WEBVTT - The Biden Presidency 0:00:01.920 --> 0:00:05.640 He drives a convertible corvette, likes wearing idiot or sunglasses. 0:00:05.640 --> 0:00:08.000 He likes going biking. His favorite treat in the world 0:00:08.119 --> 0:00:11.520 is ice cream. I mean, how damning can a man 0:00:11.560 --> 0:00:19.720 be if his favorite treat is ice cream. Welcome to 0:00:19.760 --> 0:00:23.319 One Day University Talks with the world's most engaging and 0:00:23.440 --> 0:00:28.760 inspiring professors discussing their most popular courses. This podcast is 0:00:28.800 --> 0:00:31.920 your chance to discover some of our top rated lectures 0:00:31.920 --> 0:00:36.320 on your own schedule. I'm Stephen Shragas. In the two 0:00:36.400 --> 0:00:40.159 years since his inauguration, President Joe Biden has had a 0:00:40.240 --> 0:00:44.400 lot on his plate. The COVID nineteen pandemic, threats of 0:00:44.400 --> 0:00:49.320 an economic recession, the war in Ukraine, the Afghanistan withdrawal, 0:00:49.960 --> 0:00:54.840 tensions with China, a divided and antagonistic Congress, not to 0:00:54.920 --> 0:01:00.400 mention controversies surrounding classified documents, and investigations targeting his son. 0:01:00.960 --> 0:01:03.200 It's hard in the moment to assess how well he's 0:01:03.240 --> 0:01:06.120 handling it all beyond just looking at his poll members. 0:01:06.680 --> 0:01:10.280 So we called in an expert. Professor Jeffrey Angel has 0:01:10.319 --> 0:01:14.679 given One Day University Talks on several presidents, from FDR 0:01:14.840 --> 0:01:18.880 to George HW. Bush. He's the founding director of the 0:01:18.959 --> 0:01:23.479 Center for Presidential History at Southern Methodist University and has 0:01:23.480 --> 0:01:27.760 written several books on American foreign policy. President Biden is 0:01:27.800 --> 0:01:31.880 the oldest sitting American president in history, and as Jeffrey explains, 0:01:32.480 --> 0:01:36.240 that means Biden understands how Washington has changed over the 0:01:36.319 --> 0:01:45.960 last half century. President Biden has one of the longest 0:01:46.120 --> 0:01:50.080 pre presidential records of any man who have ever upheld 0:01:50.120 --> 0:01:52.800 the obal office. There's two aspects of that, of course. First, 0:01:52.800 --> 0:01:56.280 he got started very young, and now he's also very old. 0:01:56.640 --> 0:01:59.920 And he was actually elected Senator at the age of 0:02:00.080 --> 0:02:03.480 twenty nine, before he was even eligible to sit in 0:02:03.480 --> 0:02:05.200 the Senate. Now it happens to be that the election 0:02:05.240 --> 0:02:07.240 was at when he's twenty nine, he turned thirty, which 0:02:07.280 --> 0:02:10.000 is a legal requirement age before the day who was 0:02:10.040 --> 0:02:11.960 supposed to be sworn ant. So there's nothing funny going 0:02:12.040 --> 0:02:14.280 on here. But he's just a remarkably young man and 0:02:14.320 --> 0:02:18.160 he spent all those years in the Senate from that 0:02:18.200 --> 0:02:21.680 time up until two thousand and eight, when Barack Obama 0:02:21.840 --> 0:02:26.080 chose him to be his vice president as an old hand, 0:02:26.200 --> 0:02:29.119 as a Washington expert, as a man who really understood 0:02:29.160 --> 0:02:31.880 how Washington worked. Which of course was useful for President Obama, 0:02:31.960 --> 0:02:33.359 who had only been in the Senate for a few 0:02:33.440 --> 0:02:35.600 years of that time, at least politically, to give the 0:02:35.639 --> 0:02:38.320 impression that he had an experienced hand coming with him. 0:02:38.400 --> 0:02:40.280 It really gives you a real good sense of how 0:02:40.400 --> 0:02:43.680 long President Biden had been there. He had been chair 0:02:43.720 --> 0:02:46.080 of the Judicial Committee, he had been on the Foreign 0:02:46.080 --> 0:02:48.639 Affairs Committee in the Senate for years. He was known 0:02:48.680 --> 0:02:52.920 as somebody who was willing to reach across the aisle, frankly, 0:02:52.919 --> 0:02:54.840 in a way that we don't see much in the 0:02:54.880 --> 0:02:59.359 Senate anymore. You could make a really good accusation against 0:02:59.600 --> 0:03:02.040 Senator or Biden in his last years that he was 0:03:02.480 --> 0:03:05.880 part of the problem that Washington had become too chummy, 0:03:05.919 --> 0:03:09.239 that senators, you know, essentially lived too long and worked 0:03:09.280 --> 0:03:11.040 too long together and had lost the fire in their 0:03:11.080 --> 0:03:14.000 bellies to fight out being issues. Frankly, I think today 0:03:14.000 --> 0:03:16.240 we'd like a little bit less fire in our Senate. 