WEBVTT - Kenny Beats + Rick Rubin, Part 2 0:00:15.436 --> 0:00:22.796 Pushkin. Hey y'all, Today we're bringing you part two of 0:00:22.916 --> 0:00:27.516 Rick Rubin's conversation with producer Kenny Beats. On last week's episode, 0:00:27.836 --> 0:00:30.356 Kenny broke down how regional sounds in hip hop have 0:00:30.476 --> 0:00:34.676 spread across the US and connected disparate cities Since his 0:00:34.796 --> 0:00:38.156 first conversation with Rick, Kenny Starr has continued to rise. 0:00:39.036 --> 0:00:41.196 In the past couple of years. He's produced songs with 0:00:41.316 --> 0:00:44.996 Ed Sheer In, The Baby and Staples. He's also taken 0:00:45.116 --> 0:00:48.076 several trips to the UK and produced over thirty songs 0:00:48.116 --> 0:00:52.396 with the British artists like f Ga, Twigs and Slow Tie. Today, 0:00:52.796 --> 0:00:54.876 Kenny explains how, for the first time in the history 0:00:54.876 --> 0:00:58.196 of hip hop, an American subgenre made its way across 0:00:58.236 --> 0:01:00.756 the Pond to the UK, only to come back to 0:01:00.796 --> 0:01:03.476 the United States and an updated form that is now 0:01:03.556 --> 0:01:07.916 influencing American rappers. Kenny and Rick also talk about why 0:01:07.956 --> 0:01:10.996 they don't care to understand English rappers slang, and how 0:01:10.996 --> 0:01:14.396 a group of German classical musicians are co producing some 0:01:14.436 --> 0:01:21.276 of the biggest hip hop records today. This is broken 0:01:21.276 --> 0:01:24.676 record liner notes for the digital age. I'm justin Richmondtin. 0:01:29.476 --> 0:01:33.956 Here's Rick Rubin and Kenny Beats. How are you feeling, man, 0:01:34.916 --> 0:01:37.316 I'm good A long time, No see, everything been good, 0:01:38.036 --> 0:01:41.076 been good, staying hidden, working hard. Let's talk a little 0:01:41.076 --> 0:01:44.116 bit about UK hip hop. Yeah, one of my favorite topics. 0:01:44.476 --> 0:01:47.596 What do you see going on? Well, I think something 0:01:47.676 --> 0:01:51.956 happened since the last time we talked about this subject 0:01:52.436 --> 0:01:54.996 that has never happened in the history of hip hop 0:01:55.036 --> 0:01:59.156 And correct me if I'm wrong. But the UK we're 0:01:59.596 --> 0:02:03.076 influencing the US in such a way this year that 0:02:03.116 --> 0:02:05.516 we had never seen an RP pop smoke. But one 0:02:05.516 --> 0:02:08.196 of the newest hottest artists in the world is making 0:02:08.356 --> 0:02:11.236 beats that he looked up on YouTube under UK drill 0:02:11.716 --> 0:02:16.556 or UK trap beats or UK grime. He was looking 0:02:16.636 --> 0:02:20.036 for beats that sounded like stuff from over there so 0:02:20.036 --> 0:02:22.596 he could bring something to New York that was completely different. 0:02:22.636 --> 0:02:26.156 But the weirdest thing about this is that drill, what's 0:02:26.196 --> 0:02:28.356 going on right now in the UK, like in the 0:02:28.396 --> 0:02:31.676 streets unarguably what they refer to that sound as that 0:02:31.716 --> 0:02:35.916 comes from Chicago. So there's this weird lineage of like 0:02:36.076 --> 0:02:39.236 the Chief Kief era, the Young Chop era, the Chicago 0:02:39.636 --> 0:02:42.956 era that like happened in like twenty twelve, even before 0:02:43.036 --> 0:02:46.236 Kanye got on don't like with Chief keief that whole 0:02:46.276 --> 0:02:51.236 time was such an influential area production wise, like time 0:02:51.276 --> 0:02:53.556 production wise with like Lex Luger and all these people 0:02:53.636 --> 0:02:57.276 programming stuff very different and to see the UK kind 0:02:57.276 --> 0:02:59.836 of take Chicago, make it their sound, and then it 0:02:59.916 --> 0:03:02.636 come back to New York and break artists with that sound. 0:03:03.036 --> 0:03:06.396 Like I did a record this year for Fabi, who 0:03:06.516 --> 0:03:09.596 is like one of pop smoked bigger collaborators, another Brooklyn 0:03:09.716 --> 0:03:12.876 drill artists, great guy, and it's like I'm doing beats 0:03:12.876 --> 0:03:15.436 inspired by UK producers that were inspired by American producers. 