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Speaker 1: You were listening and waiting on reparations. Production of I

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Speaker 1: Heart Radio. Yeah, Yeah, yeah, I walk like a g

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Speaker 1: talk like a wimp, wrappers a feast like lobster and

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Speaker 1: shrimp mac on the track song on the Pimp Medieval

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Speaker 1: Time tells zed get the Gilm out of ship. Don't

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Speaker 1: change is a unity call. When they had their chance,

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Speaker 1: they was building a wall. I ain't shaking no hands.

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Speaker 1: I don't feel them at all. Yo, didn't y'all lose.

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Speaker 1: I don't listen to y'all know. Hey, this is like, well, Franca,

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Speaker 1: I'm dope knife and we are waiting on reparations. Harry,

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Speaker 1: please do so what you got going on on my end?

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Speaker 1: You know, it's UM Black History Month, as we all know,

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Speaker 1: and I'm very pleased that this month, after almost two

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Speaker 1: years of working on UM trying to get reparations for

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Speaker 1: folks displaced by urban renewal here in Athens in the

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Speaker 1: nineteen sixties, is I feel, like I've discussed on previous episodes,

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Speaker 1: we finally have UM resolution UM recognizing the harm that

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Speaker 1: was done to them and their families when the university

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Speaker 1: and the city of Athens conspired to have them moved

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Speaker 1: out of their neighborhood for dormitory expansion in in the

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Speaker 1: nineteen sixties. UM, we're gonna be building a wall of

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Speaker 1: recognition on the site where their neighborhood used to be,

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Speaker 1: so that UM students that traverse that corridor frequently can

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Speaker 1: understand a bit of the history of the land which

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Speaker 1: they stand. And we're hoping it's the beginning of continued

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Speaker 1: work and getting some state laws changed so that we're

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Speaker 1: going to provide some material redress for the losses UM

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Speaker 1: they incurred. These properties that were taken from their families

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Speaker 1: would today be worth hundreds of thousands of dollars, and

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Speaker 1: so thinking about how we can get that money back

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Speaker 1: in their hands and sort of recoup some of the

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Speaker 1: financial losses to stay and as a part of that UM.

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Speaker 1: It's ongoing work, but we're really pleased we finally made

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Speaker 1: it this are and the Mayor of Athens will be

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Speaker 1: reading a proclamation formally apologizing for urban renewal later this month.

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Speaker 1: So we're like not only just talking about black history

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Speaker 1: in terms of forgotten figures in our national historical landscape,

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Speaker 1: but thinking locally about the history of black communities here

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Speaker 1: in Ankananda. Then this month, which I think think it's

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Speaker 1: really exciting and she gotten you know, just chilling living. Oh,

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Speaker 1: my mom's got her first dose of the vaccine, so

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Speaker 1: that's cool. Been making music, oh, speaking of you know,

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Speaker 1: I feel like since we've been doing this, I've been

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Speaker 1: pretty good at being ethical, Like I don't get up

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Speaker 1: here in hawk music at people all the time. But

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Speaker 1: I do have a new song that I'm putting out

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Speaker 1: on the twelfth of February, so I think like next Friday.

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Speaker 1: So that's exciting getting ready for that's doun A little

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Speaker 1: bit about the song. Oh, it's called Sundance. It's a

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Speaker 1: little love song and put know for Valentine's Day, so

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Speaker 1: it's like a wildly off brand. Actually it's it's a

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Speaker 1: funny story behind it. My um there was an ex

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Speaker 1: that I had and I had written it for her.

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Speaker 1: It was like a sweet ass, you know, love song

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Speaker 1: just about our relationship and ship like that, and then

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Speaker 1: we broke up like maybe two weeks after I wrote it,

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Speaker 1: so I never really used it for anything because I

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Speaker 1: was like, man, I don't even feel it into this

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Speaker 1: ship anymore. But next thing you know, it's been like

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Speaker 1: seven or eight years, me and her are still good. Friends,

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Speaker 1: and uh, I don't know how it came up, but

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Speaker 1: I let her hear a demo and she was like,

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Speaker 1: oh yo, why didn't you ever put that out? So

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Speaker 1: you know, she she got on me enough that I

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Speaker 1: ended up rerecording it as part of like all these

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Speaker 1: new songs that I was making, So you know, it's

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Speaker 1: a good, good, different thing to have there. I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: be putting out a lot of ignorant ship afterwards, so

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Speaker 1: it's like a good way to get my feet back

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Speaker 1: into ship. But yeah, and I'm excited about it. Um

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Speaker 1: it's been it's been a minute since I put out

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Speaker 1: some new music, so there's all the excitement that comes

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Speaker 1: with that sort of ship. And I'm gonna start, you know,

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Speaker 1: putting out like songs on the regular while I'm working

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Speaker 1: on an album, you know, just so I'm not inactive

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Speaker 1: and shipped. So it's exciting times for me. I'm excited

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Speaker 1: for people to hear my lockdown raps that I wrote.

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Speaker 1: So that's gonna be February twelfth, and it'll be on

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Speaker 1: all the streaming ship wherever you listen to ship, you'll

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Speaker 1: be able to find it. Alright, let's get to it,

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Speaker 1: So to set up what we're gonna be talking about today,

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Speaker 1: kind of gotta give you a little bit of a

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Speaker 1: backstory as to why I was thinking about this in

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Speaker 1: the first place. So it very much involves recent events

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Speaker 1: and things that are going on in politics right now.

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Speaker 1: So in the wake of the Capital Rights a few

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Speaker 1: weeks ago, while Republican politicians have stood pretty strong by

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Speaker 1: their former disgrace president, there's been a wider public backlash

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Speaker 1: against the Trump Field assault. Not only do a awhelming

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Speaker 1: majority of Americans not support what happened, but fifty eight

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Speaker 1: percent of Americans directly blame Trump according to MPR PBS poll. Now,

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Speaker 1: if you ask ani like meent is not nearly enough,

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Speaker 1: so everyone should be alarmed by that. But um, there

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Speaker 1: is eight percent of Republicans who fully support the ship

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Speaker 1: like they are behind what happened on January six, and

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Speaker 1: apparently that's who elected Republicans in Congress are representing at

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Speaker 1: this point. Regardless, the backlash has been severe for them

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Speaker 1: so far. A lot of America's biggest companies are suspending

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Speaker 1: our Nation to Republican congress members who objected to the

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Speaker 1: Electoral College's votes, including American Express, the Cross Blue Shield, Commerce,

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Speaker 1: bankdal Chemical, Marriott, AIRBNBA, Amazon A, t n D, Comcast, Disney,

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Speaker 1: MasterCard for Google, Facebook, and more. UM. Speaking in Facebook

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Speaker 1: as many of us problem only know social media companies vanished,

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Speaker 1: Trump permanently suspending his Twitter account. He's been kicked off Twitch, YouTube,

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Speaker 1: and Facebook tools like TikTok and others um, though it's

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Speaker 1: unclear the permanence of those suspensions. The conservative alternative for Twitter,

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Speaker 1: Parlor was banished from app stores and essentially rendered inaccessible

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Speaker 1: as it became a cesspool for q and On and

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Speaker 1: Nazis just straight up planning kidnappings and murders out in

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Speaker 1: the open and shipped. Then there was Senator Josh Holly,

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Speaker 1: who was one of the leading members of the Trees

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Speaker 1: and Caucus, who was so upset that he couldn't make

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Speaker 1: black people's votes not count that he just had to

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Speaker 1: help Trump inspire a riot that killed a cop, but

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Speaker 1: he ended up losing his Simon and Schuster's book deal,

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Speaker 1: and he's asked her about that. All this, along with

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Speaker 1: the fact that people who participated in the riots have

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Speaker 1: been getting put on no fly lists, lit their jobs,

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Speaker 1: getting divorced, and ma called terrorists, the American riot has

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Speaker 1: being out a screech about their new favorite part of

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Speaker 1: the culture war inns the culture as I feel, all

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Speaker 1: this accountability is part of arguments that they're being canceled.

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Speaker 1: So today we're gonna be talking about cancel culture, what

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Speaker 1: it is, what it isn't, what we think of it,

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Speaker 1: and what his hip hop's reaction been to it in

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Speaker 1: this new climate that we're in. Later on, we're also

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Speaker 1: going to be chatting with hip hop artists and professor

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Speaker 1: at Bryant and Stranton College and Buffalo, n Y, Chucky Campbell,

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Speaker 1: about his newest album, The Curious Incidents and Cancel Culture,

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Speaker 1: and see if he can help us shed some light

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Speaker 1: on this a little bit. We're gonna get into all

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Speaker 1: of that after the job. Okay, So what is cancel culture. Well,

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Speaker 1: you guys know how I love my Wikipedia results, So

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Speaker 1: let's see what Wikipedia has to say. Okay, So if

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Speaker 1: you search cancel culture in Wikipedia, what it says is

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Speaker 1: cancel culture is a modern form of ostracism in which

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Speaker 1: someone is thrust out of a social or professional circle,

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Speaker 1: either online on social media, in the real world, or both.

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Speaker 1: Those who are subject to this ostracism are said to

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Speaker 1: be canceled. Marion Webster's notes that to cancel, as used

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Speaker 1: in the context, means to stop giving support to that person,

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Speaker 1: while dictionary dot com it says in its pop Cultural

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Speaker 1: Dictionary defines cancel culture as withdrawing support or canceling a

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Speaker 1: public figure and companies after they have done or said

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Speaker 1: something considered objectionable or offensive. The expression cancel culture has

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Speaker 1: mostly negative connotations and is commonly used in debates on

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Speaker 1: free speech and censorship. The notion of cancel culture is

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Speaker 1: a variant of the term call out culture and constitutes

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Speaker 1: a form of boycott involving an individual, usually a celebrity,

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Speaker 1: who is deemed who have acted or spoken in a

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Speaker 1: questionable or controversial manner. For those at the receive even

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Speaker 1: end of cancel culture, the consequences can lead to loss

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Speaker 1: of reputation and income that can be hard to recover from.

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Speaker 1: So that's what you have in on Wikipedia. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I mean, I guess I agree with that. When you know,

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Speaker 1: if I hear the term cancel culture, I imagine that

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Speaker 1: most reasonable people kind of are thinking this when they

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Speaker 1: hear the term cancel culture. I mean, scratch that, I

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Speaker 1: don't even know what people think now. I mean, there's

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Speaker 1: been so much. It's been propagandized so much that it's like,

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Speaker 1: I don't even know what people are thinking. And maybe

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Speaker 1: everyone just like automatically thinks of like screeching hordes of

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Speaker 1: purple haired Antifa or something now because they think of

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Speaker 1: cancel culture people being canceled. I don't know, what do

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Speaker 1: you think about this definition? I feel like, um, the

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Speaker 1: Wikipedia definition of cancel culture does neglect that financial element.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I guess if you're thrust out of your

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Speaker 1: professional circle, with that comes some um financial harm like

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Speaker 1: loss of income, salary. Um we're seeing, you know with

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Speaker 1: the Republican Party, UM, loss of donations from big companies,

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Speaker 1: which actually I want to point out that some of

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Speaker 1: these companies UM have suspended donations all political campaigns. So

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Speaker 1: it's like great collapropment getting money out of politics. But

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Speaker 1: like this both sides is UM, that's a little ridiculous.

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Speaker 1: It's kind of funny, but UM, yeah, I mean I

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Speaker 1: think these are pretty apt to Miriam Webster, you know,

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Speaker 1: stop giving support for that person. Support can be material, social, um,

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Speaker 1: et cetera. Stuff like that gets at it pretty well.

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Speaker 1: I would I would, um say that the key thing

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Speaker 1: that's missing composition is discussion of accountability. That this to

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Speaker 1: me is a form of accountability. UM, that's like, Yo,

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Speaker 1: we're gonna hold you accountable by you know, punishing you

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Speaker 1: for what you've done. It's interesting to me that that

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Speaker 1: accountability is not really included among the way this uh

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Speaker 1: future of our society and media landscape is defined. Conservative

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Speaker 1: political analysts Ross do That wrote a piece for The

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Speaker 1: New York Times titled tenth Thesis about cancel culture, and

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Speaker 1: it's an interesting piece of insight into how traditional conservatives

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Speaker 1: interpreted these things. To his credit, he doesn't frame it

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Speaker 1: as a First Amendment issue, which many conservative types too.

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Speaker 1: Perhaps the most time of thing is what he what

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Speaker 1: he chose as his first thesis. Cancelation he says, properly

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Speaker 1: understood or first to an attack on someone's employment and

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Speaker 1: reputation by a determined collective of critics based on an

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Speaker 1: opinion or an action that it alleged to be disgraceful.

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Speaker 1: It is qualifying. Reputation and appointment are key terms here.

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Speaker 1: You're not simply you're not being hanceled if you um

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Speaker 1: have been canceled, if you're really being heckled or insulted.

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Speaker 1: So like what are your overall it's just your your

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Speaker 1: overall view on cancel culture. I mean, I have interesting

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Speaker 1: thoughts on cancel culture as an abolitionist one that does

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Speaker 1: believe in transformative justice, as a means of holding people

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Speaker 1: accountable for the harm that they do others, but also

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Speaker 1: calling them in to see see what they've done wrong,

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Speaker 1: to understand how they've harmed others, to change their behavior,

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Speaker 1: change their thinking so that they don't harm others in future.

