1 00:00:01,840 --> 00:00:05,040 Speaker 1: The business is. It's a horrible business. It really is 2 00:00:05,080 --> 00:00:08,600 Speaker 1: like dating a schizophrenic, even if you're lucky. But one 3 00:00:08,640 --> 00:00:12,399 Speaker 1: they have always felt is, oh I found my people. 4 00:00:14,960 --> 00:00:19,360 Speaker 2: Welcome to Off the Cup, my personal anti anxiety antidote. 5 00:00:19,640 --> 00:00:21,959 Speaker 3: This is going to be a good one. As you know, 6 00:00:22,360 --> 00:00:23,720 Speaker 3: we don't do politics here. 7 00:00:23,760 --> 00:00:26,079 Speaker 2: Off the Cup is a break from all of that, 8 00:00:26,320 --> 00:00:29,120 Speaker 2: so we'll have to dance around it a little. 9 00:00:28,840 --> 00:00:29,800 Speaker 3: Bit with today's guest. 10 00:00:29,840 --> 00:00:34,000 Speaker 2: Because as much as he's renowned for his many acting credits, 11 00:00:34,040 --> 00:00:37,880 Speaker 2: everything from The West Wing to Get Out, The Handmaid's 12 00:00:37,960 --> 00:00:41,479 Speaker 2: Tale and The Post, he's as well known for his 13 00:00:41,600 --> 00:00:45,080 Speaker 2: passion for politics. But because this is Off the Cup, 14 00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:48,840 Speaker 2: where we talk about career arcs and parenting and mental 15 00:00:48,920 --> 00:00:51,800 Speaker 2: health too, we're going to get into all of it. 16 00:00:52,920 --> 00:00:56,639 Speaker 2: Bradley Whitford is an Emmy Award winning actor of stage, television, 17 00:00:56,680 --> 00:01:00,840 Speaker 2: and film, and he's also a very involved activist, campaigning 18 00:01:00,840 --> 00:01:04,520 Speaker 2: for both issues and candidates, putting himself right in the 19 00:01:04,560 --> 00:01:06,000 Speaker 2: middle of all the action. 20 00:01:06,360 --> 00:01:08,920 Speaker 3: I'm a huge fan of all of his work. Welcome 21 00:01:08,959 --> 00:01:12,319 Speaker 3: to Off the Cup. Bradley Whitford as the Coup. 22 00:01:12,440 --> 00:01:12,880 Speaker 1: How are you. 23 00:01:13,600 --> 00:01:17,120 Speaker 3: I'm good. I'm so glad you're here. We've crosspaths on 24 00:01:17,160 --> 00:01:19,959 Speaker 3: social media for years, and I'm just so glad we're 25 00:01:19,959 --> 00:01:21,640 Speaker 3: finally getting to talk. 26 00:01:22,400 --> 00:01:25,160 Speaker 1: I'm thrilled to talk to you. You know. It's interesting 27 00:01:25,319 --> 00:01:32,800 Speaker 1: we're talking about avoiding the anxiety of politics, yep. And 28 00:01:33,120 --> 00:01:38,200 Speaker 1: it's something I have had to do consciously, between shooting 29 00:01:38,400 --> 00:01:42,720 Speaker 1: and advocating and shooting nights and then going to political 30 00:01:42,720 --> 00:01:47,840 Speaker 1: events a couple of times twice I and I've never 31 00:01:47,880 --> 00:01:52,280 Speaker 1: in my life done this. I keeled over, I like fainted, really, yeah, 32 00:01:52,320 --> 00:01:56,120 Speaker 1: which I think is beyond liberal tiers. What the right 33 00:01:56,160 --> 00:01:59,840 Speaker 1: has been going for is just to have progressives topple over. 34 00:02:00,360 --> 00:02:03,360 Speaker 1: My doctor basically said to me, you're in your sixties. 35 00:02:03,880 --> 00:02:07,600 Speaker 1: You can't do all nighters and you can't let politics 36 00:02:07,640 --> 00:02:10,640 Speaker 1: destroy you. And my wife and I have very self 37 00:02:10,680 --> 00:02:17,560 Speaker 1: consciously monitored my media intake, but I continue to advocate, 38 00:02:17,760 --> 00:02:23,480 Speaker 1: I think partially out of it's an aspiration to mental health. 39 00:02:23,600 --> 00:02:27,720 Speaker 1: I feel like if I don't speak up within reason, 40 00:02:27,919 --> 00:02:29,359 Speaker 1: I'm going to lose my mind. 41 00:02:29,680 --> 00:02:29,960 Speaker 3: Yeah. 42 00:02:30,200 --> 00:02:34,959 Speaker 1: Yes, you have children, correct, Yes, so we're all dealing 43 00:02:35,080 --> 00:02:39,799 Speaker 1: with we look at wonder with at our children at 44 00:02:40,000 --> 00:02:42,520 Speaker 1: how are they going to handle this world where we 45 00:02:42,560 --> 00:02:48,560 Speaker 1: are bombarded with so much stimuli in ways I don't 46 00:02:48,560 --> 00:02:51,320 Speaker 1: think we have just don't have an immune system for 47 00:02:52,240 --> 00:02:56,240 Speaker 1: and you've got a political movement intentionally sort of using that. 48 00:02:57,040 --> 00:02:59,920 Speaker 1: It's a very difficult balance that I kind of struggle 49 00:02:59,960 --> 00:03:01,640 Speaker 1: with every day. 50 00:03:02,000 --> 00:03:02,919 Speaker 3: You're not alone. 51 00:03:03,120 --> 00:03:05,320 Speaker 2: And like I said, even though we don't talk about 52 00:03:05,360 --> 00:03:08,919 Speaker 2: politics here, this comes up a lot because people are 53 00:03:09,040 --> 00:03:14,079 Speaker 2: very anxious about the world. And I know, being both 54 00:03:14,080 --> 00:03:17,200 Speaker 2: a journalist in politics, but also I'm an advocate myself 55 00:03:17,240 --> 00:03:22,880 Speaker 2: and an activist on some humanitarian causes. Getting involved and 56 00:03:23,160 --> 00:03:26,760 Speaker 2: whether it was like the Serian Civil War was good 57 00:03:26,800 --> 00:03:30,000 Speaker 2: for my mental health. It made me feel less helpless 58 00:03:30,040 --> 00:03:33,480 Speaker 2: and hopeless because I was doing something about this giant 59 00:03:33,560 --> 00:03:37,720 Speaker 2: problem that in a way, it made me feel more centered. 60 00:03:37,760 --> 00:03:40,360 Speaker 2: Now I had to monitor that as well, because I 61 00:03:40,400 --> 00:03:43,800 Speaker 2: would start taking that home with me, and all the 62 00:03:43,840 --> 00:03:48,400 Speaker 2: world's conflicts and awful images, I started taking that home. 63 00:03:48,480 --> 00:03:51,200 Speaker 2: And so it's a very You have to be so 64 00:03:51,360 --> 00:03:56,400 Speaker 2: intentional with news consumption, advocacy, your causes that are so 65 00:03:56,440 --> 00:03:57,160 Speaker 2: important to you. 66 00:03:57,680 --> 00:03:58,720 Speaker 3: And your mental health. 67 00:03:58,920 --> 00:04:02,440 Speaker 2: You really have to be aware and set those boundaries 68 00:04:02,480 --> 00:04:05,440 Speaker 2: so that the two aren't in conflict, the two aren't 69 00:04:05,520 --> 00:04:07,200 Speaker 2: hurting you, but you're healthy. 70 00:04:08,120 --> 00:04:08,440 Speaker 1: All right. 71 00:04:08,480 --> 00:04:10,000 Speaker 3: I want to talk about you and your work. 72 00:04:10,280 --> 00:04:12,760 Speaker 2: But first we have to start with the Aaron Sorkin 73 00:04:12,880 --> 00:04:16,000 Speaker 2: of it all, because I'm I'm a huge Sorkin fan, 74 00:04:16,839 --> 00:04:18,840 Speaker 2: especially a few good men, but also of course the 75 00:04:18,880 --> 00:04:23,839 Speaker 2: American President and West Wing obviously, but also I consulted 76 00:04:24,080 --> 00:04:27,360 Speaker 2: on the newsroom for Aaron and got to meet him 77 00:04:27,560 --> 00:04:30,120 Speaker 2: and work with him, and he's just the most wonderful. 78 00:04:30,800 --> 00:04:35,159 Speaker 1: I having dinner with him tonight. Stop true, I'll say hi. 79 00:04:35,680 --> 00:04:38,640 Speaker 2: Oh, please say hi for me. I talk to him 80 00:04:38,640 --> 00:04:40,960 Speaker 2: every now and then and adore him. 81 00:04:41,520 --> 00:04:44,520 Speaker 1: I always say about Aaron. I set it to his face. 82 00:04:44,760 --> 00:04:47,960 Speaker 1: Believe me, there's a lot of luck involved in being 83 00:04:48,000 --> 00:04:51,440 Speaker 1: able to make a living at this particular high school 84 00:04:51,600 --> 00:04:59,080 Speaker 1: extracurricular activity. Yep. But Aaron has truly given me my 85 00:04:59,560 --> 00:05:01,520 Speaker 1: career twice. 