0:03:15.436 --> 0:03:18.196 But the UK influenced this year has been undeniable, and 0:03:18.396 --> 0:03:20.396 I think that's the first time in history that's happened 0:03:20.476 --> 0:03:23.756 in hip hop ever. Yeah, I always felt like it 0:03:23.796 --> 0:03:25.436 was going to happen. I thought it was going to happen, 0:03:25.516 --> 0:03:27.716 even going back to death Jam days, just because of 0:03:27.796 --> 0:03:31.076 the history of the Blues in the United States and 0:03:31.076 --> 0:03:34.996 then the excitement of the British invasion where they would 0:03:35.036 --> 0:03:40.916 listen to American sounds and because of the distance they 0:03:40.996 --> 0:03:44.956 had a romantic image of it. Yeah, and they took 0:03:44.956 --> 0:03:47.876 it to an extreme that anyone who was doing it 0:03:48.316 --> 0:03:50.716 like any of the real bluesmen would hear what led 0:03:50.756 --> 0:03:53.516 Zeppelin did and think it was garish. You know, it 0:03:53.556 --> 0:03:56.356 was like it was too much totally. But because of 0:03:56.396 --> 0:03:59.516 the distance, they could take something that might not be 0:03:59.596 --> 0:04:03.156 cool for the people who invent it and take it 0:04:03.196 --> 0:04:06.516 to some new extreme that seems too far out for 0:04:06.556 --> 0:04:09.356 the people who have a clear vision of what its 0:04:09.396 --> 0:04:12.716 starting point is and take it to a new extreme. 0:04:12.756 --> 0:04:15.956 So the fact that that's finally happening in hip hop 0:04:15.996 --> 0:04:19.956 as an exciting things, just it gives us potential for 0:04:20.076 --> 0:04:26.876 things to grow in a deeper, faster way. It opens 0:04:27.036 --> 0:04:30.156 American hip hop and just American artists is saying, we 0:04:30.276 --> 0:04:32.876 don't know, let's take influence from somewhere else. It opens 0:04:32.956 --> 0:04:35.796 up an unlimited world instead of saying we started this, 0:04:35.876 --> 0:04:38.956 we run this. Here's how we dictate the pace once 0:04:38.996 --> 0:04:41.196 we say we're open to these ideas and these other 0:04:41.236 --> 0:04:43.476 sounds and types of production and tempos or whatever it 0:04:43.516 --> 0:04:45.876 might be. Yeah, it makes better music for everyone, and 0:04:45.916 --> 0:04:49.316 it creates some of my favorite bands and music and 0:04:49.356 --> 0:04:53.316 other genres too. That same concept of like there's this 0:04:53.316 --> 0:04:57.116 whole thaie funk thing that happened in the seventies and eighties, 0:04:57.116 --> 0:05:00.476 and I'm not up on it enough to explain the 0:05:00.596 --> 0:05:02.596 artists and this and that. But what I understand is 0:05:03.236 --> 0:05:05.956 the meters and this whole funk movement or whatever that 0:05:05.996 --> 0:05:09.556 happened in America influence people in Asia. They started making 0:05:09.596 --> 0:05:11.516 all these records years later that, like you're saying, are 0:05:11.596 --> 0:05:14.716 exaggerated versions of all this funk stuff that was going 0:05:14.716 --> 0:05:17.076 on here. And then now, one of my favorite bands 0:05:17.476 --> 0:05:20.196 these days, it's a band called Krungbin And you ask 0:05:20.276 --> 0:05:22.836 them what their influences are their band from Houston, Texas. 0:05:22.876 --> 0:05:25.516 They say, well, we listen to old Thaie funk music amazing. 0:05:25.636 --> 0:05:27.596 But those Thai funk records were then trying to make 0:05:27.636 --> 0:05:30.996 American funk records from twenty years earlier, and it all 0:05:31.716 --> 0:05:36.116 becomes almost untraceable unless you're really trying to do your research, 0:05:36.156 --> 0:05:38.396 you know. Yeah, but it just goes through the filter 0:05:38.556 --> 0:05:42.436 of the new person making it. The influence doesn't always 0:05:42.436 --> 0:05:46.876 show so clearly in the in the new creator. Yeah, 0:05:46.956 --> 0:05:49.476 let's talk more about drill music. Would you say, twenty 0:05:49.676 --> 0:05:53.396 