Speaker 1: Do you remember when we went riding together. I was
Speaker 1: on my Friesian Rins and peck us that we had
Speaker 1: a little altercation. You don't. How can I forget? I
Speaker 1: can see everything and stop motions. Brendan Fraser was part
Speaker 1: of the entertainment business in the nineteen nineties and early
Speaker 1: two thousands. You saw him in George of the Jungle,
Speaker 1: Gods and Monsters, and the Mummy series, to name a few.
Speaker 1: He was everywhere, but then he seemed to take a
Speaker 1: step back from it all. In two and twenty two,
Speaker 1: Brendan re emerged with his latest film called The Whale.
Speaker 1: In the film, Brendan plays Charlie, a housebound six hundred
Speaker 1: pound man striving to reconnect with his daughter. The Whale
Speaker 1: has received several accolades and Brendan one Best Actor prize
Speaker 1: at the Critics Choice Awards. Just last month. He even
Speaker 1: received his first Oscar nomination for his role. The film
Speaker 1: promises to give you a glimpse into the often complex
Speaker 1: nature of life. I found it to be fascinating and
Speaker 1: Brendan's performance to be excellent. It's a pleasure to sit
Speaker 1: down with Brendan today to talk about his latest film.
Speaker 1: Welcome to my podcast friend in I'm so happy that
Speaker 1: you're able to talk to us today. Me. I'm so
Speaker 1: glad to be her brother. And we've seen each other
Speaker 1: often on You were a neighbor for a while. Did
Speaker 1: you sell your property in Bedford? No, I still am
Speaker 1: your neighbor. There was oh you are Yeah, there was
Speaker 1: one piece. I had two of them, but I did
Speaker 1: sell one. Yes, But you were on my TV show
Speaker 1: several times. We did some really great segments together. You
Speaker 1: were so active in the movies. What made you kind
Speaker 1: of step back a little bit? I want to get
Speaker 1: to that life. I had kids, I had moved from
Speaker 1: Los Angeles to upstate New York to Bedford. I wanted
Speaker 1: to raise them in a neighborhood that had proper seasons.
Speaker 1: I mean, Los Angeles is great, but it's seventy seven
Speaker 1: degrees all the time mostly, and it can become you know,
Speaker 1: a bit. It's hard to mark time in in La
Speaker 1: for me, like, you only really know the passage of
Speaker 1: seasons by whatever you see on the mannequins window dressing
Speaker 1: in the department stores on Wilshire Avenue, So you know,
Speaker 1: to put a scarfod and you go, oh wow, look
Speaker 1: at that it must be December. But that's in La
Speaker 1: But certainly living in upstate where you are, where we are,
Speaker 1: there's so much more variety. I think it just makes
Speaker 1: you feel more connected to where you are, and it's
Speaker 1: easier to mark the passage of time. I find too.
Speaker 1: You know, a lot of a lot of Los Angeles
Speaker 1: people are moving to Bedford. It seems like this is
Speaker 1: now because the Los Angeles of the east, so many,
Speaker 1: so many people in your profession and the movies and
Speaker 1: theater are moving to our town. And I'm so happy
Speaker 1: because it's like an infusion of excitement here. Oh good,
Speaker 1: and uh and I want you to stay here. I
Speaker 1: want to go riding with you somewhere. Are you going
Speaker 1: to still ride? I would like that very much, Martha.
Speaker 1: My Fresians are waiting for you. Oh good. I should
Speaker 1: mention that my beloved horse Pecas has gone on to
Speaker 1: the Rainbow Bridge and greener pastors. Well you were you
Speaker 1: were used Pecas in a in a film, in a series,
Speaker 1: didn't you. That's where I met him, was, yeah, Durango, Mexico.
Speaker 1: We were doing Texas Rangers in eighteen thirty six, and
Speaker 1: everybody here's an epic and we were all assigned a horse,
Speaker 1: and I bonded with mine, and you brought him north.
