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Speaker 1: Pushkin pop music's long standing party animal, Kesha is now

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Speaker 1: dead set on slowing down and on speaking up. Since

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Speaker 1: debuting on the hook of flow Writers Mega Hit Right

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Speaker 1: Round in two thousand and nine, Kesha's released five albums,

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Speaker 1: two of which debuted at number one. Until very recently,

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Speaker 1: she was involved in a decade long court case with

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Speaker 1: her former producer and labelhead. Somehow, despite that bitter legal

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Speaker 1: battle and a public struggle with an eating disorder, Kesha's

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Speaker 1: remained steadfast in sharing her art with her fans, who

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Speaker 1: she affectionately refers to as her animals. On today's episode,

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Speaker 1: I talked to Kesha about how working with Rick Rubin

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Speaker 1: on her new album Gag Order provided the safe space

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Speaker 1: she's longed for when making music. She also talks about

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Speaker 1: how she channels Dolly Parton, Iggy Pop and Beyonce when

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Speaker 1: she's in promotion mode, and how early on her career

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Speaker 1: she lived in a castle with roommate to Vendra Banhard.

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Speaker 1: This is broken record liner notes for the digital Age.

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Speaker 1: I'm justin Ritchman. Here's my interview with Kesha. Look at you.

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Speaker 2: There you are, Oh my god, Here I am there.

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Speaker 1: You are here, I am I'm nobody.

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Speaker 2: I am also nobody.

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Speaker 1: Well that's not true based on what I've what I

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Speaker 1: heard from this album.

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Speaker 2: I was just listening to the episode with Andrea last night.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's so good. It's a

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Speaker 1: great episode.

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Speaker 2: It made me feel so good, like it made me

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Speaker 2: feel good about myself, I guess, which is the beauty

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Speaker 2: of sharing intimate parts of your mind.

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Speaker 1: Made you feel like seen, you know, yeah.

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Speaker 2: And also not alone, which I feel like is the

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Speaker 2: goal in making art.

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Speaker 1: Was there any particular part of it that resonated.

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Speaker 2: Like the entire thing? Just his ability to be so

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Speaker 2: vulnerable about and like really transparent about where he was

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Speaker 2: at when they recorded. That was helpful, especially the part

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Speaker 2: about imposter syndrome and feeling like sometimes just when you

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Speaker 2: have this hole inside of you, you focus on the

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Speaker 2: goal of making something great and then when you make it,

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Speaker 2: that hole is going to be filled. And then when

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Speaker 2: you do make it, and like, by the grace of God,

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Speaker 2: and I'm so grateful and so at the risk of

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Speaker 2: sounding like an asshole, because I am grateful and I

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Speaker 2: don't want to ever sound like I'm not. But when

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Speaker 2: you achieve success, thinking that's going to fix you, and

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Speaker 2: it doesn't, then you're kind of left at the top

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Speaker 2: of a mountain like alone, lonely, still broken.

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Speaker 1: But accomplished.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, accomplished, accomplished alone and like you've exercised all the

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Speaker 2: resources you thought were going to fix you. So I

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Speaker 2: just relate to that, like, not every day, but when

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Speaker 2: I have those moments, you feel so alone in that,

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Speaker 2: and it's scary, it's sad, it's lonely, it's terrible.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, how long into your career did it take

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Speaker 1: for that feeling to sort of make its way into

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Speaker 1: your It's funny.

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Speaker 2: Because, like, I think it actually is helpful that I

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Speaker 2: have these insecurities that I sing about on the record

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Speaker 2: and that I'm pretty transparent about now. In my life,

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Speaker 2: I've never really felt that feeling of I'm on top

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Speaker 2: of the world. Even when I had the number one

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Speaker 2: album in the country, even when my song broke records,

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Speaker 2: I felt like it was all weird luck and I

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Speaker 2: never had that feeling of like walking into a room

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Speaker 2: and being like suck by dick bitches, Like I wish

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Speaker 2: I had a moment of that, because looking back, I'm like, fuck,

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Speaker 2: I should have at least had like a year of

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Speaker 2: being a narcissistic asshole and I missed it.

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Speaker 1: This is always awkward. We met the day actually you

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Speaker 1: met Rick. Oh my god. Were walking on the beach

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Speaker 1: in Malibu doing a separate interview for something different, But yeah,

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Speaker 1: you had just met with Rick. We were talking and

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Speaker 1: it was a good vibe. But even then I didn't

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Speaker 1: want to. It's always weird to tell someone like when

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Speaker 1: you've met them, But I met you like pre TikTok

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Speaker 1: kesha like you. No, it's really not a bad story.

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Speaker 1: It was just no, it was just it was great.

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Speaker 1: It was Coachella two thousand and seven or eight, and

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Speaker 1: I was at the back of a tent watching Devandra

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Speaker 1: Banhart and a blonde girl and a brunette of some

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Speaker 1: I don't but just the script don't remember came up.

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Speaker 1: I think we were all probably inebriated, but I remember

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Speaker 1: me maybe not. You just get in I won't well,

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Speaker 1: I won't, you know, put your business out there like that.

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Speaker 1: But your friend was like, do you know who this is?

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Speaker 1: And I was like, no, I know, I have no.

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Speaker 2: Clue. That's a good friend right there. I don't remember

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Speaker 2: this particular exchange, but I do remember going to see

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Speaker 2: Devendra Banhart and I ended up sharing the same house

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Speaker 2: with him in Laurel Canyon at one point. Wow, but

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Speaker 2: there were so many rooms. The place was like a

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Speaker 2: castle that I don't think we ever even met. There

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Speaker 2: were like twelve rooms in this house, or like ten rooms.

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Speaker 2: And I would come home and I think he shot

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Speaker 2: a music video in the living room on my couch,

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Speaker 2: and I like came in and it was just like

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Speaker 2: a very it's a very sexy group of individuals like

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Speaker 2: on my couch, and I was like, the fuck is

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Speaker 2: going on here?

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Speaker 1: But sounds magical.

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Speaker 2: It was a magical time. But like your story checks out,

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Speaker 2: is there like a worse part?

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Speaker 1: No, No, there's no bad part to it. It only

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Speaker 1: it just it you having said that there was never

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Speaker 1: a part in time in your life where you feel

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Speaker 1: like you arrived, and some of your honesty on the

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Speaker 1: record about it reminded me of that time because it

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Speaker 1: was I remember your friend saying that her being like

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Speaker 1: this Kesha she sings on the flow Rider song right round,

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Speaker 1: and I was like looking at you, thinking about the souse,

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Speaker 1: like this is no way this is the same person.

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Speaker 1: I remember your name, and then like you was later

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Speaker 1: or a year or two later, TikTok came out, and

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Speaker 1: remember you were kind of like it was like you

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Speaker 1: were off to the races.

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Speaker 2: But blasted off into outer space.

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Speaker 1: Even in that moment though, you didn't really seem super

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Speaker 1: comfortable to me, and like, yeah, I'm Kesha of right

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Speaker 1: round fame was like your friend was really interesting.

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Speaker 2: Very very good friend, and I'm lucky to be surrounded

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Speaker 2: by awesome women that we always like build each other

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Speaker 2: up and like have each other's backs. And you say,

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Speaker 2: I never felt comfortable in that role, But I don't

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Speaker 2: think I've just ever felt super comfortable period, like ever

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Speaker 2: in my entire life. I mean, have you had like

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Speaker 2: an elongated period of time where you've just felt super company.

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Speaker 1: I'm starting to now, and I'm worried that that means something.

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Speaker 2: Oh that's so nice. That's that gives me hope.

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Speaker 1: It gives me hope, but it also gives me anxiety

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Speaker 1: because it does feel like maybe the other shoes is

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Speaker 1: about to drop on some level and I should be prepared,

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Speaker 1: and I'm.

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Speaker 2: Not knowing what if it's what if you just earned it?

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Speaker 1: What if? But then how long can that last? How

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Speaker 1: long can it lasts until you know, well, getting comfortable, comfortable,

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Speaker 1: It's pretty sure.

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Speaker 2: Just like taking the good. When you get the good,

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Speaker 2: you have to let it in as much as you

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Speaker 2: do the bad. That's something I'm trying to exercise on

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Speaker 2: a daily basis.

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Speaker 1: It's a fair point.

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Speaker 2: Like I sometimes I don't know if this is the

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Speaker 2: same with everybody or it's just like my special concoction

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Speaker 2: of brain cells. But when I see I can see

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Speaker 2: like a hundred thousand positives and the one negative thing

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Speaker 2: will be the thing I keep with me and convert

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Speaker 2: to being the voice of my higher power in my head. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: and so I'm really working on kind of what you

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Speaker 2: just said. If it's good, just let it be good.

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Speaker 1: Let it be good. Yeah, not worrying too much. What

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Speaker 1: I mean early on? What was it early in life

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Speaker 1: that made you not feel so comfortable?

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Speaker 2: Like what I have a core memory of playing a

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Speaker 2: song to high school. All school was fucking miserable for me. Also, Yes,

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Speaker 2: by the way, so I have a theory which I'm

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Speaker 2: not sure if this checks out, so like don't quote

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Speaker 2: me on it, but if you are doing great in school,

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Speaker 2: you're fuck the rest of your life. Like if you

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Speaker 2: have the best time in school, you're good. If you

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Speaker 2: have a shitty time in school, you have to forever.

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Speaker 2: I feel like there's this need to prove those motherfucker's wrong.

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Speaker 2: I think a lot of our lives are like shaped

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Speaker 2: by the experiences that we have, all of it.

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Speaker 1: We think we are who we are because we're making

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Speaker 1: conscious decisions day after day, day and day out to

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Speaker 1: be who we want to be. But you know you're right.

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Speaker 1: More often than not. It's it's based on unconsciously things

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Speaker 1: that have happened and sets us on these courses that

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Speaker 1: you sometimes can't you know, whatever you can't there's no

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Speaker 1: turning back.

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Speaker 2: Well, and I have you ever had this thought? I

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Speaker 2: always think, what would my style of music, of taste

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Speaker 2: and clothing of everything, what would that have been like?