86 00:05:02,040 --> 00:05:04,640 Speaker 3: Yes, let's start with the first and a few good 87 00:05:04,640 --> 00:05:05,239 Speaker 3: men to play. 88 00:05:05,760 --> 00:05:08,640 Speaker 1: People always say like, how do you get West Wing? 89 00:05:08,839 --> 00:05:11,520 Speaker 1: This is how I got West Wing? Yeah, yeah, I 90 00:05:12,480 --> 00:05:17,560 Speaker 1: got cast in Revenge of the Nerds to colon Nerds 91 00:05:17,560 --> 00:05:21,920 Speaker 1: in Paradise, which is pretty much the godfather too of 92 00:05:21,960 --> 00:05:25,600 Speaker 1: the Nerds indeed movies, and there's a guy named Tim 93 00:05:25,600 --> 00:05:29,719 Speaker 1: Bussfield in it, and Tim played Poindexter with the violin 94 00:05:29,800 --> 00:05:36,440 Speaker 1: and the erections. And Tim and I were theater rats 95 00:05:36,480 --> 00:05:43,000 Speaker 1: and we were shooting this movie in Fort Lauderdale during 96 00:05:43,120 --> 00:05:43,880 Speaker 1: spring break. 97 00:05:44,160 --> 00:05:44,440 Speaker 3: Nice. 98 00:05:44,960 --> 00:05:47,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a good opening line at a bar. 99 00:05:47,640 --> 00:05:48,320 Speaker 3: What do you do here? 100 00:05:48,400 --> 00:05:51,599 Speaker 1: I'm shooting a movie. Yeah. But Tim and I went 101 00:05:51,640 --> 00:05:54,599 Speaker 1: to the Humana Festival, which is a one act theater 102 00:05:54,720 --> 00:06:00,919 Speaker 1: festival in Louisville, and we bonded doing that movie. Tim 103 00:06:01,040 --> 00:06:05,400 Speaker 1: was doing thirty something. Tim replaced Tom Holts in A 104 00:06:05,400 --> 00:06:10,760 Speaker 1: Few Good Men. Tim basically said to Aaron, you should 105 00:06:10,800 --> 00:06:15,599 Speaker 1: see this guy. I auditioned to play what's the Kevin 106 00:06:15,600 --> 00:06:16,120 Speaker 1: Bacon part? 107 00:06:16,240 --> 00:06:18,200 Speaker 3: Jack Ross? Jack Jack Ross? 108 00:06:18,279 --> 00:06:23,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, way to go smile on Jack rossp And I said, 109 00:06:23,400 --> 00:06:26,359 Speaker 1: it's turned out to be a career strategy of mine. 110 00:06:26,360 --> 00:06:28,840 Speaker 1: But I said, I really want to understudy the lead 111 00:06:29,000 --> 00:06:34,960 Speaker 1: if that's possible. Yes, And I did, yes, and Dan 112 00:06:35,080 --> 00:06:39,159 Speaker 1: Cathy Yes. I suggest that everybody who wants to be 113 00:06:39,200 --> 00:06:42,760 Speaker 1: an actor understudy all you can. It's terrifying. The audience 114 00:06:42,839 --> 00:06:44,719 Speaker 1: is not happy when you go on, but it's a 115 00:06:44,720 --> 00:06:50,080 Speaker 1: great way to get double the experience. YEA and Aaron 116 00:06:50,560 --> 00:06:52,960 Speaker 1: at a moment, no disrespect to me, but at a 117 00:06:53,000 --> 00:06:57,560 Speaker 1: moment when the play was appeared to be waning, when 118 00:06:57,600 --> 00:07:01,240 Speaker 1: that lead role should go to a again no offense 119 00:07:01,279 --> 00:07:07,040 Speaker 1: to me, a fading television star, Aaron said, no, I 120 00:07:07,080 --> 00:07:11,920 Speaker 1: think this guy should play it. And it was an 121 00:07:11,960 --> 00:07:16,280 Speaker 1: incredibly huge shot to give me. My dressing room at 122 00:07:16,280 --> 00:07:20,760 Speaker 1: the Music Box. Theater was bigger than my apartment. We 123 00:07:20,800 --> 00:07:24,240 Speaker 1: had a twenty four hour back then security guard. I 124 00:07:24,320 --> 00:07:29,440 Speaker 1: moved my dog Luke in and I had this magical experience. 125 00:07:29,520 --> 00:07:35,440 Speaker 1: I was the lead in a Broadway play and it 126 00:07:35,560 --> 00:07:41,720 Speaker 1: was an incredible, incredible thing. So Aarin then came to 127 00:07:41,760 --> 00:07:45,200 Speaker 1: see me a couple of years later in a play 128 00:07:45,240 --> 00:07:49,240 Speaker 1: called Three Days of Rain, and he wanted to know 129 00:07:49,280 --> 00:07:51,840 Speaker 1: if I was interested in doing a television show that 130 00:07:51,880 --> 00:07:54,560 Speaker 1: he was going to do called Sports Night yep, and 131 00:07:55,760 --> 00:08:02,200 Speaker 1: I could not do it because my oldest child was 132 00:08:02,240 --> 00:08:05,200 Speaker 1: about to be born and I had been offered a 133 00:08:05,280 --> 00:08:09,480 Speaker 1: part on a picked up on the air thirteen episode 134 00:08:09,520 --> 00:08:14,760 Speaker 1: show called The Secret Lives of Men, and Aaron understood 135 00:08:15,160 --> 00:08:19,120 Speaker 1: that with a kid coming, we didn't. Aaron was totally 136 00:08:19,240 --> 00:08:23,560 Speaker 1: untested in television. I didn't say it to him at 137 00:08:23,560 --> 00:08:27,000 Speaker 1: the time, but he was writing big movies at that point, 138 00:08:28,040 --> 00:08:31,080 Speaker 1: I thought he would write the pilot and then never 139 00:08:31,120 --> 00:08:35,199 Speaker 1: write another episode of Sports Night. Right, the opposite happened. 140 00:08:36,040 --> 00:08:39,360 Speaker 1: Secret Lives of Men did not work out great and 141 00:08:39,400 --> 00:08:43,400 Speaker 1: he had this incredible, interesting show called The Sports Night 142 00:08:43,840 --> 00:08:49,080 Speaker 1: that I was jealous of. Then West Wing comes along 143 00:08:49,679 --> 00:08:53,560 Speaker 1: and it was a fascinating audition process. I knew what 144 00:08:53,640 --> 00:08:56,520 Speaker 1: to do to get ready for Aaron. I know that 145 00:08:56,640 --> 00:09:01,679 Speaker 1: you got to have those lines not just memorized, but subconscious. 146 00:09:01,760 --> 00:09:06,640 Speaker 1: And I was walking through the Canyons and Hollywood off 147 00:09:06,679 --> 00:09:11,160 Speaker 1: book for weeks working on this Josh Lymon part which 148 00:09:11,200 --> 00:09:13,800 Speaker 1: he had said he had written for me and felt 149 00:09:13,800 --> 00:09:16,760 Speaker 1: like it fit like a glove. But anyway, I had 150 00:09:16,800 --> 00:09:19,520 Speaker 1: the best audition in my life. Could not have been better. 151 00:09:19,559 --> 00:09:21,600 Speaker 1: I get home, Aaron calls me, He's like, hit it 152 00:09:21,640 --> 00:09:24,199 Speaker 1: out of the park. It made me look great Erin 153 00:09:24,280 --> 00:09:27,040 Speaker 1: didn't have the power to cast back then. And then 154 00:09:27,960 --> 00:09:31,560 Speaker 1: we found out that Warner Brothers didn't feel that way. 155 00:09:32,240 --> 00:09:35,720 Speaker 1: Tommy Schlami, who was our executive producer, did not feel 156 00:09:35,760 --> 00:09:40,560 Speaker 1: that way. And then it became a real struggle. And 157 00:09:40,679 --> 00:09:45,640 Speaker 1: I'm still with my manager of thirty years because she 158 00:09:45,800 --> 00:09:49,600 Speaker 1: would not take no for an answer. Amazing and that's 159 00:09:49,800 --> 00:09:54,560 Speaker 1: really rare because Warner Brothers is saying stop. They said 160 00:09:54,600 --> 00:09:57,760 Speaker 1: to her, what do you not understand Brad Richard is 161 00:09:57,840 --> 00:10:00,800 Speaker 1: not going to get this part. Oh my god. And 162 00:10:01,320 --> 00:10:05,120 Speaker 1: she persisted, and I got a call. I was I 163 00:10:05,120 --> 00:10:07,040 Speaker 1: had this brand new thing called a car phone. I 164 00:10:07,040 --> 00:10:09,640 Speaker 1: got a call in Santa Monica while I was pumping 165 00:10:09,720 --> 00:10:13,360 Speaker 1: gas and it was Aaron and he said, we've cast