WEBVTT - Thinking Sideways: David Sneddon 0:00:04.320 --> 0:00:17.279 Thinking Sideways. I don't stories of things we simply don't 0:00:17.280 --> 0:00:22.360 know the answer too. Hi there, welcome again to an 0:00:22.360 --> 0:00:26.000 episode of Thinking Sideways. I'm your host Joe, joined as 0:00:26.040 --> 0:00:30.840 always by and Steve. Yeah. Well, so we're going to 0:00:30.960 --> 0:00:34.159 tackle another cool mystery this week. We're going to talk 0:00:34.200 --> 0:00:38.959 about the disappearance of David Like the singer. Uh No, actually, 0:00:39.159 --> 0:00:41.640 well it's funny. It's an interesting mystery in a mystery 0:00:41.680 --> 0:00:44.640 here is that David snedd and the singer has got 0:00:44.680 --> 0:00:48.280 a Wikipedia page, but list David Sneddon does not have one. 0:00:49.360 --> 0:00:52.280 Be honest with you, the singer David Sneddon kind of 0:00:52.280 --> 0:00:55.880 became the bane of my existence throughout researching this. Yeah, 0:00:56.000 --> 0:00:59.160 I know, because I don't care where he's touring. That's 0:00:59.240 --> 0:01:02.280 not what I'm after now. It's unfortunate, but yeah, he 0:01:02.600 --> 0:01:05.880 does clog after Google service. Yeah, I know. I'm sure 0:01:05.920 --> 0:01:08.600 that fans of him are saying the exact same thing 0:01:08.640 --> 0:01:11.080 about our story tonight. I don't want to read about 0:01:11.080 --> 0:01:14.240 this story again. Really shouldn't have been in China anyway, man, 0:01:15.120 --> 0:01:17.199 any way, back to back to the disappearance of David 0:01:17.200 --> 0:01:19.759 snid And he was a twenty four year old students 0:01:19.840 --> 0:01:22.959 and traveler who disappeared in China and two thousand four. 0:01:23.400 --> 0:01:25.360 And before I say anything more, I'd also I'd like 0:01:25.400 --> 0:01:29.080 to thank our listeners Sean who suggested this story, and 0:01:29.280 --> 0:01:31.000 I'm glad that he did because I had not heard 0:01:31.000 --> 0:01:33.120 about this one before. It's really it's really good. It's 0:01:33.160 --> 0:01:37.480 an interesting story, don't you think. Yeah, And so onto 0:01:37.480 --> 0:01:39.640 the case. Then let me let me lay out the 0:01:39.640 --> 0:01:42.840 facts for you. David was twenty fourth time that he 0:01:42.959 --> 0:01:46.399 just disappeared. And in two thousand four, he had finished 0:01:46.400 --> 0:01:49.960 his junior year at Brigham Young University and was planning 0:01:49.960 --> 0:01:52.160 on returning in the fall to finish out his final year, 0:01:52.680 --> 0:01:54.720 and he was making plans to go to law school. 0:01:55.160 --> 0:01:58.480 Had it all has left, all planned out? Yeah, he was. 0:01:59.120 --> 0:02:02.480 He was a Mormon, son of Roy and Kathleen Sted, 0:02:02.720 --> 0:02:05.960 and he had ten brothers and sisters, big old family. 0:02:06.520 --> 0:02:10.200 And as he all probably know, Mormons are expected to 0:02:10.240 --> 0:02:13.000 go somewhere for two years on a mission, and the 0:02:13.160 --> 0:02:17.640 missionaries and score some new Mormons, and uh, yeah, that 0:02:17.800 --> 0:02:20.520 is part of what they do on their mission. It's 0:02:20.520 --> 0:02:26.240 not just trying to convert people. Yeah, yeah, even primarily. Yeah, 0:02:26.280 --> 0:02:30.200 but they'll do that kind of stuff too, Yeah, it's 0:02:30.200 --> 0:02:34.080 missionary work and whatever that it might entail. Yeah. Uh. 0:02:34.280 --> 0:02:36.880 David spent his two years in South Korea. Then he 0:02:36.919 --> 0:02:40.080 was fluent in Korean. Yeah, and at b y U 0:02:40.160 --> 0:02:42.960 he also studied Mandarin. He lived in the Chinese house. 