0:03:16.480 --> 0:03:19.200 But he was known during his time as being a 0:03:19.240 --> 0:03:24.840 man who was particularly interested in trying to be collegial 0:03:25.440 --> 0:03:30.640 now that oftentimes backfired. He most famously, was, of course, 0:03:30.720 --> 0:03:34.519 chair of the Judicial Committee when Anita Hill and Clarence 0:03:34.520 --> 0:03:39.920 Thomas had their famous controversy over his actions when Clarence 0:03:39.920 --> 0:03:42.640 Thomas was being reviewed for nomination for the Supreme Court, 0:03:43.000 --> 0:03:46.600 and Biden historically did not come off looking good at 0:03:46.640 --> 0:03:48.960 that point, because you know, he chaired a committee which 0:03:49.040 --> 0:03:51.560 was all men that they were asking inappropriate questions of 0:03:51.600 --> 0:03:53.720 a woman. But all of which is to say that 0:03:53.760 --> 0:03:56.320 gives a hauswle a sense that Biden was very interested 0:03:56.480 --> 0:03:58.640 throughout his career and at that moment in particular of 0:03:58.920 --> 0:04:02.160 trying to be even handed. Let me ask you, you're 0:04:02.200 --> 0:04:04.800 sort of an expert on leadership as well. I've heard 0:04:04.800 --> 0:04:07.320 you speak on that a few different times. Can you 0:04:07.360 --> 0:04:11.800 say something about Biden's leadership style, and while you're at it, 0:04:11.840 --> 0:04:16.160 his overall personality. You know, his overall personality is kind 0:04:16.160 --> 0:04:18.560 of uncle Joe or Grandpa Joe. And effectually it has 0:04:18.560 --> 0:04:20.479 always been that way, even when he was a younger man. 0:04:20.920 --> 0:04:25.360 You know, he speaks as an normal American middle class 0:04:25.560 --> 0:04:28.800 or blue collar worker would in a sense, he's never lost, 0:04:28.920 --> 0:04:31.200 as he would say, the Squinton where he grew up. 0:04:31.279 --> 0:04:34.040 He's never lost Delaware a small state feel where everybody 0:04:34.040 --> 0:04:38.400 knows everybody, and he likes to tell anecdotes. Now oftentimes 0:04:38.440 --> 0:04:42.440 those anecdotes go awry. They always have his entire career. 0:04:42.520 --> 0:04:44.720 One of the fascinating things for me watching Biden now, 0:04:45.040 --> 0:04:47.280 of course, when age is a critical element of how 0:04:47.279 --> 0:04:50.279 we understand his presidency, is how many people have focused 0:04:50.279 --> 0:04:53.680 on the fact that he misspeaks as an old man. 0:04:54.160 --> 0:04:57.920 He always misspoke as a young man for two reasons. First, 0:04:57.960 --> 0:05:02.560 because you know, some people make gaffs. I like to 0:05:02.640 --> 0:05:04.839 challenge all of my friends who like to criticize any 0:05:04.880 --> 0:05:07.680 politician for speaking, to have their words transcribed over the 0:05:07.720 --> 0:05:09.280 course of twenty four hours and see how well they 0:05:09.320 --> 0:05:12.320 stand up. But secondly, also an interesting aspect of President 0:05:12.360 --> 0:05:15.880 Biden's personal life, he actually had a severe stutter as 0:05:15.920 --> 0:05:20.200 a very young man and worked extremely hard hours spun hours, 0:05:20.200 --> 0:05:24.479 spun hours of solo labor to overcome that stutter. So 0:05:24.600 --> 0:05:26.640 every now and then when he has a gaff, one 0:05:26.720 --> 0:05:29.039 can still see that he is a person who has 0:05:29.080 --> 0:05:32.200 to think about forming words in a way perhaps a 0:05:32.279 --> 0:05:34.760 someway without a stutter does not, so it shows the 0:05:34.839 --> 0:05:37.440 sign of his perseverance. You know, he also likes to 0:05:37.480 --> 0:05:41.520 be fun. He drives a convertible corvette, likes wearing aviat 0:05:41.560 --> 0:05:44.120 or sunglasses. He likes going biking. His favorite treat in 0:05:44.160 --> 0:05:46.720 