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Speaker 2: If that one Like all the men I've been in

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Speaker 2: love with, the like unrequited love where they didn't love

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Speaker 2: me back, I just so wonder if they had loved

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Speaker 2: me back, if I would have ever become the person

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Speaker 2: I was wearing the things I wore just to try

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Speaker 2: to be hot for that dude's whose name I don't remember.

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Speaker 1: Being like trapped in that that stage, Like you just

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Speaker 1: would have never yeah gone past, yeah, yeah, yeah, It's

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Speaker 1: it's fair because you know, especially early in life, relationship

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Speaker 1: tend to work out to be like these these things

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Speaker 1: that kind of prevent growth, you know. I think hopefully

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Speaker 1: as you evolve and get older and life relationships become

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Speaker 1: like you can kind of grow as individuals, you know, ideally, right,

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Speaker 1: but yeah, like you kind of like it stunts your

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Speaker 1: growth way or like early on, you know, well it.

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Speaker 2: Can stunt it or just shape it, you know. Like

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Speaker 2: my first severe love was somebody who was really into

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Speaker 2: punk music, and because of that, I started listening to

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Speaker 2: the Stooges And now I have a Stooges tattoo and

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Speaker 2: I've done a song with Iggy Pop. Like, would I

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Speaker 2: have ever done any of that if I didn't have

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Speaker 2: a crush on a guy that I knew quote liked

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Speaker 2: punk music on his MySpace profile. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I miss MySpace. I mean probably not, probably not. You know,

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Speaker 1: who knows, you wouldn't gotten too Iggy. But that's that's amazing.

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Speaker 1: Iggy is one of the smartest people I have ever met.

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Speaker 1: I think he's iconic.

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Speaker 2: Actually have like a like the Holy Trinity of people.

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Speaker 2: I pray too. When I get an interview question and

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Speaker 2: I'm like Okay. It's either like, okay, how do I

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Speaker 2: answer this like really sincerely and kind and genuine and

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Speaker 2: speak from the heart. Then I channel Dolly Parton. If

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Speaker 2: I'm like Okay, now's the time to be a little cunt,

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Speaker 2: then I'm like okay, I channel Iggy. And then when

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Speaker 2: I'm like when you're just like above it all and

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Speaker 2: you just like are the most powerful bitch in the world,

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Speaker 2: then I'm Beyonce.

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Speaker 1: Ooh, Beyonce. I was curious who were going to pick? Yeah, Beyonce.

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Speaker 1: I mean, look, we all found little Beyonce, but like

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Speaker 1: when for you particular, we're in the journey, did you I.

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Speaker 2: Think the self titled album with the pink I think

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Speaker 2: it's just called Beyonce. Honestly, I'm not even like I

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Speaker 2: don't have like every album that I play all the time.

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Speaker 2: It was the feeling I felt when I heard the album.

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Speaker 2: It's like black with her name.

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Speaker 1: In pink thirteen. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: When I first heard that album, my goal in life

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Speaker 2: was too because she started in super pop like me,

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Speaker 2: and I feel like she has fully embodied the power

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Speaker 2: of who she motherfucking is. Yeah, and I am a

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Speaker 2: no means comparing myself to Beyonce. It's just somebody that

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Speaker 2: I tried to channel when I don't know how to

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Speaker 2: respond to something. Yeah, but like I don't know, I

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Speaker 2: just always felt a little bit different. I went to

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Speaker 2: school in Nashville. I was born in the Valley and

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Speaker 2: my mom was like a single mom made music, and

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Speaker 2: we moved to Nashville, and I just remember from the

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Speaker 2: earliest stages of going to school. I went to a

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Speaker 2: Catholic school and all the boys were wearing shorts and

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Speaker 2: all the girls had to wear skirts. And I remember

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Speaker 2: getting in trouble and I got sent to like the

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Speaker 2: head nuns office because I wore the boys outfit, and

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Speaker 2: just since I was at like six years old, like,

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Speaker 2: if the boys can do it, why can't I do it?

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Speaker 2: And nobody really had an answer. I got my hands

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Speaker 2: lapped and then it sent back to class. But I

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Speaker 2: still have not gotten the answer from anyone. No one

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Speaker 2: has given me the answer. If the boys can do it,

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Speaker 2: why can't I do it?

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Speaker 1: That is uh hot debate it still at the moment,

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Speaker 1: it's and it's a great question, and that's probably there's

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Speaker 1: no good answer, you know, there's no I.

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Speaker 2: Don't think there is I don't think there's a good answer.

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Speaker 2: Like I've gone down all the rabbit holes in my mind.

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Speaker 2: I haven't figured out the answer. But even then, I

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Speaker 2: always wondering, like why do you want to push?

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Speaker 1: Yeah?

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Speaker 2: Why do you have to find a boundary and push?

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Speaker 2: But I just if it doesn't make sense to me,

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Speaker 2: I don't understand the concept of just shutting the fuck

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Speaker 2: up and like it is what it is, which is something.

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Speaker 2: Rick Reuben, who I did this record with, he said

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Speaker 2: that to me a couple of times, and it like

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Speaker 2: blew my mind. It is what it is. It's just like,

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Speaker 2: what are you gonna argue with with that? It is

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Speaker 2: what it is? He would just I would be freaking

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Speaker 2: out about something and he would just like laugh and say,

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Speaker 2: it is what it is. And I am still trying

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Speaker 2: to like reach that level of acceptance just in life.

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Speaker 2: It is what it is.

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Speaker 1: Did any of that it is what it did? Any

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Speaker 1: of that you know that Ethos did that like find

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Speaker 1: its way into your creative process throughout the making of

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Speaker 1: the record.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Absolutely. I'm I'm like pretty accustomed to be a

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Speaker 2: control freak as much as I can be, and with

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Speaker 2: Rick kind of just like laughing it is what it is.

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Speaker 2: We didn't film the first month of recording because I

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Speaker 2: was just an emotional beyond emotional wreck, Like it was

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Speaker 2: really scary to me. He's only the second producer I've

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Speaker 2: ever done an album with, Yeah, and so I was

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Speaker 2: just so I felt so scared that he was going

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Speaker 2: to quit. And I kept just like obsessively last gkeing

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Speaker 2: him if he quits projects a lot, and if he

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Speaker 2: thinks he's going to quit my project, because I felt

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Speaker 2: so nervous that I wasn't going to be able to

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Speaker 2: deliver the goods. And he's just so patient and so kind.

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Speaker 2: I mean, you know, he's an amazing human. Yeah, he's

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Speaker 2: so great. It was such a great influence on my life,

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Speaker 2: but I have kind of taken in it is what

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Speaker 2: it is. I made what I consider to be the

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Speaker 2: most proud thing I've ever made with Rick. I'm the

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Speaker 2: most proud of this of anything that I've ever made

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Speaker 2: my entire life. I think it's a masterpiece. I think

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Speaker 2: it's a classic. And if people are going to sleep

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Speaker 2: on that, that's not my problem.

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Speaker 1: I hope not. It's really good. I mean the last

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Speaker 1: two records you made were great too, Like from a

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Speaker 1: listener's perspective. From the audience perspective, it seemed like even

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Speaker 1: those records were like a big growth period for you too,

294
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Speaker 1: like just hearing your vocal more, you know, it just

295
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Speaker 1: felt like, oh wow, like you're you're really like you're

296
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Speaker 1: seeing like this person can sing.

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Speaker 2: So I got kind of used to having auto tune

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Speaker 2: as this crutch because I was like, no, no, no,

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Speaker 2: it's like I need my medicine, like or I'm not

300
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Speaker 2: going to be able to live right, like this is

301
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Speaker 2: this is my life for us in my music, I

302
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Speaker 2: have to have the auto tune, and Rick like weaned

303
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Speaker 2: me off. It was like a detoxing program with Rick

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Speaker 2: with the auto tune. I swear to god, I would

305
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Speaker 2: cry and be like, no, please give me the auto

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00:16:32,476 --> 00:16:35,276
Speaker 2: tune and he's like, I don't know how else to

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Speaker 2: tell you that you don't need it, And like I

308
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Speaker 2: still am getting used to that idea, Like it's.

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Speaker 1: Been shocking to me that you still feel like you might.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you're a great singer.

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Speaker 2: Thank you, And also like yeah, fuck yeah I am.

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Speaker 2: And it makes me sad because, like we're talking about before,

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Speaker 2: sometimes you just remember that one comment.

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Speaker 1: You know, there's comments that I think even if you

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Speaker 1: move past, I mean, they're just going to stick with you.

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Speaker 1: There's certain comments that it's just offhanded comments. People don't

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Speaker 1: even realize what they're doing, you know, say something. I've

318
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Speaker 1: had family members say things to me as a kid

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Speaker 1: that you know, I still I still think about it.

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Speaker 1: I'm like, oh my god, you know I'm deficient in

321
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Speaker 1: this particular way because someone just said it one day randomly,

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Speaker 1: you know, not even they don't remember it.

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Speaker 2: I'm sure you know, they probably have no recollection of it.

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Speaker 2: And those things almost help define who you become because

325
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Speaker 2: as people were just an amalgamation of all of our experiences,

326
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Speaker 2: all the sounds we've heard, all the records we've heard,

327
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Speaker 2: you know, like everything's a rip off because we heard

328
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Speaker 2: it somewhere.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Like, I really think our brains are just like our dreams.

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Speaker 2: Our dreams just interpolate what we've experienced. And it's the

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Speaker 2: same with making music. It's like I'm just dreaming. It's

333
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Speaker 2: kind of like I don't know what's coming out. It's

334
00:17:55,276 --> 00:17:57,996
Speaker 2: just a dream, but it's a mashup of something I

335
00:17:58,076 --> 00:18:00,156
Speaker 2: must have heard with something else I must have heard

336
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Speaker 2: and something else I must have heard.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, the sort of like affirmations or sort of just

338
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Speaker 1: like this the samples from sort of like you know,

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Speaker 1: some are spiritual leaders. As a magician in there, it's

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Speaker 1: kind of just like these great.

341
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Speaker 2: A wizard not a magician.

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Speaker 1: Excuse that the difference?

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Speaker 2: Oh my god, yes there's a difference a magician. I

344
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Speaker 2: don't actually know the technical reason they're different, but I'm

345
00:18:27,436 --> 00:18:32,236
Speaker 2: pretty sure wizards are like more powerful, well more powerful

346
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Speaker 2: well defense. Actually that's a good question, but we should

347
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Speaker 2: ask the fans, what do you think is more powerful

348
00:18:37,836 --> 00:18:41,556
Speaker 2: wizard or magician or a musician or yeah.

