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Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha, and welcome to stuff

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Speaker 1: I've never told you protection of Hiar Radio. It's time

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Speaker 1: for another female first, which means we are once again

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Speaker 1: so happy to be joined to have joining us, to

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Speaker 1: be joined by our good friend and co worker Eve's hives.

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Speaker 1: Hi Hi. Was that stumble over that based on the

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Speaker 1: fact that you said that in passive voice or was

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Speaker 1: that just like a way that you must say it.

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Speaker 1: It's interesting you say that because in high school I

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Speaker 1: had a very very intense grammar teacher and she was

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Speaker 1: like well known throughout the school for making people cry.

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Speaker 1: She was really strict, and she hated the passive voice.

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Speaker 1: And so when I catch myself writing in it or

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Speaker 1: do it, even if I think sometimes it's not as

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Speaker 1: big a deal as she made it out to be,

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Speaker 1: or that it fits the situation, I hear Mrs Ham's

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Speaker 1: voice in the back of my head. So it is

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Speaker 1: a thing where clearly I still get hug up on it.

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Speaker 1: I didn't mean to call you out on that. It's

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Speaker 1: just it was just that something that I noticed, you know,

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Speaker 1: as a person who was an editor and you know,

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Speaker 1: thinks about grammar because it's one of those things that

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Speaker 1: never really mattered, like at all of what it does

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Speaker 1: actually make something a little bit more difficult to understand.

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Speaker 1: But like there are so many things that may matter

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Speaker 1: on the page that shouldn't be staunch rules when we're

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Speaker 1: just like speaking. So I just related, Yeah, well, thank

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Speaker 1: you picked up on it. I think about it every

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Speaker 1: day because the part of this job is communicating and writing,

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Speaker 1: and I'm always like, how can I write this and

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Speaker 1: not the passive voice, which actually relates to kind of

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Speaker 1: what I was going to ask before we get into this,

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Speaker 1: because we've been talking about sororities and fraternity these and

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Speaker 1: all of this relates to the topic to the woman

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Speaker 1: we're going to discuss today. But I was curious how

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Speaker 1: both of you your college experiences were, how you kind

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Speaker 1: of remember them. You don't have to go in depth,

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Speaker 1: but you know, kind of on the surface, how was

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Speaker 1: it for you. I wanted Samantha to go first. Oh, man,

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Speaker 1: I was first. I try to see because mine's boring.

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Speaker 1: Like I'm super religious in college, so I did a

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Speaker 1: lot of like religious things, including mission trips. And I

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Speaker 1: really regret, not regret the people that I've met, because

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Speaker 1: I feel like I've met some really cool people. But

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Speaker 1: if I had to do it over again, I would

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Speaker 1: have made a few more mistakes. I feel like I've

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Speaker 1: missed out on a lot of that. I did tell

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Speaker 1: my niece, who just recently graduated college, when she started,

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Speaker 1: I was like, enjoy it, truly, enjoy it, do what

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Speaker 1: you want, and don't be afraid to do some mischievous

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Speaker 1: not illegal necessarily, but mischievous things, and make good friend shows.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, I was really boring, not bad. Like we

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Speaker 1: were talking some of the things that I had some

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Speaker 1: flashbacks and going to Tate Center at the University of Georgia,

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Speaker 1: which is where all the kids hung out, or any

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Speaker 1: of the organizations that try to recruit you, or even

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Speaker 1: our college campus preachers who would just scream at people.

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Speaker 1: That was where they hung out. So that's what I

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Speaker 1: remember when we were talking about all of that, And

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Speaker 1: of course we were talking about sororities and trying to

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Speaker 1: be recruited. That's where they hung out majority of the time.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, very very boring essentially. Yeah, that didn't sound

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Speaker 1: boring to me at all. I mean, I just I

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Speaker 1: let me think college was good. I don't know, I

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Speaker 1: feel like it was a lot different than my high

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Speaker 1: school experience was coming out of high school obviously, as

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Speaker 1: it is for like many people, but I was like,

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Speaker 1: I was a nerd, and I've been a nerd and

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Speaker 1: I'm still a nerd. So I was still that throughout college.