twelve issues where where it got rolling? Yeah, I'm not 0:05:53.436 --> 0:05:55.076 the I can't. I can speak even more on the 0:05:55.116 --> 0:05:57.356 UK side of it than the Chicago side of it. 0:05:57.476 --> 0:06:00.916 But yeah, definitely, like it was early like Gi Herbo, 0:06:01.076 --> 0:06:05.036 Chief Keith, all this Chicago stuff that was influencing the 0:06:05.156 --> 0:06:09.596 UK that came back around and influenced every body here. 0:06:09.596 --> 0:06:11.716 But like, let me let me think of a good 0:06:11.716 --> 0:06:14.236 record to play. Is it as popular in Chicago as 0:06:14.276 --> 0:06:17.436 it was then? No, it's not. It's a sound that 0:06:17.516 --> 0:06:20.596 kind of um came and went. It was like it's 0:06:20.596 --> 0:06:22.636 a very specific, a kind of high hat pattern to 0:06:22.716 --> 0:06:25.276 drill shit. It's just very specific kind of bounce with 0:06:25.316 --> 0:06:29.556 the drums. It's like it's got this. It's a whole 0:06:29.756 --> 0:06:33.196 different kind of swing and the accentuation is like it, 0:06:33.196 --> 0:06:35.836 only it almost leans more to like the Afro Cuban 0:06:35.876 --> 0:06:37.196 thing and something than it does to like a two 0:06:37.316 --> 0:06:39.316 four rock thing that I think trap is like the 0:06:39.356 --> 0:06:41.756 hardest rock drums turned into break beat drums turned into 0:06:41.876 --> 0:06:43.476 blah blah blah, you know, and now we get trapped 0:06:43.476 --> 0:06:45.356 and now we have these huge ada weights. But the 0:06:45.636 --> 0:06:48.436 drill has these different kind of poly rhythms and little 0:06:48.476 --> 0:06:51.436 play play a good play a good example of classic 0:06:51.516 --> 0:06:56.036 drill Chicago drill, Chicago drill um. You know, a couple 0:06:56.036 --> 0:06:58.276 of niggas does down the RAF for a homicide when 0:06:58.276 --> 0:07:00.036 his drama tab run up on the nigga what the 0:07:00.116 --> 0:07:03.436 lumbus flatl leave his love was all trauma tasks one fifty. Yeah, 0:07:03.436 --> 0:07:05.276 I'm really with it. I drop his task and they 0:07:05.356 --> 0:07:07.796 forget it what I mean? Yeah, it's really interesting how 0:07:07.836 --> 0:07:12.036 the percuss shouldn't pattern have a ab pattern of the 0:07:12.076 --> 0:07:14.996 percussion part feel like they're both halves are leaning in 0:07:14.996 --> 0:07:18.076 a different direction. So it doesn't seem like anyone would 0:07:18.076 --> 0:07:20.916 ever play it that way. No, And you have this 0:07:21.036 --> 0:07:23.356 two four thing. There is a snap or a clap 0:07:23.436 --> 0:07:26.556 or a snare. Normally that is one two three four. 0:07:26.676 --> 0:07:29.316 It's on those normal rhythms where you expect the clap, 0:07:29.396 --> 0:07:33.676 but the what dictates the rhythm is that that's much 0:07:33.716 --> 0:07:35.876 more what you're gonna dance to or move to or 0:07:35.956 --> 0:07:39.556 rap two or write too, I think. And that's what 0:07:39.956 --> 0:07:43.756 has been mangled and changed and turned into a million 0:07:43.796 --> 0:07:46.556 other things over the last few years. But it's really 0:07:46.996 --> 0:07:50.636 this movement that happened in Chicago first, and it obviously 0:07:50.636 --> 0:07:52.916 influenced even the radio here to the point where Kanye 0:07:52.996 --> 0:07:54.516 and Push a T And all of good music are 0:07:54.516 --> 0:07:56.676 getting on a Chief Keef song and blah blah. It's 0:07:56.676 --> 0:07:59.116 this local niche thing that got bigger and bigger and bigger. 