0:02:42.960 --> 0:02:45.959 Apparently they had different houses there that so you could 0:02:45.960 --> 0:02:48.040 be immersed in the language and learned. So he lived 0:02:48.040 --> 0:02:50.720 in the Chinese house and his plan apparently was to 0:02:50.960 --> 0:02:53.760 when he came back uh in the follow two thousand 0:02:53.760 --> 0:02:56.080 fours he wanted to study Spanish also, so he just 0:02:56.080 --> 0:02:58.519 planning on living in the Spanish house. This guy was 0:02:58.520 --> 0:03:01.240 in the languages. Apparently he had some facility with them. 0:03:01.320 --> 0:03:03.360 I was I was gonna say, because that's not an 0:03:03.360 --> 0:03:06.440 easy thing to do. Yeah, now, neither of those are 0:03:06.440 --> 0:03:10.440 particularly easy languages. Yeah. Apparently, from what I understand, he 0:03:10.480 --> 0:03:14.080 was fluent in both Mandarin and Korean. Yeah. Yeah, so 0:03:14.280 --> 0:03:16.960 that's that's impressive. Yeah. And anyway, after he finished his 0:03:16.960 --> 0:03:18.680 class as at b y U in two thousand four, 0:03:18.760 --> 0:03:22.400 he went to China to study Mandarin and Beijing and 0:03:22.560 --> 0:03:25.280 when the classes ended, which is at the beginning of August, 0:03:25.320 --> 0:03:29.080 he left Beijing with his roommate George Bailey, who was 0:03:29.120 --> 0:03:31.480 also going to be y U, and they traveled together 0:03:31.520 --> 0:03:34.680 until August nine. At that point, George had to leave 0:03:34.760 --> 0:03:37.520 because his plane his returned plane ticket was earlier than 0:03:37.640 --> 0:03:41.000 than David's. David continued on to United Province, and I 0:03:41.400 --> 0:03:43.320 don't know, I'm gonna state this right away. There's a 0:03:43.320 --> 0:03:45.320 lot of words here that I'm probably going to mispronounce. 0:03:45.400 --> 0:03:53.360 So yeah, okay. So he went to Unan Province, which 0:03:53.480 --> 0:03:56.880 is in the southwest of China borders Vietnam. Laos Burma 0:03:57.400 --> 0:03:59.960 went down there. He went to the town of Lijiang, 0:04:00.680 --> 0:04:03.720 where he spent to night, and on August eleventh, he 0:04:03.800 --> 0:04:07.800 sent an email to his mother which read quote, actually, Devin, 0:04:07.880 --> 0:04:09.120 you want to read that so they don't have to 0:04:09.160 --> 0:04:13.120 listen to entirely in my voice. Sure, yeah, he says, 0:04:13.520 --> 0:04:18.200 I'm in Lijiang now, the in western Non province. I 0:04:18.240 --> 0:04:20.640 will take a bus and hike tiger Leaping gorge in 0:04:20.680 --> 0:04:23.320 about half an hour. I am having a great time here, 0:04:23.360 --> 0:04:27.440 but nonetheless I'm excited to come home unquote. And that 0:04:27.520 --> 0:04:29.720 was the last that the family heard from him. Uh. 0:04:29.720 --> 0:04:33.799 He went to the tiny town of Keo Too, which 0:04:33.880 --> 0:04:36.039 is the jumping off point for tiger Leaping gorge. And 0:04:36.040 --> 0:04:39.080 by the way, let a moment here Tiger Tiger leaping gorge. 0:04:39.080 --> 0:04:42.800 You can do a Google on it. It's just fantastically incredible. 0:04:43.240 --> 0:04:46.360 It's you've seen pictures of it. Yeah, it's incredible. I mean, 0:04:46.400 --> 0:04:48.560 if I ever get to China, I'm really going to 0:04:48.640 --> 0:04:50.520 try to go make that take that hike. I mean, 0:04:51.120 --> 0:04:52.560 I don't know that I would take the hike though, 0:04:53.279 --> 0:04:57.839 it's a little scary. I'm I don't know I would 0:04:57.880 --> 0:05:00.960 take that. Yeah, Yeah, more about the hike in a 0:05:01.000 --> 0:05:04.440 little bit. Here. He was carrying a large backpack. He 0:05:04.520 --> 0:05:06.799 left that at a youth hostel called James guest House, 0:05:06.800 --> 0:05:08.440 and he took the top that it's one of those 0:05:08.440 --> 0:05:10.680 backpacks that's got the detachable top party you can use 0:05:10.720 --> 0:05:13.040 kind of look at Fannie packed. And so he took 0:05:13.080 --> 0:05:16.640 that only and put a few clothing articles and toothbrush 0:05:16.680 --> 0:05:19.680 and this Book of Mormon in there, and uh left 0:05:19.680 --> 0:05:21.840 to hike the trail. And I'm sitting I'm assuming he 0:05:21.880 --> 0:05:25.720 had some water in there too. Yeah. He never came 0:05:25.760 --> 0:05:28.480 back to get the backpack. The police found it there 0:05:28.520 --> 0:05:31.360 weeks later. He was he would generally stay in touch 0:05:31.400 --> 0:05:33.520 with his family while traveling. He would email them then 0:05:33.600 --> 0:05:36.280 two or three times a week at least. Um. When 0:05:36.279 --> 0:05:39.279 a week went by, they started worrying about not hearing 0:05:39.320 --> 0:05:41.480 from but they they assumed, well, he's kind of traveling 0:05:41.480 --> 0:05:44.440 in our remote area, so maybe there's no internet cafes. 