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Speaker 1: And so I worry at times that cancel culture UM

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Speaker 1: replicates like carcero logics, uh, banishing someone just putting them

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Speaker 1: some other place, be in a physical space of a prison,

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Speaker 1: or casting them out of social circle, or you know, uh,

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Speaker 1: UM stripping them of their of their networks. UM. That

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Speaker 1: is ultimately is ultimately harmful. But at the same time,

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Speaker 1: I don't really understand what you I don't really understand

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Speaker 1: what else you can do with some people like UM.

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Speaker 1: Take for example, Marjorie Taylor Green having UM express support

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Speaker 1: for the executions of prominent democratic lawmakers UM and things

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Speaker 1: like that, and seeing how the rhetoric of UM you know,

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Speaker 1: stole an election, inspired a deadly mob then ended up

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Speaker 1: you know, seeing the lives of five people taken that

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Speaker 1: you know, two police officers who took their own lives

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Speaker 1: in the aftermath of the storming of the capitol. Um

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Speaker 1: like the lack of remorse, the lack of self um reflection,

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Speaker 1: willingness to engage in like yeah, like reflection on once actions, uh,

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Speaker 1: resistance to accountability of any kind. Like I really don't

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Speaker 1: understand what else we can do with these people other

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Speaker 1: than like, all right, you're in time out until uh

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Speaker 1: you get your act together, and if you don't, at

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Speaker 1: least you're not enable to continue harming people by having

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Speaker 1: the material resources to um engage in campaigns that you know,

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Speaker 1: wage war on the vulnerable, or you know, having these

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Speaker 1: platforms where you can inspire further violence. Things like that. Like,

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Speaker 1: I really don't know what else we can do. I'm

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Speaker 1: really interested to hear others and read others way in

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Speaker 1: on this From annapoligious perspective, it's like, if somebody really

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Speaker 1: doesn't want to gain accountability, really really doesn't want to

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Speaker 1: engage in process accountability, like what else are you supposed

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Speaker 1: to do with them? So, I mean, I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I don't think it's a bad thing to hold people accountable.

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Speaker 1: I don't think it's I think it can be helpful

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Speaker 1: to inspire that reflection by showing people like your actions

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Speaker 1: have consequences, like you can't have your fancy platform or

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Speaker 1: your a she job if you funk around and hurt people.

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Speaker 1: Um So maybe step back and be listen. All right,

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Speaker 1: this sucks. Um maybe I should think about how all

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Speaker 1: my actions have harmed others. Um So, yeah, I don't

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Speaker 1: really know whether option we have in this day and age,

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Speaker 1: though I do think like engaging with singing around what

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Speaker 1: accountability can look like that brings people in and helps

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Speaker 1: transform your behavior is really important to do. I tend

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Speaker 1: to look at what is the opposite of that. So

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Speaker 1: if there's there's definitely mad instances where quote unquote cancel

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Speaker 1: culture can be like cringe, and there's even some instances

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Speaker 1: where it can kind of be dangerous and can kind

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Speaker 1: of just be like a go with the mob whatever whatever,

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Speaker 1: I'm mad, But the opposite of that is like just

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Speaker 1: straight up bigotry. And you know, so, I don't know,

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Speaker 1: like I can deal with the annoyance and cringe factor

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Speaker 1: better than I could deal with it if just nobody

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Speaker 1: gave a fuck and there was zero accountability for anything. However,

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Speaker 1: I personally don't see the use in using activism or

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Speaker 1: organizational or boycott energy over stupid ship, you know what

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Speaker 1: I'm saying. And amongst stupid ship, I would be like, Yo,

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Speaker 1: why why are we organizing over like who's getting a

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Speaker 1: Netflix special or who's going to be in this movie

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Speaker 1: or who's voicing this character or whatever? You know what

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Speaker 1: I'm saying. It's like, I would rather that energy solely

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Speaker 1: be put to more important ship. And then once we

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Speaker 1: get through the checklist of important ship that we have

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Speaker 1: to do, then I guess we can direct some energy

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Speaker 1: to that. And I know people can chew gum and

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Speaker 1: walk at the same time, so whatever. But again, at

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Speaker 1: the end of the day, that's the aspect of the

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Speaker 1: ship that bothers me is like, damn, you know, y'all

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Speaker 1: are using all this energy over over that ship. But

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Speaker 1: other than that, yeah, it's just it's just annoying. It's

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Speaker 1: not really like I don't see it as a as

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Speaker 1: like this thing that is dominating society and is going

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Speaker 1: to make society collapse. Right by the name of Sarah

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Speaker 1: Hagee wrote an article for Time magazine called Cancel Culture

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Speaker 1: Isn't Real at least not in the way that people think.

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Speaker 1: And she made a pretty good point in this passage

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Speaker 1: here she says the idea is that if you do

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Speaker 1: something that others deemed problematic, you automatically lose all your currency,

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Speaker 1: your voice of silence. You're done. Those who condemn cancel

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Speaker 1: culture usually imply that it's unfair and indiscriminate. The problem

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Speaker 1: with this perspective is cancel culture isn't real, at least

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Speaker 1: not in the way that people believe it is. Instead,

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Speaker 1: it's turned into a catch all for when people in

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Speaker 1: power face consequences for their actions or receive any type

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Speaker 1: of criticism something that they're not used to. And that

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Speaker 1: right there at the heart of it is why I

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Speaker 1: just don't really funk with people who complain about cancel

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Speaker 1: culture like that. And I would disagree with her that

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Speaker 1: it's not necessarily a thing about rich or powerful, it's

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Speaker 1: just people in general, like people are starting to wrap

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Speaker 1: that ship up at any and all criticism. I think

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Speaker 1: um ms Haggy is completely on point with this um

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Speaker 1: it is turning into a catch all for when people

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Speaker 1: in power face any kinds of consequences for their action

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Speaker 1: or receive any type of criticism. UM, Like, I don't

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Speaker 1: know if J. K Rowling has experiencing sort of financial

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Speaker 1: hardship as a result of her transportic comments that have

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Speaker 1: led her to, you know, cry cancelation, Um, like from

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Speaker 1: what I understand, but still that books coming out and ship.

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Speaker 1: So I mean like when people are so Bela getting

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Speaker 1: heckled online as I believe Mr do that was talking

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Speaker 1: about in his New York Times piece, and they want

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Speaker 1: to call it cancelation. It's like yo, Like, still, the

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Speaker 1: internet is a harsh place. You funk around, you find

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Speaker 1: out period. Um. Getting heckled, getting criticized is not is

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Speaker 1: not the same as being deep platform and people need

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Speaker 1: to start stop complaining the two. So I mentioned J.

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Speaker 1: K Rowling, even Murby Atwood, No Chomsky, Gary Kasparov, someone

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Speaker 1: Rushdie and over a hundred and forty other intellectual cultural

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Speaker 1: figures UM signed on an open letter UM called the

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Speaker 1: Letter on Justice and Debate for Harper's Magazine, which criticized

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Speaker 1: the current tour and public shaming and ostracism, ostracism, public

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Speaker 1: shaming and ostracism of those proposing views I e. Canceled culture.

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Speaker 1: But then with the letter, is that caught a lot

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Speaker 1: of it caused a huge cur fluffle at the time,

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Speaker 1: is that there's some dope people who signed it. There's

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Speaker 1: some respect to people, there are some grifters, there's definitely

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Speaker 1: some kuks. The diversity of people signed it was kind

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Speaker 1: of the gimmick of it. Journalist Jeff Yang criticized the letter,

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Speaker 1: writing for CNN dot com, it's hard not to see

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Speaker 1: the letters merely an elegantly written affirmation of elitism and privilege,

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Speaker 1: and he said that the signatories, in the face of

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Speaker 1: result and backlash, dismissed rebuttals and positioned themselves as be

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Speaker 1: leaguered victims of a current culture, turning their support for

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Speaker 1: open debate and free expression into an example of stark

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Speaker 1: hypocrisy or sly gas lighting. Public Seminar criticized the letters timing,

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Speaker 1: stating that the letter primarily blamed cancel culture for disrupting

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Speaker 1: free and open conversation at a moment during the George

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Speaker 1: Floyd protest when it was becoming clear what influences institutions

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Speaker 1: had on controlling the debate. There's a dope article in

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Speaker 1: the Washington Post about the letter by one of the

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Speaker 1: people who signed it, Phoebe Maltz Bovy who also wrote

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Speaker 1: the Perils of Privilege, and she breaks down in a

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Speaker 1: nutshell pretty much what the problem is with the freak

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Speaker 1: out over the cancel culture boogevan, and why it's important

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Speaker 1: you know that regular people don't get caught up in

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Speaker 1: that scene. She describes how she agreed with her understanding

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Speaker 1: of the gist of the letter quote that writer should

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Speaker 1: get to choose their topics and that progressive over correction

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Speaker 1: helps trump all free speech. Sometimes there's as an euthemism

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Speaker 1: for the right to hold forth allah archie bunker. It's

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Speaker 1: being bigger trade from the comfort of an armchair, consequence free.

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Speaker 1: I happen to believe that's all of this, and she continues,

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Speaker 1: but on a more principal level, I credit here was

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Speaker 1: a list made up of largely uncancellables Margaret Atwood, J K.

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Speaker 1: Bowling and high profile and high profile you hold suspects Marklima,

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Speaker 1: Stephen Pinker and yes a few expected and yes a

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Speaker 1: few unexpected names here and there, Noam chom Ski. The

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Speaker 1: message was is sound the messengers as a collective risk

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Speaker 1: obscaring it. I mean, no Times has gotten trouble before

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Speaker 1: for I think defending if I recall correctly a holocaust,

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Speaker 1: and I are not for his beliefs for his right

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Speaker 1: to publish work. Um uh, you know about his beliefs,

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Speaker 1: and so I you know, I wasn't super surprised to

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Speaker 1: see his name there. Oh I don't fucking I don't

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Speaker 1: care about UM. But the thing, it's interesting that like

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Speaker 1: it's like an interesting reflection of like how cancel culture works,

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Speaker 1: where UM people are like on board with the idea

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Speaker 1: until they realize that people are agreeing with them that

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Speaker 1: they don't like UM or it's like oh wait, wait,

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Speaker 1: that person is down with this, that person is now

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Speaker 1: on this, where like cancel culture is okay as long

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Speaker 1: as it's not happening to you or to someone that

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Speaker 1: you agree with. Yeah, funk with that heavy. I mean

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Speaker 1: it's like we all want free and open debate, but

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Speaker 1: it's like I don't wanna just me personally. It's like

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Speaker 1: I don't want to be associated with any whack ship

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Speaker 1: when I'm trying to make like a good point, you

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Speaker 1: know what I'm saying. So I don't know, it's like

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Speaker 1: whatever objections to quote unquote cancel culture that I may have,

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Speaker 1: it's like I don't want to express that ship because

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Speaker 1: I don't want to be fucking associated with Ben Shapiro

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Speaker 1: or Dave Ruben like that if you you listen to

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Speaker 1: those motherfucker's like, cancel culture is worse than fucking climate

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Speaker 1: change and ship. So it's like when they're mucking up

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Speaker 1: that argument against it, it's like, you know, it's not

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Speaker 1: really that important enough an argument for you to make.

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Speaker 1: I'm just gonna sit this one out. So today we

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Speaker 1: are talking with a good friend of mine, Chucky Campbell.

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Speaker 1: He is a professor at the Bryant and Stratton College

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Speaker 1: and buff Low and Why, where he teaches media and ethics,

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Speaker 1: public speaking, information, literacy, learning, communities, and almost any other

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Speaker 1: writing and communication course at the college. He has a

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Speaker 1: PhD in English Literature, Creative Writing, and Composition Rhetoric from

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Speaker 1: the University of Southern Mississippi. He's the winner of the

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Speaker 1: Eastern Kentucky University Fiction Award, uh the Julia Visor Award

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Speaker 1: presented by the National College Learning Center and Association, and

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Speaker 1: numerous other awards. He's also a national touring hip hop artists.

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Speaker 1: Who's the newest album, Curious Incidents in Cancel Culture? That's

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Speaker 1: out right now? How are you doing, Chucky? I'm doing well.

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Speaker 1: Thank you guys for inviting me on. Yeah, it's great

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Speaker 1: to have you. Good to have you. How are you

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Speaker 1: holding up in these times? Um about like everybody else,

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Speaker 1: very confused about the strange things happening. But uh, for

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Speaker 1: the most part, I'm doing well well. I mean I'm

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Speaker 1: We're always curious as to, you know, people who are

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Speaker 1: working artists and things like at to how the new

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Speaker 1: way of life as it is is like affected your

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Speaker 1: craft and what you've been doing and how you have

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Speaker 1: to change things up. UM. Well, for somebody who's been

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Speaker 1: supported by the gig economy for so many years and

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Speaker 1: relied so heavily on live shows and live events, UM,

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Speaker 1: it's been troubling trying to put together things to coordinate people,

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Speaker 1: and UM it shifted everything online. A lot of my uh,

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Speaker 1: I would say, other work in terms of education, UM

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Speaker 1: is all remote learning. So that's a that's definitely a

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Speaker 1: shift and a change. And it's shifted the way I

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Speaker 1: do art out of the live environment, less of a

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Speaker 1: performance space and more into the virtual world. So I've

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Speaker 1: had to adjust to some of that. How in your

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Speaker 1: experience with remote learning, if at all, have you encountered, um,

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Speaker 1: issues of educational equity with different folks access to things

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Speaker 1: like odd Brand and now down here UM in Georgia.

