Speaker 1: What up. I'm Van Lathan. I'm here the whole bootleg
Speaker 1: keV accountable. Check me out on the Bootleg keV podcast.
Speaker 1: We had a great time. You're not gonna want to
Speaker 1: miss it. Is this? Where would I have heard of
Speaker 1: yat song?
Speaker 2: Where would you have heard a Yeat song? I think
Speaker 2: just like online on without knowing it, like if someone
Speaker 2: used it, because he did. He did the Minion song
Speaker 2: from the movie for the Rose of Grow or whatever,
Speaker 2: and it was a big It was big on online
Speaker 2: like TikTok and reels. Yeah. Well, listen, Van Lathan is
Speaker 2: here on the Bootleg CAV podcast.
Speaker 1: Right, welcome, what's up?
Speaker 2: What's up?
Speaker 1: Man chilling bro? The only thing I'm here to talk
Speaker 1: about is Dual Lipa.
Speaker 2: Well, I don't know much about her outside of I
Speaker 2: think she's from the same place Action Bronson's from from Albania. Albania.
Speaker 1: Yep, you never heard Dance the Night from the Barbie soundtrack.
Speaker 2: Maybe I watched the movie lately, I've been I watched
Speaker 2: the movie.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, you know like that she heard that song.
Speaker 2: I don't know if I've really like applied myself to
Speaker 2: when it was on to like really no, it's just
Speaker 2: background knowing.
Speaker 1: You feel you too masculine for that you're the type
Speaker 1: of god. It's like you feel like there's not a
Speaker 1: part of you and now Postcat Williams, nobody will be
Speaker 1: able to do it. But you feel like you can't
Speaker 1: let go and tap and tap into a different side
Speaker 1: of yourself. That means something.
Speaker 2: I have plenty of musical sides in myself, Like tell me, like,
Speaker 2: what's what's I have a Garth Brooks shirt on it though, Yeah,
Speaker 2: that's not what I'm talking about.
Speaker 1: Though, that's just the racist side of you. Actually, he's
Speaker 1: not a racist. I shouldn't say that about Garth Brooks.
Speaker 1: Garth Brooks is actually coolest ship.
Speaker 2: And he's like fucking I think he's like a pretty
Speaker 2: progressive differ.
Speaker 1: So I'm saying like, Garth Brooks is one of the genre,
Speaker 1: He's one of the good ones calling baton rouge. I
Speaker 1: liked that song. I also liked when he uh he
Speaker 1: flipped it up and went with Chris Gaines for a
Speaker 1: little while he was emo was emo.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I didn't get that. I mean at the time
Speaker 2: I was like a little kid, so I was just like,
Speaker 2: I don't know what's going on here?
Speaker 1: You know, so are you so you didn't like that?
Speaker 1: So are you one of the are you want to
Speaker 1: white boys that you go extra hardcore to make up
Speaker 1: for the fact that some people might like not want
Speaker 1: to let you in. You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 2: I'm just me man, just Youah, he's your favorite rapper ever? Yeah,
Speaker 2: so I have to answers to that question. My favorite
Speaker 2: MC of all time is Nas. My favorite rapper. Rapper
Speaker 2: is Nas. My favorite artist in terms of just like discography. Uh,
Speaker 2: you know, Kendrick's creeping up in there, but it's Kanye.
Speaker 1: Yeah, me too.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So it's like Nas. And then like I just
Speaker 2: have a real serious place in my heart for outcasts too.
Speaker 2: So I would say those would be like the the three.
Speaker 2: But Nas is like my favorite rapper.
Speaker 1: Nas is to me the most the most you know
Speaker 1: how people say the the greatest rapper of all time.
Speaker 1: Nas is the most anointed rapper of all time.
Speaker 2: I mean I see the perspective of people thinking that,
Speaker 2: like sometimes he's just like he just gets it because
Speaker 2: he's Nas. But in my opinion, like between ill maatic
Speaker 2: it was written, you know, I Am, I loved I AM.
Speaker 2: A lot of people didn't like it. I just don't know,
Speaker 2: like who's writing records like fucking rewind you know what
Speaker 2: I'm saying.
Speaker 1: That's my thing is like there are certain people in
Speaker 1: all of this When we have conversations about who the
Speaker 1: greatest rappers are?
Speaker 2: Who the greatest because your favorite album of all time
Speaker 2: is four hundred Degrees right?
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah yeah. But when we're having conversations about that,
Speaker 1: I think we have them too broadly for sure.
Speaker 2: I always say just my favorite, right. I think that
Speaker 2: there's like the list which to me, like the only
Speaker 2: guy who should be number one that like nobody could
Speaker 2: argue with is jay Z. Now there's what you can't
Speaker 2: are I think Drake's And again I don't think I
Speaker 2: don't think Drake's number one, but I have to give it.
Speaker 1: To so what it was when you say Drake or
Speaker 1: jay Z, Like what's the metric there?
Speaker 2: I just think that like we're getting to a point
Speaker 2: in time where if you're probably like twenty five, twenty six,
Speaker 2: I think that the way you've lived your life and
Speaker 2: consumed music, Drake probably has to be the undisputed goat
Speaker 2: because because nobody was like like a lot, like like
Speaker 2: these people weren't alive. Like I went to the warehouse
Speaker 2: when I was like twelve or thirteen and bought Blueprint,
Speaker 2: you know what I'm saying, Like I remember buying Ghetto
Speaker 2: Fabulous and Blueprint on September eleventh, like the same day
Speaker 2: the fucking the Towers hit. So I think that, like
Speaker 2: there's a whole generation of people who like there really
Speaker 2: is only like one answer that's like unarguable, and that's Drake.
Speaker 2: Right to me, I think Kendrick is. I put Kendrick
Speaker 2: over Drake.
Speaker 1: I think sometimes people confuse and this is a lot
Speaker 1: of things, and like I said, they're different subgenres. When
Speaker 1: I say Nas is the most anointed rapper of all time,
Speaker 1: there are certain rappers to me that exist that I
Speaker 1: feel like they're touched by something ethereal and spiritual, just
Speaker 1: artists across the landscape of music to say something to people.
Speaker 1: I feel like Nas is one of those guys. Feel
Speaker 1: like Jay Electronica is one of those. I feel like,
Speaker 1: you have guys out there, and these guys they would
Speaker 1: never be on the level of some of the other
Speaker 1: people because they have something that they have to say
Speaker 1: doesn't mean that they're perfect people. It doesn't mean that
Speaker 1: they don't get things wrong. Doesn't mean that they need
Speaker 1: to grow. It just means that the greatness of their
Speaker 1: music is being funneled through this ethos that's so uncommon
Speaker 1: that a lot of people aren't gonna even try to
Speaker 1: do it. When you're talking about like Drake, that's like
Speaker 1: Avatar two the Way of Water. And when I say
Speaker 1: about that.
Speaker 2: That's what I always say, Drake is like the Transformers.
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, I'm saying when you go to see when
Speaker 1: you go to see or Avengers, right right, Vengers in game.
Speaker 1: But I actually said that because Avatar two went pass Avengers,
Speaker 1: but maybe it didn't. But look, when when you go
Speaker 1: to see Avatar two, when you sit down, you're gonna
Speaker 1: be like, god damn, this is impressive.
Speaker 2: You're gonna enjoy it.
Speaker 1: You're gonna enjoy it, and you're gonna be like, this
Speaker 1: is the This is super duper impressive. The visuals are crazy.
Speaker 1: The story, which is the meat of it, is good
Speaker 1: enough for you to remember that you are having a
Speaker 1: good time. You are immersed in something. Dre's gonna do
Speaker 1: number He's gonna send box that. Drake has always immersed
Speaker 1: people into who he is. He's always given you just
Speaker 1: enough substance for you to be like, Nah, this God
Speaker 1: doesn't have anything more but not enough in my opinion,
Speaker 1: not enough, but just enough for you to be like
Speaker 1: He's given you enough emotion, he's given you enough connection,
Speaker 1: but he's never really tackled any really important issue.
Speaker 2: Dude, this is what I say. I say this on
Speaker 2: every platform imaginable. I've been saying this for fucking ever.
Speaker 2: I just don't know how he feels about the world,
Speaker 2: Like I have no idea about like what it was
Speaker 2: like growing up to be like a biracial kid whose
Speaker 2: mom is Jewish, Like I don't know what it's like,
Speaker 2: like like he has no he has no political he
Speaker 2: has no political Like he has no political about politics.
Speaker 3: Let me say about politics, what's like in the world,
Speaker 3: like any sort of like little bit of consciousness, a
Speaker 3: little bit of just state of events happening, little opinion
Speaker 3: he's like he don't want to have an opinion because
Speaker 3: it's like the Michael Jordan thing.
Speaker 1: I feel like Republican's vos sleepers, sneakers. Let me say
Speaker 1: something about about when I knew that Drake was kind
Speaker 1: of where he was and fantastic artists makes great music
Speaker 1: but this was gonna say and an incredible rapper, incredible rapper,
Speaker 1: best songmaker ever, maybe like incredible rapper, like doesn't have
Speaker 1: too many bad songs.
Speaker 2: It's literally, yes, it's hard to have a Drake.
Speaker 1: Ba ninety six percent from the field. Here's the thing.
Speaker 1: In the wake of the Drake push a T situation,
Speaker 1: that was an opportunity not just for Drake to get
Speaker 1: to the pure essence of hip hop, right because he's
Speaker 1: not already done that. For people to say that Drake
Speaker 1: has never answered to this, that's not true. He's answered
Speaker 1: this is all the time.
Speaker 2: He temporarily halted Meek Mill's career, right.
Speaker 1: But there was an opportunity there and maybe he was
Speaker 1: going to do it or whatever for us to get
Speaker 1: an understanding of how difficult the Adonna situate or the
Speaker 1: entire thing where his baby's mom was for him, because
Speaker 1: like those are, that's a real relata relatable situation. When
Speaker 1: I say that Donna situation, I don't mean to say
Speaker 1: to say that Donna situation because he loves his son
Speaker 1: and he's obviously a very great father, father is great father.
Speaker 1: But to be in a situation with someone that you
Speaker 1: weren't particularly attached to and somebody that had kind of
Speaker 1: been out there in the uh in the industry, everybody
Speaker 1: was having fun, and then to have that and deal
Speaker 1: with that, and to be trying to keep it close
Speaker 1: to the vest like that and not have people know
Speaker 1: about what's going on in your family life and then
Speaker 1: you just have somebody come out and tell all your
Speaker 1: fucking business. That's got to be fucking difficult to deal with.
Speaker 1: And if anything, that was an opportunity to and he
Speaker 1: kinda he kind of dubbed it like I wasn't hiding.
Speaker 2: He held the l and didn't reply, But.
Speaker 1: He also didn't give us anything more about what it
Speaker 1: meant to go through that, like when you're at the
Speaker 1: height of your career.
Speaker 2: And why and why it was he didn't want why.
Speaker 1: He didn't want to do it, and what it even
Speaker 1: meant for them to get back cool and all of that.
Speaker 1: So there's a and it might come from all kinds
Speaker 1: of things. You know, when we talk about people, we
Speaker 1: talk about them like we're talking about the NBA or
Speaker 1: the NFL, But these people are putting their lives in
Speaker 1: their music. So there might be a trauma response there
Speaker 1: that might be a distance from people to protect yourself.
Speaker 1: That might be there all kinds of shit, But because
Speaker 1: of that, the music is always going to be less
Speaker 1: important than somebody else who gets in there and bleeds
Speaker 1: on them motherfucking records. Always, and it don't matter what
Speaker 1: it is. We could be talking about the difference between
Speaker 1: the Beatles and Van Halen, you know, we could be
Speaker 1: talking about the difference between fucking Marvin Gay and Loser
Speaker 1: Van Drass.
Speaker 2: It's almost like you said, it's like if Drake is
Speaker 2: like we all have avengers, right, like Nas is like,
Speaker 2: you know, no Country for old men?
Speaker 1: Maybe yeah, Nas is like no Country, but the best
Speaker 1: movie in that So I would say he's like there
Speaker 1: will be blood, right yeah, Nas is like there will
Speaker 1: be blood. You can watch it and enjoyed as much
Speaker 1: as you want, and I've seen there will be blood
Speaker 1: a bunch of times. But you gotta fucking commit. You
Speaker 1: gotta commit to that movie, and you gotta give it something.
Speaker 1: It's gonna take something from.
Speaker 2: You to me. That's why Kendrick to me has like
Speaker 2: I don't know if we appreciate him enough, because he's
Speaker 2: somehow catapulted in between his sliders up right, all of
Speaker 2: them are. He has hit records.
Speaker 1: He can the best rappers, Like the music is important.
Speaker 2: I don't know if anybody is a better rapper, to
Speaker 2: be fair like, I don't know if anyone is a
Speaker 2: better rapper than Kendrick. I mean there maybe you know,
Speaker 2: like I mean, there's guys like Royce and like you know,
Speaker 2: there's guys who are amazing mcs out there, but like Kendrick.
Speaker 1: Alien Royce is not like a you know, amazing.
Speaker 2: Hendrick's like a god level MC.
Speaker 1: There's a level of gods rap better than Kendrick.
Speaker 2: I think Kendrick can do things Royce can't do, though,
Speaker 2: I think in terms of like wordplay, voice chain, and
Speaker 2: I think I.
Speaker 1: Think certain things if you were going to talk about lyricals,
Speaker 1: like lyrical just I think there's I think Loope.
Speaker 2: Is probably better than everybody. Loop is just go press
Speaker 2: just go press play on mural.
Speaker 1: No no, I think I think, I think if it's
Speaker 1: if it's em C, I think might be the greatest.
Speaker 1: Another white man sit here to separate as you did
Speaker 1: that on purpose.
Speaker 2: No no, no no, I liked when they had their I
Speaker 2: liked when they had their together.
Speaker 1: I caught that. No no, I didn't bought that I
Speaker 1: used to work at the place that invented that.
Speaker 2: So are you telling me that Loupe if we're just
Speaker 2: talking about at rap.
Speaker 1: On the most talented, he's amazing, It's like it's dumb,
Speaker 1: quite possibly the biggest what if ever, So let me
Speaker 1: tell you something about Let me tell you something about
Speaker 1: Loupe when people think that rap like isn't art. I
Speaker 1: had this conversation with my daddy Rest in peace to
Speaker 1: my dad. Man. My dad was like, yeah, man, you know,
Speaker 1: I like the little songs that you'll be having. And
Speaker 1: this is what I love about older black people. They
Speaker 1: have a way of bringing you in but then reminding
Speaker 1: you that what you're talking about really ain't shit. So
Speaker 1: my dad is like, I like the little rap songs.
Speaker 1: Little like those little rap songs, y'all do shit that
Speaker 1: ain't no confunction. You know, there ain't no Parliament funk
Speaker 1: or Derek right right right, right right, you know what
Speaker 1: I'm saying. But so I was like, Dad, I can
Speaker 1: make you right now a fan of rap. I put
Speaker 1: on put you on Game by Loupe Fiasco from the
Speaker 1: Cool and the song that's basically talking about this idea
Speaker 1: of the game and this thing that we have kind
Speaker 1: of elevated in this street ethos and this ethic that
Speaker 1: we've taken and made it into something that actually helps
Speaker 1: to define the fabric and the the conversation and the
Speaker 1: relationships and all of these neighborhoods that not only does
Speaker 1: it not serve us, it was given to us to
Speaker 1: purposefully displace us emotionally and spiritually. And by the end
Speaker 1: of the song, everybody that worships the game has sold
Speaker 1: their soul to the devil unwittingly. It is a master word.
Speaker 2: It's it's one of his best songs for sure.
Speaker 1: Yes, his best song.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's his best song. Don't Go, Don't go on
Speaker 2: the loop thing, We're not gonna, We're not gonna, I'll go,
Speaker 2: I'll go.
Speaker 1: Loope, Royce, Jay Electronica, Nas Nigga. In addition to my
Speaker 1: homeboys from Louisiana, Box Royale, all of those guys like
Speaker 1: these are the guys that I listen to. These are
Speaker 1: the guys that I listen twice, all over and over
Speaker 1: and over again. What you have to tell me, how
Speaker 1: you know, Jay Electronica, What did you.
Speaker 2: Think of the Bad Medieval Album.
Speaker 1: Here's the thing about the Bad Meats Evil album because
Speaker 1: I just I was so tired of the girl who
Speaker 1: I always confuse her name with the porn star's name.
Speaker 1: It's Skyler Gray, but I always call her, what's the
Speaker 1: porn star's name, the white chick who was popping like
Speaker 1: ten years ago.
Speaker 2: Her last name is Sasha Gray.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that's a good one right there. That's a
Speaker 1: good one, bro, Sasha. You said scholar, But Skyler Gray's
Speaker 1: I just was Scott to the point where Eminem was
Speaker 1: just putting this her pink on every fucking record.
Speaker 2: I'm like, Skylar Gray doesn't belong on a fuck.