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Speaker 1: But I did have a lot of fun, like you know,

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Speaker 1: I spent I was in Atlanta for most of my time,

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Speaker 1: I was in Savana for some of my time, and

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Speaker 1: in France for a very short time. But yeah, I

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Speaker 1: had a great time. I feel like I had a

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Speaker 1: good school work life balance. Surprisingly, like I was able

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Speaker 1: to still have new experiences with my friends and meet

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Speaker 1: new people and party and did make a lot of mistakes,

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Speaker 1: so that one Samantha Um, But I enjoyed it. You know,

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Speaker 1: I wouldn't do anything differently. I I feel like the

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Speaker 1: reason I chose Georgia Tech was a very foolish reason.

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Speaker 1: It was mostly monetary. But the second thing was I

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Speaker 1: thought I was in Atlanta so I had party a lot.

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Speaker 1: That's not the case. I definitely party more now than

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Speaker 1: I did. So I really enjoyed college because I also

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Speaker 1: have a nerd and I love like reading and I

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Speaker 1: love challenging points of view or just new ways of

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Speaker 1: thinking that I owner there those like terrifying liberal new

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Speaker 1: thoughts that you have, but I hated homework and I

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Speaker 1: still hate homework, and so it was like, if I

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Speaker 1: could just go to the class and have the Dorom experience,

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Speaker 1: that was amazing. The homework experience was a nightmare. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: And I also in high school, I didn't have to study.

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Speaker 1: In college, it was like, oh wow, here's a scene

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Speaker 1: for sure. But yeah, I had some fun times. And

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Speaker 1: I actually started running for the first time again in

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Speaker 1: over a year, which means I had to. I brought

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Speaker 1: out my old playlist, my old exercise playlist, and so

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Speaker 1: many of the songs on there, or like songs I

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Speaker 1: loved in college. I'd be walking on Skyles walk Away

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Speaker 1: and this song would be playing, and it just brought

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Speaker 1: back a lot of a lot of those memories. Yeah. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I love those songs that you can pinpoint moments in

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Speaker 1: time that they're related to and they become kind of

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Speaker 1: like the medic songs in your life. But it's funny

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Speaker 1: because I was the opposite of you, Annie. I don't know,

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Speaker 1: in college, I wasn't really yeah, but I was the

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Speaker 1: opposite of you in terms of homework. I have a

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Speaker 1: literal VHS tape of me when I was a child

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Speaker 1: in elementary school saying that I loved homework, Like when

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Speaker 1: I don't. I don't remember what I was being interview for.

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Speaker 1: I think I was in like some sort of play

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Speaker 1: and somebody asked me, like, Eaves, what do you like

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Speaker 1: or what do you like to do? And I was like,

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Speaker 1: homework so cute? Yeah, so I can't really bear loves homework.

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Speaker 1: I loved homework intill college. Oh no, I loved it

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Speaker 1: elementary school and middle school. I hated it in high school.

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Speaker 1: And but yes I would ask for extra mass sheets

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Speaker 1: because I loved doing all the calculation. I see. So

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Speaker 1: it it morphed, It transforms somehow somewhere along the way.

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Speaker 1: It did. It did when the professors were like, read

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Speaker 1: this three books tonight, and your whole score, your whole

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Speaker 1: g p A depends on the outcome of this one test.

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Speaker 1: That was not good for me, as I had a

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Speaker 1: nightmares about commas, mainly because later in the like AP

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Speaker 1: English and all of that, they're like, each common mistake

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Speaker 1: is thirty points and I'm like what what? And I

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Speaker 1: failed because of my one and a half common mistakes.

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Speaker 1: I still have nightmares about that. I think Commas, I

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Speaker 1: think we should relax about Comma. That's the quotable from

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Speaker 1: this episode. I think we still like about that. That

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Speaker 1: is a true belief that I hold. This all relates

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Speaker 1: to the person that we're talking about today, perhaps tangentially,

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Speaker 1: but it does. So who did you bring for us

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Speaker 1: to discuss today's Yeah, we have Lucy Dig's slow. So

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Speaker 1: she had a lot of first Like she was a

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Speaker 1: pioneer in many ways, and she is related to what

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Speaker 1: we were just talking about because she was in the

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Speaker 1: education field in school, she was a teacher, and she

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Speaker 1: cared a lot about the education and development of girls

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Speaker 1: and of black girls and women specifically. So she has

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Speaker 1: a lot of accomplishments, Like we could go down the

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Speaker 1: list of all of the organizations and the civil and

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Speaker 1: community and educational ventures, various ventures that she was involved in.

