24,479
Speaker 5: are off the air, I'm going to be on Kim

1533
01:18:24,520 --> 01:18:25,600
Speaker 5: Allen dot com.

1534
01:18:25,640 --> 01:18:27,760
Speaker 4: Personally because I want to see.

1535
01:18:27,840 --> 01:18:32,040
Speaker 5: I loved hearing how fiery Ava and her new boyfriend are.

1536
01:18:32,720 --> 01:18:35,439
Speaker 5: I'm so curious how my you know, I'm twenty years

1537
01:18:35,479 --> 01:18:39,200
Speaker 5: deep with my husband. If it's like and you go

1538
01:18:39,280 --> 01:18:42,439
Speaker 5: to bed early and you watch each other flush your teeth, like, I'm.

1539
01:18:42,320 --> 01:18:46,600
Speaker 2: So curious, our charts are well listen even you know,

1540
01:18:46,720 --> 01:18:50,200
Speaker 2: Ava is this is a brand new youngin relationship. So

1541
01:18:51,240 --> 01:18:54,920
Speaker 2: twenty years is a beautiful thing. And it's an evolved thing, right,

1542
01:18:55,040 --> 01:18:58,000
Speaker 2: So I think that all matters, But it is good

1543
01:18:58,040 --> 01:18:59,080
Speaker 2: to have the information.

1544
01:18:59,600 --> 01:19:00,400
Speaker 4: I would like to have.

1545
01:19:00,320 --> 01:19:01,799
Speaker 3: Her do all of our charts.

1546
01:19:02,320 --> 01:19:04,680
Speaker 2: In my case, I don't. My birth certificate doesn't have

1547
01:19:04,800 --> 01:19:09,320
Speaker 2: my time of birth. Really, I don't know why. No,

1548
01:19:09,439 --> 01:19:11,679
Speaker 2: and my mom back then you would kind of get

1549
01:19:11,840 --> 01:19:15,000
Speaker 2: you were you were unconscious when you gave birth, yeah,

1550
01:19:15,000 --> 01:19:18,439
Speaker 2: which is oh wow. So you know, in her defense,

1551
01:19:18,520 --> 01:19:20,479
Speaker 2: not a huge memory of it, and it's not on

1552
01:19:20,560 --> 01:19:22,439
Speaker 2: my birth certific I'm sure I could call the hospital,

1553
01:19:22,439 --> 01:19:23,280
Speaker 2: but probably.

1554
01:19:23,080 --> 01:19:26,160
Speaker 4: I was born at three seventeen PM, all right in

1555
01:19:26,200 --> 01:19:31,599
Speaker 4: the world during guiding Sandy. Oh wow, See, I didn't

1556
01:19:31,760 --> 01:19:34,479
Speaker 4: we like your mom, she was asleep. She doesn't remember.

1557
01:19:34,880 --> 01:19:37,920
Speaker 4: I mean I tried during my last relationship. To find out.

1558
01:19:38,160 --> 01:19:42,519
Speaker 4: My mom just told me, like, doesn't say it. I'm like, okay, yeah,

1559
01:19:42,560 --> 01:19:43,840
Speaker 4: mine really doesn't. I know.

1560
01:19:43,840 --> 01:19:44,760
Speaker 3: It's very strange.

1561
01:19:45,360 --> 01:19:48,840
Speaker 4: Hu, maybe just pick noon. It's like the middle at birth.

1562
01:19:48,920 --> 01:19:49,360
Speaker 3: Taha.

1563
01:19:49,720 --> 01:19:54,400
Speaker 8: Maybe that's what it was, and I the resemblance.

1564
01:19:55,000 --> 01:19:58,160
Speaker 4: I didn't think of that earlier, our.

1565
01:19:58,200 --> 01:20:00,639
Speaker 3: Long lost siblings. It makes her sense.

1566
01:20:00,880 --> 01:20:03,960
Speaker 8: It's like a reunion with Sally. Now one of you

1567
01:20:04,040 --> 01:20:06,519
Speaker 8: mentioned the Bachelor. Are we tired of hearing about it?