Speaker 1: I like Badman, it's evil, but it's Eminem coded. So
Speaker 1: em has a very distinct style, and it's his style,
Speaker 1: and the way he does his thing now is pretty
Speaker 1: heavy handed. So but but the song you just brought
Speaker 1: up about Loupe, I would take a single one of
Speaker 1: those from Drake and be like, Okay, he has some
Speaker 1: songs that make you think he is. Some songs like
Speaker 1: whenever Drake talks about his mother.
Speaker 2: His mom or he does I mean like he's very vulnerable.
Speaker 2: I feel like when talk when he's talking about relationships
Speaker 2: in like Darl's Room. Yeah, I just think that like,
Speaker 2: uh you know, like you said, like just dive into
Speaker 2: any sort of fabric of like the world, that'd be nice.
Speaker 1: Drake also is like one of the best examples of
Speaker 1: uh like light skinn nigga privilege that's ever existed. Because
Speaker 1: I know you can't. You probably try to in your
Speaker 1: off time. I don't because like a lot of Drake
Speaker 1: has a lot of songs that are very very very
Speaker 1: uh sensitive, complimentary, uplifting to women.
Speaker 2: But also Drake got a lot of heart on these
Speaker 2: whole songs.
Speaker 1: Drake got a lot like even when when when Best
Speaker 1: I've had? When when when Best I've had first came out?
Speaker 1: The song every all the girls are rocking, It's like
Speaker 1: when you listen to the words of that record, that's
Speaker 1: not a very heartfelt song.
Speaker 2: Well, you know, I think the greats are all uh
Speaker 2: you know, hypocrites, tupac nas I.
Speaker 1: Mean, not a human beings.
Speaker 2: So the pendulum swings both way. We're not not everybody
Speaker 2: is one thing, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: So what I'm so all I'm saying with him though,
Speaker 1: is that like he has a record, he has a
Speaker 1: reputation of making music for women. He has a.
Speaker 2: Reputation he has that reputation, right, He has.
Speaker 1: A reputation of making music for women, and really, when
Speaker 1: you think about it, especially here of late, he has
Speaker 1: as many songs for the women as he does. Basically,
Speaker 1: I'm hard on these holes and I'm Drake, you know.
Speaker 1: But look, I tell you, I'll tell you one thing
Speaker 1: right now. The run that he's been on for Nigga
Speaker 1: since I was dunking.
Speaker 2: It's eight nine, like best ever had got work.
Speaker 1: It's not gonna happen again.
Speaker 2: No, it's one of one. It's not gonna happen again.
Speaker 1: So whatever you whatever you want to say, put his
Speaker 1: jersey in the rafters is not gonna happen again.
Speaker 2: So your personal favorite rappers like give me your like
Speaker 2: did you you kind of just gave me.
Speaker 1: The nas that motherfucker juvenile Juvie Juvie fucking uh Royce
Speaker 1: j Electronica.
Speaker 2: I wonder you grow because how old are you? About
Speaker 2: the same agent forty three? Okay, so you're older than me.
Speaker 2: You're seven years older than me.
Speaker 1: When I was a little.
Speaker 2: Kid, I was so into No Limit records. Of course,
Speaker 2: ghetto dope was like an important part of my life.
Speaker 1: And you want to beat them, what you wore camouflage.
Speaker 2: Yes, I had that. I had a no I could
Speaker 2: BROH had the chain. I didn't have camera.
Speaker 1: Flro I could see you.
Speaker 2: I was super poor.
Speaker 1: I didn't have cameraf I couldn't see you. I'm from
Speaker 1: the rough scrabble areas of Phoenix. I could see you. Yes, Actually,
Speaker 1: right now.
Speaker 2: I'll tell you, hey, hey, wait wait, Phoenix is crazy.
Speaker 1: I'm sure it is. Like I'm not just Phoenix, by
Speaker 1: the way, because there will be some nigga name No,
Speaker 1: Phoenix is crazy. I see right now that nigga is
Speaker 1: gott Stale. That's how this shit gets sucked up. And
Speaker 1: then all of a sudden, I get back to my
Speaker 1: d MS and that's a nigga named Cactus T that
Speaker 1: got problems with me. Some shit like that I did
Speaker 1: not like. How was there not been a rapper some
Speaker 1: nigga that named Catasy. I'm not thiss in Phoenix, man,
Speaker 1: I'm not just in Phoenix. I had my no limit
Speaker 1: chain though I know you did, and bro, you had
Speaker 1: all the chains. You was hopping from crew to crew
Speaker 1: like one of these. I can. I can see you
Speaker 1: at fourteen of the of the Rosenberg model.
Speaker 2: No, no, it wasn't fourteen. It was more like like
Speaker 2: sixth grade. Uh, it was definitely like I would say
Speaker 2: sixth grade, fifth, sixth grade. I would have like my
Speaker 2: folder and I could tag up the rough riders are
Speaker 2: the Wu Tang.
Speaker 1: Double see what like there's a certain thing for white
Speaker 1: boys who really love rap. But it's no man, I
Speaker 1: can all see y'all, you know, because then when you
Speaker 1: get to a certain age, then we can't tell you
Speaker 1: shit about rap, no more than you get to it.
Speaker 2: No, I'm not that no, no, no, no.
Speaker 1: We get to a certain age and you can tell
Speaker 1: you can't fucking tell me what coming mint to me.
Speaker 2: In nineteen ninety five, I.
Speaker 1: Drove all the way from Phoenix to Minneapolis to hear
Speaker 1: him spit.
Speaker 2: No, I did see comment in Phoenix.
Speaker 1: See, I know you did.
Speaker 2: Common in the Roots.
Speaker 1: That's a great show. By the way, talking about rappers.
Speaker 2: Black thought, oh yeah, nuts yeah.
Speaker 1: Nuts Andre three thousand, Oh yeah, I hope Glass of
Speaker 1: Equipment right there. I hope Blast alone here is this.
Speaker 1: Glasses hundred three thousand is one of the top five
Speaker 1: rappers of all time.
Speaker 2: I think Glasses has some of the worst hip hop
Speaker 2: takes ever. And him and I argue about them all
Speaker 2: the time. So you know, Glasses has you know what, y'all.
Speaker 2: Let Glasses fuck with y'all. That's the problem. My new
Speaker 2: thing with Glasses is and I know it burns him up.
Speaker 2: That's my guy, one of the most solid people. Now
Speaker 2: he's the best.
Speaker 1: My favorite thing with Glasses is.
Speaker 2: Now there's his album's up there on tape.
Speaker 1: Three words, I say, the Glasses agree to disagree because.
Speaker 2: He doesn't want that.
Speaker 1: No, that's not what he wants. Glasses. Glasses are coming there.
Speaker 1: Sit down. He tried to sit here and say Drake
Speaker 1: wasn't hip hop and I said, that's a that's a
Speaker 1: star wars right there. And he tried to say, well,
Speaker 1: I gotta think about whether or not Kanye's hip hop
Speaker 1: because he grew up in the middle class home. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, that's just once again the Drake isn't hip
Speaker 1: hop thing. He said four for four isn't a hip
Speaker 1: hop album, which is a wild thing, right, So I
Speaker 1: mean that's these are these are see you guys are
Speaker 1: this is Glasses one on one, I'm talking about the
Speaker 1: next one. And then his tweets, his tweets, he'd be
Speaker 1: throwing it out on Twitter like I ain't even gonna
Speaker 1: engage today. He believes it though. One of the smartest
Speaker 1: guys I'm gonna talk to you, and just one of
Speaker 1: the people that like when you go against him, it'll
Speaker 1: make you smarter.
Speaker 2: No, no glasses is great now he just got some
Speaker 2: crazy takes.
Speaker 1: But yeah, so's those guys. I'm trying to think who else.
Speaker 1: Obviously I love kN Drake Lamar. It's a like a
Speaker 1: lot of people that I listened to a whole hell
Speaker 1: of a lot, like uh Lears and Fury Rock Kim.
Speaker 1: I love Rock Kim.
Speaker 2: That's one of my favorite songs.
Speaker 1: One of the If you caught me in like ninety seven,
Speaker 1: I was bumping like the Eighteenth Letter crazy, I was.
Speaker 2: Gonna say, I actually really the first rock came album
Speaker 2: I ever owned was the Eighteenth Letter, and then I
Speaker 2: kind of like went back and got like paid in fool,
Speaker 2: and I like, would I go back and kind of
Speaker 2: just go through like five MIC albums and the source
Speaker 2: and go buy them and catch up?
Speaker 1: You know, things seems the same, and the whole scene
Speaker 1: is laying I come in grant with the unexplained, with
Speaker 1: the brains chained awe like nigga. He on another level,
Speaker 1: He's the Marlon Brando him.
Speaker 2: It was cool meeting Rock Kim as I was, I
Speaker 2: think it was like you know what I'm saying, see
Speaker 2: see you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: Like it was like like you you see, that's this
Speaker 1: is what I'm talking about. Let me tell my story.
Speaker 1: It's not about let me tell your story. Is about
Speaker 1: that moment probably means so much to to keV that
Speaker 1: when he meets a new black and this is not
Speaker 1: the first.
Speaker 2: Time, why is everything Rachel, because it is. You don't
Speaker 2: want it to be. You don't want it to be.
Speaker 2: You don't want hip hop to be for black people.
Speaker 1: You don't think it is. I didn't say that, Okay,
Speaker 1: So then why can't I say Why can't I say
Speaker 1: you're white?
Speaker 2: I was trying to tell my story, you're white.
Speaker 1: I'm black. Look at this. Take a picture of this.
Speaker 1: This this is the for me and you know, but
Speaker 1: what I'm saying is this that meant so much to
Speaker 1: you because he saw you for the first time. Now
Speaker 1: far you have to drop.
Speaker 2: Know what I was trying to say, Well, it was
Speaker 2: cool when I met Rock Kim because I met him
Speaker 2: with like a lot of my homies that are like
Speaker 2: much older than me, right, so like they like like
Speaker 2: we're listening to him, like like when he was was
Speaker 2: rock him and Eric Eric b oh wow. So for me,
Speaker 2: like of course Rock Kim's Rock Kim, right, But it
Speaker 2: was just dope to see like like kind of like
Speaker 2: it was like my homies like their jay z just
Speaker 2: kind of see them and the way they were just
Speaker 2: like and I was like excited, but but to them
Speaker 2: it was like everything to meet Rock Kim. You know
Speaker 2: what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: Are you familiar with the history of Hollywood?
Speaker 2: I mean I wouldn't say I'm extremely familiar. I mean
Speaker 2: I would say I'm vaguely familiar. I think that we're
Speaker 2: all vaguely familiar.
Speaker 1: I mean I live here. Well, this is why I
Speaker 1: say he's the Marlon Brando of rap. All right, this
Speaker 1: is my explanation for this. So method act comes in.
Speaker 1: You know, Marlon Brando and you know everybody from the
Speaker 1: Stella Adler school and different all of that stuff, the
Speaker 1: Strasburg and all that method acting comes in and it
Speaker 1: changes acting, right because there's a you know, you guys,
Speaker 1: you know old Hollywood, very earnest, all of that stuff.
Speaker 1: Then you have guys that you have a different school
Speaker 1: of acting that comes in, which is based in realism,
Speaker 1: synthesizing the character, uh taking that characters emotions and then
Speaker 1: making them real, real, grounded portrayals of people that are
Speaker 1: that affects you in a different way. And then every
Speaker 1: everything changes after him, right, not necessarily the inventor of it,
Speaker 1: but the single symbol of when everyone started to sound different.
Speaker 2: Right, like he was kind of the because of him,
Speaker 2: everyone applied themselves for rapping.
Speaker 1: Right. So, after Brando, and this is Van's opinion, because
Speaker 1: I know that somebody out there going after Brando, then
Speaker 1: the next generation of actors that come in a little
Speaker 1: bit after that, particularly in the sixties, Jack Nicholson Hoffman,
Speaker 1: all of these guys, and these guys take like the
Speaker 1: Pacino de Niro, These guys interpret drama in a different way.
Speaker 1: To me, Rock him is the bridge between he ha
Speaker 1: ha coolgie rapping the rest of those guys too, but
Speaker 1: he's the He's the bridge between all of that and
Speaker 1: just thinking of a mass I'm just on this bitch
Speaker 1: and I'm just spitaking for sure, right, and there are
Speaker 1: other guys that are there too. But when I think
Speaker 1: about what it changed and how people are are different.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna get on this motherfucker. You're think of him,
Speaker 1: you think you think of him, and then you think
Speaker 1: of the sound. Totally fucking changing, at least for lyrics,
Speaker 1: for lyricism. There are other guys out there that are
Speaker 1: Internet situations. I'm sure that Ninth Wonder and Sway are like, Man,
Speaker 1: We're gonna call you and tell you a different situation,
Speaker 1: because those are too most novels with hip hop guys
Speaker 1: I've ever talked on the phone Sway.
Speaker 2: I've never I met Ninth Wonder once in Saint Louis
Speaker 2: at a bar.
Speaker 1: Nice Wonder is a fucking encyclopedia of hip hop. Nice guy, Uh,
Speaker 1: Sway is too yes. Sway for sure is the only
Speaker 1: thing I don't like about Sway. There's one thing I
Speaker 1: don't like about Sway. Sway too nice man. Sways too nice.
Speaker 1: He's too affable, he's too approachable, he's too concilia tour.
Speaker 1: It's not a negative, but you know a lot of
Speaker 1: people talk about all of these people and these powerful
Speaker 1: people and where they should be, and one of the
Speaker 1: star warts one of the most important voices. Sometimes I
Speaker 1: just want Sway to comment under the fucking thing and say, nigga,
Speaker 1: I'm your father. I've been doing this.
Speaker 2: Everyone's father and I've been doing this.
Speaker 1: But Sway he's like, legitimately, I'm walking through a fucking
Speaker 1: walking through a hotel. Twenty fourteen, twenty fifteen, Stop dang man,
Speaker 1: I love with you. This is way pre Kanye. Stop
Speaker 1: the love what you're doing TMZ and blah blah blah blah. Approachable,
Speaker 1: give you advice, talk to He's just a perfect energy
Speaker 1: and I, well, you know, I'm here for and he's
Speaker 1: been yeah, a one year heel term from say.
Speaker 2: I see, I don't, I don't. I think that's why
Speaker 2: we love Sway because he's above all that bullshit. Is
Speaker 2: he's above like the petty shit. He's above you know,
Speaker 2: worrying about what other people are doing.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: I think like Elliot's been going through that the last
Speaker 2: six months or so where he's tough and I you know,
Speaker 2: for me, like see it like like Elliott's to me
Speaker 2: like up there with Sway in terms of like your shit.
Speaker 2: I used to get his magazines when I was a kid,
Speaker 2: you know what I mean. I used to buy every
Speaker 2: double XL and all the sources and everything, and so
Speaker 2: I think with Elliott, it's like, I don't know, it's
Speaker 2: like a mixed bag. I guess how people feel with
Speaker 2: him kind of like kind of poking at you know,
Speaker 2: like a kais sanat or you know, but Sway I
Speaker 2: wouldn't want. I just feel like that's why swaying. Sway
Speaker 2: is the goat. So it's like if Sway's the goat,
Speaker 2: it's Sway Elliott, but Sway's the goat on a whole
Speaker 2: different level in terms of me because when I think
Speaker 2: of my childhood and watching MTV, that's where we before
Speaker 2: the Internet. I watched Sway interviews on MTV News, you know.
Speaker 2: But I think that that's why we love Sway, because
Speaker 2: Sway's above just you know, that's pocket watching and looking
Speaker 2: over at other people.
Speaker 1: This is what I'll say about Elliott. Elliott knows how
Speaker 1: I feel about him and what I think about him
Speaker 1: about him and honestly, what be dot do and what
Speaker 1: they mean. You know, they know how important they are.
Speaker 1: You know, you could be that as not a guy
Speaker 1: that lacks in any type of confidence. This is what
Speaker 1: I would say about Eliott.
Speaker 2: Neither, by the way, not lacking any sort of company,
Speaker 2: not that.
Speaker 1: I say about Elliott, and I hope that this is
Speaker 1: taken with as much love as well. How I mean it,
Speaker 1: Elliott is supposed to remain the example of what we
Speaker 1: want to be. It will be a gigantic blow to
Speaker 1: hip hop and to hip hop journalism. If Elliott Wilson
Speaker 1: turns into the example of what you don't want to be.
Speaker 2: What you want to be, like he's the golden standard.
Speaker 1: Let me tell yeah, exactly so what you want to
Speaker 1: be and in every single different avenue, what you have
Speaker 1: to have or like you said, standard setters, monument builders,
Speaker 1: right legends.
Speaker 2: And authorities on stuff. And when you're that, when you
Speaker 2: are that, that's bigger.
Speaker 1: Than a crowd that you can pull or the heat
Speaker 1: that you can deliver. It's bigger because what it maintains
Speaker 1: is the cultural integrity of whatever you're endeavoring into. Hip
Speaker 1: Hop is a more serious endeavor because guys like Elliott
Speaker 1: Wilson exists. Hip Hop is a more serious art form
Speaker 1: because it has serious critics and serious journalists like Elliott Wilson.