Speaker 1: I sure did. He went overland from Durango all the
Speaker 1: way up to Juarez, Mexico, and that the border. He
Speaker 1: survived two quarantines, got on a FedEx plane in El
Speaker 1: Paso and they flew him to JFK. And then he
Speaker 1: marched right off the plane and he went into his
Speaker 1: barnstall as if it had always been there. And the
Speaker 1: guys who delivered him, they were they were like, we've
Speaker 1: been doing this for a long time. And I just
Speaker 1: gotta say, your horse walked on like he owned the
Speaker 1: place and wanted to know what the movie was on
Speaker 1: the flight and what's for lunch. But he wanted to
Speaker 1: be with you, obviously. I think he knew he had
Speaker 1: a good thing coming, and he surely deserved it. I
Speaker 1: gave him a job because he needed. He was a
Speaker 1: staff horse. What does that mean? He would pull the
Speaker 1: plow or the battle wagon in days of yore. He needed,
Speaker 1: he needed, he was he had a real ethic. It's
Speaker 1: sort of duty bound. He was a workhorse. Yes, there
Speaker 1: Ago properly said um. And my son, who has an
Speaker 1: intellectual disability, was perfect for him. They were matched so
Speaker 1: well because even if if Griffin didn't want to ride
Speaker 1: that day, or just didn't want to ride for you know,
Speaker 1: too long, he was content to just get a bucket
Speaker 1: and a brush and kids on the spectrum. They loved
Speaker 1: that repetitive motion and the horse loves it, and he
Speaker 1: loved it. It was really a beautiful thing to behold.
Speaker 1: I got some great pictures of him too. Well. Do
Speaker 1: you remember when we went riding together. I was on
Speaker 1: my freesian rins and you and Pecos that we had
Speaker 1: a little altercation. Do you don't remind me? How can
Speaker 1: I forget? I can see everything and stop motions for
Speaker 1: one reason or another. My horse took offense to your
Speaker 1: horse's partner, sniffing him from behind. And I never saw
Speaker 1: Pecas do this before, but he loaded up with both
Speaker 1: cannons and went boom and put it in your horse's chest.
Speaker 1: I was more if I everybody dove at the horses
Speaker 1: to you know, separate them and calm them and everything.
Speaker 1: But and it wasn't my horse, It was the other horse.
Speaker 1: It wasn't your horse. You were no yep, and oh brother,
Speaker 1: So you see, Brenda and I do have do have
Speaker 1: history still speaking after that, Martha, I am indeed. So,
Speaker 1: why after your little hiatus which was how many years?
Speaker 1: How many years, didn't you make a movie? Um, well,
Speaker 1: a feature film. I think I only had a stretch
Speaker 1: up about two or three years so long. I mean,
Speaker 1: I've only always been busy with something a television series,
Speaker 1: you know, a part. I did a lot of voice
Speaker 1: work and those those. At that time, I was a
Speaker 1: long time player on a show called Doom Patrol, which
Speaker 1: was also voice work. I voiced a robot named Cliff Steel,
Speaker 1: and I was kept busy. I never felt as if
Speaker 1: I was completely removed from the business. But in feature films,
Speaker 1: it also came at a time in my career and
Speaker 1: in the industry when it seemed like most films were
Speaker 1: going through growing pains to size up or down given
Speaker 1: the new platforms of technology, to bring them straight to streaming,
Speaker 1: or should they release to a big, wider release and
Speaker 1: a big screen. So as a result, I had to
Speaker 1: get creative and find different things to do to just
Speaker 1: keep myself active. Did you see what Steven Spielberg said
Speaker 1: about the new Tom Cruise movie No today? Oh, he
Speaker 1: said a very nice thing. He said that it kind
Speaker 1: of saved not only the movie industry, it saved the
Speaker 1: theater industry and because of the pandemic, and that just
Speaker 1: what you were saying. It was it for streaming, was
Speaker 1: it for release in the theaters? Steven Spielberg really thinks
Speaker 1: that Top Gun was the movie of the year for
Speaker 1: preserving the movie industry, and it's kind of fun to
Speaker 1: think about that. Uncontestable. I agree with him. Well, your
Speaker 1: newest film was so great. It's a fantastic movie. I really,
Speaker 1: I really thought your performance was extraordinary. We sat in
Speaker 1: the movie theater quietly. It was like dead silence. Everybody
Speaker 1: was concentrating so much on you and on your acting.
Speaker 1: It was just an incredible experience. And here we are
Speaker 1: in a movie theater finally, and we watched that performance
Speaker 1: of yours playing a six hundred pound reclusive man. What
Speaker 1: was the objective of the movie, Well, Charlie is familiar
Speaker 1: to audiences and certainly was to me. When I read
Speaker 1: this greenplay, I felt like I knew this guy, or
Speaker 1: I know him. He's relentlessly positive. He's an educator, he's
Speaker 1: a father, he's an English professor right his students. He
Speaker 1: teaches online and for complex reasons of his personal shame.
