WEBVTT - Questlove Supreme Presents: May Flowers Part 2 0:00:00.120 --> 0:00:03.040 Quest Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio. 0:00:09.200 --> 0:00:11.360 Yo, Yo, what's up y'all is Questlove And as you 0:00:11.440 --> 0:00:13.680 heard me last time. You know, we've been talking about 0:00:13.680 --> 0:00:16.360 giving people their flowers, and I gotta keep that going 0:00:16.440 --> 0:00:20.239 because honestly, one episode is not enough. We're doing it 0:00:20.280 --> 0:00:22.880 this time in the month of May because it may flowers, 0:00:23.520 --> 0:00:26.880 all right. So see, given flowers isn't just about respect. 0:00:27.200 --> 0:00:30.040 It's about public record. It's about making sure the people 0:00:30.200 --> 0:00:33.600 who build the calls, carried the weight, who broke the ground, who. 0:00:33.440 --> 0:00:35.400 Inspired us, don't get lost. 0:00:35.200 --> 0:00:38.040 In the noise because we live in a moment where 0:00:38.040 --> 0:00:41.200 things fast and legends can fade if we're not intentional 0:00:41.600 --> 0:00:45.159 about keeping their names alive. So yeah, this part is 0:00:45.200 --> 0:00:47.640 all about them, and I want to challenge myself and 0:00:47.720 --> 0:00:50.560 you to think about the folks who may not get 0:00:50.600 --> 0:00:53.760 magazine covers, but who change the way we hear, think 0:00:53.880 --> 0:01:00.920 and move. Here a few more moments from QLs where 0:01:00.960 --> 0:01:06.479 we honored some great ones. Twenty twenty four, I had 0:01:06.480 --> 0:01:09.920 to sit down with another hero. Team Supreme sat down 0:01:09.920 --> 0:01:14.160 with Narda Michael Walton, who was a crucial member of 0:01:14.240 --> 0:01:17.959 the Mana Vishu Orchestra before becoming a hip producer for 0:01:18.080 --> 0:01:22.760 Whitney Houston, Franklin, Mariah Carey, Starship and so many others. 0:01:23.280 --> 0:01:24.039 At the beginning of. 0:01:23.959 --> 0:01:26.760 Part one, I got to ask him one of those 0:01:26.840 --> 0:01:30.800 always wanted to know questions about about his are you know, 0:01:31.360 --> 0:01:34.320 especially as a guy who was tasked with getting the 0:01:34.319 --> 0:01:40.720 best out of our superstars. 0:01:41.120 --> 0:01:46.160 I'm bringing everything I ever learned from you, man, so 0:01:46.280 --> 0:01:47.240 now you know what it is. 0:01:47.560 --> 0:01:53.320 I'm also realizing I've met you briefly before, and I 0:01:53.400 --> 0:01:56.720 will say that there are very few human beings that 0:01:56.840 --> 0:02:02.080 have an instantaneous disarming chip that I wish I had. 0:02:02.160 --> 0:02:03.240 You have a level of. 0:02:03.240 --> 0:02:07.320 Calm that I now know that. Of course, your resume 0:02:07.400 --> 0:02:10.960 is that impressive because I believe that you have a 0:02:11.000 --> 0:02:15.840 sort of calming element, because you produced some people that 0:02:16.040 --> 0:02:18.480 I would believe would be some of the hardest people 0:02:19.160 --> 0:02:23.920 personality wise to even step with. I've said no to 0:02:23.919 --> 0:02:26.840 a few of these people, were just like drumming with 0:02:26.880 --> 0:02:29.959 them or any of those things, because I couldn't bear 0:02:30.040 --> 0:02:33.600 to think of the thought of, you know, of dealing 0:02:33.639 --> 0:02:37.359 with that. But can I ask you, like, what when 0:02:37.360 --> 0:02:41.080 did you develop this personality of just calmness? Like you 0:02:41.120 --> 0:02:44.680 have a very disarming like, have you ever gotten angry 0:02:44.720 --> 0:02:45.280 in your life? 0:02:45.560 --> 0:02:45.760 Oh? 0:02:45.840 --> 0:02:48.519 Yeah, sure, sure I do, of course I do. It's 0:02:48.600 --> 0:02:52.440 just that I learned, like what you're speaking about in 0:02:52.200 --> 0:02:55.720 production and working with other people that I wanted to 0:02:55.720 --> 0:02:58.560 get their best and I realized that the love aspect 0:02:58.600 --> 0:03:01.360 was really powerful. It is really powerful. And then you 0:03:01.400 --> 0:03:05.959 mentioned meditation, So through meditation and the love aspect that 0:03:06.200 --> 0:03:09.880 became the most important part, and that the person I'm 0:03:09.919 --> 0:03:14.080 working with could feel that love to do their best, 0:03:15.040 --> 0:03:17.240 and then that would just make everything just go forward. 0:03:17.880 --> 0:03:21.280 So I kind of just pray, swim, you know, get 0:03:21.280 --> 0:03:25.280 myself together physically, and then getting that spirit that the 0:03:25.280 --> 0:03:26.799 person you really feel like, oh you're not here to 0:03:26.840 --> 0:03:29.359 fight with me, You're gonna be that great music. Then 0:03:29.360 --> 0:03:31.760 they start singing whatever they're gonna do, and the endorphins 0:03:31.840 --> 0:03:34.200 kick in and they were gone. But that spirit of 0:03:34.200 --> 0:03:36.680 love is really really important. That's what I want to 0:03:36.680 --> 0:03:37.320 say to you about that. 0:03:38.080 --> 0:03:41.600 Do you have a pre studio ritual that you do 0:03:41.800 --> 0:03:43.400 or something like the kind of get ready to get 0:03:43.400 --> 0:03:43.680 into this. 0:03:43.920 --> 0:03:46.440 You know, you can see behind me, I have a candle, 0:03:46.800 --> 0:03:49.320 two camels here and a candle up there. You know, 0:03:49.480 --> 0:03:51.080 I burn a little in sense every now and again, 0:03:51.480 --> 0:03:53.640 I usually bring a gift to the person I'm working with, 0:03:53.760 --> 0:03:56.360 just kind of make them feel the love on a 0:03:56.400 --> 0:04:01.360 physical level. A teddy bear flower, something sweet. And I 0:04:01.400 --> 0:04:03.520 want to say one more thing about what you're asking about, 0:04:03.560 --> 0:04:06.280 because it's really important for me. That Probably the most 0:04:06.600 --> 0:04:10.800 incredible moment along this line was after I made the 0:04:10.880 --> 0:04:13.840 songs of two songs, Who's Theming Who Until You Say 0:04:13.840 --> 0:04:16.400 you Love Me? And here and flew back to Detroit, 0:04:16.440 --> 0:04:19.919 Michigan to meet Aretha. It looking in her eyes is scary. 0:04:21.680 --> 0:04:23.839 That would that would scare you? That would that scared me? 0:04:25.080 --> 0:04:28.279 But there again, you know, I let her know in 0:04:28.320 --> 0:04:30.800 my spirit, my eyes, my love, I'm not here to fight, 0:04:30.839 --> 0:04:32.800 I'm not here to make a problem. I want I 0:04:32.880 --> 0:04:36.120 want to serve you, I love you, and help us 0:04:36.200 --> 0:04:38.400 make the best music. And then once the music comes 0:04:38.440 --> 0:04:42.080 on and then she starts opening up and singing, then again, 0:04:42.120 --> 0:04:43.920 like I said, it just gets happy. And then then 0:04:43.920 --> 0:04:45.520 it's like, well, what do you want to eat? You 0:04:45.520 --> 0:04:47.200 want cheeseburger? You want you know, fried chicken? 0:04:47.240 --> 0:04:47.680 What you want? 0:04:47.839 --> 0:04:49.000 And all that sounds happening. 0:04:51.040 --> 0:04:55.480 See, I wish I'd known you previously. Steve can attest 0:04:55.480 --> 0:04:58.600 to this. You know, of course I'm still here at 0:04:58.640 --> 0:05:04.320 the tonight show and lovely and I've only had one 0:05:04.480 --> 0:05:08.279 client sort of put us through the ringer to the 0:05:08.279 --> 0:05:13.680 point where I just walked away. And you know, unfortunately, 0:05:14.240 --> 0:05:17.440 I've had the pleasure of playing practically with every person 0:05:17.480 --> 0:05:20.720 I've ever idolized. But when it came to a refa 0:05:22.120 --> 0:05:28.039 and the alpha level of testing that we were put. 0:05:27.880 --> 0:05:35.400 Through, I failed that test. Oh you know, it was like. 0:05:36.880 --> 0:05:39.120 My ego was there because in my mind, I'm like, well, 0:05:39.160 --> 0:05:42.160 I'm holding up the tradition, like we are holding up 0:05:42.160 --> 0:05:45.920 the tradition of Cornell Duprix and Bernard Purty like her seventies, 0:05:46.120 --> 0:05:50.000 her seventies crack band, And you know, she wanted to 0:05:50.880 --> 0:05:53.320 have a long talk, and she wanted us to audition 0:05:54.160 --> 0:05:59.679 and all this stuff, and. 0:05:57.560 --> 0:06:02.160 You know, I just now regret that move. But I 0:06:02.240 --> 0:06:04.440 was just like, well, no, I'm fine. 0:06:04.440 --> 0:06:07.080 If you want to sing behind your karaoke track, then 0:06:07.680 --> 0:06:08.479 go ahead and do so. 0:06:08.680 --> 0:06:09.359 And she did so. 0:06:09.839 --> 0:06:13.159 And it could have been magic, but you know it 0:06:13.240 --> 0:06:17.720 was definitely I didn't know about what you just said, 0:06:17.760 --> 0:06:20.200 Like we're dealing with people and how to disarm them 0:06:20.240 --> 0:06:22.040 and all that stuff, and so. 0:06:24.720 --> 0:06:25.320 All right, y'all. 0:06:26.080 --> 0:06:28.839 In twenty twenty two, I sat down with Steve roon 0:06:29.279 --> 0:06:30.479 and a special. 0:06:30.240 --> 0:06:31.600 One on one. 0:06:31.800 --> 0:06:35.520 I'm molded so much of my drumming after Steve, but 0:06:35.800 --> 0:06:38.440 aspects of his journey and style were unknown to me, 0:06:39.360 --> 0:06:42.279 and this conversation went on over three hours and became 0:06:42.480 --> 0:06:46.360 a two parter filled with so much joy. Here's where 0:06:46.360 --> 0:06:49.960 Steve talks about going from playing with Bloodstone. 0:06:49.440 --> 0:06:51.520 To the Average White Band, which is how. 0:06:51.360 --> 0:06:52.120 I learned about it. 0:06:54.240 --> 0:07:02.440 I've heard many accounts of how Robbie passed away and 0:07:02.480 --> 0:07:05.040 how you got into the group. Yeah, but I've never 0:07:05.080 --> 0:07:08.320 heard an official version from official band member. How did 0:07:08.440 --> 0:07:10.920 Robbie pass away? And how did you get the gig 0:07:11.040 --> 0:07:12.040 for the Average White Band? 0:07:12.120 --> 0:07:12.320 Well? 0:07:12.760 --> 0:07:14.280 You know where were you know, we're friends. I was 0:07:14.320 --> 0:07:16.080 supposed to go to that party. I was supposed to 0:07:16.080 --> 0:07:18.400 meet um with that party. But I was, I was, 0:07:18.440 --> 0:07:22.080 I was. I was doing the film, doing the film. 0:07:21.800 --> 0:07:23.960 With the You're in that movie? 0:07:24.360 --> 0:07:26.280 No, I played, Well, I might be in them, but 0:07:26.520 --> 0:07:28.320 I did the move music for it. 0:07:28.400 --> 0:07:29.920 So did it ever come out? 0:07:30.800 --> 0:07:33.920 Yes, yes, I I think I have it. I think 0:07:33.920 --> 0:07:34.600 I got that found it. 0:07:34.600 --> 0:07:37.800 Oh my god, Okay, yeah, they're trained. 0:07:39.520 --> 0:07:43.120 Yes, when they when they were promoting that album on 0:07:43.320 --> 0:07:47.160 Soul Train. Uh, Don Cornelli showed like a minute of 0:07:47.160 --> 0:07:49.400 the clip where they're riding in the train and they're 0:07:49.400 --> 0:07:50.520 in the bunkers. 0:07:50.080 --> 0:07:53.000 And yeah, doing show tunes and whatnot. 0:07:53.160 --> 0:07:55.680 And so it is funny. 0:07:55.720 --> 0:07:57.120 I mean I had to go there and be on 0:07:57.200 --> 0:07:59.800 set with them and then and then we go we 0:07:59.880 --> 0:08:00.760 do re called music. 0:08:01.240 --> 0:08:03.680 Yeah, so you're all over that record. 0:08:04.080 --> 0:08:07.320 Yeah, wow, that's not you on Natural High. 0:08:07.360 --> 0:08:10.119 Money money is better. No, okay, it's not me a master, 0:08:10.320 --> 0:08:14.920 but but money is money. Badass. Something actually said it 0:08:14.960 --> 0:08:16.720 to me. That's why I started looking for it. I 0:08:16.760 --> 0:08:17.680 forgot all about it. 0:08:18.120 --> 0:08:19.080 Wow, we did that. 0:08:19.200 --> 0:08:22.200 All the best things in life, fore right, I get it. 0:08:22.840 --> 0:08:25.800 So so I was doing I was doing that, and 0:08:25.800 --> 0:08:26.680 and they were playing that. 0:08:26.720 --> 0:08:29.160 They were doing a run at the Troubador, and Robbie 0:08:29.160 --> 0:08:29.600 called me. 0:08:29.600 --> 0:08:31.040 Up and he said, come on, man, come and go 0:08:31.080 --> 0:08:34.120 and be a party on It was Sunday night or something. 0:08:34.920 --> 0:08:37.320 So I got to work. If I can, I'll be there. 0:08:38.160 --> 0:08:42.600 And and and as fate would have it, I didn't. 0:08:42.960 --> 0:08:46.679 I didn't go. Okay, and and and the next morning 0:08:46.720 --> 0:08:49.160 I woke up and my my my drum tech then 0:08:50.240 --> 0:08:52.439 guy that was working for me, guy named Terry Merchant. 0:08:52.880 --> 0:08:53.240 Mm hmm. 0:08:53.520 --> 0:08:56.359 He said, Steve Robbie. 0:08:56.120 --> 0:09:00.920 Stead Yeah, And I say, what did you Because Robbie, 0:09:01.120 --> 0:09:03.840 Robbie and I used to go out drinking together. Robbie 0:09:03.880 --> 0:09:06.840 was the hell of a drinker. And he said, no, no, no, 0:09:07.160 --> 0:09:11.920 he's dead, you know, he an overdose. Robbie wasn't so 0:09:12.040 --> 0:09:14.600 much of a drug taker. I could say, there wasn't 0:09:14.600 --> 0:09:17.520 so much of a drug. He's more of a drinker, right, 0:09:18.160 --> 0:09:20.920 But Robbie, this is this was the thing was Robbie. 0:09:22.000 --> 0:09:23.000 Robbie could drink. 0:09:23.440 --> 0:09:27.760 I'd seen Robbie drink Butler vodka and then he just 0:09:27.800 --> 0:09:29.240 switched to Scotch, right. 0:09:29.840 --> 0:09:32.640 And I get sick. But I never saw Robbie throw up. 0:09:32.960 --> 0:09:36.480 Never saw him he would pass out right. 0:09:36.840 --> 0:09:37.040 Yeah. 0:09:38.040 --> 0:09:41.600 And from from my understanding, because I wasn't there for 0:09:41.640 --> 0:09:44.679 a lot of what when when, the whole just there 0:09:44.720 --> 0:09:47.679 for the aftermath, was that he was at this party 0:09:47.880 --> 0:09:53.120 and everybody did this guy was saying some he's some cocaine, right, 0:09:53.360 --> 0:09:56.280 And so Robbie wouldn't do anything small. 0:09:56.400 --> 0:09:58.160 He was not that sort of a person either. 0:09:58.600 --> 0:09:59.360 He went bigger. 0:09:59.760 --> 0:10:01.880 Yeah, when he went and he went, he went bigger 0:10:02.160 --> 0:10:05.840 and and everybody, everybody else that did it got sick, 0:10:06.679 --> 0:10:10.360 and Robbie went home, went to sleep, and it stayed 0:10:10.360 --> 0:10:12.520 in his system. It was it was heroin and it 0:10:12.559 --> 0:10:16.600 was cut with strychnine, and it killed him. Jesus Christy's simple, 0:10:17.920 --> 0:10:21.320 you know, you know, I mean we talk a lot about, 0:10:21.600 --> 0:10:25.800 you know, accidental drug overdoses, you know, sometimes the house 0:10:25.800 --> 0:10:28.600 I'm saying at the moment, there was three guys that 0:10:28.840 --> 0:10:32.200 died of a fentanyl overdoses and and one of those, 0:10:32.280 --> 0:10:34.880 one of those guys was his was his nephew. 0:10:35.160 --> 0:10:38.200 Right, and uh, and accidental. 0:10:38.320 --> 0:10:41.760 I don't think anybody goes does any of that stuff 0:10:42.080 --> 0:10:43.160 to die, you know. 0:10:43.240 --> 0:10:44.040 I mean, if they want. 0:10:43.920 --> 0:10:46.959 To do that, they say, I'm I write a suicide note, 0:10:47.600 --> 0:10:50.520 right exactly, you did this to me, and then they're 0:10:50.679 --> 0:10:52.360 just do an enormous lot and they're dying. And I 0:10:52.440 --> 0:10:55.320 think they were recreation. I don't think that this guy 0:10:55.360 --> 0:10:56.880 even had a problem. And I think there was just 0:10:57.000 --> 0:11:01.640 three buddies that decided to go and around, let's let's 0:11:01.720 --> 0:11:03.120 try that stuff and see what it does. 0:11:03.200 --> 0:11:07.400 And unfortunately, yeah, it's a killer. 0:11:07.840 --> 0:11:09.679 It wasn't like that in the sixties. I can tell 0:11:09.720 --> 0:11:10.400 you that right now. 0:11:10.720 --> 0:11:13.440 But I don't think anything any of the drugs nowadays 0:11:13.559 --> 0:11:16.679 like they were in the sixties and seventies, and it's 0:11:16.720 --> 0:11:21.560 a it's a different animal. So, you know, Robbie, it 0:11:21.679 --> 0:11:23.560 was a tragic, a tragic accident. 0:11:24.360 --> 0:11:25.800 It did. 0:11:26.280 --> 0:11:30.400 It was a lot of pains, probably still being felt today. 0:11:30.640 --> 0:11:32.640 You know, I hadn't spoken to his widow in over 0:11:32.720 --> 0:11:34.480 twenty years. And she called me last. 0:11:34.240 --> 0:11:36.079 Week really England. 0:11:36.200 --> 0:11:40.760 Yeah, wow, he did, and and and she she was 0:11:40.800 --> 0:11:45.560 telling me that she she just just now has come 0:11:45.600 --> 0:11:47.720 to terms with the fact to be able to just say, 0:11:47.840 --> 0:11:51.120 you know, this is what it was, and not much 0:11:51.120 --> 0:11:53.920 point running around feeling resentment. And years of running around 0:11:53.920 --> 0:11:54.680 feeling resentment. 0:11:55.280 --> 0:11:57.120 It just make yourself that broke her heart for all 0:11:57.160 --> 0:12:00.360 those years, forty five years. It just wow, she read married. 0:12:01.000 --> 0:12:04.200 But yeah, still painful. 0:12:04.440 --> 0:12:06.800 Yeah, you know, Robbie was a great guy and a 0:12:06.840 --> 0:12:08.360 great drumma and a great guy. 0:12:09.040 --> 0:12:13.199 How how long does time go by before you're getting 0:12:13.200 --> 0:12:17.400 the phone call to join the average white band? And 0:12:17.600 --> 0:12:20.800 before they call you, are they trying to at least 0:12:21.040 --> 0:12:23.480 maintain the status of the name of the group and 0:12:23.559 --> 0:12:25.960 find a white guy that's funky. 0:12:26.679 --> 0:12:28.040 No, Well, I tell you. 0:12:28.080 --> 0:12:31.440 What happened was was this was that was that when 0:12:31.880 --> 0:12:35.040 when I found out about Robbie being being dead, I 0:12:35.080 --> 0:12:37.120 went and I called, I got hold of Hamish and 0:12:37.160 --> 0:12:39.880 I went over to the hotel and sat over the 0:12:39.920 --> 0:12:41.640 hotel with everybody. 0:12:42.600 --> 0:12:43.760 And we were all. 0:12:44.040 --> 0:12:48.520 Drinking because that's what we did with the Scots, and 0:12:48.520 --> 0:12:51.920 and and I said to them, listen, you know, Robbie 0:12:51.960 --> 0:12:54.920 wouldn't want you guys to stop now. You know, you 0:12:55.120 --> 0:12:58.080 just gotten to get this airplay with picked up the 0:12:58.080 --> 0:13:02.080 pieces that's happening for you. I don't know how this 0:13:02.200 --> 0:13:03.800 is all going to know, but you guys, you know 0:13:04.720 --> 0:13:06.240 you shouldn't shouldn't stop. 0:13:06.920 --> 0:13:08.960 Fare was talk of maybe we should stop the group. 0:13:10.120 --> 0:13:13.600 Well it was it was everybody was sitting around sort 0:13:13.600 --> 0:13:16.520 of like it was all over. You know, It's like 0:13:16.760 --> 0:13:19.560 it's not over, it's you know. And so I said, 0:13:19.600 --> 0:13:22.400 if there's anything I can do, let me know, and 0:13:22.400 --> 0:13:26.640 and and and I was under contract to Bloodstone, right, 0:13:28.080 --> 0:13:32.600 so what what I would do is Stick super and myself. 0:13:32.600 --> 0:13:34.160 What would happen if I couldn't do it, if I 0:13:34.200 --> 0:13:36.440 was working with a Budstone, Sticks would go and play 0:13:36.480 --> 0:13:36.800 with them. 0:13:37.559 --> 0:13:38.880 Yeah, And then. 0:13:38.960 --> 0:13:40.959 Sticks briefly joined the average white band. 0:13:42.400 --> 0:13:45.480 They played no average white man. 0:13:45.640 --> 0:13:48.080 So he go and play the gig and then and 0:13:48.120 --> 0:13:49.559 then if he could, if he couldn't do it, I 0:13:49.720 --> 0:13:52.640 do it. And then and and you know, I go 0:13:52.679 --> 0:13:56.880 and play with them. They were auditioning people s I R. 0:13:57.040 --> 0:14:00.600 There's drummers all black, white, I mean, didn't matter. They 0:14:00.600 --> 0:14:04.440 were just looking for a drummer, okay, with sticks and 0:14:04.480 --> 0:14:08.800 sticks and I would go. We'd go to the auditions 0:14:08.960 --> 0:14:10.720 and we'd sit there in the s I R. And 0:14:10.760 --> 0:14:13.079 they drummer would come in. They start playing with them, 0:14:13.080 --> 0:14:15.400 and they say, okay, no, they ain't working, and they 0:14:15.400 --> 0:14:18.400 would get more and more depressed, you know, And so 0:14:18.559 --> 0:14:20.640 either sticks or myself would go up and we jam 0:14:20.680 --> 0:14:22.520 with them and they come back to life again. 0:14:22.560 --> 0:14:24.560 And then they wheel in another drummer. And then we'd 0:14:24.600 --> 0:14:26.920 sit there and we'd watch them, and they would go there. 