Speaker 1: If he devolves, which it seems like he's dead set
Speaker 1: trying to, if he devolves into this new school, which
Speaker 1: I'm not saying I'm not a part of of clout
Speaker 1: chasing media figures. It's not just a blow to Elliot
Speaker 1: Wilson's legacy everything, it's a blow to all of it.
Speaker 1: Hip hop becomes less serious if guys like that take
Speaker 1: themselves less seriously.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I look at Elliott and beat out as like,
Speaker 2: you know, I think back to like sitting at my house,
Speaker 2: I think it was Christmas or New Year's a few
Speaker 2: years ago, watching the Drake interview, and I'm like, this
Speaker 2: is the old Like these guys don't have to put
Speaker 2: out a bunch of shit because when like they can
Speaker 2: have conversations like that nobody else has the access to
Speaker 2: have and or like that's why, like when he was
Speaker 2: kind of mad that Drake was doing whatever Drake was doing,
Speaker 2: sitting in the bed with that what's that chick saying
Speaker 2: the white chick Bobby all talk. Yeah. Yeah, like like
Speaker 2: like it doesn't matter because you've got the three hour
Speaker 2: all time Drake Interview, and you're gonna get another one
Speaker 2: because you're fucking Elliott Wilson.
Speaker 1: But here's the deal, though, there's a way to make
Speaker 1: that criticism right. I'll tell you what I mean by that,
Speaker 1: there's a way to legitimately I'm not a part of
Speaker 1: hip hop Meetia oh ship.
Speaker 2: keV Damn that velcal came off. Wow, Bro, things are
Speaker 2: broken there.
Speaker 1: It is shit. It's always good to drop a white
Speaker 1: man on his fucking head and it is your head.
Speaker 1: And I'm talking about so ecosystems. We talk about ecosystems.
Speaker 1: What is an ecosystem? An ecosystem is something that uh cyclical,
Speaker 1: ife's itself, right, It's a it's a system of life.
Speaker 1: So that means that, like you know, the fucking plant grows,
Speaker 1: the fucking insect eats the plant, the fucking animal eats
Speaker 1: the insect. Animal dos ecosystem. When one part of the
Speaker 1: ecosystem stops working, the whole ecosystem is threatened. Right. It
Speaker 1: is incumbent upon hip hop artists to do interviews with
Speaker 1: hip hop media because that feeds the ecosystem. They have
Speaker 1: to do hip hop media, there's no I'm telling you
Speaker 1: they If you are a rap artist, and you are
Speaker 1: a big rap artist, you have to do traditional hip hop.
Speaker 2: Media at some point, at some point cycle. You have
Speaker 2: to do it all the time.
Speaker 1: And the reason why I think you have to do
Speaker 1: it all the time is two reasons. Number one, cultural
Speaker 1: responsibility to invest back into that media. Number by the way,
Speaker 1: I don't disagree with you, and number two, to feed
Speaker 1: the ecosystem of hip hop because the other part of it,
Speaker 1: the people that look like Bobby and all of those people,
Speaker 1: they gonna eat off hip hop regardless. The question is
Speaker 1: whether or not Bobby all talk is whoever her name is,
Speaker 1: and no disrespect to her, is gonna eat off hip hop.
Speaker 1: That's not a question. Her people gonna eat off hip
Speaker 1: hop because her people own the record companies, her people playlist,
Speaker 1: the shit, they own, the big streamers, they gonna eat
Speaker 1: off hip hop. I don't know who her people are,
Speaker 1: but when I say her people is, I mean white.
Speaker 1: So her people are gonna eat off hip hop no
Speaker 1: matter what. The question is whether or not the black people,
Speaker 1: and not just black, but the people in hip hop media,
Speaker 1: whether they're going to eat off off of it, And
Speaker 1: the only way to really control that is to go
Speaker 1: sit down with them.
Speaker 2: I think that Unfortunately, most artists don't agree with you anymore.
Speaker 1: They don't agree. I'll tell you why they don't agree.
Speaker 1: They don't agree because and this is just a direct
Speaker 1: criticism because as hard as they are, they are equally pussy.
Speaker 1: And I say they equally pussy because everybody want to
Speaker 1: be hip hop, But don't nobody want to be hip hop?
Speaker 1: Don't nobody want to sit down and answer questions in
Speaker 1: the way that hip hop interviewers ask them. Don't nobody
Speaker 1: want to have somebody? Hip hop is supposed to be
Speaker 1: this cultural art form where we don't dance around, and
Speaker 1: we get straight to the FoST to the point, straight
Speaker 1: to the point. We don't play no games. It's no
Speaker 1: funny shit, it's no oh blah blah blah blah blah,
Speaker 1: none of that. It's like, hey, did you do this?
Speaker 1: How did this go? How did this go?
Speaker 2: Blah blah blah.
Speaker 1: But because people have seen a lot of people have
Speaker 1: bad moments on big platforms.
Speaker 2: Now, they don't want to have one of those.
Speaker 1: Afraid to be hip hop. They're afraid to go sit
Speaker 1: down and talk in the way that not just hip
Speaker 1: hop talks, but the way that black people talk, the
Speaker 1: way that we talk when we interviewing each other. Hey man,
Speaker 1: that's crazy, what the fuck you're doing? Hey man? You
Speaker 1: out of a sister? Boom boom. They're afraid to have
Speaker 1: a conversation, So they would rather go sit down with
Speaker 1: someone that has a big platform that will treat them
Speaker 1: in a way that's not to me culturally authentic, then
Speaker 1: actually have a culturally authentic and powerful conversation with someone
Speaker 1: that benefits in the long run them then that person's platform,
Speaker 1: which I am not in hip hop media. I'm just
Speaker 1: telling you my observations and the entire hip hop ecosystem.
Speaker 1: So you can't be brave enough to rap about like
Speaker 1: shooting people on records and all of that stuff, and
Speaker 1: brave enough to be out in the streets, but not
Speaker 1: brave enough to go sit down with somebody that's gonna
Speaker 1: ask you real questions.
Speaker 2: Well, I think a couple of things. One like I've
Speaker 2: heard actual like managers label people say like if someone's
Speaker 2: at a certain level, doing interviews can only hurt them.
Speaker 1: Right, Well, this is what I would say, probably, But
Speaker 1: I would also say this, there's also another part of that.
Speaker 1: Another part of that is this inside of this ecosystem.
Speaker 1: I know this very well worked at MC. Inside this ecosystem,
Speaker 1: we have to hold interviewers accountable. I agree for asking
Speaker 1: questions that aren't substantive, that are clout chasing that are
Speaker 1: beef inspiring, that are all of that stuff. You have
Speaker 1: your platform. You can ask people whatever you want to
Speaker 1: ask them. You can do whatever you want to do.
Speaker 1: But if we're going to talk about all of these
Speaker 1: different responsibilities that we have, we also have to talk
Speaker 1: about the fact that there is a way that you're
Speaker 1: supposed to conduct an interview when the interview is about music, culture, inspiration,
Speaker 1: work ethic, when it's about your past, when you're really
Speaker 1: gonna sit down and get a penetrated interview with the
Speaker 1: art artist or with someone, if there's a way that
Speaker 1: you do that, and if you veer off into the
Speaker 1: click baity clout chasy situation, which a lot of people
Speaker 1: are doing, we have to be honest about those people too.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think like my approach to interviews really is
Speaker 2: like if I'm not fully like there's people i'll interview
Speaker 2: who I'm like, I'm familiar with their music, but I
Speaker 2: might not be like a like a hardcore fan, right,
Speaker 2: So my whole approach is like trying to figure out
Speaker 2: who they are, like the common ground between me and
Speaker 2: this person, so we can shoot the shit and have
Speaker 2: like a cool conversation. Like I feel like When I
Speaker 2: think of like Elliott and Beatout, I know that they're
Speaker 2: going to have the laptop with all of the notes
Speaker 2: and then this year and then on this you know
Speaker 2: what I mean. And they're certain artists that I'll have
Speaker 2: those conversations with. But for the most part, you know,
Speaker 2: it's almost like when I went and did a I
Speaker 2: just did an interview NBA Young Boy, and I was like, Okay,
Speaker 2: everybody who talks to this guy treats him like he's
Speaker 2: an alien. Uh, I'm just gonna like just go hang
Speaker 2: out with him and shoot about ruge. Well, shout to
Speaker 2: you're from Baton Rouge, right, Well, I just feel like,
Speaker 2: you know, like I just wanted to like just talk like, yo,
Speaker 2: let's just hang out shoot the ship like mountain.
Speaker 1: Yeah, how was it? It was fucking beautiful. You loved it.
Speaker 2: It was cool.
Speaker 1: You loved it.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 1: You ever heard of his site Point and Shoot on YouTube?
Speaker 2: Yeah, he just did a video about me.
Speaker 1: I watched it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's so funny because you mad. No, I'm not
Speaker 2: at the point shooting actually broke. I m him and
Speaker 2: said the video was really good, good.
Speaker 1: Job, But can I show you that was passive aggressive? No?
Speaker 2: It wasn't it was funny.
Speaker 1: It was let me tell you, bru, y'all try to
Speaker 1: what people don't understand.
Speaker 2: I've been wait a minute, so you watched that video,
Speaker 2: so then you know I went to Grave Digger Mountain.
Speaker 2: So why did you ask me that question if you
Speaker 2: knew the answer.
Speaker 1: Because I just because I'm playing games, because.
Speaker 2: You're a troll digital That video is so funny because
Speaker 2: I did not realize. So I used to live in Vegas.
Speaker 2: I did radio on this right, and I used to
Speaker 2: DJ a monthly hip hop showcase. So there was a
Speaker 2: there was a guy named High High Life who used
Speaker 2: to throw the showcases and me and my boy saying
Speaker 2: with DJM, so we would DJ for like maybe ten
Speaker 2: to fifteen artists every time this would happen. So if
Speaker 2: you ever been to like a rap showcase, local rap showcase,
Speaker 2: one they're not very busy. Two they fucking suck the
Speaker 2: DJ because you're dealing with all these USBs. And back
Speaker 2: then it was it was a CD, you know. So
Speaker 2: I had no idea that I had ever encountered that
Speaker 2: dude sharp prior to the time I met him, and
Speaker 2: he came into my podcast, right, So it's just funny
Speaker 2: that like this guy has this like gotcha moment and
Speaker 2: it is like trying to talk down on me because
Speaker 2: like I frink wetted strip clubs in Las Vegas.
Speaker 1: And I've been but well, this is what I would say.
Speaker 2: It was funny though, No, no, I actually think that
Speaker 2: is just really funny. What I think that dude, like
Speaker 2: the video was funny.
Speaker 1: I tried to draw him out and get him on
Speaker 1: your podcast or you can line him up side. I
Speaker 1: don't know what you're trying, no care. If you're one
Speaker 1: of the biggest gangsters, you actually might be Catus Tea.
Speaker 1: You one of the biggest gangsters in Phoenix. You're trying
Speaker 1: to give them this is what people do. See y'all
Speaker 1: think I'm too I'm too veteran for this. You, hey man,
Speaker 1: I appreciate that good boom boom. I love to have
Speaker 1: you come over here and then all of a sudden,
Speaker 1: you and your man over here stomp them out. And
Speaker 1: that's good for you because now you've got a headline.
Speaker 2: Your own children. How many children you got, I have
Speaker 2: two children, and I are old. I have an eighteen
Speaker 2: year old and a ten year old.
Speaker 1: So that changes nothing. I'm not help you stomp out
Speaker 1: point and shoot outside of them.
Speaker 2: Listen, if you have babies, that would be one thing.
Speaker 1: But you what you just said was, I got another
Speaker 1: nigga in the crew that can help me fucking stomp
Speaker 1: out point.
Speaker 2: I'm not risking any charges. I'm not risking any felonies.
Speaker 1: I get it for.
Speaker 2: I actually genuinely thought the video was funny. It was
Speaker 2: I watched all his videos, and I think that, like,
Speaker 2: he's actually really good.
Speaker 1: There's something to be said that when someone is obviously
Speaker 1: fucking with you in joke. I thought it was like
Speaker 1: all of the stuff he said about me, I genuinely
Speaker 1: took YouTube.
Speaker 2: I thought it was like funny. I was like, oh,
Speaker 2: that's good because like I'm I have like, uh, I
Speaker 2: don't have that big of an ego. I don't really
Speaker 2: give a fuck. Like the way him and I talk
Speaker 2: to each other, me and my friends talk to each other.
Speaker 1: I'm like, this ship is great. What uh?
Speaker 2: What youtubes do you watch? What YouTube channels do?
Speaker 1: I mean?
Speaker 2: I would say most of my YouTube stuff is very
Speaker 2: sports heavy, you know. I would say I watch a
Speaker 2: lot of PFT with like Mike Florio, Chris Sim's I watch,
Speaker 2: Uh you know McAfee's in there every once in a while,
Speaker 2: all the NBA stuff. Uh, and then I'll I've veered
Speaker 2: into like there's this political channel called Breaking Points. I
Speaker 2: know that point, Crystal Bill.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I like the ball I love them because I
Speaker 1: can just watch and watch Rising as well.
Speaker 2: With Rising is amazing on the Hill. They're great, dude,
Speaker 2: They're great. So actually, those two shows I probably watch
Speaker 2: every day in some capacity, just clips, you know, like
Speaker 2: to catch up on what's going on. And I think
Speaker 2: that it's joke because it seems like they're all four
Speaker 2: of the people involved in those two shows are very
Speaker 2: level headed and they give you different perspectives, so.
Speaker 1: You don't ever go on Welcome to hood War stories.
Speaker 1: No no, no, no, no.
Speaker 2: I can show you my algorith you see it now, bro, Pa,
Speaker 2: what the fuck did you see that? I'm saying you want?
Speaker 1: Did you see what he just did? He said, I
Speaker 1: can show you my algorithm if you want to see it,
Speaker 1: and then he reached into his pants.
Speaker 2: Bro, No, look look what's the first video? What's the
Speaker 2: first video?
Speaker 1: Said? What did I tell you? WHOA? Well, I don't
Speaker 1: want to see your algorithm, bro, put your algorithm away.
Speaker 1: It's my YouTube algorithm, r algorithm away. I don't know
Speaker 1: what y'all don't know why you call it the algorithm,
Speaker 1: probably because.
Speaker 2: It's my YouTube algorithm, like it.
Speaker 1: Put your algorithm away, bro, They're not trying to see
Speaker 1: your algorithm.
Speaker 2: I see the herd, I see p f T Yeah,
Speaker 2: I see uh.
Speaker 1: Welcome to wod WARSW I'll go to Welcome to.
Speaker 2: Hoo fucking Uncinko MSNBC Lebatars.
Speaker 1: Like I got, I don't have as much other sports stuff.
Speaker 1: I got a lot of it, right, I got, But
Speaker 1: it's all it's very specific with me. So it's LSU football.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, you know what I'm saying. It's LSU football.
Speaker 1: So it's not necessarily I have a lot of sports
Speaker 1: stuff on there, but it's specific because I saw myself
Speaker 1: sifting through a lot of fucking sports topics I didn't
Speaker 1: give a fuck about, right, but it's Saints, LSU football,
Speaker 1: very direct sports stuff, like five different LSU football channels
Speaker 1: off the bench, my favorite one Power hour LSU Fucking
Speaker 1: After further review.
Speaker 2: There's a show like that for the Suns.
Speaker 1: I watch Tiger Bait.
Speaker 2: There's this pH and X sports podcast I watch on YouTube,
Speaker 2: like at the end of every game, they go live
Speaker 2: and then you.
Speaker 1: Sit down and watch it. Kalickie Canada stated, she comes
Speaker 1: in and she goes, Yo, why are you just watch
Speaker 1: the game? Why are you gonna sit down and then
Speaker 1: watch two hours of somebody talking about the game that
Speaker 1: you just watch? And I'll just Positive TV and I go.
Speaker 1: My wife says the same thing, just Positi TV, and
Speaker 1: I go, you want to be in this or not?
Speaker 2: Cool?
Speaker 1: Boom? Let me watch my shit, Let me watch my shit,
Speaker 1: Let me play the game. I come back all the
Speaker 1: way from uh fucking working on the road. I'm doing
Speaker 1: cn INN or something like that. I sit down, I
Speaker 1: got the controller. When I have the controller? Okay, keV
Speaker 1: And Spider Man is swinging nigga. I am Spider Man.
Speaker 1: I'm swinging around New York. I'm helping people. I'm saving people.
Speaker 1: I'm going on missions. Bro. Just last week, no bullshit.
Speaker 1: I beat Scorpion, I beat craving a Hunter. I beat
Speaker 1: motherfucking Samman, I beat Venom. Not Spider Man. Me, I
Speaker 1: did it?
Speaker 2: Okay, I beat all of these people. I say, is
Speaker 2: this Spider Man too?