Speaker 1: He keeps the camera turned off. He's a man who
Speaker 1: has lived with certain regrets after having blighted his marriage
Speaker 1: when he fell in head over heels in love and
Speaker 1: made a decision to leave his wife and live with
Speaker 1: that man. And in the transition, his daughter was compromised,
Speaker 1: and she was only eight years old. And we find
Speaker 1: him around nine ten years later at the start of
Speaker 1: the film, and he's still alone. His partner is gone.
Speaker 1: He died and died right correct, and he feels intense remorse.
Speaker 1: And he is clearly in poor health as he has been.
Speaker 1: He's been harming himself by overconsumption and it's it's a
Speaker 1: needing disorder that he has. But that's not so important
Speaker 1: apart from the fact that he is quite unhealthy and
Speaker 1: he has very little time left. And so if he's
Speaker 1: going to redeem himself in a way that's meaningful, he
Speaker 1: needs to reconnect with his daughter, who's named Ellie, and
Speaker 1: she's played by a wonderful actress called Sadie Sink, who
Speaker 1: your listeners might remember from recently from Stranger Things. She's terrific, terrific.
Speaker 1: Hitch I thought she was totally brilliant in her part.
Speaker 1: She was just intensely against making friends with you her dad.
Speaker 1: Her take on the character was that she was a
Speaker 1: very hurt little girl still and that pain was manifested
Speaker 1: in this very focused rage. That's eighty as a particular brand,
Speaker 1: she should. She's unique in the energy that she brings
Speaker 1: every day. Martha, I felt like I was just smitten,
Speaker 1: falling off of my chair watching this kid do her job,
Speaker 1: and she was constantly getting the gold star every single day.
Speaker 1: I mean, her talent really is pressing it for someone
Speaker 1: as young as she is. Well, so was your caregiver fantastic?
Speaker 1: That's Hong Chow. She Wow. She plays Liz Hang Chow
Speaker 1: is a brilliant actress who has and tell me what
Speaker 1: you think. She seems like she can convey so much
Speaker 1: just in the pauses and the silence is in between
Speaker 1: lines of spoken dialogue, and she has such a gravity
Speaker 1: and authenticity that she she brings to this role of
Speaker 1: Charlie's best friend also his de facto caregiver. Charlie is
Speaker 1: homebound his mobile homebound. It is an issue for him
Speaker 1: and he can't step outside his door for the fact
Speaker 1: that he just doesn't have the wind to do it.
Speaker 1: His body weighs hundreds and hundreds of pounds, and he's
Speaker 1: mobile with a walker at first, and then Liz gifts
Speaker 1: him a mobility chair. And it's important that he is
Speaker 1: stranded on a corner apartment on the second floor in Anywhere, Idaho,
Speaker 1: just to really drive home the point of how isolated
Speaker 1: he is. The whole film takes place inside that two
Speaker 1: bedroom apartment. So how many days did it take to
Speaker 1: film the film? About thirty two or three work days,
Speaker 1: so it was six day weeks. So it was the
Speaker 1: winter of twenty twenty one in Newburgh, New York. So
Speaker 1: you were there for six weeks, yes, and filming how
Speaker 1: long were the days? We see? It seemed like it
Speaker 1: was always daytime. Yeah. Well, it's a dark apartment that
Speaker 1: he lives in, and then as the film goes on
Speaker 1: and as Charlie has revelations, it becomes brighter and lighter
Speaker 1: until he's literally going to the lights. And that's important too.
Speaker 1: Matt Matdie Libatique is the cinematographer who made sure that
Speaker 1: Because this film is based on the stage play by
Speaker 1: Samuel D. Hunter, who produced it initially in twenty twelve
Speaker 1: at New Horizons in the city where Darren Aronovsky, our director,
Speaker 1: first saw it and became so fixated that he had
Speaker 1: to make it into a movie. The story that happens
Speaker 1: inside Charlie's apartment is very often mirrored by the weather
Speaker 1: systems that hit the windows, by what's going on outside.