the world is ice cream. I mean, you know how 0:05:47.240 --> 0:05:49.160 damning can a man be if his favorite treat is 0:05:49.200 --> 0:05:52.080 ice cream. Let me ask you, Jeff, We're now two 0:05:52.160 --> 0:05:55.440 years into his presidency. How would you sum up the 0:05:55.440 --> 0:06:01.320 Biden presidency in just two or three sentences? Remarkably significant, 0:06:02.520 --> 0:06:09.880 remarkably accomplished, remarkably misunderstood. I think President Biden first and foremost, 0:06:10.080 --> 0:06:14.159 his main goal throughout his campaign was to win. Now, 0:06:14.240 --> 0:06:17.240 that's what most campaigns are about, but he took it 0:06:17.320 --> 0:06:22.120 as a personal challenge, and there's a lot of hubris 0:06:22.120 --> 0:06:25.239 in this as a personal challenge to defeat Donald Trump, 0:06:25.240 --> 0:06:28.839 who he saw as an existential threat to the nation. 0:06:29.040 --> 0:06:30.800 I mean, most people run for president and if their 0:06:30.839 --> 0:06:32.880 opponent wins, they say, well, galli, I guess we're going 0:06:32.920 --> 0:06:35.080 to be out of power for four years. Very rarely 0:06:35.160 --> 0:06:37.200 doesn't man run for president and say if I lose, 0:06:37.200 --> 0:06:40.159 we're going to lose democracy. That was what President Biden 0:06:40.480 --> 0:06:44.240 said on the campaign trail. So just his winning alone, 0:06:44.680 --> 0:06:47.600 in a sense, could give him the sense of accomplishment 0:06:47.680 --> 0:06:50.839 that I saved the nation, or at least postponed the 0:06:50.880 --> 0:06:54.760 death of democracy for four years. That's his view of things, 0:06:54.760 --> 0:06:56.520 to be sure, But I think we also need to 0:06:56.560 --> 0:07:00.360 remember that President Biden has accomplished a remarkable out I 0:07:00.360 --> 0:07:04.119 would put his legislative accomplishments up against almost anyone's since 0:07:04.160 --> 0:07:07.120 Franklin Roosevelt or Lyndon Johnson for the first two years 0:07:07.120 --> 0:07:09.359 of his presidency. We're not going to see anything like 0:07:09.400 --> 0:07:11.200 that for the second two years, of course, because now 0:07:11.240 --> 0:07:13.960 the House of Representatives is controlled by the opposing party. 0:07:14.320 --> 0:07:17.160 But if you think about the accomplishments in terms of 0:07:17.200 --> 0:07:21.200 the Build Back Better Plan, infrastructure, reworking healthcare, yet again, 0:07:21.400 --> 0:07:25.680 they are remarkable. But one critical thing is that Minden's misunderstood, 0:07:26.200 --> 0:07:29.080 and I think he's misunderstood for two particular reasons. First, 0:07:29.120 --> 0:07:35.080 because we have a particularly bifurcated and siloed media environment 0:07:35.240 --> 0:07:38.240 at this point in American history, where people essentially only 0:07:38.320 --> 0:07:40.360 listen to the news that they signed up to here, 0:07:40.800 --> 0:07:44.560 and so people only know the information that they get. 0:07:44.880 --> 0:07:47.960 And this story that the administration told, and this is 0:07:48.000 --> 0:07:51.160 the most important point, the story that the administration told 0:07:51.280 --> 0:07:54.600 threats first two years was actually one of inability to 0:07:54.640 --> 0:07:57.320 accomplish things. Because they were trying to accomplish things that 0:07:57.360 --> 0:08:01.640 were really big legislatively, and that we're in constant negotiation 0:08:01.840 --> 0:08:05.640 and getting watered down, so that you know, President Biden 0:08:05.840 --> 0:08:09.600 wanted an infrastructure bill that was several trillion dollars larger 0:08:09.600 --> 0:08:13.960 than what he actually got. So the narrative for the 0:08:14.000 --> 0:08:16.440 American people was that for months and months and months, 0:08:16.480 --> 0:08:18.160 you've been trying to pass something and now you've got 0:08:18.200 --> 0:08:21.040 something really small. Well, the truth is it's one of 0:08:21.080 --> 0:08:25.040 the biggest bills in history. So it's really an interesting 0:08:25.120 --> 0:08:27.000 way in which, you know, if we had just put 0:08:27.040 --> 0:08:30.680 Americans into a time capsule and not had to have 0:08:30.800 --> 