1 00:00:05,720 --> 00:00:08,240 Speaker 1: Hi, this is Annie, and you're listening to stuff Mom 2 00:00:08,280 --> 00:00:23,080 Speaker 1: never told you. And today we're rerunning a classic that 3 00:00:23,200 --> 00:00:26,680 Speaker 1: has it's been top of mind for me recently, and 4 00:00:26,840 --> 00:00:31,000 Speaker 1: it is about anchor and in particular, angry women and 5 00:00:31,040 --> 00:00:35,400 Speaker 1: how we perceive angry women. And I think I've mentioned 6 00:00:36,240 --> 00:00:38,879 Speaker 1: in passing a couple of times on the show. I 7 00:00:38,960 --> 00:00:43,159 Speaker 1: have always, always, always had trouble expressing anger. I go 8 00:00:43,479 --> 00:00:48,120 Speaker 1: from one, two, and eleven, and the eleven is very rare, 9 00:00:48,159 --> 00:00:53,440 Speaker 1: but it is probably far more than whatever situation, whatever 10 00:00:53,479 --> 00:00:56,440 Speaker 1: it warrants. I do not have a healthy in between. 11 00:00:56,840 --> 00:00:59,720 Speaker 1: And this is because of my family. My dad very 12 00:00:59,760 --> 00:01:04,280 Speaker 1: much not let me express negative emotions. But also I 13 00:01:04,319 --> 00:01:09,760 Speaker 1: think society at large is extremely uncomfortable with women expressing anger, 14 00:01:09,880 --> 00:01:13,160 Speaker 1: and we penalize women for expressing anger. I have trouble 15 00:01:13,200 --> 00:01:15,959 Speaker 1: even raising my voice to the point that sometimes I'm 16 00:01:15,959 --> 00:01:19,120 Speaker 1: concerned I wouldn't be able to and if this situation, 17 00:01:19,560 --> 00:01:23,000 Speaker 1: if I really needed to um. The subject of women 18 00:01:23,000 --> 00:01:25,240 Speaker 1: in anger has been in the news a lot lately, 19 00:01:25,319 --> 00:01:29,440 Speaker 1: starting with the onslaught of furious women after the American election. 20 00:01:30,040 --> 00:01:33,600 Speaker 1: You've got Anti magazine, the whole thing around, Serena Williams 21 00:01:34,000 --> 00:01:38,320 Speaker 1: and then I'm sure a lot of you saw recently 22 00:01:38,400 --> 00:01:43,080 Speaker 1: the testimony of Brett Kavanaugh UM compared to Dr Christine 23 00:01:43,120 --> 00:01:50,400 Speaker 1: blasie Ford and how he was a crying, screaming rage monster. UM. 24 00:01:50,480 --> 00:01:56,520 Speaker 1: And as this episode will will delve into, angry men 25 00:01:56,600 --> 00:02:01,960 Speaker 1: are often seemed as more comp tent and taken more seriously, 26 00:02:02,080 --> 00:02:07,320 Speaker 1: whereas angry women are seen as more emotional and less competent, 27 00:02:07,440 --> 00:02:15,440 Speaker 1: which is infuriating. UM. I have I have gotten more comfortable, 28 00:02:16,040 --> 00:02:19,560 Speaker 1: especially recently, because there's so much, so many things that 29 00:02:19,600 --> 00:02:23,560 Speaker 1: make me angry, expressing anger and accepting my anger and 30 00:02:23,600 --> 00:02:27,760 Speaker 1: not being as afraid of it. But it is, it 31 00:02:27,880 --> 00:02:31,160 Speaker 1: is sort of a constant battle, and there there is 32 00:02:31,200 --> 00:02:36,000 Speaker 1: this tight rope of knowing how angry women are perceived. 33 00:02:36,080 --> 00:02:38,560 Speaker 1: But I think that more and more of us are 34 00:02:38,639 --> 00:02:42,160 Speaker 1: starting to accept our anger, and I think it it 35 00:02:42,240 --> 00:02:45,680 Speaker 1: is powerful, and it is pushing. It's pushing a lot 36 00:02:45,680 --> 00:02:48,120 Speaker 1: of us to do to run for political office, to 37 00:02:48,120 --> 00:02:55,040 Speaker 1: to fight against all of these these injustices that we see. UM. 38 00:02:55,120 --> 00:02:59,280 Speaker 1: So I hope that you enjoy this classic, find it 39 00:02:59,400 --> 00:03:02,480 Speaker 1: useful if if you've been struggling to deal with your 40 00:03:02,480 --> 00:03:05,320 Speaker 1: anger or find your anger. I hope it helps you 41 00:03:05,639 --> 00:03:13,080 Speaker 1: do that as well. Welcome to Stuff Mom Never Told 42 00:03:13,120 --> 00:03:20,240 Speaker 1: You from how Stuffworks dot Com. Hello, and welcome to 43 00:03:20,240 --> 00:03:23,480 Speaker 1: the podcast. I'm Caroline and I'm Kristin Kristen. I was 44 00:03:23,560 --> 00:03:27,040 Speaker 1: talking to a group of young women are our age, 45 00:03:27,240 --> 00:03:31,079 Speaker 1: young young ladies who were discussing the topic of anger, 46 00:03:31,160 --> 00:03:33,720 Speaker 1: women in anger, and we we sort of got on 47 00:03:33,760 --> 00:03:36,440 Speaker 1: the topic because one one of the women was saying, 48 00:03:37,080 --> 00:03:40,160 Speaker 1: you know, I've just been feeling so angry lately, and 49 00:03:40,240 --> 00:03:42,560 Speaker 1: not at a person or at a thing, or just 50 00:03:42,640 --> 00:03:46,320 Speaker 1: with road rage, but just sort of bubbling over with 51 00:03:46,400 --> 00:03:49,760 Speaker 1: anger in general. Does anyone else feel this way? And 52 00:03:49,800 --> 00:03:52,760 Speaker 1: how can I combat it? And I came back with, 53 00:03:53,000 --> 00:03:55,880 Speaker 1: you know, hey, lady, I actually feel the same way. 54 00:03:55,880 --> 00:03:57,920 Speaker 1: And I didn't really want to talk about it, because, 55 00:03:58,480 --> 00:04:00,680 Speaker 1: you know, nobody wants to seem like an negative Nancy. 56 00:04:01,040 --> 00:04:05,280 Speaker 1: Nobody wants to come off as some really negative, angry person, 57 00:04:06,160 --> 00:04:08,800 Speaker 1: especially with all of the different types of research that 58 00:04:08,840 --> 00:04:10,920 Speaker 1: have been done on how women are perceived when they're 59 00:04:10,960 --> 00:04:13,720 Speaker 1: angry versus men. You could do, you could get into 60 00:04:13,720 --> 00:04:16,640 Speaker 1: a whole thing with it, which we will. But so 61 00:04:16,839 --> 00:04:19,839 Speaker 1: I thought it would be a great topic to look into. 62 00:04:20,400 --> 00:04:24,440 Speaker 1: But as I was doing some research. As Kristin and 63 00:04:24,440 --> 00:04:27,760 Speaker 1: I were researching, we really did not find anything that 64 00:04:27,920 --> 00:04:31,200 Speaker 1: jumped out at us as far as a trend piece 65 00:04:31,320 --> 00:04:36,279 Speaker 1: or anything about women in our generation experiencing more anger, 66 00:04:36,560 --> 00:04:41,040 Speaker 1: less anger, different anger than women in the past have. Right, 67 00:04:41,080 --> 00:04:44,479 Speaker 1: there's some scientific research that will get into into the 68 00:04:44,480 --> 00:04:50,400 Speaker 1: biological sex differences and some socialization factors that get into that, um, 69 00:04:50,440 --> 00:04:56,520 Speaker 1: but there wasn't that much digging into culturally this idea 70 00:04:56,640 --> 00:04:59,560 Speaker 1: of the angry woman, and especially how you know, if 71 00:04:59,560 --> 00:05:03,360 Speaker 1: you think of out um in feminist circles, how often 72 00:05:03,560 --> 00:05:07,840 Speaker 1: are women liberal women criticize this angry feminists and it's 73 00:05:07,880 --> 00:05:10,080 Speaker 1: such a bad thing if we're angry. And then there's 74 00:05:10,120 --> 00:05:12,919 Speaker 1: also the trip going beyond all of this, of say 75 00:05:12,960 --> 00:05:15,720 Speaker 1: the angry black woman, where it's like, oh, be careful 76 00:05:15,760 --> 00:05:18,520 Speaker 1: not to rile her because you'll just spiral right out 77 00:05:18,520 --> 00:05:23,239 Speaker 1: of control. Um, So let's let's get into this anger 78 00:05:23,279 --> 00:05:29,400 Speaker 1: and maybe circle back to anger in adult women. Because yeah, 79 00:05:29,400 --> 00:05:32,320 Speaker 1: similar to