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Speaker 1: But as far as first, she was the first Dean

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Speaker 1: of Women at Howard University, and so the Dean of

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Speaker 1: Women was kind of this role where it was like

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Speaker 1: student affairs for women, like counseling, discipline, and student experiences

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Speaker 1: for the women's students at the school. Um. She was

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Speaker 1: also the first president of the National Association of College Women,

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Speaker 1: and she was one of the founders of the Alpha

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Speaker 1: Kappa Alpha sorority. So she is a big name in

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Speaker 1: the early nineteen hundreds and she did a lot in

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Speaker 1: terms of pioneering when it came to education for girls

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Speaker 1: and women and black women specifically in the US. Yes,

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Speaker 1: also tennis player. Also tennis player. How can I forget that? Yes,

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Speaker 1: that is also one of our first that we'll get to.

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Speaker 1: Tennis player. I've played tennis for a few years in

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Speaker 1: high school to speaking of, um, was not great at it.

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Speaker 1: It was one of those things where my dad was like,

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Speaker 1: he was really into tennis and he wanted me to

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Speaker 1: really be into tennis. And I actually really enjoyed it,

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Speaker 1: but I was also very bad. It is a fun sport.

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Speaker 1: I've actually been wanting to play it again in recent

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Speaker 1: years because it's it's a pretty accessible to Like, no,

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Speaker 1: it doesn't cost that much to have a rack in

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Speaker 1: their tennis course in a lot of places. Yeah. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: So I really suck at tennis. I tried because my

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Speaker 1: all of my friends played, all of them played, and

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Speaker 1: I hope not great at sports outside of like give

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Speaker 1: me something to throw. Sure, but I remember a dude

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Speaker 1: who was flirting with me high to teach me I

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Speaker 1: was so bad he dropped his racket and walked off

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Speaker 1: within the first ten minutes. So I was like co

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Speaker 1: co cool. So I never learned it's no good. That

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Speaker 1: guy's no good. I've seen you play some Mario perty

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Speaker 1: tennis with decent amount of success. Yes, give me a week.

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Speaker 1: I still have to have some wrist action. There some

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Speaker 1: similar motor skills happening. Maybe it's the aim where it

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Speaker 1: just goes out of the tennis court with like the

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Speaker 1: tall chain like fans. It doesn't matter how tall it is,

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Speaker 1: I'll still get it out of there. So you're the

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Speaker 1: person who makes the person have to leave the court

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Speaker 1: every time. Who's not wrong for quinnin walking away? And

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Speaker 1: there's nothing wrong with what he did. It was an

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Speaker 1: absolute correct reaction. Yeah, So me and my friends used

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Speaker 1: to in high school. We would go at night at

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Speaker 1: like nine pm and there'd be no one there and

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Speaker 1: we play what we called for court tennis, and it

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Speaker 1: was some of the best exercise I've ever got in

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Speaker 1: my life because basically, the ball, as long as it

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Speaker 1: was bouncing, it was still employee. No matter where it was.

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Speaker 1: It was so fun. That sounds tiring, but yeah, you

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Speaker 1: gotta because you would hit it on like the ford court,

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Speaker 1: the opposite court. The other person's gotta run over there.

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Speaker 1: It was awesome anyway, all right, our tennis stories aside.

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Speaker 1: Shall we get into the story here, Yeah, let's do it.

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Speaker 1: So Lucy Dick Flow she was born July fourth, and

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Speaker 1: there's some discrepancy over the day whether that was eight

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Speaker 1: three or eighteen eighty five, but she was born in

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Speaker 1: Virginia and she was the youngest of seven children. Her

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Speaker 1: parents were Henry and Fanny Slow. They died when she

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Speaker 1: was pretty young, so she went to live with an

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Speaker 1: aunt in Lexington, Virginia. And in an autobiographical story, like

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Speaker 1: a semi autobiographical story of hers, she said that she

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Speaker 1: was going to live with her aunt, who quote didn't

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Speaker 1: believe in playing in the mud or with boys or

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Speaker 1: running up and down the road was more than I

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Speaker 1: could bear. So there was a lot of talk of

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Speaker 1: how her aunt was big on education and discipline, and

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Speaker 1: you can kind of tell that in her story as well,

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Speaker 1: because years later she moved to Baltimore with her family.

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Speaker 1: Apparently her aunt wanted them to go there so that

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Speaker 1: she would have a better education, so schools were segregated

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Speaker 1: at the time. She went to Baltimore High School and

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Speaker 1: she was pretty competitive in school. She graduated as salutatorian

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Speaker 1: and she decided that she wanted to go to college.