1568
01:20:06,640 --> 01:20:06,720
Speaker 4: No?

1569
01:20:06,920 --> 01:20:09,080
Speaker 3: I just got about it.

1570
01:20:09,400 --> 01:20:11,200
Speaker 9: We got another talk back about it, so.

1571
01:20:11,400 --> 01:20:12,679
Speaker 4: Oh did we really? Yeah?

1572
01:20:12,680 --> 01:20:14,360
Speaker 3: I get a lot of that was about this too.

1573
01:20:14,520 --> 01:20:16,800
Speaker 9: Okay, it's crazy, Adam, let's hit that one up.

1574
01:20:17,040 --> 01:20:20,320
Speaker 16: Hey guys, I'm actually calling because I think you're missing

1575
01:20:20,360 --> 01:20:22,960
Speaker 16: from key points. I think that the reason that it's

1576
01:20:23,040 --> 01:20:26,479
Speaker 16: just not being exposed is because Taylor had another incident

1577
01:20:26,680 --> 01:20:30,880
Speaker 16: in February where she apparently assaulted her and she filed

1578
01:20:30,880 --> 01:20:34,639
Speaker 16: a temporary or restraining order and was received temporary custody

1579
01:20:34,720 --> 01:20:37,360
Speaker 16: of the kids. What I've heard is it was something

1580
01:20:37,400 --> 01:20:39,640
Speaker 16: to do with strangulation with a necklace that occurred in

1581
01:20:39,680 --> 01:20:41,839
Speaker 16: front of the kids. So I think that's an important

1582
01:20:41,920 --> 01:20:44,200
Speaker 16: key point to why this is all coming out now,

1583
01:20:44,280 --> 01:20:46,960
Speaker 16: and from what I've heard, they did know that the

1584
01:20:47,000 --> 01:20:50,599
Speaker 16: allegations prior or the rest hire was had gone on

1585
01:20:50,680 --> 01:20:52,920
Speaker 16: in twenty three. I just wanted to let you know. Thanks,

1586
01:20:53,080 --> 01:20:54,080
Speaker 16: love your guys, And she's.

1587
01:20:53,960 --> 01:20:54,880
Speaker 3: One hundred percent right.

1588
01:20:54,920 --> 01:20:59,519
Speaker 2: And that's why the other show, the Netflix version of

1589
01:20:59,560 --> 01:21:02,400
Speaker 2: the The.

1590
01:21:01,320 --> 01:21:03,280
Speaker 4: Secret Lives of Mormon Wives.

1591
01:21:03,439 --> 01:21:05,200
Speaker 2: I know it's so up to me or that I

1592
01:21:05,200 --> 01:21:08,439
Speaker 2: can't say that straight, the Secret Lives or the I

1593
01:21:08,439 --> 01:21:11,439
Speaker 2: can't say the name or the network correctly ever, but

1594
01:21:11,520 --> 01:21:14,320
Speaker 2: it's on Hulu, The Secret Lives of Mormon Wives.

1595
01:21:14,360 --> 01:21:15,479
Speaker 4: They halted production.

1596
01:21:15,960 --> 01:21:20,160
Speaker 2: Remember there's like forty production and producers in town. But

1597
01:21:20,200 --> 01:21:23,280
Speaker 2: there was a second incident, And to our caller's point,

1598
01:21:23,360 --> 01:21:26,479
Speaker 2: that's why this really heated up, because we've all been saying, yes,

1599
01:21:26,840 --> 01:21:27,280
Speaker 2: can you.

1600
01:21:27,160 --> 01:21:29,800
Speaker 4: Well over the second incident because I didn't quite understand,

1601
01:21:29,920 --> 01:21:33,280
Speaker 4: so did Taylor choke him or did he choke her?