0:08:33.120 them watch and listen to the sausage making in the 0:08:33.160 --> 0:08:36.600 Senate with Senator Mansion and Senator Cinema and others blocking 0:08:36.720 --> 0:08:39.880 legislation despite being Democrats, if we had managed to put 0:08:39.920 --> 0:08:42.040 people on a time capsule on the day he was 0:08:42.080 --> 0:08:45.840 inaugurated and then fast forward to today and then show 0:08:45.880 --> 0:08:48.000 them the record, they would say, my god, that man 0:08:48.080 --> 0:08:50.520 must have an approval rating of seventy five percent. But 0:08:50.600 --> 0:08:52.679 the truth is half Americans are never going to like 0:08:52.800 --> 0:08:54.959 him anyway at this point, and the other half has 0:08:55.000 --> 0:08:56.760 been saying, boy, you didn't get as much as you 0:08:56.880 --> 0:09:00.520 thought you wanted. Then let me ask this, put aside 0:09:00.520 --> 0:09:04.199 his accomplishments, what do you think have been his biggest missteps? 0:09:04.600 --> 0:09:08.040 There's no doubt that his biggest misstep was Afghanistan and 0:09:08.160 --> 0:09:10.360 the withdrawal from Afghastan. And I want to put a 0:09:10.360 --> 0:09:13.920 big asterisk and caveat around that, especially as you mentioned 0:09:13.920 --> 0:09:16.679 before as somebody who studies and teaches leadership, one of 0:09:16.720 --> 0:09:19.000 the things that is critical for people to understand about 0:09:19.080 --> 0:09:22.040 leadership is leaders don't do things. Leaders tell other people 0:09:22.080 --> 0:09:24.480 to do things. They said direction was the president's most 0:09:24.480 --> 0:09:28.000 powerful weapon. It's actually his telephone, being able to tell 0:09:28.080 --> 0:09:30.120 other people what to do and convince other people what 0:09:30.160 --> 0:09:34.640 to do. And the mission in the withdrawal from Afghanistan, 0:09:34.800 --> 0:09:38.600 which of course began as an American odyssey in two 0:09:38.600 --> 0:09:41.080 thousand and one, the longest running more in American history, 0:09:41.240 --> 0:09:44.680 which President Biden had wanted to draw down and advised 0:09:44.840 --> 0:09:47.679 the drawing down of more than the Obama administration did 0:09:47.720 --> 0:09:52.440 when he was vice president. That final withdrawal went badly. 0:09:52.840 --> 0:09:55.960 It was chaos. There were American lives that were lost, 0:09:55.960 --> 0:09:58.320 There are many Afghan lives that were lost. It did 0:09:58.360 --> 0:10:02.200 not look good on television. Now again, President Biden wasn't 0:10:02.240 --> 0:10:05.760 in Afghanistan checking people into the airport and checking their bags. 0:10:05.880 --> 0:10:08.840 But as the commander in chief, he is responsible for 0:10:08.880 --> 0:10:12.520 everything that happened, and that is I think an important 0:10:12.520 --> 0:10:16.800 thing to note about Biden as opposed to other leaders 0:10:16.800 --> 0:10:19.600 that we've had recently in the White House that when 0:10:19.679 --> 0:10:23.640 something went wrong on his watch, and Afghanistan went very wrong, 0:10:24.200 --> 0:10:26.800 Biden said, I am the commander in chief. I gave 0:10:26.840 --> 0:10:30.240 the orders. It's my responsibility. Blame me, even though he 0:10:30.320 --> 0:10:34.640 actually was in some ways let down by the people 0:10:34.679 --> 0:10:38.120 who had to initiate and engage his plans half a 0:10:38.120 --> 0:10:40.040 world away. Now, let get how want to be careful here. 0:10:40.360 --> 0:10:43.720 I'm not criticizing the military for the difficulties of its 0:10:43.800 --> 0:10:46.560 draw in Afghanistan because I couldn't do it. It's a 0:10:46.559 --> 0:10:49.240 tough job. They did a remarkable job, but it was 0:10:49.320 --> 0:10:52.679 not as smooth as they or the President wanted. Biden 0:10:52.720 --> 0:10:55.439 delivered his State of the Union address not too long ago, 0:10:56.080 --> 0:11:00.240 and it was very contentious. Republicans were yelling at him 0:11:00.280 --> 0:11:03.960 from the seats, and he interrupted his own speech to respond, 0:11:05.040 --> 0:11:09.880 I means Connress doesn't vote well. I'm glad to see you, 0:11:10.080 --> 0:11:15.719 not I tell you I enjoy conversion. Biden