0:14:27.440 --> 0:14:30.200 Any any drummer of note that tried to audition for 0:14:30.240 --> 0:14:31.480 the band that didn't. 0:14:31.240 --> 0:14:33.440 Make nobody, nobody that I knew, But that was a 0:14:33.440 --> 0:14:35.400 lot of kids wanted to play. They would, you know, 0:14:35.600 --> 0:14:37.960 it was it was a big audition to go to 0:14:39.000 --> 0:14:42.200 and so and so I had to play this gig 0:14:42.240 --> 0:14:45.280 with them down at Long Beach at Long Beach Arena, 0:14:46.440 --> 0:14:50.240 at the old Long Beach Arena, and we down there, 0:14:50.480 --> 0:14:53.080 we sit down and come out, we start to play. 0:14:54.480 --> 0:14:57.200 I remember this gig there was. They were also like 0:14:58.320 --> 0:15:01.640 kind of state static audience. They weren't really doing too much. 0:15:01.640 --> 0:15:03.800 And then there was this one I saw this one 0:15:03.840 --> 0:15:06.320 guy sort of started to rock, you know, so I 0:15:06.360 --> 0:15:08.800 sort of hold him, owned in on him, and it 0:15:08.960 --> 0:15:10.560 kind of spread out from him, and by the end 0:15:10.560 --> 0:15:13.440 of the show, everybody was like dancing and going crazy, 0:15:13.520 --> 0:15:15.480 and it was it was a great show. And I 0:15:15.520 --> 0:15:19.280 came off the stage and this little fella came walking 0:15:19.360 --> 0:15:22.000 up to me dapper, you know, it's really well dressed. 0:15:22.040 --> 0:15:24.720 And I said, you know, a little bed. He walked 0:15:24.760 --> 0:15:27.040 up to me and he said, You've got to be 0:15:27.120 --> 0:15:27.720 in the band. 0:15:28.760 --> 0:15:31.280 And I said, I'd love to be in the band, 0:15:31.280 --> 0:15:33.040 but I'm under contract to another band. 0:15:33.040 --> 0:15:33.920 I can't I can't do. 0:15:33.880 --> 0:15:34.200 It, you know. 0:15:34.320 --> 0:15:37.320 And he said, you're out of that band, and you're 0:15:37.360 --> 0:15:41.200 in the band, and then he walked and he walked off. 0:15:41.200 --> 0:15:43.680 And Bruce McCaskill was the manager at the time of 0:15:43.680 --> 0:15:47.040 the banner. I said, Bruce, who the hell is that? 0:15:47.200 --> 0:15:53.240 And he said, oh, That's how I'd heard. I was 0:15:53.400 --> 0:15:55.880 out of that contract and I was in average white man, 0:15:56.640 --> 0:15:57.160 just like that. 0:15:59.440 --> 0:15:59.760 All right. 0:16:00.080 --> 0:16:04.280 Oh, in twenty eighteen, Dame Funk help us get Leon 0:16:04.360 --> 0:16:07.160 Silver's on the show. And this was epic for me 0:16:07.280 --> 0:16:10.440 because there was so much I did not know. And 0:16:10.480 --> 0:16:13.200 you here's some of that here coming out of my intro. 0:16:15.640 --> 0:16:19.320 The reason why I feel as that we commit to 0:16:19.360 --> 0:16:24.040 this show. Yes, you know, we're about the whatever, the 0:16:24.640 --> 0:16:29.200 teaching of excellence and bringing people and exposing him to 0:16:29.240 --> 0:16:31.880 the audience, you know, to audience that might not know him, 0:16:32.040 --> 0:16:34.720 stuff like that, but just sometimes you just want to 0:16:34.800 --> 0:16:41.840 nerd out on your favorite and I there's so much. 0:16:41.960 --> 0:16:44.720 There's not enough that I can say about the gentleman 0:16:44.800 --> 0:16:49.160 that we have with us right now. I can say that, 0:16:49.440 --> 0:16:55.680 you know, he is. I mean, he's such a genius 0:16:55.800 --> 0:16:59.400 in every area that he's ever done in crafting harmonies 0:16:59.680 --> 0:17:04.320 and musicianship and his songwriting. I mean, he damn near 0:17:04.320 --> 0:17:06.119 it invented a genre of music. 0:17:07.320 --> 0:17:13.000 He killed disco, He literally killed disco of all the like. 0:17:13.720 --> 0:17:18.120 He invented genres and he inspired some of our greatest 0:17:18.200 --> 0:17:21.320 I told Jimmy jam that he was coming on our 0:17:21.359 --> 0:17:24.439 show and even Jimmy jam had to bow down because 0:17:24.800 --> 0:17:27.040 of all that he learned from this man. I'm about 0:17:27.040 --> 0:17:29.840 to start crying right now. Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome 0:17:29.840 --> 0:17:30.320 to the show. 0:17:30.960 --> 0:17:36.639 Leon Silver's the third yes. 0:17:37.640 --> 0:17:38.160 To be here. 0:17:38.480 --> 0:17:38.720 Man. 0:17:39.359 --> 0:17:44.440 You don't know how happy we are right now, Like. 0:17:44.400 --> 0:17:47.200 We're just shout out to dang funk shout the day. 0:17:52.400 --> 0:17:53.560 Yeah. 0:17:54.119 --> 0:17:57.360 We have so many questions about your life, Like I've 0:17:57.400 --> 0:18:00.679 never idolized someone so much that I really don't know 0:18:00.720 --> 0:18:04.000 that much about because you rarely did interviews and things 0:18:04.040 --> 0:18:05.040 like that that matter. 0:18:05.119 --> 0:18:09.320 But let's just should we rapid fire? Do we? 0:18:09.400 --> 0:18:11.160 Just we? 0:18:11.600 --> 0:18:13.520 I want to go, Let's go through the journey. Okay, 0:18:13.840 --> 0:18:15.760 now I'm gonna say it. Let's start at the beginning. 0:18:17.320 --> 0:18:18.680 You all gotta be proud of me. I haven't said 0:18:18.680 --> 0:18:20.120 that in a while, but SA this time. 0:18:21.720 --> 0:18:28.840 Okay. So uh, I believe your entire families from Tennessee. Correct? Uh, 0:18:30.320 --> 0:18:30.960 please be wrong? 0:18:31.000 --> 0:18:36.920 Sucking everybody except me faster Agian Pat? 0:18:37.119 --> 0:18:38.240 Where were you born? 0:18:38.400 --> 0:18:40.080 I was born in South ben Indiana. 0:18:40.280 --> 0:18:43.720 Oh yes. 0:18:44.000 --> 0:18:46.320 My father was going to college out there and my 0:18:46.359 --> 0:18:50.760 mother and I was born on the campus and only 0:18:50.840 --> 0:18:53.239 stayed there three days after I was born. So I 0:18:53.320 --> 0:18:55.840 know nothing about South Ben, Indiana. 0:18:55.840 --> 0:18:59.439 I was born there for three days. I was there 0:18:59.440 --> 0:19:03.960 for three years. Wait, you born to South Ben Yeah, 0:19:04.080 --> 0:19:11.160 Memorial Hospital. Wow, that's amazing, That's that's crazy. Yeah. So just. 0:19:13.040 --> 0:19:14.960 I just want to know it all, like to talk 0:19:15.000 --> 0:19:19.560 about the beginnings in Tennessee and how music entered into 0:19:19.640 --> 0:19:21.920 that household. 0:19:23.040 --> 0:19:27.480 Well about Tennessee, I can't remember too much except Roy Rogers, 0:19:27.640 --> 0:19:32.080 so I was too. After about two years, we hit 0:19:32.160 --> 0:19:34.639 the train and came to LA. I think I was 0:19:34.640 --> 0:19:39.520 two or three years old, and La is where everything 0:19:39.800 --> 0:19:43.720 started the motown sound for me. 0:19:44.000 --> 0:19:46.080 Why did you guys move to Los Angeles? 0:19:46.400 --> 0:19:54.160 I think my father got a gig at what is it, uh, 0:19:54.359 --> 0:19:59.560 some kind of space company something. He was doing some 0:19:59.720 --> 0:20:05.920 kind of work I couldn't remember, but he his work 0:20:05.960 --> 0:20:11.439 brought us out there. And everybody wasn't born yet. It 0:20:11.520 --> 0:20:14.760 was just myself, Charmaine. 0:20:15.000 --> 0:20:19.240 Charmaine, Charmaine is the eldest sister, and you're the eldest brother. 0:20:19.520 --> 0:20:23.399 No, Olympia is the oldest of the family. Olympia and 0:20:23.400 --> 0:20:28.280 then myself, Charmaine and James Jonathan that was who was 0:20:28.320 --> 0:20:33.440 only four of us when we went to LA and 0:20:33.760 --> 0:20:37.720 it started with me was the Motown sound. I was 0:20:37.760 --> 0:20:44.359 into James Jamison on bass period and Benny Benjamin the drums. Uh, 0:20:44.400 --> 0:20:48.600 and that was my start in music. I was taking hangers, 0:20:48.600 --> 0:20:54.439 acting like high hats. I took the drunk, the little broom, 0:20:55.000 --> 0:20:57.560 the sweeping part, used that as a rim and snare, 0:20:58.520 --> 0:21:01.880 and the box spring I used, there's a kick drum. 0:21:02.400 --> 0:21:05.120 That's how I started music right there. 0:21:05.280 --> 0:21:07.160 You know, that's where most people would take the broom 0:21:07.200 --> 0:21:10.520 and make that to a guitar. You thought to make that? 0:21:11.680 --> 0:21:13.520 Yeah? 0:21:13.880 --> 0:21:18.120 Was were there any adults that were musicians that were 0:21:18.760 --> 0:21:20.399 influential in your life at that point? 0:21:20.560 --> 0:21:24.560 Or no, I'm just Jamison and Benny Benjamin. I didn't 0:21:24.560 --> 0:21:28.320 know nobody yet. That was only about six or seven 0:21:28.400 --> 0:21:29.080 there at seven. 0:21:29.720 --> 0:21:33.000 What was it about that music that called you the bass? 0:21:33.880 --> 0:21:37.360 I got a guitar when I was like, we did 0:21:38.960 --> 0:21:41.639 we just did four part harmony because I was teaching 0:21:41.640 --> 0:21:44.840 everybody this Lower Scudder's commercial back in the day, and 0:21:44.920 --> 0:21:48.320 my brother was three years old but he held four 0:21:48.359 --> 0:21:51.800 part harmony. So we was doing this Lower Scudder's commercial 0:21:52.200 --> 0:21:55.400 and my father heard us and started teaching us some 0:21:55.440 --> 0:21:59.640 four freshman type harmony back in the day. That high 0:21:59.640 --> 0:22:02.639 lows and all that, and so we did it real easy, 0:22:02.760 --> 0:22:04.800 and he got a manager and they put us on 0:22:05.040 --> 0:22:08.240 we would called the Little Angel, right, and they put 0:22:08.320 --> 0:22:12.760 us on Spike Jones arc Link letters show all these 0:22:12.840 --> 0:22:19.919 names from back in the day. And that's where my brother, 0:22:20.760 --> 0:22:23.520 he was three when we did our first TV show, 0:22:24.000 --> 0:22:27.719 and he held he gave everybody our parts when we 0:22:27.760 --> 0:22:31.160 forgot him, so he As far as harmony is concerned, 0:22:31.200 --> 0:22:31.640 how did you. 0:22:31.560 --> 0:22:35.120 Guys even know how to notate harmony? Because well, one 0:22:35.160 --> 0:22:38.600 thing I think our audience should know is I feel 0:22:38.640 --> 0:22:46.120 like the one distinction that separated you guys from any 0:22:46.200 --> 0:22:53.159 of your contemporaries Jackson stair Steps, whoever was young at 0:22:53.160 --> 0:22:59.160 that time, was you guys had the most unusual harmony 0:22:59.200 --> 0:23:00.280 structures ever. 0:23:00.440 --> 0:23:01.560 Was that from not knowing? 0:23:02.119 --> 0:23:05.960 Like who taught you those dissonant and chromatic harmonies that 0:23:06.680 --> 0:23:07.440 weren't average? 0:23:07.680 --> 0:23:12.359 And I think, uh, well, my father was into the 0:23:12.400 --> 0:23:15.480 four freshmen and the high lows and all that. So 0:23:15.520 --> 0:23:19.520 he he saw us doing three part harmony and one 0:23:19.640 --> 0:23:24.360 lead on this Lorscuddis commercial and I gave him their parts, 0:23:24.600 --> 0:23:26.639 but it was you know, simple stuff like you know, 0:23:27.320 --> 0:23:30.320 and he saw we can hold a no, not get off. 0:23:30.640 --> 0:23:34.560 So he started giving us harder songs, songs like It's 0:23:34.600 --> 0:23:39.000 a Blue World, and uh, well I forgot the name 0:23:39.040 --> 0:23:42.720 of those songs, but uh it was four and five 0:23:42.760 --> 0:23:46.440 part harmony, and we stayed on it and didn't get off. 0:23:46.840 --> 0:23:49.800 I don't know why. My mother could have been an 0:23:49.840 --> 0:23:52.520 opera singer. She was studying for a minute, So I 0:23:52.560 --> 0:23:57.520 guess that's why we Uh we just felt we can 0:23:57.600 --> 0:23:59.320 do it, and we just did it. You know. It 0:23:59.359 --> 0:24:02.080 wasn't no or whatever. We just did it and stayed 0:24:02.119 --> 0:24:05.439 on the notes. And I actually was the worst holding 0:24:05.480 --> 0:24:10.400 the note. Really yeah, James was the best, and then 0:24:11.240 --> 0:24:17.320 it was Charmaine, then Olympia than me. I was last. 0:24:17.359 --> 0:24:20.520 I always forget my note, you know. But James had 0:24:20.560 --> 0:24:23.800 the ear for holding the notes, and he was the youngest. 0:24:24.200 --> 0:24:26.199 What year was this this was? 0:24:26.480 --> 0:24:29.360 I was like I was like seven six. 0:24:29.920 --> 0:24:32.440 But I mean, like in what year was it? Like, 0:24:32.880 --> 0:24:33.440 probably was. 0:24:33.400 --> 0:24:37.160 This sixty fifty nine or something like. I was born 0:24:37.200 --> 0:24:41.720 in fifty three, so okay, around fifty nine or something 0:24:41.760 --> 0:24:42.720 like that or sixty. 0:24:42.960 --> 0:24:46.160 So there wasn't even a template out at the time 0:24:46.240 --> 0:24:49.680 to or besides maybe Frankie Lymon and the teenagers, which 0:24:49.720 --> 0:24:52.360 is more like fifty seven to fifty, But there were 0:24:52.400 --> 0:24:55.760 no kids groups or that sort of thing to no. 0:24:56.080 --> 0:24:58.560 Just Frankie Lyman, what's your name? Sounded kind of like 0:24:58.600 --> 0:25:02.720 a kid little anthe any back then I listened to 0:25:02.800 --> 0:25:03.600 him for a minute. 0:25:03.680 --> 0:25:08.840 Yeah, So were you guys instantly in pursuit of the 0:25:08.880 --> 0:25:10.840 next level? Was just to find a record deal? Or 0:25:10.880 --> 0:25:13.240 was it just like we did this television show and 0:25:13.280 --> 0:25:13.639 that's it. 0:25:14.119 --> 0:25:16.720 Well, back then we didn't have no leads. It was 0:25:16.800 --> 0:25:20.720 off harmony, so we would just stand there and sing, 0:25:20.760 --> 0:25:25.560 no personality, no charisma or nothing, just singing holding the notes. 0:25:25.640 --> 0:25:28.159 And we were so young that I guess the crowd 0:25:28.200 --> 0:25:31.120 thought it was amazing that we were singing that kind 0:25:31.160 --> 0:25:33.880 of stuff, But we was just ready to get off 0:25:33.880 --> 0:25:38.240 the stage and go play kind of thing. But I 0:25:38.280 --> 0:25:44.080 loved music. I was the one teaching him and actually 0:25:44.119 --> 0:25:49.440 sometime making him saying. But I got into the motown thing, 0:25:49.680 --> 0:25:53.679 and then from there we didn't get into seriously making 0:25:55.160 --> 0:26:01.440 moves to record companies till I was around I guess 0:26:01.560 --> 0:26:05.600 thirteen or fourteen or fifteen, something like that, because that's 0:26:05.640 --> 0:26:09.879 when when the Jacksons came out. That's when I got 0:26:09.920 --> 0:26:15.359 serious and I started teaching that. When my brother, because 0:26:15.359 --> 0:26:19.719 he had the most powerful voice, and I was he 0:26:19.760 --> 0:26:22.720 said I can't say. I said, well, just nothing gain. 0:26:22.840 --> 0:26:25.800 You won't do nothing unless you practice it. He had 0:26:25.840 --> 0:26:28.440 the tone. So I work with him every day and 0:26:28.560 --> 0:26:32.360 practice till after a year or so he was riffing 0:26:32.440 --> 0:26:33.040 and all that. 0:26:33.200 --> 0:26:37.119 You know, so all your brothers and sisters are literally 0:26:37.160 --> 0:26:39.439 coming out the wound one by one during this period. 0:26:39.760 --> 0:26:42.080 You're just waiting for them to get of age. And 0:26:42.119 --> 0:26:45.200 like everybody, there. 0:26:45.080 --> 0:26:48.080 Was nobody that came in my family that couldn't hold 0:26:48.119 --> 0:26:50.600 a harmony. They could do that before they could do 0:26:50.640 --> 0:26:54.200 a lead. We had to practice our leads. So as 0:26:54.240 --> 0:26:57.560 far as when they give them apart, they'd hold it 0:26:57.600 --> 0:26:59.959 and we sing to somebody else's part, they would keep 0:27:00.359 --> 0:27:03.959 and never blend into the other person's part or anything 0:27:04.040 --> 0:27:06.840 like that. We all had that, I guess, But the 0:27:06.960 --> 0:27:10.560 leads we had to work on, and Edmund worked him 0:27:10.600 --> 0:27:14.879 and Foster. But Edmund worked the hardest. Uh, and his 0:27:15.080 --> 0:27:19.560 tone reaped the benefits because I worked at it at home. 0:27:19.600 --> 0:27:23.560 And then when we got with Freddie Perrin, Uh, he 0:27:23.920 --> 0:27:25.760 heard Edman's voice right off the bat. 0:27:25.840 --> 0:27:29.600 So but that was the one in the Capitol years. 0:27:30.400 --> 0:27:33.720 Jumping too fast, go ahead. 0:27:33.960 --> 0:27:37.760 So what label was Pride associated with MGM? 0:27:38.320 --> 0:27:42.359 Yeah, a friend of Mike Curb, which was Mike Wiener Curb. 0:27:42.480 --> 0:27:46.720 Mike Curb was running MGM when we were signed and 0:27:46.800 --> 0:27:48.320 he was only twenty four years old. 0:27:48.640 --> 0:27:51.520 Wait, so the Mike Curb congregation. That's one of my 0:27:51.520 --> 0:27:55.280 favorite breakdews exactly, the coming down. 0:27:56.240 --> 0:27:58.200 Yeah, oh my god. 0:27:58.560 --> 0:27:59.639 Yeah, he was cool. 0:27:59.720 --> 0:28:00.320 He uh. 0:28:00.400 --> 0:28:03.199 He was the one that really hit me with the 0:28:03.200 --> 0:28:08.480 commercial thing because I was doing I was really kind 0:28:08.480 --> 0:28:13.159 of into back then that social conscious type writing, the 0:28:13.760 --> 0:28:15.879 you know, because the Black Panthers was out and all 0:28:16.000 --> 0:28:19.480 that stuff, so socially conscious music was kind of in, 0:28:19.560 --> 0:28:23.440 and I was into that from a third grip from 0:28:23.680 --> 0:28:30.119 this this history teacher, Mr Simon. But he was the 0:28:30.119 --> 0:28:33.760 one that told me, well, Leon, your music has to 0:28:33.800 --> 0:28:37.640 be more commercial, you know. And I was on that tip, like, well, 0:28:39.000 --> 0:28:41.440 what do you know? You only do pop music, you know, 0:28:41.720 --> 0:28:44.080 you know, cause we knew how MOL I mean, MGM 0:28:44.280 --> 0:28:47.600 was as far as motown was. And he's like, you're right, 0:28:48.320 --> 0:28:50.920 but even if I do pop music, it has to 0:28:50.920 --> 0:28:54.640 be commercial. You're doing R and B. It's it's got 0:28:54.640 --> 0:28:58.080 to be as commercial and I didn't want to hear that, 0:28:58.560 --> 0:29:02.760 but I did it, and I started changing after I 0:29:02.760 --> 0:29:06.520 had that meeting because he wanted to give. He made 0:29:06.560 --> 0:29:10.080 up pride after that because he told he told us 0:29:10.120 --> 0:29:13.600 to do this song called what It Takes, an old 0:29:13.800 --> 0:29:16.440 Barry Gordy song, and he wanted us to do it, 0:29:16.440 --> 0:29:19.080 and we did it, and it you know, it wasn't nothing. 0:29:19.200 --> 0:29:22.600 You know, it didn't do nothing. And this meeting with me, 0:29:22.680 --> 0:29:24.960 I didn't know it at the time, was to get 0:29:25.000 --> 0:29:30.160 inside whoever was the head of leader of the group 0:29:30.280 --> 0:29:34.040 type of thing. And I was more like trying to 0:29:34.080 --> 0:29:38.080 tell him, we know what we're do and just let 0:29:38.160 --> 0:29:40.240 us do it, because I realized they put us on 0:29:40.280 --> 0:29:46.400 the shelf for the Osmonds because they didn't Yeah, but 0:29:46.560 --> 0:29:49.880 we didn't know that when we signed, and they didn't tell, 0:29:49.920 --> 0:29:52.120 you know, we just we didn't have no records out 0:29:52.160 --> 0:29:54.280 for a year. We didn't even go in the studio 0:29:55.040 --> 0:29:58.400 for a long time after the Osmonds was out. But 0:29:58.640 --> 0:30:01.840 you know, I understand the marketing thing. You know, they 0:30:01.840 --> 0:30:05.560 didn't want no other competition out there, and we were 0:30:05.560 --> 0:30:07.760 a family group that could sing harmony and all that, 0:30:07.840 --> 0:30:08.920 so they signed us. 0:30:09.280 --> 0:30:12.480 Well, then I got to ask then if, because I 0:30:12.560 --> 0:30:16.360 know with one bad apple not. At one point did 0:30:16.440 --> 0:30:20.840 MGM say, hmm, this sounds close like ABC. All right, 0:30:20.880 --> 0:30:23.400 Silvers here you go, like this should be for you 0:30:23.440 --> 0:30:24.840 instead of the Osmond's or no. 0:30:24.920 --> 0:30:29.800 The Odumans were signed already and they were specially targeted 0:30:29.840 --> 0:30:33.080 to be the off the other side, a white group 0:30:33.400 --> 0:30:36.479 family group and a black family group. That was I 0:30:36.560 --> 0:30:40.440 understand the marketing after, but we didn't know that was 0:30:40.480 --> 0:30:43.880 the case till, like, you know, years later. And I 0:30:43.920 --> 0:30:47.240 didn't believe it even after people was telling me because 0:30:47.280 --> 0:30:49.760 I wasn't caring about that, you know, as long as 0:30:49.800 --> 0:30:53.720 we can come out, that was my thing. So their 0:30:54.000 --> 0:30:56.440 whole thing was done, and all of a sudden we 0:30:56.560 --> 0:30:59.000 heard them out and they was on MGM. Nothing was 0:30:59.040 --> 0:31:02.600 told or anything, uh and it just came out, you know, 0:31:02.680 --> 0:31:06.160 and I actually liked the record. I thought it was 0:31:06.200 --> 0:31:09.560 you know. But Mike Curb was cool because he made 0:31:09.600 --> 0:31:13.960 a pride and well he got his friend Michael Veener. 0:31:14.080 --> 0:31:18.440 To uh incredible bar because Incredible Bargle band. 0:31:18.560 --> 0:31:21.000 Oh yeah yeah, and that was a funny story too. 0:31:21.280 --> 0:31:26.480 But he they were schoolmates, Curb and Mike Veener, and 0:31:26.520 --> 0:31:29.200 he always wanted to get into record business, and Mike 0:31:29.280 --> 0:31:32.640 Curb gave him that shot and gave us put us 0:31:32.640 --> 0:31:37.680 on another label because MGM was more pop than anything. 