0:07:59.196 --> 0:08:02.396 But I think the UK to this day are such 0:08:02.636 --> 0:08:05.036 fans of what we do, and they pay so much 0:08:05.116 --> 0:08:09.116 homage and have so much homework done before they even 0:08:09.236 --> 0:08:11.836 speak on the UK stuff, and we don't do that 0:08:12.116 --> 0:08:15.196 vice versa. We don't give them the same respect to 0:08:15.196 --> 0:08:18.796 talk about like their legends and the grime legends and 0:08:19.036 --> 0:08:21.276 you know what I mean, people like Dizzy and Kano 0:08:21.396 --> 0:08:23.636 and like all these type of people that have so 0:08:23.756 --> 0:08:26.716 much respect there that we just see as like oh 0:08:26.796 --> 0:08:29.316 UK thing instead of all these different iterations of what 0:08:29.356 --> 0:08:31.156 it's been. But when they saw what we were doing 0:08:31.236 --> 0:08:35.396 here with drill. You hear Giherbo talking about drilling in 0:08:35.756 --> 0:08:38.036 the song, you know what I mean, it's a it's 0:08:38.036 --> 0:08:40.596 a concept. They took that and they ran with it. 0:08:40.636 --> 0:08:43.796 And now we're in twenty twenty eight years later, and 0:08:43.876 --> 0:08:46.436 it turned around. It came back to us and we 0:08:46.516 --> 0:08:50.076 have artists here googling tight beats of UK producers to 0:08:50.116 --> 0:08:51.796 get their sound, and then they're covering the radio and 0:08:51.796 --> 0:08:54.516 then Travis Scott's getting on their songs here. It's insane, 0:08:55.236 --> 0:08:58.476 and it goes back to house music coming from Chicago 0:08:58.836 --> 0:09:02.596 and turning into EDM in the UK. Essentially, yeah, that 0:09:02.796 --> 0:09:06.236 intercontinental when it goes back and forth, there's so much 0:09:06.316 --> 0:09:09.556 room for growth, like you get to hear you get 0:09:09.556 --> 0:09:12.076 to hear it through new ears when it comes back, 0:09:12.356 --> 0:09:17.396 you know, definitely. And I think my almost misconception when 0:09:17.436 --> 0:09:21.756 I first got there was this is something that you 0:09:21.876 --> 0:09:23.876 guys are doing that when I come here and get 0:09:23.876 --> 0:09:25.316 in the studio with artists, I shouldn't try to make 0:09:25.396 --> 0:09:28.036 drill beats or play drill beats or you know what 0:09:28.076 --> 0:09:30.036 I mean, get in on this UK thing. Because my 0:09:30.076 --> 0:09:32.116 first trips to the UK, working with a lot of artists, 0:09:32.116 --> 0:09:33.756 I didn't want them to think that I'm coming over 0:09:33.836 --> 0:09:36.236 here while you guys are having your first influential moment 0:09:36.396 --> 0:09:38.276 and trying to be a part of that to make 0:09:38.316 --> 0:09:40.956 myself seem more authentic to the root of it. It 0:09:40.996 --> 0:09:44.036 was more like, oh no, I just recognize how talented 0:09:44.036 --> 0:09:45.916 these artists are, and I want to see what they 0:09:45.956 --> 0:09:48.716 do on not drill stuff, you know what I mean. 0:09:48.756 --> 0:09:51.396 And I released songs this year with Slow Tie, with 0:09:51.596 --> 0:09:54.796 sl with h with Heavy One, with so many different 0:09:54.876 --> 0:09:57.756 UK I was stormzy and then I also have released 0:09:57.756 --> 0:10:01.796 songs with Ed Sheeran and James Vincent McMorrow and all 0:10:01.876 --> 0:10:04.636 the Twigs and the whole other side of the UK. 0:10:04.756 --> 0:10:06.236 But when I went over there, it was much more 0:10:06.236 --> 0:10:08.236 about let me show you guys what I can do, 0:10:08.316 --> 0:10:10.436 not let me co out you're scene. But then I 0:10:10.436 --> 0:10:12.436 started playing drill beats once in a while and they'd 0:10:12.436 --> 0:10:14.276 lose it and it was like, oh, you guys are 0:10:14.316 --> 0:10:17.116 not the one who were gatekeeping whatsoever. It might be 0:10:17.276 --> 0:10:19.116 us a little bit. But when I say us, I 0:10:19.116 --> 0:10:21.956 say that lightly because I'm not from Chicago and I'm 0:10:21.996 --> 0:10:25.316 not part of the originators. But America, as you know 0:10:25.356 --> 0:10:28.076 what I mean, just like this, this hip hop institution 0:10:28.996 --> 0:10:32.076 were kind of being accepting and it's showing in the 0:10:32.156 --> 0:10:34.356 radio and it's showing an influence in the production, and 0:10:34.396 --> 0:10:36.716 that's a beautiful thing to me. Yeah. I had a 0:10:36.756 --> 0:10:39.236 conversation the other day with Scarface from the Ghetto Boys, 0:10:39.276 --> 0:10:41.836 and he was we were talking about when when I 0:10:41.836 --> 