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Speaker 1: I've had a number of students who come from rural

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Speaker 1: areas and have had to like sit in the parking

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Speaker 1: lot of the McDonald's to get WiFi to attend the

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Speaker 1: synchronous portions of our teaching. And I was wondering if

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Speaker 1: you had experienced anything similar with your UM past remote

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Speaker 1: learning during this time as well. Absolutely, I have a

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Speaker 1: lot of students that, especially if you come from a

426
00:26:27,200 --> 00:26:32,120
Speaker 1: disadvantaged background or low income background, you have less access

427
00:26:32,200 --> 00:26:36,720
Speaker 1: to technology, less access to the internet, and uh, a

428
00:26:36,760 --> 00:26:40,159
Speaker 1: lot of those students have been forced to try to

429
00:26:40,200 --> 00:26:45,160
Speaker 1: find different methods um of joining in in remote learning.

430
00:26:45,280 --> 00:26:48,080
Speaker 1: In terms of the college, the college is offered some

431
00:26:49,200 --> 00:26:53,600
Speaker 1: laptops and things of that nature to try to help

432
00:26:53,680 --> 00:26:58,119
Speaker 1: those students out, but unfortunately there's only so much you

433
00:26:58,200 --> 00:27:02,080
Speaker 1: can do, especially and a lot of your students are

434
00:27:02,480 --> 00:27:06,240
Speaker 1: from the background and from places like my students come from.

435
00:27:06,920 --> 00:27:10,280
Speaker 1: And uh, what you were talking about in terms of

436
00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:12,639
Speaker 1: rule environments, a lot of those same things carry over

437
00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:17,800
Speaker 1: to more urban city based environments as well. So just

438
00:27:17,960 --> 00:27:20,639
Speaker 1: to backtrack a little bit, so could you tell us

439
00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:23,879
Speaker 1: a little a little about your your story as it were,

440
00:27:24,000 --> 00:27:27,359
Speaker 1: because you're you're hip hop artists, your professor. So how

441
00:27:27,440 --> 00:27:31,600
Speaker 1: did that come about? Um? So, I'm I'm basically a

442
00:27:31,680 --> 00:27:35,400
Speaker 1: child of hip hop. Hip hop raised me so to speak, um,

443
00:27:36,920 --> 00:27:39,320
Speaker 1: and I grew up with it. It was initially you know,

444
00:27:39,440 --> 00:27:43,240
Speaker 1: I'm from a low income, high crime environment. Um, I

445
00:27:43,359 --> 00:27:48,040
Speaker 1: grew up and uh spaces besides the color of my skin,

446
00:27:48,680 --> 00:27:53,600
Speaker 1: I really um, it wasn't in a privileged environment. Um.

447
00:27:54,080 --> 00:27:58,200
Speaker 1: And so hip hop was like my access to learning

448
00:27:58,240 --> 00:28:01,120
Speaker 1: about my voice, my entrance into the world of ideas.

449
00:28:01,600 --> 00:28:04,000
Speaker 1: It was like the reason I wanted to read books

450
00:28:04,119 --> 00:28:08,480
Speaker 1: and challenge my thoughts, challenged myself with thoughts that were

451
00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:13,679
Speaker 1: just not readily available to me, I would say at

452
00:28:13,720 --> 00:28:19,679
Speaker 1: that moment. Um. So, I started out like in Kentucky. Actually,

453
00:28:19,840 --> 00:28:22,720
Speaker 1: like I'm from Richmond, Kentucky. Um and I used to

454
00:28:23,320 --> 00:28:26,200
Speaker 1: with one of my friends, traveled down and participate in

455
00:28:26,240 --> 00:28:29,960
Speaker 1: some of the mic battles. And uh, that's how I

456
00:28:30,080 --> 00:28:32,840
Speaker 1: really kind of was ushered into hip hop. It was

457
00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:35,879
Speaker 1: a community, um that I was just a part of

458
00:28:36,320 --> 00:28:37,960
Speaker 1: in that kind of way of life, a way of

459
00:28:38,240 --> 00:28:41,800
Speaker 1: learning how to speak and talk and walk and you know,

460
00:28:42,080 --> 00:28:45,080
Speaker 1: as I got older, you know, it became something else

461
00:28:45,160 --> 00:28:47,400
Speaker 1: to me. I was not just a student of it.

462
00:28:47,520 --> 00:28:51,480
Speaker 1: I became someone who also wanted to get back to it. So, like,

463
00:28:51,680 --> 00:28:54,720
Speaker 1: what what type of what what artists were you listening

464
00:28:54,760 --> 00:28:57,840
Speaker 1: to around that time? A lot of different ones because

465
00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:00,600
Speaker 1: I was, I guess Kentucky is a strange place. It's

466
00:29:00,640 --> 00:29:02,240
Speaker 1: like not in the South, and it's not in the North.

467
00:29:02,360 --> 00:29:06,360
Speaker 1: It's like kind of not even Midwest either. So, um,

468
00:29:07,320 --> 00:29:10,880
Speaker 1: I was listening to everything you know coming up. Um,

469
00:29:11,080 --> 00:29:15,320
Speaker 1: everything from like Tupac and Biggie two, Outcast Too, No

470
00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:19,320
Speaker 1: Limit to Freestyle Fellowship two. I mean, it was just

471
00:29:19,440 --> 00:29:22,640
Speaker 1: so many different influences coming together. Um, there were a

472
00:29:22,680 --> 00:29:24,840
Speaker 1: lot of like strict lines and divides in our hip

473
00:29:24,880 --> 00:29:28,920
Speaker 1: hop community because um, a lot of those people who

474
00:29:29,000 --> 00:29:31,560
Speaker 1: kind of are part of those different factions don't get along.

475
00:29:35,000 --> 00:29:37,000
Speaker 1: What I mean is that all like it all converges

476
00:29:37,160 --> 00:29:40,560
Speaker 1: in Kentucky like this was there is there no strong

477
00:29:40,720 --> 00:29:43,280
Speaker 1: was there no strong local scene at the time. There

478
00:29:43,480 --> 00:29:46,600
Speaker 1: was there was a strong local scene, but there were

479
00:29:46,680 --> 00:29:50,560
Speaker 1: hard lines that divided it. So a lot of the

480
00:29:51,680 --> 00:29:53,920
Speaker 1: a lot of the scene that was in coming out

481
00:29:53,960 --> 00:29:55,880
Speaker 1: of Lexington. You would have a lot of like really

482
00:29:55,960 --> 00:29:59,880
Speaker 1: really strong down South rap, you know, a lot of

483
00:30:00,040 --> 00:30:03,920
Speaker 1: then the I would say vogue of say like no

484
00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:07,360
Speaker 1: Limit Cash Money records. And then on the other side

485
00:30:07,400 --> 00:30:11,800
Speaker 1: of that you had some very heavily like Wootang East

486
00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:16,400
Speaker 1: Coast influenced music. And those two groups, while they were

487
00:30:16,560 --> 00:30:19,960
Speaker 1: part of the same community, didn't necessarily, um talk to

488
00:30:20,000 --> 00:30:22,680
Speaker 1: each other collaborate very much, so there wasn't a lot

489
00:30:22,720 --> 00:30:27,040
Speaker 1: of like cross pollination between those two styles. Yeah, those

490
00:30:27,040 --> 00:30:32,360
Speaker 1: two bases, it kind of divided the community. So Okay,

491
00:30:32,760 --> 00:30:36,160
Speaker 1: So at this time, hip hop captures your imagination and

492
00:30:36,800 --> 00:30:38,760
Speaker 1: you're kind of learning about your voice through it. So

493
00:30:38,840 --> 00:30:42,360
Speaker 1: then what makes you actually pick up the pen and

494
00:30:42,400 --> 00:30:45,800
Speaker 1: the mic and start rapping. I had a friend, Dame

495
00:30:45,960 --> 00:30:50,840
Speaker 1: Ralph prador Uh, and he was in a group called

496
00:30:50,880 --> 00:30:54,680
Speaker 1: Microphone Microphone Fanatics at that time, and they were collaborating

497
00:30:54,680 --> 00:30:58,160
Speaker 1: with another group named Mad Militia and Lexington and UM.

498
00:30:59,320 --> 00:31:01,800
Speaker 1: I went to some battles with him, and then when

499
00:31:01,800 --> 00:31:04,200
Speaker 1: I got like kind of brave enough to step on

500
00:31:04,320 --> 00:31:07,920
Speaker 1: stage and do my own thing, UM because he kind

501
00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:10,920
Speaker 1: of pushed me into that, UM, I found out that

502
00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:15,840
Speaker 1: it was something that I really liked. UM after kind

503
00:31:15,840 --> 00:31:18,920
Speaker 1: of that cultivated itself, me and Ralph started doing projects together,

504
00:31:19,840 --> 00:31:25,360
Speaker 1: and uh, that grew its own legs in a certain way. Um,

505
00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:29,920
Speaker 1: it wouldn't be too many years later that I would

506
00:31:30,160 --> 00:31:33,880
Speaker 1: start releasing stuff like publicly and it was first under

507
00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:38,719
Speaker 1: a moniker named soul Asleep. Um, it was the when

508
00:31:38,760 --> 00:31:40,520
Speaker 1: I first started putting out music. No one knew me

509
00:31:40,560 --> 00:31:44,600
Speaker 1: as Chucky Campbell. So so I mean if you were

510
00:31:44,640 --> 00:31:46,960
Speaker 1: doing all of that at the same time that you know,

511
00:31:47,040 --> 00:31:50,960
Speaker 1: obviously you were getting yourself educated and ready to like

512
00:31:51,680 --> 00:31:54,560
Speaker 1: get into the career path that you're in. So was

513
00:31:54,640 --> 00:31:56,240
Speaker 1: that something that you always knew was going to be

514
00:31:56,280 --> 00:31:59,240
Speaker 1: the case? The joys know, you were gonna be putting

515
00:31:59,320 --> 00:32:04,080
Speaker 1: as much time and effort into your music as you

516
00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:09,280
Speaker 1: were as you are your your teaching career. Um, not

517
00:32:09,400 --> 00:32:11,600
Speaker 1: really at all. I mean at first, I mean, like

518
00:32:11,680 --> 00:32:14,000
Speaker 1: a lot of people that come from like local, low income,

519
00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:19,720
Speaker 1: high crime environments, like I really wasn't into um my

520
00:32:19,960 --> 00:32:23,080
Speaker 1: education very young. I came from a public school that

521
00:32:23,280 --> 00:32:27,880
Speaker 1: was really not funded well, um, and it had its

522
00:32:27,920 --> 00:32:30,560
Speaker 1: own issues, you know, And so I didn't have a

523
00:32:30,600 --> 00:32:33,880
Speaker 1: lot of people on that side of education, and that

524
00:32:34,120 --> 00:32:36,880
Speaker 1: was that were influencing me and valued what I was doing.

525
00:32:37,040 --> 00:32:42,120
Speaker 1: So initially gravitated towards athletics. So I was a basketball player,

526
00:32:42,840 --> 00:32:45,800
Speaker 1: and uh I earned a scholarship to play basketball at

527
00:32:45,840 --> 00:32:49,760
Speaker 1: Lee University. UM I played four years of college basketball there,

528
00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:53,960
Speaker 1: um and then after that for a very short stint

529
00:32:54,200 --> 00:32:58,840
Speaker 1: some professional basketball before my knee. And then when I

530
00:32:58,960 --> 00:33:02,160
Speaker 1: came back after my knee injury, UM, I had at

531
00:33:02,240 --> 00:33:04,760
Speaker 1: that time kind of been balancing my academic life with

532
00:33:05,280 --> 00:33:08,040
Speaker 1: hip hop and rap music. So I had dropped like

533
00:33:08,120 --> 00:33:12,160
Speaker 1: a couple of EPs, and they had did um I

534
00:33:12,240 --> 00:33:16,040
Speaker 1: guess pretty well at that time for what for the

535
00:33:16,160 --> 00:33:20,920
Speaker 1: kind of industry that there was for independent art, And

536
00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:23,160
Speaker 1: so I decided when I came back after I hurt

537
00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:25,080
Speaker 1: my knee, that I was gonna move to Nashville, Tennessee

538
00:33:25,880 --> 00:33:28,480
Speaker 1: without producer. And we lived there for about a year,

539
00:33:29,800 --> 00:33:32,480
Speaker 1: and um, so I ran out of money. So I

540
00:33:32,560 --> 00:33:35,720
Speaker 1: ran out all the money that I had professionally and

541
00:33:36,320 --> 00:33:39,840
Speaker 1: built up from playing basketball. And then so when we

542
00:33:39,920 --> 00:33:43,760
Speaker 1: were forced to go back to Kentucky together, I was

543
00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:47,240
Speaker 1: there probably for about five or six months before Ralph

544
00:33:47,680 --> 00:33:50,880
Speaker 1: had moved back from Seattle, Washington, and so me and

545
00:33:50,960 --> 00:33:53,280
Speaker 1: Ralph were talking about doing some stuff again, forming a

546
00:33:53,680 --> 00:33:58,920
Speaker 1: live band and doing hip hop together. And um, then

547
00:33:59,320 --> 00:34:03,360
Speaker 1: there was and um an issue between me and Ralph.