1602
01:21:34,000 --> 01:21:37,479
Speaker 2: The understanding that I have is that back in twenty

1603
01:21:37,680 --> 01:21:40,120
Speaker 2: they have like a lot of incidents apparently, so the

1604
01:21:40,160 --> 01:21:44,120
Speaker 2: twenty twenty three one is this newly released tape that

1605
01:21:44,120 --> 01:21:44,840
Speaker 2: we've all now.

1606
01:21:44,760 --> 01:21:47,519
Speaker 4: Citen and the question is why now right, Yeah, we're

1607
01:21:47,520 --> 01:21:49,080
Speaker 4: like kind of like why now right.

1608
01:21:49,200 --> 01:21:52,640
Speaker 2: So there also have been reports that the dads and

1609
01:21:52,760 --> 01:21:56,280
Speaker 2: another one of the Mormon couples have also broken up

1610
01:21:56,280 --> 01:21:59,040
Speaker 2: and that they were like in on some like revenge

1611
01:21:59,120 --> 01:22:03,040
Speaker 2: idea to get back at all these women. However, that

1612
01:22:03,160 --> 01:22:06,160
Speaker 2: sounds different than what our caller just said, and what

1613
01:22:06,240 --> 01:22:08,840
Speaker 2: I believe to be true also is that there was

1614
01:22:08,880 --> 01:22:14,559
Speaker 2: an additional incident with Taylor and Dakota involving something violent.

1615
01:22:16,000 --> 01:22:21,479
Speaker 2: Because of this strangulation incident, the other cast members were like, dude,

1616
01:22:21,560 --> 01:22:23,639
Speaker 2: I don't want to participate in this show anymore. It's

1617
01:22:23,680 --> 01:22:26,120
Speaker 2: like these two are off the rails and she's off

1618
01:22:26,120 --> 01:22:29,120
Speaker 2: the rails. And then that kind of brought the whole

1619
01:22:29,240 --> 01:22:32,760
Speaker 2: firestorm back. And it just happened to be in this

1620
01:22:32,960 --> 01:22:36,840
Speaker 2: lead up time to this Bachelorette premiere and then it

1621
01:22:36,880 --> 01:22:40,680
Speaker 2: got extra dirty. So it appears this is what I'm

1622
01:22:40,680 --> 01:22:43,719
Speaker 2: reading on TMZ, So this is not like multiple sources,

1623
01:22:43,800 --> 01:22:47,200
Speaker 2: This is solely from TMZ as my source here, that

1624
01:22:47,520 --> 01:22:53,679
Speaker 2: Dakota allegedly sold the material to TMZ. Well, it doesn't

1625
01:22:53,720 --> 01:22:55,920
Speaker 2: discount which is a little dirty also, But that doesn't

1626
01:22:55,920 --> 01:23:01,000
Speaker 2: discount that there was multiple incidences of domestic violins, which

1627
01:23:01,040 --> 01:23:04,240
Speaker 2: is of course very very serious, particularly when it was

1628
01:23:04,240 --> 01:23:05,080
Speaker 2: a child involved.

1629
01:23:05,800 --> 01:23:09,160
Speaker 8: Yeah, Adam, Yeah, he's been following it, so jump in

1630
01:23:09,200 --> 01:23:09,799
Speaker 8: because he's.

1631
01:23:11,560 --> 01:23:15,640
Speaker 2: Our our, our bachelor at what should we call you

1632
01:23:15,760 --> 01:23:16,759
Speaker 2: journalists on the scene?

1633
01:23:17,200 --> 01:23:18,880
Speaker 4: Expert is fine.

1634
01:23:19,760 --> 01:23:21,240
Speaker 9: Experts, doctor bachelor?

1635
01:23:21,360 --> 01:23:22,679
Speaker 4: Please correct correct?