Speaker 1: And this film still has not a theatrical but more
Speaker 1: of a presentational aspect to it, because it's translated from
Speaker 1: the stage production. And it's important that the story takes
Speaker 1: place inside this little apartment, because I don't think it
Speaker 1: would what do you think, I don't think it would
Speaker 1: be the same movie experience if we went and found
Speaker 1: out where Liz works, or if she went to the
Speaker 1: grocery store or oh no, you know no. It was
Speaker 1: so much It was so much like a play, but
Speaker 1: so expansive at the same time. And that has a
Speaker 1: lot to do with with your performance, of course, and
Speaker 1: the and the other performances in that movie. How long
Speaker 1: did it take for you to actually get into the
Speaker 1: character of Charlie. Well, we had a three week rehearsal,
Speaker 1: which is rare for films, but A twenty four who
Speaker 1: was producing this was supportive of Darren's requirements, and so
Speaker 1: then we approached it as would as he said, we
Speaker 1: are now a theater company. On day zero and we
Speaker 1: worked on a taped out one to one mock up
Speaker 1: of the apartment in rehearsal hall. We watched each other's
Speaker 1: scene work. As with a theater company, we figured out
Speaker 1: the blocking. In that way, Darren could get an idea
Speaker 1: about no actually, you know, create a shot list about
Speaker 1: where he's going to put his camera to tell the story.
Speaker 1: So we had all of that homework done before we arrived.
Speaker 1: On how many people were in the room with you
Speaker 1: at all times, there were a few because again this
Speaker 1: is a film that was made in time of COVID,
Speaker 1: so there were precautions and you know, all of the
Speaker 1: protocols in place. But was helpful because we could get
Speaker 1: back to work. Although we were all of us taking
Speaker 1: a calculated risk, and none of that's lost on anyone
Speaker 1: who's worked during the period between twenty nineteen say twenty two.
Speaker 1: Everyone who chose to come and make this move was
Speaker 1: really invested in it in a way that I think
Speaker 1: heightened the very film itself. It's incredible. So how long
Speaker 1: did it shake for you to get dressed well? Because
Speaker 1: your your your outfit was also your body. Clearly, he's
Speaker 1: a man who has a challenge of obesity, and he
Speaker 1: has to be created and depicted faithfully, respectfully and with dignity.
Speaker 1: And that meant an elaborate prosthetic makeup which was created,
Speaker 1: which was also nominated for an Oscar. Adrian Moreau is
Speaker 1: a long collaborator of Darren's. Yeah, incredible, thank you, I'll
Speaker 1: tell him, he said. So he worked outside of the
Speaker 1: traditional life cast molding process where you pour the goop
Speaker 1: on your face and then from that create a bust
Speaker 1: and from that sculpt or compound and create the appliances
Speaker 1: that are then put on to the living actor's face.
Speaker 1: Again in that for one we couldn't get together because
Speaker 1: of COVID, and two this had to be seamless, so
Speaker 1: I was scanned by the producer in my driveway with
Speaker 1: an iPad. That data went to Adrian. He created Charlie's
Speaker 1: body from head to toe, each and every pore. He
Speaker 1: approached that body, that character makeup as if it were
Speaker 1: a texture map. It's that precise, down to the size
Speaker 1: of the pores, the placement of little skin anomalies, etc.
Speaker 1: And that's important because he was able to three D
Speaker 1: print the busts that would create the applications that could
Speaker 1: be put on me. So when you watch the film
Speaker 1: The Whale, it's arresting at first for the first five
Speaker 1: minutes because clearly its audience is going, wow, that's Brendan Fraser.
Speaker 1: He's changed. But after five minutes because you don't notice
Speaker 1: that it's a makeup any longer. You've invest yourself in
Speaker 1: the story and kind of fall in love with this guy.
Speaker 1: And to create that, it meant a six hour initial
Speaker 1: makeup test to see if or not we had a movie,
Speaker 1: because in absence of the makeup or an audience second
Speaker 1: guessing what a makeup artist has done because they see
Speaker 1: the you know, the seams or the construction lines as
Speaker 1: it were, and disbelieve it, we would lose our audience.
Speaker 1: But with a three D printing process, there's nothing to
Speaker 1: be detected. And this is not a digital creation, as
Speaker 1: has been incorrectly reported in the medium. Your eyes are
Speaker 1: always you and that's amazing that unpold was a rule
Speaker 1: that Darren gave to Adrian that he couldn't, you know,
Speaker 1: restrict the face my face, because you know it's it's
Speaker 1: essentially mask work and costume work. But still he needed that,
Speaker 1: you know, the human connection, and you know that had
Speaker 1: his own set of challenges marked there because when you
Speaker 1: put a silicate application on your face, and if I would,
Speaker 1: you know, play a scene where my my heart would
Speaker 1: get beating and maybe I'd flush and get red, but
Speaker 1: clearly the part that was artificial wouldn't. So you know,
Speaker 1: we had to we had to. We had to keep
Speaker 1: a real close eye on matching the colors and everything.