548
00:34:03,400 --> 00:34:04,760
Speaker 1: I don't know if you want me to tell that story,

549
00:34:04,800 --> 00:34:08,720
Speaker 1: but my um, my job was broken in two places,

550
00:34:08,800 --> 00:34:11,040
Speaker 1: so I have two metal plates in my face. UM,

551
00:34:11,360 --> 00:34:17,080
Speaker 1: and uh that with the doctors. Initially after that happened,

552
00:34:17,120 --> 00:34:18,439
Speaker 1: they told me I was not going to be able

553
00:34:18,480 --> 00:34:23,799
Speaker 1: to rap again. So I stopped rapping for like seven years. Um.

554
00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:26,840
Speaker 1: And during that time, my mother kind of helped me

555
00:34:27,200 --> 00:34:31,160
Speaker 1: condition myself where I was able to articulate and speak

556
00:34:31,160 --> 00:34:34,719
Speaker 1: again in a somewhat normal fashion. Most people can't tell

557
00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:38,160
Speaker 1: that I've ever had that happened to me now, UM,

558
00:34:39,440 --> 00:34:41,680
Speaker 1: but yeah, I wouldn't. I went off after that and

559
00:34:41,800 --> 00:34:44,120
Speaker 1: channeled all that creative energy, went back to school d

560
00:34:44,200 --> 00:34:48,719
Speaker 1: Skentuck University, got my masters, and then uh won some

561
00:34:48,840 --> 00:34:55,000
Speaker 1: awards and did some did some work in academia, and

562
00:34:55,120 --> 00:34:58,040
Speaker 1: then decided that I wanted to continue that work is

563
00:34:58,320 --> 00:35:00,560
Speaker 1: teaching English as a second language. So I moved to

564
00:35:00,680 --> 00:35:05,680
Speaker 1: China for price six to eight months and taught in

565
00:35:05,840 --> 00:35:09,799
Speaker 1: Beijing and Hining and Shanghai, and then I got into

566
00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:13,480
Speaker 1: a PhD program. How was the time that you spent overseas. Oh,

567
00:35:13,560 --> 00:35:16,239
Speaker 1: it was fun. I enjoyed it very much. That I

568
00:35:16,400 --> 00:35:19,279
Speaker 1: was learning some Mandarin Chinese at the time. It was

569
00:35:19,360 --> 00:35:22,920
Speaker 1: like a language program, exchange program. And uh, A lot

570
00:35:22,960 --> 00:35:24,560
Speaker 1: of the kids that we were teaching, we were teaching

571
00:35:24,680 --> 00:35:28,200
Speaker 1: language English, language through English by our American culture, I

572
00:35:28,200 --> 00:35:30,880
Speaker 1: would say. And uh, a lot of the kids were

573
00:35:31,000 --> 00:35:35,560
Speaker 1: very young, you know, elementary UM or middle school. So

574
00:35:35,800 --> 00:35:38,600
Speaker 1: with the things that you learned and experience being an

575
00:35:38,760 --> 00:35:42,960
Speaker 1: m C and performing and you know, talking to crowds

576
00:35:43,040 --> 00:35:45,880
Speaker 1: of people or even just putting ideas out there for

577
00:35:45,920 --> 00:35:48,640
Speaker 1: people to respond to, does any of that translate into

578
00:35:48,719 --> 00:35:51,640
Speaker 1: being an educator? Oh? Yeah, I think I've almost learned

579
00:35:52,239 --> 00:35:56,120
Speaker 1: the backward you know, like it was almost like him

580
00:35:56,160 --> 00:35:58,480
Speaker 1: seeing was what taught me how to teach instead of

581
00:35:58,600 --> 00:36:03,200
Speaker 1: like teaching help my m seeing out. So it was

582
00:36:03,280 --> 00:36:09,400
Speaker 1: like kind of learning to project my voice learning. Uh,

583
00:36:09,920 --> 00:36:14,759
Speaker 1: authenticity leads to true authority. Um. You know, some of

584
00:36:14,840 --> 00:36:18,560
Speaker 1: the values that carry over and in the culture of

585
00:36:18,640 --> 00:36:21,479
Speaker 1: hip hop work well in the classroom, and they also

586
00:36:21,560 --> 00:36:26,719
Speaker 1: work well to inspire especially kids that have been kind

587
00:36:26,760 --> 00:36:31,239
Speaker 1: of um have troubled educational histories or backgrounds that don't

588
00:36:31,320 --> 00:36:38,440
Speaker 1: necessarily lend themselves to um to wanting to read literature

589
00:36:38,719 --> 00:36:44,640
Speaker 1: or engage and uh and some more academic kinds of activities.

590
00:36:46,280 --> 00:36:48,880
Speaker 1: So I think that hip hop is kind of what

591
00:36:49,040 --> 00:36:51,920
Speaker 1: taught me about community and what allows people to come

592
00:36:51,960 --> 00:36:56,480
Speaker 1: together and and stitch those uh, those ideas into one thing.

593
00:36:57,480 --> 00:37:01,480
Speaker 1: Do hip hop texts or practices of wreck? I'm into uh,

594
00:37:02,480 --> 00:37:07,400
Speaker 1: composition classrooms in terms of analysis or is a jumping

595
00:37:07,440 --> 00:37:10,880
Speaker 1: off place to discuss um social issues or anything like

596
00:37:10,960 --> 00:37:14,239
Speaker 1: that all the time. I use Kindrick Lamar a whole

597
00:37:14,280 --> 00:37:19,399
Speaker 1: lot um. I use Lauren Hill a whole whole lot um.

598
00:37:20,960 --> 00:37:25,080
Speaker 1: Who's some other people. Recently I've used Blueprint and some

599
00:37:25,239 --> 00:37:29,640
Speaker 1: of his music. He has a song called Perspective that

600
00:37:29,840 --> 00:37:34,880
Speaker 1: is a really good one. Um lupe Fiasco. He has

601
00:37:34,880 --> 00:37:38,360
Speaker 1: a song named Jennala Forever which is pretty like craftably

602
00:37:38,520 --> 00:37:43,360
Speaker 1: written and uh. We use that in terms of understanding reading,

603
00:37:43,440 --> 00:37:47,080
Speaker 1: not just as words on a page, but reading in

604
00:37:47,160 --> 00:37:51,320
Speaker 1: a more uh kind of critical thinking, since seeing the

605
00:37:51,400 --> 00:37:56,319
Speaker 1: deep structure of things understanding that meaning often is kind

606
00:37:56,360 --> 00:38:01,880
Speaker 1: of like him hemming ways iceberg theory, like, so the

607
00:38:01,960 --> 00:38:04,680
Speaker 1: top and tip of the iceberg is what you see,

608
00:38:04,800 --> 00:38:07,400
Speaker 1: but most of the meaning lies beneath it, and that

609
00:38:07,520 --> 00:38:11,560
Speaker 1: meets kind of hand in hand theoretically with another communication

610
00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:16,080
Speaker 1: theorist that I implement, Michael Polani, who talks about communication

611
00:38:16,160 --> 00:38:19,040
Speaker 1: has a tacit dimension where we often when we speak,

612
00:38:19,080 --> 00:38:20,600
Speaker 1: we mean more than we say, and we say more

613
00:38:20,640 --> 00:38:23,560
Speaker 1: than we mean. So I kind of take those kinds

614
00:38:23,600 --> 00:38:32,080
Speaker 1: of propositions into the classroom. Um. That's especially true of

615
00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:35,520
Speaker 1: hip hop, the way we sort of circumlow qute through

616
00:38:35,680 --> 00:38:40,160
Speaker 1: metaphor and through um slang and stuff like that, sort

617
00:38:40,200 --> 00:38:42,600
Speaker 1: of obscuring the meeting, so that we do have this

618
00:38:43,000 --> 00:38:47,040
Speaker 1: tip of an iceberg that is um very aesthetic. But

619
00:38:47,200 --> 00:38:50,439
Speaker 1: what do you you know, do repeated listens or sort

620
00:38:50,480 --> 00:38:52,960
Speaker 1: of breakdown what people are saying. There's a lot more

621
00:38:53,080 --> 00:38:56,840
Speaker 1: meaning there. Um. So there's a lot of rich potential

622
00:38:56,960 --> 00:39:01,520
Speaker 1: for um exploration of hip obtects in the classroom generally.

623
00:39:01,640 --> 00:39:04,279
Speaker 1: But interesting to hear what a particular artists have come

624
00:39:04,320 --> 00:39:08,120
Speaker 1: into play in your classrooms specifically. Right. I also think

625
00:39:08,200 --> 00:39:12,560
Speaker 1: it's important that I have students that are performatively kind

626
00:39:12,600 --> 00:39:17,080
Speaker 1: of expressing themselves through not just rap music but the

627
00:39:17,160 --> 00:39:19,560
Speaker 1: culture of hip hop in the classroom as well. You know,

628
00:39:19,719 --> 00:39:22,680
Speaker 1: like so It's not as if I'm kind of just

629
00:39:22,880 --> 00:39:27,400
Speaker 1: using hip hop as a bridge. I'm actually giving hip

630
00:39:27,440 --> 00:39:30,080
Speaker 1: hop a voice in the classroom, you know. So it's

631
00:39:30,120 --> 00:39:32,759
Speaker 1: not that I'm forcing them into academic culture. It has

632
00:39:32,800 --> 00:39:35,799
Speaker 1: to be a gateway instead. Academic culture and hip hop

633
00:39:36,040 --> 00:39:39,560
Speaker 1: don't have to contradict themselves. You So, now, like that

634
00:39:39,680 --> 00:39:41,279
Speaker 1: is kind of a question for both of you, because

635
00:39:41,600 --> 00:39:44,520
Speaker 1: y'all are two people who I know personally in my

636
00:39:44,640 --> 00:39:47,560
Speaker 1: life who are to teach and do hip hop. So

637
00:39:47,680 --> 00:39:51,680
Speaker 1: do you guys like see even broader use for hipolo?

638
00:39:51,719 --> 00:39:55,320
Speaker 1: Do you think that that, um, there's a more of

639
00:39:55,360 --> 00:39:59,799
Speaker 1: a there's a more of an opportunity for teachers who

640
00:39:59,840 --> 00:40:03,880
Speaker 1: have of backgrounds like you guys to utilize just different

641
00:40:03,920 --> 00:40:06,719
Speaker 1: aspects of hip hop to like, you know, get messages

642
00:40:06,880 --> 00:40:10,239
Speaker 1: across into more effectively teach classes. Like does it work

643
00:40:10,280 --> 00:40:14,120
Speaker 1: that way? Is there any yes? For sure? I mean,

644
00:40:14,600 --> 00:40:16,839
Speaker 1: I mean, my whole I don't know if you've talked

645
00:40:16,880 --> 00:40:19,800
Speaker 1: about this techy, but my whole dissertation is on like

646
00:40:19,880 --> 00:40:23,120
Speaker 1: hip hop paedagogy and like the many decades of research

647
00:40:23,200 --> 00:40:25,520
Speaker 1: people have put in to look at how we can

648
00:40:25,719 --> 00:40:30,880
Speaker 1: use um poetic devices within hip hop to teach poetic

649
00:40:30,960 --> 00:40:34,960
Speaker 1: devices and Shakespeare to use hip hop to respond to literature,

650
00:40:35,520 --> 00:40:39,840
Speaker 1: so giving students the opportunity to respond to works of

651
00:40:40,040 --> 00:40:43,560
Speaker 1: art and using wrap as well as practices or you know,

652
00:40:43,760 --> 00:40:47,000
Speaker 1: mind states akin to like being in the cipher for example,

653
00:40:47,200 --> 00:40:49,680
Speaker 1: some way to structure dialogue in the classroom to both

654
00:40:49,760 --> 00:40:52,040
Speaker 1: like the use of hip hop text and then the

655
00:40:52,560 --> 00:40:55,800
Speaker 1: hip hop practices more broadly with regards to like stance

656
00:40:55,840 --> 00:40:59,920
Speaker 1: as we take or um sort of activities we engage

657
00:41:00,040 --> 00:41:02,319
Speaker 1: in to build community as as you were kind of saying,

658
00:41:02,400 --> 00:41:07,239
Speaker 1: checky um. But I but I guess the problem we've

659
00:41:07,280 --> 00:41:10,880
Speaker 1: seen in the research of that very often times these

660
00:41:10,960 --> 00:41:14,720
Speaker 1: practices of pedagogy are taken up by hip hop heads

661
00:41:15,160 --> 00:41:18,960
Speaker 1: and not as frequently actual hip hop practitioners as it were,

662
00:41:19,120 --> 00:41:23,359
Speaker 1: like folks like Chuckie and I um and so uh.

663
00:41:23,719 --> 00:41:26,080
Speaker 1: It is interesting to hear from someone that does do

664
00:41:26,280 --> 00:41:31,040
Speaker 1: hip hop what that looks like for them in their classroom, right.

