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Speaker 1: Push it. Happy holidays everyone, I know this is a

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Speaker 1: special time of year. We are taking a few weeks

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Speaker 1: off and we'll be back with some of my best friends.

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Speaker 1: Are in mid January, this time dropping in your feet

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Speaker 1: on Wednesdays instead of Tuesdays. We'll catch you then have

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Speaker 1: a wonderful holiday season. I was also fortunate enough to

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Speaker 1: be a part of the cast of Fargo. It's set

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Speaker 1: in Kansas City, but it was so, so so Chicago.

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Speaker 1: It felt like Chicago. You were Chris Rock's wife. No,

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Speaker 1: Chris Rock was my husband. I'm Khalil Gibrad Muhammed and

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Speaker 1: I'm Ben Austin. We're two best friends, one black, one white.

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Speaker 1: I'm a historian and I'm a journalist. And this is

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Speaker 1: some of my best friends are. Some of my best

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Speaker 1: friends are dot dot dot. In this show, we wrestle

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Speaker 1: with the challenges and the absurdities of a deeply divided

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Speaker 1: and unequal country. And in this episode we are talking

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Speaker 1: about two of our favorite television shows right now. They

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Speaker 1: tell us so much about how places themselves, like cities,

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Speaker 1: play a huge part in how we understand the divisions

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Speaker 1: in our country and how we might come together. They

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Speaker 1: give us so much joy and we want you to

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Speaker 1: enjoy them too. Man, TV as knowledge. I like this

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Speaker 1: Kalila Entertainment. We got it before we get started. I

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Speaker 1: just wanted to let you know this episode has some

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Speaker 1: strong language. Just a fair warning, but stick around something

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Speaker 1: not only what's up, Kalila, How you doing. I'm good, man,

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Speaker 1: I'm good. Loved what you just said about TV shows,

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Speaker 1: you know where they're set, being like a character in

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Speaker 1: itself and being so important to the actual story. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: to how we understand, like you know, who we are

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Speaker 1: and our neighbors and even what informs how we think

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Speaker 1: about the world. And I love movies like that. I

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Speaker 1: love TV shows like that. I love books like that.

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Speaker 1: But I'm thinking about TV shows that are set in

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Speaker 1: a certain place and how there's a pleasure when you're

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Speaker 1: familiar with the place to see to see the familiar.

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Speaker 1: And you know, we have both seen Abbot Elementary set

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Speaker 1: in Philadelphia, in an elementary school there. Oh man, it's great,

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Speaker 1: And just like recognizing the flavors of Philadelphia with the

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Speaker 1: attitudes and the food, the food, like the aspects of

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Speaker 1: a place. Yes, and a show that friends turned me

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Speaker 1: onto a couple of years ago, The Ozarks and I

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Speaker 1: was very slow to watch it, but oh my god,

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Speaker 1: I'm like totally immersed in this other world that I've

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Speaker 1: never been to, never thought about going to, and the

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Speaker 1: place is so much a part of what makes that

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Speaker 1: show work. Yeah, and so that's another idea, like you're

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Speaker 1: actually using that show to travel summer you've never been

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Speaker 1: in to learn about it. That's right. And sometimes of

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Speaker 1: course you're you're learning things that actually don't aren't very

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Speaker 1: representative of it, are No. No, there's this danger of

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Speaker 1: like a Hollywood version of a place where it's a

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Speaker 1: total caricature and it's misleading. And then there are all

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Speaker 1: shows that were like are very organic and made by

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Speaker 1: local artists and it's it's the real real. And actually

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Speaker 1: that's a good point because if you think about it,

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Speaker 1: when you don't actually know a place very well, you

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Speaker 1: can't actually evaluate what's going on, what are the interventions,

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Speaker 1: what are the writers trying to tell us about this

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Speaker 1: place that we didn't already know? Boom, And that's why

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Speaker 1: we're here today because we're going to talk about two

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Speaker 1: Chicago TV shows. Yep, So we're going to talk about

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Speaker 1: HBO Max's original series called south Side. It is a

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Speaker 1: comedy send up of this predatory lending furniture place called

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Speaker 1: Rent to Own, and we learned so much about so

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Speaker 1: many different types of Chicago INDs and also just like

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Speaker 1: the crazy stuff that happens in a city when folks

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Speaker 1: are trying to get their hustle on. And in the

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Speaker 1: second part of the show, we're going to talk about

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Speaker 1: a TV show called The Bear, which is on x Hulu.

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Speaker 1: I love that show and it's actually sort of setting

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Speaker 1: a kind of ambiguous near North side of Chicago inside

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Speaker 1: an Italian beef shop. And as a guest today, this

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Speaker 1: is amazing. We have on Jay Nicole Brooks, who is

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Speaker 1: an actor on the South Side. She's not on The Bear,

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Speaker 1: but she's an amazing Chicago an amazing Chicago actor, writer,

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Speaker 1: intellectual creator, playwright. Yes, and she and I actually met

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Speaker 1: several years ago when I finished my book about Cabrini Green,

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Speaker 1: you know, this public housing development on the near North

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Speaker 1: side of Chicago known for its infamy, because she was

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Speaker 1: writing a play about Jane Byrne, Chicago's mayor, who moves

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Speaker 1: into Cabrini Green into an apartment in nineteen eighty one,

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Speaker 1: and I had a whole chapter in my book about that,

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Speaker 1: and so here she and I are getting together and

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Speaker 1: like chopping up, like how we each came at this

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Speaker 1: story from like, you know, a narrative nonfiction way, from

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Speaker 1: a totally like fictional theatrical way, and you know, we

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Speaker 1: just totally hit it off because we doing the same work.

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Speaker 1: And how Chicago matters so much to the stories that

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Speaker 1: you tell from very different approaches. Yeah, that the meaning

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Speaker 1: of the place is so significant. So let's just jump

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Speaker 1: in with Jane Nicole Brooks and ye, because she's amazing.

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Speaker 1: I love it. Let's do it. Well, Hello, it's great

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Speaker 1: to see you. It's great to have you on. Likewise,

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Speaker 1: I'm so so happy to be here and kick it

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Speaker 1: what y'all? Thank you. You are the bomb dignity. But

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Speaker 1: I'm not sure what to call you for this interview.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I know your name is Jane Nicole Brooks,

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Speaker 1: but what do you go by? It depends on the situation.

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Speaker 1: You know, if you are like a white person that

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Speaker 1: owns a corporation and I owe you money, is probably Dianna.

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Speaker 1: If you are in the arts as Jaye Nicole Brooks,

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Speaker 1: and if you're friends, you can call me Slick, So

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Speaker 1: please call me slick. All right, Slick, I like that

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Speaker 1: we are gonna art by playing a clip from the

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Speaker 1: HBO comedy The South Side, from a little moment that

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Speaker 1: you're in one of the episodes, Alixander, good night. Can

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Speaker 1: I help me? Olivia? I'm a pa oh. I thought

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Speaker 1: thea were usually kind of on the you know, fresh

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Speaker 1: out of college, kind of a younger reconde. Okay, well

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Speaker 1: I'm a late blooman, get off my dinner, getting off

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Speaker 1: your dick, and I'm off of it. Can I help you? So? Uh? Slick?

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Speaker 1: I mean basically, I'm playing that because we're gonna we

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Speaker 1: want to get on your metaphorical dick here a little

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Speaker 1: bit and and and talk to you at first about

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Speaker 1: like who you are professionally, all the amazing stuff that

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Speaker 1: you you've accomplished. Can you describe yourself as a Chicago

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Speaker 1: actor and writer and creator? As far as my history

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Speaker 1: here in Chicago, I'm born and raised here, and uh,

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Speaker 1: I studied theater and performance and dance since I was fifteen.

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Speaker 1: And though I've lived in Los Angeles and New York,

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Speaker 1: Chicago has always planned at home. And after years of

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Speaker 1: being away and hustling all over, Chicago is pretty much

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Speaker 1: the place where my acting career sort of took a

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Speaker 1: pop and started climbing to places where I didn't quite

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Speaker 1: know it would And it's been I don't know, it's

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Speaker 1: been a beautiful joy in one of those places with Southside.

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Speaker 1: So you've been on the Southside, What else have you

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Speaker 1: been on? I'm also what we call a recurring character,

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Speaker 1: a guest star recurring on Chicago Fire. I play well

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Speaker 1: currently like one of the highest ranking characters. I play

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Speaker 1: DC Hills, So she's the deputy commissioner over the entire

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Speaker 1: fire department. Right, all right, hey, pop um, you know

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Speaker 1: I like I like telling people what to do because

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Speaker 1: we know how black women in Chicago have risen to

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Speaker 1: the highest ranks of the Chicago Fire Department. Absolutely, and

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Speaker 1: you know what, that role is actually inspired by actual individuals,

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Speaker 1: So shout out to all of the black films and

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Speaker 1: women that are first responders and then the fire department.