349
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Speaker 1: And you have it sampled. You have a wizard sampled

350
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Speaker 1: into uh, into the and like some other spiritual leaders,

351
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Speaker 1: and it's it. It helps frame the listening experience in

352
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Speaker 1: like a really beautiful way, you know, because you're dealing

353
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Speaker 1: with really I mean, just from the title alone, you

354
00:19:00,196 --> 00:19:01,716
Speaker 1: kind of know it's going to be an intense listen

355
00:19:01,836 --> 00:19:05,516
Speaker 1: from just the type of gag order. And it proves

356
00:19:05,876 --> 00:19:06,396
Speaker 1: proves to be.

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Speaker 2: You know, it is an intense listen. And we are

358
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Speaker 2: kind of talked about what we were going to call it.

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Speaker 2: It was initially going to be called Eat the Acid.

360
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Speaker 2: And as much as I love that song. It's one

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Speaker 2: of my favorite songs I've ever written, Like it's a

362
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Speaker 2: really special song. But I was afraid that that would

363
00:19:23,476 --> 00:19:27,756
Speaker 2: maybe play into this whole party girl persona that I

364
00:19:27,796 --> 00:19:32,516
Speaker 2: have been so desperately trying to recover from because I

365
00:19:32,596 --> 00:19:39,996
Speaker 2: realized America doesn't understand irony in mass so ever since then,

366
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Speaker 2: I have to be really careful anytime I mentioned any

367
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Speaker 2: kind of substance, even if I'm joking, it's like it's

368
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Speaker 2: going to follow me into I'm far beyond when I'm dead,

369
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Speaker 2: Like that's what I'm going to be remembered for.

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Speaker 1: So I was like, I don't know, maybe, you know,

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of time to you know, if that's

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Speaker 1: not what you want.

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Speaker 2: I don't want to be remembered as the chick that

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Speaker 2: liked to party. It could be like she was really

375
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Speaker 2: fun when she did party and and there's all these

376
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Speaker 2: other facets.

377
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Speaker 1: To her character and you can you know, yeah, and

378
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Speaker 1: partying is now secondary too.

379
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Speaker 2: I'm fun as fuck, like sue me.

380
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Speaker 1: We're going to take a quick break and then come

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Speaker 1: back with more of my interview with Kesha. We're back

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Speaker 1: with more from Kesha. When did you write Eat the Acid?

383
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Speaker 2: Okay, so eat the acid. I forget the date. But

384
00:20:39,556 --> 00:20:44,476
Speaker 2: that was during lockdown, So I was upstairs. This is

385
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Speaker 2: my house, so I was upstairs, and I was just

386
00:20:47,996 --> 00:20:52,116
Speaker 2: having like this intensive anxiety because I think when you

387
00:20:52,156 --> 00:20:56,796
Speaker 2: do what I do, you are like off to the

388
00:20:56,876 --> 00:20:59,476
Speaker 2: races and you have very little time to sleep or

389
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Speaker 2: do much of anything else besides maintained that this thing

390
00:21:03,116 --> 00:21:05,676
Speaker 2: you fought so hard for and dedicated your life too

391
00:21:06,556 --> 00:21:11,236
Speaker 2: is sustaining life. So that happened for twelve years. So

392
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Speaker 2: lockdown was the first time I was in one place

393
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Speaker 2: for more than two weeks, probably in over a decade.

394
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Speaker 2: So everyone had a tough time, and I am I'm

395
00:21:23,356 --> 00:21:25,716
Speaker 2: very grateful and I have a lot of privilege and

396
00:21:25,756 --> 00:21:28,836
Speaker 2: I want to acknowledge that. But it was really mentally

397
00:21:30,236 --> 00:21:36,516
Speaker 2: a fucking nightmare. Is almost unbearable, just because when you

398
00:21:36,556 --> 00:21:41,636
Speaker 2: dedicate your life to something and then you have built

399
00:21:41,676 --> 00:21:48,956
Speaker 2: this whole castle around this idea of what your purpose

400
00:21:49,076 --> 00:21:52,596
Speaker 2: is and what is and then it's disintegrating in front

401
00:21:52,676 --> 00:21:54,956
Speaker 2: of you. I really felt like I was having a

402
00:21:54,996 --> 00:21:59,716
Speaker 2: psychotic break so watching these illusions kind of fall left

403
00:21:59,716 --> 00:22:03,476
Speaker 2: and right, and realizing that if I never made a

404
00:22:03,476 --> 00:22:06,636
Speaker 2: song again, if I never went on tour again. If

405
00:22:06,676 --> 00:22:11,196
Speaker 2: I just like cease to exist, I'm not sure anybody

406
00:22:11,396 --> 00:22:15,356
Speaker 2: would care, like and that freaked me out, Like people

407
00:22:15,356 --> 00:22:18,956
Speaker 2: would care, it would be like a TMZ article, but

408
00:22:19,116 --> 00:22:22,476
Speaker 2: like my family would care, my friends would care, and

409
00:22:22,556 --> 00:22:25,556
Speaker 2: I know my fans, my fans would care. But like

410
00:22:25,716 --> 00:22:28,796
Speaker 2: in large part knowing that if something happened to you

411
00:22:28,836 --> 00:22:31,836
Speaker 2: and it would become just like a news story for

412
00:22:31,916 --> 00:22:36,436
Speaker 2: twenty minutes and fade, then you start to be like, well,

413
00:22:36,436 --> 00:22:41,756
Speaker 2: what if I risked and sacrificed everything for I've missed

414
00:22:41,756 --> 00:22:46,236
Speaker 2: so many birthdays, I miss so many moments with my family,

415
00:22:46,276 --> 00:22:49,516
Speaker 2: I miss my god son being born, Like all of

416
00:22:49,556 --> 00:22:52,716
Speaker 2: these things, all of this time that I'm never going

417
00:22:52,796 --> 00:22:55,476
Speaker 2: to get back, And what did I sacrifice it for,

418
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Speaker 2: Like for a number one song, like who fucking cares?

419
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Speaker 2: So like it's going to make me emotional because it's

420
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Speaker 2: I'm never going to have that time back, and that

421
00:23:06,316 --> 00:23:10,716
Speaker 2: like still fucks with me. Yeah, But I then kind

422
00:23:10,716 --> 00:23:14,116
Speaker 2: of like with the help of Rick, like I refell

423
00:23:14,156 --> 00:23:17,276
Speaker 2: in love with music and like why I started loving

424
00:23:17,356 --> 00:23:18,836
Speaker 2: it in the first place, but I started making it

425
00:23:18,876 --> 00:23:21,676
Speaker 2: in the first place? Why I have to make it?

426
00:23:22,276 --> 00:23:25,316
Speaker 2: And I started feeling like it doesn't matter what anybody

427
00:23:25,356 --> 00:23:29,836
Speaker 2: else would say, You're important to yourself. So this like

428
00:23:29,996 --> 00:23:35,316
Speaker 2: falling in love with myself. Dynamic Rick really helped encourage.

429
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Speaker 2: And I always when people would say love yourself, it's like, yeah,

430
00:23:38,516 --> 00:23:41,396
Speaker 2: of course, love yourself, love yourself, promote love yourself, but

431
00:23:41,436 --> 00:23:46,436
Speaker 2: it felt so corny to actually practice self love and

432
00:23:46,556 --> 00:23:48,836
Speaker 2: like sit and roll my eyes at myself and then

433
00:23:49,156 --> 00:23:53,996
Speaker 2: like and then do it. And I started realizing that

434
00:23:53,996 --> 00:23:58,756
Speaker 2: that's where my passion and lust for life came back from,

435
00:23:58,996 --> 00:24:02,436
Speaker 2: is like actually giving a shit about myself.

436
00:24:02,916 --> 00:24:06,036
Speaker 1: With that renewed sense of love for yourself, I mean,

437
00:24:06,076 --> 00:24:08,076
Speaker 1: do you feel like you can kind of integrate your

438
00:24:08,156 --> 00:24:11,276
Speaker 1: life and your art in your career better?

439
00:24:11,596 --> 00:24:16,356
Speaker 2: I hope. So we'll see. Like this album is so

440
00:24:16,796 --> 00:24:19,956
Speaker 2: fucking special to me. I feel like it encapsulates me

441
00:24:20,756 --> 00:24:25,636
Speaker 2: becoming who I am and like really being reborn in

442
00:24:25,676 --> 00:24:28,076
Speaker 2: a way that I never kind of knew was possible.

443
00:24:28,716 --> 00:24:32,876
Speaker 2: And to capture that audibly, to capture a process of

444
00:24:32,956 --> 00:24:37,156
Speaker 2: going through like a spiritual awakening and ego death, really

445
00:24:37,396 --> 00:24:42,276
Speaker 2: difficult mental obstacles, digging through the trash of my past

446
00:24:43,036 --> 00:24:46,196
Speaker 2: and re emerging on the other side, and to capture

447
00:24:46,236 --> 00:24:50,276
Speaker 2: that on a microphone felt so fucking scary. Yeah, when Rick,

448
00:24:50,316 --> 00:24:52,396
Speaker 2: when we started working, Rick was like, let's film it.

449
00:24:52,436 --> 00:24:54,196
Speaker 2: And I was like I just can't. I just can't.

450
00:24:54,236 --> 00:24:56,076
Speaker 2: And so at the end I got really sad and

451
00:24:56,116 --> 00:24:58,316
Speaker 2: I was like, fuck, we should have filmed this, and

452
00:24:58,356 --> 00:25:01,636
Speaker 2: he said, it is what it is, and so I

453
00:25:01,676 --> 00:25:03,276
Speaker 2: was like, you know what it does, what are you

454
00:25:03,276 --> 00:25:03,556
Speaker 2: going to do?

455
00:25:03,716 --> 00:25:06,316
Speaker 1: It is what it is. Making a record is documenting something.