you. 166 00:10:13,800 --> 00:10:14,360 Speaker 3: Oh my god. 167 00:10:14,600 --> 00:10:17,680 Speaker 1: And I was like, oh my god. Oh and it 168 00:10:17,720 --> 00:10:23,960 Speaker 1: had been months and he said, but you're playing Sam 169 00:10:24,000 --> 00:10:27,520 Speaker 1: And I said, Aaron, I should It was not a 170 00:10:27,559 --> 00:10:30,600 Speaker 1: card I should play, but like, I'm not the guy 171 00:10:30,640 --> 00:10:32,920 Speaker 1: with the hooker on the guy with the Christian right 172 00:10:34,080 --> 00:10:38,920 Speaker 1: And he said, give me a second. I think it 173 00:10:38,960 --> 00:10:42,000 Speaker 1: was because they were playing hardball with Rob Low in 174 00:10:42,040 --> 00:10:45,720 Speaker 1: a negotiation and they were probably undercut him. But Aaron 175 00:10:45,760 --> 00:10:52,080 Speaker 1: came back and again advocated for me. Yeah, and totally 176 00:10:52,160 --> 00:10:57,080 Speaker 1: changed my life to be able to surf on that 177 00:10:57,120 --> 00:11:00,200 Speaker 1: writing and on that guy's mind in that moment. I 178 00:11:00,240 --> 00:11:05,600 Speaker 1: am forever grateful. Oh if that had to happen, maybe 179 00:11:05,600 --> 00:11:07,720 Speaker 1: something else would have happened. But if I had not 180 00:11:07,840 --> 00:11:12,360 Speaker 1: had that experience, yeah, I mean it was twenty two 181 00:11:12,480 --> 00:11:18,240 Speaker 1: episodes a year for seven years. That's an experience I 182 00:11:18,280 --> 00:11:21,080 Speaker 1: ache for young actors because they won't get it now. Yeah, 183 00:11:21,679 --> 00:11:25,760 Speaker 1: season after season, it's acting when you're ready, when you're 184 00:11:25,840 --> 00:11:31,480 Speaker 1: not ready, when you're tired. Right, That experience completely changed 185 00:11:31,520 --> 00:11:32,600 Speaker 1: my life. 186 00:11:32,280 --> 00:11:35,760 Speaker 3: And it was such an iconic show. But you're right. 187 00:11:35,880 --> 00:11:40,040 Speaker 2: Today, you know they're doing white Lotus style shows with 188 00:11:40,240 --> 00:11:43,600 Speaker 2: like new casts every season. Or you know you're on 189 00:11:43,640 --> 00:11:45,400 Speaker 2: a Game of Thrones and you could be the star 190 00:11:45,480 --> 00:11:47,600 Speaker 2: and die in the first episode. You know, you don't 191 00:11:47,679 --> 00:11:50,520 Speaker 2: have the same kind of stability that you could back 192 00:11:50,559 --> 00:11:53,720 Speaker 2: when these long running sitcoms were prevailing. 193 00:11:53,800 --> 00:12:02,319 Speaker 1: Or that community, that intense level, familial level of intimacy. 194 00:12:02,679 --> 00:12:08,280 Speaker 3: Yeah, and we're a very close I'm sure. Yeah, yeah, 195 00:12:08,440 --> 00:12:09,079 Speaker 3: I can tell. 196 00:12:09,280 --> 00:12:13,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, we remain close. But yeah, now you know Handmaid's Tale, 197 00:12:13,520 --> 00:12:16,839 Speaker 1: I feel very close. We were lucky to have six seasons, 198 00:12:16,920 --> 00:12:22,400 Speaker 1: but we shot six seasons over ten years. Yeah, ten episodes, 199 00:12:23,000 --> 00:12:26,439 Speaker 1: and it wasn't that daily grind. Now, that daily grind 200 00:12:26,920 --> 00:12:32,320 Speaker 1: punishing for the crew, certainly for Aaron in some ways. 201 00:12:32,480 --> 00:12:35,640 Speaker 1: In many ways, that was too much, But there was 202 00:12:35,679 --> 00:12:38,800 Speaker 1: an experience there that was invaluable to me. 203 00:12:55,120 --> 00:12:57,480 Speaker 2: I want to go back a little bit and talk 204 00:12:57,520 --> 00:12:58,880 Speaker 2: about you grew up in Wisconsin. 205 00:12:58,960 --> 00:13:00,600 Speaker 3: I want to know what kind of you were. 206 00:13:01,240 --> 00:13:03,480 Speaker 1: I'm the baby in a big family. My parents had 207 00:13:03,520 --> 00:13:07,120 Speaker 1: three kids, a big break. My mom claims she was 208 00:13:07,120 --> 00:13:10,640 Speaker 1: trying to get pregnant the entire time, and then in 209 00:13:10,679 --> 00:13:14,960 Speaker 1: her forties had my brother, the Mistake, And I'm basically 210 00:13:15,000 --> 00:13:22,760 Speaker 1: the Mistake's friend because we didn't want They didn't want Dave. Yeah. 211 00:13:22,760 --> 00:13:25,760 Speaker 3: So when you get a puppy to keep your other puppy. 212 00:13:25,400 --> 00:13:29,679 Speaker 1: Company, yeah exactly. So I was there as the designated playmate. 213 00:13:30,120 --> 00:13:32,080 Speaker 1: So when he went to college, they were, you know, 214 00:13:32,120 --> 00:13:35,600 Speaker 1: in their sixties looking at me like mission accomplished. Not really. 215 00:13:35,920 --> 00:13:40,319 Speaker 1: So I was raised. I feel very, very lucky because 216 00:13:40,360 --> 00:13:43,520 Speaker 1: I was that last kid who they were choosing to have. 217 00:13:43,800 --> 00:13:49,920 Speaker 1: And now that I've had kids, my parents were incredibly loving, 218 00:13:50,360 --> 00:13:57,040 Speaker 1: incredibly supportive. My fundamental memory of my childhood that every 219 00:13:57,200 --> 00:14:00,640 Speaker 1: child should have is that every time I in the room, 220 00:14:00,679 --> 00:14:03,640 Speaker 1: they kind of lit up. They knew they were at 221 00:14:03,679 --> 00:14:08,880 Speaker 1: the end of this. They had grown children. I have 222 00:14:08,880 --> 00:14:12,320 Speaker 1: a sister's eighty five. Yeah, my sister was in college 223 00:14:12,480 --> 00:14:17,000 Speaker 1: when I was born. Their parental philosophy was love them 224 00:14:17,000 --> 00:14:19,000 Speaker 1: and keep them out of traffic because they're going to 225 00:14:19,040 --> 00:14:24,160 Speaker 1: be whatever they are, and I feel very lucky. I 226 00:14:24,160 --> 00:14:29,120 Speaker 1: always think about how different parenting is now, inevitably, and 227 00:14:29,160 --> 00:14:32,480 Speaker 1: I'm not saying I was any better at what it 228 00:14:32,600 --> 00:14:35,480 Speaker 1: seems like I'm going to criticize now. I feel like 229 00:14:35,640 --> 00:14:39,920 Speaker 1: now raising kids, we all in a very well intentioned way, 230 00:14:40,280 --> 00:14:45,760 Speaker 1: and if we're lucky, are basically looking at our kids going, Okay, 231 00:14:46,200 --> 00:14:54,080 Speaker 1: we're totally cool. But what are you because we'll support it, right, 232 00:14:54,200 --> 00:14:57,800 Speaker 1: just are you an athlete, We'll do that. Are you 233 00:14:57,840 --> 00:15:01,680 Speaker 1: an artist? Are you academic? Do it? There was none 234 00:15:01,760 --> 00:15:04,680 Speaker 1: of that right my father. I always tell the story. 235 00:15:04,760 --> 00:15:09,320 Speaker 1: My father loved me, and my father really believed in education. 236 00:15:10,040 --> 00:15:12,720 Speaker 1: And in the spring of my senior year of high school, 237 00:15:13,360 --> 00:15:16,720 Speaker 1: he took a sip of his coffee at breakfast and said, 238 00:15:18,320 --> 00:15:22,040 Speaker 1: did you apply to college? And part of it was 239 00:15:22,080 --> 00:15:24,400 Speaker 1: in Wisconsin, if you got to if you had to 240 00:15:24,440 --> 00:15:28,440 Speaker 1: be average, go to the university. There was no pressure. 