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Speaker 1: So there's that. I've also played a cap on the

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Speaker 1: first two seasons of The Shy. I played a character

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Speaker 1: called Sergeant Clements. She was a sergeant in the police department. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: we love that show. Well, I should say I love

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Speaker 1: The Shy. Just amazing don't speak for me. Yea, the acting,

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Speaker 1: the storytelling, the writing, and another show with a lot

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Speaker 1: of complexity about black people. I mean, I think that's

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Speaker 1: one of the things that makes The Shy so interesting. Yes,

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Speaker 1: you know, as an actor, I have my experiences. As

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Speaker 1: a writer, I might have other thoughts as a creative,

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Speaker 1: you know what I mean, Love it or not love it?

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Speaker 1: Any of these shows that are set in Chicago, the

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Speaker 1: ones I've been involved with, have really been a great

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Speaker 1: joy to work on. And it's just always funny to

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Speaker 1: me how you know, Like we have our opinions about

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Speaker 1: how they're done, and I got plenty of them, you know.

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Speaker 1: So I'm a Chicago and I love my city. But

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Speaker 1: I haven't lived in Chicago since I was twenty two

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Speaker 1: years old. And one of the things that Ben and

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Speaker 1: I talk a lot about is like what this city

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Speaker 1: means to us as the shared place that helped us

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Speaker 1: become the adults we are and the writers we are

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Speaker 1: and the people who care deeply about you know, really

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Speaker 1: big questions. I'm curious for you though, since you have

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Speaker 1: lived over the places, what is it about Chicago and

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Speaker 1: your artistry that is so compelling? Oh sweet baby, mallord. Okay,

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Speaker 1: first of all, you know, first of all, I think

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Speaker 1: that when you are fortunate enough to be born and

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Speaker 1: bred here, there's a certain pride that you grow up with.

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Speaker 1: And I don't care what the industry is or what

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Speaker 1: a category might be. It's like Chicago over everything everywhere,

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Speaker 1: you know, And it's also like we're Midwestern and so

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Speaker 1: we're nice, tough guys. I think. I like that. Let

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Speaker 1: me ask a related question, which is, you know, you're

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Speaker 1: also a playwright and a screenwriter. I mean, so you're

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Speaker 1: writing stories about Chicago. What are like the representations of

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Speaker 1: Chicago that you're sort of like working against that you're

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Speaker 1: trying to subvert. You know that these depictions of the

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Speaker 1: city that are out there in TV and film and

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Speaker 1: plays that you're like, I am going to show something

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Speaker 1: that's different or more complicated or other. Well, Ben, I

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Speaker 1: definitely feel you know, I feel like you and I

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Speaker 1: have so much in common, you know what I mean,

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Speaker 1: like coming from some of the same parts of town

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Speaker 1: and growing up in the same way. So I don't

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Speaker 1: know if these are some of the things that you

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Speaker 1: feel as a creator, but for me personally, I feel

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Speaker 1: like there's so many other cities across the nation, and

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Speaker 1: when it comes to home and TV and things like that,

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Speaker 1: we know their personalities. Yeah, And I feel like with

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Speaker 1: the city of Chicago, when it's represented on screen, we

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Speaker 1: don't always get a sense of the personality. And it's

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Speaker 1: often because it's people that are creating it and don't

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Speaker 1: know shit about the city. So what are they showing instead?

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Speaker 1: Oh my god, they're showing Chicago and Toronto. And I

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Speaker 1: get that that's a protos oial thing. I get it,

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Speaker 1: but it's visually missing the grit and the gorgeous, fucked

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Speaker 1: up architecture. I know when I'm looking in New York,

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Speaker 1: I know when I'm looking at la I know when

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Speaker 1: I'm looking at Paris. But sometimes when I look at Chicago,

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Speaker 1: is it a surface thing? Why set something in Chicago?

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Speaker 1: What idea they're going at? And then like, how do

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Speaker 1: you like use Chicago Differently? If you don't understand how

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Speaker 1: this city came to be, you really won't get the

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Speaker 1: nuance of it. So for me, I'm a history nerd,

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Speaker 1: and I care about what was in existence before I

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Speaker 1: came along because that adversely affects my work. So sometimes

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Speaker 1: in my work it might be like an Easter egg

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Speaker 1: is just something you kind of see. And I know,

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Speaker 1: as a writer and as a creator, I don't really

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Speaker 1: give a fuck if you don't understand a Chicago joke.

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Speaker 1: I don't give a fuck if you don't understand something

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Speaker 1: that is uniquely Chicago, because I'm writing for Chicago's interesting,

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Speaker 1: And if you are a good writer, I'm gonna just

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Speaker 1: like leave it at this. If you're a good writer,

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Speaker 1: you can really achieve the universal through the specific. So

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Speaker 1: keep your ship laser focus and give me something that

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Speaker 1: I actually can get behind and believe, because otherwise you're

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Speaker 1: giving me procedural drama that I like being on. I

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Speaker 1: like those shows because they pay well. But like you know,

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Speaker 1: give us some nuance because we it's what's there. So

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Speaker 1: if you understand the hyper segregation, it's going to filter

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Speaker 1: into your work. If you understand that, like we have

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Speaker 1: gangster mayors and always have, it's going to go into

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Speaker 1: the work or whatever, and gangster governors. We have had

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Speaker 1: so many jailbird governors, you know. Well, speaking of keeping

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Speaker 1: it real in terms of the nuances of Chicago. After

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Speaker 1: the break, we're gonna come back and talk about this

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Speaker 1: amazing show that you've been part of South Side. The

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Speaker 1: show just dropped its third season, so when we come

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Speaker 1: back more on the south Side. So you are bringing

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Speaker 1: up shows that feel like authentically Chicago and that are

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Speaker 1: grappling with sort of all the hyper segregation and all

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Speaker 1: the other issues of the city. And so we have

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Speaker 1: this comedy that we want to talk about the South

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Speaker 1: Side on HBO and it's set in Englewood and Englewood.

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Speaker 1: You and I have both written about Cabrini Green. Englewood

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Speaker 1: is like the new Cabrini Green is sort of like

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Speaker 1: a shorthand, and the way people think of Chicago a

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Speaker 1: shorthand for like crime, segregation, mostly black neighborhood, to think

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Speaker 1: about total separation, to think about like the scariest parts

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Speaker 1: of the city. And this comedy is really like anything

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Speaker 1: but that it does deal with poverty, segregation, crime policing,

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Speaker 1: but in a way that sort of subverts all of

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Speaker 1: these unbiased but we want that, we want that. I'm

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Speaker 1: extraordinarily proud of this team because they are not only

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Speaker 1: writing about it, they film in these communities, They film

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Speaker 1: on the West Side, they film all over the South Side,

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Speaker 1: and they get into places where I've known other creative

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Speaker 1: teams and crews where they're like, oh, we can't get

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Speaker 1: the insurance, we don't feel safe there and it's not safe.

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Speaker 1: And I'm like, well, why are these guys able to

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Speaker 1: do it? And I think it's because you have to

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Speaker 1: forge a relationship with communities, and I've watched these guys

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Speaker 1: do that. I'll tell you super quick anecdote. The first

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Speaker 1: time I auditioned for Southside is an actor. I heard

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Speaker 1: about the script and then I was like, all right,

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Speaker 1: this is a comedy in Chicago is probably not going

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Speaker 1: to make it past pilot because no one gives Chicago

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Speaker 1: a chance. Like I'm like, Chicago has the funniest motherfuckers

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Speaker 1: on the planet, yet we don't have comedies here, blah

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Speaker 1: blah blah. So I get the sides and I'm like, oh,

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Speaker 1: this scene is kind of funny. I was like, damn,

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Speaker 1: this scene is really funny. Yeah, damn, this seems real real.

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Speaker 1: So I was like, you know what, is probably gonna

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Speaker 1: go to a Hollywood big name, so fuck it. I

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Speaker 1: don't care. I'm gonna show up and be a chice

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Speaker 1: cargo as I can because I'm not gonna get it.