456
00:25:06,316 --> 00:25:09,116
Speaker 1: But and it sounds like this record didn't just die

457
00:25:09,116 --> 00:25:11,876
Speaker 1: document a particular phase of your life, like it documented

458
00:25:11,916 --> 00:25:16,436
Speaker 1: like a particularly like impactful phase in your life. Like

459
00:25:16,476 --> 00:25:20,236
Speaker 1: the MIC's were rolling at the right time to get they're.

460
00:25:20,076 --> 00:25:25,516
Speaker 2: Rolling at the most vulnerable times. Like there are moments

461
00:25:25,556 --> 00:25:27,476
Speaker 2: on the record that are hard for me to listen

462
00:25:27,516 --> 00:25:31,116
Speaker 2: to if I'm not in the right headspace living in

463
00:25:31,116 --> 00:25:34,796
Speaker 2: my head. It was really really hard to make. But

464
00:25:34,836 --> 00:25:37,316
Speaker 2: that was Rick's like favorite song.

465
00:25:37,516 --> 00:25:39,876
Speaker 1: What in particular in that is hard for you to

466
00:25:39,876 --> 00:25:41,556
Speaker 1: hear or made it hard to make.

467
00:25:41,876 --> 00:25:48,836
Speaker 2: Just listening to this ideation of nonexistence and talking about

468
00:25:48,836 --> 00:25:52,476
Speaker 2: my insecurities and how it you know, I don't think

469
00:25:52,476 --> 00:25:56,516
Speaker 2: it's just in music, but it's very prevalent in entertainment,

470
00:25:56,596 --> 00:25:59,196
Speaker 2: but I think it's kind of everywhere. As a woman,

471
00:25:59,276 --> 00:26:01,956
Speaker 2: I feel like there's a lot of need to compare yourself,

472
00:26:02,716 --> 00:26:05,916
Speaker 2: and I talk about that in the song. I talk

473
00:26:05,996 --> 00:26:08,556
Speaker 2: about how lonely I feel inside of my head and

474
00:26:08,556 --> 00:26:10,956
Speaker 2: how sometimes I just want someone to hold my hand

475
00:26:10,996 --> 00:26:15,876
Speaker 2: while I walk through it in there, And you know

476
00:26:15,956 --> 00:26:18,356
Speaker 2: he's not paying me to say this, so but like

477
00:26:18,516 --> 00:26:20,516
Speaker 2: Rick was the one that, like I said, like, Okay,

478
00:26:20,556 --> 00:26:22,796
Speaker 2: I'm gonna hold your handle. We walked through this together.

479
00:26:23,876 --> 00:26:24,076
Speaker 1: Yeah.

480
00:26:24,436 --> 00:26:27,836
Speaker 2: So it's a beautiful thing, and I have no idea

481
00:26:27,876 --> 00:26:30,036
Speaker 2: if people are gonna like it or listen to I

482
00:26:30,076 --> 00:26:33,316
Speaker 2: have no fucking idea. I hope they do, because I

483
00:26:33,396 --> 00:26:35,876
Speaker 2: think it will help certain people that relate to what

484
00:26:35,916 --> 00:26:39,356
Speaker 2: I'm saying. But in terms of like chart numbers and

485
00:26:39,956 --> 00:26:42,956
Speaker 2: wanting to be the dick swinging motherfucker that walks into

486
00:26:42,996 --> 00:26:45,676
Speaker 2: the room, I think I'm just too old for that. Anyways, Sadly,

487
00:26:46,676 --> 00:26:47,156
Speaker 2: I don't know.

488
00:26:47,636 --> 00:26:50,356
Speaker 1: Come on, look at look at Mix still walking around

489
00:26:50,956 --> 00:26:51,676
Speaker 1: with his dick swing.

490
00:26:52,716 --> 00:26:55,236
Speaker 2: Okay, fine, maybe I'm want to start walking around with

491
00:26:55,276 --> 00:26:58,716
Speaker 2: my dick swinging. As long as I ever start getting

492
00:26:58,796 --> 00:27:01,796
Speaker 2: out of hand, somebody shoot.

493
00:27:01,596 --> 00:27:08,556
Speaker 1: At tell me about the like the from like sort

494
00:27:08,636 --> 00:27:12,236
Speaker 1: of the creation story of this record from like how

495
00:27:12,276 --> 00:27:14,796
Speaker 1: did it come together? Like what did you bring to

496
00:27:14,916 --> 00:27:16,756
Speaker 1: Rick that first day you met Rick?

497
00:27:16,996 --> 00:27:18,916
Speaker 2: The first day I met Rick, I played him a

498
00:27:18,956 --> 00:27:23,316
Speaker 2: bunch of demos that were like not very good. I

499
00:27:23,356 --> 00:27:24,636
Speaker 2: will forever remember him.

500
00:27:25,236 --> 00:27:28,796
Speaker 3: Where Rick, you told me to play you everything and

501
00:27:28,836 --> 00:27:32,636
Speaker 3: I was like, now the song is not I don't

502
00:27:32,716 --> 00:27:35,276
Speaker 3: like the song. He told me to play you everything,

503
00:27:36,036 --> 00:27:38,876
Speaker 3: and then I played the song in about thirty seconds

504
00:27:38,876 --> 00:27:44,076
Speaker 3: and he just started like crying, laughing, and I was like, Okay,

505
00:27:44,276 --> 00:27:47,036
Speaker 3: that was the nicest way anyone ever told me that

506
00:27:47,076 --> 00:27:48,116
Speaker 3: they hate my song.

507
00:27:49,316 --> 00:27:52,516
Speaker 2: I was like, all right, that's really embarrassing. Next song

508
00:27:52,956 --> 00:27:56,316
Speaker 2: it said. They were not good songs. But we talked

509
00:27:56,356 --> 00:27:59,196
Speaker 2: a lot about spirituality through the process of this album,

510
00:27:59,476 --> 00:28:02,556
Speaker 2: and he knew that I'm a seeker and kind of

511
00:28:02,596 --> 00:28:06,316
Speaker 2: on the journey to I don't know, just be in

512
00:28:06,356 --> 00:28:10,316
Speaker 2: touch with high power of some sort. And that's what

513
00:28:10,316 --> 00:28:11,556
Speaker 2: we ended up really bonding over.

514
00:28:12,396 --> 00:28:14,436
Speaker 1: Did anything from that first batch of demos you played

515
00:28:14,516 --> 00:28:17,196
Speaker 1: him make the record, like any facet of those songs

516
00:28:17,276 --> 00:28:17,836
Speaker 1: or any.

517
00:28:18,116 --> 00:28:22,636
Speaker 2: One one did hate me harder? Oh, I like it,

518
00:28:22,716 --> 00:28:27,316
Speaker 2: hate me harder. But but the song leaked. The original

519
00:28:27,356 --> 00:28:30,636
Speaker 2: demo leaked like a couple of years ago, and I

520
00:28:30,676 --> 00:28:33,556
Speaker 2: was disappointed because I was like, that's not the incarnation

521
00:28:33,676 --> 00:28:36,596
Speaker 2: I wanted people to hear. But he took this like

522
00:28:36,916 --> 00:28:41,836
Speaker 2: very poppy, kind of happy sounding anthem song and turned

523
00:28:41,876 --> 00:28:50,436
Speaker 2: it into this really powerful ballad, strong defiant thing. So

524
00:28:50,476 --> 00:28:52,636
Speaker 2: he made it a whole different animal. One of the

525
00:28:52,676 --> 00:28:55,396
Speaker 2: many geniuses of him, he said, he's like the song

526
00:28:55,596 --> 00:28:58,076
Speaker 2: like you put different clothes on it, different genres. We

527
00:28:58,116 --> 00:29:00,196
Speaker 2: would try one song and make a ballad, and then

528
00:29:00,196 --> 00:29:02,116
Speaker 2: we would make at a disco song, just see much

529
00:29:02,156 --> 00:29:02,716
Speaker 2: one we'd like to do.

530
00:29:03,196 --> 00:29:06,116
Speaker 1: Did you ever settle on a particular feel for a

531
00:29:06,196 --> 00:29:10,076
Speaker 1: song in that process that you were maybe you wouldn't

532
00:29:10,116 --> 00:29:12,196
Speaker 1: like like you was ever an instance we're like, oh,

533
00:29:12,396 --> 00:29:15,036
Speaker 1: we'll try this song kind of like a gospel song,

534
00:29:15,116 --> 00:29:17,316
Speaker 1: but I don't know that's really gonna work, but you

535
00:29:17,316 --> 00:29:17,916
Speaker 1: were convinced.

536
00:29:18,156 --> 00:29:21,076
Speaker 2: I honestly, I just kind of like when you're in

537
00:29:21,116 --> 00:29:24,756
Speaker 2: the presence of a master, I think a really important

538
00:29:24,876 --> 00:29:27,116
Speaker 2: tool is knowing what you're good at and also knowing

539
00:29:27,116 --> 00:29:32,156
Speaker 2: what you're not good at, and surrounding yourself with people

540
00:29:32,316 --> 00:29:34,076
Speaker 2: that are good at the things you know you're not

541
00:29:34,156 --> 00:29:39,956
Speaker 2: good at so having like this like beautiful experience and

542
00:29:41,276 --> 00:29:43,156
Speaker 2: getting to be sit in the same room with Rick,

543
00:29:43,316 --> 00:29:46,196
Speaker 2: I was just like, honestly, I'm down to try whatever,

544
00:29:46,316 --> 00:29:49,236
Speaker 2: like I was game, which I think hopefully. I mean,

545
00:29:49,436 --> 00:29:51,356
Speaker 2: I'll speak for him, but I think it was fun

546
00:29:51,396 --> 00:29:53,436
Speaker 2: for him too, because I was like, sure, let's try.

547
00:29:54,236 --> 00:29:58,716
Speaker 2: Let's try dropping it like twenty bpm, drop the key,

548
00:29:59,116 --> 00:30:03,116
Speaker 2: slow it down, change the chords, like I was here

549
00:30:03,156 --> 00:30:04,156
Speaker 2: for the whole experience.

550
00:30:04,316 --> 00:30:08,276
Speaker 1: That's great. Hate me harder was an idea, so you

551
00:30:08,396 --> 00:30:10,756
Speaker 1: kind of have that, but I mean, you're kind of

552
00:30:10,756 --> 00:30:14,036
Speaker 1: also started from scratch, so what was it was scratch?