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Speaker 1: So using money that she got from scholarships and that

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Speaker 1: she got from jobs that she worked, she was able

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Speaker 1: to attend Howard University, which is an HBCU in d

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Speaker 1: C that was established back in sixty seven. She was

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Speaker 1: the first girl from Baltimore High to go to Howard

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Speaker 1: in the first to get a scholarship. And she was

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Speaker 1: super involved in things while she was at the university,

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Speaker 1: Like this is another place where you can go down

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Speaker 1: the list of things. She was involved in sports and

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Speaker 1: in student organizations, and it was here where she was

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Speaker 1: a founding member of a KA, which was the first

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Speaker 1: national Greek sorority for black women, which we talked about

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Speaker 1: a little bit talk um and the tennis comes in

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Speaker 1: here too because she was also president of the women's

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Speaker 1: tennis club. And she graduated from Howard in nineteen o eight.

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Speaker 1: So after graduating, she went back to Baltimore and she

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Speaker 1: taught English at Baltimore High School and she began teaching

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Speaker 1: at a time when public school officials were really hiring

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Speaker 1: black people to teach black students. And she once wrote

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Speaker 1: that she what she chose teaching the profession because she

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Speaker 1: was happier in that profession than she was in any

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Speaker 1: other profession. She had her own professional ambitions, but she

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Speaker 1: still she cared really deeply about the development of others

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Speaker 1: and the roots at black girls and black women took

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Speaker 1: in their careers and in their lives as well. So

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Speaker 1: in nineteen fifteen she got a master's degree in English

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Speaker 1: and comparative literature from Columbia University, and she began teaching

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Speaker 1: at Armstrong Manual Training School in Washington, d c. And

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Speaker 1: she taught English at Armstrong for four years before she

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Speaker 1: became the vice principle, which that job itself morphed into

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Speaker 1: the position of Dean of Girls. So this title and

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Speaker 1: the responsibilities that came along with it, they were highly

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Speaker 1: regarded and it prepared her for the positions that she

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Speaker 1: would have in the future. Of course, all of this stuff,

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Speaker 1: you can, you know, look at her history and see

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Speaker 1: how one thing is building up to the next, you know,

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Speaker 1: from teaching to dean um and to like president of

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Speaker 1: all these organizations and how all of her her social consciousness,

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Speaker 1: her interests in social justice and issues like racism, and

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Speaker 1: issues like education of black women, a those things kind

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Speaker 1: of aligned to create this very specific and like bright

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Speaker 1: path that she followed. She also won the first women's

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Speaker 1: national singles Championship of the American Tennis Association in nineteen seventeen.

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Speaker 1: So she was good at it. Unlike me, I'm like,

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Speaker 1: I know what I was. I wasn't saying that for you.

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Speaker 1: I was saying us. I'm like not just yeah, she

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Speaker 1: was really good at it, and so she was awarded

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Speaker 1: in it, and uh, that was a pretty big spot

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Speaker 1: in her first and in nineteen nineteen she became the

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Speaker 1: principal of the first junior high school for black students

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Speaker 1: in d C, which was Shaw. While she was there,

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Speaker 1: she established a teacher development program and as far as personally,

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Speaker 1: like I said, there were also other issues that she

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Speaker 1: was interested in, and she advocated for black women who

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Speaker 1: participated in the suffrage movement as well. That was something

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Speaker 1: that she spoke out about. But back to her education.

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Speaker 1: In two she was appointed the first permanent dean of

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Speaker 1: women at Howard University. She was also hired at the

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Speaker 1: same time as a professor of English in the School

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Speaker 1: of Education, and when she was hired, she sent a

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Speaker 1: statement to the current president of the university laying out

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Speaker 1: what the terms of her employment were. So those included

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Speaker 1: that the salary for the two positions wouldn't be less

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Speaker 1: than three thousand and two hundred dollars and that all

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Speaker 1: policies pertaining to women in the university would come from

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Speaker 1: her office with the approval of the president. And there

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Speaker 1: were some other terms that she laid out in that saying,

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Speaker 1: did I get this right based on the conversation that

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Speaker 1: we had, this is what the positions are gonna look

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Speaker 1: like for me. And she immediately became really active in

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Speaker 1: the school and instituted things. She was also active in

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Speaker 1: the city of d C within that educated black middle

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Speaker 1: class that she was also a part of, and she