1636
01:23:22,800 --> 01:23:25,360
Speaker 14: Well, yeah, I mean, I'll just back up what Stephanie

1637
01:23:25,400 --> 01:23:29,040
Speaker 14: has been saying. There was a separate incident that happened

1638
01:23:29,400 --> 01:23:33,479
Speaker 14: in February, I believe where. Yeah, Dakota and Taylor both

1639
01:23:33,840 --> 01:23:37,759
Speaker 14: accused each other of abuse, and that is what shut

1640
01:23:37,800 --> 01:23:41,800
Speaker 14: down the production of Secret Lives of Mormon Wives season five,

1641
01:23:42,720 --> 01:23:46,840
Speaker 14: and there was speculation that the Bachelorette season was going

1642
01:23:46,880 --> 01:23:49,639
Speaker 14: to be canceled in and then that's when this old

1643
01:23:49,760 --> 01:23:50,639
Speaker 14: video dropped.

1644
01:23:50,720 --> 01:23:52,480
Speaker 4: So it's very confusing.

1645
01:23:52,560 --> 01:23:54,800
Speaker 9: But yeah, but.

1646
01:23:54,800 --> 01:23:57,439
Speaker 4: Dakota is accusing Taylor of choking him.

1647
01:23:57,560 --> 01:24:01,360
Speaker 14: So yeah, Dakota, yeah, to code has accused Taylor of

1648
01:24:01,439 --> 01:24:02,080
Speaker 14: choking him.

1649
01:24:02,560 --> 01:24:03,000
Speaker 4: All I want.

1650
01:24:03,439 --> 01:24:07,759
Speaker 14: Taylor also accuses Dakota of abuse as well. She hasn't

1651
01:24:07,800 --> 01:24:11,160
Speaker 14: specified what, and it's an open case, so they can't

1652
01:24:11,240 --> 01:24:13,439
Speaker 14: really the police aren't discussing West.

1653
01:24:13,560 --> 01:24:14,280
Speaker 4: It's a case.

1654
01:24:15,040 --> 01:24:17,760
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, oh yeah, they came and they summoned.

1655
01:24:17,920 --> 01:24:21,040
Speaker 2: So the police also went back to the home and

1656
01:24:21,080 --> 01:24:25,599
Speaker 2: took the stool that she threw in for evidence. Oh,

1657
01:24:25,640 --> 01:24:29,000
Speaker 2: it's actually very harrowing. Uh So basically, the police, how.

1658
01:24:28,920 --> 01:24:30,160
Speaker 3: Much time do we have do you guys feel like

1659
01:24:30,200 --> 01:24:30,880
Speaker 3: hearing this story?

1660
01:24:31,280 --> 01:24:36,000
Speaker 2: So basically the police go to Taylor's there and they

1661
01:24:36,080 --> 01:24:37,560
Speaker 2: knock on the door. They go in the home and

1662
01:24:37,640 --> 01:24:40,599
Speaker 2: they're basically taking the stool that was seen in that

1663
01:24:40,760 --> 01:24:44,479
Speaker 2: video because it's like an investigation, and they basically tell

1664
01:24:44,520 --> 01:24:47,840
Speaker 2: her like, well, this is for the investigation. And again

1665
01:24:47,880 --> 01:24:50,599
Speaker 2: I'm paraphrasing, but it's like bodycam footage and it's like, oh,

1666
01:24:50,760 --> 01:24:53,480
Speaker 2: She's like, how bad is it? Is there an investigation?

1667
01:24:53,560 --> 01:24:57,000
Speaker 2: Like how bad is it? And the two cops were like, well, look,

1668
01:24:57,040 --> 01:24:59,320
Speaker 2: it's not I mean, you didn't kill him, you know,

1669
01:24:59,520 --> 01:25:01,719
Speaker 2: it's like that murder, but like it's not great.

1670
01:25:01,960 --> 01:25:04,679
Speaker 3: You know, it's just very silent and your.