0:10:43.836 first heard the Ghetto Boys, they were really the first 0:10:43.996 --> 0:10:47.196 Southern rap group that I heard, you know, we heard 0:10:47.596 --> 0:10:50.316 New York was really everything for a long time. Then 0:10:50.356 --> 0:10:53.116 he started hearing some music coming from the West Coast 0:10:54.236 --> 0:10:56.636 and it sounded different, and in New York we didn't 0:10:56.676 --> 0:11:00.036 really like it. And then Ghetto Boys was pretty early 0:11:00.436 --> 0:11:02.476 in the you know, not from the East Coast and 0:11:02.556 --> 0:11:05.276 not from the West coast. The only the only maybe 0:11:05.716 --> 0:11:08.476 thing before that might have been Luke. And I think 0:11:08.476 --> 0:11:12.276 a luke more as a party, more of a party 0:11:12.436 --> 0:11:15.116 thing than like real rap. You know, I don't think 0:11:15.116 --> 0:11:17.476 of it as like, I don't know, I don't, I don't. 0:11:17.516 --> 0:11:19.676 They never took it seriously as rap music. I thought 0:11:19.716 --> 0:11:22.196 of it more as like rock the party, yeah, whereas 0:11:22.196 --> 0:11:25.716 Getta Boys was more like, you know, hardcore rap wasn't 0:11:25.956 --> 0:11:29.956 deaf jam initially rocked the party. Wasn't that the origin? 0:11:30.356 --> 0:11:32.116 Or was it just make it feel like what's going 0:11:32.196 --> 0:11:35.996 on outside? It was more like, yeah, make it feel 0:11:36.036 --> 0:11:40.116 like what the club feels like. But it wasn't necessarily 0:11:40.236 --> 0:11:44.236 rocking the party because it wasn't really a The early 0:11:44.316 --> 0:11:47.916 hip hop scene wasn't really necessarily a dance scene. It's true. Yeah, 0:11:47.996 --> 0:11:50.516 like Public Enemy is not like rocking the part, Yeah, 0:11:50.556 --> 0:11:53.556 that's true. No, And most people didn't dance, you know, 0:11:53.596 --> 0:11:58.516 like they'd be breakdancing, but that wasn't so connected to 0:11:58.556 --> 0:12:01.276 the music. It happened during the music, but it wasn't 0:12:01.276 --> 0:12:04.076 necessarily to the beat, you know, it was a different 0:12:04.156 --> 0:12:07.236 It was just a different thing. It was simultaneous more 0:12:07.276 --> 0:12:12.036 than inspired by the music. But Luke and Miami and 0:12:12.076 --> 0:12:15.036 Booty Bass and Two Live Crew, everything was about make 0:12:15.116 --> 0:12:18.836 people shake what they have, make people go fucking crazy 0:12:18.916 --> 0:12:22.436 in the club. And you know, like Benny Blanco's like 0:12:22.476 --> 0:12:23.996 one of the first things that he did that went 0:12:24.036 --> 0:12:26.396 super crazy was this project was Spank Rock that was 0:12:26.436 --> 0:12:28.356 sampling a shit ton of Two Live Crew. He's one 0:12:28.356 --> 0:12:30.556 of the biggest pop producers in the world right now. 0:12:30.556 --> 0:12:34.476 You know, like this happens in so many areas, but 0:12:34.556 --> 0:12:37.956 with ghetto boys. Look at that where that lineage ended up. 0:12:37.956 --> 0:12:40.356 Mike Dean was helping engineer some of those records and 0:12:40.396 --> 0:12:42.916 working on some of that stuff, and now he's working 0:12:42.956 --> 0:12:45.476 under the Travis you know what I mean, biggest records 0:12:45.476 --> 0:12:47.116 in the world. All the stuff you're hearing now, it's 0:12:47.156 --> 0:12:50.276 like there's so many things that we're paying homage to 0:12:51.676 --> 0:12:54.436 without even knowing, and that's myself included in it. But 0:12:54.476 --> 0:12:57.196 I think that's the beauty in it. And oh my god, 0:12:57.236 --> 0:12:59.116 I saw something the other day, Rick, I almost had 0:12:59.156 --> 0:13:02.196 to text you because I was freaking out. I felt 0:13:02.676 --> 0:13:07.076 so old, and I felt so like I'd had my 0:13:07.116 --> 0:13:10.396 finger off the pulse for a second. Killed me. I 0:13:10.596 --> 0:13:14.916 was on Twitter and Timberland was the number one trending 0:13:15.196 --> 0:13:18.756 topic on Twitter. Shout out to Tim, and I go, oh, 0:13:18.796 --> 0:13:20.636 they're