WEBVTT - From the Vault: The Nutcracker

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<v Speaker 1>Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind. My name

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<v Speaker 1>is Robert Lamb.

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<v Speaker 2>And I am Joe McCormick. And hey, it's Saturday, so

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<v Speaker 2>we're heading into the vault for an older episode of

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<v Speaker 2>the show. This one originally published on December fourteenth, twenty

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<v Speaker 2>twenty three, and it's about the Nutcracker. Yes, the object,

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<v Speaker 2>the tool, the invention, the Nutcracker.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, that's right. And this, of course is the precursor

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<v Speaker 1>to an episode that will be rerunning later this month

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<v Speaker 1>on the Rat King. The pair of holiday episodes they

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<v Speaker 1>came out last year.

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<v Speaker 3>Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind, the production of iHeartRadio.

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<v Speaker 1>Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. My name

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<v Speaker 1>is Robert.

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<v Speaker 2>Lamb and I am Joe McCormick. And ooh, I can

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<v Speaker 2>almost smell hot cocoa and peppermint because the Christmas spirit

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<v Speaker 2>is a live. Today we're doing our holiday episode and

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<v Speaker 2>we're going to be talking about the Nutcracker, as promised

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<v Speaker 2>in the last episode.

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<v Speaker 1>That's right. On Tuesday, we discussed the rat King and

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<v Speaker 1>of course how that relates to the Mouse King, the

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<v Speaker 1>enemy of the Nutcracker, from the original source material for

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<v Speaker 1>Tchaikowsky's eighteen ninety two ballet, we talked about this it's

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<v Speaker 1>the work of German dark romantic author Eta Hoffman and

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<v Speaker 1>eighteen sixteen short story titled The Nutcracker in the Mouse King.

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<v Speaker 1>So we talked a good bit about monstrous, multi headed rats,

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<v Speaker 1>and the original short story does feature some just horrific

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<v Speaker 1>visions of this dreaded entity. But today it's time to

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<v Speaker 1>talk about the protagonist of this story. Yes, it's the Nutcracker. Rob.

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<v Speaker 2>When you were a kid, did your family have like

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<v Speaker 2>a classic style Christmas decoration nutcracker with the lever and

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<v Speaker 2>the jaw.

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<v Speaker 1>I think we always had one around, or there was

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<v Speaker 1>at least a Christmas ornament that had a nutcracker on it,

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<v Speaker 1>but I don't remember. We certainly did not have a

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<v Speaker 1>function nutcracker, at least as far as I can recall.

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<v Speaker 2>I remember enjoying the creepy inhuman mechanics of like how

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<v Speaker 2>far the jaw would open, and the very the squareness

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<v Speaker 2>of it, you know. I like the fact that it

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<v Speaker 2>had corners and it was almost like the pharyngeal jaw

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<v Speaker 2>of like the xenomor for something.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, you know, And it's something that you can

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<v Speaker 1>toy around with and yeah, and even if it's decorative

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<v Speaker 1>and you're a kid, if you're left alone with it,

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<v Speaker 1>you're gonna end up trying to crack some nuts in

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<v Speaker 1>that weird jaw of the nutcracker. Now, I feel like

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<v Speaker 1>most of you know exactly what sort of nutcrackers I'm

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<v Speaker 1>talking about here. You know, he's an old timey soldier

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<v Speaker 1>or king standing up, made out of woods, a tall hat,

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<v Speaker 1>big teeth, and a movable jaw that works via a lever.

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<v Speaker 1>So the lever is positioned on the nutcracker's back. You

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<v Speaker 1>pull up on the lever and this opens the jaw.

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<v Speaker 1>Insert a nut, push down on the lever, or pull

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<v Speaker 1>down on the lever, Squeeze down on the lever, however

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<v Speaker 1>you apply it, and the force is going to cause

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<v Speaker 1>the jaws and a nutcracker to close, cracking the nut.

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<v Speaker 1>That is, of course, if you're using a functional wooden nutcracker.

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<v Speaker 1>Many of the ones you encountered today are purely decorative.

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<v Speaker 1>They were never meant to actually crack a nut. Some

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<v Speaker 1>of them even have like little capes on, clearly making

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<v Speaker 1>the lever inaccessible if there even is a lever back there.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I recall thinking this about the nutcrackers of my youth.

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<v Speaker 2>It was like this. It does feel flimsy. I don't

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<v Speaker 2>know if it would stand up to a nut.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Many times we don't even need to crack the nuts,

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<v Speaker 1>right we're getting we're receiving our nuts already in some

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<v Speaker 1>sort of a snack mix. They've already been cracked.

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<v Speaker 3>Uh.

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<v Speaker 1>Sometimes cracking is not entirely necessary. You get a nice

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<v Speaker 1>bag of pistachios, they are only going to be those

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<v Speaker 1>problem pistachios that you're gonna have to crack later. The

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<v Speaker 1>rest you can open by getting your your you know,

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<v Speaker 1>your salty fingers in there and then eventually like having

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<v Speaker 1>to to slip your fingernail into the into the crevice

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<v Speaker 1>and pry them open that way.

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<v Speaker 2>But if you apply force in just the wrong way,

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<v Speaker 2>it'll kind of like nick your nail and pull it back. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>for creepy feeling, I don't like.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but it's satisfying. You know. It's one of those

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<v Speaker 1>things that is it's like deeply embedded in our genes,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, the idea that oh, here's a nut, I've

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<v Speaker 1>got to crack it, and then I've got this sweet reward,

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<v Speaker 1>and now I'm going to keep doing it again and again.

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<v Speaker 2>It does feel so biologically deep that it's like one

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<v Speaker 2>of our primary metaphors for just solving a problem, cracking

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<v Speaker 2>a nut.

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<v Speaker 1>That's right, got to crack that nut. It is a

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<v Speaker 1>problem to be solved, but there is a reward and

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<v Speaker 1>there's got to be a way into it, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>at least. This is often like you can't just give

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<v Speaker 1>up on that pistatio that can't be opened, or that

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<v Speaker 1>that nut that seemingly can't be cracked, because you know

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<v Speaker 1>there's something good in there now. Quick anthropology note, there

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<v Speaker 1>is a primate species this is Parenthepus boise eye, which

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<v Speaker 1>upon discovery in nineteen fifty nine was dubbed nut cracker

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<v Speaker 1>Man due to the skulls, large back teeth, and jaws.

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<v Speaker 1>I included an image of reconstruction of this particular skull

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<v Speaker 1>for you here, Joe.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, this looks like the opposite of my childhood nutcracker.

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<v Speaker 2>I think that the owner of the skull could have

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<v Speaker 2>dominated some nuts.

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<v Speaker 1>This would make for an interesting monstrous adaptation of the

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<v Speaker 1>nutcracker and the mouse King. Have your multi headed mouse

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<v Speaker 1>king and all fierce and disturbing, but then also have

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<v Speaker 1>your nutcracker be nutcracker man. Now we'll dive into deeper

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<v Speaker 1>history concerning just nutcracking here in a minute, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>and we'll get into other traditional ways of cracking nut,

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<v Speaker 1>some anthropomorphic in nature as well, like our nutcracker soldier.

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<v Speaker 1>But first let's get to know the wooden German nutcracker

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<v Speaker 1>a little bit better. So in looking around for various sources,

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<v Speaker 1>there does seem to be one individual in particular who

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<v Speaker 1>stands out, and it's the nutcracker Lady, and that's Arlene Wagner,

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<v Speaker 1>who is an author, has written books about nutcrackers, and

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<v Speaker 1>is also the co founder of the really fun Looking

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<v Speaker 1>Nutcracker Museum in Levenworth, Washington. And she points out that

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<v Speaker 1>standing wooden nutcrackers like these, like the traditional holiday nutcracker

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<v Speaker 1>as we know them, these were known in nineteenth century

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<v Speaker 1>German as nousnachers, listed as such in the Dictionary of

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<v Speaker 1>the Brothers Grim. Many of these were made in the

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<v Speaker 1>Erzgebirge region and would have been the ones to inspire

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<v Speaker 1>Hoffman in his writing of the Nutcracker and the Mouse King.

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<v Speaker 1>And they were not all powered by lever, as it

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<v Speaker 1>turns out, some of these were powered by screw I

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<v Speaker 1>included an image of a screw based nutcracking nutcracker for

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<v Speaker 1>you here, Joe.

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<v Speaker 2>But they've all got whether it's screw or lever, they've

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<v Speaker 2>all got the mustache. Now, the mustache is essential, as

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<v Speaker 2>is the tall hat. But the screw guy, he has

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<v Speaker 2>just kind of like a wide circular mouth sort of

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<v Speaker 2>a mouth, and in there you see the screw. Like

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<v Speaker 2>basically you would just drive the screw home into the

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<v Speaker 2>top of the nut and the gradual wars would bust it.

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<v Speaker 2>With the screw guy, I kind of missed the mouth

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<v Speaker 2>of saur On style teeth that we have in the

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<v Speaker 2>ones with the levers.

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<v Speaker 1>It does seem like a design misstep because part of

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<v Speaker 1>the whole fun that, like the whole reason you would

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<v Speaker 1>imagine that someone created a humanoid nutcracker is because it

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<v Speaker 1>moves like a jaw and you're putting something into this

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<v Speaker 1>little guy's mouth and making him smash it. This guy

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<v Speaker 1>with a screw that comes down from the roof of

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<v Speaker 1>his mouth like down through his pallet to break open

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<v Speaker 1>the nut like this just it doesn't it doesn't feel

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<v Speaker 1>as natural. It feels like someone improved upon the design

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<v Speaker 1>and destroyed the spirit in the process, but again these

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<v Speaker 1>are also classic nutcrackers fair enough. Now, apparently there was

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<v Speaker 1>a bit more variety in the design until around eighteen

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<v Speaker 1>seventy two, when one Wilhelm of Fuckner produced the first

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<v Speaker 1>commercial nutcrackers based on like one singular design. And this

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<v Speaker 1>was not like a factory situation, it's just using a lathe.

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<v Speaker 1>But this, like apparent kickstarted sort of the canonization of

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<v Speaker 1>what a nutcracker is and what it should look like.