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Speaker 1: So I showed up in do Rag my Jordan's I

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Speaker 1: had on my my Bulls jersey and like, I just

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Speaker 1: gave it to him. I was like, fuck it, I'm

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Speaker 1: not gonna get it. And they're probably gonna say, we

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Speaker 1: don't understand your vernacular. And if you you thought it

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Speaker 1: was gonna go to knee along, listen, if I ever

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Speaker 1: in my lifetime lose a role to knee along, trust me,

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Speaker 1: I'm getting that tattooed on my forehead. She lost the

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Speaker 1: role to you. Come on, let's go, let's shout out

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Speaker 1: to knee along. But my point of that story is

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Speaker 1: that not only in that audition process with the director, writers,

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Speaker 1: and a couple of producers, not only were they into

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Speaker 1: it and encouraged it. I booked the part and then

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Speaker 1: I'm like, Okay, the network is going to say, now

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Speaker 1: we got to change it, but it's Comedy Central. They

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Speaker 1: don't give a fuck. So it was on Comedy Central,

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Speaker 1: and then it got picked up by HBO initially, and

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Speaker 1: then it got picked up by HBO. Max Yeah, and

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Speaker 1: you get on the set and you're like, oh my god,

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Speaker 1: they're gonna let me be my authentic self. They're gonna

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Speaker 1: let Chicago be Chicago. And once you like sink into

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Speaker 1: it and relax. The show just really flies because it's

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Speaker 1: honest to itself. It's not trying to write Chicago so

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Speaker 1: that the entire world understands it. It's just what it is,

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Speaker 1: and you just got to catch up to it. I

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Speaker 1: just smile brightly because I think that's really dope and

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Speaker 1: not always the case. Yeah, well, I love that you're

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Speaker 1: speaking to this kind of authenticity about the way that

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Speaker 1: the South Side is depicted in Inglewood, being this community

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Speaker 1: that I was often written out is a dangerous place

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Speaker 1: that one should go to about. I don't know. Seven

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Speaker 1: years ago, I was invited to the culinary school that

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Speaker 1: was built as part of Kennedy King College there and

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Speaker 1: it was the first time that I had actually done

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Speaker 1: anything professionally in Inglewood, and I thought, this is amazing

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Speaker 1: that there's this cooking school in this community that people think,

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Speaker 1: you know, you should do everything in your power to

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Speaker 1: avoid if you don't happen to live there. So you're

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Speaker 1: absolutely right. This community is way more rich and compelling

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Speaker 1: than we often think about. But the show itself, which

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Speaker 1: I just love, is to me like a cross between

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Speaker 1: the Office and like The Odyssey, because every episode is

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Speaker 1: an adventure that these guys have to overcome some set

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Speaker 1: of obstacles, some set of challenges. All of the main

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Speaker 1: characters come on, man, shout out to Homer. Okay, come

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Speaker 1: on with the Year of Joy in my groove, y'all,

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Speaker 1: let me finish. So there's all these anti stereotypes and

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Speaker 1: we just absolutely love this for what it does to

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Speaker 1: make complex the brilliance of black people in that city.

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna tell you something. As an actor, I'm like,

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Speaker 1: if I don't get a chance to do another that

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Speaker 1: that's set in Chicago, I still feel like I won.

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Speaker 1: On the first season The South Side, my character was

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Speaker 1: in an episode called The Day of the Jordans Drop

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Speaker 1: and it's literally the you know, it's all about the

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Speaker 1: Jordans and yeah, new a new version of the or

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Speaker 1: Jordan's coming out. Hey, look, brou if it was any

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Speaker 1: other day, we will pull over. I mean, but he

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Speaker 1: them new Jordans is coming out, and we got to

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Speaker 1: get back west and finished this all up before the

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Speaker 1: hit sales out. Hey what if I told you there's

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Speaker 1: a store near you right now that never sails out where?

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Speaker 1: Really I get stuff up trying and it's just such

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Speaker 1: a Chicago hilarious episode. So it was just a lot

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Speaker 1: of fucking fun to do it in this way. You

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Speaker 1: had talked about how the specific can be universal, and certainly,

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Speaker 1: like the three of us all had these roots not

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Speaker 1: just in Chicago but on the South Side. And so

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Speaker 1: I watched this show and even as a white dude

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Speaker 1: who grew up in the South Side, it just speaks

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Speaker 1: to me and like all these like you know, arounds

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Speaker 1: are popping right, Like they talk about the stuck up

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Speaker 1: girls at Kenwood High School where we went to, you know,

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Speaker 1: we went to Kenwood, and not just that I'm married

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Speaker 1: my prom date, you know, like like I'm still married

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Speaker 1: to this dug up girl from Keo who's amazing and wonderful, Danielle,

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Speaker 1: I love you. But they're all kinds of Chicago things

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Speaker 1: like that. There's this one scene we're about to play

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Speaker 1: a clip from where one of the characters is inside

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Speaker 1: a Harold's Chicken Shack and he wants more of their

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Speaker 1: famous Mile sauce, you know, which is like this mixture

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Speaker 1: of tangy barbecue sauce, and the woman behind the bulletproof

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Speaker 1: glass is refusing to give him more. Thank you, kind sir,

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Speaker 1: Can I have five more mile sauces. I really loved

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Speaker 1: the stuff. Hey Donovan, yo talk about he want five

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Speaker 1: mile sauces, five five law sauces. This is always you

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Speaker 1: three piece of white No he happiness a day man.

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Speaker 1: I love that clip. I have lived that experience inside

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Speaker 1: Harold's no doubt. But there are all these other kinds

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Speaker 1: of Chicago things, which is just amazing. There's an episode

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Speaker 1: that uses the idea of DIBs, which is, you know,

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Speaker 1: on a snowy day, when you clear the walk in

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Speaker 1: front of your house, you start putting your furniture out

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Speaker 1: there to make sure that nobody else parks in your spot.

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Speaker 1: It is totally Chicago gangster. And there are all these

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Speaker 1: other Chicago things too. There's an episode on stepping, which

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Speaker 1: is a kind of local dancing and house music, and

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Speaker 1: and Khalil loves golf. I know that Khalil loves golf. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: there's the scene of Jackson Park, which of course probably

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Speaker 1: the most dangerous golf course in America. It's like literally

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Speaker 1: the journey from I believe Whole number nine to Whole

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Speaker 1: number ten. You you cross a kind of a baby highway,

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Speaker 1: and that's a that's a plot point in the show,

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Speaker 1: and you know there's like there's like a riff on

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Speaker 1: Italian Fiesta. Chance the rapper actually makes a really good

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Speaker 1: joke about like how depressed he is. He's like, my

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Speaker 1: favorite restaurants Italian Fiesta. I'm sad, to be honest, I

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Speaker 1: hate my life. Why do I have to name tags

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Speaker 1: on They both say currency exchange. My favorite restaurant is

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Speaker 1: Italian Fiesta on the South Side. Love that place. Some

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00:22:03,436 --> 00:22:06,316
Speaker 1: two words don't go together. Absolutely, one is Italian, one

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00:22:06,396 --> 00:22:10,356
Speaker 1: is Mexican. That's joke ever, but you know, so throwing

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Speaker 1: that back on you, like national audience is listening to

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Speaker 1: this and being like, I don't get all the references.

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00:22:16,076 --> 00:22:19,636
Speaker 1: Is there a butt to that? But I didn't grow

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Speaker 1: up in Queens and I catch all jokes. Yeah yeah,

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00:22:23,196 --> 00:22:25,476
Speaker 1: but I didn't grow up in Brooklyn, And you know

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Speaker 1: what I mean, That's just what I feel about it,

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Speaker 1: Or New Jersey and I'm watching the Sopranos or like

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Speaker 1: absolutely which exit I don't fucking know shit about Jersey,

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Speaker 1: Like you know what I mean? So like, I feel like,

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Speaker 1: as a viewer, we are trained to accept the personalities

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Speaker 1: of other cities, and so now I honestly feel like

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00:22:44,556 --> 00:22:48,796
Speaker 1: Southside is taking a charge in training. And I say

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00:22:48,836 --> 00:22:53,316
Speaker 1: that lovingly and respectfully, but like really grabbing the viewer,

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00:22:53,516 --> 00:22:56,956
Speaker 1: like yoking them up and saying, catch up. This is Chicago,

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Speaker 1: this is what we do. Yeah. And if you don't

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Speaker 1: understand the Kimwood references and like, the show just doesn't care.

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00:23:05,276 --> 00:23:09,796
Speaker 1: And to me, the show does the best with clowning

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00:23:10,236 --> 00:23:12,836
Speaker 1: because if you're a true clown. I've set this so

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00:23:12,876 --> 00:23:16,156
Speaker 1: many times before. I mean it, A true clown doesn't

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Speaker 1: do a joke for a setup. A clown just stays

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Speaker 1: in it. And if they happen to get the laugh, great,

401
00:23:23,556 --> 00:23:25,956
Speaker 1: but the clown has to keep going. And that's the

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00:23:26,036 --> 00:23:28,876
Speaker 1: fucking difference you deliver the next joke. Yeah, you gotta

403
00:23:28,956 --> 00:23:31,676
Speaker 1: keep going. Yeah, that's a beautifully put that. We learned

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00:23:31,676 --> 00:23:34,116
Speaker 1: something from that about how to Yeah. So I feel

405
00:23:34,156 --> 00:23:38,676
Speaker 1: like Bob Newhart and you know, the creative team behind

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00:23:38,756 --> 00:23:42,196
Speaker 1: south Side like both, well fucking done. And so when

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Speaker 1: they invited me back the second season to be in

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Speaker 1: this episode that's a take on Ferris Bueller's Day Off,

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Speaker 1: which I grew up just like totally idolizing that movie,

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Speaker 1: I was like, god, damn, I won again. I just

411
00:23:57,996 --> 00:24:00,596
Speaker 1: grew up a nerd for that movie and knowing every

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Speaker 1: line and all of it. So it was just a

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Speaker 1: lot of fucking fun to do it. So in this episode,

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Speaker 1: Brenda and Turner's Day Off, it is a total parody

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Speaker 1: of the nineteen eighty six film Fairest Bueller's Day Off,

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Speaker 1: starring Matthew Broderick and your character Olivia. Like everyone in

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Speaker 1: the film is trying to find Brenda, who is the

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Speaker 1: fairest in this story. It's awesome. It's about black nerds.