665
00:41:31,080 --> 00:41:34,320
Speaker 1: And I think it doesn't just extend to education. I

666
00:41:34,400 --> 00:41:37,120
Speaker 1: think it speaks to the importance of civil discourse and

667
00:41:37,200 --> 00:41:40,680
Speaker 1: what education where those two lines come to come together

668
00:41:40,880 --> 00:41:44,520
Speaker 1: or overlap, you know, I mean hip hop as even

669
00:41:44,600 --> 00:41:47,840
Speaker 1: what Mariah has done, you know politically, you know, the

670
00:41:48,800 --> 00:41:53,319
Speaker 1: it trains you and conditions you for those places once

671
00:41:53,400 --> 00:41:57,680
Speaker 1: you evolve to to take them on, you know. So

672
00:41:57,840 --> 00:42:00,920
Speaker 1: it's it's a place, it's where, like I mean, it

673
00:42:01,000 --> 00:42:03,880
Speaker 1: doesn't prepare you completely for all the things that are

674
00:42:03,920 --> 00:42:08,399
Speaker 1: gonna happen to you, um once you take that spot. Um,

675
00:42:08,960 --> 00:42:14,040
Speaker 1: but I think it's a training ground. So if um

676
00:42:15,520 --> 00:42:18,360
Speaker 1: just your your your opinion the way that you see it,

677
00:42:18,520 --> 00:42:23,680
Speaker 1: what is the probably like the biggest obstacle in the

678
00:42:23,760 --> 00:42:29,080
Speaker 1: way right now, like America's education system. Um, I think

679
00:42:29,120 --> 00:42:31,480
Speaker 1: it's the opposite thing of what most people think. It is,

680
00:42:32,000 --> 00:42:34,320
Speaker 1: like a lot of people think that, you know, the

681
00:42:34,760 --> 00:42:37,719
Speaker 1: university system is all like left wing. In my experience,

682
00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:42,600
Speaker 1: it's almost the opposite. It's very um conservative, and uh

683
00:42:42,719 --> 00:42:44,560
Speaker 1: you know, I think that that's also being propped up

684
00:42:44,600 --> 00:42:46,800
Speaker 1: right now by a number of voices and talking heads

685
00:42:47,440 --> 00:42:50,960
Speaker 1: that are dangerous to civil discourse in our country, people

686
00:42:51,080 --> 00:42:57,600
Speaker 1: like uh Canadian Jordan Peterson or Sam Harris, Ben Shapiro. Yeah,

687
00:42:58,800 --> 00:43:02,239
Speaker 1: those are all the dirt problems, the surf one. I

688
00:43:02,239 --> 00:43:05,640
Speaker 1: haven't heard that one that like that. Yeah for sure. Yeah,

689
00:43:07,440 --> 00:43:10,680
Speaker 1: I was really curious about some of your advocacy. I

690
00:43:10,760 --> 00:43:13,000
Speaker 1: know that for a while you ran hip Hop as

691
00:43:13,080 --> 00:43:16,239
Speaker 1: Revolution the music series and collaboration with Push Buffalo. I

692
00:43:16,320 --> 00:43:17,680
Speaker 1: was wondering if you talk to us a little bit

693
00:43:17,719 --> 00:43:22,560
Speaker 1: about that, right, Push Buffalo's incredible organization. You know, uh

694
00:43:23,200 --> 00:43:28,640
Speaker 1: pushes responsible for you know, keeping people up the streets

695
00:43:28,719 --> 00:43:31,520
Speaker 1: almost at this point, like with rent control and all

696
00:43:31,560 --> 00:43:36,200
Speaker 1: of those issues. And then they're also deeply kind of

697
00:43:36,760 --> 00:43:41,080
Speaker 1: entrenched in some of the more revolutionary time talk about

698
00:43:41,120 --> 00:43:44,839
Speaker 1: sustainable housing and the environment and where that meets economically

699
00:43:44,960 --> 00:43:49,560
Speaker 1: with government. And so I collaborated with guy named John Washington,

700
00:43:50,120 --> 00:43:55,120
Speaker 1: and John and me had this idea to uh cover

701
00:43:55,160 --> 00:43:57,920
Speaker 1: it up and and begin a hip hop platform that

702
00:43:58,360 --> 00:44:03,640
Speaker 1: not only brought in heavily influential political hip hop artists

703
00:44:04,360 --> 00:44:07,640
Speaker 1: and match them with some local artists that also have

704
00:44:07,800 --> 00:44:10,680
Speaker 1: that kind of tilt to their music and their their art,

705
00:44:11,239 --> 00:44:14,520
Speaker 1: but also um and form the public too. So those

706
00:44:14,560 --> 00:44:18,920
Speaker 1: events were you know, used to get people involved in

707
00:44:19,280 --> 00:44:22,439
Speaker 1: other parts of not just their political education, but also

708
00:44:22,560 --> 00:44:26,719
Speaker 1: taking taking part in changing some of the unfair properties

709
00:44:26,760 --> 00:44:30,480
Speaker 1: about the way our society is form and institutionalized. So

710
00:44:30,920 --> 00:44:34,000
Speaker 1: what was the role of hip hop as Resolution in

711
00:44:34,200 --> 00:44:36,600
Speaker 1: some of the organizing what they were doing was like

712
00:44:36,680 --> 00:44:40,399
Speaker 1: sort of recruitment space, educational like what how how were

713
00:44:40,440 --> 00:44:43,799
Speaker 1: you using that event to advance some of their prerogatives.

714
00:44:44,200 --> 00:44:46,680
Speaker 1: But we tried to bring in like anyone in the

715
00:44:46,760 --> 00:44:49,440
Speaker 1: community that had a part in hip hop, so anyone

716
00:44:49,560 --> 00:44:53,240
Speaker 1: that was related even like from culinary arts and food

717
00:44:53,640 --> 00:44:59,480
Speaker 1: to UM, an entire like booths that have UM you know,

718
00:44:59,600 --> 00:45:04,759
Speaker 1: inform a about how to organize UM, I mean the

719
00:45:05,160 --> 00:45:07,200
Speaker 1: artists themselves, kind of propping them up and giving them

720
00:45:07,239 --> 00:45:08,640
Speaker 1: a stage to say what they need to say and

721
00:45:08,760 --> 00:45:12,200
Speaker 1: voice their opinions, and then matching them with UM artists

722
00:45:12,280 --> 00:45:15,719
Speaker 1: that already have an audience and a crowd. So you're

723
00:45:15,719 --> 00:45:18,960
Speaker 1: bringing out people that normally wouldn't come to an independent

724
00:45:19,719 --> 00:45:22,640
Speaker 1: arts event and then kind of using that as a

725
00:45:22,719 --> 00:45:27,000
Speaker 1: springboard to get people interested in some of the more

726
00:45:27,480 --> 00:45:31,239
Speaker 1: important positions of our day. UM. Because it's I mean

727
00:45:31,320 --> 00:45:34,480
Speaker 1: really at this point, like we're in a slippery slope

728
00:45:34,640 --> 00:45:36,840
Speaker 1: I feel like almost a turning point in society, and

729
00:45:37,120 --> 00:45:39,520
Speaker 1: it's all of the there's been many things that are

730
00:45:39,560 --> 00:45:44,640
Speaker 1: working together to cause that two come about and get

731
00:45:44,719 --> 00:45:48,400
Speaker 1: this outcome that we're all working through right now. So,

732
00:45:50,239 --> 00:45:52,560
Speaker 1: So can you tell us a bit about the new album,

733
00:45:53,600 --> 00:45:58,000
Speaker 1: Oh curious incidents and cancel culture all right, Um, really

734
00:45:58,080 --> 00:46:02,719
Speaker 1: the point of the uh the point I really at

735
00:46:02,760 --> 00:46:05,600
Speaker 1: this point, like for years I've been collaborating with like

736
00:46:05,680 --> 00:46:09,360
Speaker 1: bigger artists and um, taking a whole different approach to

737
00:46:09,680 --> 00:46:14,160
Speaker 1: rap music and kind of like instead of just doing

738
00:46:14,200 --> 00:46:17,200
Speaker 1: whatever with stereotypical, just being as free as I could artistically.

739
00:46:18,040 --> 00:46:20,279
Speaker 1: And so I had like the band and all of

740
00:46:20,320 --> 00:46:24,279
Speaker 1: these different moving parts that where we're doing all the

741
00:46:24,360 --> 00:46:29,719
Speaker 1: touring and doing really high in music videos and um,

742
00:46:30,719 --> 00:46:33,120
Speaker 1: you know, collaborating with singers across the aisle from like

743
00:46:33,200 --> 00:46:35,799
Speaker 1: folk music. That's the thing I wanna I just need

744
00:46:35,880 --> 00:46:40,080
Speaker 1: to interject, You'll need to check out Chucky's music videos

745
00:46:40,080 --> 00:46:43,920
Speaker 1: because especially in the indie scene, like Chucky's videos are

746
00:46:44,040 --> 00:46:47,560
Speaker 1: especially like it looked like Martin Scorsese films and ship

747
00:46:50,120 --> 00:46:52,799
Speaker 1: uh this I think this project right here. We um,

748
00:46:53,239 --> 00:46:56,400
Speaker 1: so we we noticed that most of what's happening with

749
00:46:56,520 --> 00:46:58,359
Speaker 1: independent music right now is a lot of things are

750
00:46:58,400 --> 00:47:02,520
Speaker 1: going visual, you know, and since we're kind of confined

751
00:47:02,719 --> 00:47:08,080
Speaker 1: this virtual platform right now and we can't perform live. Um, Instead,

752
00:47:08,160 --> 00:47:11,160
Speaker 1: what I've done is that packaged an entire EP into

753
00:47:11,640 --> 00:47:15,200
Speaker 1: a video project, and so there are six interconnected videos

754
00:47:15,239 --> 00:47:18,000
Speaker 1: feature song. Um right now, I think we've learned the

755
00:47:18,040 --> 00:47:22,120
Speaker 1: song too. UM. But there's just a lot of heavy symbolism, symbolism,

756
00:47:22,400 --> 00:47:26,120
Speaker 1: and I wanted to speak directly to some of the

757
00:47:26,440 --> 00:47:31,440
Speaker 1: confusion and chaos um things like, um, you know, the

758
00:47:32,480 --> 00:47:36,759
Speaker 1: loss of the apprentice becomes president, murder hornets, you know,

759
00:47:36,920 --> 00:47:41,200
Speaker 1: like these these crazy things that you could not have

760
00:47:41,520 --> 00:47:48,120
Speaker 1: possibly foreseen, potentially you know, kind of happening. And I

761
00:47:48,160 --> 00:47:53,080
Speaker 1: feel like that's all too kind of put into like this,

762
00:47:54,360 --> 00:47:57,560
Speaker 1: this entire discourse about what cancel culture is too, because

763
00:47:57,600 --> 00:47:59,920
Speaker 1: they're good things that cancel culture does, like a lot

764
00:48:00,080 --> 00:48:03,360
Speaker 1: of a lot of there's a lot of good aspects

765
00:48:03,480 --> 00:48:07,360
Speaker 1: to woke to wokeness and woke culture and to cancel culture.

766
00:48:07,440 --> 00:48:10,560
Speaker 1: Because some some of these people who are being called

767
00:48:10,600 --> 00:48:12,719
Speaker 1: out deserved to be, and we should believe the people

768
00:48:12,719 --> 00:48:15,960
Speaker 1: who are calling them out. I mean, I think it's

769
00:48:15,960 --> 00:48:17,600
Speaker 1: I think a lot of them we were getting called

770
00:48:17,640 --> 00:48:19,759
Speaker 1: out deserve to be. I just for me, the thing

771
00:48:19,880 --> 00:48:25,279
Speaker 1: that really grates me about the crowd that is like

772
00:48:26,560 --> 00:48:28,760
Speaker 1: goes out of their way to be anti cancel culture

773
00:48:28,920 --> 00:48:31,720
Speaker 1: is just they treat it that the things about cancel

774
00:48:31,800 --> 00:48:34,320
Speaker 1: culture or woke culture, whatever you want to call it,

775
00:48:34,480 --> 00:48:38,440
Speaker 1: that are at the worst annoying. They treat it as

776
00:48:38,520 --> 00:48:44,280
Speaker 1: if it's like some giant incident that's gonna make Western

777
00:48:44,400 --> 00:48:47,640
Speaker 1: civilization collapse if if we don't quell it right now,

778
00:48:47,680 --> 00:48:50,840
Speaker 1: and it's like, well, the opposite of cancel culture is

779
00:48:51,320 --> 00:48:55,000
Speaker 1: people just you know, kind of being openly bigoted and ships.

780
00:48:55,120 --> 00:49:00,799
Speaker 1: So it's like right, auntability from ones like I don't know, yeah,

781
00:49:00,880 --> 00:49:05,160
Speaker 1: bigotry or transgressions are just harm that are done to others.

782
00:49:05,520 --> 00:49:08,239
Speaker 1: I kind of think that cancel culture is you know,

783
00:49:08,520 --> 00:49:11,920
Speaker 1: like a lot of things good and bad, so um.