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<v Speaker 1>And his family still produces these. According to Carol Rosenblatt,

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<v Speaker 1>who wrote an article on Atlas Obscura just earlier this

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<v Speaker 1>month about the history of the nutcracker. Now, Wagner writes

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<v Speaker 1>the decorative wooden European nutcrackers in general, like not necessarily soldiers,

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<v Speaker 1>date back to the fifteenth and sixteenth centuries in England

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<v Speaker 1>and France, and these traditions continued on during the eighteenth

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<v Speaker 1>and nineteenth centuries. So you saw a great deal of

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<v Speaker 1>ornate wooden nutcracker craftsmanship eventually in the alpine regions of

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<v Speaker 1>Germany and Italy. Because again, there's nothing about a nutcracker

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<v Speaker 1>that demands that it be shaped like a soldier. We're

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<v Speaker 1>talking about a tool that is a simple lever, and

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<v Speaker 1>then at various points people have decided to fancy it

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<v Speaker 1>up a bit because you can just have something that,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, crabcloth crunchers are basically the same thing. Crabcriot

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<v Speaker 1>crackers just a simple lever to allow you to apply

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<v Speaker 1>the necessary force to break a shell open, be it

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<v Speaker 1>the cell of a crustacean or the shell of a nut.

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<v Speaker 1>But people just end up having fun with it, creating

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<v Speaker 1>luxury items even that are still to some degree functional,

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<v Speaker 1>And then in doing it, you know, you can't help

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<v Speaker 1>but let your imagination run wild. Is it the mouth

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<v Speaker 1>of a man? Is it the mouth of a beast?

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<v Speaker 1>The legs of a beast? Perhaps, you know, perhaps it

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<v Speaker 1>has nothing to do with actual anatomical movements. You just

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<v Speaker 1>want to add some beautiful motifs to the overall nutcracker. Now,

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<v Speaker 1>according to Noreen Malone, writing for Slate and twenty ten,

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<v Speaker 1>the German nutcracker dolls the standard ones that we're talking

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<v Speaker 1>about here that look like soldiers were at least considered

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<v Speaker 1>good luck in German traditions. And I've seen other sources

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<v Speaker 1>at least loosely allude to some sort of apotropaic properties

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<v Speaker 1>as well. You know, the idea that it's this soldier

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<v Speaker 1>is going to frighten away evil spirits or bad luck

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<v Speaker 1>or something to that effect. So you know, the idea

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<v Speaker 1>that something not only as could be lucky, but it

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<v Speaker 1>could also keep ill luck, keep bad spirits away. This,

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<v Speaker 1>of course, is not uncommon with artifacts of this basic nature,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, because look at the standard Nutcracker. It has

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<v Speaker 1>a fierce face. Oftentimes it has kind of big and

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<v Speaker 1>alarming eyes, and certainly it's not blinking. So you could

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<v Speaker 1>imagine easily leaning into the idea of putting this character

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<v Speaker 1>on guard against your enemies.

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<v Speaker 2>This seems to connect with traditions as old as the

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<v Speaker 2>ones we talked about in our series on necromancy, this

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<v Speaker 2>October in ancient Mesopotamia, where you would have these little

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<v Speaker 2>figurines that might look like a warrior or king or

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<v Speaker 2>something that would be there to ward off ghosts and

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<v Speaker 2>demons that might want to attack you in your sleep.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and so perhaps Hoffman was playing with this concept

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<v Speaker 1>a little bit in his writing of the original Nutcracker story.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, the Nutcracker is a protector in this but

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<v Speaker 1>also he turns things on its head. He is also

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<v Speaker 1>something that needs protecting. He need to be protected by Marie.

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<v Speaker 1>I should point out that, yes, the little girl's name

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<v Speaker 1>is Marie in the original story, even though I believe

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<v Speaker 1>she becomes Clara in the Nutcracker Ballet. So we'll get

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<v Speaker 1>back to traditions of nut cracking technology here in a bit.

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<v Speaker 1>But to give this the proper sort of invention treatment,

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<v Speaker 1>we really need to go back before that. We need

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<v Speaker 1>to get back to the basic idea of cracking nuts.

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<v Speaker 1>And indeed, why crack a nut anyway? And why does

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<v Speaker 1>the nut need to be cracked?

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<v Speaker 2>Great question? So what are nuts? We know them when

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<v Speaker 2>we see them, and we can list a bunch of examples,

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<v Speaker 2>but botanically what are they? And I've actually found some

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<v Speaker 2>rather different definitions offered in seemingly authoritative sources. But to

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<v Speaker 2>synthesize as best I can, here are the main points.

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<v Speaker 2>First of all, nuts are fruits. Huh. Yes, they are fruits.

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<v Speaker 2>We don't usually think of them. So this raises the question,

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<v Speaker 2>going one step back further, what is a fruit? In

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<v Speaker 2>a botanical sense, a fruit is usually defined as the mature,

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<v Speaker 2>ripened ovary of a flowering plant which contains the plant's

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<v Speaker 2>seed or seeds. So, according to scientific classification. Fruits include

0:12:19.160 --> 0:12:22.480
<v Speaker 2>lots of foods we do normally think of as fruits,

0:12:22.480 --> 0:12:26.160
<v Speaker 2>like apples, peaches, and oranges, but lots of other fleshy

0:12:26.200 --> 0:12:28.520
<v Speaker 2>things that grow off of plants that we don't usually

0:12:28.559 --> 0:12:33.240
<v Speaker 2>think of as fruits, even foods like cucumbers, tomatoes, avocados,

0:12:33.280 --> 0:12:38.400
<v Speaker 2>and chili peppers, and in fact, technically even grains like

0:12:38.440 --> 0:12:41.599
<v Speaker 2>wheat and oats are a type of fruit. So a

0:12:41.640 --> 0:12:44.920
<v Speaker 2>fruit is a mass that grows from the reproductive structure

0:12:45.000 --> 0:12:48.520
<v Speaker 2>of a flour and ends up containing or bearing the

0:12:48.559 --> 0:12:52.520
<v Speaker 2>fertilized seed of that plant. The form of the fruit

0:12:52.679 --> 0:12:56.640
<v Speaker 2>is designed by evolution to help the seeds disperse, which

0:12:56.679 --> 0:12:59.120
<v Speaker 2>could mean taking the form of a delicious snack that

0:12:59.240 --> 0:13:02.079
<v Speaker 2>animals will want to eat and then swallow and then

0:13:02.120 --> 0:13:05.120
<v Speaker 2>deposit elsewhere in a nice, healthy pile of dung. But

0:13:05.160 --> 0:13:08.600
<v Speaker 2>there are other animal dispersal strategies we'll get to in

0:13:08.640 --> 0:13:12.400
<v Speaker 2>a minute. So, according to the Encyclopedia of Fruit and

0:13:12.520 --> 0:13:16.920
<v Speaker 2>Nuts edited by Yannick and Paul, nuts are a specialized

0:13:17.040 --> 0:13:21.640
<v Speaker 2>subcategory of fruit quote characterized by a hard shell that

0:13:21.800 --> 0:13:25.200
<v Speaker 2>is separable from a firmer inner kernel. So it's a

0:13:25.240 --> 0:13:27.680
<v Speaker 2>fruit that's got an inside kernel and a hard shell

0:13:27.760 --> 0:13:31.360
<v Speaker 2>on the outside. Now, to offer some of these contrasting definitions,

0:13:31.920 --> 0:13:35.320
<v Speaker 2>I found a different source by the USDA Forest Service

0:13:35.840 --> 0:13:39.560
<v Speaker 2>that claimed that quote nuts are strictly a particular kind

0:13:39.600 --> 0:13:43.480
<v Speaker 2>of dry fruit that has a single seed, a hard shell,

0:13:43.840 --> 0:13:47.920
<v Speaker 2>and a protective husk. Also adding to the confusion is

0:13:47.920 --> 0:13:50.160
<v Speaker 2>the fact that there are some things that are generally

0:13:50.200 --> 0:13:53.720
<v Speaker 2>classified as nuts by people, but are not nuts in

0:13:53.760 --> 0:13:57.319
<v Speaker 2>the botanical sense. Classic example is a peanut. These are

0:13:57.360 --> 0:14:01.400
<v Speaker 2>technically legumes. And in this episode, I am sure we

0:14:01.480 --> 0:14:05.400
<v Speaker 2>will casually refer to some of these false nuts as nuts.

0:14:05.720 --> 0:14:07.719
<v Speaker 2>It's just going to happen. Just be aware that some

0:14:07.880 --> 0:14:11.760
<v Speaker 2>quote nuts are not technically nuts. But to come back

0:14:11.760 --> 0:14:16.040
<v Speaker 2>to the synthesis definition here, among other possible criteria like

0:14:16.679 --> 0:14:19.400
<v Speaker 2>bearing a single seed, or having a husk, or maybe

0:14:19.440 --> 0:14:22.280
<v Speaker 2>having high oil content or something like that, the common

0:14:22.320 --> 0:14:25.200
<v Speaker 2>thread seems to be that nuts are fruits that evolved

0:14:25.200 --> 0:14:29.680
<v Speaker 2>a hard shell. But why how does the plant benefit

0:14:29.760 --> 0:14:32.840
<v Speaker 2>from having a hard shell around its fruit and seed

0:14:33.240 --> 0:14:37.480
<v Speaker 2>as opposed to a nice, soft, fleshy seed capsule like

0:14:37.520 --> 0:14:40.000
<v Speaker 2>a tomato or like any of these other soft fleshy

0:14:40.000 --> 0:14:45.360
<v Speaker 2>fruits where the plant in an evolutionary sense wants the

0:14:45.440 --> 0:14:48.160
<v Speaker 2>animal to gobble them up and carry them away and

0:14:48.200 --> 0:14:51.600
<v Speaker 2>poot them out somewhere. Well, I found a paper that

0:14:51.760 --> 0:14:55.920
<v Speaker 2>explains one important evolutionary strategy of nut bearing plants, and

0:14:55.960 --> 0:14:58.920
<v Speaker 2>I think this is really interesting. So the paper was

0:14:58.920 --> 0:15:03.000
<v Speaker 2>by Stephen B. Van Wall called How Plants Manipulate the

0:15:03.160 --> 0:15:08.280
<v Speaker 2>scatter Hoarding behavior of seed dispersing Animals, published in Philosophical

0:15:08.320 --> 0:15:12.640
<v Speaker 2>Transactions of the Royal Society b Biological Sciences in twenty ten.