0:05:45.400 --> 0:05:48.479 But on the twenty sixth of August, he was supposed 0:05:48.480 --> 0:05:51.640 to meet up with his brother Michael in Seoul, South Korea, 0:05:52.320 --> 0:05:54.560 and he didn't show up for their meeting, and that 0:05:54.680 --> 0:05:56.640 was That would have been about two weeks after he 0:05:56.720 --> 0:06:01.599 left to hike Tiger Leaping Gorge. Yeah. Uh so the 0:06:01.600 --> 0:06:03.920 family got in touch with the U. S. Embassy in China, 0:06:04.120 --> 0:06:06.800 and the Chinese authorities did a little searching. They they 0:06:07.279 --> 0:06:09.400 went around, like since he said he was going to 0:06:09.480 --> 0:06:11.440 go to Tiger Leaping Gorge, they went to the tiny 0:06:11.520 --> 0:06:14.400 town of Kian two and put up posters all over 0:06:14.400 --> 0:06:18.480 the place, especially outside hospital hostels. And they also went 0:06:18.520 --> 0:06:20.440 up the trail because they were there were also small 0:06:20.480 --> 0:06:23.320 little hostels and and what we're called guest houses on 0:06:23.360 --> 0:06:25.919 the trail itself. So they went to all those places 0:06:25.920 --> 0:06:28.200 and put posters up and stuff and ask questions, and 0:06:29.160 --> 0:06:33.080 that's how they found the backpack. Other than that, they 0:06:33.160 --> 0:06:36.640 apparently his passport hadn't been used to his his bank 0:06:36.680 --> 0:06:40.920 account hadn't bed touch since August five. They checked the hospitals, jails, 0:06:40.960 --> 0:06:45.360 mental hospitals, found nothing. They decided that murder was out 0:06:45.400 --> 0:06:48.200 of the question because there's very little murdering that part 0:06:48.240 --> 0:06:50.480 of that part of China. It's kind of rural and 0:06:51.160 --> 0:06:53.559 you know, nice, it's not like the cities, and China 0:06:53.640 --> 0:06:56.080 does at least officially have a very low murder rate. 0:06:56.120 --> 0:06:58.640 It's like, you know, one per a hundred thousand, which 0:06:58.680 --> 0:07:00.719 is yeah, and privacy, mean most of that is in 0:07:00.760 --> 0:07:03.040 the cities. Yeah, I would imagine. So, I mean it's 0:07:03.080 --> 0:07:06.920 it's kind of a cultural taboo, yeah, exactly. So they 0:07:06.920 --> 0:07:09.400 found his backpack where he left at Jame's guest house, 0:07:09.400 --> 0:07:12.120 like I said, and looking at that, they've got some clothes, 0:07:12.120 --> 0:07:16.160 some airline tickets, and some undeveloped rules of film, which 0:07:16.160 --> 0:07:19.040 they turned over to the U. S Embassy. Eventually, they 0:07:19.040 --> 0:07:22.760 concluded that David had fallen from the trail to his death, because, 0:07:22.800 --> 0:07:25.280 after all, it is kind of a scary little trail. 0:07:25.600 --> 0:07:27.440 It was kind of kind of treacherous. In fact, I 0:07:27.480 --> 0:07:30.960 came across several amusing blog posts by people who would 0:07:31.000 --> 0:07:35.600 who would hide the trail. You read those two, yeah, 0:07:35.800 --> 0:07:38.640 ne were talking about how it was the most terrifying experience, 0:07:38.680 --> 0:07:44.160 that there was a lot of colorful descriptions of the trail. Yeah. Yeah, 0:07:44.440 --> 0:07:46.920 so it sounds like why I'll never, I'll never hike it. 0:07:46.920 --> 0:07:48.880 It looks kind of awesome. Yeah, now it looks pretty 0:07:48.880 --> 0:07:51.120 awesome to me too, And I'm thinking about the opportunity 0:07:51.160 --> 0:07:55.760 for for photography and some really awesome pictures. Yeah. But 0:07:55.920 --> 0:07:58.520 according the end, and probably you guys read those some 0:07:58.560 --> 0:08:00.560 of the accounts that I read, which is there are 0:08:00.600 --> 0:08:03.400 a few people that said it's very easy