784
00:49:12,400 --> 00:49:15,440
Speaker 1: Mostly I feel like it's a form of descent, and

785
00:49:16,040 --> 00:49:18,120
Speaker 1: a good form of descent, a good form of kind

786
00:49:18,160 --> 00:49:23,520
Speaker 1: of protesting. It'st um things in society that are unfair

787
00:49:23,719 --> 00:49:26,880
Speaker 1: or target unfair groups or people without lots of power,

788
00:49:27,440 --> 00:49:30,160
Speaker 1: And so cancel culture is good in the respect that

789
00:49:31,040 --> 00:49:34,759
Speaker 1: it kind of um allows the voices of the people

790
00:49:34,840 --> 00:49:38,640
Speaker 1: to speak up against some of the injustices that consistently

791
00:49:39,239 --> 00:49:43,719
Speaker 1: society doesn't do a good job regulating or um protecting

792
00:49:43,760 --> 00:49:46,719
Speaker 1: people from on the other side of some of this,

793
00:49:47,160 --> 00:49:53,080
Speaker 1: it is a kind of um I would say, unchecked

794
00:49:54,120 --> 00:50:01,160
Speaker 1: um form of of power. I mean, it's power in

795
00:50:01,280 --> 00:50:03,880
Speaker 1: the people's hands, but sometimes that can be good and

796
00:50:04,040 --> 00:50:08,040
Speaker 1: bad depending on how much powers in whose hands. So

797
00:50:08,760 --> 00:50:12,640
Speaker 1: one of the things that UM has commonly been I

798
00:50:12,680 --> 00:50:16,440
Speaker 1: would say issue in our current media climate is that

799
00:50:17,320 --> 00:50:23,200
Speaker 1: UM social media has made UM information flow in such

800
00:50:23,200 --> 00:50:28,600
Speaker 1: a way where there's not UM a real UM kind

801
00:50:28,640 --> 00:50:32,520
Speaker 1: of fabric in society that we can truly trust. So

802
00:50:33,080 --> 00:50:37,759
Speaker 1: UM I would say that when you ruin like that,

803
00:50:38,360 --> 00:50:43,000
Speaker 1: that feeling of trust in the society, then also solidarity

804
00:50:43,120 --> 00:50:46,880
Speaker 1: kind of diminishes, and UH that can be problematic for

805
00:50:46,960 --> 00:50:51,240
Speaker 1: a lot of different reasons because UM, there's no editor

806
00:50:52,040 --> 00:50:55,080
Speaker 1: to edit all of these different pieces of information that

807
00:50:55,160 --> 00:50:57,480
Speaker 1: are going out and coordinating to make meaning and make

808
00:50:57,560 --> 00:51:01,400
Speaker 1: sense of the world for people. UM. And it's not

809
00:51:01,600 --> 00:51:05,640
Speaker 1: that we would prefer like all corporate entities kind of

810
00:51:05,920 --> 00:51:08,400
Speaker 1: control this and that the power flow from top to

811
00:51:08,480 --> 00:51:11,560
Speaker 1: bottom all the time. But when there's no one checking

812
00:51:12,000 --> 00:51:14,719
Speaker 1: to make sure something is true, then now you've put

813
00:51:14,760 --> 00:51:19,000
Speaker 1: all narratives on an equal playing field. So people who

814
00:51:19,120 --> 00:51:23,560
Speaker 1: have any sort of opinion UM. And it seems that

815
00:51:23,880 --> 00:51:26,359
Speaker 1: nowadays everybody thinks that they not only have a right

816
00:51:26,440 --> 00:51:29,960
Speaker 1: to an opinion, but that all opinions are equal, it

817
00:51:30,040 --> 00:51:32,920
Speaker 1: makes it harder to siphon out the good opinions from

818
00:51:32,920 --> 00:51:35,439
Speaker 1: the bad opinions, a higher truth from a lower truth.

819
00:51:36,160 --> 00:51:38,919
Speaker 1: And obviously, like there are differences between that. I would

820
00:51:39,120 --> 00:51:42,920
Speaker 1: much rather take an informed opinion, like let's say, on

821
00:51:43,080 --> 00:51:47,160
Speaker 1: race um, from someone like Martin Luther King, than I

822
00:51:47,200 --> 00:51:51,880
Speaker 1: would and Adolf Hitler. You know, so, Um, the the

823
00:51:52,040 --> 00:51:56,160
Speaker 1: idea there is that um, when you put with narrative

824
00:51:56,280 --> 00:51:58,920
Speaker 1: is the only thing that we have here, then you

825
00:51:59,040 --> 00:52:04,280
Speaker 1: have nothing to quy, defy, to test um, to prove

826
00:52:04,400 --> 00:52:07,879
Speaker 1: factually right. So when you put facts up against alternative facts,

827
00:52:07,920 --> 00:52:11,800
Speaker 1: it's just whoever has more power because each story is

828
00:52:11,840 --> 00:52:16,120
Speaker 1: going against the other story. And uh, that's that's definitely

829
00:52:16,200 --> 00:52:18,520
Speaker 1: an issue if you have, like, let's say, a president

830
00:52:18,600 --> 00:52:21,800
Speaker 1: who's saying fake news to everything that he doesn't like,

831
00:52:22,239 --> 00:52:24,040
Speaker 1: and it's just kind of using the power of his

832
00:52:24,120 --> 00:52:28,360
Speaker 1: pulpit to tell people whatever stories he wants them to believe,

833
00:52:29,040 --> 00:52:33,840
Speaker 1: which could be kind of what happened at the capitoling.

834
00:52:33,920 --> 00:52:39,080
Speaker 1: You know, so what, um, what made you want to

835
00:52:39,200 --> 00:52:43,800
Speaker 1: like tackle this on your album? I think just because

836
00:52:44,280 --> 00:52:47,880
Speaker 1: it's confusing, you know, Like I think that there's no

837
00:52:49,040 --> 00:52:55,880
Speaker 1: real straightforward, perfect answer. Two. Um, there's the current social

838
00:52:55,920 --> 00:52:59,560
Speaker 1: climate we're in. We're we're in a pretty dark place.

839
00:53:00,040 --> 00:53:02,600
Speaker 1: And I feel that what I was trying to tackle

840
00:53:02,680 --> 00:53:07,200
Speaker 1: specifically is, uh, the cognitive dissonance that comes with that.

841
00:53:07,680 --> 00:53:11,680
Speaker 1: UM also some of just the confusion about who to

842
00:53:11,760 --> 00:53:15,359
Speaker 1: believe and what to believe, and UM, how the degradation

843
00:53:15,440 --> 00:53:19,480
Speaker 1: of that entire fabric kind of leads us to this

844
00:53:19,640 --> 00:53:24,200
Speaker 1: space where almost nothing is believable. We're in a very

845
00:53:24,320 --> 00:53:29,800
Speaker 1: strange existential kind of situation. UM. So I felt that

846
00:53:30,280 --> 00:53:33,280
Speaker 1: very real. You know, like, UM, some of the songs

847
00:53:33,360 --> 00:53:38,040
Speaker 1: on the album tackle um ag is m you know

848
00:53:38,160 --> 00:53:40,840
Speaker 1: the idea that you know, you have this older generation

849
00:53:41,880 --> 00:53:44,880
Speaker 1: uh coming up and the younger people are calling them

850
00:53:44,880 --> 00:53:49,480
Speaker 1: boomers and saying they don't they don't understand the current

851
00:53:50,000 --> 00:53:52,040
Speaker 1: generation and the way to do things, and that they

852
00:53:52,239 --> 00:53:55,640
Speaker 1: mounted up this huge amount of debt and put these

853
00:53:55,760 --> 00:53:57,520
Speaker 1: and put these young kids in that debt. And then

854
00:53:57,800 --> 00:54:00,719
Speaker 1: on the other side of the older narration is looking

855
00:54:00,760 --> 00:54:02,759
Speaker 1: back and saying, well, you guys know nothing about the world.

856
00:54:02,840 --> 00:54:07,040
Speaker 1: You're obsessed with um social media and with your Instagram

857
00:54:07,080 --> 00:54:11,880
Speaker 1: pictures and snapchat, and UM, there's wait to both of

858
00:54:12,040 --> 00:54:14,960
Speaker 1: that to those things you know there is, But then

859
00:54:15,000 --> 00:54:18,520
Speaker 1: it kind of gets stupid because like I had motherfucker

860
00:54:18,560 --> 00:54:22,520
Speaker 1: trying to call me a boomer and ship it was like, yo, no,

861
00:54:22,719 --> 00:54:24,560
Speaker 1: I think I just think you're wrong. I'm six years

862
00:54:24,600 --> 00:54:29,400
Speaker 1: older than you. Shut the buck up, right right? No, absolutely,

863
00:54:29,480 --> 00:54:31,560
Speaker 1: that's I mean, that's where I'm kind of getting. I mean,

864
00:54:31,600 --> 00:54:33,840
Speaker 1: if I had to stand on one side of cancel culture,

865
00:54:33,880 --> 00:54:35,880
Speaker 1: I would stand with the people who are marginalized and

866
00:54:36,400 --> 00:54:39,959
Speaker 1: and fight for their voices to be heard. Um. I would.

867
00:54:40,200 --> 00:54:43,000
Speaker 1: I would fight for you know, women to be believed

868
00:54:43,080 --> 00:54:46,600
Speaker 1: when they called out someone as you know, a rapist

869
00:54:46,800 --> 00:54:51,239
Speaker 1: or someone who's committed some of these grotesque kinds of

870
00:54:51,320 --> 00:54:56,560
Speaker 1: crimes to just commit consistently go on checked. Um. But

871
00:54:56,719 --> 00:54:59,600
Speaker 1: then there's someone like, you know, maybe Dave Chappelle stands

872
00:54:59,680 --> 00:55:02,200
Speaker 1: up and starts poking holes in some of that stuff,

873
00:55:02,239 --> 00:55:05,200
Speaker 1: and it makes me think, I'm like, okay, well, you know,

874
00:55:05,320 --> 00:55:08,920
Speaker 1: should we be able to call people out and make

875
00:55:09,000 --> 00:55:13,359
Speaker 1: them guilty before proven innocent and the um social court

876
00:55:13,400 --> 00:55:17,279
Speaker 1: of law? You know, um? And so it does make

877
00:55:17,360 --> 00:55:19,839
Speaker 1: me stand in that gray area because I don't want

878
00:55:19,880 --> 00:55:24,160
Speaker 1: to just slam the gabble and and commit myself that

879
00:55:24,360 --> 00:55:27,160
Speaker 1: everybody might be guilty of something that they've just been

880
00:55:27,160 --> 00:55:30,440
Speaker 1: accused of before really taking my time to sift through

881
00:55:30,440 --> 00:55:33,120
Speaker 1: the information and get my mind wrapped around some of

882
00:55:33,160 --> 00:55:35,120
Speaker 1: this stuff. And you know, I was dealing with this.

883
00:55:35,239 --> 00:55:37,839
Speaker 1: I feel like it's been coming for a long time. Um.

884
00:55:38,200 --> 00:55:40,319
Speaker 1: You know some of the names that I just used

885
00:55:40,360 --> 00:55:43,520
Speaker 1: on the album, like Tommy Laren and you know, Brett

886
00:55:43,600 --> 00:55:48,400
Speaker 1: Kavanaugh and um, you know Kyrie Irvin. You know, like

887
00:55:48,600 --> 00:55:51,240
Speaker 1: whether you're talking about flat earth or you're talking about

888
00:55:51,719 --> 00:55:57,520
Speaker 1: extreme right wing politics, UM, that to me leads to

889
00:55:57,520 --> 00:56:01,480
Speaker 1: almost fascism. Um. You know, all of that creates this

890
00:56:01,680 --> 00:56:04,400
Speaker 1: kind of climate, and then when you combine that with

891
00:56:04,560 --> 00:56:07,560
Speaker 1: this isolation of the pandemic, you kind of have the

892
00:56:07,640 --> 00:56:14,520
Speaker 1: perfect petri dish for um for you know, yeah, no,

893
00:56:14,800 --> 00:56:19,279
Speaker 1: for real, UM, what are some standout tracks to you? Um?

894
00:56:19,920 --> 00:56:22,719
Speaker 1: I really personally, and I always like the tracks that

895
00:56:23,120 --> 00:56:26,480
Speaker 1: I think other people don't get into as much, you know,

896
00:56:26,719 --> 00:56:29,400
Speaker 1: I think because I mean when you're behind it writing

897
00:56:29,440 --> 00:56:32,719
Speaker 1: and it's different. But I really like the second track

898
00:56:32,800 --> 00:56:36,440
Speaker 1: swipe Right. I feel like it's um that line, um,

899
00:56:36,600 --> 00:56:39,200
Speaker 1: and every human heart there's a guide shaped whole you

900
00:56:39,280 --> 00:56:44,359
Speaker 1: know that comes from uh Sartre and existentialism, and you know, um,

901
00:56:44,600 --> 00:56:47,160
Speaker 1: we do. I think everyone kind of fills that up

902
00:56:47,239 --> 00:56:51,279
Speaker 1: with all of this stuff that is um really kind

903
00:56:51,280 --> 00:56:56,120
Speaker 1: of unhealthy and it's really you can never achieve that

904
00:56:56,200 --> 00:57:00,480
Speaker 1: original plnitude of being a whole with everything again um

905
00:57:00,680 --> 00:57:06,040
Speaker 1: and so I feel like that's what's really appealing about existentialism,

906
00:57:06,160 --> 00:57:10,680
Speaker 1: especially right now. UM. But UM, I think it sums

907
00:57:10,800 --> 00:57:14,680
Speaker 1: up almost perfect what people would do just for any

908
00:57:14,760 --> 00:57:17,760
Speaker 1: sort of love right now, whether like they're getting likes

909
00:57:17,880 --> 00:57:22,000
Speaker 1: or comments on Instagram or or Facebook or whatever it

910
00:57:22,120 --> 00:57:25,520
Speaker 1: might be, or um, why they're listening to some of

911
00:57:25,600 --> 00:57:28,280
Speaker 1: the stuff that sounds just ridiculous, you know, whether it's

912
00:57:28,320 --> 00:57:36,360
Speaker 1: Alex Jones saying so I think he said something about yeah, so,

913
00:57:36,560 --> 00:57:38,960
Speaker 1: I mean some of the things that people are believing,

914
00:57:39,000 --> 00:57:41,000
Speaker 1: you would think would be way too outrageous or out

915
00:57:41,040 --> 00:57:43,640
Speaker 1: of bounds for them believe. But then again they're in,

916
00:57:44,440 --> 00:57:47,560
Speaker 1: um a space that they've never been in, and it's

917
00:57:47,600 --> 00:57:50,760
Speaker 1: a terrifying space full of fear. And so you know,

918
00:57:50,880 --> 00:57:54,880
Speaker 1: someone believing like a Q and on um, you know,

919
00:57:55,000 --> 00:57:59,880
Speaker 1: conspiracy about you know, wayfair selling children on the internet.