241 00:15:28,800 --> 00:15:36,160 Speaker 1: So I had a corny experience doing a play in 242 00:15:36,280 --> 00:15:41,560 Speaker 1: seventh grade. I was vividly remember being backstage about to 243 00:15:41,600 --> 00:15:45,240 Speaker 1: go on in seventh grade and I'd seen my brother 244 00:15:45,320 --> 00:15:47,520 Speaker 1: do a play and it terrified me. I had seen 245 00:15:47,560 --> 00:15:51,280 Speaker 1: my sister high school play. I was like, it was 246 00:15:51,320 --> 00:15:55,480 Speaker 1: like watching a car wreck, Like why would anybody put 247 00:15:55,520 --> 00:15:58,920 Speaker 1: themselves in that in that position? And I go through 248 00:15:58,960 --> 00:16:01,680 Speaker 1: this feeling all the time. I'm still to this day, 249 00:16:01,760 --> 00:16:05,080 Speaker 1: like you could sentence people to this and crime would 250 00:16:05,120 --> 00:16:12,280 Speaker 1: go down. And then I made this entrance and it 251 00:16:12,680 --> 00:16:16,080 Speaker 1: was as close to an epiphany as I've ever had. 252 00:16:16,760 --> 00:16:22,240 Speaker 1: And the epiphany was, Oh my god, this is the 253 00:16:22,280 --> 00:16:26,880 Speaker 1: only integrated activity I've ever done. When I'm reading a book, 254 00:16:26,920 --> 00:16:28,800 Speaker 1: I have to turn off my body. When I'm doing 255 00:16:28,800 --> 00:16:31,760 Speaker 1: a sport, I have to turn off my head. This 256 00:16:32,160 --> 00:16:38,040 Speaker 1: is an immediate relationship with an audience and with other actors, 257 00:16:38,960 --> 00:16:46,560 Speaker 1: and it required everything. Here's a name drop, Bruce Springsteen wrote. 258 00:16:46,680 --> 00:16:48,680 Speaker 1: I met him many many years ago because he wrote 259 00:16:48,680 --> 00:16:51,120 Speaker 1: a song for Philadelphia which I was in. And he's 260 00:16:51,240 --> 00:16:53,760 Speaker 1: the sweetest guy on the planet. And I had a 261 00:16:53,800 --> 00:16:57,280 Speaker 1: discussion this discussion with him once because if I was 262 00:16:57,320 --> 00:16:59,960 Speaker 1: parenting my kid, I would have gone to that play, 263 00:17:00,160 --> 00:17:04,359 Speaker 1: and any contemporary parent I would have gone, oh my god, 264 00:17:04,840 --> 00:17:07,600 Speaker 1: I've never seen you happier. Do you want to take 265 00:17:07,600 --> 00:17:14,600 Speaker 1: an acting class? And I really believe that if my 266 00:17:14,720 --> 00:17:17,560 Speaker 1: dad had done that, I wouldn't have the sense of 267 00:17:17,840 --> 00:17:22,400 Speaker 1: ownership that I had by not making it pre professional. 268 00:17:22,840 --> 00:17:24,960 Speaker 1: All the way through college, I was just doing it 269 00:17:24,960 --> 00:17:28,280 Speaker 1: because I loved it. My dad, by the way, loved 270 00:17:28,640 --> 00:17:31,560 Speaker 1: I could tell he loved it. He was a frustrated musician, 271 00:17:31,680 --> 00:17:35,000 Speaker 1: amazing musician who didn't have the option coming out of 272 00:17:35,040 --> 00:17:38,760 Speaker 1: the depression, and I could tell he was into it. 273 00:17:38,840 --> 00:17:42,919 Speaker 1: But there was no pre professional pushing into it. And 274 00:17:43,760 --> 00:17:46,600 Speaker 1: you know, at one point in this conversation was bexteen. 275 00:17:46,600 --> 00:17:49,040 Speaker 1: I was like, what if your mom had come down 276 00:17:49,320 --> 00:17:52,200 Speaker 1: like with a guitar and said, oh my god, Brucie, 277 00:17:52,920 --> 00:17:55,760 Speaker 1: you got something man, And do you want to take 278 00:17:55,800 --> 00:18:00,720 Speaker 1: guitar lessons? And he said, oh, i'd be a newer 279 00:18:01,840 --> 00:18:05,400 Speaker 1: Yeah right. So it's a difficulty with parents. I certainly 280 00:18:05,440 --> 00:18:08,080 Speaker 1: did you know. With my kids, I anything they were 281 00:18:08,119 --> 00:18:11,160 Speaker 1: interested in. You know, I wanted to encourage, right, And 282 00:18:11,400 --> 00:18:14,240 Speaker 1: I think it's inevitable. It's just interesting to me. And 283 00:18:14,320 --> 00:18:18,919 Speaker 1: I'm grateful that all the way through college I was 284 00:18:19,000 --> 00:18:22,640 Speaker 1: just in many plays as I could be in. Yeah, 285 00:18:22,920 --> 00:18:25,320 Speaker 1: I wanted to act. I wanted to act more than 286 00:18:25,320 --> 00:18:28,399 Speaker 1: I want to be an actor. Yeah right right, And 287 00:18:28,440 --> 00:18:32,680 Speaker 1: then almost on a whim, I applied to graduate school, 288 00:18:32,680 --> 00:18:36,360 Speaker 1: and I remember opening this thing from Julliard and going, 289 00:18:37,080 --> 00:18:40,000 Speaker 1: Jesus Christ, I guess I'm going to be you know, 290 00:18:40,119 --> 00:18:40,920 Speaker 1: try to do this. 291 00:18:41,359 --> 00:18:44,480 Speaker 2: Yep, and you did, but I have to I just 292 00:18:44,600 --> 00:18:47,359 Speaker 2: go back for a second because I'm Yeah, it's my impression. 293 00:18:47,760 --> 00:18:49,200 Speaker 3: Looking at your yearbook. 294 00:18:50,359 --> 00:18:56,040 Speaker 2: You were a class officer, debate, forensics, math team, honor Society, orchestra, 295 00:18:56,240 --> 00:19:01,359 Speaker 2: prom court student, senate, tennis, tower time, which I appreciate. 296 00:19:01,480 --> 00:19:03,639 Speaker 3: Yes, advanced Human Relations club. 297 00:19:04,240 --> 00:19:06,159 Speaker 1: Yeah, it sounds like a euphemism. 298 00:19:06,400 --> 00:19:08,520 Speaker 3: What was Advanced Human Relations Club? 299 00:19:09,160 --> 00:19:11,359 Speaker 1: I don't remember, but I did. I had a great 300 00:19:11,400 --> 00:19:12,359 Speaker 1: time in high school. 301 00:19:12,600 --> 00:19:14,199 Speaker 2: Listen, I was gonna ask were you one of the 302 00:19:14,200 --> 00:19:16,720 Speaker 2: weirdos who loved high school? Because you did everything and 303 00:19:16,760 --> 00:19:19,720 Speaker 2: it seemed like you were super popular and happy. I've 304 00:19:19,720 --> 00:19:21,679 Speaker 2: seen all the pictures in your yearbook and you were 305 00:19:21,840 --> 00:19:22,800 Speaker 2: happy in all of them. 306 00:19:23,760 --> 00:19:30,760 Speaker 1: I yeah, yeah, I was. I was happy. Yeah. You know, Madison, 307 00:19:30,800 --> 00:19:35,560 Speaker 1: Wisconsin is a kind of shagger lot to me. Yeah, 308 00:19:35,640 --> 00:19:40,520 Speaker 1: incredibly kind people. You were able to cross pol and 309 00:19:40,600 --> 00:19:42,840 Speaker 1: eate between the jocks and the theater. 310 00:19:43,359 --> 00:19:44,840 Speaker 3: Yeah, clearly you did it all. 311 00:19:45,200 --> 00:19:47,400 Speaker 1: You know. One thing I've always felt like the business 312 00:19:47,520 --> 00:19:50,439 Speaker 1: is it's a horrible business. It really is like dating 313 00:19:50,440 --> 00:19:53,800 Speaker 1: a schizophrenic, even if you're lucky. But one they have 314 00:19:54,040 --> 00:19:58,800 Speaker 1: always felt is, oh, I found my people. And those 315 00:19:58,960 --> 00:20:01,719 Speaker 1: were the theater people bull at East High School, the 316 00:20:01,720 --> 00:20:06,240 Speaker 1: theater people at Wesleyan. Juilliard was the first time where 317 00:20:06,280 --> 00:20:08,960 Speaker 1: it was like stressy. 318 00:20:09,280 --> 00:20:12,160 Speaker 3: Because it was competitive. It was all your people were 319 00:20:12,160 --> 00:20:12,800 Speaker 3: in one place. 