to lose 0:08:03.400 --> 0:08:06.000 your way and get sidetracked and get on the wrong path, 0:08:06.200 --> 0:08:09.240 which not a false trails from the main trail. Yeah, 0:08:09.640 --> 0:08:11.880 and then some of those will lead to very perilous 0:08:11.880 --> 0:08:13.800 places and you and here you thinking, well, this is 0:08:13.800 --> 0:08:15.400 a real trail, you know your head, and you keep 0:08:15.440 --> 0:08:17.600 heading on down to this place that's going to lead 0:08:17.640 --> 0:08:20.000 it like maybe not certain death. But oh yeah, no, 0:08:20.080 --> 0:08:22.000 I've I've read I think it might have been one 0:08:22.000 --> 0:08:23.760 of the ones you put up of hikers who went 0:08:23.840 --> 0:08:26.520 down a false trail and followed it for two hours 0:08:26.560 --> 0:08:28.360 and when they realized they were on a false trail 0:08:28.440 --> 0:08:31.440 had to go back and then continue hiking in the 0:08:31.440 --> 0:08:35.640 real trail. So they're doing it in the dark. If 0:08:35.679 --> 0:08:38.440 you've ever hiked in the dark, you know, just a 0:08:38.440 --> 0:08:42.800 flat area, it's kind of perilous. Now put yourself on 0:08:42.880 --> 0:08:46.880 some extreme slope with basically a goat track, that's what 0:08:46.920 --> 0:08:50.520 you're doing. Yeah, now, uh yeah. The only time I 0:08:50.720 --> 0:08:53.240 went up lost and hiking in the dark, I luckily 0:08:53.280 --> 0:08:55.560 had a small flashlight with me. Yeah, that was a 0:08:55.559 --> 0:08:58.080 good thing for you. I'm really glad I had that 0:08:58.120 --> 0:09:00.720 with me, because I would have been hosed. As I said, 0:09:00.720 --> 0:09:03.640 The Chinese concluded that he left the trail, may roll 0:09:03.720 --> 0:09:06.880 down the mountain side, maybe even on into the Jinshaw River, 0:09:07.080 --> 0:09:10.280 which is at the bottom of Tiger Leaping Gorge where 0:09:10.320 --> 0:09:13.480 he drowned, if he wasn't already dead from the fall. Yeah, 0:09:13.559 --> 0:09:16.720 from the fall? Is this? Is this a correct conclusion? Well, 0:09:16.760 --> 0:09:18.960 there's I found one Reddit thread. There's more than one 0:09:19.000 --> 0:09:21.240 Reddit thread about this. This this particular one was the 0:09:21.280 --> 0:09:25.079 shortest one I've ever seen it. That's somebody introduces the 0:09:25.120 --> 0:09:28.160 mystery and everybody's I'll come on. Of course he fell 0:09:28.200 --> 0:09:32.360 and died, you know, Yeah, uh so, but there were 0:09:32.400 --> 0:09:35.199 other threads that had a little more we were a 0:09:35.240 --> 0:09:38.440 little less close minded than that. Yeah, there are people 0:09:38.640 --> 0:09:42.560 who think otherwise, including David Sniden's family, especially the family, 0:09:42.880 --> 0:09:45.080 because they've done a lot of looking for David. They 0:09:45.200 --> 0:09:49.080 really have invested heavily in figuring out what was going on. Yeah, 0:09:49.480 --> 0:09:51.719 good for them. I mean, you know, they won't give 0:09:51.800 --> 0:09:53.520 up on their son. I can only hope that my 0:09:53.559 --> 0:09:57.280 family would do the same, you know, you would hope. 0:09:57.679 --> 0:09:58.920 I don't know. I've met your family out and they 0:09:58.920 --> 0:10:05.360 don't seem to really care for you. It happened. Who's 0:10:05.360 --> 0:10:10.199 going to watch the dog your hell? Okay, so it 0:10:10.280 --> 0:10:15.080 goes xerox off some posters. Yeah, here are a few 0:10:15.120 --> 0:10:16.760 of the theories that are floating around out there. And 0:10:16.800 --> 0:10:18.920 he yes, we're right in the theories now right away, 0:10:19.120 --> 0:10:23.280 right away. This one. Whenever somebody disappears, of course, this 0:10:23.360 --> 0:10:27.560 theory always gets floated, which is that they disappeared voluntarily 0:10:27.679 --> 0:10:29.719 to go start a new life. And you know, we 0:10:29.800 --> 0:10:33.120 heard that in Marrow Murray's case, Dorothy Arnold's case. And 0:10:33.160 --> 0:10:37.080 I found a website called NK News which quotes an 0:10:37.080 --> 0:10:40.280 