campaigned on 0:11:15.880 --> 0:11:19.800 being able to work across the aisle with Republicans. Has 0:11:19.840 --> 0:11:22.880 that happened? What's going on? It's funny and sad at 0:11:22.880 --> 0:11:25.760 the same time. My daughter is fourteen years old and 0:11:25.840 --> 0:11:28.680 she writes for her student newspaper. She's a much better 0:11:28.679 --> 0:11:30.960 writer than I am, by the way, and she has 0:11:31.240 --> 0:11:35.600 is writing an article on the incivility of congress in 0:11:35.640 --> 0:11:37.559 particularly at the State of the Union, and she came 0:11:37.600 --> 0:11:40.160 to me and said, I've just discovered that there was 0:11:40.200 --> 0:11:42.760 a case of a congressman from South Carolina who yelled 0:11:42.840 --> 0:11:47.840 Julie at President Obama back in his earlier days, and 0:11:48.000 --> 0:11:52.640 that congressman was sanctioned for the inappropriate nature of what 0:11:52.720 --> 0:11:55.920 he did. Flash forward, of course to President Biden's most 0:11:55.960 --> 0:11:59.400 recent State of the Union address and a congress person 0:11:59.480 --> 0:12:02.400 standing up been yelling Ulie. Happened every minute and a half. 0:12:02.920 --> 0:12:06.719 So we've certainly seen a degradation of civility. I think 0:12:06.800 --> 0:12:08.439 one of the things that Biden did that was very 0:12:08.480 --> 0:12:11.840 important in his Stay of the Union, especially going off script, 0:12:12.480 --> 0:12:18.120 was to make the point that he's trying for some 0:12:18.360 --> 0:12:23.200 former bipartisanship stand up and show them will not cut 0:12:23.280 --> 0:12:29.280 our security. We will not cut Medicare benefits blong in 0:12:29.320 --> 0:12:31.480 the American people. They earned it. If anyone tries to 0:12:31.520 --> 0:12:36.160 cut over security, which apparently no one's gonna do. If 0:12:36.200 --> 0:12:40.040 anyone tries, it's trut Medicare, I'll stop them. I'll betoing. 0:12:41.360 --> 0:12:44.360 This is spontaneous quip. And I think that that's important 0:12:44.400 --> 0:12:48.959 because he even then signaled that he's trying to find 0:12:49.000 --> 0:12:52.960 things that people can agree upon, and this is not 0:12:53.040 --> 0:12:56.000 easy in the political environment in which he lives. After 0:12:56.040 --> 0:12:59.160 the break, why would anyone want to be vice president? 0:12:59.800 --> 0:13:02.200 And how big of an ego does it take to 0:13:02.280 --> 0:13:18.360 be commander in chief? What about is Vice President Kamala Harris? 0:13:19.040 --> 0:13:21.959 Obviously she made history, is the first woman to serve 0:13:22.240 --> 0:13:24.880 as vice president and the first woman of color in 0:13:24.920 --> 0:13:28.120 that role. How would you analyze her time so far 0:13:28.160 --> 0:13:31.640 as VP? Has she made an impact? The first thing 0:13:31.640 --> 0:13:34.240 we need to know about analyzing any vice president is 0:13:34.280 --> 0:13:36.720 that it is quite literally the worst job in America 0:13:37.120 --> 0:13:39.240 or the best job in America. It's not just similar 0:13:39.280 --> 0:13:41.079 to being the backup quarterback on a football team and 0:13:41.080 --> 0:13:42.720 you get paid a lot of money and hopefully nobody 0:13:42.720 --> 0:13:46.280 ever thinks you should play. So Kamala Harris has not 0:13:46.400 --> 0:13:50.640 done much, frankly, to demonstrate leadership in a White House 0:13:51.120 --> 0:13:54.520 that has a strong leader in President Biden. And this 0:13:54.559 --> 0:13:58.000 is particularly interesting because President Biden, of course was vice 0:13:58.000 --> 0:14:00.800 president understood the role for eight years to Obama. But 0:14:00.840 --> 0:14:03.000 I want you to set up the just think about 0:14:03.040 --> 0:14:06.000 the dynamics, if you will, between Biden and Obama and 0:14:06.080 --> 0:14:07.960 Biden and Harris, and I think he reveals a lot 0:14:07.960 --> 0:14:10.480 of Harris's problems. But Biden was brought in as the 0:14:10.760 --> 0:14:14.200 senior hand for Obama, as the experience mentor that he 0:14:14.200 --> 0:14:18.120 could that Obama could turn to for guidance, for wisdom, etc. 0:14:18.760 --> 0:14:21.840 That is not the traditional vice president's role. That was 0:14:21.920 --> 0:14:23.960 the vice president's role for Dick Cheney, that was the 0:14:24.040 --> 0:14:27.960 vice president's role for Biden. But more likely role is 0:14:28.040 --> 0:14:30.240 usually it's a younger person who has brought in to 0:14:30.360 --> 0:14:33.040 kind of invigorate the ticket. That was the case with 0:14:33.160 --> 0:14:36.120 Dan Quail, that was the case certainly with Kamala Harris. 