320 00:20:13,040 --> 00:20:15,719 Speaker 1: Yeah, and I'm sure you dealt with you know. There 321 00:20:15,960 --> 00:20:18,919 Speaker 1: there was a psychology that I think was pretty pervasive 322 00:20:18,960 --> 00:20:23,000 Speaker 1: in the ballet world, but there was a very misguided 323 00:20:23,560 --> 00:20:29,160 Speaker 1: teaching through intimidation. Yeah, oh yeah thing. And it's interesting 324 00:20:29,200 --> 00:20:32,400 Speaker 1: because it's something that I think about. I think about 325 00:20:32,440 --> 00:20:35,200 Speaker 1: all the time and sort of dealing with the different 326 00:20:36,000 --> 00:20:40,560 Speaker 1: hierarchies that I deal with now. It's very difficult as 327 00:20:40,560 --> 00:20:46,480 Speaker 1: an actor not to adopt a psychology of submission that 328 00:20:46,520 --> 00:20:49,320 Speaker 1: I think is dangerous because you're at the mercy of 329 00:20:50,320 --> 00:20:52,119 Speaker 1: you know, somebody has to write a play, somebody has 330 00:20:52,160 --> 00:20:58,560 Speaker 1: to choose you. The teachers are very powerful and truly 331 00:20:59,200 --> 00:21:04,639 Speaker 1: the best director experiences that I've had in my life. 332 00:21:05,000 --> 00:21:08,320 Speaker 1: The ones you would think would be the most intimidating, 333 00:21:08,600 --> 00:21:12,640 Speaker 1: the namyet brilliant ones that Jordan Peel and Steven Spielberg. 334 00:21:13,359 --> 00:21:21,640 Speaker 1: They know that their self interest won't be served if 335 00:21:21,720 --> 00:21:28,800 Speaker 1: the actor thinks that the director knows better than the actor. Huh, 336 00:21:29,080 --> 00:21:31,720 Speaker 1: how to play the part. I think it's like parenting. 337 00:21:32,320 --> 00:21:38,480 Speaker 1: Most directors overparent Our children deserve the opportunity to surprise us, right, 338 00:21:38,560 --> 00:21:41,760 Speaker 1: and if we really love them, they can take us 339 00:21:42,080 --> 00:21:45,800 Speaker 1: to a surprising place rather than the controlled place, right. 340 00:21:45,720 --> 00:21:47,680 Speaker 3: Or at the very least, we want them to think 341 00:21:47,720 --> 00:21:48,520 Speaker 3: it was their idea. 342 00:21:48,840 --> 00:21:53,199 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, it was so funny because you're nervous about directing. 343 00:21:53,280 --> 00:21:54,760 Speaker 1: The first time I did it, I'm reading all these 344 00:21:54,800 --> 00:21:58,080 Speaker 1: directors books and I'm reading about lenses and crossing the 345 00:21:58,160 --> 00:22:01,320 Speaker 1: line and all this technical stuf. And after the first take, 346 00:22:01,400 --> 00:22:03,040 Speaker 1: I realized, Oh, this is. 347 00:22:03,040 --> 00:22:05,560 Speaker 3: Parenting exactly right. 348 00:22:05,760 --> 00:22:08,040 Speaker 1: They need structure, they need support. 349 00:22:08,320 --> 00:22:11,000 Speaker 2: They have some independence, even if it's a false sense 350 00:22:11,040 --> 00:22:11,760 Speaker 2: of independence. 351 00:22:11,920 --> 00:22:14,360 Speaker 1: Yes, we're going to pretend. We're going to pretend we're 352 00:22:14,400 --> 00:22:17,160 Speaker 1: setting them free while we manipulate them. 353 00:22:17,440 --> 00:22:17,640 Speaker 3: Yeah. 354 00:22:18,080 --> 00:22:21,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, in addition to working with some incredible directors 355 00:22:21,480 --> 00:22:24,720 Speaker 2: in your first several years of making films, you work 356 00:22:24,800 --> 00:22:27,320 Speaker 2: with and I'm talking in the span of four years, 357 00:22:27,960 --> 00:22:31,960 Speaker 2: Harrison Ford, Robin Williams, Robert de Niro, Al Pacino, Nicole Kidman, 358 00:22:32,240 --> 00:22:36,680 Speaker 2: Clint Eastwood, Tom Hanks, Tommy Lee Jones, Susan Sarandon. Again 359 00:22:37,240 --> 00:22:42,040 Speaker 2: in four years, this is ninety to ninety four. Yeah, 360 00:22:42,119 --> 00:22:44,520 Speaker 2: when you're really first, I mean before that you had 361 00:22:44,520 --> 00:22:46,760 Speaker 2: done adventures, babysitting in some others, but like, this is 362 00:22:46,920 --> 00:22:51,359 Speaker 2: four years of working with the greatest actors on the planet. 363 00:22:51,680 --> 00:22:55,439 Speaker 3: Yeah, what was that? I imagine it was kind of a whirlwind. 364 00:22:55,440 --> 00:22:57,639 Speaker 2: But I also want to know what you learn and 365 00:22:57,680 --> 00:23:01,320 Speaker 2: what was disappointing in working with some of the is giants. 366 00:23:01,640 --> 00:23:05,680 Speaker 1: Wow, I've never you discovered that. For me, I do 367 00:23:05,760 --> 00:23:12,560 Speaker 1: remember watching the Oscars and realizing I was in both 368 00:23:12,720 --> 00:23:17,320 Speaker 1: clips when Pacino won and when Hanks won. 369 00:23:17,840 --> 00:23:23,240 Speaker 2: So it was Sense of a Woman and Philadelphia, Yeah yeah. 370 00:23:22,760 --> 00:23:24,040 Speaker 3: But also Awakenings. 371 00:23:24,080 --> 00:23:28,160 Speaker 2: I mean these were giant, giant films, beloved films. 372 00:23:28,480 --> 00:23:35,720 Speaker 1: Yeah. I had great experiences with all of these people. Tom. 373 00:23:35,840 --> 00:23:39,840 Speaker 1: Then I've worked with Tom, can I do it it 374 00:23:39,880 --> 00:23:41,040 Speaker 1: twice or three times? 375 00:23:41,040 --> 00:23:41,919 Speaker 3: Well? You did the post? 376 00:23:42,440 --> 00:23:46,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, I've worked with him three times. And saving mister Banks, 377 00:23:46,560 --> 00:23:49,080 Speaker 1: I've clocked in with him at these different times in 378 00:23:49,119 --> 00:23:52,960 Speaker 1: his career. And Tom, you know when he did Philadelphia 379 00:23:53,040 --> 00:23:56,160 Speaker 1: Tom was thought of as a light comic actor. This 380 00:23:56,359 --> 00:24:00,240 Speaker 1: was an intense thing, and Tom at that point would say, 381 00:24:00,320 --> 00:24:02,720 Speaker 1: who was hoping to be taken seriously as an actor? 382 00:24:03,040 --> 00:24:05,000 Speaker 2: I mean you were doing Philadelphia with him kind of 383 00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:06,600 Speaker 2: as he's coming off of Big. 384 00:24:06,880 --> 00:24:10,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, right, as he's coming up. What was great 385 00:24:10,520 --> 00:24:17,359 Speaker 1: was it was an invaluable time because you see that 386 00:24:17,600 --> 00:24:23,640 Speaker 1: these extraordinary professionals and the first player I ever did 387 00:24:23,760 --> 00:24:29,280 Speaker 1: was with Kathy Bates, and it was what was reassuring 388 00:24:30,560 --> 00:24:34,960 Speaker 1: was to see them kind of struggle to get there. 389 00:24:35,440 --> 00:24:35,840 Speaker 3: Yeah. 390 00:24:36,160 --> 00:24:39,840 Speaker 1: It brings up a really interesting question to me about 391 00:24:40,400 --> 00:24:50,680 Speaker 1: the perils of confidence, because I think creatively, especially there 392 00:24:50,720 --> 00:24:55,160 Speaker 1: really is nothing worse than a totally confident actor. Yes, 393 00:24:55,359 --> 00:24:59,520 Speaker 1: I mean there really is not, Okay, because the most 394 00:24:59,520 --> 00:25:09,879 Speaker 1: compelling actors James Gandolfini like notoriously in agony about his 395 00:25:10,160 --> 00:25:13,480 Speaker 1: capacity to pull this off. And what you got was 396 00:25:13,520 --> 00:25:20,240 Speaker 1: this a guy lugging this sack of humanity into every moment. 