anonymous friend of David's who said that David was conflicted, 0:10:40.720 --> 0:10:42.880 that he was struggling, that he felt trapped, that he 0:10:42.920 --> 0:10:45.520 was being forced into a mold that he didn't really want. 0:10:46.240 --> 0:10:50.120 K News I believe would be North Korea. I'm suspecting. Um. 0:10:50.480 --> 0:10:52.120 You know, I was never able to find out to 0:10:52.160 --> 0:10:54.400 my satisfaction whether or not it was just a North 0:10:54.480 --> 0:10:57.840 Korean propaganda side. Yeah, I think I was on that 0:10:57.880 --> 0:10:59.600 site and I couldn't figure out what was going on. 0:11:00.160 --> 0:11:02.640 I know, I know it's if you ever read any 0:11:02.640 --> 0:11:06.640 official press releases from North Korea, they're a lot less 0:11:06.679 --> 0:11:10.079 professional than that, particular than endkan News with the website. Yeah, 0:11:10.280 --> 0:11:12.720 I mean, because you know, the ones from North North 0:11:12.800 --> 0:11:17.760 Korean government are bombastic, combative and and just kind of ludicrous. 0:11:18.360 --> 0:11:22.200 And whereas that one was that that the NK news 0:11:22.320 --> 0:11:25.800 article was was actually written in a fairly reasonable rational voice, 0:11:26.000 --> 0:11:28.080 even though even though I think they made up this 0:11:28.120 --> 0:11:31.680 anonymous friend of David's and they didn't say who he was, 0:11:31.840 --> 0:11:34.679 and it didn't sound to be like from his other 0:11:34.920 --> 0:11:36.800 his other friends said that he was conflicted at all. 0:11:37.240 --> 0:11:39.440 They said he was David. Back to end Kane News, 0:11:39.559 --> 0:11:41.719 he was last seen at the Korean Restaurant in the 0:11:41.760 --> 0:11:45.160 company of quote A beautiful Asian woman unquote. So they 0:11:45.200 --> 0:11:47.959 floated the idea that he's decided to leave and start 0:11:48.040 --> 0:11:51.000 his life over again. Yeah, I don't like this, sary. 0:11:51.040 --> 0:11:53.240 Had he left seven hundred behind seven hund dollars behind 0:11:53.320 --> 0:11:55.560 his bank account, why wouldn't he get that out? If 0:11:55.600 --> 0:11:57.400 you're gonna head off to start a new life, how 0:11:57.480 --> 0:11:58.880 don't you want to take as much cash as you 0:11:58.880 --> 0:12:01.280 can with you. You never back to get his backpack either, 0:12:01.679 --> 0:12:05.360 he already paid tuition for fall and bring him young. Um. 0:12:05.400 --> 0:12:07.640 And also, last of all, I think that leaving your 0:12:07.640 --> 0:12:11.440 family hanging like that is is really kind of what's 0:12:11.480 --> 0:12:13.679 the word I'm trying to think. Yeah, it's a d 0:12:13.800 --> 0:12:16.160 bag move, you know. I mean, and he didn't strike people. 0:12:16.200 --> 0:12:18.400 What I've learned about David, that's that kind of a guy. 0:12:18.640 --> 0:12:20.320 So I have a couple of questions for you. Yeah, 0:12:20.720 --> 0:12:24.240 first off, tuition was paid? Was he financing his tuition 0:12:24.360 --> 0:12:26.360 or was he paying cash? Do you know I never 0:12:26.400 --> 0:12:28.839 found him? No, I do not know. That's a good question. 0:12:28.920 --> 0:12:31.360 I'm going to guess they're going to bring him young. 0:12:31.440 --> 0:12:34.840 He probably had to finance it. So when it says 0:12:34.880 --> 0:12:36.839 that it was paid for, really he had signed the 0:12:36.880 --> 0:12:38.840 loan paperwork, but if he never showed up, the money 0:12:38.960 --> 0:12:44.000 never would transferred. Yeah, I well, I in this particular case, 0:12:44.240 --> 0:12:48.400 I don't. I'm not fully behind the he decided to 0:12:48.400 --> 0:12:52.199 to just take off and make a new life. I 0:12:52.240 --> 0:12:58.360 will say that from the perspective of his religion. It's 0:12:59.000 --> 0:13:01.880 you here describe I've I've known some folks who were Mormons. 0:13:02.000 --> 0:13:05.480 Is that there. It's a bit rigid at times, and 0:13:05.920 --> 0:13:11.080 you put on the happy face. You are everything is great. 