you, Caroline, I was really surprised at the 80 00:05:32,440 --> 00:05:36,279 Speaker 1: gap of like, hey, where are the angry women? Do 81 00:05:36,360 --> 00:05:38,800 Speaker 1: you just not want to talk about it? Yeah? Well, 82 00:05:38,839 --> 00:05:41,320 Speaker 1: I mean I am surprised just because I feel like 83 00:05:41,400 --> 00:05:44,160 Speaker 1: there are a lot of things today with our generation 84 00:05:44,440 --> 00:05:47,479 Speaker 1: and where we are as far as in the workplace 85 00:05:47,560 --> 00:05:49,680 Speaker 1: and trying to I mean, how many articles have been 86 00:05:49,680 --> 00:05:52,240 Speaker 1: written about women trying to balance everything in their lives, 87 00:05:52,440 --> 00:05:55,680 Speaker 1: but where are the articles about like how that actually 88 00:05:56,360 --> 00:06:00,760 Speaker 1: can make us feel. Yeah, So let's from a very 89 00:06:00,800 --> 00:06:04,640 Speaker 1: basic point of what is anger? I mean, I think 90 00:06:04,640 --> 00:06:08,840 Speaker 1: everybody knows the feeling of anger and the effects of anger, 91 00:06:09,000 --> 00:06:13,560 Speaker 1: but scientifically speaking, anger is an emotional state that consists 92 00:06:13,560 --> 00:06:18,080 Speaker 1: of feelings of irritation, annoyance, fury, or rage, and heightened 93 00:06:18,120 --> 00:06:23,000 Speaker 1: activation or arousal of the autonomic nervous system. Right, so 94 00:06:23,120 --> 00:06:25,920 Speaker 1: where does anger come from? When does it jump up 95 00:06:25,960 --> 00:06:29,960 Speaker 1: in our system? Usually anger results either from violations of 96 00:06:29,960 --> 00:06:35,400 Speaker 1: expectations that we have or blocking our goals, and it 97 00:06:35,520 --> 00:06:39,560 Speaker 1: sparks in the brain so quickly it takes the brain 98 00:06:39,640 --> 00:06:44,400 Speaker 1: lesten too seconds to process anger, and it activates the amygdala, 99 00:06:44,760 --> 00:06:47,720 Speaker 1: the frontal lobe, which is our seat of reasoning, our 100 00:06:47,800 --> 00:06:50,840 Speaker 1: fight or flight response. And and thankfully there's a hormone 101 00:06:51,120 --> 00:06:54,000 Speaker 1: called a seat of coline that once our anger starts 102 00:06:54,000 --> 00:06:57,480 Speaker 1: to ebb, it brings us back down from the edge 103 00:06:57,480 --> 00:07:00,800 Speaker 1: of the cliff. Oh and even just thinking about that 104 00:07:00,880 --> 00:07:05,200 Speaker 1: physiological feeling of anger is making me tense. Well, I 105 00:07:05,240 --> 00:07:07,799 Speaker 1: wonder if that's what's going on when I'm in traffic. 106 00:07:07,839 --> 00:07:10,280 Speaker 1: I've been doing so ever since I got back from vacation, 107 00:07:11,080 --> 00:07:13,840 Speaker 1: I have been trying to do some deep breathing in traffic, 108 00:07:13,920 --> 00:07:16,520 Speaker 1: like anytime anyone cuts me off, because hello, it's Atlanta. 109 00:07:17,080 --> 00:07:20,840 Speaker 1: So it happens every two seconds. Um, I try to 110 00:07:20,880 --> 00:07:23,760 Speaker 1: take that deep breath and I feel that immediate calming sensation. 111 00:07:23,840 --> 00:07:25,760 Speaker 1: So I wonder if that's the hormone or if that's 112 00:07:25,800 --> 00:07:29,160 Speaker 1: just me taking a breath, or maybe just a combination 113 00:07:29,720 --> 00:07:31,720 Speaker 1: of both. Um, And I mean the thing. I don't 114 00:07:31,760 --> 00:07:35,680 Speaker 1: know about you, but for me, anger is sort of 115 00:07:35,680 --> 00:07:40,960 Speaker 1: a frightening emotional reaction because it feels so uncontrollable. And 116 00:07:41,040 --> 00:07:47,000 Speaker 1: maybe it's because it's considered a primitive human reaction, right. 117 00:07:47,240 --> 00:07:50,440 Speaker 1: Rich pifer Is, the president of the National Anger Management Association, 118 00:07:50,480 --> 00:07:54,160 Speaker 1: wrote that anger activates the primitive human brain referred to 119 00:07:54,200 --> 00:07:57,960 Speaker 1: as the limbic system, which is automatic and impulsive. And 120 00:07:58,000 --> 00:07:59,920 Speaker 1: this is going off of something that T. D. Kim 121 00:08:00,040 --> 00:08:03,760 Speaker 1: per road in nine seven, basically saying that anger has 122 00:08:03,840 --> 00:08:07,480 Speaker 1: actual evolutionary value. It's been with us forever. It's present 123 00:08:07,520 --> 00:08:10,960 Speaker 1: in our early life as children. It has cross cultural 124 00:08:11,080 --> 00:08:15,640 Speaker 1: universality and has differentiated autonomic patterns in our brains from 125 00:08:15,640 --> 00:08:19,800 Speaker 1: other emotions. Yeah, it's so very distinct and so very common. 126 00:08:20,360 --> 00:08:24,240 Speaker 1: Some surveys find that Americans report feeling anger one to 127 00:08:24,320 --> 00:08:27,480 Speaker 1: two days per week. But I mean there are also 128 00:08:27,560 --> 00:08:29,560 Speaker 1: some sites that say that up to a third of us, 129 00:08:29,600 --> 00:08:34,720 Speaker 1: I think, report feeling angry every single day. I have 130 00:08:34,840 --> 00:08:38,160 Speaker 1: those weeks, Yeah, it happens. Sometimes those are not good weeks. No, 131 00:08:38,280 --> 00:08:40,720 Speaker 1: not good weeks. That's when you bring out the box 132 00:08:40,800 --> 00:08:44,839 Speaker 1: of wine. But the interesting thing about anger too, when 133 00:08:44,840 --> 00:08:47,280 Speaker 1: you think about it from an emotional standpoint, is that 134 00:08:47,320 --> 00:08:51,040 Speaker 1: it's a very social emotion. A lot of times, if 135 00:08:51,040 --> 00:08:53,720 Speaker 1: you're just sitting in a room by yourself, you know, 136 00:08:53,800 --> 00:08:56,839 Speaker 1: not on the internet, just just hanging out, anger is 137 00:08:56,880 --> 00:08:58,920 Speaker 1: not going to be all of that present. Probably it's 138 00:08:59,000 --> 00:09:02,920 Speaker 1: usually when other people get involved that anger tends to 139 00:09:03,000 --> 00:09:06,760 Speaker 1: spark more often. Right. Scott Shiman, who is from the 140 00:09:06,840 --> 00:09:09,880 Speaker 1: University of Toronto and wrote the anger chapter in the 141 00:09:09,920 --> 00:09:13,080 Speaker 1: Handbook of the Sociology of Emotions, which I would love 142 00:09:13,120 --> 00:09:15,600 Speaker 1: to go back and read about the other emotions, UH, 143 00:09:15,679 --> 00:09:19,760 Speaker 1: talks about the fact that common elicitors of anger include 144 00:09:19,960 --> 00:09:26,280 Speaker 1: perceived or actual insult, injustice, betrayal, in equity, unfairness, goal impediments, 145 00:09:26,320 --> 00:09:31,679 Speaker 1: the incompetent actions of another which is pretty much why 146 00:09:31,679 --> 00:09:34,800 Speaker 1: I'm angry all the time, um and being the target 147 00:09:34,840 --> 00:09:38,679 Speaker 1: of another person's verbal or physical aggression. And the big 148 00:09:38,720 --> 00:09:45,800 Speaker 1: reason for anger is actions that threaten an individual's self concept, identity, 149 00:09:45,920 --> 00:09:49,120 Speaker 1: or public image. So again we see those common themes 150 00:09:49,120 --> 00:09:53,440 Speaker 1: coming up over and over again of expectations being violated, 151 00:09:53,559 --> 00:09:58,480 Speaker 1: control factors, other people coming in the way of what 152 00:09:58,559 --> 00:10:01,960 Speaker 1: we need to get done. And so no wonder anger 153 00:10:02,000 --> 00:10:09,880 Speaker 1: arises quite often at the workplace as a result of marriage, relationships, parenting, 154 00:10:10,240 --> 00:10:12,880 Speaker 1: and so forth. Whenever you're getting all those people in 155 00:10:12,920 --> 00:10:16,280 Speaker 1: a room together, I'm going to get angry, right, And 156 00:10:16,360 --> 00:10:19,679 Speaker 1: I mean that's not even mentioning or going into like 157 00:10:19,720 --> 00:10:22,680 Speaker 1: the gender and power divides yet. I mean, of you know, 158 00:10:22,920 --> 00:10:28,280 Speaker 1: all of those multifaceted aspects of the workplace, of marriage, relationships. 