Speaker 1: Spider Man two? I saved New York. I saved it.
Speaker 1: When I come home, let me play the game.
Speaker 2: Do you ever buy video games and you're mad because
Speaker 2: you don't have time to play them? Wrong, that's my life,
Speaker 2: not by all the games, and I never played my
Speaker 2: kids got them. Lie.
Speaker 1: You could make time to save people if you really
Speaker 1: cared about it. But the problem is that you got
Speaker 1: to listen to shoreline Mafia and the rest of the underground, which,
Speaker 1: by way, I'm not disting to my fuck with them
Speaker 1: Mark oh.
Speaker 2: Jez shouts shortline Phoenix.
Speaker 1: So the rest of the underground people, you gotta listen
Speaker 1: too much hip hop. See, I don't listen to as
Speaker 1: much hip hop as you. I'm gonna go to my
Speaker 1: hip hop right now. I'm gonna go to my title
Speaker 1: because jay Z telling me to to buy a title
Speaker 1: and then after I got tiredled and got used to title,
Speaker 1: he sold it to white people. The Verizon by ten?
Speaker 1: Is that true? Yeah? Oh? But so my ship, like
Speaker 1: literally the ship that I'm on, like my playlist, it's
Speaker 1: all old ship.
Speaker 2: Bro.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think I'm not listening to much of that
Speaker 1: new ship, so I agree. So I've heard these songs,
Speaker 1: so I don't have to like. But you have to
Speaker 1: be up on hip hop. Yeah, so you don't have
Speaker 1: time to save New York. The new ship I love
Speaker 1: is is uh.
Speaker 2: So. I knew who Dave was for a long time,
Speaker 2: but I know who from the UK. So Dave and
Speaker 2: Central cy put an EPR called to Split Decision, which
Speaker 2: was my second favorite project from last year. But I
Speaker 2: dived into this guy Dave and his discography. He's so
Speaker 2: good you like him? Like Dave, Dave is like an
Speaker 2: elite level.
Speaker 1: Where is he from?
Speaker 2: He's from the UK. He's fucking fire.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: See, he's got some of the more most vulnerable rap
Speaker 2: songs that ever heard my mine.
Speaker 1: That's Captus Tea. That's Catus T right there. I will
Speaker 1: tell you one new group that I like. These guys
Speaker 1: out of New York. They called forty one.
Speaker 2: Their fire shoutout. I've had him on twice. Jen Carter,
Speaker 2: Kyle Rich Bro. Jim Carter is crazy Broyeh, She's fire
Speaker 2: and they're cool ast fuck Jim Carter is crazy, bro.
Speaker 1: I'm I supposed to be listening to PST from the
Speaker 1: side of the side.
Speaker 2: How can I see what I what I listened?
Speaker 1: So I got this is what I got out here.
Speaker 1: I got Dua Liba I got Domino, remember him, of
Speaker 1: course you get though jam in about the slam. I
Speaker 1: got Beanie Siegel, I gots Victory, which I guess I'm
Speaker 1: not supposed to be listening to that now. Oh shit,
Speaker 1: oh shit, I'll still listen to that shit fuck that.
Speaker 1: I got a flip side. Oh my god, bro Beanie Sigle, Freeway,
Speaker 1: that's actually Freeway and p D Crack. So my my playlist,
Speaker 1: my playlist on here though is I'll show you my
Speaker 1: hip hop playlist. This is my hip hop playlist running
Speaker 1: the far side, ninety three to Infinity to Infinity, Infinity,
Speaker 1: Sean Fintassy Ye until Infinity.
Speaker 2: Shout out to the ringer Sean Finasy Yeah, which.
Speaker 1: Is the greatest hip hop song I've ever made. Disagree Yeah, Okay,
Speaker 1: got this team? Uh hey, I disagree Mass Appeal, Electric Relaxations.
Speaker 2: So this is like a playlist you put together. Yeah,
Speaker 2: this is my ship shook Ones I wish I had see.
Speaker 2: I don't have a playlist like that.
Speaker 1: That's me. I just I just big L.
Speaker 2: I just hit search and like whatever I feel like
Speaker 2: listening to. I do the same thing Boom, I do that.
Speaker 1: I do that too. But I do have some playlists
Speaker 1: that I have to have.
Speaker 2: And Spotify has a twenty tens playlist that they curated
Speaker 2: for me. That is fire. It's like all twenty ten
Speaker 2: ship that I like. Tit title Well, Spotify is great,
Speaker 2: Spotify is to You could go listen to Higher Learning
Speaker 2: on Spotify.
Speaker 1: Listen to Higher Learning the podcast on Spotify. Spotify is great.
Speaker 1: I used title for a lot of music stuff. Spotify
Speaker 1: is amazing. It's great.
Speaker 2: I used title for a lot of music stuff though, because.
Speaker 1: Title knows me now. Title knows me now.
Speaker 2: I give most of my podcast. Yeah, my twenty tens
Speaker 2: playlist is gas. But yeah, I mean I just and
Speaker 2: then I'll just download albums. You know, I got you download,
Speaker 2: I got j id on here Forever story, Pray for Paris.
Speaker 2: We'side gun, that's.
Speaker 1: Not gun crazy, whole Griselda crazy, going back to going
Speaker 1: back to Ellie and b Dot. I was loving Griselda.
Speaker 1: I was fucking with Griselda. Listened to a lot, I
Speaker 1: had a New Year's Interview, and then I became a
Speaker 1: Griselda fucking fan. Love Griselda, love them, love Griselda. But
Speaker 1: I love everybody. I love the people that don't get along.
Speaker 1: I love Griselda. I think Freddy is having a great
Speaker 1: like Freddy.
Speaker 2: Actually, yeah, he's one of my best friends in the world.
Speaker 1: So you were Freddie best friends?
Speaker 2: Yes, okay, that's my brother brother for real, for.
Speaker 1: Real, y'all. Have you ever been to Sam's Softbro.
Speaker 2: Yeah, of course, making sure chicken wings. And that's the
Speaker 2: best place to throw money at strippers. Because listen, not
Speaker 2: for me in reasons obviously.
Speaker 1: Listen to what you just said. Listen, let me tell
Speaker 1: you how you're a misogynists.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because when you throw the money at Sam's Hofbro,
Speaker 2: it's kind of like feeding birds. Okay, Wow, it's true.
Speaker 2: It's true. Whoa is anybody who's on the stage has
Speaker 2: a right to the dollar?
Speaker 1: Whoa catus tea. Let me tell you something. You throw
Speaker 1: money at strippers, I throw it in the air. I
Speaker 1: throw money too strippers because here we fucking go. I
Speaker 1: accept them and their humanity and what they are. I
Speaker 1: throw money to them.
Speaker 2: So help.
Speaker 1: No, no, no, no no, you said what you meant
Speaker 1: stand on at catus t What you said was you
Speaker 1: throw money at strippers? At them? I throw money too strippers.
Speaker 1: Sometimes I don't throw it. Sometimes I put it in
Speaker 1: an envelope and hand them to and say, most people
Speaker 1: in the world, you will not find another higher connoisseur
Speaker 1: of these establishments other than myself. I rarely go. But
Speaker 1: when I do go. When I say rarely, I mean
Speaker 1: like once a year. But when I do go, maybe
Speaker 1: not even that. But when I when I do go,
Speaker 1: I throw the money to them, hand it off like
Speaker 1: a fuck of the time, because I want them to
Speaker 1: live their dreams.
Speaker 2: I am very very integrated in the strip club culture,
Speaker 2: so I'm very very aware. I'm friends with a lot
Speaker 2: of strippers. It's a budget for a strip club night,
Speaker 2: that's a good personally me. Yeah, it was a.
Speaker 1: Boutleg kept night.
Speaker 2: It depends on where I'm going, So, uh, if I
Speaker 2: was in Arizona and my heyday, like Jaguars, which is
Speaker 2: like the best strip club on the West Coast, Jag Wires, Yeah, Jags.
Speaker 2: Jags is the best strip club on the West Coast.
Speaker 2: Anybody who's gone will tell you that. All the rappers
Speaker 2: I take there say the same Wires Jags like Jaguars
Speaker 2: Yeah war Uh So I kind of like, you know,
Speaker 2: I just kind of like I want to say, like
Speaker 2: it was kind of like my spot, so I would
Speaker 2: go in there and get my chicken wings, I get
Speaker 2: my fucking shrimp tacos, I get my cabana.
Speaker 1: Gotta tell you this is actually a very precious moment.
Speaker 1: Like there are rare times when you're talking to someone
Speaker 1: and you can see the wheels of their brain are
Speaker 1: taking them back to a time where they legitimately have
Speaker 1: good times. Yes, there a place where they legitimately like
Speaker 1: like like Kim started talking about jack Wires and he goes, yeah.
Speaker 2: It's a good place. But it wasn't even like a
Speaker 2: good place for the reasons that you like, like not
Speaker 2: even get it.
Speaker 1: It was a good place just because there are certain
Speaker 1: places even naked women or no naked women. Well, the
Speaker 1: ambiyonce it's a am Beyonce is the food. The time
Speaker 1: in your life is right time in my life.
Speaker 2: And like for me, I would rather I'm a I'm
Speaker 2: a like dive bar kind of guy or a strip
Speaker 2: club kind of guy. Like I'd rather not be at
Speaker 2: a night club. I mean, I own a nightclub in
Speaker 2: Scott Steel, right, So like shots at the nightclub game
Speaker 2: fucking does very well. I love DJing at nightclubs, you know,
Speaker 2: but I'm not going to a night club unless I'm djaying.
Speaker 1: Right, not your thing.
Speaker 2: Like, I don't want to go hang out at the
Speaker 2: club because I don't know if it's really ever been
Speaker 2: my thing, to be honest, m I'd rather go to
Speaker 2: a dive bar or go to a strip club where
Speaker 2: we could just chill, have a little convo over some
Speaker 2: fucking drinks, maybe order some food.
Speaker 1: So this is my thing about the club, and this
Speaker 1: is my thing, right. I'm from a different club culture
Speaker 1: when I was in Louisiana. We dress up, we go
Speaker 1: to the club. We dress up like we going to church.
Speaker 1: We go to Club Upscale, we go there. It used
Speaker 1: to be like that too, go to Club Upscale, We go.
Speaker 2: To the strict leaving force stress code, strictly force dress code.
Speaker 1: Right, we go, We go to there, We go to
Speaker 1: the nightlife. We go to a perfect Tien party. Shout
Speaker 1: out to TJ, Mike, everybody out there was throwing party.
Speaker 1: Shout out to all of them. We go to the
Speaker 1: parties and we go there all dressed up. But when
Speaker 1: we leave that motherfucker, we are dripping wet with sweatd B.
Speaker 1: You know them old movies where you see a joint
Speaker 1: and the people in there and the beads are sweat
Speaker 1: coming off there.
Speaker 2: They got sweat and it's.
Speaker 1: A man he got his hand on a woman like that,
Speaker 1: and they grinding and.
Speaker 2: All of that stuff.
Speaker 1: All that shit's out. You know, that's what we were doing.
Speaker 1: We were like the back of the ass up, come
Speaker 1: on and like the whole fucking club lose thing.
Speaker 2: I couldn't even imagine being alive and back.
Speaker 1: But it was a couple of joints that you would
Speaker 1: just drop by the way and just go crazy.
Speaker 2: But my argument might be, you know, that's an argument
Speaker 2: for best rap.
Speaker 1: Song ever, could be definitely the most best club song ever,
Speaker 1: could be definitely best clubs on ever. So like then
Speaker 1: you get to LA and they don't have none of that.
Speaker 1: That's not how our clubs are. The clubs in LA
Speaker 1: are uh, musical museums.
Speaker 2: I think there was probably a time where they were
Speaker 2: more like that, but I don't remember it.
Speaker 1: But like the clubs in LA were are musical museums.
Speaker 1: Like their music playing and you're looking at pretty pictures
Speaker 1: all around. I mean, people are turning up a little bit.
Speaker 1: You might get a shoulder shimmy or something like that.
Speaker 1: So I fuck with that and that's okay. But if
Speaker 1: I'm gonna do that, I would rather go to a
Speaker 1: place where I can hear somebody talking.
Speaker 2: Yes, I agree, So the music is playing, yes, and
Speaker 2: we all.
Speaker 1: Try to My whole point, were drinking. We haven't a
Speaker 1: what's what's your drink of choice? Uh?
Speaker 2: It's changed over the years these days. If I'm not
Speaker 2: trying to lose weight and be fat, Uh, I always
Speaker 2: just get a corona.
Speaker 1: I like a whisky sour and so I'll drink tequila
Speaker 1: on the rocks. So I'll drink one, right and if
Speaker 1: I can hear you talk and we can all have
Speaker 1: a we was. I was at a party last night
Speaker 1: and it was about it was for the black oscar
Speaker 1: contenders this year. Shout out to Ava and I'm going
Speaker 1: to get like fifty shoutouts in this beach. So like
Speaker 1: we so we all have it and we're just talking
Speaker 1: and we're dancing. Some people are dancing. That's what I like.
Speaker 2: I'm older. Yeah, No, I just think that, like like
Speaker 2: you said, like for me, i'd rather go to a
Speaker 2: bar or I'd rather the strip. Club is just like
Speaker 2: home to me. I feel like, what's your favorite movie
Speaker 2: with an all black cast? With an all Black casts.
Speaker 2: You can't see Friday, Friday.
Speaker 1: Cactus TEA fake answer is a fake answer, an answer alert,
Speaker 1: it's the true answer. It's nope, it's nope, it's too much.
Speaker 1: Who's your favorite rapper? Jay z Nah? I didn't say
Speaker 1: z No, But what I'm saying is nope. You can't
Speaker 1: say Friday.
Speaker 2: You can't.
Speaker 1: You gotta go. I'm challenging you to go deeper than that.
Speaker 1: I'm challenging you go deeper than Friday. Would City of
Speaker 1: God count No, No, okay, I mean you wily motherfucker
Speaker 1: you maybe, but not really kind of but no, Moonnight.
Speaker 1: I would say Moonlight. Now, now you're trying to be woke.
Speaker 1: Love moon Night. I love it too.
Speaker 2: It's fucking perfect movie, great movie perfect.
Speaker 1: Try to get Charlotte to watch it. A perfect movie,
Speaker 1: perfect movie perfect. It's a perfect one. While I land better.
Speaker 2: But like, yeah, I can't say. I can't. I can't
Speaker 2: watch anything with singing in it.
Speaker 1: Oh, you'll like musical. No, I can't do it. I
Speaker 1: can't do it.
Speaker 2: My wife was telling me so last night we went
Speaker 2: her favorite musical. I don't know, fuck, probably fucking Little
Speaker 2: mrmimad or some shit. Last night.
Speaker 3: Uh.
Speaker 2: I went to the movies with my family. Her and
Speaker 2: my other son that's ten, went sal Wonka. I went
Speaker 2: and saw Iron Claw with my eighteen year old. Yeah
Speaker 2: that's look shit, it's a fucking say bad movie. Dude,
Speaker 2: keV like you wanted to bond with him. You wanted
Speaker 2: him to know the meaning the family, which is why
Speaker 2: you see that, because that more not me and my
Speaker 2: son are hardcore wrestling fans as I am.
Speaker 1: I'm the number one voice in wrestling media. All right, Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's neude, I'm the number one voice in wrestling media.
Speaker 1: That's not true. Go to my Twitter? Are you?
Speaker 2: Are you trolling Rosenberg?
Speaker 1: Go to my Twitter?
Speaker 2: Is that what it says?
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm the number one voice. I don't think I'm
Speaker 1: hip to why you're saying that. So is it like
Speaker 1: when Andrew schul said he was the number one voice
Speaker 1: in m M A media and was trolling the other
Speaker 1: guy with the glasses. I don't know what you're talking
Speaker 1: about as far as that's controlled.
Speaker 2: But I didn't know that I.
Speaker 1: Am, And it's been discussed. This is not this is
Speaker 1: not me just saying this. I've been putting. I've been
Speaker 1: put over. Who puts you over a couple of different people,
Speaker 1: because you don't know that I've like I've been put over.
Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 2: Do you watch wrestling? Those serious questions?
Speaker 1: I am over as fun?
Speaker 2: Do you actually watch though?
Speaker 1: No you don't. Of course I'll watched wrestling.
Speaker 2: Oh okay, of course I'll watch wrestling. Did you watch
Speaker 2: all last night? I haven't. I was at the movies.
Speaker 1: See what I'm saying. This is all I'm talking about
Speaker 1: when I'm talking about white people. You're asking me if
Speaker 1: I watched wrestling last night?
Speaker 2: What was I doing?
Speaker 1: Watching fucking raw? I was watching But I was watching punk.
Speaker 1: And then you're gonna watch an Iron Claw and you're
Speaker 1: gonna come back and you're gonna you didn't even watch
Speaker 1: Rare all last I watched iron Claw. You didn't even
Speaker 1: watch about the von Eriks. I watched Iron Claw about
Speaker 1: the Von Ricks. Yeah, what's your favorite? What's your favorite match?