0:13:11.559 --> 0:13:15.280 You couldn't be happier. You do everything you're told to. 0:13:15.920 --> 0:13:20.080 You show no signs of any cracks in the foundation, 0:13:21.320 --> 0:13:24.160 but that doesn't mean they're not there, and that doesn't 0:13:24.200 --> 0:13:28.960 mean that people in that situation won't do things behind 0:13:29.120 --> 0:13:34.679 everybody else's back. Very particular example is that years ago 0:13:35.440 --> 0:13:37.720 I met a girl and we started dating. This was 0:13:37.920 --> 0:13:41.000 very briefly, and I kind of knew she was Mormon, 0:13:41.080 --> 0:13:43.760 but I didn't really pay attention to it. And then 0:13:43.920 --> 0:13:46.560 not too long after we had been together for a 0:13:46.640 --> 0:13:50.440 very brief amount of time, I come to find out that, oh, well, 0:13:50.520 --> 0:13:53.640 she's actually her family doesn't know about me. They think 0:13:53.679 --> 0:13:58.800 she's extremely devout and she's, according to the church, engaged. 0:13:59.440 --> 0:14:06.440 This does somebody else entirely who was of the church. Okay, 0:14:06.559 --> 0:14:09.959 now she was doing all of this for I mean, 0:14:10.000 --> 0:14:11.800 she pulled it off with me for about a month 0:14:11.800 --> 0:14:16.360 before I was like, whoa, So no, this is not okay. 0:14:16.600 --> 0:14:18.680 She didn't try to convert you or anything. No. But 0:14:18.679 --> 0:14:23.200 but the point is is that when you are following 0:14:23.240 --> 0:14:25.320 what you're told you have to do and it's not 0:14:25.360 --> 0:14:29.520 what you want to do, people can get extremely creative 0:14:29.560 --> 0:14:32.960 about making that double life. Now do I think that 0:14:32.960 --> 0:14:36.480 that's what happened to him? I I really I don't 0:14:36.560 --> 0:14:39.360 see anything. But then again, I have to wonder was 0:14:39.440 --> 0:14:43.640 he good enough at making that double life that for 0:14:43.760 --> 0:14:46.680 him the whole time in Korea was a giant party, 0:14:46.800 --> 0:14:49.240 but everybody else didn't know it because he was just 0:14:49.280 --> 0:14:53.960 so good at hiding it. You know, I had no 0:14:54.040 --> 0:14:56.360 idea how to vow he was. You know, any religion 0:14:56.440 --> 0:14:58.720 is like there's always going to be people who are 0:14:58.760 --> 0:15:02.520 more into it than other people. The varying degrees of commitment. Yeah, 0:15:02.520 --> 0:15:05.880 I had a lot of variance there. But he left 0:15:05.880 --> 0:15:08.880 the money in the backpack behind. I don't know. People do, 0:15:09.120 --> 0:15:13.440 not everybody obviously, but there's a certain fair number of 0:15:13.440 --> 0:15:16.160 people who classify Mormonism as a cult just to like 0:15:16.520 --> 0:15:20.520 that out there. Well, you know, while everything like Stephen 0:15:20.600 --> 0:15:23.240 saying may have seemed really hunky dorry to his friends 0:15:23.240 --> 0:15:26.280 and family, if he was feeling that, it was kind 0:15:26.320 --> 0:15:29.200 of that way and the only way to escape out 0:15:29.200 --> 0:15:31.680 of it would have been to fake his death and 0:15:31.800 --> 0:15:34.400 lead a different life. But I agree, I don't necessarily 0:15:34.400 --> 0:15:37.200 think you would leave all that stuff behind. Yeah, yeah, 0:15:37.280 --> 0:15:40.080 I don't think so. Yeah. I mean that dropping of 0:15:40.160 --> 0:15:44.520 every physical trace. That's I almost want to say, that's like, 0:15:44.560 --> 0:15:48.480 you know, a total government plot level thought ahead of time, 0:15:48.600 --> 0:15:50.960 instead of you know, some dude who is like, that's it. 0:15:51.080 --> 0:15:53.320 I got to get out. He's not going to be 0:15:53.400 --> 0:15:56.760 that good at planning and ahead and you know, I mean, 0:15:56.840 --> 0:16:01.400 it's I don't think this is what happened, But I can't. 0:16:01.440 --> 0:16:04.840 I can't push it away as a possibility is as 0:16:04.920 --> 0:16:09.720 easily as some are willing to, I can push it 0:16:09.760 --> 0:16:13.440 away pretty easily. I'm giving this theory um once one 0:16:13.480 --> 0:16:19.640 star