159 00:10:28,559 --> 00:10:32,520 Speaker 1: But you know, while anger can be definitely negative because 160 00:10:32,600 --> 00:10:35,560 Speaker 1: you know, excessive anger does affect your mental and physical health, 161 00:10:35,920 --> 00:10:39,000 Speaker 1: there are positive aspects of it. I mean, to a degree, 162 00:10:39,040 --> 00:10:41,760 Speaker 1: it can help motivate you sure. I mean, when you 163 00:10:41,920 --> 00:10:46,440 Speaker 1: feel so angry, it can push you forward to finding 164 00:10:46,559 --> 00:10:51,480 Speaker 1: a solution, right exactly. That's actually I mean, anger is 165 00:10:51,840 --> 00:10:55,000 Speaker 1: sort of kind of what drove me to leave my 166 00:10:55,080 --> 00:10:58,040 Speaker 1: newspaper job. I mean, you know, I just got I 167 00:10:58,120 --> 00:11:00,960 Speaker 1: just got one more email. I just got one more 168 00:11:01,080 --> 00:11:03,600 Speaker 1: terrible office space kind of email that and then I 169 00:11:03,679 --> 00:11:06,480 Speaker 1: was done. Well. Also, I mean so in addition to 170 00:11:07,240 --> 00:11:11,480 Speaker 1: motivating you to possibly improve your situation, anger can also 171 00:11:11,640 --> 00:11:14,160 Speaker 1: increase your sense of control. I mean, how many times 172 00:11:14,160 --> 00:11:17,199 Speaker 1: have you experienced, maybe not like super excessive negative anger, 173 00:11:17,240 --> 00:11:19,439 Speaker 1: but like a degree of anger that makes you think, 174 00:11:19,480 --> 00:11:21,520 Speaker 1: you know what, I'm going to do something about this today. 175 00:11:21,960 --> 00:11:25,400 Speaker 1: Then that is very positive. Yeah. I remember distinctly when 176 00:11:25,440 --> 00:11:29,000 Speaker 1: I was probably sixteen seventeen years old in high school 177 00:11:29,000 --> 00:11:33,319 Speaker 1: and the first time that I got mad at my parents. 178 00:11:33,440 --> 00:11:35,120 Speaker 1: I mean, granted it was this, you know, kind of 179 00:11:35,160 --> 00:11:37,679 Speaker 1: a teen rebellion acting out sort of thing, but I 180 00:11:37,720 --> 00:11:40,760 Speaker 1: got angry, and I got loud, and I felt that 181 00:11:41,240 --> 00:11:44,120 Speaker 1: sense of control for the first time of saying, oh 182 00:11:44,280 --> 00:11:49,160 Speaker 1: I own this room now, and I'm being very angry, okay, 183 00:11:49,280 --> 00:11:52,079 Speaker 1: And it was I'm sure it was a nightmare for 184 00:11:52,200 --> 00:11:55,960 Speaker 1: my parents at the time. But yeah, there was that 185 00:11:56,200 --> 00:11:59,439 Speaker 1: distinct feeling of like I'm gonna, oh, I'm gonna do 186 00:11:59,520 --> 00:12:02,680 Speaker 1: this well. But that is a feeling I think that 187 00:12:02,800 --> 00:12:05,560 Speaker 1: maybe you know we're about to get into gender issues here. 188 00:12:05,880 --> 00:12:10,720 Speaker 1: That feeling of like taking control, I think is what 189 00:12:10,840 --> 00:12:14,040 Speaker 1: a lot of women feel uncomfortable with. Absolutely. Um, it's 190 00:12:14,080 --> 00:12:18,760 Speaker 1: interesting when you look at how common anger might be 191 00:12:18,760 --> 00:12:22,520 Speaker 1: between men and women. It's not so different. It's not 192 00:12:22,600 --> 00:12:26,600 Speaker 1: that men are angrier than women are vice versa. The 193 00:12:26,640 --> 00:12:29,960 Speaker 1: difference between anger and men and women really comes down 194 00:12:30,000 --> 00:12:34,400 Speaker 1: to the way that we experience it. So our gender, 195 00:12:34,559 --> 00:12:39,320 Speaker 1: our sex affects how we perceive anger, ours and others, 196 00:12:39,320 --> 00:12:44,079 Speaker 1: whether it's positive or negative, but also how we express it. Now, 197 00:12:44,280 --> 00:12:47,480 Speaker 1: stereotypes that were all very familiar with about emotions say 198 00:12:47,520 --> 00:12:51,240 Speaker 1: that women have less self control with emotions, whereas men 199 00:12:51,280 --> 00:12:53,640 Speaker 1: are more buttoned up. You know, women were always like 200 00:12:53,760 --> 00:12:56,839 Speaker 1: weeping and asking for chocolate and crying on our best 201 00:12:56,880 --> 00:12:59,839 Speaker 1: friend's shoulder, and men, you know, they man up and 202 00:13:00,000 --> 00:13:03,360 Speaker 1: they're they're all tough. But Shiman, who we mentioned earlier, 203 00:13:03,440 --> 00:13:07,160 Speaker 1: says that anger might be the exception to that emotion stereotype. Yes, 204 00:13:07,240 --> 00:13:13,080 Speaker 1: definitely considered a male masculine emotion, and so perhaps men 205 00:13:13,160 --> 00:13:17,640 Speaker 1: are more comfortable with expressing anger. And there are often 206 00:13:17,640 --> 00:13:21,920 Speaker 1: these gender scripts that helped shape emotional regulation, and that 207 00:13:21,960 --> 00:13:24,720 Speaker 1: women are expected to not show their anger or else 208 00:13:24,800 --> 00:13:29,120 Speaker 1: risk being labeled as hostile, neurotic, or unladylike, whereas men 209 00:13:29,160 --> 00:13:32,440 Speaker 1: and boys are expected to be overt. No, you know, 210 00:13:32,559 --> 00:13:37,280 Speaker 1: to Tiger, that's my impression of an angry man. You 211 00:13:37,320 --> 00:13:40,480 Speaker 1: didn't get it, um. And there are some interesting studies 212 00:13:40,679 --> 00:13:45,280 Speaker 1: that have been done looking at how we perceive the 213 00:13:45,559 --> 00:13:48,120 Speaker 1: an angry emotion on someone's face. And there was one 214 00:13:48,679 --> 00:13:54,719 Speaker 1: that showed people just androgynous faces, not particularly masculine or feminine, 215 00:13:55,200 --> 00:13:58,960 Speaker 1: and people rated those faces that had angry expressions on 216 00:13:59,000 --> 00:14:02,280 Speaker 1: them as mass skill in and those depicting sadness or 217 00:14:02,320 --> 00:14:08,040 Speaker 1: happiness as feminine. And so no wonder, Caroline. Feminists are 218 00:14:08,040 --> 00:14:11,840 Speaker 1: so often labeled as just angry as an insult, because 219 00:14:12,160 --> 00:14:16,560 Speaker 1: our outright expression of anger is a direct violation of 220 00:14:16,760 --> 00:14:22,080 Speaker 1: gender norms. Interesting, it's daring to be angry, Yeah, exactly, 221 00:14:22,280 --> 00:14:25,040 Speaker 1: just like you did. No, I know, like, well, that's 222 00:14:25,080 --> 00:14:26,920 Speaker 1: kind of the bad side of anger. And I mean, 223 00:14:26,960 --> 00:14:29,120 Speaker 1: I'm sure whatever I was arguing, I don't even remember 224 00:14:29,160 --> 00:14:31,400 Speaker 1: what I was arguing with my parents about but I'm 225 00:14:31,440 --> 00:14:33,920 Speaker 1: sure it was something along the lines of me wanting 226 00:14:33,920 --> 00:14:37,400 Speaker 1: to stay out later than I should have. Well, darnet dad, 227 00:14:37,480 --> 00:14:42,200 Speaker 1: gummit dad, gum it um Well. So, I mean, we 228 00:14:42,280 --> 00:14:45,360 Speaker 1: have these gender stereotypes, but it's not like we don't 229 00:14:45,440 --> 00:14:49,840 Speaker 1: act according to them. Men do tend to be aggressive 230 00:14:49,840 --> 00:14:53,320 Speaker 1: and impulsive, and Dr Raymond Giesseppi found that men actually 231 00:14:53,360 --> 00:14:55,600 Speaker 1: had more of a revenge motive to their anger, so 232 00:14:55,600 --> 00:14:58,800 Speaker 1: they're they're pretty driven in their anger, whereas when women 233 00:14:58,840 --> 00:15:02,359 Speaker 1: are angry, we talk more about our feelings and stay 234 00:15:02,400 --> 00:15:06,200 Speaker 1: angry longer. We are more resentful and more likely to 235 00:15:06,280 --> 00:15:09,520 Speaker 1: just write off another person because they've made us mad. Yeah, 236 00:15:09,560 --> 00:15:12,440 Speaker 1: And when I read that, it totally resonated with me, 237 00:15:12,520 --> 00:15:15,080 Speaker 1: because you know, I've seen this happen. I may or 238 00:15:15,120 --> 00:15:17,720 Speaker 1: may not have been guilty of at least making that 239 00:15:17,840 --> 00:15:20,240 Speaker 1: threat in anger of like, well, you know, you'll just 240 00:15:20,360 --> 00:15:22,360 Speaker 1: be gone. I just don't have to deal with you anymore. 