397 00:25:21,040 --> 00:25:27,600 Speaker 1: And I think it's interesting in storytelling because it's very 398 00:25:27,640 --> 00:25:32,240 Speaker 1: difficult to gain confidence. You're always fighting to gain confidence 399 00:25:32,600 --> 00:25:36,560 Speaker 1: just so you can function. I always say to this day, 400 00:25:37,119 --> 00:25:40,840 Speaker 1: and I've had I'm blessed with more experience than I 401 00:25:40,840 --> 00:25:43,639 Speaker 1: could have ever dreamed of. But until the scene works, 402 00:25:43,720 --> 00:25:48,600 Speaker 1: I don't know if it will. It's a neurotic space 403 00:25:48,720 --> 00:25:51,959 Speaker 1: and the other crazy thing. Just to diverge a little bit, 404 00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:56,159 Speaker 1: but because your answer, going to Juilliard was really fascinating, 405 00:25:56,240 --> 00:26:00,280 Speaker 1: Because you're in this building. If you want to be 406 00:26:00,320 --> 00:26:03,240 Speaker 1: a dancer, if you want to play the trumpet, if 407 00:26:03,280 --> 00:26:04,879 Speaker 1: you want to be an opera singer, there is a 408 00:26:05,080 --> 00:26:08,159 Speaker 1: mountain of technique that you have to master before we 409 00:26:08,160 --> 00:26:11,160 Speaker 1: can even begin to know whether or not you have 410 00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:15,560 Speaker 1: whatever talent is. Right. On the other hand, I've seen 411 00:26:15,680 --> 00:26:22,320 Speaker 1: dogs be good in movies. Yeah, acting is something different. 412 00:26:23,200 --> 00:26:26,320 Speaker 1: I'm not saying it's not that there's no technique or anything, 413 00:26:26,720 --> 00:26:29,680 Speaker 1: but it's a much more elusive thing. 414 00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:30,920 Speaker 3: Well and in a way. 415 00:26:31,040 --> 00:26:34,200 Speaker 2: I mean, as a dancer, if you don't start early, 416 00:26:34,240 --> 00:26:35,159 Speaker 2: you've missed your window. 417 00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:37,360 Speaker 3: It's not something you can start at twenty or eighteen. 418 00:26:37,600 --> 00:26:40,000 Speaker 2: So acting, I wouldn't say you could just pick it 419 00:26:40,080 --> 00:26:42,080 Speaker 2: up at eighteen, but you could if you were really 420 00:26:42,600 --> 00:26:45,359 Speaker 2: naturally gifted and wanted to commit to learning the craft 421 00:26:45,359 --> 00:26:45,960 Speaker 2: of it, you could. 422 00:26:46,119 --> 00:26:48,840 Speaker 1: There's a movie that's going to come out when the 423 00:26:48,840 --> 00:26:51,520 Speaker 1: audience Sworred its Sun Dance. It's going to come out. 424 00:26:52,000 --> 00:26:53,520 Speaker 1: It's called East of Wall. 425 00:26:54,440 --> 00:26:54,760 Speaker 3: Okay. 426 00:26:55,320 --> 00:26:57,720 Speaker 1: It's all people who are acting for the first time, 427 00:26:57,760 --> 00:27:00,359 Speaker 1: and I think several of them should get out dominated 428 00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:01,080 Speaker 1: for oscars. 429 00:27:01,280 --> 00:27:01,840 Speaker 3: Wow. 430 00:27:02,320 --> 00:27:03,639 Speaker 1: Blew me out of my seat. 431 00:27:04,000 --> 00:27:09,720 Speaker 3: So you're not in it? Okay, Wow East of Wall Okay. Yeah, 432 00:27:10,200 --> 00:27:11,400 Speaker 3: we'll be on the lookout for it. 433 00:27:11,480 --> 00:27:16,040 Speaker 1: Great, but it's part of the neurotic, elusive thing about acting. 434 00:27:16,280 --> 00:27:18,359 Speaker 1: I got to do in the post. I got to 435 00:27:18,400 --> 00:27:21,479 Speaker 1: do just a little with Meryl Street. But it was 436 00:27:21,480 --> 00:27:25,199 Speaker 1: fascinating because I remember, you get a call Steven Spielberg 437 00:27:25,760 --> 00:27:29,359 Speaker 1: wants you to come to his office to read a movie. 438 00:27:29,760 --> 00:27:32,960 Speaker 1: And I had known Stephen over the years I did. 439 00:27:33,480 --> 00:27:36,000 Speaker 1: I played with Hubert Humphrey and a thing he produced, 440 00:27:36,119 --> 00:27:40,240 Speaker 1: and I worked with his wife, Kate Capshaw, many many 441 00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:42,280 Speaker 1: years ago, so I know him a little. But you 442 00:27:42,400 --> 00:27:45,680 Speaker 1: go over to the offices and you sign a non 443 00:27:45,720 --> 00:27:49,920 Speaker 1: disclosure thing and you read a script and you're like Jesus, wow, yeah, 444 00:27:50,040 --> 00:27:55,160 Speaker 1: what an amazing story. And then as you're leaving, they 445 00:27:55,200 --> 00:27:58,520 Speaker 1: go Stephen wants to talk to you. Can you stay 446 00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:02,960 Speaker 1: And you're like, yes, sure, And you go into a 447 00:28:03,040 --> 00:28:05,040 Speaker 1: room and Steven walks in and he says, did you 448 00:28:05,080 --> 00:28:08,520 Speaker 1: read the script? And yeah, and would you like to 449 00:28:08,560 --> 00:28:11,120 Speaker 1: do it? Would you like to play this part? And 450 00:28:11,440 --> 00:28:13,720 Speaker 1: I think I actually did say no, Steven, I you know, 451 00:28:13,760 --> 00:28:19,360 Speaker 1: I'd rather not, right of course, And he said, part 452 00:28:19,359 --> 00:28:20,520 Speaker 1: of the reason I want you to do this is 453 00:28:20,560 --> 00:28:22,119 Speaker 1: I've seen a couple of things you've done and I 454 00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:25,240 Speaker 1: haven't known who you are for a second. So whatever 455 00:28:25,320 --> 00:28:29,760 Speaker 1: we're doing vocally or anything, this was I think the 456 00:28:29,800 --> 00:28:32,040 Speaker 1: only character in the movie wasn't real. It was a 457 00:28:32,080 --> 00:28:33,440 Speaker 1: composite Arthur. 458 00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:35,760 Speaker 3: You're talking about yeah, oh interesting. 459 00:28:35,880 --> 00:28:38,680 Speaker 1: But he's like, change your voice a little, do some 460 00:28:38,840 --> 00:28:42,080 Speaker 1: weird with your hair and interesting? And I said are 461 00:28:42,080 --> 00:28:45,160 Speaker 1: we When do we rehearse? And he's like I don't 462 00:28:45,200 --> 00:28:49,080 Speaker 1: like to rehearse. Oh, And he's like, Meryl really wants 463 00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:53,760 Speaker 1: to rehearse. But and I was like, she's she's pretty 464 00:28:53,960 --> 00:28:56,840 Speaker 1: pretty good at acting. And he's like, yeah, yeah, I don't. 465 00:28:56,880 --> 00:28:58,520 Speaker 1: I don't. I don't like to rehearse. And I'm like, 466 00:28:58,600 --> 00:29:00,000 Speaker 1: when is the read through? And he's like, I don't 467 00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:01,920 Speaker 1: I like to do read throughs. He's like, Meryl really 468 00:29:01,960 --> 00:29:05,920 Speaker 1: wants to read through. I'm like, what is ed? He 469 00:29:06,000 --> 00:29:10,600 Speaker 1: said a funny thing with a laugh. He said, yeah, 470 00:29:10,640 --> 00:29:12,800 Speaker 1: I don't like read throughs because they give people the 471 00:29:12,880 --> 00:29:15,920 Speaker 1: idea that this is going to be a more democratic process. 472 00:29:16,000 --> 00:29:18,560 Speaker 3: Then you're gonna have a say in this. 473 00:29:19,320 --> 00:29:26,480 Speaker 1: But it's interesting speaking of over confidence, Steven intentionally, I 474 00:29:26,560 --> 00:29:30,400 Speaker 1: assumed because of his facility as a filmmaker, this guy 475 00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:34,240 Speaker 1: goes in with a plan, right, And the opposite is true. 476 00:29:34,920 --> 00:29:41,120 Speaker 1: He intentionally gets in there and sort of plays the 477 00:29:41,280 --> 00:29:48,760 Speaker 1: crew like a jazz band. He does not make decisions 478 00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:51,840 Speaker 1: in advance. It's part of the reason he's wonderful to 479 00:29:51,880 --> 00:29:55,920 Speaker 1: act with. He'll see something, he'll smell something in a 480 00:29:56,000 --> 00:30:00,600 Speaker 1: take and go on that journey. He would see Meryll. 