920
00:58:00,040 --> 00:58:02,160
Speaker 1: You know, like as if is it was a couch

921
00:58:02,280 --> 00:58:05,960
Speaker 1: or something. You know, like, um, that sounds crazy, but

922
00:58:06,080 --> 00:58:10,120
Speaker 1: in someone's mind where they're reinforcing these narratives consistently, what

923
00:58:10,360 --> 00:58:12,480
Speaker 1: really makes sense? Right now? You know that we're in

924
00:58:12,520 --> 00:58:16,320
Speaker 1: a world wide pandemic and before storming the capital and

925
00:58:16,760 --> 00:58:20,480
Speaker 1: they're believing that the president, uh, the election was still run.

926
00:58:20,600 --> 00:58:23,480
Speaker 1: You know, well, what is how do you feel about

927
00:58:24,440 --> 00:58:28,000
Speaker 1: like hip hop's place in this social climate of cancel

928
00:58:28,080 --> 00:58:31,040
Speaker 1: culture existing? And no, I think that I think that

929
00:58:31,160 --> 00:58:35,000
Speaker 1: a lot of people, you know, just because they're not

930
00:58:35,080 --> 00:58:38,320
Speaker 1: being agreed with, they're using cancel culture as an excuse

931
00:58:38,880 --> 00:58:42,600
Speaker 1: to um to kind of hold beliefs that they shouldn't

932
00:58:42,600 --> 00:58:45,720
Speaker 1: be holding. You know, instead of thinking critically about what's

933
00:58:45,760 --> 00:58:48,200
Speaker 1: going on or looking at the D structure of a situation,

934
00:58:48,600 --> 00:58:51,840
Speaker 1: they would rather um point fingers, which is easier, you know.

935
00:58:52,600 --> 00:58:55,200
Speaker 1: And what's missing here is the fine nuance you know

936
00:58:55,520 --> 00:58:58,880
Speaker 1: to some of these arguments. You know, someone uh says

937
00:58:58,960 --> 00:59:02,520
Speaker 1: something is as absurd like the Kanye West thing, you know,

938
00:59:02,680 --> 00:59:05,720
Speaker 1: like slavery is a choice thing. Obviously you have to

939
00:59:05,800 --> 00:59:09,640
Speaker 1: check them. You know, immediately I got just the complete

940
00:59:09,680 --> 00:59:12,640
Speaker 1: absurdity of something like that just deserves to be called out.

941
00:59:12,880 --> 00:59:15,680
Speaker 1: It's not canceling at all. That's telling me the truth.

942
00:59:17,440 --> 00:59:19,800
Speaker 1: Do you think do you think you were able to

943
00:59:20,680 --> 00:59:23,400
Speaker 1: like capture that and express that on the album? I don't.

944
00:59:23,400 --> 00:59:25,120
Speaker 1: I don't know. I think all artists kind of fail

945
00:59:25,160 --> 00:59:29,800
Speaker 1: at their vision, you know. Um yeah, but I did

946
00:59:29,880 --> 00:59:32,920
Speaker 1: my best to to to kind of shape that in

947
00:59:33,000 --> 00:59:35,960
Speaker 1: a way that I think other people would be um

948
00:59:36,840 --> 00:59:40,040
Speaker 1: asking questions about it, you know, like, instead of kind

949
00:59:40,040 --> 00:59:42,000
Speaker 1: of preaching at them or telling them what they're supposed

950
00:59:42,000 --> 00:59:43,800
Speaker 1: to think or telling them what's supposed to be true,

951
00:59:43,840 --> 00:59:46,800
Speaker 1: I thought that the bigger win would be to have

952
00:59:46,960 --> 00:59:49,320
Speaker 1: them question and think about it for themselves and come

953
00:59:49,400 --> 00:59:53,120
Speaker 1: to those conclusions by presenting them kind of evidence in

954
00:59:53,160 --> 00:59:55,720
Speaker 1: a different way, you know. And I feel like that's

955
00:59:55,760 --> 00:59:58,080
Speaker 1: what art's supposed to do. Instead of being like didactic

956
00:59:58,360 --> 01:00:02,360
Speaker 1: didactic and telling you what, uh this means, you're supposed

957
01:00:02,360 --> 01:00:05,560
Speaker 1: to kind of interpret it and kind of find the

958
01:00:05,640 --> 01:00:08,960
Speaker 1: meaning to you know. So it's like a co construction.

959
01:00:11,960 --> 01:00:13,680
Speaker 1: So I don't know if I I don't know if

960
01:00:13,720 --> 01:00:17,160
Speaker 1: I achieved what I wanted to achieve. Um, but I

961
01:00:17,960 --> 01:00:22,040
Speaker 1: am very proud of the record. Well for folks listening

962
01:00:22,240 --> 01:00:24,920
Speaker 1: who want to answer that question for themselves. Where can

963
01:00:24,960 --> 01:00:28,040
Speaker 1: they go check out your music? The best place to

964
01:00:28,080 --> 01:00:31,080
Speaker 1: go is to my website. It's w W dot Chucky

965
01:00:31,160 --> 01:00:34,560
Speaker 1: Campbell music dot com and Chucky with an I and E.

966
01:00:35,680 --> 01:00:42,000
Speaker 1: It's not like a demonic possess. Okay, it's Curious Incidents

967
01:00:42,560 --> 01:00:46,960
Speaker 1: and cancel culture um or if you google it, it'll

968
01:00:47,000 --> 01:00:49,200
Speaker 1: pop up all over the place. It's it's on Spotify

969
01:00:49,400 --> 01:00:51,919
Speaker 1: and it's been it did really well. It's an ep

970
01:00:52,480 --> 01:00:55,080
Speaker 1: so um I was. I was happy the way the

971
01:00:55,160 --> 01:00:58,200
Speaker 1: way it performed, especially during the pandemic. Yeah. Yeah, you

972
01:00:58,360 --> 01:01:00,800
Speaker 1: gotta make sure you go check out Jackie Campbell and

973
01:01:00,920 --> 01:01:02,840
Speaker 1: his his work. It's all on YouTube and all on

974
01:01:02,920 --> 01:01:05,280
Speaker 1: the internet. Man, thank you for coming through again. Yeah,

975
01:01:06,640 --> 01:01:12,280
Speaker 1: alright and blessings. Author Michael Eric Dyson said something when

976
01:01:12,360 --> 01:01:14,800
Speaker 1: talking about Colin Kaepernick that kind of stuck with me.

977
01:01:15,160 --> 01:01:19,040
Speaker 1: He said, cancel culture is the internalization of the of

978
01:01:19,120 --> 01:01:23,080
Speaker 1: an ethic of white supremacy. And it's with the Colin

979
01:01:23,200 --> 01:01:27,760
Speaker 1: Kaepernick situation that should pretty much inform you. Whenever you're

980
01:01:28,360 --> 01:01:31,080
Speaker 1: talking to someone or whenever you hear somebody complaining about

981
01:01:31,840 --> 01:01:37,200
Speaker 1: cancel culture, just think about Colin Kaepernick, point blank, period, Like,

982
01:01:38,840 --> 01:01:42,840
Speaker 1: just think about the situation. Right, you have somebody who

983
01:01:42,960 --> 01:01:47,280
Speaker 1: did something that wasn't politically correct, and as a result,

984
01:01:47,440 --> 01:01:50,960
Speaker 1: he had a rabid PC mob that wouldn't hear him

985
01:01:51,000 --> 01:01:54,760
Speaker 1: out and wouldn't show empathy and refuse to lend any

986
01:01:54,840 --> 01:01:57,560
Speaker 1: sort of good faith interpretation to the context of his

987
01:01:57,680 --> 01:01:59,920
Speaker 1: side of the story, and as a result, he got

988
01:02:00,080 --> 01:02:02,800
Speaker 1: fire from his job. So whenever you hear any of

989
01:02:02,840 --> 01:02:05,720
Speaker 1: these motherfucker's talking about, Okay, how's the culture this, how

990
01:02:05,840 --> 01:02:09,440
Speaker 1: come I can't speak on this college campus, I guarantee

991
01:02:09,520 --> 01:02:12,880
Speaker 1: you of them saying that would tell you all college

992
01:02:12,920 --> 01:02:14,440
Speaker 1: camra Dick he used to shut up. He needed to

993
01:02:14,480 --> 01:02:16,240
Speaker 1: do what he's told to stand out for the flags

994
01:02:16,320 --> 01:02:19,480
Speaker 1: with the troops. So you know that's why at the

995
01:02:19,560 --> 01:02:21,000
Speaker 1: end of the day, a lot of this ship is

996
01:02:21,080 --> 01:02:23,000
Speaker 1: capped and I don't I don't buy any of it.

997
01:02:24,280 --> 01:02:28,280
Speaker 1: We've talked a lot in recent episodes about um the

998
01:02:28,440 --> 01:02:31,320
Speaker 1: Maga rappers, who like in the sense we're canceled. I mean,

999
01:02:31,320 --> 01:02:33,920
Speaker 1: they were like criticized online, but as we discussed as

1000
01:02:33,960 --> 01:02:36,160
Speaker 1: well in previous episodes, like I'm not sure I've really

1001
01:02:36,240 --> 01:02:38,040
Speaker 1: had hurt their pockets so that it came out in

1002
01:02:38,040 --> 01:02:43,400
Speaker 1: support of Trump or anything like that. Um Trina. As

1003
01:02:43,400 --> 01:02:47,320
Speaker 1: another example, rapper Trina called protesters during the George Floyd

1004
01:02:47,400 --> 01:02:51,640
Speaker 1: protests animals, and she was allegedly canceled for it. Um

1005
01:02:52,120 --> 01:02:55,960
Speaker 1: apparently super disturbing to me. A little boozy paid an

1006
01:02:56,000 --> 01:02:58,680
Speaker 1: adult woman to give oral sex his son and pup

1007
01:02:59,280 --> 01:03:02,960
Speaker 1: and publicly a tacked fame basketball players transgender son, and

1008
01:03:03,240 --> 01:03:06,760
Speaker 1: he was canceled allegedly. I say allegedly because I think

1009
01:03:07,320 --> 01:03:09,080
Speaker 1: if they were to put out new music, its success

1010
01:03:09,120 --> 01:03:11,720
Speaker 1: would be determined how hot they are, and by none

1011
01:03:11,760 --> 01:03:15,200
Speaker 1: of those contrapartues. I mean, I can to like he

1012
01:03:15,280 --> 01:03:18,560
Speaker 1: talked about Llewayne and on one of the most recent episodes,

1013
01:03:19,120 --> 01:03:25,080
Speaker 1: like his new album was new music, like probably like

1014
01:03:25,200 --> 01:03:27,880
Speaker 1: I don't know how it was doing, but I wouldn't

1015
01:03:27,920 --> 01:03:29,960
Speaker 1: be surprised if a flop because it sucks, and not

1016
01:03:30,000 --> 01:03:31,960
Speaker 1: necessarily because he came out in favor of Trump. It's

1017
01:03:32,000 --> 01:03:35,000
Speaker 1: really about your artistic production and how people value it

1018
01:03:35,840 --> 01:03:40,280
Speaker 1: because people and you know, end up bobbing their heads

1019
01:03:40,320 --> 01:03:41,960
Speaker 1: and like this in the club to all sorts. A

1020
01:03:41,960 --> 01:03:44,080
Speaker 1: problem matter rappers all the time. It's really about the

1021
01:03:44,200 --> 01:03:48,520
Speaker 1: quality of your music. I mean, does anybody famous barring

1022
01:03:49,200 --> 01:03:52,880
Speaker 1: them committing like serious crimes and ship like that. But

1023
01:03:53,200 --> 01:03:58,200
Speaker 1: is anybody famous ever been successfully canceled for some ship

1024
01:03:58,320 --> 01:04:01,120
Speaker 1: that they said? I, I mean, has that happened? I'm

1025
01:04:01,160 --> 01:04:04,240
Speaker 1: not I'm not sure, But like you know, whenever they've

1026
01:04:04,320 --> 01:04:07,600
Speaker 1: dug up somebody's old tweets or somebody has been caught

1027
01:04:07,640 --> 01:04:11,880
Speaker 1: on cameras, has this like actually tangibly affected anybody's career

1028
01:04:12,400 --> 01:04:14,920
Speaker 1: Because none of the people that we just talked about,

1029
01:04:15,200 --> 01:04:17,280
Speaker 1: I don't think their career is going to be affected

1030
01:04:17,320 --> 01:04:19,840
Speaker 1: by you know, like you just said, if people aren't

1031
01:04:19,840 --> 01:04:23,000
Speaker 1: gonna buy a new Trina album, it's gonna be because

1032
01:04:23,080 --> 01:04:26,680
Speaker 1: nobody is really checking for new treat of music as

1033
01:04:26,720 --> 01:04:30,480
Speaker 1: opposed to ah Man. I was a treat A fan.