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Speaker 1: I just love that these guys are sitting around. It's

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Speaker 1: white guys as black guys. They're on the set and

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Speaker 1: out of nowhere, this conversation unfolds about a book called

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Speaker 1: Web of Stars Saga One Quantum Tunnel, a story about Shakiare,

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00:24:40,116 --> 00:24:43,116
Speaker 1: a space miner stuck on a dead end rock. I mean,

424
00:24:43,196 --> 00:24:46,636
Speaker 1: come on, you can't make this stuff up. And they

425
00:24:46,636 --> 00:24:49,996
Speaker 1: play this scene to the t and here's the clip.

426
00:24:50,236 --> 00:24:52,196
Speaker 1: Let me just go ahead and dive in. I didn't

427
00:24:52,196 --> 00:24:55,996
Speaker 1: like you, his subhuman identical doppelganger. I mean, he's evil,

428
00:24:56,116 --> 00:24:58,956
Speaker 1: he's ugly, his girlfriend is deeply unhappy with his penis.

429
00:24:59,396 --> 00:25:01,676
Speaker 1: Every fight he gets into he gets to quote greenshit

430
00:25:01,796 --> 00:25:03,996
Speaker 1: unquote beat outible. A good villain is supposed to be

431
00:25:04,036 --> 00:25:05,836
Speaker 1: the hero of his own story, but this guy's a

432
00:25:05,876 --> 00:25:09,396
Speaker 1: disappointment to himself. I mean, it's catch phrases. Why am

433
00:25:09,436 --> 00:25:15,956
Speaker 1: I so whack Chicago over everything? All day? Those actors

434
00:25:16,076 --> 00:25:19,556
Speaker 1: are just so genius and they all Chicago man, So

435
00:25:19,596 --> 00:25:21,756
Speaker 1: I just gotta keep I'm gonna wave that flag. I

436
00:25:21,756 --> 00:25:24,076
Speaker 1: don't care. I love that scene. When Kleil and I

437
00:25:24,076 --> 00:25:26,116
Speaker 1: started talking about the show, this is the piece of

438
00:25:26,156 --> 00:25:28,076
Speaker 1: it that he kept on coming back to. Yeah, and

439
00:25:28,316 --> 00:25:31,556
Speaker 1: you know, because it's about black nerds, you identified, Yeah,

440
00:25:31,756 --> 00:25:35,636
Speaker 1: it's it's about black nerves. It's okay, fine, I missed that,

441
00:25:39,156 --> 00:25:43,796
Speaker 1: got it. I don't know how they got through that scene.

442
00:25:43,836 --> 00:25:48,516
Speaker 1: I mean, like, like seriously, those are comic geniuses who

443
00:25:48,516 --> 00:25:51,276
Speaker 1: are talking about and that's why this scene is so

444
00:25:51,396 --> 00:25:55,476
Speaker 1: perfect because it's for the black nerds. So it's like

445
00:25:55,556 --> 00:25:58,756
Speaker 1: it's that hood shit and then it's that nerd shit,

446
00:25:58,956 --> 00:26:02,716
Speaker 1: and it's all coming into one. Yeah. Yeah, So how

447
00:26:02,756 --> 00:26:06,036
Speaker 1: did you see this episode? In conversation with that movie?

448
00:26:06,556 --> 00:26:09,076
Speaker 1: She has to go and chase after the lead act.

449
00:26:09,476 --> 00:26:12,876
Speaker 1: So in a way, it feels like the character Rooney

450
00:26:12,916 --> 00:26:16,876
Speaker 1: that's chasing after Ferris. It also feels like this completely

451
00:26:17,036 --> 00:26:21,116
Speaker 1: made up character, which it is, and there was a

452
00:26:21,156 --> 00:26:24,556
Speaker 1: lot of freedom in that. But it's also Ferris's sister

453
00:26:25,316 --> 00:26:30,156
Speaker 1: Olivia in this particular episode of Southside is pulling from

454
00:26:30,236 --> 00:26:34,796
Speaker 1: a lot of the characters in the original movie, and

455
00:26:35,636 --> 00:26:38,436
Speaker 1: I was a little intimidated by it, to be honest

456
00:26:38,476 --> 00:26:40,116
Speaker 1: with you, and I just want to lean into this

457
00:26:40,156 --> 00:26:42,436
Speaker 1: a little more because in whatever it is, like twenty

458
00:26:42,436 --> 00:26:45,836
Speaker 1: something minutes, there's sort of like a scene for seeing,

459
00:26:45,996 --> 00:26:49,236
Speaker 1: you know, recreation of Ferris Bueller's day off, but in

460
00:26:49,276 --> 00:26:53,116
Speaker 1: a sort of black context, a Chicago black context. Instead

461
00:26:53,156 --> 00:26:55,756
Speaker 1: of going a Cubs game, they go to a Socks game, yes,

462
00:26:56,076 --> 00:26:58,876
Speaker 1: as they should. Instead of going to the Art Institute,

463
00:26:58,916 --> 00:27:01,916
Speaker 1: they go to the Disable Museum of African American History,

464
00:27:02,116 --> 00:27:06,076
Speaker 1: which I love, absolutely love. There's just a beautiful scene there.

465
00:27:06,316 --> 00:27:09,556
Speaker 1: It's like, you know, lyrical. Actually it's a silent moment

466
00:27:09,556 --> 00:27:12,196
Speaker 1: where they're just looking at the art. I love that because,

467
00:27:12,716 --> 00:27:15,436
Speaker 1: first of all, I had the great pleasure of meeting

468
00:27:15,836 --> 00:27:20,596
Speaker 1: Margaret Burrows, the founder of the DuSable Museum, when I

469
00:27:20,676 --> 00:27:23,436
Speaker 1: was eight years old. You know, she was an educator

470
00:27:23,676 --> 00:27:27,436
Speaker 1: and she also went to my grammar school and so like,

471
00:27:28,116 --> 00:27:32,516
Speaker 1: I've known some of these heroes my entire life. So

472
00:27:32,636 --> 00:27:35,476
Speaker 1: we grew up going to the Dussable Museum. I held

473
00:27:35,516 --> 00:27:38,436
Speaker 1: hands with my first boyfriend on the field trip at

474
00:27:38,436 --> 00:27:43,196
Speaker 1: the DuSable Museum. I know, shout out to you, Brian Daniels.

475
00:27:44,356 --> 00:27:47,876
Speaker 1: So those things are iconic, but you don't see it

476
00:27:48,236 --> 00:27:52,316
Speaker 1: on film. Yeah, yeah, So seeing it in this episode

477
00:27:52,436 --> 00:27:54,356
Speaker 1: it gives me a lot of pleasure and joy and

478
00:27:54,396 --> 00:27:57,236
Speaker 1: I'm like, see how hard that was? Not? Yes, there's

479
00:27:57,276 --> 00:28:01,196
Speaker 1: one more famous scene to shout out. So everyone listening

480
00:28:01,236 --> 00:28:03,476
Speaker 1: to this who is of a certain generation remembers the

481
00:28:03,516 --> 00:28:07,196
Speaker 1: famous scene and faris Bueller when he's not in school

482
00:28:07,236 --> 00:28:10,276
Speaker 1: that day. Of course. It's it's in the opening first

483
00:28:10,356 --> 00:28:14,196
Speaker 1: quarter of the film, and his teacher is calling out

484
00:28:14,236 --> 00:28:21,956
Speaker 1: his name and it's very monotone, Bueller Bueller, Bueller Bueller.

485
00:28:23,036 --> 00:28:27,716
Speaker 1: So so there's there's a riff on that obviously in

486
00:28:27,836 --> 00:28:29,996
Speaker 1: south In this episode of south Side, it's out a

487
00:28:29,996 --> 00:28:33,196
Speaker 1: white Sox game. There's actually a sock full of French

488
00:28:33,236 --> 00:28:36,316
Speaker 1: fries there. And she's also calling somebody's name who is

489
00:28:36,396 --> 00:28:39,636
Speaker 1: Bulah with a you know, like like Bullah shoot Smith

490
00:28:39,676 --> 00:28:46,876
Speaker 1: to school right next to my house, Bula Bulla, somebody

491
00:28:46,916 --> 00:28:53,796
Speaker 1: name last a woman's first names. Yeah, oh man, it's

492
00:28:53,836 --> 00:28:56,476
Speaker 1: so so good. I was just gonna say one last

493
00:28:56,516 --> 00:28:58,996
Speaker 1: thing about this. You know, you were talking about clowning,

494
00:28:58,996 --> 00:29:00,756
Speaker 1: and you're talking about you know, Cleil, you were even

495
00:29:00,756 --> 00:29:02,756
Speaker 1: talking about the shows that you think is like and

496
00:29:02,876 --> 00:29:06,316
Speaker 1: South Side feels like the Simpsons, Like they're all of

497
00:29:06,316 --> 00:29:09,556
Speaker 1: these personalities that are characters in and I'm of cells

498
00:29:09,556 --> 00:29:13,316
Speaker 1: and they populate this world. It happens to be Englewood