481 00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:05,320 Speaker 1: The overwhelming sensation when Meryl Streep is doing a complicated 482 00:30:05,320 --> 00:30:09,400 Speaker 1: thing in front of you, I was like, oh my god, 483 00:30:10,000 --> 00:30:13,800 Speaker 1: like she's playing five pianos. Wow. 484 00:30:13,960 --> 00:30:14,160 Speaker 3: Yeah. 485 00:30:14,520 --> 00:30:17,560 Speaker 1: We're told as actors to make a choice. That's the 486 00:30:18,360 --> 00:30:24,440 Speaker 1: cliche in acting, teaching choices. It really I've always struggled 487 00:30:24,480 --> 00:30:27,440 Speaker 1: with that because it always seems to flatten things out. 488 00:30:27,760 --> 00:30:32,360 Speaker 1: And I remember watching Meryl just go through all of 489 00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:35,600 Speaker 1: these things. It really changed the way I thought about 490 00:30:35,600 --> 00:30:41,960 Speaker 1: acting that instead of narrowing the aperture of what a 491 00:30:42,080 --> 00:30:48,240 Speaker 1: character is or what someone is feeling. Have the balls 492 00:30:48,320 --> 00:30:59,280 Speaker 1: to throw it open and see what happens. 493 00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:05,400 Speaker 3: All right, we're gonna do a lightning round. 494 00:31:05,680 --> 00:31:06,160 Speaker 1: Oh God. 495 00:31:11,800 --> 00:31:15,320 Speaker 3: The first couple questions are quiz, who do you play 496 00:31:15,320 --> 00:31:16,200 Speaker 3: on Drunk History? 497 00:31:17,680 --> 00:31:20,360 Speaker 1: It's the Scopes Trial. I totally forget who I. 498 00:31:20,280 --> 00:31:24,480 Speaker 3: Played William Jennings Bryant, Na Jennings Bryant. Yep, you're one of. 499 00:31:24,440 --> 00:31:28,280 Speaker 2: The voice callers on Fraser in an episode called Kissing Cousins. 500 00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:32,000 Speaker 2: What was Stu's problem? 501 00:31:32,560 --> 00:31:35,200 Speaker 1: I have absolutely no idea memory. 502 00:31:35,680 --> 00:31:37,960 Speaker 3: Yeah, I can't remember his problem. 503 00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:40,240 Speaker 2: No, he was afraid to give up his freedom when 504 00:31:40,240 --> 00:31:42,760 Speaker 2: his girlfriend wanted him to move in and. 505 00:31:42,720 --> 00:31:43,600 Speaker 3: Get more serious. 506 00:31:44,040 --> 00:31:46,080 Speaker 2: But a lot of people don't know that the caller 507 00:31:46,360 --> 00:31:49,560 Speaker 2: in the beginning of every Fraser episode is a celebrity. 508 00:31:49,760 --> 00:31:53,040 Speaker 2: Is a well known celebrity that you never see but 509 00:31:53,160 --> 00:31:55,480 Speaker 2: you hear them call in, and that you had one 510 00:31:55,520 --> 00:31:57,440 Speaker 2: of those wonderful roles. 511 00:31:57,000 --> 00:32:01,800 Speaker 1: I miss those. My kids get embarrassed because I always 512 00:32:01,880 --> 00:32:04,800 Speaker 1: make the joke over and over again. If we're in 513 00:32:04,840 --> 00:32:06,720 Speaker 1: a restaurant, if the waiter says, can I get you 514 00:32:06,760 --> 00:32:10,080 Speaker 1: anything else? I'm always like, yeah, A four camera sitcom in. 515 00:32:10,120 --> 00:32:12,720 Speaker 2: La right, the good old days. I mean as a viewer, 516 00:32:12,880 --> 00:32:14,920 Speaker 2: there were the good old days for us too. If 517 00:32:14,960 --> 00:32:17,920 Speaker 2: you could play a president, because I know you played 518 00:32:17,960 --> 00:32:20,640 Speaker 2: Hubert Humphrey in all the way. If you could play 519 00:32:20,640 --> 00:32:22,480 Speaker 2: a president, who would it be? 520 00:32:23,680 --> 00:32:28,200 Speaker 1: I think it would be very It's a toss up. 521 00:32:28,800 --> 00:32:32,440 Speaker 1: I would love to play FDR. I think that time 522 00:32:32,920 --> 00:32:39,840 Speaker 1: is fascinating. Yeah, I don't understand how. There is an 523 00:32:39,880 --> 00:32:45,719 Speaker 1: incredible television show, The Crown, beautifully done, beautifully written, beautifully 524 00:32:45,760 --> 00:32:51,000 Speaker 1: acted about a royal family. I would be very interesting. 525 00:32:51,080 --> 00:32:54,400 Speaker 1: I think the American Crown would have something to do 526 00:32:54,440 --> 00:33:02,120 Speaker 1: with FDR and would require an upstairs downstags double take. 527 00:33:02,800 --> 00:33:05,440 Speaker 1: But the other partresident I'd like to play is Eisenhower 528 00:33:05,880 --> 00:33:09,640 Speaker 1: because I think it would be fascinating to play a 529 00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:18,920 Speaker 1: conventionally perceived middle of the road conservative whose warnings about 530 00:33:19,200 --> 00:33:24,160 Speaker 1: many things, including the military industrial complex, would make AOC blush. 531 00:33:27,040 --> 00:33:31,480 Speaker 1: I just think you would be a fascinating It would 532 00:33:31,520 --> 00:33:36,200 Speaker 1: be fascinating to bring that, yes, because I know you 533 00:33:36,280 --> 00:33:40,400 Speaker 1: come from a more from the Republican background. I come 534 00:33:40,440 --> 00:33:44,960 Speaker 1: from a progressive background, and I think of the people 535 00:33:45,080 --> 00:33:47,240 Speaker 1: that used to be frustrated with and I feel like, 536 00:33:47,720 --> 00:33:49,960 Speaker 1: you know, George Bush looks like Abby Hoffman. 537 00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:54,720 Speaker 3: Now Mitt Romney, Oh yeah, I mean, please please? I know. 538 00:33:55,960 --> 00:34:00,120 Speaker 2: Okay, who in film not TV? Who in film has 539 00:34:00,160 --> 00:34:03,600 Speaker 2: played the best fictional president? And I can give you 540 00:34:03,960 --> 00:34:07,960 Speaker 2: a list. Morgan Freeman, Deep Impact, Bill Pullman, Independence Day, 541 00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:12,160 Speaker 2: Michael Douglass American President, Jeff Bridges, The Contender, that's my favorite, 542 00:34:12,440 --> 00:34:17,040 Speaker 2: Kevin Klein, Dave Harrison, Ford, Air Force One, John Travolta, 543 00:34:17,120 --> 00:34:21,880 Speaker 2: Primary Colors, Billy Bob Thornton Love. Actually, Peter Sellers Doctor 544 00:34:21,920 --> 00:34:24,520 Speaker 2: Strange Love. That's just a list of some of them. 545 00:34:24,560 --> 00:34:25,760 Speaker 2: If you have others, find. 546 00:34:25,520 --> 00:34:28,920 Speaker 3: But it's got to be Peter Sellers in Doctor Strange Love. 547 00:34:29,239 --> 00:34:30,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's awesome. 548 00:34:30,200 --> 00:34:32,200 Speaker 2: Chart Well, that's a good one. It's hard to argue 549 00:34:32,200 --> 00:34:34,840 Speaker 2: with Peter Sellers. But I think Jeff Bridges in The Contender. 550 00:34:35,840 --> 00:34:38,440 Speaker 2: I'd love to see that script because from the Shark 551 00:34:38,560 --> 00:34:43,400 Speaker 2: Sandwiches and all of his little idiosyncrasies, I wonder how 552 00:34:43,480 --> 00:34:45,680 Speaker 2: much Jeff Bridges brought to that role and how much 553 00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:48,719 Speaker 2: was on the page, because it's just it's so good 554 00:34:48,719 --> 00:34:50,960 Speaker 2: and quirky and yet believable. 555 00:34:52,520 --> 00:34:53,360 Speaker 3: It's a great movie. 556 00:34:53,400 --> 00:34:54,240 Speaker 1: He's a great actor. 557 00:34:54,520 --> 00:34:56,960 Speaker 3: Okay, is the West Wing getting a reboot? 558 00:34:58,280 --> 00:35:01,919 Speaker 1: I have no idea. Aaron tonight, I'll ask Aaron tonight. 