241 00:15:22,640 --> 00:15:25,520 Speaker 1: And in my mind, that kind of anger of just 242 00:15:25,680 --> 00:15:29,400 Speaker 1: eliminating a person writing somebody off to me, that's far 243 00:15:29,480 --> 00:15:32,200 Speaker 1: more powerful than throwing a punch or just yelling and 244 00:15:32,240 --> 00:15:34,960 Speaker 1: stomping out. I've done it. I wonder if it's because 245 00:15:34,960 --> 00:15:37,000 Speaker 1: like we watch so much Oprah where they talk about 246 00:15:37,040 --> 00:15:40,240 Speaker 1: toxic people, you know, like cutting toxic people out of 247 00:15:40,280 --> 00:15:43,480 Speaker 1: your life. But I've done it. I mean I think, Okay, 248 00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:47,720 Speaker 1: have people done it in an overreacting way? Yeah, probably, 249 00:15:47,880 --> 00:15:50,400 Speaker 1: but it does It does feel good when someone's making 250 00:15:50,400 --> 00:15:52,800 Speaker 1: you angry and you have that realization of like, oh, 251 00:15:52,840 --> 00:15:56,280 Speaker 1: but you make me angry all the time that when 252 00:15:56,320 --> 00:16:00,400 Speaker 1: you finally do write that person off, I mean, maybe 253 00:16:00,400 --> 00:16:02,200 Speaker 1: you're not as angry anymore. And you know what that 254 00:16:02,200 --> 00:16:05,320 Speaker 1: circles back to is increasing that sense of control. There 255 00:16:05,320 --> 00:16:07,760 Speaker 1: you go, because you're like, oh wait, I actually don't 256 00:16:07,760 --> 00:16:11,320 Speaker 1: have to deal with you. Maybe we should table toxic 257 00:16:11,440 --> 00:16:14,240 Speaker 1: people for another one. Not to say that it's always 258 00:16:14,280 --> 00:16:16,680 Speaker 1: you know that people are always deserving of being written 259 00:16:16,720 --> 00:16:20,360 Speaker 1: off any who. How Um, there was an interesting study 260 00:16:20,360 --> 00:16:23,640 Speaker 1: though that was conducted, so it's a little bit dated, 261 00:16:23,760 --> 00:16:27,400 Speaker 1: but it was one of the first groundbreaking looks at 262 00:16:27,760 --> 00:16:30,240 Speaker 1: where women's anger tends to stem from. And it was 263 00:16:30,280 --> 00:16:35,280 Speaker 1: conducted by psychologist Sandra Thomas, and she identified three major 264 00:16:35,520 --> 00:16:41,480 Speaker 1: roots of women's anger, which speaks volumes about these gender 265 00:16:41,560 --> 00:16:48,760 Speaker 1: dynamics because it's powerlessness injustice and the irresponsibility of other people. Yeah, 266 00:16:49,200 --> 00:16:53,240 Speaker 1: so give us equality in the workplace and put your 267 00:16:53,280 --> 00:16:57,160 Speaker 1: dishes away. That's right, Yeah, there you go. But I'm 268 00:16:57,280 --> 00:16:59,120 Speaker 1: seriously like, I'm not trying to be glib. When I 269 00:16:59,120 --> 00:17:02,120 Speaker 1: read irresponsible city of other people, I was like, I know, right, 270 00:17:02,160 --> 00:17:05,400 Speaker 1: would people just clean up after themselves? It would be 271 00:17:05,600 --> 00:17:10,399 Speaker 1: it would be nice anyway, So moving on now. There 272 00:17:10,440 --> 00:17:13,720 Speaker 1: was a study publishing the journal Aggressive Behavior published in 273 00:17:13,920 --> 00:17:16,800 Speaker 1: February two thousand and six that looked at differences in 274 00:17:16,920 --> 00:17:22,000 Speaker 1: anger provoking behaviors and verbal insults, and it found that 275 00:17:22,720 --> 00:17:26,480 Speaker 1: men were more likely to consider sort of physical things 276 00:17:26,560 --> 00:17:29,639 Speaker 1: as anger provoking. Uh and in the examples given in 277 00:17:29,680 --> 00:17:34,159 Speaker 1: the study, those were women exhibiting physical aggression or a 278 00:17:34,160 --> 00:17:38,679 Speaker 1: man hurting another person um, whereas women were more likely 279 00:17:38,720 --> 00:17:43,040 Speaker 1: to mention condescending or insensitive behaviors regardless of whether it's 280 00:17:43,040 --> 00:17:47,280 Speaker 1: coming from a man or a woman, along with verbal 281 00:17:47,320 --> 00:17:50,399 Speaker 1: aggression as being more anger provoking. I mean. And of 282 00:17:50,400 --> 00:17:53,560 Speaker 1: course they also found physical aggression to trigger the anger, 283 00:17:53,720 --> 00:17:59,400 Speaker 1: but the verbal stuff and the more behavioral stuff came 284 00:17:59,400 --> 00:18:03,560 Speaker 1: into play a lot more for women. And also for women, 285 00:18:03,600 --> 00:18:08,840 Speaker 1: one of the big differences was accusations of promiscuity. Uh 286 00:18:09,240 --> 00:18:12,439 Speaker 1: old split shaming. Hey, what's up? Yeah, no, wonder it 287 00:18:12,480 --> 00:18:17,359 Speaker 1: makes it makes us angry. Um. Dishonesty just just dishonesty, 288 00:18:17,400 --> 00:18:20,600 Speaker 1: plane and simple provoked more anger when coming from a woman. 289 00:18:21,280 --> 00:18:27,040 Speaker 1: Huh oh lying women, lying women? Interesting? Um. One thing? 290 00:18:27,560 --> 00:18:29,960 Speaker 1: You know, we we we talked about gender divides in 291 00:18:30,040 --> 00:18:34,040 Speaker 1: the workplace a lot, and you know, anger is no different. 292 00:18:34,160 --> 00:18:38,320 Speaker 1: It's something that people experience at work. Um Uh. Studying 293 00:18:38,359 --> 00:18:41,600 Speaker 1: psychological science from March two thousand eight found that men 294 00:18:41,880 --> 00:18:45,520 Speaker 1: benefit straight out benefit from anger at work, whereas women 295 00:18:45,560 --> 00:18:48,960 Speaker 1: do not. Um. Men who expressed anger in a professional 296 00:18:48,960 --> 00:18:53,720 Speaker 1: context were conferred higher status than men who expressed sadness. 