499
00:29:13,716 --> 00:29:15,996
Speaker 1: on the South Side of Chicago, and in all of

500
00:29:16,036 --> 00:29:18,916
Speaker 1: its details too, it really is that place. But it

501
00:29:18,956 --> 00:29:22,036
Speaker 1: also feels like these humans who were like animated and

502
00:29:22,076 --> 00:29:24,236
Speaker 1: alive and like you can connect with them in a

503
00:29:24,236 --> 00:29:26,596
Speaker 1: way that you were saying, slick no matter where you're

504
00:29:26,636 --> 00:29:29,996
Speaker 1: from or where you're connecting to this show. I think

505
00:29:30,036 --> 00:29:33,716
Speaker 1: that that is so accurate. And on point one day,

506
00:29:33,756 --> 00:29:37,356
Speaker 1: talking to their main director, Michael Blyden is just super

507
00:29:37,396 --> 00:29:41,836
Speaker 1: smart and a nice guy. He actually described it as

508
00:29:41,876 --> 00:29:45,236
Speaker 1: such that it was like the Simpsons. Some of these

509
00:29:45,356 --> 00:29:47,916
Speaker 1: characters appear and reappear, and they have you know, they

510
00:29:47,956 --> 00:29:51,476
Speaker 1: come in different forms, and that to me, that feels

511
00:29:51,516 --> 00:29:56,396
Speaker 1: like a creative team that's thoughtful because they're creating an ensemble.

512
00:29:56,756 --> 00:29:59,436
Speaker 1: So you might see an actor in one season as

513
00:29:59,516 --> 00:30:04,236
Speaker 1: one character and then they come back another season on

514
00:30:04,356 --> 00:30:07,516
Speaker 1: South Side and they're a completely different character. And it's

515
00:30:07,516 --> 00:30:10,956
Speaker 1: the testament to uh, not only the skill set of

516
00:30:10,996 --> 00:30:15,316
Speaker 1: the actor, but like the show doesn't take itself too seriously,

517
00:30:15,396 --> 00:30:18,196
Speaker 1: but it also is like, I don't know, building this

518
00:30:18,316 --> 00:30:21,516
Speaker 1: crazy multiverse, and I'm into it. So yeah, I think

519
00:30:21,516 --> 00:30:24,076
Speaker 1: your dad, you're spot on, Ben. So we're gonna talk

520
00:30:24,076 --> 00:30:27,396
Speaker 1: about another show set in Chicago. FXI show on Hulu

521
00:30:27,476 --> 00:30:32,636
Speaker 1: called The Bear. We'll be right back after the break,

522
00:30:44,916 --> 00:30:47,196
Speaker 1: all right, So we're gonna talk about The Bear here, guys.

523
00:30:47,556 --> 00:30:49,916
Speaker 1: And this is another show set in Chicago. It just

524
00:30:49,996 --> 00:30:52,916
Speaker 1: finished its first season, and the premise of the show

525
00:30:53,236 --> 00:30:56,316
Speaker 1: this guy Carmen. He comes back home to run the

526
00:30:56,396 --> 00:31:02,156
Speaker 1: family's Italian beef shop. You know, carlimanbra Speedina. Can you

527
00:31:02,196 --> 00:31:04,796
Speaker 1: start new shot in there from I need my fellow first,

528
00:31:04,876 --> 00:31:10,796
Speaker 1: Jeff Carliman beef It had potentials. We have sister, but

529
00:31:10,836 --> 00:31:12,956
Speaker 1: you could punch him, blanche him, freez him frying before

530
00:31:12,956 --> 00:31:18,956
Speaker 1: the beach. Right, Okay, his brother has died by suicide

531
00:31:19,516 --> 00:31:22,236
Speaker 1: and his brother had run this Italian beef shop, and

532
00:31:22,276 --> 00:31:25,556
Speaker 1: now Carmen is back in Chicago, this high end chef

533
00:31:25,556 --> 00:31:27,796
Speaker 1: who was working in New York City, and now he

534
00:31:27,836 --> 00:31:30,596
Speaker 1: wants to run the Italian beef place like it's like

535
00:31:30,636 --> 00:31:33,316
Speaker 1: it's a Michelin Star restaurant. He doesn't exactly want to

536
00:31:33,436 --> 00:31:37,356
Speaker 1: run it, but he has to run it. Carmi, the

537
00:31:37,396 --> 00:31:41,676
Speaker 1: main character, aka the Bear that's his family nickname, is

538
00:31:41,716 --> 00:31:44,916
Speaker 1: this really troubled soul. He's come from the highest end

539
00:31:44,916 --> 00:31:47,036
Speaker 1: of the cooking world. He's been to the top of

540
00:31:47,076 --> 00:31:50,756
Speaker 1: the mountain, and he's basically had his butt kicked. His

541
00:31:50,876 --> 00:31:53,716
Speaker 1: self esteem is at its slowest, and he finds himself

542
00:31:53,796 --> 00:31:57,356
Speaker 1: inheriting the family business. And it's a shit show. They

543
00:31:57,436 --> 00:31:59,756
Speaker 1: just got a C rating from the Board of Health,

544
00:32:00,196 --> 00:32:05,076
Speaker 1: so they're they're barely making it. I mean, do you

545
00:32:05,156 --> 00:32:08,396
Speaker 1: love this show as much as we do? I have

546
00:32:08,676 --> 00:32:13,636
Speaker 1: such a this role reaction to this show because I

547
00:32:13,676 --> 00:32:16,316
Speaker 1: felt like it snatched my wig off. I was like, God, damn,

548
00:32:16,396 --> 00:32:19,876
Speaker 1: I'm not even wearing one today, and this is snatching

549
00:32:19,956 --> 00:32:23,876
Speaker 1: off the good place front. What is this short answer? Yes,

550
00:32:24,076 --> 00:32:27,356
Speaker 1: it's a good goddamn show, all right. Usually I watched

551
00:32:27,356 --> 00:32:29,916
Speaker 1: a show with a stank. I especially when it's in Chicago,

552
00:32:29,956 --> 00:32:31,596
Speaker 1: because I'm like, how come Nane call me and I

553
00:32:31,636 --> 00:32:35,036
Speaker 1: don't like that shit? No way, Um, I'm just kidding,

554
00:32:35,076 --> 00:32:39,356
Speaker 1: but I absolutely love that show. That show is definitely

555
00:32:39,356 --> 00:32:43,036
Speaker 1: written for me for so many different reasons. I have

556
00:32:43,236 --> 00:32:46,676
Speaker 1: worked in the restaurant world as a server. Oh wow.

557
00:32:46,996 --> 00:32:49,556
Speaker 1: I'm definitely someone who grew up in kitchens. I come

558
00:32:49,676 --> 00:32:52,916
Speaker 1: from three generations of cooks. Like I grew up in

559
00:32:52,916 --> 00:32:55,076
Speaker 1: a household where you could not be in the kitchen

560
00:32:55,516 --> 00:32:59,276
Speaker 1: with my mother unless you were talking about food or

561
00:32:59,396 --> 00:33:03,196
Speaker 1: unless you were chopping. There was no like no, And

562
00:33:03,236 --> 00:33:05,316
Speaker 1: I'm in the same way when I'm in the kitchen.

563
00:33:05,836 --> 00:33:08,156
Speaker 1: Let's talk more about this sense of setting in city.

564
00:33:08,516 --> 00:33:11,396
Speaker 1: Doesn't matter that this show is set in Chicago, Like,

565
00:33:11,596 --> 00:33:12,996
Speaker 1: you know, could it be set somewhere else or is

566
00:33:13,036 --> 00:33:18,156
Speaker 1: that part of its meaning? You could argue that this

567
00:33:18,196 --> 00:33:22,996
Speaker 1: show could be set in Philadelphia. M I see why

568
00:33:23,036 --> 00:33:26,716
Speaker 1: you're picking Philly. It's like you can it's a it's

569
00:33:26,156 --> 00:33:30,796
Speaker 1: a blue collar, tough town as cold as this. It's

570
00:33:30,836 --> 00:33:34,596
Speaker 1: like you could swap out the Italian beef arguably for

571
00:33:34,796 --> 00:33:38,396
Speaker 1: a Philly cheese steak. This that's just an example, but

572
00:33:38,836 --> 00:33:42,436
Speaker 1: the Italian beef is a superior sandwich. Okay, just for

573
00:33:42,516 --> 00:33:46,636
Speaker 1: the record, Just for the record, And I understand why

574
00:33:46,636 --> 00:33:49,516
Speaker 1: it's set in Chicago. Really, are you really are living

575
00:33:49,556 --> 00:33:52,476
Speaker 1: and die in Chicago? Yeah? I think this show is

576
00:33:52,596 --> 00:33:56,276
Speaker 1: very Chicago. I also if you just like look at it,

577
00:33:56,436 --> 00:33:59,476
Speaker 1: like just take the pilot episode and you just step

578
00:33:59,556 --> 00:34:04,196
Speaker 1: back from a technical standpoint, Yes, Like the character comes in,

579
00:34:04,356 --> 00:34:08,116
Speaker 1: he has there's this expository information we don't know too

580
00:34:08,236 --> 00:34:10,836
Speaker 1: much about. He has a challenge, he has to figure

581
00:34:10,836 --> 00:34:13,516
Speaker 1: the shit out. He goes through the bullshit with the team,

582
00:34:13,716 --> 00:34:15,676
Speaker 1: and then at the end of the episode he's like,

583
00:34:15,756 --> 00:34:17,916
Speaker 1: fuck it, I'm gonna go I'm gonna go against it.