559 00:35:01,960 --> 00:35:03,640 Speaker 1: You know what I do think. I think it's probably 560 00:35:03,640 --> 00:35:08,080 Speaker 1: a mistake. I always say in television series, you want 561 00:35:08,080 --> 00:35:12,520 Speaker 1: to get out before the banana turns brown. I do 562 00:35:12,600 --> 00:35:16,759 Speaker 1: think it would be fascinating if you found a way. 563 00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:22,000 Speaker 1: We're all a little geriatric now, but if you found 564 00:35:22,040 --> 00:35:30,080 Speaker 1: a way to have that naive idealism confront today's political landscape. Yes, 565 00:35:30,560 --> 00:35:34,320 Speaker 1: head on, yes, not avoid that issue. 566 00:35:35,120 --> 00:35:35,920 Speaker 3: Capra's gone. 567 00:35:36,880 --> 00:35:41,799 Speaker 1: Yes, now. I always thought that the shows, and I 568 00:35:41,800 --> 00:35:45,400 Speaker 1: think Aaron feels this way. You know, Oh, it's sentimental. 569 00:35:45,719 --> 00:35:48,760 Speaker 1: You know, it's a fantasy. And we were always compared 570 00:35:48,800 --> 00:35:51,759 Speaker 1: to the Sopranos, and I was like six people who 571 00:35:51,800 --> 00:35:55,480 Speaker 1: believe in the president they're serving, not a fantasy hit 572 00:35:55,600 --> 00:35:56,960 Speaker 1: man in therapy. 573 00:35:57,360 --> 00:35:59,239 Speaker 3: That's a fantasy. 574 00:36:00,239 --> 00:36:04,000 Speaker 1: And if you look at Aaron will always say, if 575 00:36:04,040 --> 00:36:13,560 Speaker 1: you look at what the Bartlet administration accomplished, it wasn't much. Yes, yeah, 576 00:36:13,600 --> 00:36:17,160 Speaker 1: we didn't go oh healthcare for everybody, like we really 577 00:36:17,200 --> 00:36:21,920 Speaker 1: lost a lot. And I think Aaron captured something that 578 00:36:22,520 --> 00:36:30,080 Speaker 1: is what I see as the real heroic political impulse. 579 00:36:30,239 --> 00:36:33,759 Speaker 1: Every one of those shows was some version of the 580 00:36:33,840 --> 00:36:36,440 Speaker 1: question of how dirty do my feet have to get 581 00:36:36,760 --> 00:36:40,560 Speaker 1: without me disappearing in the month in order to get 582 00:36:40,600 --> 00:36:44,120 Speaker 1: an inch of what I really want done? And it's 583 00:36:44,120 --> 00:36:48,239 Speaker 1: actually very easy to stand on principle, But how do 584 00:36:48,280 --> 00:36:49,040 Speaker 1: you get it done? 585 00:36:49,400 --> 00:36:50,880 Speaker 3: Yep? Okay? 586 00:36:50,920 --> 00:36:53,520 Speaker 2: The final question is the one that's most important to 587 00:36:53,640 --> 00:36:55,719 Speaker 2: us here. We ask it at the end of every 588 00:36:55,760 --> 00:37:00,680 Speaker 2: podcast because it's important to me culturally. When is iced 589 00:37:00,680 --> 00:37:01,480 Speaker 2: coffee season? 590 00:37:04,040 --> 00:37:07,120 Speaker 1: I think it's I think it's three hundred and sixty 591 00:37:07,160 --> 00:37:07,799 Speaker 1: five days a year. 592 00:37:07,880 --> 00:37:11,680 Speaker 3: That's the correct answer. That's the correct answer. It's your round, 593 00:37:12,239 --> 00:37:13,719 Speaker 3: yes answer either way. 594 00:37:13,920 --> 00:37:16,680 Speaker 1: I don't know if this is true, but I heard 595 00:37:17,239 --> 00:37:22,240 Speaker 1: that the Renaissance in Italy, Yes, happened one year after 596 00:37:22,280 --> 00:37:25,520 Speaker 1: they imported coffee, and I believe it. And these guys 597 00:37:25,520 --> 00:37:30,280 Speaker 1: were like, we should paint the fucking ceiling, man. Yeah, 598 00:37:30,320 --> 00:37:32,160 Speaker 1: like yeah, I could work on my back. 599 00:37:32,760 --> 00:37:35,520 Speaker 3: Yeah, I paint. You get the Tower of Pisa, No, 600 00:37:35,560 --> 00:37:37,120 Speaker 3: wonder why you see that guy? 601 00:37:37,360 --> 00:37:40,440 Speaker 1: See that guy, David and Go and the guys like, yeah, 602 00:37:40,600 --> 00:37:43,520 Speaker 1: you're gonna draw him. No, man, no, I'm gonna carve 603 00:37:43,600 --> 00:37:45,080 Speaker 1: him out of what No? 604 00:37:45,080 --> 00:37:46,640 Speaker 3: No, cutting him out of stone? 605 00:37:47,200 --> 00:37:50,839 Speaker 1: Big Stone. It's all caffeine. 606 00:37:51,480 --> 00:37:52,120 Speaker 3: I love that. 607 00:37:52,239 --> 00:37:55,279 Speaker 1: And the news or the health news, as you must know, 608 00:37:56,000 --> 00:37:58,800 Speaker 1: it's all good news on coffee. 609 00:38:00,080 --> 00:38:02,680 Speaker 2: So we do a companion podcast here called Togg and 610 00:38:02,719 --> 00:38:07,000 Speaker 2: Coffee where we talk about all the health benefits of coffee. 611 00:38:07,360 --> 00:38:09,200 Speaker 2: And then there are always like these studies that come 612 00:38:09,239 --> 00:38:11,960 Speaker 2: out telling you what not to do with coffee. 613 00:38:12,000 --> 00:38:14,319 Speaker 3: But coffee is good for you. Coffee is good for you. 614 00:38:14,560 --> 00:38:15,680 Speaker 3: Caffeine is good for you. 615 00:38:16,320 --> 00:38:21,280 Speaker 1: It's good for your liver, it's good for colon cancer. 616 00:38:21,080 --> 00:38:25,120 Speaker 2: Your heart yep, yeah, inflammation, yeah, we believe me. We 617 00:38:25,160 --> 00:38:27,720 Speaker 2: cover it. We cover all the important things here, Bradley, 618 00:38:27,760 --> 00:38:28,760 Speaker 2: and all the important things. 619 00:38:28,760 --> 00:38:29,840 Speaker 1: Four cups a day. 620 00:38:30,360 --> 00:38:32,440 Speaker 3: Four cups is considered okay. 621 00:38:32,960 --> 00:38:35,720 Speaker 1: Yeah. You may irritate your teenage children, yes. 622 00:38:35,719 --> 00:38:37,000 Speaker 3: But four cups is okay. 623 00:38:37,280 --> 00:38:39,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, Bradley Whitford, this was such a joy and a 624 00:38:40,000 --> 00:38:46,440 Speaker 2: pressure and an honor, truly aim higher. I'm so glad 625 00:38:46,440 --> 00:38:48,640 Speaker 2: we did it. And uh yeah, I hope we cross 626 00:38:48,680 --> 00:38:49,359 Speaker 2: paths again soon. 627 00:38:49,520 --> 00:38:51,560 Speaker 1: Me too, Me too, I'm a fan, so thank you. 628 00:38:54,320 --> 00:38:57,480 Speaker 3: Coming up next week, I talked to actor Justin Bartha 629 00:38:57,680 --> 00:39:00,279 Speaker 3: of Natural Treasure and the hangover. 630 00:39:00,680 --> 00:39:04,160 Speaker 4: National Treasure has really kind of been this generational gift. 631 00:39:04,680 --> 00:39:07,319 Speaker 4: I've had people come up and say, I watched it 632 00:39:07,320 --> 00:39:08,440 Speaker 4: with my dying mother. 633 00:39:08,760 --> 00:39:10,680 Speaker 1: My grandparents love that movie. 634 00:39:10,760 --> 00:39:14,680 Speaker 4: With Hangover, you know, there's a lot of just screaming 635 00:39:14,960 --> 00:39:18,239 Speaker 4: outside of cars. I found aug you know, it's like 636 00:39:18,280 --> 00:39:18,799 Speaker 4: a lot of that. 637 00:39:18,880 --> 00:39:20,440 Speaker 1: I can't go to Vegas anymore. 638 00:39:22,360 --> 00:39:24,759 Speaker 2: Off the Cup is a production of iHeart Podcasts as 639 00:39:24,800 --> 00:39:26,320 Speaker 2: part of the Reason Choice Network. 640 00:39:26,520 --> 00:39:27,920 Speaker 3: If you want more, check out the. 641 00:39:27,880 --> 00:39:32,040 Speaker 2: Other Reason Choice podcasts, Politics with Jamel Hill and Native 642 00:39:32,120 --> 00:39:34,480 Speaker 2: Land Pod. For Off the Cup, I am your host, 643 00:39:34,520 --> 00:39:37,719 Speaker 2: Si Cup. Editing and sound design by Derek Clements. Our 644 00:39:37,760 --> 00:39:42,160 Speaker 2: executive producers are me Si Cup, Lauren Hanson, and Lindsay Hoffman. 645 00:39:42,600 --> 00:39:45,719 Speaker 2: Rate and review wherever you get your podcasts, Follow or 646 00:39:45,760 --> 00:39:52,600 Speaker 2: subscribe for new episodes every Wednesday.