Speaker 1: But I was going to tell you that the rule
Speaker 1: also was that this was a makeup that must obey
Speaker 1: the laws of gravity and physics, that it had to
Speaker 1: have a weighted quality to it. It was filled with,
Speaker 1: you know, instead of what has been used in films
Speaker 1: and TV forever have been actors and really kind of
Speaker 1: a Halloween costume type effect that's filled with cotton batting,
Speaker 1: and it's an athletic or fit actor giving a performance
Speaker 1: that defies gravity. And our Charlie needed to have the authenticity,
Speaker 1: that the identity that that this required so that we
Speaker 1: didn't feel like we're putting quotation marks around this character. No,
Speaker 1: and it was it was incredibly realistic. Incredibly did you
Speaker 1: study obese obesity and obese people for the party. I
Speaker 1: met with the Obesity Action Coalition, who are a remarkable
Speaker 1: advocacy group who attend. They're members who number in the
Speaker 1: tens of thousands across the country in Canada, and I
Speaker 1: hope they're expanding. I know that as a result of
Speaker 1: this movie, their work is getting their mission statements and
Speaker 1: the bias against those who live with obesity, and they
Speaker 1: are already seeing that the support that they're receiving and
Speaker 1: the number of people who are actually having the emboldening
Speaker 1: themselves by seeing this movie to ask for help when
Speaker 1: otherwise they wouldn't have been. It's already starting to make
Speaker 1: a difference than Oh good, this is a film that's
Speaker 1: changing hearts and minds. I can attest to oh good,
Speaker 1: that's wondered I did. I did meet with them because
Speaker 1: it was important for us to have their sensibilities and
Speaker 1: to observe the sensitivities that come with bringing this story
Speaker 1: to the screen. Their mission statement is really just to
Speaker 1: end the bias against those who live with obesity, and
Speaker 1: we see it in our culture. We see it in
Speaker 1: the media, and there's terminology and there are you know,
Speaker 1: vernacular in words that we still use that we can
Speaker 1: retire we don't need anymore that are actually hurtful to people.
Speaker 1: And I say that not just because you shouldn't be
Speaker 1: mean to one another. I mean, we kind of know that,
Speaker 1: but we should be reminded of it, but because there
Speaker 1: really are healthcare ramifications, real risk to people's bodies by
Speaker 1: how we speak to one another. By harming their confidence
Speaker 1: at an early age, sets in motion a pattern that's
Speaker 1: very hard for people to break, and it can become
Speaker 1: a can It can take a child, for instance, a
Speaker 1: lifetime of feeling as if they've being you can feel
Speaker 1: less than who they are, and that affects their health.
Speaker 1: Given that Charlie is a character who eats to self
Speaker 1: medicate with food, and he does effectively eat his trauma,
Speaker 1: and the result of that trauma is represented in the
Speaker 1: size of his body, so clearly he's a man in
Speaker 1: a lot of emotional pain. Working with the OAC gave
Speaker 1: me a certainty that I had a mission of my
Speaker 1: own and to be their voice. And Tom approach this
Speaker 1: job with my job with all of the dignity that
Speaker 1: I believe that it's owed. It is um so interesting
Speaker 1: that you are You are making a difference for the
Speaker 1: for the world of obesity, society considers it to be
Speaker 1: some sort of moral failing or fault of the individual.
Speaker 1: I don't think those who live with obesity really have
Speaker 1: had a fair shake, to tell you the truth, and
Speaker 1: that's just a personal view. But since what the turn
Speaker 1: of the twentieth century, foods have become processed, high end sugars,
Speaker 1: empty calories, etc. Cheaply produced and really placeholders as far
Speaker 1: as nutrition go. And on top of that in a
Speaker 1: way that if you look at it, it's not fair
Speaker 1: that the flavors are fabricated, often in laboratories by scientists
Speaker 1: who have targeted your taste buds to make it almost
Speaker 1: impossible to not have just one. You have to have
Speaker 1: the whole box, if not the shelf, and that is
Speaker 1: what sets a cycle in motion. And I have empathy
Speaker 1: and sympathy for those who find themselves on the receiving
Speaker 1: end of that. But the good news is there is
Speaker 1: there is a way through it, if you can summon
Speaker 1: the courage to ask for help. And I can tell
Speaker 1: you now again I'm receiving messages from around the world
Speaker 1: from There was a man in the UK. It was
Speaker 1: reported by BBC he had just seen the trailer for
Speaker 1: the whale, and he said, that's my story. I live
Speaker 1: at home with the camera turned off and I work
Speaker 1: from my computer. He won't leave his apartment. He is
Speaker 1: estranged from his daughter, and it is a story they
Speaker 1: can identify with and give him the courage to say,
Speaker 1: I want to make a change in my life now.