0:15:13.440 --> 0:15:18.440
<v Speaker 2>So this paper is about interactions between plants and animals,

0:15:18.480 --> 0:15:24.400
<v Speaker 2>particularly plants and an animal behavior called scatter hoarding, in

0:15:24.440 --> 0:15:27.000
<v Speaker 2>which the animal and you can picture a squirrel, but

0:15:27.040 --> 0:15:29.240
<v Speaker 2>there are a bunch of different kinds of animals that

0:15:29.320 --> 0:15:32.880
<v Speaker 2>do this as well, primarily birds and rodents, in which

0:15:32.920 --> 0:15:35.920
<v Speaker 2>the animal or the squirrel will collect a bunch of

0:15:35.960 --> 0:15:39.600
<v Speaker 2>food items in hidden caches to be stored for later.

0:15:40.080 --> 0:15:42.960
<v Speaker 2>So our squirrel runs around gathering up a bunch of

0:15:43.040 --> 0:15:46.520
<v Speaker 2>nuts fallen from under a tree, and instead of eating

0:15:46.560 --> 0:15:49.160
<v Speaker 2>them right away, the squirrel will carry them off to

0:15:49.400 --> 0:15:52.800
<v Speaker 2>bury or hide somewhere for later, maybe in lots of

0:15:52.880 --> 0:15:57.040
<v Speaker 2>locations all around the squirrel's territory. Now, why does this

0:15:57.120 --> 0:16:00.400
<v Speaker 2>benefit the plant? For the squirrel or other animal to

0:16:00.440 --> 0:16:02.120
<v Speaker 2>do this or run off with a bunch of nuts,

0:16:02.160 --> 0:16:05.160
<v Speaker 2>take them somewhere else and bury them well. In some cases,

0:16:05.560 --> 0:16:09.760
<v Speaker 2>these storage caches of plant seeds will benefit from reproductive

0:16:09.800 --> 0:16:13.360
<v Speaker 2>fitness enhancements via animal dispersal. And we've talked on the

0:16:13.360 --> 0:16:16.680
<v Speaker 2>show before about the reasons that it is good for

0:16:16.720 --> 0:16:20.960
<v Speaker 2>a plant to have its seeds dispersed geographically away, taken

0:16:21.000 --> 0:16:24.520
<v Speaker 2>away from the parent plant. There are multiple reasons for this,

0:16:24.720 --> 0:16:28.760
<v Speaker 2>but just one example is now. If they're dispersed far away,

0:16:29.080 --> 0:16:32.280
<v Speaker 2>the offspring plant will not have to compete with the

0:16:32.320 --> 0:16:35.880
<v Speaker 2>parent plant for access to sunlight. Parent and child will

0:16:35.880 --> 0:16:38.920
<v Speaker 2>not be fighting against one another to get the sun.

0:16:39.800 --> 0:16:44.120
<v Speaker 2>But in many cases, these scatter hoarded caches will be

0:16:44.680 --> 0:16:48.920
<v Speaker 2>forgotten or otherwise abandoned by the animal that made them,

0:16:49.040 --> 0:16:52.760
<v Speaker 2>allowing the seeds to germinate and grow in the places

0:16:52.840 --> 0:16:55.920
<v Speaker 2>they were hidden. So squirrel takes a bunch of nuts,

0:16:55.960 --> 0:16:58.680
<v Speaker 2>stashes them all over the place, buries them, hides them.

0:16:58.920 --> 0:17:01.440
<v Speaker 2>The squirrel will go back and get some of them

0:17:01.480 --> 0:17:04.040
<v Speaker 2>later and eat them. But some of them the squirrels

0:17:04.080 --> 0:17:06.280
<v Speaker 2>never going to get again, and they'll just be wherever

0:17:06.320 --> 0:17:08.560
<v Speaker 2>they are, and they might have a chance to sprout

0:17:08.640 --> 0:17:09.040
<v Speaker 2>and grow.

0:17:09.840 --> 0:17:12.560
<v Speaker 1>Plus, the world can be pretty rough on a squirrel,

0:17:12.640 --> 0:17:16.400
<v Speaker 1>so even if the squirrel remembers where those nuts are,

0:17:16.480 --> 0:17:18.440
<v Speaker 1>it doesn't mean that squirrel is going to be around

0:17:18.480 --> 0:17:19.760
<v Speaker 1>to come back and claim them later on.

0:17:20.400 --> 0:17:26.280
<v Speaker 2>Right, So, Vanderwald explains how plants have evolved to encourage

0:17:26.400 --> 0:17:30.200
<v Speaker 2>scatter hoarding behavior in animals and why it helps them

0:17:30.280 --> 0:17:32.119
<v Speaker 2>so that you know, it is good for the plant

0:17:32.200 --> 0:17:35.760
<v Speaker 2>to get animals to practice scatter hoarding with its seeds.

0:17:36.080 --> 0:17:38.480
<v Speaker 2>How does it get the animals to do that? First

0:17:38.520 --> 0:17:41.800
<v Speaker 2>of all, by producing seeds that are delicious and nutritious,

0:17:41.840 --> 0:17:44.879
<v Speaker 2>so they are highly attractive to animals as a food.

0:17:45.560 --> 0:17:49.040
<v Speaker 2>But second, here's the important one for our question about

0:17:49.119 --> 0:17:53.120
<v Speaker 2>why why nuts have hard shells, by imposing what Vanderwald

0:17:53.119 --> 0:17:58.560
<v Speaker 2>calls handling costs that mean the animal cannot feasibly eat

0:17:58.640 --> 0:18:02.679
<v Speaker 2>all of the seeds immediately upon discovery. And there are

0:18:02.680 --> 0:18:07.160
<v Speaker 2>two main strategies mentioned for increasing these handling costs. One

0:18:07.240 --> 0:18:10.960
<v Speaker 2>is by lacing the nutritious seed or fruit with chemicals

0:18:10.960 --> 0:18:14.280
<v Speaker 2>that make it hard to digest, such as tannins, which

0:18:14.520 --> 0:18:17.480
<v Speaker 2>kind of slows down the buffet, you know. But then

0:18:17.520 --> 0:18:21.000
<v Speaker 2>the second thing is by putting in place, physical barriers

0:18:21.320 --> 0:18:24.720
<v Speaker 2>that take time and energy to break through. So here's

0:18:24.760 --> 0:18:28.160
<v Speaker 2>our hard outer nutshell. The hard shell of a nut

0:18:28.440 --> 0:18:31.520
<v Speaker 2>makes it impossible for the squirrel to just gobble up

0:18:31.600 --> 0:18:35.560
<v Speaker 2>all of the fruits immediately. They want that good stuff inside,

0:18:35.880 --> 0:18:38.760
<v Speaker 2>but each one is going to take time and energy

0:18:38.800 --> 0:18:42.000
<v Speaker 2>to open an access, So the animal is encouraged to

0:18:42.119 --> 0:18:45.359
<v Speaker 2>take the nuts away and hide them for later. Now,

0:18:45.400 --> 0:18:48.240
<v Speaker 2>there are a couple more strategies Vanderwall mentions as well.

0:18:48.280 --> 0:18:52.359
<v Speaker 2>One is masting. This is quote where a population of

0:18:52.359 --> 0:18:57.600
<v Speaker 2>plants synchronizes reproductive effort, producing large nut crops at intervals

0:18:57.640 --> 0:19:01.800
<v Speaker 2>of several years. Massed crops not only satiate seed predators,

0:19:01.840 --> 0:19:05.479
<v Speaker 2>but also increase the amount of seed dispersal because scatter

0:19:05.560 --> 0:19:10.000
<v Speaker 2>hoarding animals are not easily satiated during cashing, causing animals

0:19:10.040 --> 0:19:13.200
<v Speaker 2>to store more food than they can consume, but are

0:19:13.320 --> 0:19:16.840
<v Speaker 2>satiated during cash recovery. So does that make sense. There's

0:19:16.880 --> 0:19:19.440
<v Speaker 2>a lot of nuts, and because they take time to

0:19:19.480 --> 0:19:23.080
<v Speaker 2>get into, the scatter hoarding animal is going to be

0:19:23.160 --> 0:19:25.800
<v Speaker 2>hungry while they're gathering all these nuts, so it just

0:19:26.400 --> 0:19:29.040
<v Speaker 2>encourages them to keep gathering more and more nuts and

0:19:29.080 --> 0:19:32.440
<v Speaker 2>storing them and planting them for the plant, but then

0:19:32.600 --> 0:19:34.760
<v Speaker 2>they will get full on these nuts when it's finally

0:19:34.800 --> 0:19:37.600
<v Speaker 2>time to recover the cash and crack them open and

0:19:37.640 --> 0:19:39.399
<v Speaker 2>eat them, so they're probably not going to get to

0:19:39.520 --> 0:19:41.320
<v Speaker 2>all of the stuff they stored.

0:19:42.000 --> 0:19:45.520
<v Speaker 1>Basically exploiting a real eyes bigger than one's stomach sort

0:19:45.520 --> 0:19:47.800
<v Speaker 1>of situation with the squirrels exactly.