probably just giving him his flowers. There's this thing 0:13:20.676 --> 0:13:22.276 every once in a while where just a producer and 0:13:22.356 --> 0:13:24.916 artist comes up, or someone has a birthday, and everyone 0:13:24.996 --> 0:13:26.956 talks about all the songs they love that made them 0:13:26.996 --> 0:13:30.476 feel so great. Timbo was the number one trending thing, 0:13:30.476 --> 0:13:31.956 and I went to go see what was trending. Was 0:13:31.956 --> 0:13:33.756 it his birthday? Was it about a song? Was an 0:13:33.716 --> 0:13:41.116 Aliyah thing? Missy thing? People were saying exposed, Timberland stole 0:13:41.836 --> 0:13:45.396 these old Indian records for all his biggest songs, big Pimpin. 0:13:45.516 --> 0:13:47.596 And then they show the Indian song it came from, 0:13:47.676 --> 0:13:49.516 or the Bollywood sample or whatever it might be. Then 0:13:49.516 --> 0:13:51.276 they show an Aliah record and they show this, and 0:13:51.596 --> 0:13:57.356 TikTok was going nuts saying no dalent and you're exposed 0:13:57.356 --> 0:13:59.116 and we found this out and da da da and 0:13:59.116 --> 0:14:03.396 blah blah blah, and it's like, are you guys losing it? 0:14:03.436 --> 0:14:06.636 Am I losing it like some of my favorite records 0:14:06.676 --> 0:14:10.276 of all times are loops of old samples like let Alone, 0:14:10.556 --> 0:14:13.316 adding something like Timbo. That's what hip hop is. Hip 0:14:13.316 --> 0:14:19.436 hop is taking from existing things and montaging them together 0:14:19.476 --> 0:14:22.156 to make something new. And that's something that you've never 0:14:22.196 --> 0:14:25.356 heard before. It's always been that's what DJ culture is. 0:14:25.756 --> 0:14:30.476 DJ culture starts with records. Kids were freaking out about 0:14:30.596 --> 0:14:32.996 just the idea of sampling, just the concept like showing 0:14:32.996 --> 0:14:35.196 an alias song and then showing the sample like they 0:14:35.276 --> 0:14:38.596 like they had discovered some you know, a great whale 0:14:38.716 --> 0:14:42.076 of like a secret. But it was It was so 0:14:42.196 --> 0:14:45.836 crazy to me because like I'm having this moment right 0:14:45.836 --> 0:14:49.596 now of of sampling so much again and getting back 0:14:49.636 --> 0:14:52.876 into it. A lot of it came last year randomly 0:14:52.916 --> 0:14:56.996 and then Dooms passing RPMF Doom has really just thrown 0:14:57.036 --> 0:14:59.756 me back into it. So to see that I'm going 0:14:59.756 --> 0:15:04.116 the opposite way and sampling more and people on the 0:15:04.116 --> 0:15:06.516 internet were taking it like that, it really threw me 0:15:06.556 --> 0:15:08.756 for a loop for a second. I had to get 0:15:08.796 --> 0:15:11.956 off to it. Or for him that's crazy, Well, just 0:15:12.116 --> 0:15:16.516 it really is just a misunderstanding or um or. Times change. 0:15:17.156 --> 0:15:19.876 Time's definitely change, but like it's it's weird for me 0:15:19.956 --> 0:15:21.956 to see on the side of it, where I'm producing 0:15:21.996 --> 0:15:25.076 records now that sample these guys who've been through hell 0:15:25.236 --> 0:15:28.836 clearing samples or even with the recognition of people calling 0:15:28.836 --> 0:15:30.796 you out for taking a record or whatever it is, 0:15:30.796 --> 0:15:33.156 when people are getting paid behind the scenes and everything 0:15:33.276 --> 0:15:37.476 is fully worked out. Like I literally, like I saw 0:15:37.516 --> 0:15:40.596 people tore down James Blake. James Blake tried to sweet 0:15:40.636 --> 0:15:42.436 if you want to know what Timbo did to the sample, 0:15:42.716 --> 0:15:45.076 tried dancing to the original. You think people and in 0:15:45.116 --> 0:15:47.156 these countries couldn't dance to these samples before timbol it. 0:15:47.156 --> 0:15:50.756 It's like, Okay, we understood, we know, we know, we 0:15:50.836 --> 0:15:53.476 know that, and I know James probably would have reworded 0:15:53.476 --> 0:15:56.836 it if he could have, But like, it was just 0:15:56.996 --> 0:16:00.636 crazy to see how people were perceiving that when that's 0:16:00.636 --> 0:16:04.636 like the root of why I love doing what I do, 0:16:04.716 --> 0:16:06.996 and when I sample these guys, when I've sampled Farrell, 0:16:07.036 --> 0:16:09.876 when I've sampled Timbo, when I've sampled these huge records 0:16:09.876 --> 0:16:12.356 that they've done for artists I'm working with. Rico Nasty 0:16:12.396 --> 0:16:15.756 said I want dirt off your shoulders, and I was like, Okay, 0:16:15.796 --> 0:16:17.596 we can do something like that, and she's like, no, 0:16:17.876 --> 0:16:22.036 I do that, And I was like, all right, I 0:16:22.036 --> 0:16:25.236 could say. I don't feel uncomfortable saying they were so 0:16:25.276 --> 0:16:29.596 fucking cool about clearing shit or about whatever like percentages 0:16:29.676 --> 0:16:32.236 or whatever back like back end bullshit there is. They 0:16:32.276 --> 0:16:35.276 were all so cool and I've dealt with that firsthand, 0:16:35.316 --> 0:16:37.556 so to see like what Frell has gone through with 0:16:37.636 --> 0:16:39.396 Marvin Gay or what Twitter is just going through, even 0:16:39.396 --> 0:16:42.436 in just perspective right now, Like it was wild to 0:16:42.516 --> 0:16:45.836 me because I wouldn't have got into half of the 0:16:46.276 --> 0:16:49.756 really interesting music or cultural things I know about if 0:16:49.796 --> 0:16:52.356 it wasn't via sampling, Like if people thought I was 0:16:52.356 --> 0:16:56.316 gonna be listening to sun Ra without Madlib, there's no way, 0:16:56.996 --> 0:16:58.596 you know what I mean. And it's like it's what's 0:16:59.036 --> 0:17:02.036 helped me understand so many cultures and so many things 0:17:02.076 --> 0:17:03.636 that I should be paying respect to and that I 0:17:03.636 --> 0:17:07.116 should be speaking on. And it's instead of the opposite, 0:17:07.116 --> 0:17:09.716 which people think, it's like you're trying to hide the stolen, 0:17:10.476 --> 0:17:12.996 you know what I mean, it's exactly the opposite. It's 0:17:13.036 --> 0:17:16.396 always paying tribute, and of course they're cool about when 0:17:16.396 --> 0:17:19.156 you do it, because that's what the culture is built on. 0:17:19.236 --> 0:17:22.436 It's like they built their culture on it, and they 0:17:21.916 --> 0:17:26.036 know if you understand how it works, that there's this 0:17:26.236 --> 0:17:29.596 pool of in the old days, like the Beatles would 0:17:29.596 --> 0:17:31.956 listen to Roy Orbison and then they would learn the 0:17:31.996 --> 0:17:34.356 guitar parts like Roy Orbison. Then they'd either speed it 0:17:34.396 --> 0:17:35.916 up or slow it down, and then they'd make it 0:17:35.956 --> 0:17:38.636 their own or a chuck Berry song, and then they 0:17:38.636 --> 0:17:42.276 would make it into their own song. That's what sampling is. 0:17:42.316 --> 0:17:46.676 It's now we'd do it without instruments. We sample and 0:17:46.956 --> 0:17:48.796 speed it up or slow it down, or loop it 0:17:48.916 --> 0:17:52.076 or chop it in a particular way, or combine several 0:17:52.116 --> 0:17:56.156 pieces together, or pick a very tiny little piece of 0:17:56.196 --> 0:17:59.156 a piece of music that's not representative of the other, 0:17:59.236 --> 0:18:01.836 of the entirety of the music at all. You know, 0:18:01.956 --> 0:18:05.396 most breaks are not representative of the thing that they're 0:18:05.436 --> 0:18:08.716 a break of at all. Yeah, it's like there's a 0:18:08.756 --> 0:18:12.156 saw and there happens to be this moment in the 0:18:12.196 --> 0:18:14.676 song that you find a way to flip and make 0:18:14.756 --> 0:18:16.716 into something new, but it has nothing to do with 0:18:16.796 --> 0:18:20.476 the original song. More often than not, I always found 0:18:20.476 --> 0:18:23.916 it so interesting, how how big that that Mountain break 0:18:24.116 --> 0:18:28.476 was Mississippi Queen, Because Mountain is like such a hard 0:18:28.636 --> 0:18:32.476 Southern rock group. It's such a like it's almost