Speaker 1: And he will pursue, for instance, a bariatric procedure. And
Speaker 1: that's positive right there. This character, Charlie, he could save
Speaker 1: lives if he has not already. Well, congratulations on that.
Speaker 1: That is amazing. It's a really really unusual film. It's
Speaker 1: a heartbreaking film. It's a heartrending film. Your character emotes
Speaker 1: so many different different feelings. And I wish you well
Speaker 1: with the oscars, by the way, would that be great?
Speaker 1: It would be great. Who are you up against? Oh,
Speaker 1: let's see, there's some great performances this year. There's Austin
Speaker 1: Butler and Elvis oh yeah, Colin Farrell in Banshee's of
Speaker 1: Innes Sharing, Oh yeah, Bill Nihey in Living and um,
Speaker 1: I'm Paul mescal in After Sun and All. And they're
Speaker 1: also different. I mean they're so different. I think all
Speaker 1: the first time nominees too, Oh boy. And it should
Speaker 1: be it should be. I remember Bill Nihey's been saying
Speaker 1: that that he had never expected it. Um and uh
Speaker 1: and Elvis, Oh my god, what a great performance. But
Speaker 1: oh amazing. It is a very difficult field this year.
Speaker 1: Oh well, best of luck, Bred, Thank you my neighbor.
Speaker 1: Well why do you think you were cast in the role?
Speaker 1: Darren Aronofsky is a world class filmmaker. He has never
Speaker 1: offered up any easy answers to the human condition in
Speaker 1: his movies Bury You to Look Away, and he presents
Speaker 1: the spiky sides of life that maybe we would circumnavigate
Speaker 1: or avoid, but because we want to know, we watch
Speaker 1: his films and they're unflinching for that night. I deeply
Speaker 1: admire him as a filmmaker and have done as he
Speaker 1: and I both kind of came up in the industry
Speaker 1: around the same time, from the nineties until now. Had
Speaker 1: you ever worked with him before? No, I'm not, Martha.
Speaker 1: The word was out that he wanted to make it,
Speaker 1: that he was going to make a movie, and he
Speaker 1: was interested in meeting me, and that was astonishing, and
Speaker 1: the answer was yes, I do want to. But I
Speaker 1: automatically felt a real healthy measure of creative intimidation, I'll
Speaker 1: admit to you. But when I met him at his
Speaker 1: offices in twenty he was a gentleman and he presented
Speaker 1: to me the challenge he had before him as a director, UM,
Speaker 1: which was to cast this role of Charlie, a man
Speaker 1: whose body weighs hundreds and hundreds of pounds. And he
Speaker 1: had been forthcoming that he had met many, many, many
Speaker 1: actors for a ten year period and just didn't find
Speaker 1: what what said, Yes, this is correct for him, And
Speaker 1: like I said, you know, you didn't get the indication.
Speaker 1: He's a very single he's a very singular vision when
Speaker 1: he makes something. UM. And he had seen I think
Speaker 1: a trailer from something I did in a film that
Speaker 1: was in sal Paulo, Brazil a number of years before.
Speaker 1: He was on a YouTube rabbit hole or so he says,
Speaker 1: and he had I popped up and he went, you know, lightbulb,
Speaker 1: it would mean wearing that elaborate costume and makeup. It
Speaker 1: was cumbersome. It was, it was. It was I forgot
Speaker 1: to say this earlier. It was filled with you know,
Speaker 1: instead of like I said, traditionally the or previously like
Speaker 1: sort of cotton batting. It was, it was filled with
Speaker 1: different combinations of pellets and what are they those orbis pellets? Garden, Yeah,
Speaker 1: sort of gelatine they yes, they have some weight to it.
Speaker 1: So like I say, Charlie's body must obey physics and gravity.
Speaker 1: How many hours a day were you in it? Twelve
Speaker 1: to fourteen? Yes, it was exhausting, and yes it gave
Speaker 1: me an appreciation in the most unique way to feel
Speaker 1: what an emulation of what it feels like to live
Speaker 1: in a body of that size. And something interesting happened
Speaker 1: I was not expecting. When it came off each day
Speaker 1: and took an hour to get out of, I still
Speaker 1: felt as if I was carrying that. I still felt
Speaker 1: a sense of like vertigo, you know when you get
Speaker 1: out of a boat and you step out of the
Speaker 1: dock and for a moment you get you who whoa.