553
00:30:14,156 --> 00:30:16,436
Speaker 2: And then it was at the end of a song

554
00:30:16,956 --> 00:30:19,156
Speaker 2: he heard me starting to sing living in my head

555
00:30:19,196 --> 00:30:22,076
Speaker 2: because I was at the session and I had a

556
00:30:22,116 --> 00:30:27,476
Speaker 2: lot personally going on that day, just with another department

557
00:30:27,516 --> 00:30:31,196
Speaker 2: of my life, and I started just having an anxiety

558
00:30:31,276 --> 00:30:34,636
Speaker 2: attack thinking about the phone call. I was just gonn me,

559
00:30:35,316 --> 00:30:37,116
Speaker 2: so I was leeing. I just kind of mumbled into

560
00:30:37,116 --> 00:30:39,476
Speaker 2: a mic like this like I don't want to be

561
00:30:39,556 --> 00:30:43,076
Speaker 2: here anymore. I don't want to be here anymore. I'm

562
00:30:43,076 --> 00:30:46,156
Speaker 2: so fucking insecure. So we listened to the whole song

563
00:30:46,196 --> 00:30:48,876
Speaker 2: and that little tiny part of the end ended up

564
00:30:48,876 --> 00:30:51,036
Speaker 2: being living in my head and he was like that

565
00:30:51,036 --> 00:30:53,716
Speaker 2: that's real. I want to start with that. So there

566
00:30:53,716 --> 00:30:57,396
Speaker 2: were like little tiny pieces, I guess thinking back but

567
00:30:57,516 --> 00:31:00,076
Speaker 2: hate me hard. It was the only song in its entirety,

568
00:31:01,236 --> 00:31:04,276
Speaker 2: but Eat the Acid. I don't think I ever even

569
00:31:04,756 --> 00:31:09,836
Speaker 2: played actually don't remember. Potentially no back. He may have

570
00:31:09,876 --> 00:31:13,036
Speaker 2: heard Ethi Acid, but it was so different, but he

571
00:31:13,236 --> 00:31:16,356
Speaker 2: just took everything off of everything, like the production all

572
00:31:16,396 --> 00:31:19,556
Speaker 2: went away and it was rebuilt. Yeah, but Ethie Acid

573
00:31:19,636 --> 00:31:22,516
Speaker 2: was kind of like the foundation of the album. That

574
00:31:22,636 --> 00:31:25,276
Speaker 2: was when I was sitting upstairs having this like what

575
00:31:25,476 --> 00:31:28,596
Speaker 2: I perceived to be a psychotic break but turned out,

576
00:31:28,916 --> 00:31:32,436
Speaker 2: according to my therapist to be a spiritual awakening. So

577
00:31:32,556 --> 00:31:34,516
Speaker 2: that was the song I wrote the next day after that.

578
00:31:34,916 --> 00:31:36,836
Speaker 1: I guess to go back to the story you're telling

579
00:31:36,876 --> 00:31:39,196
Speaker 1: you sort of in this dark period start of the

580
00:31:39,236 --> 00:31:42,836
Speaker 1: first couple of weeks of lockdown, and you feel like

581
00:31:42,836 --> 00:31:45,316
Speaker 1: you have a psychotic break in that that same sort

582
00:31:45,316 --> 00:31:47,236
Speaker 1: of instance, you talked to your therapist.

583
00:31:47,636 --> 00:31:48,996
Speaker 2: Oh, I talked to her the next day.

584
00:31:49,356 --> 00:31:49,836
Speaker 1: The next time.

585
00:31:50,556 --> 00:31:56,436
Speaker 2: I was like, I was like genuinely was like, Okay,

586
00:31:56,876 --> 00:31:58,836
Speaker 2: it happened now what do I do?

587
00:31:59,516 --> 00:32:00,756
Speaker 1: Yeah, And it was like.

588
00:32:00,756 --> 00:32:02,756
Speaker 2: The first week I would say it's the first weeks,

589
00:32:02,756 --> 00:32:06,236
Speaker 2: maybe first months were the most intense of lockdown. I

590
00:32:06,236 --> 00:32:10,036
Speaker 2: don't remember the exact day, like it was somewhere between

591
00:32:10,036 --> 00:32:14,196
Speaker 2: March Tune somewhere somewhere in those months is when that happened.

592
00:32:15,076 --> 00:32:18,516
Speaker 2: So this experience happened. I felt like I had a

593
00:32:18,556 --> 00:32:22,116
Speaker 2: conversation with God, who is really funny.

594
00:32:22,196 --> 00:32:25,476
Speaker 1: Turns out it's good to know. I'm so happy to

595
00:32:25,516 --> 00:32:25,796
Speaker 1: hear that.

596
00:32:26,476 --> 00:32:29,196
Speaker 2: Thank God, like great sense of humor.

597
00:32:29,436 --> 00:32:31,116
Speaker 1: Thank God, that's that fool.

598
00:32:31,716 --> 00:32:37,316
Speaker 2: And I was so scary that I just like woke

599
00:32:37,396 --> 00:32:39,276
Speaker 2: up the next day and got like I was like

600
00:32:39,396 --> 00:32:42,156
Speaker 2: genuinely scared. I can laugh about it now because I've

601
00:32:42,196 --> 00:32:44,636
Speaker 2: had some distance, but Jesus Christ, So I was so scared.

602
00:32:45,076 --> 00:32:47,316
Speaker 2: And then after she told me that she's like just

603
00:32:47,396 --> 00:32:49,196
Speaker 2: lean into it, it was all very casual.

604
00:32:49,276 --> 00:32:50,196
Speaker 1: I was like, Okay.

605
00:32:50,676 --> 00:32:53,596
Speaker 2: So then I got on a zoom with my mom

606
00:32:53,956 --> 00:32:56,356
Speaker 2: and Stuart Crichton, and I was like, we have to

607
00:32:56,396 --> 00:32:58,676
Speaker 2: write a song about how I thought I was saying

608
00:32:58,716 --> 00:33:04,796
Speaker 2: my mind. But I think I saw allusion of what

609
00:33:05,196 --> 00:33:09,436
Speaker 2: is fall and I realized what love is and the

610
00:33:09,476 --> 00:33:14,156
Speaker 2: only thing that can save us as society is love.

611
00:33:14,836 --> 00:33:17,316
Speaker 2: And there were all these like see what the album

612
00:33:17,396 --> 00:33:20,356
Speaker 2: is gonna be. But it had to start with eth

613
00:33:20,516 --> 00:33:22,916
Speaker 2: acid because my mom told me when I was young

614
00:33:23,556 --> 00:33:28,836
Speaker 2: to never take acid. So to this day, I've never

615
00:33:28,876 --> 00:33:30,356
Speaker 2: taken as you've never taken acid.

616
00:33:30,676 --> 00:33:34,036
Speaker 1: No, I've never taken acid. I'm terrified of it me too.

617
00:33:34,276 --> 00:33:38,116
Speaker 1: Why are you ah, because I have I have mental

618
00:33:38,236 --> 00:33:41,236
Speaker 1: mental in my family. I'm just scaring I'm going to

619
00:33:41,316 --> 00:33:44,036
Speaker 1: turn out like you know, have like a break, you know,

620
00:33:44,156 --> 00:33:48,876
Speaker 1: mushrooms other things fine, but also too long, too long.

621
00:33:48,916 --> 00:33:51,836
Speaker 1: I'm like, you know, it's five six seven hours of

622
00:33:51,876 --> 00:33:52,236
Speaker 1: my time.

623
00:33:52,636 --> 00:33:54,796
Speaker 2: I think we would really get along like off camera

624
00:33:54,796 --> 00:33:56,876
Speaker 2: as well, honestly, because I'm right there with you.

625
00:33:57,076 --> 00:33:59,156
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like, you know, I could you know, noon

626
00:33:59,796 --> 00:34:01,716
Speaker 1: cool and then I can have dinner and be like

627
00:34:02,076 --> 00:34:03,316
Speaker 1: good to go great.

628
00:34:03,116 --> 00:34:06,076
Speaker 2: You know, and get like sleep. Yeah, I don't get

629
00:34:06,516 --> 00:34:10,716
Speaker 2: I like the idea of getting just like like feeling

630
00:34:10,716 --> 00:34:12,676
Speaker 2: a little naughty, like have a glass of wine and

631
00:34:12,796 --> 00:34:16,836
Speaker 2: I'm like okay, I like I like keeping the anchor

632
00:34:17,036 --> 00:34:18,876
Speaker 2: of stability.

633
00:34:18,156 --> 00:34:22,756
Speaker 1: Because I have to, and that's the control. Yeah, probably

634
00:34:22,756 --> 00:34:23,156
Speaker 1: part of.

635
00:34:23,356 --> 00:34:28,836
Speaker 2: Right, totally. I think I cling very very aggressively to

636
00:34:28,916 --> 00:34:31,036
Speaker 2: what I can, which I'm currently in the process of

637
00:34:31,076 --> 00:34:35,916
Speaker 2: trying to loosen the grip because we're not really in

638
00:34:35,996 --> 00:34:40,516
Speaker 2: control of much. Actually, no, that's another illusion. That's another

639
00:34:40,556 --> 00:34:41,756
Speaker 2: illusion I'm trying to get rid of.

640
00:34:42,876 --> 00:34:44,916
Speaker 1: We have to pause for another quick break, and then

641
00:34:44,916 --> 00:34:51,996
Speaker 1: we'll be back with more from Kesha. We're back with

642
00:34:52,036 --> 00:34:54,916
Speaker 1: the rest of my interview with Kasha, and I love

643
00:34:54,956 --> 00:34:57,716
Speaker 1: the outroas I actually wanted to ask you about that.

644
00:34:58,036 --> 00:34:59,436
Speaker 1: In the next life, I want to come back as

645
00:34:59,476 --> 00:35:02,876
Speaker 1: a house cat like that melody. Did it come from something?

646
00:35:03,636 --> 00:35:05,316
Speaker 2: It did? But I want to know what the melody

647
00:35:05,356 --> 00:35:06,396
Speaker 2: reminds you of. First.

648
00:35:07,516 --> 00:35:09,556
Speaker 1: I don't it reminds me one of those like real

649
00:35:09,716 --> 00:35:13,316
Speaker 1: like fifties songs, you know, like Earth Angel or something.