0:31:37.880 --> 0:31:40.280 They never had no R and B groups on MGM, 0:31:41.040 --> 0:31:43.880 so Pride was the label that he put us on. 0:31:44.720 --> 0:31:49.880 Got a well KEG. Johnson, got a black promoter and 0:31:51.320 --> 0:31:54.880 Mike Veener was the head of Pride and we hit 0:31:55.320 --> 0:31:58.720 with Fool's Paradise our first record. Well it was R 0:31:58.720 --> 0:32:01.800 and B hit, you know, didn't get no pop play, 0:32:02.480 --> 0:32:07.320 but uh that was that. And when we started practicing, 0:32:07.440 --> 0:32:09.680 we went on the road and things were happening quick 0:32:09.680 --> 0:32:13.640 because we had the big naturals and people automatically oh 0:32:14.040 --> 0:32:18.200 another Jackson's and we had the bigger naturals. So can you. 0:32:20.560 --> 0:32:23.040 Those your natural Yeah? 0:32:23.160 --> 0:32:26.280 Yeah, okay, I had to know it for his wags 0:32:26.320 --> 0:32:31.560 or not because they were so perfect silvers afros for me, 0:32:31.640 --> 0:32:33.920 the real standard of the afro, not the Jackson five 0:32:34.080 --> 0:32:34.240 like that. 0:32:34.680 --> 0:32:36.000 You know. Well, we we. 0:32:35.840 --> 0:32:39.360 Had a concept. I thought, if you would we would 0:32:39.560 --> 0:32:43.040 go to bed instead of with the natural flattening it up, 0:32:43.080 --> 0:32:45.760 we would brush our hair up and take rubber bands 0:32:45.760 --> 0:32:49.120 and have a unicorn going up and go to sleep 0:32:49.200 --> 0:32:50.960 like that and we took the rubber bands off. It 0:32:51.000 --> 0:32:52.200 would just lay out like that. 0:32:52.440 --> 0:32:53.040 Wow. 0:32:53.200 --> 0:32:54.720 So that was our. 0:32:56.600 --> 0:33:01.560 You think, I ain't gonna do this, only braid my 0:33:01.640 --> 0:33:03.120 hair so can have that effect. 0:33:03.280 --> 0:33:05.080 I was like, damn, I could just unicorm my ship. 0:33:07.960 --> 0:33:11.360 You're fired, Thank you? 0:33:10.320 --> 0:33:13.520 I love you? Oh man? 0:33:13.840 --> 0:33:19.280 So uh knowing or you know, I don't. I don't 0:33:19.320 --> 0:33:24.840 know how big of a presence the Jackson Five were 0:33:25.120 --> 0:33:27.520 in you guys's life as far as like VA's the 0:33:27.600 --> 0:33:29.880 goal or if it was some sort. 0:33:29.680 --> 0:33:34.800 Of eclips it was, but it was oh, sorry, no, well. 0:33:34.720 --> 0:33:38.960 I'm asking like, was there a thing like well until 0:33:39.000 --> 0:33:41.760 we reached the status of the Jackson Five, like we 0:33:41.800 --> 0:33:43.480 haven't made it yet or that sort of thing. 0:33:43.560 --> 0:33:47.440 And at least with the Pride Records. 0:33:47.160 --> 0:33:52.520 It wasn't openly said because we were kind of controlling 0:33:52.840 --> 0:33:57.280 are We were writing our songs, we were doing our 0:33:57.280 --> 0:34:00.800 own harmony. We didn't have a corporation, and like guys 0:34:00.840 --> 0:34:02.960 that knew what they were doing, you know too, so 0:34:03.040 --> 0:34:06.520 we learned everything. So it was like a great feeling 0:34:06.680 --> 0:34:09.319 each level of it. So we wasn't even thinking. We 0:34:09.320 --> 0:34:12.440 were just happy to be in it really and doing 0:34:12.480 --> 0:34:13.360 our own music. 0:34:14.320 --> 0:34:17.080 So those prior records were was that you in the 0:34:17.080 --> 0:34:19.920 studio like just pretty much doing everything? 0:34:19.960 --> 0:34:21.279 How much was that? How much? 0:34:22.120 --> 0:34:28.120 But Jerry Butler had three guys, well two Cake Johnson 0:34:28.160 --> 0:34:32.319 and Jerry Peters working with his company, and he sent 0:34:32.400 --> 0:34:35.200 them first to meet us, and he met us at 0:34:35.239 --> 0:34:40.040 the six Flags Magic Mountain doing a show, and backstage 0:34:40.239 --> 0:34:43.560 after the show he brought his records. I guess that 0:34:43.640 --> 0:34:47.279 he wanted well that he did want us to hear 0:34:47.360 --> 0:34:50.120 from Jerry Butler, telling him to let him hear this. 0:34:50.840 --> 0:34:54.239 And I had my base ready in an amp and 0:34:54.280 --> 0:34:59.080 we were all sitting in a line, well in a circle, 0:34:59.120 --> 0:35:02.839 half circle, and we knew he was coming, so we 0:35:02.840 --> 0:35:05.840 was prepared to play our songs and he said I 0:35:05.880 --> 0:35:09.960 heard you all right, Keg did, and we looked at 0:35:09.960 --> 0:35:12.600 each other and said yeah yeah, And he said, okay, 0:35:12.640 --> 0:35:15.760 let me hear something. So we started playing Fool's Paradise 0:35:15.880 --> 0:35:17.839 at the w recor, our first record, and I started 0:35:17.880 --> 0:35:22.680 off with the base du and then Charmain started singing 0:35:22.760 --> 0:35:25.719 and we all you know, and Keg just walked over 0:35:25.800 --> 0:35:28.600 to the trash can and then okay, that's one, let 0:35:28.640 --> 0:35:31.600 me hear another one. And through through the records in 0:35:31.640 --> 0:35:32.480 the trash. 0:35:34.120 --> 0:35:34.799 In front of us. 0:35:34.880 --> 0:35:35.680 You know, we like that. 0:35:35.840 --> 0:35:38.279 We was teenagers. We was like, we looked at each other. Yeah, 0:35:40.280 --> 0:35:42.480 so that was great. We clicked right off the bat, 0:35:42.960 --> 0:35:44.680 you know when he did that. 0:35:45.040 --> 0:35:49.600 You know so well, even though buying these records and 0:35:49.719 --> 0:35:52.040 seeing the production and stuff, I knew that you wrote 0:35:52.080 --> 0:35:56.040 the songs, but yeah, I was trying to figure out, 0:35:56.120 --> 0:35:59.360 like how much production control you had these songs. 0:36:00.520 --> 0:36:03.360 I was learning then I didn't want to produce. I 0:36:03.440 --> 0:36:05.520 didn't even play on it, and I didn't want to. 0:36:05.640 --> 0:36:08.680 He asked me, did cagg was the producer, but it 0:36:08.760 --> 0:36:11.360 was supposed to be It was Keg and Jerry Peters 0:36:11.400 --> 0:36:15.160 that were the producers. Jerry Butler wasn't going to produce, 0:36:15.360 --> 0:36:19.319 but it was his company that was hired, and uh, 0:36:20.000 --> 0:36:25.640 some things went down. But Keg was the producer, and 0:36:26.080 --> 0:36:27.800 he asked me, did I want to play on it? 0:36:27.920 --> 0:36:32.080 Because he liked everything he heard, uh, and he was worried. 0:36:32.160 --> 0:36:34.480 He wasn't going to tell Jerry. Now I didn't notice 0:36:34.520 --> 0:36:37.120 at the time, but he was. He wasn't going to 0:36:37.200 --> 0:36:42.239 tell Jerry till later. Oh wow, because Jerry was busy still, 0:36:42.280 --> 0:36:44.520 he was still hot with his career. He was on 0:36:44.680 --> 0:36:48.000 tour and all that stuff. So, uh, we was actually 0:36:48.040 --> 0:36:53.000 in the studio cutting this stuff before Jerry even knew that. 0:36:53.120 --> 0:36:56.400 We didn't do his record. But I didn't know this. 0:36:56.640 --> 0:37:00.560 I just heard it from a phone conversation with my mother, 0:37:01.080 --> 0:37:06.600 Mike Wiener, and Keg because Keg was with Jerry and 0:37:06.640 --> 0:37:10.120 they were about to get rid of him, because Jerry 0:37:10.239 --> 0:37:13.279 came in and came down, and I remember I had 0:37:13.280 --> 0:37:15.360 to go in the studio and he was telling me, now, 0:37:15.480 --> 0:37:19.000 this is what I wanted y'all to do. And he 0:37:19.160 --> 0:37:25.240 played a way worse bubblegum record than one Bad Apple, 0:37:25.400 --> 0:37:29.839 and I like that. This was horrible. It was bubblegum. 0:37:30.440 --> 0:37:32.680 So I was like, you know, I was from the 0:37:32.760 --> 0:37:38.240 Nickason Garden and Watts, so yeah, I wasn't even trying 0:37:38.320 --> 0:37:43.839 to hear it. But I liked Jerry Butler, so I said, well, yeah, 0:37:44.680 --> 0:37:45.600 we're not doing that. 0:37:48.120 --> 0:37:48.919 That's all I said. 0:37:48.960 --> 0:37:51.120 I didn't want to say nothing else because I liked him. 0:37:51.160 --> 0:37:52.880 I just, you know, let me cut to the chase 0:37:53.400 --> 0:37:56.239 and I play around, we ain't doing it, and he said, 0:37:56.320 --> 0:38:01.600 oh why not? Yeah, it's too bubble gum, that's all 0:38:01.640 --> 0:38:06.200 I said. And he said, oh, okay, you sure, that's 0:38:06.239 --> 0:38:09.320 all he said. I said yeah, and he let it go. 0:38:10.360 --> 0:38:14.879 He just made sure everything went through his company, KEG, 0:38:14.960 --> 0:38:18.200 and then was gonna get fired. But I liked the 0:38:18.239 --> 0:38:20.640 way he handled hisself with us when he threw the 0:38:20.719 --> 0:38:23.080 records in the trash. So I stood up for him. 0:38:23.560 --> 0:38:26.520 I told him, Oh, if you get rid of KEG, 0:38:26.680 --> 0:38:27.840 we ain't doing nothing. 0:38:29.520 --> 0:38:29.800 Okay. 0:38:30.239 --> 0:38:31.920 I didn't know what I was I was, but I 0:38:32.040 --> 0:38:37.640 meant what I said. I was only about but eighteen, No, 0:38:38.160 --> 0:38:41.719 I was seventeen or something. But I was the one 0:38:41.800 --> 0:38:44.560 that everybody was listening to, and they like KEG, and 0:38:44.760 --> 0:38:47.839 we were doing our own things. So I just told 0:38:47.920 --> 0:38:50.840 Mike Wiener, Hey, if you get rid of KEG, we 0:38:50.920 --> 0:38:53.080 ain't doing nothing. We'll go somewhere else. 0:38:53.560 --> 0:38:56.200 Before y'all got into the studio, how were you writing 0:38:56.239 --> 0:38:58.719 your songs like foods preadicce writing them on base at home? 0:38:58.840 --> 0:39:02.360 On base? Oh, I would use the bass excuse me 0:39:02.960 --> 0:39:05.759 as a harmonic to the melody that I would sing. 0:39:06.640 --> 0:39:06.799 Uh. 0:39:08.640 --> 0:39:11.719 Always. I wouldn't do it as a you know a 0:39:11.760 --> 0:39:14.520 lot of people stay on E for the funk type thing. 0:39:15.640 --> 0:39:19.000 I would use it as a keyboard. I would always 0:39:19.000 --> 0:39:22.640 play the bass a harmonic to my melody and then 0:39:22.719 --> 0:39:25.360 the chords would you could you could hear different ones, 0:39:26.000 --> 0:39:29.000 you know as you listening to the melody and the bass. 0:39:30.120 --> 0:39:33.600 So are a majority of the songs that you write? 0:39:33.640 --> 0:39:36.680 Do you write it on bass? Verse before? You never 0:39:36.760 --> 0:39:37.240 on piano? 0:39:37.360 --> 0:39:41.000 Never on Okay, now I do because you know you 0:39:41.080 --> 0:39:44.160 got a studio in your hand. Now you know you 0:39:44.239 --> 0:39:50.359 could do anything. Really, But back then, if I did 0:39:50.400 --> 0:39:52.879 a melody, I immediately went to the bass and did 0:39:52.920 --> 0:39:56.200 the harmonic bass line because that was like my keyboard. 0:39:57.560 --> 0:39:57.920 So for. 0:40:00.680 --> 0:40:04.520 For those first four three or four initial Silvers albums, 0:40:06.239 --> 0:40:08.799 that didn't catch you on the way that showcase quote 0:40:08.800 --> 0:40:10.319 on once you guys went to Capital, But. 0:40:12.160 --> 0:40:14.719 Was it at all shocking to you that. 0:40:16.360 --> 0:40:19.239 Those records would be discovered in a new light in 0:40:19.360 --> 0:40:22.600 the era of rare groove culture and hip hop sampling, 0:40:23.200 --> 0:40:27.720 Like because even though in your mind you might think like, oh, well, okay, 0:40:28.520 --> 0:40:31.480 those first few records weren't hitting like you know, our 0:40:31.560 --> 0:40:32.520 Capital years. 0:40:32.400 --> 0:40:36.239 But for a lot of us, yeah, that's the holy grail. 0:40:36.320 --> 0:40:36.879 Oh my god. 0:40:37.040 --> 0:40:40.440 Yeah, I mean the first album alone with with uh 0:40:41.440 --> 0:40:42.320 wish I could talk to you. 0:40:42.600 --> 0:40:46.640 I'll never be ashamed, Like there's least like in my eyes, 0:40:46.719 --> 0:40:49.759 like that first Silver Records has at least six six 0:40:49.920 --> 0:40:52.880 or seven gems on it that we see in the 0:40:52.960 --> 0:40:56.080 light of sampling and how it's so was it at 0:40:56.160 --> 0:41:01.640 all shocking to you that, like some thirty five years later, 0:41:01.760 --> 0:41:05.759 forty years later, that suddenly like even in my DJ 0:41:05.920 --> 0:41:09.360 said like I'll play only one can win, as. 0:41:10.520 --> 0:41:12.000 So that is ain't shocking it all? 0:41:12.600 --> 0:41:15.600 Well, actually I felt great. I mean it was like 0:41:16.280 --> 0:41:20.120 an honor for and then I started thinking, how does 0:41:20.200 --> 0:41:20.760 that happen? 0:41:21.160 --> 0:41:21.320 You know? 0:41:21.640 --> 0:41:24.520 And then the only thing I could think of is wow, 0:41:25.200 --> 0:41:28.400 it was young people that picked that up. And I 0:41:28.600 --> 0:41:30.719 was young at the time when I wrote it. So 0:41:30.880 --> 0:41:35.120 it's like twenty years later that same spirit that you 0:41:35.200 --> 0:41:38.880 know musical DNA if you will, you know, only the 0:41:38.960 --> 0:41:42.239 young could hear that, because I was like, wow, that 0:41:42.440 --> 0:41:44.640 must be it. The same thing with Missing Me, all 0:41:44.719 --> 0:41:47.719 those songs that were sampled I wrote when I was 0:41:48.520 --> 0:41:49.440 younger than eighteen. 0:41:50.880 --> 0:41:53.160 Right, No, that's that's a whole twenty minute conversation just 0:41:53.239 --> 0:41:53.759 on that song. 0:41:54.160 --> 0:42:01.040 Yes, well what's started man with? Yeah with misdemeanor, Like, 0:42:01.200 --> 0:42:04.160 how how did you come with that? 0:42:05.600 --> 0:42:05.759 Uh? 0:42:07.239 --> 0:42:13.680 Wow? I didn't I the base came first. Uh, I 0:42:13.800 --> 0:42:17.680 was just I was stomping my foot and I was 0:42:17.840 --> 0:42:22.960 just hitting mm hmmm mmmmm. No, I was just doing 0:42:23.040 --> 0:42:28.839 the first one first, mm hmmm mm hmmm. 0:42:29.400 --> 0:42:29.600 Oh. 0:42:29.960 --> 0:42:32.359 And then I started repeating those two over and over 0:42:32.800 --> 0:42:35.200 and I would hit my foot kind of hard on 0:42:35.320 --> 0:42:38.360 the ground like a kick. And I had one of 0:42:38.440 --> 0:42:42.720 them old. It was I think it was a Signo 0:42:42.880 --> 0:42:46.120 cassette player. They only made one. It had one big 0:42:46.320 --> 0:42:51.239 giant speaker. It was a Mono radio cassette player. Man, 0:42:51.360 --> 0:42:55.360 it had the perfect compression for that mic. Because I 0:42:55.520 --> 0:43:00.400 recorded that baseline stomping my feet with that cassette. Man, 0:43:00.480 --> 0:43:05.520 it was the best sound ever. I did everything. I 0:43:05.600 --> 0:43:07.880 went and bought two of those iPhone. 0:43:08.800 --> 0:43:11.480 Yeah, that's what the that's what the iPhone sounds like now. 0:43:11.600 --> 0:43:14.080 And sort of I track a lot of my drums 0:43:14.120 --> 0:43:16.640 up withut the iPhone, like on the floor, like thirteen 0:43:16.680 --> 0:43:19.319 feet away from me, and it's the same perfect man. 0:43:19.480 --> 0:43:23.359 So I just loved that. I kept that cassette till 0:43:23.400 --> 0:43:26.040 it evaporated. 0:43:26.440 --> 0:43:26.640 You know. 0:43:27.200 --> 0:43:30.800 It just had that the misdemeanor vibe on it. And 0:43:30.960 --> 0:43:36.600 I just recorded that and then said the hook. I 0:43:36.680 --> 0:43:38.719 don't remember if I had the words already I did, 0:43:38.800 --> 0:43:45.640 probably didn't, I was, and I knew because I listened 0:43:45.680 --> 0:43:48.160 to that melody lower octave with the base and the 0:43:48.280 --> 0:43:52.560 same register, and it's wrong. It's the most horrible melody 0:43:52.719 --> 0:43:55.480 with the baseline because it's one of them notes that 0:43:55.640 --> 0:43:58.879 if you do an octave high you can get away 0:43:58.920 --> 0:44:01.800 with it. It sounds cool, almost funky, but if you 0:44:01.840 --> 0:44:04.399 do it in the same register like an octave lower, 0:44:05.280 --> 0:44:08.640 the worst thing to your ear. You couldn't. I hated 0:44:08.680 --> 0:44:11.239 it when I when I heard it like that, But uh, 0:44:12.239 --> 0:44:15.320 I knew what I had When I actually did the 0:44:15.440 --> 0:44:19.279 melody with the baseline, it sounded great. I just knew 0:44:19.320 --> 0:44:24.000 I had something that would people would like. I don't 0:44:24.040 --> 0:44:26.239 know why. It just had a feeling vibe, you know. 0:44:26.480 --> 0:44:28.000 And how old was Foster when he cut that? 0:44:28.920 --> 0:44:32.680 He was wrong? I think ten? Uh turn. 0:44:35.120 --> 0:44:37.640 Like ten years old? The funky shit out. 0:44:38.080 --> 0:44:39.040 Were you were? 0:44:40.040 --> 0:44:46.560 Because of the pristine level of musicianship that a lot 0:44:46.640 --> 0:44:49.959 of the Pride era records were under. Were you guys 0:44:50.080 --> 0:44:52.440 always using the same musicians in the studio or was 0:44:52.520 --> 0:44:55.279 it did you have a relationship with these musicians or 0:44:55.400 --> 0:44:56.959 was just like who's here today? 0:44:57.239 --> 0:44:59.960 We met him? Because we wanted to be at every session, 0:45:00.480 --> 0:45:04.440 so it was mainly Chuck Rainy on bass or what 0:45:04.920 --> 0:45:09.800 oh Man Felder, those two were the bass players. 0:45:10.000 --> 0:45:10.680 Those guys were just. 0:45:11.160 --> 0:45:13.319 Moon like no, they were the top. 0:45:14.800 --> 0:45:20.759 But I'm just saying like, like, yeah, well, Keig Keg and. 0:45:20.840 --> 0:45:25.279 Jerry Peters they were real good producers back then. They 0:45:25.360 --> 0:45:30.200 did Uh, Gray, what's that song that friends of friends 0:45:30.239 --> 0:45:34.319 of distinct? Yeah, they did that and uh you got 0:45:34.400 --> 0:45:38.840 me going? And and so Keig Johnson and Jerry Peters 0:45:38.920 --> 0:45:42.879 were formidable producers themselves. So and Jerry Peters was great 0:45:43.000 --> 0:45:47.839 keyboardist and arranger. So they knew all the top musicians. 0:45:48.040 --> 0:45:51.920 And I'd go to every session. David t was main guitar. 0:45:52.800 --> 0:45:56.799 Uh Felder. They'd switch up on keyboard guys because there 0:45:56.880 --> 0:45:59.440 was a lot of them, but it was always kind 0:45:59.480 --> 0:46:00.680 of jazz oriented. 0:46:00.760 --> 0:46:02.040 Guys, is there still alive? 0:46:02.480 --> 0:46:03.040 Yes he is. 0:46:03.680 --> 0:46:08.120 Wait, it's just hit me. Was it one of your 0:46:08.160 --> 0:46:12.960 brothers or three? Somehow? You guys were actually involved in 0:46:13.080 --> 0:46:13.920 the Jackson five. 0:46:13.840 --> 0:46:17.160 Cartoon Edmund he was Marlon's voice. 0:46:17.400 --> 0:46:18.719 Okay, here's a voice of Morl. 0:46:18.840 --> 0:46:24.320 Yeah all right, So in this next clip, I literally 0:46:24.400 --> 0:46:27.319 tell hip hop pioneer Lady B. Why I'm giving her 0:46:27.600 --> 0:46:31.200 her flowers. Her work on radio, which reached me in 0:46:31.400 --> 0:46:35.359 nineteen eighty one, literally set me on a course, which 0:46:35.440 --> 0:46:37.520 is why you know of a quest love Today. 0:46:38.040 --> 0:46:41.319 What's cool is Lady B gives Laiah some flowers here too. 0:46:44.719 --> 0:46:48.279 One of my favorite nights of yours was the the 0:46:48.640 --> 0:46:52.440 aforementioned Uh Steady be versus. 0:46:52.239 --> 0:46:53.240 Will Smith battle. 0:46:53.840 --> 0:46:59.640 Yeah, find dude, Okay, So Will Smith will forever, he'll 0:46:59.719 --> 0:47:04.239 for ever had my respect because he somehow got the call. 0:47:05.360 --> 0:47:09.200 He freestyled that Steady Bee was a munchie chi and 0:47:09.760 --> 0:47:14.719 I just remember at that point Steady Bee actually wanting 0:47:14.800 --> 0:47:16.600 to fight Will and them. 0:47:16.640 --> 0:47:19.880 Like, and I did not help matters any because I 0:47:19.960 --> 0:47:23.560 thought it was the funniest is I ever heard. And 0:47:23.640 --> 0:47:26.640 I think the fact that we all laughed made him 0:47:26.800 --> 0:47:27.720 really angry. 0:47:28.280 --> 0:47:29.760 Yo, we were all laughing. 0:47:29.840 --> 0:47:32.960 But that was the era when Shante stepped off that stage. 0:47:33.000 --> 0:47:34.600 That was the era when you had to come off 0:47:34.880 --> 0:47:36.800 off the top of your head and just you just 0:47:36.880 --> 0:47:40.440 had that. That was actually what you call free styling. 0:47:40.760 --> 0:47:43.720 That was freestyling people environment. 0:47:43.800 --> 0:47:47.279 They underestimated Will because they were like, well, you're not 0:47:47.400 --> 0:47:48.759 real hip hop, you're suburban. 0:47:48.880 --> 0:47:49.840 You talk all proper. 