1671
01:25:04,479 --> 01:25:06,920
Speaker 2: Life isn't going to be over, but you should, you know,

1672
01:25:07,000 --> 01:25:09,840
Speaker 2: hopefully take this opportunity to get the help that you

1673
01:25:09,880 --> 01:25:11,800
Speaker 2: guys need or whatever. And you can kind of see

1674
01:25:11,800 --> 01:25:16,080
Speaker 2: the panic on her face. It did read like like

1675
01:25:16,160 --> 01:25:18,080
Speaker 2: these guys are just like on a different planet. They're

1676
01:25:18,120 --> 01:25:21,559
Speaker 2: like those writing couples that just it just tears it

1677
01:25:21,720 --> 01:25:26,640
Speaker 2: up the pens, right, just terrible. Yeah, and you know

1678
01:25:26,920 --> 01:25:29,120
Speaker 2: that's the worst kind of a relationship if you're in

1679
01:25:29,160 --> 01:25:32,000
Speaker 2: that kind of a relationship that is not that is

1680
01:25:32,000 --> 01:25:32,920
Speaker 2: not our chemistry.

1681
01:25:33,360 --> 01:25:34,160
Speaker 4: That is trauma.

1682
01:25:34,320 --> 01:25:37,559
Speaker 2: Like you guys are trauma bonding in the most demented way,

1683
01:25:37,720 --> 01:25:40,519
Speaker 2: and it feels familiar because maybe that was something in

1684
01:25:40,560 --> 01:25:43,559
Speaker 2: your previous life. So it's like, oh, I get this,

1685
01:25:44,240 --> 01:25:46,799
Speaker 2: but it's really it's a cycle that needs to be broken.

1686
01:25:47,400 --> 01:25:51,320
Speaker 2: So to that end, they're both now multiple friends from

1687
01:25:51,360 --> 01:25:54,400
Speaker 2: the show have also come out to say like they're toxic,

1688
01:25:54,520 --> 01:25:57,920
Speaker 2: like both of them are equally terrible, and it seemed

1689
01:25:57,920 --> 01:26:01,160
Speaker 2: like that, like Dakota was like going to stick a

1690
01:26:01,200 --> 01:26:04,120
Speaker 2: tour in the eleventh hour. But it also does not

1691
01:26:04,200 --> 01:26:07,000
Speaker 2: discount the fact that you know, strangulation, Come on now,

1692
01:26:07,280 --> 01:26:08,000
Speaker 2: those children.

1693
01:26:09,240 --> 01:26:10,120
Speaker 4: Yeah, so it's worth it.

1694
01:26:10,120 --> 01:26:13,320
Speaker 14: It's worth noting as well, like Taylor pled guilty to

1695
01:26:13,560 --> 01:26:16,920
Speaker 14: domestic abuse charges back in twenty twenty three, and she

1696
01:26:17,040 --> 01:26:20,680
Speaker 14: was on she's currently on a probation period that she

1697
01:26:20,840 --> 01:26:24,120
Speaker 14: can't you know, if she messes up and something bad happens,

1698
01:26:24,600 --> 01:26:28,000
Speaker 14: she could really face consequences. So whatever just happened back

1699
01:26:28,080 --> 01:26:30,600
Speaker 14: like a couple months ago, I mean she could be

1700
01:26:30,600 --> 01:26:32,520
Speaker 14: in really serious trouble.

1701
01:26:32,680 --> 01:26:33,400
Speaker 4: Like jail time.

1702
01:26:33,720 --> 01:26:34,840
Speaker 9: Yeah wow.

1703
01:26:35,160 --> 01:26:39,000
Speaker 8: Yeah, So everything I said about maybe she is, you know,

1704
01:26:39,160 --> 01:26:41,240
Speaker 8: good for casting, it could be interesting ratings.

1705
01:26:41,520 --> 01:26:44,040
Speaker 3: Oh no, no, no, it's terrible for casting. And it

1706
01:26:44,080 --> 01:26:44,960
Speaker 3: did put people in it.