0:19:48.119 --> 0:19:50.960
<v Speaker 2>And then the last strategy mentioned here is by having

0:19:51.000 --> 0:19:55.000
<v Speaker 2>seeds that don't put off strong smells, making them harder

0:19:55.040 --> 0:19:57.960
<v Speaker 2>for the animal to find later after they are hidden,

0:19:58.359 --> 0:20:01.199
<v Speaker 2>so really just sort of helping squirrel or bird or

0:20:01.200 --> 0:20:05.080
<v Speaker 2>whatever animal forget where it put some of its nuts. So,

0:20:05.160 --> 0:20:08.760
<v Speaker 2>according to this theory, hard nutshells are part of a

0:20:08.800 --> 0:20:12.119
<v Speaker 2>suite of strategies used by plants to aid in seed

0:20:12.160 --> 0:20:16.679
<v Speaker 2>dispersal by animals like birds and rodents, which makes it

0:20:16.840 --> 0:20:20.160
<v Speaker 2>more difficult for the animal to eat the nut, making

0:20:20.200 --> 0:20:22.720
<v Speaker 2>it more likely that the animal will carry the nut

0:20:22.800 --> 0:20:25.800
<v Speaker 2>off and hide it or bury it somewhere later and

0:20:25.840 --> 0:20:29.720
<v Speaker 2>then possibly forget about it or for whatever reason, never

0:20:29.760 --> 0:20:32.439
<v Speaker 2>come back to it, allowing the plant to germinate in

0:20:32.480 --> 0:20:36.000
<v Speaker 2>its hiding place. Hard nutshells you could think of sort

0:20:36.000 --> 0:20:38.960
<v Speaker 2>of like a speed bump in the eating process. They

0:20:38.960 --> 0:20:43.080
<v Speaker 2>make it hard for the bird or the rodent or

0:20:43.119 --> 0:20:46.720
<v Speaker 2>whatever to just like blaze through whatever it finds that

0:20:47.080 --> 0:20:59.520
<v Speaker 2>it can't just eat it all at once, but to

0:20:59.720 --> 0:21:03.359
<v Speaker 2>come back at this from the animal's perspective, nuts are great.

0:21:03.440 --> 0:21:05.480
<v Speaker 2>Animals want to eat them, so how to get the

0:21:05.480 --> 0:21:08.160
<v Speaker 2>good part out? Animals do have strategies for getting at

0:21:08.200 --> 0:21:12.399
<v Speaker 2>those good parts. Even if while benefiting from the nuts

0:21:12.440 --> 0:21:16.160
<v Speaker 2>they do crack open and eat, they're sort of inadvertently

0:21:16.200 --> 0:21:18.600
<v Speaker 2>helping the plant by not getting to a lot of

0:21:18.640 --> 0:21:21.520
<v Speaker 2>the nuts they store. Let's look at a few strategies here.

0:21:22.040 --> 0:21:26.120
<v Speaker 2>One is brute force, you know, teeth, jaws, beaks, or bills,

0:21:26.200 --> 0:21:30.440
<v Speaker 2>and other intrinsic mechanisms that allow an animal to crack

0:21:30.560 --> 0:21:35.200
<v Speaker 2>or punch through hard nutshells. We've already mentioned that rodents

0:21:35.240 --> 0:21:38.040
<v Speaker 2>are a major consumer of nuts in the wild, but

0:21:38.160 --> 0:21:42.920
<v Speaker 2>also other hard substances, and rodents like rats, squirrels, and beavers,

0:21:42.960 --> 0:21:45.680
<v Speaker 2>have an adaptation that helps them in this regard, which

0:21:45.720 --> 0:21:48.880
<v Speaker 2>is they're incisors, pairs of front teeth at the top

0:21:48.920 --> 0:21:53.879
<v Speaker 2>and bottom that, unlike our teeth, continuously grow throughout the

0:21:53.960 --> 0:21:58.360
<v Speaker 2>rodent's life. So this means rodents must gnaw on things

0:21:58.440 --> 0:22:02.240
<v Speaker 2>and also must grind to their front teeth to maintain

0:22:02.400 --> 0:22:06.320
<v Speaker 2>good dental health. Rat incisors not worn down by continuous

0:22:06.359 --> 0:22:12.560
<v Speaker 2>gnawing can grow into a bizarre, unsettling spiral shapes they

0:22:12.600 --> 0:22:15.320
<v Speaker 2>go off, and this is obviously really bad for the rat.

0:22:15.800 --> 0:22:18.879
<v Speaker 2>And while having teeth like this imposes a burden to

0:22:19.200 --> 0:22:23.000
<v Speaker 2>constantly be gnawing and grinding the teeth together, it also

0:22:23.160 --> 0:22:26.280
<v Speaker 2>helps equip rodents to put their front teeth through some

0:22:26.359 --> 0:22:29.960
<v Speaker 2>serious abuse because the teeth will just continue growing in

0:22:30.320 --> 0:22:33.840
<v Speaker 2>and the grinding will continue to sharpen them. So you know,

0:22:33.880 --> 0:22:36.760
<v Speaker 2>if an adult human cracks a tooth, that's sort of

0:22:36.760 --> 0:22:40.359
<v Speaker 2>a permanent problem. Rodents like rats can just let their

0:22:40.400 --> 0:22:42.800
<v Speaker 2>teeth keep growing in so they can put them through

0:22:42.800 --> 0:22:46.720
<v Speaker 2>a lot. Rodents like rats also have very strong and

0:22:46.760 --> 0:22:51.560
<v Speaker 2>specially adapted jaw muscles for their size, specifically the massiter muscles,

0:22:51.720 --> 0:22:55.640
<v Speaker 2>and their special teeth and chewing muscles help them cut

0:22:55.680 --> 0:22:59.800
<v Speaker 2>through tough barriers like nutshells. Of course, on the larger

0:23:00.200 --> 0:23:03.760
<v Speaker 2>of the animal spectrum, you've got bigger animals that just

0:23:03.920 --> 0:23:07.200
<v Speaker 2>have big teeth, big jaws that can pretty easily crush

0:23:07.240 --> 0:23:11.600
<v Speaker 2>through nutshells. For example, elephants and some wild pigs. You know,

0:23:11.640 --> 0:23:13.960
<v Speaker 2>if you've got big enough jaws and teeth and stuff,

0:23:13.960 --> 0:23:16.600
<v Speaker 2>crushing a nutshell isn't that hard. I even found one

0:23:16.640 --> 0:23:19.879
<v Speaker 2>report of gorillas allegedly cracking nuts with their teeth, so

0:23:19.960 --> 0:23:22.879
<v Speaker 2>there's some question about to what extent this comes with

0:23:23.000 --> 0:23:26.719
<v Speaker 2>significant risk of tooth damage to the gorilla. And then

0:23:26.800 --> 0:23:30.720
<v Speaker 2>also some birds, such as like Jay's blue jays, will

0:23:30.760 --> 0:23:32.960
<v Speaker 2>collect the nuts so that they can break through nutshells

0:23:33.040 --> 0:23:36.879
<v Speaker 2>with their bills. But some other animals have a different strategy,

0:23:36.960 --> 0:23:39.399
<v Speaker 2>which is just, you know, swallow the nuts whole and

0:23:39.480 --> 0:23:42.880
<v Speaker 2>let the gizzard work it out. Wild turkeys are an example.

0:23:42.880 --> 0:23:43.120
<v Speaker 1>Here.

0:23:43.160 --> 0:23:46.240
<v Speaker 2>Turkeys eat a lot of nuts, such as wild pecans,

0:23:46.680 --> 0:23:49.879
<v Speaker 2>but they don't bother cracking them or chewing them. There's

0:23:49.960 --> 0:23:53.200
<v Speaker 2>just no need. They gulp the whole thing, shell and all,

0:23:53.640 --> 0:23:56.000
<v Speaker 2>and then it goes to the gizzard. And the gizzard

0:23:56.560 --> 0:24:00.359
<v Speaker 2>works essentially like an internal jaw. It is a part

0:24:00.359 --> 0:24:04.359
<v Speaker 2>of the bird's digestive system, a sort of muscular sack

0:24:04.880 --> 0:24:09.560
<v Speaker 2>in which food stuffs are churned around with externally acquired

0:24:09.720 --> 0:24:13.879
<v Speaker 2>abrasives like rocks and sand, which the turkey also swallows,

0:24:14.160 --> 0:24:19.000
<v Speaker 2>and eventually this muscular sack churning nuts around with rocks

0:24:19.040 --> 0:24:22.280
<v Speaker 2>and sand grinds the nuts or whatever food into pieces

0:24:22.680 --> 0:24:24.840
<v Speaker 2>so it can pass on down through the rest of

0:24:24.880 --> 0:24:26.000
<v Speaker 2>the digestive tract.

0:24:26.880 --> 0:24:30.119
<v Speaker 1>See, we need more gizzard based nutcrackers. Maybe the screw

0:24:30.400 --> 0:24:34.399
<v Speaker 1>nutcracker is kind of a gizzard nutcracker in a limited sense.

0:24:34.960 --> 0:24:37.240
<v Speaker 2>I g Yeah, it would be like what would a

0:24:37.280 --> 0:24:39.800
<v Speaker 2>gizzard based nutcracker be. It would be more like a

0:24:39.920 --> 0:24:42.200
<v Speaker 2>like a rock polisher, you know, you get the nuts

0:24:42.200 --> 0:24:44.560
<v Speaker 2>in there and it's got like an internal like shaker

0:24:44.640 --> 0:24:46.439
<v Speaker 2>with rocks and they bust them up.

0:24:46.920 --> 0:24:47.560
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

0:24:47.640 --> 0:24:50.359
<v Speaker 2>So those are the internal mechanisms, but there are also

0:24:50.440 --> 0:24:54.040
<v Speaker 2>animals that do use external mechanisms, in other words, tools

0:24:54.119 --> 0:24:57.320
<v Speaker 2>to crack nuts. Tool use in nutcracking has been observed

0:24:57.320 --> 0:25:00.159
<v Speaker 2>in multiple primate species. I came across a paper for

0:25:00.280 --> 0:25:04.479
<v Speaker 2>documenting novel observations of orangutans figuring out how to smash

0:25:04.560 --> 0:25:09.280
<v Speaker 2>nuts with a wooden hammer. The paper was by Bandini

0:25:09.400 --> 0:25:16.240
<v Speaker 2>at All, called Naive Orangutans Individually Acquire nutcracking using hammer Tools,

0:25:16.280 --> 0:25:18.840
<v Speaker 2>published in the American Journal of Primatology in the year

0:25:18.840 --> 0:25:21.840
<v Speaker 2>twenty twenty one, and I found the background section of

0:25:21.880 --> 0:25:26.760
<v Speaker 2>this paper helpful for collecting other documented examples of primate

0:25:26.800 --> 0:25:29.919
<v Speaker 2>tool use in nutcracking, especially the use of tools by

0:25:29.960 --> 0:25:34.879
<v Speaker 2>chimpanzees to open nuts. The authors say that chimpanzees, long

0:25:34.880 --> 0:25:39.320
<v Speaker 2>tailed macaques, and capuchin monkeys have been observed using tools

0:25:39.359 --> 0:25:43.560
<v Speaker 2>to break through nutshells, and wild chimpanzees have been observed

0:25:43.600 --> 0:25:48.399
<v Speaker 2>in multiple locations using hammer tools to smash nuts and

0:25:48.480 --> 0:25:52.520
<v Speaker 2>access kernels. So, to read from their background quote, the

0:25:52.600 --> 0:25:57.600
<v Speaker 2>crux of the nutcracking behavioral form in chimpanzees involves three steps.