297 00:18:53,760 --> 00:18:56,439 Speaker 1: So there we have this gender norms anger is a 298 00:18:56,440 --> 00:19:00,199 Speaker 1: normal masculine emotion, where a sadness is considered more feminine. Um. 299 00:19:00,400 --> 00:19:05,080 Speaker 1: Both men and women conferred lower status on angry female 300 00:19:05,160 --> 00:19:08,960 Speaker 1: professionals than male It was just totally not surprising whatsoever, 301 00:19:09,000 --> 00:19:11,840 Speaker 1: because if you already have a woman in more of 302 00:19:11,880 --> 00:19:15,560 Speaker 1: a leadership position, she's already at social risk from having 303 00:19:15,760 --> 00:19:18,679 Speaker 1: violated those those forms of climbing up the ladder, and 304 00:19:18,720 --> 00:19:21,160 Speaker 1: then to show anger on top of that, well, she's 305 00:19:21,160 --> 00:19:24,720 Speaker 1: just going to be considered a shrew r. One thing 306 00:19:24,720 --> 00:19:26,760 Speaker 1: that I thought was really interesting about this study, though, 307 00:19:27,040 --> 00:19:31,480 Speaker 1: was that women's emotional reactions were attributed to internal characteristics 308 00:19:31,680 --> 00:19:35,720 Speaker 1: their p m s NG again, whereas men's were attributed 309 00:19:35,760 --> 00:19:38,800 Speaker 1: to external circumstances. So obviously, if a woman is expressing 310 00:19:38,800 --> 00:19:41,920 Speaker 1: a masculine emotion like anger, you know, she's got to 311 00:19:41,960 --> 00:19:44,440 Speaker 1: be like, you know, her her uterus is floating around 312 00:19:44,480 --> 00:19:48,600 Speaker 1: her body, whereas men probably have a legitimate reason yeah 313 00:19:48,640 --> 00:19:50,959 Speaker 1: you know, the shipment didn't come, that didn't come in 314 00:19:50,960 --> 00:19:54,720 Speaker 1: on time or something. But there was an equalizer with 315 00:19:54,760 --> 00:19:58,400 Speaker 1: all of this. They found that providing an external attribution 316 00:19:58,920 --> 00:20:04,320 Speaker 1: for the person's anger eliminated gender bias. So if you're 317 00:20:04,320 --> 00:20:08,560 Speaker 1: able to basically say, oh, okay, well our stock price 318 00:20:09,119 --> 00:20:13,399 Speaker 1: plummeted today, so that's why he or she is angry, 319 00:20:13,600 --> 00:20:17,280 Speaker 1: then everyone's like okay, right. But yeah, So that I mean, 320 00:20:17,640 --> 00:20:20,000 Speaker 1: that is something important to keep in mind, whether you're 321 00:20:20,000 --> 00:20:22,840 Speaker 1: a man or a woman. At work, people are making 322 00:20:22,960 --> 00:20:25,480 Speaker 1: really big assumptions about you when you act a certain way. 323 00:20:25,600 --> 00:20:27,840 Speaker 1: Although I will say, I mean, you know, while this 324 00:20:27,920 --> 00:20:30,399 Speaker 1: study says that men benefit from anger at work, I 325 00:20:30,600 --> 00:20:33,520 Speaker 1: imagine that's to a point sure. I mean if you're 326 00:20:33,560 --> 00:20:36,760 Speaker 1: hitting people and like flipping over desks and creating a 327 00:20:36,840 --> 00:20:39,760 Speaker 1: toxic environment, correct, and then I would just write you off. 328 00:20:39,960 --> 00:20:43,399 Speaker 1: That's right, because I'm ruthless. I mean to write you 329 00:20:43,440 --> 00:20:47,840 Speaker 1: off and march straight to the unemployment office. I'll show you. Um. 330 00:20:47,880 --> 00:20:51,080 Speaker 1: But let's circle back to to this idea that women 331 00:20:51,200 --> 00:20:55,400 Speaker 1: might hold in our anger, stay angrier longer even though 332 00:20:55,440 --> 00:20:58,879 Speaker 1: we might be quieter, because this might be leading to 333 00:20:59,240 --> 00:21:04,000 Speaker 1: a higher rate of internalizing disorders. Right. This is coming 334 00:21:04,080 --> 00:21:08,879 Speaker 1: from psychologists Susan Nolan Hoax Sima and Cheryl L. Rusting, 335 00:21:09,080 --> 00:21:13,440 Speaker 1: who found that women show higher rates for all mood 336 00:21:13,440 --> 00:21:18,439 Speaker 1: and anxiety disorders except importantly enough manic episodes uh and 337 00:21:18,480 --> 00:21:22,919 Speaker 1: that includes depression, and they report feeling more shame, sadness, guilt, 338 00:21:23,080 --> 00:21:29,800 Speaker 1: and fear, whereas externalizing disorders, things like antisocial personality disorder 339 00:21:29,840 --> 00:21:33,400 Speaker 1: and substance use disorders are diagnosed more often in men. 340 00:21:33,800 --> 00:21:37,200 Speaker 1: But when it comes to self reporting, women yet again 341 00:21:37,280 --> 00:21:43,119 Speaker 1: reported just as much anger and hostility as men. So again, 342 00:21:43,160 --> 00:21:47,520 Speaker 1: we're expressing it, we're experiencing it, probably differently, and so 343 00:21:47,720 --> 00:21:51,280 Speaker 1: the inconsistency in these findings could be related to the 344 00:21:51,320 --> 00:21:55,520 Speaker 1: gender differences that elicit anger, and that we're more likely 345 00:21:55,600 --> 00:21:59,840 Speaker 1: to feel shame and sadness. Oh man, that's depressing. Yeah, 346 00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:02,480 Speaker 1: I just I feel like it's kind of a minefield. 347 00:22:02,800 --> 00:22:07,320 Speaker 1: Not only are we kind of discouraged from feeling or 348 00:22:07,359 --> 00:22:11,240 Speaker 1: expressing anger, but if we do, I feel like we're 349 00:22:11,280 --> 00:22:14,200 Speaker 1: more likely to be guilty about it and and ashamed 350 00:22:14,240 --> 00:22:17,639 Speaker 1: of our strong masculine emotion. Oh yeah. If I if 351 00:22:17,680 --> 00:22:22,000 Speaker 1: I let my temper flare and I lowed to another 352 00:22:22,040 --> 00:22:26,080 Speaker 1: person about it, try to put this delicately, I feel 353 00:22:26,119 --> 00:22:29,760 Speaker 1: incredibly guilty. It's like a it's a cycle. I can 354 00:22:29,800 --> 00:22:33,359 Speaker 1: predict it almost down to the minute. Well I can't. 355 00:22:33,600 --> 00:22:35,919 Speaker 1: All right, maybe this says something bad about me. I 356 00:22:35,960 --> 00:22:38,639 Speaker 1: can't say that when I get actually angry, not just 357 00:22:38,680 --> 00:22:41,040 Speaker 1: annoyed or whatever. When I get actually angry, I can't 358 00:22:41,040 --> 00:22:43,879 Speaker 1: say that I feel guilty about it. But I do. 359 00:22:44,040 --> 00:22:47,560 Speaker 1: It just poisons like the next several hours for me. Right, 360 00:22:47,800 --> 00:22:50,040 Speaker 1: I guess it's more. I don't feel guilty about feeling angry. 361 00:22:50,200 --> 00:22:53,199 Speaker 1: I get I feel guilty if I express it to 362 00:22:53,280 --> 00:22:59,520 Speaker 1: the target of that anger. Because Mavos Caroline can get loud, 363 00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:04,479 Speaker 1: I'm a yeller. Well, I um just drop a lot 364 00:23:04,560 --> 00:23:07,280 Speaker 1: of F bombs, like uncontrollably. Now, I'm like, I had 365 00:23:07,320 --> 00:23:11,159 Speaker 1: a day a couple last week, a day where I 366 00:23:11,200 --> 00:23:13,480 Speaker 1: just seriously, like, let loose a string of F bombs 367 00:23:13,520 --> 00:23:16,400 Speaker 1: and I couldn't even control it. Like I couldn't even 368 00:23:16,680 --> 00:23:18,440 Speaker 1: It's not like I was making a conscious effort to 369 00:23:18,480 --> 00:23:20,200 Speaker 1: say F this and F that and F that guy 370 00:23:20,240 --> 00:23:22,880 Speaker 1: and screw this, and no, I was just I think, 371 00:23:22,880 --> 00:23:24,320 Speaker 1: I don't know. I blacked out for a second. I 372 00:23:24,359 --> 00:23:26,840 Speaker 1: came to and I was like, man, I said a 373 00:23:26,920 --> 00:23:29,600 Speaker 1: lot of F bombs, but I've got to go do 374 00:23:29,680 --> 00:23:32,639 Speaker 1: work now. So well, and then you realize you were 375 00:23:32,760 --> 00:23:38,800 Speaker 1: live on television. Oh you've been Ashton Kutcher this whole time. 376 00:23:39,520 --> 00:23:41,600 Speaker 1: Uh No, But seriously, a lot of a lot of 377 00:23:41,600 --> 00:23:44,960 Speaker 1: this uh this research has been resonating a lot with 378 00:23:45,200 --> 00:23:48,440 Speaker 1: my own personal patterns of anger and even just talking 379 00:23:48,520 --> 00:23:53,639 Speaker 1: publicly about being angry. I'm not calling myself an angry person, 380 00:23:53,920 --> 00:23:56,640 Speaker 1: but even just acknowledging to the world that I experience 381 00:23:56,720 --> 00:24:02,359 Speaker 1: and express anger sometimes I'm feeling uncomfortable. Yeah yeah, uh, 382 00:24:03,160 --> 00:24:08,920 Speaker 1: I guess I think that speaks to our identities are personal, 383 00:24:09,000 --> 00:24:12,400 Speaker 1: our personal identities, how we think of ourselves, and also 384 00:24:12,440 --> 00:24:15,679 Speaker 1: how we want to portray ourselves to other people. It 385 00:24:15,680 --> 00:24:20,639 Speaker 1: feels very vulnerable just to speak honestly about it. But 386 00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:25,480 Speaker 1: maybe perhaps could it get better as as we get older. 