out of seven possible. They it's one of those 0:16:19.640 --> 0:16:23.320 stories for Joe. Yeah, folks at home, please write down 0:16:23.360 --> 0:16:26.920 that number. You're gonna need a cheat sheet at the 0:16:27.040 --> 0:16:30.680 edge because there will be a test. Yeah. Yeah, so 0:16:30.800 --> 0:16:33.040 not a not a good theory in my opinion. Okay, 0:16:33.120 --> 0:16:36.800 next theory, Um, he was murdered. It's hard to say 0:16:37.000 --> 0:16:40.400 why somebody would murder him. Something maybe robbery, Maybe somebody 0:16:40.400 --> 0:16:43.240 wanted wanted his money as Walleton, but it seems like 0:16:43.320 --> 0:16:46.160 he didn't have that much money on him. Yeah. Yeah, 0:16:46.280 --> 0:16:49.440 and uh, it's probably not necessary to kill somebody. You 0:16:49.440 --> 0:16:52.640 can just rob him, right. And of course, as I said, 0:16:52.800 --> 0:16:55.800 murder was not typical of the area. But I will 0:16:55.800 --> 0:16:58.200 say this I did, I did look around a little bit. 0:16:58.240 --> 0:17:02.000 But it turns out in in two thousand four when 0:17:02.080 --> 0:17:06.080 David disappeared, there happened to be a farmer named jiangyang Ming. 0:17:06.160 --> 0:17:08.879 He lived in Yunon Province, although he didn't live like 0:17:08.920 --> 0:17:10.800 he lived near the sent of the city of kung Ming, 0:17:11.040 --> 0:17:13.879 which is a city that David was actually going it 0:17:13.920 --> 0:17:17.680 was actually going to travel to shortly. It's a nearby city. Uh. 0:17:17.720 --> 0:17:21.560 In May two thousand twelve, Young Ming Jiang how would 0:17:21.600 --> 0:17:25.240 be calling jiangang Ming was arrested for murder and turns 0:17:25.280 --> 0:17:28.000 out he was a serial killer and he was suspected 0:17:28.040 --> 0:17:31.600 of murdering perhaps as many as seventeen people. Yeah, his 0:17:31.680 --> 0:17:35.680 first murder was in nineteen seventy nine. He uh served 0:17:36.000 --> 0:17:38.040 prison time for that until nineteen ninety seven, when they 0:17:38.080 --> 0:17:41.879 let him out and gave him some land in Yunan 0:17:41.960 --> 0:17:45.760 Province to be a farmer. After he murdered these people, 0:17:46.080 --> 0:17:50.440 reportedly he butchered their bodies and fed parts of them 0:17:51.080 --> 0:17:55.480 to his dogs. And here's the best part, or maybe 0:17:55.480 --> 0:17:58.000 not the best part, but a lot of the meat. 0:17:58.080 --> 0:18:00.000 He would cure it and take it down to the 0:18:00.040 --> 0:18:05.120 local market and sell it as ostrich meat. It's white meat, yeah, 0:18:05.160 --> 0:18:07.800 I know, And so you don't know what in white 0:18:07.800 --> 0:18:12.240 meat is white meat? Yeah? So yeah, the word of 0:18:12.280 --> 0:18:14.000 the wise if you go to China, don't eat the 0:18:14.000 --> 0:18:21.440 ostrich meeting. Yeah. So, anyway, his spree is mostly concentrated. 0:18:21.480 --> 0:18:22.800 I think the ones that were able to pin on 0:18:22.920 --> 0:18:26.040 him were from two thousand to two thou twelve. That 0:18:26.119 --> 0:18:28.679 doesn't mean that he didn't commit the odd murder before 0:18:28.760 --> 0:18:33.240 that time, just means maybe he escalated, so could Jang 0:18:33.280 --> 0:18:36.080 and David cross paths and did that and not so 0:18:36.200 --> 0:18:40.000 well for David that you know. My thing with this 0:18:40.040 --> 0:18:44.359 whole theory is that he's hiking a trail. Yeah, you know, 0:18:44.440 --> 0:18:47.360 that's not the best place to try and abduct somebody 0:18:47.480 --> 0:18:49.879 or commit a crime, because you don't know there's you know, 0:18:49.920 --> 0:18:52.760 there's inevitably going to be somebody just around the corner 0:18:53.520 --> 0:18:56.080 on that path. Well yeah, but I don't. I don't 0:18:56.400 --> 0:18:59.919 because I personally think spoiler alert here and play your ear. 0:19:00.119 --> 0:19:03.560 But I personally think he didn't meet him on the trail. 