0:25:57.920 --> 0:26:01.600
<v Speaker 2>One retrieving a nut from the surrounding area and placing

0:26:01.640 --> 0:26:04.199
<v Speaker 2>it on an anvil e g. A tree root or

0:26:04.200 --> 0:26:08.440
<v Speaker 2>a stone. Two picking up a stone or a wooden hammer,

0:26:08.560 --> 0:26:12.800
<v Speaker 2>and three hitting the nut with the hammer, parentheses holding

0:26:12.840 --> 0:26:16.359
<v Speaker 2>it with one or both hands until its shell is

0:26:16.359 --> 0:26:20.399
<v Speaker 2>cracked open and the inside kernel can be retrieved and consumed.

0:26:21.840 --> 0:26:26.040
<v Speaker 2>And this is noted as being a really interesting case

0:26:26.080 --> 0:26:29.360
<v Speaker 2>of tool use in non human animals because most cases

0:26:29.640 --> 0:26:33.040
<v Speaker 2>of animal tool use involve only a single object and

0:26:33.080 --> 0:26:36.320
<v Speaker 2>a single type of action, you know, thinking something like

0:26:37.000 --> 0:26:40.040
<v Speaker 2>using a stick to extend reach into holes and crevices.

0:26:40.440 --> 0:26:44.520
<v Speaker 2>But this nut hammering process involves two separate tools apart

0:26:44.560 --> 0:26:48.040
<v Speaker 2>from the nut, the hammer and the anvil, and it

0:26:48.119 --> 0:26:51.600
<v Speaker 2>involves multiple steps, only culminating in a food reward at

0:26:51.600 --> 0:26:55.119
<v Speaker 2>the end of the process. So it's extremely interesting and

0:26:55.160 --> 0:26:59.119
<v Speaker 2>impressive and has been the subject of a lot of

0:26:59.400 --> 0:27:02.879
<v Speaker 2>study and debate, And there are also interesting scientific debates

0:27:02.880 --> 0:27:06.800
<v Speaker 2>about how this process first arose in wild chimpanzees and

0:27:06.840 --> 0:27:10.919
<v Speaker 2>how it gets passed from one individual to another. But anyway,

0:27:10.960 --> 0:27:14.640
<v Speaker 2>coming back to the experimental portion of the study in orangutans,

0:27:14.720 --> 0:27:18.680
<v Speaker 2>the authors here tested naive orangutans who had no experience

0:27:18.760 --> 0:27:22.480
<v Speaker 2>cracking nuts with tools that were in captivity to see

0:27:22.520 --> 0:27:25.800
<v Speaker 2>what they would do if given hard shelled nuts and

0:27:25.880 --> 0:27:29.680
<v Speaker 2>tools for nutcracking, but no demonstration of how it was done.

0:27:29.800 --> 0:27:31.760
<v Speaker 2>So just like, here's the stuff you would need, but

0:27:32.000 --> 0:27:36.840
<v Speaker 2>there's no teaching or showing them. And somewhat shockingly, quote,

0:27:37.160 --> 0:27:41.520
<v Speaker 2>out of twelve orangutans tested, at least four individuals, one

0:27:41.520 --> 0:27:46.640
<v Speaker 2>from Leipzig and three from Zurich, spontaneously expressed nutcracking using

0:27:46.640 --> 0:27:47.520
<v Speaker 2>wooden hammers.

0:27:48.240 --> 0:27:48.920
<v Speaker 1>Fascinating.

0:27:49.560 --> 0:27:52.800
<v Speaker 2>I thought so too, And they say that this result

0:27:53.080 --> 0:27:56.760
<v Speaker 2>seems to be evidence that orangutans can in fact quite

0:27:56.760 --> 0:28:02.600
<v Speaker 2>readily produce emergent tool use behaviors through individual learning, they say,

0:28:02.680 --> 0:28:06.040
<v Speaker 2>just sort of personal trial and error learning without having

0:28:06.080 --> 0:28:10.400
<v Speaker 2>to watch another do it and copy the behavior from them.

0:28:10.520 --> 0:28:12.679
<v Speaker 2>Though they did say they actually make a distinction in

0:28:12.720 --> 0:28:17.560
<v Speaker 2>this paper between non copying social learning and copying social learning.

0:28:17.800 --> 0:28:20.600
<v Speaker 2>So copying social learning is what they call like the

0:28:20.720 --> 0:28:24.399
<v Speaker 2>how to knowledge where you watch another individual do something

0:28:24.800 --> 0:28:28.400
<v Speaker 2>and then you copy what they're doing. They do say

0:28:28.440 --> 0:28:31.439
<v Speaker 2>there could be some social learning involved here. That's not

0:28:31.640 --> 0:28:34.359
<v Speaker 2>watching what the other individual is doing, but just seeing

0:28:34.400 --> 0:28:37.879
<v Speaker 2>kind of like what area of the enclosure they're paying

0:28:37.920 --> 0:28:40.880
<v Speaker 2>attention to, what kind of objects they're paying attention to,

0:28:41.320 --> 0:28:43.800
<v Speaker 2>and so forth, in the words of the author, is

0:28:43.880 --> 0:28:47.400
<v Speaker 2>not how to social information, but sort of what and

0:28:47.440 --> 0:28:50.960
<v Speaker 2>where social information. And then finally just wanted to mention

0:28:51.040 --> 0:28:52.760
<v Speaker 2>that this has also come up on the show before.

0:28:52.840 --> 0:28:56.560
<v Speaker 2>But there are some bird species that have evolved ways

0:28:56.560 --> 0:28:59.720
<v Speaker 2>of using external tools to crack nuts. One of the

0:28:59.720 --> 0:29:03.760
<v Speaker 2>most interesting examples is the case of Japanese crows, specifically

0:29:03.880 --> 0:29:07.280
<v Speaker 2>Japanese crows, because as far as I know, this behavior

0:29:07.320 --> 0:29:10.920
<v Speaker 2>has not been found in crow populations elsewhere, but Japanese

0:29:10.920 --> 0:29:16.000
<v Speaker 2>crows have been observed leaving difficult nuts on busy streets

0:29:16.040 --> 0:29:18.200
<v Speaker 2>so that cars will run over them and crack the

0:29:18.200 --> 0:29:19.560
<v Speaker 2>shells for them.

0:29:19.920 --> 0:29:22.640
<v Speaker 1>That's fascinating, man, to you, it's a highway to us

0:29:22.760 --> 0:29:27.479
<v Speaker 1>a nutcracker. So coming back to humans, specifically, coming back

0:29:27.520 --> 0:29:32.280
<v Speaker 1>to modern humans, modern humans absolutely can crack nuts with

0:29:32.320 --> 0:29:35.960
<v Speaker 1>their teeth. This is a true statement. However, modern humans

0:29:36.000 --> 0:29:39.239
<v Speaker 1>absolutely cannot crack all nuts with their teeth, and they

0:29:39.280 --> 0:29:43.080
<v Speaker 1>certainly can't do so without risking permanent damage to their teeth.

0:29:43.520 --> 0:29:46.480
<v Speaker 2>Right again, we are not rodents. Their teeth will keep

0:29:46.520 --> 0:29:49.120
<v Speaker 2>growing in if they hurt them while getting into a nut.

0:29:49.480 --> 0:29:51.920
<v Speaker 2>Not so much for an adult human, that's right.

0:29:52.080 --> 0:29:55.000
<v Speaker 1>So, as such, there is a huge advantage, even a

0:29:55.040 --> 0:29:58.640
<v Speaker 1>survival advantage, in being able to turn to various tools

0:29:58.680 --> 0:30:01.440
<v Speaker 1>to crack open said nuts and get at the precious

0:30:01.520 --> 0:30:04.360
<v Speaker 1>nutrients inside, and of course then not be held and

0:30:04.400 --> 0:30:06.440
<v Speaker 1>also not be held back by the speed bump so much.

0:30:06.480 --> 0:30:08.160
<v Speaker 1>I mean, you are hitting the speed bump of having

0:30:08.200 --> 0:30:11.320
<v Speaker 1>to manually crack nuts. But if you can utilize technology

0:30:11.360 --> 0:30:14.280
<v Speaker 1>to speed that process along, then you can do a

0:30:14.320 --> 0:30:15.880
<v Speaker 1>whole host of other things.

0:30:15.840 --> 0:30:16.320
<v Speaker 2>That's right.

0:30:16.760 --> 0:30:19.960
<v Speaker 1>As such, prehistoric humans made use of their surroundings to

0:30:20.080 --> 0:30:23.280
<v Speaker 1>open many a nut much in the same way that

0:30:23.520 --> 0:30:26.200
<v Speaker 1>other tool using animals did and the examples that we

0:30:26.320 --> 0:30:30.320
<v Speaker 1>just mentioned stones of course do wonders. And eventually this

0:30:30.520 --> 0:30:34.800
<v Speaker 1>was fine tuned to make use of pitted stones. Pitted stone,

0:30:34.880 --> 0:30:36.760
<v Speaker 1>you know, a stone that has a little indentation there,

0:30:36.920 --> 0:30:39.200
<v Speaker 1>kind of a spot that holds the nut in place

0:30:40.240 --> 0:30:42.880
<v Speaker 1>while you either whack it with another stone or use

0:30:42.880 --> 0:30:46.360
<v Speaker 1>some sort of like hammer and chisel scenario to apply

0:30:46.440 --> 0:30:48.600
<v Speaker 1>force to it. And then this will also sort of

0:30:48.600 --> 0:30:51.120
<v Speaker 1>collect the fragments and keep the nut and or fragments

0:30:51.160 --> 0:30:53.520
<v Speaker 1>from just flying off in all directions.