like 0:18:32.556 --> 0:18:35.436 a Leonard skinnerd level Southern you know what I mean. 0:18:35.516 --> 0:18:40.596 But Mississippi Queen is one of the most used like 0:18:40.676 --> 0:18:43.756 vocal samples and sample packs and like it when people 0:18:43.796 --> 0:18:47.036 say like, oh I want that, like that that he's 0:18:47.076 --> 0:18:49.476 this vocal scream thing. It's like a lot of that 0:18:49.596 --> 0:18:52.236 is from like these rock records in the fifties and 0:18:52.276 --> 0:18:54.556 sixties and stuff like The Break ended up being like 0:18:54.756 --> 0:18:57.636 the hardest rap thing you ever heard, you know. It's 0:18:57.676 --> 0:18:59.956 like that's that's what's beautiful about it to me, because 0:18:59.996 --> 0:19:04.996 that's what gave me so much of like my history 0:19:05.036 --> 0:19:08.276 and my background was finding shit through other shit, you know. 0:19:08.836 --> 0:19:11.756 The the guitar player from Mountain just passed away within 0:19:11.796 --> 0:19:14.396 the last couple of weeks, Leslie West sad sad to 0:19:14.476 --> 0:19:16.756 hear yet oh Man all Ip. I saw him live 0:19:16.916 --> 0:19:20.636 at the Ridgefield Playhouse with my dad at twelve years old. 0:19:20.956 --> 0:19:24.516 It's crazy. One of the greats, one of the greats. Yeah, really, 0:19:25.276 --> 0:19:27.916 we'll be back with Rick Ruben and Kenny Beats. After 0:19:27.916 --> 0:19:36.116 a quick break. We're back with Kenny Beats. So since 0:19:36.236 --> 0:19:39.836 Drill has moved on in Chicago. Has anything replaced it 0:19:39.876 --> 0:19:43.516 in Chicago. I think Chicago's kind of always set trends, 0:19:43.556 --> 0:19:46.076 But I don't know if I can say there's been 0:19:46.116 --> 0:19:52.436 a specific niche genre like drill to come from Chicago 0:19:52.556 --> 0:19:56.236 or really anywhere that's influenced the world and come back 0:19:56.396 --> 0:19:58.996 the way that has, like Chicago's evolved so much, and 0:19:59.036 --> 0:20:02.716 like Little Dirk is on the newest Drake single, you 0:20:02.756 --> 0:20:05.276 know what I mean, And like Little Dirk comes from 0:20:05.316 --> 0:20:07.556 exactly the air I'm talking about in the video shoots 0:20:07.676 --> 0:20:09.596 in the middle of some house in the middle of 0:20:09.996 --> 0:20:11.996 some part of Chicago that people don't want to go do. 0:20:12.516 --> 0:20:14.676 And that was like this cool thing on YouTube that 0:20:14.716 --> 0:20:18.396 turned into influencing the charts, that turned into now huge artists, 0:20:18.516 --> 0:20:22.276 huge legitimate artists, And like there's still someone every single 0:20:22.396 --> 0:20:26.236 year coming from Chicago that's influencing people in a major way. 0:20:26.236 --> 0:20:29.516 The last time I was like blown away by someone 0:20:29.556 --> 0:20:33.596 from Chicago was Valet. Valet was so unique and so 0:20:33.636 --> 0:20:36.076 singular and different to me. When he came out play 0:20:36.116 --> 0:20:40.796 us a great Valet track. Oh that's so easy, I'll 0:20:40.836 --> 0:20:44.116 do sisty at Syndey came back, I was getting some 0:20:44.356 --> 0:20:47.116 net from a net gave up rain bat pace. Don't 0:20:47.156 --> 0:20:53.716 ask me if his pocket the simplicity like how brash 0:20:53.796 --> 0:20:56.516 he is. But as much as Valat is influencing people 0:20:56.516 --> 0:20:58.156 on the way that a lot of artists, I will 0:20:58.196 --> 0:20:59.996 tell you, will not speak on how much they listened 0:20:59.996 --> 0:21:01.716 to his ship at the time he came out and 0:21:01.716 --> 0:21:03.716 how much it was influenced them. But like Juice World 0:21:03.716 --> 0:21:06.316 is Chicago, r I P. Juice. You know who's bigger 0:21:06.316 --> 0:21:09.676 than him on the charts? Like who in fluence more 0:21:09.756 --> 0:21:12.516 kids than that? You know, him and X and Peep 0:21:12.556 --> 0:21:15.596 and all this stuff, Like Chicago is part of every 0:21:16.156 --> 0:21:19.516 historical hip hop era that I can remember since I 0:21:19.556 --> 0:21:21.996