0:19:03.600 --> 0:19:06.080 He met him, met him afterwards, after he left the trail, 0:19:06.600 --> 0:19:10.280 if he met him at all, that I doubt. At 0:19:10.320 --> 0:19:12.800 the odds of these two crossing paths is I think 0:19:13.040 --> 0:19:16.879 pretty minimal. Yeah, it makes me think of do you 0:19:16.920 --> 0:19:21.160 remember what is that Timothy Oliphant movie where he is, uh, 0:19:21.200 --> 0:19:24.240 he's a newly wed and he needs another newlywed couple 0:19:24.400 --> 0:19:26.639 and it turns out one of the one couple is 0:19:26.640 --> 0:19:31.680 a set of crazy psycho killers. But it's just everything 0:19:31.680 --> 0:19:35.080 about the movie is so absurd because the chances of 0:19:35.080 --> 0:19:36.960 this and the chances of that, and you know, it's 0:19:37.000 --> 0:19:39.480 one of those we just build suspense and suspense till 0:19:39.520 --> 0:19:42.800 we have a sort of okay ending. But it's like 0:19:43.560 --> 0:19:47.560 that that only happens in written Hollywood movies. That's where 0:19:47.600 --> 0:19:50.080 they meet on the trail and they hike for a 0:19:50.160 --> 0:19:53.000 day together, and they bore him my friendship and then 0:19:53.000 --> 0:19:56.560 he beats him over the head and cooks him for dinner. Yeah, 0:19:56.680 --> 0:19:59.800 I know the I don't think that if they did meet, 0:20:00.280 --> 0:20:03.560 I think they would admit probably later on. Okay, but 0:20:03.880 --> 0:20:06.880 I guess another point to be made probably is that 0:20:07.160 --> 0:20:10.320 you don't a tourist is probably way more likely to 0:20:10.359 --> 0:20:13.639 be missed. That's an American tourists. Yeah, you know, because 0:20:14.640 --> 0:20:18.400 apparently people disappear in China with a disturbing regularity, but 0:20:18.480 --> 0:20:22.600 like locals, locals exactly. So everybody figures they went to 0:20:22.680 --> 0:20:25.440 the big city or the next town to get better work, 0:20:25.640 --> 0:20:28.520 or everybody figures that they were kidnapped and sent off 0:20:28.560 --> 0:20:33.480 to do Okay, yeah, yeah, okay, so I I murder. 0:20:33.520 --> 0:20:35.960 I'm going to say it's kind of improbable, and we're 0:20:36.040 --> 0:20:40.520 going to give that three stars okay out of okay. Yeah, 0:20:40.560 --> 0:20:42.920 I'm going to be consistent here. Is this an arbitrary 0:20:42.920 --> 0:20:45.879 scoring system, by the way, or is there some you know, 0:20:46.040 --> 0:20:50.360 he's he's done all the math behind it, calculations want 0:20:50.400 --> 0:20:53.400 to make really complex formulas. I don't. I don't want 0:20:53.440 --> 0:20:56.280 to get you know, some statistician right and in about 0:20:56.280 --> 0:20:58.880 how our system is skewed. I just want to make sure. Yeah, 0:20:58.920 --> 0:21:01.359 now you multiply three of three or three times and 0:21:01.440 --> 0:21:08.600 you get yeah. And I like the system because it's 0:21:08.600 --> 0:21:12.760 more precise than just say four or five stars. Yeah. Okay, 0:21:12.760 --> 0:21:17.600 next theory suicide. Now, I know it's stupid, but I'm 0:21:17.600 --> 0:21:20.119 going to give this one a quarter star. Yeah, because 0:21:20.119 --> 0:21:23.000 obviously nobody h there was no evidence of any kind 0:21:23.040 --> 0:21:26.159 of depression. His friend George Bailey that he lived with 0:21:26.200 --> 0:21:29.800 in Beijing and he traveled with after Beijing said I 0:21:29.880 --> 0:21:32.640 didn't report any sort of depression or anything like that. Yeah. 0:21:32.640 --> 0:21:36.119 I would give ran away more more credence in this. 0:21:36.240 --> 0:21:39.520 Oh yeah, twice as much in fact, at least our 0:21:39.560 --> 0:21:42.600 next theory he fell on the gorge and went splat. Yeah. 0:21:43.400 --> 0:21:45.479 Of course, as you know, some people believe this, including 0:21:45.480 --> 0:21:49.040 the Chinese government. That's what China says, That's what says. Yeah, 0:21:49.560 --> 0:21:52.800 it's plausible because the high Trail's what we've already said. 0:21:52.840 --> 0:21:55.760 It's kind of scary, and people have died by the way. 0:21:56.200 --> 0:21:58.720 Of course, one difference between those incidents and this is 0:21:58.760 --> 0:22:01.479