1707
01:26:45,120 --> 01:26:47,400
Speaker 2: Oh, by the way, even product, I mean production, even

1708
01:26:47,479 --> 01:26:50,200
Speaker 2: like if somebody is in like a state, you know,

1709
01:26:50,640 --> 01:26:52,920
Speaker 2: somebody working on the show, and you have somebody who's

1710
01:26:53,320 --> 01:26:56,200
Speaker 2: disconnected from reality because that's the norm. It seems like

1711
01:26:56,240 --> 01:26:59,720
Speaker 2: there's a lot going on there. But again, even going

1712
01:26:59,760 --> 01:27:04,840
Speaker 2: back to the Hulu show The Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, Yes,

1713
01:27:06,439 --> 01:27:09,840
Speaker 2: nice to shut production down when you have three weeks

1714
01:27:09,920 --> 01:27:13,280
Speaker 2: left of shooting, I can promise you is so expensive

1715
01:27:14,040 --> 01:27:18,000
Speaker 2: and such a drag and they're apparently have had producers

1716
01:27:18,080 --> 01:27:22,240
Speaker 2: there and like literally nobody is wanting to work on

1717
01:27:22,320 --> 01:27:25,559
Speaker 2: the show because it was air quotes dangerous, so think

1718
01:27:25,600 --> 01:27:25,920
Speaker 2: about it.

1719
01:27:25,920 --> 01:27:26,759
Speaker 3: This is their paycheck.

1720
01:27:26,800 --> 01:27:30,519
Speaker 2: Also, so if you know, if they were looking only

1721
01:27:30,560 --> 01:27:33,680
Speaker 2: for fame and money, they would be shooting regardless and

1722
01:27:33,760 --> 01:27:36,599
Speaker 2: like making any of this, and they were everybody seemed

1723
01:27:36,640 --> 01:27:39,240
Speaker 2: to say TV time out, like we're not into this

1724
01:27:40,000 --> 01:27:40,800
Speaker 2: TV wow.

1725
01:27:41,200 --> 01:27:43,240
Speaker 4: Yeah, well yeah, I mean listen, if she really if

1726
01:27:43,280 --> 01:27:45,680
Speaker 4: she really did strangle him, and there's evidence that, you know,

1727
01:27:46,000 --> 01:27:48,400
Speaker 4: if he went to the hospital or you know, anything

1728
01:27:48,439 --> 01:27:50,320
Speaker 4: like that, she could really be facing some jail time.

1729
01:27:50,360 --> 01:27:54,160
Speaker 4: That's those are serious allegations. Yeah, regulation you need to

1730
01:27:54,240 --> 01:27:56,280
Speaker 4: really start over exactly.

1731
01:27:57,080 --> 01:28:01,719
Speaker 5: Yeah, the David said that she took the necklace, ripped

1732
01:28:01,760 --> 01:28:05,559
Speaker 5: it off of her boyfriend baby Daddy's neck, and use

1733
01:28:05,640 --> 01:28:06,559
Speaker 5: that to strangle him.

1734
01:28:06,840 --> 01:28:09,400
Speaker 4: What seems like, oh my god.

1735
01:28:10,080 --> 01:28:12,840
Speaker 14: And also it's in the court record from the twenty

1736
01:28:12,920 --> 01:28:16,400
Speaker 14: twenty three case that she hit because her daughter is

1737
01:28:16,439 --> 01:28:19,160
Speaker 14: sitting on the couch when she's throwing the stools, and

1738
01:28:19,200 --> 01:28:21,800
Speaker 14: it's in the court records that the daughter was hit

1739
01:28:21,920 --> 01:28:25,519
Speaker 14: by one of the and Dakota is saying that your

1740
01:28:25,600 --> 01:28:26,439
Speaker 14: daughter's on the couch.

1741
01:28:26,439 --> 01:28:29,800
Speaker 4: Your daughter's on the couch, And yeah, I thought we

1742
01:28:29,800 --> 01:28:32,800
Speaker 4: were just gossiping. I mean, this is like, no, this is.

1743
01:28:34,040 --> 01:28:36,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, this really just happened to a lot of new

1744
01:28:36,280 --> 01:28:40,280
Speaker 2: information is coming out time and by the way, it

1745
01:28:40,320 --> 01:28:42,479
Speaker 2: also does remind us and we all have to pay attention.