387 00:24:25,640 --> 00:24:29,000 Speaker 1: Maybe we're just young and crazy and you know, just 388 00:24:29,119 --> 00:24:32,640 Speaker 1: fiery women and anger will just kind of chill out 389 00:24:32,640 --> 00:24:37,120 Speaker 1: as we get older. Um. Maybe, but probably not. Most 390 00:24:37,119 --> 00:24:41,320 Speaker 1: studies have shown, honestly that if you're a fiery angry 391 00:24:41,359 --> 00:24:44,600 Speaker 1: twenty something, you're going to be a fiery angry sixty something. 392 00:24:45,160 --> 00:24:48,399 Speaker 1: Oh well, and there was also this I'll be curious 393 00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:52,200 Speaker 1: here from any listeners to fit this demo whether this 394 00:24:52,640 --> 00:24:57,040 Speaker 1: rings true to you. Sandra Thomas at UT Knoxville did 395 00:24:57,040 --> 00:25:00,159 Speaker 1: a study in January two two, and she found that 396 00:25:00,560 --> 00:25:05,199 Speaker 1: women in their forties scored significantly higher on anger at 397 00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:08,200 Speaker 1: work than women of other ages, and their scores were 398 00:25:08,200 --> 00:25:12,080 Speaker 1: twice as high as men in their forties. I wonder, though, 399 00:25:12,200 --> 00:25:15,120 Speaker 1: This is my pet theory, is that women in their forties, 400 00:25:15,640 --> 00:25:18,440 Speaker 1: if you have a job, you're probably also taking care 401 00:25:18,480 --> 00:25:21,240 Speaker 1: of kids. There's the imbalance a lot of times of 402 00:25:21,280 --> 00:25:26,560 Speaker 1: the housework. Yeah, you might, you might be a bit angrier. Yeah, 403 00:25:26,640 --> 00:25:29,680 Speaker 1: I absolutely I thought the same thing when I read that. Um, 404 00:25:29,720 --> 00:25:32,680 Speaker 1: But as far as Kristen, raising our voices and expressing 405 00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:37,360 Speaker 1: anger to other people, You're in the majority, um. They 406 00:25:37,400 --> 00:25:39,840 Speaker 1: found in this study. As Thomas found in the study 407 00:25:39,920 --> 00:25:43,919 Speaker 1: that UM, there were significant age differences for the propensity 408 00:25:43,960 --> 00:25:48,120 Speaker 1: to overtly express anger. Women in their twenties and thirties 409 00:25:48,160 --> 00:25:52,680 Speaker 1: had the highest mean score on the total expressed anger scale, 410 00:25:53,320 --> 00:25:56,800 Speaker 1: leading Thomas to ask whether we're seeing a weakening of 411 00:25:56,920 --> 00:26:02,280 Speaker 1: traditional gender role socialization. So basically, uh, women are becoming 412 00:26:02,480 --> 00:26:06,280 Speaker 1: more expressive of anger more often. Yeah, there was speaking 413 00:26:06,320 --> 00:26:11,919 Speaker 1: of which a very flimsy daily mail, Yes, the Daily 414 00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:15,640 Speaker 1: Fail story that we found on how young girls are 415 00:26:15,680 --> 00:26:20,760 Speaker 1: fighting and becoming you know, these rambunctious young women and 416 00:26:20,840 --> 00:26:23,560 Speaker 1: so we must be angry and crazy. Now what what 417 00:26:23,560 --> 00:26:26,320 Speaker 1: what to do about it? Which I don't even know 418 00:26:26,359 --> 00:26:29,119 Speaker 1: if it's worth siding. Yeah. I just thought it was 419 00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:33,280 Speaker 1: funny because in all of this was actual academic research 420 00:26:33,320 --> 00:26:35,959 Speaker 1: about anger and how we expressed that according to our 421 00:26:36,040 --> 00:26:40,280 Speaker 1: gender norms. Um, there's like, hey, girls getting bar fights 422 00:26:40,320 --> 00:26:45,480 Speaker 1: now that means equality, right or something? No, moving on, 423 00:26:45,880 --> 00:26:47,840 Speaker 1: So how do we manage all this anger? We we 424 00:26:47,920 --> 00:26:50,639 Speaker 1: both acknowledge that it happens to us. Cooly, it happens 425 00:26:50,640 --> 00:26:55,520 Speaker 1: to other people, and it's this fully physical mental process 426 00:26:55,640 --> 00:27:00,119 Speaker 1: that is natural. It's tolly natural. But we need to 427 00:27:00,960 --> 00:27:03,560 Speaker 1: we need to manage it. How do we do that right? Well, 428 00:27:03,560 --> 00:27:07,640 Speaker 1: there are three basic responses to anger. Those are one expression, 429 00:27:07,720 --> 00:27:10,879 Speaker 1: everything from having a nice, calm discussion to blowing up 430 00:27:10,880 --> 00:27:14,240 Speaker 1: and yelling a lot of F bombs about something that 431 00:27:14,280 --> 00:27:18,440 Speaker 1: didn't go your way. Not that I'm being specific. Suppression, 432 00:27:18,600 --> 00:27:21,840 Speaker 1: which can be holding it in, changing your focus, or 433 00:27:21,920 --> 00:27:23,480 Speaker 1: letting it go. And you would think that letting it 434 00:27:23,520 --> 00:27:25,240 Speaker 1: go could be a good thing, but I would think 435 00:27:25,240 --> 00:27:28,159 Speaker 1: that this refers to like, if somebody keeps harping on 436 00:27:28,200 --> 00:27:30,679 Speaker 1: you or infringing on something and you just continue not 437 00:27:30,760 --> 00:27:32,320 Speaker 1: to deal with it, that could be a bad thing. 438 00:27:32,760 --> 00:27:35,640 Speaker 1: But also let's look at management. That's the third one, 439 00:27:35,640 --> 00:27:39,400 Speaker 1: and that is acknowledging anger as a normal emotion and 440 00:27:39,440 --> 00:27:42,920 Speaker 1: making choices to improve your situation, not just dropping f bombs, 441 00:27:43,080 --> 00:27:46,199 Speaker 1: but actually doing something about it. Yeah, there's some of 442 00:27:46,200 --> 00:27:49,639 Speaker 1: the stuff we read said that venting, like that letting 443 00:27:49,680 --> 00:27:53,320 Speaker 1: your volcano explode, is actually not the best way to 444 00:27:53,560 --> 00:27:57,399 Speaker 1: express yourself. So the Mayo Clinic, for instance, offers a 445 00:27:57,480 --> 00:28:01,280 Speaker 1: number of suggestions on healthy anger may management, which is 446 00:28:01,400 --> 00:28:05,240 Speaker 1: as basic as counting to tend you're taking a time 447 00:28:05,240 --> 00:28:09,879 Speaker 1: out before you react, um, expressing your anger once you're calm, 448 00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:14,800 Speaker 1: so you're not being confrontational. Exercise. That's something I wholeheartedly believe, 449 00:28:14,800 --> 00:28:18,000 Speaker 1: and I've talked before about how yoga essentially keeps me 450 00:28:18,040 --> 00:28:23,120 Speaker 1: saying along with jogging um. Also looking for solutions rather 451 00:28:23,200 --> 00:28:27,000 Speaker 1: than just looking for a target. Yeah. And one important 452 00:28:27,000 --> 00:28:28,720 Speaker 1: thing that I try to remember every time I have 453 00:28:29,040 --> 00:28:31,320 Speaker 1: I try to have a productive conversation with my roommate 454 00:28:31,560 --> 00:28:34,600 Speaker 1: is to use I statements. Try to avoid criticizing and 455 00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:38,680 Speaker 1: replacing blame um. And also this is a hard one, 456 00:28:38,720 --> 00:28:42,000 Speaker 1: I think, but don't hold a grudge. Try to forgive 457 00:28:42,480 --> 00:28:46,360 