0:14:36.240 --> 0:14:38.800 And I think in all those cases, the vice president 0:14:38.840 --> 0:14:41.800 who is the younger person is frankly seen to be 0:14:42.360 --> 0:14:46.120 appropriately subservient to the president. And that's not a great 0:14:46.160 --> 0:14:50.120 way to increase your political stature. Remember, and this can't 0:14:50.120 --> 0:14:54.960 be overseered enough. President Biden, when he accepted the vice 0:14:55.080 --> 0:14:59.400 presidency nomination in two thousand and eight, gave up any 0:14:59.520 --> 0:15:03.560 dreams of being president. He believed he was going to say, 0:15:03.760 --> 0:15:08.200 spend four hopefully eight years helping an administration, and then 0:15:08.240 --> 0:15:11.240 he was going to retire. And in twenty sixteen seventeen 0:15:11.680 --> 0:15:16.040 he left office and did retire. It's only the existential 0:15:16.080 --> 0:15:18.720 threat that he saw to the nation that was Donald Trump, 0:15:18.760 --> 0:15:22.640 that made him get back into the race to run 0:15:22.680 --> 0:15:26.680 in twenty twenty. Kamala Harris obviously has political aspirations, and 0:15:26.760 --> 0:15:30.000 that puts her in an extraordinarily difficult position. So I 0:15:30.000 --> 0:15:32.920 think she would be disappointed if we had put her 0:15:32.960 --> 0:15:35.200 in a similar time capsule and had her pop up 0:15:35.240 --> 0:15:38.720 and look at her popularity ratings two years after inauguration, 0:15:38.920 --> 0:15:41.400 she'd be disappointed with where they were. But I don't 0:15:41.400 --> 0:15:43.920 think she should be surprised. Let me push back on 0:15:44.000 --> 0:15:47.440 that a little bit, though, Jeff. I've heard people say 0:15:47.840 --> 0:15:50.240 Joe Biden wanted to be president from the time he 0:15:50.360 --> 0:15:54.280 was three years old and spent a lifetime trying to 0:15:54.320 --> 0:15:57.960 get there, and then it looked like he lost out. 0:15:58.840 --> 0:16:02.720 But a set of circumstances arose and he could run. 0:16:02.760 --> 0:16:06.440 In twenty twenty, there were other people who could have 0:16:06.480 --> 0:16:10.080 been elected president and made Donald Trump an ex president. 0:16:10.720 --> 0:16:13.000 He didn't have to run, He wasn't the only person, 0:16:13.600 --> 0:16:18.120 but he did. Is it possible his political aspirations are 0:16:18.200 --> 0:16:21.120 just so strong he couldn't let go of them. You know, 0:16:21.160 --> 0:16:23.240 two things can be true at the same time. Let's 0:16:23.280 --> 0:16:27.520 remember we're talking about a person becoming president. I have 0:16:27.680 --> 0:16:30.120 argued elsewhere, I suspect argued to the end of my 0:16:30.240 --> 0:16:34.320 days that all presidents are sociobaths, or at the very 0:16:34.360 --> 0:16:38.800 least psychologically unusual in the sense that imagine the ego 0:16:38.880 --> 0:16:42.200 it takes to be a leader of a country of 0:16:42.200 --> 0:16:44.320 three hundred and fifty odd million people, and you got 0:16:44.400 --> 0:16:46.200 to look in the mirror every morning and say, there 0:16:46.280 --> 0:16:48.440 is no one else among those three hundred and fifty 0:16:48.480 --> 0:16:51.280 million who can do the job I can. That's an 0:16:51.320 --> 0:16:54.160 unusual edo who lost stress in the word unusual. And 0:16:54.200 --> 0:16:56.320 by the way, I should mention that person also by 0:16:56.440 --> 0:17:00.280 running for office, gains the power to destroy all of humanity. Well, again, 0:17:00.720 --> 0:17:03.280 not the average thing a person wants. So we should 0:17:03.280 --> 0:17:07.760 not be surprised that when President Biden perceived the nation 0:17:07.840 --> 0:17:11.000 in danger. He said, I'm the only one that can 0:17:11.240 --> 0:17:13.119 save it. At that point, of course, he was former 0:17:13.240 --> 0:17:16.920 Vice President Biden. When he saw a problem. We should 0:17:16.960 --> 0:17:18.800 not be surprised that man of that ego and that 0:17:18.840 --> 0:17:23.280 aspiration would say I am the one to solve the problem. 