584
00:34:18,036 --> 00:34:21,516
Speaker 1: So like it's set up very neatly in terms of

585
00:34:21,596 --> 00:34:26,916
Speaker 1: TV Land, but there's something about it that feels very Chicago.

586
00:34:27,276 --> 00:34:28,596
Speaker 1: You know, what the fuck are you know the Kennedy

587
00:34:29,436 --> 00:34:34,676
Speaker 1: chill the fuck out, Citer listen, Naperville, No fucking Cicero's

588
00:34:34,716 --> 00:34:38,796
Speaker 1: in will met Now you gotta get on the That's right,

589
00:34:38,796 --> 00:34:43,996
Speaker 1: that's right, that's so we're hurry to see that motherfucker. Well,

590
00:34:43,996 --> 00:34:46,476
Speaker 1: I know Ben has uh, I mean been being there

591
00:34:46,556 --> 00:34:49,116
Speaker 1: and for him this is daily life. For me, it's

592
00:34:49,156 --> 00:34:51,556
Speaker 1: you know it's just an occasional visit. But all these

593
00:34:51,596 --> 00:34:56,236
Speaker 1: scenes of the elevated train, the l the skyscrapers off

594
00:34:56,236 --> 00:35:00,636
Speaker 1: in the distance, this sense of like a grimy place. Uh.

595
00:35:00,716 --> 00:35:04,756
Speaker 1: I personally love the interplay of like the old immigrant

596
00:35:04,796 --> 00:35:09,036
Speaker 1: Italian heritage and the new kind of black and Latino

597
00:35:09,236 --> 00:35:12,596
Speaker 1: presence in the kitchen, as this like mashup of old

598
00:35:12,676 --> 00:35:16,236
Speaker 1: and new. That's so interesting. Khalil talking about griminess and

599
00:35:16,276 --> 00:35:19,076
Speaker 1: you even saying, you know, slick, that it might be Philly.

600
00:35:19,116 --> 00:35:24,796
Speaker 1: Like to me, in this show, Chicago equals grit, grime, toughness, Right,

601
00:35:24,876 --> 00:35:27,036
Speaker 1: there's this idea that they want to convey and you're right,

602
00:35:27,076 --> 00:35:29,556
Speaker 1: like working class and sort of this kind of you know,

603
00:35:29,916 --> 00:35:32,396
Speaker 1: low end food that people love. You know, it's not

604
00:35:32,516 --> 00:35:35,316
Speaker 1: high end food. I don't think there's a single shot

605
00:35:35,756 --> 00:35:38,716
Speaker 1: with sunshine in the entire show, Like it's either a

606
00:35:38,836 --> 00:35:42,476
Speaker 1: night shot or it's overcast. Like there's such sort of

607
00:35:42,556 --> 00:35:46,476
Speaker 1: you know, grimness you know throughout the whole thing. You

608
00:35:46,516 --> 00:35:49,276
Speaker 1: know is that there is an idea of Chicago. But

609
00:35:49,356 --> 00:35:52,436
Speaker 1: of course, like I'll just compare it to the South Side,

610
00:35:52,836 --> 00:35:55,996
Speaker 1: Like there are no neighborhood shots. There's like Khalil, you

611
00:35:55,996 --> 00:35:58,436
Speaker 1: were talking about things like the l and the lake

612
00:35:58,796 --> 00:36:02,356
Speaker 1: and buildings, and sometimes we're traveling and then we're inside

613
00:36:02,436 --> 00:36:05,076
Speaker 1: interiors or we're in alleys, but we're never in like

614
00:36:05,236 --> 00:36:08,916
Speaker 1: a place, a community where people live, and certainly not

615
00:36:08,916 --> 00:36:11,876
Speaker 1: with sunshine and you know, neighbors and things like that.

616
00:36:12,276 --> 00:36:16,076
Speaker 1: I love that. To me, that is a very specific

617
00:36:16,516 --> 00:36:21,556
Speaker 1: and smart idea because when I watch shows that are

618
00:36:21,636 --> 00:36:24,836
Speaker 1: set in like northern Europe, I love those. I love

619
00:36:24,876 --> 00:36:28,076
Speaker 1: the Ship to set in Finland and Scotland because they're

620
00:36:28,116 --> 00:36:31,796
Speaker 1: like these heavy blue overtone you know, it's great, it's

621
00:36:31,876 --> 00:36:35,436
Speaker 1: not sunny. This show plays on this idea of the

622
00:36:35,516 --> 00:36:38,276
Speaker 1: kitchen itself as a melting pot, as a place where

623
00:36:38,316 --> 00:36:41,956
Speaker 1: culture comes together, and I think that's really really beautiful.

624
00:36:41,996 --> 00:36:44,516
Speaker 1: We want to play a scene though, of like when

625
00:36:44,556 --> 00:36:48,636
Speaker 1: culture comes together and then shit goes crazy, like like,

626
00:36:48,956 --> 00:36:52,196
Speaker 1: because as much as we might romanticize the idea of

627
00:36:52,196 --> 00:36:55,236
Speaker 1: a melting pot, these folks are not always getting along.

628
00:36:55,716 --> 00:36:59,316
Speaker 1: There's you know, the Latino folks, there's black folks, there's

629
00:36:59,556 --> 00:37:01,836
Speaker 1: you know, the white guys who are our Italian heritage,

630
00:37:01,836 --> 00:37:04,516
Speaker 1: and all of their ethnic identities are really played up

631
00:37:04,596 --> 00:37:06,836
Speaker 1: to some degree in this show. So we're going to

632
00:37:06,876 --> 00:37:10,076
Speaker 1: play a clip of Richie, the Italian cousin who was

633
00:37:10,116 --> 00:37:12,596
Speaker 1: the best friend of the guy who died, who is

634
00:37:12,676 --> 00:37:16,236
Speaker 1: just kind of like your asshole's asshole, but he's something

635
00:37:16,276 --> 00:37:19,836
Speaker 1: fundamentally endearing about this guy. And then Sydney, who is

636
00:37:19,876 --> 00:37:22,756
Speaker 1: this young black woman who is super well educated. She

637
00:37:22,796 --> 00:37:25,396
Speaker 1: went to Culinary Institute of the Arts, and she comes

638
00:37:25,396 --> 00:37:27,996
Speaker 1: into this kitchen and she's like, what is happening here?

639
00:37:28,356 --> 00:37:30,916
Speaker 1: Except she grew up eating that food and she thinks

640
00:37:30,956 --> 00:37:32,596
Speaker 1: it's an amazing place and she wants to help to

641
00:37:32,676 --> 00:37:34,996
Speaker 1: change it. So here's a scene from Richie and Sydney

642
00:37:35,236 --> 00:37:39,116
Speaker 1: trying to figure each other out. You know, the restaurant

643
00:37:39,316 --> 00:37:43,876
Speaker 1: could be good, like I know, you know that, Like

644
00:37:43,916 --> 00:37:45,556
Speaker 1: it doesn't have to be a place where the food

645
00:37:45,596 --> 00:37:48,156
Speaker 1: is shitty and where everybody acts shitty and feels shitty.

646
00:37:48,196 --> 00:37:50,516
Speaker 1: Like it could be a good legit spot. Okay, you

647
00:37:50,556 --> 00:37:52,356
Speaker 1: know what, Sydney're getting a little aggressive, and I think

648
00:37:52,356 --> 00:37:55,156
Speaker 1: maybe you should just pause and take a breath before

649
00:37:55,156 --> 00:37:58,476
Speaker 1: you start driving. Man or woman. I'm not discriminating. It's

650
00:37:58,556 --> 00:38:04,076
Speaker 1: dangerous to get behind the wheel when you're hysterical. It's

651
00:38:04,116 --> 00:38:06,156
Speaker 1: so interesting, I mean, I love that you picked that

652
00:38:06,196 --> 00:38:09,636
Speaker 1: clip Khalil of Richie and Sydney and like a sort

653
00:38:09,636 --> 00:38:14,516
Speaker 1: of like a crux of attensions. You know, older, younger, white, Black.

654
00:38:14,836 --> 00:38:17,956
Speaker 1: He didn't even finish a technical school. She's you know,

655
00:38:18,036 --> 00:38:22,636
Speaker 1: super well educated. Yeah, and you know those divisions in

656
00:38:22,716 --> 00:38:26,236
Speaker 1: this setting which brings them together. That certainly doesn't have

657
00:38:26,316 --> 00:38:30,156
Speaker 1: to be Chicago, you know, any city that has a diversity.