0:47:50.320 --> 0:47:53.759 First of all, he lived in my neighborhood that he 0:47:53.960 --> 0:47:56.839 wasn't out there gang banging and talk about it bee 0:47:57.000 --> 0:47:59.719 grabbing his jawn and acting. And you know, we didn't 0:47:59.719 --> 0:48:01.759 come up in a one parent household. We didn't learn 0:48:01.800 --> 0:48:04.160 how to respect women and stuff. Just because he wasn't 0:48:04.239 --> 0:48:07.600 raised like that, why not mean he wasn't a part 0:48:07.719 --> 0:48:09.960 and just as authentic and true to hip hop as 0:48:10.040 --> 0:48:13.080 everybody else. That is what I love the most about him. 0:48:13.520 --> 0:48:16.920 That's when Will was the first one, you know who 0:48:17.160 --> 0:48:21.759 made me. His lyrics made me smile. I call it 0:48:22.200 --> 0:48:25.719 happy hip hop, and everybody else was all bravado. I 0:48:25.800 --> 0:48:28.080 got a big back Cadillac. I got to know you 0:48:28.160 --> 0:48:29.319 don't you live in your mama house? 0:48:29.600 --> 0:48:31.239 I stopping right, you know what I mean? 0:48:31.560 --> 0:48:31.799 Fat? 0:48:31.880 --> 0:48:34.000 But Will was like the first one. I mean, you 0:48:34.120 --> 0:48:37.640 know it was it was. It was funny, it was 0:48:37.960 --> 0:48:41.160 fun it made you smile, and then you put a 0:48:41.200 --> 0:48:43.000 dope DJ like Jeff with him and it was just 0:48:43.239 --> 0:48:44.680 the greatest combination ever. 0:48:45.600 --> 0:48:50.440 Wow, I can I can go on and on nerding 0:48:50.480 --> 0:48:51.000 out forever. 0:48:52.040 --> 0:48:54.359 It's been beautiful seeing your friendship too, and how it's 0:48:54.400 --> 0:48:56.799 evolved and stuff. You Jeff and Will and how they 0:48:56.880 --> 0:48:57.920 still come out and support you. 0:48:58.080 --> 0:48:58.839 That shit is dope. 0:48:58.960 --> 0:49:00.919 I just texted the guy us on the movie set 0:49:00.960 --> 0:49:02.160 with him. I'm like, tell well, I need a one 0:49:02.200 --> 0:49:03.640 minute video of him congratulate me. 0:49:03.680 --> 0:49:04.360 For my fortieth. 0:49:05.320 --> 0:49:07.040 They got text back. He's doing it as soon as 0:49:07.120 --> 0:49:08.640 he gets out of such and such and I'm like, 0:49:08.680 --> 0:49:08.920 thank you. 0:49:09.480 --> 0:49:14.680 He lives for Instagram posts, So you know, no, ja 0:49:14.800 --> 0:49:15.280 you missed? 0:49:15.360 --> 0:49:17.880 Was my thirtieth. He came home to surprise me, like 0:49:17.920 --> 0:49:19.160 I didn't even know he was coming to the show. 0:49:19.320 --> 0:49:19.520 Really. 0:49:20.000 --> 0:49:22.399 He performed with Salt and Pepper. He did what a man. 0:49:23.000 --> 0:49:25.520 He performed with Chuck and Flave. He got out there. 0:49:25.520 --> 0:49:27.840 He was a whole s one w He did a 0:49:27.880 --> 0:49:31.919 lot of guy. He just stayed on stage all night 0:49:32.080 --> 0:49:35.960 and wait and there's more. It rained torrential rain. It 0:49:36.120 --> 0:49:40.080 was like the hip hop woods Stock. People did not leave. 0:49:40.239 --> 0:49:42.880 They stayed in the rain. Will was shaking me. Are 0:49:42.960 --> 0:49:44.640 you having as much fun as me? I'm like, I 0:49:44.719 --> 0:49:45.160 don't think. 0:49:46.120 --> 0:49:46.359 Wow. 0:49:47.840 --> 0:49:50.160 He stayed on stage all night and surprised me. It 0:49:50.239 --> 0:49:51.319 was the dopest thing ever. 0:49:52.239 --> 0:49:56.239 Well, you deserve all your flowers, you know, eighty one. 0:49:56.680 --> 0:50:01.640 You just you literally introduced me to the world that 0:50:01.920 --> 0:50:02.600 I get to. 0:50:02.960 --> 0:50:04.520 That I built it in an empire. 0:50:06.239 --> 0:50:07.040 That says a lot. 0:50:07.640 --> 0:50:08.600 I want to thank you for that. 0:50:09.239 --> 0:50:11.759 And forget about your radio mentees around here, because she 0:50:11.840 --> 0:50:13.200 got a lot of those in the world too. 0:50:14.280 --> 0:50:17.680 Oh yes, I love that one. That's that's my little 0:50:17.760 --> 0:50:19.920 mini lady because she only and does she sit up 0:50:19.920 --> 0:50:22.640 there and and act like she asked. But you ain't 0:50:22.680 --> 0:50:24.840 let nobody say nothing to her either. She was the 0:50:24.960 --> 0:50:26.960 only one that stabbed and he was to speak up. Yeah, 0:50:27.040 --> 0:50:27.400 that's right. 0:50:27.800 --> 0:50:28.320 He watched me. 0:50:28.719 --> 0:50:30.960 He watched me get one right there, proud of that 0:50:31.040 --> 0:50:32.920 one right there, and you watch me get fired to girl. 0:50:33.040 --> 0:50:33.799 So it's all good. 0:50:37.239 --> 0:50:38.720 You have any you got any children? 0:50:38.960 --> 0:50:39.000 Like? 0:50:40.080 --> 0:50:43.839 No, I I tried, but my sister again, I talk 0:50:43.880 --> 0:50:47.440 about her so much. She's been going for two years now. No, 0:50:47.680 --> 0:50:50.960 my sister, uh gave me kids and then my old 0:50:51.000 --> 0:50:53.200 man passed away on me and he left me kids. 0:50:53.280 --> 0:50:56.680 So am I a mother and a grandmother? Yes, to 0:50:56.800 --> 0:51:00.600 every extent of the word. I have taught them to walk, talk, 0:51:00.680 --> 0:51:02.680 potty trained school meetings. 0:51:02.880 --> 0:51:04.279 I am a mother and. 0:51:05.920 --> 0:51:09.400 I am a grandmother. And I know I literally you know. 0:51:09.560 --> 0:51:11.480 I remember when my sister took ill she had a 0:51:11.520 --> 0:51:13.000 stroke and I was taking care of her in her 0:51:13.080 --> 0:51:15.480 latter years, and the doctor asked her, you know, you 0:51:15.520 --> 0:51:17.560 don't have a high blood pressure or anything. You don't 0:51:17.960 --> 0:51:20.520 do you worry about anything. It says you have three 0:51:20.640 --> 0:51:23.880 children and seven grandchildren. She says, no, I don't do that. 0:51:24.000 --> 0:51:24.640 My sister does. 0:51:25.000 --> 0:51:26.080 And she makes it like she. 0:51:27.640 --> 0:51:29.600 I raised her kids. She was my She called me 0:51:29.680 --> 0:51:32.560 her baby daddy. She sent me cards on Father's Day. 0:51:34.320 --> 0:51:39.200 Wow, you the dopest daddy. Yeah, but that's dopey. Yes, 0:51:39.320 --> 0:51:41.960 they walk right past their mother. Come to me crazy, 0:51:48.440 --> 0:51:48.799 all right. 0:51:48.960 --> 0:51:55.000 So when The Roots signed their record deal in November 0:51:55.760 --> 0:51:59.799 of nineteen ninety three, our manager Richard Nichols wanted us 0:52:00.040 --> 0:52:03.520 to instantly get this record out of the way, and so, 0:52:04.160 --> 0:52:06.920 I believe because of the cheaper rates, we recorded like 0:52:07.680 --> 0:52:09.400 around like Christmas. 0:52:09.520 --> 0:52:11.760 Week, believe these songs. 0:52:11.800 --> 0:52:13.600 To mix them, we had, you know, we recorded the 0:52:13.680 --> 0:52:17.960 songs in early December and then we uh mixed them 0:52:18.560 --> 0:52:21.960 right after Christmas and New Year to get the EP 0:52:22.160 --> 0:52:25.279 out by April. We were trying to move fast, and 0:52:25.440 --> 0:52:28.640 so this is around the time when Tribe had just 0:52:28.760 --> 0:52:33.440 released Midnight Maratis, their third album. They recorded at Battery 0:52:33.480 --> 0:52:37.160 Studios because Battery was the studio owned by Jive Records, 0:52:37.200 --> 0:52:41.080 their label. We chose Battery Studios because that's also where 0:52:41.120 --> 0:52:43.960 Bob Power Tribes engineer. 0:52:43.960 --> 0:52:45.520 Wanted to mix our record. 0:52:46.000 --> 0:52:49.440 We love the way that Bob's drums sounded on Tribe albums, 0:52:49.480 --> 0:52:52.080 and it was like, hey, we want the same treatment. 0:52:52.239 --> 0:52:57.719 So that's how influential Tribe was. There was a legendary 0:52:57.800 --> 0:53:00.319 show with Dayla Soul, Soul's of Mischief and a tribe 0:53:00.320 --> 0:53:03.719 called Quests that I believe was at the Ritz and 0:53:03.880 --> 0:53:06.680 Union Square. Trek and I went to this concert. It 0:53:06.800 --> 0:53:10.040 was like, I consider that the last time that Tarik 0:53:10.080 --> 0:53:12.800 and I were civilians, and I remember that night. I 0:53:12.880 --> 0:53:16.040 remember saying, like I joke when we walk home, I said, Yo, man, 0:53:16.080 --> 0:53:19.200 you know what's crazy. The next time we come back 0:53:19.280 --> 0:53:21.880 to the United States, like we will have had an 0:53:22.000 --> 0:53:25.040 album out, Like we won't be civilians anymore. 0:53:25.440 --> 0:53:26.680 We're gonna be you know. 0:53:27.000 --> 0:53:29.640 Celebrities, stars. Like we had hope in the air that 0:53:29.760 --> 0:53:31.880 we were gonna like just come out of the box 0:53:31.960 --> 0:53:33.200 and like blow everyone away. 0:53:33.360 --> 0:53:37.520 That's that's that's what we that's what we planned on. 0:53:37.880 --> 0:53:40.959 So we kind of went to the day La Soul 0:53:41.160 --> 0:53:46.239 tribe called Quest Soul's a Mischief concert and just when 0:53:46.320 --> 0:53:49.200 the mosh pit and jumped around and ah, man, it 0:53:49.320 --> 0:53:49.760 was awesome. 0:53:50.360 --> 0:53:55.200 But basically it was just like I believe that Q 0:53:55.400 --> 0:54:01.600 Tip had come to Battery Studios to do a quickie 0:54:01.800 --> 0:54:04.799 remix to Oh My God. 0:54:05.120 --> 0:54:07.080 They were gonna do like a different version of it 0:54:07.239 --> 0:54:10.440 on stage that night, and if I recall correctly, they 0:54:10.520 --> 0:54:15.160 were using the mini rippert in loop that that's the 0:54:15.280 --> 0:54:17.880 second song on the Adventures in Paradise album. 0:54:18.560 --> 0:54:25.799 So if you listen to a Boom Boom, that's. 0:54:26.880 --> 0:54:32.640 Look up Minie Rippleton Adventures in Paradise and the song 0:54:32.760 --> 0:54:34.160 after Baby This Love I Have. 0:54:34.400 --> 0:54:38.040 I remember them looping me like I was like eavesdropping 0:54:38.880 --> 0:54:39.600 from the hallway. 0:54:39.600 --> 0:54:42.520 I'd like, go to the bathroom, but then sneak down 0:54:42.560 --> 0:54:45.080 the studio see and put my ear up against the 0:54:45.920 --> 0:54:48.040 wall to hear them loop in something. 0:54:48.320 --> 0:54:49.759 And they were gonna they. 0:54:49.680 --> 0:54:53.000 Were just making like a show debt for that particular 0:54:53.080 --> 0:54:56.239 New Year's performance, And you know, I was real shy 0:54:56.360 --> 0:54:58.800 as talk to them, even though you know they've seen. 0:54:58.719 --> 0:55:01.040 Us, Hey, y'all doing yeah, yeah, y'all the roots, y'all dope. 0:55:01.640 --> 0:55:04.040 But then I saw him in the hallway man, and 0:55:04.560 --> 0:55:07.400 it was like five weeks old, and I was like, yo, 0:55:08.760 --> 0:55:13.200 that three measure loop you do on Electric Relaxation, Like 0:55:13.800 --> 0:55:17.719 what is that about? Like it was unusual to not 0:55:17.960 --> 0:55:22.479 be an even four bar loop, Like if you listen 0:55:22.560 --> 0:55:26.960 to Electric Relaxation, it's a three bar loop. And I 0:55:27.080 --> 0:55:32.319 was just getting like two overly like nerdy and analytical. 0:55:32.440 --> 0:55:35.240 And he told me then that was the red flag. 0:55:35.480 --> 0:55:41.000 Like he's like, yo, like you talk like a journalist, 0:55:41.080 --> 0:55:46.120 you don't talk like a human being. And so I 0:55:46.200 --> 0:55:50.000 got a I got put in time out until about 0:55:50.880 --> 0:55:53.840 three albums later. Like you know, I saw him a 0:55:53.960 --> 0:55:55.880 little bit for the do You Want More? Period, but 0:55:56.000 --> 0:55:58.000 not that much because every time I saw him, it's 0:55:58.000 --> 0:56:02.600 just that likequestions to ask. And then he warmed up 0:56:02.640 --> 0:56:06.319 to us towards the end of ill Adelph Half Life 0:56:06.400 --> 0:56:09.799 and wanted to be on the album. And you know, man, 0:56:09.960 --> 0:56:13.600 he's he's my hero man, So big up to Q Tip. 0:56:15.040 --> 0:56:17.640 Here Frante gives Q Tip some flowers and he runs 0:56:17.680 --> 0:56:21.600 with it with a thoughtful response. Then we started playing 0:56:21.640 --> 0:56:23.200 clips and getting antidotes. 0:56:27.719 --> 0:56:29.120 I will say to if you were one of the 0:56:29.239 --> 0:56:31.080 one of my favorite producers in the sense that you 0:56:31.280 --> 0:56:33.600 always the way I've always described it is like you 0:56:33.640 --> 0:56:35.960 always kept a foot in both worlds, Like you could 0:56:36.040 --> 0:56:39.800 do a Midnight Marauders, but then could do the infamous 0:56:39.880 --> 0:56:41.560 you know what I'm saying, Or you could do like 0:56:41.920 --> 0:56:44.040 a Craig mac remix, and like you always found a 0:56:44.080 --> 0:56:47.080 way even when you work with big mainstream acts of 0:56:47.160 --> 0:56:49.920 the time, you still found a way to put your 0:56:50.160 --> 0:56:53.080 stamp on what you were doing. And I think that's 0:56:53.239 --> 0:56:55.640 and in my opinion to me, that always kept you 0:56:56.680 --> 0:56:58.759 kind of you. Never to me, never came across as 0:56:58.840 --> 0:57:00.440 like that bitter guy like a lot of the old 0:57:00.520 --> 0:57:01.160 chat So you know. 0:57:01.200 --> 0:57:02.120 What it is, you know why? 0:57:02.280 --> 0:57:04.600 And he could tell you it's not even a big secret. 0:57:04.600 --> 0:57:07.320 It's DJ right, don't you find it? 0:57:07.440 --> 0:57:13.160 I mean like djing' I'm smart about it now because 0:57:14.520 --> 0:57:19.120 I wasn't DJing as heavy since maybe the last three 0:57:19.160 --> 0:57:21.280 or four records where I'm now aware of it. Yeah, 0:57:21.440 --> 0:57:23.440 now now I know why Dre, Like when I saw 0:57:23.520 --> 0:57:26.840 straight out of Compton and realize the environment that Dre 0:57:27.080 --> 0:57:29.880 was DJing at at that roller skating rink where it's 0:57:29.920 --> 0:57:30.080 like you. 0:57:30.120 --> 0:57:32.439 Play the wrong record, that's ass. 0:57:33.200 --> 0:57:37.080 Now realize, oh, that's why all of Dre's stuff is 0:57:37.160 --> 0:57:40.040 taking no prisoners with with his singles and stuff like 0:57:40.120 --> 0:57:42.280 it has to just got to hit grab you by 0:57:42.320 --> 0:57:42.760 the throat. 0:57:42.880 --> 0:57:44.840 Now I realize that, yeah, that's That's the. 0:57:46.520 --> 0:57:50.840 Other thing about it too, is that it's it's you 0:57:50.960 --> 0:57:54.920 get to see what works and why, you know, because I, 0:57:55.200 --> 0:57:58.040 you know, I think that you and I we maybe 0:57:58.160 --> 0:58:00.160 I think we come from the same philosophy when we 0:58:00.240 --> 0:58:04.840 spend you know what I'm saying, It's like, you know, current, current, 0:58:05.720 --> 0:58:08.600 a little bit back on another one, throwback, temple wise, 0:58:08.640 --> 0:58:12.400 tempo match, baseline match and boom now current you know current, 0:58:12.720 --> 0:58:15.400 you know, just to try to mix and then sometimes 0:58:15.480 --> 0:58:19.080 you know that the crowd may not know the throwbacks, 0:58:19.400 --> 0:58:21.600 but you just want to see the reaction if if 0:58:21.640 --> 0:58:24.680 it's one of the yeah, because if it if it 0:58:24.720 --> 0:58:27.240 doesn't stop the grooving that you see who's moving it 0:58:27.320 --> 0:58:29.760 to it. It's a great study, you. 0:58:29.800 --> 0:58:31.160 Know, psychological stuff. 0:58:31.600 --> 0:58:33.360 If you're just tuning in, We're getting a hip hop 0:58:33.440 --> 0:58:37.200 history lesson with rapper, actor, producer DJ and member of 0:58:37.240 --> 0:58:39.360 a tripal Quest Q Tip. The reason why I brought 0:58:39.400 --> 0:58:45.120 up the record collection is because m the era of 0:58:45.680 --> 0:58:48.640 when you guys finally get your debut record out. 0:58:48.960 --> 0:58:49.080 Uh. 0:58:49.800 --> 0:58:53.080 First of all, the long ass title of People's Instinctive 0:58:53.120 --> 0:58:55.240 Travels and the Paths of Rhythm. 0:58:56.480 --> 0:59:00.120 Why I mean Captain Beef. 0:59:03.040 --> 0:59:03.480 Difficult? 0:59:03.680 --> 0:59:07.480 Yeah, I mean you know we title we need to 0:59:07.560 --> 0:59:08.520 stick the fuck out. 0:59:09.760 --> 0:59:15.640 When other options for the debut album before was the 0:59:17.200 --> 0:59:19.840 you know either or we always had like three to 0:59:19.920 --> 0:59:21.560 choose from it, they decided. 0:59:21.240 --> 0:59:22.960 Like, okay, now, were just like, yo, this is what 0:59:23.080 --> 0:59:23.320 it is. 0:59:24.560 --> 0:59:30.600 Okay. So in the era of you guys making that record. 0:59:32.320 --> 0:59:35.160 Well as a music producer, the first thing, the reason 0:59:35.200 --> 0:59:40.560 why I have a dividing line between the renaissance era 0:59:40.760 --> 0:59:44.200 of hip hop and the classic era of hip hop 0:59:44.760 --> 0:59:47.960 and the thin line that's in between is the fact 0:59:48.000 --> 0:59:55.680 that you guys managed to miraculously avoid James brown Well 0:59:55.880 --> 1:00:01.160 using anything from Break B Lose Ultimately and Breaks Collection, 1:00:01.800 --> 1:00:05.600 which all right for our listeners, Break Be Lou shout Out, 1:00:05.640 --> 1:00:05.960 What's Up? 1:00:06.360 --> 1:00:06.560 Lou? 1:00:06.680 --> 1:00:07.640 Lou Floores. 1:00:09.920 --> 1:00:14.800 Wisely came up with a Wikipedia or a cliff notes, 1:00:14.960 --> 1:00:17.480 if you will, of records. 1:00:17.280 --> 1:00:19.479 And Street Beat Lenny Street BT Lenny too. 1:00:19.560 --> 1:00:22.880 Yeah, Street B Lenny shout out of all the records 1:00:22.960 --> 1:00:28.120 that Bam and HERK and Flash and Theodore would spend 1:00:28.800 --> 1:00:31.840 back in the day, and when this compilation came out 1:00:31.880 --> 1:00:38.840 in late nineteen eighty five through nineteen eighty nine, pretty 1:00:38.880 --> 1:00:42.880 much I'll say sixty percent of most hip hop relied 1:00:43.080 --> 1:00:48.320 on these breaks for their daily diet, all these you know, 1:00:49.200 --> 1:00:53.080 synthetic substitution and peached the President. God made me funky. 1:00:54.080 --> 1:00:56.520 It was just to the point where the average record 1:00:56.600 --> 1:01:00.960 take like take a producer like Herbie Lovebug his productions 1:01:01.160 --> 1:01:04.280 on saying, like a filler cut on a kid in 1:01:04.320 --> 1:01:05.600 play record, You. 1:01:07.320 --> 1:01:08.120 Tell that's why? 1:01:08.280 --> 1:01:08.560 You mean? 1:01:09.080 --> 1:01:10.920 He used the drums from here and the loop from 1:01:10.960 --> 1:01:13.720 there and the baseline from there, you know, all on 1:01:13.800 --> 1:01:16.520 the same record where you really didn't do any heavy digging. 1:01:16.680 --> 1:01:19.320 So this is the first time, or at least with 1:01:19.640 --> 1:01:23.440 with the native tongues, this is the first time that 1:01:23.520 --> 1:01:28.200 I'm hearing loops that aren't on that compilation. And it's like, 1:01:28.720 --> 1:01:30.720 oh God, I gotta do some work to figure out 1:01:31.000 --> 1:01:35.800 what this is. Was that was that already a rule 1:01:35.960 --> 1:01:40.720 that like no substitution, no funky drummer, no impeach the President. 1:01:41.520 --> 1:01:42.200 Yeah, we were. 1:01:43.480 --> 1:01:43.720 It was. 1:01:44.960 --> 1:01:49.080 It was a crew of us, right like it was 1:01:49.280 --> 1:01:55.760 me Africa, the beat nuts. 1:01:56.160 --> 1:01:58.320 Who is the music head of the beat nuts. They 1:01:58.400 --> 1:02:05.240 both are who's your go to well made juju? 1:02:05.520 --> 1:02:09.640 I mean because that was my men, like in senior 1:02:09.760 --> 1:02:13.280 year high school, like we were me him Rashad. 1:02:14.760 --> 1:02:14.960 Yep. 1:02:16.240 --> 1:02:18.120 They all went to the No no, no, we all 1:02:18.200 --> 1:02:20.280 went to different schools, but we were all like meet 1:02:20.360 --> 1:02:22.880 up at the hubs and ship, like we just knew 1:02:22.960 --> 1:02:26.560 niggas from when you know, we was getting up getting 1:02:26.600 --> 1:02:28.760 beats and ship and you'd see dudes and be like, Yo, 1:02:28.880 --> 1:02:31.520 that dude got because we always there was a there 1:02:31.640 --> 1:02:36.040 was a small group of us who was like anti 1:02:36.720 --> 1:02:39.080 break beat, you know what I mean, Like we had 1:02:39.120 --> 1:02:42.360 to have the right ship, you know what I mean, 1:02:42.960 --> 1:02:43.560 like all right, the. 1:02:43.680 --> 1:02:45.480 Large professor substitution. 1:02:46.520 --> 1:02:46.720 Huh. 1:02:47.200 --> 1:02:48.840 But not once did you feel like all. 1:02:48.800 --> 1:02:52.120 Right, oh yeah, well after after you know, after we've 1:02:52.400 --> 1:02:55.760 established ourselves in that way, you didn't come back. There's 1:02:55.760 --> 1:02:59.360 been times I've used substitution kicks and ship like that 1:02:59.520 --> 1:02:59.800 and like. 1:03:00.120 --> 1:03:04.600 No, that's whatever, you can't tell yeah okay, or. 1:03:04.760 --> 1:03:07.320 Like you know, and like Pete would use he would 1:03:07.400 --> 1:03:11.560 use substitution a lot, you know, some of them ships. 1:03:11.640 --> 1:03:13.160 Just as a producer, you'd be like, yo, that ship 1:03:13.240 --> 1:03:17.080 is still that is that James brown Snea is still rocking. 