0:30:53.640 --> 0:30:56.080
<v Speaker 2>In terms of getting over the speed bump is speeding

0:30:56.160 --> 0:30:58.720
<v Speaker 2>up the process. This is a great advancement actually using

0:30:58.720 --> 0:31:02.800
<v Speaker 2>a pitted stone like this, of moving from the hammer

0:31:02.840 --> 0:31:06.200
<v Speaker 2>and anvil principle to the mortar and pestle principle.

0:31:06.880 --> 0:31:09.200
<v Speaker 1>Now, according to Wagner, example of this sort of artifact

0:31:09.240 --> 0:31:12.760
<v Speaker 1>go back thousands and thousands of years. Indeed, according to

0:31:13.000 --> 0:31:15.640
<v Speaker 1>I was looking at a twenty nineteen paper published in

0:31:16.200 --> 0:31:19.280
<v Speaker 1>Plos one or plus one. I forget which way we're

0:31:19.320 --> 0:31:22.120
<v Speaker 1>supposed to say it these days. It's plus plus.

0:31:22.120 --> 0:31:24.440
<v Speaker 2>I said it wrong. For years I spelled it out.

0:31:24.480 --> 0:31:28.360
<v Speaker 1>It's plus all right, Well, plus one, twenty nineteen. This

0:31:28.600 --> 0:31:33.640
<v Speaker 1>was a paper by Colleen Pardeaut titled Quondong stones a

0:31:33.680 --> 0:31:38.360
<v Speaker 1>Specialized Australian nut cracking tool. And in this the author

0:31:38.400 --> 0:31:42.120
<v Speaker 1>points out that paleolithic sites in the levant provide evidence

0:31:42.240 --> 0:31:45.120
<v Speaker 1>of the importance of nuts in the human diet as

0:31:45.200 --> 0:31:48.240
<v Speaker 1>far back as seven hundred and forty thousand to seven

0:31:48.360 --> 0:31:51.880
<v Speaker 1>hundred ninety thousand years ago, and we see this via

0:31:52.000 --> 0:31:56.160
<v Speaker 1>the evidence of specialized stone implements for shell cracking in

0:31:56.240 --> 0:32:01.520
<v Speaker 1>kernel extraction. Additionally, early Holoslene site suggests that hazel nuts

0:32:01.520 --> 0:32:06.680
<v Speaker 1>were important in Mesolithic and early Neolithic European diets. The

0:32:06.720 --> 0:32:08.960
<v Speaker 1>paper in question, by the way, highlights the use of

0:32:09.040 --> 0:32:13.840
<v Speaker 1>pitted stones by Aboriginal Australians to crack open the quandong

0:32:14.040 --> 0:32:17.760
<v Speaker 1>or native peach. They point out that pits in stones

0:32:17.920 --> 0:32:22.040
<v Speaker 1>like this are common and they sometimes indicate other functions.

0:32:22.080 --> 0:32:25.160
<v Speaker 1>It's not always there for nut cracking. You know, it

0:32:25.200 --> 0:32:27.920
<v Speaker 1>could be an anvil or it could have multiple functions,

0:32:28.440 --> 0:32:31.960
<v Speaker 1>but the stones in question have multiple pits and were

0:32:32.000 --> 0:32:35.320
<v Speaker 1>found in areas where quand dongs are common. They also

0:32:35.440 --> 0:32:38.480
<v Speaker 1>analyze the exact nature of the wear and tear on

0:32:38.560 --> 0:32:40.480
<v Speaker 1>these stones. Apparently, if you know what you're looking for.

0:32:40.920 --> 0:32:43.680
<v Speaker 1>You can analyze that wear and tear and see like, okay,

0:32:43.720 --> 0:32:48.920
<v Speaker 1>what kind of regular and or repeated force was applied here?

0:32:49.240 --> 0:32:54.920
<v Speaker 1>And they believe that these artifacts indicate nutcracking. I included

0:32:54.960 --> 0:32:57.200
<v Speaker 1>a couple of pictures here from you below. One is

0:32:57.240 --> 0:33:03.280
<v Speaker 1>from Wagner's museum. You see like basic pitted stone nutcracking scenario.

0:33:03.760 --> 0:33:06.560
<v Speaker 1>And then I have some images from this paper about

0:33:06.680 --> 0:33:09.840
<v Speaker 1>Aboriginal Australian artifacts and you can see like a like

0:33:10.240 --> 0:33:13.640
<v Speaker 1>multiple pits in one of the stones they're talking about.

0:33:13.920 --> 0:33:18.400
<v Speaker 1>M Yeah, by the way, broadly speaking, nuts cracked in

0:33:18.400 --> 0:33:21.000
<v Speaker 1>this manner were sometimes, of course just eaten raw. You know,

0:33:21.080 --> 0:33:25.200
<v Speaker 1>you've solved the puzzle. Now enjoy the spoils. But they

0:33:25.200 --> 0:33:28.440
<v Speaker 1>were also initially eventually used for other purposes. You could

0:33:28.480 --> 0:33:31.960
<v Speaker 1>make flowers out of them, or nut butters. There's apparently

0:33:32.040 --> 0:33:35.600
<v Speaker 1>evidence for peanut butter of a sort in Aztec and

0:33:35.600 --> 0:33:40.080
<v Speaker 1>Inca civilizations, and one can only assume that ancient European

0:33:40.120 --> 0:33:43.440
<v Speaker 1>hazel nuts scavengers would have done something similar, though of course,

0:33:43.720 --> 0:33:47.160
<v Speaker 1>without access to South America's chocolate, they'd be denied the

0:33:47.160 --> 0:33:51.200
<v Speaker 1>invention of nutella. Up until I believe the eighteen hundreds.

0:33:51.520 --> 0:33:53.200
<v Speaker 2>Are you a nutella lover, Rube?

0:33:53.840 --> 0:33:58.400
<v Speaker 1>I mean I like nutella, but I deny myself nutella.

0:33:59.320 --> 0:34:00.000
<v Speaker 2>It's too easy.

0:34:00.560 --> 0:34:03.040
<v Speaker 1>It is it needs some speed bumps, and so the

0:34:03.880 --> 0:34:08.080
<v Speaker 1>speed bump I put down is just not buying it. Now,

0:34:08.200 --> 0:34:12.919
<v Speaker 1>coming back to other nutcracker designs, obviously, simple wooden nutcrackers

0:34:13.560 --> 0:34:17.160
<v Speaker 1>are also a pretty ancient scenario. You know, likely some

0:34:17.200 --> 0:34:21.160
<v Speaker 1>combination of wood pieces, perhaps a strip of leather, exactly

0:34:21.239 --> 0:34:24.480
<v Speaker 1>the sort of thing to easily vanish from the archaeological record,

0:34:24.560 --> 0:34:27.520
<v Speaker 1>like this is just organic matter that's not going to last.

0:34:27.719 --> 0:34:31.320
<v Speaker 1>But eventually, with the advent of metalworking, humans begin making

0:34:31.400 --> 0:34:35.680
<v Speaker 1>simple nutcrackers, which are also again largely identical to crab

0:34:35.760 --> 0:34:39.160
<v Speaker 1>claw crackers that enable them to use hand strength and

0:34:39.280 --> 0:34:42.400
<v Speaker 1>a lever to crack nuts. This again is the basic

0:34:42.480 --> 0:34:46.000
<v Speaker 1>principle of the German wooden nutcracker that we associate with Christmas.

0:34:46.520 --> 0:34:49.920
<v Speaker 1>Wagner writes that the oldest evidence of a metal nutcracker

0:34:49.960 --> 0:34:53.000
<v Speaker 1>goes back to the third or fourth century BCE. Apparently,

0:34:53.280 --> 0:34:57.640
<v Speaker 1>this nutcracker is on display in the Toronto Museum in Italy.

0:34:58.400 --> 0:35:02.880
<v Speaker 1>It's exceedingly ornate, considering consisting of a pair of bronze

0:35:02.880 --> 0:35:06.960
<v Speaker 1>hands with gold bracelets making use of an internal hinge

0:35:07.400 --> 0:35:11.360
<v Speaker 1>to function as a nutcracker. Obviously this is a luxury item,

0:35:12.280 --> 0:35:14.680
<v Speaker 1>and really the subject matter here is quite fascinating. I

0:35:14.680 --> 0:35:18.000
<v Speaker 1>included an image of this nutcracker device for you here, Joe.

0:35:18.160 --> 0:35:19.720
<v Speaker 2>That is creepy looking.

0:35:20.520 --> 0:35:25.600
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, there are like these bronze hands with golden like

0:35:26.000 --> 0:35:30.600
<v Speaker 1>they're dark bronze hands with golden like serpent bracelets, and

0:35:30.680 --> 0:35:33.160
<v Speaker 1>it's like they're reaching up out of the void to

0:35:33.520 --> 0:35:34.480
<v Speaker 1>crack a nut for you.

0:35:35.160 --> 0:35:38.479
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, exactly hands from the portal to the underdark. There's

0:35:38.640 --> 0:35:43.040
<v Speaker 2>just like extremely creepy looking. Though when I first saw these,

0:35:43.080 --> 0:35:46.919
<v Speaker 2>I didn't realize these were just solid to be used

0:35:46.920 --> 0:35:50.000
<v Speaker 2>with the lever to crush. What I honestly imagine was

0:35:50.040 --> 0:35:53.960
<v Speaker 2>that these were like rigid metal gloves that you would

0:35:53.960 --> 0:35:57.360
<v Speaker 2>put on to just smash a nut between your palms.