0:17:23.359 --> 0:17:27.840 At the same time, I fully believe and I am 0:17:28.000 --> 0:17:31.040 quite confident in the fact that had it not been 0:17:31.200 --> 0:17:35.520 for the Trump presidency, Biden would not have run in 0:17:35.600 --> 0:17:38.359 twenty twenty. He realized Hillary Clan had the backing of 0:17:38.359 --> 0:17:41.879 more Democrats, including President Obama. But he could have pushed 0:17:41.880 --> 0:17:44.800 back and said I'm sorry, I'm running anyway. He didn't. 0:17:45.080 --> 0:17:46.760 So that tells me if there had to be something 0:17:46.800 --> 0:17:48.880 else that occurred for him to want to jump into 0:17:48.880 --> 0:17:51.880 the race. Well, I don't know if he's a sociopath, 0:17:51.960 --> 0:17:55.760 but if he is, he's the oldest sitting presidential sociopath 0:17:56.000 --> 0:18:01.080 in American history. Has that age issue hurt presidency? Oh? 0:18:01.119 --> 0:18:03.760 And definitely. How do you think Americans view him? I 0:18:03.760 --> 0:18:05.800 think as an old man because here's the thing, he's 0:18:05.800 --> 0:18:08.719 an old man. He is going to be the oldest 0:18:08.720 --> 0:18:10.560 president in history. And then when he's going to run 0:18:10.600 --> 0:18:13.919 as the oldest candidate for reelection in American history, and 0:18:14.400 --> 0:18:19.240 agism maybe the last acceptable form of stereotyping and large 0:18:19.280 --> 0:18:23.240 scale criticism that Americans are allowed. But they do seem 0:18:23.280 --> 0:18:26.000 to take advantage of that when talking about President Biden. 0:18:26.280 --> 0:18:28.639 I think there is no question in my mind that 0:18:28.760 --> 0:18:32.720 if President Biden were fifty three and had accomplished the 0:18:32.760 --> 0:18:37.040 same there would be no talk anywhere within the Democratic 0:18:37.040 --> 0:18:39.920 Party of challenging him or perhaps that he should step down. 0:18:39.960 --> 0:18:42.639 Why would He's got an incredible record. Now then, I 0:18:42.720 --> 0:18:45.840 know this is speculative, but let's say he does run 0:18:46.440 --> 0:18:49.679 and he does win. Let's say he is reelected. What 0:18:49.760 --> 0:18:53.480 would a second term for Joe Biden looked like? Disappointing 0:18:54.280 --> 0:18:56.280 only in the sense that almost every president second term 0:18:56.320 --> 0:18:59.480 is disappointing. You know, even Ronald Reagan, who had great 0:18:59.480 --> 0:19:03.399 accomplished in trying to tamp down the tensions of the 0:19:03.400 --> 0:19:06.040 Cold War and some argue move US towards a initial 0:19:06.080 --> 0:19:09.320 steps towards a post Cold War world, was sucked down 0:19:09.400 --> 0:19:12.919 and almost impeached because of Iran Contra. There's a reason 0:19:13.119 --> 0:19:18.879 that presidents in their second term modern presidence particular increasingly 0:19:18.920 --> 0:19:21.840 focus on foreign affairs. It's because they have come to 0:19:21.840 --> 0:19:24.960 the realization that domestic politics are really hard and they've 0:19:25.000 --> 0:19:27.399 likely burned almost all their political capital even by the 0:19:27.400 --> 0:19:29.520 time they're reelected, especially since most are never going to 0:19:29.600 --> 0:19:34.600 run again. So consequently, whatever President Biden wants for his 0:19:34.680 --> 0:19:37.280 second term is going to be harder to achieve, more 0:19:37.320 --> 0:19:40.679 likely than it was in his first term. So I 0:19:40.720 --> 0:19:44.400 would tamp down expectations, which is not to say that 0:19:44.440 --> 0:19:48.080 one should not vote or vote for Biden because he 0:19:48.160 --> 0:19:50.439 is going to be less than he promises. Every president 0:19:51.200 --> 0:19:53.639 is less than they promise, but he is not going to, 0:19:53.680 --> 0:19:58.080 i would imagine, achieve more than he aspires to. Will 0:19:58.119 --> 0:20:01.119 there ever be a presidential leader