1:03:17.480 --> 1:03:19.600 We got to boot, you know what I mean. But 1:03:20.280 --> 1:03:23.760 back then, early on, it was just about it was 1:03:23.840 --> 1:03:28.120 about the hunt, nigga, you know saying the hunt. You 1:03:28.200 --> 1:03:30.040 know that ship just had to fight. It was just 1:03:30.120 --> 1:03:31.880 like and then we got so on and we would 1:03:31.960 --> 1:03:35.160 travel out of town and flights. Me and Paul would 1:03:35.200 --> 1:03:36.959 get fucking rent cars. 1:03:36.680 --> 1:03:39.240 And be driving Pittsburgh. 1:03:39.560 --> 1:03:41.200 Yeah, all types of ship. 1:03:41.400 --> 1:03:42.720 You would go to Jerry's and Pittsburgh. 1:03:43.160 --> 1:03:43.400 Yep. 1:03:43.480 --> 1:03:44.320 I went to Jerry's. 1:03:44.800 --> 1:03:46.320 Yeah, it's yeah. 1:03:46.440 --> 1:03:51.200 If any beat nigger, there's seven Pilgrimage like Mecca Pilgrim, 1:03:51.720 --> 1:03:54.200 but Jerry's you'll never get past. 1:03:54.320 --> 1:03:58.640 Like the letter D and or C right right, right right, 1:03:58.880 --> 1:04:00.520 that's how large is where houses. 1:04:01.200 --> 1:04:06.520 But the crew was it was like Juju and and 1:04:06.640 --> 1:04:09.400 this is the crew like we all would know each other. 1:04:09.520 --> 1:04:12.440 We always go to spots and ship. It was Juju 1:04:12.760 --> 1:04:23.560 Diamond large myself Africa, Pete, I said Paul, right, Paul, 1:04:27.680 --> 1:04:31.479 prem had already bought a store. He already had everything. Wow, 1:04:32.040 --> 1:04:39.600 he had a store. Oh Latif Latif, I said Rashad, No, 1:04:41.320 --> 1:04:47.760 it was we was we was Mark already had he's 1:04:47.760 --> 1:04:52.120 a og so he was already. So Prem had the 1:04:52.200 --> 1:04:54.440 record store that he bought when he was in Texas 1:04:54.760 --> 1:04:58.280 and came and they just shipped him every like forty 1:04:58.360 --> 1:05:00.640 thousand records of some crazy ship. So he had everything, 1:05:01.160 --> 1:05:05.440 and Mark had everything. So we were all putting our 1:05:05.520 --> 1:05:08.160 shits together kind of at that time, you know, at 1:05:08.160 --> 1:05:12.240 the same time, you know. But it was the hunt. 1:05:12.680 --> 1:05:13.280 It was the hunt. 1:05:13.480 --> 1:05:15.040 It was like Game of Thrones and some shit. 1:05:15.160 --> 1:05:15.360 Dude. 1:05:15.480 --> 1:05:20.120 See, I'm glad you're saying this because even though my 1:05:20.280 --> 1:05:23.920 career came in the tail end of it, many a 1:05:24.000 --> 1:05:27.360 record dealer had the fear of their eyes when like, 1:05:28.200 --> 1:05:30.440 because I would just straight up ask them because they like, 1:05:30.560 --> 1:05:33.880 record dealers will do this thing where it's like, all right, 1:05:33.960 --> 1:05:36.960 they know what kind of money's walking in, right Jack. 1:05:37.040 --> 1:05:37.760 So they'll look at me. 1:05:38.360 --> 1:05:40.160 They'll look at me and like, okay, a mirror's good 1:05:40.200 --> 1:05:43.360 for ten thousand. So they have a system where it's 1:05:43.440 --> 1:05:46.520 like they'll give you all right, that's ten, that's twenty, 1:05:46.800 --> 1:05:49.600 that's ten, that's twenty, that's ten, that's twenty. 1:05:49.800 --> 1:05:50.720 No, that's right. 1:05:50.880 --> 1:05:54.000 But then they know you're itching and I'm like, so 1:05:54.120 --> 1:05:56.360 that's it, and they'll be like, well, you know, I 1:05:56.440 --> 1:05:58.800 got a shipment that just came. 1:05:58.720 --> 1:06:03.440 In last night, and all the warehouses up the block. 1:06:03.600 --> 1:06:06.120 Right, oh, take you over the block. Yeah that's all that. 1:06:08.040 --> 1:06:11.680 I got some dresses over here. Yeah. No, but that's 1:06:11.680 --> 1:06:14.960 what it's like. And then there's just a point I 1:06:15.000 --> 1:06:17.280 would tell them to just cut to the chase, like 1:06:17.640 --> 1:06:18.120 and that's the. 1:06:18.160 --> 1:06:21.120 Thing as a record collector, you never tell them like, look, 1:06:21.880 --> 1:06:23.800 only got a thousand, Just cut to the chase and 1:06:23.840 --> 1:06:25.680 give me the good ship, because no, they'll just do 1:06:25.800 --> 1:06:29.200 the same ship the tens, the twenties, the tens, the twenties, 1:06:29.360 --> 1:06:30.760 the tens, the twenties. 1:06:30.640 --> 1:06:31.439 Were you out there? 1:06:31.960 --> 1:06:35.520 And then they'll be like they you They will usually 1:06:35.640 --> 1:06:38.760 say like Pete Rock was always the thing, like well, yeah, 1:06:38.800 --> 1:06:40.560 we were holding some of the stuff for Pete Rock. 1:06:42.720 --> 1:06:46.880 You know, I'll give you an extra yeah. But then 1:06:46.920 --> 1:06:49.320 you're like you get desperate and not realize this wouldn't 1:06:49.320 --> 1:06:51.920 even be true. No, no, no, no, I realized then 1:06:51.960 --> 1:06:53.240 I realized that was the hustle. 1:06:53.400 --> 1:06:57.680 And then finally I found a guy where he's just like, look, 1:06:58.480 --> 1:07:01.440 this is worth a hundred, worth one fifty. This is 1:07:01.640 --> 1:07:05.240 you know, in those type of things, So of course 1:07:05.320 --> 1:07:08.440 those prices would be jacked up because they would use 1:07:08.480 --> 1:07:10.000 it like stuff already. 1:07:10.080 --> 1:07:11.840 So like like a. 1:07:13.360 --> 1:07:17.800 Prime example the Manti Alexander in Happiness. 1:07:18.000 --> 1:07:21.360 All right, so before you use that for Gangster bitch, 1:07:26.240 --> 1:07:29.440 I know that the album was worth like ten bucks now, 1:07:29.720 --> 1:07:35.280 but because Gangster like he cutes him, single handedly brought up. 1:07:35.240 --> 1:07:39.200 The stocks on all well, not just the stuff people. 1:07:40.160 --> 1:07:43.400 I feel bad a little bit because it just happened 1:07:43.440 --> 1:07:44.520 like okay boom. 1:07:44.280 --> 1:07:47.560 So yeah, my generation is now paying the extra on. 1:07:47.960 --> 1:07:48.880 A new Tribe album. 1:07:49.240 --> 1:07:56.000 I use this this for whatever. What is the Nairobi Yeah, 1:07:56.480 --> 1:08:01.840 like that ship is rocketed already. 1:08:01.960 --> 1:08:03.760 But give me an example of like from once it 1:08:03.840 --> 1:08:05.560 came to whence they got once Tip touched it? 1:08:07.000 --> 1:08:09.760 No all the time, like oh Jesus Christ, I've read 1:08:11.120 --> 1:08:12.760 Ramp is a five dollars record. 1:08:13.920 --> 1:08:16.160 I don't even think there's an original Ramp record. Like 1:08:16.439 --> 1:08:20.760 every Ramp album I've seen is. I just felt like 1:08:21.000 --> 1:08:24.679 they Yeah, they finally just printed it in the name 1:08:24.880 --> 1:08:27.400 of the interest of finding the Benina apple bum sample. 1:08:27.960 --> 1:08:30.439 So how much is that now, Ramp three hundred? 1:08:30.720 --> 1:08:33.639 Well you for an original press never seen an original 1:08:33.720 --> 1:08:40.040 pressing of Rent, But uh, Eugene McDaniels, I've never seen 1:08:40.240 --> 1:08:44.280 I've never seen the headless heroes under two hundred bucks original. 1:08:49.080 --> 1:08:53.080 Playing that. I played that ship. 1:08:59.120 --> 1:09:02.160 The first argument Stacey and I ever had over music, 1:09:04.720 --> 1:09:09.599 first Tasty Trees, Stacey and I ever had over music 1:09:10.400 --> 1:09:11.519 was over that record. 1:09:13.200 --> 1:09:17.519 She by the time we got to that song, she 1:09:17.720 --> 1:09:18.479 was like you. 1:09:20.880 --> 1:09:26.560 This is the latest song on McDaniel's debut album. I 1:09:26.640 --> 1:09:31.120 played everything, No, No, No, the sam just before news 1:09:31.280 --> 1:09:31.600 for this. 1:09:31.960 --> 1:09:35.519 For the tip Us it was jagget a dagger. It 1:09:35.560 --> 1:09:37.519 was jagged dagger. You know, we was having a ball. 1:09:37.960 --> 1:09:40.200 That's going on the mic. Weird enough. 1:09:40.640 --> 1:09:43.640 Jack of the Dagger was such a dig at mic. 1:09:43.760 --> 1:09:46.880 Jagger like stealing black music. 1:09:47.720 --> 1:09:50.960 The loop was so dope. One of the one of 1:09:51.000 --> 1:09:54.520 the last dates that we did on when Lauren. 1:09:54.360 --> 1:09:56.439 Released that, did you play that as he walked out? 1:09:56.800 --> 1:10:02.760 No, no, no, no, man, you know what he can't Yes, 1:10:02.880 --> 1:10:05.719 he was scheduled, he was scheduled to be on the show. 1:10:06.560 --> 1:10:07.960 We prepared that song and. 1:10:08.040 --> 1:10:10.679 Then he okay, okay, he didn't do it, but yeah, 1:10:10.680 --> 1:10:15.479 when he comes, dude's dagger like what they gonna do 1:10:15.520 --> 1:10:16.240 the research on it? 1:10:16.760 --> 1:10:17.160 Anyway. 1:10:18.000 --> 1:10:22.240 Last the last date, the last date of this Lauren 1:10:22.320 --> 1:10:25.000 Hill tour when she did that unplugged record Smoking Groups tour. 1:10:25.000 --> 1:10:25.880 I remember that right. 1:10:26.280 --> 1:10:29.800 So it was Thanksgiving night in Seattle and I played 1:10:29.800 --> 1:10:33.640 the Parasite and blasted it because I DJ before she 1:10:33.800 --> 1:10:36.600 came on dog the look on the art it was 1:10:36.680 --> 1:10:37.360 the best. 1:10:39.200 --> 1:10:41.320 I might have to play you. Yes, I gotta Can 1:10:41.360 --> 1:10:42.280 I play a whole song? Please? 1:10:42.600 --> 1:10:43.400 The whole song is like that. 1:10:45.080 --> 1:10:46.640 We can't not right now. 1:10:46.640 --> 1:10:49.080 I mean if you can put a little bit, just 1:10:50.200 --> 1:10:51.799 skim through, skim through certain. 1:10:52.120 --> 1:10:53.760 Yeah, I think it's a good close. We'll close the 1:10:53.800 --> 1:10:57.800 show with it. Okay, we will close the show. That's fair. 1:10:58.439 --> 1:11:00.559 Can we talk over it? And then is the show 1:11:01.000 --> 1:11:03.280 like Mystery Science Theater? 1:11:04.800 --> 1:11:08.000 That is kind of what we do. That's all we do, 1:11:08.520 --> 1:11:08.840 all right? 1:11:09.000 --> 1:11:15.880 So what making this? Making the record the debut? Yeah, 1:11:16.120 --> 1:11:24.599 people's I call it Peter Peter Ptour, Peter making that record. 1:11:25.960 --> 1:11:29.440 What is because this is a group of super producers. 1:11:30.040 --> 1:11:32.080 I mean it's a group of multiple c's, but it's 1:11:32.080 --> 1:11:33.559 also a group of super producers. 1:11:34.600 --> 1:11:40.040 How what is the what is the agreed upon method 1:11:40.200 --> 1:11:42.200 of making joints? 1:11:42.880 --> 1:11:42.920 Like? 1:11:43.160 --> 1:11:45.519 Is it just yo? I got this loop? 1:11:45.800 --> 1:11:46.479 I got this loop. 1:11:46.880 --> 1:11:47.559 I like that loop. 1:11:47.600 --> 1:11:51.400 Okay, let's work on that is it, you know, do 1:11:51.479 --> 1:11:53.280 you just come in with the finished product like I 1:11:53.439 --> 1:11:55.320 like this does a least say, Yo, what do you 1:11:55.360 --> 1:11:55.760 think about this? 1:11:55.840 --> 1:11:56.000 Yeah? 1:11:56.040 --> 1:11:58.800 That joints nice? I'll do that. It's kind of okay 1:11:58.880 --> 1:12:01.000 in the beginning, what it like? What's it like on 1:12:01.120 --> 1:12:01.759 the first album? 1:12:01.920 --> 1:12:06.400 Like in the beginning, Uh, A lot of it was 1:12:06.960 --> 1:12:13.479 demos that I'd done over the prior, I'd say five 1:12:13.640 --> 1:12:14.640 years maybe. 1:12:14.680 --> 1:12:18.720 Okay, I'm calling I'm calling an artible storytime with Q tip. 1:12:18.880 --> 1:12:21.080 All right, I'm just gonna play ten seconds of random 1:12:21.160 --> 1:12:24.160 tribe joints and you tell me, like, what comes to 1:12:24.240 --> 1:12:26.080 mind when you made this? 1:12:26.280 --> 1:12:28.760 Like, well, if you remember any details. 1:12:31.600 --> 1:12:37.120 The read it, read it the page, see what it says, 1:12:37.479 --> 1:12:42.000 read it? I mean running away roy is you know 1:12:42.120 --> 1:12:44.920 it's one of my favorite This. 1:12:45.000 --> 1:12:48.719 Shake catches a lot of slack like I I'll read, 1:12:49.120 --> 1:12:55.880 I'll read you know, like uh uh lists like Ego 1:12:55.960 --> 1:12:59.960 trip list or whatever, where of course this didn't description 1:13:00.120 --> 1:13:05.439 and was of course, so it catches flak as in 1:13:06.200 --> 1:13:07.519 weird debut songs by. 1:13:07.479 --> 1:13:09.880 Groups that were later god doubt. 1:13:10.280 --> 1:13:15.240 But there's nothing wrong with this loop. This is not 1:13:15.320 --> 1:13:18.240 my go to song to spend. But I was never 1:13:18.439 --> 1:13:20.640 mad at this loop or the. 1:13:20.720 --> 1:13:22.760 Place of the ending. It felt like a good ending 1:13:22.840 --> 1:13:23.400 for the album. 1:13:23.720 --> 1:13:23.920 Yeah. 1:13:24.040 --> 1:13:25.800 I used to run that joint and that was actually 1:13:25.840 --> 1:13:34.320 the B side was even funnier. Pubic B side talking 1:13:34.360 --> 1:13:35.679 smack comics. 1:13:35.800 --> 1:13:36.759 It was funny. 1:13:36.920 --> 1:13:38.439 It was like, it's very skipped to my loop. 1:13:38.640 --> 1:13:39.880 No, no, no, you know what it was. 1:13:41.400 --> 1:13:47.280 I had two years earlier. There was a store on Bleika, 1:13:47.320 --> 1:13:51.160 the street where you get all the fucking prints unreleased joints. 1:13:54.200 --> 1:13:56.240 Well not Bob's, but it was another joint. 1:13:57.280 --> 1:13:59.360 It was Generations. 1:14:00.240 --> 1:14:03.960 It was not Unbleaker, but it's off you know where 1:14:04.000 --> 1:14:07.560 all the chest stores. I think it was across the 1:14:07.600 --> 1:14:09.360 street and down the black from Mock Moods. 1:14:09.400 --> 1:14:11.439 I think there's a story where Prince actually walked in 1:14:12.040 --> 1:14:13.360 to that store and. 1:14:13.479 --> 1:14:17.120 Walked out with all this ship. Yeah, that had Yo, 1:14:17.680 --> 1:14:20.799 It's ill because I was in there. I would always 1:14:20.880 --> 1:14:23.280 hit there after school because Karena and I would always 1:14:23.400 --> 1:14:25.360 be in the village and ship and I would always 1:14:25.439 --> 1:14:28.000 go get I was just a huge Prince fan. So 1:14:28.120 --> 1:14:31.919 I had heard movie Star, heard Bob, George, super Califern 1:14:31.920 --> 1:14:34.280 at the front, whatever the fuck you know all of 1:14:34.320 --> 1:14:37.080 that ship. Like, I was just like stuck. I remember 1:14:37.120 --> 1:14:39.600 playing movie Star for Africa and he and we're in 1:14:39.800 --> 1:14:43.200 like eleventh grade and we're like mocking the ship and 1:14:43.360 --> 1:14:47.360 listening to all this unreleased Prince Ship, and this was 1:14:47.520 --> 1:14:49.400 like kind of like one of the. 1:14:51.120 --> 1:14:53.519 Who's you know about George? 1:14:53.960 --> 1:14:57.000 You know what I like doing all that silly ship. 1:14:57.520 --> 1:15:00.640 Underneath it is the BT Express beat, you know what 1:15:00.680 --> 1:15:04.600 I mean. I mean it's it's clearly tuned out. But 1:15:05.560 --> 1:15:11.040 it was also still an overage of disco kind of 1:15:11.200 --> 1:15:13.920 house parties that were still going on. You know, you 1:15:14.040 --> 1:15:17.160 still have Frankie Knuckles, Ip, still had Larry Levan doing 1:15:17.280 --> 1:15:20.840 parties back then, even though their houses had closed, and 1:15:21.040 --> 1:15:24.720 maybe Frankie was doing back and forth from Chicago to 1:15:24.840 --> 1:15:28.840 New York. So body, Body and Soul was being established, 1:15:28.960 --> 1:15:31.320 re established, So it was still a disco thing that 1:15:31.479 --> 1:15:31.880 was happening. 1:15:31.920 --> 1:15:34.720 Have you ever got to see Larry spin Yeah or 1:15:34.800 --> 1:15:35.800 his systems? Yeah? 1:15:36.160 --> 1:15:38.840 Well I saw him at Limelight. 1:15:39.439 --> 1:15:41.040 Okay, did he control the system there? 1:15:41.320 --> 1:15:44.080 I don't think. So this is towards because. 1:15:43.800 --> 1:15:48.400 When you DJ, you have the world's loudest base cabinets ever. 1:15:48.479 --> 1:15:52.759 And I know that he always you You're always aiming 1:15:52.880 --> 1:15:54.000 for a paradise. 1:15:54.880 --> 1:15:56.400 Yeah, I'm trying to go for that, man. 1:15:56.479 --> 1:15:58.000 Yeah, okay, I'm a stickler for that. 1:15:58.520 --> 1:16:02.920 But the first real big system I think I heard 1:16:03.080 --> 1:16:03.280 was in. 1:16:03.360 --> 1:16:06.280 The world what was the last record that you played 1:16:06.400 --> 1:16:07.200 yours in the club? 1:16:07.240 --> 1:16:10.599 And you was like, oh what feeling you play? 1:16:10.680 --> 1:16:10.720 What? 1:16:11.640 --> 1:16:11.840 Yeah? 1:16:12.240 --> 1:16:14.120 Wow, See, now that's weird. 1:16:14.400 --> 1:16:21.320 I have a rule against playing because every time I 1:16:21.400 --> 1:16:22.240 play the roots ship. 1:16:22.240 --> 1:16:23.240 Is the fastest for. 1:16:27.040 --> 1:16:28.479 Yeah, I don't, I don't. 1:16:31.000 --> 1:16:33.719 But no, but I'm saying they got this already. 1:16:33.920 --> 1:16:39.679 It's already established that you're the establishment of that level. 1:16:39.920 --> 1:16:44.120 Like you know, there's at least five tribe songs that 1:16:44.200 --> 1:16:48.360 are the mount rushmore go to songs of a party start. 1:16:48.600 --> 1:16:53.200 So even when you were djaying like it's embarrassing to 1:16:53.320 --> 1:16:55.760 play what's the captain obvious one like scenario, I. 1:16:55.760 --> 1:16:57.280 Don't play none of it obviously. 1:16:57.400 --> 1:17:00.280 So even when you were DJing in let's say nineteen 1:17:00.360 --> 1:17:03.559 ninety three and you put scenario on, knowing the motherfucker's 1:17:03.600 --> 1:17:05.240 gonna go out, they mind like is this still like 1:17:05.280 --> 1:17:05.800 a weird thing? 1:17:06.000 --> 1:17:07.800 Like yeah, I don't, I don't. 1:17:07.840 --> 1:17:10.960 I don't do that. I can't do that. I'll play, 1:17:11.920 --> 1:17:13.320 Oh you'll play some obscure shit. 1:17:13.720 --> 1:17:16.040 I'll play something more if like especially if it's like 1:17:16.080 --> 1:17:19.960 a I have a groog rowing or whatever. Like let's say, okay, 1:17:20.120 --> 1:17:23.040 so what is somewhere like one hundred and five bp 1:17:23.240 --> 1:17:24.000 M or some ship. 1:17:24.040 --> 1:17:27.760 I know what you're gonna say, what, No, I was doing? 1:17:27.880 --> 1:17:28.240 Do it? Do it? 1:17:28.320 --> 1:17:30.320 Do it? I was going to say you you would 1:17:30.439 --> 1:17:39.479 probably player no footprints foot I feel like you would 1:17:39.479 --> 1:17:45.719 play footprints a not to play print club song. But okay, 1:17:45.840 --> 1:17:56.240 you taught me this term part of my French niggaig. 1:17:53.439 --> 1:17:57.920 Nigga drums, nigga drums that he nigga drums, nigga drn. 1:17:59.439 --> 1:18:00.920 I need that dry. 1:18:02.560 --> 1:18:05.280 No, he's just it's just he taught me that term. 1:18:05.640 --> 1:18:09.599 He's just like it's like that's the secret. 1:18:09.760 --> 1:18:13.839 Like the music smooth, but the beat is so cracking 1:18:13.920 --> 1:18:17.320 and hard and just hard like it's it's it's like 1:18:17.520 --> 1:18:20.280 Freddy Fox punching you in the news. 1:18:21.240 --> 1:18:27.160 It's this ship over on top right, while like in 1:18:27.240 --> 1:18:29.439 my head, why was Freddy Fox? Yeah? The hip hop? 1:18:30.120 --> 1:18:35.679 Yeah, like damn it, we're getting a pound from busting rhymes, 1:18:35.840 --> 1:18:40.160 you know, like it's yeah, no, when busted pigs you up, 1:18:40.200 --> 1:18:42.280 it's you gotta hide your. 1:18:42.200 --> 1:18:46.400 Hands like him, him and the Angelo, Him and Angelo 1:18:46.520 --> 1:18:50.599 the like he pulls your finger like a thing. 1:18:50.600 --> 1:18:54.120 But he did is relentless deal do it all night. 1:18:54.080 --> 1:18:57.479 For two hours every since Primo says the same thing 1:18:57.560 --> 1:19:04.200 he has like he had after every two minutes. DM Buster, 1:19:04.320 --> 1:19:05.439 the reason why I get. 1:19:05.400 --> 1:19:08.719 Pounds out because they will pull your joints out of sockets, 1:19:08.960 --> 1:19:09.280 giving you. 1:19:09.280 --> 1:19:12.080 A pounds so hard test your manlihood. 1:19:12.360 --> 1:19:14.400 It's just now, it's just pounds. 1:19:14.479 --> 1:19:14.639 Man. 1:19:14.880 --> 1:19:15.759 It does. 1:19:23.240 --> 1:19:27.240 Somebody Q Tip work with his Diamond D, another legendary 1:19:27.400 --> 1:19:31.519 MC producer. Whereas Diamond D says the best producer on 1:19:31.640 --> 1:19:36.040 the Mic twenty twenty three, we linked in Atlanta and 1:19:36.160 --> 1:19:38.719 got to tell Diamond what he means in the cannon 1:19:38.800 --> 1:19:40.680 of hip hop production, sampling. 1:19:40.400 --> 1:19:41.240 And album Make It. 1:19:44.040 --> 1:19:44.280 Dog. 1:19:44.640 --> 1:19:47.680 The resume is scrown like some of my my my 1:19:47.880 --> 1:19:52.640 favorite producer moments comes from this gentleman years. I mean, 1:19:52.720 --> 1:19:57.599 we all of his records, Suns, Blunts and hip hop Hatred. 