0:35:58.000 --> 0:35:59.920
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. I was looking around to see some sort of

0:36:00.239 --> 0:36:03.239
<v Speaker 1>video or demonstration of exactly how the mechanism works. There.

0:36:03.280 --> 0:36:07.680
<v Speaker 1>Supposedly is a mechanism there, but most of the images

0:36:07.719 --> 0:36:11.839
<v Speaker 1>I was pulling up just show the hands and yeah,

0:36:11.840 --> 0:36:15.280
<v Speaker 1>there they're quite beautiful to look at now. Wagner's Museum

0:36:15.280 --> 0:36:18.960
<v Speaker 1>apparently has a Roman nutcracker dated to between two hundred

0:36:19.000 --> 0:36:22.320
<v Speaker 1>BCE and two hundred CE, and this one is also

0:36:22.480 --> 0:36:25.800
<v Speaker 1>ornate with animal motifs, but it is it is otherwise

0:36:25.960 --> 0:36:29.760
<v Speaker 1>like not something that mimics human or animal crushing power.

0:36:29.880 --> 0:36:32.640
<v Speaker 1>No jaws or anything including an image of this for

0:36:32.760 --> 0:36:33.879
<v Speaker 1>you here as well, Joe.

0:36:34.320 --> 0:36:36.399
<v Speaker 2>It's just the standard pencer lever.

0:36:37.000 --> 0:36:39.600
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and of course you know they're all manner of

0:36:39.719 --> 0:36:43.040
<v Speaker 1>tools and objects in human history that have been turned

0:36:43.360 --> 0:36:47.360
<v Speaker 1>into something ornate and something even more decorative than functional.

0:36:48.000 --> 0:36:50.040
<v Speaker 1>But again, I know there's something about the nutcracker. There's

0:36:50.040 --> 0:36:52.439
<v Speaker 1>sort of even though it is work, there's also sort

0:36:52.440 --> 0:36:55.239
<v Speaker 1>of an implied leisure there, Like it is the kind

0:36:55.280 --> 0:36:59.239
<v Speaker 1>of work that you can imagine even an emperor being

0:36:59.280 --> 0:37:03.360
<v Speaker 1>okay with do because there is something satisfying about it. Yeah.

0:37:03.480 --> 0:37:07.760
<v Speaker 2>Maybe it's because the food reward is in most cases

0:37:07.800 --> 0:37:10.600
<v Speaker 2>implied to be immediate. But I know exactly what you're

0:37:10.640 --> 0:37:15.320
<v Speaker 2>saying that there's a different energy to a nutcracker versus

0:37:15.360 --> 0:37:18.480
<v Speaker 2>like a potato peeler. So you imagine the process of

0:37:18.520 --> 0:37:23.320
<v Speaker 2>peeling a potato is labor. It's not associated with fun.

0:37:23.800 --> 0:37:25.960
<v Speaker 2>It's like just something you've got to do in the

0:37:26.000 --> 0:37:29.520
<v Speaker 2>process of cooking something. But that's not the same. Yeah,

0:37:29.719 --> 0:37:32.640
<v Speaker 2>not the case with a nutcracker. The nutcracker is an

0:37:32.680 --> 0:37:35.960
<v Speaker 2>emblem of coziness and leisure and getting what you want

0:37:36.080 --> 0:37:36.600
<v Speaker 2>right now.

0:37:37.080 --> 0:37:41.160
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's like a novel technological enhancement of human abilities.

0:37:41.640 --> 0:37:44.040
<v Speaker 1>It's like, look what I can do. That's not as

0:37:44.040 --> 0:37:48.120
<v Speaker 1>nothing compared to my strength, as my strength is accentuated

0:37:48.360 --> 0:37:51.000
<v Speaker 1>by this tiny wooden man that cracks my nuts for

0:37:51.120 --> 0:37:55.879
<v Speaker 1>me now. Wagner also showcases multiple European metal nuttrackers from

0:37:55.880 --> 0:37:59.000
<v Speaker 1>the thirteenth century onward. In many of these, I didn't

0:37:59.000 --> 0:38:01.319
<v Speaker 1>even include pictures off Joe because they just look like

0:38:01.520 --> 0:38:05.200
<v Speaker 1>metal lever tools. You know, it's just exactly all that

0:38:05.239 --> 0:38:08.640
<v Speaker 1>you would need to crack nuts and nothing fancy. But

0:38:09.000 --> 0:38:12.440
<v Speaker 1>they sometimes take on other fanciful forms. I included a

0:38:12.480 --> 0:38:15.719
<v Speaker 1>couple of images from her museum here. One is I

0:38:15.760 --> 0:38:18.080
<v Speaker 1>believe an eagle and the other is a dog.

0:38:18.520 --> 0:38:22.360
<v Speaker 2>Okay, does the eagle crushed the nut in its beak?

0:38:22.480 --> 0:38:24.080
<v Speaker 2>I guess does the beak pop open?

0:38:24.360 --> 0:38:26.400
<v Speaker 1>It looks like, yeah, I believe the beak is powered

0:38:26.400 --> 0:38:29.120
<v Speaker 1>by the lever. And then we also have the dog,

0:38:29.160 --> 0:38:31.879
<v Speaker 1>which I guess the tail is the lever for the

0:38:31.920 --> 0:38:32.600
<v Speaker 1>dog's mouth.

0:38:33.200 --> 0:38:36.560
<v Speaker 2>You know, I really enjoy the grotesque unreality of the

0:38:36.600 --> 0:38:40.560
<v Speaker 2>way that the human awoid nutcracker's mouth opens so wide

0:38:40.600 --> 0:38:42.080
<v Speaker 2>with the lever. I don't think I would have that

0:38:42.120 --> 0:38:43.800
<v Speaker 2>same enjoyment with the dog figure.

0:38:44.080 --> 0:38:46.319
<v Speaker 1>Do you think it's just not becoming of the dog? Yeah.

0:38:46.360 --> 0:38:50.560
<v Speaker 2>I don't know a man whose jaw opens down to

0:38:50.640 --> 0:38:53.880
<v Speaker 2>his belly button and has gigantic teeth bigger than his eyes,

0:38:54.280 --> 0:38:56.799
<v Speaker 2>that's funny. A dog that has that, I don't know.

0:38:56.840 --> 0:38:58.720
<v Speaker 2>It's just like I want it to be cuter.

0:39:00.400 --> 0:39:04.759
<v Speaker 1>Now, there's another variety of metal nut opening. I guess

0:39:04.760 --> 0:39:06.719
<v Speaker 1>you would say tool that I want to touch on here.

0:39:07.719 --> 0:39:11.080
<v Speaker 1>It's one that's also hinged, often of bronze or iron.

0:39:12.360 --> 0:39:16.560
<v Speaker 1>But these are nut openers found in various Asian cultures,

0:39:16.560 --> 0:39:22.200
<v Speaker 1>including in India, in Indonesia, in Afghanistan. Many of these

0:39:22.320 --> 0:39:26.480
<v Speaker 1>also boast animal in human design motifs. These were not

0:39:26.600 --> 0:39:29.360
<v Speaker 1>used to crack open a nut, but to slice the

0:39:29.360 --> 0:39:33.320
<v Speaker 1>aureka nut of the Areca palm, which is then wrapped

0:39:33.360 --> 0:39:36.520
<v Speaker 1>in a beetle leaf. These are beetle nuts. These are

0:39:36.719 --> 0:39:40.839
<v Speaker 1>then chewed, sometimes with other additives, in order to get

0:39:40.840 --> 0:39:45.520
<v Speaker 1>at the psychoactive properties all then I included some images

0:39:45.560 --> 0:39:48.920
<v Speaker 1>of these beetle nut slicers. I guess is really the

0:39:48.960 --> 0:39:52.320
<v Speaker 1>more accurate terminology, though they're basic. The basic physics of

0:39:52.320 --> 0:39:55.440
<v Speaker 1>the design is similar to many of the nutcrackers we're

0:39:55.440 --> 0:39:57.879
<v Speaker 1>talking about here. But as you can see, Joe and

0:39:57.920 --> 0:40:00.719
<v Speaker 1>I encourage folks to look up images of these. There's

0:40:00.760 --> 0:40:03.760
<v Speaker 1>some that look like birds, there are some not pictured

0:40:03.800 --> 0:40:06.239
<v Speaker 1>here for you, Joe, that are very ornate but don't

0:40:06.239 --> 0:40:09.440
<v Speaker 1>look like any any particular animal or what have you.

0:40:09.680 --> 0:40:14.080
<v Speaker 1>And then some just straight up resemble human beings, sometimes

0:40:14.120 --> 0:40:17.680
<v Speaker 1>with the handles of the slicer being the legs of

0:40:17.719 --> 0:40:20.840
<v Speaker 1>a humanoid or the legs of two humanoids that are dancing.

0:40:21.800 --> 0:40:24.920
<v Speaker 2>Okay, but it is a slicing action, not a cracking action,

0:40:25.080 --> 0:40:28.480
<v Speaker 2>so it's more kind of like those little cigar guillotines

0:40:28.520 --> 0:40:30.080
<v Speaker 2>that people have. I don't know what those are called.

0:40:30.680 --> 0:40:32.520
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, I guess it would be similar that similar

0:40:32.520 --> 0:40:35.400
<v Speaker 1>to that. Yeah, they're there for slicing, but they do

0:40:35.440 --> 0:40:39.080
<v Speaker 1>resemble nut crackers a lot, and you'll often find collectors

0:40:39.120 --> 0:40:40.960
<v Speaker 1>of one may collect the other as well.

0:40:42.080 --> 0:40:43.480
<v Speaker 2>Beautiful designs though.