658
00:38:30,436 --> 00:38:32,716
Speaker 1: How can we bring people who are different together? What's

659
00:38:32,716 --> 00:38:36,156
Speaker 1: a place that can bring them together? And once they're together, shit, Like,

660
00:38:36,156 --> 00:38:38,756
Speaker 1: there's all sorts of drama that's going to unfold and slick.

661
00:38:38,796 --> 00:38:40,636
Speaker 1: Maybe you can talk about this. This isn't a lot

662
00:38:40,676 --> 00:38:43,796
Speaker 1: of ways a wider show than The South Side, of course,

663
00:38:44,076 --> 00:38:47,116
Speaker 1: but there's this way that the Kitchen is written almost

664
00:38:47,156 --> 00:38:49,276
Speaker 1: like a stage play, Like you could write a play

665
00:38:49,316 --> 00:38:51,716
Speaker 1: that's set in the kitchen, and because it's a workplace,

666
00:38:51,756 --> 00:38:54,476
Speaker 1: it brings all these different people together. How did you

667
00:38:54,516 --> 00:38:57,236
Speaker 1: see that in terms of like racial dynamics and letting

668
00:38:57,276 --> 00:39:00,476
Speaker 1: them play out in this setting? In many ways, when

669
00:39:00,556 --> 00:39:02,196
Speaker 1: I watched this, I was like, well, this is a

670
00:39:02,236 --> 00:39:07,516
Speaker 1: little bit of a documentary because kitchens can be extraordinarily

671
00:39:08,436 --> 00:39:12,196
Speaker 1: not just the kids and restaurants can be so segregated.

672
00:39:12,956 --> 00:39:17,916
Speaker 1: You might see dishwashers that might be Latine or Latin

673
00:39:18,076 --> 00:39:21,116
Speaker 1: X or Hispanic or whatever. You might see some cooks

674
00:39:21,116 --> 00:39:24,796
Speaker 1: on the line that are mostly male and uh, you

675
00:39:24,836 --> 00:39:29,316
Speaker 1: know a variety of ethnic and racisms such there aren't

676
00:39:29,436 --> 00:39:32,956
Speaker 1: very many women or films in the kitchen. Usually the

677
00:39:34,036 --> 00:39:37,436
Speaker 1: chef de cuisine is you know, some really fucked up

678
00:39:37,516 --> 00:39:40,876
Speaker 1: angry white dude. Uh. You know, you might come into

679
00:39:41,076 --> 00:39:44,156
Speaker 1: the whole stand and see someone of color. You might

680
00:39:44,196 --> 00:39:46,676
Speaker 1: see like, you know, I've also seen the kitchens where

681
00:39:46,676 --> 00:39:49,036
Speaker 1: it's like you got you know, black folks in the

682
00:39:49,116 --> 00:39:51,476
Speaker 1: back chopping things, but not on the floor. So like

683
00:39:51,756 --> 00:39:56,796
Speaker 1: it's a it's a very hierarchical, very hierarchical. It's high. Yes,

684
00:39:56,996 --> 00:40:01,076
Speaker 1: everything is at play, the hierarchy, the patriarchy. Yeah. So

685
00:40:01,756 --> 00:40:05,196
Speaker 1: in this show, I love that they're to me, they're

686
00:40:05,236 --> 00:40:09,876
Speaker 1: just a band of misfits. That's really it is, like

687
00:40:09,916 --> 00:40:12,676
Speaker 1: he returns to Misfit Island and he's trying to get

688
00:40:12,716 --> 00:40:15,316
Speaker 1: them ready for the Macy's Parade and they just not

689
00:40:15,916 --> 00:40:21,636
Speaker 1: you know, the Macy's Parade, right, right, But I love

690
00:40:21,716 --> 00:40:28,436
Speaker 1: that he comes back to try to implement this French brigade,

691
00:40:29,356 --> 00:40:33,596
Speaker 1: which is like a terrible idea. It's also like I

692
00:40:33,676 --> 00:40:38,316
Speaker 1: get the discipline of it, but it's problematic. And so

693
00:40:38,436 --> 00:40:41,556
Speaker 1: you have this, uh, this young black woman who has

694
00:40:41,636 --> 00:40:44,516
Speaker 1: gone to the CIA, so you know that she knows

695
00:40:44,516 --> 00:40:46,636
Speaker 1: how to sharpen her knives and chop it up and

696
00:40:46,716 --> 00:40:49,756
Speaker 1: make a stew And that's the Culinary Institute of America.

697
00:40:49,836 --> 00:40:54,076
Speaker 1: It's not the Central Intelligence. No, it's not. So you

698
00:40:54,156 --> 00:40:58,156
Speaker 1: have that, but then you also have the like she's

699
00:40:58,196 --> 00:41:02,116
Speaker 1: basically coming in, she's saying like, we can do something

700
00:41:02,276 --> 00:41:05,036
Speaker 1: better and coming in with a better business model. I

701
00:41:05,156 --> 00:41:09,636
Speaker 1: completely understand that, coming from a mother who managed and

702
00:41:09,756 --> 00:41:15,116
Speaker 1: operated family owned businesses, so I understood how I got

703
00:41:15,156 --> 00:41:19,156
Speaker 1: everything in this show. So it feels really really real

704
00:41:19,356 --> 00:41:22,876
Speaker 1: to me. We have a question for you, So, um,

705
00:41:23,076 --> 00:41:26,076
Speaker 1: if we can get you hired to write for season

706
00:41:26,116 --> 00:41:29,476
Speaker 1: two of The Bear, what would you do differently? I

707
00:41:29,556 --> 00:41:32,956
Speaker 1: think the show does not take for granted that the

708
00:41:32,996 --> 00:41:36,316
Speaker 1: audience is dumb and that you have to feed them

709
00:41:36,436 --> 00:41:38,956
Speaker 1: pardoning you know, pardon the pun, but that you have

710
00:41:39,036 --> 00:41:43,116
Speaker 1: to spoon feed them everything. And as a writer, that

711
00:41:43,156 --> 00:41:46,476
Speaker 1: makes me happy. And so if you put me on

712
00:41:46,556 --> 00:41:50,476
Speaker 1: season two as a writer, like the thing I would

713
00:41:50,516 --> 00:41:53,116
Speaker 1: do differently is like become a writer and then put

714
00:41:53,156 --> 00:41:59,556
Speaker 1: myself in the cast. And that's what I wanted to try, right,

715
00:42:00,556 --> 00:42:02,796
Speaker 1: I would do it like like in Rocky you know

716
00:42:02,876 --> 00:42:05,556
Speaker 1: how how Nick his coach who's like this, you know,

717
00:42:05,636 --> 00:42:08,116
Speaker 1: quintessential Irish guy turns out to be Jewish and like

718
00:42:08,196 --> 00:42:10,676
Speaker 1: you know Rocky three or for something, that's what I

719
00:42:10,676 --> 00:42:12,796
Speaker 1: would do. It turns out that all these Italian guys

720
00:42:12,796 --> 00:42:15,756
Speaker 1: are Jewish, and that's and then like it moves into

721
00:42:15,836 --> 00:42:19,276
Speaker 1: like you know, Skokie and the synagogues and they start

722
00:42:19,316 --> 00:42:23,076
Speaker 1: selling they start selling Italian beef on bagels, right, you know,

723
00:42:23,156 --> 00:42:25,116
Speaker 1: like a little schnitzel, and like you know, I would

724
00:42:25,116 --> 00:42:28,796
Speaker 1: like you love it? Yeah, so oh well, well, Slick,

725
00:42:28,836 --> 00:42:31,516
Speaker 1: it has been amazing to have you on the show.

726
00:42:32,196 --> 00:42:36,276
Speaker 1: You know, your career is blooming at this time. You

727
00:42:36,396 --> 00:42:40,276
Speaker 1: just close to play nineteen nineteen inspired by the poetry

728
00:42:40,316 --> 00:42:43,076
Speaker 1: of Eviewing, and I know Ben got a chance to

729
00:42:43,116 --> 00:42:46,316
Speaker 1: see the play, and so we're just super excited that

730
00:42:46,396 --> 00:42:48,396
Speaker 1: you took some time out to join us when some

731
00:42:48,436 --> 00:42:50,396
Speaker 1: of my best friends are today. We wish you all

732
00:42:50,436 --> 00:42:53,116
Speaker 1: the best in your continued work time as a construct,

733
00:42:53,156 --> 00:42:54,836
Speaker 1: and I'm glad I got to spend it with two

734
00:42:54,876 --> 00:42:59,596
Speaker 1: people whom I just adore. Thank you both, seriously. Yeah yeah,

735
00:42:59,596 --> 00:43:02,556
Speaker 1: And you're talking about our aligned paths, me and you

736
00:43:02,636 --> 00:43:05,196
Speaker 1: and sort of like imagining the city. I'm with you.

737
00:43:05,396 --> 00:43:09,036
Speaker 1: Let's go, let's keep on doing it. Slick is raising

738
00:43:09,316 --> 00:43:12,916
Speaker 1: arms and making these giant muscles, giant muscles. Let's go.