1034
01:04:30,640 --> 01:04:33,280
Speaker 1: But then she said, like, I don't just think. I

1035
01:04:33,320 --> 01:04:35,680
Speaker 1: don't think her fans are even looking at caring about

1036
01:04:35,760 --> 01:04:38,560
Speaker 1: that ship. I would, but I don't think her fans are.

1037
01:04:40,760 --> 01:04:44,040
Speaker 1: Little Wayne is definitely not canceled. You know what I'm saying.

1038
01:04:44,120 --> 01:04:47,320
Speaker 1: He's he's gonna he's gonna do do his numbers when

1039
01:04:47,360 --> 01:04:50,160
Speaker 1: he comes out, Kanye West, whatever he drops a new album,

1040
01:04:50,240 --> 01:04:53,280
Speaker 1: he's gonna do his numbers. So Lynn Minuel Miranda Face

1041
01:04:53,320 --> 01:04:56,400
Speaker 1: claims his renowned musical, Hamilton's whitewash crimes of the u

1042
01:04:56,520 --> 01:04:59,640
Speaker 1: S founding Fathers. That's cool, but what had happened? There's

1043
01:04:59,640 --> 01:05:01,880
Speaker 1: a good one of hip hop bands grind cancel culture

1044
01:05:01,920 --> 01:05:04,840
Speaker 1: despite the man of self tweeting all criticisms. The valid

1045
01:05:05,160 --> 01:05:07,720
Speaker 1: is your tonage of complexities and failings of these people.

1046
01:05:08,120 --> 01:05:11,280
Speaker 1: I couldn't get or wrestled with boot cut I took

1047
01:05:11,360 --> 01:05:13,240
Speaker 1: six years and fits as much as they could into

1048
01:05:13,280 --> 01:05:15,160
Speaker 1: a two and a half hour musical have been my best.

1049
01:05:15,440 --> 01:05:18,560
Speaker 1: It's all fair game. That's interesting. The people who are

1050
01:05:18,600 --> 01:05:23,240
Speaker 1: super opposed to cancel culture, we'll freak out about celebrities.

1051
01:05:23,280 --> 01:05:27,400
Speaker 1: They like receiving criticism, even in those celebrities themselves embrace

1052
01:05:27,520 --> 01:05:32,680
Speaker 1: that process of accountability. In my opinion, that's pretty much

1053
01:05:32,720 --> 01:05:35,680
Speaker 1: just what Chucky was saying, and Lynn had the right

1054
01:05:35,960 --> 01:05:39,840
Speaker 1: sort of perspective of it. But it's like, YO, shut

1055
01:05:39,880 --> 01:05:44,520
Speaker 1: the funk up. Just because people don't like something that

1056
01:05:44,680 --> 01:05:48,680
Speaker 1: someone did doesn't mean that they're being canceled. That means

1057
01:05:48,720 --> 01:05:51,000
Speaker 1: that a motherfucker is telling you they have a problem

1058
01:05:51,080 --> 01:05:53,680
Speaker 1: with you, and you can either be like, oh damn,

1059
01:05:53,760 --> 01:05:55,480
Speaker 1: you have a problem with me. Damn, what did I

1060
01:05:55,560 --> 01:05:57,560
Speaker 1: do wrong? How can I fix this, How can I

1061
01:05:57,640 --> 01:05:59,760
Speaker 1: be better? Or you can say, yeah, I don't give

1062
01:05:59,760 --> 01:06:01,600
Speaker 1: an if you got a problem with meks my ass,

1063
01:06:01,960 --> 01:06:06,360
Speaker 1: but don't fucking cry about your being canceled. And oh

1064
01:06:06,440 --> 01:06:08,760
Speaker 1: this is canceled culture. Oh my god, did you hear

1065
01:06:08,840 --> 01:06:12,200
Speaker 1: those four hundred people? Four hundred of my million Twitter

1066
01:06:12,320 --> 01:06:14,880
Speaker 1: followers are upset that I did something? Why are you

1067
01:06:15,000 --> 01:06:19,200
Speaker 1: canceling me? It's it sounds fucking pathetic. After a point,

1068
01:06:20,960 --> 01:06:24,000
Speaker 1: Atlanta rapper t I Mr t I P. Do they

1069
01:06:24,000 --> 01:06:28,560
Speaker 1: still call t t I P? Anyway? T I said,

1070
01:06:28,680 --> 01:06:31,720
Speaker 1: all this cancel culture I think is fake. Like jay

1071
01:06:31,800 --> 01:06:34,080
Speaker 1: Z said, first they hate you, then they love you,

1072
01:06:34,200 --> 01:06:37,920
Speaker 1: then they hate you again. You'll cancel Kanye. You canceled

1073
01:06:38,000 --> 01:06:41,160
Speaker 1: someone like Kanye. Now, I don't agree with his views.

1074
01:06:42,040 --> 01:06:44,080
Speaker 1: There are a lot of things he says, a lot

1075
01:06:44,160 --> 01:06:46,920
Speaker 1: of positions and perspectives he speaks from that I have

1076
01:06:47,080 --> 01:06:49,760
Speaker 1: no agreeance with. But that's not going to take away

1077
01:06:49,800 --> 01:06:52,000
Speaker 1: from the fact that he's a phenomenal artist and he

1078
01:06:52,120 --> 01:06:56,200
Speaker 1: makes great music. T I said, but you'll cancel him.

1079
01:06:56,880 --> 01:06:59,640
Speaker 1: But at the same time, when someone like Gucci does

1080
01:06:59,720 --> 01:07:02,200
Speaker 1: black face, then you're cool with that, so you'll keep

1081
01:07:02,240 --> 01:07:08,520
Speaker 1: wearing Gucci, but you canceled Kanye. No, nigga, you'll keep

1082
01:07:08,600 --> 01:07:14,760
Speaker 1: wearing Gucci, Yo, man, I don't understand Yeah, ladies and gentlemen,

1083
01:07:14,840 --> 01:07:18,240
Speaker 1: I just I've just read the news. I don't claim

1084
01:07:18,280 --> 01:07:20,800
Speaker 1: to understand it. I don't know what the funk any

1085
01:07:20,880 --> 01:07:23,880
Speaker 1: of that ship means. But it's like, no, I don't

1086
01:07:23,960 --> 01:07:27,360
Speaker 1: wear Gucci and I'm not gonna be listening to Kanye.

1087
01:07:27,800 --> 01:07:30,040
Speaker 1: It's just a personal decision. And I think that's all

1088
01:07:30,200 --> 01:07:33,560
Speaker 1: the any point that anybody was making. The few people

1089
01:07:33,640 --> 01:07:36,520
Speaker 1: who were willing to go that far, that's all they

1090
01:07:36,600 --> 01:07:40,080
Speaker 1: were saying. I didn't hear any sort of calls for

1091
01:07:40,280 --> 01:07:43,920
Speaker 1: a this company shouldn't sell the new Yea Zys or

1092
01:07:44,040 --> 01:07:47,800
Speaker 1: like Yo, Kanye's record labels should drop them, even after

1093
01:07:47,920 --> 01:07:50,080
Speaker 1: all the slavery was a choice ship. I didn't hear

1094
01:07:50,120 --> 01:07:53,400
Speaker 1: anybody calling for that ship. There was just, you know,

1095
01:07:54,040 --> 01:07:57,160
Speaker 1: a decent chunk of people who were like, oh, Kanye

1096
01:07:57,280 --> 01:08:00,400
Speaker 1: is sucking with the Nazis. I don't funk with Kanye anymore.

1097
01:08:01,240 --> 01:08:03,280
Speaker 1: And that's it. Now at the point that t is

1098
01:08:03,320 --> 01:08:06,760
Speaker 1: trying to make it, NA, you can't do that. That's canceling.

1099
01:08:07,280 --> 01:08:09,760
Speaker 1: You gotta buy his new album or else you're part

1100
01:08:09,800 --> 01:08:12,840
Speaker 1: of the PC mob. Get the funk out of here

1101
01:08:12,880 --> 01:08:16,320
Speaker 1: with that dumb ship. Okay, that is gonna do it

1102
01:08:16,520 --> 01:08:19,120
Speaker 1: for us today, Ladies and gentlemen, don't forget to go

1103
01:08:19,200 --> 01:08:23,040
Speaker 1: out and check out Chucky Campbell stuff. And don't forget

1104
01:08:23,280 --> 01:08:26,599
Speaker 1: to check me out my new song Sundance coming out

1105
01:08:26,640 --> 01:08:30,320
Speaker 1: in February twelve. Hey, shameless promotion in February twelve. Dope

1106
01:08:30,400 --> 01:08:34,240
Speaker 1: Knife new song Sundance. Check it out Spotify YouTube, all

1107
01:08:34,320 --> 01:08:38,479
Speaker 1: that ship. Um, I feel like rapping your joel. Let

1108
01:08:38,560 --> 01:08:44,639
Speaker 1: her brother get a beat? Check check check did dope

1109
01:08:46,080 --> 01:08:51,240
Speaker 1: waiting on reparations? Dope Knife is an effect while you

1110
01:08:51,320 --> 01:08:53,519
Speaker 1: hating the brother. The only thing that I'm gonna cancel

1111
01:08:53,640 --> 01:08:55,920
Speaker 1: is a date with your mother like a motherfucking all

1112
01:08:55,960 --> 01:08:58,800
Speaker 1: star knocking out the ballpark. Keep a short and simple dog.

1113
01:08:58,840 --> 01:09:01,639
Speaker 1: I've never been a tall dog. Cancel take the rap game.

1114
01:09:01,680 --> 01:09:04,080
Speaker 1: Holding for ransom. The only rat nigget it. Used to

1115
01:09:04,200 --> 01:09:06,720
Speaker 1: listen to hands and pouring beers and yelling cheers like

1116
01:09:06,800 --> 01:09:09,280
Speaker 1: Teddy dancing. I gotta be boys in my squad his

1117
01:09:09,320 --> 01:09:11,760
Speaker 1: steady dancing. I'm about to bug out and cause a

1118
01:09:11,840 --> 01:09:14,880
Speaker 1: fucking wreck. If biding the democrats, don't send me another check.

1119
01:09:15,000 --> 01:09:16,760
Speaker 1: I don't know what the hell is taken long? Why

1120
01:09:16,800 --> 01:09:18,920
Speaker 1: I had to make the song, need the reparations with

1121
01:09:19,000 --> 01:09:23,120
Speaker 1: the hell you people waiting all imagine for a second

1122
01:09:23,160 --> 01:09:25,400
Speaker 1: that your name is Joe Wynn Woklin and feeling the

1123
01:09:25,520 --> 01:09:29,000
Speaker 1: heat so transported. Now get crying. I cancel culture all

1124
01:09:29,040 --> 01:09:30,640
Speaker 1: your fans. So just why can't I just be a

1125
01:09:30,720 --> 01:09:33,080
Speaker 1: big weep on the French shoulder. Well, if it is

1126
01:09:33,120 --> 01:09:35,680
Speaker 1: in the consequences of oma shitty actually coming up to

1127
01:09:35,760 --> 01:09:37,639
Speaker 1: catch it, it's and it's so sad. You gotta answer

1128
01:09:37,640 --> 01:09:39,400
Speaker 1: to the people who made it so you could buy

1129
01:09:39,400 --> 01:09:41,559
Speaker 1: a fancy man. Just be in hell on the internet

1130
01:09:41,640 --> 01:09:44,400
Speaker 1: where the total possessed get a grip taken out of it.

1131
01:09:44,800 --> 01:09:46,720
Speaker 1: This is how bad against And trust me, girl, you're

1132
01:09:46,880 --> 01:09:49,160
Speaker 1: much luckier than the average. All the rest of us

1133
01:09:49,200 --> 01:09:51,080
Speaker 1: are broken ship between the bills and rent. You could

1134
01:09:51,120 --> 01:09:54,640
Speaker 1: to sit our neuro stickpy and hated, filthy rich. Hey yo,

1135
01:09:55,120 --> 01:10:00,160
Speaker 1: my name's Dove. We are waiting on reparations for up

1136
01:10:00,400 --> 01:10:03,120
Speaker 1: see you next week. Waiting on Reparations is a production

1137
01:10:03,160 --> 01:10:06,000
Speaker 1: of I Heart Radio. Listen to Waiting on Reparations on

1138
01:10:06,080 --> 01:10:09,040
Speaker 1: the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you

1139
01:10:09,080 --> 01:10:09,919
Speaker 1: get your podcasts.