1:19:57.920 --> 1:20:00.479 I got to ask you about your your sophomore hatred, 1:20:00.600 --> 1:20:06.080 passionate infidelity like Dome Piece, the Gotham, and now your 1:20:06.120 --> 1:20:10.880 brand new joint the review which is excellent work. You've 1:20:10.880 --> 1:20:15.400 been doing quality, excellent work and sometimes it's easy to 1:20:15.640 --> 1:20:18.560 sort of take for granted. People do excellent work and 1:20:18.600 --> 1:20:21.320 they often get overlooked, and when top five lists and 1:20:21.360 --> 1:20:24.840 top ten lists are named, and you know, sometimes a 1:20:24.880 --> 1:20:30.680 person is so effortless that you tend to forget their contributions. 1:20:30.760 --> 1:20:32.640 But you know, that's what quest Love Supreme is for. 1:20:32.800 --> 1:20:33.240 So that's it. 1:20:33.479 --> 1:20:38.040 Let's welcome the one and only, finally, finally, Diamond. Am 1:20:38.040 --> 1:20:39.400 I allowed to call you Diamond D? Now? 1:20:39.439 --> 1:20:39.760 Of course? 1:20:40.200 --> 1:20:42.759 Okay, number one? Can you please? 1:20:43.960 --> 1:20:44.839 We allowed? 1:20:44.960 --> 1:20:45.000 No? 1:20:45.040 --> 1:20:45.320 No, no no. 1:20:45.400 --> 1:20:45.920 But here's the deal. 1:20:45.960 --> 1:20:49.160 I two versions of the album when it was like 1:20:49.400 --> 1:20:52.000 Diamond stump blumped in here and then there was Diamond. 1:20:52.760 --> 1:20:58.040 Well it was Diamond and psychoch Neurotics, Diamond Diamond psychoch Neurotics. 1:20:58.320 --> 1:21:01.280 So what was the situation with your name? It was 1:21:01.320 --> 1:21:03.840 there another Diamond D like back in the day that I. 1:21:03.840 --> 1:21:04.280 Don't know what. 1:21:05.360 --> 1:21:08.599 I'm not sure, but I think it might have been 1:21:09.040 --> 1:21:13.519 originally somebody that was signed to Weston Records of New York. 1:21:13.680 --> 1:21:16.160 Yeaheah. They did Tony Gardener at Heartbeat, like. 1:21:16.439 --> 1:21:18.720 You know, hot Shot was on that table, but I 1:21:18.760 --> 1:21:19.880 think somebody had the name. 1:21:20.000 --> 1:21:25.640 Yeah, okay, so yeah, well you know this is my 1:21:25.720 --> 1:21:28.120 favorite nerd out moment on Quest Love Supreme. So I'm 1:21:28.120 --> 1:21:32.040 gonna start from the beginning. What was your first musical memory? 1:21:32.840 --> 1:21:34.760 Time out? Let me go to og style. Where were 1:21:34.800 --> 1:21:35.160 you born? 1:21:36.200 --> 1:21:38.439 I was born in Manhattan, New York hospital. 1:21:39.120 --> 1:21:42.880 Wow, I never heard any Yeah, get to get to 1:21:42.920 --> 1:21:46.400 it all right, New York all right. Was raised in 1:21:46.439 --> 1:21:51.280 the Bronx. Okay, your first musical memory sitting. 1:21:51.000 --> 1:21:53.240 In my uncle's room and him just playing music. 1:21:53.760 --> 1:21:57.680 He had a large vinyl collection, So I was just 1:21:57.720 --> 1:21:59.800 sitting in his room, like eight nine years old, just 1:22:00.120 --> 1:22:01.000 didn't play records. 1:22:01.600 --> 1:22:02.360 What was he playing? 1:22:03.560 --> 1:22:07.920 Everything? Mostly mostly funk, jazz, soul, you know what I mean? 1:22:08.240 --> 1:22:10.840 Shouts out to Gary was he was? 1:22:10.920 --> 1:22:14.240 He very meriticulous with the collection, Like I've had an 1:22:14.479 --> 1:22:15.720 older cousin that was that way. 1:22:15.800 --> 1:22:18.320 But you couldn't touch the wax and. 1:22:18.479 --> 1:22:22.040 You know, yeah, definitely fresh, yeah, definitely. You know, you 1:22:22.080 --> 1:22:23.720 know you have to hold a record like this with 1:22:23.840 --> 1:22:28.360 both hands. He's very meticulous about his vinyls. And then 1:22:28.439 --> 1:22:30.080 you know, when I came along with the DJ and 1:22:30.160 --> 1:22:31.360 you know, we had to put our hands on the. 1:22:31.400 --> 1:22:33.759 Record, I was gonna say, how okay. 1:22:33.880 --> 1:22:38.519 So I've sometimes I try and explain to people the trouble, 1:22:39.360 --> 1:22:41.120 you know, I mean Teezy now that hip hop is 1:22:41.280 --> 1:22:44.519 and it's about to be in its fiftieth year for 1:22:44.680 --> 1:22:47.320 us also to take for you know, for granted its 1:22:47.439 --> 1:22:50.240 development and how you know far it's come. But you know, 1:22:50.400 --> 1:22:52.280 I try to explain to people that a lot of 1:22:52.320 --> 1:22:57.840 those pioneers, you know, Flash, got so much kickback or 1:22:57.920 --> 1:23:01.920 pushback if you will, you know, because the general idea 1:23:02.040 --> 1:23:05.040 is that you're going to destroy the needle or destroy 1:23:05.160 --> 1:23:08.200 the belt driver or the turntable. 1:23:07.760 --> 1:23:11.599 Like putting your fingers on the grooves. Those are big 1:23:11.720 --> 1:23:12.200 no nose. 1:23:12.720 --> 1:23:16.160 Yeah, I got punishment trying to uh, you know, like 1:23:16.280 --> 1:23:18.720 my first introduction in scratching, of course was you know, 1:23:18.920 --> 1:23:23.000 grand Master Flash on the wheels of steel and you know, 1:23:23.160 --> 1:23:25.200 trying to practice on my dad's you know, while he's 1:23:25.240 --> 1:23:27.599 not looking and see what happens and you get in trouble. 1:23:28.040 --> 1:23:30.240 But yeah, like how do you discover what that is 1:23:30.840 --> 1:23:33.439 in the bronx and where you like privy to any 1:23:33.479 --> 1:23:35.000 of those like block parties or anything. 1:23:35.000 --> 1:23:37.560 Oh yeah, they were like right outside, explain it. 1:23:37.680 --> 1:23:37.880 Take it. 1:23:38.840 --> 1:23:43.519 Growing up in Farvest projects me Fat Joe lor f Ness, 1:23:43.560 --> 1:23:46.879 we would all see DJs like you're in the same buildings, 1:23:46.920 --> 1:23:50.920 still the same same complex. But we would see guy 1:23:51.040 --> 1:23:56.320 like Grant with the Theadore mainly Theatre, Suntime Flash. At 1:23:56.320 --> 1:23:58.840 that point they were already making records, but we were 1:23:58.880 --> 1:24:01.240 able to just go downstairs and just see these jams 1:24:01.320 --> 1:24:02.280 going on in the parks. 1:24:02.960 --> 1:24:05.000 What was it? What was it like seeing? 1:24:05.040 --> 1:24:08.479 Because I'm assuming that you're too young for Harlem World 1:24:08.760 --> 1:24:12.200 or right, so I'm assuming that you're eleven or twelve 1:24:12.240 --> 1:24:15.439 year olday seem it? So what how does the trickle 1:24:15.479 --> 1:24:18.200 effect happen to you? Like where tapes the thing instantly 1:24:18.720 --> 1:24:21.760 or how do you get the information just. 1:24:21.840 --> 1:24:24.080 Watching it firsthand? You know, you've seen people out there, 1:24:24.120 --> 1:24:26.439 you know, with boxes, you know, recording or whatever. But 1:24:26.600 --> 1:24:30.800 we you know, I saw the firsthand, you know, when 1:24:30.840 --> 1:24:36.400 Flash made Grand Master Flash in the Wheels Steals, I 1:24:36.520 --> 1:24:38.840 had already seen him do some of that, you know, 1:24:38.920 --> 1:24:41.680 outside in the parks, cutting up good times, you know, 1:24:42.479 --> 1:24:47.080 shit like that. But just being close in proximity to 1:24:47.200 --> 1:24:50.559 it is what drew me and in fact quest when 1:24:50.600 --> 1:24:53.479 I was a little kid, whenever I saw the DJ 1:24:53.720 --> 1:24:57.760 reach for the damn right, I'm somebody album cover by 1:24:57.840 --> 1:25:00.000 the JB's you know, I would lose my mind because 1:25:00.080 --> 1:25:02.560 I knew he was gonna play blow your Head, and 1:25:02.720 --> 1:25:05.400 that sticked. Like even now as an adult, that always 1:25:05.400 --> 1:25:08.160 sticks out to me. A lot of times people ask me, 1:25:08.320 --> 1:25:10.160 you know, what's the first song to draw you into 1:25:10.240 --> 1:25:10.639 hip hop? 1:25:12.520 --> 1:25:13.559 I mentioned blow your Head. 1:25:13.800 --> 1:25:16.360 It's not a rap record, I know, it's just a 1:25:16.439 --> 1:25:19.400 break bead that was real popular, and as little kids 1:25:19.439 --> 1:25:21.439 we would lose our fucking mom when that shit came on. 1:25:24.439 --> 1:25:25.919 The hip hop legends continue. 1:25:26.920 --> 1:25:28.519 Eric Sherman and I had a one on one a 1:25:28.600 --> 1:25:31.280 few months ago in late twenty twenty four, and I 1:25:31.400 --> 1:25:34.439 told the EPMD co founder what a lot of fans say, 1:25:34.680 --> 1:25:37.360 even though he's from New York, he's kind of a 1:25:37.439 --> 1:25:41.280 G funk pioneer and creating a sound that was later. 1:25:41.200 --> 1:25:44.360 Popularized out of La Let's Listen. 1:25:47.400 --> 1:25:52.439 It wasn't often, especially back in eighty eight, where you 1:25:52.520 --> 1:25:59.120 would see a summit meeting of frus from opposite sides 1:25:59.200 --> 1:26:03.200 of the coast or you know, wherever they were from, 1:26:03.840 --> 1:26:08.000 like normally birds of a feather flocked together. And seeing 1:26:08.560 --> 1:26:14.320 Nwa in the Big Paypack video, it was like such 1:26:14.360 --> 1:26:18.760 a big deal for us, like yo, EPMD knows Nwa, 1:26:19.000 --> 1:26:21.719 like craz That's how me and Reek were like watching 1:26:21.800 --> 1:26:25.200 your TV reps like you are a g Funk pioneer 1:26:25.320 --> 1:26:28.479 that never got the credit, and you are also a 1:26:28.600 --> 1:26:32.479 neo soul pioneer that never got the credit. But do 1:26:32.640 --> 1:26:37.760 you think that because of the sort of the thick 1:26:38.040 --> 1:26:42.759 texture of your production for those like first two EPM 1:26:42.840 --> 1:26:44.160 D records where like the. 1:26:44.320 --> 1:26:45.519 Zap collaps, we like. 1:26:47.320 --> 1:26:49.720 Like that spoke to the West Coast more than any 1:26:50.560 --> 1:26:53.360 more than Public Enemy could have because it's touring. 1:26:54.439 --> 1:26:57.160 Don't forget this, it's touring, you know, So so you 1:26:57.160 --> 1:26:59.559 know that was a la was one of my biggest 1:26:59.600 --> 1:27:02.040 markets because the way they thought me. And when you 1:27:02.400 --> 1:27:04.760 hear Snoop telling the story, Snoop said, he drove to 1:27:04.800 --> 1:27:08.320 Britwood looking for me in Parish, right, because they don't 1:27:08.320 --> 1:27:11.280 forget this in Britwood in California. So he's so he's 1:27:11.360 --> 1:27:13.760 in Britwood thinking that we're from the suburbs. 1:27:14.439 --> 1:27:17.760 Oh okay, okay. So he told the story a. 1:27:17.760 --> 1:27:18.400 Couple of times. 1:27:18.479 --> 1:27:21.360 But anyway, being on tour, but me and Cube was tight, 1:27:21.600 --> 1:27:23.880 like like I had seven roses Zukie when I went 1:27:23.920 --> 1:27:25.120 to LAQ picked me up. 1:27:25.320 --> 1:27:27.280 He had seven roses Zukie, you know. 1:27:28.000 --> 1:27:31.240 And again at the end of the day, me and 1:27:31.360 --> 1:27:34.960 Dre was two people that was on both sides stample 1:27:35.040 --> 1:27:35.599 in Parliament. 1:27:35.880 --> 1:27:36.559 Don't forget them. 1:27:37.520 --> 1:27:39.800 He was doing it first in eighty seven before me 1:27:39.880 --> 1:27:43.200 and Parish even came out. It wasn't like, okay, people 1:27:43.400 --> 1:27:46.519 credit me. Like if you talk to dub C, he 1:27:46.640 --> 1:27:50.400 has say, yo, I gotta get the the West Coast. 1:27:50.720 --> 1:27:55.080 Hat to Eric sermon, because they showed us how to 1:27:55.200 --> 1:27:59.280 rap on this music. So while we was playing Roger, 1:27:59.720 --> 1:28:04.320 they rhyming on Roja. While we was playing Riding High, 1:28:04.600 --> 1:28:07.920 they were rapping on Riding High. So all the stuff 1:28:08.080 --> 1:28:10.920 that they hearing on the way that Me and Paris 1:28:11.080 --> 1:28:14.920 did the Funk records were different than what they was 1:28:14.960 --> 1:28:16.680 doing it, so it kind of gave them a blueprint. 1:28:16.960 --> 1:28:22.120 If you hear people talk, they say Dre enhanced the 1:28:22.280 --> 1:28:25.640 stuff I did by playing live. So if you hear 1:28:26.000 --> 1:28:29.280 woman to Woman fan but then be Bett, I just 1:28:29.439 --> 1:28:34.120 sampled it right. He did California Love and we played them. 1:28:34.160 --> 1:28:38.400 Now it's bigger so and then once epm D broke up, 1:28:38.920 --> 1:28:40.800 he was able to go to Roger too. 1:28:41.800 --> 1:28:43.719 You know, things of that nature. 1:28:44.320 --> 1:28:48.120 How are you developing your production skills and your rhyming 1:28:48.240 --> 1:28:53.639 skills in eighty seven in time for like your debut record, 1:28:53.880 --> 1:28:57.160 because you know, like how long did the epm D 1:28:57.560 --> 1:29:01.160 exist before you guys actually got strictly business. 1:29:01.040 --> 1:29:05.679 To the public one year see the ones that's fast. 1:29:06.040 --> 1:29:08.560 The one thing that you that we didn't know. We 1:29:08.640 --> 1:29:11.439 didn't know what the producer was. We thought every record 1:29:11.560 --> 1:29:13.280 you heard was done by that person. 1:29:14.160 --> 1:29:15.200 God, it's not crazy. 1:29:15.320 --> 1:29:17.960 So we're doing what we think we're supposed to be doing. 1:29:18.040 --> 1:29:20.479 We didn't know about we was producers. We never heard 1:29:20.560 --> 1:29:23.560 that word. We just wanted to make a record. So 1:29:23.760 --> 1:29:26.559 we took the break beach that we had that parents 1:29:26.640 --> 1:29:29.400 had out of DJ, took records from each other houses, 1:29:29.439 --> 1:29:32.080 the whole nine, and that's how we formulated epm D. 1:29:32.520 --> 1:29:34.160 You know, we made what was in front of us, 1:29:34.560 --> 1:29:35.760 not knowing what we were doing. 1:29:35.960 --> 1:29:36.400 Don't forget. 1:29:36.439 --> 1:29:37.080 We didn't know how to. 1:29:37.120 --> 1:29:37.799 Make a chorus. 1:29:38.160 --> 1:29:41.840 So Will Starklov called the awesome two All your two 1:29:42.000 --> 1:29:43.600 came and said, let me get that seven minutes to 1:29:43.680 --> 1:29:46.439 funk record because we just had the record looping. So 1:29:46.600 --> 1:29:49.320 when it's my thing, we said, it's my thing, there's 1:29:49.400 --> 1:29:53.720 nothing there, so Teddy ted said, give me, and he said, 1:29:53.720 --> 1:29:56.320 give me that record, so he found that for tip 1:29:56.360 --> 1:29:58.360 boom for tim boom, and then that fam f F 1:29:58.800 --> 1:30:02.720 bet So caught me how to format a chorus. I 1:30:02.720 --> 1:30:05.839 would never even known how to due a chorus or format. 1:30:05.960 --> 1:30:08.680 It was caught to me by the author too. 1:30:09.520 --> 1:30:11.600 So there was a version of It's My Thing that 1:30:11.680 --> 1:30:13.240 didn't have no version of this. 1:30:13.320 --> 1:30:16.880 Reportant record came out. The label was telling us that 1:30:17.000 --> 1:30:19.960 we needed to have a chorus and to know the 1:30:20.080 --> 1:30:21.080 chorus get ready to come in? 1:30:21.760 --> 1:30:22.479 Got it okay? 1:30:22.600 --> 1:30:25.759 Because all we had was it It's My Thing louder. 1:30:25.960 --> 1:30:27.920 All we had was that we didn't have the drum 1:30:28.040 --> 1:30:30.679 roll and the the horn to be like the boy 1:30:30.760 --> 1:30:33.000 can drop down and come back to the raps. We 1:30:33.120 --> 1:30:35.840 end up had to split it up so there's a 1:30:35.920 --> 1:30:38.720 chorus and then there's a part you riy on. And 1:30:38.840 --> 1:30:41.880 once we learned that, I went nuts and I started 1:30:41.920 --> 1:30:47.040 doing get down, get down. Time keeps on slipping. So 1:30:47.200 --> 1:30:49.720 now I was just knowing what to do now, And 1:30:49.800 --> 1:30:51.720 then when saying came out, I was like, to what 1:30:51.840 --> 1:30:52.400 you're saying. 1:30:53.880 --> 1:30:54.640 Now, we're in it. 1:30:54.760 --> 1:30:56.840 Now you're not a format of song. 1:30:56.960 --> 1:30:57.320 I get it. 1:31:00.360 --> 1:31:02.960 Curtis Blow was on qols in late twenty nineteen. 1:31:03.600 --> 1:31:06.519 He's a rap pioneer, with The Breaks being the first 1:31:06.640 --> 1:31:11.599 gold certified rap record and this clip, which celebrates Curtis. 1:31:11.880 --> 1:31:14.759 He also makes a point to honor the late Larry Smith, 1:31:15.360 --> 1:31:18.479 one of hip hop's first and most important producers, who 1:31:18.560 --> 1:31:19.719 sadly passed away. 1:31:19.479 --> 1:31:20.280 In twenty fourteen. 1:31:23.120 --> 1:31:25.720 I know, since you were the first to ever tour 1:31:25.840 --> 1:31:28.360 like this internationally, there had to be like some mistakes. 1:31:28.400 --> 1:31:29.760 There had to be like some moments where you and 1:31:30.040 --> 1:31:31.720 you and Russell were like, okay, so we're not going 1:31:31.800 --> 1:31:34.080 to do this like that again. Like there were just 1:31:34.160 --> 1:31:35.960 so many new things to you, guys, Like did you 1:31:36.000 --> 1:31:37.479 even know about writers? Did you know? 1:31:37.680 --> 1:31:40.360 Like what didn't you know that you learned in your first. 1:31:40.680 --> 1:31:41.720 How many lost pass for? 1:31:42.160 --> 1:31:44.320 Yes, I had to learn it all. 1:31:44.600 --> 1:31:46.320 I learned it all on Where's your Traveling? 1:31:46.640 --> 1:31:49.280 I was like that guy. Oh it was incredible. 1:31:49.640 --> 1:31:49.920 I was. 1:31:50.240 --> 1:31:56.600 I was the most sought after live act because it 1:31:56.760 --> 1:32:00.639 was just me and my DJ, just two people, two people, 1:32:01.000 --> 1:32:04.680 two turntables in the microphone. Really, yes, so not the 1:32:04.760 --> 1:32:08.400 first to start the choerage right right, So you're easy 1:32:08.479 --> 1:32:14.599 to work with. But then Russell in eighty one, Oh, boy. Yeah, 1:32:16.400 --> 1:32:19.519 so here he comes with Larry Smith. Larry Smith was 1:32:19.560 --> 1:32:22.800 playing bass, play bass on the breaks and Christmas rap 1:32:22.880 --> 1:32:24.280 and so. 1:32:24.400 --> 1:32:28.120 Larry Smith produced Orange Crust was the band for all 1:32:28.160 --> 1:32:29.680 those for Christmas rap. 1:32:29.840 --> 1:32:32.240 No no, no, no, no no, not Orange Crushed. That 1:32:32.439 --> 1:32:37.960 came after Russell took forty thousand dollars of my money 1:32:39.120 --> 1:32:41.719 and bought all his banning and he gave it to Larry. 1:32:41.840 --> 1:32:44.800 Larry bought the band equipment and they said, all right, 1:32:44.840 --> 1:32:48.320 you're going out with the band. I'm like, what how 1:32:48.400 --> 1:32:51.599 could you do that? I didn't okay this? He said, wait, hey, 1:32:54.080 --> 1:32:54.879 I'm the manager. 1:32:57.240 --> 1:32:57.639 Manager. 1:32:57.840 --> 1:33:01.680 You built Larry Larry uh Smith's career. 1:33:02.320 --> 1:33:04.320 Well budget that. 1:33:06.280 --> 1:33:06.599 Larry. 1:33:06.680 --> 1:33:08.360 I got to give props to him because he was 1:33:09.960 --> 1:33:12.880 excellent musician, incredible producer. 1:33:13.720 --> 1:33:13.880 You know. 1:33:13.960 --> 1:33:16.080 I remember many of the nights we sat up and 1:33:16.200 --> 1:33:20.720 talked about, you know, my sound and trying to get 1:33:20.720 --> 1:33:23.040 a sound that was in between James Brown and Chic 1:33:24.280 --> 1:33:27.720 and Larry was the man. He was definitely the man. 1:33:27.800 --> 1:33:31.080 I love him so who worked on like Christmas rapping 1:33:31.160 --> 1:33:32.200 and rapping blow. 1:33:32.080 --> 1:33:34.599 And yeah that was Larry. Larry was on the bass, 1:33:35.439 --> 1:33:40.320 but you had John Trope. I was on guitar, And 1:33:40.400 --> 1:33:45.040 we had Jimmy Braylile who actually went on to become 1:33:45.120 --> 1:33:51.080 a len drum a Lin drum programmer, and uh, he 1:33:51.280 --> 1:33:54.519 was on drums. And you know, so during that time, 1:33:54.680 --> 1:33:57.560 you know, we recorded in the studio like the seventies 1:33:57.600 --> 1:34:00.320 in the sixties, it was a live band, you know 1:34:00.360 --> 1:34:02.479 what I mean. And and and we had to rehearse 1:34:02.600 --> 1:34:05.680 and you know, let's play it one more time and 1:34:06.160 --> 1:34:08.120 record it and hopefully it would come out. 1:34:08.200 --> 1:34:11.400 Okay, I'm sorry, And we do White Guy in the 1:34:11.479 --> 1:34:15.600 Corner As a question, John Tropia. 1:34:15.760 --> 1:34:18.200 Yeah, the guitarist. Yes, so was he the guitar. 1:34:18.320 --> 1:34:21.439 He's a to me, he's the famous jazz guitarist. 1:34:21.880 --> 1:34:23.759 Right, and he's on the breaks. 1:34:24.720 --> 1:34:25.760 Wow, that's his work. 1:34:26.080 --> 1:34:28.920 That's his work on the break. 1:34:29.120 --> 1:34:37.520 On run DMC stuff that was not well Edie did Martinez, 1:34:38.600 --> 1:34:39.880 Eddie Martinez. 1:34:39.600 --> 1:34:43.799 And wow, no, I need to process. I'm not schooling 1:34:43.920 --> 1:34:47.080 on anything. I don't know too much about about him. 1:34:47.080 --> 1:34:48.160 I just have a few records. 1:34:48.200 --> 1:34:48.320 You know. 1:34:49.320 --> 1:34:50.559 He don't get blown away easily. 