Speaker 1: You know. I had that undulation. And I think that
Speaker 1: because it was my own brend in my body was
Speaker 1: responding to having the exertion, pressure and weight on it
Speaker 1: and from all different sides. And I was adapting in
Speaker 1: a way but confusing myself by taking it on and
Speaker 1: off enough. And I think what it did is just
Speaker 1: it drove home for me how the very tactile sensation
Speaker 1: of living in that body, must feel it affected the
Speaker 1: way I could breathe. It gave me a sort of
Speaker 1: a wheezing sound. But it looked like that, it looked
Speaker 1: like you were really really belaboring the weight. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's just like incredible. I was to an extent affecting
Speaker 1: a performance to sell that it was heavier than it
Speaker 1: really was. Did you find that that you felt like
Speaker 1: you had sympathy for this individual? Oh, totally, because he
Speaker 1: was He is a nice person, and he's smart, and
Speaker 1: he's stuck and he's depressed. All the bad things happening
Speaker 1: to this guy all at the same time. And then
Speaker 1: the daughter, you could tell she loved him, but she
Speaker 1: hated him and she's very angry. It feels like we
Speaker 1: all have you know that individual, that optimistic man who
Speaker 1: is a man of letters or a person of letter
Speaker 1: that we know. I know it Charlie. I've known versions
Speaker 1: of Charlie's throughout my own life. So you have three sons, yes,
Speaker 1: So this is ultimately a story about fatherhood and uh,
Speaker 1: and you are you spent? Do you spend a lot
Speaker 1: of time with your kids? They're they're they're finishing up
Speaker 1: school and they can't do it fast enough right now
Speaker 1: because they're eager to get out into the world. Ones
Speaker 1: just started driving. Well, both of them have. Actually my
Speaker 1: oldest son who I mentioned on the spectrum, he's a
Speaker 1: big kid too. Well, you say on the spectrum, does
Speaker 1: he have autism? Correct? Yes, yes, his body is large,
Speaker 1: but he's also like a sis fifteen foot triple wide eyed.
Speaker 1: I met him. I met him. You brought hup to
Speaker 1: dinner to Marco's house. Yeah, and uh, and he seemed
Speaker 1: a pleasant young man. There's twenty. We were there to
Speaker 1: listen to a violinist who is brilliant and he's keenly
Speaker 1: interested in music. He always has been. And while having
Speaker 1: a conversation with him may seem halted, he is able
Speaker 1: to convey his wants and his needs and two word
Speaker 1: sentences or little bursts, and other than that, he's the
Speaker 1: most intuitive. He understands everything. You know once you I
Speaker 1: learned as a father that once I thought was Griffin
Speaker 1: getting this. Yeah, he is, Believe me. He knows everything
Speaker 1: going on around him, but he doesn't need to be
Speaker 1: talking about it so much like you're listening to me
Speaker 1: blather on and on and on. I think he's got
Speaker 1: this thing sorted out to tell you the truth. Oh great,
Speaker 1: and you're a you're a really lovely father. So of
Speaker 1: all the films you've done in your career, and you've
Speaker 1: done a lot, Uh, which film did you enjoy most making? Wow? Well,
Speaker 1: I'm going to cheat and say there're aspects of not
Speaker 1: all of them, but many, many of them. I can
Speaker 1: remember every day at work on my very first film,
Speaker 1: which was school Ties in nineteen ninety one to ninety two,
Speaker 1: and it was a big deal for me. It was
Speaker 1: a breakthrough role. I worked alongside Matt Damon and Ben
Speaker 1: Affleck and Cole Houser, big cast. It was modeled kind
Speaker 1: of on the model of the film Diner, which was
Speaker 1: very big in the eighties, which introduce I Love Diner.
Speaker 1: So school Ties was a first film for me, and
Speaker 1: you know, I was enchanted for what I was learning
Speaker 1: and the fact I was pinching myself to just be there.
Speaker 1: As the story of a kid who goes to a
Speaker 1: prep school and he's only allowed to be there because
Speaker 1: he's a very good quarterback, and the school is willing
Speaker 1: to overlook that he is Jewish because they don't approve,
Speaker 1: but they do need glory brought to them. So he's
Speaker 1: a ringer who can throw football. But he has to
Speaker 1: make a decision about whether or not to own who
Speaker 1: he is essentially fundamentally, or to play along. And he's
Speaker 1: he's he has that he has a real moral dilemma.