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Speaker 1: was immersed in the arts, particularly dance and theater. She

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Speaker 1: joined a literary club and a d Boys Circle, which

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Speaker 1: was a black women's club that discussed things like arts

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Speaker 1: and current events and other issues. And in ninete she

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Speaker 1: became the first president of the National Association of College Women,

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Speaker 1: which was an organization of black women in college graduates

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Speaker 1: at Liberal Arts colleges and universities, and you know that

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Speaker 1: this is also just in alignment with all the other

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Speaker 1: things she was doing. So in the first statement that

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Speaker 1: she gave as part of that organization, she noted that

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Speaker 1: it was formed to raise the standards and the colleges

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Speaker 1: where black women were educated, and to make better conditions

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Speaker 1: for black women's faculty, and to encourage more advanced scholarship

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Speaker 1: among women. And another thing that people have pointed out

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Speaker 1: about her stories that she was involved in the church

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Speaker 1: and she would sing in church choirs, but she was

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Speaker 1: also sometimes a bit critical of the traditional Black church

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Speaker 1: and the role that it played and how Black women

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Speaker 1: were affected by it. But um, she was really heavily

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Speaker 1: involved in her community in many different facets like and

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Speaker 1: obviously educational work is also community work, so she was

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Speaker 1: she just had her hands in so many, so many

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Speaker 1: pots when it came to the cultures that she was

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Speaker 1: invested in, education, the arts, and church. So she Yeah,

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Speaker 1: she organized tease for women's dormitories, and she also gave

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Speaker 1: an annual garden party at her home for the students.

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Speaker 1: But that's not to say that there wasn't any conflict

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Speaker 1: during her time at the University. In ninet Mordecai Johnson

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Speaker 1: became the first black president at Howard and they kind

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Speaker 1: of clashed from the beginning. So, for instance, he would

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Speaker 1: deny her request for pay raises, cut budgets for her,

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Speaker 1: took her office, some of the council's tried to get

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Speaker 1: her to live on campus, so they definitely put heads

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Speaker 1: over the time. But she stayed there until the time

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Speaker 1: that she died, so she was there for quite a

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Speaker 1: while um and made a lot of changes while she

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Speaker 1: was there, So women's education and leadership were things that

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Speaker 1: were very important to her. There was a nineteen thirty

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Speaker 1: one speech at the Teacher's College at Columbia University, and

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Speaker 1: I'll give you a quote from that speech. She said,

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Speaker 1: in the first place, most college administrators must change their

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Speaker 1: philosophy of education and reference to their women's students. They

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Speaker 1: must realize that, whether they like it or not, the

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Speaker 1: life that women are leading today is different from that

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Speaker 1: which was led by their grandmothers. For this present day

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Speaker 1: life demands that women must be ready to make their

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Speaker 1: contribution not only to the home, but also to the economic, political,

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Speaker 1: and civic life of the communities. So it's clear that

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Speaker 1: that was something that she was invested in herself and

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Speaker 1: was really interested in leaving other people to live that

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Speaker 1: sort of life and recognized that things were changing. She

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Speaker 1: advocated for the independence of women and for them branching

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Speaker 1: out in terms of what they pursued in their courses

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Speaker 1: of study. So all of these things were really merging

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Speaker 1: in her story, and she helped found the National Council

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Speaker 1: of Negro Women with Mary McLoud Bassoon, and she served

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Speaker 1: as the organization's first executive secretary. She was also interested

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Speaker 1: in the peace movement and was a member of the

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Speaker 1: Women's International League for Peace and Freedom. And it's the

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Speaker 1: thing that you know, people have talked about more in

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Speaker 1: her story in terms of her companionship with Mary Burrow,

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Speaker 1: who was a well known teacher and playwright in dc UM.

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Speaker 1: They lived together for the last fifteen years of Lucy

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Speaker 1: dig Slows life, and there was speculation that there were lovers.

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Speaker 1: And yeah, she remained Dean of Women until she died

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Speaker 1: in nineteen thirty seven of some health complications. And she's

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Speaker 1: had a bunch of things named after her, like a

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Speaker 1: dorm at Howard and a boring machine, which makes sense

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Speaker 1: based on her name. Lucy Dig slows just like lends

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Speaker 1: itself to pense. But she did so much during the

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Speaker 1: time that she was alive in regards to education and

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Speaker 1: the community work. And I think that her legacy really

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Speaker 1: lives on and people have acknowledged that in various ways

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Speaker 1: when it comes to actually naming things after her and

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Speaker 1: recognizing the work that she's done and trying to, you know,

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Speaker 1: get things making sure that we acknowledge the spaces that

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Speaker 1: she was in her house as historic place is and

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Speaker 1: her as a pioneer of the work that she was doing.