650
00:35:13,316 --> 00:35:14,796
Speaker 1: I don't know why, Like it reminds me of like

651
00:35:14,836 --> 00:35:19,436
Speaker 1: a do Woppy early R and B always been in existence,

652
00:35:19,676 --> 00:35:20,676
Speaker 1: one of those songs, you know.

653
00:35:21,036 --> 00:35:24,516
Speaker 2: Oh cute. I love that. It's totally not what the

654
00:35:24,556 --> 00:35:27,236
Speaker 2: inspiration was. Do you want to know what it is?

655
00:35:27,436 --> 00:35:27,596
Speaker 1: Yeah?

656
00:35:27,716 --> 00:35:30,276
Speaker 2: Or should I just let you live with your fantasy of.

657
00:35:30,316 --> 00:35:32,676
Speaker 1: Part I'll revert back to my mind. Okay, I see,

658
00:35:32,716 --> 00:35:33,276
Speaker 1: But I do want to.

659
00:35:33,276 --> 00:35:36,796
Speaker 2: Know so the end, So the drama. I wanted to

660
00:35:37,636 --> 00:35:41,476
Speaker 2: have one song that is kind of poking fun at

661
00:35:41,596 --> 00:35:47,156
Speaker 2: the fact that, like, we as humans love drama. I

662
00:35:47,196 --> 00:35:49,516
Speaker 2: think it is. I don't know if it's the culture.

663
00:35:49,636 --> 00:35:51,836
Speaker 2: I don't know if it's just part of being a human,

664
00:35:52,396 --> 00:35:55,916
Speaker 2: or maybe it's just me, but people fucking love drama.

665
00:35:55,956 --> 00:35:58,996
Speaker 2: They love bad news, click bait, like everybody loves it

666
00:35:59,036 --> 00:36:02,156
Speaker 2: in their own vein. Like I think about sports teams,

667
00:36:02,236 --> 00:36:03,796
Speaker 2: is that just so you can have a team and

668
00:36:03,796 --> 00:36:06,436
Speaker 2: then fight each other, and then there's drama like the

669
00:36:06,476 --> 00:36:11,356
Speaker 2: Real Housewives of Beverly Hills drama. Politics, to a large part,

670
00:36:11,556 --> 00:36:17,996
Speaker 2: sadly now becoming more about drama. I don't think that's right.

671
00:36:18,716 --> 00:36:21,676
Speaker 2: I think politics should be about politics. But so I

672
00:36:21,716 --> 00:36:26,756
Speaker 2: wanted to kind of compile a song that sounded like

673
00:36:26,956 --> 00:36:32,916
Speaker 2: the psychosis of what the world and what like scrolling

674
00:36:32,956 --> 00:36:40,236
Speaker 2: through TikTok feels like to me, it feels genuinely so

675
00:36:40,476 --> 00:36:46,156
Speaker 2: deranged sometimes where you're like he he, I'm dancing, Oh

676
00:36:46,236 --> 00:36:53,196
Speaker 2: my God, like that constant flow of noise and chaos.

677
00:36:53,516 --> 00:36:56,876
Speaker 2: I wanted this song to be about that, and then

678
00:36:56,956 --> 00:36:59,796
Speaker 2: the outro I wanted it have you ever been to

679
00:36:59,876 --> 00:37:04,876
Speaker 2: Disney land. Okay, So the Housecat, which I wrote with

680
00:37:04,996 --> 00:37:09,236
Speaker 2: Kurt Vile, is for me supposed to sound like and

681
00:37:09,236 --> 00:37:12,316
Speaker 2: you're going on the water ride, the one you're in,

682
00:37:12,396 --> 00:37:15,076
Speaker 2: like the log ride. I don't know what it's called.

683
00:37:15,476 --> 00:37:17,636
Speaker 2: So you're going up and you're passing all these like

684
00:37:17,676 --> 00:37:20,916
Speaker 2: really cute little characters, and there's like a wolf and

685
00:37:20,956 --> 00:37:23,556
Speaker 2: it's a wolf's singing in the corner and he has

686
00:37:23,596 --> 00:37:26,876
Speaker 2: a cauldron foot a bunch of bunnies and it's so cute,

687
00:37:27,036 --> 00:37:30,236
Speaker 2: but it's actually really fucked up, like there's a wolf

688
00:37:30,556 --> 00:37:35,796
Speaker 2: boiling bunnies alive and echoing while you're going. You're going

689
00:37:35,876 --> 00:37:37,876
Speaker 2: up the hill and there's these songs going and they

690
00:37:37,876 --> 00:37:39,956
Speaker 2: start getting faster and then they goes a're getting fat.

691
00:37:40,036 --> 00:37:42,436
Speaker 2: He starts hearing the screams of children.

692
00:37:43,036 --> 00:37:45,356
Speaker 1: And I wanted to end of the song something like that,

693
00:37:45,756 --> 00:37:51,436
Speaker 1: like the screaming of children. No, like the not the ride. Okay,

694
00:37:51,436 --> 00:37:52,276
Speaker 1: I got you on.

695
00:37:52,156 --> 00:37:58,276
Speaker 2: The whole, like the experience of the deranged moment of

696
00:37:58,596 --> 00:38:01,676
Speaker 2: the water ride at Disney when you haven't yet reached

697
00:38:01,796 --> 00:38:04,916
Speaker 2: the top but you're about to free fall.

698
00:38:05,156 --> 00:38:08,356
Speaker 1: I love that. Yep, Why am I? I love them?

699
00:38:08,356 --> 00:38:12,596
Speaker 1: Attractor on this modeled after the deranged experience of scrolling

700
00:38:12,636 --> 00:38:16,996
Speaker 1: TikTok and and you know, the bizarre world of fairy

701
00:38:17,036 --> 00:38:23,156
Speaker 1: tales screaming children. It's such a good song though, thank you. Yeah.

702
00:38:23,196 --> 00:38:25,676
Speaker 1: And there's a couple of there's a couple of moments

703
00:38:25,716 --> 00:38:28,636
Speaker 1: too of them, because I mean, you know, as you said,

704
00:38:28,676 --> 00:38:30,516
Speaker 1: it's like, you know, obviously it's like a heavy listen,

705
00:38:30,556 --> 00:38:33,996
Speaker 1: but it's a couple of songs that are like really

706
00:38:34,076 --> 00:38:39,156
Speaker 1: nice reprieves from kind of like those more tense moments

707
00:38:39,276 --> 00:38:42,116
Speaker 1: about halfway through while I need is you yeah, and

708
00:38:42,156 --> 00:38:44,716
Speaker 1: then and then happy at the end. I mean, it's

709
00:38:44,756 --> 00:38:46,436
Speaker 1: just a great closer.

710
00:38:46,716 --> 00:38:47,196
Speaker 2: Thank you.

711
00:38:47,316 --> 00:38:49,476
Speaker 1: It's a beautiful song, Thank you.

712
00:38:49,596 --> 00:38:56,196
Speaker 2: I really have such protective feeling, you know, I don't

713
00:38:56,196 --> 00:38:59,396
Speaker 2: have kids that are human. I have animals, So it's

714
00:38:59,436 --> 00:39:02,596
Speaker 2: like the only thing I can compare it to. That's

715
00:39:02,636 --> 00:39:05,436
Speaker 2: how I feel protective, or of like what I'm hanging

716
00:39:05,436 --> 00:39:08,796
Speaker 2: out with my brother's kids, Like that's how I feel

717
00:39:08,836 --> 00:39:13,596
Speaker 2: about that song. Yeah, I feel very like maternally protective

718
00:39:13,636 --> 00:39:17,156
Speaker 2: over that because I know that once you've spent your

719
00:39:17,276 --> 00:39:22,276
Speaker 2: life chasing all the things I've chased and accomplishing a

720
00:39:22,316 --> 00:39:26,116
Speaker 2: lot of them, failing miserably and embarrassingly in front of

721
00:39:26,316 --> 00:39:30,076
Speaker 2: a lot of people, over and over and over, buying

722
00:39:30,196 --> 00:39:33,996
Speaker 2: nice houses, going on the vacations, having the hit songs,

723
00:39:34,076 --> 00:39:38,676
Speaker 2: having the not hit songs, the glory and the humiliation.

724
00:39:39,556 --> 00:39:43,796
Speaker 2: After I had this experience I told you about, I

725
00:39:43,876 --> 00:39:47,756
Speaker 2: walked out of this album realizing that now that I've

726
00:39:48,356 --> 00:39:52,196
Speaker 2: trudged through the not only sad, it's not only sad.

727
00:39:52,356 --> 00:39:57,236
Speaker 2: It's just a really contemplative album. And there's moments of fun.

728
00:39:57,276 --> 00:40:00,076
Speaker 2: There's moments of joy, there's moments of anger. There's moments

729
00:40:00,156 --> 00:40:04,876
Speaker 2: of surprise totally, there's moments of what were you surprised

730
00:40:04,876 --> 00:40:05,916
Speaker 2: about them?

731
00:40:05,956 --> 00:40:09,796
Speaker 1: Just certain changes in song, like really honest, there's certain

732
00:40:09,876 --> 00:40:12,756
Speaker 1: changes in song, the brief interludes, like all of a sudden,

733
00:40:13,636 --> 00:40:16,916
Speaker 1: ram Das is in my ear. You know, it's like, oh,

734
00:40:17,036 --> 00:40:21,956
Speaker 1: you know, it just took me to places I wasn't expecting. Yeah.

735
00:40:22,076 --> 00:40:26,636
Speaker 2: I always wonder if, like if people are bummed when

736
00:40:26,676 --> 00:40:32,156
Speaker 2: an artist flips the sonic script on them, because at

737
00:40:32,156 --> 00:40:36,916
Speaker 2: a point you become something that people go to for escapism.

738
00:40:36,996 --> 00:40:39,876
Speaker 2: For me, I feel like a lot of people have

739
00:40:39,956 --> 00:40:43,116
Speaker 2: previously come to me for escapism, which I think is

740
00:40:43,156 --> 00:40:48,796
Speaker 2: an incredibly important thing for humans, but so putting out

741
00:40:48,796 --> 00:40:51,996
Speaker 2: this record, I'm I'm just curious if people like when

742
00:40:52,076 --> 00:40:54,956
Speaker 2: artists do really drastically different stuff.