0:40:43.640 --> 0:40:48.040
<v Speaker 1>Now I'd also run across examples of apotropaic uses of

0:40:48.280 --> 0:40:51.520
<v Speaker 1>these devices as well, such as using them to protect

0:40:51.600 --> 0:40:55.719
<v Speaker 1>sleeping child. I also found mention of protective qualities that

0:40:56.120 --> 0:41:01.120
<v Speaker 1>are attributed to beetlenuts in general in some culture. There's

0:41:01.160 --> 0:41:05.000
<v Speaker 1>a nineteenth century beetlenutcutter from Malaysia in the collection of

0:41:05.080 --> 0:41:07.799
<v Speaker 1>the Victoria and Albert Museum in the UK, and they

0:41:07.800 --> 0:41:10.920
<v Speaker 1>have this featured on their website. It has a stylized

0:41:10.960 --> 0:41:14.840
<v Speaker 1>bird shaped head set with rubies mounted with gold, so

0:41:15.040 --> 0:41:18.400
<v Speaker 1>very ornate, and the museum shares the following quote. Although

0:41:18.400 --> 0:41:21.880
<v Speaker 1>the habit of beetle chewing had rapidly declined in the

0:41:21.920 --> 0:41:26.040
<v Speaker 1>Malay world by the mid twentieth century, iron araka nut

0:41:26.120 --> 0:41:28.800
<v Speaker 1>cutters are still in use today for their power, according

0:41:28.800 --> 0:41:32.960
<v Speaker 1>to local tradition, in warding off evil spirits the shears.

0:41:33.239 --> 0:41:35.640
<v Speaker 1>And I think that's accurate. You can describe these as

0:41:35.640 --> 0:41:38.840
<v Speaker 1>shears are usually placed above the head of a newborn

0:41:38.920 --> 0:41:40.080
<v Speaker 1>baby for protection.

0:41:40.840 --> 0:41:45.440
<v Speaker 2>Oh. That's an interesting parallel to the decorative or ritual

0:41:45.680 --> 0:41:50.319
<v Speaker 2>use of the no longer functional nutcrackers and Christmas celebrations.

0:41:50.920 --> 0:41:54.120
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, I do find it fascinating that you'll have

0:41:54.200 --> 0:41:58.000
<v Speaker 1>like two very distant cultures here and they both have

0:41:58.400 --> 0:42:01.880
<v Speaker 1>some sort of an ornate device that has that is

0:42:02.000 --> 0:42:06.240
<v Speaker 1>used to get at the goodness, be it nutritional or psychoactive,

0:42:07.280 --> 0:42:10.480
<v Speaker 1>or I think they are also medicinal traditions concerning the

0:42:10.480 --> 0:42:12.840
<v Speaker 1>beetle nut as well. But to get at the goodness

0:42:12.840 --> 0:42:15.560
<v Speaker 1>in the nut, you have to use this device, and

0:42:15.600 --> 0:42:18.839
<v Speaker 1>then that device becomes more and more ornate, it takes

0:42:18.880 --> 0:42:22.440
<v Speaker 1>on various forms and then begins to have these supernatural

0:42:22.480 --> 0:42:25.080
<v Speaker 1>properties as well. Or even if you're looking at the

0:42:25.120 --> 0:42:30.319
<v Speaker 1>modern nutcracker, like the decorative nutcracker, has no function other

0:42:30.400 --> 0:42:33.759
<v Speaker 1>than to provide a bit of holiday whimsy and to

0:42:34.800 --> 0:42:37.600
<v Speaker 1>you know, to put us in the spirit of things

0:42:37.600 --> 0:42:38.840
<v Speaker 1>for the holiday.

0:42:39.160 --> 0:42:42.320
<v Speaker 2>Or alternately to chase your sibling around the house biting

0:42:42.360 --> 0:42:42.919
<v Speaker 2>at them with.

0:42:44.480 --> 0:42:46.600
<v Speaker 1>Now, I would love to hear from folks out there

0:42:46.640 --> 0:42:49.280
<v Speaker 1>if you have certainly if you can speak from personal

0:42:49.320 --> 0:42:52.279
<v Speaker 1>experience or family experience, cultural experience to anything that we've

0:42:52.280 --> 0:42:54.800
<v Speaker 1>touched on in the episode, including the beetle nuts. Shears.

0:42:55.320 --> 0:42:58.160
<v Speaker 1>But even like the classic German nutcracker, if there's anyone

0:42:58.160 --> 0:43:00.560
<v Speaker 1>out there who has a like a family addition in

0:43:00.640 --> 0:43:03.480
<v Speaker 1>which there are protective elements to it, you know, like

0:43:03.520 --> 0:43:06.680
<v Speaker 1>the nutcracker is placed in a child's room to ward

0:43:06.760 --> 0:43:10.960
<v Speaker 1>off some sort of you know, ill luck, no matter

0:43:11.000 --> 0:43:14.239
<v Speaker 1>how you know, overt no matter how strong the superstition

0:43:14.360 --> 0:43:16.560
<v Speaker 1>or weak the superstition is. I'd love to hear about

0:43:16.600 --> 0:43:19.799
<v Speaker 1>that as well. But so I'm partially speaking from my

0:43:19.800 --> 0:43:23.959
<v Speaker 1>own experience, in which the standard nutcracker like doesn't really

0:43:24.000 --> 0:43:27.920
<v Speaker 1>carry a lot of supernatural or focal or weight. It

0:43:28.040 --> 0:43:30.839
<v Speaker 1>is just festive, you know. It's a completely secular thing.

0:43:31.640 --> 0:43:34.080
<v Speaker 1>Like the elf on the shelf ends up having more

0:43:34.160 --> 0:43:36.960
<v Speaker 1>power in a given home than the nutcracker usually does,

0:43:37.160 --> 0:43:39.879
<v Speaker 1>or at least that's how it seems to me. I'd

0:43:39.920 --> 0:43:41.880
<v Speaker 1>love to hear if that's not the case, though.

0:43:41.800 --> 0:43:44.400
<v Speaker 2>Though at the same time, I wouldn't undervalue the ritual

0:43:44.480 --> 0:43:48.160
<v Speaker 2>power of holiday decorations. I mean, like, it is interesting

0:43:48.200 --> 0:43:51.640
<v Speaker 2>how we surround ourselves with these physical objects literally to

0:43:52.320 --> 0:43:55.000
<v Speaker 2>sort of engineer our own minds. It's like, I want

0:43:55.040 --> 0:43:59.440
<v Speaker 2>to make myself feel festive, I want to put myself

0:43:59.480 --> 0:44:02.560
<v Speaker 2>in the mind space of a particular season, and in

0:44:02.680 --> 0:44:04.279
<v Speaker 2>order to do that, I know I will have to

0:44:04.320 --> 0:44:07.319
<v Speaker 2>surround myself with objects that are hidden for the rest

0:44:07.320 --> 0:44:07.759
<v Speaker 2>of the year.

0:44:08.680 --> 0:44:10.480
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, I feel like that's kind of the approach

0:44:10.520 --> 0:44:12.680
<v Speaker 1>my family takes with our Christmas tree. You know, it's

0:44:12.719 --> 0:44:14.520
<v Speaker 1>and this is you know, I think how a lot

0:44:14.520 --> 0:44:17.680
<v Speaker 1>of people do it. You know, each little decoration you

0:44:17.719 --> 0:44:19.319
<v Speaker 1>put up in there, put up on the tree has

0:44:19.320 --> 0:44:22.120
<v Speaker 1>some sort of value to you. You know, it either

0:44:22.120 --> 0:44:24.799
<v Speaker 1>speaks to a time or a place, or an aspiration

0:44:25.239 --> 0:44:28.719
<v Speaker 1>or an idea that you like. You know, it has

0:44:28.800 --> 0:44:33.520
<v Speaker 1>religious significance and or cultural significance. And it all becomes

0:44:33.560 --> 0:44:37.680
<v Speaker 1>this kind of you know, this kind of amalgam of

0:44:37.719 --> 0:44:41.440
<v Speaker 1>different values. Then you light it up and yeah, you

0:44:41.520 --> 0:44:43.959
<v Speaker 1>transform your world at least for a few weeks there.

0:44:44.840 --> 0:44:47.360
<v Speaker 2>All right, should we crush this nut once and for all.

0:44:48.280 --> 0:44:51.400
<v Speaker 1>Let's do it. Yes. We hope you enjoyed our look

0:44:51.480 --> 0:44:53.879
<v Speaker 1>at the Nutcracker and earlier in the week the rat King.

0:44:53.960 --> 0:44:55.799
<v Speaker 1>If you didn't hear the rat King episode, go back

0:44:55.920 --> 0:44:58.200
<v Speaker 1>listen to that. I think it's a nice companion for

0:44:58.239 --> 0:45:03.359
<v Speaker 1>this episode. But yeah, we obviously we wish everyone out

0:45:03.360 --> 0:45:07.080
<v Speaker 1>there who celebrates the holidays, Happy holidays, will remind you

0:45:07.320 --> 0:45:09.840
<v Speaker 1>that Stuff to Blow your Mind is a science podcast

0:45:09.840 --> 0:45:13.640
<v Speaker 1>for Core episodes on Tuesdays and Thursdays. On Mondays, we

0:45:13.680 --> 0:45:16.040
<v Speaker 1>tend to do listener mail on Wednesdays we tend to

0:45:16.080 --> 0:45:18.719
<v Speaker 1>do a short form monster fact or Artifact episode, and

0:45:18.760 --> 0:45:20.800
<v Speaker 1>on Fridays we set aside most series concerns to just

0:45:20.800 --> 0:45:22.920
<v Speaker 1>talk about a weird movie on Weird House Cinema.

0:45:23.120 --> 0:45:26.719
<v Speaker 2>Huge thanks as always to our excellent audio producer JJ Posway.

0:45:27.080 --> 0:45:28.759
<v Speaker 2>If you would like to get in touch with us

0:45:28.760 --> 0:45:31.280
<v Speaker 2>with feedback on this episode or any other, to suggest

0:45:31.320 --> 0:45:33.520
<v Speaker 2>a topic for the future, or just to say hello,

0:45:33.800 --> 0:45:36.560
<v Speaker 2>you can email us at contact stuff to Blow your

0:45:36.600 --> 0:45:45.800
<v Speaker 2>Mind dot com.

0:45:45.880 --> 0:45:48.840
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0:45:48.920 --> 0:45:51.720
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0:45:51.880 --> 0:46:09.160
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