1:34:50.640 --> 1:34:54.040 But it is Curtis. That's just really yeah, weird, unexpected, 1:34:54.320 --> 1:34:55.040 unexpected name. 1:34:55.120 --> 1:34:58.040 Yeah, yeah, but he's he's a legend, definitely a legend, 1:34:58.080 --> 1:35:03.400 and you know, I seeing him in the studio because 1:35:03.400 --> 1:35:06.200 of my producer, JB. Moore was also a guitar player, 1:35:06.280 --> 1:35:09.519 and he couldn't do the guitars right the way we 1:35:09.680 --> 1:35:13.240 wanted it and the way he wanted it actually, and 1:35:13.400 --> 1:35:21.439 so when John came in and played it perfect, perfect 1:35:21.520 --> 1:35:25.080 rhythm and it was just immaculate, you know. 1:35:25.479 --> 1:35:26.200 Drives him. 1:35:26.920 --> 1:35:29.920 So for your first album, like, whose idea was it 1:35:30.000 --> 1:35:31.920 to do? Like taking care of business. 1:35:32.680 --> 1:35:34.840 To the girl? What's the other one? 1:35:34.880 --> 1:35:36.280 That the slow one that's like. 1:35:36.960 --> 1:35:38.280 All I want. 1:35:40.160 --> 1:35:41.320 Fir. 1:35:42.560 --> 1:35:44.840 People don't even credit that as the first love ballot. 1:35:45.040 --> 1:35:47.719 So it's like for you, you were making a format 1:35:47.800 --> 1:35:50.720 that was palatable. The radio was like Frankie Crocker on 1:35:50.760 --> 1:35:53.479 your mind, like okay, the label saying we need something 1:35:53.520 --> 1:35:54.000 that you know. 1:35:54.760 --> 1:35:57.120 Right, Well, it was all by design, of course. 1:35:57.200 --> 1:35:57.360 You know. 1:35:57.479 --> 1:36:01.080 We wanted to, you know, have a fusion and with 1:36:01.240 --> 1:36:03.880 other forms of music because they was so brand new, 1:36:04.000 --> 1:36:07.880 this thing hip hop and rap, you know, so why 1:36:07.960 --> 1:36:10.640 not rap over a rock and roll song? Why not 1:36:10.840 --> 1:36:13.479 have a reggae rap? Or I was the first to 1:36:13.520 --> 1:36:17.080 do a country in Western rap, that Way Out West song. 1:36:17.240 --> 1:36:20.320 You know, you know, we we we just tried to 1:36:20.800 --> 1:36:23.280 be different and try to give something new. 1:36:26.360 --> 1:36:28.920 In retrospect, though, do you see how like free you 1:36:29.080 --> 1:36:30.400 were in that moment, Because I feel like a lot 1:36:30.400 --> 1:36:33.200 of EMC's today out the gate couldn't just say I'm 1:36:33.400 --> 1:36:34.799 producing that in this different genre. 1:36:34.880 --> 1:36:36.800 I'm like, they won't they want to be allowed to. 1:36:37.200 --> 1:36:39.920 Well here's the thing. I always wanted to be a singer, 1:36:40.880 --> 1:36:46.479 and I remember singing those singing songs that every album 1:36:46.560 --> 1:36:50.479 I put on, the singing But listen, folks, it took 1:36:50.600 --> 1:36:52.840 me a couple of weeks to do those. 1:36:57.560 --> 1:37:01.800 In Philadelphia Party Time, very big record, yes, which of 1:37:01.880 --> 1:37:07.760 course you know well that Tracy Lee like try to 1:37:07.800 --> 1:37:11.920 bring try to bring that back. So that was the 1:37:12.000 --> 1:37:14.920 first time I ever heard Full Force on record. So 1:37:15.120 --> 1:37:17.280 how did you how did you hook up with those 1:37:17.360 --> 1:37:19.320 guys as far as like did they produce that record? 1:37:19.360 --> 1:37:21.680 Were they just the band or like what was how 1:37:21.720 --> 1:37:22.360 did you guys. 1:37:23.120 --> 1:37:25.880 They became producers after that because we sat in the 1:37:25.880 --> 1:37:29.400 studio and talked about you know, uh JB. Moore and 1:37:29.520 --> 1:37:31.960 Robert Ford and what they were doing on my stuff 1:37:32.040 --> 1:37:34.360 and how they wanted to do the same thing but 1:37:34.520 --> 1:37:40.000 differently more funkier or more creative. Uh so they were incredible. 1:37:40.080 --> 1:37:44.040 I met them through JB. Moore and Robert Ford and 1:37:45.080 --> 1:37:49.080 very very, very talented musicians and singers, and it was 1:37:49.200 --> 1:37:51.000 incredible just to be a part of that. But the 1:37:51.120 --> 1:37:54.200 Go Go song, talk about it, trouble for Wow Tub 1:37:55.000 --> 1:37:58.879 that was EU. So here it is on my birthday 1:37:58.960 --> 1:38:01.840 I turned twenty one years old. I had the number 1:38:01.880 --> 1:38:05.439 one record in the country, and so I'm going down 1:38:05.520 --> 1:38:09.160 to play the Capital Center down in d C. So 1:38:09.400 --> 1:38:11.960 I had my band, remember the Orange Crushed band. I 1:38:11.960 --> 1:38:14.880 ain't got ten bollies and oh man, we got like 1:38:15.120 --> 1:38:16.439 eight eight nine pieces. 1:38:16.560 --> 1:38:16.720 Right. 1:38:17.240 --> 1:38:20.880 We rolled down to the Capital Center and I'm headlining 1:38:21.439 --> 1:38:25.040 this concert and they have all these local bands there 1:38:25.880 --> 1:38:28.120 and I didn't know what they were, you know what 1:38:28.240 --> 1:38:34.000 it was. So I'm walking the spot. I'm here first time, 1:38:34.920 --> 1:38:38.200 that first time I'm here in Go Go you were you. 1:38:41.400 --> 1:38:43.960 The whole crowd is going crazy. I'm saying, oh, I'm 1:38:43.960 --> 1:38:44.920 about to tear this. 1:38:47.280 --> 1:38:47.439 Right. 1:38:48.439 --> 1:38:50.439 So they were going crazy and it was a band 1:38:50.479 --> 1:38:55.360 called Trouble Funk. Then another band came on, EU Freeze. Right, 1:38:55.479 --> 1:39:03.840 they went on the same thing, but now and the 1:39:03.920 --> 1:39:07.240 crowd is going crazy again, even more crazy. So I'm like, wow, 1:39:07.400 --> 1:39:08.360 Chuck Brown, was it? 1:39:08.520 --> 1:39:09.240 Oh my god? 1:39:09.960 --> 1:39:12.640 Right the Godfather he comes out and tears up the 1:39:12.760 --> 1:39:15.800 spot too. So it's my turn. So I locked it, 1:39:18.960 --> 1:39:23.560 let me music up. I throw on Christmas Wrapping and 1:39:23.600 --> 1:39:27.080 we're playing Christmas Wrapping. The band is tight, clean and everything, 1:39:27.479 --> 1:39:29.560 but the crowd is like this looking at us, like 1:39:34.960 --> 1:39:37.840 I'm like, oh my gosh, we better get to the breaks, 1:39:37.880 --> 1:39:40.439 and you know, quick on this one here right, So 1:39:40.600 --> 1:39:42.960 I'm speeding through the set and then we throw on 1:39:43.040 --> 1:39:46.120 the brakes, clap your hands over here, right right, and 1:39:46.240 --> 1:39:51.360 then like still right, number one record in the country. 1:39:51.479 --> 1:39:54.640 And so that night I got my butt tore up 1:39:55.200 --> 1:39:58.320 three or four different times. And for me, it was 1:39:58.439 --> 1:40:01.080 like my mom's always said they you can't beat them, 1:40:01.160 --> 1:40:01.479 join them. 1:40:01.800 --> 1:40:02.240 Hell yeah. 1:40:02.720 --> 1:40:03.920 So I got all that numbers. 1:40:05.400 --> 1:40:06.400 Nice. Nice. 1:40:06.760 --> 1:40:09.759 Next year, I called my boys sugar Bear. 1:40:10.680 --> 1:40:12.519 And the Sugar Band didn't playing on parties. 1:40:12.840 --> 1:40:17.840 We did a party time, damn. Okay, yeah, okay, And 1:40:18.000 --> 1:40:21.200 it's just wonderful to have them in the studio just 1:40:21.840 --> 1:40:22.760 doing that thing live. 1:40:22.880 --> 1:40:25.400 And how many pieces in the studio in that moment. 1:40:25.400 --> 1:40:27.679 Oh yeah, it was like seven eight pieces. 1:40:28.520 --> 1:40:28.720 Yeah. 1:40:29.080 --> 1:40:30.680 And so you were the first for that too. I'm 1:40:30.720 --> 1:40:33.680 guessing the first to do a go go collapse. 1:40:33.439 --> 1:40:37.200 Well, no, because Flash of them did. They did a 1:40:37.320 --> 1:40:41.479 live version. Well, they actually signed Trouble Funk two Sugar Records. 1:40:41.960 --> 1:40:45.360 The first live Go Go that I've. 1:40:45.240 --> 1:40:47.960 Heard was Trouble Funk Live on Sugar Hills. So the 1:40:48.120 --> 1:40:49.560 Robinson's got there early on that. 1:40:49.960 --> 1:40:55.680 And then actually actually the first sample loop right was 1:40:55.840 --> 1:40:58.280 on the song If I Ruled the World, and and 1:40:59.120 --> 1:41:02.919 the sample was Trouble Funk. You know that pump pump, pump. 1:41:04.680 --> 1:41:04.920 Push. 1:41:05.640 --> 1:41:13.920 I took the percussion part and laid it under If 1:41:13.960 --> 1:41:14.679 I Wrote the World. 1:41:19.520 --> 1:41:23.720 Okay, okay, how did that feel for you to have 1:41:23.880 --> 1:41:27.439 that song come back and for people to learn that 1:41:27.640 --> 1:41:30.640 you're you know, you're the origin of of of that 1:41:30.720 --> 1:41:32.920 particular song, because that's all means so much too. 1:41:33.360 --> 1:41:35.080 I like your harmonies, fans, and. 1:41:36.600 --> 1:41:38.000 You got that harmonies. 1:41:37.840 --> 1:41:42.880 Okay right there? 1:41:43.479 --> 1:41:48.320 You know it was you and Allison Williams actually right, 1:41:48.479 --> 1:41:49.559 that's Alison singing. 1:41:49.400 --> 1:41:56.920 Yes, yes, yes, that ters and Audrey Wheeler yes. 1:41:58.320 --> 1:42:00.800 Yes, yes, and so harmonies were better. 1:42:04.120 --> 1:42:04.320 It was. 1:42:04.920 --> 1:42:07.439 It was awesome. It's it's the ultimate and flattery to 1:42:07.800 --> 1:42:10.160 hear your song on the radio that you recorded some 1:42:10.320 --> 1:42:13.639 time ago. I remember when Sony sent me the tape. 1:42:13.680 --> 1:42:17.439 They sent me a cassette tape, and it was awesome. 1:42:17.479 --> 1:42:19.559 I sat there and played the tape in my car 1:42:20.479 --> 1:42:23.880 for about three hours, kept rewinding and rewinding it. 1:42:24.600 --> 1:42:24.760 You know. 1:42:24.960 --> 1:42:27.479 It was like, Oh my god, that's gotta be Laurence Hill. 1:42:28.040 --> 1:42:29.320 That's gotta be Lauryn Hill. 1:42:29.920 --> 1:42:30.080 You know. 1:42:30.320 --> 1:42:32.800 So I called them back. I said, look, Sony, you 1:42:32.880 --> 1:42:35.519 guys got a big, major, major, monster hit on you. 1:42:35.600 --> 1:42:38.320 You better put all your promotion in this because this 1:42:38.560 --> 1:42:41.799 is going platinum. It went, It went triple platinum. 1:42:42.560 --> 1:42:44.360 Now did you think that were too close or. 1:42:45.080 --> 1:42:48.559 The same thing? But I didn't hear it. I didn't 1:42:48.600 --> 1:42:52.200 hear that song. Like like I sat and you know, 1:42:52.360 --> 1:42:54.360 listened to If I Rule the World because I feel like. 1:42:54.360 --> 1:42:57.960 The checks are the same, like that Songlain the World 1:42:58.080 --> 1:42:59.840 right about next to close it. 1:43:00.520 --> 1:43:03.080 It was huge yet one song of the year. I 1:43:03.160 --> 1:43:05.439 think in nineties something Jesus Christ. 1:43:05.479 --> 1:43:06.519 I forgot about next. 1:43:07.720 --> 1:43:13.840 Christ, that song like the song that you get annoyed 1:43:13.840 --> 1:43:17.080 because it just played all the time that the dance. 1:43:16.920 --> 1:43:19.120 For you know, as a DJ, I need that song, 1:43:19.200 --> 1:43:19.720 so I get it. 1:43:22.560 --> 1:43:26.320 What better place to close than with the legendary Jimmy 1:43:26.439 --> 1:43:29.519 jam We spoke for like seven hours, and really it's 1:43:30.280 --> 1:43:34.360 all flowers. But here's the one area that I especially like. 1:43:37.520 --> 1:43:42.000 This is serious of life goals here. Yeah, let's just 1:43:43.479 --> 1:43:46.920 we're starting from the where were you born, sir? 1:43:47.680 --> 1:43:48.800 Minneapolis, Minnesota. 1:43:49.120 --> 1:43:53.600 Okay, what part of what part of Minneapolis? 1:43:54.120 --> 1:43:57.160 I grew up South Minneapolis, So you know, I can 1:43:57.200 --> 1:43:59.760 say like forty first in Portland Avenue, which doesn't mean 1:43:59.760 --> 1:44:01.800 a lot to anybody, but you know, if you think 1:44:01.840 --> 1:44:04.519 of downtown, it's like, you know, First Street, Second Street, 1:44:05.160 --> 1:44:08.160 you know, First Avenue, so on and so forth. I 1:44:08.280 --> 1:44:10.519 lived forty one blocks south of downtown. 1:44:10.600 --> 1:44:12.640 I feel like when any black person is from the 1:44:12.760 --> 1:44:16.320 south side of town, south side of east side, that 1:44:16.439 --> 1:44:18.400 means something going on. 1:44:18.840 --> 1:44:22.120 Like what part of what was the town part of 1:44:22.160 --> 1:44:24.000 town to not go to? In Minneapolis? 1:44:24.400 --> 1:44:28.760 Uh well, okay, if you were black, the northeast was 1:44:28.800 --> 1:44:30.920 where to not go to. It was called actually the 1:44:31.040 --> 1:44:35.240 northeast is what we called it. Where the white people lived. Yeah. 1:44:35.600 --> 1:44:39.040 Yeah, every town has the white people. 1:44:39.520 --> 1:44:42.439 The white people didn't didn't necessarily want us to be there, 1:44:42.840 --> 1:44:45.400 you know, because white people live every I mean, let's 1:44:45.439 --> 1:44:50.120 face it, back, growing up I think the state population 1:44:50.360 --> 1:44:53.320 was something like three percent black, and maybe it was 1:44:53.960 --> 1:44:56.400 eight percent black in Minneapolis or something like that. So 1:44:56.479 --> 1:45:01.600 pretty much white people were everywhere. But certainly, uh, you know, 1:45:02.320 --> 1:45:04.880 everybody was very tolerant, I guess, I would say, and 1:45:05.000 --> 1:45:08.880 it was very progressive town. But as you can tell 1:45:08.880 --> 1:45:10.160 from the music, it came out of there. I think 1:45:10.240 --> 1:45:12.080 that's had a lot to do with it. But no, 1:45:12.240 --> 1:45:14.439 I mean, really, the north side probably is where the 1:45:14.479 --> 1:45:17.880 folks were. You know, I was one of the only 1:45:18.000 --> 1:45:21.240 South side guy. I mean in Prince obviously because we 1:45:21.320 --> 1:45:23.320 went to school together and stuff. But on the north 1:45:23.360 --> 1:45:26.600 side of town you had you know, Morris Day, Jellybean, 1:45:27.200 --> 1:45:30.519 Terry Lewis, you know, and you had the community center 1:45:30.600 --> 1:45:32.720 called the Way, which everybody used to rehearse at and 1:45:33.400 --> 1:45:35.160 that kind of thing. So it was a lot more 1:45:35.240 --> 1:45:37.559 happening on the north side of town, I would say 1:45:37.560 --> 1:45:38.479 that on the south side. 1:45:38.840 --> 1:45:43.520 So in your formative years, how many of your contemporaries 1:45:43.560 --> 1:45:46.160 and peers that you were professional with would you see 1:45:46.200 --> 1:45:47.160 on a regular basis? 1:45:48.600 --> 1:45:50.639 Everybody? Man, it was a it was a small community, 1:45:50.720 --> 1:45:53.680 it was it was. It was a lot like I 1:45:53.720 --> 1:45:56.880 always say that Purple Rain, the movie was a kind 1:45:56.920 --> 1:45:59.160 of a It was fiction, but it was it told 1:45:59.160 --> 1:46:01.640 a lot of truth. And that was there was like 1:46:01.760 --> 1:46:04.040 a couple of clubs you could play at, and there 1:46:04.120 --> 1:46:07.479 was more bands than the clubs could hold. So it 1:46:07.600 --> 1:46:10.639 made for a very competitive situation where if your band 1:46:10.760 --> 1:46:13.760 wasn't firing, you just wouldn't be playing in the club. 1:46:14.400 --> 1:46:16.080 And so that's the way we grew up. So there 1:46:16.160 --> 1:46:18.080 was like the Elks Lounge. There was a club called 1:46:18.080 --> 1:46:23.439 the Nakarima. Nakaima was actually American spelled backwards. And you know, 1:46:23.720 --> 1:46:25.800 the Cozy Bar was another place. There was a place 1:46:25.840 --> 1:46:28.960 called the Flame, and you know, so between you know, 1:46:29.320 --> 1:46:30.960 back in that day, you had you know, my band, 1:46:31.000 --> 1:46:33.360 I had a band called Mind and Matter, Terry had 1:46:33.439 --> 1:46:35.439 Flight Time. We were together and then we were apart. 1:46:35.520 --> 1:46:37.360 We were you know, we were going back and forth 1:46:37.400 --> 1:46:42.360 a lot. And then Prince had Grand Central. Morris had 1:46:42.400 --> 1:46:45.439 a band called the Enterprise Band of Pleasure at one point, 1:46:46.160 --> 1:46:47.639 you know, so on and so forth. So what happened 1:46:47.760 --> 1:46:49.880 was there was all these bands, but there's only a 1:46:49.920 --> 1:46:52.559 couple of places to play. But all of those guys, 1:46:52.720 --> 1:46:56.679 and particularly people like and and really the best, probably 1:46:56.720 --> 1:46:59.960 the baddest dude up there was Sonny Thompson. 1:47:02.080 --> 1:47:05.320 Everyone speaks of Sonny Thompson like he's God. Yeah, Like, 1:47:05.479 --> 1:47:08.559 what is it about, what is the legend of Sonny Thompson. 1:47:09.800 --> 1:47:13.160 Well, Sonny Thompson. I remember back when I first met Terry, 1:47:13.640 --> 1:47:15.759 and I remember we put our little band together and stuff, 1:47:15.760 --> 1:47:17.799 and then they used to do these big outdoor festivals 1:47:17.840 --> 1:47:19.920 at a place called the Philliswheetlely, which is a big 1:47:19.920 --> 1:47:23.240 community center, and they used to do these outdoor concerts 1:47:23.760 --> 1:47:25.680 and I remember seeing they had a band, actually the 1:47:25.720 --> 1:47:29.040 original band that was called the Family. Sonny Thompson was 1:47:29.080 --> 1:47:31.880 in that band. But I'd never seen a brother play 1:47:31.920 --> 1:47:32.640 the guitar like that. 1:47:32.800 --> 1:47:33.920 I mean, he just was like. 1:47:35.640 --> 1:47:38.800 He was like legendary. He was like the dude. And 1:47:39.439 --> 1:47:42.080 on top of it, he had the attitude like if 1:47:42.120 --> 1:47:43.840 you didn't like him or you didn't like the way 1:47:43.880 --> 1:47:45.320 he was playing, he was gonna come down to kick 1:47:45.360 --> 1:47:47.759 your ass. Right, So he'd played the gig and stuff, 1:47:47.760 --> 1:47:49.760 and then afterwards if he'd like, look at it you 1:47:50.000 --> 1:47:52.920 and you'd say to him, oh man, he killed it, Sonny. Man, 1:47:53.120 --> 1:47:57.000 that was amazing, because you better say that. But the 1:47:57.080 --> 1:47:59.320 good news was he always what he was. He was amazing, 1:47:59.360 --> 1:48:01.280 and he was a dude. Did everybody just kind of 1:48:01.280 --> 1:48:03.519 stopped and stared and went, damn. 1:48:03.880 --> 1:48:05.240 What was his style of playing? 1:48:06.240 --> 1:48:08.920 He was a great rhythm player. He played with a 1:48:08.960 --> 1:48:09.719 lot of aggression. 1:48:09.760 --> 1:48:09.880 You know. 1:48:10.000 --> 1:48:12.760 The thing I always said about about Prince and the 1:48:12.800 --> 1:48:16.080 way he played is I've never seen anybody attack instruments 1:48:16.160 --> 1:48:19.640 the way Prince did. Like he literally attacked the instruments 1:48:21.040 --> 1:48:23.760 louder or just toned well, you know he would. I 1:48:23.800 --> 1:48:27.080 mean I always say, like, for instance, Terry, you know, 1:48:27.280 --> 1:48:29.960 Terry's a great bass player, There's no doubt about it. 1:48:30.200 --> 1:48:33.360 But you know how we always use the analogy like 1:48:33.439 --> 1:48:37.120 in basketball, people that make you better. Prince was that person, right, 1:48:37.240 --> 1:48:41.719 So Terry would be playing a bass part and Prince 1:48:41.760 --> 1:48:44.599 would take the bass from Terry and go, no, play 1:48:44.640 --> 1:48:46.920 it like this, and then he'd play it, and then 1:48:46.960 --> 1:48:49.120 he'd had Terry the bass back, and Terry would look 1:48:49.160 --> 1:48:51.200 at the bass like he'd never seen it before. You know, 1:48:51.520 --> 1:48:54.920 It's like damn, you know so that but that was 1:48:55.000 --> 1:48:57.479 the way Sonny was, and I think Prince got a 1:48:57.600 --> 1:49:01.720 lot of that from Sonny. Attack of the instruments, And 1:49:01.760 --> 1:49:03.320 it's the same with the keyboards. We used to break 1:49:03.400 --> 1:49:06.120 keyboards all the time because it wasn't like you would 1:49:06.200 --> 1:49:09.400 just hit the keyboard politely. It was like we were 1:49:09.439 --> 1:49:12.160 doing all kind of swoops and wow wow on all 1:49:12.200 --> 1:49:14.720 that kind of stuff, Like we would break keyboards. I 1:49:14.800 --> 1:49:16.040 mean that kind of stuff. I mean that was the 1:49:16.080 --> 1:49:19.680 way he wanted you to play. And so I mean 1:49:19.760 --> 1:49:21.760 that that kind of attitude, to me was the thing 1:49:21.840 --> 1:49:24.880 that you know, set him apart, along with a whole 1:49:24.880 --> 1:49:26.920 lot of other things, but it really set Prince apart 1:49:27.120 --> 1:49:27.439 for sure. 1:49:28.000 --> 1:49:31.080 What were the what was a gold club to play 1:49:31.160 --> 1:49:35.720 in Minneapolis at the time, Like, was First Avenue a 1:49:35.920 --> 1:49:37.480 dream that was unattainable? 