Speaker 1: From Jimmy Superfly Snooker to what? You didn't answer it
Speaker 1: because you don't know wrestling like I know wrestling.
Speaker 2: That's before my time.
Speaker 1: But I was just joking. I want to say, was it?
Speaker 2: No, it wasn't. Jimmy was Jimmy Superflies. I'm trying to
Speaker 2: think what was WrestleMania. Was it two or three? Where
Speaker 2: fucking macho man. I don't think that was against Jimmy
Speaker 2: Super Superflies.
Speaker 1: You know, I'll be honest with you all, Jose, I'm
Speaker 1: not good at recounting, like individual matches that I love.
Speaker 1: I have individual matches.
Speaker 2: That I love.
Speaker 1: There are but to me, for me, there are certain
Speaker 1: matches that I do love. There's certain matches that I
Speaker 1: love too that I can fall out. But it's more storylines,
Speaker 1: it's more specific moments. It's he'll turns like my favorite
Speaker 1: wrestler run ins ten years.
Speaker 2: Uh, but this is before he passed. Everyone knew this.
Speaker 2: But I love Bray, you love who Bray Whitet. Bray
Speaker 2: White was my guy, dude.
Speaker 1: He was my god.
Speaker 2: Some reason I thought you said Ray and then no Bray. Yeah,
Speaker 2: Ray was that fucking dude. I felt like he was
Speaker 2: so mismanaged and he should have been the guy to
Speaker 2: be fucking Undertaker, not Brock the under thing.
Speaker 1: The other thing that that's tough about being the number
Speaker 1: one voice of pro wrestling and being such a wrestling fan,
Speaker 1: it's such a hard life on the guys Man and
Speaker 1: the ladies. So you're like, it's going to be a
Speaker 1: lot of tragedy. If you were a huge wrestling fan.
Speaker 2: And watching did you watch Iron Call? I did that
Speaker 2: watching that movie, You're like, damn, like wrestling literally like destroyed.
Speaker 1: That's some different shiit. Like I won't shout out to
Speaker 1: Kevin von Eric and like at the end of the
Speaker 1: Iron Claw not to not to see a picture of
Speaker 1: his family, see a picture of his family. I couldn't
Speaker 1: have been happier for him.
Speaker 2: Me too, man, because the whole movie, you're just you
Speaker 2: just feel for him.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I do not want anyone to think it's not
Speaker 1: too far off though. I was gonna say that the
Speaker 1: von Eric family represents the typical wrestling family is trajectory.
Speaker 1: But I mean there's a lot of carnage and a
Speaker 1: lot of tragedy. But that is, man, God bless Kevin
Speaker 1: van Eeric.
Speaker 2: That is that next level, bro.
Speaker 1: That's insaying. Look, I've seen this before. I know in
Speaker 1: my own life. Right now, you know, all my dad,
Speaker 1: my dad, and all his brothers passed away. My father
Speaker 1: like literally in the last fifteen years we lost all
Speaker 1: of those guys, right, So my uncle Mark died then
Speaker 1: my dad died. Then my uncle Milton died. Excuse me,
Speaker 1: my uncle Mark died, My uncle Milton died, my dad died.
Speaker 2: My uncle Ray died. Nobody touched seventy, right.
Speaker 1: So the movie hit me in a different way at
Speaker 1: this time because I'm looking at it and I'm thinking
Speaker 1: about brotherhood bonds, a whole line of family. What it
Speaker 1: meant for my uncle Ray, who just passed away a
Speaker 1: couple of weeks ago, to be the last of his
Speaker 1: brothers and to know that all of those guys are gone.
Speaker 1: You know, he didn't even make it a year and
Speaker 1: a half, two years after my father passed away. I'm
Speaker 1: not sure how much he wanted to be here after
Speaker 1: all of that stuff. And like if you if you
Speaker 1: from bar Rouge or other places like that, you know
Speaker 1: situations where he didn't got killed, his brother didn't got killed,
Speaker 1: she did, his mom, and then got killed everybody. So
Speaker 1: it's not like I don't know tragedy situations like that
Speaker 1: when it happened to them in the way that that
Speaker 1: happened to them. Just the bizarre, hyper tragic nature of
Speaker 1: all of it. It gives it this weird, almost spiritual
Speaker 1: through line. And you try to wonder when you're watching
Speaker 1: the movie or you're ingusting a story like that, you wonder,
Speaker 1: like what's the point, Like what is like what what
Speaker 1: did all of that tragedy mean?
Speaker 2: There has to be a meaning for.
Speaker 1: Someone to lose one kid from uh uh getting electrocuted,
Speaker 1: another kid from uh suicide, another kid from suicide, another
Speaker 1: kid had gastro inter. I think three sons committed suicid.
Speaker 1: I think it was carry Michael and and the youngest one.
Speaker 1: So three suicides and then all that you have, you wonder,
Speaker 1: you know, especially as they get older, even like Carrie,
Speaker 1: like losing his leg, well done the movie, Carrie losing
Speaker 1: his just free accident after freak accident. It's just a crazy, crazy, crazy.
Speaker 2: Story, great movie that everybody should go check it. Zach
Speaker 2: Efron's fucking jacked.
Speaker 1: He's big, bro. What did he what? I want to know?
Speaker 2: Like, that's like committing to a role because he turned
Speaker 2: into like a fucking John Cena level yoked ass, fucking
Speaker 2: big big. I mean, you know, I wanted to ask
Speaker 2: you because uh you obviously the shots of the Higher
Speaker 2: Learning podcast, But what's it like Working with a guy
Speaker 2: like Bill Simmons is great because I listened to the
Speaker 2: Bill Simmons part. I've been listening for like ten years,
Speaker 2: so almost every almost literally almost every episode.
Speaker 1: So here's the thing. So imagine that you're a person
Speaker 1: like myself, right, and you have all of these varied interests.
Speaker 1: You're probably the number one guy in terms of wrestling.
Speaker 2: Because you're you're unrewatchables a lot too now, but in history, yeah.
Speaker 1: I'm on you know, and but you love that. You
Speaker 1: love movies, you love sports, and you love politics, you
Speaker 1: love history. Uh, you are very invested into black culture.
Speaker 1: You have thoughts on so many different things, video games,
Speaker 1: and then there's one place that somebody knows how to
Speaker 1: give you the opportunity to uh express, develop and utilize
Speaker 1: those talents and those interests. It's not just about the
Speaker 1: fact that you're good at talking, because I think that
Speaker 1: if you talk enough, you'll get good at it, right,
Speaker 1: and if you get blind to the camera, then you'll
Speaker 1: do your thing.
Speaker 2: Sorry, James Andre Jefferson Junior just finished the workout. We're
Speaker 2: in a competition. I'm listening one place I'm listening. I'm
Speaker 2: listening to that now.
Speaker 1: I like my job.
Speaker 2: Fucking No, go ahead and say you're gonna check your
Speaker 2: wife wile I'm doing my ship going.
Speaker 1: It's enough. That's enough. That's enough. That's on, that's on
Speaker 1: the that's on. McKinley, Hi, I'm not finishing that ship.
Speaker 2: Well, well, I gotta make sure. I always have to
Speaker 2: make sure it's not my kid or my wife. It's always.
Speaker 1: But if your kid has an emergency right now, you're
Speaker 1: sitting down with the nigga who told Kanye Off, I
Speaker 1: think you got to make decisions. You know what I'm
Speaker 1: saying like that, that to me, That to me is disrespectful. Yeah, daddy, daddy,
Speaker 1: I need ice cream. Daddy, Daddy, I skinned my knee. Hey,
Speaker 1: your kid's name is Justin right? Hey, No, my kid's
Speaker 1: name is not Justin. Probably probably it's Aiden either. First
Speaker 1: of all, both my kids are mixed Justin or Aiden.
Speaker 1: See how close that is?
Speaker 2: Aiden and Millennium nigga?
Speaker 1: What yeah Millennium.
Speaker 2: Yeah, my ten year old names is Millennium.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Millennium. Yeah. But then what I mean, there's gotta
Speaker 1: be a story. Uh.
Speaker 2: So me and my wife Black Lady, No, she's Mexican,
Speaker 2: but my my son Millennium is So we met when
Speaker 2: he was three, So I have an eighteen year old
Speaker 2: from my previous relationship, right, who I've had custody of
Speaker 2: the whole time, me and my girl when we started dating.
Speaker 2: Her son is three, but he's never met his dad. So, uh.
Speaker 2: She was watching TV one day, uh, and there was
Speaker 2: like a Millennium Productions at the end of a TV
Speaker 2: show or something, and she was like, nobody else is
Speaker 2: gonna name their kid this. I want a one of
Speaker 2: one name. She's right about that, So we call him
Speaker 2: Millie Millennium MILLI. Yeah, it's that really the hip hop
Speaker 2: shit again? A cat this T shirt a million million
Speaker 2: milli a Melli. No, but he's he's a what is
Speaker 2: he into?
Speaker 1: He wraps?
Speaker 2: He plays basketball? Now he's he's Mexican Black and Puerto Rican.
Speaker 2: Oh man, Yeah, he about to be hell on these
Speaker 2: holes man.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a crazy Now.
Speaker 2: He's a big he's a he's a big, big hooper.
Speaker 1: Though he does like what do he play? Like he
Speaker 1: played with Matt Kids or something like that.
Speaker 2: Uh, he's in this Burbank league and then he does
Speaker 2: this AAU tournament and sure, a thousand oaks. What are
Speaker 2: you like as a basketball dad?
Speaker 1: Are you like? Let me let me pick up the
Speaker 1: bill Simons question real qick because I want to faix
Speaker 1: this so I enjoy working with the ringer. I enjoy
Speaker 1: working with the Ringer because I'll say this is last sense.
Speaker 1: It's one thing to go to a place where you're
Speaker 1: telling you. It's another place to work a place where
Speaker 1: your interests right, It's different, it's different. You're talent being
Speaker 1: utilized means hey, you're good at talking about something. We're
Speaker 1: gonna make you talk about this thing that you don't
Speaker 1: really care about that much so that you can do
Speaker 1: something for us, because we need you to feel a spot.
Speaker 2: Well, like for like rewatchables, do you like tell them like, Hey,
Speaker 2: if you ever do this movie, I want to be
Speaker 2: a ike. That's my ship.
Speaker 1: Not necessarily, but it'll it'll be a situation to where
Speaker 1: it's like, hey, h do you like this movie?
Speaker 2: Or you'll get a list of movies like hey, tell
Speaker 2: us which ones you like? Yeah, and then you tell
Speaker 2: what you watch what was fucking amazing. It's a great podcast.
Speaker 2: Just think about it, so think about how pure it is.
Speaker 1: It's just a podcast about rewatching old movies and talk
Speaker 1: about talking about what the movie meant culturally, what you care,
Speaker 1: how much you care about the movie where you were
Speaker 1: at the time.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like, in terms of like any of my non
Speaker 2: hip hop like podcast listening, it's pretty much all Ringer
Speaker 2: Universe and Joe Rogan. Yeah, because I fucking love I
Speaker 2: love the mismatch too with Verno and Kevin O'Connell my
Speaker 2: my NBA shit big Rogan guy. Huh Yeah, I like Rogan.
Speaker 1: What do you like about him?
Speaker 2: I just like the fact that, like anybody who comes
Speaker 2: like it's like he'll have a crazy conversation with like
Speaker 2: a comedian, and then I'll have another conversation with like
Speaker 2: some dude who's like self efficient setting up like farmland
Speaker 2: grid and then another guy who like talked about like
Speaker 2: fucking you know, uh, like like mapping out the.
Speaker 1: Old world, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2: I mean he did an interview with the with the
Speaker 2: guy who went and investigated the the the minds in Congo,
Speaker 2: the cobalt mines in Congo. That was fucking crazy. That Like,
Speaker 2: I just feel like if you if Joe Rogan, there's enough.
Speaker 2: It's just such a vast range of conversations makes you
Speaker 2: gives you more tools in your intellectual tool thought. And
Speaker 2: I wouldn't even say that it's just kind of like
Speaker 2: because I don't agree with everything that's said on the podcast.
Speaker 1: You know, like the nigger word.
Speaker 2: Well yeah, I mean, wait, you do agree with the
Speaker 2: nigger didn't say that? Well, see look at what this is.
Speaker 1: The way, this is the way. This is why you
Speaker 1: gotta be careful because like you're you're you know what
Speaker 1: this this this is TM level. This is where yeah,
Speaker 1: well you think I learned that. This is where you
Speaker 1: gotta be. This is where you gotta be careful. This
Speaker 1: is way you gotta be careful because I could make that.
Speaker 1: I could that I could make that clip look a
Speaker 1: crazy way in my head, that's what I can make.
Speaker 2: That cool crazy Like, No, you can't make it look
Speaker 2: that crazy.
Speaker 1: Yes, again on Joe Rogan, like, I'm like, I'm like,
Speaker 1: like the nigger word, which is a joke, and you went, well,
Speaker 1: you said you don't agree with it. I don't agree
Speaker 1: with everything that, obviously, I'll like, well, like, no, obviously
Speaker 1: I don't agree with that. No, obviously I don't agree
Speaker 1: with you're trying to this is.
Speaker 2: What we're gonna do.
Speaker 1: What were your thought, Well, I'm gonna take this and
Speaker 1: I'm gonna clip this and and try to ruin and
Speaker 1: then I'm gonna put it out there and I'm gonna
Speaker 1: I'm gonna do this whole thing in k fade I'm
Speaker 1: gonna do. I'm gonna do wrestling terms. I'm gonna do
Speaker 1: this whole thing. I'm gonna clip this piece of this
Speaker 1: of this interview I'm gonna put out there. I'm gonna
Speaker 1: put it on Twitter. He's gonna like, I'm gonna say
Speaker 1: lead keV hesitates to answer whether or not I'm telling
Speaker 1: I'm teaching everybody right now how to cook a headline.
Speaker 1: You know what's the point and shoot, here you go.
Speaker 1: I'm teaching everybody right now how to cook a headline.
Speaker 1: This is how you cook a headline. When you're writing
Speaker 1: the headline, there are three things you need. Number One
Speaker 1: conflict like for example, uh, black iPhone on desk? No conflict? Right,
Speaker 1: How do you inject conflict into that headline about the
Speaker 1: black iPhone on the desk?
Speaker 2: Device made by child slave labor.
Speaker 1: In China, left on desk. Now you have something that.
Speaker 2: Is it'll peak.
Speaker 1: You'll be like, oh, oh, what is this device that
Speaker 1: was made by child Let me see what is this?
Speaker 1: Why do we need children to make this device. What's
Speaker 1: the thing? What it is? That's the way you do
Speaker 1: that headline. One headline is I'm not gonna I don't
Speaker 1: care about the iPhone be on the desk, but something
Speaker 1: that kids slaves made. I care about that. Click on
Speaker 1: the headline. Okay, oh it's an iPhone. Fuck it's an iPhone, right,
Speaker 1: selective age right now, you're going there now. But by
Speaker 1: the time you get to the fact that it's an iPhone,
Speaker 1: got your bitch then clicked my ship.
Speaker 2: Aha, dummy, it was just about an iPhone that someone
Speaker 2: left under, did you? I mean?
Speaker 1: Is that me finished? Pleaset tea? Now we take we
Speaker 1: take you right? And I asked you a question. You
Speaker 1: balked at it. I'm not sure why if I cut
Speaker 1: it off right, if I cut it off, if I
Speaker 1: cut it off right there, I don't.
Speaker 2: Have to lie.
Speaker 1: It's not a lie. I can do it two ways.
Speaker 1: I can either ask a question that incites conflict, which is,
Speaker 1: by the way, is this TMZ one on one?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Okay, watch Bootleg? And there are people much better at
Speaker 1: it than I want. I was in terms of like
Speaker 1: headline writing, like much better right, watch Bootleg, Watch Bootleg.
Speaker 1: keV hesitate when asked if he supports Joe Rogan's inWORD use. Now,
Speaker 1: you could do it that way, I wouldn't do that,
Speaker 1: because that's leading too much. It's actually not the type
Speaker 1: of headline.
Speaker 2: I will write.
Speaker 1: I will write, I will watch boot Bootleg keV. I'll
Speaker 1: probably put it in quotes, Bootleg keV on Joe Rogan's
Speaker 1: inWORD use well, and I'll put that in quote. And
Speaker 1: I will put that in quote. I will do like
Speaker 1: whatever you said, I will like. I would like I
Speaker 1: would put Bootleg keV because this because then I got
Speaker 1: this is what I want. What I want the headline
Speaker 1: number one audio. I don't want your name, God bless you.
Speaker 1: You know whose name? Who names? Whose name? Do I want?