Speaker 1: He does make a mistake, but he learns from it
Speaker 1: that that's the film school Ties. If you haven't seen it,
Speaker 1: I encourage you to check it out. It it holds
Speaker 1: up really well. So what's next you have? I think
Speaker 1: you have a movie coming out this spring? Another movie
Speaker 1: I worked Get This. I worked with Martin Scorsese. Can
Speaker 1: you be a deal? It is your first movie with
Speaker 1: him him? Yes, oh boy. I had a small part
Speaker 1: and a epic piece that he has done with the
Speaker 1: usual round of Robert de Niro, Leonardo DiCaprio. I worked
Speaker 1: with John Listgow. It's the story of the Osage Indian
Speaker 1: nation at the turn of the nineteenth century. In the
Speaker 1: twentieth century, when mineral rights were being appropriated by the
Speaker 1: locals in Oklahoma, who were bending a lot of rules
Speaker 1: to be kind and essentially stealing back the oil from
Speaker 1: the inhabitants who had been sent there. The Native American
Speaker 1: Indian nation. Yes, Um, so look at the Scorsese movie
Speaker 1: is epic and scope. We were in um, I think
Speaker 1: it wasn't It was a Baptist church and they completely
Speaker 1: remodeled the inside of it to make it look like
Speaker 1: brand new Federalist court architecture in you know, nineteen twenty something.
Speaker 1: And they built the pews, every the molding, everything, none
Speaker 1: of it's cg and filled it with a and Martin
Speaker 1: shot a courtroom scene with four cameras, quadruple coverage, one
Speaker 1: long single takes, one long take with a courthouse fooled
Speaker 1: with people who actually had were descendants of the Osage
Speaker 1: Indian nations, a court, a jury, everything like that, and
Speaker 1: it felt like living in again, like a theatrical production.
Speaker 1: It was quite remarkable experience for me. But that'll be
Speaker 1: I don't have a date for it, but yeah, coming up.
Speaker 1: So you're out in California a period and all these things.
Speaker 1: What do you do with your family? Did you come
Speaker 1: back and forth? Oh? Yeah, I've been. I've been racking
Speaker 1: up a lot of sky miles lately. Um, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: bring my kids with me to the Oscars. That that's
Speaker 1: my reward right there, No matter what the result is
Speaker 1: what else should people know about you Brendon? About me? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm handy at a grill. Oh good, I like playing
Speaker 1: with knives and fire like let the boys do um.
Speaker 1: I do archery to relax and clear my mind. Oh
Speaker 1: I just got a whole bunch of bows and arrows
Speaker 1: where wow? Really right here in bed for you? So
Speaker 1: you come over, really nice ones, This is for you know,
Speaker 1: for for archery. I love archery. I was on the
Speaker 1: archery team at Barnard, and so I want to I
Speaker 1: want to pick up my skill again. And my grandchildren,
Speaker 1: my two grandchildren love archery, so that'd be fun. So
Speaker 1: you have to come over. You're gonna ride one of
Speaker 1: You're gonna ride one of my Freezians, and then you're
Speaker 1: gonna show us your skills as an archer. I will do.
Speaker 1: Do you know what kind of bows are? They are?
Speaker 1: They recurve bows, long, recur recurve bows. And there's a
Speaker 1: good there's a good strong one for you. Oh god,
Speaker 1: you have to get them different, a different, you know,
Speaker 1: different strengths for younger and older. But yeah, you want
Speaker 1: to like a fifteen pound poll or yeah, I think
Speaker 1: I made a mistake and I think I got, I got,
Speaker 1: I got a couple of big ones by mistake, but
Speaker 1: they're here. Yeah, anything for some adults doesn't work for them.
Speaker 1: But well, thank you so much for joining us, and really,
Speaker 1: best of luck. We're rooting for you. We're rooting for
Speaker 1: the Whale as a movie. And your movie company actually
Speaker 1: got eighteen nominations for Oscars this year, didn't you. They're
Speaker 1: having a banner year, their manner year for a small
Speaker 1: new movie production company. It's really great. We'll give my
Speaker 1: best to them and are very very best to you,
Speaker 1: and thank you so much for your time. Thank you, Martha.
Speaker 1: Uh I hope to see you soon. See you soon
Speaker 1: in upstate New York. Bye bye for now,