again on the scale 0:20:01.119 --> 0:20:04.960 of Washington or Lincoln or Fdr. I'm talking about someone 0:20:04.960 --> 0:20:08.840 who belongs on Mount Rushmore. You and I should pray 0:20:08.960 --> 0:20:11.960 every night that it does not. And I'll tell you why, 0:20:12.480 --> 0:20:17.200 because whenever presidential historians or people on bar stools start 0:20:17.320 --> 0:20:20.800 arguing about who is who were the greatest presidents, those 0:20:20.840 --> 0:20:23.520 three that you mentioned are always at the top. And 0:20:23.640 --> 0:20:25.840 you can have a fair argument over who's one, who's two, 0:20:25.880 --> 0:20:28.160 who's three, but nobody ever disputes that those are the three. Well, 0:20:28.200 --> 0:20:30.640 what do those three have in common. The thing those 0:20:30.640 --> 0:20:32.720 three have in common is that those are the only 0:20:32.880 --> 0:20:36.640 three times their presidencies in American history, the only three 0:20:36.680 --> 0:20:40.520 I would argue where the existential crisis face to nation, 0:20:41.160 --> 0:20:43.879 as to say, where the very existence of the United States, 0:20:43.880 --> 0:20:45.840 whether it was going to continue as a country, was 0:20:45.880 --> 0:20:49.240 in doubt. Obviously at the beginning, George Washington had that 0:20:49.400 --> 0:20:51.720 both during revolution and then of course during his presidency. 0:20:51.800 --> 0:20:54.040 Can we get this new thing up in Roland? During 0:20:54.040 --> 0:20:56.880 the Civil War certainly a moment of existential crisis. If 0:20:56.960 --> 0:20:59.040 Lincoln loses the Civil War, well then we don't have 0:20:59.040 --> 0:21:01.199 the United States, certainly as we know it. And then 0:21:01.240 --> 0:21:04.840 FDR faced the third greatest crisis in American history, not 0:21:04.880 --> 0:21:06.920 where we're two, by the way, which was the Great Depression. 0:21:07.359 --> 0:21:09.719 The Great Depression was so bad when he assumed office 0:21:09.720 --> 0:21:12.239 that he was not uncommon for people to question the 0:21:12.359 --> 0:21:16.320 very validity of the concept of democracy. And I could 0:21:16.320 --> 0:21:18.760 speak for hours and hours and hours on that which 0:21:18.800 --> 0:21:20.440 you don't want me to do, all of which is 0:21:20.480 --> 0:21:24.840 to say, to be a truly great president requires a 0:21:24.880 --> 0:21:29.439 great crisis. And I would rather have mediocre presidents and 0:21:29.680 --> 0:21:32.959 small crises going forward. The rest of my life. All right, 0:21:33.000 --> 0:21:35.840 I have one more question for you, Jeff. Another professor 0:21:36.160 --> 0:21:39.560 is a friend of yours, Jeremy Surrey. He's asserted a 0:21:39.560 --> 0:21:42.879 few times that the presidency has grown into a job 0:21:43.240 --> 0:21:47.720 that is just too big for any one person. Do 0:21:47.760 --> 0:21:51.600 you agree with that? I don't, actually, but I agree 0:21:51.680 --> 0:21:54.840 with everything that Jeremy says up until his solution, which 0:21:54.880 --> 0:21:56.720 is to say, yeah, the presidence, he's grown too big. 0:21:56.760 --> 0:21:58.439 You know what, the country's grown too big. You know what, 0:21:58.560 --> 0:22:00.320 My life has grown too big. Your life is grown 0:22:00.320 --> 0:22:03.520 to big. Every generation you can find people saying, boy, 0:22:03.560 --> 0:22:05.679 the world is moving faster than I remember, and you 0:22:05.720 --> 0:22:07.720 know what, this time it's actually going that way, and 0:22:07.720 --> 0:22:10.080 it's going to get worse in the future. I can't 0:22:10.119 --> 0:22:12.440 keep it with my inbox. Neither can most people I know, 0:22:12.560 --> 0:22:15.760 so the President Nited States certainly can't. But that doesn't 0:22:15.760 --> 0:22:18.720 mean the solution is to diminish the presidency. That doesn't 0:22:18.760 --> 0:22:21.440 mean that the solution is to have co presidence or 0:22:21.440 --> 0:22:25.440 a triumvirate. I will tell you one of the problems 0:22:25.520 --> 0:22:28.399 that has developed over the course of the twentieth century, 0:22:28.400 --> 0:22:33.280 which we are living with today is the balance and 0:22:33.520 --> 0:22:37.400