Speaker 1: That's the name I want. So I want Joe Rogan's
Speaker 1: name in the headline. Okay, so I want Joe. I
Speaker 1: might even go I might even do this. I might
Speaker 1: even put above the headline. I might put Joe Rogan right,
Speaker 1: and then I might put uh uh podcast or Cactus
Speaker 1: t agrees or balks or hesitates when asked if he
Speaker 1: likes inward usage on Joe Rogan experience boom, We're going everywhere? Now,
Speaker 1: then this is what I'll do. Then I'll take the
Speaker 1: clip of Joe Rogan saying the in word over and
Speaker 1: over and over again. That's a subasset in the post
Speaker 1: that's at the bottom of the post.
Speaker 2: All right, really yeah, this is this sounds this sounds yeah,
Speaker 2: how I see it. This is how you do it.
Speaker 1: Then as a subasset at the bottom of the post.
Speaker 1: And then I put tags and all throughout there. I
Speaker 1: got hyperlinks, I got, I got Rogan's apology in the post.
Speaker 1: I got Rogan saying the inward in the post. I
Speaker 1: got the whole nine. And then I leave off on.
Speaker 2: A question I'm wondering because you obviously worked at TMZ,
Speaker 2: right your I mean, you have one of the more
Speaker 2: famous moments ever. Was there ever anything you're a part
Speaker 2: of over there that you ever like regretted later on
Speaker 2: in terms of like maybe a particular story or like
Speaker 2: what you just told me you like that, like you
Speaker 2: just walked me through this whole thing, which was essentially
Speaker 2: your job. Was there ever anything you you look back
Speaker 2: on and you're like, like, damn that I was.
Speaker 1: A part of, that you were a part of, or
Speaker 1: is there plenty of things that happened at TMC that
Speaker 1: I was embarrassed about, not even just that you were
Speaker 1: at TMZ four, but like maybe it was a story
Speaker 1: you wrote that maybe you got wrong initials.
Speaker 2: You maybe felt you like it was an unfair approach
Speaker 2: to that person that after you got later context, you
Speaker 2: maybe you know, were like, fuck, don't see.
Speaker 1: Here's the thing about me. There is one time, and
Speaker 1: it's there's something that I learned from it. There was
Speaker 1: one time where I did this whole thing with a
Speaker 1: porn star that I found out wasn't sleeping with Black talent, right, okay,
Speaker 1: and so and I named the porn star mmm, the
Speaker 1: way I would do that now, because it was it
Speaker 1: was kind of like, I'm just I'm on TV. It's early,
Speaker 1: and I'm reckless. I'm just Hey, I found out that
Speaker 1: this porn start that everyone likes doesn't sleep with black talent,
Speaker 1: and who is the porn start on camera? Well, if
Speaker 1: I do that now, it makes no sense. True. So
Speaker 1: if I found out that they didn't sleep with black talent,
Speaker 1: and so I asked a question about it, and they weren't, like,
Speaker 1: they weren't into porn. So the entire room, they don't
Speaker 1: really know what's going on, right, so they're like, oh
Speaker 1: my God, like, oh my god, blah blah blah. Harvey
Speaker 1: goes crazy, he loves the story. They put it up,
Speaker 1: They put her up there, they do the whole thing. Now,
Speaker 1: to me, is it a relevant conversation to have about
Speaker 1: racism and porn or why certain porn stars won't do
Speaker 1: scenes with black guys? Sure, is a relevant conversation, but
Speaker 1: it's such a wides widespread thing that's probably unfair to
Speaker 1: make one person the face of that, right, if you're
Speaker 1: going to talk about it the way you talk about
Speaker 1: it and not make one person the victim of a
Speaker 1: lot of vituall when that person might not necessarily be
Speaker 1: a racist. Is you just say hey, you ask the
Speaker 1: same question because I asked them by on the street.
Speaker 1: I said, hey, blah blah blah blah blah, doesn't do that.
Speaker 1: I name the person. You just say, hey, my favorite
Speaker 1: points are ports are alike or whatever whatever like that,
Speaker 1: and then you you have the same conversation. You get
Speaker 1: the same fears, but somebody doesn't have to bear the brunt.
Speaker 2: Of it because it's it's an industry wide It's.
Speaker 1: Not an industry wide thing. Only certain people do it,
Speaker 1: you know, not talking about just the racism and porn
Speaker 1: in general. Racism and porn is an industry wide thing. Now,
Speaker 1: I don't have any problem talking about that, and I
Speaker 1: don't have any problem asking somebody, Okay, well then what's
Speaker 1: the reason that you wouldn't work with black talent?
Speaker 2: What is that reason?
Speaker 1: Because there, it's that is it's it's such a fundamental,
Speaker 1: such a fundamentally troubling thing to me, Like okay, you're
Speaker 1: you'll do all of this.
Speaker 2: But like not that.
Speaker 1: I mean, later on I figured out that they've talked
Speaker 1: to enough people black and white, and they told me
Speaker 1: that they are just straight up business reasons for it.
Speaker 1: Whatever it's their industry. I'm not gonna get involved with it.
Speaker 1: They can fight their own battle. But what I'm saying
Speaker 1: is whatever it is, whatever it is, forget about it,
Speaker 1: whatever it is. What I have to do is be
Speaker 1: really intentional when I want someone to wear a problem,
Speaker 1: when I want to put a problem on somebody, when
Speaker 1: you're on television, when you have a microphone in front
Speaker 1: of you, you have to be super intentionally, super intentional
Speaker 1: when you call somebody out, because when you call somebody out,
Speaker 1: you make them the issue that you're talking about and
Speaker 1: they have to have earned that to such a degree
Speaker 1: that you have to be so sure about that, or
Speaker 1: else you just don't care about your own responsibility. That's
Speaker 1: something that I regretted or something that I learned to
Speaker 1: do differently. As far as stories that I might have broken,
Speaker 1: to be honest with you, not really, and I'll tell
Speaker 1: you why. The stories that I was involved with, they
Speaker 1: weren't that big a deal. Like my job at TMZ.
Speaker 1: I wrote a lot of stories. But my job at TMZ,
Speaker 1: especially after the first couple of years, because you know,
Speaker 1: I was on the street. Well you started with like
Speaker 1: the tourist, I was on the team, and then I
Speaker 1: was on the street right with the camera. Sometimes those
Speaker 1: interactions I would regret, just like running up on somebody
Speaker 1: like yeah, and it's because I'm from the South. And
Speaker 1: for the most part, that job was fun. And for
Speaker 1: the most part, for the most part, celebrities in Los
Speaker 1: Angeles they know the do. They're cool, they're cool, they're
Speaker 1: they're down to have a good time. But every once
Speaker 1: in a while, you put the camera on somebody and
Speaker 1: you look and they'd have that look of I'm really
Speaker 1: having a fucked up day, Like something's going on with me,
Speaker 1: like something's happening, or you put your camera on somebody
Speaker 1: and they would be like, I know, crying, or they
Speaker 1: would be sad, or you know, they're.
Speaker 2: With their kids. Was there a specific instance you can recall?
Speaker 1: Not really, not a specific one that I can recall.
Speaker 1: You know, of course you would have people get mad
Speaker 1: at you, but uh not one where I felt that
Speaker 1: I can recall that I felt really really bad about.
Speaker 1: But I just know that it was like there were
Speaker 1: certain times to where I was like, I ain't not
Speaker 1: fucking feeling this today.
Speaker 2: The paparazzi game is such an interesting one. I always
Speaker 2: have been like super intrigued by it. Like I watched
Speaker 2: did you ever see the Netflix show? It was only
Speaker 2: one season where they like the ambulance chasers who they
Speaker 2: go and they get the footage on like accidents and
Speaker 2: then they sell it to like the news stations and
Speaker 2: stuff like that. Yeah, crazy show. I forget what it
Speaker 2: was called.
Speaker 1: So good.
Speaker 2: It was actually like a Netflix original. But like on
Speaker 2: the paparazzi side, it's like someone's gonna do that job, right,
Speaker 2: Those people like have to, I mean, if that's their profession,
Speaker 2: Like I'm sure paparazzi have kids, they have families, They
Speaker 2: got to support themselves. Was it like, are there like
Speaker 2: people who have just been doing this job because it
Speaker 2: feels like a means to doing something else if you're
Speaker 2: doing that job, or there are people who like they're
Speaker 2: thirty years.
Speaker 1: They've been doing it for a long time, but doing
Speaker 1: it as long as they can do it for right,
Speaker 1: because there's always somebody new, and.
Speaker 2: Because I think that, like the guys who get like
Speaker 2: the real private photos and I'm like, damn, so let
Speaker 2: me tell you something about that or anything this.
Speaker 1: There are very few jobs, any type of job that
Speaker 1: you can do that are completely devoid of integrity. Like
Speaker 1: drug dealing is bad. We act like it's not, but
Speaker 1: it is.
Speaker 2: Oh, it's terrible.
Speaker 1: Drug dealing is bad. Right, there are levels to drug dealers.
Speaker 1: There's a way to do drug dealing, to deal drugs.
Speaker 2: And we're talking about serious drugs here, talking about.
Speaker 1: Serious yes, Like there are a way to deal drugs
Speaker 1: to do less harm than somebody else. Like hey, I
Speaker 1: won't deal drugs to a seven year old kid. I
Speaker 1: won't deal drugs to a pregnant lady. I won't deal
Speaker 1: drugs Like there are ways to do that. Now, it's
Speaker 1: all bad, right, but there are ways to even do
Speaker 1: that with integrity. Right. So, if you look at being
Speaker 1: a paparazzi as an inherently bad thing, which once again,
Speaker 1: it's part of a celebrity ecosystem, it's really not any
Speaker 1: different than anything else. Like your famous. Part of being
Speaker 1: famous is leveraging and people take your picture. It's part
Speaker 1: of a celebrity ecosystem. In and of itself is not bad. However,
Speaker 1: the nature of the job sometimes can lend itself to
Speaker 1: being hyper competitive. And when it's hyper competitive, then that
Speaker 1: means that the humanity of the subjects on the other
Speaker 1: side of the camera.
Speaker 2: Are not being taken into consideration.
Speaker 1: So if it's and the same thing about anything else,
Speaker 1: it's I gotta be first. I gotta get the picture.
Speaker 1: I gotta get the racist photo. So I'll stick my
Speaker 1: camera up your dress. So I'll doorstep you, which means
Speaker 1: I'll be outside of your house waiting for you to
Speaker 1: come outside your house. Don't know what's gonna come outside
Speaker 1: your house. Doorstepping people, which Timz didn't do. I'll incite you.
Speaker 1: I'll put the camera in your face and ask you
Speaker 1: about your friend who died to try to get you
Speaker 1: to cry or try to make you mad, because that
Speaker 1: picture is gonna go everywhere because once it gets hyper competitive,
Speaker 1: if and the capitalism gets involved, then that makes you
Speaker 1: look at the person as you're a big game hunter.
Speaker 1: Now you're not a photographer anymore. Now you're trying to
Speaker 1: get something.
Speaker 2: You're trying to get something to sell to a site.
Speaker 1: Right, So there's to if you're a freelancer, if you're TMZ,
Speaker 1: you work for TMZ, right, you got to abide by
Speaker 1: their rules, right, And like the way it's supposed to
Speaker 1: be at TMZ is if you pick your camera up
Speaker 1: someone says, hey, I'm not into it, you shut your
Speaker 1: camera down, right to be respectful. Right, it's more of
Speaker 1: an on the street interview than it is actually just
Speaker 1: snapping pictures. That is not to separate what TMZ paparazzi
Speaker 1: are doing from anybody else. I was on the street
Speaker 1: with a lot of different guys and most of them
Speaker 1: are cool, Like most of them are cool, But then
Speaker 1: you have some guys that don't give a fuck that
Speaker 1: are going to get the shot. However, they're going to
Speaker 1: get the shot, and if they have to follow you
Speaker 1: for a little while. If they have to wait outside
Speaker 1: your kids' school, if they have to do all of
Speaker 1: that stuff, they're gonna get it. And so what I'm
Speaker 1: saying is that's not indicative of the industry per se.
Speaker 1: To me, it's indicative of what that person is willing
Speaker 1: to do to get an extra buck or to succeed.
Speaker 2: That's yeah. I think it's just like, you know, I
Speaker 2: feel like living here, you kind of see it a
Speaker 2: little differently because, like you said, like you'll talk to
Speaker 2: people and they'll they'll like management will call and be like, Yo,
Speaker 2: my client's leaving this restaurant at this time.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I mean that's a lot of it.
Speaker 2: A lot of it is that though, like a lot
Speaker 2: like for people who don't know, like like like or
Speaker 2: the artists don't even do it right, Oh my god,
Speaker 2: bro or the artist or the actor or whatever because
Speaker 2: they want to put their narrative.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I give you example. Oh I don't want to
Speaker 1: say names, but there was an R and B singer
Speaker 1: who was a pretty big R and B singer at
Speaker 1: one time, and I knew through a friend of mine,
Speaker 1: and you know, it was at the Saddle Ranch in
Speaker 1: this big fancy car and we had. We were the
Speaker 1: three of us were eating at the Saldar Range. Right,
Speaker 1: We're hanging out eating at the Saddle Ranch. And I
Speaker 1: was like, when you leave here, you prophasee you on
Speaker 1: the lower or whatever. And he goes, no, it's not
Speaker 1: at all. I'm like, okay, well, I'm gonna send the
Speaker 1: camera to you. I was like, as a matter of fact,
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna send the camera to you. I got
Speaker 1: my camera in the car. I'm just gonna shoot you
Speaker 1: and we're gonna do a little thing for TMZ. And
Speaker 1: so car pulls out like a big Red Bentley or
Speaker 1: something like that, right, recognizable, guy had hits And I
Speaker 1: pulled a camera out. When I pulled a camera out
Speaker 1: and I start shooting him inside of his car, everybody
Speaker 1: starts coming around. Everybody's like, oh.
Speaker 2: My god, who is that?
Speaker 1: And they know his face, like they probably wouldn't have
Speaker 1: bothered him any other time, but they know it's face.
Speaker 1: So everybody's going to Man, I get in my shit
Speaker 1: and I'm going back to the office, and I get
Speaker 1: a call. Bro that fucking shit was crazy. Man. We
Speaker 1: oughtna do that all the time. Bruh. I needed that, Broh,
Speaker 1: Like I fucking needed that. Man, We should do that
Speaker 1: all the time. And now you have somebody that wants
Speaker 1: to get shots. You have people that want that you
Speaker 1: that uh that want you to shoot them. That's a contact,
Speaker 1: that's one that if they are ever involved in a story.
Speaker 2: You could hit them.
Speaker 1: Now that you have that relationship, or if someone tangential
Speaker 1: to them is ever involved into a story with the story,
Speaker 1: now you have that relationship. So there is not for
Speaker 1: the most part, at least while I was that they're
Speaker 1: an adversarial relationship between TMZ and the celebrity at large,
Speaker 1: most of the celebrities dig it. I don't know how
Speaker 1: it is now things have changed a little course, but
Speaker 1: most celebrities dug it to me most and if they
Speaker 1: didn't dig it, they didn't have a problem with They
Speaker 1: got it right. Then there are some who just can't
Speaker 1: fucking stand it, like ig Iggy mel Gibson, the fucking
Speaker 1: The like owner Luke Wilson don't fuck with it, Like
Speaker 1: a lot of people like that don't fuck with it.
Speaker 1: And if I ever saw if I saw a black
Speaker 1: celebrity and they were in a situation to where like
Speaker 1: I remember one time I saw I saw Golden Brooks,
Speaker 1: he's sweet lady. And she was eating. She was at
Speaker 1: She was actually with Regina King. They were they were eating.
Speaker 2: This is years of.
Speaker 1: Watchman season two. Please find no, not Regina King. She
Speaker 1: was with Regina Hall. She was with She was with
Speaker 1: Regina Hall and they were eating at on sunset. And
Speaker 1: I remember I was walking around with my camera and
Speaker 1: I asked them two black women. I'm not trying to ask. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they were eating. I asked them, like, after you guys done,
Speaker 1: do you want to do a shop? And they went, no,
Speaker 1: move on.
Speaker 2: How to be deal? Somebody else will be around, you know.
Speaker 2: But it's just all of that stuff. Once again, it's
Speaker 2: part of an ecosystem.
Speaker 1: What I will say about TMZ is this, there's a
Speaker 1: lot of criticism that TMZ gets right from all all
Speaker 1: kinds of people. You get criticism for team from from TMZ.
Speaker 1: People will tell you you worked there, you did this,
Speaker 1: and you did that, all that stuff. People hate TMZ.
Speaker 1: They hate it.
Speaker 2: Everybody is TMZ true, like everyone is TMZ. Guess what
Speaker 2: when you see that famous person, what do you do?
Speaker 1: I mean that in two ways. Number One, when people
Speaker 1: know that you work there, it doesn't matter where you
Speaker 1: go you go sit down at the nicest restaurant in La.
Speaker 1: I'm in La. I mean, I'm at a cut I
Speaker 1: sit down, somebody comes over, they know me from the show. Hey,
Speaker 1: just let you know Tom Hanks is going to be
Speaker 1: here in a little bit. You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: Like the valets, everyone everyone wants to be a part
Speaker 1: of it. That's what do you tip them? Yeah, if
Speaker 1: they give you a good they give you a good tip.