1:49:38.080 --> 1:49:40.920 No, Actually, here's an interesting thing. Yeah, Now First Avenue 1:49:41.760 --> 1:49:44.679 was actually the first place that actually allowed like black 1:49:44.800 --> 1:49:45.960 bands to play. 1:49:46.920 --> 1:49:49.640 So there was a quiet segregation or oh it was 1:49:49.840 --> 1:49:52.760 not in your fleece, Oh it was, I. 1:49:52.800 --> 1:49:54.519 Guess, I guess you could say it was quiet. I mean, 1:49:54.560 --> 1:49:56.040 if you were a band and you were trying to 1:49:56.080 --> 1:50:01.160 play somewhere, you knew there were that were just unattainable, 1:50:01.200 --> 1:50:04.360 you just weren't going to play that club. And I 1:50:04.479 --> 1:50:07.320 thank god to this day that that happened because what 1:50:07.479 --> 1:50:11.559 it did as history has always shown with black folks 1:50:12.640 --> 1:50:17.560 is from adversity comes all good things. You know, you 1:50:17.640 --> 1:50:19.719 look at what you don't have, and then you figure 1:50:19.760 --> 1:50:22.000 out that you can't go the easy route that everybody 1:50:22.040 --> 1:50:23.599 else is going, and then you figure out a way 1:50:23.640 --> 1:50:25.760 to go get it done. So what we used to 1:50:25.840 --> 1:50:29.840 do back in the day, we knew we couldn't play 1:50:30.360 --> 1:50:32.080 I can't remember even the names of the clubs, but 1:50:32.120 --> 1:50:34.000 there was all these very fancy white clubs and they 1:50:34.040 --> 1:50:37.720 all had white bands, but they were all playing R 1:50:37.720 --> 1:50:41.400 and B music, which was ironic. We knew we couldn't 1:50:41.439 --> 1:50:43.639 play those clubs. So what we would do is, for instance, 1:50:43.680 --> 1:50:48.720 there was a hotel downtown called the Dykeman Hotel. It 1:50:48.880 --> 1:50:51.679 was a hotel that was probably about a year away from, 1:50:52.520 --> 1:50:54.479 you know, being torn down. I mean, it was just 1:50:54.680 --> 1:50:57.280 nobody stayed there. Rooms were ratty, the whole thing. But 1:50:57.400 --> 1:51:00.519 what they had was a big ballroom. What we would 1:51:00.520 --> 1:51:03.400 do is we would take you know, we'd go to 1:51:03.479 --> 1:51:05.599 the owner of the hotel and we'd say, hey, can 1:51:05.680 --> 1:51:10.240 we rent the ballroom out. We'll give you the liquor, 1:51:10.320 --> 1:51:12.960 whatever the liquor sales are, you keep and we'll take 1:51:13.000 --> 1:51:14.600 the door. We'll charge you know, three bucks at the 1:51:14.640 --> 1:51:18.400 door or whatever. And so what it did is it 1:51:18.520 --> 1:51:21.640 forced us to become entrepreneurs because it wasn't like we 1:51:21.840 --> 1:51:24.519 just had the talent we could go play. It was like, okay, 1:51:24.560 --> 1:51:26.080 we got the talent, Now we got to figure out 1:51:26.120 --> 1:51:28.800 how we're going to go play. So we would do that. 1:51:28.920 --> 1:51:30.759 Now we now back in the day, there's no Twitter 1:51:30.840 --> 1:51:33.639 and no social media, so it was go to institut prints. 1:51:33.880 --> 1:51:35.439 That was the place you go. You print up a 1:51:35.439 --> 1:51:37.240 bunch of flyers and then you put them on people's 1:51:37.280 --> 1:51:40.719 cars and you'd say, you know, ladies get in free 1:51:41.439 --> 1:51:43.479 two for one drink. So you'd say whatever the heck 1:51:43.560 --> 1:51:45.840 you needed to say to get them to get them down. 1:51:47.120 --> 1:51:49.040 And all of a sudden, you get on Saturday night, 1:51:49.479 --> 1:51:52.040 and all of a sudden, you'd get fifteen hundred people 1:51:52.800 --> 1:51:58.120 in this ballroom. Meanwhile, the white clubs are sitting empty. 1:51:59.120 --> 1:52:03.200 So now they're going, wait, where's everybody at tonight? And 1:52:03.280 --> 1:52:05.320 they're like, well, they're all going to see the band 1:52:05.360 --> 1:52:09.400 you wouldn't let play at your club. And so what 1:52:09.680 --> 1:52:12.040 happened after that was there began to be a little 1:52:12.040 --> 1:52:16.560 bit of a thing where people begin to recognize that 1:52:16.680 --> 1:52:18.760 maybe there's a talent, or maybe we should let these 1:52:18.960 --> 1:52:21.280 folks in, you know, because these guys are talent and 1:52:21.280 --> 1:52:24.680 they're obviously drawing, right. But the first person to really 1:52:24.720 --> 1:52:28.320 act upon it was Steve McClellan at First Avenue who said, 1:52:28.920 --> 1:52:31.679 we'll book you guys in what was called Seventh Street Entry, 1:52:31.840 --> 1:52:34.120 which is like the little club, right, so if you 1:52:34.320 --> 1:52:36.040 were cool there, if you could get it going there, 1:52:36.720 --> 1:52:39.400 then we'll move you to the main room. But he 1:52:39.560 --> 1:52:41.439 was the one that really gave us the shot, and 1:52:41.560 --> 1:52:43.519 he gave you know, back then, it wasn't just by 1:52:43.560 --> 1:52:45.080 the way, It wasn't just black bands, but it was 1:52:45.160 --> 1:52:48.280 like new wave bands you think about, like the Replacements 1:52:48.320 --> 1:52:50.519 and the Suburbs and all of those bands. Those bands 1:52:50.560 --> 1:52:53.080 all started, those white bands all started in that Seventh 1:52:53.080 --> 1:52:53.639 Street Entry. 1:52:53.720 --> 1:52:55.880 We even mix it with those guys at all, Like 1:52:55.920 --> 1:52:57.559 would you see Replacements and m. 1:52:58.640 --> 1:53:00.639 We didn't mix it all, not I mean just because 1:53:00.640 --> 1:53:02.000 we didn't. It wasn't it. We didn't like them. We 1:53:02.080 --> 1:53:04.639 were aware of them, and I think they were aware 1:53:04.640 --> 1:53:07.120 of us. But we know we never mixed together at all. 1:53:07.200 --> 1:53:09.439 It was just kind of the same dudes from the 1:53:09.439 --> 1:53:11.880 neighborhood that we grew up with it was all of 1:53:11.920 --> 1:53:13.080 those same guys all together. 1:53:13.760 --> 1:53:16.479 So kind of jumping ahead a little bit, did you 1:53:16.560 --> 1:53:21.880 have goals to make it out of Minnesota or or 1:53:22.040 --> 1:53:24.920 was it just like, Okay, we'll just be a local 1:53:25.000 --> 1:53:29.000 band here and maybe well no, I mean I'll get 1:53:29.040 --> 1:53:29.360 a job. 1:53:29.800 --> 1:53:33.200 Like are your parents supportive of this? Or well? 1:53:33.439 --> 1:53:36.639 Okay, so two really good questions. 1:53:37.920 --> 1:53:38.679 So my parents. 1:53:38.720 --> 1:53:43.479 First of all, my dad played in a band and 1:53:44.200 --> 1:53:46.479 was always a professional musician. Used to take me to 1:53:47.600 --> 1:53:50.280 rehearsals and stuff back when I was, you know, six 1:53:50.400 --> 1:53:53.639 seven years old, and I you know, at that point, 1:53:53.680 --> 1:53:56.360 I had the music bug totally, so I got to 1:53:56.400 --> 1:53:57.600 see it. I used to used to get to go 1:53:57.640 --> 1:54:00.880 to the studio and the whole thing. But he was 1:54:01.000 --> 1:54:04.920 always he never made it really where he wanted to. 1:54:05.040 --> 1:54:07.080 He was always kind of that guy on the cusp 1:54:07.280 --> 1:54:07.800 of making it. 1:54:07.880 --> 1:54:08.040 You know. 1:54:08.160 --> 1:54:09.880 He'd get on a few back in the day, there 1:54:09.880 --> 1:54:12.560 were kind of regional records that were hits, and my 1:54:12.640 --> 1:54:15.120 dad would play on those records and then they'd ask 1:54:15.240 --> 1:54:18.040 him to go tour. But because at that point of 1:54:18.120 --> 1:54:20.599 his life he had me and he had gotten married, 1:54:22.120 --> 1:54:25.040 my mom always used to kind of frown upon, you know, like, well, no, 1:54:25.160 --> 1:54:28.280 you can't. You got responsibilities, you got family, and you 1:54:28.400 --> 1:54:30.320 got you know, you can't just run off and go 1:54:30.439 --> 1:54:33.200 on tour and that kind of stuff. And that really 1:54:33.280 --> 1:54:37.400 affected what happened with me because when I got to 1:54:37.480 --> 1:54:39.440 the point where I really wanted to do music, my 1:54:39.560 --> 1:54:42.880 mom was one hundred percent behind me because she realized 1:54:42.960 --> 1:54:45.720 that my dad never had a chance to do what 1:54:45.840 --> 1:54:47.640 he the way he wanted to do it. So she 1:54:47.760 --> 1:54:49.760 really kind of stepped out of my way and was 1:54:50.080 --> 1:54:55.120 very supportive of me. So that was huge for me. 1:54:55.240 --> 1:54:57.480 By the way, and they because they separated and so 1:54:57.840 --> 1:55:00.720 or they got divorced, and so I basically stayed with 1:55:00.840 --> 1:55:03.560 my mom. So she said, you know whatever, as long 1:55:03.600 --> 1:55:05.400 as I see you doing music, you can do whatever 1:55:05.440 --> 1:55:07.120 the heck you want to do. But you know, as 1:55:07.160 --> 1:55:09.200 long as you was serious about it and that kind 1:55:09.200 --> 1:55:10.720 of thing. So that was that was important. 1:55:11.040 --> 1:55:14.360 What was the industry in Minnesota? 1:55:14.720 --> 1:55:18.520 Like if cars were Detroit and black families were there, 1:55:18.800 --> 1:55:22.400 middle class and buying instruments and stuff, and the same 1:55:22.480 --> 1:55:26.880 for factories in Indiana and the Midwest, what was the 1:55:27.080 --> 1:55:31.120 industry in Minnesota that kept was that an industry town 1:55:31.200 --> 1:55:31.440 at all? 1:55:32.760 --> 1:55:34.960 Well, the things I remember growing up were first of 1:55:34.960 --> 1:55:37.840 all Grain and Flower. I remember Gold Metal Flower was 1:55:37.880 --> 1:55:40.200 a big company back in the day. Pillsbury was up there, 1:55:40.240 --> 1:55:41.640 big company general. 1:55:42.640 --> 1:55:46.760 Yeah, I forgot I now realize. 1:55:46.800 --> 1:55:49.760 He said that the ghetto boys thought he had came, 1:55:49.840 --> 1:55:51.040 but it was Gold Metal Flower. 1:55:52.800 --> 1:55:56.000 Now I get it. It was Flower. Thank you for 1:55:56.120 --> 1:56:07.080 serving that mystery I was made because of his accent. 1:56:07.280 --> 1:56:12.520 You know, I thought so myster. 1:56:14.360 --> 1:56:15.480 I didn't know there was a mystery. 1:56:18.080 --> 1:56:19.800 No, we had it, but I just didn't. 1:56:19.840 --> 1:56:21.720 You didn't put it together that that's what he was saying. 1:56:23.280 --> 1:56:25.200 But all of those were up there, and obviously three 1:56:25.400 --> 1:56:28.480 M was up there to Honeywell. There were some some 1:56:28.560 --> 1:56:32.600 pretty big companies up there, for sure, but just to 1:56:33.000 --> 1:56:35.200 and just to wrap the other thing we were saying. 1:56:35.560 --> 1:56:37.600 The whole idea, yes, was to get out of town. 1:56:38.680 --> 1:56:41.560 That was our focus because we knew we couldn't sit 1:56:41.640 --> 1:56:45.320 around and depend on playing in the clubs that weren't 1:56:45.320 --> 1:56:47.240 gonna let us play, And we knew that we couldn't 1:56:48.240 --> 1:56:50.720 make it playing in a club circuit where there's two 1:56:50.840 --> 1:56:53.240 or three clubs and there's eight bands or whatever it is, 1:56:53.440 --> 1:56:55.360 like that was not going to happen. So we set 1:56:55.400 --> 1:56:59.040 our sites always on making it nationally. That was our 1:56:59.080 --> 1:57:03.920 whole thing. When Prince made it out, that showed us 1:57:04.560 --> 1:57:07.720 that it can happen. And it also because he was 1:57:07.800 --> 1:57:11.200 so unique in what he did, that then brought everybody 1:57:11.640 --> 1:57:14.280 started looking at Minneapolis like, Okay, what else is up there? 1:57:14.360 --> 1:57:17.200 Because that that happens with all talents, happened with Seattle, happens, 1:57:17.280 --> 1:57:18.840 you know, that's just the thing that happens. It's like 1:57:18.920 --> 1:57:21.000 something great comes out and it's like, oh, what what 1:57:21.120 --> 1:57:23.120 else is there? What else is there? So we were 1:57:23.120 --> 1:57:25.760 definitely the beneficiaries of that. And there's a lot of 1:57:25.880 --> 1:57:29.880 great I will say, a lot of talented white musicians 1:57:29.960 --> 1:57:32.600 playing R and B music that never made it out 1:57:32.600 --> 1:57:35.240 of Minneapolis. Some of them made it out because Jesse 1:57:35.360 --> 1:57:37.920 took a couple folks with him and when he did 1:57:38.000 --> 1:57:44.160 his band Jesse Johnson Review the Peter the Peterson's. How 1:57:44.160 --> 1:57:45.280 many Peterson's were there? 1:57:46.000 --> 1:57:46.440 A lot? 1:57:46.800 --> 1:57:50.760 Yeah, that was the That was the musical family up there. 1:57:50.800 --> 1:57:53.920 I mean, just so much talent, you know, but there 1:57:53.920 --> 1:57:56.960 were but there were other ones too, And I'm just 1:57:57.040 --> 1:57:59.040 kind of I'm blanking our names and stuff, But there 1:57:59.120 --> 1:58:01.640 was a lot of talent. But because they didn't. They 1:58:01.680 --> 1:58:04.040 were very comfortable, so they had no reason to try 1:58:04.080 --> 1:58:06.600 to think outside of getting out of Minneapolis or anything 1:58:06.680 --> 1:58:09.080 like that. Like, we were so a lot of great 1:58:09.160 --> 1:58:11.320 talent up there that people didn't know about until, like 1:58:11.400 --> 1:58:13.360 I say, until that time when you know, Jesse picked 1:58:13.440 --> 1:58:16.280 up a few people and I'm trying to think Margaret Cox, 1:58:16.320 --> 1:58:19.080 who was actually Tomorrow Margie. But yeah, but Margaret Cox 1:58:19.200 --> 1:58:23.480 was insanely talented, you know, so as a singer. So yeah, 1:58:23.520 --> 1:58:24.000 people like that. 1:58:24.720 --> 1:58:29.200 So when can I assume that Funky Town was the 1:58:29.320 --> 1:58:34.320 first at least indication that an escape could be made 1:58:34.440 --> 1:58:35.440 or something could happen. 1:58:35.600 --> 1:58:38.200 Was that just like a fluke went off in your eyes? 1:58:38.720 --> 1:58:43.200 Well for us, you know, Prince was the example that 1:58:43.280 --> 1:58:45.360 you could make it because see Prince was like three 1:58:45.440 --> 1:58:49.440 years before Funky I forgot yeah towns seven but no, 1:58:49.560 --> 1:58:51.800 but but but but Funky Town was eighties and that 1:58:52.040 --> 1:58:54.680 was you know, at the height of the disco craze 1:58:54.880 --> 1:58:57.080 and when it was and actually when disco was being 1:58:57.120 --> 1:58:58.720 played on the radio, not only in the clubs, but 1:58:58.840 --> 1:59:01.440 actually the format because I'm remember we had a radio 1:59:01.480 --> 1:59:03.600 station up there that went from a rock format to 1:59:03.680 --> 1:59:08.360 a disco format, which was very controversial, but disco was 1:59:08.440 --> 1:59:09.440 hot at that point in time. 1:59:09.480 --> 1:59:14.120 But we thought, what did you grow up listening on? Like, 1:59:14.240 --> 1:59:15.160 what were you listening to? 1:59:15.960 --> 1:59:16.160 Grow? 1:59:16.400 --> 1:59:19.400 For me, yeah, well there was nothing but pop radio 1:59:19.520 --> 1:59:22.440 up there. I mean, I grew up as a kid. 1:59:23.320 --> 1:59:27.720 My earliest memories were always you know, I always loved 1:59:27.720 --> 1:59:32.320 the harmony groups. I loved Seals and Cross America America. Yeah, 1:59:32.680 --> 1:59:36.440 you know that kind of stuff. Bred that was. I mean, 1:59:36.520 --> 1:59:38.400 to this day, that's the way I stacked my harmonies 1:59:38.480 --> 1:59:41.120 because of the way they sang those songs. Back then, 1:59:41.640 --> 1:59:45.240 a little bit later in life, I liked, like, around 1:59:45.280 --> 1:59:47.040 the time I met Terry, I was really into Chicago 1:59:47.200 --> 1:59:50.000 that was. That was my favorite band ever, you know, 1:59:50.480 --> 1:59:53.120 and me and Terry both loved them. And then Terry 1:59:53.200 --> 1:59:54.840 then turned me on to when I met him, he 1:59:55.000 --> 1:59:57.800 turned me on to earth Wind and Fired, Tower of Power, 1:59:57.960 --> 2:00:01.800 New Birth I met in seventy two. Okay, yeah, so 2:00:01.960 --> 2:00:03.760 we're just so we're talking last days in time, earth 2:00:03.800 --> 2:00:06.520 Wind and Fire and Music in my mind Stevie Wonder. 2:00:07.080 --> 2:00:08.720 You know, these were the albums and Terry turned me 2:00:08.800 --> 2:00:09.320 on to those. 2:00:10.440 --> 2:00:13.480 Black radio. You didn't have no black radio experience at 2:00:13.480 --> 2:00:15.240 the age of ten, twelve. 2:00:15.360 --> 2:00:18.360 There wasn't a black radio experience for me. When I 2:00:18.400 --> 2:00:21.400 got into high school, I was really into or junior 2:00:21.480 --> 2:00:23.640 high and into high school, I was really into Gambling, 2:00:23.680 --> 2:00:27.120 huff and everything coming out of Philadelphia. Blue Magic was 2:00:27.200 --> 2:00:30.160 my favorite all time group. I know everybody was into stylistics, 2:00:30.200 --> 2:00:31.360 but Blue Magic was my group. 2:00:31.400 --> 2:00:33.880 But how could you hear it or see it? 2:00:33.960 --> 2:00:34.000 Was? 2:00:35.280 --> 2:00:38.480 Oh yeah, Soul Train definitely was on and you definitely 2:00:38.480 --> 2:00:41.520 would hear it on Soul Train. But I I remember 2:00:41.840 --> 2:00:44.920 I had a friend of mine whose dad was an 2:00:44.960 --> 2:00:46.760 executive of music Land, which is one of the big 2:00:47.000 --> 2:00:48.880 retail stores back in the day. So he used to 2:00:48.920 --> 2:00:52.760 get every single record that came out. And my thing 2:00:52.920 --> 2:00:54.640 was I was always a big liner note reader and 2:00:54.680 --> 2:00:55.680 a big label reader. 2:00:56.080 --> 2:01:00.520 So my thing was we all collector if I's A 2:01:00.640 --> 2:01:03.160 and Ville, yes, So. 2:01:03.320 --> 2:01:06.640 My whole thing was. I remember there were records that 2:01:06.680 --> 2:01:10.280 would come out and I would particularly during the Motown 2:01:10.320 --> 2:01:13.600 era because I really I really loved the Motown records, 2:01:13.680 --> 2:01:15.680 all of that stuff, the Holland Dozer, Holland, like I 2:01:15.920 --> 2:01:18.920 remember I did. I remember looking at a Supremes album 2:01:19.440 --> 2:01:21.480 at a like a family reunion or something back in 2:01:21.640 --> 2:01:24.040 sixty two or something or sixty. So I was like 2:01:24.040 --> 2:01:25.760 three or four years old, and I remember that Holland 2:01:25.800 --> 2:01:28.520 Dozer Holland it was. The album was called The Supreme 2:01:28.600 --> 2:01:32.080 sing Holland Dozer Holland Gold Record, and I the gold record, right, 2:01:32.280 --> 2:01:35.560 I had no idea what that meant. Well, I kept going, 2:01:35.680 --> 2:01:37.880 what does this mean? What do you mean they singing 2:01:38.120 --> 2:01:40.960 Holland Dozer Holland, And somebody explained to me, no, they 2:01:41.120 --> 2:01:43.520 wrote the songs. The girls are the singers, but somebody 2:01:43.560 --> 2:01:46.080 wrote the songs. And something went off in my head 2:01:46.120 --> 2:01:49.440 at that point. That always made me look who wrote it, 2:01:49.800 --> 2:01:52.880 who produced it? And so I remember like all the 2:01:52.960 --> 2:01:55.480 Motown records would be the first ones I'd always go to. 2:01:55.720 --> 2:01:57.720 And I remember like staring at the first time I 2:01:57.760 --> 2:02:02.240 heard I Want You Back and five and you know 2:02:02.360 --> 2:02:05.440 Dinah Ross and Dinah Ross presents the Jackson five, and 2:02:05.520 --> 2:02:07.880 I thought, oh, wow, that's cool. And I looked down 2:02:07.920 --> 2:02:09.720 the record. I'm like, well, I don't see Donna Ross's 2:02:09.800 --> 2:02:14.240 name anywhere on here. Right, there's some dudes called the Corporation. 2:02:15.080 --> 2:02:16.960 I got to find out who the corporation is, you know. 2:02:17.080 --> 2:02:21.360 So that was always my my thing. And and and 2:02:21.520 --> 2:02:23.280 I knew that because what I learned was there were 2:02:23.320 --> 2:02:26.680 certain there were groups I like, but it was all 2:02:26.720 --> 2:02:27.920 about who produced them. 2:02:28.200 --> 2:02:28.560 Like it was. 2:02:28.720 --> 2:02:30.920 It was like, you know, like Eddie Kendricks could come 2:02:30.960 --> 2:02:34.480 out with a song and I would be like, Yeah, 2:02:34.560 --> 2:02:36.600 that's okay. And then you come out with a song, 2:02:36.640 --> 2:02:38.480 I go, oh, I love that song. Okay, who did 2:02:38.520 --> 2:02:42.160 that song? Okay, Leonard Casting and you know, Frank Wilson 2:02:42.280 --> 2:02:45.800 and okay. And then I'd hear another song that had 2:02:45.920 --> 2:02:47.800 nothing to do with Eddie Kendricks, but I'd go, oh, 2:02:47.840 --> 2:02:50.120 I like that track. Who did that? And it'd be 2:02:50.200 --> 2:02:52.520 the same dudes, right, And and that's when I got 2:02:52.640 --> 2:02:56.320 That's when I started going, Okay, that's that's my thing. 2:02:56.360 --> 2:02:59.320 And so for me, that's what always excited me. And 2:02:59.400 --> 2:03:01.680 that's what you know, ultimately made me want to become 2:03:02.120 --> 2:03:03.360 a songwriter and a producer. 2:03:04.760 --> 2:03:05.080 All right. 2:03:05.120 --> 2:03:07.240 That was Jimmy Jim And I think you all for 2:03:07.320 --> 2:03:10.520 tuning in, and please give people their flowers while they 2:03:10.560 --> 2:03:12.720 can still smell them, all right. 2:03:15.320 --> 2:03:21.640 Quest Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio. For more 2:03:21.680 --> 2:03:26.160 podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or 2:03:26.200 --> 2:03:27.840 wherever you listen to your favorite shows,