743
00:40:55,676 --> 00:40:57,516
Speaker 1: It's hard to say that, you know, Like, I'm sure

744
00:40:57,636 --> 00:41:02,316
Speaker 1: you have like super fans from the very beginning, and

745
00:41:02,356 --> 00:41:07,516
Speaker 1: they probably want just that same formula. But I do

746
00:41:07,596 --> 00:41:10,116
Speaker 1: think that even if you gave that fan the same

747
00:41:10,156 --> 00:41:13,756
Speaker 1: thing over and over, they say they want it, but

748
00:41:13,796 --> 00:41:18,396
Speaker 1: they'd probably become bored of it and then they use you.

749
00:41:18,396 --> 00:41:21,076
Speaker 1: You know. It's like you can't win with some people, right.

750
00:41:21,516 --> 00:41:25,196
Speaker 2: Well, I think my like actually surprisingly my super right

751
00:41:25,316 --> 00:41:30,396
Speaker 2: or Die fans, my animals, they're so here for the evolution.

752
00:41:30,676 --> 00:41:34,796
Speaker 2: It's more I think people that maybe have heard a

753
00:41:34,836 --> 00:41:37,956
Speaker 2: song or two of mine, only saw a picture or

754
00:41:37,996 --> 00:41:40,276
Speaker 2: two of me and a video or two, and then

755
00:41:40,316 --> 00:41:43,236
Speaker 2: they're like, the fuck are you doing? Like I kind

756
00:41:43,236 --> 00:41:45,916
Speaker 2: of felt like I had to work through the right

757
00:41:46,036 --> 00:41:48,196
Speaker 2: to make an album like this, But then that's when

758
00:41:48,196 --> 00:41:51,916
Speaker 2: I would channel Beyonce. Yeah, thinking about that album I

759
00:41:51,956 --> 00:41:53,836
Speaker 2: told you about, and I was like, she just like

760
00:41:54,276 --> 00:41:58,676
Speaker 2: made it a piece of amazing art that encapsulates who

761
00:41:58,716 --> 00:42:02,356
Speaker 2: she is. I feel and hear who this woman is.

762
00:42:03,596 --> 00:42:06,036
Speaker 1: I want to do that well, This album's like kind

763
00:42:06,036 --> 00:42:08,796
Speaker 1: of locked me in to Kesha, you know, like I'm

764
00:42:09,196 --> 00:42:09,636
Speaker 1: that like.

765
00:42:09,916 --> 00:42:10,836
Speaker 2: Have you been converted?

766
00:42:11,276 --> 00:42:17,996
Speaker 1: I'm nearly animal, I'm nearly you know, you know I

767
00:42:18,076 --> 00:42:19,796
Speaker 1: might end up there. I would say I was a

768
00:42:19,876 --> 00:42:22,036
Speaker 1: casual listener before and like, but this album is like

769
00:42:22,116 --> 00:42:24,596
Speaker 1: one of those ones that I think if you really

770
00:42:24,836 --> 00:42:28,596
Speaker 1: like music, warrants like a couple of like deep listens.

771
00:42:28,676 --> 00:42:34,036
Speaker 1: You know. It's it's sequenced, beautifully produced beautifully, it's written beautifully.

772
00:42:34,156 --> 00:42:37,636
Speaker 1: You sound great on it. You know. It's like bits

773
00:42:37,636 --> 00:42:39,956
Speaker 1: and pieces of things that I think have come out

774
00:42:39,996 --> 00:42:42,516
Speaker 1: on other albums, and it's like it's like all of

775
00:42:42,556 --> 00:42:46,676
Speaker 1: it finally, all those things that were great in these

776
00:42:46,676 --> 00:42:48,396
Speaker 1: little moments, and it's like, oh, it's now, this is

777
00:42:48,436 --> 00:42:51,036
Speaker 1: all this is the complete thing, this is It's all there.

778
00:42:51,156 --> 00:42:53,956
Speaker 1: You know that that was my experience listening.

779
00:42:54,356 --> 00:42:56,156
Speaker 2: Thank you. I'm going to just accept. I'm going to

780
00:42:56,196 --> 00:42:58,436
Speaker 2: take in the good because I love it. I worked

781
00:42:58,476 --> 00:43:01,476
Speaker 2: really fucking hard on this and I know Rick did too,

782
00:43:01,556 --> 00:43:03,676
Speaker 2: and yeah, so I'm going to take in the good.

783
00:43:03,556 --> 00:43:04,836
Speaker 1: And I know he loves the record too.

784
00:43:05,156 --> 00:43:07,636
Speaker 2: Wait, I want to finish one sentence because I go

785
00:43:07,676 --> 00:43:10,076
Speaker 2: on tangents that I didn't finish, and then my manager's

786
00:43:10,076 --> 00:43:13,636
Speaker 2: going like, yes, what I can carry on for a second,

787
00:43:13,676 --> 00:43:15,236
Speaker 2: but my cat has to go to the set.

788
00:43:15,876 --> 00:43:16,556
Speaker 1: That's important.

789
00:43:16,596 --> 00:43:18,156
Speaker 2: I wrote, All I need is you about him?

790
00:43:19,236 --> 00:43:21,596
Speaker 1: Really? So yeah, wow, it's beautiful.

791
00:43:21,636 --> 00:43:23,876
Speaker 2: I have a necklace with his little name on it.

792
00:43:24,036 --> 00:43:30,196
Speaker 1: What's his name, mister peeps, mister peeps? I love it.

793
00:43:31,356 --> 00:43:37,796
Speaker 1: What a cat you know is miss Okay?

794
00:43:37,876 --> 00:43:42,156
Speaker 2: Yes, let me say by do him hold over? Okay? Sorry?

795
00:43:42,556 --> 00:43:49,236
Speaker 1: Tell me that you'll live forever mister peeps.

796
00:43:49,956 --> 00:43:54,276
Speaker 2: Oh. I think that I had to channel the most sincere,

797
00:43:54,396 --> 00:43:57,116
Speaker 2: pure love I could think of. And Rick was like,

798
00:43:57,156 --> 00:44:00,516
Speaker 2: write it about the love you have for yourself and

799
00:44:00,556 --> 00:44:04,196
Speaker 2: I was like, honey, we're not there yet.

800
00:44:04,476 --> 00:44:06,036
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah, but.

801
00:44:07,756 --> 00:44:10,196
Speaker 2: We're going to start with mister peeps.

802
00:44:10,396 --> 00:44:12,876
Speaker 1: That's like when I do my loving Kindness meditations and

803
00:44:12,916 --> 00:44:15,076
Speaker 1: that you know, they ask you to think about it

804
00:44:15,156 --> 00:44:18,236
Speaker 1: easy love, like nothing complicated. My mom always goes to

805
00:44:18,276 --> 00:44:21,556
Speaker 1: my mom's dog, you know, because it's like how can

806
00:44:21,676 --> 00:44:23,996
Speaker 1: you You just can't. It's like the most goofy little dog

807
00:44:24,076 --> 00:44:25,916
Speaker 1: with like one tooth, and you just like, yeah, I

808
00:44:25,956 --> 00:44:26,756
Speaker 1: get you know, It's.

809
00:44:26,596 --> 00:44:30,716
Speaker 2: Like how can you hate a creature like that? You can't.

810
00:44:30,916 --> 00:44:31,796
Speaker 1: It's impossible.

811
00:44:32,356 --> 00:44:37,356
Speaker 2: But it's like humans are very hateable. Yeah, you have

812
00:44:37,516 --> 00:44:42,156
Speaker 2: one wrong sentence and you could just hate somebody.

813
00:44:42,716 --> 00:44:45,836
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it's we're not We're so complicated, man. There's

814
00:44:45,876 --> 00:44:51,236
Speaker 1: just so much room for misunderstanding and heartbreak and heartache

815
00:44:51,596 --> 00:44:54,556
Speaker 1: and disappointing, you know, in the way that others treat us,

816
00:44:54,596 --> 00:44:56,276
Speaker 1: impact the way that we treat other It's just like

817
00:44:56,356 --> 00:44:57,956
Speaker 1: it's a fucked up cycle, you know.

818
00:44:58,156 --> 00:45:02,476
Speaker 2: One who we are and what we've experienced and mismatch

819
00:45:02,556 --> 00:45:05,596
Speaker 2: with who someone else is and their experience. And it's

820
00:45:05,636 --> 00:45:11,076
Speaker 2: not even an intentionally hateful or negative if person or

821
00:45:11,756 --> 00:45:17,916
Speaker 2: it's just a negative dynamic of a particular two energies

822
00:45:17,916 --> 00:45:19,236
Speaker 2: coming together, you know what I mean.

823
00:45:20,396 --> 00:45:20,636
Speaker 1: Yep.

824
00:45:20,796 --> 00:45:23,636
Speaker 2: A lot of times if I dislike someone, I don't

825
00:45:23,676 --> 00:45:29,436
Speaker 2: hate them. I am sad for what they're either reflecting

826
00:45:29,516 --> 00:45:33,276
Speaker 2: onto me or I'm sad for what they're going through.

827
00:45:33,876 --> 00:45:37,236
Speaker 2: Because usually I've found that when people are hateful to me,

828
00:45:37,596 --> 00:45:40,676
Speaker 2: people that don't know me, I find that I become

829
00:45:40,716 --> 00:45:44,436
Speaker 2: a mirror at times, which has become a big part

830
00:45:44,436 --> 00:45:47,556
Speaker 2: of my job is becoming the mirror and being okay

831
00:45:47,596 --> 00:45:49,836
Speaker 2: with being the mirror. And sometimes people want to punch

832
00:45:49,876 --> 00:45:50,716
Speaker 2: the fucking mirror.

833
00:45:51,756 --> 00:45:57,316
Speaker 1: You know, Yeah, have you long been that and you

834
00:45:57,396 --> 00:46:01,436
Speaker 1: just are realizing it? Or is this like a recent

835
00:46:01,636 --> 00:46:02,836
Speaker 1: sort of I think.