Speaker 1: Yeah I would. And the other part of it is this,
Speaker 1: if you are an outlet or you are a radio station,
Speaker 1: your blog or whatever, and you repurpose a TMZ story,
Speaker 1: meaning you report on what they reported, you give the
Speaker 1: information that they got your TMZ. Yeah, I mean I've
Speaker 1: used You're like, what they want more than anything is
Speaker 1: for other people to pick up the things. Well, I
Speaker 1: also think and so and so. My thing is I've
Speaker 1: had there have been so many places where even when
Speaker 1: I was working there and even after that, I've been criticized. Right,
Speaker 1: and then I hear them say, according to TMZ, this
Speaker 1: and this and happen. If that's like, you can't have
Speaker 1: that both ways. If a place is too fucked up
Speaker 1: for you, either you're gonna say this place has to
Speaker 1: exist and you want them to be better or you're
Speaker 1: not gonna fuck with them. And then on top of
Speaker 1: that most of these other celebrities. I've had celebrities or
Speaker 1: people that I know directly criticize TMZ and what they've done,
Speaker 1: and then I'll see them when they have something to
Speaker 1: promote on TMZ live. You can't do it that way.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like you're gonna shoo on TMZ, but then
Speaker 2: when you when you need.
Speaker 1: Which, by the way, when I was there, there were
Speaker 1: times where the website wasn't a little irresponsible, it was
Speaker 1: insanely irresponsible, downright racist, sexist, insensitive, the whole nine. When
Speaker 1: I was there, there was an attack an attachment post
Speaker 1: twenty sixteen to Donald Trump that TMZ did a lot
Speaker 1: of his bidding. I'm not all caping for the organization,
Speaker 1: but what I'm saying is with some place like that
Speaker 1: that thrives on attention the sharing of stories, it's.
Speaker 2: Kind of like the Vlad thing, right, It's like people
Speaker 2: talk about Vlad, but then they're going to show when
Speaker 2: they have to promote their album or they need some
Speaker 2: clout or wash.
Speaker 1: The reality is it's a massive platform it's a huge platform,
Speaker 1: so and so people, and I don't want to compare
Speaker 1: with ladin TMZ because that I don't want to do
Speaker 1: that because you know, look, there's nothing inherently wrong with TMZ.
Speaker 1: There's actually actually inherently wrong with what laders doing. Ladders
Speaker 1: doing interviews, TMZ is doing celebrity news. The reality is,
Speaker 1: if you have a problem with it, if you have
Speaker 1: a problem with it, the only way to do the
Speaker 1: only way to really affect that problem is to not conticipate.
Speaker 2: Don't assume that's the only thing you can do.
Speaker 1: And the reality is is that the influence on the
Speaker 1: the website and the platform on culture is too strong
Speaker 1: for anyone to really do that. The way I look
Speaker 1: at most people, some people with.
Speaker 2: TMZ is like they've been right, like almost I feel
Speaker 2: like that, you know, when they're not right, they update
Speaker 2: the story in such a real time that it's like very.
Speaker 1: Few times they're going to be inaccurate.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and this is I mean, as a radio personality,
Speaker 2: always like yo, this check TMZ.
Speaker 1: But I give an example. People said that TMZ was
Speaker 1: inaccurate on the Lil Wayne story. Remember that, do you.
Speaker 2: Remember the story? Was it when he was it when
Speaker 2: he got arrested.
Speaker 1: All right, So I'm gonna I'm gonna do another tmz
Speaker 1: uh No, it wasn't when he was arrested. When he
Speaker 1: was sick.
Speaker 2: Oh, yes, yes, when he was having his seizures. Yes,
Speaker 2: I remember that.
Speaker 1: This is one of the times that I caught some
Speaker 1: of the most hell. Okay, all right. So March twenty
Speaker 1: thirteen TIMS, he reported that Lil Wayne was in a
Speaker 1: coma and received his last rights at Seius and Hospital.
Speaker 1: I remember this in Los Angeles. Okay, So let's look
Speaker 1: at I'm gonna give I'm gonna give everyone right now
Speaker 1: another little lesson because here's the story right now, let's
Speaker 1: look at it. So it's been updated a bunch of
Speaker 1: times right now.
Speaker 2: But you originally wrote this story.
Speaker 1: No, I didn't have anything to do with it. I was,
Speaker 1: I was. I was on the street at this time.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 1: So it says it says Lou Wayne is in ICU
Speaker 1: critical condition after suffering yet another seizure. Where told it
Speaker 1: doesn't look good, teams, he has learned. We brought the story.
Speaker 1: Three year oldrapper was rushed to see a sign in
Speaker 1: the hospital. First of all, prays up for Wayne glad
Speaker 1: that Wayne is happy, healthy and doing of course, of
Speaker 1: course he's using this as example. This is one of
Speaker 1: the things. So all of this stuff that is being
Speaker 1: a legend here is being confirmed through sources. So someone
Speaker 1: is telling someone this, right, Okay, someone is telling someone
Speaker 1: that this is what is going on. Okay, So let
Speaker 1: me tell you what a lie is journalistically here is
Speaker 1: that that person isn't telling us that if we're making
Speaker 1: that up right now, So when they say Lil Wayne
Speaker 1: is in critical condition and he's being read his last run, no, no, no.
Speaker 1: If a source says that and then it is put
Speaker 1: up on TMZ and it's attributed to sources, then that
Speaker 1: story is legit. Right. If the source said it, the
Speaker 1: source said that, then the story is legit. Now if
Speaker 1: loul Wayne pulls through, the source said that, hey, it
Speaker 1: doesn't look good, that's that person's objective interpretation.
Speaker 2: Doesn't look good.
Speaker 1: Somebody came in like they're preparing for something objective opinion.
Speaker 1: Now Lil Wayne rebounded.
Speaker 2: And the whole world went. The whole world.
Speaker 1: Went TMZ lit. It was never that big of a deal.
Speaker 1: If people an example of something, you're married, I'm not
Speaker 1: calling this on your marriage I'm just using this as
Speaker 1: an example. If you have brothers or sisters, one sister,
Speaker 1: that one sister. If I walk into a restaurant right
Speaker 1: now and someone says, if I'm on the basketball court
Speaker 1: and someone that I've never met before says, hey, you
Speaker 1: know bout Let Cav, I saw you on this podcast,
Speaker 1: I'm like, yeah, it's like, Bullet cav is getting a divorce,
Speaker 1: not blue Let CaMV is not getting a divorce. God
Speaker 1: protect this marriage, he says, blue Let cav is getting
Speaker 1: a divorce. If I run to the website and put
Speaker 1: that up on the website, that's an irresponsible story.
Speaker 2: Because who's your source, who's my source?
Speaker 1: You have a sister, My sister tells you, If your
Speaker 1: sister tells me, if your sister tells.
Speaker 2: Me, then then it's like, well that's that's that's the.
Speaker 1: Sources close to butlet cav say the marriage is on
Speaker 1: the rocks and.
Speaker 2: Divorce is on the table or something.
Speaker 1: If you do not get divorced, that does not make
Speaker 1: that story less true. The story is not you getting
Speaker 1: divorced or not getting divorced. The story is your sister,
Speaker 1: who they don't know who she is. You're not gonna
Speaker 1: out your source told us that you were getting divorced.
Speaker 1: The strength of that, and that goes for journalism everywhere. Hey,
Speaker 1: before the Dobb's decision is coming out, somebody gets ahold
Speaker 1: of the opinion that somebody wrote or someone like. This
Speaker 1: hasn't leaked yet, but according to sources that tell ABC
Speaker 1: News this information is coming out. Well, if the information
Speaker 1: doesn't come out, ABC News would be embarrassed, of course,
Speaker 1: and so you have to do your due diligence with
Speaker 1: the sources that you have that they're not gonna double
Speaker 1: back on you. But the reality of the situation is
Speaker 1: if you have a source and that source is ironclad
Speaker 1: and that source is in with whomever you're talking about,
Speaker 1: that's go on that story. The question about whether or
Speaker 1: not you would report something that's that serious and unless
Speaker 1: you knew it to be, that's different, varies varies platform platforms,
Speaker 1: platform the platform. When you report about Michael Jackson and
Speaker 1: the fact that he had passed away, you haven't seen
Speaker 1: the body, you haven't checked his pulse, you haven't done
Speaker 1: any of that stuff. You don't know when you report
Speaker 1: on Prince like you you haven't seen his dead body.
Speaker 1: Somebody that knows.
Speaker 2: Him really well said he was dead and so, and
Speaker 2: you know that to be true.
Speaker 1: You're staking your relationship with them in a in a
Speaker 1: journalistic way of them on them being a good source. Right,
Speaker 1: So when I say that they're normally right, it's if
Speaker 1: they if something is factually correct or factually incorrect, it
Speaker 1: normally won't go up on the site. I'll talk about
Speaker 1: one story I did have Jason Pierre Paul, the football player.
Speaker 2: I remember him fires incident.
Speaker 1: Maybe I knew about that before it happened, hours like
Speaker 1: hours before it happened. Somebody hit me and literally went,
Speaker 1: hey man, JPP just blew his hand off with some
Speaker 1: firewors hours before it happened. It ended up because that
Speaker 1: was on fourth of July, right, And so it ended
Speaker 1: up happening maybe at a certain time. It was on
Speaker 1: the East coast, and I couldn't ever put it up
Speaker 1: on the site. I couldn't put up on the site
Speaker 1: because I couldn't confirm it. I couldn't get a picture
Speaker 1: of it right, I couldn't get any of that stuff right.
Speaker 1: I could have gone on the source that he did that,
Speaker 1: but it's such a finite thing that when it's this
Speaker 1: has happened not this will happen, but this has happened.
Speaker 1: I even need to be able to talk to somebody
Speaker 1: that saw the hand and can give me pictures of
Speaker 1: the hand. I need to be ironclad because I can't
Speaker 1: put that up and true, because that's a strength. It's
Speaker 1: didn't either happened or it didn't happen. That's a straight
Speaker 1: up lie. So guess what we put it on the story.
Speaker 2: We couldn't get it.
Speaker 1: The guy who did get it, I think it was Schefter.
Speaker 1: He violated hippo laws to get it because he got
Speaker 1: the ship. I remember him getting in trouble. I don't
Speaker 1: want to say if Schefter, if it wasn't Schefter, So
Speaker 1: because I don't want to get.
Speaker 2: It, you don't want to. Yeah, but somebody, somebody, you
Speaker 2: take out the.
Speaker 1: Schefter thing there was. There was actually somebody who did
Speaker 1: get it that violated hippo laws to get the story
Speaker 1: and ended up getting in trouble. We weren't gonna do that.
Speaker 1: We weren't gonna call We weren't gonna call any hospitals
Speaker 1: to try to get it. We were calling any doctors
Speaker 1: to try to get it. I was trying to get
Speaker 1: deeper into his inner circle to have someone give me
Speaker 1: a picture of that.
Speaker 2: Damn, that's crazy. I feel like that world the schefter, like, uh,
Speaker 2: you know, the shams versus WOS world. That shit's crazy.
Speaker 1: M hmm.
Speaker 2: It's so, it's it's it's it's like the sports TMZ.
Speaker 2: It's the same thing.
Speaker 1: I mean, we have TMZ sports, so it was the
Speaker 1: same thing, but we didn't do contract stuff. It was
Speaker 1: more lifestyle stuff around guys. But the same thing. A
Speaker 1: trade is about to happen, like, uh at three hours
Speaker 1: from now they sent it to Osh said it to
Speaker 1: was wosebomb boom? What if they didn't take the deal
Speaker 1: off the table? Did woes lie? No, somebody told them that.
Speaker 2: I was for sure. I was going to ask you.
Speaker 2: You mentioned that people were. It felt like TMZ did
Speaker 2: the bidding for Trump, and I feel like a lot
Speaker 2: of all the news networks are pretty much guilty of that.
Speaker 1: No, they weren't.
Speaker 2: I think CNN did in terms of just how much
Speaker 2: they covered him. There was like a free information for
Speaker 2: Trump all day. Okay, I didn't know.
Speaker 1: I'm not talking about I'm not talking about like I'm
Speaker 1: not I'm not talking about.
Speaker 2: What capacity did you mean when you said that.
Speaker 1: That the stories were favorable.
Speaker 2: They were favorable for him.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, okay, okay, yeah, it's like because Harvey and
Speaker 1: Trump were friends.
Speaker 2: Oh I didn't know that they were. Well, I was
Speaker 2: going to ask you just like, because because you you
Speaker 2: you talk politics a lot on your podcast. For people
Speaker 2: who don't know, go check it out Still Podcast.
Speaker 1: High Learning Podcasts, ring your podcast network. We're gonna have
Speaker 1: Cactus Tea on our show pretty soon.
Speaker 2: Well, I was going to ask you, like, where do
Speaker 2: you see because I don't think Biden's gonna endup being
Speaker 2: the guy, because I think it'll lose. I think they
Speaker 2: probably know that by now.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so roll that out for me. I was just
Speaker 1: gonna ask you, like, no, no, no, no, no, no,
Speaker 1: stay on your opinion. So BID's not gonna BID's not
Speaker 1: gonna run. So who's going to run? I think he'll
Speaker 1: probably be Gavin Newsom. Gavin Newso will run. Okay, when
Speaker 1: are they gonna make this decision?
Speaker 2: I think they gotta make it after Super probably after
Speaker 2: Super Tuesday, so or after the primaries is what I
Speaker 2: meant to say. After the Democratic primary. Yeah, so they're
Speaker 2: gonna do the primaries. Joe Biden is then going to be.
Speaker 2: I think he's gonna take like a if I had
Speaker 2: to predict it, I think he's gonna probably just for
Speaker 2: like health reasons, just step away, which is probably like
Speaker 2: the way to do it, right.
Speaker 1: So with every passing day, every passing second, that becomes
Speaker 1: less likely.
Speaker 2: You're right, because I don't disagree with you. My thing
Speaker 2: is is do you feel like what happened? Because I
Speaker 2: feel like the CNN, Fox News news cycles, MSNBC during
Speaker 2: twenty sixteen twenty fifteen, all you would see is Trump
Speaker 2: trump trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, trump Trump because it was
Speaker 2: good for ratings, right, And I feel like.
Speaker 1: Something it's also a relevant news story.
Speaker 2: It was it was, but I feel like something similar
Speaker 2: is kind of happening now. But in terms of like
Speaker 2: all of these cases that are I mean not and
Speaker 2: he broke the law, right well allegedly obviously he's gonna
Speaker 2: go have to go to court.
Speaker 1: And you know it looks like and if you were
Speaker 1: being objective, that there's some smoke there in some of
Speaker 1: these cases yet, right, So.
Speaker 2: Are all these cases to me are kind of doing
Speaker 2: the same thing the media did from the first go round,
Speaker 2: Because I feel like it's kind of it like making
Speaker 2: people feel like he's like a martyr more now than ever.
Speaker 2: Who If you had to predict who's gonna be the
Speaker 2: next president right now, I will predict.
Speaker 1: I will predict Joe Biden.
Speaker 2: Here's the thing, So you think Biden's sticking sticking in it?
Speaker 1: If I had to predict, if you had to, that's
Speaker 1: your scenario is uh is not out of the question.
Speaker 1: But I'm interested. All the reason why I ask follow
Speaker 1: ups is because I'm interested in the specificity of it.
Speaker 1: Right right, Okay, Joe BID's not gonna run. Everybody say, Okay,
Speaker 1: Joe BID's not gonna run. Who's gonna run? Are they
Speaker 1: gonna give Michelle to do it?
Speaker 2: That'd be nice?
Speaker 1: Is it gonna so?
Speaker 2: So your situation right in your let's say it's Newsome
Speaker 2: first Trump.
Speaker 1: Let's say it's Newsome. Right, that's a gigantic problem for
Speaker 1: the Democrats. Newsom is a is a I wouldn't say
Speaker 1: a great candidate. He's a corporate Democrat like the rest
Speaker 1: of them.
Speaker 2: Is extremely corporate Democrat.
Speaker 1: But he's a corporate But he is young, charismatic who
Speaker 1: was just hanging out with Clinton today, speaks incredibly well,
Speaker 1: He's a statesman, presentable, Yeah, when all Fox News was
Speaker 1: able to mix it up with Sean Hannity or whoever
Speaker 1: else they have him on there, held zone against handy,
Speaker 1: held his own against the Santas We actually the Hannity's
Speaker 1: lunch No murdered handed. Yeah, but okay, So if Gavin
Speaker 1: Newsom is your candidate, what's the problem with that? What's
Speaker 1: the huge problem with him being a candidate?
Speaker 2: I think that the national opinion of California is that
Speaker 2: it's in shambles and that he's a terrible I don't
Speaker 2: think that's that big of a deal. What do you
Speaker 2: think is the main problem?
Speaker 1: You jumped Kamala Harris. So the fact that you jumped
Speaker 1: Kamala Harris right after making such a big deal.