1746
01:28:42,640 --> 01:28:45,120
Speaker 2: Is like, at one point we saw whatever the little

1747
01:28:45,160 --> 01:28:47,960
Speaker 2: clip was when she was being arrested on the hulu's

1748
01:28:48,040 --> 01:28:49,799
Speaker 2: version of Secret Lives of Mormon Wives.

1749
01:28:50,040 --> 01:28:51,680
Speaker 4: Now cut to the Bachelorette.

1750
01:28:51,880 --> 01:28:53,600
Speaker 2: She talks about it very openly, and I mean, I

1751
01:28:53,640 --> 01:28:55,519
Speaker 2: don't even watch that show, and I've seen her give

1752
01:28:55,560 --> 01:28:57,880
Speaker 2: interviews about this set experience, so it's sounding like she

1753
01:28:57,920 --> 01:29:02,280
Speaker 2: was holding a big secret. However, obviously everybody knew about it,

1754
01:29:02,640 --> 01:29:06,200
Speaker 2: but she talked pretty openly about having this like terrible

1755
01:29:06,479 --> 01:29:08,839
Speaker 2: toxic thing in this one incident when she had been drinking.

1756
01:29:09,320 --> 01:29:11,240
Speaker 4: Then you see the video and.

1757
01:29:11,160 --> 01:29:14,599
Speaker 2: It's real different, right, Like it's really hard to come

1758
01:29:14,640 --> 01:29:17,160
Speaker 2: back from it, right. So you see this video and

1759
01:29:17,240 --> 01:29:19,880
Speaker 2: you're thinking, Okay, this was the worst day of this

1760
01:29:19,920 --> 01:29:24,440
Speaker 2: person's life. Her experience was she thought her daughter was upstairs,

1761
01:29:24,760 --> 01:29:27,120
Speaker 2: didn't even know she was on the couch. She comes

1762
01:29:27,120 --> 01:29:29,920
Speaker 2: in the house because it was like bedtime, I'm paraphrasing

1763
01:29:30,120 --> 01:29:32,880
Speaker 2: typically she's upstairs at this time and in bed. She

1764
01:29:32,960 --> 01:29:36,840
Speaker 2: comes rolling in, probably a little drunk, and those two

1765
01:29:36,880 --> 01:29:39,839
Speaker 2: get into it real time, and like she hadn't noticed

1766
01:29:39,880 --> 01:29:43,560
Speaker 2: that her daughter was there because she was so interesting remembrane.

1767
01:29:44,320 --> 01:29:47,680
Speaker 2: And of course this father is saying what about the kid?

1768
01:29:47,680 --> 01:29:50,040
Speaker 2: What about the kid? And you hear the little girl

1769
01:29:50,320 --> 01:29:52,960
Speaker 2: saying my mom, because you know, like the little girl

1770
01:29:53,040 --> 01:29:56,200
Speaker 2: is like covering her ears. It's really it's everything about

1771
01:29:56,240 --> 01:30:00,559
Speaker 2: it is terrible, but also in some way, there's only

1772
01:30:00,640 --> 01:30:02,639
Speaker 2: one silver lining that I want to just see clear about.

1773
01:30:02,640 --> 01:30:06,679
Speaker 2: So she needs to get sober. But even others seeing

1774
01:30:06,720 --> 01:30:09,160
Speaker 2: that tape, yeah, you'd be surprised. A lot of people

1775
01:30:09,200 --> 01:30:11,760
Speaker 2: are finding themselves in those situations, and until you see

1776
01:30:11,800 --> 01:30:14,520
Speaker 2: it on another person and in their life.

1777
01:30:14,680 --> 01:30:16,320
Speaker 3: It's sometimes hard to identify it.

1778
01:30:16,439 --> 01:30:18,760
Speaker 2: So I actually think this will be a bit of

1779
01:30:18,760 --> 01:30:22,640
Speaker 2: a wake up call for many because toxic relationships, I mean,

1780
01:30:22,680 --> 01:30:25,400
Speaker 2: they're easy to get into and they're really hard to

1781
01:30:25,439 --> 01:30:25,880
Speaker 2: get out of.