836
00:46:02,676 --> 00:46:05,516
Speaker 2: Like there's an element of always if you're like, you

837
00:46:05,556 --> 00:46:08,276
Speaker 2: don't have to be a singer that puts out records

838
00:46:08,276 --> 00:46:10,876
Speaker 2: and lots of people, not just anybody on Instagram. Like,

839
00:46:10,916 --> 00:46:12,996
Speaker 2: if you're putting your life out there, people are gonna

840
00:46:13,756 --> 00:46:15,556
Speaker 2: If you're in a bad mood and you feel bad

841
00:46:15,556 --> 00:46:19,996
Speaker 2: about yourself and you're on your period and you're breaking out,

842
00:46:20,036 --> 00:46:23,356
Speaker 2: and you're breaking up and like your mom is sick,

843
00:46:23,596 --> 00:46:26,076
Speaker 2: Like there's no way you can look at a picture

844
00:46:26,876 --> 00:46:32,276
Speaker 2: of someone having the time of their life and be like, yes, really,

845
00:46:32,796 --> 00:46:36,916
Speaker 2: I mean maybe some people can, but like at particular

846
00:46:36,956 --> 00:46:40,276
Speaker 2: moments in time, I have a hard time just not

847
00:46:40,996 --> 00:46:43,676
Speaker 2: making that photo about myself.

848
00:46:44,276 --> 00:46:45,676
Speaker 1: Yes, I know what you mean, like.

849
00:46:45,796 --> 00:46:47,756
Speaker 2: Someone else's experience.

850
00:46:47,836 --> 00:46:51,836
Speaker 1: I then internally make aperience where they are. They're creating experience,

851
00:46:51,996 --> 00:46:55,436
Speaker 1: not even not thinking about you, concern not even you're

852
00:46:55,476 --> 00:46:58,276
Speaker 1: not even in the thought process of it, but it

853
00:46:58,316 --> 00:47:01,596
Speaker 1: becomes personal for you because yeah, yeah.

854
00:47:01,316 --> 00:47:03,676
Speaker 2: Going through shit, or if you feel really good and

855
00:47:03,716 --> 00:47:05,996
Speaker 2: you see that same picture, then you're like, fuck, yeah,

856
00:47:06,036 --> 00:47:08,156
Speaker 2: eat it up, live your life. So I think it's

857
00:47:08,276 --> 00:47:10,156
Speaker 2: just yeah, people are complicated.

858
00:47:10,556 --> 00:47:13,116
Speaker 1: It's like The Oh Show says, man, you gotta eliminate jealousy.

859
00:47:13,916 --> 00:47:19,316
Speaker 2: I think that, like I finally overcome that mountain. For me,

860
00:47:20,156 --> 00:47:24,516
Speaker 2: the jealousy was just always thinking that I wasn't good enough.

861
00:47:24,996 --> 00:47:26,876
Speaker 2: So that's where the self love kind of kicked in

862
00:47:26,916 --> 00:47:32,236
Speaker 2: and really helped, because I really think everything and everyone

863
00:47:32,436 --> 00:47:34,156
Speaker 2: is perfect without comparison.

864
00:47:34,476 --> 00:47:39,036
Speaker 1: Comparison is a thief, you know it absolutely?

865
00:47:39,116 --> 00:47:40,676
Speaker 2: Is that a famous quote or did you just make

866
00:47:40,716 --> 00:47:40,956
Speaker 2: that up?

867
00:47:40,996 --> 00:47:43,156
Speaker 1: Believe it's a quote. No, I didn't make that up.

868
00:47:43,236 --> 00:47:43,996
Speaker 1: I believe it's a.

869
00:47:43,956 --> 00:47:48,196
Speaker 2: Quote that's brilliant. Well, especially like I've I've grown up

870
00:47:48,916 --> 00:47:52,676
Speaker 2: in a sphere of pop music. That's my history. That

871
00:47:52,796 --> 00:47:56,196
Speaker 2: is not my present, and that's not my future necessarily,

872
00:47:56,276 --> 00:48:00,436
Speaker 2: I don't know, but growing up in the years of

873
00:48:00,436 --> 00:48:02,596
Speaker 2: people would be in college, but like going to an

874
00:48:02,636 --> 00:48:05,796
Speaker 2: award show and then you get lined up and people

875
00:48:05,876 --> 00:48:10,156
Speaker 2: pick like their favorite but like, they're of the craziest

876
00:48:10,196 --> 00:48:14,076
Speaker 2: things that I've experienced. And I could laugh about it now,

877
00:48:14,116 --> 00:48:16,436
Speaker 2: but at the time it was really hard to Like

878
00:48:16,436 --> 00:48:19,916
Speaker 2: they would line up multiple women's bodies and just compare

879
00:48:20,036 --> 00:48:24,356
Speaker 2: like nose to nose, lips to lips, arm to arm,

880
00:48:24,396 --> 00:48:27,356
Speaker 2: breast to breast, asked to ask like who has the

881
00:48:27,356 --> 00:48:30,876
Speaker 2: best and if you could make the hottest woman, which

882
00:48:30,876 --> 00:48:33,276
Speaker 2: if each of these women would you put together? And

883
00:48:33,356 --> 00:48:36,356
Speaker 2: things like that were just you know, that definitely took

884
00:48:36,356 --> 00:48:39,956
Speaker 2: a toll. It turned into a really severe eating disorder

885
00:48:40,996 --> 00:48:44,356
Speaker 2: because I didn't as all I could control. I felt like, Wow,

886
00:48:45,036 --> 00:48:46,916
Speaker 2: thank god, I'm in a place right now. I'm just like,

887
00:48:47,196 --> 00:48:47,876
Speaker 2: I'm really hot.

888
00:48:47,996 --> 00:48:51,236
Speaker 1: So it's fine, it's beautiful. I'm so glad you're in

889
00:48:51,236 --> 00:48:56,076
Speaker 1: a good place personally and musically, and you're so excited

890
00:48:56,316 --> 00:48:59,636
Speaker 1: You've you've found what you want to do. The first

891
00:49:00,116 --> 00:49:03,556
Speaker 1: the first song of like the you know this is it.

892
00:49:03,556 --> 00:49:05,356
Speaker 2: It's funny that you say you found what I want

893
00:49:05,356 --> 00:49:07,116
Speaker 2: to do. I actually have no idea what I want

894
00:49:07,156 --> 00:49:10,316
Speaker 2: to do. Like this very well might be the last

895
00:49:10,316 --> 00:49:12,476
Speaker 2: song and the last album I ever put out. I

896
00:49:12,476 --> 00:49:17,116
Speaker 2: don't know. I'm letting. I've let go of the control

897
00:49:17,316 --> 00:49:21,476
Speaker 2: of what I think should happen. I'm allowing what is

898
00:49:21,516 --> 00:49:24,596
Speaker 2: going to happen happen. And I'm gonna work really, really

899
00:49:24,636 --> 00:49:29,196
Speaker 2: hard to facilitate safe spaces for all people. That's all.

900
00:49:29,236 --> 00:49:30,676
Speaker 2: I know what I want to do, and I'm not

901
00:49:30,676 --> 00:49:34,716
Speaker 2: sure exactly what that means, but you know, for the summer,

902
00:49:34,796 --> 00:49:36,876
Speaker 2: that means a tour and we'll see where that goes.

903
00:49:37,516 --> 00:49:39,676
Speaker 1: I'm sure your tour will be a safe space for everyone.

904
00:49:39,716 --> 00:49:41,316
Speaker 1: It's gonna beautiful, it's gonna be great.

905
00:49:42,076 --> 00:49:43,636
Speaker 2: It's so fun. You should cut me. You'll have a

906
00:49:43,636 --> 00:49:44,076
Speaker 2: great time.

907
00:49:44,676 --> 00:49:50,756
Speaker 1: I'll come out. I'm gonna be I'll be there. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, Kasha,

908
00:49:50,796 --> 00:49:51,516
Speaker 1: thank you so much.

909
00:49:51,876 --> 00:49:53,076
Speaker 2: Thanks for letting me ramble.

910
00:49:53,316 --> 00:49:56,196
Speaker 1: Yeah, thank you. Go go take care of mister Peeves.

911
00:49:56,636 --> 00:49:58,636
Speaker 2: Thank you. It was really nice to talk to you.

912
00:49:58,836 --> 00:50:05,556
Speaker 1: Yeah. Same, Thanks Takasha for delving into artistic evolution and

913
00:50:05,596 --> 00:50:09,076
Speaker 1: how that influenced the making of her new album, Gaggler.

914
00:50:09,996 --> 00:50:11,876
Speaker 1: You can hear gag Order, along with all of our

915
00:50:11,876 --> 00:50:15,236
Speaker 1: favorite Casher songs, on a playlist at broken record podcast

916
00:50:15,396 --> 00:50:18,676
Speaker 1: dot com. You can subscribe to our YouTube channel at

917
00:50:18,756 --> 00:50:22,156
Speaker 1: YouTube dot com slash broken record Podcast, where you can

918
00:50:22,196 --> 00:50:26,036
Speaker 1: find all of our new episodes. Broken Record is produced

919
00:50:26,036 --> 00:50:30,476
Speaker 1: with help from Leah Rose, Jason Gambrel, Benlliday, Nisha Venkat,

920
00:50:30,796 --> 00:50:35,596
Speaker 1: Jordan McMillan, and Eric Sandler. Our editor is Sophie Crane

921
00:50:36,636 --> 00:50:39,796
Speaker 1: Broken Record is a production of Pushkin Industries. If you

922
00:50:39,876 --> 00:50:42,756
Speaker 1: love this show and others from Pushkin, consider subscribing to

923
00:50:42,956 --> 00:50:47,236
Speaker 1: Pushkin Plus. Pushkin Plus is a podcast subscription service that

924
00:50:47,316 --> 00:50:51,236
Speaker 1: offers bonus content and uninterrupted ad free listening for only

925
00:50:51,316 --> 00:50:54,596
Speaker 1: four ninety nine a month. Look for Pushkin Plus on

926
00:50:54,636 --> 00:50:58,716
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts subscriptions, and if you like the show, remember

927
00:50:58,756 --> 00:51:01,556
Speaker 1: to share, rate, and review us on your podcast stapp

928
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Speaker 1: Our Themes expect Anny Beats on Justin Richmond,