Speaker 1: and learn from the situation. Also practice relaxation skills things 458 00:28:46,360 --> 00:28:50,160 Speaker 1: like yoga, help, meditation, you know, napping, um. But also 459 00:28:50,200 --> 00:28:53,160 Speaker 1: know when to seek help. For instance, the whole conversation 460 00:28:53,200 --> 00:28:57,320 Speaker 1: that started this topic that we picked. You know, there's 461 00:28:57,360 --> 00:29:00,560 Speaker 1: a point at which you're not just kind of going 462 00:29:00,600 --> 00:29:04,040 Speaker 1: through a funk. Maybe you're not just annoyed with you know, 463 00:29:04,240 --> 00:29:07,680 Speaker 1: traffic or work or whatever. It's it's something that maybe 464 00:29:07,720 --> 00:29:10,560 Speaker 1: has changed or something that has gotten worse over time, 465 00:29:10,560 --> 00:29:12,840 Speaker 1: and maybe you're just now noticing it, so you do 466 00:29:13,000 --> 00:29:16,680 Speaker 1: need to go talk to someone that's perfectly normal and healthy. Yeah, 467 00:29:16,760 --> 00:29:21,400 Speaker 1: I think that point of remembering the anger is a 468 00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:26,360 Speaker 1: normal human emotion that has been with us for millennia 469 00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:30,280 Speaker 1: is really important. It helps you kind of rationalize things 470 00:29:30,320 --> 00:29:33,320 Speaker 1: maybe right heat at the moment. And I absolutely think 471 00:29:33,520 --> 00:29:36,520 Speaker 1: that because when I, like when I took vacation and 472 00:29:36,640 --> 00:29:39,120 Speaker 1: I had a minute to actually think, you know, a 473 00:29:39,120 --> 00:29:42,360 Speaker 1: minute to actually sit and drink coffee and think, you know, 474 00:29:42,400 --> 00:29:45,360 Speaker 1: I did reflect on the things that had made me 475 00:29:45,640 --> 00:29:48,800 Speaker 1: angry in my life and like, Okay, what what's driving 476 00:29:48,800 --> 00:29:51,160 Speaker 1: this like crazy town feeling? And what can I do 477 00:29:51,240 --> 00:29:54,280 Speaker 1: to change that stuff? You know, not just letting it stew. 478 00:29:54,320 --> 00:29:57,720 Speaker 1: Actually give yourself a minute to kind of think about 479 00:29:57,800 --> 00:30:01,240 Speaker 1: why you're having this reaction and and what needs to change. 480 00:30:02,080 --> 00:30:06,120 Speaker 1: Because the thing is not managing your anger and just 481 00:30:06,600 --> 00:30:10,320 Speaker 1: letting it eat away at you is not good for 482 00:30:10,360 --> 00:30:13,960 Speaker 1: your health overall. It's probably not good for your relationships either. 483 00:30:14,120 --> 00:30:17,280 Speaker 1: But just physically speaking, a lot of studies have shown 484 00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:23,200 Speaker 1: how not managing your anger in a positive way is 485 00:30:23,240 --> 00:30:26,880 Speaker 1: possibly worse than the health effects of smoking and obesity. Yeah, 486 00:30:26,880 --> 00:30:30,320 Speaker 1: we found a lot of studies from Harvard Um. Most 487 00:30:30,360 --> 00:30:34,280 Speaker 1: of them focused on men, so we'll have to you know, hey, 488 00:30:34,480 --> 00:30:37,719 Speaker 1: listeners out there who do research, could you get on 489 00:30:37,760 --> 00:30:41,320 Speaker 1: this um Harvard found that among men with an average 490 00:30:41,320 --> 00:30:44,920 Speaker 1: age of sixty two, the angriest were three times more 491 00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:49,120 Speaker 1: likely to develop heart disease than the most relaxed. And 492 00:30:49,280 --> 00:30:53,760 Speaker 1: coming from John's Hopkins, a study tracked male medical students 493 00:30:53,800 --> 00:30:56,719 Speaker 1: for thirty six years and found that anger and young 494 00:30:56,760 --> 00:31:00,880 Speaker 1: adulthood emerged as a predictor of premature art disease. Listen 495 00:31:00,880 --> 00:31:04,120 Speaker 1: to this. The angriest students were six times more likely 496 00:31:04,120 --> 00:31:07,640 Speaker 1: to suffer heart attacks by fifty five and three times 497 00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:11,640 Speaker 1: more likely to develop some type of cardiovascular disease. And 498 00:31:11,720 --> 00:31:14,000 Speaker 1: so I can only imagine that the fact that women 499 00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:18,040 Speaker 1: tend to stay angrier longer could have equally dire physical 500 00:31:18,080 --> 00:31:21,040 Speaker 1: consequences as well. I mean, because think about all those 501 00:31:21,080 --> 00:31:25,360 Speaker 1: physiological facets of anger, things like a surge in adrenaline, 502 00:31:25,360 --> 00:31:28,640 Speaker 1: the stress hormone that boost blood pressure and pulse rate, 503 00:31:28,760 --> 00:31:33,880 Speaker 1: increasing the heart's workload and increasing also its need for oxygen. 504 00:31:33,960 --> 00:31:38,320 Speaker 1: Anger actually makes your body work harder, right. It activates platelets, 505 00:31:38,360 --> 00:31:41,320 Speaker 1: those little tiny blood cells that trigger blood clots and 506 00:31:41,480 --> 00:31:44,000 Speaker 1: high anger levels can even provoke a spasm in a 507 00:31:44,040 --> 00:31:48,520 Speaker 1: coronary artery, So it's really not a good idea to 508 00:31:48,600 --> 00:31:52,280 Speaker 1: get angry and stay angry for a long period of time. Yeah, 509 00:31:52,280 --> 00:31:55,400 Speaker 1: there was one study we found from July two thousand 510 00:31:55,480 --> 00:31:58,720 Speaker 1: three in Psychosomatic Medicine UM, and it suggested that women 511 00:31:58,880 --> 00:32:04,800 Speaker 1: suppressed anger correlated with cardiovascular and cancer related early mortality, 512 00:32:04,840 --> 00:32:09,480 Speaker 1: and so essentially these women were dying sooner, maybe possibly 513 00:32:09,480 --> 00:32:15,880 Speaker 1: related to not expressing that anger. Yeah, so I don't know, man, 514 00:32:16,400 --> 00:32:18,560 Speaker 1: I guess I would sum it up by saying that 515 00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:23,360 Speaker 1: you've got to use anger as a catalyst to look 516 00:32:23,440 --> 00:32:26,000 Speaker 1: internally at things that maybe aren't going your way and 517 00:32:26,040 --> 00:32:28,560 Speaker 1: figure out how you can change them or fix them, 518 00:32:28,600 --> 00:32:32,400 Speaker 1: because if you just stay angry, I mean that has 519 00:32:32,440 --> 00:32:36,560 Speaker 1: some pretty direct consequences. And also maybe focusing on how 520 00:32:36,600 --> 00:32:38,680 Speaker 1: anger can be a positive in those ways that we 521 00:32:38,760 --> 00:32:41,800 Speaker 1: noted in terms of being a motivator to find solutions, 522 00:32:42,040 --> 00:32:43,920 Speaker 1: a warning that something might be wrong, that you need 523 00:32:43,960 --> 00:32:47,320 Speaker 1: to adjust something in your life, or increasing that sense 524 00:32:47,360 --> 00:32:50,360 Speaker 1: of control, and perhaps as women circling back to the 525 00:32:50,360 --> 00:32:53,400 Speaker 1: beginning of the conversation with you know women are age 526 00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:54,960 Speaker 1: saying like, you know what I'm angry and I don't 527 00:32:55,000 --> 00:32:58,200 Speaker 1: know why or you know, feminists who are criticized for 528 00:32:58,280 --> 00:33:01,960 Speaker 1: being angry and like the label of anger being sort 529 00:33:02,000 --> 00:33:04,440 Speaker 1: of dangled over women's heads of like, oh, you don't 530 00:33:04,440 --> 00:33:06,760 Speaker 1: want to come