1782
01:30:27,360 --> 01:30:30,440
Speaker 3: And but boy, it sounds real good at first.

1783
01:30:32,280 --> 01:30:35,200
Speaker 2: All that I was going to say, we should do

1784
01:30:35,240 --> 01:30:37,920
Speaker 2: their chart, you know, buyer beware. And there is like

1785
01:30:37,960 --> 01:30:40,439
Speaker 2: another ex involved somewhere, Adam, I meant to ask you

1786
01:30:40,479 --> 01:30:42,000
Speaker 2: about this today, so we'll get to that and the

1787
01:30:42,040 --> 01:30:44,400
Speaker 2: next time. But isn't there like another ex that has

1788
01:30:44,400 --> 01:30:45,600
Speaker 2: another set of complaints?

1789
01:30:46,240 --> 01:30:46,599
Speaker 17: Uh?

1790
01:30:47,000 --> 01:30:49,639
Speaker 14: You know, I saw a TMZ photo of Dakota and

1791
01:30:49,720 --> 01:30:53,560
Speaker 14: her ex husband together like the courtroom.

1792
01:30:53,120 --> 01:30:56,240
Speaker 2: And those two are like teaming up.

1793
01:30:56,320 --> 01:30:57,840
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, I don't know.

1794
01:30:58,000 --> 01:31:01,000
Speaker 14: I don't know what it seems like for whatever reason,

1795
01:31:01,000 --> 01:31:06,320
Speaker 14: that was a more peaceful relationship quote unquote, but we'll

1796
01:31:06,360 --> 01:31:06,760
Speaker 14: dig in it.

1797
01:31:06,760 --> 01:31:07,519
Speaker 4: We'll do a deep dive.

1798
01:31:08,360 --> 01:31:09,719
Speaker 3: Now, she's so beautiful.

1799
01:31:09,720 --> 01:31:11,519
Speaker 2: They're so good looking you now, and I look at

1800
01:31:11,520 --> 01:31:13,320
Speaker 2: their pictures, like there's one of them in Vegas. It

1801
01:31:13,320 --> 01:31:15,200
Speaker 2: looks like and she has a little bikini on. I mean,

1802
01:31:15,439 --> 01:31:18,360
Speaker 2: she's like perfect and it's like leaning on him and

1803
01:31:18,400 --> 01:31:21,320
Speaker 2: he's super cute. And now they look a little crazy,

1804
01:31:22,080 --> 01:31:25,960
Speaker 2: Like beauty fades when you see that. Right, So once

1805
01:31:26,160 --> 01:31:33,880
Speaker 2: nonviolent kind generate sober sober. You know, this is a mess.

1806
01:31:34,240 --> 01:31:36,920
Speaker 2: So if you're in a mess, there's way out. There

1807
01:31:37,000 --> 01:31:41,160
Speaker 2: is for sure a way out, but you know, buyer beware.

1808
01:31:41,600 --> 01:31:43,519
Speaker 4: Yeah, and recognizing is the first step.

1809
01:31:43,840 --> 01:31:45,679
Speaker 3: Yeah, because they they bring her the worst in each other.

1810
01:31:46,800 --> 01:31:47,400
Speaker 4: Oh, this is me.

1811
01:31:47,479 --> 01:31:49,120
Speaker 3: We're wrapping up right now already.

1812
01:31:49,360 --> 01:31:50,160
Speaker 4: Is that possible?

1813
01:31:50,479 --> 01:31:52,479
Speaker 2: Listen, guys, you're gonna have an amazing weekend. We're back

1814
01:31:52,520 --> 01:31:55,920
Speaker 2: on Sunday, KFI. Baby, We're gonna have Robert Brandt talking

1815
01:31:55,960 --> 01:32:00,240
Speaker 2: about so sed As brothers, So listen, he's talked to

1816
01:32:00,280 --> 01:32:03,760
Speaker 2: them recently, so he'll be joining us on Sunday. Great show.

1817
01:32:03,840 --> 01:32:13,160
Speaker 2: We love you, Thank you for the call. Stay safe,