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Speaker 1: When you first sent the name, I was looking up like, Okay,

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Speaker 1: what what's she all about? And it was just like

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Speaker 1: so much, so much accomplished in a relatively short amount

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Speaker 1: of time. You can tell she had a passion and

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Speaker 1: was just fighting for it and then really made some

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Speaker 1: some changes. It's very impressive, very inspirational. Yea for sure.

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Speaker 1: And she's also part of this larger history too, when

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Speaker 1: it comes to something like the a k A sorority history,

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Speaker 1: the history of Howard University and HBCUs, like there's also

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Speaker 1: this looming is it's like a negative word, but like

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Speaker 1: this overarching history of black people, of black education, of

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Speaker 1: women's education and all of those other offshoots of the

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Speaker 1: things that she was doing. She was wrapped up in that.

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Speaker 1: And also Harlem Renaissance kind of eating into that too,

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Speaker 1: So yeah, she she was definitely Arson culture like that

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Speaker 1: was another element of the things she was interested in.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, it's she touched a lot of points, and

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Speaker 1: I think it's fascinating in that way where it's like

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Speaker 1: we can learn so much just from the way she

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Speaker 1: was moving and the things that she was interested in

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Speaker 1: about the time, and about the causes and the issues

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Speaker 1: that people were concerned with, and and how her upbringing

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Speaker 1: lt to that. Yeah, and also tennis also tennis, I

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Speaker 1: keep forgetting about that sport. Yes, yeah, that's that's always

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Speaker 1: impressive to me when people have those like two things

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Speaker 1: that they're really good at that aren't correlated necessarily, and

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Speaker 1: you're like, it's like, how do you have the time? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: this is making me want to play tennis. I'll tell

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Speaker 1: you that. It's I still in my old racket, but

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Speaker 1: it's been a minute, so I think it might be

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Speaker 1: a disaster. M H. I believe in you. Thank you, Eves,

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Speaker 1: thank you. I need all the help. I think, yes,

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Speaker 1: there anything else that you want to add before we

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Speaker 1: wrap up. No, I think that's all okay, Well, where

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Speaker 1: can the good listeners find you? Eves? Y'all can find

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Speaker 1: me at Eaves Jeff Coo on Twitter at not Apologizing

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00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:26,480
Speaker 1: on Instagram. You can also listen to the shows This

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00:24:26,640 --> 00:24:29,600
Speaker 1: Day in History Class, which is a daily show about

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00:24:29,760 --> 00:24:33,440
Speaker 1: people and events in history. You can listen to Unpopular,

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00:24:33,520 --> 00:24:35,600
Speaker 1: which is about people in history who really defied the

408
00:24:35,640 --> 00:24:38,120
Speaker 1: status quo and we're persecuted for it in some way

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00:24:38,400 --> 00:24:43,480
Speaker 1: and what their stories were and yeah, and then on

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Speaker 1: female first ex and I think I think this might

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00:24:48,520 --> 00:24:52,399
Speaker 1: have been our or big, but I think we'll just

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Speaker 1: say the next one is, so that's the one. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: we'll just make it up. We play hard and fast.

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Speaker 1: WHI out rules here. Thank you so much as always

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00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:08,960
Speaker 1: for being here. Eve's always a pleasure. Thanks for having me. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and thanks to the listeners. Please go check us out

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Speaker 1: if you haven't already. You can email us if you

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00:25:16,160 --> 00:25:18,960
Speaker 1: would like at Stephanie Dea mom Stuff at iHeart media

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00:25:19,000 --> 00:25:20,520
Speaker 1: dot com. You can find us on Twitter at mom

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00:25:20,600 --> 00:25:23,000
Speaker 1: Stuff Podcast or on Instagram at stuff I've Never tells you.

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Speaker 1: Thanks as always to your super producer Christina. Thank you Chrissena,

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00:25:26,840 --> 00:25:29,200
Speaker 1: and thanks to you for listening stuff I never told you.

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Speaker 1: It's a production of I Heart Radio from more podcast

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00:25:31,280 --> 00:25:33,879
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