across that way, do you, and may 531 00:33:06,760 --> 00:33:08,800 Speaker 1: be saying, you know what, actually, it's totally fine to 532 00:33:08,840 --> 00:33:11,280 Speaker 1: be angry. Yeah, there reasons for it. There are definitely 533 00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:14,720 Speaker 1: reasons for it. We're not talking about being irrationally angry, 534 00:33:14,840 --> 00:33:19,200 Speaker 1: you know, but sure maybe it should be okay more 535 00:33:19,240 --> 00:33:24,520 Speaker 1: okay for women to get angry sometimes. So curious to 536 00:33:24,560 --> 00:33:28,280 Speaker 1: hear what folks have to say about this one. Your 537 00:33:28,320 --> 00:33:34,960 Speaker 1: thoughts on anger expressed kindly? Yeah, don't be angry at us. Yeah, 538 00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:40,120 Speaker 1: and now our letters. Okay, well, I have a letter 539 00:33:40,200 --> 00:33:44,120 Speaker 1: here from Elizabeth, who wrote to us about our Bachelor's 540 00:33:44,200 --> 00:33:48,240 Speaker 1: Party episode. She says, I am Mormon, and so are 541 00:33:48,280 --> 00:33:50,920 Speaker 1: my friends who are my bridesmaids, and as such, we 542 00:33:51,000 --> 00:33:53,960 Speaker 1: had a stone cold, sober night out on the town 543 00:33:53,960 --> 00:33:56,560 Speaker 1: in Baltimore. We spent the first part of the day 544 00:33:56,560 --> 00:33:59,120 Speaker 1: shopping and touring the Inner Harbor, followed by a delicious 545 00:33:59,200 --> 00:34:02,000 Speaker 1: dinner and Deserve It at a downtown restaurant. The night 546 00:34:02,080 --> 00:34:04,800 Speaker 1: was finished by going to a dueling piano bar and 547 00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:08,439 Speaker 1: enjoying the spectacular musical talent. I had such a great 548 00:34:08,440 --> 00:34:10,800 Speaker 1: time with all of my girlfriends and never once thought 549 00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:12,920 Speaker 1: I was prude or missing out because I didn't have 550 00:34:13,040 --> 00:34:16,240 Speaker 1: penis whistles, binge drink, or watch a male stripper, et cetera. 551 00:34:16,920 --> 00:34:19,279 Speaker 1: In fact, I firmly believe I hadn't even better time 552 00:34:19,320 --> 00:34:22,160 Speaker 1: because of it. No hangover, less expensive. I remember all 553 00:34:22,160 --> 00:34:24,360 Speaker 1: the good times and it felt very classy and fun. 554 00:34:24,880 --> 00:34:26,920 Speaker 1: I saw the night as a celebration for me and 555 00:34:26,960 --> 00:34:29,319 Speaker 1: the girls of my upcoming nuptials, and as part of 556 00:34:29,360 --> 00:34:31,360 Speaker 1: my thank you for all of their hard work and 557 00:34:31,400 --> 00:34:34,560 Speaker 1: effort supporting me along the way. Just food for thought 558 00:34:34,640 --> 00:34:36,600 Speaker 1: for other women who were turned off by the current 559 00:34:36,600 --> 00:34:39,600 Speaker 1: status quo for bachelorette parties. And then she says thanks 560 00:34:39,600 --> 00:34:43,239 Speaker 1: for the podcast. Hey, you're welcome, and I have been 561 00:34:43,239 --> 00:34:45,200 Speaker 1: listening for a couple of years now and always enjoy 562 00:34:45,280 --> 00:34:47,759 Speaker 1: that it challenges me to think outside my sometimes nearrow 563 00:34:47,840 --> 00:34:50,640 Speaker 1: view of the world. And thank you for sharing your 564 00:34:50,719 --> 00:34:53,880 Speaker 1: view with us. Elizabeth, and I've had a Facebook message 565 00:34:53,920 --> 00:34:58,560 Speaker 1: here from Dana and she was writing about our episode 566 00:34:58,560 --> 00:35:03,400 Speaker 1: on office romances, and she has an interesting story to share. 567 00:35:03,640 --> 00:35:06,280 Speaker 1: She says, I currently work in a male dominated work 568 00:35:06,360 --> 00:35:11,759 Speaker 1: environment of brewing, and I am dating my boss. She said, 569 00:35:11,800 --> 00:35:13,680 Speaker 1: when I was going through this, I was extremely happy 570 00:35:13,680 --> 00:35:16,279 Speaker 1: in my job and extremely attracted to my boss. I 571 00:35:16,280 --> 00:35:18,520 Speaker 1: didn't want to lose my job, blues face, or mess 572 00:35:18,600 --> 00:35:22,239 Speaker 1: up the women in brewing image. I needed guidance. I 573 00:35:22,280 --> 00:35:24,920 Speaker 1: really couldn't find any that suggested that the scenario might 574 00:35:25,040 --> 00:35:28,840 Speaker 1: work out. Ultimately, against the advice of almost everyone I knew, 575 00:35:29,200 --> 00:35:32,000 Speaker 1: I decided to trust myself, and so did he. I 576 00:35:32,040 --> 00:35:34,200 Speaker 1: agree with Caroline that working your way to the top 577 00:35:34,360 --> 00:35:38,880 Speaker 1: using sexuality is despicable. I think these days character determines 578 00:35:38,920 --> 00:35:42,240 Speaker 1: the existence of abuse, exploitation, and inequity in the workplace 579 00:35:42,320 --> 00:35:45,920 Speaker 1: dating dynamic. I don't think the formula male manager plus 580 00:35:45,960 --> 00:35:50,480 Speaker 1: female subordinate necessarily equates to those things. Once my manager 581 00:35:50,480 --> 00:35:53,360 Speaker 1: and I decided that we were falling in rev we 582 00:35:53,480 --> 00:35:57,879 Speaker 1: told the CEO and HR. The response was, Okay, we'll 583 00:35:57,880 --> 00:36:00,279 Speaker 1: make this work. We signed one of those cupid hype 584 00:36:00,280 --> 00:36:03,640 Speaker 1: contracts and have moved forward. It's been a year now 585 00:36:03,680 --> 00:36:05,560 Speaker 1: we lived together and I can still work with him 586 00:36:05,600 --> 00:36:08,239 Speaker 1: as my manager. I think that the CEO's judgment was 587 00:36:08,280 --> 00:36:11,360 Speaker 1: based on this thought that we were good people with integrity. 588 00:36:11,560 --> 00:36:13,640 Speaker 1: Maybe if we were unscrupulous people, he would not have 589 00:36:13,640 --> 00:36:16,080 Speaker 1: trusted us to engage in what it's now pretty much 590 00:36:16,160 --> 00:36:19,680 Speaker 1: against company policy. But the relationship was never casual, so 591 00:36:19,800 --> 00:36:24,000 Speaker 1: perhaps there was inherent respect to rely on. I suppose 592 00:36:24,040 --> 00:36:26,080 Speaker 1: that if it was merely dating, I wouldn't have trusted 593 00:36:26,160 --> 00:36:28,640 Speaker 1: him as much. So, long story short, you can date 594 00:36:28,680 --> 00:36:34,600 Speaker 1: your boss as long as both parties aren't heads. So 595 00:36:35,200 --> 00:36:38,359 Speaker 1: thanks Danta and Elizabeth and everybody else for writing in 596 00:36:38,840 --> 00:36:40,640 Speaker 1: mom Stuff of Discovery dot com is where you can 597 00:36:40,680 --> 00:36:42,960 Speaker 1: send your emails. You can also message us on Facebook 598 00:36:43,000 --> 00:36:45,400 Speaker 1: or tweet us at mom Stuff podcasts, and you can 599 00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:47,640 Speaker 1: keep up with a steering the week over on Tumbler 600 00:36:47,719 --> 00:36:50,000 Speaker 1: where it's stuff mom Never Told You dot tumbler dot 601 00:36:50,000 --> 00:36:52,000 Speaker 1: com where you can follow us and don't forget that 602 00:36:52,080 --> 00:36:55,479 Speaker 1: you can watch us as well on YouTube YouTube dot com. 603 00:36:55,520 --> 00:36:57,560 Speaker 1: Slash stuff Mom Never Told You is where you can 604 00:36:57,600 --> 00:37:03,000 Speaker 1: go and I'll forget to subscribe for more on this 605 00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:05,720 Speaker 1: and thousands of other topics. Is it how Stuff Works 606 00:37:05,719 --> 00:37:14,520 Speaker 1: dot com