Speaker 2: Of her being the first one, being the first vice president.
Speaker 1: Yeah, VP, you jumped Kamala Harris. Now, every single black women,
Speaker 1: not all of them, but a lot of black women.
Speaker 1: Let me not speak in absolutes that uh support Democrats
Speaker 1: more loyal blindly than any other group. I wouldn't say blindly, no, no,
Speaker 1: but very very like. I mean, my grandma and my
Speaker 1: mom are like that. What I'm saying is those democrats't matter.
Speaker 1: Black women are incredibly well educated, and I think they're
Speaker 1: making decisions. Uh. I don't think it's blind support. I
Speaker 1: think it's traditional support. I wouldn't call it blind. Those
Speaker 1: voters are now to a degree disenchanted. Now, that doesn't
Speaker 1: mean that they would vote for Donald Trump. I'm not
Speaker 1: saying that at all. But what I am saying is
Speaker 1: it would be incredibly politically risky if you were going
Speaker 1: to go with another candidate, so to alienate your base,
Speaker 1: most loyal loyal base. So let's say it's Kamala Gavin,
Speaker 1: Kamala Gavin like Kama at the top of the ticket,
Speaker 1: Gavin as vice president.
Speaker 2: Will you do that? I would? I would think so.
Speaker 1: I mean he wants to be president absolutely. I think
Speaker 1: he will be one day. The question is not the
Speaker 1: question is when. The question is is it twenty eight?
Speaker 1: Does does Kamala still get her turn? Does she still
Speaker 1: get her turn at president? Is he? Uh? Does does
Speaker 1: she come back in twenty eight? Then? Does he have
Speaker 1: to wait? Or does he jump her? Obama jumped a
Speaker 1: couple of people. Yeah, it just sometimes you you you
Speaker 1: grab the world in your hands and you.
Speaker 2: Have to do that. Jump Hillary jump Hillary?
Speaker 1: Right, and so then when you come back to kind
Speaker 1: of what he was were talking about in terms of
Speaker 1: of Donald Trump. Right now, there's a couple of questions
Speaker 1: I would ask you, h, who's indicting Donald Trump?
Speaker 2: I mean that's the question if he gets indicted. I
Speaker 2: think that is, well, he's been indicted, if he gets convicted,
Speaker 2: Rather so if he gets question.
Speaker 1: Is when I say who's indicting them? I'm talking about
Speaker 1: I'm asking specific questions about the coverage. Right. See, and
Speaker 1: n isn't indicting Trump. MSNBC isn't indicting Trump. Trump has
Speaker 1: been indicted in New York, in Georgia, and he's been
Speaker 1: indicted by Justice Department. Okay, So those entities indicting Donald Trump,
Speaker 1: whether you feel like it's politically motivated or not, they
Speaker 1: have a duty to prosecute crimes, right, and if there
Speaker 1: are crimes committed under their watch and they become aware
Speaker 1: of these crimes, they're not going.
Speaker 2: To take it to indictment unless they think they can
Speaker 2: get a conviction.
Speaker 1: Right, That's the only purpose of doing it. So they
Speaker 1: have to prosecute criminals. So what I wouldn't want is
Speaker 1: a Justice Department or a DA or any these people
Speaker 1: that represent the car Storo, the carcural conditions of America
Speaker 1: and the cartal state that we live in, which is bad.
Speaker 1: I'm not a huge fan of just locking people up
Speaker 1: and throwing away to key. That's not the way I
Speaker 1: look at the world. But I wouldn't want any of
Speaker 1: them to not indict or prosecute, specifically a wealthy white
Speaker 1: man because they think it's bad politically. I think if
Speaker 1: you are going no one thinks about whether or not
Speaker 1: it's bad for the hood. When you are going to
Speaker 1: indict a man for selling drugs and he has a family,
Speaker 1: or he has a baby's mother, he has no one
Speaker 1: thinks about if it's bad for his family. No, for sure,
Speaker 1: nobody thinks about it if it's bad for anything else.
Speaker 1: When they do that, I see criminal, I get criminal.
Speaker 1: I put criminal in jail. So and more often than not,
Speaker 1: when we're looking at the other side of this, those
Speaker 1: guys are being targeted, They are being stopped in frisk. Sure,
Speaker 1: there are police in their neighborhoods waiting to create a criminal.
Speaker 1: Out of the circumstances and the systemic dysfunction and failure
Speaker 1: that has existed in America for a very long time,
Speaker 1: there are people.
Speaker 2: Waiting to do that, so they're almost born into.
Speaker 1: This sort of uh legal entrapment that for a lot
Speaker 1: of them is difficult to escape. So the question isn't
Speaker 1: whether or not, it's it's making people sympathetic to Donald Trump.
Speaker 1: The question is did he fucking do it?
Speaker 2: So I think that's the question on the factual base,
Speaker 2: but perceptually it doesn't matter.
Speaker 1: What difference does that make? Though? Well, I mean, well,
Speaker 1: and so you so you would want you would want
Speaker 1: the Justice Department to say no, because then that would
Speaker 1: certainly do what between the Justice no, no, No.
Speaker 2: What I'm saying is you're saying they're doing their job,
Speaker 2: which they are doing. I think that Joe Schmoe's perception
Speaker 2: of what's happening is, oh, it's all happening. At the
Speaker 2: same time, there's a reason why they don't want him in,
Speaker 2: so I'm gonna vote for him.
Speaker 1: That's Look, here's the thing. I'll just be honest with you.
Speaker 1: Maybe maybe there are people who who are more sympathetic
Speaker 1: to them and criminals. Right, I'll tell you what. People
Speaker 1: of Americans have had a long cultural relationship with criminality. Right,
Speaker 1: mafioso's scarface, scarface, dope dealers all have been lying eyes,
Speaker 1: and there've been movies made about them. Also, I'll tell
Speaker 1: you what they've never done. They've never took taken one
Speaker 1: of those guys that they knew to be a criminal
Speaker 1: and decided that he was going to lead the country.
Speaker 1: So what I'm going to say is this, if we
Speaker 1: are so deep down the rabbit hole of Trump's being
Speaker 1: persecuted or something like that has happened to that you
Speaker 1: want them to lead the nation, that's fine. You can't argue.
Speaker 2: Listen, it's a wild It's not wild at all. It's
Speaker 2: a wild. I just feel like we've been living in
Speaker 2: like a Family Guy episode or a South Park episode
Speaker 2: the last like eight years. So like if he's like
Speaker 2: re elected, I would not be surprised.
Speaker 1: I wouldn't be surprised either. Look, here's the thing when
Speaker 1: you when you ask me why I think that he'll lose,
Speaker 1: or why I think that Biden, who is objectively a
Speaker 1: bad candidate for sure, like objectively a bad candidate.
Speaker 2: Yes, right, I'll give you a couple of examples.
Speaker 1: Well, I think that.
Speaker 2: One.
Speaker 1: History tells me Trump will lose. Trump won one election
Speaker 1: and then he's been consistently losing elections since then, lost
Speaker 1: in twenty twenty the midterms, people have flipped on them.
Speaker 1: They've cooled.
Speaker 2: All the people who have dived into the elections stealing
Speaker 2: shit have been losing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Also that there's been a referendum from America on
Speaker 1: trump Ism, on the whole maga thing. The parts of
Speaker 1: America that are very definitively maga are not going to
Speaker 1: come away from it. They feel represented and seen through that.
Speaker 2: So that's not going to change.
Speaker 1: But the people who are at the margins of that
Speaker 1: that actually flipped elections, they have been going a different way.
Speaker 1: So I would have to see them elect him again
Speaker 1: for me to change trend, not for me to believe it,
Speaker 1: because they do do it in twenty sixteen to change
Speaker 1: trend number one. I also do think that as the
Speaker 1: criminal trials beginning, as thing's mount he will probably become
Speaker 1: even less desirable by some of the other people on
Speaker 1: the side. The Republicans are working against Donald Trump right now.
Speaker 1: They're trying to get fronton sadis whatever not gonna be
Speaker 1: able to do it. He's still gonna way. But I'll
Speaker 1: say this, so with all of that stuff, like, I
Speaker 1: think that Joe Biden probably still would beat Donald Trump
Speaker 1: if if he ends up in a general election. About
Speaker 1: Joe Biden and the Democrats are doing themselves, I'm I'm
Speaker 1: all the way to the left. They're doing themselves a
Speaker 1: tremendous disservice in the way they are running their campaign.
Speaker 2: I just saw Obama, like sources close to Obama said
Speaker 2: that he's there.
Speaker 1: You go, yeah, so.
Speaker 2: You saw that story about I did.
Speaker 1: Yeah, there are there are a couple of measurables out
Speaker 1: there that actually look good for the president, that look
Speaker 1: good for his administration. Economy is coming back, not the
Speaker 1: way people will want it to come back, but it's
Speaker 1: coming back robustly, not maybe as quick as people want
Speaker 1: to come back. Economies coming back, gas prices coming down.
Speaker 1: We keep talking about how bad things are in the streets.
Speaker 1: Data says, y'all talk to people. You always have to
Speaker 1: talk to people. But data says that violent crime is
Speaker 1: down in most of the places where it was up before.
Speaker 1: There's still places where it's terrible. And if you're on
Speaker 1: the ground in some of these places and you talk
Speaker 1: to people, they're gonna get You're gonna get all kinds
Speaker 1: of different stories about how their lives actually are. I
Speaker 1: get that. So there are things to message, they're not
Speaker 1: messaging them.
Speaker 2: Well, they've always kind of been the worst at promoting
Speaker 2: themselves there. They have a messaging problem, well, one a
Speaker 2: branding problem.
Speaker 1: Well, one problem they have now is that they don't
Speaker 1: have an executive that's capable of speaking with authority and
Speaker 1: charisma to his wins or to Australia, his his failure, right,
Speaker 1: they don't have that.
Speaker 2: He's not capable.
Speaker 1: He's not capable and for whatever reason, they've sidelined Kamala Harris.
Speaker 1: She hasn't been where she.
Speaker 2: Needs to be.
Speaker 1: People think that these things are criticisms of the Democrats
Speaker 1: that I make. I'm not Democrat, but I said, I'm
Speaker 1: always to the left, but I don't have any part
Speaker 1: of affiliation. People think that these criticisms I'm making a
Speaker 1: Democratic party are ones that I'm making because there's some
Speaker 1: sort of secret agenda from me or from anybody else.
Speaker 1: There are observations that I hope that people would listen
Speaker 1: to so that these things would change. There's no problem
Speaker 1: right now that people that look at the world like
Speaker 1: me are observing that would be better under Donald Trump.
Speaker 1: The war in the Middle East will be prosecuted in
Speaker 1: a much less favorable way, in a much more aggressive
Speaker 1: and bloody way to the Palestinians and Gaza than it
Speaker 1: already is being. And what we're seeing over there right
Speaker 1: now is terrible, ridiculous, murderer, a crazy so just all
Speaker 1: over the place. But it would be worse under Trump. Trump,
Speaker 1: while he was in office, you could make an argument stoked.
Speaker 2: Some of these tropes.
Speaker 1: No, they he stoked some of these fires, Some of
Speaker 1: these tensions arose under him. He made the decision geopolitically
Speaker 1: to move the embassy uh to Jerusalem and recognized Jerusalem
Speaker 1: as the capital of Israel, which was a long held
Speaker 1: point of contention between you know, Israel and the West Bank,
Speaker 1: like who runs who has Jerusalem? Everybody had just said,
Speaker 1: kind of we're leaving out on the table. We're not
Speaker 1: trying to figure that out where it's It's a place
Speaker 1: that nobody kind of owns. You talk about Jordan all
Speaker 1: that stuff, and Trump's like, no, no, no, no, Jerusalem
Speaker 1: is the cultural and political center of Israel. He moved
Speaker 1: it there, and not very many other places in the
Speaker 1: world went along with him doing that. The reality of
Speaker 1: it is that he did that to signal just how
Speaker 1: staunch an ally he years of not just Israel, but
Speaker 1: of bebing that in Yahoo. I want to make sure
Speaker 1: I say this, Any criticism that I have of Israel
Speaker 1: is of Israel as a state. Any criticism that I
Speaker 1: have of any state is of that state as a state. Right,
Speaker 1: people are diving deep into some pretty obvious anti Semitism,
Speaker 1: and these things are being conflated. But if you are
Speaker 1: talking about a country and it's geopolitical actions, it's economic actions,
Speaker 1: it's human rights violations or human rights violations that have
Speaker 1: been committed against them in October seventh, one of the
Speaker 1: worst terrorist attacks we've ever seen, you have to talk
Speaker 1: about it in a sanitized, intellectual way. And the reality
Speaker 1: is there's a geopolitical advantage for the United States to
Speaker 1: have an ally where Israel is situated, for them to
Speaker 1: have a country that has some semblance of democracy and
Speaker 1: blindly support and to blindly support it, not because they
Speaker 1: believe in Israel. It's people, it's freedom, it's self determination,
Speaker 1: or the freedom of the self determination of anybody else
Speaker 1: in that region, but because they believe in their own
Speaker 1: and it's their own interests at heart. It's being able
Speaker 1: to check up on Iran, Iran and being able to
Speaker 1: have an ally there and so you'll send them as
Speaker 1: a mini a pasture helicopters as they need three point
Speaker 1: three billion dollars a year. So when you're talking about
Speaker 1: like what you think a country should be able to
Speaker 1: do and what they should what they should do, you're
Speaker 1: talking about how you look at the world. And the
Speaker 1: way I look at the world is through things that
Speaker 1: have been deprived of me when I was a kid
Speaker 1: in Baton Rouge, which is freedom, justice, access to food, water, healthcare,
Speaker 1: environmental justice, one person, one vote, having your life matter.
Speaker 1: Those are things that when I'm consistently burying people where
Speaker 1: I'm from, that I do not see being reflected in
Speaker 1: certain situations all over the world, right, And that's the
Speaker 1: way I look at the world. I don't look at
Speaker 1: the world through America.
Speaker 2: First.
Speaker 1: I don't look at the world through the lens of
Speaker 1: what's good for us is the most important thing to me.
Speaker 1: I'll look at the world through the lens of are
Speaker 1: people getting what they need? People have what they need?
Speaker 1: Particularly in this case, I'm asking America to be the
Speaker 1: police for the entire world. Particularly in this case, America.
Speaker 2: Is involved, yeah, very much involved. Without being involved in
Speaker 2: America's involved.
Speaker 1: So if America is involved, and you know, three cents
Speaker 1: out of every dollar that I have are going to
Speaker 1: the Defense Department or whatever the number is probably more
Speaker 1: than that, then what I want to know is that
Speaker 1: the people in charge have values and beliefs about the
Speaker 1: value and sanctity of human life that align with mine.
Speaker 2: Well, the only candidate that's running that, it's Corner West
Speaker 2: that shares those I feel like, because everybody else I
Speaker 2: feel like is very much.
Speaker 1: This is what I mean. It's not a Biden thing,
Speaker 1: it's not Trump thing. It's an American thing. America.
Speaker 2: I think that's the most support.
Speaker 1: Here's here's the deal and the killing of Jeffrey Epstein,
Speaker 1: and my god, it's like, it's like, but here's the thing.
Speaker 1: This is what I'm saying. I'm saying is this. I'm
Speaker 1: saying that I have a problem with their being with
Speaker 1: having allies, the problem with America being like like in
Speaker 1: a cultural or economic or even a military alliance with Israel.
Speaker 1: The problem becomes when things are being rubber stamped that
Speaker 1: as an American citizen, I think go against our stated
Speaker 1: morals and.
Speaker 2: Goals value the values of the country.
Speaker 1: I have never been upheld or things that go against mind,
Speaker 1: and I'm allowed to say. Hey, you know what, I
Speaker 1: want everybody to be safe. I want everybody to feel
Speaker 1: safe in their own home. I love the fact that
Speaker 1: there's a place where Jews can go and they can
Speaker 1: feel at home and they can feel safe. I want
Speaker 1: everybody to have that. But at the same time, what
Speaker 1: I want is for power in the world to be responsible.
Speaker 1: That's it.
Speaker 2: That's beautiful, beautifully said.
Speaker 1: Look we out. I gotta say something real before I go.
Speaker 1: I'm fucking with Catus Tea and everything that you're doing. Baby, Thanks.
Speaker 2: My mixtapes coming soon.
Speaker 1: Catus t mixtape coming soon. Joe Rogan in word situation,
Speaker 1: I'm a I'm a. I'm a By the end of
Speaker 1: the week. When is this dropping? Uh? Probably Friday, Okay,
Speaker 1: So by next Friday. By next Friday, you gonna be
Speaker 1: Donald Trump.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 1: Because I'm gonna write this headline, adopted this headline. I'm
Speaker 1: gonna go, they're very fine people. I'm gonna find I'm
Speaker 1: gonna find all the other stuff you did for some subassets.
Speaker 1: I got you. Not fuck with what you've been talking.
Speaker 2: I appreciate it.
Speaker 1: Yeah,