739
00:43:13,516 --> 00:43:25,196
Speaker 1: Let's fucking go, man, Khalil. I feel like I'm not

740
00:43:25,276 --> 00:43:27,396
Speaker 1: done talking about the Bear. I'm still thinking about it

741
00:43:27,436 --> 00:43:30,716
Speaker 1: in terms of Chicago. Well, that's what a great television does, right,

742
00:43:30,836 --> 00:43:33,516
Speaker 1: keeps the conversation going, That's what a great podcast is.

743
00:43:33,516 --> 00:43:36,916
Speaker 1: It's just a starter for conversation. But but you know,

744
00:43:37,076 --> 00:43:40,396
Speaker 1: I'm thinking about as it's Chicago aspects, you know, watching

745
00:43:40,396 --> 00:43:42,996
Speaker 1: it in this way, and I think it's different than

746
00:43:43,076 --> 00:43:45,516
Speaker 1: Southside in a lot of ways. Okay, break it down

747
00:43:45,836 --> 00:43:48,916
Speaker 1: to me. It feels like it's made by outsiders. And

748
00:43:49,396 --> 00:43:51,956
Speaker 1: there are all these sort of like literal billboards and

749
00:43:51,996 --> 00:43:54,796
Speaker 1: I'm using literal correctly here. There'll be these billboards here

750
00:43:54,836 --> 00:43:58,276
Speaker 1: that are like giant Chicago nests, things like lord, this

751
00:43:58,476 --> 00:44:01,236
Speaker 1: like terrible drink that people drink here, Like signposts like

752
00:44:01,396 --> 00:44:04,836
Speaker 1: remember this is Chicago, this is Chicago. This is Chicago.

753
00:44:05,156 --> 00:44:08,476
Speaker 1: Here's the l here's the lake. It's all exteriors, like

754
00:44:08,556 --> 00:44:10,756
Speaker 1: it gets a lot the Chicago things wrong, you know,

755
00:44:10,796 --> 00:44:13,716
Speaker 1: and this is like the nippicky Chicago stuff. But also

756
00:44:13,796 --> 00:44:15,596
Speaker 1: like I'm okay with it. And I think I'm okay

757
00:44:15,596 --> 00:44:19,036
Speaker 1: with it because because the intimacy of that, those kitchen

758
00:44:19,076 --> 00:44:21,236
Speaker 1: scenes that we talked about, which in a way could

759
00:44:21,276 --> 00:44:24,756
Speaker 1: be anywhere, but like the dynamics that happened there. Yeah,

760
00:44:24,796 --> 00:44:27,276
Speaker 1: you know, I probably don't feel the same way you

761
00:44:27,316 --> 00:44:31,436
Speaker 1: do about it. It's more outsider perspective and the way

762
00:44:31,476 --> 00:44:33,996
Speaker 1: that they use all these symbols of Chicago. And I'll

763
00:44:34,036 --> 00:44:37,556
Speaker 1: tell you why bring it? Why? Because yeah, because when

764
00:44:37,596 --> 00:44:39,796
Speaker 1: we worked at Hyde Park Computers, a place where we

765
00:44:39,876 --> 00:44:42,836
Speaker 1: met when we were fourteen. Yeah, fourteen years old. You

766
00:44:42,876 --> 00:44:45,556
Speaker 1: were my boss. Boom. That's right. We were in a

767
00:44:45,636 --> 00:44:48,596
Speaker 1: place although it wasn't a kitchen, it was kind of like,

768
00:44:48,796 --> 00:44:52,356
Speaker 1: what is happening on this television show? You are writing

769
00:44:52,356 --> 00:44:55,636
Speaker 1: our next paycheck right here? Hyde Park Computer is the

770
00:44:55,676 --> 00:44:59,276
Speaker 1: TV show, the sitcom. You had Ed the Irish Catholic John,

771
00:44:59,356 --> 00:45:02,196
Speaker 1: the Jewish guy from New Jersey. You had Jeff, the

772
00:45:02,236 --> 00:45:05,556
Speaker 1: Polish descended guy from the North Side, Abraham, the Mexican

773
00:45:05,596 --> 00:45:09,036
Speaker 1: American descended along with Jerry Man. Holy cow, you had

774
00:45:09,196 --> 00:45:12,316
Speaker 1: black guy Aaron, you had Jeff who was Chinese American

775
00:45:12,836 --> 00:45:15,036
Speaker 1: and who was from the University of Chicago. It was

776
00:45:15,116 --> 00:45:18,396
Speaker 1: this crazy stew of people. All we wanted to make

777
00:45:18,516 --> 00:45:21,196
Speaker 1: was the perfect computer store. We just wanted to make

778
00:45:21,396 --> 00:45:24,156
Speaker 1: the best computers are Pole. You're right, but think about it,

779
00:45:24,236 --> 00:45:28,436
Speaker 1: we had our own French brigade of making computers back then. Yeah,

780
00:45:28,436 --> 00:45:31,196
Speaker 1: and so in a way, the show actually makes me

781
00:45:31,236 --> 00:45:35,076
Speaker 1: feel more like a Chicago because, unlike what most people

782
00:45:35,116 --> 00:45:38,436
Speaker 1: think of this, you know, crazy segregated city, which it

783
00:45:38,556 --> 00:45:42,316
Speaker 1: is true, there are these pockets of amazingness where people

784
00:45:42,396 --> 00:45:44,996
Speaker 1: from all walks of life do live life together. They

785
00:45:44,996 --> 00:45:48,156
Speaker 1: work together, they play together, they love together. And that's

786
00:45:48,196 --> 00:45:51,836
Speaker 1: what I love about both Southside and The Bear. Yeah

787
00:45:51,876 --> 00:45:54,156
Speaker 1: you said it, and Slick said this so beautifully when

788
00:45:54,196 --> 00:45:57,356
Speaker 1: she said you need to forge relationships with communities that

789
00:45:57,476 --> 00:46:00,156
Speaker 1: these TV shows and that you can make the universal

790
00:46:00,196 --> 00:46:02,316
Speaker 1: in the specific two things that are going to stay

791
00:46:02,356 --> 00:46:05,156
Speaker 1: with me. Oh, I love it, oh Man. Yes. And

792
00:46:05,236 --> 00:46:07,676
Speaker 1: you know, for the second season of The Bear, when

793
00:46:07,716 --> 00:46:11,356
Speaker 1: it's said in a Jewish delicatessen becomes Manny's Delhi. I

794
00:46:11,356 --> 00:46:13,636
Speaker 1: think we're gonna even develop these themes more, you know,

795
00:46:13,636 --> 00:46:15,756
Speaker 1: like when they have the matzo ball fight. I mean,

796
00:46:15,756 --> 00:46:18,876
Speaker 1: this is gonna be amazing, all right. I'll want to

797
00:46:18,876 --> 00:46:22,796
Speaker 1: look forward to that, all right, man, Love you, Love you.

798
00:46:27,076 --> 00:46:29,436
Speaker 1: Some of My Best Friends Are is a production of

799
00:46:29,476 --> 00:46:32,836
Speaker 1: Pushkin Industries. The show is written and hosted by me

800
00:46:33,076 --> 00:46:36,556
Speaker 1: Khalil Dubron Muhammad and my best friend Ben Austin. It's

801
00:46:36,596 --> 00:46:40,716
Speaker 1: produced by John Assanti and Lucy Sullivan. Our editor is

802
00:46:40,796 --> 00:46:44,556
Speaker 1: Jasmine Morris, our engineer is Amanda ka Wang, and our

803
00:46:44,636 --> 00:46:48,956
Speaker 1: executive producer is Mia LaBelle. At Pushkin thanks to Leita Mulad,

804
00:46:49,396 --> 00:46:54,836
Speaker 1: Julia Barton, Heather Faine, Carly Migliori, John Schnars, Greta Khne,

805
00:46:55,196 --> 00:46:59,396
Speaker 1: and Jacob Weissberg. Our theme song, Little Lily, is by

806
00:46:59,436 --> 00:47:03,836
Speaker 1: fellow chicagoan the brilliant Avery R. Young, from his album Tubman.

807
00:47:04,276 --> 00:47:06,156
Speaker 1: You definitely want to check out his music at his

808
00:47:06,236 --> 00:47:09,956
Speaker 1: website Avery R. Young dot com. You can find Pushkin

809
00:47:10,036 --> 00:47:13,636
Speaker 1: on all social platforms at Pushkin Pods, and you can

810
00:47:13,676 --> 00:47:16,716
Speaker 1: sign up for our newsletter at pushkin dot fm. To

811
00:47:16,836 --> 00:47:21,996
Speaker 1: find more Pushkin podcasts, listen on the iHeartRadio, app, Apple podcasts,

812
00:47:22,236 --> 00:47:24,356
Speaker 1: or wherever you like to listen. And if you like

813
00:47:24,516 --> 00:47:27,356
Speaker 1: our show, please give us a five star rating and

814
00:47:27,396 --> 00:47:29,356
Speaker 1: a review and listen even if you don't like to

815
00:47:29,436 --> 00:47:31,556
Speaker 1: give it a five star rating and a review, and

816
00:47:31,756 --> 00:47:34,956
Speaker 1: please tell all of your best friends about it. Thank you,